Modern French Foreign Legion

In this article we will complete the story of the French Foreign Legion. Currently, the soldiers of his regiments in France are much better treated than fifty years ago. At the very least, the soldiers of the legion are not now considered polls and socially dangerous psychopaths. However, special sympathies, especially in the left and liberal circles, are also not observed for them. Legionnaires themselves joke that the French love them only one day a year - during the Bastille Parade, when their units march through the Champs Elysees in a solemn march.

Sappers (pioneers) of the Foreign Legion. Military parade in honor of the anniversary of the capture of the Bastille, Paris, Champs Elysees. 2016 year

Weapon Foreign Legion soldiers taking part in the Bastille Parade

Regimental flags of the first and second regiments of the Foreign Legion, Paris, 2003

There were times when the size of the Foreign Legion reached 42 people (the beginning of World War I), now it numbers, according to various sources, from seven and a half to eight thousand soldiers and officers. Jean Moren (namesake of the last commander of 000e REP, Jeanpierre's successor), defense attaché of the French Embassy in the Russian Federation, in an interview with Radio Echo of Moscow on April 1, 24, said the number was 2010 people. Probably, his data should be trusted, since from August 7600, 1, he was the commander of the units of the French Foreign Legion.

Lieutenant General Jean Moren, a graduate of the Academy of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, a former military attaché in Russia, commander of the Foreign Legion

Commander of the Foreign Legion Jean Moren and soldiers of the Third Regiment. French guiana

Of the 11 regiments of the Legion, 7 are now based in France: in Aubagne, Castelnodari, Calvi (Corsica island), Orange, Avignon, Nimes and Sant Cristolier, 4 - outside its borders: in Djibouti, French Polynesia, Mayotte Island (archipelago of Comoros) and French Guiana.

The locations of the regiments of the French Foreign Legion

The headquarters of the entire legion is now Aubagne (a city about 15 km from Marseille): the First Regiment (1 RE) is located in the barracks of Vieno, after evacuation from the Algerian city of Siddi Bel Abbes, which the legionnaires affectionately called the Beautiful Abbes (in it By the way, spagas were also located) the main headquarters of the Foreign Legion and its command were transferred.

Barracks in Siddy Bel Abbes in the XNUMXth century

A beautiful building of the General Staff of the Foreign Legion in the city of Aubagne

This monument to the fallen soldiers of the Foreign Legion was erected in Siddy Bel Abbes in 1932:

We see a globe lying on an armful of palm branches, which is guarded by four figures symbolizing the legionnaires of Algeria, Mexico, the colonial campaigns and the First World War. The initiator of the creation and installation of this monument was the "father of the legion" - Colonel Paul Frederic Rolle (it was described in the article "Dogs of War" of the French Foreign Legion ") At his request, the legionary of the colonial campaigns was given the resemblance to Major Brundso.

Major Brundso

Leaving Algeria in 1962, the legionnaires brought him to Aubagne:

The first regiment is now training, the main function of its troops is the primary training of recruits.

The second infantry regiment, which was formed back in 1841 on the basis of the 4th and 5th battalions of the First Regiment, is located in the Wallong barracks (the city of Nimes). It is curious that the regimental song of the second regiment is the German Anna Maria.

Barracks Wallong, Nimes

Caserne 2e REI, Nimes

Joint exercises of the second infantry regiment and the first engineer-sapper regiment of the Foreign Legion. From 2e REI - 5th company, from 1er REG - engineering platoon and medical team

The famous 13th semi-brigade is actually a regiment, however, in memory of past merits, it retained its name.

The 13th half-brigade of the Foreign Legion passes through Roman ruins. Lambaesis, Algeria, 1958

Until 2011, it was located in Djibouti. In these photos we see the soldiers of the 13th semi-brigade:

Soldiers of the 13th Brigade, Djibouti

Legionnaires in Djibouti

And here is the French combat reconnaissance vehicle ERC 90 Sagaie of the 13th semi-brigade in the vicinity of Djibouti, 2005 photo:

French erc 90 sagaie

Then the 13th brigade was transferred to Abu Dhabi (UAE), and now has returned to France.

In this photo, the fourth regiment of the Foreign Legion leaves the barracks of Denjou, city of Castelnodari, France (1980):

This regiment has an officer school and a school for sergeants.

Many recruits who went to study at the Castelnodari school recall the time spent there as a nightmare: they had to work literally for wear and tear.

In addition to infantry, in the Foreign Legion there are parachute landing, tank (armored cavalry), engineer-sapper regiments (by the way, only sappers are currently allowed to let go of their beards).

The paratroopers of the second parachute regiment of the Foreign Legion

The structure of the paratrooper regiment of the legion (2e REP, located in the barracks of Raffali, the city of Calvi, Corsica) includes special forces units, which are recruited from volunteers with the rank of at least a sergeant, - CRAP (Commandos de Recherche et d'Action dans la Profondeur).

GCP (Parachute Commando) member from 2e REP (left) with a 17e RPG, March 8, 2013

The regimental holiday 2e REP is celebrated on September 29, the day of the Archangel Michael, who is considered the patron saint of paratroopers.

All regiments of the legion are part of the larger military formations of the French army. For example, the second parachute regiment is part of the 11th parachute brigade, and the first armored cavalry is part of the 6th light armored division.

The most difficult is the service in the third infantry and second parachute regiments. It is difficult to serve in a parachute regiment due to constant high loads and extremely tough daily routines. Moreover, some companies of this regiment have their own unique training programs: the 1st company specializes in fighting in the city, the 2nd company specializes in war in the mountains, the 3rd company is engaged in naval operations, and the 4th company carries out sabotage and reconnaissance operations.

Third company of the second parachute regiment of the Foreign Legion

2e REP legionnaire at Calvi, Corsica, 1965

The third infantry regiment was previously stationed on the island of Madagascar, it is the second in the legion in the number of awards, and its regimental holiday falls on September 14 - this is the date of the breakthrough of the Hindenburg line in 1918. Currently, it is located in Guiana, a place that the French used to call the “dry guillotine”: in the first half of the 97th century, mortality in prisons of three nearby islands (Ile de Salou archipelago) and three mainland reached XNUMX%.

French Guiana map

The most famous convict of Guiana is the former commander of the Rhine and Northern armies, General Pishegru, whom Napoleon called St. Helena "the most capable of the generals of the Republic." By the way, he became one of the few who managed to escape from Guiana. Another “celebrity” of the Guiana convict was the anarchist Clement Duval, who also fled from the infamous “Devil's Island” in 1901.

Currently, legionnaires traveling to the "tropical paradise" of this overseas department of France receive up to 14 vaccinations against various diseases.

In Guiana, the main spaceport of the European Space Agency (Kourou) is located, the protection of which is one of the tasks of the third regiment of the legion. And so that the Legionnaires would not be bored, the Center d'entrainement a la foret equatoriale was built nearby - a training center for survival in the jungle. The training course consists of modules of varying complexity, the simplest of which teaches you not to die within four days (under the supervision of an experienced instructor). The second level of difficulty is covert movement, ambush organization, reconnaissance and surveillance. The third - training in command of the unit during sabotage or counterguerrilla operations. The fourth is an autonomous raid with a minimal survival kit. Legionnaires receive injuries during such classes regularly, often life-threatening.

Legionnaires in the jungle of Guiana

Banner of the Third Regiment of the Foreign Legion

The “youngest” unit of the Foreign Legion is the second engineer-sapper regiment (2-e REG), created in 1999. He specializes in mountain operations and is part of the 27th Mountain Infantry Brigade (27e brigade d'infanterie de montagne). It is located in the city of Sant Cristol.

Soldiers of the Second Engineering Combat Regiment:

2REG Foreign Legion

And here we see the teachings of the legionnaires of the DLEM unit (de Légion étrangère de Mayotte), Mayotte Island, 2007:

This is the smallest compound of the Foreign Legion, its motto is the Latin phrase Pericula Ludus (something like “Pleasure in danger” or “Danger - my game”).

DLEM division insignia worn on beret

Those of you who read the article “Bob Denard, Jean Schramm, Roger Folk and Mike Hoar: The Fate of the Condottieres”, we must remember that it was the DLEM legionnaires who in 1995 arrested the famous mercenary king Bob Denard in the Comoros, who wished to arrange another coup d'etat in this state.

Despite the fact that the Foreign Legion is currently one of the most combat-ready formations of the French army (it is often called the “tip of the French spear”), its rank-and-file military personnel receive the usual maintenance (modest base salary of 1200 euros or more) and do not have benefits in terms of compared to other parts.

Base Salaries of Foreign Legion Soldiers

During the fighting, the salary of military personnel increases significantly (second numbers in the table below). An additional 600 euros are paid to paratroopers.

Jean Moren, already mentioned by us in his interview, stated that in the Foreign Legion

“Non-commissioned officers receive a lower than average salary in France, as a skilled worker at the beginning of their careers. Experienced non-commissioned officers receive a salary as teachers at school ... Senior officers receive a salary, like senior personnel of enterprises. It means above average in France. ”

The salary is also affected by the number of children in the legionnaire's family.

After being injured or injured, during the time spent in the hospital, the legionnaires also receive a salary supplement of 50 euros per day. Insurance payments are also expected - up to 240 thousand euros. In the event of death, relatives indicated by the legionnaire himself can claim compensation in the amount of 600 thousand euros.

Since the Foreign Legion is a closed structure, its officers cannot count on the highest posts in the French army. The pinnacle of their career is the rank of brigadier general, who is usually assigned to the commander of units of the Foreign Legion, and the colonel - the commander of one of the regiments. However, only a few make their way to positions above these and in other military formations of France.

In the legion, punishments are practiced, which can be material (fines), disciplinary, but more often physical: from 30 to 50 push-ups. In winter, as a punishment for wrongdoing, you can spend the night on the street under a thin blanket:

According to the stories of modern veterans of the Legion, sometimes the more “traditional” methods of “physical impact” and “upbringing” are also used, but, as a rule, they are not systematic.

After a year of impeccable service, a soldier is awarded the title of second-class legionnaire. After another two or three years, he can claim the title of corporal. But to get the rank of sergeant (main corporal), there is little service - you still need to graduate from the school of non-commissioned officers. In the absence of serious violations of discipline after 8 years of service, a bonus of two annual salaries is paid.

In the Foreign Legion there are no differences in rations - no halal or vegetarian menu.

Legionnaire's rather modest breakfast

According to those who have served, the food in the canteens of the Legion is monotonous, and the food is not too tasty. The drafters of the menu are apparently inspired by the aphorism of Alexander the Great:

"The best cooks: for breakfast - a night transition, for lunch - a poor breakfast."

In this photo, found on the Internet, there is breakfast in Castelnodari, where the fourth regiment of the legion is located:

The exception is Christmas dinner, which is the second “special” day in the legion (the first is the Bastille Day parade). The third and last unusual day is a holiday in honor of the anniversary of the Battle of Cameron (it was described in the article "Dogs of War" of the French Foreign Legion ".

Foreign Legion Military Orchestra at Cameron, Aubagne, 2007

They say that the Cameron holiday resembles Saturnalia in Ancient Rome: soldiers and sergeants “swap places”, and ordinary soldiers even get “breakfast in bed”: black pudding (le Boudin) and coffee with rum, but without sugar. The youngest legionnaire is appointed chief of the barracks, and sergeants are involved in cleaning the premises. But it is unlikely that ordinary legionnaires, remembering that there are still 364 (and sometimes 365) days a year, are too abusing their “rights”.

In addition, each military unit of the Foreign Legion has its own regimental holiday.

Legionnaire’s annual vacation is 45 working days. In addition, single legionnaires after retirement can settle in one of the "veteran houses", for example, in Domaine Capitaine Danjou.

Many sources say that homosexuals are still not accepted into the Foreign Legion. Another requirement for recruits is to be unmarried: they will be able to get married after two years of service, and this will require official permission from the commander.

But they do not require knowledge of the French language from recruits — they quickly learn in the process of preparation under the "strict guidance" of a strict sergeant. Usually, a companion who knows the French language is usually assigned to a rookie, and both are punished for every misunderstood word.

The only benefit is the possibility of obtaining French citizenship and a pension.

Documents for obtaining French citizenship can be submitted in 3-5 years, but they say that upon completion of the first contract it is easier to get a resident card for a period of 10 years.

The legionnaire’s pension cannot be called very large - from 800 euros, its size is affected by the place and time of service, and for skydivers it is also the number of jumps. Previously, the minimum length of service was 15 years, now, depending on the circumstances, from 17 and a half to 19 years.

But even this turns out to be enough to make the service in the Foreign Legion attractive in the eyes of immigrants from poor countries (now soldiers of 130 nationalities serve in it). Currently, there are two pre-selection centers for candidates from all over the world to go to: camps near Paris and in Aubagne (Provence).

Aubani, Courtyard of Honor of the Foreign Legion

In addition to pre-selection centers, in nine cities in France there are legion recruitment offices where you can (in exchange for a passport) get a ticket to Paris or Aubagne.

The competition in the legion is comparable to the competition in the leading universities of France and even surpasses it (the exception is people with a medical education, who are on a special account and often come "out of competition").

Jean Moren quoted here in an interview from 2010 said:

“We [in the French army [have no recruitment problem. For ordinary people, maybe it's like a contest, 2 people per place. For non-commissioned officers there may be 4 in place or 5, in the Foreign Legion - 8 per place».

I admit, I recently nearly fell out of my chair after reading in one article the following literally:

“It’s enough for the French legionnaire to pull up four times, have healthy teeth and a little intelligence.”

However, various sources cite the following standards of physical preparation of candidates: 10 pull-ups, 30 push-ups, 50 squats, climb a six-meter rope without using legs, run 2800 meters in 12 minutes.

Soldiers of the Second Infantry Regiment of the Foreign Legion, 2013

A test to determine the degree of mental development, of course, is also conducted. Recruits age: 17 to 40 years old. True, persons under the age of 18 must bring with them permission from their parents.

The most striking and memorable detail of the form of the Foreign Legion are the famous white caps (Képi blanc), which, however, are worn only by ordinary soldiers (both with full dress and everyday). Caps are handed to recruits after taking the oath. Before this, the future legionnaire needs to pass the test with a march-throw with a full combat calculation, which can last more than a day, and the distance traveled can reach 60-70 km.

Legionnaires in caps

One of the official songs of the legion is called “White Caps”:

“It just so happened that our fate is a battle, and pain that must be endured.
We did not choose our fate - fate chose us.
And the guarantee is the strength of our souls,
The strength of our hands and hearts
Without choosing an easy road, knee-deep in mud
Go ahead White Caps.
Above the road are the White Kepi banners - and the road belongs to them.
And behind us is hatred
And ahead of us is the rumor that we are killers,
Black to mud drenched from head to toe.
Go ahead White Caps.
We are dying on the road.
We die - but win the battle
Swallowing black mud and the bitterness of loss
Go ahead White Caps.
Fate smiles at those who are furious, proud, those whose blood is hot.
"Honor and loyalty!" - we carry these words on our banners
From battle to battle.
And choking on the dirt, blacker than that,
Go, go ahead White Caps. "

Later green berets appeared, on the right side of which there is a stylized image of a grenade with seven flames. They are not worn with a full dress.

During the first four months, before taking the oath, the recruit can leave the location of the legion at any minute (the second parachute regiment leads in the number of "refuseniks"). After that, it takes up to a month to review the resignation report, and usually this month is one of the worst “deserters” in life.

A spokesman for the Foreign Legion, Lieutenant Gregory Gavrois, didn’t say that the typical recruit of this unit was “a restless person with a fragile psyche who decided to change his country, has lost its roots, and seeks to start life from scratch.” And therefore, the advertising slogans of the Foreign Legion are the call "Change your fate!" and its definition as "second chance schools." During the selection process, they still look at the petty offenses of the candidates through their fingers, but try to cut off people who have served their sentences for serious crimes and are accused of extremism and drug trafficking. “A legionnaire is rarely an angel, but never a criminal,” the official site of the Foreign Legion now assures.

And Colonel Pierre Framager is more optimistic:

“I’m not saying that the legionnaires are the best, but they are among the best! They have challenged themselves in life and have every reason to win. ”

French Foreign Legion Advertising Poster

And this advertising poster of the legion offers “to look at life in a new way” (or “to see another life”?)

Legion's own magazine (Kepi Blanc) should help a rookie get to know history of this combat unit:

After the collapse of the USSR, the legion included many immigrants from the former Soviet republics (as well as countries that were members of the Warsaw Pact), according to some reports, up to 30% of all personnel. In second place are immigrants from Latin America - 25%, least of all Asians - 8%. As a result, the official site of the legion appeared Russian-language version (in addition to French and English).

A Frenchman who wishes to join the legion as an ordinary, receives a new passport in which he appears as a citizen of some French-speaking country. Such may be Switzerland (where there are French-speaking cantons), Belgium, Luxembourg, Canada. This little trick allows French presidents to avoid uncomfortable questions from journalists about the deaths of unclear where and why French citizens. And mercenaries without a clan and tribe and with a suspicious biography ... Who are they interested in, who will consider them? It is believed that such “former Frenchmen” in the legion are now about 20% of the total number of military personnel.

In order to become an officer, you must first obtain French citizenship, but they still give him very reluctantly before leaving.

Foreign Legion Museum, courage awards

Foreign Legion units are the only ones officially prohibited from serving women. Susan Travers, who was the only exception to this rule, was described in an article “The French Foreign Legion in the First and Second World Wars”.

Women who now work in the structures of the legion (laundresses, cleaners, cooks and others) are civilian, they are not legionnaires.

They say that soldiers and sergeants who have served in the Legion are willingly accepted into modern private military companies, which were described a little in the article. "Private military companies: a respectable business of respected gentlemen".

And many former legionnaires from those who do not like the harsh order of the French barracks, or those who cannot find a place in civilian life, take the opportunity to find employment in these structures.

In the next article, we, as promised earlier (in the article “Zouaves. New and unusual military units of France "), let's talk about the zouaves of the armies of other countries.

Comments

[Olgovich]

This monument to the fallen soldiers of the Foreign Legion was erected in Siddy Bel Abbes in 1932:
We see a globe lying on an armful of palm branches, which is guarded by four figures symbolizing the legionnaires of Algeria, Mexico, the colonial campaigns and the First World War.

less than 90 years have passed and France has no Algeria, no colonies (almost), no Mexico, but there is a rout of WWII.
Legionnaires did not help ...

The last frontier of defense was France itself.
But....

Thanks to the author for the work!

[Civil]

Quote: Olgovich

This monument to the fallen soldiers of the Foreign Legion was erected in Siddy Bel Abbes in 1932:
We see a globe lying on an armful of palm branches, which is guarded by four figures symbolizing the legionnaires of Algeria, Mexico, the colonial campaigns and the First World War.

less than 90 years have passed and France has no Algeria, no colonies (almost), no Mexico, but there is a rout of WWII.
Legionnaires did not help ...

The last frontier of defense was France itself.
But....

Thanks to the author for the work!

1. Not those times, with modern standards of colonialism, the natives themselves give all the resources for pieces of paper, France does not need to maintain an administrative apparatus and army. The native administration of their children and grandchildren keeps in France, as a guarantee of loyalty. The native population plows for a penny.
2. The French have kept the most delicious "paradise" islands for themselves. Guadeloupe, Martinique, Fr. Guinea..itp, see list of French Overseas Territories.

[Olgovich]

Quote: Civil

The French have kept the most delicious "paradise" islands for themselves. Guadeloupe, Martinique, Fr. Guinea..itp, see list of French Overseas Territories.

See the list of LOST overseas territories of France and compare with the remaining stub.

That's why I wrote "almost no": this stub is "almost".

PS Indochina was .... tasteless?

[Civil]

Quote: Olgovich

Quote: Civil

The French have kept the most delicious "paradise" islands for themselves. Guadeloupe, Martinique, Fr. Guinea..itp, see list of French Overseas Territories.

See the list of LOST overseas territories of France and compare with the remaining stub.

That's why I wrote "almost no": this stub is "almost".

PS Indochina was .... tasteless?

Time has put everything in place, the indigenous administrations (presidents, leaders, general secretaries, etc.) leave all revenues from the sale of resources in France, it turns out a triple effect of resources, all the former colonialists have all the money and there is no cost to maintain order in the colonies. Not to mention the departure of the most talented natives to the former metropolis.

[Olgovich]

Quote: Civil

administrations are native presidents, leaders, general secretaries, etc.) all revenues from the sale of resources are left in France, a triple effect is obtained

What side is it to, for example, Indochina?

[Civil]

What side is it to, for example, Indochina?

See France-Vietnam trade structure. Well, the Vietnamese elite is firmly connected with France, Ho Chi Minh himself was educated there.

[Olgovich]

Quote: Civil

See France-Vietnam trade structure.

I look, and France is practically not there:

The main import partners of Vietnam are China, Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Thailand, and Singapore.

Vietnam's main export partners are USA, Japan, China, South Korea, Malaysia and Germany

The largest investors were companies from South Korea (30%), Malaysia (11%), Japan (8%), Hong Kong, Singapore, China, Taiwan, Great Britain, the USA and Thailand.

Quote: Civil

Well, the Vietnamese elite is firmly connected with France, Ho Chi Minh himself was educated there.

gone elite

[Blacksmith 55]

I think the author has done a huge, titanic work. Thank .
We all heard about the French foreign legion, but not in such detail.
Not only well and detailed, but many different photographs are presented.
The author of further success.

[L-39NG]

Lezhion entrange is not a magic wand. There was also a high command with its policies and orders. On May 28, 1940, a German landing in the vicinity of Narvik. The French Foreign Legion defeated these Germans. in June 1941, part of the legion fought for De Gaulle, part for Vichy in Syria, for Damascus. Oasis Bir Hakeim, yes, Rommel won there, but at the cost of incomparably greater losses than the Foreign Legion had, and despite the fact that the Germans had many times superior forces. Few events? This is not a Soviet movie about liberation and not "small land" from Brezhnev.
And do not just make heroes of yourself. Europe began to fight against Hitler when two more mustachioed, one more, the other less, played love among themselves. And the number of victims is not a reason to be heroes, but a reason for grief.

[Kronos]

The USSR fought with the Nazis in Spain in 1936, beat the Japanese Nazis 2 times, so no need to lie

[Olgovich]

Quote: L-39NG

Europe began to fight against Hitler when two more mustachioed, one more, the other less, played love among themselves.

She began to "fight" with him in 1935, when the Nazis presented the FLEET, then in 1936 - RHEIN, then AUSTRIA, then SUDETS, then CZECH REPUBLIC and SLOVAKIA, SPAIN. Sclerosis?
The entire military industry of Hitler, also loans from Europe and the United States

[nks]

Quote: Olgovich

no colonies

There are no colonies at all

Quote: Olgovich

Of Mexico

Mexico never happened.

Quote: Olgovich

The last frontier of defense was France itself.

With such guardians, you go, it will not be lost :))

[Olgovich]

Quote: nks

There are no colonies at all

overseas departments, from Mars fell to France?

Quote: nks

Mexico never happened.

The second Mexican empire to the ignorant to help.

Quote: nks

With such guardians how are youGo, it will not be lost:

[nks]

Quote: Olgovich

overseas departments, from Mars fell to France?

Overseas departments are overseas departments, not colonies. I quoted above not quite correctly - emphasis on

Quote: Olgovich

(nearly)

No colonies almost, quite no

Quote: Olgovich

The second Mexican empire to the ignorant to help.

In-in - read-read :))

Quote: Olgovich

But you are rude in vain. Moreover, your uneven breathing to France and spelling gives :)))

[Olgovich]

Quote: nks

Overseas departments are overseas departments, not colonies. I quoted above not quite correctly - emphasis on
Quote: Olgovich
(nearly)

There are almost no colonies, but not at all

ONCE AGAIN: overseas departments - have fallen off MARS?
What were they before the department?

Quote: nks

In-in - read-read :))

What for?

Quote: nks

Here you are rude in vain. T

Quote: nks

Moreover, your uneven breathing towards France and spelling gives out

Why "all the more"?

France is indifferent.

And what about spelling and what do you care about it?

[nks]

Quote: Olgovich

ONCE AGAIN: overseas departments - have fallen off MARS?

I explained what my comment related to. No need to replace the question.

Quote: Olgovich

What for?

Capacitively!) A writer, but not a reader?))

Quote: Olgovich

France is indifferent

And then what are you scribbling comments on the fate of France when the article is not about that?

[Olgovich]

Quote: nks

I explained what my comment related to. No need to replace the question.

And I explained. WHAT didn’t reach?

Quote: nks

Capacitively!) A writer, but not a reader?))

Quote: nks

And then what are you scribbling comments on the fate of France when the article is not about that?

1. What is your business?

2. Where is my "pain" about the fate of France?

3. Legion WHOSE? Whose fate determined? Can they be ... separated from each other?
Tell the Legionnaires

[nks]

Quote: Olgovich

1. What is your business?

I don’t have any. This is a question for you to think about your own motivations.

Quote: Olgovich

2. Where is my "pain" about the fate of France ?:

The word "pain", in order to put it in quotation marks, but you can also say so - it is in your comments, including deliberate (in the writing of other countries) writing France with a lowercase letter

Quote: Olgovich

3. Legion WHOSE?

Quote: Olgovich

Whose fate determined?

First of all, the legionnaires, probably still someone who came across him, but certainly not the fate of France, if you had this in mind.

Quote: Olgovich

Can they be ... separated from each other?

Legionnaires? Apparently, yes - especially when they left the service

Quote: Olgovich

Tell the Legionnaires

"what for?" I would rather ask them something. Oh yes, you're a writer

[Olgovich]

Quote: nks

This is a question for you to think about your own motivations.

1. What kind of "you have to think", "spelling"?
2. Think back to who needs your .. questions to think back?

Quote: nks

The word "pain", in order to put it in quotation marks, but you can also say so - it is in your comments, including deliberate (in the writing of other countries) writing France with a lowercase letter

My shift sticks. Did it get there?

Quote: nks

First of all, the legionnaires, probably still someone who came across him, but certainly not the fate of France, if you had this in mind.

WHOM did Legton serve? not ..... France? And for .... "someone" who came across it?

Quote: nks

Legionnaires? Apparently, yes - especially when they left the service

Legion and France - if it didn’t reach again

Quote: nks

why? "I would rather ask them something. Oh, well, yes, you are a writer

Tired of you already empty chatter ....

[nks]

Quote: Olgovich

My shift sticks. Did it get there?

If it sticks, fix it and don’t stoop to such ridiculous excuses.

Quote: Olgovich

Whose fate determined?

Quote: Olgovich

And WHOM did Legton serve?

"Served" and "determined fate" have very different meanings.

Quote: Olgovich

Tired of you already empty chatter ....

I also hope that you finally do self-education Good luck!

[Kronos]

Is it burning that peoples gained freedom from empires?

[Lepsik]

--- 10 pull-ups, 30 push-ups, 50 squats, climb a six-meter rope without using legs, run 2800 meters in 12 minutes.

these are nominations for cripples

[VLR]

These are, apparently, the basic requirements - to make sure that the recruit is not a hopeless weakling. And then they themselves bring it to the "required condition". In addition, in the same tank units, pitching is especially not needed.

[Anton S]

That's right, these are the minimum requirements, usually people who come there can do much more physically.

[Andrey VOV]

The TRP standards for the union were steeper for schoolchildren)))) we girls pulled up at least 10 times .. the truth was the sports class we had, but nonetheless ... food, to be honest, I thought they would say it is more tighter than in the pictures .. and of course the legend about super salaries .. everything turns out to be much more prosaic

[Anton S]

Yes, they feed normally there, the food is balanced, varied. In battle regiments, they usually don’t go to the dining room for breakfast — a light breakfast in their room, lunch is required, dinner is optional.

[3x3zsave]

super salary legends ..
Given the fact that a person does not need to think about food and housing - a normal salary.

[ccsr]

Quote: 3x3zsave

Given the fact that a person does not need to think about food and housing - a normal salary.

This is also a myth - I know that now one of the former citizens of Ukraine specially went to serve in French Guiana, because there they really pay well and he needs to support his wife and two children. Since he plans to end his service in general, he wants to prepare for retirement. She has no housing in France, so the question is urgent for him and money will be needed. True, he served himself a pension, and apparently will be a reliable client for obtaining a loan from any bank in France, if he wants to buy a mortgage. But Ukraine lost four Ukrainian citizens forever, though the Russian Crimea, too.

[3x3zsave]

This is also a myth -
What is a myth? What does the Legion provide personnel with a roof over their heads, food and medical care in addition to their maintenance?

[ccsr]

Quote: 3x3zsave

This is also a myth -
What is a myth?

That the legion provides housing for the legionnaire and his family in France - he needs to acquire his home after the end of the service at his own expense. By the way, medical insurance is also not free - as is customary in all NATO countries in relation to family members.

[3x3zsave]

Where in my comments did you see even a word about the families of legionnaires or about veterans of the Legion?

[Legionista]

What is a myth? What does the Legion provide personnel with a roof over their heads, food and medical care in addition to their maintenance?

You are absolutely right. Moreover, there are two sanatoriums, in the mountains and on the sea, anyone can use on weekends, or during vacation, of course, not for free, but the price is symbolic, what can you do - "Animal grin of capitalism"

[3x3zsave]

That's what I'm talking about. By the way, comrade, enlighten what is the base rate of a legionnaire (because everything is very vague), and are taxes collected from it?

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: 3x3zsave

By the way, comrade, enlighten what is the base rate of a legionnaire (because everything is very vague), and are taxes collected from it?

Read A. Negrivodu. He is a legionnaire.

[3x3zsave]

Thanks, I read.

[Legionista]

Do not read). Negrivoda has nothing to do with the legion). Raw fantasies)

[3x3zsave]

Thank you for the information

[Legionista]

Good evening. The author correctly indicated in the article. The young legionnaire receives around 1200-1300 euros. And everything is really "very vague")), tk. various allowances may be added to the salary, the so-called. "prime de terrain" - field exits, "prime de l'air" - parachute jumps. Taxes are levied if the annual income exceeds a certain amount, I do not have up-to-date information, but in the early 2000s, ordinary legionnaires paid taxes only in 2REP (of course, if they wanted to declare income, because for legionnaires this is all voluntary. However, to obtain a residence permit it is necessary declare income for the last 3 years). This is, by the way, to stories about passports, etc. Obtaining citizenship is quite problematic.

[Andrey VOV]

but the tanker doesn't need it ... but should you wave the goose with a "mashka"? Do you need to ... load the shells? clean the barrel ... here you can't do without physical strength

[Pane Kohanku]

but the tanker doesn't need it ... but should you wave the goose with a "mashka"? Do you need to ... load the shells? clean the barrel ... here you can't do without physical strength

reminded a famous movie about how the Japanese tank repaired that's for sure!

[Krasnodar]

Quote: VlR

These are, apparently, the basic requirements - to make sure that the recruit is not a hopeless weakling. And then they themselves bring it to the "required condition". In addition, in the same tank units, pitching is especially not needed.

“Armor doesn't like sagging muscles.”
Я I HEARD 10 pull-ups, 12 minutes 3 km. Specialties such as military assistant or sapper - do 5 pull-ups, walk three kilometers in 15 minutes - they will take))

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Krasnodar

I heard 10 pull-ups

So with ... Is it with me that my 25 pull-ups will be taken away immediately to the specialist? And I push up 120 times in 45 seconds ...

[3x3zsave]

In this photo, found on the Internet, there is breakfast in Castelnodari, where the fourth regiment of the legion is located:
Ugh, damn it! And here is barley!
Thank you, Valery!

[Pane Kohanku]

Ugh, damn it! And here is barley!

otherwise Bolts, silvuple!

Sappers (pioneers) of the Foreign Legion. Military parade in honor of the anniversary of the capture of the Bastille, Paris, Champs Elysees. 2016 year

As far as I understand, the fashion for bearded uncles with axes went from Napoleon?
There was a terrible battle of French drums, the glass rang in the windows of the burghers from the roar: it was from Tempelhof that an ominous crowd moved in the streets of Berlin, in huge bear caps, all tanned, all barefoot, and long black beards hanging down to the waist. Each of them dragged a huge ax on his shoulder, which the butchers use when cutting meat carcasses. The Germans took them for the executioners of Napoleon, but they were sappers. Behind them a handsome officer rode on a horse, discharged like a rooster, and juggled with a long stock, adorned with rubies and rhinestones - a tambourmajeur! (V.S. Pikul, "To Each His Own").

The sappers of the French Foreign Legion arrived in Paris to take part in the Bastille anniversary parade. Third French Republic. July 13, 1939. The sappers of the French Foreign Legion, according to the tradition inherited from the time of Napoleon Bonaparte, are required to wear a broad beard. In addition, an ax and an apron are included in the parade uniform.
Source: https://fishki.net/2350169-retrofotoassorti-chasty-2/gallery-4747657-sapyory-francuzskogo-inostrannogo-legiona-13-ijulja-1939-goda-parizh-photo.html © Fishki.net

[nks]

Quote: Pane Kohanku

As far as I understand, the fashion for bearded uncles with axes went from Napoleon?

Generally earlier, but with Napoleon it became regular, and in the legion essno later.

Quote: Pan Kohanku

In addition, an ax and an apron are included in the parade uniform.

I must say that now the beard is included only in ceremonial uniforms, as a tribute to tradition at various ceremonies

[Pane Kohanku]

the beard is now only part of the parade uniform

Alexei, do you think they haven’t shaved for six months before the parade? Or do they have a special front Velcro beard?
Oh .. just yesterday I read about the French Revolution, the commissar-flayer and Teresa Talien personally. I read right up to three nights! In the morning I came to work - and then Valery gave another article about the French .. I wish you new articles!

[nks]

Quote: Pane Kohanku

Alexei, do you think they haven’t shaved for six months before the parade?

It’s approximately the same - the parades are actually a summary part. Who wants to get there is getting ready.

[Yrec]

Their commander is now credited.

[Legionista]

At the moment, Commander I.L. - Brigadier General (General de brigade) Denis MISTRAL, he replaced the Division General (General de Division) Jean MAURIN July 26, 2018.
Jean MAURIN is currently Director of the Protection and Security Service of RENAULT in Russia

[Pane Kohanku]

Jean MAURIN is currently Director of the Protection and Security Service of RENAULT in Russia

By the way, the satisfied, the satisfied! "Logan" was a good workhorse for me, now I have been enjoying "Megan" for seven years.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Pane Kohanku

now for seven years I have been rejoicing at "Megan".

Ugh, damn it, poked a finger, and a dent was formed. I had to putty.

[Pane Kohanku]

Ugh, damn it, poked a finger, and a dent was formed. I had to putty.

there are a couple of scratches until I cover up. They do not rot

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Pane Kohanku

They do not rot

Well, glory to the many-sided Shiva.

[Pane Kohanku]

Well, glory to the many-sided Shiva.

Shiva will not help if the head is sewn in! (Indian proverb) no, a good car. Anton is a witness.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Pane Kohanku

Anton witness

Did he use a lot?

[Pane Kohanku]

Did he use a lot?

No way. Sober drove. And we use it exclusively without cars!

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Pane Kohanku

Not. Sober drove.

My colleague somehow got drunk and went to the Crimea. For a day I got from the Tula region. On a penny.

[Pane Kohanku]

My colleague somehow got drunk and went to the Crimea. For a day I got from the Tula region. On a penny.

it's called - "interesting movie" no, we will not repeat the feat. You can’t get in a drive while driving. Well him.

[Legionista]

I read the entire cycle with pleasure and interest. In my opinion, this is the most reliable presentation that I have seen here on the site and on other information platforms. Possible small inaccuracies are by no means critical, since I.L. enough "living organism"))). What was 8-10 years old may no longer occur now. I'm not even talking about what I.L. 40-50-80 years ago. To the author - Thank you very much for the interesting information and the work done! With respect

[VLR]

I am very glad that many people liked this cycle, but, of course, your opinion and your "colleagues" are of special importance. I am glad that the articles were positively evaluated. Thank you for your kind feedback. And for the fact that by their presence they "inspired" me and stimulated me to "gnaw out" information from wherever it was possible.

[Pane Kohanku]

And for the fact that by their presence they "inspired" me and stimulated me to "gnaw out" information from wherever it was possible.

I will say from myself - I am grateful to you. Hope we are still waiting for dashing Murat, prudent Bernadotte and Teresa Talien with protruding breasts personally. In your articles! And also Gauche, Pishegru, Vendée and Georges Cadudal, swallowing glasses of wine without getting drunk. The fanatical executioners of the Jacobins, the relaxed Barras and ... the ascent of the guiding star of that same captain Buonaparte ... thank! You, Valery, write and write!

[VLR]

Incidentally, I have two articles about Murat. If you haven’t read, you can see:
https://topwar.ru/163673-dve-gaskonady-ioahima-mjurata.html

https://topwar.ru/163867-ioahim-mjurat-geroj-stavshij-predatelem.html

We will return to Napoleonic and post-Napoleonic France through an article about princes and bastards of the Bonaparte House.

[Pane Kohanku]

Incidentally, I have two articles about Murat.

Was reading! But with pleasure I still read your articles about that era.

We will return to Napoleonic and post-Napoleonic France through an article about princes and bastards of the Bonaparte House.

But for this - I will say sincere thanks! Beauharnais, too, were still beetles - the second son of Eugene married the daughter of Nikolai Pavlovich, and the daughter was married off to the son of Bernadotte! That is, the parents were at war, and the descendants with might and main "put up with their families", thereby strengthening their dynasties.

[ccsr]

Author:
Ryzhov V.A.

Since the Foreign Legion is a closed structure, its officers cannot count on the highest posts in the French army.

At the beginning of the series of articles, I described in detail why serving in the legion is of little prestige for career officers of the French army, which is why they are reluctant to serve there. realizing that there is no prospect there. But some "experts", having served in the legion for one or two terms, tried to refute me, believing that they understand better than me the psychology of French officers. As it turned out, the author of the article came to this conclusion and I completely agree with him. By the way, my information was not from the media articles about the foreign legion, but from more prosaic sources - professionals in their field worked in our military mission in the French zone of the FRG, and they knew from first hand many of the subtleties of serving as officers in different structures of the French Armed Forces. So they gave detailed information about how things really are.

[Legionista]

[quote] By the way, my information was not from media articles about a foreign legion, but from more prosaic sources — professionals in their military mission worked in our French mission in the French zone of the FRG, and they knew firsthand the many subtleties of serving as officers in various structures French Armed Forces [/ quo te]
French officers themselves reported on all the nuances of military service? And so as not to complicate, probably taught for this the Russian language, that would certainly information was accepted in full)))
[quote] But some "experts", having served in the legion for one or two terms, tried to refute me, believing that they understand better than me the psychology of French officers [/ quote]
I'm used to arguing my comments. So here are some facts from a "certain expert" for a "political officer who understands the psychology of French officers":
-Paul LARDRY, General of the Army (highest military rank of the French Armed Forces) Commander I.L. in 1980-1982, in 1986-1988 commander of the rapid reaction forces (FAR), (for the political officers from the Western Group of Forces, it was this general who commanded the "Moineau Hardi" maneuvers in Germany in 1986. But apparently the "professionals in their field" forgot to report this)
-Christian PIQUEMAL, General de corps d'armee (the second rank of the French Armed Forces in the hierarchy), commander I.L. in 1994-1999 In 1989-1992 Deputy Chief of the Military Council under the Prime Minister (cabinet militaire du Primier ministre)
Bruno DARY, Army General, Commander I.L. in 2004-2006, the military governor of Paris, head of the Defense Zone of Paris and the region (Ile-de-France) in 2007-2012
-Alain BOUQUIN, General de corps d'armee. Commander I.L. in 2009-2011. General Inspector of Land Forces in 2013-2015
Christophe de SAINT CHAMAS, General de corps d'armee, Commander I.L. 2011-2014, Commander of the North-Eastern Military District (Region terre Nord-Ouest) in 2014-2017.
[quote] At the beginning of the series of articles, I described in detail why service in the legion is not prestigious for staff officers of the French army, which is why they are reluctant to go there to serve. realizing that there is no prospect there. [/ quote]
If the military career of the above generals is considered "hopeless", then alas)))))

[3x3zsave]

Bravo, comrade!

[Legionista]

it was this general who commanded the "Moineau Hardi" maneuvers in Germany in 1986.

I am sorry for the incorrect year. Exercise Moineau Hardi, also known as Kecker Spatz (Brave Sparrow), was held in 1987. But the general was this

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

French officers themselves reported on all the nuances of military service

No, they didn’t report, they just talked with our missionaries, who were fluent in the French language, and, out of purely corporate solidarity, told us a lot of things that ordinary legionermas are not supposed to know.

And so as not to complicate, probably taught for this the Russian language, that would certainly information was accepted in full)))

All French missionaries in Potsdam were fluent in Russian — they were professional intelligence officers, and they were entitled to it by status, as were Soviet missionaries in the French zone of occupation. Our officers also constantly communicated with them - this was part of the protocol of the activities of the Allied armies. Some were even detained at our training grounds when they were reconnaissance too arrogantly.

Quote: Legionista

for a "political officer who understands the psychology of French officers":

Past the box office, verbiage - I knew their psychology by virtue of my official duties, and the political leaders were engaged in the education of our personnel. It is immediately obvious that you did not serve a day in the Soviet Army.

Quote: Legionista

If the military career of the above generals is considered "hopeless", then alas

Only four generals with a very modest term of command of the legion and a quick departure from it to other positions - you amused me as an "expert" of the French army, about which I learned more in the GSVG in five years than you did during your two terms of service in the legion. On me people like you do not make an impression. You can impress those who have no idea about the French army at all, but not me. IL regiments of about a thousand people and less - this is generally a mockery of chickens for any military professional, but you can continue to convince everyone that being a legionnaire is cool. Although it is already clear that they go there to serve out of need or for a reason to get some kind of specialty, and then transfer to the ordinary troops of the French army.

[Legionista]

This is all demagogy, like Prokopenko’s with REN TV. Not a single fact and a reasonable argument. Maybe you and him are classmates on FEFU?
You, as a political officer, are given out by the frequent use of personal and possessive pronouns- "we, to us, to us"))))

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

This is all demagogy, like Prokopenko’s with REN TV. Not a single fact and reasonable argument.

The foreign legion is not even included in the forces of rapid deployment.

Quote: Legionista

You, as a political officer, are given out by the frequent use of personal and possessive pronouns- "we, to us, to us"))))

You are betrayed as an ordinary shiver by the fact that you have no idea about the Conscientious Army and do not suspect that there are people better than you who know the French army, in which the foreign legion is too small a structure to take into account in the general balance of the armed forces. But you continue to campaign, although I do not think that there are still fools in Russia who will go to serve voluntarily in the Foreign Legion - you are behind the times, we are not nineties.

[Legionista]

Throw out your training manual for the political officer))) FAR do not exist since 1998. However, at the time of its existence, the 6th Armored Cavalry Division included 2 REI, 1 REC, 6 REG. The composition of 11 VDD included 2 REP.

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

Throw out your training manual for the political officer)))

This is not a training manual for a political officer, but an official document for a limited contingent of GSVG officers. But it can be seen from it that even during the Cold War, no one took the Foreign Legion seriously, as it does now.

Quote: Legionista

However, at the time of its existence, the 6th Armored Cavalry Division included 2 REI, 1 REC, 6 REG. The composition of 11 VDD included 2 REP.

Well, you yourself proved that IL did not even trust independent operational tasks, and he could not solve them without the division commander. That is why he was completely reassigned to the division commander, who was superior in status to any IL commander. You are still that "professional" as I can see.

[Legionista]

You, as an ordinary trepach, are betrayed by what you have no idea about the Conscientious Army

1990-1992. VUS 172039)

[Legionista]

Keywords for VUS-SLVI 71, developed in the year when you probably graduated from the university))

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

1990-1992.

I thought it was one of the "jackets", but it turned out that you only had an urgent one, and even then it was worthless, since you do not know what your political officers were doing. Only I still don’t understand why there is such a puppy delight from serving in a foreign legion, if the Soviet Army had units much more abruptly than in the IL? I understand that need forced you to go there to serve, but this is not a reason to be proud of it - by the way, some who served there, just here at VO, dissuaded the naive from repeating your example.

[Legionista]

1992-1997VVUZ), 1997-2001 served as ZabVO. Further, as written)) some are reduced, young- green "by the state" in the national economy)))

but this is not a reason to be proud of it - by the way, some who served there, just here in VO, discouraged the naive from repeating your example.

He served honestly, there is nothing to be ashamed of.

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

He served honestly, there is nothing to be ashamed of.

And I would be ashamed to take off the epaulettes of an officer of the Soviet (Russian) Army and go to serve a foreign state. I have more respect for those who taxed as needed or worked as security guards at that time, which is why I don’t understand your choice. I understand those who, having no education and work, did not know where to put themselves at that time, and went to serve in the legion, but you seem to be not in this category. This is strange for me, I will not hide. By the way, from which country did you go to the legion?

[Legionista]

And I would be ashamed to take off the epaulettes of an officer of the Soviet (Russian) Army and go to serve a foreign state

I was ashamed when Starley shot himself on duty. Because he was married, they didn’t pay money, someone put up with it, someone didn’t. Just do not “recall the hardships and deprivations of military service”. I remember evrything)

By the way, from which country did you go to the legion?

Directly from Russia.

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

I was ashamed when Starley shot himself on duty.

In the part where I served, in the eighties a major shot himself on duty due to family troubles. So this is not an indicator for everyone who served at a time when there was relative stability.

Quote: Legionista

I remember evrything)

I also remember how I secretly worked part-time, realizing that my career could collapse instantly - and now what to build out of myself as a "hero" who survived the time of troubles?

Quote: Legionista

Directly from Russia.

This is strange for me. I returned from well-fed Germany to complete discord at the end of 1992, and I didn’t even think about staying in a foreign country, as some of those who served in the Western Peace Group did. Apparently I was just a more mature person than you when you made this decision.

[Anton S]

"A foreign legion is not even included in the rapid deployment force."
I’ll let you insert my 5 kopecks because I also served in the Legion. In the 2000s, France actively promoted the idea of ​​including in the COS a landing regiment (combat 00), which would be assigned to assault missions. According to the fighting qualities of the 11th parachute brigade only 2 REPs came up. As a result, they didn’t include him there, because foreigners cannot serve in COS, but they didn’t include any other regular army parachute regiment there either. Formally, 2 REPs are not included in COS, but in fact, they use it. The last three operating rooms The jump is all on the REPa account.
And about the prestige of serving in the legion for officers, you are mistaken. During his service, he crossed paths with cadet officers (before graduation, they have many different lengths of service: parachute jumping, mountain training, going to Djibouti, Guiana and before.) They spoke that the first of the release always choose either the legion or the paratroopers.
And there are not so many legion officers in the top command, because they are few in percentage of the total mass of army, navy and air force officers. And to get to the very top you need to be not only a good officer, but also from the right family (officer- rather closed caste in France).
And regarding the motivation for serving in the Legion, believe me, it’s not only money and documents, each one has her own, but there will be enough impressions for the rest of my life.
Sincerely.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

. During his service, he crossed paths with cadet officers 3 times (before graduation, they have many different lengths of service: parachute jumping, mountain training, going to Djibouti, Guiana and before.) They said that the first ones from the graduation always choose either a legion or paratroopers .

They go to serve there specifically in order to take a course, and after that they try to immediately go into the ordinary troops. In Soviet times, too, in Soviet times, many graduates of the MBOKU went to the ZabVO or TurkVO for a couple of years, so that later they would have a mark in the characteristic "began to serve in a distant garrison" apparatus. I think that the French cadets did not tell you about all their true motives sincerely, especially those who did not have a great military pedigree behind them.

Quote: Anton S

And in order to get to the very top, you need to be not only a good officer, but also from the right family (officers are a rather closed caste in France).

I completely agree, as well as with the fact that the "necessary family" is unlikely to advise their offspring to go to IL, because they are planning another military career for him. It is precisely because of the caste nature of the French army that service in IL has always been considered a milk-producing occupation, and this has not changed until now, although no one speaks about this openly, and even admire IL at parades.

Quote: Anton S

And regarding the motivation for serving in the Legion, believe me, it’s not only money and documents, each one has her own, but there will be enough impressions for the rest of my life.

How about motivation to serve your country on a long trip or a long business trip outside the country? Is it not honorable for anyone who decides to make military service his vocation? Why get into the Foreign Legion, if not because of money - you can explain to me, if only because of curiosity.

[Anton S]

I do not consider myself to be altruists; any hard work must be paid. But money was not my main motive. I wanted to see the world and show myself.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

But money was not my main motive.

And what was the main motive?

Quote: Anton S

I wanted to see the world and show myself.

My brother, for forty years, traveled around all the seas and oceans of the world as a senior electrician on various ships and visited more than 80 countries of the world, and in even more ports and airports. I think that he has seen much more in life than you could see in IL. Why doesn’t this career suit you? But alright, let you not like the sea, let’s leave it. What made you risk your head in the interests of a foreign state - do you think you left a mark in the history of France? An optimistic choice, you will not say anything ...

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

in the French zone of Germany

Quote: ccsr

it was part of the protocol of the activities of the allied armies. Some were even detained at our training grounds.

Some kind of mess. IN Germany already there were no occupation zones. While the armies were allied, there were no "our training grounds"

Quote: ccsr

Just four generals

We are waiting for at least one surname from you that you know "due to your official duties"
wait, wait .. :))

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

Some kind of mess. Germany no longer had occupation zones

Meshanina in your head - in Germany there were three zones of the occupying forces.

Quote: nks

While the armies were allied, there were no "our training grounds"

Our landfills were in the GDR - it was our occupation zone in accordance with the Potsdam agreements.

Quote: nks

We are waiting for at least one surname from you that you know "due to your official duties"

Learn what I knew in my time

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

in Germany there were three zones of the occupying forces.

Separate western occupation zones existed until 48, then merged into one, and then, as a result of their abolition, Germany appeared.

Quote: ccsr

Our landfills were in the GDR

Already better. Allied relations between the USSR and Western countries within the framework of the anti-Hitler coalition lasted until a maximum of 1947. When did the GDR form? Do you know?

Quote: ccsr

Learn what I knew in my time

And can you find out which of these Monsieurs served in the MMFL and spoke Russian (I don’t ask about your personal contacts with them)?

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

Separate western occupation zones existed until 48, then merged into one, and then, as a result of their abolition, Germany appeared.

The occupation zones of Germany always existed, up to the unification of Germany, because the location of the occupying forces was secured by the Potsdam agreements. The borders of the occupation zones were clearly defined, and if there were any incidents with the troops, then the commanders of those zones in whose territory it happened were disassembled.

Quote: nks

Allied relations between the USSR and Western countries within the framework of the anti-Hitler coalition lasted a maximum until 1947

Lies, because mandatory visits by the commanders of the four zones of occupation were routine planned activities. We were not allies, but the occupation zones themselves retained their borders. Moreover, even the corridors of passage to West Berlin, where there were also three zones of the occupying forces, were necessarily agreed with our Commander-in-Chief, as responsible for his zone of occupation.

Quote: nks

And you can find out which of these Monsieur served in the MMFL

Find out if you are interested. You asked for the names of the French military - I brought them, so there is no need to wag and be clever. I did not have personal contacts with them, but I saw those who commanded the French troops in the FRG, because they had repeatedly come to Wünsdorf with official izites. It was an ordinary procedure, we even sometimes invited them to our classes on command training:

Once, a small American group arrived at the GSVG headquarters to watch some training camp on the territory of one of the divisions (such delegations exchanged between former allies from time to time). And the devil pulled them to express a desire to drive to the gathering place on our vehicle together with the staff officers. They appointed a departure time, created a convoy of 8-10 buses, plus escort and at the appointed time, they left for a certain place (either Altengrabov, or somewhere else, I don’t remember). About two hours later, arrived at the place, unloaded and wait for the team.

http://zapravdu.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=2561&p=153055&hilit=творчество#p153055

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

You asked for the names of the French military - I brought them, so there is no need to wag and be clever

MDA .... Then I will quote (or do you immediately forget what you write?)
"I knew their psychology because of my job duties"
"they just talked to our missionaries, who were fluent in French, and spoke out of corporate solidarity."
"All French missionaries in Potsdam were fluent in Russian."

So what can you say about psychology, service in the MMFL and knowledge of Russian of the French officers you quoted?

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

So what can you say about psychology,

The fact that it is fundamentally different from the psychology of the ordinary and sergeant composition of the IL.

Quote: nks

and knowledge of Russian French officers brought by you

Why did you suddenly decide that the top military leaders of the French Armed Forces are required to know the Russian language? He was well known to those who worked against us as part of the French military mission, and I myself heard one of the officers speaking in Russian during another event when they visited the group headquarters. What is incomprehensible to you in this?

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

I myself heard a speech by one of the officers in Russian during a regular event when they visited the headquarters of the group. What is incomprehensible to you in this?

Yes, that’s clear enough for me - I won’t deprive you of the pleasure of acrobatic shoes (this is apparently deeply professional), but what kind of officer will you name? Did he say something about the legion?

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

But will you call this officer? Did he say something about the legion?

Don’t be stupid - information about the French army was obtained by our missionaries who served in the French zone of occupation, and they were fluent in French. Enlighten yourself, since you don’t know anything about it:

All members of the missions had permanent passes in two languages, freely moving around the territory of the occupation zone. The exception was the location of military units. The "missionaries" were obliged to wear military uniforms, to drive in official vehicles with special, one-of-a-kind numbers, which was a big minus for scouts. The mission under the US Army Commander-in-Chief in Europe is located on the outskirts of Frankfurt. In the spa town of Bad Salzuflen, which is 100 kilometers from Hanover, the Soviet mission is located under the commander of the British Rhine Army. Later, the mission will change its deployment and move to the nearby city of Bünde. But in the famous Baden-Baden, the Soviet communications mission was stationed under the commander of the French troops in Germany.
..... The chief of the mission, his deputy (with the rank of colonel - major general), middle officers (with the rank of major-lieutenant colonel), As a rule, they were graduates of the Military Diplomatic Academy. Often they also had two academic entities. Indeed, in intelligence they tried to attract officers who had already proved themselves in practical work, who knew how to lead people. So, on his second foreign trip, Hero of the Soviet Union, Colonel Ivan Lezhov, the head of the Soviet military mission under the Commander-in-Chief of the US Army in Europe in 1964-1970, arrived when he had three diplomas in his "officer satchel": the end of the Air Force, the Military diplomatic academies and the Academy of the General Staff.

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

-Paul LARDRY, General of the Army (highest military rank of the French Armed Forces) Commander I.L. in 1980-1982, in 1986-1988 commander of the rapid reaction forces (FAR), (for the political officers from the Western Group of Forces, it was this general who commanded the "Moineau Hardi" maneuvers in Germany in 1986. But apparently the "professionals in their field" forgot to report this)

An interesting career - he commanded the IL for only two years, and quickly left there in the rapid reaction forces, where, by the way, the IL units are not included. This is the price of "prestigious service in the legion" for a normal officer of the French armed forces. By the way, IL units have never been involved in large-scale exercises at the theater of military operations - we did not even include them in the reference books because of their small numbers and weak weapons.

Quote: Legionista

Bruno DARY, Army General, Commander I.L. in 2004-2006,

Quote: Legionista

-Alain BOUQUIN, General de corps d'armee. Commander I.L. in 2009-2011.

Two years of command of the IL - this speaks about everything about these generals and about their desire to serve in the legion.

[Legionista]

Two years of command of the IL - this speaks about everything about these generals and about their desire to serve in the legion.

Too lazy to translate from French into Russian the entire biography of these and other generals. For this I write the name, surname and title in its original form. With a sufficient level of intellectual development, as well as with access to the media, everything can be found). For the politicians I’ll explain, to become the commander of I.L. it is necessary, at least, to occupy the primary officer position in the units of I.L.

[Legionista]

we didn’t even include them at all in reference books because of their small size and weak armament.

That is why in I.L. greatly offended by you)), depressed, and flew to Africa to hunt oppressed natives))))

[Ryazan87]

I think your opponent understands everything well, but continues the argument out of ideological stubbornness. Of course, if the future conflict is presented exclusively in the form of tank wedges to the English Channel with a dozen nuclear mushrooms on the horizon, then several thousand well-trained light-armed infantrymen may not play a special role (although this depends on the use, they will undermine something important or organize several centers of resistance and everything will become sad).
But according to this logic, and, say, the military formations of the General Staff of the General Staff of the USSR Armed Forces, "this is generally ridiculous chickens." Yes, and the Airborne Forces of the Soviet period, it turns out, are not far away - the same light infantry, in general. And nothing, over time, the landing "birds", Rooks with Swans, took over the entire army.

[Legionista]

Of course, if the future conflict is presented exclusively in the form of tank wedges to the English Channel with a dozen nuclear mushrooms on the horizon, then several thousand well-trained light-armed infantrymen may not play a special role

I agree with you categorically . Legionnaires are precisely "well-trained foot soldiers." In a bear circus they teach to ride a bicycle, and in 5 years you can confidently teach a person in the specialty “00” (French equivalent of our VUS 100000A)

[Ryazan87]

Unfortunately, in the post-war Soviet army with well-trained infantry (motorized riflemen, I mean) there was a rather tense situation. Why? But your opponent demonstrates why: "there is no reception against scrap", why bother when we have tank armadas, special warheads and artillery with 250 barrels per kilometer of the front. And so it will do.
Although in the GSVG, combat training was conducted intensively, if compared with troops within the Union.
As a result, in real, not planned wars, they began to use the same paratroopers as ordinary infantry, because they knew how to at least minimally.
They took here, for example, and dispersed mountain rifle units - "the chickens laugh," on donkeys with mortars. And 10 years have not passed, the Afghan campaign has begun - hello hot ...

[Legionista]

I agree with your point of view.

As a result, in real, not planned wars, they began to use the same paratroopers as ordinary infantry,

Sometimes this comparison is very frustrating paratroopers, but, alas, it was. You can also recall how the Marines of the Northern Fleet and Pacific Fleet were used in the First and Second Chechen War.

[ccsr]

Quote: Ryazanets87

I think your opponent understands everything well, but continues the argument out of ideological stubbornness.

This is a professional assessment of IL, you just can not understand it.

Quote: Ryazanets87

But according to this logic, and, say, the military formations of the General Staff of the General Staff of the USSR Armed Forces, "this is generally ridiculous chickens."

Your ignorance surprises me - the parts of the GRU of the General Staff are support parts, and ILs are all the same combat units. Do you even figure this out first when you start comparing them in terms of quality and capabilities, otherwise professionals will laugh at you. By the way, in some parts of the GRU the General Staff served more officers than they were in the entire Foreign Legion during the collapse of the USSR - and this is a fact.

Quote: Ryazanets87

Yes, and the Soviet Airborne, it turns out, not far gone - the same light infantry,

One Airborne Division was almost one and a half times larger than the entire Foreign Legion in number, and I am not even talking about weapons. So be careful with such statements.

Quote: Ryazanets87

... And nothing, over time, the landing "birds", Rooks with Swans, took over the entire army.

Yes, they were first-class fools, and both had a bad memory - one could not find a normal subordinate and climbed into Grozny himself without appropriate training, and the second was cursed in the army for the "peace" he signed. You have "good" landmarks for those who now serve ...

[Legionista]

This is a professional assessment of IL, you just can not understand it.

By the way, in some parts of the GRU the General Staff served more officers than they were in the entire Foreign Legion during the collapse of the USSR - and this is a fact.

accountants from NATO or ATS counted?

So be careful with such statements.

And what will happen ?? Duel)?

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

accountants from NATO or ATS counted?

You apparently are not able to understand that some of the servicemen had data on the staffing structure of not only the formations of the Soviet Army, but also of our probable enemy.

Quote: Legionista

And what will happen ?? Duel)?

I think there will be a debunking of the myths about the IL, and about how French officers "dream" of getting there, especially after an official flight.

[Legionista]

Given that you are older than me in age, I apologize for the possibly rudeness.

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

Given that you are older than me in age, I apologize for the possibly rudeness.

Come on, apologize - here we are all users with our point of view, and if they sharply uphold it, then there are unpleasant assessments regardless of age. I am a realist, and I don’t bother with this - I see no reason to be offended by someone for what he expressed here. Moreover, here and inadequate often scribble different nonsense.

[Ryazan87]

you just can't understand it.

The argument is what you need. However, I really do not quite understand what you want to prove. What are legionnaires poorly trained? What Legion as a combat unit can not be taken into account? That the officers of the Legion in the French army are somehow particularly disliked? If you meant that IL couldn’t defeat the Soviet army alone, well, yes, of course.

Your ignorance surprises me - the parts of the GRU of the General Staff are support parts, and ILs are all the same combat units.

Well, if we consider the 2nd parachute landing regiment of the IL, then why not compare in quality and capabilities. However, if you want to be surprised and laugh - at health.

in some parts of the GRU, the General Staff served more officers than they were in the entire Foreign Legion during the collapse of the USSR — and this is a fact.

AND? And in the Soviet army, officers, in principle, served significantly more than in the French - also a fact.

One Airborne Division outnumbered the entire Foreign Legion by almost one and a half times

- it was, we note, not about the number.

Yes, these were primary fools, and both of them had a bad memory.

Here I agree with you. The "landing lobby" did a lot of harm to both the Soviet army and the Russian one.

[ccsr]

Quote: Ryazanets87

However, I really do not quite understand what you want to prove. What are legionnaires poorly trained?

Trained in the same way as the entire French army, with some specifics necessary for foreign business trips - such as our military police in Syria.

Quote: Ryazanets87

What Legion as a combat unit can not be taken into account?

Of course, you can’t take it into account - the legion does not even draw for a full-fledged formation of the French army. Well, you can’t bother with such structures, otherwise we will drown in a sea of ​​unnecessary information. By the way, one of those who served there, he himself said that their units would actually be drawn into a light armored cavalry division - that’s the answer that we must take into account.

Quote: Ryazanets87

That the officers of the Legion in the French army are somehow particularly disliked?

Do not distort - I did not say that. I only claimed that the overwhelming majority of Saint Cyr graduates are unlikely to go to serve in the Foreign Legion, because there is too little prospective service, and the contingent is not at all one to be proud of later. In France there are more elitist formations and regiments, and the composition there will be of higher quality.

Quote: Ryazanets87

AND? And in the Soviet army, officers, in principle, served significantly more than in the French - also a fact.

That is why we did not stoop to taking into account the Foreign Legion as a full-fledged military formation in France.

Quote: Ryazanets87

- it was, we note, not about the number.

The point is not only in numbers, but also in quality, our airborne regiments are much stronger in terms of weapons and training of commanders in operational and tactical terms. If you carefully studied the scattering of the IL regiments, and compared them with the placement of the airborne regiments, then you would understand that the commander of the airborne division would conduct exercises at a higher level, fulfilling the tasks of the formation. Military skill is formed from such "trifles".

[Anton S]

"and the contingent is not at all the one to be proud of. In France there are also more elite formations and regiments, and the composition there will be of better quality."
Can you give an example, what kind of shelves are these?
For example, 2 REP is considered the best regiment of the 11th parachute brigade.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

Can you give an example, what kind of shelves are these?

Unfortunately, now there is no directory at hand, but from memory I can definitely say that those regiments and formations that fought against Germany in the 19th century have a higher status in the French Armed Forces system. Of the more modern units, aviation regiments are especially respected, especially those that can carry nuclear weapons by air. As far as I remember, the most prestigious are the commanders of submarines with ballistic missiles on board - this is almost the national pride of France. However, I could miss something - too much time has passed since when I was interested in it. That is why a beginner career officer is not always advised to go to IL - there are other ways to advance in the service.

[Anton S]

You just pointed out in your comments that “the contingent there is not at all the same.” The contingent there is just the same, very much the same. And what determines the membership of the elite of a regiment? In the modern world, it is certainly not the number of battles written on the regimental banner, but by the number of operations carried out, and an officer who did not participate in them will never move up the career ladder, even if his regiment is at least three times elite.
Legion officers make a career in the French army and only then can they get to the very top. To serve in the submarine fleet and aviation is prestigious everywhere, but, as a rule, with rare exceptions, they do not later become chiefs of the General Staff. The chances of a French officer to make a successful career are not great if he did not command a platoon and a company of paratroopers or legionnaires (submarines and aircraft did not attack everyone).
In general, the Foreign Legion is the elite of the army, 2 REP, in particular, the elite of the 11th brigade, which combines the airborne regiments of France.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

You just pointed out in your comments that "the contingent there is not at all the same."

Not exactly that - there are too few native citizens of France among ordinary and sergeant personnel.

Quote: Anton S

And what determines the membership of the elite of a regiment?

The further career of his commanders and senior officers.

Quote: Anton S

And an officer who did not participate in them will never advance through the ranks, even if his regiment was at least three times elite once.

You just don’t have to tell this - you yourself claimed that the caste was highly developed, and from which family the officer was more important than his service in the legion.

Quote: Anton S

Serving in the submarine fleet and aviation is prestigious everywhere, but, as a rule, with rare exceptions, it is not they who later become the chiefs of the General Staff.

This is not so - in the directory I gave the name of the admiral, chief of staff of the French Armed Forces, you can see his career yourself.

Quote: Anton S

The chances of a French officer to make a successful career are not great if he did not command a platoon and company of paratroopers or legionnaires

Do not tell me, the legion does not even have heavy weapons. And how then can the regiment commander from IL become the chief of staff of the French heavy division? No need to fantasize, there are their own orders, which do not differ much from those in other armies of the world, and a healthy careerism will not allow advancement for those who do not have the command of full-fledged parts of France.

Quote: Anton S

In general, the Foreign Legion is the elite of the army, 2 REP, in particular, the elite of the 11th brigade, which combines the airborne regiments of France.

Perhaps in the legion they think so, only the reality there was different - at least according to our military experts. How can the legion be an elite if it does not have OTR and heavy armored vehicles in service, not to mention more complex systems that allow the use of tactical nuclear weapons.

[Anton S]

And what, that there is little native population there? Human material there is an order of magnitude higher than the regular army.
Belonging to the elite is determined not by the further career of its officers, but by operations.
Yes, I argued that caste was developed in the French army, but if you were even the son of a generalissimo, you would not advance higher if you did not participate in operations.
About the admiral from the directory, I said that they did not become chiefs of the General Staff, with rare exceptions.
About heavy weapons: if an officer did not command howitzer artillery, this does not prevent him from making a successful career in the army.
Well, about nuclear weapons, you have already gone far. In your opinion, it turns out that only the Strategic Missile Forces of the Russian Federation are the elite of the Armed Forces, and all the rest in Russia are not.
The elite of the unit lies in the operations carried out and conducted by it, and not in potential opportunities.

[Ryazan87]

During the discussion, I became interested in the current state of the French army (Source - "White Paper on Defense", data for 2017).
Total:
French Ground Forces (Armée de terre française) - 131 thousand people. Including about 66 тыс. - in combat units.
Foreign legion - 8,9 thousand people (i.e. 6,7% of the total number of ground forces)
There are no divisions as such now (in 1989 they were), there are only headquarters. The main unit is the brigade.
The structure is taken from an open source (for 2018) - IL is highlighted in red, very clearly:

Well, you need to consider:
"... According to the degree of combat readiness, out of all of the above, only parts of the Foreign Legion are constantly kept in full states, which acquire full combat readiness within 72 hours from the moment of receiving the order. Within 5-7 days, the 3rd and 6th lungs and 11th Parachute Brigade, categorized as rapid deployment forces. "
"The total strength of the French Army's high alert forces is approximately 20 to 23. Of these, the Joint Reaction Force numbers only 5000."
"There have been no major exercises at least at the brigade level in France since 2006, and the regimental ones since 2008. The battalion in full force entered the training ground for the last time in 2010." *
That is in view of this and it is worth making conclusions, IMHO.
And so, yes, the commander of one of the 4 French SSBNs or there "Charles de Gaulle" to be cooler than an IL officer. But this is simple and it is not correct to compare it from the word at all, especially since Saint-Cyr, mentioned several times here, trains officers of the ground forces, and by no means the fleet.
* data for 2017

[Legionista]

Here is a comment with facts and arguments.

units of the Foreign Legion that are fully operational within 72 hours of receipt of the order.

. That's right. This is called the Alerte GUÉPARD. 72-hour availability is replaced by 48-hour availability, then 24 and 12-hour availability. It was on this alarm that 2REP flew to Kolwezi in 1978.

[Legionista]

There was another, not very advertised reason. In 1978, the Feast of the Holy Trinity- (PENTECÔTE) fell on May 14th. All regiments that were on duty were unable to quickly assemble their l / s, because all went home. In 2 REP this problem was not - “Legio-Patria Nostra”. 98% l / s was in the regiment.

[ccsr]

Quote: Ryazanets87

That is in view of this and it is worth making conclusions, IMHO.

Inferences should be drawn from other definitions of the Strategic Review, not what you are referring to:

For the first time since the end of the Cold War, Russia has been viewed as a source of military threat to Europe. It notes "the deployment of large Russian groupings of troops near the borders of European countries", "the illegal annexation of Crimea, followed by a build-up of the military presence and the transformation of the peninsula into a bastion on the Black Sea, just like Kaliningrad in the Baltic states", "forceful intervention in the conflict in Donbas and the absence in the implementation of the Minsk agreements, "a provocative demonstration of military force in the Baltic region," "an increase in the intensity of military activity in the northern part of the Atlantic (flights of strategic bombers, patrolling of submarines)."

That is why, based on the concept of "containment", France relies on its own strategic nuclear forces, and not on IL units, which are better than others capable of fighting in overseas territories:

In this regard, France intends to continue to ensure the required level of combat readiness of the naval and air components of the strategic nuclear forces (SNF). Currently, the naval component is represented by a squadron of nuclear missile submarines. The squadron includes four SSBNs of the Triumfan project, which are armed with three sets of ballistic missiles, 16 M-51 SLBMs each. The air component includes 32 Rafale F3 aircraft and 20 Mirage-2000N aircraft, ready to use 52 ASMP-A missile launchers with nuclear warheads.

Foreign military review. 2018, No.4 S. 19-26
And I’m not saying this, but Colonel A. Shapovalov, doctor of military sciences, associate professor, with whose opinion I completely agree, but you can continue to blow into your tune about IL, and how he will fight against Russia.

[Ryazan87]

and you can continue to blow into your dupe about IL, and how he will fight against Russia.

But to invent something for the opponent, and then refute it somehow .. well, at least unprofessionally
I meant: 1. IL currently plays an important role in the structure French Army and is practically the most combat-ready part of them. And most importantly - ready to join the battle in an extremely short time. 2. To judge the combat value based solely on the number + presence of heavy weapons is very reckless.
Where did I write about the war with Russia? Although, by the way, in the framework of a conflict like Donbass (and this is the most realistic version of the collision in the European theater of operations now), IL will be much more sense than all SSBNs combined.

You first started talking about "heavy divisions", then when it turned out that there were no divisions in France for a long time, you moved on to the idea that SSBNs are very cool and elite compared to the infantry. Because, it turns out, within the framework of the concept of "containment" of Russia (which is named one of the sources military threat), France is betting on strategic nuclear forces. And I, a sinner, thought that they decided to arrange Borodino with motorized infantry, and with Leclerks (instead of cuirassiers). Thanks, enlightened.
Then the following story, how officers do not want to serve in the IL, because there, you see, it is impossible to get the proper command experience. And this is taking into account the fact that in France at least brigade exercises have not been conducted for about 15 years. Of course, sitting in a cropped brigade without a real chance to participate in at least some kind of military operation is an invaluable experience.

There are potential threats and conflicts, but there are real ones. Why bother them in one boiler?

[ccsr]

Quote: Ryazanets87

I mean:

I don’t know what you meant, but I gave you the opinion of a military professional, and nothing is said about the legion there.

Quote: Ryazanets87

You first started talking about "heavy divisions", then when it turned out that there were no divisions in France for a long time,

Who told you that they are not there, if they are deployed in the same way as our cadre divisions in all the internal districts of the USSR. Do you even know that at that time only the GSVG had fully equipped armies with five divisions, and in the districts of the army they had, at best, one fully deployed division, and everything else was of a reduced composition. France went the same way because it saves the military budget.

Quote: Ryazanets87

And this taking into account the fact that in France at least brigade exercises have not been conducted for 15 years.

But are you an expert on their command-staff exercises at the level of the corps and above, that you immediately decided that since there were no brigade exercises, then in general everyone had scored for combat training? Do not tell me - even front-line KSUs could be carried out here without the involvement of troops, and the armies were used only to imitate the exchange of information, so that the reports resembled real changes in the operational situation.

Quote: Ryazanets87

There are potential threats and conflicts, but there are real ones. Why bother them in one boiler?

You’d better carefully read what they write about IL and compare their 72-hour readiness (three days!) With at least the daily readiness of our first-line enlistees who, after 24 hours, held military posts in the country's air defense or in some other parts, where there were strict standards for admission of enlisted personnel. And you want to prove something to me regarding the IL, although it is clear to me that their readiness is just a kindergarten, compared with the readiness of 45-55 minutes of shelves in the GSVG. Do you even know anything about our combat readiness before you admire the order in the IL? I think that your knowledge is too superficial, and this is noticeable.

[Ryazan87]

I don’t know what you meant

I already understood that. With regard to the French's assessment of military threats, please read the White Paper on Defense and National Security 2014-2025:
"... The doctrine proceeds from the fact that the country's unique geographical position excludes any direct threat of a global war directly in Europe. However, it is noted that threats requiring military repulsion may arise in other regions of the world. In particular, difficulties are mentioned in the Sino-Japanese, Russian-Japanese, Japanese-Korean relations, the dangerous situation around the DPRK, the Indo-Pakistani conflict and the situation in Afghanistan. Separately, the growing threat of international terrorism and the threat of destabilization in the Sahel region, which is important for France, are noted. Of course, Colonel A. Shapovalov can adequately assess the likelihood of a land conflict between France and Russia, and therefore wrote what he wrote.

Who told you that they are not there, if they are deployed in the same way as our cadre divisions in all the internal districts of the USSR.

About "castrated" divisions, I "at least" know. But about "exactly the same" - I strongly doubt: "The French command plans to form divisions or any other large military formations only" locally "based on the specific composition and nature of the threat." It was not like that in the USSR.
Who has learned from whom, keeping in mind the Serdyukov reforms of the "brigade", is also a big question.
It's funny, but historically the French already had something like such a system, just before the war of 1870. Also, the divisions began to form "in fact" and "need" during the period of mobilization and the beginning of the war. Well it is, aside.

that since there are no brigade exercises, then in general everyone scored on combat training?

again ascribe to me your own thoughts. I didn’t say that. And yes, KSH is an excellent thing, but it is impossible to completely replace them with real teachings. Real combat experience, by the way, too. Why? Mr. Clausewitz wrote excellently about this (I certainly read it, I am sure of it).

You would better read carefully what they write about IL and compare their 72 hour readiness (three days!) With at least the daily readiness of our first-priority assignees .. their readiness is just a kindergarten, compared with the readiness of 45-55 minutes of shelves in the GSVG ..

Those. from comparing IL with other parts of the ground forces of France, we smoothly proceed to comparison with the troops of the Northern Fleet, which for almost 30 years has not existed. Well, OK.

I think that your knowledge is too superficial, and this is noticeable.

Well, I did not proclaim myself a professional. So, an amateur interested.
And by the way, you just wrote "... Of the more modern units, aviation regiments are especially respected, especially those that can carry nuclear weapons by aircraft."
If anyone is interested: the Strategic Aviation Command (Commandement des forces aeriennes strategiques) includes:
- Fighter-bomber aviation squadron "Gascony";
- Lafayette fighter-bomber squadron;
- refueling air squadron "Brittany".
That's all the "shelves"
The structure of the French Air Force.

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

That is why, based on the concept of "containment", France relies on its strategic nuclear forces, and not on IL units

She has always done this since the creation of the strategic nuclear forces. In the Russian Federation Airborne Division or something containment do you think provide? Each type and unit has its own tasks. Listen, what graduate school did you get to know?

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

She has always done this since the creation of the strategic nuclear forces.

So even more so, it was not worth fooling people about the charms of the Foreign Legion, which against their background looks like the usual insignificant unit of the ground forces of France. And then inflated from the molehills and rejoice that someone will believe in fairy tales about this legion.

Quote: nks

Listen, what graduate school did you get to know?

If you want, you will find it yourself. Where I studied, A.I. Denikin was educated, but this is not the main thing, because the officer’s level is determined by the last position. That's why your question betrayed you with your head - you have thinking at the level of conscripts.

[Legionista]

Where I studied, A.I.Denikin was educated,

I suppose we are talking about KVOKDKU them. M.V. Frunze? Fak. Troop intelligence? Did Lieutenant General Kravchenko release?

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

I suppose we are talking about KVOKDKU them. M.V. Frunze?

I believe that you do not know where A.I. Denikin studied. I have an engineering background, is that enough for you?

[Legionista]

I believe that you do not know where A.I. Denikin studied.

I was sure that Anton Ivanovich Denikin studied at the Kiev Infantry Junker School, but I could not even imagine that you studied at the same school))) Or did you go through training at the Nikolaev Academy of the General Staff))? In any case, to get an education in educational institutions of the Russian Empire and end the service in the GSVG is not to tickle a navel for a hare!

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

I was sure that Anton Ivanovich Denikin studied at the Kiev Infantry Junker School, but I could not even imagine that you studied at the same school

I lived in the same barracks as AI Denikin - read at your leisure about the "Konstantinovtsy", maybe you will understand something. And the continuity of the traditions of the Russian army has not been canceled even in Soviet times - it is enough to study the charter of the G and KS and the biographies of individual Soviet commanders.

Quote: Legionista

In any case, to get an education in educational institutions of the Russian Empire and end the service in the GSVG is not to tickle a navel for a hare!

You are just an eccentric, with attempts at originality - I went to the GSVG to serve from a higher structure than the headquarters of the group, and ended the service in it, having returned from the Western Peace Group. So get away - you have not even left the category of young officers, but you are already undertaking to discuss those who have gone too far from you in military service.

[Legionista]

Where I studied, A.I.Denikin was educated,

I lived in the same barracks as A.I. Denikin

You already decide, you lived or

studied

in places somehow connected with A.I. Denikin. About "Konstantinovtsy" I know that the so-called junkers of the Konstantinovsky Artillery School - "Who is impolite, stupid and stupid? This is a junker-konstapup ..."))) - this is not my idea . That's just what this has to do with Denikin, I really don't know).

So get away - you have not even left the category of young officers, but you are already undertaking to discuss those who have gone too far from you in military service.

Indeed, it’s time to hang out. It was fun with you) Thank you
"Qui nimium probat, nihil probat"

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

You already decide whether you lived or
studied

And he lived and studied.
Enlighten:
http://regiment.ru/reg/VI/C/10/1.htm

Quote: Legionista

Indeed, it’s time to hang out. It was fun with you)

But I didn’t really - they crushed those who did not have experience in the SA, but who are trying to prove that they know much more those who have seen more of them in life ..

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

Indeed, it’s time to hang out. It was fun with you)

Tell me in good faith - you are under fifty dollars, as I understood from the term of military service, and most likely there are already children and grandchildren. Will you advise them to go to serve in the Foreign Legion or not? Only honestly and without reservation.

[Legionista]

Good day! You are absolutely right) I am 48, there are children I will not advise in any case!

Only honestly and without reservation.

Fair. Fulfilling your condition, I will not indicate reservations and the reasons for my “not advising”

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

Good day! You are absolutely right) I am 48, there are children I will not advise in any case!

I knew all this beforehand - you just began to look at life in the light of your experience, and it forces you to give an assessment of your youthful moves in projecting the future of your children and grandchildren.
So understand correctly - I just didn’t want one of our citizens, having read articles about IL, to repeat your path, which you will never advise your children to choose. My son went in tenth grade to a five-day training camp in one of the Moscow Region units and after that said that he would not go to serve in the army and chose a different path. But if he decided to go serve, believe me, I would never discourage him.

[Legionista]

So get it right - I just didn’t want one of our citizens, having read articles about IL, to repeat your path, which you will never advise your children to choose

I agree with you, in turn, never! I would not want my comments to be considered advertisements encouraging me to enter I.L.
I think that the incentive to enter / ignore I.L. , serves, nevertheless, the general situation in the country. I don’t think that the arguments for / against individuals, like you and me, can play any fundamental role. By the way, Russians (Russians) have always been the least, as a percentage of all Russian speakers. I, and others like me, in this particular case are certainly marginalized.

[nks]

Who's fooling around? Probably you yourself and others at the same time (together with Olgovich). Here is just a series of articles about the rich history and present of IL, which is interesting to many. None of the coolest / deadliest and "determining the fate of France" in the material.
A lot of work has been done and thanks to the author, although there are inaccuracies, some of which I have indicated, including, but the author is not particularly in a hurry to correct them.

You may have been dreaming of some kind of global war with NATO with throws to the English Channel (well, so that not without torn limbs, but with medals) while in France, but not at all a dream (or war) in France c USSR / RF. The French Armed Forces, including IL, ensure the safety and protection of the interests of the RF. IL is not an insignificant unit - it ensures, among other things, the safety of French citizens abroad and the French / European space program in Guiana.

Quote: ccsr

you have thinking at the conscript level.

Not guessing - I did not serve as an urgent one :) You see, I do not position myself as an expert at all, I am just an amateur interested in certain questions on this topic. For some reason, for some reason, in the topic about IL, you constantly refer to your professional experience, which has nothing to do with IL, while demonstrating ignorance of the basic regulatory things of IL. In fact, my question is different and not on the topic of IL - I wonder if Soviet officers were somehow taught / explained such concepts as "occupation regime" and all sorts of Geneva conventions, in accordance with which DB should be conducted? You just get the impression that no.

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

And who is fooling around? Probably you yourself and others at the same time (together with Olgovich). There is simply a series of articles about the rich history and real IL, which many people are interested in.

For example, you fool people by telling stories about the occupation zones. As for the "richest history" of the armed forces of France, it ended in disgrace from the capture of Paris by Russian troops during Napoleon's time, and subsequently by Hitler's troops in World War II. In order to somehow embellish their military history, the French deliberately inflate the myth of the Foreign Legion, although it is clear that this "cannon fodder" is not taken seriously even by the French military.

Quote: nks

You may have been dreaming of some kind of global war with NATO, with throws to the English Channel, while serving in the GSVG

Stop fussing about what you don’t know - at no FKSHU in the GSVG the option was even considered that we would be the first to go on the offensive, and the usual task was to practice defensive operations. And who thought you that in a nuclear war a group of forces would not have been destroyed before it could even penetrate the territory of Germany at least 100-200 km away. It looks like you are that couch strategist ...

Quote: nks

IL is not an insignificant unit - it ensures, among other things, the safety of French citizens abroad and the French / European space program in Guiana.

With us, the military police in Syria are doing this even more successfully - even sometimes Americans change diapers after meeting them.

Quote: nks

Did not guess - I did not serve urgent

It is sad. But why then are you making breathtaking conclusions, even if you have no idea about the army?

Quote: nks

I'm curious, were the Soviet officers somehow taught / explained such concepts as "occupation regime" and all sorts of Geneva conventions, in accordance with which the database should be conducted? You just get the impression that no.

I understand that you are an illiterate person in this matter, but at least you will carefully study it, because the fate of Germany was determined not in Geneva, but in Potsdam:

GROUP OF SOVIET OCCUPATIONAL A TRAIN IN GERMANY was created after the victory of the USSR and the anti-Hitler coalition in the Great Patriotic War and the unconditional surrender of Germany, based on the Directive of the Supreme Command High Command No. 11095 of May 29, 1945.
..... After the formation of the GDR (1949) and the abolition of occupation functions in 1954 in accordance with the General Staff directive of March 26, 1954, the Group of Soviet occupation forces in Germany from March 24, 1954 became known as the Group of Soviet Forces in Germany (GSVG).

Well, the Soviet government could not occupy the state of workers and peasants in the form of the GDR, which is why they gradually replaced the name of the group. Marxism does not provide for the occupation of one socialist state by another - however, I am afraid that you will not understand this, and your template has already broken from the abundance of unfamiliar information.

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

It is sad.

On the contrary, it’s wonderful. I also scored a military department at one time, being satisfied with relatively short-lived personal observation of Soviet officers of those times (if not for long, then it’s a pretty fun sight) and already after high school I realized that it was the right decision not to surrender military posts, and after talking with you only affirmed in his opinion.
I understand that at your age it is already difficult to change something in the brain and you will still live with American diapers, paddles and other complexes. My question about the Geneva Conventions did not refer to Germany, but to the Soviet army (and even the post-Soviet). The fate of Germany as a result of WWII was mainly decided in Yalta, and at the Potsdam conference there were questions about other countries, but I'm glad that you at least clarified (seemingly) for yourself what the occupation regime is.

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

My question about the Geneva Conventions did not refer to Germany, but to the Soviet army (and even the post-Soviet).

Your illiterate question was due to the lack of knowledge that the zones of German occupation remained until the complete withdrawal of Soviet troops from Germany. And not a single NATO soldier, except the German army, had the right without our permission to be in our occupation zone.

Quote: nks

The fate of Germany following WWII was decided mainly in Yalta,

And where was the delegation of France, since it was allocated the occupation zone? You are completely out of your mind - it is still unknown how the war will end from the point of view of at least the capture of Berlin, and in Yalta all the zones of occupation have been cut and even for France. Burn on, verbiage ...

Quote: nks

I scored on the military department in due time,

I realized that you are a white ticket soldier who has slanted from the army, you can not tell further.

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

that the zones of occupation of Germany remained until the complete withdrawal of Soviet troops from Germany.

Opps .. sorry, my joy was premature. It turned out that you did not understand, but just a hash in your head accidentally turned for a moment in almost the right way (like those broken clocks :)

Quote: ccsr

And where was the delegation of France, since it was allocated the occupation zone?

Here are the minutes of the Yalta Conference.
http://www.hist.msu.ru/ER/Etext/War_Conf/krim.htm
There this question was considered on different days, but perhaps the key
http://www.hist.msu.ru/ER/Etext/War_Conf/krim07.htm

The second issue at the meeting of foreign ministers was the question of the French zone of occupation. The following decision was made on this issue: a) consider the provision of France of the zone of occupation in Germany as agreed; b) the question of France’s participation in the supervisory board, V.M. Molotov and Mr. Stettinius consider it appropriate to refer to the European Advisory Commission. Mr. Eden considers it appropriate to discuss the issue of France’s admission to the supervisory board now, at a conference.

Details then, of course, were worked out in the European Consultative Commission - this is not the business of the heads of state.

Quote: ccsr

You are completely out of your mind - it is still unknown how the war will end from the point of view of at least the capture of Berlin, and in Yalta all the zones of occupation have already been cut

Clearly, the concept of planning is also not familiar to you.

Quote: ccsr

I realized that you are a white-ticketer, sloping away from the army

Again they didn’t guess, but all because judge by yourself.

PS: In general, judging by you, Soviet military education was a very bottom. I suppose, after all, it’s not quite, it’s just that you personally have distinguished yourself especially.

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

and just a hash in your head accidentally turned for a moment in almost the right way

I understood - you had to admit that I was right, gritting my teeth.

Quote: nks

Here are the minutes of the Yalta Conference.

In Potsdam, the composition of the participants changed in comparison with Yalta, and they could have completely abandoned previous agreements if the war with Japan had not continued. So there is no need to fantasize what and where it was decided - the result of the war was the Potsdam agreement on the post-war arrangement, and the zone of French occupation was also fixed there.

Quote: nks

Clearly, the concept of planning is also not familiar to you.

Of course, you can share the skin of an unkilled bear, but tell me why then the German troops were not disbanded by the Allies until our leadership was outraged by this? You do not seem to know that the Western countries already understood the inevitability of the Cold War, which is why it would be stupid to believe them on the part of Stalin.

Quote: nks

. I suppose, after all, it’s not quite, it’s just that you personally have distinguished yourself especially.

I believe that you are just an illiterate verbiage trying to convince everyone that you understand something in that setting.

[Legionista]

Listen, what graduate school did you get to know?

Where I studied, A.I.Denikin was educated,

If we are talking about the building, then probably LVVIUS “without communication there is no control, without control there is no victory”))). Interestingly, at least a dozen soldiers were subordinate)? Or just radio tubes, earphones, antennas and a bunch of "secret literature not for everyone"))?

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

If we are talking about the building, then probably LVVIUS “without communication there is no control, without control there is no victory”))).

Past the box office - I immediately realized that you never studied the biography of A.I. Denikin.

Quote: Legionista

Interestingly, at least a dozen soldiers were subordinate)?

A whole shift on duty with officers and warrant officers was accepted in the strategic link of the USSR armed forces. Yes, and I started the service right away with the captain’s position - you’re simply not in the subject of how it was in the SA in strategic units.

Quote: Legionista

Or just radio tubes, earphones, antennas and a bunch of "secret literature not for everyone"))?

There was a lot of sophisticated equipment, and which in ordinary troops is practically not found. That is why we had a selection - in the military registration and enlistment offices, the personnel were specially selected for us, so compared to the rabble from the legion, they were proven and reliable servicemen, many of whom had a secondary technical education, and sometimes there were "year-ends" with higher education, moreover, as a rule, all from complete families and positively characterized by different sources.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

About heavy weapons: if an officer did not command howitzer artillery, this does not prevent him from making a successful career in the army.

The point is not the personal command of artillery, but the fact that the heavy divisions of various armies have tank, motorized rifle, anti-aircraft missile and artillery regiments, and in order to become the chief of staff of a formation, one must have at least the command of battalions and divisions of various branches of the armed forces. Well, how will the chief of staff of the division develop a plan for the combat training of the formation if he has no idea about the intricacies of the training of the same tankers and artillerymen? It is the limited armaments and the number of ILs that put obstacles to the further advancement of the officers serving in it. Although I do not deny that some of them leave IL and make a successful career because of their personal qualities, and not because they served in IL.

Quote: Anton S

Belonging to the elite is determined not by the further career of its officers, but by operations.

We did this after the Afghan war, when some of those who went through the war suddenly decided that they knew best the tasks of the Soviet Army and how best to prepare it. I will not tell you about the details of what was happening in our army, but their error led to the fact that even Gromov was removed from the Moscow Region and transferred to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, and then retired from the armed forces. So do not think that the French military leaders do not understand what the real power of their armed forces lies in - certainly not in IL operations in overseas territories.

Quote: Anton S

.In your opinion, it turns out that only the Strategic Missile Forces of the Russian Federation are the elite of the Armed Forces, and all the rest in Russia are not.

No, the elite we have is the whole triad of strategic nuclear forces, but also the OTR with nuclear equipment in the Ground Forces and the Navy is also not the youngest trump card for us.

Quote: Anton S

The elite of the unit lies in the operations carried out and conducted by it, and not in potential opportunities.

In the war with the Papuans, the IL may also be the elite, but in the war against Russia they are only a small bargaining chip. Believe me, this is not snobbery, but a sober assessment of the capabilities of the legion in a great war.

[Legionista]

In the war with the Papuans, the IL may also be the elite, but in the war against Russia they are only a small bargaining chip. Believe me, this is not snobbery, but a sober assessment of the capabilities of the legion in a great war.

A military professional does not have the right to underestimate any opponent. Whether it's a Papuan with poisoned arrows, a barefoot Pashtun with a Lee Enfield SMLE 4 rifle, or Farah Aidid militants with a rusty Chinese AK.
The 800th construction and training battalion, later the Brandenburg 800 Special Purpose Training Regiment, also did not have tanks or artillery, which, however, did not prevent it from playing a rather important role in Operation Weseryubung, the capture of Fort Eben-Emal (Fort d'Eben-Emael), disorganizing the defense of Maikop.
Returning to the possible use of I.L. you need to consider exactly how and where this will happen. Sabotage and sabotage is most likely how the capabilities of the various units of the legion will be used. Russian speakers are not only citizens of Russia, but citizens of other countries, in the context of my comment, unfortunately. For the enemy who speaks your language is much more difficult to identify and destroy.

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

A military professional does not have the right to underestimate any opponent.

No platitudes - leave this for housewives, they will marvel at your high knowledge.

Quote: Legionista

The Brandenburg 800 special-purpose training regiment also had neither tanks nor artillery, which, however, did not prevent it from playing a rather important role in Operation Weserubung, the capture of Fort Eben-Emal

You would remember about Napoleon’s campaigns, and about Denis Davydov’s raids - then a more picturesque picture would turn out, even a tear would break. But not at all, because now is not the time.

Quote: Legionista

Sabotage and sabotage is most likely how the capabilities of the various units of the legion will be used.

Well, once you talk about this yourself, name the maximum range of the reconnaissance and sabotage groups of the legion from their place of deployment, so that you can understand what damage they can cause to the enemy and in which country.

Quote: Legionista

For the enemy who speaks your language is much more difficult to identify and destroy.

These are all thoughts that have nothing to do with the point strikes of our air forces in Syria. Do you even understand that now more and more military operations are taking place in a non-contact way - this is the Americans who showed us in the first war in the Gulf, and we also began to use it. And you tell me tales about some Papuans, against which the Foreign Legion will fight - this is not even funny, especially after the French military lost the war in Vietnam and Algeria.

[Legionista]

And you tell me about some Papuans telling tales against which the Foreign Legion will fight

The elite is also possible in the war with the Papuans IL, but in the war against Russia they are only a small bargaining chip

Forum member "Ryazanets87" is right) You really forget that you wrote yourself 24 hours ago.

And you want to prove something to me regarding IL, although it’s clear to me that their readiness is just a kindergarten, compared with the readiness of 45-55 minutes of shelves in the GSVG

I could say that the GSVG (ZGV) has not existed for more than 25 years, like most of the units included in it. I.L. There is still, next year will be 190 years to celebrate.

Well, once you talk about this yourself, name the maximum range of the reconnaissance and sabotage groups of the legion from their place of deployment, so that you can understand what damage they can cause to the enemy and in which country.

I suppose a little more than similar units of the RF Armed Forces. Syria does not need to be mentioned, because the Syrian Express, unfortunately, depends on the mood of Erdogan. I believe that you are familiar with the Montreux Convention.

Do you even understand that now more and more military operations are taking place in a non-contact way - this is the Americans who showed us in the first war in the Gulf, and we also began to use it.

Here you are right, and that’s all about the GSVG, tank divisions, combined arms armies, and other

Do you even know that at that time only the GSVG had fully equipped armies of five divisions,

old 40 years ago. Therefore, to your thesis

You would remember about Napoleon’s campaigns, and about Denis Davydov’s raids - then a more picturesque picture would turn out, even a tear would break. But not at all, because now is not the time.

I will say in your own words, “not at the right time,” the GSVG has long been))) no

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

Forum member "Ryazanets87" is right) You really forget that you wrote yourself 24 hours ago.

And you ghost for comparison, otherwise it's just blah blah blah.

Quote: Legionista

I could say that the GSVG (ZGV) has not existed for more than 25 years, like most of the units included in it.

This standard is for all regiments of covering the state border, and it still exists - you are simply not in the subject.

Quote: Legionista

I suppose a little more than similar units of the RF Armed Forces.

Do not wag, name a number, and then we will discuss how things are in the Russian Federation.

Quote: Legionista

Here you are right, and that’s all about the GSVG, tank divisions, combined arms armies, and other

So they exist, and therefore they have deployment standards.

Quote: Legionista

I will say in your own words, “not at the right time,” the GSVG has long been))) no

Here recently 1 Guards. the tank army was taken from the GSVG - does this even tell you something? What process has begun?

The 1st Guards Tank Red Banner Army of the Western Military District is reinforced by the Guards Sevastopol Red Banner Motorized Rifle Brigade deployed in the Novomoskovsk Administrative District of Moscow. This was reported by the press service of ZVO.

https://topwar.ru/171881-pervuju-tankovuju-armiju-zvo-usilili-motostrelkovoj-brigadoj.html

[Legionista]

Do not wag, name a number, and then we will discuss how things are in the Russian Federation.

Of course, I can’t tell you the number, as they say, “the question is not about salaries,” rotations are regularly carried out (not only RDGs) to Mayotte, New Caledonia, all of Equatorial Africa, now in the Sahel region, about Afghanistan, Iraq, you probably also heard. In Norway, 2 REG units are trained regularly. In the framework of NATO exercises, of course.

[ccsr]

Quote: Legionista

Of course, I can’t name a figure for you, as they say "the question is not about salary",

I knew that you would swim right away when the question concerned the combat use of the RDG, and you yourself confirmed this - the salary is not the same.

Quote: Legionista

rotation regularly

Rotations do not affect the capabilities of the RDGs at all - they are determined by the weapons and equipment with which they are provided. Okay, we’ve passed - you’re clearly not in the subject of the actions of the Special Forces units, that’s why the dispute will be pointless.

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

there are too few native citizens of France among ordinary and sergeant staff ..

Wow)))) There are none at all - by definition, you are our expert. Do you still create ideas for the world from Soviet manuals?

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

There are none at all - by definition, you are our expert.

Do not lie, because I know the fate of the legionnaire who is currently serving, who received French citizenship after the first two contracts, then quit, and after a while he returned to the legion and is now serving as a French citizen in French Guiana. His wife and children are citizens of France, although they were citizens of Ukraine.

Quote: nks

Do you still create ideas for the world from Soviet manuals?

And you, out of habit, are balabolite, not knowing the essence of the question, and posing as a smart guy? Well, well, the "legionnaire" homebrew ...

[nks]

oh, have you forgotten what you wrote before? Regardless of the reality of this legionnaire of yours - in your opinion, with the receipt of FR citizenship he immediately became "indigenous"?))

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

Regardless of the reality of this legionnaire of yours - in your opinion, with the receipt of FR citizenship he immediately became "indigenous"?))

Regardless of my example, any native Frenchman who became a criminal could hide in the Foreign Legion, and then legalize after serving. And this was common practice, but as they say, now it has become more stringent.

[Krasnodar]

professionals in their field worked in our military mission in the French zone of Germany, and they knew firsthand the intricacies of serving as officers in the various structures of the French Armed Forces. So they gave detailed information about how things really are.
Did they know this from the point of view of the role of Marxism-Leninism in the career of the army in France? )))

[3x3zsave]

And then! Only ideologically seasoned commanders and fighters served in the GSVG. For example, they didn’t take me. For trying to congratulate George W. Bush on Soviet Army Day.

[Krasnodar]

Because you, because of your unconsciousness, forgot that this is not only the day of the Soviet Army, but also of the Navy

[Pane Kohanku]

Because you, because of your unconsciousness, forgot that this is not only the day of the Soviet Army, but also of the Navy

Yeah, that's what they said: "Forgetful and with enchanting sense of humor - do not take! And then he will ruin all our diplomacy! Serve you, friend of the city, in the air defense in the territory of the Union"

[3x3zsave]

And I went to guard the peaceful sky of that state, the mention of which causes a pre-infarction state in turbo hamsters.

[Pane Kohanku]

And I went to guard the peaceful sky of that state, the mention of which causes a pre-infarction state in turbo hamsters.

When you went to guard, you went to guard the sky of a common great country. and what "good" politicians have achieved during your service does not apply to you.

[3x3zsave]

When I was driving this guard I was interested in the inviolability of one woman’s vagina

[Krasnodar]

Anton - all according to Freud

[Pane Kohanku]

Anton - all according to Freud

and he definitely wants to talk about it .... Well, Albert, let him settle on the couch, and we will light cigars, and ask them to tell us what they are thinking at the moment? chur - in half! Residential psychiatric facility "Doctor Guillotin Krasnodar and Sons and Mikado who joined them "

[Krasnodar]

Anton, in the air defense exercises, given the object you are guarding, have you experienced any hostility to the fighter of a conditional adversary rocket being aimed at a virtual, flying closer and closer to the battery?

[Pane Kohanku]

Anton, tell me, what associations do you have when you imagine a rocket aimed at a virtual fighter of a conditional opponent flying closer to the battery?

[3x3zsave]

I, at that moment, felt inaccessible to a human female

[Krasnodar]

That is, looking at the hats of members of the Politburo while watching the Time program, did you feel the impossibility of being at the Mausoleum? Did you really want to be over Lenin?

[3x3zsave]

No, I really wanted to be above Natasha!

[Krasnodar]

Explain to you the psychology of denial? )))

[3x3zsave]

"Freeze, angels, look: I'm playing !!!" (FROM)

[Krasnodar]

I openly answer all questions (C)

[3x3zsave]

Exactly! Joking does not imply a different answer.

[3x3zsave]

Kids, who are you going to go? An old inquisitor?

[Krasnodar]

No way.
And Lenin is always young
And Young October Ahead

[3x3zsave]

Exactly! But Kolya is still trying to rock the boat ....

[Pane Kohanku]

Kids, who are you going to go? An old inquisitor?

There is a mechanism for crowding out the problem!

[Krasnodar]

And substitutions!

[3x3zsave]

Go to the afhedron, homegrown psychologists !!!! I know all my problems! Treat yourself!

[Pane Kohanku]

Go to the afhedron, homegrown psychologists !!!! I know all my problems! Treat yourself!

We will treat ourselves. And you, who will treat you? Albert, look how aggressively he reacts to his complexes!

[3x3zsave]

Doctor, contradict yourself! You need to carefully build a conversation with the patient, take a master class from Alexander.

[Pane Kohanku]

Doctor, contradict yourself! You need to carefully build a conversation with the patient, take a master class from Alexander.

I don’t have enough nobility of Alexander ... Such a Good Doctor must be born, for which I call him that.

[Krasnodar]

Quote: Pan Kohanku

Go to the afhedron, homegrown psychologists !!!! I know all my problems! Treat yourself!

We will treat ourselves. And you, who will treat you? Albert, look how aggressively he reacts to his complexes!

And what would Grandpa Freud say about this? )))

[Pane Kohanku]

And what would Grandpa Freud say about this?

He would have disassembled it completely, until birth, and interpreted it in its own way, with color.

[Krasnodar]

Yeah. Anton would have pulled out his beard in the middle of the conversation

[Pane Kohanku]

Yeah. Anton would have pulled out his beard in the middle of the conversation

Perhaps yes .... He generally does not like to hear about his shortcomings, he immediately climbs swearing with warm promises. And how would the behavior of Anton be interpreted by Grandfather Sigmund - only Eros knows!

[Krasnodar]

I would try to explain the nature of aggression))

[Pane Kohanku]

I would try to explain the nature of aggression

Against the background of accustoming to the pot .... Anton: Anton, Good Doctor Freud would have analyzed everyone like that - and me and Albert too!

[Krasnodar]

My aunt analyst psychoanalyzed - I started telling her about carrots and hats, she went to Bnga - collectively unconscious and so on))

[Pane Kohanku]

she moved to Bng - collective unconscious and so on

Profession!

I started telling her about carrots and hats

I asked him about the hat, ask him about carrots.

[Krasnodar]

I asked about rockets

[Pane Kohanku]

I asked about rockets

So he will start asking us about punchers and other construction quirks - then we will have to sweat!
I really liked the theme of complexes in Smeshariki. We worked fine.

[3x3zsave]

"The boy did not stop writing, but now he is proud of it"

[3x3zsave]

"You know, child, there are just dreams ..."

[Pane Kohanku]

"You know, child, there are just dreams ..."

Kids and tell! We have a serious office. Anton, which hats do you prefer?

[Krasnodar]

Are you talking about how tightly it fits to the head or the width of the margins?

[Pane Kohanku]

Are you talking about how tightly it fits to the head or the width of the margins?

He will definitely beat us .... or cut off!

[Krasnodar]

Their bean is shaved))))

[Pane Kohanku]

Their bean is shaved

but I’ve already grown ... When I showed Anton my passport with my appearance in 20 years, he laughed for a long time ... I was thinner, and with hair!

[Krasnodar]

I compare my photo from a Russian passport with a muzzle in Israeli. It must be seen

[Pane Kohanku]

I compare my photo from a Russian passport with a muzzle in Israeli. It must be seen

Is the facial expression different? Joke. I have the same thing. Yesterday, an employee of Sberbank (a very beautiful and pleasant Korean woman) laughed when she began to compare my physics with a passport, and I said that at 20 I looked much better.

[Krasnodar]

That's right - facial expression))

[Pane Kohanku]

That's right - facial expression

as we talk about our cat: "I have eaten - wider than the newspaper!" In principle, it differs little from my "eating of the physiognomy".

[Krasnodar]

In-in, in Russia I have become bad and evil)))

[Pane Kohanku]

In-in, in Russia I have become bad and evil

Well, sorry! This is due to your "social burden" on the territory of the Russian Federation, with a change in personal status!

[Krasnodar]

Well, yes - also dropped a couple of dozen

[3x3zsave]

Stetson, of course. And more! Otherwise, the earflaps will not fit

[Pane Kohanku]

Stetson, of course. And more! Otherwise, the earflaps will not fit

Cheaper, take sombrero right away!

[3x3zsave]

Haha! Haha! In the conditions of the Arctic, on a sombrero, overnight, it will sweep up to two cubic meters of snow!

[Pane Kohanku]

Haha! Haha! In the conditions of the Arctic, on a sombrero, overnight, it will sweep up to two cubic meters of snow!

this is to swing your neck and shoulders!

[3x3zsave]

Yeah, "you are heavy, AlCapone hat, you press hard on the brain"

[3x3zsave]

But did the Soviet Union have any intelligible surface fleet?

[Pane Kohanku]

But did the Soviet Union have any intelligible surface fleet?

It was. As if, the second in the world. Then - was.

[3x3zsave]

Yes, hell with two !!! Was underwater! Surface died in Russian-Japanese. By 1914, some fleet was built at the expense of the patriots, but everyone was rotten in the Civil War!

[Pane Kohanku]

Yes, hell with two !!! Was underwater! Surface died in Russian-Japanese. By 1914, some fleet was built at the expense of the patriots, but everyone was rotten in the Civil War!

Anton, what do you mean by a surface fleet? If the ships were of the "cruiser" and higher ranks, yes, there were not many of them. The question is who had more of them in 60-70 years, besides us? US only. And our squadron in the Mediterranean quite acted on a potential enemy’s nerves.
If we take the Gorshkov doctrine, then a lot of units of the "mosquito fleet" have been built - MRK, MPK, etc. Consider them ships? In the Baltic and the Caspian, and that's enough, for example. Moreover, these ships still serve. Even before any prohibitions, in March, we traveled to Kronstadt - there, in the harbor and on the roads, a pair of MPK pr.1331 maneuvered, like these.

Just now these ships, the buildings of the GDR, are of little use, but they serve! as well as the BDK built in Poland.
But was it right a fleet development - God knows ...

[Ryazan87]

If the ships were of the "cruiser" and higher ranks, yes, there were not many of them.

As of 1989 - 160 surface ships of the ocean and far sea zone. Quite a lot.

[Pane Kohanku]

As of 1989 - 160 surface ships of the ocean and far sea zone. Quite a lot.

Here, and I'm talking about the same, Nikita! Quite a lot!
No, maybe (I'm not a strategist!), The fleet should have been built somehow differently. ... Instead of a bunch of different models to build just a few basic ones, as in the USA .... The question is - would a moshna pull such an armada? With infrastructure, with factories, with repairs? Moreover, it was also necessary to pull a huge army with tens of thousands of tanks ... Question!

[Ryazan87]

The total military budget of the USSR * (1989) - 77,294 billion rubles, of which the cost of the Navy is 12,08 billion.
The Soviet Navy suffered not from a lack of pennants, but from a wild zoo of projects, the preservation of a large number of completely obsolete ships in service, poor quality of construction, and a discrepancy between the capabilities of the coastal infrastructure and the scale of the built fleet. In part, these were inevitable "growing pains", in part a consequence of objective economic and even geographic conditions.
And the creator, Admiral Gorshkov, at a speech on November 2, 1985, summed up the main result of the construction of this entire armada:
fleets are not ready to conduct modern operations and fight at sea. There, the whole performance was full of "beautiful", like this:
"... In the Atlantic Ocean and in the Pacific Ocean, the fleets have not been able to open the patrol areas of American Ohio-class SSBNs ... we cannot control the submarines of a potential enemy, they freely penetrate into the Sea of ​​Okhotsk."
And this is not to mention the high accident rate, delayed repair time, poor technical and tactical training of personnel.
It is quite curious to observe how the problems and "injuries" of the RIF crawled into the Soviet Navy, and then into the modern Russian fleet.

* I would trust these figures from Pavlov’s handbook with great caution, but I think they convey the order correctly.

[3x3zsave]

Nikolai, are you following the news? Just yesterday, the United States sent two AUGs to the coast of China. So, like ... And how can the Russian Navy TF answer? By dragging two river tugs along Tan'anmen Square?

[Pane Kohanku]

And what can the Russian Navy TF answer? By dragging two river tugs along Tan'anmen Square?

No, Mine Freund, let's deal with dialectics! "Who-where-why-when-who!" ("Ball of the Vampires", Professor's aria) So, you said:

But did the Soviet Union have any intelligible surface fleet?

Then, for some reason, he dragged Tsushima:

Surface died in Russian-Japanese.

Let's figure it out. The Soviet fleet was. Exactly what - WAS. Even under Joseph Vissarionovich, they began to build a large series of cruisers of the 68-K project, then 68-bis. One of them stands in Novorossiysk now - the ship-museum "Mikhail Kutuzov". And these became our most massive cruisers in history. What Nikita Sergeich has done with the drink of ships - he alone knows. The question is that these cruisers participated in the service until the end of the 80s, including in the Mediterranean Sea. As rightly writes A.B. Shirokorad (which is often doubtful), they say, if the duty of our squadron was in direct visibility from the US Navy, then the artillery cruiser would be enough to sweep the deck of the American aircraft carrier in one gulp in the very first minutes of the battle ...
Then rocket ships began to enter the series, then aircraft carriers, etc.
But! As Nikita Ryazanets rightly said, 87

inconsistencies of coastal infrastructure capabilities with the scale of the fleet built

and what have we got there with "Kuznetsov"? The only floating dock sank, can't we fix it?
But, again, this is a consequence current situation. It is the current. For 30 years, excuse me, the fleet was in the pen, and they did not create a new infrastructure, but they probably plundered the old one. Plus there are no engines, no one, no this, no other ... Well, what country do we live in? where everything is wrong, but we are optimistic about the future with a charismatic leader, and all the neighboring countries around are sodomites? why are you surprised, my friend?
So, returning to your thought. Now we have to answer the American Navy nothing. But initially your messages were addressed to the fleet Soviet! If development that country went the right way .. It would be something to meet.
Oh! For once I debated with you!

[Krasnodar]

Quote: 3x3zsave

But did the Soviet Union have any intelligible surface fleet?

It was good underwater, for example))

[3x3zsave]

Above Nikolai answered.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: 3x3zsave

Was the Soviet Union any intelligible surface fleet?

Oleg Rykov. Charlie-Charlie-Bravo.

[ccsr]

Quote: Krasnodar

professionals in their field worked in our military mission in the French zone of Germany, and they knew firsthand the intricacies of serving as officers in the various structures of the French Armed Forces. So they gave detailed information about how things really are.
Did they know this from the point of view of the role of Marxism-Leninism in the career of the army in France? )))

No, they discussed issues from the point of view of Christian values, the role of the army in society and career prospects for a military professional. And they were greatly surprised by the Jews, who, unlike Christians, forcefully call women into their army, and at the same time give the right to the orthodox not to serve in it. This is a very interesting question from the point of view of Marxism-Leninism and Christian teaching - how can this be in a humane society.

[ccsr]

Quote: Krasnodar

Did they know this from the point of view of the role of Marxism-Leninism in the career of the army in France? )))

No, they evaluated the prospects of military service from the point of view of Christian and Communist morality, which preach humanism in relation to man and woman in the first place. And they criticized Judaism, which forcibly drives women into the Israeli army, while at the same time affording the right not to serve Orthodox men. This greatly saddened the French and Soviet officers who did not understand the duplicity of the Israelis in relation to their women - apparently the concepts of humanism in this country are simply perverted.

[nks]

Lieutenant General Jean Moren, graduate of the Academy of the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation

He, of course, is not a graduate, but a volunteer

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

He, of course, is not a graduate, but a volunteer

Don't talk nonsense - he had to be enrolled as a student by the order of the head of the General Staff Academy, otherwise he would not have been allowed beyond the threshold of the academy, so his "will" did not play any role, if only because of the secrecy regime. And upon graduation from the academy, all graduates receive diplomas and a badge. So if he studied at the Academy of the General School, then he could not be any "auditor" - such a trick does not work even in ordinary higher educational institutions, because foreigners go through the entire approved course of study.

[nks]

Firstly, the will in any case plays a role even for the applicant, just it alone is not enough. Secondly, a volunteer is a person who attends lectures without being enrolled in students and, accordingly, without subsequent passing qualification exams and obtaining a diploma with qualification. And graduate status involves qualifications. The maximum that a volunteer can get is a piece of paper that he attended such and such courses.
The possibility of such a practice depends, of course, on the university. Somewhere you can’t do it at all, somewhere you can go to a lecture almost from the street, somewhere you need an official decision of the leadership. I don’t know what exactly happened with Jean Moren at the Academy of Civil Aviation, but in his bio he is listed as a listener in 2004 (only in 2004) .. Well, probably for this there was an order from the Academy leadership.
If he were a graduate, they would write differently.

[ccsr]

Quote: nks

I don’t know what exactly happened with Jean Moren at the GA Academy,

So I don’t know what kind of weirdo it was that he was a graduate of the General Staff Academy and launched this nonsense on the net. That's why I immediately said that

So if he studied at the General Staff Academy, then he could not be any "auditor"

As for the particular general, in the framework of cooperation with NATO, the General Staff Academy and not only it provided lectures for senior military officials from this unit, but these were review lectures or classes, and nothing to do with the training of our officers at the Academy GS they did not have. So the dreamer who claimed that this French military was a graduate of the General Staff Academy simply lied for a red word, and the author of the article bought it. At best they could give him a certificate that he attended a course of some lectures and no more, but not a diploma of the General Staff Academy.

[Jünger]

A Frenchman who wishes to join the legion as an ordinary, receives a new passport in which he appears as a citizen of some French-speaking country.

I don’t understand - how can France legally issue a passport to another country, for example Canada?

[Legionista]

I don’t understand - how can France legally issue a passport to another country, for example Canada?

Good day. Let me clarify, a Frenchman who enters the service in I. L. receives a new official document in which he is indicated not as a French citizen (this is prohibited), but as a citizen of one of the countries, where one of the state. Languages ​​is French. Canada, Belgium, Switzerland.

[Jünger]

Quote: Legionista

Good day. Let me clarify

Good afternoon, thanks for the reply. It turns out that the article is an inaccuracy.

[soul]

Quote: Legionista

receives a new official document in which he is indicated not as a citizen of France (this is prohibited), but as a citizen of one of the countries, where one of the state. languages ​​is french

It turns out a kind of semblance of "France's non-interference in other people's affairs." Conveniently.

[nks]

Good afternoon. I would like more clarifications - you want to say that this is a common, albeit unspoken, practice - a person comes with a French passport and they simply write it down on other documents (actually fake passport data)? As far as I heard, there really are isolated cases of French service in the IL, but there people just come with a non-French passport (either they already have another citizenship initially, or they draw it up specially for IL). In principle, it can be any country, but of course it is more convenient for them to take a passport from Canada or Belgium (Swiss citizenship is quite difficult to obtain even for the French)

[Legionista]

Good afternoon.

just write on other documents (actually fake passport data)

In fact, this is exactly what happens. A person is given a new name, surname, date and month of birth, the year of birth is not changed. The new identity card (carte d'identite militaire)) contains the changed data. And "last but not least", there is a Big Red seal on the certificate - "non valable pour tout demarche administrative", i.e. "not valid for administrative procedures". You cannot open a bank account, buy an apartment, or travel outside France. Previously, for foreigners, the change of personal data was mandatory, in recent years it is a voluntary matter.

[Anton S]

Quote: ccsr

Quote: Legionista

1990-1992.

I thought it was one of the "jackets", but it turned out that you only had an urgent one, and even then it was worthless, since you do not know what your political officers were doing. Only I still don’t understand why there is such a puppy delight from serving in a foreign legion, if the Soviet Army had units much more abruptly than in the IL? I understand that need forced you to go there to serve, but this is not a reason to be proud of it - by the way, some who served there, just here at VO, dissuaded the naive from repeating your example.

Quote: ccsr

Quote: Legionista

1990-1992.

I thought it was one of the "jackets", but it turned out that you only had an urgent one, and even then it was worthless, since you do not know what your political officers were doing. Only I still don’t understand why there is such a puppy delight from serving in a foreign legion, if the Soviet Army had units much more abruptly than in the IL? I understand that need forced you to go there to serve, but this is not a reason to be proud of it - by the way, some who served there, just here at VO, dissuaded the naive from repeating your example.

Regarding those who served there, who are discouraging, are you sure they really did serve there? Usually, people who say they served and leave negative comments about the legion or did not serve there, or did not qualify, or deserted from there. did not meet any negative comments from those who actually served. Do not be lazy, read the comments to the article "Combat operations of the legion in the second half of the twentieth century" from the same cycle. There the user Vavilon claims that he served as a kindergarten for him, but he himself does not know what matricule (personal number of a legionnaire) is, in his mind, this is the number of the part. And the number of such "serving" commentators on the Internet, I'm afraid, exceeds the number of the entire Foreign Legion.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

Regarding the servicemen who are dissuading. Are you sure that they really served there?

I'm not sure that you served there - what's the point of bothering this with respect to any forum author who wrote something about IL?

Quote: Anton S

Never met negative comments from really serving.

You just have not heard the stories of our conscripts about their military service, especially from Central Asia - they tell you so much that you unwittingly want to submit them to the state award. But it turns out that he used a shovel in a construction battalion, and no more ...

Quote: Anton S

Do not be lazy, read the comments to the article "Legion's Combat Operations in the Second Half of the XNUMXth Century" from the same cycle.

Why do I need this if I personally knew the people who commanded our air defense crews in Vietnam and shot down American planes, or, for example, participated in hostilities in Afghanistan. Our own military history is such that no Foreign Legion has ever dreamed of, so it’s better to study it, there will be more benefit.

Quote: Anton S

And the number of such "serving" commentators on the Internet, I'm afraid, exceeds the number of the entire Foreign Legion.

I completely agree with this, and therefore I do not believe in extreme assessments, because I immediately understand that this is either a lie or propaganda. I regarded the legion as an integral part of the French Armed Forces, and long ago realized that it was just a tool for saving the lives of the French themselves in dubious operations, i.e. to put it simply, the usual "cannon fodder", but with a beautiful seasoning.

[And Makarov]

Interesting there with them. Thank you for the article

[Anton S]

[quote = ccsr] [quote = Anton S] Regarding those who served there, who dissuade. Are you sure that they really served there? [/ quote]
I'm not sure that you served there - what's the point of bothering this with respect to any forum author who wrote something about IL?

[quote = Anton S] I have never met any negative comments from those who actually served. [/ quote]
You just have not heard the stories of our conscripts about their military service, especially from Central Asia - they tell you so much that you unwittingly want to submit them to the state award. But it turns out that he used a shovel in a construction battalion, and no more ...

[quote = Anton S] Do not be lazy, read the comments to the article "Combat operations of the legion in the second half of the twentieth century" from the same cycle. [/ quote]

Not sure that I served there, your right, and I don’t prove it to anyone here. Who served, knows how to quickly check everything.
About war songs about battles and campaigns, no one here shouted that he took the Reichstag, I'm talking about personal impressions that remain with the person.

[Anton S]

Quote: ccsr

Quote: Anton S

But money was not my main motive.

And what was the main motive?

Quote: Anton S

I wanted to see the world and show myself.

My brother, for forty years, traveled around all the seas and oceans of the world as a senior electrician on various ships and visited more than 80 countries of the world, and in even more ports and airports. I think that he has seen much more in life than you could see in IL. Why doesn’t this career suit you? But alright, let you not like the sea, let’s leave it. What made you risk your head in the interests of a foreign state - do you think you left a mark in the history of France? An optimistic choice, you will not say anything ...

Everyone has their own choice, I am not saying that my most correct, but he is mine and I am pleased with him. And I did not try to leave a trace in the history of France, I am quite satisfied with the trace that the legion left in me.
You somehow all look like slogans: a trace in history, serving a foreign country ... In life, everything is much more prosaic.

[Legionista]

mon ami, c'est même pas la peine de discuté avec cette pax)) il vit toujours à l'époque de l 'Union Soviétique. À mon avis, il a d'énormes complexes psychologiques

[Anton S]

J'ai déjà comprised, mais ses arguments sont vraiment bizarres

[Legionista]

J'ai déjà comprised, mais ses arguments sont vraiment bizarres

"Bizarres" c'est une définition très très polie

[Anton S]

Lui aussi il est bizarre))

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

You somehow all look like slogans: a trace in history, serving a foreign country ... In life, everything is much more prosaic.

Substituting your head under the bullets because the "frogs" are cowards themselves and do not want to go to fight for the interests of France - yes, this is really an "honorable" goal for some, who would doubt it ....
I explained it to you prosaically - I hope you will someday by the end of your life understand that this was not the best choice in your life. Although I do not blame you for anything, I just would like our young compatriots not to repeat such stupidity in their lives, because risking our lives for the interests of the Motherland and for the money of people alien to us is two big differences.

[Anton S]

Quote: ccsr

Quote: Anton S

You somehow all look like slogans: a trace in history, serving a foreign country ... In life, everything is much more prosaic.

Substituting your head under the bullets because the "frogs" are cowards themselves and do not want to go to fight for the interests of France - yes, this is really an "honorable" goal for some, who would doubt it ....
I explained it to you prosaically - I hope you will someday by the end of your life understand that this was not the best choice in your life. Although I do not blame you for anything, I just would like our young compatriots not to repeat such stupidity in their lives, because risking our lives for the interests of the Motherland and for the money of people alien to us is two big differences.

We have very big ideological differences, you see a lot in a negative light, so I will not dissuade you.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

We have very big ideological differences, you see a lot in a negative light, so I will not dissuade you.

"Who was not a poet in his youth,
And in old age, not a misanthrope,
Mistakes may not have made,
But he will lie in the coffin as an idiot ... "

[Anton S]

I read your comments. In your opinion, everyone who is not an officer of the Soviet army is a shit and a balobol. Legion is a rabble, which is like military police for you, although they have completely different tasks, the Americans have no time to change diapers. You’ve been stuck in the past. When you move fronts, armies and divisions on your maps, make sure that you aren’t overwhelmed with guides.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

I read your comments. In your opinion, everyone who is not an officer of the Soviet army is a shit and a balobol.

When people like you discuss something that they don’t know much about, that’s how I feel about them.

Quote: Anton S

Legion rabble,

So even French officers in my time thought, I think that even now the situation has not changed, if they are still afraid to trust heavy weapons.

Quote: Anton S

You are stuck in the past.

Military science is quite conservative - you just don’t understand this due to your lack of basic military education, even for the level of a platoon commander.

[Anton S]

Quote: Ryazanets87

During the discussion, I became interested in the current state of the French army (Source - "White Paper on Defense", data for 2017).
Total:
French Ground Forces (Armée de terre française) - 131 thousand people. Including about 66 тыс. - in combat units.
Foreign legion - 8,9 thousand people (i.e. 6,7% of the total number of ground forces)
There are no divisions as such now (in 1989 they were), there are only headquarters. The main unit is the brigade.
The structure is taken from an open source (for 2018) - IL is highlighted in red, very clearly:

Well, you need to consider:
"... According to the degree of combat readiness, out of all of the above, only parts of the Foreign Legion are constantly kept in full states, which acquire full combat readiness within 72 hours from the moment of receiving the order. Within 5-7 days, the 3rd and 6th lungs and 11th Parachute Brigade, categorized as rapid deployment forces. "
"The total strength of the French Army's high alert forces is approximately 20 to 23. Of these, the Joint Reaction Force numbers only 5000."
"There have been no major exercises at least at the brigade level in France since 2006, and the regimental ones since 2008. The battalion in full force entered the training ground for the last time in 2010." *
That is in view of this and it is worth making conclusions, IMHO.
And so, yes, the commander of one of the 4 French SSBNs or there "Charles de Gaulle" to be cooler than an IL officer. But this is simple and it is not correct to compare it from the word at all, especially since Saint-Cyr, mentioned several times here, trains officers of the ground forces, and by no means the fleet.
* data for 2017

Thank you very much for the comment, everything is beautiful on the shelves, not add not add.

[Anton S]

Quote: Legionista

Here is a comment with facts and arguments.

units of the Foreign Legion that are fully operational within 72 hours of receipt of the order.

. That's right. This is called the Alerte GUÉPARD. 72-hour availability is replaced by 48-hour availability, then 24 and 12-hour availability. It was on this alarm that 2REP flew to Kolwezi in 1978.

When he served, they said that REP did not even stand in front of Kolvezi on ALERTE GUEPARD, but he was "put" there, I can not vouch for the reliability - I heard

[Legionista]

Right! I also heard it, they said that they could not collect the "slag"). Of the jumpers, I stayed in the adjudant chef SAULNIER moderator; it seemed to be such a dry company.

[Swan]

A very good series of articles turned out. thank

[Anton S]

Quote: Legionista

Right! I also heard it, they said that they could not collect the "slag"). Of the jumpers, I stayed in the adjudant chef SAULNIER moderator; it seemed to be such a dry company.

I remember Saulnier, but he was on CCL. He also wrote a book, you can buy it on AMAZON, I don’t remember the exact name, something like "The Life of a Legionnaire from Kolwezi to Afghanistan". There was also a major Satter (maybe the surname is not so in French spelled out), they said that he became either caporal au feu or sergent au feu on Kolwezi.
And also caporal-chef at the first company, what’s the name, I don’t remember.

[nks]

Quote: ccsr

that being a legionnaire is cool.

In such a kindergarten spirit, only here you express yourself

[Artyom Vetrov]

What nonsense did I read ?? The author, if you don’t know about this topic ... but consult with the servants (or the topic of who is serving there now). but it turns out: I heard there, someone whispered, I read it, and now the article is ready

[Anton S]

Quote: ccsr

Quote: Anton S

I read your comments. In your opinion, everyone who is not an officer of the Soviet army is a shit and a balobol.

When people like you discuss something that they don’t know much about, that’s how I feel about them.

Quote: Anton S

Legion rabble,

So even French officers in my time thought, I think that even now the situation has not changed, if they are still afraid to trust heavy weapons.

Quote: Anton S

You are stuck in the past.

Military science is quite conservative - you just don’t understand this due to your lack of basic military education, even for the level of a platoon commander.

I am discussing what I saw (not so long ago), and you cite as an example some mythical French officers who told you something 30 years ago, and you "I think the situation has not changed even now" - awesome analytics, the main thing is modern and timely.
But, in general, the all-knowing expert all the time compares the warm with the solid, and the cold with the soft.
You used to be someone and you knew something, but since then the world has changed a lot.

[ccsr]

Quote: Anton S

I discuss what I saw (not so long ago)

What structure of the armed forces of France did you serve?

Quote: Anton S

You used to be someone and you knew something, but since then the world has changed a lot.

It seems so to you from an early age, because you do not understand the meaning of the proverb "As old as the world." Nothing has changed in the psychology of French officers in thirty years - that's what I'm sure of. On the contrary, they began to more realistically assess the advantages of a calm and well-fed life of a French officer, and only those sick in the head will go to serve in the Foreign Legion, realizing that service in France is very different from service in overseas territories.

[Anton S]

Quote: ccsr

Quote: Anton S

I discuss what I saw (not so long ago)

What structure of the armed forces of France did you serve?

Quote: Anton S

You used to be someone and you knew something, but since then the world has changed a lot.

It seems so to you from an early age, because you do not understand the meaning of the proverb "As old as the world." Nothing has changed in the psychology of French officers in thirty years - that's what I'm sure of. On the contrary, they began to more realistically assess the advantages of a calm and well-fed life of a French officer, and only those sick in the head will go to serve in the Foreign Legion, realizing that service in France is very different from service in overseas territories.

I served in 2 REP.
I do not quite understand your promise about a well-fed life in France and service in overseas territories.

[Terrible ensign]

Small inaccuracy. The 1st Armored Cavalry Regiment moved in full force from Orange to the suburbs of Marseille. In Orange, there is now a military unit that does not belong to the Legion.