Armored decked lightning. Cruiser II rank "Novik". After the death of Stepan Osipovich

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As we said earlier, 31 in March, on the day when Stepan Osipovich last time took the squadron ships out to sea, there were no losses on the Novik. But three of his officers - the commander of the cruiser MF. von Schulz, midshipmen S.P. Burachek and K.N. Knorring lost their brothers who died in Petropavlovsk.

And then, after the death of S.O. Makarov in the squadron came a period of almost complete passivity and apathy: in April 1904, the ships almost did not go out to sea, with the exception of the Vladivostok detachment of cruisers, the description of the actions of which lies outside this cycle of articles. At the same time, the Japanese continued to be active - they fired Russian ships in the harbor with throw-fire, tried once again to bar the exit from the internal raid on the external and, most importantly - on April 21, the news came about the landing of the Japanese troops in Bitszyo. The next day the deputy went urgently to Mukden, leaving the squadron command to Rear-Admiral V.K. Witgefta.



After the ill-fated release of 31 in March, when Petropavlovsk exploded, Novik stood for more than a month in the internal roadstead and did not participate in any affairs. Only 2 in May 1904 r he in 14.35 still went to the external raid in order to cover, in which case, returning after the attack of the Japanese 16 destroyer ships. These are the ships of the 1-th and 2-th detachment, which VK. Vitgeft sent into the sea after it became clear that two battleships of the Japanese detachment, "Yashima" and "Hatsuse", were blown up on the barrage exposed by the Amur mine layer. We will not describe this case in detail, since the participation of Novik in it is minimal - his participation in this operation was limited to entering the external raid. However, if I may say so, this aimless, in general, the output marked the beginning of an extremely intensive exploitation of the cruiser.

The next day, 3 March, V.K. Vitgeft was going to give an order to Amur to place a barrage at Melanche Bay, and cruisers and destroyers, including Novik, were supposed to cover it. But the mines were not ready, 11 of Japanese destroyers and 4 of large ships were noticed on the horizon, so the barrage was canceled: nevertheless, Novik and two destroyers, Silent and Fearless, were ordered to “go to the raid to practice personal composition. "

The meaning of this order, alas, is unclear to this day - Novik and its accompanying destroyers left for 13.00, traveled 8 miles, returned, and returned to 15.15 in the internal pool, the enemy was not noticed. Such, completely aimless movements along the raid, in the conditions of the existence of a mine threat, with which, despite all efforts, could not “win” completely, seem to be an absolutely unnecessary risk. It’s one thing if the ships went out to carry out a combat mission, or at least advanced into the sea for reconnaissance or training - and so ... The official Russian historiography notes: "This exit, which did not bring any benefit to us, at the same time witnessed to the Japanese the failure of the barrier the entrance by the firewalls. " True, in the latter it is difficult to agree - “Novik” went to the external raid and 2 of May, here, probably, the Japanese observers couldn’t say anything new to the Japanese observers.

But on May 5 an interesting thing took place. VC. Witgeft nevertheless sent Amur, who had 50 ready mines by that time, to set up a barrage at Melanche Bay where the minelayer had entered the 13.35, accompanied by the 4 destroyers and the Novik cruiser. Commander of “Amur”, captain of 2 rank Ivanov, commanded this detachment. In addition to the ships listed above, the “Askold” was also involved in the operation, which carried out, if I may say so, a distant cover, because it did not come out with the detachment, but was ready to go to its rescue.



Ships lined up. The destroyers went ahead, used as “anti-mine vessels”: they towed the trawls in pairs, followed by Amur, and after it the Novik. At first, they kept the course at 6 nodes, but then they increased it to 8-10 nodes — the trawls held up well.

But, without reaching 2 for miles to Sikao Bay, from “Amur” they saw enemy ships, which were later identified as 9 large and 8 small destroyers. As we know today, the 4 th and 5 th fighter squads met with the Russians, as well as the 10 th and 16 th detachments of the destroyers - unfortunately, the Japanese official historiography does not specify how many ships were at that time. By state, they should have been 8 large and 8 small destroyers - on the 4 ship in each detachment, but there may be different. Some ships could get damaged or have a breakdown and did not go on a march, and vice versa - sometimes the Japanese could rank another destroyer or fighter in the squad. But in any case, it can be argued that if the Russian sailors were mistaken, then not much, it was unlikely there were fewer 14-16 fighters and destroyers.

Kavtorang Ivanov immediately developed a very hectic activity. He ordered the destroyers to remove the trawls and sent Novik to reconnoitre, telling him "Not to approach the enemy and be careful." Then he called on the radio “Askold”, which, however, could not come instantly, because the “Amur” with the ships accompanying him had already departed from Port Arthur by about 16 miles. Nevertheless, at first, Ivanov found it necessary to continue the operation, because he divided the destroyers, sending "Domineering" and "Attentive" to the aid of "Novik", and "Watchtower" and "Rastenny" left at the minelayer, and with them he continued to move in the direction of the bay Melanhe.

I must say that the commander of Novik, von Schulz, saw all these events a little differently - with his words Novik went into the sea after Amur, but not in 13.35, but in 14.00, and after an hour and a half, 15.30, saw several destroyers. Then the cruiser received an order to reconnoiter and went at low speed to the enemy. This was dictated by the desire to get as close as possible to the Japanese, since the cruiser was poorly visible against the backdrop of the coast, but if he had made a big move, the smoke would surely give out. “Novik” “sneaked up” to 16.00 when the Japanese discovered it all the same, and, having divided into 2 groups, tried to get close and attack the cruiser.

In response, the Novik commander ordered the 22 to be given a node, turned astern to the enemy destroyers, and from the 45 distance the cables opened fire, taking the battle at the departure. This, of course, was extremely beneficial for the cruiser, since the fastest Japanese destroyers, even moving at full speed, would have taken more than half an hour to get closer to the torpedo shot - and all this time they would slowly approach each other. 120 mm guns.


Nose gun "Novika"


Of course, the 22 node could not be dialed all at once, and some time was spent on the turn, so the Japanese managed to get close to the cruiser on the 35 cable. But already the first shots of the Novik from this distance lay down quite well, besides, the cruiser gained momentum, so the Japanese considered it best to retreat, hoping to carry the Russian ship with them. “Novik” “got carried away”, as it turned around and pursued the Japanese for some time, but then, seeing that it couldn’t catch up with them, turned back to “Cupid”. At this time, Ivanov decided to complete the operation and raised the signal to return to Port Arthur.

Such a decision may seem strange and even “overly cautious,” but it is absolutely correct. The fact is that the minefield is good when it is set up in secret, and here “Amur” ran into many Japanese destroyers. It’s not a fact that they could all be dispersed, all the more so that according to observations from Amur the destroyers pursued by Novikom were divided into squadron 2, which went in different directions. “Novik”, with all its advantages, could not guarantee that the Japanese, knowing that the Russians had gone somewhere, would not begin to follow our detachment. Even being driven away, they could easily appear on the horizon during a mine setting, thus reducing its value to zero. And the mines in Port Arthur already had not so much to be thrown by them in vain.

So, Novik, having stopped the pursuit of the Japanese troops, turned back and saw a signal from Amur, canceling the operation. But then the Japanese destroyers really split up and the five big fighters again went after the Novik. Mf von Schulz ordered him to slow down in order to get the enemy closer, and then, in 16.45, from a distance 40, the cable or so opened fire again. As soon as the Japanese came under fire, they immediately turned around and left.

At this moment, the Askold approached the scene of action — they noticed Novik first, since they saw how the cruiser fired the 2-3 shot, but from Novik they noticed the Askold only after the shooting was completed. At this adventures of the Russian squad ended, and he returned to Port Arthur. During the battle, Novik used only 28 shells with an 120-mm caliber, which speaks of it rather as a short skirmish.

I would also like to note that the very modest consumption of shells contradicts the very colorful description of this battle in the memoirs of Lieutenant Novik, A.P. Shter:

“Once we had to deal with 17 destroyers; several times they tried to attack us with a common force, but, possessing a large stroke, we kept them at a distance from our guns, not allowing them to converge, which made them split into three groups that tried to attack us from three sides, but also they did not succeed, since we met with fire in turn all three detachments, not allowing them to act simultaneously. It was a competition in speed and in the art of maneuvering, from which Novik emerged victorious. The Japanese retired, having received, in all likelihood, damage, since the shooting was sustained and calculated, the sea was calm, which made it possible to correct distances and directions, and also to see the fall of the shells, which lay down in the majority perfectly. The collision showed that such a cruiser as the Novik had no control over any number of destroyers with good governance. ”


It would be quite possible to agree with the conclusion of the lieutenant, since we see that the Japanese destroyers fled every time the cruiser opened fire on them, but the description of the battle was highly embellished - including because the reports of other eyewitnesses (the commander of “Amur "Ivanov, commander of" Novik "von Schulz) does not contain descriptions of" tripartite attacks ". As for losses, as far as it can be understood, neither the Japanese nor the Russians received any combat damage in this battle.

The next time "Novik" with the destroyers went into the sea on the morning of March 13, searching for the enemy in the area of ​​Tahe Bay. Having not found the enemy, according to the order, they stood at anchor in the bay itself until 17.00 in the evening and then returned to Port Arthur without incident.

The next day, March 14, the output of “Cupid” was repeated. The differences were that this time it was decided to mine the Tahe Bay, and instead of the 4 destroyers with Amur and Novikom, Gaydamak and Horseman cruisers sailed. This time, the Japanese were not met, and 49 mines were successfully delivered, and another mine due to heavy rolls was thrown upside down with a tripod, causing it to get some kind of damage (probably the cap was broken) and the mine exploded after 1-2 minutes after falling into the water. Fortunately, no one was hurt.

16 May “Noviku” in 18.30 was ordered to breed pairs and in 19.25 he went to the outer raid. Japanese destroyers appeared, but since the sunset on that day took place at 19.15, around 20.00 the cruiser was ordered to return to the inner harbor. Why was it sent at all?

General Fok insistently demanded that two Japanese gunboats be driven away from Hexi Bay, and 20 in May V.K. Vitgeft ordered the Bayan, Askold, Novik cruisers, two gunboats and 8 destroyers to be ready to leave. But in 05.00, General Stoessel responded to the request to send ships “no need,” and in 09.00 he changed his mind. VC. Vitgeft was originally going to send the Novik, along with gunboats and destroyers, to Pigeon Bay, from which the destroyers, if there was a fog, had to go to Inchends and attack there they would meet. Novik and the gunboats were supposed to remain in Pigeon Bay until they received orders, but all ended with the expulsion of the destroyers alone. "Novik" and other cruisers stood under pairs futilely.

May 22 “Novik” again escorted “Amur” - this time they put 80 mines at Pigeon Bay. Everything went without incident, except for the fact that this time the caravan came across a lot of mines and all three large trawls were torn, which in the end had to follow the light trawl stretched between two sixes. I must say that this route (along the coast) ordered VK to go. Vitgeft, but the commander of “Amur” considered him to be extremely dangerous, and his suspicions, alas, were “brilliantly” confirmed. But, fortunately, there was no loss.

Interestingly, May 28, Rear Admiral V.K. Vitgeft sent two destroyer detachments (4 and 8 ships) to reconnoiter the islands of Cap, Reef, Iron, and Miao-Tao. The first detachment of the destroyers left in the morning, the second - in the evening, and in such an operation “Novik” could well be useful to them, since it was a decisive “argument” when meeting with Japanese destroyers. However, the destroyers operated independently, and the Novik remained in the harbor.

Quite another thing - 1 June 1904, when "Novik" almost used to solve its inherent problems. The bottom line was this - the generals asked to fire at Japanese positions from Melanche Bay, and at the same time, Japanese destroyers were found in the number of 14 units in Longvantan Bay, one of which went straight to the bay and fired at it. VC. Witgeft decided to counteract this and sent a detachment consisting of Novik and 10 destroyers, of which 7 were the 1 squad, and 3 - 2 th, into the sea. In 10.45, the destroyers of the 1 squad detached from mooring lines and went to the outer raid, where they connected with the ships of the 2 squad, then made a small course on the Cross Mountain in order to allow Novik to catch up with the destroyers. At this time, 11 of enemy destroyers near the bay of Longvantan was observed from the Russian ships, of which 7 was large.

Further, the reports of the commanders of Novik von Schulz and the destroyer squad Eliseyev are somewhat different. Most likely, the situation was like this: in 11.30, Novik went on an external raid, but did not connect with the destroyers (Eliseev writes that Novik approached them), and moved after them. Seeing this, the commander of the destroyer detachment ordered to increase their travel to 16 nodes, and the Russian ships went under the coast.

In 11.50 (according to the report of Eliseev) or in 12.00 (according to the report of von Schulz), Novik opened fire from a distance of approximately 40 cables and almost simultaneously struck Russian destroyers from their 75-mm cannons. At last, it was assumed that the distance to the enemy was 25 cables, which suggests that at the beginning of the battle Novik was behind its destroyers by 1,5 miles. At the same time, on Novik, 11 and 16 destroyers were observed, although the large ones were also 7, as Eliseev pointed out in his report. According to Japanese records, these were the 1 and 3 units of the fighters and the 10 and 14 units of the destroyers, so the enemy was probably counted more accurately, this is not surprising, since the review from the cruiser is better than from the destroyer. As for the ten-minute time difference of the beginning of the battle, it must be borne in mind that Russian logbooks were usually filled in after the battle, and not during it, therefore such deviations, alas, are quite expected.

Simultaneously with the discovery of fire, Novik increased the speed to 20 nodes, but the destroyers continued to go on 16 nodes for some time, perhaps not trying to approach the Japanese too quickly, until Novik caught up with them. When the cruiser began to overtake the destroyers on the left side, they brought the speed to the 21 node.

At first, the Japanese destroyers continued to move towards the Russian ships, responding with their 75-mm guns, but apparently under the influence of the Novik 120-mm cannons were forced to turn away and retreat. At the same time, the Russian destroyers noticed that three Japanese ships were lagging behind the others, so that Eliseev had a desire to cut them off and destroy them, so 7 of the most high-speed destroyers of the 1 squadron in 12.30 turned to 4 rumba and went in pursuit.

But the Novik and 3 destroyer 2 units didn’t follow them - instead, they continued their way to Melanche Bay, where they arrived at 12.50, and then proceeded to inspect the Japanese positions. At this time, a group of enemy destroyers again attempted to approach the "Novik", and, at the same time, Japanese trenches were discovered. The Novik opened fire, firing from the left side at the Japanese ground positions located at a distance of approximately 3,5 miles, and the starboard at the enemy destroyers, forcing the latter to retreat, so that they completely disappeared from view in 13.15. In 13.20, Novik, having fired at all targets visible on the shore, finally threw several 120-mm shells across the mountains, according to the intended location of the Japanese forces, and proceeded to destroy the deviation. The destroyers of the 2 squadron also fired at coastal targets, but, as far as can be understood, they did not shoot at the Japanese destroyers, most likely because the distance to the latter was too great.

On the destroyers of the 1 squadron, with 12.30 pursuing the enemy, 13.00 found that even the lagging Japanese ships could not catch up - the speeds turned out to be about the same. Shooting 75 mm guns proved ineffective, although Eliseev believed that “hits, apparently, were” - however, the distance, which at the beginning of the chase 25 cable, did not decrease. In the end, Yeliseyev ordered to stop the persecution, and by 13.30 he returned to Melanche Bay. There, having waited for Novik, the Russian detachment went to Port Arthur, where it arrived without any special adventures. In 15.15, Novik entered the internal pool and anchored there.


Novik in the Port Arthur East Basin


In this combat episode, Novik spent 95 shells of 120-mm caliber, of which 30 was fired on the shore, and 65 on Japanese destroyers, and in addition, 11 * 47-mm and 10 of rifle cartridges. Shooting on the coast, apparently, proved to be quite effective, disrupting the Japanese attack on the right flank of our ground position, but shooting enemy destroyers was again unsuccessful - the Japanese ships (like the Russians) did not receive any hits. So the only naval target suffered as a result of our ships leaving was a domestic mine, which was torn down from the anchor, and which was shot by Novik when the detachment returned to Port Arthur.

Novik’s actions in this battle may raise some questions, the main of which is why the cruiser did not lead the first detachment 7 destroyers and did not go after the Japanese. After all, even holding onto the 25 cable from the lagging Japanese ships, he could well expect to hit at least one of them with his 120-mm guns, make him lose his course and drown. But, judging by the available documents, the situation was such that Novik did not receive an order to fight the Japanese destroyers, but had an unequivocal order to bombard the coast, and that’s what he did. In other words, on Novik, they apparently believed that they were going to the rescue of our ground forces and considered it their duty to support them with fire as quickly as possible, while the enemy destroyers were regarded as nothing more than an annoying obstacle to the main task.

A day later, on June 3, Novik again went to sea, for the last time escorting the Amur mine transport. On the way to the future mine position, Amur, moving along the coast in a dangerous area, touched the ground, resulting in underwater holes, and flooding 5 between bottom bottoms and 3 coal pits. The minelayer was forced to interrupt the march and, entering the Pigeon Bay, proceed to patching and repairing damage, and Novik and three accompanying destroyers anchored in anticipation of the repair results - the fourth destroyer, “Stormy,” went to reconnaissance about. Reeff. Soon an officer from the land communications post arrived at the ships, reporting that Japanese destroyers were visible at sea. At this time, "Stormy" found a commercial steamer, and rushed in pursuit: all this was noticed on the ships of the detachment and "Novik", with two destroyers, leaving the Amur under the supervision of one "Fearless", he rushed to intercept. Soon, the Japanese destroyers 11 were discovered on Novik, but they didn’t make any attempt to get close and join the battle: the ship was stopped and turned out to be Norwegian Heimdall, which was moving from Kobe to Newchung for cargo for Japan. Therefore, von Schulz sent an officer and four sailors to him and ordered him to follow the Novik. The cruiser, destroyers and the captured ship returned to the Amur, which by that time was able to start a plaster, after which the detachment returned to Port Arthur.

At this, the actions of the minelayer "Amur" ceased. He received quite serious damage, which the artisans of Port Arthur had no strength to cope with, as they were loaded with repairs of other warships. In addition, there are almost no mines left in Port Arthur, so even if Amur were in perfect order, it would be impossible to use it anyway. Therefore, the ship remained without repair until the end of the siege.



A day later, on June 5, the cruiser’s adventures continued. This time V.K. Witgeft, at the request of the ground command, sent a detachment consisting of Novik, gunners “Gremyashchy” and “Brave” and 8 destroyers to attack the Japanese positions, which were supposed to be produced from Sikao and Melanhe bays. The detachment was commanded by Rear Admiral MF. Loschinsky, who held the flag on the brave cannon “Brave”. It must be said that this exit was rather risky, since large Japanese ships were visible on the horizon to avoid meeting with them, V.K. Vitgeft ordered to go under the coast, for the trawls.

At about 09.30 in the morning, the ships went to their destination, following in this order: in front of them were two pairs of destroyers with trawls, followed by both gunboats, then Novik with the rest of 4 destroyers. At the same time, 11 Japanese destroyers were seen on the horizon already at the time of entering the outer raid, but there were no cruisers, and the march continued. Already in 09.45, the first mine exploded in the trawls, and then, just in 2, the cable from this place was another, so both pairs of the destroyers, although they did not suffer, but lost trawls. The reserve trawl was one, on the gunboat "Brave", but M.F. Loschinsky did not consider it possible to go further under just one trawl, and sent one of the destroyers, the Watchdog, after another to Port Arthur, and the rest of the detachment's ships anchored in anticipation of his return. Approximately at 10.30, the Japanese destroyers left - right, there was nothing interesting in observing the standing Russian ships. Only in 13.00 the squad resumed movement, but already in 13.20 another trawl burst, catching something at the bottom, and then the Russian ships followed one trawl.

14.00 Japanese destroyers were spotted in 6, but they are gone. Almost immediately, 3 junks were found under sail, which were examined by destroyers, but nothing reprehensible was found on them.

Finally, at the beginning of the 3-hour of his detachment approached the observation post Luvantan, with him a rather vague message was sent to the ships that the Japanese had retreated and no one was there. Mf Loschinsky radioed V.K. Vitgeftu: “Colonel Kilenkin reports that the Japanese have left, there is no one to shoot, I ask permission to return,” but V.K. Witgeft insisted on carrying out the shelling. There is a persistent feeling that the squadron commander, who had repeatedly had problems with land leadership because of his refusals to send ships to bomb the enemy, was at least formally fulfilling the request. His instruction “You have a milestone map of the Kwantung Peninsula, by which you can find out the area that can be fired,” is hardly possible to explain.

As a result, the "shelling" still took place - "Brave" spent 2 * 229-m and 7 * 152-mm projectiles, and "Thundering" - 1 * 229-mm and 2 * 152-mm projectile. They were shooting “somewhere in the wrong direction” because there was no one to direct and correct fire from the shore, since a post was not organized on the shore and, although an artilleryman and an officer from the post Luvantan arrived on the ships, he did not help could

Events developed as follows: 15.50 on the Russian ships found 11 destroyers and three two-pipe and two-mast cruisers of the Japanese, they were going to connect to another single-tower and one-pipe ship, which was visible earlier. In 16.10, the candolls opened fire, in 16.25, the shooting was stopped due to its complete invalidity and went full speed to Port Arthur. The Russian detachment was "accompanied" by a small Japanese squadron of 4 cruisers, 6 large and 7 small destroyers: on our ships, the cruisers were identified as "Kasagi", "Chitose", "Azumi" and "Matsushima". This Japanese unit moved beyond our unit to Port Arthur at a distance of 6-7 miles from the coast, but the matter did not come to a clash.

As for the Japanese squadron, it is, as can be understood from the official stories, consisted of "Chin Yen", "Matsushima", "Kasagi" and "Takasago", which went on reconnaissance, attracted by the sound of shots. Moreover, the pursuit of the Russian detachment turned out to be accidental - it was discovered on Japanese ships already when the ships of M.F. Loschinsky already entered the outer raid of Port Arthur.

In general, the operation, perhaps, has become the standard of how not to fire the enemy ground forces from the sea. Sending ships under the coast was justified in terms of camouflage, but led to a great risk of detonation by mines. At the same time, if the Japanese understood in time what was going on, they would have had the opportunity to attack our squad with superior forces, and if Novik and the destroyers could easily have come off at the expense of high speed, then two low-speed gunboats, of course, could not. Of course, there is no war without risk, but it was worth the risk to achieve some goal, while firing positions without adjustment from the shore turned out to be completely pointless. It must be said that naval officers were very poorly guided by land maps, since the rugged terrain from the sea was poorly viewed, and it was extremely difficult to understand where the Japanese positions are. Alas, when the land officers began to take them to the ships, the land officers did not cope better with this orientation: the view from the sea and from a viewpoint unknown to them has its own characteristics, so even those who, being on land, saw the Japanese positions, having arrived on ships , could not always pinpoint them from the sea.

The next time Novik left Port Arthur 10 June, when, finally, all previously damaged squadron battleships, including Retvisan and Tsesarevich, were repaired and technically ready for battle. Thus, it was no longer meaningful to stand still further in the inner harbor of Port Arthur and, pushed by telegrams, instructions and orders of the viceroy E.I. Alekseeva, commander of the 1 Pacific squadron Rear-Admiral V.К. Witgeft decided to take her out to sea.

To be continued ...
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  1. +5
    13 January 2019 08: 31
    Article plus hi
    Generally speaking, there is nothing to comment on .... Ordinary "work" everyday life amid general depression and despair ... But this "merit" is more likely to be done by the command staff of the fleet than by the crew of Novik request
  2. +1
    13 January 2019 09: 23
    I must say that naval officers were very poorly guided by land maps, since rugged terrain from the sea was poorly viewed, and it was extremely difficult to understand where the Japanese positions were. Alas, the land officers, when they began to take them on ships, coped with this orientation no better: the view from the sea and from an unfamiliar angle has its own characteristics, so even those who, when on land, saw Japanese positions when they arrived on ships , could not always accurately point them from the sea.
    Before the war, didn’t such exercises to support ground troops be held? After all, whatever one may say, this is also one of the tasks of the fleet.
    1. +3
      13 January 2019 10: 04
      Quote: KVU-NSVD
      Before the war, there were no such exercises to support ground troops with fire.

      And who before the war thought that the Japanese would besiege the base of the fleet? wink Hypothetically, it would be ideal to keep the Japanese on the isthmus of Qingzhou, then the support of the fleet would be easier. But then it was necessary to own the sea at least within a radius of 50 miles from PA. There, an isthmus about 5 km wide was shot along and across. And so try to adjust the fire in the highlands ... what Moreover where the situation changes every day ...
      1. +4
        13 January 2019 15: 10
        Quote: Rurikovich
        And who before the war thought that the Japanese would besiege the base of the fleet?

        It’s even simpler - where and when in peacetime did the sea and land learn to interact closely, rather than dog each other? laughing Competition between the branches of the armed forces, traditional for all powers, was expressed, among other things, in such unpleasant incidents. Of course, in WWI, our fleet seemed to have worked out quite well along the coast, but it may well be that just against the background of disgusting results during the RYA. If we recall, for example, how the other fleets worked along the coast, then a lot of questions also arise ... In addition, here the capabilities of artillery could simply outstrip the theory of its use along the coast. Previously, as it was - the guns are not very long-range, if you need to fire on something - then it is usually in the line of sight, there are no particular problems with adjustment. And here - the targets are out of sight, you have to shoot "blindly" .... And I will remind you that even in the RYAV, even ground forces were just beginning to master shooting from closed positions, where can the fleet be able to do virtually the same.
        1. 0
          14 January 2019 12: 18
          Quote: arturpraetor
          Of course, in WWI, our fleet seemed to be working out quite well along the coast, but it may well be that it was against the background of disgusting results during the WWII.

          It was just that the WWII lasted longer than the RPE - and the fleet managed to restructure. smile
          The same Black Sea Fleet began to depict support for the ground forces in 1915, but achieved results only in 1916 - after organizing normal interaction with the army and sending the Rostislav BR to support.
  3. +2
    13 January 2019 10: 31
    as always interesting and to the point
  4. +1
    13 January 2019 12: 16
    He received quite serious injuries, celebrate which the artisans of Port Arthur had no strength, since they were loaded with the repair of other warships. Moreover, there were almost no mines left in Port Arthur, so even if Amur were in perfect order, it would still be impossible to use it. Therefore, the ship remained without repair until the end of the siege.

    I have always wondered if there was at least a hypothetical possibility to send the "Cupid" to cruise?
    P.S. still probably "fix" or even "fix"
    1. 0
      15 January 2019 00: 28
      Quote: Senior Sailor
      I have always wondered if there was at least a hypothetical possibility to send the "Cupid" to cruise?

      It was full of opportunities, but not a drop of desire.

      In addition to the Amur River, a good auxiliary cruiser Hangar hung at the wall in Port Arthur. Why then disarmed a month later and presented to the Red Cross. And in Vladik, the auxiliary cruiser Lena was also thrown at the wall. Large, fast, 20-node long-range steamers and better armed than Novik. None of the bosses raised a finger to use them at least for show.
  5. +3
    13 January 2019 15: 13
    In short, Novik, being the only rank II cruiser in Port Arthur, was used very, very actively. On the one hand, it is good, the constant maintenance of a high level of crew skills, but on the other hand, it is too intensive use, without interruptions for elementary tech. service and psychological relief of the crew, fraught with problems with the mat. part and personnel. Which again speaks in favor of the fact that Novik is, of course, excellent, but not only its high speed characteristics are important, but also the number of such ships.
    1. +1
      13 January 2019 16: 16
      Quote: arturpraetor
      Novik, being the only cruiser of the II rank in Port Arthur, was used very, very actively.

      "Big" thanks to Sarychev request , otherwise it would have been two for the Japanese, for the fact that the war began not in 1905, but a year earlier, then there would have been four (plus "stones" ... or "minerals" ... what )
      And in simple terms, they did not calculate the strength ...
      After preliminary discussion, the new plans for the construction of the Russian fleet were put forward for a special meeting held in St. Petersburg on December 27, 1897, under the chairmanship of Admiral General. The meeting was attended by Vice Admirals P.P. Tyrtov-manager of the Ministry of the Sea, V.P. Verkhovsky, N.M. Kaznakov, I.M. Dikov, S.P. Dikov, S.P. Tyrtov, S.O. Makarov, F.K. Avelan and E.N. Alekseev. Based on the provision that “our fleet should be slightly stronger than the Japanese one, so that in the event of a collision it should be capable of active activity”, the 37th meeting recommended that by 1903, 10 squadron battleships, 5 armored cruisers, 10 reconnaissance cruisers should be concentrated in the Pacific with a displacement of 5-6 thousand tons, 10 cruisers of the 3rd class, 2-2,5 thousand tons each, one or two mine vehicles of 8 thousand tons each (carriers of destroyers), two mine loaders and 36 destroyers - destroyers (part the latter could be replaced by destroyers). To achieve the specified composition in a special program "For the needs of the Far East" in 1898-1902. It was necessary to build 5 squadron battleships, 5 cruisers of the 1st rank and other ships.

      The year 1903 is even indicated, although later, after agreeing, the dates were shifted to 1905 ... The series "Borodino", "pebbles", "Oslyabya" with "Oleg" were intended for the Pacific Ocean according to the thoughts of those in power ... Alas ... each EBR then accounted for one scout in 6000t. and one 3000t. This is what the Fleet would be like ... It would be ... If only ... winked
      But even at the end of 05, if it was possible to strengthen, they would have only ten EBRs, they did not at all hold out for cruisers - roughly 5 scouts (Varyag, Askold, Bogatyr, Oleg, armored Bayan + trinity of "fighters of trade", that is, "goddesses." Total usyago 8), which are distant and only 4 cruisers of 3000 tons, the close ones ....
      Yes, to whom I am telling - you yourself know this very well wink smile drinks hi
      1. +1
        13 January 2019 17: 38
        Quote: Rurikovich
        And in simple terms, they did not calculate the strength ...

        And they sprayed the already not too big strengths on various not very necessary things. Although, perhaps, I am biased - but it would be better if instead of the 6000-ton armored decks, the "Novik" or "pebbles" were built, and most importantly - earlier in time. The Japanese had several times more cruisers than battleships, and they still believed that these universal ships were few, building as many units of moderate characteristics and displacement as possible, and we moved into replicating technically excellent, but conceptually vicious large armored decks - here is the result: by the beginning of the war, BpKr was at hand less than battleships, and this reduced the flexibility of the fleet and the quality of reconnaissance, and forced the Novik to use it for wear and tear. The death of "Boyarin" is not so critical here - even with the presence of 2 BpKr of the 2nd rank, what is it in comparison with the crowds of Japanese cruisers?
        1. +2
          13 January 2019 18: 38
          Quote: arturpraetor
          what is this compared to crowds of japanese cruisers?

          Artyom, I absolutely agree with you Yes
          Even if we remove the large armored ones, then 1 TOE included 7 BpKr ("Bayan", "Varyag", "Askold", "Bogatyr", Pallada "," Diana "and" Novik "with" Boyarin "- the rest is ancient and auxiliary trash is not considered) to meet the needs of 7 EBR, then the Japanese - 14 (Izumi, Chiyoda, Naniwa, Takachiho, Akitsushima, Suma, Akashi, Tsushima, Niitaka , "Otova", "Yosino", "Takasago", Chitose "," Kasagi "). It does not matter that most of them were the size of" Novik ", what is important is that they performed more efficient reconnaissance, sentinel functions than their Arthurian Although, in addition to this, the Japanese had about 10 different "-sim", small trophy cruisers and advice notes, capable to some extent also perform patrol functions, freeing more modern and high-speed brothers for active activity ...
          So we state the fact that in the RIF with cruisers there was a complete mess ... request
          1. +1
            13 January 2019 19: 22
            Quote: Rurikovich
            So we state the fact that in the RIF with cruisers there was a complete mess ...

            But at the same time, large and rather expensive "Rurikovichs" were built ("Thunderbolt" cost as THREE "Noviks") and small armored decks-six-thousanders laughing In general, this is a fairly popular topic for the crew among the Aishnikovs, but, IMHO, it was possible to get even with a real financing a much more balanced and efficient fleet than the one that was in reality. The problem is that we did not have time to react to the changing realities of time, because of which morally obsolete ships were built, and not really needed ones, there were not enough funds. Abydna, yes! The much younger and inexperienced German fleet in this regard turned out to be noticeably more prudent, and in general its configuration looked better as a complex of ships, even taking into account all the German mistakes recognized and not.
            1. +2
              13 January 2019 19: 27
              Quote: arturpraetor
              But at the same time, large and rather expensive "Rurikovichs" were built

              Artyom, they have nothing to do with the Program - they were ALREADY built when there was a meeting and adoption of the Program Yes
              Rђ RІRѕS,
              Quote: arturpraetor
              small armored six-thousanders
              were built according to the program. Another thing is that there really were not enough of them - so far they have found an acceptable type on foreign orders, while they have swelled ... Here is the time and lost. Moreover, for the Black Sea Fleet, two cruisers gave ... request
              1. +1
                13 January 2019 19: 33
                Quote: Rurikovich
                Artyom, they have nothing to do with the Program - they were ALREADY built when there was a meeting and adoption of the Program

                The program is only a continuation of the views of the Russian admirals on manning the fleet with ships and the naval strategy, which in some places were quite expensive and, unfortunately, erroneous.
                Quote: Rurikovich
                there were really few of them - while on foreign orders they found an acceptable type, while they swelled ... Here is the time and lost. Moreover, for the Black Sea Fleet, two cruisers gave ...

                I'm afraid that even had time to put into operation before the war "Oleg" and "Vityaz", all the same it would not be enough. No, they, of course, are very much even a cruiser, one of the best large armored decks in principle, as it seems to me, but the concept itself ... Even the British, as far as I remember, had already abandoned it by that time - there are always a lot of cruisers, which under the economies of that time, it predetermines their small size, but in our country they decided the opposite - it is better to have a few, but large ones.
                1. +4
                  13 January 2019 19: 51
                  Quote: arturpraetor
                  but the concept itself.

                  It seems to me that the choice of the performance characteristics of a long-range reconnaissance aircraft was dictated by a possible confrontation with Japanese ships of the Kasagi type. A larger displacement to achieve a speed of 23 knots and an armament composition of 152mm guns seemed preferable to a mixture of 203mm and 120mm. That is why they turned out like this ... But these ships were built specifically for the Far East ...
                  For me, it would be better if several Bayans were built than armored decks with 152mm art smile Any reconnaissance could be carried out and in a squadron battle would have been more stable ...
  6. +2
    13 January 2019 16: 19
    ... put up a fence at Melanhe Bay, where the mine layer and left at 13.35, accompanied by 4 destroyers and cruisers "Novik"

    Here is the difference between theoretical purpose and practical use. In broad daylight, protection is the only one. It is known that Novik was listed as a cruiser, but how he could "protect" - help if 1-2 yap came there. cruisers? Could I have time (due to speed) to escape?
    After all, Amur himself could have beaten off from the destroyers, and Novik would not have helped from the cruisers. I wonder why they didn’t use which thread the goddess? Too valuable? (... don't take risks ...))
    Destroyers of the 2nd detachment also fired at coastal targets ...

    I wonder what? winked
    1. +1
      13 January 2019 18: 56
      Quote: anzar
      I wonder why they didn’t use which thread the goddess?

      One with a hole in the repair, and the second holy prince commands - it is not worth the gentleman to risk his health smile
      1. +2
        13 January 2019 19: 30
        Well, it's you in vain.
        1) During the described time, Ivanov-2nd commanded "Diana". Lieven took over the cruiser on May 11.
        2) Alexander Alexandrovich was an intelligent officer. The future head of the commission for the description of the RJV and the head of the Morgenstaff.
        1. 0
          13 January 2019 19: 34
          Then sorry hi I remember that there were 2 commanders in the PA, but the shift time was not taken into account feel
          2.
          Quote: Senior Sailor
          Alexander Alexandrovich was an intelligent officer

          Maybe .... But what was "Diana" in PA, that she was not .... request
          1. +2
            13 January 2019 19: 46
            Sorry colleague, but not even a very good cruiser, better than none at all. In principle, that the goddesses, that other cruisers under the prevailing conditions served as guardhouses. SOM ordered them to make a fence on the outer roadstead from mine nets to guard the entrance. "Dasha" and "Broadsword" coped with this no worse than others.
            1. +1
              13 January 2019 20: 56
              Quote: Senior Sailor
              to guard the entrance. "Dasha" and "Broadsword" coped with this no worse than others.

              Ivan, ships for which the protection of the base and the raid is a sacred duty - canboats, of which there were as many as 6 in the PA (the seventh is "Korean", but alas) are excellent for the guardhouse service, so that the same "Diana" could be safely involved for roaming at least about PA, and not wipe your pants in the raid smile
              1. +3
                13 January 2019 22: 08
                So that the same "Diana" could be safely involved for roaming at least around the PA, and not wipe his pants in the raid

                You can, who can argue that, but even "Askold" and "Bayan" rubbed more and more ...
                gunboats, of which there were as many as 6 in the PA (the seventh is "Korean", but alas)!

                Four colleagues, two armored ("Thundering", "Brave"), "Gilyak" and "Beaver"
                "Sea lion" was in the Yingkou earthen dock, "Manjur" in Shanghai.
                1. +1
                  13 January 2019 23: 27
                  Quote: Senior Sailor
                  Steller sea lion "in the Yingkou earthen dock stood," Manjur "in Shanghai.

                  Yes The first is flooded, the second is interned.
                  You are right again, but I’m not accurate feel smile hi
  7. -1
    15 January 2019 00: 39
    Again, the sluggish, non-aggressive behavior of the cruiser in meetings with enemy destroyers draws attention. I'm afraid that everyone who sees him primarily as a mine mine was disappointed with this part of his story. Off-guard rapprochement and shooting are always from the maximum distances, although there is no doubt who the predator is. And what could the cruiser do this minuscule trifle with its 47-mm cannons.

    Well and separately - as always hits zero. Of the six-barrels, even in 17 birds with one stone did not happen to happen even once. Although everyone assures that Novik was continuously practicing shooting before the war. And even the range finder went to him. But for some reason, they did not know how to shoot Russian ships. There is a riddle in this ..
  8. +2
    15 January 2019 11: 23
    Quote: Saxahorse
    But for some reason, they did not know how to shoot Russian ships. There is a riddle in this ..


    Yes, there is no mystery in this - what is the preparation, so are the results. And even when they hit the target (Tsushima), there was little sense from this - for some reason the Japanese stubbornly refused to sink. You can also minus me, but there is still nowhere to go from the historical truth. And I, frankly speaking, "warmed my soul" by the words of Admiral F. Ruge about our naval artillerymen in the Baltic (41-45), he said that "... in terms of artillery, the Russians were beyond praise!" And the enemy said it. You won't hear such a thing about our artillerymen from the Japanese, even in the form of the notorious "eastern politeness".
  9. 0
    20 January 2019 18: 07
    Folklore of 1905.

    It was under Arthur,
    Bad business friends.
    Togo, Feet, Kamimura did not give us life.
    Kuropatkin is proud
    I was in a hurry right in Tokyo ...
    What are you laughing at, my horse is zealous?
    What did you lower your neck? ...