Expedition to the ancestors. Road between two glaciers

140
Expedition to the ancestors. Road between two glaciers
Neanderthal from Moustiers Cave, anatomist Solger, 1910. Chicago Museum


And he drove Adam out
and placed it in the east near the garden of Eden
Cherub and flaming sword turning,
to guard the way to the tree of life.

Genesis 3:24

Migrants and migrations. As you can see, in the Bible everything was very simple: God kicked Adam and Eve out of paradise, and they went, burning with the sun, wherever their eyes looked. But what made ancient, primitive people go great distances, cross rivers and forests and go to places completely unknown to them?



Well, we will, of course, talk about this too, but first let’s look at the species composition, so to speak, of the migrants who began moving from one place to another 50 years ago.

Survival of the fittest or the smartest?


The fact is that neoanthropes were not the only species of people 50 years ago. Of their contemporaries, the most famous are the Neanderthals, who were distinguished by large flat-headed heads with prominent brow ridges, powerful jaws, and a stocky build. In contrast, neoanthropes looked different: tall, with long limbs and a short torso, more adapted to hot climates.

Interestingly, the brain of Neanderthals was not inferior in size to ours. And the fact that they managed to settle in territories from the arid plains of the Middle East to the cold tundra of Central Europe also speaks of their intelligence. Having good stone tools, they could even hunt such large game as bison, wild horses and reindeer.


Neanderthal skull from Gibraltar. Museum of Natural stories, New York

The concept of caring for one's neighbor...


But the most important thing is that they were already familiar with the concepts of good and evil, and they cared about their loved ones. The skeleton of a robust man has been found, whose corpse was carefully placed in a shallow grave in the Kebara Cave in Israel 60 years ago.

At the site of La Chapelle-aux-Saints in France and in the Shanidar Cave, bones of disabled people who suffered from severe arthritis, broken bones and blindness were found. All of them died at the age of no more than 40 years and for some time could not help but be a burden to their fellow tribesmen. However, they still fed them, instead of killing and eating them in the most rational way! Moreover, after death they were buried quite decently!


Handprints on a stone wall. Australia. Griffith University

Cave painting as a manifestation of intelligence


And it should also be noted that it was the Neanderthals (and they were named after the Neanderthal Gorge in Germany, where the third skull of this type was found) who began to bury the dead, often with signs of obvious ritual ceremonies. They almost certainly knew how to speak. But, apparently, Neanderthals were still in some ways lagging behind Homo sapiens sapiens; it was not for nothing that they were not the only species of people to populate the entire world.

In any case, it was the neoanthropes who demonstrated unprecedented adaptive capabilities in the conditions of a changing natural-geographical environment. But for some reason the Neanderthals were unable to do this. Perhaps the whole point is that neoanthropes had a developed imagination, as evidenced by their use of colored stones, exotic shells, amber and mammoth tusks to make various jewelry and figurines.

And, of course, they also did cave painting. Moreover, they went to paint in hard-to-reach places where it was impossible to do without artificial lighting. Most likely, this also had some special meaning that also had to... be invented! In any case, the art of ancient artists is simply amazing and testifies to extraordinary intelligence.


Figures with boomerangs in their hands. Australia. Griffith University

But at the sites of Neanderthals, only a few carved bones were found, and they used exotic materials very rarely and were not at all keen on cave painting.

And then about 27 years ago, having lived next to the neoanthropes for about 000 years, they disappeared. But Homo sapiens sapiens remained the only human species on the entire planet.


“We were here!” Gargas Cave in the Pyrenees

But there could be more of us, people of different species!


However, now we quite clearly understand that this success of the neoanthropes was not predetermined from the beginning. As we can see, for many thousands of years neoanthropes coexisted with representatives of Homo erectus in Asia and Neanderthals in Europe and the Middle East.

And there were also the so-called Denisovans, who lived side by side with the Neanderthals and migrated with them far to the north to their “Denisovan cave”. And their bone remains were found in China, that is, from somewhere in the west they went to the outskirts of Eurasia in China. So the competitors of our immediate ancestors were no worse adapted to their environment.

All three of these species lived in small groups. They used approximately similar primitive tools. And they also all suffered together from climate change and natural disasters - the eruption of Mount Toba about 70 years ago. And it turns out that there were much more similarities between them than differences.

However, the more developed social organization of neoanthropes significantly increased their ability to develop new territories, and they had more ability to adapt to environmental changes.

And just then another ice age began...


Map of caves with drawings in France and Spain

Hard life in a cold era


Note that over the past 800 years, there have been as many as eight glacial eras on planet Earth, interspersed with relatively warm and short (about 000 years) interglacial times.

Ice ages are periods of sharp cooling in extratropical regions. The average temperature in the Northern Hemisphere was 15 °C lower than today, and vast areas were covered with thick ice sheets. Due to the fact that a huge amount of water froze in them, the level of the World Ocean dropped by one and a half hundred meters. As a result, land passages appeared between islands and continents, connecting parts of the land into one single giant supercontinent.

Accordingly, the global decrease in humidity was also reflected in the tropics, where significant desertification occurred. During the advance of glaciers, northern plants and animals were pushed towards the equator, but during interglacial periods they returned back to the thawing lands.

Obviously, all these changes forced people to migrate as well. They left desertification zones, as well as too cold areas, to where the climate was more moderate and suitable for life. At the same time, the migration routes of our ancestors from Africa led east to Asia and, accordingly, north to Europe. They were helped in this by the development of methods for making fire, the invention of clothing and, most importantly, the improvement of social organization and methods of communication.


Migrations of primitive people of different species

Ice Age people


Glaciation reached its maximum approximately 20 years ago. At the same time, people occupied relatively narrow, but favorable zones for life. Throughout Eurasia, between the northern ice and southern deserts, from Alaska to northern Spain, tundras and steppes stretched, which in the summer turned into grass-rich pastures for large herds of mammoths, bison, horses and reindeer. That is, here you just had to learn how to make supplies for the winter, build warm dwellings (and they learned how to build them, including using mammoth tusks), and it became possible to survive the coldest and most hungry winter time!


But this image of a man was found in a cave in Sicily!

America - a hunting reserve


Apparently, similar conditions have developed in North America. By the time neoanthropes arrived there 15 years ago, the prairies were home to a huge number of different animals: bison with horns spanning up to 000 m; huge beaver-like rodents kasteroids; camelids; ground sloths; moose; two species of musk ox; felines no smaller than a lion; mastodons and three types of mammoths.

But the first Americans hunted so successfully that after 5 years almost all of these animals disappeared, including horses, which were brought back to the New World by Europeans after Columbus's voyages.

Pathways of ancient migrations


By the way, the penetration of people into North America is an extremely interesting question in itself.

The fact is that they could only get there in one way - through the so-called Beringia - a piece of land in the Bering Strait region, formed due to a drop in sea level. But in the area of ​​Alaska and Canada they should also have been met by a glacier blocking the entire territory of Canada from the Atlantic Ocean of Alaska - the so-called Laurentian Ice Sheet. Another glacier, the Cordilleran Ice Sheet, stretched along the Pacific coast.

And so, as it turned out, there was a gap between them - a section of swampy tundra with a length of more than one and a half thousand kilometers. And it is obvious that primitive people passed it, purposefully moving south, and then, having passed this passage, they could already move anywhere. So, neoanthropic sites today are found throughout the American continent, both in North and South America, and even in Tierra del Fuego (Fels Cave).

Well, on the territory of the Eurasian continent to the south of the “mammoth steppe” there was a wide strip of arid steppes. A significant part of the Sahara, as well as the Middle East and Hindustan, was a desert, and people settled there only along the banks of large rivers like the Nile.

Similar conditions existed in Australia, where burials excavated along the Murray River resemble those of Egypt from the same era. By the way, moving around Eurasia at that time was easier than it is now. The Black Sea had no connection with the Mediterranean, and the Mediterranean had no connection with the Atlantic Ocean, that is, they were closed salt lakes. Sicily was connected to the Apennine Peninsula, the Japanese islands to the mainland. But the Caspian Sea was much larger in size than it is now.


A picture of a bison on a cave wall. Peace Museum, Liverpool

Last migrations of Stone Age people


Modern humans began to replace Neanderthals in Western Europe about 35 years ago. At the same time, they quickly reached a high cultural level. In southwestern France, the Pyrenees and northern Spain, hundreds of caves with images of animals and various symbols have been discovered - clear evidence of the importance of art in the life of Ice Age people.

Then, about 12 years ago, glaciers began to recede, making room for plants and animals to spread, followed by gatherers and hunters moving north again. There was plenty of food, people multiplied extremely quickly, so that by the 000th millennium BC. e. both in Central America and the Middle East they began to lack food. Therefore, they began to engage in the breeding and selection of edible plants and the domestication of animals, that is, the transition to agriculture and cattle breeding began.

The continental glacier melted about 4 years ago, after which the migration of people to the Arctic began.

Finally, 2 years ago they managed to explore all of Oceania, and 000 years ago they even sailed to New Zealand - 1 years before Captain James Cook!

To be continued ...
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  1. +6
    30 September 2023 03: 38
    It’s normal, one remark: The Mediterranean Sea and the Atlantic were connected during the last ice age, the level was lower, but this was due to a general drop in the level of the world’s oceans.
    1. -2
      1 October 2023 14: 08
      Were these tools really primitive for those people at that time? There were much better flying saucers and moonshine tanks?
  2. +12
    30 September 2023 05: 11
    But there could be more of us, people of different species!

    Vyacheslav Olegovich! I don’t know how certain ideas mature in your head, but I want to share one observation with you:

    On the right is Sergo Zakariadze, who played Giorgi Makharashvili in the famous (at least to my generation) film “Father of a Soldier”...
    Isn't it a striking resemblance?
    So, we are not far removed from the Neanderthals... In any case, both in appearance and in preferences...
    hi
    1. +10
      30 September 2023 06: 01
      Quote: ROSS 42
      Isn't it a striking resemblance?

      One person studied with me on the course, exactly like a Neanderthal - short, strong, broad-shouldered, with a low-set head and strongly protruding brow ridges. In addition, he was hairy like an orangutan. In a word, he is very similar to a Neanderthal or the boxer Valuev. But unlike his primitive appearance, he studied excellently and even won some diplomas at the city mathematical Olympiads. He was not given a honors diploma, but he only had A's in his record books... wink
      1. +10
        30 September 2023 06: 42
        According to modern science, we have on average 2% of genes from Neanderthals, probably someone is going crazy.
        Well, in general, like in a bearded joke
        - Man, the mutator needs to be washed more often, you gave birth to a black man, they named it Geno!
      2. 0
        30 September 2023 15: 18
        Quote: Luminman
        Quote: ROSS 42
        Isn't it a striking resemblance?

        One person studied with me on the course, exactly like a Neanderthal - short, strong, broad-shouldered, with a low-set head and strongly protruding brow ridges. In addition, he was hairy like an orangutan. In a word, he is very similar to a Neanderthal or the boxer Valuev. But unlike his primitive appearance, he studied excellently and even won some diplomas at the city mathematical Olympiads. He was not given a honors diploma, but he only had A's in his record books... wink

        Strongly reminiscent of the description of Professor Challenger.
      3. -2
        2 October 2023 16: 52
        Exactly, the boxer Valuev is very similar. But now he is not a boxer, but a deputy from United Russia. The symbol of the party...... But Zakariadze is not at all similar.
    2. +6
      30 September 2023 06: 56
      Quote: ROSS 42
      On the right is Sergo Zakariadze, who played Giorgi Makharashvili in the famous (at least to my generation) film “Father of a Soldier”...
      Isn't it a striking resemblance?
      So, we are not far removed from the Neanderthals... In any case, both in appearance and in preferences...

      Dear Yuri Vasilievich! Ideas mature... in different ways. Sometimes early in the morning, half asleep, sometimes on the go, in time with the steps, sometimes while reading... But I completely approve of your idea and it is correct. We also have Neanderthal genes. The % is important, isn't it? And this is where it gets funny. I know a girl whose genetic analysis showed that she has 98,8 genes from her father. And only 1,2% from the mother! Mother constantly laughs: what in her was passed on to her from me? Are there primary and secondary sexual characteristics? And she looks (and very much) not like her mother, not like her father, but like her niece and nephew on her mother’s side. These are the zigzags!
      1. 0
        30 September 2023 11: 25
        Good afternoon . It has already been proven that Neanderthals and Homo sapiens had common descendants. That's why we have common genes.
      2. TIR
        0
        19 November 2023 18: 56
        By the way, there was a project to create a dam across the Bering Strait. So to speak, block the cold waters of the Arctic from the coast of Kamchatka and Primorye. Then it would almost become tropics there. So to speak, the southern warm currents did not cool down from the influx of water from the north. But by blocking the strait, we would thereby receive a huge ice sheet from the North Pole to Tobolsk and Yakutk. And the fact is that the Bering Strait is not deep. Only 90 meters. What if there was a cataclysm that slightly lowered the average temperature. This led to the formation of glaciers, which accumulated the water of the world's oceans. It was a gradual process over thousands of years. But as soon as the level of the world's oceans dropped by 90 meters, then the Bering Strait was blocked and a real catastrophe occurred on Earth. The cooling accelerated sharply, and the glacier began to rapidly creep into Eurasia from the north. The desert was advancing from south to north. The animal kingdom should roughly give us the timing of this event with its mass extinction. But how then did man get to America? So the southern warm current in the Pacific Ocean went north along the coast of North America, and there, without mixing with the waters of the Arctic, it went south along Kamchatka. And so the coast of the Pacific Ocean was not completely covered with ice due to this warm current. And man, following the animals, walked along the coast to America.
    3. +1
      30 September 2023 12: 30
      Quote: ROSS 42
      Isn't it a striking resemblance?
      Exactly! And I remember where I saw him before.
      1. The comment was deleted.
    4. 0
      30 September 2023 19: 26
      So this is a reconstruction from more than a century ago, and the mustache confused you. It is believed that the most Neanderthal-like sapiens bear little resemblance to Neanderthals.
    5. The comment was deleted.
  3. +7
    30 September 2023 05: 48
    There is such a book: “Sapiens” by Harare, and it explains quite well how a person became a person, outlived other people, why he was more successful than them, and how he turned into you and me. Highly recommend
    1. +9
      30 September 2023 05: 53
      Quote: Tlauicol
      how a man became a man

      Well before you become man, a person of the distant past ate Neanderthals - in the caves where Cro-Magnons lived, and these are our very distant ancestors, gnawed bones of Neanderthals and even beads from the teeth of Neanderthals were found...
  4. +9
    30 September 2023 06: 08
    And it should also be noted that it was the Neanderthals (and they were named after the Neanderthal Gorge in Germany, where the third skull of this type was found) who began to bury the dead, often with signs of obvious ritual ceremonies. They almost certainly knew how to speak. But, apparently, Neanderthals were still in some ways lagging behind Homo sapiens sapiens; it was not for nothing that they were not the only species of people to populate the entire world.

    In any case, it was the neoanthropes who demonstrated unprecedented adaptive capabilities in the conditions of a changing natural-geographical environment. But for some reason the Neanderthals were unable to do this. Perhaps the whole point is that neoanthropes had a developed imagination, as evidenced by their use of colored stones, exotic shells, amber and mammoth tusks to make various jewelry and figurines.

    what Ritual burials, endowment of the mystical properties of nature and its deification are a manifestation of abstract thinking not only of our Cro-Magnon ancestor, but also of the Neanderthal and Denisovan.
    Neanderthals have not been preserved in their pure form, but their genotype has been skillfully preserved in part of us - humans; some diseases and immunity, as scientists believe, are also a legacy from Neanderthals.
    migrated with them far north to their “Denisovo cave”

    wink It’s not that north, our dacha is further north, we grow grapes in open ground, and some “white filling” apples (no worse than those from dachas near Penza from relatives), pears, cherries, strawberries in early June, raspberries... watermelons with The Ob reaches were quite good even in tsarist times.
    Denisova Cave, coordinates: 51.39779, 84.67628
    If I’m not mistaken, the genotype of Denisovan man is adapted to living in high mountains; supposedly, scientific research has revealed its distribution among a group of peoples in the areas inhabited by the Himalayas...

    what It is necessary to look for the work of the Novosibirsk branch of the Russian Academy of Sciences on the study of the Ob regions during the times of the “mammoth steppes”, winters were then considered not so snowy, they allowed large animals: mammoth, woolly rhinoceros, large reindeer, to roam quietly and get food, people accordingly followed the animals, people had seasonal camps...
    1. +3
      30 September 2023 07: 00
      Quote: Lynx2000
      And it should also be noted that it was the Neanderthals (and they were named after the Neanderthal Gorge in Germany, where the third skull of this type was found) who began to bury the dead, often with signs of obvious ritual ceremonies. They almost certainly knew how to speak. But, apparently, Neanderthals were still in some ways lagging behind Homo sapiens sapiens; it was not for nothing that they were not the only species of people to populate the entire world.

      In any case, it was the neoanthropes who demonstrated unprecedented adaptive capabilities in the conditions of a changing natural-geographical environment. But for some reason the Neanderthals were unable to do this. Perhaps the whole point is that neoanthropes had a developed imagination, as evidenced by their use of colored stones, exotic shells, amber and mammoth tusks to make various jewelry and figurines.

      what Ritual burials, endowment of the mystical properties of nature and its deification are a manifestation of abstract thinking not only of our Cro-Magnon ancestor, but also of the Neanderthal and Denisovan.
      Neanderthals have not been preserved in their pure form, but their genotype has been skillfully preserved in part of us - humans; some diseases and immunity, as scientists believe, are also a legacy from Neanderthals.
      migrated with them far north to their “Denisovo cave”

      wink It’s not that north, our dacha is further north, we grow grapes in open ground, and some “white filling” apples (no worse than those from dachas near Penza from relatives), pears, cherries, strawberries in early June, raspberries... watermelons with The Ob reaches were quite good even in tsarist times.
      Denisova Cave, coordinates: 51.39779, 84.67628
      If I’m not mistaken, the genotype of Denisovan man is adapted to living in high mountains; supposedly, scientific research has revealed its distribution among a group of peoples in the areas inhabited by the Himalayas...

      what It is necessary to look for the work of the Novosibirsk branch of the Russian Academy of Sciences on the study of the Ob regions during the times of the “mammoth steppes”, winters were then considered not so snowy, they allowed large animals: mammoth, woolly rhinoceros, large reindeer, to roam quietly and get food, people accordingly followed the animals, people had seasonal camps...

      Maybe write us a response to this, say, article? It would be very interesting!
      1. +1
        30 September 2023 07: 58
        Quote: kalibr
        Maybe write us a response to this, say, article? It would be very interesting!

        Vyacheslav Olegovich, writing reports, certificates, decisions has become a long time ago, even poking fingers at the buttons on the monitor or keyboard is tedious and tedious for me..., wink Let’s just say, fly to Novosibirsk or straight to Gorno-Altaisk, we’ll meet you, put you in a UAZ, drive by yourself, take a look, visit local history museums... Yes So far I have hovered significantly further north... 56.23917, 162.53230

        Py.Sy. As lecturers on criminology said, if it were not for abstract thinking, then there would be no Sherlock Holmes with analysis from the particular to the general.
        By the way, I made a typo - the Neanderthal genotype was reflected in us, in Homo Sapiens (not skilled).
        1. +2
          30 September 2023 08: 55
          wink It’s not that much north, our dacha is further north, we grow grapes in open ground, and some “white filling” apples (no worse than those from dachas near Penza from relatives), pears, cherries, strawberries in early June, raspberries... watermelons from the Ob reaches, even in tsarist times they were quite good.

          Good morning, a lot depends on selection and climate!
          Ob watermelons are good, but in the area of ​​the northern Ob (Salekhard) potatoes are grown in greenhouses, as my friend from those regions put it, “particularly stubborn or very rich.”
          However, the day before yesterday, for the first time in my life, I ate strawberries from the garden beds of the second harvest of the year. I had never seen anything like this before.
          It’s really useless to grow grapes, only wild ones. By the way, it produces fruits, although I don’t know whether they are edible or not. There are no problems with local varieties of apples, and it has become easier with cherries. Although the southern varieties are not the only ones that have not taken root.
          1. +3
            30 September 2023 08: 59
            In the Moscow region this year, September is simply a summer month.

            Moscow pictures:
          2. +3
            30 September 2023 09: 02
            To be continued (without further delay):


          3. +2
            30 September 2023 09: 19
            And the third time, according to classic fairy tales:

          4. +3
            30 September 2023 10: 02
            Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
            Although the southern varieties are not the only ones that have not taken root.

            I just arrived from the dacha and brought a bucket of cucumbers from the greenhouse. Arugula, basil, mustard, eggplant... I brought roses too! They are blooming with all their might!
          5. +4
            30 September 2023 11: 15
            Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka

            Good morning, a lot depends on selection and climate!
            Ob watermelons are good, but in the area of ​​the northern Ob (Salekhard) potatoes are grown in greenhouses, as my friend from those regions put it, “particularly stubborn or very rich.”

            Vladislav, good afternoon! I have two small homelands - Alai and the Far East, where, as they say in Primorye: the latitude is Crimean, and the longitude is Kolyma wink .
            But, however, in the southern regions of the Altai Territory, some regions of the Altai Republic (Chemalsky, Choysky and Maiminsky districts) are zones of favorable gardening, I even remember my youth in the mid-90s, when the Maiminsky and Barnaul distilleries produced fruit and berry wines (amber, apple, pear) are quite usable and natural together with fresh, fluffy white meat with a hole on top, stuffed with minced beef and lamb with onions and peppers, or a portion of two crispy chebureks with the same minced meat...
            Fruits and vegetables in these areas, in terms of the growing season, are even far ahead of Penza. Yes
            1. +2
              30 September 2023 15: 40
              Vladislav, good afternoon! I have two small homelands - Alai and the Far East, where, as they say in Primorye: the latitude is Crimean, and the longitude is Kolyma wink.

              Good day Alexander!
              I know firsthand that it is warmer in Gorno-Altaisk. In March 2008, your fellow countryman came to me for advanced training in summer shoes. Fortunately, our shoe sizes were the same, so I left in my winter boots.
              Although this year, despite the cold June, summer has just begun to lose its ground..
        2. +2
          30 September 2023 10: 00
          Quote: Lynx2000
          Let’s just say, fly to Novosibirsk or straight to Gorno-Altaisk, we’ll meet you, put you in a UAZ, drive by yourself, take a look, visit local history museums...

          And I would be glad, dear Alexander, but finances and health do not allow it. Now it’s done it again... the rider is now like a bullet out of me.
          1. +1
            30 September 2023 12: 03
            Quote: kalibr
            Quote: Lynx2000
            Let’s just say, fly to Novosibirsk or straight to Gorno-Altaisk, we’ll meet you, put you in a UAZ, drive by yourself, take a look, visit local history museums...

            And I would be glad, dear Alexander, but finances and health do not allow it. Now it’s done it again... the rider is now like a bullet out of me.

            Well, in vain ... hi In August of this year, our relatives (my wife’s uncle, born in 1960, mostly driving and a little his son-in-law) on his wife’s side came under their own power by car from Penza to Gorno-Altaisk, a day on the road with an overnight stay, on the second day after lunch on the spot, a train from Moscow via Penza goes to Vladivostok via Novosibirsk, from Penza there is a cheap flight to Moscow, from Moscow to Gorno-Altaisk or Barnaul/Novosibirsk, preferential/subsidized for pensioners. Yes
            1. +3
              30 September 2023 16: 11
              I understand everything, Alexander, but... I can’t. I already wrote that there are health problems due to which it is better to stay at home. And finances... the point is not whether a flight from Penza to Moscow is cheap or not. I have a very busy work schedule - right now there is a book of 40 chapters. Every day - 1 chapter, + articles on VO. This is "finance" for the future. I can't break the schedule. After this book there will be another one... and there is also a tight schedule.
    2. +3
      30 September 2023 09: 03
      what Ritual burials, endowment of the mystical properties of nature and its deification are a manifestation of abstract thinking not only of our Cro-Magnon ancestor, but also of the Neanderthal, and also of the Denisovan.

      Abstract thinking (my personal opinion) has corrupted humanity. If 10 years ago an artist had to bother and draw beautifully in the real sense of the word, then with the advent of the abstract component it is already enough to convince society that it is beautiful.
      Mysticism, religion and much more come from basic ignorance, because believing is always easier than knowing. A lazy person, this is where all his achievements and troubles come from!!!
      1. +3
        30 September 2023 09: 26
        Abstract thinking (my personal opinion) has corrupted humanity. If 10 years ago an artist had to bother and draw beautifully in the real sense of the word, then with the advent of the abstract component it is already enough to convince society that it is beautiful.

        Or convince them that it’s not beautiful. As for me, this is possible not because of the presence of abstract thinking, but because of the lack of critical thinking.
    3. 0
      30 September 2023 19: 46
      Ritual burials, endowment of the mystical properties of nature and its deification are a manifestation of abstract thinking not only of our Cro-Magnon ancestor, but also of the Neanderthal and Denisovan.

      As for abstract thinking among Neanders, this is a controversial issue. T.N. “ritual burials” turn out to be fictionalized, unsubstantiated descriptions made by unprofessional romantics during the formation of anthropology. Either it happened or it didn’t, with the latter being more likely. The drawings of Neanderthals differ little from the drawings of chimpanzees (though, in nature, chimpanzees do not draw). We know practically nothing at all about the Denisovans. Well, it seems that in Tibet their children left handprints in clay - so probably young chimpanzees could have left such prints.
  5. +2
    30 September 2023 07: 29
    I came across a book by Didenko, developing the ideas of Professor Porshnev, in which people are divided: superanimals, suggestors, diffuse mass and a person who is spiritually evolving.

    The first two categories were those who eat their own kind.

    I don’t know how convincing this is, but there is a whole theory.
    1. +2
      30 September 2023 08: 32
      Quote from Korsar4
      I don't know how convincing this is

      I was convinced. True, I haven’t read Porshnev himself, but I’ve read some of his followers...
      1. +3
        30 September 2023 08: 42
        There's something about it. And modern examples with berserkers, athletes, Ostap Benders are interesting.

        Another thing is that it is not a fact that people are clearly divided into 4 types.
    2. +2
      30 September 2023 09: 49
      Quote from Korsar4
      The first two categories were those who eat their own kind.

      Emperor Bokassa, President Idi Amin, Armin Meiwes, Jeffrey Dahmer...
      And in general, why did the aborigines eat Cook?
      1. +2
        30 September 2023 10: 16
        These are all the leaders. Bigger bastards, less big bastards.
  6. +5
    30 September 2023 08: 00
    However, they still fed them, instead of killing and eating them in the most rational way!
    There was more humanism now, when spaceships roam the expanses of the Universe, killing in various rational ways. smile
    1. +2
      30 September 2023 08: 07
      It is easiest to eat a person when he is sick... because then he himself does not know who ate him, and you can maintain the most wonderful relationship with him.
      1. +4
        30 September 2023 08: 34
        It's easiest to eat a person when he's sick...
        What has changed? Only methods.. and form.. smile Then they ate their fellow tribesmen in only a few, now in the millions. Whatever one may say, there was more humanism then. smile
        1. +3
          30 September 2023 08: 40
          Yes. This is exactly what Schwartz showed himself. And pawnshops, where cannibals serve as appraisers, continue to operate.
    2. +4
      30 September 2023 09: 20
      Quote: parusnik
      However, they still fed them, instead of killing and eating them in the most rational way!
      There was more humanism now, when spaceships roam the expanses of the Universe, killing in various rational ways. smile

      Yeah, taking into account that primitive man considered (forgive me for the tautology) a man, only a fellow tribesman of his own kind. At best, speaking a language he understands, the value of humanism is very conditional. Let us remember that the bulk of self-names of peoples come from derivative words associated with “speak”, “our own” or “from the edge”. Mirrored “neighbors” are “mute”, “strangers” and “distant”.
      My personal opinion is that “humanism” and “tolerance” are such rubbery concepts that in the case of a tribal society their application is quite conditional. I think the most important thing in the formation of the socio-cultural portrait of a primitive society was written by positive and negative experiences. It’s trite “don’t spit in a well from which you’ll have to drink.”
      1. +3
        30 September 2023 10: 49
        The key phrase in my comment is
        when spaceships roam the expanses of the Universe
        smile And the emoticon. But..okay.. smile It’s not in the rules to explain, the point of the joke. smile
        1. +3
          30 September 2023 15: 24
          Quote: parusnik
          The key phrase in my comment is
          when spaceships roam the expanses of the Universe
          smile And the emoticon. But..okay.. smile It’s not in the rules to explain, the point of the joke. smile

          Dear Alexey, in my comment I do not criticize you, but continue the irony you outlined!
  7. +2
    30 September 2023 08: 14
    I was wondering if the shorter prints are a consequence of injuries or just bent fingers?
    1. +2
      30 September 2023 08: 36
      Is this a consequence of injury or just bent fingers?
      No, alien prints laughing laughing
    2. +3
      30 September 2023 09: 23
      I was wondering if the shorter prints are a consequence of injuries or just bent fingers?

      Scientists were also interested in this question, but they have not yet come to a consensus that it is not uncommon for paleoanthropology. The reasons are said to be injuries, frostbite, ritual amputations, and symbolic bending of fingers. The last one is the most popular.
      1. +4
        30 September 2023 10: 01
        Quote: Dekabrist
        I was wondering if the shorter prints are a consequence of injuries or just bent fingers?

        Scientists were also interested in this question, but they have not yet come to a consensus that it is not uncommon for paleoanthropology. The reasons are said to be injuries, frostbite, ritual amputations, and symbolic bending of fingers. The last one is the most popular.

        It’s unlikely that they were showing off with their fingers.No.
        But seriously, making stone tools using original technologies turned out to be very traumatic. Paleontologists tried to reconstruct and found out. It’s clear, no vice, no hammer, no chisel, you hold the workpiece with one bare hand, the other tool, and play with all your might. There are many thousands of years before the invention of the phrases “safety precautions” and “labor protection”...
        I know safety precautions on a circular saw like my own three fingers. lol
        1. +3
          30 September 2023 11: 53
          Quote: Nagan
          I know the safety precautions on a circular saw like my own three fingers.

          I once ordered trellises for my dacha from a woodworking company. The workers there were heavy drinkers and... I have never seen so many cripples anywhere else: 1 finger (!), 2,3, 4, 5... almost everyone had them. All 10 were owned by only one non-drinking woman, who was there for everyone. I ask the owner, but you are not... that... for violating the safety regulations... And he told me - so they lost everything before me... And they work for me because no one else takes them. They don't even need money. There would be a scale in the morning and evening. They even sleep right there in shavings! Just creepy! If I hadn't seen it, I wouldn't have believed it!
        2. +3
          30 September 2023 12: 10
          It’s unlikely that they were showing off with their fingers.

          According to one theory of the origin of language in Homo sapiens, language developed from an earlier system of nonverbal communication based on gestures - "gesture theory." So they didn’t show off, they just communicated.
          1. Fat
            +3
            30 September 2023 12: 44
            Quote: Dekabrist
            According to one theory of the origin of language in Homo sapiens, language developed from an earlier system of nonverbal communication based on gestures - "gesture theory." So they didn’t show off, they just communicated.

            hi Greetings, Victor.
            Hmmm. Then these drawings are not simple, but a message written in gestures... A forerunner of writing?
            For some peoples, the open palm gesture means prohibition (in Greece it is a serious insult). Some researchers consider the open palm drawing to be a symbol of prohibition or “taboo”... smile
    3. +1
      30 September 2023 09: 30
      Children from Yakutia still leave such imprints. It turns out quite beautiful.
      1. +3
        30 September 2023 15: 31
        Surprisingly, of the three almost international finger gestures (horned goat, V and fig), I did not see even one. So if the message is, then it’s a good one.
  8. +2
    30 September 2023 08: 28
    The author, in general, speaks well, but not even in 800 thousand years, but in the last million years, there were not 8, but only 4 ice ages --- Würm (the most recent), Riss, Mindel and Günz! And if we take the entire Anthropocene period (2,5 million years) --- then there were also the Danube and Biberian periods. The last interglacial period (from 120 to 70 thousand years ago) is called the Eemian period, and American scientists call “their” Würm period the Wisconsin period. I agree with Andobor about the Strait of Gibraltar, it actually only happened in the Pliocene, and not during human existence.
    But maybe there was a land bridge from Sicily (then part of Europe) to Africa, through Malta?
    Someone may disagree, but I believe that Atlantis, Pacifida, Lemuria, Hyperborea, Antilia, and the numerous sunken areas of land in the Mediterranean basin cannot be torn out of History! And it is quite possible that the mythical goblin, a merman with a kikimora, an Indian rakshasa, a yeti, an Indonesian orang pendek, etc. will there be alternative species of humans that have survived to this day??? And animals thought to be extinct actually live on Earth? After all, there were animals and birds that were considered extinct, and then they were discovered alive??? Kalimantan cat, coelacanth, David's deer, Przewalski's horse, Takahe cockerel, one of the types of lemurs for example.
    1. +1
      30 September 2023 09: 31
      The author generally speaks well, but not even in 800 thousand years, but in the last million years, there were not 8, but only 4 ice ages

      The author says that in the last 800 years there have been eight ice ages, not periods. An Ice Age is a subdivision of the Ice Age.
      1. The comment was deleted.
    2. +3
      30 September 2023 10: 01
      Someone may disagree, but I believe that Atlantis, Pacifida, Lemuria, Hyperborea, Antilia, and the numerous sunken areas of land in the Mediterranean basin cannot be torn out of History!
      With some degree of certainty we can only talk about Doggerland, but this is in the North Sea.
      Hello Dmitry!
      1. +1
        2 October 2023 10: 29
        Quote: 3x3zsave
        Hello Dmitry!

        Greetings Anton! hi Someone here disagrees with me over the terms "era" and "period".
        The so-called Ice Age in question is correctly called the Pleistocene! And Wurm, Eem, Riess, Holstein and others should be called horizons!
        There have been several ice ages in the history of the Earth. It was on the border of the Carboniferous and Permian periods, there was a cooling in the Cretaceous, there were all sorts of climatic freaks in the early Pliocene, and the most significant glaciation was generally in the Proterozoic, when the entire planet was covered with ice!
        Couldn't answer yesterday, weekdays
    3. +5
      30 September 2023 10: 07
      Quote: Reptiloid
      Hyperborea,

      And where was she?
      1. +4
        30 September 2023 10: 45
        Quote: kalibr
        And where was she?

        In ancient Greek myths...
      2. +5
        30 September 2023 12: 00
        And where was she?

        Please contact Dugin. There is such a famous freak, the “father” of the “Hyperborean theory”. Local Samsonov with his “superethnos” is not even visible against his background.
        1. +2
          1 October 2023 00: 46
          Please contact Dugin. There is such a famous freak.

          Why is he a freak, sir... If he were a freak, the Ukrainian degenerate whore, with the full support of other special services, would not have killed him in a vile way... True, she would not have killed him?..
          1. +2
            1 October 2023 01: 44
            Why is it a freak, sir...

            Perhaps some complexes, perhaps more subtle mental difficulties or a way of self-expression. There can be many reasons.
            It's not about the road we choose, it's what's inside of us that makes us choose the road.

            The rest is a consequence of choice.
            1. +3
              1 October 2023 02: 08
              The rest is a consequence of choice.

              I will leave my path behind me. Personal - for yourself personally. Civil - as a history buff and a resident of his great country. A country that has something to be proud of. A country that was and will be great.

              1. 0
                1 October 2023 08: 36
                I will leave my path behind me.


                And each went his own way
                And the train went on its way
  9. +4
    30 September 2023 09: 03
    In any case, it was the neoanthropes who demonstrated unprecedented adaptive capabilities in the conditions of a changing natural-geographical environment. But for some reason the Neanderthals were unable to do this. Perhaps the whole point is that neoanthropes had a developed imagination, as evidenced by their use of colored stones, exotic shells, amber and mammoth tusks to make various jewelry and figurines.

    The reasons for the extinction of the Neanderthals, which are being considered today:
    - demographic (too small a population leads to degeneration due to inbreeding);
    - competitive exclusion (competing with a more adapted species, a less adapted competitor loses its ecological niche);
    - assimilation by neoanthropes;
    - climate change;
    - diseases brought by neoanthropes, to which Neanderthals had no immunity.
    Combinations of several of these factors are also considered.
    1. +2
      30 September 2023 09: 48
      Quote: Dekabrist
      competitive exclusion (by competing with a more adapted species, a less adapted competitor loses its ecological niche)

      Today, according to the highbrows, this is the only logical explanation. Maybe there was something else, but this is the root cause
    2. 0
      30 September 2023 10: 48
      Quote: Dekabrist
      demographic (too small a population leads to degeneration due to inbreeding);


      Inbreeding has already been practically ruled out, based on research conducted in the Chagyrskaya cave. They went to other communities to get married. They, apparently, taught people this too. Data below.

      nature articles article
      Paper
      Open Access
      Published: 19 October 2022
      Genetic insights into the social organization of Neanderthals
      Laurits Skov, Stéphane Peyrégne, Divyaratan Popli, Leonardo NM Iasi, Thibaut Devièse, Viviane Slon, Elena I. Zavala, Mateja Hajdinjak, Arev P. Sümer, Steffi Grote, Alba Bossoms Mesa, David López Herráez, Birgit Nickel, Sarah Nagel, Julia Richter, Elena Essel, Marie Gansauge, Anna Schmidt, Petra Korlević, Daniel Comeskey, Anatoly P. Derevianko, Aliona Kharevich, Sergey V. Markin, Sahra Talamo, …Benjamin M. Peter


      The best-fitting scenarios (AIC = 6.2) assumed a community size of 20 individuals, with 60–100% of the females being migrants from another community (Supplementary Table 8.4).
  10. +2
    30 September 2023 09: 15
    And it should also be noted that it was the Neanderthals (and they were named after the Neanderthal Gorge in Germany, where the third skull of this type was found) who began to bury the dead, often with signs of obvious ritual ceremonies.

    Today this issue is still debatable, the debate has not subsided since 1908, scientists have not yet come to a consensus regarding the number of known burials of Neanderthals, the figure ranges from 36 to 60.
    1. 0
      30 September 2023 19: 54
      Were they even there? Those. yes, there were probably some primitive ones, but there are doubts about speaking confidently about ritual burials.
  11. +2
    30 September 2023 09: 59
    The fact is that they could only get there in one way - through the so-called Beringia - a piece of land in the Bering Strait region, formed due to a drop in sea level.

    Last time I wrote that paleoanthropology is very dynamic and theories that were considered unshakable just yesterday are crumbling today. It's the same with the settlement patterns of America. Recently, the “classical” theory of the land bridge or the “Bering Strait” theory has been subjected to serious “pressure”. It has not yet been possible to topple it, but the vibrations are quite serious.
    1. +2
      30 September 2023 11: 57
      Quote: Dekabrist
      is subject to serious "pressure"

      I read about it ...
    2. +3
      30 September 2023 12: 52
      Recently, the “classical” theory of the land bridge or the “Bering Strait” theory has been subjected to serious “pressure”.
      Solutrean hypothesis?
      1. +5
        30 September 2023 13: 23
        Solutrean hypothesis

        The Solutrean hypothesis, on the one hand, competes with the “classical” one, on the other hand, it is itself under serious “pressure”. And recently, litigation has also begun around it from various political loafers exploiting racial theories (the first American was white or colored). This is not conducive to development.
        There is also a theory of coastal migration. But the main pressure comes from geneticists. Briefly there is here.
        https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/how-humans-came-to-americas-180973739/
    3. Fat
      +3
      30 September 2023 12: 56
      Quote: Dekabrist
      The “classical” theory of the land bridge or the “Bering Strait” theory is subject to serious “pressure”.

      In any case, American Indians are not autochthonous. I read that people could get to America by moving along the edge of the ice. Other hypotheses have not yet come across. Where can I read it?
      1. +4
        30 September 2023 13: 43
        Where to read?

        To put it very briefly, I gave the link above. If you look into it in detail, you need to wander through highly specialized publications, moreover, they are all in enemy languages.
        1. Fat
          +4
          30 September 2023 14: 17
          Thank you, the Smithsonian magazine is enough for now to understand that archaeological data is still completely insufficient to turn at least one hypothesis into a “self-sufficient” theory. smile
          Everything is moving towards the fact that experts will decide that the history of the conquest of the Americas by Homo sapiens is a complex of all the proposed options, unless something completely extraordinary is found.
          With respect.
      2. +2
        30 September 2023 19: 04
        Quote: Thick
        Quote: Dekabrist
        The “classical” theory of the land bridge or the “Bering Strait” theory is subject to serious “pressure”.

        In any case, American Indians are not autochthonous. I read that people could get to America by moving along the edge of the ice. Other hypotheses have not yet come across. Where can I read it?

        Good evening Alexey, good evening Comrades!!!
        Vivovatenko, on radio Echo of Moscow (program Vivat history), heard that according to one version, the closest relatives of the North American Indians are the Ket (Ket) people living in the middle reaches of the Lena.
        However, they were definitely not the first; the first “Americans” must be looked for far to the south (in South America). The settlement process has always resembled a domino principle. The first ones went somewhere, the second ones made room, etc. Those Chukchi ended up on the shores of Chukotka because of Genghis Khan. However, like other peoples of Siberia.
        For example, the Evenks, who in their legends mention antlerless riding deer (horses). The latest progress is already associated with our expansion to the east.
        For example, the departure of the Mansi from the banks of Chusovaya to Konda, and the Bashkirs to Ufa.
    4. +2
      30 September 2023 14: 41
      Quote: Dekabrist
      Recently, the “classical” theory of the land bridge or the “Bering Strait” theory has been subjected to serious “pressure”. It has not yet been possible to topple it, but the vibrations are quite serious.


      There is a strong argument in favor of this hypothesis. The arcuate sandbank is much south of the Bering Strait.



      If the level of the Pacific Ocean dropped sufficiently, they could pass.
      And the Bering Strait itself could be crossed on primitive floating craft. Two crossings, 30 km each, with an island in the middle, is quite possible. The Chukchi get married and go hunting, which is why their ancestors couldn’t. In fact, in the caves of Neanderthals, shells of mollusks living at depths of 20 meters and deeper were discovered. How they extracted them is shrouded in darkness, but their ears are deformed, like those of professional divers.
      1. +4
        30 September 2023 18: 41
        In the caves of Neanderthals, shells of mollusks living at depths of 20 meters and deeper were discovered. How they extracted them is shrouded in darkness, but their ears are deformed, like those of professional divers.

        Your last phrase aroused my genuine interest. I wonder where you could see the preserved auricles of Neanderthals? After all, the auricle or auricula, according to the medical encyclopedia, is the visible part of the ear made of soft tissue, which is located outside the head. Do you know other artifacts of Neanderthal bodies besides bone remains? Share. really curious
        1. +1
          30 September 2023 20: 25
          but their ears are deformed, to
          laughing
          it is the visible soft tissue part of the ear that lies outside the head. Do you know other artifacts of Neanderthal bodies besides bone remains?
          hi
          good
        2. +2
          1 October 2023 00: 18
          I'm not expressing myself professionally. We are talking about deformation of the bone of the ear opening of the human skull. It is observed in professional divers, for example, for pearls. The phenomenon was not recorded among Homo Sapiens of that period. Deformation of the bones.
  12. +2
    30 September 2023 10: 48
    Quote: Reptiloid
    but I believe that it is impossible to tear Atlantis, Pacifida, Lemuria, Hyperborea, Antilia out of History

    For alternative history they can trample under foot, however, the so-called Troy. scientists was also considered a myth at one time...
    1. +1
      30 September 2023 19: 21
      The history of Crete, before the volcanic eruption on the island, fits well with the disaster of Atlantis. Santorini.
  13. +1
    30 September 2023 11: 22
    And then about 27 years ago, having lived next to the neoanthropes for about 000 years, they disappeared. But Homo sapiens sapiens remained the only human species on the entire planet.


    When it comes to the disappearance of the Neanderthals, we must not forget about the Ice Age in Europe 25 thousand years ago, which practically erased all traces of Neanderthal sites, with the exception of remains in caves. This is probably why we have such strange ideas about the life of Neanderthals. Perhaps everything was a little different. In any case, their tools, knowledge, diet known today, and hunting areas speak of something completely different. A typical Neanderthal ate a much more varied and better diet, not only than his contemporary Homo Sapiens, but also better than modern humans. This was shown by analyzes of Neanderthal tooth enamel. We would like such an assortment.

    As it was possible to reconstruct the main commercial species of Neanderthals, in all cases they turned out to be the largest herbivorous mammals. Where mammoth and woolly rhinoceros were found in the accompanying fauna, these species were in the lead. Where they did not exist, the most common hunting prey was wild bulls and wild horses. Other herbivorous mammals, such as reindeer, were less frequently hunted. It is important to note that all of these animals live in open spaces.

    Three sites associated with the Neanderthal population are reliably known and contain evidence of the use of marine products. Grotto di Mascerini (Italy), Devil's Tower and Vanyard (Gibraltar) (Richards, et al., 2005).



    Based on the range of food, the contemporary of the Neanderthals, Homo Sapiens, was at the level of a primitive savage and ate rodents and, at best, rabbits. Therefore, there is no need to talk about the dominance of Homo Sapiens in Europe, rather assimilation during migration to warmer climes.
    1. +1
      30 September 2023 20: 17
      A typical Neanderthal ate a much more varied and better diet, not only than his contemporary Homo Sapiens, but also better than modern humans. This was shown by analyzes of Neanderthal tooth enamel.
      Controversial issue. It is usually written that at the peak of glaciation, Neanderthals felt unwell. And the fact that the Neanders died out 27 thousand years ago is now considered very outdated dating
      1. +1
        1 October 2023 00: 41
        Extinct, somehow does not correspond to their capabilities and skills.
        Neanderthals:
        1. When starting a family, they brought brides from other communities. Today it corresponds to the traditions of Europeans.
        2. Cared for the sick and wounded. Consequently, a developed social structure was present.
        3. Owned the technology for producing birch tar, without access to oxygen. In fact, they gave it to us and we use it.
        4. Used minerals that reduced the combustion temperature of wood when lighting a fire. We just found out about this.
        1. 0
          1 October 2023 18: 06
          1. This is not something extraordinary among mammals. It's the same with chimpanzees.
          2. Elephants also take care of the sick and wounded. And they even bury the dead in their own way.
          3. It seems - yes, but the evidence is sporadic. In single quantities, Neanderthals could do a lot of interesting things. But the inventions were not widely distributed.
          4. Same thing.
          Everything suggests that Neanderthals were advanced and intelligent early humans. But it says nothing about their abstract thinking...
          1. 0
            2 October 2023 12: 38
            Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
            1. This is not something extraordinary among mammals. It's the same with chimpanzees.


            The chimpanzee hierarchy can be said to be flat because a few individuals can be powerful enough to collectively dominate other lower-ranking members. The dominant male is usually called the alpha male. The alpha male has the highest social position, he rules the group and maintains order during disputes.


            In fact, chimpanzees have a harem organization typical of tropical monkeys. This is not exactly what was found in Neanderthals. It's more likely to be married couples there. In any case, this is exactly what DNA tests of the group showed.

            Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
            2. Elephants also take care of the sick and wounded. And they even bury the dead in their own way.


            Elephants do not heal broken limbs, do not feed frail old people, and do not care for those who have lost limbs. They, like other mammals, protect a member of the herd for a certain time. This does not correspond to the burials of clearly helpless Neanderthals.

            Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
            3. It seems - yes, but the evidence is sporadic. In single quantities, Neanderthals could do a lot of interesting things. But the inventions were not widely distributed.


            Neanderthals hunted mammoths. This was their priority goal. Imagine a weapon capable of not only piercing the skin of an animal, but also killing it. It must be a very high-quality, reliable weapon, otherwise death. Let's not forget. Mammoths grazed in herds in open areas. A mammoth is larger than an elephant, with a thick coat of fur, a thicker layer of subcutaneous fat and a thicker skin. Not an easy catch, even for a hunter with a gun. You need a special gun.

            Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
            4. Same thing.


            The fact is that they used it, but We never knew about it, did not use it, and already knowing, we still do not use it. At least 60 thousand years difference.

            Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
            Everything suggests that Neanderthals were advanced and intelligent early humans. But it says nothing about their abstract thinking...


            Who can develop a scenario for a successful hunt for a Mammoth, or a woolly rhinoceros, without abstract thinking? This is hardly possible, given the scale of the territory covered. This is at least tens of square kilometers, where every detail had to be taken into account. These guys still give us a head start, they will give us ten moves ahead and all the formations, scenarios, models and maps were built and stored in memory, without paper or computers.

            600 Nitro Express

            Type of cartridge
            Hunting large-caliber
            Manufacturer country
            United Kingdom
            History of production
            Constructor
            Jeffery
            Time of creation
            1899 year
            Years of production
            1903 - present
            Features
            Chuck length, mm
            91,18 [1]
            Real bullet caliber, mm
            15,8[2] (0,6 in)
            Bullet weight, g
            58,5 [1]
            The mass of powder charge, g
            6,48-7,1 (120 grains)
            Initial speed of a bullet, m / s
            620
            Bullet Energy, J
            9 - 10.5 kJ[1]
            Sleeve parameters
            Sleeve length, mm
            76,2 [1]
            Case neck diameter, mm
            16,51 [1]
            Sleeve base diameter, mm
            17,78 [1]
            Sleeve flange diameter, mm
            20,87 [1]


            Weapons chambered for the .600 Nitro Express cartridge are, first of all, “African rifles”, single- and double-barreled, usually weighing 6-7 kg and costing several tens of thousands of dollars (often more than 100 thousand dollars), but rarely Carbines are also available for it. In recent years, with an increase in demand for African hunting in Russia among wealthy hunters, weapons chambered for this cartridge, as well as the cartridges themselves, have appeared on sale in Russia. The price of one cartridge reaches $100.


            The .600 Nitro Express cartridge is used almost exclusively for its primary purpose - shooting elephants. The muzzle energy of its bullet is enormous; when loading the cartridge manually, it can reach up to 12 kJ. This power is more than enough to reliably kill the largest elephant with one shot, and when shooting you don’t even have to try to hit the slaughter spots clearly[2]. Such a high lethality had to be paid for with colossal recoil, which not every shooter is able to tolerate normally. Very often, after a shot, the hunter cannot stand on his feet; Cases of bleeding from the nose and even ears are not uncommon. More serious injuries also occur.


            Now imagine what you need to hunt Mammoth. What quality should a successful hunter's spear be?
            1. 0
              4 October 2023 21: 05
              Who can develop a scenario for a successful hunt for a Mammoth, or a woolly rhinoceros, without abstract thinking?

              Wolves are quite comfortable with large-scale hunts without abstract thinking.
              Now imagine what you need to hunt Mammoth. What quality should a successful hunter's spear be?

              So it was preserved, that spear. "a spear made of yew, found between the ribs of a fossil elephant skeleton at the Löhringen site in Germany. The length of this item is 2,4 m, the diameter at the base is 3,1 cm, and closer to the sharp end it narrows to 2 cm. The weighted base indicates that that the aerodynamic properties of the spear were of little concern to its manufacturer: it was clearly a striking weapon, but not a throwing weapon. The pointed end bears traces of exposure to fire, which is apparently the result of deliberate firing, which was intended to make the wood harder. The Löhringen site dates back to the time of the last interglacial, when Neanderthals were, apparently, the only inhabitants of Europe, which means there was no one else to make the described object except them." Schöningen spears also did not have stone tips. Although stone spear tips have also been found. Read how pygmies hunt elephants.. Abstract thinking, as a rule, does not mean the ability to separate during a driven hunt, or to care for a wounded relative, but the presence of a cult, in our case, fossil cult objects, but this is what the Neanderthals have trouble with.
            2. 0
              4 October 2023 21: 34
              “The fact is that they used it, but We never knew about it, we didn’t use it, and already knowing, we still don’t use it. The difference is at least 60 thousand years” - don’t believe the romantics from anthropology less. Another name for pyrite is iron or sulfur pyrite. It is generally accepted that sapiens widely used it to produce fire. And even quite recently, during the Second World War, when there were no matches, they used them. But whether the Neanderthals used it is a big question; the evidence is rather snotty. There are often no signs of fire at their sites.
  14. +7
    30 September 2023 11: 37
    Glaciation reached its maximum approximately 20 years ago. At the same time, people occupied relatively narrow, but favorable zones for life.

    drinks
    Well, for the surviving people! drinks

    Bottleneck disasters:
    "According to data published in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, about 1,2 million years ago the human population declined to 18,5 thousand people (according to other estimates - up to 26 thousand people)[4][5].
    In 2008, The American Journal of Human Genetics suggested that about 75 years ago[000], after the eruption of the Toba supervolcano, the human population fell to 6 thousand people[2][7]. It has been suggested that from the African population of people, the ancestor of all humanity, about 8 thousand people survived this event[10][9].
    Scientists at Stanford University, based on an analysis of Y chromosomes, also discovered that the human population went through another bottleneck around 5000-3000 BC[11]. There are suggestions that the reason for this could be the first large-scale wars in history or a social picture in which only small groups of privileged men continued the family line. This also resulted in a significant reduction in Y chromosome diversity.
    "

    IMHO, this article needs to be toasted drinks sort it out today.
  15. +3
    30 September 2023 12: 12
    Speaking of DNA, there was a science documentary on television that said that European man has a low percentage of Neanderthal DNA and a high percentage of Homo Sapiens DNA, but the black Africans living in Africa have never mixed with any population in the world. they do not have Neanderthal DNA. It is clear from this that we are the result of a union of two species: HOMO Sapiens and Neanderthals, while black Africans are precisely Homo Sapiens.
    1. +1
      30 September 2023 13: 51
      Quote from: Semovente7534
      It is clear from this that we are the result of a union of two species: HOMO Sapiens and Neanderthals, while black Africans are precisely Homo Sapiens.


      They mixed with Neanderthals, but a very long time ago. They have a small percentage of Neanderthal component. Actually, these Neanderthals look like some kind of invincible terminators from the outside. Wherever they have been and what they have not done or come up with.
  16. +1
    30 September 2023 16: 13
    [quote=ROSS 42][quote]
    On the right is Sergo Zakariadze, who played Giorgi Makharashvili in the famous (at least to my generation) film “Father of a Soldier”...
    Isn't it a striking resemblance?
    hi[/ Quote]
    There is a hypothesis that Neanderthals finally died out not so long ago; their last genera hid for a very long time in inaccessible mountainous areas and mixed with the local population relatively recently (several thousand, even hundreds of years ago). The phenomenon of Caucasian blacks is known - sometimes people with dark skin are born in the Caucasus, this happened quite recently. Descendants of Neanderthals, great-great-great grandchildren.
    1. 0
      30 September 2023 20: 19
      More likely the descendants of African slaves. I don’t remember any Negroid features among Neanderthals.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Fat
        +3
        30 September 2023 21: 24
        Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
        More likely the descendants of African slaves. I don’t remember any Negroid features among Neanderthals.

        hi Sergei... belay Well, there is nothing to argue with! I don’t remember Neanderthal blacks either. I have met blacks, but I cannot say with complete certainty whether I have met Neanderthals. laughing drinks
      3. 0
        30 September 2023 21: 39
        African slaves in the Caucasus??????????....................
        1. +1
          1 October 2023 18: 14
          Why not? Specifically, Negroid types were noted precisely in the Black Sea regions - Abkhazia and nearby, which were associated with the Mediterranean region since antiquity, and further in Roman, Byzantine, and Turkish times. Herodoto also wrote about the Egyptian colonies in the Black Sea Caucasus (if memory serves). At the very least, the assumption that some crazy bek brought African slaves or ghouls for himself sounds much more plausible than the search for Negroids among Neanderthals.
    2. Fat
      +2
      30 September 2023 21: 12
      hi Greetings, Roman.
      Quote: Roman Efremov
      The phenomenon of Caucasian blacks is known - sometimes people with dark skin are born in the Caucasus, this happened quite recently. Descendants of Neanderthals, great-great-great grandchildren.

      Ah, Roman. I won’t upset you too much if I say that on the territory of Abkhazia there is a small racial-ethnic assimilated Negroid group of the Abkhaz people of African origin, living mainly in the Abkhaz village of Adzyubzha at the mouth of the Kodor River and the surrounding villages of Abkhazia (Chlou, Pokvesh, Agdarra, Merkula, etc. .). Still.
      They are called black Abkhazians or Caucasian blacks.
      What suggests that these are descendants of Neanderthals?
  17. +3
    30 September 2023 16: 14
    Thank you all for participating in a very interesting discussion of the material and very good informative comments!
  18. -2
    30 September 2023 16: 17
    It was not the strongest or the most evil who survived, but the most flexible, organized, and creative. Neanderthals had virtually no speech (existed only in rudimentary forms), Cro-Magnons began to speak. All modern art was created by Cro-Magnons - painting, sculpture, music. The beginnings of Religion come from the Cro-Magnons.
    1. +4
      30 September 2023 17: 06
      Neanderthals had virtually no speech (existed only in rudimentary forms)

      The presence and form of speech among Neanderthals is a debatable question; at present there is no clear answer to it.
      In paleoarchaeology, categorical formulations are generally unpopular.
      1. 0
        30 September 2023 20: 22
        Yes Yes! But... considering the speed with which the Neanderthals gave way to the Cro-Magnons (despite the fact that they were physically stronger and better adapted to the cold), there is a strong suspicion.
    2. +4
      30 September 2023 18: 55
      All modern art was created by Cro-Magnons - painting, sculpture, music.

      The minuses are not mine, I don’t minus anyone on principle, but let me object to you - I won’t argue about painting and sculpture - I just don’t know, but the oldest discovered musical instrument belonged to the Neanderthals. This is a well-known so-called. - a flute from Divye Babe, discovered in 1995 by paleontologist researcher Ivan Turk at the archaeological site of Divye Babe in Slovenia. The age of the find is estimated at approximately 43 thousand years. This is the femur of a cave bear with holes drilled into it. Today it is the oldest known musical instrument.
      a photo. Neanderthal flute from Divye Babe
      1. +2
        30 September 2023 19: 22
        I’m terribly sorry, Dmitry, but by the appearance of this thing it’s difficult to determine whether it’s a flute, a hunting decoy, or even one of the pendants in the necklace.
        1. +2
          30 September 2023 19: 42
          The flute, dear Anton, is exactly the flute! Yes
          Do you want to listen to her? Please!
          video. Tidldibab, 60.000 years old, Neanderthal Bone Flute.
          "The Neanderthal flute from Divye Babe is played by Katinka Dimkaroska
          1. +1
            30 September 2023 19: 55
            The stakes are rising! Already 60 thousand years, against the stated 43, in your first comment. This is the first.
            2. I also know how to “play” a comb with a piece of paper, but this does not make it a musical instrument.
            3. Does the girl really play this artifact or an exact copy?
            1. +1
              30 September 2023 20: 27
              I will answer in order. Firstly, radiocarbon dating of this artifact was carried out repeatedly and in different laboratories. The results vary greatly. As of 2020, the age limit for a sample that can be accurately determined by radiocarbon dating is about 55 years. As for this particular artifact, it was decided to consider its “official age” in palentology to be the results obtained at the accelerator mass spectrometer of the University of Arizona in 000. This is plus or minus 2011 thousand years. I have absolutely no idea why the title of the video says 43 thousand years. You should ask the creators of this video about this. Maybe they have some new data?
              Secondly, the fact that you know how to play a comb, of course, does not make it a full-fledged musical instrument, but it does mean that you already have some idea of ​​music. That. Judging by the artifact, the Neanderthals could well have had rudimentary musical ideas about it.
              And lastly, think for yourself - how can I know that the girl is actually playing this artifact or its exact copy? I didn't hold a candle. The title of the video only states that she plays "Neanderthal flute from Divye Babe". It is not written whether this is the real artifact itself, or its exact copy.
          2. +1
            30 September 2023 20: 43
            43 thousand years ago, Cro-Magnons were most likely already roaming Slovenia.
        2. +3
          30 September 2023 20: 59
          I’m terribly sorry, Dmitry, but by the appearance of this thing it’s difficult to determine whether it’s a flute, a hunting decoy, or even one of the pendants in the necklace.

          You, Anton, are correct in your doubts, since an article could be written about discussions about this flute, and more than one. At the moment, supporters of the idea that this is a Neanderthal musical instrument are still holding their position, but critics are not giving up hope. Below you ask what the girl plays. She plays on an exact copy. Moreover, the copy was made by professionals. And the resulting instrument fully corresponds to the name of the musical instrument, it has three and a half octaves and you can play modern music on it.
          Moreover, the researchers tried to change the proportions, which immediately worsened the characteristics of the instrument. That is, the conclusion suggests itself that this is truly a musical instrument created by man.
          1. +5
            30 September 2023 21: 09
            In my opinion, the first musical instrument was the drum.
            "Blacks have a sense of rhythm,
            Whites feel guilty"(c)
            1. +1
              30 September 2023 21: 33
              In my opinion, the first musical instrument was the drum

              It is quite logical, although it is worth clarifying - not the musical instrument itself, the drum with a leather membrane, but its stone or wooden “ersatz” - something that primitive people always had in abundance at hand.
              By the way, during excavations in Mesopotamia, some of the oldest percussion instruments were found, made in the form of small cylinders covered with leather, the origin of which dates back to the sixth millennium BC, rock paintings in the caves of South America also date back to this time, and the age of the drum found in Moravia dates back to the fifth millennium BC. e.
              However, wooden and bone wind musical instruments of the longitudinal family - pipes, horns, flutes, pipes, aulos, bansuri, etc. can just as easily lay claim to the role of the first musical instruments. Archaeologists have also found quite a few of them.
      2. 0
        30 September 2023 21: 37
        Does it say it's a Neanderthal flute? laughing
    3. +3
      30 September 2023 19: 30
      Quote: Roman Efremov
      It was not the strongest or the most evil who survived, but the most flexible, organized, and creative. Neanderthals had virtually no speech (existed only in rudimentary forms), Cro-Magnons began to speak. All modern art was created by Cro-Magnons - painting, sculpture, music. The beginnings of Religion come from the Cro-Magnons.

      It is doubtful that a highly organized society that dared to use and make tools, moreover, that used fire did not have a means of communication.
      1. +4
        30 September 2023 19: 39
        Hello, Vlad!
        Unfortunately, the soft tissues of Neanderthals have not been preserved to speak with any degree of certainty about the presence of a speech apparatus. What if they were empaths? How do you like this assumption?
        1. +3
          30 September 2023 21: 04
          Unfortunately, the soft tissues of Neanderthals have not been preserved to speak with any degree of certainty about the presence of a speech apparatus.

          However, the hyoid bone of a Neanderthal was found.
          1. +2
            30 September 2023 21: 27
            They found it, they found it, but to what extent was this creature a Neanderthal...
            1. +2
              30 September 2023 21: 46
              Anton. VikNik is right - this is the bone of a Neanderthal.
              In the Kebara Cave in Israel in 1989. Among other bone fragments of Neanderthals, a Neanderthal hyoid bone, about 60 thousand years old, similar to a human one, was found. The hyoid bone is the only bone of the vocal tract, and therefore the only part of it that could survive to this day.
              Stephen Wroe from the University of New England in Armidale (Australia) and his colleagues conducted three-dimensional X-ray microtomography of bone at the electron synchrotron of the Italian laboratory ELETTRA. Thus, they obtained data on its internal microstructure, which changes under the influence of mechanical stress. She turned out to be similar to a human

              "We can say that we have taken an important step forward. (Our results) show that the hyoid bone from Kebara Cave is not only similar to a human bone - it was used in a very similar way," explained Wroe, as quoted by the BBC. si".
              1. +3
                30 September 2023 21: 52
                A rather interesting hypothesis was put forward by Dutch linguists Dan Dediu and Stephen Levinson from the Max Planck Institute for Psycholinguistics in Nijmegen (Netherlands). After years of linguistic research into the world's largest language groups, they published a paper suggesting that the ability to speak arose in the common ancestor of Homo sapiens and Neanderthals half a million years ago, and traces of Neanderthal vernaculars can be found in modern human languages.
                1. -1
                  4 October 2023 21: 35
                  the ability to speak arose in the common ancestor of Homo sapiens and Neanderthals half a million years ago, and traces of Neanderthal vernaculars can be found in modern human languages.

                  Is there a contradiction here? Neanderthal dialects in this case are a parallel branch of speech development.
        2. +4
          30 September 2023 21: 45
          Quote: 3x3zsave
          Hello, Vlad!
          Unfortunately, the soft tissues of Neanderthals have not been preserved to speak with any degree of certainty about the presence of a speech apparatus. What if they were empaths? How do you like this assumption?

          My friend, yesterday I saw two cats chasing a mouse around the garden. One sits in the boundary, the second drives. True, later because of her (the mice) they fought, but having missed the start, the red one drives it again, the gray one is in ambush. Everything was ruined by my mother’s Steshka, who came to the fuss and ignored the red cat and chased the gray one. Moreover, there was no shortage of screams, hisses and meows from her. Red and the mouse waited for the light show, the first then independently caught the mouse and ran away.
          If animals can interact, then primitive people even more so.
          I will say more - when I let my mother Steshka out into the street. Magpies on the larch begin to croak. Later I noticed that this is how they notify about the appearance of any cat in the yard. In the evening, I go to drive the cat home after their hubbub (the cat is near the tree). Haven't been deceived yet. Otherwise, you can call her for half an hour.
          So, communication abilities, verbal or non-verbal, are an open question, but definitely for a herd animal (like a person) bvli.
      2. +1
        30 September 2023 22: 28
        In its infancy. The shape of the pharynx structure did not allow for full speech in our modern understanding.
        1. +3
          1 October 2023 00: 19
          Quote: Roman Efremov
          In its infancy. The shape of the pharynx structure did not allow for full speech in our modern understanding.

          Students develop a callus on their index finger from frequent use of a ballpoint pen.
          It is not necessary to have a full-fledged conversational speech with a vocabulary of 3-5 thousand words. It is enough to have an order of magnitude less to fully implement “communication.” Moreover, the “universal pendel” does not involve the use of the nasopharynx, but is simple and intelligible.
          By the way, my observations say that verbal communication was initially secondary for a person. Since the most effective way to reinforce a “lesson” is either through your own experience or through your feet.
    4. 0
      1 October 2023 05: 55
      It is hardly possible to talk about Cro-Magnons as the population of ancient Europe and especially Eurasia. There is no evidence of significant settlement of Europe by Cro-Magnons. Everything revolves around a few finds. What can hardly be described as the settlement of Europe, rather random travelers.
      1. 0
        1 October 2023 18: 51
        Cro-Magnons is a term that refers to the very first massive sapiens of Europe. And these are by no means isolated finds. There is no talk about Eurasia, since the term Cro-Magnons is not applied to Asian sapiens in competent sources.
        1. 0
          2 October 2023 01: 17
          Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
          Cro-Magnons is the term for the very first mass sapiens of Europe. And these are by no means isolated finds. There is no talk about Eurasia, since the term Cro-Magnons is not applied to Asian sapiens in competent sources.


          https://www.britannica.com/

          Cro-Magnon, population of early Homo sapiens dating from the Upper Paleolithic Period (c. 40,000 to c. 10,000 years ago) in Europe.
          In 1868, in a shallow cave at Cro-Magnon near the town of Les Eyzies-de-Tayac in the Dordogne region of southwestern France, a number of obviously ancient human skeletons were found. The cave was investigated by the French geologist Édouard Lartet, who uncovered five archaeological layers. The human bones found in the topmost layer proved to be between 10,000 and 35,000 years old. The prehistoric humans revealed by this find were called Cro-Magnon and have since been considered, along with Neanderthals (H. neanderthalensis), to be representative of prehistoric humans. Modern studies suggest that Cro-Magnons emerged even earlier, perhaps as early as 45,000 years ago.


          I mean articles that suggest a historical period of existence of Cro-Magnons as a transitional species in relation to modern man. It is unlikely that they can be separated. Even the dating of the first finds, from 40 to 10 thousand years ago, covers a very wide period. An entire ice age fits into this gap and more. With these first finds, there is complete uncertainty regarding dating, in relation to the conclusions that are being drawn.
          1. 0
            4 October 2023 21: 19
            Cro-Magnons are not a transitional species; they are modern people in all respects. Yes, the skull cap is more massive than the current average, but within the limits of species variability. Well, archeology shows that they made great progress in stone processing, made complex composite tools, processed bone, made musical instruments, knew how to weave and sew, made figurines and knew how to draw. - and all this is accurate, and quite massively, and not individually and under great question, like the Neanderthals.
  19. The comment was deleted.
    1. +1
      30 September 2023 21: 54
      Good evening, Andrey!
      Purely because of harmfulness, I can assume that losers and suckers were expelled from favorable Africa, surprisingly, what nature made of them (what happened). laughing
      It is negative conditions that force any living creature to develop and adapt. Everything else is from the evil one.
  20. +1
    30 September 2023 21: 45
    Quote: Thick
    hi Greetings, Roman.
    Quote: Roman Efremov
    The phenomenon of Caucasian blacks is known - sometimes people with dark skin are born in the Caucasus, this happened quite recently. Descendants of Neanderthals, great-great-great grandchildren.

    What suggests that these are descendants of Neanderthals?

    What does it mean that the descendants of African blacks?
    1. Fat
      +3
      30 September 2023 22: 09
      Occam's razor (Latin: novacula Occami) is a problem-solving principle that recommends seeking explanations based on the smallest possible set of elements.
      1. -3
        30 September 2023 22: 50
        The terms are 10000 years, then 50000 years, then the age of burials in South America is 20000 years, advanced civilization says that modern science and individual branches in it don’t really know anything and are not friends with each other. And if you read geneticists and specialists in the formation of blood groups, then in addition to the fact that they are not friends with each other, they also contradict other theories. Those. This is all far-fetched. Regarding ice ages, there were no such periods, the earth’s poles simply shift periodically, and a pole fell onto land, and so you have a glacier. As I understand it, with a maximum of some error, we know approximately what happened a maximum of a couple of thousand years ago. Everything else is hypotheses and theories. You can read and form your own opinion https://cont.ws/jr/earthrotations
    2. 0
      1 October 2023 18: 23
      What does it mean that the descendants of African blacks?

      What indicates that these are the descendants of non-African blacks? laughing “According to one version, several hundred black slaves were purchased and imported by the princes Shervashidze (Chachba) to work on citrus plantations” (VIKI).
  21. 0
    1 October 2023 07: 21
    Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
    Quote: Roman Efremov
    In its infancy. The shape of the pharynx structure did not allow for full speech in our modern understanding.

    It is not necessary to have a full-fledged conversational speech with a vocabulary of 3-5 thousand words. It is enough to have an order of magnitude less to fully implement “communication.” Moreover, the “universal pendel” does not involve the use of the nasopharynx, but is simple and intelligible.

    When a large mass of people perform work that requires an instant reaction (war, hunting, construction), you can’t get enough pendels for everyone. Full speech provides fantastic benefits to its owners.
    1. +1
      1 October 2023 07: 23
      Yes, I forgot another important point: the oral transmission of traditions, cults, legends, etc. Without developed speech, society cannot have a developed system of traditions. You can't convey much with grunts and gestures.
      1. 0
        1 October 2023 18: 42
        What exactly were Neanderthals supposed to convey in coherent speech? A minimum of everyday skills - using fire, making stone and wooden tools, using caves, huts and skins is quite possible without speech. Deaf and mute people live quite normally and serve themselves, making do with hooting and gestures.
  22. +1
    1 October 2023 07: 38
    Quote: Thick

    They are called black Abkhazians or Caucasian blacks.
    What suggests that these are descendants of Neanderthals?

    And the massive skeleton, stockiness, large nose, increased hairiness - is this also from African blacks among Caucasians? Let us then remember the Abkhazian Zena - the hairy woman caught in the mountains. With dark skin, according to eyewitnesses (but not black like blacks!!!) possessing incredible strength and endurance. Left offspring from humans (also hairy and with a characteristic skull structure)!
    You can also remember the Sumerian Enkidu - a hairy “wild man” (most likely not a pure Neanderthal, but a mestizo). The fact is indisputably recorded in the epic - only 5000 years ago such Enkidu were still encountered.
    1. 0
      1 October 2023 18: 26
      What do Neanderthals have to do with it? There are plenty of stocky and hairy, dark-skinned and sloping-fronted sapiens without Neanderthals. No one has found an excess of Neanderthal genes in such people.
  23. 0
    1 October 2023 21: 25
    Quote: Sergey Sfyedu
    Deaf and mute people live quite normally and serve themselves, making do with hooting and gestures.

    Because they live surrounded by people who hear and speak. If everyone suddenly became deaf and dumb, the rapid decline of civilization would begin.
    1. 0
      4 October 2023 21: 39
      So the Neanderthals did not have any special civilization.
  24. 0
    6 October 2023 11: 26
    Well, let’s say the continents took their modern shape a little over 800 years ago. And dinosaurs went extinct about 2000 years ago, as suggested by the Radical Catastrophe Theory Hypothesis. On which of these dates did Neanderthals cease to exist?
    1. 0
      6 October 2023 20: 45
      "Let us suppose",
      Well, no, we have no right to allow such stupidity.
  25. 0
    8 October 2023 00: 17
    2 years ago they managed to explore all of Oceania, and 000 years ago they even sailed to New Zealand - 1 years before Captain James Cook!

    Now it’s 2023... maybe I didn’t catch up with something, but I’m lost in chronology and dates...