Ensuring the work of the air defense system on low-flying targets without involving Air Force aviation

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The curvature of the earth’s surface and the uneven terrain of the terrain severely limit the ability of ground and ship-borne air defense missile systems to detect and destroy low-flying air assault vehicles (EIS). How can you effectively ensure the possibility of firing air defense missiles at low-flying targets?

Climb higher


One option is to place the radar on a lifting mast device (PMU). If we place the radar at an altitude of 15 meters, then the visibility range of the aircraft (LA) moving at an altitude of 50 meters above the surface will be 41 km. Increasing the height of the PMU to 50 meters will increase the theoretical visibility range by only 13 km (to 54 km), while the complexity and bulkiness of such equipment will grow to a much greater degree.



Ensuring the work of the air defense system on low-flying targets without involving Air Force aviation

The capabilities of modern truck cranes make it possible to lift a load of 9 tons to a height of up to 50 meters, which makes it possible to place on a PMU of a similar radar design to detect low-flying targets


It would seem quite normal for short-range air defense systems of the Pantsir-SM type? But in practice, uneven terrain, forests, buildings and other natural and artificial obstacles will reduce this value several times.

What is the minimum height necessary to raise the radar in order to ensure the detection of low-flying targets?


Range of direct visibility depending on the height of the placement of detection means, excluding the terrain


The height to which the detection means must be raised to compensate for the irregularities of the terrain may vary in each particular case. In most cases, the elevation difference in the flat territory of Russia within the 100-200 km range is no more than 100-200 meters. In mountainous areas, the difference can be significantly greater, and it is difficult to specify a specific value.


Elevation profile


Conventionally for short-range SAM systems (up to 40-50 km), you can take the height necessary to compensate for uneven terrain in 100 meters; for medium-range SAM systems (up to 50-150 km), the height necessary for compensating uneven terrain will be 200 meters.

Thus, the minimum height of radar placement for detecting low-flying targets for short-range SAM systems is about 200 meters, for medium-range SAM systems, about 700 meters. The height of the radar to ensure over-the-horizon long-range air defense systems should be comparable to the altitude of the DRLO aircraft, of the order of 10 000 m, in this case the terrain plays a significantly smaller value.

These heights make the use of the PMU impossible, but there are several other ways to “look beyond the horizon”.

Aerostat radar


One of such methods is the use of balloons. In the USA, the JLENS project is being implemented. The project provides for the deployment of radar and optical reconnaissance equipment on aerostats fixed in certain points of the country and intended to detect low-flying cruise missiles. The height of the balloons is 3 - 4,5 km, the payload mass is about three tons. The detection range of aerial targets should be of the order of 550 km, ground targets of the order of 225 km. In addition to detection, the JLENS balloon should provide over-the-horizon target designation for ground-to-air missiles. To hold the balloon in position and data exchange, it is supposed to use a cable that includes power supply cables and fiber-optic data transmission cables in a carbon braid.


The principle of operation and the balloon of the project JLENS



The machine for weaving carbon fiber preforms can also be used to make a jacket for high-strength cables.


Within the framework of the task we are considering, this project has several drawbacks: the balloon is not very convenient for permanent movement by vehicles and, if possible, should be tied to a certain point, which excludes the possibility of changing positions with mobile air defense systems and is unacceptable. In addition, the huge size of the balloon (length over 70 meters) can theoretically interfere with its operation in strong gusty winds.

On the other hand, the concept itself is quite promising. Placed on aero radars, radar can cover stationary objects from low-flying EHVs, primarily such as intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) mines, submarine bases, ballistic missile carriers, strategic bombers' aerodromes, nuclear power plants and other critical elements of the country's armed forces and infrastructure. .

Thus, despite the fact that aerostats are not the optimal means for providing air defense systems with the possibility of hitting targets beyond the horizon line, they can play an important role in covering particularly important stationary objects from a sudden strike by low-flying enemy EHVs. Their main advantage is the possibility of quasi-continuous stay in the air without significant costs of fuel and electricity.

In Russia, such balloons are developed by RosAeroSystems. In particular, it is possible to consider a high-volume tethered balloon “PUMA”. The Puma balloon was designed as a radar carrier for round-the-clock radar surveillance from altitudes up to 5 km during 30 days without landing.

Estimated radius of detection and tracking of air targets will be 300-350 km. The balloon must withstand hurricane winds up to 46 m / s and direct lightning strikes. The balloon is held by cable-rope during ascent, descent and parking at working height, it also provides power supply for on-board systems and payload with power up to 40 kW, as well as lightning and static electricity. The payload of the PUMA balloon is up to 2250 kg.


Attached balloon of large volume "PUMA"


Apparently, the Russian armed forces are working on this direction:
In July, 2015, Advisor to the First Deputy General Director of the Radioelectronic Technologies Concern (KRET) Vladimir Mikheev told RIA News about the start of work on the airship project for the needs of the country's missile defense. It can become a full-fledged element of the missile attack warning system (EWS), which today consists of two echelons - the orbital satellite constellation and ground-based radar stations.


The case of the concern Almaz-Antey, it is necessary that the balloons and airships could not only warn about the threat of air attack, but also direct anti-aircraft guided missiles (SAM), equipped with an active radar homing head (ARGSN), at the identified targets.

Quadcopters and other unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) vertical takeoff and landing


Let's return to the air defense system. To begin with, we will consider short-range and medium-range air defense systems, for which it is required to raise the radar to a height of 200 and 700 meters, respectively.

At the beginning of 2018, Boeing introduced a prototype of an electric unmanned quadcopter cargo aircraft. This UAV is designed for testing and debugging the technologies necessary for the creation of next-generation cargo and passenger aircraft. The length of the experienced UAV 4,57 meter, the width of the 5,49 meter, the height of the 1,22 meter, the weight, including the weight of the batteries, is 339 kilograms. Payload - up to 226 kg. The design includes four electric motors with eight rotors.


Boeing's cargo quadcopter



Boeing company's quadcopter presentation

Electric quadcopters-UAVs can be an effective solution for detecting low-flying EAS for land and sea-based air defense missile systems.

Electric quadcopter-UAV should be placed on the vehicle carrier, there should also be placed a diesel generator set (DGU) to provide the UAV with electricity. Unfortunately, the power of the electric motors of the experienced quadcopter, battery charging time and flight time are unknown at this time.

Two options can be considered:
- in the first variant, there are no rechargeable batteries needed to maintain long flight, power supply is provided from the carrier vehicle, there is only a small backup battery for emergency landing of the UAV, presumably, this option can be considered optimal;
- the second option can be used if the weight of the cable required to supply the necessary power to the quadcopter is too large, in this case the batteries or supercapacitors (ionistors) with a fast charging function should be placed on the quadcopter.

To ensure the continuity of staying in the air for four short-range air defense systems, at least two carrier vehicles with UAVs are necessary. The time the UAV is in the air will be limited only by the availability of fuel for a diesel generator set.

Instead of an electric quadcopter, a UAV can be implemented on the basis of gasoline or diesel piston engines. In Russia, SKYF Technology is engaged in the development and production of such solutions, offering a SKYF vertical takeoff and landing UAV to a customer. At the moment, the SKYF UAV payload capacity is 250 kilogram with the prospect of increasing to 400 kilogram. The height of the flight of the UAV to 3000 meters.


Gasoline UAV vertical takeoff and landing



Flight demonstration SKYF UAV


Presentation SKYF UAV

Earlier, Horizont was announced by the Horizon Air S-100 helicopter type UAV with a circular review radar based on the Austrian Schiebel Camcopter S-100. Mounted on this UAV radar circular review "Hummingbird", installed in the bottom of the fuselage, is being developed in conjunction with the Moscow "Research Institute of Radio Physics." The total mass of radar equipment should be no more than 6,5 kg, the required range in the circular view mode (UAV hang) is not less than 200 km, in the mode of the synthesized aperture not less than 20 km.

The payload of this UAV is too small (35 kg) in order to accommodate a radar with acceptable characteristics, which may be interesting as a concept. Continuous hours in the air 6.


Helicopter-type UAVs manufactured by Horizon with a circular viewing radar


The given examples of quadcopters-UAVs cannot be directly involved in the placement of the radar, since they have a relatively modest payload, but there is no doubt that their designs will be actively developed and improved. First of all, it is related to electric quadrocopters-UAVs.

The main requirements for a quadcopter type UAV or a helicopter type UAV-DRLO type should be high reliability and the possibility of long-term stay in the air, ensuring the specified flight performance (LTH), as well as high operating life and low flight hour.

High altitude UAV


For long-range UAVs, a vertical take-off and landing UAV will no longer be an effective and sufficient reconnaissance tool, since the radar placement height, in order to achieve a range of about 400 km, must exceed 10 000 meters.

Supposedly, as a flying radar for long-range air defense missile systems, UAVs of long duration, aircraft type, medium or long dimension can be used.

One of the candidates for the role of promising drone-DRLO can become an Altair UAV with a take-off weight of 5 tons and a payload of 1-2 tons. This UAV is being created as part of the Altius-M research project at the Sokol Design Bureau (Kazan) together with the Transas company. The duration of its flight should be up to 48 hours, the flight range is 10 km. In 000, the Altair UAV program was transferred to the Ural Plant of Civil aviation"(UZGA). Altair UAV flight tests should begin in 2019.


Prototype UAV Altair


Devices of this type are being developed in other countries. In particular, the Chinese company CETC is developing a JY-300 UAV. A medium-sized device should become a carrier of conformal antennas and serve as an AWED unmanned vehicle. According to preliminary data, the JY-300 UAV has a take-off weight of about 1300 kg and can carry 400 kg of payload. He is able to fly for up to 12 hours, at altitudes up to 7,6 km. Built in the design of this drone radar should allow the detection of air and sea targets at long distances.


Prototype UAV DRLO JY-300 Chinese company CETC


Russian medium and large-sized UAVs are plagued by many problems, including the lack of compact, powerful and economical domestic engines, the absence of modern avionics. One of the most important problems is the lack of high-speed channels of satellite data transmission with global reach, allowing the UAV to be managed and to receive intelligence information from it at a great distance from the basing point.

The use of a DRLO UAV with a long flight duration does not require the presence of such channels. In general terms, the operation of a long-range air defense system of a long-range UAV can look like this:

The long-range UAV DRLO takes off from the airfield and goes into the patrol zone over the positions of the echelon air defense. All information from it comes to the long-range air defense system operators, and further, through the command and control point to the other air defense system operators that are part of the united echelon air defense system. The flight of the UAV should be carried out mostly in automatic mode on a given trajectory. One long-range air defense system should include two DRLO UAVs. In this case, they can shift their duty in shifts over the position of the air defense missile system with a duration of 36-48 hours, depending on the distance of the home airfield.

The requirements for long-range UAV DRLOs are the same as for UAVs for short- and medium-range air defense missile systems - high operational life and low flight hour costs.

The question may arise: the title of the article refers to the work of the air defense system on low-flying targets without involving Air Force aircraft, while the UAV of a long duration of flight clearly refers to aviation. Here the question is rather in departmental affiliation. In the United States, by agreement of Johnson-McConnell between the army and the Air Force, helicopters do not belong to the Air Force and are directly subordinate to the US Army and act in its interests (the division of aircraft in the United States between the army and the Air Force is well written here). So our case, the fact that the UAV refers to a specific air defense missile system will not allow the use of its air force for other purposes.

Echelon air defense with drone drone


The use of a quadrocopter type DRLO UAV and a long duration DFLO UAV will allow you to create a dense radar terrain coverage and ensure target targeting to missiles with ARGSN and IR GOS at maximum range.

Presumably, two short-range air defense systems should have one car with a quadrocopter-type AWAC UAV or two cars for four air defense systems. The medium range air defense system should include two vehicles with a quadrocopter type UAV. Two long-range drone UAVs should relate to long-range air defense systems.

During the period of danger or in the event of the start of hostilities, long-flight UAVs must carry out continuous patrols over the positions of the air defense missile system. Quadrocopter-type UAVs from the short- and medium-range air defense missile systems should be on carrier vehicles in readiness for an immediate launch. If an air threat is detected, a quadrocopter type UAV should be launched within a few minutes.

The cost of the UAV itself and their flight time is traditionally significantly lower than the cost of manned aircraft and helicopters, which makes this task economically attractive. Technically, the proposed concept also contains no insurmountable problems.

For stationary objects of high importance can be used AEW balloons. In the case of air defense facilities equipped with airborne early warning balloons, UAVs of long duration are not required and can be excluded from the long-range air defense missile systems or can be on the airfield in readiness for departure as a backup reconnaissance and target designation tool.

UAV DRLO for fleet


Previously, only the use of UAVs in the interests of ground-based air defense systems was considered. But no less, and perhaps more important, is the use of a quadcopter-type UAV and a UAV with a long flight duration in the interests of air defense of naval ships fleet (Navy). Given the fact that we have no aircraft carriers and, accordingly, AWACS aircraft on them, modern Russian ships are poorly protected from air attacks, regardless of whatever air defense they were on, due to physical limitations on the detection range of low-flying targets.

The use of quadrocopter-type UAVs on ships of the Russian Navy will make it possible to significantly push the line of destruction of low-flying targets. And sending a UAV with a long duration and flight range to the area where the Navy ships are located will give them additional capabilities in reconnoitering the enemy forces and issuing target designation to the missile arms long range.


The concept of the British ship Dreadnought 2050 with a UAV connected to the ship with a carbon nanotube cable and a superconducting cable with cryogenic cooling


One cannot exclude the use of balloons and airships of AWACS in the interests of the Navy, especially since historical there are examples of the use of balloons by the Russian fleet.


Cruiser "Rus" with an attached aerostat


Conclusions


Ground and surface defense without the possibility of attacking low-flying targets at a long distance will be crushed.

To solve this problem in the interests of short and medium range SAM systems, it is necessary to create a quadrocopter type DRLO UAV, preferably with power supply via cable from the carrier vehicle.

For long-range air defense systems it is necessary to intensify the development of long-duration UAV UAVs.

For stationary objects of high importance can be used AEW balloons.

All of the above-mentioned systems (quadrocopter type drone drone, long duration drone drone, and early warning drone) are of great importance for improving the efficiency and survival of not only ground-based air defense systems, but ships of the Russian Navy.
52 comments
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  1. +1
    April 26 2019 12: 23
    Problems, problems ... and nothing more problems.
    1. +3
      April 26 2019 12: 43
      The use of new missiles with ARGSN, when shooting over the horizon, as technology develops in conjunction with the development of systems for horizontal target designation, it will solve many problems, but not all. The sword and shield competition will continue.
      1. 0
        April 26 2019 16: 42
        The use of missiles with ARGSN when firing at a radio horizon is limited by many factors, including the difficulty of detecting and automatically tracking air targets, especially those made using STELS technology. In addition, when using such missiles, it is difficult to control their effectiveness (i.e., it went beyond the horizon, but it did or didn’t and for whom the big question came up). It’s not easy to maintain constant communication with a missile that has gone beyond the radio horizon, and such communication unmasks the rocket, i.e. exposes the missile under fire EHV.
        Overseas target designation is also not a panacea, because SAM at such distances requires precise guidance and not the coordinates measured by over-the-horizon radar with an accuracy of plus or minus bast. Such accuracy is still suitable for the systems of early warning of an enemy EIA attack, but it is in no way suitable for targeting missiles. In addition, over-the-horizon radar is an excellent stationary emitting target.
        for ORS and such targets will be destroyed first.
        Therefore, the effectiveness of missiles with homing heads when shooting for a radio horizon is still a big question.
        And further. Why install an entire radar on an aerostat?
        Maybe it will be enough to install only the radar antenna on the aerostat, and place the rest of the radar equipment (transmitter, receiver, processors, etc.) on the ground stationary or on mobile units?
        1. 0
          April 26 2019 17: 19
          Quote: gregor6549
          ... And further. Why install an entire radar on an aerostat?
          Maybe it will be enough to install only the radar antenna on the aerostat, and place the rest of the radar equipment (transmitter, receiver, processors, etc.) on the ground stationary or on mobile units?


          Perhaps it will do so. I counted on that exactly speaking about quadrocopters on a cable with a power cable. To bring up only the AFAR canvas, and the rest as far as possible down onto the car carrier.

          It is easier with aerostats, they have a load capacity of about three tons, they can immediately install everything in them so that it is easier to relocate.
          1. +2
            April 26 2019 17: 55
            AFAR is not always required. In some cases, it can be limited to installing a reflecting canvas on a balloon or another flying platform and leaving the scanner below. The load capacity of the balloon is also a double-edged sword. The greater the load capacity of the balloon, the greater its dimensions, reflecting surface and visibility for the enemy radar. In addition, when installing radar equipment on zamle or on vehicles, its maintenance is simplified, including the prompt replacement of its faulty modules with serviceable ones from spare parts. And when it's all on the balloon, imagine how much time and effort you will need to spend on such a replacement. And so at the top one mirror / canvas antenna does not require special maintenance.
        2. -1
          April 26 2019 19: 32
          gregor6549, read more literature and do not pour outdated your knowledge. Missiles with ARGSN - 40N6, SM-6 easily hit targets, including over-the-horizon subtle - cruise missiles - read about the tests of SM-6 and much will become clear. If the communication channel with the ARGSN disappears, it switches from semi-active to fully active mode and, scanning the space, directs the missile’s anti-aircraft gun precisely at the target having previously old target designation.
          Quote: gregor6549
          Therefore, the effectiveness of missiles with homing heads when shooting for a radio horizon is still a big question.

          It is only in your head.
          Quote: gregor6549
          It’s not easy to maintain constant communication with a rocket that has gone beyond the horizon, and such a connection will unmask the rocket, i.e. Submits missiles to the STS fire.

          But how will you shoot down a maneuvering 40N6 hypersonic missile (10 M) with an overload of more than 25 g?
          And about the over-the-horizon radars - you have incomplete ideas, read about the class of these radars - such as Mineral-ME. Maybe then you will have a different opinion?
          1. -1
            April 26 2019 20: 17
            In addition, a missile with ARGSN can transmit its target designation to other target designation means and to the same missiles having a communication channel, which is done in the new 40N6 anti-aircraft missile.
          2. 0
            April 27 2019 07: 32
            Be rude kid. Although this has become a common style of communication in VO. And what about obsolete knowledge .... Knowledge never goes out of date. Here is their absence, such as you, "experts" often replace with illusions, advertising videos and other informational rubbish gleaned from such "deeply informed" sources as the notorious National Interest and similar "primary sources. From what such a hangover did the shipborne radar Mineral ME of the centimeter range become Suddenly over-the-horizon. And capable of detecting subtle cruise missiles behind this very horizon. Was the radio horizon canceled by the highest order? And how do you say the rocket will perform a hypersonic maneuver with an overload of more than 25g? After all, it will collapse by itself, poor thing. There have always been supersonic ones. problems with performing steep maneuvers, and you are talking about hypersound.And after all you said, you begin to teach people who have been developing air defense systems for more than 40 years, who managed to do something in this area and who still advise both customers and manufacturers on these most systems.Truly militant ignorance is not badimo
            1. 0
              April 27 2019 07: 49
              When did such a ban appear? Yes, there was a reprimand for me for allegedly profanity and a ban on leaving my comments here for several weeks, but those weeks are long gone. And my vocabulary was more than innocent, compared to the vocabulary of many commentators. Maybe the admins don't like the fact that I sometimes speak out against the "general" opinion and do not support shrieking for any reason and without reason. So this is not my problem, but those who shrug and those admins who support it. Already got stuck in the late 0s. How it ended at 30 is known
            2. -2
              April 27 2019 11: 21
              gregor6549! You can see what knowledge - their complete absence. Apparently you do not know at all the types of over-the-horizon radars and consider yourself above others to even read information about them.
              Also, the complete lack of knowledge about the new 40N6 anti-aircraft missile and about the overload capacity of 25 g. Don't forget to read about the SM-6 anti-aircraft missile and its tests. You are completely out of topic. You can see what an "illiterate" designer you are with your "outdated" knowledge. Learn to start materiel. And do not assume what you do not know about others. Just verbal babble.
              1. -1
                April 27 2019 11: 46
                gregor6549, this is for your reference.
                Mineral-M is a Russian multifunctional radar ship complex designed to illuminate the marine environment, target designation missile systems and control of naval groups equipped with similar complexes. The complex includes active and passive over-the-horizon radar, as well as a station for the mutual exchange of information.

                Teach materiel. wassat
                1. 0
                  April 28 2019 12: 57
                  This is what sources you offer me to teach materiel?
                  Isn’t it agitated at https://www.arms-expo.ru/armament/samples/1873/77129?
                  So there, even from the pictures of the radar, any specialist can say that the ability of such a radar to detect air targets beyond the radio horizon, declared there, is obvious bullshit. Yes, passive radar can detect RADIATING aerial targets at a greater range than non-emitting ones. But again, not beyond the radio horizon, but above it, and the enemy is not the kind to fly and "shine".
                  One could still somehow believe in these "over-the-horizon" tales if the radar had at least a meter range, but for a centimeter radar these tales remain tales.
                  And these fairy tales are designed for experts like you. Excuse the old man with his "outdated" knowledge in the field of air defense systems, including in the field of radar systems for these systems. By the way,
                  I do not advise you to study the materiel, as you and other specialists advise me. Yes, and it is unlikely that you and they have access to the real TTH of this very materiel. But to get acquainted with the basics of the theory of radiolocation Shirman, Skolnik and other well-known experts in the field of radar and you, and they just would not hurt. Or the theory of radar, too, is already outdated, and someone invented something new?
                  Now about the miracle of missiles like 40N6 and SM-6. It seems that your opinion was formed by the same sources from where you got the data about the Mineral-M radar. Firstly, these missiles cannot be classified as hypersonic. 3M is supersonic, but not hypersonic. In the Second, both in that and in the arc rocket ARGSN are used on the lumpy section of the trajectory, while the target must have sufficient RCS (like AWACS and U aircraft) so that ARGSN can detect and escort it (and against aircraft using stealth technology it will be difficult and due to the weak onboard radar of the rocket and due to the limited computing power of the onboard digital computer of this rocket) or be emitting like the same AWACS and U.
                  You can, in principle, create a missile defense system with a super duper radar, and a super duper on-board digital computer, but such a missile will be truly golden, and it will take a lot of time to develop it.
                  And the last. In my past work, I had to deal with the X-NUMX air defense system and communicate with С300 developers from Almaz. So I know some kind of materiel deeply enough and I think that there are some fundamental differences between С300 and its clones (С300, С350 and С400), besides the improved SAM, no.
                  Yes, these radars can be added to the extent necessary and additional radar and other means that were previously not in the standard structure of the СХNUMX air defense missile system, but these are not so much technical as organizational measures, which also
                  seriously increase the cost of air defense systems and the complexity of their t6 technical maintenance with a questionable increase in their efficiency and reduced mobility. No one has yet canceled the evaluation of such systems on the basis of the efficiency / cost criterion.
                  1. 0
                    April 30 2019 13: 48
                    gregor6549, what you write is simply ugly. And again you showed your complete ignorance in radar!
                    Read carefully about "Mineral-M", as well as about the ground version - "Monolit-B". And don't try to wriggle out.
                    And I would advise you to learn the basics of radar, familiarize yourself with the works
                    Yu. Kazarinov, D. Barton, Skolnik, Makovetskiy and others in the field of radar. You didn’t even bother to read about Mineral-M and again fell into a hole. Can you understand the meaning?
                    And according to the technical specifications - the 40N6 rocket - reaches a speed of 9M, not 3M, as you write, otherwise you will not hit the target at a distance of 400 km, during your flight it will fly far - out of reach. Your thoughts about the weak onboard radar simply do not hold water. The detection range of the ARGSN, like that of an AWACS aircraft - 800 km for air targets, is not required, and therefore it is not required to have such parameters - only according to the possibility with the development of technologies and signal processing.
                    In general, you have only one words ...
          3. 0
            April 29 2020 22: 15
            Where did you see the article on SM-6? in Russian?
            As for the over-horizon SM-6 (in the sense of hitting low-flying targets outside the radio horizon), I understood differently, for its success, the F-35 is needed as an external control post, so to speak. And how will 40N6 be induced in your opinion ?.
    2. 0
      April 28 2019 01: 06
      NO problems, NO SOLUTIONS !!!! wink alas, life consists of this !!!! wink
  2. +6
    April 26 2019 12: 30
    It is an adequate article. Problems are considered from all sides.
    Now drones need to be shoved into everything - even in armored personnel carriers and in each squad of soldiers.
    1. 0
      April 26 2019 15: 51
      If you have autonomous swarms of drones, then people will greatly complicate their tasks, increase the cost of swarms with the same combat capabilities tenfold. you will need to recognize who your own. A person, even in the Russian Federation, is expensive, hundreds of drones if you consider his cost of growing and training as a fighter - this is, if not fuzzy meat, but a fighter in equipment, large kilograms in gold equivalent. The cost of just one fighter like a swarm of about 1 thousand small drones with a load of 1-2 kg with a range of not kilometers but more than 150 km each. So what's the point of shoving people where drones are more effective?
      What will a person with a machine gun do against a drone without a full-fledged swarm system? He will be kicked quickly because Electronic warfare is from remote control systems and from "robots" that are only called so. If the network is not in radio communication and the security of the chips is decent, Faraday grids with ground exploration, etc., you may not even be able to take the drone from a hundred meters with an impulse - a sufficient distance for it to use onboard weapons at you. For "flying Kalash" the price tag will be 50-100 times higher, although they are needed. As well as necessary electronic warfare, tk. if you could not crush cheaper electronic warfare, the cost of drones of the combat network drops several times for planners made of plastic from 0,05 g of gold, a price in million lots is possible.
  3. +4
    April 26 2019 12: 36
    Conclusion - UAVs must fight with UAVs.
  4. +3
    April 26 2019 12: 50
    Air defense officers have always dreamed of seeing more clearly! This is a natural desire.
    Here, any means are good if they are effective. And if, moreover, operational and not expensive, then only forward!
  5. +1
    April 26 2019 13: 20
    The author correctly wrote, but there are, in my opinion, some nuances.
    1. Perhaps he himself did not pay attention, but everywhere we are talking about the detection of targets, and not the guidance of missiles SAM.
    And this is not the same thing.
    Homing shipboard SAM-6 can do, for example, F-35 and Hokai, and this task is very difficult.
    Especially for the near-ground air defense missile systems. For example, for the shell. Slightly easier for missiles with active GOS, but also not so simple.
    2. I, frankly, had doubts about quadropters capable of hanging 36 watches with radar loads. I do not claim anything, but I strongly doubt it. Usually such a time is shown by drones of aircraft type with a large area of ​​the wing, but not helicopters and quadropters.
    3. A hanging airship or quadroter greatly unmasks the radar itself and at least its location. In addition, it may be affected by EW.
    4. There is no mention of passive rtr stations like Kolchuga or Vega- https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vega_(complex_radio-technical intelligence)
    5. The author did not mention the existing detection system on ships with the Aegis Lamps Mark 3 system, in which the helicopter’s HAK and radar are used not only in the helicopter itself, but also as remote sensors, the signals from which are processed by Aegis computers, which significantly expands the capabilities of the onboard HOOK and radar helicopter.
    Of course, the struggle between air defense and aviation is an eternal struggle between shell and armor.
    But at the moment, aviation is clearly ahead ....
    1. 0
      April 26 2019 13: 43
      Quote: Avior
      The author correctly wrote, but there are, in my opinion, some nuances.
      1. Perhaps he himself did not pay attention, but everywhere we are talking about the detection of targets, and not the guidance of missiles SAM.
      And this is not the same thing.
      Homing shipboard SAM-6 can do, for example, F-35 and Hokai, and this task is very difficult.


      Drew, without fail. Even in the previous material it was mentioned that there is no confirmed information about the possibility of issuing target designation from the DRLO to a missile with ARGSN. And in this article:

      The case of the concern Almaz-Antey, it is necessary that the balloons and airships could not only warn about the threat of air attack, but also direct anti-aircraft guided missiles (SAM), equipped with an active radar homing head (ARGSN), at the identified targets.


      And further, target designation is surely mentioned, without it, the game is not worth the candle, just to see what they are flying and doing nothing ...

      Quote: Avior
      Especially for the near-ground air defense missile systems. For example, for the shell. Slightly easier for missiles with active GOS, but also not so simple.


      Primarily for missiles with ARGSN. It seems that there were rumors that it was possible for the Armor to be developed such a rocket.

      For rockets with radio command guidance, for a short-range air defense system, a false start algorithm can be used.

      Now how - the missile saw the radar detection, passed on the seizure, the rocket flies, defeat.
      As it is possible to see a target beyond the horizon radar in the air, which is not accessible to the tracking radar, the meeting point is calculated taking into account the time required to capture the tracking radar target, the rocket is launched so as to be as close as possible to the target. In essence, we will reduce the time of the combat work cycle for the duration of the flight of the rocket before the meeting with the target.

      2. I, frankly, had doubts about quadropters capable of hanging 36 watches with radar loads. I do not claim anything, but I strongly doubt it. Usually such a time is shown by drones of aircraft type with a large area of ​​the wing, but not helicopters and quadropters.


      36 hours do not hang, it is written for aircraft-type UAVs. For petrol quadcopter 6 hours are announced, but with a load of 50 kg with a maximum load of 250 kg. On the other hand, he has an altitude of up to 3000 m, and here he needs to hang at an altitude of 200-700 m. And they already promise to raise the maximum carrying capacity to 400 kg.

      I’m more impressed with electric quadcopters. They will develop intensively. Here, of course, there are a lot of questions about how much mass a radar can be obtained, how much power must be supplied to the engines, respectively, the mass of the cable. If you can make email. quadcopter capable of raising the radar canvas (processing all on the "ground") on 200 m and powering it with a cable, then it can hang for a very long time while there is enough fuel for the generator.

      Quote: Avior
      3. A hanging airship or quadroter greatly unmasks the radar itself and at least its location. In addition, it may be affected by EW.


      Therefore, I believe that they should be placed on stationary objects whose positions are already known. If the air defense system protects this object, then the change of position will still be +/- 2-3 km, only so that it is not covered by GPS, and the balloon can hang where it was hanging. Well, or for the fleet, the ship and so will spot from afar.

      And EW can all be exposed, and it can be supplemented with OLS.
    2. +4
      April 26 2019 13: 55
      Quote: Avior
      I honestly have doubts about quadroptors that can hang 36 hours with a load in the form of a radar

      Easy, even more possible. If it's a tethered platform. With a power source on the ground. At the dawn of "drone building" they managed to reach a height, not just electricity, pump gasoline ...
  6. +1
    April 26 2019 13: 28
    Placing a radar on a balloon is a bit difficult. It may be possible to place on the balloon only a reflective screen and control mechanisms for this screen for scanning. And leave the radar on the surface of the earth so that the radar beam is reflected from the screen.
  7. +3
    April 26 2019 13: 34
    Rich fantasy.
    The capabilities of modern truck cranes make it possible to lift a load of 9 tons to a height of up to 50 meters, which makes it possible to place on a PMU of a similar radar design to detect low-flying targets

    Firstly for cranes there is a limit on the maximum wind load when working at height with the load.

    Secondly, a crane with a lifting capacity of 9 to the height of 50 m - is not produced in the country (we do not live in China where there are manufacturers of cranes with similar characteristics - XCMG, SANY, ZOOLION, etc.) we take imported second-hand Liebherre, etc.
    1. 0
      April 26 2019 14: 07
      Quote: DimerVladimer
      Rich fantasy.
      The capabilities of modern truck cranes make it possible to lift a load of 9 tons to a height of up to 50 meters, which makes it possible to place on a PMU of a similar radar design to detect low-flying targets

      Firstly for cranes there is a limit on the maximum wind load when working at height with the load.

      Secondly, a crane with a lifting capacity of 9 to the height of 50 m - is not produced in the country (we do not live in China where there are manufacturers of cranes with similar characteristics - XCMG, SANY, ZOOLION, etc.) we take imported second-hand Liebherre, etc.


      The crane is given as an example of the fact that such a construction is realizable.
      We do not need such a mass at such a height, it is unlikely that the radar would weigh more than a ton.
      In general, they are presented as an element of analysis, to show that there is little use for them, so that later in the comments not to justify why the towers are not considered.
    2. 0
      April 27 2019 14: 58
      The tower is good, but suitable only for the hospital.
      Ascent / descent from the tower (25 m like) of the S-300 antenna should be done in at least 1 hour.
      No cranes are needed.
      At the department they said that once with the help of a crane they raised a post to a tower with an additional section (45 meters). A few hours time and a bunch of hemorrhoids. I had to take a crane, which in St. Petersburg was then a few pieces.
  8. +2
    April 26 2019 13: 47
    It’s good that they took up early-warning balloons and airships.
    But the next step is worth working out: missile airship deployment. Thus, it is possible to obtain supermobile air defense systems for problem regions (Arctic).
  9. +2
    April 26 2019 14: 00
    As life shows, for example, in Afghanistan and on the BV, it is much more important not the detection range, but the glare of the undeveloped folds of the relief.
    1. +1
      April 26 2019 14: 08
      Quote: Peter S
      As life shows, for example, in Afghanistan and on the BV, it is much more important not the detection range, but the glare of the undeveloped folds of the relief.


      It's all just interconnected. Above the radar placement platform - the relief affects less.
      1. 0
        April 26 2019 15: 10
        Right? Well, teach me to look around the corner.
        1. 0
          April 26 2019 15: 12
          Quote: Peter S
          Right? Well, teach me to look around the corner.


          The angle of what? Cruise missile for nine-story hide?
          1. 0
            April 29 2019 10: 55
            You are far from air defense, so better shut up. You will seem clever.
            1. 0
              April 29 2019 10: 58
              Quote: Peter S
              You are far from air defense, so better shut up. You will seem clever.


              You will "poke" and gag someone else, first write something clever yourself.
              1. 0
                April 29 2019 11: 04
                I’m not going to teach you. This will not add to your brain.
                1. 0
                  April 29 2019 11: 06
                  At the very sight of the brain in abundance, only the mind is not in them, as well as elementary politeness.
                  1. 0
                    April 29 2019 11: 30
                    I am always rude with the boors! The author brought you the classic tables, and you’re like peas against a wall - you make nonsense and scatter it on the Internet. An obstacle of only 50 meters covers the radar located 10 km at a distance of 412 km! Do not go into adult conversations, not yet mature.
                    1. 0
                      April 29 2019 11: 32
                      I am the author
                      1. 0
                        April 29 2019 11: 34
                        The tables are not yours. And if you brought, then think how to use
                      2. 0
                        April 29 2019 11: 35
                        Is it really not mine? And I sat calculating ...
                      3. 0
                        April 29 2019 11: 40
                        Similarly, I found a textbook, looked. Here you are too naughty - in addition to the curvature of the earth, the shape of the petal is also taken into account.
  10. +1
    April 26 2019 15: 21
    Finally ! Finally, "someone" has supported (albeit, perhaps indirectly) my point of view! I have long and repeatedly "expressed" that ground air defense systems are largely outdated! And it is required to carry out a number of constructive measures to bring air defense systems closer to the required combat state, corresponding to modern realities and organically fitting into these realities! Not PMU, not balloons ... but "electric" platform-copters with a cable-cable-carriers of radar equipment - that's the solution to the problem. It is necessary to consider placement options, both for radar transceivers with an antenna system, and only AFAR with a power amplifier ... At the same time, the components of the optical location station will be "there"! It is not excluded that it is advisable to place small-caliber interceptor missiles protecting air defense systems on "tethered" copter platforms. Interesting prospects are opening up as a result of the massive introduction of aerial platforms with nuclear power plants (Burevestnik base): DRLO , repeaters, and even carriers of air defense weapons. The use of copters with "heat" engines is not excluded, if the problem of convenient fuel supply through the "hose" to the "tethered" copter is solved. If possible, ensure the copter's ability to "hover" for a while and move a certain distance "to the side" in the event of a "break" of the cable-cable / cable-hose (batteries, mini-tank ...).
    1. +3
      April 26 2019 20: 30
      I am entirely in favor, and also wrote posts on this topic.
      It’s time to raise radars into the air on an UAV with a power and communication cable.
    2. 0
      April 29 2019 11: 06
      Surely a cable hose is more realistic than a cable. The idea is not bad, and super-heights and super-ranges are not needed. The main thing is cheapness and compactness so that every wrinkle can be illuminated.
  11. 0
    April 26 2019 19: 23
    It seems everything is simple and logical ... and just as maximally inapplicable in our realities.
    The most flimsy AWACS equipment barely breaks into the IL76 (apparently, also with overload), and you fantasize about placing quadrocopters or special aircraft-type UAVs that so far can only fly (and this is difficult, and not always).
    Of the most rational means of increasing the effectiveness of ground-based air defense systems, there remains only a balloon (for good reason, Americans and Jews have already chosen this base for themselves).
    It is not necessary to consider a crane as a "tower", now there are cheap quick-assembly plastic truss structures with a height of a hundred meters, this is also quite enough for a short and medium-range air defense system.
    Also, do not forget the old as the world concept of cheap diversity transmit-receive antennas.
    1. 0
      April 27 2019 02: 43
      Okho-ho-ho ... DRLO-they are all sorts! As they say ... there is Fedot, and there is Fedot, who is not wink After all, "real" AWACS have a lot of "superfluous" equipment ... (superfluous for, for example, for medium-range air defense systems ...). And besides, having mentioned "AWACS on a copter", I got excited ... I mean "one", but for brevity I wrote another ... And about "truss structures a hundred meters high ...
      the concept of cheap diversity transmit-receive antennas ... "... But what? Wasn't this or something similar (!) known to techies? But where are they? So it turns out that your proposal not applicable in our realities And if you choose the options: to clutter up the trucks with farms or place a copter in the truck, then most likely the copter will be more optimal. As for the balloons ... let's not talk about the "windage" of these "products", about their dimensions (visibility) .. How are you going to "inflate / deflate" the entyerostats? Here it is necessary "fly" to curl up and leave the previous position! Shaw to do with a balloon? "Blow off"? Can ! But will it take shikoko time? Well, in comparison with PMU, or "truss structures", maybe it will do, but compared with a copter, it is unlikely ... Let's go further ... And what and how are you going to fill the erostat with? Helium or hydrogen? And how are you going to transport the "ethno"? How much transport do you need for a gas car? You can fill it with "exhaust gases", but ... the gas generator ... the filling time and ... so that the "hot sausage shines"? Well, of course ! You can indignantly talk about "modern heat-reflecting materials" ... but how much will they increase the weight, the cost of the "balloon"? About the same can be said about hot air (hot air balloon) ...
  12. +2
    April 26 2019 20: 28
    "Concept of the British ship Dreadnought 2050 with a UAV connected to the ship
    carbon nanotube cable and superconducting cable with
    cryogenic cooling "////
    -----
    The concept is absolutely correct. But to realize it is not easy.
    You can make a semi-balloon-semi-quadrocopter. Power cable
    from a ship power plant.
    AFAR on such an UAV will have a view ten times larger than
    from the ship’s tower superstructure.
    It is better to duplicate the system: one radar in the air, the second - on the preventive
    service or in reserve.
  13. -3
    April 26 2019 20: 39
    Airborne air defense / missile defense radars for Russia are required only in wartime or during expeditionary operations. In peacetime, it is more efficient to use the "Container" ZGRLS with an air target detection range of 3000 km and a dead zone of 1000 km (for this distance the ZGRLS refers to the interior of the country).

    An aerostat as a radar platform will not work - it will easily be brought down by the enemy in the first place as a large fixed target. The helicopter will not work either - the weight of a modern radar with a full-scope AFAR is several hundred kg.

    The aircraft type UAV remains with a payload of the order of 1000 kg. Barrage height - 10 km, radio horizon - 400 km. The radar itself must be equipped with hardware and software, which form dips in the pattern of interference sources and provide a mode of reverse synthesized antenna aperture for dividing the group target into separate aircraft and separating the true targets from the false ones by their geometrical dimensions.

    And no satellite channels for transmitting radar data - only via a UAV repeater to a ground control station or directly to this point with the corresponding area of ​​the UAV radar.

    PS In the event that the Pantsirey air defense system contains short-range anti-aircraft missiles "Nail" (operating on aviation ammunition) in the amount of 96 units on each air defense system, the detection range of air targets by ground radars will be quite sufficient.
  14. 0
    April 27 2019 11: 10
    Quote: Operator
    .....
    The aircraft type UAV remains with a payload of the order of 1000 kg. Barrage height - 10 km, radio horizon - 400 km. The radar itself must be equipped with hardware and software, which form dips in the pattern of interference sources and provide a mode of reverse synthesized antenna aperture for dividing the group target into separate aircraft and separating the true targets from the false ones by their geometrical dimensions.

    PS In the event that the Pantsirey air defense system contains short-range anti-aircraft missiles "Nail" (operating on aviation ammunition) in the amount of 96 units on each air defense system, the detection range of air targets by ground radars will be quite sufficient.

    .... it would be nice, of course, to have at least .. One thing. But, unfortunately, he still does not remain.
    After all, firstly, during an attack by an airborne bomb, using almost all active interference, covered by the massive use of the same, slightly sawed-up self-propelled electronic warfare containers, ..45-kilogram MALDs, ... with failures of the bottom of the air defense radar mounted on the UAV, in azimuths and angles of the location of the all-round suppliers of active interference (SVN-s and MALD-s), ... the screens of the radar systems of air defense systems will be pristine clear. So maybe the radar, with the same success, simply does not include the radiation? ..).
    Secondly, - "nails", as much as 96 pieces, - when attacking several F-15s, with their own active interference and fifty of the same electronic warfare MALDs "in one rank" (practically at the same range in different high-altitude echelons) the number of nails is enough, there is not enough time for their (adversaries) total destruction, due to the insignificant channeling of the Shell on the target.
    Somewhere like that ..... and how, in general, to shoot at an active jammer from the Pantsir or S-400 without all the firing data on the range to the target ?? This is a big theoretical question, the "three-point" method "does not shoot" here, because the current missile defense system is not on liquid-propellant engines, on solid propellants, and most of the trajectory follows a ballistic curve ..
  15. Quote: gregor6549
    AFAR is not always required. In some cases, it can be limited to installing a reflecting canvas on a balloon or another flying platform and leaving the scanner below. The load capacity of the balloon is also a double-edged sword. The greater the load capacity of the balloon, the greater its dimensions, reflecting surface and visibility for the enemy radar. In addition, when installing radar equipment on zamle or on vehicles, its maintenance is simplified, including the prompt replacement of its faulty modules with serviceable ones from spare parts. And when it's all on the balloon, imagine how much time and effort you will need to spend on such a replacement. And so at the top one mirror / canvas antenna does not require special maintenance.

    ***
    1. The passive reflector is large and windage. Its presence will attenuate the transmission and reception signals significantly, therefore, it will require large transmission powers, greater amplification of the reception signals, and greater energy consumption of consumption.
    2. Due to the windage, the width of the radiation beam and the orientation of the targets in azimuth and altitude, this is at least threefold (aerostat, ground launcher. Target), the system will probably be poorly coordinated.
    3.Maybe more suitable is an active repeater on a balloon with remote control antenna devices that allows the spatial orientation of all components of the system, because the repeater has smaller antenna devices than passive reflectors, and the energy costs of relaying, loss of transmission and reception signals at the repeater - PU section will be minimal;
    4. My brother in Afghanistan used passive reflectors when organizing PP communications in the mountains, but they were stationary fixed and strictly oriented.
    5. From my experience of working with RRS with VZPU GK VVS: R-409 with a power of 40 W, I could keep in touch with ground RRS R-409 at VzPU GK VVS (flight altitude 10 km) at a distance of up to 320 km.
    6. I believe that the average power of the AWACS transmitter can be several kilowatts.
    7. Based on 5 and 6, Questions,
    7.1. From what distance the radar of early warning itself located on the balloon will be detected by the enemy's early warning systems?
    7.2. Will it be a significantly premature unmasking sign of the presence of air defense systems in the area?
    7.3. Will it be an extremely vulnerable component of air defense in the 1-th queue and its meaning will be leveled in advance?
    PS When I play chess, I forget to think like an opponent, I think for myself, and the opponent thinks for himself .... this entails a loss .. (The series "THINK LIKE A CRIMINAL" ...)
    1. 0
      April 30 2019 12: 49
      Quote: Lieutenant Colonel USSR Air Force in stock

      7.1. From what distance the radar of early warning itself located on the balloon will be detected by the enemy's early warning systems?
      7.2. Will it be a significantly premature unmasking sign of the presence of air defense systems in the area?


      On 7.1, I will not answer, and I'm not sure that someone will answer exactly, because you need to know what type of radar and what power the balloon has, how sensitive the enemy's RTR is, or the radar of the AEW plane

      7.2 - I believe that the balloon is optimal for stationary objects that are already known to the enemy, such as ICBM mines. They are in the depths of the country, it is important not to let them be destroyed with a debilitating blow, one of the means of which can be low-flying KR.

      Quote: Lieutenant Colonel USSR Air Force in stock
      7.3. Will it be an extremely vulnerable component of air defense in the 1-th queue and its meaning will be leveled in advance?


      Balloons - depending on how far they are from the border, some will be able to immediately destroy, and some must be reached. They are unmanned, not such a critical loss, and of course they must be protected, the same defense, within which they operate, aircraft. And they have to act not alone - manned DRLO planes as part of air groups, DRLO UAVs of long duration, radar on quadcopters powered by cable.
      1. I absolutely agree that in peacetime it is suitable for reconnaissance, and for border objects, and for deep objects, as well as for cheap false simulators of goals, with the goal of reducing attacks on real objects. And in wartime they will be visible so far that .... Aircraft AWACS at least change their location.
  16. 0
    2 May 2019 15: 31
    The answer was back in 1992. Thermal plan ALA-40 for 40 tons of payload and the development of ALA-2000 as already understood for 2000 tons of payload.

    it was developed and has long been there, as always, "no one's hands reach" until the state order does not come from Vladimir Putin himself. To the flock, according to the moim, a normal Man, but not all of his surroundings inspire confidence, he does not rule everyone himself, does not keep up.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cLEllRn0euo
    from 30 minutes, look about the thermo plan, but it’s better to view everything completely.