Military Review

Walk, ragged, from the hryvnia and above, or what is behind the loud statements of Admiral Haiduk

101
The Black Sea was once called more honest. Or more correctly. It was called Russian. For more than a thousand years, right up to the 17th century, this name flashed in historical documents of different countries.




Then came the contenders for the ownership of this sea. Russia did not actively resist this. The point, seriously, is not in the title. The fact is, who actually owns the Black Sea region. But applicants wanted more. Applicants wanted to expel Russia from the region. And this desire was reinforced by very big blood. The blood of soldiers and sailors.

Ukraine today is among those who want it. Independence has engendered hatred for everything Russian. So, Russia today is forced to confront those whose ancestors lie with the Russians in the Crimean land. Whose ancestors tore their pharynx teeth to the Turks, the French, the British, the Germans. All invaders.

Today we are reviving our Black Sea fleet. It is difficult to revive. With a creak. We lived tears. But we are reviving. And, if you look historically, not for the first time. So for the success of this event for some reason there is confidence.

What is a fleet in terms of the military? I specifically focus on this.

For the majority of the inhabitants, the fleet is surface and submarine ships. This is a naval base. These are coastal batteries.

In fact, the modern fleet has long been not only ships. Let even the most modern. Fleet is a system. A system that can independently conduct any kind of hostilities. From submarine to space. And, if in terms of space is exaggerated, then very little.

Can anyone talk today about full navy without the marines? Without an air defense system? No sea aviation? Without EW? Without a full engineering service? You can write a lot. But it is easier to ask what the modern fleet does not have from what the army has?

In light of this, I would like to clarify the statements of the Ukrainian commander-in-chief, Admiral Haiduk, about the revival of the Ukrainian fleet in the near future. In the near, of course, in historical perspective.

So, from the admiral's statement, we see that in the plans of Kiev before 2020, to get from 2-x to 4-submarines. And also build at least 30 combat and auxiliary ships. Thus, to bring the number of the fleet of Ukraine almost to 70 units. I will not give the exact figure in 66 units. Just because the figure may vary depending on whether a machine gun is mounted on the next river boat or not.

However, Haiduk perfectly understands what a fleet is. Admiral, to whatever fleet he belongs to, man of the fleet. Sea man. That's why it speaks not only about ships. But also about the rest of the structure. First of all, about the coastal defense.

"Thanks to the creation of an integrated system, the basis of which is the division of the barrel and rocket artillery, the coastal strip in the Odessa and Nikolaev regions is reliably protected."

Simply put, Ukrainian naval commanders reinforce the coastline with artillery systems and volley fire systems. The task of these systems is to destroy a possible naval landing on the coast. At first glance - quite normal desire. Landing, especially marines, it is always very serious.

But what kind of admiral will he send his elite for shells without preliminary preparation of the coast? Russian will not be sent. And others too. A Marine is too expensive for the fleet. Too. It's easier to demolish all these batteries with air strikes. Yes, and rocket ship will help.

The Ukrainian Marines today actually have a very distant relation to the normal Marines. Today these are simple parts from the ATO area. With appropriate training and appropriate personnel.

Aviation of the Navy of Ukraine? Alas, this component is almost nonexistent. For all the years of independence of the country, not a single aircraft or helicopter was built for the Navy. All that remains today is the legacy of the "damned past" from the USSR. And the past is aging by leaps and bounds. I will not talk about moral aging. It's just about destruction. Sea water for aircraft is not a very pleasant neighborhood. As well as the lack of proper care and repair.

Air defense? The same legacy of the "cursed past." Therefore, we will not talk about him seriously.

And now about what the Ukrainian admirals are really planning. That in a few years will confront the Russian Black Sea Fleet.

Today in the Russian Black Sea Fleet is 43 warship. Different in age and class. Most of them are outdated and unable to conduct real combat operations in other seas. But quite capable of fighting in the Black Sea. In total, the Black Sea Fleet has approximately 2500 ships.

Ukrainian fleet: 3 warships, 5 boats and 1 minesweeper. Loud names no longer scare anyone. A very recent example has shown who is who in the Black Sea. I mean the meeting of our boats with the Ukrainian when transporting oil-producing platforms.

The surface fleet of Ukraine today cannot be replenished with at least something serious. The only more or less modern frigate that could theoretically be completed is frozen. And its readiness is only 37%. I mean the frigate of the project 58250 "Vladimir the Great".

The project is quite interesting. But. Bookmark took place in 2010 year (officially in 2011). And in 2015, the project is completely mothballed. And the re-entry, according to experts, is no longer possible. Another cruiser "Ukraine", nothing more. But it was planned for 2026 to create a powerful grouping of such ships.

What is the priority today? Oddly enough, boats. For more modern Ukraine is not capable. And while serious rocket boats also can not produce. No weapons. So, landing boats and boats of artillery support today a ceiling.

And the submarine fleet? Where Ukraine is going to take submarines? Build? The possibility of such construction showed repair "Zaporizhia".

This question interests many. Especially in Ukraine. And no one wants to give an answer. So, probably, I will have to.

The fact is that the admirals of Ukraine are pinning their hopes on the "modern" German submarines of the 209 project (type 209). These boats are equipped with such great maritime powers as Turkey or Greece. Boats "modern". Delivered to replace the boats of the 2 world war since 1971.

It is Turkish boats that will most likely be transferred to Ukraine. The fact is that the Turks write off this trash. Operation becomes too expensive. A combat capabilities weak.

Thus, behind the loud statements of the President of Ukraine, the Commander-in-Chief of the Navy, is zilch. The naval version of land battalions numbering 100-200 people. A physical loss of the fleet has already occurred. Legal, even if everything that the admirals conceived will come true, will occur before the 2025 year. No matter how much you say "fleet", ships will not increase.

However, all these calculations in no way remove from us the task of strengthening our Black Sea Fleet. The fleet must be such that no one has any desire to try it "on teeth". To in the coastal cities never appeared new military memorials. That the Russian seaman was perceived all over the world as a worthy descendant of the heroic sailors of the Russian Empire and the Soviet Union. And we will do it.
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  1. VNP1958PVN
    VNP1958PVN 2 February 2016 06: 49
    32
    The Black Sea was once called honest. Or more correctly. It was called Russian
    Do not tell Ukrainians, they will use up bile ... laughing
    1. Sakhalininsk
      Sakhalininsk 2 February 2016 06: 55
      41
      laughing we quietly ... otherwise it will not be humane, they dug it))))
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Your friend
      Your friend 2 February 2016 11: 15
      10
      Quote: VNP1958PVN
      The Black Sea was once called honest. Or more correctly. It was called Russian
      Do not tell Ukrainians, they will use up bile ... laughing

      I think the Black Sea should be called Ukrainian. After all, who dug - the name of that should be the sea.
      1. Diana Ilyina
        Diana Ilyina 2 February 2016 11: 47
        22
        Quote: Your friend
        I think the Black Sea should be called Ukrainian. After all, who dug - the name of that should be the sea.


        What is it like?! "Black Sea, construction team of ward No. 6, named after twice Zhovto-blockit ensign and three times Heroes of Ukraine Bandera and Shukhevych" ?!
        1. Unclean
          Unclean 4 February 2016 23: 56
          0
          Shuhe Bandera Sea?
    4. Edvagan
      Edvagan 2 February 2016 11: 48
      20
      that's zrada: Ukrainians dug and dug the sea, but it was called Russian))))
      1. Thunderbolt
        Thunderbolt 2 February 2016 12: 06
        +7
        This does not bother them. They consider themselves to be true Russians, and mixed with the Finno-Ugric and Mongol-Tatars. For example, in Lviv there is a Russian street. And this name is recorded, already, from 1472.
        1. visitork67
          visitork67 2 February 2016 22: 44
          13
          Here you are all the laughter and the laughter. And the Ukrainians have reinforced concrete evidence that they dug this hole, i.e. sea. Look at Wikipedia for at least - solid hydrogen sulfide after 200 m. Who else could so litter the whole sea. Definitely overwhelmed.
        2. Archon
          Archon 3 February 2016 16: 00
          +3
          Because Lviv is a Russian city. or was it before "polonization", "Austrianization" and "Ukrainianization"
      2. Furious bambr
        Furious bambr 3 February 2016 20: 43
        -1
        Again zrada wink
    5. Alex20042004
      Alex20042004 4 February 2016 18: 21
      0
      Ah, then ..............!
  2. pest
    pest 2 February 2016 06: 50
    12
    They love everything air in Ukraine: - castles in the air, air forces, inflatable frigates. Just a question: - how will the inflatable fleet sink under water, because the feces do not sink.
    1. builder
      builder 2 February 2016 07: 20
      42
      Do not worry about it, they will soon have the entire fleet underwater.
      1. Ami du peuple
        Ami du peuple 2 February 2016 08: 19
        21
        Quote: stroitel
        Do not worry about it, they will soon have the entire fleet underwater.

        Why all? Something will stay afloat, so that, so to speak, to demonstrate the flag in the Black Sea
      2. bocsman
        bocsman 2 February 2016 08: 28
        26
        How people from Nata supply their allies can be seen in the example of three "Baltic tigers". Then about ten years ago they had a conflict over the Baltic herring between Estonia and Latvia. So the then Minister of Defense of Latvia said, - We cannot fight with Estonia, their fleet is three times larger! And the joy was three boats and the Latvians, respectively, one.
        And in all seriousness, this is the problem. These merinos really think of themselves as tigers! But hohlotyranosaurus and even more so!
        1. Ami du peuple
          Ami du peuple 2 February 2016 09: 54
          17
          Quote: bocsman
          We can’t fight with Estonia. Their fleet is three times bigger! And the comfort was three boats, and the Latvians, respectively, one.

          laughing good Miraculously managed to escape the greatest naval battle! Tsuushimaa in the Baltic, yeah
          1. Oldwiser
            Oldwiser 2 February 2016 13: 50
            +4
            Quote: Ami du peuple
            Tsuushimaa in the Baltic

            Moonsund-3 !!!
        2. UNFAMILIAR
          UNFAMILIAR 2 February 2016 21: 27
          +5
          Quote: bocsman
          So the then Minister of Defense of Latvia said, - We can’t fight Estonia with their fleet three times as much! And the comfort was three boats, and the Latvians, respectively, one.

          So Estonia was among the Baltic states, the largest Navy (due to gifts from Sweden and France), Latvians with their licensed series of two patrol German catamarans are the weakest, between Estonia and Latvia Lithuania with the purchase of Danish "corvettes" (probably according to our classification of the IAC ), naval special forces.
      3. Nicola Bari
        Nicola Bari 2 February 2016 10: 35
        +5
        A wonderful plus of the submarine fleet - we can say that it is, even if it is not. Underwater).
  3. Good cat
    Good cat 2 February 2016 06: 51
    +8
    Similarly, rusty junk will be collected from NATA and they will have a great fleet, and then they will buy spare parts for furious loot!
    1. Pig
      Pig 2 February 2016 08: 22
      +6
      the point is, oddly enough, not only in "junk" ... for basing submarines you need a special infrastructure, basing points, training centers, trained crews that need to be trained for more than one year ...
      and if a "good uncle for so" can give the pelvis, then billions are needed for everything else ...
      it is such a peculiar military-political masturbation
      1. Amurets
        Amurets 2 February 2016 08: 46
        11
        Quote: Good cat
        Similarly, rusty junk will be collected from NATA and they will have a great fleet, and then they will buy spare parts for furious loot!

        The Turks will have a double benefit: firstly, they will discard rotten junk and secondly they will save money on the disposal of this junk. And dill will not just sink, but sink on foreign cars.
        1. cheguevarazhiv
          cheguevarazhiv 2 February 2016 12: 16
          +4
          And in Odessa have already identified places where these boats are welded?
          1. Bashibuzuk
            Bashibuzuk 2 February 2016 15: 39
            -6
            You guys are wrong ....
            They will sell these tattoos.
            In Somalia, say.
            Or to Afghanistan.
            To these scumbags, but not welded ..... I do not believe it.
            .
            Nevertheless, there is something in this - the Ruska Sea.
            Not Russian ... but Russian, exactly.
            Russian sounds somehow minted like this. Tsok, Tsok, S..S ..
            But Ruskoye sounds - well, it seems like - what, you, bunny, again crap around, no one, small, we will wash you, powder you ... you are our hero ....
  4. as150505
    as150505 2 February 2016 06: 51
    0
    The revival of the Black Sea Fleet is a strategically important area.
    1. ivanych
      ivanych 2 February 2016 07: 44
      +4
      ... brilliant. In the Kremlin, the back of the head is scratched, everything was planned somewhere in the wrong direction.
      .... Let's somehow dispense with the slogans.
      1. Dart2027
        Dart2027 2 February 2016 09: 36
        0
        This is not a slogan, but a reality - it is the Black Sea Fleet that may be in the combat zone.
        1. cap
          cap 2 February 2016 09: 58
          +2
          map
          Quote: Dart2027
          This is not a slogan, but a reality - it is the Black Sea Fleet that may be in the combat zone.



          What about the fact that the Caspian flotilla is already there (in this zone). Take a compass, draw circles, draw conclusions. Something like that hi .
          1. Dart2027
            Dart2027 2 February 2016 15: 46
            +1
            Quote: cap
            Take a compass, draw circles, draw conclusions

            In this sense, yes, but there are no opponents directly in the Caspian Sea, but there can be anything in the World Cup and the World Cup.
    2. oborzevatel
      oborzevatel 2 February 2016 12: 18
      +1
      Quote: as150505
      The revival of the Black Sea Fleet is a strategically important area.

      Congenial.
      I never knew that.
      Thank you for opening your eyes. And not only to me, but to many in the Kremlin, probably.
      "And in winter, they say, it snows in Russia ..."
    3. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 2 February 2016 18: 47
      +5
      The revival of the closed sea fleet, the only way out of which is not even into the ocean, but into yet another closed sea, is controlled by the NATO country - it is a waste of already small funds of the Navy. We do not have a lot of ships and money in the budget to maintain 4 strong fleets on 4 unrelated TVDs. So the maximum that can be done is to maintain the CCF at the current level.

      The priority in obtaining new ships, PMSM, should be given to the Northern Fleet and Pacific Fleet - to protect the same positional areas of the SSBN. And 5 OPESK so far can be formed from the composition of the Northern Fleet - using the Black Sea Fleet bases as rear and repair ones.
      1. TRex
        TRex 2 February 2016 19: 40
        0
        Alexey! That is, how "at the current level"? Ships for thirty years! There is a state program. The fleet has already begun to receive new submarines, ships, support vessels.
        Everything is calculated without us. So let them build, let them update. Not one "Moscow" should pull the strap ... By the way, I remembered. There was "Moscow" (then still RRC "Slava") in the 80s with a friendly visit to Greece. A local newspaper posted on the front page a photo of a cruiser standing against the wall in Piraeus, under the headline "THE BREATH SHOCK OF SOCIALISM."
        Well, as here some shout: "There will be a fleet!" or "The revival of the Black Sea Fleet is a strategically important area." I will even say this: "Water is wet" or "Fire is burning" ...
        Hello to all. Best wishes ...
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 3 February 2016 09: 50
          0
          Quote: TRex
          Alexey! That is, how "at the current level"? Ships for thirty years! There is a state program. The fleet has already begun to receive new submarines, ships, support vessels.

          Speaking of maintaining current, I was referring to the replacement of the ships that had served their term.
          Because the "revival of the fleet" is still something more, for example, bringing the KChF to the size of the Soviet era. smile
      2. Cap.Morgan
        Cap.Morgan 2 February 2016 21: 29
        0
        The Bosphorus Strait is controlled not only by Turkey.
        It used to build a fortress in the strait and control.
        Now in order to control it is necessary to have the courage to confront a nuclear power.
        Erdogan is now shy about flying over Syria. It would seem that he controls the border there and, in general, Turkey has a large army, go fight. However, no. Something stops him.
        Would he mind if, at the time of the crisis, the missile code had already been uncovered, the Black Sea Fleet would go to Srd Mediterranean. Something tells me that it will not.
  5. aszzz888
    aszzz888 2 February 2016 06: 55
    +1
    Thus, bring the Ukrainian fleet to almost 70 units.


    Whatever the child was amusing, she didn’t ask to eat anyway! laughing
    Although they take in psychiatric hospitals in marine uniforms! fellow
    1. visitork67
      visitork67 2 February 2016 22: 54
      0
      So after all, they ask for food and, for that, arithmetic.
  6. Volga Cossack
    Volga Cossack 2 February 2016 06: 56
    0
    the great fleet - a great country))))) pah-nausea! but most importantly - statements!
  7. Eggor
    Eggor 2 February 2016 07: 04
    +5
    Where is Ukraine going to get submarines from? Build? The possibilities of such construction were shown by the repair of Zaporozhye.
    1. Pavel_J
      Pavel_J 2 February 2016 08: 29
      +4
      Her place in the dry dock of the Balaclava Museum under the mountain, the museum would have become even cooler.
  8. itr
    itr 2 February 2016 07: 14
    +2
    But how can you become an admiral in the modern world if there is not a single submarine under your command ????
    1. Eggor
      Eggor 2 February 2016 09: 10
      +5
      Quote: itr
      and how can you become an admiral in the modern world if under your command
      1. KBR109
        KBR109 2 February 2016 11: 00
        +2
        It is worth remembering that Ukraine, at the end of 2014, had 14 admirals. good
        1. visitork67
          visitork67 2 February 2016 22: 59
          +1
          The power is unbidden. Tear any.
        2. kapitan92
          kapitan92 3 February 2016 19: 27
          +3
          So what!? In each region we have our own government and ministers, and the mess and theft are more and more.
      2. Mikhail Krapivin
        Mikhail Krapivin 2 February 2016 17: 39
        +2
        Yes, not a lot. But any horse will popularly explain that since we have all the ships, all the missiles and all the tanks are rusty, the victory will be theirs :)
    2. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 2 February 2016 18: 53
      +4
      Giggles ... the one and only submarine "Zaporozhye" in the Naval Forces of Ukraine fed the headquarters structure, in which there were already three admirals.
      Now there is no submarine - and where to go to poor admirals? There are already 14 of them in the Navy.
  9. parusnik
    parusnik 2 February 2016 07: 18
    +4
    Gaiduk, it remains only to say: We dug up the Black Sea, we will bury it ...
    1. visitork67
      visitork67 2 February 2016 23: 11
      +1
      Like "I gave birth to you, I will kill you." A shovel and a flag in hand, a drum on his neck and a train to meet.
  10. inkass_98
    inkass_98 2 February 2016 07: 28
    +3
    The boats of the project 209 are not only outdated (although Turkey has three issues, the last ones are quite fresh, in the late 90s - early 00s), they are also poorly adapted to the depths that the current remnants of the Ruin fleet operate at. The main base of the Navy is now in Odessa, and there it is quite shallow, 10-20 m. And where is there a normal boat to turn around, not to mention the invisibility of passing somewhere to the rear to the "thieves"?
  11. vch62388
    vch62388 2 February 2016 08: 37
    +7
    The boats of the project 209 (especially the latest series) are not bad. The problem is different. They are completely designed according to Western standards. The length of the torpedo tubes, the frequency of operation of the means of communication - everything else. You can get 1-2 PLs as a gift, but you will have to BUY a lot of things for them. We'll have to rebuild or rebuild EVERYTHING (coastal communication centers, and the rest of the coastal infrastructure, training centers, purchase weapons and consumables, pay for repairs at western shipyards, etc.). It is extremely expensive, but there is no money and is not expected. The gift will have to be welded to the pier following the example of Zaporozhye. And even then you will have to spend money on ongoing maintenance.
    It is more or less realistic to build boats at Poroshenko's "Lenin Kuzna". He will not give his good to saw, in contrast to the same Nikolaev Shipyard. But most likely only in the artillery version.
    1. Eggor
      Eggor 2 February 2016 08: 49
      +3
      Quote: vch62388
      It is more or less realistic to build boats at Poroshenko's "Lenin Kuzna". He will not give his good to saw, in contrast to the same Nikolaev Shipyard.

      There are also enough jambs:
      In Odessa. The stinks of all the middle boules are empty if they were "let down". And do it all at once ...

      Due to a disruption in the supply of components, it is highly likely that the first two boats will be commissioned only next year. At best this fall.
      Sad ...

      One of the suppliers, despite receiving the money, has not yet delivered equipment. And the worst thing is not known when it will be delivered.
      Another one cannot finish making the system due to lack of money.

      Anyway, the Lenin Forge is a very specific office.
      While the boats were transported to Odessa, they lost half of the equipment delivered.
      One was forgotten in Kiev, the rest was dumped (someone's crazy hands tried) into the container without fixing it inside. Well, the consequences you imagine.
      With this approach to the production of military equipment, they will go very far away ...

      And there have long been rumors about laying another 4 of the same boats this year.
      How can you still lay if these have not yet been brought to mind? What would the improvements double the price? (rather rhetorical questions)
      In general, we are moving to NATO standards (why does UOP not tell anyone how much it will cost the country), without learning how to work properly according to GOSTs.

      http://www.mil.in.ua/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=2214&start=300
    2. PSih2097
      PSih2097 2 February 2016 19: 43
      +1
      Quote: vch62388
      You can receive 1-2 submarines as a gift,

      Well, who will do this, but Type 206, you can get these ... in the same Germany there are five of them in the crap ...
  12. sa-ag
    sa-ag 2 February 2016 08: 59
    +2
    "... The Black Sea was once called more honestly. Or more correctly. It was called Russian."

    Well, to be honest, you need to remember all the names, Pont Euxinus for example
    1. Idiot
      Idiot 2 February 2016 10: 29
      0
      They told you in what period of time it was called Russian.
    2. Idiot
      Idiot 2 February 2016 10: 29
      0
      They told you in what period of time it was called Russian.
      1. sa-ag
        sa-ag 2 February 2016 11: 06
        +2
        Quote: pft, fkb
        They told you in what period of time it was called Russian.

        Who claims this?

        "... The ancient Greek name of the sea is Pontus Aksinsky (ancient Greek. the sea received due to difficulties with navigation, as well as wild hostile tribes inhabiting its shores.However, most likely the Greeks adopted the local Scythian name of the sea, representing the reflex of ancient Iran. * axšaina - "dark blue", "dark", correlating with its current name, and rethought it in consonance with the Greek word “inhospitable.” [5] Later, after the successful development of the coast by the Greek colonists, the sea began to be called Pontus Euxine (Greek Πόντος Εὔξενος, “Hospitable Sea”). (7.3.6) there are references to the fact that in antiquity the Black Sea was also called simply “the sea” (pontos). Later, in the X-XIV centuries, in ancient Russian, Arab and Western sources it is referred to as the “Russian Sea”, which is connected with its active use by Scandinavian sailors lami - Varangians-Rus. The "Tale of Bygone Years" says "And the Dnieper will flow into the Pont Sea three zherela, hedgehog the sea to call Rusko ...". [6] "

        "... Strabon (ancient Greek Στράβων; c. 64/63 BC - c. 23/24 AD.) - Ancient Greek historian and geographer. Author of" History "(not preserved) and preserved almost entirely "Geography" in 17 books, which serves as the best source for studying the geography of the ancient world. "

        Thus, it was called Pontus of Evksinsky somewhere a couple of thousand years ago.
        1. Proud.
          Proud. 2 February 2016 15: 23
          +1
          Quote: sa-ag
          the sea became known as Pontus of Euxinus (Greek Πόντος Εὔξενος, "The hospitable sea").

          That's right. The common name, without nationality.
          Quote: sa-ag
          Later, in the X — XIV centuries, in ancient Russian, Arab and Western sources it is referred to as the “Russian Sea”,

          And in this case, who "used" the given sea more and controlled, was named according to that affiliation.
          Quote: sa-ag
          Varangians-Russia.

          This is according to the Norman concept of the History of Russia. But even in it there are a lot of shoals that Lomonosov noted (for example, on the inconsistency of the work of the name “Rus” from the Finnish designation of the Swedes “ruotsi”, since neither the Slavs nor the Vikings knew such an ethnonym. to the examples of the names of “England” and “France,” Lomonosov took away with an obvious argument: the name of the country can go either to the winners or to the defeated, and not to the names of a third party. He noted Lomonosov and “Germanization” by Bayer of the names of Slavic princes. his conclusion is convincing that “these names have no sign in the Scandinavian language” (the interpretation of the princely name Vladimir as “forest overseer” can serve as an example of the “German” interpretation of Slavic names. None of the Normanists have yet overcome the conclusion of Lomonosov). By the way. In the same Pedia, I quote: ... Varangians (dr. Scand. Væringjar, Greek. Βάραγγοι) - a group of the population of Ancient Russia, wearing ethnic, professional social or social character ... In short, they didn’t decide who they are until the end. Maybe there is easier Varyazhskaya Russia, but there are no Varangians, much less aliens.
  13. Klos
    Klos 2 February 2016 09: 26
    +3
    What do you guys walk on the seas?
    After all, the ships managed to rot at the berths.
    Dumb reproach about the service of not too short years
    They wrote off their friends soullessly to Chermet ...

    Why do you guys, wander the seas?
    After all, ships and the motherland should be saved.
    To reject the unclean servants, make peace with a brother-
    And live with a pure soul calmly and richly.
  14. Lelek
    Lelek 2 February 2016 09: 38
    +1
    (The Ukrainian marines today are actually very distantly related to normal marines. Today these are simple units from the anti-terrorist operation zone. With appropriate training and appropriate personnel.)

    In addition, units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine began to be attacked by an uncontrolled submarine. (Click.)
  15. SkobarSerezha
    SkobarSerezha 2 February 2016 09: 46
    +2
    Vladimir the Great? lol I think they’ll rename
  16. unknown
    unknown 2 February 2016 10: 04
    0
    Quote: sa-ag
    "... The Black Sea was once called more honestly. Or more correctly. It was called Russian."

    Well, to be honest, you need to remember all the names, Pont Euxinus for example


    Well, to be more honest, it was originally called BLACK, that is, RED.
    1. Proud.
      Proud. 2 February 2016 15: 29
      0
      Quote: ignoto
      it was called BLACK, that is, RED

      Is that, we (on the planet) TWO "Red Seas" !?
      I found another definition. I am quoting: "... In Slavic" black "- severe, stormy: the ancient Iranian name - Akhshaena - Dark Sea, which means a harsh sea ...".
    2. synodontis
      synodontis 4 February 2016 21: 46
      0
      You are all familiar with the black color. Think of the color of eggs dyed with onion peels for Easter. Banners in Russia were of red color. This is the color liberals hate so much. "red-brown"
  17. cheguevarazhiv
    cheguevarazhiv 2 February 2016 12: 26
    +1
    Quote: ScobarSerezha
    Vladimir the Great? lol I think they’ll rename

    On Petro Peremoga
  18. Lord blacwood
    Lord blacwood 2 February 2016 12: 26
    +1
    Ukraine itself is to blame. Here is a vivid example: the Ukrainian Navy received two unfinished aircraft carriers from the USSR. One was sold to a Chinese company and turned into a floating entertainment center, and the second was also bought by a Chinese company for a floating entertainment center, BUT was re-sold to the Chinese Navy and is today called "Liaoning". Several more aircraft carriers will be built on its basis. But Ukraine could build this aircraft carrier for itself.
  19. Olfred
    Olfred 2 February 2016 13: 11
    +2
    Another cruiser "Ukraine", nothing more.
    and the name is one, and fate is the same ... sad
  20. Alexy
    Alexy 2 February 2016 13: 33
    0
    Yes, this is all nonsense. Ukraine has never had a fleet and never will. That misunderstanding called the navy is not a fleet. They plundered, sawed and sold almost everything that they got during the division of the CCF.
  21. Khokhol
    Khokhol 2 February 2016 13: 58
    -10 qualifying.
    To the stupid people I’m not bachiv.tіlki basіkati spromozhnі. You can read here, I don’t have to go to the circus. I don’t know my history, I’m only talking about Russia. Russia is a terrorist-slave tabir, people 20% are terrorist, 80% are slave. So you don’t have the right to negotiate, on the back.
    1. inferno_nv
      inferno_nv 2 February 2016 14: 21
      +1
      You probably learned your story in Israel!) hi I'm just wondering what is your story? What are you on history throughout history? Slave terrorists, etc. - all this is idiocy. In Ukraine, everyone is free from everything, a penny’s salary, prices like in Europe, the elite of the muzzle eats by leaps and bounds and you say that slaves are in Russia?)))
    2. Lord blacwood
      Lord blacwood 2 February 2016 14: 32
      +4
      Crest, the rules of the site say that the communication language is Russian. So be so kind as to follow the rules. And yet, the theory of racial and national superiority crashed in 1945, so do not insult participants of a different nationality.
    3. Proud.
      Proud. 2 February 2016 15: 45
      +2
      Quote: Crest
      I'm not stupid to the people

      Look in the mirror
      Quote: Crest
      You can read here, I don’t have to go to the circus

      You go to your sites, not that you don't need a circus, Comedy Club, with your Vecherniy Kvartalom, they are resting. Only "pearls" Klitschka can interrupt.
      Quote: Crest
      .і do not know their history,

      Take a shovel, "knowing history", and go to dig a new sea, and add new mountains.
      Quote: Crest
      .Rossia - terrorist-slave tabir, th people 20% of terrorist, 80% of rabi.

      He’s interchanged the cookie, mankurt? The brain has dried up, for people like you. You can only spew fakes and poke stubby stamps.
      Quote: Crest
      marvel at yourself.

      Look, gnEdlik (self-derived from the larva of an insect parasite). And we look at the likes of you. In this regard, the vaccination against maydanutism is good. That you proved. With your "opus". You are ..., do not worry. You will soon be in yatsyk with nails sent to the ban, in short.
    4. rJIiOK
      rJIiOK 2 February 2016 15: 58
      0
      Of course of course. Ninochka, in which room do we have a prosecutor?
    5. Pavel_J
      Pavel_J 2 February 2016 16: 39
      0
      here are the results of a genetic study, show what color the dumb people are here
    6. Mikhail Krapivin
      Mikhail Krapivin 2 February 2016 17: 46
      +1
      Terrible thing. Ukrainians and Jews themselves are very specific (if I may say so) guys. Well, there is cunning, greed, love of money and others, qualities that are pleasant to their mentality. And a crest under the Israeli flag is already a pathology! :)
    7. perfect100
      perfect100 2 February 2016 17: 52
      0
      Dear Khokhol, you will see how many mistakes you made in a couple of sentences in Russian! Or is it your local dialect funny?
    8. perfect100
      perfect100 2 February 2016 17: 52
      +1
      Dear Khokhol, you will see how many mistakes you made in a couple of sentences in Russian! Or is it your local dialect funny?
  22. Algetxnumx
    Algetxnumx 2 February 2016 14: 35
    0
    Quote: Crest
    I'm not stupid to the people who are stupid.

    Shaw, did he hit the mirror?
  23. 1961NNN
    1961NNN 2 February 2016 15: 06
    +1
    Boats of type 209 are built in 5 series, slightly differing in size and performance characteristics. Series are indicated by surface displacement. For example, boats of the second series are designated “type 209/1200”. By 2008, 8 units of the 1100 series, 26 of the 1200 series, 8 of the 1300 series, 15 of the 1400 series and 4 of the 1500 series were built. [5] Orders for 3 more boats were canceled.
    1100 1200 1300 1400 1500
    Displacement underwater 1207 t 1285 t 1390 t 1586 t 1810 t
    Dimensions 54,1 × 6,2 × 5,9 m 55,9 × 6,3 × 5,5 m 59,5 × 6,2 × 5,5 m 61,2 × 6,25 × 5,5 m 64,4 , 6,5 × 6,2 × XNUMX m
    Diameter of a strong case 6,8 m
    Power plant 4 diesel generators consisting of 4 MTU 12V 396 SB83 diesel engines - 4x1250 hp and 4 generators - 4x900 kW
    1 4000 hp propeller motor, 1 propeller shaft
    3730 kW (5000 hp) 4550 kW (6100 hp)
    4 batteries of 120 cells 4 batteries of 132 cells
    Speed ​​(surface) 11 knots 11,5 knots
    Speed ​​(underwater) 21,5 knots 22 knots 22,5 knots
    Range (surface) 11 miles (000 km) at a speed of 20 knots (000 km / h)
    Range (snorkel) 8000 miles (15 km) at a speed of 000 knots (10 km / h)
    Range (underwater) 400 miles (700 km) at a speed of 4 knots (7 km / h)
    Autonomy of swimming 50 days
    Immersion depth 200 m - working, 280 m - extreme (according to other sources 300 m - working, 500 m - maximum)
    Armament of 8 bow torpedo tubes of caliber 533 mm:
    • 14 torpedoes
    • installation of anti-ship missiles "Sub Harpoon" is possible
    • installation of sea mines is possible
    Crew 31 33 30 36
  24. rus-5819
    rus-5819 2 February 2016 15: 20
    +1
    What is the priority today? Oddly enough, boats. Modern Ukraine is not capable of more.

    Ideally: "Flutter like a butterfly and sting like a bee"!
    In fact: "Look like maggots and stink like homeless!"

    What about the submarine fleet? Where is Ukraine going to take submarines?

    There are a lot of them on the steppe ...
  25. 1961NNN
    1961NNN 2 February 2016 15: 22
    0
    The Turkish Navy includes boats of type 209 - 14 units.

    Local type Subtype Name
    (Board number) Commissioning
    Atilay 1200 Atilay (S-347) 1976
    Saldiray (S-348) 1977
    Batiray (S-349) 1978
    Yildiray (S-350) 1981
    Doganay (S-351) 1984
    Dolunay (S-352) 1989
    Preveze T1.1400 Preveze (S-353) 1994

    Sakarya (S-354) 1995
    18 Mart (S-355) 1998
    Anafartalar (S-356) 1999
    Gur T2.1400 Gür (S-357) 2003
    Canakkale (S-358) 2005
    Burakreis (S-359) 2006
    Birinci Inönü (S-360) 2007
  26. thinker
    thinker 2 February 2016 15: 32
    +4
    The title inspired: as the Black Sea was called Russian, so the hryvnia was minted in St. Petersburg.
  27. rus-5819
    rus-5819 2 February 2016 15: 34
    0
    Quote: Your friend
    Quote: VNP1958PVN
    The Black Sea was once called honest. Or more correctly. It was called Russian
    Do not tell Ukrainians, they will use up bile ... laughing

    I think the Black Sea should be called Ukrainian. After all, who dug - the name of that should be the sea.


    Actually it was "Pontus Euxinsky". From the side of ukraine, pont remained so pont
  28. rJIiOK
    rJIiOK 2 February 2016 15: 57
    +3
    Forgive me guys, I will be a traitor, but I make a suggestion to my Ukrainian friends:
    since you dug up the Black Sea, I propose to fight the Black Sea Fleet by digging the sea back.
  29. 1774
    1774 2 February 2016 18: 34
    +5
    I am extremely indignant and upset by the pace of de-communization. I have the following questions - why the Dnieper hydroelectric power station has not been blown up yet - the damned legacy of the Soviet occupation, why all nuclear power plants have not been drowned and destroyed, why the plants and factories are working, even with the last gasp, built by the damned commies, and finally when they demolish all the Khrushchev and residential buildings built in the period 1924-1991.
    1. Lord blacwood
      Lord blacwood 2 February 2016 19: 15
      +1
      All that the Ukrainian authorities are capable of is changing the names of cities and streets.
    2. Klos
      Klos 2 February 2016 19: 20
      +2
      Well, the process of destroying citizens born in this period is going on with might and main ...
    3. RoTTor
      RoTTor 3 February 2016 18: 30
      0
      For the victory of decommunization, it is necessary to blow up everything that has been inherited from the Russian Empire and the USSR. Because nothing has appeared since 1991, and there will remain a wild field with wild people
  30. Pete mitchell
    Pete mitchell 2 February 2016 20: 11
    +9
    Let them give the boats, it will finally gobble up the country 404. The Dutch also drove a "warship" from the times of King Peas to Latvia on the cheap. It is expensive to saw on needles ourselves, however. The gift was with a small condition: repair and any modernization to do in Holland, and already without discounts. Those who could build a ship in Latvia howled, repairs were not very cheap.
    So that the Ukrainians of fair wind, nowhere ...
  31. red_october
    red_october 2 February 2016 23: 13
    +2
    Though they will give them the 209 submarine of the project, at least two thousand and nine - what is the use of it, if there is no one to fight anyway?
  32. red_october
    red_october 2 February 2016 23: 17
    0
    Colleague, not the word I support you !!!!
    How so, here it’s not even in the Dnieper hydroelectric station and in the nuclear power plant!
    How long will the illumination of Ilyich’s lamp shine in each staircase ????!
  33. Roll
    Roll 3 February 2016 01: 43
    0
    Quote: Lelek

    In addition, units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine began to be attacked by an uncontrolled submarine. (Click.)

    Coincidence, I don’t think so!
    http://topwar.ru/90085-istochnik-v-luganskoy-oblasti-podorvalsya-gruzovik-s-ukra

    inskimi-voennosluzhaschimi.html # comment-id-5515448

    “According to preliminary data, there were 12 people in the car,” the source said. “Of the twelve victims, no one survived.”
    On the website of the Luhansk news agency this fact was confirmed by the representative of the People's Militia Igor Yaschenko. He added that the car of the Ukrainian Armed Forces had blown up "at its own mine."
  34. Balagan
    Balagan 3 February 2016 14: 34
    0
    Damn, did you miss a movie? So many quotes on this psak-crest. What brought him here? Truth wanted to slurp something. It is harmful to them; an overdose of pure water is fatal to them.
  35. beck
    beck 3 February 2016 16: 53
    0
    Quote: Amurets
    Quote: Good cat
    Similarly, rusty junk will be collected from NATA and they will have a great fleet, and then they will buy spare parts for furious loot!

    The Turks will have a double benefit: firstly, they will discard rotten junk and secondly they will save money on the disposal of this junk. And dill will not just sink, but sink on foreign cars.

    so also the junta on the kickbacks will warm their hands)))
  36. msm
    msm 3 February 2016 18: 26
    0
    In fact, Ukraine has great potential in mechanical engineering and shipbuilding. The potential that he left from the USSR. In Ukraine, there is a high level of specialists at various levels: engineers, technicians and workers. I wouldn’t laugh ... The Politburo (all Ukrainians) all the most science-intensive, mostly they gave their favorite for decades!
  37. RoTTor
    RoTTor 3 February 2016 18: 27
    -3
    The fact that the "admiral" hiduk is with ....... a, not a sailor, is a fact. But they didn’t notice that in the VVMU and in the service. Another personnel failure?
    Ukraine does not need a fleet. The best example is the fate of the failed flagship Oken Ukrainian. "Fleets" of the heavy cruiser, which was not completed during the USSR, received the name "Ukraine" after 1991 and has been rotting since then at the factory wall. Or the flagship of the "submarine" forces of the Navy "PL" "Zaporozhye", thanks to which a lot of money was stolen for repairs and stamped unnecessarily capres - its "commanders".

    However, without emotion:
    1. The Russian time has always been and always will be the White Sea, the inland sea.
    2. The Russian Empire came to the shores of the Black Sea only at the end of the 18th century, under Catherine the Great. Before that, regardless of the name, it was actually Turkish - all the coasts belonged to the Ottoman Empire and its colonies.
    3. To fight in Chechnya where there is no sea, the marine corps were also sent.
    4. During the Second World War, the marine corps also included ship crews, who had already received training during their service on the shore.
    During the collapse of the army in the early 90s, the guards, multi-bearing, but cropped division, located in the North, was deployed, somehow re-formed, changed, transferred to the Northern Fleet, but from this it never became a marine corps.
  38. aba
    aba 3 February 2016 23: 35
    0
    Is it worth it to comment on the words of the Ukrainian military, even if he is a "sailor" ?!
  39. ZKB
    ZKB 4 February 2016 04: 08
    +1
    maybe I'm off topic, but all these plans until 2030 have a rational link. BY 2030, THESE ADMIRAL STRATEGS, THE GOVERNMENT THAT ACCEPTS THESE PROGRAMS, YES AND MOST UKRAINE WILL NOT BE AT THIS RATE !!! therefore, do not turn the stars around the stars, the more you can for such a star who will throw money over the hill, and the people who are fooled can not immediately turn their heads (they say they think about the future, they threaten the aggressor with Russia). These are statements from the category of threats to the sea blockade of Crimea. Loud, bright, scary ... but if you evaluate the reality is FUNNY
  40. YLTHEN
    YLTHEN 4 February 2016 08: 34
    -3
    Quote: VNP1958PVN
    The Black Sea was once called honest. Or more correctly. It was called Russian
    Do not tell Ukrainians, they will use up bile ... laughing
  41. Evil 55
    Evil 55 4 February 2016 10: 48
    0
    Why do they need modern submarines ... The underwater chovlomokrovs in wooden form were more terrible than German junk ... here and let them remember the old and the forests they have more than brains, iron and technology ...
  42. misterwulf
    misterwulf 4 February 2016 11: 17
    0
    Ukro-raft generally does not exist!
    My comrade, the officer (in the past the Russian Navy was a submariner) once recalled a nightmare. Like, he wakes up and the commander says to him: go, take the boat! And he asks: which one? And Glavkov points to him at the 13th plant in Sevastopol.
    This is the only submarine of the Ukrian Navy - "Zaporozhye", which was repaired at the 13th RUSSIAN plant and has not been repaired, for the reason that HOWEVER WAS NOT PAYED!
    Here is such a dream of horrors told me a submarine officer. laughing
    During the "Russian spring" we squeezed this "Zaporozhye", but then returned the kaklam for uselessness. Because if you untie her from the pier, she will immediately ... drown. wink
  43. walrus-a
    walrus-a 4 February 2016 14: 16
    0
    Yes ... soon we will see "submarines in the steppes of Ukraine"! An old army joke ...
  44. SuperVodka777
    SuperVodka777 4 February 2016 20: 45
    -4
    Rusnya continues cotton articles until the ruble falls, budgets are cut, and officials buy cottages in Austria (you need to be patient, you need to get rid)))). When you give back the Donbass, and the economy will improve with us, because it does not depend on your smelly oil and Ukraine will build what it needs. And he will also join NATO. Your garbage troughs, and so surrounded for a long time, will still have Georgia to join NATO and the gas station will not get any more *.
    1. Mih
      Mih 4 February 2016 23: 47
      0
      Rusnya continues cotton articles

      Aviation of the Ukrainian Navy? Alas, this component is almost absent.
      Physical loss of the fleet has already occurred. laughing
  45. Mih
    Mih 4 February 2016 23: 45
    0
    Ukrainian naval commanders reinforce the coastline with artillery systems,
    but it’s easier to tear down all these batteries with airstrikes. And ship missiles will help.
    fellow

    And how it all began - the young admirals, hung with stars on the shoulder straps, spoke of a cheerful service. But what happened: the Ukrainian fleet: 3 warships, 5 boats and 1 minesweeper. Aviation of the Ukrainian Navy? Alas, this component is almost absent.
    Physical loss of the fleet has already occurred. love