Arsenal of Japanese samurai (second part)

83
Arsenal of Japanese samurai (second part)
Fighting fan gumbay uchiva. They could give signals, fan themselves, but occasionally repel an arrow or even a sword strike, because it was made of ... iron!


Wooden weapons, who did not have European analogues, were also gekken and yagara-mogara. Gekken had a tip in the shape of a crow's beak and another in the shape of a crescent (turned outward). Gekken allowed the warrior to be captured by the neck and thrown off his horse. Or strike with a poke at the neck, in which there was also little good, even despite the armor. The yagara-mogara (or its variety tsukubo) was a real T-shaped rake, the upper part of which was bound with metal completely bristled with sharp spikes. Such weapons in the arsenal of European knights were not sure, but the samurai did not disdain to use it. True, again, not so much in war as in the peaceful era of Edo, in order to take the criminal alive.




Tsukubo


Special mention also deserves such Japanese weapons as sickles, representing a raven-shaped blade that was fixed to the pole at a right angle. Such a sickle (coma) on a long handle, turned into a very dangerous weapon in skillful hands. The naigama (or roku-shakugama - “six-syaku sickle”) had a shaft up to 1,8 m long, and the o-gama (“large sickle”) - up to 1,2 m. These weapons are often found on figures XII - XIII centuries., And accordingly, they are also mentioned in the chronicles. Used this weapon in order to trim the legs of horses, and in navy as crimsons and even to cut algae, which impeded the movement of boats in shallow water. However, such weapons could be used as a European slander. Toei-noborigama had a length of 1,7 m and a L-shaped top in the form of a narrow ax with a lower edge, sharpened like a sickle. In any case, the same peasants, for example, could very easily arm themselves with such sickles, tying them to long bamboo poles.


Kusari-gama species


However, a sickle with a handle attached to it with a chain - nage-gama or kusari-gama was also part of the samurai’s arsenal and was used by them to defend castles and fortresses: they were usually thrown from the wall at the besiegers, and then dragged back with a chain. In the hands of a skilled warrior, these weapons could also be very effective. Kusari-gama was used by both samurai and legendary ninja. And it was possible to unhook the chain with a hammer from the sickle and ... use it as a brush!


Kataoka Hatiro Tameharu with a chain brush. Woodcut Utagaro Kuniyoshi (1844 g.)


The shafts of short Japanese spears and, like all other weapons, were made of oak, light bamboo was made for long ones. Painted them black or red to match the color of the armor. For the tips - which, by the way, was not typical for Europeans, lacquered sheaths were invented (except that the incredible Mogaras didn’t have a completely unbelievable one for quite objective reasons!), Often inlaid with mother-of-pearl and in addition a cloth cover protecting them from rain . Inlaid mother of pearl and also the shaft in the area of ​​the tip. Including even the sode-garami. And, by the way, it should be noted here that the spears of the Japanese ashigar were the longest in the world (up to 6,5 m!), That is, longer than in Europe, and significantly!

Throwing darts in Japan were also known and, again, many of them were considered just female weapons! For example, a dachi-ute dart about 45 cm long with a feather like an arrow. He was held on special holders above the door. In the event of an attack, it was enough to reach out to grab him and throw!


The Japanese believed that the one who skillfully owned such weapons as naginata * could even have reflected the arrows flying at him. Woodcut Tsukioka Yoshitoshi. Library of Congress.


But such a weapon as naginata, firstly, was also considered a sword (although in Europe it would definitely be called a halberd!), And secondly, also a woman's weapon! The samurai’s daughters, when she got married, were given a whole set of such “halberds” as a dowry, and the girls were fencing a course long before marriage. However, women used naginatu and married, although not all, of course. History brought to us the name of Tomoe Gozen - one of the few female samurai who fought with men on a par. So, in the battle of Awaji in 1184, in which she participated with her husband Minamoto Yoshinaki, he, seeing that the battle was lost, ordered her to flee and leave. However, she risked disobeying him and rushed at the enemy. One of the noble samurai she wounded naginata, pulled from his horse, and then pressed to his saddle and cut off his head. Only after that she obeyed the order of her husband and left the battlefield where Yoshinaka himself was killed!

And this is what Heike Monogatari reports about Tomoe Godzen: “... Tomoe was extremely beautiful, with white skin, long hair, and charming features. She was also a skilled archer, and in the battle with swords alone cost hundreds of warriors. She was ready to fight a demon or a god, on horseback or on foot. She had the great ability to tame unbroken horses; unhurt from the steep mountain slopes. Whatever the battle, Yoshinaka always sent her forward as his first captain, equipped with excellent armor, a huge sword and a powerful bow. And she always did more valiant deeds than any other of his troops ... ”


Woodcut Toyohara Tikanobu. Tomoe Gozen cuts off the head of the enemy!


Of course, there were also simply huge naginaty for men, and its heavier variety - bisento with a much more massive blade, which could completely cut off the head, not only man, but the horse. Thanks to their wide scope, with their help, they chopped off the legs of horses, and then finished off the riders after they fell to the ground. Until the end of the Heian period (794 - 1185) it was the weapon of an infantryman and warrior monk (sohei). The noble warriors (busi) rated him during the war Hempmei (1181 - 1185), which became a kind of transitional era between the Heian and Kamakura eras (1185 - 1333). At this time, it is used especially widely, which in a certain way even affected samurai armor. So, the suneate leggings appeared because it was necessary to somehow protect the warrior's legs from this terrible weapon. It also manifested itself during the Mongol invasions (1274 and 1281), and in everyday life naginata played an important role as a weapon with which a woman could protect her home.
An equally important weapon for women was the dagger kaiken, with which they never parted, but hid their kimono in the wide sleeve. It should also be used to protect the family home, but mainly to perform a purely female seppuku in critical circumstances, which was made with a blow of a kaiken to the carotid artery!


Dagger kaiken - very simple and functional weapon.


However, women from samurai families learned to wield the sword as well, and the cases when they used it in battle are known from history. However, they are also known from historical novels, although it is very difficult to say how much of what has been described corresponds to historical truth. Well, not only women used daggers. There were also samurai in the arsenal, and not only the short blade of the wakizashi pair, which was considered to be not a dagger, but a sword, but also such original “things” as tanto and aiguchi ..


Wakidzasi, manufactured by the blacksmith (kaji) Taikei Naotane (1805 - 1858).


Tanto had a tsuba of normal size and looked like a smaller copy of a short sword. Aiguchi (literally “open mouth”) usually did not have a handle winding, so the stingray or shark skin that covered it was very visible. Without a tsuba, he did not have sepp's goals. It is believed that the samurai that were in the service wore the tanto dagger, and the ayguti — those who resigned (seemingly as proof that they are capable of something, because the dagger, even if it is without a guard, anyway dagger).


Kabutovari, the end of the XVIII-beginning of the XIX century


Kabutovari (the first hieroglyph “helmet” and the second hieroglyph “breaking”) is a forged metal curved baton with a pointed end and a sharp edge of Tosin, as well as dolom - hokoshi, kuichigai-hee with a small hook kagi at the base of the tsuki - handle. The latter protects the brush from the blows of the opponent, and everything else, when attacking the enemy, could cut the soft tissues of the body, even through kimono. The invention of this weapon is attributed to the legendary gunsmith Masamune.

They used samurai and the original look of the stylet - hativara, which, unlike its European counterpart, had a blade not straight, but curved, and even had a sharpening from the inner, concave side. With such thin blades, they pierced the armor of each other in hand-to-hand combat, but they also had double-edged blades with a dale attached to the traditional Japanese handle - yorodoshi-tantто, and its blade was very similar to the tip of the Japanese lance su-yari. Another "sharpened the opposite" pattern of Japanese bladed weapons was the dagger of the cubikir-zukuri. His blade had a greater curvature and also had a sharpening on the concave side, and the point was completely absent. The word "kubikiri" is translated as "head cutter", so its purpose is clear. These daggers were worn by servants of noble samurai, whose duty was to cut off the heads of dead enemies with his help, since they were "war trophies." Of course, that was how it was used in ancient times, but by the 17th century, the daggers of the cubikir-zukuri were worn mainly as a sign of distinction.


Hativa stiletto


Another purely Japanese weapon for self-defense were jute daggers. In fact, it was ... a rod with a handle, cylindrical or multifaceted, and without a pronounced tip, but on the side it had a massive hook. These weapons, moreover, usually a pair, were used by the Japanese police during the Edo period in order to disarm the enemy armed with the sword. With a blade and a hook, his sword was “caught”, after which it was pulled out or broken with a blow to the blade. A lanyard with a colored brush, the color of which determined the rank of a police officer, was usually attached to the ring on its handle. There were entire schools that developed in their walls the art of fighting in jutte and, in the first place, the techniques of countering this swordsman to a fighter with a samurai sword.


Police Stiletto Jyutte


Samurai’s weapon could even be a fan tessen, which could be used not only to give signals, but also to repel an enemy arrow or simply as a short baton, as well as a fighting chain - kusari with a weight at the end, an ax it and an ax Masakari.


Masakari ax could be very similar to the medieval European ...



Fighting fan tessen was entirely made of metal and had the appearance of a folded fan. Except they could, with terrible force, unexpectedly hit the opponent on the head!



Samurai Saburo Yoshihide (XII century, died in 1213) - the famous warrior, son of Tomoe-Gozen and Wada Yoshimori, adviser to Minamoto-but Yoritomo. Notable for extraordinary strength, valor and courage. He is the hero of numerous legends, including stories about his descent into hell, about the conquest of the demons “They are Kigai ga Sima”, and about how he, in 1180, during the battle, tore a huge tree from the ground and used it as a weapon. Here and on this xylography, wanting to emphasize its power, the artist Katsukawa Syuntey (1770 - 1820) armed him with an ax, well, just of inconceivable size!


The latter types of weapons could have a grip almost as tall as a man, so it was quite difficult to use them, just like the “bearded” ax of the Anglo-Saxon xuslar 1066 of the year. But then their strike was most likely cut by any Japanese armor. Naturally, these weapons were used to break through the doors or gates in the fortifications of the enemy. Well, they were also used by mountain hermit warriors Yamabus, who lived in the forests and cut their way through the thickets.


Yamabus Ax - it


But perhaps the most amazing weapon of the samurai was the wooden canabo mace, entirely made of wood or with iron spikes or nails, or without thorns, but with a faceted surface that resembled a modern baseball bat in shape and again almost as tall as a man!

A blow with such a club would leave the opponent very few chances and even the sword would not have helped him. It is interesting that, judging by the ancient Japanese prints, even if they are far away and cannot always be trusted, as the source, not only infantrymen fought with such clubs, but even horsemen! Intermediate between kanabo and tetsubo are such types of weapons as arareboi and neybo - even larger (more than two meters) sizes of cudgel, cubic or round in cross section of thickness 10-20 cm in diameter tapering to the handle. The legendary weapon of the busi is of the greatest power, since it is far from everyone to make swing movements with such a heavy object. The technique of working with neybo today is preserved only in the schools of kisin-ryu.

But the guards of the imperial palace had iron clubs, Cyricoba, which were most similar to scrap, so the saying “there is no reception against scrap” was obviously well-known to the Japanese even in ancient times. The war hammer in Japan was most of all like a big-bellied barrel impaled on a long handle. Usually this “barrel” was wooden and only occasionally was bound with metal. Unlike kanabo and kirikob, it was a weapon of commoners, but it’s not known how this division developed.


The mace of tetsubo - also made of metal and with blunt spikes was very short, no longer than a combat fan!


Although a mace similar to European and Middle Eastern designs in Japan was known, it was not very popular and the symbol of a military leader, as in Europe, was never considered! It should be noted that every samurai, in addition to everything else, had to be able to fight with a long wooden staff - bo, possession of which was equal to the ability to hold a spear and a halberd!

As for wick guns, the Japanese arquebuses were very different from European ones. Let's start with the fact that they had the opposite drive wick, the so-called gander. And the butt ... wasn’t attached to the chest at all while shooting! His hand pressed to the cheek, and recoil absorbed heavy barrel. In fact, it was ... a very long gun - that's how!


Tanegashima - Japanese wick gun, so named after the island, from where it spread to Japan. Caliber 12,5-mm. Above: separate trunk and box.



Wick trigger (gaff) and pilot hole. There is no cover for it on this sample.


Well, did the Japanese know pistols with short trunks? Indeed, in Western Europe, the knightly cavalry already in the same XVI century, replaced the cavalry of the latniki-pistoliers for whom precisely the pistols proved to be the ideal weapon. Yes, they knew, and they called the pistor spoiled by the European word. However, they were not widely spread among the Japanese. After all, they, too, were with wick locks. But if such a lock was convenient enough for an infantryman, he was no good for a rider, since he had to hold such a pistol with one hand, and what is most unpleasant is to constantly monitor the state of the wick glowing in it. In addition, the effectiveness of such cavalry has always been directly proportional to the number of pistols in each rider. In Europe, the pistol locks were wheel-mounted, and the pistoliers could have several of them at once: two in holsters near the saddle, another one or two behind the belt, and two more behind the boots of the boots. And they were all ready to shoot at once! In this sense, the Japanese wick pistol was no different from an infantry arquebus. Therefore, the rider could not have more than one such gun, and if so, then there was no point in it as a weapon. To master the mass production of a complex wheel lock, the Japanese at that time failed, although they made some of its samples. Hence all their problems with this type of weapon.


Wick Japanese pistol pistor (or tanju) with the image of a diamond on the trunk - the emblem of the clan Mayu.


Interestingly, in the West, although rarely, there were still combinations of a noble knight’s sword with a pistol, but in medieval Japan they were never joined together, although the combined weapon was known there, for example, a pistol-wakizashi, a pistol-pipe. But it was a weapon of people of noble rank. A real samurai could not use it without tarnishing his honor!


Japanese wick weapon teppo-jutte of the Edo epoch. Intended for concealed carrying. Weight 580


The Japanese knew about the invention in Europe in the second half of the XVII century bayonet bayonet, which was inserted with the handle into the hole of the barrel. There were two kinds of them: a sword-like dzuken and a spear-shaped juso. But they also did not spread because the improvement of firearms undermined the basis of the power of the samurai class and was very painfully perceived by the government and Japanese public opinion of the shogun era.

* The words “naginata” in Japanese are not inclined, but why not follow the norms of the Russian language in this case ?!

The author is grateful to the company.Japanese Antiques»For the information provided.
83 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. +3
    7 May 2015 07: 39
    Interesting. Japanese weapons, like the country itself, are very distinctive ...
    1. +1
      7 May 2015 18: 48
      Quote: Pal2004
      Interesting. Japanese weapons, like the country itself, are very distinctive ...

      I like the checker and the whip;)
    2. +1
      7 May 2015 20: 09
      We have a cool exhibition of Japanese weapons in the artillery museum!
  2. +4
    7 May 2015 07: 45
    Still, isolation of a country from the outside world is not always to the detriment of the natives, it sometimes gives a very peculiar and original culture, including military culture.
    1. Elk
      Elk
      +2
      9 May 2015 03: 22
      Just then another Admiral Piri comes up and with the help of an “opener” of the appropriate caliber bends the whole original culture, including the military one, as he wants.
  3. +12
    7 May 2015 08: 30
    The "isolation" of Japanese culture is the same myth as that of the "unsurpassed" martial art of the samurai. The Japanese, like the rest of the nations, "safely" tried to conquer the states surrounding them, including Korea (see the film "Admiral", but not of Russian, but Korean production) and China. In the same way, they were subjected to aggressive attacks by neighbors, in addition to whatever they said, but they had trade relations with Europe and America, and therefore, all of their "isolated" "original" culture, upon closer examination, turns out to be a motley mixture of Korean and Chinese cultures tested to their very limited resources.
    1. avt
      +7
      7 May 2015 10: 27
      Quote: Monster_Fat
      The "isolation" of Japanese culture is as much a myth as about the "unsurpassed" martial art of the samurai. The Japanese, like the rest of the peoples, "successfully" tried to conquer the surrounding states, including Korea (watch the film "Admiral", but not Russian, but Korean production) and China.

      laughing This is yes! By the way, the weather helped from the invasion of Khubilai in general, and the outright scam of Chinese officials, who, in fulfillment of the khan's will to build an armada of SEA vessels, transferred to the register of sea river vessels, which safely and sank off the coast of Japan in a banal sea storm. That actually was confirmed by the Japanese - an underwater archaeologist, having found the site of the mass wreck and taking out the artifacts confirming all this. And the rest, on sea junks, calmly .... well, not quite, but sailed back to China. ,, Pole arms, which had no European analogues, were also gecken and yagara-mogara. Gekken had a raven-beak-shaped point and another crescent-shaped point (turned outward). Gekken allowed to grab the warrior by the neck and throw him off his horse. Or hit the neck with a jab, "----- Come on! It never happened !? Is that how no one guessed in the life of a rider from a horse with something on a long stick? The gaff is banal with a spear, it's another matter that it is quite well established production of weapons and halberds was enough, which is still lying and chopped like cabbage, you can.
      1. +4
        7 May 2015 11: 08
        By the way - from the invasion of Khubilai in general, the weather helped and the outright scam of Chinese officials
        And most importantly - ignorance of the seasonal climatic features of Japan. The season favorable for the war in mainland China was not entirely suitable for large sea shipments off the coast of Japan - just like the typhoon season.
        On which, in fact, burned. But those who knew the conditions of the merchants, fishermen and sailors were not asked. Well, the conqueror and stunner of the Universe cannot be defeated even by the gods ...
        Hehe ...
        Hook banal with a spear
        And a million more varieties of war braids a'la Jacqueria-Hussites-Taborites and other Gueuze. In the same direction, all sorts of kuz, glaives with runes and other crap.
      2. 0
        7 May 2015 11: 49
        There is a watercolor on which it is shown how it is necessary to detain a criminal with the help of an agar-mogar. Very indicative image!
      3. +2
        7 May 2015 12: 06
        I join - even the scythe, both ordinary and fixed along the shaft, was the favorite weapon of all peasant uprisings in Europe, and it was used even when there was a choice between more "professional" types of weapons, since the scythe was "more familiar" for the peasants. If you watch the fights and fights of the samurai, then you will not find anything interesting in terms of military art, but if you look at the same period in Europe, then I personally am interested in a really innovative method of warfare, shown by the Taborites under the leadership of Jan Zizka.
        1. 0
          7 May 2015 12: 29
          the scythe, both ordinary and fixed along the pole was the favorite weapon of all peasant uprisings in Europe
          She was popular in that capacity wherever she existed. For it is accessible to the rebels.
          If you look at the fights and fights of the samurai, you won’t find anything interesting in terms of military art, but if you look at the same period in Europe, then I’m personally interested in the really innovative method of warfare shown by the taborites led by Jan подižka.
          This is because when you look at the fights of the samurai, you are watching individual fights. And looking at the Wagenburg taborites, you look at the tactics of group combat. These things are different things. If you watch 500 fights of knights in a row, then you will also start to yawn no later than on the 50th. Everything will be too monotonous. Just like you will watch with interest 50 battles of samurai squads. because in each case there will be one or another tactical nuance - then the relief is different, then the resistance of the soldiers in one place or another is different ...
          1. +1
            7 May 2015 13: 21
            Well, in addition to the "Wagenburg", the Taborites also used such innovative methods of waging a war against chivalry, such as: a "fire bag", "artillery ambush", "powder bombs", etc., in fact, this is NEW in the conduct of war, predetermining the complete decline of chivalry and the beginning of the domination of firearms on the fields of war. And samurai wars are all similar to one another, with varying degrees of variations of ambushes, rounds, betrayals (by the way, betrayal is an integral part of all samurai wars, and they also speak of "samurai devotion!") And other classical methods of waging war in the era of cold weapons. Firearms, on the other hand, were quite widespread in Japan in modern times, but they did not play a decisive role, even despite the existence of multiple-charge rapid-firing samples, precisely because of the stereotyped use of them. Actually, only the restoration of Meiji with its civil wars brought truly revolutionary modern methods of warfare to Japan. Well, as for the "boredom" or "interestingness" of individual fights, their attractiveness, brilliance depend on the master-writer who literally wrote them down, regardless of what it is about: the Scandinavian sagas, the ballad about Rolland or the Legend of Yoshitsune, useful in them from the point of view of military art, a little, except that the spirit of the era is present.
            1. +1
              7 May 2015 13: 44
              Well, in addition to the "Wagenburg", the Taborites also used such innovative methods of waging a war against chivalry.
              I repeat once again: all these are tactical devices. The tactics of the battles of the Japanese (and indeed of any other people) are rarely shown. And she is more diverse than individual fights. We are lucky in this regard with Europe. And there are more materials, and they are considered more often.
              Firearms were quite widespread in Japan in modern times, but did not play a decisive role
              Even how it played. It was with his help that the country united under Tokugawa. European merchants tried to supply the future shogun of all Japan with a sufficient number of trunks. And their artisans made a small but feasible contribution.
              And then, after the victory of the bakufu government, away from sin monopolized the openbridge and executed with great trepidation any attempt to get hold of its tangible number in the ranks of the samurai. It was announced that it wasn’t in the samurai way to naughty from a gunshot. That a sword is divine if it is no longer than a katana. If longer, then this is the machinations of evil gods and intent on the power of the shogun.
              What can we say about the firearm, when a whole special system was introduced for the impoverished ruin of the specific daimyo princes so that they could not grow too economically, and then lay claim to something in the political sense.
              Well, as for the "boredom" or "interestingness" of individual fights, their attractiveness, colorfulness depends on the master-writer
              And also on their number per unit time, when absorbed by the viewer / reader. With too many of them, satiation and boredom ensue.
              1. +1
                7 May 2015 14: 10
                Well, yes, what does Oda Nobunaga alone cost with his 3 thousand teppos at the battle of Nagashino. Also, the famous Toyotomi Hideyoshi defeated Prince Asai with the help of an arquebus teppo. The invasion of Korea at the end of the 16th century also showed the increased role of firearms, and then there was a paradoxical situation: the Japanese had more long-range arquebuses and more, and the Koreans practically did not have arquebuses, but they had long-range guns. Despite the fact that it was in Korea that the Japanese got acquainted with the effectiveness of gun fire, they did not attach much importance to them, on the one hand, having failed to master all the intricacies of casting large barrels, on the other hand, considering them too clumsy on the battlefield.
        2. 0
          12 May 2015 13: 35
          Quote: Monster_Fat
          If you watch the fights and fights of the samurai, then nothing interesting in terms of military art can be found there

          Those. how not to find it?
          1. active use of weapons with long chains
          2. Yumi bow and specific archery technique
          3. training to repel arrows flying at a warrior
          4. A number of aspects of the use of ninja
          5. The main thing is the psychological training of warriors.
          6. I would also call a much deeper ability to wield saber-shaped blades such as katana than the Europeans.
          7. Aikido and other schools of hand-to-hand fighting aimed at fighting with armed people.
          8. The characteristic type of hardening and forging weapons (flake steel)
          This is just what immediately comes to mind. It is clear that both Europeans and Chinese could also teach a lot, just do not underestimate either.
          1. +2
            18 May 2015 14: 19
            This is just what immediately comes to mind.
            Which of the following did you draw from movies?
            Point by point:
            1. In close formation in battle? On horseback? Yes you are a comedian.
            2. What is its specificity in contrast to shooting from any other powerful bow? Acre of posturing in public as part of modern public events? Slowly, a meditating archer in a battle will be quickly cut off his head (the samurai had such weakness; they liked to brag about the enemies' Bosco at the end of the battle).
            3. In the confinement of the battle and with massive shelling, when 1 sq.m. surface up to 20-30 arrows flies? Yes, you have to be gaseous to dodge. Similar techniques existed among the best warriors wherever bow and arrow were known. The same Chukchi of the 16-17th centuries used similar.
            4. Behind the absolute cinema legendary scale of the phenomenon, there’s nothing to talk about.
            5. Believe me, such training has existed at all times and among all peoples, where in general there was a social stratum of professional soldiers.
            6. Your opinion is based solely on the crafts of Hollywood. No more.
            7. Similar schools and receptions existed in Europe and in other cultural traditions. If they have not reached our days in such a good shape as martial arts or you do not know about them, this is another matter.
            8. As a man who makes armor and blades, this is nonsense. European raw materials were better, and the quality of the blades is no worse than Japanese.

            What do we have in the bottom line? Your argument is zero without a wand.
    2. +3
      7 May 2015 11: 48
      It is truth too. In our country, the Japanese military art and "loyalty" and "sense of duty" are often absolutized. And there was everything the same as everywhere else: the smart ones lived at the expense of fools and robbed them in every way, using the force of arms, opinions and ... myths. The princes there were no better and no worse than ours. Ours also gave, souls, poisoned and blinded competitors. Such was the life! And they write about borrowings themselves. There are whole studies - what, when and where! Iron, tea, Buddhism, crossbow - all from China! From Korea - stirrups ... and so on.
      1. Elk
        Elk
        0
        9 May 2015 04: 38
        The princes there were no better and no worse than ours.

        And he is the same person everywhere. The difference in cultures is simply determined by the difference in living conditions, and the basic premises laid down in us by nature are the same for all.
        Alas, we are all descendants of cannibals.
  4. +2
    7 May 2015 08: 42
    An excellent example of the correct attitude to your history. Gentle and stubborn. Even researchers from other countries are forced to use their names "sashigiri-wasigiri". It is a pity that the Romanovs and their Germans destroyed everything that is ancient, everything they could. And the liberals are now helping them with might and main to destroy and slander our memory.

    It seems that many of the weapons presented are caste-professional. It is difficult to imagine that a rake with thorns was made not for intimidation, but for some reason. Although the economic factor, apparently, is more important - a wooden rake is cheaper to make than a halberd with a large piece of iron at the end. Also with a sickle on the handle - it's cheaper than a saber. Iron there is probably simpler. And talking "in the right hands ....." is for a diversion. A screwdriver in skillful hands is no worse than a stylet, when a toad strangles a stylet.

    Thanks to the author more.
    1. +5
      7 May 2015 10: 28
      All weapons, similar to peasant inventory, came from this inventory. And immediately gives out a source of inspiration - a ban on the peasants to have weapons and ersatz weapons of the peasants during uprisings and unrest. It was after that, impoverished samurai picked up such sophistication, developed battle systems for them, and so on.

      By the way, almost all the images and links to him in the article refer us to the relatively peaceful era of the sunset of samurai, as a military class - the Tokugawa shogunate. Until this time, samurai had no need to massively pervert so much with weapons.
      The same combat short sickle - trying to scoop up on this battlefield this hardened, perfectly professionally trained and extremely motivated samurai of the 13-15th centuries with a two-handed tati is possible only from peasant hopelessness.

      In general, this series of articles, with unconditional cognition, has a major drawback that does not allow us to correctly outline the topic - the lack of systematicity. Because it looks like just collecting interesting facts. In the same way, parallels are drawn with European knights, absolutely in isolation from a particular era and territory.

      If the author had presented the material in the evolutionary order of the weapons and tactics of the samurai from the time of the birth of the samurai (approximately 7th century AD) to some point, it doesn’t matter - the era of Kamakura, the era of the unification of the country under Tokugawa or the Meiji revolution, it would be much better and more instructive for readers. The same is true for comparisons with Europe. Compare only with the relevant European era. And then comparisons of horse archers with royal musketeers flash. That is the weapons of knights with police nishtyaks of the 17-19th centuries ... What can only cause bewilderment.
      1. +2
        7 May 2015 11: 34
        In popular articles designed for the general reader, it is meaningless to do this without reference to the source database. It is instructive to show: here it was, there are such points of view. And then, who is interested, here let him study and compare. Reads Turnbull, Kure, Spevakovsky, Nosov, Bryant, and ... gains systematic knowledge. Here is an informational site, not a distance education system. Accordingly, the tasks are different and the presentation of information. In short, you cannot demand a mortar to shoot at planes, although the barrel looks up!
        1. +1
          7 May 2015 12: 00
          In popular articles designed for the general reader, it’s pointless to do this without links to the source database. It is instructive to show: this was it, these are the points of view.

          Nevertheless, even the format of a short article allows you to specify briefly:
          - during the Nara period, a complex of weapons and armor was ...; in Europe at that time it was like that ...
          - in the Heian period, everything was like this ...
          And further on the periods of the history of Japan: Kamakura - ...; Muromachi - ... With relevant comparisons across Europe. Well, or even in the Middle East. would also be indicative.
          Then and
          who are interested, let him study and compare.
          They would have something to cling to in order to search purposefully and without shoveling the extra mountains of literature.

          Or do you have a rationale for comparing samurai from the 8th-10th centuries - basically enough prosperous and therefore equestrian, hired archers with 17th-century musketeers?
          In my concept, it is necessary to compare comparable estates of one era. For example, the end of the sixteenth century: Japan - a massive samurai and already to a large extent a foot army (excluding unambiguously walking ashigars) and Europe - cuirassiers, reytars and officers of the Landsknechts. That is, the nobility of both countries for the same time period.
          1. avt
            0
            7 May 2015 12: 09
            Quote: abrakadabre
            Nevertheless, even the format of a short article allows you to specify briefly:

            good That allows you to further learn in comparison and draw conclusions who and how much advanced in technology and application in battle and encourages yourself to strain and search. Everything is known in comparison, and so slowly but surely you can simply slide into a sect of adorers, not only purely Japanese weapons - any.
          2. +1
            7 May 2015 13: 06
            Everything is true, but this is a personal view of how it should be. And "mountains of literature" are not superfluous, if they are not shoveled, then knowledge is superficial.
    2. -1
      8 May 2015 18: 47
      And our ancient is Finno-Ugric. And our cheekbones are not from the Mongols, as all fools think, but whether the ancient Ural tribes, who settled long before the Indo-European peoples. The ancient sedentary (not nomadic !!) Scythians are our ancestors!
    3. 0
      12 May 2015 13: 42
      you misunderstand the subtleties. Stiletto is much better than a screwdriver. As for the sickle, it is rather an auxiliary weapon, often disposable. The Japanese actively used it - various bolos, sickles, shakens, etc. The shown rake is a police weapon, they look status because they were created for this, but they were simply peasant wooden or with stone teeth. Often, Japanese weapons need to be perceived as part of the whole arsenal that a man carried - then you will understand its real value and effectiveness. For example, it would be strange to analyze Wakizashi (I apologize for the transcription), not having in mind that he was a pair for a katana and that this pair of swords usually ended the battle, but did not start, but it started with completely different weapons.
      1. 0
        18 May 2015 14: 26
        For example, it would be strange to analyze Wakizashi (I apologize for the transcription), not having in mind that he was a pair for a katana and that this pair of swords usually ended the battle, but did not start, but it started with completely different weapons.
        And?
        The European knight also had at the beginning of any battle: a spear, sword, mace or hatchet (or both), a dagger. And this is the minimum.
  5. -1
    7 May 2015 08: 59
    Most likely in Japan, until the 19th century there were no horses, like many other domestic animals. You will not find an ancient horse harness anywhere, all the Japanese traveled on foot or on a stretcher who is richer. Japanese shoes do not propose horse riding. in the 19th century, travelers actively visited Japan, and there are many photographs, but there is not a single photograph of a horse. Maybe the horses were. but there were scanty numbers. All legends about horsemen, usually a remake. A Japanese with an ax looks like an Armenian, very much worn.
    1. +2
      7 May 2015 10: 19
      That is why the Japanese quietly, from 5-6 centuries. n e. polished badjutsu (the art of combat riding), so that in the 19th century so op, and sharply show everyone! And the Cherepanovs' family hid the engine from the baptism of Russia, and only then two brothers talked.
      There are a lot of books on oriental studies, and they don’t like modern ones - take the Soviet, Imperial (we began to take an interest in Peter and I), Dutch, finally.
      1. 0
        7 May 2015 17: 12
        in the Russo-Japanese War, once we encounter the described event: at night a Japanese jumped out to the fire and began to make strange gestures, a Cossack ... hit him on the head, after which the Japanese died. I don’t remember the name of the Cossack. And that’s all. there is no more mention of superfighters. In World War II, there is not a single mention of Japanese melee fighters. There were no superyups, or rather it was, but unity.
        1. +1
          7 May 2015 19: 48
          Sorry, but you basically do not care what to write? And what do they answer for you too?
          Read my message carefully and find there even a fleeting mention of "super fighters", especially about "hand-to-hand fighters". The Japanese, like most of the eastern peoples, by "horse warrior" meant "horse archer". There is no horse in the bike you quoted. Or was it meant there, and after breaking the veil about the timing of the appearance of horses in Japan, you decided to invent equestrian karate? Or equestrian boxing right away?
          1. +1
            8 May 2015 08: 50
            Probably all the same horse taekwondo.
    2. +1
      7 May 2015 10: 47
      Horses appeared in Japan a long time ago. In military affairs too.
      Japanese shoes are indifferent to horseback riding. Just the Japanese used stirrups other than continental. For example, here is a modern replica in the picture.

      The thing is different. At the time of the end of the civil war for the unification of Japan, the number of armed armies, including the samurai proper, according to various estimates reached 200 or more thousand. And this is in a mountainous country, where it’s not just pasture for horses, but there was an acute shortage of acreage for rice.
      Such a general military contingent is very large even on the scale of the entire relatively flat era of Europe before the massive national armies.

      So the war horses could afford the samurai far from even average income. But a warhorse is a sample of the total population, including mares, foals, draft and transport animals.
      Most samurai simply could not afford such a luxury as a horse. How would they not want to maintain their exclusive estate status.

      The shoguns understood this problem very well and were very afraid that such a number of soldiers without peace would not coexist peacefully in the country for a long time. Why the invasions of Korea were organized: the conquest will succeed - Hurray !!!, it will not succeed - and to hell with it, we will reduce the number of extra frenzied and therefore dangerous fighters for power.
      1. Elk
        Elk
        0
        9 May 2015 04: 42
        So the war horses could afford the samurai far from even average wealth

        So in Europe, a good war horse was worth as a herd of cows. Moreover, it also needs to be properly maintained, and you can’t feed it with hay alone.
        1. 0
          12 May 2015 07: 59
          So in Europe, a good war horse was worth as a herd of cows. Moreover, it also needs to be properly maintained, and you can’t feed it with hay alone.
          Good. Since you do not immediately and completely see the difference, I give you suggestive: compare the area of ​​the flat part of Europe and the same plain part of Japan; based on these figures, make the simplest estimates about the feed capacity of these areas (even taking into account the deduction of areas for forests, for arable land); additionally estimate the possibility of importing horses from the steppe zone (much easier than across the sea in the case of Japan).
          I do not urge you to make calculations with an accuracy of a dozen goals. Such a general estimate is sufficient.
          1. Elk
            Elk
            0
            16 May 2015 16: 30
            Good. Since you do not immediately see the difference at all

            Why do you think so? Moreover, I have been to Japan wink . And he saw what she was like.
            And the meaning of my post is that in Europe a war horse was VERY expensive. Just learn to read.
            1. 0
              18 May 2015 14: 31
              And the meaning of my post is that in Europe a war horse was VERY expensive.
              Therefore, initially, with the emergence of the flax system, the knight was given flax - precisely so that from his income everything needed would be acquired and kept in constant readiness. In Japan, lands on the flax ended a very long time ago. Therefore, the samurai were paid not with land, but with rice.
              Nevertheless, you did not provide recommended estimates for the flat area of ​​Europe and Japan.
              1. Elk
                Elk
                0
                18 May 2015 14: 55
                Nevertheless, you did not provide recommended estimates for the flat area of ​​Europe and Japan.

                Just because they are not there. There are no flat territories in Japan equal to European ones. Hence the payments of Coca.
                1. 0
                  18 May 2015 15: 36
                  There are no flat territories in Japan equal to European ones. Hence the payments of Coca.
                  Here is a strange person. And what am I already talking about?
                  In Japan, there is not enough free space for pastures for such a livestock of horses that every samurai could afford to maintain a war horse. Yes, and with a replacement in case of injury thereof.
                  Although initially a samurai is a heavily armored horse archer, in the developed period of the 14th-16th centuries, this is only in theory and tradition.
                  While for the same Mongolia of the same period, exhibiting 5-6 tumens of which 2-4 thousand armored cavalry (elite, her mother) is not a question.
                  In Europe, too, the knight's horse was very expensive. But nevertheless, natural conditions made it possible to scrape together a sufficient amount, for more or less mass cavalry.
                  And even then, in Europe, what is mass heavy cavalry? 1000 knights is sooo much. Probably by the standards of the 20th century (WWII) as a shock army. 2-3 thousand - almost like a front. It can be adequately compared with tanks. So it will be, 2-3 thousand knights - like 2-3 thousand tanks of our time. The power is incredible.

                  And the total contingent of the Crusades of 6-8 thousand knights - all Europe was gaining in pieces. For example, the estimate of the number of knights of the united army of Europe at the battle of Arsuf (September 7.09.1191, 4000) is about XNUMX.
                  1. Elk
                    Elk
                    0
                    22 May 2015 17: 28
                    While for the same Mongolia of the same period, exhibiting 5-6 tumens of which 2-4 thousand armored cavalry (elite, her mother) is not a question.

                    Rave. Have you been to Mongolia?
    3. 0
      7 May 2015 10: 55
      By the way, the Japs did not seem to use spurs. That as if hints at the level of horse control in the stressful situation of a dense equestrian battle at a short distance.
      European knights, focused on hand-to-hand fighting on horseback, rather than shelling from afar, without spurs are inconceivable so much that spurs are, along with a sword and a knight's belt, an indicator of belonging to the estate.
    4. 0
      7 May 2015 11: 35
      There is an ancient harness and finds, everything is there. From the 5-6 century. But the horses were really small. Although not as little as you think.
    5. 0
      12 May 2015 13: 45
      horses were, but few. Basically, they used to know and for military purposes.
      I recall that there were not so many samurai. It happened that a samurai family was at the bottom of several villages. And not every one of them was a rider, had good armor.
      1. 0
        18 May 2015 14: 33
        And not every one of them was a rider, had good armor.
        What and speech.
  6. 0
    7 May 2015 09: 06
    The principle of Japanese culture is to take EVERYTHING from other peoples, but to remake it for yourself. And they do not change this principle today. That's where their current success in everything comes from!
  7. 0
    7 May 2015 09: 37
    Japan is still poor in minerals - there is very little iron, not to mention alloying additives.
    Therefore, the technique of processing iron and steel is purely manual and "home-grown"; in Europe and Central Asia - and you damask, and "Damascus", and metal processing technology from Toledo, and from Salamanca ...
    In Europe - it is easier with iron, bladed weapons both for the "elite" and for the "simple" ... The same is in armor.
    Japan is a resource-poor country, but rich in people and spirit; therefore, such a reverent attitude not only to weapons and armor, but also to objects in general - they try to do everything carefully, with some kind of decoration, even if minimalist ...
    China is seemingly ethnically related to the Japanese people, but clothes are more colorful, household items are more diverse, and weapons and armor; in this, China is closer to Europe, or, say, to Indian culture, to Central Asia and the East.
    Even household items of the South American Mayans, Aztecs and others - and they are decorated with completely non-minimalist ornaments and drawings ...
    1. +1
      12 May 2015 13: 51
      how much resources do you need to craft a sword? It’s nonsense to say that there was not enough iron.
      Do not forget that the Japanese lived in the mountains, and there many elements are available. As for alloying additives - even greater nonsense. You forget that the necessary elements could be found in plants or even in blood (as the Romans did), obtained from the sea.
      As for forging, the Japanese also had their own effective ways, and its complexity was due to the fact that there really weren’t a lot of really good blades to make.
      1. Elk
        Elk
        +2
        22 May 2015 17: 15
        how much resources do you need to craft a sword?

        To hell and more. To begin with, you need a blacksmith, and not just a blacksmith, but a very not a bad specialist. Who would be engaged in this business all his conscious life. You just imagine yourself extremely sluggish imagine the cost of training a real professional.
        there are many items available.

        And what are the elements? In any form? And how will you add them to the alloy?
        You do not understand a damn thing in metallurgy, therefore do not write nonsense.
        its complexity was due to the fact that it was not necessary to produce really good blades.

        But this passage is generally the height of stupidity. There are never many good weapons; this is such a simple axiom.
        In Japan, really good blades were made once or twice and miscalculated, but not because they did not want to, but because the technology was at the level of the beginning of the Iron Age and the raw materials were poor. I'll tell you more, a blade forged from a tank torsion will be better than the coolest katana.
        1. +1
          28 May 2015 10: 40
          because the technology was at the level of the beginning of the Iron Age and the raw materials are poor.
          I will add that the understanding of the processes occurring in steel was not absolutely from our scientific point of view. Everything was at the level of empirical experience, faith in magic and all that.
          With modern knowledge, laboratory analysis can quickly achieve a good result with the traditional primitive technology: ore-krita-forging-product. Precisely because it is known where and how to move. And what result will be at any stage of work.
  8. +3
    7 May 2015 09: 38
    All right The Japanese have udrevnili their history. But how carefully they treat it! How does propaganda work! The cult of the samurai is developed all over the world. Worldwide schools of Japanese martial arts, tea ceremonies, origami (and can not translate, do not understand), Japanese gardens, poetry, etc.
    That is probably the way to promote yourself.
    1. +2
      7 May 2015 11: 39
      Especially nobody did anything. Everything that is written is somehow confirmed by artifacts found by archaeologists. Of course, there is no point in believing that the first emperor was the grandson of Amaterasu. But the story they have recorded since ancient times - here they are lucky!
      1. +2
        7 May 2015 12: 21
        It was especially fortunate that in all their civil wars, the status of the emperor was not in principle disputed, and the fragmentation of the country took place under the formal preservation of the unity of the country and the continuity of the imperial clan line.
        1. +2
          7 May 2015 13: 10
          Yes, and this is amazing, this has not happened anywhere else. No one even dared to think of becoming an emperor. In Egypt, where the pharaohs were deified, priests and military leaders also became them, in Rome ... it's better not to talk about Rome. And there ... all the emperors are known by name, the years of life coincide until the day ... take it and teach history, you won't be mistaken. In Japan, Fomenko is "resting"!
          1. +1
            7 May 2015 13: 52
            In Japan, Fomenko is "resting"!
            Oooh ... this academician, in principle, does not rest on a historical field. It is enough for him to declare all these lists of sun-faced emperors a lie and again work on redrawing history
            wassat
            1. 0
              7 May 2015 21: 00
              That you truly noticed!
          2. +2
            18 May 2015 14: 36
            Yes, and this is amazing, this was not anywhere else.
            Well, why, in part, it was: the Holy Roman Empire in Europe, the Chinese kingdoms for at least 3 years.
            But yes, in the sense of the continuous reign of ONE dynasty, Japan surpassed everyone by a wide margin. As for her, what after.
    2. Elk
      Elk
      0
      18 May 2015 15: 00
      Origami, by the way, is a very interesting art. Try it yourself
  9. Hajate
    0
    7 May 2015 09: 53
    Next, you have to think about a gunshot?
  10. Hajate
    0
    7 May 2015 09: 53
    Next, you have to think about a gunshot?
    1. +1
      7 May 2015 11: 42
      Do you know, is it necessary? After all, about the samurai artillery was already here. In this material there were guns and pistols ... Well, except to tell about the ashigaru warriors and then, in relation to them, about the weapons with which they acted ...
  11. +5
    7 May 2015 09: 56
    The point is not in the "propaganda" of Japanese culture, but in the degradation of European culture as such. Interest in various "exotic" cultures such as Japanese, African, Maya, Indian, etc. arises from the cultural vacuum that has arisen in the place of European culture. European culture already has nothing to offer, to offer a person, except as a desire for "possession," "consumption," "tolerance," "moral and sexual liberation," etc. Hence the spiritual vacuum that Europeans experience and who seek to fill it interest in "exotic" cultures. Russian culture is not interesting to Europeans due to the fact that it does not differ much from the classical European one and, in addition, preaches traditional moral, family and other values ​​that are not welcomed in modern Europe, but various cultural and moral perversions that are alien to European traditions, introduced from other cultures. even encouraged ...
    1. -1
      7 May 2015 11: 37
      You can only evaluate the level of culture
      from the future (when "today" becomes history).
      Estimates of the present are most often momentary propaganda.
      The rise (or fall, or stagnation) of the cultures of Europe, Russia,
      USA, Japan) will be understood only after 50 years.
    2. +2
      7 May 2015 11: 40
      In this you are absolutely right. Any exotic attracts when there is no strong cultural roots!
    3. Elk
      Elk
      +1
      9 May 2015 04: 01
      Interest in various "exotic" cultures such as Japanese, African, Maya, Indian, etc. arises from the cultural vacuum that has arisen in the place of European culture.

      You know, but it seems to me that you are wrong. Interest interest discord. It is one thing when a person tries, outside his culture, to find a certain system of values ​​and behavioral imperatives. And it’s a completely different matter when interest is caused by a desire to know the world (well, why should there be a sin, bend it under yourself). this is where the watershed between Przhevalsky and Roerich passes. Both of them studied central Asia. But if the first was a normal European researcher, then the second hit in mysticism. Or take the same Bismarck. He perfectly knew Russian culture, Russian customs, understood what and what was happening in Russia, but this knowledge did not make him Russian and he did not fall into Russian mysticism.
  12. +2
    7 May 2015 10: 18
    Thanks for the interesting article.
  13. +4
    7 May 2015 11: 40
    Quote: Monster_Fat
    Russian culture is not interesting for Europeans because it is not very different from classical European and

    What are you saying !!! And so the balalaika has been banned in SUSHI since 1940 and Barack Husseinovich extended the ban until 2020, probably because pin.Ostam is not interested !! I was enraged from the institute about the complete lack of interest of the pundits of the former USSR and the then CIS to the history and culture of the Slavs. Topics for abstracts about cultural traditions, (imagine that there was such a thing in the technical university of the OIIMF, now unfortunately ...) were only about geyeuropeystvo, tea, japon, even about Papuans with voodoo, AND ABOUT SLAVES WASN'T, but I demanded and received, debuffed in the library to them. Krupskaya, while I found what I was looking for, but it was then that I realized that 99.9% of all scientific historians and philosophers were completely x ... almost nobody wrote about their culture, only Orientalists, European preachers, South American Americans, African scholars, and SLAVANISTS UNITS, that's sad, Anglo-Saxons are very scrupulously treated everything RUSSIAN and tried to extinct all RUSSIAN from history, replace it with templates. For example, everyone knows about the heroic 300 Spartans, and not many people know about 500 Russians in the Russian-Persian war. Because 500 soldiers not only survived (unfortunately not many), but also lulled such Persian kebabs, when when a detachment of 2300 people came to their aid, then 40000 Persian army REFUSED !!!!!!!! Or a lot of information about the defense of the Pavlov House in Stalingrad, where from September 23.09 to October 25.10.1942, 31, XNUMX people defended and only three died. Is it not heroism, why not write and make films about such events, And ????? And there are a lot of such examples throughout history, and our, ugh, historians write and copy from each other about anything but the Slavs ... eh ... I want to say so much. The Anglo-Saxons divided the Persians into Iran and Iraq stolkonul them and gathered a gesheft and again divided the Slavs and push them ... recourse
    1. +1
      7 May 2015 12: 11
      "Being foolish" is not beautiful. And, "hysteria" - and even worse.
    2. +1
      7 May 2015 13: 29
      Now, in technical universities, they are studying the culture of the Slavs, and their beliefs, and wooden architecture, and the first baptism and the second ... So not everything is as bad as you were!
      1. +2
        7 May 2015 13: 54
        Now they study in technical universities and the culture of the Slavs, and beliefs, and wooden architecture, and the first baptism and the second ...
        It would be better to sopromat and other specialized subjects. And sometimes you look at what kind of snowstorm they carry. Moreover, on technical issues, and on humanitarian ...
        1. 0
          7 May 2015 19: 22
          I think that in that university where the author teaches, and with technical disciplines everything is still normal)
        2. 0
          7 May 2015 21: 03
          Well, I am not compiling the programs. One semester has been assigned to cultural studies, one on the history of Russia, one on philosophy ... And within this, all this goes. By the way, in the USA in Massachusetts Polytechnic Culturology goes through the whole training of an engineer!
        3. Elk
          Elk
          0
          9 May 2015 04: 34
          It would be better to sopromat and other specialized subjects.

          Sopromat, TMM, theory is right and necessary, but human thinking is much more complex. Accordingly, a normally educated person should know what kind of world is around him. And then I met some who know from and to and not a bit more, there was little sense with them either ...
  14. +4
    7 May 2015 13: 10
    Good sequel.
    But, Vyacheslav Olegovich, this is subjective - somehow the continuation seemed to me weaker than the first part.
    Or, overeating simply, from the first part.
    ...
    Well, looking at all these gadgets and recalling other, different materials about the cold weapons of Japan, I visited such an idea.
    In fact, this diversity is caused by a lack of ability to military affairs. On the contrary, rather.
    From the poor and hopeless, in the absence of commodity volumes of iron, each artisan made something of his own. Or, if it really worked for the clan, at least to make it look like a serial.
    And the art in decoration - from the same source. It’s just that there’s nothing else to do with another naginata, and there will be nothing to decorate - so we’ll tear ourselves away from this one so that then, in the 21 century, they will die on Topwar, discussing the master Ueshibu Nepodela.
    Some mass was, of course. But no comparison with Europe and Asia.
    Here is the art - to tie a broken sickle to the handle. This has already been read by Vladimir Yan, in "Genghis Khan".
    And some "artisans" did not bother at all - forged an iron stick, tied it with a stingray skin, hung a string with a brush - get it, samurai, tetsubo ... and a flag in your teeth.
    And in order not to be offended with a stick for a walk - memorize the sixth commandment of bushido.
    And you will be happy.
    ...
    And thanks for the article /
    1. +1
      7 May 2015 21: 12
      You know ... and it is all true, you noticed it very well! Poor country! At least somehow, at least something ... A harsh country, 3000 earthquakes a year, that is, it shakes all the time. There are no livestock, they fertilized the fields with their own. Life is strictly regulated - "police state". And people want variety. Well, that's it. I'll have to think about it. An interesting thought is that diversity is not a consequence of military ability. I’ll have to ask Turnbull what he thinks. Tonight I'll write to him - he is very busy, he will not answer right away, but he will answer. And then I will write you his answer.
      1. +2
        8 May 2015 08: 52
        It is also strange that they did not eat all the other small animals from the poverty of all the monkeys. The Chinese are richer in resources, and then they are eating everything that moves. And what does not move, they move and also eat.
    2. Elk
      Elk
      +2
      9 May 2015 05: 30
      Well, looking at all these gadgets and recalling other, different materials about the cold weapons of Japan, I visited such an idea.
      In fact, this diversity is caused by a lack of ability to military affairs.

      The variety of weapons and armor in Europe is superior to that in Asia. Only during periods of strengthening the state at the time of the emergence of regular armies can we observe the standardization of weapons.
      Historically, standardization has evolved from two directions. On the part of the state, first and foremost it is the standardization of weapons and ammunition, in order to facilitate the supply of a regular army. And from the respective guilds and workshops. Mainly to reduce production costs.
      In Japan, the dominant class of samurai in the 17th century managed to conserve the feudal system under the reigning, but not ruling, emperor. What naturally caused stagnation in the technical and economic development. The European state could not afford such a luxury. The slightest lag, the slightest weakness, and the neighbors will devour and not frown. So you want, you don’t want, but you have to develop industry and trade after it. Accordingly, over time, merchants and artisans strengthen and begin to demand their piece of power. With each turn, the spiral unwinds. And voila, if in the 14-15 centuries Japan was not much inferior to any European country, then by the 17th century the gap was obvious, and in the 19th century the backwardness of feudal Japan was overwhelming. To get out I had to arrange a revolution to survive the civil war.
      1. +1
        9 May 2015 21: 55
        Elk, dear Elk ....
        ".. The variety of weapons and armor in Europe surpasses that in Asia ..."
        Surpasses! One kind of sword - about twenty. Or two hundred. And with the Asians - in general darkness.
        One club - you’ll think about counting.
        But here, something I have never met a multi-pin metal rake as a weapon in Europe. And in Asia.
        Yes, the very last Jean Valjean would be ashamed. in my opinion, go into battle with such a cunning poker.
        ...
        Actually, I was talking about exotic. Well, it didn’t enter European consciousness that you could make a sword to cut horses and riders.
        Nodati sword ...
        http://static.diary.ru/userdir/2/9/1/7/2917375/80567957.jpg

        The Europeans did not recognize that it was possible to pervert with flexible swords - hakujin-no-tati ... a sword belt.
        http://static.diary.ru/userdir/2/9/1/7/2917375/80567550.jpg
        ...
        Why?
        Because there was a lot of iron. And the masters tried not so much to FIND a new option, as if to make something out of nothing - how to improve what is.
        Worked deep, intensively. Developed technique and technology.
        And the Japanese worked in breadth - fantastic rakes, tricky hookers for drunken samurai, flail with triple links (to see that he himself was guaranteed to check out.
        Extensive way.
        The fact that the iron stick was wrapped in the skin of a "sea cat" and dragged over it for four months in a trance - the stick did not get better.
        So I think.
        1. Elk
          Elk
          +2
          9 May 2015 23: 30
          But here, something I have never met a multi-pin metal rake as a weapon in Europe. And in Asia.
          Yes, the very last Jean Valjean would be ashamed. in my opinion, go into battle with such a cunning poker.
          ...
          Actually, I was talking about exotic. Well, it didn’t enter European consciousness that you could make a sword to cut horses and riders.

          So in Europe they fought a little differently. All battle rakes, shovels, three-link flails and other things are weapons for combat out of action. They just do not really act in the ranks. And to cut a heavily armed rider sitting on a horse 1m70cm at the withers and weighing 700-800 kg is not even science fiction. And our ancestors were very pragmatic.
          Because there was a lot of iron

          And you know, not everywhere. And far from everywhere, the available ores with those technologies made it possible to get something decent.
          Do not forget that some twenty years after the Meiji revolution, the Japanese are already smashing China, and ten years later they are successfully fighting the Russian Empire. And now Japan is one of the most technically developed countries in the world. But resources on the islands did not increase ...
          So I think that all the same, the primary socio-economic relations in society. It is they who determine the level that this society can reach.
          You know, technically, a steam engine was already possible in the time of the Roman Empire, even existing models existed, only slaves were cheaper ...
          1. 0
            10 May 2015 21: 32
            Good comment.
            I was very pleased.
            I know about Heron’s steam engine, yes.
            And, in fact, that far to go then, to ancient Rome, Greece.
            How many slaves are still there, how many were during the Chechen wars.
            ...
            I hope we cross again, Vyacheslav.
        2. +2
          12 May 2015 08: 26
          Actually, I was talking about exotic. Well, it didn’t enter European consciousness that you could make a sword to cut horses and riders.
          Zweichander with an average length of 170-190 cm to help you. Nodati is also impossible to cut the horse as a whole. Even using the inertia of a running horse.
          Most likely, the mechanical strength of such a sword is enough for this feat. But the strength of the human muscles, even in the size of Valuev - no. Moreover, the enemy (along with the horse) does not lie tied to the stump. And especially since the relative position of the swordsman and the attacking rider does not give such an opportunity at all. Such a sword, like European two-handed ones, could have chopped the front legs of a horse sweeping past. Here the blade is long, range (amplitude), range (reach without getting hit by the rider), the weight of the sword and the size (power of bones) of the horse’s legs very much contributed to this.
          Jokes about chopping off a hospitable rider (both in Japan and in Europe), along with the horse, leave to storytellers and exalted chroniclers who did not personally go into battle.
          The Europeans did not recognize that it was possible to pervert with flexible swords - hakujin-no-tati ... a sword belt.
          Because in relatively cool Europe, the military class wore thick clothing and armor over it. And to invent such a complex in technological terms and in the technique of using specialized weapons in order to solve a naked peasant is a lot of honor to him. This is in India, where even the infantry to a large extent walked in one loincloth, it was possible to achieve something with such a sword-whip. And even then, only out of order. In an infantry formation, you can cut more of your own with swings than opponents with shields. After that, their delighted comrades, they will strangle you on this flexible "belt"
          A simple chain mail even without an armor will reduce the effect of such a very weightless whip to zero. A thick padded jacket of an armchair or Asian gown will also reduce the likelihood of defeat to extremely low values.
          By the way, all the information about such a sword and even a video about it I met only in India. Such a sword is called - urumi. And the picture you have given is also about an Indian. And most of the references to such delights (in the Japaneseized version), for some reason, lead to all sorts of anime manga, and not a museum and historical works. That as BE hints at the "deep antiquity" of this phenomenon in Japan.
    3. 0
      30 June 2018 09: 06
      He also came to a similar conclusion - this whole zoo of exotic weapons was caused by Japan’s backwardness from the European military system and the lack of a systematic application of the “correct” system, which should have led to the abandonment of the zoo and the unification of weapons with the mass production of a small number, but effective weapons for the system armies.
  15. 0
    7 May 2015 14: 25
    The fan from the first photo is no longer a fly swatter laughing
    1. 0
      12 May 2015 14: 02
      he was partly a swatter
  16. +1
    7 May 2015 16: 27
    Quote: kote119
    The fan from the first photo is no longer a fly swatter laughing

    Noble Fly Swatter smile I read my thoughts directly!

    Master Ushibu Nepodel had a patron - Toyama Tokanawa samurai and secret love - geisha Sukashima smile
  17. +2
    7 May 2015 16: 28
    In 1869, May 4, Department of History. Its task is to create ancient chronicles and documents, create a new official history, show the uniqueness of the historical path of the Japanese. This was justified by the fact that the last official chronicle was "Sandai Jitsuroku" in 901. Describing the 869 earthquake. And that's it !!! further is the purest remake. About Japanese horses. Normal growth, supposedly a Japanese horse with a height of 110cm, maximum huge 130cm. How do you imagine a war horse in height, just below the donkey? I was always amused by the sight of an Uzbek on a donkey, the rider's legs were dragging along the ground. And then the fearless samurai, in straw slippers, his ammunition after a kilometer will be erased, dragging along the ground.
    1. 0
      7 May 2015 16: 54
      In 1869, on May 4, the Department of History was created, sorry.
    2. 0
      7 May 2015 21: 15
      You know, I will not answer you anything. Not my topic. But somehow Steve Turnbull does not write about it anywhere. And knowing his meticulousness, we can say that if there was something serious there, he would have written. He is the thickness of the stones in the castle of Meryl, and found out that ... outside he is big, but flat and thin, ha-ha! But it looks like a huge monolith!
  18. +2
    7 May 2015 18: 56
    Quote: Free Wind
    I was always amused by the sight of an Uzbek on a donkey, the rider's legs dragging along the ground. And then the fearless samurai, in straw slippers, his ammunition will be erased after a kilometer, dragging along the ground.

    ... on the command to "dismount", the rider must quickly select his feet from the stirrups and straighten his legs, until the soles touch the ground, freeze at attention ... (from the military charter of the Japanese imperial army.)

    PS I somehow had a question - what if one day the Japanese islands begin to sink and perish in the ocean !!!
    Are we supposed to let the Japanese live on the Kuril Islands? Here's the question too ... Why us? Spit that they live nearby, let them row to America ... a friendly nation.
    1. +1
      8 May 2015 08: 56
      If such a large and rather mountainous piece of land drowns at once, at least within one day, I dare to assure, the meteorite that destroyed the dinosaurs seems a ridiculous misunderstanding, in comparison. Here even the great Permian extinction will be like an innocent sneeze.
      1. Elk
        Elk
        0
        9 May 2015 04: 54
        Here even the great Permian extinction will be like an innocent sneeze.

        You exaggerate and compare the incomparable. But purely geologically, the sinking of the Japanese archipelago is quite possible. And nothing particularly global will happen. Over the past 5 million years (well, we will count from the appearance of the first of the genus homo), at least a dozen events of this magnitude have occurred, and so what? With each such disaster, 95% of the world's biota died out?
        1. 0
          18 May 2015 14: 43
          Over the past 5 million years (well, we will count from the appearance of the first of the genus homo), at least a dozen events of this magnitude have occurred, and so what? With each such disaster, 95% of the world's biota died out?
          Over the past 5 million years, not a single mass extinction has been recorded. It is massive, comparable to the great. Mammoths with woolly rhinos are complete garbage in this sense. What a shame for mammoths.
          1. Elk
            Elk
            0
            22 May 2015 17: 27
            Over the past 250 million years, not a single extinction has been recorded comparable to the Perm-Triassic massacre.
            This, you know, is such a well-known fact.
            But over the past 5 million years, supervolcanoes erupted at least 15 times, the Mediterranean Sea dried up and filled with water 2 times, glaciers crawled and retreated at least 20 times, large asteroids crashed into the Earth at least 5 times, and the amount of drowned and rising land is not amenable to accounting .. .
            So this is your statement and there is complete garbage. Yes, on a local scale, the disappearance of the Japanese archipelago will be a disaster, but globally nothing much will happen.
            1. 0
              28 May 2015 10: 34
              The Mediterranean Sea dried up and filled with water 2 times, glaciers crawled and retreated at least 20 times
              The whole question is how fast. If Japan drowns with the speed of drying of the Mediterranean Sea - thousands of years. Then yes. But if it completely hides in waves during the day, this cataclysm is worse than the outpouring of Siberian traps (Perm extinction).

              And believe me, the eruption of a supervolcano is a cataclysm of planetary proportions for the biological life of the planet, difficult but not fatal.

              The outpouring of traps is much more serious - this is when, for example, on an area of ​​1 million square kilometers, the entire earth's crust is covered with cracks, of which rushing magma. And rushing for a very long time. According to geologists, the Siberian traps (the most powerful of the most famous) flowed for thousands of years without ceasing.

              It’s like a couple of thousand such supervolcanoes at the same time.

              The largest traps in the history of the Earth of the known:
              Siberian traps - area ~ 2 million sq. km, the volume of erupted rocks - 1-4 million cubic km, age about 250 million years
              Deccan Traps (Hindustan) - an area from 0.5 to 1.5 million square kilometers (according to various estimates), the volume of erupted rocks is 0,5 million cubic kilometers, age is about 65 million years.
              Traps of Paraná Etendek (Africa and South America) - an area of ​​about 1.5 million square kilometers, the volume of erupted rocks more than 2 million cubic kilometers, age 128-138 million years.

              Japan is much smaller than the above traps. But if, hypothetically, it disappears in one day, then the scribe will be much larger than the traps.
  19. 0
    7 May 2015 19: 29
    We are a little misunderstood the average height and size of the average Japanese, especially if this is not our contemporary ..
    Well, yes, we know that they are small, but we do not always understand how much)
    literally 2 days ago there was a case - I held in my hands a katana blade dated to the 16th century.
    so short, light and thin - well, purely a toy)
    the blade was forged 12 years ago, in Japan it’s a completely different subject)
    1. 0
      12 May 2015 14: 09
      the Japanese nation has grown over the past 50 years by more than 20 cm
      By the way, the Slavs used to be lower in stature.
  20. 0
    7 May 2015 21: 59
    Very interesting, thank you very much! I look forward to continuing smile
    Never heard of Mongol invasions of Japan.
    In your article, you mention historical novels — I will be sincerely grateful for the links.
    Best regards hi
    1. 0
      8 May 2015 08: 32
      Read two: The Shogun - James Claywell and the Knight of the Golden Fan - Christopher Nicole. In both, a lot of things are lying — it is simply amazing how much, but ... it is written on the whole well. Although the translation of the Shogun is terrible. There the hero puts on a codpiece and a coat! There is a film Shogun, Japanese and there are fewer mistakes! The most important thing is that the Portuguese sell muskets with JANISH butts from the ship of the newly arrived from Macau to the Japanese. Well, this is a small thing ... This is art!
      Well, the classic of cinema: the film Kurosawa - "Seven Samurai"
      1. 0
        8 May 2015 08: 46
        Thank you Yes, only it has already been read and viewed smile
        1. 0
          9 May 2015 07: 06
          Then the arrows on the wind, the author Matsuoka Takashi.
          1. 0
            9 May 2015 11: 25
            Yeah, thanks a lot!
      2. Elk
        Elk
        0
        9 May 2015 04: 58
        The most important thing is that the Portuguese sell the Japanese muskets with JAPANESE stocks, and from the ship just arrived from Macau.

        If you are interested in this question, you will find out that a similar type of lodge was very common in Southeast Asia and India. Yes, and in Europe, samples came across ...
        1. 0
          9 May 2015 07: 08
          To be honest, I have never seen it. Although looked and funds of various museums and illustrations. Asia yes, but Europe?
          1. Elk
            Elk
            +1
            9 May 2015 09: 29
            You just probably did not pay attention. We called these guns "chinka". were a light gun, sometimes rifled, with a caliber of 9-14mm, usually had a wheel lock. They were widespread in the 16-17 centuries. When applied, the shooter pressed the butt not to the shoulder, but to the cheek. Due to the small caliber and relative mass of the charge, such an attachment was acceptable. They were intended mainly for fast shooting, as such an attachment made it easier to compensate for the vibrations of an unstable platform, such as a horse or the deck of a ship.

            1. Wheel rifle. Germany, Dresden (?),
            c. 1560-1570

            2. Wheel rifle. Germany, trunk - Aachen, castle -
            Dresden, box - southern Germany (Nuremberg?),
            1600-1610 years.

            3. Wheel rifle. Germany, Dresden, 1720-1730,
            master Johann Andreas Ertel
            Photograph and signature taken from the website of the Gatchina Museum http://history-gatchina.ru/museum/arsenal/arsenal.htm
            1. 0
              9 May 2015 20: 39
              Thank! You gave me a gift right away.
              1. Elk
                Elk
                0
                9 May 2015 23: 05
                Not at all.
                However, I do not think that the Portuguese, under the control of the Jesuits, dragged arquebuses directly from Europe. Most likely they ordered them in their colonies in India and China. Although the first samples of firearms came to Japan from China, it was the Portuguese deliveries that made it truly massive.
                And the Japanese were very diligent students. Now, of course, I understand that history does not have a subjunctive mood, but what would happen if Nobunaga and Tokugawa and Toyotomi Hideyoshi, who joined them, did not begin to preserve the socio-economic system of Japan so much after sengoku jidi?
                1. 0
                  12 May 2015 08: 57
                  However, I do not think that the Portuguese, under the control of the Jesuits, dragged arquebuses directly from Europe. Most likely they ordered them in their colonies in India and China.
                  Most likely it was so and so. In addition, local Asian production was extremely conservative. The very China, at that moment, was already losing ground strongly as a center of development and new technologies. Tradition and Confucianism did their job - development was inhibited.
                  1. Elk
                    Elk
                    0
                    16 May 2015 16: 42
                    development was inhibited.

                    This is the biggest problem in the East. I happened to communicate with Japanese and Koreans (both northern and southern), and with Chinese. All of them are prone to "pupation", that is, to closure within themselves. If there were no outside influence, then in the same Japan the shogunate would still be in good health.
                    1. 0
                      18 May 2015 14: 44
                      Not only them. This is a pan-eastern problem. The same Indians ...
      3. 0
        12 May 2015 08: 52
        The most important thing is that the Portuguese sell the Japanese muskets with JAPANESE stocks, and from the ship just arrived from Macau.
        There were no special Japanese stocks. Because the Japanese got acquainted with the firearm from European merchants. And their own weapons were made in the image and likeness of imported ones due to the extreme degree of tradition.
        All these Gobul stocks - from the first, the most primitive (and therefore the cheapest for the seller) arquebuses, hand-tools and other groovnits. Why bring top-end, and therefore already expensive in Europe, models of muskets (like mass parties, rather than piece-wise gift) to Japan, if you can stagger away the overwhelmingly expensive? ..
  21. -1
    8 May 2015 11: 04
    yeah! Japan is certainly an alien not-what. and to this day.
  22. 0
    8 May 2015 18: 55
    A wonderful article is super, but I want about the Russian - Lithuanian, Russian - Polish wars !! About Livonian !! About the formation of Russian statehood! About our nameless graves of the 16th century near Pskov and Izborsk !!
    1. 0
      9 May 2015 07: 09
      Thanks! But ... about what there is no material "a little extra", it is better not to write. Let anyone have a pull up!
  23. Elk
    Elk
    +2
    9 May 2015 04: 21
    As for the wick guns, the Japanese arquebuses were very different from the European ones. To begin with, on the contrary, they had a wick drive, the so-called gagra. But the butt ... wasn’t applied to the chest at all!

    1. They are no different. Since they are copies of the samples imported by the British and Dutch. Naturally, local manufacturers adjusted to the capabilities of their own production and the physical condition of the "users". All the same, the Japanese, even now, for the most part are not very large.
    2. Gagra (with us) and serpentine (in Europe), called the simplest type of wick lock. Koyi was a simple lever S-shaped, which was fixed on the axis. The wick was mounted on the upper shoulder and, accordingly, after pressing the lower end of the lever, it fell to the shelf. The spring wick lock, the most common in Japan, has been known in Europe since the 15th century, but there it was very quickly and significantly replaced by a lever lock.
    3. In Europe there was a whole class of carbines, the butt of which was not pressed neither to the chest nor to the shoulder.
    1. 0
      9 May 2015 07: 10
      Good photo, very. But the form is still different! Is it not visible?
      1. Elk
        Elk
        0
        9 May 2015 09: 47
        The principle of application is the same. In this photo, German samples, and Asian and, accordingly, Japanese shotguns, have a shape close to the old. The Portuguese brought such weapons to Southeast Asia.
      2. 0
        12 May 2015 08: 58
        Not at all. All within the smallest variations on one theme. Moreover, in Europe of that period they did not even realize standardization.
        1. Elk
          Elk
          0
          23 May 2015 05: 59
          Moreover, in Europe of that period they did not even realize standardization.

          Just started to guess that this can be useful. The development of manufacturing with an ever-deeper division of labor simply forced standardization and the creation of metrology as a science.
    2. 0
      9 May 2015 07: 12
      And let me ask you a question: where does this photo come from and where are these carbines lying in, in which museum?
      1. Elk
        Elk
        +1
        9 May 2015 09: 43
        http://annales.info/evrope/behaym/behaym14.htm
        Follow this link. This is one of the best works on the history of medieval weapons.
        1. 0
          9 May 2015 20: 44
          Thanks again! Live and learn...
  24. +1
    10 May 2015 12: 54
    I never understood the phrase "Japanese samurai". What else are there? Chinese, Korean or Danish! There are American ones, though in the fevered imaginations of Hollywood scriptwriters.
    1. 0
      12 May 2015 09: 00
      Hykhy, there are also Russians - one is still living in the Volga region. Under 90 to him. The truth is - a former Japanese prisoner of war.
      But you are right ...
  25. 0
    12 May 2015 17: 18
    If the article claims to be "historical", then
    1. For each woodcut, the date and place of publication should be indicated.
    2. For each photo of the "weapon" again the place where it was photographed and the date of production.
    And, in the article, pictures and photographs are simply pulled into a large pile and presented as historical material. The illustrations of the duck are generally late, but they depict the "old times" ... well, this is the same as taking Vasnetsov's painting "Heroes" and using them to tell what kind of weapons all the heroes had.
    Again, when they show solid iron clubs and say that this is a "weapon of commoners" it is immediately clear that the author is an amateur. Before the industrial revolution, iron was in a wild deficit, and not only in Japan, where people already lived on each other's heads, but even in "enlightened" Europe.
    1. 0
      18 May 2015 14: 53
      Before the industrial revolution, iron was in a wild deficit, and not only in Japan, where people already lived on each other's heads, but even in "enlightened" Europe.
      To be precise, it depends on which century.
      If at 10-13, then yes. If at 15-16, then it is simply expensive, and not rare. Just because of the production method in relatively small forges. And because of its high cost, the system of reuse of iron in the Middle Ages worked better than in the dashing 90s with us - everything was reforged many times.
  26. 0
    15 May 2018 10: 35
    Quote: Elk
    Just then another Admiral Piri comes up and with the help of an “opener” of the appropriate caliber bends the whole original culture, including the military one, as he wants.

    Another big survey of someone bent down. After all, Japan did not become a colony, and having gained useful technologies, it poured out to all European neighbors. and we fell on nuts, and the Anglo-Saxons. I think the Europeans had many more reasons to regret that this Piri had discovered this Japan at all and woke it from a medieval dream.
  27. 0
    15 May 2018 10: 40
    Quote: Monster_Fat
    The "isolation" of Japanese culture is the same myth as that of the "unsurpassed" martial art of the samurai. The Japanese, like the rest of the nations, "safely" tried to conquer the states surrounding them, including Korea (see the film "Admiral", but not of Russian, but Korean production) and China. In the same way, they were subjected to aggressive attacks by neighbors, in addition to whatever they said, but they had trade relations with Europe and America, and therefore, all of their "isolated" "original" culture, upon closer examination, turns out to be a motley mixture of Korean and Chinese cultures tested to their very limited resources.

    Let us not forget that the Japanese are the only ones in history who were able to smash the Russian army dry, yielding it in numbers. And that before the advent of atomic weapons, no one could conquer Japan.
    1. 0
      9 May 2020 13: 35
      Losing in numbers? In the Far East, the Japanese military contingent was more
      1. 0
        21 December 2020 18: 36
        Sorry for the late answer. Google the number of armies in all battles of the Russo-Japanese War. Ours have a stable numerical advantage over the Japanese there.
        1. 0
          3 January 2021 14: 13
          Liaoyang - equality, Mukden - about 10-13 thousand advantages, in fact, only on Shah there was a serious numerical advantage for the Russian army - about 40 thousand people, but at the same time - the siege of Port Arthur, battles on Yalu, Wafangou, Jinzhou , battles at sea, the Japanese had the advantage. But at the same time I agree that in total at the end of the war Russia had an advantage in the number of troops.
          PS My answer is also not very prompt - work
          1. 0
            9 January 2021 16: 50
            Well, strictly speaking, at Liaoyang ours still had an advantage of 2 thousand soldiers. Of course, we can say that this is already a trifle and chicanery, but let's not forget that the Japanese were advancing there, and we were defending ourselves sitting in fortified positions and forts. The art of war requires at least a threefold advantage from the coming, and here there are even fewer Japanese. In addition, we had 5 more artillery units. For those playing against a fortified defense, this is already a serious advantage. To step on the entrenched enemy, yielding to him in numbers and artillery, is a bold step. You could even say reckless.
            The extra 10 thousand at Mukden is already an additional division that can be used as a reserve in an important area of ​​the battle. And the enemy will not have it. And the straw breaks the back of the camel. Again, the Japanese are advancing in this battle, and we are playing from a fortified defense. By the way, in addition to Shakhe, we must also mention the battle of Sandepu. There we also had a very serious numerical advantage of 70 thousand bayonets (our 290 thousand against 220 thousand Japanese). And also defeat.
            The siege of Port Arthur is still not a battle, it is a siege of a fortress. Considering that Port Arthur was one of the most powerful fortresses of its time and its garrison was more than enough for defense, the numerical advantage of the besiegers is not a critical factor here. The besiegers are always an order of magnitude more than the besieged. Yalu, Jinzhou and Wafanggou are minor battles of the beginning of the war, I somehow did not think about them. Although yes, I admit, the Japanese won there due to the numerical superiority and the initiative of those who started the war. The same can be said during the textbook battle of the Varyag in Chemulpo. There is not much to praise the Japanese for, anyone would have won, therefore he did not mention these battles. But if we are talking about small battles of the beginning of the war, then one cannot but mention the Yanzelinsky Pass, which there is no desire to remember. Our 27 thousand, Japanese - 11 thousand. Ours saddled the pass, the Japanese again, yielding in numbers, advance and overturn us from the pass. I can't say anything about Tsushima, I mean land battles. In the marine theme, I confess, like a pig in oranges.
            PS It's okay, answer when it suits you. I drop by here from time to time.