Tu-160: the resumption of construction of "White Swans" - patching holes?

Interesting news was heard on April 29 from the lips of the Minister of Defense of Russia Sergey Shoigu - he ordered to begin work on restoring the production of the most modern Russian strategic Tu-160 bombers, nicknamed “White Swans” in our country, and Blackjack in NATO. In this light, consider the reasons that led to such a decision, the current state of strategic aviation RF and its prospects.

Bears and swans

First we turn to the current state of Russian strategic aviation. As we have already noted, our most modern and powerful aircraft is the supersonic Tu-160 bomber. The machine is mass-produced from the 1984 of the year, the real production stopped at the beginning of the 90-s, when funding stopped, but several more aircraft were released using prefabricated elements left over from the Soviet era. The last Tu-160, which was given the name "Vitaly Kopylov", was released at the Kazan Aviation Plant named after SP Gorbunova in 2008 year. According to some reports, there are still 2 unfinished aircraft of this type. All in all, the Russian Air Force currently has 16 “White Swans”, although 35 aircraft were launched. Some cars were lost in plane crashes, and a large number of “swans” were disgustingly destroyed in Ukraine at the end of the 1990 for American money - the benefit of some aircraft was saved by taking them on account of the gas debt. At the moment, all Tu-160 are planned to be upgraded to the level of Tu-160М, which will significantly increase their combat capabilities - now the aircraft will also be able to successfully use non-nuclear high-precision weapons. The main "highlight" should be the replacement of strategic cruise missiles X-55CM (they carry a nuclear warhead) with new X-101 / 102 (the first modification has a non-nuclear warhead, and the second - nuclear). The maximum range of launch will increase from 3500 km to 5500 km, while achieving tremendous accuracy - the circular deviation of the missile is equal to 10 meters. Total aircraft can carry up to 12 like cruise missiles.

The second pillar of the strategic aviation of the Russian Federation is the Tu-95 bomber, nicknamed "The Bear" in the West, and produced from 1955 onwards! Only the American strategic bomber B-52, who also continues to serve in the US Air Force, is the same age as our “old man”. The car, though old, however, is standing on the armament of the Russian Federation modification of the Tu-95MS carries exactly the same cruise missiles as the Tu-160. With the launch range of the X-55CM rocket, a component of 3500km, the supersonic speed or stealthiness inherent in newer machines is not so important - the entire ammunition will already be shot off by the time the bomber detects the enemy forces. Tu-95MS undergo the same modernization as the Tu-160. By 2020, the Russian Air Force will have 20 Tu-95MSM capable of carrying all the same new strategic cruise missiles X-101 / 102 up to 6 units.

PAK DA (PAK DA)

Earlier there were plans to launch a serial production of the new strategic bomber PAK DA in the middle of the 2020-s. The machine must first replace the outdated Tu-95, and later the Tu-160. In addition, the PAK DA is considered a replacement for the Tu-22М3 long-range bomber. According to preliminary information, the aircraft will be carried out according to the “flying wing” scheme (like the American B-2 Spirit) and subsonic. The speed will be sacrificed for the low profile aircraft for radar. There is no other reliable information about PAK YA now.

Underfinancing or deadlines?

Quite an unexpected proposal to resume the release of Tu-160 bombers can be most easily explained either by cutting the budget for the development of PAK DA, due to the economic crisis, or too “Napoleonic” plans for it, voiced initially. The combination of these two factors is also quite likely. The fact is that the gliders of the Tu-95 with time, unfortunately, do not become younger and, sooner or later, will become unusable. Staying with 16 TU-160 against 66 and the American B-1 (which was recently decided to return nuclear weapons) and 20 and B-2 Spirit stealth bombers are not the best prospect. And in large local and regional conflicts, to have a carrier of high-precision weaponscapable of firing from great distances, certainly not hurt. The target number of Tu-160 produced must be such as to replace all Tu-95MSM - which means at least 20 units. So, this is good or bad - we are seeing patching holes that have arisen as a result of a complete decline in that part of the domestic aircraft industry, which is responsible for the construction of bomber aircraft. Not the last role in this decline was played by the fact that airplanes of this class are not shipped abroad - and arms exports have saved so many arms manufacturers in difficult years.

Cost and possibilities of the Russian aircraft industry

It is no secret that from scratch Tu-160 class cars are not produced since the collapse of the USSR. Moreover, the possibility of producing the NK-32 engines necessary for the flight of the machine was lost. However, last year it was announced that OAO Kuznetsov was restoring production of NK-32, and by 2016, the first batch of engines would have to be released. The production of this power plant is necessary to maintain the existing Tu-160 in flight condition, in addition, based on it, an engine for the PAK DA will be created. As for the rest, it will definitely be uneasy, but all the documentation is in place — the key point is the investment in machine tools and other equipment necessary for production. The approximate cost of one Tu-160 in 1993 was $ 250 million - since then, of course, inflation has “worked”, however, taking into account the use of more modern production technologies, we will consider such a price relevant to this day. In this case, the cost of the production program 20 new Tu-160 will be at least $ 5 billion, and possibly more.

The money is not small - but not too large, especially considering that the production of such a batch of airplanes will be quite extensively stretched over time. So it remains to wait and observe whether the production of strategic aviation of the Russian Federation will receive an impulse. The successes of recent years in the construction of tactical combat aviation inspire a healthy optimism. In the meantime, we can all watch our "Bears" and "Swans" at the 9 Victory Parade in May.

Comments

[mabuta]

Still, the sale of RD-180 (181) p.i.nd.dos.sa.m, with a stretch, but justified.
The decision to resume production of Tu-160 somehow overlaps with the same decision on B-1В.

[sergey261180]

Quote: mabuta

Still, the sale of RD-180 (181) p.i.nd.dos.sa.m, with a stretch, but justified.

How is it justified?

[Kalinov Bridge]

Quote: sergey261180

How is it justified?

By commercial interest, naturally.
Like, however, almost everything (well, except for the struggle for their own eternal rule), which the leadership does.

[Enot-poloskun]

I'm afraid the decision to resume production of the Tu-160 is associated with high military danger.

Not until PAK YES ...

[Per se.]

Quote: Enot-poloskun

I'm afraid the decision to resume production of the Tu-160 is associated with high military danger.

Not only, and not so much. To do modern airplanes is not to convert the shops of destroyed factories into shopping centers. Soviet education and science were defamed and destroyed, production is the same, there should be results, and they are ... Pensioners are leaving, designers, engineers, old foremen, workers, and young people wanted to be bankers, financiers and lawyers. No wonder that old man George Sores delivered free textbooks at one time, with a history edited by the State Department and the CIA, and "economic science" under the dollar and the leadership of the United States sharpened. "Menager" know how to "enlarge" enterprises, merging design bureaus with serial production, and by cutting workers, get immediate profit, but they cannot be creators, generators of technical ideas. We are already riding on the safety margin of the Soviet Union, modernizing what we have created earlier, refining what we started earlier. If there were no work on the T-95, there would not have been the same "Armata", a simplified and "cheaper" universal version of the tank in a "platform", without Soviet backlog, there would not have been all the upgrades on the Su-27, there would have been no work by PAK FA. By the way, the MiG-31 also decided to resume production. It is necessary to begin to revive the lost from education and science. Better yet, with a simultaneous revival of Soviet morality and socialist economic development. It is unlikely that consumer motivation and "liberal capitalism" are true blessings for our people and our country.

[afrikanez]

Well done, I hit the point right

[GSVG]

Everything is VERY true !!! Especially (IMPORTANT) the last three sentences !!! That is, "LOOK INTO THE ROOT" !!! Set out briefly and very accurately! Happy ALL!

[maai]

Good comment.
PS I'm looking at our Minister of Education and Science and the head of government - and these "tongue-tied clever people", IMHO, only spoils my mood.

Quote: Per se.

Even better, with the revival of Soviet morality

Yes! Nothing so lifts and does not stimulate such an important thing - morality, as an adequate and timely application or demonstration of the "belt" next to the booty, coupled with the correct words and a declaration of moral and cultural values.

[Tribuns]

"Menager" know how to "enlarge" enterprises, merging design bureaus with serial production, and, by reducing workers, get immediate profit, but they cannot be creators, generators of technical ideas "

The Russian authorities, as a rule, keep silent about the underlying reason for the destruction of the world's best Soviet education and science, who really train creators and patriots of the Russian state ...
And the reason for this is that the liberals who came to power and still hold power have brought to Russia an alien market economy that has been alien to it since the Yeltsin Chronicle has destroyed domestic industry and made our country a raw materials appendage of the industrial West ...
And, according to liberals, the raw materials economy of Russia does not need education or science ...

[ty60]

An example of this is the Yak factory in Saratov, now the Orange shopping center.

[Aleksandr72]

But the Tu-160 car is far from the most modern, at least in development time:
The beginning of work on a new multi-mode strategic aircraft carrier in the USSR dates back to 1967, when two domestic aviation design bureaus started working on it: Design Bureau P.0. Dry and just restored OKB V.M. Myasishchev. November 28, 1967 issued a government decree on a new aircraft. In 1969, it was decided to involve A.N. Tupolev, in which they began to prepare an advance project of the aircraft, which first received the Tu-160 index. By 1972, the advance project was completed and provided by the Air Force. At the same time, the Air Force accepted the designs of the Design Bureau of V.M. Myasishchev and Design Bureau of P.O. Sukhoi for consideration. All three projects were presented in the framework of the competition held by the IAP in 1972 with the aim of obtaining the best solution for a promising strategic aircraft.
The results of the consideration of the proposed projects of the Design Bureau of P.O. Sukhoi, Design Bureau of V.M. Myasishchev and Design Bureau of A.N. Tupolev, as well as the analysis of work in the USA on B-1, tipped the scales in favor of the Myasischevsky M-18, it was supported by TsAGI and NTS MAP. However, this design bureau did not have the necessary production base and was small in number for the implementation of such a complex project. By decision of the leadership of the MAP and other authorities, this task is transferred for execution to the more powerful OKB A.N. Tupolev. The project of the Design Bureau of P.O. Sukhoi T-4MS was withdrawn from consideration mainly due to the high degree of technical risk and because of the unwillingness of the Air Force to load this design bureau with complex work, which would probably pull its design and production forces from projects so important for the Air Force, as T-6 (Su-24), T-8 (Su-25) and T-10 (Su-27). After all these events, which decided the fate of the domestic multi-mode aircraft, the A.N. Tupolev Design Bureau began designing the Tu-160 aircraft with a variable sweep wing. Two Decrees of the Council of Ministers of the USSR of June 26, 1974 and December 19, 1975 (No. 1040-348) set the creation of a strategic multipurpose Tu-160 aircraft in the variant of a bomber-carrier with DTRDF NK-32.
Production of the first three aircraft began in Moscow in the workshops of MMZ "Experience" in 1977. The fuselages for them were made in Kazan, the wing and the stabilizer in Novosibirsk, the cargo compartment doors in Voronezh, and the landing gear in Gorky. Simultaneously with the production of these machines, KAZ-e (KAPO) was preparing for the serial construction of the Tu-160. The first prototype machine “70-01” was intended for factory testing and debugging, the second (“70-02”) for static tests, the third (“70-03”) was supposed to be a pre-production machine.
By the summer of 1980, the first car was partially completed and transported as such to ZhLI and DB at the airfield in Zhukovsky. On October 22, 1980, testing of aircraft systems and equipment began on an experimental machine. The final assembly of the experimental aircraft in ZhLI and DB was completed in January 1981. November 14, 1981 the aircraft under the control of the crew, led by test pilot B.I. Veremey makes the first taxiing, and on December 18 of the same year the crew of B.I. Veremeya lifts the plane on its first flight. Factory tests of the first machine began, in February 1985 it first developed supersonic speed. The third "70-03" machine, which has a full set of serial bomber equipment, takes off on October 6, 1984. On October 10, the first serial production vehicle manufactured by KAPO im. Gorbunova, March 16, 1985 - the second serial, December 25, 1986 - the third serial. On August 15, 1986, the fourth production car takes off. Aircraft are preparing for admission to the Air Force. The first two production vehicles arrived in Priluki in the 184th Guards TBAP on April 17, 1987, one of them was piloted by the deputy commander of the 37th VA Lieutenant General L.V. Kozlov. For the first time, by order of the Minister of Defense, such a complex aircraft was transferred to the combat unit for trial operation, without completing state tests.
Here is such a difficult fate for this wonderful machine in every sense.
I have the honor.

[prosto_rgb]

Quote: Alexander72

But the Tu-160 car is far from the most modern, at least in development time:

And where and who in the world have more modern strategic missile carriers with such characteristics?
B-1 Lancer - developed in 1970-80. in service with 1985. The performance is inferior to the Tu 160.
It seems like there are no other analogues, so what's the question then?
Even if:
For example, the F-15 Japanese, accompanied by the Tu-160, could not overtake them ...
(taken here: http://topwar.ru/3617-bombardirovshhik-b-1b-lancer.html)

[ancient]

Quote: prosto_rgb

For example, the F-15 Japanese, accompanied by the Tu-160, could not overtake them ...
(taken here: http://topwar.ru/3617-bombardirovshhik-b-1b-lancer.html)

Link to Link..not understood
Did you want to compare the characteristics of the Tu-160 and V-1V?
And what does it mean ... the Japanese could not overtake?
With the Formula 1 is not confused?

[Yeti]

And how then caught up with something?

[Ze Kot]

Quote: prosto_rgb

For example, the F-15 Japanese, accompanied by the Tu-160, could not overtake them ..

And why overtake them? You did not mix up tasks?

[kuz363]

What’s out of date? If weapons and electronics - then everything is fixable. The main thing is the design itself and the power unit are unchanged.

[lev1201]

In fact, B-1 is ALREADY older ...

[ancient]

Quote: Enot-poloskun

I'm afraid the decision to resume production of the Tu-160 is associated with high military danger.

Do not be afraid If suddenly a "miracle" happens and "there will be a restoration of production of Tu-160" , then on the planet Earth the "high military danger" will end long ago.
Or do you think. that this will happen at .. "the dictates of the pike, at my will"

And the question. and how can the Decision affect the "high military danger"?

The danger seems to be right here. and your decision .. WHERE ???

[maai]

The meaning of what was said is incomprehensible. Please rephrase your thought in accordance with the rules of the language.

[Foreman49]

War is a social and economic category. Rockets and airplanes did not save the USSR, and in the conditions of the constitutional discrimination of the Russian people on ethnic grounds in the Russian Federation, the OFFSHORE model of power, business, the loss of the Russian people will not save the Russian Federation either. Putin corny seizes power (rhetoric and patching) and devastates Russia, prepares IT for surrender, remains the GUARANTEE of the continuity of "perestroika and reforms" in the interests of the "family" that brought him to power and third countries.

[FID]

Quote: Foreman49

. Missiles and planes did not save the USSR

Excuse me, what would save the USSR? Nevertheless, the United States would have lost the race ... Once again, I ask for petition ...

[Foreman49]

So, for 15 years, Putin did not and did not understand that today China is clearly demonstrating an advanced model of social and economic development.
But this is not "our way", as Putin said, so we will drag ourselves in the tail! There is no time for new developments, only patching up the Soviet! And with his (Putin's) help, we will remain a nation of unrealized opportunities.

[lev1759]

What a pity you are not the president ....

[maai]

Yes, he would fix everything right away. He would have told them and all of them immediately ran in and did everything. And if they hadn’t done or stolen what would he have told them - uuuh ... and they immediately, - aah ... and to the Canaries. .. or they would have declared him a despot, and the world community began to condemn, despise and boycott. But he would have ruined it all in an instant, he would have mastered it and inserted all of them with new brains — correct from all points of view of morality, morality, culture and traditions. Descendants would call him god! ... or crucified on the cross, to the hair dryer edren !?

[maai]

Many do not understand! They think that if you are president, EVERYTHING can be done! THE MOUNTAINS TO FOLLOW. This is not true! If you are ONE, then at least take a command - they will sneeze and laugh in your face. Because you are alone - and they are legion.
The President does not appear to have a team. To establish a quick reaction and quick actions, with the fastest possible result, you need to put on a tightrope. ... immediately all the lazy demons, and just demons, will start yelling about the "cult of personality", "autocracy", "bloody regime and its reptile" and so on. So it was with all the great rulers.

Ivan the formidable - was formidable because he was formidable for the enemies, and not because he allegedly liked to put someone on a barrel of gunpowder - let him fly. "

Peter the Great - also ... a bone in the throat, a murderer, a bloodsucker, give your beard, do not send the child to learn adversary, an overseas idol.

I’m already tired of talking about Stalin and I’m not going to argue. Here I, if anything, have long had one answer. The final and uncompromisingly undeniable, - HE WAS A GEORGIAN! SO ALL QUESTIONS ARE THERE!

[maai]

The USSR did not save - a weak light industry.

https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Лёгкая_промышленность

[Zoldat_A]

Quote: Enot-poloskun

I'm afraid the decision to resume production of the Tu-160 is associated with high military danger.

Nuclear danger has always been there since 30 on August 1945. Churchill persuaded the United States to deliver a nuclear strike against the USSR. I note for a moment that World War II has not yet officially ended, and Small Britain, the USA and the USSR are official allies. What about the Dropshot?

What interests me more is not the threat of external nuclear aggression, to which our people have grown accustomed over 70 years, but internal aggression. NK-32 engines not? Kuznetsov Design Bureau ruined? And look at what the defense plants have turned into Samara (and throughout the country!) And now - the main traditional question -

WHO'S GUILTY?

Who gave the order to stop the production of these beautiful “birds?” Who is to blame for the fact that there are no engines? Who is to blame for the fact that at the aircraft plant, which under the Soviet Union produced 54-56 new aircraft a year, now 2-4 are being repaired a year? Who gave the order to bring down the defense industry so that it would not get up? Who said that we have friendship with America, that there is no threat and, as it were, the army is no longer needed? Who gave the order for 4 years not to accept an application to military flight schools, and now is pushing the opportunity to serve in the Russian army to foreigners and, in particular, military pilots? To hell with these "who" !!!!!

The main thing is that many of the defendants, starting with Gorbachev and ending with Taburetkin, are alive and very healthy. Who and when will build them on Red Square and say: "They destroyed the country." Or at least in the textbooks he will write about them what they "rightfully deserve". And then in the new history textbooks again blah-blah-blah about "bloody gebnya, Stalin the executioner, Brezhnev-stagnation, Democracy-hurray !, Liberalism-finally nishtyak !, Human values ​​- Forever!" What did the GDP say about a single textbook? Nate - get it, sign it. Grant-eaters of Grantoids pushed their libel again ...

[Foreman49]

Of course, the ELECTOR is to blame for listening to Putin’s stories for 13 years.

[Zoldat_A]

Quote: Foreman49

to blame VOTER listening to Putin's stories xnumx years

Each decision made by TAM has a name, surname and position. Here is a list of them in the studio! And not an abstract "voter" deceived in his hopes.

[Foreman49]

I’m clarifying the President of the Russian Federation Putin and his gaydariki!

[Foreman49]

Moreover, war is an integral process of human civilization, and our ally is ONE of our Army and Navy, but the Kremlin’s idiots forgot the ancestral covenants!

[maai]

Quote: Zoldat_A

Who gave the order to stop the production of these beautiful “birds?” Who is to blame for the fact that there are no engines? Who is to blame for

This is a complex issue. Parts, metals, etc. do not grow on trees. It all starts in the kitchen! And rots from the head.

[forester]

Quote: Enot-poloskun

I'm afraid the decision to resume production of the Tu-160 is associated with high military danger.

Not until PAK YES ...

It's simple - if you want peace, prepare for war

[maai]

With such neighbors - this is the only way to exist.

[da Vinci]

No commercial interests justify equipping a potential enemy with means of delivering military satellites into orbit (the same thing - before the Second World War to supply Hitler with strategic raw materials for fear of "spoiling a good attitude")

[lidiy]

We supplied Hitler with strategic raw materials not for "thanks". During the Soviet era, this was not accepted.

February 11, 1940 in Moscow, the signing of an economic agreement between the USSR and Germany. It stipulated that the Soviet Union would supply Germany with goods worth 420-430 million German marks in 12 months, that is, until February 11, 1941. Germany was obliged to supply the USSR with military materials and industrial equipment for the same amount in 15 months, that is, before May 11, 1941.
During the “blitzkrieg”, Germany quickly consumed all the petroleum products received from the USSR, ate the food they received, and could not achieve victory. On the contrary, the USSR used German machine tools and other factory equipment during all four years of the war.
German deliveries under an economic agreement were received in the total amount of 287 million German marks. An impressive number of metal-cutting machines received from Germany in 1940-1941 was 6430. For comparison, and thereby assessing the value of these supplies, it can be noted that in 1939 the total number of machine tools imported by the Soviet Union from all countries amounted to 3458, with its own production of 58 thousand pieces.

Samples of the latest German weapons, purchased in 1940-1941, made it possible to evaluate their capabilities and a number of technical solutions used in them were used by Soviet engineers in domestic military equipment. A significant role in the development of Soviet industry, including defense, was played by purchases in Germany of machine tools and other factory equipment.
Purchased materials, goods, products, factory equipment and weapons samples contributed to the strengthening of the defense and industrial power of the USSR.
The USSR received from Germany hundreds of types of the latest models of military equipment and industrial products. 35 aircraft samples, propellers and piston rings for aircraft engines, taximeters, altimeters, speed recorders, oxygen supply systems at high altitudes, dual aerial cameras, instruments for determining the loads on aircraft control, radio direction finders, aircraft radio stations with an intercom, blind landing devices were obtained and other devices for aircraft, aircraft batteries, stands for testing engines, riveting machines, bomber trailers, sets of high-explosive, high-explosive and high-fragmentation bombs, 50 types of test equipment and many other products for the aviation industry.
And a lot more. Who cares, read:

https://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Германо-советское_торговое_соглашение_(1939)

[MrK]

Actually, on 22 on June 1941, the USSR delivered raw materials worth Germany’s 637,9 million marks to Germany, and Germany supplied equipment worth a total of 599,1 million marks to the USSR, including 81,5 million military orders.

[your1970]

in the Urals, before the 80's, a rolling mill (piece!) received for raw materials worked, rolled armored plates - tanks from which they destroyed the Wehrmacht ...

[da Vinci]

Or another option is to sell engines, but instead buy the most advanced equipment for the production of our own high-tech equipment (microelectronics, CNC machines, etc.), but to warn domestic eeffeeeeekktivny managers about responsibility for both the purchase of trash and for the “efficient” use ...

[maai]

It’s a pity you’re not working in Gazprom, you would have gasified all of Russia long ago.

[kuz363]

And how will the manager check whether a "bug" or a similar byaka is sewn into a foreign CHIP? Which will refuse to work after a certain period or at a given time? So you only have to do responsible things.

[maai]

You know, we want to eat at the factory, but you don’t buy engines from us. There is no sponsorship from you, deductions for telecommunications, communications, glonas, etc. etc. we don’t see or the cat cried. I’m your engines, you’re my zero, but what is it to live on?
BUY IT! BUY IT! BUY IT!
... give Christ for the sake of a high-precision vacuum spraying machine ...

[Nick]

Quote: Kalinov Most

Quote: sergey261180

How is it justified?

By commercial interest, naturally.
Like, however, almost everything (well, except for the struggle for their own eternal rule), which the leadership does.

If only the interests coincided with the interests of Russia.

[opus]

Quote: Kalinov Most

By commercial interest, naturally.

? What interest?

There is 18 LPRE x 15 (20 million $) = 270 000 000 $ you can survive (compensate from the budget)
What is 270 ppm USA?
1.Recently reassigned to the post of head of Russian Railways, Vladimir Yakunin sent the president a forecast of the financial indicators of the monopoly for the current and 2015 years. According to his calculations, if you leave everything as it is, the company will end the 2014 year with a loss of 83,8 billion rubles, according to the results of the 2015 year RZD’s net loss could amount to 99,4 billion. Moreover, the company's debt in the next year will reach 900 billion rubles.
in 2015 year Russian Railways will need additional 45 billion rublesstate injections ..
http://polit.ru/media/photolib/2014/07/15/thumbs/yakunin_1405421381.jpg.600x450_
q85.jpg
?
Vladimir Yakunin talked about a possible purchase of Greek railways last week (currently, Greek railways have debts of about 800 million euros)
2. "Workhorses" that allow the Russian space industry to earn 700 – 800 million dollars per yearAre the Proton and Soyuz launch vehicles developed in the Soviet Union

3. About 1 trillion rubles are stolen annually from budget funds allocated for public procurement in Russia / Theft from public procurement reaches 1 / 14 of the country's budget, Stepashin said

[yehat]

Quote: Kalinov Most

Quote: sergey261180

How is it justified?

By commercial interest, naturally.

justified by the lack of our own program requiring similar engines

[maai]

The fact that we make money for our product.

Do not be naive to think that if you sell something, they can simply disassemble and copy it. Thus, the technology is allegedly "presented" to the enemy. Even an ordinary AK assault rifle copied by the Chinese is not equivalent to our reference model. And jet engines are far from automatic.
A banal example: we purchase oil production equipment for currency and haven’t set up something for our production yet.

PS Or what bothers you about selling am rocket engines? Just the fact? This is silly. We make money on our product. This is how it works.

[DRA-88]

Quote: Author

By 2020 year in the Russian Air Force will be 20 Tu-95MSMcapable of carrying the same new strategic cruise missiles X-101/102 in an amount of up to 6 pieces.

Yeah, a little more prank and the plane will meet its 100th anniversary !!!

Quote: Author

So, is it good or bad - we are witnessing patching of holes that arose as a result of a complete decline in that part of the domestic aircraft industry that is responsible for the construction of bomber aircraft

And in what area of ​​aircraft construction is there a "concept from the knees"?

Quote: Author

As for the rest, it will be unequivocally uneasy, however, all the documentation is in place - the key point is the investment in machine tools and other equipment necessary for production.

And where did you find domestic machine tool industry?
The production of the means of production was finally destroyed, just over the past 16 years.

Quote: Author

In this case, the cost of the production program for 20 new Tu-160Ms will be at least $ 5 billion, and possibly more.

For many "our" governors to finance such a project is a snap

Conclusion from the article: the existing state model is completely incapable of implementing aviation and other large-scale projects. All attempts by the state are reminiscent of assembling Russobalts in handicraft workshops at the beginning of the century. Endless empty chatter of presidents, prime ministers, deputy prime ministers about modernizations, innovations, replacements, breakthroughs, etc. - no more than pshyyk! To this chatter For 16 years, a large-scale de-industrialization of the country has been carried out!
What can we say about high-tech industries, when even the "pipe" and "mine" are the breadwinners of the current government, the industry cannot provide its own equipment. Therefore, there are not even scanty reasons to believe in a new industrialization, in a breakthrough and an economic-production miracle ...

[Rus2012]

Quote: DRA-88

Conclusion from the article: the existing state model is completely incapable of implementing aviation and other large-scale projects. All attempts by the state are reminiscent of assembling Russobalts in handicraft workshops at the beginning of the century. Endless empty chatter of presidents, prime ministers, deputy prime ministers about modernizations, innovations, replacements, breakthroughs, etc. - no more than pshyyk! To this chatter For 16 years, a large-scale de-industrialization of the country has been carried out!
What can we say about high-tech industries, when even the "pipe" and "mine" are the breadwinners of the current government, the industry cannot provide its own equipment. Therefore, there are not even scanty reasons to believe in a new industrialization, in a breakthrough and an economic-production miracle ...

... well, I agree with many things.
But at the same time, who will guarantee that the "existing state model" will remain so forever? :)
Ahead is a change of force majeure from a series of "tectonic shifts in global transformation", which, already with the naked eye, will lead to state monopolies and state plans in strategic industries such as defense, space, mining ...

As for the "new industrialization" - yes, it may be required ... moreover, it goes. But it will be completely different than in 30-50xx.
Much will be done at the "world factory of the 21st century", i.e. in China. Already the contours are visible:
- long-range wide-body airliners (and why not bombers, in any case gliders? :)
- elements of orbital stations, lunar modules :)))
...
- let's say the same machine park ...

Everything goes to that! The Union is growing stronger, becoming vital between countries of non-European civilization, and on other foundations (fair, equitable and humane).

By the way, this summer there will be naval maneuvers of the Russian Navy and China ... in the Mediterranean!
As they say, a frank "hint" or "warning", as you like, understand it! :))))
The world is changing before our eyes ...

[Wheel]

Quote: Rus2012

Ahead is a change of force majeure from a series of "tectonic shifts in global transformation", which, already with the naked eye, will lead to state monopolies and state plans in strategic industries such as defense, space, mining ...

Looks like your eye is completely naked, I'm sorry.
Our state has one unshakable monopoly: to sell everything that is possible.
Nobody has canceled plans for further privatization, on the contrary, it has repeatedly been confirmed at the highest level that these plans will be implemented.

Quote: Rus2012

As for the "new industrialization" - yes, it may be required ... moreover, it goes. But it will be completely different than in 30-50xx.
Much will be done at the "world factory of the 21st century", i.e. in China. Already the contours are visible:
- long-range wide-body airliners (and why not bombers, in any case gliders? :)
- elements of orbital stations, lunar modules :)))
...
- let's say the same machine park ...

Everything goes to that! The Union is growing stronger, becoming vital between countries of non-European civilization, and on other foundations (fair, equitable and humane).

Great is your thought!
It did not work to become a full-fledged colony of the West, we will be a colony of China!

Quote: Rus2012

The world is changing before our eyes ...

In whose favor, by and large?

[Rus2012]

Quote: Wheel

In whose favor, by and large?

... to ours!
Otherwise, why the hell to live ?!

[shamil]

That's right! We will be friends with everyone who helps us, we only need to observe the measure so as not to be deceived. But in truth, not everyone can trust us (the country of Russia), both during imperial Russia and during the USSR, and modern Russia has repeatedly changed its behavior on the world stage. And on the topic of the article, great news. It is necessary to ensure the safety of proven technology. Especially since state aircraft are even older in design and construction. With the finished development drawings, a new generation of engineers and workers will be brought up, which is perhaps even more important.

[Rus2012]

Quote: Rus2012

Quote: Wheel
In whose favor, by and large?
... to ours!
Otherwise, why the hell to live ?!

... a detachment of Russophobes = "minus throwers" = 5columns for the content of 3,14nd the day arrives at the VO?

[Rus2012]

Quote: Wheel

Our state has one unshakable monopoly: to sell everything that is possible.

... yours, maybe!
In ours - everything is worked out backward, wringing it off from recent invaders ...

[Kalinov Bridge]

Quote: Rus2012

In ours - everything is worked out backward, wringing it off from recent invaders ...

Could it be more specific that they have squeezed out recent privatizers? Yukos and .... everything? Not a lot ... Yes, and you can not call HODOR RECENT privatizer.
On the contrary, the place of the LONG privatizers was taken NOT by long ago. Or have you heard of the second wave of privatization?
Yes, and MAIN privatization - PRIVATIZATION of power is not such a long-standing action - you can’t shove it into the 90s

[Rus2012]

Quote: Kalinov Most

recent privatizers

Bashneft, the Central Bank - this is only from what is heard out loud.
Acres of this, most defense enterprises ...

[one]

Quote: Rus2012

Quote: Wheel

Ours - everything is worked out backwards

sorry ... but "in the ass" is written separately.

what are you hinting at?

[Samurai3X]

Well, most "potreotofs" can only bleat what kind of power is bad and do absolutely nothing, sitting on the priest exactly. Doesn't it remind anyone?
Can you tell us again about the "Vlasov" flag and the counter-revolution? And then my mood in the morning is so-so. I want to neigh over another pearl of the court jester

[Xergey]

You’re just a pessimist, Moscow wasn’t built right away either, and even more so now is a turning point or we’ll bend with 40-50 swans, or we will wait until we develop and launch PAKs but bend and dodge without anything behind.

[one]

Quote: KSergey

You’re just a pessimist, Moscow wasn’t built right away either, and even more so now is a turning point or we’ll bend with 40-50 swans, or we will wait until we develop and launch PAKs but bend and dodge without anything behind.

for a start, it would be good, so as not to "bend", to learn to grow potatoes and carrots ourselves.
media communication - 800 tons of potatoes from BANGLADESH were rejected at customs !!! and before it was another 1200 tons.
some bugs there ...
comments needed?

[Saburov]

You are too pessimistic, the TU-95 strategist is a well-developed, versatile and reliable machine and it does not matter how old she is, look at the same B-52, that I don’t hear what the US is trying to write off or replace it with irons (with the same aerodynamics) type B-2, and given its duralumin-aluminum glider, with proper care, it will last 200 for years, the same with the TU-160, the machine is fast and unique in its characteristics and is specially designed for missile weapons (I think you will agree that in the USSR, designers and creators of the doctrine of application YES weren’t fools), but the production of TU-160 is technically a very difficult task and they are trying to solve it now, which is basically right. As for machine-tool construction in Russia, you are absolutely not aware and you probably never were interested in this topic, it exists, though not on such a scale and it works mainly for the defense industry, as our private enterprises prefer to buy machine tools in China for a couple of cents and repair there. Over the past two decades, the production of machine tools in Russia has decreased by almost 20 times: from 70 to 3 thousands, which are produced only about 100 enterprises. According to experts, the number of operating machines in the country is estimated from 900 thousand to 1,5 million pieces. Of these, about 50 thousand are decommissioned annually. The total deterioration (moral and physical) of the equipment reached 80%. China holds the world lead in machine tools by a wide margin. Germany, Italy, South Korea and Taiwan follow it in dense formation. The USA occupies the 7 place, Russia is only the 21-e. But do not forget that our enterprises can increase production by quantity, only order is needed, the Russian machine tool industry has not left the global arena of competition and is working in innovative directions. Experts see the most promising way for the development of domestic enterprises manufacturing modern equipment: transformation into assembly plants with the machining of only the defining parts of assemblies and the know-how in design developments.
So, in terms of quality and manufacturability, developments of JSC Sterlitamak Machine-Tool Plant (universal machines for complex processing) are approaching world standards; Ryazan Machine Tool Plant OJSC SASTA (development of precision turning equipment; production of high-precision CNC machines and an operational control system with rolling guides.)
Machine-tool plants introduce innovative innovations, use the modular principle, computer-aided design, and update their product lines, which are in high demand among consumers.
Significant backlogs for the production of complex types of machine-tool products are available at a number of domestic plants. For example, multioperational machining centers and flexible production modules are created and mastered at the already mentioned Sterlitamak Machine Tool Plant and Savelovsky Machine Plant, the Krasny Proletariy, Sasta, RSZ, Sedin, IZTS factories. Modern internal grinding machines and circular grinding precision machines are produced at the Vladimir Techneka machine tool plant, CNC gear processing machines are produced at the Saratov and Ryazan machine tool plants.
OJSC Ivanovo Heavy Machine Tool Plant, one of the largest machine-building enterprises for the production of high-tech and high-tech equipment, produces and offers for sale high-precision horizontal boring machines, machining centers with table lifting capacity up to 25 tons.
Among the latest developments of the Kirov-Stankomash plant are gear-shaping semiautomatic devices, gear-cutting semiautomatic machines.

[Saburov]

Well, as for industrialization, you are again wrong again; only in December 2014 more than 40 new productions were opened http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/12561/ or, for example, in April 2015 http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/61627/ I would He said very well, just at the moment, a policy of silence is better than shouting at all angles that we are carrying out industrialization of the country, let them think that everything is bad with us, generally ask why our media are silent about opening new plants and workshops.

[one]

Quote: Saburov

... at the moment, a policy of silence is better than shouting at all angles that we are conducting the industrialization of the country, let them think that everything is bad with us ...

and for complete disinformation of a potential adversary - to dress the whole country with tattered pants, galoshes and write all shit with mistakes.

[gjv]

The Ural-Instrument-Pumori company (Perm, a member of the Pumori Ural Machine-Building Corporation) has launched the first Russian-Indian machining center, the Center for W&P VF400.

The machine passed all the necessary tests and meets all the requirements for equipment manufactured in the territory of the Russian Federation, which is confirmed by a certificate of conformity.
The manufacture of machine tools in Russia using components made in Russia made it possible to reduce the cost of the machine, thus creating competition for imported equipment, which is important in the light of the current situation.
In 2015, it is planned to manufacture a CNC processing center - “Center UiP VF-450/1000”, as well as other models with a total number of at least 20 pieces. In the future, the creation of an assembly center in Perm. The implementation of this project is possible only with the localization of production, which implies the creation of new jobs in the Perm Territory and placing orders for components from local manufacturers.

[Saburov]

At the moment, Russia produces about 5-6 thousand different machine tools per year at all enterprises, and what can not but rejoice, is that volumes are gradually growing, and with the introduction of unified management and programs for machine tool builders, volumes can increase to 20-25 thousand machines in year.

[Nirvanko]

Similar news: http://mother-russia.org/blog/production/1460.html

[gjv]

On April 23, 2015, CJSC "MCST" and PJSC "INEUM named after I.S. Brook" (Moscow) announced that they were replenishing the range of products with new models of computing systems: a personal computer AWP Elbrus-401 and a server Elbrus-4.4, and that for experienced samples of these systems are open for orders by e-mail and telephone. Contacts can be found on the official website of CJSC "MCST". Orders are accepted only from legal entities.

[FID]

Quote: gjv

new models of computer systems

The processors themselves - yes, it’s impressive, I'm sorry, but the periphery: whose ADC and DAC are the company, or is it not visible in the picture?

[gjv]

Quote: SSI

and the periphery: ADC and DAC whose company, otherwise it is not visible in the picture?

It is "like" a regular PC. It does not have an ADC and a DAC normally, only if the board is plugged into the PCI Express bus. And Elbrusovsky there are two microcircuits - CPU 1891VM8Ya and south bridge KPI 1991VG1Ya (this is ioLVDS (duplex, up to 2 GB / s); PCI-Express 1.0a x 8; PCI 2.3 (32/64 bit, 33/66 MHz); Gigabit Ethernet (1 Gbit / s); USB 2.0 (2 channels); SATA 2.0 (4 devices); IDE (2 devices); AC-97 audio codec; RS-232 (2 channels); IEEE-1284; SPI and I2C; GPIO ( 16 signals, in a typical configuration 8); timers; interrupt controller.
The integrated DVI + VGA video interface is already imported Silicon Motion SM718. Support for 3D video cards are also of the AMD Radeon 6000 family. RAM, FLASH BIOS, SSD-drive, CompactFlash card - everything seems to be imported too. Logos can be seen dimly and tried to recognize, but did not find (it looks like something, but not a fact ).

[FID]

Quote: gjv

The integrated DVI + VGA video interface is already imported

You see, that is exactly what I had in mind. Yes, something is done in Zelenograd, but ... We are deeply behind, unfortunately, we are trying to catch up, but, you know, KRET recommends that its enterprises buy microelectronics from China ...

[gjv]

Quote: SSI

You see, that is exactly what I had in mind. Yes

Yes, I understand ... Amer's research and development program in the 80s was called Gallium Arsenide in Microelectronics. Soviet was called "Advanced technologies in microelectronics". Result...
Our engineers (probably they were not stupid and something "had a presentiment") went to the AS several times:
- Let's develop our microelectronics. There is a base, areas allow.
- What are you guys ?! This is another industry! There is a whole ministry. The state will not leave us!
And that's it ... Already in 1989, the "lousy" divider by 2 could not wait ...
And the braids at this time had a video processor up to 2 GHz with parallel analog and digital signal processing!
Now - "Father China"!Funny, but no laughing matter ...

[FID]

Quote: gjv

- Let's develop our microelectronics.

The question is who? Who will develop? You will call, I am ready to support ...

[gjv]

Yes, this is my "lament for the past youth" USSR, 80s. Even then, the "wise leaders" filled up factories.

Quote: SSI

The question is who? Who will develop? You will call

Today I don’t know. But in that article about KRET:

Four enterprises presented their technological solutions - “Electroautomatics to them. Efimova, Ulyanovsk Instrument Engineering Design Bureau, Tekhpribor and Radio Signal.

Is that also all - KRET Chinese? Something did not find them as part of KRET.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: gjv

And the braids at this time had a video processor up to 2 GHz with parallel analog and digital signal processing!

Where did you find 2 GHz in 1989?
The Cray SV1 (or Tera / Cray SV1) system has succeeded both the Cray J90, which was based on CMOS technology, and the Cray T90, based on ESL technology. The release of the system began in 1998.
Cray SV1 was rightly considered a new level of supercomputer in scalability and performance. The Cray SV1 processor has a peak performance of 4,8 GFLOPS. By scalability from a single processor, you can move to hundreds of processors with up to several trillion operations per second (TFLOPS) performance.
SV1 core processors have two vector pipelines, each of which can perform two floating point operations per cycle. At a clock frequency of 250 MHz, this gives a performance of 1 GFLOPS, i.e. five times higher than that of a 100-MHz Cray J90. In 1999, a version of Cray SV1 with a 300-MHz processor appeared, the performance of which reached already 1,2 GFLOPS.

[gjv]

Quote: Pilat2009

Where did you find 2 GHz in 1989?Cray SV1 System

So is multistreaming and a cluster of 32 nodes (GigaRing, HIPPI, FDDI, ATM, Ethernet and the ability to connect SCSI devices) . It - Digital computer (well, also Kosovo).
Regarding the same GPU up to 2 GHz with parallel analog and digital signal processing - years have passed, I don’t remember the names. If you're really interested, re-read Electronics Design, A Penton Publication for 1988 - 1992. Keywords: system on a chip, delta-sigma ADC, delta-sigma modulator with oversampling, CCD for video signals, gallium arsenide multiplier, Hilbert element, UVC, DAC, PWM signal, well, video processor and ... GHz.

[Zuborez]

Quote: gjv

Center UiP VF-450/1000

I looked in tyrnet. Indian bed, Siemens stand,bought in Russia. Although Leningrad makes CNC systems, they are not bad either. Whose spindle is unclear, but hardly domestic. And 6000 rpm is not comme il faut at the present time. The type of certification for all kinds of electrical compatibility is modestly silent about the accuracy class.
This is a screwdriver assembly in order to avoid taxes IMHO.

[gjv]

Quote: ZuboreZ

Siemens stand bought in Russia

Just the news added. Himself in the machines is not very strong (16K20, etc. - ). There are also all sorts of pipe benders, listogibs, end faceting. threading. Siemens himself "sinned". And what are you doing? M. b. suggest to Sergey Ivanovich, and he will be able to advise where to promote your machines.

[Vadim237]

The Tu 95 is of course a reliable machine, but after ten years all of these aircraft will have exhausted their engine life, and the NK 12 engines will no longer be made and the aircraft will be decommissioned.

[prosto_rgb]

Quote: Vadim237

The Tu 95 is of course a reliable machine, but after ten years all of these aircraft will have exhausted their engine life, and the NK 12 engines will no longer be made and the aircraft will be decommissioned.

And what prevents to resume the release of NK12 now?
60 years ago they could do it !!!
And without any computers, "Internet", CNC machines, many coordinate machining centers ...

[Samurai3X]

Useless. How much I looked through the forums over the next six months, from this particular whiner is always the same.
"Everything is lost, everything is plundered, the defense industry is in the w * ne, Sochi is cut and does not work, Putin is a ghoul, nothing is being done, etc."

In general, he is no different from the liberals, except that he mows down under the communists and spews out the next "But it was better before."

[gjv]

Quote: Saburov

TU-95 strategist is a well-developed, versatile and reliable machine and it does not matter how old she is

Tu-95MSM, capable of carrying the same new strategic cruise missiles X-101/102 in an amount of up to 6 pieces.

New strategic cruise missiles X-101/102 - up to 8 rockets on external sling + 6 X-55 on the fuselage launcher.

Photo of the Tu-95MS strategic combat bomber (b / n “red 10”, reg. Number RF-94128, name “Saratov”) of the Russian Air Force, equipped during modernization with new four double external suspension units for deploying a new type of strategic air-launched cruise missiles .

[FID]

Quote: gjv

(b / n “red 10”, reg. number RF-94128, name “Saratov”) Russian Air Force

I apologize, not the TITLE, but the NAME. Aircraft NAME wear ...

[gjv]

Sergey, in the case of Tu-160 agrees 100%!
In the case of the Tu-95, as well as with submarines carrying names cities, the word "name" is often used. This is a "grammatical" phenomenon, IMHO you can't figure it out without "half a can" and a small fight. Do you need it? Seems to me not a topic for dispute.
The opinion on the resource of the Tu-95 and Tu-160 glider will be more interesting.
Yes, and about the underwing nodes of the X-101 missiles on the Tu-95, too.

[FID]

Quote: gjv

The opinion on the resource of the Tu-95 and Tu-160 glider will be more interesting.

On the fly, the resource of gliders is about 50-000 hours, but there is still a resource for landings. After the "departure" of the resource, the plane can still fly, but after the development of landings - most often not.

[Ruslan67]

Quote: SSI

After the "departure" of the resource, the plane can still fly, but after the development of landings - most often not.

But what about the mantra: But you are a Communist!
hello, Sergey I have not seen you for a hundred years

[FID]

Quote: Ruslan67

I have not seen you for a hundred years

Over the past six months, 4 months (full) on business trips was ... And the mantra - it is always strong ...

[Ruslan67]

Hopefully productive?

[FID]

Quote: Ruslan67

Hopefully productive?

Business trips? In Kiev, it’s bad, high power does not allow Ukrainians to work with us, but in Russia - yes, not bad.

[Ruslan67]

Quote: SSI

In Kiev, bad, high power does not allow Ukrainians to work

There for what bolt on 23 skidded !?

[FID]

Quote: Ruslan67

There, behind which bolt 23 skidded!

An-148 ... It's still their intellectual ...

[Ruslan67]

Quote: SSI

An-148 ..

Is there anything else alive? Or just to clean up the remnants and honor the memory?

Quote: SSI

It's still their intellectual ...

We will not specify what ...

[FID]

Quote: Ruslan67

Is there anything else alive? Or just to clean up the remnants and honor the memory?

Well, VASO is letting them out so far, and they are flying with our friends on the island ...

[Ruslan67]

Quote: SSI

Yes, and with our friends on the island they fly ...

This makes me happy
But what about the situation and attitude? You can throw in a personal

[ancient]

Quote: gjv

The opinion on the resource of the Tu-95 glider will be more interesting

And is it not interesting to think of a significant increase in drag coefficient due to the presence of rockets on the external load?

On the Tu-160 I will not be at all.

1. This is nonsense, but not an article ..... take a good look at the interview with Shoigu -... "to analyze the possibility of producing 2 missile carriers from among the available ... fittings."
Everything else ... nonsense, well, or "uryapatriotic frenzy" from our "air specials from the media" (including ... from the "official"

2. Specific consumption of NK-32 at cruising mode) 0.7, and at supersonic 1.70 .... where are the hell figs and how far is the Tu-160?
This is not for you, but for the Air Force reserve lieutenant ... whose Tu-160 flies at 2600, although the maximum is much lower, and is it seriously limited by the glider's resource?
so before "running away" from fighters, let him take and calculate the hourly consumption and how many kilometers he can fly in this mode (and then ... the fighter will run out of fuel, and we ... Lala-poplar ... so the fighter will reach the point of interception and ... will turn around home. and here you are ... with rusty tanks where will you unfold?

3. Nobody forgot (it's easier not to know) that Tu-160 ... is a 13 meters titanium welded caesoon, so that to start "producing" it, there is NOT ANYTHING ... not even an institute that dealt with the technology of this process.

4. Kazan has never made any wings. Not a nacelle. Not a tail.

Well, etc., etc.

Dear forum users .. do not turn the Site into a VO ... into a "Spring Balagan" (like .. a spring aggravation ), yellow press level

Although the desire of the Site Owner .. this is the Law .. you cannot argue here .. or you "play" according to the rules of the "official media" .. or you go .. "smoke"

[FID]

Quote: ancient

Dear forum users .. do not turn the Site into a VO ... into a "Spring Balagan"

Alexander! Do not be nervous, get used to it. How much I had to go through, but nothing, I even scold the superjet. You have to feel right (I have been in aviation for more than 30 years, an autopilot, so to speak) and not really strain ...

[ancient]

Quote: SSI

Alexander! Do not be nervous, get used to it

Dear Sergey Ivanovich! But how can you not get nervous .. it is clear that EG and all sorts of "urya-propaganda", but not to the same degree.
Somewhere the other day I read that with YOU, some ... did not agree and began to "teach wits-reason" .... where are we going .... although ..... "Slerasar of the fifth category" does its job together with Manturov, and the "Great Mountain Merry Moldochnica", something was written off early, by the way .. in the photo in the article he is in full .. "is present"

[FID]

Quote: ancient

but not to the same extent.

The degree, sometimes rolls over, but hold on. The forum has a lot of smart, out of the blue ... people. When I'm not on business trips, I’m always ready to talk, with respect, SSI!

[prosto_rgb]

Quote: ancient

3. Nobody forgot (it's easier not to know) that Tu-160 ... is a 13 meters titanium welded caesoon, so that to start "producing" it, there is NOT ANYTHING ... not even an institute that dealt with the technology of this process.

Please explain in more detail about the production technology of these nodes. Or at least a reference to some sort of material on the topic.
I am curious.
Unfortunately, I am absolutely not familiar with the features of the production technology of the Tu 160.

[ancient]

Quote: prosto_rgb

Please explain in more detail about the production technology of these nodes

For this car ... product 70 all questions to Dear Sergei Ivanovich (SSI), he was her "dear father" and nursed her starting from the GC Stage and ... until she "finished"
Best regards,

[FID]

Quote: ancient

For this car ... product 70 all questions to Dear Sergei Ivanovich (SSI), he is her "dear father"

Well, only about the ACS, and not about the airframe and motors ... And the "native father" was the USSR, with all the design bureaus, I was just a participant in lifting this machine and launching it into series ...

[ancient]

Quote: SSI

Well, only about the ACS, and not about the airframe and motors ... And the "native father" was the USSR, with all the design bureaus, I was just a participant in lifting this machine and launching it into series ...

Don't be shy, dear Sergei Ivanovich! It was only before. Yes, and in the songs ... "about the heart and the fiery motor", but what will happen now with this glider and motors without ACS, ABSU, SDU, KSU, ESDU, etc.

[gjv]

Quote: prosto_rgb

Please explain in more detail about the production technology of these nodes. Or at least a reference to some sort of material on the topic.

The "Russian militarists" have a little
http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-262.html
Ask Sergey Ivanovich for details.

[FID]

Quote: prosto_rgb

regarding the production technology of these nodes.

The center section is the main power part of the airframe; at item 70, it was welded from titanium billets. The welding technology was developed at VIAM. Welding in an argon atmosphere in a special chamber ... In principle, it was CCC (such a neck).

[prosto_rgb]

Quote: SSI

Quote: prosto_rgb

regarding the production technology of these nodes.

The center section is the main power part of the airframe; at item 70, it was welded from titanium billets. The welding technology was developed at VIAM. Welding in an argon atmosphere in a special chamber ... In principle, it was CCC (such a neck).

Thanks to everyone who responded to my question.
Sergey Ivanovich, resolve the question ?!
In your opinion, is it realistic to revive the production of Tu 160 with "0" now, and not from the blanks left over from the good old days (USSR)?
Just in my humble opinion, it is in Russia that the most developed, advanced technologies for working with titanium, both theoretically and practically, and if something is lost can be relatively quickly re-created / (recreated).
PS
Sergey Ivanovich - I express to you my deepest respect and respect
Chatting with you is ... Very cool !!

[FID]

Quote: prosto_rgb

In your opinion, it is now realistic to revive the release of Tu 160 with "0"

There are no people, there are simply no workers, it’s not fashionable now ... The manager of the trading floor - yes, but the riveter - no. Who will hunch over two shifts, for what? I do not see yet the possibility of restoring the production of Tu-160 ...

[Rus2012]

Quote: SSI

The manager of the trading floor - yes, but the riveter - no.

Yes, riveter, THIS IS IT!

For the first time, he came across a riveter in Tashkent at an aircraft factory ...
As a rule, they work in pairs - one on the one hand, the other on the back of the connected glider sheet parts. The noise from the air guns is hellish. Put mufflers headphones. But you need to talk with a partner.
That is why those couples who understand each other from a half-view to a half-gesture were especially valued. The average age is about 40. Before retirement, I think, hardly anyone was able to resist, yet the profession requires agility-flexibility of the body and other special skills ...
The authorities were treated with particular disgust, they also did not differ in understanding, but circumstances demanded - they had to pay 400-500 rubles at that time. per month, otherwise problems in finding professionals. The workers were mainly "recruited" from the villages of Ukraine, less often from Russia ...

Of course, we must think that the volume of riveted joints on modern aircraft has been significantly reduced. Due to the huge unit panels, composite, other technical operations of the joint - welding, gluing. But, nevertheless, the final riveting is unlikely to completely go away ... For a very reliable, simple and universal way to connect.
Over the hill, geyropah-3,14indosno, I think. migrants work - Mexicans, Colombians, Czechs, Poles, Yugoslavs, Turks and others like them ...
We could also have our own migrants - Ukrainians ... Sev Koreans, Vietnamese, Chinese ... If our "recruited" no longer exists ...

[FID]

Quote: Rus2012

Of course, we must think that the volume of riveted joints on modern aircraft has been significantly reduced.

Here you are mistaken. A number of rivets stop the development of cracks, so rivets cannot be avoided. And as for composites - this is the question ...

[Zuborez]

Quote: SSI

And as for composites - this is the question ...

And dancing with the T50 is an indicator. But it seems like we’ve thought better of it, and we’ve bought m / r machines. We’ll see at MAX.

[clearance]

Here is a book about the Tu-160
http://filecloud.me/n17iydd0t2vg.html

[Zuborez]

Quote: Saburov

Machine-tool plants introduce innovative innovations

A lot of fiction. Some factories no longer physically exist. "Red Proletarian" for example. Saratov Heavy Gear Cutting Machine Plant merged with Saratov Aviation. Deripaska left some corner from the flea market for them. But machines for the manufacture of hypoid gear wheels (as in differentials m) only two firms in the world produced: "Glisson" and the Saratov plant. Now one is left.
In general, at the end of May the exhibition will be there and look at the achievements of domestic machine tool builders.

[Foreman49]

The ergonomics of these monsters are from the last century. Therefore, we can talk about THEIR efficiency only in the framework of the understanding that Putin's "effective managers" are not able to develop what is better than the Soviet one!

[Petrik66]

And what can you offer? Well besides throwing all the shit?

[FID]

Quote: Petrik66

And what can you offer? Well besides throwing all the shit?

Sorry, if you hit, did not want to. And to whom to offer? You? What can you do?

[gjv]

Quote: SSI

And what can you offer? Well besides throwing all the shit?

Quote: SSI

Sorry, if you hit, did not want to. And to whom to offer? You? What can you do?

Sergey, this is he Vladlena DRA-88 I asked.

[FID]

Quote: gjv

Sergey, this is he Vladlena DRA-88 asked.

I'm sorry, it seemed to me ...

[adept666]

The production of the means of production was finally destroyed, just over the past 16 years.

http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/?search=%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%81%D
1%82%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5

[Rus2012]

Quote: mabuta

The decision to resume production of Tu-160 somehow overlaps with the same decision on B-1В.

Tu-95 bomber, nicknamed the "Bear" in the West, and manufactured since 1955 of the year!

at the same time, the aircraft produced no later than 80xx were in service. We have older Tu95 bred.

About -

20-istels-bombers B-2 Spirit

it is not true! They are in service no more than 17-18ti.
B1B - in no way will it be able to withstand either the Tu95 or Tu160, because it is not able to carry long-range without redesigning and rebuilding the airframe - the dimensions of the inside fuselages do not allow it.
And on external pylons - cruising speed must be reduced to M = 0,8 so as not to spoil the suspended KR

[Throw]

"New, old, patching holes .."
Do not forget, 160 is a shock COMPLEX, and no less important is the glider - that it carries with what avionics and sighting systems. And this can be upgraded / set new for a long time.

[sent-onere]

After the well-known events, when the prospect of strategic aviation of the former Soviet Union became obvious, the production of aircraft engines must continue to increase and at the same time restart the assembly of the Tu-160 under the letter M. Despite the difficulties, the issue must be resolved. For the simple reason that Russia clearly lacks White Swans in view of its role in the world and the international situation. 16 units is not just a little, it is practically nothing. Taking into account many factors, the value "160" is clearly underestimated. But they are not only the most flexible element of the nuclear triad, but also a very convenient platform for the implementation of the concept of a "global strike", as well as the deployment of promising weapons, including hypersonic, beam, and electromagnetic weapons. Possessing unique characteristics and enormous modernization potential, the "swans" will serve Russia for more than one decade, and most likely will meet the second half of the XNUMXst century in combat formation. Taking these considerations into account, the resumption of their production looks advisable, and the current number is not sufficient. In short, the "white hundred" would not hurt us ...)

[Wheel]

Quote: sent-onere

but also a very convenient platform for implementing the concept of "global strike"

Not everything is clean with this concept, you know.
It was smooth on paper, but forgot about the ravines.
It is enough to impartially look, count, analyze and it turns out that this is a bluff, similar to SDI.

[Throw]

Where to look? Texture?
And the "ravine" is still one for all - the creation of a long-range hypersonic missile system with a powerful warhead. This is the shock component of the 160/95/22 complexes ..

[prosto_rgb]

Quote: mabuta

Tu-160: the resumption of construction of "White Swans" - patching holes?

These are fairy tales for young children, about patching holes.
The resumption of construction of the Tu-160 is absolutely necessary !!!
Here

Quote: mabuta

plans to start serial production of the new strategic bomber PAK DA in the mid-2020s

really in doubt?
Sense in PAK YES?
- hypersonic flight ?, it’s definitely unrealistic on today's technologies, for an object of this size, and whether the aircraft needs it, it’s easier to make a hypersonic missile.
- stealth? only for subsonic ones, and even then I doubt that if ours see their stealth, then what will prevent them? No one canceled the IR range and do not forget about satellites. They’ll see it anyway.
- I drank about money while developing, I’m generally silent (remember the super jet).

Over the past 25 years, progress in microelectronics and rocket technologies is such that even the Tu-95, with appropriate modernization, can cope with almost all tasks, they only fly slower than the Tu-160.
It is much better and more economical for the country to establish mass production of the Tu-160M, introducing modern technical solutions:
- radar with AFAR;
- modern jamming systems;
- BRONO on a modern elemental base;
- The introduction of composite materials in the design of the airframe (where possible);
- increase the efficiency of engines;
- The developers themselves know what to do ...
Here, for the soul:

[Basarev]

I've read a lot here about machines and here’s what I thought: what if we disown all machines as from the last century and completely switch to 3D printing? I agree, it is difficult to teach this printer to work with metal, but it is difficult - it does not mean impossible!

[prosto_rgb]

Quote: Basarev

I've read a lot here about machines and here’s what I thought: what if we disown all machines as from the last century and completely switch to 3D printing? I agree, it is difficult to teach this printer to work with metal, but it is difficult - it does not mean impossible!

They have already taught, even jet engines print and rail, but so far, these products are far from already developed technologies: price, reliability.
http://msiter.ru/news/vpervye-udalos-raspechatat-reaktivnyy-dvigatel-na-3d-print
Features
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtsRIYDFJQw
The entire plane has not yet been printed, although for certain units the use may be justified. Technologists should consider this question.

[Aleksiy]

We found the opportunity to invest in Abramovich, Deripaska, Chubais, on the TU-160 it is certainly more difficult.

[Kalinov Bridge]

Quote: Aleksiy

We found the opportunity to invest in Abramovich, Deripaska, Chubais, on the TU-160 it is certainly more difficult.

Well, after all, the Tu-160 will not unfasten at the request of various Wishlist authorities from the World Cup to the elections.

[VadimL]

PAK YES it is not yet known when it will appear, and strategic bombers are needed right now. So the decision to resume the release of the TU-160 is the most reasonable in such circumstances.

[NEXUS]

Quote: VadimL

PAK YES it is not yet known when it will appear, and strategic bombers are needed right now. So the decision to resume the release of the TU-160 is the most reasonable in such circumstances.

quite right ... we add to this the development of technologies and a platform for new solutions that will be used in subsequent "strategists".

[Kalinov Bridge]

Quote: NEXUS

... plus to this the accumulation of technology

What technology developments are we talking about? Tu-160 was created in the 70 - 80s of the last century. Manufacturing technology is even older.
Of course, you need to do something, but you don’t have to talk about any new technologies.

[sso-xnumx]

Quote: Kalinov Most

Manufacturing technology is even older.
Of course, you need to do something, but you don’t have to talk about any new technologies.

Absolutely right! New technologies will appear only with a new promising project capable of ensuring the fulfillment of a combat mission in the second half of the 21st century.

[Rus2012]

Quote: sso-250659

fulfillment of the combat mission in the second half of the 21 century.

and who can explain in what way this will be expressed?
I think no one!

For it is not known what the second half of the 21 century will be like.
One thing - the United States will remain in its greatness.
Other - there will be a different world, or the New World.

Based on this, there will be new tasks and requirements ...

[prosto_rgb]

Quote: sso-250659

Quote: Kalinov Most

Manufacturing technology is even older.
Of course, you need to do something, but you don’t have to talk about any new technologies.

Absolutely right! New technologies will appear only with a new promising project capable of ensuring the fulfillment of a combat mission in the second half of the 21st century.

Nobody forbids, now, to use modern technological equipment in the production of Tu 160.

You understand that the physics of flying in the atmosphere cannot be fooled.

By and large, the T-160 (product 4, or “weaving”) could fulfill the tasks of the Tu 100, although it was made generally in 1967-1972. But he was not launched into the series ...
So, talking about the ancient and obsolete Tu 160, to put it mildly, I do not inspire confidence.
Ritunok T-4
(taken here
http://topwar.ru/840-ubijca-avianoscev-tragicheskaya-istoriya-sotki-t-4.html)

[g1v2]

It was created, of course, 30 years ago, but now it is undergoing modernization, it is modernized. Well, the decision on pr-ve means that they will restore pr-in strategists with the subsequent transition to the release of the pack and when it is ready. But the site and facilities for him are being prepared in advance and while they will occupy the prospect of tu160m. Personnel will learn at the same time, prepare production capacities, etc.

[vladimir_krm]

In addition to iron, which suits in all respects, there is also on-board equipment, which will be completely updated. That's the technology. You will not believe it, but it costs the lion's share of the price of an airplane ...

[Zuborez]

Quote: vladimir_krm

it costs the lion's share of the price of the aircraft

This is during modernization. And in production, engines.

[NEXUS]

Quote: Kalinov Most

What technology developments are we talking about? Tu-160 was created in the 70 - 80s of the last century. Manufacturing technology is even older.

Yes? Then name at least one state that can build the same aircraft with the same performance characteristics today.

Quote: Kalinov Most

Of course, you need to do something, but you don’t have to talk about any new technologies.

Do you really think that everything has already been learned in this direction and therefore nothing has been investigated? Speaking about new technologies, I meant the development of PAK DA. I am convinced that there are new developments and solutions now.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: NEXUS

Then name at least one state that can build the same aircraft with the same performance characteristics today.

But do they need such? The basis of nuclear deterrence in England and France is submarines. You can build anything, remember Concordes

[NEXUS]

Quote: Pilat2009

Do they need these?

I'm not talking about what we need or not. But about the level at which nobody can repeat this even today.

Quote: Pilat2009

The basis of nuclear deterrence in England and France are submarines

and how much is this basis? And when was the last time the nuclear arsenal was modernized on these submarines?

Quote: Pilat2009

remember Concordes

you do not confuse. Concord was passenger and not military. And besides, with a lot of problems. By the way, Concord was created by the tandem of France-England countries, and not one state by the forces of only its aviation industry.

[Wheel]

Quote: NEXUS

By the way, Concordes were created by the tandem of France-England countries, and not one state by the forces of only its aviation industry.

Yes, we add that the Tu-144 was created by the forces of one country ...

[NEXUS]

Quote: Wheel

Yes, we add that the Tu-144 was created by the forces of one country ...

and we have TU-144, TU-160, T-4 (SOTKA) ... and this is all one country. This is another reason to be proud!

[FID]

Quote: NEXUS

..and this is all one country. This is another reason to be proud

Simply, you need to add the name of the country - the USSR!

[chikenous59]

Quote: NEXUS

Quote: Wheel

Yes, we add that the Tu-144 was created by the forces of one country ...

and we have TU-144, TU-160, T-4 (SOTKA) ... and this is all one country. This is another reason to be proud!

Well done, of course, but compare the size and population of the USSR and the two gay European countries!

[Pilat2009]

Quote: NEXUS

and how much is this basis? And when was the last time the nuclear arsenal was modernized on these submarines?

And what does the quantity have to do with it? Globally they are not going to measure their pussy, and for conflicts there is tactical nuclear weapons

[Pilat2009]

Quote: NEXUS

in which even today no one can repeat this.

The United States went through the creation of an orbital drone, for some time stretched out for junk and there will be a whole new level.

[NEXUS]

Quote: Pilat2009

The United States went through the creation of an orbital drone, for some time stretched out for junk and there will be a whole new level.

you "don’t shaggy here," dear. The USA tried to copy the TU-160 by making B-1. But they didn’t succeed. As well as the X-37B, an attempt to copy and modify the Russian development “Spiral”.
And will this leap, the big question.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: NEXUS

you "do not shaggy grandma here" dear

You, no less respected, leave your grandmother alone.
Countries have a different concept of using airplanes and nobody will blindly copy anything. The USA tried to create an airplane using Stealth technology,
without pursuit of speed. The concept of a low-altitude air defense breakthrough aircraft has been implemented, through the ability to fly at ultra-low altitudes with rounding the terrain. Do you have data on the visibility of aircraft in the radio range? Aircraft, unlike the TU-160, participated in hostilities. what we are cool "not worth a penny.
As for the X-37B, it flies slowly, unlike the Spiral

[NEXUS]

Quote: Pilat2009

The United States tried to create a stealth aircraft,
without chasing speed

Dear, I told you about the B-1 bomber! And what about the stealth technology?

Quote: Pilat2009

The United States tried to create a stealth aircraft,
without the pursuit of speed.

it’s you probably talking about B-2 Spirit. So the year of manufacture of the Swan and B-2 do not bother you? The stealth technology when the Swan was developed was not studied as in the construction of Spirit.
The TU-160 was sharpened to break through the adversary’s air defense, hence the supersonic sound, and the B-2 was sharpened to strike without entering the enemy’s air defense zone. Once, the B-1 was built as a bomber for a breakthrough.

Quote: Pilat2009

Do you have data on aircraft visibility in the radio range?

and you have them? You probably Pentagon e-mail throws info.

Quote: Pilat2009

All other screeching "how cool we are" are not worth a penny.

Squeal say ... hmm. I was touched by people like you. All this technique is American, stealth, UAV, Raptor, Zimvulfa and other wunderkraffle invented in the end with the thought that it will be used against the Russians. And, if tomorrow, some some B-1 flying over your house will start throwing off bombs, DON'T GIVE GOD, what then do you tell them about the concept to your children?

[Pilat2009]

Quote: NEXUS

it’s you probably talking about B-2 Spirit. So the year of manufacture of the Swan and B-2 do not bother you? The stealth technology when the Swan was developed was not studied as in the construction of Spirit.

No, not about Spirit. Nevertheless:
B-1B (100 cars produced)
Revised version B-1, with the use of radar stealth technology and a maximum speed of Mach 1,25.
http://topwar.ru/3617-bombardirovshhik-b-1b-lancer.html

Quote: NEXUS

DON'T GIVE GOD that you then about the concept tell them to your children?

We are now discussing specific aircraft. Who did whom he could and could or could not. You say that we are ahead of the rest. Will there be anything in essence?

[NEXUS]

Quote: Pilat2009

.You claim that we are ahead of the rest

in the construction and development of strategists, there are RUSSIAN "SOTKA" and "SWAN" THE WORLD'S BEST STRATEGIC BOMBERERS.

Quote: Pilat2009

However:
B-1B (100 cars produced)

But can you find out how many of them are in service and are actively used?

Quote: Pilat2009

Will there be anything essentially?

I tell you, dear, and I am essentially speaking. Compare the performance characteristics of Lancer, Cygnus and Spirit. As regards the concept of use, the carcass also has missiles that allow it not to enter the air defense coverage area of ​​the x-101 adversary and with the X-102.
And if your assessment rests only on a quantitative moment, then this is no longer a comparison of aircraft, but a comparison of the military arsenal of states.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: NEXUS

Compare TTX of Lancer, Swan and Spirit

I tell you about Thomas, you tell me about Erem
ok let's get the performance
V1V / TU-160
Speed ​​max 1 328/2230 km / h
Range with b load 12 000/12 000
Battle load 34 (+22) / 45
Ceiling 18 / 290
In formation 64/16

At the same time, the dimensions of the Tu-160 are decently larger, which means that the EPR is larger
Explain what is ours better and what Americans are weak.
Besides speed

[NEXUS]

Quote: Pilat2009

Explain what is ours better and what Americans are weak.

Speed, ceiling, cargo.

Quote: Pilat2009

Ceiling 18 / 290

in some sources, the figures are 15240 m for Lancer and 23000 m for Lebed.

Quote: Pilat2009

At the same time, the dimensions of the Tu-160 are decently larger, which means that the EPR is larger

you look like americans, you think that stealth technology is a panacea. I will disappoint you, absolute invisibility does not exist by definition. And the stealth that the Americans give their planes is not a problem for our air defense systems, fighters and interceptors, which has been practically proved more than once .And about active protection ... so the specialists from KRET, during the last modernization of TUShek, transparently explained that the newest electronic warfare systems were installed on Swans. I can assume that it was about such systems as VITEBSK, LEVER, HIMALAI, or the like systems and God knows what else, as you rightly noted, our bombers are more Amer (more spacious), which means there are more opportunities with modernization and line-up.

[Rus2012]

Quote: NEXUS

Speed, ceiling, cargo.

Plus, the range of weapons
В1В-free-falling bombs, corrective bombs, short-range missiles.
TU160-the whole nomenclature: from strategic KR to free-falling bombs!
Plus, the time spent continuously in the air -
B1B - approx. 8 hours
Tu160-day

B1B real TTX below declared -

Maximum flight speed at high altitude 1 330 km / h (M = 1,25); speed when overcoming air defense in flight at an altitude of 60 m - 965 km / h; practical ceiling 15 240 m;
high-altitude flight range 12 000 km;
- practical range with normal combat load at high altitude: without an additional fuel tank 9 600 km, with an additional fuel tank 10 400 km; practical range with a maximum combat load of 8700 km.

[gjv]

Quote: Rus2012

In B1B real performance characteristics are lower than declared - Maximum flight speed at high altitude 1 km / h (M = 330); speed when overcoming air defense in flight at an altitude of 1,25 m - 60 km / h; practical ceiling 965 m; ferry range at a high altitude of 15 km; - practical range with normal combat load at high altitude: without an additional fuel tank of 240 km, with an additional fuel tank of 12 km; practical range with a maximum combat load of 000 km.

Here's another "dokin" of the same real characteristics:
high speed flight - 1 km / h;
when overcoming air defense in flight near the ground - 1 km / h;
practical ceiling - 15 m;
Max. range with a combat load of 10 kg and with an additional fuel tank in the third bomb bay during flight along the optimal profile - 900 km;
the maximum range with the AGM-86B ALCM KR (8 on the internal suspension and 14 on the external) is 7200 km.

[saturn.mmm]

Quote: Pilat2009

Battle load 34 (+22) / 45

34 (+22) what is this? If instead of kerosene bombs hang or what? So if there are 12000 bombs?

[gjv]

Quote: Pilat2009

Revised version B-1, with the use of radar stealth technology and a maximum speed of Mach 1,25.

Information for consideration (B-1Borman):
The aircraft is designed using low-visibility technologies - in the centimeter wavelength range, its effective scattering surface is 1% (according to other sources, 3%, ie, from 1 to 3 sq. M) of that of the B-52N Stratofortress strategic bomber ...
The main directions of modernization of B-1B bombers are carried out within the framework of three key projects: FIDL (Fully Integrated Data Link), CITS (Central Integrated Test System) and VSDU (Vertical Situational Display Upgrade), united into a common program IBS (Integrated Battle Station - integrated combat station). This will ensure more effective interaction with aircraft of the Jistars system, ground command posts, reconnaissance and sabotage groups and advanced aircraft controllers, as well as increase the situational awareness of the crew.
This modernization is the most complex in the history of the B-1V flight operation. As a result, the crew receives more information about the air and ground situation in the combat area. Improved secure communication channels improve the combat capabilities of the vehicle to defeat designated targets. The work was carried out by Boeing Corporation specialists at Tinker Air Base (Oklahoma). The first modernized bomber was delivered to the United States Air Force on January 21, 2014.
The FIDL project envisages equipping machines with Link-16 equipment. This will make it possible to automatically receive in real time information about the combat situation and targets from various external reconnaissance means, change the flight mission and re-target weapons, transmit received using onboard sighting systems (mainly from the "Sniper-XR" optoelectronic station) data for units of ground forces, up to the platoon level. All received information, including geo-referenced to the terrain, should be displayed on digital large-format multifunctional color indicators at the workplaces of operators of weapons and electronic warfare systems. They will also display data from the new integrated control system (CITS project). CITS can also be used by ground personnel to diagnose malfunctions of onboard systems.
Monochrome indicators based on cathode tubes, as well as analog indicators on the dashboard of pilots are replaced by four multifunctional color indicators (project VSDU).
The estimated deadline for completing the IBS program is 2018.
According to the views of American military experts, strategic bomber aviation is called upon to play an important role in the wars of the future. These views are confirmed by programs for its modernization. And with regard to the B-1B Lancer strategic bombers, the US Air Force plans to keep these aircraft in service until 2030-2040.

[silver_roman]

Quote: NEXUS

you "do not shaggy grandma here" dear. The USA tried to copy the TU-160 by making B-1

in fact, the Tu-160 is our response to the creation of the B1 Lancer. so do not confuse!
Tu-160 made its first flight at 81, and B1 at 74.

[Sergeant Pank]

There is an opinion that producing according to old technologies may not work out. Almost from scratch, production must be created, and this equipment is no longer there. It is easier to finalize the project for new materials and production technology.
P.S. Let me remind you when they made Tu-29 from B-4, almost created new industrial sectors.

[vladimir_krm]

Exactly! And let the author keep his naive fantasies to himself: "The proposal to resume production of Tu-160 bombers can be most logically explained either by budget cuts for the development of PAK DA due to the economic crisis, or by too" Napoleonic "plans for it, voiced initially."

Previously, the political situation was completely different, and there were enough available sides. Now they are needed, and moreover, urgently: there is simply no new time for development and numerous tests.

[And Us Rat]

In the news:

[fa2998]

Yes, something doesn’t merge with PAK DA.Tu -160-plane is off-the-plane, but reviving a production airplane of 80 years of the last century is a moot point. Maybe it’s possible to use these funds on PAK DA, which will allow lawful development, subtraction of production, and start production .Run after two birds with one stone, you won’t catch a single one. You need to be patient, stop the panic, they say that we have few bombers. The old but reliable Tu-95s and existing Tu-160s fly 10 years, now we need to focus on the production of a new bomber.

[Bkmz]

It’s not just a plane of the 80s that is being revived, firstly, production facilities and the forging of qualified personnel with an eye on the PAK DA, but for now they are thinking of building the Tu-160, secondly, among other things, these are engines, electronics and, of course, materials and testing technologies, for example, new control systems and all that sort of thing, a kind of running-in, like a system for the PAK FA being tested in the Su-35.

[glasha3032]

... "new materials and new technologies, new electronics" ... - everything is NEW and tested according to NEW! And how many more years to spend on testing "new" aircraft? There are old, time-tested and operational solutions, and the Tu-160 should be made only in the old version. Then the question is, does it make sense to make junk, and is it not better to spend money, time, resources on the production of a new PAK YES, especially since they say that it has already been delivered to Kazan? We must take it and do it!

[EGOrkka]

Better a goose with apples than a duck under the bed !!!

[Iline]

I read the comments and wonder. All speak with one voice about a great plane. Different from what? Very expensive to manufacture and operate? Very gluttonous? The possible use of high-precision weapons declared in the article and the existing ability to use bombs are dubious advantages for this type of aircraft. I can understand the Americans in this matter with their local wars with a weak adversary. And who and we decided to fight with such weapons? Tu-22M3 is quite enough for this, and the latest conflict with Georgia has clearly shown this. That's really who you really need to reproduce.
The promise in the article about the deterioration of the Tu-95MS gliders, which have been produced since 1955, does not withstand any criticism. Tu-95MS is not much younger than Tu-160 and production ended at about the same time. This aircraft was created very quickly, because the X-55 rocket was ready, and with the Tu-160 by this time there were problems and a solid headache. Headache, by the way, continues to this day.
Let's create something new, and not step on the old rake.

[sergey261180]

Quote: Iline

And who and we decided to fight with such weapons?

With the same Americans and Chinese.

Tu-22M3 is quite enough, and this was clearly shown by the last conflict with Georgia

This is where it is clearly demonstrated how bombers should not be used.

Let's create something new, and not step on the old rake.

They are not capable of a new one, they would repeat the old Soviet.

[Iline]

Quote: sergey261180

With the same Americans and Chinese.

How do you imagine the Tu-160 as a bomber over the territory of the United States or China? Will they do much damage? Something seems to me that the damage of the Tu-160 itself will not be comparable with the effect of their use against these opponents.

Quote: sergey261180

This is where it is clearly demonstrated how bombers should not be used.

And what, in fact, of the assigned tasks was not fulfilled by them? Were the weapons depots destroyed? Were! Are airfields out of order? Withdrawn! Detection Locators Destroyed? Destroyed! The troops from front-line aviation worked for the troops. Or, in your understanding, should bombers spray pesticides over fields? It seems vaguely to me that you are hinting at one downed Tu-22M3. So this is war, my friend. And so many losses on the number of sorties made - the score is excellent. Moreover, this particular aircraft did not have a defense complex. I bring this data, because he himself was directly involved in these matters. Yes, and the Tu-95MS and Tu-160 had to serve a very long time.
And the modernization and resumption of production in return for the exhausted Tu-22M3 resource has ripened a very long time ago, it would be better if we dealt with this issue.

[sergey261180]

Quote: Iline

How do you imagine the Tu-160 as a bomber over the territory of the United States or China? Will they do much damage?

Starting from containment (preventing war, which is already good), ending with blocking ocean communications, 12 nuclear missiles - 12 megacities.

It seems vaguely to me that you are hinting at one downed Tu-22M3

As if hinting. Used Tu-22 is not correct. To send a huge plane into the coverage area of ​​unsuppressed air defense is the management’s debauch, for which the pilots paid with their lives. With the bombing of airfields, too, not everything went well. Free-falling bombs, almost all fell by, some of them did not burst, attack aircraft blocked the NARs with take-off. Guided bombs did not appear to have been used.

[Iline]

Strange 2009 shots. If anything, they fought in 2008. And the very location of the "bomb" type raises many questions. They are too neatly arranged. Have you ever seen the consequences of a massive bombing? And the take-off was blocked not with NARs, but with simple bombs with different detonation slowdown times. The enemy did not know how long this time was installed in each specific bomb, hence the long time for mine clearance.

[sergey261180]

Quote: Iline

Strange pictures of 2009. If anything, then fought in 2008

I know that in 2008 A strip was not repaired immediately, especially since they almost did not have combat aircraft left.

Quote: Iline

And the take-off was blocked not by NARS, but by simple bombs with different time for slowing down the blasting

Bombs are dropped at a specific time interval, so they fall in a chain. NARS lie down heaped.

[Iline]

http://topwar.ru/uploads/images/2015/128/xbbf788.jpg
Explain to me at what time intervals these bombs are dropped and how evenly will they fall apart?
Under the NARs, as I understand it, the S-8 is supposed to be? Well, and what can they pick up scary in concrete? S-24, S-25 can be considered as an option, but judging by the spots on the concrete it is not they. Why? Just the Su-25 is not able to take on board as many missiles as there are spots on concrete in one line.

[sergey261180]

Quote: Iline

Explain to me at what time intervals these bombs are dropped and how evenly will they fall apart?

Well let's count. Suppose a plane flew at a speed of 600 km / h, which equals approximately 166,66666666666666666666666666667 m / s. The distance between the funnels is approximately 30 m. Divide this distance of 30 m by the speed of the aircraft, we get the time = 0,18 seconds.

Under the NARs, as I understand it, the S-8 is supposed to be?

There is also the S-13. Designed specifically for punching concrete shelters at airfields.

Just the Su-25 is not able to take on board as many missiles as there are spots on concrete in one line.

What makes you think that there was only one Su-25? There are also Su-24 and the same Tu-22. And why did you get the idea that they made so many funnels there at one go?

[Rus2012]

Quote: Iline

How do you imagine Tu-160 as a bomber over US territory

... firstly, if necessary, they will not come close, having shot ammunition for a couple of thousand kilometers. from the coastline (range KR = 5500km, what the hell is closer?)
Secondly, they will go after a couple of waves of ICBMs, to press aiming remains.
Thirdly, even all of this is not required.

And against the Chinese - Tu-160, obviously unnecessary. Moreover, we are not going to fight with China and will not. Rather, on the contrary, we will "be friends" against others ... :)))

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Rus2012

Secondly, they will go after a couple of waves of ICBMs

Shockwaves canceled?
Rather, missiles will be launched immediately after determining the launch, so as not to be shot down - perhaps all planes are tracked and accompanied by fighters, which does not preclude an attack on them before the launch of ICBMs.
And in general, do the strategists of the Kyrgyz Republic wear in a fairly peaceful time? Most likely not, which means that it takes time to equip them, start and approach

[Rus2012]

Quote: Pilat2009

Do the strategists of the Kyrgyz Republic wear in a fairly peaceful time? Most likely not, which means it takes time to equip them, start and fly

... ours and yabb - no and never drove. Only layouts and conventional equipment.

Strategists are on duty on earth.
Those. crews are allocated for the database. With the onset of the "threatened period" and further, there is a dispersal to alternate airfields and jump airfields. At the same time, depending on the situation, different DB orders can be introduced: in different time readiness for takeoff, incl. air watch ...

[alecsis69]

The attack that you describe is not sudden. Intelligence will know at least a few days before the alleged strike, so strategists will be prepared.

[K-50]

Quote: Iline

How do you imagine the Tu-160 as a bomber over the territory of the United States or China?

It seems wonderful.
About two years ago, the TU-160 flew over the North Sea, so the British could only find them when 40 km were left to the British shores. A planned guided aerial bomb from a drop height of 20 km flies to a target of 70 km, already enough. Also, the aircraft are equipped with long-range supersonic cruise missiles, with a range of up to three thousand km. So both China and America are shooting through.
The filling will be changed for them by navigation and electronic warfare, and the rest of them is already quite good.

[Iline]

Darn! People, do you read posts or do you just post your thoughts? I wrote "as a bomber", not a missile carrier. In the version of a pure missile carrier, no questions arise (by the way, the Tu-95MS is a pure missile carrier and there are no questions about its use).
About the discovery of the Tu-160, 40 km from Britain. Do not entertain yourself with illusions. As soon as these aircraft enter neutral waters, they are transferred from hand to hand to the air defense of NATO countries. And the fact that the fighters did not fly out to intercept does not mean anything. Just in this case, they were shuganuli from the border from the very risky approach of aircraft to the state. the border.
I can give you a couple more examples, because served in YES. But it is possible to turn this way and that without knowing the true alignment of forces and capabilities. Therefore, I will not do this so as not to excite the patriots. Everything is very complicated in this world.

[Rus2012]

Quote: Iline

I wrote "as a bomber"

... only after "the conquest of air supremacy and the suppression of all air defense", but otherwise why?

[FID]

Quote: Iline

who have developed the Tu-22M3 resource

This is straight ... And they definitely worked out a resource? And what is your resource Tu-22M3?

[Ustin]

Repeating the problem is no less difficult than starting a new one. At cost, the organization of mass production will be approximately the same order. So most likely everything will remain as it was ...

[saturn.mmm]

Quote: Ustin

So most likely everything will remain as it was ...

And how is the creation of the MS-21 progressing, but is there any recent news about this?

[Rus2012]

Quote: sergey261180

and the Chinese

??
get out ...
They will overwhelm everyone, even if they use only the methods of Gandhi - "non-resistance", because the hand will get tired of waving ... :)))
And they are not going to fight with anyone. Unless forced ...
They even charged us to guard our Nicaraguan canal.

[Rus2012]

By the way, here's the topic -

Starting with the lunar program and military exercises in the Mediterranean Sea and ending with the Victory Parade in Moscow, China and Russia over the past few days have announced a number of measures aimed at developing military, financial and political ties.

• In March, the Russian state-owned aircraft manufacturer announced a production schedule for a joint venture with China Commercial Aircraft Corporation to create a long-haul wide-body aircraft, which should be completed by 2025 year. Much of the funding for this 13 billionth project will fall on China’s shoulders. In April, China became the first foreign buyer of the newest C-400 missile system as part of the 3 billion deal, which should be completed by the 2017 year. The sale of C-400 again "underlines the strategic level of our relations," as Anatoly Isaikin, head of the Rosoboronexport state company, told reporters of the Russian newspaper Kommersant.

• Russia became the founding member and main sponsor of the Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank, proposed by Beijing's 100 billion-dollar development bank, which many analysts consider a challenge to the World Bank and other Western financial institutions. This week, Russia's Deputy Minister of Economic Development, Stanislav Voskresensky, told reporters that Russia could become the third largest sponsor among dozens of countries — neither the United States nor Japan — that joined the investment bank, and that Russia could get a seat on his board of directors.

• This week, Mr. Rogozin and Chinese Deputy Prime Minister Wang Yang discussed in detail plans for cooperation in space exploration for the next few decades. Mr. Rogozin said that Beijing and Moscow are united by “deep mutual understanding and common interests” in their joint space exploration projects. In February, Chinese Deputy Foreign Minister Cheng Guoping reported that China plans to cooperate with Russia in a number of areas, including space projects, since Beijing is currently working on developing the Changzheng-9 rocket on the eve of the first flight. Chinese astronauts to the moon.

• The joint naval exercises, which were announced on Thursday, 30 April, became another step in the framework of the expanding informal military cooperation between China and Russia, according to military analysts. Nine military surface ships will take part in these exercises, and during them, defense at sea, resupply, escorting ships, and other tasks will be worked out, according to a spokesman for the Ministry of Defense of China, Geng Yansheng.

http://inosmi.ru/russia/20150502/227814429.html

[sergey261180]

Quote: Rus2012

??
get out ...
They will overwhelm everyone, even if they use only the methods of Gandhi - "non-resistance", because the hand will get tired of waving ... :)))
And they are not going to fight with anyone. Unless forced ...

12 rockets of 200 kilotons each - there will be a large fried mass of hee-hee corpses. And who was not going to Daman there?

[will go]

You forget an essential thing, the country is just rising from its knees, and overseas "friends" actively interfere with this, and unlike them, we cannot turn on the printing press. I think we are not all fools, and based on realities they act.

[sergey261180]

Quote: vair

the country is just rising from its knees

Does it seem to be up already?

Quote: vair

and in this she is actively interfered with by overseas "friends"

Why then should they sell at least weapons-grade uranium and RD-180?

Quote: vair

unlike them, we cannot turn on the printing press

What, we do not know where it turns on or there is no electricity?

Quote: vair

I think we are not all fools

Of course, not fools: grandmothers and children were sent abroad a long time ago, but here on a rotational basis.

[Rus2012]

Quote: Iline

And who and we decided to fight with such weapons?

That's it!:)))
It seems to me that if 3,14ndoses turn sour and merge at the turn no further than 20xx, then Tu-160 seems to be unnecessary (then PAK_DA should be supersonic).

Only if in order to fulfill the "gendarme function" on a planetary scale - to frighten the remnants of the Anglo-Saxon world. With threats brought into reality within 10-20 hours. Unfortunately, the Tu-22M is not capable of this, if it does not contain "overseas bases" on other shores ... :)))

[Grenader]

Quote: Iline

And who and I decided to fight with such weapons? Tu-22M3 is quite enough for this, and the latest conflict with Georgia has clearly shown this. That's really who you really need to reproduce.

Do not confuse XPQ with a tram handle. Tu-160 strategist, his task is to deliver long-range nuclear-powered cruise missiles. X-555 and X-101 to the borders of the United States and release them without entering the enemy’s air defense zone. Until a new strategist is ready and it will not be developed soon, the number of Tu-160s will increase, thereby increasing nuclear pressure on the United States the most rational way out.

[Wheel]

Quote: Iline

I read the comments and wonder.

And I wonder at the porridge in your head, I'm sorry ...

[gjv]

Quote: Iline

Let's create something new, and not step on the old rake.

The new does not look like a "rake".

Earlier, plans were announced to begin serial production of the new strategic bomber PAK DA in the mid-2020s. The machine must first replace the obsolete Tu-95, and later the Tu-160. In addition, the PAK DA is considered a replacement for the Tu-22M3 long-range bomber. According to preliminary information, the aircraft is planned to be executed according to the “flying wing” scheme (similar to the American B-2 Spirit) and subsonic. Speed ​​will be sacrificed to stealth aircraft for radars. No other reliable information about PAK YES

This is not a rake, this is some kind of pitchfork!
And the Shvets, and the reaper, and the dude on the pipe? Unreal Tournament. Speed ​​sacrificed - Tu-160 will not replace!

[0255]

Quote: fa2998

Yes, something does not grow together with PAK YES

Maybe it was just necessary to finance the aircraft industry, and not another "innovative" black-and-white nanoplate from Chubais?

Quote: fa2998

The Tu -160-plane is off-beat, but reviving a production airplane of 80 years of the last century is a moot point. Maybe it’s possible to put these funds into PAK DA, which will allow you to complete the development, turn off production, and start production. You won’t catch a single run with two rabbits. We need to be patient, stop the panic, and they say that we have few bombers. The old, but reliable Tu-95s and existing Tu-160s fly for 10 years, now we need to focus on the production of a new bomber.

The Third World is approaching, it is necessary to restore the production of what is. Is the Tu-160 really outdated? The first flight of PAK DA is scheduled for 2019, then refinement, the start of production - this may not be as fast as we would like. Where is the guarantee that they will not bomb us until 2019?

[K-50]

Quote: fa2998

the -160-plane is excellent, but reviving a production airplane of 80 years of the last century is a moot point.

So no one is going to install equipment of the 70-80s. The glider of the aircraft is magnificent, and the stuffing change this thing necessary and necessary, which they will do.

[gjv]

Quote: K-50

and change the stuffing necessary and necessary, which they will do.

KRET announced its readiness to start production of avionics for a strategic missile carrier. The aircraft will be equipped with an aerobatic complex, an on-board weapon control system, sensors, fuel devices and indication systems developed by the Concern.
In addition, the missile carrier will be equipped with a strap-down inertial navigation system such as BINS-SP developed by KRET, as well as a highly efficient electronic warfare system with improved tactical and technical capabilities to overcome the air defense system.

[glasha3032]

That is, the whole Tu-160 fleet is a joke? The planes have already been overhauled and will have to remove the aircraft (1,2,3 ...?) From the unit for a year (at least), having removed it from readiness, and modify it at the factory (remove the whole electrician, lay a new one, regulate, test, etc., etc. This is either stupidity or sabotage ...

[gjv]

Quote: glasha3032

That is, the whole Tu-160 fleet is a joke? ... This is either stupidity .or wrecking ...

Answer:

Quote: ancient

This is nonsense, but not an article ..... take a good look at the interview with Shoigu -... "to analyze the possibility of producing 2 missile carriers from among the available ... fittings."

Question: Do you carefully read the article and comments?

[glasha3032]

"KRET announced its readiness to release avionics" - on how many aircraft? On one? The meaning? It makes sense to update on ALL - and then all the difficulties and troubles about which I wrote will begin.

[glasha3032]

"missile carrier from stock - if titanium center sections (2pcs) they still have and the templates for the marking of the skin remained (and were not thrown out as for the An-124), then you can still assemble 2 vehicles, but the instrumentation will still not be new, but restored from graduated years 20 years ago Alas ... there is no one to do ...

[vladimir_krm]

Procrastination of death like (c)

[Valkh]

Resuming the release is the best solution, in my opinion !!! And the cheapest for the country !!!!

[Blondy]

Quote: Valkh

Resuming the release is the best solution, in my opinion !!! And the cheapest for the country !!!

That's right, Lebed is already proven to be the best, and as said, for several decades, especially with modernization. But whether the new PAK YES will be better - this grandmother said in two, somehow modestly the parameters were laid in it. Mattress covers have already changed to new models two times after B52, but it's no use. An example, of course, "well it", but you have to keep in mind. And the fact that Kuzhuketych in the practical sense does not toil with foolishness (like some, we will not point the finger), but dodges in the best, and sometimes even original and paradoxical way, we have all been observing for a long time.

[APASUS]

Quote: Valkh

Resuming the release is the best solution, in my opinion !!! And the cheapest for the country !!!!

It was logical to include the restoration of production of the Tu-160 in the program of the next bomber or aircraft similar in terms of performance characteristics, to reduce the cost of the project. Also to develop a machine using Tu-160 units.
Restoring production will cost no less than building anew, although the example of Ukraine, Libya, Iraq is quite indicative - do not count on the prudence of our "partners"!

[Vadim Zhivov]

while fishing, a friend from Kuznetsov told me that they work on a swan .. but it was two years ago if not more .....

[glasha3032]

Two years is not a deadline! Now Tu-22M3 is undergoing major repairs and modernization in Kazan, so they made the decision in 2008! Inertia in Russia!

[501 Legion]

as for me it is necessary to do White Swan 2.0 with a new filling in everything. rather than stupidly put the car on the conveyor again. Yes, the plane is excellent, but technology does not stand still. I would really like it to not be just a renewal, but an improved aircraft with new internal equipment.

[vladimir_krm]

And so it is:

In the case of the resumption of production of the Tu-160, the bomber will receive an aerobatic complex, weapon control system, sensors, fuel devices and indication systems developed by KRET. In addition, it can be equipped with an inertial navigation system such as BINS-SP, developed by the concern, as well as an electronic warfare system with improved capabilities to overcome air defense.

In addition, as a result of the possible modernization of the Tu-160 "they will have improved flight characteristics, the range of weapons used will expand."
http://kramtp.info/news/18/full/id=42462;

[Support]

Damn - do not let out - bad, let out - bad. It must be somehow determined. In the end, they release (renewed) not Po-2, but a very good car. So would shut up .....

[4bas]

In my opinion, there can be no debate on this issue. Since this solution will allow us to renew the necessary lines of the production chain of long-range strategic aviation that were lost in the time we knew, as a result of which many, many problems that may arise at the time of launching the PAK DA series, such as lack of production, lack of qualified personnel, etc. .d. This is not counting the macroeconomic poles in the form of creating jobs, increasing GDP and real support for domestic producers, because these machines are a whole complex, in the creation of which hundreds of enterprises will take part. In addition, PAK DA exists only on paper and in the minds of designers with a bunch of unresolved issues, and strategists are needed yesterday, especially such as TU-160, which I think will not lose its relevance even with the advent of PAK DA.
More questions arise related to the lack of any distinct prospects for the TU-22, because these are extremely necessary

[4bas]

cars that in the near future will not be replaced.

[Fotoceva62]

... A dagger is bad for someone who does not have it and good for someone who has it at the right moment ... (Abdullah, White desert sun).
All-crawling colleagues stop whining. We are all for everything good, against everything bad, but there is a harsh reality that requires a strategist here and now. Tu_160 is the best that is available in the world today, the machine is capable of solving all the tasks of a strategist today and in the future. There is a worked-out glider, touched equipment in production, still retained personnel and ITR. They will install new avionics, which will be improved in terms of glider and power plant, and equipped with promising weapons. What else do you need. By the way, nobody works on PAK YES, but this is a long business, and you read some - “that we should build a house, we’ll draw a living.”

[andrei.yandex]

This does not surprise me. The fact is that anyone who is interested in aviation knows the Tupolev Design Bureau with deplorable matters. Therefore, you understand that they will have to work hard in the field of raising not so much projects, but the revival of the team to the last level. As for PAK YES. I would like to see the aircraft still ahead of its time, and not a copy of the B-2 in a slightly modified form. If you set goals, then with a new level, and as an example - this is the T-4 Sukhoi Design Bureau, which, although it did not go into the series, but gave a huge reserve for future other projects. It is time to master at least near-hypersonic speeds and reaching practical flight ceilings of at least 20-25 km.

[0255]

The Tu-160 is not a copy of the B-1, but the project of the M-18 EMZ Myasishchev bomber transferred to the Tupolev Design Bureau. Myasischev developed the M-18 project several months earlier than the Americans did their B-1. Tupolev generally wanted to create a Tu-160 based on the Tu-144

Model of the aircraft M-18 EMZ Myasishchev:

Find 10 differences between the serial Tu-160 from the Myasishchev project

[K-50]

Quote: 0255

The Tu-160 is not a copy of the B-1, but the project of the M-18 EMZ Myasishchev bomber transferred to the Tupolev Design Bureau

Is it okay that one is made according to the "Duck" design, and the other according to the normal aerodynamic design with a folding wing? It's just that these are so different schemes that you won't be able to convert one into another, you need a complete recalculation of the entire structure, that is, create a NEW aircraft! So do not write what you are not sure about and less nonsense.

[gjv]

Quote: K-50

It's nothing that one is made according to the "Duck" scheme,

Alex, and who "one stupid" Duck " that ?

[0255]

Tupolev offered to the competition exactly the converted Tu-144, under the designation "Tu-160". M-18 Myasishchev was chosen as the winner, but the project itself was handed over to Tupolev. And the M-18 went into production as the Tu-160. You are wrong

[andrei.yandex]

Where did you make out the duck circuit?

[andrei.yandex]

Not many people know that it was so. The aviation literature about the Tu-160 did not hide it. It is necessary to educate people. And then many do not know or forgot that there were other design bureaus in the USSR.

[Arno]

It should bring the number of Tu-160 to 100 units.
And you still need 20 thousand cruise missiles.
And we don’t need an aircraft carrier.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Arno

It should bring the number of Tu-160 to 100 units.
And you still need 20 thousand cruise missiles.
And we don’t need an aircraft carrier.

Well, I would prefer the PL-10 pieces of 50 CR is enough.
Do not forget about START-3

[sergey261180]

Quote: Pilat2009

Do not forget about START-3

In-in, no one has sat down for it yet. As well as for START-1 and 2, as well as for the collapse of the Soviet Socialist Republic.

[andrei.yandex]

Comrade you and the flag in your hands, we are waiting for your financing. Well, seriously, for a country with its economic situation - 20 is already not bad.

[S-cream]

With an X-55SM missile launch range of 3500 km, the supersonic speed or stealth inherent in newer vehicles is not so important - all the ammunition will be shot by the moment the bomber detects enemy forces.

They would be ashamed to write such nonsense. Aircraft, and especially such (because they are under special observation), are detected at the time of takeoff. Another thing is that their interception is difficult, just because of the launch range.

[RuslanNN]

This is not patching holes, but the correction of gross errors. A country that thinks about its security should develop its armed forces.

[Wheel]

Quote: RuslanNN

A country that thinks about its security should develop its armed forces.

A country that thinks about its security should have a full range of industry.
And now, our own developed industry will allow us to seamlessly develop our armed forces.

[tolancop]

I don’t know if holes are patching up or not, but in any case, Russia will even benefit from an attempt to restore the construction of the TU-160.
Guest workers cannot stand such a device and cannot assemble it on their knees.
Like it or not, but you have to train personnel: engineers, technicians, workers.
A machine park will definitely be needed, maybe the revival of the Russian machine tool industry may finally begin.
We need engines ... All of the above applies to engine operators.
Need materials .... Read above ...
Need avionics .... Read above ...

T.ch. in fact, if the TU-160 were not needed, its need would have been invented.

[Mordvin 3]

The fact of the matter is that cadres decide everything. We have made a monastery from one vocational school, from another - jur. college. And so it is everywhere. And there are almost no teachers to work on modern machines, at least invite Mr. Cook.

[Fast]

Question. To make PAK YES subsonic - is this a strategic mistake? Everything should develop in a direction higher, further and faster. PAK YES of the last generation, it seems to me, should be an invulnerable rocket plane at the appearance of which the p-mill will become an order of magnitude closer, and they will all swallow pills there from fear. The arguments in favor of subsonic are not convincing, they just want to save money due to combat capabilities, I regard it as better than the 95th of the fifties, the difference is not only on welding and bolts, but on clothespins and Velcro only.

[vladimir_krm]

They also work on hypersound, but you can’t refuse the rest.

[Lt. Air Force stock]

Quote: Fast

Question. To make PAK YES subsonic - is this a strategic mistake? Everything should develop in a direction higher, further and faster. PAK YES of the last generation, it seems to me, should be an invulnerable rocket plane at the appearance of which the p-mill will become an order of magnitude closer, and they will all swallow pills there from fear. The arguments in favor of subsonic are not convincing, they just want to save money due to combat capabilities, I regard it as better than the 95th of the fifties, the difference is not only on welding and bolts, but on clothespins and Velcro only.

Anyway, it’s really possible to intercept a high-speed target, and a subsonic target designed and built using stealth technology is more likely to break into the launch area of ​​cruise missiles. The principle is the quieter you go on going.

[Fast]

While the "wing" is being made, the air defense will develop so that there will be no invisibility, and everyone will throw this whim out of their heads. Surprise and success are guaranteed only by cosmic speeds. We have some groundwork, Buran is an example of this.

[Sergeant Pank]

What prevents air defense systems from "developing" and shooting down hypersound?

[Panda_eye_60ru]

Nothing interferes, they do it, only an order of magnitude less efficiently than the "stealth slug" and in a much narrower territorial range.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Fast

Buran is an example.

Are you going to carry bombs on the Buran? Type flies a week, then back ....
It’s necessary to make a suborbital vehicle so that it flies in the atmosphere and higher. In the USA, a drone won a year in space

[Sukhoi]

In my opinion, it would not be superfluous to return the TU-22 the possibility of refueling in the air. Good help for waiting time PAK YES.

[0255]

They say that on the Tu-22M you can return the refueling system.

[Sukhoi]

Sure. Americans lobbied the withdrawal, now there is every reason to put on these agreements and return the bar.

[Panda_eye_60ru]

Enough modern avionics to upgrade and pour more fuel, and refueling is not needed.

[stranik72]

They resume production of the TU-160 for one reason, there is no way and time to create a breakthrough project in the next 20 years, and if even those developments that were in the USSR plus today's avionics are introduced into TU-160 and NK-32 (though our Russian Federation is also not ice) and dream of introducing the innovation that exists in today's Russian Federation, in composites and standard materials, it will be quite a product of the 21st century, is there just enough effort and money? Now the production of MI-14 is resuming, a lot of new things will be introduced into it, but still not everything that could be, the issue of price turned out to be more significant than technical perfection. But the Mi-14 does not win the war, and the TU-160 can

[monopodman]

Not certainly in that way. The creation of a breakthrough project (the same PAK YES) will go exactly these 20 years (if you look at the history of any new aircraft), and to master a project of this level without the established production of the Tu-160 will be much more difficult than if you first start making new ones Tu-160. And the Tu-160 itself from the appearance of PAK YES will not lose relevance. Rather, PAK DA will serve as a universal subsonic replacement for the Tu-22M3 / Tu-95MS / Tu-160 troika, but of these three, the Tu-160 will be relevant for another 50 years

[Vadim237]

At cost, the new TU 160 will cost as much as 5 SU 35 - 7 billion rubles.

[NEXUS]

Quote: Vadim237

At cost, the new TU 160 will cost as much as 5 SU 35 - 7 billion rubles.

and MAPL "ASH" costs like 5-6 "Varshavyanka", so what? Tu-160, like Yasei and Borei, as well as Yars complexes, this is our NUCLEAR TRIAD, our shield and sword.

[monopodman]

7 billion rubles - this is only 140 million (course 50) or 175 million (course 40) dollars for one Tu-160. I think it will be at least $ 250 million, and that's fine!

[Vadim237]

7 billion rubles, this is the minimum price of 160go, and there it can reach up to 18 - 20 billion.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

I read the article, comments, did not understand anything.
First - what is patching holes? We have just taken up PAK YES. The Americans began to design their B-2 in 1979 (if not earlier), the first flight - 1989 g, and only entered the service in 1994, or in 1997. Total - about 15 years from the start to service. About all kinds of raptors and penguins, I generally keep quiet.
What do we want? So that before 2020, three regiments PAK YES in the ranks? I also want to, only miracles do not happen. PACK YES, it’s not going anywhere, but it will happen oh soon, but until then you have to live with something and the new Tu-160 will be oh as if in place.
The second - if anyone thinks that after developing the PAK DA project it is enough to clap your hands - and the invisible hand of the market will immediately take out the production facilities with trained personnel for the production of 100500 PAK DA per month from your pocket - this is also a slightly mistaken view of things. We need the REANIMATION of the production of long-range bombers, and it’s no bad thing to start it with a machine already mastered once in the past. You look, by the time of mass production of PAK DA, we will also have a machine park and specialists.
Comments like "chef, it's all gone!" - well, I myself am a notorious "all-consuming", but nevertheless, in aviation we have really big and good progress in recent years - it's ridiculous to deny, it's enough to look at the rate of receipt of new equipment in the troops. I know that a thousand and one problems have not been solved yet, but still the situation with the beginning of the 2000s is incomparable

[MolGro]

The only question is which one is that 160?) If this is a new modification, then everything will understandably load capacities and work out technologies for PAK-YES !!

[bmv04636]

The restoration of TU-160 production, on the contrary, confirms that we intend to build PAK DA. It can’t be built from scratch, so we want to restore what we lost and I think that the new Tu-160 will be a transitional model for the PAK. Yes, its image is mule like in the automotive industry when a new car is hiding under the old shell.

[glasha3032]

In the same regiment there will be TWO TYPES of Tu-160? How to repair-service. Spare parts?

[Starik72]

I have already written here more than once that Soviet industry was destroyed for 20-25 years, and you want to restore it in a year or two? In order to restore the aircraft industry in full, it’s necessary to load the remaining enterprises with work, so I think the solution is right. This will give time for restoration, since these samples of equipment so far correspond to this time, and impetus to the latest developments. And the main thing in this is that it would not be words, but work, work and work, as they once said before the seventh sweat. As the saying goes: WHAT DOES IT DOES TO THE BEST and is terribly NOT ACTION but WITHOUT ACTION.

[EGOrkka]

But agree on the organization and technology (machines) of the 40s to build a worthwhile would be very expensive and clearly not competitive ...

[glasha3032]

And with whom on Tu-160 do we need to compete? Here on the technique of the 60-70s they were made.

[glasha3032]

... "load the enterprise with work" ... - to start the enterprise you need to load workers and technicians with engineers! But then the planes will go.

[EGOrkka]

Yes, you can load it with the production of bolts, but it will only give little. And if you also ignore economic indicators, then the bolts can be "gold" in the sense of their cost ...

[demotivator]

Quote: Enot-poloskun

I'm afraid the decision to resume production of the Tu-160 is associated with high military danger.

Not until PAK YES ...

As if, if we had already created this very PAK YES today, then something would have hurt us. There is no longer up to prospective developments; there would be enough time, effort and specialists to resume the production of old Soviet aircraft models. Russia, as always, lacks only ONE year. One can only hope that we have this year.

[TOR2]

In this case, the cost of the production program for 20 new Tu-160Ms will be at least $ 5 billion, and possibly more. Money is not small - but not too big, especially considering the fact that the production of such a batch of aircraft will be quite long in time

Then you do not need to aim only at the Tu-160M, but talk about the entire aircraft industry as a whole. And the program should be appropriate. In addition to the Tu-160, military transport aircraft are also needed, and you should not forget about the passenger ones. For a large program, it will be easier and cheaper to train personnel and create equipment. If such a program is correctly compiled and implemented, then in addition to the Tu-160, disk-shaped ECIBs for various purposes will appear in the sky.

[gjv]

Quote: TOR2

Then you do not need to aim only at the Tu-160M, but talk about the entire aircraft industry as a whole. And the program should be appropriate. In addition to the Tu-160, military transport aircraft are also needed, and you should not forget about the passenger ones. For a large program, it will be easier and cheaper to train personnel and create equipment. If such a program is correctly designed and implemented,

Yuri, a good look at the "big program", however, excuse me, it is too "idealistic". The key is yours If... This "key" may not be enough. Large "programmer"offices - UAC, OSK, UEC, OMK, Rusnano ... Are the results of their activities impressive in their achievements?
In the USSR, the scientific program of the 80s was called "Advanced Technologies in Microelectronics". what they just didn’t push there (Skolkovo, ay !). Well, that is, there were interesting topics. However, the total volume should have been at the mercy of the developers, but "there was no private initiative and entrepreneurship"!... The American program was called "Gallium arsenide in microelectronics". An example of the difference in the development of domestic and adversarial electronics, it seems to me, shows that a deliberately purposeful" small "program can be more effective and give a clear and useful result (A chicken pecks by the grain and is full ). More "small programs" with competent and responsible (before their conscience in the first place) leaders who understand the setting of tasks and questions to the performers and have the will and self-control to control and coordinate joint actions (and not the temptations of theft or long-term chatter for big money, which is also in essence - theft). And then the work will go purposefully and there will be a conscious and tangible result. In the USSR, this was partly in the form of competition between different design bureaus on similar topics or on a uniform task by performance characteristics.

[gjv]

Quote: TOR2

Then you do not need to aim only at the Tu-160M, but talk about the entire aircraft industry as a whole. And the program should be appropriate. In addition to the Tu-160, military transport aircraft are also needed, and you should not forget about the passenger ones. For a large program, it will be easier and cheaper to train personnel and create equipment. If such a program is correctly designed and implemented,

Yuri, a good look at the "big program", however, excuse me, it is too "idealistic". The key is yours If... This "key" may not be enough. Large "programmer"offices - UAC, OSK, UEC, OMK, Rusnano ... Are the results of their activities impressive in their achievements?
In the USSR, the scientific program of the 80s was called "Advanced Technologies in Microelectronics". what they just didn’t push there (Skolkovo, ay !). Well, that is, there were interesting topics. However, the total volume should have been at the mercy of the developers, but "there was no private initiative and entrepreneurship"!... The American program was called "Gallium arsenide in microelectronics". An example of the difference in the development of domestic and adversarial electronics, it seems to me, shows that a deliberately purposeful" small "program can be more effective and give a clear and useful result (A chicken pecks by the grain and is full ). More "small programs" with competent and responsible (before their conscience in the first place) leaders who understand the setting of tasks and questions to the performers and have the will and self-control to control and coordinate joint actions (and not the temptations of theft or long-term chatter for big money, which is also in essence - theft). And then the work will go purposefully and there will be a conscious and tangible result. In the USSR, this was partly in the form of competition between different design bureaus on similar topics or on a uniform task by performance characteristics.

[monopodman]

Yes, and in large local and regional conflicts, having a carrier of precision weapons capable of firing from great distances will definitely not hurt

Su-34 is still suitable for this purpose - it is capable of carrying 2 X-101 / X-102 missiles

[monopodman]

In general, the restoration of production of the Tu-160 is a sound decision. It is necessary to establish a technological chain, restore all ties with related enterprises and form a professional team. This can be done now, when PAK YES is only at the initial stage of development. On the example of PAK FA, we see that the development of a new aircraft takes a long time. Can you imagine our Air Force without the production of Su-30 / Su-34 / Su-35 in anticipation of a new fighter?

By the time PAK DA is ready for mass production (late 20s), the work of all enterprises should have already been established thanks to the release of the Tu-160. If this is not done, then it will be possible to tear.

[glasha3032]

The decision to restore the production of Tu-160 at least is ill-conceived. Airplanes are now 25-30 years old and on-board electronics have run out of resources (SSI said that they are 4-6 ready) and now it’s more important and more important for the Tu-160 to quickly change this electronics throughout the fleet.

[monopodman]

You probably do not know - all 16 vehicles in service at the moment completely change the entire electronic stuffing.

[glasha3032]

In the course, DO NOT CHANGE ANYTHING !!!

[glasha3032]

Of course, it’s possible to commemorate _this is not a problem! The problem is the laws of nature — the laws of physics and chemistry! When materials diffuse in radio elements (alas. From time) and radio elements burn out in CHAINS, what reliable flights and tasks can you talk about? Before the pilot, for example, is there such a remote control PR- 2 - well, what if suddenly in flight on a circuit board what mode radio elements burn out? And if several and at once? What should the pilot do and where to escape? So, for our Air Force it is now more important to have the current number of combat-ready vehicles than a slight increase of another 2x.

[Black Colonel]

"... the cost of the program for the production of 20 new Tu-160Ms will be at least $ 5 billion, and possibly more."
"Mistrals" - France, grandmother (advance payment with a penalty) - to the base! So there will be something to collect "White Swans".

[Vadim237]

Even if France pays a forfeit, this money will go to patch holes in the budget.

[da Vinci]

In my opinion, it is too unjustified to build a defense system on one type of weapon with "unique characteristics" that no one has ever seen. This applies to the PAK FA (to the detriment of tactical aviation), and to the PAK DA (to the detriment of the Tu 22 and Tu 160), and to the Armata (to the detriment of the T 90), and much more. Of course, you shouldn't be scattered, but to have 2-4 different weapons of one type stretched over time (i.e. 2 modern, 2 promising, taking into account variations and the possible failure of a new development) would be more rational. I recall Hitler's fascination with wunderbluff, albeit with some unique properties, to the detriment of improving the existing reliable weapons systems (for example, the production of Panthers to the detriment of the TIV modification).

[Mountain shooter]

The Tu 160 is an extremely successful aircraft ahead of its time. But the PAK YES project is "a chicken in a nest", and what will it carry there? While the flows of petrodollars poured, one could afford to experiment with projects. The situation has changed, and restoring the production of an excellent aircraft is the right and economical solution. Restoring production in the presence of documentation on a proven technology is much easier than mastering the technology anew. I can assure you that the production technology of such an aircraft is expensive and time-consuming. Just as expensive is the development of a new aircraft, testing, the creation of a complex of weapons - testing, practicing combat use. An aircraft like the Tu 160 is almost a strategic missile submarine, but ten times cheaper. And easily flies to Venezuela ...

[Oman 47]

And in the photo - Tu22m3.

[FID]

Shoigu at KAPO, and there Tu-22M3 was released, and now a cap. they repair and modify, so there is nothing surprising ...

[Concealer]

The approximate cost of one Tu-160 in 1993 was $ 250 million - since then, of course, inflation has “worked”, however, taking into account the use of more modern production technologies, we will consider such a price to this day. In this case, the cost of the production program for 20 new Tu-160Ms will be at least $ 5 billion, and possibly more.

Don't be naive, this is for the USSR with a planned economy, where the calculation of the cost of production did not take into account the "profit" of the owners, and did not take into account the "corruption". Today 250 needs to be multiplied by two to account for "profit" and then multiplied by two again to account for corruption. So each plane will turn out 250 billion.
What did you want capitalism ... :)))))))))))
It’s a good idea, but just repeating the technical achievements of the USSR with the current economic model is extremely expensive. Space is a striking example. Well, there is no way to make it "commercial".

[gjv]

Quote: Concealer

Do not be naive, this is for the USSR with a planned economy, where the calculation of the cost of production did not take into account the "profit" of the owners, and did not take into account the "corruption". Today 250 needs to be multiplied by two to account for "profit", and then multiplied by two again to account for corruption.

Don't be naive... "Overhead costs" for the production of military equipment in the USSR reached up to 400%. Workers did not see this money, and often did not receive enterprises.
It also happened. The company ordered new equipment to carry out promising developments, but the company was "on the periphery". And the purchased equipment went to the ministerial supply base in Moscow. There he was noticed by some cunning supplier from the "closer" and straight to the ministry to the "hairy paw" with cries: - "Oh ... la, we urgently need this!" And that's all - a peripheral enterprise, where all the main work had to be done - in "suction", but trying to do something "on the knee". And the necessary equipment is idle at the "center", often not even unpacked.

[gjv]

Quote: Concealer

Do not be naive, this is for the USSR with a planned economy, where the calculation of the cost of production did not take into account the "profit" of the owners, and did not take into account the "corruption". Today 250 needs to be multiplied by two to account for "profit", and then multiplied by two again to account for corruption.

Don't be naive... "Overhead costs" for the production of military equipment in the USSR reached up to 400%. Workers did not see this money, and often did not receive enterprises.
It also happened. The company ordered new equipment to carry out promising developments, but the company was "on the periphery". And the purchased equipment went to the ministerial supply base in Moscow. There he was noticed by some cunning supplier from the "closer" and straight to the ministry to the "hairy paw" with cries: - "Oh ... la, we urgently need this!" And that's all - a peripheral enterprise, where all the main work had to be done - in "suction", but trying to do something "on the knee". And the necessary equipment is idle at the "center", often not even unpacked.

[Tektor]

The main purpose of the strategist is containment. There should be exactly as many as are required to guarantee this deterrence. To finish a couple from the backlog is not a way out or a solution to the problem. If the cost of only a set of 4 engines is 6 billion rubles, then it is clear that the containment task requires an exact solution. Their total number on duty, km, should be at least 24. Therefore, it is necessary to count on the construction of at least 12 sides.

[Flinky]

Nersisyan can go to a soft place. Tu-160 are needed. Needed.

[Des10]

The article photograph is not a Tu-160. Rather, the Tu-22M. Not serious for an analytical aviation theme.

[FID]

The photograph is Tu-22M3, and the photograph was taken at KAPO (or KAZ, as it is now fashionable to say), in workshop 07 ...

[Lenin]

TU-160 is simply necessary and I am sincerely glad that their production will be resumed. This plane is our heritage and tranquility at our borders.

[FID]

I apologize, but the desire to resume production and the resumption itself are, as they said in Odessa, two big differences ...

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Honestly, I have some hope for this - it turns out that the TU-160 is too much for us and at least a little stir - maybe we will fail the Tu-160 renewal program, but at least we will prepare for PAK YES ...
No, I'm still an indestructible optimist

[FID]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

No, I'm still an indestructible optimist

You look who goes to the left of Shoigu ... Maybe a lot will become clear ...

[biznaw]

So what. There is no one with the MIG or Yak, but this is understandable because they cannot really help either by cooperation or people, unlike Sukhoi.

[glasha3032]

Sergey Ivanovich! I wanted to ask a question - about the ABSU-200 moving to the city of S ... comrade, will the stands also leave us?

[FID]

Quote: glasha3032

Sergey Ivanovich! I wanted to ask a question - about the ABSU-200 moving to the city of S ... comrade, will the stands also leave us?

Break down during disassembly, I think. And they won’t get anywhere ...

[saturn.mmm]

Quote: SSI

Break down during disassembly, I think. And they won’t get anywhere ..

Hello Sergey.
More recently, there was news about the production of PD-14, what is your opinion about this engine.
Antonovites’s situation is not so good, are there any kinds of teams in Russia?

[FID]

Quote: saturn.mmm

More recently, there was news about the production of PD-14, what is your opinion on this engine

Excuse me, I’m an ignoramus about motors, how to talk about specials ... But, you see, both Pratt-Witney and J-M make a motor of the same power with a thrust of 14 tons, so they plan to equip the MS-21 (Yak-242) with either or other. I'm afraid that we are in the deep pit on the motors. Yes, Perm motors are a very, very good company, but they do not decide which motors will be used.

[saturn.mmm]

Quote: SSI

Yes, Perm motors are a very, very good company, but they do not decide which motors will be used.

Nothing can be seen in Russia; probably, the one from the left will decide.
Did you manage to attract your son to your work, if not a secret of course?

[Daemonicus]

Quote: Kalinov Most

Quote: Rus2012

In ours - everything is worked out backward, wringing it off from recent invaders ...

Could it be more specific that they have squeezed out recent privatizers? Yukos and .... everything? Not a lot ... Yes, and you can not call HODOR RECENT privatizer.
On the contrary, the place of the LONG privatizers was taken NOT by long ago. Or have you heard of the second wave of privatization?
Yes, and MAIN privatization - PRIVATIZATION of power is not such a long-standing action - you can’t shove it into the 90s

And it didn’t occur to you who bought the shares of Russian companies in 2014 at ridiculous prices and why did our government react for so long to the ruble fall? And can you answer the question of where did the Central Bank get funds to increase our ranks?
Ps Nobody squeezed anything and will not squeeze it, they will sell it architecto again, they will buy it back cheaply again. This was done, and so will many, including ours.

[xomaNN]

As today would be the way a dozen Tu-160s, which were to please the Americans "pros .... ny" and destroyed in the Ukraine. airfields Uzina and Priluk. And after all, Russia was ready to exchange them on gas barter. So the "Ukrainian .. deflection" under the Yankees began back in the 90s

[Pakistan_007]

And I advise you the same. Maybe even heal like people.
in \ in Ukraine now there is a fight against corruption, the economy is rising, but what about Russia?
As always, catch up and overtake? But for some reason, you always find yourself forward ...
There, they even intended to produce an aircraft that passed flight tests 46 years ago, and this is not even the retirement age for any type of aircraft.
What is one more country on the planet that relies on nuclear weapons !!!
The United States has long abandoned the "total war", China was not going to accept it.

[glasha3032]

We use nuclear weapons - DO NOT LOAD!

[Governor]

Well, the authorities proved their failure by direct return to Soviet developments in 2015 completely.
Although for hurray hurray for Vovan's defenders, restoring a "penny" would be the right thought ... Clowns.
It was necessary to restore tu160 about 10 years ago, and now ... And now it is necessary to look at a straight line.
Here the question of a war is constantly slipping through. I can hardly imagine why Russia can fight the United States.

[Willywonka]

I’m wondering what is so special about Tu 95 that everyone praises it. EPR is comparable to the area of ​​a football field. I may be mistaken, but in the conditions of VD, Tu95 pilots are very at risk. IMHO the most important characteristic today for strat.beber EPR, the time of preparation for the departure. By the way, who will tell you how much time and how much fuel goes to refueling the Tu 160?

[goose]

Quote: WillyWonka

I’m wondering what is so special about Tu 95 that everyone praises it. EPR is comparable to the area of ​​a football field. I may be mistaken, but in the conditions of VD, Tu95 pilots are very at risk. IMHO the most important characteristic today for strat.beber EPR, the time of preparation for the departure. By the way, who will tell you how much time and how much fuel goes to refueling the Tu 160?

This is a relatively inexpensive to operate aircraft with a huge range of flight. Given its characteristics, it can use the main weapons from areas devoid of air defense and radar. We really lack a bomber similar in concept, relatively inexpensive and efficient in load-range versus weak or absent air defense. For example, made from An-12 or IL-114.

[opus]

Quote: Author Leonid Nersisyan

Tu-160: the resumption of construction of "White Swans" - patching holes?

What the author wanted to download ... did not understand. Even when the author posted at the beginning of the photo of the repaired long-range aircraft Tu-22M

The Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation Sergey Shoigu during his working visit to Kazan on 4 on June 2014, visited the Kazan Aviation Plant named after S.P. Gorbunova is a branch of Tupolev OJSC, where he got acquainted with the progress of the state defense order.

During the visit, the head of the Ministry of Defense was informed about the transfer of the repaired Tu-22МЗ long-range aircraft, the second according to the plan of this year, to the Air Force and about the readiness for delivery of the Tu-214 aircraft, which had undergone a modernization program according to the order of the defense department. During the workshop, among the new projects being carried out in Kazan, the creation of a promising long-range aviation complex was discussed.

There was no bazaar about the Tu-160 (M). PAK FA was discussed
About Tu-160 it was 19.12.14

[studentmati]

The last Tu-160, which was named "Vitaliy Kopylov", was launched at the Kazan Aviation Plant named after S.P. Gorbunov in 2008.

In aviation, the concept of "last" is really the last, then "zero", nothing, emptiness, death.
When talking about revival, it is appropriate to speak extreme.

[Zomanus]

Something burst into tears in the comments ... I understand that. Over the years of hard times, we have steadily rolled back even from our previous positions in some sectors: heavy machine building, machine tool building, microelectronics ... Somewhere there’s less rollback, somewhere more. And now, in these sectors, we need to first achieve our previous positions, and then to surpass them. Achieve by itself already at a modern base. So there is the achievement of the old positions, reaching the starting position for new achievements. And if you try to adapt the defense system in parallel to civilian needs, it will set even greater potential. Uniforms, means of communication and detection, vehicles ... And again, people will begin to chase things released by our defense industry.

[goose]

Quote: maai

It’s a pity you’re not working in Gazprom, you would have gasified all of Russia long ago.

Worked next to Gazprom-Invest. 100% of employees on Mercedes, the dress code is this. There was 1 BMW, it was always driven into the very corner of the parking lot. I asked how this is possible: employees are bought Mercier on the basis of leasing, roughly speaking, after 3 years of operation, the car is bought for about 10-25% of the initial cost, depending on the number of accidents during this period. Budget ...
The guards and the girls at the reception really creep up to the bow. I saw a drag that was arranged by a girl who was 7 minutes late for work, there were screams for the whole block. Tin.

[Kasimov]

Quote: ancient

And you do not be afraid If suddenly a "miracle" happens and "there will be a restoration of production of Tu-160"

Do not be afraid a miracle will happen.

[colobo]

With the existing education system in Russia, new aircraft will not be developed soon. The State Department eats its bread for good reason.

[SergeySeverny]

if the TU-160 was not needed, then its need should have been invented
I completely agree with this conclusion