MMRCA Indian tender: three years of fruitless negotiations

42
January 31 marks exactly three years from the date of the announcement of the results of the MMRCA tender. A few years ago, the Indian armed forces expressed their intention to acquire new fighters and had long since chosen the desired aircraft. Nevertheless, negotiations on the future contract have been going on for three years, but so far have not led to its signing. Throughout all past time, the customer and supplier of aircraft technicians can not agree on the specific terms of the contract. At the end of last year, the epic with the supply of fighters received its continuation.

The MMRCA (Medium Multirole Combat Aircraft) tender was launched in 2007. His goal was to purchase 126 medium multipurpose fighters for the Indian Air Force. Applications for the competition were filed by six aircraft manufacturers. In particular, the Russian industry offered the Indian military MiG-35 aircraft. In 2011, the "finalists" of the competition were identified - the French Dassault Rafale aircraft and the European Eurofighter Typhoon. The final result of the tender was announced three years ago. The Indian Air Force chose the French fighter. Shortly thereafter, negotiations began on a future contract, which for various reasons continues to this day.

At the very end of last year, Indian Defense Minister Manohar Parrikar made an important statement regarding the current situation in the negotiation process. According to the minister, there are certain difficulties that make it difficult to conclude a contract and start supplying aircraft. First of all, they are connected with the position of the French side, which does not wish to undertake certain obligations offered by the Indian military. In addition, M. Parrikar expressed a very interesting thesis about the prospects for the purchase of aircraft for the Indian Air Force. If it is decided to abandon the purchase of Rafale fighter jets, then, according to the Minister, the Indian Air Force will be able to purchase an additional batch of Su-30MKI planes.



An important feature of the December statements of M. Parrikar is the fact that for the first time since the beginning of the tender MMRCA, a high-ranking Indian official acknowledges the existence of problems in the negotiation process on a future contract. Nevertheless, the very fact of the appearance of such statements cannot yet be regarded as a kind of signal, after which the situation should change radically. In addition, we should not forget the statements of the Indian Minister made during the negotiations with his French counterpart in early December last year. Then M. Parrikar argued that negotiations on the future contract will be completed soon.

A few days after the press conference of M. Parricar, new reports appeared in foreign media about possible options for further developments around the long-suffering contract. Thus, according to the Indian edition of The New Economic Times, the Indian Ministry of Defense is already considering the possibility of refusing to continue negotiations with France. By refusing Dassault to buy its equipment, the Indian military will buy Russian Su-30MKI planes. It should be noted that the corresponding publication was published without any references to official sources in the Indian military.

A little later, the Indian Air Force was forced to comment on media reports. The press service of the Air Force did not confirm the published information about the possible rejection of the purchase of "Rafale" in favor of Su-30MKI.



The main problem hindering the signing of the contract is disagreement about the approach to the production of ordered aircraft. Indian Air Force want to buy 126 fighters. In this case, 18 machines are supposed to be purchased in finished form, and the remaining 108 should be built by the Indian company HAL. Thus, the contract involves the transfer of all necessary technologies and documentation, so that an Indian company will be able to engage in the licensed construction of fighters.

Earlier it was reported that the proposal of the Indian Air Force is not fully satisfied with the company Dassault. French aircraft manufacturers, taking into account the requirements of customers, offered to sign two contracts. In accordance with the first in France, the first batch of 18 aircraft will be built, and the second will stipulate the conditions and procedure for the construction of the remaining fighters at the Indian plant. The fact is that Dassault does not want to take full responsibility for the production of aircraft in India. These disagreements were one of the reasons that the parties have not been able to sign the contract in three years.

At the beginning of last year, financial problems were added to disagreements regarding the organization of production. Initially, in 2007, it was estimated that approximately 126 billion US dollars would be spent on the purchase of 12 aircraft. By the beginning of 2012, the estimated contract value had risen to 18 billion. In January, 2014, the company Dassault announced a change in prices for its products. Previously, the cost of one aircraft was approximately 65 million dollars, and the new price reached 120 million. Thus, the approximate value of the contract should exceed 30 billion dollars.

To date, the Indo-French negotiations are deadlocked and are unlikely to be able to get out of it while maintaining the existing positions. India wants to buy modern aircraft and establish their own production, and France refuses responsibility for cars built in India, at the same time raising the price of them. As a result, the positions of the parties simply do not allow finding a common language and in the near future to complete an order of protracted negotiations.

While officials and merchants are trying to find a way out of the current situation, specialists and the public again discuss a possible contract for the supply of Rafale fighter jets. In the Indian press, there were again calls to abandon the contract with the French company and continue cooperation with Russia. In light of recent events, the Su-30MKI fighter, mentioned by M. Parrikar, can be considered a good alternative to the French car.

The aircraft of Russian production in a number of parameters has an advantage over the French fighter. There is a certain superiority in flight data and combat qualities. In addition, the Su-30MKI is half the price of the French Dassault Rafale. The construction of one such aircraft in Indian enterprises costs about 56 million dollars. After last year’s increase in the value of the French aircraft, the price advantage of the Russian becomes undeniable. However, Su-30MKI has one feature that can prevent its ordering. The MMRCA tender had as its goal the selection and purchase of medium-sized fighters, and Su-30MKI belongs to the heavy class. From this can follow certain technical and tactical limitations that will not allow to change plans for the purchase and operation of equipment.

In the context of the latter News negotiations between India and France are sometimes recalled by recent events in Europe, which may well be an additional reason for prolonging consultations. Currently, official Paris refuses to transfer to Russia the Mistral-type landing ship ordered by it (the first of two under construction). The reason for this is the current Ukrainian crisis and the position of Moscow. The French leadership claims that there are currently “no conditions” for the transfer of the ship.

According to popular belief, Paris is pulling a ship because the American leadership is putting pressure on it. Unwilling to spoil relations with one of the main partners, the leaders of France are forced to quarrel with Russia. One of the consequences of the current situation with landing ships may be the loss of reputation. Now France is among the five largest suppliers of weapons and military equipment. However, the refusal to transfer ships for political reasons may hit her image as a reliable partner. Seeing such a precedent, potential customers may refuse to purchase French products and turn to other suppliers.

It cannot be excluded that the Indian Ministry of Defense is not only well aware of the situation around the Mistrals, but also drew the appropriate conclusions from it. It is possible that now the Indian military will be wary of their partners, given the possible risks of a political nature.

Last year, the company "Dassault" raised the prices of their aircraft, but the requirements of the Indian Air Force regarding the number of purchased equipment remained the same. In this regard, the Indian Ministry of Defense has every reason to take measures to reduce the total value of the contract. One of the tools of such work can be various statements by high-ranking officials hinting at a possible termination of negotiations and the purchase of equipment produced outside of France.

Anyway, M. Parrikar was forced to admit that the negotiation process on possible future deliveries of Dassault Rafale fighter jets faces certain difficulties. Moreover, he had to talk about the possibility of purchasing aircraft of other types. All this may indicate that for three years the parties have not been able to agree and form mutually beneficial terms of the contract. This means that the contract for the supply of Dassault Rafale aircraft is unlikely to be signed in the near future. Moreover, the very possibility of such a transaction raises more and more doubts.


On the materials of the sites:
http://business-standard.com/
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/
http://ria.ru/
http://vz.ru/
http://bmpd.livejournal.com/
42 comments
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  1. Alexey K.
    +10
    27 January 2015 06: 05
    Indians got lost - they would take our Mig 35 and sleep peacefully. Our need to bring Mig 35 to the mind and put it first in the Russian Armed Forces. And then the Indians to offer.
    1. +6
      27 January 2015 06: 12
      The Hindus need technology! Our planes are excellent, but! AFAR is on the same Rafals. That’s what we can’t give yet! That's why they are trying to get French planes. In order to combine our and Western technologies in the future and build their plane on their basis hi
      1. +2
        27 January 2015 07: 39
        And on 30 su not AFAR worth ????
        1. +4
          27 January 2015 07: 47
          Quote: 09061982
          And on 30 su not AFAR worth ????

          1. Not worth it.
          2. Su-30s are manufactured in India, they are so familiar with the technologies of its production in India that they repair Su-30s in Vietnam.
          3. India needs modern aircraft technology.
          1. +4
            27 January 2015 08: 07
            3. India needs modern aircraft technology.


            You want to say that Su-30 is already yesterday? belay
            1. +2
              27 January 2015 13: 36
              Quote: Nevsky_ZU
              You want to say that the Su-30 is already yesterday? belay

              For the Indians, yes, what can they learn from him?
              1. Pervusha Isaev
                +8
                27 January 2015 14: 52
                Quote: Nayhas
                For the Indians, yes, what can they learn from him?


                how sharply they slipped through level 4, do you think they can make engines, or airplane radars, or missiles, bombs? they don’t know how to do this, but they know how to rivet airplanes, well, even cast langerons ...
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. +1
            27 January 2015 09: 37
            A AFAR on ours, where is ????
            1. +5
              27 January 2015 14: 34
              At Mig-31, by the way, this is the first aircraft in the world with AFAR if I am not mistaken
              1. +2
                28 January 2015 12: 14
                Hmm, they did it too ... None of our production aircraft have AFARs, MiG-31s.
            2. +2
              27 January 2015 17: 55
              AFAR is planned only at PAK FA, like the BEETLE - this is AFAR on the MiG-35.
              The Su-35s is equipped with the IRBIS HEADLIGHTS. By the way, I'm not special in this, but I remember vaf even wrote that it is not a fact that the PAR always loses.

              1. +2
                27 January 2015 18: 10
                Quote: silver_roman
                the fact that the PAR is always losing.

                It just requires more emitter power.
        2. +7
          27 January 2015 08: 04
          Quote: 09061982
          And on 30 su not AFAR worth ????


          On MIG-35 stood AFAR like?

          And on the SU-30 passive stands. It's not bad too.
      2. +9
        27 January 2015 08: 15
        On the MIG-35 stands AFAR. What technology are you talking about ????

        And the Indian competition was pissed away, because "Russian Ivan", as always, does everything a day before the exam, and MIG went to the competition with a prototype of AFAR and all the assurances that you will buy and we will finish the Indians did not give a ride :)
        1. +5
          27 January 2015 08: 22
          Quote: SergeySh
          On the MIG-35 stands AFAR. What technology are you talking about ????

          And the Indian competition was pissed away, because "Russian Ivan", as always, does everything a day before the exam, and MIG went to the competition with a prototype of AFAR and all the assurances that you will buy and we will finish the Indians did not give a ride :)


          Radar Beetle-AE, isn't it? Do you have data from RSK MiG?
          About these:

        2. +8
          27 January 2015 15: 04
          The Indians wanted a mass-produced product. At the time of the tender, and even now, the MiG-35 is not mass-produced. And there is a new avionics and engine. Buying a non-serial and unfinished car means taking a pig in a poke. What the Indian side did not want. That's the whole answer to the question of why the MiG lost.
        3. The comment was deleted.
      3. 0
        27 January 2015 23: 22
        However, it is precisely on the MiG-35 AFAR that it is. But yes, the Indians wanted to get acquainted with the French production technology. While familiarization is not very.
      4. 0
        1 February 2015 17: 55
        Hindus need technology! ...! Therefore, they are trying to get French planes. In order to combine our and Western technologies in the future and build their own aircraft on their basis
        Take an interest in the rules of India for the purchase of weapons. They had a requirement that the equipment was cut in half, half of ours, the second NATO one, they do not want to be left without spare parts in case of any possible sanctions. Now they have more than 80% of our aircraft, so the Indians immediately said that Russia would not win in tendar.
    2. Pervusha Isaev
      0
      27 January 2015 14: 45
      in general, it's time to earn extra money at the same time the infidels Indians punish. Prices have risen so that not 56 lemons now, but 120 well, we will give you 100 as old friends, the next time you will be smarter ...
      1. 0
        28 January 2015 12: 08
        EURO is currently in France, and it has fallen by 30% against the dollar. So in dollar terms it is quite possible that the aircraft will become cheaper. But the main question for the Indians is still technology, well, of course, for reasonable profits.
    3. 0
      29 January 2015 04: 17
      it is worth noting that ours, too, "got lost" in their time: they did not fly to India for the final "show", considering that the tender was already in their pockets. The Hindus were offended. so you can understand them, but the French turned out to be much worse partners. and my heart senses that in the near future, the French from the five leading arms suppliers will fly into the second dozen, like a champagne cork, with such a policy ...
  2. +8
    27 January 2015 07: 04
    Quote: Alexey K.
    Indians got lost - they would take our Mig 35 and sleep peacefully. Our need to bring Mig 35 to the mind and put it first in the Russian Armed Forces. And then the Indians to offer.


    It is necessary, but the 3 year has passed since the moment of the competition, but the MiG 35 is still not there.
    1. +2
      27 January 2015 08: 10
      Quote: CruorVult
      Quote: Alexey K.
      Indians got lost - they would take our Mig 35 and sleep peacefully. Our need to bring Mig 35 to the mind and put it first in the Russian Armed Forces. And then the Indians to offer.


      It is necessary, but the 3 year has passed since the moment of the competition, but the MiG 35 is still not there.


      Yes, a dark story with the MiG-35. There were so many videos and news that a contract has already been signed and production is planned, but things are still there ... Could such burning eyes of the general director of RSK "Mig" be deceiving? Watch carefully with 1: 50 :

  3. The comment was deleted.
  4. +5
    27 January 2015 07: 43
    Don’t say, but Rafal is a beautiful car ...
    1. +5
      27 January 2015 10: 54
      Quote: Kibalchish
      Don’t say, but Rafal is a beautiful car ...


      I agree, but with all the gloating I want am so that this "beauty" is not exported. It is more profitable for us that Rafali is only in service with France. We do not need competitors, they need to be pressed negative ! Eurofighter and Super Hornets alone are enough as competitors, no longer needed!
  5. +4
    27 January 2015 08: 01
    It cannot be ruled out that the Indian Ministry of Defense is not only well aware of the situation around the Mistrals, but also draws conclusions from it.

    The Indian Defense Ministry is well aware of the reasons and frankly do not care about the Russia-France relationship. As the author correctly pointed out the whole gag in the French, and not in the Indian side. Now there is a war of nerves, the French really need this contract, the Indians really need this plane. Hindus try to stick to their positions because they understand that they have an advantage. Rafal lost in the Brazilian tender and his positions on the world market are precarious, not a single country has bought them yet, while Typhoon and Grippen have already gone as they say to the masses ...
    PS: Honestly, the requirements of the Indians are, to put it mildly, inhuman. Demand a guarantee from Dassault for aircraft that HAL does not represent the ability to control the entire production cycle. It is unclear why the Indians need this, because it will provoke a decrease in quality, all the same, Dassault will answer for everything ...
    1. +3
      27 January 2015 11: 05
      Quote: Nayhas
      The Indian Defense Ministry is well aware of the reasons and frankly do not care about the Russia-France relationship. As the author correctly pointed out the whole gag in the French, and not in the Indian side. Now there is a war of nerves, the French really need this contract, the Indians really need this plane. Hindus try to stick to their positions because they understand that they have an advantage.


      In this situation, we must push Rafal at any cost and advance as many of our aircraft as possible.

      Quote: Nayhas
      Rafal lost in the Brazilian tender and his positions on the world market are precarious, not a single country has bought them yet, while Typhoon and Grippen have already gone as they say to the masses ...


      In Brazil, in my opinion, Rafal was the favorite, and I hoped that they would choose him and not the competitors in the tender (F / A-18 and Saab). There is an extremely complicated story, it seems to me that Saab was taken for the most part solely because of cheapness, although in other respects it was inferior to Rafal and Super Hornet.

      Quote: Nayhas
      PS: Honestly, the requirements of the Indians are, to put it mildly, inhuman. Demand a guarantee from Dassault for aircraft that HAL does not represent the ability to control the entire production cycle. It is unclear why the Indians need this, because it will provoke a decrease in quality, all the same, Dassault will answer for everything ...


      Nayhas, I don’t understand, why is it such sympathy for our competitors? On the contrary, you should be glad that the French had problems this time. Do you think the French sympathized with us when our MiG-35 lost in the tender? I would be glad if I sincerely Indians will not conclude a contract for the supply of Rafaley. am
      1. +4
        27 January 2015 11: 54
        "Saab was taken for the most part solely because of its cheapness, although
        the rest of the parameters he was inferior to Rafal and Super Hornet "///

        That's right. If to a point, then Brazilians most of all
        Super Hornet came up, because they need to patrol and defend
        long coast (oil shelf), and Hornet imprisoned for flights over the sea
        long distances. But Brazil has entered the economic lane
        difficulties, and took the cheapest.
      2. -3
        27 January 2015 13: 53
        Quote: supertiger21
        In this situation, we must push Rafal at any cost and advance as many of our aircraft as possible.

        How to move? It would be worth it ...
        Quote: supertiger21
        In Brazil, in my opinion, Rafal was the favorite, and I hoped that they would choose him and not the competitors in the tender (F / A-18 and Saab). There is an extremely complicated story, it seems to me that Saab was taken for the most part solely because of cheapness, although in other respects it was inferior to Rafal and Super Hornet.

        If you take on combat effectiveness, then undoubtedly Rafal is better, then Hornet and only then Grippen. But Brazil does not have and will not have opponents at least somehow corresponding to such power. There is enough grippen for the eyes. Well, of course, the issue price is for Grippen, it is not only cheaper in pieces, but it has no equal in operation. And what attractive conditions the Swedes drew, it was difficult to resist here ... Therefore, the Swedes won fairly.
        Quote: supertiger21
        Nayhas, I don’t understand you, why is it such sympathy for our competitors?

        I am not a shareholder of either Sukhoi Company OJSC or RSK MiG JSC, so Dassault Aviation and Saab AB are not competitors to me ...
        Quote: supertiger21
        I would be glad with all my heart if the Indians did not conclude a contract for the supply of Rafaley

        ... and contract with LM or Eurofighter GmbH? And rest will come?
    2. +3
      27 January 2015 13: 44
      Quote: Nayhas
      Honestly, the demands of the Indians are, to put it mildly, inhuman. Demand a guarantee from Dassault for aircraft that HAL does not represent the ability to control the entire production cycle. It is unclear why the Indians need this, because it will provoke a decrease in quality, all the same, Dassault will answer for everything ...

      Hindus are very fond of changing the terms of contracts, after concluding primary ones, bargaining all sorts of new conditions
    3. +2
      27 January 2015 15: 08
      Quote: Nayhas
      It cannot be ruled out that the Indian Ministry of Defense is not only well aware of the situation around the Mistrals, but also draws conclusions from it.

      PS: Honestly, the requirements of the Indians are, to put it mildly, inhuman. Demand a guarantee from Dassault for aircraft that HAL does not represent the ability to control the entire production cycle. It is unclear why the Indians need this, because it will provoke a decrease in quality, all the same, Dassault will answer for everything ...
      For such grandmothers, 120 megaevriks, paddlers could assign their inspector to every Indian worker on the HAL.
    4. The comment was deleted.
    5. 0
      27 January 2015 21: 43
      Quote: Nayhas
      The Indian Defense Ministry is well aware of the reasons and frankly do not care about the Russia-France relationship.

      The French thwarted ship deliveries to Israel, under pressure from Great Britain refused to supply missiles to Argentina (Falkland conflict), Mistral under pressure from the USA ... who is the next to put pressure on the French - Pakistan? China? No, the Hindus do not care))) even if a third party prohibits the supply of spare parts.
    6. -1
      28 January 2015 19: 40
      The Indian Defense Ministry is well aware of the reasons and frankly do not care about the Russia-France relationship.


      Of course, however, they don't give a damn about the fact that their longtime "friend" Pakistan has very friendly relations with the United States and the fact that it is because of the US position that France is not fulfilling its contractual obligations. If we draw a parallel, then we can see certain fears of Delhi in these insinuations, where there is a guarantee that if, in the event of conflicts with Pakistan, France, for example, does not suspend the supply of certain elements of Raphael's structure that will not be localized in India. And such 100% will be, for example, APM on radar or thermal imaging matrix OLS?
  6. +5
    27 January 2015 08: 28
    Quote: 09061982
    And on 30 su not AFAR worth ????

    On the Su 30 MKI there is an N011M radar with a passive phased antenna array.
    1. +1
      27 January 2015 09: 39
      And our AFAR, is there anywhere ???
      1. +5
        27 January 2015 10: 42
        T-50.

        On the current MiG-35 being the marketing of the MiG-29M / M2 = there is generally a Slit Beetle, as on a boat.

        The MiG-35 for India was essentially a flying project and a demonstrator flew, not even a prototype. The creation of which took several billion dollars and three to four years.

        Hindus thanks to good lobbying, trials and promises - have chosen serial Rafal, and AFAR and the newest TALES. The point was at minimal risk, because the car is already serial and there should not be any special problems. But problems arose in what the French thought and what the Hindus thought on the same promises? The French do not want to transfer production to India’s capacities, they want more money for the whole package (1,5 times as much as total) and the main Indian lobbyist Rafal has been pushed to where the sky is in a box and clothes are in a strip.

        By the way, against the background of Obama’s visit, perhaps the loser American will get a chance ... But the MiG there is definitely not in the top three ... sad
  7. +4
    27 January 2015 08: 31
    "The Russian-made aircraft has an advantage over the French fighter in a number of parameters. There is a certain superiority in flight performance and combat qualities. In addition, the Su-30MKI is half the price of the French Dassault Rafale." - Comparing cars of different classes is not good. If the Indians needed additional Su 30s, they would not have started a competition for a medium multipurpose combat aircraft.
  8. +2
    27 January 2015 08: 41
    Quote: Nayhas
    It cannot be ruled out that the Indian Ministry of Defense is not only well aware of the situation around the Mistrals, but also draws conclusions from it.

    The Indian Defense Ministry is well aware of the reasons and frankly do not care about the Russia-France relationship. As the author correctly pointed out the whole gag in the French, and not in the Indian side. Now there is a war of nerves, the French really need this contract, the Indians really need this plane. Hindus try to stick to their positions because they understand that they have an advantage. Rafal lost in the Brazilian tender and his positions on the world market are precarious, not a single country has bought them yet, while Typhoon and Grippen have already gone as they say to the masses ...
    PS: Honestly, the requirements of the Indians are, to put it mildly, inhuman. Demand a guarantee from Dassault for aircraft that HAL does not represent the ability to control the entire production cycle. It is unclear why the Indians need this, because it will provoke a decrease in quality, all the same, Dassault will answer for everything ...

    The impudence of the Indians is that they need the technology for the production of modern Raphales. Hindus are accustomed to the fact that the Union and Russia, selling them their equipment as a bonus, sells a license for their production, so they demand "full stuffing" from the French.
    1. +1
      27 January 2015 14: 20
      Quote: La-5
      The impudence of the Indians is that they need the technology for the production of modern Raphales. Hindus are accustomed to the fact that the Union and Russia, selling them their equipment as a bonus, sells a license for their production, so they demand "full stuffing" from the French.

      All the same, the situation is strange. India has rich experience in trading with France, moreover, the contribution of the French to Indian aircraft construction is huge. I have no doubt that in India they value this, but here they are clearly driving the French into a corner ... Why?
      I can only assume there is some US influence. The United States entered the Indian arms market rather cheerfully, while openly dumping ... but not with the price, but with the offer. In reality, the United States offers the widest range of weapons, while the Congress gives good for everything instead of the typical "can you sell them?" Well, how can you not think about it ... Do I need to spend so much money on Rafale, when you can get F-35 technology, and the Americans will also help create their own 5G ...
  9. +3
    27 January 2015 08: 44
    120 million for the plane !!! not sickly.
  10. +2
    27 January 2015 10: 20
    The Indians somehow wanted to buy the Hawk TCB from England. 20 years old they agreed, but received the planes on their own terms. The French will also press it, not now so later.
    1. +1
      27 January 2015 11: 53
      Hawk is still a training aircraft. And 20 years is a lot. Rafal may not reach this deadline.
  11. +2
    27 January 2015 11: 25
    Quote: 09061982
    And our AFAR, is there anywhere ???

    No, the T-50 will be installed.
    1. +2
      27 January 2015 15: 22
      On the Su-35S, possibly with a planned modernization.
  12. The comment was deleted.
  13. +3
    27 January 2015 11: 38
    still, I understand the French. You can not give out your latest developments right and left. Plus, the desire to provide their plants with work, not Indian.
    But on the other hand, the Indians will also not wait forever. And the French really need to conclude a major contract for rafal. Quite a few of them were produced, 121 (5 lost). In NATO, priority is given to eurofighter. Apart from India, hardly anyone will buy it. Otherwise, the entire project can be lost.
  14. 0
    27 January 2015 15: 21
    Quote: 09061982
    And on 30 su not AFAR worth ????

    PFAR stands there
  15. +3
    27 January 2015 18: 15
    Quote: Nayhas
    Quote: 09061982
    And on 30 su not AFAR worth ????

    1. Not worth it.

    The SU-30 is equipped with a radar system with PFAR, and according to experts, it detects fighter-type targets at a range of 150-170 km.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTevMzPNj3o
    Rafal does have a radar with AFAR, but the aircraft itself is light, its maximum mass is 24 tons (the SU-30 is 10 tons heavier than it, it has 34). It is unlikely that with such a mass of the aircraft, its radar, even if it is with AFAR, will detect targets further than the PFAR of a heavy air superiority aircraft.
    I think that although technologically the Rafal radar is more perfect, the range of its action is not higher, and at best, is approximately equal to the range of the SU-30 radar.
    Most likely, the Indians need "Rafali" only to gain access to new technologies for them. As for the combat advantages of the Rafale over the SU-30, they are practically nonexistent, and most likely, they will lose to the SU-30. The combat advantage is essentially only one: "Rafale", due to its lower weight, is easier to adapt to being based on an aircraft carrier.
  16. +3
    27 January 2015 23: 44
    Quote: kot11180
    At Mig-31, by the way, this is the first aircraft in the world with AFAR if I am not mistaken


    You are wrong. The radar-8B "Zaslon" for the MiG-31 was for a long time the first and only radar in the world with a phased array, but, alas, a Passive one.
    By the way, on the basis of the MiG "Zaslon", the N-011M "Bars" radar was also built for the Indian Su-30MKI. Barça's weight has been reduced from 250 to 100kg.
  17. 0
    28 January 2015 00: 07
    Quote: Pimply
    Hindus are very fond of changing the terms of contracts, after concluding primary ones, bargaining all sorts of new conditions


    East is a delicate matter! And if we consider that for Eastern men it is TRADITIONAL, there are no occupations more respected than war and trade, then such behavior with regard to the purchase of military equipment on their part looks at least natural.
    Here it would be appropriate to recall the death of the creator of the "Indian" T-90, Vladimir Ivanovich Potkin, who undermined his health a lot during the long bargaining with our ally.