Interest in "Piranhas" on Euronaval-2014

29
In the past few weeks, on the background of events in the Baltic Sea, discussions of Soviet / Russian projects of small submarines began again. Such a technique, designed to perform various special tasks, is of particular interest, and in some situations may cause the emergence of conspiracy theories. Interest in the subject of small submarines has increased thanks to the Russian exposition at the recent exhibition Euronaval-2014, where Malachit presented some of its developments in this area.



At the SPMBM Malachite stand four projects of small submarines with different characteristics were presented at once. Potential customers are offered submarines with a displacement from 218 to 750 tons, differing in size and other characteristics. So, the crew of the smallest of the proposed submarines consists of 5 people, although, according to experts, it can manage one person. The maximum crew in the submarine family is the 9 man. In addition, the proposed small submarines can carry up to 6 combat swimmers with weapons and equipment.

According to available data, some foreign countries in need of means of protection of various objects are showing interest in small submarines developed by the Malachite SPMBM. However, so far the proposed submarines remain at the project stage, since no one has expressed a desire to purchase such equipment. For this reason, the fate of new projects remains in question. It is possible that in the near future the Malakhit SPMBM will begin negotiations on the construction of small submarines for any customers.

It should be noted that the current projects of small submarines created in the Malachite SPMBM are not the first domestic developments in this field. Since the late eighties, the Navy of the USSR and Russia has exploited two small submarines of the Piranha project 865. The creation of the 865 project began in the mid-eighties at the request of the Navy command. The aim of the project was the development of a small submarine capable of operating in the coastal zone at depths of 10-200 meters and performing reconnaissance or other combat missions. New submarines had to ensure the work of combat swimmers, carry mine and torpedo weapons and various equipment. The maximum displacement of the Piranha submarines was limited to 80 tons.

L.V. was appointed the chief designer of the project 865 "Piranha" Chernopyatov. Later, in 1984, he was replaced by Yu.K. Mineev. Observer from the naval fleet the captain of the 2nd rank A.E. was appointed Mikhailovsky. Design work, which began in 1976, encountered certain difficulties. Design Bureau "Malachite" had no experience in creating small submarines, which is why for the first time in his practice he had to solve a number of specific issues. Due to the lack of required experience, specialists conducted a large number of studies and tests. The design of the Piranha boats was completed in the first half of the eighties. The lead submarine was laid at the Leningrad Admiralty Association in the summer of 1984.



The submarines of the 865 project received a two-part design with a developed superstructure to accommodate various equipment and weapons. The robust case was proposed to be made of titanium alloys. Its characteristics were calculated taking into account the immersion to a depth of 200 m. The light hull contours were created taking into account the developments on single-shaft submarines, as a result of which the Piranhas received an ellipsoidal bow and tapering tailpiece with a propeller and rudders. An interesting feature of the outer contours of the submarines of the 865 project are cargo containers located outside the robust hull on the sides of the cabin.

The original terms of reference involved the creation of a submarine with a displacement of no more than 80 tons, but during the development of the project, it became clear that this parameter should be significantly increased. As a result, the surface displacement of the Piranha submarines reached 218 t, the underwater displacement - 318 t. The total length of the submarines was equal to 28,2 m, width - 4,8 m, average draft - 3,9 m.

The diesel-electric power plant of the 865 submarines of the submarines had full electric propulsion. The basis of the power plant was a diesel generator power 160 kW. In addition, lead-acid batteries were used on small submarines. In the rear part of the submarines there was a rowing electric motor with power 60 kW. The engine rotated the propeller, enclosed in an annular channel. For maneuvering and effective control at low speeds, the annular channel of the screw was made in the form of a rotary nozzle, used as a rudder.

The units of the power plant were located in the aft compartment, however, the accumulator pit was located in the middle part of the hull, under the central post. In the central post there were jobs for three members of the crew of the submarine and all the equipment necessary to manage it. Submarines of the 865 project were equipped with radar and hydroacoustic stations, communication equipment, etc. The periscope and the radar retractable shaft were located in front of the central post.

In the forward part of the strong hull, in front of the central post, there was a lock chamber designed to ensure the work of divers without the need to ascend. In the bulkhead between the central post and the airlock, there was a hatch, a porthole and a small gateway for the transfer of various objects. The airlock was controlled from the central post. The camera provided access and reception of combat swimmers at depths up to 60 m.

Own crew submarines project 865 "Piranha" consisted of three people. The work of the various systems was controlled by the commander-navigator, electronic weapons assistant and assistant to the electromechanical part. The autonomy of the submarine - 10 day.

To carry out sabotage missions, the Piranha submarine could take on board up to six combat swimmers with equipment. Inside the robust hull, only diving breathing apparatus was transported. Other equipment was placed in two sealed containers in the superstructure of the hull. Submarines of the 865 project could not only deliver swimmers to the operation site, but also ensure their work. If necessary, divers could replenish stocks of the gas mixture and use electricity supplied from the boat.

Cargo containers, located in the superstructure of the hull, made it possible to transport various diving equipment and small-sized weapons. Each such container was a metal cylinder with a length of 12 m and a diameter of 0,62 m, equipped with a sliding tray with a drive. The dimensions of the containers allowed the Piranha submarines to carry two Siren-U type diving towers or four Proton tows. In addition, there were two mine-laying devices in the superstructure, each containing two PMT bottom mines. The mine setting using a special drive pushed mines forward along the submarine.

The small dimensions of the submarines of the 865 project and the specific hull lines did not allow them to be equipped with a sufficiently powerful power plant capable of providing high performance. For this reason, the surface speed of the Pirani did not exceed the 6,4 node, the subsea - 6,7 node. The economic speed was the 4 node. In the surface position, the range reached 1000 miles, in submarine (at an economic speed) - only 260 miles.

Construction of the submarine project 865 began in 1984 year. The MS-520 submarine was launched on August 20 1986. Tests of the new submarine required a lot of time, as a result of which it became part of the Baltic Fleet only at the end of the 1988 year. The second submarine of the project, MC-521, was laid in December 87-th and launched at the end of May 1990. In December of the same year, she was also accepted into the Baltic Fleet. In 1988, the third submarine of the series, which received the designation MC-518, was laid. However, due to political and economic problems, construction has stalled, and at the end of January 91 was officially terminated.

Initially, both Piranhas were based in Liepāja, but after the collapse of the Soviet Union they were transferred to Kronstadt. Each of the new submarines had two replaceable crews, another crew was formed to service the new technology. It is known that in the year 1992 one of the crews of the head MS-520 was reduced. After a short service of 1 in September of 1994, all crews of small submarines of the 865 project were disbanded, and the submarines themselves were removed from the fleet and sent to sludge.

31 July 1996, both Piranha submarines were excluded from the Navy. It was decided to dispose of. According to some reports, various organizations offered to install submarines as monuments or museum exhibits, but the lack of funding prevented the implementation of these proposals. In 1998, one of the Piranhas was used during the filming of The Peculiarities of National Fishing. In the same year, the submarines were sold for disposal. The submarines were cut to metal in the 1999 year.

Back in the nineties, the Malachite SPMBM specialists began work on updating the 865 project. So there were several new projects with the designations "Piranha-T", "Piranha-2", P-130, P-550, etc. All of them represent the development of a basic 865 project using new equipment and weapons. So, in the line of proposed projects there were submarines with new power plants, increased armament, more advanced electronic equipment, etc. At the same time, the early versions of the modernization of the Piranha project meant the preservation or minor change in the size and displacement of the submarine.

Of particular interest is the weapons provided by the projects on the basis of "Piranha". The designers of SPMBM "Malachite", through the use of new ideas and equipment, managed to equip it with two torpedo tubes of caliber 533 mm (project П-170) without any special changes in size. Increasing the size of the submarine (displacement up to 1000 t and length around 70 m), implied by the П-750 project and its variants, allows equipping it not only with torpedo, but also with rocket armament.

Since 1993, Malachit SPMBM regularly brings materials on its projects of small submarines to various exhibitions. The first demonstration of projects for potential customers from foreign countries was held at the IDEX-1993 exhibition in the United Arab Emirates. A large number of different projects, differing from each other in different characteristics, equipment composition and other features, allows us to speculate about the great export potential of the new Pirani. However, over the past two decades, all small submarines remain at the project stage. So far, no one has expressed a desire to acquire such equipment for their naval forces.


On the materials of the sites:
http://rg.ru/
http://ria.ru/
http://navy.su/
http://deepstorm.ru/
http://bastion-karpenko.narod.ru/
29 comments
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  1. +1
    7 November 2014 08: 05
    I wonder if the installation of an air-independent power plant is implied?
    1. 0
      7 November 2014 08: 44
      Quote: saag
      I wonder if the installation of an air-independent power plant is implied?

      Most likely as soon as the tests are completed.
      1. jjj
        0
        7 November 2014 12: 15
        We had atomic "kids"
        1. Demetry
          0
          7 November 2014 20: 09
          Which? which project?
          1. jjj
            +2
            7 November 2014 20: 47
            On the left, the AS-23 project 1851, on the right, pr. 1910. We stood at the wall of the "Zvezdochka"
            1. Demetry
              +1
              7 November 2014 21: 49
              Well, these are not combat boats. Experimental, scientific research. Another project 10831. In addition, they were not and are now. and not only with us. The smallest, if not mistaken, was the American boat NR-1 Jason. She's generally a little bit bigger than Piranha.



              I thought this was about the 705 Lear project, our smallest nuclear-powered combat ships talk.
    2. Denis fj
      +2
      7 November 2014 19: 29
      A good advertisement for the Russian submarine fleet was created by the Swedes, who invented the presence of the Russian mini-submarine off their coasts. laughing
  2. +14
    7 November 2014 08: 43
    On July 31, 1996, both Piranha submarines were expelled from the Navy. It was decided to dispose of


    Mismanagement, why dispose of. It was necessary to sell to Colombia, there such boats are worth their weight in gold, they have nothing to smuggle cocaine into americosia, and they rivet them themselves from what they have. laughing


    Homemade Colombian submarine.
    1. Serjant_VS_SSSR
      +2
      7 November 2014 22: 41
      They work in the wrong direction: They went to a position, instead of a warhead, they struck 20-70 kg of selected coca with a torpedo, pramo to Miami beach, and of course friends met there, it’s hard to intercept, I’m joking!
  3. +10
    7 November 2014 08: 46
    Well, what a bastard decided to utilize unique special boats, which are not even ten years old ??? ....
    1. +15
      7 November 2014 08: 52
      If this bastard was in the singular, otherwise the name is legion and still live onet to this day. But the boats were unique for that time and for the present too
      1. Demetry
        -1
        7 November 2014 12: 07
        Quote: gregor6549
        And the boats were unique for that time and for the present too

        And what is its uniqueness? Explain. What did she possess so much that made her head and shoulders above other boats?
        1. +4
          7 November 2014 14: 13
          Firstly, exceptionally low noise
          Secondly, the ability to act in the depth range from 10 to 200 m.
          Thirdly, with a very modest displacement, a very powerful radio and sonar weapons and 10 daily autonomy.
          1. Demetry
            -1
            7 November 2014 16: 28
            Quote: gregor6549
            Firstly, exceptionally low noise

            All modern diesel-electric submarines, nuclear submarines have extremely low noise. This is their hobby. Moreover, as I understand it, you have no data on the noise parameters. Therefore, this is only an assumption.
            Quote: gregor6549
            Secondly, the ability to act in the depth range from 10 to 200 m.

            Oh wow!!! The fact that the submarines plunged below 200 meters into World War II is not about that? The fact that modern submarines have an immersion of 300 to 600 meters is so-so ... And diesel easily more than 200.
            I honestly did not understand what is unique in the fact that the submarine sinks 200 meters. It's like saying that the "N" aircraft is unique because it can fly .... Sorry. wink

            Quote: gregor6549
            Thirdly, with a very modest displacement, a very powerful radio and sonar weapons and 10 daily autonomy.

            That's right. There are almost no weapons on the submarine. Therefore, a sufficiently strong radio electronics was put on the vacant seat. Take out all the weapons from any small submarine and you can cram into it the same at your discretion. I exaggerate, of course, but I think the idea is clear.

            As a result, the question remains. What is so unique about her? It is unique and not standard? And why over the past 20 years, NO ONE FLEET IN THE WORLD, including the Russian, was not interested in this boat?

            PS By the way, do you know that its underwater speed is 2-3 times lower than that of similar-sized Germanic buildings 50 years ago? Well, the range is 3-5 times lower than the same Germans?
      2. TeR
        TeR
        +1
        8 November 2014 16: 32
        However, there are very specific signatures on the documents.
        Surnames are known ...
    2. Serjant_VS_SSSR
      +1
      7 November 2014 22: 51
      Only two were built. The operation of these boats has shown that they are very complicated technically, they have no rudders, they have rotary propellers. Although time is not worth it, the technical, production capabilities and high automation of boat operation are now at a completely different level. In a word, the idea of ​​"PIRANHA" is super. But at that moment it was simply ahead of its time!
      1. +5
        8 November 2014 09: 07
        For questions about the noise parameters, contact the 1 department and the regime department of the design office where these Piranhas were developed. Immediately they will answer and imprison for excessive curiosity.
        And so many people lay out too much technical and other data on this site, trying to show their awareness. So, after all, TsRUshnikov can be left without work. And after all, they need to feed families. This is the time.

        About the range of depths. Just the most valuable thing in these boats is their ability to sail in shallow water, and not the ability to dive to great depths. These are two

        And three. It is necessary to compare these boats not with the carriers of ballistic and cruise missiles, but with P / Ls of a similar purpose, for example, with the same "wet" Tritons, on which not only were there no weapons, but, forgive me, the crew's eggs froze over in a very short time. And the crew was only 2 people, who were simultaneously saboteurs. To what extent these saboteurs were able to perform BZ after a long stay in cold water I cannot judge, but most likely they were not fully capable
        1. Demetry
          0
          8 November 2014 13: 45
          Quote: gregor6549
          For questions about noise parameters, please contact 1st Division

          That is the question. Those. none. Neither I nor you know the real parameters. Therefore, talking about uniqueness is fortune-telling on coffee grounds. Knowing how people like to cheat on this thick, you can easily imagine smile
          Therefore, I do not think that the overall noise level went beyond the scope of her compatriots - boats of the 877 project. Those. was very good, but not unique.
          Quote: gregor6549
          About the range of depths. Just the most valuable in these boats is their ability to sail in shallow water, and not the ability to dive to great depths.

          Do not understand. Those. her uniqueness is not that she dived deeply but that she dived shallowly? Minimum original. Just here unique. Any boat can go in shallow water, as far as the hull allows and the danger of damage to the equipment.
          This boat is small, respectively, the hull allowed to go at shallow depths. What is unique ???

          Any small boat can do this. What is this 60 ton Colombian


          What is this 120 ton Iranian


          What is this 60 ton American (which at the same time can be delivered anywhere in the world’s oceans)


          And even this drug dealer wink


          All of them know how to do just that. Work in shallow water. Only this is not their uniqueness but their design feature.
        2. Demetry
          -1
          8 November 2014 13: 47
          Quote: gregor6549
          And three. It is necessary to compare these boats not with the carriers of ballistic and cruise missiles, but with P / L of a similar purpose, for example, with the same "wet" Tritons,

          This is epic !!! Those. comparing 2 full-fledged submarines with a difference in displacement of 2-7 times is not good, and comparing a SUBMARINE with a WET TYPE with a difference in displacement of 130 times is just the time wink .



          Well then, you can compare it with a wetsuit in the same way. The difference will be even more impressive.

          So you described the design features. But I haven’t noticed anything unique so far.

          ------

          And you still haven't answered the last question: Why hasn’t a single fleet in the world (including the Russian) acquired such a unique boat in the last 20 years, even though it is PR at all exhibitions ???
          God forbid if after this Euronaval someone buys it. But for 20 years not a single creep has been made.
          Tell me your thoughts on this, please!
  4. The comment was deleted.
  5. +2
    7 November 2014 09: 23
    I hope that with the installation of an air-independent power plant, these boats will get 2 breaths and will appear in the Russian Navy !!! We will wait and hope!
  6. +3
    7 November 2014 09: 44
    It is better for the leadership of the SPMBM to push the idea of ​​saturating exclusively the Russian Navy with such submarines. Does not understand command-prove !!!!! And do not look for potential customers on the side. Merchants are fucking. For such cases, criminal liability, as for treason, and not otherwise.
    1. pahom54
      0
      7 November 2014 09: 52
      Quote: Evgeniy667b
      It is better for the leadership of the SPMBM to push the idea of ​​saturating exclusively the Russian Navy with such submarines. Does not understand command-prove !!!!! And do not look for potential customers on the side. Merchants are fucking. For such cases, criminal liability, as for treason, and not otherwise.



      And here is the answer in the same review article:

      "until now, the proposed submarines remain at the project stage, since no one has expressed a desire to purchase such a techniquey "....

      Once again I am amazed how sensible, intelligent people and dumb, short-sighted people get along in the leadership of our country ...
      Having such submarines at least on the Black Sea Fleet and Baltic Fleet you can make all coastal countries dirty, not only Sweden, forever looking for our submarines ...
  7. Alexander
    +1
    7 November 2014 10: 49
    Quote: pahom54

    Once again I am amazed how sensible, intelligent people and dumb, short-sighted people get along in the leadership of our country ...
    Having such submarines at least on the Black Sea Fleet and Baltic Fleet you can make all coastal countries dirty, not only Sweden, forever looking for our submarines ...


    And for this, Lada and Varshavyanka are not suitable? You read carefully - small boats of coastal action, i.e. in the territorial waters of a foreign state, let’s say for the landing of saboteurs. Maybe you still offer a company of paratroopers somewhere over Sweden to throw in parachutes?
    1. jjj
      0
      7 November 2014 12: 16
      Small boats are transported on a womb
  8. 0
    7 November 2014 11: 46
    For me, so in the Caspian they would not have prices !!!
    Although, of course, knowledgeable people if that will correct))
    1. +2
      7 November 2014 11: 54
      Quote: alex56
      For me, so in the Caspian they would not have prices !!!

      for each fleet of 1-2 such would not hurt .... really did not hurt
    2. 0
      7 November 2014 19: 41
      Quote: alex56
      For me, so in the Caspian they would not have prices !!!

      To transport caviar, sturgeon ...
  9. +2
    7 November 2014 11: 53
    For sale please, but your Navy doesn’t need it.
  10. jjj
    +5
    7 November 2014 12: 20
    For example, the glorious project 1910. Of course, the Piranha is bigger, but in terms of efficiency, autonomy and secrecy ...
  11. kig
    +2
    7 November 2014 12: 57
    Quote: saag
    I wonder if the installation of an air-independent power plant is implied?

    Watch a movie, two vodka boxes were enough for the flight to Finland.
    1. +5
      7 November 2014 14: 30
      Quote: kig
      two vodka boxes were enough for the flight to Finland.

      1. not to Finland, but from
      2. There were 16 boxes of vodka. One box of vodka was drunk on the Finnish coast, and the rest was consumed as fuel.
      3. Learn the classics ....
  12. Sam
    -3
    7 November 2014 13: 15
    It is amazing how many traitors live and live in Russia?
  13. +1
    7 November 2014 16: 04
    The latest versions of the project provide for a displacement of 800-1000 tons, in order to cram at least some normal armament in them, well, and what is better than the German small boats 206 and 209 series worked out in many series with already quite powerful armaments?
  14. +2
    7 November 2014 19: 15
    Submarines were carved in metal in 1999.

    "I would have killed the bastards who so thoughtlessly destroyed our still powerful Soviet fleet in the 90s am In addition to the well-known character of EBN, I would like to surname these unknown "antiheroes" at least!
    1. 0
      7 November 2014 20: 25
      ... And at the same time a henchman who draws "cons" belay The fleet was then "sawed" by these characters
    2. 0
      7 November 2014 21: 23
      I still insist that the "anti-fleet" lobby is the "anti-heroes of Russia." Do not minus, unknown apologists love
  15. 0
    7 November 2014 20: 37
    It would be to the place on this submarine
  16. -2
    8 November 2014 01: 43
    ))
    A slight smile on the topic)
    ))
    and a small appeal to people: about minusculers on THIS page, --- in any kgug, alas, not without liberalist! ...
    - and they DO NOT know how not to spoil ...
  17. +1
    8 November 2014 01: 45
    coming back from a campaign ...

    (by the way, I’ll reveal a secret: about Sweden and the noise about the submarine, it’s my fault ... The "Earth Matrix" simply failed, I’m just on the submarine IN THE GAME! I was a little hooligan at sea ... I apologize)))
  18. Rzhevsky
    0
    8 November 2014 03: 04
    Such a boat without a uterus boat or a carrier ship would be out of work. Service needs to be done too!
    Simpler, cheaper Tritons. "Or a drone. Piranha turned out to be an incident of history, which was confirmed by the cinema.
    All tactical tasks assigned to Piranha can be solved by drones or Triton.
    Piranha is a real diversion boat, only it is an economic diversion, this did not take root!
    1. Demetry
      -1
      8 November 2014 13: 52
      Quote: Rzhevsky
      Such a boat without a uterus boat or a carrier ship would be out of work.
      Absolutely right. She does not have her own carrier. Those. obliged to act independently. And for independent actions, she has a meager speed and low autonomy. They apparently wanted to sit on two chairs, and as a result fell between the chairs.
      Although it could be useful in limited areas - BV, Caspian, Baltic, Caribbean, Southeast Asia, etc.
    2. +2
      10 November 2014 12: 52
      "Triton" - wet, "Piranha" - dry, autonomy - incomparable, excellent boat - a dream. The money invested in this boat, in the case of completing this combat mission (the probability is very high), is incommensurate with the losses of potential "partners" ... This the project was very much disliked in NATE, which already has an excellent characteristic.
  19. +6
    8 November 2014 10: 21
    Even if Piranha was unnecessary, why cut it? Or is there little space in Russia and not enough scrap metal?
    They would put it on the wall or on the shore - as an object for research, as a monument of the era, as a sightseeing place ...
    Brew hatches and let it stand - until better times. Why cut it? Even how much money is needed for recycling!
    Idiocy!
    1. Rzhevsky
      +2
      8 November 2014 20: 20
      This is how boats were built not at their own expense, but recycling comes at the price of scrap metal, and someone got it.
      It was more correct to put on conservation, and there you look, through time it is possible to upgrade! Which of course is cheaper than building a new boat.
      The problem of piranha is short range, i.e. calculate it is not difficult.
      Probably there are still no such small submarines with range and autonomy as in Warsaw, for example.
  20. The comment was deleted.
  21. viruvalge412ee
    +1
    8 November 2014 17: 10
    Taki, how many fools we have always had among officials! It was possible to depict the taverns in them expensive for rich Jews! And they would have drunk and boasted that they served on the submarine. All the good!
  22. +1
    10 November 2014 12: 42
    Quote: miner804
    Well, what a bastard decided to utilize unique special boats, which are not even ten years old ??? ....

    And you try to find the ends (signatures) - be very surprised.