Military Review

Dmitry Rogozin suggested that Russia and China join forces to master Mars

40
Friendship between Russia and the PRC is strengthening every day. Collaboration between countries has become more intense after the end of May 2014, China visited Vladimir Putin. The main outcome of the Russian leader’s visit to Beijing was the signing of the largest stories two states gas contract. According to the terms of the contract, Gazprom undertakes to supply Beijing with 38 billions of cubic meters of gas annually for 30 years. The total value of the agreement reaches the order of 400 billion dollars. This gas project opened the door for countries to cooperate in other sectors. Another factor in the rapprochement between Moscow and Beijing was the policy of the United States and the EU, aimed at the economic isolation of Russia.


At the round table, which was devoted to cooperation between the two countries in the field of satellite navigation, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin spoke about the fact that Russia is preparing to develop the solar system "hand in hand" from the Middle Kingdom. The round table was held in Harbin, China, within the framework of the exhibition “The First Russian-Chinese EXPO”. At the same exhibition for the first time, photographs of Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev were presented. Dmitry Rogozin stressed that space navigation is only one of the segments of the space services market in which countries can work together. In addition, he noted the possibility of working together in the field of creating space materials and spacecraft, as well as in cartography and communications.

In the future, we could talk about creating our own independent radio component base and developing spacecraft. “It would be a very serious step towards each other in the field of cooperation in space,” said Dmitry Rogozin. After that, no one would have any doubt that Russia, "hand in hand" with the PRC, was ready to develop a manned cosmonautics, ready to take up the exploration of the Moon and Mars, and the entire Solar System as a whole.


According to the Russian vice-premier, the parties deserve to move to a new level of high-quality technological cooperation between the states, and you can start with cooperation in the GLONASS and Beidou projects. According to Rogozin, these programs are perfectly combined with each other. Due to the specifics of these two systems today, we have no real competition in the Northern Hemisphere, especially if we are talking about northern latitudes, the Vice Premier developed his idea. At the same time, China, when creating its own satellite navigation system, expands the orbital constellation to the south. Therefore, GLONASS and "Beidou" could be perfectly combined with each other, complementing one another. In this issue, our countries have a great future.

At the same time, the Russian-Chinese space exploration event took place against the background of continuing failures that are haunting our country in this area. Dmitry Rogozin himself noted a high accident rate and stressed that it was simply impossible to put up with this state of affairs. Currently, the Russian Federation is carrying out a profound reform of the entire rocket and space industry, its goal is to catch up with technological progress, Rogozin stressed. According to him, deep reforms in this area should eventually lead to the consolidation of the entire Russian rocket and space industry.

The last of the major accidents in the Russian space industry occurred in May 2014. As a result of the collapse of the Proton-M, Russia has lost its most powerful communications satellite, which has never been launched into orbit. Among the versions of the incident was considered even sabotage. In addition, in the planned time frame it was not possible to test the latest Russian ecologically clean Angara missile. But this launch, although it was postponed several times, did take place. The first tests of the light rocket were successful.


But even despite all the recent failures, the round table in Harbin ended on a rather optimistic note. A memorandum of understanding was signed on cooperation in global navigation satellite systems. From the Chinese side, it was signed by the Satellite Navigation Office, and from the Russian side - by the Federal Space Agency. This memorandum establishes a new level of cooperation between the two states in space exploration.

Russia loses space race to China

At present, Russia is losing the space race to China, this is becoming noticeable even in numerical terms. The Angara launch vehicle family is the mirror that reflects all the pros and cons of the post-Soviet space industry. In the advantages of modern Russia, it is possible to write down the ability to create fairly complex space technology (although, for the most part, we are talking about rockets). The disadvantages, of course, include the failure to meet the deadlines of the projects. The same "Angara" was developed almost 20 years, if you count from the moment of determining the winner in the competition of projects. Also in the passive of our space industry is cost overruns and inefficiencies. To these criteria, the Accounts Chamber of Russia turned its attention back in the year 2013. The Russian Angara will become a rather expensive rocket, and its price may adversely affect its future, especially if the Americans and the same Chinese succeed in creating rockets with a lower prime cost of putting the payload into orbit, and that’s it.

At the same time, for Russia, it is the commercial market for the delivery of various goods into space that continues to be the segment where we still maintain leadership. About 40% of Russian rockets fly into space exclusively with foreign payload in the form of various satellites and astronauts. However, in the scale of the entire modern economy of space, this is a very small segment, it accounts for less than 1% (about 2 billion dollars). With the arrival of new competitors in this market, there is a high probability that Russia will have to seriously make room here.


In the very near future, in the space race, Russia can finally press down precisely China. Currently, the number of satellites operating in orbit in Russia and China has become equal: in 3 last year, China brought the number of satellites to 117 units (an increase of 72%), and Russia - to 118 units (an increase in 20%). At the same time, at the end of 2013, China launched its first lunar rover, which successfully landed on the moon. By 2020, the Celestial Empire expects to land a man on the Moon and build its first full-fledged orbital station. Currently, China has already caught up with the United States in the number of missile launches, and in terms of the pace of development of the space industry, it has just come out on top in the world.

Today, China is far ahead of our country in the number of non-military satellites in orbit, designed to study meteorology, Earth exploration, space exploration and the development of its technologies. At the same time, China will not stop there. Euroconsult experts believe that only from 2013 to 2016 years will China launch about its satellites around 100 - the most in the world. It is important to note the quality component. Today, the average expected time of operation of Chinese satellites is 7,4 of the year, Russian - 6,3 of the year. For comparison: in Europe and the USA - 10,2 and 9,9, respectively).

At the same time, the expenditures of the Russian Federation on space exploration alone over the last 10 years grew immediately in 14 times, last year our country spent about 10 billions of dollars on space, which is 14% of total world government spending in this area. Despite the fact that Russia is one of the leaders in terms of costs, our country occupies only peripheral positions in terms of income from space. According to estimates given by RBC, today the Russian Federation accounts for no more than 1,6% of the revenue of the entire global commercial space, which, according to expert estimates, is estimated at 240 billions of dollars a year.


At the same time, Russia may lose its leadership in commercial starts. All participants in the race - the USA, China and the EU - are creating their own new spacecraft and rockets, including for the delivery of cargo and pilots aboard the ISS. For example, after the start of flights of the space shuttles Dragon, which are produced by the American company SpaceX, the demand for domestic transport workers Progress immediately fell by a third. Vitaly Lopota, who is the head of RSC Energia, told reporters about this. At the same time, in the development of SpaceX, there is also a new heavy-class Falcon Heavy rocket, which is able to put up to 53 tons of various cargoes into low reference orbits for just 1,5-2,5 thousands of dollars per 1 kg. The PRC is currently also working on relatively inexpensive Long March 5 / 7 heavy rockets, and by the year 2020 hopes to bring its share of commercial launches to 15%. It expects to make a country that in 2013 did not make a single commercial launch.

The newest Russian rocket "Angara", whose first flight was to take place as early as 2005, attracted the attention of auditors from the Russian Chamber of Accounts. The auditors concluded that the funds that were invested in the project over almost 20 years of work (an unprecedented time for world practice) have multiplied the cost of this rocket many times over. At the same time, the exact cost of the finished rockets has not yet been disclosed. Judging by the cost of the engines for the first stage, the upper stage and the complex of launch services, the price of one Angara-5 rocket (a heavy version of the PH) that can deliver tons of cargo to 24,5 orbit can reach 100 million dollars. Shipping cost - 4,1 thousand dollars per 1 kg of cargo. This exceeds not only the cost of shipping Falcon Heavy cargoes (from 1,5 to 2,5 thousands of dollars for 1 kg), but also the existing Proton-M missiles (3,3 thousands of dollars per 1 kg).

Russia is very inefficient spending money on space

From all this follows the fact that Russia is not efficiently spending money on space. According to the Space Report 2014, the total government spending on space in all countries of the world in 2013 amounted to 74,1 billion dollars. At the same time, more than half (41,3 billion) fell on the United States. However, Russia has spent a lot of money - 10 billion dollars. Over 10 years, costs have increased 14 times. Currently, with 47 dollars for every 10000 dollars of the country's GDP, Russia ranks first in the ranking of government spending on space, in the United States this figure is equal to 25 dollars, and in the PRC only 4 dollars.


Money in space in Russia do not regret. Within the framework of the implementation of the new state program “Space Activity of Russia for 2013-2020”, it is planned to allocate an impressive amount - 1,8 trillion rubles. But the one who "looks" at this figure has a question: how effectively were the funds spent on the previous program, for which 2006 trillion rubles was allocated from 0,5 onwards? According to the previous state program of development of the Russian rocket and space industry, the Russian share in the world market of rocket and space technology was supposed to increase from 11% to 21% to 2015 year. But now, as reported by RBC with reference to ORKK (United Rocket and Space Corporation), this proportion is 12%. That is, it almost did not change compared with the rate reached 8 years ago. At the same time, in the new state program this indicator is planned to be brought only to the 16% by the 2020 year.

Under the 2006 program of the year, it was planned that the share of modern industrial equipment at the enterprises of the industry (age of equipment less than 10 years) by 2015 will increase from 3% to 35%. However, according to ORKK, this indicator was able to bring only to 12%. To date, more than 70% of technological equipment, which is already older than 20 years, is used in the Russian rocket and space industry. The sad situation with patents. During the period from 2000 to 2008, our country accounted for only 1% of patents related to the space industry, for the USA - 50%. At the same time, it is necessary to take into account the fact that in Russia the space industry is patented 3 times more often than others.

The audit by the Accounts Chamber of 15 targets and indicators that were set for the 2010 year showed that only 6 (40%) was fulfilled, 2011 (10%) in 66,7, and 2012 (11%). At the same time, the number of Russian satellites launched into Earth orbit in 73,3-2010 amounted to only 2012% of the planned targets, which is significantly below the required level. At the same time, the cost of developing Russian satellites in 47,1 is several times higher than foreign standards, and their operational and technical characteristics are very low, and their accident rate is growing. According to the auditors, in recent years, the industry has practically "formed a system of collective irresponsibility." Roskosmos, which simultaneously performed both the functions of the manufacturer and the functions of the customer, and sometimes the operator of various space systems, in practice was not responsible either for the execution of tasks or for their deadlines. All this has led to a situation that we now have and can be corrected which, perhaps, can only be achieved through a deep reform of the entire industry.

Information sources:
http://ria.ru/science/20140630/1014091684.html
http://www.mk.ru/politics/2014/06/30/i-celogo-mira-malo-rogozin-pozval-kitaycev-na-mars.html
http://top.rbc.ru/economics/30/06/2014/933404.shtml
http://www.rg.ru/2013/07/04/proverka-site.html
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  1. Magic archer
    Magic archer 15 July 2014 09: 09
    +6
    the thing is that we are too fixated on the ISS. The program is certainly necessary, but still it's time to think about exploring the Moon and then Mars. Humanity is growing too fast and not spending resources right. Therefore, the joint Russian-Chinese space program is a step forward!
    1. Canep
      Canep 15 July 2014 10: 44
      +3
      The Americans all the same curtailed all cooperation in space exploration, why not start cooperating with China? True, they will not be able to teach us much, but they have enormous financial opportunities.
      1. little man
        little man 15 July 2014 11: 59
        +3
        But will the Chinese themselves want to cooperate with us? After all, they are probably the same, all of the figures given in the article know. Well, why should they take a stagnant competitor as partners?
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Aryan
          Aryan 15 July 2014 13: 55
          +5
          Quote: man
          But will the Chinese themselves want to cooperate with us? After all, they are probably the same, all of the figures given in the article know. Well, why should they take a stagnant competitor as partners?


          Rogozin is doing everything right!
          The more Chinese people look at Mars
          the less Chinese look at Siberia and the Far East hi
          1. Dimas Tugarin
            Dimas Tugarin 15 July 2014 20: 57
            +2
            That's right, colonists from the Chinese are colonists from us, let’s fly to Mars and there they’ll raise virgin soil. wink
      2. Bayonet
        Bayonet 15 July 2014 12: 05
        +5
        Quote: Canep
        True, they can teach us little.

        If we continue to say so, looking from high to others, and not work, there will come a moment when we will be surprised to find that we are in deep f .. e!
        1. Thunderbolt
          Thunderbolt 15 July 2014 21: 14
          +3
          Our country is completely uncompetitive. We are going to build a bridge across the Kerch Strait, which by 2018 should connect the Kuban to the Crimea. The costs for this project are truly astronomical: the bridge will become one of the most expensive in the history of mankind. The construction is already estimated at $ 8 billion, and closer to the matter, the estimate is likely to grow further. So far, the most expensive bridge in history is the Danyang-Kunshan Viaduct in China, which cost $ 8,5 billion. By the way, its length is 165 km, while the width of the Kerch Strait is less than 5 km.
          1. askold
            askold 15 July 2014 22: 35
            0
            And here's what we have already built, here is an excerpt from the article "Why there was an Olympiad" by the magazine "Za Rulem":
            "... The length of the new combined highway (road and railways go side by side) leading from Adler to Krasnaya Polyana is 48 km, including 23 bridges and three tunnels. The road laid right along the Mzymta riverbed broke all cost records: almost 10 billion dollars! three times more expensive than the American program to deliver and operate the Curiosity rover ... "
            As the character of Leonid Bykov used to say in the film "Only old men go to battle", - "Not mogYom, but mogem."
            As for cooperation with China. As it turned out, the Americans are better at rivalry, - well, the Stars and Stripes in their hands, they are all so exceptional. To overtake us in space by just one "... a small step of one person ... "It took a national idea (America, an American, this should sound proudly), the help of a brilliant designer (a Nazi, by the way) and a lot, a lot of money. For the sake of politicians, you can get the moon from the sky. Cooperation, partnership and friendship may open up new horizons, set new tasks, will embody new projects, already in the name of all mankind. And it is better to be friends with neighbors.
  2. rotor
    rotor 15 July 2014 09: 29
    +1
    By 2020, the Celestial Empire expects to land a man on the moon


    This is unlikely, by 2025-2030 more so far it looks real.

    After 2020, Russia needs to create an orbital station in the orbit of the moon. And land on the moon in the 2030th. Then it may be possible to get ahead of the Chinese.

    Roscosmos: The Russian cosmonaut will enter the moon in 2030-2035.
    www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/20140714233333.shtml
    1. rotor
      rotor 15 July 2014 09: 46
      0
      Roscosmos: Russia plans to carry out a manned flight to the moon in 2030-2031
      http://itar-tass.com/nauka/1316918
  3. parusnik
    parusnik 15 July 2014 09: 37
    +2
    If they didn’t steal in the country ... no matter how much they do ...
  4. papa-billy
    papa-billy 15 July 2014 11: 25
    +1
    Too much has been lost due to the collapse of the USSR and further decline. However, it pleases that the money is there, flights are being conducted, and developments are being conducted.
  5. bmv04636
    bmv04636 15 July 2014 11: 25
    0
    The ISS has already worked out a program for us that’s new to us; it doesn’t give anything to everyone else; it is needed; it turns out that we help others at our own expense without getting anything in return
    1. Bayonet
      Bayonet 15 July 2014 12: 08
      0
      Quote: bmv04636
      for us new to us, it doesn’t give something for everyone else it is needed

      Want to say that our science has finally died?
      1. bmv04636
        bmv04636 15 July 2014 22: 08
        0
        no, just after the World, this passed stage needs to focus on the lunar base
  6. crasever
    crasever 15 July 2014 12: 37
    0
    Well, for sure, in response to the beginning of such cooperation, the Americans in five years will urgently invent and test Saturn -6 or 7 and the landing module, and send the heroic astronauts to Mars first !!!
  7. chunga-changa
    chunga-changa 15 July 2014 12: 51
    +6
    Theft with impunity. Impunity gives rise to permissiveness. The volume of theft is only growing. If now, for example, 50% are stealing, then in five years 75% will be stealing. Therefore, if you do not look at the amounts and numbers, but at the results and achievements, then everything becomes clear. Russia simply does not participate in any race. The Russian efficient ones simply master money on an industrial scale on pseudo space projects. The fact that at the same time something turns out, flies somewhere and does something, then this is just an inevitable side effect. In theory, for greater efficiency, they will try to get rid of this and transfer the entire space industry into a pure virtual. For example, create a joint-stock company ros-nano-cosmos, which will provide various near-space services and control the flow of money, and state-ros-cosmos, which will simply transfer a specified part of the budget to the disposal of JSC nanokosmos. I even know who will be the chairman of the board of directors of the company, unless, of course, he has died by that time. I repeat once again - Russia does not participate in any race. What a race if for "developers and performers" the limit of the future is a very secure old age somewhere in Miami and decently attached children. The rest simply doesn't interest them.
    1. TROG
      TROG 15 July 2014 14: 20
      +2
      Bull's-eye.
      But on the other hand, we must be careful with China. All these agreements, in my opinion,
      will turn into a drain of the last remaining technologies to China.
      And what do we get from China?
  8. gregor6549
    gregor6549 15 July 2014 14: 23
    +2
    Another fix idea. It might be better to spend the money so that the Russians at any point especially distant from Moscow do not feel like on Mars. Moreover, there is no extra money and is not expected. The Americans at one time too squeaked to be the first on the moon and wipe the nose of Russian. Well, they became the first so what? But nothing. We calculated the decks thrown on a flight to the moon and wept. And Mars will be further and more expensive than the Moon. Or, from the height of the Kremlin’s cabinets, nothing can be seen besides Mars. They are high, and Mars is high. And you don’t need to lower your eyes down, where people are swarming.
  9. Free wind
    Free wind 15 July 2014 14: 55
    +1
    Hooray. cheers cheers. Glory to Rogozin. I liked the achievement of Russia. first presented at the exhibition. photo by D. Medvedev. It's time. it's time to build a base on Mars. Why on Mars. there is not much space, let's immediately Saturn. take over all of Saturn. and our rings will be. Oh, and the chatterbox is this Rogozin. By the way, about the Angara. Only the light version of this complex was launched. before the launches of heavy missiles of this class. how to Kiev oh how to Arkhangelsk cancer.
    1. Bayonet
      Bayonet 15 July 2014 15: 23
      0
      Quote: Free Wind
      before the launches of heavy missiles of this class. how to Kiev oh how to Arkhangelsk cancer.

      The launch of the Angara-5 heavy launch vehicle is scheduled for late December of this year. This was reported to President Vladimir Putin by the general designer of the Angara series of missiles, Vladislav Nesterov.
    2. Leonid41
      Leonid41 17 July 2014 01: 02
      0
      Yeah - we would have to deal with the Earth. And then they are building, they are building the Vostochny Cosmodrome and will not build it at all. Either there aren’t enough working hands, then a scandal with embezzlement, but time is running out. In the meantime, you can dream about space flights)
  10. snifer
    snifer 15 July 2014 15: 04
    -1
    As long as there is no protection against cosmic radiation, there can be no talk of any flights, they simply give us a head! Just like with the Americans flying to the moon, this is not possible !!
    1. Bayonet
      Bayonet 15 July 2014 15: 28
      0
      Quote: snifer
      we just have their heads powdered! Just like with Americans flying to the moon, this is not possible !!

      "About how many wonderful discoveries we have, the spirit is preparing for enlightenment ..."
      Unfortunately - not everyone ...
      1. snifer
        snifer 15 July 2014 15: 44
        0
        Experts on the basis of experiments have established that radioactive particles in space have in their structure nuclei of iron atoms that have phenomenal penetrating power. That is why it is surprisingly difficult to defend against them.

        On Earth, researchers simulated cosmic radiation at the American Brookhaven National Laboratory on Long Island, where a special particle accelerator is located. In the course of the experiments, the researchers determined the periods during which the disease occurs and progresses. However, while the researchers conducted experiments on laboratory mice, exposing them to doses of radiation comparable to those that people would have received during a flight to Mars. After the experiments, almost all the mice received impaired functioning of the cognitive system of the brain. Abnormalities in the cardiovascular system were also noted. In the brain, foci of accumulation of beta-amyloid, a protein that is a sure sign of impending Alzheimer's disease, have been identified.

        Scientists say that they do not yet know how to overcome space radiation, but they are sure that radiation is the factor that deserves the most serious attention when planning future space flights.
        Such a problem is the high level of radiation in space. There are already research results that show that astronauts who are in outer space and at orbital stations are subject to high levels of radiation. In particular, the radiation doses that astronauts “absorb” in themselves exceed the life limit after a year and a half of being in space for women. Men, however, receive their lifetime dose of radiation after only two years of work in space.
        In this case, if we take into account the time it takes to overcome the distance to Mars, this time will be obtained, this is precisely this that is an obstacle to flights of this kind, and, therefore, makes it impossible to “visit” the Red Planet.
        Here are small excerpts from the first sources that came to light, whether you could believe further on the moon on the moon. There is no desire to convince you and look for other sources. A person will be burned from radiation outside the protective belt of the earth
        1. snifer
          snifer 15 July 2014 19: 26
          +1
          Eh minusers, minusers, if only it was ... s, I thought they would tell me now where and in what I was wrong. Yes, let's forget about cosmic radiation (there’s no such thing) and we will believe that flights are possible because it’s so romantic ” and apples will bloom on Mars " bully
          1. Bayonet
            Bayonet 15 July 2014 21: 28
            +1
            Quote: snifer
            I thought they would tell me now where and in what I am wrong

            Only 7 "Apollo" flew to the moon:
            Apollo 11 - July 21, 1969
            Apollo 12 - November 19-20, 1969
            "Apollo 13" - flew to the moon, but landing was not carried out due to a serious accident,
            Apollo 14 - February 5-6, 1971
            Apollo 15 - July 31-August 2, 1971,
            Apollo 16 - April 21-24, 1972
            Apollo 17 - December 11-14, 1972
            If you do not recognize this - what to talk about?
            1. snifer
              snifer 15 July 2014 22: 01
              0
              winked well, yes, they flew and even showed them live on TV in America, we know photos and videos. As for the flight, there is a huge number of nuances, it’s not the plane that sat down and flew, (By the way, why didn’t ours fly to the moon, because they really wanted to fly but could not and still cannot), if you are interested, you can search for a lot of sources, ranging from videos to books, you cannot tell in the post. Well, yes, do you think why it happened that the power "flying on the moon "can not even go into the orbit of the earth in so many years ?? we were stupidly fooled at what everyone, Hollywood is it that way." yes and finally, a clip in the subject
              1. askold
                askold 15 July 2014 23: 25
                +1
                And why are you not satisfied with the official point of view, you simply do not want to believe in it? Or do you personally have evidence? Or does the version that a man’s foot has not stepped on the moon seem to you just more interesting? As my higher mathematics teacher used to say: most people know that 2x2 = 4, but there are individuals who can prove that 2x2 = 5, however, if a person believes that 2x2 = 0, then he must carefully hide this circumstance. It can be so absurd, our crew flies to the moon, sits next to the remains of any of the six American moons moduley.Vidit there's traces of astronauts, but not our faith !!! And what a robot heritage, at the moment there are no Americans !!!
                And everything that you write about radiation, it is true, but only for flights to Mars, the mission to the Moon was short, only about a week. In addition, during the awarding ceremony in the Kremlin, on the occasion of the Day of Russia, the scientist received a state award from the hands of the president. , the head of the group, the Institute of Medical and Biological Problems, engaged in just the study of the impact of harmful factors on the human body during long space flights. In an interesting, albeit short, interview, one could hear words and phrases: "... Mars, ... a nuclear engine. .. "So don't be so skeptical, people work and even receive awards.
                1. snifer
                  snifer 16 July 2014 00: 29
                  0
                  While still in grade 10, I first saw on TV a program about the fact that they were not there, they were mainly considered videos and photos. This gave rise to doubts. After I watched many different videos, I also read various books. As for radiation, you do not take into account the outbreaks in the sun which give a colossal emission of radiation, there "you will fry from radiation like in a frying pan." I am not an astrophysicist, if you are interested, you can find the answers to the questions yourself. I offer a video (the quality is really not very good, but if you are not satisfied with this particular video, then you can google many other videos on this topic) personally, after many sources, I decided for myself that there was no man on the moon and whether there would be a big question.
  11. Nitarius
    Nitarius 15 July 2014 15: 15
    0
    ALL SHOULD BE THE OWNERS!
    and in SPACE!
    A NEW QUEEN, GAGARIN, and TUPOLEV, etc. are NECESSARY. IDEAS AND VERY LARGE AND LITERATE DESIGNERS NEEDED!
  12. P-36M
    P-36M 15 July 2014 15: 17
    0
    The space industry was and will be one of the priority for us, because in many respects national security depends on it, in view of the fact that modern and promising methods of warfare are very much dependent on satellites. I hope that in the future the budget will only increase.
    And on account of the "licking" of our developments in this area, it is possible that they have already bypassed us in that area, so we have only advantages from cooperation with our southern neighbors.
  13. Deff
    Deff 15 July 2014 16: 06
    +1
    IMHO what that garbage is inconsistent! Well, master the Moon, from the same Moon to Mars it is easier to start. There are behaviors like Yanukovych and yours and ours. Leonov, you see, flared up on Mars, Putin on the moon, - the result: we will make two programs. A clear idea of ​​what we want to get from Mars, except for medals - is unclear!
    2. The lunar project, with a normal, non-advertising approach, is the second nuclear weapon that can solve both the environmental problem of the Earth and gain energy leadership. For example, only the solar energy of the Moon abundantly covers all current and existing energy needs.
    I would say that this program is as promising as Kurchatov’s with a nuclear bomb!
    Of strategic importance is the task of narrow-beam energy transmission over long distances.
    Where can I get energy and resources for a bunch of programs? With this approach, there will never be a concentration of efforts, nor specialists, as at one time on the same nuclear program or the first flight into space.
    Cheap populism, a waste of effort and money!
  14. Diviz
    Diviz 15 July 2014 17: 09
    0
    China received its space technologies from us. To carry out space exploration we have a problem with quantity and time. At the expense of whom we will decide at the expense of "gas" Gazprom dreams come true.
  15. el.krokodil
    el.krokodil 15 July 2014 17: 41
    -1
    but I wouldn’t be friends with China in space .. everyone knows China’s love for copyright .. better myself and I would even say fewer such initiatives ... this is short-sighted .. one thing about the ISS .. what about the Americans that without them it will fly .. and Mars is a breakthrough .. yes what kind of thing .. such a nation rallies .. and the Chinese, well, there’s no place here .. let their teikonauts on their own and we really like it ourselves .. again in case of some or you can ask your failure .. but from a Ketayan, how do you ask? but who else would ask? ... her comrade Rogozin exceeded his authority and farted off topic ... he is still young .. fool
  16. air wolf
    air wolf 15 July 2014 17: 52
    -1
    That's where all the Chinese and mattresses can be relocated laughing
  17. MSA
    MSA 15 July 2014 19: 15
    0
    The program is needed, we must definitely promote it.
  18. GRAY
    GRAY 15 July 2014 20: 55
    0
    ... people -. They did a lot of stupid things: they came up with costumes for dogs, the position of an advertising manager and things like the IPhone, having received nothing in return but a sour aftertaste. But if we developed science, mastered the Moon, Mars, Venus ... Who knows what the world would be like then? Mankind has been given the opportunity to surf the cosmos, but it wants to engage in consumption: drink beer and watch TV shows (c)
  19. homosum20
    homosum20 15 July 2014 23: 01
    +1
    Something Dmitry is fading. I would suggest the development of an alpha centaur. There, Khrushchev - dill in principle - and that promised communism for 20 years.
    How much is Mars in the modern development of space? (Americans don’t have any spacecraft at all, ours can’t start - they are pouring back).
    Not bold enough, Dmitry Olegovich. Dmitry Anatolyevich even pings you.
    Would you at least decide with Ukraine a question for a start, or something. So many years with NATO were, now engaged in defense. And the result is like that of Chubais. The goal is to bring localization in the defense industry to 80%. (Today, USC in tenders requires localization of at least 50%). Those. it is translated into Russian as follows - today, foreigners own 50% of our defense industry. Quite Chubais.
  20. coolvoldik
    coolvoldik 15 July 2014 23: 59
    +1
    Quote: Nitarius
    ALL SHOULD BE THE OWNERS!
    and in SPACE!
    A NEW QUEEN, GAGARIN, and TUPOLEV, etc. are NECESSARY. IDEAS AND VERY LARGE AND LITERATE DESIGNERS NEEDED!

    Nah ..., most importantly, you need an effective manager - Chubais for example.
    Serdyukov’s candidacy is also suitable. The top manager will assemble a team of managers and all this locust will eat up three annual budgets. You look and in a year we are on the red planet!
    1. schizophrenic
      schizophrenic 16 July 2014 01: 36
      0
      Quote: coolvoldik
      You look and in a year we are on the red planet!

      With such as Serdyukov, only about money and it is necessary to negotiate. For example, the cost of flying to Mars is 200 billion euros and 300 billion for you to organize, and we will be the first on Mars. laughing
  21. Falcon5555
    Falcon5555 16 July 2014 01: 24
    +2
    In the future, we could talk about creating our own independent radio component base and developing spacecraft. “It would be a very serious step towards each other in the field of cooperation in space,” said Dmitry Rogozin. After that, no one would have any doubt that Russia, "hand in hand" with the PRC, was ready to develop a manned cosmonautics, ready to take up the exploration of the Moon and Mars, and the entire Solar System as a whole.

    Something I did not understand.
    1. "own independent radio component base" - what is it - Russian or Russian-Chinese? In the first case, where is China? Secondly, how independent is it?
    2. "After that, no one would have any doubts that Russia" hand in hand "with the PRC is ready to develop manned astronautics, is ready to engage in the exploration of the Moon and Mars, and the entire solar system as a whole." - who said - Rogozin or the author of the article? Why should Russia suddenly need to prepare to develop manned space exploration together with China? "By the exploration of the Moon and Mars" - does this mean manned flights or automatic? In the first case, didn't he swing too much - they learned how to make microcircuits and you can already fly to Mars? Second, what kind of mastering is this? "And the entire solar system as a whole." - is this manned too? Then let’s deal with the entire Galaxy right away. Why grind?
  22. Kruglov
    Kruglov 17 July 2014 05: 25
    0
    Quote: Bayonet
    Quote: snifer
    I thought they would tell me now where and in what I am wrong

    Only 7 "Apollo" flew to the moon:
    Apollo 11 - July 21, 1969
    Apollo 12 - November 19-20, 1969
    "Apollo 13" - flew to the moon, but landing was not carried out due to a serious accident,
    Apollo 14 - February 5-6, 1971
    Apollo 15 - July 31-August 2, 1971,
    Apollo 16 - April 21-24, 1972
    Apollo 17 - December 11-14, 1972
    If you do not recognize this - what to talk about?


    Dear Bayonet!
    Before asserting, they say, something was flying somewhere, take a closer look at what was published, even on the Internet. I'm not talking about sweeping ridicule of everything and everything. But there is a sufficient number of works in which the analysis of the ability to perform these flights was carried out. I will say this, oh, very mixed conclusions are being obtained. Starting with the carrier rocket, including the engines, and ending with the ship itself. As well as the reverse start system. There are big questions on spacesuits. In the specified dimensional parameters, well, the necessary life support systems do not fit in any way. The passage of the Van Allen belts is generally a separate issue. All this raises a lot of questions and causes a healthy distrust. It seems to me that, as they say, to admit to the word, everything that the Americans say is at least not quite right.