Russian "Cornet" against the American "General Abrams"

167
Russian "Cornet" against the American "General Abrams"


The Soviet and Russian GRAU never paid due attention to improving the 9M133 "Kornet" ATGM in terms of overcoming the dynamic and active defenses installed on the American tanks Abrams. In February of this year, an article appeared in the press claiming that the Kornet is capable of striking not only tanks, but also fortifications, low-speed air, surface targets. This article contains false statements related to the functioning of the "Cornet" with dynamic (DZ) and active (AZ) protection of the Abrams.

This position is misinforming the officers, cadets of schools, students, defense workers, related to the study, operation and creation of this type of weapon. Despite the universality of the "Cornet", the task of fighting tanks remains a priority. Let's try to understand this problem.

THE CORRETE'S Doubtful Efficiency

The tactical and technical assignment (TTZ) of the Grau was intended to create a rocket complex "Kornet" with a semi-automatic control system using a laser beam. The complex was designed to defeat modern and advanced tanks, equipped with dynamic protection. A rocket with a tandem cumulative warhead must pierce a package of armor plates 475 – 500 mm / 60 hail. with hinged DZ (BDZ-1).

At the same time, a tandem warhead must ensure the penetration of the M1 - P60, P30, P65 tank simulators equipped with built-in DZ (BDZ-2) units. At the same time, the rule was ignored that the efficiency of a DZ depends on its length in the plane of interaction. However, even on the ancient tanks M48А3, М60А1, "Centurion" was used mounted DZ with a length of containers 400 – 500 mm. In other words, the Graduate Survey continued its unwarranted technical policy leading to the creation of an ineffective anti-tank Cornet.

Instead of a truly existing DZ with a 400 – 500 mm container length installed on foreign tanks, as a counterpart for testing domestic ATGM, the GRAU justified the DZ with a 250 mm container length, which is an irresponsible fact. By and large, overcoming the Kornet DZ rocket in accordance with the TTZ GRAU can be considered a fabulous illusion that has nothing in common with combat reality.

The values ​​of the probability of destruction of tanks M1А1, М1А2, presented in Table. 1, obtained as a result of mathematical simulation modeling under the direction of General Designer, Academician of RAS Arkady Shipunov. Based on the simulation, graphs of probabilities of hitting tanks М1А1, М1А2 are built depending on the armor penetration of the main charge (OZ) of tandem warheads. These data are published in the well-known metropolitan magazine for the armor penetration ability of the OZ Kornet 1300 mm.

The results table. 1 relate to two cases of the interaction of "Cornet" with DZ. The first case demonstrates results corresponding to BDZ-1, BDZ-2, which are not analogous to DZ installed on foreign tanks. The second case corresponds to the detonation conditions of all eight DZ elements (EDS) in a BDZ-2 container, 15-mm steel lid of which always interacts with the cornet body and with the cumulative OZ jet (fig.1).

The BDZ-1 container is a stamped hollow body made of sheet steel 3 mm thick, into which two flat ejectable plates are installed, each of which consists of two stamped steel plates of thickness 2 mm (length 250 mm; width 130 mm) and placed between them a layer of plastic explosive thickness 6 mm. Protection against cumulative ammunition and armor-piercing piercing shells is provided by BDZ-2 according to the design of the Steel Research Institute, the container of which consists of four sections and is covered with a common steel lid (500х260 mm) with a thickness of 15 mm. Each section fits into two EHL 4C20. When hit, ATGM detonate the ELD of one section. The EDL explosion of adjacent sections does not occur due to the presence of steel partitions between them. The EDS detonation of one section causes a “cutting out” of a 15-mm cover plate (length - 250 mm, width - 130 mm), which never interacts with the rocket body, and also does not appear in the path of the cumulative OZ jet.

For the first case, the high values ​​of the probability of hitting the tanks M1A1, M1A2 were obtained. Note that these values ​​correspond to the installation BDZ-1, BDZ-2 on the "Abrams" with a length of X-ray retractors 250 mm, the fragments of which never explode with the cumulative OZ jet during the LZ explosion, which is confirmed by the GRAU illusion.

And finally, Table. 1 contains the values ​​of the probability of destruction of tanks in relation to the conditions of the second case. It should be recalled that the 9М119М Invar and 9M131 Metis-M missiles put into service have a layout scheme similar to Cornet. Experimental studies on the interaction of these missiles with a built-in DZ, having a length of 500 mm containers, have established that when they hit the upper half of the container when eight EDS are detonated, the armor penetration of the OZ tandem warhead is reduced by 70%. Spread these patterns on the "Cornet". In this case, the armor penetration capability of the Cornet tandem warhead after interaction with the 15-mm cover will decrease by 900 mm, and the armor penetration value of the non-deformed part of the cumulative jet will be 400 mm. Using the materials of the above-mentioned article by Arkady Shipunov, we will determine the probability of hitting tanks M1А1, М1А2 with the Kornet missile. In this case, the probability of injury will be 1 for М1А0,1, and 1 for М2А0,07. It can be assumed that with such effectiveness of the striking action, the Cornet should not have been adopted. But the illusionists of Grau have proven the opposite.

In captivity of the insensitive judgment

The main disadvantage of judgments about the fighting qualities of the "Kornet" is that they lack a comparison of the estimates of the combat capabilities of the "Kornet" with the development parameters of the protection of the "Abrams". The defeat of two M1 tanks during Operation Freedom to Iraq is noted, but no attention is paid to the fact that thousands of M1, M1X1, M1X2 tanks were deeply upgraded by integrating modular armor with DZ and AZ. As a result of this modernization, thousands of M1A2 SEP tanks appeared.

At the same time, the “Cornet” is one of the latest ATGMs created in accordance with the TTZ of the Soviet GRAU. As a result (tabl. 2), due to the incorrect setting of the parameters of foreign tanks of foreign tanks, a number of ineffective ATGM with tandem warheads were created.

During the state tests of the Kornet, the P30, P60, and P65 obstacles were used, which “imitate” the frontal protection of the М1 tank, and not the modern and prospective tanks. The task of the BDZ-1, BDZ-2, P30, P60, P65 simulators in the TTZ is either a gross error, or a fraud and deception. The reader can figure it out on his own (HBO No. 10, 2012).

A significant influence on the formation of the layout of the rocket "Cornet" has a dynamic protection, installed on foreign tanks. At the same time, the publication mentioned in the beginning of this article presents a very naive formulation of the functioning of a tandem warhead "Cornet". Here it is: “... the 9М133 rocket received a tandem warhead, where the first charge was destroyed by the elements of dynamic protection - iron boxes with explosives, when undermined, the anti-tank ammunition was thrown to the side or destroyed, and the second charge hits the tank directly. It is noteworthy that in order to create an effective cumulative jet of the second, it’s the main charge of the rocket, it is located in the tail section, the engine equipped with oblique nozzles is in the middle, and the control system is located in the tail section of the rocket ”.

Let's analyze this nonsense. It is argued that LZ tandem warhead destroyed elements of dynamic protection. It is well known that LZ detonates when colliding with a DZ. After that, the impact of its cumulative jet initiates the detonation of explosives in remote sensing. Therefore, the DZ cannot destroy the first charge, since at the moment of initiation of the detonation of explosives in the DZ it is simply absent. After the "destruction" of the first charge from somewhere appears anti-tank ammunition, which is thrown to the side or destroyed. Where this ammunition came from remains a mystery. And suddenly, a second charge of the tandem warhead appears, which hits the tank. Next, we will not deal with the unsuccessful description of the process of interaction between the Cornet and the DZ and its layout, but consider what happens in reality.

In order not to overload the reader with difficulties, let us provide a simplified scheme of interaction between tandem warheads “Kornet” with a built-in remote sensing device (BDZ-2), in the container of which eight EDS are placed, simultaneously detonating when subjected to a cumulative LZ jet. When the "Cornet" collides with the BDZ-2 (Fig.1), the LZ (1) is triggered to form a cumulative jet, which excites the detonation of explosives in the EHD. Formed from the detonation of explosives in EDS explosion products through 70 microseconds (ms) provide the movement of the 15-mm cover with a speed of 400 m / s. After 300 μs, after the LZ has triggered, the OZ (5) is detonated using a delay line to form a cumulative jet with 1100 – 1300 mm armor penetration. But on the way of the cumulative OZ jet all the time there will be an 15-mm cover, which will deform a part of the Cornet's body with the existing filling. The rocket engine (3) will make the greatest contribution to reducing the armor penetration of the OZ due to the channel displacement (4) for the passage of the cumulative OZ jet. After interacting with the engine channel, the cumulative OZ jet acquires a shape approximately corresponding to a sinusoid, due to which it interacts with the main body armor not in one zone (the area of ​​a circle equal to the diameter of the cumulative jet), but more with scattering over the area of ​​a rectangle whose length is 120 mm, width 20 mm. In other words, the mechanism for reducing armor penetration from DZ exposure is to disperse the cumulative jet over the area of ​​the armor plate much larger than the area of ​​the cumulative jet with no impact of the 15-mm cover on its side surface.

Thus, in the TTZ on the Kornet, the rules for functioning under the conditions of the interaction of the rocket to overcome short-distance DZ were laid down. At the same time, the main requirement was to ensure high armor penetration, which was easily achieved with a small length of E / S in the BDZ-1, BDZ-2 designs. But by now the combat conditions have become different. On tanks М1А2 appeared the system AZ with the possible installation of a tandem DZ.

LIFE CYCLE "CORNET"

"Cornet" began to arrive in the troops in 1994, and in 2007, the US Army received after a deep modernization of the 1150 МХNUMXА1 SEP tanks equipped with an active defense system (SAZ). It is known that the "Cornet" was not created in relation to the defeat of "Abrams" with SAZ and tandem remote sensing. For this reason, in 2, the life of the “Cornet” with a duration of 2007 years ended. The short life cycle of the Kornet is a consequence of mistakes made in the miscalculations of the development of foreign tank building. Today, the layout of the "Kornet" does not correspond to the real combat properties of the M13-X1 SEP tank.

High armor penetration is an essential combat property of the “Cornet”. But while the Cornet was being created, foreign tank builders created an active defense system for the M1А2 SEP tank, which allowed for achieving positive results on the Cornet’s disruption when approaching the M1А2 SEP. In other words, even before interacting with the armor protection of the tank, the "Cornet" may lose its high armor penetration.

Recently, in leading foreign countries, much attention has been paid to the creation of an SAZ. These systems must ensure defeat on the approach to the ATGM tanks and other anti-tank weapons. The former head of the Main Automobile and Armored Directorate, Colonel-General Sergey Mayev, in one of his articles, reports on the installation of an active defense complex on the M1-X2 SEP tank. This complex combines: detection tools (six special sensors operating in the ultraviolet range of the electromagnetic spectrum, designed for detecting the launch of anti-tank ammunition); tracking equipment (six laser rangefinders and a millimeter-wave radar station); means of destruction; means of setting passive (smoke grenades) and active (interference transmitters to laser and infrared anti-tank guidance systems) interference.


Photo 1. The engines of the missiles "Invar" (1), "Metis-M" (2), "Kornet" (3) together with a 15-mm steel cover of the built-in remote sensing drastically reduce the armor penetration of these missiles. Author's photo


Considering the fact that the “Kornet” was created according to the TTN 1988 of the year, its design significantly lags behind modern requirements. For example, the aforementioned TTZ does not contain requirements for overcoming a tandem DZ, in which the first layer of explosives is designed to localize the effect of LZ, and the second - to reduce the armor penetration of the OZ. Abroad, much attention has been paid to tandem remote sensing.

So, back in 1992, the Polish Military Institute of Arms Technology developed a tandem DZ unit - ERAWA-2 for installation on T-72 tanks, which were produced in Poland. It should be recalled that in Russia by now a block of the tandem DZ Relikt has been created, with the help of which the fact of its overcoming by the Kornet missile has not been established. In 1993, the Americans began to carry out active work to create a “smart” SAS (Smart Armor System) body armor. In this system, a grid of sensors, a computer, and explosive units are combined. Essentially, this system is a computerized version of dynamic protection that will detect, destroy or deflect attacking ammunition using small DZ units. In relation to the "Cornet" this system will act as follows. When the Cornet passes the sensor system, the computer will determine its size and the number of DZ blocks that are located under the Cornet and must work in order to reliably destroy it.

The aforementioned article contains many laudable assessments of Cornet, based on information received from specialists of various levels. At the same time, such assessments are not based on characteristics related to combat reality. Such characteristics include survivability, noise immunity, secrecy. Vitality - the property of "Cornet" to retain the ability to perform its functions during combat damage. Unfortunately, today there are no laws defeating the "Cornet" from the SAZ fragmentation ammunition of the М1А2 SEP tank, without the knowledge of which the rocket survivability cannot be characterized. Vitality has a greater impact on the effectiveness of the "Cornet" than all other characteristics. Noise immunity - the “Cornet” property to perform combat functions in the conditions of creating interference by the enemy. Indeed, the guidance system using a laser beam is not sufficiently protected from smoke interference. Characteristics of noise immunity can be the probability of normal functioning in the conditions of a given (standard) interference of the enemy. Stealth - the property of "Cornet" not to be detected by enemy intelligence. For example, the portable complex “Kornet” can be detected by the crew of the М1А2 SEP tank when the “Cornet” uses a laser emitter that illuminates the target of the rocket. Then the destruction of the "Cornet" will follow along with the calculation. Such an operation can be carried out by a complex installed on foreign tanks.

"CORNET" IN FIGHT AGAINST SAZ AND TDZ

The increase in the protection performance of the M1А2 SEP tank by installing the SAZ and the tandem DZ (TDZ) can be assessed as follows. It is known that the probability of hitting a tank (P) is determined by the product of the probability of overcoming the SAZ “Kornet” while maintaining the normal functioning of the tandem warhead (Р1), the probability of getting the “Kornet” in the frontal part of М1А2 SEP (Р2), the probability of overcoming the tandem DZ “Kornet” (РX) RX (Р3) of the tandem DZ “Kornet” (RX) (Р1) (P2) ), the probability of penetration of the frontal fragments of protection МХNUMXА4 SEP (Р5), the probability of damage to the units inside the tank (РXNUMX).

To create a protection for the Abrams against the cumulative jet of the OZ Kornet with 1300 mm armor penetration, it is no longer possible to use multi-layered armor, which unnecessarily increases the mass of the tank. In other words, the time of layered armor has passed. For this reason, SAZ and TDZ are installed on the Abrams.

The predicted characteristics of the Kornet's combat effectiveness in connection with the installation on the Abrams SAZ and TDZ are presented in the 3 table. The first line of the table contains the probability of hitting the М1А2 SEP tank, on which there are no SAZ and TDZ. The second line corresponds to the installation on the SAZ tank, which Kornet overcomes with probability 0,3, which corresponds to the modern system with good noise immunity. “Cornet” was not created to overcome the TLV, as evidenced by the unsatisfactory value of R. The extremely unsatisfactory value of the probability of hitting the M1A2 SEP tank corresponds to the installation on the Abrams SAZ and TDZ. The smallest probability of hitting this tank is 0,02, which requires giving Cornet properties to overcome the SAZ and TDZ. But these properties are much easier to obtain for a new anti-tank missile than with the modernization of the Cornet.

The unsatisfactory state of combat effectiveness of anti-tank guided missiles with tandem warheads indicates that the anti-tank breach of the Ministry of Defense continues to expand (HBO No. 45, 2011).

In the 80 of the last century, the KBP commissioned the Drozd SAZ to enhance the protection of tanks. At the same time, KBM established the Arena SAZ. Obviously, for the creation of these SAZ KB used anti-tank guided missiles they create. The SAZ “Drozd” and “Arena” adopted for use showed positive results. But that was it. The question arises: why nothing was done to ensure that our ATGM reliably overcome the SAZ of foreign tanks? State tests (GIs) of all domestic ATGMs with tandem warheads did not contain a check of the overcoming of the SAZ of foreign tanks of the last upgrade of the M1А2 SEP. Also, for all missiles with tandem warheads, no tests of tandem remote sensing were provided.

It is appropriate to recall that the “Cornet” is often represented as super-precise. What kind of super-precision can we talk about when the SAZ of the M1-X2 SEP tank has completed the functioning of the Cornet even on approach?

The submissions indicate that the "Kornet" was created by the Soviet TTZ, which does not take into account the appearance of the M1A2 SEP tank with SAZ and TDZ. The P30, P60, P65, corresponding to the protection of the frontal fragments of the М1 tank, were provided as valid obstacles. These obstacles simulators were supposed to be equipped with the built-in remote sensing of the old structure. Thus, the Cornet proved to be ineffective for hitting the M1X2 SEP tank, the protection of which is capable of localizing the high armor penetration of the tandem warhead of this missile. It should be noted the inactivity of the Russian GRUU, which calmly refers to this situation.



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  1. The comment was deleted.
    1. +28
      28 June 2014 08: 46
      This clown was thrown out of the industry a long time ago, so he whines for how many years, and on specific Russophobic resources. I picked it up to death, obviously some kind of grant works.
      1. +11
        28 June 2014 08: 50
        I wonder where he worked.
        Let him go to his historical homeland and not sink in the Dead Sea laughing
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. +31
        28 June 2014 09: 32
        Quote: Mikhado
        Bullied to death, obviously some grant fulfills.

        Bullied, not bullied but raises the issue and personally I think that is not from scratch.
        You can’t treat spices on their laurels, the enemy does not sleep and is looking for ways.
        The problem of overcoming SAZ, TDZ exists.
        Especially with:For example, the portable complex “Cornet” can be detected by the crew of the M1A2 SEP tank when the “Cornet” uses a laser emitter that illuminates the target with a rocket. Then followed by the destruction of the "Cornet" along with the calculation.
        In the conditions of urban-rural development or complex terrain (mountain-ravines, rugged terrain) it is still possible to neutralize, but in open places it is already suicide, as in other things and with a group of goals.
        1. +18
          28 June 2014 16: 49
          Slightly disagree with Papakiko - raising the issue is one thing, and trashing a work thing is somewhat different. No one says that the peak of scientific and technological thought is at the root, but, excuse me, this cannot be said about many things (for example, the T-34 or T-72, but the same abrash or phantom), but this did not make them less suitable. Pointing out the flaws is one thing, and lousy to impudent, at the same time, turning to the individual and not providing concrete evidence - is quite another.
        2. +6
          29 June 2014 18: 58
          as far as I remember the Israelis in the Lebanese (with Hezbollah) war in 2006, it was the "cornets" that burned the "carrots". And they are not worse than ambros.
          1. +1
            29 June 2014 20: 49
            Quote: pinachet
            as far as I remember the Israelis in the Lebanese (with Hezbollah) war in 2006, it was the "cornets" that burned the "carrots". And they are not worse than ambros.

            Can I have the details?
            1. +1
              1 July 2014 00: 41
              Here is what US diplomats reported about the Second Lebanese War in 2006 in a report to the State Department that was published in The New York Times in August 2006. According to this report, between July 12 and August 7, Israel lost 343 military personnel. killed and 617 wounded. The number of Merkava tanks set on fire reached 118, another 46 vehicles were damaged to some extent - now they need serious repairs. In addition, 96 armored personnel carriers, military jeeps and bulldozers were set on fire during the war. On the battlefield, the Israeli army used up 90% of its ammunition, forcing the command to reactivate the ammunition depots, which had been closed for decades. The fighting lasted 34 days from July 12 to August 14, 2006. According to Israeli official figures published in the Haaretz newspaper on August 13, 2006, the total losses from the conflict amounted to 23 billion shekels (approx. 6 billion US dollars), of 7 billion shekels are direct military spending.
              1. -1
                1 July 2014 07: 42
                Quote: Vol50
                Israel lost 343 troops killed and 617 wounded.

                ... and Shabak slaughtered the families of all the dead, their classmates and colleagues, so that they would remain silent and run to the press or social networks. And therefore, the official version of Tzahal has been refuted for 8 years now. No names, no surnames ...

                Quote: Vol50
                The number of set fire tanks "Merkava" reached 118

                1180 !!!
                1. picca2
                  -1
                  24 November 2014 21: 41
                  Professor - read here .... http: //waronline.org/IDF/Articles/2nd-lebanon-war-statistics/c
                  asualit
                  ies.html
                  The number of wounded soldiers is about 750. According to the department of rehabilitation (Agaf Shikum) of the IDF (Bamakhane, July 06.07.2007, 8, p. XNUMX), the number of wounded in the IDF was:

                  107 - hard;
                  100 - moderate;
                  2,442 - easy;
                  2,782 - psychological injuries (it was noted that 80% of the soldiers who received psychological assistance during the battles returned to duty within a few hours or days);
                  By July 2007, about 700 soldiers and 140 civilians had received some degree of disability from the Ministry of Defense (“Ahuzei Nehut”).
                  As for the losses of SW in equipment, in total 52 units of BTT were damaged, including 46 tanks (according to other sources - 46 tanks and 14 units of another BTT). 5 tanks were recognized as not repairable: 2, blown up on high-explosive bombs (Merkava-2 and Merkava-4 each), and 3 that were hit by ATGMs (Merkava-2, Merkava-3 and Merkava, one each) 4"). Among other heavily damaged equipment, at least 2 D9 bulldozers and 1 Puma armored personnel carrier.
                  1. +1
                    24 November 2014 21: 47
                    Quote: picca2
                    Professor - read here .... http: //waronline.org/IDF/Articles/2nd-lebanon-war-statistics/c
                    asualit
                    ies.html
                    The number of wounded soldiers is about 750. According to the department of rehabilitation (Agaf Shikum) of the IDF (Bamakhane, July 06.07.2007, 8, p. XNUMX), the number of wounded in the IDF was:

                    107 - hard;
                    100 - moderate;
                    2,442 - easy;
                    2,782 - psychological injuries (it was noted that 80% of the soldiers who received psychological assistance during the battles returned to duty within a few hours or days);
                    By July 2007, about 700 soldiers and 140 civilians had received some degree of disability from the Ministry of Defense (“Ahuzei Nehut”).
                    As for the losses of SW in equipment, in total 52 units of BTT were damaged, including 46 tanks (according to other sources - 46 tanks and 14 units of another BTT). 5 tanks were recognized as not repairable: 2, blown up on high-explosive bombs (Merkava-2 and Merkava-4 each), and 3 that were hit by ATGMs (Merkava-2, Merkava-3 and Merkava, one each) 4"). Among other heavily damaged equipment, at least 2 D9 bulldozers and 1 Puma armored personnel carrier.

                    I read it. So what? There appeared new names that were hidden from the eyes of the general public?
                    1. picca2
                      -1
                      24 November 2014 21: 51
                      Yes, that who asked for details here ....
                      1. +1
                        24 November 2014 21: 58
                        Quote: picca2
                        Yes, that who asked for details here ....

                        Details of what? In Israel, they know their fallen by name.
                      2. picca2
                        -1
                        24 November 2014 22: 02
                        How does a smart Jew talk to a stupid one?
                        - High and from New York.
        3. Yuriy74
          +2
          15 July 2014 09: 50
          The author, it seems, does not quite represent the principle of operation of the Kornet's guidance system. First, the laser does not illuminate the target, but the receiver in the rocket. Secondly, immediately after the launch, the overshoot mechanism is triggered, and the rocket flies several meters higher. Accordingly, the laser radiation does not hit the tank's sensors. The descent occurs on approach to the target, and in a short time the AZ system may not have time to operate.
      4. +15
        28 June 2014 12: 47
        As you put it, nagging can be quite justified regarding the use of the cornet against the latest modifications of modern tanks, the situation is that where the latest modification of the same abrams is applied and will be applied, there are still not enough cornet for those. But if we discard emotions, then the article has a lot of interesting (though not new)
      5. +21
        28 June 2014 17: 26
        Quote: Mikhado
        This clown was thrown out of the industry a long time ago, so he whines for how many years, and on specific Russophobic resources. I picked it up to death, obviously some kind of grant works.

        There is the "Independent Military Review" (NVO): a weekly supplement to the Nezavisimaya Gazeta.
        Mikhail Rastopshin, Candidate of Technical Sciences, is among the regular authors of the NVO.
        For the sake of interest he leafed through a huge list of his articles and did not find a single article in the title of which there was no criticism of everything Russian.

        The titles of some of his articles:
        "Foreign tanks are not afraid of our missile systems"
        "The anti-tank gap of the Ministry of Defense is expanding"
        "All-round defense of Russian armored vehicles is bursting at the seams"
        "The expected and natural failure of GPV-2020"
        "Are our tanks doomed in a real war?"
        "Mobile" Poplar "at gunpoint" Tomahawk ""

        His next article begins with this:
        "The system for creating military equipment does not meet the requirements of the defense capability of our state."

        He is either alarmist or troublemaker.
        1. pavlo
          +9
          29 June 2014 00: 22
          everything that begins with the words independent-stinks Americanism and further in the text .....
        2. +13
          29 June 2014 14: 36
          I am not an expert in this field, but let me express my opinion.
          Opinion "teapot", and not "armored".

          Complete destruction of enemy armored vehicles is of course a good thing, and we must strive for this.
          But besides the "slaughter" of anti-tank weapons, I advise you to take into account the human factor.
          Our likely adversary is used to fighting in comfort:
          if there is no three meals a day, toilet paper with the smell of mimosa or foot powder - and he is no longer a fighter.
          And in the event of the slightest malfunction, he prefers to be modest and can give um.

          Remember the story that happened in 1943 in Tunisia:
          The shell fell between the tower and the hull Panzerkampfwagen VI (Tiger-1).
          As a result, the tower jammed, and the crew threw the car, which remained ammunition, and in the tanks - fuel.
          It happened that our warriors went to the ram in a burning tank or plane, threw themselves on the barbed wire or embrasure with their breasts - and these representatives of the “superior race” were confused because of such a small fault in principle.
          As a result of “light injury”, the enemy lost the combat vehicle.

          It is in the movie “Black Hawk Down” that they are all as one bold and purposeful.
          And remember the recent history of the massive layoffs on the US destroyer Donald Cook:
          The Pentagon promised to increase the insurance sums of military personnel from 1 million dollars to 3 million dollars, but few of them calmed down.
          Survival on the open sea and then receive an insurance payment is not enough chances.
          And dead money is not needed.

          As a result of the events described, the crew of the "Donald Cook" was forced to sail with a shortage of personnel.
          The further dismissal of 27 crewmembers, possibly followed by others, threatens the destroyer’s continued successful execution of the task.
          And all that happened was that the destroyer flew around at a shaving pensioner SU-24 ...

          I believe that it’s enough to hit a potential enemy in an armored vehicle in which the intercom, the commander’s sight or the air conditioner will fail - and we can assume that the car has left the battlefield.

          But it is necessary to improve the domestic ATGM.
          1. +1
            30 June 2014 21: 49
            The belief that protivnik cannot fight without a dry closet is fatal and leads to defeat.
            Let's consider the probable adversary as a super-soldier, or at least as a super-professional, then we will not have unjustified expectations and defeats of the 41-year-old again.
            With regard to the battlefield, on the battlefield there is a chance of incapacitating the same abrams by hitting them in the frontal projection from the zsu, but again, let's develop, adopt and prepare the crews, taking into account that the enemy’s tanks are modern and they are good soldiers.
        3. 0
          30 June 2014 09: 05
          Or, in the worst case, "Cassandra" .... However, it is difficult for a layman in the field to distinguish "xy from xy". Emotions are too much.
        4. The comment was deleted.
      6. +3
        29 June 2014 09: 34
        Quote: Mikhado
        This clown was thrown out of the industry a long time ago, so he whines

        The most important thing is that real armor penetration, as well as armor resistance with and without DZ - are data from owls. secret.
        The true values ​​become known only as a result of "field tests", because even combat damage cannot serve as a completely accurate criterion: exact distances, angles, modifications, etc. are not known.
        Also sov.secretny design features guidance systems guided missiles and shells.
        Where does Mr. Rastopshin get his knowledge?
        He knows everything, he only ran straight from a test site at a trot. Yes
        There was an article by an engineer who himself tested the "TOU" and "Milan" ATGMs. There is clearly visible truth and competence.
        And here ..., so chatter in the calculation of heating unhealthy interest.
        Although with all this, at the same time, it does not mean at all that the armor penetration and other characteristics of domestic ATGMs are in full order.
        But only "competent" bodies and persons can judge this.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. +9
      28 June 2014 08: 48
      Rastopshin invented nothing (http://www.fips.ru/) - a search engine.
      I wonder what kind of education he has?
    4. 0
      28 June 2014 12: 32
      Hmm ... It's ALWAYS easier to criticize ... And THIS IS CREATING ... !!! I think it is clear !!!
  2. +16
    28 June 2014 08: 04
    Pancake. The author of the cornet clearly did not like it. And strive to work in contrast: they say everything is pi ..... S (including academicians of the RAS), and I am D "Artanyan. Only the practical experience of the rebels in Iraq confirms the opposite. And according to the Merkava - like nothing, they say, works. // http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zglAX5axIos]
    As far as I know, on the Abramsahs, DZs are not placed on the frontal parts (apparently the author’s imagination), but are used to protect the side (very extensive and not very protected surface of the side)
    1. +6
      28 June 2014 23: 52
      That's right. Amrams forehead of the hull and tower - passive protection from
      several plates of depleted uranium.
      DZ boxes began to protect the sides after the second Iraqi.
      There is no AZ at Abrams.
      Cornet will pierce the side and the roof. But the forehead is not.
      1. badger1974
        +3
        29 June 2014 07: 02
        it’s in vain that you think so, on the sides of the mechanic drive there are about 200 liters of kerosene, even a slight ricochet from the DShK (12.7) forces the crew to leave the abra, and in the niche of the 12.7 tower leads to the complete loss of the tankababra, what can we say about the shelling by the Cornet or the magnificent "seven" , turnip scales (read technical editions and not climb in the net)
  3. +13
    28 June 2014 08: 08
    Most interestingly, in addition to theoretical conclusions (such as the influence of an infinitely long electromagnetic wave propagating in an ideal vacuum to infinitely believing colleagues), the author does not give any arguments in defense of his point of view.
  4. Platoon
    +9
    28 June 2014 08: 33
    Well, now the author is showered with poop. Wang a hundred comments like "cornets snap abrams like nuts". And I would like, as a layman, constructive criticism. At the article level. It is a pity that it will not be.
    1. +10
      28 June 2014 09: 19
      Quote: Platoon
      Well, now the author is pooping.

      What's the point?
      Most of the visitors will not be able to grasp the essence because they do not have education in this direction and will perceive the article solely as a "spit" in the domestic defense industry.
      And they will be right.
      Quote: Platoon
      Wang a hundred comments like "cornets snap abrams like nuts"

      If my grandmother had a shit, then she would be a grandfather.
      Most will simply miss this spit for a weekend0 skewers-beer-girls-bath-vodka-balalaika. Computer nerds are not very many in the vast Motherland and the summer is SHORT.
      Quote: Platoon
      And I would like, as a layman, constructive criticism.

      For this, contact the natives of the Israeli townships, they will "fill" your brain.
      Quote: Platoon
      At the article level. It is a pity that she will not be.

      Ask to "tovarischi" to such people as, for example, http://gurkhan.blogspot.ru/search?updated-min=2014-01-01T00:00:00%2B06:00&update
      d-max=2015-01-01T00:00:00%2B06:00&max-results=50 .
      They will orient you in the world of knowledge about armored problems.
      hi
      1. karpag
        -5
        29 June 2014 00: 26
        On the whole, I am fairly objective (and therefore skeptical) about Russian weapons. I must admit that the "cornet" is one of the few successful Russian weapons. And the presence of the cornet in the hands of Hezbollah worries me much more than the future deliveries of S-300 and MiG-35 to Syria
        1. badger1974
          +3
          29 June 2014 07: 08
          Well, you went over with the MiG-35 (there aren’t any), but with the S-300 you’re crap too, keep Triumph above the S-400 (you think), the ATGM cornet, and 125 mm is the same but called Chrysontema, as with 72 Mona bullet and with Octopus-B
    2. avt
      +18
      28 June 2014 09: 54
      Quote: Platoon
      Well, now the author is pooping.

      Why throw it down? He buried himself in the tree. Now, if we discard all the pseudoscientific husk of words and tablets about the PROBABILITY of the defeat of Abram s. What's the bottom line ??? "Scoop" did not foresee what would happen in the 21st century. "Cornet" to the dump, he will not break through the future protection, by the way, which appeared after the "Abrams" and "Merkavas" "Cornet. What
      Quote: Papakiko
      You can’t spice on laurels

      Eka is unseen! Common truth and no one has yet made absolute weapons for a couple of centuries, the atomic bomb does not count.
      Quote: Platoon
      And I would like, as a layman, constructive criticism. At the article level.

      Well, fire negative with what fright to descend to the level of the author? What is there in the article of such a clever, cunning, based on quite itself specific data of combat use and experimental shooting by the "Cornet". What, did the US give him to shoot at the new armor to write plates ?? He crawled out destroyed tanks and saw what came out of the battle after the shelling ?? Bullshit is pseudo-scientific, written by a person envious of someone else's glory.
      1. +13
        28 June 2014 11: 48
        based on the experience of the use of Hezbollah fighters and guerrillas in Iraq against the Abrams ...

        1. create special teams of 5 6 soldiers, which should be composed of: ATGM operator, machine gunner and sniper to protect against infantry ....
        2. Ambush sites should be selected in areas restricting the movement of tanks.
        3. the ambush location should ensure the free departure of the group after the completion of the task ...
        4. when conducting military operations in the city, it is necessary to use several teams, placing them at different levels - in basements, on the first or third, roofs of buildings. for reliable destruction of the tank, it is recommended to simultaneously produce up to 5-5 on it. shots from anti-tank systems / RPGs from various directions ....
        6. It is recommended to shell MBT in the upper hemisphere, sides, MTO ...., from the flanks and from the rear .... shots at the frontal armor are ineffective and can only unmask a grenade launcher ...
        1. +6
          28 June 2014 11: 57
          in Chechnya 1,2. Ichkeria militants used this tactic: two grenade launchers, tried to shoot at the same point .. in Chechnya, this point was the first digit of the side number and that’s it ... the first removes the defense, the second hits for defeat ...
          1. +11
            28 June 2014 12: 40
            A grenade launcher is not a sniper rifle that getting into the same cube is not so easy for me
            1. Tyumen
              +7
              28 June 2014 15: 33
              There are such snipers. From the 90s there was an attempt on a super-guarded banker. Somehow they switched the traffic signal along its route, and when the car got up, one entered between the doors, the second a second later at the same point. Edge effect, the armor did not help, the legs of the banker were torn off, he died on the way to the hospital.
              1. +1
                28 June 2014 20: 51
                Well, such a sniper unit, moreover, the car stood up, and the tank is in motion and the infantry will not allow to aim for sure
              2. 0
                28 June 2014 20: 51
                Well, such a sniper unit, moreover, the car stood up, and the tank is in motion and the infantry will not allow to aim for sure
                1. badger1974
                  +1
                  29 June 2014 07: 14
                  yes, easily, from the "seven" on the mers shevardnadze shmalnuli, the mersebens boasted "to our cart of preziks as it protects" - only one kept silent, if a meter closer to the salon, then ...., the prezik would be that taking into account the movement of a representative car, these are the purchase
              3. +1
                29 June 2014 14: 30
                Tyumenev
                What? This man drove a car with DZ, what had to be knocked down with two grenades?
                1. Tyumen
                  0
                  30 June 2014 14: 53
                  Apparently, for sure.) He said that I remember the case is real, if you want, you can find information.
                2. The comment was deleted.
                3. +1
                  30 June 2014 17: 34
                  It was in St. Petersburg. On the waterfront. Two people carried glass from the doors (80mm). A number 666 auto. Trusted.
            2. +1
              30 June 2014 08: 50
              Quote: ruslan207
              A grenade launcher is not a sniper rifle that getting into the same cube is not so easy for me

              But you can try!
          2. The comment was deleted.
        2. Voronbit
          +1
          29 June 2014 13: 03
          BEAT THE GUN ... write in capital letters
    3. +19
      28 June 2014 12: 26
      Quote: Platoon
      For example, the portable Cornet complex can be detected by the crew of the M1A2 SEP tank when the Cornet uses a laser emitter that illuminates the target with the rocket. Then followed by the destruction of the "Cornet" along with the calculation. Such an operation can be carried out by a complex installed on foreign tanks.

      The author is just a troll - Cornet does not highlight the target with a laser !!!! A missile is controlled by a laser - that is, the missile is not aimed at the reflected laser beam, as is done in the traditional version, and the laser beam entering the receiver in the tail of the rocket transmits operator’s commands. This ensures noise immunity - a direct laser beam is an order of magnitude stronger than the reflected signal.
      1. +5
        28 June 2014 16: 56
        Quote: avdkrd
        the laser beam entering the receiver in the tail of the rocket transmits the operator’s commands. This ensures noise immunity - a direct laser beam is an order of magnitude stronger than the reflected signal.

        You are a little wrong here. The laser beam has a certain width and is not a thin beam as in science fiction films (otherwise the rocket would simply lose control when flying along the trajectory). So the detection is quite real, it’s another matter that it will happen AFTER the launch and the crew’s reaction time, consider that it doesn’t.
        1. +2
          28 June 2014 16: 59
          The author is just a troll - Cornet does not highlight the target with a laser !!!!

          Laser rangefinder on the tank, thereby revealing itself.

          Quote: tchoni
          So the detection is quite real, it’s another matter that it will happen AFTER the launch and the crew’s reaction time, consider that it doesn’t.

          You are mistaken. The laser range finder of the PU Cornet will issue fighters long before the launch of the rocket.
          1. badger1974
            +1
            29 June 2014 07: 19
            the ballistic calculator can be on or off (do not forget to cornet this is an enlarged tank chrysoneme), everything else is in the optical range, keep the mark on the target, and the lidar will do its job, you will find it when the tank jumps
        2. s1н7т
          0
          28 June 2014 18: 46
          Quote: tchoni
          AFTER the launch and the reaction time from the crew, consider that not.

          And when you AIM - they will not find it?
          1. +6
            28 June 2014 22: 03
            Quote: c1n7
            Laser rangefinder on the tank, thereby revealing itself.

            Professor, in the cornet there is NO laser range finder - for the projectile is active and not ballistic and accurate knowledge of the distance to the target is not required.
            Perhaps you are confusing with an eye to the LNG-9 - yes, there are, but such sights - in Russia, it’s counted out once or twice. For export, in my opinion they were not supplied.
            1. 0
              28 June 2014 22: 14
              Quote: tchoni
              Professor, in the cornet there is NO laser range finder - for the projectile is active and not ballistic and accurate knowledge of the distance to the target is not required.

              At Cornet, the missile flies in excess so that the laser does not irradiate the target and does not give out itself. Immediately before the target, the rocket returns to the line of sight. Now explain how the missile and launcher know when to return to the line of sight without determining the range to the target? The target can be at 500m and at 5000m ...
              1. +4
                28 June 2014 23: 36
                Quote: professor
                Quote: tchoni
                Professor, in the cornet there is NO laser range finder - for the projectile is active and not ballistic and accurate knowledge of the distance to the target is not required.

                At Cornet, the missile flies in excess so that the laser does not irradiate the target and does not give out itself. Immediately before the target, the rocket returns to the line of sight. Now explain how the missile and launcher know when to return to the line of sight without determining the range to the target? The target can be at 500m and at 5000m ...

                And you can calculate the distance to the target, if the excess over the rocket over the target (in meters) is constant, the rate of change of the excess over the target (in degrees) do you know the flight speed is constant and you know the current distance from the operator to the rocket?
                1. 0
                  29 June 2014 08: 03
                  Quote: yanus
                  And you can calculate the distance to the target, if the excess over the rocket over the target (in meters) is constant, the rate of change of the excess over the target (in degrees) do you know the flight speed is constant and you know the current distance from the operator to the rocket?

                  No I can not. The distance to the goal you need to know. I will return to my example. How does a rocket know the target at 500 m or 5000 m? It may already come back to the line of sight and the missile has passed over the target ...

                  And yes, I forgot to ask how it turns out that the Merkavas with the same LWS-2 could not "smoke" themselves from the Cornets, if the dull Cornet gives itself out with a laser rangefinder.

                  1. The mess was there.
                  2. You are sure that you could not "smoke" yourself. I saw a video of how Merkava actively smokes himself.
              2. +2
                28 June 2014 23: 45
                Quote: professor
                Now explain how the missile and launcher know when to return to the line of sight without determining the range to the target? The target can be at 500m and at 5000m ...

                And yes, I forgot to ask how it turns out that the Merkavas with the same LWS-2 could not "smoke" themselves from the Cornets, if the dull Cornet gives itself out with a laser rangefinder.
              3. badger1974
                +5
                29 June 2014 07: 39
                easily, keep the mark of the sight in the lens (magnification over the grid of the optical range finder), when you launch the rocket enters the wide cone of revolution of the laser beam, falling into its capture (the mirror begins to give a return signal) the beam cone of revolution narrows, bringing the rocket to an anticipated point,

                It's a shame not to know-the ADADS star-striped complex in '86, though I don't understand why they oriented this guidance to the "ground-air", not really for working out the helfair and mods for the meverik?
              4. +2
                29 June 2014 10: 10
                Professor, I had some experience working with the cornet, and I can say for sure - before the shot it works in a passive mode and does not radiate anything.
                1. 0
                  29 June 2014 10: 13
                  Quote: tchoni
                  Professor, I had some experience working with the cornet, and I can say for sure - before the shot it works in a passive mode and does not radiate anything.

                  Explain pliz, how does he know the distance to the target in order to return to the line of sight?
                  1. badger1974
                    +2
                    29 June 2014 10: 44
                    something like this, only with a photocell
                    1. +2
                      29 June 2014 11: 32
                      Why guess? Just write, "I don't know." With an optical sight, it is almost impossible to determine the distance to the target of 5000 m or 7000 m for example.
                      And the question is again valid:
                      The Cornet operator identified the target, fixed a mark on it and the rocket went beyond the line of sight ... How does the rocket know when to return to the line of sight to hit the target?
                      1. badger1974
                        +1
                        29 June 2014 12: 10
                        Hello my ra, but the diode bridge of the razoposchitel (there is current and there is no current) does not mean anything to you? why did you divorce the kindergarten, the current ma is created by lidar (radar) at the quantum coherent level, unlike the radar of a remote station with 100 or more kW, lidar does not require such capacities, so the question is not a question, but beingness
                      2. +1
                        29 June 2014 15: 33
                        Why give out secrets even 20 summer ago? Well, they didn’t know how the cornet works and wouldn’t know further in the Middle East wassat
                      3. +3
                        29 June 2014 15: 43
                        Quote: KG_patriot_last
                        Why give out secrets even 20 summer ago? Well, they didn’t know how the cornet works and wouldn’t know further in the Middle East wassat

                        What are the secrets? Russian Cornets in the hands of the Tsahal at least since 2006.
                      4. Aries
                        +3
                        29 June 2014 19: 34
                        badger1974 - right, in the optics of the cornet there is a grid (a small glass with a picture) on which the rangefinding strokes are applied - they determine the distance to the target, then on the device the range of removal from excess is set with the switch, as a result, in flight the rocket falls about 1 km to the target from exceeding the target line of sight (taking into account the speed for 3-4 seconds before hitting the target), and as for the rangefinder, it really is not on the cornet, it is not needed ...
                      5. Yuriy74
                        +1
                        15 July 2014 10: 10
                        The previous author almost accurately indicated the principle of measuring the range in the Cornet. There is a rangefinder scale on the launcher grid, according to which the operator determines the distance to the target, and then manually enters it. The missile launch range is up to 5 km, so the fact that "In the optical sight it is almost impossible to determine the distance to the target of 5000 m or 7000 m for example" is not important.
                  2. 0
                    29 June 2014 20: 40
                    Honestly, I don’t know. And I don’t even know if it determines. I know that the sensor for detecting laser radiation from a curtain complex only works after a shot, and then not immediately.

                    in addition, the rocket is constantly in sight of the sight. And, regarding the excess that you spoke of, it is, if there is one, it is not very large.

                    And the distance to the target can be determined even after the launch, the rocket is then up to the sound, and peck the distance to the laser - I would say a second-second thing ..... (but this is my logical reasoning smile )
                    1. badger1974
                      0
                      30 June 2014 09: 51
                      the curtain is always triggered when there is an irradiation buzzer, only the BM commander has the right to activate this PZ system, and this also extends in time, because the curtain also records laser school pointers
          2. badger1974
            +2
            29 June 2014 07: 20
            and when you poke pictures, they find you?
        3. 0
          29 June 2014 21: 40
          Quote: tchoni
          So the discovery is real

          I did not comment on the possibility of detection, but the highlight of the target. For a direct beam, aerosols present much less interference, because reflected from the armor is already weakened tenfold, plus resistance to interference systems such as Stor - Cornet does not have a receiver in the head. In the case of Hellfire’s illumination, for example, the seeker is located in the missile’s head and picks up the signal reflected from the target, which immediately puts special demands on the sensitivity of the seeker (the reflected signal is weaker) and the difficulty to maintain control in the case of optoelectronic suppression (at least the seeker in subject to interference in any case).
          1. badger1974
            0
            24 August 2014 10: 32
            I’m leading to this, the Cornet basically acts as a wired ATGM, and the operator’s professionalism is the key to success,
  5. +7
    28 June 2014 08: 37
    I read this cry about the Cornet untimely asleep, I looked who gave birth to this exposition of nonsense to the reader, further, as they say, without comment. You shouldn’t moan the trash and get busy, if you’re so smart, help people get off a new, more powerful anti-tank missile. Or not smart and smart ?
  6. +26
    28 June 2014 08: 45
    1. Cornet is a serious weapon;
    2. Cornet's main problem is getting there.
    3. Show me Abrams with a SAZ capable of intercepting Cornet. The author is clearly sophisticated.

    PS
    Russian "Cornet" against the American "General Abrams"

    Not "Russian", but "Soviet" or, if you insist, "Russian". Tatars and Bashkirs have nothing to do with him?
    1. Voronbit
      +13
      28 June 2014 09: 04
      Professor, sometimes you say practical things ............. do not stoop to the level of a professor of acidic ... they have ... but I'm proud. that this is a Tula product
    2. +9
      28 June 2014 09: 30
      Quote: professor
      Not "Russian", but "Soviet" or, if you insist, "Russian". Tatars and Bashkirs have nothing to do with him?

      Professor, it means you’ve never been seen in Russophobia, nu-nu laughing
      1. +7
        28 June 2014 10: 00
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        Professor, it means you’ve never been seen in Russophobia, nu-nu

        Never. Do not distort, otherwise I'll start to call all Mi helicopters Jewish.
        1. +11
          28 June 2014 11: 32
          They would have every right if these helicopters were designed and manufactured in Israel from Israeli components. And so - say what you want.

          As for Russophobia, you have it, you have it. Such an important "brick" in the foundation of your attitude and self-justification. However, not only you.
          1. +3
            28 June 2014 12: 02
            Quote: stoker
            They would have every right if these helicopters were designed and manufactured in Israel from Israeli components. And so - say what you want.

            Helicopters are also produced in Kazan, does it mean that it is Tatar or all the same Russian? Maybe I am now a Tatarophobe? wink

            Quote: stoker
            As for Russophobia - yes, you have it.

            how you want to sometimes wishful thinking ...
            1. +8
              28 June 2014 12: 42
              And what have the "helicopters" to do with it? (Thanks to "nvv"). "Helicopters" have nothing to do with this topic. This is not about "helicopters", but about the content and tone of your statements. And you don't need to "give out" anything. "Issuing" is just you, and regularly.
              1. +1
                28 June 2014 13: 02
                Quote: stoker
                And what have the "helicopters" to do with it? (Thanks to "nvv"). "Helicopters" have nothing to do with this topic. This is not about "helicopters", but about the content and tone of your statements. And you don't need to "give out" anything. "Issuing" is just you, and regularly.

                This is not about helicopters, but "Russian", "Tatar" and "Russian", "Soviet" weapons.
                1. badger1974
                  0
                  30 June 2014 01: 28
                  You’re full of garbage, so that the construction of the equipment was presented in its splendor, this is the work of the whole people, this geo-exploration is not applicable to the peoples inhabiting a certain area, this is the development of a deposit that includes different nationalities, this is the delivery of materials, etc., etc., in short, the labor of peoples,


                  so it’s not worth it
            2. +15
              28 June 2014 16: 15
              Professor do not invent, everything that was created in the USSR was created by Russians, Russians with different roots: Jewish, Tatar, Bashkir, Baltic, Ukrainian, etc. I can guarantee you that all the designers or engineers knew Russian as a native language, soaked in mother’s milk, or at least since childhood, that it became the second native language. If you do not agree with me, then you can write the names here.
              1. -8
                28 June 2014 16: 24
                Quote: projdoha
                Professor do not invent, everything that was created in the USSR was created by Russians, Russians with different roots: Jewish, Tatar, Bashkir, Baltic, Ukrainian, etc. I can guarantee you that all the designers or engineers knew Russian as a native language, soaked in mother’s milk, or at least since childhood, that it became the second native language. If you do not agree with me, then you can write the names here.

                Yeah, the Russians. Dad is Armenian, his mother is Armenian, and he suddenly became Russian, and the other has both parents of purebred Jews and suddenly again Russian.
                1. s1н7т
                  +8
                  28 June 2014 18: 59
                  A classmate once went to Germany with his family to relax. In a cafe, I talked with a German. To the question - who are you? The answer is Russian. laughing Why - a separate nuance, but still. And when in the 80s, it happened, they shot down an Israeli Phantom, came running with Izvestia in his hand - you read, ours filled up one more reptile! ... So Russian Jews were and are! Right now, the new block of the BN-600 reactor is "spilling", dear person! "So shtaaa ..." (c)
            3. The comment was deleted.
        2. +7
          28 June 2014 13: 11
          Quote: professor
          otherwise I’ll start to call all Mi helicopters Jewish.

          This is a threat? Ahaha, professor I was not scared, but you have another attempt laughing
          1. 0
            28 June 2014 13: 35
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            This is a threat? Ahaha, professor I was not scared, but you have another attempt

            Can I threaten moderators? Subordination in the Navy taught me well. hi
            Well then let's call the atomic bomb Jewish ... wink
        3. The comment was deleted.
        4. Voronbit
          +1
          29 June 2014 12: 42
          ha ha ha ... purely Jewish rhetoric. although I really don't like the Nazis. Knowing how to make peace
        5. 0
          29 June 2014 19: 01
          Well, also Sikorsky.
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. The Art of War
      +5
      28 June 2014 12: 20
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zglAX5axIos Профессор это ответ на ваш 2-ой пункт!2. Главная проблема у Корнета это попасть.
      1. 0
        28 June 2014 13: 08
        Quote: The Art of War
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zglAX5axIos Профессор это ответ на ваш 2-ой пункт!2. Главная проблема у Корнета это попасть.

        And why did you decide that this is Cornet? Want to discuss Cornet's guidance system, please. Tell us how the Cornet is induced at a distance of 5 km.

        By the way, the video is called "The defeat of the tank" Merkava "Mk.4. (Lebanon, 2006)". I saw only a hit, not a defeat, and a second tank without a track that had nothing to do with the first.

        PS
        Here's another "defeat".
        1. The Art of War
          +6
          28 June 2014 13: 35
          Professor is the answer!
          1. +1
            28 June 2014 13: 45
            Quote: The Art of War
            answer

            You do not offer me commercials, I have already seen them. Explain on your fingers how to point the Cornet at 5+ km. He does not have a seeker and the operator observes the target through the launcher throughout the entire flight of the rocket. I’m hinting that optics on PUs are far from Tsayzov’s and all with an increase of x20.
            1. The Art of War
              +3
              28 June 2014 14: 04
              Professor, when there’s a GOS, not only Javelin and your (Spike) have them laughing
              1. 0
                28 June 2014 14: 38
                Quote: The Art of War
                Professor, when there’s a GOS, not only Javelin and your (Spike) have them laughing

                And where is she Head of Self Guidance. Show by arrow.

                1. The Art of War
                  +6
                  28 June 2014 14: 48
                  Professor is an old rocket! hi
                  1. +1
                    28 June 2014 15: 03
                    Quote: The Art of War
                    Professor is an old rocket! hi

                    Well let's get a new photo. wink
                    1. The Art of War
                      +12
                      28 June 2014 15: 57
                      The professor may show if you show on the map where your nuclear weapons lol wink
                      1. -8
                        28 June 2014 16: 16
                        Quote: The Art of War
                        The professor may show if you show on the map where your nuclear weapons lol wink

                        Do not show it in nature does not exist. I have the honor. hi
                2. badger1974
                  +1
                  29 June 2014 07: 55
                  professor, a block in the head, and receivers (mirrors in the ass (i.e. at the tips of the tail of the rocket)
                  1. 0
                    29 June 2014 08: 13
                    Quote: badger1974
                    professor, a block in the head, and receivers (mirrors in the ass (i.e. at the tips of the tail of the rocket)

                    And where is the GOS? Where are the sensors that detect the position of the target or recognize the target?
                    1. badger1974
                      +1
                      29 June 2014 08: 44
                      you will not believe, there is no gos in the cornet or in the chrysanthemum, there are mirrors (photodetectors on the tips) and there is a control unit (it is in the middle of the rocket) with servos on the steering wheels, that's all the gos, just like on an ADATS
                      1. 0
                        29 June 2014 08: 46
                        Quote: badger1974
                        you will not believe, there is no gos in the cornet or in the chrysanthemum, there are mirrors (photodetectors on the tips) and there is a control unit (it is in the middle of the rocket) with servos on the steering wheels, that's all the gos, just like on an ADATS

                        Believe me, I knew this before.
                3. Aries
                  +1
                  29 June 2014 19: 40
                  Do not argue that the Cornet missiles do not have a seeker, he does not need them, and in the 20x optics the tank is visible perfectly not only at a distance of 5,5 km, but also much further ...
                  1. -1
                    29 June 2014 20: 54
                    Quote: Aries
                    Do not argue that the Cornet missiles do not have a seeker, he does not need them, and in the 20x optics the tank is visible perfectly not only at a distance of 5,5 km, but also much further ...

                    No, not great. I have a Tsayz telescope with a similar magnification. Periodically I observe tanks at different distances and different atmospheric conditions. You can see them not very well, and I’ll be silent about the twenty-time domestic PIR.
                    1. 0
                      30 June 2014 08: 58
                      Do not be overwhelmed, the "cornet" is absolutely not dangerous for your tanks and other BT, everything is fine ....
        2. Aries
          0
          29 June 2014 20: 11
          on the 10th from the roller, a missile is clearly visible, after which a luminous fragment flies upwards to the right - the tracer is 150% one of the modifications of Metis - it has a pyrotechnic tracer installed on one of the wings ...
    5. +3
      28 June 2014 12: 41
      Already not Soviet, it seems, and Iran makes cornet under license
      1. Aries
        0
        29 June 2014 19: 41
        you are wrong about the license and what they "do" are also wrong
    6. The comment was deleted.
    7. +1
      28 June 2014 12: 45
      That's what I respect Professorand - for objectivity ...
    8. -1
      28 June 2014 12: 45
      That's what I respect Professorand - for objectivity ...
    9. +9
      28 June 2014 13: 30
      This article seemed strange to me. Crying "Ariadne abandoned?" Funeral speeches at one time were, oddly enough, and about the RPG - 7, at a time when the dynamic protection of tanks appeared. There is a feeling that the author is conducting the conversation proceeding from the myth of the Abrams' invulnerability. The whole paradox is that the "wars of the bearded", where they use what is at hand, show that there are no invulnerable.
      Often, in time-tested weapons, an irresistible move against the invulnerable is to change the parameters of the warhead of the munition. Judge for yourself:





    10. +3
      28 June 2014 18: 36
      Quote: professor
      Not "Russian", but "Soviet" or, if you insist, "Russian".

      I agree, but only call Dassault "Rafale" French pepelats, and the Challenger tank English-Ozian.
      1. -5
        28 June 2014 20: 27
        Quote: zennon
        I agree, but only call Dassault "Rafale" French pepelats, and the Challenger tank English-Ozian.

        When such words are included in the Russian language, then we'll talk.
        1. +3
          29 June 2014 00: 04
          Quote: professor
          When such words are included in the Russian language, then we'll talk.

          So the "Russian" is rubbish. It is planted to humiliate us. There are 80% of Russians in Russia! And we get along well with almost everyone for centuries, unless of course they are not trying to be rude to us.
          1. -2
            29 June 2014 08: 10
            So "Russian" is rubbish.

            Do not fantasize. There is a Russian Federation, not a Russian Federation. When the name is changed then we'll talk.

            He is being planted to humiliate us.

            Paranoia?

            Russian in Russia 80%!

            So what? Did Kobzon become Russian from this? What about Rosenbaum?

            And we have been fine together with almost everyone for centuries, well, unless of course they are not trying to be rude to us.

            This is not necessary, otherwise Yermolov will remember the Pale of Settlement with pogroms.
            1. 0
              30 June 2014 20: 12
              Or maybe, for a start, let us remember the Pentateuch of Moses: "And at that time they took all his cities, and put to the curse all the cities, men and women and children, did not leave anyone alive" (Deuteronomy, ch. 2), "3. And the Lord betrayed, Our God, into our hands, and Og, the king of Bashan, and all his people; and we smote him, so that no one remained with him.
              4 And at that time we took all his cities; there was no city that we would not have taken from them: sixty cities, the entire Argov region, the kingdom of Og Bashan "(Deut., Ch. 3), we read the Talmud-about the attitude towards non-Jews (towards the goyim, who are worse than dogs), remember the Khazar kaganate, reconquest in Spain (for which the Holy Inquisition was created.) So you don't really need to remember about Ermolov and the Pale of Settlement.
    11. 0
      29 June 2014 20: 48
      By the way, about getting there. One teacher (gunner) told an entertaining story. The troops got to test the ATGM baby. First practice shooting exercises - not a single hit. And people do not seem to be fools - all the gunners are experienced, and it seems like everything is according to the instructions - they try to combine the tracer with the target contour - but one hell of a mess. Dashed off a slander in the design bureau - they say, crap, you comrades, done. And take it from the design bureau, and a girl of about 25 came, who made 3 holes in the target with 3 launches. Yes, not just anywhere, but clearly under the shoulder strap of the tower. And then, with the words "learn, comrade officers," I went home.
      So with proper dexterity - everything is possible. However, the issue of its acquisition is very complex and ambiguous. Here I agree with you.
      1. Aries
        0
        29 June 2014 20: 57
        Last year, one of our government officials hit the target with Metis after 15 minutes of training. Do not compare Baby and Cornet - the baby had manual guidance, at least in the one about which you brought the story, and in the Cornet a semiautomatic device - the shooter does not look at the rocket at all - his task is only to keep the crosshair of the sight on the target, I will say more - if the shooter will follow the rocket - most likely it will miss ...
  7. Voronbit
    +2
    28 June 2014 09: 08
    and indeed this struggle every day loses relevance
  8. +1
    28 June 2014 09: 35
    Explanations for the figure:

    Rice. Fig. 1. Interaction of the 9M133 ATGM with built-in remote sensing: 1 – leading charge (LZ); 2 – aerodynamic steering wheel; 3 – solid propellant rocket engine (RDTT); 4 - channel for the passage of the cumulative jet OZ; 5 - main charge (OZ); 6 - wing; 7 - 15 mm cover; 8 - container with EDZ; 9 - a package of armor plates. Author's drawing
    1. +7
      28 June 2014 12: 08
      ATGM 9K129 "Kornet-E", against the MBT "Abrams M1A1M" of the Iraqi army ...

      used in Iraq by IGL militants in June 2014 ...
    2. 0
      28 June 2014 12: 46
      Maybe it's a mestizo or bassoon, like in flight they all look alike?
      1. +5
        28 June 2014 13: 02
        Quote: ruslan207
        Maybe it's a mestizo or bassoon, like in flight they all look alike?

        maybe only the media lie .....
        here from here: http: //vpk.name/news/108571_kornetyie_protiv_irakskih_abramsov.html

        ATGM 9K129 "Kornet-E" used in Iraq by the group "Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant" (ISIS) ... 2014
        Source: ISIS
        1. -1
          28 June 2014 13: 32
          Iran is stamping Cornets in full: Iranian Cornets
          1. The Art of War
            +3
            28 June 2014 13: 57
            Professor, why the photo? What would Iran supply them to Hezbollah? laughing
            1. +2
              28 June 2014 14: 36
              Quote: The Art of War
              Professor, why the photo? What would Iran supply them to Hezbollah? laughing

              The photo is an example of what Iran is already doing ala-cornet and it is not known which Cornets fly in Iraq.
              1. The Art of War
                +4
                28 June 2014 14: 46
                Professor, if Iran learned to do them, then I won’t envy Israel first in Iraq, then maybe Hezbollah can use them against tanks, I think you know which ones?
                1. 0
                  28 June 2014 15: 02
                  Quote: The Art of War
                  Professor, if Iran learned to do them, then I won’t envy Israel first in Iraq, then maybe Hezbollah can use them against tanks, I think you know which ones?

                  Hezbollah and Hamas have long been armed with Russian-made Cornets, and I guess they are better than Iranian clones. Tsahal also does not sit still and adopted the KAZ, which successfully intercepted the Cornet in combat conditions.
                  1. The Art of War
                    +3
                    28 June 2014 15: 06
                    KAZ (Trophy)?
                    1. 0
                      28 June 2014 15: 11
                      Quote: The Art of War
                      KAZ (Trophy)?

                      And Trophy, too, as well as Iron Fist from IMI.
                      1. The Art of War
                        +4
                        28 June 2014 15: 15
                        And if you take into account if the rocket flies from the top, suppose from a hill (a mountain or a high-rise building? hi
                      2. 0
                        28 June 2014 15: 22
                        Quote: The Art of War
                        And if you take into account if the rocket flies from the top, suppose from a hill (a mountain or a high-rise building? hi

                        Take into account. Trophy completely covers the upper hemisphere.
                      3. +4
                        28 June 2014 21: 51
                        and when creating the merkava, the professor took into account weak soils and wooden bridges
                      4. +2
                        28 June 2014 22: 19
                        Quote: bmv04636
                        and when creating the merkava, the professor took into account weak soils and wooden bridges

                        Weak soils are not a problem, the specific pressure on the soil is important. But wooden bridges are very relevant for the Middle East ...
                      5. 0
                        29 June 2014 13: 47
                        Well, and what is the specific pressure of these wonderful machines like Merkava and Abrams and how quickly they can be transferred, for example, to the borders of Russia
                      6. +1
                        29 June 2014 14: 57
                        Quote: bmv04636
                        Well, and what is the specific pressure of these wonderful machines like Merkava and Abrams and how quickly they can be transferred, for example, to the borders of Russia

                        ground pressure
                        Merkava: 0,9 kg / cm2
                        T-90 (C): 0,938 kg / cm2
                        T-90A (SA): 0,97 kg / cm2
                        T-80: 0,925 kg / cm2
                        Leopard 0,85 kg / cm2
                        Abrams M1: 0,96
                        Abrams M1A1: 1, .01
                        Abrams M1A2: 1,07
                        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%90%D0%B1%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BC%D1%81_(%D1%82%D0%B0%
                        D0% BD% D0% BA)
                        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A2-90
                        http://armor.kiev.ua/Tanks/Modern/T80/T80vsLeopard.php
                        http://armor.kiev.ua/Tanks/Modern/Merkava/mer1/
                      7. The Art of War
                        +2
                        29 June 2014 15: 15
                        Professor, you want to say that Abrams and Markava, which are 90 tons heavier than the T-20, have a slight error? laughing
                      8. 0
                        29 June 2014 15: 26
                        Quote: The Art of War
                        Professor, you want to say that Abrams and Markava, which are 90 tons heavier than the T-20, have a slight error?

                        An example from life. A girl of 5 years old and Valuev are trying to walk in deep snow. It weighs 20 kg, it is 150 kg. She is in boots, and he is in the puddles. The question is who falls more into the snow if the size of the sole area of ​​the boots is 200 cm2, and the ski is 4000 cm2? wink
                      9. The Art of War
                        0
                        29 June 2014 15: 40
                        Girl like, if I'm not mistaken?
                      10. +2
                        29 June 2014 16: 19
                        Professor and how quickly Merkava and Abrams can transfer at least 8 km
                      11. 0
                        29 June 2014 20: 23
                        Quote: bmv04636
                        Professor and how quickly Merkava and Abrams can transfer at least 8 km

                        Israel itself will not be able to transfer, and the Americans have no problems at all. They have no equal in logistics.
                      12. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 14
                        and yet you didn’t say how and how quickly, for example, to our borders with Ukraine across the Black Sea it’s unlikely that you can dismantle the floor of the abrams on the autobahns slowly and for a long time since they can be quickly and most importantly covertly transferred and how much it will cost the professor
                      13. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 18
                        Are you attracted to unscientific fiction? Who is going to fight Abramsami and Marakavami with Russia? wink

                        The Americans have special tanker vessels, and transport aircraft can easily transfer X tanks in a day. Will cost nothing else print money.
                      14. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 36
                        the question is what kind of aircraft and how much it will cost, but my question is not idle, the bosses would like to help Ukraine, but it’s unprofitable how much time and money they spent on the transfer of ambros during an operation in a desert and the merkava will not get on the platform without dismantling the rollers
                      15. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 44
                        I do not like science fiction ... Merkava is very transportable both by air and by sea and by land. But you think not to worry, it will not exist in Ukraine. hi
                      16. 0
                        29 June 2014 23: 02
                        it’s right that there will be no merkava no ambramas too expensive it is unprofitable to carry a cemetery however leopards and bring those
                      17. badger1974
                        0
                        30 June 2014 01: 41
                        there are few gelaxes in the states, with current ma globals when "unloading" abras (exactly like all NATO armor consumption), instructions are her mother,
                      18. Aries
                        0
                        29 June 2014 20: 44
                        the specific pressure on the ground is a good thing, but unfortunately the rivers and ditches are most often crossed by bridges laid by the bridge layers, but the one whose net weight is less than the one designed for the bridge will pass already ... and unlike our tanks, abrams, merkavas and leopards cannot pass on our bridges, but we can ...
                      19. +1
                        29 June 2014 22: 33
                        The “Merkava Mk.4” track width is 660 mm, the support surface length is 4520 mm, the support area is 5,966 sq. M, the average ground pressure is 1,17 kg / sq. Cm, compared to the 1,07 kg / sq. Cm for “Abrams »М1 А2 SEP and 1 kgf / sq. Cm for T-90С.
                        whom the professor to believe is taken Constructive vulnerabilities of the main combat vehicle of AOI Merkava Mk.4. Ending
                      20. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 35
                        Quote: bmv04636
                        whom to believe professor

                        Believe me I will personally measure in Latrun. True weigh Merkava is not - the steelyard broke. laughing

                        PS
                        The article you are linking to is left. negative
                      21. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 44
                        and why you weren’t all there and explained
                      22. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 46
                        Quote: bmv04636
                        and why you weren’t all there and explained

                        I left one comment there, that's enough.
                  2. badger1974
                    +1
                    29 June 2014 08: 09
                    why did you forget to mention what happens with combat rounding when a KAZ type TROPHI is triggered, your ARENs are counted, but what about your conclusion?
                    1. 0
                      29 June 2014 08: 16
                      Quote: badger1974
                      why did you forget to mention what happens with combat rounding when a KAZ type TROPHI is triggered, your ARENs are counted, but what about your conclusion?

                      What to mention? Rafael writes that the damage to the infantry is minimal. This is not an Arena, there are no fragments. And as a result of the combat use of Trophy no one was hurt.
                      1. badger1974
                        0
                        29 June 2014 08: 46
                        but in tanks, losses, as they say, an apple from an apple tree doesn’t have to fall far,
                      2. +1
                        29 June 2014 09: 33
                        Quote: badger1974
                        but in tanks, losses, as they say, an apple from an apple tree doesn’t have to fall far,

                        After the adoption of the KAZ in the tanks, there were no losses.
                      3. badger1974
                        0
                        30 June 2014 01: 43
                        it’s like banderlogs have no losses, current separatists are killed, it’s a sin to unclean your uncle, your losses are catastrophic,
                      4. 0
                        30 June 2014 16: 55
                        there were no losses, but there was no third Lebanese epic after the second shamefully lost when more than 50 merkas were shot down; 4 connection with which they began to be used as a sau, their effectiveness was not up to par but the soldier because of which everything supposedly started to be exchanged, then specify the professor how many Palestinian fighters?
                      5. 0
                        1 July 2014 07: 37
                        Quote: bmv04636
                        there were no losses, but there was no third Lebanese epic after the second shamefully lost when more than 50 merkas were shot down; 4 connection with which they began to be used as a sau, their effectiveness was not up to par but the soldier because of which everything supposedly started to be exchanged, then specify the professor how many Palestinian fighters?

                        Go, go, I serve only on Saturdays
                      6. +1
                        29 June 2014 16: 35
                        infantry may be but on an armored personnel carrier may flop
                      7. 0
                        29 June 2014 17: 00
                        but I almost knocked out
                  3. Aries
                    +1
                    29 June 2014 19: 46
                    Especially for fighting tanks equipped with KAZ, the cornet has long been able to shoot in tandem - 2 missiles one after another in one beam ...
      2. Aries
        0
        29 June 2014 20: 35
        obviously not a mestizo or a bassoon - the mestizo has 3 wings and a pyrotechnic tracer at the end of one of them, the headlight has a headlamp in the tail, it is also not visible, but it looks very similar to the cornet - two nozzles of a marching engine ...
        1. badger1974
          0
          30 June 2014 01: 45
          rather, it was the engine itself plus the pyrotechnic composition in the outer M3
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. badger1974
      0
      30 June 2014 01: 33
      no matter how, the rocket has a certain decentration, so your idiotic picture has an idiotic idea about ATGM in general, just like about grenade launchers
  9. The comment was deleted.
  10. +24
    28 June 2014 10: 17
    Again they attacked the professors. I also disagree with him on some points, but the professor is one of the few on the site who is able to reasonably, without going to the individual, discuss the problem. Some would have to learn from him.
    1. +3
      28 June 2014 12: 36
      Quote: Serbor
      I also disagree with him on some points, but the professor is one of the few on the site who is able to reasonably, without going to the individual, discuss the problem. Some would have to learn from him.


      A separate plus brother ...
    2. badger1974
      0
      29 June 2014 08: 02
      That's right, because you are small and not intelligent (I mean the level in the military base), a professor is a destabilizer if you don’t have anything in your luggage, having a hobby about technology is the main weapon against him, and no, he’s not ebbing, it’s checked
    3. 0
      29 June 2014 19: 54
      Most likely this is not a professor, but the CIA.
      1. 0
        29 June 2014 21: 07
        Quote: Patriot.ru.
        Most likely this is not a professor, but the CIA.

        and MI6 and Mossad. bully
        1. badger1974
          0
          30 June 2014 10: 18
          Yes, you are a professor like a snowman in a military school, (I laugh nothing personal)
  11. dFG
    +11
    28 June 2014 10: 43
    Quote: Serbor
    Again they attacked the professors. I also disagree with him on some points, but the professor is one of the few on the site who is able to reasonably, without going to the individual, discuss the problem. Some would have to learn from him.

    so hurt that he comments on all this from Israel but I would like it from Ryazan)) then there would be no complaints against him))
  12. Leshka
    +2
    28 June 2014 10: 43
    tired of these thoughts if there is a war then check
    1. lankrus
      +5
      28 June 2014 11: 43
      Quote: Leshka
      tired of these thoughts if there is a war then check

      But will it be too late? We must prepare for a future war, with the appropriate weapons. How many of our guys will have to die for the GRAU to adopt weapons that ensure victory on enemy tanks.
      You need to worry now.
    2. badger1974
      +2
      29 June 2014 08: 47
      go nuts, you wake up, the war is already under your window
  13. +3
    28 June 2014 10: 59
    Chrysanthemum, in my opinion, if not the best, then in the first three of the best anti-tank systems.
    1. badger1974
      0
      30 June 2014 10: 20
      you forgot to add-TANK, then you can bullet from the standard smooth-bore 125 mm
  14. lankrus
    +3
    28 June 2014 11: 31
    It is sad to read some comments criticizing the author of the article. If these articles are true, it is very sad, however, with Serdyuko betrayal, incompetence and corruption reached their maximum. Respect to the author - the courage to express the truth, no matter how bitter it is, has always distinguished real patriots.
  15. Stasi
    +1
    28 June 2014 11: 47
    I agree that Kornet is good as an anti-tank complex. But I also agree that the protection of foreign tanks has been improved recently, which means that it will be more difficult for the Cornet to fulfill its tasks. If we talk about improving the development of domestic weapons, then it is necessary to solve three problems: 1) obtaining reliable and reliable information about modern military developments and technologies; 2) the availability of modern production technologies and personnel; 3) the presence of a modern scientific and design school capable of solving the assigned tasks and providing projects for their solution to defense enterprises. Our military intelligence (GRU) is successfully solving the first problem. But then there are problems with the implementation of the information received, since our military-industrial complex mainly works on technologies left over from the Soviet defense industry. There are also problems with personnel both in the defense industry and in scientific enterprises and design bureaus. Many of them ceased to exist during the collapse of the USSR and the subsequent numerous reforms that did not affect our defense industry in the best way. I would also like to note what work is underway to improve the protection of our tanks from modern promising means of destruction of the foreign armies in service. This is not mentioned in the article.
    1. s1н7т
      +2
      28 June 2014 19: 13
      Quote: Stasi
      The first problem is successfully solved by our military intelligence (GRU)

      Not true. The GRU has not systematically resolved these issues since the 90s. What is the GRU now, you know? I have co-workers / classmates for a couple of years as a military attaché - my ears wilt when you listen sad Kapets, patriotism is rushing among the people from all the cracks, but if not - brains!
      1. Stasi
        0
        29 June 2014 19: 21
        The state of military intelligence in the period of the 90s and the current one is different. Different people serve there. There are those who boast of patriotism on every corner, and there are those who quietly and silently work for their country, extracting important information for it. It’s not worthwhile to conclude about the entire special service because of several figures.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  16. yurik
    +5
    28 June 2014 12: 38
    It should be noted the inactivity of the Russian GRAU, which is calm about this situation.

    Here we can agree with the author, the development of the 3rd generation ATGM is delayed while the NATO armies re-equip the American Javelin ATGM and the Israeli Spike ATGM.
    But in this situation, the needs of other countries that are not ready to spend money on the purchase of expensive 3rd generation ATGMs continue to be met by Cornet i.e. it is still in demand on the arms market plus its modernization is being carried out, for example, Kornet-EM - with a firing range of 10 kilometers it is able to "work" both on ground and air targets, primarily on unmanned aerial vehicles and combat helicopters. In general, it’s too early to write off the Cornet, but it is necessary to develop a new complex faster, otherwise it turns out that the Americans are already working on the 4th generation ATGM and we still have not figured out the third generation
    1. badger1974
      +1
      29 June 2014 09: 13
      do not make a garden, an ATGM spike is an old TOU with new brains and senile sores, Jova "proser" (absent from the TPK) is off the charts, plus the unstable work of the IR seeker in harsh conditions, in short a garbage dump, RPG-7 and AT4 - that's a lot, although AT-4 in comparison with the seven-row was not
      1. 0
        29 June 2014 09: 37
        Do not carry nonsense. Spike is not TOU.
        Please share the statistics of absenteeism of Javelin with TPK. I have translated a couple of articles about Javelin, I'm very interested.

        plus unstable operation of the infrared seeker in harsh conditions, in short trash,

        Now everything is clear, trash. There is nothing to discuss.
        1. badger1974
          +2
          29 June 2014 10: 27
          well, no, jove is the most natural trash heap, if it comes out of the TPK, it hits a contrast target without movement and from the distance of which if I were in a tank in the city ... but I would turn the calculation of the jove at the ready, at least there is protection by 72 otdzhov, with the "seven" the situation is much more complicated, and the hour is not far off when a grenade for the "seven" with a gyrocompass will appear,

          articles about jov "the journal" Foreign military service "is complete, the assessment and prospects, I will note iridescent, Jane's yearbook, almost every year (though the last 2012 and 2013 did not look expensive)
  17. +5
    28 June 2014 12: 47
    The author, except for theory, can not lead anything. Also, the author obviously believes that the soldiers on the battlefield are not smart and will hit the frontal part with the Cornet.
  18. +2
    28 June 2014 14: 58
    How would the answer to the article:
    What the Military-Industrial Commission Should Know
    Reply to the article by M. Rastopshin

    http://wartank.narod.ru/on-Rastopshin.htm
  19. The comment was deleted.
  20. +3
    28 June 2014 16: 05
    as I understand it, the glorious abrams poorly resists the DShK; when waved, the auxiliary engine located at the back of the arable land is abraded; the abrams gets up and then is shot by vampires or sevens
    to the stat and the great and mighty merkava could not resist the bite of a vampire
  21. +3
    28 June 2014 16: 16
    Heavy learning - easy in battle. Stop throwing hats - you need to really assess the situation
  22. -2
    28 June 2014 17: 29
    Yes, when is it already drowned drowning.
    after all, an unprepared brain shouts this with a bang
  23. +2
    28 June 2014 17: 35
    honestly, I didn’t understand - for whom is the article addressed? for in-depth study of the race armor-shell? for professionals? There are special departments, closed editions. for young people specialists? write there too.
    but no.
    all the more so since I didn’t see any proposals for a radical improvement in the ratio of penetration to defense ...
    option two:
    1. see which
    2. we, discussing the article, "feed the troll".
  24. +3
    28 June 2014 18: 32
    Quote: Mister X
    He is either alarmist or troublemaker.

    The alarmist is "our way," the Stalinist, the NKVDist.
    Next you have to come at night and pick up.

    And suppose the articles of this author would be named differently:
    "Foreign tanks are afraid of our missile systems"
    "The anti-tank power of the Ministry of Defense is getting stronger"
    "The all-round defense of Russian armored vehicles is stronger than ever"
    "The expected and natural success of GPV 2020"
    "Our tanks are invincible in a real war!"
    "Poplar mobiles are invulnerable to Tomahawk"
    "The system for creating military equipment meets the requirements of the defense capability of our state."

    Some names would be hard to read without a grin, right?
    Would you read this bravado and sugar?
    1. Cpa
      0
      29 June 2014 01: 42
      In a nutshell: you need a construct.
    2. 0
      29 June 2014 16: 00
      Quote: Falcon5555
      Would you read this bravado and sugar?

      Is nothing worthy of praise?
      All only through the stump-deck?
      If the author wrote not only exposing articles, but also tried to find in this confusion even with a positive grip, I would call it both independent and unbiased.

      And the author turns out as in a joke:
      A man enters the store and is indignant:
      “There’s nothing in our stores: no meat, no sausage, no eggs, no sugar ...”
      Two decently dressed men come up to him and say:
      - Listen, under Stalin you would have been shot for such words.
      The man fell silent, walked out of the store, spread his hands and said:
      - Here, already and we do not have cartridges.
      1. +1
        29 June 2014 21: 04
        Haha Maybe so.
        But you can remember many anecdotes from history, when people were actually shot as alarmists, and then everything turned out like that, as they warned. For example, the 5th Armored Division. According to separate information (and if my memory serves me, I apologize if I confuse something), her special officers shot 2 people from the local population who crossed the river and warned that the Germans were already on the other side of the river (the first or second day of the war, the river in 50 km from the border, the division had an order to take up defenses along the river by the middle of the day on June 21!). So, historians are still "looking" for this division. She just disappeared. The next day, her command was seen 100 kilometers east, and that was all.
        1. badger1974
          0
          30 June 2014 01: 57
          you, my friend, are raving, there were no armored divisions at the Red Army, there were corps, there were cavalry divisions, there were rifle divisions, but there were no armored divisions,

          look for psaki, there are mountains in the Rostov region and the Baltic coast in Belarus
          1. +2
            30 June 2014 18: 04
            Here is another "own regime". Maybe a bot on a salary. Armored - I don't know, but this one is tank. I described myself, think about it, and I'm delirious right away? The tank corps consisted of divisions! Type in something like "5th Panzer Division" in Yandeks. And in Wikipedia you can already find out much more than I knew. Historians have already unearthed a lot about how she disappeared. I've apologized in advance for the possible confusion like this: tank - armored. It would be nice for you to apologize for rudeness, and shut up in the future.
            1. The comment was deleted.
  25. +6
    28 June 2014 18: 32
    Once again, Mr. Rastopshin claims that the bulletproof and anti-cumulative stability of the main reservation of domestic tanks is lower than, for example, the American tank M1A2 General Abrams, for this he even drew a tablet (see table 6 in M. Rastpshin's article “ What the Military-Industrial Commission Should Know ”). Where did the author get this data - either from the tables installed next to the exhibits at the BTT Museum in Kubinka, or during the next "imitation", in any case, they have a very distant relation to the truth.
    In the last article "The situation in the domestic tank building: truth and fiction" Mr. Rastopshin was informed that, nevertheless, a far from three-layer "pie" (steel-STB-steel) was installed on domestic tanks, which he presented as the only achievement of our designers over the past 40 years. It is worth recalling that in 1985 the old three-layer VLD design of the T-72A tank (the same was with other domestic tanks) was completely abandoned. To replace the T-1985B, which entered serial production in 72, a new six-layer VLD was installed. In the late 80s, they switched to a different, much more advanced scheme. The data given by Rastopshin for the T-72B and T-80U do not correspond to the durability of any of them.
  26. +5
    28 June 2014 18: 33
    What do they think about protecting our tanks abroad? In the 1993 year, specialized foreign publications (Deutsche Airspace report, L. Mann. 1993 year) published test data for the T-72X1 tanks (export version of the T-72A), which showed that its resistance is equivalent to 420-480 mm steel homogeneous rolled armor from modern at that time ammunition caliber 105 and 120 mm manufactured in Germany. Reservation of the T-72B tank, with the earliest series produced by 1985 of the year equivalent to more than 550 mm from BOPS. Once again, Mikhail Rostopshin’s habit of underestimating the performance of domestic technology makes itself felt. It is also worth recalling that at the end of the 80's the T-72B was equipped with the built-in dynamic protection “Contact-5”, which the author does not take into account in her estimates, although she “removes” more than 20% of BPS armor penetration. Thus, with the improved design of the armor and the airborne landing gear, the T-72B tank had a resistance of up to 750 mm from the BPS, which is quite at the level of the best foreign models that entered service in those years.
    Rastopshin also indicates that the Shtora-1 complex is intended only for impact on feedback rockets using a tracer. However, the author did not take into account that, along with counteracting PTS with IR coordinators, the complex also provides protection against PTS using laser homing heads, laser rangefinders, etc.
    From the side of the tank, without distracting the crew from their main combat work, an effective barrage is created in a wide sector that protects the object from ATGM with IR coordinators (types "Toy", "Milan", "Hot", "Dragon", etc.), which are common types of anti-tank weapons, as well as complexes with laser heads with passive homing - such as the guided projectile "Cophead", KUV "Lahat", "Hellfire" and other systems that use this principle.
  27. +6
    28 June 2014 18: 36
    On the effectiveness of ATGM and TOUR
    According to Mikhail Rastopshin in his article, the ammunition of Russian tanks now includes the very aged ATGM 9M128, 9M119M with tandem warheads, which were intended to destroy the M1 and M1A1 tanks.
    Regarding the probabilities of defeating the Abrams tank for ATGM and BOPS, I would like to contact Mr. Rastopshin, what are the methods by which you calculate all this? There are many methods and the most advanced of them include entire systems for preparing the initial information. Does Mr. Rastopshin have at home detailed blueprints and reservation schemes for Abrams, has a complete statistical analysis of the conditions for its use, statistical characteristics of armor penetration and dispersion of BPS, characteristics of the alleged theater of operations, and much more? If he uses one of the simplified methods that a competent student from Baumanka can do on a computer, then I'm sorry ... Until Mr. Rastopshin presents a calculation method, it is worthless to such estimates, which are especially outdated.
    In his article, Rstopshin admires the increased attention of Americans to unification, citing the creation of the American universal ATGM JCM (Joint Common Missile), which will replace the Hellfire, Hellfire Longbow and Mayvrik missiles. Starting from 2009 The JCM missile will be equipped with the F / A – 18E / F Super Hornet fighter, the new MH-60R helicopter, as well as ground equipment, such as future FCS combat systems of the US Army.
    The JCM rocket will have a range of 16 km, and installed on aircraft - 28 km.
    Why, once again, admiring foreign developments that will appear only in 2009, if they still appear, he will not pay attention to domestic developments in this area? - And they are.
    As an example, we can cite the Hermes complex, which is a promising complex of high-precision weapons of a new generation - a reconnaissance and fire multi-purpose ATGM system, combining the properties of artillery and anti-tank complexes. "Hermes" opens up new areas of combat use of anti-tank weapons - the transfer of its fire deep into the zone of action of enemy units and the ability to repel an attack in any sector of defense without changing the firing position. This will prevent the advance and deployment of enemy armored units to the attack lines while reducing their own losses.
    ATGM "Hermes" is built on a modular principle, which makes it possible to optimize the composition of the attracted funds, depending on the tasks to be solved, it is reasonable to combine various methods of guidance at different firing ranges, as well as to place the complex on ground, air (Hermes-A) and sea carriers (Hermes -TO). The firing range, depending on the type of missile, is from 15 to 100 km.
  28. +1
    28 June 2014 20: 36
    He is working on the turnover of our defense industry. There are such people all over the world. Everything is bad with us. GIVE MONEY for rearmament
  29. +2
    28 June 2014 21: 33
    Underestimating the enemy means losing to him. Raising the issue of efficiency is a good thing. Even if he goes too far. A soldier in battle is better convinced that Rastopshin is not right than right. Is not it?
  30. bubble82009
    +3
    29 June 2014 01: 14
    battles near Slavyansk showed that even the old PTRS are able to fight modern tanks. hit the barrel or the stern, hit the rinks or the caterpillar. Of course, the tank cannot be stopped or damaged from the first shot. but you can and should fight
  31. badger1974
    0
    29 June 2014 08: 05
    article minus how about anti-tank systems, and that raised the issue of anti-tank systems is undoubtedly a plus, in short zero
  32. Crang
    0
    29 June 2014 08: 06
    If the author Mikhail Rastopshin can not read the article. Rave. This is the enemy of the people.
  33. 0
    29 June 2014 09: 10
    I saw in the advertising price-list from the GNPP "Basalt" a product with two missiles, flying out in a split second, specifically to deceive AZ. The second grenade is tandem. The truth about guided munitions has never been heard.
  34. 0
    29 June 2014 10: 58
    With the advent of fiber-guided ATGMs, the Cornet looks outdated on their background.
    Fiber optic guidance has several advantages.
    1 Ability to fire from closed positions.
    2 Strikes a vehicle from above in less sheltered places.
    3 Amazes targets that themselves are in closed positions.
    4 It is more difficult to detect missile launch and better noise immunity.
    5 Video from a rocket can be used as reconnaissance. data from the air.
  35. +1
    29 June 2014 11: 47
    Quote: professor
    The Cornet operator identified the target, fixed a mark on it and the rocket went beyond the line of sight ... How does the rocket know when to return to the line of sight to hit the target?

    As I understand it, the rocket does not need to know anything. The beam itself returns to the line of sight and the rocket, in turn, goes with it.
    1. 0
      29 June 2014 11: 50
      Quote: Denimax
      As I understand it, the rocket does not need to know anything. The beam itself returns to the line of sight and the rocket, in turn, goes with it.

      How does the beam know when to return the rocket to the line of sight? How does the PU determine the distance to the target?
  36. 0
    29 June 2014 12: 02
    Quote: professor
    How does the beam know when to return the rocket to the line of sight? How does the PU determine the distance to the target?

    I don’t know the details, but it can be assumed that if the launcher has a laser, then there is a laser rangefinder function. You can also approximately find out using optics. The speed of the rocket is known.
    1. 0
      29 June 2014 12: 51
      Quote: Denimax
      I don’t know the details, but we can assume that if the PU has a laser, then there is a laser rangefinder function. You can also approximately find out using optics. The speed of the rocket is known.

      That's what I’m talking about. Laser rangefinder is an active thing and irradiates the target.
      1. Aries
        0
        29 June 2014 19: 57
        There is no laser rangefinder in Cornet, as well as in Metis and in the Competition - the distance to the target is determined by the rangefinder strokes on the grid in the optical channel ...
  37. 0
    29 June 2014 14: 29
    Quote: professor
    That's what I’m talking about. Laser rangefinder is an active thing and irradiates the target.

    I think it’s not necessary to highlight the goal itself. You can also have a nearby object, such as a building.
    1. 0
      29 June 2014 14: 56
      Quote: Denimax
      I think it’s not necessary to highlight the goal itself. You can also have a nearby object, such as a building.

      Tank in the open field? What will highlight, and in general, why guess?
      1. slon82
        +1
        29 June 2014 16: 27
        Good day, actually regarding the question:
        In my humble opinion, the Cornet, as a complex still being developed for the Soviet army, is easy to use and cheap to manufacture. Therefore, there is not a single GOS head in the rocket, the rangefinder is the same. Aiming at the target of the complex is carried out according to the principle of firing from a rifle, the operator keeps the crosshair at the target (tank in this case), the rocket follows the target with the least deviation from the line of sight. In fact, the crosshair in the device, the sight is the tail of the rocket. All.
        1. 0
          29 June 2014 20: 26
          Quote: slon82
          Aiming at the target of the complex is carried out according to the principle of firing from a rifle, the operator keeps the crosshair at the target (tank in this case), the rocket follows the target with the least deviation from the line of sight. In fact, the crosshair in the device, the sight is the tail of the rocket.

          No, not all. A rifle bullet flies along a ballistic trajectory, and a Cornet cruise missile flies almost straight over the line of sight and immediately before the target returns to the line of sight. The question is in force, how does he know when to return?
      2. slon82
        0
        29 June 2014 16: 27
        Good day, actually regarding the question:
        In my humble opinion, the Cornet, as a complex still being developed for the Soviet army, is easy to use and cheap to manufacture. Therefore, there is not a single GOS head in the rocket, the rangefinder is the same. Aiming at the target of the complex is carried out according to the principle of firing from a rifle, the operator keeps the crosshair at the target (tank in this case), the rocket follows the target with the least deviation from the line of sight. In fact, the crosshair in the device, the sight is the tail of the rocket. All.
        1. slon82
          +1
          29 June 2014 16: 34
          YES, and I, for example, can hardly imagine why use expensive complexes like Javelin and Spike for targets equipped with KAZ. You can of course, but very expensive. Therefore, Cornet, RPG variations will still be relevant.
        2. slon82
          0
          29 June 2014 16: 34
          YES, and I, for example, can hardly imagine why use expensive complexes like Javelin and Spike for targets equipped with KAZ. You can of course, but very expensive. Therefore, Cornet, RPG variations will still be relevant.
      3. +1
        29 June 2014 16: 29
        On Thursday, October 10, during an operation conducted by the 9 Battalion of the 401 Armored Brigade in the north of the Gaza Strip, an emergency occurred.
        As reported by the Galei IDF radio station, as a result of a malfunction, the windbreaker of one of the tanks worked, mistaking the Namer armored personnel carrier of the Golani brigade, which had been operating together with the tankers, for an enemy missile.
      4. +1
        30 June 2014 09: 24
        Quote: professor
        Tank in the open field? What will highlight, and in general, why guess?

        What a bastard, Americans! In an article about guided tank shells being developed in the USA (damn, I keep forgetting the abbreviation), it was stated that first you can "illuminate" a piece of a "clear field" near the tank with a laser; and then: either transfer the beam to the tank, or capture the thermal imaging target homing head. But, once, the professor fails; then ...
        1. 0
          30 June 2014 09: 31
          Quote: Nikolaevich I
          damn, I forget the abbreviation all the time

          What a pity...
          1. The comment was deleted.
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          3. +1
            1 July 2014 03: 26
            Quote: professor
            (damn, I always forget the abbreviation

            Tank guided projectile MRM-CE
            1. 0
              1 July 2014 07: 54
              You are right. In this ammunition, the target is not spoiled by anything, but only the direction to the target is indicated. The goal itself is directed by the IR GOS. hi
              MRM KE/CE 120mm
    2. +3
      29 June 2014 16: 39
      Laser rangefinders are pulsed. Short signal - answer - calculation.
      But the impulse gives out the shooter himself.

      And the Kornet missile guidance laser gives a constant weak "corridor"
      a sensor on the rocket stabilizer, looking back and correcting the rocket on the course.
      Neither the operator, nor the Kornet rocket (not having a seeker) know the exact distance to the target.
      They don’t need it. The operator leads a rocket for several seconds through its lens optics (periscope).
      He must see the tank all the time. The accuracy of the defeat depends on the skill of the operator.
      But the rocket and the whole system are much cheaper than their fellow missiles with GOS and fiber-wire.
      1. Aries
        0
        29 June 2014 20: 19
        In principle, everything is correct, only the laser radiation receiver in the cornet is not mounted on the rocket stabilizer, but in the tail - exactly along the central axis
        1. +1
          29 June 2014 23: 46
          Interesting. But what about the hot gases from the engine? They do not interfere with the receiver?
      2. +1
        29 June 2014 20: 43
        Quote: voyaka uh
        Neither the operator, nor the Kornet rocket (not having a seeker) know the exact distance to the target.
        They don’t need it

        must

        Quote: voyaka uh
        The operator leads a rocket for several seconds through its lens optics (periscope).
        He must see the tank all the time.

        That's right, the operator holds the mark on the target, but the rocket flies OVER the line of sight and immediately before the target returns to the line of sight. The question is in force, how does he know when to return?
        7:30


        from the video: "... the operator performs simple actions. Detects a target through a PU scope. Determines the distance to the target. Sets the range on the scope. Pulls the trigger and holds the crosshair of the sight on the target until it is defeated ..."

        PS
        At the beginning of the video, their language turns to call the complex the third generation.
        1. Aries
          +1
          29 June 2014 20: 47
          badger1974 - right, there is a grid in the optics of the cornet (a small glass with a picture) on which the rangefinding strokes are applied - they determine the distance to the target, then on the device the switch sets the removal distance from the excess, as a result, when the rocket flies to the target, about 1 km the equipment lowers the laser beam to the target to the target, and accordingly the missile falls from exceeding the target line of sight (taking into account the speed for 3-4 seconds before hitting the target), and as for the rangefinder, it really is not on the cornet, it is not needed .. .
          1. 0
            29 June 2014 20: 59
            Quote: Aries
            and as for the rangefinder - it really is not on the cornet, it is not needed ...

            What you need, you even noted yourself, but don’t tell me the appointment of 3 eyepieces on the PU Cornet?

            A large-diameter lens is a thermal imager, one is a sight, and the rest?

            1. Aries
              +1
              29 June 2014 21: 06
              Firstly, do not confuse Cornet, about which Rostopshin’s article, with Cornet-EM, which you have shown in the picture, secondly, in this embodiment, a thermal imaging sight is installed, so in addition to the ones listed here, there are also camera lenses ... and this There is a laser rangefinder, but it is not used to determine the range for the target at which the missile descends from the excess to the line of sight ...
            2. Aries
              0
              29 June 2014 21: 11
              in these two pictures from the Kornet-E movie - the old sight and the laser rangefinder are still not here ... two lenses in the upper part of the device are guidance channels ....
              1. 0
                29 June 2014 21: 15
                Quote: Aries
                .Two lenses in the upper part of the device - guidance channels ....

                I don’t argue because I don’t know the materiel badly, but why 3 (three) lenses for one day sight?
                1. Aries
                  0
                  29 June 2014 21: 22
                  in my phrase, which you used as a quote, we are talking about a portable version of a cornet with a remote launcher, the device of which is shown in the 2nd picture, in the 3rd picture - it is the same, but with an installed thermal imager - I repeat again - the upper two lenses - guidance channels, the lower one - the lens of the sighting channel, which some here called the periscope. There is no rangefinder here! A thermal imager with a large mirrored lens takes thermal radiation and shows it to the arrow through the lens of the "periscope" ... ie. thermal imager - type of attachment for the "periscope" ...
                  1. 0
                    29 June 2014 21: 49
                    Quote: Aries
                    I repeat once again - the upper two lenses are the guidance channels, the lower one is the lens of the sighting channel

                    Why do I need a thermal imager, I know, but I can’t understand why it is necessary to have already 2 guidance channels and even the lens of the sighting channel? Why do the bourgeoisie cope alone, but here are either 2 or 3?
                    1. Aries
                      0
                      29 June 2014 21: 57
                      bourgeois also cannot cope with one, at least two for the rocket and for the shooter, and the "newest" ATGM MMR (here it is) already has 5 lenses ... And in the picture is an old device, now there are only 2 lenses, one for the laser control channel ( for the rocket), and the second arrow for the eye - to see the target.
                      1. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 06
                        One on PU, one on GOS missiles.

                        Day and night on the PU and dual-mode on the rocket.


                        I still do not understand why 2,3 day on Cornet’s PU? Why is one not enough? request
                      2. Aries
                        0
                        29 June 2014 22: 15
                        You brought a picture from the ATGM in which the GOS is installed in the rocket - here's the third lens - there is no GOS in the cornet, instead of it there is a laser control channel on the PU ... which is not clear?
                      3. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 24
                        Quote: Aries
                        You brought a picture from the ATGM in which the GOS is installed in the rocket - here's the third lens - there is no GOS in the cornet, instead of it there is a laser control channel on the PU ... which is not clear?

                        How Javelin or Spike works is understandable to the bolts, but the presence of several lenses on the Cornet is not clear. Moreover, it is not clear to a person who has written a dissertation on optics and has been working with optics for many years.
                        For the bourgeoisie, a "lens" on the GOS is needed to capture the target of this very GOS. The Cornet does not have a GOS and therefore there is no need for such a "lens". Why did the "early" versions have so many "lenses"? request
                      4. Aries
                        +2
                        29 June 2014 22: 29
                        The lens on the seeker is the basis of the missile control system, just like the lens on the launcher in the Cornet control channel is the basis of the missile control system, so you can’t get the Cornet’s seeker lens ... you need to replace something ... but two were earlier because the two channels were control - horizontal and vertical ... now they are combined ...
                      5. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 30
                        Quote: Aries
                        .a two were earlier because the two channels had control - horizontal and vertical ... now they are combined ...

                        Thanks for the answers and patience. Learned a lot. good
                      6. Aries
                        0
                        29 June 2014 22: 18
                        Now the cornet has such a sight - the upper lens is the control channel, the lower one is the lens of the sighting channel (periscope), nothing more ...
                      7. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 27
                        Quote: Aries
                        Now the cornet has such a sight - the upper lens is the control channel, the lower one is the lens of the sighting channel (periscope), nothing more ...

                        Two lenses and no questions. Unless ... How accurately can a fighter determine the distance to a target using a grid? How many 3-4 seconds. on the line of sight in front of the target? The target can have time to blind, put the curtain, back up ....
                      8. Aries
                        0
                        29 June 2014 22: 36
                        In order:
                        1. Accuracy of hit by Cornet at a distance of 5,5 km - + - 0,3 m
                        2. There is no one to dazzle - the receiver at the rocket in the tail - looks at its position, any obstacles set by the enemy - the cornet simply does not see, because the receiver of the rocket looks the other way
                        3. put the veil - please - the rocket by inertia will still fall into it, because the tank will hide behind the veil, and not the laser beam with its launcher ...
                        4. Reverse - in 3-4 seconds, taking into account the reaction of the driver, the tank will not move even a meter ...
                      9. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 44
                        Quote: Aries
                        There is no one to dazzle - the receiver at the rocket in the tail - looks at its position, any obstacles set by the enemy - the cornet simply does not see, because the receiver of the rocket looks the other way

                        Blind operator who must hold the mark on the target ...

                        Quote: Aries
                        put the curtain - please - the inertia rocket will fall into it anyway, because the tank will hide behind the curtain, and not the laser beam with its launcher ...

                        If the tank is in motion plus the curtain, the operator can miss even despite the small thread on the control sticks.
                      10. Aries
                        +1
                        29 June 2014 22: 54
                        A tank has much more inertia than a rocket and cannot stop immediately (there is a stopping distance like a car) if the shooter aligned the angular velocity of the sighting line and the target during the guidance process, then it may not look into the sighting channel and small cloves further. .. although I agree, any obstacle that hides the target increases the likelihood of a miss ... experience is needed, but our guys do not have enough - they shoot a little ...
                      11. +1
                        30 June 2014 01: 08
                        It, like RPGshnika, is difficult to detect. For the one they are shooting at -
                        sunny bunny. But there are a couple of seconds, and sometimes more. Must
                        have time to fall face to the ground (as we were taught, but not useful).
                        And the tank is full back. Merkava has 5 speeds back, a jerk will turn out,
                        if not yawn.
                      12. 0
                        29 June 2014 22: 48
                        professor at such a tall fence sorry board sin not to miss
                      13. Aries
                        +1
                        29 June 2014 22: 21
                        http://topwar.ru/uploads/images/2014/130/oeqc294.jpg
                      14. badger1974
                        0
                        30 June 2014 02: 07
                        for this there is such an optical chip-prism, are you an optic who are unclear? Or are you in the 8th grade?
        2. Aries
          0
          29 June 2014 21: 31
          nowhere is it said here that "Determines the range to the target using a laser rangefinder ..." I repeat once again - the range is determined using rangefinder strokes on the reticle ... if you carefully watch the video that you called advertising, then there are these rangefinder strokes in the sighting channel, both real ones and those drawn with the help of computer graphics in the animated part are clearly visible ...
      3. +2
        29 June 2014 20: 49
        But the exhaust gases of the rocket do not prevent the operator from seeing the tank, and the rocket - the operator’s laser?
        1. Aries
          0
          29 June 2014 21: 01
          almost always there is a wind that blows smoke ... besides the gases from the solid propellant rocket engine are not smoke from hay ...
        2. badger1974
          0
          16 September 2014 14: 31
          Falcon5555 And the exhaust gases of the rocket do not interfere with the operator to see the tank, and the rocket - the operator’s laser?

          this is where the trick of the quantum generator is, there are no difficulties in the IR quantum generator. in UV, any vaporization is a loss of signal, well, think further. why the operator and the rocket in the cornet "find" each other in any conditions
  38. -1
    29 June 2014 14: 52
    A lot of letters and no practical sentences, etc.
  39. 0
    29 June 2014 18: 08
    Quote: professor
    Tank in the open field?

    This is already from a joke.
  40. Aries
    0
    29 June 2014 20: 04
    It's pointless to argue with the author of the article, I can only offer to sit in the Abrams advertised by him (if he can get it), and shoot at him with a cornet. Even if the author of the article turns out to be right in something and indeed the entire cumulative jet from the main charge of the warhead will "bend" by the flying engine and the DZ will be washed out and the armor penetration will be pitiful mm - a 29 kg missile strike at a speed of 250 - 300 m / s on an iron box is not enough it seems - for training, he can put a metal bucket on his head, and let the child hit it with a hammer ...
    1. +1
      29 June 2014 23: 57
      A metal-ceramic sandwich behaves differently. It shatters in chips, but
      extinguishes the force of a rocket’s impact on such armor. There have been cases in the last Lebanese
      Cornet breaking the side of the Merkava-4, when the remnants of the jet without hitting people
      inside and in the ammunition did not cause much harm to the tank.
      1. badger1974
        0
        30 June 2014 02: 09
        however, 60 tons were sent to the base and not to the front line
  41. 0
    30 June 2014 07: 30
    On the other hand. What would you like? The USSR is gone for 22 years !!!!!! Do you really think that you can rest on your laurels and rely on developments almost a quarter of a century ago ???? Was there such a thing in the USSR that in 20 years a new means of destruction of tanks was not introduced? And in Israel or the USA? That's what it is. A new ATGM is needed. Even if Rostopshin is wrong, it is not a fact that in 5 years this will be the situation. Will we throw our caps on the tanks then? Therefore, both Shoigu and Putin need to think about Rastopshin's articles, and they also need to release money for R&D, and not cash it out through the "redhead" ON SKOLKOVO PROJECTS. I don't want to believe Rastopshin at all, but who knows, after all, he worked at the Institute of Steel, was engaged in booking issues. God forbid that we are right, but we are trying to throw our hats. Therefore, if there are doubts about the Cornet, then it is necessary to develop new complexes and modernize the Cornets. MANDATORY !!!!
  42. 0
    30 June 2014 07: 37
    Quote: voyaka uh
    the last Lebanese were cases
    Cornet breaking the side of the Merkava-4, when the remnants of the jet without hitting people
    inside and in the ammunition did not cause much harm to the tank.

    All the same, Merkava-4 will be cooler than Abrams. Here the Jews are great, they were able to defend their interests and the lives of their soldiers. It is a pity that with "Lavi" they caved in under the "big brother". No, guys, as a US ally, he is not a very reliable guy, no matter how much you love him and worry about America's well-being.
  43. +3
    30 June 2014 15: 14
    The only thing that can be said about the discussion of the Professor, Aries..a, badger1974, is much more interesting, professional than sheep’s articles from the bottom of my heart, thanks to everyone. And enough comments, it seems to me that the three of you would write something more interesting on this topic. Thanks again.
    1. badger1974
      +1
      30 June 2014 18: 37
      That we are still for ATGM Skif and Hornet unaffected. it would have been concrete, because there Israel is in development in a batch, though now it is being denied, but nonetheless
  44. Bormental
    +1
    30 June 2014 17: 27
    Put this gondon (aphthora) in Abrams, and fuck Cornet.
  45. 0
    7 July 2014 14: 14
    Abrams in the sides and stern freely breaks out of the RPG-7
  46. 0
    21 July 2014 17: 02
    The RPG-7 missile is a capricious bitch, it can penetrate the shaggy thickness of the armor or it can bounce off the rubber bulwark ........
    1. badger1974
      0
      16 September 2014 14: 36
      there is such, but there is no equal in reloading the "seven", to live for another "seven" decades, if not more, and as I said earlier, nanotech will lead the "seven" to the 22nd century, without any bells and whistles except for grenades
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  51. 0
    28 September 2015 15: 56
    Quote: Papakiko
    Bullied, not bullied but raises the issue and personally I think that is not from scratch.

    Such windbags as the author of the article always act in the same primitive way: they cling to existing problems and further push in their “vision” that has nothing to do with reality.
    Why did you leave this comment??? For what???
    Ay-ay-ay modern tanks detect laser illumination. Well, yes... what's next? Ours are also detected. And they also destroy. Moreover, our DZ and AZ school will be more experienced. The issue of equipping all our tanks with modern protection systems, as always, comes down to money, but not to quality.
    Regarding the targeting itself, I’ll again ask a rhetorical question: what are NATO anti-tank systems aimed at? By the eye of Sauron??? Their guidance principles are still the same, and their countermeasures are appropriate.
    What our warheads lack is the ability to hit armored targets through the roof.