Military Review

The project "Ash" on the background of the state of industry

39
It is no secret that the events of recent decades have negatively affected the domestic defense industry and, in particular, shipbuilding. The industry has lost a lot of valuable personnel and part of important enterprises. In recent years, attempts have been made to rectify this situation, but the state of industry is still poor. The complexity of the current situation is clearly shown by the multi-purpose nuclear submarine K-560 Severodvinsk. This submarine missile carrier was laid back in December 1993, and the transfer the fleet took place only in the last days of the past, 2013. Thus, the construction and testing of the new submarine took 20 years.



APKR "Severodvinsk" shortly before state tests, 02.11.2013 (photo from forums.airbase.ru from CrazyMk)


Fortunately, the main work on the head submarine of the 885 “Ash” project has been completed, and it has been accepted for trial operation. In the near future, industry and the military will eliminate the remaining shortcomings, after which Severodvinsk will become a full-fledged combat unit of the Northern Fleet. The fact that the nuclear submarine "Severodvinsk" will be in trial operation for some time was announced at the very end of last year, when the military signed an acceptance certificate for it. It soon became known that the new submarine has some problems with a number of systems that are planned to be eliminated in the very near future. After that, the submarine can be entered into the combat structure of the Navy of Russia.

On January 23, the ITAR-TASS news agency published new information about the Severodvinsk submarine. With reference to the representative of the defense industry, associated with shipbuilding, it was claimed that the head submarine of the project "Ash" would be accepted into the fleet combat no earlier than the second half of 2014. The reason for this shift in timing is the need for additional verification of a number of onboard systems. According to an industry source, the new submarine will have to test some systems at sea, including launching Caliber missiles from a submerged position. In addition, it is planned to test the operation of hydroacoustic, navigation and other systems. One of the objectives of the new test will be an additional reduction in the noise level produced by the submarine. At present, these parameters of the submarine "Severodvinsk" does not meet the requirements, although it is ahead of other submarines of the Russian fleet.

To conduct additional tests will take several more months. During this time, the submarine "Severodvinsk" must make several outlets at sea. Due to the peculiarities of the climate of the Barents Sea, trials will begin no earlier than the beginning of summer, which will have an appropriate effect on the timing of the submarine’s deployment to the fleet. Because of this, according to an ITAR-TASS news agency source, the raising of the St. Andrew’s flag on a new submarine will take place no earlier than September. However, he did not rule out the possibility of some problems, because of which this event will be postponed to November or even December.

Thus, until the autumn of this year (at best), the Russian Navy will not be able to replenish its combat strength with a new nuclear submarine. Submarine "Severodvinsk" even after the end of the test has a number of problems that now need to be fixed. To justify the shipbuilders and suppliers of various equipment, it should be said that the specific climate of the northern regions will affect the timing of additional work and testing. Currently, the proposed test area in the Barents Sea is covered with ice, which is why seafarers and shipbuilders will have to wait for warming. From the words of the source ITAR-TASS, it follows that the ice will add to the time required for testing and modifications, at least a few months.

It turns out that the nuclear submarine K-560 "Severodvinsk" can become a full-fledged combat unit of the Northern Fleet only by the end of this year, i.e. almost a year after the signing of the acceptance certificate and acceptance into trial operation. In the light of the time it took to build this submarine, such a shift in terms does not look outstanding, but it cannot be recognized as useful for the fleet.

According to current plans, in the foreseeable future, domestic shipbuilding should hand over a total of eight submarines of the 885 and 885М projects to the fleet. The first of them has already been handed over to the military, but is in trial operation. Two other submarines of the project "Ash" (K-561 "Kazan" and K-573 "Novosibirsk") are still on the stocks. As it became known a few days ago, this year the construction of the fourth submarine project will start.

February 7 General Director of the Sevmash enterprise M. Budnichenko told about the plans for this year. At the Sevmash plant, which is building nuclear submarines, this year two strategic submarines of the Borey 955 project, one Yasen submarine and one special-purpose submarine will be laid. It should be noted that the planned submarine, like the Kazan and Novosibirsk being built, will be related to the updated 885М project.

The construction of two types of submarines will not stop there. It has already been announced that in the 2015 year, Sevmash will begin the construction of two Borey submarines and three Ash trees. Thus, by the end of next year, the total number of 885 and 885М projects built and under construction by submarines will reach seven. This means that in the future it will remain to lay and build only one multi-purpose nuclear submarine "Ash".

Existing plans for the construction of submarines of 885 and 885 projects look interesting and optimistic. There is every reason to believe that by the 2020, the Russian Navy will indeed be able to receive eight planned submarines. However, the situation with the head boat "Severodvinsk" may be the reason for doubts about such a completion of the construction program "Ash". The time of launching and transferring the Severodvinsk submarine to the fleet was repeatedly shifted, and after the acceptance certificate was signed it was not included in the operational strength of the Navy, but was put into trial operation. So far, no one can rule out an unpleasant scenario, in which the remaining seven submarines of the new project will repeat the fate of the lead ship.

Nevertheless, it is already clear that the construction of new submarines of the 885M project will take several times less time than the construction of the Severodvinsk nuclear submarine. The fact is that in the first years of the construction of the head "Ash" funding was irregular and in insufficient amounts. As a result, the submarine was launched only in the middle of the 2010 year. Financing the construction of new submarines of the 885M project is carried out to the necessary extent, due to which almost all problems are technological in nature. Therefore, there is reason to believe that the construction program of eight “Ash” submarines will be completed in accordance with the plans, by the year of 2020.

As we see, domestic shipbuilding gradually restores its former potential and builds new nuclear submarines. It should be noted that the defense industry still has a lot of problems, such as lack of experienced personnel or outdated equipment. Nevertheless, certain progress in this direction already exists and the first results of the new approach to work are already noticeable. According to current plans, from 2011 to 2020 years, over 20 trillion rubles will be spent on the purchase of new weapons and military equipment, as well as on the modernization of defense enterprises. The purpose of such financial injections is a radical update. weapons and equipment of the armed forces, as well as the modernization of production capacity of the industry.


On the materials of the sites:
http://ria.ru/
http://itar-tass.com/
http://lenta.ru/
http://oborona.ru/
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39 comments
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  1. mirag2
    mirag2 18 February 2014 07: 36
    +8
    Everything (except for w ...) directly itches from the anticipation that our defense industry is about to start working at the previous level!
    1. Arberes
      Arberes 18 February 2014 09: 39
      +13
      One of the goals of the new tests will be to further reduce the noise level produced by the submarine. Currently, according to these parameters, the Severodvinsk submarine does not meet the requirements, although it is ahead of other submarines of the Russian fleet.
      This phrase makes you think! Problems are solved, elimination of shortcomings and childhood diseases, a natural process. The head boat as a stand for revision, will the other beauties be perfect? ​​!! (oh time-time, I want it faster)!
      Dear KIRILL, thank you for your work! hi
      1. Theophanes
        Theophanes 18 February 2014 20: 16
        +3
        These are all echoes of the privatization of the name of "patriot" and "hero" of Russia .... and Chubais! How many were privatized on the advice of the Central Intelligence Agency, how many small, but very important, factories were cut off by Chubais !!! And how many trade megapoles were erected instead of factories and factories? And the government doesn't care about it - it will now grab the Novorossiysk port and a bunch of other enterprises. The Soviet legacy has not been completely destroyed. Thanks to it (the legacy), we have been living for 20 years! No shit !!!! To destroy is what they can and what their brains are capable of !!!! Destroy villages, cities (supposedly) not promising, medical and felsher points, their purpose from our "friends". Privatizers-murderers of Russia and its people ! Fuck them in the throat and a hedgehog in ...
    2. jjj
      jjj 18 February 2014 11: 41
      0
      But it’s good that they are in no hurry to put on the line. Only practice will help bring the ship to mind, and maybe even improve against the original plan
    3. tilovaykrisa
      tilovaykrisa 18 February 2014 18: 40
      +2
      On the farewell, it won’t work, it was the USSR military-industrial complex, and at the moment the RF military-industrial complex, that as they say 2 big differences, if the tasks are completed within the promised time and it will be already fine, we will have to pull up to the level of the USSR (thanks to Mecheny, EBN and KO ) for a very, very long time.
    4. clidon
      clidon 18 February 2014 20: 18
      -1
      At the previous level, it will no longer work.
  2. Dangerous
    Dangerous 18 February 2014 07: 46
    +5
    I really hope that the construction of these nuclear submarines will give an impetus to the technological development of Russia. otherwise, there are a lot of outdated equipment and a lack of qualified technical specialists
    1. vyatom
      vyatom 18 February 2014 13: 02
      +6
      Quote: Dangerous
      I really hope that the construction of these nuclear submarines will give an impetus to the technological development of Russia. otherwise, there are a lot of outdated equipment and a lack of qualified technical specialists

      Interestingly, what are the salaries of ordinary hard workers? And are young people going to work there?
      And if directors and associates receive millions, and a welder or a cabinetmaker at Sevmash or an adjacent enterprise 15-20 thousand, then do not expect any update in the foreseeable future.
  3. saag
    saag 18 February 2014 08: 12
    +4
    do not expect miracles
  4. Ivan Petrovich
    Ivan Petrovich 18 February 2014 08: 14
    +13
    frames decide everything! No wonder Comrade Stalin said. Now other people of a different scale ... political impotent
  5. Vadim12
    Vadim12 18 February 2014 08: 41
    0
    The Yasen, Borey and a special-purpose boat will be laid down. What does special boat mean?
    1. Nayhas
      Nayhas 18 February 2014 08: 46
      +5
      Quote: Vadim12
      What does special boat mean?

      Submarine equipped with additional equipment. Type manipulators, inhabited underwater vehicles, etc. In order to collect drowned secret equipment / ammunition at the bottom, look for the enemy’s cable, reconnect to them. purposes. But they will really help to search for oil on the Arctic shelf ...
    2. avt
      avt 18 February 2014 10: 53
      +6
      Quote: Vadim12
      What does special boat mean?

      In our time, there was such a saying - “For a guessed answer, you will receive ten years" NATO and a special boat ", for specialists and their special activities. bully
  6. Good_Taxist
    Good_Taxist 18 February 2014 08: 53
    +1
    Quote: mirag2
    our defense industry will work at the previous level!

    everything will be fine! Break through! la!
  7. avt
    avt 18 February 2014 09: 54
    +6
    A long-suffering ship that immediately performs the functions of an experimental ship and the lead boat of the project, and even combat service must be carried out. God forbid the series will be issued, if only under the guise of imperfections and high cost the bastards would not hack to death. There are already some inclinations. 15 pieces to replace the 971m would not hurt. Well, if after the tests on "Sarov" something more interesting will not work.
    1. Arberes
      Arberes 18 February 2014 10: 06
      +5
      Quote: avt
      God forbid they will issue a series, if only under the guise of imperfections and high cost the project would not be cut off.

      I share your concerns, dear avt (3) hi
      I remember there was some kind of little article by another "expert" recently, on the boats of the "ASH" project!
      Test ball ???
  8. avt
    avt 18 February 2014 10: 19
    +5
    Quote: Arberes
    Test ball ???

    Yes, the campaign was informed that this project is essentially becoming a kind of semi-strategy. “Malachite” initially went from three specialized boat projects to the creation of a universal ship, which in the future, in the presence of high-precision weapons, even non-nuclear, functions of “strategic deterrence”. In fact, this is a new step in the concept of multipurpose boats. Yes, they were also developed and made in the "dashing 90s" !!! Truly - the need for invention is cunning.
    1. Hitrovan07
      Hitrovan07 18 February 2014 11: 23
      +5
      I will add that references to an overly expensive project are absolutely groundless if you look at how much our Central Bank spends on "supporting the ruble exchange rate" monthly - at such a rate you can finance the construction of at least a dozen Ash trees every year. smile
  9. ImPerts
    ImPerts 18 February 2014 11: 21
    +2
    Quote: Arberes
    Test ball ???

    Let's see where the flows begin to flow.
  10. sinukvl
    sinukvl 18 February 2014 11: 26
    +1
    How do you want our military-industrial complex to finally rise and earn at full capacity
  11. Tektor
    Tektor 18 February 2014 11: 34
    -2
    Severodvinsk is a 3,5 generation boat: it has been under construction for 20 years and part of the equipment and the hull are from the last century. The reactor of the wrong system.
    1. avt
      avt 18 February 2014 11: 43
      +9
      Quote: Tektor
      part of the equipment and the case - from the last century. The reactor of the wrong system.

      laughing“This song is sung by young people .. this song cannot be strangled, you cannot kill ...." Even Oleg Kaptsov has partially changed his mind about this, he was the first to say so that boats are being built from old "scrap" boats, after several discussions with real marimans on the site. So look in the archive of the site on this topic - maybe you will find something interesting.
    2. Dart2027
      Dart2027 18 February 2014 17: 24
      +1
      Fourth, and the reactor is normal.
  12. SibRUS
    SibRUS 18 February 2014 11: 50
    +9
    Under the Union, most of our factories were of dual use. At the time of the privatization of orders from the military, there was virtually no Therefore, tooling, and even equipment, was handed over for scrap. Design bureau reduced, technology stolen.
    I had a chance to work at one such enterprise in the early XNUMXs, so I saw perfectly what was happening. Now this plant, instead of auxiliary equipment (converters, generators, electric motors), which is intended by the way for the submarine fleet, produces components for railway cars, even though there is an acute shortage of qualified personnel.
    I don’t know how it is now, but already 10 years ago, our gas processing plants did not produce a low-noise bearing - corresponding to the parameters of military acceptance, there was talk of buying German bearings.
    1. Khokhloma
      Khokhloma 19 February 2014 08: 46
      0
      Do not worry, we make low-noise bearings. They do. And not only for the fleet, but also for aviation (although it would seem nonsense - an airplane and low-noise bearings)
  13. Russ69
    Russ69 18 February 2014 11: 57
    +5
    The other day "Sevmash" completed the formation of the corps of the next "Borei". "Monomakh" seems.
  14. avt
    avt 18 February 2014 12: 09
    +3
    Quote: Russ69
    The other day "Sevmash" completed the formation of the corps of the next "Borei". "Monomakh" seems.

    Like they wrote - "Vladimir"
    1. Russ69
      Russ69 18 February 2014 17: 46
      +3
      Quote: avt
      Like they wrote - "Vladimir"

      Yeah, a little fooled. smile "Prince Vladimir"
  15. ImPerts
    ImPerts 18 February 2014 12: 12
    +1
    Quote: SibRUS
    I don’t know how it is now, but already 10 years ago, our gas processing plants did not produce a low-noise bearing - corresponding to the parameters of military acceptance, there was talk of buying German bearings.

    Exactly...
    The Vikramaditya showed how difficult it was to restore technological capabilities. And the fact that both the aircraft carrier and the SSGN were completed speaks volumes. Including probable "partners"))). Look how one half is furious and splashing saliva about the missed opportunity and the need to pressurize, and the other half is trying not to make any sudden movements. In this way, everyone will match up and will try not to make sudden movements)))
  16. polkovnik manuch
    polkovnik manuch 18 February 2014 12: 18
    +4
    "So buy your transistors boyar as soon as possible," Ivan Vasilyevich seems to say in a famous comedy. Move quickly, brothers, enemies all around. The main thing is even among us!
  17. Roman 1977
    Roman 1977 18 February 2014 12: 34
    +1
    And by the way, we did not forget that ...
    MPLATRK project 885 "Ash" - accepted into EXPERIMENTAL OPERATION and will be accepted into the combat composition of the Navy not earlier than the second half of this year due to incomplete tests of hydroacoustics, navigation, electro-mechanical part, missile complex "Caliber", as well as work to reduce noise from the purpose of bringing it to the parameters established in the TTZ. And this is after 20 (twenty) years of construction (founded in 1993)
    "the completion of the submarine tests, the signing of the acceptance certificate and the rise of the Andreevsky flag at Severodvinsk are expected not earlier than September-October," however, "if the need arises," these terms may be shifted to November-December. "Everything depends on the successful solution of all the tasks set, unnecessary haste to the detriment of quality is unacceptable"

    http://bastion-karpenko.narod.ru/Severodvinsk_2011_01.html

    http://www.newsru.com/russia/30dec2013/sevdvinsk.html


    MPLATRK project 885 "Severodvinsk"
    The diesel-electric submarine "Saint Petersburg" has been in the same trial operation, however, under the St. Andrew's flag (first in the Baltic, and since 17.10.2013 - in the Northern Fleet) for a very long time (almost four years - since 22.04.2010) project 677 "Lada".

    Arrival of Project 677 "Saint Petersburg" DARL to the Northern Fleet
    If this goes on, our Navy will turn into a large testing ground, where substandard products of the USC (OPK) will be endlessly brought to mind, which, like Severodvinsk,
    "not ready for combat missions."

    So, it’s very early to open champagne and enjoy it ...
    1. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 18 February 2014 18: 08
      +4
      Quote: Novel 1977
      incomplete testing of hydroacoustics, navigation, electro-mechanical part, missile complex "Caliber", as well as work to reduce noise in order to bring it to the parameters set in the TTZ.

      Roman, hello. The author is somewhat behind the events. "Severodvinsk" was successfully fired off with a 2-missile underwater salvo "Caliber", after which it was accepted for trial operation. The reactor is more complicated. At high travel speeds (more than 20 kt), "constructive" noise appears, which can be "isolated" or "screened" in an operating reactor, but it is impossible to get rid of it before replacing the nuclear power plant. There is only one way out - limiting the speed, but then the performance characteristics of the boat deteriorate. Also not ICE, but I don't see any other way out. G / A and other systems will bring to mind. ("That's right!"). But the heart needs to be changed. Soon, the repair period will come up. But the ship will not be touched until this time - the moment is political - the prestige of the state.
  18. 120352
    120352 18 February 2014 13: 12
    +1
    For 20 years of construction, Ash could not but become obsolete. At such a pace, we will always lag behind and will not be able to enter a leading position. Thanks to Serdyukov and those who continue to protect him!
  19. Manul
    Manul 18 February 2014 13: 12
    +6
    It is better to bring to mind than to do nothing from a big mind.
    1. ImPerts
      ImPerts 18 February 2014 14: 21
      +1
      Absolutely.
      It is better to be smart and fooling around than to be a fool and clever)))
  20. Internal combustion engine
    Internal combustion engine 18 February 2014 14: 23
    +2
    It’s interesting, but who spread rot on our military-industrial complex all this time, Martians or what?
  21. nazgul-ishe
    nazgul-ishe 18 February 2014 14: 30
    +3
    The main thing moved and did not fall for scrapping. There is progress, industry will tighten, there will be personnel.
  22. Zomanus
    Zomanus 18 February 2014 15: 29
    +2
    What was built before the 2000's can be ignored. In the sense of not including this time in the timeline. There was no money there, and the building was frozen. Here we beat off 2000-2005 and from this moment we consider the terms. And the boat is undoubtedly necessary. Even if they release simplified projects. For our strategists must be accompanied on duty.
    1. Roman 1977
      Roman 1977 18 February 2014 16: 33
      -1
      What about us now? Our medveputy have been ruling for 14 years, the military-industrial complex regularly receives money, and at the end ...
      1 TFR project 11540 "Yastreb" - "Yaroslav the Wise", for the Baltic Fleet, laid down in 1988 - commissioned in 2009 (21 years passed from the moment of laying down to delivery to the fleet);

      2 TFR project 11661 for KFL, "Tatarstan" was founded in 1990 - delivered in 2003 (13 years); "Dagestan" was founded in 1991 - commissioned in 2012 (21 years old);
      3 TFR (corvettes) of the project 20380, for the Baltic Fleet: "Guarding" was laid in 2001 - delivered in 2008 (7 years); "Savvy" was founded in 2003 - commissioned in 2011 (8 years); "Boyky" was founded in 2005 - commissioned in 2013 (8 years). That is, a corvette with a total displacement of 2220 tons has been under construction for 7-8 years.

      At present, one more corvette of Project 1 "Stoyky" is to be delivered to the fleet - laid in 22380, this year will be handed over to the fleet, it turns out again 2006 years. In the Far East in 8 at the Amur plant a corvette "Perfect" was laid down, it has not yet been launched, it is expected to be delivered to the fleet by the end of this year, which is unlikely ...


      photos of the construction of the Corvette "Perfect"
      The larger ship frigate of project 22350 "Admiral Gorshkov", laid down in 2006, is supposed to be handed over to the fleet this year. The situation is similar with the Ivan Gren large landing craft, founded in 2004, which is being built at such a pace that it will enter service only in 2015, and most likely as an armed transport.

      That is, out of 6 large ships, 3 of the largest (Yaroslav the Wise, Dagestan, Tatarstan) were built from the Soviet reserve.
      3 IAC project 21630 for CFL "Astrakhan" was founded in 2004 - delivered in 2006 (2 years); Volgodonsk was founded in 2005 - commissioned in 2011 (6 years); "Makhachkala" was founded in 2006 - commissioned in 2012 (6 years).
      In the Caspian Sea, the tests of 2 MRK project 21631 "Uglich" (3 years) and "Grad Sviyazhsk" (4 years) are being completed. By the way, no one will clarify the situation, on Wiki they are already listed as included in the fleet. It seems that the adoption of new ships is an extraordinary event, but there is silence in the media.
      1 MTSH "Vice-Admiral Zakharyin" of project 02668 "Agat" for the Black Sea Fleet was founded in 1990 - delivered in 2008 (18 years old);
      1 RCA of the 12411 project for the Pacific Fleet is laid down in 1992, was commissioned in 2003 (11 years);
      6 Project 21980 Grachonok project: 3 for the Black Sea Fleet, 1 for the Baltic Fleet, 1 for the Pacific Fleet, 1 for the KFL (average construction period is 1 year). Another one is being completed for the Pacific Fleet.
      1. Roman 1977
        Roman 1977 18 February 2014 16: 41
        0
        11 DKA: 3 of the 1176 project “Shark” (for the Northern Fleet, Pacific Fleet, Black Sea Fleet); 7 of the 11770 project “Chamois” (3 for CFL, 2 for Baltic Fleet, 1 for Pacific Fleet, 1 for Black Sea Fleet). 1 of the 21820 project "Dugong" (for CFL).
        On tests 3 DKA: 2 project 11770 "Chamois" (for CFL), 1 project 21820 "Dugong" (for Pacific Fleet)
        One special-purpose boat 1 "Raptor" is undergoing trials, 03160 similar boats 2A "Mongoose" are being completed on the water.
        Submarines :
        2 SSBNs of project 955 "Borey": For Northern Fleet and Pacific Fleet; "Yuri Dolgoruky" was founded in 1996 - commissioned in 2012 (16 years old); "Alexander Nevsky" - founded in 2004 - commissioned in 2013 (9 years). Both boats are in trial operation. On trials, a submarine of a similar project "Vladimir Monomakh", for the Pacific Fleet, has been built since 2006, if it is handed over this year - 8 years.

        1 MPLATRK project 885 "Ash" for SF - put into trial operation. Laid down in the 1993 year, delivered to the fleet in the 2013 year (20 years).
        "Severodvinsk" will be accepted into the combat composition of the Russian Navy not earlier than the second half of this year due to incomplete tests of hydroacoustics, navigation, electro-mechanical part, missile complex "Caliber", as well as work to reduce noise in order to bring it to parameters installed in the TTZ.

        The next boat of the Kazan project is expected in 2015 (laid down in 2009).
        1 diesel-electric submarine of project 677 "Lada" "St. Petersburg", while for the BF, transferred to the Northern Fleet for testing, in trial operation. Laid down in 1997, commissioned to the fleet in 2010 (13 years old).

        The boats turned out to be so unsuccessful that in February 2012 of the year the media said that the Navy was abandoning the Lada project, according to Commander-in-Chief Vysotsky:
        ... the declared technical characteristics of the submarines of the 677 project are not confirmed by tests of the head submarine "St. Petersburg". “In its current form, Lada, the Russian Navy is not needed. We do not need new “brains” with weapons that would sit on the energy of the Second World War. What for? Who needs this? And her operational properties are the same ...

        However, the project was not abandoned and it was decided to complete the construction of 2 diesel-electric submarines of the project: Kronstadt (laid down in 2005) and Sevastopol (laid down in 2006)
        After the failure with project 677, they were forced to begin construction of diesel-electric submarines of project 636.6, which is a development of project 877, originally intended for export. The first diesel-electric submarine "Novorossiysk", laid down in 2010, launched on November 28.11.2013, XNUMX, is expected to be delivered to the fleet at the end of this year. In the same year, another diesel-electric submarine of the Rostov-on-Don project is expected.
        1 Project 20120 Sarov special-purpose diesel submarine designed for testing new types of weapons and military equipment. Based on the SF. Laid down in 1989, delivered to the fleet in 2008 (19 years old).

        1 special purpose nuclear submarine of the 10831 AC-31 project. Based on SF. Laid in the 1990 year, delivered to the fleet in the 2010 year (20 years)
      2. Russ69
        Russ69 18 February 2014 17: 50
        +3
        Quote: Novel 1977
        What about us now? Our medveputy have been ruling for 14 years, the military-industrial complex regularly receives money, and at the end ...

        Plus, a bunch of orders that all shipyards are busy. So the ships will be ...
      3. rudolff
        rudolff 18 February 2014 17: 54
        +2
        Roman, correct with Gren. Not armed transport, but armament transport. BDK did not come out of it. Yes, actually, looking at the project with its pontoon-bridge unloading, it could not get out.
    2. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 18 February 2014 17: 54
      +4
      Quote: Zomanus
      For our strategists must be accompanied on duty.

      Such tactics have long been abandoned. In order not to unmask the rkkSn, multipurpose nuclear submarines are deployed in threatened directions with the task of stealing the maneuverable submarine forces in the area. Sometimes they are purposefully substituted to lead the tail. So did ...
      1. Dart2027
        Dart2027 18 February 2014 20: 04
        0
        And the meaning of escort is this - to distract yourself.
  23. 1c-inform-city
    1c-inform-city 18 February 2014 16: 27
    +2
    A boat when it is brought to mind will be good. And I would really like it to be not limited to 8 pieces. Although there is talk of launching a simplified version in a series. To know what they want to throw out? Let them finish it, and we do not need solemn receptions for the holidays and birthdays with bolts hammered with a sledgehammer and cut-off slots.
  24. silver_roman
    silver_roman 18 February 2014 17: 37
    +2
    I am personally optimistic about the 885 and 885M. Severodvinsk took a long time to build for a variety of reasons. there is no need to remind what a terrible time this submarine was laid down.
    The good news is that the series is not shrinking ... at least for today. with K-560, problems exist at certain nodes. while the serial samples are brought to the level of "Severodvinsk", the jambs will be removed and we will get a continuous technical process at the output. with 955 it was easier, tk. there was a stand in the form of "Donskoy" (but this is more about a mace).
    In this case, the whole process will be worked out on the lead ship and everything will go on more vividly. You can take it, but does it make sense to use raw equipment? just to tick?
  25. rudolff
    rudolff 18 February 2014 18: 09
    +2
    I don’t remember for my service that they signed the deed of delivery of the ship, took it into trial operation, but the fleet did not accept it. It annoys a little. A sort of flying Dutchman.
  26. 1c-inform-city
    1c-inform-city 18 February 2014 18: 40
    0
    There will be nothing and a holiday on our street. Look at China, in general, all nuclear-powered boats are in trial operation, and the Amers have Zumvolt with LCS too, the lion's share of boats from the same place. Let's hope everything settles down.
  27. Power
    Power 18 February 2014 20: 14
    0
    What do you want? Twenty years of bumming, and then immediately the submarine, it does not happen. If not for Putin, this would not have happened.
  28. xomaNN
    xomaNN 18 February 2014 20: 24
    +5
    I had to take part in the tests of the lead nuclear submarine of 941 projects in the 80s. And, if anyone does not remember, then the entire USSR with its own subordinates built this giant. And the money was allocated immeasurably. And still there were a lot of big and small comments. And the solid hull was drilled, the inputs were modified in a new way, and they were replaced and modernized as the system was put into operation. I mean, the boat that we have and that of the Yankees is "terra incognita". And even if the Yasenya is now fully funded, it will not be possible to quickly commission a full-fledged combat unit. This is a difficult and thorny path of the court industry and military men.
    1. Hitrovan07
      Hitrovan07 18 February 2014 22: 05
      0
      Here in the theme of the proverb "The road will be mastered by the walking".
    2. Hitrovan07
      Hitrovan07 18 February 2014 22: 05
      0
      Here in the theme of the proverb "The road will be mastered by the walking".
  29. Manul
    Manul 19 February 2014 03: 49
    +1
    What we had before and what we have now is useless to compare. 1. Production facilities are destroyed by the Tagged and EBN, and we need to take as a fact what we have. 2. The engineers left, drunk, went to a different profile, and new ones cannot come, because there are no incentives. 3. Education and creation of personnel is now reduced to zero. That is, you all spread rot for the work of all those Heroes who are trying to put into operation at least something! The country is not thanks to power, but contrary to !!! with great difficulty introduces new equipment, new frontiers, and you .. All you can - talk - how slowly. You need to talk about something. Scold specifically those who are guilty, and at the same time pay tribute to all those who work! I with great respect, I say thanks to all those who work tirelessly, creating the armor of our country. My sincere recognition to you !!!
  30. papik09
    papik09 19 February 2014 04: 47
    +1
    And I am happy for the industry of Russia. Reborn. Although the projects are 20 years old (even more, because the bookmark was 20 years ago, so the project itself is at least 25 years old), but the boats themselves are really nothing. drinks hi
  31. Anton Gavrilov
    Anton Gavrilov April 2 2014 20: 55
    0
    I see you all forgot a lot of important things!
  32. Anton Gavrilov
    Anton Gavrilov April 2 2014 21: 01
    0
    Firstly, it was not 20 that was built, but 17,5 years, and from that time even less. In 1996, it was practically abandoned and construction stopped until the beginning of the zero years, only then it began to be built again! I suppose I forgot about the deepest socio-economic decline in 90-e ??? There is one more thing that is often forgotten — a lot of changes were made to the project in the zero years — this is not exactly the boat that was laid in the 93 year! And indeed its level is very high, do not forget to counterbalance to whom it was built originally by American Si Wolfe. If we consider it to be worse than this American boat, and taking into account the fact that Virginia (a simplified version of Sea Wolf) turned out to be in many ways (but not in everything) worse or on a par with its predecessors, then Ash Tree is at least no worse than Virginia! I’m no longer I'm talking about British boats like Astyut!
  33. bezdonnyj
    bezdonnyj 16 June 2015 12: 39
    0

    I recorded a video on the submarine of the Ash project