Military Review

The fire on the submarine "Tomsk" and its consequences

85
On Monday, September 16 on the nuclear submarine "Tomsk" (project 949А "Antey"), undergoing repairs at the seaside plant "Zvezda", a fire occurred. In the morning local time, smoke appeared in one of the compartments of the submarine, as a result of which 13 fire fighting and fireboats were called to the dry dock in which the Tomsk was located. Within a few hours the fire was extinguished.


The fire on the submarine "Tomsk" and its consequences


Shortly after the first News about this incident in the press there were speculations about the causes of the fire. According to reports, the reason for the smoke in one of the compartments was the carelessness of the shipyard employees. When carrying out welding work on a lightweight body, a spark hit a certain part of the ballast tank mount. As a result, the rubber coating and cable routes ignited. At the same time, according to some publications, rubber and wiring were only smoldering, and there was no open fire.

13 Pacific fire brigades were called to the scene fleet and MOE. It took more than four hours to eliminate the fire. During the incident, 15 sailors were injured. Now they are in hospital. The result of the fire was damage to some parts of the main ballast tank. RIA Novosti, citing a source in the Ministry of Defense, writes that it will take a few days to eliminate the consequences of the accident. Estimated recovery time for damaged structures is 10 days. According to the Ministry of Defense, the fire incident does not pose any danger to the environment. The boat "Tomsk" has long been under repair, therefore weapon aboard absent and reactor stopped.

Already in the afternoon of September 16, the garrison investigation department of the Gulf Shooter opened a criminal case against officials related to the repair of the submarine. They are suspected of committing a crime under Article 286 of the Criminal Code - abuse of office. As part of this criminal case, several examinations will be carried out to help establish an accurate picture of the incident and identify those responsible for it.

It should be recalled that the “human factor” during welding work is not the first time that it causes various incidents on Russian submarines. The largest in the newest stories Russian Navy accident caused by the negligence of workers, occurred 29 December 2011 of the year. Then, in the dock of the 82 shipyard (Roslyakovo, Murmansk region), when a technological hole was cut in the light hull of the Ekaterinburg submarine, a fire also occurred. Unlike the events at the Tomsk submarine, in December the 2011 of the fire spread over a large area: the flames spread to the wooden forests surrounding the submarine, and then to the light hull and the space between the hulls. The fire lasted about nine hours. The submarine "Ekaterinburg" is still under repair.

At this time, the damage from fire caused by a violation of safety measures during welding operations is much less. However, the fact that the Russian nuclear submarine is not the first time was at great risk because of the negligence of repairmen, forced the Ministry of Defense to draw the appropriate conclusions. On Monday, the head of the Russian military department, S. Shoigu, spoke about the first results of the investigation into the causes of fire. The main version at the moment - a violation of safety during the work. In connection with the incident at the Tomsk nuclear submarine, S. Shoigu demanded to strengthen control and supervision at Russian shipbuilding and ship repair enterprises. The second requirement of the Minister concerns the timing of the repair of the injured submarine. The Ministry of Defense wishes to receive assurances from the Zvezda plant that the fire that has occurred and the restoration work associated with it will not affect the total repair time and the timing of the return of the Tomsk boat to service.

At the selector meeting on the incident at Tomsk, President V. Putin also expressed his point of view. He ordered the Ministry of Defense to deal with the situation and determine the range of measures necessary to ensure that such incidents do not recur. Putin recalled that this is not the first case of such an accident and all measures are required to be taken to eliminate such incidents in the future.

A set of measures designed to eliminate such incidents in the future is still being developed. However, now the Ministry of Defense intends to take some steps that directly or indirectly affect the course of repair of ships and submarines. According to the head of the armaments department, Major General A. Gulyaev, at present the military department is preparing a lawsuit for the Zvezda plant. The military is not satisfied with several aspects of the enterprise. Shipbuilders, according to Guliaev, do not comply with the deadlines, and the quality of work leaves much to be desired.

A good example of why the Ministry of Defense intends to sue the factory "Zvezda", is the course of repair of the submarine "Tomsk". The submarine was docked back in the 2009 year and, in accordance with the repair contract, was supposed to be back in service back in the 2011 year. In the future, due to the failure of the initial deadlines, the 30 of July 2013 was appointed the date of completion of the repair. However, as of mid-September this year, the technical readiness of the submarine is only 80%. The military department still hopes to get the repaired submarine "Tomsk" before the end of this year, but is already preparing a lawsuit. The Ministry of Defense intends to receive compensation in the amount of 110 million rubles. In addition, there may be another lawsuit related to another breakdown of the deadlines.

As you can see, a small fire without an open flame led not only to the insignificant complication of the repair of the submarine, but also to the great consequences of an organizational nature. Because of the next fire on the repaired submarine, the Ministry of Defense is forced to give greater priority to the issue of the quality of repairs and control over their implementation. In addition, it intends to recover a significant amount from the enterprise, which twice failed to repair just one submarine. The results of the investigation of the causes of fire will be known later, but we can already say that they will also be followed by the corresponding conclusions.


On the materials of the sites:
http://ria.ru/
http://vz.ru/
http://interfax.ru/
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  1. ReifA
    ReifA 18 September 2013 08: 00
    +7
    In this news, it is gratifying that, in comparison with the recently described fire on an American submarine, ours hardly suffered. I think it will not hurt to study the possibility of sabotage, this ignition.
    1. Apollo
      Apollo 18 September 2013 08: 08
      10
      good morning everybody hi

      if the submarine were repaired on time you look and there was no this state of emergency.

      quote- The Ministry of Defense intends to receive compensation in the amount of 110 million rubles. In addition, another lawsuit may arise related to another failure to meet deadlines.

      I just can’t understand one thing, really it was necessary to wait for the submarine to ignite in order to then sue in connection with the delay in putting the submarine into operation.

      infographics
      1. Turik
        Turik 18 September 2013 08: 17
        +6
        There is only one reason - the banal gouging of those. services.
        1. ed65b
          ed65b 18 September 2013 08: 32
          +8
          Quote: Turik
          There is only one reason - the banal gouging of those. services.

          Or rather welded. Always Russian poherism and maybe. Come on "Vasily", here is "Vasily" and gave it.
          1. donavi49
            donavi49 18 September 2013 09: 42
            +5
            So, everyone has it. Vaughn Casey asked for leave from work, because on TV an important match of his favorite team was broadcast and friends with beer were waiting. But the tyrant boss sent him to repaint Miami's SSN 755. So he painted so that the boat had to be written off.
          2. mmmakm
            mmmakm 18 September 2013 11: 14
            10
            And where does it immediately welded? With a welded mask closed, he does not see where the spray is flying. He has all the attention on the seam. But if there is a danger of fire, then a person with a fire extinguisher should be nearby and monitor the situation.
            1. mudflow
              mudflow 18 September 2013 11: 19
              0
              before cooking apl you need to ask ... at least. and what's between the buildings
              and in addition, the star has long been able to only recycle ... the nuclear weapons next to the abrek
              1. Old_kapitan
                Old_kapitan 18 September 2013 20: 01
                0
                "before you cook an apple you need to ask ... at least. what is there between the buildings"

                Absolutely fair! We, too, were under repair, both in Polyarny on the mezhpokhodovy and on the Zvezdochka on the capital. The first thing the repair begins with is the unloading and cleaning of all tanks. And then 4 years in repair and rubbish lying in the Central City Hospital? I do not understand...
            2. vostok68
              vostok68 18 September 2013 15: 21
              +2
              Very correctly said, usually a sailor is standing next to a fire extinguisher! But before that, one of the bosses checks the welded workplace for compliance with safety standards! So he is to blame!
            3. AlNikolaich
              AlNikolaich 18 September 2013 20: 44
              +1
              Quote: mmmakm
              And where does it immediately welded? With a welded mask closed, he does not see where the spray is flying. He has all the attention on the seam. But if there is a danger of fire, then a person with a fire extinguisher should be nearby and monitor the situation.

              Uh ... Welded receives approval for the production of hot work. Prepares the workplace. In short, he complies with all safety requirements for welding, for welding under certain conditions! During normal welding operations there should be ventilation, lighting, a bucket of water and a fire extinguisher, as well as the absence of flammable substances in the working area, or their shielding! During ship repair, the requirements may be higher, including the assistant welder (second number). If safety requirements are not met, the welder has no right to carry out work!
              1. Old_kapitan
                Old_kapitan 18 September 2013 21: 27
                0
                Uh ... Welded receives approval for the production of hot work. Prepares the workplace. In short, he complies with all safety requirements for welding, for welding under certain conditions! During normal welding operations there should be ventilation, lighting, a bucket of water and a fire extinguisher, as well as the absence of flammable substances in the working area, or their shielding! During ship repair, the requirements may be higher, including the assistant welder (second number). If safety requirements are not met, the welder has no right to carry out work!

                You are right, but not quite. Not an assistant, but providing from among the crew. Further, providing food, the welder began work, and he climbed onto the hull, say smoke. The welder may not see this. Anyway, he needs his work to work, and not to look at the personnel.
                1. SPLV
                  SPLV 18 September 2013 23: 07
                  +1
                  Of course, I am not a sailor, but according to the current standards, among other things, after the completion of hot work at the existing enterprise, the duty station must be on duty for 3 (three) hours. Self-respecting leaders respect this. Most likely, the fire occurred just after the completion of work, which most often happens. Ordinary TB violation.
                  As for the delay, first you need to take an interest in the payment schedule, whether the deadlines are met, and then draw conclusions: either the shipbuilders are chemists, or someone in the Moscow Region has violated the deadlines and now wants to cover his train.
                  1. Old_kapitan
                    Old_kapitan 19 September 2013 07: 37
                    +1
                    Of course, I am not a sailor, but according to the current standards, among other things, after the completion of hot work at the existing enterprise, the duty station must be on duty for 3 (three) hours. Self-respecting leaders respect this. Most likely, the fire occurred just after the completion of work, which most often happens. Ordinary TB violation.
                    As for the delay, first you need to take an interest in the payment schedule, whether the deadlines are met, and then draw conclusions: either the shipbuilders are chemists, or someone in the Moscow Region has violated the deadlines and now wants to cover his train.

                    I don’t know how the organization of repair work was set up, but I think it’s not very different from the times when I served. So, then the hard workers left the ship as in a regular factory - in 17.00. Further observation by the crew leaving the ship at 18.00 and on duty. Now let's look at the ignition time - between 04.00 and 05.00. We did not carry out fire hazardous work at night IN ANY EVENT, because at this time, the ship is only on guard - an 15 man on an 120-meter ship. For example, in the stern of three huge double-deck compartments - 1 people.
          3. Old_kapitan
            Old_kapitan 18 September 2013 15: 54
            +5
            When carrying out fire hazardous operations, next to the welded one there MANDATORY is to provide, from among the crew, water-foam and carbon dioxide fire extinguishers, a bucket of water, an IDP hose unwound. Is it really so to blame welded? I'm for a divers to swallow a throat, but ...
        2. mejik
          mejik 18 September 2013 11: 23
          -3
          Quote: ed65b
          Quote: Turik
          There is only one reason - the banal gouging of those. services.

          Or rather welded. Always Russian poherism and maybe. Come on "Vasily", here is "Vasily" and gave it.

          They’re picking up, fucking, asshole by the announcement ...
          1. mejik
            mejik 18 September 2013 16: 21
            -1
            Quote: mejik
            Quote: ed65b
            Quote: Turik
            There is only one reason - the banal gouging of those. services.

            Or rather welded. Always Russian poherism and maybe. Come on "Vasily", here is "Vasily" and gave it.

            They’re picking up, fucking, asshole by the announcement ...

            I will try to like the minuswalker. Acquire, wah, high-class experts on the thug. Probably not like it again. They pick up, mazafak, saboteurs from the filing of a friendly CIA. Cho! Again? Well, I don’t know, and the specialists were cool and they burned the boat. Where is the trouble?
            1. Old_kapitan
              Old_kapitan 18 September 2013 19: 48
              +1
              "I'll try to like the minus one."

              By the way, I also did not understand why you are being minus. After all, in essence, everything is correct. Considering that in ukronedorazumenya, called for some reason the fleet, everything is the same, if not worse, I am even glad that "Zaporozhye" does not go to sea. My son served on "Ternopil", so he said that when a fire broke out on a nearby ship (either "Vinnitsa", or "Lutsk", I don't remember), the weight of the hp kicked out on the wall, extinguished only contract soldiers and officers with warrant officers. This is the fight for survivability! And what happens at sea, where will they be driven out?
        3. washi
          washi 18 September 2013 15: 30
          +1
          There are many reasons:
          Lack of trained workers due to lack of finances at the plant (or their appropriation (taking into account Amer’s funding for the cutting of our boats)
          Lack of control on the part of the crew (nihilists - graduates of TVVMU whose goal is not service, but loot)
          Special sabotage (show that not only in the USA boats are being repaired during repair). Drive the loot and everything will be.
          No ideology - no state. There is a joint accommodation.
          Previously, Big Stone workers were proud of their work. Now they just make money.
      2. donavi49
        donavi49 18 September 2013 09: 25
        0
        Well, how much is the lawsuit filed? Therefore, the MO first receives the equipment, accepts it, and then lays claim for failure to meet the deadlines.
      3. Eugeniy_369
        Eugeniy_369 18 September 2013 10: 00
        +1
        Quote: Apollon
        I just can’t understand one thing, really it was necessary to wait for the submarine to ignite in order to then sue in connection with the delay in putting the submarine into operation.

        If it weren’t for the fire, everyone would quietly quietly let the brakes go. If total corruption has swept the whole country, then why should the military-industrial complex and the Russian army be on the sidelines?
        They are not on Mars.
      4. politruk419
        politruk419 18 September 2013 15: 51
        +2
        He was the deputy of 621 crew in 2009-10 and part of 2011. Tomsk was kept in the "Zvezda". The idea expressed by Shoigu that the plant should be responsible for disrupting all conceivable and inconceivable terms of delivery of the ship is absolutely correct. I will say more. Nichrome not doing "Zvezda" in every possible way delays the work. Referring to objective and subjective reasons. In fact, the plant simply makes money on the delivery of the RF Ministry of Defense piers, the sale of water, electricity, steam, etc., etc.
    2. little man
      little man 18 September 2013 10: 10
      +1
      Nothing pleases in this news! What a nonsense! These are the enemies of the people !. For two years, the deadlines and in addition a little boat can not be ruined!
      1. alone
        alone 18 September 2013 23: 06
        +1
        or maybe they burned the boat to conceal the theft of funds for repairs. I remember that the most favorite method of concealing the shortage was a fire, after which everything that could be written off was written off
    3. igor.borov775
      igor.borov775 18 September 2013 11: 56
      +1
      Here, the supplier is all in time; the other can’t do it; yes, there’s enough of their work, Now it’s already obvious that there are not enough enterprises that exist, the Economic cluster in the east almost needs to be re-created, There are a lot of long-term construction and not only shipbuilding and repair plants are to blame, Those that remained far very busy, you think they don’t know there, They know but there are no shifts so far, It was here in the east that these problems were resolved, Many outdated equipment and the absence of close suppliers of equipment disappeared in the mess that existed, If in the west it’s long-term construction it’s possible to go east he is far from silent, Until a clear discipline is observed in supplies and repairs, It’s still there the atomic ship can’t bring it to readiness and it’s worth it all can’t finish it,
    4. clidon
      clidon 18 September 2013 16: 51
      +1
      How much she really suffered write much later ...
    5. vjhbc
      vjhbc 18 September 2013 18: 40
      0
      Hello everyone with this, there’s nothing to be done now and it’s not visible even when it can be possible because there aren’t even any prerequisites and what measures this government and president cannot change because people react very subtly if the government is responsible and it works like a damn then the people work and vice versa, and this is all called a decrease in the responsibility of performers or, popularly speaking, poh-ism
      Quote: ReifA
      In this news, it is gratifying that, in comparison with the recently described fire on an American submarine, ours hardly suffered. I think it will not hurt to study the possibility of sabotage, this ignition.
  2. PSih2097
    PSih2097 18 September 2013 08: 14
    11
    At a conference call on the incident in Tomsk, President V. Putin also expressed his point of view. He ordered the Ministry of Defense to deal with the situation and determine the set of measures necessary so that such incidents do not recur. Putin recalled that this is not the first case of such an accident and that all measures are required to eliminate such incidents in the future.
    I did not have time to return state security to the factory with the broadest powers, as during the Great Patriotic War, messed up - get the deadline ...
    1. Deniska999
      Deniska999 18 September 2013 08: 35
      +1
      I agree with you.
    2. donavi49
      donavi49 18 September 2013 09: 29
      +3
      Yes, even shot in the courtyard in front of the factory staff. Then the cruisers and submarines also burned for repair. The Americans burn out too, and I'm not talking about the famous boat, recently there was a fire at Tiki's repair, they also put out the hours for 2-3 and fixed the jambs for an additional week of repair.

      Here it is necessary either to abandon potentially dangerous procedures (welding), which is unrealistic. Or improve the work of fire services and reduce response time. We arrived at Tomsk quickly and a lot - the result is minimal damage. We traveled to Yekaterinburg for a long time and a little - the result was a good burnout of the boat, a hull burned, etc.
      1. washi
        washi 18 September 2013 15: 33
        +1
        Quote: donavi49
        Yes, even shot in the courtyard in front of the factory staff. Then the cruisers and submarines also burned for repair. The Americans burn out too, and I'm not talking about the famous boat, recently there was a fire at Tiki's repair, they also put out the hours for 2-3 and fixed the jambs for an additional week of repair.

        Here it is necessary either to abandon potentially dangerous procedures (welding), which is unrealistic. Or improve the work of fire services and reduce response time. We arrived at Tomsk quickly and a lot - the result is minimal damage. We traveled to Yekaterinburg for a long time and a little - the result was a good burnout of the boat, a hull burned, etc.

        Or maybe just restore what was already? But on a new level.
    3. Eugeniy_369
      Eugeniy_369 18 September 2013 10: 04
      +1
      Quote: PSih2097
      Putin recalled that this is not the first case of such an accident and that all measures are required to eliminate such incidents in the future.

      "And Vaska listens, but eats" (c)
    4. Garrin
      Garrin 18 September 2013 16: 05
      +2
      Quote: PSih2097
      I did not have time to return state security to the factory with the broadest powers, as during the Great Patriotic War, messed up - get the deadline ...

      Why, as during the Second World War? From the 85th to the 89th I worked at a metallurgical plant in Makeevka, by the way, as the head of the electric welding section in the metal construction workshop. So, the investigation of every major accident, in the least, began with the arrival of KGB officers.
    5. clidon
      clidon 18 September 2013 19: 40
      0
      Who will work at such a wonderful plant? You seem to be very far from the current state of production.
  3. Sgt.
    Sgt. 18 September 2013 08: 53
    +3
    Kindergarten is direct some! once again.
    Usually, at any enterprise, when carrying out welding work, measures are taken to prevent fire, responsible persons are appointed. Yes, just put a couple of fire extinguishers with the welder, and preferably a couple of people with a fire extinguisher.
    1. donavi49
      donavi49 18 September 2013 09: 32
      +4
      Yes, just weigh it all with fire extinguishers. Manual fires occur daily on every order. They are extinguished easily and quickly. Another thing is if the fire goes beyond manual accessibility ...
      1. vostok68
        vostok68 18 September 2013 15: 57
        +3
        Here I want to agree, ignition during welding is usually in manual accessibility! Before my eyes, during welding, a barrel of silver was in manual accessibility! They tried to extinguish it for half an hour (all this on the submarine’s hull), then a virtuoso crane operator, threw a burning barrel into the sea with a hook and saved everyone! For another 5 minutes, bubbles near the side of the submarine rose! And even 10 fire extinguishers did not help, and if the senior had checked everything in advance, there would have been nothing! And what is difficult to see a barrel of silver on the site of future work?
        1. washi
          washi 18 September 2013 16: 37
          -4
          Quote: vostok68
          Here I want to agree, ignition during welding is usually in manual accessibility! Before my eyes, during welding, a barrel of silver was in manual accessibility! They tried to extinguish it for half an hour (all this on the submarine’s hull), then a virtuoso crane operator, threw a burning barrel into the sea with a hook and saved everyone! For another 5 minutes, bubbles near the side of the submarine rose! And even 10 fire extinguishers did not help, and if the senior had checked everything in advance, there would have been nothing! And what is difficult to see a barrel of silver on the site of future work?

          You are bad. did not provide elementary TB
          1. vostok68
            vostok68 18 September 2013 17: 00
            +1
            And I didn’t provide anything there, I watched on a shift, and when needed, I brought fire extinguishers, and you, bad person, where did you serve? Why on earth are you bringing such charges against me? Where do you live I would like to meet with you! I am in Khabarovsk, tell me, how do we meet?
          2. vostok68
            vostok68 18 September 2013 17: 01
            +1
            I do not like you!
          3. AlNikolaich
            AlNikolaich 18 September 2013 20: 56
            +2
            Quote: Vasya
            You are bad. did not provide elementary TB

            The minus is not set. But somehow rude, and not the topic.
            LOKH - a person deceived by a bully, according to the modern-suffered ...
            Vostok68 said that the case was before his eyes. He did not say that he was responsible for TB, but noted that he was a senior job!
            And you sucker ... It's a shame, right? I would apologize ...
    2. Garrin
      Garrin 18 September 2013 09: 53
      +7
      Quote: Sergeant
      Usually, at any enterprise, when carrying out welding work, measures are taken to prevent fire, responsible persons are appointed. Yes, just put a couple of fire extinguishers with the welder, and preferably a couple of people with a fire extinguisher.

      Everything is correct. Although we do not cook submarines, we carry out all welding work according to the tolerance, and there, almost a technological map is developed, with reference to a specific place of welding or firing.
      1. vostok68
        vostok68 18 September 2013 16: 01
        +1
        Exactly! Thank you for such a useful comment!
  4. Vrungel78
    Vrungel78 18 September 2013 09: 07
    -10 qualifying.
    And not a single media outlet, nor Ryabov Kirill, writes that at the moment the level of radiation in Big Stone is 1000 times higher than the norm, as in Fukushima. Only in Japan all people were evacuated, but not in Big Stone. Like, there is no reason for concern.
    1. Dangerous
      Dangerous 18 September 2013 09: 16
      +1
      where does this information come from?
      1. Vrungel78
        Vrungel78 18 September 2013 09: 23
        -3
        Father lives there, talked to him yesterday.
        1. donavi49
          donavi49 18 September 2013 09: 36
          12
          Oh yes, and from the boat you can see a green glow, and the fifth hand has grown out of the factory workers wassat .

          Monitoring of radiation is ongoing. If AUTHORITIES ALL LIE, then measure yourself, since ordinary dosimeters are sold freely.

          Z.Y. If the norm were x1000, then SNN and BBS would go Breaking Nuvs according to B. Stone. For such radiation levels would be recorded in other countries, as well as a monitoring system.
        2. gispanec
          gispanec 18 September 2013 09: 45
          +5
          Quote: Vrungel78
          Father lives there, talked to him yesterday.

          1000 times .... and father lives there .... two questions
          1- how does he live there in such radiation?
          2 what did he measure this radiation with?
          1. Vrungel78
            Vrungel78 18 September 2013 09: 58
            -4
            I have nothing to prove my case, and I'm not going to do it. For what I bought, for that I sell. And yet there is no reason not to believe your own father. Well, maybe he lied for a dozen millisieverts. This does not change the essence of the matter. And you are trying to catch me with not insignificant inaccuracies.
            1. Russ69
              Russ69 18 September 2013 10: 11
              +3
              Quote: Vrungel78
              And yet there is no reason not to believe your own father. Well, maybe he lied for a dozen millisieverts. This does not change the essence of the matter. And you are trying to catch me with not insignificant inaccuracies.

              Let father take a dosimeter, measure and upload a photo. Toda and we will believe ... smile
              You need to think a head, at least sometimes ...
            2. mejik
              mejik 18 September 2013 11: 29
              +2
              Quote: Vrungel78
              And you are trying to catch me with not insignificant inaccuracies.
              And you are responsible for your words! Or, you think, you can throw misinformation, and when you are caught, hide behind your father, and make excuses with "insignificant inaccuracies." This is a clear provocation! Sorry! hi
        3. washi
          washi 18 September 2013 16: 39
          0
          Quote: Vrungel78
          Father lives there, talked to him yesterday.

          Sorry, but I'm somewhere nearby.
          Do not believe those who want to remove "radiation" with alcohol.
    2. svp67
      svp67 18 September 2013 11: 29
      +2
      Quote: Vrungel78
      And not a single media outlet, nor Ryabov Kirill, writes that at the moment the level of radiation in Big Stone is 1000 times higher than the norm, as in Fukushima.

      As far as I know, there is a VERY strong "monitoring" and SUCH races cannot remain unnoticed by the people living there ... and this, accordingly, would become known to the whole world, since our net is still open ... So this is message question ...
  5. VohaAhov
    VohaAhov 18 September 2013 09: 19
    +8
    I found a small article on the Internet. I do not claim authorship, but, in my opinion, in the subject
    What a fireman should know about a welder!
    1. A welder is a bastard by definition. Among the welders there are quite decent and sane specimens, but this is rather the exception.
    2. The welder is practically impossible to train.
    3. Welders permanently spoil the waste of their life - specifically (even though they deny it) aiming at places where soft, fluffy and low-combustible objects are stacked.
    4. When the welder is explained the abomination of his behavior (the so-called briefing before starting work), he looks into the eyes and understands everything, waving a torch or an electrode holder cheerfully.
    5. Do not believe it - if a fireman turns away (or worse, move away) and the welder immediately spoils.
    6. Returning to the welder left unattended, you need to save a good stick, which should immediately hit the welder caught at the site of the violation in different parts of the body.
    7. Usually helps for a while. Welders are practically deprived of the punishment for their deeds. Also, most welders lack an elementary instinct of self-preservation.
    8. It is necessary to beat the welders constantly, moderately, but sensitively - in rubles.
    The old - now almost forgotten recipe for ancestors - rubles (metal - unless of course if they suddenly have an excess from the fireman?) Are poured into a durable bag and more ...
    9. With proper upbringing, even a welder can make a relatively decent ... man.
    10. The most important thing - well, after all, WITHOUT welders can not do. We love these arrogant, unprincipled villains. The kidnappers of our ... wallets. They are very useful.
    ZY - beat the WELDER on MIK's ruberoid roof (!) - when the roof was already slightly smoking, he fought in the basement, filled with a pair of fingers with a continuous layer of oil - and in the midst of magnificence - a cart with oxygen and acetylene cylinders and the phrase "A zhzh-zh- burn the torch. " Slightly less gloomy situations - do not count ...
    1. AK-47
      AK-47 18 September 2013 11: 06
      +3
      Quote: VohaAhov
      A welder is a bastard by definition.

      To the point.
      "The procedure for conducting welding work was violated, and after the old rubber and paint caught fire in the compartment, it was not possible to quickly liquidate the fire, since the fire extinguisher turned out to be faulty," the source said.

      According to him, there is a strict procedure for each type of repair work on a nuclear submarine, the fulfillment of all requirements eliminates possible emergency situations.

      "When carrying out gas welding work on a nuclear submarine (NPS) in accordance with the charter of the ship service, before welding, specialists first of all must check the operability of the fire extinguisher. This was not done. The fire extinguisher turned out to be faulty," the source said. He said that a worker with a fire extinguisher and a sailor on duty from the crew, who were supposed to control the situation, should have been at the place of gas welding next to the worker.



      RIA Novosti http://ria.ru/
    2. washi
      washi 18 September 2013 16: 44
      +5
      In fact, the welder is a rare specialist.
      The welder is not a manager - there are few welders
      A welder who knows how to cook ALL metals is unique. It is necessary to cherish and cherish it.
      Where was the vocational school where the specialists were trained? They were replaced by colleges that train "stylists"
  6. zav
    zav 18 September 2013 09: 35
    +1
    smoke in one of the submarine compartments


    If a fire occurs inside the ballast tank, that is, in a light casing, smoke cannot occur inside a strong casing, that is, in one of the compartments.
    1. AK-47
      AK-47 18 September 2013 11: 38
      0
      Quote: zav
      If a fire occurs inside the ballast tank, that is, in a light casing, smoke cannot occur inside a strong casing, that is, in one of the compartments.

      However, something smoked and quite strong.
      1. zav
        zav 18 September 2013 15: 24
        +1
        Smoked or burned rubber seals mounted in a lightweight submarine housing. But the lightweight body is not divided into compartments.
        I am for technically competent terminology.
  7. Shellback
    Shellback 18 September 2013 09: 54
    +2
    The fire at the Yekaterinburg did not teach anyone anything.
  8. bistrov.
    bistrov. 18 September 2013 10: 08
    0
    "Sue"! That's right! To crush the capitalists with money! Maybe at least this will teach them to maintain discipline and fulfill obligations.
  9. mudflow
    mudflow 18 September 2013 10: 10
    0
    no, of course. there are now people thinking about who will make them rich. Rosneft or Gazprombank. what submarines.
    Координаты: 43°6'16"N 132°22'50"E
  10. Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 18 September 2013 10: 11
    +6
    And here, mother-brood, the Ministry of Defense ?! Isn’t it time for Rostekhnadzor to disrupt? Coy someone! There is a completely harmonious and adequate system for issuing work orders. When issuing any outfit, TB prescribes long-established safety measures that make such things impossible. Regime maps and schemes for the production of any hazardous work of 30-40 years cover all conceivable and inconceivable situations ...
    And this system of issuing orders at the factory is poher, do not go to the grandmother. TB engineer under trial, head of TVET under the ass with a knee from the factory. And the controlling organization must be shaken very, very hard. This is their fault. To tear bribes and all? But do you need to oversee the execution of hazardous work? Well, of course, you need to tear off the fine from the factory. Razyayai ...
    1. Kavtorang
      Kavtorang 18 September 2013 11: 55
      +8
      And despite the fact that "Tomsk" does not contain a factory crew. And no one canceled the ROZH RK, and any hot work is coordinated by the commander of the BC-5 and, in some cases, also by the flagship mechanic of the brigade of submarines under construction and repair. The commander of the BC-5 enters the work into the daily plan and determines the work support. There is no need to reinvent bicycles - you need to use the existing ones normally.
  11. cth; fyn
    cth; fyn 18 September 2013 10: 27
    +1
    The Indians also recently burned down a submarine and also after repairs, was it by any chance that it was repaired at the Zvezda?
  12. mudflow
    mudflow 18 September 2013 10: 32
    +1
    no. read it with a North Sea asterisk .... especially the word Disposal.
    http://www.fes-zvezda.ru/areas/
  13. Storm
    Storm 18 September 2013 10: 36
    +1
    They are right that they are preparing a lawsuit. It's time to do something with the irresponsibility and sloppiness that reigned with us everywhere since the 90s. Otherwise, nothing good shines for us. Responsibility must be - then everything will be.
    1. mudflow
      mudflow 18 September 2013 10: 59
      +2
      those. the state represented by the Ministry of Defense podask suit, and the state represented by Osk will pay for it.? better wool personality
  14. Samy
    Samy 18 September 2013 11: 24
    +1
    Quote: Vrungel78
    that at the moment in Big Stone the radiation level is 1000 times higher than the norm, as in Fukushima.


    Complete nonsense.
  15. Kavtorang
    Kavtorang 18 September 2013 11: 46
    +1
    The press service of the GVSU SK RF fully:
    "The military investigation department of the Investigative Committee of the Russian Federation on the Strelok Bay garrison has opened a criminal case against officials of the Tomsk nuclear submarine of the Pacific Fleet, suspected of committing a crime under Part 1 of Article 286 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation (abuse of office).
    It was established that on September 16, 2013, as a result of violations during the installation of the main ballast tank, the inter-hull heat and sound insulating material was ignited in the space between the light and strong hull of the nuclear submarine, as a result of which the Tomsk nuclear submarine partially lost its functional characteristics. In addition, 15 soldiers who are currently in hospital in the Naval Clinical Hospital were injured.
    In the criminal case, forensic, fire-technical and forensic examinations have been assigned and are being conducted.
    During the investigation, it is necessary to establish all the circumstances of the incident, determine the nature of the violations and the degree of guilt of both the military officials of the Tomsk nuclear submarine and the specialists of Far East Plant Zvezda OJSC, whose actions led to the outbreak and spread of the fire.
    Investigation of the criminal case continues.
    Source: press service of the Main Military Investigative Directorate of the RF IC "
  16. kim. 230752
    kim. 230752 18 September 2013 12: 00
    +9
    Quote: VohaAhov
    1. A welder is a bastard by definition.




    A welder is a worker who REALLY CREATE material values. It works in hazardous conditions (light radiation, gases from an electrode or a burner), often in very uncomfortable conditions (probably just like that on a submarine). There were very few good welders (6th grade and with a personal quality mark) before, but now, probably, not at all, and the fire is a consequence of the low level of work organization at the shipyard. This is the fault of "effective managers" at all levels. First of all, the highest (they created such a system in which there is no place for highly skilled workers). Well, the bunglers on the spot also made their contribution. RESPECT THE WELDER, HE IS A MAN !!!
    1. vostok68
      vostok68 18 September 2013 16: 15
      +2
      +! I talked about the same thing above!
    2. washi
      washi 18 September 2013 16: 47
      +1
      Quote: kim.230752
      Quote: VohaAhov
      1. A welder is a bastard by definition.

      A welder is a worker who REALLY CREATE material values. It works in hazardous conditions (light radiation, gases from an electrode or a burner), often in very uncomfortable conditions (probably just like that on a submarine). There were very few good welders (6th grade and with a personal quality mark) before, but now, probably, not at all, and the fire is a consequence of the low level of work organization at the shipyard. This is the fault of "effective managers" at all levels. First of all, the highest (they created such a system in which there is no place for highly skilled workers). Well, the bunglers on the spot also made their contribution. RESPECT THE WELDER, HE IS A MAN !!!

      The work of the welder should have been provided by a safety engineer, process engineer, boat crew.
      1. vostok68
        vostok68 18 September 2013 17: 14
        +1
        Here you are absolutely right!
  17. Kavtorang
    Kavtorang 18 September 2013 12: 04
    +2
    Quote: ReifA
    In comparison with the recently described fire on an American submarine, ours was hardly affected.

    Yes indeed belay For the striped ones, this is simply a write-off of one of 43 Elks. And for us - bullshit. Just think, the "loaf" stood for 4 years in the "Zvezda" and now it is not known how long it is stuck. We simply cannot count them. Could you tell me from what year the Irkutsk is outside the combat strength of the fleet?
  18. archi.sailor
    archi.sailor 18 September 2013 12: 34
    +4
    Quote: Kavtorang
    And despite the fact that "Tomsk" does not contain a factory crew. And no one canceled the ROZH RK, and any hot work is coordinated by the commander of the BC-5 and, in some cases, also by the flagship mechanic of the brigade of submarines under construction and repair. The commander of the BC-5 enters the work into the daily plan and determines the work support. There is no need to reinvent bicycles - you need to use the existing ones normally.

    I agree, dear, both hands are for, well, plus. Pts all right!
    1. vostok68
      vostok68 18 September 2013 16: 18
      0
      Well, they found the guilty one! (Are you sure about that?)
  19. Volkhov
    Volkhov 18 September 2013 13: 46
    0
    Everything that is not done is for the better, the burned out person will not drown. How are the other Antheas doing?
  20. Kavtorang
    Kavtorang 18 September 2013 13: 58
    +1
    Quote: Volkhov
    How are the other Antheas doing?

    Just drop dead am Look, for example, here: http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-608.html - the consolidated register of the project at the end.
  21. The comment was deleted.
  22. 9k72
    9k72 18 September 2013 14: 17
    +1
    On Sunday I visited relatives in Bolshoi Kamen. On Monday evening I called, yes, fire, radiation, no, just empty fire extinguishers + Monday
  23. Nikolski1973
    Nikolski1973 18 September 2013 14: 25
    0
    All the military and factory workers are lying, for this it’s time to put it already, this is not just negligence - this is a diversion aimed at undermining the country's combat readiness.
  24. daem00n
    daem00n 18 September 2013 15: 12
    +1
    Quote: VohaAhov
    I found a small article on the Internet. I do not claim authorship, but, in my opinion, in the subject
    What a fireman should know about a welder!
    1. A welder is a bastard by definition. Among the welders there are quite decent and sane specimens, but this is rather the exception.
    2. The welder is practically impossible to train.
    3. Welders permanently spoil the waste of their life - specifically (even though they deny it) aiming at places where soft, fluffy and low-combustible objects are stacked.
    4. When the welder is explained the abomination of his behavior (the so-called briefing before starting work), he looks into the eyes and understands everything, waving a torch or an electrode holder cheerfully.
    5. Do not believe it - if a fireman turns away (or worse, move away) and the welder immediately spoils.
    6. Returning to the welder left unattended, you need to save a good stick, which should immediately hit the welder caught at the site of the violation in different parts of the body.
    7. Usually helps for a while. Welders are practically deprived of the punishment for their deeds. Also, most welders lack an elementary instinct of self-preservation.
    8. It is necessary to beat the welders constantly, moderately, but sensitively - in rubles.
    The old - now almost forgotten recipe for ancestors - rubles (metal - unless of course if they suddenly have an excess from the fireman?) Are poured into a durable bag and more ...
    9. With proper upbringing, even a welder can make a relatively decent ... man.
    10. The most important thing - well, after all, WITHOUT welders can not do. We love these arrogant, unprincipled villains. The kidnappers of our ... wallets. They are very useful.
    ZY - beat the WELDER on MIK's ruberoid roof (!) - when the roof was already slightly smoking, he fought in the basement, filled with a pair of fingers with a continuous layer of oil - and in the midst of magnificence - a cart with oxygen and acetylene cylinders and the phrase "A zhzh-zh- burn the torch. " Slightly less gloomy situations - do not count ...

    I absolutely agree! I work on ships of the merchant fleet the situation is similar, but there is always a person next to the welder with a fire extinguisher and a bucket of water to control the situation and extinguish it if necessary. This is a tough rule if violated, there are sanctions from a fine to dismissal, so no one here tries not to break.
    1. vostok68
      vostok68 18 September 2013 16: 27
      0
      I gave an example above, when 10 fire extinguishers and a bucket of water did not help, the senior worker (officer) violated the rule and what does the welder have to do with it? Of course, he could notice this barrel of silver, but it is not his duty!
      1. SPLV
        SPLV 18 September 2013 23: 34
        0
        An adequate competent welder will not only notice, but also warn. And welders "not his duty" often get injured and injured. When "my house is on the edge" and "how did you get me with your labor protection", then it turns out "I didn't know, I didn't want to, it's not my fault, now I'm on sick leave ..."
  25. washi
    washi 18 September 2013 15: 42
    0
    Quote: Sergeant
    Kindergarten is direct some! once again.
    Usually, at any enterprise, when carrying out welding work, measures are taken to prevent fire, responsible persons are appointed. Yes, just put a couple of fire extinguishers with the welder, and preferably a couple of people with a fire extinguisher.

    Forget. Around one loot.
    And Kazakhstan has problems because of this. You also have tribal relations, i.e. in the absence of Russians, the probability of an accident rises significantly
  26. clidon
    clidon 18 September 2013 16: 06
    +1
    Russian welders - American painters "Score 2: 1
  27. Sunscorpion
    Sunscorpion 18 September 2013 16: 15
    0
    "appropriate conclusions" - this is a lowering of the category of welders and deprivation of their bonuses, to begin with for a year, and if repeated - dismissal with a wolf ticket; for the beginning. workshops - felling; for "managers" - full material compensation for damage or also felling - a choice. Then there will be organization, and coordination, and control, and regulation of changes. Then they will begin to work conscientiously, and not through f ... carelessly.
    1. clidon
      clidon 18 September 2013 16: 49
      +1
      In modern conditions, with such offhand, you will be left without welders. They will find a quieter job for themselves, as turners (millers) and welders in general are very popular people. Pay them a lot of money? Only to them or to all the workers? If only for them, the boat will eventually be set on fire by others, and not the fact that unintentionally. Everyone? It turns out that workers will receive more engineering and technical personnel? Everyone will have to raise her here. If you raise everyone - the cost of work will skyrocket - after all, we have "unparalleled" equipment, often first of all cheaper than analogues. And if you raise it, you will lose the tender - the market will be given to the one who offers the job to be made cheaper. And he will pay little, hoping that, as always, he will.
  28. Moore
    Moore 18 September 2013 16: 24
    0
    Quote: Old_Kapitan
    When carrying out fire hazardous operations, next to the welded one there MANDATORY is to provide, from among the crew, water-foam and carbon dioxide fire extinguishers, a bucket of water, an IDP hose unwound. Is it really so to blame welded? I'm for a divers to swallow a throat, but ...

    Now the prosecutor’s office is digging up and it suddenly turns out that the work permit for the production of hazardous (electric-fire) work was not written out, the fire station was not set, the welded work was finished, all the others left and left (rather than waiting an hour and a half, as experience suggests). Probably didn’t do any of this. And the commander will be responsible ... And who else? ...
    1. vostok68
      vostok68 18 September 2013 16: 47
      0
      Maybe it will! At my current job, it all happens, the boss is to blame! Such a trend now!
  29. VohaAhov
    VohaAhov 18 September 2013 17: 11
    +1
    Quote: clidon
    Russian welders - American painters "Score 2: 1

    Probably still 3: 1 we have “Yekaterinburg”, “Tomsk” and also “Yantar”
  30. Technologist
    Technologist 18 September 2013 17: 27
    0
    Quote: mmmakm
    And where does it immediately welded? With a welded mask closed, he does not see where the spray is flying. He has all the attention on the seam. But if there is a danger of fire, then a person with a fire extinguisher should be nearby and monitor the situation.

    In any case, they will begin to load the hard worker, the bosses don’t want to fall into Shoig’s arm, but the guilty one will be needed.
  31. Ogogoshka
    Ogogoshka 18 September 2013 18: 14
    +1
    The problem is not in welders, in an integrated approach and as an example:
    a hangar was dismantled at our factory, according to documents it was made of non-combustible materials, and so they decided to cut it with autogenous fuel, it is not combustible, for forty seconds the hangar 75x25 meters burned to the ground.
  32. dizelniy
    dizelniy 18 September 2013 19: 18
    0
    Quote: Vasya

    washi
    (4)

    Today, 15: 30

    ↑ ↓ New


    There are many reasons: Lack of trained workers due to lack of finances at the plant (or their appropriation (taking into account Amer’s funding for the cutting of our boats) only in the USA the boats burn during repair). Drive the loot and everything will be. There is no ideology - there is no state. There is cohabitation. Previously, the workers of the Big Stone were proud of their work. Now they just earn.

    And we are waiting for the fleet in Russia, wait .....
  33. GVARDEETS
    GVARDEETS 18 September 2013 21: 31
    +2
    Now I work at a large enterprise, and I was pleasantly surprised: a "welded" arrived in the shop to carry out work for 15-20 minutes, a guy of 23-25 ​​brought with him 3 fire extinguishers, 2 felt felt, a bucket of water, forced the machine operators to clean everything from oil, dust, brought the brain to the head of the shop for permission to carry out hot work, to my question where they fought for compliance with safety standards, he answered: the former commander of the battalion of one of the airborne divisions, a teacher at a training center hi Pleasantly surprised!