Military Review

KTO Rosomak (part of 1)

15
WTO (wheeled armored personnel carrier) Wolverine


CTO Wolverine during international exercises


CTO Wolverine is the Polish version of the AMV vehicle created by the Finnish company Patria Vehicles Oy. Patria won the tender, which ended in December on 2002 on 690 wheeled armored personnel carriers, beating the competitive Pandur II (Steyr - Daimler - Puch), as well as Piranha IIIC (MOWAG). The name "Wolverine" was chosen as a result of a competition announced in the magazine "New Military Equipment" (Nowa Technika Wojskowa). The combat version of the conveyor has a double Hitfist tower - 30P, developed by Italian Mellar. By agreement, the manufacture of most of the vehicles ordered must be made in Poland. The conveyor production line was set up at the Military Mechanical Plant (WZM) in the town of Siemianowice-ленlsk. The assembly line, and later the production of the towers, went to the enterprise Bumar - Łabędy in Gliwice. At the moment, the program includes a huge number of suppliers of items of equipment or those who are developing specialized versions. By agreement with the manufacturer, the platform being developed is also an improved version of the conveyor, which can be ordered after the delivery of vehicles from the first order is completed.

AMV Transporter






Patria AMV transporter prototype with Delco-25 turret as well as the first two Wolverines (combat and base)


The XC-360 transporter was developed as a successor to the BTR, which has been manufactured since the early eighties, Sisu XA – 180, as well as its varieties. It is interesting that five armored personnel carriers of this type were leased by the Polish army and used by the military contingent on the Golan Heights.

The first tactical and technical requirements for the new transporter appeared in the first half of the nineties, the final version of the requirements was approved in the 1999 year. The main machine had to be of modular construction, and also should have a reduction in the effect of visibility, through limiting heat, noise and a special form of the hull, which reduces radar reflection. When designing, computer equipment, a design program (CAD), is used to a very large extent. The first car model (equipped with an AMOS caliber 120 mm tower with a double-barreled mortar) appeared in 2000-m, in the same year was shown at the Eurosatory exhibition in Paris. The first prototype appeared in November 2001 of the year and was supposed to be used only for testing, but these plans were changed. At that time, the Polish Ministry of Defense announced a tender for the supply of wheeled armored personnel carriers for the Polish army.

Replacement plans for wheeled armored personnel carriers in Poland relate to the second half of the 90, when BTR SKOTs began to be withdrawn from the troops en masse (only service carriers of specialized equipment were left in service). It should be remembered that the first plans also talked about buying a small number of armored personnel carriers, which should have been used only for foreign missions (1998 talked about buying an 180 BTR). During this period, Polish troops participated in operations in the Balkans. It was not planned also at the beginning of the use of heavy weapons on the BTR, they were supposed to be equipped with only machine guns. By the time the tender began, these requirements were changed.





The troop compartment of the early and current Wolverine, the number of seats for the assault force was reduced from 8 to 6, the seats themselves were reinforced, under the seat is also an additional reservation that provides additional security, and seat belts were also added.


20 in May The 2002 transporter reached Poland, where the American Delco tower was supposed to be added (the main weapon is the M25 Bushmaster 242-mm automatic cannon). The reunion took place at the WZM enterprises in Siemianowice-Slask, which initially became a partner of Patrii in the KTO program. Already 22 May in Suleuwek vehicle was presented to representatives of the troops and the press. May 24 passed shooting at the range, with the towers of the OTO Melara HITFIST - 25 and Delco - 25 at the range in Wędrzynie. In total, during tests in Poland, an armored troop-carrier passed 2700 km without damage. The car was delivered to Finland for the installation of propellers and intrinsic. In September, the vehicle was again in Poland, presented at the MSPO 2002 (equipped with the PML 127 OWS unmanned module with an 12,7-mm NSWT). 9-14 September in Suleiuwek, studies have been conducted that relate to the buoyancy of a vehicle with different types of equipment, simulating future weapons. The buoyancy margin at the maximum tested mass of 22 800 kg exceeded the norm by 14,2%. At the end of 2002, the second prototype AMV was completed at the Patrii enterprises. 20 December The 2002 Tender Chamber of the Polish Ministry of Defense decided with the choice of Patria as the supplier of armored wheeled transporters for the Polish Army. The supply contract for 2004-2013, provided for 690 vehicles, was signed on 15 on April 2003.

The car in the Polish configuration, which was previously designated XC - 360P since the signing of the contract no longer existed. The most significant change in the Polish version of the conveyor: the reduction in the car's own weight from 26 tons (in the Finnish configuration) to 21 tons, which made it possible to transport the BTRs with C-130 aircraft. The width of the car was also reduced (on the outer armor of the car in the Polish configuration there is no characteristic bend like on a Finnish car), as well as the re-equipment of the troop compartment with two stern doors instead of a folding hydraulic ramp.





MTO Wolverine Scania DI 12 56A03PE, which consists of the engine, gearbox ZF 7HP 902S Ecomat and the cooling system; Wolverine wheel is equipped with tabs that allow you to continue with shot through tires.


In 2004, the PS - 0 pre-production conveyor was completed and presented, which already had most of the solutions used, which were in the requirements for the Polish version such as: tapered housing. 31 May 2004, the first two transport vehicles for the Polish Army (PL-1 and PL-2) reached Gdini. Then they were transported to enterprises in Siemianowice-Шlленsk, where the installation of the Hitfist single-person tower 30P delivered to Italy on PL-1 armor, as well as general testing and verification of both transporters took place. According to the schedule, 30 June 2004, the solemn transfer of both vehicles to representatives of the troops and the official presentation of the name of their own "Wolverine" took place in Sulejuwek.

The AMV conveyor is a steel beam frame construction. It is mounted on the suspension system and driving. This design provides greater rigidity, as well as easier maintenance of some elements. The power plant of the vehicle is a 6 cylinder, ordinary diesel engine with a Scania DI 12 56A03PE turbocharger with a maximum power of 360 kW (490 hp) at 2100 rpm. Engine displacement 11,7 liters, liquid cooling. It works with the automatic transmission ZF 7HP 902S Ecomat, 7 forward gears and 1 rear, which allows you to reach a maximum speed in excess of 100 km / h. Movement in the water is ensured by two propellers, with a maximum speed of 10 km / year. The exhaust system is equipped with an exhaust cooling system. Fuel capacity is 325 liters.





Successful placement of the winch allows you to use it in both directions; Above the rear doors is the driver’s rear view camera.


The vehicle has eight wheels, 14.00R20, which are derived to a central tire pressure monitoring system. All wheels have an independent suspension, are depreciated through the drives of the hydropneumatic system, allow you to adjust the ground clearance in 200 mm - 250 mm. The suspension travel is 450 mm. The turning radius of the car is 12 meters. Overcoming obstacles: a hill with a slope to 60 hail, maximum lateral tilt to 35 degrees, vertical wall 0,5 m, beards 1,5 m width of the trench 2,1 m.

The Polish version has received a number of domestic solutions, such as the Stopfire fire extinguishing system, the Fonet intercom system, the driver observation device PNK - 72 Radomka, Polish radio stations VHF z Radmoru.

Hitfist Tower - 30P




It was designed by Italian Oto Melarę. Hitfist Tower - 30P is a two-seater turret armed with an ATK Mk 30 Buschmaster II automatic cannon (equipped with an ammunition dual power supply mechanism) and 44-mm machine gun UKM, 7,62C. The design represents the development of the Hitfist tower - 2000, used on the Italian Dardo infantry fighting vehicles. The tower was however significantly modified according to Polish requirements. The biggest change is a significant reduction in height - with the goal of reducing the silhouette of the car so that it becomes possible to transport the aircraft C - 25 Hercules. Interestingly, a tower with a design very close to the Polish one was used on the Italian BTA Centauro VBM Freccia.

The tower is armored, built of aluminum, and also equipped with additional ceramic armor. The armament is controlled by a fire monitoring system equipped with a DNRS-288 day-night sight from Kolsman, a second-generation TILDE FC thermal camera, Galileo Avionica, and a laser range finder. Additional equipment includes a set of sensors of the SSP system - 1 Obra - 3 and also an aerosol launcher (it contains six 81-mm caliber) grenades.





The location of the commander Wolverine, a visible set of periscopes, a SKO console, a Mk 44 dual-powered gun drive in the depths; Gunner's position, visible aiming system with a screen and manipulators, a scope eyepiece, a UKM machine gun - 2000C


The shooter sits on the right side of the machine, there is a SKO console with controllers, as well as a ten-inch screen, a backup (optical) sight and a hand held occasion, which serves to turn the turret in case of power failure in the turret drive motors (azimuth regulating left height). The addition is the front periscope. In front of the shooter there is a system for removing sleeves from the main armament, as well as a machine gun, which he also maintains (reloading and removal, empty tapes).

The commander sits on the left side of the tower. By its disposal has a workplace SKO, as well as a set of periscopes 8, which allow you to familiarize yourself with the situation around the BTR. Periscopes have the ability to hide, so that they do not stick out the contours of the tower (this design forced the requirement of air transport to be put forward). The commander can take over full control over the armament of the car.





The SSP 1-3 Obra exposure warning sensor system and the 81-mm smoke grenade launcher, as well as the main sight "eye" with a thermal imaging camera, optical channel and laser range finder.


Own weight of the tower 2350 kg, but its combat weight 2850 kg. Its height (with hidden periscopes) is 595 mm, rotation in 360 degrees, the declination / elevation angles of the weapon are 10 and + 60 degrees. The stock of 30-mm ammunition ready for use is 220 shells, in addition 250 shells are located in two under the fields under the turret.

In 2010, the Bumar group proposed an increase in the capability of the turret, due to the installation of anti-tank missiles and the addition of an independent panoramic sight to the commander. An alternative option is to equip the subsequent Wolverine Hitfist unmanned tower - the 30 OWS, which is already equipped with anti-tank systems.

Plans


Plans with 2002

In accordance with the initial plans, which are now irrelevant, the plans for the order should have been 690 transport of the following versions:
313 Wolverine and Wolverine - 2 - the main version of the infantry combat vehicle, according to the original plans of the Hitfist towing system - 30P, was to be adapted for use with Spike ATGM - LR, Wolverine - 2; Spike.

125 Pieces Wolverine - 1 - infantry transporter with a 12,7-mm machine gun module.
78 pieces Wolverine WDST - car tactical commander
41 Wolverine WEM - medical evacuation vehicle
34 Wolverine WPT - technical assistance vehicle
32 R1 Wolverine and R2 Wolverine - (8 and 24 transporter, respectively), diagnostic cars, it was first planned to build a shorter version of the Wolverine using 60 × 6, which is now planned to be built on the basis of the reconnaissance version 6 × 8 (8-mm gun).
23 things - artillery car (until the end we know what exactly the weapon of this version should have been) support.
22 stuff - engineering car
17 Pieces - Chemical Intelligence Vehicle
5 Pieces - Engineering Intelligence Car

Plans with 2008 year

In 2008, decisions are made that allow the continuation of an order for an armored personnel carrier Wolverine, as well as an increase in the development of work on specialized options. The initial order for 690 machines can be extended further by 140 cars (later there were reports that the new machines ordered will be based on the improved design of the 2 generation Wolverine). The number of KTO Wolverine vehicles that the motorized battalion will be equipped with has been increased from 75 to 88.

Contract Renewal in 2013

This year, the production of cars from the initial order for the 6 90 Wolverine has come to an end. After adjustment, this number consists of: 359 combat vehicles and 331 special vehicles, (base). In the second half of this year, the agreement between AMP SA and Patria Land Services Oy was revised, which was preceded by an agreement between Patria and the treasury on behalf of the Ministry of Economy.

Based on the agreement, WZM S. A received the right to continue the license for the products and sales of Wolverine for the Armed Forces during 10 years (until 31 December 2023), the Ministry of Defense plans to buy 307 vehicles. Also, Wolverine’s export restrictions were abolished, which allow Wolverine to be sold on the world market and regulate WZM and Patri’s cooperation in this area (the agreement is also for 10 years).

WZM SA received the right to independently design specialized versions, as well as modernize and modify new, as well as previously produced vehicles for the Armed Forces of the Polish Republic, as well as selling them to third markets. This agreement will be valid for 30 years from the date of the last sales, but no later than before the 2052 year.

To be continued ...
Author:
Originator:
http://gdziewojsko.wordpress.com/wozy-bojowe/kto-rosomak/
Articles from this series:
KTO Rosomak (part of 1)
KTO Rosomak (part of 2)
KTO Rosomak (part of 3)
KTO Rosomak (part of 4)
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  1. Akim
    27 August 2013 08: 02 New
    +7
    I should not ask questions - why the text of such a statement. I played the role of a stupid machine translator.
    1. svp67
      svp67 27 August 2013 13: 03 New
      +1
      Quote: Akim
      I played the role of a stupid machine translator.
      That is, a machine translator?
  2. Hey
    Hey 27 August 2013 08: 30 New
    +2
    Highly tall. Catch everything that is intended for him and even more.
    1. Horst78
      Horst78 27 August 2013 12: 24 New
      -1
      So the height strained me, the dream of a blind grenade launcher wassat
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 27 August 2013 13: 03 New
        +5
        And the dream of the infantryman riding in it.
        1. bask
          bask 27 August 2013 18: 33 New
          +2
          Quote: Spade
          And the dream of the infantryman riding in it.

          Yes, Akim, thanks for the article. Yes, a couple of questions, you can ask. repeat
          By topic. All modern armored personnel carriers are almost identical in terms of performance characteristics.
          And most importantly, not only the world's leading corporations design and produce them.
          If the rating is old: (purely personal opinion).
          1.Patria AMV /
          2.Piranha 4.5.
          3. Terrex AV81.82 (developed by the Irish company Timiney Technologia
          4.SEP 6 / 6,8 / 8, (Hagglung Sweden)
          5.Boxer.Germany
          6.Nexter. France.
          7.Pandur.Austria.
          8.GPV SESHA (Pars).
          9.Freccia VBC.
          10.CM-32 Taiwan.

          EVERYTHING IS SO HOPE FOR THE CODE TO COME OUT, BOOMERANG, IT WILL BE NO. 1
          1. Akim
            27 August 2013 18: 46 New
            +3
            Quote: bask
            Yes. Akim, thanks for the article.

            She's not finished yet. The moderator has three more parts.
            And as for the rating ... Let the BTR-4M not perfect, but I would like to see him in the army. To be honest, I'm not interested in ratings. I wonder what the neighbors have and what we have. And while we unfortunately lose both in quality and quantity.
            1. bask
              bask 27 August 2013 19: 22 New
              +3
              Quote: Akim
              I wonder what the neighbors have and what we have.

              Look at the countries. Finland in the late 80s was 90% armed with weapons from the USSR.
              They rushed forward technologically. They created world-class armored personnel carriers.
              And we have one chatter, PR praise of the guarantor, total corruption.
              Yes, even Syria merged su ***** s.
              Quote: Akim
              And while we unfortunately lose both in quality and quantity.

              And in Russia, instead of the modern BTR-90, Rostock, adopted for service, is stamped BTR80 / 80A / 82.
              Without mine protection. Again, all ride on armor.
              1. Akim
                27 August 2013 19: 36 New
                +3
                Quote: bask
                They rushed forward technologically. They created world-class armored personnel carriers.

                These are not my thoughts, this is only a translation, but Finland did not create an AMV from scratch. It is a pity that we do not develop the "Soviet" school, but use only the backlogs.
                1. bask
                  bask 27 August 2013 19: 56 New
                  +2
                  Quote: Akim
                  but Finland did not create AMV from scratch

                  You meant.
                  BTR ,, Pasi ,, HA-180, 6/6. Serially produced in Finland since 1983. Bulk out by company, Patria Vehicles ,,. in the city of Hameenlinna, owned by the corporation ,, Sisu Vehicles ,,.
                  But the creation of this armored personnel carrier was not without technical support, the Germans.
                  BTR 6/6 ,, Fuchs ,,. Armored personnel carrier TPz 1 ,, Fuchs ,, adopted for the arming of the Bundeswehr in 1976. Manufactured by Rheinmetall AG.
                  TTX is almost identical.
                  1. Akim
                    27 August 2013 20: 05 New
                    +2
                    Quote: bask
                    But the creation of this armored personnel carrier was not without technical support, the Germans.

                    Of course, we got technology and experience and then created our own completely.
                  2. bask
                    bask 27 August 2013 20: 15 New
                    +3
                    Quote: Akim
                    It is a pity that we do not develop the "Soviet" school, but use only the backlogs.

                    This is exactly the point.
                    We need our own technologies, but technologists will not take them from scratch. In the 90s and 2000s, defense research institutes lost their strength. Dozens, and hundreds with allies.
                    In Ukraine, the situation is probably the same.
                    Once again, go back to the BTR -90, Rostock ,,. They were given to the Ministry of Defense for the development of performance characteristics, with the aft arrangement of the MTO, they did what they ordered.
                    But it was simply not possible to begin its production without re-equipping the machine-technological park of the Arzam plant.
                    Made a few units and all. Technological dead end. We hung noodles on our ears and started production on the old BTR-80 equipment.
                    And the main question. How on the old equipment are going to mass-produce BTR ,, Boomerang ,,.
                  3. bask
                    bask 27 August 2013 20: 55 New
                    0
                    _______________________________
                    BTR VAB 4 / 4,6 / 6. France.
                    It has been developed since the beginning of the 70s by French companies, on the instructions of the French Ministry of Defense. Companies, Panar, ,, Saviem, Renault,. Prototypes were developed, which received the designation VAB - front-line armored vehicle. In 1974, the company was won by Renault. The first production model entered the ground forces of France in 1976.
                2. smiths xnumx
                  smiths xnumx 27 August 2013 20: 13 New
                  +1
                  Dear Akim, in July 1990, two BTR-80s were acquired by Finland for testing. The Finns were just looking for new "armored horses" instead of the obsolete BTR-60 for their jaeger brigades. "Eighty" from this point of view was quite nice. The second test participant was to become the Sisu SA-1983 armored personnel carrier manufactured from 150 on the basis of the Sisu SA-180 commercial truck, nicknamed Pasi (from Fin. Panssaroitu Sisu - "armored Sisu".

                  BTR-80 in tests in Finland
                  Comparative tests of the BTR-80 and XA-180 revealed the following:
                  - cars have an equivalent reservation;
                  - XA-180 is more capacious, comfortable and has a higher maximum speed on the highway;
                  - BTR-80 but faster on the ground, much better equipped (14,5-mm and 7,62-mm machine guns mounted in the tower against the mounted on the turret 12,7-mm or 7,62-mm machine guns), and most importantly - much cheaper!
                  Preference was given to the BTR-80. The Finns have already begun negotiations with the Soviet side on the acquisition of a large batch of BTR-80, when the Soviet Union collapsed. Then, in its former territory, it began to happen such that, despite all the assurances of the Russian representatives about the guaranteed supply of armored personnel carriers and spare parts for them, the Finns scored a bolt on the BTR-80, leaving only a couple of “eighties”. These two vehicles served in Suomi until 2007, when one of them went to scrap, and the second to the Parol tank museum. Best regards! hi
                  BTR-80 at the Finnish Tank Museum in Parola
                  1. Akim
                    27 August 2013 20: 31 New
                    +1
                    Quote: smiths xnumx
                    BTR-80 but faster on the ground, much better armed (

                    It does not seem that the Finns soared because of the machine gun. In any case, priority would be for their domestic machine. A large party for the Finns is a convention. In ten years, they acquired no more than a hundred new armored personnel carriers - despite the fact that abroad, under a license, they collected or sold more than a thousand. And if the Polish Wolverine wins a tender in India, there will be many more. And the US marines are also running around Patria’s chassis.
                    1. smiths xnumx
                      smiths xnumx 27 August 2013 21: 13 New
                      0
                      In 1982, Finland underwent comparative tests of 6x6 wheeled armored personnel carriers SISU HA-180 and Valmet 1912-6,
                      prototype Valmet 1912-6

                      intended to replace the BTR-60PB, which was in service with the Finnish army. Based on the results of the armament tests, an SISU company armored personnel carrier was adopted. One of the decisive factors in his favor was the widespread use in the construction of components and assemblies of the SA150 4x4 Masi truck, which was also designed by SISU and used in the Finnish armed forces. Serial production of the BTR XA-180 began in 1983. The first order was 50 vehicles for the self-defense forces and another nine for the Finnish UN contingent. The first XA-180s for the UN were delivered in August 1984, mass production in the interests of the army began on November 23, 1984. After that, mass production and supplies of the XA-180 continued, reaching 400 aircraft in 1994. In July 1990, Finland arrived two armored personnel carriers 80, purchased for testing, the purpose of which was to test them as new machines for equipping fighter brigades and subsequent large orders. But for a number of reasons, and mainly because of the uncertainty caused by the collapse of the USSR, the purchases of BTR-80 were refused in favor of additional deliveries of the BA HA-180. Armored personnel carriers are not used by armored forces, they are assigned only to fighter brigades.
                      http://www.xliby.ru/transport_i_aviacija/tehnika_i_vooruzhenie_1999_01/p11.php
                      Yours! hi
                      BTR XA-180SA. 1989 year
                  2. bask
                    bask 27 August 2013 21: 21 New
                    0
                    Quote: smiths xnumx
                    manufactured since 1983 by the Sisu company on the basis of the Sisu SA-150 commercial truck, the XA-180 armored personnel carrier (6x6), nicknamed Pasi (from the Finnish panssaroitu Sisu - "armored Sisu".

                    Infa taken. [Media = http: //u-96.livejournal.com/3103964.html]
                    ,, We continue last year’s walk around the second pavilion of the Tank Museum in Parola. ,,.
                    BTR 6/6 XA-180 ,,, Pasi ,,. Created by Sisu. Uses components and assemblies of a Sisu SA-150 commercial truck. Batch production of the XA-180 armored personnel carrier began in 1983. WITH
                    1983, a total of about 1000 armored personnel carriers were produced.
                    Best regards hi
                    1. smiths xnumx
                      smiths xnumx 27 August 2013 21: 37 New
                      0
                      I absolutely agree with you, the respected boatswain u_96 in his livejournal, if you know him, give him my deepest bow, I always read him with great interest, I consider him one of the best. Especially photo reports (Parola, Kubinka, the museum of Vadim Zadorozhny, etc.). I apologize for using the data from his LiveJournal, simply in “technology and armaments,” this drama is not described so lively and with interest. Yours faithfully! hi
                      1. bask
                        bask 27 August 2013 22: 05 New
                        0
                        Unfortunately with
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        boatswain u_96 in his livejournal,
                        I don’t know. But I absolutely agree with you, it is written professionally and without unnecessary ,, water ,,. Thanks for the information provided ...
                        Best regards hi
  3. 128mgb
    128mgb 27 August 2013 08: 32 New
    +1
    And how tall is he? Three meters no less. Visible to contactless combat.
  4. tupolev-95
    tupolev-95 27 August 2013 09: 23 New
    +4
    Another barn for intimidating Aboriginal people from a distance. It’s difficult to sniff.
  5. solomon
    solomon 27 August 2013 10: 50 New
    +2
    KTO Rosomak (Armored Wheeled Conveyor - Wolverine)
    Length, mm: 7770
    Width, mm: 2830
    Height, mm: 2360-2990
  6. washi
    washi 27 August 2013 12: 33 New
    +1
    Not for our area, full of speeches and lack of roads. Although for the Baltic states (which the Poles should defend against us) will do. Even a rear-view camera is useful (because you need to see how much it came off).
    Height, mm: 2360-2990 is most likely without a tower. (if we correlate the growth of the fighter and the height of the car in the first photo)
    1. Akim
      27 August 2013 12: 54 New
      +1
      Quote: Vasya
      Although for the Baltic states (which the Poles should defend against us) will go

      Of course, the Poles consider Russia a likely adversary, but not so much as to fit in with the Baltic states.
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 27 August 2013 13: 02 New
        +2
        Quote: Akim
        but not enough to fit in with the Baltic states.

        That's right. Moreover, strongly disagree. Thank you for the article.
  7. vomag
    vomag 27 August 2013 13: 08 New
    0
    I agree that it’s a little tall !! but on the whole it’s not bad that leaves a pleasant impression, this is what pleased me (as well as the re-equipment of the landing compartment with two aft doors instead of a folding hydraulic ramp.) And this is a curtsy towards our design school. something tells me that our developments will also be about this size; I don’t know if it’s a fashion trend or objective reality request
    1. Akim
      27 August 2013 13: 26 New
      +1
      Quote: vomag
      then it tells me that our developments will also be about this size

      Well, if you start from the length of the barrel 2A42 - 2400 - this 3D model looks generally a giant.
      1. Ka-52
        Ka-52 27 August 2013 15: 05 New
        +1
        Well, I hope that this is only a 3D model that does not coincide with reality ...
        Otherwise belay , such faces will be for everyone laughing
      2. bask
        bask 27 August 2013 21: 53 New
        0
        Quote: Akim
        Well, if you start from the length of the barrel 2A42 - 2400 - this 3D model looks generally a giant

        Despite the fact that the Poles received a licensed license. BTR Patria AMV (Rosomak).
        They designed and released their own armored personnel carrier.
        BTR ,, Hippo ,, company developer - AMZ Kunto Sp.
        The BTR was on display at the last MSPO show in September 2012.
        The mass of the armored personnel carrier without additional armor is 21 tons. Carrying capacity of 5 tons (seaworthiness up to 26 tons. The maximum with additional swearing is 36 tons.
        The developers claim that the new armored personnel carrier is suitable for engineering intelligence.
        And still, first of all, the Polish Ministry of Defense wants to support a local producer.
        1. Akim
          27 August 2013 22: 05 New
          +1
          Quote: bask
          And still, first of all, the Polish Ministry of Defense wants to support a local producer.

          It is a little for other purposes. I already wrote about him here.
          http://topwar.ru/24019-oh-nelegkaya-eto-rabota-begemota-taschit-iz-bolota.html
  8. Starover_Z
    Starover_Z 27 August 2013 14: 56 New
    0
    version of the requirements approved in 1999. The main machine had to be of a modular design, and also had to reduce the effect of visibility,

    Yeah, completely invisible - under 3 meters laughing
    Quote: Spade
    And the dream of the infantryman riding in it.

    Rather, the nostalgia of a platoon of infantrymen on minibuses laughing
    Laughter, laughter, but alas, a fee for a wheeled version of the device and booking the bottom.
    The target turned out to be more growth. Not, "We will go the other way!"
  9. smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 27 August 2013 15: 08 New
    +3
    But what a very good machine, it should be noted that the Poles back in the time of the Warsaw Pact made quite good OT-64 SKOT armored personnel carriers, which are still part of the armies of the Czech Republic, Slovakia and Poland. Also, the OT-64 armored personnel carriers were purchased: Algeria, Egypt, India, Iraq, Morroco, Sudan and other Asian and African countries. In total, about 4500 armored vehicles were produced. At the same time, the Czech company Tatra was responsible for the development of the chassis, and the Polish FSC for the development of the armored hull. Serial production of the BTR OT-64, which received the name Obrněný Transportér, began in 1963. OT-64 was the first of the armored personnel carriers in the Soviet zone of influence to have a rear exit through two doors, as in the BMP-1 created later. In terms of technology, the OT-64 was far ahead of its counterpart, the Soviet BTR-60. The OT-64 was equipped with one diesel engine (taken from the Tatra 138), unlike the two gasoline engines in the BTR-60, which greatly simplified the design and reduced fuel consumption. The block heads were air-cooled aluminum, so the weight of the unit was significantly lower. The thickness of the armor, in turn, reached 13mm compared to 4-6mm for the BTR-60.

    BTR OT-64, rear view

    Yours! hi
  10. stoqn477
    stoqn477 27 August 2013 18: 08 New
    +1
    I do not understand why you are laughing at foreign technology? Were armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles, how low was something safer? Hardly. I think that everything we saw is soldiers who are standing on top of the car, hoping that if something hit the car in order to survive. Let's deny something alien, compare it with what you have. Soldiers who are unlikely to laugh at them.
    1. smiths xnumx
      smiths xnumx 27 August 2013 19: 42 New
      +1
      Dear Stoyan Ivanov, currently the Bulgarian army has 150 armored personnel carriers BTR-60PB-MD-1 modernized in Bulgaria with an engine from CUMMINS. 8 smoke grenade launchers are installed on the tower with KPVT and PKTM machine guns. Instead of the old sight, a more modern one with improved characteristics is installed. For convenience of entry and exit of the landing, the doors are cut through the sides.

      But the true breakthroughs of the Bulgarian military-industrial complex was the creation of its own BMP-BMP-23, created by the Bulgarian defense industry on the chassis of the MT-LB armored personnel carrier and the 2C1 Gvozdika self-propelled guns based on it, produced under license in Bulgaria. During mass production, 115 BMP-23s were produced. BMP-23 is significantly different from BMP-1 and is more similar to BMP-2. The hull is designed on the basis of the car body 2C1 "Carnation", but with thicker armor and a more powerful diesel engine. "Carnation" is a larger vehicle than the BMP-1, and therefore inside it is not as crowded as in the BMP-1. Cast steel armor that can withstand heavy machine gun fire. The tower is armed with a 23 mm cannon and two or four 9M111 Bassoon or 9M113 Competition missiles.

      There is a variant of BMP-30 - a variant of BMP, characterized by the installation of a tower from the Soviet BMP-2 with a 30-mm gun 2A42 and ATGM 9M111 Fagot.

      Yours! hi
      1. stoqn477
        stoqn477 27 August 2013 23: 35 New
        0
        There is no problem in what we have in service. For me, the problem is that people still insist that the BMP or the APC is slightly lower, this will help. Sorry, but if the armor is thin, like paper, it won’t save it, if it’s a meter high. This will not save her from a meeting with an RPG.
        The BMP-30 variant is not produced at all. I think there was no market for it. For our army, I think they left a cheaper version with a 23 mm gun.
  11. alert_timka
    alert_timka 27 August 2013 18: 29 New
    0
    Quote: stoqn477
    I do not understand why you are laughing at foreign technology? Were armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles, how low was something safer? Hardly. I think that everything we saw is soldiers who are standing on top of the car, hoping that if something hit the car in order to survive. Let's deny something alien, compare it with what you have. Soldiers who are unlikely to laugh at them.

    That's for sure. YouTube videos in Syria have shown that the machine’s height is not an obstacle for grenade launchers. From 200 meters they fall in low BMP silhouettes, and as a rule they don’t shoot at large distances. The article states that this device floats well and showed good buoyancy with a mass of 20 tons. so what problems did some commentators see when arguing about rivers?
  12. wei
    wei 27 August 2013 21: 46 New
    0
    Author - Akim Translation
    and you are a noble Troll old man lol
    provided by two propellers, with a maximum speed of 10 km / year

    1,5 m beards

    You do not have a high opinion of its seaworthiness or rather buoyancy laughing
    1. Akim
      27 August 2013 22: 01 New
      0
      Quote: wei
      and you are a noble Troll old man

      Oh, how strict you are. I gave a link to the original. You can, since you are a Thomas unbeliever, send it through an interpreter and read it if you understand all this nonsense - because Google is “FAST” translating.
      I repeat for those who are in an armored train. I just TRANSLATED! To judge his seaworthiness - you need to see him live. For the Poles, he did not replace the BWP-1 for the Marines. They are waiting for the combat version of "Hippo". He can be shown at the exhibition this year.
      1. bask
        bask 27 August 2013 22: 29 New
        0
        Quote: Akim
        To judge his seaworthiness

        Seaworthiness is not bad. The need for the marines will increase the US.
        In the Patria AMV commercial. test for the UAE with the Russian module ,, triad ,,,
        Does Patria have a license to use the Russian combat module? Who has info ..?
        1. Akim
          27 August 2013 22: 41 New
          0
          Quote: bask
          Is there a license for Patria to use the Russian combat module? Who has info ..?

          This is not a question for Patria. The tower is supplied by the Russian side at the request of the customer. The Finns are the chassis, though elongated.
  13. smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 27 August 2013 22: 46 New
    0
    So the UAE army announced the need to purchase 700 heavy wheeled armored personnel carriers with the 8x8 formula. In this case, the best chance of purchase are VBCI armored vehicles from the French company Nexter.

    VBCI has already been tested in military operations in Afghanistan, Lebanon and recently in Mali, where it has shown itself flawlessly, both in terms of protection, mobility and endurance (the transition from Dakar to northern Mali was carried out in record time). However, the UAE army presented the condition of equipping the VBCI with a combat module from the Russian BMP-3. It is also highly effective and well tested in the UAE.

    Since the BMP-3 turret is much heavier than the original French combat modules, it took the job of adapting the vehicle to the Russian weapons complex. Corps VBCI received the corresponding gain. In general, representatives of Nexter expressed their confidence in the feasibility of this project and presented a model of a modernized combat vehicle.

    The only considered competitor in the UAE VBCI is considered the Finnish combat vehicle Patria AMV. However, Nexter managed to make a more competitive offer, while the Finns did not show much activity in promoting their BTR. In the case of a successful conclusion of a contract with Nexter, the Russian Federation will also receive significant benefits. At the same time there are two ways of mutually beneficial cooperation. The first is the sale of the Nexter license for the BMP-3 combat module, which our developers and manufacturers are unlikely to agree on in other matters, the second is the direct participation in production with the cooperation with Nexter.

    http://www.military-informant.com/index.php/army/2577-vbci-ifv-100mm.html


    VBCI model with a combat module from BMP-3 at the NEXTER stand Regards! hi
  14. Kir
    Kir 27 August 2013 23: 22 New
    0
    Thank you to the translator and put, not one but many Pros !!! and the question does not own the Finnish case, since Wolverine has Finnish roots, and can it turn into a Wolverine? or in Russia, the word was Russified, by the way, and the translation of the word (it wasn’t immediately found), but it seems to be walking along the hills, and for a floating armored car more than suitable, I mean the beast itself with its transcendent survival capabilities.
    1. Akim
      28 August 2013 07: 10 New
      0
      Quote: Kir
      and the question does not own the Finnish case, t

      That's what is not, is not. English, spanish, polish. A little french and italian. And I understand almost all Slavic languages.
      In general, I was afraid on a Russian site to give a translation of a Polish article. I thought the reaction would be completely different, even on the technical side.