Military Review

By rail with a breeze

54
Despite the observed stagnation in the economy, the political leadership of the country offers new expensive and large-scale projects. So the president has already agreed with the plans to build a network of high-speed railways. Earlier, Russians have heard more than once about various special state programs for the development of Siberia and the Far East, the tourism cluster in the Caucasus, the holding of the Olympic Games in Sochi, and other sports competitions. Each of these undertakings is estimated at billions and even trillions of rubles. Projects implemented in Russia are often struck by the high cost of implementation and the associated scale of abuse and theft. At the same time, the country's leadership offers all new initiatives.


May 27 Vladimir Putin held a meeting in Sochi, which was dedicated to the construction of high-speed railways. The head of the Russian Railways, Vladimir Yakunin, proposed in the near future to build in our country almost 7 thousand kilometers of roads with a speed of more than 140 km / h and more 4 thousand kilometers of roads with a speed of more than 200 km / h. The primary task is to connect the high-speed highway Moscow and Kazan. The price of the issue is almost 1 trillion. rubles. According to the head of the Russian Railways, the implementation of this project can give a serious impetus to the country's economy. First of all, it will allow residents of the province to travel to the capital to earn money.

The construction of high-speed highways looks quite reasonable, if we consider that according to the results of 2012, the average commercial speed of freight trains in Russia was 9,1 km / h. This is not only several times lower than in the world's largest economies, but also lower than the speed of movement of experienced cyclists. At the same time every year the situation only gets worse, and the low speed of movement of freight trains can put an end to plans to turn our country into a bridge between Asia and Europe.

Even in their best years, the “freight train” went on the Russian railway at a speed of no more than 11,6 km / h or 280 km. per day, which is significantly inferior to the speed indicators of other major economies of the world. So in Germany and China, the average train speed is 50-60 km / h, in the USA it is about 45 km / h. According to Anatoly Fedorenko, who holds the post of head of the department of logistics infrastructure management at HSE, the share of transportation costs in the final cost of products in Russia is 20%, while the world average is 9-10% and in China - 13 %

By the end of last year, the speed of freight trains in Russia has fallen below that of 40 years ago. In 1970-s, the average commodity composition went at a speed of 229 km per day, whereas in 2012, this figure was only 219 km. The industry has demonstrated its worst results in 1980-1990s. So, for example, in 1997, the average commercial speed of the “freight train” (this time included not just travel time, but also the cost of loading, unloading and parking the train) was 8,3 km / h. In the 2000-s, these figures increased, but since 2010, they began to decline again.

For this reason, there is nothing strange in the construction of new high-speed railways, it can only be welcomed. Today, many developed countries follow the same path. In his report, Yakunin referred precisely to international experience. In the People's Republic of China, France, Japan, high-speed highways connect large industrial centers. At the same time, in Russia, most of the roads should link the capital, in which there is a redistribution of profits from the sale of natural raw materials, with regional centers that are not in the best economic situation. And the cost of travel on existing trains to St. Petersburg and Nizhny Novgorod is significantly higher than in Europe and China, so it’s too early to talk about new branches as an accessible type of transport.

On the whole, Putin supported the idea of ​​the Russian Railways to build a high-speed transport network, proposing to work out a direction from Moscow to Rostov-on-Don and Adler. Travel time on this route could be reduced to 8 hours. According to the president, this direction is quite in demand, even despite its seasonal nature, although it is planned to make a year-round resort center out of Sochi. In any case, the priority at this time is the direction of the Urals. The priority task is to build a road from Moscow to Kazan, which should go through 5 subjects of the country, including the city of Vladimir, Cheboksary and Nizhny Novgorod, said the head of the Ministry of Transport of Russia Maxim Sokolov.

This direction is particularly promising in the light of further work on the continuation of the high-speed highway to Yekaterinburg, Chelyabinsk, and further towards China, said First Vice-President of Russian Railways Alexander Misharin. At present, China is considering the possibility of creating a high-speed railway line from Beijing to London. At the same time, there is an 2 construction option - through the territory of the Russian Federation or bypassing it.

Pilot project

By the beginning of the World Cup 2018 of the year, which will be held in Russia, it is planned to build a pilot section of the high-speed Moscow-Kazan railway, which trains will travel at a speed of 350 – 400 km / h. As a result, travel time can be reduced from about 11,5 to 3,5 hours. According to Yakunin, the construction of this highway requires 928 billion rubles, or 1,16 billion rubles for each kilometer of the road. At the same time, according to the Minister of Transport, this amount can be adjusted depending on inflation and project documentation.

The government is ready to share the financial risks of implementing a pilot project with investors. The state is ready to invest 70% of investments in infrastructure development, while the 30% business is to develop a super-infrastructure, i.e. trains, all the arrangements that are there, said Vladimir Yakunin. Proceeding from this, the state grand will amount to 650 billion rubles, and at the operation stage a state subsidy of 315 billion rubles will also be required for 4's years. With the construction of this line, the domestic business can count on receiving orders for construction - 270 billion rubles and equipment - 100 billion rubles.

According to Yakunin’s calculations, Russia's revenues less expenses are estimated at 5,3 trillion. rubles, annual budget revenue - 6,88%. According to Yakunin, the high-speed highway (VSM) is a completely new technology for our country, so a preferential taxation can be introduced for it - resetting the VAT and optimizing the property tax. Such measures could increase the profitability of the project.

In the future, high-speed trains “Lastochka” and “Sapsan” will go from Moscow to Sochi and Yekaterinburg. Line Moscow - Ekaterinburg should be ready for the 2020 year. Its length will be 1,5 thousand km, and the total amount of construction in the spring of the year 2012 was estimated at 1,5 trillion. rubles, i.e. approximately 1 billion rubles per kilometer. However, earlier estimates amounted to 2,24 trillion. rubles, so that JSC "Russian Railways" still managed to reduce the cost of construction.

In addition, the construction of the Moscow-Kazan high-speed railway with a length of 800 km may be cheaper than a similar Spanish road. Creating a railway line from Barcelona to the French border, which is 7 times less than the length of the track (131 km) cost 3,7 billion euros or 149 billion rubles. Currently, immediately 2 of the country's largest banks: Sberbank and VTB have already confirmed their interest in participating in the construction of high-speed rail lines, the head of the Ministry of Transport said. However, it’s still early on the choice of participants. First you need to prepare all the project documentation for the project and its financial model. According to Vladimir Yakunin, the preparation of project documentation will take at least 8 months.

Estimated Fare

Ticket prices for high-speed highways in the south of Russia and in the Volga region should be affordable “for the overwhelming majority of citizens,” Vladimir Putin said during a meeting in Sochi. In turn, the head of the Russian Railways said that the fare for passengers on the new high-speed highways will be in the range from 1 to 10 rubles per kilometer, depending on the route and class of cars.

If we take into account these figures, the cost of a ticket on a pilot route from Moscow to Kazan, the length of which is 800 km., Will have to be from 800 to 8 000 rubles. At the same time, the Russian president noted that the development of high-speed rail traffic should be accompanied by significant investments in transportation security, including technological, fire and anti-terrorism security.

Plans before 2030 year

The head of the Russian Railways proposed to build an 2030 km in the country for 6922 in the year. lines of highways and 4253 km. high-speed lines. According to Vladimir Yakunin, if these projects can be implemented, the 100 million inhabitants of Russia will live in the area covered by the high-speed railway network. In 2012, the interdepartmental working group developed a plan for the development of high-speed rail traffic, which is expected to launch the high-speed Moscow-St. Petersburg highway by 2017. With its launch, the train will cover the distance between the two capitals in 2,5 hours, developing in some sections a maximum speed of up to 400 km / h. The projected traffic volume on this line will be more than 14 million people per year. The cost of construction of this railway line is 696,2 billion rubles.

In addition, according to the plan, it is recommended to develop railway communication in Russia at a speed of up to 2020-160 km / h on routes: Moscow-Minsk (to Red, with extension to Warsaw and Berlin), Moscow-Kharkov-Adler, Moscow-Yaroslavl , Moscow - Kiev (to Suzemka) and Omsk - Novosibirsk.

In the next decade (before 2030), it is planned to significantly accelerate the movement of passenger trains to 350-400 km / h from Moscow to Minsk, with extensions to Warsaw and Berlin, from Kazan to Samara and from Moscow to Kiev. Also, up to 2030, it is planned to link high-speed highways (up to 160-200 km / h) from Saratov, Yekaterinburg from Chelyabinsk, Saratov from Samara and Volgograd, Samara from Saransk and Penza, Novosibirsk to Krasnoyarsk, Barnaul, Kemerovo and Novokuznetsk , Khabarovsk - with Vladivostok.

Currently, there are only 3 high-speed rail lines in Russia: Moscow - St. Petersburg, St. Petersburg - Helsinki and Nizhny Novgorod - Moscow. According to Vladimir Putin, the passenger traffic on them constantly increased, and there was no doubt about the effectiveness of this type of transport. At the same time, many experts recognize that the transport system is far from the only problematic branch of the Russian economy. It is necessary to build new high-speed railways, but not to the detriment of other problematic industries.

Information sources:
-http: //svpressa.ru/society/article/68661
-http: //www.vz.ru/economy/2013/5/27/634513.html
-http: //lenta.ru/articles/2013/02/01/trains
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  1. Denis
    Denis 30 May 2013 07: 56 New
    +8
    Will the condition of the paths allow?
    It was said that even after the high-speed ER-200 of the Moscow-Peter walked crews, the brigades of the trackers tightened the nuts
    Ways that were not calculated at such speeds, will you have to put new ones?
    1. Vladimirets
      Vladimirets 30 May 2013 09: 18 New
      +4
      Quote: Denis
      Will the condition of the paths allow?
      It was said that even after the high-speed ER-200 of the Moscow-Peter walked crews, the brigades of the trackers tightened the nuts
      Ways that were not calculated at such speeds, will you have to put new ones?

      Will not allow it. And now the advertised "Peregrine Falcon" in many areas lugs with great speed limits. Moreover, the track crews are reduced. Most of all, the overlap is blocked 4 times a day by moving 20 minutes before the passage of the masterpiece, there are ambulances and fires. Moreover, there are rumors that instead of building tunnels or overpasses they just want to close part of the crossings.
      1. Egoza
        Egoza 30 May 2013 10: 05 New
        +3
        Quote: Vladimirets
        the advertised "Peregrine Falcon" in many areas lugs with great speed limits.

        Oh guys! Everything is relative. We bought "Huh .. Huh ... indai" from us, so they generally stand in the way for 4 hours. Moreover, the battery lasts only minutes on the 15-20. Accordingly, there is no heating, no light, no water, and you can’t get out - the doors do not open! That frost prevented, now the heat is in the way. And the cost of tickets is going through the roof. And for late arrivals passengers do not want to pay compensation. With a creak, with a creak ... like that train. So rejoice in the "minor" troubles.
        1. fzr1000
          fzr1000 30 May 2013 10: 59 New
          +1
          Is it a train or a bus? And where does this happen?
          1. Andrey_K
            Andrey_K 30 May 2013 12: 06 New
            +2
            In Ukraine, of course.
            Again, they showed off at us - they bought Korean - and they are poorly adapted to our weather.
            1. Evrepid
              Evrepid 31 May 2013 13: 38 New
              0
              In the yellow forums about this are strong abuse. What is good in Ukrzaliznitsa is bad, the conditions of rolling stock of the Russian Federation and Ukraine are compared.

              In Russia, another hope is now that the high-speed passenger train EP20 runs in the directions of Peter, Adler, Voronezh, Rostov and others.
              It seems they plan to start towards Kiev.
              This is what this car looks like at speeds of 160 and 200:
              [img] http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/ЭП20-001.jpg?uselang=r

              u [/ img]
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. Evrepid
              Evrepid 31 May 2013 13: 45 New
              0
              In the Russian Federation, such a high-speed locomotive runs in the directions of Peter, Adler, Rostov, Voronezh and others. Speeds 160 and 200:
              EP 20 on the tracks near the plantEP 20 on the tracks near the plant
        2. Akim
          Akim 30 May 2013 11: 58 New
          +1
          Quote: Egoza
          Oh guys! Everything is relative.

          Elena, I traveled on Itersiti trains. Hyundai from Kiev to Donetsk and on a two-story Skoda from Donetsk to Dnepropetrovsk - in April. Maybe I was lucky, but nothing broke, everything worked properly. He went in, sat down and drove off. Convenient, fast - really expensive. If not for the 50% discount, the price bites. But they say in Russia more expensive. Who drove the Sapsan respond.
          1. Egoza
            Egoza 30 May 2013 12: 16 New
            +4
            Quote: Akim
            Maybe I was lucky, but nothing broke

            I sincerely wish you to continue to be lucky. Just here is the info from May 21:
            Not in the field, so in the forest: the "high-speed" Hyundai broke again
            May 21 2013
            High-speed train Hyundai Kiev - Dnepropetrovsk yesterday got stuck in a forest near the station Pyatikhatki.
            This was told by one of the passengers of the train. Hyundai left Kiev in 6: 57 and was supposed to arrive in Dnepropetrovsk in 12: 10.
            Not far from Pyatikhatki station, the train broke down. The official version for passengers is "something fell on the roof of the train and broke wires." An unplanned stop took 1 hours and 10 minutes.
            During the breakdown, the toilets and air conditioners did not work due to lack of electricity - there were enough batteries for 10 minutes. Almost all the exit doors were locked, only three doors worked, in front of which crowded people. Windows were impossible to open.
            http://www.depo.ua/ru/rynki/transport/ne-v-pole_-tak-v-lesu-skorostnoi-hyundai-s
            nova-slomalsja.htm
            XXXX
            I mean, it would be better to produce our own, especially since there is still a base.
            1. Akim
              Akim 30 May 2013 12: 28 New
              +1
              Quote: Egoza
              I mean, it would be better to produce our own, especially since there is still a base.

              Azarov gave the order on May 15 to buy two Kryukovsky high-speed trains. It is a pity that so far there is no such train between Donetsk and Odessa. On our roads and bus for 14 hours - unpleasant.
            2. MG42
              MG42 30 May 2013 13: 55 New
              +2
              Quote: Egoza
              "fast" Hyundai broke again

              Hyundai company officially announced the causes of frequent breakdowns. The trains that Ukrainians traveled for two months and whose delays suffered hundreds of people, it turns out - unfinished. And subject to additional technical intervention. Despite this, many complaints from the Koreans were voiced in the direction of the Ukrainian customer. TSN release for December 27, 2012
              Ukrainian-language video
          2. FATEMOGAN
            FATEMOGAN 30 May 2013 14: 45 New
            +1
            Quote: Akim
            But they say in Russia more expensive. Who drove the Sapsan respond.


            Direction Business class Economy class
            Moscow - St. Petersburg 4198 - 6507 rubles. 2323 - 3483 rub.
            Moscow - Nizhny Novgorod 3421 - 4648 rubles. 1082 - 1623 rub.

            Maybe not cheap, but not super expensive either, personally, an acceptable price for me, an airplane will be more expensive for anyone, so the development of high-speed trains in Russia is unambiguous - YES !!!
            and why in Ukraine. tickets for the people?
            1. Akim
              Akim 30 May 2013 15: 16 New
              +1
              Quote: FATEMOGAN
              and why in Ukraine. tickets for the people?

              The longest route from the train Kiev-Donetsk. Price: 1 class 539 hryvnia
              2 class 388 hryvnia (1552 rubles). This is basic. Thursday, Saturday 10% cheaper Friday, Sunday more expensive. If it does not break, it is a pleasure to ride. Especially sartir is super! To go from Kiev by bus - 11 hours, this train is six and a half. The price of the bus is 230-250 UAH.
              PS In general, I liked riding a two-story Skoda more. That would be more trains.
          3. Hauptmann emil
            Hauptmann emil 30 May 2013 20: 56 New
            0
            “Peregrine Falcon” in my opinion has one main advantage - speed. I very often went to Moscow on a business trip. It was easier for me to ride the Express or the Red Arrow. Come sleepy, comfortable, fast. A "Peregrine Falcon" for those who want to "ride" one day. It’s bad that you don’t smoke all the way. True, from June 1 and in other trains will not smoke.
          4. nerd.su
            nerd.su 31 May 2013 00: 25 New
            0
            Quote: Akim
            Who drove the Sapsan respond

            The cost of the Peregrine Falcon is commensurate with the cost of air tickets. The only plus: you arrive in the center of Moscow or St. Petersburg, you do not need to get to the airport first, and then get out and wait in the drive.
      2. postman
        postman 30 May 2013 14: 09 New
        +2
        Quote: Vladimirets
        Will not allow it. And now the advertised "Peregrine Falcon" lurks in many areas

        And not only the "broken-down" paths.
        1. we have joints (in Germany are spiritless)
        2. Noise vibration load
        3. Security at driveways and surrounding areas.
        4. The safety of the staff (I have never heard that they would throw stones at ICE in Germany)
        To understand the staged nature of the declared achievements, it is enough to see the allegro fare (every day, a curse on level crossings and for passing / oncoming trains)
        In July, the Russian government may decide on a financial source for solving the most acute problem associated with a large number of single-level railway crossings on high-speed trains of the Sapsan type. Half-hour overlap of crossings at the approach of “Sapsan” is dictated by the regulations of high-speed traffic. The result is huge traffic jams.
        14 relocations are planned for closure in the near future, and 18 are already closed.
        It looks very strange i.e. by the next summer season, more trains will be brought in and our direction will remain completely without electric trains, but with Allegro, and with 40 minute crossing crossings.
        Personally, my railroad tracks pass quite close to the house, 800 meters with a forest belt, my friends and I are shaking when trains are running, when there are freight trains, a sideboard jumps in the house, the tracks were shifted a year ago, shaking became much more


        Transfer between Sandy and Beloostrov.
        The crossing closes 15-20 minutes before the passage of the Allegro train
        From Levashovo From Beloostrov

        6:55 _____ ______ 10:09

        11:40 ___________ 14:09

        15:40 _____ _______ 19:09

        20:40 ______ _______ 23:03
        1. FATEMOGAN
          FATEMOGAN 30 May 2013 14: 50 New
          +2
          Quote: Postman
          in order to understand the staged nature of the declared achievements, it is enough to see the allegro fare (every day, a curse on level crossings and for passing / oncoming trains)

          According to the normal for all these super trains, you need your own track, separate, so that they could accelerate, and they shouldn’t interfere with others, as I understood from the article, they are going to do so that before St. Petersburg, there will be a separate, high-speed before Kazan branch.
          1. postman
            postman 30 May 2013 15: 08 New
            0
            Quote: FATEMOGAN
            Normal for all these super trains you need your own track

            In Germany, they go on the same track (the experience of "riding" on ICE, TVG, Thalys, Pendolino for more than 10 years)
            the whole thing:
            1. The "density" of railways
            Germany: 117.59 km / per 1000km2 ,Russia : 5.1
            km / per 1000km2

            23 (!) Times more . WE AFTER UGANDA AND IRAQ, slightly ahead of Egypt .....
            However, here is even more clear:
            http://ru.worldstat.info/World/List_of_countries_by_Density_of_railways
            2. the path itself (rut)
            3. The adjacent infrastructure
            1. common man
              common man 30 May 2013 19: 56 New
              +2
              Quote: Postman
              1. The "density" of railways
              Germany: 117.59 km / per 1000 km2, Russia: 5.1

              You did not try to compare population density in Russia and Germany? In Russia - 8,38 people / sq. Km, in Germany - 229 people / sq. Km. 27,33 (!) Times.Sorry, but to compare Germany and the vastness of Siberia and the Far East? To put it mildly, not correctly.
              1. postman
                postman 30 May 2013 23: 47 New
                0
                Quote: man in the street
                You did not try to compare population density in Russia and Germany?

                But why?
                I compared (and not me in the end, but logistics economists) to the DENSITY of railways.
                No one binds them to the "density" of the population (and did not bind them)
                Then let the number of cars per 1000 inhabitants of Germany add the density of roads.
                STRATEGIC ROUTE: SPB-Murmansk ..... on the first strip in each direction, narrow.
                Glory to the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, although the asphalt was renewed last year, but in this they closed the crossing (dead) of the Svirskaya HPP
                And?
                Quote: man in the street
                and open spaces of Siberia and the Far East?

                There is nothing soft here.
                Just because of Siberia, the Far East and Yakutia (as well as the North) and there MUST BE in Russia more railway (than anywhere else) is meant more "density"
                1. nerd.su
                  nerd.su 31 May 2013 00: 33 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Postman
                  Quote: man in the street
                  You did not try to compare population density in Russia and Germany?

                  But why?

                  Quote: Postman
                  Just because of Siberia, the Far East and Yakutia (as well as the North) and there MUST BE in Russia more railway (than anywhere else) is meant more "density"


                  Something with the logic ... Do you have a huge railway density in a sparsely populated country? Whom to bring, the peoples of the north with deer to new pastures? Yes, we are 2-2,5 times the length of the railway to increase and last for centuries. If the Chinese do not breed.
                  1. postman
                    postman 31 May 2013 02: 47 New
                    +1
                    Quote: bot.su
                    Is there a huge railway density in a sparsely populated country?

                    1.See Egypt (next after Russia, there REALLY EMPTY, desert, there will be another 300 years.
                    2.Siberia, Yakutia, Far East-Void?
                    Yes, due to them, we live and exist.
                    2. Defense, strategic importance.
                    =================
                    Before you tryndet about logic: make trips: Moskva-Tyura there (by train)

                    Or a car in St. Petersburg, Murmansk, or by train (no difference)
                    Then broadcast about the "logic"
                    1. nerd.su
                      nerd.su 1 June 2013 20: 05 New
                      0
                      Quote: Postman
                      Then broadcast about the "logic"

                      Yes, my friend, if you really still study, then you are an excellent example of the achievements of the reforms of the current education :(

                      Quote: Postman
                      1.See Egypt (next after Russia, there REALLY EMPTY, desert, there will be another 300 years.

                      The fact that Egypt is a desert does not mean that there is a void. The population density of Egypt is 74 people / sq. Km, and the population density of Russia is 8,38 people / sq. Km. So the void in Russia, compared with Egypt, is big. Russia is 8,8 times more empty in population than Egypt. In terms of railway density, we are nearby.
                      Quote: Postman
                      2.Siberia, Yakutia, Far East-Void?

                      The population density in the Far Eastern Federal District is 1,01 people / sq. Km. But this figure is obtained with such cities as Khabarovsk, Vladivostok, Blagoveshchensk. And so, the population density of Yakutia is 0,31 people / sq. Km, and in Chukotka in general 0,07 people / sq. Km. This is VOID! And to hell there is a dense railway network?
                      Yes, you need to build roads. But wise. Even if you double the length of the railway, the cost of research alone for this case will be the same as the budget of an average African country. And the research is a miserable interest, in the cost of the road ... Therefore, they build it first in the most densely populated European part of the country, where passenger traffic will allow at least something to be recouped within a reasonable time. Rather, it’s quick to make a profit, but that's okay, capitalism.

                      Well, at the expense of tryndet and travel. Moscow - Turatam (two days on the road), of course a decent distance, but I advise you to take a ride on the Vladivostok-Moscow route (a week on the road. Then you will take a different look at our country.
                      So, at the desk, comrade - study, study and study again!
                  2. postman
                    postman 3 June 2013 19: 14 New
                    +1
                    Quote: bot.su
                    Something with the logic ... Do you have a huge railway density in a sparsely populated country?

                    With logic, everything is fine with me.
                    look at the map of the Russian Federation: enterprises, production, protection of state borders, defense significance.

                    Nobody wrote about the tundra.

                    Quote: bot.su
                    Yes, we are 2-2,5 times the length of the railway to increase and last for centuries.

                    Will not be enough.
                    Compare then the European part of the Russian Federation and Germany
                    Accordingly, the density. This is not difficult: all of Germany, and the data on the RF RF are in Russian Railways.
                    The result will be slightly better, but still not in comparison.
                    1. nerd.su
                      nerd.su 4 June 2013 23: 12 New
                      0
                      Quote: Postman
                      With logic, everything is fine with me.

                      The facts say the opposite. You stubbornly compare only the density of railways, regardless of population density and area. Roughly, the railway density in the European part of Russia is rounded up to 15 km / 1000 sq. Km. More precisely, it’s a pity to take time. The density of the railway in Germany, according to your data, is 117,59 km / 1000 sq. Km.
                      That is, the density of railway in Germany is 7,8 times higher than in Russia. Now we look at the population density in Germany of 229 people / sq. Km, and in the European part of Russia 27 people / sq. Km. That is, the population density in Germany is 8,5 times higher than ours in the European part. This difference is the whole point. It creates a greater passenger and cargo flow in Germany, which pays for everything and makes a profit. Well, we are at the limit, if we double the length of the railway in Russia in one generation, the economy will explode.

                      Quote: Postman
                      look at the map of the Russian Federation: enterprises, production, protection of state borders, defense significance.

                      What’s the map for me, I’ve already seen half the country. What about border protection?
                      Prey, yes. But here it must be considered, otherwise the construction and maintenance of the railway will be more than the cost of railway. It is more profitable for us to build pipelines. Here we will overtake Germany laughing


                      Quote: Postman
                      Nobody wrote about the tundra.

                      Well, then you throw out the area of ​​the tundra from the calculation of the density of railway in Russia. At the same time, the area of ​​the poorly populated taiga, and the steppes are not densely populated ... We look and we will catch up with Germany smile

                      In general, you see for yourself, logic fails you.
                2. Evrepid
                  Evrepid 31 May 2013 14: 11 New
                  +1
                  In one film, there is a phrase: “I’ve been the leader of the region for 20 years, but they throw everything at me. I either didn’t have time, I didn’t do it, but what did I do to fix it?”

                  So in your case it turns out, when the Soviet Union built a road, then it was enough, now there isn’t, but after all in 20 years they haven’t built anything, but the USSR is to blame? )))
                  Well, no?
                  1. postman
                    postman 31 May 2013 14: 53 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Evrepid
                    "I’ve been the leader of the region for 20 years,

                    I do not quite understand .... If to me, then over the course of 26 years I have done something, though the leader has not been .....
                    Quote: Evrepid
                    and the USSR is to blame? )))

                    Just the opposite.
                    1.SSSR (and Tsarist Russia) built roads. True, I consider the USSR-LITTLE (despite the experience of the Russian-Japanese, 1MV, 2MV-which showed = NOT ENOUGH), even using de facto slaves.
                    2. A number of railway trains of the USSR were built in the wrong direction and not at all.
                    Chum - Salekhard - Igarka 1947-53 GULZhDS Ministry of Internal Affairs

                    Judging by the documents of the Central Administrative Department of the USSR, as of January 1, 1953, the Gulag contained 2.258.957 people, Of these, 255.865 people were employed in the GULZHD system.
                    3. Russia (modern) does not build much or nothing, to the detriment of strategic security.
                    Highlights of the high-speed line are floodlights for populi and pumping state money (ours) into your pocket.
                    Believe me: there is a "relative": bosses, not seven spans in the forehead, nothing useful but a wad, but nahapan:: yourself and great-grandchildren, like cheese in butter.
                    And Russian Railways squeaks: we are unprofitable ...
                    That's what I meant
                    1. nerd.su
                      nerd.su 1 June 2013 20: 47 New
                      0
                      Quote: Postman
                      1.SSSR (and Tsarist Russia) built roads. True, I consider the USSR-LITTLE (despite the experience of the Russian-Japanese, 1MV, 2MV-which showed = NOT ENOUGH), even using de facto slaves.

                      The USSR built roads no less than tsarist Russia. Plus, he also completed the construction of roads and reconstructed pre-revolutionary roads.

                      Quote: Postman
                      2. A number of railway trains of the USSR were built in the wrong direction and not at all.
                      Chum - Salekhard - Igarka 1947-53 GULZHDS Ministry of Internal Affairs

                      Here you contradict your first statement about strategic importance. This road began to be designed and built at the end of the Second World War as the Vorkuta-Norilsk road. If you know why the city of Norilsk arose and about the vulnerability of the Northern Sea Route revealed during the war, you must understand the strategic importance of this road. And the year of completion should explain to you why it is abandoned. For the new strategist who led the country, the polar lands did not matter, because corn does not grow there.

                      Quote: Postman
                      3. Russia (modern) does not build much or nothing, to the detriment of strategic security.


                      This is almost true. There are few new roads. Nevertheless, the view from the train window on the railway economy is getting better.
          2. Vladimirets
            Vladimirets 30 May 2013 17: 19 New
            +2
            Quote: FATEMOGAN
            According to the normal for all these super trains, you need your own track, separate, so that they could accelerate, and they shouldn’t interfere with others, as I understood from the article, they are going to do so that before St. Petersburg, there will be a separate, high-speed before Kazan branch.

            Its own branch is very good, only in the direction of the same Kazan from Moscow everything is already built up, everywhere there are roads, rivers, fields and land. In a good way, this branch must be raised to the flyover so that it does not bother anyone and everyone can force this Chinese wall. I hardly remember the last time I used the services of railway transport and why the hell should I suffer from the desire of Russian Railways to make money?
            1. Akim
              Akim 30 May 2013 17: 33 New
              0
              Quote: Vladimirets
              I hardly remember the last time I used the services of railway transport

              I also basically did not go by train (a bus or car is very rarely an airplane). But after a trip to Intercity my opinion changed (maybe because I went in the warm period and without breakdowns). If you are not going to thump on the train - that’s it. I consider the plane to fly for a long time. Such trains are certainly not for Russia. In the US, passenger trains are unprofitable. Maybe even in the European part, where the density of large cities is higher.
            2. FATEMOGAN
              FATEMOGAN 30 May 2013 18: 51 New
              0
              Quote: Vladimirets
              I hardly remember the last time I used the services of railway transport and why the hell should I suffer from the desire of Russian Railways to make money?

              It can be said so, but it is possible that this money will remain in Russia and will work for its economy and development, because they will be able to start up freight trains in the future on these high-speed branches. In any case, it is better to invest them in the country's infrastructure than it is customary for us to put money in a small pill or buy American debt bonds.
            3. nerd.su
              nerd.su 31 May 2013 00: 39 New
              +1
              Quote: Vladimirets
              I hardly remember the last time I used the services of railway transport and why the hell should I suffer from the desire of Russian Railways to make money?

              But after all, a lot of people use railway transport. Why should they suffer so that you can use the car?
              Recently, we have only been thinking more about ourselves. Nothing good will come of such thoughts; those who are younger, stronger and more impudent will always be right.
          3. Pilat2009
            Pilat2009 30 May 2013 20: 11 New
            0
            Quote: FATEMOGAN
            all these super trains need their own track

            it’s like they want to build it separately. I don’t understand why again Siemens seemed to have the best offers. And I still don’t understand, the article also talks about the pass and the freight, everything is piled up. I don’t think that freight can travel along the same routes and with the same speed. In general, the budget can not stand such a cut
      3. Ramadan
        Ramadan 30 May 2013 20: 43 New
        +1
        Another gossip and pessimism. No need to talk about some kind of "rumor." No brigades of railwaymen already walk after the Sapsans and do not score crutches after each train. All the old ways have long been changed. On the contrary, rejoice at the initiatives, this is better than another nagging ...
    2. Interface
      Interface 30 May 2013 14: 50 New
      0
      Stagnation is not stagnation, AND CLOSURE WILL HAVE. Or we’ll continue to lurk in rotten canned goods, say the reserved seat “Moscow-Vladivostok”.
  2. Alex45
    Alex45 30 May 2013 08: 35 New
    +3
    In principle, I am in favor of accelerating movement by rail, but there are doubts about the increasing passenger flow (at least in some regions). And I would like the cost of new trains to be about the same, how many now. If now the fare Yekaterinburg - Nizhnevartovsk is in the reserved seat on average 2000 rubles, then from the average 5 rubles. per km. on a new train may become 6500 rub.
    So I want innovations but concerns about the competent implementation of this initiative remain.

    UrBK, Moscow, 07.12.2012. Due to the decrease in passenger traffic in the winter, to optimize the route network and release infrastructure capacity from circulation, 19 trains forming the Federal Passenger Company OJSC (a subsidiary of Russian Railways) are canceled, including all trailed and direct train cars that run in their composition. This was said in a statement.

    In particular, a number of trains and direct trains running along the routes Yaroslavl - Nizhny Novgorod, Kotlas - Kirov, Tynda - Komsomolsk, Neryungri - Tynda, Severobaykalsk - Anapa, Krasnoyarsk - Abakan, Novokuznetsk - Novosibirsk, Tomsk - Beliy Yar, Omsk - Kulunda are canceled , Kemerovo - Tashtagol, Kemerovo - Furnaces (direct trains Kemerovo - Kislovodsk), Tomsk - Taiga, Penza - Samara, Novorossiysk - Adler - Arkhangelsk, Rostov - Volgograd, Rostov - Grozny, Stavropol - Caucasian (direct trains Stavropol - St. P burg) - Stavropol Caucasian (direct cars Stavropol - Vorkuta, Stavropol - Arkhangelsk), Nalchik - Cool (direct cars Nalchik - Adler).

    In addition, due to the decrease in passenger traffic and low population, train No. 18 / 17 Moscow - Perm will be canceled by departure from Moscow from 15.01.2013, from Perm from 16.01.2013. However, with the introduction of a new schedule in May 2013, the schedule of train No. 17 / 18 will be used for the 7 / 8 train No. XNUMX, which maintains its routing, with the Ekaterinburg - Moscow service. Passengers who wish to travel from Moscow to Perm and vice versa can also use one of the many transit trains running along this route.

    The losses incurred by the FPK OJSC from the operation of these trains for the 9 months of the current year amounted to 760,4 million rubles (even taking into account the full compensation of the lost revenues from the federal budget, the losses amount to 543,4 million rubles).

    The draft federal budget for 2013 provides for subsidies for compensation of shortfalls in revenue from regulation of tariffs for passenger transportation in reserved seats and general wagons in the amount of 14,8 billion rubles, which is 2 times lower than the level of subsidies this year and amounts to 40% of the declared.
  3. pinecone
    pinecone 30 May 2013 08: 39 New
    +2
    Ways
    Quote: Denis
    Will the condition of the paths allow?
    It was said that even after the high-speed ER-200 of the Moscow-Peter walked crews, the brigades of the trackers tightened the nuts
    Ways that were not calculated at such speeds, will you have to put new ones?


    Now there are flying Sapsan high-speed trains manufactured by the German company Siemens. The roads are broken thoroughly and repair work on them is ongoing. For this reason, the schedule of commuter trains changes daily at intervals of up to 3 hours or more.
    1. Denis
      Denis 30 May 2013 09: 18 New
      +4
      Quote: pinecone
      the schedule of commuter trains changes daily at intervals of up to 3 hours or more
      So it turns out give the wife to his uncle, and go to ...
      Some kind of train with flashing lights, so that he drove everyone to stand
  4. shurup
    shurup 30 May 2013 09: 03 New
    +8
    The government will continue to fly on planes. Citizens will continue to replace shock absorbers and curses on the quality of roads. Russian Railways will swallow trillions of money and increase the speed of cargo transportation by 2km / h.
    China and Europe will receive a lot of money for components and materials. Banks will receive a bunch of interest. Citizens will receive a price increase for tickets, shock absorbers and gasoline.
    The authors will receive royalties and awards, and some will receive the “Hero of Labor”.
    The declared amounts can be used to empty containers through pipes, but this is not Russian Railways.
    In modern logistics, railway is a small niche.
    1. fzr1000
      fzr1000 30 May 2013 11: 01 New
      +1
      Seriously? Maybe in modern world logistics, yes, not in Russian. There are still places in Russia (especially in the North and Siberia), which can only be reached by train or helicopter. And how do you propose there / there to make logistics?
      1. polida
        polida 31 May 2013 03: 31 New
        0
        If our state is built on a pipe - what kind of logistics is it ??? If the real economy works here, you can’t do without railway !!!
  5. ehan
    ehan 30 May 2013 09: 11 New
    +5
    1,16 billion rubles for every kilometer of the road !!! In our region, for this money, you can take an ordinary person 350 000 m3 of high-quality (M-300) concrete, i.e. if the width of the road is 10 meters, the thickness of the pillow is 35 m. the height of a 12-storey building ... this is cut, this is what I understand ... and they’re not even shy. In China, for the money we would have made the subway.
    1. igor36
      igor36 30 May 2013 10: 36 New
      0
      The comment is completely unqualified. They saw the number of zeros: everything was thieves. A few numbers for reference:
      Double-track railway device 150-300 million rubles per km, depending on the category of ground and category of track (for HSR, the numbers are likely to be maximum)
      With bridges, level crossings, overpasses, etc. double about.
      Electrification 45-80 million rubles per km.
      Plus the purchase of rolling stock and other equipment.
      So estimate now who cares how much it costs to build a railway.
      1. igor36
        igor36 30 May 2013 23: 23 New
        0
        And what are the cons? Write arguments, show numbers.
  6. rennim
    rennim 30 May 2013 09: 12 New
    +4
    According to the head of Russian Railways, the implementation of this project can give a serious impetus to the country's economy. First of all, this will allow residents of the province to travel to the capital to earn money.

    Ah, that's why everything is being done. And on the contrary, it can begin to develop regions. Or Moscow is all of Russia.
    1. Andrey57
      Andrey57 30 May 2013 09: 18 New
      11
      Moscow has not been considered Russia for a long time in the regions.
      1. Evrepid
        Evrepid 31 May 2013 14: 16 New
        0
        But do you think the opposite is another indicator? :)

        Paris is not all France in France
        In Germany, Berlin is not all Germany
        In Russia, Moscow is not the whole of Russia.
        Etc.
    2. AK-47
      AK-47 30 May 2013 10: 34 New
      +1
      Quote: rennim
      Or maybe on the contrary, begin to develop regions.

      In advisers to the President did not try to run? hi
  7. Andrey57
    Andrey57 30 May 2013 09: 14 New
    +7
    It is most likely not worth hoping that a high-speed network will be aimed at the benefit of the Russian population, if we consider this issue as an example from the Moscow-St. Petersburg direction. After the launch of the Sapsan, with frantic ticket prices almost 10 times more expensive than a regular train, the problem of at least partial loading was solved very simply - all day trains were canceled, now you can leave at regular prices only at night, while Sapsan "runs half-empty, and night trains go crowded. And people regretfully recall the times when it was possible to buy a cheap ticket for a seated wagon, read a book or magazine, and in 7-8 hours drive to St. Petersburg or Moscow for 500-700 rubles. instead of 6,000-8,000thousand on the Sapsan.
    1. gosha1970
      gosha1970 30 May 2013 10: 39 New
      +1
      Something you turned down prices. Do not scare people. From 1800 rub.
    2. FATEMOGAN
      FATEMOGAN 30 May 2013 14: 59 New
      +1
      Quote: Andrey57
      And people regretfully recall the times when it was possible to buy a cheap ticket for a seated car, read a book or magazine, and after 7-8 hours drive to St. Petersburg or Moscow for 500-700 rubles. instead of 6,000-8,000 thousand on the Sapsan.


      Direction Business class Economy class
      Moscow - St. Petersburg 4198 - 6507 rubles. 2323 - 3483 rub
      In general, you are cunning, to put it mildly, you are quoting the prices of a business class, while there is also an economy, which is much cheaper, you would still remember 50 years and tickets for some 20 rubles. Another thing is that these trains need a separate, own track, so as not to interfere with ordinary slow-moving vehicles.
  8. ayyildiz
    ayyildiz 30 May 2013 10: 28 New
    +1
    It’s time for Russia to develop high-speed trains!
  9. Vital 33
    Vital 33 30 May 2013 10: 40 New
    +5
    I don’t know how expensive it is, but new billionaires will be added ...
  10. Takashi
    Takashi 30 May 2013 11: 16 New
    0
    how about a return to steam locomotives?
    There are a lot of them in sedimentation tanks and sidings in case ..... of cases.
    With save on the purchase of compounds

    Instead of special brigades / bridge detachments - prisoners of colonies (with saving on food, clothing, travel, shovels)

    But seriously, there are already routes from M to Kazan - are they overloaded? do not withstand high-speed trains?

    another cut from Russian Railways.
    1. postman
      postman 30 May 2013 14: 47 New
      +1
      Quote: Takashi
      Instead of special brigades / bridge detachments - prisoners of colonies (with saving on food, clothing, travel, shovels)

      We spend on restoring the infrastructure for servicing locomotives, harvesting firewood (pellets), heating water tanks at stations, utilizing ash, changing the entire draft technology And ...?
      According to the signed Kyoto agreements, we pay Shtrafnyak for additional greenhouse gas emissions (the quota is already on our way)

      No wonder they refused the steam locomotives, although today the tree (pellets) is beyond competition at the cost of obtaining calories of heat.
    2. NOBODY EXCEPT US
      NOBODY EXCEPT US 30 May 2013 20: 13 New
      0
      About twenty years ago, trains ran every half hour, freight trains went one by one, and now mostly passenger trains and freight trains are good if the heels pass ..... (Undol, Vlad. Region)
    3. Evrepid
      Evrepid 31 May 2013 14: 18 New
      0
      As in the USA, let ZK build roads. Shackles on legs and shovel in hand.
  11. Vtel
    Vtel 30 May 2013 11: 28 New
    +5
    On the piece of iron, as in the world electronics, there are no domestic breakthroughs. What is called high-speed - 140 km per hour - can be said in relation to the cochlea. Grandmothers gash big as with the purchase of German Peregrine Falcons - a bonanza. The Chinese have trains that run - China "put on the rails" a new CTT500 super-fast passenger train capable of moving at a speed of 500 km / h. And we all kiss with the Germans and where such love comes from.
    1. Takashi
      Takashi 31 May 2013 02: 45 New
      0
      so the Chinese also kissed the Germans in the initial stages. After with the Japanese and Koreans.
      Wait, they want a train to London, they think of kissing with the Russians or not, or is it easier for the Turks.
  12. Metlik
    Metlik 30 May 2013 11: 44 New
    +1
    All world trade goes mainly through shipping. Cost is much cheaper. Stalin understood this perfectly and built channels.
  13. Algor73
    Algor73 30 May 2013 12: 09 New
    +7
    Of course, you need to build highways, but in conjunction with the general development of the regions. And it turns out, the head of the train in the 21st century, and the tail flounders in the 19th. However, the grander the construction, the muddy the water. It’s better to spend this money on improving the communications of Russian Railways, repairing the roads themselves, the road, and the speed will increase from 9 km to 20. And by dividing the high-speed into non-high-speed sections and thus take an average of 20, is this progress?
  14. capitosha1rang
    capitosha1rang 30 May 2013 12: 39 New
    +6
    The most interesting thing in all this disgrace is the reference to the fact that "... the inhabitants of the province will go to work in Moscow" And to invest a trillion in the economy of the same Tatarstan, Chuvashia, Nizhny Novgorod region? To people living there, earned on the spot, not looking up from home and family?
    And what - in Moscow there are already not enough migrants to work on home strips and in the street-house economy? Or are they expecting a guy from Vasilsursk in the office of Mosbank?
    Blessed is he who believes!
    Another snag - to cut down forests along the proposed route begin even before the start of design and survey work.
    I encountered this while working at the BashNPP Construction Directorate, when the forest along the proposed (not approved!) Power transmission line began to be cut down, left-right by 200 meters, when the foundation for the first of four blocks had not yet been poured.
    And the construction of a light rail in Ufa? They cut down the forest for the unnecessary transport route, then the project was canceled, and since the forest was already cut down anyway (in the park zone), we decided to occupy this territory with low-rise construction (cottages).
    1. Young Putin
      Young Putin 30 May 2013 13: 38 New
      +1
      Quote: capitosha1rang
      A trillion to invest in the economy of the same Tatarstan

      Tatarstan is not very poorly developed and developing; billions of rubles are spinning in our country. Aircraft manufacturing, mechanical engineering, the chemical industry, agriculture, forestry, water, oil and gas are developed in the republic. Tatarstan itself does not earn badly and does not particularly need data.
      the birth rate in 2012 reached the level of 1987, that is, an indicator of the USSR !!! we have a smart and advanced president, that’s the whole trick! pay attention when Putin is convening the next meeting of ministers, Minnikhanov is often present there.
      bridge over Kama was built near Chistopol only under the dictator Putin am and before that, under the USSR, there was only a ferry service.
    2. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 30 May 2013 20: 17 New
      0
      Quote: capitosha1rang
      residents of the province will go to work in Moscow

      will they ride every day or something? then no salary is enough
    3. Evrepid
      Evrepid 31 May 2013 14: 23 New
      0
      So initially for the cottages the territory was planned for sure. ;)
  15. sys-1985
    sys-1985 30 May 2013 13: 02 New
    0
    It didn’t hurt for a long time that in Nizhny Novgorod we had a meeting of the governor with representatives of Russian Railways, we discussed the project of construction (modernization) of tracks for high-speed trains. Now on Peregrine Falcon 4 with a penny h to Moscow will be 1 h and Kazan is the same time. Implementation of the modernization project 2018. for the World Cup.
  16. deoman
    deoman 30 May 2013 13: 08 New
    +1
    He traveled many times from Nizhny Novgorod to Moscow on SAPSAN, not expensive and very convenient, and saves time.
  17. cyclist
    cyclist 30 May 2013 13: 28 New
    +2
    crying no matter how all the effective managers of Russian Railways would plunder until 2020
  18. varov14
    varov14 30 May 2013 13: 37 New
    +2
    Quote: Denis
    Will the condition of the paths allow?
    It was said that even after the high-speed ER-200 of the Moscow-Peter walked crews, the brigades of the trackers tightened the nuts
    Ways that were not calculated at such speeds, will you have to put new ones?

    ----- And where are they going to spend a billion rubles if not on new paths? Is it really stupid to steal?
    1. polida
      polida 31 May 2013 03: 27 New
      0
      And you ask Yakunin how much money is swelled into the railway in Libya !!!
  19. The comment was deleted.
  20. USNik
    USNik 30 May 2013 13: 42 New
    +3
    the cost of a ticket on a pilot route from Moscow to Kazan, the length of which is 800 km., will have to be from 800 to 8 rubles.
    Such a good little "fork". While the head of Russian Railways will be Yakunin, there will be no high-speed transport, there will be a protracted construction, with a constant delay, beging for state money and closing "unnecessary", "irrelevant", "little-visited", "poorly filled" suburban trains.
    1. postman
      postman 30 May 2013 14: 42 New
      +3
      Quote: USNik
      Such a good little "fork". While the head of Russian Railways will be Yakunin

      I will upset you, it will be more expensive than in Germany like this: Hamburg -Muenchren = 800 km ghbvthyj
      Deutsche Bahn

      And this is the 2nd grade of course, sedentary
      Those wishing to predict:
      http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/d

      What will definitely not be is Wochenende Ticket (weekend ticket)

      Fuenf Leute. Ein Tag. Fuer 42, - Euro können Sie das Schoenes-Wochenende-Ticket
      5 (!) People, for 42 Euros (previously it was true 25 Euros) can travel ALL Germany, so many times, how many people want, but only on S-Bahn, RB, IRE, RE trains (not valid on ICE-Sapsan).
      And even on some trains and destinations in Denmark, Holland, Austria, Poland and Switzerland.
      Ride until you turn blue
      .
      42 Euro x 40,5: 5 = 340 p person from Saturday from 0:00 to 24:00 Sunday.
      We will not have this essno.
      1. postman
        postman 30 May 2013 14: 59 New
        0
        Hamburg -Muenchren = 800 km
        Deutsche Bahn
        from 139 Euro
        (the pictures do not "sculpt")

        And this is the 2nd grade of course, sedentary
  21. postman
    postman 30 May 2013 14: 22 New
    +6
    Quote: Author
    that at the end of 2012, the average commercial speed freight trainsin Russia was 9,1 km / h.


    what relation do Sapsan and Alegro have to freight trains?
    freight trains cannot fundamentally move at such speeds, and PRR and sorting, EVERYTHING will “throw off” the average speed by that amount.
    The average speed is determined by the state of the economy of the country (congestion)

    The solution can only be to increase the railway lines (parallel, junctions, junctions), it is not connected with the high-speed PASSENGER (they passenger ONLY brake the freight)

    Grube: 250 km / h ist für ICE schnell genug (maximum speed is not everywhere for ICE in Germany, in some places they can accelerate to 300 Frankfurt am Main-Koeln, Ingolstadt - Nürnberg. Project reach 220 -250 by 2020.

    And the average speed of freight trains in Germany = Mittelgeschwindigkeit von 30,44 km / h
    So in Germany the railway density is not the same, it’s enough to recall 1MB as they wound between Prussia and Belgium (Samsonov’s Army)
    1. Evrepid
      Evrepid 31 May 2013 14: 26 New
      0
      The answer on your chart is visible. the rolling stock fleet became obsolete, there was nothing to drive, the railway track without cap investments also collapsed, these two reasons led to a decrease in speed, naturally not only these, but they are the main ones.
  22. kosmos84
    kosmos84 30 May 2013 15: 01 New
    0
    and now we have itr 3 of the day at my own expense and the installers on 1 day write vgot today and you bastard
  23. 1goose3
    1goose3 30 May 2013 17: 25 New
    +1
    The construction of high-speed highways looks quite reasonable, if we consider that according to the results of 2012, the average commercial speed of freight trains in Russia was 9,1 km / h. This is not only several times lower than in the world's largest economies, but also lower than the speed of movement of experienced cyclists. At the same time every year the situation only gets worse, and the low speed of movement of freight trains can put an end to plans to turn our country into a bridge between Asia and Europe.

    I put a minus to the author, the person mixed everything up, perverted everything. Passenger and freight transportation were thrown into a heap, confused the concepts of commercial and district speed, compares the incomparable.
    In one author, the rights of movement indicators have fallen, but the reasons for this are not so much technical as organizational. The railway transport management system was broken under the slogan of reorganization and restructuring. The interaction of individual structures is awaited, Russian Railways ceases to exist as a single mechanism. Formally, there is interaction at the Moscow level, but on the ground it is actually slipping.
    Regarding high-speed traffic, we are talking about high-speed passenger traffic. Such speeds are possible in the construction of individual highways for these purposes. Heavy freight traffic does not require such speeds, although increasing the local speed to 120-150 km / h would be a reasonable solution.
    And if you say whether you need high-speed traffic, then of course the answer is: Yes. Pleasure is expensive, but necessary economically, politically and morally.
    By the way, compare the railways of France, Germany, etc. with the Russian railways, at least it’s not correct, their cargo transportation in comparison with ours can be taken as zero, and the weight of our freight trains from 5 to 12 thousand simply throws them into shock. hi
  24. QWERTY
    QWERTY 30 May 2013 19: 03 New
    0
    Oh, my topic))) I work in the office for equipping railway systems with automation and communication systems. Once my organization equipped the PBX line Moscow - St. Petersburg, St. Petersburg - Buslovskaya (state border with Finka). Let's sort it out.
    1. NUTS at high speed no one twists (well, practically). There are brackets, they do not loosen. Nuts are the last century.
    2. The FREIGHT trains are breaking the tracks, so soon they will be removed from the line of St. Petersburg - Buslovskaya, put into detour through the branch from Sosnovo, which is being completed.
    3. NO special paths are built, mostly curves are removed, they are made more gentle. The set speed depends on the track profile (curves, climbs) and automation (for example, Allegro drives slowly near St. Petersburg because automation has not yet been reconstructed)
    4. Moving is a problem)) You would see how many idiots go through them ... under closed barriers, under red lights of traffic lights .. A train, especially a freight one, does not stop instantly. The braking distance, depending on the weight, is up to 600-800 m. Elektrichka, and even more so a high-speed train is very likely to go off the rail in a collision with a car, and there will be a lot of dead passengers. That’s why the transfers are closed 15-20 minutes before the high-speed train.
    5. Pedestrian bridges are also a topic. Almost no one walks through them. Laziness. Climb over fences. And they draw and relieve themselves on bridges. And when they hit with a train, they file a lawsuit against the railway.
    6. The train doesn’t stop when it hits a person. The driver reports to the nearest station, and the sacrament services are called from there. Because one moron will get the whole branch out of cancer. Separately about morons - HOW CAN I NOT SEE THE TRAIN? can be heard for half a kilometer. Recently, on Udelnaya lay on the sleepers of the cyclist’s brains. He fell under a motor vehicle. At the same time, there is a guard, whistling whistles, ringing bells and all kinds of traffic lights ringing red. But he was obviously in a hurry. In general, this is akin to natural selection, stupid people die.
    7.And money - for example, for a contract on a railway for the construction of something, 35% of the estimated cost should be paid. That's it.
    1. polida
      polida 31 May 2013 03: 10 New
      0
      Have you heard the train coming !!!
      1. QWERTY
        QWERTY 31 May 2013 12: 27 New
        0
        I have been hearing them constantly for the past seven years. I have witnessed a message from a station operator on duty about a collision. It is likely that they do not stop at a particular site.
    2. polida
      polida 31 May 2013 03: 18 New
      0
      What kind of piece of iron do you work on? Since January 1, we have three corpses and the driver always does emergency braking,
      and the assistant runs to look - this is according to the instructions and in life an office railway worm ,,,
      1. polida
        polida 31 May 2013 03: 25 New
        0
        October Railway near St. Petersburg
  25. 1goose3
    1goose3 30 May 2013 21: 50 New
    0
    Quote: Postman
    And the average speed of freight trains in Germany = Mittelgeschwindigkeit von 30,44 km / h
    So in Germany the railway density is not the same, it’s enough to recall 1MB as they wound between Prussia and Belgium (Samsonov’s Army)


    I feel like I'm talking to the engine. But I do not agree that you are comparing the speed of freight traffic in Russia and Germany in principle. The weight of the freight train in Germany is practically comparable with the passenger and freight it can be considered conditionally by our standards. And therefore, in fact, with Siemens, Russian Railways works in the field of passenger transportation, as well as along with the French in the field of signaling, automation and telemechanics. In the field of freight transportation, in my opinion, there is no one to compare with Russia in Europe. Of course, in cargo transportation we can compete only with the Americans, but we have 70 percent electric traction and we did the Americans on this. sad
  26. Bombowoz
    Bombowoz 30 May 2013 22: 08 New
    0
    From the prospects already breathtaking! And who will build all this? On railway contraction continuous and reduce specialists, or conditions are created so that they themselves leave. There is no one to work in the inverter. Who will contain? Already now observed the "Taliban" as travelers. And so they will work ... The locomotive fleet for shunting is extremely worn out, they are assembled from several, and they barely pull themselves. Salary since the beginning of the crisis, it has not increased (indexing tariff rates cut other payments). Young people do not go to working specialties, and those who come do not work long (well, maybe with the exception of the “collars”). The attitude towards people is bestial. And how many daughters did you make? The iron was torn into pieces. Where then to look for money, with whom to ask? Well, they will make the way, and then the express trains will again go 100km / h and we will be told about the specifics of the ground and the relief of the track.! First you need train. return to the state (under the tsar, this has already happened, and Westerners have had such a thing more than once) and revive the prestige of the profession, and then think about it. For some reason, everyone is talking about money, but about a man who does all this a word. But one thing is certain - high-speed traffic on railways in our country with our distances is necessary as air. Only speeds should be from 300km / h (probably utopia, but I would like to).
  27. polida
    polida 31 May 2013 02: 48 New
    0
    I work on railway Yakunin sawing money
    Under the kings, the piece of iron was bought from private traders
    Aksenenko, although he stole a piece of iron, was one
    Now the husband laughs in Russian Railways, there were only blacks from the locomotive
    And at the expense of high-speed, ask Petersburgers - 1 platform on the Moscow most expensive foundation pit in the World
  28. polida
    polida 31 May 2013 02: 54 New
    0
    Under kings, private roads were bought up
    Under Aksyonenko, even though he was stealing, they were kept in the state
    High-speed highway - ask Petersburgers at the Moscow station for a long time loomed how the most expensive foundation pit in the world laughed at 1 platform