AMB-17 - why and why

71
AMB-17 - why and why
A fighter of the Espanyola volunteer brigade with an AMB-17.


Soldiers of the Espanyola volunteer brigade in the special military operation zone were the first to receive the latest AMB-17 assault rifle. In the unit, the machine gun will essentially undergo military tests. The machine gun was demonstrated to journalists at one of the training grounds, and a brigade fighter demonstrated firing from it.




A still from a video demonstrating the AMB-17.

The AMB-17 is essentially a variant of the AM-17 assault rifle. Both of them were first demonstrated back in 2017 at the Army Forum. If anyone is aware of the suffering of JSC Concern Kalashnikov regarding Ksyukha (a separate material can be made about this, maybe more than one), then it was precisely as part of the development of a replacement for the AKS-74U that the AM-17 appeared.


AMB-17 and AM-17.

AMB-17 is a small, lightweight and silent machine gun, which seems to be supposed to replace the Vintorez/VAL tandem. The machine gun is essentially a reworking of Evgeny Dragunov’s own design, or more precisely, the layout diagram of his machine gun. The Dragunov AM assault rifle was developed as part of the development work initiated by TsNIITOCHMASH, “a small-sized assault rifle with extensive use of plastic.”

In order to reduce the height of the receiver and make disassembly more convenient, the design of the machine uses a separate pusher with the bolt frame. Apparently, this is one of the solutions that attracted Kalashnikov designers already in the 1st century, because a lower receiver means ease of working with optics. Look at how fighters with AKs with standard stocks hold their heads up, aiming through the same 87PXNUMX, and you will understand what we are talking about.


An early example of AMB-17. It differs in body kit parts from the sample submitted for military testing, and uses a Vintorez/VAL magazine.

The project continued to be refined for six years, after which the AMB-17 finally reached the front.

The Kalashnikov had more than one approach to the projectile. Back in the early 2000s, an assault rifle chambered for 9x39 mm, the AK-9, appeared. At first it was simply a conversion of the AKS-74U for a different ammunition. In 2009, a version of the AK-9 appeared based on the concern’s “hundredth series” assault rifles. Later, a variant was announced based on the AK-12 assault rifle, or rather, its very first version.


Dmitry Medvedev holding an AK-9, unified with “hundredth series” assault rifles, Izhevsk, 2008.

None of the above ever went into production or entered service. The idea in this case was generally good - an assault rifle capable of solving the same problems as Vintorez/VAL, but with greater unification with standard army assault rifles.

The new AMB-17 does not have such an advantage. This is a system made largely from scratch, and is not unified with the AK-12 in terms of details, both the mechanism and the body kit. At the same time, the early assault rifles that Kalashnikov demonstrated were powered by standard Vintorez/VAL magazines.

The machine gun that ended up in service with the troops has an original magazine, apparently inherited from the current AMB-17 from the AK-9. That is, the unification with any systems currently in service is, by and large, zero.


AM-17 and AM Dragunov systems. General layout solutions can be guessed unmistakably.

Is there now an urgent need to change the Vintorez/VAL systems?

Yes, in general, no. They fully perform the tasks for which they were created.

In addition, the systems are being modernized and have already gotten rid of many of their shortcomings inherent in the initial projects, such as: low magazine capacity, outdated sighting mounting system, inability to use additional elements that improve ergonomics, etc.

The ergonomics of the new machine gun are definitely better than those of the Vintorez/VAL family, but it’s not so bad as to warrant developing and adopting a new system. Moreover, some of the problems are being successfully solved, for example, a more ergonomic stock was installed on the VSSM (modernized Vintorez).


AM-17 is also there and shoots. But not at the front, but in the hands armory bloggers. Blogger RAZVEDOS on the territory of the Russian University of Special Forces named after. V.V. Putin.

Is there a need to increase the production of systems chambered for 9x39 mm, especially enough to put another model into service?

In general, no. There are a lot of things missing at the front, a lot of things we would like more of, but there seems to be no acute shortage of 9x39 mm caliber systems. Their tasks are very specific.


A soldier of the army special forces of the RF Armed Forces with a VSSM rifle in the area of ​​the SVO.

The Espanyol fighter says that the machine gun can be an excellent second weapon for a sniper pair. But is there any point in using a small-sized assault rifle with a caliber of 9x39 mm, and not 5,45x39 mm? By and large, no.

Moreover, the AMB-17 cannot be a universal weapon; it uses very specific ammunition. In fact, the 9x39 mm tandem and Vintorez were created for one specific task - to silently shoot a sentry at a distance of up to 400 meters. Just a “regular” machine gun caliber would be more universal. Fortunately, there is now a huge variety of PBS, standard and “can” sights, and commercial sights.

So the “replacement for Ksyukha” AM-17 would be more relevant at the front, especially since the crews of various equipment also seem to be waiting for it.


There is an AKS-74U at the front, but not there, not everyone has enough.

Perhaps the fact is that Vintorez/VAL are produced not by Kalashnikov Concern JSC, but by other enterprises of the domestic military-industrial complex. Why shouldn’t they occupy the niche of army special silent weapons? Moreover, now Kalashnikov has an ace in the hole in the form of the Deputy Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation, including those who monitor the implementation of state defense orders, the former general director of Kalashnikov Concern JSC.


Vintorez/VAL is not the only system chambered for the 9x39 mm cartridge in the SVO zone. A fighter of the 11th Separate Guards Air Assault Brigade of the Airborne Forces in the Northern Military District zone with the OTs-14 “Groza” complex. In the 1990s, several systems for 9x39 mm ammunition were born.

Be that as it may, let’s hope that the operation of the AMB-17 will provide additional information and experience to our gunsmiths, and most importantly, will help our soldiers bring the final victory closer.


The modernized “VAL” of our fighter in the North Military District zone attracts attention with a 30-round magazine.
71 comment
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  1. +2
    April 13 2024 04: 10
    AMB-17 - why and why

    One head of papaya, Don Ricardo!
    The bicycle has been invented!!! Today we are looking at its modifications, made using new materials and technologies.
    Blasters and other weapons based on new physical principles are not yet available... Or available to those who move through thorns to the stars.
    1. 0
      April 13 2024 22: 22
      Or maybe just a banal cut? Will you crush this “market” for yourself?
      1. +4
        April 14 2024 13: 47
        Quote: SKVichyakow
        Or maybe just a banal cut? Will you crush this “market” for yourself?

        Yes, the usual promotion of its product by the developer, fortunately, it is military time and conducting military tests in combat conditions is not a problem. They armed the reconnaissance unit with a new automatic weapon with all the equipment and ammunition and let them fight. Test results and user reviews will be used as an asset... or archive. And it will prove to be more convenient\practical\error-free\accurate, and there will be a decent chance to launch it into series and offer your product to import customers.
        And the reconnaissance unit will not refuse such a freebie either - a new silent one, with a heavy bullet, with new ergonomics.
        Quote: SKVichyakow
        banal cut?

        Quite the contrary. I wouldn’t be surprised if the developer, at his own expense, prepared a pilot batch, the entire body kit, purchased ammunition and consumables and delivered it to a specific unit for testing. But even if at the expense of the Moscow Region, this is definitely not a “cut.” These are military tests.
    2. 0
      April 14 2024 18: 00
      It seems that Val is very high maintenance.
      We need to see how things are going with this machine.
      Does a 9 mm cartridge penetrate body armor?
  2. 0
    April 13 2024 04: 16
    We must fight not with numbers, but with the ability to apply it to the required task.
  3. +29
    April 13 2024 04: 30
    After reading the material, a certain analogy arises. The Kalashnikov concern began to resemble the Sukhoi company in aircraft manufacturing and the Saturn company in engine building. Namely, having gone a long way and having acquired their own lobby “at the top,” they suppress and destroy competitors, crushing them under themselves and promoting exclusively their products.
    Everyone is well aware of the actual defeat of the MiG, Il, Tu, Yak design bureaus.
    The “war of destruction” between Saturn and the Perm engine-building complex has not been forgotten.
    And now Kalashnikov. It might be a good idea to make a new (or another) type of weapon. But what kind of justifications are there for its promotion? No special ones. The niche is filled with models that are far from outdated. Export prospects are not particularly bright. Do you need a boy?
    But they will still push...
    1. +8
      April 13 2024 04: 59
      Quote: U-58
      Namely, having gone a long way and having acquired their own lobby “at the top,” they suppress and destroy competitors, crushing them under themselves and promoting exclusively their products.

      Ordinary CAPITALISM!
      1. +10
        April 13 2024 05: 47
        Quote from: AllX_VahhaB
        Ordinary CAPITALISM!

        How can I say, but how can I call the way Yakovlev or Tupolev crushed all competitors, not always the best examples?
        1. +1
          April 13 2024 12: 22
          Quote: U-58
          It might be a good idea to make a new (or another) type of weapon. But what kind of justifications are there for its promotion?
          In my opinion, if the machine gun is already at the front, you need to wait for the reviews and, based on them, make decisions about which machine guns to equip the Army with.
          At one time, the competition against the ancestor of the AM-17 was won by the AK-74, now the requirements have changed slightly and, apparently, the Dragunov assault rifle turned out to be more promising, which was not considered before
    2. +7
      April 13 2024 05: 25
      having come a long way and having acquired their own lobby “at the top”, they suppress and destroy competitors, crushing them under themselves and promoting exclusively their products
      Kalashnikov has already gone so far as to start producing drones! I have the impression that some officials own shares in this company and promote this company, being a powerful battering ram against competitors. Once upon a time, designer Yakovlev, favored by Stalin, had serious administrative resources, but even in his time there was competition between design bureaus. Without this it is impossible
      1. +7
        April 13 2024 07: 37
        Quote: Dutchman Michel
        Kalashnikov has already gone so far as to start producing drones! I have the impression that Some officials own shares in this company and promote this company, acting as a powerful battering ram against competitors.

        And I am confident that our officials, in addition to the official salary, have shares in the “necessary” companies, which provide them with annual dividends that are orders of magnitude higher than income from the state... And everything is according to the law, and there is no corruption...
        And what kind of corruption can Volodin have? And 66 a year is not such a lot of money compared to Mantura’s 000...
    3. +15
      April 13 2024 05: 55
      Everyone is well aware of the actual defeat of the MiG, Il, Tu, Yak design bureaus.

      Actually, this is a rather objective process. Current technologies are so complex that only powerful design and industrial groups can use them. No one can afford to maintain more than two of them anymore, and certainly not the Russian Federation. Pay attention to the richest USA - from a large pool of aerospace corporations 30 years ago, there were actually three left - Lockheed Martin, Boeing, Northrop Grumman... And then - apparently, mattress makers think that this is too much... Yes - there are still a bunch There are smaller corporations, sometimes representatives of related fields intervene, but the main pie in this industry is still divided between these three. It's the same with engines - either Pratt & Whitney or General Electric. Sometimes the truth is given to the British Rolls-Royce...

      Well, the current bourgeois Russian Federation cannot handle FIVE powerful research and production design bureaus at once! There won’t be enough money, there won’t be enough personnel, and alas, there won’t be many orders. This is not the Soviet Union. And even more so - with the catastrophic defeat of domestic civil aviation, carried out under the wise leadership of the beloved guarantor...

      Another thing is that Sukhoi was allowed not to absorb, but rather to destroy its competitors... Which now turns out to be rotten. But this is the same with us as always during the time of blessed capitalism... The battle for the loot leaves only corpses in its wake.
      1. -1
        April 13 2024 06: 03
        from the large pool of aerospace corporations 30 years ago, there are actually three left - Lockheed Martin, Boeing, Northrop Grumman
        This is the result of competition, and not pushing other companies with their hands, using administrative resources wink
        1. +8
          April 13 2024 06: 06
          Come on - do you seriously think that in the blessed West the concept of administrative resource is not familiar?? Right now!! Worse than ours.. Only it is called beautifully and foreign - lobby.. Whoever brought in the most wins. And everything is quite official...
          1. -7
            April 13 2024 06: 09
            Only it is called beautifully and foreign - lobby
            The lobby is not a squeeze on business or bureaucratic chaos. All this is transparent. Although, of course, there is undoubtedly the promotion of someone’s interests. You can't keep track of everything
            1. +12
              April 13 2024 06: 14
              Well, of course - where does the chaos come from? And even more so, squeezing out the business... It’s just that, for objective reasons, all orders go to your competitor, who after a while simply buys you out of impoverishment with all your giblets... And everything is absolutely transparent. Only the result is similar - there are fewer and fewer people fussing around the pie.
        2. +7
          April 13 2024 06: 13
          Quote: Dutchman Michel
          This is the result of competition, and not pushing other companies with their hands, using administrative resources

          laughing laughing laughing
          Fair capitalist competition! The market decided it itself! laughing laughing laughing
          I didn’t think that there were still people who believed in these tales of the 80s/90s... lol
          1. +4
            April 13 2024 06: 18
            Alas, Chubais managed to bite many before he left for a well-deserved rest in his historical homeland... sad
      2. 0
        April 13 2024 06: 10
        Quote: paul3390
        And even more so - with the catastrophic defeat of domestic civil aviation, carried out under the wise leadership of the beloved guarantor...

        Actually, civil aviation was destroyed before him...
        1. +7
          April 13 2024 06: 17
          Is it true?? And under whom was the final decision made to buy exclusively imported aircraft? Well - or like your own, but with an overwhelming share of imported components? Ass?
          1. +2
            April 13 2024 06: 25
            Quote: paul3390
            Who made the decision to buy exclusively imported aircraft?

            So by that time our own aviation industry was destroyed. Even under Gaidar. By the way, the USSR aviation industry was not concentrated exclusively in the RSFSR. Dozens of related enterprises were scattered throughout the Union. With the collapse of the USSR, the industry also collapsed. And the “leaders” of that time had no time to recreate it within the Russian Federation, especially when they were lobbying for something completely different from overseas. We need to do privatization! Expropriate state property! The fact that the military-industrial complex has survived is already a MIRACLE!
            1. +6
              April 13 2024 06: 33
              Come on... Even by 2005, not everything was lost yet... Yes, the design bureaus suffered significant damage, but at least they were somehow afloat. The base remained, and the personnel remained. Yes, and there were some achievements. And if what they are feverishly trying to finish on their knees now had been ordered then, the situation would have been completely different.. But the guarantor ordered the purchase of Boeings and Airbuses..

              Here is the epic with the Tu-204 and its variants - it was almost ready! AND? What happened next? And now, bending in yogic poses, we bite our knees...
      3. 0
        April 13 2024 17: 19
        You say that, it seems like the state is dragging the design bureau on its back. In the Russian Federation there can and should be several design bureaus both in weapons production and in the production of equipment. The design bureaus are pushing and pulling themselves. It’s simply time for the state to end its monopoly ordering of equipment from only one design bureau. And this applies to everything: from simple shooting to aircraft and space construction. Otherwise, in a monopoly market with monopoly orders in only one design bureau, we will really go rotten and will have rotten rifles and rotten equipment. It is competition that makes techies' brains work.
    4. +1
      April 13 2024 10: 17
      And if you conduct an experiment: Yes, an automatic machine is needed, but it will be produced at the expense of the salaries of the Concern’s managers and, of course, the general manager, directors and shareholders’ dividends. Yes, and also add the deputy’s salary. Minister of Defense, who is a former director of the Concern. Don't touch the salaries of workers and engineers! I’m wondering when the people listed above will say that no one needs this machine gun anyway?
    5. 0
      April 13 2024 15: 08
      It seems that the FAS and the prosecutor's office should take a close look at the concern, as well as the contempt, if he wants to show himself as a real democrat, and not ....., the likes of whom are driven from office with pissing rags and their propaganda is banned in Russia.
  4. fiv
    0
    April 13 2024 05: 41
    Well, at least it didn’t turn out to be a PMM, that’s good.
    1. +3
      April 13 2024 09: 45
      Oddly enough, PMM is still in demand, produced and sold by the manufacturer. Unlike PM. Main buyers: TFR, FSIN and FSO.
      Actually, in the niche of a 12-round pestle for concealed carry in civilian life, it has no competitors.
  5. +1
    April 13 2024 05: 48
    Please tell me, we used to have a tradition of the last letter in naming a weapon being the surname of the creator.
    AMBD should be - Dragunov at the end. (SKS, AK, etc.)
    What happened?
  6. +5
    April 13 2024 05: 52
    Medvedev with a machine gun in the photo is, well, just a monument.
    1. +2
      April 13 2024 06: 04
      Medvedev with a machine gun in the photo is like a monument
      You probably haven't seen his iPhone photos wink
      1. +1
        April 13 2024 06: 26
        With an iPhone he looked a bit stupid, but here he looks like bronze.
        1. 0
          April 13 2024 09: 51
          What kind of bronze? Only in granite drinks
        2. -1
          April 13 2024 18: 33
          With an iPhone he looked a bit stupid, but here he looks like bronze.
          No need to cast. It needs to be flogged. On marble (or in?)
          1. 0
            April 13 2024 19: 06
            Carve? Agree. Only not on the marble, but on the stable. laughing
            1. -1
              April 13 2024 19: 40
              Only not on the marble, but on the stable.
              laughing good
    2. -1
      April 13 2024 08: 51
      Quote: Andrey Moskvin
      Medvedev with a machine gun in the photo is, well, just a monument.

      Checkers are missing!
    3. 0
      April 13 2024 09: 34
      This is him imagining himself in battle with a beautiful machine gun! Well, he's a real hero!!!
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  8. 0
    April 13 2024 06: 28
    a lower receiver makes it easier to work with optics

    The question is controversial. Depends on physical parameters. I have long paws and a long neck, and after installing a newfangled stock on my rifle bike I had to change the rings to super high ones - well, it’s inconvenient for me to bend the stupid thing to the eyepiece like that..
    1. 0
      April 13 2024 10: 11
      The lower the optic is to the barrel, the better for efficiency and convenience. At one time, on the small scale, the TOZ-99 knocked down all the mechanical sights in order to place the sight as low as possible. Subsequently, I purchased weapons either without mechanical sights at all, or where they could be dismantled.
      Leupold had a series of sights with a large lens, in order to position it as low as possible, they distorted it - they made a notch in it.
      1. 0
        April 13 2024 11: 20
        The lower the optic is to the barrel, the better for performance and convenience.

        I hope you are writing this not only on the basis of your youthful petty experience? As for this sight - yeah, a powerful argument... Can you imagine the diameter of such a lens? And how high should it be raised to install it? It has a 56 eyepiece only, and a length of 340. Without hemorrhoids, this can only be placed on a rifle without a rear sight at all, otherwise it will get stuck. And in order not to narrow the audience, they resorted to such perversion. Otherwise, you’ll find hell of a ring under it. So this is an unfortunate example to put it mildly...
        1. -7
          April 13 2024 12: 22
          In the youthful sense? I’ve been a penny for a long time and in my youth I didn’t have access to small things, the communists banned everything, but now I have small things as my main entertainment tool, from 1996 to the present, so it’s in trends. And yes - it does not have mechanical sighting devices, why are they not needed for sports and hunting shooting. Most manufacturers have realized this; just look at the catalogs - how many models are offered for sale without mechanics.
          My bullets at the current moment in time and space drinks
          1. +6
            April 13 2024 17: 01
            Quote: hhurik
            the communists banned everything

            In a parallel universe or what? belay After being in vocational school in Afghanistan, my father was initially a physical education teacher and a shooting instructor. There was a basement equipped... I’ve been shooting since I was 6 years old... tozy, margolin, even shooting from Khaidur’s TX-62. Uncle was in charge of the hunting base - there were bears and leopards and other rifled request
            1. +2
              April 13 2024 18: 29
              In Soviet times, in high school (1970-72), our military instructor Nikolai Yegorovich not only forced everyone to shoot from the air, but also equipped a shooting range in the basement of the school, where we shot from small guns, and also from AKs in the shooting range of the Anti-Aircraft School. In addition, he gave a theory of shooting. He was a good retiree, I understand that now.
              1. +5
                April 13 2024 18: 41
                After demobilization in 2001, I was resting, hanging around, they took the military registration and enlistment office, first through special communications as the deputy of the 1st department, then the head of the secretariat... but I realized that it was not for me.... I asked the military commissar.... As a result, they gave me a contract and training in sniper lines. I got to the instructor... I won’t say his last name... Call sign Grandfather... to him then as I am now. He knew who my grandfather was... he drilled me so much that I began to hate him and there were a couple of fights (reports) that I was almost fired. Now I understand that I myself was an idiot and what a wagon of knowledge he passed on to me. When I was discharged due to injury at the end of 2004, without question they appointed me as an instructor for a 2-year contract in another training school. Although it was hard, of course... I was still essentially learning to walk again.
                ZY And Grandfather went... at 65 on his own... died under work six months ago. recourse soldier
              2. +1
                April 14 2024 18: 07
                Quote: Aviator_
                but also equipped a shooting range in the basement of the school, where we shot from small guns

                We also had a shooting range. But we shot according to the standards because no one will just give out cartridges.
                1. 0
                  April 14 2024 19: 07
                  But we shot according to the standards because no one will just give out cartridges.
                  So we do not do it out of nothing to do, but within the framework of the standards of the GTO complex. It was updated in the early 70s and schools began to require its implementation.
                2. 0
                  April 17 2024 17: 15
                  Quote from Kartograph
                  We also had a shooting range. But we shot according to the standards


                  As part of the NVP - five rounds and a target - for each student.

                  Quote from Kartograph
                  no one will just give you ammunition.


                  So our military commander led the rifle section and even if you shoot yourself with a small rifle...
                  Level 2 was easy. And then it gets worse - the vision is not very good.
          2. +4
            April 13 2024 17: 09
            Editing time has expired....
            Z.Y By the way, the experience from the tiger was especially useful to me in the first battle 13 years later... when our company commander was wounded, etc. I had a friend in the department and knew that I was somehow proficient, unlike the selection committee of the military registration and enlistment office (which preferred to make me a signalman)... in return for Ksyukha they gave me an IED, a machine gunner and another guy, also a conscript, to load magazines... like that and fought. After the fight, my hands were shaking like a drunkard after a binge.... then they injected me with something and gave me gabopentin. 170+- shots... from 200 to 400 meters. There is an invoice, as well as a sheet...
            ZY It turned out that I have essentialism, just like my father...
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          3. +1
            April 14 2024 12: 41
            In the youthful sense? I’ve been a penny for a long time and in my youth I didn’t have access to small things, the communists banned everything, but now I have small things as my main entertainment tool, from 1996 to the present, so it’s in trends.
            It is clear that it was not for nothing that they were banned. It would be better to practice badmenton laughing
          4. 0
            April 19 2024 13: 58
            The commies didn’t forbid a damn thing... At school every week they shot with small guns. And the military instructor was a former sniper.. So all the skills came from there... Of course, the toys are completely different..
  9. +6
    April 13 2024 06: 40
    The most remarkable thing about the article is the photograph of the LADIES. It evokes a strange association:
    The guy is standing on the porch
    With an expression on his face...
  10. +1
    April 13 2024 08: 42
    And again we are trying to apply what we have where it is not needed. Narrow specialist 9×39. Why is it massive? And even more so as number 2 for snipers??? The ballistics of this cartridge are for thoughtful shooting. Off the top of my head, how will it work with greenery?
    For the second number, the 9×21 caliber is ideal. Fortunately, the light BBhi have been used up.
    1. Owl
      +3
      April 13 2024 13: 10
      Small-sized weapons, equipped with low-noise and flameless shooting devices, are necessary not only for the second numbers in sniper pairs, they are in great demand in military reconnaissance, in assault units and for special operations forces.
      1. +1
        April 13 2024 17: 20
        But distances up to 200 meters... shooting at the maximum 400 with VSS is a separate class of sado-maso and I know guys who are into it.
        Quote: Eagle Owl
        necessary not only for the second numbers in sniper pairs

        Even a company sniper works from 400 to 800 meters with SVD/m/u, etc. Why does the whip need number 2 when the company commander is not even taught this! You somehow diverged in your fantasies. The choice of VSS or VAL in special units depends only on how much one or the other is planned. For a long time - SHAFT, several hours - VSS. Associated with the specifics of barrel manufacturing and some differences in automation
        1. Owl
          +1
          April 14 2024 20: 07
          Low-noise weapons are used by a sniper pair for self-defense in position or while moving.
  11. Owl
    0
    April 13 2024 13: 06
    Magazine for 30 rounds of 9x39 - this is the first time I’ve seen a photo.
    1. +1
      April 13 2024 17: 21
      This is a perversion that no one needs.... They would fix the 20s, from which if you charge more than 16, there are constant wedges or shortfalls. Not to mention the fact that if you lost your family’s 10s, that’s all. crying
  12. 0
    April 13 2024 13: 59
    for the Russian Guard and the Ministry of Internal Affairs, it’s the same thing in return for Ksyukha.
    1. -2
      April 13 2024 16: 37
      The existing weapons of the Ministry of Internal Affairs are quite sufficient to solve the assigned tasks.
      1. 0
        April 13 2024 19: 56
        not exactly a weaker cartridge
        1. -2
          April 13 2024 21: 36
          Maybe you don’t know - the Ministry of Internal Affairs is armed with the same machine guns, rifles and machine guns as other law enforcement agencies. And the pistol spitters, like in the photo (which I attached for fun), are just pranks.
          When the wind is without bricks - they carry something lighter, the roast rooster has pecked - they are equipped with heavier equipment. It's an everyday matter. Therefore, AMB-17, etc., is not needed. hi , there are other problems through the roof.
  13. -4
    April 13 2024 18: 05
    This is not a machine gun, but a PP with a bullet that is shitty in terms of ballistics
  14. 0
    April 13 2024 19: 55
    Back in the early 2000s, an assault rifle chambered for 9x39 mm, the AK-9, appeared. At first it was simply a conversion of the AKS-74U for a different ammunition.
    Using the 9x39 cartridge in a weapon that is not specially designed for it is a waste of money: the roar of the automation will not allow the weapon to be considered low-noise.
    1. 0
      April 13 2024 22: 11
      You're getting a little confused here: low-noise doesn't mean silent. And yes, not only the noise is produced by the arrow, but also by the flash
    2. 0
      April 19 2024 14: 01
      I guess my little mind wasn’t strong enough to flare the 5,45 sleeve to 7,62 and it would have turned out to be an excellent fart for the police, but it didn’t work out... Now it’s impossible
  15. -2
    April 14 2024 12: 50
    Quote: oppozite28
    In the youthful sense? I’ve been a penny for a long time and in my youth I didn’t have access to small things, the communists banned everything, but now I have small things as my main entertainment tool, from 1996 to the present, so it’s in trends.
    It is clear that it was not for nothing that they were banned. It would be better to practice badmenton laughing


    “Professor, why do animals lick their eggs?”
    - Because they can!

    Badminton (English: badminton, from the proper name: Badminton) - guess what, that’s what it’s called. At one time it was better not to lick eggs, but to study.
  16. 0
    April 19 2024 17: 48
    What’s the problem, well, a special machine gun. They will not arm them en masse. But in general it can be useful...
    In theory, in order to revive weapons under 9*39, it would be necessary to develop a good supersonic armor-piercing cartridge for it. Silent weapons are good, but they have poor flatness, a short effective range and, taking into account the development of modern personal protective equipment, have insufficient armor penetration.
    If we solve this issue so that a fighter does not have to carry 2 machine guns, but simply take a different ammunition, this would greatly simplify people’s lives and make the weapon more versatile.
    They say that the Storms will be partially armed with the ASh-12, but I think that with 9*39 it would be possible to squeeze out even more... A lighter bullet with a tungsten carbide core and an initial speed of 600-700 m/s, instead 300, would make it possible to obtain an assault rifle with significant armor-piercing power and high stopping power.
    The only thing is that due to the very different ballistics of the bullets, you will have to think something about the zeroing of the sights, but I think we can come up with something.
  17. 0
    April 21 2024 16: 47
    Well, if Ksyukha is no longer produced, then the AM-17 is very appropriate.
    And for the police, the undeservedly forgotten 9A-91 suits the suit. Not to be confused with another undeservedly forgotten A-91 assault rifle.