Antiques in the service of the Armed Forces of Ukraine

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Antiques in the service of the Armed Forces of Ukraine
Still from a video from April 2023, a unit of the Ukrainian Armed Forces with Maxim machine guns mod. 1910/1930. Clearly civilian transport is visible in the background; another current problem of the Armed Forces of Ukraine is the lack of vehicles and tractors.


Literally in passing we can mention the rifle weapons.



The giggling and hawing about Mosin rifles among those mobilized from the People's Militia of the Donetsk People's Republic ended quite quickly. This situation was typical only for the Donetsk mobilized, but not for the Lugansk ones. Why is a topic for another discussion. But those mobilized were increased in terms of supply, and then the DPR NM units were included in the RF Armed Forces. Everyone has practically forgotten about “mosinki”.


A machine gun in the ranks of the Ukrainian Armed Forces in, probably, the only role suitable for it in modern realities - the main weapon in a bunker or bunker. And here, too, on a rare Vladimirov machine from 1931. A real rarity.

But comedians under the leadership of a former Kaveen member began to have problems with small arms of all calibers already in 2022. It was not possible to solve them only at the expense of the Western allies, the problem was so acute and of such magnitude.

On the territory of Ukraine there are several huge warehouses that the country inherited from the USSR, these are:

– 65th Arsenal – ammunition storage base of the Central Missile and Artillery Directorate of the Armed Forces of Ukraine (outskirts of the city of Balakleya, Kharkov region);
– “Shepetivka Repair Plant” (military unit A-2394).

Yes, for many these are warehouses specifically for artillery weapons and ammunition for various artillery systems, as well as an enterprise for the repair and modernization of artillery weapons. But ask any collector of models of firearms from the Great Patriotic War period if he knows what Balakleya and Shepetovka are, and he will probably show you at least one item from his collection with the inscription on it - “Wined in Ukraine.”

At one time it was a whole business - the sale of Soviet warehouses. This also applied to small arms from the Great Patriotic War. Some of it was deactivated and sold in the form of models, including in Russia, some were sold as is. For example, rifles and submachine guns went to the USA. The famous YouTuber Hickok45 in one of his videos fired from a Thompson submachine gun, “which was imported from the former USSR.”


A still from a video with soldiers of the 46th Special Operations Brigade of the Ukrainian Armed Forces, where they complain about the “new” equipment issued when the unit was formed. All the unit’s machine guns turned out to be Soviet and manufactured in the 1930s–1940s.

Mosin rifles have not yet become a ubiquitous phenomenon, but Soviet machine guns that fought in the Great Patriotic War are already a widespread phenomenon in the ranks of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Moreover, if somewhere they are found sporadically, then in parts of the local Volksturm (terrorist defense) and not only in the rear and in secondary, quiet areas, they can form the basis of machine-gun armament of entire units.

CBA-118


In 2013, at the exhibition “Zbroya and Bezpeka-2013”, a new development of the DP “KBAO”, which was part of the Ukroboronprom House of Culture, was presented - the 60-mm mortar KBA-118. The mortar was supposed to solve problems similar to those solved by the AGS-17, and at the same distances. Own, unique, unparalleled - and that’s all. Now the mortar is often positioned as a special forces weapon.


2016, the leader of Ukraine is shown the “newest” KBA-118.

The mortar is indeed unique, but not because of its characteristics, but because stories appearance, or rather, who are its progenitors. In fact, this is an exact copy of the Chinese Type 63-1 mortar. The Chinese model once fought in the civil war in China, then in Korea. From China, the already modernized version came to Pakistan and Egypt. A Pakistani copy under the designation Fateh fought with the hands of the Mujahideen against the 40th Army in Afghanistan.

How did the Chinese get their mortar?

And they copied, without any licenses, the American M2 mortar, which was also supplied to the Kuomintang troops during the war with Japan. This is how the Type 31 appeared, which later became the Type 63-1. And the American itself is a licensed copy of the French Brandt Mle 1935, which was put into service in 1935.


KBA-118 in the SVO zone. In the foreground is what makes the 80-year-old structure truly dangerous - American M768A1 mortar mines with M734A1 fuses.

It must be said that in fact, Brandt’s designs are the progenitors of all modern mortars, and the Mle 1935/M2 was a very successful design, quite widespread, copied and used in dozens of countries. But the fact remains that in 2013, the Ukrainian Armed Forces received a copy of a copy of an 80-year-old French mortar.

The mortar is still fighting and is a rather dangerous weapon, largely thanks to the latest generation of modern 60-mm ammunition supplied by Western countries, but that’s a completely different story.

BS-3


The weapon was created during the Great Patriotic War as a response to the emergence of new German heavy weapons. tanks and as an analogue of the German heavy anti-tank gun Pak 43. The resulting 100-mm field gun of the 1944 model (BS-3) turned out to be lighter and more mobile than its German counterpart, plus the USSR had already produced a suitable tractor for such a system by that time. Several hundred of these guns fought as part of the Red Army anti-tank artillery brigades at the final stage of the Great Patriotic War.


Ukrainian BS-3 in the NWO zone.

Like many other types of weapons, these artillery systems went to the new “independent” state in 1991. In 2012, it seemed that the age of these guns was over in Ukraine, and the BS-3 went into storage. But in 2014 the dust was blown off them again, and the guns returned to combat units. Over time, the guns were removed from the front.

But in 2023, they again began to appear in footage from the front. The situation with the artillery of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, despite all the attempts of Western partners, is only getting worse, and during the battles near Bakhmut, old Soviet artillery systems, such as D-44 and BS-3, began to appear in photographs. There is no longer any need to talk about any anti-tank role of these guns; in fact, they are used for firing from closed firing positions outside the line of sight of the enemy.


Loading Lithuanian M101s for shipment to Ukraine, September 2022. Yes, this is how they transport weapons and ammunition to Ukraine, in ordinary civilian trucks across the border with Poland.

M101 Howitzer


This designation hides the American M2A1 howitzer of the 1940 model. The howitzer was renamed after World War II. A real weapon of victory for American artillerymen of World War II.

The gun, produced in a gigantic edition of more than 10 copies, fought as part of the US Armed Forces on all fronts of World War II, in Korea and Vietnam. It was distributed to the armies of dozens of countries and remains in service in many of them to this day.

Until recently, one of the last episodes of combat use of these howitzers was the battles in the Philippine city of Marawi in 2017. M101s of the Philippine Army destroyed the positions of Islamic fundamentalists in dense urban areas, both from indirect positions and with direct fire.


A still from the first video of the M101 being used in the Northern Military District zone, November 2022.

In September 2022, it was announced that Lithuania would transfer 16 guns from its stocks to Ukraine, namely from storage. As of the beginning of 2023, Lithuania seems to have gotten rid of all available M101s (54 units) in favor of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Slovenia donated another 16 guns.

Immediately upon arrival, these howitzers glowed actively in news issues. Information on the bright side was almost everywhere presented with the sauce - “Russians can be beaten even with such museum antiques.”

By the end of 2022, the flow of news about the M101 almost completely stopped, apparently due to their active elimination, there was nothing much to brag about.


M101 at the front, January 2023.

But Lithuania threw in more artillery systems, and the most surprising thing is that these guns, apparently, were still fighting in mid-2023. At least, the last current shots of the M101 in the front-line artillery units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine date back to the end of spring - beginning of summer 2023.

The safety factor built into the gun by American designers back in 1940, and new artillery ammunition from the same BAE Systems, fully allow these guns to compete in range with domestic 122 mm caliber systems.

In general, the current conflict has shown that range is the Achilles heel of all our artillery, but this, again, is a topic for another discussion.


The result of the work of our artillerymen is a hole in the frame from a fragment of a Russian shell, January 2023.

The SVO became a real melting pot, in which the entire Soviet weapons heritage of Eastern Europe was disposed of by the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Now, unfortunately, things that are more than unique and historical have also gone there, the place of which is more likely in a museum.

But the situation may get worse, because some participants have a desire to continue the conflict at any cost, and the means will be found. There are examples, after all, the Japanese were seriously going to fight the Americans on their home islands with units of schoolchildren with sharpened bamboo sticks. There are still schoolchildren in Ukraine, and if necessary, they can deliver sticks.


A still from a video of the M101 being used at the front, early summer 2023. Everything is beautiful here, commenting only spoils it.
62 comments
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  1. -24
    5 March 2024 04: 36
    Still from a video from April 2023, Ukrainian Armed Forces unit with Maxim machine guns mod. 1910/1930. Clearly civilian transport is visible in the background; another current problem of the Armed Forces of Ukraine is the lack of vehicles and tractors.
    Of course, a mosquito fly will do, but there are cartridges with a rim.... recourse They haven’t been made for a hundred years, or will they be ordered again from the Japanese-Americans, maybe they still have the drawings from WWII?
    1. kpd
      +34
      5 March 2024 05: 33
      Can you remind me what the Kalashnikov machine gun or Dragunov sniper rifle fires?
      They make these cartridges and they make a lot of them.
      1. +7
        5 March 2024 07: 52
        Quote: kpd
        or the Dragunov sniper rifle, don’t remind me

        Moreover, initially one of the points of the technical specifications was to ensure accuracy when using a bulk machine-gun cartridge. 7N1 appeared a little later
      2. +3
        5 March 2024 09: 04
        In war, all means are good. It makes no difference to those who died whether it was “Sunshine” or “Mosinki”. Homo homini lupus est. Unfortunately what
        1. -4
          5 March 2024 09: 44
          You and I both know that this is not true. There are a couple of videos of the consequences of the “sunshine” and to say that it is horror is to say nothing. I don’t think soldiers ever come to experience the effects of a thermal bar.
          1. -1
            5 March 2024 10: 32
            I don’t argue, but...We’ll all be there. Only in different ways. That's life. "He who is destined to be hanged shall never be drowned." hi
      3. -2
        5 March 2024 20: 07
        The question is how “Maksimka” will eat a varnished cartridge case, a very interesting one.
        1. +2
          5 March 2024 23: 31
          I’ve never seen 7.62x54R in the GS version. As a collector, I am willing to pay for such a rarity. All these cartridges come with a GZh, copper-plated sleeve.
          1. +1
            16 March 2024 21: 57
            Since the second half of the 7,62s, there have been quite a lot of steel sleeves for 54x80, Tula and Novosibirsk have been churning out such cartridges in large quantities. You just have to look.
    2. -1
      5 March 2024 10: 58
      Quote: Mavrikiy
      Of course, a mosquito fly will do, but there are cartridges with a rim.... recourse They haven’t been made for a hundred years, or will they be ordered again from the Japanese-Americans, maybe they still have the drawings from WWII?

      Why go so far? The brothers from Arsenal will always be ready to help: "Why, ten bucks isn’t too much".
  2. +10
    5 March 2024 04: 37
    There are examples, after all, the Japanese were seriously going to fight the Americans on their home islands with units of schoolchildren with sharpened bamboo sticks. There are still schoolchildren in Ukraine, and if necessary, they can deliver sticks.

    If only the author could beat you with such sticks.
  3. 0
    5 March 2024 05: 05
    gun, produced gigantic circulation more than 10 000 copies,
    belay For the sake of a nice word, he won’t spare his father either. request
  4. +11
    5 March 2024 05: 18
    And the American itself is a licensed copy of the French Brandt Mle 1935, which was put into service in 1935.

    you haven't looked at the rocket yet
    The American M-2 Browning heavy machine gun, which is installed on all light armored vehicles, was created in 1918, modernized between the wars, and is still in service.
    1. +3
      5 March 2024 15: 19
      created in 1918, modernization was carried out between the wars

      The main thing is that no one tells the author that all multi-barreled art. systems are
      copies from a copy

      Gatling systems of the shaggy years.
    2. 0
      April 18 2024 12: 13
      In 2010, according to Wiki, a modernization was carried out, which introduced a quickly installed barrel without any changes. Previously, in order to position the barrel of the M2, it was necessary to perform a whole operation with special probes.
  5. +2
    5 March 2024 05: 18
    And the American itself is a licensed copy of the French Brandt Mle 1935, which was put into service in 1935.

    you haven't looked at the rocket yet
    The American M-2 Browning heavy machine gun, which is installed on all light armored vehicles, was created in 1918, modernized between the wars, and is still in service.
  6. +4
    5 March 2024 05: 56
    The length of the mines in the photo and the caliber are confusing - they are clearly larger than can be stuffed into a 60mm mortar
    1. -4
      5 March 2024 07: 53
      Well, there are frequent ruptures, because they probably hammer them in there with a sledgehammer laughing wassat
    2. +4
      5 March 2024 11: 00
      This is the shooting angle. What is close to the lens always seems larger. Fishermen have long mastered it.
      1. +1
        5 March 2024 11: 29
        Quote from solar
        This is the shooting angle. What is close to the lens always seems larger. Fishermen have long mastered it.

        Well, I don’t know, in my opinion they are much larger and longer 60mm.More like 80mm
        1. +1
          5 March 2024 13: 08
          No, this is just the shooting angle
  7. +9
    5 March 2024 06: 04
    It’s obviously not with this rubbish that they’ve been holding the front lines for three years now?
    1. +4
      5 March 2024 08: 39
      Quote from invisible_man
      It’s obviously not with this rubbish that they’ve been holding the front lines for three years now?

      What difference does it make - what bullets flying across the battlefield are fired from for a particular fighter? Rifles are an anachronism, and Browning machine guns have been fighting for 110 years already...
      1. +4
        5 March 2024 09: 33
        Bullets are not as effective now as in previous wars. If you do not have modern artillery and the ability to launch missile and bomb strikes (including high-precision ones) 24/7, it is better not to get involved in an armed conflict at all. Here, by the way, recently there were three arrivals in a row of “Chimeras” for some schizophrenic drill review near the LBS, and they were talking to us about “Maxim” machine guns :)
        1. +1
          5 March 2024 09: 45
          Quote from invisible_man
          Bullets are not as effective now as in previous wars.

          Come on belay belay - are they completely ineffective?
          And vulgar economists believed, based on the economics of wars of the 20th century, that they were the most effective in terms of cost per unit of killed soldier.
          Yesterday there was an article that Syrsky’s audit (which the West demanded to conduct) does not match the 700 people of the Armed Forces of Ukraine....
          1. +2
            5 March 2024 09: 47
            Not to say that they are completely ineffective, but most of the losses in the current conflict namely from artillery and missile and bomb strikes. By the way, we lost another ship this night.
            1. +1
              5 March 2024 11: 55
              Quote from invisible_man
              Not to say that they are completely ineffective, but most of the losses in the current conflict are precisely from artillery and missile and bomb strikes.

              Somewhere I came across a statement that, according to statistics, mortars were the leaders in the destruction of manpower in WWII.
              1. +1
                5 March 2024 17: 57
                Quite possible. Our artillery losses at the beginning of the war were compensated for the most part by increasing the number of mortars. And if the weight of an artillery salvo of classical guns did not catch up with the pre-war one, then taking into account the mortar one it increased significantly.
                The mortar itself is cheap, the mine is cheap and does not require scarce materials and equipment.
          2. +2
            5 March 2024 11: 04
            Quote: your1970
            Yesterday there was an article that Syrsky’s audit (which the West demanded to conduct) does not match the 700 people of the Armed Forces of Ukraine....

            But in terms of the salary paid, everything probably comes together. smile
            1. 0
              5 March 2024 11: 30
              Quote: Alexey RA
              Quote: your1970
              Yesterday there was an article that Syrsky’s audit (which the West demanded to conduct) does not match the 700 people of the Armed Forces of Ukraine....

              But in terms of the salary paid, everything probably comes together. smile

              Well, in any case, it’s down to a pretty penny lol
    2. 0
      5 March 2024 15: 24
      Including this one.
      There is no problem, the main thing is to use it correctly. The same Mosinka is just a repeating rifle, but attach a fancy sight to it and the SVD is already a weak brat
      1. 0
        6 March 2024 07: 27
        The same Mosinka is just a repeating rifle, but put a fancy sight on it

        But put it on! How will you mount it? The receiver wall is thin and will not support a heavy sight. How will you recharge and recharge? Bend the bolt handle with a sledgehammer? The clingers are on our heads....
  8. +10
    5 March 2024 07: 02
    Well, we faced the same problems, the same mosquitoes, and many on TV also proved that these weapons are almost better than modern analogues, it was not for nothing that they began to get T-55s, they also began to install ship guns on all sorts of movable assets, apparently not from good life. I personally am not interested in the enemy’s armed museum (no offense to the author, I read the article and have no desire to criticize), but I would like our soldiers not to have a museum...
    1. +4
      5 March 2024 11: 16
      What the Ukrainians have is their business. We ourselves have recently received a large number of RPDs in our linear units, while individual units also receive DPs.
  9. +10
    5 March 2024 07: 21
    Oh, again we see a speck in someone else’s eye, but we don’t notice the log in ourselves. Some people say that our army was equipped with 70-something new weapons, but for some reason very often rarities end up in the frame. Or do we not understand this too?
    1. +1
      5 March 2024 07: 59
      They did not expect active resistance, a front with a length of 2 thousand km, and that a significant part of these “70 and a penny” would be knocked out in the first year of the war. Hence all the junk in the troops.
  10. +6
    5 March 2024 07: 29
    In any case, these are weapons, there are many of them, they kill. We also have giant warehouses with brand new PPSh in oil and other not modern things, I saw them myself 20 years ago. But if something happens, it won’t matter how you protect your life, the main thing is that it works.
    1. +4
      5 March 2024 07: 54
      In any case, these are weapons, there are many of them, they kill.
      I agree with you. No matter what year the weapon is, it shoots and kills. And the same Maxima machine gun is not so bad in its characteristics, despite the existing disadvantages: weight, dimensions and water cooling of the barrel.
      1. -2
        6 March 2024 07: 31
        Yes the same machine gun "Maxima" is not so bad in its characteristics, with existing disadvantages: weight, dimensions and water cooling of the barrel.

        Have you, specifically you, tried to bring this machine gun into normal combat? How about serving?
    2. +4
      5 March 2024 07: 59
      To the point colleague! Removed from the tongue. In addition, there are such specimens that they are not at all ashamed of them at the front even after many decades. Take the MG-34 for example.... I definitely wouldn’t grow taller than it good laughing
  11. -4
    5 March 2024 08: 19
    The Mosin rifle is a super machine, along with a Kalash, in a trench, and even with a sniper scope, a fairy tale. The only problem is the bayonet, which must be fastened on a regular rifle.
    1. +2
      5 March 2024 09: 09
      from a fairy tale with a sniper scope, you still need to be able to shoot
    2. 0
      6 March 2024 07: 37
      Yes, even with a sniper scope, a fairy tale. Only the whole trouble is in the bayonet,

      Well, of course, with a bayonet! To get a “fairy tale” you just need to screw on the sight...
      For such connoisseurs of Mosin-Nagant optics, I’ll tell you:
      1. The rifle is loaded from a cartridge pack, which is inserted from the TOP into the receiver window.
      2. The bolt handle, in the open position, faces UP.
      Oh! And your sight is in the way, and even the bayonet...
  12. +5
    5 March 2024 09: 09
    I don’t see anything wrong with a machine gun if it is intended for a fortified point. Shoot without fear of overheating the barrel, just add water. Nowadays they just don't make them like that.
    1. -2
      5 March 2024 09: 55
      Now you have more tape from one position and they won’t let you shoot. Instantly a drone or ATGM will arrive.
      1. 0
        5 March 2024 10: 52
        I saw a video on the Internet from some stronghold, where there were bags of shell casings, several bags of shell casings.
  13. +3
    5 March 2024 10: 07
    I thought Ryabov, but I was wrong.
  14. +4
    5 March 2024 10: 35
    Reminds me a little of the parable about envy of a neighbor...
    Like, they recruited rare personnel, and that’s the joy...

    And the fact that 1) for the multi-million population of countries, there will definitely be both working rarities and awkward photos...
    2) in science fiction literature, for example ours, if necessary, they rip out everything that will help from museums... And nothing, no one laughs...
    But "this is different"
  15. +2
    5 March 2024 10: 52
    The gun was created during the Great Patriotic War as a response to the emergence of new German heavy tanks and as an analogue of the German Pak 43 heavy anti-tank gun. The resulting 100 mm field gun model 1944 (BS-3) turned out to be lighter and more mobile than its German counterpart,

    Yeah, yeah... in 1943 they began to create an anti-tank gun without an armor-piercing projectile. smile
    The BS-3 was created as a field gun, which is what you yourself write about. The purpose of its creation was to give the army a light long-range cannon (M-60 in a new way), which would not require scarce heavy artillery tractors and would keep up with mechanized units. For the almost eight-ton A-19 required a Voroshilovets for high-speed towing. And on traditional agricultural tractors it could barely keep up with the infantry.
    At the same Balaton there were 96 BS-3s (all as part of the 2nd UV), but only 16 of them were in the 2nd Guards Iptabr. The remaining 80 pcs. were precisely field guns - in the 61st, 62nd and 63rd corps artillery brigades of the 9th Guards. And also in the 202nd separate light artillery brigade of the 6th Guards. TA.
  16. +1
    5 March 2024 10: 59
    until the cartridges for these guns run out and they will be used, I mean all the equipment from the times of the USSR
  17. +5
    5 March 2024 11: 53
    They also laughed at the rubber boats of the ukroflot for a long time. And above the engines from civilian jet skis installed.....well, you know the rest....
    1. -6
      5 March 2024 12: 09
      compared rubber boats and homemade backs with modern English backs that are controlled via satellite
  18. +5
    5 March 2024 12: 07
    Let us omit how the author clearly mocks the enemy and the state of affairs in our troops. Let's take an example with machine guns; not more than a couple of months ago, the now well-known “Razvedos” was collecting boxes for RPD all over the Internet. As for the easel Maxim, you can say whatever you want, but if his crew is provided with water, cartridges and knows how to wind oil seals, then having settled in a good bunker or, God forbid, in a bunker, he can keep a significant area of ​​​​the terrain under fire and conduct this fire in case necessity almost continuously. Cooling the barrel with water makes the difference. The best machine gun in a bunker is a zeroed machine gun with water cooling.
    1. +5
      5 March 2024 15: 42
      The Maxim system went through the hell of the western front of WWII, and went through the hell of the eastern front of WWII.
      She was in the mud, in the desert, in the ice, in the sky and sea, firing thousands of rounds without stopping. This is the case when proving something is insulting.
      Even hinting at ridicule of these machine guns is a sign of little intelligence.
      1. +1
        5 March 2024 16: 58
        Maxim's biggest drawback is that he is too complex for the current generation. His NSD contains dozens of checks and adjustments that require hands experienced in working with iron and a competent head.
        The adversary, by the way, has the same problems - the only modernization of the M2NV over the 70 years of its existence was associated with the need to simplify the design for modern “users”. So that the calculations do not cripple themselves with hand-to-point adjustments, the ability to adjust the position of the shutter mirror and, EMNIP, the striker, was removed from the design.
        1. 0
          6 March 2024 09: 40
          His NSD contains dozens of checks and adjustments that require hands experienced in working with iron and a competent head.

          Here it is!
        2. 0
          April 18 2024 12: 18
          There are videos on YouTube from Ukrainian Armed Forces instructors who show how to adjust the positioning of the barrel relative to the bolt group. Quite a long and scrupulous process using special tools (probes). So there are also old versions of M2 in the ranks of the Ukrainian Armed Forces. It's better for us. By the time the bonehead adjusts M2, the battle will be over.
  19. +5
    5 March 2024 12: 34
    - Hello, grandfather, I became a tank driver. I have a T-55, can you tell me how to drive it?
    - Give me the number of the tank, maybe this is the same one I drove.
    1. +1
      5 March 2024 21: 41
      Soon it will come to "Shermanoy".)))
  20. +9
    5 March 2024 14: 47
    The article is a vivid example of stupid propaganda. If you follow the logic (or rather the lack thereof) of the author, then the Ukrainian army, armed with all sorts of antiques and bamboo sticks, has been opposing, and quite successfully, the “second army of the world”, armed with 70 percent “analog” weapons for the third year.
    By the way, the author does not want to write the same bravura piece about the fleet. Things are really bad for Ukraine there - no ships, no sailors.
    1. +6
      5 March 2024 15: 45
      Ukraine is doing very badly there - no ships, no sailors

      And they drown it.
  21. 0
    7 March 2024 15: 19
    One thing is not clear: if these arsenals are known, then why are they not in the stratosphere, with all the museum or imported goods?