Savage vs Colt

22
Savage vs Colt
Revolver "Savage". The photograph clearly shows all the features of its design: the presence of a traditional lever for tightly driving bullets under the barrel, as well as a lever combined with a trigger located inside a particularly large bracket. The fire tubes extend to the outer surface of the drum. Photo of Rock Island Auction


Van Horne was wearing a white sixpenny
a paper shirt covering the torso and belt,
on which dangled a tobacco pouch,
knife in sheath, cartridge clips
and a large automatic revolver in a leather holster.

Jack London "Jerry Islanders"
lane A. V. Krivtsova

stories about weapons. Today we will once again have an article from the “weapons against weapons” series. And it will tell about the rivalry between two well-known American companies: Colt and Savage in their attempt to create an automatic pistol for the army. “Savage” lost then, although he still achieved something. But if I hadn’t lost, then all story military pistols in the United States could have gone very differently.



It is well known that in the mid-1th century in the United States, the handgun market was dominated by the company of Samuel Colt. She had few competitors. This is primarily the Smith and Wesson company, which launched the production of cartridge revolvers No. 2 and XNUMX, and the Remington company, which produced a revolver with a closed frame, which looked purely visually more durable and, in addition, had a replaceable drum.

Fighting them was a very risky business, but there were two people who decided to do it. They were Henry S. North and Edward Savage from Middletown, Connecticut, owners of the North and Savage company, which in 1860 they renamed the Savage Revolving Arms Company. On May 7, 1861, they were able to sign a contract with the US government to supply the army with 5 revolvers of their design at a price of $500 apiece. However, in the first two years of the war alone, the government purchased 20 of these revolvers from them at an average price of $11. Moreover, by June 284, the company supplied more than 19 revolvers to the troops. In addition, she had a separate contract with the Navy for 1862 revolvers, also at a price of $10 apiece.


The Savage revolver with the so-called “nipple trigger”, a modified handle shape and without the ability to slide the drum onto the barrel. In this form, it was practically no different from Colt revolvers. Photo of Rock Island Auction

Since the Navy was the first to order these revolvers from the firm, the 1861 model was named Navy. But they were also used by the following US Army regiments: the 1st Wisconsin US Volunteer Cavalry, the 2nd Wisconsin US Volunteer Cavalry, the 5th Kansas Volunteer Cavalry, and the 7th New York Cavalry Regiment.

Confederate States Army regiments used them as well. These were the 34th Virginia Cavalry, 35th Virginia Cavalry, 11th Texas Cavalry, 7th Virginia Cavalry, and 7th Missouri Cavalry.

And here the question arises: “What was it about these revolvers that the government ordered them in such quantities? After all, it was more expensive than the same time-tested Colt revolvers?”

Judging by the markings, North and Savage began work on this revolver as early as 1856 and received patents for it in 1856, 1859 and 1860. Like the Colt, it was a six-shot .0,36 caliber percussion revolver. It seemed like there was nothing special about it, but that’s only at first glance.

Unlike Colt's revolvers, which were manually cocked (which is why they had such a short trigger pull), their revolver had a separate cocking lever or trigger ring. When it was pulled back, the hammer was cocked and the drum rotated. When the ring was released, the revolver drum moved forward and was mounted with a chamber on the conical part of the barrel, which made it possible to provide a gas-tight connection, which was later used on Pieper-Nagant revolvers.

So the designers took care of the shooter’s safety to a much greater extent than the Colt gunsmiths. After all, one of the main problems of the revolvers of that time was the dangerous possibility of the drum exploding due to the breakthrough of gases when firing into its neighboring chambers, or the so-called “chain fire”.

That is, the revolver had, firstly, a movable drum, which increased the safety of its use. Secondly, it was self-cocking, which reduced the pressure on the trigger and thereby increased the accuracy of shots. And thirdly, the fire tubes on it were not at the end of the drum, but on its side surface, so charging it was much easier and more convenient.

So you can imagine how this revolver was praised by its sellers. And its frame is solid. And the drum slides onto the barrel, which eliminates gas breakthrough. And its rate of fire is higher than others, since the hammer is cocked simultaneously with the rotation of the drum. And the trigger pull is as light as that of a Colt. And Savage revolvers began to successfully compete with Colt’s.

It was only when cartridge revolvers appeared that all these tricks were immediately unnecessary. Or rather, they ceased to be relevant, and the championship again passed to the cheaper Colts!

The second time the weapons of the Colt and Savage companies had to compete during the competition for a pistol for the army, announced by the US government in 1906. Naturally, many companies and Savage’s company in particular were interested in the competition.

But she simply would have had nothing to participate in the competition if shortly before this, a former employee of the Sprigfield Arsenal, Major Elbert Hamilton Searl, had not retired, taken up his favorite hobby - designing pistols, and had not approached Savage with an offer for his pistol. And the pistol had to be designed in such a way as to circumvent the patents of John Moses Browning and other well-known companies, that is, it was required to be absolutely new.


One of the very first pistols from the Savage company, 11,43 mm caliber, presented at the 1907 competition. Needless to say, the design of this pistol was excellent! Photo of Rock Island Auction

And this is exactly the pistol Searle suggested! In his design, the barrel, coupled to the bolt, was slowed down when fired due to its rotation and friction. According to Searle's idea, while the bullet is twisting in the rifling of the barrel, the barrel will tend to rotate with it in the same direction, but its rotation will be prevented by the friction of the protrusion on the barrel in the tracking groove on the bolt casing. Well, after the bullet had taken off, the inertia accumulated by the bolt casing and bolt should have allowed them to roll back together and rotate the barrel, which was thus disengaged from the bolt.

The pistol turned out to be more complex than the Colt Browning pistol submitted to the competition, and it was also difficult for Savage to compete with Colt and quickly correct design flaws made by the military during testing. And it turned out that in the first round the Savage was inferior to the Colt in terms of the number of delays and misfires, although it surpassed it in accuracy of fire.

And as a result, the tests of the two pistols that more or less passed the competition lasted for several years, so that only on March 15, 1911, both rivals entered the final tests, one might say, face to face. Moreover, both Arthur Savage and John Moses Browning, along with representatives of the Colt company, arrived at the shooting range to personally observe the final shooting.


Another 45-caliber (11,43 mm) competition pistol "Savage". The handle safety bracket is clearly visible on the back of the handle. Photo of Rock Island Auction

Six thousand shots were fired from the new Colt Model 1911 without a single breakdown or delay, but Savage had both delays and breakdowns. The commission's verdict was clear: Colt should become the new army pistol.

However, Savage also got his share of the pie: the caliber of his pistol was reduced from 11,43 to 9 and 7,65 mm, and it was thrown onto the civilian market, where it was advertised primarily as a repeater, because it had ten rounds in the magazine , while the same Colt M1911 has only seven.

And when Savage’s advertising managed to involve the legend of the Wild West, Buffalo Bill, who was still alive and well at that time, then things for the company began to improve. Moreover, the advertising at that time was very visual, and the same “Savage” was then advertised like this:

"Dark night. Gloomy loneliness. Howling dogs; creaking floors; fear “pursues the sleeper behind every curtain.” Your children with beautiful innocent faces are sleeping peacefully. Mother is alone in a big house. What it is? Noise below. She props herself up on her elbow; listens in horror. This time it's not a false alarm: it's a robber. What can she do? Nothing? Absolutely nothing. She and these young children are helpless - at the mercy of a hardened and violent criminal. Therefore, any father who has any sense of pity, and even a sense of duty, should buy a Savage 10 this morning; accustom your family and yourself to shoot it this afternoon in a vacant lot and forever banish the fear of burglars and firearms from your home. But don't buy a 6- or 8-shot pistol when you can get a 10-shot Savage for the same price. Don't buy an automatic pistol that's hard to aim when you can buy a Savage that's as easy to aim as pointing and for the same price. And the only automatic pistol that lets you tell whether it's loaded or empty, just by touch or glance. Therefore, he is harmless, like an old cat in the house.”


Civilian "Savage" 1907. Photo of Rock Island Auction

This is how the Savage M1907 pistol appeared in the USA, the only external difference of which (besides the caliber) from the military prototype presented for testing was the absence of a strap loop on the handle.

Well, advertising did its job: if in 1910 the company sold 15 pistols, then in 500 - already 1912 thousand. True, they soon fell quite quickly - a little more than a thousand were sold in the entire 30. But France in 1919 placed an order for 1915 thousand of these pistols (almost 44/1 of all those produced from 5 to 1908), of which 1920 thousand were specifically produced for this order, and the rest came from “civilian” assembly and what they did not have time by this time to sell in the USA. The pistol was also sold in other countries, for example, in Russia, where it was called “Savage” in the French manner.


"Savage", which entered service with the French army, and next to it its ten-round double-stack magazine. Photography by Alain Dobress

PS


The author and administration of the site express gratitude to the Rock Island Auction company and Alain Dobresse for the photographs they provided.
22 comments
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  1. +6
    17 November 2023 03: 41
    Vyacheslav hi and the version of the revolver for Russia did not differ from other versions? As always, thank you for the material!!!!!! hi
    1. +5
      17 November 2023 06: 44
      Quote: Thrifty
      and the version of the revolver for Russia was no different from other versions?

      I do not know.
      1. +5
        17 November 2023 07: 38
        The pistol was also sold in other countries, for example, in Russia, where it was called “Savage” in the French manner.

        a photo. advertising the sale of the Savage M1907-7.65 pistol in the most popular Russian magazine before the revolution, "Niva" No. 46 of 1908

        Pay attention to the price. In America it sold for $20
  2. +1
    17 November 2023 05: 35
    Secondly, it was self-cocking, which reduced the pressure on the trigger
    In my opinion, the release from self-cocking is more difficult than from a cocked hammer. A?
    1. +7
      17 November 2023 06: 44
      In this case, the hammer was not cocked by the trigger. And with a lever! This is not a revolver! Therefore, releasing the hook itself was easy.
  3. +2
    17 November 2023 07: 11
    Quote: Andrey Moskvin
    In my opinion, the release from self-cocking is more difficult than from a cocked hammer. A?
    If in relation to "Nagan", then yes, because. there, additional force is applied to move the drum forward. But with ordinary revolvers, the trigger is easy and is no different from the trigger with the hammer cocked.
    1. +3
      17 November 2023 08: 14
      Yes exactly. I forgot about “forced” obturation.
    2. 0
      18 November 2023 08: 54
      Quote: rotmistr60
      But with ordinary revolvers, the trigger is easy and is no different from the trigger with the hammer cocked

      If the trigger force did not differ, then no one bothered with the self-cocking design of revolvers. In reality, modern heavy-duty revolvers have about 4-6 kg of trigger release during self-cocking, and 1,5-2 kg with pre-cocking.
  4. +4
    17 November 2023 08: 15
    After all, one of the main problems of the revolvers of that time was the dangerous possibility of the drum exploding due to the breakthrough of gases when firing into its neighboring chambers, or the so-called “chain fire”.

    The problem of gas breakthrough and chain fire is greatly exaggerated. Of course, such cases happened, but only because the revolver was incorrectly equipped with bullets of a smaller diameter. To ensure safety, the chamber of the revolver was slightly smaller than the bullet, and when the bullet was pressed into the chamber, the soft lead was deformed and even some of the metal was cut off from it. In this way, the chamber was sealed, which eliminated the possibility of chain fire.
    1. +2
      17 November 2023 17: 19
      There could probably be similar cases, say, 1 in 10. Every story must have a basis.
      Tipai: New Jersey, one guy's drum burst when he pulled the trigger. And if he hadn’t been greedy for the extra 3-5 dollars, this wouldn’t have happened.
      1. +3
        17 November 2023 23: 16
        Quote: vladcub
        There could probably be similar cases, say, 1 in 10. Every story must have a basis.
        Tipai: New Jersey, one guy's drum burst when he pulled the trigger. And if he hadn’t been greedy for the extra 3-5 dollars, this wouldn’t have happened.

        The problem with “chain fire” is only in the incorrect equipment of the revolver. If the revolver is equipped correctly and is technically in good working order, then nothing like this can happen.
  5. +5
    17 November 2023 08: 33
    and quickly correct design flaws made by the military during testing

    It would be more correct to write “seen by the military during testing”
  6. +7
    17 November 2023 11: 10
    The second time the weapons of the Colt and Savage companies had to compete during the competition for a pistol for the army, announced by the US government in 1906. Naturally, many companies and Savage’s company in particular were interested in the competition.

    Yes, there weren’t that many of them, there were actually four, three American, Grant Hammond Manufacturing, Savage, Colt, one German - DWM.

    1. 0
      17 November 2023 18: 03
      "one German: DWM, a pistol similar to a Luger"
      1. +3
        17 November 2023 19: 13
        the gun looks like a Luger

        The 1906 Luger pistol was produced by DWM in two calibers - 7,65 mm with a 120 mm barrel and 9 mm with a 100 mm barrel.
    2. 0
      18 November 2023 09: 54
      Tell me, am I the only one who thinks that SAVAGE is very similar to our TT?
      1. +1
        19 November 2023 15: 05
        Not at all similar. SAVAGE is second from the top.
        The TT is similar to a Browning pistol - it is third from the top - because the TT was made based on the Browning design at one time.
    3. -1
      18 November 2023 11: 24
      Considering that the photo is NOT an experienced Luger 45ACP, but some other one, instead of a Colt 1906-11 there is some kind of Browning with a front pin for disassembly, there are doubts that these are pistols that took part in the 1906 competition.
      In the book on the history of Luger and Borchard, this competition is described in great detail, first they chose a cartridge, then pistols for it, which is why it took so many years. By the way, the lethal effect was carried out at the Chicago slaughterhouses by shooting at animals, and not at gelatin blocks and other imitators, although the penetrating effect was tested on boards. Hence the choice of caliber - it felled a bull from the first hit, and the 9th was more dependent on the skill of the shooter.
      The Searle-Savage system is also much less technologically advanced, from the oblique protrusions on the barrel and bolt to the refined shape of the bolt itself. The angle of the handle also raises questions for me, although I have not shot from this model, but still the M1911 is very comfortable in the hand, almost like the P-08.
  7. +6
    17 November 2023 11: 20
    According to Searle's idea, while the bullet is twisting in the rifling of the barrel, the barrel will tend to rotate with it in the same direction, but its rotation will be prevented by the friction of the protrusion on the barrel in the tracking groove on the bolt casing. Well, after the bullet had taken off, the inertia accumulated by the bolt casing and bolt should have allowed them to roll back together and rotate the barrel, which was thus disengaged from the bolt.

    In reality, everything looks a little different.
    When fired, the bolt-casing moves backward, turning the barrel around its axis in the direction opposite to the rotation of the bullet due to the interaction of the barrel protrusions with the spiral grooves inside the bolt-casing. And the bullet, rotating in the opposite direction, slows down the rotation of the barrel until it leaves the barrel and the gas pressure drops to a minimum. That is, it is a semi-free shutter.
    1. +3
      17 November 2023 21: 49
      Quote from Frettaskyrandi
      the bullet, rotating in the opposite direction, slows down the rotation of the barrel until it leaves the barrel and the gas pressure drops to a minimum.

      In theory, the bullet slows down its rotation only at the moment of the primary impulse, during the formation of rifling on it. Then the opposite effect occurs.
      I wonder if this rotation of the barrel is the reason why the system's accuracy is increased compared to its competitors. In general, it would be logical if this were so. Even advertising in Russia lured with a “direct shot up to 150 steps.” Although the advertisement is about "the only automatic pistol that allows you to tell whether it is loaded or empty by just one touch or look." I was puzzled - I can’t tell from the photo whether the gun is loaded. Although the illustrations are beautiful, I join in the thanks.
  8. +3
    17 November 2023 18: 01
    "raises himself on his elbow; listens in horror." I myself was in a similar situation in the spring and summer.
    At night, I wake up and listen: what is happening behind the door?
    My son, when he was on vacation from Novorossiysk, ordered metal doors. He decided that Turkish doors were more reliable, and I bought throwing discs at Sportmaster. Lying near the bed
    And now, I live in the “baby’s” apartment, and he installed an electronic lock + on the nightstand, I’m lying there and now I sleep peacefully
  9. 0
    19 November 2023 00: 39
    The company still exists:

    https://www.savagearms.com