See through armor and use artificial intelligence: Israeli Merkava Barak tank

234
See through armor and use artificial intelligence: Israeli Merkava Barak tank

The other day it became known that the Israel Defense Forces, after seven years of development and testing, finally received the first Tanks Merkava Barak for military use in the 52nd battalion of the 401st armored brigade. The creators did not provide them with either a new cannon with more powerful shells, or a rearrangement of the interior, or, most likely, new armor. But they definitely didn’t skimp on the electronics, introducing a lot of improvements, ranging from “artificial intelligence” to the Iron Vision complex, which makes it possible to “see through armor.”

Of course, the Israeli Merkava tank is an extremely controversial vehicle, the design and combat qualities of which are still hotly debated among its supporters and opponents. There is no point in getting involved in these battles, but one thing is for sure: the scale and significance of the changes regularly made by designers to this “Chariot” (translated from Hebrew) can cause envy even among tank builders in Europe and the USA. And this is clearly demonstrated by the new package of updates introduced on tanks of the fourth series, designated Merkava Barak.




This modernization option took quite a long time to develop and bring to fruition: only the stage of developing the concept, which began in 2015, and the subsequent organization of technical capabilities took about three years. Then, in 2018, full-scale development of the project and subsequent tests began, ending with the delivery of the first vehicles to the troops this year. And, presumably, those innovations prepared for the Merkava Mk.4 were not limited to one small thing.

In general, most of the items in the list of changes look standard and even routine: improved sights with expanded capabilities for searching for targets and firing day and night; improved means of information transmission (communication); all-round viewing system in the form of television and thermal imaging cameras in all projections of the tank; new ergonomic controls for turret rotation and target targeting in the form of joysticks; system for monitoring the distribution and generation of electricity in the on-board network; driver warning system about obstacles; touch screens displaying all the necessary combat information and so on.


Taken together, these points significantly increase the combat capabilities of the tank and the ease of its operation, but there are also some improvements that take the vehicle to a whole new level.

"Artificial intelligence"


The most modern combat vehicles have a huge range of equipment for searching and destroying the enemy, ranging from thermal imaging sights, with the help of which you can detect and identify a target at enormous distances in almost any weather and at any time of the day, to ballistic computers, shooting conditions sensors and machine guns target tracking.

However, even with such an abundance of various electronics, the human factor has not been canceled. Therefore, no matter how perfect it may be, a person who can get tired still comes to the fore, his eyes sometimes blur, and logic and instinct - when you expect an enemy in one place, and he appears in another - can fail. Merkava Barak was able to fix this by introducing a new fire control system with the Makhshev Mesima task computer, which uses elements of “artificial intelligence” or, more simply, neural networks.

At the moment, this innovation is called a computerized replacement of the fifth crew member in the tank, and deservedly so.

The neural network that is part of the Makhshev Mesima is actually trained on thousands of different signatures from the tank’s sensors, thanks to which, within the framework of the established algorithms, it is capable of identifying dangerous targets in the field of view without human intervention. A kind of computerized “eye” that sees more and beyond the human. However, the matter cannot be done with data from the sights and surveillance systems of the tank alone, since the electronic brains of the device also collect reconnaissance and target information from external sources - other tanks and units united in a single operational network.


Thus, the tank is capable of conducting effective fire not only at those positions that are directly visible through its sights, but also in cases where the enemy, having been detected by friendly formations, is in various types of shelters.

Analyzing the received data, the computer automatically identifies targets and distributes priority for their destruction from the most to the least dangerous in the existing situation, displaying on the commander’s display an enlarged image of an object from which a potential threat may come. At the same time, “Makhshev Mesima” independently determines the type of projectile suitable for hitting the enemy, and also measures the range to the target, makes corrections for firing and points the gun in the desired direction. So, from the moment an enemy object is detected until it is eliminated, literally a few seconds pass, and the tank commander only needs a few clicks on the touch screen and the final press on the trigger.


A similar complex called “Atlas” is currently being tested in the United States, but its trial operation will most likely last until the introduction of M1A3 tanks into production - sometime in the 2030s.

Iron vision


As you know, the burden of observing the battlefield and detecting targets in a tank falls on the shoulders of the commander. In the richest configuration of virtually any production tank, the workplace of this crew member is equipped with periscope surveillance devices installed around the perimeter of its hatch, as well as a panoramic sight-surveillance device equipped with thermal imaging and television (sometimes even optical) channels with a 360-degree view.


But there are some difficulties: periscopes are a thing in which it is generally impossible to install anything electronic, except for electron-optical converters. And the panorama, although formally providing visibility around with the convenience of thermal imagers, is extremely limited both in viewing angles - especially vertically - and in the speed of interaction with a person. Therefore, often, in order to control the situation, the commander from time to time - sometimes very often - has to lean out of the hatch and observe the battlefield with the “naked eye.”

This is especially true for battles in urban environments, although in an open field sometimes this is also indispensable. But a tanker leaning out of the hatch is an ideal target both for a sniper or any other infantryman, and for shell fragments. Therefore, to protect the commanders, Israeli engineers equipped the Merkava Barak with the Iron Vision system, which practically allows you to see through the tank’s armor.


Its main component is a panoramic viewing module, interfaced with the tank’s on-board computer and installed on the roof of the vehicle’s turret. It includes television and thermal imaging cameras, providing the ability to observe in day and night conditions. The module itself, although it resembles a regular panoramic commander’s sight, can not only rotate around its axis, providing a 360-degree view, but also move the camera block in declination and elevation angles vertically.

Panoramic movable module in the upper left part of the photo
Panoramic movable module in the upper left part of the photo

The digital video signal from the module is transmitted via wires to an electronics unit mounted on the commander’s helmet, and after processing in the form of a projected image, it is displayed on a small screen in front of the tankman’s eyes, as if wearing augmented reality glasses. Moreover, since the helmet-mounted electronics are equipped with an electronic gyroscope, the system automatically reads the position of the commander’s head and reacts to any of its movements, responding to them with the synchronized movement of the panoramic module.

Thus, the moving block of cameras becomes the second eyes of a person, turning in the direction where he is looking, providing full observation of the area without the need to lean out of the hatch.

The electronics unit is in the back of the helmet and the display is in front of the eyes
The electronics unit is in the back of the helmet and the display is in front of the eyes

However, it is worth noting that the video signal to the Iron Vision display can also be transmitted from cameras installed on the hull and turret of the tank, but judging by the presentation videos, the panoramic module is still a priority.

Also, additional information is displayed on the screen in the form of vehicle speed, direction of movement and rotation of the commander’s head relative to the vehicle body, as in the azimuth indicator. In addition, Iron Vision can interface with friend-or-foe identification systems and combat information and control systems, producing an image of the area with symbolic marks about the location of friendly and enemy troops. In the future, this will be added to the ability to connect to cameras of unmanned aerial vehicles.

Protection, communication and training


There is no data yet on whether the Merkava Barak armor has received at least some changes - there was no data about this even in the official statements of the manufacturer and media publications. It is possible that the level of security remained the same as that of the regular “four”. But the tank has a modified active protection complex “Trophy” (export name “Meil Ruach”).

Formally, its job is to detect cumulative missiles and grenades approaching the tank, followed by their preventive destruction by shooting fragmentation counter-munitions. However, this system, due to radar stations and, possibly, UV radiation sensors, is also capable of determining the direction and approximate location of the point from which fire is being fired at the tank, warning the crew about this.


Thus, the tank commander receives information about where fire is coming from, automatically, with the corresponding data displayed on the display. All this allows you to quickly detect and destroy enemy positions, even if they were initially out of sight of the tank crews. At the same time, in Merkava Barak, due to the introduction of new target designation systems and the exchange of combat information, the commander can transmit the coordinates of the target to the crew of another tank if for some reason he cannot hit it on his own.

In fact, a unit with modernized tanks, operating on the ground, becomes not only more protected from attacks, but also receives expanded capabilities to identify and destroy enemy firing points.

Another significant update is the appearance of equipment for connecting the tank to the TORCH-X automated combat unit control system as part of the concept of network-centric warfare.

In fact, in a minimal version, this network allows the exchange of basic information about combat missions, the position of one’s own formations, enemy formations, target designation, and also makes it possible to closely interact between different types of troops from the tactical level and above.


At the maximum, the inclusion of “artificial intelligence” is provided, the work of which is to find the most rational solution to the task at hand, up to the construction of a route and designation of the positions that the unit needs to take in order to successfully destroy the enemy or repel his attack.

We haven’t forgotten about the built-in training mechanisms for tank crews, which turn any tank into a full-fledged simulator and reduce the cost of honing the crew’s skills. This is practically a trend that advanced tank builders are gradually beginning to follow - especially in the USA, whose M1A2 SEP v.4, which never went into production, was supposed to be equipped with similar systems.

In Merkava Barak, judging by the manufacturers' long-standing statements, the built-in virtual reality system is responsible for this. In fact, it is an analogue of various toys with VR glasses, in which you are immersed in a world built with computer graphics. Only in this case there are no glasses - the image is displayed on the working displays of the tankers, and instead of a virtual game world there are virtual scenarios embedded in the memory in the form of urban development, mountainous and wooded areas, and so on.

As a result, you can practice tactical maneuvers, shoot at the enemy, and establish interaction between units. And all this without the use of specially built polygons - a simple desert is enough, which, if desired, can turn into a city with dense rows of houses, or into a forest.

Conclusions


As a conclusion, it should be noted that the modernization package implemented in the Merkava Barak truly takes the tank to a completely new level in many respects.

First of all, this is a more complete implementation of the firepower of the vehicle due to elements of “artificial intelligence”, capable of almost automatically identifying targets, thereby reducing the load on the crew and maximally eliminating the influence of the human factor. And also a significant improvement in the situational awareness of tankers with the help of IronVision, which not only allows for a full overview of the battlefield, but also directly affects the survivability of commanders and expands the ability to quickly obtain and study tactical information.

And all this is seasoned with enhanced security provided by the modernized Trophy KAZ, access to connecting a network of automated command and control and information exchange, cheaper and easier training for operators and many smaller, but no less necessary improvements.

It can be assumed that such a large pile of newfangled electronic “toys” cannot yet guarantee full and uninterrupted operation in all situations. Nevertheless, many of them have already been tested on other tanks, and prototypes of the future Merkava Barak have been tested for a long time. In this regard, the Israeli military has already planned to re-equip all existing Merkavas of the fourth series to this standard.
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  1. -9
    29 September 2023 04: 30
    In Merkava Barak, judging by the manufacturers' long-standing statements, the built-in virtual reality system is responsible for this. In fact, it is an analogue of various toys with VR glasses, in which you are immersed in a world built with computer graphics. Only in this case there are no glasses - the image is displayed on the working displays of the tankers, and instead of a virtual game world there are virtual scenarios embedded in the memory in the form of urban development, mountainous and wooded areas, and so on.

    Is the chassis of the “chariot” adapted to real landscapes and scenarios “in the form of urban development, mountainous wooded areas, and so on”?
    The impression is that the new concept is an attempt to create equipment that, ideally, can fight without human participation...
    Let's wait and see what various electronic warfare equipment and lasers will say to this complete collection of electronics and AI...
    1. -9
      29 September 2023 04: 50
      Quote: ROSS 42
      Let's wait and see what will they say for this complete collection of electronics and AI various electronic warfare equipment and lasers...
      Not to mention the electromagnetic pulse. request
      recourse
      1. +15
        29 September 2023 22: 35
        There is simply nowhere to go from the victims of the Unified State Examination and the many reforms that have devastated domestic education. No matter how much an article or comment about a drone, robot or electronic product can’t be stopped, they come up with a comment about EMP.
        If these EMPs actually worked as you dream about, then Leopards, Abrams, Hymers and other equipment stuffed with electronics would shoot down this same EMP. But this doesn’t happen and here’s why (a little educational opportunity for those who spent their physics lessons in a smoking room):
        Firstly, the EMR source has a spherical wave front. What does this mean for those who skipped fundamental sciences or, even worse, the humanities? This means that as the distance increases, the energy intensity decreases in proportion to the square of the distance. That is, at a distance of 10 meters from the epicenter of the explosion, the energy decreases by 100 times, at a distance of 100 meters, the pulse energy decreases by 10000 times. Therefore, it is very desirable to carry out the explosion directly near the target itself. But here physics comes into play again;
        secondly, according to the corollary of the Ostrogradsky-Gauss theorem, the flow of the electric field strength vector through a closed surface, in the case in which the charges are located outside this surface, is equal to zero. This explains some videos where lightning strikes a car and people are left unharmed. Therefore, a car is considered a safe place during a thunderstorm. Based on this theorem, lightning protection in aircraft is built. It is worth remembering that the energy of some lightning bolts may be greater than that of EMP warheads;
        thirdly, many electronic devices in tanks and other armored objects are located in their sealed metal cases. This results in double shielding. In addition, the inputs and outputs of the electronics are protected by special gas dischargers and latch diodes.
        fourthly, any modern military aircraft, even our domestic one, is stuffed to the brim with electronics. And these are not line scanning units from a tube TV, but rather sensitive and capricious electronics. At the same time, it sometimes flies calmly for hours in the upper echelons, where there is a fairly high level of cosmic radiation relative to the surface of the earth and does not pupate when it is illuminated by radar. Many modern radars easily pump megawatts of power per pulse, even very easily and on their antennas based on adaptive phased arrays they form a narrowly directed pulse beam with low divergence - an almost flat wave front.
        Therefore, an infantry fighting vehicle, and even more so a tank, these are your EMPs up to one place below the stern. Unless it explodes inside the tank. With the tank's current level of armor, it will be difficult to damage its hard armor.
        1. +1
          30 September 2023 13: 31
          Quote from barbos
          This means that as the distance increases, the energy intensity decreases in proportion to the square of the distance. That is, at a distance of 10 meters from the epicenter of the explosion, the energy decreases by 100 times, at a distance of 100 meters, the pulse energy decreases by 10000 times.

          There was an error. Where did you get the idea that after 10 meters it’s 100 times?
          Quote from barbos
          secondly, according to the corollary of the Ostrogradsky-Gauss theorem, the flow of the electric field strength vector through a closed surface, in the case in which the charges are located outside this surface, is equal to zero. This explains

          Just google Faraday cage
          1. +1
            3 October 2023 14: 26
            Where did you get the idea that after 10 meters it’s 100 times?

            From the determination of the dependence of radiation intensity on distance from the radiation source. The dependence says that the denominator must be distance to the second power.
            But I agree that this is an approximate calculation that is more suitable for understanding the level of numbers. In fact, everything is extremely complicated. And the values ​​I cited are not there nearby. I completely agree with you here.

            Just google Faraday cage

            I agree here too. But apparently many people need an appeal to fundamental sources so that they stop scaring tanks with EMP charges. There are two pyramids of cesium crystals and a cunning system for initiating an explosion at a price that negates the expediency of their use against ground armored vehicles such as tanks and infantry fighting vehicles. A dozen ATGMs are cheaper.
        2. 0
          3 October 2023 01: 29
          Quote from barbos
          This means that as the distance increases, the energy intensity decreases in proportion to the square of the distance. That is, at a distance of 10 meters from the epicenter of the explosion, the energy decreases by 100 times, at a distance of 100 meters, the pulse energy decreases by 10000 times. Therefore, it is very desirable to carry out the explosion directly near the target itself.

          The damage radius of EMP ammunition is approximately 10 times greater than that of high-explosive ammunition of the same caliber.
          Quote from barbos
          thirdly, many electronic devices in tanks and other armored objects are located in their sealed metal cases.

          But there are, at a minimum, antennas and receivers.
          Quote from barbos
          Based on this theorem, lightning protection in airplanes is built

          If lightning strikes the antenna radome area, the aircraft's electronics will fail. If everything goes well - “direct mode” and manual landing at the nearest airfield. And if it fails...
          Quote from barbos
          In addition, the inputs and outputs of the electronics are protected by special gas dischargers and latch diodes.

          The EMP reaches high power faster than the protection is triggered.
          Quote from barbos
          If these EMPs actually worked as you dream about, then Leopards, Abrams, Hymers and other equipment stuffed with electronics would shoot down this same EMP.

          EMR works and has been used, but:
          1. There is no way to quickly determine the damage caused to an object.
          2. Indiscriminate action. May cause damage to its objects.
          3. Because of 1,2, the tactics of use are not clear.
          1. +2
            3 October 2023 14: 49
            The damage radius of EMP ammunition is approximately 10 times greater than that of high-explosive ammunition of the same caliber.

            1 So what of this?
            2 In theory, electromagnetic waves from such an explosion can fly to the other side of the universe.

            But there are, at a minimum, antennas and receivers.

            The antenna can be damaged by pointing. I’ll just repeat once again, many lightning charges can have more energy than an EMP charge. In practice, do you have a lot of damaged car antennas damaged by EMR from lightning during a thunderstorm? After all, sometimes it gets close.
            The receiver input is usually protected by several shock protection cascades.

            If lightning strikes the antenna radome, the aircraft's electronics may fail.

            Is it all the electronics on board the aircraft or just the aircraft radar? Are there many cases in global civil aviation when this happens? Because in civil aviation, lightning strikes on the hull are relatively common.

            EMP reaches high power faster than protection is triggered

            Here you have a violation of cause-and-effect relationships. In fact, at the beginning there was a powerful emission of EMP, which very quickly, but not instantly, reaches the target, only then a fairly quick protection is triggered. But not the other way around.
            Structurally, a tank or infantry fighting vehicle is a thick-walled metal closed structure. If we turn again to the Ostrogradsky-Gauss theorem, then it completely lacks a time parameter. There are spatial coordinates, but no time at all. What does this mean? That talking about the time to reach a given power and, in general, talking about some time is devoid of physical meaning. It doesn’t matter at all at what instantaneous speed the EMP gains power. For a closed metal surface this makes no sense. Physics.
        3. +1
          5 October 2023 19: 10
          You're not entirely right. Even in conventional explosive charges, the shock wave is created not spherical, but directed, for example, a shaped charge! The formation of the EMR wave front can also be moderated. Those. the propagation of the front is not spherical... And secondly, the main thing is that the power required to disable the elements of various detection systems and sensors is extremely insignificant, and there the main task is not power, but often the front of power increase, so that the spark gap or other charger does not have time work!

          So not everything is so simple
          1. 0
            11 October 2023 14: 39
            I will not attribute everything to sophistry or stubbornness; I will also attribute it to the consequences of immoral long-term violence against the education system, from school to academic.
            So, a subset of cumulative charges included in the set of ordinary charges does not at all mean that the defining properties of this subset also determine the properties of other subsets included in the set of ordinary charges. In other words, high-explosive or thermobaric charges should not have the properties of a directed cumulative jet at all. Or another example: if you have five fingers on your hand, it is not at all necessary that because of this you should have five eyes on your head - the hand and the head are parts of the body. It is also incorrect to say that due to the existence of shaped charges, this is why charges with EMR also have a flat wave front - clapping your eyes and clapping your palms are completely different and dissimilar phenomena.
            You can make a charge with EMR directed in a certain direction, but for this you will need to install a reflector to reflect the EMR and somehow orient it in the desired direction. And there are two serious points here: the reflector must withstand the shock wave of the initializing explosive and must somehow be oriented in the right direction. How are things going with this?

            And secondly, if we go into the details of the mathematical meaning of physical terms, then power is nothing more than the first derivative of energy with respect to time. That is, the rate of change of energy. Therefore, the main factor is not power, but energy. The next point, which is very important, in electronics the protective cascades and the receiving cascades themselves are placed in series. The first is the protective cascade, often multi-link, then comes the receiving path, but not vice versa. As noted earlier, all electronic equipment after the invention of nuclear weapons comes in a sealed metal case, to which shielded cables are suitable. This results in double shielding. Earlier, again for those who like to think about the growth of the wave front, I wrote that according to the Ostrogradsky-Gauss theorem, there is no point in talking about the rate of change of the energy of the EMR wave front, because in this theorem there is no time variable at all. And it is incorrect to say that the EMR energy directly, in some miraculous way, bypassing the protective cascades will end up directly in the receiving stage.

            In fact, it is easier to disable the crew of an armored vehicle by simply throwing a wire with a phase on the armor than to uselessly explode charges with EMP nearby.
      2. +4
        30 September 2023 18: 27
        Quote: Mavrikiy
        Not to mention the electromagnetic pulse.

        Since the invention of nuclear weapons and the discovery of the phenomenon of EMP during its detonation, that is, for 70+ years, all military electronics have been produced shielded from EMP.
        Or do you think the bulky boxes in which it is located, and thick cables in metal windings with huge connectors, exist in order to take up more space?
        In addition to shock protection, they perform the function of a Faraday cage.

    2. +22
      29 September 2023 05: 03
      Is the chassis of the “chariot” adapted to real landscapes and scenarios “in the form of urban development, mountainous wooded areas, and so on”?

      Do you still imagine the territories of possible military operations (both in Israel itself and beyond its borders) as exclusively deserts without vegetation, varied landscapes and urban development? winked

      Let's wait and see what various electronic warfare equipment and lasers will say to this complete collection of electronics and AI.

      Undoubtedly, all that remains is to watch, since neither lasers nor electronic warfare equipment in the largest conflict in Europe since WWII were applied to any significant extent to automated command and control systems and even military (not conversions from civilian) unmanned aerial vehicles. In order to experience AI elements, you need to have them. How to have an automated control system. Perhaps somewhere in the next military conflict, more high-tech. In the meantime, for Israel, for its theater of operations with their opponents, such bells and whistles are only a plus.
      1. +8
        29 September 2023 07: 30
        All Barak innovations have two principles - 1. Maximum probability of hitting the enemy in the shortest possible time, in the area of ​​​​responsibility of a single tank and unit. 2. Necessary tank protection to achieve the above.

        This means minimizing uncertainty about the battlefield to perform combat missions == necessary / maximum awareness of the battlefield. Hence sensors, communications, decision-making speed, learning speed in the operating environment, algorithms, AI.

        In principle, combat simulation can use algorithms for transmitting information with an acceptable probability of error in a multidimensional vector communication channel in the presence of random and intentional interference and noise.
        1. -4
          29 September 2023 23: 38
          Quote: Mikhail Drabkin
          All Barak innovations have two principles - 1. Maximum probability of hitting the enemy in the shortest possible time, in the area of ​​​​responsibility of a single tank and unit. 2. Necessary tank protection to achieve the above.

          What will Comrade Lancet say? wink
          1. +5
            30 September 2023 10: 53
            Quote: Alex777
            What will Comrade Lancet say? wink

            He won't say anything, but will quietly fall. For a KAZ that shoots down ATGMs flying at speeds of hundreds of m/s, an order of magnitude slower drone is not even an easy target, but simply a target at a shooting range. Of course, I understand that in Russia the lancet has now been declared the main prodigy of all times, but Israel had superior over-the-horizon ATGMs and loitering ammunition in service back in the 80s...
            1. -3
              30 September 2023 12: 05
              Quote from: Barmaglot_07
              He won't say anything, but will quietly fall. For a KAZ that shoots down ATGMs flying at speeds of hundreds of m/s, an order of magnitude slower drone is not even an easy target, but simply a target at a shooting range.

              That's what you think. But there is an opinion that KAZ Trophy is not a prodigy either. Although expensive.

              KAZ type Trophy. Their protection is all-aspect, modern systems can “work” against projectiles flying at a speed of about 1-500 m/s. There is only one problem - the Trophy cannot intercept ammunition attacking from above. The problem is the launcher, which cannot rise high enough, although the onboard system will be aware of the threat. That is, if the drone flies into the side, then the KAZ will work successfully, but if it flies into the roof at an acute angle, then it will not.


              Quote from: Barmaglot_07
              Israel had superior over-the-horizon ATGMs and loitering ammunition in service back in the 80s...

              I have nothing against Israel. But possible deliveries of Trophy to countries unfriendly to us make my question relevant. bully
              1. +3
                30 September 2023 13: 28
                A “funnel” not covered by a windbreaker is 70 degrees, i.e. 35 degrees from vertical. I have never seen a video of a “lancet” attack at an angle even approaching this. The Javelin, in attack mode from above, dives at an angle of 45 degrees, i.e. within the range of the windbreaker.

                And yes, the windbreaker has dozens of combat interceptions, and hundreds in various tests, with a wide range of foreign customers, who, according to the results, pay a lot of money for it. Where are the purchases of "Arena" and "Afghanite", even for the native Moscow Region, not to mention the export for which "Arena-e" was offered?
              2. +1
                3 October 2023 21: 39
                That is, if the drone flies into the side, then the KAZ will work successfully, but if it flies into the roof at an acute angle, then it will not.

                Please remind me, what kind of Russian ammunition hits from above?
            2. -4
              30 September 2023 20: 39
              in Russian


              Eco is cringing at you, like an Israeli, I probably rehearsed it on purpose, a non-existent word laughing This chariot will run into a minefield and lose its spokes. There are no and never will be indestructible tanks. The Euro-Orcs also boasted about their technology. But what works against barmalei does not work in a serious conflict. For its region, it is undoubtedly a good tank. But we have all already become convinced that in a modern theater of operations everything does not happen as planned and modeled.
              1. +3
                30 September 2023 21: 02
                A favorite pastime of fighters against fascism is to distort the inhabitants and names of other countries if there is nothing substantive to say. Where is the modern theater of operations?! Two backward, albeit for different reasons, armies are fighting.
                1. +4
                  30 September 2023 22: 26
                  Quote: stone
                  Two backward, albeit for different reasons, armies are fighting.

                  The fight between the crippled and the crippled, yes. Small inclusions of modern weapons immediately become prodigies.
            3. The comment was deleted.
            4. -2
              8 October 2023 07: 48
              Today is September 8th. The advertised Merkava IV M with KAZ burns like candles from primitive Hamas drones. So you say, "The Lancets will fall"?
              1. 0
                20 December 2023 22: 24
                Today is December 20th. There are less than a dozen “Chariots” destroyed in more than 2 months, despite numerous hits from tandem RPGs and landmine explosions.
    3. +7
      29 September 2023 05: 25
      Quote: ROSS 42
      And the chassis of the “chariot” is adapted to real landscapes and scenarios “in the form of urban development

      I read somewhere that the architecture of Israeli tanks, even at the drawing level, is designed primarily for operations specifically in urban areas. Such design elements were even indicated, but I’m not a tank driver and the highly specialized terms slipped out of my head...
    4. +5
      29 September 2023 10: 08
      It looks very decent.

      But you need to be prepared for the fact that the modernization of all four already released will take 7-8 years at best. sad
      1. +2
        30 September 2023 00: 18
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        It looks very decent.
        Doesn't look right: "Video unavailable"
        The owner of the video has banned it from being viewed in your country."
    5. -2
      29 September 2023 10: 58
      Quote: ROSS 42
      Let's wait and see what various electronic warfare equipment and lasers will say to this complete collection of electronics and AI..

      I wonder what Merkava has to do with import substitution. The gun is German, the engine is American, the electronics are Taiwanese (or vice versa, I don’t remember).
      For example, production in Germany will shut down or some evil anti-Semite will come to power in the USA. It's a turbulent time these days. I worry about the Israeli military))))
      1. -5
        29 September 2023 11: 04
        Quote: Winnie76
        German gun, American engine, Taiwanese electronics

        I wonder where the armor comes from? It seems there is no developed metallurgy in Israel
        1. +5
          29 September 2023 11: 13
          It seems there is no developed metallurgy in Israel

          When it seems, they are baptized.
          Then how do we have tanks and guns and much more?
          1. -4
            29 September 2023 17: 52
            Quote: merkava-2bet
            Then how do we have tanks and guns and much more?

            Perhaps they took it as interest on money in growth? laughing laughing laughing
        2. +3
          30 September 2023 20: 49
          [/ Quote]
          I wonder where the armor comes from? It seems there is no developed metallurgy in Israel[/quote]
          Ask about the company Plasan. One of the world leaders.
      2. +8
        29 September 2023 11: 07
        Everything except the engine is our own, but I heard a rumor that they want to open an engine assembly line in Israel.
        The gun has long been no longer German, although it had a license, after many improvements and modernizations it is almost a new product, and has been produced in Israel since 1986.
        Only our own electronics and optics.
        1. -8
          29 September 2023 14: 06
          Something is hard to believe. In my entire life I have never seen a Jewish mechanic, miner, electrician, turner, milling machine operator. Maybe you gather specialists from other nations from all over the world, working on a rotational basis. Then yes, you can.
          Although I was on an excursion in Israel, I didn’t see any industrial buildings or industrial zones anywhere. I actually saw one thermal power plant in all of Israel, and it operates from wheels, from seagoing dry cargo ships with coal. soldier
          I completely forgot, I saw a diamond cutting factory and was there. hi
          1. +4
            29 September 2023 14: 31
            Quote: V.
            Something is hard to believe. In my entire life I have never seen a Jewish mechanic, miner, electrician, turner, milling machine operator. Maybe you gather specialists from other nations from all over the world, working on a rotational basis. Then yes, you can.
            Although I was on an excursion in Israel, I didn’t see any industrial buildings or industrial zones anywhere. I actually saw one thermal power plant in all of Israel, and it operates from wheels, from seagoing dry cargo ships with coal. soldier
            I completely forgot, I saw a diamond cutting factory and was there. hi

            Also say that you didn’t see any peasants.
            1. -7
              29 September 2023 15: 22
              I saw the peasants, and I can’t hide my admiration for their agriculture, drip irrigation, and grooming.
              In Siberia, I was surprised how our city was littered with Israeli radishes in the “Pyaterochka” owned by Israeli entrepreneurs. She filled the whole city. Works well with discounts for seniors.
              But I don’t believe in industry, scientific and technical thought, or the military-industrial complex. The military-industrial complex in Israel in general, as I understand it, is deeply secretive; everything is produced abroad with the label “Made in Israel.” You don't have people for this. But scientific and technical intelligence on military innovations and technologies works great. Both Merkava and air defense are based on Russian developments with the help of engineers who have left or traitors. soldier
              1. +1
                29 September 2023 15: 47
                Quote: V.
                I saw the peasants, and I can’t hide my admiration for their agriculture, drip irrigation, and grooming.
                In Siberia, I was surprised how our city was littered with Israeli radishes in the “Pyaterochka” owned by Israeli entrepreneurs. She filled the whole city. Works well with discounts for seniors.
                But I don’t believe in industry, scientific and technical thought, or the military-industrial complex. The military-industrial complex in Israel in general, as I understand it, is deeply secretive; everything is produced abroad with the label “Made in Israel.” You don't have people for this. But scientific and technical intelligence on military innovations and technologies works great. Both Merkava and air defense are based on Russian developments with the help of engineers who have left or traitors. soldier

                Oh bullshit. Enjoy it.
                https://m.youtube.com/@elbitsystems/videos
              2. 0
                29 September 2023 18: 54
                Both Merkava and air defense are based on Russian developments with the help of engineers who have left or traitors.

                And here's more details, names, appearances, apartments.
                It has already been written many times, both here and on other resources, that this is not true, and there are no longer specialists in Russia that Israel urgently needs, our doors are open everywhere, we just don’t advertise them.
                The Merkava tank, as a prototype, appeared in 1972 during testing at my home base of Tseilim, and the project itself dates back to the beginning of 1966.
                Jericho's first extensive and strategic missile development also began in the 1960s.
                Our main problem is finances, but not talent and intelligence, unlike your defense industry.
          2. +2
            29 September 2023 18: 37
            And what about excursions to industrial zones and especially defense factories? I also want such an excursion.
          3. 0
            29 September 2023 19: 15
            In my entire life I have never seen a Jewish mechanic, miner, electrician, turner, milling machine operator.

            Well then, urgently read your history, the creation of the nuclear missile shield and cosmonautics, as well as many other things that were done by the Eskimos or Papuans, in one thing you will reduce your vulgar illiteracy.
            1. -2
              29 September 2023 21: 48
              I just don’t understand you Jews who left Russia and live in Israel, as you think it’s great and you have everything, why are you ranting here on the site? Maybe I don’t understand or know something?
              Why do you, an Israeli tankman who fought and killed people, bother with Russian commentators? We already know that you are all very smart there and everything that was created was invented by Jews and not by your Ukrainian competitors, as they believe. hi
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. +9
                29 September 2023 23: 08
                To V. Soldatov:

                With all due respect, a person who is prevented from understanding the world by bias is unfortunately doomed to envy, boasting, inflated self-esteem, anger and hatred.

                This perception of the world leads to incorrect strategy and tactical decisions - be it personal life, professional development, assessment of the enemy, choice of military tactics and strategy.

                To avoid this, you need high patriotism, a sense of duty and responsibility for decisions made, high professionalism, a broad outlook and a desire for self-improvement, confident calm, courage - including admitting mistakes, of course, not saying everything you think, but thinking about everything you say .
                1. +4
                  30 September 2023 19: 05
                  Quote: Mikhail Drabkin
                  To avoid this, high patriotism is required

                  Moreover, real patriotism is creation for the benefit of one’s country, and not pouring slop on someone else’s. hi
              3. -2
                3 October 2023 21: 49
                To slightly knock down the ambition from “2 days before the English Channel”
          4. +7
            30 September 2023 19: 02
            Quote: V.
            In my entire life I have never seen a Jewish mechanic, miner, electrician, turner, milling machine operator.

            Nazi cliche and anti-Semitic stereotype.


            Quote: V.
            I didn’t see any industrial buildings or industrial zones anywhere.

            Because they don't look like Soviet factories and are located on the outskirts or outside of cities.
            1. -9
              1 October 2023 08: 30
              Honestly speaking, I am not writing or commenting for Jews, but for my fellow citizens. I don't care about your conclusions and comments. And what you do there and produce or don’t do is also a fic to me. Although, by and large, I feel sorry for you, like other peoples who live their whole lives in permanent war. Citizens of Israel are drafted into the army every year, serve in military conflicts and kill anyone. How do you deal with this? Are you laughingly telling us over a bowl of soup at home that you shot another Palestinian? hi
              1. +4
                1 October 2023 12: 04
                Citizens of Israel are drafted into the army every year, serve in military conflicts and kill anyone. How do you deal with this? Are you laughingly telling us over a bowl of soup at home that you shot another Palestinian?

                Does this also apply to your soldiers and officers who perform their duty in the Northern Military District, or is it something else?
                1. -3
                  1 October 2023 12: 26
                  Don’t pretend to be a fool, you yourself understand that it’s completely different. What a stupid way of Jews to distort everything. hi
                  1. +2
                    1 October 2023 14: 03
                    Don’t pretend to be a fool, you yourself understand that it’s completely different. What a stupid way of Jews to distort everything.

                    Well, it’s you who convincingly prove this every time. I’m just presenting facts and arguments, and with that we’ll say goodbye, I’ll give you a brush.
              2. +2
                1 October 2023 13: 32
                Quote: V.
                Honestly speaking, I am not writing or commenting for Jews, but for my fellow citizens.

                Yes, I understand, you are engaged in inciting anti-Semitic sentiments and national discord, spreading false stereotypes, like a true Banderaite.
                Criminal Code of the Russian Federation Article 282.
                1. -4
                  1 October 2023 14: 46
                  Is this a denunciation to the relevant authorities? You cannot accept that your nation is no worse or better than other nations. And when you start saying that you are better than other nations, you become like fascists, and you defame those who do not accept this and even try to hand them over to the authorities. hi
                  1. +4
                    1 October 2023 17: 48
                    Quote: V.
                    You cannot accept that your nation is no worse or better than other nations.

                    I can do that, but apparently you can’t.
                    Because a Judeophobic remark like “I haven’t seen a Jewish worker” is like saying “I haven’t seen a single sober Russian” - this is ordinary Nazism.

                    Quote: V.
                    And when you start saying that you are better than other nations

                    It is your sick imagination that says this for us, not us.
                    This is a rotten method of demagoguery, trying to attribute to someone words that he did not say, and then trying to accuse him of them for them.
                    1. -7
                      1 October 2023 19: 34
                      Your country will be destroyed by pride, you don’t even want to listen to another opinion. hi
                      1. +2
                        3 October 2023 01: 10
                        Quote: V.
                        you don't even want to listen to another opinion

                        The opinion of the Nazis and anti-Semites - no, we don’t want it. This makes no sense, there is nothing new there.
                      2. -1
                        8 October 2023 07: 54
                        Well, Israel is so fluffy and white, everyone owes it. Yes, you betrayed your victims long ago by helping the fascist Bandera regime in Ukraine. You lick those who killed your grandfathers.
        2. -9
          30 September 2023 17: 00
          The gun is supplied from the USA - manufacturer.
          1. +5
            30 September 2023 19: 19
            Quote: Foma Kinyaev
            The gun is supplied from the USA - manufacturer.

            From Alpha Centauri. wassat
            The MG253 gun is produced at the IMI plant near Beer Sheva. laughing
      3. +8
        29 September 2023 21: 27
        Quote: Winnie76
        For example, production in Germany will shut down or some evil anti-Semite will come to power in the USA. It's a turbulent time these days. I worry about the Israeli military))))

        We went through this during the Embargo.

        Israel is trying to localize production as much as possible (that’s why they started the fuss with the Merkava, by the way). Consumables, including ammunition, are all our own. Where production cannot be carried away, say in the case of the F-35, they try to develop their service as much as possible. The new Obama will be enough for a couple of presidential terms.
      4. +2
        30 September 2023 17: 24
        The gun is based on a German one, and as far as I remember, engine production is localized (they are also German, just produced by an American division).
      5. +5
        30 September 2023 18: 49
        Quote: Winnie76
        German gun

        Probably the slowest individual at VO already remembered that the MG253 gun was developed and manufactured by the Israeli company IMI.
        Holy shit how much stories and rumors eat into the public consciousness. what

        Quote: Winnie76
        American engine

        Localized. Despite the fact that the main batch was purchased in the USA.
        Israel has a full cycle of small-scale production of a licensed version of the MTU MT883, as well as the transmission, by the way.
        Which exists as insurance, precisely in case of a supply chain break.

        Quote: Winnie76
        Taiwanese electronics (or vice versa, I don’t remember)

        On the contrary, the electronics are 100% Israeli.
    6. +5
      29 September 2023 21: 29
      Quote: ROSS 42
      Is the chassis of the “chariot” adapted to real landscapes and scenarios “in the form of urban development, mountainous wooded areas, and so on”?

      Yes of course. By the way, this is why the Jews abandoned torsion bars: springs performed better in the mountains.
      1. +3
        30 September 2023 12: 12
        Not in the mountains, but on the rocky terrain of the Golan and Ramat a-Golan.
    7. +3
      30 September 2023 18: 18
      Quote: ROSS 42
      Is the chassis of the “chariot” adapted to real landscapes and scenarios “in the form of urban development, mountainous wooded areas, and so on”?

      Yes, otherwise it would have been replaced long ago. At least the nuance that the Mk-4 track is wider than that of NATO tanks, and the ground clearance is greater (with a similar weight), already makes it more passable in different landscapes than the same Leo or Abrams, and the torsion bar suspension with computer control is more durable and soft in rocky terrain, while allowing full operation on soft soils.
      Therefore, contrary to popular belief, it is Leopards, Abrams and Leclercs that are tailored for use in a narrow geographical region, namely in European latitudes.

      Quote: ROSS 42
      The impression is that the new concept is an attempt to create equipment that, ideally, can fight without human participation...

      And this is true. The developers do not even hide that the final goal is an unmanned robotic, AUTONOMOUS tank. Which does not need to be controlled remotely, but simply assigned a combat mission. And not only to the tank itself individually, but to the entire military unit.
      The ideal is the exclusion of humans from direct combat, leaving the “meatbags” with the role of managing and maintaining equipment.

      Quote: ROSS 42
      Let's wait and see what various electronic warfare equipment and lasers will say to this complete collection of electronics and AI...

      Contrary to common misconceptions, electronic warfare can only disrupt communications; to destroy the systems themselves, an EMP is needed that can overcome the protection of military electronics designed for the EMP of a nuclear explosion.
      Here, the main threat is probably not electronic warfare, but cyber troops, but here Israel is still the leader.
      And we shouldn’t forget that “electronic warfare and lasers” will work in both directions, and proactively.

      A simple observation - Azerbaijan’s operation to “abolish” the NK began precisely with the removal of electronic warfare equipment, and only then the drones flew and the tanks drove.
      You shouldn’t compare everyone with the “soldiers” from the Armed Forces of Ukraine, who became aces in the mediocre waste of equipment due to illiterate tactics and strategy.

      The war is won not by a tank in the field, but by a general above the map.
      1. 0
        30 September 2023 19: 08
        Quote: And Us Rat
        and torsion bar suspension

        Sorry, typo, I meant spring suspension.
      2. +3
        30 September 2023 20: 44
        At least the nuance that the Mk-4 track is wider than that of NATO tanks, and the ground clearance is greater (with a similar weight), already makes it more passable in different landscapes than the same Leo or Abrams, and the torsion bar suspension with computer control is more durable and soft in rocky terrain, while allowing full operation on soft soils.
        Therefore, contrary to popular belief, it is Leopards, Abrams and Leclercs that are tailored for use in a narrow geographical region, namely in European latitudes.

        In addition, in Israel in 1996, the M1 Abrams and Merkava-3 were tested, where Abrams showed an advantage in speed and maneuverability in desert areas, and even then not by much, but lost on the rocky hills of Ramat a-Golan, the suspension could not stand it, and it torsion bar, and the Americans seriously thought about converting the Abrams to hydraulic, which by the way was tested on an experimental Abrams tank, or to hydropneumatic suspension, but budget cuts buried this.


        Abrams tank with hydraulic suspension.
        1. The comment was deleted.
      3. The comment was deleted.
  2. +13
    29 September 2023 04: 39
    According to modern fashion, AI is already being introduced into robotic vacuum cleaners. Add a stun gun - and then who the hell will walk through the washed area! We will live on the landing.
    1. 0
      29 September 2023 22: 32
      I’ll tell you more - these women were assigned to these AIs to monitor the noble spirits from Gaza! The noble one will only roll out the shaitan-arba to the perimeter, and the AI ​​will already see it and the woman confirms that the baradat must lie down in the ground before or immediately after he takes the arba in his hand.
      And this is not the first generation of AI, nor the first in which women take on roles in policing their country. Everything about them is godless, everything!
  3. -2
    29 September 2023 05: 03
    I wonder, if you detonate the ammunition with a metallized sanitizer over her, will she be able to see?
  4. +9
    29 September 2023 05: 18
    And here's where it all started:


    Anti-srapnel mask of a British tankman during the First World War. Protected the tank crew from shrapnel and small fragments falling into the cracks of the tank...
    1. +8
      29 September 2023 05: 25
      And here's where it all started:

      Come on, it didn’t just start with anti-splash products from plastically deformed metal. The crews of those very “diamonds” of the First World War on the slopes, since the engine was fed with fuel under the influence of gravity (and not forced supply), had to conditionally and exaggeratedly put fuel into the carburetor from the palms of their hands and other improvised containers. And now there are electronic systems for monitoring the power plant, distribution and generation of energy, and all sorts of thermal imagers. request
      1. +5
        29 September 2023 05: 30
        Well, we should note the connection, which seemed to be not very good - the crew launched carrier pigeons from the tank... wink
        1. +7
          29 September 2023 05: 33
          Well, we should note the connection, which seemed to be not very good - the crew launched carrier pigeons from the tank

          Which were experimentally used even as live reconnaissance UAVs bully
  5. -6
    29 September 2023 05: 22
    One Lancet is enough to make you blind and deaf!
    1. +6
      30 September 2023 16: 09
      Well, most likely the KAZ will work as a lancet. It was probably set up by specialists; there are enough lancets in Israel, or rather kamikaze originals from which the lancet was copied wink
  6. 0
    29 September 2023 06: 14
    I keep asking myself the question, if these super tanks, with a bunch of sensors and cameras and other gadgets, are thoroughly bombarded with good old shrapnel, how much combat effectiveness will they retain?
    1. +8
      29 September 2023 06: 33
      Quote: Cartalon
      fire with good old shrapnel, how long will they retain combat effectiveness?

      The trouble is that the firing range of shrapnel seems to be not very good, but they won’t let you get close...
      1. +2
        29 September 2023 08: 26
        The range is not very good for buckshot; for shrapnel depends on the delay of the fuse and, in principle, can be comparable to the range of a conventional projectile. But shrapnel is no longer in service (EMNIP).
        1. +4
          29 September 2023 09: 07
          Quote: dzvero
          The range is not very good for buckshot; for shrapnel depends on the delay of the fuse and, in principle, can be comparable to the range of a conventional projectile. But shrapnel is no longer in service (EMNIP).

          So a smart tank will be the first to find a non-smart tank, after which it will quickly hit it. After which there will be no one left to fire
          1. -2
            29 September 2023 18: 01
            Quote: BlackMokona
            So a smart tank will be the first to find a non-smart tank, after which it will quickly hit it. After which there will be no one left to fire

            If two not smart tanks approach a smart one from both sides, then the smart one will only have to console himself for a short time with the fact that he saw them first...
            1. +1
              3 October 2023 17: 45
              Quote: Peter_Koldunov
              Quote: BlackMokona
              So a smart tank will be the first to find a non-smart tank, after which it will quickly hit it. After which there will be no one left to fire

              If two not smart tanks approach a smart one from both sides, then the smart one will only have to console himself for a short time with the fact that he saw them first...

              You still did not understand the text of the article. The tank, network-centric, has “battlefield” information from all possible sources.
              The principle there is: “one saw, now everyone sees.”
              Therefore, the tank commander will not allow the approach of two dangerous targets from both sides.
              The maneuver will begin to call and destroy them one by one.
              1. +1
                7 October 2023 21: 23
                And I even saw Tefal, “which thinks for you,” where you really need to add coffee or tea yourself, according to your individual taste.
      2. +1
        29 September 2023 09: 07
        In urban areas they can shoot almost point-blank.
        Perhaps even a bucket of paint poured from the upper floors onto the tank will do...
      3. 0
        29 September 2023 15: 23
        It’s amazing this is a military site, but here they don’t know what shrapnel is
    2. +5
      29 September 2023 09: 42
      Quote: Cartalon
      I keep asking myself the question, if these super tanks, with a bunch of sensors and cameras and other gadgets, are thoroughly bombarded with good old shrapnel, how much combat effectiveness will they retain?

      You can shoot, but it’s unlikely to run away after that. Everything there is tied to a single battlefield information system, data is transmitted instantly
    3. AUL
      +3
      29 September 2023 11: 17
      Quote: Cartalon
      I keep asking myself the question, if these super tanks, with a bunch of sensors and cameras and other gadgets, are thoroughly bombarded with good old shrapnel, how much combat effectiveness will they retain?

      This is if he allows himself to be “taken a good shot” with his situational awareness.
      1. +3
        29 September 2023 15: 25
        It is unlikely that he will be so aware of a howitzer 30 km away
        1. +1
          29 September 2023 18: 03
          Quote: Cartalon
          It is unlikely that he will be so aware of a howitzer 30 km away

          And it certainly won’t be about an attack aircraft flying from above...
          1. +5
            29 September 2023 21: 21
            Quote: Peter_Koldunov
            And it certainly won’t be - about an attack aircraft flying from above

            Excuse me, whose stormtrooper?
          2. 0
            30 September 2023 19: 33
            Quote: Peter_Koldunov
            And it certainly won’t be about an attack aircraft flying from above...

            Yeah, if he gets there.
        2. +4
          29 September 2023 18: 06
          Quote: Cartalon
          It is unlikely that he will be so aware of a howitzer 30 km away

          Israel is not Ukraine. But whether the howitzer will be aware is a big question.
        3. +1
          30 September 2023 19: 32
          Quote: Cartalon
          It is unlikely that he will be so aware of a howitzer 30 km away

          There is only one small thing left - to conquer the air, knock out the artillery and roll this howitzer these 30 km with a single mechanism. laughing
          The war against the Ukrainian Armed Forces creates a distorted picture for many of what a database might look like.
        4. +7
          1 October 2023 09: 49
          You talk as if a tank is a spherical horse in a vacuum. In the context of Merkava, for example, there are UAVs of all types, AWACS, a satellite constellation, and so on. And data from everything goes to this very tank. And then - what do you think, the developers are complete idiots and there is thin-walled glass without protection on these same sensors?
          1. -1
            1 October 2023 11: 57
            Quote: Pimply
            And then - what do you think, the developers are complete idiots and there is thin-walled glass without protection on these same sensors?

            Certainly! After all, competent developers exist exclusively in the homeland of elephants, and the rest of the world is inhabited exclusively by idiots. Vasya Lozhkin paints the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth, and not a bit of satire!
            1. +3
              3 October 2023 18: 05
              Quote from: Barmaglot_07
              Quote: Pimply
              And then - what do you think, the developers are complete idiots and there is thin-walled glass without protection on these same sensors?

              Certainly! After all, competent developers exist exclusively in the homeland of elephants, and the rest of the world is inhabited exclusively by idiots. Vasya Lozhkin paints the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth, and not a bit of satire!

              The rest of the developers only have the opportunity they were given.
              If a country does not have programmers who know how to program exactly what is needed for network-centricity, if there are no architects who developed this concept of network-centricity, introduced data exchange protocols, automation...
              If there are no microprocessors, signal processors, communications equipment of the appropriate level, no materials science, chemistry, optics, and much more, then we will produce the T-80.
        5. +3
          3 October 2023 18: 00
          Quote: Cartalon
          It is unlikely that he will be so aware of a howitzer 30 km away

          Be.
          If there are counter-battery warfare radars in a single network-centric system, then all users of this system will know about the howitzer that fired the shot.
          And what can a howitzer do to a tank 30 km away if the tank does not allow itself to be illuminated by the forward gunner?
          Nothing
  7. +3
    29 September 2023 06: 19
    The upgrade package implemented in the Merkava Barak truly takes the tank to a whole new level in many respects.
    It seems like a way to congratulate the Israelis. But in modern warfare, rely exclusively on electronics, and even more so the so-called. AI is probably not worth it after all.
    1. +19
      29 September 2023 08: 08
      Where should they go? They don’t have people for meat assaults, they have to get out due to technical superiority.
  8. +7
    29 September 2023 06: 22
    What can I say, well done Israelis. No matter what anyone says, the tank is designed for their database theater, it suits them. It’s more difficult for our tank builders in this regard, with our open spaces and different climatic conditions. Thank you very much to the author for the review!
    1. +3
      29 September 2023 09: 43
      Quote: Alex 1970
      What can I say, well done Israelis. No matter what anyone says, the tank is designed for their database theater, it suits them. It’s more difficult for our tank builders in this regard, with our open spaces and different climatic conditions. Thank you very much to the author for the review!

      It’s more difficult for ours in terms of electronics. If there isn’t enough “pine” for everyone, let alone Kaz and other features
    2. +3
      30 September 2023 19: 41
      Quote: Alexey 1970
      the tank is tailored for their database theater

      This is a common misconception, it’s more likely that NATO tanks are tailored for a specific combat theater, but the Merkava has to spin.


      1. +4
        30 September 2023 22: 27
        A few photos on the topic. Regarding which theater of operations the Merkava tank can be used in.




        1. +5
          30 September 2023 22: 31
          And there’s still not much, otherwise many people don’t get around to the computer to look.




  9. 0
    29 September 2023 06: 35
    Quote: Cartalon
    I keep asking myself the question, if these super tanks, with a bunch of sensors and cameras and other gadgets, are thoroughly bombarded with good old shrapnel, how much combat effectiveness will they retain?

    The first thought that comes to mind.
    1. -10
      29 September 2023 09: 01
      Our warriors can jump onto a tank and cover all these electronic eyes with a raincoat or overcoat and force the crew to surrender or shoot themselves. bully
      By the way, it seems that Jews are allowed to surrender if they find themselves in insurmountable circumstances. Yes
      1. +5
        29 September 2023 09: 49
        Quote: V.
        Our warriors can jump onto a tank and cover all these electronic eyes with a raincoat or overcoat and force the crew to surrender or shoot themselves. bully
        By the way, it seems that Jews are allowed to surrender if they find themselves in insurmountable circumstances. Yes

        You come up first. I remember in Iraq the Americans destroyed the battalion while trying to get close to an infantry fighting vehicle at night from an RPG.
        1. -7
          29 September 2023 10: 25
          Don't confuse Russian fighters with Bedouins or Jews. In WWII, our fighter killed a platoon of Germans with an axe, and before that they took his rifle away. soldier
          1. +9
            29 September 2023 22: 39
            You smelled some polish. Do you really really think that neither Bedouins nor Jews are capable? And about WWII and Jews in the USSR army they would also be embarrassed... however, the solution is insidious.
          2. +1
            4 October 2023 15: 23
            Well, in the works of propaganda, not such feats were encountered
        2. -11
          29 September 2023 10: 44
          Yeah, a whole battalion, don’t tell tales, the Americans were rubbing your ears. At least they consulted with those who served in the infantry, with grenade launchers. A normally trained grenade launcher, when a target appears at striking distance, makes an accurate shot within 2-3 seconds. But I believe that the Iraqi grenade launchers destroyed a battalion of American infantry fighting vehicles. soldier
        3. -6
          29 September 2023 18: 09
          Quote from Kartograph
          You come up first. I remember in Iraq the Americans destroyed the battalion while trying to get close to an infantry fighting vehicle at night from an RPG.

          And I also think that one American soldier is able to trample an entire anthill with a hundred thousand ants with one foot...
          Do you seriously perceive the demoralized (and even before that not shining in combat training and courage) Iraqi armored rabble - as miracle heroes and powerful armed forces?
          1. +7
            29 September 2023 21: 19
            Quote: Peter_Koldunov
            Iraqi armored rabble - like miracle heroes and mighty armed forces?

            The strongest army in the region immediately after a major war. It’s a little strange at the end of 2023 to hear that someone there was not good at fighting.
        4. -1
          3 October 2023 01: 39
          Quote from Kartograph
          Quote: V.
          Our warriors can jump onto a tank and cover all these electronic eyes with a raincoat or overcoat and force the crew to surrender or shoot themselves. bully
          By the way, it seems that Jews are allowed to surrender if they find themselves in insurmountable circumstances. Yes

          You come up first. I remember in Iraq the Americans destroyed the battalion while trying to get close to an infantry fighting vehicle at night from an RPG.

          Hot Shots 2 is sadly resting.
      2. +8
        29 September 2023 22: 42
        Our soldiers can jump onto the tank and wear a raincoat or overcoat
        We specifically have companies of soldiers dressed in greatcoats and belted with raincoats. Our secret weapon.
        1. +2
          30 September 2023 17: 51
          division named after Maxim Perepelitsa?
        2. 0
          30 September 2023 19: 45
          Quote from barbos
          We specifically have companies of soldiers dressed in greatcoats and belted with raincoats.

          Exactly! It's called a construction battalion! In general, they are animals, they are not even given weapons! fellow
  10. +3
    29 September 2023 07: 15
    Probably against a modern tank... we need to make “aerosol” shells
    which, upon contact, create a cloud of sticky substance
    that settles on everything...
    So super tanks will fall into temporary or permanent disrepair
    some optical and other sensors and such projectiles can be mounted on FPV drones/kamikazes)
    1. +4
      29 September 2023 08: 14
      Quote from Sith
      So super tanks will fall into temporary or permanent disrepair
      part of optical and other sensors

      Who is stopping you from making sensors with multiple redundancies and retractable ones, like the headlights on sports cars of the 1980s? Sensors broken/contaminated? No problem, we put forward the next set. The armor of the sensors is light, bulletproof/fragment resistant, won’t take up much space and won’t add much weight.
    2. +1
      29 September 2023 22: 42
      Even in my short memory of reading VO, there is a notch that such a thing was developed in the Russian Federation, I just have to hear about its use by standards in BV...
    3. -1
      29 September 2023 22: 48
      Everything was invented long ago before us. A glass bottle with a mixture of gasoline and engine oil, when ignited, destroys all electronics, and as the tankers themselves say, the armor too. Because sitting in the tank gets very hot. All that remains is to go up and throw such a bottle with a Molotov cocktail. But this is exactly the problem.
    4. +1
      30 September 2023 19: 49
      Quote from Sith
      Probably against a modern tank... we need to make “aerosol” shells
      which, upon contact, create a cloud of sticky substance

      This is stupid. If you can get it, then it’s better to immediately work on the defeat, and if not, then no aerosols will help.
  11. +3
    29 September 2023 08: 15
    The tank is excellent, expensive and complex. Considering its small batches, and the fact that the country is surrounded by enemies, it essentially remains the main strike weapon, if only it weren’t being improved all the time! But Israel has brains, so everything is up to par.
    1. +3
      29 September 2023 09: 11
      Small batches, more than 450 pieces have already been made, compared to other countries it’s just a sea.
      1. 0
        30 September 2023 01: 56
        Quote: merkava-2bet
        Small batches, more than 450 pieces have already been made, compared to other countries it’s just a sea.

        It depends on who and what you compare with. In the USSR, roughly 72 T-25000s were riveted, and if you count the T-54/55/62, then there was enough for half the world, and even Israel got blanks for heavy armored personnel carriers.
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IDF_Achzarit
        1. +4
          30 September 2023 06: 53
          Quote: Nagan
          It depends on who and what to compare with

          With modern tanks, of course. From Leo2 and later.

          And the Soviet T-72s, unlike the Merkavas, for some reason ended at the most unexpected moment. This problem has been discussed several times here on the site.
    2. -6
      29 September 2023 09: 14
      They just copied "Armata". The idea is one to one. Yes
      1. +7
        29 September 2023 13: 29
        Absolutely right! And what’s interesting is that about...twenty years before the appearance of the Almata!
      2. +9
        29 September 2023 21: 16
        Quote: V.
        They just copied "Armata". Idea one to one

        Exactly. They took most of the fairy tales of the Zvezda channel and did it in metal. Let the Zvezda channel continue to tell it, don’t move the bags.
      3. -5
        3 October 2023 01: 08
        Quote: V.
        They just copied "Armata". The idea is one to one. Yes

        In this part - yes, you can say so. This appeared earlier on Armata. But on the other side they still won’t believe it. Ideology in your head will get in the way.
    3. +7
      29 September 2023 21: 14
      Quote: Vadim S
      The tank is excellent, expensive and complex. Considering his small parties, and the fact that the country is surrounded by enemies,

      The country is not surrounded by enemies. There are brains there in the Foreign Ministry, not just in the military.

      To be honest, looking at specific characters, it’s hard to believe that Israeli politicians have brains, but in the long run, oddly enough, it turns out well. From the coalition of 48, it seems that only Syria remained alive and an enemy of Israel, and that was barely there. I mean, barely alive.
      1. +5
        30 September 2023 00: 47
        Quote: Negro
        In the long run, oddly enough, it turns out quite well. From the coalition of 48, it seems that only Syria remained alive and an enemy of Israel, and that was barely there. I mean, barely alive.

        Lebanon. Some of their ministers declared that Lebanon would be the last to sign peace with Israel.
        Iraq. No matter how many regimes have changed since 1948, everything is fundamentally against peace. Especially the current ones, they look into the mouths of the ayatollahs, although they do not hesitate to take American taxpayers’ money.
        Well, Iran was added. Although it is not Israel’s fault that the Shah could not resist, it was the idiot Jimmy Carter who pressed the Shah with human rights and crap freedoms.
        1. +6
          30 September 2023 06: 47
          Quote: Nagan
          Lebanon.

          You are right, I forgot that he also fit into the kipesh in 48.

          OK, two barely alive enemies.
          Quote: Nagan
          Iraq

          Iraq will not attack Israel now. Plus they don't have a common border.
          Quote: Nagan
          Well, Iran was added

          Just Iran, bearded miners and tractor drivers are fighting in Lebanon and Syria. But this is already a much different calico than 48. Moreover, Iran is not at all nearby; tanks will definitely not arrive there at dawn. The distance is like from present-day Russia to present-day Germany.
  12. -10
    29 September 2023 08: 23
    Give me a more expensive tank. An ordinary piece of hardware that is perfectly destroyed by ATGMs and grenade launchers. Although if you don’t have your own, you have to install artificial intelligence. Only there is no AI, they haven’t grown up yet, just an ordinary computer with a special program.
    1. +5
      29 September 2023 09: 17
      And how many Merkava tanks were destroyed?
      Over the entire history of the Merkava tank, from 1979 to today, less than 30 tanks were destroyed or written off after battle, and if you include various road accidents, then 40-45 vehicles of all models, and this is for 44 years of intensive operation and various wars and operations.
      We draw conclusions and don’t talk nonsense.
      1. -1
        29 September 2023 10: 21
        Quote: merkava-2bet
        We draw conclusions and don’t talk nonsense.

        Is it really the most indestructible? Well, after Challenger, of course. It was completely impossible to knock him out. Death Star on tracks. I wonder what about the statistics of Japanese tanks. Probably not bad either, not like the Orthodox T72
      2. 0
        29 September 2023 18: 36
        Quote: merkava-2bet
        , from 1979 to today, less than 30 tanks were destroyed or written off after battle

        It’s clear that I want to downplay it... but completely different information is circulating on the Internet: 64 Merkava tanks were knocked out by Hezbola alone, and only in the second Lebanese War. Moreover, these are tanks in which there were casualties after the defeat. (I don’t insist that all those hit were destroyed, but still...)
        If you search, you will even find a detailed list of destroyed tanks literally by day. This is data from waronline.org - and this, for a moment, is an Israeli military forum.

        But Israel was always trying to fight someone along its borders - so naturally there were much more tank losses.

        By the way... Jews usually do not fight with regular armed forces, but traditionally swagger over the Basmachi in dressing gowns and slippers... and even then manage to lose tanks. If you really want to learn everything about the combat capabilities and survivability of these tanks in battles with a truly prepared, serious enemy, then wait until Israel delivers Merkavas to Ukraine... but I’m afraid that you will be disappointed in your expectations. How disappointed the Germans and British were... and just now the Americans are coming to be disappointed laughing
        1. +5
          29 September 2023 19: 10
          You hear a ringing and don’t know where it is. Read the Waronline resource again, very carefully. We are talking about all the affected armored vehicles, but only five Merkava tanks were destroyed, and of them two Merkava-2, one Merkava-3Baz, and two Merkava -4alef, the very first modification, without KAZ Windbreaker.
          The first Merkava-4 was destroyed by a powerful landmine, and the second caught the Kornet ATGM ammunition in the stern, which caused detonation, and that’s it, five Merkava-2/3/4 tanks, five Karls, five.
          And yes, I was in that war and not a tourist.
          1. 0
            29 September 2023 21: 37
            Quote: merkava-2bet
            And yes, I was in that war and not a tourist.
            So you are the Israeli military?
            1. +2
              30 September 2023 00: 27
              Yeah, he is the one, there is such a profession - to defend the Motherland.
          2. -6
            3 October 2023 02: 08
            Quote: merkava-2bet
            and that’s it, five Merkava-2/3/4 tanks, five Karls, five.

            Your opponent was like this. Without aviation, without missiles, without artillery... And, EMNIP, on average, every second hit led to a penetration of the armor, and for every penetration of the armor there was one dead tanker. And what caused the full crew of 4 to die in an undestroyed tank?
        2. 0
          30 September 2023 19: 55
          Quote: Peter_Koldunov
          Jews usually do not fight with regular armed forces

          History on the Unified State Exam? request
          1. -4
            2 October 2023 07: 37
            Quote: And Us Rat
            Quote: Peter_Koldunov
            Jews usually do not fight with regular armed forces

            History on the Unified State Exam? request

            How many tanks, helicopters, planes and air defense systems did Hezbollah have in Lebanon?
  13. +1
    29 September 2023 08: 23
    It’s not surprising that the Israelis fight their chariot only for their theater of war. And as with the so-called “glass cockpit,” the operator’s brain is not indignant, the brain sees that he has no armor, he is in a bare place.
  14. +6
    29 September 2023 09: 12
    It’s good to read a reliable article that states the facts, and not Ryabov’s propaganda. Thanks to the author, it was a good read. good
    1. +1
      29 September 2023 09: 28
      The author doesn’t know a lot for various reasons, but I know about Merkava tanks, I myself served and fought on them, and also repaired them, plus my love for armored vehicles, as well as various courses on tanks that I took, give me much more knowledge than anyone here forum member, but a lot to say “Nizya”
      1. -1
        30 September 2023 19: 57
        Quote: merkava-2bet
        but a lot of things to say are “Nizya”

        Oh, how I understand you, but sometimes you really want to hit the next loudmouth with a butt on the head. feel drinks
      2. -3
        2 October 2023 07: 41
        Quote: merkava-2bet
        The author doesn’t know a lot for various reasons, but I know about Merkava tanks, I myself served and fought on them, and also repaired them, plus my love for armored vehicles, as well as various courses on tanks that I took, give me much more knowledge than anyone here forum member, but a lot to say “Nizya”

        I readily believe you. But will the Merkava withstand Tos’ salvo? Will it pass through the minefields of Agriculture?
        1. +2
          2 October 2023 17: 16
          I readily believe you. But will the Merkava withstand Tos’ salvo? Will it pass through the minefields of Agriculture?

          Why waste so much time on trifles, let’s immediately fire up an Iskander or a Caliber, or even better, a Satan with a 20 Mt BB, and then together we’ll count the molecules and atoms.
          1. -2
            9 October 2023 21: 11
            Quote: merkava-2bet
            Why waste so much time on trifles, let’s immediately fire up an Iskander or a Caliber, or even better, a Satan with a 20 Mt BB, and then together we’ll count the molecules and atoms

            No, it’s enough to drop a bomb from a copter
        2. +2
          4 October 2023 15: 28
          Is TOC designed to destroy armored vehicles?
          1. -1
            9 October 2023 21: 13
            Quote from Sumotori_380
            Is TOC designed to destroy armored vehicles?

            In general, he burns everything out. He doesn’t care
  15. -1
    29 September 2023 09: 58
    The massive use of electronics in military affairs has always evoked double feelings. On the one hand, it will no longer be possible to fight without it. On the other hand, with the development of electronic warfare, I’m silent about the electromagnetic pulse, everything turns into scrap metal... Well, and the requirements for the qualifications of fighters and maintenance. Cost of production and repair.
    When the Armata got up on the eve of the parade and didn’t start working right away, it turned out (for which it was bought, experts explained in the media) that the driver managed to ask the computer something incorrectly, and just couldn’t restart it, and they were waiting for the developers to wake up the tank. and when used en masse by recruited crews in combat conditions? If anything, I’m not talking about Armata, but in principle about saturating weapons with electronics. Relatively recently, they described how our potential friends were testing a “smart” rocket (or a drone, I don’t remember, it doesn’t matter) that turned around and hit the operator. It’s clear, tests, new technology - everything is natural and so for everyone. But where is the guarantee that overlays will not begin in real conditions? The price of each is the completion of the task, the life of the crew, the destruction of equipment.
    1. +8
      29 September 2023 10: 24
      I have always been interested in, where was EMR used, well, besides a nuclear explosion at test sites?
      I’ll tell you a big secret, genetically any armored vehicle is protected much better from EMP than other types of weapons, with the exception of only submarines under water, it has absolute protection even from radiation.
      Modern weapons systems are made intuitive and foolproof, now anyone who uses a smartphone will not experience problems with weapons, they are not asked to write a program in the ADA language, but everything is very simple and understandable, they have studied many systems themselves and have something to compare with.
      Regarding the Armata tank, at the moment it is, at best, a prototype, but not yet a tank, it needs to be proven, massive deliveries to the troops and personnel training, as well as industry, and only then will it be possible to talk about it as a tank.
    2. +9
      29 September 2023 10: 24
      But in practice we see drones, artillery, no EMP and red lines. If they start throwing neutron bombs, then it won’t matter what’s on the tank.
      The presence of electronics, on the contrary, simplifies the work and relieves stress from the crew - many things are monitored by the digital computer, not the soldier. Compare the Boeing 787 and 737. We like to talk about “it’s more reliable” when in fact they couldn’t/didn’t. What about automatic transmissions, what about electronics.
      The situation shows that fat and sophisticated tanks should be made BEFORE the war, and not after. Which is what the Israelis do. When the war starts there will be no time and money for this.
      1. +3
        30 September 2023 00: 54
        Quote from Arisaka
        If they start throwing neutron bombs, then it won’t matter what’s on the tank.

        Well, finally, neutrons don’t travel very well through metal plates. Infantry in the field - yes, it will be killed almost immediately, but tankers will get much less, and will feel it much later.
        1. 0
          4 October 2023 15: 32
          They just walk around and create induced radiation, which prevents the crews from being in the affected vehicles for a long time. It seems like they planned to use neutron warheads against tank columns on the march
    3. -1
      30 September 2023 19: 59
      Quote: Nikif
      I’m already silent about the electromagnetic pulse, everything turns into scrap metal....

      In the fantasies of ignorant ordinary people. In reality, everything is “a little” different. Yes
  16. +3
    29 September 2023 10: 35
    It seems that the time is passing when the tank was half-blind and helpless without prying eyes and could be more of an assault weapon to reinforce the infantry than a tank itself. So those brilliant cuirassiers will return to the battlefields, but in a new guise and with new capabilities that will make this force even more formidable. It seems that only little things change, but because of them such a revolution occurs in the entire military affairs.
  17. -1
    29 September 2023 10: 54
    I'll throw in my three cents, banal ones. That's when a plastic drone with a Molotov cocktail falls from above, stupid with it. When the sensors start smoking, what can the AI ​​do?
    1. +2
      29 September 2023 21: 38
      Quote: Geo73
      When the sensors start smoking, what can the AI ​​do?
      Find your bearings based on information from your neighbors. But what should a person do?
    2. +2
      30 September 2023 20: 02
      Quote: Geo73
      That's when a plastic drone with a Molotov cocktail will fall from above

      Palestinians regularly throw bottles of fuel at Israeli equipment, even armored jeeps rarely become unusable because of this, this can do little harm to a modern tank, this is not a tin box from the Second World War.



      The war against the Ukrainian Armed Forces seems to be giving rise to new misconceptions.
      1. -3
        9 October 2023 21: 20
        Quote: And Us Rat
        Palestinians regularly throw bottles of fuel at Israeli equipment, even armored jeeps rarely become unusable because of this, this can do little harm to a modern tank, this is not a tin box from the Second World War

        1. 0
          10 October 2023 07: 43
          And where do you think the tank itself is on fire? The incendiary mixture is burning on the edge of the tank and on the ground. The tank itself doesn’t give a damn about it. You need to think and analyze what you see before giving out anything.
  18. +2
    29 September 2023 11: 25
    When they have experienced all the advantages of this method of seeing around, the second step will be to create a similar system for fur-water, with its own bells and whistles, such as recognizing obstacles, mines, hidden holes, and soil moisture.
    1. +4
      29 September 2023 19: 25
      It’s already been at least 15 years, but we have it.
  19. -1
    29 September 2023 11: 44
    A tank commander in a combat situation must use glasses, essentially an analogue of various VR toys in which you are immersed in a world built with computer graphics. Anyone who has tried this device knows that it causes nausea and dizziness. Perhaps the latest versions are protected from this, but not a fact. If military pilots have a trained vestibular apparatus, then it looks like tankers need to start training like pilots, otherwise why this very expensive Iron Vision.
  20. +7
    29 September 2023 13: 05
    Impressive. The dream of a tanker today in terms of equipment, a company commander in terms of training opportunities for l/s wherever you want with training ground quality, a division commander in terms of the ability to manage units. Israeli electronics engineers and programmers are at their best.
  21. KCA
    +2
    29 September 2023 13: 15
    The more complex electronics, the greater the vulnerability, everyone is already accustomed to computers, it seems that the electronics are not particularly complex, but if you give the case a good slap, there is a very high probability of a reboot, less likely to fail, and then grenade launchers will fly into the tank , ATGMs, guns, what it means to reboot all electronic systems in a tank is clear to everyone - 50-60-70 tons of scrap metal
    1. +4
      29 September 2023 14: 35
      If you slap it hard, it seems to me that the crew themselves will not feel very good, which will also affect the further possibility of fighting.
      Perhaps we also underestimate electronics too much (although we laugh at the flesh and blood ammunition feeder in Abrams)
      1. KCA
        +1
        29 September 2023 17: 39
        Soviet electronics, like later Russian electronics, were somewhat different from Western ones, microassemblies baked in ceramics and sealed into a board, this is not a board with a bunch of connectors, although we also have D-SUB connectors and other unreliable ones
    2. +4
      29 September 2023 19: 28
      They are afraid of the wolf and don’t go into the forest. The whole world is becoming digital and we, like mammoths, are dying out.
      1. KCA
        -3
        30 September 2023 08: 06
        Dada, like mammoths, in backward Russia of all developed countries there is the cheapest and fastest Internet, mobile 4-5G, home cable 100 and many have 1000MB/s, but in non-dying countries gayrops and SSH_P still use modems for telephone lines, our population coverage is also higher, they promise to roll out a photolithograph in two years, and not a copy of the Dutch one, say, but using other technologies, MSK will be produced faster and cost less
        1. +7
          30 September 2023 09: 17
          they promise to roll out the photolithograph in two years

          Yes, my friend, you love science fiction.
          They officially promised 2300 Armat tanks by what year?
          From around the world, volunteers are collecting radios and Maviki copters for soldiers in the Northern Military District.
          Continue?
          1. KCA
            -4
            30 September 2023 09: 44
            China, like us, was banned from selling photolithographs, but somehow specialists found that the new Huawei smartphone processor was made using 7nm technology, where did it come from? Either they made their own, or “parallel import”, i.e. smuggling, and Russia will not be able to create or buy? The Armata is never a tank for attack, you don’t need many of them, one per battalion, no one forbids volunteers from purchasing r/st and Mavics, and in what countries are Mavics produced? In China and Taiwan, not at all in SSH_P, maybe the ARM processors for them come from SSH_P? Fuck it, from Southeast Asia, I’ve been selling computers for 10 years, I’m not 100% sure after all these years, but I’ve never seen an AMD or Intel processor made in the USA, Nvidia is also not from the US_P
            1. +4
              30 September 2023 11: 40
              Armata is never a tank for attack

              What is it for, for PR and parades?
              1. +5
                30 September 2023 11: 43
                This is what we see, T-62 and even T-55 tanks appeared in the Northern Military District zone, or is this all the machinations of the imperialists?
                1. KCA
                  -6
                  30 September 2023 13: 20
                  Have you seen a T-55 or T-62 somewhere on the front line? They stand quietly at checkpoints and in the rear, buried or covered with concrete blocks up to their ears. Which is better, a tank or an armored personnel carrier at a checkpoint?
                  1. +5
                    30 September 2023 13: 48
                    Quote: KCA
                    Have you seen a T-55 or T-62 somewhere on the front line? They stand quietly at checkpoints and in the rear, buried or covered with concrete blocks up to their ears.

                    https://ukr.warspotting.net/search/?belligerent=2&weapon=1&model_str=t-62
                    I see 73 killed and 8 damaged T-62s. I don’t see any roadblocks or concrete blocks.
                    1. KCA
                      -5
                      30 September 2023 14: 31
                      I didn’t dig deep into the link, I’m too lazy, but what did you want to see on the bourgeois portals? The fact that Russia is tearing up the outskirts like a hot water bottle? Look at hundreds of destroyed Russian tanks and armored vehicles, a tank burned to hell, rusty, and on the rust there are absolutely clean, white letters Z, V, O, it’s a miracle, the tank burned down, and the letters seemed to have been applied right before filming, isn’t it a miracle? Didn't they print any new training manuals for you at Tsipso? Call me on my mobile, we’ll discuss the investigator or the security service of Sberbank, although I don’t have accounts with it
                      1. +2
                        30 September 2023 16: 35
                        Quote: KCA
                        Look at hundreds of destroyed Russian tanks and armored vehicles, a tank burned to hell, rusty, and on the rust there are absolutely clean, white letters Z, V, O, it’s a miracle, the tank burned down, and the letters seemed to have been applied right before filming, isn’t it a miracle?

                        This, as I understand it, is a statement that the loss of the Armed Forces of Ukraine is passed off as the loss of the RF Armed Forces? The example is not useful, there are no T-62 tanks in service with the Ukrainian Armed Forces, so any killed T-62 does not need identification.
                      2. KCA
                        -5
                        30 September 2023 16: 50
                        Do you know how many T-62 and T-55 were stored in the outskirts? Where did you get this information from? The main storage facilities were in the DPR, but not all of them, tell us, or is the VCA not allowing it?
                      3. +2
                        30 September 2023 17: 10
                        An example of the T-62 in service with the Ukrainian Armed Forces - in the studio. There is a T-55 from Slovakia, a T-62 - I’ve never seen it, even captured ones don’t seem to be used.
                      4. KCA
                        -4
                        30 September 2023 18: 34
                        There are T-62s from the storage of the Verkhovna Rada, but in the outskirts there were none at all, or in the territory of the Western Military District in the outskirts there were only initially completed T-64s? Come on? Where do the T-72 and T-80B come from? their outskirts did not produce, they produced T-80, but B and BM Tagil
                      5. +2
                        30 September 2023 18: 42
                        So will there be examples? Or just “I swear to my mother, they must be!”?
                      6. -10
                        30 September 2023 18: 55
                        Quote from: Barmaglot_07
                        https://ukr.warspotting.net/search/?belligerent=2&weapon=1&model_str=t-62

                        After your “photo” with the “cassettes collected in Kharkov”, you should hide in a crack and not show off. Amateur, damn, proof negative
                  2. 0
                    30 September 2023 20: 23
                    Quote: KCA
                    Have you seen a T-55 or T-62 somewhere on the front line?

                    In your own media and telegram channels. request

                    1. KCA
                      -1
                      30 September 2023 23: 33
                      And cheat? These photos could have been taken at a training ground, thousands of kilometers from the LBS, I will dress in camouflage and take the photo 30 meters from the house, against the backdrop of a swamp or pine forest, like this, I have a swamp to the left of the road, a hill and pine trees to the right, and what? Am I a frontline air force fighter?
                    2. +1
                      1 October 2023 02: 11
                      In your own media and telegram channels.

                      T-62s on the front end, precisely in direct fire contact with the enemy, and not with the PDO, are encountered. About the T-54/55, although they are also there at the front, I haven’t seen much information like that yet. But in your first photo it’s not a T-62 or a T-54/55, but a “seventy-two”. smile
        2. +1
          4 October 2023 15: 40
          And the base stations are also made in Russia?
        3. 0
          4 October 2023 15: 41
          We'll wait until they roll out and then we'll start dancing.
  22. 0
    29 September 2023 15: 43
    The direction is correct, BT's situational awareness is the biggest problem. The question is why not give the commander and driver FPV glasses? It’s better to install better cameras, everything in the system under AI, the commander receives data from the UAV with duplication from the command post. So for all this you need a fast and reliable Internet and software for all this.
    1. KCA
      0
      29 September 2023 17: 43
      They ran out of advertisements for FPV, and these are just the first person viewing virtual glasses, the problem is that they can cause epilepsy attacks and other mental disorders, it’s possible to control one drone, taking into account its flight time, but 2-3-4 can already be fraught, this is not a movie with virtual reality, it will easily blow the roof off
      1. +4
        29 September 2023 20: 59
        This is not so, I myself was in an exercise where they used quadcopters in the “Swarm” system, there were 12-16 copters in the air at the same time, and everyone who was in the “Tsayad/Hunter” system received data, two girls in a jeep controlled them and everything was automatic ,they just confirmed or canceled missions and that’s it.
        1. KCA
          -1
          30 September 2023 15: 38
          This is all individual, personally, I played with 3D glasses a long time ago and was surprised at the realism, my co-worker flew off his chair after 10 minutes, although he was sober, did not suffer from illness, and what will happen to your girls if they do not show demonstration performances, but dupe from dawn to dusk, or even a day, in the mud, in the snow, in the snow, when shells and missiles are exploding somewhere nearby? In the female troops of the IRGC, I’m sure they are maniacs, but is it like that everywhere?
          1. 0
            30 September 2023 20: 53
            I understand that you are a bit old, and most likely a tube, how can I explain the neural network control algorithms to you?
            1. KCA
              -2
              30 September 2023 23: 48
              Don’t even explain, I’m not that old, I’ve been working with computers for 35 years, I’ve known them for 40 years, I’m more or less familiar with both old age and innovations, but can you personally explain the neural network control algorithms? If you can, what are you doing here on a simple website? You must have a job worth hundreds of kilobucks a month and no time for babbling, but you’re here, that means you’re just a babbling
              1. +1
                1 October 2023 01: 49
                You must have a job worth hundreds of kilobucks a month and no time for babbling, but you’re here, that means you’re just a babbling

                That is, this forum is only for homeless people, alkanauts and people like you, with low social self-esteem?
      2. 0
        30 September 2023 20: 34
        Quote: KCA
        they can cause epilepsy attacks and other mental disorders

        It all comes down to quality. If this is cheap crap for 200 bucks, then it is quite likely, but if it is, for example, XTAL 3 Mixed Reality for 12 kilobucks, then this is a completely different story. And this is a civilian helmet. I tried it, you can sit in it for days without consequences, you can’t even see the pixels in it, and the picture is like rock crystal.
        And military technologies are even more advanced than civilian ones.
        1. KCA
          +1
          30 September 2023 23: 54
          Well, not 12, but from 9, and this is official and in Moscow time, and I write - purely individually, snipers can lie there for several days and wait for the target, everyone can do that, but what, a cool camouflage suit, a vintage one for fifty dollars, lie down and wait, but why is one in a million able, but the rest can’t?
    2. 0
      29 September 2023 21: 41
      Quote: max702
      The question is why not give the commander and driver FPV glasses?
      Glasses cause problems. Here they wrote about Apache pilots whose eyes began to move asynchronously to work with goggles.
      1. +3
        3 October 2023 18: 26
        Quote: bk0010
        Quote: max702
        The question is why not give the commander and driver FPV glasses?
        Glasses cause problems. Here they wrote about Apache pilots whose eyes began to move asynchronously to work with goggles.

        It was about glasses for Mi-28 pilots.
        In which they could not stay for 10 minutes.
        The cuckoo flew away completely.
  23. 0
    29 September 2023 17: 26
    We need all this too. Something more (transparent armor), something less (artificial intelligence: it is unknown whether it will help or will only interfere, there is no freeway in battle), but it is necessary. I didn’t like that the situational awareness tools were made in the form of one part. It would be better to stick about 20 more webcams on the outside: the thing is cheap, but they won’t knock everyone out with one burst, plus different angles can be useful.
    1. +4
      29 September 2023 19: 02
      I didn’t like that the situational awareness tools were made in the form of one part. It would be better to stick about 20 more webcams on the outside:

      IronVision also works with cameras installed in different projections of the tank. Simply the most informative observation device is the panoramic module.
  24. +2
    29 September 2023 18: 58
    Tanks are gradually approaching modern aviation. Perhaps we will eventually see crews with a pilot and operator, like in a fighter bomber. Such tanks will be very suitable for modern youth, who are unlikely to be able to walk far through the taiga, but can sit in front of a computer screen for 16 hours. In conditions of total war, to produce such complex products, it is necessary to build megafactories with a production capacity of a million units, like passenger cars. The presence of 500 or 1000 pieces of even the most ingenious products does not solve anything because... they won't last long.
  25. +2
    29 September 2023 19: 32
    Quote: merkava-2bet
    It seems there is no developed metallurgy in Israel

    When it seems, they are baptized.
    Then how do we have tanks and guns and much more?

    I confirm that there is, I was invited to a plant in Israel as a process engineer back in 2013, we almost reached an agreement but it didn’t work out, I was asked to look hard for my Jewish roots, as I didn’t push my mother to the wall, she denied everything, in short, I couldn’t prove that you have Jewish roots. As for the salary, if I’m not mistaken, we were talking about 5800 shekels, I have no idea how much it is now at the exchange rate..
    1. +5
      29 September 2023 20: 46
      Boy. Do not whistle. Who needs you here as an engineer and without citizenship. For reference. A cleaning lady received 5800 in 2013. You will tell stories here on the site. We have enough of our own specialists
  26. -2
    29 September 2023 21: 03
    The sore spot of this tank is the electronics, the “blood of the tank”. Take out the tank’s electronics and it turns into a pile of scrap metal, a target.
  27. -5
    29 September 2023 21: 09
    Alaba on Merkava and that’s it, Israel has no tanks at all!
  28. +3
    29 September 2023 23: 24
    The main point of this article is the inclusion of a tank in TORCH-X. Find here the link to the @elbitsystems channel and look there about this very “torch”. The videos alone are enough to make you see the light. Talking about a bucket of paint or shrapnel is like the joke: “I’ll give you an introduction - you’re in the bare steppe, and suddenly two German tanks come around the corner.”
    Also in the discussion, one of the Israeli residents mentioned that the entire M tank project had “import substitution” as one of its main goals. Someone will remember Lahav, but I’ll remind you of something else: even in the F35 they built in the integration of on-board sensors with the Israeli information exchange system, essentially replacing American software with their system.
  29. -1
    30 September 2023 07: 40
    All this is interesting! But until this chariot takes part in real combat operations, it is very premature to judge its qualities with an equal enemy. I think the example of leopards and challengers is indicative!
    1. +1
      30 September 2023 21: 14
      But until this chariot takes part in real combat operations, it is very premature to judge its qualities with an equal enemy.

      Go study history, the 1982 war in Lebanon, where tanks were first used against the T-55 and T-62, you’re an expert on horseradish.
  30. 0
    30 September 2023 08: 07
    Quote: Vadim B
    Boy. Do not whistle. Who needs you here as an engineer and without citizenship. For reference. A cleaning lady received 5800 in 2013. You will tell stories here on the site. We have enough of our own specialists

    Monsieur, you are a stupid and pompous sheep, you have never met me but you accuse me of not even understanding what.
    1. As for the salary - 5800 shekels at the 2013 exchange rate is 1600 dollars, do you say a cleaning lady gets that much in Israel, and even in 2013?
    2. Regarding local Jews who want to work at a metallurgical plant, you know, when I studied to become a metallurgical engineer, all our textbooks were written by Jews, but for some reason, during the 20 years of my work in metallurgy, I did not see a single Jew working at a metallurgical plant plant working as an ordinary technologist, but there were many of them among the management, but not a single one among the technical staff.
    1. +3
      30 September 2023 09: 36
      . As for the salary - 5800 shekels at the 2013 exchange rate is 1600 dollars, are you saying that a cleaning lady gets that much in Israel, and even in 2013?

      The question is, gross or net, if gross then yes, the cleaner and an ordinary security guard are super, if net then a cleaner with two jobs and a security guard at a government agency.
      In 2013, as a University Security employee, I received a net 6500-7000 shekels per month after paying all taxes, which is about 20%.
      And yes, they offered you a very low salary, in general, at that time, a young engineer after graduating from university was given 8500-9000 shekels a month, and this is for mechanical engineering, more for electricity, and the coolest programmers, my programmer friend, began to receive 2011-12000 in 13000 shekels net, and that’s not much, now he has 55000-65000 shekels a month, not counting the bonus, he earned his name and experience with his mind.
    2. +2
      30 September 2023 10: 31
      Quote from: mad-max78
      Quote: Vadim B
      Boy. Do not whistle. Who needs you here as an engineer and without citizenship. For reference. A cleaning lady received 5800 in 2013. You will tell stories here on the site. We have enough of our own specialists

      Monsieur, you are a stupid and pompous sheep, you have never met me but you accuse me of not even understanding what.
      1. As for the salary - 5800 shekels at the 2013 exchange rate is 1600 dollars, do you say a cleaning lady gets that much in Israel, and even in 2013?
      2. Regarding local Jews who want to work at a metallurgical plant, you know, when I studied to become a metallurgical engineer, all our textbooks were written by Jews, but for some reason, during the 20 years of my work in metallurgy, I did not see a single Jew working at a metallurgical plant plant working as an ordinary technologist, but there were many of them among the management, but not a single one among the technical staff.

      And in Western Kazakhstan, the senior technologists at open-hearth, bloom and ESPT-2 were Jews. Kliot, Faibisovich, Shparber. Why did I know them since childhood, because my mother worked first as a senior quality control inspector at a bloom for about 15 years, and then as a head of quality control at an open-hearth until she retired.
  31. 0
    30 September 2023 10: 09
    Quote: merkava-2bet
    . As for the salary - 5800 shekels at the 2013 exchange rate is 1600 dollars, are you saying that a cleaning lady gets that much in Israel, and even in 2013?

    The question is, gross or net, if gross then yes, the cleaner and an ordinary security guard are super, if net then a cleaner with two jobs and a security guard at a government agency.
    In 2013, as a University Security employee, I received a net 6500-7000 shekels per month after paying all taxes, which is about 20%.
    And yes, they offered you a very low salary, in general, at that time, a young engineer after graduating from university was given 8500-9000 shekels a month, and this is for mechanical engineering, more for electricity, and the coolest programmers, my programmer friend, began to receive 2011-12000 in 13000 shekels net, and that’s not much, now he has 55000-65000 shekels a month, not counting the bonus, he earned his name and experience with his mind.

    I understood that I was offered a low salary, but Gersh Leibovich, with whom I negotiated, promised prospects for salary growth, by the way, there are mainly metallurgical technologists, mainly from the countries of the former USSR, on short-term contracts, a year, two, no more, I don’t hold any grudge that I due to the lack of Jewish roots, they didn’t take me on a long-term contract and I wasn’t interested in a short-term one, it’s just that at that moment there was a crisis with work and it seemed like a good option to me, and then 2014 came and in my DPR such problems began against the background of which what I considered a problem before was my best period in my life.
    1. +1
      30 September 2023 11: 54
      I don’t hold any grudges that due to the lack of Jewish roots I was not hired for a long-term contract

      I don’t believe it, where is the contract and where is permanent residence in Israel.
      I personally know two scientists, one is a candidate and the other is a doctor, both in economics from Novosibirsk University, they have been working under contract at our Ben-Gurion University for ten years, and they are not the least bit Jewish, they dream of obtaining Israeli citizenship, but alas.
      And their salary is in dollars, for example, a candidate receives $5500 not including social benefits and once a year a free flight to Russia for a visit, and if more often a 50% discount on tickets, including family, his wife works as a legal consultant at the Russian Embassy.
  32. -4
    30 September 2023 13: 04
    Everything sounds great, like a regular advertisement for Israel. One thing is unclear. Which crew member runs around the outside of the tower and wipes all the sights and sensors from dust and dirt so that the crew can control the tank, and the electronics, along with artificial intelligence, work correctly and in a timely manner?
    1. +1
      1 October 2023 10: 01
      So, in your theory, they all won’t work because they resemble a fragile milliner from the 19th century?
  33. -1
    30 September 2023 13: 59
    Quote: merkava-2bet
    I don’t hold any grudges that due to the lack of Jewish roots I was not hired for a long-term contract

    I don’t believe it, where is the contract and where is permanent residence in Israel.
    I personally know two scientists, one is a candidate and the other is a doctor, both in economics from Novosibirsk University, they have been working under contract at our Ben-Gurion University for ten years, and they are not the least bit Jewish, they dream of obtaining Israeli citizenship, but alas.
    And their salary is in dollars, for example, a candidate receives $5500 not including social benefits and once a year a free flight to Russia for a visit, and if more often a 50% discount on tickets, including family, his wife works as a legal consultant at the Russian Embassy.

    Did you carefully read what I wrote? I was asked to find Jewish roots, you understand perfectly well why they need this and this is exactly what is needed for me to become a citizen of Israel with all rights, I didn’t have these roots, for a long-term contract there were such conditions, for non-citizens the conditions are simpler but in terms of time, these are usually six-month contracts and the salary is less.
    1. +1
      30 September 2023 14: 19
      Quote from: mad-max78
      I was asked to find Jewish roots, you understand perfectly well why they need this and this is precisely what is needed for me to become a citizen of Israel with all rights, I did not have these roots.


      It's a pity that you are not a friend of Abramovich. He would definitely help. It would be discovered that you are a descendant of a lost tribe of chinstrap emperor penguin herders. Israel would announce the discovery of a lost tribe, you would receive citizenship, the emperor penguins would definitely confirm this, for an additional portion of fish. This is in every way cheaper than becoming a Sephardic Jew, and among the penguins, no one will vote against it, nor will they be indignant. I didn't want to offend. Joke.
    2. +1
      30 September 2023 20: 42
      Quote from: mad-max78
      Did you carefully read what I wrote?

      Guy, four Israelis are already telling you - don’t whistle. Well, don’t get into the bottle, don’t embarrass yourself. Tell me honestly - I lied, it didn’t work, be a man and admit your mistake. wink
    3. +1
      30 September 2023 21: 01
      I'm afraid you didn't understand me, read it again, I wrote it in Russian and it's clear.
      A contract and permanent residence are two different things, and if someone works under a contract in Israel, even a Martian, they don’t care about their nationality, the terms of the contract and that’s all.
      You want to say that if you were working in Dubai under a contract, you would be forced to convert to Islam for the sake of this, don’t talk nonsense, there are quite a few Russian scientists at my university, and I have already given two examples.
  34. -5
    30 September 2023 16: 04
    It’s interesting, why do we need tracked tanks in the paradise desert, where there is eternal summer? As far as I understand from the networks, today the Israelis, to save money, are switching to Japanese jeeps instead of armored personnel carriers.
    1. +3
      1 October 2023 10: 04
      Israel has 9 climatic zones, and in a very small area, changing landscapes from desert to mountainous - you will find everything. 4-5 months a year there are heavy rains with a sharp cooling, as a result of which part of the territory turns into impassable mud. This is what the caterpillars are after
  35. +1
    30 September 2023 17: 04
    Quote from Eugene Zaboy
    Quote from: mad-max78
    I was asked to find Jewish roots, you understand perfectly well why they need this and this is precisely what is needed for me to become a citizen of Israel with all rights, I did not have these roots.


    It's a pity that you are not a friend of Abramovich. He would definitely help. It would be discovered that you are a descendant of a lost tribe of chinstrap emperor penguin herders. Israel would announce the discovery of a lost tribe, you would receive citizenship, the emperor penguins would definitely confirm this, for an additional portion of fish. This is in every way cheaper than becoming a Sephardic Jew, and among the penguins, no one will vote against it, nor will they be indignant. I didn't want to offend. Joke.

    Well, maybe Abramovich needed it more than me, maybe the person was in a hurry or was late))
    This was interesting to me from the point of view of understanding how these roots are looked for, and they are looked for until the third generation, the grandmother is still coming, but the great-grandmother is no longer there, although with Abramovich it somehow went wrong))
    1. 0
      1 October 2023 01: 41
      Quote from: mad-max78
      This was interesting to me from the point of view of understanding how these roots are looked for, and they are looked for until the third generation, the grandmother is still coming, but the great-grandmother is no longer there, although with Abramovich it somehow went wrong))


      Don't be upset, you're not the first. Up to the third generation, this is still a small thing. The Ashkenazis tried to get to the bottom of the original ancestor - the Italian one. All they found out was that their “Eva” is a purebred Italian and has no Jewish roots. So, today, they are not considered Jews. They were Jews for thousands of years and for their own money they lost this right. At least this is no longer recognized by part of the Jewish Diaspora. You can't argue with geneticists. Ashkenazis, by the way, managed to create a reference genetic portrait of a Jewish man. So what should we do with all this now? Therefore, the option with emperor penguins looks like the most suitable and indisputable. It is difficult to argue with Abramovich, the arguments are very weighty. Most likely, his ancestors from the Roman Empire moved to Portugal, then with Columbus they moved to America, gradually crossed it, conquering the prairies from the Indians. We were among the first to reach the West Coast of the North American continent. We lived there for a while and moved to Kamchatka. With all this, grandmothers always followed grandfathers on this difficult and dangerous route. What commands respect. Abramovich himself decided to complete his ancestors’ trip around the world by returning to Portugal, and then, probably, he will decide to move to Italy. Something like this. Quite logical. Although, the details are not known and these are all tea leaves.
  36. 0
    30 September 2023 21: 00
    Quote: And Us Rat
    Quote from: mad-max78
    Did you carefully read what I wrote?

    Guy, four Israelis are already telling you - don’t whistle. Well, don’t get into the bottle, don’t embarrass yourself. Tell me honestly - I lied, it didn’t work, be a man and admit your mistake. wink

    I have opened a correspondence especially for you, the company with which I negotiated www.hodmetal.co.il, there is even a website in Russian, in case you don’t understand Hebrew, the contact person with whom I communicated and negotiated is Gersh Leitman, the telephone number of the person with whom I spoke 972-543383227, email used for correspondence [email protected]
    correspondence from 2016 is not 2013 as I wrote at the beginning, this is to blame.
    Is this information enough for you to check on your own, am I telling the truth, or is there anything else that needs to be provided? I would be grateful if you call these contacts yourself and write here about whether I lied or not. I'm looking forward to your response, I hope you won't keep me waiting long.
    1. +2
      30 September 2023 21: 34
      I won’t bring up the past for your sake, you couldn’t get a contract, that’s your problem, and there are enough swindlers in any country, they wanted to scam you like a kid, that’s all, or you’re not telling something.
  37. +1
    30 September 2023 21: 46
    Quote: merkava-2bet
    I won’t bring up the past for your sake, you couldn’t get a contract, that’s your problem, and there are enough swindlers in any country, they wanted to scam you like a kid, that’s all, or you’re not telling something.

    Well, they wanted and wanted, I really don’t understand why, other than a low salary, they wanted to scam me, no one offered to become a Jew, circumcision was not needed, I didn’t lose anything, they didn’t gain anything, in the very first message I wrote that I’m not offended, For me it was an interesting communication experience.
  38. +1
    1 October 2023 20: 07
    Quote: And Us Rat
    Quote: V.
    You cannot accept that your nation is no worse or better than other nations.

    I can do that, but apparently you can’t.
    Because a Judeophobic remark like “I haven’t seen a Jewish worker” is like saying “I haven’t seen a single sober Russian” - this is ordinary Nazism..

    As I understand it, the remark about not seeing Jewish workers is a stone in my garden. Mr. Anasrat, I’ll expand my answer especially for you, I worked at 6 metallurgical plants since the XNUMXs and at none of these plants there was not a single person in the hot shop at the steel smelting furnaces or blast furnaces with a Jewish surname in ordinary positions, imagine a Jewish steel worker or a Jew blast furnace operator from the field of science fiction, the exception were young people after college who could work in these positions for a year or two to gain experience. But there are quite a lot of Jews among the middle management, and even more among the top management.
    My mentor Lev Leizerovich Urin, technologist of the steelmaking shop, everything I know I learned from him and I am grateful to him for it, my late director Lam Matvey Markovich, honored metallurgist of Ukraine, the best director I have ever encountered, both Jews, both played huge role in my life.
    Now I will go further and tell you where there are even fewer Jews than in metallurgy, my brother is a miner, and in his entire life he has not seen a single Jew in a mine in an ordinary position, and as a site manager or director of a mine, like our famous Jew “miner” Efim Zvyagilsky (Ukrainian deputy of the 5th convocation) https://fb.ru/article/253005/zvyagilskiy-efim-leonidovich-biografiya-foto-semya you can read his biography, he began his career not as a miner but immediately as a site manager, probably a coincidence) )
    At the same time, he created the most successful mine in Ukraine and the salary at this mine was the highest in the industry.
    That is, the trend for Jews in metallurgy and mines is the same, there are no Jews among the rank and file or they are very rare, but there are enough Jews among the middle and many among the top management, this is stupid statistics, of course you can show your statistics in which the percentage of Jews among There will be less leadership than among other nationalities, but I think you won’t be able to provide such statistics because this is the absolute truth.
    Please tell me, dear Anasrat, does this information make me a Judeophobe or am I still objective?
    In my humble opinion, what I wrote is publicly available information, it does not make Jews second class, Jews as leaders are more successful than non-Jews, this nation is more proactive than the Slavs and everyone else, I can’t imagine a Jewish mother who, from childhood, tells her son you should become a good miner or steelmaker)))).
    My many years of experience working with Jews in my production suggests that Jews are thinking about their careers and steps for the years ahead, is this bad?
    The answer is no, that’s how it should be.

    PS By the way, yesterday, accusing me of lying, you did not respond to my message in which I indicated the name, phone number and email of the person with whom I negotiated about working at a metallurgical plant in Israel, you checked this information, I will wait for your answer or there is no point in waiting ?
  39. +3
    2 October 2023 09: 02
    Quote from Kartograph
    Quote: merkava-2bet
    The author doesn’t know a lot for various reasons, but I know about Merkava tanks, I myself served and fought on them, and also repaired them, plus my love for armored vehicles, as well as various courses on tanks that I took, give me much more knowledge than anyone here forum member, but a lot to say “Nizya”

    I readily believe you. But will the Merkava withstand Tos’ salvo? Will it pass through the minefields of Agriculture?

    I’ll tell you more, it won’t withstand an Iskander strike, and it won’t withstand a tactical nuclear charge, not to mention a strategic nuclear strike, and if a Merkava is dropped from an airplane, it won’t withstand that either, in short, there’s a lot of things it won’t withstand, you Is this exactly what you wanted to know?
  40. 0
    3 October 2023 16: 08
    You have not been active as a commentator for a long time (write comments). Voting is prohibited.
  41. The comment was deleted.
  42. +2
    5 October 2023 13: 42
    Quote: V.
    I feel sorry for you, like other peoples who live their whole lives in permanent war.

    Citizen, let's not talk about this. Afghanistan had just ended, the Chechen epic had just begun, Chechnya had just calmed down, Georgia had happened, Georgia had just been defeated, Syria and Ukraine were formed. Since '79 there has been a permanent conflict with someone somewhere.
  43. -1
    8 October 2023 05: 31
    Well, what did they see through the armor?)) These Merkavas - Shmerkavas are burning with a clear flame, as a result of the battles it became clear that it was far from our tanks, now they were fighting and waving, including all their reconnaissance being crap so that they don’t have time to change their pants.
    1. -1
      8 October 2023 16: 20
      Yes, they burned Merkava. Something like that. No armor saved
  44. 0
    12 October 2023 01: 26
    As I understand it, the statistics of the affected merks need to be rewritten? Will a regular fpv drone work?
  45. 0
    12 December 2023 01: 02
    61-63 tons weight, and $6-$10 million per tank (6 for ourselves, 10 for export). Well, yes, you can make a great tank.