Who will give the Russian army armor

Recently, Mr. Medvedev got everyone a little overexcited when, in his usual manner, he announced that this year the army would receive 1 new tanks. From the questions "from what?" the internet has gone haywire. The Commander-in-Chief had to intervene, and Vladimir Vladimirovich clarified that the army would receive 1 new and modernized tanks.

As the saying goes, feel the difference.

The question is, who and where will make these 1 tanks? As they say, the question is not that of Everest, but Elbrus for sure.

During the Great Patriotic War, tanks and self-propelled guns (somehow we didn’t have any other armored vehicles, except for the Komsomolets tractor) were produced by the following enterprises:

– Plant No. 183 in Nizhny Tagil (evacuated from Kharkov);
– Nizhny Tagil Carriage Works;
- Kirov Plant (Chelyabinsk Kirov Plant, created on the basis of an evacuated plant from Leningrad);
- Plant No. 112 "Krasnoye Sormovo" in the city of Gorky;
– Ural plant of heavy engineering, Sverdlovsk;
- Plant No. 174 Omsk;
- Stalingrad Tractor Plant.

Plus, factories that produced armored vehicles, of which more than 13 thousand were manufactured:

- Plant No. 177, Vyksa, Gorky Region;
- GAZ in the city of Gorky;
- Izhora plant in Leningrad;
- Plant No. 189, Leningrad.

In total, over 116 tanks and self-propelled guns (33 types) and 13 armored vehicles (6 types) were produced in three shifts by workers and engineers from 11 enterprises.

Probably everyone is wondering what is in Russia today?

Today, 52 different models of armored vehicles (tanks, self-propelled guns, infantry fighting vehicles, armored personnel carriers, engineering and auxiliary equipment), which are in service with the Russian Army, are produced at 7 factories.

1. JSC Research and Production Corporation Uralvagonzavod named after F. E. Dzerzhinsky. Belongs to the corporation "Rostec".

Today it is really a full-fledged corporation, which includes several enterprises. Uralvagonzavod itself today produces the following types of armored vehicles:

- Tank T-90 and its modifications, export version of T-90S;
- Tank T-72B3;
- Combat recovery vehicle BREM-1, BREM-1M;
- IMR-3M obstacle engineering vehicle;
- Tank bridge layer MTU-72;
– Tank bulldozer-snow plow TBS-86.

In addition, theoretically, the plant can produce the T-14 tank, BMP T-15, BMOP "Terminator-2". Here the word “may” should be interpreted in such a way that, under certain conditions, the release of this technique is theoretically possible. In practice, while the manual assembly of single copies.

It is difficult to assess the capabilities of UVZ in terms of tank production, the data is closed, it is necessary to calculate through the total revenue, which is very inaccurate. But there are two numbers: the first is the minimum, from pessimists - 250 pieces per year. The second is from the optimists, but even they can't reach Medvedev - 1 tanks. If we just take the middle as the truth, then it turns out that UVZ can produce from 300 to 500 tanks, but this is a very optimistic figure in reality. UVZ does not have enough workers at its disposal to enable the plant to plow in three shifts. Moreover, teams of specialists from UVZ work both in the border zone on the territory of Russia and directly in the combat zone, repairing tanks.

At the height of its power, in 1985, UVZ produced 1 T-559 tanks. In post-Soviet times, the maximum output was 72 cars per year.

In general, UVZ is actually working at the limit of its capabilities, simultaneously releasing new tanks, repairing damaged ones and modernizing museum exhibits such as the T-62 and T-54.

2. Rubtsovsky Machine-Building Plant. Branch of Uralvagonzavod.

A small plant in the Altai Territory produced parts and assemblies for the BMP-1, subsequently the plant launched the production of tracked vehicles:

- Combat reconnaissance vehicle BRM-3K "Lynx";
– Mobile reconnaissance point PRP-4MU(A);
- Repair tracked vehicle RM-G "Desna";
– Caterpillar transporter-tractor GT-TM;
– Caterpillar transporter MT-LB.

In general, the plant has a certain prospect in terms of the production of light armored vehicles of the BMP / BMD type and can definitely become a kind of reserve for the production of armored vehicles.

3. Ural Transport Engineering Plant (Uraltransmash).

The tram production center of Russia, among other things, is engaged in the production of self-propelled artillery mounts:

- "Msta-S";
- "Acacia" 2S3M2;
- modernization of the 2S7 "Pion" installation in 2S7M "Malka";
- maintenance of 240-mm self-propelled mortars "Tulip".

It is worth noting the small amount of work performed by the plant as part of the state defense order. It is possible that there are also opportunities at UTM to increase the production of self-propelled guns, although the use of old T-62 tanks as self-propelled guns in the SVO suggests just the opposite.

4. Omsk plant of transport engineering.

The plant worked very closely on the topic of T-64 / T-80, but today it produces tanks and several other types of equipment:

- Heavy flamethrower system TOS-1A "Solntsepek";
- Transport-loading vehicle TZM-T for TOS-1A;
- Landing ferry, RAP (Product 561P);
– Caterpillar conveyor PTS-4;
- Tank bridge layer MTU-2020;
- Heavy mechanized bridge TMM-6.

In addition, according to reports, the plant retained equipment for the production of T-80 tanks, which in general gives some hope for the resumption of production of these vehicles in decent quantities.

5. Kurgan machine-building plant.

An enterprise producing lightly armored tracked vehicles:

- BMP-2M;
- BMP-3;
- BTR-MDM "Shell";
- Self-propelled anti-tank gun "Octopus-SD";
- BREM-L;
- BMD-4M.

KMZ is one of the few dynamically developing (as far as possible) enterprises of the military complex in Russia. State defense orders are fulfilled on time, there are no complaints about the equipment.

6. Volgograd Tractor Plant.

What is in the picture is the checkpoint and the plant management building - all that remains of the giant of the tractor industry.

The northern civilian part has been demolished, the southern, military, is working. Basically - in the interests of the Airborne Forces of the Russian Federation, for which it makes equipment:

- BMD-4;
- BTR-D;
- "Octopus-SDM".

Fortunately, the Volgograd Machine-Building Company VgTZ, which was engaged in the production of military equipment, was withdrawn from the Volgograd Tractor Plant, which was declared bankrupt, and today the company is a branch of the Kurgan Machine-Building Plant, which can be seen from the range of manufactured equipment.

In principle, KMZ and VgTZ are a decent-sized association for the production of lightly armored vehicles.

7. Arzamas engineering plant.

The only company on our list that is not part of Rostec. The plant is managed by Military Industrial Company LLC.

AMZ is wheels. All army armor on wheels is here:

- BTR-80A;
- BTR-82A;
- BMM, a medical transporter based on the BTR-90, which did not go into the series;
- BREM-K.

Some factories (for example, in Tula) make specialized vehicles of the RHM-6 type for the RHBZ or KSHM troops on the basis of already manufactured chassis, but this is already a secondary production.

8. Motovilikha Plants.

At the very beginning of the article, it was said about seven enterprises. Indeed, everything is so: seven enterprises are producing, the fate of the eighth is unclear and vague, because PJSC Motovilikhinskiye Zavody has been in a state of bankruptcy since 2017 and, at best, they will be destined for the fate of the Volgograd plant, that is, not all will be destroyed.

But today, among other weapons, on our topic in Perm they are still producing:

- Self-propelled gun 2S9 "Nona-S";
- Self-propelled gun 2S23 "Nona-SVK";
- Self-propelled gun 2S31 "Vienna";
- Self-propelled mortar 2S4 "Tulip".

In addition, 1V13, 1V14, 1V15 and 1V16 vehicles are produced within the walls of Motovilikha (and only there), which are part of the 1V12 "Machine-S" self-propelled artillery fire control automation system.

In the end, what do we have?

Frankly sad in terms of tanks. One plant for the entire army is a minuscule amount. In wartime, even more so. I agree with the figure of 400-500 new tanks per year (this is if there are no ambushes with components from subcontractors), but this is frankly not enough to compensate for losses. Experiments with museum exhibits of the T-62 and T-54 will not lead to good, but the one who arranges dances around these tanks, saying that the T-62 is cooler than the Abrams today, he, of course, will never sit down at its levers and will not burn in this "ultra-modern" tank. Unfortunately.

With tanks, we really are not very good. UVZ is a monster, but even such a huge plant cannot solve all the problems of today. Therefore, the question of connecting in full as a backup enterprise of OmskTransMasha is being drawn here, where they still know how to build tanks and modernize them.

T-80 is not T-90, but not T-62 either. We must understand.

If, nevertheless, the bankruptcy and dispersal of Motovilikha, which will continue to supply the army with mortars, and, moreover, self-propelled ones, are stopped, if Omsk is involved in the construction of new tanks ...

You know, something like the former football championships. It was the same there, if the Russian team plays a draw with the Czechs, and the Portuguese lose to the Italians with a difference of two goals, and the Bulgarians beat the British, then ours will definitely be in the final.

That's just something tells us that in our case it will be the same as it used to be with our team - that is, everything that is possible will be “merged”. UVZ will choke and will not pull out, because in reality the scope of work is fantastic, and Rostec is very purposefully trying to sell Motovilikha. In general, the Berezutsky brothers playing fast football.

But still there is something to rely on. And if it were not for the catastrophe with repair plants, which are also lacking (for more than 1 MT-LBs requiring repair, there is an opportunity to repair no more than 000), one could listen to Medvedev calmly. And even believe what he says, although the snow charges from his speeches are no worse than from the words of Peskov.

The Rubicon, that is, September 2022, has already been crossed. Until that moment, it was possible not to think so much about the fact that we would need a lot of tanks and infantry fighting vehicles. Now it is already clear that they will not just be required, but in huge quantities. Some issues on "plugging holes" can be solved. Some will require drastic measures. The question is what our authorities will decide to do to make the fairy tales about “hundreds of new T-90s and T-73B3s” come true.

Such wars are won by factories and workers. Proven, by the way, the Second World War.

The most ingenious military leader cannot do anything if he does not have tanks, and the enemy has enough of them, although there simply are not enough tanks.

Comments

[Ross xnumx]

In the end, what do we have?

And we have April 1 and all the talk around the bush can be reduced to a joke ... Or Shift the deadlines to the right, as some effective managers and inefficient officials are used to doing.

[Mikhail Drabkin]

—- Under the "tank" in the West they read out everything moving with a gun more than 30mm. Sometimes even without the MBT classification.

—- I hope, the Supreme, and DAM did not succumb to this innovation, and we are talking about MBT.

[Oleg Ogorod]

As a result, we have here the analyzes of a couch expert, which he scooped deeply from the Internet.
That's all.
The tank is not produced in one factory.
On it, it is assembled from the received blanks, assemblies and equipment. However, he produces some of the blanks himself, for example, the blank of the tower.
A tank and a cannon, which are made by several factories in cooperation, headed by Factory #9. But he does not make cannon blanks either, he assembles them from blanks he has modified.
Next is the engine. This is its own branch of cooperation led by the manufacturer of this engine.
Transmission. I don't know who makes it. Perhaps also cooperation.
Control mechanisms, electrics, electronics, including various sights, active protection against damage, communication systems ...
The author thinks that this is all done at UVZ ... or at the Omsk plant ...
Yes, and the corporation / concern / plant "UVZ" (this three-headed serpent) is now suffering very strange organizational losses ...
However, what do you take from a couch analyst?
Uraltransmash mainly makes trams for him, and not self-propelled howitzers ...
Build a tank, not buy a donkey.

[Oleg Ogorod]

By the way, the armor itself, not all of it is poured into UVZ ...

[spektr9]

In general, it seems that there are not enough factories not only for the production of new equipment, but also for the revival of tanks from "storage" bases. From here, everything that starts up on its own is somehow tricked, and now we already have a T-62 at the front, instead of a T-72 \ T-80 that has grown into the ground on the basis of "storage"

[svp67]

T-80 is not T-90

It is much better...
Yes, and the Author has dropped OAO Muromteplovoz from the list, since he is so concerned about the repair of the same MT-LB
https://muromteplovoz.ru/product/mil.php

[flanker7]

Quote: svp67

It is much better

That's how right it is! HOW I AGREE!!!

[78bor1973]

The author also forgot the Kirov Plant. You can also do something there.

[EMMM]

Unfortunately, at the Kirov Plant they are engaged in more serious equipment.

[Old tanker]

But only if it is T-80U or T-80BVM.

[bayard]

Quote: spektr9

From here, everything that starts up on its own is somehow tricked, and now we already have a t-62 at the front, instead of a t-72 \ t-80 that has grown into the ground on the basis of "storage"

In part, this is true - there is not enough capacity, incl. repair . That is why last year it was announced the intention to urgently build and launch two new repair plants in the European part of the country. Yes, and in order to bring existing plants to nominal / planned capacities, time, personnel and, in part, technical re-equipment are needed.
As for the T-62, everything is already clear - the repair plant is sharpened to repair just this type of tanks and light armored vehicles. In addition, it is much easier, faster and cheaper to remove the T-62 from the reserve and return it to service. Yes, and there are enough shells for them in warehouses. So there is nothing wrong with this idea. It would be bad if such a decision had not been made. Then in the annual balance we would have 250-300 tanks less.
For the rest. Today's capabilities of the Kazan Helicopter Plant for the production of tanks are estimated at "about 800 units per year." Perhaps these are not only new ones, but also the T-72B3M, and the new "Terminators. That is, the gross production of heavy combat armored vehicles. But the fact of the matter is that not only UVZ and Omsktransmash, but also at least a tank repair plant in St. Petersburg, and it’s far from the first year... So the technical process has been debugged there for several years... About other repair plants (how many of them and how they work), but if you estimate their combined capabilities, then they are, in principle, able to reach the bar of 72-3 new and modernized tanks, moreover, already during this year.
The trouble is that not only tanks are needed, modern self-propelled guns are also needed. Moreover, long-range, capable of using precision-guided munitions. For the war is going on with artillery and the role of artillery, as it were, is no higher than that of tanks. And here we have ... The only plant capable of producing "Coalition-SV" is loaded with the modernization of self-propelled guns "Msta-S" ... Not only that, for SO many years of testing and refinement, they never thought of transferring self-propelled guns "Coalition-SV" on a normal seven-roller chassis (they would take as a basis the same chassis that goes for the S-300-V \ V-4 and "Malka" - an elongated T-80 chassis) ... the bases from the "Armata" also did not wait, yes and perhaps no work was carried out at all ... as a result, the Army is without long-range artillery, and the only long-range "Malka" has a low rate of fire and does not have guided ammunition.
And for this it is necessary to ask the responsible characters to the fullest.

There are more than enough tanks at the storage bases - about 7000 T-72s and about 5000 T-80s (of which up to 3000 units are suitable for upgrading to the BVM level). Old, but suitable for modernization and use in the SVO T-62M, about 2000 pieces. , but only 800 units are planned to be modernized. for 3 years.
The whole question is whether our industry will be able to expand the production and modernization of tanks to the required volumes in a short time.

[svp67]

Quote: bayard

(we would take as a basis the same chassis that goes for the S-300-V \ V-4 and "Malka" - the extended T-80 chassis)

There are only elements of the chassis from the T-80, transmission and engine from the T-72.
This unified tracked chassis is produced by the Universalmash plant (a subsidiary of Kirovsky Zavod OJSC), a former tank production

[bayard]

Quote: svp67

There are only elements of the chassis from the T-80, transmission and engine from the T-72.

Did I suggest to shove a turbine there?
A diesel engine with a capacity of 1130 l / s is quite enough for a seven-roller chassis for the "Coalition-SV". But at the same time, the chassis will correspond to the dimensions of the tower and provide the necessary stability when firing.
I will not forget the first time I watched footage from the tests of the "Coalition-SV", how it swayed when firing, and how ridiculous the huge tower looked on the "small" T-90 chassis. A weapon of such power and a tower of such dimensions on a six-roller chassis is nonsense.
Inexplicable nonsense.

[svp67]

Quote: bayard

Did I suggest to shove a turbine there?

Yes, it will be "crammed" there anyway, as an additional power plant ...

Quote: bayard

But at the same time, the chassis will correspond to the dimensions of the tower and provide the necessary stability when firing.

Is not a fact. After all, firing is not carried out from this chassis, for this container with missiles they rise vertically and rest against the ground.
But the idea is good and worth taking into consideration and practical verification.

[bayard]

Quote: svp67

After all, firing is not carried out from this chassis, for this container with missiles they rise vertically and rest against the ground.

Actually, they meant the seven-wheeled chassis of the T-80 tank (the best chassis of all MBTs), and this is now used on the S-300V4 launcher and on the Malki. I hope you will not mind that they still shoot from the Malka chassis, and with a much larger caliber than that of the Coalition-SV.

Quote: svp67

But the idea is good and worth taking into consideration and practical verification.

This should have been done during the development of the "Coalition". But apparently it was then that Omsktransmash no longer produced such chassis, and the T-90 (and T-72) was chosen as the single MBT of the RF Armed Forces, so apparently they decided to take the T-90 chassis without any changes - it’s easier and cheaper ... And problems started.

[bulava74]

If they fail, then the NWO will end at the "OLD" borders of the Russian Federation. Well, he demanded to boot, as well as everything that "Geyropa" promises to our country in the event of a defeat.
So, the choice is actually not rich - it is necessary to tear the "veins".

[Dmitry_Semashko]

The thing is that even the generals of the Wehrmacht managed to get out of the warring and flaming Europe to Argentina, Canada and even the USA. And our effective patriots, without batting an eyelid, will steal the last one and dump it as if nothing had happened to London and the same States. My personal experience - in August I bought an apartment for half the market price from the daughter of Konstantin Goloshchapov. This is from the closest friends of the Supreme Commander. Google it. Now the whole family settled in Chicago. Well, you yourself know everything about Chubais and the rest.

[Oleg Ogorod]

Yes, and there are enough shells for them in warehouses.

Gentlemen "officers", do you know when was the last time they made shells for the T-62?
And how long is the warranty period for tank or howitzer shots? And what happens to the charge?
The gunner proceeds from the calibrated value of the power of the shot, and after many decades of storage, he is no longer a cake ...
A batch of old shots must be tested and updated values ​​given. But this is in theory and ideal ... usually let's load faster ...
Therefore, short flight, flight ...
And in modern combat, this is fraught.

[AA17]

In general, it seems that there are not enough factories ...

Dear spektr9.
I agree with you.
But at the same time, conflicting events are taking place in our country with enterprises related to the military-industrial complex.

Against the backdrop of numerous demands to mobilize the economy and transfer it to a military footing, the news about the bankruptcy and sale of the property of defense plants sound absolutely fantastic. ...
But seven months after the start of the special military operation and the seemingly obvious problems with the lack of production capacities of the military-industrial complex, such processes are surprising.
The following factories are currently being liquidated:
▪️50th Automobile Repair Plant, Rostov-on-Don
▪️258th repair plant for refueling and transporting fuel, Bataysk
▪️751st repair plant, Rostov, Yaroslavl region
▪️5th Central Automobile Repair Plant, Yekaterinburg.... https://pikabu.ru/story/zakryityie_voennyikh_zavodov_9497770

The events of the past seven months have revealed many unsightly things in our country. And the reports on repair enterprises that are systematically destroyed by subsidiaries of the Rostec concern look even more creepy .... https://topwar.ru/202777-goskorporacija-rosteh-odnoj-rukoj-stroit-zavody-pjatju-ubivaet.html

“Almost eight months after the beginning of the NMD, when the front is increasingly in need of a strong rear, it turned out that defense enterprises are massively going bankrupt across the country, many of which have unique competencies. ... https://19rusinfo.ru/politika/24538 -strashnee-chem-diversiya-po-vsej-rossii-tikho-vzryvayut-oboronnye-zavody

P.S. Against the background of this information, the orders of the Head of the Russian Government M. Mishustin look somehow ridiculous:

... The head of the Russian government, Mikhail Mishustin, signed an order to establish a plant for the repair of rocket and artillery weapons of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation ... https://tvzvezda.ru/news/2023331228-9RK2u.html

There is an INTERESTING SITUATION. If the information about the closure of the factories is FALSE, then the State media should give a refutation. If the information about the closure of factories is TRUE, then this process during the NWO with the bankruptcy and closure of military enterprises should be considered a crime.

[cast iron]

This is a crime under communism. And under capitalism, this is the optimal form of economic activity. If you are not aware, then under capitalism, the state and the population are one big business project. Which needs to be constantly optimized and which should bring profit to the ruling class.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: cast iron

And under capitalism, this is the optimal form of economic activity.

It's called "optimization". Like how my friend suddenly became one electrician on duty for two shops, between which the distance is about 2 kilometers. Tired of him, and went to the guards to wipe his pants. Let the optimizers themselves run around with black tape.

[vlad106]

Quote: spektr9

we already have t-62 at the front, instead of ingrown into the ground on the basis of "storage" t-72 \ t-80

Who will give the Russian army armor

Mandurovskaya and Meshustinskaya Superindustry ...
She can do anything...

[maiman61]

At the moment, it is more profitable to revive the T-62 than the T-72 rooted into the ground. The specificity of modern warfare has shown that tanks have turned into armored self-propelled guns. What's the point of sending the T-72 greenery to fire. if you can send a T-62 with a hell of a cloud of shells in storage! But they send an infantry fighting vehicle with cardboard armor and a 30 mm fart. Or maybe it's better to send a T-62 instead of an infantry fighting vehicle? Yes, and at checkpoints it is better to have T-62 than cardboard infantry fighting vehicles or armored personnel carriers. And the infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers should be released to perform their duties, transporting infantry covered with at least bulletproof armor than with tarpaulins on cars.

[Deonnix]

One rather smart-looking citizen said that old tanks would be used more as a replacement for unprotected guns, because. and the armor is available and the time to deploy is less necessary and you can leave the position unlike faster. How will you answer?

[spektr9]

One rather smart-looking citizen said that old tanks would be used more as a replacement for unprotected guns, because. and the armor is available and the time to deploy is less necessary and you can leave the position unlike faster. How will you answer?

Let's get your "smart" person to the NWO, in T62 and let it come, from there it will already unsubscribe how he was able to replace the unprotected gun there or not, otherwise I look at the "smart" people here like to scratch their tongues but something is not torn on the NWO
And so I can with a bang - "patriotic": here is the T-62 better than the AK machine gun !!!! And the fact that, in fact, for the place of this t-62, not an automatic machine is needed, but about five t-72s I will proudly keep silent ...

[fif21]

1. Everything depends on finances and personnel. Motovilikha cannot be sold, no one is willing. But there is a prospect of getting out of bankruptcy due to new orders. 2. A less expensive way, this is the expansion of existing industries. 3. What will happen to people at the end of the SVO? Over the fence again? . 3. What about the Chelyabinsk tractor? In the Urals, there are many small metallurgical plants with personnel and unused territories, where there were workshops working for the military-industrial complex of the USSR, but for known reasons they switched to the production of civilian products. Therefore, if the Ministry of Defense issues a real defense order, with real funding, and not with a proposal to take loans from banks, then the issue is resolved.

[spektr9]

Therefore, if the Ministry of Defense issues a real defense order, with real funding, and not with a proposal to take loans from banks, then we solve the issue

Do you yourself believe in it? If for a year now there has been a local conflict near our border, with arrivals almost to Moscow, and the Defense Ministry has not issued a real defense order ..
Will it issue in a hot conflict when NATO troops enter the territory of the Russian Federation? There, before the oligarchs scratch at this plant, everything that can fly will arrive and there will already be no one to give a defense order

[fif21]

Quote: spektr9

Do you believe that yourself?

The owner of the bar! But the motto is - chairs in the morning, money in the evening, it no longer rolls in the Russian Federation. Fuckers working according to the rules of Siluanov, Gref and K * have already gone bankrupt and gone bankrupt.

[alexey_Murzin]

I agree with this .. The state structure has not been able to give me money since December .. They have some problems with financing there ... Since the beginning of the year, I canceled all deliveries with postpaid

[svp67]

Quote: spektr9

and the Ministry of Defense never issued a real defense order ..

Yeah ... the Moscow Region cannot agree on it, so much is needed, and the military-industrial complex is not able to immediately give so much ...

[Doccor18]

Quote: fif21

It all comes down to finance and human resources.

Everything revolves around frames. They, unlike machine tools and hangars, cannot be built or purchased. There is finance in the country, but to no avail. Even if several medium-sized enterprises are built in an emergency mode, there will be no one to work there. For thirty years, the professions of a locksmith / welder / adjuster have not been the goal of young people, they have been replaced by sales managers and bloggers, but in order to make a good machine operator out of a manager, you need a lot of patience, desire and at least five years of work ...

[fif21]

Quote: Doccor18

Everything revolves around frames.

The fish is looking for where it is deeper, and the man, where it is better! There will be good salaries (finances) and there will be personnel.

Quote: Doccor18

but in order to make a good machine operator out of a manager, you need a lot of patience, desire and at least five years of work ...

During the war, at our factory, women and children got up to the machine. Yes, it takes time. But CNC machines are no more complicated than a laptop or a food processor. Put the workpiece, select the program, remove the finished product - is it so difficult to learn?

[Doccor18]

Quote: fif21

There will be good salaries (finances) and there will be personnel.

There will be people, not cadres, cadres need to be trained, and this is the time ...

Quote: fif21

But CNC machines are no more difficult than a laptop or a food processor.

Have you worked on a CNC machine?

Quote: fif21

During the war, at our factory, women and children got up to the machine

Yes, and they worked on tractors ... I would not risk entrusting a ten-ton bulldozer to a teenager or a woman now. Maybe I'm wrong.

[Filosoff]

Do you think anyone would take the risk then? There was simply no other choice.

[Non-fighter]

About the manufacture of all sorts of tricks. There are two ways.
The first is a drawing for the worker, and let him draw something on the machine. The yield of suitable products STRONGLY depends on the qualifications of the worker, and we have piece copies.
The second - we break the manufacturing process into separate operations performed by ONE tool in ONE pass. Yes, and in addition to the tool, you still need a mount so that the workpiece can be fixed in one single and CORRECT way. In this case, the worker actually goes into the "semi-automatic" mode. To make a finished part from a blank, you don’t need qualifications AT ALL !! This is how I earned my first paycheck. I went to the factory, to such a shop. In 5 minutes, I, 15 years old, was taught to work. Disadvantages: firstly, you need a BIG order, otherwise the cost of manufacturing equipment (tool and clamp) will not pay off. Well, qualified personnel, but less. A technologist who will crush the production process, a designer who will come up with a tooling, and a worker who will make this tooling according to a drawing. Moreover, in the latter case, the tolerances are greater, and the qualifications may be less.
Advantages: minimum requirements for the machine park, I worked on a machine that had 2 buttons - "Start" and "Stop".
And one more minus: where will you get people from? Will you close offices and drive them into workshops? So this mobilization must be announced. Labor.
Z / P naturally piecework, how much you have earned and get. The work is monotonous, for smoking breaks, chatting, playing on the phone, hanging in the social network, watching videos, etc. no one will pay.

[spektr9]

And one more minus: where will you get people from? Will you close offices and drive them into workshops? So this mobilization must be announced. Labor.
Z / P naturally piecework, how much you have earned and get.

I like your approach, making a decent salary for workers so that people themselves go from the office to the factory is not an option. But we will drive them by force and force them to plow for a penny.
I'm afraid you just did not take into account the experience of 1917 ...

If you want a normal industry, redistribute expenses from the pocket and yacht club of the guarantor's friends to enterprises. If you don't want to, well, then reap what you have now

[bayard]

Quote: spektr9

so that people themselves from the office go to the factory is not an option. But we will drive them by force and force them to plow for a penny.
I'm afraid you just did not take into account the experience of 1917 ...

Well, if you do it stupidly and through the anus. Or you can simply offer an alternative - mobilization into the Army (which is at war, by the way) or mobilization to a factory with armor. And be surprised how quickly the shops will fill up with a young workforce.
And even with a decent salary ... There is also competition here.

[Vincent price]

You wanted to say that the factories are filled with kids of various kinds of paid parents. These kids won't do shit anyway, and those who could do it will go to the front.

[bayard]

Quote: Vincent Price

These kids won't do shit anyway,

If these "kids" do nothing (give a plan - shift work), then they will go to the front very quickly. Where the enemy spends at least some ammunition on them - no matter what, but all the damage to the enemy.
The factory will have to POW!
And live in a barracks / hostel.
Labor mobilization is not a ticket to a sanatorium, it is the same military service. With all the RESPONSIBILITY that comes with it. Incl. for negligence and sabotage.
According to the laws of war.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

There are more subtleties here. If the removal of armor led to being sent to the front, then this is one thing, but if the fool simply leaves the factory, as is the case in my area, due to mobilization by waves, then this is quite another.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: bayard

And even with a decent salary ...

What is it? What do you mean, decent salary? 15 thousand a month - will it work?

[bayard]

Well, you take an interest in today's salary at defense plants. They raised it. And if a specialist, there is no such price at all.

Quote: Mordvin 3

15 thousand a month - will it work?

Not .

[IS-80_RVGK2]

Quote: bayard

Or you can simply offer an alternative - mobilization into the Army (which is at war, by the way) or mobilization to a factory with armor.

Are you competing there who is vile and vile to find a solution to the problem?

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

Hmm, interesting argument. What do you live?

[nerovnayadoroga]

Nonsense, you have never stood at a machine tool with more than 2 buttons, you still need to dip the technologist headlong into the hole, in general, the technologist develops the technological process (documentation) for which the part is manufactured, from harvesting operations to finishing, including the equipment used, processing modes , transitions, descriptions and drawings of tooling and machine tooling, thermal and galvanic processes, writing down all operations and manufacturing modes in accordance with the purpose of the existing equipment, in addition, it monitors the timely testing of the technological accuracy of the equipment, otherwise you will not be able to complete the part with the required accuracy qualifications if your equipment is not able to perform the specified part due to the features or physical wear of the equipment! Everything else you can carve with a stone ax!

[Stena]

Quote: nerovnayadoroga

in addition, it monitors the timely conduct of checks for the technological accuracy of the equipment, otherwise you will not be able to complete the part with the required accuracy qualifications if your equipment cannot perform the specified part due to the features or physical wear of the equipment!

Drawings are created by designers. And about the qualifications, you generally wrote to him in vain - they broke the whole world! It looks like he worked in the production of the simplest parts (perhaps he worked somewhere on a lathe), where there are no strict requirements for accuracy. Or after "his work" there was a refinement already directly during the installation of the final product.
There was some kind of situation: an Uzbek or a Tajik came to the production to get a job (to grind products) - they show him a grinding machine, and he says - I only know how to grind.
Moreover, when the part is from 3 meters or more, and the requirements for accuracy are at the level of 6 quality (or higher), then its creation is a very non-trivial task (for example, when creating parts for machine tools or the machines themselves or experimental products ( not typical).
In fact, normal milling operators, unfortunately, are not required now: either the salary is not suitable, or age, or the XP department (former personnel officers) - who, without even looking at a person, conclude that he is useless.
Therefore, such "Non-fighters" come out everywhere. True, then complaints and marriage (very often - not removable) - but everything is done - it’s not for him to collect and use the product! That's just a shame for such "specialists"!

[Non-fighter]

Disrespectful author!
At least you read what you are quoting.
Accuracy qualifications? In this case, they are determined by the quality of the tool and the fixation of the part in the clamp. Both are not my problems, but the one who developed and manufactured it.
Further. Where in the text was it said about my participation in the manufacture of 3 meter beams? No. Again, at least read what you quote, and do not brag about your possible experience. What do you think, a 15-year-old teenager will be put on something responsible? It’s hard to spoil something there, but unlike today, the salary was paid :)

Where did you disappear with your brilliant ideas? You should have gone straight to the General Secretary of the Politburo of the USSR. I think that in this case you could immediately be awarded an order, for example, this: "The master with a show off, they didn’t give you a gold one."

Well, this is generally a pearl, Attributing your wet fantasies to others. Well, show me the place in my comment where I boasted about the introduction of this system? No?
In general, judging by the text, you obviously just finished school, and senior comrades talked about a 3-meter beam and accuracy qualifications.

[Stena]

Quote: Not the fighter

Accuracy qualifications? In this case, they are determined by the quality of the tool and the fixation of the part in the clamp. Both are not my problems, but the one who developed and manufactured it.

That is, you have no idea what accuracy qualifications are, by whom they are developed and how they are applied. Then it is not surprising - about all the subsequent nonsense that you wrote here.

Quote: Not the fighter

Further. Where in the text was it said about my participation in the manufacture of 3 meter beams? No. Again, at least read what you quote, and do not brag about your possible experience. What do you think, a 15-year-old teenager will be put on something responsible?

I know for sure that in order to create and process such blanks - to give them the characteristics required by the design documentation - a specialist is needed, and not - "Not a Fighter". This is from many years of successful production practice.

Quote: Not the fighter

Further. Where in the text was it said about my participation in the manufacture of 3 meter beams?

These are not three-meter beams ... Do you know the difference between a beam and a workpiece? No? Not surprising. You don’t know production terminology, you don’t know design documentation, you don’t know milling technology.
You wrote about "2 ways of manufacturing:

Quote: Not the fighter

About the manufacture of all sorts of tricks. There are two ways.
The first is a drawing for the worker, and let him draw something on the machine. The yield of suitable products STRONGLY depends on the qualifications of the worker, and we have piece copies.
The second - we break the manufacturing process into separate operations performed by ONE tool in ONE pass. Yes, and in addition to the tool, you still need a mount so that the workpiece can be fixed in one single and CORRECT way. In this case, the worker actually goes into the "semi-automatic" mode. To make a finished part from a blank, you don’t need qualifications AT ALL !! This is how I earned my first paycheck. I went to the factory, to such a shop. In 5 minutes, I, 15 years old, was taught to work. Disadvantages: firstly, you need a BIG order, otherwise the cost of manufacturing equipment (tool and clamp) will not pay off. Well, qualified personnel, but less. A technologist who will crush the production process, a designer who will come up with a tooling, and a worker who will make this tooling according to a drawing. Moreover, in the latter case, the tolerances are greater, and the qualifications may be less.

Is this written by you? Or did the son get up and type some letters on the keyboard?
If it was you - then, I'm sorry, brother - I'm telling you no offense - but you wrote - complete garbage.
No need to be offended. Not given. Happens.
Maybe you can prove yourself in construction? Or in agriculture?
And the production of "complex" products is an art that does not tolerate hack work. Otherwise, there will be attempts to "push" substandard products to the Quality Control Department, and possibly to the customer - and then a long period of work on correction (on complaints), perhaps - a court, loss of face of the organization and then - bankruptcy.
And what you wrote - non-specialists (who are the majority here - well, people are not obliged to understand the intricacies of production) can be taken as the ultimate truth. They will come to production with the "baggage of knowledge" written by you, and there - everything turns out to be completely different. Why mislead people?

[Non-fighter]

Brad, you never stood at a machine with more than 2 buttons

As for the technologist, I may have been mistaken, but I not only saw machine tools with industrial electronics (and there are entire control panels), but also repaired them for 5 years at the same plant. A tester, a screwdriver, pliers and forward to the workshop to find out why the unit (and besides the machines they also hung robots like STAS on me) does not work. It was fun, sometimes I diagnosed with my bare hands - by ear and by sight.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

In vain you are crucified. Your opponents have no idea what mass and large-scale production is, and that there are semi-automatic machines. It is possible that they do not even know what mechanical engineering is and who a service engineer is. You naturally throw beads, you yourself know in front of whom.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: nerovnayadoroga

Everything else you can carve with a stone ax!

Yes Yes. I remember how we made the first booth in the 90s. We invented, and the technologist stood next to us. Then he brought a drawing with all our jambs.

[Stena]

Quote: Not the fighter

About the manufacture of all sorts of tricks. There are two ways.
The first is a drawing for the worker, and let him draw something on the machine. The yield of suitable products STRONGLY depends on the qualifications of the worker, and we have piece copies.
The second - we break the manufacturing process into separate operations performed by ONE tool in ONE pass. Yes, and in addition to the tool, you still need a mount so that the workpiece can be fixed in one single and CORRECT way. In this case, the worker actually goes into the "semi-automatic" mode. To make a finished part from a blank, you don’t need qualifications AT ALL !! This is how I earned my first paycheck. I went to the factory, to such a shop. In 5 minutes, I, 15 years old, was taught to work. Disadvantages: firstly, you need a BIG order, otherwise the cost of manufacturing equipment (tool and clamp) will not pay off. Well, qualified personnel, but less. A technologist who will crush the production process, a designer who will come up with a tooling, and a worker who will make this tooling according to a drawing. Moreover, in the latter case, the tolerances are greater, and the qualifications may be less.

April first?
PS After all, there were wonderful people in the USSR - they developed a whole system of training workers, engineers and other industrial specialties - why? Where did you disappear with your brilliant ideas? You should have gone straight to the General Secretary of the Politburo of the USSR. I think that in this case you could immediately be awarded an order, for example, this: "The master with a show off, they didn’t give you a gold one."
When you write some of your proposal - please indicate - that this is "your personal development based on n-years of experience in the specialty ... and obtaining the degree of doctor (candidate) of technical sciences.
But seriously - those. the process is needed for completely different reasons than those that you "described" above.

[Aingof]

The most important skill of an engineer, in my opinion, is the ability to search, read and understand regulatory and technical documentation. There everything is described for us and invented. What do I see now almost everywhere? - Attempts to reinvent the wheel and reinvent everything anew in each individual enterprise. In the regions, there is no engineering school at small enterprises, it has died out, and these ruins are ruled by self-taught people, sometimes talented ones, as in a post-apocalypse. He himself came out of these and for a long time was surprised that everything was invented before me.

[fif21]

Quote: Not the fighter

I went to the factory, to such a workshop. In 5 minutes, I, 15 years old, was taught to work.

Someone started working with machine tools at school, at labor lessons (turning, drilling, milling) there was such a subject - drawing at school! Therefore, the men in Rus' are handy. In the 80s, CNC machines (Czech Aida) and computers with punched cards were installed at the plant! Now there are 3D printers, and a lot of other interesting things. Technologies have changed (powder metallurgy), labor protection has gone brutal .....

Quote: Not the fighter

And one more minus: where will you get the people from?

How many self-employed in the Russian Federation? At the labor market? In garages? It is necessary to interest and stimulate, according to Komsomol vouchers, it will no longer work.

[Sumotori_380]

I adore eccentrics who believe that office workers kick the bullshit all the polls. I had a businessman friend who was sure that the main thing is the main activity, and paperwork is bullshit. No accountant could convince him otherwise. And even the tax office, which rolled out a fine and a couple of lyam arrears after a desk audit, also failed. True, it is not a fact that he continues to undertake ...

[Sergey Dvornikov]

Go and get up! And do not eat vodka lying on the couch

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

Difficult, yes! Even just cutting a thread, you need to think. A qualified machine operator won’t work even in five years ... And if you are given a ready-made set of parts for assembling a tank, if you give at least a thousand ignorant people to help, how long will it take you to assemble a tank? Answer: you will never collect, even if you extend your life to a thousand years!

[Alien From]

Just one more little question, but where can I get these CNC machines? those who want to sell them to us, but we practically do not produce our own. There was an article on VO about machine tools, there is sadness like everywhere else. I didn’t find the link, sorry, but I think the forum users remember and correct it

[TheWatcher]

And you read less VO and don’t believe in the nonsense that amateurs and provocateurs often write here, who are very actively trying to mimic competent pros.

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

At the end of the XNUMXs, he worked for a year on the territory of the aircraft factory. Chkalov (Novosibirsk). I saw how brand-new and not very machine tools without engines were pulled out of the workshops, loaded into long lengths and taken to ferrous metal, I did not hesitate to ask the peasants about their destination ... They handed it over, and now where do you order them to take? .. They screwed up the whole industry , They screwed up the entire defense industry, and to this day no one is itching in terms of trying to restore what was destroyed! Nobody!

[Andy_nsk]

At the end of the XNUMXs, he worked for a year on the territory of the aircraft factory. Chkalov (Novosibirsk). I saw how brand-new and not so new machines were pulled out of the shops without engines, loaded into long lengths and taken to ferrous metal,

Machine tools are now normal at the aircraft plant, many with CNC, they are our neighbors, they recently came to visit us, many people from there work for us. Of course, the number of the plant decreased (compared to the Soviet period) by an order of magnitude, as did the number of aircraft produced.

[nedgen]

Quote: fif21

Quote: Doccor18

Everything revolves around frames.

The fish is looking for where it is deeper, and the man, where it is better! There will be good salaries (finances) and there will be personnel.

Quote: Doccor18

but in order to make a good machine operator out of a manager, you need a lot of patience, desire and at least five years of work ...

During the war, at our factory, women and children got up to the machine. Yes, it takes time. But CNC machines are no more complicated than a laptop or a food processor. Put the workpiece, select the program, remove the finished product - is it so difficult to learn?

It may look very simple, but unfortunately it will take 3-4 months to leave. And for all this thanks to the educational system (if it exists at all). If the lessons of labor had not been destroyed at one time, it might have taken less time, but unfortunately, for the majority of the younger generation, their hands grow from where the sun does not peek.

[Goto]

That's why they write about frames. You have described the operator of the CNC machine. BUT it is necessary (highly desirable) that the operator understands what the machine does and how, knows its device. The machines are not eternal, they also have to be serviced, etc. It’s just that an operator who does not know the process can make a lot of marriage before this time, and this is a loss and overspending.

[alexey_Murzin]

CNC is an order of magnitude more complicated .. it's only in films that you press the button and you're done. But in reality, there may be failures during operation and so on. And there will be one failure, in order to launch the continuation and not to mess up, you need qualification

[Arsen1]

For thirty years, the professions of a locksmith / welder / adjuster have not been the goal of young people, they have been replaced by sales managers and bloggers,

Well, I myself am a welding engineer, I worked in my specialty only during my studies. Because after university I was offered an engineer's rate in Moscow, 60 thousand. Or work in sales of equipment, but for a total income 2 times more. The choice is obvious.

[Victorovich]

Not that word..
to get a specialist, you need 2-4 years of study at a technical school and then another 5 years of production, but again, so that this is an ongoing production. and the current after this time we will get a sufficiently skilled worker.
What about engineering and design personnel? And take off even cooler - 5 years of the institute. then 5-10 years of production on the sidelines, another 5-10 years of design on the leading roles ... and after that we can get a design engineer of sufficient qualification.
Eventually
working specialty - from 7 to 9 years .. if we count from graduation, then by the age of 28 we have a turner (milling operator, grinder, locksmith), a couple more years and we will have a highly skilled worker.
design engineer - from 15 to 25 years .. from graduation, by 35 ... 40 years of age we get a designer, another five years and we will have a high-class designer by 40..45 years.

And how to go right now to the engineer if there is a salary at the level of the janitor !!!!??!??!??
My child is now studying for a master's degree, and he regularly sends me job offers. So the salaries are really ridiculous, but the demands are huge.
Here's an example was the "Head of the Laboratory" - at least a candidate of science with certain publications is required. The child and I counted all the options - so here is the earliest possibility of fulfilling the conditions by the age of 45, and more realistically by 50. And the salary rate is 18000 rubles.
And who is going to work there?

[nerovnayadoroga]

In the USSR, in the system of vocational education, those specialists were trained 2,3,4 with 6 higher ranks in 10 months, but this is primarily school training, those. drawing, geometry, mathematics, chemistry, physics without an understanding of technological processes is just a pusher of buttons A and B, you ask a modern turner if he has Bradis tables, did he even hear that !? In the USSR, if you don’t have tables and you don’t know how to use them, then you are not a turner, but just a clown, now even newly-minted engineers cannot boast of them, so prepare managers who can do everything, in any field!

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

Oh yeah! Now I work in a small shop, I collect metal structures. The guy-engineer issues drawings, I go to him with questions. I find out that he somewhere heard the words sine, tangent, but does not know what it is. I thought he was joking. No, he wasn't joking. I had to do the calculations myself ... The products are accepted by the OTKashnik, who does not understand how to calculate the diagonal in a rectangle. And this one was not joking, and he has a higher education.

[UAZ 452]

At one time, Bismarck said that the Franco-Prussian war was won by a German school teacher. I'm afraid that if we really start to revive our country, we will also have to start with school teachers. Here are just 90% of the current ones, even if the salary is raised several times, there will be no sense. Complete degradation has already taken place there, the consequences of decades of negative selection (starting from late Soviet times).

[Andy_nsk]

you ask a modern turner if he has Bradis tables, did he even hear that !? In the USSR, if you don’t have tables and you don’t know how to use them, then you are not a turner

I saw Bradis tables only at the institute in the 80s. Why are they now? There is a calculator or a computer - it will calculate any function. So neither the workers nor the engineers have any tables - they have long been replaced by a computer. And you seem to have not learned how to use a computer or even a calculator?

[Mordvin 3]

Quote from Andy_nsk

And you seem to have not learned how to use a computer or even a calculator?

That is, if you need to cut a thread by 8 with a tap in lumii, will you run to the computer to find out which drill do you need? Well, clown.

[Aingof]

I am a commissioning and testing engineer (electrical laboratory) and without a phone with the Internet or a PC I can’t even imagine how to work. Carrying out adjustment on objects, I often come across equipment that needs to be adjusted with a finger (FC regulators, gas analyzers, etc.). For a long time, complete instructions do not come with devices, only in electronic form and mainly on the Internet. Likewise, the drawings have long been in the phone and not in paper.

[fif21]

Quote: nerovnayadoroga

In the USSR, if you don’t have tables and you don’t know how to use them, then you are not a turner, but just a clown,

We sent complaints from France for our products (already the times of the Russian Federation)
The French (and this is a joint venture) also do not want to lose profits. They sent a turner to the factory. We gathered to learn how to work. The first thing the Frenchman did was put a thermometer next to him! Our jaws have dropped.

[Sergey250455]

Since the beginning of the NWO, our defense industry has been completely packed. Jobs increased and wages doubled. Although the assembly and the testers, and so the salary was not bad. Machine operators have up to 100 thousand

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

You, where is it? Here, a couple of months ago, Sibselmash was bankrupted, where shells were fired at the scoop. We are peaceful people, what do we need shells for, right? Last year, the heavy hydropress plant was bankrupted, in which, if necessary, it was quite possible to rivet tanks, and the foundry is at hand!

[the most important]

Quote: Doccor18

to make a good machinist out of a manager, you need a lot of patience

It's not realistic regardless of time. The monkey turned into a man for four million years.

[Sergey Dvornikov]

I agree with you! But most importantly, Putin still has enough money to wage war - the only question is how much is enough? Indeed, in addition to weapons, there is the main component - this is "manpower" and no one will fight for free!

[Gardamir]

Putin still has enough money

He's just good at bluffing.

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

The main thing is that he lacks intelligence and this is the main trouble!

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

You're so smart! And tell me where do you use tangents when assembling metal structures? Surprise me. I really don't like empty talk.

[bk0010]

Quote: fif21

but for well-known reasons, they switched to the production of civilian products. Therefore, if the Ministry of Defense issues a real defense order, with real funding, and not with a proposal to take loans from banks, then we solve the issue

This is not a fact: if they switched to civilian products, then again they may not want to contact the Defense Ministry. You won’t earn much on the state defense order, and hemorrhoids are through the roof. They will run into under Article 7.29.2 of the Code of Administrative Offenses - they will give a million to fall behind.

[fif21]

Quote: bk0010

This is not a fact: if they switched to civilian products, then again they may not want to contact the Defense Ministry.

And here you are right. We have a turbogenerator plant (newer than in St. Petersburg) They produced generators for hydroelectric power stations, diesel locomotives, electric locomotives, ships .....
What was left was seized by the oil and gas workers. Unnecessary huge workshops were simply demolished. This is the result of a policy - we sell raw materials, we will buy everything else. The country is ruled by adherents of the virtual economy, they have a thin gut for a real one.

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

But nothing that the USSR was destroyed more than thirty years ago? Do you think that those people who worked for the military-industrial complex of the Union meekly sit and wait to be called back? .. No, finances will not change much now in conditions when there are no personnel. For forty years, the one who first came to the plant is already either dead or retired. So who will collect tanks for you, people from the street? .. If people of labor were sung at the scoop, now there are no young people who want to go to the plant. Absolutely no one has been training personnel for factories for almost forty recent years, and it is understandable: factories were closed and demolished. Putin's policy has borne fruit. I well remember his "manifesto", where he announced that only those industries that would bring quick profits would receive state support, in other words, he staked everything on the sale of hydrocarbons and fucked up those plants that survived under ebna.

[fif21]

Quote: Marat Nazmutdinov

Do you think that those people who worked for the military-industrial complex of the Union meekly sit and wait to be called back?

Of course not .

Quote: Marat Nazmutdinov

For forty years

Well, vocational schools and technical schools, sharpened for production, died in the 90s. Factories are still working, but it is only in production that people have to be trained in the profession. Announcements of the type are required for turners of the 6th category, welders of manual welding of the 6th category, already cause a sad smile.

[bulava74]

You don’t build projects there about Chelyabinsk.
For 25 years everything has been "dead" and "optimized". Where the T-72 and BMP-2 hulls were welded by welding, confectionery factories and other small molds have long been operating. All buildings have long been sold except for the linear shop.

Forget about "TANKOGRAD" - it is not on the map of the country.

[Bulgarian]

I notice that the author constantly promotes the topic "Everything is wrong", "Everything is lost" in his articles. Who do you work for Roman.

[nickname7]

that the author constantly in his articles promotes the theme "Everything is wrong", "Everything is lost". Who do you work for Roman

It happens in different ways, Roman wrote that himars would fall apart without spare parts and repairs and there was no sense in them, he wrote specifically for your pink world. But it turned out that the warehouses were knocked out by himars and they played an important role in the attack on Izyum.

[Gnefredov]

promotes the theme "Everything is wrong", "Everything is lost"

In view of the potential entry into the conflict of such a country as Poland, where, for a minute, another 1000 tanks were ordered in South Korea, it still looks even more gloomy. and we will have to dampen these deliveries, and here the question is natural - why?

[Doccor18]

Quote: Gnefredov

in view of the potential entry into the conflict of a country like Poland, where for a minute, another 1000 tanks were ordered in South Korea, it still looks more gloomy ...

180 vehicles by 2025 (under contract), the remaining 820 from 2026 to 2032... It's scary to think that the Ukrainian conflict will last another nine years...

[Gnefredov]

180 vehicles by 2025 (under contract), the remaining 820 from 2026 to 2032... It's scary to think that the Ukrainian conflict will last another nine years...

Let's just say that the story with Ukraine will end faster than the story with Europe. And the story with Europe has not yet begun in this century, but based on well-known history, every 100 years Europeans pick up a pitchfork and attack a bear ... Well, then, however, as always, history tends to repeat itself

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

No one in February last year could have imagined that the war would last more than a year, but there was no end in sight and the forecasts were not bright

[TheWatcher]

How is it nobody? It was full of statements of competent people that the CBO with a high degree of probability will last no less than three years.
And the so-called "no one" is a simple incompetent people who sincerely thought that we would defeat them with one left.
And by the way, he was right about something - in two / three months we would have gouged them. But our Western partners began to support Banderstan in the most active way, both financially and with weapons, mercenaries and military advisers.
So while counting on a quick outcome is absolutely not worth it.

[S. Nikolaev]

No one in February last year could have imagined

Do you really think that those people who turned this confrontation into a hot phase, starting the NWO, were counting on just a year of rigmarole and victory?

[solar]

those people who turned this confrontation into a hot phase, starting the NWO, were counting on just a year of rigmarole and victory?

Why for a year?
Three or four weeks. According to the plan, they were supposed to meet with flowers, you can’t get enough flowers for a year ...

[S. Nikolaev]

you can’t stock up on flowers for a year ...

What a delicious irony. Those who met and waited without flowers were demonstratively killed, defiantly wearing white bandages (as in Bucha), clearly showing what will happen to those who are not satisfied with the power of "free and democratic" Ukraine

[Beck69]

For almost 10 years people have been clattering there, a whole generation of soldiers has grown up.

[S. Nikolaev]

It's scary to think that the Ukrainian conflict will last another nine years...

That is, for thirty years it was not scary to roll into the abyss, but it was scary to get out of there?

[S. Nikolaev]

damping will have to be done, and here the question is natural - why?

damper. A damper should be brought to Belarus. Here they are to dampen.

[Stas157]

Quote: Bulgarian

the author constantly in his articles promotes the topic "All wrong", "Everything is lost"

А what's wrong did the author write?
Can you express something intelligibly?

[Sergey250455]

Firstly, Uralvagon has a plan of 125 cars per month

[TheWatcher]

All! He writes what he absolutely does not understand. In order to be at least a little competent in what he writes about, you must be far from the last person in the Moscow Region or UVZ.
And who is the author..? Nobody! Nobody at all! He is close to incompetent in what he writes))

[UAZ 452]

But who's stopping you from reading exclusively the press releases of Lieutenant General Konashenkov, "far from being the last person in the Moscow Region"? Enjoy! Why are you reading an author you don't trust? From congenital masochism?

[S. Nikolaev]

Yes, he wrote something like that, and even quite flowery, everything shows that he owns a pen. But in support of his thesis about "tales about "hundreds of new T-90s and T-73B3s" it would be nice for the author to also have data, and give a few figures on the actual and planned production of newly manufactured and modernized tanks for this year in terms of the capacities that this production provides. And so the information that some equipment for the production of machines remained at the Omsk plant is, of course, very important information, but I would still like specifics - how much this plant, which is engaged in the modernization of T80BV and T72B, produces machines per day and which ones. Well, etc.

[Beetle1991]

I notice that the author constantly promotes the topic "Everything is wrong", "Everything is lost" in his articles. Who do you work for Roman.

Here, another question is more relevant: for whom do "patriots" work, who say that everything is fine, nothing needs to be changed, no one needs to resign, there is no corruption (including in the Moscow Region and defense enterprises). Let everything boil in its own juice.
I remember Gerasimov was in the NVO zone. Ukrainians wanted to bang him. The Americans were strongly opposed. It looks like overseas it is beneficial for the Chief General Staff to remain the same. And yes, nothing has changed at all. They rob themselves, they set themselves up. A story for Americans.

[S. Nikolaev]

The Americans were strongly opposed. Seeing overseas is beneficial for the Chief General Staff to remain the same

Well, of course! And about this interest of theirs, like this, they trumpeted the whole world. To everyone!
Listen, well, before you write something or blurt out, well, you think at least a little. If there is anything

[your vsr 66-67]

Quote: Bulgarian

I notice that the author constantly promotes the topic "Everything is wrong", "Everything is lost" in his articles. Who do you work for Roman.

The novel always raises burning questions! And if he somewhere made a mistake with the conclusions, these questions still do not lose their relevance!
Looked at the ruins of the Stalingrad tractor. And there was one indignation! Our fathers and grandfathers built, today's liberals destroyed! Or do you think how women and teenagers will become machine tools in the Second World War? Yes, such as God forgive Buzova, they will hang themselves faster than stand up to the machine! And all (or almost all) of these bloggers, managers and the like have already been dumped from the country! Why do they need a homeland? They only need money from the Motherland!
I don’t know what will happen next, if this continues, when those who are entrusted with guarding are stolen, I think nothing good will happen! And until the moratorium on the death penalty for treason, for theft on a large scale and for similar crimes, nothing rosy awaits us!

[UAZ 452]

And until the moratorium on the death penalty for treason, for theft on a large scale and for similar crimes, nothing rosy awaits us!

Are you sure that those people who warm their hands on the budget will not compile the execution lists? Or those who protect them, having solid kickbacks for this? And in this case, I'm even afraid to imagine who will be included in these execution lists. Most likely - first of all, those who dare to ask these people uncomfortable questions.

[Alex_mech]

Anyone who disagrees with the "party line" is a Japanese spy or better a Bulgarian spy?

[TheWatcher]

But didn’t you notice that here on VO, in fact, all the articles just scream that "everything is wrong .."
VO has long turned into a gathering of amateurs with a claim to competence, who suddenly decided that they know and understand the problems of the Moscow Region much better than competent people who are really in the subject of what is happening. And the funny thing is that here amateurs write articles for amateurs like them and then discuss all this in all seriousness. But in reality, none of them has the slightest idea about the real state of affairs, from the word at all - just zero understanding, some incompetent conjectures.
At the same time, when you try to point this out to them and make it clear that in their cases it is better to chew than to speak (write), then you immediately get a shaft of indignation on their part, because this completely breaks their internal agenda that "everything is bad - everything is not So". You immediately receive the label of a Kremlinbot, a urapatriot and other derogatory terms that are poured into your address. And of course, they immediately downvote your post, which they actually did with yours. Mine is expecting exactly the same thing. Here it is a bunch of dilettantes in all its manifestations, unable to think independently and objectively, they need someone who will shout louder than anyone "Yura, we've lost everything" - and they will immediately scream in ecstasy in response and give you no God does not shout with them in unison.

[Alex_mech]

Well, on the contrary, I encounter the opposite behavior, as soon as you doubt something, immediately “tsipso”, “tsrushnik” or “Ukrainian”. Everywhere there are aggressive commentators who have too much free time

[UAZ 452]

VO has long turned into a gathering of amateurs with a claim to competence, who suddenly decided that they know and understand the problems of the Moscow Region much better than competent people who are really in the topic of what is happening

I'm embarrassed to ask - what does the word "for a long time" mean, used by a person whose absence of a "badge" next to whose nickname indicates that he has been on this forum for less than a year? Or banned by the main nickname? Then I can not challenge the correctness of the moderators. And "a competent person is much better" (we will not evaluate the compliance of the phrase with the rules of the Russian language) one must think - you? I can’t dispute this statement of yours, but then at least please the readers with your vision of the situation. Or - the Chukchi is not a reader, and not a writer, the Chukchi is a critic?

[Alexey Sommer]

For a long time it means in 2014 everything on this site was already finished.
In my opinion.

[Goto]

Write and publish an article! Show all these "whiners" how professionals work !!!!
Only in this way you will wipe their nose!

[nazgul-ishe]

"Get your overcoat, let's go home." There are other patriotic statements, but they will not pass. This is only D. And you can express what he thinks.

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

There is too little space in the head for smart thoughts in this half-sized, that's why crap grinds.

[tTshka]

It is necessary to publicly execute a couple of "effective managers" for jambs, of course, then we can do everything !!!

Well, the capacities, of course, are not enough, especially if we take into account the fact that the entire Western gang will also begin to rivet weapons ... yes, the second question is how much they will succeed, but the fact is their crowd ...

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

It is necessary to start executions from the top ones, so this is already a utopia.

[Alex_mech]

What is there to execute, not even dare to criticize. There they instructed you minuses, the peasants defend the master.

[UAZ 452]

The minuses were probably instructed by those who understand that they will not be shot at all by those who should be. Those will just make lists.

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

– Plant No. 183 in Nizhny Tagil (evacuated from Kharkov);
– Nizhny Tagil Carriage Works;
- Kirov Plant (Chelyabinsk Kirov Plant, created on the basis of an evacuated plant from Leningrad);
- Plant No. 112 "Krasnoye Sormovo" in the city of Gorky;
– Ural plant of heavy engineering, Sverdlovsk;
- Plant No. 174 Omsk;
- Stalingrad Tractor Plant.

At least the author missed another plant that produced tanks in the city of Sverdlovsk - N37.

[spektr9]

At least the author missed another plant that produced tanks in the city of Sverdlovsk - N37

Are you talking about this?

In 1922, the plant was named "Metallist". In 1941, the plant was transferred to the production of military products: on October 9, 1941, Plant No. 37 named after S. Ordzhonikidze was established on its site, which, in addition to Metallist, included evacuated enterprises. On June 28, 1966, by the decision of the Council of Ministers of the RSFSR, the plant was named after Ya.M. Sverdlov. In 1967, the plant was named the Ural Plant of Transport Engineering named after Ya.M. Sverdlov" And finally, on December 10, 1990, the enterprise was renamed into the production association "Uraltransmash".
By 2012, the plant will finally stop its work, it is intended for demolition

[Stas157]

Quote: Kote pane Kohanka

Sverdlovsk - N37.

This is Uraltransmash, if I'm not mistaken? The author mentioned it.

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

Quote: Stas157

Quote: Kote pane Kohanka

Sverdlovsk - N37.

This is Uraltransmash, if I'm not mistaken? The author mentioned it.

The author remembered the Ural Heavy Machine Building Plant (UZTM), which at Uralmash
Seomorokhov forgot to write about the Ural Transport Engineering Plant (Uraltransmash), which produced the T-60 at Elmash during the war years.

UZTM

Uraltransmash.

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

Our plant, sharpened for the production of shells, went bankrupt completely this year. So our authorities won't care about drums in this war. I just don’t know why on the drum, because of their stupidity or from betrayal. It looks like the last one.

[Alex_mech]

I do not believe in betrayal, but the first option is obvious.

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

If it's about stupidity, why is it always the same gate? After all, according to the theory of probability, there should be a hit for one miss, but here all the time to the detriment!

[Alex_mech]

No, this is called "confirmation bias" if you are sure of betrayal, then you will interpret all the facts in this direction. But the question is, is it all-all-all traitors? Is this the only way to explain that no one inside the Kremlin (or the Moscow Region or somewhere else) notices anything?

[UAZ 452]

In 1991, not a single person stood up for the defense of the USSR (the maximum - he ticked the referendum, and, pleased with himself, went on to drink beer). Out of almost 300 million. So it cannot be said that the betrayal of the state by all its citizens, not to mention the elites, is an absolutely impossible scenario. True, the successful implementation of such a scenario characterizes, first of all, the state itself as having lost efficiency and viability.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

You are not telling the truth. In the same Moscow, rallies were held for the restoration of the USSR, the number of participants in which amounted to millions.
And you don't take into account a lot of factors.
First of all, those who were supposed to do this, the KGB and the army authorities, did not stand up for the USSR. Questions to them first. Although oh, there was the State Emergency Committee!
Or do you think that cohabitation with Ukrainian Nazism is a pleasure? And he, Ukrainian Nazism, even then was almost the same as now. And what is it like, for example, to live in a big city, where all, or almost all, leading positions are occupied by them.
Yes, there are questions about a wagon and a small cart.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: UAZ 452

In 1991, not a single person stood up for the defense of the USSR (the maximum - he ticked the referendum, and, pleased with himself, went on to drink beer). Out of almost 300 million.

Already hesitated with this lie. If you went to drink beer, then my dad went to rallies.

[UAZ 452]

Well, just compare - how the formation changed in 1917-1920 and how in 1991. Republic of Ingushetia, in the eyes of a fair part of its citizens, discredited itself, but there were monarchists, and they fought for their country with weapons in their hands. Well, tens of millions of communists and Komsomol members in 91 - they went to rallies, yeah ... Heroes, what can I say.

[Private SA]

Once the Murom plant named after Ordzhonikidze (ZiO) produced:
1) Gearboxes for tanks.
2) Wheels for tanks and infantry fighting vehicles.
3) Bases of tank rotary hatches.
4) Manhole covers and handles to them.
5) Torsion shafts.
6) Supports and balancers.
7) Fingers for tracks.
8) Simulators for Soviet tankers.
And much more besides Oka refrigerators and children's toys.
Who ruined it all, who was allowed to escape with a mark in Istanbul
airport? And for what ...

[Stas157]

Quote: Private SA

Who ruined it all who were allowed to escape with a mark in Istanbul
airport? And for what ...

At what in zero well-fed years. In the time of famine, under the drunkard, enterprises (not only yours) still somehow existed. But they could not stand the subsequent optimization for shopping centers, warehouses, shops ...

[sgrabik]

Exactly, they existed, formally, but they did not work, they were not modernized, labor collectives were reduced almost completely, here you have the final results, and most importantly, no one is to blame for this.

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

In the middle of the XNUMXs, I encountered an interesting phenomenon. In Komsomolsk, a team of assemblers was recruited for the aircraft plant for a shift, they promised very good money for that time. I found out that one team was rolling out to several factories. We sent a state order to Irkutsk for a couple of aircraft-assemblers go there. They ordered a plane in Kazan, they are going to Tatarstan ... One brigade for the whole country! Well, that was twenty years ago, and after all, not a single supreme rat thought of the need to train personnel!

[UAZ 452]

Do you think that they should have prepared a team, or better not one, for each of the factories? And how to pay them, and what to do with them, if you write yourself - the state order was for a couple of aircraft, and occasionally?
Now the managers of military-industrial complex enterprises also cannot have the "back" thought that they will invest in expanding production, and in six months or a year the situation will "settle down", and military orders will again come to naught. And then what should they do with the expanded specialized production, equipment, loans, recruited by people, in the end?

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: sgrabik

That's right, they existed, formally, but did not work

We have worked.

[G17]

It remains to recall the "recycling list" of Minister of Defense Serdyukov, who wanted to destroy all Soviet stocks of tanks and other equipment under the tale that in 2015 we will get "Armata" and rivet the necessary equipment (tanks, infantry fighting vehicles) on its platform. If he had carried out his plan, then we would not have received any tanks at the front now. It is from the miraculously surviving stocks that 1.500 tanks a year will be riveted. In reality, this will not be new equipment, but 90% old Soviet, modernized to a different level.

[Stas157]

Quote: G17

It remains to recall the "recycling list" of Minister of Defense Serdyukov, who wanted to destroy all Soviet stocks of tanks

And some here bow at the feet of this great optimizer! Say, look, it was he who created the modern and efficient Russian army, abandoning everything "unnecessary" Soviet.

[Doccor18]

Quote: Stas157

abandoning everything "unnecessary" Soviet.

From divisions, for example ...
Now rebuilding...

[UAZ 452]

And what? If they cannot establish interaction between BTGs, then will they be able to ensure effective communication, control, transmission of target designations within divisions, and even more so between divisions? Rather, I believe that they will finally wean the officers of the battalion commander level to make independent decisions - everything will be delegated to the level of the divisional commander, who simply will not keep up with the rapidly changing situation. So I won’t be surprised if after some time they once again shy away from the brigade organization. And then again in the division ... and again ... and again ... And for each reform - orders, titles ...

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

So Serdyukov was going to fight with inflated tanks, I remember it well ... For all the time, none of the ministers was punished for jambs. Nobody. Ulyukaev doesn't count, he just decided to run into a teammate.

[UAZ 452]

It remains to recall the "recycling list" of Minister of Defense Serdyukov, who wanted to destroy all Soviet stocks of tanks and other equipment under the tale that in 2015 we will get "Armata" and rivet the necessary equipment (tanks, infantry fighting vehicles) on its platform.

They write that there are more than 64 T-2s at the storage bases alone. Only now it is impossible to use them due to technical condition. So, was Serdyukov wrong if he wanted to melt down these 2 tanks rather than spend money on their storage, even if in the current situation it turned out to be impossible to put them into operation? And as far as I remember, his successor never disavowed his statement on "Armata". And why in 2015 the T-14 did not go to the troops - another MO should be asked questions. That MO, which, by the way, has been in office for more than 10 years, while Serdyukov spent about 5 years in this chair.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: UAZ 452

already another MO should be asked questions. That MO, which, by the way, has been in office for more than 10 years, while Serdyukov spent about 5 years in this chair.

Yes, there is no difference there, Serdyukov, Shoigu, or Vanya Zalupypkin. Questions above should be asked, the Almighty.

[UAZ 452]

If in a huge country questions can only be asked to one person, then in fact the question should be asked to everyone else: "How did we allow things to come to this state of affairs?"

[Sergey Samkov]

Everything is as always .. He is an expert in everything ... If only he would reveal the topic of boobs !!! In detail, with calculations and illustrations, links ...

[Asad]

Write better, who's stopping you? Laziness or not knowing the material?

[Doccor18]

Quote: ASAD

or not knowing the material?

If with the internal structure, in detail, with functionality - the topic, I will say, is very voluminous, complex and fascinating.

[Alf]

Quote: Sergey Samkov

.Here he would open the topic of boobs!!! In detail, with calculations and illustrations, links ...

Who hurts something ...

[Leader_Barmaleev]

My friends, I want to tell you a little about the city in which I live - in Novosibirsk for the last twenty years, that way is SURPRISINGLY clean air. No, our traditional dust has not gone away, but the smoke ... Previously, there was regular smog in Novosibirsk, almost like in London, and the gray haze was just constant, especially on the left bank - factories smoked, HUGE MILITARY FACTORIES producing special steels and armor , rockets and shells, SEMICONDUCTORS AND MICROSCHEMS, the huge TsARZ specialized in the repair of tanks and armored vehicles. Rumble, dust, smoke... And now silence. Factories have been turned into offices and shopping centers. You may not be aware, but it is Novosibirsk that is the WORLD LEADER in terms of the number of retail space per capita. No, it’s wonderful that children’s entertainment and leisure centers have appeared the size of a small airfield, that there have appeared shops and shopping centers in which the opposite wall is not visible, but I remember a sad anecdote about how a stupid boy changed his family Mauser for a Swiss watch. I hope that conclusions will be drawn based on the results of this war and "effective managers" will be partly shot, partly they will go to the tundra to remove snow with shovels, no one will expect the ships to pay back, and the factories will start working again. They didn't smoke that much.

[Asad]

Instead of smog from factories in our Pylesibirsk, smog was formed from low-quality brown coal for thermal power plants.

[Li17]

Quote: Leader_Barmaleev

I hope that conclusions will be drawn based on the results of this war and "effective managers" will be partly shot, partly will go to the tundra to remove snow with shovels, no one will expect the ships to pay back, and the factories will start working again.

Too late, they are already "cleaning up" in London and Israel!

[PC]

Dreams, dreams, dreams, dreams...............

[Marat Nazmutdinov]

Countryman, in my understanding, the forecast of events is bleak. If we win the war, our decay will not be disturbed by anything, and we will remain quietly rotting in our vast expanses. If we lose the war, then we will also lose the hope that we will ever recover. The third option is a very big boom with the use of atomic weapons, and now it seems to me that this is the best way out for us.

[Viktior Vinland]

In order to resolve the issue, it is necessary that the SVO develop into a liberation war of the Soviet people against the occupation regimes, as the First World War grew into a socialist revolution. After all, now simple and brave guys have taken up arms and they fight better than the black-assed Papuans whom the Yeltsin-Putin regime uses to suppress people and to keep illegally seized power on the territory of the USSR.
This is a historic chance to throw off the yoke of ghouls and scoundrels.

[Ryaruav]

sergey you are a big optimist about the execution, the guarantor does not understand why he doesn’t give up his fools

[Dart2027]

UVZ does not have enough workers at its disposal to enable the plant to plow in three shifts.

In fact, it has long been said that all these plants work in three shifts.

[IS-80_RVGK2]

Quote: Dart2027

In fact, it has long been said that all these plants work in three shifts.

Last year, they wrote about a plant for the production of drones operating in three shifts. Well, how did they fill up the army with drones?

[Vladimir_2U]

BMOP "Terminator-2"

Official name? Somehow I missed it when ... Just curious.

[Alien From]

Thanks Roman! The correct questions are asked in the article, only to those who are at the top, not before. Zamonali!

[Victor Masyuk]

In order to objectively assess the possibilities of producing armored vehicles in the volumes set by the country's leadership, it is necessary not only to say about the number of factories, but also to evaluate their fixed assets (production capacities), compare the machine park, its modernity and productivity. The author pointed his finger at the UVZ from the times of the USSR in 1985, and from his article it seems that UVZ works on 40-year-old equipment, which has never been updated since then. The fact that since then UVZ has produced no more than 300 tanks does not mean at all that this is its maximum ... We do not know to what extent the author's conclusions are correct. He may be right, but with the help of the methodology he "hit his finger in the sky", in other words, he accidentally guessed. Or maybe I didn’t guess, but Putin and Medvedev, due to their official capabilities, are better informed than Roman Skomorokhov. Not a single parameter of the production capacities of the current plants is indicated, but the amount of equipment produced in previous years means only the contractual obligations fulfilled by one or another enterprise, and not at all, the enterprises, the maximum possibilities ....

[lukash66]

Absolutely agree with you. With all due respect to the author, he does not have all the information, and all of us here present. And this is all guesswork on the coffee grounds. It is clear that in the USSR there were much more military-industrial complex factories and, accordingly, they produced much more products. But let's not forget that a large part went to the aid of the pro-communist regimes, to the countries of the Warsaw Pact. Take, for example, the production of cars: up to 70% was exported. Moreover, not only in the socialist countries. camps and countries in Africa and Latin America, but also in the West. Europe. Remember postcards and queues for them for years. This applies to VAZ, AZLK, and to a lesser extent GAZ. But the fact that the 90s went like a skating rink through the enterprises of the military-industrial complex, no one argues here. There was a time when everyone believed in friendship between peoples and peace throughout the world. And like, in figs we have so many tanks, if we were not going to the English Channel.

[Alf]

Quote from: lukash66

Take, for example, the production of cars: up to 70% was exported.

Herr lieutenant, before writing this, you should familiarize yourself with the numbers ...

[Alf]

Quote: Alf

Herr lieutenant, before writing this, you should familiarize yourself with the numbers ...

70%?

[Igor K_2]

This is a very simple question, will UVZ be able or not. The answer is nowhere simpler - it can not! The arguments are simple. In 1985, the lion's share of T-72 parts was produced at thousands of enterprises in the USSR. Now the main part of the T-90 is made by UVZ itself, it simply cannot physically carry such a volume alone. The narrowest and not quickly solved places are equipment, skilled workers and engineers.

[Stas157]

Quote: Victor Masyuk

but Putin and Medvedev, due to official opportunities better informed Roman Skomorokhov.

Well, yes. And they also have very high-quality rose-colored glasses and a lot of broken promises.

[Victor Masyuk]

Well, of course! It is you who know exactly what information is on their tables, where exactly they lie, and what color their glasses are ...

[spektr9]

. The author pointed his finger at the UVZ from the times of the USSR in 1985, and from his article it seems that UVZ works on 40-year-old equipment, which has never been updated since then. The fact that since then UVZ has produced no more than 300 tanks does not mean at all that this is its maximum ... We do not know to what extent the author's conclusions are correct

Of course, I apologize wildly, but I'm sorry, what kind of nonsense is this? It’s good even if the fleet has not been updated, who bothers to produce 80 units of t-1500m on the machines of the 90s? After all, the t-90m is not a super-mega new tank, but a chassis from the t-72 with a new turret, of innovations, in fact, only electronics.
If the park, as you say, has been updated, then no one interferes with the production of 1500 pieces, t-90m (and with the new park, half of this number of t-90m can be replaced with fittings)
However, as the year goes by, the NWO and the production of new equipment at the Uralvagon, it’s good that 400 pieces. So, dear patriots, decide either something is wrong with the factories and your beloved 30-year-old democracy has brought them to such a state, or is something wrong in the Kremlin and outright sabotage is taking place?

[Victor Masyuk]

Let me ask you, what form of admission do you have, why are you talking so confidently and accurately about the number of tanks produced by UVZ?

[spektr9]

Let me ask you, what form of admission do you have, why are you talking so confidently and accurately about the number of tanks produced by UVZ?

Then a turbo-cheers-"patriot" question for you, if the author is wrong - Where are the Zin tanks?
You are trying to convince us here that the Uralvagon plant can produce 1500 (or how many in your hooray fantasy?) t-90m, where are these tanks? Where are they, why is the T-62 on the SVO instead of them?
Something other than rotten-hooray, no other arguments are visible from you

[Victor Masyuk]

I don't know. And you don't know. And Skomorokhov, I note, also does not know. And where, in what place of my comments did you read "URA" ?? Where did I write that UVZ can produce this ?? All that I said in my comment: the author does not own the subject and, giving his forecasts, does not base them on the analysis of fixed assets and production capacities. And therefore, his conclusions have no serious grounds. I, if you read my comment completely and carefully, said that the author may even be right, but only by chance, since he does not say a word about those parameters on which it is only possible to draw conclusions on the subject of the article. And if you cannot understand the meaning of what you read and attribute to me what I did not write, then I am not your doctor.

[Victor Masyuk]

Of course, I apologize, but you know how to read in the sense of folding letters into words, but with understanding what you read, you have difficulty. My main idea was that the author cannot reasonably talk about the expected amount of equipment produced, since he does not have information about the production capacities of the enterprises he writes about. And without such information, any reasoning on a given topic is empty chatter, which is what not only the author does, but also those who support him in the comments.

[Alf]

Quote: spektr9

who prevents the production of 80 units of t-1500m on the machines of the 90s?

A small moment - the machine produced in the 80s has already completely exhausted its resource and breakdowns, to put it mildly, are frequent. Where can I get spare parts for it?

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

The machines are different. I saw in action an English milling machine of the 30th year of production, at that time it had already worked for about 60 years. If you do not need high accuracy, and the machine is maintainable in design, anything can happen.
For machine tools, property taxes are much more dangerous than their age.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Alf

A small moment - the machine produced in the 80s has already completely exhausted its resource and breakdowns, to put it mildly, are frequent. Where can I get spare parts for it?

About eight years ago I sorted out a machine made in 1988. Romanian. When he grumbled that putties were piled on him, like on a Mercedes, they told me: "Vova, this machine costs more than a Mercedes." Turning, if anything.

[UserGun]

Quote: Victor Masyuk

The fact that since then UVZ has produced no more than 300 tanks does not mean at all that this is its maximum ...

You forget that UVZ is only an assembly))) And the assembly includes thousands of components. If, for example, a Zhiguli is produced without power steering, without a catalyst, without ABS, and even without seats, it will certainly be able to go somehow))) Not far, of course, and sadly so))) But try to release a tank, for example, without a gun stabilization system? ))) I'm generally surprised why the Russian Federation needs super wunderwaffles? T-34 is our choice!

[Filibuster]

In 1944, the industry of the USSR produced 29 tanks, the industry of Germany produced 000 tanks.

How can you compare this minuscule amount of 1 tanks with the Great Patriotic War and call it the military-industrial complex ?!

[Victor Masyuk]

Do I understand correctly that you put labor costs and the technical complexity of manufacturing the T-34 and T-90 on the same level?

[Stas157]

Quote: Victor Masyuk

Do I understand correctly that you put labor costs and the technical complexity of manufacturing the T-34 and T-90 on the same level?

And you do not take into account the qualitative change in production technologies from the period of the first half of the 20th century to the first half of the 21st?

Productivity has increased manifold, and labor costs have decreased. Modern technologies and equipment make it possible to produce even technically complex products on a much larger scale.

A good example is the automotive industry. Compare how many primitive cars were produced in the forties of the last century and what a huge number they are producing now. The difference is simply enormous! Plus, a modern car looks like a spaceship compared to those carts!

[UserGun]

Quote: Stas157

A good example is the automotive industry.

A good example of the automotive industry in the Russian Federation is Avtovaz. Where the release of incomplete cars is considered the norm. And they seem to be releasing them in thousands, only now they are sold by the dozens

[sgrabik]

You would still remember the Battle of Kulikovo, now it’s a completely different time and other alignments, why write such nonsense.

[1 z1]

They were able to direct DAM and GDP with their statements, people's energy in the right direction. Like, let them count, calculate, analyze where it is not quite subtle. In fact, can the industry produce 1500 tanks a year? On the verge of collapse and rush, maybe (taking into account equipment from storage and recapitalized ones that have already been in battles). Most likely, the figure of the defense order is in this aisle. Otherwise, where does the top management get the figures from. That is, everything seems to be fine with tanks. Plus, DAM has started a contact campaign and soon 400 highly professional contract soldiers will join the orderly ranks of the armed forces. It turns out that all the main problems have been solved.

[Alf]

Quote: 1z1

DAM has started a contact campaign and soon 400 highly professional contractors will join the orderly ranks of the armed forces.

Where does he get so many of them? All the more highly professional?

[1 z1]

HZ knows him, this is the officially declared figure. Maybe they are counting on conscripts who will be demobilized + graduates of military universities. Well, and Syrian volunteers who are waiting for commands

[Alf]

Quote: 1z1

HZ knows him, this is the officially declared figure.

The iPhone itself does not know, its task is to produce an acoustic effect in the volume of rain H2O.

Quote: 1z1

Maybe they are counting on conscripts who will be demoblezed

Blessed is he who believes ...

[1 z1]

More Chinese and Koreans, which are northern. Some seriously believe that they are sleeping and seeing how to fight on our side.

[Alf]

Quote: 1z1

Some seriously believe that they are sleeping and seeing how to fight on our side.

Damn, they took off the tongue ...

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: 1z1

Maybe they are counting on conscripts who will be demobilized + graduates of military universities. Well, and Syrian volunteers who are waiting for commands

Yeah, somehow they gave Zil 131 to a military unit. After overhaul. They bring it back six months later. The electrician looked at what the crazy hands had done there, grabbed his head. I looked, it fell out. Boys-military-overgrown-cogs-shpunts.

[1 z1]

I don't understand why my sarcasm didn't come through. Minus and minus

[Li17]

The topic is certainly important. And there is another sub-topic, which is now kind of in the shadows, but is the basis for everything. And where do we have the production of chips and other things from this series? As far as I know, in Rostov all radio factories have been destroyed, precisely as factories and not separate workshops, and the rest of the list goes on in the same form. The armor remained, but the electronic filling is modern .... Something tells me if the Chinese cover Ali ...

[sgrabik]

From patriotic chatter, often not confirmed by the real state of affairs, we need to move on to solving existing problems, because words alone cannot be defeated, they need to be confirmed by deeds, and so far we are not doing very well with this, the plans are really ambitious, but there are few of them voiced, they still need to be implemented.

[UserGun]

Why are you discrediting the government in its entirety? Ai-yay-yay) No, of course I understand that for more than 20 years of continuous victories, this government has undoubtedly achieved success in its own PR, but just as frankly as you, take everything and cheat )))

[Down]

Quote: Leader_Barmaleev

My friends, I want to tell you a little about the city in which I live - in Novosibirsk for the last twenty years, that way is SURPRISINGLY clean air. No, our traditional dust has not gone away, but the smoke ... Previously, there was regular smog in Novosibirsk, almost like in London, and the gray haze was just constant, especially on the left bank - factories smoked, HUGE MILITARY FACTORIES producing special steels and armor , rockets and shells, SEMICONDUCTORS AND MICROSCHEMS, the huge TsARZ specialized in the repair of tanks and armored vehicles. Rumble, dust, smoke... And now silence. Factories have been turned into offices and shopping centers. You may not be aware, but it is Novosibirsk that is the WORLD LEADER in terms of the number of retail space per capita. No, it’s wonderful that children’s entertainment and leisure centers have appeared the size of a small airfield, that there have appeared shops and shopping centers in which the opposite wall is not visible, but I remember a sad anecdote about how a stupid boy changed his family Mauser for a Swiss watch. I hope that conclusions will be drawn based on the results of this war and "effective managers" will be partly shot, partly they will go to the tundra to remove snow with shovels, no one will expect the ships to pay back, and the factories will start working again. They didn't smoke that much.

You are an optimist, my friend, you first look at what years and under whom the air became cleaner, so don’t dream. They don't cut themselves. Moreover, if everything was fine, then there would be no point in talking about the release of new technology to calm the masses.

[Dmitry Ivanov_8]

Somewhere on the internet I saw a figure that UVZ produces 3 tanks per day - 21 per week. Not sure if new or upgraded. So if this is the case, then 1500 tanks a year is real.

[Leader_Barmaleev]

The main feature of quotes from the Internet is that you believe them immediately and unconditionally (c) V.I. Lenin, complete works.

[Down]

Quote: sgrabik

From patriotic chatter, often not confirmed by the real state of affairs, we need to move on to solving existing problems, because words alone cannot be defeated, they need to be confirmed by deeds, and so far we are not doing very well with this, the plans are really ambitious, but there are few of them voiced, they still need to be implemented.

And what was the time when the oligarchs were different, please, give a list ....

[Down]

Quote: Victor Masyuk

Do I understand correctly that you put labor costs and the technical complexity of manufacturing the T-34 and T-90 on the same level?

Yes, this is a correct comparison, in 1944, there were no CNC machines, but in the USSR since the 80s, they have been used everywhere, and their productivity is many times greater than that of machine tools of the 1944 model.

[Down]

Quote: ASAD

Write better, who's stopping you? Laziness or not knowing the material?

He is hindered by the law "On Discrediting" and the title article is also limited to general conclusions, we live in such a country.

[Igor K_2]

There is nothing to be surprised here, it was quite expected. For 32 years, we have liquidated a very decent number of defense industry plants. UVZ even if it strains a lot and won’t get close to 1000 tanks a year, because there are simply no necessary subcontractors. I think that in the Soviet years it was they who dragged the production of most of the tank parts. And no one will restore these lost factories, for the most part they are wastelands with ruins. Somewhere something remained, but most of the equipment was sold or went into ferrous metal. And from our local factory, some of the machines were sold cheaply to Ukraine in the 90s, which is very ironic ...

[Down]

Quote: Bulgarian

I notice that the author constantly promotes the topic "Everything is wrong", "Everything is lost" in his articles. Who do you work for Roman.

So he takes an example from our leaders. Medvedev built a silicon valley that you didn’t notice, on every corner there are solar panels, domestic ones that have no analogues ..., the second “until I am president, there will be no pension reform”, and the most interesting thing is that the theme of religion is being promoted everywhere, and if I’m not mistaken , then isn’t it written in holy scripture, “once lied ...” The fact is, this is the most stubborn thing ....

[Alex 1970]

Well, the fact that the LADIES will blurt out after waking up has raised a lot of questions more than once. The late Zadornov spoke about his mental abilities. Nevertheless, it is necessary to increase the production of tanks, how is it another matter? To say one thing, but was the funding for this program announced somewhere, or was it said which tanks would be produced in such a quantity? Nowhere and nothing. If they start building a ship, they blow it from all the irons, where, when and what for what, in aviation it is similar. And here it is, either to scare the adversary, or to calm oneself.

[Michael2015]

A high-class CNC machine tool adjuster worked with me in the same workshop (unfortunately, he died prematurely). He worked all his life at the Volgograd Tractor Plant. And after 50 years, he was forced to move to the Moscow region, because the plant was destroyed ((He talked about the Volgograd Tractor Plant with such enthusiasm and brilliance in his eyes !!!
PS Even our small plant employs about 10 people (machine operators) from Volgograd, since there is a very low level of wages in industry ((

[vext-tor]

Here are those who bankrupt factories in Russia, and they must be castrated from the head with a sledgehammer, regardless of their status and belonging to the ruling elites. These are the accomplices of the NATO Nazis, Stalin did not even judge such people, but immediately let them go to waste. Moreover, there are a lot of such Russian traitors in Rostec.

[UAZ 452]

And if the plant has been regularly asking for funding for decades, and just as regularly fills up all orders? Still supporting the dead? Spend money, provide subsidies? So what?

[Irokez]

Do you think it should be closed?

[UAZ 452]

No, keep it artificially afloat by investing in it money taken from successful enterprises. Just do not be surprised that with each year of such a policy, the number of successful budget donor enterprises will decrease, and the number of subsidized leeches will increase. You can't imagine a better demotivation for those who know how to work and want to.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

Some industries cannot be financially successful because of the tax system, not because they perform poorly or their products are not needed.
For example, they have large taxable production areas and taxable large inventory, without which it is impossible to maintain the production cycle.

[Vlad2012]

Also add self-propelled artillery to this picture.

[sgrabik]

Here, for our most modern and widely publicized self-propelled guns "Coalition SV" for many years they have not been able to establish mass production, and our army needs it at the front like air, self-propelled guns "MSTA S" are certainly good, but with all the desire it cannot beat for such long distances as the "Coalition of the SV", to be sure, we do not have enough necessary factories for the military-industrial complex, this is a clear fact and you can not argue with that, we went bankrupt, and now we have to disentangle the mistakes made by the liberals to please the West, for which we are now pay off.

[Sergey Valov]

Articles like this are largely meaningless. Only plants involved in the final production of products (assembly) are considered. But the maximum output very often depends on the suppliers of components, in this case, for example, guns. Immediately the question is - is the plant producing (namely, producing and not “building”, as it has become fashionable to write now) guns capable of ensuring the production of the required number of products? And so on throughout the range of components. No “buffoons” (sorry if I offended, dear author, I’m in a figurative sense) will not answer this question, because there is information with at least two letters “s”, or even cooler. And secondly, at absolutely any plant there are bottlenecks that hinder an increase in output, expand this place (the work can be a penny, or maybe a billion) and the total output can increase by a multiple. At any plant they know about it, but they also know that if you grow one place, another will immediately appear, and so on ad infinitum. The question is different - what production volumes are determined for the plant? That's why you should dance.

[UAZ 452]

Well, one bottleneck is well known - we practically do not have our own electronics. And semiconductors are indispensable components of any weapon, except for machine guns, and the machine costs a little without the same night sights, other body kit, where electronics are also present.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

The bottleneck is the tax and financial system. And just with semiconductors, you can somehow get out of the situation.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich

The bottleneck is the tax and financial system. And just with semiconductors, you can somehow get out of the situation.

And what does HSE lecturer Mishustin say about this?

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

I can't express my opinion on this issue without indecent words.

[Maks1995]

In general, as always.
Everyone discusses and explains the pieces of iron, and not the people who all this allowed and muddied.

And as one of Stalin's devotees said: "any problem, any failure, any decision harmful to the country and people has a First Name, Last Name, and Patronymic" (literally)

[vovochkarzhevsky]

Like it or not, everything rests on the existing economic formation.
We now have capitalism, however, and the worst format, thieves. Our big business did not create its production from scratch, it stole them from the state. Well, quite naturally, in strict accordance with the formula, - money - goods - money, - deals with the "optimization" of the inherited productions. That is, to isolate from them only those capacities that, according to the understanding of Russian capitalism, bring profit, and eliminate everything else. Without thinking at all that these same unprofitable chains de-energize the existence of profitable elements, in the short and long term.
Our capitalism behaves like an unreasonable owner who, having bought an apartment, replans it to his own convenience, without embarrassment demolishing load-bearing walls.
And in general, it's time to remember, the capitalist is only interested in money. He essentially does not care about the development of the economy, industries.

[UserGun]

As it turned out after 20 years of continuous victories, capitalism and capitalism are different, in different countries) Someone quite successfully develops the economy and production by leaps and bounds, and someone smokes bamboo and cries on the sidelines)

[vovochkarzhevsky]

Do you like to dream about the "hand of the market"? I won't even try to convince you. If they haven't woken up in 30 years, then what can I say.

[Sergey39]

Perhaps the "military specialist" Medvedev, counted for tanks, all the tracked vehicles that the factories produce, for the year.

[Georgy Sviridov_2]

Medvedev counted the upgraded tanks that are being removed from storage bases ...

[1 z1]

Why only from storage bases? And those who are repairing after operation on the NWO think they don’t count? They are also being returned to service.

[UAZ 452]

Well, yes - the T-62 is in the T-62M, and there is a checkmark in the report, all repairs can be safely included in the report - they still don’t produce native components for antiques removed from storage, so for anyone they will put something a little newer - also modernization. Moreover, each repair can be counted as a modernization, so one car and several times a year can be counted as a modernized one. We know how to draw up reports ... Ukrainian aviation has already been destroyed several times. According to reports.

[Georgy Sviridov_2]

Everything would be fine if the author didn’t have problems with mathematics ... Otherwise, he himself names the numbers 250-1300 and himself says that we need to take the average (I would not write the average, but "in my opinion, the real figure ..." there would be no questions) and instead of 700-800 he writes 500-600, and at the end of the article he writes 400-500 in general ...
In fact, 1500 are not new tanks, but most of them are the modernization of t-72 tanks removed from storage, of which there are actually thousands of units, which means that the plant will actually be able to produce such volumes for several years until the stocks of tanks in storage are exhausted.
T-62m model 22-23 years old, no better than modern abrams, but definitely better than leopard 2a4 and much better than leopard 1a5 ... As well as better than t-62s released in 60-70 years and not undergone serious modernization. Better than the Polish T-55s that they want to transfer to ...

[Illanatol]

Quote: Flibuster

In 1944, the industry of the USSR produced 29 tanks, the industry of Germany produced 000 tanks.

Where did the firewood about the production of 33 tanks in Germany in 000 come from?
T-4 was produced in 1944 in the amount of 3126 pieces.
Panther T-5 in the same year released 3749.
Tigers - 623.
Tiger II - 377.

Approximately 8 thousand turns out.
In total, for the entire period of WWII, the Reich produced approximately 25 thousand tanks. Other armored vehicles were not taken into account.

[Tank destroyerSU-100]

In fact, it sucks not to know and forget that Plant No. 183 and Uralvagonzavod are one and the same enterprise.

[Vlad Gor]

The best armor is the Laws that do not give the aggressors the opportunity to unleash aggressive wars. Laws in accordance with which the defense of the Fatherland takes place. Laws specifying who owns what. Laws in which the goal, strategy, tactics, tasks are spelled out and the enemy is named. A year has passed, but the authorities of the Russian Federation have not yet legally approved the goal, strategy, tactics, tasks in Ukraine. Nobody knows what the Kremlin wants in Ukraine, except for the talk about demilitarization, denazification and references to the UN Charter. Russia needs a Law. The entire territory of Ukraine is an integral part of Russia. 30 years have passed since the destruction of the Soviet Union, and the authorities are trying to maintain the legitimacy of those events, although everyone understands that a coup d'état has been carried out, and this is a criminal offense that does not have a statute of limitations. All wars in the post-Soviet space, as a result, come from the 1990s. In the presence of laws, tanks may not be needed.

[Irokez]

If you write your plans on the fence, then they will not come true due to the fact that someone interested will screw them up.

[Viktior Vinland]

I agree that the bacchanalia with the goals and objectives of the war complicates an already difficult situation.

It would be different in the current political situation if honest and competent people come to power. Otherwise, the current political system and the clan of usurpers of power are themselves part of the problem. And this is the main difficulty.

And of course we need good laws.
Only these laws should be written, adopted, observed and protected by someone.
Otherwise, the law is just a bunch of letters.
There was a law on the procedure for withdrawing from the USSR and it was violated, so what?

[Alexey G]

Thanks to the author for the informative article. It was interesting to find out who and what we do on the topic of armor.
The T80 theme is interesting. I think now we need to decide on the main battle tank. It is impossible to do 4 types at once. T62, 72, 80 and 90.
Of course, it was better to do this before the war, but even now it is probably not too late. Judging by the number of factories, you need to choose one. And of course, the T90M breakthrough is preferable, judging by the feedback from the front.
Omsk residents may be more logical to focus on a larger release of TOS. the car is praised and awaited at the front. She is good both offensively and defensively.
Kurgan people also make 2 types of infantry fighting vehicles. Is it rational? I think the BMP 3, again, judging by the reviews from the front, is the best. And to do it to the T90M in a pair.
I think the Volgograd residents should be helped by the Airborne Forces, but not the BMD4, which are not very popular, but switch to the BMP3 and help the Kurgans. As for the Octopus, it's hard to say ... no information.
One armored personnel carrier should be built for Arzamas. I think BTR82A ...
Motovilikha plants 4 types of self-propelled mortars. I understand that a different caliber, but leave 2 maximum. Nona and Tulip maybe.
Uraltransmash 4 self-propelled guns! A lot of. I don't think more than 2. Msta and one large-caliber. Tulip or Malka.
Reducing the number of models will lead to a simplification of repairs, which was proven in the Second World War and will partly solve the problem of the lack of repair plants and spare parts.
The theme of unification somehow left the author. I think this is important, although the preservation of these enterprises is, of course, necessary.
I also believe that with regard to tanks, it is necessary to focus on the issue of improving visibility from the Tower in order to better see the battlefield and, in the case of enemy anti-aircraft defense, it was possible to respond with a salvo of several guns to one ATGM, suppressing it.

[Wildcat]

Good article, facts collected, conclusions drawn.

[Repellent]

Quote: Wildcat

Good article, facts collected, conclusions drawn

And the author is correct. Well, why not, umm... pat?

[Tank destroyerSU-100]

During the Great Patriotic War, the following enterprises were involved in the production of tanks, self-propelled artillery installations and tank diesel engines:
1. Plant No. 183, Kharkov: June - October 1941 - production of medium tanks T-34-76.
2. Plant No. 183, Nizhny Tagil: December 1941 - May 1945 - production of medium tanks T-34-76 and T-34-85.
3. Stalingrad Tractor Plant: June 1941 - September 1942 - production of T-34-76 medium tanks and V-2 tank diesel engines.
4. Plant No. 112 "Krasnoye Sormovo", Gorky: September 1941 - May 1945 - production of medium tanks T-34-76 and T-34-85.
5. Chelyabinsk Tractor Plant, from September 1941 - Chelyabinsk Kirov Plant: from July 1942 to March 1944 - production of T-34-76 medium tanks; from July 1941 to October 1943 - production of heavy tanks KV-1, KV-1s, KV-85, flamethrower tanks KV-8 and KV-8s; from October 1943 to May 1945 - the production of heavy IS tanks; from March 1943 to January 1944, the release of heavy self-propelled guns SU-152; from December 1943 to May 1945 - the production of heavy self-propelled guns ISU-152, ISU-122 and ISU-122s; from November 1941 to May 1945 - the production of V-2 tank diesel engines.
6. "Uralmash", Sverdlovsk: in 1941 - 1942 - production of corps of heavy tanks KV-1 and medium tanks T-34; in 1943 - the production of stamped towers for T-34 tanks; from September 1942 to May 1943 - the production of medium tanks T-34-76; from November 1942 to August 1943 - the release of medium self-propelled guns SU-122, from July 1943 to November 1944 - the release of medium self-propelled guns SU-85 and SU-85M, from September 1944 to May 1945 - production of medium self-propelled guns SU-100.
7. Plant No. 38 "Named on the 1st of May", Kolomna, Moscow Region (locomotive plant) / g. Kirov: production of light tanks T-60 and T-70, from November 1942 to the end of 1944 - production of light self-propelled guns SU-76 and SU-76M.
8. Gorky Automobile Plant: from September 1941 to mid-1942 - the production of light tanks T-60, in 1942-1943. - production of light tanks T-70; in 1943-1945 - production of light self-propelled guns SU-76 and SU-76M; in 1943, an experimental batch of T-80 tanks was produced (a variant of the T-70 tank with a double turret).
9. Plant No. 37, Moscow: at the beginning of October 1941, the production of T-40 tanks, then T-60.
10. Plant No. 37, Sverdlovsk: from December 1941 to January 1943 - the production of light tanks T-60 and an experimental batch of T-70 tanks, from the spring of 1943 switched to the production of components for medium tanks T- 34.
11. Plant No. 264, Krasnoarmeysk, Stalingrad region: from November 1941 to September 1942 - production of T-60 light tanks; from June 1941 to September 1942 - the production of armored hulls and turrets of medium tanks T-34 for STZ.
12. Plant No. 174, Leningrad: produced a small batch of T-50 tanks, assembled T-26 tanks from the existing backlog.
13. Plant No. 174, Omsk: at the beginning of 1942, produced a small batch of T-50 light tanks; from June 1942 to May 1945 - the production of medium tanks T-34-76 and T-34-85.
14. Plant No. 40, Mytishchi, Moscow Region: from the second half of 1943 to May 1945 - production of light self-propelled guns SU-76 and SU-76M; in 1943 - the release of a small batch of T-80 light tanks.
15. Engine Plant No. 76, Sverdlovsk: from November 1941 to May 1945 - production of V-2 tank diesel engines.
16. Engine Plant No. 77, Barnaul: from November 1942 to May 1945 - production of V-2 tank diesel engines.
In total, up to 251 enterprises were involved in the production of tanks and self-propelled guns within the framework of industrial cooperation as part of the NKTP.
Today we have in stock: "Uralvagonzavod", which has not lost its competence in the production of tanks, "Omsk Transport Engineering Plant" - modernization and repair of T-80 tanks is possible, the competence of production is questionable. The Kirov Plant - the competencies for the production of tanks, most likely, have been lost, Kurganmash - the competencies for the production of BTT have been preserved, but the liberal fifth column is stubbornly trying to bankrupt and demolish the plant, the Volgograd Tractor Plant (BMD production) - destroyed, the Altai Tractor Plant (production of equipment on the basis of the BMP-2) - destroyed, the Chelyabinsk Tractor Plant - the competence for the production of armored vehicles is questionable.

[Alexander Tkachenko]

30 years of the rule of effective menagers show that they are in shock, the people are without pants, the army is without shells and tanks!

[Viktior Vinland]

joke from the internet

The son of a Russian official asks his father:
- Dad, what is patriotism?
- Patriotism is when ordinary people work for a penny so that we can live on the estate and go to the dacha in Spain.
"But don't ordinary people get angry about it?"
- Of course they are angry! But it's called extremism

[Tikhonov_Alexander]

DAM, who jumps out of every snuffbox like hell, is clearly determined to replace the guarantor. But DAM, at one time, did things - did not crush the Georgians to the end, tore off the defense contract for the S-300 with Iran, abstained in Libya, disbanded 29 military schools ... Although, one must think, our guarantor loomed behind him .. DAM again seems to want to steer. Or someone else wants it ... And the result - since our leaders do not have the ability to at least slightly calculate possible options for events - they will be "deceived" at every step and victory, as in the Patriotic War, will again be paid for by heavy losses. ..

[SNA]

Quote: Marat Nazmutdinov

A qualified machine operator will not work out even in five years ... And if you are given a ready-made set of parts for

Don't treat people as idiots. At the age of 27, I mastered 1K62 in a month. True, I have a good heredity (grandfather has golden hands and a head). And aircraft modeling.

[nerovnayadoroga]

There to "master" and 10 minutes in excess, but to do the work ... You can cut modular and pitch threads, sharpen the Archimedean spiral !?

[Irokez]

Well, such threads are not needed for mass production, and the designer always tries to lay down simpler parts that are cheaper and faster to make in production. Optimization so to speak.
In a single case, these threads may be needed, although not all turners will be able to make them with a long work experience - they simply did not need it.

[Swarotwar Hort]

Everyone is waiting for DECISIONS from the HEADS.
WAIT FOR ORDERS FROM MO. Awaiting funding.
And where can the MO get finances from? This is not a bank.
Medvedev can promise at least 1800 such a year, at least 3000.
Everything was privatized, but what about the obligations of these plants in case of war? So there is no war. There is no State Defense Committee. There is no state control.

[Vlad888]

You just look at the composition of Rostec's general managers and everything will become clear, at one time it was a place of exile for certain liberal officials and there are a lot of evil spirits sitting in management. There are also their proteges at the factories themselves, it’s not just that they introduced a criminal offense for the disruption of the defense order.

[Kirsanov]

UVZ in 1985 did not make 300 T-72s, but 1500 (open plant statistics, published long before the SVO).
Now the equipment at UVZ is much more technologically advanced, weeks in 1985.
Such a discrepancy in the figure is very annoying about the article as a whole.

[Warrior_II_digit]

People, what about the production of the Coalition-SV self-propelled gun, it never went into production?

[Negro]

Quote: Warrior_II_category

What about the production of the Coalition-SV self-propelled gun, it never went into production?

Forget it.

[Warrior_II_digit]

Are all production facilities busy with the production and repair of Msta-S?

[Dmitriy22]

Perhaps, in order to resolve the personnel issue at military-industrial complex enterprises during the period of hostilities, it makes sense to introduce at the legislative level the concept of labor mobilization of workers in specialized specialties. Naturally, with the payment of appropriate salaries and provision of acceptable social and living conditions. On a rotational basis.

[d1975]

Yes, you are right, but why will Russian people (Russians) be busy? This is not why they threw everything and everyone down the drain.

[Eleazar bin Shaul]

there are authors from the special forces unit “Pull the Shutter.” Regarding the T-62 tanks. The mention in the article about the modernization of old tanks is a blatant distortion. When I see how an armored personnel carrier suppresses firing points in urban areas, risking catching a response, the thought immediately comes to mind, if only there was at least a T-55 with its 105mm cannon. That's what obsolete tanks are for! Not to compete with the Challengers, but to safely reinforce infantry fire support.
even roll out a T-34-85 against a machine gun point in a five-story building, it will be better than an armored personnel carrier

[Negro]

Quote: Eleazar ben Shaul

at least the T-55 with its 105mm cannon

How is the weather in Haifa?

[IS-80_RVGK2]

Quote: Eleazar ben Shaul

Now if only there was at least a T-55 with its 105mm cannon.

Then he would have burned in the same way. Without modernization, it has nothing to do there, just like the BMP 1 2. Although, of course, the large caliber of the gun is a serious plus.

[Mister who]

Let us remember the people, any tractor and other machine-building plants are capable of producing military equipment, including tanks. Provided that this is a real plant with a full production cycle, and some, as it is now fashionable to call a screwdriver assembly a production. Under the UNION, these factories were supposed to be converted to military products; by the way, a simple machine-building plant with a full cycle is capable of producing and repairing tanks, infantry fighting vehicles, armored personnel carriers, shells of various calibers, and, the cherry on the cake, even ballistic missiles. Soviet factories are designed for this. The main thing is the personnel at these factories. This is real and taken from life (for those who say this is impossible), under some factories there were analogues of these factories with machine tools underground, a factory under a factory. Some metro stations at least “were” equipped with machines underground for firing shells in case the city was surrounded, which is a big question now.

[EVGENIY_VLADIMIROVICH]

Finance and personnel for state defense procurement are interconnected things. If the conditional Uralvagonzavod cannot increase the volume of tank production due to a shortage of machine operators, those that exist are already working 12 hours a day. Naturally, the plant is looking for co-contractors. But many simply cannot fulfill the requirements of military acceptance, and those that can (they have equipment and specialists) do not fit into the government order prices. The cost of highly qualified labor has increased by 1.5 - 2 times compared to December! A vicious circle: it is impossible to increase the prices of government orders, but no one will write off the loss, the tea factory is not an African country.

[IS-80_RVGK2]

Quote: EVGENIY_VLADIMIROVICH

The cost of highly qualified labor has increased by 1.5 - 2 times compared to December!

Cry of effective managers. You are burning with a blue flame. Cut the management's exorbitantly inflated salaries and settle them.

[Down]

Quote: Vlad Gor

The best armor is the Laws that do not give the aggressors the opportunity to unleash aggressive wars. Laws in accordance with which the defense of the Fatherland takes place. Laws specifying who owns what. Laws in which the goal, strategy, tactics, tasks are spelled out and the enemy is named. A year has passed, but the authorities of the Russian Federation have not yet legally approved the goal, strategy, tactics, tasks in Ukraine. Nobody knows what the Kremlin wants in Ukraine, except for the talk about demilitarization, denazification and references to the UN Charter. Russia needs a Law. The entire territory of Ukraine is an integral part of Russia. 30 years have passed since the destruction of the Soviet Union, and the authorities are trying to maintain the legitimacy of those events, although everyone understands that a coup d'état has been carried out, and this is a criminal offense that does not have a statute of limitations. All wars in the post-Soviet space, as a result, come from the 1990s. In the presence of laws, tanks may not be needed.

Where are you hovering? A long time ago, the law on friendship and cooperation between Ukraine and Russia was ratified, according to which we recognized their borders, mind you, voluntarily, despite the speech in the Duma by Zhirinovsky, who said that our descendants would curse us for this and there is no need to sign anything. But we always approve...And now we ourselves have violated it, why did we sign the question then? This is one of the reasons why third countries, or rather a significant part of them in the UN, condemn us. There is an agreement, which is also a law, according to which they recognized and themselves violated it. So. that we need to start by saying that we changed our minds and we need Ukraine, but it will look stupid, so the rationale is different now. Or do you think that the representative of the Foreign Ministry Zakharova will tell you these nuances))

[IS-80_RVGK2]

Quote from Etwas

This is one of the reasons why third countries, or rather a significant part of them in the UN, condemn us.

This is just a lousy decoration for the real reasons.

[Down]

Quote: Dmitriy22

Perhaps, in order to resolve the personnel issue at military-industrial complex enterprises during the period of hostilities, it makes sense to introduce at the legislative level the concept of labor mobilization of workers in specialized specialties. Naturally, with the payment of appropriate salaries and provision of acceptable social and living conditions. On a rotational basis.

Complete stupidity. Firstly, now it’s capitalism, which means you have to pay for everything.
Secondly, it is necessary to introduce the death penalty, because you can call up, mobilize, but how can you make him work, where is the incentive?

[Mister who]

There was a practice, during large orders and production volumes, they called pensioners and asked to return to the plant for 2-3 months, half a year, to help the plant produce products, not all. But people came and helped from year to year, of course for a salary, and you as they wanted for free) this practice existed until recently, people understood and came to the rescue. Low bow to our pensioners. Thank you for your work!

[fiv]

If during the Great Patriotic War someone had answered a question about a defense plant that it was going bankrupt, they would have taken him out into the yard and shot him. Rostec bankrupts Motovilikha during the war. Where is the blood on the asphalt?

[IS-80_RVGK2]

Quote: fiv

Where is the blood on the asphalt?

She is in Artemovsk. Where people are dying on both sides in the interests of those who have robbed and deceived them for the past 30 years.

[Mister who]

You fell)) what kind of labor costs, you take a plant that is barely afloat, give an order, help you stay afloat financially, it doesn’t really matter to the sharpener what to sharpen, as they said “it doesn’t matter to me what to sharpen, the main thing is give me the drawing” it all comes down to this, if there is one thermal training, foundry, coordinate - what is stopping you, crooked hands and unwillingness)) if you need to ask plant veterans, pensioners to return to the plant for a while. The main problem is just getting the documentation for the production of parts, the resource base (raw metal, casting and its processing), people who know how to work, everything. People who don’t want to find 1000 excuses, we need people who will find 1000 reasons how to do it. At agricultural factories they actually repaired military equipment, created parts for it, and this did not cause any particular difficulties, and not 34ku, but modern ones. Those who say that this is impossible and labor-intensive cause laughter, you are not the enemies of the country. At least they worked at the factory))

[Igor Chupakhin]

And on the basis of the T-55 and T-62, produce “terminators” and heavy infantry fighting vehicles
it is forbidden? There are developments, prototypes too. So what's the deal?!.

[Igor Chupakhin]

Those who go to the military-industrial complex only for money and titles, all three letters! There will be no sense from them! One harm! Needed, - "vitally needed", - "Sharagi"!!!

[lopvlad]

The question is what our authorities will decide to do to make the fairy tales about “hundreds of new T-90s and T-73B3s” come true.

so the State Department and its followers considered Russian hypersound to be fairy tales and cartoons, and in the end they quietly admitted everything. Fairy tales are such footcloth articles with pictures, and what do these evil fairy tales have to do with it, just like from radio freedom or the mossy echo of Moscow.
Do you think that you have more information than Dmitry Medvedev or the President of Russia?

[d1975]

You must love your homeland! There is still no ideology in the country; the values ​​have been eroded and continue to do so. The punishment system is zero. They are not led from the bottom by those who have come up with intelligence, but by stupid people who came from God knows where. And so it is in every industry. Godfather, brother, matchmaker. D. F. Ustinov knew how to solve these problems, but this requires reforms and a change in the country’s course. The rest is secondary. Aspen is no match for orange!

[Private SA]

Quote: Flibuster

In 1944, the industry of the USSR produced 29 tanks, the industry of Germany produced 000 tanks.

Please provide the source where this data was taken from. In 1944, the English and American
Aviation heavily bombed factories producing ball bearings on the territory of the Third Reich.

[Tim666]

Quote: AA17

In general, it seems that there are not enough factories ...

Dear spektr9.
I agree with you.
But at the same time, conflicting events are taking place in our country with enterprises related to the military-industrial complex.

Against the backdrop of numerous demands to mobilize the economy and transfer it to a military footing, the news about the bankruptcy and sale of the property of defense plants sound absolutely fantastic. ...
But seven months after the start of the special military operation and the seemingly obvious problems with the lack of production capacities of the military-industrial complex, such processes are surprising.
The following factories are currently being liquidated:
▪️50th Automobile Repair Plant, Rostov-on-Don
▪️258th repair plant for refueling and transporting fuel, Bataysk
▪️751st repair plant, Rostov, Yaroslavl region
▪️5th Central Automobile Repair Plant, Yekaterinburg.... https://pikabu.ru/story/zakryityie_voennyikh_zavodov_9497770

The events of the past seven months have revealed many unsightly things in our country. And the reports on repair enterprises that are systematically destroyed by subsidiaries of the Rostec concern look even more creepy .... https://topwar.ru/202777-goskorporacija-rosteh-odnoj-rukoj-stroit-zavody-pjatju-ubivaet.html

“Almost eight months after the beginning of the NMD, when the front is increasingly in need of a strong rear, it turned out that defense enterprises are massively going bankrupt across the country, many of which have unique competencies. ... https://19rusinfo.ru/politika/24538 -strashnee-chem-diversiya-po-vsej-rossii-tikho-vzryvayut-oboronnye-zavody

P.S. Against the background of this information, the orders of the Head of the Russian Government M. Mishustin look somehow ridiculous:

... The head of the Russian government, Mikhail Mishustin, signed an order to establish a plant for the repair of rocket and artillery weapons of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation ... https://tvzvezda.ru/news/2023331228-9RK2u.html

There is an INTERESTING SITUATION. If the information about the closure of the factories is FALSE, then the State media should give a refutation. If the information about the closure of factories is TRUE, then this process during the NWO with the bankruptcy and closure of military enterprises should be considered a crime.

What makes you think that someone owes you something?

[ermak124.0]

How can you not whine on April Fool's Day? In general, I’m glad it turned out that the country is simply stuffed with analysts.

[Sergey Venediktov]

The awareness of the average person today is higher than that of the chairman of the KGB of the USSR in 1980

therefore, as the country's chief analyst, I will say

There is potential to produce up to 2000-3000 new tanks today

but the main problems lie elsewhere

a) there are no trained crews for new tanks (an average mobik can’t handle it - he doesn’t have enough intelligence and health)
b) we don’t have KAZ or intelligent defense systems on our tanks.

Those. we cannot teach the tank’s electronics to fire a smoke grenade when an ATGM flies into the tank in order to hide the tank or block the line of sight

But in order to seriously talk about production, you need to be admitted to it at least at the level of reading such percentages

[QuestionsNeudobny]

Those. we cannot teach the tank’s electronics to fire a smoke grenade when an ATGM flies into the tank in order to hide the tank or block the line of sight

Well, you got excited! -

http://btvt.narod.ru/4/shtora1/shtora1.htm

read.

[ZVictory]

No matter what they write, I know one thing
V.V. Putin does not waste words.
If you said that there will be 1600 tanks, then there will be

[Human_manoid]

What about the Kirov plant, or what is the number of our underground tank equipment plant???

[odisey3000]

Well, what do you want from the storyteller builder Shoigu, he didn’t tell our Supreme Commander that. PR is also a weapon to make the enemy afraid. All sensible people understand that even if we try hard enough, we won’t be able to handle so many tanks. The main thing is, that in this regard we also have factories producing armored vehicles that were not looted or destroyed. And let them chug without a break 24 hours a day.

[Aingof]

Have you seen what the factories have been turned into? In the center of all of them, with their conditions, sbshniks and tbshniks, where everyone wants to fuck the hard workers. I am silent about the defective ones. There are no conditions. How we laugh, in the city of Novotroitsk there are 3 zones - 3, 5 and “Ural Steel”, colloquially called simply “”. This is a city-forming enterprise with good salaries in the region and a shortage of staff. Each enterprise is a state within a state, with its own rules (everyone goes crazy in their own way).
How do you want to win when your rear is rotten? The mobilization took place first of all in enterprises, gathering hard workers. It’s also simpler, mostly men work and there are many of them in one organization, there is no need to catch them, the personnel department itself will do everything for the military commissars. There are already a shortage of them at every enterprise. Open any website and you will see: required, required. There are already not enough low-skilled workers, not to mention specialists. And no one in their right mind strives for production.

[Pavel57]

AMZ is wheels. All army armor on wheels is here:....

– BMM, a medical transporter based on the BTR-90, which did not go into production;..
So maybe we can return to the topic of BTR-90?

[AlexWar]

As they say, we have not yet passed our 1941, when we will not have tanks. We have no real statistics on what we lost. Ukraine will receive newer and newer tanks. The whole West will work for them, tank production must be urgently expanded
Return the plan to 1500 tanks per year. This plan exists, but not only new ones.

[Zaurbek]

T-80 is not T-90, but not T-62 either. We must understand.

The main thing is to understand that the country should produce ONE tank, no matter how many factories. And I would stop the topic with “special equipment for the Airborne Forces”. The BMP-3 needs to be produced en masse. At two factories, like the mortars on her “cart”

[koramax81]

I thought that Skomorokh had once written a normal article... But, no. At the end of the shit he poured out the bucket, he doesn’t cheat on himself

[av58]

Motovilikha will not go bankrupt. Since 2017, everyone has been scratching their heads and wondering how to resolve the situation, since it is impossible to refuse bankruptcy directly against the law, but you cannot go bankrupt, and no one has canceled the telephone right, so in the current situation, especially no one will dare to sign bankruptcy if just doesn't have 2 heads and 7 cat lives.