Kinoch and Dimancha: similar on the outside, but different on the inside

13
Kinoch and Dimancha: similar on the outside, but different on the inside
Revolver Kinocha. Left side view


Behold, I am making new things; now it will appear;
don't you want to know that too?

Exodus 43: 19

People and weapon. In articles about weapons, we have repeatedly noted that, firstly, it is subject to the influence of fashion, like everything else, and secondly, that the desire to do something of one’s own in the arms industry is indestructible, just like in any another. A great many gunsmiths, apparently, reasoned thus: “I will make something new, and suddenly people will like it? After all, how do you know what will happen ... ”So in the end, sometimes completely amazing weapons appeared. It was enough to look at some to immediately say - “there will be no good from this!” But their authors did not pay attention to this and fought with maniacal persistence to promote their products.



And what? Is it really that bad?

They had the opportunity to do something new, they made it new, and why shouldn't they offer it to people? No wonder it is said that how many people, so many preferences. And it is also said like this: “be awake, because you do not know either the day or the hour” - that is, you should always be ready, because you never know who and where you need it!


Revolver Kinocha. Right side view

So today we will tell you about two designs of revolvers of the late XNUMXth century, which clearly claimed originality, but for many reasons “did not go.” And that, having turned out to be worse than others, today they have eclipsed them ... with their rarity and price at auctions, because collectors love what - curiosities, and get rich on rarities!


Kinocha revolver and cartridges for it

Recall that a classic revolver has the following device: the trigger usually serves not only to release the trigger, but also cocks it, and also turns the drum. Such, at least, is the design of a double-action revolver.

The disadvantage of this design is a large force on the trigger, which reduces the accuracy of the shot. That is why systems with manual cocking of the trigger appeared, in which the effort on the trigger was small. True, such revolvers had a reduced rate of fire, but there was nothing to be done about it.


Nickel-plated Kinocha revolver. Photo Rock Island Auction Company

Although there were inventors who tried to get around these difficulties. In particular, the Birmingham manufacturer William Tranter invented the double trigger, which was a powerful lever with an easy trigger. To shoot from a revolver equipped with such a lever, in single action mode, you had to first press the lower process of the trigger, which protruded beyond the guard, which allowed you to pull the trigger back and turn the drum.

At this moment, it was also possible to shoot, only by slightly pressing the top trigger. But in order to shoot even faster, it was necessary to pull both triggers (both the one below and the one above) at the same time, which turned this revolver into a double-action weapon. By the way, this did not complicate the design of the weapon much, but it did complicate it a little!


Scheme of the Kinoch revolver of the Tranter system. Attention is drawn to the original constipation of the upper frame of the revolver with the help of a curved pin sliding down

And in the end, the industrialist George Kinoch was found, who rented the arms factory of William Tranter in 1885 after the latter's retirement, and engaged in it, among other things, the production of revolvers of his own design. However, not entirely his own.

He was the manufacturer and on this basis he made a corresponding inscription on the revolver. But he had a business partner, Henry A. Schlund, who just patented several engineering solutions used in these revolvers. That is, in fact, it was a Shlund revolver, although, probably, he discussed its design with Kinoch, and more than once.

By the way, even before renting the Tranter factory, Kinoch founded a successful ammunition and hardware factory known as Lion Works. He supplied patrons to the British and Turkish governments and eventually achieved respect and honor, and was even elected to Parliament. But in 1888, due to disagreements with the company's board, he moved to South Africa, where, until his death in 1891, he entered into contracts for the supply of weapons and ammunition with Boer leaders.

But back to his revolver...


Kinocha revolver extractor device

Unlike Tranter's design, in his revolver both triggers are completely closed by the trigger guard, and the second has a spring-loaded latch that allows the revolver to be cocked in one action and also released without firing. The first trigger fires with light force (single action) or can be used in double action mode.

The revolver has a closed hammer with a thumb-actuated latch. The barrel is marked "KYNOCH GUN FACTORY ASTON" (at the top of the barrel), and "CAL 380" on the left side of the frame.


Trigger inside trigger guard


Latched trigger

Schlund revolvers were produced by the Kinocha factory in 1885, after which they were offered to the London Metropolitan Police around 1886 in various sizes and calibers, but were never adopted by it.

Bad examples, as they say, are contagious.

So the Romanian captain Haralamb Dimancha from Bucharest either saw the Kinocha revolver somewhere, or indeed the fashion for hammerless revolvers spread at that time, he only designed something outwardly very similar to this revolver. But here's the internal structure came up with his own. And not only did he come up with a new revolver, but also offered it to the War Ministry, which put it to the test.

And then he offered to produce it to two English firms - the enterprise of George Kinoch and the Gatling Arms company. In total, both of these companies produced about 1 units of his revolvers. But due to technical difficulties, their production was stopped, and the French M000 revolver was adopted by the Romanian army.


What first of all catches your eye when you see Dimanch’s revolver is its massive back, and the question involuntarily arises in your head: “What is there?” Photo forgottenweapons.com

By 1885, when he patented his revolver, it seemed to be very difficult to come up with something new. But Dimancha succeeded. In any case, he managed to come up with a very original revolver in its design, which had no analogues at all.

Outwardly, it somewhat resembled Kinoch's revolvers, but had an even larger rear part of the frame, in which a firing mechanism of a very unusual design was hidden.


And this is how it looked in the hand. Photo forgottenweapons.com

Let's start with the fact that the trigger that hits the cartridge primers was not in it at all. There was a spring-loaded drummer with a striker. Moreover, the mechanism was designed in such a way that before the shot it was retracted by one of the teeth of the sprocket located inside. But this asterisk was double, or rather, it consisted of two asterisks: one larger in size and a smaller one, planted on the same axis. So, the big asterisk, by pressing the trigger, turned the drum, setting it to the desired position, and the smaller one pulled the drummer back, after which it lowered it, and it went forward and struck the primer!


Completely disassembled Dimancha revolver. As you can see, there are clearly too many details in it for military weapons. Although there is an original solution - the trigger, together with the trigger guard, is removed as one piece! Photo forgottenweapons.com

In the same strange way, the revolver was reloaded. Not one drum leaned to the side, but the entire front part of its frame along with the barrel. The swivel assembly of the frame was unlocked by a protrusion in its rear part, like that of the Kinoch revolvers, only the blocker itself had a completely different and rather complex device.


Spring loaded parts. Photo forgottenweapons.com


And this is how both sprockets worked inside the back of the frame. The larger one pushed the drum, the smaller one pulled back the drummer. Photo forgottenweapons.com

The extractor was also similar to the one used on the Kinoch revolver, so to some extent, the Dimanch revolver can be considered an over-engineered clone of it.

It is clear that the revolver worked, but there were too many details in it, and the details were quite complex. Disassembling it was not at all easy, which also did not at all testify in his favor. Nothing happened with Dimanch with him.

Although no one will deny that his design really turned out to be exceptionally original!

PS


Photos of Kinoch revolvers courtesy of Alain Daubresse.
13 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. +7
    19 March 2023 07: 22
    Thank you, Vyacheslav! hi
    The presented revolvers do not differ in balanced appearance, engineering beauty. On the contrary, products that gain fame and distribution always have their own special style. There are many examples. What is primary here: a perfect design always meets the laws of harmony and becomes beautiful, or is the subconscious craving of men for the beautiful: horses, cars, weapons, women the reason for choosing?
    I think that in cases of weapons, the selection committees decided after the tests. wink however, there are beautiful and high-quality Rooger products that exist for the civilian market, but in its own way, the beautiful and technological AUG rifle, which is called "did not enter". Expensive mass production? Maybe.
    1. 0
      19 March 2023 14: 21
      The presented revolvers do not differ in balanced appearance, engineering beauty.

      A hasty conclusion, in my opinion. In addition, in the article, the photos show products from not very good angles.



      Revolverul Dimancea. For some reason, the author of the article did not voice such a moment that unites the samples presented in the publication - the first batch of revolverul Dimancea was made at the "Kynoch Gun Factory Aston". Further, the production of these revolvers was carried out by Gatling Arms and Ammunition Co. And it is not known how the fate of the revolver would have developed if Gatling Arms and Ammunition Co had not gone bankrupt.
      And one more interesting point - Sylvester Krnka took an active part in the improvement of revolverul Dimancea
      1. +1
        19 March 2023 16: 38
        The revolvers are enchantingly ugly, the length of the mechanism from the capsule to the back of the handle is too big, and judging by the photos of the details, they need workers from the watch factory to produce them.
        Amazing artifact!
        Kynoch in pre-revolutionary literature was written in Russian letters as Kinoch, so it is not clear how it is correct.
        1. +2
          20 March 2023 08: 57
          There was even a spelling "Kaynok"
          1. +1
            20 March 2023 13: 38
            Apparently, this is the correct pronunciation - Kaynok.
    2. +1
      19 March 2023 17: 03
      Quote: Galleon
      I think that in cases of weapons, the selection committees decided after the tests.


      Pharmacists practice a double-blind study, and the brewers did not lag behind them - it was they who sponsored the development of the statistical "Student's criterion", and in sports horse breeding they also decide on the breeding of a breed based on race statistics and measurements of body deviations from standards. But in those days, probably, the testing of revolvers was not so strict.
  2. +3
    19 March 2023 10: 23
    And in the end, the industrialist George Kinoch was found, who rented the arms factory of William Tranter in 1885 after the latter's retirement, and engaged in it, among other things, the production of revolvers of his own design.

    Given that George Kynoch was also a member of parliament and president of the Aston Villa football club, he managed the plant only until 1888.
  3. +3
    19 March 2023 12: 27
    In particular, the Birmingham manufacturer William Tranter invented the double trigger, which was a powerful lever with an easy trigger.


    Capsule revolvers "Tranter-Adams" 1854 (1855).

    By the way, Vyacheslav hi , photo from your own article "William Tranter - a man and a revolver". smile
    1. +6
      19 March 2023 12: 42
      Quote: Sea Cat
      from your own article

      And now - the development of the topic ...
      1. +4
        19 March 2023 13: 22
        Well, unlike the Adams-Trenters, this "development" has not received development, sorry for the tautology. smile
  4. 0
    28 March 2023 20: 10
    Thats one fucking ugly pistol..
    who ever designed tat this should be severely punished
  5. 0
    29 March 2023 19: 11
    What an ugly gun... if i could add a photo i could show you true beauty of gun design.
    Beauty and function always go hand in hand.
  6. 0
    April 14 2023 13: 39
    The classic Kinoh revolver was an elegant weapon suitable for self-defense. I own a revolver, but it had exactly as many flaws as the author describes. However, it was an interesting collectible weapon. As a result, the revolver ended up in the revolver collection of my colleague and friend. From revolvers for shooting I was satisfied with "Nagant am "