Fiddler on the roof and in the "Shell"

130
Fiddler on the roof and in the "Shell"

News the tapes were filled with photos and videos with the hoisting of the Pantsir air defense missile system on the roofs of administrative buildings in Moscow.

The idea itself is not a masterpiece, and it cannot be called new. At the end of the last century, anti-aircraft missile launchers stood on the territory of a Voronezh enterprise, providing direct cover for the most valuable Processor plant, which, however, died in Bose at the beginning of the XNUMXs. The British easily set up shooters during the London Olympics, in the USA the White House is guarded by crews located nearby, and what can be seen on the roofs of Seoul ... But North Korea is not far there, and from there it can fly suddenly and easily.




About the same rushed to say all our "experts". Say, we are not the first, which is already there. The fact is that these gentlemen will justify anything if there is an order for it. And in the State Duma, in general, everything related to the placement of air defense systems on the roofs of Moscow was declared fake.

But, in fact, we have a very peculiar set of circumstances.

Placement



It is worth noting here that neither the Koreans, dragging rapid-fire small-caliber artillery onto the roofs of their skyscrapers, nor the British, who placed the Rapira-2000 air defense system in parks and squares for the duration of the Olympics, are not even close to their Russian colleagues.




It's no joke, dragging a car weighing almost 30 tons onto the roofs of buildings is already very significant. And, by the way, it shows the level of trust in Soviet builders.

Not every, you see, the building will withstand the installation of such a machine on it. The risk is not small.

In general, this story with the hoisting of the "Shell" on the roofs, it gives off the smell of haste, if not panic. Yes, in Russia there are no analogues to foreign small-sized air defense systems like the British Rapier-2000, but such an air defense system would look more appropriate.


It would be possible to use the marine version of the same "Pantsir", "Pantsir-M", which is definitely lighter than the ground counterpart. There is no exact data on the weight of the marine version of the Pantsir, but no more than the same Kashtan-M, which weighs a little more than 12 tons. The difference is palpable.


And it would be possible to power the marine version from the electrical networks of the building no less efficiently than relying on the Pantsir-S1 diesel generator, to which diesel fuel would also have to be dragged from the ground. Not really a problem, but still...

It is obvious that someone came up with a superbright idea regarding the additional protection of certain structures. Few of those complexes that have already been deployed in some areas of Moscow to those that have always been there, it is also necessary to pile up on the roof. There is never a lot of air defense, it is very difficult to argue with this statement.

Combat application



Is the updated "Shell" good against UAVs or is it still not very good - this is a separate issue. Great concern is caused by the consequences of its use. The range of the Pantsir-S1 missiles ranges from 12 km (9S335) to 20 km (57E6E). That is, unambiguously BEFORE the boundaries outlined by the Moscow Ring Road in the minimum case and flying a little beyond the Moscow Ring Road in the maximum case.


What does this mean?

Yes, that if the same “Flight” or “Swift” really flies to Moscow, and they start trying to shoot it down with the help of the “Shell”, then they will intercept it exactly over Moscow. In general, the Ukrainian military has already proven that, under certain circumstances, an ancient Soviet jet drone is capable of flying where it needs to be. For example, in Engels. Although experiments on this topic have been going on since March 2022, when a Tu-141 with an improvised warhead blew up in the capital of Croatia, Zagreb, 50 meters from a student hostel. Having flown before that through the airspace of Romania, Hungary and Croatia itself.

In general, the air defense of the above countries turned out to be at the level of Russian air defense, which just missed Drones Tupolev Design Bureau to the strategic airfield aviation Russia.

The case when an old horse can plow from the heart.

And at the end of last year, representatives of the Ukrainian state defense conglomerate Ukroboronprom announced that they had completed testing a new design of a strike drone with a range of 1000 kilometers. That is, an even more effective apparatus from the point of view of the Ukrainians will be able to arrange a complete victory in the same Moscow.

Apparently, someone in the Ministry of Defense did not really like the information and it was decided to take action. Fast and result. As a result, the "shells" were dragged by cranes to the roofs.

Well, let's hope that the roofs and load-bearing structures of the Soviet period will hold up.

In general, the Armed Forces of Ukraine have already shown their ability to hit targets far from the borders of Russia. Sooner or later, an attempt to probe Moscow’s air defense could well follow, because if successful, the Ukrainian side could get real profit from such strikes: hitting cruise missile substitutes on targets in Moscow could entail the redeployment of air defense systems from the frontline zone closer to the capital.

The temptation is obvious, since the Ukrainians would very much like to pay for the strikes on Kyiv and other cities, at least partially. Artillery strikes on the border villages of the Kursk, Bryansk and Belgorod regions do not have such political weight as Ukraine would like, because the supply of weapons to the Ukrainian army will depend on the military-political successes of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. This is clear and understandable, because the expectation of a "retaliation strike" is quite obvious.

Possible consequences



Everything is clear here. If the “shell” intercepts targets within its range with its missiles, then, alas, a repetition of the tragedy in Dnepropetrovsk is quite possible. No matter how hard you try, Moscow will be below, and downed rockets will fall on Moscow houses.

Even in the most beautiful case, if the crew of the "Shell" quickly (not like in Syria) "sees" the target and aims missiles at it, launches and hits the target, then the target will hit objects near the place of its fall. Yes, as happened in Dnepropetrovsk.

Many smart people have already spoken out on the topic of who is more to blame, the Ukrainian anti-aircraft missile or the Russian cruise missile Kh-22, but the fact is that if you try to hit cruise missiles over cities, civilian casualties will be up to 90% likely.

Of course, a Ukrainian anti-aircraft missile with a maximum warhead weight of 150 kg will not be able to cause such destruction as the Kh-22 with its 960 kg warhead, of which 630 kg is TGAG-5 explosive, a mixture of TNT, RDX and aluminum. In addition, an anti-aircraft missile that hit a target is already without a warhead, that is, only unburned fuel poses a danger.

In general, the prospects for Muscovites are not very good. True, in the event that something nevertheless flies to Moscow from the territory of Ukraine and this something will be missed by all air defense posts on the way.

Previous Ukrainian drone strikes against targets inside Russia indicate that Russia's air defense network is actually having some difficulty detecting and tracking drones. Drones, by their nature, are generally difficult to detect and intercept, because an additional line of defense from the "Shells" seems to be a good thing, but the fact that the "Shells" will drop missiles at Moscow is not the best thing that could happen.


Do they know about this in the Ministry of Defense? Definitely yes. They cannot fail to know and understand the possible consequences of such shooting. But apparently, protecting ourselves, loved ones, is a more important task for our generals. Which is also generally understandable.

On January 18, 2023, Sergey Lavrov, answering a question from journalists about the events in Dnipro at a briefing, said that “Ukrainian air defense, contrary to all the laws of warfare, all norms of international law, is located in residential areas and this was the reason that an air defense missile eventually hit this house.”

And what about Ukraine? Well, in general, rather, where does Frunzenskaya Embankment and Teterinsky Lane of the city of Moscow have to do with it.

If according to the Minister of Foreign Affairs of Russia, then the deployment of air defense systems there is contrary to international law and all the laws of warfare. And you can’t place them there, on January 18, Sergei Viktorovich perfectly understood what such actions could lead to.

Alas, but if you really want, then everything is possible. And international law...

In general, of course, I really hope that the Armed Forces of Ukraine will not launch anything in Moscow, and all their stories are nothing more than propaganda. I count on it very much. I really would not like to see the Dnieper in Moscow.

I wonder who will be to blame?


The Ukrainian side is to blame for the tragedy with the house in the Dnieper. She placed air defense systems in urban areas, she intercepted missiles over cities, from which they fell on residential buildings and killed civilians. The choice was small, but it was. Either a Russian missile hits an infrastructure facility, or it is dropped on residential buildings.

And now, apparently, our generals in the Ministry of Defense received some information that something appeared in Ukraine weapon, capable of calmly flying to Moscow, or something else from the same opera, but our generals were clearly worried. Apparently, they believe that the Ministry of Defense is the most important goal for the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

A lot will depend on what kind of violinist will be on the roof and what melody he can play.

If the Armed Forces of Ukraine launch something like this towards Moscow, I wonder who will be to blame for the fact that the same Strizh falls on a residential building and smashes it?
130 comments
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  1. +11
    22 January 2023 04: 17
    News feeds filled with photos and videos of the hoisting of the Pantsir air defense missile system on the roofs of administrative buildings in Moscow
    .The combat module of the Avenger anti-aircraft missile system with Stinger missiles on the roof of one of the administrative buildings near the White House in Washington.
    1. +9
      22 January 2023 06: 56
      In principle, everything is logical. The shell was designed as a short-range air defense object and one of its tasks was the defense of industrial enterprises and critical infrastructure nodes.
      Everything "big" will be removed at a distance by the older "brothers" of the shell. His goal is the fight against drones that can launch within the Moscow Ring Road.
      What they put on the roof. So in the goals of the Great Patriotic War, on the roofs of Moscow, Leningrad and other cities, anti-aircraft guns and machine guns, lighting, surveillance and warning devices were placed.
      As far as I know, similar opportunities were stabbed into many high-rise building projects. Including industrial ones.
      1. +7
        22 January 2023 07: 16
        The author mentioned the UAV only once except for the Swift, but which UAV? A classmate of Geranium, small and not very powerful, just right for the Shell, with a high probability of "annihilation" of warheads. And in case of a miss, the Shell rocket is not fatal for the building.
        And the light foreign air defense systems that Roman mentioned do not even have the capabilities of the Shell, which is why they are light ...
        1. Eug
          +16
          22 January 2023 08: 26
          The fact is that both Swifts, and Flights, and even X-101 (the latter,
          if I'm not mistaken, until 2002, if not later) they were made at the Kharkov Aviation Plant, and the engines for them - in Zaporozhye ... there probably were documentation sets, and even without this "missile" and, accordingly, "management" (in relation to aircraft ) there are a lot of competencies in Ukraine ... so the creation of an aircraft with such characteristics is primarily a financial issue, and, as I understand it, there are no problems now.
          1. KCA
            +10
            22 January 2023 09: 46
            You are confusing X-55SM / 555 and X-101/102, X-101/102 was put into production in 2013, when there was no cooperation with / on, there was enough sales of / on X-55 and documentation to China
          2. +3
            22 January 2023 10: 21
            Quote: Eug
            so the creation of an aircraft with such characteristics is primarily a financial issue, and, as I understand it, there are no problems in this now.

            Rather, it is a question of place and meaning. What is the point of organizing at least some production of obsolete drones on the territory of Ukraine? If Caliber can fly there at any moment. It is easier to organize the production of Geranium analogues in Poland, Bulgaria, Romania, etc.
          3. 0
            22 January 2023 17: 06
            Quote: Eug
            surely there were sets of documentation left, and even without this "missile" and, accordingly, "management" (in relation to aircraft) competencies in Ukraine in bulk ...

            Have they been doing something MASS aviation and / or missile for the last 30 years?
            If not, then there are no competencies there. Who was needed - those in China / the USA who settled down in the EU ...
            Only pensioners left
            1. 0
              6 March 2023 18: 48
              Are we in a radically better position?
      2. -2
        23 January 2023 08: 16
        At the sight of the shell on the roof, Muscovites nervously lit a cigarette, and real estate around the Kremlin fell sharply in price. There were 4 air defense units around Ufa during the Soviet era, there were 5 units around Kazan. There were 20 S-300 divisions around Moscow in the early 2000s, according to the 2019 article. https://topwar.ru/154115-zaschitit-moskvu-pro-pvo-i-istrebiteli.html all the same 20 divisions but already armed with the S-400 and two regimental sets of S-300 PM. So sleep well
        1. 0
          24 January 2023 16: 11
          From where 4 around Ufa, there was one zrp and that one was dispersed in 93-94. several divisions were in position.
  2. +14
    22 January 2023 04: 18
    The message of the article is not clear. Everything that was set to be removed or what? How could something not work out?
    1. +51
      22 January 2023 04: 37
      Quote from Voronezh
      The message of the article is not clear.

      The meaning is simple. Until now, banderlogs have been blamed for the fact that they place air defense in residential areas in Kyiv and not only. Well, now the same thing only in Moscow. But this is really different! After all, is it true?
      1. +3
        22 January 2023 08: 00
        Quote: Stas157
        But this is really different! After all, is it true?

        Truth! Simply because in this case they are protected from missiles that can pass along the bed of the Moscow River at a height of several meters above the water surface. And the downed rocket will not fall on buildings, but into the water. And the generals are protecting not their loved ones, but the approaches to the Kremlin from two sides along the riverbed. You only need to look at the map to understand this.
        1. +10
          22 January 2023 10: 01
          Quote: Cube123
          Simply because in this case they are protected from missiles that can pass along the bed of the Moscow River at a height of several meters above the water surface. And the downed rocket will not fall on buildings, but into the water.
          Why put it on the roof?
          1. +5
            22 January 2023 10: 43
            Quote: Stirbjorn
            Why put it on the roof?

            And this is the elementary theory of antennas. Any antenna located near the surface of the earth has a zero pattern along the surface. This is where the concept of the minimum detection height comes from. When the antenna is raised above the surface, the beam drops down and the antenna looks in the direction of the surface. The top petals fall down. The concept of minimum detection height disappears. For the detection of missiles at altitudes of several meters, this is of fundamental importance.



            "Propagation of radio waves with raised antennas and a flat Earth"
            https://vuzdoc.org/46857/tehnika/rasprostranenie_radiovoln_podnyatyh_antennah_ploskoy_zemle?ysclid=ld72evcx5s246549260

            Let me remind you that the surface of water in the first approximation is flat.
          2. -4
            22 January 2023 11: 06
            Quote: Stirbjorn
            Why put it on the roof?

            And cannon shells, when fired from top to bottom, will not scatter for kilometers, hitting random unwanted objects.
            1. +7
              22 January 2023 16: 02
              Quote: Cube123
              Quote: Stirbjorn
              Why put it on the roof?

              And cannon shells, when fired from top to bottom, will not scatter for kilometers, hitting random unwanted objects.

              With all due respect to you drinks - Well, you are talking nonsense !!! am
              What nafik from top to bottom!!! Further in the text, it doesn’t even make sense to see commenting - it’s clear that you are very strong from air defense - unlike mnu feel
              All the best fellow And learn the materiel before writing such comments)))
              1. +8
                22 January 2023 16: 48
                Quote: Corona without virus
                What nafik from top to bottom!!! Further in the text, it doesn’t even make sense to see commenting - it’s clear that you are very much from air defense - unlike mnu feel

                That's why I didn't discuss further. Not an air defense specialist, but even it seems to me that some kind of crap comes out, from top to bottom, along the river lol hi
            2. +7
              22 January 2023 17: 29
              Yes, and cannon shells when fired from top to bottom ...

              The shell can shoot from top to bottom ???
        2. PPD
          +6
          22 January 2023 11: 09
          Do you even know how many bridges and meanders are on the Moscow River?
          With skyscrapers along the waterfront?
        3. +5
          22 January 2023 14: 31
          What missiles from Ukraine can pass along the Moscow River?)
          1. -2
            22 January 2023 17: 54
            Quote: Arsen1
            What missiles from Ukraine can pass along the Moscow River?)

            The ones that the neighbors can supply
        4. 0
          23 January 2023 18: 40
          I came across a joke about construction epic fails: During the construction of the Empire State Building, the architect provided platforms for anti-aircraft guns, calculating their strength based on the weight of the guns subtracted from the encyclopedia. But then it turned out that the guns have a downward recoil, for which the overlap was not calculated.
          Quote: Cube123
          protect themselves from missiles that can pass along the bed of the Moscow River

          Then it would be logical to drag the "western" installation into a "flying saucer" that hangs under the bridge built along the river to Zhukov, and the "eastern" one somewhere in Kolomenskoye, there are just high-rise buildings with a good view of the river.
      2. 0
        28 February 2023 09: 47
        . But this is really different! After all, is it true?


        There is something "other" here. Moscow is the largest air hub. There are always civilian aircraft with passengers in the sky. And they do not have a friend or foe identification system. One mistake, hundreds of corpses.
    2. +6
      22 January 2023 05: 19
      Maybe the message is that the leadership does not trust the existing air defense system and, in this regard, arranges the last line of defense for itself.
      1. +9
        22 January 2023 06: 04
        Quote: YOUR
        Maybe the message is that the leadership does not trust the existing air defense system and, in this regard, arranges the last line of defense for itself.

        Or maybe everything is much simpler?
        For example, ours are preparing a strike on government buildings in Kyiv, and accordingly, in this case, they expect a response in Moscow? Here's to insurance! Well, if rockets fall on the residential buildings of Muscovites, well .... NWO ... Losses are inevitable, and NWO will write everything off .. The main thing is that the generals and those in power do not suffer! And the people? So ..............
        1. -2
          22 January 2023 06: 30
          Quote: your vsr 66-67
          Or maybe everything is much simpler?
          For example, ours are preparing a strike on government buildings in Kyiv

          There have already been such blows. The SBU building in Dnepropetrovsk. in Kharkiv, Ukrainians also reported strikes near the SBU building in Kyiv and Zelensky's office. It was after the sabotage on the Crimean bridge.
          After our rocket was knocked out and it fell on a residential building, with numerous casualties, for some reason it seems to me that strikes in cities will be stopped. They look to the west to see how they perceive it.
          Rest
          Quote: your vsr 66-67
          Well, if rockets fall on the residential buildings of Muscovites, well .... NWO ... Losses are inevitable, and NWO will write everything off .. The main thing is that the generals and those in power do not suffer! And the people? So ..........

          The appearance of missiles over Moscow is already nonsense. And it doesn’t matter where the rocket will fall into the building of the Ministry of Defense or into a residential building. The appearance of an air defense missile system on the roof of the building of the Ministry of Defense is nothing more than stupid propaganda of alleged work
        2. +20
          22 January 2023 10: 19
          Quote: your vsr 66-67
          The main thing is that the generals and those in power do not suffer! And the people? So ..............

          We sell an apartment in Moscow.
          Very close to metro.
          Quiet courtyard, nice neighbors.
          There is a concierge and air defense.

          Move in and live.
          Security is top notch!
          If you just want to,
          We also have BMPs.

          An exclusive that you will not find.
          Never, no one.
          For the eleventh month
          Our glorious NWO!

          Real estate agency "MO and partners"
          1. +7
            22 January 2023 11: 08
            It's hard for you to do it laughing good "" "
          2. +5
            22 January 2023 18: 04
            Quote: Hyperion
            Quote: your vsr 66-67
            The main thing is that the generals and those in power do not suffer! And the people? So ..............

            We sell an apartment in Moscow.
            Very close to metro.
            Quiet courtyard, nice neighbors.
            There is a concierge and air defense.

            Move in and live.
            Security is top notch!
            If you just want to,
            We also have BMPs.

            An exclusive that you will not find.
            Never, no one.
            For the eleventh month
            Our glorious NWO!

            Real estate agency "MO and partners"

            Perfect!!! Taking off my hat!!! hi
      2. +5
        22 January 2023 06: 23
        Quote: YOUR
        Maybe the message is that the leadership does not trust the existing air defense system and, in this regard, arranges the last line of defense for itself.

        Or, like everywhere else, nothing has been done since Soviet times.
      3. +3
        22 January 2023 11: 21
        Quote: YOUR
        Maybe the message is that the leadership does not trust the existing air defense system

        Kakly threatened with a massive strike with the help of new drones like our Geranium, so we are preparing for this.
      4. +6
        22 January 2023 13: 47
        Quote: YOUR
        Maybe the message is that the leadership does not trust the existing air defense system and, in this regard, arranges the last line of defense for itself.

        Finally, we have found that red line that the country's leadership has been drawing all the time. Or not yet?
    3. +3
      22 January 2023 07: 00
      No. The meaning is in the last phrase about the violinist. Nice. Suddenly. Non-trivial. For someone. The rest is empty chewing gum of words. Roman, stop. Already at the bottom. Don't dig further. Order kills.
      1. -3
        22 January 2023 12: 17
        Join.
        Shallow Roman. Obviously shrinking. with every article.
        It is a pity.
    4. +14
      22 January 2023 08: 08
      The message of the article is not clear

      The point is that they install a Kamaz truck on the roof, or they could just have a shell module without a truck.
    5. 0
      23 January 2023 08: 21
      1. So any appearance of air defense over buildings is a message that air defense is full of holes.
      2. Why is there no covert mobile air defense that can be placed on the roof of any house?
      3. They could safely put the TOR air defense system, he doesn’t have guns on ships, because they put it without a chassis.
      4. If they decide to shoot down from cannons and fire at residential buildings by accident with 200, as a result of shelling, the enemy will raise a fuss.
      5. Is there a pine bending complex in service that they weren’t installed if the enemy is an UAV?
      1. +2
        23 January 2023 10: 53
        Quote: insafufa
        3. They could safely put the TOR air defense system, he doesn’t have guns on ships, because they put it without a chassis.

        The ships were equipped with Tor-M2KM land autonomous combat modules, which Kupol, EMNIP, made for export.

        The mass of this module is about 20 tons.
        1. +1
          23 January 2023 11: 54
          Quote: Alexey RA
          The mass of this module is about 20 tons.

          So the shell weighs all 27 tons
  3. +6
    22 January 2023 04: 18
    The appearance of the Shells on the roofs is not associated with the reflection of an air threat

    This was done openly, in order to scare and demonstrate to society that everything is serious. To perceive the war as something close and now concerns everyone

    PR people don't eat their bread in vain
    1. +4
      22 January 2023 04: 27
      Well, you write just like S.S. Tarmashev:
      To remember..
    2. +15
      22 January 2023 05: 00
      Quote: Santa Fe

      -2
      The appearance of the Shells on the roofs is not associated with the reflection of an air threat

      And wearing body armor is not associated with protection from bullets and shrapnel ... wassat
      1. +2
        22 January 2023 05: 22
        And wearing body armor is not associated with protection from bullets and shrapnel ...

        If you put it on just like that, going to a cafe in the center of Moscow during the day, then this is due to paranoia

        And the shells on the roofs are not body armor, they look impressive. And they are for a different purpose. About which I wrote a little higher
        1. +9
          22 January 2023 07: 44
          I agree with you. What is one shell for all of Moscow? Little more than nothing.
          If the Armed Forces of Ukraine launch something like this towards Moscow, I wonder who will be to blame for the fact that the same Strizh falls on a residential building and smashes it?

          The one who built the air defense in such a way that some kind of Swift will fly to Moscow and will not be found, will not be shot down will be to blame.
          Another answer to the question is who will be to blame, and who is to blame for the fact that these missiles flew to Engels? Has anyone heard of withdrawals, investigations ............. silence. It is not worth rocking the boat at such a period of our lives.
          1. KCA
            -1
            22 January 2023 09: 51
            The swift will not fly, the air defense / missile defense ring on the "concrete" around Moscow is not separate complexes, but the overlap of all zones, the Shells are installed from light UAVs, which can be launched from the region and from Moscow itself, GPS, however, is in the center near they will not work, but there is also manual control
            1. 0
              22 January 2023 22: 44
              That's how many Ukrainians we have here! Well, after all, KSA writes everything correctly! No, the minuses are beating him !!! It should be embarrassing!!
          2. +2
            22 January 2023 14: 30
            Quote: YOUR
            The one who built the air defense in such a way that some kind of Swift will fly to Moscow and will not be found, will not be shot down will be to blame.

            Guilty will be, as always, extreme, and not really guilty. If it already flies, then I doubt that they will shoot down here.
        2. +8
          22 January 2023 09: 52
          Quote: Santa Fe
          If you put it on just like that, walking during the day in the cafe

          Here the royal wolf Rogozin didn’t even put on a bulletproof vest in a cafe. Now he repents!
          1. 0
            24 January 2023 09: 23
            You pulled out and cut off my phrase

            Rogozin was wounded not in the center of Moscow
    3. +11
      22 January 2023 08: 20
      Now my son, who graduated from college, will serve in a combat unit in the center of Moscow. In the personal file there will be a record of a member of the CBO
    4. +4
      22 January 2023 10: 04
      Quote: Santa Fe
      This was done openly, in order to scare and demonstrate to society that everything is serious. To perceive the war as something close and now concerns everyone
      It's easier to put a dummy then
    5. +6
      22 January 2023 10: 23
      Quote: Santa Fe
      The appearance of the Shells on the roofs is not associated with the reflection of an air threat

      This was done openly, in order to scare and demonstrate to society that everything is serious. To perceive the war as something close and now concerns everyone

      PR people don't eat their bread in vain

      Their memory is like that of a goldfish, they do not need to do what they most actively accused their enemy of. wassat
  4. +12
    22 January 2023 04: 24
    You have to understand the logic of the military.
    The possible death of the civilian population from the fall of the downed apparatus will be the subject of accusation of the Ukrainian Armed Forces of Ukraine and the highest political leadership of "inhumanity and violation of the rules of warfare"

    But when such devices get into the territory of the Kremlin, the Presidential Administration, the houses of the Duma or the Government, the Moscow Region,
    DOMA-2 will rebound to the military with huge troubles with the demotion of high bosses and the court-martial for lower-ranking bosses and other appointed switchmen.
    Therefore, it is better to insure the most significant houses and objects, as well as ourselves, with a reasonable cost of equipment, than to deploy a semi-circle along the outskirts of the city with five times the consumption of air defense systems.
    1. +6
      22 January 2023 04: 57
      But when such devices get into the territory of the Kremlin, the Presidential Administration, the houses of the Duma or the Government, the Moscow Region,


      They became too vulnerable after NATO approached the borders of Russia
      Isn't it time to move Russian government institutions deep into the Ural Mountains or Siberia?
      St. Petersburg is now within a strike distance of an F-16 fighter based in the Baltic States ... with Finland joining NATO, it will be a paradise for NATO strike aircraft.
      1. -5
        22 January 2023 05: 59
        Here, build cities there, with your liberal accomplices, as Mr. Shoigu promised, then they will move ... lol
      2. +1
        22 January 2023 19: 37
        Quote: Lech from Android.
        But when such devices get into the territory of the Kremlin, the Presidential Administration, the houses of the Duma or the Government, the Moscow Region,


        They became too vulnerable after NATO approached the borders of Russia
        Isn't it time to move Russian government institutions deep into the Ural Mountains or Siberia?
        St. Petersburg is now within a strike distance of an F-16 fighter based in the Baltic States ... with Finland joining NATO, it will be a paradise for NATO strike aircraft.

        To Siberia? In the Ural mountains? As for me, it's better to go to continental Yakutia! There are now frosts down to -60 .. Nothing Amersky will fly! laughing
    2. +6
      22 January 2023 14: 35
      That is, Ukraine is to blame in the Dnieper because it shot down, and in Moscow Ukraine will be to blame because it launched it?) It turns out smoothly for you, is your last name by any chance Konashenkov?
  5. -8
    22 January 2023 05: 01
    Well, you need to start somewhere, especially since the author’s friends from the United States supply missiles of such a good range, and the VSUK has a dream - to shoot at Moscow.
    1. +4
      22 January 2023 05: 15
      A ballistic missile that has flown in Moscow - do not shoot down, but it will fall where it was aimed.
      1. +1
        22 January 2023 07: 01
        Quote: NG inform
        A ballistic missile that has flown in Moscow - do not shoot down, but it will fall where it was aimed.

        For ballistic - it is fashionable to get an answer in the form of fifty nuclear ones.
  6. +17
    22 January 2023 05: 16
    And now, apparently, our generals at the Ministry of Defense received some information that a weapon had appeared in Ukraine that could easily fly to Moscow, or something else from the same opera, but our generals were clearly worried. Apparently, they believe that the Ministry of Defense is the most important goal for the Armed Forces of Ukraine.
    When I heard this news about the installation of air defense systems on roofs, I think it's a fake, someone's bad joke. It turned out to be serious. Well, one can only say, "it was the eleventh month of the war," ah, not exactly ... NWO. We fought. With such generals, we will go far. But what to do, there are no others? "What is the pop, such is the parish." What durable houses in the USSR did that ... yes. They will say, in 41, also on the roofs, they installed air defense systems. Well, then the German was standing 25 kilometers from Moscow, not like now. They remembered about the Olympics. Yes, so that in the USSR, during the Olympics-80, for example, “Shilka”, they dragged them onto the roofs, it couldn’t be, because it couldn’t be, although there was tension, they entered Afghanistan. Yes, what are we talking about, RF not the USSR. But how bravo they reported ..The level of potential of the anti-missile defense system of Moscow and the Central Industrial Region is sufficient to provide protection against missile weapons of a potential enemy, said Colonel Andrei Cheburin, commander of the missile defense division of the First Air Defense and Missile Defense (Special Purpose) Army of the Russian Aerospace Forces.
    “The modernization of the missile defense system is ongoing. There is a modernization of our pride - the locator, new fire weapons are being developed, ”
    and further .... According to A. Cheburin, "the current missile defense system will not become obsolete in the coming decades."
    He noted that all officers of the formation that provides anti-missile defense of Moscow and the Central Industrial Region undergo psychological training, at least once a year they undergo psychological testing .... Wow, everything is in the best possible way. Soon it will be so ...
  7. -12
    22 January 2023 05: 23
    The author of the article is an interesting person and seems to write correctly, putting all the risks on the shelves.
    But just not by the time such articles are now, I threw a shiver - there will be foam, do not forget about it.
    Do you think only adequate people here on the forum?
    1. +8
      22 January 2023 07: 11
      At the same time, we will correct the demography in Siberia and the Far East !!! good
      Grandfather told how the residents of the capital “draped” at 41. “Some stood in lines at the military registration and enlistment offices, stayed overnight in workshops, were on duty on the roofs, others “draped”. Cars, carts, carts, prams and sleds were used to carry furniture, scrub, trunks. One Moscow was preparing to fight - the other fled.
  8. -2
    22 January 2023 05: 45
    But it doesn’t seem that this is a photo montage, the boom of a truck crane is 20-25 m, and the maximum lifting weight is about 20-25 tons
  9. +8
    22 January 2023 05: 57
    Quote: Yuri Martynenko
    But it’s just not the time for such articles now

    Yes, yes, how the NATO forces will inflict a blow on Moscow or St. Petersburg with the hands of the Ukronazis will be just in time.
    The war took on the character of a positional confrontation ... and there is nothing worse than horror without end ... when it all ends is completely incomprehensible. request The goals of the NWO are too half-hearted and blurred.
    1. +2
      22 January 2023 07: 04
      The sooner it will be, the sooner they will wake up there and understand that they need to fight, and not play their own with pacification.
  10. +1
    22 January 2023 06: 47
    They will definitely send you, don’t go to a fortune teller, and only a guarantee of a retaliatory strike can hold back. And on personalities.
  11. +17
    22 January 2023 06: 59
    I wonder who will be to blame?

    Strange, but what is not clear to the author? Lavrov said everything clearly:
    “Ukrainian air defense, contrary to all the laws of warfare, all norms of international law, is located in residential areas and this was the reason that an air defense missile eventually hit this house.”

    On this resource, it was repeatedly voiced that for Ukraine this is a war, so they violate its laws. And we have NWO, I did not find international laws of NWO anywhere on the net request
  12. -5
    22 January 2023 07: 08
    And in the State Duma, in general, everything related to the placement of air defense systems on the roofs of Moscow was declared fake.

    If the Shells were placed on the roofs almost in the center of Moscow, then where will the downed UAVs, spent missiles and shells fall? On the heads of Muscovites?
    I know about the "scattered" love for Muscovites, but not to the extent that they would replicate dill fakes on a popular network resource.
    1. +1
      22 January 2023 07: 12
      If the Shells were placed on the roofs almost in the center of Moscow, then where will the downed UAVs, spent missiles and shells fall? On the heads of Muscovites?

      Do you think on the heads of the generals from the Moscow Region? So it looks like the headless are sitting there, they can’t even think about it.
  13. Des
    -4
    22 January 2023 07: 37
    From the article:
    “In general, this story with the hoisting of the “Shell” on the roofs smells of haste, if not panic.
    No matter how hard you try, Moscow will be below, and downed rockets will fall on Moscow houses.
    In general, the prospects for Muscovites are not very good.
    ... "Shells" will drop missiles at Moscow - this is not the best thing that could happen.
    I count on it very much. I really would not like to see the Dnieper in Moscow.
    If the Armed Forces of Ukraine launch something like this towards Moscow, I wonder who will be to blame for the fact that the same Strizh falls on a residential building and smashes it? "
    An interesting article for analyzing the state of a person, his mood and motives for such a presentation of information))). Direct refrain clear. For me, if there is a danger, then such a decision is justified (placement on the air defense roof). And what will bring down the "Strizh", "Shell" or a lighter air defense system over the territory of the city, it no longer matters. So you need to intercept earlier. I think they are working on it.
  14. -1
    22 January 2023 07: 51
    The Shell module can be installed permanently. And it weighs far from thirty tons. Thirty tons is together with the chassis. Not otherwise, the author thinks that they put Kamaz on the roofs. Judging by the fact that no one noticed this in the comments, they are the same “specialists”.
    1. +4
      22 January 2023 10: 26
      Quote from DeadPahom
      The Shell module can be installed permanently. And it weighs far from thirty tons. Thirty tons is together with the chassis. Not otherwise, the author thinks that they put Kamaz on the roofs. Judging by the fact that no one noticed this in the comments, they are the same “specialists”.

      So the photographs show that they put Kamaz. lol
    2. -5
      22 January 2023 21: 30
      Quote from DeadPahom
      Not otherwise, the author thinks that they put Kamaz on the roofs.

      The author does not think, he has no time to think. He needs to write articles. And about artillery, and about the Su-35, and about the T-14, and about the Shell on the roof ...
  15. +2
    22 January 2023 08: 02
    Stalin's skyscrapers were built with the calculation of the location of air defense systems on them, why they don’t put it incomprehensibly
  16. +9
    22 January 2023 08: 03
    The Tor-2MK air defense system is just designed for installation on roofs!
    The design of this complex provides for the possibility of placing it at the request of the customer on any automobile chassis, semi-trailer, trailer, railway platforms of the appropriate carrying capacity, as well as small-tonnage vessels or use in a stationary version on the roofs of buildings and structures. This allows you to significantly expand the range of application of the Tor-M2KM air defense system up to protection against air terrorists of stadiums during major international sporting events.
  17. -4
    22 January 2023 08: 04
    But what about military doctrine? What needs to be done to activate the Strategic Missile Forces? As I understand it, Kremlin drones are nonsense?
  18. +3
    22 January 2023 08: 04
    There is never a lot of air defense, it is very difficult to argue with this statement.

    There was an article on VO that shahid mopeds are cheap and effective and will soon be used by the Armed Forces of Ukraine, so we need to prepare now, and not wait. The fact that the Defense Ministry installs air defense on the roofs is correct, although of course, together with the KAMAZ, it is not buzzing. But we don’t have other air defense systems for roofs, sorry.
  19. Eug
    +4
    22 January 2023 08: 12
    First, the weight of the Shell
    up to 30 tons and, accordingly, the load on the roof of the building is in a calm state, so to speak, in statics. And when launching missiles, the load will increase significantly, and, although it will be short-term, it may exceed something. And the launch of the entire charged package can cause vibrations in the structure of the entire building (even taking into account the launch order and the fact that the chassis is designed for such a launch), and this can again lead to bad consequences...
    1. KCA
      +3
      22 January 2023 09: 58
      Well, these are rockets, not anti-aircraft guns, they even installed recoilless guns on motorcycles, and nothing, they didn’t tip over, and the rocket is also recoilless, both ends are knocked out at the container
  20. +3
    22 January 2023 08: 17
    Quote: Nikolaevich I
    The Tor-2MK air defense system is just designed for installation on roofs!

    The shell can also be removed from the chassis and work autonomously. He has his own generator, plus it can be powered from external sources. Unlike Thor, it has cannon weapons, so it is preferable to use it in the city. Weighs not thirty tons, fifteen maximum.
  21. +1
    22 January 2023 08: 25
    although of course, together with KAMAZ, there is no buzzing. But we don’t have other air defense systems for roofs, sorry.

    With what other KamAZ? Has everyone gone crazy together? Did you personally see how KAMAZ was lifted onto the roof? Combat module maybe? For a moment, it is not tightly welded to the chassis and can be removed.
  22. +9
    22 January 2023 08: 29
    Novel! Here is the question you asked:
    If the Armed Forces of Ukraine launch something like this towards Moscow, I wonder who will be to blame for the fact that the same Strizh falls on a residential building and smashes it?

    I am more than sure that you already know the answer.
    In turn, I will express my own opinion.
    I will blame the one who, for a long time, has not “started” the NWO, when sane people suggested from the first days to mobilize and finish.
    It will soon be a year since we continue to fight against the Nazi scum that flocked to Ukraine at the call of the Kyiv regime, turning this once flourishing republic of the Soviet Union into a stronghold of the most vile reptiles, for whom Anglo-Saxon interests are more precious than Slavic unity.
    Even today, the Russian Defense Ministry, headed by the minister and the General Staff, does not have a clear plan for achieving victory. Yes, that's right - VICTORIES! Because defeat for Russia (and not only for it) is like death. All this reasoning about the possibilities and prospects is simply sickened. It is so ridiculous that the other side does not take it seriously. He comes out of bile, rages with all his might and ... does not believe in the victory of Russian weapons.
    What we do not doubt is the strength of the spirit of those glorious fighters who took up arms and strive to save THEIR MOTHERLAND from the horrors that this fascist gang brings us. Honor and low bow.
    Arguments about the benefits of air defense systems on the roofs of buildings in Moscow can have different conclusions, but I understand only one thing: some still like the situation in which the death of Moscow will mean the death of Russia ... But didn’t we cultivate this city too carefully and furiously , while emptying the periphery? Who has created and continues to create the center of gravity, "swollen" from various "exclusives"? What are the prospects for SIBERIA and the FAR EAST with an abundance of energy resources? Or are these “Shoigin” plans and fairy tales about new cities just another “bone” for the electorate that has spat on its position?
    Here you, Roman, successfully titled the article: Fiddler on the roof and in the "Shell"...
    But today, it is much more important for us not only WHAT and HOW LOUD the “first violin” plays in the Kremlin, but also WHO and HOW CLEARLY hears it in the world ...
    hi
    1. -1
      22 January 2023 09: 56
      sane people suggested from the first days to mobilize and finish.

      I'm embarrassed to ask, what kind of VUS do you have? What prevented "from the first days" to sign up as a volunteer and restore order in Ukraine? Lack of common sense or excessive gravitational pull of the couch?
      1. +2
        22 January 2023 22: 36
        I know that you won’t read it - there is no bell, but you can’t keep silent either.
        Yuri Vasilyevich is a very old man, so take it easy! And in general - show respect for the commentators, do not get personal. I recommend you apologize.
        1. +1
          23 January 2023 09: 11
          There was no rudeness in my message.

          And the position of a person who proposes to mobilize (that is, forcibly, without asking, send to war with the risk of injury or death) someone else, others, since he himself has a "good reason" seems to me doubtful. The elderly person probably has children, grandchildren - are they at the front, in this case? Did he manage to "correctly" educate them, since he himself is not able to stand under a gun?

          PS By the way, I'm not a young man myself, if so.
  23. +3
    22 January 2023 08: 41
    No, all the same, what a clever Sergei Kuzhugetovich. After all, he had long proposed moving the capital to Siberia. It is unlikely that anything will reach Krasnoyarsk from Ukraine.
  24. +8
    22 January 2023 08: 58
    Quote: ROSS 42
    Haven't we cultivated this city too carefully and furiously, while devastating the periphery?

    I agree wholeheartedly. Humans and banks. There has been no production for a long time, there seem to be training centers - the same MAI or Baumanka - but they are almost meaningless, because those miserable remnants (from the USSR) of aviation and space production capacities are far from Moscow and graduates from a "warm" place will not go to Siberia, but they will try to become the next "effective" or dump them to the west.
    I will say sedition - Russia will not suffer from an attack on Moscow ...
    1. +3
      22 January 2023 09: 34
      And I fully support it too. In addition to museums, ancient temples and an armory with a diamond fund, there is nothing there.
  25. +1
    22 January 2023 09: 43
    In my opinion, it is complete nonsense to write about the hoisting of the ship's Shell M! It is lighter than Pantsir on a KAMAZ chassis! But in order to put the ship's Shell, a foundation will be needed and, of course, during additional construction work, the weight will probably be no less than the mobile version. And of course the time spent on the necessary work.
  26. +7
    22 January 2023 09: 54
    Vbsheto yesterday I read that the DUMA declared this news a fake.

    So now either the news is fake, or a thought ...
  27. +3
    22 January 2023 10: 03
    Judging by the photo, by the way, the shell was put not on the Soviet building, but on the building, which was completed in the region of 2014-15.
  28. 0
    22 January 2023 10: 20
    They put it - and they do it right. You need to be ready for everything. And where the downed rocket will fall - God only knows. Most of them should be shot down in Moscow and neighboring regions. If something slips through, you will have to shoot down already over the city.
    And if we talk about every little thing that mishandled Cossacks can launch directly from the territory of Moscow - that’s exactly what the air defense near Moscow will not be able to shoot down, here we need personal protection for each potential target of attack.
  29. PPD
    +9
    22 January 2023 10: 41
    This is not a solution, this is absolutely not weak such a fright.
    What UAVs are you going to defend against? From toys launched from Andreevskaya embankment with Neskuchny garden?
    Yes, a grenade thrown from such a unit will damage the building severely ..
    But the fallen missile of the complex itself, even if the UAV is hit ....
    Southwestern, Leninsky Prospekt, Shabolovka and further down the list.
    And UAVs like Tu will probably be launched from the Sparrow Hills? fool
    There it doesn’t matter if they shoot down or not, everything will collapse down.
    Moscow's air defense is gone?
    Removed would not disgrace.
    1. Alf
      +2
      22 January 2023 22: 25
      Quote: PPD
      Removed would not disgrace.

      It’s scary ... It’s not going to fall on a van on the front line, but on a loved one ... And Skabeeva and others like her, their name is legion, will be able to explain to the electorate ...
  30. +3
    22 January 2023 10: 51
    If the Armed Forces of Ukraine launch something like this towards Moscow, I wonder who's to blamethat the same "Swift" will fall on a residential building and smash it?

    The APU will definitely be to blame, don’t go to the grandmother !!! good wassat
    We can, they can't, the law of the jungle - whoever is stronger is right laughing winked
  31. +11
    22 January 2023 10: 57
    Quote: YOUR
    It is not worth rocking the boat at such a period of our lives.

    If our boat is not rocked, it will soon sink, as the sailors say, "on an even keel." Does it suit you? And many are not.
  32. +8
    22 January 2023 11: 39
    Do they know about this in the Ministry of Defense? Definitely yes. They cannot fail to know and understand the possible consequences of such shooting. But apparently, protecting ourselves, loved ones, is a more important task for our generals. Which is also generally understandable.
    The life of the generals has nothing to do with it - the last frontier of air defense is being created to protect the Moscow Kremlin, because if it flies there, it is hard to imagine more humiliating consequences, the whole world will laugh. sad
    1. Alf
      +1
      22 January 2023 22: 26
      Quote: Radikal
      the whole world will laugh.

      The world will laugh, but the main people in the West will understand that already "everything", you can do anything ...
  33. +5
    22 January 2023 11: 59
    A photo for the freaks who write about KAMAZ on the roof. A photo before removing the combat module is available in the article. Anticipating meaningless remarks, I will immediately write that the Shell consists of three modules: a tower module, a control module and a power module. The photo shows the process of removing the control module. The remaining modules have already been removed. Stop writing nonsense already.
  34. +3
    22 January 2023 13: 14
    It was also possible to put the cruiser Gorshkov with all the trunks on the roof
    They will not spend on weapon development, we will put cruisers on wheels and let them go into battle.
  35. +8
    22 January 2023 13: 21
    I won't argue about efficiency. The question is different. Ghouls can fire at Belgorod, "red lines" do not apply to the population, but Moscow is behind us. It is necessary to relocate everyone, starting with the guarantor and ending with the pseudo-assistant of the deputy, to the Belgorod region. To feel the situation in their own skin, and not from the office.
  36. +3
    22 January 2023 13: 38
    Who would have thought at the beginning of their own that air defense would be installed on rooftops in Moscow? what next? dig trenches outside the Moscow Ring Road ?? Moreover, the descendants of t3 t 4 will soon be in dill.
  37. +1
    22 January 2023 13: 59
    Quote: ROSS 42
    Novel! Here is the question you asked:
    If the Armed Forces of Ukraine launch something like this towards Moscow, I wonder who will be to blame for the fact that the same Strizh falls on a residential building and smashes it?

    I am more than sure that you already know the answer.
    In turn, I will express my own opinion.
    I will blame the one who, for a long time, has not “started” the NWO, when sane people suggested from the first days to mobilize and finish.
    It will soon be a year since we continue to fight against the Nazi scum that flocked to Ukraine at the call of the Kyiv regime, turning this once flourishing republic of the Soviet Union into a stronghold of the most vile reptiles, for whom Anglo-Saxon interests are more precious than Slavic unity.
    Even today, the Russian Defense Ministry, headed by the minister and the General Staff, does not have a clear plan for achieving victory. Yes, that's right - VICTORIES! Because defeat for Russia (and not only for it) is like death. All this reasoning about the possibilities and prospects is simply sickened. It is so ridiculous that the other side does not take it seriously. He comes out of bile, rages with all his might and ... does not believe in the victory of Russian weapons.
    What we do not doubt is the strength of the spirit of those glorious fighters who took up arms and strive to save THEIR MOTHERLAND from the horrors that this fascist gang brings us. Honor and low bow.
    Arguments about the benefits of air defense systems on the roofs of buildings in Moscow can have different conclusions, but I understand only one thing: some still like the situation in which the death of Moscow will mean the death of Russia ... But didn’t we cultivate this city too carefully and furiously , while emptying the periphery? Who has created and continues to create the center of gravity, "swollen" from various "exclusives"? What are the prospects for SIBERIA and the FAR EAST with an abundance of energy resources? Or are these “Shoigin” plans and fairy tales about new cities just another “bone” for the electorate that has spat on its position?
    Here you, Roman, successfully titled the article: Fiddler on the roof and in the "Shell"...
    But today, it is much more important for us not only WHAT and HOW LOUD the “first violin” plays in the Kremlin, but also WHO and HOW CLEARLY hears it in the world ...
    hi

    I agree, +++++.
  38. +4
    22 January 2023 14: 21
    I consider this idea with air defense on a building in the center of Moscow a pure masquerade, far from real military science. It seems that the main purpose of this is purely informational to whip up excitement and fear! What was it for? Do we have a bare desert from the borders of Ukraine to the walls of the Kremlin? And it would not be better to put this shell on the roof of a high-rise building in Belgorod, Kursk, Bryansk, DONETSK in the end !!! Our authorities have already recorded the entire Russian territory from Svatovo to the Primkadye in the gray zone of the NVO with the corresponding expectations and consequences.
    1. -4
      22 January 2023 14: 37
      Imagine the situation. The intelligence services received information about an impending terrorist attack against government buildings in Moscow using small-sized civilian UAVs (freely sold in stores, the radius is small, you can even launch from a neighboring yard). Your actions? Put the Shell in Donetsk?
      1. +5
        22 January 2023 15: 39
        To begin with, it is necessary to introduce a complete ban on the use of any aircraft in Moscow and the Moscow region, as has already been done by the way in some regions. Secondly, the shell will not save you from the word AT ALL from a racing drone with an adhesive tape screwed on. Well, if the Ukrainians again launch a huge carcass like a swift that will have to be beaten over their heads and Muscovites, then it will simply be a shame and another proof that the entire space from Moscow to Ukraine is a walking field for any enemy aircraft. Then it would be just right to close the airspace for airlines because the military has no control over unidentified flying objects that can inadvertently shoot down a plane with a hundred people on takeoff or landing.
        1. -1
          22 January 2023 16: 16
          Well, they introduced a ban on flights of civilian drones. After that, you can calm down and sleep peacefully? Yes, the number of false targets will decrease, but this will not make it safer. As for the Swifts, they need to overcome the layered air defense system before reaching the Defense Ministry building. As a last line of defense, these Shells will not be superfluous, but I do not think that they are installed specifically against this type of UAV.
          1. 0
            24 January 2023 01: 00
            Quote from DeadPahom
            Imagine a situation ... with the use of small-sized civilian UAVs (freely sold in stores, the radius is small, you can even launch from a neighboring yard)

            Do you propose to shoot down quadrics and crafts from the Children's World using the Shell in a dense city with busy traffic?
      2. +1
        22 January 2023 19: 03
        Quote from DeadPahom
        Your actions?

        1.ZU-23-2 with "special shells" ...; 2. Anti-aircraft gun installations (ZPU); 3. Drones (for example, quadrocopters ...) with "net throwers" ...
  39. +4
    22 January 2023 14: 45
    If the shell fires cannons at a low-flying drone, where will the shells hit, given that they will initially fly almost horizontally?
    1. +3
      22 January 2023 16: 38
      If the shells fly at an angle, it will not be better. Any shooting over residential areas is cherevata. Especially when the population is not familiar with the actions on the signal "Air Raid!".

      https://www.techinsider.ru/weapon/640813-kuda-devayutsya-puli-vypushchennye-v-nebo-iz-ognestrelnogo-oruzhiya/
  40. 0
    22 January 2023 14: 48
    The author is handsome: they don’t do it - it’s bad, they do it - it’s also bad. Here he wrote about the factories.
    1. Alf
      +1
      22 January 2023 22: 36
      Quote: Blackgrifon
      The author is handsome: they don’t do it - it’s bad, they do it - it’s also bad.

      This is not the author of a handsome man, this is our government "handsome", he really does not know what to do next, everything comes out through ..pu.
  41. +4
    22 January 2023 15: 21
    "who will be to blame and who will be to blame" - everything goes according to plan - Peskov will not let you lie
  42. +3
    22 January 2023 16: 30
    Something seems to me that Shell - the thing is too powerful against drones, like cannons on sparrows. Explain, please, yes or no.
  43. -1
    22 January 2023 17: 16
    Guys, now let's try to strain our brains and think. I know it hurts, but it's necessary. lol
    So, several days passed, and besides a few photos on the network and no. And this is in Moscow? Is it really so bad that everyone immediately ran out of cameras, smartphones and quadrocopters? belay
    Here's the best photo I've found:

    True, the metadata on this photo is cropped, but God bless them.
    What do we see there? It is correct that the object is supposedly on the northeast helipad.
    Who is too lazy to look at satellite photos, here is a screen:

    I don’t even ask how it was that about 12 tons of iron landed on a site designed for receiving a helicopter with 000 kg of take-off mass.
    I'm interested in something else, what kind of crane can I get there?
    Here is another photo.

    What kind of arrow should this be in order to reach out of the alley? what
  44. +1
    22 January 2023 17: 22
    On January 18, 2023, Sergey Lavrov, answering a question from journalists at a briefing about the events in Dnipro, said that “Ukrainian air defense, contrary to all the laws of warfare, all norms of international law, is located in residential areas and this was the reason that the air defense missile defense ended up in this house.”

    Another proof of the complete lack of professionalism of the Foreign Ministry.
    It is already obvious that there are no "norms of international law" in this regard; on the contrary, this is a fairly common practice throughout the world.
    Special thanks to Konashenkov, who the next day after the attack publicly stated that all the missiles hit where they were aimed.
    Maybe a special ministry is needed so that different officials do not contradict each other? And in general, would you make sure that at least obvious nonsense is not chatted? Like an air defense missile hitting a house or the fact that air defense on the roof is a fake?
  45. +1
    22 January 2023 17: 42
    On January 8, 2023, Sergey Lavrov, answering a question from journalists about the events in Dnipro at a briefing, said that “Ukrainian air defense, contrary to all laws of warfare, all norms of international law, is located in residential areas

    But I doubt that there are any "rules and laws of warfare" prohibiting the installation of air defense in the city. Nonsense. This is the choice of the most defending side, taking into account all the risks.
  46. +3
    22 January 2023 18: 08
    Well, if the building of the Moscow Region, and to hell with it, but the Spasskaya Tower will be a pity ((
  47. +4
    22 January 2023 19: 30
    Honestly. I'm very excited to see Mr. Volodin on the front line together with Ms. Matvienko. If they slap, it won't be a pity.
    1. Alf
      +2
      22 January 2023 22: 13
      Quote: bandabas
      If they slap, it won't be a pity.

      Yes, if on the Other side they find out about this couple, then they will generally forbid, under pain of immediate execution, to shoot at all in their direction. They are well aware that for Russia this couple will be more terrible than a vigorous loaf.
  48. Alf
    +1
    22 January 2023 22: 11
    If the Armed Forces of Ukraine launch something like this towards Moscow, I wonder who will be to blame for the fact that the same Strizh falls on a residential building and smashes it?

    The stump is clear - APU, who else ...
  49. +1
    22 January 2023 22: 19
    In 2011, the last RTV school (Military Institute of Radio Electronics) was closed in St. Petersburg. There is no field even in the European part. Here are the bosses and resr. overprotected himself. But Teply Stan and Kaluga are not a pity. Such is fate.
  50. 0
    22 January 2023 22: 23
    Everything from the author is logical, but (!):
    The Ukrainian side is to blame for the tragedy with the house in the Dnieper. She placed air defense systems in urban areas, she intercepted rockets over cities, from which they fell on residential buildings and killed civilians
    ??
  51. +1
    23 January 2023 00: 09
    I recommend that all experts take a map of Moscow and from the points where the Shells are located, shown in the photo, draw circles with a radius of 4 km. And see what kind of object is in the area where all the circles overlap. The third "Pantsir" is installed on the roof of "Petrovka, 38". The Kremlin is covered on all sides.
  52. +1
    23 January 2023 10: 29
    It won’t be superfluous, but it seems to me that the placement of such installations on the roof should have been carried out more secretly, and so, in fact, their locations are already in the public domain.
    1. +1
      23 January 2023 11: 14
      Can you give examples, at least 10 photos and not edited?
  53. 0
    23 January 2023 17: 34
    I don’t presume to judge the military feasibility of placing air defense missile systems on the roofs of houses, but it is clear that the Defense Ministry will not only cover itself for its beloved ones, because military air defense is not located on the command posts themselves, and air defense on the objects themselves, they are somewhat to the side, with mutual overlap of “circles” " defeats.
    Here, most likely, everyday issues are not at the forefront, because if you place this shed on the roof of a simple house, then you still need a whole range of measures: not to let onlookers in, i.e. security and defense (involvement of the Ministry of Internal Affairs), sometimes feeding the crew (yes, the complex needs people), sometimes washing them and giving them somewhere to rest (tent on the roof?), Well, and the question of power supply from the network - in the building of the Ministry of Defense (Ministry of Internal Affairs) in the general account , but if it’s in a residential building, then who will pay, the residents? (I know about generators, but you need fuel, diesel fuel and oils are needed in canisters on the soldiers; such a solution, as well as a reserve of two or three tons on the roof, maintenance regulations and etc). In general, placing objects in a controlled area is a reasonable solution, but it does not resolve the issues, and why is it necessary at all.
  54. 0
    6 March 2023 18: 54
    What raises questions is not the placement of anti-aircraft guns on the roofs, but the fact that our leadership categorically does not want to fight. Everything else is a consequence.