Reform of the Russian army: long-awaited or doomed

Please consider certain points in this text as sound criticism of the Ministry of Defense in accordance with the words: “... We need to hear those who do not hush up the existing problems, but seek to contribute to their solution” (V. V. Putin)

So ... Now many people will talk about the announced reform of the Russian army, we here with our comrade colonels thought well and also decided to insert our five rubles.

In general, everything voiced at a historical (without exaggeration) speech requires separate reflection, understanding, calculations and transcripts. And then it's time to express opinions.

So, it seems that our leadership has realized two very significant points:

- The Russian army in its current state is very far from ideal;

– clash with NATO in a non-nuclear conflict weapons perhaps, and in it the Russian army shines very little.

Therefore, the army simply needs to be reformed, once again tightening their belts, spending trillions of rubles on this, guessing that this money will go to its intended purpose, and will not be spent on exhibitions and parades.

What was announced:

- the return of the military districts of the Soviet structure, Moscow and Leningrad;
- Deployment of a special army corps in Karelia;
– In the Zaporozhye and Kherson regions of Russia there will be two new motorized rifle divisions;
- The Airborne Forces will receive an additional two airborne assault divisions;
- seven existing motorized rifle and tank brigades will be deployed in divisions;
- all brigades of the Marine Corps are deployed in the division;
- tank armies receive a mixed air division and an army brigade aviation from about 80 attack helicopters;
- Aerospace Forces will receive 8 new bomber regiments, one fighter aviation regiment;
- six new army aviation brigades were created;
- 8 new artillery divisions (including one or two large capacity);
- the age of conscription for military service will be 21 years, the limit - 30 years;
- the number of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation is assigned to one and a half million people (including 670 thousand contract soldiers).

Battalion tactical groups

Here immediately there is an understanding that all this is not for one year and not for five years. To create and deploy all these divisions and brigades will require a lot of things: people, equipment, money. Equipment still needs to be made, people need to be found and trained.

Training is a separate issue altogether, the SVO perfectly showed that BTG (battalion tactical groups) in the modern conditions of Ukraine and with the current state of communications in the Russian army (at the level of the 60s of the last century) and reinforced brigades are simply nothing, because BTGs assembled from the world piece by piece, with a zero level of interspecific interaction of troops, without modern intelligence and control, are simply not capable of solving problems in the modern theater of Ukraine.

Yes, one can recall the first and second Chechen wars, where it was the battalion and regimental groups that decided. And then you need to remember in what areas it happened. The area of ​​the Chechen Republic is 16 sq. km. The area of ​​the Kharkiv region, for example, is 171 sq. km. We add here all the other areas where the NWO is going, and we understand the depth of the gaping abyss into which BTGs fell, are falling and will fall.

Thank God, it dawned on someone there that such fronts should be held precisely by divisions. Moreover, not assembled on the knee, but completely mobilized and ready to perform combat missions.

Basically, what is BTG? This has already been discussed more than once - a tool that is just perfect for driving barmaley in the Syrian expanses. Suitable for pecking terrorists, but for full-fledged positional battles, to put it mildly, not quite suitable. In fact, a crutch for defective regiments.

Here you just need to take a tour of history, and even in Soviet times. It was then, and not under Serdyukov-Ivanov, that the Soviet army system "company - battalion - regiment - division - army" began to be killed. Many smart people from those times say today that the main reason was not the desire to “mow down” according to Western models, but the completely trivial desire of Soviet colonels to retire as generals. Still, a general will be much fatter than a colonel.

But the system, which had worked perfectly since the Great Patriotic War, did not allow to have so many generals. Everything was clear and understandable - the regiment commander was a colonel, the division commander was a major general.

Who, when and how came up with such a stellar idea with brigades, I can’t say for sure, but it was this person who quickly realized that potentially the brigade was commanded by ... a colonel or a brigadier general! Yes, somewhere a brigadier general is called a senior colonel, this is something intermediate between a colonel and a major general in many armies, but ours grasped the idea clearly: the main thing is the general!

And rushed. They began to churn out brigade regiments by reinforcing a motorized rifle regiment with a tank battalion, an artillery battalion, an air defense battalion, and so on. And here it is, the coveted general's position!

Major General, well, don’t introduce a senior colonel or a junior general, after all ...

And the most important thing began in 2007, when the Ministry of Defense, by the will of President Putin, received a new Minister of Defense, Anatoly Serdyukov. But the three-eagle State Councilor is half the battle. Serdyukov is a real civilian, and the demand from him is somewhat in the other direction. But the Chief of the General Staff Nikolai Makarov ...

Here Makarov, it seems to me, really hated the army. And as much harm as he did with the full approval of Serdyukov, probably no one has done in the entire history, starting with Tukhachevsky. But with Tukhachevsky, how it happened, and Makarov is alive and well to this day.

To be objective and fair, the Makarov-Serdyukov duo did a lot of useful things and innovations for the army. But all the useful things that they have done can in no way compensate for the harm they have done to the army.

The way military schools were thinned out, closing in batches, how the officer corps was reduced, and not where it was necessary, but lower - the generals all sat there. How civilian outsourcing came instead of logistics. What can I say, we all observed and will observe for a long time the results of this work in the Northern Military District, when there is no communication, no normal control, no sane coordination between the assembled units like a vinaigrette, just terrible chaos in the rear.

We will not say anything about the mobilization system, everyone saw everything with their own eyes: the mob system died that way 30 years ago, and the mobilization necromancy of the 2022 model put everything in its place.

Brigades

The idea was quite right: instead of large and really clumsy divisions (including cadre divisions), it seemed like more mobile brigades of constant readiness appeared. There was something reasonable in this, but: the divisional scheme was worked out by two world wars, and worked out clearly. The brigade system is a special matter, brigades cannot be used effectively everywhere, everything depends very much on the theater of operations and the enemy.

The mobility of the brigade is good when there is a need for it. In small regional conflicts such as Syria or Karabakh. If we are talking about the fact that today in the NMD zone a dead defensive stand is required or, conversely, offensive actions based solely on brute strike power over large spaces, this is a division.

The mobility of the brigade is determined by its weakness. A motorized rifle brigade is essentially just a motorized rifle regiment, reinforced by another motorized rifle battalion, artillery, anti-aircraft and anti-tank battalions. That is, in fact, to fulfill the tasks of the old division today, three brigades are required. Two and a half. Moreover, they are in the hands of one command.

And management is also difficult. The brigade headquarters is expectedly inferior to the divisional headquarters, which is capable of working out more complex and more global tasks. The Americans, by the way, honed their ability to use brigades in small conflicts for a very long time, but when it came to a serious fight (Operation Desert Storm), the 7th US Army Corps of the divisional formation went into action. Yes, the divisions were of a two-brigade composition, but these were precisely the divisions, each consisting of two brigades, and not two brigades in some kind of operational subordination.

It is possible to assemble two brigades into one shock fist, but this does not make them a division. Issues of communication, control, coherence of headquarters and divisions.

This, at last, seems to be understood in Moscow. Therefore, they decided that yes, it was necessary to fight with the usual and prescribed blood scheme “company - battalion - regiment - division - army - front”.

And here is a full hello.

Reforming this level is not a matter of one year and not one trillion rubles, as already mentioned. Here it is worth recalling the example of Marshal Tukhachevsky, who gave birth to the idea of ​​mechanized corps, consisting of a thousand tanks each. And how these corps, left without control and supply, were destroyed in the first month of the war, proving their complete incapacity.

And then, in the conditions of the winter of 1941, tank brigades had to be hastily formed in order to be able to maneuver in the face of an acute shortage of tanks. But after 1941 came 1944, and in Germany and other countries already included tank armies, well-oiled tools for the destruction of everything in their path. The raids of the armies of Lelyushenko and Rybalko have become an adornment of any textbook, both tactics and history. And these armies were already quite well supplied and managed, which means they could win. And they won.

And note that the path "division - corps - brigade - division - army" took almost 8 years. And 5 of them are military.

Today we have a slightly different alignment. If we want to see these divisions created from scratch and deployed from brigades, all this requires hundreds of tanks and self-propelled guns. Airplanes and helicopters. Also hundreds. And for planes, helicopters and tanks, crews are needed. Trained and trained. The question arises - where to get them? Mobilization? Not seriously. You can mobilize / buy privates and sergeants, with pilots everything will be very difficult. Will the remnants of flight schools (Krasnodar and Syzran) be able to satisfy the need for flight crews? It's kind of doubtful, to be honest.

Approximately the same is with the rest of the divisions that are planned to be formed and created. They will need a huge number of experienced officers and sergeants, with whom there is still a shortage. And there will be more shortages. And this despite the fact that now there is an outflow of personnel from the army, from all branches of the military.

To many, the situation with the NMD today resembles the first Chechen campaign precisely in that it was necessary to assemble combat-ready units throughout Russia. And all the same, we had to arrange mobilization, and as a result we have a complete hodgepodge of army units, "BARS", the Chechen National Guard, "musicians" and units of the LDNR. And all the same problems with management and communication.

Reformers

Here is the cost of the very army that Defense Minister Sergei Ivanov began to prepare at the beginning of the XNUMXs. The one that was before Serdyukov, and under which the destruction of the army began. It was under Ivanov's rule that the myth that the army could be manned by contractors died.

In general, the activities of all our ministers can and should be discussed separately, because each contributed to what the whole world sees today, looking towards the Russian army. But they see little that is pleasant for us and a lot that is encouraging for themselves. The Russian army has ceased to be a scarecrow on a global scale, you can not be afraid of it. To the greatest regret.

But who will return the disbanded schools? Factories for the production and repair of equipment that are sold even now, when there is a war?

Minister Ivanov reduced the army to "sufficient for defense" one million people, Ivanov began to reduce the officer corps by reducing military universities. That is, gentlemen, the generals both sat in their chairs and remained sitting, but there were fewer lieutenants at times. But the problems with military service, which were reduced to one year, went away, although this was a very controversial step.

Then there was the reign of Serdyukov. Yes, by a strange coincidence, in 2008 the army was able to solve the Georgian problem.

The army worked perfectly, but the whole catch was that the Russian military acted according to deployment plans that were developed almost under Defense Minister G.K. Zhukov. Since the scheme was working, it was required to get rid of it as soon as possible, with which Mr. Serdyukov coped more than successfully.

The number of officer positions was significantly reduced, from 350 thousand to 150. The institute of midshipmen and ensigns was abolished. In my opinion, this is one of the significant losses for the army, because ensigns are not only warehouses and canteens, but also signalmen, cryptographers, operators of various complex systems, gunsmiths and technicians. It was warrant officers and midshipmen who were the technical backbone on which the technical part of the army and fleet.

Yes, under Shoigu, they seemed to come to their senses, and the institute of ensigns was returned, but the ensigns themselves did not return in such volumes. That is, the army and navy have a huge shortage of specialists with a secondary technical profile of education. Techies. Which will be needed for new divisions. Where would you like to take them?

In general, according to the ideas of the reformers, ensigns were to be replaced by some specialists with a higher technical education, perhaps even civilians. However, for some reason, the "citizen" was not able to provide these specialists at the disposal of the army.

Approximately the same problems with personnel and funding began to be observed in the defense industry. And here Serdyukov's reforms backfired with a rushing mass of imported developments. French ships, thermal imagers, Austrian rifles, Italian armored vehicles and so on. "Why do when you can buy?"

Today, "Armata" was left without a radar, thermal imager, screens, electronics. And there is nowhere to buy all this, and there was not even a project of its own. And it won't be anymore.

And now they have continued what Serdyukov started, who simply played in corruption schemes, that is, he began to steal, as if he were not in himself. And so he would continue to be a minister, if not for corruption scandals.

So now they just continued Serdyukov's reforms. On the one hand, there are reforms of social issues for the military, an increase in monetary allowance, and housing. On the other hand, there was a ceremonial-ostentatious army that was slipping into the abyss of competitions and exhibitions. The mortgage army, which will now have to be treated for many problems.

One plus: those who did not want to serve from the beginning of the SVO together began to throw reports on the table to the authorities and flee from the army. The outcome was comparable to the flight of those who did not want to be mobilized from Russia, only these gentlemen fled from the army. And this outcome will also have to be compensated at any cost.

And on the whole, it can be stated that the creation of the “new Russian army”, which began in the mid-90s, failed miserably. And the creation of a professional and contract army capable of solving extremely limited combat missions of a counter-terrorist nature led to the fact that the army was unable to solve combat missions within the framework of the NMD.

And here is the reform

Not for one year. Here you can clearly see that this is for several years, if the leadership of the army will have these several years at all.

Cutting up the ZVO monster into the Leningrad and Moscow military districts is not fast. How many offices will need to be filled with generals... But what was created under the USSR turned out to be more reasonable and effective than the huge districts of Russian reality. Well, like the mechanized corps of Tukhachevsky in comparison with the tank brigades of 1942.

And we are not yet talking about the restructuring of all communication and control systems in the structure of the Ministry of Defense and the General Staff, caused by the emergence of two (two or two?) old new districts.

But I would like to say that the Karelian corps, two airborne assault divisions of the Airborne Forces, two divisions in new areas, the deployment of all marine brigades in a division, and so on, will simply require a breakthrough in equipment. Of course, those who get such fat government orders will be happy, but the question is: how long will the production of this equipment take? In conditions when T-90Ms go to the front instead of T-62s, this looks somewhat optimistic.

As far as this is possible - we will see in the very near future. But what was within the power of 20-30 years ago, today may simply be beyond the strength of the Russian industry. After all, we are talking about hundreds of tanks, guns, planes and helicopters, and our military industry cannot yet cope with the elementary release of shells.

The announced reform is a very necessary thing. But the huge problems that must be solved on the way to its implementation inspire fears that the Russian military-industrial complex, which is already working to break, which is a remnant of the destroyed Soviet military-industrial complex, will not survive. The creation of new divisions is to drive those not mobilized into the army, everything is much more complicated.

Comments

[YOUR]

Reforms reforms, reforms only result in deterioration in everything, not only in the army. Forestry was reformed, constant fires were removed, foresters were reformed, GOSTs were reformed ... solid palm sausages and milk appeared immediately, it is not clear from what, the army was reformed by the SVO showed what it had come to, and how cool the air defense was reformed, this is generally a masterpiece. And like Raikin's suit, everyone did their job perfectly. There are no complaints about the buttons being sewn tightly, but only the suit is crooked.

[Lech from Android.]

The novel has not yet touched upon the air defense reforms of our country, after which the Ukronazis calmly bombard our strategic aviation airfields with Soviet drones on a NATO tip.
All the same, the SVO well revealed and revealed all the real flaws, sores of the country's defense from mobilization to intelligence.
There will be enough work to eliminate them for many many years to come ... I just don’t know if our enemy in the person of the United States and NATO will give time to eliminate them ... because we need a modern army with Suvorovs and Kutuzovs now and not tomorrow.

[28st region]

You know how the reform in air defense went. The first thing that was reformed was the liquidation of the air defense armies, they were transferred to the districts already as one of the departments. Then Spotty, followed by Alkash, began to reduce the army. The distribution order comes to the district to cut 20 units with a total number of 20 thousand people. Only ground soldiers are sitting there, a tank regiment is more dear to them than an anti-aircraft missile brigade or a radio engineering battalion. And not thinking them under the knife. The entire Far East was cut down so that foreign airlines refused to fly through Russia. Russia has become a white spot in terms of radar tracking. Immediately began to restore. Naturally, not to the extent that it was, but at what altitudes do the planes of foreign companies fly? Mostly from 8 to 000 meters. So they put the radar in such a way that these heights were controlled along the international corridors.
Knowing where these radars are located, it is possible not only to conduct a Tu-141 UAV unnoticed, but a B-52 type bomber at altitudes of 5 m will go unnoticed.
Is anyone responsible for this devastation? Yes, everyone either lives in retirement in palaces, or further continues to "solve matters"

[Lech from Android.]

Quote: 28st region

Knowing where these radars are located, it is possible not only to conduct a Tu-141 UAV unnoticed, but a B-52 type bomber at altitudes of 5 m will go unnoticed.

After the second breakthrough of the Ukrainian drone to the strategists, it became clear to me that in our common air defense (Not objective) there are holes and gaps through which the enemy calmly penetrates into the country at low altitudes.
We are still lucky that the Ukronazis did not launch a massive attack on dozens of drones on strategic targets in our country (this may happen soon) ... this danger is real and has not yet been closed.

[28st region]

This became clear after the helicopters of the Armed Forces of Ukraine fired on and destroyed an oil storage facility in Belgorod.
Now it turns out what kind of debris and where they got
The UAV hit in, as they say, the administrative building. What administrative buildings can be in a military unit - headquarters, even barracks, but these are already residential, workshops are technical premises. The fire area is 120 square meters. m.. i.e. in theory, the headquarters burned out completely. The image losses of the country are simply wild, they lost the cruiser, lost the large landing ship, how many boats and small boats were lost in general, information only comes from our suprativniks. Daily shelling of the Belgorod region, Kursk, Voronezh.
Whoever bent their fingers there a year ago, I hope they experience it in their own skin in the NWO.

[Lech from Android.]

Belgorod is a front-line city and it will inevitably be shelled ... but Engelsk and Saratov are already remote places of Russia and the appearance of Ukrainian drones there is already a reason for unpleasant questions to the Russian Ministry of Defense ... what they do there and what they think.

[Gardamir]

Belgorod is a front-line city and it will inevitably come under fire.

How easy it is to get used to spitting in the face.

[Maxim Arkhipov]

It's not spitting. It's a face wash. And soon the feces are sprinkled.

[2112vda]

It will be quite "fun" when the arrivals for chem. combines, Engels is just flowers. As usual, our leadership is in a capricious mood. With SVO, everything is according to Chernomyrdin: "we wanted the best, it turned out as always." I have a simple question for the management, are you going to increase the production of Iskanders, where are you going to get diesels for the auxiliary power unit? After all, the Vladimir plant was "safely" destroyed, however, like a lot of other plants with mothballed mobilization lines.

[alexoff]

There are more than enough Iskander installations, the question is with missiles for them - if each of the one and a half hundred installations fired back once a week with a pair of missiles, then the dryers would sleep in an open field and in maternity hospitals, where it is difficult to cover them. Iskanders do not even need to be transported far, it seems to me that they can generally be transported on railway platforms and shoot. And there are either few missiles, or they save them for a rainy day (like there are still norms)

[Pilat2009]

Quote: 2112vda

It will be quite "fun" when the arrivals for chem. combines, Engels is just flowers. As usual, our leadership is in a capricious mood. With SVO, everything is according to Chernomyrdin: "we wanted the best, it turned out as always." I have a simple question for the management, are you going to increase the production of Iskanders, where are you going to get diesels for the auxiliary power unit? After all, the Vladimir plant was "safely" destroyed, however, like a lot of other plants with mothballed mobilization lines.

And I have a question, who will serve? Conscripts of 1 year of service? Who sleep at home? It's no secret that the population is declining in the country, and given the commissioned wounds, it's generally unclear who will serve. But first you need to somehow finish this SVO, the end of which not visible and which sucks the economy.

[YOUR]

Quote: Lech from Android.

Belgorod is a front-line city and it will inevitably be shelled

Our helicopters do not risk flying across the front line, an advanced method of shooting from a pitch, and these managed to fly a hundred kilometers and attack an object. Not just to attack, but to destroy and calmly escape.

[Civil]

1. Absolutely all reforms since 1985 have failed. Nothing has been successfully reformed.
2. In these army reforms, the first thought is where and on what the cut will be. Who prepares chairs for their positions?

[paul3390]

It depends on whose point of view the failures .. For the goal of all types of reforms without exception was only the acquisition of dough. And only this. And in this situation - they are very successful ..

For some reason, our ghouls-refomators believed that as soon as a person, naturally approximate, was given property, he would immediately begin to manage it extremely effectively. Well, well, a freebie - it hasn’t brought anyone good yet. In order for the owner to become effective, he must earn and build this property with his own hands. And only so. In addition, the main goal of the capitalist is to have as much money as possible at the same time with as little labor as possible, moreover, as quickly as possible. Thus - having received the plant in its paws, it is most expedient to sell it immediately for metal, and to arrange a business center in the buildings. And do not try to produce something there effectively ..

[vadivm59]

to confirm your words. an example from my recent pre-retirement work. worked at one defense industry enterprise. chemical industry enterprise associated with acids and other products of a very aggressive property. the old general director went from the foreman of the site, after the institute, to the general director. -e, we survived. But it's time to retire. All the same, the 90th decade. And now they send us an appointee to the position of director, he travels with his retinue around the plant and admires the rumor "HOW MUCH STAINLESS STEEL IS HERE!". He admires, and after all, he was not even embarrassed by people, he was already counting the profits from its implementation. well, not for a long time "rules", they left him. and this is a state-owned enterprise.

[Kornily]

the old general director went from the foreman of the site, after the institute, to the general director. he stood a mountain for the enterprise

The problem with such directors, or as they used to be called "red directors", is that they are good specialists but bad managers in market conditions.
Therefore, in our modern times, the positions of Chief Designers have been separated from the General Directors. Everyone must do their job.

[vlad106]

Quote: Civil

1. Absolutely all reforms since 1985 have failed...

The way it is! humpbacked (that he took loot in envelopes, which was brought to the Central Committee from Stavropol by the masson Androp), recruited in the west, with his wife Rakhel Maksudovna, and began the active destruction of the SA and the Soviet Union itself according to the plans of the State Department.
How can a corrupt official be appointed the head of the country, that Andropov-Fleckenstein, being the head of state security, did not know what kind of sticky hands the "bear-envelope" had?

[Alexey Lantukh]

As a local resident: helicopters of the Armed Forces of Ukraine flew up to the oil depot along the valley of the Seversky Donets River. Earth radars simply could not or could not detect them everywhere. It needed a high-altitude radar. Flying or on a high tower. This is science for Engels too.

[vovochkarzhevsky]

Sending helicopters over the front line is just mediocre to lose them. It's just that you first need to look into the tactics of army aviation, and then offer ideas.

[28st region]

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

Just first you need to look into the tactics of army aviation,

Do you know her? Share

[vovochkarzhevsky]

For God's sake, I'm sorry. Study.
https://files.mai.ru/site/unit/institute-of-military-science/tvvs/index_ogl.html?referer=https%3A%2F%2Fyandex.ru%2Fclck%2Fjsredir%3Ffrom%3Dyandex.ru%3Bsearch%2F%3Bweb%3B%3B

[28st region]

Those. found a book and without even reading it decided that you know everything

[vovochkarzhevsky]

Yes, you are just a master of deduction, induction and what else.

[YOUR]

A book about aviation, about airplanes, and very superficial. At least look at what you post.

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

Sending helicopters over the front line is just mediocre to lose them.

Those. downed pilots don't need to rely on search and rescue helicopters. Well, it's mediocre to lose helicopters by sending them over the front line. Just a single incident brought you helicopters over enemy territory.

[vovochkarzhevsky]

A book about aviation, about airplanes, and very superficial. At least look at what you post.

Just looked through. And it’s not the materials of the course of tactics to spread, all the more so since a simple source, as it turned out, was beyond our strength.

Those. downed pilots don't need to rely on search and rescue helicopters. Well, it's mediocre to lose helicopters by sending them over the front line. Just a single incident brought you helicopters over enemy territory.

This is already called cheating. What is the side of the PSO to setting the task of destroying targets in tactical depth for the crews of combat helicopters?

[YOUR]

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

It's already called bullshit

This is called to give an example of the use of helicopters deep in enemy territory.

[Derbes19]

If not the front line, then where to send helicopters? Fly over your territory?)

[vovochkarzhevsky]

You should first complete a school spelling course before discussing army aviation tactics.
But still, I will answer, just like that, to work while being over their territories at a distance of at least 2 km to the front line. The task of combat helicopters is the direct support of the combat operations of the ground forces. That is, the primary task is the destruction of targets identified during these very hostilities.
Since only helicopters can work on an enemy who has already come into combat contact.

[28st region]

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

The task of combat helicopters is the direct support of the combat operations of the ground forces.

For example, landing and landing cover.

[vovochkarzhevsky]

Well, what do you know about helicopter landings, tell me, what if you tell me something new? And then I started my service in the 11th ODShBr, where can I.

[28st region]

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

Well, what do you know about helicopter landings, tell me, what if you tell me something new?

I know that they land in the depths of enemy territory, and how you

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

And then I started my service in the 11th ODShBr

You can not know this by saying that

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

Sending helicopters over the front line is just mediocre to lose them.

[vovochkarzhevsky]

Firstly, not in depth, but in close tactical depth.
Secondly, this type of hostilities is carried out, either where the enemy does not have enough forces, in particular air defense, or, more often, is an integral part of much larger operations.
Thirdly, and most importantly, it was about the fact that a certain forum participant considers it wrong that COMBAT helicopters are not sent beyond the front line to destroy targets.

[28st region]

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

Thirdly, and most importantly, it was about the fact that a certain forum participant considers it wrong that COMBAT helicopters are not sent beyond the front line to destroy targets.

You have asserted and asserted that

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

Sending helicopters over the front line is just mediocre to lose them

Now it starts and not in the depths, but in the near tactical, yes, you can, but if the air defense is weak.
The main thing is that you argued that helicopters should not cross the front line.

[vovochkarzhevsky]

You will lie, it was originally about setting tasks for combat helicopters to destroy targets in tactical depth.
PS
This is the magical power of the internet. If you actually showed up in the squadron class and started rubbing something to the helicopter pilots about tactics, then you were simply ridiculed.
And on the Internet, hiding behind anonymity, you imagine that you are arguing on equal terms.
One of the reasons for the failure of the AVIA.RU forum, by the way. At the time of the opening of that resource there were many interesting people and experts in their field. But then shkolota came, and with it flooding and trolling. And the knowledgeable people fled.

[28st region]

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

You will lie, it was originally about setting tasks for combat helicopters to destroy targets in tactical depth.

What did I lie? I brought your words, and you renounce them.

[vovochkarzhevsky]

You lied that in response to my objections why it is impossible to send combat helicopters to destroy targets in tactical depth, you led helicopter landings without any understanding of how they are carried out.
Your job is to listen to the professionals, not to argue with them.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: vovochkarzhevsky

Sending helicopters over the front line is just mediocre to lose them. It's just that you first need to look into the tactics of army aviation, and then offer ideas.

Say it x o x l a m

[EFIM LYUBIN]

Lech from Android, you asked a rhetorical question - "what are they doing?". "Saw" the budget with corrupt officials and thieves-traitors Russian oligarchs. Supporters of Russia from abroad can clearly see this, because we are outside the system, and not inside like you.

[zenion]

Lech from Android. Unpleasant questions need to be asked to those who are sitting on top and ask him - why did this happen all of a sudden? Why did Stalin know, Churchill knew, Roosevelt knew what was being done, but the Russian Supreme did not know and did not want to know what was going on in the old, what was his interest in this?

[RoTTor]

It will never come across that from the present border of Ukraine to Moscow and the Kremlin is twice as close as to Engels.

[AdAstra]

Well, what are you pumping with us, "everything is according to plan" or are you in doubt?

[Sid2014]

Strategic mistakes, only the blind do not see them. Example 1. brought the matter to WAR. 2. As the president admitted, it was necessary to act earlier, in 2014. 3. Russia did not have a modern army, etc ...
Where is the confidence that today's actions are correct? After all, for victory there are few spells on TV that Victory will be ours! Time will tell! And modern Russia has never been in such danger as it is now. Only 1/2 of the population and 2/3 of the youth do not understand this!

[2 Level Advisor]

Quote: Sid2014

And modern Russia has never been in such danger as it is now.

and, for example, in the Second World War? it was cooler there and we didn’t have nuclear weapons .. so why was there NEVER such a danger?

[Plate]

Yes, people like to dramatize things. Either they really want to tickle their nerves, or they want to score pluses and likes on loud slogans.

[UAZ 452]

WWII and modern Russia? What are you talking about? That country had a different name. and MODERN Russia began in 1991 as the largest, but still only a fragment of that country. Now we are squabbling with the second largest fragment of the country that won the Second World War.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Level 2 Advisor

So why was there NEVER such a danger?

Because the raids on the airfields based on strategic nuclear weapons show that there will be no retaliatory action. A non-nuclear country quite successfully fights a nuclear power

[Medvedb]

Well, on Red Square, somehow the plane landed, so they always were.

[zenion]

He got out of the den, spread his wings and sat down in the clearing, such bears started up. When something takes off across the sea and ocean - everyone knows when it takes off, not in the taiga, no one sees, they want not to be seen.

[bayard]

Quote: Medvedb

Well, on Red Square, somehow the plane landed, so they always were.

And the day before that, all the trolleybus wires were removed there - so as not to be caught inadvertently when landing.

[vlad106]

Quote: bayard

Well, on Red Square, somehow the plane landed, so they always were.

Yah! Seriously filmed in a day?
So it was a planned and coordinated operation of the arrogant and humpbacked t ff ari ...
And the day before that, all the trolleybus wires were removed there - so as not to be caught inadvertently when landing.

[AG-76]

With such alignments (holes) in air defense, the matter may not be limited to single launches of the ancient T-141s. "Our Western non-partners" can supply the dill with a mass of modern drones and send them not to the twice attacked air base, but to where they are not expected ... And what could be there? Moscow, nuclear power plant, ... ?

[UAZ 452]

send not to the twice attacked air base, but to where they are not expected

Do you mean that after the first time in Engels, the enemy did not expect a second strike? So it means that after the second they do not wait for the third. And if they waited and prepared, then, in principle, they were not able to repel it. And then who will prevent the Armed Forces of Ukraine from inflicting a third blow, fourth, fifth on the same target? I don’t even know which option is worse for our Aerospace Forces and Air Defense. Either they are absolutely untrainable, or they drag the service to the limit of relaxation, or we don’t have any air defense, only brave reports and beautiful pictures at exhibitions.

[vlad106]

Quote: UAZ 452

Either they are absolutely untrainable, or they drag the service to the limit of relaxation, or we don’t have any air defense, only brave reports and beautiful pictures at exhibitions.

Well, our super-talented menister loves this kind of thing...

No wonder he invented biathlon
In general, he likes to show off surrounded by "beauties"

[RoTTor]

The 10th Red Banner Air Defense Army of the country defended the entire European North and the most dangerous direction from the United States.
Air defense was generally in a black body, especially if half of the army was in the disadvantaged North. Nevertheless, everything was created with sweat and blood, and the army was the most combative.
Stupidly destroyed. Including an air defense division in Karelia and a corps in the Murmaeskor region.
Now, with the fact that Finland and Sweden are climbing into NATO with a drill, without this army there is a solid hole in the defense, and not a word about its reconstruction.
How many military aircraft are being built by Russia today and how many centuries the process of producing aircraft for the necessary air divisions will stretch.
With leaky air defense, which is concurrently led by an infantry layman-Armagandon, the remnants of the Soviet aviation industry - Tu-160, Tu-95, MiG-31, if they don’t destroy enemy missiles and drones, they will still soon disappear due to antiquity, yes they are counted.

[Lomaster]

As a deputy platoon commander of the starting battery of the S-200 air defense system, UrVO, 1987-1989. confirm. When our division, which was stationed in the forest near Nizhnyaya Salda, Sverdlovsk Region, took up a month-long combat duty, we ran 2-3 times day and night to the starting positions to uncover the launchers and bring them into combat position. And all due to the fact that the next B-52 flew up to the 1000 km border in front of the Kola Peninsula. And from it to us is even more than 1000 km. Such was the depth of the country's air defense radio-technical reconnaissance. Then the USSR. I will add that our complex hit at a distance of about 200-250 km and a ceiling of about 30 km. And our complexes were stuck in the Ural and Siberian forests like potatoes in a harvest year. Not a single plane could fly without RTV illumination. Alas, in the 90s our group of divisions was disbanded. I don’t even know how they protect the sky over the Urals now. And what they will protect in the event of a flight of drones is also unclear. And there is a strategic industrial and defense region of the whole country. UVZ in Nizhny Tagil (tanks), strategists (aircraft and missiles) in Salki, etc. It is terrible to think what will happen if we lose all this as a result of air attacks or sabotage.

[Mustached Kok]

Seeing a long and heated discussion just about the current state of air defense. And about the holes in our air defense. Including the example of Belgorod alone. A terrible thought came to my mind.
And suddenly there I already know about some of our holes, including holes in the Far East, the Caucasus and Central Asia. Maybe for a long time since the beginning of the NMD, they have been letting scouts to us at low altitude through these holes, and they regularly fly to us and conduct reconnaissance of inland areas and strategic objects. And we don't know yet. Because the air defense in the NVO zone already spends all its attention on the front (and even then, little comes out), and in other areas they try to keep track of at least large objects that, in principle, can be tracked (DRLO aircraft, satellites, etc.). But small reconnaissance drones, calmly, at night, conduct raids into inland territories from reconnaissance. And we don't even know about them.
I understand that this is more like paranoia. But what are the chances that this is getting closer and closer to reality.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Lech from Android.

The novel has not yet touched upon the air defense reforms of our country

Roman already has the whole article - a continuous cry of Yaroslavna. And if you add air defense as well, then there will be something like hysteria.
I agree with Roman's article, only he thickened the colors to the grotesque. After all, divisions will not be created from scratch. Is it possible to form two regiments of normal composition out of three brigades? Or not?
Regiments and divisions of the second, rear line, for the time being, can temporarily be armed with old equipment removed from conservation.

[Dart2027]

Quote: Krasnoyarsk

Roman already has the whole article - a continuous cry of Yaroslavna.

Guessed the author by name.

[2 Level Advisor]

and the personnel in this size and the officers for them, from what conservation to remove? and the resources to supply them?

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: 2 level advisor

and the personnel in this size and the officers for them, from what conservation to remove? and the resources to supply them?

But is it about the momentary formation of divisions?
All this will be extended in time. A large replenishment of officers, except for the VU, will give a SVO.
Moreover, not simple, but with combat experience.

[Sergej1972]

One brigade is much larger than a regiment. With an equal number of motorized rifle and tank battalions. Russian motorized rifle and tank brigades are very heavy compared to the brigades of other armies.

[Stas157]

Yes, by a strange coincidence, in 2008 the army was able to solve the Georgian problem.

They just started fighting.

They acted quickly. They did not wait until they mobilized and pumped Western weapons to the opposite side.

[Goto]

Prior to this, the West supplied them with weapons and so on. Just brought a little.

[Barberry25]

everything is much simpler, any system has problems and they pop up when the system begins to be actively used. The simplest example is the Kalashnikov assault rifle, which even after 75 years is changing ... So it is now

[AA17]

Dear VASH (Vladimir).
Your fair comment causes indescribable bitterness and hopeless longing. Why do I think so? Because I don’t see how the mistakes made will be corrected (and can they be considered mistakes?). Who will be entrusted with correcting these errors? The same people, with the complicity of which the above reforms were carried out in the Army? One has already been appointed to "steer" the military-industrial complex, with the participation of which at one time strategic enterprises were reduced by five times. Based on this, it would be logical to involve the same Serdyukov for new reforms in the Army.
Most importantly, all these reforms in the Army, in forestry, in healthcare, in pensions, in the Constitution, etc. took place with the tacit approval of one person who has been in power for more than 20 years.

[Per se.]

Quote: AA17

Most importantly, all these reforms in the Army, in forestry, in healthcare, in pensions, in the Constitution, etc. took place with the tacit approval of one person

Here the questions arise, how diametrically opposite actions turn out to be behind the right words. At the same time, some blame "bad boyars", about network ideological "lawyers" and "firewalls" who work out their bone, justifying "cunning moves", it makes no sense to talk about how to argue with their crafty demagoguery. The main question, which is the cause of all our problems, is how, being in capitalism, can one defeat the system of world capitalism, with an already established leader and owner? In the USSR, they only "made galoshes", and the revival of socialism is not in the plans of our leadership, but only a way out of world capitalist dependence can save Russia. So what do they want from us, declaring about the Satanism of the West and the ring of enemies around our borders?

Maybe everything is going according to a "cunning plan", but whose plan is it and for whom? Why was the issue with Ukraine not resolved in 2014, when there was an appeal for help from Yanukovych? Everything would be legal according to the norms of international law, even without the introduction of troops, they could recognize referendums in the Donbass and demand an all-Ukrainian under the "Russian Spring". No, just a puff of cheeks, Donbass was called "self-proclaimed republics", but they recognized Poroshenko, allowing, in the presence of legitimate Yanukovych and Azorov, those who organized and carried out the anti-constitutional coup to be legalized. For 8 whole years Russians were killed in the Donbass, were we preparing for the NWO? This is how it was necessary to prepare in order to get what Russia got ... It generally seems that with the right words, the wrong deeds will continue.

To Roman’s article, the problem is also in military logistics, how will we replenish tons of spent shells and cartridges, how will we replenish high-precision missiles with their almost piece production? This Strange Military Operation is not going to end quickly and victoriously, and this is much more costly than the war in Afghanistan, the operation in Chechnya.
So it turns out that either people's power and a planned economy will return to Russia, as a condition for victory over the collective satanic West (capitalism), or the country will be bled under beautiful words and handed over to this very satanic West, in which the souls of our oligarchs and other powers have long been.

[Alexey Dashkin]

A circus with Yanukovych, who didn’t even start ticking into the Crimea with Luhansk - but immediately from the country ...
showed him that very "legitimacy" - which in Ukraine, as it turned out, EVERYBODY was pissed))
omnipotent, yeah

[Per se.]

Quote: Alexey Dashkin

showed him that very "legitimacy" - which in Ukraine, as it turned out, EVERYBODY was pissed))

Not everyone, on January 24, 2019, the Obolonsky District Court of Kyiv recognized Yanukovych’s letter to Putin as an act of “high treason” and “complicity in the aggressive war” of Russia against Ukraine.

Yanukovych's appeal is a historical fact, the world saw this appeal at a meeting of the UN Security Council on March 3, 2014, when it was shown there by the Permanent Representative of the Russian Federation Vitaly Churkin. This statement was registered as an official UN document provided by the Russian delegation. The fact that President Yanukovych and Prime Minister Azarov were in Russia does not negate their legitimacy at that time.
President Putin requested emergency powers and they were granted to him, a grouping of Russian troops was drawn up, far exceeding the available forces of Ukraine, most importantly, they were not ready to resist Russia.

I repeat, it was not about Yanukovych, but about another person who then said - "just let them try." They tried, and we still pay them for the transit of ammonia and gas, and the surrender of Kherson coincided in a strange way with the unfreezing of Abramovich's billions in the West.

A strange military operation continues, with the death of civilians in the same Donetsk, from which, in February, it will be a year since our troops cannot push back the Bandera. So, some feats are performed at the front, while others in the rear are baking about their money, having their own selfish interests on the territory of Ukraine and in general in the now hostile West.

[alexoff]

Not true, there is no transit of ammonia! Ammonia was first promised for a grain deal (under which we had nothing), then for Kupyansk, then for the extraction of the Natsiks, then for Kherson. Well, the question is, why allow transit if, in exchange for promises of money, ours are ready to hand over people and territories?
And about 2014, I want to hint that Minsk-2 came after him, and then militia commanders began to die. Bednov was openly killed by our own, Mozgovoy was pressed and, like, the Ukrainian DRG killed, and then the rest went, where, like, it’s definitely a Ukrainian DRG. And here the questions are not about stupidity, but about direct betrayal. And after all, such scenarios are not provided for enemies for some reason, only for their own.

[Per se.]

Quote from alexoff

Not true, there is no transit of ammonia!

You are right, not at the moment. The ammonia pipeline from Tolyatti to Odessa was built in the late 1970s. Since February 24, after the start of the Russian NWO in Ukraine, transit was suspended. It was planned that ammonia would be supplied to Ukraine from Togliattiazot. Information about the resumption of ammonia supplies appeared in November after the announcement of the extension of the grain deal between Russia and Ukraine. The agreements between the two countries provide for the export of grain and fertilizers from the Black Sea ports.

But, in any case, the transit of ammonia was and was supposed to continue, there was nothing wrong with the fact that there was Nazi power in Ukraine, killing Russians in the Donbass.
About Minsk-2, as the same Merkel admitted, the West needed time to arm Ukraine and indoctrinate it. This has been fully utilized. What our guardians of "good will" have prepared for 8 years is a big question. If in 2014 even a military invasion would have been legal and successful, then by 2022, after the recognition of Nazi power, we have become aggressors for the whole world, just as the annexation of Crimea automatically became illegal. How could it be possible, having recognized the referendum in Crimea, not to immediately recognize the referendums in the Donbass?

The cleansing of all the heroes of Donbass, including Zakharchenko, also raises questions about who killed them and for what, as well as how much the oligarchs need the PEOPLE'S republics. For example, a stop signal for the capture of Mariupol, when this could be done by developing the offensive of the militia. Alas, again selfish interests of the oligarchs, money, Akhmetov's orders, protruding ears of Severstal and Vnesheconombank.

How then to believe in zeal for the common people, if our boys are bad guys, in fact, henpecked by their masters from the bourgeoisie?
The SVO may have begun in order to empty the arsenals of Russia, bring stocks from the USSR to critical ones, and surrender the main thing that scares the West, the Soviet nuclear missile potential. Naturally, in the name of peace, humanism and tolerance, as the main gesture of "good will." In fact, when there is nothing more to fight, everything will be wasted in Ukraine, only nuclear weapons will remain under the NATO army, well, do not ruin the world, your accounts in foreign banks, yachts and real estate, your children and wives, who live happily in London or New York? ... This will be the finale of that "chess game", the consistent destruction of Russia, as a great country, with such traitorous agents from Gorbachev and Yeltsin.

[skeptick2]

Quote: AA17

Who will be entrusted with correcting these errors? The same people, with the complicity of which the above reforms were carried out in the Army?

Partial remarks.
Let's try to understand the phrase from the article - "Here Makarov, it seems to me, really hated the army. And as much harm as he did with the full approval of Serdyukov ...".
It turns out that in the end Serdyukov was to blame? Wonderful. Move on. Let's try to comprehend one more thesis of the article - "And the most important thing began in 2007, when the Ministry of Defense, by the will of President Putin, received a new Minister of Defense, Anatoly Serdyukov."
Here, we will not dig to the point, until we find out who is ultimately to blame. For - even scary to think and assume.
But whatever you say, as in fact the same person ruled the country for a quarter of a century, he continues to rule. As he oversaw everything and everyone (including the military component), so he will oversee.
Now, therefore, it was he (and who else has such power and authority?) who gave the command to carry out military reform?
Then two questions arise.
Where is the guarantee that this time he will succeed? What will he guess now with the appointment of a new Minister of Defense and Chief of the General Staff? Or will the reform be carried out by the same persons? But Shoigu cannot be filmed now. For purely political reasons. For its removal by a machine gun will indicate that the war is not going on ... in short, everything is clear to everyone.
And why should the military reform be carried out not before the war (it's time to put this misname "SVO" out of use after the guarantor himself called the war a war in front of a million audience in Russian), but during the war? Only after a fried rooster pecked in the back seat?
Previously, the problems of the army were not visible to the guarantor? Was the Supreme Commander quite satisfied with the parades on Red Square, peppy reports and reports and victories in biathlons?

[zenion]

AA17. You might think that he came and sat down in a chair. He was put there by those who need him to sit there, otherwise there will be no gain. Puppet. It is somewhat reminiscent of a fairy tale about Pinocchio and the whole circus of puppets.

[vlad106]

M-yes!
He does not need to listen to these mediocre sociologists, tax specialists, and builders, but the opinion of ordinary people who really support the country, unlike pocket fillers and account openers in foreign banks

[Sumotori_380]

GOSTs were not a panacea either. At the time of their action, sausage was also not made from marbled beef. Jokes about toilet paper in doctor's sausage in Soviet times arose and for a reason. And the USSR imported palm oil quite millions of tons

[Alexey RA]

Shhh... don't disturb the adherents saint USSR from cities of a special and first category of supply, dream about tasty and healthy Soviet products. You also remember about the oil for 3-50, which crumbled under the knife, and when melted, it broke up into an incomprehensible emulsion and water.
And as for the Soviet GOSTs - just few people read them.

It is allowed to use the following when making boiled sausages, sausages, small sausages and meat loaves:
food phosphates in an amount of 0,3% by weight of raw materials (in terms of anhydrous);
sodium ascorbate or ascorbic acid in an amount of 50 g per 100 kg of raw material;
smoking preparations authorized by the USSR Ministry of Health;
(...)
dry cream with a fat content of 42% in the amount of 1 kg instead of 2,1 kg of cream from cow's milk with 20% fat content;
cow's whole milk powder with a fat content of 25% in the amount of 1 kg instead of 610 g of dry cream with a fat content of 42% or 1281 g of cream from cow's milk with 20% fat content;
egg powder in an amount of 274 g instead of 1 kg of melange or 1 kg (24 pcs.) of chicken eggs;
(...)
extracts of spices and garlic instead of natural ones;
(...)
protein stabilizer to the mass of raw materials in an amount of up to 5% - for boiled sausages, sausages and meat loaves of the first grade and up to 6% - for boiled sausages and meat loaves of the second grade;
(...)
the mass of beef, pork or lamb obtained in the processing of bone in saline in an amount of 4 kg instead of 1 kg of meat mass obtained by mechanical pressing, with a decrease in the mass of added water by 3 kg;
food plasma (serum) of blood of slaughtered animals to the mass of raw materials in the following quantities:
up to 5% in return for added water in the production of cooked sausages, sausages, sausages and meat bread of the highest grade;
up to 15% in return for added water in the production of boiled sausages, sausages, sausages and meat breads of the first and second grade;
up to 10% instead of 2% meat of veneered pork and 8% of water or 3% of meat of veneered beef (or lamb) and 7% of water
or up to 15% instead of 3% meat of veneered pork and 12% of water or 4% of meat of veneered beef (or lamb) and 11% of water;
(...)
Instead of beef, pork, lamb, it is allowed to use the joint protein stabilizer, beef or pork meat mass, or mutton, food plasma (serum) of blood, starch or wheat flour.

© GOST 23670-79

[frog]

Ek was thrown at you)))). Obviously, they didn’t read Soviet GOSTs))) It’s good that you didn’t voice other GOSTs, then dozens of minuses would go
And with oil ..... EMNIP, the oil was so-so (so to speak)) for 3 rubles 20 k. For three and a half it was still smeared)) .....

[Alexey RA]

Quote: frog

Ek was thrown at you)))). Obviously, they didn’t read Soviet GOSTs))) It’s good that you didn’t voice other GOSTs, then dozens of minuses would go

I haven’t given statistics on foreign economic activity of the USSR with data on purchases of palm oil.

[Foul skeptic]

I haven’t given statistics on foreign economic activity of the USSR with data on purchases of palm oil.

And what should she say to people? What palm oil is used in cooking and cosmetic industry?

[Blackgrifon]

Quote: Alexey RA

I haven’t given statistics on foreign economic activity of the USSR with data on purchases of palm oil.

But in vain! From this, some all-weeping people and whiners would have flared right up to Mars :)

[Vladimir Yurievich]

So let's, do not be shy, give statistics, but be sure to compare with similar imports in today's Russia, and even in comparable per capita terms. Do not forget today's specifications (according to GOSTs, few people work at all now, and it’s better not to say how all this is now observed and controlled) for meat and dairy products we will decipher here. You look, and "fans of the USSR" will decrease.
That's how everyone speaks language...

[Foul skeptic]

GOST 23670-79

AND? It always touches when people who are far from food production technology begin to talk about what they have read in GOSTs.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Nefarious skeptic

AND? It always touches when people who are far from food production technology begin to talk about what they have read in GOSTs.

Well, the topic starter connected the appearance solid palm sausages and milk, it is not clear from what just with the replacement of Soviet GOSTs with Russian ones. So I showed that the Soviet GOST allowed adding to sausages and sausages.

[Konstantin Vorontsov]

Would you turn on the kid stuff and think, is the Internet giving you the GOST text, your teacher? Judging by the current times, the reworking of history came from Volkogonov and Yakovlev and their instructors from the NSA and the CIA, when the Soviet archives were gutted and masses of "sensational documents" appeared ". This is still relevant in various areas. And now the message is simpler. In the USSR, the population was under 300 million. The birth rate was high and not just the birth rate, but healthy generations. Compare the level and list of diseases of that time and now. The population was not dying out then, if that. flu strains - SARS, bird and swine flu, etc., let's keep quiet about AIDS. These are all the results of no immunity from completely chemical grub and slop ecology. And it feels like they didn’t live at that time, but"expert" .... And therefore, be an expert of the time in which you live. There will be really incomparably more footcloths that you can put up and suck with relish with like-minded people.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Konstantin Vorontsov

Would you turn on the little substance and think, is the Internet giving you the GOST text, your teacher?

I will return your question to you - but about the current Russian GOST. Are the texts shown to us by the Internet?
If the "Code" gave distorted texts from \ official standards, it would get a lot of money.

Quote: Konstantin Vorontsov

There will be really incomparably more footcloths that you can put up and suck with relish with like-minded people.

Thank you for the advice - judging by the knowledge of the matter, from personal experience - but I prefer traditional dishes.

[Barberry25]

Sumotori 380, here to write that in the USSR, not everything was so unambiguously impossible .. they will peck .. You still remember about margarine ..

[zenion]

An order came - to switch to GOST. Enough already about that, this can lead to the fact that they will try on shackles. Either they frighten with plates, then bitch children bark, then the ruins speak. Give GOST!

[Foul skeptic]

Jokes about toilet paper in doctor's sausage in Soviet times arose and for a reason.

They did not arise from a great mind, and not because toilet paper was added to the sausage. Frozen briquette meat came in cardboard packaging, which stuck and froze to the meat, it was cut with knives. If you missed a piece of packaging somewhere, then yes, it could later be found in the finished product.

[zenion]

They cut badly. Now what they forgot to cut off rules the country.

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: YOUR

Reforms reforms, reforms as a result of only deterioration in everything, not only in the army

Do not forget who was at the head of all this mess for 20 years. Putin's "Board" showed that Russia does not have a state-level manager: smart, experienced, strong-willed, "economic", possessing to a certain extent the "gift" of foresight, capable of accepting extraordinary decisions ... Putin's guilt in the revealed disgrace is unconditional (!); but does he realize it? Hardly! Did he go out at least once to the people "with downcast eyes and a bashful blush on his cheeks"? No ! In his speeches, there are continuous "excuses" and omissions. Everyone abroad is to blame, but not him, his "sharashka" and the flawed model of management and functioning of the state that was established under him!

[AA17]

...but does he realize it? ... Everyone abroad is to blame, but not him, his "sharashka" ...

Dear Nikolaevich I (Vladimir). You have asked a very interesting question. The answer could also be:
"It's not Putin who burns the pots,
Putin is not imprisoned
Why do people scold him?
I personally do not understand.
He doesn’t hold the salary
Nurses and teachers.
He’s not knocking down pedestrians,
Having drunk up to this in the trash.
And he doesn’t extort money
At the hospital under the guise of a doctor.
He’s not even throwing a ridge
On Ilyich square.
And help everyone who suffers
He even wanted to, could not.
He just watches everything
An ordinary living demigod." (c)

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: AA17

He just watches everything
An ordinary living demigod. "

Yeaaa... ugh... ! God! Idol! He doesn’t clamp the salary ... he doesn’t knock down pedestrians ... but under him a system was created where non-humans who imagined themselves to be “masters of the country ... the cream of society” allow themselves, often with impunity, to commit all sorts of abominations and create lawlessness!

[AA17]

... but under him a system was created where non-humans, who imagined themselves to be "masters of the country ...

Dear Nikolaevich I (Vladimir).
+100. Top ten.

[Dismas]

You, you see, did not live in the 1990s, or were you "in office" in those days? The same "subhumans" who imagined themselves to be "masters" - from the region to the country, with military operations in the format of skirmishes in the n / a. Unless the "seven bankers" were cut ... partially.

[Alexey Kudashov]

Servants of the people imagined themselves to be masters .. in vain. All who gave criminal orders will be condemned by a public people's court.

[Catfish]

will be judged by the people's court.

The only pity is to live in this beautiful time

You won't have to, neither me nor you."

[alexoff]

This is the usual fate of a country of peripheral capitalism - a low standard of living, dependence on external players, corruption and stratification of society. The problem is that Putin is quite satisfied with this and he cannot and does not want to do anything about it

[Ulan.1812]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

Quote: YOUR

Reforms reforms, reforms as a result of only deterioration in everything, not only in the army

Do not forget who was at the head of all this mess for 20 years. Putin's "Board" showed that Russia does not have a state-level manager: smart, experienced, strong-willed, "economic", possessing to a certain extent the "gift" of foresight, capable of accepting extraordinary decisions ... Putin's guilt in the revealed disgrace is unconditional (!); but does he realize it? Hardly! Did he go out at least once to the people "with downcast eyes and a bashful blush on his cheeks"? No ! In his speeches, there are continuous "excuses" and omissions. Everyone abroad is to blame, but not him, his "sharashka" and the flawed model of management and functioning of the state that was established under him!

The notorious vertical of power. Which, at the very least, worked with a creak in peacetime and turned out to be completely incompetent during the war.

[Barberry25]

and at the same time, we regularly have a bunch of accidents drunk .. is Putin also to blame? Maybe everyone should just fulfill their duties as they should? Otherwise, remembering the story of "YaSashaMasterSport", our people have not learned to answer for themselves ... Putin is always to blame. but not them

[Deon59]

Due to regular accidents, the country is not standing on the edge of the abyss. Due to the fact that someone crossed the street in the wrong place, the country is not shelled and people do not die. Everything is very simple, the guarantor does not fulfill his duties and you can sing about anything, but he does not work .

[user]

Reforms reforms, reforms

Yes, somewhere a brigadier general is called a senior colonel, this is something intermediate between a colonel and a major general in many armies, but ours grasped the idea clearly: the main thing is the general!

And remember almost the first order of the new Minister of Defense Shoigu. He introduced the colonel general marshal's star on the shoulder straps. With this in the army, the whole convertible begins. I don’t even remember about tank biathlon, public relations, by the way, about one and a half million sets of uniforms (dissolved as if in a fog) and, most importantly, the person responsible for this became simply the main leader of the “paradise” group.

Why did I write all this? With the current composition and position in the command and control of the RF Armed Forces, this is like that goal, remember who forgot:
Our goal is COMMUNISM.
And I didn’t want to offend anyone, just who does not agree with such an opinion, please write adequate justifications why this is not so.

And most importantly - did the President of the Russian Federation understand what kind of document he signed? Not in the sense of necessary reforms, but what does it really mean?

[Uncle lee]

what was created under the USSR turned out to be more reasonable and effective

-it was not necessary to destroy everything Soviet!

The creation of new divisions is to drive those not mobilized into the army

And you won’t drive it, 500 won!

[2 Level Advisor]

Well, if more or less earnings are only in the army, they will be typed ..

[UAZ 452]

If there is no income anywhere except the army, then the economy is dead, and the army can be fed at most, and then starving. In principle, it will be impossible to arm something modern in this situation. And now, wars are not won by crowds of half-starved infantry armed with junk. Such an army is more dangerous for their country than for anyone else.

[certero]

The topic of the article is correct, but where is the money for all this?
However, I know exactly where.
My friend has a fairly wealthy person, both daughters study in the UK.
When they began to study there, the daughter of the former Minister of Defense Serdyukov also studied at the same school. Only, unlike my friend's daughters, she flew to the UK on her personal plane.
All these planes, yachts, real estate in Western countries, stocks, bonds, deposits in Western banks - this is the missing electronics, radio stations, communications and simple uniforms for our army. Until the perpetrators are held accountable, nothing will change.

[Ulan.1812]

Quote: certero

The topic of the article is correct, but where is the money for all this?
However, I know exactly where.
My friend has a fairly wealthy person, both daughters study in the UK.
When they began to study there, the daughter of the former Minister of Defense Serdyukov also studied at the same school. Only, unlike my friend's daughters, she flew to the UK on her personal plane.
All these planes, yachts, real estate in Western countries, stocks, bonds, deposits in Western banks - this is the missing electronics, radio stations, communications and simple uniforms for our army. Until the perpetrators are held accountable, nothing will change.

Responsibility will not be incur and nothing will change. Nepotism and nepotism rule everywhere, and not decency and professionalism.

[UAZ 452]

They will not bear responsibility and nothing will change everywhere nepotism and nepotism rules

It rules not only at the very top, but also permeates our entire society, except perhaps the very bottom. You somehow missed the phrase of your interlocutor:

My friend has a fairly wealthy person, both daughters study in the UK.

Serdyukov's daughter, who flew to an English school by plane, is an object of class hatred, and a friend who has two daughters studying there is a friend, albeit a wealthy one, but that's a completely different matter! But about anyone else whose heirs study in a private English school, a respected certero would be 100% sure that this is a thief and a bribe taker. This is how we live - everyone considers himself entitled to cheat a little, slightly redistribute the public for personal benefit, and the rest are thieves and embezzlers of public funds. Definitely!

[vlad106]

Quote: UAZ 452

about anyone else with whom heirs study in a private English school, a respected certero would be 100% sure that this is a thief and a bribe taker.

All those who dump abroad, have real estate there and accounts in foreign banks - that's all there are traitors, traitors and warugs

[zenion]

certero. And they are not to blame for this, but those who did not go to study as engineers, electronics engineers and other professions needed for defense. Who needs such a profession, after all, a man with a broom gets such a patch as a man with an airplane, tank, rocket and a lot of responsibility. She can’t even buy an apartment, but she is given to a peasant with a broom. It is interesting that beyond the cordon, a peasant with a broom is given an apartment.

[Vladimir Yurievich]

Serdyukov did not turn his thieves' affairs on his own, one conditional "Serdyukov" has at least five assistants (such small "serdyuchki"), each of which has its own pyramid of performers.
And there are only a few such big "Serdyukovs" (there are many of them, but you can count them), and there are very, very many such friends like yours with daughters (and money) in England (and not only), and these "daughters" of them (if you know what I mean) all together

Quote: certero

and there is that now missing electronics, radio stations, communications and a simple form for our army.

And how, tell me, is the culprit found?

[FRoman1984]

There was a similar post recently...
The army is built under the doctrine. Doctrine! Someone was going to fight in eastern Ukraine in 2020? Probably just one person. He already knew. Naturally, that Army of the 2020 model (conditionally) was not ready for such an intense war, because no tasks were set. The army is a living organism that develops according to the military doctrine of the state.
Now for the reform. The phrase - "not by number, but by skill" - is not about us. No conclusions have been drawn by the General Staff. To fight with blood, not with equipment - these are the conclusions of the General Staff.
Army aviation brigades ... With such a saturation of MANPADS, army aviation has a very limited use, work from a pitch-up, and does not have a significant impact on the course of the war.
About the financial component, equipment and personnel, the author correctly indicated where to get all this ??
Additional divisions of the Airborne Forces (assault divisions) - what is the current meaning of the Airborne Forces with aluminum armored vehicles (BMD-4, Sprut)? Light, mobile infantry. Which will be "not competitive" when meeting with a mechanized brigade with heavy weapons.
Not a word about IMPACT unmanned aircraft. Like a Reaper. This is the development of aviation, which will save thousands of soldiers' lives. But this is not our way.
Seven BAPs. On the Su-34. The same as with army aviation. As soon as our Su-34s entered the air defense zone for targeted work, they shot down 2 aircraft a day. If you don't give a damn about cars, then the lives of pilots are priceless.
The author wrote everything correctly about the financial component, equipment and personnel - where to get all this in the absence of everything.

[parma]

Quote: FRoman1984

There was a similar post recently...
The army is built under the doctrine. Doctrine! Someone was going to fight in eastern Ukraine in 2020? Probably just one person. He already knew. Naturally, that Army of the 2020 model (conditionally) was not ready for such an intense war, because no tasks were set. The army is a living organism that develops according to the military doctrine of the state.
Now for the reform. The phrase - "not by number, but by skill" - is not about us. No conclusions have been drawn by the General Staff. To fight with blood, not with equipment - these are the conclusions of the General Staff.
Army aviation brigades ... With such a saturation of MANPADS, army aviation has a very limited use, work from a pitch-up, and does not have a significant impact on the course of the war.
About the financial component, equipment and personnel, the author correctly indicated where to get all this ??
Additional divisions of the Airborne Forces (assault divisions) - what is the current meaning of the Airborne Forces with aluminum armored vehicles (BMD-4, Sprut)? Light, mobile infantry. Which will be "not competitive" when meeting with a mechanized brigade with heavy weapons.
Not a word about IMPACT unmanned aircraft. Like a Reaper. This is the development of aviation, which will save thousands of soldiers' lives. But this is not our way.
Seven BAPs. On the Su-34. The same as with army aviation. As soon as our Su-34s entered the air defense zone for targeted work, they shot down 2 aircraft a day. If you don't give a damn about cars, then the lives of pilots are priceless.
The author wrote everything correctly about the financial component, equipment and personnel - where to get all this in the absence of everything.

A logical question arises - did the tactics of the teams turn out to be inoperative due to the inferiority of the idea or because of the quality of execution? Before February 24.02, was there at least one brigade actually formed according to all the requirements in Russia? Well, those with a sufficient level of training and support, not at the "level of the 60s" as the author himself says? Was at least one brigade used precisely as a brigade, and not as an amorphous consolidated formation? ... the tactics of the brigades imply that this formation has, first of all, modern means of reconnaissance and communications, and we have problems with this ... for almost a quarter of a century we have been going one after one “rearmament programs”, the percentage of modern technology is growing and growing (well, talking heads were broadcasting on TV), but how it got to the point it turned out that it was all garbage ... so the leaders from the Moscow Region ran in with the idea of ​​\u90b\u72breturning everything back ... well, we don’t have conditional T-62M and support equipment per brigade to complete tasks, which means you need to act as a division on the first modifications of the T-XNUMX and T-XNUMX for the reserve ...
We decided to do everything as always - take a good idea and spoil it with execution. The same thing happened with the contract army, if we take the US Army in this regard, it turns out that most of the military personnel are sergeants (it’s not for nothing that there are almost more different sergeant ranks in the US Army than all the others), they are the professional infantry, they are the ones who are engaged in training of recruits (including officers in some aspects) and so on and so forth. How are we doing this?…

[Galleon]

Quote: parma

How are we doing this?…

According to reports, everything will be in openwork, as with drones. Money - mastered, so everything is there. Or will be, with a shift to the right.
The power of thieves will not be able to truly carry out such a reform. They will be held, like all the previous ones, in the same way.

[paul3390]

A logical question arises - did the tactics of the teams turn out to be inoperative due to the inferiority of the idea or because of the quality of execution?

Well - if you already remember the Second World War, then the Soviet tank units had exactly the brigade-corps organization. And nothing - somehow managed .. So - apparently, after all, the quality of performance .. Like everything in our country for 30 years - it is by no means up to par. And this stems from the very state-social ideology. In which the main goal in life is the acquisition of dough at any cost. And not at all the work that you are entrusted with. Capitalism-s..

And if we do not return Soviet power in all its aspects, we will definitely be a khan. Bourgeois - they will kill us with iron in such situations ..

[parma]

Quote: paul3390

A logical question arises - did the tactics of the teams turn out to be inoperative due to the inferiority of the idea or because of the quality of execution?

Well - if you already remember the Second World War, then the Soviet tank units had exactly the brigade-corps organization. And nothing - somehow managed .. So - apparently, after all, the quality of performance .. Like everything in our country for 30 years - it is by no means up to par. And this stems from the very state-social ideology. In which the main goal in life is the acquisition of dough at any cost. And not at all the work that you are entrusted with. Capitalism-s..

And if we do not return Soviet power in all its aspects, we will definitely be a khan. Bourgeois - they will kill us with iron in such situations ..

Classical capitalism and our "wild capitalism" are two different things... but even in our time they were able to create very successful products within the framework of private initiatives - as an example, the IT sector: 1C, VK, mail, Yandex, etc. quite successful world-class products, the creation privately without any participation of the state, which almost completely occupied the market not only of our country, but of almost the entire CIS ... it is a pity that with the advent of the state they obviously turned the wrong way ...

[Vladimir Yurievich]

How, interestingly, the successes of VK and Yandex (registered, by the way, in the Netherlands) could help strengthen Russia's defense capability? How many "world-class" thermal imagers are manufactured at Yandex factories per day, how many drones does the VK holding give the Russian army every day? All these private companies

Quote: parma

creation in a private manner without any participation of the state, which almost completely occupied the market not only of our country, but of almost the entire CIS

turned out to be successful only in terms of the profit of their shareholders (from advertising and paid services for network hamsters) and nothing more.
Capitalism is not "correct" or "wild", all this chatter is in favor of the poor. And do not repeat after the talking heads that, they say, we have a "wrong" capitalism. So we can agree to the fact that in 1605-1612, when the Poles in Rus' violated unrest, we had "wrong feudalism." Capital has only two states of aggregation, it either grows and gains strength, expanding, or weakens, shrinks and disappears, torn apart by more persistent competitors. Capitalist states, in their essence, do not differ from capitalist commercial organizations in anything other than the scale of operations. And in this context, we are talking about the level of competence of the "top management" of our God-saved bourgeois state. And this level has been causing concern for a long time ...

[vlad106]

Quote: paul3390

if we do not return Soviet power in all its aspects, we will definitely be a khan. Bourgeois - they will kill us with iron in such situations ..

The power of the Soviets, yes. We must return. Capitalism is destroying us.
The industry is practically destroyed. We are looking for drones in Iran, and missiles in North Korea.
There is no electronics nichrome,
Avionics all from Israel

[Alexey RA]

Quote: parma

A logical question arises - did the tactics of the teams turn out to be inoperative due to the inferiority of the idea or because of the quality of execution? Before February 24.02, was there at least one brigade actually formed according to all the requirements in Russia?

So this is the main question. All criticism of the brigade structure is based on the actions of the current brigades. Which have nothing to do with Makarov's brigades.
The Makarov brigade was planned as a unit of constant combat readiness, staffed by contract soldiers with a staffing of 90% - always a well-coordinated unit, ready for battle in full force. The preparation of the future reserve of conscripts was to be carried out in educational units and centers.
But due to opposition from the army and financiers, the brigades were filled with conscripts and part of the units were framed. And they received old-style under-divisions with all their problems.

[UAZ 452]

A logical question arises - did the tactics of the teams turn out to be inoperative due to the inferiority of the idea or because of the quality of execution?

There are other reasons at work here. I wrote about the stupid increase in the number of general posts, I will not repeat myself.
But in connection with this "reform" and the media activity around it, I remembered a conversation with a supplier I knew. He told me that a literate person can make money by expanding, reducing, liquidating, resubordinating anything. The main thing is to have movement. It is very difficult to make money on constancy, systematic development.
I mean, it's hard to say - brigades are better, or divisions, but I know for sure - in 10-20 years these divisions will again shake up into brigades, corps, legions ... Yes, into anything - the main thing is to ensure that muddy water, where the fish are so good. And the reform, the mass organizational staff, is an ideal example of this very "muddy water".

[Sergej1972]

Not so with sergeants. The US Army has a smaller percentage of officers and sergeants compared to our army. American sergeants are analogues not only of our sergeants, but also of our ensigns.

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: FRoman1984

The army is built under the doctrine. Doctrine! Someone was going to fight in eastern Ukraine in 2020? Probably just one person.

I agree with you very much. Therefore, all the words about the unpreparedness of the army for a conflict in Ukraine are broken against this iron argument!

[zenion]

FRoman1984. Even in the time of Khrushchev, although everything was already lousy, there were special factories that worked on special inventions for the army. It didn't go to factories, it went to maybe three or four factories that started working on the product. They prepared schemes, tools, etc., so that the manufacturing plants would receive a fully prepared instruction for the preparation of the application of the Ministry of Defense. Everything was done thoroughly and in a couple of years the product was ready to start using. It was nice to see on TV how the products made at our factory were held on Red Square. It is clear that such factories were destroyed in the first place. Then allied factories that manufactured finished products, so much so that the workers there "did not know" what they were making there. Now they don't even know what they make and why. We said - our product is our brand, our face. The old people said work - keep the style. So the figures made an application - it will be necessary to order overseas, and now we are making money for ourselves. Done, but the smell is unpleasant.

[vlad106]

Quote: zenion

Everything was done thoroughly and in a couple of years the product was ready to start using. It was nice to see on TV how the products made at our factory were held on Red Square.

M-yes! And we have been trying to bring Armata to mind for a dozen years ... And show it on Red Square during the parade

Quote: zenion

such factories were destroyed in the first place.

In general, the factories are no longer visible. And the military continues to finish ...
When will someone raise this issue?
It's time to ask the authorities: "WHO GIVED THE COMMAND FOR SHAREHOLDING, BANKRUPTCY OF ENTERPRISES?
and SPECIFICALLY ON THE DESTRUCTION OF ENTERPRISES..."

[ximkim]

Unreal.
What is in the Kremlin, what is the Moscow Region, there are people who suit Putin with personal qualities, and not professional ones.

[your vsr 66-67]

But who will return the disbanded schools? Plants for the production and repair of equipment that are sold even now, when

And how many aircraft and airfields built in Soviet times were destroyed?! I looked at a satellite map of the airfields of the Far East, the Amur Region and Transbaikalia and was horrified! Almost all airfields are abandoned and destroyed! This is how many years it takes to restore airfields and replenish them with aviation, and how much money for all this ?!
Pre-reformed ...

[vinschu]

A very optimistic post. The stated "Wishlist" of the Moscow Region is from the category: "Apple trees will bloom on Mars!"

[Vladimir_2U]

Today, "Armata" was left without a radar, thermal imager, screens, electronics. And there is nowhere to buy all this, and there was not even a project of its own.

This is pure nonsense! And thermal imagers and screens and electronics, which are none, have their own. And the radars were so domestic.

[2 Level Advisor]

The Uralvagonzavod Corporation, by order of the Ministry of Defense, is producing a pilot batch of new Armata tanks, which will take part in the Parade on May 9, 2015 on Red Square. Vyacheslav Khalitov, deputy general director of the Uralvagonzavod corporation, announced this.
According to Khalitov, the imported element base and optics are used in Russian tanks, but in a maximum of five years they will be replaced by domestic counterparts.
"Yes, we use (imported components). If we say so, it's optics and electronics," he said on the air of the Russian News Service radio station.
https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/1559781/amp

it's a pity that not everyone tries to check something before calling something nonsense .. although it is possible if the truth is not needed ...

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Level 2 Advisor

who will take part in the Parade on May 9, 2015

And what year is it now?

[alexoff]

Qualitatively new unmanned aerial vehicles as a result of the “transition of the Air Force to a new look” will amount to 40% of the total volume of Russian combat aviation. This was stated by the Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Air Force, Colonel-General Alexander Zelin.

"A number of intensive measures are planned to create a qualitatively new unmanned aerial vehicles, which will begin to enter the troops in 2011 and will be able to solve not only reconnaissance, but also a number of other combat missions currently being performed by manned army, front-line and long-range aviation" , - RIA Novosti quotes Zelin.

Speaking about the need for maneuverable drones, Zelin said that they would save the lives of pilots, as well as significantly save money. “A front-line aviation pilot of the first class is trained on average for 7-8 years, and the cost of his training is about $ 3,4 million, and the training of a sniper pilot takes 10-12 years and costs $ 7,82 million,” the general said. Colonel, adding that the annual training of a drone operator costs the state $200

[certero]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

This is pure nonsense! And thermal imagers and screens and electronics, which are none, have their own. And the radars were so domestic.

Surely you can back up your words with some facts? For example, who produces thermal imagers and radars for Almaty?
We produce for air defense ourselves, but a small one for a tank does not work.

[PROXOR]

I am not a very experienced comrade in the military-industrial complex, but it seems to me that SOSNA sighting systems with a thermal imaging channel are produced by domestic ones.

[2 Level Advisor]

With regard to all tanks, except for the Armata, you are right, with Pine ...

[UAZ 452]

And if you go down from the product to the element base, then it is also all domestic? The worst thing that can be - 99% localization. If the finished products are imported, then under the embargo there may be problems with the purchase - you need to change the supplier, use gray schemes. but if you make, say, the whole computer yourself, and buy only a processor for it (this is just an example), then when supplies stop, you not only cannot create a computer, but the whole industry producing the rest of the components stops, people lose their jobs, enterprises stop paying taxes... And there are significantly fewer manufacturers of processors (in this case, military and dual-use microcircuits) than computers and laptops, and it is much easier to track their products by cutting off supply channels. Or even deliberately "missing" a defective batch, which at the right time will turn the carriage (tank) into a pumpkin.

[alexoff]

Usually in the Russian Federation, even the most civilian manufacturers have a warehouse with the necessary sources for months of work, since even without sanctions, all logistics can break down. The military could buy years in advance, checking for loopholes on less than the latest chips. In general, for reference - a thin macbook costs three times cheaper than a "bumblebee", an engine for an orion and a bayraktar costs like a "krasnopol", it was possible to buy any imported electronics for a dozen CBOs and the "patriot" park would still be more expensive. The Americans have already hacked geraniums and other Iranian drones, American chips are worth

[fsb_buzuk]

The military has always purchased imported components for the product immediately for the entire service life (estimated).

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: certero

Surely you can back up your words with some facts?

Undoubtedly.

As Murakhovsky explained, so far the production of matrices on MCT films has been established within the framework of pilot production. What has already been produced, and those matrices that will appear in the coming years, will be enough to equip the "Armata" with infrared sights.

https://new.topru.org/armata-teplovizor-chux-chux/

According to the terms of reference of the Ministry of Industry and Trade, the Armata platform will receive Ka-band (26,5-40 GHz) radars based on an active phased antenna array (AFAR), made using low-temperature ceramic technology. A similar radar is used in the T-50 fighter

https://vpk.name/news/104063_na_tanki_armata_ustanovyat_radary_izgotovlennye_po_toi_zhe_tehnologii_chto_i_dlya_istrebitelei_t-50_izvestiya.html

Quote: certero

We produce for air defense ourselves, but a small one for a tank does not work.

Maybe give a fact about the foreign origin of the AFAR for Almaty and Su-57?

[zenion]

Of course, there is one on five tanks, for which everything was bought from Pinocchio.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: zenion

Of course, there is one on five tanks, for which everything was bought from Pinocchio.

You write fables...
Do you still buy thermal imagers for Sosny-U and Kalina in France?

[bya965]

Tuned in. I began to read, like on business, then Makarov-Serdyukov were very guilty and twitching began. The author simply should not have a bunch of information that he comments on and draws conclusions.

Armata is the one that annoyed you?

[mikh-korsakov]

I have a question. The enemy is successfully fighting us in brigades. The author criticizes such an organization, what is the difference.

[Moore]

Divisions are not created for the war with the Ukrainians. Combinations of BTGs of different composition successfully fight with them.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

The enemy is NOT successfully fighting with us. He, having a numerical superiority, does not win, cannot knock us out of his territory, and suffers much greater losses - what is the success here?

[parma]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

The enemy is NOT successfully fighting with us. He, having a numerical superiority, does not win, cannot knock us out of his territory, and suffers much greater losses - what is the success here?

The last six months of regrouping only from our side. Given the initial difference in potential, it’s difficult not to call this a success (so far a feast) ... but about losses ... there are only official figures from both sides, the rest is guesswork and everyone believes only what he wants

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: parma

The last six months of regrouping only on our part

And we still occupy many areas that we did not occupy on February 23, 2022

Quote: parma

Given the initial difference in potential, it is difficult not to call this a success (so far, a feast) ...

We are now talking not about our successes, but about the successes of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. You postulated that the Armed Forces of Ukraine are fighting successfully. So for the time being, it is the army of the Russian Federation that is successfully fighting, another question is that it is not fighting as successfully as expected. But the fact that the Russian army does not meet our expectations is not a priori the success of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

Quote: parma

and about losses ... there are only official figures from both sides,

There is also an understanding of the scale of mobilizations on both sides. And it tells you whose losses are greater

[parma]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

Quote: parma

The last six months of regrouping only on our part

And we still occupy many areas that we did not occupy on February 23, 2022

Quote: parma

Given the initial difference in potential, it is difficult not to call this a success (so far, a feast) ...

We are now talking not about our successes, but about the successes of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. You postulated that the Armed Forces of Ukraine are fighting successfully. So for the time being, it is the army of the Russian Federation that is successfully fighting, another question is that it is not fighting as successfully as expected. But the fact that the Russian army does not meet our expectations is not a priori the success of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

Quote: parma

and about losses ... there are only official figures from both sides,

There is also an understanding of the scale of mobilizations on both sides. And it tells you whose losses are greater

There is exactly the same understanding that many of these "squares" were practically not defended at the time the operation began. In the Kherson direction, the movement was exactly until the moment when the enemy gathered forces, which, accordingly, does not in any way speak about the effectiveness of the tactics used by each of the parties, since in fact it was practically a march without clashes (you can also recall the attempts to encircle Kharkov, when the famous checkpoint crossed passed from hand to hand several times and, as a result, was not behind us) ... in the areas of the main clashes like the DPR, for almost the entire period of the NMD, the “push-pull” mode has been going on, the Donets has not been safe from enemy cannon artillery strikes for a single day ...
Regarding the success of the actions of one side or another: success is the fulfillment of certain strategic and tactical goals. From those few bits of information, one gets the impression that the strategic successes of an offensive nature on our part ceased in the middle of summer (it can be conditionally tied to the arrival of "rocket cars"), then I did not observe any strategic successes (but I am a layman, I could be wrong) ...
Regarding the notorious "scale of mobilization" - there is no exact data on the scale of the enemy's mobilization, according to indirect signs, the mobilization resource is still very far from being exhausted (in the photo and video from the other side, despite the mobilization and emigration of men outwardly suitable for mobilization criteria, there are even more than a lot). There is no exact understanding of the number of those mobilized from the enemy in each wave, you can mobilize 300 thousand people at once, like ours (although some, by indirect signs, such as the ratio of the number mobilized to% of the total population of the country by region, call the figure 600 thousand and even a million), but it’s possible to recruit 300 thousand in waves of 10-30-50 thousand people ... again, judging by the photo from the NVO zone (there are still T-64 relatively fresh modifications, captured BMP-3 and BTR-80) and small volumes of equipment supply from the “partners” information about “half a million losses” (100 thousand dead, the rest wounded) sound very optimistic, although I tend to think that the enemy’s losses are higher, but not by an order of magnitude and not many times ...
In other words, there are no obvious facts of the incapacity of brigade tactics ...

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: parma

. There is no exact understanding of the number of mobilized from the enemy in each wave

But there is an understanding of the timing of mobilizations and the fact that the mobilized Armed Forces of Ukraine are fighting with might and main. Ours is mostly still not. Therefore, the great numerical advantage of the Armed Forces of Ukraine (by the time their offensives began) is, as it were, obvious.
Where is the result?

Quote: parma

In other words, there are no obvious facts of the incapacity of brigade tactics

Not noticeable. How not noticeable is her success with the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

[Foul skeptic]

mobilized Armed Forces of Ukraine are fighting with might and main. Ours is mostly still not.

mobilized LDNR, they are also ... ours. So, they also fought with might and main.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Nefarious skeptic

mobilized LDNR, they are also ... ours. So, they also fought with might and main.

It does not mean they, but only 300 thousand RF. Because the appeals of the LPR and the DPR did not solve the numerical superiority of the Armed Forces of Ukraine

[Victor Leningradets]

Success in pinning down our best ground forces and tactical air forces. If the enemy deploys operations by NATO troops in Belarus, then we will roll back beyond the Dnieper in Belarus and will stand on the Panther line in the Baltics practically with the people's militia. And there is also a potential front on the Karelian Isthmus, in Karelia itself and the Arctic. Here, in general, there will be nothing to oppose except for a bare ass.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

can't push us out of their territory

Why would he need to knock us out if time is working for them? They are sitting in fortified areas and we are attacking. Losses in this situation are 1 to 3.

[zenion]

Reminds me of the movie "Fanfan Tulip"! The king asks the marshal, why did the enemy turn his back on us? Marshal answers the enemy against all the laws of war decided to fight with us, so to speak, against wool. It's impossible to fight like that. Or maybe it was the enemy who attacked our opponent, who dared to attack our opponent, the king asked the marshal. And then the enemy went to surrender to them. The king threw his glove on the ground and said - it's impossible to fight like that. If the Ukrainians go to surrender, then the Russian army will give the drang to the ost, this is a catch! In a comedy film, it's funny, but in reality it's a damn thing.

[Moore]

Quote: bya965

Armata is the one that annoyed you?

Well, of course ... Armats appeared at the border training ground - we must react!

[Lech from Android.]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

This is pure nonsense! And thermal imagers and screens and electronics, which are none, have their own.

I agree ... the Internet is full of advertisements for the sale of thermal imagers for various purposes, cost and class ... I don’t want to take it if I have money.

[2 Level Advisor]

I’m not sure that modern tank thermal imagers are sold on the Internet .. IZH-12 is quite different from AK-12 .. although it shoots both ..

[Dilettante grandfather]

The main problem, and not only in the army, is the lack of personnel. Cadres decide everything - this is an axiom. Not enough tanks, helicopters, planes? Factories can be built if desired. But who will work there? Not to design these very tanks, but to work, with pens? Turners, locksmiths, mechanics, assemblers must be trained. Moreover, to make professions prestigious and competitive, so that young people would dream not of selling Chinese goods in offices, but of turning nuts up to their elbows in grease. For serious (alas, the time is now) money. Previously, in the USSR, there were vocational schools. Yes, those who could not enter the university or the technical school went there. Yes, they drank-smoked-volynil there. Yes, they studied, and they taught, what is there, anyhow. But they still got the initial skills there. The rest was comprehended in the course of work at the enterprise.
To begin with, it is necessary to radically change the education system, return to proven Soviet schemes, albeit partially. For example - if there is a demand from defense enterprises for graduates of universities and technical schools - to introduce mandatory working off. After completing your studies, you are in demand by production workers, which means that you work in your specialty for 3-5 years where you were assigned. Only after that your diploma will be considered valid in full. And then, if you really worked productively, and did not serve a number. No - consider that you spent your time at the university just like that. The diploma is cancelled. This will help to weed out random people who went to the university not at will or vocation, but "behind the tower, no matter in what area." The country does not need such "specialists", and if it is not needed, then why waste time on their training? And with those who study for a fee, you can also do exactly the same. I don't see any problems. If you want to study as an economist, you didn’t get into the budget, you pay for this profession, which means you will work by distribution. This is what you wanted, right?
In general, first you need personnel. And not factories, factories, if desired and necessary, the state will build. Like tanks, planes, ships.

[Klaus8691]

Everything you mentioned here is absolutely correct. But over the past years, young people have formed completely different views about the profession. As you pointed out here, they would rather sell Chinese consumer goods or bloggers than go to the factory. True, those factories and factories are left with gulkin's nose. Although there are hard workers, but they are a minority, unfortunately.

[Mixweb]

What personnel can we talk about if there is a forced total digitalization at the school. It is superimposed on the bureaucratic nightmare, amplifying it many times over. But at the lessons of labor they began to study exclusively theory. We were lucky at the time. They managed to work on machines and ride a tractor. And now the machines are either decommissioned and plundered, or gathering dust in heaps of the rest of the junk.

[PROXOR]

There is truth in what you say, but yes and no. Yes, the younger generation should know the basics and no, they must be taught to work not with their hands, but to program CNC machines.
It's time to change the setting in your head to Turners, Millers and the like.
In other words, it is necessary to put into practice the words of the song: WHAT HAVE THE PRRGRESS REACHED.

[ALARI]

What you said about diplomas is again a whip for ordinary people, the bulk of the population, but what about for the so-called elite? How is it with her? Where will she work? Again, take the people out on your hump.

[parma]

Quote: Grandfather is an amateur

The main problem, and not only in the army, is the lack of personnel. Cadres decide everything - this is an axiom. Not enough tanks, helicopters, planes? Factories can be built if desired. But who will work there? Not to design these very tanks, but to work, with pens? Turners, locksmiths, mechanics, assemblers must be trained. Moreover, to make professions prestigious and competitive, so that young people would dream not of selling Chinese goods in offices, but of turning nuts up to their elbows in grease. For serious (alas, the time is now) money. Previously, in the USSR, there were vocational schools. Yes, those who could not enter the university or the technical school went there. Yes, they drank-smoked-volynil there. Yes, they studied, and they taught, what is there, anyhow. But they still got the initial skills there. The rest was comprehended in the course of work at the enterprise.
To begin with, it is necessary to radically change the education system, return to proven Soviet schemes, albeit partially. For example - if there is a demand from defense enterprises for graduates of universities and technical schools - to introduce mandatory working off. After completing your studies, you are in demand by production workers, which means that you work in your specialty for 3-5 years where you were assigned. Only after that your diploma will be considered valid in full. And then, if you really worked productively, and did not serve a number. No - consider that you spent your time at the university just like that. The diploma is cancelled. This will help to weed out random people who went to the university not at will or vocation, but "behind the tower, no matter in what area." The country does not need such "specialists", and if it is not needed, then why waste time on their training? And with those who study for a fee, you can also do exactly the same. I don't see any problems. If you want to study as an economist, you didn’t get into the budget, you pay for this profession, which means you will work by distribution. This is what you wanted, right?
In general, first you need personnel. And not factories, factories, if desired and necessary, the state will build. Like tanks, planes, ships.

Isn't it better to abolish public education altogether? Make either paid or targeted. Then education will be more valued... perhaps there will be (should be) practices like in the West, when a private company pays for tuition and monitors the student's progress, as it raises an employee. Accordingly, the level of education will increase, because irrelevant universities will not be able to survive

[Adrey]

Quote: parma

because irrelevant universities will not be able to survive

What are you talking about! And where are all those teachers with regalia? Should they start working in production? So there such figs are not needed

[ammunition]

Quote: parma

abolish public education? Do either paid or target. Then education will be more valued…............ Accordingly, the level of education will increase,

Practice has shown that the highest quality education was under the USSR. (i.e. free).

[fiberboard]

I completely DO NOT agree with the distribution after the university. After graduating from the agricultural institute, I was sent to a state farm, where no one cared about anything. I didn’t receive an apartment or a salary for three months. Stupid Soviet distribution system. Now it's much better - graduated from high school, go look for a job yourself. I agree that it is possible to conclude agreements with the employer, then work for him. But I have a friend and a classmate who teach their daughters at their own expense to become doctors. And why should they go to work somewhere after college? People will simply stop going to college.

[PROXOR]

Then there are no questions, you don’t want to go through the distribution, you study at your own expense. I studied for the budget - you go where you were sent.
Whoever pays the money dances the girl.

[ALARI]

And the budget is formed by the case not from the taxes of the student's parents and the public domain? Or bureaucrats from their own pocket pay for education on the budget?

[Dismas]

"And the budget is formed by chance not from the taxes of the student's parents and the public domain"
So, go and work off the national wealth spent on you (your training) where the "party" directs. Children of bureaucrats in the system of paid education from a nursery - private kindergartens, private schools, etc.

[runway-1]

After graduating from the agricultural institute, I was sent to a state farm, where no one cared about anything. Not an apartmentdidn't get paid for XNUMX months.

Sorry Vladimir, but something is not true here. Not to receive a salary for a specialist (even if he was sent to work by distribution, even if he was independently employed) - this is from the field of tales, or we are talking about the early 90s, but then in post-Soviet times the distribution is already "dead" ...

But I have a friend and a classmate who teach their daughters at their own expense to become doctors. And why should they go to work somewhere after college?

They shouldn’t, and who says that in such cases they are obliged to work out?!

[your1970]

Quote: Grandfather is an amateur

For example - if there is a demand from defense enterprises for graduates of universities and technical schools - to introduce mandatory working off. After completing your studies, you are in demand by production workers, which means that you work in your specialty for 3-5 years where you were assigned.

And who will go to study at those universities so that after working for 50? That's right - 000 fig tenths ....

Quote: Grandfather is an amateur

And with those who study for a fee, you can also do exactly the same. I don't see any problems. If you want to study as an economist, you didn’t get into the budget, you pay for this profession, which means you will work by distribution. This is what you wanted, right?

Amazing!!! You pay 200 a year - so that later you are assigned to work in a state office with a salary of 000?
After such tricks - you won’t have a single student there in half an hour ....
And yes, you will have to prohibit emigration in general as such. Otherwise, your freshly trained graduates will simply go over the hill ...
And yes, offering large salaries is also not an option - now military equipment is expensive, but it will still rise in price due to salaries. Even if the director does not steal and his salary will be only 2-3 times more than a hard worker

[2 Level Advisor]

Quote: your1970

And who will go to study at those universities so that after working for 50? That's right - 000 fig tenths ....

besides this, I agree with everything .. I don’t know where you come from, where the salary is 50-nothing, but here in Stavropol, for this money, 90% of graduates will go to work ...

[your1970]

Quote: Level 2 Advisor

but here in Stavropol, for this money, 90% of graduates will go to work ...

To factory lower Engineers - be responsible for the crooked hard workers and constantly rake for the shitty quality of products ?? Well, there are no people who want to work in the industry - that's a fact.
Moreover, this fact did not appear yesterday or today - in my childhood they already said "If you study, you will go to college, if you don’t, you will go to vocational school !!"

By the way, in St. Petersburg, the Kirov Plant offers vacancies for turners with 60.
And in the Far East with 127 milling operators.

And our farmers have already begun to raise the salary of tractor drivers - they are already propping them up. 20-25 monthly all year round if only they don’t leave, 70 for sowing and harvesting + 20-30 tons of grain

[PROXOR]

And then a familiar tune comes to mind with the famous chorus: Back in USSR...

[vinschu]

"Only after that your diploma will be considered valid in full. And then, if you really worked productively, and did not serve a number. No - consider that you spent time at the university just like that. The diploma is canceled." Super !!! (not sarcasm)

[filibuster]

But who will work there? Not to design these very tanks, but to work, with pens? Turners, locksmiths, mechanics, assemblers must be trained. Moreover, to make professions prestigious and competitive, so that young people would dream not of selling Chinese goods in offices, but of turning nuts up to their elbows in grease. For serious (alas, the time is now) money. Previously, in the USSR, there were vocational schools. Yes, those who could not enter the university or the technical school went there. Yes, they drank-smoked-volynil there. Yes, they studied, and they taught, what is there, anyhow. But they still got the initial skills there. The rest was comprehended in the course of work at the enterprise.

You don’t see the problem there, everything that you listed is solved relatively easily, it’s a matter of organization and money, if factories are built with modern machines, equipment, then the required number of turners will be reduced by orders of magnitude (tens of times), if factories are built on Soviet technologies , then again this is a matter of wages, they will pay a decent salary, they will recruit the required number of turners, locksmiths, and young people will also go to study.
South Korea, Taiwan, China have already gone through this, I repeat, this is a matter of organization.

To begin with, it is necessary to radically change the education system, return to proven Soviet schemes, albeit partially. For example - if there is a demand from defense enterprises for graduates of universities and technical schools - to introduce mandatory working off.

Is it already impossible to make the working conditions attractive? Mandatory working out will be the same after the sleeves.

[UAZ 452]

Factories can be built if desired. But who will work there? Not to design these very tanks, but to work, with pens? Turners, locksmiths, mechanics, assemblers must be trained. Moreover, to make professions prestigious and competitive, so that young people would dream not of selling Chinese goods in offices, but of turning nuts up to their elbows in grease.

I don’t impose my opinion on anyone, but it seems to me that it was precisely this approach, when the role of a hard worker who “twisted nuts elbow-deep in grease” was emphasized to the detriment of those who should “design these same tanks” and led to the collapse of the USSR. He simply mothballed its technological backwardness (and the trend towards this began from the Khrushchev period). When an engineer earned less than a hard worker, the degradation of production was inevitable. And if now young people from sales offices are driven into factories as mechanics, shaved with infantry vans into a one and a half million (and then two, three, etc.) army, then this will not lead to the revival of the country, rather by 1991, only in more hard version. And if the borders are not tightly closed, the same thing will happen to the whole country, which happened earlier (and even during the late USSR) with the village - the washing out of the most competitive youth, degradation and total alcoholization of the remaining population.

[Boris Sergeev]

They say that everyone understands to the extent of their depravity. Where did you see "protrusion of the role of a hard worker with hands up to the elbows in grease"? Look at Soviet films more closely, the same Nikolai Rybnikov, for example. Until the last days of the USSR, scientific research institutes worked, now they have become a haven for firms "Horns and Hooves". And the salaries of the employees there were quite on the level. Not to mention the professorship, which not only had decent salaries, but also the social prestige that only high-ranking officials now have.

[2 Level Advisor]

Didn't a skilled worker get more engineer, doctor, teacher? and indeed more than almost anyone with a higher education, if not an official / military? Do you think it’s normal when a good factory design bureau engineer gets less than a good factory worker? and a professorship is already extreme, by analogy for a worker - a "Stakhanovite" .. my father worked at the research institute - a senior researcher - 200 rubles, like an ordinary worker "with an average discharge" at a factory ..

[filibuster]

You apparently didn’t live in the USSR or were just a child, the engineer lost his attractiveness for some time, I don’t know on purpose it was conceived or it happened by chance, but the engineer was paid less than the worker, all other things being equal, there was even such an anecdote when an old friend came to his classmate to the director of the plant and ask him to arrange his son, who graduated from school, at the plant and the director offers him a salary of 150 rubles, and if he fulfills the plan, then you can get 250, to which the friend replies that 250 is too much, he can sleep and ask for 80-100 rubles, for which the director, in turn, replies that for this he needs to learn to be an engineer.

[your1970]

Quote: Boris Sergeev

research institutes worked, now they have become a haven for firms "Horns and Hooves". And the salaries of the employees there were quite on the level.

"MeNeeS" - 125 rubles - 75% of the basis of those research institutes ??

[Foul skeptic]

"MeNeeS" - 125 rubles - 75% of the basis of those research institutes ??

The salary of the Ministry of Taxes and Taxes ("a less needed employee") varied from 120 to 300 rubles, depending on the category of institution and length of service. Plus allowances. The SNA ("a completely unnecessary employee") has from 200 to 400. Plus allowances. And since the mid-80s, they have generally taken off by 1,6 times.

[zenion]

Worked at the factory, mailbox. They came from TU to the factory. They put him for a month, with a small salary, to a specialist for a review, and a month later he was already standing near the machine on one part for months. Those who could cut threads, sharpen from above, inside, make curly parts, could switch the machine settings, they received the third category and a month later got to the processing of precise parts. Whoever understood the machine, prepared additional products in order to make cool parts, he got to the site where they prepared parts that went to applications for the manufacture of completely new products, which then got to the masters and completely new weapons were prepared. They made the cutters themselves and other auxiliary tools. The cutters were ordered in a special workshop and received to the machine. After the shift I ordered, in the morning already on the machine. Sharpened, installed and working.

[bk0010]

Quote: Grandfather is an amateur

Factories can be built if desired. But who will work there? Not to design these very tanks, but to work, with pens? Turners, locksmiths, mechanics, assemblers must be trained.

Why do you need heaps of turners and locksmiths at new factories? Now is the 21st century, not the first half of the 20th. Flow technologies rule (high-precision stamping, high-precision casting, etc.), when hundreds of parts are manufactured. The flow technology is not suitable - put a robot, a CNC machine, finally. There is no need to build a plant where armies of turners are needed, it is outdated.

Quote: Grandfather is an amateur

For serious (alas, the time is now) money.

Terrible time! The workers must be paid, otherwise these bastards leave! It will soon come to the point that the salary of managers will exceed the work of contemptible hard workers by only 2-3 times! Where is the world heading!

Quote: Grandfather is an amateur

For example - if there is a demand from defense enterprises for graduates of universities and technical schools - to introduce mandatory working off. After completing your studies, you are in demand by production workers, which means that you work in your specialty for 3-5 years where you were assigned.

Quote: Grandfather is an amateur

And with those who study for a fee, you can also do exactly the same. I don't see any problems.

Well, yes, a person paid for education (there are so few budget places that those who unlearned them are not enough for anyone), studied for 5 years, and now go and work for your uncle "for a small price." Yes, just no one will go to such universities. They will oblige all universities - they will go to study "over the hill" (fortunately, the prices are already comparable, if you don't show off with Oxfords), and they will stay there. In the meantime, there are problems with this - they will simply give up on education and will earn. No one will put their youth on facilitating the work of bureaucrats.

Quote: Grandfather is an amateur

In general, first you need personnel.

With your approaches, there will be no frames at all. Need people - pay. Capitalism in the yard (yes, it works both ways). They find money for deputies - and they will find money for workers. And there is no money - so people are not so needed.

[Keer]

And with those who study for a fee, you can also do exactly the same. I don't see any problems. If you want to study as an economist, you didn’t get into the budget, you pay for this profession, which means you will work by distribution. This is what you wanted, right?

under such conditions, no one will study for a fee in Russian universities. Unlearn over the hill online, or in person. Moreover, the prices are comparable. In order to demand something, you must first give something. Namely, to pay for education. And here, we are smoothly moving into the state. investment in science and education. There is no desire in power to give "their money" there. There, the cutting efficiency is much less. And partners will not approve.

[2 Level Advisor]

spent a lot of resources - built, built and finally built .. now build-rebuild spending another lot .. and they will do it - the same people .. hmm .. what will be the result?

[lopvlad]

- the number of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation is assigned to one and a half million people (including 670 thousand contract soldiers).

not the total number of the armed forces of the Russian Federation (military + civilian personnel), which already since August 29 was determined to be more than 2 million people, or rather (2 people) where the number of military personnel was a little over a million, namely 039 military personnel.
Now the number of military personnel will grow to 1 million 500 thousand and the total number of armed forces of the Russian Federation will be 2 ​​people.

[Alexey Lantukh]

As Vysotsky sang "... where is Zin's money .." Half a million troops, and even with new equipment? How much money do you need. Let's tighten our belts. We will not build new schools, kindergartens, houses, pensions, salaries. Sadly. Putin's saying: "Without damage to the economy" - however, miracles do not happen. Troops are always at the expense of the economy and are always money ruined for development. I wonder if our billionaires will be pinched? If not, then a social explosion cannot be avoided.

[ab111]

I don’t believe in some kind of social explosion ..
Our people have lost passionarity.
There will be a quiet long impoverishment and several waves of emigration of those people who are capable of it.

[Dismas]

Yes, what does this Gumilyov "passionarity" have to do with it, explaining everything that is needed within the framework of one of the models of cognition of the past, but not explaining the realities? Any "revolution" (from the Dutch to the October - classical and, moreover, "colored") had a foreign policy interest who supported and provided (from overseas bases and weapons to finance and propaganda) the revolutionaries and, subsequently, their parties. Now there is no such interest, respectively, there are no revolutionaries, no parties, only "clowns" imitating the opposition. All the "rhetoric" of the Western establishment boils down to one thing - Putin needs to be removed in order for the Russian Federation to come to power ... no, not revolutionaries, but elites inside the country "sympathetic" to the idea of ​​"open world".

[malyvalv]

Any "passionarity" is based on material interest. Passionarity of Ukrainians is ensured by the slogan "Ukraine for Europe" and the anticipation of the future Panuvianism.
Just as the victory of the Reds in the civil war was ensured by the simple slogan "Land to the peasants, factories to the workers" and the same anticipation of splendor in the future.
We are not fighting for the future, but for the preservation of the past.

[zenion]

Do not foresee, but follow in the footsteps of others.

[break_beats]

The whole problem is that hundreds of thousands of years of evolution have passed, and the primitive human brain is still not able to understand that the State is people, the Army is people.

The state is not some kind of third-party system that performs some functions, but the coordinated work of the entire Collective Mind.

Hundreds of thousands of conditional “Rum Skomorokhovs” are sitting here and distilled from empty to empty, reassuring themselves that “everything has already been stolen before us”, and this is the most accessible explanation for the level of brain development for them. Only Questions are generated instead of Suggestions

This is the only and main problem.

[Boris55]

Quote from breakin_beats

The state is not some kind of third-party system that performs some functions, but the coordinated work of the entire Collective Mind.

"The state is a system of survival, preservation and development of the people".

The previous formation of our army has shown its effectiveness in the fight against ISIS in Syria. The West drew a conclusion and imposed war on us in the "old" style. We have no choice but to accept this challenge and reform the army for new tasks.

[Mikhail Maslov]

I have a different opinion. You can’t reform the army without reforming the state. The reform should begin with the Kremlin, it is there that the approach needs to be changed. Then the army can be reformed. If this is not done, money and time will be spent on sham reforms.

[Boris55]

Quote: Mikhail Maslov

Reform must start with the Kremlin

If you start reforms from the Kremlin, then I'm afraid that there will be nothing more to reform - there will be no country. A little more than a year is left before the presidential re-election.
Wait or what?

[Boris Sergeev]

You are already preparing Medvedev for re-election. Castling 2.0..well, hang in there!

[zenion]

Boris55. In 1917 they did it, there were people with brains. Now, what are not those heads? Now, what, harm themselves, so much so that they would gasp later. Like aliens did it all? Or maybe foreigners did all this? He came, he saw, he stole, he stole. They live in someone else's mind.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote from breakin_beats

Only Questions are generated instead of Suggestions

This makes no sense. Firstly, there were a lot of proposals, and secondly, who needs them, these proposals?

[Boris55]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

there were a lot of offers, secondly - and who needs them

What percentage of those who suggested something graduated from the General Staff Academy?
Zero? None? So can the General Staff of the Moscow Region advise you to turn to kindergarten for advice?

Anecdote:
Why can't you fall in love with a girl in a public place?
- Why not?
- Because there are many advisers.

[victor50]

Quote: Boris55

What percentage of those who suggested something graduated from the General Staff Academy?
Zero? None? So can the General Staff of the Moscow Region advise you to turn to kindergarten for advice?

And is that an argument? From the same series: and if not HE, then who - name the candidates. Life has shown that the knowledge and arguments of those who did not graduate from the General Staff Academy were often correct. And those who graduated from these academies have yet to prove that they are able to hear, understand and perceive, analyze information. While with this...

[2 Level Advisor]

and at the Academy of the General Staff they teach reforming the Armed Forces, economics, research, etc. Or do they still teach the management of the association? Well, Makarov was Chief of Staff - they cut everything in front of him, so what? But did he and his deputies finish the Academy of the General Staff of the Russian Federation? finished ... not an indicator at all ..

[Boris55]

Quote: Level 2 Advisor

and at the Academy of the General Staff they teach the reform of the Armed Forces

They learn how to respond appropriately to emerging threats.
Our army has proven itself well in Syria. The united West lost outright to us there. Today he has imposed on us a different kind of war, which requires us to reconsider the current structure of the army.

[2 Level Advisor]

Quote: Boris55

Our army has proven itself well in Syria. The united West lost outright to us there.

and there were hostilities with the "West" - when? when the north and east (where the best lands of Syria) were taken from the Turks with the striped ones? didn't they take it? how did they lose?

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Boris55

Our army has proven itself well in Syria. The united West lost outright to us there.

Need to eat

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Boris55

So can the General Staff of the Moscow Region advise you to turn to kindergarten for advice?

Yes, I will advise. According to statistics, the child will give 50% of the correct advice if given clear alternatives (will choose at random). This is more than MO

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Boris55

What percentage of those who suggested something graduated from the General Staff Academy?
Zero? None? So can the General Staff of the Moscow Region advise you to turn to kindergarten for advice?

Those who graduated from the ACS formed and trained the current army. In which a tank division was formed without UAV units. In which commanders most of the time are not busy with combat training, but with the preparation of numerous reports, plans, and the like, and during that same combat training they are mostly concerned with the preservation of materiel (which, as a result, lies in warehouses and in the KShM). In which they managed to bring to the troops only terminal devices - personal walkie-talkies - from the entire newest communication system. In which artbooks and batteries for UAVs are purchased with public money.
And which is organically incapable of fighting in a special operation with full-blooded formations, since they are packed with conscripts.

[Boris55]

Quote: Alexey RA

Those who graduated from the ACS formed and trained the current army.

Which proved to be excellent in Syria.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Yes, you are delirious, my dear. Born in Syria, there was no army - only the Aerospace Forces, Air Defense and MTR.

[Sergej1972]

In the Russian understanding of the Aerospace Forces, the Strategic Missile Forces, the Airborne Forces, the MTR is also an army. The army is everything that is not part of the Navy. In the US, the Army is the ground forces.

[Alex Nevs]

And the kindergarten rammed you with minuses . Plusanul.

[G17]

All critical questions are raised correctly. First of all: where to recruit people for new divisions? In our country, the mobilization of 2022 passed with a huge creak and hit the economy, from where a lot of the people she needed were withdrawn. And when, under Shoigu, they began to revive divisions in 2013-2021. I remember with what a huge creak they were formed precisely because of the lack of personnel. For the formation of these new corps, divisions, new mobilizations (and more than one) will be required. Is the country ready for it? I doubt it very much, since Russia approached the war not as a densely populated and powerful industrial power, but as a dying country of women, migrants and pensioners with the remnants of Soviet industry and the military-industrial complex. The second question is also correctly raised: how to equip the new divisions? The Russian military-industrial complex produces little new equipment and will not cover the needs. Inevitably, we will have to turn to Soviet stocks. This means that de facto we will get "divisions" in the form of reinforced brigades armed with obsolete Soviet equipment (God forbid, even modernized). And again, time, time and time again. The decisions made on a sharp increase in the army are correct, but they had to be taken and implemented from 2014. And then our blitzkrieg would not have failed and Bandera Ukraine would have ceased to exist this year. Now time has been lost - we cannot win a war of attrition with NATO (there is a stronger economy, more people, equipment and technologies), the Russian leadership does not want to liquidate Ukraine (which has been repeatedly officially admitted), and yet on the verge of a war with the entire NATO bloc .

[FoBoss_VM]

That's right. To lure people into the army in the current political environment is possible only with goodies, high salaries and benefits. Where are they planning to take it in their thoroughly corrupt budget? Will there be less stealing for the sake of the Motherland? Yes, I'm begging you... . And who will do all the equipment for them? Factories are barely breathing, technical training is ruined, there are no specialists, only effective managers with outrageous salaries. As for me, these Putin's Wishlist will take decades, but Russia does not have them. They destroyed everything very quickly, but to rebuild, oh, how difficult it will be

[zenion]

Maybe it was done on purpose, but missed. Like, across the cordon, I saw how Russia was moving forward and took an example from it, and after 10-15 years everything fell apart, and Russia has all the tanks, even though they are old, but they have, all the millionaires are new, the billionaires are new and everyone is concerned about the people and the country . This is where capitalism will burn out, without a single shot being fired. Take them with your bare hands and into bed.

[break_beats]

Quote: G17

but a dying country of women, migrants and pensioners with the remnants of Soviet industry and the military-industrial complex.

you can see NG since the beginning of December began to celebrate did not master the rest of the slogans

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

That is, you are not aware that the death rate in the Russian Federation totally exceeds the birth rate, and that it is possible to keep the country's population at about the same level solely thanks to migrants and the annexation of territories like Crimea?
Hmm .. Maybe you should .. Write less and read more?

[Denis812]

Andrey, do you know that this situation is everywhere. Throughout the EU. And even in the USA.
The white world is degenerating. The reason is quite simple - we don't want more kids. We have nowhere to grow. As one gentleman said in the film "The state is disgusted by static." Here we have exactly this static.
Nature governs everything. And those nations that are now aggressive, such as yellow or Mex - yes, they are growing.

[jdiver]

The reason is quite simple - we don't want more kids. We have nowhere to grow.

The reason is the Satanists in power in these countries, aimed at death, to "live now and only for yourself." And accordingly built the system of education of people in these countries. Yes, and being part of a global satanic state, parsley, controlled from a single center, descending directives to vassals on how to teach children, what clowns to show on TV, how to cut social spending and "plan a family" so that they do not procreate, etc. It is with such "integrated" people that a million people die a year, and everything from education to industry and the army goes to hell. Under the scream of doves from TV screens.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Denis812

Andrey, do you know that this situation is everywhere. Throughout the EU. And even in the USA.

Really? :)))
You, before sculpting this, at least familiarize yourself with the statistics. In the United States, for example, more people are born than die. So in 2020, 4.1 million were born there, -2,7 died. There are other examples in the EU.

[UAZ 452]

In the United States, for example, more people are born than die. So in 2020, 4.1 million were born there, -2,7 died

What if blacks and Hispanics are excluded from the count?

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: UAZ 452

What if blacks and Hispanics are excluded from the count?

And if we exclude persons of Caucasian nationality and born children of immigrants from the east?

[Sergej1972]

Incorrect comparison. The combined percentage of Latinos and blacks in the United States is many times greater than the percentage of Caucasians in the Russian Federation. The two largest Muslim peoples of the Russian Federation, Tatars and Bashkirs, have a birth rate that is not much higher than that of Russians, while it is the same for urban Tatars and Bashkirs. And given the strong assimilation of the Tatars living outside of Tatarstan and the Volga region, the total number of this people is declining. Among the same Caucasians, a high birth rate is preserved among the Chechens, Ingush, and among the majority of the peoples of Dagestan. But they are also shrinking. And among the Adyghe peoples, and among the Ossetians, the birth rate has decreased very much. The Finno-Ugric peoples of the Russian Federation and the Chuvash have worse demographic indicators than the Russians.

[Sergej1972]

In most EU countries, the demographic situation is different compared to the US.

[Sergej1972]

Look how yellow. Japan and South Korea have one of the world's lowest birth rates and declining populations. The population of China will soon begin to decline. Despite the lifting of restrictions, the birth rate in China is falling, no measures of the party and government to increase the birth rate have yet worked. By the way, in many countries of Latin America, the birth rate has also declined significantly. And in Muslim Turkey and Iran.

[zenion]

Andrey from Chelyabinsk. This is all not true. Children are hidden so that they would not understand that the population of Russia has exceeded a billion, that the north of the country is completely built up, but secretly, as if there is nothing. The taiga is full of people, under every pine or other tree, there is a tent in which up to a dozen people live and wait for a signal to get into rockets and free the planet from capitalism. That's how it is!

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: zenion

Here it is!

And for the disclosure of military secrets you will be severely punished!

[tsvetahaki]

You can talk for a long time, but the main question

Reform of the Russian army: long-awaited or doomed

And here comes the story... Let's not talk in detail about our reformers, which have no analogues in the world... But here's what I want to say about the main question posed.
When you accept a person for a responsible position, you look at his resume, achievements, completed projects... The resume for the foreseeable future of potential reformers - both individually and as a whole - does not include any achievements, but includes many, say, non-achievements. ..
From this we can conclude - of course, the reform of the Russian army will be extremely successful!

[Joker62]

Reform of the Russian army: long-awaited or doomed

The long-awaited... Finally, the ice has broken, ladies and gentlemen of the jury... After the reforms from Serdyukov, the army did not become stronger, but, on the contrary, showed its weakness in everything. This showed itself during the NWO in Ukraine. And now, Shoigu, along with other generals, are going to close up deep gaps - from sergeants to officers that Serdyukov created with his "effective" managers in the army. Not to mention the training of specialists from military universities and colleges.
There are enough problems, and all this will take a lot of time and resources.

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Joker62

After the reforms from Serdyukov, the army did not become stronger, but, on the contrary, showed its weakness in everything.

Yes, how is it?! And after the Crimea, they said the opposite!

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Joker62

After the reforms from Serdyukov, the army did not become stronger, but, on the contrary, showed its weakness in everything.

Because the reform of Makarov-Serdyukov drowned in the Ministry of Finance and the corridors of the Arbat, giving rise as a result of numerous mutants and chimeras that have little in common with the original concept.

Quote: Joker62

И now, Shoigu, along with other generals, are going to close up deep gaps - from sergeants to officers that Serdyukov created with his "effective" managers in the army.

Heh heh heh ... but don't you remind me - when did Shoigu become the Minister of Defense?

[9PA]

And it turns out that Putin is not guilty, only the military are to blame?

[Lykases1]

Exactly. And Yeltsin is not to blame. He's generally good. There is a center for him out of his own name.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

So the military is not to blame. No one is to blame, we are not in the 37th year ...

[kor1vet1974]

And it turns out that Putin is not guilty, only the military are to blame?

Of course, they misled the commander-in-chief, he was honestly mistaken. Once again, they cheated.

[Alexey Dashkin]

"And Putin is not guilty, it turns out, only the military are to blame?"

So Lenin))

[break_beats]

Quote: Joker62

Reform of the Russian army: long-awaited or doomed

The long-awaited... Finally, the ice has broken, ladies and gentlemen of the jury... After the reforms from Serdyukov, the army did not become stronger, but, on the contrary, showed its weakness in everything. This showed itself during the NWO in Ukraine. And now, Shoigu, along with other generals, are going to close up deep gaps - from sergeants to officers that Serdyukov created with his "effective" managers in the army. Not to mention the training of specialists from military universities and colleges.
There are enough problems, and all this will take a lot of time and resources.

Bravo! Full understanding of the materiel

[runway-1]

Aha, aha, the cuckoo praises the rooster for praising the cuckoo!

[Jackson]

Serdyukov- Serdyukov .... He ruined ... And, excuse me, was there no commander over him? Or maybe the commander did not pay attention to such trifles as reforming and reducing the army?

[Lykases1]

That is not the way to talk. And then you can start thinking badly about the premiere, and even .... No, even - don't.

[Woodman]

Quote: Jackson

Serdyukov- Serdyukov .... He ruined ... And, excuse me, was there no commander over him? Or maybe the commander did not pay attention to such trifles as reforming and reducing the army?

as much harm as he did with the full approval of Serdyukov, probably no one has done in the entire history, starting with Tukhachevsky.

And then I had a question: was there no commander over Tukhachevsky either?

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Lesovik

And then I had a question: was there no commander over Tukhachevsky either?

And for such words, father, you can put a party card on the table! ©

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Was. And the commander of Tukhachevsky for a year figured out his professional suitability, after which Tukhachevsky was arrested and shot. And Serdyukov worked for 5.5 years

[UAZ 452]

And after Serdyukov, Shoigu "corrects" for 10 years. How much more does the Supreme need to figure out his professional suitability?

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

Was. And the commander of Tukhachevsky for a year figured out his professional suitability, after which Tukhachevsky was arrested and shot.

Ummm ... actually, Tukhachevsky was deputy commissar for 6 years at the temporary detention center. And in the same 1935, Stalin fully supported him even against Voroshilov.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Alexey RA

Ummm ... actually, Tukhachevsky was deputy commissar for 6 years at the temporary detention facility.

Not at all: in June 1931 he was returned to the central office, where he successively held the posts of Deputy People's Commissar of the Navy, Deputy Chairman of the Revolutionary Military Council of the USSR and Chief of Armaments of the Red Army. In November 1934, Tukhachevsky was appointed deputy, and in April 1936 - 1st deputy people's commissar of defense of the USSR.

[Woodman]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

And the commander of Tukhachevsky for a year figured out his professional suitability, after which Tukhachevsky was arrested and shot. And Serdyukov worked for 5.5 years

Well, under Serdyukov, Georgia was forced to peace in a few days, and Tukhachevsky screwed up near Warsaw and became the head of the academy and rose to the rank of marshal. And you say "per year" ...

[Edward Vashchenko]

That is, the army and navy have a huge shortage of specialists with a secondary technical profile of education. Techies.

So this is a problem for the entire national economy, for 20 years, at least until the zero, there was a Soviet reserve.
If we imagine that now, as deputies who have awakened from many years of hibernation sometimes say, it is necessary to restore vocational schools and technical schools, and then what? Where should graduates go? To the free checkout "Tasty and point"?
The deindustrialization that has been successfully carried out for the last successful 20 years has led to the degradation of everything, including the management of all ministries and departments.

[alekseykabanets]

Quote: Eduard Vaschenko

So this is a problem for the entire national economy, for 20 years, at least until the zero, there was a Soviet reserve.

And why study as an instrumentation and A adjuster, for example, if a job in a specialty can only be found in big cities? All this "reverberates" with the general collapse of the industry, which no one is going to restore. But there is no industry == no army, that's it, and no matter what reforms you do, the result will be known in advance.

[Edward Vashchenko]

But there is no industry == no army, that's it, and no matter what reforms you do, the result will be known in advance.

Absolutely.
The composition of the army of the late USSR. Guys from the countryside, or tractor-tank drivers, or just people for whom the forest and the steppe are not exotic, to which you need to get used to ALL SERVICE, but life itself. Urban - or after technical schools and vocational schools, for the most part ready for those. Specialties, or carriers after DOSAAF - 8 months of preparation.
What are the ensigns?
Everyone, no matter what, has NVP behind them. Yes, not ideal, yes, there were also many problems, fighters from the Middle East, etc. But ... in general, the level of the conscript is a head higher than the current one: a head!!!
And this is when serving on land - 2 years, in the Navy - 3 !!!
Well, the cherry on the cake - it was the army of the country, where everything belonged to the people, without vulgar ones: but there was no sausage, ... really, EVERYTHING ...

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Eduard Vaschenko

Where should graduates go?

Generally speaking, dear Eduard, the need for industrial enterprises in workers of all specialties is extremely high

[Edward Vashchenko]

Andrew,
I greet you!!!
The statistics say otherwise. If there was such a real need, and not for single enterprises, within the market, everyone would go to such universities, and universities would massively switch to training in those. specialties.
In fact, this is absolutely not the case, I'm talking about statistics.
Why, the graduate of the school thinks, go to the factory, where they will pay so-so and tear three skins, I'd rather go into the banking sector, and there ... what's there, the question, but ... suddenly you're lucky)))
I somehow looked at the structure of the MAI, the number of students, the same as in the USSR! But ... if only 100% engineers studied there in the USSR, now there are 10% of them.
I don’t argue with you, the factories remaining in the Russian Federation have needs for specialists, but ... this is not a mass phenomenon.
At one time, I completed my education of electronic engineers with the help of the Chinese, because our level of education (this is Moscow) - alas. I think the regions are in trouble.
Best regards,

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Eduard Vaschenko

In fact, this is absolutely not the case, I'm talking about statistics.

Dear Eduard, as a person, he worked all his adult life in industry, I assure you that the shortage of designers, technologists, and skilled production workers is simply total. Those that are, graduates of technical specialties, very often have a low basis, high salary expectations and unwillingness to work (not all, but this is a trend). Designer, a proud bird, until you kick it, it will not reach the workshop.
Workers, in fact, are totally taught by enterprises on their own, for their own money, concluding contracts with various training centers. They would still be working after that...
In general, I will not name the holding, but when in a city with a population of 400 people they see no reason to develop production, because the task of finding 000 skilled workers is assessed as obviously utopian...

[Evil eye]

Obviously, this is a complex problem... On the one hand, the memory of those years when work in industry was hard and poorly paid has not yet faded away. Many, one must think, are frightened off by physical exertion. In addition, the risk of bankruptcy has risen again: why study as a narrow specialist if the enterprise can stand up or even close down? It’s better to study the humanities - you will do everything a little bit and practically nothing, but then you don’t risk so much. Again, setting for "prospects", for mandatory career growth, or at least moving (from the provinces to a millionaire, from there to Moscow, and from there "to a normal country"). The state only exacerbates the desire to climb over the heads, with all these dubious "optimizations" knocking out the food supply from the middle strata of the population. Those. now you can’t just live and work, now you have to be fast in order to climb higher - or you will remain in the cold.
Physical labor, by the way, also exacerbates this: you work, you plant health or stick your fingers in the wrong place - and that’s it, the years have been wasted.

On the other hand, I repeat, starting from school, they hammer in that "you need to study, otherwise you will go to work hard at the factory," and by training, first of all, they mean humanitarian brainwashing, English (to dump in a normal country, of course), etc. .
The attitude is such that those who could not find a job anywhere else go to work - and judging by your words, to some extent this is a self-fulfilling stereotype. Those. the fewer capable people go into production, the worse the situation and the fewer talented people will go there.

[Rustic]

because the task of finding 1000 skilled workers is regarded as patently utopian...

As long as the senior managers of the holding with salaries of 2 lemons will look for workers with a salary of 20 thousand, it will be obviously utopian. Offer a salary of 500 thousand, and the competition will be 100 people per place.

[FoBoss_VM]

Until they shoot creatures like Serdyukov and Makarov, all these reforms are doomed to failure. For they will be made by exactly the same personalities ... Campaign Russians do not throw their slogan about Putin and his managers. The whole country knows that he is a pest and a traitor, but the president does not put him on trial, because he is his own. So everything will be like in a joke about the Avtovaz plant. I told you the place is cursed, and you hands out of your ass, hands out of your ass

[HaByxoDaBHocep]

Yes, these endless reforms are already boring, let's already exchange a global nuclear strike with NATO and no reforms are needed) the strongest will survive

[ab111]

As the experiments of scientists show, cockroaches and rats will be the strongest!

[Joker62]

Quote: 9PA

And it turns out that Putin is not guilty, only the military are to blame?

And why do you see only Putin's fault?
And who began to ruin the state? Putin again? And everywhere Putin is to blame.
Why are you not criticized as Gorbachev, Yeltsin??? They finally ruined and finished off both the economy and the statehood.
We need to look even deeper, it began after the death of Stalin, namely with Khrushchev. In the Brezhnev era, as liberals like to talk, the times of "stagnation", they secretly prepared a major coup d'etat. Before Gorbachev, there was a series of leapfrog in power.
And Putin got almost complete collapse, the war in the Caucasus, where many mediocre generals, such as Grachev, simply ruined the army.
And Putin is forced to follow the lead of the oligarchs in order to stop the collapse of the state as Russia.
And to restore everything, it will take a lot of time. And how many undercover intrigues in the Kremlin, it's just awful.. Yes, and the 5th column showed its charm of betrayal in relation to Russia.
So you don’t have to la-la, but turn on your head!

[Lykases1]

Yes, he stopped the collapse of the country, which was quite visible. This is a plus. But then there are a lot of non-pluses.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Joker62

Why are you not criticized as Gorbachev, Yeltsin???

Because Putin had almost a quarter of a century to correct. And that was more than enough.

Quote: Joker62

And Putin got almost complete collapse

It was Stalin who got almost complete collapse. And his situation was an order of magnitude more complicated - where Putin had a completely viable system of education, medicine, etc. and, most importantly, there was a population still of Soviet training, excellent personnel - workers, scientists, teachers, etc. Stalin had nothing.
Only now Stalin created all this in 20 years, and Putin - profukal

[ab111]

If you have ever been involved in project activities, you should understand ... and if not, take my word for it: - in 90% of cases, developing a project from scratch is much easier than redoing an existing old one.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: ab111

If you have ever been involved in project activities, you should understand ... and if not, take my word for it: - in 90% of cases, developing a project from scratch is much easier than redoing an existing old one.

nothing is easier. Firstly, what allows you to consider remaking capitalism into socialism a project "from scratch" and socialism into capitalism a project "remaking the existing old"?
Secondly, the complexity of the project is determined primarily by the ratio of the goals being achieved and the resources available to achieve them. And here Putin was in a much better position.

[Alexey Dashkin]

In that project, it was necessary to glue wallpaper and bring in furniture - stupidly, to develop light industry and other consumer goods with the corresponding liberalization of the economy by the "NEP".
In the presence of a fully functioning heavy machinery, science and other state institutions of society and fundamental foundations.

[kor1vet1974]

Why are you not criticized as Gorbachev, Yeltsin???

They started, he continued..

[Alexey Dashkin]

[quote=Joker62][quote=9PA]
And Putin got almost complete collapse ... [/ quote]
In the psychiatric hospital, the window was closed again)))
what else on *** "collapse"
The collapse was in the 45th - after only a decade and a half after which the country flew into space.

[victor50]

Quote: Joker62

And Putin is forced to go on about the oligarchs,

So everyone but him? Do you have such an opinion about every acting person or only in relation to him?

[alekseykabanets]

Quote: Joker62

And who began to ruin the state? Putin again? And everywhere Putin is to blame.

And who continued to destroy the state? It has come to the point that the lag behind the USA and China is already greater than that of the Republic of Ingushetia before the First World War from the leading caps. countries.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

Quote: Joker62

Why are you not criticized as Gorbachev, Yeltsin???

Yes, criticizing the dead is not only bold, but also very useful. But why stop at Gorbachev? Brezhnev staged a stagnation, Khrushchev quarreled with China, Stalin allowed a German to reach Moscow, Lenin planted an atomic bomb under the USSR, Nicholas II lost to the Japs, well, Alexander III seemed to be the tsar, it’s only on his inheritance that we hold on ...

Quote: Joker62

And Putin got almost complete collapse, the war in the Caucasus, where many mediocre generals, such as Grachev, simply ruined the army.

Grachev retired since 1996.

[Edward Vashchenko]

This, at last, seems to be understood in Moscow. Therefore, they decided that yes, it was necessary to fight with the usual and prescribed blood scheme “company - battalion - regiment - division - army - front”.

Well, why write nonsense, what kind of blood-scheme?
WWII - was a new type of war, everyone learned to control from wheels.
In what kind of textbooks was it written, we are fighting: a company, a battalion, some kind of Western word ...
If everything was spelled out in "blood", then why then brilliant commanders? Take the charter and fight. And the generals, it's about applying new tactics on the battlefield: from a reinforced flank (Levktra) to tank wedges.

[break_beats]

Quote from: FoBoss_VM

Until they shoot creatures like Serdyukov and Makarov, all these reforms are doomed to failure. For they will be made by exactly the same personalities ... Campaign Russians do not throw their slogan about Putin and his managers. The whole country knows that he is a pest and a traitor, but the president does not put him on trial, because he is his own. So everything will be like in a joke about the Avtovaz plant. I told you the place is cursed, and you hands out of your ass, hands out of your ass

I call it a brilliant idea within a fantastically primitive concept!

[FoBoss_VM]

And I call your comment as a concentrated release of greenhouse gases into the aquatic environment, accompanied by a loud sound effect. What's next?

[Gardamir]

As for the brigades. It's not about that. that they are more mobile than divisions. Many in the late 80's and early 90's reviewed videos. The videos were American and the American army defeated everyone on them. Yes, and remember Desert Storm, this is not some kind of Soviet Patriotic War. There, American brigades defeated a strong Iraqi army.
In addition, optimizers came to power in the country. Now, if Kudrin agreed. so that he is left with one kidney, one lung, one eye, one ear, then he can be allowed for optimization. It is clear that in peacetime in the army a lot of things are not needed. But what about the strategy? The trick is that in the current reality there is not a single strategist at the top. They don't know what will happen in the future. The main thing today is to cut.

[Lykases1]

In my opinion, "Desert Storm" was a call. At that time, the same technique was in service in the USSR. Yes, not everywhere, but stood. Those colleagues showed how air defense breaks through, how cruise missiles, dlro aircraft, and jamming aircraft operate effectively. It would seem - watch and learn. But no. Our everything is kilometer columns on the march. But even in the infantry we have miracles. I once read an article about how one teacher at a military university was asked a question. Rides, for example, BMP 3 with troops. There is a vehicle commander. There is a commander of the landing squad. And who is in command? And the Colonel got bored. Another question - the BMP landed troops, he went forward and collided with the enemy. Behind there is a car with a good gun. How will the department request support? The Colonel answered with a voice. And if the distance is 200 meters? The teacher said that he had no time and left. Well, then why be surprised if these teachers train officers?

[parma]

Quote: Lykases1

In my opinion, "Desert Storm" was a call. At that time, the same technique was in service in the USSR. Yes, not everywhere, but stood. Those colleagues showed how air defense breaks through, how cruise missiles, dlro aircraft, and jamming aircraft operate effectively. It would seem - watch and learn. But no. Our everything is kilometer columns on the march. But even in the infantry we have miracles. I once read an article about how one teacher at a military university was asked a question. Rides, for example, BMP 3 with troops. There is a vehicle commander. There is a commander of the landing squad. And who is in command? And the Colonel got bored. Another question - the BMP landed troops, he went forward and collided with the enemy. Behind there is a car with a good gun. How will the department request support? The Colonel answered with a voice. And if the distance is 200 meters? The teacher said that he had no time and left. Well, then why be surprised if these teachers train officers?

“Storm” is “storm”, there was not yet such a strong impression, in terms of strength they were + - equal, but the UN forces had an advantage in aircraft and, most importantly, in technology. Therefore, it was still possible to attribute the victory to these facts, but the invasion in 2003 plays with other colors. In 2003, Iraq had 7 (!) times more forces, while Iraq was on the defensive, but the army was crushed in less than 3 weeks ... and not just bombarded like during a "storm", but simply drove through the country like a skating rink ...

[ab111]

How the air defense (our air defense) breaks through was shown by the Jews in a series of Arab wars of the 60-80s.

[Comet]

Quote: ab111

How the air defense (our air defense) breaks through was shown by the Jews in a series of Arab wars of the 60-80s.

These "breakthroughs" have nothing to do with our air defense.

[Comet]

Quote: Lykases1

In my opinion, "Desert Storm" was a call. At that time, the same technique was in service in the USSR.

No, not the same technique.

Quote: Lykases1

Those colleagues showed how air defense breaks through, how cruise missiles, dlro aircraft, and jamming aircraft operate effectively. It would seem - watch and learn.

There is nothing to learn there. This did not work against modern RES and air defense systems at that time.

[Lykases1]

Quite the same. We, at that time, were quite armed with the same ones from -75 and from -125. T62 and T72 tanks still drive today. Naturally, our weapons were modernized, but nonetheless.

[Comet]

Quote: Lykases1

Quite the same. We, at that time, were quite armed with the same ones from -75 and from -125.

In the USSR, the basis of the country's air defense was the mixed formations S-300PS / PT and S-200V / M under the control of automated control systems. The S-300PM was already in serial production. None of this happened in Iraq. In the USSR, the S-75 and S-125 were "additional" or generally in secondary directions. There were even SA-75s in Iraq, which did not exist in the USSR at all. In the USSR, in the air defense of the SV there were Buk-M1, S-200V / M and there were already S-300V and Tor. None of this happened in Iraq. In the radar it is similar: 5N64, 64N6, 9S15, 9S18M1, ....

Quote: Lykases1

T62 and T72 tanks still drive today. Naturally, our weapons were modernized, but nonetheless.

Iraqi T-72s have never been in service with the SA. The T-72BM and the Iark T-72 had a completely different design of armored barriers, an FCS and a cannon. The Iraqi T-72 BPS were decommissioned by the SA 10 years before Desert Storm.

[Sergej1972]

Is there a separate BMP commander? There is a squad leader who is also the commander of an infantry fighting vehicle.

[Lykases1]

Each car has a commander, a mechanic, a gunner, a radio operator. The tank is the same, but without a radio operator

[Sergej1972]

Looked at several sources. There is no separate vehicle commander in the BMP. The squad leader is also the commander of the vehicle. The gunner is also the deputy commander of the vehicle. There is no radio operator on the BMP in the distance. Squad shooters are not included in the crew.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Gardamir

Yes, and remember Desert Storm, this is not some kind of Soviet Patriotic War. There, American brigades defeated a strong Iraqi army.

EMNIP, in 1991 there were not brigades, but divisions and even corps. The brigades of that time were temporary consolidated formations from the subdivisions of divisions, united by the permanent headquarters of the brigades that were available in the states of the divisions - a sort of campfgruppen of the new time.

[Edward Vashchenko]

The army worked perfectly, but the whole catch was that the Russian military acted according to deployment plans that were developed almost under Defense Minister G.K. Zhukov.

Well, why write this?
Plans G.K. Zhukov to deploy something in the Georgian SSR by the RSFSR?
Where did they lie, in the secret archives of the NKVD-SMERSH or the Central Committee of the CPSU, and were they found in the presidential administration? Are there any plans by Baryatinsky or Milyutin to deploy in these same areas in the XNUMXth century?
Under Zhukov, as well as after him, until the 90s there was the North Caucasian and Transcaucasian military districts, there were no battles between them on their territory.

[erased]

The essence of the problem is shown well. But there are questions.
1. "Here it is simply necessary to make an excursion into history, and back in Soviet times. It was then, and not under Serdyukov-Ivanov, that they began to kill the Soviet army system ..."
The request to the author to name the documents and indicate links to them, where the above is stated. Because the statement itself is strange.
2. "Here it is worth recalling the example of Marshal Tukhachevsky, who gave birth to the idea of ​​mechanized corps, consisting of a thousand tanks each. And how these corps, left without control and supply, were destroyed in the first month of the war, proving their complete incapacity ..."
The tank corps were disbanded in 1939 following their unsuccessful performance in the Polish campaign.
Newly created in 1940 following an analysis of Germany's war against France. These corps had 1031 tanks in the state and looked like monsters, only there were only a few full-staff corps, the rest were very incomplete. And Tukhachevsky, who was shot in 1937, had nothing to do with them.
3. The motorized rifle regiment of the 1989 model and the motorized rifle brigade of 2010 have the same number of battalions, the brigade has one more artillery division and instead of a reconnaissance company there is a reconnaissance battalion, only of a non-standard staff. That is, in fact, there is no difference. In combat terms, the brigade is no stronger than the regiment. This is a really moronic reform.
Outcome. With proper coverage of issues and good presentation of materials, it would be good to observe documentary correctness.
Thanks for the interesting content.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: erased

3. The motorized rifle regiment of the 1989 model and the motorized rifle brigade of 2010 have the same number of battalions, the brigade has one more artillery division and instead of a reconnaissance company there is a reconnaissance battalion, only of a non-standard staff. That is, in fact, there is no difference. In combat terms, the brigade is no stronger than the regiment. This is a really moronic reform.

On paper, yes. But in fact, equality between them is achieved only after the mobilization and staffing of this very regiment. And only under the condition of an official declaration of war. The brigade was originally envisaged with 90% staffing, moreover, contract soldiers.
Brigades Makarov-Serdyukov - this is the result of 08.08.08. When it turned out that on paper we had a division, but in fact a brigade was going into battle from it. And the rest is cropped and will be ready for battle in a couple of weeks, or even a month.

[erased]

Well, where are these mobilized brigades? Now they are fighting with some BTGs, their completeness is a big question.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: erased

Well, where are these mobilized brigades?

And there are none. What is now called brigades, except for the name, has nothing to do with the Makarov-Serdyukov brigades. The reform was killed from two sides - the financiers and the Arbat generals. The result - we got brigades stuffed with conscripts, and even with cropped units. The same pre-reform divisions, profile view.

[nazgul-ishe]

Any army is not perfect and requires constant improvement. New weapons should appear and run in the troops constantly. New structures and units can only be tested in combat conditions, which means wars are inevitable. You must be very careless not to understand this.

[Voronezh]

That's right .... But will these 5-7 years be, that is the question. How is it with us, a new supreme came and "to the foundation, and then ....."

[Kirill Valkovsky]

All these unfortunate experts are still trying to pretend that the army "is about to run out of ammunition." It was 11 months NWO ...

[doktorkurgan]

And rushed. They began to stamp out brigade regiments by reinforcing a motorized rifle regiment with a tank battalion

I am wildly sorry, but in the SME, the tank battalion in the state has been at least since the 70s.

[doktorkurgan]

A motorized rifle brigade is essentially just a motorized rifle regiment, reinforced by another motorized rifle battalion, artillery, anti-aircraft and anti-tank battalions.

I apologize again, but the artillery (122 or 152 mm howitzers), anti-aircraft (Shilka or Tunguska) and anti-tank division (ATGM "Malyutka" or "Competition" on the BRMD-2 chassis) were regularly part of the SME , back from the 70s.

[Boris55]

Quote: R. Skomorokhov

The creation of new divisions is not mobilized into the army to drive,

Drive? To protect the Motherland, your home, your family - this is the true purpose of a man! Those who have not been hunted down and fled, whose IFOs are known, should never again hold public office, receive education at the expense of the state.

The change in the concept of war invariably led to a change in the formation of the army. This is a natural and inevitable process. Putin, having held a meeting with the generals of the General Staff, gave them the last Chinese to start loving the Motherland or resign, for the time being voluntarily.

[Alexey Dashkin]

For tankers, there is no longer any education, treatment, and other goodies at the expense of "the expense of some kind of state."
for a long time. over.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

Americans have long defended their home, homeland and family on every continent except where their home, homeland and family are located. Now we have decided to take an example. But then do not complain that the people do not understand the high meaning of what is happening.

[Rustic]

Putin, having held a meeting with the generals of the General Staff, gave them the last Chinese to start loving the Motherland or resign, for the time being voluntarily.

Empty blah blah. No one there does not know how to do anything, except for sawing and theft, and does not want to. And no one will resign, these can only be taken out feet first from there. And to help them endure quickly, Putin will not give, he does not abandon his own. Here comes the vicious circle. From time to time everyone says and says talking shop, but nothing changes.

[alexey_444]

Reforms ... We must look at the time at which they were, Tukhachevsky's ideas were correct, only as usual the connection let us down, without communication it was useless to manage such armadas. Transfer to brigades, closing departments, so there was no money, then each institute was transferred to the university, so that more money would be allocated, there was such a time. As they say, happiness and misfortune (its) would help. The army must fight, Hitler clearly showed by defeating the non-belligerent, numerically superior armies of Europe, like a car that should drive if it stands "rusted".

[Eug]

I have a question for the author - is he actually aware that he insisted (and eventually insisted) on the formation of 1000 Zhukov tank corps? For everything else, we urgently need to improve system intelligence (the battlefield and the nearest rear), sayazi and the interaction of the same BTG and RTG, platoons and even squads. In the end, the APU sometimes succeeds very well
efficiently.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Eug

I have a question for the author - is he actually aware that he insisted (and eventually insisted) on the formation of 1000 Zhukov tank corps?

You are wrong. MK is not his brainchild, and returning to them was largely a forced decision

[Sergey_K]

Comrade colonels! Majors, Soviet, agree with you. But... better late than never! Only, maybe we will finally do what is called "in the mind." I also want to say - the reform of the army, this is, first of all, the reform of the entire state !!!

[kor1vet1974]

better late than never!

It becomes a tradition, but in time, is it impossible?

[Vladimir80]

The most dangerous thing is that the new reform that the authors dream of will most likely finally finish off our army - you cannot win the war by changing the plates on the offices and changing the entries in the military ID. I haven’t heard anywhere about the necessary industrial mobilization, a return to the Soviet system is to build thousands of tanks (obsolete) and planes (obsolete) at the expense of the economy, so only 91 years can be brought closer. I have not heard anywhere about building up a satellite constellation and about the production of drones. Without admitting mistakes and lies about import substitution, we will again sit in a puddle with this reform

[kor1vet1974]

Reforms in the Russian army are like playing in a sandbox .. I made a Easter cake, broke it, then a new one .. Yes, and the reforms in the country are the same ..

[Boris55]

Quote: kor1vet1974

Reforms in the Russian army are like playing in a sandbox.

Newton's Third Law: Every action causes a reaction.

If the West had not imposed such a war on us in Ukraine, then there would be no reason for us to reform the army. The old structure of the army showed itself perfectly in the war in Syria.

[Alexey Dashkin]

Who imposed something on you there ...
There is such a good thing for this - a fence is called. With dogs and bazookas.

[S. Viktorovich]

The published list of wishes on the principle of "increase everything" can hardly be called a reform.
Lots of "why" questions. Why increase the Airborne Forces if there is no transport aviation? Why increase the number of marines if there is no corresponding fleet and tasks for it?
The main question is how to do all this and is it possible in principle with the existing economy, education, state of scientific and engineering schools? It is pointless to continue to get trash from Soviet storage bases, personnel reserves have been exhausted.

[UAZ 452]

The key here is the formation of divisions in virtually every branch of the Armed Forces and branch of service. A division is primarily a general's position, and not even one, since it provides for a corresponding increase in general and colonel's positions in higher headquarters. So we decided not to offend either the landing or the naval lobby - to all the sisters in earrings (stripes), let no one leave offended. The efficiency of all this economy is the last thing the authors care about.

[UAZ 452]

How many offices will need to be filled with generals ...

This is the only concrete content of the announced reform - more general posts. Well, fatter budgets, which generals in uniform and without (who are from the military-industrial complex and various government structures in charge of it) will steer. Everything. But why would one expect an increase in the combat capability of the army from this reform? What is the connection?

[Alexey Dashkin]

when you speak - the impression that you are delusional (s)

devastation was in the 45th - and what about then in the 61st? ...)

[Boris Sergeev]

NATO has so far provided only part of the equipment of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and intelligence with advisers. NATO itself has not yet come to the war.

[Alexey Dashkin]

And, half of the junk.
xs if they start not junk ...

[Vyacheslav Krylov]

I read the article, comments, put the pros / cons and got the following.
The article is stupid, but with many pictures instead of thoughtful analysis and realistic suggestions.
The comments are interesting, informative, informative.
A site with pluses / minuses cheats.
So, realism and perspectives are in front of you in all its glory.

[Antey]

Quote: certero

The topic of the article is correct, but where is the money for all this?
However, I know exactly where.
My friend has a fairly wealthy person, both daughters study in the UK.
When they began to study there, the daughter of the former Minister of Defense Serdyukov also studied at the same school. Only, unlike my friend's daughters, she flew to the UK on her personal plane.
All these planes, yachts, real estate in Western countries, stocks, bonds, deposits in Western banks - this is the missing electronics, radio stations, communications and simple uniforms for our army. Until the perpetrators are held accountable, nothing will change.

Ha, okay, if only the minister was stealing! What about at the front? "Shoot here, don't shoot there!" The command of divisions and units has its own little gesheft. They were sent from the other side so that they would not touch someone's objects. Corruption as a way of life in the military sphere.

[Boris Sergeev]

As a result of sabotage, called "reforms", a little over 100 tank lieutenants and 400 pilot lieutenants a year are produced in the country. It is impossible to even recruit officers for the 17 divisions that should be created according to Shoigu's plan. Most importantly, the reductions in military schools continued from 2007 to 2012, under the leadership of those who are now announcing another "reform" of the army. It turns out that no one will give a car to a half-educated mechanic for repair a second time, and the army will be reformed by the forces of the same "irreplaceable" - please!

[depressant]

Who, when and how came up with such a stellar idea with brigades, I can’t say for sure ...

Roman, I remember, immediately after the 2008 war with Georgia, the press literally choked: brigades are needed!

[Alex92]

Well, I don’t know, Tukhachevsky was dragged in vain here, I think that without the results of his actions, we would have lost the war. Why and how to justify your point of view in the comments will be very long and voluminous.
And so yes, due to what and who were going to do all of the above is a big question. Here we must also remember that all this is rather conditional - an example: a division of the Red Army in the 41st is 10000 people (well, roughly, roughly), with the appropriate staff of equipment, a division of the Wehrmacht is 17000. Here is the ground for manipulation during the reform- you can deploy as many divisions as you like, with a staff of 1.5 brigades of 4000 personnel ... The main thing is to master the means.
Well, in terms of timing, Hitler created a combat-ready army in 6 years. Yes, I know times are different, but... You can do it in 10-12, or you can find an excuse again and start new reforms, already in the 2030s... If they don’t crush us

[Alexey Dashkin]

How much do you remember
platoon 30, company 100, regiment 1000, division 3000

[Sergej1972]

Where is the battalion? There are no such small divisions anywhere.

[Rinat Khametov]

Khatskelevich’s mechanized corps was destroyed not because he was a bad corps, but because Khatskilevich was a Trotskyist ..... And the corps was drained on purpose ..... Instead of disrupting the logistics of the tank groups that were rushing deep into the country, this one began to retreat, losing equipment with a small resource work due to the lack of fuel and aviation, by the way, they took all the air defense from him in this mechanized corps .....
And with normal leadership, this very fur corps could leave the Germans without fuel and demanded everything for the conduct of hostilities.
By the way, the Germans advanced as if they knew for sure that this corps would not hit them on the flank ....

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Rinat Khametov

Instead of disrupting the logistics of tank groups that were rushing deep into the country, this one began to retreat, losing equipment with a short service life due to lack of fuel and aviation

Ahem ... but how to disrupt the logistics of tank groups without fuel and aircraft? Or at the sight of enemy tanks, our tanks forget about fuel?
Khatskilevich did exactly what Boldin and Pavlov ordered him to do. And it was not his fault that there were no enemy tanks in the direction of attack - the 3rd TGr then lost intelligence at all levels, and the front headquarters simply did not take into account the possibility of its turn to Minsk. Well, then it all happened again like it used to - the mechanized corps, unwound on the march by air strikes and equipment breakdowns, ran into the anti-tank guns of the German infantry and got stuck in it. Virtually no artillery. Without fuel. No rears. On the second day, communication with the divisions was also lost. In general, a typical picture of a year ago - the battles of French tank units with the Wehrmacht.

Quote: Rinat Khametov

And with normal leadership, this very fur corps could leave the Germans without fuel and demanded everything for the conduct of hostilities.

To do this, it is necessary to rebuild the entire USSR starting from the mid-20s. For management needs cadres, cadres need materiel, and materiel needs reconnaissance and supplies. And to maintain all this, a different economy is needed - and not one in which the army has 3/4 of low-combat-ready territorial divisions (because the territory costs the treasury ten times cheaper than personnel), any plans to increase the number of divisions are faced with the requirement to maintain the total number (hence the divisions of the plan Tukhachevsky in 7000 people), and the personnel, instead of combat training, are busy equipping the PPD in a household way - for money and materials as planned no.
And personnel must begin to be trained 15 years before the war. So that 70-80% of cadets do not enter schools, having an elementary school behind them or having nothing at all. And in order to have time to prepare commanders from these cadets.

And in the form in which the 6th MK met the war in the real USSR (judging by the reports of the corps in the spring of 1941), no leadership will help it.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

Quote: Alex92

Well, in terms of timing, Hitler created a combat-ready army in 6 years. Yes, I know times are different, but...

This is not a record yet. At the beginning of WWII, the US Army numbered as many as 148 thousand people with almost no equipment.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Yaroslav Tekkel

This is not a record yet. At the beginning of WWII, the US Army numbered as many as 148 thousand people with almost no equipment.

It is worth adding that half the number of US ground forces accounted for coastal artillery. And a third of the peacetime divisions were located outside the Metropolis: one - in Hawaii, one - in the Philippines.

[Sergej1972]

But at the same time, the United States had a powerful fleet at that time.

[Ezekiel 25-17]

There is no Stalin, there is no Beria ... They cannot be returned, well, at least remember how they did it.

[Rinat Khametov]

Stalin was ill with exactly the same disease as Hitler, faith in his own infallibility ..... Well, the Georgians did not expect that the Austrian corporal was such a blockhead that having a military machine three times less than the USSR had to decide on military operations ..... And Hitler went the war on the USSR, without even having a clear idea of ​​\u34b\uXNUMXbwhat the USSR actually has in terms of military equipment, I remember he threw such a phrase. If he knew that the USSR had tanks like t-XNUMX, then he would not have started a war
In any case, both then and now, betrayal plays a huge role .....

[Million]

a clash with NATO in a conflict without the use of nuclear weapons is possible, and the Russian army has very little chance in it.

Why such a conclusion?
Technology is technology, but the human factor plays a significant role.

[Alexey Dashkin]

"Technology is technology, but the human factor plays a significant role."

no longer plays
you were deceived (((

[Rinat Khametov]

Comrade, do you remember the text of the oath? Where does it say that those drafted into the army must fight abroad?

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

That's exactly why. I don’t remember in the American, British or even the undeservedly ridiculed French army a special term for soldiers and officers who joined the army for a preferential mortgage, and when the war began, they began to submit batches of reports of dismissal.

[spirit]

, but ours grasped the idea clearly: the main thing is the general!

This phrase describes well what modern Generals are like and you can’t argue

[Adrey]

And how these corps, left without control and supplies, were destroyed in the first month of the war, proving their complete incapacity.

And then, in the winter of 1941, it was necessary to quickly form tank brigades in order to be able to maneuver in conditions of an acute shortage of tanks. But after 1941 came 1944, and tank armies, well-functioning instruments for destroying everything in their path, were already entering Germany and other countries. The raids of the armies of Lelyushenko and Rybalko became the decoration of any textbook, whether tactics or history.

The author is disingenuous, oh, disingenuous)...
It’s hard to disagree with the first part of the quote, but here’s what follows. The tank armies of 44 were formed from tank corps, but those from tank brigades! That is, the base unit has not changed since 41.
The crisis of 41 with the formation of tank brigades was caused not only and not so much by the lack of tanks (well, they would have created a division instead of three tank brigades. What’s the problem?), but correct crisis assessment Management.
The wartime German tank division corresponded in number and strength to our tank corps (about 120 tanks) and appeared after the reform of pre-war tank divisions numbering 330-350 cars Those. The Germans, independently of us and somewhat earlier, came to the conclusion that such monsters were ineffective and poorly controlled.
A certain Manstein, in his memoirs, equated the management of a tank corps to the management of a combined arms army in terms of the number of decisions made per unit of time.
So it’s most likely not the brigade structure, it’s something else...
Well, one of my colleagues once correctly wrote here that it is impossible to bring such a monster as a modern division in its entirety to the training ground. There won’t be enough echelons or it will take months to move forward, and we need to look for training grounds of this size.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Adrey

The crisis of 41 with the formation of tank brigades was caused not only and not so much by the lack of tanks (well, they would have created a division instead of three tank brigades. What’s the problem?), but by a correct assessment of the management crisis.

Well, yes - instead of consolidated temporary Kampfgruppen, assembled anew each time from division units for a specific task, in the BTV KA at the end of the summer of 1941 they decided to rely on the permanent core of the Kampfgruppe in the form of a permanent brigade, on which, if necessary, they could attach reinforcement means. This greatly simplified combat coordination and interaction within such a camp group, at the cost of some loss of tactical flexibility.
Well, our tank commanders of the early 40s were not willing to form combined groups - especially considering that until 1940 our armored fighting vehicles were generally fairly homogeneous tank brigades, suitable only for direct support of infantry (since most of them did not have standard motorized infantry and artillery was). And these commanders are handed a formation - two tank regiments of heterogeneous composition, a motorized regiment with artillery, an artillery regiment, an anti-aircraft division and other units.
Plus the eternal problem with infantry commanders pulling formations apart - units were constantly pulled out of the division to solve tactical problems, so that as a result, by the time it was brought into battle, it had shrunk to a regiment.

[Adrey]

Of course I completely agree with you.
I even tried to give examples of progress indicating the reasons for these reforms.
But at this stage, as usual, we have our own vision of the problem and it sounds ambiguous to me, unfortunately: “We can’t effectively use brigades, we don’t have enough strength. Give us a division, then we’ll wow!”
More battalions to God of battalions... But the practice of “large battalions” always has a negative (disastrous) effect on society...
PS It's a pity there are no emoticons

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

Quote: Adrey

The wartime German tank division corresponded in size and strength to our tank corps (about 120 tanks) and appeared after the reform of pre-war tank divisions numbering 330-350 vehicles.

350 vehicles is indeed too much, but 120 was not due to a good life, but due to a lack of tanks. After the war, the Germans again came to divisions with 300+ tanks (both in Germany and the GDR). And at the beginning of WWII, oddly enough, the most reasonable staff of a tank division was the French - 200-odd tanks in six battalions, a good motorized infantry regiment of three battalions, a reconnaissance battalion in armored vehicles, an engineering battalion and well-thought-out supplies in special armored personnel carriers. The only thing is that the artillery against the German counterpart was rather weak.

[Introvert]

Quote from strelec69

who prevented the current under-minister from reviving schools

I served in the Ministry of Emergency Situations for 8 years, although not in Russia, but I think the essence is the same. They jokingly called it “My-Clean-Wash”. Mostly ordinary fighters worked at everything above - fraud and window dressing. No, there were also normal officers. But the system worked for show and beautiful reports. Over these 8 years, changes were only in the direction of increasing paperwork and reporting. So, your minister also works for the wrapper: games, parades, temples. They don’t know any other way now.

[Alexey RA]

And then, in the winter of 1941, it was necessary to quickly form tank brigades in order to be able to maneuver in conditions of an acute shortage of tanks.

The reason for the transition to a brigade structure was not a shortage of tanks. The new brigades required so many tanks that they could equip three dozen tank divisions.
The reason was different - the average level of Soviet tank (and infantry) commanders did not allow them to operate a divisional-regimental structure copied from the Panzerwaffe, in which it was supposed to fight in tactical groups formed “on the fly” from divisional units for specific tasks. Well, our consolidated BTGs didn’t work out. Therefore, we decided to make ready-made BTG brigades. And then, having learned the personnel and tested the structure of the “building blocks”, begin to unite them into larger formations - corps and army.
Where the Germans pulled out units from regiments, battalions and divisions and united it with the headquarters of the Kampfgruppe, they took from us a ready-made brigade, which was given reinforcements from the corps and army.

[flyer]

All “reformers” and “effective” managers after dismissal emerge in new, no less significant positions, so there is no point in further reforms while the managers are still the same parquet generals.

[User_neydobniu]

I ran through the text and again the 2 main theses of our cheering “patriots”

1) As usual, the mine was planted by our jingoistic “patriot” by the USSR, how could it be otherwise?

Here it is simply necessary to take an excursion into history, back in Soviet times. It was then, and not under Serdyukov-Ivanov, that they began to kill the Soviet army system

2) There’s no need for a lot of equipment; in general, military equipment is evil; people can’t get enough of it

Today we have a slightly different schedule. If we want to see these divisions created from scratch and deployed from brigades, all this requires hundreds of tanks and self-propelled guns. Airplanes and helicopters. Hundreds too. And planes, helicopters and tanks need crews. Trained and trained. The question arises - where to get them?

In general, judging by the agenda that our respected author decided to ask - mobilized fight with what you have, we will not give you equipment and the latest systems (you idiots will not understand it), and if you don’t like something, it’s all the USSR’s fault. Yay, yay

[Rinat Khametov]

The other day I watched a film called the best people in hell... The scenes hurt my eyes when half a platoon of infantrymen with light riflemen tries to capture a building... At the same time, I clearly remember the story of my father, who served the entire war in tank reconnaissance, about what they used in urban battles self-propelled guns against houses like these in which the defenders are sitting, a self-propelled gun hits point-blank with a 152 mm high-explosive charge, first at one corner of the building, then at the second.... At the same time, the facade collapses.
That's it, the house is captured without any infantry....

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

Well, yes, when the housemates in this house only have faust cartridges that shoot at 50-80 m and are not recommended for shooting from indoors, you can drive up (almost) point-blank. What if there is NLAW?

[Rustic]

What if there is NLAW?

3-4 snipers and a couple of machine guns, and not a single suicide bomber with NLAW will stick his head out. But the problem is not this, but the fact that, firstly, no one will allocate a tank, and secondly, there is an order not to use such tactics, but to methodically smoke them out with the help of assault groups, losing personnel.

[SergioPetrov]

This is if they don’t have a machine gun in the house and a couple of three snipers and a Mavik doesn’t fly nearby and doesn’t direct enemy artillery, but otherwise, then yes.

[Alexey RA]

Then there was the reign of Serdyukov. Yes, by a strange coincidence, in 2008 the army was able to solve the Georgian problem.
The army worked perfectly, but the whole catch was that the Russian military acted according to deployment plans that were developed almost under Defense Minister G.K. Zhukov.

The army performed extremely poorly. And the victory in the campaign on 08.08.08 was due to the fact that we had Georgians as our opponents. With a normal opponent, we would have washed ourselves in blood even then.
See for yourself. The first stage of any local war over the past half century is gaining air supremacy and suppressing enemy air defenses. What is our Air Force doing? They send YES to the unsuppressed air defense, and then tell stories about the Georgian S-200s, although information about Georgia’s purchase of Bukovs was published in an open UN report. The surveillance radar near Gori was killed only on the third day - all this time the Air Force was feverishly searching the districts for the living “Phantasmagoria”. What prevented us from doing this before the war (the situation was heating up for at least two weeks + a week before the war there were exercises with the scenario “helping peacekeepers”) - there is a great mystery.
Ground troops. These have even forgotten the experience of the two Chechens, an example of which is the attack on Khrulev’s column by a Georgian group (patrol, guards - why, because the army commander with journalists is rushing forward on the white horse of the BTG). Systematic actions are replaced by personal heroism, not provided with equipment and personnel. Reconnaissance units were left in the rear to guard the tunnel. The army is fighting with equipment from the Afghan era, with staff levels worse than in Chechnya. The training of personnel is such that commanders do not know how to use the already deployed communications - during rare general exercises, communications were carried out via mobile phones. Interaction with aviation is not only zero, but negative - any air target is fired upon by military air defense. Army aviation was lucky that it was not sitting behind the ridge.
Fleet... hmm. The actions of the fleet can be judged by the fact that the greatest losses of the Georgian Navy were caused by the 45th Airborne Regiment, which sank in the harbor those ships that the fleet had previously reported being destroyed.

We were very lucky that the Georgians were against us. Who, judging by the well-known article by Okruashvili, upon learning about the approach of our troops, first succumbed to panic and then fell into apathy. And even at the last line before Tbilisi, after the news that there would be no engineering equipment for digging trenches, it was simply lay in the gardens and watched the movement of the enemy.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

You are absolutely right. You can also recall the Georgian artillery brigade, which the entire artillery of the Russian group could not suppress, firing cars of shells and missiles “in that direction.” If the Georgians themselves would shoot accurately (like today’s Ukrainians), we would be in a very sour situation.

[ab111]

Good afternoon Sorry, I don't come here often...
But I wanted to ask... maybe someone will answer...:
Why has there never been a single attempt to disrupt the supply of Western weapons, equipment and ammunition from Poland and Romania over the entire nearly one-year period of the Northern Military District in Ukraine?
Why were some railway marshalling stations and the notorious bridges not destroyed, but at least not damaged?
Why were no attempts ever made to derail the echelons? Even if they were unsuccessful (the Ukrainian propaganda would definitely have trumpeted them to the whole world)? Why was not a single DRG sent to the rear?

[BAI]

There is one answer to all questions - such an agreement

[ab111]

I don’t even know what’s worse in this case...
An agreement or a banal inability to carry out operations in the rear?

[Rinat Khametov]

In the same direction, if I’m not mistaken, in Europe the width of the railway gauge is narrower than in Russia..... As in 1941, and now at the beginning, measures to destroy places and equipment for changing the gauge from European to Ukrainian were not undertaken...

[vvn_vl]

reform? is it sewing new uniforms for each parade, holding all sorts of exhibitions and conferences, etc.? or the minister reading unfamiliar words from a piece of paper in front of the falling asleep generals? It’s strange that the party leaders who were sent to lead the army, after 6 months of a murky and absolutely ill-planned operation, are still sitting in their chairs, although they could already be in charge of medicine or education

[Rinat Khametov]

What’s interesting is that 2022, on May 9th, the parade is in full swing, and at the parade they are still pushing us with this same armature and similar equipment that is available in single copies especially for exhibitions.. let’s see what we have this year on May 9th, will it be a show again or will it be show exactly what works and shoots at the front..
By the way, as I understand about the fact that at the parade you have to be in full dress uniform, they completely hammered home..... Some women wander around either in black skirts with black boots or in white skirts with black shoes about warriors who walk around with their chests open in vests different colors I'm generally silent

[Rinat Khametov]

How in XNUMX the leadership came out and did not want to quarrel with the military... Moreover, in XNUMX at least Pavlov was spanked along with the lever man. But now the embarrassment remains without consequences. I recalled that there was evidence that Pavlov did everything deliberately badly, just like Zhora the butcher

[Igor Zhorov]

I don’t understand why it is necessary to divide the district? Do inspectors have to fly far from Moscow to Arkhangelsk? Why create chocolate places for inspectors of the availability of bedside slippers for conscripts? BTG appeared because conscripts cannot be involved in the military military service; again, there are peacetime and wartime states. There is no war and there is no required availability of personnel to conduct combat operations. In general, since 2014 there has been a steady decline in the real income of military personnel. OFFICIAL inflation is more than the 4 percent offset in October. There is nothing easier: at the end of the year in January, increase the monetary allowance in accordance with inflation. Should the economy be economical? The accumulative mortgage system involves the payment of a substantial amount after 20 years of service. Only in conditions of inflation there is no point in saving money, everyone takes out a military mortgage, which means that banks will take half of what they deserve for interest. Why can’t we give a loan to the military, who can be called upon to carry out a combat mission at any time?

[Alexey RA]

Quote from buslaif

At the same time, there was a reduction in the number of officers from 450 thousand people to 150 thousand.

450 thousand officers for an army of 1 million people - isn’t that a lot? Roughly speaking, this is one officer per private or sergeant.
You will inevitably remember Slashchev:

Arriving in the troops, I found 256 bayonets, 28 guns and with them the 2 division headquarters and the 1 corps headquarters, fully equipped!

[Sergej1972]

There was no transition to a brigade organization in the Strategic Missile Forces and Airborne Forces.

[Maks1995]

The main problem is that the reform “should” be carried out by the same people who previously successfully carried out the anti-reform.

M writes a lot about hatred of America, who kept his son in it until they kicked him out, and lobbied Boeing instead of his aircraft industry, and iPhones instead of his electronics....

And everyone pretends to believe and believe, almost sleeping at the meetings...

[billy bones]

“Here it is simply necessary to take an excursion into history, back in Soviet times. It was then, and not under Serdyukov-Ivanov, that the Soviet army system “company - battalion - regiment - division - army” began to be killed. Many smart people from those times talk today about "The main reason was not the desire to conform to Western standards, but the very trivial desire of Soviet colonels to retire as generals. After all, a general is much fatter than a colonel."

Still, tsarist Russia would have been blamed for what was happening.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

And when you read the critical press of that time about the state of the army under Nicholas II - “you will inevitably believe in the transmigration of souls.” The problems are still the same. And the first of them is “the average officer is interested in anything but military affairs.”

[rica1952]

What the hell is a reform - restoration of the Soviet appearance and reformers starting from Ivanov and including Shoigu, Article 58 of the Criminal Code of the USSR. And it’s not very difficult to understand who led and approved.

[Sergej1972]

The USSR Criminal Code never existed. There were the Fundamentals of the Criminal Legislation of the USSR and the Union Republics and, in accordance with them, the Criminal Code of the Union Republics.

[Thrush]

You read how much needs to be done and think.
Increase the number of armed forces, the number of equipment, the satellite constellation, we need new factories, qualified personnel and workers for these factories - this is all right.
But there is one more task, more abrupt than everything described - these are the conditions for creating all this. To build factories, no matter how strange it may sound, you need to build factories. Factories that will produce machines, equipment and metal structures for the construction of enterprises, accordingly, workers are also needed there, and competent teachers are accordingly needed for training. Teachers also need to be trained somewhere. And they require educational buildings, the construction of which requires workers. In order for all this to begin to function, it is necessary to develop the energy sector, which requires the construction of new facilities, which requires factories and workers, etc. and so on. I think the meaning of the growing coma is clear.
PS But in fact, no matter how complex the problem may seem, there is always a solution, the main thing is that competent people deal with the problem and deal with it, i.e. "cadres decide"

[Ulan.1812]

The main question is, who are the performers?
If the current ones, then there are big doubts that something good will come of it.
Everything will go down the drain, and the output will be nothing.
And again we will have to start a new reform.
A country of constant reforms.
The goal is nothing, the movement is everything.
And most importantly, more and more money.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

To teach a soldier, you must first teach an officer. But the officer does not like to study and actively resists it.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Yaroslav Tekkel

To teach a soldier, you must first teach an officer. But the officer does not like to study and actively resists it.

And then a trained officer comes to the unit - and it turns out that there is enough time either to conduct combat training, or to compile and properly formalize reports and plans about this training. Moreover, they will ask him specifically for reports and plans.
Plus, it turns out that it is extremely difficult to write off materiel lost during combat training (and the ability of personnel to lose materiel entrusted to them is truly legendary). And consumables for new systems were either not intended at all, or are in substandard condition due to the quality of manufacture or the discrepancy between the storage conditions approved by the Ministry of Defense and the manufacturer’s requirements.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

And you are right too. It's a vicious circle. On the one hand, 90% of the officers have seen combat training in their graves, on the other, the system itself is not oriented towards it. And then they are faced with an army that has studied military affairs properly...

[Jack sklo]

Once again, Roman, while touching on serious topics, makes gross factual errors. Where did he find divisions in the tank armies of 1944? There was a chain: brigade-corps-army. The corps became divisions only in the post-war period.

[Vincent price]

Wait, what kind of alarmism is this? Minister of Defense, Army General Shoigu, friend and closest associate of the Supreme Commander-in-Chief, has been developing the army in the right, modern direction for more than 10 years. Modernized and trained. The surprise checks alone are worth it. And here there is such vainness about the Moscow Region. Our army has connections from the 60s, the organization is bad, what kind of lies and slander? Couldn't the army general allow this to happen, or...? Remind me of the joke about beds and prostitutes in a brothel?

[AdAstra]

And the article is correct and the comments to it are correct, but those “at the top” not only don’t give a damn about all this, but also don’t care from a high tower. So we can break spears here endlessly, but it will happen - we have a professional army, but mobilization - machine gun - into battle, oh, excuse me, into our own.

[buslaif]

Quote: Alexey RA

450 thousand officers for an army of 1 million people - isn’t that a lot? Roughly speaking, this is one officer per private or sergeant.
You will inevitably remember Slashchev:

It should be recalled that in the RF Armed Forces at that time we had cadred units, where there were more officers in these units than soldiers and sergeants.
The number of military personnel in the USSR Armed Forces by the end of 1991 reached 3,7-3,8 million people (excluding civilian personnel).
May 7, 1992 -2,5-2,8 million military personnel.
By 1996 - up to 1,7 million (40% compared to 1992).
In April 2015, Deputy Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation Nikolai Pankov reported that the number of officer corps in Russia is about 200 thousand people. Moreover, the payroll composition or the number of staff units is not specified. But this already happened after Serdyukov’s cuts.
In 2017, the regular number of military personnel was 1 million 13 thousand 628 people.

[Viktorkh]

There should be no reforms, there MUST BE SYSTEMIC PROGRESSIVE THOUGHT DEVELOPMENT OF THE ARMY, with obvious and predictable threats to Russia. The collapse of the army, economy, education, medicine is to blame for specific people, with names and positions, enemies, Torah reformers, Gorbachev, Yeltsin, Gaidar, Chubais, officials, ministers of education, medicine, economics, finance, the central bank, the minister of defense... Specific people with names and positions are guilty, every official up to and including the president must personally bear criminal responsibility for his actions, his decisions, or inactions... Bomb.

[Zaurbek]

Today, "Armata" was left without a radar, thermal imager, screens, electronics. And there is nowhere to buy all this, and there was not even a project of its own. And it won't be anymore.

Who said this? All this is produced (and those components that are not are available on the open market).
War is the engine of progress.
1. Lessons from the Afghan war - lost and did not survive until the Caucasian war (together with the officers)
2. The lessons of the Chechen Bolsheviks are less taken into account (but this is more of a police operation)
3. SAR - was a good experience.
4. The 404th war should give something useful.

[Drugov]

It’s scary to imagine how events would have unfolded after February 24 if there had not been Donetsk and volunteer battalions on the front line, and subsequently PMCs. What a destruction the entire machine of the RF Armed Forces suffered in the absence of a powerful core of fighters of the People's Militia of the Republics! And this picture is a direct reflection of the entire 22-year policy of the “great” Putin and his gang. There is a more or less painted facade all around, and behind it there are heaps of crap and these are not even Potemkin villages, this is worse......

[BAI]

1.

How civil outsourcing replaced logistics support.

Periodically we had to check the soldiers' canteen and kitchen. You walk in and are immediately thrown back by a wave of the stench of sauerkraut.
They outsourced and civilian women came into the kitchen. And the dining room immediately began to smell like FOOD, not food! Here it was only beneficial.
2.

Today, "Armata" was left without a radar, thermal imager, screens, electronics. And there is nowhere to buy all this, and there was not even a project of its own. And it won't be anymore.

And where did the Armat battalion come from, which is undergoing coordination at the training ground before being sent to the North Military District zone, which was shown by V. Soloviev (this Sunday on TV), shouting that he was sitting there inside and everything there was crammed with electronics?
Who to believe: your own arrogant, shameless eyes or the honest word of the author?

[Alexey RA]

Quote: BAI

Periodically we had to check the soldiers' canteen and kitchen. You walk in and are immediately thrown back by a wave of the stench of sauerkraut.

Bigos is our everything!
Rumor has it that people have seen this product eat through an aluminum bowl.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

You must always trust your eyes. For example, if show Armat battalion, then there should be 30+ of them in the video.

[lubesky]

The Russian Federation is a country where it is imperative to listen to Shoigu’s words in a comparative analysis with other “officials” and look at real maneuvers. The answer is simple - just two days after the historic meeting of the expanded military board (so expanded that there were people in cassocks sitting there), Manturov declared - “the mobilization of industry and the economy is not needed now”!

This is a response to the author that it was smooth on paper on the podium, but they forgot about the liberal huge ravine in the economy and industry. And if there is no militarization of industry, well, it’s simply physically impossible to deploy more than 10 new divisions, because as the author correctly noted, you need not just a lot of equipment, but simply a breakthrough in equipment and trained personnel for it, who simply need a huge infrastructure!

[Ulan.1812]

Quote: lubesky

The Russian Federation is a country where it is imperative to listen to Shoigu’s words in a comparative analysis with other “officials” and look at real maneuvers. The answer is simple - just two days after the historic meeting of the expanded military board (so expanded that there were people in cassocks sitting there), Manturov declared - “the mobilization of industry and the economy is not needed now”!

This is a response to the author that it was smooth on paper on the podium, but they forgot about the liberal huge ravine in the economy and industry. And if there is no militarization of industry, well, it’s simply physically impossible to deploy more than 10 new divisions, because as the author correctly noted, you need not just a lot of equipment, but simply a breakthrough in equipment and trained personnel for it, who simply need a huge infrastructure!

Indeed, we have a catastrophic shortage of priests in the army.
Let's get more and win.
By the way, the army of the Republic of Ingushetia with its priests lost the First World War, but the Red Army with its political commissars won the Second World War.

[seacap]

The main problem in this whole state mess is the creation of an inherited class society with its inadequate personnel policy based on nepotism, personal loyalty and crime, with a complete disregard for intellectual, professional, moral and business skills, any experience and significant achievements in the field of their activities, in the end and the corresponding result. If the most important and, as it seems to me, the most difficult issue in public administration, which is of vital importance for any state, in addition to a resource and knowledge-intensive, time-difficult issue such as military construction, for some reason (everyone knows) it is prescribed to carry out reforms, or rather the destruction of “an effective manager of furniture production” happened by chance, also Zubkov’s son-in-law, then a “builder” in the end, it is difficult to expect any sane progress and development from their activities, but only degradation covered by a glossy picture. There was only one goal, the destruction of the Soviet legacy according to Hollywood advertisements, i.e. tearing out claws and teeth, killing a bear, turning it into a Cheburashka, it seems to me that this is purposeful and conscious sabotage and a crime, where again there are no guilty people and impunity reigns, well, that’s how it happened, that’s it. Only such “mistakes” for some reason, in the end, are richly seasoned with the blood of a Russian soldier, having previously swallowed shame and humiliation. If such a result was predicted by junior officers and warrant officers, discussing among themselves the ongoing destruction of the Armed Forces, before their shoulder straps were torn off and thrown into the street, the senior leadership and authorities did not see it. Then there are 2 sad conclusions, or their intellectual level, moral and business qualities, or simply logic is so inconsistent with their positions and positions that it’s hard to believe, or they implemented someone else’s will, being to one degree or another under external influence and management of our “bosom partners”. Neither stupidity nor betrayal with such fatal consequences against the state and people, in my opinion, should remain unpunished, regardless of positions held and friendly (family) and other ties in any adequate state.
It is good that at least at this price there has come an understanding and awareness of the depth of the abyss into which we began to slide, that in the Soviet state much was done on the basis of scientific calculations and all historical experience. Based on personal experience, it seems to me that for the immediate and initial replenishment of officers, junior command, especially company, battalion and regimental levels, it is necessary to remove all age restrictions, with health clearance, voluntarily call up those transferred to the reserve and retire, with a real career prospect career growth, salaries and increase in service (together with the labor qualifications (experience)), etc., there is a separate conversation about benefits, the creation of appropriate military service. These measures, in my opinion, will make it possible to obtain a significant number of experienced and honored commanders, instructors, teachers, staff and other unit specialists for at least the first few years, along with short-term commander courses based on the experience of the Second World War. Remove the shameful and humiliating reduction factor from the calculation of pensions, stop dividing the officer corps into “our own” and “foreign Soviet” when calculating pay and pensions.

[Wildcat]

Just a wonderful reform plan, I think.
Timely.
Soon after the New Year, in some places in Ukraine "RASPUTITSA" will end, but we have reform in the yard.

If we don’t even consider the question of where to find “soldat, das officers und generals” for such a planned number of divisions in the Army, even if we don’t consider the question of where to find equipment for these divisions, we will have more divisions than the USA!
This is a real victory!!!
To resolve the issue of equipment and personnel, I propose that the divisions be immediately formed as hussars - both beautifully, and the necessary training of personnel is already underway:


"...three directorates of aviation divisions , eight bomber aviation regiments , one fighter aviation regiment , six brigades Army Aviation".
Everything is simple.
Where can I get personnel and equipment? I propose to resolve the issue of equipment and personnel by switching to my beloved B52.
Here, in fact, is the B52, which I recommend for delivery into service:


I’m not talking about B53, I still have to survive NG.

All of Shoigu’s other proposals are just as wonderful and timely.
In general, Shoigu is great - he has so beautifully “sorted out” the new reform for the Northern Military District.
Bravo!

[cold wind]

There is an excellent acronym for these cases: IBD - Imitation of Violent Activity.

[Lawyer60]

“Reform is a necessary thing”... But the author has already described several reforms, they were also considered necessary! References are made to the successful Soviet past (army, education, technology, enterprises) and this is correct, but only under that system! We have fallen into capitalism, and this is “nothing personal, just business,” so the army will remain a business. It makes no sense to harass Serdyukov, or Ivanov, or even Mutko, etc., they were all appointed by the commander-in-chief (he has been commander for 22 years!), but he does not surrender his own, it is a pity that we are not his own... I am sure that order will return, only with a change, a return, of the system raised by us, born in the USSR.

[seacap]

Quote: 28st region

Do you know how the reform in air defense proceeded?

There were already not enough air defense officers from the ground forces (closer to the body) at all times, especially in jobs and special positions, the requirements and amount of knowledge were too specific. There was a more or less relative complement in the groups of troops, and even the “two-year-olds” could not be saved; barely fledged seniors were put on the SNR. With the destruction of the famous schools, the Kiev Academy and the departure of the Poltava Academy, etc., in which scientific, research, etc. work was carried out by the teaching staff and cadets, manuals on non-propelled guns and operating instructions for complexes were created and tested in practical classes, the seams, the air defense system of the ground ceased to exist as a system and integration into the country’s system became nominal. The saying (from fellow “grudgers” and “envious people” from Mabuta) about women’s hair has become relevant.

[Illanatol]

Quote from: skeptick2

And why should the military reform be carried out not before the war (it's time to put this misname "SVO" out of use after the guarantor himself called the war a war in front of a million audience in Russian), but during the war? Only after a fried rooster pecked in the back seat?

Has it ever occurred to you that our guarantor is not at all an autocrat with absolute power? That he is obliged to take into account the interests of certain shadow groups of very influential people? And in order to take a really decisive step in any area, he is obliged to coordinate it with the home-grown “deep state”? He can convince them (representatives of the shadow elite) to give their “go-ahead” only by providing an irrefutable practical justification for the need for such a step, since the elitists are quite happy with the status quo.
Let's not forget how Sobchak's former deputy ended up in the Kremlin. It is naive to think that from then on he became completely sovereign, like the Byzantine emperor.

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

We all saw the Sabbath before the recognition of the LDPR. How “influential people” shook and stuttered in front of the guarantor.

[Clone]

If only the next reform did not begin with a new dress uniform. “We swam, we know!” In general...no sooner does the ink dry on the report card on the staffing and organizational structure than changes and additions follow. For this, the “Arbat military district”, rotten from laziness, should be thrown into real trenches. For re-education.

[DO]

It is difficult to disagree with the author that the transition from brigades to divisions in the Russian army will take at least several years.
However, the SVO in Ukraine must be completed within a period of no more than a year, with the complete liquidation of the Ukrainian Reich and the liberation of the entire territory of Ukraine.
Consequently, the SVO will have to continue and end with the brigade structure of the Russian army - whether this is correct from the point of view of military science, or not.
Therefore, the primary task of today is to increase the effectiveness of the Russian group in Ukraine by saturating it with reconnaissance and communications equipment, organizing adequate control, saturating UAVs (reconnaissance and strike), high-precision artillery (Krasnopol + UAV) and MLRS, means of countering reconnaissance, communications and positioning the enemy (primarily countering satellite systems and their ground-based assets - from jamming to destruction), methodical and, if possible, complete destruction of the logistics infrastructure of the Ukrainian Armed Forces and its vehicles.

[S. Viktorovich]

Brigades - divisions, BTG-RTG - these are all meaningless exercises in the current conditions. For any meaningful military reform, several years are needed. Moreover, for this

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

Quote: DO

However, the SVO in Ukraine must be completed within a period of no more than a year, with the complete liquidation of the Ukrainian Reich and the liberation of the entire territory of Ukraine.

The US and about 40 other countries do not agree with your plans. They themselves would like to delay the military defense until the presidential elections in the United States, but if the question of the defeat of Ukraine arises, then Western-made tanks/infantry fighting vehicles in quantities, missiles with a range of 500 km, and airplanes, and everything that is needed will instantly arrive.

[DO]

Quote: Yaroslav Tekkel
if the question of the defeat of Ukraine arises, then Western-made tanks/infantry fighting vehicles in quantities, missiles with a range of 500 km, airplanes, and everything that is needed will immediately arrive.

It is high time for the RF Armed Forces to work purposefully on the logistics infrastructure of the Armed Forces of Ukraine so that “everything” does not arrive.

[lubesky]

Quote: Maxim Arkhipov

But only then, within 10 years, it was only indexed. We were happy only in 2012. And then the local bonuses were removed. There are no bonuses.

Quote: Maxim Arkhipov

But this is of course different. Cops are always goats..

What should you pay for? Why not goats... then? The police, young and old, have turned into a service serving capital, essentially anti-people, anti-Korotyshkin - according to N. Nosov. It doesn’t matter who is out there in big uniforms bringing this system down, what matters is that you take it under your thumb, and the system is simple - for the MONEY and when necessary, you don’t lose your competence in the investigation! And as people say, all your checks are carried out (they don’t actually carry out any shit) by the district police department with only one goal - to remove illegal refusal materials and run to the prosecutor’s office so that they can dictate to you how to refuse and get the prosecutor’s approval! And cases of any complexity are handed over to the district police - in order to REFUSE the citizen and send him to court!
It is clear that where there is a body, excitement automatically occurs

[AdAstra]

About the reform of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, you are right on point "" "

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

But for curtains with a rainbow or a picket with a white sheet, they arrive instantly, and the case is brought to a victorious end through the higher court.

[Sergej1972]

Why is it so difficult to study the Police Law? Is it really impossible to find a few hours to read? Or is it such hard intellectual work? For some reason, school teachers and university professors read the Education Law not only because they are forced to, but because they work in this system. And changes in legislation are being monitored.

[zenion]

You just need to say to the current situation - your colleagues are enemies, you must wait a little, otherwise it will turn out that you will have no one to fight with. We will not compete with you under the current conditions. We need to confer with the former president in his palace, what he meant and who he meant, who had him, the people and the country. If all his answers are negative, then we will destroy his current place of residence, wherever it is located, for good and file an application for it in Hell, for an extraordinary trial. Joseph Kobzon sang in exactly the same way after the death of V. Vysotsky. Kobzon had a question for the authorities - where were you before when he was alive. Here it is worth remembering one wise man, Shlomo, who boasted about his wife Sarah - it’s good to be smart, like my Sarah later. Then Sarah knows everything, about everything, but it doesn’t help, she’s smart, but it’s too late. It didn’t reach those who ruled and straightened everything out after the Patriotic War, why they fought to the death with a united Europe, as well as the Jewish word of wisdom - there should be no more enemies than you can defeat and an equal number of them, and better with an advantage on our part friends, even if only until victory, but there should be more of them. It’s not that it turns out that he really wanted it big, but forgot to take off his pants and underpants to boot. There is no need to go to the army if you are stalling. They fight well, so much so that the enemy still owes money and is paid during the battle. For whom did they start the war? Probably not so that the people would be offended, so that the people would realize that in golden castles live those who have fleeced the people like crazy. They are behind the cordon, and now, behind the cordon, poor Russians in Russia must protect and enrich them.

[Rinat Khametov]

Why bother with conventional weapons? If tactical nuclear munitions had been used first, the issue would have been closed a long time ago.....
And in general, if we didn’t go anywhere and not to Georgia, not to Crimea, much less to the actual territory of Ukraine, but for any shot from that side, special ammunition would fly in, we would feel great even with conscripts of one year of service....

[Introvert]

Well, now the next act of the circus performance in the brothel will begin with the eleventh rearrangement of beds. As far as I understand, a change of priestesses is not even expected.

[RoTTor]

Have you forgotten: ex-NGSh Makarov is a hero of Russia?
So he is also the culprit of the failed military-technical policy!
Such people should be publicly executed! Impale in front of the Moscow Region building, so that others will be embarrassed!

https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Макаров,_Николай_Егорович
Maybe Stoolkin was also promoted to hero by secret secret order?

[Knell wardenheart]

– the size of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation is set at one and a half million people (including 670 thousand contract soldiers)

Magically. But. It’s 2022 - and where will we get the funds for modernization of this scale, for expanding the structure, for the salaries of these people? With this, we will have about 3 million security forces for 140+ million population, which, to put it mildly, is not very rich in the main part. Where will we “reap” this time?

I’m not saying that this is not necessary, I’m just curious, by some kind of street magic they will find funds for this so that the already delicate economic situation does not get worse.

[Dron_sk]

Export revenues are here to stay. Yes, they will sag due to the introduced ceilings and countermeasures to reduce production volumes, and the rise in costs of logistics and insurance, but there will be income. It’s just that previously a significant part of this income flowed back abroad (in the form of dividends to non-residents, Russian billionaires and other smaller rich people took abroad what they earned in Russia and loved to buy real estate and luxury goods abroad and spent huge amounts of money there, invested in foreign stocks and bonds ), now the West itself has stopped the outflow of capital from the Russian Federation to the West, and now a significant part of this capital that previously flowed abroad will remain in the Russian Federation and will also be used for Army reform. Using Friedman’s example, Russian oligarchs realized that no one needs them in the West, if they don’t have leverage and don’t want to harm and destroy Russia from the inside, then they will simply be robbed there in the West and forgotten. So they have no other choice but to develop and invest in Russia, otherwise they may lose everything.
Plus there is a money box (national security fund and reserves), which were just accumulated for difficult times. Plus, the budget will be deficit in the coming years, since it is strange to save money when the existence of the country is under threat and everything must be done to preserve it.
In general, a revolution could be made in the pricing policy in some entire industries: given the West’s refusal to provide equal market conditions for Russian producers, when will our Ministry of Finance and our producers understand that Russia accounts for 20% of the world’s resources, and in some areas more than 40%, when they understand that the world cannot live without our resources, then it is possible to set prices independently of the world’s pro-Western exchanges, create local markets for those who need it and regulate prices and volumes and impose inflated conditions on unfriendly countries. But it would be an economic war, for which it would be necessary to wait out time - a certain period with low incomes, plus a period of information pressure from all sides that Russia is using its resources as a weapon.

[Smirnov Sergey]

The main reform should be to ensure that conscripts do not sweep the parade ground for a year, but conduct real combat training, comparable in intensity to that conducted before sending those mobilized to the Northern Military District. The second part of the reform concerns military departments. In reality, we don’t need so many air defense officers, strategic missile forces and other disposable units in reserve - it’s more likely that the spare parts and stock of this equipment will run out than the officers to work with it. Priority should be given to training personnel for the ground forces - signalmen, tank crews, artillerymen.
Well, return the framed parts. So that it is in them that conscription service takes place, and so that upon mobilization, it is possible to immediately begin receiving and training the mobilized at their base.

[Sergej1972]

For some reason, reviews about the cadred units and their officer corps are overwhelmingly negative. Acquaintances who served in such units sincerely admit that they learned nothing and in case of war they would be of no use.

[Oleg Zorin]

There is no need to pin all the blame on Serdyukov and Makarov. They made the army that was ordered for them - small, inexpensive and tailored for local conflicts. No one demanded that Makarov create an army capable of solving problems with an enemy the size of Ukraine.

[buslaif]

This is true. These were the tools of the military-political leadership. But what was it thinking, and does United Russia know it?

[Commissioner_Wolf]

But the problems with military service went away, which was reduced to one year, although this was a very controversial step.

Yes, they haven’t gone anywhere, no one is engaged in combat training of conscripts, and to this day, edging and household work have priority in the army. You can train a fighter in a year, but no one is doing this.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Commissioner_Wolf

Yes, they haven’t gone anywhere, no one is engaged in combat training of conscripts, and to this day, edging and household work have priority in the army.

Well, to test the qualifications of the same gunner-operator, you must first prepare for the test. And the edging, collar and bedside table can be inspected with any knowledge and in any condition. So the training of personnel is based on the visit of the average inspector.

[buslaif]

The President instructed Manturov, a purely civilian man, the Minister of Industry and Trade, to organize the production of weapons and ammunition in full confidence that the Minister is able to lead the defense industry in war conditions, which he is “not good at” and cope with this difficult task, although In peacetime, our production is not doing so well. During the Great Patriotic War, the core of the defense industry was four all-Union sectoral people's commissariats of the defense industry: the People's Commissariat of the Aviation Industry (NKAP), the People's Commissariat of Ammunition (NKB), the People's Commissariat of Armaments (NKV) and the People's Commissariat of the Shipbuilding Industry (NKSP), formed in accordance with the Decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR dated January 11, 1939 by dividing the People's Commissariat of Defense Industry of the USSR. Because they knew that they would have to fight and created a structure that proved its effectiveness during the war. This is the level of responsibility and competence of the Party Central Committee and the Supreme Command headquarters. Do we have anything similar today? No. Then what are we talking about?

[Olegsv]

The announced changes are not reform. This is a response to the situation and experience of military operations in Ukraine. To simply have something stupid to fight with. This will not lead to a radical improvement in the army, and in the future it will only worsen the situation. The author himself wrote, the connection is at the level of the 60s and much like that. Marines only in divisions are complete nonsense, just like the airborne forces