Versus. Su-35 vs. F-35: a clash of two tactics

206

What will be more interesting, the very possibility of a collision of two systems on "neutral" territory or its consequences, is still difficult to say. However, for some reason, I do not want to discount this possibility.

Yes, today NATO is making statements that it won't do anything in Ukraine. However, it is worth remembering what movements took place in November-December on the other side of the Ukrainian border, in Poland, Romania, and so on. One can also recall how the Russian side stubbornly talked about maneuvers on its territory, and that in Ukraine everyone can sleep peacefully.



The bottom line is that today it’s not worth talking about some kind of gentlemen’s agreements at all. It's funny after 1991, and after March 2014, it doesn't look serious at all. Kindergarten is the junior group of world politics, nothing more.

So there is absolutely no faith in promises today, so today Stoltenberg said one thing, and tomorrow his successor will say (and cooler if he does it right away) completely different.

Therefore, there is a possibility of a clash between NATO and Russian forces on the territory of Ukraine. Perhaps it is small, but to say that the word of the North Atlantic allies in the military bloc is harder than a diamond is completely for optimists.

By the way, this year Dave Majumjar of The National Interest, known to us, spoke very frankly about the possible confrontation between the Su-35 and F-35.


True, old Dave spoke in the sense that neither Russia nor China would be able to build a real air fleet from fifth-generation fighters and use it. Unlike the US, of course. The fifth generation is expensive both to build and to operate.

Therefore, American aircraft will have to deal with the descendants of the Su-27 in all variations, from the Su-27 Flanker itself to the Su-35.

You can not discount the F-15, F-16, F / A-18 of all modifications, of course, the old aircraft will go into battle first against the no less new Su-27 and MiG-29, but it is the aircraft of the latest designs that will be thrown into the bowl scales with stones capable of turning the tide in the sky.


The Americans, however strange it may seem, are not sure of the total superiority of the F-35 over the Russian opponent. And in fact, the way it is, and the reason for this is not even the combat and flight characteristics of the aircraft, but the elementary tactics of warfare.

Everything is very clear here: the F-35, using the information support of the satellite constellation and AWACS aircraft, relying on its own stealth, will have to be the first to detect the enemy and strike at him.

Demanding something more from an attack fighter (according to Majumjar) is not worth it, especially using it as an air superiority fighter. But after all, the F-35 was not intended for this, despite the fact that the United States positions it (and advertises it) as a multi-role fighter.


However, destroying equipment and other targets on land and water is also a completely normal job for a fighter-bomber or fighter-attack aircraft.

Therefore, if the F-35 meets in the sky with the Su-35, then it will not be a meeting of equal opponents who set approximately the same goals. F-35s will go to their targets on the ground, and Su-35s will do everything possible to ensure that the targets remain intact.


Therefore, everyone who today compares the F-35 and Su-35 is doing it somewhat incorrectly. Aircraft differ not so much in performance characteristics as in tactics of use.

If we start with tactics, then most likely it will look like this: the F-35 link will go as covertly as possible, without using its radars at full capacity, and the AWACS aircraft or satellites will lead the link. In such a situation, "foreseeing" will be on the side of American aircraft, and therefore they will have a chance to detect the Su-35 first.

And will AIM-9 or AIM-132 go further?

But no. Alas, there are no AIM-35Ds or European Meteors in the standard F-120 combat set of weapons. The F-35 simply does not have long range missiles, and short and medium range missiles against the Su-35, which has the R-37 - sorry, not serious.

If the Russian fighter were blind and deaf, but its radar is quite capable of detecting the F-35 OUTSIDE the range of the latter's missiles. This is a very serious moment, because in this way a certain parity is obtained: the F-35 sees its enemy, but until a certain point it cannot do anything with it. But if the Su-35 sees the F-35, then there will be a steak. Possibly with blood.

Yes, stealth and excellent sensors are the strength of the F-35, which pilots simply must implement, but ...

It will be easier, having discovered the Su-35 using any means of observation, the F-35 link can simply change course and, in simple terms, “dump into the fog”, calling for help F-22, F-15, in general, anyone who will try to compete with the Su-35.

In general, the F-35 corresponds to the tactics of air warfare, in which one of the warring parties is trying with all its might to gain air superiority. This is how you can minimize your losses and cause maximum damage to the enemy.


In order to gain air superiority, the US Air Force seems to have aircraft that can handle such a task. All the same "Raptors". There is some skepticism in the words “seemingly” and “may”, since there are doubts that the F-22 can be the factor that will remove the Su-35 from the path of the F-35. But this is generally a separate conversation.

The whole problem is that, as we have already seen from recent examples, the implementation of plans and optimal solutions is far from always possible in a war.

If we consider the hypothetical situation in the sky of Ukraine, then there will be parity. The territory of Ukraine will become an arena, and both sides will work from airfields outside Ukrainian territory. Russian - from their own (which is happening now), NATO representatives - from Romanian or Polish.

All territories have radars that perfectly scan almost the entire territory of Ukraine. Let me express the opinion that our radars are doing a little better than the Romanians or Poles. The western part of Ukraine will be under better control from NATO, the eastern part - from our side.

The satellite constellation is our headache. Americans and Europeans have more satellites, I won’t judge the quality because there is simply no information, but there are holes and gaps in the most luxurious network. It is a fact.

Therefore, in terms of observation, we can say that the parties will be equal.

Naturally, there are things that interfere with the operation of surveillance systems. Yes, not all, but they are. Electronic warfare systems are one of the components of an air war, since a blind aircraft is not weapon. Here, Russia has an advantage, since those electronic warfare systems that the Russian side can put up to fight against aircraft are a big stone in the scales. And it’s not at all about the over-praised Krasukhas, there are more efficient stations that can significantly complicate work aviation the adversary.

In conditions where everyone sees everyone, and the "gray zone" in the central part of Ukraine can become an exception, the F-35 loses many of its useful properties. Of course, more accurate guidance from AWACS aircraft is good, but if enemy radars see you, this is of little use.

In addition, in a real war, everything goes wrong. Therefore, such an alignment is quite possible, in which the F-35 pilots will have to rely only on themselves.

Agree, this is a normal situation in a war, when someone yells, demanding support, and someone higher up the career ladder does not give this help.

The Americans believe that in such a situation, F-35 pilots should simply take and use the strengths of their aircraft and not allow enemy pilots to use the weaknesses of the F-35. That is, the F-35 should reach the target as stealthily as possible and hit it, and if you have to fight, then do it from behind the line of sight.


Given some of the features of the F-35, namely its frankly low speed, problems are promised here. Afterburner cruising speed of the F-35 is only 850 km / h. Maximum afterburner - 1,6 M or 1930 km / h.


Su-35 in afterburner mode produces 1300-1400 km / h, and afterburner 2,3M or 2500 km / h.

Such a big difference in speed suggests that the F-35 has little chance of safely getting out of the detection area. Especially if it will be seen by radars both in the air and on the ground.

Plus, at short and medium distances (namely, the F-35 missiles work on them), the American aircraft does not have decent maneuverability for combat, while this is the norm for the Su-35.

Yes, today many people say that modern air combat is long-range combat. Whoever has better detection systems and more tenacious missiles will win. And you can forget about maneuverability.

True, the Americans themselves admit (weapon expert Bill Swiftman) that their AIM-9X can easily be confused by dynamic maneuvering, and the more actively an aircraft can maneuver in battle, the more the range of a confident missile launch at it decreases.

It turns out an unpleasant moment: in order to destroy the Su-35, the F-35 must come closer, to the distance of a confident launch of at least medium-range missiles. Thus, all the advantages in stealth are leveled by the rather powerful and very successful, according to many world experts, the H035 Irbis radar, which, in conjunction with the R-37 missiles, may not give the F-35 a chance to attack at all.

Luck? Perhaps this factor plays a certain role in modern air combat, but it is still better to rely on the range of radars and missiles. Because the most “invisible” aircraft will sooner or later sparkle in the radar beams. And for the pilot of the F-35 it will be very unfortunate if it is the Irbis of our Su-35.

What is the essence of American air combat tactics? There are only three principles: "First discovered, first shot, first destroyed." Basically, nothing new. But here with implementation now there can be problems. More precisely, with the appearance of the Su-35 on the arena, tactics will need to be revised.

The role of the hunter in a hypothetical air battle will be played by the Su-35.


Yes, it is not so luxurious with stealth, but R-37M missiles with a range of 400 km are an indisputable advantage. 4 R-37M missiles and 8 R-77 medium-range missiles can cover the entire conceivable range, turning the F-35 into a victim capable of snapping. Yes, it’s good to snap back, AIM-120s allow you to do this, but you still have to approach a confident launch distance of 100 km. Given that 300 km will have to go at gunpoint R-37M. Not the most pleasant and very exciting thing.

The Air Combat Lottery is a very, very fragile structure.

But the most unpleasant thing is that just in the "dog dump", or, as the Americans now call it, "knife fight", the best translation of the term is the Russian word "stabbing", the advantage is absolutely on the side of the Su-35.

The super-maneuverability of the Su-35, its ability to turn, “cobras”, “pancakes” gives it an advantage precisely in “stabbing”. Cannon, missiles, maneuver - and the F-35 has problems. The ability to fly at minimum speeds, instantly accelerate to supersonic speed, all these super maneuvers give the Su-35 an advantage in dynamic combat.


Close combat is not for the F-35. This is the domain of the Su-35.

The further we look at all these analyzes and reports on combat use, the more and more the image of the fifth generation fighter F-35 melts.

Lightning 2 is not a fighter. Too slow, too "tight" in terms of acceleration and climb, with a small number of missiles and very decent bombs - an image more for a bomber than for a fighter. Plus stealth, elevated to a rank.

So yes, the F-35 is a bomber with the ability to fend off enemy fighters with a certain amount of luck. Relying not so much on speed, maneuver and weapons, but on stealth and invisibility.

Of course, there are no fools in the American command and no one will set the task of gaining air superiority for F-35 pilots. For this there are F-15 and F-22. And it is with them that the Russian Su-35 hunter will have to deal.

Definitely, the case when the fifth generation aircraft will not have any advantages over the 4 ++ aircraft. If the confrontation took place in Syria, Afghanistan, Africa, where there simply aren’t as many working radars as in Europe, then yes, the F-35 would be the king of sudden strikes.

But the confrontation, albeit hypothetically, will be on the territory of the country, which is all in the field of view of hundreds of radars, and in such conditions it will not be easy to realize the advantage in stealth.

At the dawn of their appearance, these aircraft were nicknamed "stealth aircraft". Years passed, and as radars matured, aircraft became more and more visible to radar beams. And today they are correctly called just barely noticeable, since neither coatings, nor diffusers, nor new forms - nothing made the planes invisible.

In this regard, the aerodynamic forms of the Su-35, designed for maneuvering, do not provide advantages in stealth, but they are great for stabbing. And in our case, a fourth-generation aircraft is capable of becoming an executioner for a fifth-generation aircraft. And not because it is our plane, but the victim is American. It's just that the Su-35 was initially focused on implementing the principle of "find, catch up, kill." And the F-35 is to sneak up on the target as quietly as possible and destroy it with bombs or missiles.

Therefore, an inconspicuous small (and in fact the F-35 is actually smaller than the Su-35S) bomber is doomed in advance to become a victim of the fighter-hunter, which is the Su-35S. And there is nothing supernatural in this, this is a normal alignment in the fighter-bomber duet.

In the end, there was no confrontation. In the end, a lot still depends on the pilot. The fact that an experienced F-35 flyer has a chance to slip through unnoticed and hit a target in almost any country in the world - that is, that is. The fact that if the Su-35S pilot detects the Lightning, the F-35 will have very little chance of returning back is also a fact.

It's just that each aircraft has its own range of tasks that it can effectively solve.
206 comments
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  1. +16
    8 June 2022 04: 46
    The F-35 simply does not have long-range missiles, and short and medium-range missiles against the Su-35, which has the R-37 - sorry, not serious.

    UR R-37 on combatant Su-35S? Did not know..
    Thanks to the author, he made a lot of discoveries in this publication! belay
    1. 0
      8 June 2022 05: 31
      Quote: Tucan
      The F-35 simply does not have long-range missiles, and short and medium-range missiles against the Su-35, which has the R-37 - sorry, not serious.

      UR R-37 on combatant Su-35S? Did not know..
      Thanks to the author, he made a lot of discoveries in this publication! belay

      what's wrong? it on a case of a DB of reflections.
      1. +30
        8 June 2022 05: 56
        UR R-37 on combatant Su-35S was not and is not. The author confuses with the R-77, which in itself is significant. Everyone should mind his own business, and write about what he understands at least a little.
        1. +14
          8 June 2022 09: 34
          Quote: Tucan
          The author confuses with the R-77, which in itself is significant. Everyone should mind their own business, and write about what they understand at least a little.

          )))
          You are too smart.

          The author under the heading Versus. Su-35 vs F-35 in the photo there are two aircraft WITH TWO nozzles. What kind of R-77 are there, what are you talking about.
          1. +8
            8 June 2022 11: 36
            Well, yes, they hesitated to stick pictures from the bulldozer. That f-16 is confused with f-18, now f-22 instead of this bast shoes (f-35) was posted.
          2. +5
            8 June 2022 12: 22
            The author under the heading Versus. Su-35 vs F-35 in the photo are two aircraft WITH TWO nozzles. What are the R-77s, what are you talking about

            good
            With language removed.
            Mdyayaya.
            And VERSUS is what the author meant? Especially if there is a dot after the word.
            According to the rules of the Russian-English vinaigrette, it was necessary like this:
            Versus: Su-35 and F-35
            Or
            Su-35 versus F-35
            Or
            Su-35 vs F-35
            And he got it: Butter oil
            1. -3
              8 June 2022 15: 05
              The Americans, however strange it may seem, are not sure of the total superiority of the F-35 over the Russian opponent.

              But ours are sure of complete superiority. Both qualitatively and quantitatively. No doubt, the article confirms this.
          3. 0
            23 June 2022 16: 41
            Let's not pick on the photo with the title. It is chosen as an icon for the article, not as an explanatory illustration or drawing. And if you really find fault, find a photo of the Su-35 and F-35, in one photo. Then you can reproach the author, what are you looking for badly.
        2. +4
          8 June 2022 15: 47
          Quote: Tucan
          UR R-37 on combatant Su-35S was not and is not. The author confuses with the R-77, which in itself is significant.

          Already tested two years ago. They launched the R-37M from the Su-35. So if and nothen while no.
          https://www.gazeta.ru/army/2020/10/06/13283281.shtml
          https://iz.ru/991422/anton-lavrov-bogdan-stepovoi/chetyre-s-pliusom-su-35-vooruzhili-giperzvukovoi-raketoi
          1. 0
            9 June 2022 01: 14
            Quote: Hyperion
            Already tested two years ago. They launched the R-37M from the Su-35.

            By and large, hanging the R-37M on the Su-35S is pointless, just like, say, the R-33 on the Su-27P. No.
            The missile is too heavy and large, and the radar characteristics do not allow realizing the maximum firing range.
    2. Eug
      -1
      8 June 2022 08: 12
      Su-35 1300-1400 km / h WITHOUT FORCING? Maybe afterburner is still needed to overcome the shock wave? But in this case, is it possible to talk about afterburner mode?
      1. +3
        8 June 2022 15: 42
        Maybe afterburner is still needed to overcome the shock wave?

        No boost required
        at a speed close to the speed of sound, a shock wave arises, which turns into a sound wave, which accompanies the aircraft throughout its entire flight at supersonic speed. For this reason, passenger aircraft are prohibited from flying over land at that speed.

        But the jump itself does not play a big role and there is no need to “overcome” it.
        Wave crisis and resistance growth already by 0,8-0,9 M.
        To overcome the sound barrier, you need a short wing with a large sweep angle
        In December 1991, an Evergreen International Airlines Boeing 747-100 freighter flew from New York to Tokyo with an intermediate stop in Alaska. An emergency situation. The autopilot was delirious, diving with baggage -30g. an abnormal descent propelled the aircraft to Mach 1,25.
        The designers of the Su-35 did not assume and did not plan a supersonic cruising flight without afterburner, but having received new data after testing the aircraft at transonic and low supersonic speeds at altitudes of 5 and 11 km, they will consider in more detail the possibility of such a flight.

        - said I. Demin (director of the program for creating a fighter at the Sukhoi company)
        He explained that the fighter, which is currently undergoing the stage of flight tests, accelerated to supersonic speed without turning on the afterburner, which pleasantly surprised its developers.
    3. +16
      8 June 2022 08: 35
      Quote: Tucan
      UR R-37 on combatant Su-35S?

      )))
      Yes, and the author got rid of AIM-120 with one left.
      1. +21
        8 June 2022 08: 50
        Yes, the whole article is a horse-drawn circus. What about electronic warfare or weapons, about everything. Level just negative
      2. +11
        8 June 2022 09: 39
        Quote: Negro
        Yes, and the author got rid of AIM-120 with one left.

        You are absolutely right Yes I didn't focus on that. However, this author is not very versed in modern combat aviation. Either he writes that there are no more missile launchers on American long-range bombers, or he claims that the Su-27P appeared later than the Su-30. request
        1. +4
          8 June 2022 12: 04
          Yeah ... Who is stronger than a whale vs an elephant with thriller elements. So it makes no sense to talk about the conduct of hostilities in modern conditions. Somehow, the outfit of forces and means is determined from the assigned tasks, which provides one or another tactic for maintaining the database. And that's all, well ... for the layman, maybe with a bang, but not for VO.
        2. +3
          8 June 2022 12: 26
          this author in modern combat aviation is not

          In general, a modern popularizer of aviation. Akta Danya Milovich or Dud?
          Recalled

          To paraphrase: you need to read the author
  2. -3
    8 June 2022 05: 02
    and the AWACS aircraft or satellites will lead the link
    Will the Russian Aerospace Forces, in the event of the first use of the F-35, endure Sentry and other Hawkeyes within reach? Not sure.
    1. +4
      8 June 2022 08: 36
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      Will the Russian Aerospace Forces, in the event of the first use of the F-35, endure Sentry and other Hawkeyes within reach?

      Weird question. And who will ask?

      This is already a task for partners - whether they will be able to correctly apply these funds.
      1. -11
        8 June 2022 08: 42
        Quote: Negro
        And who will ask?
        Isn't this question weird? Well, they will use the F-35, then what? Without external guidance, their invisibility is worthless, and AWACS will become the primary goal of the Aerospace Forces. More weird questions?
        1. +5
          8 June 2022 09: 17
          And who cares that there will be a priority target for the Aerospace Forces? What makes you think that they will play giveaway with you? How are you going to get to this AWACS?
          1. -10
            8 June 2022 09: 55
            Quote: Negro
            How are you going to get to this AWACS?

            What palm tree did you climb off? Does the abbreviation RVV-BD mean anything? Even without mentioning the Su-57, a serial machine in general.
            1. +4
              8 June 2022 10: 13
              Quote: Vladimir_2U
              Even without mentioning the Su-57, a serial machine in general.

              And what happened to him? Will you climb under the avax on the Su-57? By the way, at what rate will you exchange Su-57s with Avaxes, 5 centuries and 10 hokai for each?
              Quote: Vladimir_2U
              Does the abbreviation RVV-BD mean anything?

              Long-range missile against airliners? Do you understand that an avax differs from an airliner precisely in that it sees this rocket - and it is unlikely that it will keep its course and flight level for 5 minutes so that the inertial system of the rocket leads it where it needs to go?
              1. -9
                8 June 2022 12: 14
                Quote: Negro
                And what happened to him? Will you climb under the avax on the Su-57?

                Do you even know that you don’t need to climb anywhere, but just go to the missile launch line? 300+ km. Or do you imagine that they will bring down guns? Well, the Su-57 is generally an inconspicuous aircraft.
                Quote: Negro
                Long-range missile against airliners?
                TsIPSOshnik or what? Theirs, yes ukrov's favorite topic is about peaceful airliners shot down by Russia / USSR.
                Quote: Negro
                Do you understand that an avax differs from an airliner precisely in that it sees this rocket - and it is unlikely that it will keep its course and flight level for 5 minutes so that the inertial system of the rocket leads it where it needs to go?
                What does he see right from the launch line? Pff. If a target of the "Fighter" type is definitely not inconspicuous, no further than 400 km, then what can we say about a rocket. And the word "inertial" does not allow you to see the words "with radio correction" and "with active radar homing." And at a speed of 6 M 300 km, it is less than 3 minutes.
                In short, your AWACS cried.
                1. +15
                  8 June 2022 13: 17
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  Well, the Su-57 is generally an inconspicuous aircraft.

                  No aircraft with such logs under its belly is inconspicuous.
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  is it enough to reach the missile launch line? 300+ km.

                  If you ask about the source of information about the integration of the R-37 with the Su-57, then you can see either statements in the future tense (Obnosov), or "military experts" - political scientists (Makienko).
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  favorite topic about peaceful airliners shot down by Russia / USSR.

                  The design of this type of missile suggests, in the most extreme case, a flying tanker - the target must fly without changing course, speed and altitude.
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  What does he see right from the launch line?

                  Yes of course.
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  no further than 400 km, then what can we say about a rocket.

                  He has 400 km for ultra-low altitudes - even AWACS is not visible beyond the horizon. And the R-37 follows a ballistic trajectory practically - the bourgeois sees such beauty at 600+.
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  at a speed of 6 M 300 km it is less than 3 minutes.

                  6M it reaches at the time of engine development. Then it goes by inertia, gradually slowing down. She does not have any ramjet to maintain this speed.
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  it doesn’t let you see the words “with radio correction” and “with active radar homing”.

                  This urapatriotism does not allow you to see that when registering the launch of this log, the avax turns off the spotlight and goes behind the growler. Radiocorrect the growler as much as you like. Instead, another avax turns on (imagine there are a lot of them) or one F-22/35/15EX leaves the strike group and turns on the searchlight, transmitting data to other aircraft.
                  1. -10
                    8 June 2022 15: 02
                    Quote: Negro
                    No aircraft with such logs under its belly is inconspicuous.
                    Such confidence is straightforward, only RVV-BD is declared as a load for the main groups. compartments. So that's a mistake.

                    Quote: Negro
                    R-37 with Su-57, then you can see either statements in the future tense (Obnosov), or "military experts" - political scientists (Makienko).
                    Yeah, in 2018, only 22 in the yard, and Makienko also works at Military Watch, right?
                    In October 2020, Military Watch noted . the Su-57 fighter has the ability to use advanced missiles. ..... The R-37M has an unsurpassed flight range of 400 km and is capable of hitting targets at hypersonic speeds exceeding Mach 6
                    Mistake, yet another.

                    Quote: Negro
                    The design of this type of missile suggests, in the most extreme case, a flying tanker - the target must fly without changing course, speed and altitude.
                    Design, gosspadi, you’re broadcasting from behind a hillock. UR-37 is dynamically unstable, if you know what I mean.

                    Quote: Negro
                    He has 400 km for ultra-low altitudes - even AWACS is not visible beyond the horizon. And the R-37 follows a ballistic trajectory practically - the bourgeois sees such beauty at 600+
                    And for targets with an RCS of 1 sq.m per 400 km at any altitude, the RCS of a missile flying in the forehead is dia. 38 cm is not even 0,25 sq.m .. And the ballistic trajectory is waste, practically! I suppose they read about ballistic tests, and imagined who knows what! laughing

                    Quote: Negro
                    6M it reaches at the time of engine development. Then it goes by inertia, gradually slowing down. She does not have any ramjet to maintain this speed.
                    Yeah, only the engine burns out at 150 km. and for 300 km, the speed is not lower than 4 M. and 3 minutes, taking into account the increase and decrease in speed.
                    Quote: Negro
                    This urapatriotism does not allow you to see that when registering the launch of this log
                    A log, only if it's on the side, that's it, forget all the nonsense about the log.
                    Ten Su-57s, as a special means, with 20 missiles will bring rustle to your favorites to their crap pants. Even with a hit probability of 0,5.
                    1. +8
                      8 June 2022 15: 51
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      Such confidence is straightforward, only RVV-BD is declared as a load for the main groups. compartments. So that's a mistake.

                      It was the anonymous propagandist from Wiki who placed it in the inner compartment. The manufacturer emphasized that only pylons. Google Obnosov R-37 Su-57 Interfax.
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      Yeah, in 2018, only 22 in the yard, and Makienko also works at Military Watch, right?

                      Makienko has been dead for some time, and no facts about the Su-57 with the R-37 have appeared since then. Looks like the bean is dead.
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      Makienko works at Military Watch, right?

                      You are quoting an axe, not a military watch. I'm not going to look for the source for you. And judging by the quote, this is written by another noname like that same mukhamorzhar from the national interest.
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      UR-37 is dynamically unstable, if you know what I mean.

                      Ordinary Soviet flying telegraph pole.
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      And for targets with an RCS of 1 sq.m per 400 km at any altitude, the RCS of a missile flying in the forehead is dia. 38 cm

                      Exactly what for anyone. At 400 km, he sees the earth. And you read about a square meter at the next noname.
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      ballistic trajectory is waste, practically

                      A ballistic trajectory is a ballistic trajectory. In order for a rocket with solid propellant rocket motors to reach 6M, it must be thrown very high.
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      3 minutes, taking into account the increase and decrease in speed

                      300 km in 3 minutes, dear friend, that's 100 km per minute. 100 kilometers per minute is 6000 km / h - and according to the projection on the ground, and not according to the distance that the rocket itself travels with its ascent, descent and maneuvers. Arithmetic is not yours.
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      A log, only if it's on the side, that's it, forget all the nonsense about the log.
                      Ten Su-57s, as special equipment, 20 missiles

                      And, do you want to put all the Su-57s in the VKS at once? OK, so it will really be more convenient for everyone.
                      1. -9
                        8 June 2022 17: 14
                        Quote: Negro
                        dear friend
                        Of course of course.
                        Quote: Negro
                        It was the anonymous propagandist from Wiki who placed it in the inner compartment.
                        The fact that Vicki is a recognized hotbed of Rusphobic propagandists doesn't bother you, my friend?
                        http://www.airwar.ru/enc/fighter/su57.html

                        Quote: Negro
                        The manufacturer emphasized that only pylons. Google Obnosov R-37 Su-57 Interfax.
                        The CEO joked / misinformed, and fools are being waged.
                        Kh-58UShKE length 4,2 m, Kh-59MK2 4,2 m climb into the main compartments. And R-37m with the same length, they don’t climb, RVV-BD climbs even worse from 4,06 m. But Expert said that they don’t climb, that’s all, isn’t it, my friend?

                        Quote: Negro
                        You are quoting an axe, not a military watch
                        Basically a wiki. But it doesn't matter, my friend.

                        Quote: Negro
                        Ordinary Soviet flying telegraph pole.
                        Well, the connoisseur writes how to argue. In the USSR, they didn’t know how to make maneuverable missiles, like airplanes, right, my friend?

                        Quote: Negro
                        And you read about a square meter at the next noname.
                        Oh, well, refute authoritatively, but not like with the RVV-DB and the pillar, otherwise it’s some kind of banana crap, my friend


                        Quote: Negro
                        A ballistic trajectory is a ballistic trajectory. In order for a rocket with solid propellant rocket motors to reach 6M, it must be thrown very high.
                        Connoisseur on the line, yeah. Of course, accelerators of solid fuels therefore do that they cannot give thrust. Rocket 53T6 from the ground up in 4 seconds gave 4000 m / s. This is a fiasco, my friend.

                        Quote: Negro
                        300 km in 3 minutes, dear friend, that's 100 km per minute. 100 kilometers per minute is 6000 km / h - and according to the projection on the ground, and not according to the distance that the rocket itself travels with its ascent, descent and maneuvers. Arithmetic is not yours.

                        6 M is 7150 km/h. I'm fine with arithmetic, better than yours, my friend.

                        Quote: Negro
                        And, do you want to put all the Su-57s in the VKS at once? OK, so it will really be more convenient for everyone.
                        Oh, these hohlomrias, the Javelins burned all the Russian tanks, the Stingers shot down all the aircraft of the Aerospace Forces, and the rest of the Sentry will be finished off, for the second time. Buddy.
                      2. +6
                        8 June 2022 20: 15
                        I'm already a little tired of discussing the use of a cartoon rocket by a cartoon plane. Moreover, I give you a statement from the manufacturer - you give me the inscriptions on the fence, Vika and airvor. Finally post a photo of the Su-57 with this missile in the internal compartment - like this

                        and close the topic.
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        In the USSR, they didn’t know how to make maneuverable missiles, like airplanes, right, my friend?

                        All that the USSR could not do, do not retell, my friend.
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        Oh, well, refute authoritatively

                        In order not to refer to the same Vika, the military gives 250 miles directly.
                        https://www.af.mil/About-Us/Fact-Sheets/Display/Article/104504/e-3-sentry-awacs/
                        For the purposes of our discussion, this is sufficient.
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        Rocket 53T6 from the ground up in 4 seconds gave 4000 m / s

                        Oh, what trump cards went. Why so little? Vika says 210, this is 2000+ m / s2 - at sea level, then. Next time, do not underestimate the achievements of Soviet power. People wrote to Vika, they tried, but you have 100 of everything.
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        I'm fine with arithmetic

                        Yeah. Once I counted at a speed of 6M throughout the flight, and since then I have been sitting with this invaluable knowledge.
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        The Javelins burned all the Russian tanks, the Stingers shot down all the VKS planes, and the remaining Sentry will finish off, for the second time. Buddy.

                        I see that no one feels sorry for Russian tanks and planes here. Well, why not take a look at your MiG-31 hack with Avaxes. It will be fun, although not for long.
                      3. -1
                        9 June 2022 04: 06
                        Quote: Negro
                        Finally post a photo of the Su-57 with this missile in the internal compartment - like this
                        What a scream, bring a photo of a penguin as proof of the impossibility of the internal suspension of the R-37m in the Su-57.?! Zelen and Lyusya Arestovich became jealous! But what about X59-58? So the topic is not closed, so the topic is merged, my friend TsiPsoshny.


                        Quote: Negro
                        In the USSR, they didn’t know how to make maneuverable missiles, like airplanes, right, my friend?
                        All that the USSR could not do, do not retell, my friend.
                        That is, do you think that the Su-27 and R-73 are non-maneuverable? That says a lot about your intellectual power, my friend.


                        Quote: Negro

                        In order not to refer to the same Vika, the military directly gives 250 miles
                        https://www.af.mil/About-Us/Fact-Sheets/Display/Article/104504/e-3-sentry-awacs/

                        Just laughing out loud, your source is as smart as you.
                        The radar has a range of more than 250 miles (375.5 kilometers). They couldn’t even translate miles into kilometers, neither nautical miles nor American ones. But more importantly, my friend, there is not a word about the EPR of the goal!
                        Negro] And you read about the square meter at the next noname. So with the detection of a target with an EPR in a quarter, in fact, much less, sq. meters, my friend?


                        Quote: Negro
                        Oh, what trumps went. Why so little? Vika says 210, this is 2000+ m / s2 - at sea level, then. Next time, do not underestimate the achievements of Soviet power.
                        It's just amazing that there is something to broadcast that Vicki fu, and immediately refer to it. So there the limiting estimated parameters are entered, and I brought the lower estimated parameters. Well, the drain with stupidity about solid propellant rocket motors you somehow need to cover up, I understand, my friend!

                        Quote: Negro
                        Yeah. Once I counted at a speed of 6M throughout the flight, and since then I have been sitting with this invaluable knowledge.
                        What, Mach confused with a thousand km? Live with it, mate.


                        Quote: Negro
                        I see that no one feels sorry for Russian tanks and planes here.
                        The fact that you are a foreign miracle, with an appropriate level of development, is already clear. Yes, and it’s a shame for you for your yellow-blakit buddies (described blue).
                      4. +1
                        9 June 2022 08: 55
                        Your persistent desire to discuss me personally, and not pieces of iron, suggests that the conversation has exhausted itself.

                        For those who have kept the thread of the discussion, I will add that in a normal world, even the presence of a rocket on a suspension does not imply that the aircraft is ready to use it. The same AIM-120 missile mentioned always fit into the belly of a penguin, but was planned only for use according to the "fire-and-forget" scheme. The latest version of the 120D with two-way communication is adapted only now, almost 10 years later.
                      5. -1
                        9 June 2022 09: 49
                        Quote: Negro
                        Your persistent desire to discuss me personally, and not pieces of iron, suggests that the conversation has exhausted itself.

                        Weeping, weeping, you confidently merged through the glands, and as for the personality, you didn’t even bother to insert the name FRIEND, what kind of person are you.
                      6. 0
                        9 June 2022 09: 53
                        I don't bother you anymore, my friend. Study Wikipedia further - although what to study there, you are just the authors.
                      7. 0
                        9 June 2022 10: 00
                        Remind the student:
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        Just laughing out loud, your source is as smart as you.
                        The radar has a range of more than 250 miles (375.5 kilometers). They couldn’t even translate miles into kilometers, neither nautical miles nor American ones. But more importantly, my friend, there is not a word about the EPR of the goal!
                        Negro] And you read about the square meter at the next noname. So with the detection of a target with an EPR in a quarter, in fact, much less, sq. meters, my friend?
                        laughing laughing
        2. +5
          8 June 2022 09: 57
          Without external guidance, their invisibility is worthless

          The F-35 in passive radar mode will detect our Su-35 for more than a hundred kilometers, without any AWACS, it will approach a distance of 100 km, launch the AIM-120 and go to the base.
          And at this time, the missile will approach the target, the active homing head will turn on, for which it is not a problem to detect a target with the Su-35 EPR and our plane was shot down.
          and AWACS will become the primary target of the Aerospace Forces

          And the AWACS, of course, will pretend that it does not see enemy planes flying up to it and release escort fighters. But in reality, we do not have enough Su-35s to successfully attack at least one AWACS. The example of RRC Moscow has not taught you anything.
          1. -11
            8 June 2022 12: 15
            Quote: ramzay21
            The F-35 in passive radar mode will detect our Su-35 for more than a hundred kilometers, without any AWACS, it will come up to a distance of 100 km

            One hundred minus one hundred equals zero. With such calculations, it’s not for you to talk about the defeat of AWACS. laughing
  3. +8
    8 June 2022 05: 15
    There is one question: will the Russian Federation have enough pilots with one flight school ...
    1. +8
      8 June 2022 08: 26
      Quote: avia12005
      There is one question: will the Russian Federation have enough pilots with one flight school ...

      And the planes themselves. We, unlike the states, do not bake them like pies. And also losses in the NWO.
    2. -1
      8 June 2022 08: 33
      Six months of training and at the helm)
    3. +4
      8 June 2022 21: 18
      Hooray patriots will explain to you that each of our pilots will shoot down 10-100-1000 enemy ones, thanks to fighting spirit and sprinkling the plane with holy water request
      Seriously, no one canceled the economy of war and the ratio of human resources ..
      1. 0
        9 June 2022 16: 12
        Ukraine is a piece of wood. When a sliver goes too far, it must be quickly pulled out. Don't let it start festering. Although the people are not aware of what is happening, it is simply not without reason that one has to go against the whole world. Ukraine played.
        1. 0
          9 June 2022 17: 04
          but it's just not without reason that you have to go against the whole world

          By analogy: in 1991, Hussein went to annex Kuwait for no reason, setting himself against the whole world. Come on, it was just a convenient moment (it seemed like it).
          Rulers who start small victorious wars (which turned out to be not so small) always explain to the inhabitants that it was not just that.
          Hussein, for example, also explained the need for an inconclusive and terribly bloody Iran-Iraq war that he launched. There are many analogies in history.
          Ukraine played.

          Therefore, is it time to use the sovereign right to install a puppet government in a neighboring country or even annex an occupation administration?
          But the previous government and the president were elected by the people, millions of citizens. Apparently they are against it.
          What to do with them?
          10 percent of the population to plant, and 2-5 - to execute? Make others work for you?
          Don't you think that Latvia has played much more? Is it time to punish her?
          And Poland?
  4. -4
    8 June 2022 05: 36
    Compare should be equal in "generation" aircraft. F-35 and Su-57.
    In the event of a collision between the Russian Federation and the United States, even without the use of nuclear weapons, say, in Ukraine, mutual destruction of electronic warfare, radar, and air defense stations by rocket weapons will certainly begin. I admit that in the event of war, and the battle between the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation and the Armed Forces of the United States is a direct conflict between the two states, both sides will try by all possible means and methods to disable as many enemy satellites as possible. So the "gray zone" may be not only due to the neutralization of ground / air detection tools: if we deploy the S-500, there is a possibility that even GPS will not be available over Ukraine. Like Glonass.
    My humble opinion. In conditions when pilots will have to rely only on on-board systems, our aircraft have an undeniable advantage over American ones. About the superiority of our pilots, it’s even uncomfortable to talk about, it’s obvious. Recently, the Americans either did not participate in serious conflicts, or managed by ground forces (Syria, Ukraine). And combat experience is of great importance.
    1. +13
      8 June 2022 06: 05
      Quote: Grandfather is an amateur
      Compare should be equal in "generation" aircraft. F-35 and Su-57.

      Compare.
      F-35: over 2022 produced as of 06-01-800.
      SU-57: on 2022-06-01 10 prototypes were produced, 6 serial with engines of the 1st stage. Those. in fact, pre-series. Phase 2 is scheduled to begin installation in 2023.
      Quantity, as the old man Karl Marx taught (and perhaps someone else before him), turns into quality.
      1. +10
        8 June 2022 07: 35
        Let's be honest - our aviation will be taken out by 4th generation machines .. All sorts of F-16s, F-15s, Typhoons, etc. .. Yes - not immediately, yes - exchanging with a shameful score for themselves, but - they will take it out. Trite due to the huge superiority in numbers .. As well as in the means of detection and guidance .. So - our only hope will be for the most powerful air defense, missile strikes on their infrastructure and, at the very least, nuclear weapons. I hope - only tactical nuclear weapons.

        They will not get a clear sky for the type of free hunting. In addition, as the operation in Tsegabonia shows, air supremacy is not the last argument. Here we kind of have it there - so what? We managed to defeat the ukrovermacht in a month? Yes, it seems not .. Rubilovo has been going to its full height for 100 days. And there is still no victory in sight. Of course, there are quite obvious reasons for this, but a fact is a fact. In Afghanistan, NATO had complete air supremacy from the very beginning, and how did they win there? Syria ironed almost with impunity - Assad lost? Yes, it seems not .. So - as Ostap Ibrahimovich said, do not make a cult out of food ..
        1. 0
          8 June 2022 09: 02
          To achieve a huge superiority in numbers, a significant part of the US Air Force must come to Europe.
        2. +2
          8 June 2022 11: 55
          Quote: paul3390
          Let's be honest - our aviation will be taken out by 4th generation machines .. All sorts of F-16s, F-15s, Typhoons, etc. .. Yes - not immediately, yes - exchanging with a shameful score for themselves, but - they will take it out. Trite due to the huge superiority in quantity ..

          To do this, they must enter the Russian ground air defense zone, which can easily control 100 km of enemy territory (S-300/350).
          Quote: paul3390
          air supremacy is not the last argument. Here we kind of have it there - so what?

          In Ukraine, there is no destruction of air defense. Thanks to Western real-time intelligence systems, they use ambush tactics. With a full-fledged war, when there are no border restrictions, this situation will no longer exist.
          And aviation, with developed artillery + missiles, is needed only for specific strike missions.
          Quote: paul3390
          Rubilovo has been in full growth for 100 days. And there is still no victory in sight.

          Here, rather, the adjustable speed of the offensive, since Russia is faced with the task of destabilizing the West, which will also stop when the war in Ukraine ends. When Ukraine hit the Donbass, it destabilized Russia. Now the attacked Ukraine hits the west. When the West is broken, Ukraine will completely pass ....
          Quote: paul3390
          In Afghanistan, NATO had complete air supremacy from the very beginning, and how did they win there?

          They have fulfilled their task of building up the instability that is beneficial to them and bringing the Taliban to power, with the creation of a cold war regime that will soon turn into a hot state.
          Quote: paul3390
          Syria ironed almost with impunity - Assad lost?

          Assad without Russia...
          Quote: paul3390
          So - as Ostap Ibragimovich said, do not make a cult out of food ..

          Don't talk crooked.
          1. -2
            8 June 2022 12: 04
            What nonsense..
      2. -1
        8 June 2022 08: 25
        It must be understood that a war without martial law and technological sanctions will slow down this already extremely slow process.
      3. +2
        8 June 2022 14: 44
        Quantity does not always translate into quality. Read about the problems with armored vehicles in the USSR in 1940-41. And think about the number of these armored vehicles.
    2. KCA
      +2
      8 June 2022 07: 35
      GLONASS satellites fly in orbit at an altitude of more than 19 km, GPS is definitely no less than what S-500, which can get satellites in orbit just above 100 km? Only the rocket of the A-235 complex or something that they don’t write or talk about, but the A-235 costs more than a satellite along with the launch vehicle that launched it into space, but the satellites of "remote control of the Earth" are just for the S-500, them low orbits
      1. KCA
        0
        8 June 2022 08: 02
        over 19 thousand km
    3. +7
      8 June 2022 08: 10
      Wow statements! How will the S-500 help fight GPS satellites hanging at an altitude of 25000 km?
    4. +15
      8 June 2022 08: 44
      Quote: Grandfather is an amateur
      Compare should be equal in "generation" aircraft. F-35 and Su-57.

      )))
      It's too easy. F-35 is, Su-57 is not.
      Quote: Grandfather is an amateur
      in the event of a collision between the Russian Federation and the United States, even without the use of nuclear weapons, say, in Ukraine, mutual destruction of electronic warfare, radar, and air defense stations by rocket weapons will certainly begin

      )))
      It will start unconditionally, but it's hard to say about the "mutual" one. So far, even the ancient air defense of Ukraine is working quite well.
      Quote: Grandfather is an amateur
      if we deploy the S-500, the option is possible with the absence of even GPS over Ukraine. Like Glonass.

      In the order of educational program - ZhPS satellites are in high orbits, no S-500 will interfere with them. Disabling GLONASS would also require launches of heavy missiles - Musk will do it, but even he will need several weeks.
      Quote: Grandfather is an amateur
      In conditions where pilots will have to rely only on on-board systems, our aircraft have an undeniable advantage over American ones.

      )))
      Of course not. Even 50 years ago, they said that a fighter was needed to lift its radar into the air - and the lag in electronics was catastrophic.
      Quote: Grandfather is an amateur
      It’s inconvenient to even talk about the superiority of our pilots, it’s obvious

      Well, you have jokes.
      1. 0
        10 June 2022 05: 01
        "It's too simple. There are F-35s, there are no Su-57s" - that is, aircraft that are not involved in the NWO? recourse
        1. +2
          10 June 2022 06: 39
          Quote: Grandfather is an amateur
          Do planes participate in NWO that do not exist?

          Oh sure. A huge number of stellar stars participate in the NWO, first of all. But there were questions about the Su-57 even before the NWO.
          1. -1
            10 June 2022 08: 57
            A huge number of stellar stars participate in the NWO, primarily

            I hope you have irrefutable evidence of your words?
            1. +4
              10 June 2022 09: 30
              About the stars? Need proof - look in the mirror.

              One of the signs of the times that especially infuriates me is these "an anonymous source told RIA Novosti that 4 Su-57s networked destroyed the S-300." What kind of nonsense?

              If this is information for the press, why is it reported by an anonymous source and not by Konashenkov?

              If this is classified information, then what kind of drug addict will believe that someone is leaking classified information not to the CIA, but to the Russian state media?

              But no, there is a whole crowd of such drug addicts.
    5. +1
      9 June 2022 17: 40
      both sides will try by all possible means and methods to disable as many enemy satellites as possible

      Question: which side has more ready-made anti-satellite weapons, more satellite constellation and more opportunities for its restoration?
      Rogozin complained from time to time (before February 24.02.22, XNUMX) that there were not enough imported microcircuits of the "space" class. Our grouping is three times smaller than the American one, and half that of the Chinese.
      S-500 in development.
      And on the other hand, dozens of ships of the 1st rank with SM-3, THAAD ground systems with an altitude of 200 km, not to mention the monstrous GBMD.
  5. -1
    8 June 2022 05: 57
    Therefore, there is a possibility of a clash between NATO and Russian forces on the territory of Ukraine. Perhaps it is small, but to say that the word of the North Atlantic allies in the military bloc is harder than a diamond is completely for optimists.
    yes uzhzhzh ... you can’t trust these "civilized" countries. They have completely compromised themselves along with their "values" ...
  6. +13
    8 June 2022 06: 01
    The author, that a small number of air battles over the territory of Ukraine, the Russian Aerospace Forces won with a dry score due to the fact that Ukrainian aircraft were previously detected by more modern radars / radars and hit mainly by R-77 medium-range missiles. I mean, whoever finds out first wins. And the chances of nothing are equal, there will be no melee.
    1. +1
      8 June 2022 08: 47
      Quote: FRoman1984
      a small number of air battles over the territory of Ukraine Russian Aerospace Forces won with a dry score

      Seriously?
      1. +2
        9 June 2022 03: 41
        Quote: Negro
        Quote: FRoman1984
        a small number of air battles over the territory of Ukraine Russian Aerospace Forces won with a dry score

        Seriously?

        Absolutely. Not a single VKS aircraft was lost in air battles. Only from ground air defense systems.
        1. 0
          9 June 2022 06: 51
          Quote: FRoman1984
          Not a single VKS aircraft was lost in air battles.

          As if you are so aware of the losses of the VKS in general and their causes in particular. This is not for you to dispute Hartmann's accounts - Goebbels and the Sovinformburo were the most honest people against the background of the current ones.
          1. +1
            10 June 2022 02: 56
            Quote: Negro
            Quote: FRoman1984
            Not a single VKS aircraft was lost in air battles.

            As if you are so aware of the losses of the VKS in general and their causes in particular. This is not for you to dispute Hartmann's accounts - Goebbels and the Sovinformburo were the most honest people against the background of the current ones.

            If you have nothing to say in essence, then it is probably better to shut up? Do you have other data on losses specifically in air battles with dates, aircraft registration numbers, at least some details?
            1. +1
              10 June 2022 06: 43
              Quote: FRoman1984
              If you have nothing to say in essence, then it is probably better to shut up?

              It's strange that you just now came up with this idea.
              Quote: FRoman1984
              Do you have other data on losses specifically in air battles with dates, aircraft registration numbers, at least some details?

              Of course not. So far, we know for sure only about those planes on the ground that journalists from the Ukrainian side got to. How they ended up on earth - we will find out in three years at best. Although there is an opinion that Russia will also classify the archives for a special military operation for 150 years.
  7. +2
    8 June 2022 06: 04
    Lightning 2 is not a fighter. Too slow, too "tight" in terms of acceleration and climb, with a small number of missiles and very decent bombs - an image more for a bomber than for a fighter. Plus stealth, elevated to a rank.

    It remains to be seen what is more profitable for hitting ground targets. F-35 or conventional aircraft, but with hypersonic missiles.
    1. +8
      8 June 2022 09: 14
      Quote: riwas
      It remains to be seen what is more profitable for hitting ground targets. F-35 or conventional aircraft, but with hypersonic missiles.

      The F-35 will most likely carry the JDAM. Those. a cheap as dirt free-falling bomb, perhaps even from Cold War stockpiles, to which an inexpensive and small targeting unit is bolted, both in size and weight, which makes this bomb highly accurate. Consider that the bomb is free, and the targeting unit costs $25000. And the F-35 has been in the series for a long time, a replacement in case of loss can be obtained soon, and for not very expensive. That fabulous price of the first F-35s, which everyone laughed at, turned out to be due to the crazy prices for development and subsequent improvements, but now they are simply mass-produced.
      How much can a hypersonic missile, the same "Dagger" cost? Most likely hundreds of thousands, translated into evergreens. To carry and launch it, you need a specially converted MIG-31, an expensive aircraft to operate, which cannot be replaced in case of loss, because. technology is lost and will not quickly revive, if at all possible. And how many "Daggers" does the MIG-31 raise? A little, as if not one piece at all.
      So the arithmetic is not very simple.
      1. +7
        8 June 2022 10: 19
        Quote: Nagan
        How much can a hypersonic missile cost, the same "Dagger"? Most likely hundreds of thousands, translated into evergreen

        Would you like to joke? Even if the dagger is just an Iskander attached to the plane, Iskander is estimated at 7 million by eye.
        1. -1
          8 June 2022 18: 59
          Quote: Negro
          if the dagger is just an Iskander attached to an airplane, Iskander is estimated by eye at 7 million.

          Iskander or whatever is there instead of him is just an upper stage for a hypersonic missile, and this is, roughly speaking, $ 100000. And the "Dagger" itself will cost at least the same, and maybe more.
          1. +6
            8 June 2022 19: 17
            Again. Iskander according to estimates (see for example caliber vs iskander on this site) costs 7 million dollars (about 400 million rubles at old prices). This figure looks quite realistic if the American MGM-140, which is much more modest and massive than the Iskander, costs $3M.
            For 100 thousand, you can only buy a Helfire or something like it. People usually do not understand well how expensive all sorts of peace-enforcement measures are.
            1. -2
              8 June 2022 20: 22
              Sorry, I thought that you brought the cost in rubles. And if it is in dollars, then all the more it confirms my thesis above that shooting "daggers" from inexpensive (relative to the F-35) aircraft is, as it were, no more expensive than F-35 bombing using cheap bombs. Because F-35s either get noticed or they don't. And even if they notice, they will either shoot down or not. A "dagger" by definition is disposable.
  8. +6
    8 June 2022 06: 10
    Of course, I understand that Hooray-patriotism and all things, but damn it, when we can’t advance in Ukraine for 3 months, we lose these very dryers one after another, tell how they will cut the F-35 ... Well, it’s even difficult to call this propaganda, it’s so out of touch article from reality
    1. -15
      8 June 2022 06: 21
      Are you in a war zone?
      Can you answer why you, damn it, have not been able to advance in Ukraine for 3 months? First of all, so to speak. And if you are not there, then why do you write the word ,, we ,,?

      Ps British scientists noticed that after the word “we”, there is always a set of anti-Russian nonsense covered with a screen of alleged concern for the state.
      1. +9
        8 June 2022 06: 35
        Are you in a war zone?
        Can you answer why you, damn it, have not been able to advance in Ukraine for 3 months? First of all, so to speak. And if you are not there, then why do you write the word ,, we ,,?

        Because you need less to shout dear friend, tell me why the 3rd largest army in the world cannot knock out 19th largest army (not to mention weapons), come on at least protect your border territories from shelling
        And how are you going to mow hundreds of NATO F35s with such success, also tell
        While I only hear rotten cheers from you
        1. -12
          8 June 2022 06: 39
          That is, in the most serious sense, do you think that the decisions of the General Staff and the design departments are made based on reading comments on the forums? What are you smoking?

          Why is the Special Military Operation taking so long? Because this is essentially an anti-terrorist operation of a combined arms scale where it is necessary to save the lives of the civilian population. This operation, which had no examples in history, will be studied under a microscope for decades by experts from all over the world.
          1. +2
            8 June 2022 06: 44
            Why is the Special Military Operation taking so long? Because this is essentially an anti-terrorist operation of a combined arms scale where it is necessary to save the lives of the civilian population

            I repeat my question at the borders, civilians of the Russian Federation are being killed, what kind of life are you, dear friend, together with the General Staff, then save? Lives of the civilian population of Western Ukraine

            So the General Staff does not seem to be the Russian Federation, but the Armed Forces of Ukraine ...
            1. -11
              8 June 2022 08: 59
              Two civilians were killed by EMNIP. Excuse me, are you going to kill tens of thousands of our own future citizens in order to protect two?
              1. +3
                8 June 2022 15: 13
                Two civilians were killed by EMNIP. Excuse me, are you going to kill tens of thousands of our own future citizens in order to protect two?

                Here it is the horse muzzle of the "patriot" urya, this ... do not care that civilians are put on the territory of the Russian Federation, that Donbass is shelled every day, that Russian soldiers are dying. It only cares about the inhabitants of Ukraine ...
                1. 0
                  14 June 2022 08: 35
                  And you don't care about our soldiers either? I will disappoint you, but in any case there will be corpses, the question is where is less. Although what to expect from those who have either heard enough of working out hryuvnas or are working out, in their opinion, Russia should not solve the most important military tasks, but smash its own head during the assault on the Avdeevsky fortified area, or keep 20 thousand army, so that God forbid the Ukrainians do not kill a dozen people on Russian territory, while in other places, only because of the delay in the operation and the lack of those same forces sitting near the border, additional hundreds of Russian soldiers will die. They don’t have parents and children at home, soldiers are not people, they can be killed.

                  Do you want minimum losses? Solve the most important problems.
        2. -7
          8 June 2022 07: 24
          So the 5th (and not the 3rd) largest army in the world is fighting in peacetime, and general mobilization has been announced in Ukraine. And at the same time, one must also take into account that no one canceled the tasks of defending the fatherland and the main composition of the army remained in places
          dislocations. According to various estimates, 100-190 thousand are fighting in Ukraine. And Zelensky said that as of May 21, 2022, the strength of the Ukrainian army is 700 thousand people. Do you believe him? Zelensky will not lie?
          1. +10
            8 June 2022 08: 04
            Quote: Vyacheslav Ermolaev
            According to various estimates, 100-190 thousand people are fighting in Ukraine.

            This is the RF Armed Forces. they are far from alone. of the large ones - NM LDNR and the Russian Guard - at least another 150 thousand plus ..
          2. 0
            14 June 2022 08: 37
            It is unlikely that there are 700 thousand there, the issue is not only in losses, but in the fact that these plans are unlikely to be implemented at least by 90%. But I can believe in 500 thousand.
        3. -7
          8 June 2022 12: 57
          now the Ukrainian army is even larger in number than the Russian army
          1. -1
            8 June 2022 23: 57
            Russia acts 10% of what it can ... :))
    2. +10
      8 June 2022 08: 28
      This is what the vast majority of our population has been doing for decades - escaping from reality. It's easier to live that way.
      1. -13
        8 June 2022 08: 40
        Soon everything will change in Ukraine and you will stop running from reality
        1. +5
          8 June 2022 09: 51
          Well, I live in the Russian Federation and I'm talking about my country, as it were)
  9. -5
    8 June 2022 07: 26
    Quote from kristal
    we lose these very dryers one by one

    Please, show the sources of losses of our SU-35s or, at worst, SU-30s.
    Because other dryers do not fit the words "these same".
    If you can't, then you are a liar.
  10. +6
    8 June 2022 07: 29
    And I thought the F-35s should fight with the SU-57s, which in an amount of more than 3x will someday appear in the Russian Air Force
    1. +4
      8 June 2022 08: 19
      In pre-sanction times, mass production could not be established, and now the process will slow down even more - this is inevitable
    2. +3
      8 June 2022 12: 21
      Quote from Nauru
      And I thought the F-35 should fight with the SU-57

      The main task of the F-35 is the suppression of ground air defense.
  11. -8
    8 June 2022 08: 01
    How many SU-35s do the Russians have, and how many 35s can NATO bring into battle. 22 doesn't count, they seem to be banned from leaving the US.
    1. +15
      8 June 2022 09: 03
      Quote: savoj
      prohibited from leaving the United States.

      Who is forbidden?
      https://rg.ru/2018/09/24/su-35-vzial-na-pricel-amerikanskij-samolet-nevidimku-f-22-v-sirii.html
      In general, a test move: just take and cancel the machine that the enemy created to gain air supremacy. I suspect that the General Staff of the Russian Federation is planning about the same - judging by the results.
  12. +12
    8 June 2022 08: 02
    And that the enemy is going to use the F-35 to gain air supremacy? Another fake article...
  13. +2
    8 June 2022 08: 11
    The superiority in the number of aircraft of various generations, as they say, other things being equal, is a very serious argument in favor of whoever has this superiority. No options.
  14. -8
    8 June 2022 08: 15
    Yeah, but AWACS will just fly and no one will touch them. Tired of this fantasy.
    Only one country is able to use the F35 as intended, but a collision with it will develop into a nuclear war in the very first hours, which makes it pointless to write any nonsense about a collision of two aircraft, tactics, etc.
    In all other cases, F35 belonging to other countries, if they collide with the Su35, then without AWACS, satellites and other turbidity. At the same time, taking into account their number, the Su35 will most likely be used as air defense interceptors, covering their troops and not going beyond the S300,400 area of ​​​​responsibility, using target designation of ground-based detection and guidance systems.
    1. +5
      8 June 2022 09: 26
      Quote: Victor Sergeev
      Only one country is able to use the F35 as intended

      Israel has been actively using it for several years, and the country is small and with limited capabilities, in every way inferior to the same Britain, Italy, and who else in NATO has already got the F-35. And how to use them is described in the article. Sneak up to the target unnoticed, drop bombs on it, and, if possible, just as quietly dump it on the base. It was called a fighter only because Congress is very reluctant to give money for bomber development programs. And so he is a bomber with the ability, if he is very tight, to conduct an air battle. Approximately like the SU-34.
      1. 0
        9 June 2022 07: 42
        So, who is he using against? Against the Syrians? There, the F35 needs an umbrella like a fish. "Invisibility" can be realized when using AWACS aircraft, in other cases the F35 turns into a disabled person inferior to the same F15 in everything.
        1. +1
          9 June 2022 09: 36
          Quote: Victor Sergeev
          "Invisibility" can be implemented using AWACS aircraft
          Firstly, the Jews have an EL / W-2085 AWACS based, if I am not mistaken, on a Gulfstream business jet. And secondly, the Syrians, Hezbalons, and Persians arrive, but they can’t even understand where.
  15. +8
    8 June 2022 08: 15
    It's quite funny to read about the spherical "superiority in a vacuum" over the most technologically advanced machines in the world, when we clearly see that the Russian Aerospace Forces are completely unable to suppress even the air defense of Ukraine
    1. -9
      8 June 2022 08: 42
      Does Ukraine have air defense now? All their air defenses are portable air defense systems that you can fucking track
      1. +10
        8 June 2022 09: 09
        Naturally there is. Therefore, aviation does not fly to the rear, if you have not noticed. It works only along the line of contact and in its rear (Mariupol).
        1. +3
          8 June 2022 09: 48
          So it is, in fact, we do not hide it. More precisely, they indirectly confirm with single strikes to the rear only with missiles
          1. +4
            8 June 2022 09: 58
            Quote from jngus
            More precisely, they indirectly confirm with single strikes to the rear only with missiles

            Well, the blows are not exactly isolated. However, you are right. A lot of people say they couldn't replicate the '91 Desert Storm. But we did not see systematic work in the style of Syria 82 and even dashing in the style of Libya 86. We, thank God, did not see the readiness to stupidly take in quantity despite the sacrifices a la Vietnam.
      2. +6
        8 June 2022 09: 41
        Does Ukraine have air defense now? All their air defenses are portable air defense systems that you can fucking track

        Moreover, they still have aviation. And they also have a bunch of S-300s and Buk M1 and even Tor, which is why our planes are forced to fly at low and extremely low altitudes, where MANPADS crews are waiting for them.
      3. +1
        8 June 2022 09: 45
        If there were no air defense, we would have long seen the raids of strategists on railway junctions and other targets in the depths of the country. They then MANPADS up to one place, and 30-40 tons of cast iron along the railway junction, a much more weighty argument than a dozen calibers. You can not talk about the price of the issue at all. But this is only in the absence of significant air defense.
        1. +1
          10 June 2022 11: 23
          And there is. But when you want to believe in something, arguments are useless
    2. -6
      8 June 2022 14: 57
      Manufacturability is confirmed by their accidents? Or the fact that the coating peels off them, cracks? The simpler the technique, the more reliable it is. A high-tech aircraft for a bunch of Baku papers, experienced problems, and at the same time did not conduct a single air battle with a real enemy. Our planes are tested in real combat operations. What is in Syria, what is now, in Ukraine. F-35 - well advertised, but I don’t remember the real combat use of 5th generation American aircraft.
    3. -2
      9 June 2022 07: 53
      I hope you didn't forget to pray for the US flag? How much admiration for the West is highly developed in you. Do you understand what air defense is? The modern complex is mobile, it is hidden, masked. Air defense, in principle, cannot be completely suppressed, or it is necessary to spend huge resources to suppress it.
      Russia destroyed air defense in Ukraine as a system, destroying the remnants, fragments as they appear on the battlefield, in order to ensure the work of aviation in the right areas.
      And now about the F35 - a waste of money and cutting the American budget, an aircraft that no one needs, the F15, 16, 18 and A10 will still fight for this very reason, Russia does not slap the Su57, realizing that the 5th generation is a dead end branch of development absolutely not needed in mass production now.
      1. +1
        10 June 2022 11: 44
        Your claims have already been answered above, in principle, I have nothing to add. And as for the uselessness of new weapons systems - I generally refrain from polemics on this topic, because I don’t comment on stupidity
        1. -1
          10 June 2022 12: 50
          And I didn’t write that new weapons systems weren’t needed, I said that we needed a weapon that meets a specific situation, taking into account efficiency and price. The nail can be hammered with a microscope.
          The 5th generation is a dead end, since it did not bring anything new, except for the next cut of the American budget, a breakthrough is needed, but it doesn’t exist. Therefore, Russia does not spank the Su57, using it as a laboratory for the 6th generation.
          Modern wars, for example with Ukraine, show that 4 ++ aircraft are quite capable of coping with any war with an enemy that is not a US satellite, and for the latter, not aircraft, but missiles are needed.
          1. 0
            11 June 2022 16: 57
            Genius analytics. You should go to the Pentagon - open your eyes to idiots)
            1. -1
              11 June 2022 19: 50
              The Pentagon has its own logic:
              1. To scare the people and politicians by giving bribes to lobbyists, knocking huge money out of the budget.
              2. Come up with new themes for the development of weapons and spend the money received, even if the ideas are useless, along the way, the Pentagon leadership line their pockets, getting their share of the stolen.
              3. Produce something new and force your colonies to buy it.
              4. Buy weapons at triple the price, getting your share.
              Pentagon + VPK is a profitable home for lobbyists from Congress and the US government, owners of VPK companies and the Pentagon leadership. Although the Pentagon steals everything, at any level.
              Therefore, the F35 appeared and was put into service.
              .
  16. -8
    8 June 2022 08: 57
    Not planes are fighting, but org. structures. And the banal calibration of airfields can become an argument against the Fu-35, it’s not a useless surviving MiG-29 to catch, it will be quite a platform with a decent amount of expensive and status aircraft on it.

    As for speed, the "superhornet" has the same speed as the Fu-35, the same thrust. As an aircraft, it is a "superhornet", but with one engine and volumes and weight released due to this. No one considers the superhornet to be an incapable aircraft and a bad flyer. True, the hornets have low speed - the result of a large deck-based wing, so they have gorgeous takeoff and landing characteristics and mountain maneuverability, while the Fu-35A, apparently , was chosen by analogy, and is considered sufficient for solving its tasks. The Hornet was never an interceptor (for this it was the F-14), it was a multi-machine operator, with sufficient performance characteristics so as not to suffer from a meeting with interceptors of the same Fu-16 level (I don’t think about the F-15, it’s still not “Fu”).

    In the air, the distances between aircraft can exceed 100 km, and if the interceptor goes to a target moving at a speed of 0.9M, then on a catch-up course, in order to approach in any adequate time, its speed should be hundreds of kilometers per hour more. That is, even such an unhurried aircraft as the Su-24 (1700 km / h, but it doesn’t care, you can’t accelerate above 1500 near the ground) the “hornet” may not catch up (imagine that action in the stratosphere and maximum speeds are achievable). On the other hand, if the "hornet" performs a strike task and is forced to get away from the interceptor, or leave the battle, then its dynamics should be enough to break away after giving it an afterburner. The interceptor is faster, but a difference of a couple of hundred km / h may not be enough to get close in a reasonable time, while the fuel is burned at an accelerated pace.

    One should not think that the Americans could not make the Fu-35 faster, but, apparently, their experience suggests that the hornet-level speakers are enough, and they also have a lot of means to make sure that enemy interceptors do not interfere.
  17. +14
    8 June 2022 09: 02
    To be honest, I did not manage to read this article to the end. Who are these specialists? Let's start with the fact that you need to understand what is what and how it works. F-35 stealth aircraft, the tactics of air combat which lies in the following. I spotted an enemy fighter from a distance of 200 kilometers, while remaining invisible myself. Since my radar just scans the space - no enemy radiation sensors will notice that I found it. And I also have a short interrogation pulse in my radar. The enemy radar station Irbis will be able to see me only from 90 km. These are very old statements of Irbis manufacturers. I put the data on the route of the detected target into the AMRAAM-120, fly up to 100 km and let it into the supposed square where the target will be by the time the missile approaches. She quietly flies there while I wind up in a more convenient position, leaving the approaching zone of detection of the enemy radar, without accompanying the missile. Arriving in a given square kilometers 7-15 from the target, my rocket turns on the radar, finds and attacks the target. An unsuspecting enemy pilot receives an exposure warning when it's too late. This is how this weapon complex is conceived. This is where the money is invested. These are three in one: stealth, AFAR with a short polling pulse and a missile with the "fire-and-forget" principle. As for the R-37 and its 300 km, it can only be fired at such a distance at a target with an EPR of the B-52 type, but not the F-35. The lower the RCS of the target, the shorter is not only the range of its detection, but also the range of self-locking of the guidance head after the launch of the missile at the target and its tracking by fourth-generation aircraft radars. The only Russian missile so far known to me that can fly on the principle that AMRAAM is the R-77. And then, the real launch range, as the Indians say after the battles with the Pakistanis, is 70 km on 4th generation fighters not protected by the stealth system. And yes, the fact that the Russian Irbis will be able to detect the F-35 from a distance of 90 km does not mean that it will be possible to shoot from this distance. There you will have to get closer to at least 60 kilometers so that your own rocket does not go into the sky. And by the way, these 90 km, this is if the goal is on the course. And if not on course, then the closer to 180 ° from the course, the smaller the range from which something can be detected. That's how it works.
    1. -7
      8 June 2022 11: 20
      Since my radar just scans the space - no enemy radiation sensors will notice that I found it.


      Did you understand what you wrote? In general, if your radar can receive a response impulse from the target, then for the target your radar is like a Christmas tree at night. On Red Square, where they poured a ton of gasoline and set it on fire. They didn’t even put a radio altimeter on the F-117 so as not to shoot.

      I put the data on the route of the detected target into the AMRAAM-120, fly up to 100 km and let it into the supposed square where the target will be by the time the missile approaches. She quietly flies there while I wind up in a more convenient position, leaving the approaching zone of detection of the enemy radar, without accompanying the missile. Arriving in a given square kilometers 7-15 from the target, my rocket turns on the radar, finds and attacks the target.


      Do you even understand that the target can simply turn away and then even the theoretical possibility of spitting a rocket into nowhere, perhaps it will find someone, disappears?
    2. -1
      8 June 2022 11: 50
      Quote: rtutaloe
      There you will have to get closer to at least 60 kilometers so that your own rocket does not go into the sky.

      It should be noted that the P-77 also has a correction on the trajectory, so it may not go into the sky. But for this you will have to continue to follow the target with the Irbis.

      Quote: rtutaloe
      the real launch range, as the Indians say after the battles with the Pakistanis, is 70 km

      The actual range is always less than the maximum. Most likely, for the AIM-120D it will not be much more if the target is able to detect a missile launch on it. And then there is the question of whom the Irbis will detect earlier - the F-35 or the AIM-120.
      1. +3
        8 June 2022 16: 09
        It is almost impossible to detect a missile, and even such a small one as AMRAAM with its EPR. They detect a missile launch by a powerful radar beam at long distances. On short ones, you can detect the heat trail. And then, not everything is always successful, otherwise the planes and helicopters would not fall, for example from stingers. And with these "let it go, I forgot it", the joke is that they do not highlight. Yes, you can adjust by radio commands.
        1. -3
          8 June 2022 17: 04
          Quote: rtutaloe
          It is almost impossible to detect a missile, and even such a small one as AMRAAM with its EPR.

          EPR AIM-120 from the forehead is estimated at about 0,1 square meters. meters. Allows you to detect it at a fairly decent distance, tens of kilometers. In any case, this is more than the F-35.
  18. +8
    8 June 2022 09: 27
    Spheroconin.

    The operation of the Su-35 against the F-35 is possible with an adversary who uses these aircraft to seize air supremacy - that is, this adversary has an F-35, but no or few F-22s or F-15s. These are Israel, Italy, Norway, the Netherlands, Australia, Great Britain. In this case, the conflict should take place without the help of an older brother. Despite the recent events, I find this probability extremely small - even in the event of a conflict with Israel in Syria, the Su-35s will not play any role.
    In the near future, the Poles and Finns will have penguins - and here the conversation will become more substantive. However, it will just have to be carried out in detail - with those capabilities for AWACS, air defense and other things that will be available at that moment.
  19. +15
    8 June 2022 09: 33
    Maybe it's enough to scribble captive articles? They have already laughed at the Ukrainian RCC Neptune, but apparently Moscow has not learned any lessons from the death of the RCC. If our Su-35 meets the F-35 in the sky, then this meeting will not end with anything good for our aircraft.
    And in order to have at least equal chances, not to mention the advantages, it is necessary to produce new generation aircraft and not mock-ups for exhibitions and modernization of Soviet aircraft, plus it is necessary to build AWACS aircraft without which waging a modern war is unthinkable.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. -12
      8 June 2022 11: 24
      No one laughed at the "Neptunes", because no one was interested in him, and, most likely, he had nothing to do with it.

      And so, the topic has not been disclosed, you need to crow about the yachts of the oligarchs instead of the planes.

      And the F-35 is not a next-generation aircraft, because the aircraft is a vehicle, and the sensors and radars with missiles are the cargo that this vehicle carries. And as a vehicle, the F-35 is nothing special compared to cars from the 1980s.
      1. +3
        8 June 2022 20: 26
        And the F-35 is not a next-generation aircraft, because the aircraft is a vehicle, and the sensors and radars with missiles are the cargo that this vehicle carries. And as a vehicle, the F-35 is nothing special compared to cars from the 1980s.

        Awesome statement! RRC Moscow, in the opinion of people like you, was a killer of aircraft carriers and died from two anti-ship missiles Neptune launched from the shore, one of which did not explode and over which our fools made fun.
        Now you consider the F-35, the most combat-ready fighter in the world, to be an underplane, that's right, don't give up! If, God forbid, our Su-35s have to meet in a real battle with the F-35, for me the result of such a meeting is obvious, for you it will be like with the RRC Moscow. I have no desire to prove something like you.
        1. -1
          14 June 2022 08: 46
          What "Moscow" was for 2022, I don't know. And I have reason to believe that the Neptunes have nothing to do with it. Firstly, a couple of missiles were supposed to be intercepted, there was nothing new here since the 1s, secondly, the Armed Forces of Ukraine, sucking out power from everywhere, somehow didn’t come up with anything at that time, they didn’t even award anyone, although they didn’t have a show nowhere.

          I am not interested in your opinion about the combat capability of the F-35, since the US Department of Defense does not share information with you, nor the statements of its developer. Everyone knows how to declare, ours say that the Su-35 is able to see the F-22 for 90 km. And this statement is no worse than the American ones. And the fact that the F-35, like an aircraft, is an analogue of the "superhornet", is evident from its declared performance characteristics. I like the "superhornet", but this is a machine with quite a definition. capabilities, and which was not even planned to work as an interceptor.
          1. 0
            14 June 2022 09: 32
            And the fact that the F-35, like an aircraft, is an analogue of the "superhornet", is evident from its declared performance characteristics.

            An amazing statement. It turns out that if the MiG-25 has a higher speed and altitude than the Su-35, then it is better.
            I am not interested in your opinion about the combat capability of the F-35, since the US Department of Defense does not share information with you, nor the statements of its developer.

            Then there is nothing to talk about. Good luck! hi
    3. +7
      8 June 2022 11: 42
      Quote: ramzay21
      If our Su-35 meets the F-35 in the sky, then this meeting will not end with anything good for our aircraft.

      Even a meeting with something like Rafal will be extremely dangerous for the Su-35. AFAR is a real and serious advantage, unlike "pancakes" and other "stabbing".
      1. -2
        14 June 2022 08: 48
        AFAR does not provide any fundamental advantages over PFAR; in both cases, electronic scanning. But the power of the radar gives. It is especially interesting how to form beams on AFAR when there is not enough power, in all directions, and in each half-blind.
        1. -1
          10 July 2022 09: 11
          Quote: EvilLion
          AFAR does not provide any fundamental advantages over PFAR; in both cases, electronic scanning. But the power of the radar gives. It is especially interesting how to form beams on AFAR when there is not enough power, in all directions, and in each half-blind.


          The Su-35 miserably lost at least a couple of tenders to Rafal due to the failure, first of all, of its radar against Rafal's AFAR radar. The power and range of the Su-35 radar did not help him and did not save him.
          And the death of the cruiser is an argument that simply cannot be brushed aside by assuming an ostrich pose. Then the next time they will take it even more severely. The technological and technical advantage in the means and systems of destruction and protection is not something that can be neglected and something that can be taken lightly. Otherwise, it is death on the battlefield and defeat in the war.
  20. +7
    8 June 2022 10: 59
    Awesome! The author did not even mention in the article such an aircraft as the F-15EX - the latest modification of the air superiority fighter, which, along with the F-22, will inevitably accompany numerous strike F-35s. The F-15EX is a fucking long-range radar with built-in (!) directional EW (!), which can jam the Irbis Su-35 PFAR, having received target designation from an AWACS aircraft. F-15EX is 22 (twenty-two !!!) AIM-120 missiles, operating on the "fire and forget" principle and able to passively aim at the enemy's EW signal source (!!!).
    1. -7
      8 June 2022 11: 28
      Radar and electronic warfare together is, of course, powerful. In terms of generators and cooling.

      By the way, I still don’t understand why the F-15EX has as many as 22 missiles, if everyone here tells me that you can’t dodge a missile. Maybe real aviators have a different opinion on this matter, and vice versa, they believe that a missile miss is much more likely than a hit, and therefore the aircraft must carry many missiles of even the same type.
      1. +6
        8 June 2022 11: 56
        Probably because to destroy 124 Su-2021s built as of August 35, only 5,6 F-15EXs will be required.
    2. +3
      8 June 2022 20: 35
      The author did not even mention in the article such an aircraft as the F-15EX - the latest modification of the air superiority fighter, which, along with the F-22, will inevitably accompany numerous strike F-35s.

      In general, as far as I understood correctly, the F-15EX can work in tandem with the F-35, where the F-35 will detect targets and carry out target designation, and the F-15EX will be at a safe distance from enemy aircraft as a flying arsenal. It seems that even an F-35 pilot can control F-15EX missile launches
      1. 0
        14 June 2022 08: 53
        Can I ask a simple question, but why the hell do you need all this, the F-35, which already shines with radar, cannot launch a rocket itself?

        There is a simpler hypothesis, we need fast interceptors, for which stealth is irrelevant, because the radar is on, and vehicles like the Su-34, which can carry a lot of various ammunition, and not 2 bombs of 900 kg each.
        1. +1
          14 June 2022 09: 46
          You probably don’t know that the F-35 has the best radar in the world, capable of passively detecting targets at long distances without flare, and the F-35 itself has such a low EPR that it allows you to operate freely in enemy airspace and direct missiles.
          And what's the point that the Su-34 can carry ammunition? Israeli F-35s operate freely over Syria, in whose air defense there are S-300s, but Su-34s over Ukraine with the same S-300s cannot act like that, they will be detected and shot down.
  21. +5
    8 June 2022 11: 29
    Quote: Author
    ... the Russian side stubbornly talked about maneuvers on its territory, and that in Ukraine everyone can sleep peacefully.

    Well, Duc, they have a lie, sex and a knife in the back, and we are a military trick, "treat with understanding" ©
    laughing
  22. +9
    8 June 2022 11: 40
    The super-maneuverability of the Su-35, its ability to turn, “cobras”, “pancakes” gives it an advantage precisely in “stabbing”.

    Has anyone been able to demonstrate at least in a training battle on the Su-35 the advantage that "pancakes" and "cobras" give?
    1. +4
      8 June 2022 15: 59
      In my opinion, all these cobras are demonstrated to buyers in order to show the power and reliability of the engine and airframe. No more. And the layman is told fairy tales that if the all-round radar notices the enemy 20 km behind you, you can make a cobra with a show off and shoot everyone down. In fact, if the enemy is on your tail 20 km away from you, you will obviously not care about the cobras.
      1. 0
        14 June 2022 08: 54
        The turn is faster, and this is less loss of speed.
    2. 0
      10 July 2022 09: 30
      In defense of maneuverability, the following can be said. Other things being equal, having an advantage in maneuverability in air combat is a blessing compared to its absence.
      1. 0
        8 August 2022 09: 51
        A sniper doesn't need maneuverability in combat. His trump card is stealth. The F-35 is a tactical sniper. Su-35 is like a maximum of some heavily armed infantryman. However, practice shows that a pair of snipers can easily destroy an infantry squad. A sniper doesn't need supermaneuverability. Moreover, the limitation of the maneuverability of the aircraft is 6-9G, and the air-to-air missiles are 12-14G.
        1. -1
          16 September 2022 06: 24
          Snipers on both sides can run out of ammo. And then a "knife" fight is possible, where the advantage in maneuverability will play a decisive role.
          1. 0
            16 September 2022 15: 12
            Considering the amount of current equipment, a sniper cannot run out of "cartridges" in any way. Usually, opponents of snipers end earlier, and snipers leave unnoticed. The result of their work is obvious, but where they themselves are is unclear. And they strive for the same. Moreover, given that only a couple of dozen aircraft are being built in the ood, and not a couple of thousand, then what kind of completion of "cartridges" can we even talk about? Planes will run out before chum ammo.
            1. 0
              16 September 2022 17: 33
              Maybe you misunderstood me, maybe I didn’t express myself clearly, so I’ll simplify the question and suggest that you consider a scenario in which in an air battle there are opponents with absolutely similar characteristics of stealth, avionics, weapons, etc., the only difference is that one is noticeably more maneuverable than the other. What is your prediction for the outcome of this fight, assuming none of the opponents dodge it?
              1. -1
                17 September 2022 15: 54
                Those. a battle in which all five Russian Su-57s meet two or three dozen F-35s, right? Or even more real: a pair of Su-57s meets with a dozen F-35s covered by two pairs of F-22s, and warned about the route of the Russian Su-57s from the NATO Avaks aircraft. So, I presented - a very real situation - what next?
                1. 0
                  17 September 2022 17: 08
                  You make you think badly of yourself by avoiding the obvious answer.)) Which was required to be proved. Good luck.))
                  1. -1
                    17 September 2022 23: 33
                    Obvious? It's just so obvious to me. Here are your fantasies.
  23. 0
    8 June 2022 11: 49
    Of course, you can dream up, but this will be the beginning of the end.
  24. 0
    8 June 2022 12: 01
    For some reason, their IB f35 is constantly striving to be compared with pure I SU35, and not with IB SU34. or single-engine LShch Yak 130.

    on VO and partners every month - one - two - three articles F35 against Su35. You can see the numbers are the same in the title.

    And not a single F35 article against the Yak130, almost nothing about the F35-Su34

    IMHO, aircraft of different purposes - a small F35 bomber and a large, almost one and a half times heavier, Su 35 fighter.
  25. +5
    8 June 2022 12: 34
    This is my first comment on VO on an article that I do not read.

    The "Armata vs. Abrams" approach, or, as in the title of the article, F-35 vs. Su-35, I consider initially erroneous, but, unfortunately, typical.

    It is not supposed to confront these aircraft, especially in the form of a duel. There is an F-22 for air superiority, specifically for the task of confronting the most modern enemy.
  26. +4
    8 June 2022 13: 07
    In my opinion, when they relied on the F35 as the main aircraft of the Air Force, they stopped producing the F22 ..... the Americans believed that the Russian Federation would not pull something more modern than the Su27M (and derivatives) and Mi29 ...... for all this, the F35's capabilities are "above the roof" ... and even now, in the absence of massive modern AFARs (or PFARs) and in the absence of massive and modern AWACS .... the fight against the F35 hordes and the fresh F15 and F16 of the latest series .. .combined with AWACS (large numbers) will be a very difficult task .... and their strike missions are accompanied by a large number of CDs.
  27. +8
    8 June 2022 14: 13
    A lot of optimism, Roman. It should be understood that behind the West is not only a shaft of satellites-DLRO-quality equipment and microelectronics, but also a combination of the quantity and quality of modern technology, piloting and maintenance personnel. That is, here we can talk about complex superiority. These people did not wake up yesterday, their army was in a completely combat-ready state for decades, they had time to hone and train interaction, study our equipment and our tactics, and in general, in principle, our entire complex. I believe that disproportionately more than we could study them.
    The complex advantage is expressed in the fact that one of our conditional Su-35s will have how many NATO aircraft there? How many NATO air-to-air missiles will be needed for one of our missiles? How much better is the state of affairs with NATO's "real time" alert, relative to how it is with us?
    Finally, the question of rotation - how many high-quality pilots does NATO have, and how many do we have? Experienced forces are, of course, magical, but replacing tired, burnt-out and retired people with fresh and also experienced ones is much more wonderful.

    Speaking about our trump cards in the hypothetical struggle between our forces and NATO aviation, I can definitely single out only one - ground elements of a layered air defense-missile defense system. These are precisely the forces whose grinding would be a long, bloody and dangerous job for NATO. Only in connection with these forces and our complex of forces, our aviation objectively poses a threat to NATO - in the event of any conflicts on the territory of Ukraine. By itself, our aviation is not on its territory in qualitatively better conditions than NATO aviation, which could be there.
    We do not have dominance in terms of the total number and performance characteristics over NATO aircraft, which may end up on the territory of Ukraine (and be based there) and also operate the airfields of neighboring states.
    The speed of putting new machines into operation by our aviation industry is also inferior (significantly) not even to NATO, but specifically to the United States. How will we replace the losses? Who will we replace them with? And there would certainly be losses.

    Our problem, as I see it, is not even 100500 5th generation aircraft or an economy that is unable to ensure their significant production. Our problem is that we are inferior to NATO in the network centric, both in terms of the quality of approaches and the abundance and quality of means. This is something that could be adjusted in a few years, which would cost much more modestly in terms of costs than new cars. But, alas, organizationally we are still much harder than the West ..
    1. +5
      8 June 2022 15: 10
      Quote: Knell Wardenheart
      This is something that could be adjusted in a few years, which would cost much more modestly in terms of costs than new cars.

      What would cost less? Your link 16? Is this some kind of joke?
      Quote: Knell Wardenheart
      I can single out only one unambiguously - ground elements of a layered air defense missile defense system. These are precisely the forces whose grinding would be a long, bloody and dangerous job for NATO.

      Where does the strange idea come from that the states have a four-story integrated missile defense / air defense system (TNAAD / PAK3 / Avengers / centurions) (and now they are cutting in two more floors, NASAMS / Iron Dome for medium range and Typhoon to bend over all life), backed up with nothing than incomparable radio reconnaissance, does not present a problem, but the bushes of the RF Armed Forces for an order of magnitude more powerful enemy aviation - do they?
  28. -5
    8 June 2022 15: 14
    Well, the topic of air confrontation between machines is quite interesting.
    It is clear that the Americans tried to create a machine for attacks on civilian targets or on a deliberately technically backward enemy.
    But according to information from various media, the F-35 is a "raw" car, even according to American data, up to 800 improvements need to be done there. And the US has already begun to cram the F-35 models into its allies ... :)

    And yet, the quality of the aircraft can be assessed after the average number of takeoffs over 10 years is equal to the number of landings on the runway and the number of combat missions completed.
    According to these criteria, the F-15 and our Su-27 had good showings.
  29. 0
    8 June 2022 15: 36
    It seems that everything is logical, but it would be nice to know what the parties have in the stash, which so far no one has ever dreamed of. For Hitler, too, the T-34 and KV, along with Katyusha, turned out to be a complete surprise.
  30. +1
    8 June 2022 15: 46
    Quote: EvilLion


    Did you understand what you wrote? In general, if your radar can receive a response impulse from the target, then for the target your radar is like a Christmas tree at night.


    Have you ever heard of the sensitivity threshold of devices? Although from where, for this it is necessary now to study in special institutions. By the way, I took a course at a technical school. Not everything for KiPovtsev is as simple as you think. At the threshold, by the way, there are many criteria: pulse time, pulse energy, physical parameter of the pulse, such as wavelength, etc. So, different devices have different sensitivity thresholds, accuracy classes, etc. And the enemy radiation sensor usually feels good when your radar is aiming at it. It does not scan with short pulses, but it aims so that this powerful continuous signal is reflected and hits the small insensitive radar of your semi-active homing missile. Therefore, it is necessary to highlight targets for missiles of previous generations. And it is precisely such continuous radiation that will be detected by a sensor that scans frequency after frequency of possible exposure. But not the entire possible range at once. In addition, irradiation sensors can be directional. And there are still cameras that shoot well only during the day, there are those that shoot at night, and there are night vision devices of different classes. And usually, in the course of technological progress, new devices can significantly exceed the old ones. And there is the human eye, which is generally better than most devices that do not have a narrow specialization in terms of a combination of factors. But devices of narrow specialization in their range bypass it. This is a little bit about the sensitivity of devices, about the difference in sensitivity between devices with a wide and narrow range. Has anything become clear to you about the radar surveying space in short pulses?


    Do you even understand that the target can simply turn away and then even the theoretical possibility of spitting a rocket into nowhere, perhaps it will find someone, disappears?

    The target can turn away even when you guide the missile manually, and it is not a fact that your reaction will be more effective than an anti-missile maneuver. And the anti-missile maneuver used to save even rockets from guided vehicles. This time. And on the other hand, why would she turn away from her course if there are no input data. Thirdly, a certain search square is given to the rocket, within which, taking into account
    the most probable maneuvers will still turn out to be the target in a fairly short time of the rocket's flight. And think about it, people have thousands of years of experience shooting moving targets that can turn away, and they are often successful.
    1. 0
      14 June 2022 09: 08
      Have you ever heard of the sensitivity threshold of devices?


      For college students. You have a radar that sends a pulse. Somewhere after 100 km, an insignificant part of this pulse collides with an obstacle and is reflected, an insignificant part of the reflected pulse enters the radar receiver. That is, the signal that the sensor receives on the target is orders of magnitude more powerful than what reaches the radar. It is clear that there is a frequency that is changing, this technology is 100 years old in the afternoon, but it is very naive to hope that a very powerful radiation will remain undetected. It is clear that if we have frequency-tunable radars, then the reaction to such exposure will be appropriate, and not like in the 70s, when you never know what came to the sensor, the SPO will yell when captured.

      In general, this all works within the framework of the notion that they have some kind of miracle technology, and we, apparently, have the MiG-21. Nu-nu. It is for this that the Americans call banal well-known technologies with new names, all of them have pseudo-random frequency tuning, and they have LPI, or-what-it-is-they-called.
      1. 0
        14 June 2022 15: 33
        LPI is not work immediately on the frequency spectrum, this function is provided only by AFAR.
      2. 0
        8 August 2022 10: 08
        If you have at least some signal strength that does not match the frequency of the radio reception, then the latter will not accept it in any way. And it is impossible to listen to all frequencies at the same time. Get yourself the simplest FM radio on the market and see for yourself. You will not be able to listen to any Europe-plus if you are tuned to Peter-FM at this moment. You can constantly drive the local oscillator knob back and forth to listen to different frequencies. But if the desired sound on some unknown wave sounds in a period much shorter than the period you scroll the local oscillator in one direction, then most likely you will miss it, no matter how strong it sounds. In addition, if you are looking for something specific, and there is noise on the air, then when you quickly scroll, you will not be able to distinguish the sound you are looking for from the noise. You can only catch a persistently long and stubbornly hanging wave. This is the trick of the radar with a short polling pulse. Approximately according to this principle, the protection of the bluetooth channel in your Chinese headphones connected to a smartphone works. Two devices change the frequency of connecting to each other according to a pseudo-random algorithm. Therefore, no outsider can listen in, although a powerful signal is always on the air, but periodically it changes the broadcast frequency. And this despite the fact that another dozen happy people with bluetooth headphones are sitting next to you on the bus. So, if you have a short-pulse radar that can also change the frequency of emission and reception, if you have F-16, F-18 on different planes , F-22, F-35 are radars with different wavelengths - you can't listen to them all at the same time on one radio. Moreover, even 50 radio receivers will not solve all your problems and will not cover the entire possible frequency range. Is it clear on the fingers?
  31. 0
    8 June 2022 17: 06
    It will not be the plane against the plane that will fight, but the state against the state, the army against the army.
  32. -3
    8 June 2022 20: 35
    The F-35 must be compared with the Su-34, and they are identical in terms of tasks both in terms of functionality and performance characteristics.
    1. 0
      14 June 2022 15: 33
      Su-34 is a completely different aircraft.
      1. 0
        14 June 2022 15: 59
        with a fig another? Both are called fighter-bombers with attack aircraft functions, both have a maximum speed of 1900 km / h.
        1. 0
          14 June 2022 16: 36
          The difference is in the set of speed, maneuverability, radar, radar visibility.
          The Su-34 is a sort of overweight F-15E, which they decided to replace the Su-24 with.
          1. 0
            14 June 2022 16: 44
            Radar stealth is not a destination. But the functions of the bomber and attack aircraft are both original. And about the speed increase, I'm not sure that the fu-35 is faster.
            1. 0
              14 June 2022 17: 29
              And about the speed increase, I'm not sure that the fu-35 is faster.

              The F-35A does not carry an armored cabin useless in air combat, has a more advanced engine, and has no restrictions on maneuver due to the resistance of missiles suspended under the wings.
              Attempts to belittle the opponent's technique by giving it funny nicknames do not affect the characteristics and training of pilots in any way. As well as the number of these machines (700+ pieces already, 15! Aircraft are produced per month against 2 Su-30/35 in our country).
              RL stealth is not a destination

              What do you mean??
              Stealth is an important tactical advantage in combat.
              1. 0
                14 June 2022 17: 47
                137 Su-30SM (for 2020) Su-35S 97 units (for 2022) Su-34 122 (for 2020) total if all together, taking into account the past 2 years, 360-400 aircraft. Taking into account the military budget of Russia 42 billion against the United States 760 billion, the difference in aircraft is two times .. and the budget is more than 16 times.
                1. 0
                  14 June 2022 18: 02
                  You forgot that 800 pieces (as of 1.06.22) are only F-35s.
                  220 F-15E, 236 F-15S, 951 F-16 of the latest modifications, 195 F-22, and 765 F-18 of all modifications in the fleet ..
                  And in addition to this, 45 AWACS aircraft and about 500 (more than all countries combined) tankers.
                  Russian budget 42 billion against the US 760 billion

                  This budget also includes the world's largest fleet, which includes 10 aircraft carriers, 80+ ships of the first rank.
                  It's always better to be rich and healthy request
                  1. 0
                    14 June 2022 18: 16
                    well-u-u-u-u .. 10 aircraft carriers is a profanity ... on list paper ... we know how many are in real service ... if 3 units, then this is already excellent.
                    1. 0
                      14 June 2022 18: 56
                      on payroll paper ... we then know how many are in the ranks in real life ... if 3 units, then this is already excellent.

                      Not in the ranks, but on campaigns. In the event of a major war, everyone will go to sea. And aviation on them will be the safest.
                      Perhaps I will discover America, but ships from all countries undergo periodic maintenance and repairs.
                      Important: the pace of construction. In a year, the Russian Federation will have +24 Su-30/35s (it will be difficult for minutes due to a disruption in the supply of electronics), and the USA will have + 180 technically complex F-35s.
                      I’m generally silent about comparing the pace of construction of surface ships .. We have 12 years for a frigate (2 ranks), they have 4 years for a destroyer (1 rank).
              2. 0
                14 June 2022 17: 50
                Yes .. and I forgot about the important advantage in the form of stealth ... the F-35 is a complete profanity because it glows on the S-400 radars like a black eye ... tested in Syria and Turkey.
                1. 0
                  14 June 2022 18: 08
                  S-400 radars like a black eye ... tested in Syria and Turkey.

                  Outside of sorties, such aircraft fly with Luneberg lenses.
                  Find a way to stuff the Irbis radar with a headlamp diameter into the R-77 rocket. (Not working yet)
                  The radar of this missile captures a target like the Su-35 from 20 km, for the F-35 it’s good if from 5 km. This means that you will have to “lead” the rocket in the oncoming battle for longer. But when a similar missile is fired at you, this will not work, you will have to descend and turn away, breaking the capture
                  I've posted 2 videos in the comments here to give you an idea of ​​how modern out-of-sight combat goes. See.
  33. +4
    8 June 2022 20: 39
    It's funny after 1991, and after March 2014, it doesn't look serious at all. Kindergarten is the junior group of world politics, nothing more.

    After 1991, the armies of the NATO countries decreased by an average of 2 times, and the number of US military personnel in Europe - by 10 times. This is clear evidence of preparations for an attack. No.
  34. +2
    8 June 2022 21: 02
    One gets the impression that the author does NOT understand how the battle goes out of sight. Where, in order not to be hit, you need to be fast enough and inconspicuous, and not turn turns, as at an air show (the rocket will not be impressed).

    (To roughly understand what it is about. At the end of the video - an analysis of the battle on the map)
    The concept of using the stealthy F-22, and later the F-35 with missiles with ARL seeker, was tailored precisely for such a combat scheme.
    In close combat - there are R-73M and AIM-9x, with a Max overload of 50-60g.
    Israeli Python-5s, which the F-35 can use, do not self-destruct after a miss, but make a circle and attack the (often relieved and more vulnerable) target again.
    1. +3
      8 June 2022 23: 36
      The author has driven himself into a narrow framework, and such serious threats to the Su-35 as IRIS-T air-to-air missiles (Tornado, F / A-18 Hornet, Eurofighter Typhoon, F-16 Fighting Falcon, Saab JAS-39 Gripen) and MBDA Meteor (Saab JAS-39 Gripen, Dassault Rafale, Eurofighter Typhoon).
      Simple arithmetic shows that the total number of carriers of these ultra-modern missiles in NATO is many times greater than the number of Russian Aerospace Forces fighters opposing them. And "pancakes" and "cobras" will only lead to the pilots dying tired from overloads.
      1. +4
        9 June 2022 08: 49
        Quote: Torvlobnor IV
        such serious threats to the Su-35 as air-to-air missiles IRIS-T (Tornado, F / A-18 Hornet, Eurofighter Typhoon, F-16 Fighting Falcon, Saab JAS-39 Gripen) and MBDA Meteor (Saab JAS- 39 Gripen, Dassault Rafale, Eurofighter Typhoon).

        You expect too much from this author.

        They write that in January the upgrade of the penguin to block 4 began. They promised that integration with the meteor and AIM-120D would finally be established in this block. I don’t know if it works, but if it works, then the issue with the DVB is more or less resolved.
      2. 0
        14 June 2022 09: 10
        Are you going to fight with all of Europe and the USA with a population of 700 million at once? Against a nuclear strike, all these miracles of aviation are helpless.
        1. 0
          14 June 2022 15: 37
          At least the aircraft carriers will survive. They don't care about the ICBR.
          And this is several hundred aircraft, for which there will be targets even after the exchange of strategic strikes.
          In addition, during a threatening period, aircraft on the ground will be dispersed as much as possible over a large number of airfields.
    2. -1
      14 June 2022 09: 09
      To be fast, you just need to turn turns as efficiently as possible, while maintaining maximum energy.
      1. 0
        14 June 2022 15: 23
        fast just need to turn turns as efficiently as possible

        Turning corners, you lose speed. Airshow aerobatics - for speeds of 0,5-0,6M.
        And for a battle out of sight, the speed must be 1m or more.
        Watch the video.
        By the way, about the attempts to "break into close combat", which some wrote about here, passing off as effective tactics against the F-22:
        there is a certain minimum distance beyond which you can still get away from the AIM-120, for the C5-7 modification it is about 10 miles (it should be more for D).
        Closer - the rocket still has enough energy so that, with any tricks, the enemy plane will be shot down with a probability close to 100%.
    3. 0
      22 June 2022 10: 23
      Cool and professional! Bringing DCS videos as evidence is a sign of skill. True, this is a bit of a past century. Now such videos serve as proof of the count of downed aircraft.
      1. 0
        22 June 2022 17: 03
        You apparently did not understand:
        The DCS is just to give you an idea of ​​out-of-sight combat in general (which few here seem to have).
        The best simulator in the world, all the features are taken into account.
        Read about BVR (beyond visual range) tactics.
        The appearance of the AIM-120 and P-77 largely led to this.
  35. -3
    8 June 2022 21: 16
    Although there are errors in the article, one of the messages is absolutely correct.
    It is impossible to objectively evaluate the two aircraft as they are designed for different strategies. Hence the different design priorities.
    But I would not agree that over Ukraine, in its environment, Su will have a strong advantage. But in the Far East, if the Japanese have F-ki, the advantage will most likely not be with our aircraft.
  36. -2
    9 June 2022 10: 37
    Comparison of warm with soft. Okay, I'll try my best.
    The point here is not even that the terms are mixed up, the concept with tactics.
    Comparing the Su-35 and F-35, to put it mildly, is not entirely correct. Even if the F-35 can work on the VTs, the opponent of the Su-35 is still the same F-15, which is in service and its mass production continues. As for the F-35, yes, the tactics of its use are different, yet it is primarily information security.
    Yes, and he is imprisoned more for colonial wars.
    1. 0
      14 June 2022 15: 43
      Yes, and he is imprisoned more for colonial wars.

      It is imprisoned for combat out of sight. It accelerates quickly (despite the lower speed than the Su-35 Max), an inconspicuous, advanced AFAR radar.
      For close combat, military customers decided that AIM-9x with the ability to capture and launch from all angles (using DAS) was enough.
  37. +1
    9 June 2022 17: 20
    By the way, the article has an F-22 in the first photo, which is not entirely consistent with the title.
    "Report" has a very good chance of winning both in close combat and in combat out of sight (medium-long range) against the Su-35.
    Stealth, better visibility from the cab, HOTAS control, requiring less effort at high g-forces. Large specific thrust, no resistance from missiles suspended under the wings and the restrictions imposed by this fact on Max overload (for the Su-35 it is 6-7 g, instead of 9-10 for the "empty" one at the air show). The advantages of the internal weapons bay, aerodynamics are always the same ...
  38. 0
    9 June 2022 17: 42
    "Only three principles" - they just forgot the fourth principle - the first fell down, regardless of the result wink
  39. +1
    9 June 2022 18: 46
    The funny thing is that the dispute about the capabilities of aircraft is based on paper characteristics. Everyone declares MAXIMUM ranges of destruction / detection, etc. And no one cares that these characteristics can float depending on the type of target, its maneuvering / speed characteristics, in general, the presence of maneuvering, and so on.
    In fact, none of the compared aircraft worked on each other. Therefore, one can only guess what and how.
    "Smooth on paper, but forgot about the ravines" (c)
    1. 0
      13 June 2022 09: 42
      And if the Irbis radar is replaced by ROFAR Belka from the Su-57
      1. 0
        13 June 2022 20: 18
        By the way, if this ROFAR Belka is installed on the M-55. Geophysics, with its ceiling of 22 km, I wonder what the target detection range will be
        1. 0
          15 June 2022 23: 21
          Squirrel is not a rofar at all, and the very concept of rofar in combat aviation now looks no closer than combat lasers
        2. 0
          29 August 2022 15: 58
          The geophysicist was released only 5 pieces, it seems. And it is not known how many of them are now in flight condition. But the fact that Avaks with a good antenna could not be created over 40 years of work to improve the Bumblebee is a stone in the garden of these design bureaus, which only mastered the budget in full, completely not focusing on the result
    2. 0
      14 June 2022 15: 28
      Above in the comment, I posted a video that gives an idea of ​​\uXNUMXb\uXNUMXbmodern combat out of sight (medium-long distance).
  40. 0
    14 June 2022 19: 06
    I don't understand the meaning of these comparisons. Why push these fighters 1 on 1? What's the point? NATO units have a numerical superiority!
    The analogy is simple. Let's remember Panther and T-34 in 1943. It is obvious that the German prodigy is newer and more perfect. But there were many more Soviet cars!
    So these comparisons are meaningless.
    1. +1
      22 June 2022 18: 34
      Only here we have the numerical superiority of the Panthers.
      You can adopt the sports principle: “the main thing is not victory, but participation” request
  41. -2
    17 June 2022 11: 43
    F 35 fly, I mean fly normally, can’t fly at all. Greetings from Grandpa Whitcomb! It would also be worth remembering the flight efficiency of the engine and a lot of other, no less indecent abbreviations.
    The aircraft is flawed not even from the moment of conception, but from the moment when the father of the project threw his leg on his mother.
    Americans generally have a passion for universalism in their blood.
    1. 0
      22 June 2022 18: 40
      The aircraft has a range significantly greater than that of the F-18 and F-16.
      Speed ​​characteristics (acceleration, cruising supersonic 1,2M) are better than those of the F-18.
      The presence of an internal weapons bay allows missiles NOT to influence maneuvers and speed gain. (Su-35 with 6 missiles is immediately limited to 5-6g, can NOT fly 1,1M without afterburner).
      All this, coupled with stealth, gives the Lightning 2 advantages in combat out of sight, for which this aircraft was imprisoned.
      Yes, in a battle with Su-35, Raptor, Eurofighter cannons, he will most likely be shot down. With the use of BVB missiles, everything is no longer so obvious.
      And the battle out of sight - only with the "Raptor" will go on an equal footing.
  42. 0
    22 June 2022 18: 29
    Another advantage of the HOTAS aircraft controls is that the control stick and the pilot's hand do not block the monitors and sensors, you do not need to lean forward to see the information at the bottom of the display (very inconvenient when overloaded).

  43. -1
    5 July 2022 23: 18
    By the way, one of the worst options for us. As in Korea, Soviet pilots flew for a moment 15 with Korean identification marks. F 35 with Ukrainian marks may appear. Formally, these will be Ukrainian aircraft, with Ukrainian pilots. (Formally). In real life, NATO pilots.
  44. Pablo
    0
    20 July 2022 22: 03
    Of course, I didn’t finish flying school .. But is the speed advantage of the Su-35 a weakness? In my opinion, 850 km per hour for the F-35 fighter is equal to the Me-262 in afterburner mode. Even that ancient MiG-15 will overtake him. Plus, the presence of air defense missiles on the fuselage of the Su-35 hull, which have a large interception range .. In my opinion, comparing the F-35 and SU-35 is pointless. Because it's obvious who will win.
  45. 0
    22 July 2022 08: 24
    All territories have radars that perfectly scan almost the entire territory of Ukraine.
    I'm wondering what are these? What does the West have in the radar that allows you to look through Ukraine through and issue target designation?
  46. 0
    8 August 2022 18: 14
    The Su-35 is armed with 4 × R-37M (RVV-BD), which is a fact ... And so, I will support the author: the F-35 is a fighter-bomber, it has both a speed of 1930 km per hour and maneuvering characteristics not high, the missiles are designed for combat at medium distances - it will be difficult for him to fight with the Su-35, which is a 4 ++ fighter, the F-35, simply, is not intended for this ... As for AWACS, Russia has their own AWACS, there are also satellites, so the Americans, especially, have nothing to catch, especially since Russia can widely use electronic warfare systems ... And with regards to the "raptors", F-22, the Americans have 184 of them, t .e. uncritically larger than our Su-35s, they were released a long time ago and it is not known in what, really, condition (now their combat readiness, officially, is 68%).... https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Su-35
  47. AML
    0
    20 August 2022 01: 14
    In general, it is rather strange that neither the Russian Federation nor NATO are even trying to develop a rapidly reproducible cheap aircraft. Modern aircraft are technologically complex, in a global conflict they will last for six months if with optimism, and then what?

    In the Second World War, tens of thousands of aircraft were produced. What gives you reason to think that modern aircraft will retire with less intensity? F35 throughout Western civilization for 15 years 800pcs and this is still a good production rate.

    I'm not saying that now they need to be done in unthinkable quantities, but there must be some kind of plan B. Something from "shit and sticks" plus a cannon / machine gun. No, I don’t know, maybe somewhere in the bins the MiG-15/19/21 assembly line is gathering dust. And if not?
    1. 0
      29 August 2022 15: 53
      The essence of the concept of using a fighter has changed. If during the development of the MiG29 the factor was taken into account that during the war it is unlikely that it would take off more than twice, now, when the cost of one F35 is approaching 100M tanks, they do not want to lose it in 1 or 2 air combat ...
  48. 0
    29 August 2022 15: 50
    The author stubbornly does not mention the size of the F35 tag on the Russian air defense locator. And she, excuse me, corresponds to the size of a goose in flight
    1. AML
      0
      30 August 2022 08: 48
      Invisible in the mm range, but in cm? Too much 'if' should happen.

      If the Americans do not see f35 in their radars, then who is their doctor?