Military Review

DARPA DRACO program building a nuclear powered spacecraft

86

DRACO ship in orbit - so far only in the artist's view


Advanced Development Agency DARPA, together with a number of third-party organizations, begins preliminary design for the DRACO program. Its goal is to create a promising spacecraft with a nuclear rocket engine. With the help of such technology, the army will be able to obtain fundamentally new logistics and other capabilities.

New tasks


Currently, the Pentagon is working on the concept of "fast maneuver in the space between the Earth and the Moon." Complexes and systems for various purposes are proposed, capable of quickly placing the required load into orbit and solving certain arising problems. In this case, special requirements are imposed on the characteristics of the launch vehicle and the ship with a payload. It is the latter that is proposed to be developed within the framework of the new program.

The program was named DRACO - Demonstration Rocket for Agile Cislunar Operations ("Demonstration rocket for flexible operations within the orbit of the moon"). As the name implies, while we are talking about the rocket-space complex-technology demonstrator. The first launch of a rocket and a ship of a new type is going to be carried out no later than 2025.

A key issue in the DARPA program is the choice of propulsion system. DARPA believes that modern chemical and future electric rocket engines have an unfavorable ratio of key characteristics, and therefore are not quite suitable for use in "fast maneuver".

A way out of this situation should be a nuclear rocket engine (NRM), designated as Nuclear Thermal Propulsion (NTP). Especially for DRACO, it is proposed to develop such a motor with a given level of performance. It is assumed that the NRE with a high specific power and high efficiency will give the ship the required characteristics.

In several stages


The search for future project participants began last year. It was reported about the imminent signing of contracts with large organizations with extensive experience in the rocket and space sector. The possibility of attracting small organizations with the necessary competencies was not excluded. Recently, the search process culminated in the signing of contracts with contractors.

On April 12, DARPA announced the start of DRACO's design work and the selection of contractors. The development of new technologies and units will be carried out by General Atomics, Gryphon Technologies, Blue Origins and Lockheed Martin. They are given various kinds of tasks, incl. quite complex.

Earlier it was reported that the DRACO program will be divided into several stages, each of which will solve its own problems. The first of them, starting right now, will last 18 months and will end in the fall of next year.

It is divided into two main directions, in the course of which various tasks will be solved. The aim of the project "Track A" is to create the definition of the general appearance of the propulsion system based on NTP and the subsequent development of the preliminary design. General Atomics becomes the Contractor for Track A. The main components of the reactor will be developed by Gryphon Technologies.

Blue Origin and Lockheed Martin will operate in parallel on Track B. They have to develop two projects of spaceships. The first to do the so-called. Demonstration System (DS) demo for testing. Then, on its basis, an Operational System (OS) product will be created, designed for full-fledged operation.

It is noted that the DS and OS projects are not the main components of the program. The main focus in the near future will be on the NTP nuclear propulsion system. It is necessary to find the necessary technologies and form the main features of its design. Also, DARPA and contractors will have to work out security issues.

DARPA is already announcing the next stages of the program, but it dispenses with unnecessary details. By next autumn, the appearance of the rocket and space system will be formed, after which the development of a full-fledged project will start. The first start is scheduled for 2025. For obvious reasons, the developers of DRACO cannot yet reveal all the technical aspects of the project.

Advanced technologies


The available data on the DRACO project allows us to imagine what the new American rocket and space system will be like - and why it is of great interest to the Pentagon, represented by DARPA. Such a system would include a carrier rocket, probably of one of the existing types, and a special spacecraft of a new development.

DARPA DRACO program building a nuclear powered spacecraft
One of the concepts of a nuclear powered spacecraft

For takeoff and entry into the calculated orbit DRACO will use a "traditional" booster rocket with a chemical fuel rocket engine. Despite all the benefits and precautions, NRE is too dangerous for use within the earth's atmosphere. The ship will only be able to launch its own engine in outer space.

Gryphon Technologies offers a modern NRP design based on the well-known concept of a gaseous propellant engine. In such an engine, hydrogen must enter the core, receive thermal energy, and exit through the nozzle, creating thrust. This principle has already been used in experimental projects of the past, and in the new project it is planned to use modern solutions in the field of structures and technologies.

It is planned to obtain several main advantages through the use of NRE. A nuclear engine is much more compact and lighter than a liquid plant with the same thrust indicators, and also does not need large tanks for fuel and oxidizer. The use of atomic energy provides significant advantages in all basic characteristics. However, NRE is difficult and expensive to manufacture, and its use is associated with a number of important limitations. An accident with the destruction of the core threatens the most serious consequences.

Future issues


DARPA and the Pentagon indicate that the DRACO rocket and space system will be used for various operations in space within the orbit of the Moon. DRACO will differ from existing spacecraft in greater flexibility and efficiency of use. At the same time, the US military does not name specific tasks that such a system will face.

Perhaps the list of future responsibilities of the new ship with NRE has not yet been determined, and tasks for it will be searched for at the next stages of the program. However, it cannot be ruled out that the Pentagon already has the most serious plans for this development, but does not consider it necessary to disclose them.

NASA is also showing interest in systems with NRE - they can be useful for non-military space exploration. The DRACO-like system is expected to facilitate scientific missions such as flights to the Moon or Mars. In the latter case, according to calculations, a nuclear engine will reduce the flight duration by half.

However, it is too early for the Pentagon and NASA to plan the practical use of a promising rocket and space system. In the coming years, DARPA and a team of contracting organizations will focus on building the theoretical and technological base, as well as designing new products. If the DRACO program does not face serious problems, then the first test flight will be carried out in 2025 - and only by that time the real prospects of the project in its current form will be clear.
Author:
Photos used:
DARPA, NASA
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  1. Vladimir_2U
    Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 04: 29
    +4
    The first launch of a rocket and a ship of a new type is going to be carried out no later than 2025 ...
    .... It is assumed that the NRE with a high specific power and high efficiency will give the ship the required characteristics.

    FOR FOUR years ?! Yes, nonsense!
    1. bayard
      bayard April 16 2021 09: 29
      +4
      This is the reanimation of the developments of the 60s. They were abandoned at one time due to the danger of use and accidents during launching into a reference orbit. But apparently they were hot - they are in a hurry to the moon.
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 10: 20
        -6
        Quote: bayard
        This is a reanimation of developments from the 60s
        And what, the reanimation of ancient developments in four years will allow both the engine and the ship to create? Something noticeably more recent Saturn-5 was not mastered, but here it is.
        1. Proctologist
          Proctologist April 16 2021 11: 25
          -2
          Well, now the speed of development of space technologies has increased significantly - private traders have set a new pace. They can do it with the traditional right to "shift deadlines" - that is, we write 4, we count 6.
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 April 16 2021 15: 15
          +3
          Something noticeably fresher Saturn-5 was not mastered Overpowered - the first stage is sent for assembly at KSC
          and the ship for the moon is ready
          the planned launch should take place at the end of this year or at the beginning of the next - at the first stage, an unmanned flyby of the moon
          1. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 16: 08
            -2
            Quote: Vadim237
            Have mastered - the first stage is sent for assembly to KSC

            Quote: Vadim237
            the planned launch should take place at the end of this year or at the beginning of the next - at the first stage, an unmanned flyby of the moon
            Is this all the development of the Apollo program?
            1. Vadim237
              Vadim237 April 16 2021 21: 28
              +2
              The Apollo program began and ended at the turn of the early 60s and early 70s - and this program of Artemis can be said to be a continuation of Apollo.
        3. bayard
          bayard April 16 2021 16: 30
          +1
          They make ships separately, they already fly and have even tried them with a crew. We are talking specifically about a nuclear engine, which is conceptually simple, but technically dangerous. And if they already grabbed for such, it means that they have something hot.
          And similar engines were tested (on the ground) both with them and with us in the 60s.
          And they refused.
          Due to the danger of radiation contamination. After all, this is practically an open (!) Nuclear reactor.
          What is easier to place the fuel rod into a conventional "combustion chamber" \ expansion chamber, and inject hydrogen into the fuel rod there, with an outflow through the nozzle. The temperature and speed of the outflow can be obtained 2 - 3 times higher than that of a chemical engine ... But the launch vehicle accident happened during the launch of this into orbit and ...? And the spacecraft piloted as such to dock, if it oozes with radiation ... it is, after all, open ...
          That's what they thought and refused.
          From an open-type reactor engine.
          And they began to trick ... how to make a compact closed-type reactor with the generation of electricity, but let the propulsion device be ... ionic ... plasma ... whatever.
          Here is "Nuclon" for example.
          ... And NASA suddenly decided to return to the very first open-type model? ...
          So they are in a hurry somewhere.
          ... and there is no such Greta Tumberg ...
          1. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 16: 40
            0
            Quote: bayard
            And NASA suddenly decided to return to the very first open-type model? ...
            So they are in a hurry somewhere
            Here, within the framework of paranoia, I had the idea that by looking at the withdrawal of this bandura, the US-sheep will try to "close the sky" or do some other nasty thing.
    2. astepanov
      astepanov April 16 2021 10: 07
      +4
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      FOR FOUR years ?! Yes, nonsense!
      Considering many years of backlog and ground tests, this is not nonsense at all. In addition, they are not inclined to steal so intensively and promise recklessly, even without intending to fulfill.
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 10: 18
        -2
        Quote: astepanov
        Considering many years of backlog and ground tests, this is not delusional

        How so, why did the long-term backlog not allow to recreate the beautiful engines of Saturn-5?
        1. Oleg83
          Oleg83 April 16 2021 12: 13
          +1
          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          Quote: astepanov
          Considering many years of backlog and ground tests, this is not delusional

          How so, why did the long-term backlog not allow to recreate the beautiful engines of Saturn-5?

          For the same reason that the production in the Russian Federation of the excellent Moskvich-412 car is not being recreated
          1. Intruder
            Intruder April 16 2021 14: 55
            +1
            For the same reason that the production in the Russian Federation of the excellent Moskvich-412 car is not being recreated
            and no less beautiful: VAZ 2101/06 repeat
          2. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 16: 19
            -2
            Then why did the excellent Titan launch vehicles develop and launch from 1966 to 2005? On the progressive and terribly ecological dimethylhydrazine and more.
          3. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 16: 20
            0
            Quote: oleg83
            For the same reason that the production in the Russian Federation of the excellent Moskvich-412 car is not being recreated

            Then why did the excellent Titan launch vehicles develop and launch from 1966 to 2005? On the progressive and terribly ecological dimethylhydrazine and more.
      2. gridasov
        gridasov April 16 2021 11: 18
        -1
        Sorry, but no damage! Fly efficiently and the way things are done now are completely unrelated techniques. It is like in mathematics the addition of particular solutions by computational methods and the construction of algorithmically linked mathematical data on functions of a constant value of a number. One should strive to understand that the more the processes of variables in their meaning, the more accurate and definite these values ​​should be. And these mathematical foundations of the analysis of large data are fundamentally different from methods on functions of a variable value of a number
    3. Vadim237
      Vadim237 April 16 2021 15: 06
      0
      Work on NRM in the United States has never stopped.
      1. Disant
        Disant April 16 2021 20: 10
        0
        as I understand it - since 2005, the Americans have not done anything per yard
  2. Wedmak
    Wedmak April 16 2021 05: 54
    +1
    Welcome to the new space race. our Nuclon is also under development and even assemblies of individual components.
    Perhaps the list of future responsibilities of the new ship with NRE has not yet been determined, and tasks for it will be sought at the next stages of the program.

    But at least we have decided on the tasks:
    Among the tasks performed in the orbit of the moon:

    surface mapping with determination of slopes and height of irregularities;
    top cover mapping up to several kilometers deep;
    identification of areas with subsurface voids, assessment of their size, volume and depth of occurrence;
    exploration of mineral resources of the Moon, including its cryolithospheric resources;
    determination of the electrophysical properties of the soil, identification of areas with anomalous conductivity, heat capacity, density in order to ensure communication on the lunar surface, selection of optimal landing sites and placement of stationary stations.

    The flight from the near-earth orbit of the assembly of the complex to the orbit of an artificial satellite of the Moon will take no more than 200 days

    Do not look at the long duration of the flight, the total mass of the system will be no more than 55 tons, and the engines will be ion engines. Total payload up to 10 tons. Let's see what DARPA will give birth to.
    1. Blackmokona
      Blackmokona April 16 2021 07: 41
      +5
      Nuclon is now at the stage of an advance project, that is, thinking about whether he is needed.

      Last year, Roskosmos signed a contract worth 4,2 billion rubles for the development of preliminary project tug - the work is scheduled to be completed by July 2024.
      https://www.aex.ru/m/news/2021/4/15/226947/

      A preliminary project is a set of works that perform before carrying out development work for the purpose of a feasibility study of the feasibility of product development and ways of its creation, production and operation
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak April 16 2021 11: 32
        0
        Such a good preliminary project ... that even a full-size prototype was made.




        1. Pontiffsulyvahn
          Pontiffsulyvahn April 17 2021 18: 23
          0
          This is not a prototype, this is a mock-up.
          1. Disant
            Disant April 17 2021 19: 36
            0
            layout design remained in the 70s-80s of the last century
    2. Cosm22
      Cosm22 April 16 2021 12: 18
      -1
      Please state the alphanumeric index of these ion engines.
      I'm curious to see him.
      1. Wedmak
        Wedmak April 16 2021 12: 25
        -2
        Contact the developers, I get information from open sources.
        1. Cosm22
          Cosm22 April 16 2021 12: 58
          -1
          So do I.
          And so I know that there is complete uncertainty about Nuclon's ion engines.
          In this regard, the question arises: how can you call a product model a prototype for which a remote control has not even been selected yet?
          Or are the published pictures akin to mock-ups of plywood-plastic Eagles-Federations, designed only to indicate the dimensions of the designed products?
          1. Wedmak
            Wedmak April 16 2021 13: 24
            0
            Nevertheless, this is no longer an advance project, this is real work to be embodied in hardware. Perhaps they are akin, it's a pity that all our space projects are so creeping with smoke breaks.
            1. Cosm22
              Cosm22 April 16 2021 14: 27
              0
              Real work on implementation in hardware implies, first of all, the adaptation of the spacecraft architecture to a specific control system. Under its dimensions, weight, under the number of engines in the end. For it is one thing if the ID-500 engine is used in Nuclon, and a couple of dozen SPD-230 is another.
              So pretty pictures don't impress me.
              1. Disant
                Disant April 16 2021 21: 26
                +1
                For it is one thing if the ID-500 engine is used in Nuclon, another - a couple of dozen SPD-230
                So pretty pictures don't impress me.

                so the Nuclon scheme itself is working for any engines. The main thing is not the characteristics of the engines and the speed of movement, but the fact that the ship itself will be able to create in orbit thanks to its power plant
          2. Svetlana
            Svetlana April 17 2021 00: 05
            +2
            Quote: Cosm22
            There is complete uncertainty about Nuclon's ion thrusters.

            At speeds of the working fluid outflow from the RD nozzle 7..10 km / s, the stagnation temperature goes off scale, exceeding the melting temperature of all known metals. Therefore, it is necessary to look for ways to reduce the thermal load on the walls of the heat exchanger and the nozzle of a nuclear jet engine YARD. One of the options for solving the problem was proposed in Novosibirsk:
            The plasma under a pressure of about 100 atmospheres will be held by a metal wall of the nozzle apparatus of the installation of a heat exchanger for a jet engine (RD).
            The role of the magnetic field is reduced to a decrease in heat transfer from the plasma to the wall due to magnetic thermal insulation. In open magnetic gas-dynamic traps of the GOL-3 type (Novosibirsk), the plasma pressure is approximately equal to the magnetic field pressure. But in the taxiway for a flight to the Moon, thermonuclear temperatures and an outflow velocity of 1000 km / s are not yet needed. To create a decent thrust, the velocity of the outflow from the nozzle ~ 100 km / s is sufficient. Accordingly, the densities of the working fluid flowing out of the nozzle will be (at the same plasma pressure in an open trap of about 100 atm) 10 times higher than, for example, in the TriAlfaEnergy installation.
            Receiving electrical energy for the power supply of the microwave plasmatron - by the same closed-cycle turbomachine unit with radiation cooling, generally speaking, another working medium, which differs from the working medium of the microwave plasmatron of an open magnetic gas-dynamic trap.
            Heating high-pressure plasma - as in an open gas-dynamic magnetic trap GOL-3 in Novosibirsk, or as in a Chinese RD using electromagnetic microwaves.
            Those. A promising NRE should combine a high density of the outflowing plasma, as in the Nuclear Thermal Propulsion (NTP) thermal NRE, with heating the plasma by microwaves, as in the Nuclon NRE project.
            1. Svetlana
              Svetlana April 17 2021 09: 32
              +2
              Taking into account the fact that a mission to the moon can only have a one-way ticket, it is possible to create a jet thrust with the same working fluid - a coolant, which is also used in an onboard nuclear power plant (NPP) with a gas coolant to remove heat from fuel rods. In this case, part of the gaseous coolant, after passing through radioactive fuel elements, is directed into a magnetically insulated chamber for further microwave heating with microwaves and then into an exhaust magnetically insulated nozzle to create jet thrust. The rest of the gas coolant (not directed into the microwave heating chamber after passing through radioactive fuel rods) is sent to the gas turbine of the onboard turbomachine nuclear power plant (or to the onboard MHD generator) and then to the radiation heat exchanger-cooler for partial closure of the thermodynamic cycle of the onboard nuclear power plant. However, the MGDG exhaust can also be directed to the nozzle. Magnetic thermal insulation is needed to prevent the solid-state walls of the microwave heating chamber and the magnetic nozzle from melting by the heat flux from the plasma.
            2. Disant
              Disant April 17 2021 20: 15
              +1
              with plasma heating by microwaves, as in the Nuclon YRD project.

              the YARD-Nuclon project has not been rolled out yet. if there is - give a link. After all, you have to do a completely different architecture. In my opinion, this is a much more complicated project, and there are no engines.
              on engine operation with GOL - is there anything for dummies?
              1. Svetlana
                Svetlana April 18 2021 19: 06
                +2
                Quote: Disant
                on engine operation with GOL

                Physicists from Novosibirsk have confirmed the possibility of creating a plasma jet engine. Water can be used as a working substance in the engine. The RESIN (Spiral Magnetic Open Trap) installation is based on a completely new principle - the plasma in the so-called magnetic trap is held by a rotating magnetic field twisted into an Archimedes spiral, like in a meat grinder.
                https://www.interfax-russia.ru/siberia/news/novosibirskie-fiziki-usovershenstvovali-ustanovku-osnovu-plazmennogo-reaktivnogo-dvigatelya
                The GDT gas-dynamic trap and the GOL-3T, GOL-NB and VETA installations, assembled on the basis of the GOL-3 corrugated trap, are currently operating at the INP SB RAS.
                To reduce losses, magnetic plugs are installed, i.e. sharply increase the strength of the magnetic field at the ends of the device. In the gas-dynamic trap of the GDT, in this way it is possible to very much narrow the “necks” of the bottle from which the plasma flows out, but losses cannot be completely avoided. In the GOL corrugated trap, on each side there is not one magnetic plug, as in the GDT, but several, depending on the configuration (for example, in the already disassembled GOL-3 there were about 50 plugs, and in the GOL-NB - 14 at each end), due to which the plasma does not just flow through a smooth pipe, but, as it were, rubs against the corrugation of the magnetic field. Due to the frictional force, the flow rate is lower than the supersonic one, which means that there will be less losses.
                See https://rscf.ru/news/media/v_iyaf_so_ran_gotovyat_konfetku_smola/
                The TriAlfaEnergy setup contains an open magnetic trap, in the center of which a thermoelectric power is generated by microwave and / or neutral beams tangentially directed into the plasma. Due to the thermopower (arising from the uneven heating of the plasma along the damped beam due to absorption in the plasma), a tangential electric current is created, directed in the opposite direction to the electric current in the magnetic solenoids surrounding the open magnetic trap. Due to the opposite direction of the tangential electric current induced in the plasma by tangential beams, a toroidal-poloidal configuration of the spheromak magnetic field is formed in the plasma. This spherical magnetic field configuration is particularly effective in confining high-density
                high temperature plasma. A side effect of spheromak confinement are jets of colder, but denser plasma that can flow from the poles of the spheromak in both directions along the Z axis of the magnetic trap (along and against the direction of the Z axis). One of these jets is capable of creating jet thrust. The second jet (in the opposite direction) is decelerated by a multi-mirror or rotating helical configuration of the magnetic field. By the way, the sources of neutral beams in TriAlfa were made in Novosibirsk.
                1. Disant
                  Disant April 19 2021 11: 09
                  +1
                  https://rscf.ru/news/media/v_iyaf_so_ran_gotovyat_konfetku_smola/
                  The TriAlfaEnergy installation contains an open magnetic trap,

                  normal link.
                  but they themselves also write that it is not soon. Two or three generations of traps +, that is, 50 years to wait for an "ordinary reactor", and with a trap it means a long time.
                  And the plasma, judging by the link, gives out 100 km / s, and the electroreactive ones collected in the iron ID-500 gives out already 70km / s. But they can and add.
                  most likely teasing partners.
                  or am I wrong about the speed orders?
                  1. Svetlana
                    Svetlana April 20 2021 13: 31
                    +1
                    Quote: Disant
                    plasma, judging by the link, gives out 100 km / s, and electroreactive ones, collected in the ID-500 iron, gives out already 70 km / s. But they can and add.

                    You are not mistaken about the speed orders. But we need to fly from near-earth orbit to the Moon as quickly as possible. Using the Wyvernjet thermonuclear jet engine (TNRE) (https://tnenergy.livejournal.com/7428.html) based on an open magnetic trap (see http://go2starss.narod.ru/pub/E028_WJ.html) we calculate the main parameters ship and the time of delivery of the cargo to the moon.
                    In the calculations, we will take the Wyvernjet parameters: dry mass of TYARD 60 tons. The mass of the working medium is 40..60 tons (hydrogen or butyllithium C4H9Li is a compound of lithium with butane). Water can also be a working medium, but it emits more in the discrete spectrum.
                    Let us take the minimum temperature of the outflowing working fluid as 17,5 eV (where 13 eV is the ionization energy, and 4,5 eV is the thermal dissociation energy of the 2H molecule). The specific impulse of such a working fluid will be 91 m / sec or 850 sec.
                    1,86 keV plasma flowing out through a magnetic nozzle of 65 grams per second can heat up to a temperature of 17,5 eV about 7 kilograms of hydrogen, which will give a thrust of 633 kN (or 64 kilograms * s). Operating time of the TYARD 500 sec. The speed of the ship at the end of the operation of the TYARD is 3000 km / s. Fuel consumption during the operation of the TYRD 15 t. The distance from the Earth at the end of the operation of the TYRP is 21 km. Flight time to the moon is 22000 hours.
                    For comparison: A nucleon with ion jet engines will reach the Moon in 200 days. Conclusion: ID-500 is not suitable for solving urgent tasks on the Moon and geostationary orbit during a threatened period.
                    1. Disant
                      Disant April 21 2021 00: 13
                      0
                      But we need to fly from near-earth orbit to the Moon as quickly as possible.

                      Flight time to the moon is 10 hours.
                      For comparison: A nucleon with ion jet engines will reach the Moon in 200 days. Conclusion: ID-500 is not suitable for solving urgent tasks on the Moon and geostationary orbit during a threatened period.

                      In a threatened period, we will need to prepare to remove from orbit satellites, control satellites of constellations of satellites and low-orbit satellites of the enemy, and not gallop on the Moon.
                      Explain the meaning of rushing to the Moon in such a hurry during the threatened period? there is nothing there and in the next 10 years there will be no - today's American lunar program is zilch. unless, of course, they have conceived instead of lunar and supra-lunar bases to stuff military satellites there. But by that time Nuclon will be in time and disperse the whole gang.
                      .
                      in general, even so I will ask - why bother with a YAR engine in space? it is simply more efficient than "conventional" chemical-fueled rockets. And that's all. Further only problems. Moreover, the farther from the Earth you need to fly away, the more EJEs catch up with it in time and at a certain point in flight time they will overtake it. And that's just talking about time.
                      1. Svetlana
                        Svetlana April 23 2021 15: 34
                        0
                        Quote: Disant
                        In a threatened period, we will need to prepare to remove from orbit satellites, control satellites of constellations of satellites and low-orbit satellites of the enemy

                        You're right. In a threatened period, we will need to prepare to remove enemy satellites from orbits. One of the options is to remove satellites with lunar pebbles lifted from its surface by an explosion. For a fast flight to the moon, you can use a pulsed thermonuclear engine. The heart of a pulsed fusion engine is a simple 6 Tesla double-mirror magnetic trap. Fusion targets are periodically detonated inside the trap.
                        The thermonuclear target is a cylinder-liner made of beryllium (Be) or aluminum (AL), 10 cm long, 10 cm in diameter, 1,5 mm thick. The target is placed in the center of a spherical explosive chamber with a radius of 6 m in an axial magnetic field of 6..10 Tesla with the configuration of a simple two-mirror magnetic trap created by external coils located outside the explosive chamber.
                        On the outer surface of the Be-cylinder - 300 grams of explosive (BB) is applied. On the inner surface of the Be-cylinder, a layer of DT fuel is deposited in the form of a LiD + LiT compound.
                        Plasma inside the Be - cylinder is created and preheated to 100..300 electron volts by microwave beams of pulsed gyrotrons with a wavelength of 1,47 mm. The total energy in the beams of gyrotrons is 23 KJ. The duration of the gyrotron radiation is 10 μs. Number of beams 40 pcs.
                        Microwave beams of a conical shape are formed by pulsed gyrotrons and then focused on a target in the form of cones tapering to the target using diffractive Fresnel lenses or parabolic mirrors with a diameter of 50 cm.
                        The pulse power of each microwave beam is 51 MW. Microwave beams are directed into the explosion chamber through the windows in its walls. The radius of the aperture window (i.e., the inner radius of the barrel for introducing the microwave beam into the explosion-magnetic chamber with the liner) is 20 cm.
                        Next, microwave beams are directed into the liner along a non-intersecting family of generators of a single-cavity hyperboloid at an angle of 45 degrees to the vertical axis of the liner inside the Be-cylinder through the upper end of the liner onto the inner surface of the liner walls with DT fuel deposited on it.
                        A one-sheet hyperboloid of revolution, along the generatrix of which microwave beams are directed, has a vertical axis that coincides with the vertical axis of the liner.
                        The diameter of the throat of a single-cavity hyperboloid of revolution is chosen equal to 5,14 cm and the plane of the throat section passing through the center point of the former grain DT of fuel is placed on the liner axis. In total, a one-sheet hyperboloid has two disjoint families of generators.
                        Microwave beams direct one family at a time, namely, one family that gives an azimuthal electric current due to the thermopower in the plasma of a grain, opposite to the electric current in the ring solenoids of a simple mirror magnetic trap with a magnetic field of 6 Tesla, surrounding the explosive chamber.
                        In another embodiment, a grain of the LiD + LiT compound is placed in the center of the liner on its axis. Then this grain is evaporated and ionized with a laser beam.
                        When the plasma from the grain expands to the inner radius of the liner, the microwave beams are turned on.
                        The duration of the action of microwave beams is 10 μs. Due to the thermoelectric power during absorption in a plasma with a concentration of 10 ^ 17 cm-3 by microwave beams in the plasma inside the liner, a configuration of a spheromak magnetic field frozen into the plasma is created. Then this plasma with the magnetic field of the spheromak frozen in it begins to be compressed by radial implosion by initiating an explosive charge on the outer surface of the liner.
                        Explosives are initiated from the outer surface by focused low-power pulsed laser beams, as in an explosive magnetic generator.
                        Adiabatic compression of plasma is carried out with a frozen-in magnetic field of a spheromak inside a Be-cylinder. In 10 μs, the plasma will be compressed from a diameter of 10 cm to a diameter of 1 cm.
                        Upon reaching a diameter of 2,33 cm (when the compressed plasma becomes opaque to the laser wavelength), a pulsed CO2 laser with a duration of 10 nsec and a beam energy of 10 kJ is switched on at the magnetized plasmoid compressed by the implosion of the explosive.
                        This laser beam is directed along the liner axis to the compressed plasma. They initiate the onset of thermonuclear combustion in compressed plasma with the compressed magnetic field of the spheromak frozen into it, too. Thermonuclear power release
                        will be 10 ^ 7 J. The liner explosions are carried out periodically with a frequency of 1 time per second. The explosion products of the liner with a target with a total mass of 330 grams fly away through the magnetic nozzle at a speed of 8270 m / s, creating a thrust of 2,66E + 03H
                        With a spacecraft mass of 100 Tn with the above-described pulsed thermonuclear installation on board and a stock of target-liners with a total mass of 28 Tn in 24 hours, you can gain a second space speed and go to the Moon.
                      2. Disant
                        Disant April 23 2021 20: 33
                        0
                        mortar on the contrary - I hear about such details and figures for the first time. Here you have to draw. Apparently there is a link. Please share))
                        .
                        In another embodiment, a grain of the LiD + LiT compound is placed in the center of the liner on its axis.

                        I heard about this, about the first - I did not hear and did not understand. I have to draw.
                        We talked about polymer fuel, LiD + LiT - apparently this is what it is.
                        .
                        Pulse power of each microwave beam 51 MW
                        -search apparently.
                        1MW = 1000kW = 1 W = 000 mW.

                        .
                        in short - no drawings - nothing is clear, but very interesting.
                        in any case, this is something far away yet.
                        .
                        .p.with. and if the target consumption is 28 tons in 24 hours, and the exhaust is the second space velocity, then this is a dead end
                      3. Svetlana
                        Svetlana April 25 2021 17: 27
                        0
                        Quote: Disant
                        Apparently there is a link.

                        Вот ссылка : https://zen.yandex.ru/media/iap_zts/kto-bystree-fatima-ibrahimi-razrabotala-termoiadernyi-kosmicheskii-dvigatel-sposobnyi-ubit-nuklon-v-zarodyshe-601e86a85fadcc22a9c2eab5
                        The link contains drawings explaining the principle of operation of a pulsed thermonuclear engine, based on the periodic ejection through a magnetic nozzle of magnetized plasmoids-spheromaks. There is no description in the pulsed power of gyrotrons. The wavelength of the gyrotrons 1,47E-01cm is chosen such that the frequency of the microwave radiation of the gyrotrons is less than the electron cyclotron frequency in the magnetic field of the external solenoids of the magnetic trap. Unusual microwave waves can penetrate into a magnetized plasmoid-spheromak at a frequency less than the plasma and less than the electron cyclotron frequency, reaching the regions of electron-cyclotron resonance when penetrating into the plasma from the side of a stronger magnetic field on the axis of the plasmoid-spheromak, moving towards weaker toroidal poloidal magnetic magnetic fields located inside the plasmoid around its axis. Reaching the region of electron-cyclotron resonance, microwave beams are absorbed by the plasmoid, transferring their energy to it and generating a toroidal-poloidal electric current in the plasmoid due to the thermopower. The total energy of 40 pieces of microwave beams is 23 kilojoules, the duration of their action is 10 ^ (- 5) seconds (10 μs). The total power of 40 pieces of microwave beams is 2011 Megawatts, the power in one beam is 2011/40 = 50,2 MW.
                        Target consumption is proportional to the cube of their sizes; therefore, by optimizing the target size, the required thrust force can also be optimized.
                      4. Disant
                        Disant April 25 2021 18: 36
                        0
                        you will excuse me of course - but this is some kind of shamanism.
                        Plasma spitting tokamak motor.
                        There are no ordinary workers tokamaks yet, and how long the work will last even on new installations that are still under construction - no one knows, but they know for sure that later it will be necessary to build even newer ones - also for experiments. This has been two cycles for at least fifty years.
                        the tokamak again needs to be powered with electricity (probably from naked space) and as I understand it -))) in addition to something to shoot at a target with two thousand MW - this is the power of several nuclear power plants.
                        according to your link, it is not that approximately nothing is explained - but there they write about the same one or several hundred kilometers per second of speed that ordinary ionic devices give.
                        .
                        Even if we discard the nonsense about microwave and megawatts of energy for firing, in any case there is Tsiolkovsky's formula, and there are only three parameters that can affect the speed of the ship - the speed and mass of the thrown fuel and the mass of the ship.
                        .
                        I hope that I did not understand you and that you were not misled.
                        the link is very bad
                      5. Svetlana
                        Svetlana April 25 2021 19: 48
                        0
                        Quote: Disant
                        the link is very bad

                        The following links will help you understand the principle of operation of a pulsed thermonuclear engine:
                        https://www.studmed.ru/vedenov-aa-zadachnik-po-fizike-plazmy_7789d363b0a.html
                        https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-plasma-physics/article/an-alfvenic-reconnecting-plasmoid-thruster/F296E45CC504E8FF2586EA79117E2514
                        Hope you enjoy them this time. There is even Tsiolkovsky's formula Δv = ve * ln (m0 / m1)
                      6. Disant
                        Disant April 25 2021 21: 05
                        0
                        these are very hard links - Problem book on plasma physics.))) 1981.
                        It's just that for a wide range of readers there are simpler explanations, and that link to Dr. Fatima Ibrahimi with explanatory drawings is simply awful, especially since there are no explanations, but there is the obtained speed of the spitting out plasma without bringing the assumed masses.
                        Second, the new engine creates thrust by ejecting plasma particles and magnetic "bubbles" known as plasmoids.

                        the same principle of operation of a chemical engine having the exhaust velocities of existing ion engines in iron.
                        Is it supposed to push off from magnetic bubbles, sorting out the gravitational strings of the universe? - no, she writes that bubbles only help to throw out plasma
                      7. Disant
                        Disant April 25 2021 21: 27
                        0
                        Hope you enjoy them this time. There is even Tsiolkovsky's formula Δv = ve * ln (m0 / m1)

                        in the same place, in the second link -
                        thrust is ideally independent of ion mass
                    2. Svetlana
                      Svetlana April 25 2021 20: 31
                      0
                      Quote: Disant
                      nonsense about microwave and megawatts of energy for shooting,

                      About the nonsense about the microwave - see links:
                      https://radiophysics.unn.ru/sites/default/files/papers/2011_8-9_559.pdf
                      https://scientificrussia.ru/articles/multimegavattnyj-millimetrovyj-girotron
                      In the developed gyrotron, in contrast to the previously realized long-wavelength devices, a built-in quasi-optical converter of the operating mode radiation into a Gaussian wave beam with a transformation efficiency of more than 95% was used. The maximum output pulse power observed in the experiment was 5,6 MW at a frequency of 94,4 GHz. with an efficiency of about 20%.
                      Quote: Disant
                      must be powered by electricity (probably from bare space)
                      Electricity will be supplied using the direct conversion of the energy of the expanding plasmoid into the electric energy of the magnetic field of external solenoids, similar to a gasoline internal combustion engine, in which instead of gasoline combustion products there is a plasmoid after the completion of a thermonuclear reaction in it, as a piston - the magnetic field of external solenoids of an open magnetic trap , and as a connecting rod with a crankshaft - an inverter current converter in the coil circuit of the external solenoid.
                  2. Svetlana
                    Svetlana April 29 2021 20: 48
                    0
                    According to a revised calculation, the total energy of 40 pieces of microwave beams is 8,5 kilojoules, their duration is 97 microseconds. The total power of 40 pieces of microwave beams is 87,55 Megawatts, the power in one beam is 2,19 MW.
                    Before / After the compression of the plasmoid with an explosive charge
                    1,25E + 017 / 1,25E + 020 n cm-3 concentration of ions in the plasmoid
                    1,160E + 06 / 1,160E + 08 TK plasma temperature in the plasmoid
                    5,24E + 002 / 5,24E-001 V cm3 plasmoid volume
                    3,143E + 03 / 1,048E + 05 U j thermal energy in the plasmoid
                    5,00E + 000 / 5,00E-001 plasmoid radius, cm
                    3,88E + 004 / 3,88E + 006 magnetic field frozen in the plasmoid, G
                    9,70E-005 duration of gyrotron beams, sec
                    40 number of beams of gyrotrons, pcs
                    2,19 Power in each beam of gyrotrons, MW
                2. Svetlana
                  Svetlana 1 May 2021 23: 56
                  0
                  Quote: Disant
                  if the target consumption is 28 tons in 24 hours, and the exhaust is the second space velocity, then this is a dead end

                  Calculations for different sizes of a thermonuclear target show a strong dependence of the thermonuclear energy release on the target size.




                  So that the plasmoid does not fly away through the magnetic plug when oblique microwave beams are supplied only from the side of one magnetic plug, under the action of the jet thrust from the ablation of the DT tablet,
                  Microwave cone beams are directed along two families of non-intersecting generators of a one-sheet hyperboloid of revolution:
                  on the first family from the side of the upper magnetic plug, the direction of movement of electromagnetic waves in the waves from top to bottom;
                  along the second family, from the side of the lower magnetic plug, the direction of movement of electromagnetic waves in the rays is from bottom to top.
                  Each generator of the first family intersects with the generator of the second family. Generators of one family do not intersect.
                  There may be no magnetic plugs from external solenoids at all - because the plasma will be retained by a metal cylindrical glass made of Be or AL.
                  The equatorial plane of the DT pellet coincides with the equatorial plane of the metal cylinder surrounding the DT pellet.
                  The outer surface of the metal cylinder (surrounding the DT pellet) is coated with a layer of explosives.
                  The thickness of the explosive layer (BB) near the ends of the metal cylinder is increased in comparison with the thickness of the explosive layer in the equatorial plane of the metal cylinder on its outer surface.
                  The tips of the cones of CO2 beams are focused on the surface of a DT tablet with a diameter of 1..2 cm.
                  The tips of the microwave cones are focused on the throat of a single-sheet hyperboloid with a diameter of 4..8 cm.
                  Cone beams of microwave gyrotrons and / or CO2 pulsed lasers (directed along 2 families of generators of a single-sheet hyperboloid of revolution) pass through the upper and lower ends of the metal cylinder

                  The azimuthal component of the gyrotron electromagnetic beams forms in the plasma around the DT grain two ring electric currents of the same direction, which create a configuration of the magnetic field of a simple two-mirror magnetic trap around the DT fuel pellet. These two ring electric currents of the same direction (forming the configuration of a simple two-mirror magnetic trap) are attracted to each other. The magnetic field of the ring electric currents compresses the DT tablet, but due to the skin microwave effect, the ring electric currents will be superficial over a thin layer of the tablet surface and will not go far into the tablet. The DT tablet under the action of laser beams focused on its surface will begin to evaporate from its surface. The evaporating gas is ionized by the beams of gyrotrons during the duration of the action of the gyrotrons of the order of 100 microseconds. During this time, the entire DT tablet may not have time to completely evaporate, but it will feed the formed magnetized plasmoid-spheromak with low-temperature plasma on the axial axis of the spheromak and stabilize instabilities at the boundary of the spheromak. The DT flux evaporating from the surface of the DT tablet by the beams of CO2 lasers - expands, reaches the microwave neck of a single-cavity hyperboloid with a diameter of 4 cm - the radius of the neck is 2 cm

                  The axial component of conical electromagnetic rays (directed along 2 families of generators of a one-sheet hyperboloid of revolution) forms
                  a radially directed magnetic field in the equatorial plane of a DT tablet. This radial magnetic field prevents the two annular regions from approaching.
                  with annular azimuthal currents in the plasma around the DT tablet that are equally directed and attracted to each other.
                  However, due to an increase in the thickness of the explosive at the ends of the metal cylinder after the explosion of the explosive, two annular regions with equally directed and attracted to each other annular azimuthal currents in the plasma around the DT tablet come together. Due to the explosion of the explosive, the plasmoid is compressed along the radius by a factor of 10. The bulk of the thermal energy in a compressed plasmoid is generated not by the energy of microwave beams or lasers, but by the energy of the explosive explosion during adiabatic compression of the plasmoid.
                3. Svetlana
                  Svetlana 8 May 2021 18: 32
                  0
                  There is another way to avoid the escape of the plasmoid through the magnetic plug when applying oblique microwave beams (directed along the family of non-intersecting generators of a single-sheet hyperboloid of revolution) only from the side of one magnetic plug of the two plugs of the magnetic bottle, created by external solenoids, under the action of the reactive thrust from the ablation of the DT tablet.
                  The DT tablet is placed in a cylindrical beaker, the end of which is closed with a solid lid that forms the bottom of the beaker. The inner surface of the solid bottom of the glass is covered with a layer of lithium deuteride.
                  The plasmoid will keep the bottom of the glass from flying away, and from the open end of the glass, the plasmoid will keep the jet thrust of the plasma flowing out through the open end of the glass from the ablation of the DT tablet from flying away inside the glass.
                  The equatorial plane of the DT pellet coincides with the equatorial plane of the metal cylinder surrounding the DT pellet.
                  The side walls of the cylindrical barrel are made of Li-Be alloy or AL.
                  A layer of explosives is applied to the outer surface of the cylindrical glass (surrounding the DT tablet).
                  The thickness of the explosive layer (BB) near the ends of the cylindrical glass is increased in comparison with the thickness of the explosive layer in the equatorial plane of the metal cylinder on its outer surface.
                  Beams of gyrotrons and / or lasers create a magnetized plasmoid inside the glass with a plasma pressure of several tens of atmospheres.
                  The magnetic field in a magnetized plasmoid is of the spherical type, has toroidal and poloidal components. The poloidal component of the magnetic field on the axis of the plasmoid is directed against the direction of the axial magnetic field created by the external solenoids of the magnetic bottle.
                  The tips of the cones of CO2 beams are focused on the surface of a DT tablet with a diameter of 1..2 cm.
                  The tips of the cones of microwave beams are focused on the throat of a single-sheet hyperboloid with a diameter of 4..8 cm.
                  Cone beams of microwave gyrotrons and / or CO2 pulsed lasers (directed along a family of non-intersecting generators of a single-sheet hyperboloid of revolution) pass through the open end of the cylindrical glass.
                  It will take about 100 microseconds to create a magnetized plasmoid inside a cylindrical glass. The plasma temperature in the plasmoid will reach 100 Ev, and the plasma pressure will be 40 atmospheres.
                  After creating a plasmoid by laser beams, an explosive is initiated on the outer surface of a cylindrical glass and adiabatically compress the plasmoid from a radius of 8 cm to a radius of 0.8 cm. An outbreak of thermonuclear combustion at the end of the compression of the plasmoid will lead to an energy release in TNT equivalent of 150 kg TNT.
  • Intruder
    Intruder April 16 2021 14: 59
    +2
    Do not look at the long duration of the flight, the total mass of the system will be no more than 55 tons, and the engines will be ion engines. Total payload up to 10 tons. Let's see what DARPA will give birth to.
    So they, they refused from ionizers just in this version and other electroreactive circuits, only a "thermosetting" engine heated from an onboard nuclear power plant, gaseous (molecular) hydrogen .., just like the British declare this year that they need a nuclear reactor for space projects !?
    The original of this news on the DARPA official website:
    The space domain is essential to modern commerce, scientific discovery, and national defense. Maintaining space domain awareness in cislunar space - the volume of space between the Earth and the Moon - will require a leap-ahead in propulsion technology.
    The goal of the Demonstration Rocket for Agile Cislunar Operations (DRACO) program is to demonstrate a nuclear thermal propulsion (NTP) system on orbit. NTP uses a nuclear reactor to heat propellant to extreme temperatures before expelling the hot propellant through a nozzle to produce thrust. Compared to conventional space propulsion technologies, NTP offers a high thrust-to-weight ratio around 10,000 times greater than electric propulsion and two-to-five times greater specific impulse (ie propellant efficiency) than chemical propulsion.
    The DRACO program anticipates two tracks. Track A will include the baseline design of a NTP reactor and culminate in a baseline design review. Track B will include development of an operational system concept to meet operational mission objectives and a demonstration system design that is traceable to the operational system but focuses on demonstrating the propulsion subsystem. Track B is anticipated to culminate in a technology maturation plan review for the demonstration system.
  • Disant
    Disant April 16 2021 21: 12
    0
    But at least we have decided on the tasks:

    yes, we have not only to decide on the tasks on Nuclon, we need to throw in these tasks as much as possible - there will be a nuclear reactor operating CONSTANTLY with good return on board)) - hung the ship into the orbit of the Moon, Mars, Jupiter and want this, but you want plow for a dozen years without interruption))
    but it is possible and that the military screw - constant 200-500 kW of power! On the heels of long-term combat lasers are enough.
    .
    The American project in its present form will only give an impulse for the acceleration and deceleration of the ship.
  • Per se.
    Per se. April 16 2021 07: 02
    -3
    NASA is also showing interest in systems with NRE - they can be useful for non-military space exploration. The DRACO-like system is expected to facilitate scientific missions such as flights to the Moon or Mars. In the latter case, according to calculations, a nuclear engine will reduce the flight duration by half.

    The guys from NASA easily flew to the moon more than 50 years ago, as they say, everything from the first approach. Until now, a rocket has not been created even close to repeating the declared carrying capacity and accident-free operation, as in the Saturn 5 that suddenly appeared half a century ago, the same can be said about the F-1 engines.
    Now they have been rolling around Mars for many years without any accidents, having not yet created a single lunar rover.
    If the topic of creating a nuclear engine for a flight to Mars is also understood as a manned flight, the guys need to understand that in addition to reducing the flight time, the issue of crew safety in outer space, without protecting the ozone layer of the Earth, behind the radiation belts of our planet, remains unresolved.
    It is appropriate here to recall the words of our President Vladimir Putin, in an interview with Sergei Govorukhin (2017.04.03).

    Sergei Govorukhin: Who will be the first to fly to Mars?
    Vladimir Putin: A car. Why? Because everyone is planning flights to Mars, but few people know that in today's conditions and in today's spaceships, a living cell is unlikely to fly. It's just that a living cell in such a hard space, in the far, is not protected by a spaceship. Probably, everything is changing and, probably, such opportunities will appear, but there are still problems. Therefore, for now, probably, research will still be carried out using technology.
    1. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 07: 18
      -9
      Quote: Per se.
      in today's spaceships, a living cell is unlikely to reach

      Alive is unlikely, but completely deceitful! The Apollo won't lie!
    2. Blackmokona
      Blackmokona April 16 2021 07: 46
      +11
      Well, look how much NASA paid then and how much it is now.
      The only question is price.
      1. Per se.
        Per se. April 16 2021 09: 56
        -4
        Quote: BlackMokona
        Well, look how much NASA paid then and how much it is now.
        Are you saying that now NASA has no money for Saturn 5 and the F-1 engine, and sending Mars rovers is cheaper than a lunar rover?
        In general, I understand that a gift from Nixon, "Lincoln Continental" to dear Leonid Ilyich, in the prices of those years cost $ 10, and already in 000 prices it would have cost about $ 2018, but it's not just the price.

        Interestingly quite different, I repeat.
        The unsurpassed and still rocket Saturn-5. Was, but somewhere gone ...

        The unsurpassed F-1 engines to this day. There were, but they went somewhere ...

        The lunar modules, on which they immediately landed and took off from the Moon, without having preliminary operating time, without making more than one such launch from the Moon. There were, but they went somewhere ...

        Drawings, project documentation, design characteristics. There were, but they went somewhere ...

        Photo and film originals. There were, but they went somewhere ...

        Kilograms of allegedly imported lunar soil. There were, but they went somewhere ...

        Unsurpassed technology of entry into the Earth's atmosphere at 2 space speed according to the "one-hole scheme", without injuring the "astralonauts" from overloads and critical state of the descent vehicle. Was, but somewhere gone ...

        Unique protection against radiation, which has not yet been presented for manned flights beyond the Earth's radiation belts. Was, but somewhere gone ...

        The spacesuit ... Space radiation, on the moon the temperature difference is from -173 degrees Celsius to +127. The technologies must be unique, they would be very useful on the Earth itself, for example, during the accident at the Three Mile Island nuclear power plant in Pennsylvania. But here, too, they were, but they went somewhere ...

        Believe it or not NASA (there are no other sources directly confirming the conquest of the Moon by the Americans), everyone's personal business.

        Unchanged, only the image of the most advanced capitalist country does not disappear anywhere, for the sake of which you can go to any costs, in general, to anything. Here, this is the main thing.
        1. SovAr238A
          SovAr238A April 16 2021 10: 21
          +4
          Quote: Per se.


          Interestingly quite different, I repeat.
          The unsurpassed and still rocket Saturn-5. Was, but somewhere gone ...
          The unsurpassed F-1 engines to this day. There were, but they went somewhere ...
          The lunar modules, on which they immediately landed and took off from the Moon, without having preliminary operating time, without making more than one such launch from the Moon. There were, but they went somewhere ...
          Drawings, project documentation, design characteristics. There were, but they went somewhere ...


          If you are in any way connected with a real production process and know what technological maps are, then you must understand the impossibility of restoring old production.
          It's easier, faster, cheaper to re-create than to try to "revive" the old.

          There is a very popular (at the everyday level) description - why "reviving" the old is the worst thing that could be imagined - https://www.yaplakal.com/forum2/topic2025412.html
          1. Per se.
            Per se. April 16 2021 11: 08
            -2
            Quote: SovAr238A
            There is a very popular (at the everyday level) description - why "reviving" the old is the worst thing that could be imagined
            So, don't revive, make something new, make it better. However, NASA is still unable to develop a heavy rocket with a payload of 70 tons, let alone repeat the capabilities of Saturn V.

            Arguing with the "experts" from NASA, who, as they can, turn themselves out in excuses and demagoguery, from the inevitable creative blunders of half a century ago, is a hopeless business, as well as to convince the sect of "lunar witnesses".
            In short, Brezhnev's deal on the Moon, where we were "anointed" to the topic, at the expense of American concessions (Soyuz-Apollo), ultimately gave rise to a fetish of the West, led to the collapse of the Soviet Union. But, it is impossible to lie endlessly, the fake achievements laid down "for growth" turned out to be impossible to repeat after 50 years.
            It may very well be that for another 50 years no one will be able to really fly to the moon like in the American show. The consequences of national disgrace for the United States will be no less catastrophic than the collapse of the USSR, after our temporary benefit from American gifts, concessions and political dividends in detente.

            Time will put everything in its place, without, - "I am Erema, you are Thomas. I am those words, you are two to me."
            All the best.
            1. Oleg83
              Oleg83 April 16 2021 12: 14
              +4
              Quote: Per se.
              Quote: SovAr238A
              There is a very popular (at the everyday level) description - why "reviving" the old is the worst thing that could be imagined
              So, do not revive, do something new, do better. However, NASA is still unable to develop a heavy rocket with a payload of 70 tons, let alone a repetition of the capabilities of the "Saturn-5"

              Have you heard of SLS?
              1. Per se.
                Per se. April 16 2021 12: 54
                0
                Quote: oleg83
                Have you heard of SLS?
                This was supposed to "open up completely new possibilities for science and human exploration of space beyond near-earth orbit, including flights of astronauts-researchers to various regions of the solar system to search for resources, create new technologies and get an answer to the question of our place in the Universe"?
                If "Ares V" was supposed to take 180 tons of payload (from "Ares" it had to be abandoned, it did not work), the new miracle was already limited to withdrawn cargoes from 95 to 130 tons, and, in the creation of SLS, there is too much policy to preserve the image of the States.
                The project is declared "the most powerful launch vehicle in the history of mankind, while its design will be easily adapted to various requirements regarding both manned flights and the launch of various payloads into space."
                It's great, but so far nothing really flies, all the more so magically accident-free as with "Saturn 5."
          2. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 11: 32
            0
            Quote: SovAr238A
            It's easier, faster, cheaper to re-create than to try to "revive" the old.

            Come on. Not everyone agrees.


            Quote: astepanov
            Considering many years of backlog and ground tests, this is not nonsense at all.

            Quote: bayard
            This is a reanimation of developments from the 60s



            "Flights to the moon" of the Americans did not give anything to astronautics! No launch vehicles, no ships! The question is, why is there such a jump from Saturn-5 to the Shuttle? Where is the evolutionary development? Nothing to develop was easy.
            1. SovAr238A
              SovAr238A April 16 2021 14: 41
              +3
              Quote: Vladimir_2U
              Quote: SovAr238A
              It's easier, faster, cheaper to re-create than to try to "revive" the old.

              Come on. Not everyone agrees.


              Quote: astepanov
              Considering many years of backlog and ground tests, this is not nonsense at all.

              Quote: bayard
              This is a reanimation of developments from the 60s



              "Flights to the moon" of the Americans did not give anything to astronautics! No launch vehicles, no ships! The question is, why is there such a jump from Saturn-5 to the Shuttle? Where is the evolutionary development? Nothing to develop was easy.

              What do we now, at the moment, after almost 40 years use from Energy and Buran?
              I will answer with your own words: "no missiles, no ships" ...
              What did they give our astronautics?
              1. Vadim237
                Vadim237 April 16 2021 15: 21
                -1
                RD 171MV ground tests passed this summer will be assembled by Soyuz 5 where it will be used in the first stage, and in general from Buran in the civilian sector of production, hundreds of developments are used.
              2. Intruder
                Intruder April 16 2021 15: 23
                +3
                What do we now, at the moment, after almost 40 years use from Energy and Buran?
                well, what about:
                1.
                The propulsion system of the LV "Energia" consists of four four-chamber oxygen-kerosene engines RD-170
                even sold to space race partners ...
                2.
                An important factor that influenced the successful implementation of the rocket unit A program was that in parallel with the work of NPO Energia on the creation of the Energia launch vehicle, the Yuzhnoye design bureau (Dnepropetrovsk, general designer V.F. Utkin) was developing the launch vehicle middle class "Zenith". The missile units of both LVs were supposed to be as unified as possible. The unification was envisaged in terms of the size of the fuel tanks, the construction materials used, the engine and most of the automation units. The advance timeframes for the Zenit LV made it possible to largely extend to Block A the results of ground and flight testing of Stage I of Zenit LV
                And now the upper stages are made according to the following scheme: The upper stage DM-SL is used in the Zenit-3SL rocket, the DM-SLB in the Zenit-3SLB rocket, and the Fregat-SB in the Zenit-3SLBF rocket. The upper stages of the DM series are designed and manufactured at RSC Energia, and Fregat at NPO Lavochkina.
                Flying product samples:
                1. "Zenit-3SLBF" modification of the missile "Zenit-2SLB" / "Zenit-3SLB", using the KGCH developed by NPO im. S. A. Lavochkina. It includes the Zenit-2SB launch vehicle and the Fregat-SB upper stage. The first launch (SC "Electro-L" No. 1) took place on January 20, 2011. The spacecraft was successfully launched into a near-geostationary orbit.
                2. Zenit-3SLB is a modification of the Zenit-3SL missile, modified for use at Baikonur. It includes the Zenit-2SB launch vehicle and the DM-SLB upper stage. The first launch (SC "Amos-3") took place on April 28, 2008. The spacecraft was successfully launched into a near-geostationary orbit.
              3. Vladimir_2U
                Vladimir_2U April 16 2021 16: 22
                -1
                Quote: SovAr238A
                What do we now, at the moment, after almost 40 years use from Energy and Buran?
                Wow, i.e. Is there no difference between the death of the Soviet Union and the not-so-lousy years in the United States? Not bad.
          3. Intruder
            Intruder April 16 2021 15: 14
            +3
            It's easier, faster, cheaper to re-create than to try to "revive" the old.
            Well, if we compare, the old F-1 with the new Raptor, then we have:
            for the F-1:
            Link:
            Vacuum / ur. sea: 790 tf / 690 tf. (7,77 / 6.77 MH)
            Specific impulse: 304/263 s.
            Working time: 165 sec.
            Combustion chamber pressure: 7 MPa.
            Expansion ratio: 16
            from Raptor:
            Link:
            2MN (loses here .. until recourse )
            Specific impulse: 375/330 s.
            Combustion chamber pressure: 33 MPa
            Expansion ratio: 200/40
            that's why they don't think to restore the technology for the F-1, while they fly on the RD-170 reserves, and then after they are exhausted they will decide .. what / what and how !? Most likely ... although it is possible, as always, to err in different directions ...
        2. Aleksandr97
          Aleksandr97 April 16 2021 13: 19
          0
          A qualified specialist, and workers who are able to manufacture a rocket engine of any design are truly Specialists with a capital letter! Further more! Design engineers, process engineers, salaries are not less, or even more! They will not all be paid a salary (decent) if there is no order here and now !! Equipment - documentation - machine tools - tooling all this is specialized! If on a milling machine (for example) it is possible to conditionally process a part for the automotive industry, then in any case, for space, the equipment for such machines will be specific - expensive and not applicable for anything else. The lunar program is over, the result of the capitalist approach: specialists are dismissed, equipment, if not sold - in metal, all technical and technological documentation (I consider it a crime) in waste paper! A private trader (and now we do the same) will not pay wages and save everything that does not bring income here and now !!!!
    3. astepanov
      astepanov April 16 2021 10: 11
      +3
      Quote: Per se.
      words of our President Vladimir Putin, in an interview with Sergei Govorukhin (2017.04.03).
      Sergei Govorukhin: Who will be the first to fly to Mars?
      Vladimir Putin: A car.

      ABOUT! Our president in 2017 did not know that rovers on Mars have been crawling for many years? Now it is clear why we have the best friend of the cosmonauts - the fake "Doctor of Technical Sciences" Rogozin.
    4. The comment was deleted.
  • gridasov
    gridasov April 16 2021 08: 34
    -1
    To begin with, it is necessary for everyone to stop lying and honestly determine the state of affairs and knowledge.
    1. Trapp1st
      Trapp1st April 16 2021 09: 14
      +3
      To begin with, it is necessary for everyone to stop lying and honestly determine the state of affairs and knowledge.
      In any discussion of affairs, during the said phrase "you just need to find a balance" meets with approval laughing hi
  • pytar
    pytar April 16 2021 09: 16
    0
    Gryphon Technologies offers a modern NRP design based on the well-known concept of a gaseous propellant engine. In such an engine hydrogen must enter the core, receive thermal energy and exit through the nozzle, creating thrust.

    Why not water? Hydrogen must be finished off, squeezed, cooled to supernatural temperatures, so that it becomes flowing! Then it must be stored in a reservoir with powerful thermal insulation! Difficult and expensive! It is true that when expanded, it will give more thrust than water vapor, but water can be stored much more easily without steaming complex systems!
    1. vadimtt
      vadimtt April 16 2021 09: 36
      0
      Why do you think the generators of power plants with hundreds of megawatts are cooled with hydrogen and not water, despite all the danger?
      That is why the most optimal working fluid for a nuclear heat engine is hydrogen.
      Moreover, in space it is easier to work (including storage) with hydrogen than with water.
      1. gridasov
        gridasov April 16 2021 10: 38
        0
        And I believe that mercury is the source of energy conversion of radioactive material. At the same time, I deliberately left the term nuclear energy. It is worth deciding that, first of all, it is necessary to construct mathematical models of algorithmically sequential stages of transformation of exclusively positive extremes of each stage. And only then can one understand why mercury and how to use its key property. By the way, not a waste potential.
      2. pytar
        pytar April 16 2021 11: 52
        0
        Why do you think the generators of power plants with hundreds of megawatts are cooled with hydrogen and not water, despite all the danger?

        Since I'm not an expert on this topic, I asked:
        http://gigavat.com/generator_sistemi_ohlaghdeniya.php
        When performing direct liquid cooling of generators, the coolant is used distilled water or oil, which have a higher heat dissipation capacity compared to hydrogen and, therefore, allow to further increase the unit power of the generators while maintaining their dimensions. Distilled water as a cooling agent has much more advantages in comparison with oil: higher heat dissipation properties, fire safety. Therefore, in most cases, powerful generators that were produced in the USSR were made with water cooling..
        But as I understand / maybe I am wrong / hydrogen allows to reduce the temperature of the working surfaces more efficiently than water, which affects their durability ?!
        1. vadimtt
          vadimtt April 16 2021 12: 37
          +2
          They came to water in generators because of more stringent safety requirements (for example, within the framework of AES-2006). Still, hydrogen in the atmosphere is dangerous. As applied to rocketry, it should be borne in mind that hydrogen has the maximum specific heat of all gases and, given its molecule, is quite fluid (not helium, but that's not bad). And in a nuclear thermal rocket engine, where heat is directly removed from the fuel elements by the working fluid at a high speed, this characteristic is extremely important.
          1. pytar
            pytar April 17 2021 13: 13
            0
            Thanks for the info! hi
  • Aleksandr97
    Aleksandr97 April 16 2021 10: 14
    +1
    American YARD projects of the 50-60s "NERVA" (Nuclear Engine for Rocket Vehicle Application), "KIWI", according to the Pluto project, two prototypes of the engine - Tory-IIA and Tory-IIC. As part of the Pluto project, it was planned to install nuclear-powered missiles on cruise missiles, which in the 1950s were created under the designation SLAM (Supersonic Low Altitude Missile (supersonic low-altitude missile)). It was planned to build a rocket 26.8 meters long, three meters in diameter, and weighing 28 tons. (HELLO from Petrel!).
    Soviet nuclear engine RD-0410 was assembled in the mid-60s

    To increase the core temperature without the risk of explosion or melting of the reactor walls, it is necessary to create such conditions for a nuclear reaction in which the fuel (uranium) turns into a gaseous state or turns into plasma and is held inside the reactor by a strong magnetic field, without touching the walls. And then the working fluid - hydrogen, entering the reactor core, “flows around” the uranium in the gas phase, and, turning into plasma, is ejected through the nozzle channel at a very high speed.
    This type of engine is called the gas-phase YARD. The temperatures of gaseous uranium fuel in such nuclear engines can range from 10 thousand to 20 thousand Kelvin, and the specific impulse reaches 50000 m / s, which is 11 times higher than that of the most efficient chemical rocket engines.
    The creation and use in space technology of gas-phase NRE of open and closed types is the most promising direction in the development of space rocket engines and exactly what is necessary for mankind to master the planets of the solar system and their satellites.
    The first research on the gas-phase nuclear reactor project began in the USSR in 1957 at the Research Institute of Thermal Processes (NRC named after M.V. Keldysh), and the very decision to develop nuclear space power plants based on gas-phase nuclear reactors was made in 1963 by Academician V.P. Glushko (NPO Energomash), and then approved by the decree of the Central Committee of the CPSU and the Council of Ministers of the USSR.
    The development of a gas-phase NRE was carried out in the Soviet Union for two decades, but, unfortunately, it was never completed due to insufficient funding and the need for additional fundamental research in the field of thermodynamics of nuclear fuel and hydrogen plasma, neutron physics and magnetohydrodynamics.
    1. Dmitry V.
      Dmitry V. April 16 2021 12: 53
      0
      Quote: Aleksandr97
      The creation and use in space technology of gas-phase NRE of open and closed types is the most promising direction in the development of space rocket engines and exactly what is necessary for mankind to master the planets of the solar system and their satellites.

      The dead-end way - to control, in fact, the thermal explosion of nuclear fuel - is not a complete task, and such an engine is not safe either for an unmanned tug, much less for manned flights.
      There are more manageable and safer ways to warm up / accelerate the working fluid to the desired temperatures / speeds.
      1. Aleksandr97
        Aleksandr97 April 16 2021 13: 49
        -1
        A complex engineering structure, imperfect in its execution, is dangerous even if it is on the wood!
        As for the open type, I agree, there are doubts about the efficiency of predictably worse values ​​due to radiation from the explosion to the sides and from the spacecraft, i.e. not transmitting momentum to the ship. As a closed type, I am sure before the invention of ways to move in outer space without using the reactive principle of motion, nuclear RD - thermonuclear RD - this is the only working option for mankind to master the solar system! Unless, of course, alternative sources with a higher energy density for all fuels are invented - well, hypothetically, for example, vacuum energy.
        1. Dmitry V.
          Dmitry V. April 16 2021 14: 37
          +2
          Quote: Aleksandr97
          As a closed type, I am sure before the invention of ways to move in outer space without using the reactive principle of motion, nuclear RD - thermonuclear RD - this is the only working option for mankind to master the solar system! Unless, of course, alternative sources with a higher energy density for all fuels are invented - well, hypothetically, for example, vacuum energy.


          This is definitely the case.
          It is depressing that mankind spends huge amounts of money on armament and protection from each other, turning a blind eye to the fact that the threat from outer space at any moment can put a global point in the development of civilization. If the meteorite exploded not over Chelyabinsk, but over Moscow, someone would probably think about it.
          An expedition to Mars could have been carried out with existing technologies. But no one is in a hurry - there is no incentive, as in the Moon Race.
      2. Falcon5555
        Falcon5555 April 16 2021 18: 27
        0
        thermal explosion of nuclear fuel
        - why an explosion? No explosions are expected there. But the implementation is questionable.
    2. Knell wardenheart
      Knell wardenheart April 16 2021 15: 14
      +1
      Gas-phase, in fact, requires a huge and super-complex engine, this is an overwhelming project given the complexity of ground demonstrations.
    3. Vadim237
      Vadim237 April 16 2021 15: 23
      0
      This engine has long been obsolete in terms of technology. Now no one will take it as a basis.
  • Dmitry V.
    Dmitry V. April 16 2021 12: 45
    +1
    A nuclear engine is much more compact and lighter than a liquid plant with the same thrust indicators, and also does not need large tanks for fuel and oxidizer

    Not more compact and not lighter - with what does the author compare?
    11D58 - for block "D" RN N-1
    11D58M - for RB "Block DM" LV "Proton-K"
    11D58M with NRO-M - using carbon-carbon nozzle instead of
    11D58MF - for use in RB "Block DM-03" LV "Angara-A5".

    It is not yet possible to compare the calculated figures with the implemented projects of the upper stages


    What do you mean does not need "large tanks"?
    Nevertheless, the term "capacious" is more literate when applied to containers, which are T and OT tanks.
    And the working fluid in the form of a heated gas, in what does the author plan to store it?
    How does the author know the flow rate of the working fluid?
    Also, the specific impulse was not announced by either domestic developers or the Americans.
  • Knell wardenheart
    Knell wardenheart April 16 2021 15: 10
    +1
    Considering quite a working NERVA, I do not see any difficulties in actualizing this idea when investing money. Probably some revival in this direction is associated with the coverage of our developments such as "Petrel" and "Nuklon". It is quite logical for them to need a powerful tug in the foreseeable future, so they start to fuss.
  • Falcon5555
    Falcon5555 April 16 2021 18: 16
    0
    A nuclear engine is much more compact and lighter than a liquid plant with the same thrust indicators, and also does not need large tanks for fuel and oxidizer.
    This is all nonsense! And it is not easier, and needs large tanks, especially if we are talking about a working medium - hydrogen. Only it will not be called fuel, but a working fluid. Advantages - in thrust per unit of mass, and in general thrust - in front of electroreactive engines (and not a "liquid plant"), and in a higher flow rate over liquid-propellant rocket ones (but not over electroreactive or electro-rocket ones - no matter what you call them).
    motor with specified performance level ... ...
    again, this verbal cotton wool - pouring from empty to empty.
    However, in general, the idea is not entirely clear.
    How does the working fluid, hydrogen, fit in with a long stay in space?
    Why is this project better than Nerva? And the fact that for environmental safety it is proposed to use uranium with relatively small enrichment. belay That is, it will still be much more than in Chernobyl, but less than on submarines. repeat How this should improve safety is not explained in any way. sad Let's not take plastic bags on board just yet - they are so bad for the environment. laughing , and take not plastic, but only paper straws for cola. laughing
  • RAM
    RAM April 16 2021 20: 55
    0
    I wanted to comment, but changed my mind, but what should I comment on? Wishlist is one thing, reality is another, as the famous character said, .... so let's drink so that our desires coincide with our capabilities.
  • Essex62
    Essex62 April 16 2021 21: 46
    -1
    Humanity is marking time in near-earth orbit and will not go anywhere further. For 60 years, when compared with other breakthroughs in the life of the planet, not a step has been taken. The flight to the moon is most likely a grandiose nonsense. There are too many unlinks there. Something went wrong, as science fiction writers have portrayed since the 60s of the last century. Someone is not letting us into the interplanetary and further ...
  • ioan-e
    ioan-e April 20 2021 10: 20
    0
    It was reported about the imminent signing of contracts with large organizations with extensive experience in the rocket and space sector.

    But what about the American immutable postulate - experience is brain fat? And or is it just us you can vtyuhivat, but as far as business concerns themselves, then here is .........