Military Review

The state and prospects of the tank fleet of France

77

In 1993, the newest Leclerc main battle tank was adopted by the French ground forces. Machines of this type are still the basis of the striking power of the army and will maintain this status in the future. Current plans call for the continuation of their service for at least the next ten years.


Past and present


The promising Leclerc MBT was developed by GIAT Industries (now Nexter Systems) and put into series in the early nineties. The starting customer was the French army, and then began mass deliveries to Jordan and the UAE. The last batch tanks handed over to the customer in 2007, and in 2008 the production line was closed as unnecessary.

Over the entire production period, more than 860 tanks were built. At the time of the cessation of construction, the French army had 254 MBTs and a small amount of unified equipment. At the same time, not all plans were fulfilled. So, initially, the army wanted to re-equip four regiments - 80 tanks in each, as well as create a reserve of 100 vehicles. In the future, these plans were seriously reduced, mainly at the expense of the reserve.


Later, there were new funding cuts, due to which the number of MBTs in the troops again decreased. According to open data, the French army currently has 222 Leclerc MBTs and 17 Leclerc DNG armored recovery vehicles at a tank base. It is believed that this amount of equipment is sufficient to fulfill the assigned tasks and allows you to keep costs at an acceptable level.

222 available tanks are assigned to four tank regiments stationed in eastern and central France. These are the 12th cuirassier and 501st armored regiments from the 2nd tank brigade, as well as the 1st armored and 4th dragoon regiments of the 7th tank brigade.

Maintaining the state


Soon after the completion of the production of tanks, the Ministry of Defense adopted a plan for the further operation and maintenance of existing tanks. To reduce costs without loss of quality of work, it was proposed to use a new approach. It provided for the selection of a "single service provider" and the issuance of a long-term contract stipulating the implementation of all the necessary activities.


In 2009, the Ministry of National Defense and Nexter entered into a Maintien en Condition Opérationnelle (MCO) agreement for armored vehicles. It provided for all the necessary work to be carried out over the next 10 years.

The cost of the contract was determined immediately and did not change in the future; it was 900 million euros. Thus, on average, it was planned to spend approx. 3,5 million annually. The actual costs for specific MBTs varied due to the uneven consumption of the resource and the release of funding due to the reduction in the number of equipment.

According to the MCO contract, the contractor was supposed to oversee the operation of Leclerc tanks in the army and provide the necessary support. The latter was mainly expressed in carrying out medium and overhaul repairs as equipment deteriorated or breakdowns.


The MCO contract did not touch upon the modernization of armored vehicles - all these measures were proposed to be carried out in the course of separate programs with their own budgets. However, after the introduction into mass operation, new components, such as the AZUR kit or new devices of the SCORPION program, also had to fall under the responsibility of Nexter Systems through the MCO.

New contract


The MCO contract from 2009 was valid until March 31, 2021. Despite certain difficulties and criticism for various reasons, the original approach paid off, and the contractor company coped with the tasks set. The customer was satisfied with the results of the work performed over the past years, which resulted in a new contract.

The cooperation of the Ministry of Defense and Nexter Systems will continue under the new contract. At the same time, we are not talking about the extension of the existing MCO, but about a new agreement with modified conditions. The renewed contract was named Marché de Soutien en Service 2 (MSS2).


The MSS2 agreement is designed for the next 10 years, its value exceeds 1 billion euros. On average, maintenance and repairs of each tank will cost 4,5 million euros annually.

The general conditions and approaches under MSS2 remain the same, but several important innovations have been proposed. Thus, a new feedback mechanism is being introduced between the troops and the performer of the work. It should simplify and speed up the interaction between the army and industry.

Previously, the medium and overhaul of the Leclerc MBT was carried out only by enterprises from the Nexter. In accordance with MSS2, the army units of the Army Technical Service Service de la Maintenance Industrielle Terrestre (SMITer) will be involved in this work. Mechanisms for purchasing and supplying spare parts have been refined and improved.

The MSS2 contract is of great importance to the French army. The oldest tanks "Leclerc" have already celebrated their 30th anniversary, the equipment of the last batches is about half the age. Thus, the new contract will ensure the maintenance of aging equipment in the required condition and will extend its service life. In addition, the MCO and MSS2 actually lay the foundation for future upgrades.


Project "XLR"


Recently, the French Ministry of Defense has embarked on a major modernization program for the ground forces with the SCORPION code. It provides for keeping the Leclerc MBT in service for a long time, until the next tank appears. In this case, cash machines must be equipped with a set of new equipment for various purposes.

The modernization of the tank to meet SCORPION standards was named Leclerc XLR. This project provides for strengthening the protection of the side and stern projections, as well as the introduction of new warning systems and electronic warfare equipment. A radical modernization of weapons control systems and the integration of promising communication facilities are proposed. Own armor, power unit, chassis and armament will remain the same.

According to current plans, in 2020-25. 200 tanks must be upgraded to Leclerc XLR. Also, new protection and electronics will be installed on the unified ARRV Leclerc DNG. These measures will allow the continued operation of MBT and ARV, as well as ensure their full-fledged use in promising ground forces control loops.


In accordance with the previously approved plan, last year Nexter, together with its subcontractors, began a planned modernization of army tanks under the XLR project. In the near future, the updated equipment will return to service. By the middle of the decade, it is planned to modernize approx. 90% of the available Leclerc fleet, as well as to receive large quantities of new equipment from the SCORPION program.

Clear perspectives


The French Ministry of Defense is well aware of the importance of main battle tanks for the modern army and is not going to abandon this class of equipment. Work is already underway to create a promising "European tank", but in the next 10-15 years the existing Leclerc vehicles will remain the main striking force of the ground forces.

It is proposed to provide the operation of the Leclerc in the future in two ways. First of all, due to repairs of varying degrees of complexity, the required technical condition will be maintained, and at the same time, modernization will be carried out to obtain new opportunities. The construction of tanks will not be resumed. The enterprises that were previously engaged in the production of MBT have long been transferred to the production of other products.

Thus, in the next 10-15 years, the tank forces of France will not differ in large numbers, but this deficiency is compensated for by a high level of technical development and broad combat capabilities. The required programs and processes are already running. Their real results will become known in the near future.
Author:
Photos used:
French Defense Ministry, Nexter Systems
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  1. SaLaR
    SaLaR April 9 2021 18: 07
    +3
    Bonjuuuurrr ...................... wassat
    1. Intruder
      Intruder April 10 2021 13: 37
      +1
      Bonjuuuurrr.
      Hi, bro ... drinks
  2. WHAT IS
    WHAT IS April 9 2021 18: 38
    +9
    The main striking force of the ground forces will remain the existing Leclerc vehicles.

    Leclerc is really good, why then reinvent the wheel ..
    1. Nikon OConor
      Nikon OConor April 11 2021 14: 14
      +2
      Well, yes, the tank is really not bad, but 4.5 euros per year? The T-90MS costs $ 4.5 million, which is cheaper. I understand standards and all that ... but even after three years of service, you can buy the same new leopard, anyway, the line was closed and they do not support the domestic manufacturer.
  3. Sergey M. Karasev
    Sergey M. Karasev April 9 2021 18: 53
    +1
    The construction of tanks will not be resumed.

    Those. the French do not plan to fight, because there are no wars without losses, but they must be compensated.
    1. nks
      nks April 9 2021 20: 04
      +2
      Of course, they do not plan a large-scale war with tanks (tanks are redundant in most cases). And so in general there is a reserve and repairs (if the losses are not irrecoverable), and if it is really necessary, then, one must think, to expand production.
      1. Sergey M. Karasev
        Sergey M. Karasev April 10 2021 07: 10
        +1
        Quote: nks
        Of course, they do not plan a large-scale war with tanks (tanks are redundant in most cases). And so in general there is a reserve and repairs (if the losses are not irrecoverable), and if it is really necessary, then, one must think, to expand production.

        Initially, they planned to have almost twice as many Leclercs.
        So, initially, the army wanted to re-equip four regiments - 80 tanks in each, as well as create a reserve of 100 vehicles. In the future, these plans were seriously reduced, mainly at the expense of the reserve.

        Now there are 222 + 17 ARVs. The size of the reserve is not indicated in the article, but, you must understand, it is not serious.
        The enterprises that were previously engaged in the production of MBT have long been transferred to the production of other products.

        That is, production, in case of need, will be very difficult to deploy.
        Conclusion: France is not planning large-scale wars, after all. I do not mean local troubles in the third world with the participation only of the Foreign Legion, which has no "Leclercs" at all.
        1. English tarantas
          English tarantas April 10 2021 12: 13
          0
          Conclusion: France is not planning large-scale wars, after all.

          Invalid output. France does not plan major conflicts in the near future, and also does not plan to talk about its plans for the future.
          1. Sergey M. Karasev
            Sergey M. Karasev April 10 2021 14: 34
            +2
            Thus, in the next 10-15 years, the French tank forces will not be distinguished by a large number, but this deficiency is compensated for by a high level of technical development and broad combat capabilities.

            The "near future" is 10-15 years.
            France does not plan major conflicts in the near future, and also does not plan to talk about its plans for the future.

            That is, do you assume that the French plans for armored forces announced in the article may turn out to be disinformation?
            1. English tarantas
              English tarantas April 10 2021 15: 13
              0
              Are you suggesting that the French plans for armored forces announced in the article may turn out to be disinformation?

              I suppose that these plans may change, and we may not know anything about further plans.
        2. nks
          nks April 12 2021 12: 42
          0
          Quote: Sergey Mikhailovich Karasev
          Initially, they planned to have almost twice as many Leclercs.

          Initially (at the time of development) it was generally planned four times more - under 1000, but by the beginning of production the Cold War ended and the order was cut to 400+ - it was completed, but then the number in combat units was adjusted several times, mainly downward, as -that was even less than 222 - now some have been returned from the reserve

          Quote: Sergey Mikhailovich Karasev
          The size of the reserve is not indicated in the article, but, you must understand, it is not serious.

          A total of 406 tanks were delivered, less than 50 tanks from the first 3 batches were written off in one form or another.
          222 in combatants, the rest in training and in storage.

          Quote: Sergey Mikhailovich Karasev

          That is, production, in case of need, will be very difficult to deploy.

          In general, in a regularly operated tank, except for the hull, everything is to one degree or another a consumable (that is, there is even a modular upgradeable booking and in different versions it is different), and therefore it is produced. The resumption of production, of course, requires effort, but in essence it consists in deploying a line (room + equipment + workers), which will cook the hulls and carry out the assembly and installation


          Quote: Sergey Mikhailovich Karasev
          Conclusion: France is not planning large-scale wars, after all.

          This is clear even without tanks :))
    2. spech
      spech April 10 2021 06: 39
      +5
      - How many tanks do you need to defend Paris?
      - I don’t know, we have never been.
      1. English tarantas
        English tarantas April 10 2021 15: 14
        +1
        Um, we tried it once for sure. They defended it, so I had to try it a second time.
        1. boris epstein
          boris epstein April 10 2021 17: 14
          +3
          If the Russian Empire had not sacrificed Samsonov's army for the sake of Paris, the Germans would have taken him in 1914. And in 1939, the French and the British grumbled, they wanted to set Hitler on the USSR as soon as possible, so they had to declare Paris an open city. After all, they did not try to defend it.
          1. English tarantas
            English tarantas April 10 2021 18: 05
            0
            Are you into alternative history? Russia would have entered WWI in any case, and quickly, in fact, it happened, and the Germans would have immediately been distracted by us, because if we had not fulfilled our obligations to the French (the alliance was mutually beneficial, it’s stupid to blame the French), then all forces were thrown the Austrians and Germans would have had to help the weak, just as it was in reality. And in the 39th, firstly, the Belgians set up the allies so great, frightened of the dashing actions of the Germans (which neither the French nor the British expected), and secondly, the British were afraid of a repetition of WWI and therefore conducted a series of awkward retreats and dashes, and thirdly the Germans surprised the French new tactics and skillful execution of it. The French did everything they could, but when the Germans make a maneuver that is simply impossible to guess, and if you guess, it will still be very difficult to sort things out, nothing can be done. Although after Belgium the Germans themselves were a little lost from the sound French defense, but the motorized fists of the Germans pulled out. The allies are to blame only for the fact that the top managers of the countries and the armed forces understood that they would not be able to pull out the second PMA (objectively true, the same Englishmen ran out of money back in the 40s) and everything began to crumble, and the Germans famously finished off. The same story with the French navy describes everything perfectly.
            1. EvilLion
              EvilLion April 10 2021 20: 42
              +2
              But if the USSR, frightened by the common border with Germany, unilaterally fits in for Poland, and they look from the outside, then this would simply be a nice thing. It did not work out, the USSR and Germany reached an agreement at least for some time and the French had to fight the British all the same. Until now, Stalin cannot be forgiven. The smartest thought, in the end they ate g ... and got nothing from it, moreover, in 1947 the Britons flew out of India, because 2 million local soldiers are not Gandhi for you, who can be ignored.
            2. cat Rusich
              cat Rusich April 10 2021 21: 29
              +2
              Quote: English Tarantas
              Are you interested in alternative history? ... Allies are to blame only for the fact that
              England and France in November 1939 were already planning a war with the USSR ... Operation Pike.
              They planned to strike in the north - Murmansk, Arkhangelsk, in the south - Batumi, Poti, Grozny, Baku, on the rest of the ports on the Black Sea.
              One can argue about the "reality" of such plans, but ...
              Fighting with Germany, to help Poland, the Allies considered the option start a war with the USSR.
            3. boris epstein
              boris epstein April 11 2021 13: 20
              0
              And this is not an alternative history. This is analytics. It's just that Samsonov's guards army was thrown into the offensive without a mind, without interaction with Rennenkampf's army, just to save Paris.
              1. English tarantas
                English tarantas April 11 2021 18: 03
                0
                So claims to a voluntary sobzny agreement or to a stupid command?
    3. Private-K
      Private-K April 10 2021 07: 36
      +3
      Let's compare the size of the military budgets of France and South. Korea: 50 and 43 billion. USD respectively.
      At the same time, the Koreans are constantly conducting a bunch of R&D, constantly buying a lot of weapons and equipment of all types for the Armed Forces 3-4 times larger than the French.
      Conclusion - somewhere the French budget money "dissolve".
      1. English tarantas
        English tarantas April 10 2021 12: 20
        0
        No need to exaggerate, the Korean army is 2 times bigger. And if you look at the actual equipment of the troops, by the composition of the fleet and the air force, it will immediately become clear why the Korean presidents, after the deadline, immediately buy themselves a robe and a ticket away. For the size, let me remind you, yuk is still at war, and the size of the mob reserve for France and Korea + is the same.
      2. monster
        monster April 10 2021 14: 46
        +1
        And the Koreans have no choice. The Japanese will not leave them alone. The tradition of the children of Amaterasu, centuries-old, is to nightmare the Celestial Empire and the country of Morning Freshness. And the French will once again remind the French that the number of tanks does not matter, you will still lie down, frogs)
        1. Yaroslav Tekkel
          Yaroslav Tekkel April 25 2021 04: 20
          0
          All Germany is one salvo of "Triumfan".
      3. Yaroslav Tekkel
        Yaroslav Tekkel April 25 2021 04: 19
        0
        Firstly, the Koreans have a conscription army, and the French have a contract army, the soldiers have to be paid.

        Secondly, Koreans do a lot of R&D, but the French do a lot of more complex R&D. Most of what the Koreans have are also the French. The opposite is not true: where are the Korean nuclear submarines, intercontinental ballistic missiles, 4+ fighters, a whole line of helicopters, a nuclear aircraft carrier, etc.? The first and so far the only Korean helicopter "Surion", which means "completely domestic", is not completely domestic, but for the most part was developed by the very same French. SAM "Chun-Ma" - also nee French "Crotal-NG". Koreans also respect various military electronics from the French "Thales". But the French do not buy Korean weapons for something (although, in fairness, they are quite good and already serve in some places in Europe).

        Thirdly, the French have atomic weapons, and they cost money.

        Fourthly, the French labor force is still more expensive than the Korean one.

        Fifth, although Korea is little by little involved in peacekeeping missions, this is not comparable to the French, who constantly fight somewhere, maintain military bases in other countries and generally maintain an expensive military presence in the world.

        Sixth, when comparing the military budgets of different countries, one must always take into account what in a particular country is included in the military budget and what is not. For example, in France, foreign intelligence (very weak in size and funding) is mostly hung around the neck of the Armed Forces. I don't know how with that in Korea.
  4. nks
    nks April 9 2021 20: 05
    +3
    It would be nice if the author indicated the source from which he made his crooked translation
  5. paul3390
    paul3390 April 9 2021 20: 18
    +3
    I sincerely do not understand why 200 tanks are generally called armored forces .. And what's the point of discussing them ..
    1. arkadiyssk
      arkadiyssk April 10 2021 10: 17
      +3
      Because the country is small and they are not going to attack, and with their border of 0.8-1 thousand km in a tank-hazardous direction, they can provide their greater density with 200 vehicles than Russia with its border of 15 thousand km and 2500 tanks. And if you consider that the French (like the Germans with their Leo) can keep their tanks in a super modern state, because there are simply few of them, in contrast to Russia, which has only 1200 modern cars, so they will surpass us, tk. in addition, they have the ability to act in concert with their NATO allies. You see - that now, in order to threaten the seedy Ukraine - Russia is pulling tanks from all over the Western direction.
      1. paul3390
        paul3390 April 10 2021 10: 54
        +1
        Well, well ... Aloizievich also hoped for supertanks a lot .. And - as a result? Westerners in general are for some reason very susceptible to mystical belief in the wunderwaffe .. They probably have it from the time of the crushing of blacks with machine guns Maxim ..
        1. English tarantas
          English tarantas April 10 2021 12: 25
          0
          And as a result

          That was a good result.
          They have it left from the time of the crumbling of blacks with machine guns Maxim ..

          On domestic channels, they saw how we praise weapons, and began to MAKE it this way.
          I really don't understand

          You do not understand a little about military affairs.
          1. paul3390
            paul3390 April 10 2021 14: 00
            +2
            But you, my dear fellow, as I see it, are no less than the president's military adviser .. Judging by your ambitions.

            Well, if Aloizievich's result is good for you .. belay what
            1. English tarantas
              English tarantas April 10 2021 14: 23
              +1
              But you, my dear fellow, as I see it, is no less than the president's military adviser .. Judging by the ambitions

              You came up with this, but you could not come up with the existence of the principle of sufficiency and expediency, that is why stupid questions about why 200 tanks are needed at all and that this is not serious. I advise you at least to watch a video of how the tank works in terms of targets, but there is nothing to answer, and then multiply it by 200+.
              Well - if the result of Aloizievich is good for you

              Specifically, the tanks of the year up to 44 worked more than well, after 44 it was already worse, the very fate of Hitler does not directly depend on tanks, this is a drop in the sea of ​​his defeats and failures.
        2. Intruder
          Intruder April 10 2021 13: 41
          +1
          Aloizievich also hoped for supertanks a lot .. And - as a result?

          Yes, somehow ... and on the sighting were wink :
      2. nks
        nks April 12 2021 12: 56
        0
        The country, after all, is not small, but average. In the eastern direction, the length of the front, where tanks can actually advance, I think, is even less. In the Russian Federation in the Western Military District, generally <1000. Well, a maximum of 1500 will be able to concentrate (but in reality everything is much less) - in general, there are no special problems here.
    2. nks
      nks April 12 2021 12: 54
      +1
      And who calls them armored forces? These are armored units as part of the ground army
  6. Lara Croft
    Lara Croft April 9 2021 20: 23
    +2
    It turns out that France has fewer tanks than Great Britain, 222 versus 227 ...
    1. nks
      nks April 9 2021 20: 42
      +1
      222 is in combat units (4 regiments) + 100+ in reserve, and at VB in combat units 168 (in 3 regiments)
      1. Lara Croft
        Lara Croft April 10 2021 13: 55
        +1
        Quote: nks
        at VB in combatants 168 (in 3 regiments)

        And in total, the WB has 227 MBTs, here an article about them was recently ...
        + 100+ in reserve

        Not a word in the article ...
    2. OgnennyiKotik
      OgnennyiKotik April 9 2021 22: 36
      -6
      More tanks are not needed. Even in nightmares, they do not dream of occupying Russia; our forces are not enough to move westward.
      1. Graz
        Graz April 11 2021 14: 29
        0
        what movement to the west. why and for what, there will be an immediate blow yao
      2. Incvizitor
        Incvizitor April 12 2021 02: 18
        0
        No one will liberate the West and will not (as it was in 45), they will burn out all this dirt to zero, in which case it is normal.
  7. CastroRuiz
    CastroRuiz April 9 2021 20: 37
    0
    Prevoskhodniy tank. Da, on dorog, no eto high tech. 15 vistrelov / min. T-90M 6, prichom u obikh AZ.
    V boyakh v Yemene UAE nepoteriali ni odnogo Leclerka. Leo i Abrams bili ot khusiov podbiti.
    1. Nestor Vlakhovski
      Nestor Vlakhovski April 9 2021 21: 53
      +2
      In the 90s, the Frenchman stood out even against the background of his NATO allies.
      Smooth hydropneumatic chassis (Abrams with leopards swing on torsion bars), 52-caliber cannon (Abrams with Leo2 only have 44-caliber), second-generation teplak (Abrams with Leo2 received only in the 00s), also a robotic gearbox at the leclerk (in leo2 also automatic transmission, but more traditional hydromechanical). Such a limousine among the tanks. And it costs accordingly.
      But there is also a fly in the ointment, "Leclerc" is the only modern NATO MBT, which caught a penetration into the frontal plane (under the tower) with a Soviet ATGM (like a cornet, but this is not certain)
      1. Private-K
        Private-K April 10 2021 07: 40
        +1
        Quote: Nestor Vlahovski
        In the 90s, the Frenchman stood out even against the background of his NATO allies.

        Well, Leclerc is more than 10 years younger than the Abrams and Leo-2.
        And initially many of them were not planned. And in the 70s - 80s, the pace of equipping the French ground forces with tanks was ridiculous. By the way, in the 80s, they happily shoved shitty AMX-30V into their aircraft - the level of the modernized T-55, but worse in protection. Level, what.
        1. CastroRuiz
          CastroRuiz April 11 2021 14: 54
          -1
          Spasibo za info pro probiti v 2015g.
      2. CastroRuiz
        CastroRuiz April 10 2021 20: 21
        -1
        Mozhte mne napisat kde i kogda bil Leclerc podbit Kornetom v lob? Spasibo.
      3. nks
        nks April 12 2021 13: 04
        0
        Quote: Nestor Vlahovski
        also the leclerk has a robotic gearbox (the leo2 also has an automatic transmission, but a more traditional hydromechanical one).

        No, sesm esm500 is also hydromechanical, it differs from renk on leo2 in less weight and front / rear 5/2 gears
        against 4/4 for the Germans :)) By the way, on the export "tropical" German diesel with the same German transmission (but not the same as on leo2),
        but SESM, which actually now belongs to the same RENK, makes an automatic transmission for the modernization of the T-72 :)

        Quote: Nestor Vlahovski
        But there is also a fly in the ointment, "Leclerc" is the only modern NATO MBT, which caught a penetration into the frontal plane (under the tower) with a Soviet ATGM (like a cornet, but this is not certain)



        Leclerc is the only modern MBT in the world that actually participated in the database, which received under 2 dozen hits and several explosions on IEDs there and did not have irrecoverable losses.
        Yes, there was one penetration, where exactly it is not known, but presumably in the area of ​​the mechanic drive hatch under the tower. There everyone has a weak point. And he really was rather just very "lucky".
        But the result that one mechanized driver is killed, the commander is lightly wounded, and the tank is on the move, says rather a plus.

        From the Turkish Leo2, I remember the generally wet place left when the ATGM hit the mechvod sector on the side - it looks like the BC jerked
        1. DV tam 25
          DV tam 25 11 May 2021 06: 13
          0
          Don't speak so confidently. All information about the use of Leclerc in Yemen is very sketchy and fragmentary. In fact, the tank took part in hostilities, but mainly it was movement in the form of columns - tanks and other equipment ironed out the desert area, sometimes hitting mines (at least twice) and receiving single hits, most likely unintended, but which resulted in the death of crew members from p / missiles (driver-mechanic, according to other sources, the tank commander died when the ATGM allegedly hit the hatch). There is information (five how true?) That in the area north of the village of Yakhtul, located halfway between Al-Mokha and Al-Khukha, Leclerc was either hit or burned (identified by the silhouette). So, based on the available publications, no conclusions can be drawn from these open sources. It should be noted that each text necessarily describes the enthusiasm of the Emirates about these tanks - they are both economical and protected, and generally just super! Also, the Emirates are ready to order at least four hundred more pieces. And they advise others. We must pay tribute, the tank is really well protected and has a very modern and serious stuffing. And yet, comparing its use with Abrams is not entirely appropriate. Lebanon, Kosovo and even Yemen very tentatively show Leclerc's capabilities. Although, the combat potential he has, perhaps (undoubtedly?), Is not small.
          1. nks
            nks 11 May 2021 11: 36
            0
            Ummm .. Yes, I forgot to add that all this information is based on anecdotal evidence - I used all the other words quite accurately.
            In general, I did not really compare with anyone, and certainly not with Abrams, I only mentioned Leo2. You just need to understand that the experience of Leo2's participation in the database is about the same as that of Leclerc. If we take the Yemeni conflict separately, then only there the Abrams were decently pressed, but the fact is that yes - among Western tanks, according to Abrams, there is most of all statistics and application experience.
            I state two simple facts (and the shot from Yakkhtul does not change anything here): there is confirmation of participation in real databases (both in the city and in an open, mostly deserted area. And hits, too, clearly indicate participation in _real_ databases) and there is neither one confirmation (and even just a message) about the irrevocable loss of Leclerc. For all other modern tanks that participated in the database, there is such evidence of irrecoverable losses.
            There are also facts of hitting Leclerc and detonating it on an IED. Then you can interpret it as you like, but it is strange to interpret them as a negative experience of use.
            By the way, I do not really understand what non-aimed hits are, and what is the difference with aimed hits in this case, if these are all hits.


            Quote: DV tam 25
            driver mechanic, according to other sources, the tank commander died when the ATGM allegedly hit the hatch)

            There are some unofficial data and they are indirectly confirmed by other public data, and the rest is the fantasy of Internet authors.
            1. DV tam 25
              DV tam 25 13 May 2021 16: 32
              0
              "Leclerc is the only modern MBT in the world that actually participated in the database" - what's this? And we also have the Internet. So there is no need to draw conclusions, there is nothing and nothing about.
              "... there is not a single confirmation (and even just a message) about the irrevocable loss of Leclerc" - wait, you will be shown a report with a photo and signatures). Abramsov, too, no one knocked out, only his own and accidentally. And in 800 Russian hackers posted a tender for a contract to repair about 2004 tanks and armored vehicles on the US Army website. Everything is clear here).
              1. nks
                nks 14 May 2021 11: 00
                0
                You still have difficulties understanding the text. We may not get further discussion. But just in case, I will clarify the last time, if suddenly the problem is in this phrase
                "Leclerc is the only modern MBT in the world that actually participated in the database"
                should read
                "Leclerc is the only modern MBT in the world that actually participated in the database ..." although there further in the context it is already completely understandable. I am not at all claiming that other tanks did not participate in the database - I just take this category, because it is stupid to compare combat losses with non-combat ones. Your obsession with the Abrams is completely incomprehensible to me - where does the contract for the repair?
                1. DV tam 25
                  DV tam 25 14 May 2021 12: 07
                  0
                  I'm not discussing anything with you. Fantasize further).
  8. Keyser soze
    Keyser soze April 9 2021 20: 49
    +5
    Yes, 200 tanks will be enough for them ... there are no aggressive neighbors and will not be expected, but enough for everything else. And if the Third goes, then these tanks will definitely come out of the hangar and on the street there is cesium with thorium in bulk ... laughing

    As it was in the song - Everyone, everyone can't believe it, a nuclear mine falls, falls ... laughing
  9. Redsun
    Redsun April 9 2021 21: 00
    -4
    In fact, it is quite indicative that for the 4 most efficient NATO armies in Europe (these include Germany, France, England and Poland) there are no more than 1000 modern MBTs. Their shells are, of course, more interesting than ours, but they do not compensate for such a quantitative gap. Moreover, the T-14 is already on its way. Apparently, the confrontation with us is not even considered seriously. It may of course be on the conquest of air supremacy, but it is also controversial
    1. OgnennyiKotik
      OgnennyiKotik April 9 2021 22: 33
      -1
      Quote: redsun
      Apparently, the confrontation with us is not even considered seriously.

      Yes.
      Quote: redsun
      Maybe, of course, the rate is on the conquest of air supremacy,

      Yes.
      Quote: redsun
      but also controversial

      No.
      Quote: redsun
      there are no more than 1000 modern MBTs.

      Russia has 3000 tanks, parity. With the total superiority of NATO (even without the United States and Turkey) in the air.
      1. Redsun
        Redsun April 10 2021 01: 09
        -4
        Underestimating the enemy is certainly a disastrous business, but you should not underestimate your own strength. You put our technique low, since 3 to 1 is parity
        1. OgnennyiKotik
          OgnennyiKotik April 10 2021 01: 25
          +1
          Parity does not mean equality. I do not assess the quality of military equipment in this case, for a successful offensive you need 3 or more times superiority in tanks and armored vehicles. This condition is not met. The main thing is that any offensive is impossible without gaining air superiority.
          And your numbers are strange, Poland has so many tanks:

          MBT 808: 137 Leopard 2A4 (being upgraded to 2PL); 105 Leopard 2A5; 5 Leopard 2PL (in test); 232 PT-91 Twardy; 329 T-72A / T-72M1
          1. Redsun
            Redsun April 10 2021 02: 05
            0
            I only take into account modern MBT. On old type 2a4, Twardy and 72a / m1, we have our own in the sedimentation tanks in bulk
            1. OgnennyiKotik
              OgnennyiKotik April 10 2021 07: 58
              +2
              In our army:
              MBT 2,840: 650 T-72B / BA; 850 T-72B3; 530 T-72B3M; 310 T-80BV / U; 140 T-80BVM; 350 T-90 / T-90A; 10 T-90M;
              VDV:
              MBT 160: 150 T-72B3; 10 T-72B3M
              Fleet:
              MBT 330: 50 T-72B; 150 T-72B3; 30 T-72B3M; 50 T-80BV; 50 T-80BVM


              2210 pieces of T-72B / BA / B3 and T-80BV, I would not call them the height of perfection.
      2. Bobik012
        Bobik012 April 11 2021 06: 11
        -1
        With the total superiority of NATO (even without the United States and Turkey) in the air.

        NATO without the US and Turkey !?
        Air superiority !?
        Don't smoke THIS anymore!
    2. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi April 9 2021 22: 59
      +1
      Quote: redsun
      In fact, it is quite indicative that for the 4 most efficient NATO armies in Europe (these include Germany, France, England and Poland) there are no more than 1000 modern MBTs. Their shells are, of course, more interesting than ours, but they do not compensate for such a quantitative gap. Moreover, the T-14 is already on its way. Apparently, the confrontation with us is not even considered seriously. It may of course be on the conquest of air supremacy, but it is also controversial

      They believe that using a tank as a PTS is an extremely undesirable use of a resource. A stake on a large number of modern anti-tank systems.
      1. Redsun
        Redsun April 10 2021 01: 01
        +1
        We also have a lot of vehicles, both self-propelled and portable. The question is who will end it all before
      2. bk0010
        bk0010 April 10 2021 12: 28
        +2
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        A stake on a large number of modern anti-tank systems.
        And you drag this ATGM through the source of defeat to smash the enemy rear ...
      3. English tarantas
        English tarantas April 10 2021 12: 33
        +1
        They believe that using a tank as a PTS is an extremely undesirable use of a resource.

        There are no questions about the French and the British, they showed sho can in the deserts. But how long ago did the Germans start making landmines on the leopard?
      4. nks
        nks April 12 2021 12: 58
        0
        Everyone thinks that tanks are not the only vehicle and that everything should be used in the complex, while tanks have a vehicle that is not the only function. This is what the modernization of the leclerc is aimed at:
        Secentrism and versatility (for example, shooting from closed positions)

        PS: In general, some of THEM (not French :) tanks are criticized for the lack of OFS shots.
    3. Bobik012
      Bobik012 April 11 2021 06: 07
      -2
      4 most efficient NATO armies in Europe (these include Germany, France, England and Poland)

      Oh yeah! Poland! Estonia has been forgotten!
  10. Sahalinets
    Sahalinets April 10 2021 01: 01
    +1
    The MSS2 agreement is designed for the next 10 years, its value exceeds 1 billion euros. On average, maintenance and repairs of each tank will cost 4,5 million euros annually.

    Here it seems to me a mistake, as in the similar figures above. Simple maintenance and maintenance of one tank without modernization for 4,5 million euros per year? Even with their wild price tags, it's too much. Rather, we are talking about the cost of the contract for the entire ten years ...
    1. nks
      nks April 12 2021 12: 52
      0
      In addition to the crookedness of the translation, the author also had some confusion, although, perhaps, this is such a deliberate policy. Of course, even from this text it is clear that the cost is indicated for 10 years (and in fact ~ 900 million), an average of ~ 400 thousand per tank per year is obtained. But the contract not only includes zip as such, but also infrastructural things.
  11. Bobik012
    Bobik012 April 11 2021 05: 55
    -1
    Quote: English Tarantas
    Are you interested in alternative history?

    Thank you. A very interesting alternative history.
  12. Hiller
    Hiller April 11 2021 11: 57
    0
    And from what resource do they "dance" ??? How many hours are allocated in peacetime for conducting fire training, driving, coordinating units, tactical exercises ??? Then you can reduce "debit with credit".
  13. Crabong
    Crabong April 11 2021 17: 34
    0
    The tank is good, but it is afraid of dirt ...
  14. nks
    nks April 12 2021 12: 46
    0
    Quote: Lara Croft
    Not a word in the article ...

    I wrote about the "article" above. A total of 406 tanks were delivered, less than 50 were written off, a small part, by the way, was recently returned to service.
  15. Constanty
    Constanty April 12 2021 20: 05
    +1
    The MSS2 agreement is designed for the next 10 years, its value exceeds 1 billion euros. On average, maintenance and repairs of each tank will cost 4,5 million euros annually.
    The indicated value seems to be overstated. Let's calculate 1 billion euros over 10 years. It costs 100 million euros a year - that's about 400-450 thousand euros per tank, not 4,5 million !!!

    This would also be somewhat adequate to the data provided. They show that in 2016 the maintenance of one Leclerc MBT cost an average of 246 euros, that is, about 249 euros per month.
    Now the tank is older, worn out, with inflation, so I understand twice as much. Not 4,5 million euros a year, because that's half a new tank !!

  16. Sedoy
    Sedoy April 19 2021 20: 52
    0
    this disadvantage is compensated for by a high level of technical development and broad combat capabilities

    Curiously, there are examples of real use of "broad combat capabilities" against a commensurate enemy?
    1. DV tam 25
      DV tam 25 11 May 2021 06: 17
      0
      Lebanon, Kosovo - peacekeeping forces, Yemen - participation in hostilities. Everything is very sketchy and general.
  17. Givi Jalagoniya
    Givi Jalagoniya April 26 2021 16: 11
    0
    200 tanks ?! I immediately remembered 180 tanks, irretrievably lost by the Red Army on the first day of the Berlin operation.
  18. CommanderDIVA
    CommanderDIVA 1 June 2021 07: 36
    0
    France has no opponents on land in Europe, the time of massive tank battles has passed, it would be better if these expensive tanks were sold to the Arabs or the Indians, and there are enough aviation and legionnaires to control the situation in the former colonies and overseas territories
  19. zenion
    zenion 11 June 2021 19: 51
    0
    So you can go crazy worrying about everyone that everyone is not ready for war. And then there is the Cosmos, plates, and in general everything flies. And if the Earth does not have time to dodge, then everyone is kapets.