Military Review

Variant grenade shovel

57
Variant grenade shovel
Elements of the product "Variant"


At the beginning of the Great Patriotic War, the VM-37 mortar shovel was in service with the Red Army for a short time. This product combined the functions of a small-caliber artillery gun and an entrenching tool. VM-37 had a number of congenital flaws that seriously limited its fighting qualities, and it was quickly abandoned. They returned to the idea of ​​a mortar-shovel only at the end of the seventies, but the new product "Variant" was also not very successful.

New initiative


The idea of ​​a mortar-shovel in 1978 was brought back to life by the designer-gunsmith from the Tula TsKIB SOO Viktor Vasilyevich Rebrikov. This proposal was based on the same considerations and ideas as in the case of the VM-37. New weapon could increase the firepower of the rifle unit and provide a fragment of the trenches.

This took into account the latest developments in the field of infantry weapons. Under-barrel grenade launchers had already been adopted by the Soviet army, and the new model was supposed to supplement them in rifle units. It also provided for the use of standard grenade launcher shots. In this regard, the development of V.V. Rebrikov is most often referred to as a shovel grenade launcher.

The promising project was developed on an initiative basis and received limited support from the management of TsKIB SOO. In this regard, the weapon did not receive an index with the letters "TKB", and only the working title "Option" was used. The Bureau's leadership allowed the development and manufacture of a couple of prototypes. The further fate of the project depended on the results of their tests.

The expectedly initiative project attracted the attention of the military mission. Consequently, the tests were carried out under the supervision of a potential customer. Accordingly, with the demonstration of high characteristics, the "Option" could receive the support of the army, and with it, the real chances of getting into service.

Combining functions


In terms of its architecture, Rebrikov's Variant was similar to the VM-37 mortar, but a number of important innovations were proposed that affected all key components of the design. With their help, it was possible to obtain sufficiently high combat and operational characteristics - while ensuring the solution of fundamentally different tasks.


Shovel grenade launcher (top) versus a conventional entrenching tool

The Variant product was designed for the VOG-25 serial round for the GP-25 under-barrel grenade launcher. The 40-mm grenade went through a full cycle of tests, confirmed its characteristics and was put into service. The use of VOG-25 made it possible to unify the new grenade launcher-shovel with under-barrel systems, as well as to ensure the receipt of high power on the target.

The grenade launcher was structurally divided into several units. It included a firing part with a barrel and a trigger, a shovel blade (also known as a base plate), a removable sight and a plug handle. In the transport position or in the configuration for excavation work, the firing part and the blade were placed on the same line and fixed with a cylindrical coupling. At the same time, the sight was inside the barrel, closed with a removable plug-handle. To transfer to the firing position, it was necessary to remove the plug, install the sight and, if necessary, open the firing part with the base plate.

The shooting part of the "Variant" consisted of a rifled barrel of the type used on the GP-25. With the help of a thread, it was connected to a longer breech-shank, inside which was a striker-type trigger mechanism controlled by an external nut-coupling. There was also a sight mount on the shank. The opposite end of the shank was fitted with a hinge for connection to the base plate. The connection was carried out near the upper edge of the latter.

The slab, which also served as a canvas, repeated in shape and size the detail of a standard shovel. To increase rigidity and strength, three longitudinal stampings were provided on it. In the deeper central one was a hinge for the firing part-handle. With its help, it was proposed to carry out vertical guidance.

A simple quadrant sight was developed for the grenade launcher. It was mounted on the breech to the right in the direction of fire and allowed setting the range to the target. Horizontal aiming was carried out by rotating the entire structure around the axis, and for vertical guidance it was proposed to move the barrel manually towards or away from you.


"Option" in the configuration for firing on mounted trajectories

In the configuration of the entrenching tool, the "Variant" product had the dimensions of a standard infantry shovel. Ergonomics remained almost unchanged, although the new "handle" in the central part was thicker due to the 40 mm barrel. Due to the use of a number of new parts, the weight of the product increased to 2 kg - versus 1,2 kg for a standard shovel.

The spent VOG-25 grenade and the rifled barrel made it possible to obtain sufficiently high firing characteristics. The estimated firing range reached 400 m with a theoretical possibility of good accuracy and accuracy. The power of the 40-mm ammunition was supposed to provide an effective fight against enemy manpower in open areas and behind shelters.

Shovel at the landfill


Two experimental "Variants" were tested by TsKIB SOO forces under the supervision of representatives of the Ministry of Defense. The unusual weapon has confirmed the design characteristics and has shown its capabilities. As a matter of careful study, the shooting was carried out both "in mortar" from different surfaces, and in other positions, incl. from the shoulder and with an emphasis on various objects.

In all cases, sufficient range and accuracy of fire was ensured, and target destruction mainly depended on the skills and experience of the grenade launcher. Shooting from the shoulder was possible, although it was complicated by the large recoil. The impact of the "Variant" was compared to the recoil of a gun with a powerful cartridge.

However, it was not without criticism. It was obvious that the combination of the functions of a tool and a tool imposes certain restrictions, incl. and potentially dangerous. So, the active use of a shovel could lead to damage to the mechanisms of the grenade launcher with the impossibility of firing or with other consequences. The thickened handle was not very comfortable, and the hinge was subjected to heavy loads.

"Option" was supposed to complement the infantry grenade launchers. However, the staffing number of the latter has already been determined taking into account the role and needs of the departments. Because of this, additional weapons with similar characteristics were no longer required.


Split layout of the VOG-25 shot - a key component of the "Variant" system Photo: Vitalykuzmin.net

When adopting a grenade launcher for service, there would be legal problems. The grenade launcher would have to be responsible for the shovel grenade launcher as a full-fledged weapon. At the same time, any breakdowns during the execution of work could have unpleasant consequences, at least of a bureaucratic nature.

After testing, in 1981 V.V. Rebrikov received a patent for an unusual design. It was decided to continue looking for a customer, but this process did not lead to anything. It is known of limited interest from the engineering troops, which considered the possibility of making a small batch of grenade launchers for military trials. However, no real order followed.

Benefits and futility


The "Variant" project was developed without an order from the army and could not go beyond the proving grounds. This was due to the lack of interest from the customer, as well as the presence of a number of specific design features, incl. mutually exclusive. The proposed product did not have fundamental advantages over existing samples, and its versatility did not affect the opinion of the military.

It should be noted that the "Option" compares favorably with the previous VM-37. The main advantages were associated with the use of spent and effective ammunition with sufficient characteristics. An equally important innovation was the rifled barrel, which provided increased range and accuracy of fire.

In general, "Option" V.V. Rebrikov was similar to the result of a serious revision of the concept of the VM-37 product, based on the experience of its operation. However, the result of such a project, with all its curious qualities and advantages, did not find a place in the army. The functions of the means of increasing firepower remained with the under-barrel grenade launchers - with the same ammunition and similar characteristics.
Author:
Photos used:
Weaponland.ru, Vitalykuzmin.net
57 comments
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  1. Zufei
    Zufei April 23 2021 18: 08
    +6
    What does the GP-25 not suit you? Everyone strives to cross a snake and a hedgehog.
    1. Sergey Aleksandrovich
      Sergey Aleksandrovich April 26 2021 16: 37
      +1
      This is how people try, create. Trial and error is sometimes necessary, especially when the costs are low.
  2. The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins April 23 2021 18: 12
    +3
    Bravo! Many have heard / read about the mortar-shovel, but I think it's unlikely about this instance!))
    1. AUL
      AUL April 23 2021 20: 48
      -3
      Dancing on a rake is our longtime fun!
      1. Intruder
        Intruder April 24 2021 03: 15
        +1
        Dancing on a rake is our longtime fun!
        from the "opera": "two spirits from the construction battalion, replace the excavator .." !? laughing
    2. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I April 23 2021 23: 31
      +4
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      Many have heard / read about the mortar-shovel, but I think it's unlikely about this instance!)

      Why so? belay When on the pages of VO there was a "note" about the VM-37 shovel-mortar, I posted a comment about the "Option" ... I did not write a detailed "article", assuming that those who are interested can find the missing information on the Internet on their own. the name: "grenade launcher-shovel (mortar-shovel)" Option "!
      PS "In every joke, only a fraction of a joke" ... So "he looks into the book, but sees a fig" confirms this!
      1. The leader of the Redskins
        The leader of the Redskins April 24 2021 07: 13
        0
        Nikolaevich! You mentioned... It's like something fleeting ... You know yourself - it's better to see once than hear a hundred times))) I remember that article. I even left a comment there, as I had read about the mortar-shovel in "TM" even earlier, and your comment - request !)) Maybe it was bright and detailed, but you wrote it later than mine?)
      2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Kote Pan Kokhanka April 24 2021 07: 34
        0
        Quote: Nikolaevich I
        PS "In every joke, only a fraction of a joke" ... So "he looks at the book, but sees a fig"

        Nikolaevich, why be harmful. Many people like me feed only on VO. There is no time for other resources. Even now, I read the article about Option those two days later. So the potential for Igor (the Leader) from your side is not fair.
        Sincerely yours, Vlad!
        1. Nikolaevich I
          Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 07: 55
          +1
          Maybe so ... I will not argue ... But I mentioned the "Option" on VO, in my opinion, 2 times at different times ... and not in order to "earn pluses"; and so that more "people" knew not only about VM-37! It turns out that he tried in vain?
          1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
            Kote Pan Kokhanka April 24 2021 12: 25
            +1
            Quote: Nikolaevich I
            It turns out that he tried in vain?

            Well, this is you in vain!
            Firstly, for the sake of the pluses, you would be - white and fluffy, and not harmful and ruffy.
            Secondly, practice shows that many members of the forum and even authors swim worse than you on the topic of weapons. I am personally sure, like Igor, they read your comments with great pleasure, but the fact that we have not "googled" the links cannot be cleaned up in any way. Even I now hold a plug in one hand and a phone in the other.
            With all due respect, Vlad!
  3. Prisoner
    Prisoner April 23 2021 18: 16
    +3
    As an engineering challenge, for God's sake. It became interesting, they came up with it, riveted it, solved the problem. Well done, smart. Only some of our eggheads have such a quirk, sometimes they forget that on whatman paper this is one thing, in the field it is a bit different. In creative excitement, they lose their sense of reality. winked
    1. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 06: 16
      0
      Mortar-shovel VM-37 ... "Grenade launcher-shovel" "Option" ... I propose an even more convenient, practical version of a shooting shovel like a rod "mortar" AP / AV700 ...! fellow
  4. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
    Paragraph Epitafievich Y. April 23 2021 18: 25
    -5
    Crazy idea. The next project of this ingenious inventor is a Kalash with the additional function of a sapper shovel?
    1. Cetron
      Cetron April 23 2021 18: 58
      +2
      Why, the shoulder blade is hidden in the butt. Split Stock - Shovel Cover! Unbuttoned the butt, dug in, fastened - shot. Joke
      1. t-12
        t-12 April 23 2021 19: 47
        +2
        The shovel can be attached to the barrel (like a bayonet knife). In this case, the additional fuse is automatically activated. And the butt is the handle of the shovel.
        1. Nikolaevich I
          Nikolaevich I April 23 2021 23: 50
          +5
          Quote: t-12
          The shovel can be attached to the barrel (like a bayonet knife). And the butt is the handle of the shovel.

          Exactly! The Americans did it! It remains only to imagine how it will be on the AKM!
          1. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter April 23 2021 23: 54
            +2
            Quote: Nikolaevich I
            It remains only to imagine how it will be on the AKM!


            No way! neither technically nor applied. hi
            1. Nikolaevich I
              Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 00: 01
              +4
              Quote: Stroporez
              No way! neither technically nor applied

              Not applied? But it's cool! wink
              1. Sling cutter
                Sling cutter April 24 2021 00: 07
                -1
                Quote: Nikolaevich I
                Not applied? But it's cool!

                Wow! It would also be cool to place a nuclear charge on a shovel directly wassat And on this topic for the Mikhans to publish an article, and then discuss it! belay
                Aircraft carriers will smoke))))
                1. Nikolaevich I
                  Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 00: 34
                  +3
                  Quote: Stroporez
                  place a nuclear charge on a shovel AND On this topic for the Mikhans to publish an article, and then discuss it!
                  Aircraft carriers will smoke))))

                  Well, what? what In our time and in our age, there is so little entertainment! request
                  1. Sling cutter
                    Sling cutter April 24 2021 00: 52
                    -2
                    Quote: Nikolaevich I

                    Well, what? In our time and at our age, there is so little entertainment!

                    Colleague, I remember you a long time ago, like many other Dear commentators of the site!
                    There was also a designer, and submariners, and pilots, tankmen and we infantry (later, also gunsmiths). Then a malacholny mikhan appeared and ...., now only Ukraine, sanctions ... and a "nuclear shovel" .. I regret one thing that the president did not show it in 5D .... meeting to hell, and a kind and bright life would begin.! yes fellow
                    1. Nikolaevich I
                      Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 02: 17
                      -1
                      Oh, don't put salt on the wound! Undoubtedly ... IN "then" and IN "now" - two big differences, as "they say in Odessa" ... and not always for the better ...! What is the "annoyance"? Yes, there is a "danger": With whom you will lead, from that you will gain! Sometimes you notice this in yourself ... recourse
                      PS For the sake of fairness, probably, one should not blame the "administrative apparatus" for all the "shortcomings"! "The retinue is playing the king!" Much depends on the "contingent"! What is the "contingent", so is the IN!
                2. Intruder
                  Intruder April 24 2021 03: 25
                  0
                  Wow! It would also be cool to place a nuclear charge on a shovel directly
                  immediately pour it into a concrete block and sell it as humanitarian aid .. to the enemy, even before the battle !? A gloomy idea - a preliminary nuclear strike, already with delivery to the territory of a potential ...
              2. Intruder
                Intruder April 24 2021 03: 17
                0
                But it's cool! wink
                to make the enemy laugh in close combat, so that they start colic and reduce their combat effectiveness !? laughing wink
          2. t-12
            t-12 April 24 2021 10: 20
            0
            This is how it will be. Only instead of a knife blade - a shovel blade. And the ring tightly plugs the barrel so that digging dirt does not get inside. A fuse lock is also added so that it cannot accidentally switch from shaking.
    2. ABC-schütze
      ABC-schütze April 27 2021 12: 12
      0
      "Idekya", just nrolrmal. Especially if we do not mean the actions of regular troops (formations) on the battlefield, "in the war," but, say, the actions of partisans - "combatants" on the territory of a potential enemy, in any other conditions and situation. Incl. and in the so-called. "Peaceful time" ...
  5. Sandro1977
    Sandro1977 April 23 2021 19: 15
    +6
    Shoots like a shovel, digs like a grenade launcher?
    1. Intruder
      Intruder April 24 2021 03: 19
      0
      Shoots like a shovel, digs like a grenade launcher?
      Even so, it is better than a howitzer excavator, or a 40 mm micro SRZO. caliber ??? fellow
  6. The comment was deleted.
    1. Prisoner
      Prisoner April 23 2021 19: 42
      0
      "Aren't I people?" (c) We are not sane, too, to read something. winked
  7. nonsense
    nonsense April 23 2021 19: 55
    -6
    will not calm down in sawing the dough ... Like, they could not immediately figure out that this stupid repetition of a mortar-shovel at a new level is meaningless? - no, they will invest money in the development of a deliberately idiotic design ..
    PS: IMHO, even the same monkey imitation of amers in adopting the GP-25 grenade launcher was by mistake! Excess weight on the shooter without increasing real efficiency in combat. Before that, there were under-barrel grenade launchers from the one who really needed them (all sorts of "Canaries" from the scouts), but what was the point of this device in the infantry then? - They had their own group firepower, much more effective! Why was it necessary to overload the infantrymen-porters(group weapons)? (and even complicate = increase the cost of the AKM design)
    1. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 06: 10
      +1
      Quote: nespich
      the adoption of the GP-25 grenade launcher was a mistake!

      Well, it's a moot point! I would think about, for example, rifle grenades ... especially since the Italians, for example, had a "mortar grenade launcher" using ammunition based on a rifle grenade! But the Americans, having rifle grenades in the "assortment", for some reason, decided to get hold of a grenade launcher-grenade launcher! By the way, ahead of him they managed to acquire just an "infantry 40-mm grenade launcher" ...!
      1. nonsense
        nonsense April 24 2021 10: 20
        0
        I think that rifle grenades are not a smart solution either. They carry a lot of unnecessary weight ... And an individual fighter with such a weapon is overweight ... IMHO the original Soviet concept group weapon carrier and the ammunition was correct. And there was no need to move away from it, but only to improve this very group armament (single machine guns, RPGs, author's grenade launchers, mortars, large-caliber machine guns and anti-material rifles) and ammunition for it. A soldier in personal use only has a PDW in the form of an AKM and hand grenades (for close range). Everything! Lightweight and mobile - ready to carry ammunition for group weapons and the weapon itself ...
        1. Nikolaevich I
          Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 11: 05
          0
          Quote: nespich
          the original Soviet concept of a fighter-porter of group weapons and ammunition was correct.

          In fact, in a number of publications it is believed that it was the Germans who began to "concentrate" the infantry units of the group weapons district ... for example, an infantry squad "around" a single machine gun ... what
  8. Alexander Betonkin
    Alexander Betonkin April 23 2021 21: 27
    +3
    If the service had given out such a shovel, I would never have dug it into life. A seemingly squishy connection - it will break, then you won't pay off the foreman. Yes, and the "quadrant sight" can be lost at a time.
  9. starley
    starley April 23 2021 22: 46
    +3
    The weapon is more guerrilla rather than for regular forces.
    Dangerous for the shooter himself. And - the removable scope is a problem.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Intruder
      Intruder April 24 2021 03: 38
      +1
      The weapon is more guerrilla rather than for regular forces.
      The Yankees, in their films, went even further in the dark heroism of Hollywood:
    3. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 04: 56
      +2
      Quote: starley
      The weapon is more guerrilla rather than for regular forces.
      Rod mortars are more suitable for the role of partisan weapons! Such weapons are simple in design, can be manufactured in relatively simple "handicraft" workshops ... even ammunition!




      1. Intruder
        Intruder April 24 2021 08: 55
        +1
        Rod mortars are more suitable for the role of partisan weapons.
        They have a progenitor from France, it was used back in the First World War:
        Unlike the wooden crossbows of the Middle Ages, the "Grasshopper" was entirely made of metal. A special handle located on the right side was used to tension the bowstring, which was made of steel cable. When this handle was rotated, the slider moved, pulling the string along with the metal bowl into which the Mills grenade, F-1 or type 14 grenade was inserted. The distance to which the ammunition had to be thrown was calculated according to the instructions on the left. On a special scale, the distance was set taking into account the weight of the grenade. The mass of the crossbow-grenade launcher itself was 24 kg, and the maximum firing range from it reached 140 meters, which in the conditions of trench warfare was quite acceptable to itself




        1. Nikolaevich I
          Nikolaevich I April 24 2021 09: 54
          0
          But nevertheless, it is probably better to "focus" on the "gunshot" age, and not on the "Middle Ages"! what
  10. serg.shishkov2015
    serg.shishkov2015 April 24 2021 05: 54
    0
    I first learned about him in the year 98, the magazine * Soldier of Fortune *, since then THIS article is the first about him! People should be aware of such samples!
  11. bk0010
    bk0010 April 24 2021 11: 43
    0
    "Shaw, again? !!!" Why not make a normal hand grenade launcher, like the Americans have M79? And do not screw anything to either the shovel or the machine.
    1. Doliva63
      Doliva63 April 24 2021 20: 09
      0
      Quote: bk0010
      "Shaw, again? !!!" Why not make a normal hand grenade launcher, like the Americans have M79? And do not screw anything to either the shovel or the machine.

      And what is the RPG-7, for example, not normal?
      1. bk0010
        bk0010 April 24 2021 21: 00
        +1
        Quote: Doliva63
        And what is the RPG-7, for example, not normal?
        Bolshoi and FOG do not shoot.
        1. Doliva63
          Doliva63 April 26 2021 17: 21
          0
          Quote: bk0010
          Quote: Doliva63
          And what is the RPG-7, for example, not normal?
          Bolshoi and FOG do not shoot.

          Well, there's a grenade for that.
      2. Sergey Aleksandrovich
        Sergey Aleksandrovich April 26 2021 16: 16
        0
        RPG-7 first of all requires an open space behind the back during a shot, for example, you cannot shoot from the window of a small room. You have to shoot, as they say, in full growth, while aiming and firing being substituted under enemy fire.
        1. Doliva63
          Doliva63 April 26 2021 17: 41
          0
          Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
          RPG-7 first of all requires an open space behind the back during a shot, for example, you cannot shoot from the window of a small room. You have to shoot, as they say, in full growth, while aiming and firing being substituted under enemy fire.

          There is no universal weapon. Well, maybe engineer Garin's hyperboloid. And on whom will you hang the extra weapon in the infantry squad? There and so everyone has enough, in my opinion. And in general (I don't know if you are a military man or not), its outcome is not decided in a battle, but much earlier - during planning. In reconnaissance it was like this - according to the battle plan was not? So it won't, we go by. And if it was necessary - the flaw of the command. And here no bells and whistles will save, only luck. But the task was thwarted anyway. And for its implementation, the standard weapon is more than enough. And you can shoot from an RPG even while lying down, if that.
          1. Sergey Aleksandrovich
            Sergey Aleksandrovich April 26 2021 20: 15
            0
            So it is so, so it is of course. And how often did you have to take the RPG-7 with you on reconnaissance?
            1. Doliva63
              Doliva63 April 27 2021 15: 42
              0
              Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
              So it is so, so it is of course. And how often did you have to take the RPG-7 with you on reconnaissance?

              In the reconnaissance and assault group of the airborne assault platoon of the reconnaissance landing company model 87g. Reconnaissance grenade launcher with RPG-7 - standard unit. So shtaaa (s).
              1. Sergey Aleksandrovich
                Sergey Aleksandrovich April 27 2021 16: 02
                0
                The unit is regular, but the fact that this unit went with the RPG-7 at night in reconnaissance, something I doubt. And can't he also be given a choice of GM-94, just for night outings?
                As it is not convincing arguments about the versatility of the RPG-7, especially since the high-explosive fragmentation grenade for him appeared only in the mid-90s. Although in fairness it should be noted that the cumulative ammunition for the grenade launcher and GM-94 is also delayed.
                1. Doliva63
                  Doliva63 April 28 2021 18: 26
                  0
                  You shouldn't doubt it. He's not just a grenade launcher, but with the "scout" prefix. He also had an assistant, but was called the other way around - a reconnaissance grenade launcher laughing And yes, I forgot, the grenade launcher was an RPG-7ND. And then there was already a high-explosive grenade. I'll tell you a secret: if a group, during reconnaissance, discovers an object from a certain list (for example, Lance's battery on the march), it must drop everything and start destroying this object. Therefore, other groups (in the exercises), even with ATGM calculations, went, not like with RPGs laughing And even in the regimental reconnaissance groups there was a "heavy" PK machine gun. And why reconnaissance - at night? At night, reconnaissance is rarely done, more marches are made. But reconnaissance is carried out more often during the day. I mean visual observation as the main method. At night - raids, sabotage, etc. But all this is being prepared during the day.
                  1. Sergey Aleksandrovich
                    Sergey Aleksandrovich April 28 2021 19: 16
                    0
                    That is, you did not conduct real military intelligence in Afghanistan or Chechnya? Because it is possible to talk about Lance batteries only theoretically, the real opponents of that time did not have them. I find the conclusion about the rarity of night reconnaissance inappropriate, if you go in the daytime, in the open, this is something else, like a raid or exit.
                    The PKM machine gun is not so heavy and, when a group is detected, it can help more significantly than an RPG, for which, under such circumstances, the target may not be. Not "Cliff" all the same, you can carry it away.
                    And for ammunition, thermobaric grenade -1988, fragmentation -1999. Don't you confuse anything about ammunition?
                    And, for some reason, special forces and riot police take GM-94 with them, and not RPG-7, for actions in the city, maybe they don't understand what?
                    1. Doliva63
                      Doliva63 April 29 2021 18: 43
                      0
                      Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
                      That is, you did not conduct real military intelligence in Afghanistan or Chechnya? Because it is possible to talk about Lance batteries only theoretically, the real opponents of that time did not have them. I find the conclusion about the rarity of night reconnaissance inappropriate, if you go in the daytime, in the open, this is something else, like a raid or exit.
                      The PKM machine gun is not so heavy and, when a group is detected, it can help more significantly than an RPG, for which, under such circumstances, the target may not be. Not "Cliff" all the same, you can carry it away.
                      And for ammunition, thermobaric grenade -1988, fragmentation -1999. Don't you confuse anything about ammunition?
                      And, for some reason, special forces and riot police take GM-94 with them, and not RPG-7, for actions in the city, maybe they don't understand what?

                      I don’t know what you mean by “Spetsnaz”, and the OMON has nothing to do with it - we are talking about army intelligence. There they carry out tasks in the regular composition and with standard weapons. About Lance - that's me conditionally, but there is such a list of objects and it is strictly observed. In my time there was such a book in the red cover "Fundamentals of Combat Use of Reconnaissance Units and Subdivisions of the USSR Armed Forces" (including special forces and MRP) - try to violate something or not, and the special officers will become your bosom friends. I haven’t been to Afghanistan or Chechnya, but there were many of my friends - classmates and colleagues, I didn’t learn anything new from them, except that I had heard enough about the unreal, sorry, mess. Remember Ulman? This is the highest level of lawlessness. We were taught - the task is above all! And then - bam! .. About when and how to make marches, and when and how to conduct reconnaissance, you can talk for a long time, but you can find on the net a textbook of a sergeant of reconnaissance units and read.
                      1. Sergey Aleksandrovich
                        Sergey Aleksandrovich April 30 2021 09: 36
                        0
                        The fact is that recent conflicts were not all-out wars of annihilation, for which the statutes and manuals are designed. Therefore, deviations and non-compliance do occur. RPG is of course in demand both in total war and in local conflicts. But there are tasks in which the GM-94 is much more convenient, in the city, when clearing settlements, in night reconnaissance in small groups, and in many other places where you will not meet heavy enemy armored vehicles. The choice of weapon should be, especially where it is really needed.
                      2. Doliva63
                        Doliva63 April 30 2021 17: 46
                        0
                        The Charters are not designed for wars of destruction, they are designed for any kind of war. This is an axiom. For example, Chechnya. We decided to quickly transfer the SME to the BMP from point A to point B in order to quickly solve a local problem. I don't remember whose SME it was. Because of the haste, they did not set up lateral security in the mountains, did not conduct reconnaissance. The battalion has been destroyed. I can give many examples of the stupidity of "not total war". It is not for nothing that they say that the Combat Manual was written in blood.
                        Intelligence is not engaged in "cleansing" and should not fight in the city (and anywhere else) - this is also an axiom. I do not consider ambushes or raids to be combat, because this is not a combined-arms battle, it is a special case, limited in time and scale. Intelligence at night. This is only if you fumble along the front edge, as in the Second World War. Today, well, that is, 20 years ago, of course, it was accepted differently. We conduct reconnaissance during the day, because it is better to see, but additional reconnaissance - yes, this is already at night. Example. The task of the airborne assault brigade is to land behind enemy lines, make a march and take there hell knows what (I'm not particularly aware of their affairs). But along the march there is a river and a guarded bridge. They have little intelligence. In addition, everything must be done quietly, until the roar of their helicopters. Therefore, we move out much earlier, leisurely stomp on foot to this bridge, quietly surround it, observe, that is, conduct reconnaissance. It seems that everything is clear. Disembark at dawn. At night we do additional reconnaissance, clarify that all the "targets" are in place (if not, there is still time to change the decision), quietly "remove" posts, block the guard and wait for the arrival of the brave paratroopers. In this case, the subgroups are advanced in the direction of the likely appearance of the enemy. Well, if it's quite simple. But this is not a very typical task.
                      3. Sergey Aleksandrovich
                        Sergey Aleksandrovich April 30 2021 20: 15
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                        You shouldn't catch me on the posting of battalions, it is not my level and not my level of responsibility.
                        How everything that you describe is related to the varieties of grenade launchers I do not understand.
  • Sergey Aleksandrovich
    Sergey Aleksandrovich April 26 2021 16: 27
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    GM-94 is, not nearly worse than the Americans.
  • Doliva63
    Doliva63 1 May 2021 18: 54
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    Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
    You shouldn't catch me on the posting of battalions, it is not my level and not my level of responsibility.
    How everything that you describe is related to the varieties of grenade launchers I do not understand.

    In no way laughing And I'm not catching you on anything, these are your speculations. Do you even remember the subject of discussion?