Two decades of the PAK FA project. Long way to the series


One of the experienced T-50s in flight. Photo UAC / uacrussia.ru


It is obvious that the development of promising models of military equipment is currently a complex, lengthy and expensive process. For example, almost 57 years have passed since the start of development of the advanced PAK FA aviation complex (now Su-20). Half of this period was spent on research and development, and the following years were used to conduct flight tests and prepare serial production.

First decade. Project


The PAK FA program was launched in the interests of the Russian Air Force in May 2001. Its goal was to create a new fifth-generation front-line aviation complex. The first months were spent on making plans and choosing performers. So, at the end of 2002, the Sukhoi company was chosen as the lead developer; A number of other scientific and design organizations were also involved in the project.

Unfortunately, most of the information about R&D on the PAK FA is still secret. However, it is known that during the 37s, Sukhoi and other organizations conducted a lot of research on various topics, including using flying laboratories. In addition, developments in older projects, such as the S-47 / Su of the nineties, were used in the PAK FA project. Due to this, a new project managed to implement a number of modern and promising technologies.

In 2004, Sukhoi for the first time showed the country's military and political leadership a model of the future fighter. This product was not shown to the general public, and she recognized the face of the future aircraft much later. After the first closed show, the project moved to a new stage, preceding the construction of the prototype.


Joint flight of prototypes. Wikimedia Commons Photos

In 2006, construction of a glider for ground and strength tests began in Komsomolsk-on-Amur. He was handed over to the testers in 2009. At the end of that year, the so-called integrated full-scale stand for ground tests. Finally, in December 2007, the laying of the first flight model, known as the T-50-1, took place. It was rolled out in 2009 and transferred to ground tests.

Against the background of preparation for the tests appeared news about the export future of PAK FA. In 2008, Russia and India agreed to develop the FGFA project - a version of a fighter for sale to foreign countries. The joint production technique was proposed to be delivered to the Indian Air Force, as well as sold to third countries.

Second decade. Test


The path from the first instructions of the leadership to the start of flight tests, the PAK FA program has passed in less than nine years. In January 2010, the first prototype fighter began jogging. On January 29, the first test flight took place, giving a start to a new stage.

By its first "anniversary" the project has already shown new successes. So, in early March 2011 - shortly before the decade of launching the program - the first flight of the second prototype T-50-2 took place. Soon a very high-profile event took place - the T-50 first overcame the sound barrier. A few months later, the aircraft was first shown to the public at the MAKS-2011 salon. In the same year, a third car was launched for testing, and a year later a fourth. In October 2013, the T-50-5 aircraft was lifted into the air, becoming the last aircraft of the so-called. the first stage.


The fourth take-off prototype. Photo UAC / uacrussia.ru

The sixth flight model became the "prototype of the second stage"; he flew in November 2016. At the same time, he produced a sample for static tests. Then in 2016-2017. flight tests of four more cars began.

Thus, from 2006 to 2017, KnAAPO / KnAAZ built more than a dozen T-50 aircraft, including various kinds of samples for ground tests. Aircraft were built according to two versions of the project and significantly differed from each other both in design and in equipment.

The second half of the tenth years was spent on the final stage of flight tests, in parallel with which preparations were made for serial production. In addition, during this period, the T-50 / Su-57 was involved in other projects. So, in 2019, it became known about the use of one of the experimental T-50s in the project of a heavy UAV “Hunter”. The fighter served as a flying laboratory, and also made joint flights with an unmanned vehicle.

Since the beginning of 2018, the experimental T-50s were tested in the conditions of a real combat zone. A pair of aircraft for military tests was deployed at the Khmeimim base in Syria. Fighters completed about a dozen sorties and showed their combat capabilities. At the end of 2019, new events of this kind took place.


Engine surging during a public demonstration. Wikimedia Commons Photos

Challenges of the Second Decade


The process of ground and flight testing of T-50 fighters was quite complicated and lengthy. In addition, not without various problems and accidents. Some incidents became public and for quite some time remained a topic of discussion and debate.

On August 21, 2011 at the MAKS-2011 salon, the T-50-2 prototype participated in demonstration flights, but the next take-off did not take place due to engine damage and subsequent surging. In June 2014, during tests at the LII them. Gromov there was a fire in the T-50-5. A noticeable part of the glider burned out, but the aircraft was restored and returned to testing at the end of 2015.

Against the background of flight tests, there were disputes with the expected foreign customer. The Indian Air Force regularly criticized PAK FA and FGFA projects and threatened to break off cooperation. In April 2018, the threats were realized, and India withdrew from the project. The reason for this decision was called the insufficient characteristics of the aircraft and the mismatch of on-board equipment with existing wishes.

Third decade. Series


50 years have passed since the day of the first test flight of the T-1-10 aircraft. During this time, Sukhoi and related organizations managed to conduct a full cycle of flight tests and organize serial production. For a number of reasons, the expected delivery dates of the first production vehicles were repeatedly shifted, but so far all such problems have been resolved.


An experienced Su-57 accompanies the S-70 Hunter UAV. Photo by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation

In August 2018, the first contract for the serial Su-57 appeared. It provided for the supply of only two cars in the coming years. In June 2019, a larger agreement appeared. The Ministry of Defense ordered 76 aircraft with delivery during 2020-27. It soon became known that the PAK FA program officially entered the stage of mass production of equipment.

Reportedly, the first production Su-57 was built by the beginning of winter 2019. In December, it passed flight tests before being handed over to the customer. Unfortunately, the car never reached the troops. December 24, during another test flight, the fighter crashed; the pilot catapulted. The causes of the incident have not yet been published.

Meanwhile, KnAAZ continues to build a new generation of serial fighters. In the near future is expected to roll out a new aircraft. He will become the first transferred to the troops. According to media reports, the loss of the first serial Su-57 should not have a significant impact on the mass production process.

What will happen in the near future is already clear. The industry will release several dozen new aircraft and transfer them to the armed forces. First, the equipment will go to the Center for combat use and retraining of flight personnel, and then the fighters will disperse to combat units. Thus, in the second half of the twenties, VKSs will receive in sufficient quantities and master fundamentally new equipment with special capabilities.

Two decades of the PAK FA project. Long way to the series
The first production Su-57 under construction. The car was lost in December 2019. Photo by Paralay.iboards.ru

Long way


Second decade in stories The PAK FA / T-50 / Su-57 project is coming to an end with all the desired results. Experienced equipment has passed the necessary tests and is involved in fundamentally new projects, mass production has begun, and the troops are waiting for the first deliveries. The third decade will pass under the banner of mass construction and the annual delivery of large quantities of aircraft.

It should be noted that the process of developing, testing and starting production turned out to be quite long. Moreover, it took longer than originally planned. However, even with all such problems and difficulties, the desired results were nevertheless obtained. Production is deployed, and the videoconferencing team is preparing to take the news.
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  1. svp67 30 January 2020 18: 03 New
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    Production is deployed, and the videoconferencing team is preparing to take the news.
    How did this "swallow" WAIT. I wish success to our aircraft builders. WORK GUYS !!!
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    1. Passing 30 January 2020 21: 33 New
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      Yes, what is not clear here, they are waiting for a full version, with an engine of the second stage, but for now they will rivet little by little. That’s even a specific deadline, by the year 2027 they will start the engine of the second stage, perhaps they will also modify the stealth, and in 2027 a really massive purchase will go.
      1. Alt-right 30 January 2020 22: 04 New
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        Quote: Passing by
        perhaps also stealth modify

        I’m also interested in such improvements. Will manufacturers fight to reduce thermal visibility using flat nozzles or will they pretend that a hefty airplane is brisker than a thermal-guided missile, which is several times smaller.
        And yes, flat nozzles are not a panacea, but still ...
        1. Passing 30 January 2020 22: 20 New
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          There will be no flat nozzles. That's for sure. And in terms of thermal visibility, there are options without nozzles. For example, the bypass ratio of the engine. More cold air, less thermal signature. It seems that on the engine of the first stage it is a variable of 0,2-0,4, while in F22 it is 0,2. Those. maybe I don’t know for sure, the Su-57 without flat nozzles is less noticeable in the thermal range. Although ... the engines not shielded by the gondola do not inspire optimism.
          1. opus 30 January 2020 23: 28 New
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            Quote: Passing by
            For example, the bypass ratio of the engine. More cold air, less thermal signature.

            no need to whistle
            1. The bypass ratio K from 0,5 to 2 are engines on aircraft designed to fly at high subsonic and supersonic speeds
            if K> 2, then this is most likely an engine for a passenger SUBLINE sound or transporter, because a large bypass ratio means a large air consumption, which implies, in turn, large diameters of the engine. And this can’t afford any fighter
            Pratt & Whitney F100-PW-229 (0,4 bypass ratio)

            and PD-14

            2.P = G (c - v), here P is the engine thrust, G is the air flow through the engine (kg / s), c is the velocity of the gas stream from the engine (m / s), v is the flight speed (m /from). From this formula it is clearly seen that the higher the speed of the jet, the higher the thrust of the engine.
            jet velocity can be obtained only (in fact) by temperature.
            а
            High bypass engines are most efficient
            with large degrees of heating, those. at high gas temperature in front of the turbine

            this temperature is not going anywhere-> to the casing-> further by radiation and heat transfer by an incoming air flow

            The main elements of a gas turbine engine, determining its intensity
            thermal radiation are:
            - blades of the last stage of a gas turbine;
            - internal surfaces and structural elements of the afterburner and
            jet nozzles located in the gas path;
            - a jet of high temperature gas exiting the nozzle.

            3. The use of flat nozzles due to the shielding of the hot elements of the engine path and intensive mixing of the output flat stream of hot gas with outside air makes it possible to effectively reduce IR radiation in unforced modes.
            1. Vladimir_2U 31 January 2020 03: 51 New
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              As usual, a set of something there that does not confirm the point of view. Comparison of a turbojet and turbofan engine especially.
              1. Monar 31 January 2020 05: 31 New
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                As far as I know, a turbofan is a turbojet with a bypass of more than 2.
                Perhaps in the dimensions of the fighter they will make such a dvigun in the future. But today, the increase in bypass for such products is not realistic.
                1. Vladimir_2U 31 January 2020 05: 53 New
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                  But for the F-100, the degree of 0,4 is indicated, and for the F-119 it is simply "Low bypass ratio", and why would a higher degree not reduce the total temperature of the jet? Indeed, in essence, the second circuit is “cold” air and the more it is, the lower the overall temperature. And certainly
                  Quote: opus
                  intensive mixing of the output flat stream of hot gas with outside air
                  the bypass will ensure this mixing is not worse than flat nozzles.
                  Quote: opus
                  2.P = G (c - v), here P is the engine thrust, G is the air flow through the engine (kg / s), c is the velocity of the gas stream from the engine (m / s), v is the flight speed (m /from). From this formula it is clearly seen that the higher the speed of the jet, the higher the thrust of the engine.
                  jet velocity can be obtained only (in fact) by temperature.
                  And this is just a PC, where here the dependence of traction on temperature, even t is not indicated here at all. Opus constantly drags a bunch of graphs and formulas most likely without understanding their essence, and so, it touches somehow, and very well.
                  1. Monar 31 January 2020 06: 15 New
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                    Quote: Vladimir_2U
                    the bypass will ensure this mixing is not worse than flat nozzles.

                    I agree. The question is how to fit this into the dimensions of a fighter. Only two options.
                    Drive a large flow of air without compression (as in passo and trucks) and get cold air at the outlet.
                    Drive a large air flow in the dimensions of the engines of the fighter with strong compression and get hot air at the outlet. It is clear that lower than the temperature of the jet, but how much ...
                    The fact remains one. Dvigunov for modern fighters with a high degree of bypass is not and not a foresight. They can not or are not effective in this case, here. Designers better know. In my humble opinion, here most likely the restriction imposes flying on supersonic.
                    1. Vladimir_2U 31 January 2020 06: 33 New
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                      Well, yes, including the forehead of the turbine must be hidden and the more it is the more difficult. And the mixing can also be arranged for round nozzles, I have no doubt, and even screening, only there will be nothing left of all aspects.
              2. opus 31 January 2020 09: 52 New
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                Quote: Vladimir_2U
                As usual, a set of something there that does not confirm the point of view.

                as usual could not realize, but spilled the poison.
                at Volodenka they (comments) are all out of place and about what. I forgot that it’s not there that you always handed over mathematics by 5k?
                Quote: Vladimir_2U
                Comparison of turbojet and turbofan

                MA for mesenya have always been a mystery

                1.
                Quote: opus
                Bypass ratio K from 0,5 to 2 are engines on aircraft designed for flight at high subsonic and supersonic speeds
                if K> 2

                2. Turbofan engine in popular literature commonly called turbojet dual-circuit engine (turbojet engine) with high (above 2) bypass ratio
                Quote: Vladimir_2U
                And this is just a PC, where here the dependence of traction on temperature

                Kaneshno ", I wrote above UO

                Quote: opus
                as usual could not realize, but spilled the poison

                Quote: opus
                This formula clearly shows that the greater the speed of the jet, the higher engine thrust.
                speed jet can be obtained only (in fact) temperature.

                Need to chew
                Quote: Vladimir_2U
                a bunch of graphs and formulas

                or so it will
                ?
                Quote: Vladimir_2U
                the bypass will ensure this mixing is not worse than flat nozzles.

                Why indulge the fact of what-thread in the studio "please be kind"?
                1. Vladimir_2U 31 January 2020 11: 39 New
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                  Quote: opus
                  Bypass ratio K from 0,5 to 2 are engines on aircraft designed for flight at high subsonic and supersonic speeds
                  Yes Yes
                  Quote: opus
                  Pratt & Whitney F100-PW-229 (0,4 bypass ratio)
                  The fact that raising the bypass not even to 2 but to 1,2 will increase this parameter by a factor of THREE my UO allows me to calculate, and your powerful intellect does not allow you, so it means semi-powerful (PMI abbreviated).
                  Quote: opus
                  The bypass ratio K from 0,5 to 2 have engines standing on
                  Oh, but what about the F100-PW-229 (0,4 bypass ratio) Is he already everything, not a turbojet engine? Or F-119, which
                  Quote: Passing by
                  It seems that on the engine of the first stage it is a variable of 0,2-0,4, while in F22 it is 0,2
                  and at all 0,2, also not a turbofan engine?
                  Quote: opus
                  2.P = G (c - v), here P is the engine thrust, G is the air flow through the engine (kg / s), c is the velocity of the gas stream from the engine (m / s), v is the flight speed (m /with)
                  Well, chew up, where is the dependence on temperature, with your PMI it’s the same time to spit.
                  Quote: opus
                  the bypass will ensure this mixing is not worse than flat nozzles.
                  Why indulge the fact of what-thread in the studio "please be kind"?
                  from the same article, where did you get a powerful formula for the influence of temperature on traction, without even indicating a temperature symbol, you brought:
                  The fact is that turbofan engines can be of two types: with mixing flows and without it. That is, the flow of the second circuit can, from the moment of separation with the flow of the first, pass independently to exit the engine and leave it through its own nozzle. It will be an engine without mixing flows.
                  But two streams can mix. This usually happens in the so-called mixing chamber. And then the mixed flow with the common temperature and pressure leaves the engine through a common nozzle

                  To chew you, that when mixing hot and cold, the temperature of hot decreases a little or guess yourself?
                  http://avia-simply.ru/trdd/ так себе кстати источник, хотя ваш полумогучий интеллект и его целиком не осилил, разжалуем его в четвертьмогучий интеллект (ЧМИ). Уж не знаю, осилит ли ваш ЧМИ тот факт, что расход воздуха и скорость истечения второго контура можно увеличить без увеличения диаметра компрессора, а за счёт увеличения частоты вращения, к примеру, или добавления ступени компрессора.
                  In the theory of gas turbine engines, the following parameters of a multistage compressor are usually used:
                  a) the degree of pressure increase (the ratio of the total air pressure behind the compressor to the total pressure in front of the compressor);
                  b) second air flow through the compressor;
                  at) compressor rotor speed;
                  d) adiabatic efficiency of the compressor.

                  Theory of gas turbine engines (V. M. Korneev)
            2. Passing 31 January 2020 17: 04 New
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              Quote: opus
              no need to whistle

              I didn’t understand what exactly I “whistled” for, all your arguments or general arguments “about the structure of the universe”, or absolutely nothing contradict my thesis. In my support, I will add more specifics:
              Let's take a look at the facts:
              For F-22 (https://www.forecastinternational.com/archive/disp_pdf.cfm?DACH_RECNO=901)
              Pratt's F119-PW-100 engine is a straightforward design turbofan with a bypass ratio of 0.2: 1

              F119-PW-100 flat nozzle with a bypass ratio 0,2
              For F-35 (http://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14070)
              Bypass ratio, (F135-PW-100, -400) 0.57; (F135-PW-600), conventional flight 0.56

              at F135-PW round nozzle with a bypass ratio 0,56
              The conclusion is obvious. This is certainly not iron proof, but as indirect very, very ...
        2. Alexey LK 1 February 2020 22: 18 New
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          Quote: Alt-Right
          And yes, flat nozzles are not a panacea, but still ...

          If not a panacea, then maybe you should not bother with them, because it is also a decrease in traction. Laser jamming stations - a more suitable option for missiles with infrared seeker, especially for short distances. However, it’s possible that developments will appear on flat nozzles in connection with the topic PAK YES (he needs it) - then in the future the SU-57M may receive them - who knows ...
      2. marmalade 30 January 2020 22: 40 New
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        in 2027, competitors will already have a series of 6 on a flight test and 5 will be already 5 ++
        1. Nick 31 January 2020 00: 48 New
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          Quote: Marmalade
          in 2027, competitors will already have a series of 6 on a flight test and 5 will be already 5 ++

          Give a tooth? The competition and the fifth does not go. We decided to return to the good old F-15.
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            1. Nick 31 January 2020 04: 04 New
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              Quote: Marmalade
              and why should I give a tooth? - it will be like this, just don’t have to scream cheers cheers but you need to turn on your head .. although the site is now propagandistic and the Kremlin’s sea is here ... everything is limited today to the development of science and technology

              You have a problem with the arguments.
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                1. Nick 31 January 2020 04: 07 New
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                  Quote: Marmalade
                  drain is counted to you - what else to say hi

                  Again without arguments.
                  1. marmalade 31 January 2020 04: 09 New
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                    at first you didn’t explain your words to me or to people — once you enter into a conversation, you need to enter into arguments, and you have verbiage about anything — I leaked you 3 times .. streamline
                    1. Nick 31 January 2020 04: 11 New
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                      Quote: Marmalade
                      at first you didn’t explain your words to me or to people — once you enter into a conversation, you need to enter into arguments, and you have verbiage about anything — I leaked you 3 times .. streamline

                      So you do not give arguments alone allegations. Only about drain and repeat. Plumber along the way.
                      1. marmalade 31 January 2020 04: 14 New
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                        dude, if you’re on the Internet, and here you have your own laws and etiquette, do you think yes? draining this verbiage on the opponent’s arguments from the absence of counterarguments is considered a disgrace and shkkvar .. now it’s clear? the conversation with the troll is closed
                      2. Nick 31 January 2020 04: 15 New
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                        Quote: Marmalade
                        dude, if you’re on the Internet, and here you have your own laws and etiquette, do you think yes? draining this verbiage on the opponent’s arguments from the absence of counterarguments is considered a disgrace and shkkvar .. now it’s clear? the conversation with the troll is closed

                        Yes, you are also a boor.
                      3. marmalade 31 January 2020 04: 18 New
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                        still some if a person is not responsible for his words, success and health to you hi
                      4. Nick 31 January 2020 04: 23 New
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                        I am responsible for your own, and you are responsible for your verbiage.
  3. Alexey LK 1 February 2020 22: 30 New
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    Quote: Marmalade
    in 2027, competitors will already have a series of 6 on a flight test

    Perhaps you meant the 6th generation when you wrote "6th series"? ... But first, try to formulate at least clear criteria for such a generation - how exactly should it differ fundamentally from the 5th? Because "in the literature" this question is still very far from clarity, if at all, sometime it will be resolved. For example, we are not discussing the 6th generation of sailing ships now - it is possible that something could have been invented in theory, but why? So here - all sorts of innovations in the field of electronics and aviation weapons have not yet brought the plane (fighter in this case) to the next generation - we need a fundamentally new stage in the design of the airframe or power plant. Even the “drone” does not give the 6th generation - unless we can talk about the first drone. Now, if there are developments on engines for hypersound, or access to the upper atmosphere / near space, or weapons appear that require completely different energy - then yes, we can talk about the next generation. But while it is completely unclear where and in what the next breakthrough will occur, there is no point in talking about the 6th generation of jet fighters.
  • Artemiy_2 1 February 2020 16: 40 New
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    "Vyser" to the public suffering from constipation of the "organism".

    Why are you talking so badly about yourself?
  • NF68 30 January 2020 18: 16 New
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    Catching up is always harder. Especially after the collapse of almost the entire defense industry.
    1. Ross xnumx 30 January 2020 18: 27 New
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      Quote: NF68
      Catching up is always harder. Especially after the collapse of almost the entire defense industry.

      Was there a war? Or "adversaries" flew? I remember how engineers and technicians became shuttles so as not to die from the Gaidar-Chubais “happiness” ...
      For eight post-war years, Stalin managed to cope with all the problems, and these "leaders" for thirty years could not pull away the Soviet legacy.
      Only hear these edro-whiners. Either they got a bad economy, then they get in the way of sanctions, then embezzlement and corruption, then mediocrity got into the government, then the heads of furniture production and teachers of Roman law into ministers ... We need to work more and eat less. And think not about villas and yachts, but about aviation and the navy ...
      1. NF68 30 January 2020 18: 40 New
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        Quote: ROSS 42
        Was there a war? Or "adversaries" flew?


        It was even worse since the adversaries nevertheless flew-internal and they turned out to be much more dangerous than adversaries from outside.
      2. EvilLion 31 January 2020 09: 23 New
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        And why exactly for 8? And in the USSR, complete happiness came?
        1. Ross xnumx 31 January 2020 10: 45 New
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          Quote: EvilLion
          And why exactly for 8?

          You are right, the error came out:
          In 1948, in 2,5 years, the country's pre-war economic level was restored. For comparison, after the Civil War, the pre-war level of 1913 of Tsarist Russia was restored in 6 years.

          belay
      3. Edik 31 January 2020 09: 43 New
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        Quote: ROSS 42
        Was there a war? Or "adversaries" flew? I remember how engineers and technicians became shuttles so as not to die from the Gaidar-Chubais “happiness” ...

        The demographic losses of Russia in the 90s were, according to the most conservative estimates of 10 million people + unborn about 2 million. And now Russia pays for it a demographic pit.

        Human losses are comparable to war, not to mention economic losses, breaking production chains, losing markets, uncompetitive production, lack of money among the population! Do not you find that it looks like something like a war?
        Quote: ROSS 42
        Stalin in eight post-war years coped with all the problems

        Well, he didn’t personally manage himself, although he was, as they say, “dictator” with the authority of the tsar, do you agree? It was the people of the USSR who, for a minimal fee, did more ideological than material, working to the limit! cold! Since everyone understood that they would crush us if we did not restore the country in the shortest possible time.You Now not a lot of stress, you will arrange such a howl, not like now!
        Quote: ROSS 42
        and these "leaders" for thirty years could not plunder the Soviet legacy.

        Do you agree with me that ten years of downtime for “competitive” production is practically death? The production left as a legacy from the USSR of Russia was in the form of private property, a destroyed, uncompetitive production base! They could not compete even in our market, not to mention others!
        Quote: ROSS 42
        Only hear these edro-whiners. Then they got a bad economy

        And this is so! The USSR ruined its economy with a printing press, printing more money than there were goods and services! Want to figure it out, I have it.
        https://www.cbr.ru/Content/Document/File/48220/ArchivalFonds_014.pdf
        https://www.cbr.ru/Content/Document/File/48219/ArchivalFonds_015.pdf
        Quote: ROSS 42
        then sanctions prevent them

        You are a wonderful person! This is not against “Russia” sanctions have been imposed, it is against you and me as well.
        The price of annexation ”: Bloomberg calculated the losses of Russia for 5 years of“ reunification ”with the Crimea.

        Quote: ROSS 42
        then embezzlement and corruption

        It's you who ride it, endlessly! Corruption has always been and will be in human society, and in the USSR it was also a birthmark.
        Quote: ROSS 42
        You need to work harder and eat less.

        Well, now, if we all eat less and work harder then the example of China is before our eyes! I hope you will not argue that there is no communism in China, but there are market relations and these same "oligarchs"?
        Quote: ROSS 42
        And think not about villas and yachts, but about aviation and the navy ...

        Do not think, they are already thinking for you!
        In terms of combat readiness, the Russian army ranks second in the world!
        1. Bad_gr 3 February 2020 12: 05 New
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          Quote: Edik
          The price of annexation ”: Bloomberg calculated the losses of Russia for 5 years of“ reunification ”with the Crimea.

          And without Crimea sanctions would be imposed. How many of them have been introduced recently for far-fetched reasons.
    2. rudolff 30 January 2020 18: 37 New
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      Not all defense industry enterprises were ruined. The same Sukhoi very well survived the 90s, and since the beginning of the 2000s, as generally as cheese in butter ...
      1. NF68 30 January 2020 18: 41 New
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        Quote: rudolff
        Not all defense industry enterprises were ruined. The same Sukhoi very well survived the 90s, and since the beginning of the 2000s, as generally as cheese in butter ...


        This is one of not many exceptions.
        1. Nick 31 January 2020 01: 17 New
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          Quote: NF68
          Quote: rudolff
          Not all defense industry enterprises were ruined. The same Sukhoi very well survived the 90s, and since the beginning of the 2000s, as generally as cheese in butter ...


          This is one of not many exceptions.

          JSC Concern East Kazakhstan Almaz-Antey, Sukhoi Aviation Holding Company, Irkut Scientific-Production Corporation, Ufa Motor-Industrial Production Association, Northern Machine-Building Enterprise Production Association, Rostvertol Helicopter Production Complex OJSC Rostvertol, Uralvagonzavod Scientific and Production Corporation named after F.E. Dzerzhinsky "," Ulan-Ude Aviation Plant "," United Aircraft Corporation "and" Kazan Helicopter Plant "
          Source: https://realnoevremya.ru/articles/64588-top-100-oboronnyh-kompaniy-rossii
          These are only 10 of the largest “exceptions”.
    3. Nick 31 January 2020 01: 08 New
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      Quote: NF68
      Catching up is always harder. Especially after the collapse of almost the entire defense industry.

      Yeah. The Abrams plant in Detroit is shut down. There was only a tank repair left, the aircraft carriers forgot how to do it, the long-suffering J. Ford, they cannot finish it for 12 years, the F-35 fighter has not been brought to mind in 16 years. We decided to return to the old F-15 developed already in 1972. Nuclear technology lost, Westinghouse, a company that produces nuclear fuel and other materials, successfully went bankrupt in 2017.
      In short, they can’t catch up with Russia.
  • rudolff 30 January 2020 18: 26 New
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    It will be possible to breathe lightly only when the car with the engines of the second stage goes into the series.
    1. bk316 30 January 2020 18: 39 New
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      Well, if you find fault, then it will be possible to breathe easier when the whole series arrives in the army, with the engines of the second stage laughing and we will have a hundred of these birds.
  • Kleber 30 January 2020 18: 43 New
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    Unfortunately, most of the information about R&D on the PAK FA is still secret.


    This is fortunately, not unfortunately. There is nothing our R&D to know for all who are not lazy.
    1. Alt-right 30 January 2020 22: 06 New
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      Quote: Kleber
      This is fortunately, not unfortunately. There is nothing our R&D to know for all who are not lazy.

      That is yes. This is especially true, in practice, of all sorts of "strategic partners"! bully
  • Amateur 30 January 2020 18: 52 New
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    Sorry, most of the information about R&D on the PAK FA remains secret.

    Not unfortunately, but fortunately. Otherwise, any copywriters - the Chinese or the same Indians - will be able to use the billions of rubles and scientific groundwork. The author for whom is "a fan"?
  • master 52 30 January 2020 19: 11 New
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    it’s better to at least do something and it pleases, but for a long time yes few orders but the most important thing is the operating time and experience gained during construction
  • Demagogue 30 January 2020 19: 21 New
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    The Su-57 is definitely the right aircraft. But this is not the 5th generation. Yes, in the end it will be better in a number of ways than Rafal, for example, but it is not a full-fledged stealth. It is rather a transition machine before the introduction of real stealth. Generation 4.5, and it could hardly have been otherwise. It's bad that nothing is heard about the development of a new machine. There is only talk about resuscitation of the Yak-141 line, which, if implemented at the 5th generation level, would solve the problem. Losing time again. And aviation decides everything in modern wars. No s-600 will replace it.
    1. Sky strike fighter 30 January 2020 20: 15 New
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      What do you think the Su-57 falls short of how you put it, "real stealth"? Only more specifics and less demagogy. And specifically why is it not a full-fledged stealth? Facts in the studio. Transition cars between 4 and 5 generations.
      these are the Mig-35 and Su-35, which have no stealth and afterburning supersonic.
      1. Firelake 31 January 2020 09: 23 New
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        1. There is no S-shaped bar: the engine is visible in the front surface.
        2. No flat nozzle: worse IR stealth.
        3. There is no 2nd engine yet.

        In general, the car is needed. But it is precisely that which is transitional.
        1. EvilLion 31 January 2020 12: 35 New
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          Do you know how the S-shaped air intake affects traction, and why does the Su-57 have engines at a certain angle? By the way, full-time flat nozzles are the same, a serious loss of thrust of all-round deflection. It is strange that you envy the dubious of those. decisions.
          1. Firelake 3 February 2020 11: 18 New
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            Over-maneuverability: is it needed?
        2. Artemiy_2 1 February 2020 16: 42 New
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          1. There is no S-shaped bar: the engine is visible in the front surface.
          2. No flat nozzle: worse IR stealth.
          3. There is no 2nd engine yet.

          All this is not in the f-35
          1. Firelake 3 February 2020 11: 16 New
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            The nozzle is ordinary. S-shaped fence. And on the third point: we do not have the Andean Whitney Pratt. Of course it is sad. But such is life.
    2. Nick 31 January 2020 01: 20 New
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      Quote: Demagogue
      The Su-57 is definitely the right aircraft. But this is not the 5th generation

      Su-57 Fifth generation. And you are a demagogue.
    3. bk316 31 January 2020 10: 49 New
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      real stealth.

      And for you, the fifth generation and stealth are the same thing?
      And if a stealth is completely stealth, it does not have over-maneuverability or is it fifth generation over-the-air supersonic?
      And in general, with what ERP does stealth start? Talking about the need for S-shaped air intakes or flat nozzles is simply illiterate, because these are engineering solutions, and a low EPR can be achieved by other solutions.
      1. Firelake 3 February 2020 11: 21 New
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        Question:
        How to close the compressor if not S shaped? While there is such a solution and it works. At 22 and at 35. We do not have it. Perhaps because of the engine. The collapse of the engines is associated with reducing the thermal footprint.
        1. Bad_gr 3 February 2020 12: 12 New
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          Quote: FireLake
          How to close the compressor if not S shaped?

          As well as on the Tu-160: the shape of the front vanes redirects the radar radiation to the absorbing walls of the air intake.
          1. Firelake 3 February 2020 12: 13 New
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            160 glows like a lamp.
            1. Bad_gr 3 February 2020 12: 14 New
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              Quote: FireLake
              160 glows like a lamp.

              Where does this data come from?
        2. bk316 3 February 2020 12: 16 New
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          How to close the compressor if not S shaped?

          Have you heard anything about the basic radar equation? laughing
          One feels if they have heard, then there is no sense or solutions.
          I will explain for non-mathematicians. This is the very effective reflective surface.
          And in the equation, the integral over the surface and the integrand is a function of surface currents.
          This means that you can even assemble a configuration with a small EPR from corner reflectors and an active device.
  • senima56 30 January 2020 19: 23 New
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    I remember how, as the Deputy Prime Minister, Mr. S. Ivanov then oversaw our “aircraft industry” and promised that in 2013 (??? !!!) PAK FA / T-50 will go into production! I heard and saw it on TV! negative
    Maybe that’s why Mr. Ivanov S. is no longer deputy prime minister and is engaged in what he considers tigers in the taiga, i.e. is "in place" !? fool
  • smaug78 30 January 2020 19: 27 New
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    “Industry will release dozens of new aircraft and transfer them to the armed forces. Thus, in the second half of the twenties, VKS will receive in sufficient quantities and master fundamentally new equipment with special capabilities.” Again propaganda in the worst traditions of the late USSR (((
  • Cowbra 30 January 2020 20: 00 New
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    Yes, actually in time it’s just fine. F-35 is an ASTOVL program. 1988 - Count It Yourself
    1. Alt-right 30 January 2020 22: 21 New
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      Quote: Cowbra
      F-35 is an ASTOVL program.

      F-35 is JSF actually (Joint Strike Fighter) and this is already 1996.
      1. Cowbra 30 January 2020 22: 23 New
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        The CALF was a DARPA program to develop a STOVL strike fighter (SSF) for the United States Marine Corps and replacement for the F-16 Fighting Falcon.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Strike_Fighter_program
        Well, how can I tell you)))
        1. Alt-right 30 January 2020 22: 28 New
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          Quote: Cowbra
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Strike_Fighter_program
          Well, how can I tell you)))

          So say: There was a wandering around papers and concepts!)
          But such moments can be discussed endlessly. As for me, it’s much more important when the first flight prototype was rolled out, or at least when these walks around the concept ended.
          1. Cowbra 30 January 2020 22: 54 New
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            I just. as far as I remember, and in tanks. and on airplanes - in peacetime, entry is always long - but it is logical - there is no war. and we’ll take it into service without jambs ... The Harrier guns who didn’t fire cannons at all also fired at the war, and the MiG-3 wasn’t UD ... because it makes sense to take a crude fighter now? Is it burning? We remove the jambs, then we look.
            That's why I am laughing, the F-35 collapsed in November last year at the army acceptance - the army did not accept it, about 600 flaws. over 10 months of testing, an average of 11% of fighters were combat-ready. And THIS is delivered to the troops ... "Limited combat capability." What is it like? "Hey, boy, go defend your homeland, on those rifles - it is of limited use. Shoots! Well. Not always ... And not there ... But it shoots, hold on, fighter!"
            1. Alt-right 30 January 2020 23: 29 New
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              Quote: Cowbra
              I just. as far as I remember, and in tanks. and on airplanes - in peacetime, entry is always long - but it is logical - there is no war.

              There is 1 more moment. forcing events requires more investment, which means a conditional program is becoming more expensive.
              Quote: Cowbra
              That's why I am laughing, the F-35 collapsed in November last year at the army acceptance - the army did not accept it, about 600 flaws. over 10 months of testing, an average of 11% of fighters were combat-ready. And THIS is delivered to the troops ... "Limited combat capability." What is it like? "Hey, boy, go defend your homeland, on those rifles - it is of limited use. Shoots! Well. Not always ... And not there ... But it shoots, hold on, fighter!"

              The main obosrams of this program is the volume of pre-orders.
              It is because of this that all this fierce game with the F-35 is happening! Here it’s no wonder to do it so hard, because the degree of technical novelty / risks is beyond the limit, and the deadlines, due to pre-orders, are straining.
              But there is no other way: If the USA wants to get, in fact, a single “second line” fighter, they will have to push through this “commercial stealth”, because the cost of the program is prohibitive even by the standards of the states.
              But there are pluses: Most programs for light aircraft carriers simply can not do without the F-35B.
              PS Yes, F-35B - This is the only modification that can’t cruise to supersonic, but with grief in half it is better than Harrier, which, moreover, is no longer produced.
              1. Firelake 31 January 2020 09: 34 New
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                Harier has been outdated for 10 years already.
                And 35 as a replacement is quite normal. Although their problems are fun)
  • Demagogue 30 January 2020 20: 43 New
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    Quote: Sky Strike fighter
    What do you think the Su-57 falls short of how you put it, "real stealth"? Only more specifics and less demagogy. And specifically why is it not a full-fledged stealth? Facts in the studio. Transition cars between 4 and 5 generations.
    these are the Mig-35 and Su-35, which have no stealth and afterburning supersonic.


    Cool what))) specificity is necessary. And unshielded rpm engines are not visible? A few m2 EPR despite the fact that on the stealth every hundredth is considered. Plus visibility in the IR range. On Rafale, for example, the engine is closed and the exhaust cooling is standing. And the Su-57 glows like a Christmas tree. In an attack mission, the chances of going back due to open engines are plummeting. Because of them, an air defense missile can see the outgoing aircraft even against the background of the surface. In aerial combat, rockets of the centuries will cling precisely to these engines. To call a plane the 5th generation does not mean that it is. On the same Rafale is full RPM, radar afar, the engine is closed, but it is not stealth. And the su-57 is not stealth.
    1. Sky strike fighter 30 January 2020 23: 51 New
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      On engines for the Su-57.
      Also, the engine should have significantly less noticeability in the infrared and radio waves. This is achieved by the special design of the nozzle and air intake. A serious aspect of the new engine is also a decrease in the cost of the machine’s life cycle - less maintenance costs, more overhaul life, ”said Marchukov about new power plants.

      Nozzles and vanes

      A flat nozzle is being developed for the new engine, which will be installed on Su-57 fighters from the mid-2020s. Typically, such an apparatus is two movable plates mounted on an S-shaped channel at the output of a jet engine. In particular, this was done on the fifth-generation F-22 Raptor American fighter.

      Such a nozzle, together with an S-shaped channel hiding the red-hot blades of an engine turbine, reduces the infrared visibility of a combat aircraft for surveillance systems, including infrared search and tracking systems. However, this same technical solution introduces additional resistance for outflowing gases, due to which engine characteristics deteriorate by an average of 2-3 percent.

      https://zen.yandex.ru/media/nplus1/kak-razrabatyvaetsia-i-kakim-budet-dvigatel-dlia-istrebitelei-piatogo-pokoleniia-su57-5dcd9f6640e93148148a3876
      Well, Rafal is definitely not a stealth. His counterpart is the Mig-35. But the Su-57 is the most stealth, like the F-35.
    2. EvilLion 31 January 2020 09: 28 New
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      Did you accurately determine the EPR from a photograph? Well then, why don't you work in intelligence? They are needed there.
    3. EvilLion 31 January 2020 12: 40 New
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      A few sq. meters - this is the entire Su-27, sit down two. But even for the 4th generation, about 1 square meter is possible. m do. Rafal is not geometrically trying to be a stealth. What would be the main criterion. Well, the EPR F-117 EMNIP is 0.025, and he’s going to oppose this matter, that is, what for every hundredth, any existing plane has more EPR than the F-117, by definition.
  • L-39NG 30 January 2020 21: 11 New
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    Guys. what are you talking about? In 2011, they stood with Vova in Zhukovsky, in a crowd of guards and jackets, and they showed us the Su-57, then, some kind of responsible person tried to impress me that they did not show him to us and he (the plane) was not there. How can this work? Who are you holding us for? Or rather, why do you get paid there? I would have your Russa.
    1. Alt-right 30 January 2020 23: 35 New
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      Quote: L-39NG
      Guys. what are you talking about? In 2011, they stood with Vova in Zhukovsky, in a crowd of guards and jackets, and they showed us the Su-57, then, some kind of responsible person tried to impress me that they did not show him to us and he (the plane) was not there. How can this work? Who are you holding us for? Or rather, why do you get paid there? I would have your Russa.

      When I was working in Ramensky district, Su-57s flew over me closer than at MAKS they do it. There was a case before MAKS. Even before the past, when he was statically shown at the stand. And yes, in 2011 he was also. +1 as they say.
  • Zaurbek 30 January 2020 22: 13 New
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    An interesting comparison of the cost price for the Su35 vs Su57 series
  • Ioannis Andris 30 January 2020 22: 34 New
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    Forgive me for the fact that I do not speak Russian very well, I am Greek.
    Well, I just thought .. If Russia continued to work with the interrupted MiG 1.44 fighter, wouldn't it be better? MiG 1.44 made its first flight in 2000. Even assuming a lengthy test process, in the worst case, by 2010-2012, with funding, batch production was supposed to begin. Assuming an average of 10-12 aircraft per year, today Russia will have 100+ new fighters. And yes, I know that he would most likely be inferior to the PAK FA, especially in the inconspicuous (stealth) aspect, but still ..
    1. Alt-right 30 January 2020 23: 49 New
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      Quote: Ioannis Andris
      Well, I just thought .. If Russia continued to work with the interrupted MiG 1.44 fighter, wouldn't it be better?

      MiG 1.44, like the Su-47, is simply a classic of the “conceptual denial of everything Western,” with corresponding consequences. "They tried to develop their view on the 5th generation," yeah.
      Rather wasted time. IMHO. I believe that even if there was an outright theft of ideas “somewhere out there”, if only it worked as it should, and not just utilized time / resources.
      And why do we need to duplicate the 4th generation cars? We have them and so good)
    2. EvilLion 31 January 2020 09: 35 New
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      Firstly, the MiG-1.44, even visually from the 80s with its "duck" scheme, that is, it became obsolete before it was born. Secondly, the MiG Design Bureau was already practically incapacitated. Thirdly, just then, in 2010, production of the Su-35 began. Fourth, an empty box could fly, only the PAK FA program is not only a glider, it is avionics and means of destruction specially adapted for internal placement. So to throw a 10 year late project, the solution is quite logical.
  • marmalade 30 January 2020 22: 39 New
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    while the potential opponent will finish it in the series, there will already be the 6th generation
    1. Nick 31 January 2020 01: 32 New
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      Quote: Marmalade
      while the potential opponent will finish it in the series, there will already be the 6th generation

      A potential adversary already has no fifth. Release of the F-22 was discontinued in 2008, and the F-35 was never brought to the full fifth generation.
      1. marmalade 31 January 2020 04: 01 New
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        I’m grieving you, my dear friend f-22, just the 5th generation, the closest to him, they didn’t rivet because there are no competitors .. and the f-35 will soon be 5 + generation .. do not read Soviet newspapers (our lying media)
        1. Nick 31 January 2020 04: 06 New
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          Quote: Marmalade
          I’m grieving you, my dear friend f-22, just the 5th generation, the closest to him, they didn’t rivet because there are no competitors .. and the f-35 will soon be 5 + generation .. do not read Soviet newspapers (our lying media)

          And again there are no arguments.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. Nick 31 January 2020 04: 09 New
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              Quote: Marmalade
              and again the drain is counted

              fool
              1. The comment was deleted.
                1. Nick 31 January 2020 04: 13 New
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                  Quote: Marmalade
                  I looked at your comments and profile, you are either a Kremlin boat or a patriot-note cheers, it already doesn’t make much difference .. I don’t have such conversations.

                  And you, marmalade, apparently from the minority.
                  1. The comment was deleted.
        2. EvilLion 31 January 2020 09: 45 New
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          If I buy a new video card, and it has a cut memory bus with the most advanced chip, and it does not give a performance gain compared to the old one, then I don’t care what generation it is. The Americans had the F-22 with the most advanced engines, they could do something on its basis, but they did not and gave out a stub of the “Superhornet” level according to the LTX, albeit at a higher technical level. But this has nothing to do with airplanes to gain superiority in the air. A fundamentally new aircraft is being built only to fly better than the previous ones, all sorts of sensors and radar can be put on the old one.

          When the F-22 appeared, there were no competitors. Now they are, but the F-22 is already no more than built and new ones are not expected. Doraha!
        3. bk316 31 January 2020 10: 55 New
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          f-35 will be soon generation 5+.

          Yes? In what parameters should a 5+ generation aircraft meet, dear echsperd?
  • marmalade 30 January 2020 22: 43 New
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    already su 27 with ET 27 rockets recognizes the thermal trail of engines of this type for 30-40 km and this is the 4th generation — I'm afraid to imagine how far the heat will scan f 22 with such engines on this 57 m .. so no this is not the 5th generation
  • Deniz 30 January 2020 23: 25 New
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    There will be a certain imitation of the F-35 and F-22, as the Su-30 does not reach the top F-18s, F-16s, Rafaleys. And by then, if they rivet them, it will be junk.
    1. Nick 31 January 2020 01: 39 New
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      Quote: DeniZ
      Su-30 does not reach the top F-18, F-16,

      Training fights conducted in India showed the opposite.
    2. tomket 31 January 2020 01: 50 New
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      Quote: DeniZ
      like the Su-30 does not reach the top F-18, F-16, Rafaley.

      but let me ask what exactly does not reach the su-30?
      1. Hermit21 31 January 2020 08: 52 New
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        The main problems of the Su-30SM are rather weak engines and an outdated radar. But, it seems, this will be fixed in SMD1
        1. EvilLion 31 January 2020 09: 49 New
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          Or they will prefer to euthanize them in their existing form, and then they will sell them, replacing them with the Su-57.
    3. EvilLion 31 January 2020 09: 47 New
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      Given that the F-16 Block 50/52 even has a worse radar than the MiG-29, and Rafale is generally a light bomber on the verge of under-aircraft, this can only make people laugh.
  • Nitarius 31 January 2020 05: 59 New
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    like any child .. not born immediately!
  • Hermit21 31 January 2020 08: 51 New
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    Start of the ATF program - 1981;
    The beginning of the development of fighters under the program - 1986;
    The first flight of the prototype YF-22 - 1990;
    The first flight of the pre-production F-22A - 1997;
    First deliveries to USAF - 2005;
    Completion of the issue - 2011;
    The first combat use is 2014.

    For comparison
    1. Artemiy_2 1 February 2020 16: 44 New
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      shhhh. Do not show it to local
  • viktor_ui 23 March 2020 09: 22 New
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    "The third decade will pass under the banner of mass construction and the annual commissioning of large quantities of aircraft." - remember and compare what will happen on the exhaust especially in terms of mass hi