Prospects of "Admiral Kuznetsov": there is no dock, but you hold on there!

209
If you compile everything that is, in terms of information on this topic, the output will be, to put it mildly, ambiguous. Moreover, over time, more and more intimate details of the cruiser emerge.





The main problem of today is the dock. There is no Doc, moreover, he is not even foreseen in perspective, although there are some thoughts, prospects, and so on. But no wonder the question is still hanging in the air.

But let's start in order.

So, last year, "Admiral Kuznetsov" stood up for another repair, which would have to last right up to the 2021 year. Further, as everyone knows, the dock PD-50, in which the cruiser was standing, sank. And the Admiral Kuznetsov itself, although it was damaged, was towed to the wall of the 35 shipyard.

No, not to continue the repair, just there is his regular parking lot, if that.

To complete the begun operations on docking the cruiser you need a dock. Moreover, there is still one small nuance: by the time of the disaster, the propellers were removed from the Kuznetsov to provide some work.

As I understand it correctly (the Ministry of Defense, by the way, is not that silent, the Russian ceases to understand on this topic), Kuznetsov's propellers remained there ... In PD-50.

And the situation looks more than ominous:
1. Need to raise the old screws.
2. Urgently make new ones.
3. The dock in which these screws can be put back.

Actually, item number XXUMX kills everything, because there is no dock and is not expected.

Yes, we have PD-41. In the Far East. This dock was built in 1978 by order of the USSR in Japan, is based, of course, in Fokino, and is intended for the repair of combat ships of the Pacific Fleet.



How realistic is it to transfer the dock to the North? I think this is just pure science fiction. Doc, to put it mildly (see photo) is not in a position to travel through the Northern Sea Route.

And then, and the ships from the Pacific Fleet also have to drive to the north for repairs?

The situation is generally so-so. And without any particular prospects. More precisely, the prospect is the same: it is necessary either to raise the PD-50, or to build a new dock. Otherwise, no prospects.

But the matter is very difficult, as it were with the construction of a ship larger than a corvette of a problem, wherever you go. Moreover, the dock, the more enormous, which we have never built ourselves, hatching. Even in the period of the power of the USSR.

Japanese? It is doubtful that we had problems with PD-41. It was ordered 5 docks of this type, but the Japanese agreed to build docks only on the condition that it was not for the repair of warships. And as soon as ours, having received the first one, immediately on pleasures, the warship was driven there, the agreement was broken.

Well, as if Norway is unlikely to agree to build something for us.

I don’t even want to talk about lifting the dock. It is clear that there is generally salty sadness. We are unlikely to raise such a colossus, it is clear. But, unlike the Kursk submarine, which the Dutch were raising on the high seas, it’s more than doubtful to arrange such a show in Roslyakovo.

So today, the Ministry of Defense is seriously considering the cancellation of the cruiser, if it is not possible to resolve the issue with the dock. And since the prospects are very dubious, you inevitably start scratching your head, remembering that, in addition to Kuznetsov, we are part of the North fleet still a bunch of ancient ships of the 1st rank, which without a dock will be difficult to survive.

These are both TARK project 1144.2 “Peter the Great” and “Admiral Nakhimov”, cruiser project 1164 “Ustinov”, BOD project 1155 “Severomorsk”, “Levchenko”, “Kharlamov”, “Fists”, BOD project 1155.1 “Chabanenko”.

How to deal with them is also completely incomprehensible. To drive for repairs in Fokino - sorry, I don’t think that we will amuse the whole world. So you still have to do something.

Already thinking people gave the idea. History already, of course, but in 1988, we had laid the ship, which was supposed to replace the Krechetam. This is the so-called project 1143.7, ATAVKR "Ulyanovsk". This atomic heavy aircraft-carrying cruiser was cut right on the stocks at the metal in 1992 due to lack of funds.

But the ship was pretty much more than the “Krechet” and longer by as much as 18 meters. That is, the dock did not fit. And to service these ships, a dry dock was needed after all.

And work on the creation of this dock began simultaneously with the bookmark, but alas, no luck. “Ulyanovsk” was cut, and construction movements of the dock ended at the stage of the first stage of explosive planning works.

Nevertheless, it is possible that it is worth digging in the archives. It is clear that both 40 years ago, and today, we are not able to master the floating dock. However, maybe we are able to do a dry dock on the shore? There, at the northern tip of Cape Chalmpushka? On the development of the project it would be nice to save so much ...

There is another option, but it looks quite frivolous already.

On the other side of the same Kola Bay, the company Novatek is building the so-called Kola Shipyard. Quite a large site for construction, including floating LNG plants. A floating factory is a rather large structure, there is no dispute. And technically, the shipyard squares will be able to accept a large ship, but ...

But it’s a little unclear how much the Novatek shipyard will welcome contacts with our Ministry of Defense. And in case of what, what to do in case of emergency, when urgent repairs are needed, and the shipyard is busy?

I did not find Novatek’s readiness to discuss the possibility of repairing large warships of the Northern Fleet anywhere, to be honest.

Somehow, this possible rent of a private shipyard for repairing such ships looks strange. Including transfer of personnel to and fro, equipment and, most importantly, compliance with the regime of protection of state secrets.

But, as Izvestia was told, not everyone in the Ministry of Defense considers it appropriate and reasonable to continue the repair. Since we again have the factor of a “sudden” budget constraint, then, as it was said earlier by the representatives of the Ministry of Defense, there will be no major repair and modernization. No money left.

That is why many people are thinking today: is there a reason to make a garden? For 50 of billions is still money. This is almost a billion dollars, that is, the amount is quite normal, which you can safely add even more than one ship a class lower.

Replacing fuel equipment boilers is, of course, wonderful. But it turns out that the Granite guidance system did not work, so it will not work. So, from the abbreviation TAVKR, a couple of letters can be safely removed. This is no longer a heavy cruiser, this is a small aircraft carrier. Type of Thai.


Thailand's naval carrier Chakri Narubet (background) and the US Navy strike aircraft kitty science


In general, if someone forgot, this fall it will be possible to note with tears in his eyes the thirtieth anniversary of the Admiral Kuznetsov service.



Many will reasonably argue: 30 years is not a time limit for a ship. Oh yeah. Indeed, there are ships that serve longer. The only question is how effectively they are doing it and how much money they need to tumble into. How does the 100-year-old vessel “Commune” on the Black Sea serve, we are aware of.

It also produces some dissonance. On the one hand, an aircraft carrier seems to be needed, for prestige and all that. On the other hand, isn’t it enough money for prestige?

50 billion to ensure that this constantly breaking old ship served 10 for years?

By the way, what about the modernization of the aircraft of his wing? Yes, the MiG-29KR will be quite enough for themselves to be pulled back by the 10 years, since they will not really be used anywhere. But after all, Su-33 - already frank aviahlam. At the level of conventional MiG-29, which are in service with the Papuans and rogue who do not have money for planes.

Many experts "sentenced" Su-33. The reason for this is the Su-33 aiming complex, which is based on the essentially oldest “Sword” radar H-001, developed in the 70s of the last century. Many say that the modernization of the C-33, which is essentially the Su-27, is out of the question, since there is no physical or economic sense to put modern radars on these ancient machines.



No, maybe there is, but only if Kuznetsova is still paid up and sent for an honorary pension to the Black Sea Fleet. As a training ship.

By the way, a good idea, because the weather conditions are softer there, and there are simulators. It would be possible to train sea pilots without driving, as today, from the Murmansk region to the Crimea and back.

But this is good only if our military has a clear plan to replace Kuznetsov. Unfortunately, a clear-cut plan has never been announced, and the semi-fantastic projectors are somehow not very encouraging today. And 20 years, which will be needed to build a full-fledged nuclear aircraft carrier, "Kuznetsov" is clearly not stretch.

Yes, at one time there were bravura statements about work on the PAK KA (a promising complex of ship aviation), but today we are sober-minded people, and quite clearly observe how the multi-billion dollar games with PAK FA and PAK DA ended. We are selling Su-57 to China, and PAK YES and, in general, Putin canceled. I’m not sure that there will be something more meaningful in the PAK KA.

So what do we have in the end?

We have very dubious prospects for the entire Northern Fleet in the future. “Kola shipyard”, which Novatek is building, is good. There is a firm belief that the company will build a shipyard, Novatek is not the Ministry of Defense.

Another question is how much this shipyard can be loaded with works on warships? Which year after year do not grow younger, but exactly the opposite? But the company has its own tasks in terms of working with shipyards, rather than repairing warships. Fact.

I need my own military dock. Either build on the coast, at Cape Chalmpushka, or (forgot the text) to buy in China or South Korea. And it should be such a dock to take a ship of 1 rank or a couple of ships of lower rank.



But you have to do something. The Northern Fleet is the main shock unit of Russia at sea. And you need to treat it accordingly.

Modern problems in the infrastructure not only do not help to solve emerging issues, on the contrary, complicate matters. And, accordingly, undermine the fleet combat capability.

An example not to be unfounded? Easily! Repair TARK "Admiral Nakhimov" in the bulk pool "Sevmash". Sevmash is the main nuclear underwater shipbuilding enterprise. And so, in one fell swoop, it was not enough that the plant took away one of the most important workshops (No. 50), so they took away the workshop and the people working in the workshop for an incomprehensible amount of time!

And unfortunately, we have in many things so. All the same native army / navy mess. We will look for a year guilty in the accident with PD-50, and the crane will still stick out of the Kuznetsov deck. Indeed, what has the ship’s combat capability to do when it comes to finding the guilty, right?

Peculiar situation. Unfortunately, as a blueprint written. And most importantly - completely vague prospects.

Yes, you have to spend money. Moreover, it is necessary to spend huge sums. But on real business, on real army and navy, and not on expensive toys of the “Army Games” shooting gallery, exhibitions and modest churches for 6 000 visitors.

Money must be spent wisely. Then there will be a return, then there will be a perspective. But, I'm afraid, “everything as always” awaits us.

But we do not have another ministry of defense, we do not have another minister. We do not have another commander in chief.
209 comments
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  1. +6
    April 8 2019 05: 37
    Maybe Kuzyu really should be scrapped, he is out of date anyway. As far as I know, it is planned to build a dry dock for the construction of large floating docks. And orders for the docks are already available. So everything is ahead. And Kuzya, maybe if they stop pouring money into him and start financing the construction of a new aircraft carrier, we’ll get a new modern ship faster.
    1. +29
      April 8 2019 06: 44
      well, apparently, the hour has come for the "eternal comatose" of our fleet ... further resuscitation is absolutely pointless ...
      as they say - a terrible end is better than horror without an end ...
      1. +14
        April 8 2019 07: 46
        Quote: kepmor
        as they say - a terrible end is better than horror without an end ...

        By the way, to dock new nuclear-powered icebreakers of the Arctic type, a new dock is really needed, and it will most likely be built in China.
        And here is another potential opportunity. Implement the Soviet dry dock project on the territory of the 82 th shipyard. Dry dock measuring 460 × 120 meters. After all, they were already starting to implement it in the USSR. Less - you have to continue to chop the rock. Plus - high bearing capacity of soils.
        1. +10
          April 8 2019 07: 53
          Something like that fellow

          By the way, in the PD-41 last year the large nuclear-powered reconnaissance ship SSV-33 "Ural" ended its existence. (you can read about it here: https://topwar.ru/26231-tragediya-unikalnogo-urala.html). The next heavy nuclear missile cruiser, Admiral Lazarev, is next in line for disposal at PD-41.
          1. +3
            April 8 2019 17: 34
            Ludwigovich, have you seen Lazarev’s photos for a long time? Yes, he looks better than the PD-41. And by the way, 2014 carried out its docking, with full anti-corrosion treatment and painting. This was even on fleet.com was https://flot.com/2015/204801/
            According to the dry dock, I fully agree with you - it is necessary to do. In the end, that we have little explosives?
            1. +2
              April 8 2019 18: 47
              Quote: Dante
              Have you seen the photos of Lazarev for a long time? Yes, he looks better than the PD-41.

              In the 2014 year, the cruiser was docked in order to maintain buoyancy, so that the hull was enough for another 10 years and he did not drown before the start of disposal. Lack of a repair and upgrade decision means inevitable disposal.
              The Ministry of Defense is disappointed with the results of the modernization of “Admiral Nakhimov” - the actual cost of the work turned out to be higher than originally planned, and the deadline for their completion is always shifting to the right. For those who have already forgotten or did not know - according to the initial plans, the Admiral Nakhimov missile cruiser was to be modernized before the end of the 2012 year.
              The 2019 year is already underway, and the head of the USC carefully talks about the 2022 year. It turns out that the ship should be transferred to the Navy at 10 years later, and all in all, it will take 22 of the year to repair and upgrade it (taking into account the waiting time for the start of work). This is 4 times longer than the construction period - laid down by 17.05.83, delivered to the Navy 30.12.88. It is not yet clear what to do with Peter the Great, but you can definitely forget about Admiral Lazarev.
              1. +2
                April 8 2019 19: 11
                Ludwigovich, let's in fact, they began to modernize Nakhimov only at the end of the 13-th - the beginning of the 14-th and planned to finish at the end of the 18-th - the beginning of the 19-th. Now the deadlines have moved to 21-22. I’m not saying that this is normal, I’m just saying that the cruiser should be ready for the 2012 year of speech and was out of the question.
                It is also obvious that Peter is next in line, as is obvious that there are much fewer problems in him. Although knowing our USC here, too, everything can stretch out over many summers. But forgive me, I want to be optimistic and believe that Lazarev will wait for his turn, because if Kirov was prepared for the final write-off, they don’t do anything on it.
                When asked where to get the money, there are several options, but not one of them will please either those in power, or oil and gas moneybags, or the leaders of the USC
                1. +1
                  April 10 2019 07: 58
                  Quote: Dante
                  I want to be optimistic and believe that Lazarev will wait for his turn

                  Lazarev does not have to wait for his turn - he can be put for modernization in the dry dock of the SSK "Zvezda" - and he will not disturb anyone there.
                  1. 0
                    April 10 2019 15: 25
                    But here I have to disagree with you. And the point is not that I am against such a scenario. On the contrary, with both hands "for". But investors who have invested in the construction of a new dry dock at Zvezda are unlikely to be delighted with such an offer instead of some tanker. Unfortunately, now the Star is much more a private enterprise than a state one, because we all remember: whoever pays for a girl dances with her. In fact, everything that is now at the disposal of the state is part of a Soviet-built complex and, as far as I know, it is already loaded with orders for the planned mid-term and long-term repair of ships and submarines of the Pacific Fleet. So, as sad as it sounds, Lazarev will wait in line and would really like to wait. For only if it is available (i.e. with 3 ships of pr. 1144 in the fleet) we can extend the operation of these wonderful ships for another 30 years: without much damage to defense, sending one or another unit for repair, while always having 2 ships are on operational duty, which will have an extremely favorable effect on the resource of metal structures and propulsion mechanisms. Now, the exploitation of the Soviet legacy is merciless - without any rotation and replacement, in fact, until it is completely worn out, the example of Peter, cruisers 1164, BOD 1155 and the almost deceased destroyers 956 are excellent confirmation of this.
                    1. +1
                      April 11 2019 08: 59
                      Tankers and other vessels belong to the MEDIUM-TONNAGE shipbuilding and will be built on a heavy slipway. And in the dry dock "Zvezda" will be carried out LARGE-TONNAGE shipbuilding, namely the construction of gas carriers. Now we have signed a contract for only one gas carrier with a deadline for handing it over to the customer in 2022
                      https://sudostroenie.info/novosti/26434.html
                      It is assumed that the pilot gas carrier will be built in cooperation with South Korea.

                      This means that a large part of the vessel will be built in South Korea. Here one more point is important, where the parts built on the Star and in Korea will dock. If on Zvezda, will they have time to build a dry dock by this time? If the sections are transported to Korea, this means that there will be no need for a dock, because the sections themselves can be built on a heavy slipway. So what am I for? As soon as a dry dock is built on Zvezda and commissioned, a trio of Leader icebreakers will be built there. This construction will take many years and will be carried out sequentially and in parallel: they will be laid at intervals of maybe a year or two or three. But at some point in time, three buildings will be built simultaneously in the dry dock. Generally speaking, the Zvezda SSK will start operating at full capacity only by 2024, when all the second stage workshops adjacent to the dry dock will be completed. The dock itself is planned to be built by 2020. Therefore, maybe the first Leader will be laid in the period 2020-2024. The rest are clearly after 2024.
                      The most important thing is that while the Leaders are being built, the construction of gas carriers will be simply impossible - these three-hundred-meter vessels will need to be built quickly and taken out of the dock. And if there is an icebreaker still under construction, it will not work. And to separate them with a batoport also will not work - the banal length of the dock is not enough.
                      And then there is a good opportunity for the TARKR "Admiral Lazarev". It is "only" 250.1 meters long. This means that it can be located at the same time as the icebreaker under construction in the same dock and fenced off with a bathoport. In the far part of the dock, the cruiser will be modernized, and it is even possible to assemble sections of icebreakers nearby. And in the front part of the dock, sections of icebreakers will be docked and removed from the dock. And there is enough space for everyone.
                      Summary: Building leaders gives a unique chance for Admiral Lazarev.
                      Financing and labor issues are already debatable.
                      1. 0
                        April 11 2019 17: 03
                        Thanks, Anton, for the wonderful comment. To be honest, I did not go so far into rehearsing projects that prophesy for the modernized Star. But if everything goes exactly as you say, Lazarev may well have a chance. One can only hope that they will be used in the Navy. hi
                      2. 0
                        20 May 2019 19: 58
                        Great advantage!
              2. 0
                20 May 2019 19: 49
                Disposal or recovery? Can Russia in the near future build a ship of the first rank?
          2. 0
            April 10 2019 07: 55
            You read the comments on Sdelanunas - right)
            1. 0
              April 10 2019 08: 03
              There is more positive fellow Therefore, I read.
              1. +1
                April 10 2019 08: 07
                There is often more constructive)
        2. -2
          April 8 2019 13: 17
          No, they will build it. My friend is working on these projects. Infa 100%
        3. +2
          April 9 2019 00: 03
          Less - you have to continue to chop the rock. Plus - high bearing capacity of soils

          + You can’t drown him))
        4. 0
          18 May 2019 18: 21
          A dry dock 485 * 114 is being built in Bolshoy Kamen at SK Zvezda. It will be finished somewhere in a year.
    2. +15
      April 8 2019 07: 08
      Quote: Twodi
      And Kuzya, maybe if they stop pouring money into him

      nothing will change, just in a couple of years they will start screaming that the traitors have destroyed the last aircraft carrier of the Russian Federation .... and carrier-based aircraft will disappear as a species .... at such a rate we and EM, corvettes frigates are not needed ..... dear heterogeneous rubbish .... build only a series of Bykov (carry the flag abroad) and MRK "Karakuty" (like a fleet and all that) ....
      1. +23
        April 8 2019 07: 37
        And I like the Bulls, such a beautiful yacht with a gun in the military style. You can go to a tuna and a pirate.
        1. +5
          April 8 2019 07: 39
          Well, a beautiful patrolman feel
          1. +5
            April 8 2019 07: 41
            An example not to be unfounded? Easily! Repair TARK "Admiral Nakhimov" in the bulk pool "Sevmash". Sevmash is the main nuclear underwater shipbuilding enterprise. And so, in one fell swoop, it was not enough that the plant took away one of the most important workshops (No. 50), so they took away the workshop and the people working in the workshop for an incomprehensible amount of time!

            And here Roman Skomorokhov got excited. The 50 workshop of Sevmash Production Center (built by 1940 - reconstruction began several years ago) has long needed reconstruction. Here is a photo of 3's years ago. The 50 workshop is currently at the final stage of reconstruction, after which it will be used for the construction of promising nuclear submarines. The battleships “Soviet Russia” and “Soviet Belarus” began to build in it.
        2. +8
          April 8 2019 15: 40
          Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
          And I like the Bulls, such a beautiful yacht with a gun in the military style. You can go to a tuna and a pirate.

          So "Bulls" would actually be a good ship if it went under the St. Andrew's cross on a green field. Well, this is not a naval ship - it even has an official list of tasks that coincides by 80% with the SOBR.
    3. +9
      April 8 2019 12: 37
      at Sevmash they would like to .... so just who will give them? In general, one gets the impression that the dock did not sink accidentally. Someone benefited from it. Now it is easier to justify the funds "invested" in Kuznetsov. The same is with the Su-33. What kind of modernization the MO is broadcasting is not clear. Against the background of all this, the next news about the embezzlement in the MO. It will be interesting to find out where the money went from the budget and for whose needs.
    4. +9
      April 8 2019 18: 06
      I wonder how much this new dock will cost with all the cuts and cuts, stuffing bank accounts, half the world dies of laughter. The bridge in the Crimea did not even go gold, but interspersed with diamonds. Good luck in building. chunga changa thick wallet-chunga changa-kursavelli round gooood ...
      1. 0
        18 May 2019 18: 11
        oh and there with a bridge, but tell the expert)))
    5. 0
      18 May 2019 18: 10
      Admiral Kuznetsov is essentially a useless ship (operations in the SAR are a confirmation of this), just like heavy nuclear-powered cruisers like Peter the Great, it’s generally a heavy nuclear missed wagons.
      For effective confrontation, the US Navy needs effective coastal aviation, a submarine fleet and many ships such as corvette and frigate.
      And for operations such as in the SAR, UDCs of the Mistral type and the creation of support vessels to ensure such operations are necessary.
      Kuznetsov, even if he returns to service, is somehow useless and weak and will remain - a modern aircraft carrier, more precisely, an air group is inconceivable without an AWACS aircraft, especially if the air group does not have stealth aircraft. At the same time, Kuznetsov’s air group can only provide air defense; aircraft must be modernized against the ground.
      A new aircraft carrier, if they decide to cost, should be universal - that is, the air group must perform a full range of tasks from providing air defense, anti-aircraft defense and support to ground forces. But you won’t do it from Kuzi.
    6. 0
      14 June 2019 21: 09
      Not to waste, but to make a modern museum with an air wing. Useful for milking history and patreotism. In St. Petersburg put with us, next to the boat. Or in Kronstadt, just there a new military park will be built soon.
  2. -23
    April 8 2019 05: 40
    Everything will be fine with Kuzey. Pay and swim. And the dock will be lifted somehow.
    1. +3
      April 8 2019 06: 15
      Quote: Darth Ragozinus
      they will fly up and swim. and the dock will be raised somehow.

      if the dock is rusted and drowned, then most likely there is massive corrosion there, it will begin to sink every six months, out of 1155 only a couple of Severomorsk-Kulakov remained on the SF, the rest are in scrap, and there are a lot of repairs where possible, so the PD50 is only for Kuzi was needed.
      1. +6
        April 8 2019 06: 57
        Kuzya is at least a real ship. It’s clear - in the pool in the Ministry of Defense all kinds of thermonuclear advanced aircraft carriers are floating, but these are toys. Kuzyu needs to be repaired and the dock raised.
        1. +5
          April 8 2019 07: 29
          Quote: Darth Ragozinus
          Kuzyu needs to be repaired


          So even if Kuzya is repaired, questions arise, with replacing / upgrading the air wing on it, but there is no money (s) PAK KA on the horizon, there is no news at all, and apparently there is no money either .... about the granite guidance system They also said in the article, as I understand it, that they allocated money to replace the boilers, but it didn’t work out with financing for granites, if I am mistaken, I hope they will correct it. And the question with the Dock remains open, even if you build a dry dock then you need financing again, but there is still silence in the news on this topic ....
          1. -4
            April 8 2019 07: 40
            It’s just that it’s not really lucky with the dock. Yet Kuse also broke the dome with a crane.
        2. 0
          April 8 2019 12: 38
          cheaper UDC pile
      2. +10
        April 8 2019 16: 20
        It’s not at all a fact that everything is rotten. Although it surprises me how they got to such a state of the dock that he sank. Given that this is a strategically important facility on which ships of the first rank are placed. Anyone responsible for his condition? The dock, like any ship, requires regular hull detection and repair. Why has this not been done? How did he go through surveys by the Russian Maritime Register?
        And raising it is easier and cheaper than building a new dock. After all, it still had propellers. And what is the problem alone to raise mushroom screws at least ??? Finally pump out water from the ballast tanks and it will rise. You just need to do this, and not prepare public opinion on the cancellation of Kuzi.
    2. +5
      April 8 2019 09: 55
      They will not pick it up - they simply will push it into a huge pit, near which it lies and that's it, let it take it apart and dispose of it there.
  3. +24
    April 8 2019 05: 43
    Money must be spent wisely, if you have it of course ...
    There is no money, but you hold on! Good luck and good mood!
    1. +2
      April 8 2019 22: 42
      Quote: Pessimist22
      Money must be spent wisely, if you have it of course ...
      There is no money, but you hold on! Good luck and good mood!

      So what?! Where is the informational benefit and the meaning of your comment. Or repeat the hackneyed quote is already a feat ...
  4. -3
    April 8 2019 05: 47
    There was news that the ego for repair in China will be pulled?
    1. +27
      April 8 2019 06: 05
      Quote: Konatantin 1992
      There was news that the ego for repair in China will be pulled?

      I think in China, already and the MLC would be lifted and repairs continued ...
      1. +17
        April 8 2019 09: 37
        Quote: Aerodrome
        I think in China, already and the MLC would be lifted and repairs continued ...

        and guilty of a bullet to the head with the complete confiscation of all acquired ...
        1. +1
          April 8 2019 09: 57
          This dock was made in the 80th, welds burst, design fatigue - that's it.
          1. +2
            April 9 2019 12: 45
            Quote: Vadim237
            This dock was made in the 80th, welds burst, design fatigue - that's it.

            Here, brain fatigue, someone who, by duty, had to monitor the conditionam
            With proper maintenance, he would still bother.
            Negligence or sabotage killed him
      2. +6
        April 8 2019 09: 58
        Quote: Aerodrome
        I think in China, and the PKD would have been raised and the repair continued.

        BOD "Severomorsk" has already been brought to Sevastopol for docking. No doc, but you hold on
        1. +5
          April 8 2019 12: 44
          There are docks in the Northern Fleet for the Project 1155 BOD. Currently, the BOD 1155 "Admiral Kharlamov" has begun to be dismantled for parts at the dock on Nerpa (Snezhnogorsk). They will take off the whole Polynomial fairing and put it on the VPK "Vice-Admiral Kulakov" instead of the crumpled and broken one ... The SSV "Severomorsk" went to Sevastopol on the way, and at the same time passed docking.
          1. +3
            April 8 2019 12: 47
            thank! how do you all know I never cease to be surprised!
            1. +4
              April 8 2019 12: 59
              It’s just interesting to me. Watch the video about the construction of the Center for the construction of large-capacity offshore structures (CSKMS) of the NOVATEK company in the village of Belokamenka (Murmansk region). Dry docks will have dimensions of 400 × 185 × 15.7 and 400 × 205 × 15.7 meters! For the construction of reinforced concrete foundations for various oil and gas projects, including Arctic LNG-2.
              1. +22
                April 8 2019 13: 23
                in other words, if it is necessary for the export of gas and oil, then PLEASE. But if for the repair of a single aircraft carrier, then there are no technologies and means?
                1. Alf
                  +11
                  April 8 2019 18: 55
                  Quote: dirk182
                  in other words, if it is necessary for the export of gas and oil, then PLEASE

                  "That gasoline, and then children."
                  Quote: dirk182
                  But if for the repair of a single aircraft carrier, then there are no technologies and means?

                  And why is it needed, there are no enemies, there are only "partners" around ...
                2. +3
                  April 8 2019 22: 11
                  you do not confuse private wool with the state))
              2. +2
                April 8 2019 13: 31
                class. thank
              3. +7
                April 8 2019 13: 48
                Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
                For the construction of reinforced concrete foundations for various oil and gas projects

                And then all these projects will float under the rags of various under-states.
  5. -6
    April 8 2019 05: 50
    We have very dubious prospects
    Grandma in two
    pitchfork on the water ....
  6. +47
    April 8 2019 05: 52
    We have rowers in the galleys - millenes.
    All - on Kuzya rowers, led by the Great Helmsman.
    1. +27
      April 8 2019 05: 54
      It’s not better to collect grandmothers for repairs on Channel One laughing
    2. -1
      April 8 2019 11: 01
      ... why not use the Ministry of Emergencies - Shoigu * shakes the old days * and everything will be * hockey * ..- seven seconds ..
      1. +23
        April 8 2019 12: 45
        Shoigu is time to put on another department. Our MO is turning into some kind of theater. Games, churches, film studios, cartoons. A lot of PR. And in some ways this, of course, is correct. But the goals are incomprehensible. A bunch of programs in general GPV. Certainty is not visible. Either a lot of money, or they themselves can’t understand what they want.
        1. +16
          April 8 2019 13: 14
          not games, games. as in ancient rome. those gladiators, Shoigu has a tank biathlon with a woman’s crew. and not hits are important, but running speed and a triple blind person will be the winner ...
          1. +3
            April 8 2019 13: 21
            female crew is of course bust! Absolutely agree.
        2. +1
          April 8 2019 14: 38
          ..I noted something like that - deleted - the wrong dimensions became ..
        3. 0
          April 10 2019 02: 32
          .. well so - he’s a director there ..
    3. Alf
      +4
      April 8 2019 18: 57
      Quote: SarS
      We have rowers in the galleys - millenes.
      All - on Kuzya rowers, led by the Great Helmsman.

      In my barn a couple of oars were lying around, I don’t have a clue where from, give an address, where to send it?
  7. -23
    April 8 2019 06: 08
    Aircraft carriers are aggression ships, Russia doesn’t need them, for the sake of a flight of aircraft per hour contain one command 2000 people and there is no AUG for him and will not ..... repair and sell China to India and close this topic. For the Cruisers, there are quite a few areas for repair, and why do they need to be repaired massively? Moscow smoothly went into the scrap, Ustinov can serve another 8-10 years, Varyag is in doubt = a morally obsolete project. The Nakhimov will get out of the repair, maybe they will carry out the Petrograd VTG (just under the cancellation of Ustinov), and Lazarev most likely will not wait after Petya ... he’ll be too old. In total, after two years, one or two Cruisers 8 will be left behind, it will be enough for them to repair Sevmash.
    1. +37
      April 8 2019 06: 28
      In total, after two years, one or two Cruisers 8 will be left behind, it will be enough for them to repair Sevmash.

      Then Sevmash will end. The Mosin rifle with a tetrahedral bayonet is our everything. Only she will save Russia which has forgotten how to build ships.
      1. -11
        April 8 2019 10: 32
        Quote: Deck
        Then Sevmash will end.

        not at all, the submarine base of the fleet is being built and right
    2. +31
      April 8 2019 06: 37
      Quote: vladimir1155
      Carriers of aggression
      And submarines "ships of the world", maybe it's enough to repeat this nonsense? Aircraft carriers, first of all, are carriers of naval aviation, so when aviation at sea is not needed, then aircraft carriers will not be needed either.
      1. -12
        April 8 2019 10: 05
        Soon there will be infantry fighting systems capable of hitting aircraft carrier strike formations - it makes no sense to build aircraft carriers, the larger the ship, the easier it is to find and sink, the more the ship, the more money you need to maintain and maintain it - between the first and second price and service differences, in several thousand times.
        1. +12
          April 8 2019 11: 35
          Then you don’t need to build anything larger than a frigate, but even larger than a missile boat, because you can push the PKR with a nuclear warhead there. It’s cheap and cheerful, but for some reason the stupid PRC is building both destroyers and aircraft carriers — apparently the narrow mind does not allow them to look wider.
          1. 0
            April 8 2019 18: 37
            The People's Republic of China with a billion population has opportunities and plans on different continents
            1. Alf
              +6
              April 8 2019 18: 59
              Quote: vladimir1155
              The People's Republic of China with a billion population has opportunities and plans on different continents

              That's it, and our elite has only one plan - to grab and export.
            2. 0
              April 9 2019 21: 06
              Maybe, but why was everyone so excited when the Russian Federation was a regional power?
          2. 0
            April 8 2019 23: 39
            Frigates and corvettes are the best thing for Russia - and let China build what it wants, it has a lot of extra money, including for servicing the hulks.
        2. +2
          April 8 2019 16: 46
          Soon there will be anti-aircraft missile systems capable of hitting aircraft carrier strike formations - there’s no point in building aircraft carriers,

          And the pyndos will "soon have" a combat laser with which they will destroy the USSR. But they haven’t been killed in their own fleet, and this fleet has been helping them to bend their line for decades.
          1. 0
            April 8 2019 23: 47
            Let tens of billions be lowered further into it - with the advent of hypersonic anti-ship missiles and IRBMs, all of them, and not only them, the ships will turn into expensive scrap metal, with the very minimum possibility of counteraction and efficiency, at least 10 Megawatt laser will be put on everything - against "bananas" then, but no more.
            1. 0
              April 8 2019 23: 52
              Quote: Vadim237
              Megawatt laser will put everything against "bananas"

              We do not have such.
            2. +3
              April 9 2019 21: 04
              I can tell you that thousands of tanks, hundreds of aircraft, bombers can be converted to metal, for there is only one answer - brdsd and hypersonic crs, of course. You know, somewhere I read about this, like one lover of corn and large rockets said so. By the way, supersonic pkr with apple appeared long ago and seemed to end the era of surface ships, but even the scoop that had sunk in the summer did not rush to refuse them.
      2. -16
        April 8 2019 10: 34
        Quote: Per se.
        Carriers of aggression
        And submarines "ships of the world"
        Yes, of course, the way it is, thanks to the presence of nuclear submarines they are afraid to attack Russia, all world stability rests on Russian nuclear submarines and the Strategic Missile Forces! Glory to the submarine fleet the guarantor of peace and security on the planet, glory to the Strategic Missile Forces!
    3. +9
      April 8 2019 06: 49
      Quote: vladimir1155
      Aircraft carriers are aggression ships, Russia doesn’t need them, for the sake of a flight of aircraft per hour contain one command 2000 people

      and to cover submarines in the ocean than from foreign anti-submarine aviation? two or three are needed, albeit small like "Kuznetsov".
      Quote: vladimir1155
      and there is no and will not be AUG

      yes, no arguing against the facts, no serious order is foreseen. this is the problem and the pain.
      1. -12
        April 8 2019 10: 37
        Quote: Aerodrome
        cover submarines in the ocean

        do you understand what you wrote? Where? and how will you cover the mythical squadrons of aircraft carriers and where will you find naval divisions on them? The cover of the submarine is its secrecy, and on its shores it is coastal aviation and underwater security systems.
        1. +2
          April 8 2019 11: 24
          Quote: vladimir1155
          do you understand what you wrote?

          to you, the question is the same ... and read carefully, and think with your head.
    4. +9
      April 8 2019 07: 18
      Quote: vladimir1155
      Carriers of aggression

      belay I dare to remind you that any, absolutely any weapon is a weapon of aggression !!
      Quote: vladimir1155
      Russia does not need them

      your and only your desires that either do not coincide with either the military or the civilian!
    5. +11
      April 8 2019 08: 47
      Aircraft carriers ships of aggression, Russia does not need them ...


      Well done, you earned a medal from NATO
  8. -1
    April 8 2019 06: 15
    Kuzyu will be written off how to drink, everything goes to that. But. Now the Star is building a large dry dock and most likely it will not only be built tankers and dry cargo ships: length 485 meters, width 114 meters and depth 14 meters. A pair of Nimits will enter. I have already stated the idea that our ocean fleet ceases to be surface and gradually goes under water, a clear skew towards the submarine is already noticeable. So why yes? If the Husky project is embodied in iron, and it seems like it will be cheaper than Ashen, they can stamp several dozen.
    We do not need to attack anyone, and our own shores will protect perfectly.
    1. +12
      April 8 2019 06: 54
      Quote: Wedmak
      Kuzyu will be written off how to drink, everything goes to that.

      I was sure of this, after the "victorious" Syrian campaign ... but a mountain of sneakers flew into me. True, when the boilers were brought up to change, I began to be tormented by vague doubts about my suspicions, but ... fortune against "Kuzi" ...
      1. +4
        April 8 2019 20: 56
        Quote: Aerodrome
        I was sure of this, after the "victorious" Syrian campaign ...


        The idea of ​​a campaign came from the Supreme ... Shoigu took a visor and set the task of the naval commander. He began to obey the order. And no one had the courage to explain to the commander in chief that the campaign would finish off Kuznetsov. And so it happened.
    2. 0
      April 10 2019 08: 05
      Quote: Wedmak
      The star is building a large dry dock and most likely not only tankers and bulk carriers will be built there.

      Tankers - will only be built on heavy slipways. In the dry dock - large-tonnage shipbuilding - only gas carriers. So far, the contract has been signed for one gas carrier, and it is not clear how they are going to have time to make it before 2022. More precisely, it is not clear how deep the "cooperation" with the Koreans will be - maybe the SSK will only make a section on the slipway and tow it to Korea.
  9. +25
    April 8 2019 06: 33
    Kuznetsov’s mission is to remind of the former power of the USSR, until it is written off. I think Russia will not have another similar ship in this century
    1. +30
      April 8 2019 08: 17
      Quote: The Plague Doctor
      Kuznetsov’s mission is to remind of the former power of the USSR, until it is written off. I think Russia will not have another similar ship in this century


      That's it. Only the Russian Federation has never the USSR and will never even come close to it. Containing the ocean fleet for thieves' Russia is not for Senka cap. Unless our billionaires take the initiative. Do they need it? They have no homeland.
    2. -7
      April 8 2019 10: 41
      Quote: Plague Doctor
      Kuznetsov’s mission to recall the former power of the USSR,

      it is only true that this is a very expensive reminiscent of a useless dummy that draws off resources from important tasks, "If you want to ruin a small country, give it a cruiser" ... (c) Winston Churchill .... they will make a super Nakhimov and you can smoothly close the Kuzi topic to fanfare
  10. +9
    April 8 2019 08: 13
    As I understand it correctly (the Ministry of Defense, by the way, is not that silent, the Russian ceases to understand on this topic), Kuznetsov's propellers remained there ... In PD-50.

    I wonder where this conclusion comes from.
    Generally speaking, it all started with the publication of Izvestia, where there are such words
    Docking is an important part of restoring the ship’s technical readiness, without which the Kuznetsov will not be able to return to service, if only because only the dock propellers previously taken during the repair can be reinstalled onto the ship.

    At the same time, the news speaks directly
    If we assume that Kuznetsov will be able to dock in Belokamenka in 2020, then the completion of its repair in 2021 does not represent any unsolvable problem.

    But then for some reason went the bike about the recessed screws ...
    1. 0
      April 8 2019 11: 53
      But then for some reason went the bike about the recessed screws ...

      in general, as for me, it is a strange idea to leave the removed screws in the submersible dock when the ship is being taken out of it. But there are also quite a few problems with just one drowned dock.
      1. +5
        April 8 2019 12: 50
        The network wrote that the cruiser took a couple of kilotons of water.
        The combat ship was saved by the well-coordinated work of the crew that remained on board during the repair, which promptly began the struggle for survivability and saved it from flooding, despite the flow of water through the openboard fittings and holes made during the repair. As a result, the aircraft carrier, having taken several thousand tons of water, was towed to the berth of the 35 shipyard - to its usual parking spot.

        https://iz.ru/806496/ilia-kramnik/upustili-dok-pochemu-admiral-kuznetcov-edva-ne-utonul
        1. +5
          April 8 2019 19: 11
          Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
          The network wrote that the cruiser took a couple of kilotons of water.

          Yes, this is understandable, but where are the screws? :))) I was pretty sure that the screws were removed, but that they were thrown at the dock is extremely doubtful
    2. 0
      April 10 2019 08: 17
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      As I understand it correctly (the Ministry of Defense, by the way, is not that silent, the Russian ceases to understand on this topic), Kuznetsov's propellers remained there ... In PD-50.

      I wonder where this conclusion comes from.

      How from where - the journalists heard something out of the corner of their ears or read somewhere - half understood, half thought up themselves, depending on their horizons. So these journalism decided that if the screws were removed in the floating dock, then they are stored there. And the fact that they were dragged into the nearby SRZ-82 workshop is apparently not given to everyone to understand.

      If we assume that Kuznetsov will be able to dock in Belokamenka in 2020, then the completion of its repair in 2021 does not represent any unsolvable problem.


      Rakhmanov, however, already mentioned that they would reconstruct the SRZ-35 docks, so Belokamenka let him build his gravity platforms. Moreover, the Belokamenka filling pools will be little adapted for docking - instead of the batoport there is an earthen rampart. But to dock the cruiser of the first rank and the entire strategic submarine of the SF anyway somewhere you need to regularly.
  11. +4
    April 8 2019 08: 20
    But we do not have another ministry of defense, we do not have another minister. We do not have another commander in chief.

    We have no other that is the most important thing in our situation! And the prospects are vague, at that we have it.
  12. 0
    April 8 2019 08: 56
    I must say right away that I am not an expert and I’ll ask you not to throw slippers at me, comments on the case.
    Now to the point - replacing the screws may not require docking. Trim on the nose (a good one) and screws in the "access zone". Maybe this is why the management does not have any special panic - the PPR is being developed.
    1. +1
      April 8 2019 10: 43
      Quote: mark1
      Trim on nose

      it's not a yacht, it won’t work out
      1. 0
        April 8 2019 11: 08
        Quote: vladimir1155
        it's not a yacht, it won’t work out

        What can get in the way? In a storm, it “kills” in the same way, that the yacht, that the aircraft carrier - nose up and down, the strength is calculated (and in principle there can be no deflection), there is practice for use (in the historical period). IN AND. certainly big but not very much. By the way, in the same (Soviet) story, there seems to be an experience of docking a part of the ship (I blew everything up, but according to the law of meanness I have not found now) Minus removed, apparently the activity of anonymous partisans.
        1. +3
          April 8 2019 11: 28
          Quote: mark1
          What can get in the way? In a storm, it is equally "kubilitsya," that the yacht, that the aircraft carrier - nose up and down,

          "Kuznetsova" is less "kapulyat" than the destroyer.
        2. Alf
          +2
          April 8 2019 19: 03
          Quote: mark1
          By the way, in the same story (Soviet), there seems to be experience in docking a part of the ship

          At least give the name of the ship or, at least, its displacement and dimensions.
          Can you imagine what kind of trim on the nose you need to create to get the screws out of the water? Yes, Kuznetsov will have to be drowned in the cabin.
          1. 0
            April 8 2019 19: 09
            Quote: Alf
            At least the name of the ship, or, at least, its displacement and dimensions

            C'mon, I talked in vain, it turned out stupid (I just passed it with my casual eyes, but now I can only aggravate something), if I manage to raise something, I will inform you.
          2. 0
            April 8 2019 20: 08
            Quote: Alf
            Can you imagine what kind of trim on the nose you need to create to get the screws out of the water? Yes, Kuznetsov will have to be drowned in the cabin.

            Yes, I immediately made a link to incompetence, you corrected me, thanks. I looked at the drawings - the trim of degrees 7-10 to the cutting, as if, did not reach. (The measuring tool is not at hand)
            Regarding incomplete docking - WWII experience, plant No. 201; repair of cruisers Krasny Kavkaz and Molotov - maintaining the bow with pontoons.
            1. Alf
              +2
              April 8 2019 20: 16
              Quote: mark1
              you corrected me, thanks.

              Not at all, always ready to help.
              Quote: mark1
              Regarding incomplete docking - WWII experience, plant No. 201; repair of cruisers Krasny Kavkaz and Molotov - maintaining the bow with pontoons.

              They also compared. 9000 tons and 170 meters and 62000 and 270 meters.
              1. -1
                April 8 2019 20: 22
                Quote: Alf
                They also compared. 9000 tons and 170 meters and 62000 and 270 meters.

                The forties of the 20th century, the conditions of the Second World War, the 10th of the 21st century, a first-class enterprise and a bunch of engineers. 62 tons - not correct - 000 just right, or even less.
                1. Alf
                  +1
                  April 9 2019 18: 59
                  Quote: mark1
                  and a bunch of engineers.

                  Those who have not yet scattered.
                  1. 0
                    April 9 2019 20: 06
                    Quote: Alf
                    Those who have not yet scattered.

                    Well then, all of us Khan ... belay
    2. +1
      April 8 2019 18: 14
      Rather, build a caisson in Port Arthur wink
      1. 0
        April 8 2019 18: 47
        Quote: Andrzej K

        Rather, build a caisson in Port Arthur

        In short, the options for five dozen can be considered ... I also "dawned" once again - two hulls of the 941 project are idle completely without work, and these are two pontoons with a lifting force of 25000 tons! Maybe this is the solution, although I like the trim on the nose better
  13. +18
    April 8 2019 09: 01
    Yes, they destroyed everything that can be (not to break, not build) and nothing new was built! The man was the first to be sent into space and now - the rockets at the start "bless" to fly!
  14. +12
    April 8 2019 09: 05
    "... you can safely finish building more than one ship of a lower class."
    Is logical. At 50 billion rubles, you can buy tens of thousands of rubber boats on Ali or cut, and sell the only aircraft carrier to the Chinese or Indians. They then easily repair and upgrade it. They do not have corruption, and specialists have their hands growing from where it should be.
    "No money, but you hold on ..."
    1. +11
      April 8 2019 09: 22
      The Chinese will send. They have a Varangian + new 001A. They played enough with the STOBAR scheme and now only CATOBAR. Which is actively collected. 60 + aircraft. 3-4 catapults. By the end of the year there will be a docking of sections in Shanghai. They won’t already think where to fuse their Kuzyu (Varyag). They are talking about Pakistan.


      Hindus - they have their own av completed, everything cannot be completed. Plus the negative experience of work on Gorshkov, Kuzya at times more ushatany.
  15. +2
    April 8 2019 09: 20
    Needles to guess
  16. +3
    April 8 2019 09: 40
    To the author. And what ... the dock is only needed for "ancient ships"? Young people don't need him from the word at all ???
    1. +10
      April 8 2019 10: 12
      Young ships are much smaller - and therefore a lot of docks capable of accepting them. The problems are mainly in the Arctic, Petrukh / Nakhimov. 1164 and BOD - can be serviced in other docks (smaller).

      Plus submarines. Well, in general, ship repair in the north. This dock was an important element. Now the line for dock repair is already decent. And the situation will only get worse.
      1. 0
        April 10 2019 07: 38
        I understand you. I'm interested in why the ships are "ancient". with sw.Andrey.
    2. -3
      April 8 2019 10: 45
      docking every few years or more often, just if the new ships are frigates, then finding the docking place is much easier
      1. 0
        April 10 2019 07: 37
        it's even easier if the new ships are "dive-1" and "dive-2" don't you find ???, glue and a piece of the camera from the bike. and the whole dock repair. JOKE.
    3. +7
      April 8 2019 11: 09
      Quote: pin_code
      dock is needed only for "ancient ships"?

      By the way, I hooked this moment.

      Why is it "ancient"? Kuznetsov was adopted by the fleet in 91, 28 years ago. Of the 10 Nimitzes, half are older than him, the first Nimitz is 16 years old, adopted by the fleet in 75th. Its withdrawal is planned for the 22nd, and that depends on the situation with the Fords. May be extended.
      Enterprise served from 1961 to 2012, then another 5 years - in reserve. The latest non-nuclear withdrawal - Kitty Hawk - served 48 years, from 1961 to 2009.
      1. +6
        April 8 2019 15: 46
        Quote: Cherry Nine
        Why is it "ancient"? Kuznetsov was adopted by the fleet in 91, 28 years ago. Of the 10 Nimitzes, half are older than him, the first Nimitz is 16 years old, adopted by the fleet in 75th.

        "Kuznetsov" is ancient not in terms of service life, but in condition. If in the decaying West "Nimitz" is regularly renovated and modernized, then we either have no money. either the dock is busy or come on, come on. what repair - urgent camping... What they did with the Kuznetsov after Syria had to be done long before the campaign.
        We do not have a formidable aircraft carrier, we have a springboard for flying achievements, from time to time giving the course and occasionally providing flights of naval aviation with even more rarely working radio equipment.
        ©
        1. +8
          April 8 2019 15: 52
          Quote: Alexey RA
          ancient not by service life, but by condition. If in the rotting West

          Sorry, but if the ships rot twice as fast as in the decaying West - there are no Storm aircraft carriers, or whatever they are, you will not have enough. Perhaps it would be worth it to spend two percent on the volume of conversations about zircon-Poseidon. Kuznetsov found the dashing 90s as a child, and he rotted the remaining 20 years under stability and patriotism.
          1. +6
            April 8 2019 17: 00
            Quote: Cherry Nine
            Perhaps it would be worth it to spend two percent on the volume of conversations about zircon-Poseidon.

            Not in this life. And not in the past. And not even the year before last.
            Saving on the basis of - one of the cornerstones of the neck of our fleet.
            And this story stretches from the time of its foundation. And it all ends with the same thing. That Archipelago Squadron immediately after the release is forced to overhaul ships in Britain (Englishwoman crap, Yes...). That is, until the end of the war, the Vladivostok port could not repair the only wok armored deck (and I still don’t remember the wonderful story of the absence of a second set of barrels for large-caliber naval guns - they saved; or how they collected weapons for the VSKR around the world - because the fleet could not give from stocks even 120 mm). That is, in the SF before the war, half of the EM needs repair of boilers and ADH - because there is no supply, water, electricity and steam in the base at the berths, and you have to drive a power plant and diesel engine. Then the ships of the USSR Navy have been waiting for a turn for repairs for years - and they wait only when they are simply written off after leaving the repair.
      2. +1
        April 10 2019 07: 39
        I understand you.
  17. -7
    April 8 2019 09: 52
    There is no floating dock and why is it not needed - now they are building dry docks. And if they need it, they will order new ones from the same "Zvezda".
  18. +9
    April 8 2019 09: 53
    the more you live, the less you are surprised at what is happening. The write-off of Kuznetsov means that there will never be carrier-based aircraft in Russia again. Putin's twenty-year-old began with a laconic answer, "She drowned." The twenty-year ticket will end with the answer to the question: "Where are the Kuznetsov's screws with the same answer -" they sank. "
    Sad and sad for the country. In the meantime ..
  19. +9
    April 8 2019 10: 07
    The author screams that a billion dollars for resuscitation Kuzi expensive? So, is 8-10 billion to build a new aircraft carrier cheap? Or is the dock only for Kuzi and is needed and there are no other things for him? or Kuzya himself doesn’t stick to the Far East? (remember how the Chinese pulled a similar case to their kicks). Or, maybe our shipbuilders have already laid 100-500 udk or helicopter carriers?
    Personal IMHO. If our fleet wants to have an aviation component. At least whatever., Then in the next 15-20 years Kuzya has no alternative according to the price-quality criterion. It can be upgraded with a minus sign (well, there, the launching of granite for museum exhibits will remain, part of the radar will be removed, maybe even the same air defense systems will be damaged. Maybe even part of the boilers will be removed with all the ensuing consequences for speed). But, Kuzya MUST be restored to be returned to system. How? He who wants to do something - is looking for a way, who wants not to do it - is looking for a reason.
    1. +2
      April 8 2019 10: 44
      Quote: tchoni
      The author screams that a billion dollars for resuscitation Kuzi expensive?
      Well, the whole Nimitz cost about $ 4 billion, so yes, a little expensive. Moreover, without an upgrade, only the necessary repairs. IMHO, Kuzyu must be saved until the next aircraft carrier.
      Explain what is the problem of raising the dock? But it is by its nature designed for immersion-ascent, it wasn’t bombed, why didn’t they use regular means to lift it?
      1. +6
        April 8 2019 10: 53
        It was clearly investigated - and found that the power set fell apart and you can only raise surrender. Once the plans for the rise went far into the beautiful and purely for utilitarian purposes - in order to clear this site for use without restrictions.

        There the design worked for wear. And it didn’t fall with an even keel - on an even bottom.
      2. -1
        April 8 2019 11: 45
        Why is a little expensive? Just right. The last ships of the series as races of 6 yards and cost. So this is a series of 10 ships. They started a new series with 8 yards apiece and gradually slipped to 12) A little too expensive, don't you find?
        1. -1
          April 8 2019 23: 50
          The last aircraft carrier costs $ 15 billion - ours will cost a trillion rubles with an air wing - like 30 frigates 22350.
      3. +3
        April 8 2019 15: 07
        Whole Nimitz cost 6 billion dollars in the last century. In this, taking into account inflation is much more expensive
      4. 0
        April 9 2019 09: 22
        He kind of cracked when he hit the ground ... request
    2. -5
      April 8 2019 10: 50
      Quote: tchoni
      If our fleet wants to have an aviation component. At least whatever., Then in the next 15-20 years Kuzya has no alternative according to the price-quality criterion.

      yes, quality is priceless for the price, right ..... but the aircraft component can be based on human conditions on the shore, and not wait for the weather by the sea .... and what is it that you are all killing about this link of old aircraft on the ship? where and when can it affect, change the combat situation? Yes, nowhere, give them calmness and a total of 5 pieces.
    3. +2
      April 8 2019 12: 55
      maybe the author just wants to say something else? That money, even if allocated for repairs, will go nowhere. It won't do any good. They will "repair", and then they will find a reason for the people, why not
      1. +1
        April 8 2019 13: 01
        Maybe so. Only then this reason was already found "the dock drowned" (or drowned). And the author clearly explains to the reader why you shouldn't worry about this topic. and it turns out that he is in the same bundle with the drowned dock? -))) And what? quite similar! and the site is suitable)
        1. 0
          April 8 2019 13: 05
          I think that is not so) The author is only assuming so far. There were no official statements on Kuznetsov.
    4. 0
      April 13 2019 16: 20
      Quote: tchoni
      but, Kuzya MUST be reinstated back into service

      What for ? What is the REAL combat mission that justifies this investment? What exactly will he do? Deck aircraft, and for what? There is a sense with full-fledged 3-4 AUG (preferably 5-6), but this is provided that the partners have everything at their current level, but doubts about this will build another 10-15 AUG and what? You will say that 10-15 AUG "more" is fantastic, well, and 3-4 AUG is not less fantasy here ..
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. 0
        April 15 2019 10: 08
        Quote: max702
        Deck aviation, and for what? There is a sense with full 3-4 AUG (better 5-6) but e

        There is a point even in one aircraft carrier ship. And deep and philosophical. To begin with, this is a blacksmith of cadres and a piggy bank of invaluable experience. (Well, how do we decide to return to the ocean in ten years? And we do not have pilots, not instructors, not admiral commanders capable of using aircraft carriers?)
        The second one. This is an opportunity to qualitatively increase the capabilities of air defense, anti-aircraft defense, or to improve the shock capabilities of grouping ships, significantly reducing the cost of one strike. The caliber is still a rather expensive missile, and when using the conventional warhead it is not more powerful than a bomb - five hundred. Drying for the departure of such pieces eight delivers, if not more (this is a volley of mrk). And drying per day can make up to three pieces. (MRK recharge I don’t even know how much will be)
        The same picture with air defense and anti-aircraft grouping of ships.
        But, first of all, Kuzya is a way to save personnel, application experience and the possibility of improving the methods of using aircraft-carrying ships in the fleet.
        1. -1
          April 15 2019 12: 52
          Quote: tchoni
          To begin with, this is a blacksmith of cadres and a piggy bank of invaluable experience. (Well, how do we decide to return to the ocean in ten years?

          The fleet is a very cumbersome thing with an extremely slow reaction, if in 10 years we decide to return, it means that we will return in 20-25 at best .. By this time, all today's decisions will become obsolete .. That's what the conversation is about sculpting AUG today anyway, what to do sailing ships in the era of armadillos .. Expensive and stupid, all the tasks that you listed are performed by other means much cheaper! And do not look at hypothetical scenarios that somewhere our AUG swam and planes bombed some enemy from it .. Which one? Where? What for? Planet earth has long been divided into zones of influence and on the sea, the ocean, therefore, there have been no major naval battles for more than 70 years, because everything could end in World War III. Aviation, because it’s universal, missile forces are the same, especially in the light of progress in technology, NEs are categorically necessary because they put an end to all conflicts .. look at the geography and the specifics of our trade with the rest of the world where and why we should go ? If someone beguiled the coast, then the VKS and the Strategic Missile Forces will explain everything completely and will guarantee that those vessels that perform the tasks we need no one dare touch .. Need firmness and determination, and not 3-3 AUG ..
          1. 0
            April 15 2019 13: 34
            Quote: max702
            The fleet is a very cumbersome thing with an extremely slow reaction, if in 10 years we decide to return, it means that we will return in 20-25 at best .. By this time, all today's decisions will become obsolete .. About

            That is why the Kuzya is needed primarily as a combat training and practical ship. Able to save staff (which, as you know, decide everything), but also to increase and preserve experience, adapting it to the current moment.
            And as for sailing ships in the era of battleships, I will tell you this: They continue to build them in the era of nuclear powered ships. Mostly as educational. But, some people advocate for cargo))) But seriously, as soon as the United States reduces its carrier program - we can talk about the futility of the aircraft carrier as a weapon. So far, sorry, the states are only expanding their program due to the introduction of new (oh and not cheap) pennants, and due to the equipping of the park of their U-F-35 c.
            And as for the price, I'll tell you this: an aircraft carrier is still one of the cheapest ways to deliver 500 kg of TNT equivalent to any destination in the world. Don't believe me? Calculate how much it costs to defeat one target with Kuzi aircraft and how much it costs. And, even taking into account the two sunk planes, Kuzya will win by a good margin. Or do you think that a base on someone else's territory is not worth anything? or is it very easy to deploy?
            1. 0
              April 15 2019 14: 35
              Quote: tchoni
              As for the price, I'll tell you this: an aircraft carrier is still one of the cheapest ways to deliver 500 kg of TNT equivalent to any destination in the world. Don't believe me? Calculate how much it costs to defeat one target by aviation with a "Kuzi" and how much "caliber"

              Kuzya, the aircraft carrier of the air defense and on the "ground" did not sharpen on this it is difficult to talk about the price, but any rocket and bomb launched from an aircraft taking off from a US aircraft carrier was estimated at at least 7.5 million / USD since this included the cost of the ship, air wing, maintenance and personnel training for all this .. So there is no need to talk about cheapness, the same tomahawk or caliber costs 1 million dollars of today's prices .. Forget about carrier-based aircraft, you don't need it anyhow! There are no goals or tasks that would pay for its existence .. As for the United States, firstly they live in debt, to put it mildly (though having won two world wars before that), and secondly, even taking into account the first, their economy is many times larger than ours, which allows such Wishlist .. As soon as we reach similar values, then we can start thinking about it, but for now it is a criminal waste of money.
              1. 0
                April 15 2019 19: 53
                Quote: max702
                Forget about deck aviation

                Well. if so, you can forget about the ocean fleet ... As, however, in general, about the fleet. Without an aviation component, it is useless, and if there is a ground aviation component, it is not needed
                1. 0
                  April 16 2019 10: 37
                  Quote: tchoni
                  Well. if so, you can forget about the ocean fleet ... As, however, in general, about the fleet. Without an aviation component, it is useless, and if there is a ground aviation component, it is not needed

                  Here I completely agree with you! It’s not necessary from the word at all, for it cannot bring any benefit ...
  20. +15
    April 8 2019 10: 16
    Does Russia need a fleet? Well, are the biggest yachts in the world for Abramovich, Timchenko and other patriots of Russia. And so we will manage cartoons about nuclear-powered rockets. The economy is at zero, and we grieve for the Soviet legacy. Desovetization, decommunization, de-Stalinization are our main tasks. It is enough for temporary workers to continue plundering natural resources and trading in Russian territories.
    1. +14
      April 8 2019 10: 35
      Well, then you can continue further:
      Do I need an 3 tank with zero unification (and, in fact, all 5)?
      T-72Б - an old hodgepodge from 85 to 89 + years. Which undergo repairs and VTG, without modernization.
      T-72Б3 - and there is at least 3 subtype for years that are still different.
      T-90 - also 2 tech + first 42 T-90M.
      T-80 - both old and modernized.
      T-14 - well, it’s clear here.

      3 tanks (T-72, T-80, T-14) have in fact zero unification.

      As for the fleet, I repeat - why then spend money at all? So why build a borea? I pointed out in a different topic yesterday.

      If there is no provision for deployment and access to launch areas (and 2x945A, 2x671RTMK, 4 ShchukiB vs 17 Virginia and 32 Elk can provide access), then SSBN will shoot ballistic missiles either from the base or from the near sea zone. To the dagger volley or exit to the volley from the pole - it will not be allowed to go out by opponents and the lack of support forces. Total efficiency of volley from the water area +/- will be equal to the efficiency of volley from mobile missile systems of the Topol or Yars type. However, on the 1 Northwind, with the condition of the entire life cycle, you can purchase 60 + mobile Yars with the provision of the entire life cycle. And the question is, why do we need Boreas if we abandon the fleet?
      1. +4
        April 8 2019 17: 30
        Quote: donavi49
        Total efficiency of volley from the water area +/- will be equal to the efficiency of volley from mobile missile systems of the Topol or Yars type.

        Efficiency will be equal only if all gates are brewed on the basis of the PGRK. smile

        In any other case (in the current state of the Navy), the effectiveness of PGRK will be higher than the SSBN. Just because PGRK can get out of the impact on the RPD and, having run up to the positions of wartime, work out a retaliatory strike (not retaliatory, but retaliation). But locked in the base of the SSBN nowhere to run and dive too. Only the first or retaliatory strike is available to them. They will not be able to strike back.
  21. AAK
    +11
    April 8 2019 11: 32
    Wherever you look, the well-fed polar fox everywhere in abusive terms and the first part of the eternal Russian misfortune ...
    Is it really that the elementary is not clear at the top, at first - the basic means and equipment, and only then - the products, even if they venerate Stalin if he lacks his mind ...
    Taking into account at least 4-5 years of real bringing "Kuznetsov" after the emergency to mind and complete obsolescence of the Su-33, it is more expedient - to scrap.
    On our own, we will not build a new floating dock of the necessary condition before 5-7 years, it is advisable to buy 2 in China or South Korea (and then, not the fact that they will sell)
    KIAP needs to be relocated to Novo-Fedorovka and Yeysk poetically, there are at least ground models of the deck there, even if the guys fly like that ..
    If (with the availability of money and SRZ capacity) to build a new "flight deck" - then only with catapults and nuclear power plants, no more ersatz ...
    1. +2
      April 10 2019 08: 27
      Quote: AAK
      it is advisable to buy 2 in China or South Korea

      Koreans for the needs of the Navy will not immediately sell. And even if you order a construction in China, it will still not work faster than the construction of a dry dock - the project must first be developed (about a year), the construction of such a dock itself, judging by the pace of construction of a floating dock for SSK "Zvezda" in China, will take exactly more than a year. Plus transportation to the Kola Bay. And seeing how we operate floating docks, we can say with confidence that a 100% dry dock will be safer and more durable at times. And most importantly, the price of the issue will be comparable.
  22. +1
    April 8 2019 11: 32
    Su-57 sold to China?
  23. +1
    April 8 2019 11: 47
    Unfortunately, far from everything is known to us about the condition of the ship. Let’s say, I’m interested in, why is a tugboat almost always present when entering the sea as part of a ship’s group? Also, for a full-fledged carrier group, guard ships in the right amount are needed, supply ships - all this is scraped into the air by the world. Deck aviation pilots are also apparently not enough. Does it make sense to push?
    1. +1
      April 8 2019 17: 32
      Quote: mik193
      Let’s say, I’m interested in, why is a tugboat almost always present when entering the sea as part of a ship’s group?

      Because we do not have more bases on which such tugs are located at other aircraft-bearing countries. Therefore, you always have to carry with you a stripped-down version of the floating rear.
    2. -1
      April 9 2019 09: 51
      Quote: mik193
      there is almost always a tugboat in the ship’s group

      and it doesn’t surprise you that with the dichotomy of any military convoy there is always a technical closure in the form of a tractor and specialists? it’s a normal practice of a long voyage, by the way, a tanker, though the meaning of such a tugboat is lost for the AB, it’s not very possible to move, so frigates are more convenient
      1. -1
        April 9 2019 15: 01
        Strange, but under the Union, ships went to military service without tugboats ...
        1. 0
          April 10 2019 11: 40
          Quote: mik193
          Strange, but under the Union, ships went to military service without tugboats ...

          So look at how many PMTOs or "points" the USSR had abroad, where the same floating rear was on duty.
          1. -1
            April 10 2019 13: 13
            Or maybe the thing is different? Maybe the materiel is so killed that it’s scary to go out to sea on it?
    3. 0
      April 10 2019 18: 43
      Because tugs as part of the fleet also participate in all exercises and other activities. Including the towing of "emergency" ships. Your commentary from the series, why do we need medics at the exercises of a motorized rifle battalion, there are no wounded. They also study and they find wounded for them. Yes, and elementary safety requirements. Better let it not be needed, than it will not be, but it will be needed. And you will tell your grandchildren the tales that were different in the USSR. have changed.
  24. +11
    April 8 2019 11: 55
    Nda! The inability to raise the floating dock located in the database says only one thing! About the complete decline and lack of professionalism of the rescue service! And if in the 20s of the last century a certain Ernest Cox, damn on small fins, scapa flow, in ten years raised almost the entire flooded German fleet. At the same time, having no education or notion in the lifting of ships. There’s nothing further to talk about. This is a shame from shame from which one cannot wipe out or justify oneself! Here is a reference to the book. (https://www.e-reading.club/book.php?book=15712) The rise of the German fleet is beautiful and dangerous in colors there. By the way, it can serve as a guide or training manual for the fleet.
    P.S. PD-50 sectional dock! So unmounting in sections and lifting in principle does not present significant problems, especially considering the shallow depths!
    1. +2
      April 9 2019 09: 55
      Quote: dgonni
      So unmount in sections and raise, in principle, does not represent significant problems

      typical reasoning of the command staff, in aprinzip it is possible to move the city of Moscow to another place ... only the price and expediency .... it’s like on a car if there is a small hole of delivery corrosion, then there are a lot of these holes when the sandbox is revealed, and the dock with I think it’s there, and the bottom is rusted up, and now it will break through in another place ..... its rise is fraught with difficulties, a very large structure, tearing apart ... it will work with a metal, and then after the rise it will completely replace the bottom, solution must take again specialists yes GOVERNMENTAL objective study of the dock and status of its provisions
      1. 0
        April 9 2019 10: 35
        You have a typical idea of ​​a person who does not even understand what he is talking about. DOC SECTION! this means that it consists of autonomous sections which are completely autonomous closed compartments with their shutoff valves! And cut NOTHING! Anchors and bolts down and voila, blow air and raise the section. Drag her to another dock and repair her health. Or do you think such monsters are being proved? That's right, the section was disconnected, taken to the very dock, repaired, and then in a circle!
        P.S. But amateurs, they are such amateurs :(
        1. -1
          April 9 2019 18: 11
          Quote: dgonni
          But amateurs, they are such amateurs

          I would like to look at the bolts with which you can twist such a colossus! and so that they do not burst ..... you have amateurish ideas about metal products, and the loads that the hull of the ship or dock experiences
          1. -2
            April 9 2019 19: 47
            You only saw bolts in your car wink . And you are far from the concept of an anchor and other questions like from the moon!
    2. +1
      April 9 2019 13: 05
      Quote: dgonni
      Nda! The inability to raise the floating dock located in the database says only one thing! About the complete decline and lack of professionalism of the rescue service! And if in the 20s of the last century a certain Ernest Cox, damn on small fins, scapa flow, in ten years raised almost the entire flooded German fleet. At the same time, having no education or notion in the lifting of ships. There’s nothing further to talk about. This is a shame from shame from which one cannot wipe out or justify oneself! Here is a reference to the book. (https://www.e-reading.club/book.php?book=15712) The rise of the German fleet is beautiful and dangerous in colors there. By the way, it can serve as a guide or training manual for the fleet.
      P.S. PD-50 sectional dock! So unmounting in sections and lifting in principle does not present significant problems, especially considering the shallow depths!

      Decline in the head must be treated, first of all
  25. +13
    April 8 2019 12: 02
    But the cartoons show everyone and shake the cam. Yes, we really swell money in temples, in museums ... This is all done to amuse the pride of the Minister of Defense.
    1. -1
      April 8 2019 12: 59
      first an accountant, then a "rescuer" .... when will a present general be put at the head of the Defense Ministry? Surovikin would have been put or something ... there would have been the entire GSh doing push-ups for the jambs
      1. +7
        April 8 2019 17: 43
        Quote: dirk182
        first an accountant, then a "rescuer" .... when will a present general be put at the head of the Defense Ministry?

        Think help?
        Remember the 90s. Then real officers of the soviet school sold and rented out almost the entire floating rear of the Pacific Fleet in just a couple of years. The rent of "Fotiy Krylov" was estimated at $ 1. However, businessmen in epaulets and warships did not disdain - the Pacific Fleet quickly shrank to a flotilla. The rest of the ships are on pins and needles.
        1. 0
          April 8 2019 18: 23
          Alexey, I remember (Just a faint spark of hope that some individuals may be pacified by "their" man in uniform
  26. 0
    April 8 2019 13: 47
    GRKR Moscow. Also a big question. Do not know about his future fate?
  27. +6
    April 8 2019 15: 20
    The situation is such that very soon in about 10 years we will be in the same place where Ukraine is now - that is, in ... well, we will no longer have a fleet except a mosquito. Sadness however .. Comrades are on the right track!
    1. -4
      April 8 2019 23: 57
      After 10 years - everything will be the same as it is now, only 10 Yasinoy will be like 10 Boreev.
  28. +8
    April 8 2019 15: 48
    Not a seaman, but took some part in the development of control systems for carrier-based aircraft and the Kuzi air defense system.
    My opinion. Kuzya has never been a full-fledged aircraft carrier and would hardly have become one even if not one, but several billions were spent on its modernization. This was a typical representative of the Soviet "aircraft-carrying" cruisers, which were neither full-fledged cruisers nor full-fledged aircraft carriers. In the USSR, a full-fledged aircraft carrier was developed and even began to be built, but it was "drowned" as the USSR itself was drowned, and at the same time projects of AWACS and U aircraft were drowned without which the aircraft carrier's air group is nothing more than a group of blind chicks, and projects of catapults, without which the aircraft AWACS and U cannot take off, and much more. So why should you now be exhausted from the impotence of your fearlessness? The train has left and is unlikely to return. And there is no sense in his return. Russia is not the United States or China, which needs to protect the sea routes of oil supplies, passing in the regions of the Middle East and the southern tip of Africa. Thank God, Russia has at least some oil of its own. In a full-scale war, the life of aircraft carriers is very limited. Finding AUG from satellites is a piece of cake. And then something ballistic or winged with its seeker is launched into the area where the AUG is located, and this something is quite capable of finding the AUG in this area, selecting the aircraft carrier from every little thing and ... hello to Neptune.
    Therefore, before arguing about saving Kuzya or not, it would be good to finally decide on the military doctrine of the Russian Federation, the place of the Navy in this doctrine, what tasks the Navy should solve and what kind of force of funds is required to solve these problems.
    The slogan "Give us everything and more" never worked even in the best of times, it will not work now.
    Well, it would be good for all of us to understand that the state budget is the best feeder for dishonest people, of whom now is unmeasured on all levels of government. They understood this before the collapse of the Union and attended to access to the trough was only for them.
    Well, so that the people did not ask unnecessary questions, a whole strategy was built, in which all the institutions of the Russian State (industry, armed forces, etc.) were externally preserved and the stormy activity of these institutions was portrayed. And on the quiet went and continues to go robbery and cutting the budget of unimaginable sizes, which the American "sawers" never dreamed of. By the way, one of the first in the cut of the state budget was the Ministry of Emergency Situations of the venerable Shoigu. How can one calculate how many millions were spent on fighting the elements and how many of them ended up in the pockets of the EMERCOM authorities?
    Although I live in Minsk, there are many friends and former colleagues in all the former republics of the Union. A couple of years ago I was in St. Petersburg and drove past a plant where, during the Soviet era, they made hydroacoustics for nuclear submarines, including for Sharks, and which I had to visit a couple of times. The plant was equipped with the most advanced technology available at the time, including large printed circuit boards using precision technology purchased "through the back porch" from the Brit. Now from the plant there are horns and legs. Most of the production area is given to "businessmen". Naturally, the formal owners (director and co) of these areas have a pretty piece of these businessmen. And if this happened only at one plant. But EVERYWHERE. So what big fleet are we talking about after that?
    1. +2
      April 8 2019 17: 55
      Quote: gregor6549
      In the USSR, a full-fledged aircraft carrier was developed and even began to be built, but it was "drowned" as the USSR itself was drowned, and at the same time the projects of AWACS and U aircraft were drowned. AWACS and U cannot take off, and much more.

      If you're talking about 11437, then this is the third approach to the projectile.
      At first there were 1160 and 1153. Classic aircraft carriers with catapults, nuclear power plants, full-fledged carrier-based aircraft and AWACS. They were sunk at the stage of the project - they sacrificed to the continuation of the construction of project 1143 (specifically - 11433). The initiator is well-known - amateur SECP comrade Ustinov.
      Then there was the first project 11435. With the usual GEM, but with catapults. The catapult was made and passed factory tests. But first Ustinov demanded to remake the ship under SKVP, and then Amelko promptly stopped all work on the catapult. The catapult was removed from the project, and ordinary planes in the air group were left only due to the appearance of the Su-27 with the MiG-29 and the installation of a springboard.
      It was possible to sell the MO to a full-fledged AB only by the seventh TAVKR - pr.11437. Moreover, EMNIP Morin, wrote that, despite the project number, pr 11437 was not a continuation of the line 11431-11436, but was a return to pr 1160.
  29. +3
    April 8 2019 15: 50
    Shoigu is doing everything right. Soon, all the same, everyone will switch to unmanned vehicles ... spacecraft. So why spend money on trash that will become obsolete in a few decades. :) It’s more important to buy a property from a potential adversary. :)
  30. -1
    April 8 2019 18: 03
    In fact, the solution to repair the "Admiral Kuznetsov" has long been found - the repair for us will be carried out in China. In return, some technology will be transferred to China, see the link below for details:

    https://yandex.ru/turbo?text=https%3A%2F%2Fura.news%2Fnews%2F1052365819&d=1
  31. +1
    April 8 2019 18: 22
    "You are land animals, and we are sea ..." Sir Winston explained the situation at sea to Generalissimo Joseph Vissarionitch. Stalin was furious - "so, in your opinion, I know nothing about naval affairs?" "Believe me, I know a lot about the sea .." - the prime minister, who was thoroughly laden with brandy, muttered soothingly in a tangled tongue. The last Sailor was Tsar Peter 1 in our state protected by God.
  32. -1
    April 8 2019 18: 26
    The Su-33 is currently being upgraded to the version of the Su-33M, some of the aircraft have already been modernized and transferred to the Navy. For details, see the link below:

    https://dfnc.ru/c106-technika/morskaya-aviatsiya-rossii-poluchila-ocherednuyu-partiyu-modernizirovannyh-palubnyh-istrebitelej-su-33/
    1. +1
      April 8 2019 19: 13
      This "modernization" has already been chewed on in another topic. Look if you're interested.
      1. -1
        April 8 2019 20: 38
        I just disagree with the author this article that writes:
        But the Su-33 is already an outright air junk. At the level of conventional MiG-29s, which are in service with the Papuans and rogues

        Before modernization, it’s possible. But not after modernization.

        And, meanwhile, the upgraded Su-33M have already begun to arrive at the Navy.
        1. 0
          April 9 2019 07: 11
          Yes, what has changed in them ??? Radars would be new then. And it would be better if they bought new cars. No unification in the troops.
  33. +1
    April 8 2019 19: 13
    Traditionally, we’ll build ships for the Soviet-Russian fleet, but we’ll think about repairs later, we built an aircraft carrier, before there weren’t one, and a lousy floating ship built-very expensive for K. Sormovo built floating ships for every submarine, and nothing the only one in the whole North, and he drowned, but cannot be raised?
  34. +2
    April 8 2019 20: 46
    The sea mess with the PD-50 drowning revealed a big problem in the heads of the Great Uncles of the Navy. As with the introduction of the aircraft carrier "Kiev", due to the lack of an auxiliary base infrastructure, the vehicle's motor resource was ineptly spent. And now Kuznetsov for the scrap ??? Or is it easier to add money and resources, including docks?
    1. +1
      April 8 2019 23: 58
      Actually, the PD 50 is owned by Rosneft.
  35. 0
    April 8 2019 20: 47
    but what kind of patrol ships we have without weapons, and what kind of communication boats, there is a feeling that at the head of the navy there is one stupidity
    1. 0
      April 9 2019 00: 01
      And what kind of patrol ships - the coast guard, should have weapons? You do not confuse them with RTOs, corvettes and frigates.
      1. 0
        April 10 2019 11: 44
        Quote: Vadim237
        And what kind of patrol ships - the coast guard, should have weapons?

        У naval patrol ships should have a normal PLO and at least some sort of air defense for self-defense.
        And we ordered for the fleet ships with weapons like those of the PSKR. No, as part of BOHR 22160 would have looked quite out of place. But they didn’t buy them for border guards, but for the Navy.
  36. 0
    April 8 2019 20: 56
    To build at least a new floating dock, at least a coastal dock is not a problem. Allocate a place and give money - in a year there will be the first coastal dock. Further it will be possible to build these docks piece by piece per year. I recently looked at the plans of the harbor, where the float drowned - there you can put twenty docks along the banks. The size is approximately 500 by 75 meters. And it will cost inexpensively, if you don’t, Grefs and Kudrinoids should not be allowed to the people's money. Plus, orders from dock construction will revitalize metallurgy and the building materials industry. After all, 200 thousand cubic meters of concrete per year and one hundred thousand tons of iron will our industry pull? And how many new technologies can be developed! Underwater tractors - bulldozers, automatic welding, concreting large volumes at sea ...
  37. -2
    April 8 2019 20: 56
    Quote: Twodi
    Maybe Kuzyu really should be scrapped, he is out of date anyway. As far as I know, it is planned to build a dry dock for the construction of large floating docks. And orders for the docks are already available. So everything is ahead. And Kuzya, maybe if they stop pouring money into him and start financing the construction of a new aircraft carrier, we’ll get a new modern ship faster.

    Or maybe the "managers" at all levels are sent to the "junk" - you look, and the drowned dock will be raised, and the money will be found for the modernization of old and construction of new ships! And not only them ... winked wink
  38. 0
    April 8 2019 21: 15
    Somehow everyone considers the drowning of the dock only as mismanagement. And I, for example, do not exclude the possibility of conscious sabotage.

    I hope that the FSB is considering all possible versions, otherwise the following docks may be at risk.
    1. 0
      20 January 2021 04: 24
      Yes, sabotage is possible. But, most likely, there is low literacy, poor education and failure to comply with more than half of the general rules for the operation of the former military dock. The defense capability of Russia has been damaged. As a director, Ch. the engineer, the dock master, the dock mechanic, they took inappropriate performers. Almost random people.
  39. +1
    April 8 2019 22: 58
    A. Fedorov. In Sevastopol, using the primitive technique in the 19th century, three dry docks Alekseevsky, Aleksandrovsky and Severny were built. Having a ready-made working draft and modern equipment, Metrostroy will have no problem building a dry dock.
  40. -2
    April 9 2019 04: 17
    "We have, as it were, problems with the construction of a ship larger than a corvette" ... Not quite so, nuclear icebreakers are being built, in comparison with which corvettes are just boats, a floating nuclear power plant has been built, many things are being laid. It is no longer allowed to simply waste money, now money is gradually learning to count. Yes, one aircraft carrier in the navy seems to be not a sin, as well as a couple - three "eagles" ... but if you create strike groups according to your mind, then it does not interfere with each having an aircraft carrier, but really why? What are the geopolitical goals? Just iron the oceans and show the flag? So you need to supply such formations, have bases, you need ships of different classes, supply vessels, an auxiliary fleet ... will it pull the Russian budget or will it overstrain? Do you need this or are there asymmetric alternatives?
  41. -3
    April 9 2019 05: 52
    and not the expensive toys of the Army Games shooting gallery, exhibitions and modest churches for 6 visitors.


    "toys" made it possible and allow us to raise the level of combat readiness of the Russian army, and the temple in honor of military victories and exploits of our great people allows us to raise and preserve those remnants of patriotism that have not yet had time to ruin liberal education and upbringing.
  42. -6
    April 9 2019 07: 51
    Another article of nausea, all-props))) Do you have at least one positive become ???
  43. +1
    April 9 2019 08: 13
    Thank you for the article ... God, how sad it all is ... Irony there is definitely no place ...
  44. +2
    April 9 2019 09: 50
    Quote: lopvlad
    and not the expensive toys of the Army Games shooting gallery, exhibitions and modest churches for 6 visitors.


    "toys" made it possible and allow us to raise the level of combat readiness of the Russian army, and the temple in honor of military victories and exploits of our great people allows us to raise and preserve those remnants of patriotism that have not yet had time to ruin liberal education and upbringing.


    Without a temple, patriotism cannot be supported in any way? Do we have few temples and churches? What century do you live in, dear?
    In Russia, the absence of a national idea and the distortion of the very concept of "patriotism" results in the fact that the average man in the street no longer understands what these words mean. You can, of course, attach a St. George ribbon to all places and paste over your car with inscriptions like "To Berlin", and cherish yourself with the thought that this is real patriotism.
    And you can look a little wider than your ordinary outlook, put aside the imposition of "external" enemies and see if everything is fine with us in our native Fatherland? Maybe it's time to start putting things in order in the country. How? Yes, start with yourself. Stop littering on the street, start observing traffic rules, help the weak and the old, fight injustice and theft, look into the future, not the past, stop cherishing yourself and others with imperial ambitions?
    Maybe this is real patriotism?
    1. 0
      April 9 2019 10: 39
      Do you really think that self-restraint, and not self-development, is the path to prosperity?
      1. +1
        April 10 2019 11: 49
        Quote: Sancho_SP
        Do you really think that self-restraint, and not self-development, is the path to prosperity?

        First, prosperity, then self-development. For self-development needs a base - it’s very difficult to think about high, when there is nothing to eat, it’s very difficult to engage in high-tech, when no one can realize your ideas.
        And, as practice shows, the path to prosperity lies precisely through self-restraint. The "Asian Tigers" did not rise at all at the expense of freedom, democracy and the value of the individual, but at the expense of hard work, a planned economy and the harsh suppression of all fluctuations from the general line of the party - no matter what the party was. Lee Kuan Yoo, Ro Dae Woo, and Jung Doo Hwan are examples of this.
        And then, when there is a reliable basis - you can release the tightened nuts a little.

        However, even in the cradle of democracy, the basis of prosperity was being built in those years when the striking workers were dispersed by bandits with "Tommy-Guns", and cavalry, tanks and combat chemistry (adamsite) were used against the WWII veterans who went out on the protest march.
        1. 0
          20 January 2021 04: 05
          Confusing arguments in places. There is no prosperity from scratch. Only flowers, maybe. First development, and only then prosperity. PROSPERITY also slides along with development. Best the enemy of the good. And in fact, "why look for the complex when there is a lot of incomprehensible simple around."
  45. -2
    April 9 2019 10: 38
    It is obvious to everyone that Kuznetsov is an unsuccessful aircraft carrier. But - the only one. And the decision should be made not by Kuznetsov himself, but by aircraft carriers in general. There is an opinion that we do not need them.
    1. 0
      20 January 2021 04: 14
      Dear friend! To put it mildly, it is not correct to write on behalf of other people, using the words "obviously" and "we do not need them." You have no moral or legal right to do so. The desire to write beautifully and look a little downwardly will not work. "Not a hat for Senka.
      1. 0
        20 January 2021 18: 34
        Are you sure that by “us” I also meant you? Do you have the right to write for others? Well, that's nothing;)
  46. +1
    April 9 2019 11: 27
    ))) not an article but some kind of panic ... it’s not up to the author to decide! there is a problem .. and I think that there is a solution!
    1. 0
      April 11 2019 20: 31
      Of course there is, and Shaigu has already said that "they are going to complete the repair and modernization of the heavy aircraft-carrying cruiser Admiral Kuznetsov by the end of next year."

      См.: https://yandex.ru/turbo?text=https%3A%2F%2Fmilitary.pravda.ru%2Fnews%2F1412349-kuznetsov%2F&promo=navbar&utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fzen.yandex.com
  47. 0
    April 9 2019 22: 08
    Quote: dgonni
    You are far from the moon!

    rather you
  48. 0
    April 10 2019 17: 21
    The dock must be lifted unambiguously. Otherwise, it’s not worth the price of environmental inclinations towards the "green" with the cleaning of the Arctic from Soviet rusty barrels, when we throw thousands of tons of iron in the bay, which can and should be useful.
    1. 0
      April 10 2019 19: 02
      Needless to say, anyway. However, the desire to build without fail a super-lifespan is very spiritually elevated, if one does not want to make a flooding (excluding inability by definition and karma).
  49. 0
    April 13 2019 23: 10
    No duck? Then - the execution.
  50. 0
    April 22 2019 10: 01
    50 billion to ensure that this constantly breaking old ship served 10 for years?

    48 yards to the zenith arena is normal. 50 yards for the country's only aircraft carrier is expensive. Yes Yes.
  51. 0
    9 June 2019 15: 26
    Yes and no. On the one hand, if Russia needs a navy...then yes, something needs to be done yesterday...But on the other hand, does it need it? If you remember the Republic of Ingushetia, the fleet there really was a full-fledged support of the country. And let us remember the Union... during which the fleet, to put it mildly, showed nothing during the wars... I lied about showing the courage of the sailors and their fighting spirit in the ranks of the Marine Corps for which they have honor and praise... but building and maintaining ships is for so that the sailors could then be turned into shock infantry? It seems to me that after the Revolution we lost the “maritime tradition” and it cannot be restored on its own. I do not dispute the importance of the nuclear triad... and ships as transports of troops and cargo... But it is quite obvious that we do not have the capabilities... and they did not exist during the Soviet era to build a Fleet that could threaten and resist NATO (we have less, ports, shipyards, docks, brains).......only if underwater. Plus, the role of the fleet in the new conditions of warfare is questionable, I’m talking about “hypersonics” ..it seems to me that the surface fleet is gradually turning into an expensive, prestigious but useless toy... and therefore Kuznetsov is doomed.
  52. 0
    20 January 2021 03: 54
    It is possible to raise the dock. Briefly, it looks like this.
    1 sealing of buoyancy reserve compartments.
    2 pumping water out of them. The dock pops up and it becomes possible to work in towers with systems. The dock will gain waterline and stability.
    3 Repair of pumps and clinkers.
    4 While lifting the dock, determine the possible damage to the ballast pontoons from the rocks at the bottom of the pit and determine the procedure for self-repair of the pontoons and the simultaneous use of the dock for its intended purpose.
    About cruiser propellers. The propellers have definitely rolled off the deck and are lying on the ground. The dock has a list and trim. The depth of the pit at the intended location of the propellers is about 60 m. (data from the Internet) To install them without inserting them into the dock, you need to fit a dinghy of sufficient lifting capacity to the stern of the dock. At the same time, tamp the bow until the propeller shafts come out of the water. And, then, using the dinghy in the same way as a slipway deck, place the screws on the cones. Using calculations, you need to check the stability of the ship in a convenient position for work. Best regards. Petr Slepenkov. shipbuilding engineer.