Military Review

Non-162 Salamander - jet "people's fighter" of the Third Reich

115
Fighter Non-162 Salamander (Salamander) today causes many people to respect the incredible efforts that made the German aircraft industry in a rather scary for her conditions of the end of the Second World War. In total, 69 days separated the start of the construction of the Non-162 fighter from the flight of the first prototype of the machine, which took place in December 1944. Designed as a turbojet interceptor fighter the aircraft was built using wood - to reduce the cost and facilitate production. Now it is impossible to believe, but the German industry was going to build up to 4000 data planes per month. Naturally, these figures were utopian.


History the creation of this fighter, probably, is the most exciting among all ever created combat aircraft. The idea of ​​building the so-called "Folksgerer" - "people's fighter" was born in the mind of the chief of the specially created "fighter headquarters" Otto Zaur, who was the protégé of the German Minister of Arms Albert Speer. From the appearance of the idea to the construction of the first plane, it took just 90 days! The idea of ​​a "national fighter" envisaged the development of a cheap, simple fighter, which would be suitable for mass production using low-skilled labor and cheap materials.

The reason for the birth of this idea was the weakness of the German air defense system, which by the autumn of 1944 had already become obvious enough for the leadership of the Third Reich. Bearing this in mind, the Ministry aviation Germany accepted the idea of ​​holding a competition for the development of a jet fighter, which was supposed to be produced in sufficiently large volumes - from 1000 to 5000 fighters per month. Competitive conditions were sent to all the major aircraft manufacturing companies in the country and contained a list of the following tactical and technical requirements for the future aircraft:

Maximum speed up to 750 km / h
BMW-003 engine with xNUMX kgf.
Wing load on the wing no more than 200 kg / m2
Maximum flight time at the ground 20 min.
Armament: 1 or 2 gun MK-108.
The maximum range of the takeoff of the aircraft is no more than 0,5 km.
Armor weight not more than 50 kg., It was supposed to be used only in front
Aircraft take-off weight not more than 2000 kg.
Non-162 Salamander - jet "people's fighter" of the Third Reich

In addition, among the requirements indicated simplicity of the machine equipment and cheaper production, ease of piloting. It was also interesting that the tree was decided to use in the design of the wings.

Heinkel received all the necessary 8 September 1944 documents for this competition, and already on September 24, the company’s design team based in Vienna began to design the future fighter, which received the designation Non-162 and the factory designation “Salamander”. By the beginning of November, they had prepared the working drawings of the machine, while as the drawings were ready, the production of separate units and fighter units was carried out. All this made it possible to finish work on the interceptor fighter already by 6 December 1944. On the same day, the first Non-162 took off.

Description of construction

Heinkel He-162 was a single-engine single-seat fighter equipped with a turbojet engine. It was a high-profile mixed design with spaced vertical tail and tricycle landing gear, the front pillar of which was manageable.

The front of the fuselage to the wing was detachable monocoque type, the rest of the half-monocoque. The design was mainly metal, with the chassis compartment flaps, nose fairing, battery compartment cover, weapon hatches, and the inside walls of the fuselage fuel tank compartment made of wood. Above behind the cockpit mounted wing, and above it was installed engine nacelle. The aircraft differed unusual top engine. The turbojet engine was attached to the front of the fuselage with 2-me in the front with vertical bolts, and 2-me with horizontal bolts in the back.

The wing of the plane was wooden. It was one-piece, trapezoidal and two-spar. Its working sheathing was 4-5 mm thick. and was plywood. Duralumin was only wing tips, which deviated downward at an angle of 55 degrees. The wing was attached to the fuselage of the fighter using 4 bolts. Between the wing spars were located 2 small fuel tank. The flaps and ailerons were also wooden. The flap drive was hydraulic, and the aileron was mechanical.

The landing gear was three-post, retractable. The front landing gear in the retracted position was in a special niche, located under the dashboard. The size of the front wheel was 380 on the 150 mm., Buna or Continental tires were used on the front pillar. The main landing gear were a cantilever type and were fastened to the fuselage of the car and retract into it back against the direction of flight. The wheels of the main chassis were 660 size on 190 mm. The landing gear drive was hydraulic, and their release was a mechanical spring drive. Chassis cushioning was oil. The chassis was equipped with drum brakes. The doors of the chassis niches were also made of wood, but were reinforced with duralumin elements.

The cockpit canopy was made of Plexiglas and was two-piece. The back of the lamp was folded back and upwards; in the open position, it could be fixed with the aid of a stop and a lock. On the left side in the cockpit lantern there was a glazed round ventilation vent. The cockpit was not sealed. A collimator sight of two types of Revi 16A or Revi 16B was mounted in the cab, which was mounted on a special bracket mounted above the dashboard. Navigation instruments, engine controls, radio equipment were placed on the dashboard and partly on the side consoles. The pilot's seat on this fighter was catapulted, was adapted for laying a parachute and used a powder charge. Immediately behind the pilot's seat was an armored plate.

The fighter was fitted with a BMW-003E1 turbojet with a weight of kgf in 800. The engine allowed the plane to reach speed at an altitude in the area of ​​900 km / h. The fuel supply was equal to 945 liters, of which 763 liters were in the fuselage tank, which was immediately behind the flight seat, another 182 liters were in 2-x wing tanks.

Armament aircraft consisted of 2-x automatic guns, which were different depending on the modification of the aircraft. In the Non-162 A-1 modification, these were the 30-mm Rheinmetall-Borsig MK 108 cannons with 50 ammunition on the barrel, in the Non-162 A-2 modification, two automatic Mauser MG 20 / XNX guns were used, two Mauser MG 151 / XNX automatic cannons used in the Non-20 A-120 modification. 151 shells on the barrel. In the process of firing, liners and chain links were ejected through special openings in the bottom of the aircraft fuselage. The reloading and lowering of the guns on the MG 20 / 108 was electric, and on the MK XNUMX guns, electropneumatic.

Production and combat use

In order to ensure the production of non-162 fighters in the context of the ongoing raids of Allied aviation, most of the enterprises were moved underground. So only in the abandoned gypsum mines in Mödling (near Vienna) the allies found an assembly plant, in the shops of which at different stages of readiness more than 1000 Non-162 fighters were found. The serial production of these machines was started only in January of the 1945 year, when it was possible to assemble the first 6 aircraft. In total, before the end of the war, the enterprises handed over parts of the Luftwaffe around 120 airplanes, and even more 200 vehicles were factory tested at that time.

Despite its high performance characteristics, the Salamander never became a lifesaver for the Luftwaffe. There is no reliable data on the number of Allied airplanes shot down by them, but the score here goes to one. This was largely due to the fact that the "people's fighter" was not an airplane for beginners. Non-162 due to the installation of the engine above the fuselage had an unstable pitch. The fighter was not the most pleasant to operate the machine, which required very high accuracy from the pilot. It was not by chance that the first rule for pilots of these fighters was: “Always operate smoothly with the control knob — no abrupt maneuvers, no abrupt movements!” Even experienced pilots needed to undergo substantial flight training in order to get used to the fighter, to develop the necessary “car feeling”.

All this led to numerous accidents and disasters involving these aircraft. Many of them were due to design miscalculations, as well as manufacturing defects of fighters. So only during 3 weeks from April 13 and until the end of the war 1 squadron of 1 squadron, which was armed with non-162 fighters, lost 13 fighters and 10 pilots. However, only the 3 fighter were shot down by the Allies, the rest belonged to non-combat losses. Thus, only in this squadron for every 2 day did the average 1 crash occur.

Separately, it should be noted that all these results must be viewed in the context of the total collapse of the armed forces and industry in Germany in the final months of the war as a result of the actual defeat of the Reich. In the event that the fighter reached the combat units at least a year earlier, the results of its combat use could be completely different.

Performance characteristics of the He-162a-2

Dimensions: wing span - 7,02 m., Length - 9,03 m, height - 2,6 m.
Wing area - 11,1 square. m
The weight of the aircraft, kg
- empty - 1 664
- normal takeoff - 2 600
- maximum take-off - 2 800
Engine type - 1 TRD BMW-003, thrust 800 kg.
Maximum speed at altitude - 900 km / h.
Practical range - 970 km.
Practical ceiling - 12 000 m.
Crew - 1 man
Armament: 2 × 20-mm guns MG-151 / 20 with 120 shells on the barrel.

Sources used:
www.airpages.ru/lw/he162.shtml
www.pro-samolet.ru/samolety-germany-ww2/reaktiv/200-he-162-salamandra
www.airwar.ru/enc/fww2/he162.html
www.airx.ru/planes/he162/he162.html
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115 comments
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  1. biglow
    biglow 23 June 2012 09: 38
    +4
    all this equipment couldn’t help the Germans even a year before or before. Retribution is like a guillotine movement, it can’t be stopped by anything. Moreover, the Germans had a resource hunger, Raw materials for industry ended, and after May 9 all German industry could live a couple of weeks no more. There are memoirs of the German Minister of Arms Speer, everything is painted in detail there
    1. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 43
      0
      until the fall is easy, if not until 1946
      1. sergeyezhov
        sergeyezhov 17 May 2018 20: 04
        +4
        Quote: YELLOWSTONE
        until the fall is easy, if not until 1946

        How could they survive until the 46th year if in August 45 they had already bombarded Japan with atomic bombs? I don’t think Truman would doubt for a long time. It is fortunate for Germany that they lost in May 45th. Otherwise, there would still be a radioactive desert instead of Berlin and Munich and other German cities.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 20: 19
          +2
          very simple, there was German uranium in Hiroshima yes
          it’s happiness for all that the Russians resisted in Hungary in March and took Berlin in May 1945
          and the Germans also had sarin and soman, and with the help of V-1 and V-2 they could fill the whole of England with the waste from their nuclear program, and the coastal states would also get it.
          the second time everyone (the United States in particular) was lucky when the USSR stopped Japanese experiments with plague and anthrax in China.
        2. Vadivak
          Vadivak 18 May 2018 11: 35
          +2
          Quote: sergeyezhov
          I don’t think Truman would doubt for a long time.

          Germany is not Japan, it was already in the plans for the post-war confrontation of the USSR
          1. YELLOWSTONE
            YELLOWSTONE 18 May 2018 20: 34
            0
            so Japan has always been in such plans, it’s just that the Germans had something to answer like the Japanese for the time being
            and you can’t just drive the German diaspora into concentration camps, they are the majority in the 5 northern states
        3. RUSS
          RUSS 20 May 2018 07: 31
          +1
          Quote: sergeyezhov
          Otherwise, there would still be a radioactive desert instead of Berlin and Munich and other German cities.

          There is no radioactive desert in Nagasaki and Hiroshima right now.
    2. gladcu2
      gladcu2 16 May 2018 23: 59
      +3
      Not bad.

      Shove a practical range of 2 km into 940 tons. Rather, the maximum. Two 20 mm guns with 150 rounds each. Pilot and armored back. As well as fuel supply ....

      Mdaaaa ...

      Alfred Speer, however, a rare instance of homo sapiens. So be able to motivate the country to work. Even lawns were trimmed in the factories.

      But he went without security, in his car.
      1. sergeyezhov
        sergeyezhov 17 May 2018 20: 07
        +2
        Quote: gladcu2
        Alfred Speer, however, a rare instance of homo sapiens. So be able to motivate the country to work. Even lawns were trimmed in the factories

        Soviet Vannikov turned out to be cooler than him. Speer could not set up the production of military products of the required quantity and quality in the conditions of retreat.
    3. nikoliski
      nikoliski 17 May 2018 01: 09
      +1
      all this is clear, but amazing developments (the same Wehrmacht flying saucer) amaze the country that had television in Berlin in 38 in my opinion and was then more advanced than the degrading modern Ukraine
      1. Alf
        Alf 17 May 2018 22: 22
        +3
        Quote: nikoliski
        (the same flying saucer of the Wehrmacht)

        You can PHOTO (rather than drawings), where, when, how much is released, where it was used?
        Quote: nikoliski
        38 year old country television in Berlin

        In the USSR, television broadcasting began in
        The first broadcast of television images on the radio in the USSR was made on April 29 and May 2, 1931. They were carried out with the decomposition of the image into 30 lines. Using the RVEI-1 short-wave transmitter of the All-Union Electrotechnical Institute (Moscow), images of a live face and photograph were transmitted at a wavelength of 56,6 meters. In 1938, the first experimental television centers in Moscow and Leningrad were commissioned in the USSR. The decomposition of the transmitted image in Moscow was 343 lines, and in Leningrad –240 lines at 25 frames per second. On July 25, 1940, a decomposition standard of 441 lines was approved.

        The first successes of television broadcasting made it possible to begin to develop industrial designs of television receivers. In 1938, serial production of console receivers for 343 lines of the TK-1 type with a screen size of 14 × 18 cm began. Despite the fact that during the Great Patriotic War television broadcasting was stopped, research work in the field of creating more advanced television equipment did not stop.

        In the US, too, zombies began to show in the late 30s.
    4. svp67
      svp67 17 May 2018 12: 53
      0
      Quote: biglow
      this technology couldn’t help the Germans

      This is certainly NOTHING. A plane in which there was so much wood, even with a jet engine, was already very poorly performing its duties on the battlefield, even against slower piston aircraft, it was not for nothing that they easily shot down it. And even the upper location of the wing and the engine is not the right decision on the issue of favor and comfortable leaving the faulty aircraft by the pilot.
  2. understudy
    understudy 23 June 2012 11: 07
    +16
    The more such information, the more there are thoughts that the Germans were helped, at least, by "aliens". There are a lot of really "breakthrough" solutions and real achievements ...
    1. starded
      starded 23 June 2012 18: 01
      +1
      The SS were ordinary Satanists. This is a known fact. Who "helped" them - the answer is obvious ...
      1. Hole puncher
        Hole puncher 16 May 2018 17: 14
        +1
        Quote: starded
        Who "helped" them - the answer is obvious

        Satan?
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 46
          0
          did the adik have a nickname?
          1. sergo1914
            sergo1914 16 May 2018 22: 45
            0
            Quote: YELLOWSTONE
            did the adik have a nickname?


            Well, the Fuhrer. So what?
            1. YELLOWSTONE
              YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 23: 20
              +1
              it’s a party position, and the nickname is corporal or “possessed Fuhrer”
              1. sergo1914
                sergo1914 17 May 2018 10: 39
                0
                Quote: YELLOWSTONE
                it’s a party position, and the nickname is corporal or “possessed Fuhrer”


                Corporal - nickname? I thought the military rank.
                1. YELLOWSTONE
                  YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 11: 49
                  0
                  also a nickname, after WWI he was a lieutenant when he came under the gas like a corporal
                  1. alatanas
                    alatanas 17 May 2018 15: 19
                    0
                    Well, duck corporal and corporal are one and the same.
                    1. YELLOWSTONE
                      YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 15: 24
                      0
                      well, the lieutenant is definitely not
                      1. alatanas
                        alatanas 17 May 2018 18: 20
                        +1
                        He was not a lieutenant. They wrote off the rank of corporal, as I know.
                    2. YELLOWSTONE
                      YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 19: 57
                      +1
                      he received the corporal back in the autumn of 1914, he fought almost until the end of the war, which he met in the hospital with slight poisoning, so no one wrote him off
                      for 4 years with that mortality rise above the corporal no problem
      2. gladcu2
        gladcu2 17 May 2018 00: 06
        0
        Stupidity.

        Satanists, not Satanists are tales.

        The motivation for fascism is absolutely the same as for Soviet ideology.

        Even comrades called each other.

        The difference is that fascism is a format of CONSERVATION of capitalism. Fascism is the connection of the state, the financial oligarchy and the people, under the idea of ​​national superiority.

        Communism-socialism is already defeated capitalism. Almost. Since the monetary system will be preserved.

        Socialism is the connection between the state and the people with complete absence or complete control of the financial sector.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 19: 59
          0
          how so, it turns out Muslims with their banking live under socialism?
    2. biglow
      biglow 23 June 2012 19: 23
      +6
      The Germans began to engage in jet engines as early as the 20s, as did our queens in their 30s, and such a breakthrough in technology occurred because in a state of agony the state agreed to implement any of the craziest and most raw projects that would normally require a long development and normal tests. The same speer, the Minister of Armaments wrote in his memoirs that defense firms brought the most incredible and often useless projects for orders and financing, but in the conditions of war, a thoughtful technical examination of cases There was no one and once and they approved everything at once. Of course there were pearls in a pile of dirt, but there was also a lot of dirt
      1. Gamdlislyam
        Gamdlislyam 25 June 2012 08: 00
        +5
        The Germans began to engage in rocket and "jet engines as early as 20 years" because they did not fall under the prohibition of the Versailles Peace Treaty of 1919, unlike piston engines.
        In the 30s, we began to engage in jet engines. In-line engines have been developed. Arkhip Mikhailovich Lyulka was engaged in this turbojet engine. In 1939-41, he began to build a prototype, but in connection with the war, work was stopped. In 1943, work on the engine was resumed. In 1946, the engines were tested and installed on a 4-engine IL-22 (did not go into the series). But the subsequent engines Lyulka AM already mass-produced.
    3. Zerstorer
      Zerstorer 24 June 2012 09: 42
      +2
      They just paid a lot of attention to basic research. For example, they built the first supersonic wind tunnel in 1909! Practical research on supersound dates back to 40 years (I may be mistaken, please clarify).
      1. Aviator_
        Aviator_ 16 May 2018 22: 55
        +2
        Of course you are mistaken, especially about the supersonic tube in the 1909 year. Do not confuse a supersonic jet from a tank with a supersonic wind tunnel. There is such a book, “Applied Gas Dynamics,” by G. N. Abramovich, it is perfectly shown there that for air the pressure drop above 1,89 already gives a supersonic outflow. The outflow from any aerosol can at a distance of 3-4 of the caliber of the hole is supersonic, more precisely, with “barrels”. These barrels are clearly visible even after the afterburner operation of the aircraft engine, so in the aerosol can everything is the same, only small.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 23: 23
          0
          you can just google about it yes The link will immediately be on Wikipedia
          1. Aviator_
            Aviator_ 17 May 2018 08: 29
            +2
            Whoever gets into the wiki writes, calling the supersonic stream into which something was shoved, a supersonic wind tunnel. But there is a difference, and significant. Truly working pipes were created only in the middle of the 40-s of the last century.
            1. YELLOWSTONE
              YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 11: 53
              0
              the Germans had a pulsed in 1909 continuous operation slightly later, even before WWII, then in the interwar period the theory, which the British then two years later began to independently open and independently publish yes Abramovich didn’t look into Vika with his spray can
              1. Aviator_
                Aviator_ 17 May 2018 20: 45
                0
                Again. To obtain data on the model, which can then be converted to nature (unlimited flow), it is possible only in a specially designed wind tunnel. She appeared with us in the 1943 year (T-106). In the United States, similar pipes appeared around the same time. Leave me alone with the German "wind tunnel" of the 1909 model of the year.
                1. YELLOWSTONE
                  YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 20: 54
                  0
                  and the Germans had it much earlier, and they also knew how to count better
                  transonic jet aircraft they flew and even supersonic V-2 rockets
                  stop being ashamed of G.N. It’s quite possible for Abramovich and “bagels” that after the Second World War he worked for the USA, he wrote such books lol
                  1. Aviator_
                    Aviator_ 17 May 2018 21: 13
                    0
                    Have you ever seen a plane in afterburner? This is the first. Secondly, Heinrich Naumovich Abramovich was the head of the department at TsIAM, I attended his interesting seminars in the 80 of the last century. And to you - to study, study and study, as the classic said.
                    1. YELLOWSTONE
                      YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 21: 21
                      0
                      and you open your eyes at the expense of when someone has what
    4. Kibb
      Kibb 24 June 2012 18: 51
      0
      Quote: Understudy
      the more thoughts arise that the Germans were helped, at least, by "aliens"

      There is nothing special about this, they just needed to fight (it's good that they didn't do it) - you can shoot down the B17 on a regular Me109, especially Lancaster, with the Moskto it's more difficult
    5. Alf
      Alf 16 May 2018 21: 46
      +2
      Quote: Understudy
      There are a lot of really "breakthrough" decisions

      For example ?
      Quote: Understudy
      Germans were helped at least by “aliens”.

      And where did they go then? Spit and fly away?
    6. nikoliski
      nikoliski 17 May 2018 01: 43
      0
      they say the devil was to Hitler, what frightened him greatly, by the way about aliens, I also thought, but what if the aliens are demons? Well, before, when in ancient times they saw horned people, having no idea about other planets and worlds, they called them that way, but now it’s different (by the way, Americans today will at least cooperate with demons-aliens in order to gain power over the world) jokes, but there’s some truth is everywhere ...
      1. Alf
        Alf 17 May 2018 22: 14
        +1
        Quote: nikoliski
        say to Hitler the devil was

        Hitler had to drink less.
        1. nikoliski
          nikoliski 17 May 2018 23: 04
          0
          you want a joke? my friend’s grandmother is paralyzed, so she’s telling a friend we’ll come with her mother to visit her and the grandmother asks and the man will come to me? they are surprised (the grandmother is closed) which guy in FIG? Yes, one man comes to me with a current on his feet ... Oh, they don’t know what to do, they called the priest, but they didn’t say why on the way they’ll explain how he found out why he flatly refused to go and I’m going to go (apparently already with a similar one) how they persuaded the grandmother to consecrate the house more and more that “man” didn’t come so such things happen (many familiar interesting things were told just like that you think involuntarily he’ll take a rash, by the way I went once to the Divnogorsk monastery in our Voronezh region’s service there was a girl standing nearby and her belly rumbled all the service well, I didn’t give attention to whether she ate what, and as a priest hit her face with holy water, it happened that my peasant’s hair stood on end from horror (this can’t tell) from the lips of this girl there was such a terrible bass- “I can’t endure it anymore!” I could have sworn I saw and heard who would say I didn’t believe it and fear simply the animal attacked like something from another world nearby ...
          1. Tochilka
            Tochilka 17 May 2018 23: 09
            +1
            after reading blood flowed out of my eyes! comma-free as delirium is read
  3. laurbalaur
    laurbalaur 23 June 2012 12: 08
    +3
    Doubler, and the British, with their Meteor, also aliens helped? He flew, by the way, until the 70s and was no less successful (but rather even more) aircraft than ME-262.
    1. Kibb
      Kibb 24 June 2012 18: 54
      0
      Yes, the plane was not good. Only MiG15 didn’t need him to compete, but the engines on the MiG 15 were British
      1. YELLOWSTONE
        YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 21: 03
        0
        improved and Soviet-made, the British stood in the F-9F, in the F-86 German American-made.
    2. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 48
      0
      why didn’t he fight with him then? lol
  4. understudy
    understudy 23 June 2012 12: 23
    +2
    So I'm not just talking about this plane ... from small arms to rockets.
    1. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 51
      +3
      and what about shooting? they themselves ran with SVT and PPSh, copied a 120mm Soviet mortar, except for MG with an overrated rate of fire,
      STG-44 uses the principle and mechanics of SVT-40
      1. gladcu2
        gladcu2 17 May 2018 01: 44
        0
        STG-44. Exactly, a gas engine with a swing shutter.
        AK-47 rotary shutter, which makes a fundamental difference.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 03: 31
          0
          the Germans, having reduced their cartridge, took it as a basis and failed to repeat it under a rifle, plus cold stamping to reduce the cost
  5. Rascopov
    Rascopov 23 June 2012 15: 10
    +6
    This is more like a gesture of despair than something that really could help in the war, which at that moment was lost for the Germans.
    The layout is unsuccessful. But German industrial potential is respected!
  6. the gray wolf
    the gray wolf 23 June 2012 16: 28
    0
    German technology is the best in the world. starting from Mercedes and ending with ..... whatever you want.
    1. Zerstorer
      Zerstorer 24 June 2012 09: 46
      +18
      Yeah! Only wild Russians did not know this smile
    2. Mooh
      Mooh 16 May 2018 18: 05
      +2
      Maybe they were once, but now only the most lazy of them are not ahead of Asians. I drive a 15 year old Toyota and she is in every way better than fresh Germans that I buy for my wife. What Opel, what BMW is now UG, that Hyundai against their background is a luxury car. The father-in-law has a Mercedes, it’s a little better, but the cost of the original consumables is just off scale. And for some reason there are no non-original ones. Another relative drives Lifan and treats him in much the same way as I did with my wife BMW, only much cheaper.
      1. YELLOWSTONE
        YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 52
        +1
        the Turks collect them there
        1. Mooh
          Mooh 16 May 2018 23: 38
          +1
          Yes, even blacks, what difference does anyone collect when constructive defects are bundles. Damn survived, the Germans can not make a motor without oil consumption and with the unstable timing chains.
          And another remark, when Astra was, the servicemen recommended putting decent quality parts from Cruise into it, and not the original Opel shit. And in BMW from what to order to order? On the market to select Toyota parts in size? As before, the Zhiguli ones were picked up and thrown into foreign cars?
          1. YELLOWSTONE
            YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 00: 03
            +1
            big, problems with chains and oil often from her
      2. Fayter2017
        Fayter2017 17 May 2018 14: 40
        +1
        So no one hides what iron cars stopped doing in the mid-90s, afterwards for the sake of marketing.
  7. viktor_ui
    viktor_ui 23 June 2012 16: 31
    +11
    Considering the speed with which they tried to establish mass production on the verge of collapse ..., a glider that was collected from improvised means (for the Germans) didn’t fly to mind flies 900 km ..., it amazes the presence of a catapult for the pilot ... I HAVE NO WORDS AND it’s a great success that they simply did not succeed.
    Rascopov - nichrome a gesture of despair .... we would have such a craving since the fucking perestroika ...
    1. biglow
      biglow 23 June 2012 19: 29
      +2
      in the conditions of war and trade blockade, all resources were running out. For example, alloying additives for metals left only less than 100 kg and this condition was in many positions, and by the way, food was also physically running out. Therefore, there was simply nothing to fight after the guerrilla occupation of Germany
      1. Volkhov
        Volkhov 24 June 2012 12: 34
        +4
        The partisan war was canceled by Doenitz’s order, as senseless, they simply had and have a second Germany, and it rules.
        1. Gamdlislyam
          Gamdlislyam 25 June 2012 08: 14
          +1
          Dear colleague of the Volkhov, the partisan war was not abolished by Admiral Doenets, but by the German people. They were preparing for it in Germany, creating special units. Allies were also preparing, including SMERSH. Another thing is that it quickly came to naught, and did not receive mass distribution and public support. The mentality of the Germans was not the same as that of the Russians.
          1. Volkhov
            Volkhov 25 June 2012 18: 04
            +3
            Glad you are writing from the forest, fighting for the USSR. Send videos to the site.
            1. YELLOWSTONE
              YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 55
              0
              google "shooting of the Supreme Council of the USSR"
              1. Aviator_
                Aviator_ 17 May 2018 08: 34
                +1
                In fact, the Supreme Soviet of the USSR itself fled, or rather, it did not meet. In 1993 there was a shooting of the RF Armed Forces.
                1. YELLOWSTONE
                  YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 11: 55
                  0
                  and many were killed while going to, there will be links, people there died under Soviet flags
  8. Tyumen
    Tyumen 23 June 2012 23: 35
    0
    Faustpatron in the Air Force version. Although in the shoe version of Salamander
    Germans conquered the USSR.)
    1. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 56
      0
      yes prisoners of war restored the destroyed national economy then
  9. Volkhov
    Volkhov 24 June 2012 01: 36
    +5
    The car was obviously designed earlier and started to be done earlier too - it is impossible to design an aircraft in a matter of weeks, especially high-speed, and for production you need a lot of equipment.
    A jet engine looks alien, like a propeller on Iranian flying boats. Rather, it was supposed to be fundamentally different inside the fuselage.
    Most likely, the car was made for stubborn defense, but after the agreement with the Allies on pacification in the fall of 44, the secret engine was replaced with the famous one and the demo version was delivered to the troops. The original version could also be sent to evacuation - in old Germany there was nothing to refuel such a bunch of aircraft.
    1. Kibb
      Kibb 24 June 2012 22: 01
      0
      No, maybe the engine was already there, the guns there are far from the best, the glider also doesn’t represent anything. The main problem is to find pilots on it, that it’s not Hartman, not the rest of the super duper Nets asses did not fly on it.
      1. NF68
        NF68 16 May 2018 17: 23
        +1
        Quote: Kibb
        No, maybe the engine was already there, the guns there are far from the best, the glider also doesn’t represent anything. The main problem is to find pilots on it, that it’s not Hartman, not the rest of the super duper Nets asses did not fly on it.


        The main problem was not to find pilots, but more or less reliable turbojet engines.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 57
          0
          fuel for them
          1. NF68
            NF68 17 May 2018 16: 05
            0
            Quote: YELLOWSTONE
            fuel for them


            Well yes. Although until the summer of 1944, the situation with liquid fuel in Germany was still less acceptable and if it were not for the problems with low engine life of German turbojet engines, Germany could have actively used fighter jets since 1943 of the year.
            1. YELLOWSTONE
              YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 17: 16
              0
              piston had about the same, fuel is even scarcer and repair is more difficult
              1. NF68
                NF68 17 May 2018 20: 29
                +1
                Quote: YELLOWSTONE
                piston had about the same, fuel is even scarcer and repair is more difficult


                Jumo-211 during normal operation worked up to 200 hours before the bulkhead, DB-605 up to 150 hours, DB-603 in 1944 worked up to 100 hours, the first production BMW-801s up to 20-25, even fancy 24-X Jumo-X cylinders and those at the beginning of small-scale production worked out approximately 222 hours, Jumo 30 average to 004 and then if you do not sharply increase traction, otherwise with a high probability the engine will turn on, BMW 10 were even worse because of the blades each of which was made separately from the compressor rotor .
                1. YELLOWSTONE
                  YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 21: 24
                  0
                  this is if in normal and not in combat, the piston before the bulkhead had the resource most of all 2 - 3 times, and it was many times more difficult as the current maintenance
                  1. NF68
                    NF68 18 May 2018 20: 20
                    0
                    Quote: YELLOWSTONE
                    this is if in normal and not in combat, the piston before the bulkhead had the resource most of all 2 - 3 times, and it was many times more difficult as the current maintenance


                    Even at the end of WWII, the forced-converted DB-605 on the Me-109 worked on not the best gasoline, and then it worked on the 60-70 for hours. Normal or more or less normal operation of the engines is also possible in the course of hostilities. The main thing was to monitor the operating modes of the engines.
                    1. YELLOWSTONE
                      YELLOWSTONE 18 May 2018 20: 25
                      0
                      the main thing is the enemy, especially if there are a lot of them and they can catch up
                      1. NF68
                        NF68 18 May 2018 20: 35
                        0
                        Quote: YELLOWSTONE
                        the main thing is the enemy, especially if there are a lot of them and they can catch up


                        I do not argue. However, the water-methanol forcing of the Germans did not help a lot if only the maximum power of the piston aircraft engines was achieved, the Germans could squeeze out not 2-3 minutes, but up to 10 minutes.
                    2. YELLOWSTONE
                      YELLOWSTONE 18 May 2018 20: 48
                      0
                      and the turbocharger did not fit well with it
                      1. NF68
                        NF68 19 May 2018 16: 00
                        0
                        Quote: YELLOWSTONE
                        and the turbocharger did not fit well with it


                        They combined just not bad. Even if you pay attention only to the engines of the company Daimler-Benz:

                        http://alternathistory.com/razrabotki-aviadvigate
                        lei-firmy-daimler-benz

                        Yes, only the Germans had heat-resistant materials too little because of what the Germans had to develop 2-speed superchargers which, with the exception of the DB-628 engine, had about 2000 meters lower altitude than the same engines with turbochargers.
                    3. YELLOWSTONE
                      YELLOWSTONE 19 May 2018 21: 28
                      0
                      stepping with heat resistance does not correspond
                      the turbocharger is small, heat-resistant materials were enough for large WFDs
                      1. NF68
                        NF68 20 May 2018 15: 55
                        +1
                        stepping with heat resistance does not correspond


                        The two-stage superchargers of the German engines DB-603 L, DB-603 LA, Jumo-213 E-1, Jumo-213 F and Jumo-213 EB were mechanical and did not require heat-resistant materials. Heat-resistant materials were needed for high-altitude engines, in which the first stage was a turbocompressor, and the second was a mechanical supercharger. How it was done on DB-603 U.

                        the turbocharger is small, heat-resistant materials were enough for large WFDs
                        .

                        And again we return to the fact that, despite all the efforts, the Germans could scrape together materials only on a small series of engines with turbochargers such as BMW-801 J-1 in 310 units, and all other developments were limited only to prototypes, some of which were brought up, but the Germans did not have material for their mass production. And what about this? You write that the Germans had enough heat-resistant materials for large WFDs, and at the same time, the Germans could not produce the turbochargers they needed in large batches. As a result, the Germans had to engage in the development and serial production of 2-speed mechanical superchargers.
                    4. YELLOWSTONE
                      YELLOWSTONE 20 May 2018 19: 50
                      0
                      again we rest on the fact that large WFD from these materials were produced in large grays
                      and the afterburner on this DB-603 U engine was turned on simultaneously with the turbocharger? some he is not a fighter engine yes
    2. Gamdlislyam
      Gamdlislyam 25 June 2012 08: 24
      0
      Heinkel was engaged in jet aircraft since the late 30s. He built the first fighter jet in Germany. Another thing is that Messerschmitt circumvented him in the carpet war for ordering aircraft for the Luftwaffe.
      1. Volkhov
        Volkhov 25 June 2012 17: 58
        +2
        Just on the first fuselage in the workshop you can see the engine template - inside the fuselage and the swirl is toroidal, like a small plate. This is most likely just for checking seats. The fuselage is real, metal, and the wing is a wooden and jet engine - an ersatz to cover production and fly a little. When saving metal, they primarily use wood in the fuselage - it is more and less loaded, and lastly in the wing, but here it is the other way around, i.e. fooling allies.
        The Germans sent all the best to the 4th Reich.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 57
          0
          for particularly stubborn - Dr. Schauberger is a common schizophrenic
        2. Alf
          Alf 16 May 2018 21: 51
          +1
          Quote: Volkhov
          The Germans sent all the best to the 4th Reich.

          Where where ?
          1. YELLOWSTONE
            YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 22: 04
            +1
            through one by number from the 6th in which the Napoleons are kept, and maybe next to them through the wall.
  10. Volkhov
    Volkhov 24 June 2012 01: 55
    0
    The car was obviously designed earlier and started to be done earlier too - it is impossible to design an aircraft in a matter of weeks, especially high-speed, and for production you need a lot of equipment.
    A jet engine looks alien, like a propeller on Iranian flying boats. Rather, it was supposed to be fundamentally different inside the fuselage.
    Most likely, the car was made for stubborn defense, but after the agreement with the Allies on pacification in the fall of 44, the secret engine was replaced with the famous one and the demo version was delivered to the troops. The original version could also be sent to evacuation - in old Germany there was nothing to refuel such a bunch of aircraft. In the photo of the workshop in the first aircraft, a toroidal model of the engine is seen approximately where it should be, that is, it is a factory of real fuselages and demo aircraft.
  11. Bagno
    Bagno 26 June 2012 19: 15
    -1
    this is what I understand the level ... not like our sheep .. well, they couldn’t come up with anything .. nothing ....
    1. pro100y.belarus
      pro100y.belarus 16 May 2018 19: 13
      +2
      Your rams?
      Why so disrespect yourself?
      1. YELLOWSTONE
        YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 20: 59
        +1
        maybe it was about the Americans whose NASA director was an SS man (there are no former)? lol
  12. DimerVladimer
    DimerVladimer 16 May 2018 15: 57
    +2
    In the event that this fighter reached the warheads at least a year earlier, the results of its combat use could be completely different.


    The results would not be different - to work smoothly with the handle - this is not for the fighter, at best for the interceptor.
    The high wing already has a poor vertical maneuver, and when abruptly converted to climb, engine surging is also possible, therefore this scheme was not widely used in fighters.
    1. gladcu2
      gladcu2 17 May 2018 01: 52
      +1
      At that time, we were not yet familiar with the surge of the engine.
  13. NF68
    NF68 16 May 2018 17: 22
    0
    The reliability of the BMW-003 turbojet engine was even worse than that of the Jumo-004 in which the engine life was approximately 10 hours. the lack of heat-resistant materials reminded of itself in full growth. So the real benefits of these developments for Germany were not many.
    1. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 21: 00
      0
      the rest of these materials had even less
      1. NF68
        NF68 17 May 2018 16: 03
        +1
        Quote: YELLOWSTONE
        the rest of these materials had even less


        Either Americans baked tens of thousands of pancakes for turbo-engines for B-17, B-24, B-29 and P-47 engines. The Germans had only enough raw materials for the 310 serial BMW-801 J-1. The British lived off supplies from the United States.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 17: 17
          +1
          in turbochargers the temperature is lower
          1. NF68
            NF68 18 May 2018 20: 24
            0
            Quote: YELLOWSTONE
            in turbochargers the temperature is lower


            Nevertheless, the Germans could not establish a truly large-scale production of turbochargers for their high-altitude fighters, although in the 1944 year they had many good high-altitude engines made in small quantities. And all because of the lack of heat-resistant materials. What can I say about the thousands of turbojet engines.
            1. YELLOWSTONE
              YELLOWSTONE 18 May 2018 20: 28
              0
              Quote: NF68
              thousand turbojet engines

              for which you need better materials and more
              1. NF68
                NF68 19 May 2018 16: 01
                0
                Quote: YELLOWSTONE
                Quote: NF68
                thousand turbojet engines

                for which you need better materials and more


                Here are the German turbojet engines, respectively, and worked no more than 10 hours.
                1. YELLOWSTONE
                  YELLOWSTONE 19 May 2018 18: 22
                  0
                  the rest of it was even worse
                  What should be done of these materials turbochargers that would work more than 10 hours?
                  1. NF68
                    NF68 19 May 2018 20: 00
                    0
                    Quote: YELLOWSTONE
                    the rest of it was even worse
                    What should be done of these materials turbochargers that would work more than 10 hours?


                    The Americans in the second half of WWII still had enough to give them their piston aircraft engines and the British too. And in terms of the number of any of the most modern combat aircraft, the Allies were superior to the Germans. Plus, the Allies had significantly more experienced pilots. Here the Germans could not compete with them on equal terms in the amount of equipment produced, and it was for this reason that the Germans were the first in the world to take seriously the development of turbojet engines that would allow German combat aircraft to gain advantage. Before WWII, when the passions in Europe had not yet reached the beginning of WWII, Adolf Aloizovich assured his entourage that the war with BI would begin not earlier than either 1944 or 1946 of the year. It is entirely possible that in peacetime the Germans could have acquired all the materials they needed and the chances of success with turbojet engines and turbochargers would be higher. And when the war became truly global, the Germans were all the more unable to abandon their attempts to achieve qualitative superiority over their opponents.

                    Perhaps the operating conditions of turbochargers and the most thermally loaded parts of the turbojet engine were different. The Germans and turbojet engines and turbochargers began to engage in the late 1930-ies, but nevertheless, by the end of WWII in Europe, the Germans did not achieve much success.
                    1. YELLOWSTONE
                      YELLOWSTONE 19 May 2018 21: 32
                      0
                      the Germans and everyone else took up the development of turbojet engines before the war
                      compressor is less loaded
  14. Vard
    Vard 16 May 2018 18: 05
    +3
    Or maybe the national factor played a role ... Or rather, the absence of persons of a certain nationality ... Already painfully many breakthrough developments were made by the Germans in that period ...
    1. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 21: 01
      0
      rather the absence of wrecking, except for a little Czechs wink
      1. Alf
        Alf 16 May 2018 21: 53
        +2
        Quote: YELLOWSTONE
        rather the absence of wrecking, except for a little Czechs wink

        Something I do not recall sabotage in the factories of Czechoslovakia.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 16 May 2018 22: 01
          0
          there was one attempt at the factory with a bunch of sand, and so they dressed more and more in dark colors and wrote to themselves in beer.
    2. NF68
      NF68 18 May 2018 20: 25
      0
      Quote: Vard
      Or maybe the national factor played a role ... Or rather, the absence of persons of a certain nationality ... Already painfully many breakthrough developments were made by the Germans in that period ...


      There were developments, but there was no raw materials necessary for large-scale production.
      1. YELLOWSTONE
        YELLOWSTONE 18 May 2018 20: 30
        0
        for large-scale operation (fuel), from Me-262 which consumed kerosene like these two Heninkels or P.20 (which Me-163 with WFD and therefore a good radis) flew off less than a quarter, and with piston gasoline at the end of the war it became completely deaf
  15. whinny
    whinny 17 May 2018 00: 27
    0
    A beautiful machine if the riddle is removed.
  16. akunin
    akunin 17 May 2018 15: 14
    0
    if they didn’t decide to solve the “Jewish question”, then no matter how much and what else they’ve built up, but they would have been ahead of the rest on nuclear weapons and it’s not known how the war would have developed.
    1. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 17: 25
      0
      if they had not attacked the USSR
  17. voyaka uh
    voyaka uh 17 May 2018 17: 40
    +1
    The British worked in calmer conditions
    and calmly set their jet Gloucester Meteor in 1944
    on combat duty in air defense.

    He already has a normal layout. One step to the MiG-15 and Saber.
    1. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 17: 57
      0
      Quote: voyaka uh
      One step to the MiG-15 and Saber.

      yes
      F-86 was made by those who made its engine for the Americans lol
      while the Meteor calmly carried the guard away from the German jet messers, these messers in the German air defense calmly carried Lancaster, Liberators and B-17
      1. voyaka uh
        voyaka uh 17 May 2018 21: 11
        +3
        The meteor was given the normal air defense mission - to shoot down the V-1. What he successfully did.
        One American bomber attacked a group. The goal was definite: to set fire to 2 motors on one wing. Then the bomber turned around and somehow went to its base. For one "big bomber" they gave the order - "Cross" (or for 12 English / American fighters).

        The engine for the MiG-15 was made by those who did the Meteor-Gloucester.
        1. YELLOWSTONE
          YELLOWSTONE 17 May 2018 21: 29
          0
          Why not immediately V-2? or Me-262? lol
          for one fighter the Germans were given 1 point, for a large bomber they were given 3 points even less than the number of engines, so shooting down bombers was more dangerous and not more profitable
          engine for the MiG-15 in the USSR redid
        2. Alf
          Alf 17 May 2018 22: 13
          +1
          Quote: voyaka uh
          The engine for the MiG-15 was made by those who did the Meteor-Gloucester.

          It's like ... mother, sorry to understand?
          The meteor was produced by Gloucester, the engine for MIG was created by Rolls-Royce, in the USSR on the basis of RR for MIG-15 it was created by VK-1 Klimov's company.
          1. YELLOWSTONE
            YELLOWSTONE 18 May 2018 05: 24
            0
            Quote: Alf
            sorry to understand?

            but I really want to bomb already, in England they also love the topic that the gloucester supposedly entered the service a month earlier than Messer
  18. Borders
    Borders 18 May 2018 00: 03
    0
    in three months ... from the prototype to the finished product ... well, Germany, you really ...
    1. YELLOWSTONE
      YELLOWSTONE 18 May 2018 20: 46
      0
      one and a half times the best record in the USSR in WWII
  19. Kibb
    Kibb 18 May 2018 10: 11
    0
    An article from 2012, a time machine exists !!! Two Kibb and this is the same I !!!))))
  20. hhhhhhh
    hhhhhhh 21 May 2018 14: 02
    0
    today, many people respect the incredible efforts that the German aircraft industry
    Is respect for the use of Soviet prisoners of war in the aircraft industry? It is somehow strange written.