What is more necessary for the "Warrior": a knife or a bayonet?

129


The question is interesting, and the answer is even more interesting. I am sure that, having read the words “bayonet-knife”, many readers didn’t recall the most pleasant memories, accompanied by the “same” expressions.



Yes, the bayonet for the Kalashnikov assault rifle was a strange device. Like a knife, he was about nothing at all. Of course, for an experienced fighter to mutilate a can of canned food so that you can get to the contents or chop a loaf of bread into 6-8 parts is not a problem. It was possible to bite the wire, and an experienced fighter could do it without damaging the fingers.

Yes, it was possible to throw a bayonet into a tree and then, with surprise, state the fact that weapon no longer a weapon, but two pieces of metal. One is just metal, and the second with plastic terminations. This happened in the Soviet Army, and neither the fighter nor his commander could shine anything good.

It was exactly like a bayonet that I personally didn’t have to use it, thank God and circumstances. Therefore, I will not undertake to judge how the bayonet 6x4 (according to the ROW) was a weapon. Maybe he and the bayonet was the same as a knife. Although in principle, if you take it, unleash together with the scabbard and hit the enemy in the head, most likely, there will be a deadly result.

Let us return to our current topic, namely, to the question of what is more necessary for the “Warrior” kit: a knife or a bayonet?

The answer to the question is given by KAMPO JSC (before 1993 of the year - Orekhovo-Zuyevo Design Bureau of Oxygen Equipment).

The company was established in 1953 on the basis of a resolution of the Council of Ministers of the USSR and is one of the oldest enterprises in the military-industrial complex, a developer and serial manufacturer in the field of instrumentation for aviation, astronautics, medicine, diving, fire and rescue services, as well as shipbuilding and production of cold steel.

As a developer of cold arms, AO KAMPO is the author and manufacturer of such special knives as HB, HBC, Murena, Diver for divers and scuba divers, a multifunctional knife (multitool) for NS sappers.

After working under the program "Ratnik", specialists from Orekhovo-Zuyevo came to the conclusion, which was supported and adopted by the Ministry of Defense. Two blades were created and successfully passed state tests: the Bumblebee NB-2 combat knife (GRAU index 6X9) and the ShN-2 bayonet-knife (6X9-1).


Combat Knife NB-2 (6х9)


The kit combat knife NB-2 includes:

combat knife 6X9;
sheath with nippers and a diamond bar for sharpening;
sheath cover;

accessories:
- safety cord;
- a latch for fastening on a zone belt;
- a belt for additional fixing on a leg with the quick-release lock.

What is more necessary for the "Warrior": a knife or a bayonet?


The knife withstands the load applied to the middle of the handle, when securing the blade along the entire length - at least 100 kg.
Time to remove the knife from the scabbard - no more than 2 with.
Knife weight - no more than 270
Knife weight with scabbard and fasteners - no more than 700 g.
Overall dimensions of the knife with a scabbard - no more than 330x70x35 mm.
The surface of the blade has a special treatment to reduce the unmasking glare.
Knife length - no more than 281 mm.


The ShN-2 bayonet-knife differs from a fellow only in that it is designed to mount on the barrel of an automaton.

A bayonet-knife can withstand the load applied to the middle of the handle when securing the blade along the entire length - at least 100 kg.
Sheath extraction time is no more than 2 seconds.
Mass of a bayonet knife - no more than 325.
Mass of a bayonet with scabbard and fasteners - no more than 750 g.
Overall dimensions with sheath - no more than 340х85х35 mm.
The length of the bayonet is no more than 290 mm.
Blade length - no more than 162 mm.
Blade width - no more than 30 mm.
Blade thickness - 5 mm.

Blade steel - 95X18 hardness 54 ... 58 HRC

A titanium-based nanocomposite coating is applied to the blade of the knife and bayonet with high hardness and wear resistance.

The surface of the blade has a special treatment to reduce the unmasking glare.

The blade has a differentiated sharpening of the cutting edge.

The blade of the knife passes along the entire length of the handle and ends with a percussion element, which is intended for applying shock blows and breaking through hardened glass.

The compact sheath is made of impact-resistant plastic with a device for cutting steel wire and a diamond bar for straightening the cutting edge.



Fastening the knife on the equipment is carried out with the help of a cover, which is equipped with a fastening element on the belt and thigh, as well as a universal fastening for fixing on the combat equipment.

The fastening of the knife and bayonet on the “Warrior” equipment is carried out with the help of a cover, which is equipped with a fastening element on the belt and thigh, as well as a universal fastening for fixing on the combat equipment.

Both NB-2 and SHN-2, when used, can affect the enemy's manpower not only with muscular effort, but also by throwing.

Each combat equipment "Warrior" will now include two knives: a multifunctional (multitool) and combat. Moreover, depending on the characteristics of duty, the combat knife can be replaced with a bayonet for soldiers with small arms, to which it can be attached.

Do I need a knife to a modern soldier, I think the question is stupid. Definitely needed. And as a weapon (including the last chance), and as a reliable assistant. Not only canned open, of course. Moreover, in modern IRP it is quite possible to do without a knife, by the way. Cut the "thorn" without damaging your fingers, brush away the suspicious wire, unscrew something, cut off a piece of rope or rope, and at least cut it up to inspect the wound.

All these new knives from CAMPO will have to be implemented easily and naturally, unlike their blunt and fragile predecessor.

Used materials of the official site of JSC "KAMPO" (http://kampo.ru).
129 comments
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  1. +2
    21 March 2017 06: 37
    Photo multitool. The knives and bayonet seem to be not bad, but how is this device?
    1. +6
      21 March 2017 06: 49
      I think that there should be several multitools, also depending on the type of troops - combined arms, engineer, signalman ... in principle, some of them have already been developed and will not require major additions.
      But as for the bayonet and the knife ... I just don’t know what to say, the tools are too different and how to combine them to fulfill their purpose equally well - I can’t imagine very much, except to improve the knife for "hoarfrog" in multitool.
    2. avt
      +6
      21 March 2017 09: 32
      Quote: Razvedka_Boem
      But how is this device?

      Throw it away and buy a normal Lutherman.
      Quote: Razvedka_Boem
      The knives and bayonet are pretty good,

      If about ,, Warrior ", then I didn’t get hold of it in my hands, but outwardly .... it looks solid. good Neatly and in a case like everything. But here is my personal opinion - in addition to the regular one, you still need to have your own personal to whom I picked up under my own hand. Naturally not a saber, or a similar stray, but .... hozbyt.
      1. 0
        21 March 2017 10: 24
        But here is my personal opinion - in addition to the regular one, you still need to have your own personal to whom I picked up under my own hand.

        The main thing is that Chinese laughing, but it was such a sad experience, he turned and only had a handle in his hands ...
        1. avt
          +2
          21 March 2017 10: 31
          Quote: Evil543
          The main thing is that Chinese

          Do not believe it, but Chinese, Chinese strife. I have been using the Chinese analogue of Bayley S4 for so long sharpening, but am pleased to disgrace. And even vague doubts torment me that they did exactly the same but for $ 700 at one factory.
          1. +1
            21 March 2017 10: 44
            My trophy handle was comfortable for blows and therefore left
            1. avt
              0
              21 March 2017 16: 18
              Quote: Evil543
              my trophy handle was comfortable for blows and therefore left

              Quote: Evil543
              , but it was such a sad experience, he turned and only had a handle in his hands ...

              That's why I preferred
              Quote: avt
              Bayley S4,

              ,, ultimatum "although now ,, Gerber" released ,, ultimatum "Pro. That probably would be now if there was a choice ..... no. I would buy BOTH. bully Well, multitool from Laterman.
      2. +5
        21 March 2017 16: 23
        Our recruits are buying in the shops "Tourist"
        something like that. They don’t give her out in the army.
        Who chooses for himself a more "power", who - the lighter.
        The main thing is not to forget to tie it with a cord with a carabiner to the belt,
        otherwise it’s easily lost.
        1. avt
          +1
          21 March 2017 18: 43
          Quote: voyaka uh
          The main thing is not to forget to tie it with a cord with a carabiner to the belt,
          otherwise it’s easily lost.

          Well, to the maximum ... it’s brutal so Leatherman Mut EOD 850132N, but actually and more simply there are quite decent and comfortable Leatherman Surge
      3. 0
        21 March 2017 17: 54
        Throw and buy a normal Lutherman

        I did not say. that I have such an aggregate ..)
        In this sense, we are not limited. It would just be interesting to hear the opinions of people using this thing.
    3. +2
      21 March 2017 12: 13
      Quote: Razvedka_Boem
      The knives and bayonet seem to be not bad, but how is this device?

      No way! There is actually no knife and crimp for CD.
      (And forgot about the nail file laughing )
    4. +1
      21 March 2017 18: 38
      “But how is this device?” - To be honest, it looks completely “collective farm” winked Is this a proprietary device proposed to the “bayonet-knife” described above?
  2. +4
    21 March 2017 06: 46
    Anyway, it is not clear why two, if the only difference is the possibility of mounting on the machine.
    1. +5
      21 March 2017 07: 59
      Apparently the case in law.
      And the knife and bayonet cold steel - the functionality is close, but the statements are different. winked
      In general, it is certainly good that at last you can at least cut bread with some bayonets and provide some kind of household needs, but it was difficult to chop even pigs.
      Sincerely.
  3. +21
    21 March 2017 08: 22
    Article advertising KAMPO !!!! All these new knives from CAMPO will have to be implemented easily and naturally, unlike their blunt and fragile predecessor.
    The author before writing, about, it was possible to throw a bayonet-knife into a tree and with surprise then ascertain the fact that the weapon is no longer a weapon, but two pieces of metal. need to write why the bayonet knife to AK made so !!
    At VO often, and much has been written about the cause of the fragility of the bayonet-knife for AK. Let me remind you that the knife’s fragility is due to the fact that if the enemy is defeated, it can become stuck in his body and it will be difficult to pull it out, so it can be broken by leaving the blade in the enemy’s body, thereby freeing the machine gun, the soldier’s main weapon !!!

    It is NOT necessary to think that in the USSR (with its financing of the defense industry!) The designers were more stupid than the KAMPO designers, and could not come up with and make a quality knife !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    1. +15
      21 March 2017 09: 36
      Quote: Kostya Andreev
      At VO often, and much has been written about the cause of the fragility of the bayonet-knife for AK. Let me remind you that the knife’s fragility is due to the fact that if the enemy is defeated, it can become stuck in his body and it will be difficult to pull it out, so it can be broken by leaving the blade in the enemy’s body, thereby freeing the machine gun, the soldier’s main weapon !!!

      - fly away belay
      - that is, it was made brittle by a specialist (steel was selected ... heat treatment was also selected), instead of making a mold so that it didn’t get stuck laughing

      Quote: Kostya Andreev
      It is NOT necessary to think that in the USSR (with its financing of the defense industry!) The designers were more stupid than the KAMPO designers, and they could not come up with and make a quality knife !!!

      - Certainly they could.
      - but for some reason they adopted exactly this ... shelter, forgive me, Lord ...

      As an option: they made it hard so that the nippers do not blunt. And they were too smart with heat treatment, they also made it fragile. What is not the version? wink
      1. +9
        21 March 2017 10: 18
        Quote: Cat Man Null
        As an option: they made it hard so that the nippers do not blunt. And they were too smart with heat treatment, they also made it fragile. What is not the version?

        Rather, the task was to create the most cheap bayonet-knife, capable of cutting wire at the same time.
        By the way, not all of them are brittle. Perhaps, for the sake of cheapness, we went to, let's say, the scatter of the properties of the final product.
        1. 0
          21 March 2017 12: 25
          And what about the military reception?
          1. +1
            21 March 2017 12: 45
            In the sense of "military acceptance"? They did not check every knife.
          2. +1
            22 March 2017 00: 37
            You still drag in military acceptance, I know everything how it happens and from which yksperds it consists hi
            1. 0
              26 March 2017 13: 51
              Quote: Großer Feldherr
              You still drag in military acceptance, I know everything how it happens and from which yksperds it consists

              Well, you are the "yksperdam," for sure, even a toilet paper dispenser is not good enough. It's funny to read you, by golly !!!
      2. +2
        21 March 2017 11: 06
        I thought about how to answer you for a long time, it won’t work out briefly, because I need to describe why this knife (first of all, the bayonet), why it has such descents, why it made such a bevel. which resembles a point of cherry. We need to consider the steel from which he made. etc. That is, it will be a long time, and you can write an article !!!
        Therefore, I will answer briefly, simply if it were necessary to make a bayonet-knife that should cut the sausage and not break when stuck in a tree, we would take 65G (spring) and make a knife from it that meets all these requirements, well, whatever rusted can take 65 * 13 !! such a knife is not difficult to do in the garage, and even in production and even more so!
        1. +4
          21 March 2017 11: 29
          Quote: Kostya Andreev
          ... need to describe why is this knife (first of all a bayonet), why does it have such slopes, why did you make such a bevel of the butt. which the resembles a point of cherry...

          - need not
          - what the hell Recalls? belay

          Quote: Kostya Andreev
          Therefore, I will answer briefly ...

          - You do not answer, you began to list brands for some reason.
          - I finished MISiS in due time, and I can name much more brands.
          - I remind you, the question was "why, instead of optimizing the shape, they made it fragile"
          - This question was asked under the assumption that your "opportunity to break so as not to get stuck" really took place in the statement of work for this bayonet-knife. Although, IMHO, this is nonsense request

          That's about as Yes
          1. +7
            21 March 2017 13: 11
            . it is necessary to describe why this knife (first of all, a bayonet), why it has such descents, why it made such a bevel butt. which resembles a point of cherry. Why not, because of these characteristics, you can find out what the knife was intended for and why it cannot be done differently! Are you not interested?
            Not a pancake, but a cherry! cherry is a knife! This classic knife, a role model !!!! Compare it and AK knife, draw conclusions!
            I will answer the question with your question "why, instead of optimizing the shape, they made it brittle " And do not you think that this form is optimal for such a weapon, namely a bayonet? And what do you mean by optimizing? What shape of the tip can be applied so that it passes through the shape, does not stop on buttons and other things, does not get stuck in the body, while it can open zinc and do a bunch of other things? But its main purpose is not cutting, but stitching when it is on the trunk! Everything else is additional functions!
            The fact that this form is optimal can be compared with the bayonet to M-16 and with many other samples, which are made with emphasis on stitching functions. Any knife or other cold weapon (short blade) can get stuck in the human body !!! I want to ask you a question, how to free the machine if the knife is stuck in an obstacle?
            Forced to repeat in order to understand why this form is optimal, you need to explain why he has such descents, why he made such a bevel butt. . We need to consider the steel from which he made. etc. It's a long time, you can assume that I'm not in the know.
            I am very glad that you graduated from an educational institution, you can name the steel grade, I do not mind (with only two hands for), could you enlighten me by naming the steel grade that is used for the knife bayonet under discussion!
            When listing steel, I explain to you that if the task was to make a knife that cuts and does not break, they would take this steel or another and do it !!! M
            My nonsense, no more than yours about the wise with hardening. Is it at the enterprise, with access to equipment? Why is IMHO nonsense, you are not surprised, for example, that fuses blow out when the load is exceeded?
            By the way, I haven’t heard any version from you except how sophisticated I’ve heard, but would it be interesting to listen?
            1. +1
              21 March 2017 16: 02
              Quote: Kostya Andreev
              Kostya Andreev

              - ... chur me, chur ... stop
      3. PPD
        +1
        21 March 2017 15: 51
        Do you think the bayonet for Mosinka is bad? He, if you do not quickly pull back, also gets stuck, for reference.
        1. +1
          22 March 2017 15: 41
          In fact, so that the bayonet does not get stuck in the body (between the ribs), they prick it in the abdomen. Though a Mosin bayonet, at least automatic. If special, then to the neck, although in the heat of battle this is unlikely.
      4. +1
        23 March 2017 23: 30
        The answer to the causes of the fragility of the bayonet-knife has already been given in VO in the material on bayonet-knives.
        The bayonet was specially made brittle so that the fighter would not remain unarmed if the bayonet got stuck in the body of the opposing heap — sideways movement and the fighter again with a machine gun, albeit with a broken bayonet.
        1. +1
          23 March 2017 23: 36
          Quote: tolancop
          The bayonet was specially made brittle so that the fighter would not remain unarmed if the bayonet got stuck in the body of the opposing enemy - the movement to the side and the fighter again with a machine gun, albeit with a broken bayonet

          - yo, yo-yo ...
          - read carefully, there were several times correct explanation of the phenomenon of fragility of the bayonet-knife
          - what you wrote here is the wrong explanation request
        2. +1
          24 March 2017 10: 04
          they corrected the correct explanation, the designer made a mistake, a violation of the technology, well, or it was very expensive to make another steel, well, another belebber, from specialists
    2. avt
      +7
      21 March 2017 09: 42
      Quote: Kostya Andreev
      Let me remind you that the knife’s fragility is due to the fact that if the enemy is defeated, it can become stuck in his body and it will be difficult to pull it out, so it can be broken by leaving the blade in the enemy’s body, thereby freeing the machine gun, the soldier’s main weapon !!!

      laughing laughing How is this before the appearance of a bayonet-knife for AK old people did not guess!? wassat bully And stupidly taught the techniques of bayonet fighting. But all this has been a business since the time of Petit No. 1, well, when the baguette and bayonet actually appeared in the army, to make them fragile so that they break bully
      Quote: Kostya Andreev
      It’s NOT necessary to think that in the USSR (with its financing of the defense industry!) The designers were stupider than the KAMPO designers,

      I’ll tell you a secret, all the same, I had a chance to work in the first specialty in the Design Bureau and to stand in the collective also for the kulman. All sorts of people were in different positions, and lotions were sometimes given out by no means stupid people and not from evil. So, one did not think when he made the offer, the other did not check, and the third signed and the lead solder was inserted into the line with hydrogen peroxide. And crap knife - the launch pad in Plisetsk turned from ,, seven. "
      Quote: Kostya Andreev
      in the USSR (with its defense funding!

      then rebuilt. And even blaming the soldier, they almost repeated the encore! A competent officer caught a good grasp and aurally determined the reaction of hydrogen evolution and stopped refueling. And it would have shied again.
      1. +2
        21 March 2017 10: 16
        Guessed from experience: when a bayonet got stuck between ribs or between human vertebrae from an impact. stuck does not always happen, in this case it was recommended to even release the weapon with the emphasis on the enemy (I don’t remember the source). And in this case, using the machine as a lever, a sharp movement to the side and the weapon is free!
        It’s incorrect to compare weapons of the times of Peter the Great and the mid-1th century! It varies, as well as the conditions for its use!
        By the way, you can search the network for information on AK knives made of high-quality steel, (If my memory serves me, then when I was in my service, I saw this longer than the standard one with a black handle. I didn’t postpone it in my memory, I just remembered that it was different from ours! I will not argue!)
        I want to say right away that I didn’t cut a person, so this is a theory !!!
        1. avt
          +3
          21 March 2017 10: 37
          Quote: Kostya Andreev
          It varies, as well as the conditions for its use!

          bully ,, The conditions "are still the same. The bullet-fool, the bayonet - is on, but you need to have time to kick.
          Quote: Gray Brother
          bayonet fighting was no longer taught, but taught hand-to-hand combat with weapons - feel the difference.

          good One of the conditions for admitting to the “Olympic family” back under Stalin was the abolition of the ALL-Union bayonet competitions in the USSR and ... the liquidation of the sports federation itself. request
          1. 0
            21 March 2017 16: 59
            But what about fencing with bayonet knives? The most elite discipline in special forces competitions.
          2. +1
            21 March 2017 21: 54
            The last All-Union competition in bayonet fighting (military-applied sport) was held in the 1956 year, under Khrushchev Kukuruznoy, then everything. And at the Olympics of the USSR he played since 1952 of the year, to hell who would have banned the winning country from developing the sport that she considers necessary.
        2. +2
          21 March 2017 12: 40
          Quote: Kostya Andreev
          And in this case, using the machine as a lever, a sharp movement to the side and the weapon is free!

          Doesn't roll. Here we are talking about fragility. Those. shock load. Illustration, chisels and incisors hold a very serious load, but when struck they get a chip. To get a chip by ordinary pressure, even with the use of a lever, is almost impossible. I also note that at the break at the bayonet-knife it seems like even the standard was - not less than some value. At one time, I bent and broke a lot of things, with or without a tool. Therefore, I note two points that are important for the effectiveness of the operation. Rigidity of fastening and radius of a bend. Ribs are not a vice, the bending radius is large. Plus they spring back, extinguishing the load. Therefore, I suspect that breaking a blade about them is about the same as breaking it against branches of trees of comparable radius. Because of what, in order to carry out the described operation, it is necessary to make a bayonet almost made of glass.
          1. +1
            21 March 2017 13: 59
            I agree with you about chisels, but tool steel is used to make cutters! It is necessary to find out what steel the knife was made of. and only then draw any conclusions! on the network there is a mention of 8XB, but which technology was used, is the question? So the comparison of cutters made of tool steel and a knife made of construction is incorrect!
            1. 0
              21 March 2017 18: 35
              The incisors are also different, from P18 - for example, it is like rubber - it bends but does not break and does not chip!
              About this knife it is written material 95x18 steel, this is a highly corrosive steel close to absolutely stainless.
              1. +3
                21 March 2017 19: 19
                Quote: sibiryouk
                95X18 steel

                Then they were wise with MOT.
              2. 0
                21 March 2017 20: 26
                Could you source, call about 95 * 18? since there are doubts! In my opinion, does it go to bearings? a comrade made a knife from it, told both of them, and the end result even externally differed from the bayonet, very durable. I also have blanks from the bearing, I don’t remember the steel, maybe it is, but it is durable and does not prick
                1. +1
                  22 March 2017 10: 36
                  Quote: Kostya Andreev
                  Could you source, call about 95 * 18? since there are doubts!

                  Speech about the "given knife", i.e. knives from the article. Expensive quarter alloyed steel, mostly chrome. Such a combined-arms bayonet-knives did not even dream of.
            2. +1
              22 March 2017 15: 55
              The manufacturing technology is important - quenching-tempering (normalization), their quantity, modes. Or forging, again with its technology. I know for myself, when I worked as a locksmith on PCM, I had to make knives from a “technical” stainless steel (takes hardening) I do not want to rummage around a steel maker. So, some gave the blacksmith for forging blanks, while others poured in kerosene. Both the blade was elastic, but when you sharpen the blade in the penultimate operation (the last one is grinding-polishing), then when the blade overheats, the red-hot blade is released, and the forged one does not lose its properties.
      2. +3
        21 March 2017 10: 19
        Quote: avt
        And stupidly taught the techniques of bayonet fighting.

        In particular, they taught to dose force and not to plant a bayonet with all the dope, especially between the ribs, and then you will pull the figs out.
        And in the case of AK, bayonet combat was no longer taught, but taught hand-to-hand combat with weapons - feel the difference.
        1. 0
          21 March 2017 13: 01
          Quote: Gray Brother
          In particular, they taught to dose force and not to plant a bayonet with all the dope, especially between the ribs, and then you will pull the figs out.

          The bayonet-knife can also sit, this is typical for flat blades. In the case of rifles, there seemed to be another, more important goal - to bring the enemy into a state of shock from the first strike. Sometimes they beat me so that the barrel of the rifle penetrated the body after the bayonet.
    3. +2
      21 March 2017 10: 31
      Quote: Kostya Andrei
      Article advertising KAMPO !!!! All these new knives from CAMPO will have to be implemented easily and naturally, unlike their blunt and fragile predecessor.
      The author before writing, about, it was possible to throw a bayonet-knife into a tree and with surprise then ascertain the fact that the weapon is no longer a weapon, but two pieces of metal. need to write why the bayonet knife to AK made so !!
      At VO often, and much has been written about the cause of the fragility of the bayonet-knife for AK. Let me remind you that the knife’s fragility is due to the fact that if the enemy is defeated, it can become stuck in his body and it will be difficult to pull it out, so it can be broken by leaving the blade in the enemy’s body, thereby freeing the machine gun, the soldier’s main weapon !!!
      It is NOT necessary to think that in the USSR (with its financing of the defense industry!) The designers were more stupid than the KAMPO designers, and could not come up with and make a quality knife !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      Etozh how to stick so as not to pull out?
      And do not tell me why the grooves on the blade hi ?
      1. avt
        +3
        21 March 2017 11: 01
        Quote: Evil543
        And do not tell me why the grooves on the blade

        laughing Grooves .... good Type in the search engine - DOLL, or DOLLS on the knife.
        1. +3
          21 March 2017 12: 06
          Quote: avt
          Quote: Evil543
          And do not tell me why the grooves on the blade

          laughing Grooves .... good Type in the search engine - DOLL, or DOLLS on the knife.

          I know this, I wanted to know from a friend hi
      2. +1
        21 March 2017 13: 22
        And you have not been taught in the army, such a thing as the use of an assault rifle in hand-to-hand combat? In general, they explained where and how to stick and poke!
        I won’t say for the grooves, but I know about the dales, and although I don’t have the knife I am discussing, can I remember any grooves there? so you need to find out about which grooves and on which knife say
        early modification of the knife has grooves, and even on both sides, the groove on the left and the groove on the right, and he is so long and pretty, with pretty little screws.
        1. +2
          21 March 2017 13: 49
          Well, if you were taught then don’t be foolish about the fact that if a bayonet-knife is stuck it must be broken. When struck with a bayonet, it is sometimes cranked up, inflicting a lacerated wound and it should not break, it is not disposable.
          1. 0
            21 March 2017 14: 07
            My friend, (groove), if you struck, you would not ask questions about how hard you need to stick, you also need to develop mindfulness and not ascribe your thoughts to me! where I wrote that the knife is disposable, If you make an effort on yourself and read the comments, not only mine but others, then it says that the knife MAY get stuck !!!
            I would like to listen to your version of the fragility of the knife !! I hope it will not be foolish?
            1. +1
              21 March 2017 15: 08
              Well, first, learn for yourself, and then teach others, the grab of a weapon is enough to pull out a stuck bayonet-knife and nothing needs to be broken. And about the one-time bayonet, just read the previous comment, if you do not understand, then I'm sorry. And do without insults?
              1. 0
                21 March 2017 17: 46
                This Andreev’s bone has a lot of things written ... muddy type.
                1. 0
                  21 March 2017 18: 15
                  Well, probably a specialist hi
        2. +1
          April 8 2017 00: 11
          Quote: Kostya Andreev
          early modification of the knife has grooves, and even on both sides, the groove on the left and the groove on the right, and he is so long and pretty, with pretty little screws.

          This "pretty little with a black little handle" is called the "knife of the day", and a dagger instead of a knife. It was made from a bayonet from SKS. Here it was possible to throw it ...
    4. +2
      21 March 2017 10: 56
      Quote: Kostya Andreev
      It is NOT necessary to think that in the USSR (with its financing of the defense industry!) The designers were more stupid than the KAMPO designers, and could not come up with and make a quality knife !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      Nevertheless, there were plenty of mistakes in them too. In particular, on a bayonet, they clearly rested.
    5. +2
      22 March 2017 00: 50
      Article advertising, I agree here. But the fact that the bayonet — the knife to the AK 74 — is kaka (you can say an open ram and this will be true) is a medical fact known to any fighter to whom a fully equipped individual weapon falls into a hand or arm.
      I'm not really straining my memory, I can remember 2 breakdowns of the bayonet, despite the fact that they are worn with them, like with glass, you can’t do anything with them, you can open a maximum of canned food. The theory of deliberate fragility so that the weapon does not get stuck in the enemy’s body does not stand up to criticism (complete nonsense), the first time I heard this story was neighing for half an hour). My opinion was overdone with hardness and cheapness. The main function is piercing (therefore, the blade is dull), for this the low-alloy blade was made as resistant to longitudinal loads as possible, and the hard one was redirected, forgetting that in everyday life the knife is often faced with lateral loads.
      1. +1
        22 March 2017 19: 26
        It’s good that my opinion made you laugh, because laughter prolongs life and gives a good mood.
        I will not laugh at your version, I will not even call it nonsense, I just note that designers and technologists create a product that meets the requirements set by the customer, if it does not meet them, then they either bring it to mind or stop developing !!!
        from my own experience, I’ll say that this knife is not a problem, and as a person who does a little work with knives, there is always the opportunity to change the heat treatment on the next knife, metal and more !!!
        That is, the problem is not a technology error or the wrong material selected !!
        It is practically not possible to think of hardening and other technological things, that complaints will immediately come from the troops, and all who participated in the development. making, accepting a knife, will have trouble. and the problem will be fixed very quickly !!! all the more, before starting the series, everything passes the tests, where all the shortcomings and advantages are revealed. If this is not done, then the knife met the requirements !!!!
        I am forced to remind you that before the adoption of this knife was in service, there was a bayonet-knife made of high-quality steel, they refused it !!! took a new knife from another steel, with a different shape !!! That is, up to this point, they knew how to make knives, and after that they began to be wiser with hardening and technology !!!
        1. +2
          23 March 2017 20: 36
          Quote: Kostya Andreev
          I am forced to remind you that before the adoption of this knife was in service, there was a bayonet-knife made of high-quality steel, they refused it !!!

          I have to remember that before 6X3, there were not a single bayonet knife in service with the RI / USSR :)
          The 6X2 to AK is a blade bayonet, and the first bayonet knife was the “brittle" 6X3 where the name tried to emphasize its versatility, before that we had exclusively bayonets - blade, needle, folding and adjoining - but bayonets.
          Quote: Kostya Andreev
          I won’t even call her nonsense,

          Only you rave here - I’ll tell you a terrible secret - 6X3 was developed on the basis of the blade and additional tool of the experimental knife of Todorov’s scout divers, the main feature of which was multifunctionality - the ability to bite wire and cables and saw rods, i.e. the bayonet-knife blade had to easily and without consequences bite through the steel wire and saw steel i.e. The "traditional" St45 bayonet and knife 65G were not suitable, it was too expensive to make a P18 type hard-wearing tool and it was stupid, as 99% of users would never use this opportunity more than 1-2 times, and even more out of curiosity, so they used a less “kosher” steel, but just the same used for manual metal cutting tools (nippers, scissors for metal) 8KhF steel, in general, the reason for the fragility of the blades is not a malicious intent and not a violation of technology, but a forced palliative between cost-effectiveness yu-sufficiency. In general, the TTZ blade corresponded and if you do not use it in ways not provided for in the charters :) (as a throwing or knockout) then how it is intended to work is true, because of the high fragility and coarse-grained structure it’s impossible to grind it to a razor and it’s not difficult to break secret practices with a fragment of a blade in the carcass of the enemy, leave housewives for the forum.
          1. +1
            24 March 2017 10: 00
            You can tell these secrets in the forums of housewives where they believe and know that 65 G is knife steel, although it was spring all life, knife steel is different. and they make knives out of the spring because of its availability and are cheap, but why were 45 and 65 unsuitable?
            R 18 is expensive for you, and with mass-flow mechanized production it’s a penny. look at the price of an instrument made of it, and this is not just a strip of metal, like a knife.
            forced palliative between cost-effectiveness-sufficiency who forced? You went through the heights, found a mention of steel in the network and decided to boast of knowledge, I’ll also tell you a secret: there’s a horseradish mountain of other steels that could be used in production without increasing the cost, or even reducing it, for example, there are many varieties of stainless steel, using which you can get a product with different price and quality,
            And so you wrote a lot of beech letters, the meaning of which can be reduced to a simple one: that steel was taken that met the stated requirements, namely to withstand the load at the time of the injection. and if you need to break in order to free the weapon. All!!
            You can continue to tell tales about poliative and other nonsense !!!
    6. 0
      April 17 2018 21: 36
      Quote: Kostya Andreev
      It is NOT necessary to think that in the USSR (with its financing of the defense industry!) The designers were more stupid than the KAMPO designers, and could not come up with and make a quality knife !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      You will make a good knife - they will pull the demobilization for souvenirs !!! laughing
  4. 0
    21 March 2017 08: 53
    the "Bumblebee" in the photo on the handle also noticeably mounts on the trunk, if so - what's the difference?
    1. +6
      21 March 2017 09: 45
      Quote: kot11180
      the "Bumblebee" in the photo on the handle also noticeably mounts on the trunk, if so - what's the difference?

      the very first photo is a bayonet-knife, and throughout the text the knife appears everywhere, they messed up the photos.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. 0
        April 8 2017 00: 18
        Quote: veteran66
        the very first photo is a bayonet-knife, and throughout the text the knife appears everywhere, they messed up the photos.

        as well as inscriptions on the blades ... First, take a closer look at the pictures, and then speak
  5. +3
    21 March 2017 08: 53
    The bayonet ak knife flew and stuck quite well. And did not fall apart even once.
    1. 0
      21 March 2017 10: 28
      Those that went to Ak74m did not break, newer.
    2. +1
      21 March 2017 11: 21
      I had to watch a training film once, how to throw a bayonet-knife and a sapper blade ... filmed in a TVO in a mountain rifle company ...
  6. 0
    21 March 2017 09: 05
    It seems not bad, but what is the price of this knife?
  7. +3
    21 March 2017 09: 33
    Quote: kot11180
    the "Bumblebee" in the photo on the handle also noticeably mounts on the trunk, if so - what's the difference?

    By the way, I also did not notice any differences in the photographs of the bayonet and bayonet-knife
    1. +7
      21 March 2017 10: 23
      1st and 3rd photo are the same. On the 2nd there are differences in the knife.
  8. 0
    21 March 2017 09: 50
    In the vastness of the network, I met another option that differs from those represented by the shape of the blade
  9. +1
    21 March 2017 10: 52
    The bayonet knife in modern warfare has lost its functions.
    The percentage of killed bayonets with a knife after the Second World War is negligible.
  10. +1
    21 March 2017 11: 13
    The first AK had a cool bayonet (AK-47 in the press)
  11. +7
    21 March 2017 11: 15
    Friends, the one who understands what a knife fight is, he knows that it lasts no more 2-3 seconds.
    During this time, you can destroy the enemy 2 - 4 times by inflicting wounds incompatible with life.
    Many knife developers make one fatal mistake - the lights try to make the knife universal. This is a technical and military mistake.

    The combat knife should only serve to destroy the enemy. This is his main and main goal.
    From here the knife design should go.
    In the description of the knife "Bumblebee" it is written that it is removed from the sheath in 2 seconds.
    I will kill the enemy twice in 2 seconds.
    When the knife is designed to work in water (for divers), the speed of removing the knife from the sheath does not particularly affect survival, since in water all movements are slowed down due to the high density of water.
    In the air, this number will not work.
    As a rule, knife combat takes place at close and medium distances, i.e. at arm's length.
    And the one who strikes first is the winner. This is not a competition where they can stop the battle, this is a battle to destroy and the rate of this battle is life and the ability to complete a combat mission.
    An important aspect is the method of carrying the knife, what is the design of the scabbard.
    The knife must be held in the sheath due to the friction of the blade on the sheath. So that you can grab it instantly without wasting time on various fasteners.
    I believe that the development of KAMPO JSC does not meet the requirements of the modern army.
    I have developed a knife called "Pastukhov’s Combat Knife" patent for invention No. 2609119 from 06 on August 2013.
    You can look at the PASTUKHOV Arms Plant website in the Our Inventions section or find a description at the Federal Institute of Industrial Property of the Russian Federation.

    Pastukhov Evgeny Grigoryevich
    1. +2
      21 March 2017 11: 50
      "When the knife is designed to work in water (for divers), the speed of removing the knife from the sheath does not particularly affect survival because all movements in the water are slowed down due to the high density of the water" ... Especially if you are without a breathing apparatus, the air supply 1,5, XNUMX minutes and got into a network ... you can not come up ...
      1. +2
        21 March 2017 14: 27
        Yes, and still need to take into account the time to search for the latch that secures the knife in the scabbard, and even on the leg, but still need to reach it ....
        Then you definitely will not come up.
    2. +4
      21 March 2017 14: 58
      Quote: pegas60
      one who understands what a knife fight is

      Well it was a matter of reconstructing with the guys. In a symmetrical situation, either stupid mutual striping, designed for maximum damage per second. Or vice versa, circling at a distance due to unwillingness to get hit back - this is especially true for those who already have experience in receiving cut wounds and who do not want to update it. It is especially great if you have time to wind the jacket on your hand. It immediately becomes clear that the result will be a clinch with mutual killing. Only someone will possibly reach resuscitation, while someone will no longer be. The bottom line - the knife itself is junk. It is necessary to supplement it with at least a gas spray, then the chances of not suffering yourself increase.
      Quote: pegas60
      he knows that it lasts no more than 2-3 seconds.

      This is if the victim is disarmed and immobilized in advance.
      Quote: pegas60
      "Pastukhov's combat knife"

      I read the description.
      1. The designer offers it as a universal tool for especially impoverished saboteurs who do not have any other special means - i.e. The warrior here is clearly not the topic.
      2. It practically guarantees that the impoverished saboteur specially trained specifically for this knife will be able to effectively confront several starving men with knives at once, but indecisive and untrained. The situation from a series of fiction. Again, not the topic.
      3. He claims that with the help of his knife it is possible not only to cut the victims, but also to dissect using other methods, for example, damaging or breaking joints. If true, it may come in handy. Modern equipment materials are practically not cut, and their puncture requires a rather narrow blade. I just have a suspicion that a character who has the necessary conditions for such matters will knock out an opponent without these troubles.
      4. Recalls that the safety requirements regarding pistols do not apply to the knife, which is why putting them into a combat position is delayed for several seconds. And the aforementioned knife allegedly has a particularly advanced slaughter, which will allow him to occupy the niche of the weapon of last chance. There is a rational kernel. At us, with all our Warriors and other things, the pistols to the ordinary staff seem to be still not put. In this situation, only knives or sapper blades can be considered as a backup weapon.
      1. +1
        21 March 2017 15: 58
        Thank you for your interest in my knife.
        Just understand that knife fighting is not a toy.
        Surviving is not the strongest, but equipped with good weapons.
        Now everyone wears body armor.
        And you have to be a complete idiot to try to pierce with a knife body armor of any protection class.
        A person is very tenacious and it is very difficult to kill, but on the other hand, a person’s life is very fragile.
        And a knowledgeable fighter can destroy the enemy with one stab of a knife.
        I will not describe the battle technique here.
        1. +2
          22 March 2017 11: 40
          Quote: pegas60
          Just understand that knife fighting is not a toy.

          The problem is that a purely knife fight in the form of a duel is something rare, unprecedented and almost useless.
          Quote: pegas60
          Now everyone wears body armor.

          Bulletproof vests are few. But practically any equipment has resistance to cut. For example, "tactical gloves." How many I remember, even cheap ones, with fingers sewn separately, and those in the description have this property. Yes, such a fabric usually pierces easily. But then the blade will have to be made narrow to the detriment of everything else, including the methods of use in battle.
          Quote: pegas60
          a knowledgeable fighter can destroy an enemy with a single stab of a knife.

          Not just knowledgeable, but specially trained. It should also be noted that conscripts are unlikely to be trained in this case, so as not to produce experienced thugs in the civilian life. And what's even worse - training specifically under the knife does not develop much strength and mobility compared to hand-to-hand combat. Those. They will teach hand-to-hand combat, and one lesson will be devoted to knife fighting.
          Quote: pegas60
          I will not describe the battle technique here

          According to the knife, there is no sensible battle technique. There is a killing technique. An opportunity has appeared - you are realizing it. No, take your feet. The same pepper spray, as a supplement, can perfectly help this. An order of magnitude more than some special battle technique or blade design. And great versatility - a flock of dogs (they will easily tear an ordinary hacksaw) or a group of machine gunners in a confined space - both of these can be seriously puzzled.
        2. +4
          23 March 2017 21: 04
          Quote: pegas60
          Just understand that knife fighting is not a toy.

          It’s only necessary to understand that you are already old enough to hang around shit :) As a cold store for a soldier, a shovel, hatchet, cleaver or even a trite baton are much more suitable — we look at how they waved in the trenches and how the ground attack aircraft were armed, than they fought in hand-to-hand combat in the WWII - and we were surprised at the bayonet knives but they fought mainly with shoulder blades, grenades, used rifles and submachine guns and even Faustpatrons and spare machine-gun barrels as a club, but yes, there are still knife and dagger masters - commandos, brand Yerburzhtsy and other diversions - but even there the shaving is not the task, and the Americans at first played in every way with fearful daggers, but while fighting a little, they hurriedly carried with them smartchettes, machetes and even tomahawks - I wonder why this is? Everything is simple - it is much easier to kill instantly by breaking a skull, and disarming a broken arm than trying to poke an opponent with a knife.
          But in principle, you are not alone - there are still enough people jumping to gyms with rubber knives, trying to evade bullets and other enlightened ones by the pendulum method, you start talking with such an adept of "secret deadly practices" - his eyes are burning, he whispers what he already a master, and thanks to secret tricks known only to him, he is almost an unbeatable super warrior, etc. - and you dig deeper - the office hamster did not serve, but with a bunch of complexes secretly hoping to become a cool commando, ninja james bond, etc.
          PS I happened to use the knife as a weapon once against not the largest shepherd but an aggressive shepherd (for all kinds of greens, I inform you - in that situation there was no other way out either I would bang it - or it would tear me up) - despite the fact that I got successfully — having immediately killed all the aorta at the exit from the heart — it actively moved for a rather long time, and the knife remained in the wound as the handle instantly became slippery with blood and stupidly at the moment of impact the dog bounced and pulled the knife out of his hands. In general, while she died, she managed to reach me a couple of times, despite the fact that I did not stand a stump.
          1. +1
            25 March 2017 15: 53
            You are right.
            That knife fight which is shown at competitions is a complete profanity.
            And believe me, a knife is a very dangerous weapon.
            And even if you have an ax, a tomahawk or a sapper shovel in your hands, a trained fighter will kill you with a knife and this is without options.
            So that you know our ancestors with two knives, they could resist and destroy soldiers armed with long bladed weapons - a saber, a saber.
            The Russians had in their arsenal knife fighting techniques such that not every enemy dared to engage in a fight with him. That is why Russia occupied 12 time zones.
            The Russians were always guided by the rule "die yourself, and help a comrade."
            This we have now turned into wordless rams, which from 1917 of the year have been robbed and destroyed by these enemies - cosmopolitans with Russian surnames.
            Four generations of Russians have not seen a good life. And now there’s no gap ahead.
            Good luck to you.
      2. 0
        21 March 2017 17: 06
        In the states there was a real case when police officers (all armed with firearms) tried to detain a bully with a knife. Bottom line: delayed. Losses: cut 19 police officers.
        1. +4
          22 March 2017 11: 48
          Quote: ignoto
          Bottom line: delayed. Losses: cut 19 police officers.

          So the specifics are indicated in the text itself: they tried to detain him and eventually they detained him. They would try to kill - the losses would be much smaller.
  12. 0
    21 March 2017 11: 31
    Everything develops in a spiral. With the modern equipment of the enemy fighter, it is the piercing actions of the bayonet-knife that become again in demand. And when throwing, the piercing-piercing function is the main one. It’s only in the cinema that two in T-shirts wave cutters against each other for 15 minutes, then cut one leg, then cut one hand. In real combat, the combat contact time is seconds. I didn’t sew it, - they rolled away to the sides and in a new way, until again you entered the hand-to-hand combat. Here I am afraid that they will forget about the main function of the knife - to kill. And therefore, I think that 2 knives are needed - combat / throwing and the second multifunctional.
    1. +3
      21 March 2017 12: 11
      Something I don’t believe in the stabbing function of a knife, if the enemy has body armor, a helmet with face protection, etc., there is not much space where to stab. Well, if I got close, tried on and poked, but if in a dump, I don’t know ... But throwing a knife is for sure, only for fighters.
      1. +1
        21 March 2017 13: 30
        A durable blade that has an effective shape (a Russian trihedron would be best) has an interesting property. He’s slipping, you know. With armor plate just on the joint. Which in the armor is made of just fabric, all in all. And if the plate is superimposed on the plate, then its tip gently raises ...
        1. 0
          21 March 2017 14: 42
          Now in NATO, the fabric on the bronch of kevlar threads, so that the trihedron will leave bruises and that's it.
        2. 0
          21 March 2017 15: 10
          I can agree with this. Alshpis for piercing lat has been known since the 1400s, as is the stylet. but this is a highly specialized weapon, for which it is no longer suitable. doing it now
          vsepronozh.ru
      2. +2
        21 March 2017 14: 45
        Throwing a bayonet of a knife is comparable to throwing a machine gun or a pistol, but in general a sharpened sapper is a good thing as a weapon of last chance.
    2. +2
      21 March 2017 15: 45
      Quote: andrew42
      Here I am afraid that they will forget about the main function of the knife - to kill.

      Then the gun is much more convenient and efficient. In WWI and WWII, captured guns and revolvers were in great demand.
      Quote: andrew42
      In real combat, the combat contact time is seconds.

      Of course. Since the option when two fighters are fighting on knives is from a series of fiction. More often there will be other layouts. For example, a knife against a machine gun or pistol made for battle. The time of such a real combat contact will really be a few seconds.
      Quote: andrew42
      And therefore, I think that 2 knives are needed - combat / throwing and the second multifunctional.

      Ideally, a gun + multitool. To paratroopers - a sling cutter, where without it. If there is no money for pistols, then a bayonet-knife, since it is many times more effective than a conventional knife. Moreover, the bayonet and guard bayonet relies on the nature of the activity.
  13. +6
    21 March 2017 12: 23
    Oh, how many marvelous, unforgettable moments I had to endure in two years, arming the hand-assed nerds who strove to destroy state property, simply dropping this misunderstanding on the concrete floor of the gun park
  14. +1
    21 March 2017 12: 24
    A knife in battle is a stupid thing, especially in winter, but it is absolutely necessary in everyday life, in preparation for a military base, etc.
    A bayonet on a weapon is a terrible thing. The power of the blow is huge, psychologically invincible. 18-20 year old boys crush in a single fit any Basurman even with a saber, even without a Soviet bayonet-knife (the quality of the knives was different, but they broke often). A small multitool is necessary and decent for every driver mechanic with a car.
    We usually each had a personal knife in a boot or on a belt not folding.
    1. 0
      21 March 2017 17: 08
      From the point of view of modern military psychology, the optimal age of a soldier is 35+.
      1. +2
        23 March 2017 11: 21
        In terms of practice, 35+ wounded gray-haired colonels. This is if not on the couch.
        War is the work of the young.
  15. 0
    21 March 2017 12: 33
    In the Oliver Stone film “Platoon” -1986, an episode with a bayonet attack of Vietnamese with AK. The truth is with a Chinese with a needle bayonet. A bayonet enters the body nicely !!!
  16. 0
    21 March 2017 13: 26
    Need, of course, both. To begin with, a man, if he is in more difficult conditions than a house-car-office-house without a knife, is generally problematic to manage. Well, if only he is armless. A knife is a universal tool for solving a wide range of tasks, especially if it is not equipped with various additional features, like many "survival knives". All these devices reduce its convenience and versatility, but greatly reduce reliability.
    What is a bayonet? This weapon is designed to quickly and effectively kill the enemy in close combat. In this case, the bayonet is mounted on the barrel of the weapon. The tasks of one and the second tool overlap very weakly. An attempt to universalize will lead to the same thing as always - "a universal tool performs all tasks equally badly."
    If for civilian life everything is not so bad - just throw out another sophisticated stray, then you will pay with your life in the war. Looking at the proposed cuttlefish, we can immediately say that the bayonet is worthless. When struck, and the only thing, the bayonet should provide the fastest possible incapacitation of the enemy. How will this device provide this?
    With a knife strike, the enemy can remain active for up to half a minute. The Soviet bayonet inflicted a large, lacerated wound, blood loss from which ensured an almost instantaneous loss of consciousness. And what's that? The same waste as a modern "bayonet" designed for beautiful photos ...
  17. +4
    21 March 2017 14: 32
    The tale about the bayonet-knife from AK breaking, everyone heard but no one saw. This is from the same series that the best gun of the twentieth century (PM) is shit.
    1. +3
      21 March 2017 14: 37
      The tale about the bayonet-knife from AK breaking, everyone heard but no one saw


      From personal experience I’ll say the bayonet knife from the AK breaks easily, it is enough to drop it on a tile or concrete floor, very fragile.
      1. +4
        21 March 2017 22: 19
        Quote: krops777
        The tale about the bayonet-knife from AK breaking, everyone heard but no one saw

        From personal experience I’ll say the bayonet knife from the AK breaks easily, it is enough to drop it on a tile or concrete floor, very fragile.


        One cannot believe in such fragility. In the Soviet army, soldiers at the age of 18 were in fact still scratched. So the bayonets from the AK-74 were thrown at random. And not once did not one break. But we are ordinary soldiers, not special forces, and the number of thrusts was scanty. And these knives flew with great crash into different angles and did not break. Moreover - they threw him directly with a machine gun, like a dart, and also did not always stick. And when a machine with a bayonet falls, the bayonet will always receive a side impact. The bayonets were ordinary, in orange scabbard. And you say - fell on the tile and all. The only thing that surprised me was that the blade crumbled like sugar. If you hit a nail during a throw, for example.
  18. +1
    21 March 2017 14: 37
    Quote: Kostya Andrei
    Guessed from experience: when a bayonet got stuck between ribs or between human vertebrae from an impact. stuck does not always happen, in this case it was recommended to even release the weapon with the emphasis on the enemy (I don’t remember the source). And in this case, using the machine as a lever, a sharp movement to the side and the weapon is free!
    It’s incorrect to compare weapons of the times of Peter the Great and the mid-1th century! It varies, as well as the conditions for its use!
    By the way, you can search the network for information on AK knives made of high-quality steel, (If my memory serves me, then when I was in my service, I saw this longer than the standard one with a black handle. I didn’t postpone it in my memory, I just remembered that it was different from ours! I will not argue!)
    I want to say right away that I didn’t cut a person, so this is a theory !!!

    This is a knife from AK47. He has wooden handles, very high-quality steel.
  19. +7
    21 March 2017 17: 00
    I read it. He laughed. I read the comments .... Laughed even more.
    A conversation at the level - The Yars rocket is a terrible force, we had it in the neighboring regiment. Yes, garbage, we have it fell on a soldier only ears remained ....- - but because the alloy in it is rare and that's broken .....
    Dear what are you talking about? Go to the kitchen and see how many knives you have there?
    Similarly, in military affairs. THE UNIVERSAL CAN'T BE ANYTHING!
    A throwing knife, by definition, cannot be a good bayonet. Stroporez - badly cuts canned food ....
    And you can kill a person with your hands, and with a knife and a word, it is important that you know how to do it.
    Regards, Boris.
    1. +3
      21 March 2017 22: 38
      That's right, but most of the comments were about the fragility of the bayonet-knife from the AK-74. In my opinion, no one really gave an explanation. So you laughed at others, but you yourself didn’t say anything either. Because how to say that the knives are all different - this is to say nothing.
      1. +4
        21 March 2017 23: 36
        It so happened in my life that I have two military specialties. Well, according to the first - you cannot take off a bayonet with a knife with a knife. But in the second some experience is available. The second is when the white-blue vest and the Oak between the sky and you.
        For us, the cutter was more important, but on the ejection of the bayonet, the knife is quite an irreplaceable thing. The truth is mostly beyond no other name. In fact, it’s tighter to open the canned food, to cut a piece of wood .... to fry the coffee from the dandelions .... Our officers, who incidentally have a good command of knife fighting, usually took with them something homemade and more practical.
        About the fragility of the blade. I can only assume that the bayonet knife was originally created in the late 40s. The main purpose is to stab the enemy in hand-to-hand combat experience a bit faded into the background, under the influence of the PCA. But the customer out of habit demanded that the developers leave this function. They tried to combine the breakthrough through the barbed wire with the first one .... plus they tried to give it a "kitchen" universality. In the conditions of mass production of that time, they were made of steel that was. And of course, neither surface hardening, nor cementation, nor nitriding, nor ... heaps of everything tasty, in conditions of mass production is impossible. And steel, just pierced whole, mainly so that you can cut the wire.
        I repeat - I am not an expert in this matter. Although I own a little knife. And sometimes he made knives for himself, when there was an opportunity, He worked as a mechanic in a factory.
        A few words about the knife in modern combat. I immediately remember a joke about two fucking ... in the desert where there is no stone. There were many comments and I agree with many. Firstly, before getting into a hospital bed, I could deal with the enemy with an armed pistol, for three meters if I had a knife. Checked. The knife has always been and will be an effective weapon of battle. They said a lot here that with a knife "the warrior cannot be pierced." Yes, really, but are there many opponents in bulletproof vests on the battlefield now? So it all depends on the specific situation. But my opinion is that if I have something to kill the enemy on the battlefield, I should be able to do it and preferably better than the enemy and it is desirable that this “something” was better than the enemy
        Regards, Boris.
  20. +1
    21 March 2017 17: 20
    Comrade GERBER
  21. +2
    21 March 2017 17: 58
    in my opinion everything is clear and no comments are required, to each his own, motorized infantry a bayonet-knife, a special intelligence reconnaissance knife, but I’ll always leave everything for Caesar’s Finnish belt ...
  22. +3
    21 March 2017 22: 09
    Pampering is everything. The knife is needed for household purposes and nowhere else. The time of bayonet attacks has long gone. All sorts of precedents there "and here I ran out of ammunition", "we ran nose to nose" and "I stabbed him" happen once every 1000 fights. If the weight of this knife is transferred to cartridges for the main weapon, how much can you put on them, unlike a lottery with a knife?
    A modern warrior is usually dressed in a good 5th grade armor with an apron, collar and shoulder straps, a helmet with a visor and jumpsuit made of anti-splinter fabric. You can pierce only the limbs, not to mention cuts.
    Sentinels are many times easier to remove from silent than crawling portraying a militant hero with the risk of getting a bullet.
    1. avt
      +2
      21 March 2017 23: 06
      Quote: Marssik
      Pampering is everything. The knife is needed for household purposes and nowhere else. The time of bayonet attacks has long gone.

      Well, that's it, that's it ... However .....
      The dagger is good for the one who has it, and bad for the one who doesn’t have it ... at the right time.
      1. +1
        22 March 2017 01: 38
        Good, bad ... The main thing is who has a gun!
    2. +1
      26 December 2017 15: 14
      “and then I ran out of ammunition”, “we ran nose to nose” ... and there would have been a good old wooden butt, like the AK-47 ... you could just move like a club.
  23. +3
    21 March 2017 22: 52
    Just noticed shoulder straps. This, in the sense, who wrote how many comments? I saw the army general, but are there Mershals?
    1. +2
      22 March 2017 00: 50
      Eat, still look at the marshals hi
  24. +7
    22 March 2017 16: 50
    In the bottom photo, the knife reminds me of something very green, since no one paid attention? We reinvent the wheel again.
  25. +2
    22 March 2017 17: 29
    Oh, this knife reminds me of a knife. Wonderful blade!
    1. +7
      25 March 2017 22: 37
      I immediately thought of him)
  26. 0
    23 March 2017 15: 17
    I used the multitool 3 pcs. All broke and heavily to ugliness mainly used crimping for cd and so junk ...
    1. Bat
      0
      12 October 2017 20: 38
      Something I am amused in your words. Two years have used it. Better than any Ledik.
  27. +2
    24 March 2017 10: 29
    No need to break either copies or knives, I think many will agree with the idea that for a simple infantryman you need a good, reliable knife, cut bread, open a tin can, and so on. Massive bayonet attacks with drums, a banner and an officer with a saber were glorious pages in history. Or isn’t it? Hand-to-hand combat will remain of course, as long as people are fighting, not robots. For commandos, GRU special forces, and other masters of knife fighting, special knives to perform special tasks. Naturally, better steel, more expensive. A simple soldier needs a knife. Just a good knife.
    1. Bat
      0
      12 October 2017 20: 40
      Agree to all 100
  28. +3
    24 March 2017 13: 09
    Everyone forgets about another function of the bayonet in battle. This is if they clamp down to deepen the shelter. You can dig up with a bayonet and zemlyots from a prone position while scrambling. And chop / cut the roots. And much more if the head works. Isn’t it easier to make a high-quality combat knife with all the necessary functions and make it possible to mount the automatic machine optional and secondary. There should be several forms of the handle so that each fighter can choose for himself.
    1. Bat
      0
      12 October 2017 20: 41
      Correctly. Comrade.
  29. 0
    25 March 2017 12: 38
    but what kind of modification is it and most importantly what kind of tricky sharpening, what is it for?

    1. +2
      25 March 2017 17: 33
      What kind of modification I do not know. And sharpening is different for this reason: the area closest to the handle has a smaller angle and therefore can be sharpened to a greater sharpness, but the sharpening loses faster. It is for domestic use. Rope cut bread cut a bale to spread. Yes, and throat these sections of the blade “strike”. To sharpen the section farthest from the handle to shaving sharpness is much more difficult, but it also holds sharpening much better. Less prone to painting and spalling when hitting hard objects. Most for stinging punches
  30. exo
    +1
    27 March 2017 23: 04
    Finally, normal steel, on the blade. If, still TMT will be decent, it will be very good. And outwardly, it already looks decent
  31. 0
    1 August 2017 01: 21
    as practice has shown (including a hardcore month in the “field” in the amount of 1 set per platoon), a Bundeswicks spark (new 111mm) and a lazerman rebar, almost completely covers the needs of ordinary and sergeant personnel.
  32. Bat
    +1
    12 October 2017 20: 35
    For 12 years he used a bayonet-knife to Kalash every day. A great thing. If you don’t throw it at a stone or past a tree. This is a GUN at first and then a KNIFE. It opens perfectly the hen and enemies. And nothing more is needed.
  33. 0
    19 October 2017 20: 09
    95-18, normal stainless steel with moody termichka. Confuses such a run in hardness: 54-58.
  34. 0
    26 December 2017 15: 05
    “Yes, the bayonet-knife for a Kalashnikov assault rifle was a strange device. Like a knife, it was about nothing at all.” ... no matter how, a well-thought-out security system for use, they could not be cut.
  35. 0
    13 October 2018 14: 33
    Canned bayonet with a knife for Kalash, opened elementarily. It is designed to stab the enemy and cut the wire. And only stupid people can throw it into a tree
  36. 0
    12 January 2020 17: 20
    The blade of the knife passes along the entire length of the handle and ends with a percussion element, which is intended for applying shock blows and breaking through hardened glass.

    This, as I understand it, is something like "cullet". Of course, professional designers and engineers work at KAMPO JSC, and they worked out some kind of misconduct in this regard, but I don’t remember where in the army the glass may need which glass the soldier will break in a combat situation, moreover, all the glasses on a new and promising technology are not tempered, but bullet-resistant. The soldier is not a rescuer, not a firefighter, and not an inspector on the road, and he won’t even be able to deliver a “shock strike to the enemy” (if it comes to such close combat), he will try to simply destroy the enemy in any way possible!
    In 99% of cases, any Combat Knife is used for non-combat missions. But for such work, as for opening something or when you need to use the force of two hands and with one hand to strike at the top of a knife - such a job the soldier has to do quite often. And in this case, this “cullet" will just interfere and work against its owner. Therefore, I believe that this part of the Combat Knife is simply superfluous and even harmful. And as a confirmation of my thoughts - there were no "cullets" on any military or trench knife of past wars.
    And the second thing. This Combat knife or Bayonet knife is certainly better than all those that were in the Russian and Soviet armies, but it is good only for soldiers of the main units, but for special tasks such as reconnaissance or DRG, it does not fit from an owl "at all" - not a single scout will to carry with him this "weapon of the last chance" weighing 700 grams, the scout will take with him better "extra" 60 rounds or a couple of grenades!
  37. 0
    20 January 2022 11: 06
    Quote from: uw09072019
    cullet type

    Everything is simple here. Glass breaker was invented in warm California, when a person who has an accident has sandals on his feet (if they have not fallen off from the impact), and kicking glass is fraught with cuts, after which there will be no chance of getting out of the car.
    A soldier has berets or boots on his feet, and a blow with a sole will take out any glass instantly, although it is easier to hit with a barrel or butt, or shoot.