Ukraine is arming and wants to arm NATO

401


The other day, the head of the Ukrainian mission in the North Atlantic Alliance, Ambassador I. Didenko, said that the Ukrainian government is taking a number of measures to develop relations with NATO at a qualitatively new level in the military industry. During the interview for the Interfax-Ukraine agency, he noted that due to certain circumstances, relations between Ukraine and the member countries of the alliance were in limbo. Therefore, the Ukrainian authorities will do everything possible to ensure that these contacts develop regularly. Didenko also said that the meetings of representatives of the two parties are scheduled for February already. He also stressed that during the negotiations, the Ukrainian side intends to work out the prospect of attracting the Ukrainian military-industrial complex to NATO contacts in order to participate in them and submit their applications.

Historically, trade weapons is one of the priority factors of international relations. Since it is one of the aspects of the foreign policy of each state, military trade has always attracted and will attract the attention of not only the world community, but also possible opponents and competitors, experts, as well as private individuals. The percentage of arms exports is about 2 percent of total world exports. And over the past decade, weapons worth about 300 billions of dollars have been sold. According to experts, approximately 50 of exporting countries and about 120 - importers deal with arms trafficking.

It is not surprising that Ukraine is trying to find its place in the global arms trade market. At the time of independence on the territory of Ukraine, the military-industrial complex included about 3,5 thousands of enterprises that employed 3 million people.

Today, the military-industrial complex of the Ukrainian state has a fairly high export potential in areas such as the development and modernization of military transport and combat aircraft and helicopters, the production of gas turbines and equipment based on military ships, the development and production of rocket-space complexes and missiles , development and research of samples of military equipment and weapons.

A.Artyushenko, director of the development and procurement of military equipment and weapons of the Ukrainian military, said that the ministry plans to adopt the Sapsan missile system before 2016. This is probably the first case for the entire period of independence, when the government allocates a significant amount to carry out developments of its own modern weapons. Such a decision was confirmed by the President of Ukraine V.Yanukovych during his visit to the Kharkov military factories. The designers of Yuzhnoye Design Bureau, who were the authors of 12 from 20 of similar developments during the Soviet era, will be engaged in designing. All the defense enterprises of the country will be engaged in construction. Thus, it will be a national Ukrainian development. The decision to create the Sapsan missile system was made back in 2006 year. It was planned that experimental tests of it would be held in the 2013 year, and in a few years, that is, in the 2015 year, it was supposed to start equipping the Ukrainian army with new weapons. But, since the funds for development were practically not allocated, then, accordingly, no work on its creation was conducted. Thus, the terms of delivery of the complex are transferred. However, according to some military experts, if the required amount is approximately 460 million dollars will be found, then the first missiles will be ready for 2015 year.

Recall that Ukraine has previously made attempts to create such missile systems. The first of these was carried out in 1994, when “Yuzhnoye” began the development of a complex of short and medium range “Borysfen”. The second is the “Thunder” OTRK, which was planned to be used as a defense of non-nuclear deterrence for the Ukrainian borders. But the lack of funds caused both of these projects to wind up.

The new missile system "Sapsan" should surpass the "Point-U" technical characteristics. Its effectiveness is low vulnerability and high mobility. According to the project, the Sapsan will be based on an automobile chassis, and the missiles will not require any additional maintenance costs during the operation. Thus, according to Ukrainian specialists, the new complex will be much cheaper than its closest competitor, the Russian Iskander, which costs approximately 1 billion dollars.

Experts quite ambiguously assess the desire of the Ukrainian government to create its own missile system. Some are sure that its creation and subsequent purchase will be of immense moral and psychological importance for the Ukrainian military, since in all the years of independence the Ukrainian army has not received a single complex. Others argue that if the state cannot sell a single complex to other countries, production will be unprofitable. Another part of the experts believes that such development is inexpedient, since Ukraine does not have a specially equipped testing ground or a guidance system that could ensure the accuracy of missile penetration. Russian experts generally say that the project is not very feasible in the conditions of Ukraine, but even if it is created, the complex will not be able to compete properly with the Iskander.

It should be noted that a year ago, as an alternative to development, the possibility of equipping the Ukrainian armed forces with Russian Iskanders was considered; however, according to Ukrainian politicians, such a move would only aggravate the dependence of the Ukrainian state on Russia and lead to a complete freezing of the Sapsan project.

Ukraine’s military initiatives are not thrilled with NATO, which, prior to the admission of Hungary, Slovakia and Bulgaria to the alliance, demanded the disbandment of the missile units. Moreover, the United States of America persistently demanded the Ukrainian government to destroy the Scud complexes. The arguments included the accession of Ukraine to the MTCR and the agreements on the INF.

Despite numerous difficulties, the Ukrainian government decided to create Sapsan. Upgrading missile weapons is relevant for the state, since most of the complexes that are in service with the Ukrainian army — Smerch, Grad, and Hurricane — have already exhausted their resources and need to be modernized. But neither the missiles themselves, nor their components in Ukraine are produced. “The Tochka-U complexes, which are currently in service, work out the service life to 2015 of the year. Therefore, the creation of a new missile system, which could replace outdated weapons, is the best option for Ukraine, especially since its production will require the cooperation of a large number of enterprises, which means thousands of jobs.

According to A.Artyushenko, that before 2016, the Ukrainian army will receive the first ship "corvette". In general, it is planned to build a ship of this class 4 to 2020 year.

To date, the Ukrainian fleet does not have ships in the far sea zone, and the flagship of the naval forces Getman Sagaidachny, the corvettes Ternopol and Lutsk, as well as the landing ship Konstantin Olshansky take part in international exercises.

The decision to develop a warship for the Ukrainian Navy was made back in 2006 year. The project is engaged in the Nikolaev Shipbuilding Research and Design Center, which stated that the new ship would combine the tasks of a frigate and a corvette.

The Minister of Defense of Ukraine M. Yezhel said that 29 enterprises of Ukraine would be involved in the construction. 200 million hryvnia will be allocated for the design work. The total budget of the program will be 16, 2 billion hryvnia, of which 11 billion is for the construction of ships.

The lead ship, the Vladimir the Great, was laid down in Nikolaev in May last year. According to the project, it is planned to equip the new ship with modern equipment. At the same time, the Minister of Defense said that this would not be Russian equipment and weapons, but purchases would be made in Italy and in France, and diesel generators would be purchased from the United States. It is assumed that the ship will be equipped with anti-ship missiles, the range of which is about 200 kilometers. Each corvette will have Exocet MM8 Block40 3 missiles, as well as an anti-aircraft missile launcher from the same company.

In addition, M. Yezhel urged the Ukrainian population to make charitable contributions for the construction of a new warship and even promised to transfer their monthly salary.

Recall that during the independence of the Ukrainian state, the naval forces received only two corvettes: in the 1994 year - the “Lutsk”, in the 2005 year - the “Ternopil”. All in all, the Ukrainian Navy has 56 ships, of which 28 are warships.

The state project of a targeted defense program for the development of military equipment and weapons for 2012-2017 provides for the provision of armed forces with new and modernized equipment in order to carry out combat missions.

For the development of the program for five years it is expected to allocate about 17 billion UAH In addition, it will determine the priorities in the development of the defense industry, which will contribute to the creation of modern weapons. It is planned to attract about 160 enterprises of the military-industrial complex of the Ukrainian state to the program.
401 comment
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. Alexey Prikazchikov
    -4
    6 February 2012 08: 33
    Yeah, I haven’t laughed like that for a long time. wink while reading the article. In a word, Ukrainians cannot be called them in another way laughing
    1. +4
      6 February 2012 11: 06
      At the time of independence on the territory of Ukraine, the military-industrial complex included about 3,5 thousand enterpriseswhich employed 3 million people.

      It is planned to attract to the implementation of the program about 160 enterprises military-industrial complex of the Ukrainian state.

      And that's it!!!
      1. Splin
        +11
        6 February 2012 11: 16
        This does not say anything. Yes, the number of defense industry enterprises has decreased (HOW AND IN RUSSIA)
        1. dmitri077
          -13
          6 February 2012 11: 50
          "This does not say anything. Yes, the number of defense industry enterprises (LIKE IN RUSSIA) has decreased" - again Ukraine ... again the "hurray patsriots" are concerned about the problems of the neighboring state ... then they told that Ukrainians need to go to the Ukrainian site, and who themselves discussing? Russians can, but Ukrainians are not allowed? lol as always, their "Wishlist" is issued as a reality .. everything will be fine in Ukraine, do not worry ... Ukraine will "morally decompose" the enemy, and no one will fight with anyone! There is the Caucasus in Russia, and do it ... there people are killed every other day, but everyone is preoccupied with weapons in Ukraine ... as always, the story with a "log in the eye" ... laughing
          1. +3
            6 February 2012 12: 07
            No one is concerned, I have nothing against Ukraine, only against Yanukovych.
            And about the log in the eye, you correctly noticed to yourself
            1. doktoraikasap
              -7
              6 February 2012 16: 17
              Quote: urzul
              only against Yanukovych.

              Putin is, around and step arsh!
            2. dmitri077
              0
              7 February 2012 01: 26
              "Nobody is concerned, I have nothing against Ukraine," - well, of course, of course, at the time of my entry in the topic as many as 388 comments ... the topic "Ukraine" is very painful for many Russians .... living without southern "brothers" is not can! laughing What else can be discussed here? all love each other and it’s time for huts ... to save up forces on Iran and Syria bully
          2. Eugene
            0
            6 February 2012 12: 09
            I advise you to compare per capita GDP and the growth rate of the economy and high-tech industries smile
            1. doktoraikasap
              -2
              6 February 2012 16: 18
              Quote: Eugene
              I advise you to compare per capita GDP and the growth rate of the economy and high-tech industries

              Only one who understands nothing in this speaks of this. belay
          3. Alexey Prikazchikov
            -6
            6 February 2012 12: 30
            The military-industrial complex in the Russian Federation is developing unlike Ukraine. There are 3 trillion allocated for this, not counting the fact that new plants are being built.
            1. doktoraikasap
              +1
              6 February 2012 16: 19
              Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
              There are 3 trillion allocated for this, not counting the fact that new plants are being built.

              And they also removed the benefits, reduced funding for education and medicine ... Here is such a GDP and state defense order. fellow
              1. klop_mutant
                +3
                6 February 2012 21: 29
                Is it with you? What does Russia have to do with Russia?
                1. lightforcer
                  -4
                  6 February 2012 22: 50
                  It has a direct. Personally, I’m funny to hear about modernization in healthcare, because this does not imply the availability of medical care. The number of beds is decreasing, tuberculosis hospitals are closing down, detoxification centers have long been closed, the number of false or trifling calls is growing, and there is also a shortage of jobs with full employment on paper. Yes, corruption schemes work, but nowhere to complain. We are not sinless, mistakes happen, you can put pressure on everyone. And recently I heard directly from edros the true goal of the national project - to make doctors and nurses vote for Putin and edro! So that. By the way, it didn’t work, the deputy was booed and scolded. Therefore, for the purposes of propaganda, they now send well-known doctors of the city.
            2. vladimir89
              0
              14 February 2012 01: 35
              Did the teacher tell you in kindergarten?
          4. doktoraikasap
            -3
            6 February 2012 16: 17
            Quote: dmitri077
            Ukraine will "morally disintegrate" the enemy, and no one will fight with anyone!

            There is something in this, but also an inferiority complex.
            Quote: dmitri077
            but everyone is preoccupied with weapons in Ukraine ...

            All penetrate weapons - the prospects of eurases ... laughing
            1. Auschwitz
              0
              6 February 2012 16: 24
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              doktoraikasap Today, 16:17 new -1 
              Quote: dmitri077
              Ukraine will "morally disintegrate" the enemy, and no one will fight with anyone!
              There is something in this, but also an inferiority complex.
              Quote: dmitri077
              but everyone is preoccupied with weapons in Ukraine ...
              All penetrate weapons - the prospects of eurases ...

              It's just a song I read. The story of your illness. Voices are desperately interrupting each other. laughing
          5. 0
            6 February 2012 19: 25
            Yes, pay for the gas first! Then push the loot into the weapon! Against whom is it going to be interesting? If you bother in NATO! For gas, take 120% prepaid !!!!

            And here is the log? First you need to pay for gas, then invest money in the defense industry. Who is this weapon against? If one foot in NATO? Against Russia? Or type for sale? Before you buy something, you need to sell something! And then gas for free, because there is no money. And there are racquets! HOWEVER!
            1. dmitri077
              +1
              7 February 2012 01: 33
              "Yes, pay for the gas first!" - ha-ha, just like Yazov, like your namesake Marshall ... the same amount of mind lol the amount of gas that Ukraine buys should make it one of the best CLIENTS of "gazprom" forever! and the Russians are still trying to bellow something about this! look at the volume and COUNT our contribution to your economy, ignoramuses! so much speculation on this topic ... Ukraine should have started to reduce the volume of purchases for a long time ... but the "fixers" on both sides did not give everything .. The States showed how to work on shale ... an example worth thinking about
              1. -1
                9 February 2012 13: 59
                Russia, by Ukraine, has a lot to sell gas to! They will gladly buy it in Europe, just recently complained about a reduction in supplies! And about the best customer, you are bent! Your constant debts and attempts to initiate a tariff review under any pretext may lead to any tantrum supplier! So keep quiet about the best customer! (Scalamburil however! smile ) Anyway! It’s useless to communicate with you! You turned on the basis of the greatness of your homeland! A sick man worthy of sympathy!
          6. oleg-sochi68
            +1
            7 February 2012 01: 02
            Hi Dmitry077 !!! I treat Ukrainians very well, but reading comments, I feel sorry for you. You, as children, are trying to prove to everyone that your dad is the strongest. Finally, understand that if it’s bad in Russia, it’s not so much as in Ukraine. Yes, and communication with you - and you, and I, and here .... Who so fucked up your head? We are one people! What offends you so much? Let's discuss it constructively, otherwise it’s not even interesting. And I can make fun of, for example, penguins.
            1. dmitri077
              +1
              7 February 2012 01: 41
              and what does the attitude to nations? What if I am an Eskimo? then what to do? laughing no need to regret, you just need to provide reasoned information, but do not engage in stupid bawling like "your own does not stink" .. unfortunately, a little information that can be gleaned .. some rash emotions .. need to bring a fresh stream good what does one nation mean? The USSR will no longer exist, and do not hope .. young people do not want to go to war in the Caucasus .. this is your "exclusive" .. many aspire to Europe ... sometimes, reading some characters, there is nothing but to be pinned and there is no choice ... laughing
              1. oleg-sochi68
                +2
                7 February 2012 02: 57
                We are not trying to send you to the Caucasus. You climb there yourself (Georgia). And our exclusive person, as you put it, is rather the Bundeswehr (I am German by nationality, but they just can not convince me to leave Russia - I grew up here and I like it here.
        2. doktoraikasap
          -1
          6 February 2012 16: 15
          Quote: Splin
          Yes, the number of defense industry enterprises has decreased (HOW AND IN RUSSIA)

          In Russia, worse.
          1. Auschwitz
            -4
            6 February 2012 16: 25
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            In Russia, worse.

            Better Yes
            1. doktoraikasap
              0
              6 February 2012 17: 46
              Quote: Auschwitz
              Better

              Where is the IL-214 ???? laughing

              A new transport aircraft will be designed in Ukraine - General Designer of Antonov State Enterprise

              This year in Ukraine will begin to design a new transport aircraft AN-178. Dmitry Kiva, President-General Designer of Antonov State Enterprise, said this on Channel 5. According to D. Kiva, the Antonov State Enterprise is working on many programs, but the main thing in 2012 should be the creation of a new transport aircraft An-178.
              "We carried out preliminary research work and made a decision in the scientific and technical council to start designing such an aircraft," he said.
              D. Kiva also said that this year Antonov State Enterprise intends to participate in many air shows, in particular in Germany, Asia, China, because it is very important to advertise domestic products in the world.
              1. klop_mutant
                -4
                6 February 2012 21: 29
                In Ukraine, built a cardboard layout of the aircraft? Achievement!
              2. beard999
                0
                6 February 2012 23: 20
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                in Ukraine will design a new transport aircraft

                Truth? Will they design? What `s next? You have designed the An-70, but you cannot produce it yourself. 70% of components manufactured in Russia (source - http://republic.com.ua/article/14951-old.html). But on the Russian IL-476 there is nothing Ukrainian. And the first plane was already rolled out http://forum.keypublishing.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=202077&d=1324684440.
                1. doktoraikasap
                  -3
                  6 February 2012 23: 30
                  Quote: beard999
                  Truth? Will they design?

                  Clowns from a circus country look funny where they do not know how to make airplanes.
                  Quote: beard999
                  You have designed the An-70, but you cannot produce it yourself.

                  We can and we will, not somewhere else - this is the workload of this program for 40 years.
                  Quote: beard999
                  70% of components manufactured in Russia

                  No already.
                  Quote: beard999
                  But on the Russian IL-476 there is nothing Ukrainian.

                  The country of the Russian Federation is ready to reject in writing in 76 all Ukrainian in official written form in the form of an open letter ??? laughing
                  Quote: beard999
                  And the first plane has already been rolled out

                  It didn’t fly out, and in March it should only try. 476 is not new - but Soviet remotorization. :))))))))))))))))))))))) laughing
                  1. beard999
                    +1
                    7 February 2012 18: 34
                    Quote: doktoraikasap
                    Clowns look funny

                    But you look quite adequate ... For a citizen of Ukraine. They dragged pictures from murders and made the conclusion that they are a powerful military-industrial complex in Ukraine. Want to engage in self-deception? For God's sake. A flag in your hands and a drum around your neck. Sport further ...
                    Quote: doktoraikasap
                    We can and will

                    At the moment, you can’t do it yourself. This is the main thing. Everything else is empty demagogy.
                    Quote: doktoraikasap
                    No already.

                    And can you prove it? Waiting for links.
                    Quote: doktoraikasap
                    The Russian Federation is ready to mislead in 76 from all Ukrainian in the official

                    Can you name what is Ukrainian on IL-476? Or again pobaklanili in the bushes?
                    Quote: doktoraikasap
                    Did not fly out

                    Bad with the Russian language? Where did I write "flew out"?
          2. ytqnhfk
            -1
            7 February 2012 00: 09
            We then began to build new plants and are you weak?
      2. doktoraikasap
        0
        6 February 2012 16: 14
        Quote: urzul
        And that's it!!!

        What is said? What is the relationship of the manufacturer of rubber tires to corvettes? lol
        1. Auschwitz
          -2
          6 February 2012 16: 25
          Quote: doktoraikasap
          What is said? What is the relationship of the manufacturer of rubber tires to corvettes?

          So it says HAVE! wink
          1. doktoraikasap
            0
            6 February 2012 17: 49
            Quote: Auschwitz
            So it says HAVE!

            Where is the Angara ????

            The first launch of the Vega launch vehicle is scheduled for February 13

            The first launch of the European Vega light carrier rocket from the Kourou Cosmodrome in French Guiana was postponed from February 9 to February 13 of this year. This was reported by "Cosmonautics News" with reference to the European Space Agency.
            As previously reported, the contractors in the Vega project are the Yuzhny Design Bureau named after M.K. Yangel and the Yuzhny Machine-Building Plant named after A.M.Makarov SE, which have developed and manufactured the fourth-stage rocket engine carrier.
            1. Eugene
              +1
              6 February 2012 21: 36
              Not only that, on the rocket body there are flags of not only Ukraine, but there is no Ukrainian at all. In addition, it is a light carrier rocket, i.e. 2-2.5 tons per 200 km orbit.

              Angara is a family of missiles ranging from light to those that will be able to display 35 tons per 200 km orbit.

              И only developed by Russia. These are incomparable things.
            2. beard999
              +1
              6 February 2012 23: 21
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              The first launch of the European Vega light carrier rocket from the Kourou space center in French Guiana was postponed from February 9 to 13

              Last year, the Russian Soyuz-ST flew with Kuru http://www.viet.rfi.fr/sites/images.rfi.fr/files/aef_image/SOYOUZ%201.jpg.
              And unlike Ukraine, we are doing not one step on the entire rocket, but the launch vehicle is fully
    2. doktoraikasap
      +1
      6 February 2012 16: 11
      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
      Yeah, I haven’t laughed like that for a long time.

      So do I. wink



      1. Auschwitz
        -4
        6 February 2012 16: 20
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        So do I.

        laughing laughing laughing
        Oh, how I laugh today. Well, with a new bot with a new unfortunate bot!
        1. doktoraikasap
          +1
          6 February 2012 17: 50
          Quote: Auschwitz
          Oh, how I laugh today. Well, with a new bot with a new unfortunate bot!


          Where is the Bison ????

          Small landing hovercraft "ZUBR"
          1. -1
            6 February 2012 21: 36
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            Where is the Bison ????

            Well, you sold it to the Chinese, or forgot ???? winked
            1. doktoraikasap
              -4
              6 February 2012 22: 07
              Quote: SLAVA
              Well, you sold it to the Chinese, or forgot ????

              not sold, but sold - you cannot even make it for yourself ... Losers without a military industrial complex. fellow
          2. beard999
            0
            6 February 2012 23: 23
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            Where is the Bison ????

            Yes, here http://www.almaz-kb.ru/projects.htm. And not only the Bison ...
            1. doktoraikasap
              -1
              6 February 2012 23: 40
              Quote: beard999
              Yes, here http://www.almaz-kb.ru/projects.htm. And not only the Bison ...

              In the ass - Raska can’t build, and Ukraine - yes. Just that:
              The Russian Navy has abandoned the landing "Bison"
              http://lenta.ru/news/2011/12/22/zubr/


              laughing laughing laughing
              1. beard999
                +1
                7 February 2012 18: 45
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                In the ass - Rashka cannot build, but Ukraine - yes. Exactly that: the Russian Navy refused from the landing "Bison" http://lenta.ru/news/2011/12/22/zubr/

                In the ass only hohlyandistan. Do you build your own Bison? No!!! You have already managed to write off three ships of this type, because you are not able to save what you got after the USSR.
                Now we follow your link and read:
                "The Russian Navy has decided not to order the construction of Project 12322 Zubr small amphibious assault ships," the Izvestia newspaper writes, citing a source at the Navy headquarters. will be used on various landing craft, including Mistral-class helicopter carriers.
                Here is the Russian shipbuilding program (in general terms) http://www.kommersant.ru/doc/1867395.
                Announce the Ukrainian?
        2. -2
          6 February 2012 18: 10
          Quote: Auschwitz
          Oh, how I laugh today. Well, with a new bot with a new unfortunate bot!

          This is not a new bot, this is the return of the banderlog ........
      2. klop_mutant
        -2
        6 February 2012 21: 31
        A beautiful model was brought to the exhibition.
        1. doktoraikasap
          -2
          6 February 2012 22: 08
          Quote: klop_mutant
          A beautiful model was brought to the exhibition.

          The model from Chelyabinsk has been rolling for 20 years, which last summer - the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation decided to buy for itself ... request
          1. klop_mutant
            0
            7 February 2012 22: 01
            The Chelyabinsk 1,5-thousanent is serially produced and used in pumping units, successfully passed the GI as part of the O-195.
      3. beard999
        0
        6 February 2012 23: 22
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        I also

        Yes, we do not suffer the same.
        Russian engine A-85-3 and others.
        http://gurkhan.blogspot.com/2011/09/blog-post_02.html
        http://gurkhan.blogspot.com/2011/09/2_06.html
        http://gurkhan.blogspot.com/2011/09/3.html
        http://gurkhan.blogspot.com/2011/10/normal-0-false-false-false-ru-x-none-x.html
        1. doktoraikasap
          -1
          6 February 2012 23: 41
          beard999,
          In Peugeot, the Russian engine together with a gurkan.
          1. beard999
            0
            7 February 2012 18: 47
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            In Peugeot, the Russian engine together with a gurkan dubil

            And you with yours there with your crafts, along with the degenerate Anryusha Tarasenko
    3. Noni4
      -1
      6 February 2012 16: 36
      Laugh at yourself better)
    4. ruaben
      +1
      11 February 2012 16: 10
      what's so funny? We produce missiles, tanks, armored personnel carriers, ships, anti-tank systems and much more. and besides, 30% of your Russia is purebred Uraintsy.
  2. Tolia
    -2
    6 February 2012 08: 55
    Russian experts generally say that the project is not feasible in Ukraine, but even if it is created, the complex will not be able to compete with Iskander.

    What else can they say? It is high time in Ukraine to understand the real strategic partner of Ukraine is not Russia, but China ... Ukraine and China have a lot of successful and profitable projects in the military-industrial complex.
    1. Eugene
      0
      6 February 2012 09: 18
      Well, our Iskander is already at the very least, but in the army and Sapsan so far only on paper. So, there’s nothing to talk about.

      About "Vladimir" liked it, really the shipyards in Nikolaev, tired of shoving boiler and turbine units of their own production into their ships? Which then, only the lazy dashing does not remember.
      1. ZHORA
        -3
        6 February 2012 10: 57
        The Russian Strategic Missile Forces are waiting with horror if suddenly Ukrainian experts do not extend the RS-20 resource ... only poplars will remain, which in case of great need and with acceptable losses, the US will crush ...
        1. -3
          6 February 2012 11: 11
          Aha will remain on 580 less charges from more than 2000 in service.
        2. Eugene
          0
          6 February 2012 11: 19
          And there will be Topolya-M, Yarsy and Sineva.
          1. doktoraikasap
            -1
            6 February 2012 16: 26
            Quote: Eugene
            And there will be Topolya-M, Yarsy and Sineva.

            Potential commensurate with Pakistan ... lol
            1. Physician
              -5
              6 February 2012 16: 36
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              Potential commensurate with Pakistan ...

              I suppose you from your own stupidity you yourself became funny fool
              1. doktoraikasap
                +3
                6 February 2012 17: 52
                Quote: Doctor
                I suppose you from your own stupidity you yourself became funny

                Where is the mace ????
                1. beard999
                  0
                  6 February 2012 23: 24
                  Quote: doktoraikasap
                  Where is the mace ????

                  Are you already waiting for her in Kiev?
                  “The Ministry of Defense has already signed a contract for the production of intercontinental ballistic missiles of the Bulava type with a deadline of 2020, Russian First Deputy Defense Minister Alexander Sukhorukov told reporters on Tuesday.
                  "The state tests of the Bulava missile system in December 2011 have been successfully completed, and now a draft decree (of the President of the Russian Federation) on its adoption by the Navy is being prepared," Sukhorukov said. Source - http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20120124/ 547579478-print.html
                  1. doktoraikasap
                    -4
                    6 February 2012 23: 43
                    beard999,
                    The mace is not accepted as a rocket (crap), but adopted as part of the Borey complex - which in 2016 needs to be decommissioned or modernized ... Crap ...
                    But what about the Russian MKR mine-based ??? lol
                    1. beard999
                      -1
                      7 February 2012 18: 54
                      Quote: doktoraikasap
                      Mace not accepted as rocket

                      At Mace, the GIs are completed. And your murzilka will forever remain only on paper.
                      Quote: doktoraikasap
                      Borea - which in 2016 needs to be decommissioned or modernized

                      I have already given you plans for Borea. So your stories do not bother me much. You certainly will never have anything like this.
            2. Eugene
              0
              6 February 2012 21: 53
              Again by.

              Poplar: 171 missiles.

              Mine poplar: 52 missiles.

              Poplar-m: 18 missiles.

              Yars: 15 missiles.

              3 more rocket carriers 667kalmar: 48 missiles.

              4 missile carriers 667 dolphins: 64 missiles

              I have not yet included in the list of UR-100, because they, too, are not painfully new, like Voivod, strategic aviation (16 + 60 strategic bombers somewhere), several dozens of Euro-strategic Tu-22 m3, still the largest in the world is an arsenal of tactical nuclear weapons that can be used according to the doctrine and against the enemy with conventional weapons.

              As you can see, even without the Voivode and UR-100, inflicting unacceptable damage on any enemy (demolishing a couple of megalopolises to hell) is solved without problems.
            3. 0
              7 February 2012 00: 22
              enough for you
              1. doktoraikasap
                0
                7 February 2012 00: 30
                Quote: kalbofos
                enough for you

                And in muzzle - did you get a bastard for a long time?
        3. +6
          6 February 2012 13: 39
          Quote: JORA
          .. only poplars will remain which, in case of great need and with acceptable losses, the US will crush ...


          It is interesting to know what and how? With tomahawks without a nuclear warhead, they will use several cruise missiles (3-5 units) for each ICBM, only in this case it will be possible to more or less reliably guarantee the destruction of the target.
          Our rocket divisions in Kozelsk (Kaluga region) and in Vypolzovo (Tver region) will have the worst. They are located too close to the western border and are not covered by any air defense. Practically the same can be said about the division in the Teikovo region (Ivanovo region), which was the first to receive the last year 6 PGRK RS-24. Three Ticonderoga-type cruisers, provided they are fully loaded with Tomahawks (122 each), will be enough to completely destroy these three divisions. In this case, ships can shoot from the safe for themselves the North and Norwegian Seas.
          In the Yoshkar-Ola and Nizhny Tagil divisions, submarines can be shot from the Barents Sea, and in the Yoshkar-Ola, moreover, from the Black Sea. For the destruction of each division will need approximately 12 boats, (12 KR in the mines, and possibly 4-8 in the torpedo tubes on each).
          The Tatishchevskaya (Saratov region) and Dombarovskaya (Orenburg region) divisions will create much more problems, the first of which is the largest in the Strategic Missile Forces - the 93 ICBM. To destroy them, the Americans will have no options to drive into the Black Sea all 4 SSGNs like Ohio. And one of these SSGNs will have to shoot at the Dombarovsk division, being near the Russian coast.
          All of the above, under the conditions of complete extraterrestriality and the absence of the smallest resistance.

          And now the most interesting thing is that the regiment is displayed on the software (let's say in the framework of the TSU).
          First, all 9 APUs occupy positions in the RND (3 each) and then each in its BLB scatter to such remote places in the same Ivanovo, Kostroma, Yaroslavl, Vladimir Regions. that no vaunted special forces will find their hell. They will ride through the endless forests until they find and catch everyone, saboteurs, even if they find it, will not be able to attack, since a premature attack, again, destroys the surprise. Moreover, all Poplars and YaRSs can shoot not only from prepared positions but also from any point on the route, although it will take 3 minutes to complete the time. more, but this doesn’t matter. They can only catch the moment of deployment on the PC when the APU cannot technically start up until it is up and horizontal, but I can tell you that the APU calculation conducts this event quite quickly even in peacetime, so this is also from Hollywood fiction.
          It is IMPOSSIBLE to determine the signs of a military unit in practice; in reality, each APU has at least 5 total of 45 per regiment and 180-200 per division. This is how much special forces are needed per Teykov division, for example? Even if they know all the points, how will they guess which ones will be used?
          So in any case, they are provided with the Big Black Arctic fox
        4. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 16: 25
          Quote: JORA
          The Russian Strategic Missile Forces are waiting with horror if suddenly Ukrainian experts do not extend the RS-20 resource ...

          If not for Ukraine, then Russia has signed START-4 already ... request
          1. Physician
            -4
            6 February 2012 16: 35
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            If not for Ukraine, then Russia has signed START-4 already ...

            And if it weren’t for your illness (mental), then you would live a normal and not a fictitious, invented life. YOU ARE SICK !!! am
            1. doktoraikasap
              +2
              6 February 2012 17: 53
              Quote: Doctor
              And if it weren’t for your illness (mental), then you would live a normal and not a fictitious, invented life. YOU ARE SICK !!!

              Where is the S-400 ?????


              1. klop_mutant
                0
                6 February 2012 21: 33
                S-400s are standing near Moscow. And where are the Khokhlyatskie "analogs"? Plans and drawings?
              2. beard999
                +2
                6 February 2012 23: 24
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                Where is the S-400 ?????

                Unlike your murzilka, the S-400 has been on combat duty for a long time http://www.defesanet.com.br/site/upload/news_image/2011/09/3365.jpg
                1. doktoraikasap
                  -3
                  6 February 2012 23: 44
                  Quote: beard999

                  Quote: doktoraikasap
                  Where is the S-400 ?????
                  Unlike your murzilka,

                  In order to be called that, the S-400 must have a missile "as a complex", and now no more - PM2. And then 200 km does not always fly. And there is no factory for missiles ... laughing
                  1. beard999
                    0
                    7 February 2012 19: 03
                    Quote: doktoraikasap
                    S-400 in order to be called so - must have a missile "as a complex", and now no more - PM2

                    At least 9M96 and 48N6DM are available.
                    Quote: doktoraikasap
                    And there’s no factory for rockets

                    Factories are being built to increase the output of S-400. And the 3rd S-400 regiment is already in the army.
          2. -3
            6 February 2012 19: 34
            Why so?
        5. 0
          7 February 2012 00: 22
          there are no acceptable losses from poplars, I hope you will be included in this list of "acceptable" !!!
      2. doktoraikasap
        -1
        6 February 2012 16: 25
        Quote: Eugene
        So, there’s nothing to talk about.

        There is something - Iskander is not an ICBM, but Yuzhmash made 12 of the 20 ICBM scoops.
        Quote: Eugene
        About "Vladimir" liked it, really the shipyards in Nikolaev, tired of shoving boiler and turbine installations of their own production into their ships?

        some, in Nikolaev, the only scoop plant producing an engine for what is being built in Russia, and for the Bison - which is not already being built in Russia.
        Quote: Eugene
        Which then, only the lazy dashingly does not remember.

        Oh-yo-yo, put the American GTD - you're cool, they will sell you ... And the Nikolaev will stand in Chinese, Indian, Vietnamese, Korean, Polish ... fellow
        1. Physician
          -2
          6 February 2012 16: 29
          Quote: doktoraikasap
          There is something - Iskander is not an ICBM, but Yuzhmash made 12 of the 20 ICBM scoops.

          The main thing that made one!
          Quote: doktoraikasap
          some, in Nikolaev, the only scoop plant producing an engine for what is being built in Russia, and for the Bison - which is not already being built in Russia.

          from where a typical scoop has so much hatred for a scoop or does this disease mean doctoraikasap is not real am
          Quote: doktoraikasap
          Oh-yo-yo, put the American GTD - you're cool, they will sell you ... And the Nikolaev will stand in Chinese, Indian, Vietnamese, Korean, Polish ...

          We are happy for them love
          1. doktoraikasap
            +1
            6 February 2012 17: 54
            Quote: Doctor
            We are happy for them

            And we are happy for them !!!!!

            1. klop_mutant
              0
              6 February 2012 21: 34
              Again the picture. The power of the Khokhlyat military-industrial complex is evident.
            2. beard999
              -1
              6 February 2012 23: 25
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              And we are happy for them !!!!!

              Are you happy with all the pictures? We have already launched the main building on the water http://militaryrussia.ru/i/284/611/Fff6X.jpg
              1. doktoraikasap
                -4
                6 February 2012 23: 46
                Quote: beard999
                Are you happy with all the pictures? We have already launched the main body into the water

                You have the longest coastline in the world and half the world is at risk .... :)))))))))))))))) laughing
                1. beard999
                  +1
                  7 February 2012 19: 07
                  Quote: doktoraikasap
                  You have the longest coastline in the world

                  Fact.
                  Quote: doktoraikasap
                  half the world is at stake

                  Only no one rock the boat. You have no idea why?
                  1. maolex
                    0
                    12 February 2012 09: 18
                    everything is somehow written on emotions .... uninteresting and unreasonable, but just try to answer a simple question - why has the Far East been Chinese and Russian for a long time already, and a lot of Chinese quarters where Russian is forbidden? But what about the Tajik-Korgiz Urals? and one more thing - Mongols will soon be trampled from Kazakhstan with domestic syphilis and tuberculosis ... duck answer, why the hell to fight, if you can just come? and there’s nothing to run into the doctor, although he is too emotional, better think about how to restore order in your state
            3. ytqnhfk
              -1
              7 February 2012 00: 01
              Who painted this kid? aren't you by chance? Where in the metal? What kind of project?
        2. Eugene
          0
          6 February 2012 22: 20
          We continue the evening of the debunking of myths.

          Quote: doktoraikasap
          There is something - Iskander is not an ICBM, but Yuzhmash made 12 of the 20 ICBM scoops.


          It was about Peregrine Falcon, and he is EMNIP same not ICBM.
          Thank you Yuzhmash for Satan and others, it’s very unfortunate that so many specialists left the dashing 90s and that’s a real loss.

          Quote: doktoraikasap
          some, in Nikolaev, the only scoop plant producing an engine for what is being built in Russia, and for the Bison - which is not already being built in Russia.


          So good that the Project 956 modern destroyer reaches its maximum power 2 hours after launch, and the American GTE in 8 minutes. This is one of the reasons why they are not very struggling in terms of modernization. There is no bison, it's sad, but with the same success can I tell you about submarines or am I missing something?

          Kuzya must embark on the modernization of the VTCh and the power plant.

          Quote: doktoraikasap
          Oh-yo-yo, put the American GTD - you're cool, they will sell you ... And the Nikolaev will stand in Chinese, Indian, Vietnamese, Korean, Polish ...


          Now it will appear on the stocks of the Mistral, you look like the technology of its engines.

          And I'll see the shipyard in such a prime that they sold the Varangian built on them at the price of scrap metal, instead of completing it and selling it like a normal warship.
    2. Captain
      +1
      6 February 2012 15: 01
      My friend, what are you talking about? China is copying Ukrainian military technology with might and main, what benefit are we talking about?

      The growth of unlicensed copying by Chinese companies of some samples of Ukrainian weapons and equipment is so far the only real result of the reform of the military-industrial complex.

      http://www.segodnya.ua/news/14255952.html
      1. Splin
        +1
        6 February 2012 15: 15
        Do not generalize like that. The Chinese can make a copy, but it will be worse than the original. Electronics, I agree, but the engines can not. Why would they then buy a massive quantity of diesel and turbines for the L-15 for their tanks. It’s like a car. They will make an excellent copy of Toyota, but you start the movement and it is clear that this is far from Japanese. Why are Pakistanis buying Ukrainian engines for a joint fighter with the Chinese? Therefore, it is not so worrying about marine diesel engines and gas turbines.
        1. doktoraikasap
          0
          6 February 2012 16: 29
          Quote: Splin
          Electronics, I agree, but the engines can not.

          Right.
          Quote: Splin
          Why would they then buy a massive quantity of diesel and turbines for the L-15 for their tanks.

          And also for helicopters in a volume larger than Russia.
          Quote: Splin
          Why are Pakistanis buying Ukrainian engines for a joint fighter with the Chinese?

          No - there is a Russian engine, but with a Ukrainian kit. Ukrainian - tank.
    3. doktoraikasap
      0
      6 February 2012 16: 21
      Quote: Tolya
      Russian experts generally say that the project is not feasible in Ukraine

      It is a bad omen to mention "Russian experts" before bedtime ...
      Quote: Tolya
      the complex will not be able to compete with Iskander.

      Let's see what Yuzhmash is - we know what Iskander isn’t released - we know too ... We’ll also evaluate the possibilities of serial production ... Yes
      1. Physician
        -5
        6 February 2012 16: 31
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        " before going to bed - a bad omen ...

        What are anxiety panic indigestion complaints about?
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        Let's see what Yuzhmash is - we know what Iskander isn’t released - we know too ... We’ll also evaluate the possibilities of serial production ...

        We will evaluate finished products and your sanity bot laughing
        1. doktoraikasap
          +1
          6 February 2012 17: 56
          Quote: Doctor
          We will evaluate the finished products

          Where is the new technology ????


          Changes have occurred in the structure of the Office of the Chief Technologist of Motor Sich JSC - a new bureau of helicopters and gearboxes has appeared, the company said. AEX.ru
          It will be engaged in the development and provision of technological requirements for helicopters and gearboxes being modernized and designed by the design and technological department, as well as in the design of technological equipment for their manufacture, testing and maintenance. All these regular changes are associated with the need to implement the Program for the modernization of Mi-8T and Mi-2 helicopters, as well as with preparations for mastering the production of gearboxes.
          “Our goal is to establish production of our own helicopter with acceptable flight performance. A successful decision was to re-engine the Mi-8 helicopter - to replace the obsolete TV2-117 engines with TV3-117VMA-SBM4E. This engine differs from the standard TV3-117VMA-SBM1V, which is installed on the Mi-24, Mi-17 helicopters, in that it has an electric start, and the generator is installed on the box of the aircraft engine units.The TV3-117VMA-SBM4E engine can be successfully operated on Mi-8T helicopters due to the fact that the engine is lubricated, namely: the freewheel unit of the main gearbox. This is a fundamental difference between the VR-8 gearbox and the one installed on the Mi-17, and the minimum required to adapt this engine to a helicopter, "explained the director of helicopter production Nikolai Zubko.
          "The tests carried out in Feodosia showed that the parameters of the obtained Mi-8MSB helicopter with new engines are close to those of the Mi-8MT helicopter. Such performance characteristics of the helicopter should satisfy many of our customers, especially from African countries, and And this is understandable.If the Mi-8T with TV2-117 engines has a standard dynamic ceiling of 4,5 thousand meters, then the Mi-8MSB helicopter has already reached a height of 6,3 thousand meters. Moreover, the price of a category 1 helicopter of the Mi-17 type, according to various sources, ranges from 10 to 17 million dollars, and a helicopter
          The Mi-8MSB is several times smaller, "he added.
          1. beard999
            0
            6 February 2012 23: 26
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            Where is the new technology ????

            Yes, at least http://www.paralay.com/su50/0FAW2423.JPG. Note, unlike your picture, not a spare part, but a full-fledged functionally finished product.
            1. doktoraikasap
              -1
              6 February 2012 23: 49
              Quote: beard999
              Yes, at least http://www.paralay.com/su50/0FAW2423.JPG. Note, unlike your picture, not a spare part, but a full-fledged functionally finished product.

              Before he is finished, he still needs to earn the title of "finished" and be accepted as a complex along with everything, and before that he still has many years and Indian days. belay
              1. beard999
                0
                7 February 2012 19: 20
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                Before finished, he still needs to earn the title of "finished" and be accepted as a complex along with everything

                What did you demonstrate in your picture? That's right - a spare part. Which, then they plan to put on a Ukrainian helicopter, which so far is not even in the pictures. So another fantasy ...
                I brought you a sample of a functional example of Russian new technology. Already really existing and flying.
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                indian money

                FGFA and the Russian T-50 are not the same thing. Hindus pay for their option. Moreover, they agreed to pay only after they saw the already created T-50 in flight http://vpk.name/news/48889_rossiya_i_indiya_sozdadut_istrebitel_5go_pokoleniya.h
                tml.
          2. ytqnhfk
            -1
            7 February 2012 00: 11
            What was the conversation about rockets like a fly from one pile to another flew over?
        2. ytqnhfk
          0
          7 February 2012 02: 54
          DATA FOR 2012 (standard replenishment)
          Complex "Sapsan" (Ukraine)

          Multifunctional missile system / modular missile system. The development of the national missile system has been carried out by the Yuzhnoye design bureau (Dnepropetrovsk) together with the National Space Agency of Ukraine since 2007. The decision to create a national operational-tactical complex was adopted by the Security Council of Ukraine in 1997. the first national project of OTR "Borisfen" (KB "Yuzhnoye", 1994, range of up to 500 km, development was discontinued in 2003). Also, most likely, when developing the project, the project of the OTR "Thunder" complex was used, which was proposed by the Yuzhnoye Design Bureau for export supplies in the 1990s.

          The terms of reference for the creation of the Sapsan complex was issued by the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine by the end of 2006. According to the initial plans, the development of the Sapsan complex was planned to be completed in 2011, but by 2010, 7 million USD were spent on development, after which the project was terminated ... According to the media in the project of the complex for 2010-2011. it is planned to combine an operational-tactical missile system and a tactical-range MLRS in a single system and on a single SPU. In addition, in 2007-2009. the media discussed the configuration of the complex with a cruise anti-ship missile and anti-aircraft missiles.
          In April 2011, government funding for the creation of the complex was resumed. As of the spring of 2011, it is planned to start testing in 2012, the development of the complex is planned to be completed in 2015, and according to unofficial data (media), the development of the complex requires about 440 million USD. Serial production of the complex is planned to begin at PO "Yuzhmash" (Dnepropetrovsk) in 2016. On December 30, 2011, the media announced that the planned start of tests was 2015. Later, on January 31.01.2012, 2012, it was announced that funding the creation of the complex will begin in 105.5 in the amount of 2017 million hryvnia and the complex will go into service in XNUMX. good lol
      2. ytqnhfk
        0
        7 February 2012 00: 05
        Iskander is in service and enters the regiments !!!!!!!!!
        1. ytqnhfk
          -1
          7 February 2012 01: 02
          http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-185.html посмотрите по искандеру малыш!!!!!!!!!!!!
  3. Splin
    +4
    6 February 2012 09: 17
    What is the source of laughter? Is it that Ukraine is looking for new markets? Russia then refused to purchase our equipment. and buys not even his own and NATO. Here, of course, much has been said about "Sapsan"
    , but the Ukrainian Ministry of Defense has many other plans. Of course, these are not Russian scales of rearmament, but they are much larger in volume than for the boards of previous Presidents.
    1. 0
      6 February 2012 11: 47
      Yes, really ... Regarding the purchase of Mistrals, as well as the statements of some "figures" regarding the fact that you need to give up your own tanks and better buy Leopards, there really are questions. It is necessary to drive such Popovkins and others like them from the service ...
    2. doktoraikasap
      -2
      6 February 2012 16: 31
      Quote: Splin
      Russia then refused to purchase our equipment.

      Russia cannot refuse purchases in principle. Can only make a retual "banzai" and hara-kiri as with the Bison. smile
      Quote: Splin
      not even buying his own but NATO.

      What a shame, well, well ... lol
      Quote: Splin
      Of course, these are not Russian rearmament scales.

      Praportional and no worse.
      1. Physician
        -3
        6 February 2012 16: 44
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        Russia cannot refuse purchases in principle. Can only make a retual "banzai" and hara-kiri as with the Bison.

        No, Russia will do everything right with us Putin!
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        What a shame, well, well ...

        We are not picky
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        Praportional and no worse.

        Worse and much worse wink
        1. doktoraikasap
          +1
          6 February 2012 17: 58
          Quote: Doctor
          We are not picky

          Fu, to eat from the garbage can of NATO ...

          Booster “DNEPR”

          Designed to launch KA into circular and elliptical near-Earth orbits with an inclination of 65.50 °, 87.30 °, 98.0.

          The three-stage launch vehicle, created on the basis of the world's most powerful intercontinental ballistic missile RS-20 (SS-18 “Satan“). Fuel components: nitrogen tetroxide and asymmetric dimethylhydrazine.

          The complex can provide up to 25 launches of launch vehicles per year.
          1. beard999
            -1
            6 February 2012 23: 26
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            The complex can provide up to 25 launches of launch vehicles per year.

            Theoretically, it may well be "provides." But in practice, we make the vast majority of launches in the Russian Unions and Protons (26 launches in 2011 out of 32 made). http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D1%EF%E8%F1%EE%EA_%EA%EE%F1%EC%E8%F7%E5%F1%EA%E8%F
            5_%E7%E0%EF%F3%F1%EA%EE%E2_%D0%EE%F1%F1%E8%E8_%E2_2011_%E3%EE%E4%F3
          2. ytqnhfk
            -1
            7 February 2012 00: 15
            Booster rocket "Dnepr"

            The program for the creation and operation of the Dnepr space rocket complex based on the PC-20 (15A18), the world's most powerful intercontinental ballistic missiles, to be destroyed, is one of the largest conversion programs. It can serve as an example of international cooperation between the Russian Federation, Ukraine, the Republic of Kazakhstan and other countries.

            The Dnipro program is based on more than 150 PC-20 missiles suitable for conversion into launch vehicles. These missiles are part of the second modification of the R-36M heavy missile system, the R-36M1 (sometimes called the R-36UTTKh). The complex was developed at the Yuzhnoye State Design Bureau under the leadership of Academician V.F. Utkin to replace the R-36 (8K67) complex. Flight design tests of the R-36M1 complex began on October 31, 1977. The 15A18 missile entered service on December 17, 1980.

            The first regiments with missiles, designated SS-18 Mod 4 ("Satan") by the US Department of Defense classification, entered combat duty on September 18, 1979. In 1982-1983, all the P-36Ms in service were replaced.

            At the Baikonur Cosmodrome, there are mine-type launch complexes and all the necessary equipment.

            In the joint Statement of the Presidents of Russia Boris Yeltsin and Ukraine, Leonid Kuchma, dated May 31, 1997, the creation of the Dnepr complex is referred to the priority areas of activity for the long term.

            The Government of Russia and the Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine have issued Resolutions defining the procedure for implementing the Dnepr program.

            The head organization for the Dnepr program is the International Space Company (CJSC) Kosmotras, specially created by the decision of the Russian Space Agency and the National Space Agency of Ukraine.

            It includes enterprises and organizations of Russia and Ukraine, which created the PC-20 missile system and carry out warranty and field supervision in the process of its operation: wink laughing Wow, that’s cool, and most importantly, the most recent development not only of Ukraine but of all of those listed !!!!!!!!!!
      2. beard999
        -3
        6 February 2012 17: 18
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        Russia cannot refuse purchases in principle

        What kind of "purchases"? Specifically list?
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        Can only make a retual "banzai" and hara-kiri like with the Bison

        You have no impudence. Without shame and conscience, they stole the development of the Almaz Central Design Bureau. Well, it would be good if they themselves used or, at least, traded only ready-made MDKVPs, but no, they decided to merge them with the technical documentation of production in China. Then the Chinese will build themselves and sell them all over the world, but the Ukrainians will just cut down the dough easily.
        1. Splin
          -2
          6 February 2012 17: 34
          Do not blame only Ukraine for arrogance. Do you think that An-124 Russia is trying to sell by agreement? In Soviet times, everything was so intertwined .. No one held copyright. Now in the information war they were remembered. Like with Tuzla.
          In St. Petersburg, they designed all our aircraft-carrying cruisers, but the Indians are remaking the Admiral Gorshkov so clumsily that they doubted.
          1. doktoraikasap
            0
            6 February 2012 17: 59
            Quote: Splin
            Do you think that An-124 Russia is trying to sell by agreement?

            Russia, with those attempts and attempts, did not see the An-124 ...
          2. beard999
            -2
            6 February 2012 20: 43
            Quote: Splin
            Do you think that An-124 Russia is trying to sell by agreement?

            And who and whom is trying to sell the An-124. Link, please.
            Quote: Splin
            Indians are remaking "Admiral Gorshkov" so clumsily

            And again unfounded. Where is the link, as if the Indians assured that "Admiral Gorshkov" is being modernized clumsily?
            1. Splin
              +1
              6 February 2012 21: 23
              Oh, how I love modern approaches. On the one hand, I saw a lot of photos I only knew about. On the other hand, this method completely deprives you of the opportunity to analyze. The date of delivery of the aircraft carrier was repeatedly postponed, the amount increased significantly. What does this mean? I don't use links or surf the Internet all day. Only this site is in the majority and then I answer through a communicator, then in the car, then at work, or at my mother-in-law. There are many more ways to get information. I "threw a dead cat" - if you do not agree, refute.
              1. beard999
                0
                6 February 2012 23: 28
                Quote: Splin
                The delivery dates of the aircraft carrier were repeatedly postponed, the amount increased significantly. What is this talking about?

                Those. In your opinion, this suggests that the modernization is carried out "clumsily"? Strange, but the Indians themselves do not complain about the modernization itself http://flotprom.ru/publications/interview/IMDS2011alsufev/. The transfer period of the ship is agreed until a specific day http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20120117/541380050-print. html
                As you know, the problems were with the financing of modernization. Russia demanded additional funds. Hindus agreed http://www.aviaport.ru/digest/2008/12/04/162492.html.
                So do you have evidence about the “curve” modernization or not?
                Quote: Splin
                I "threw a dead cat" - if you do not agree, refute.

                What to refute? Your speculation? You did not provide any evidence that Russia was allegedly going to sell the An-124. So far, there are only unfounded accusations on your part.
      3. Eugene
        0
        6 February 2012 23: 44
        Recall the number of upgraded MiG-29s put into operation by the zp for the past 20 years.
  4. Igor
    -2
    6 February 2012 09: 17
    If Ukraine does not take urgent measures to inject the dough into its defense industry, then in 5-7 years this will not remain.
    1. doktoraikasap
      0
      6 February 2012 16: 32
      Quote: Igorek
      If Ukraine does not take urgent measures to inject the dough into its defense industry, then in 5-7 years this will not remain.

      This has already been completed, and an injection will not help Russia - thanks to Putin!
      1. Physician
        -4
        6 February 2012 16: 41
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        This has already been completed, and an injection will not help Russia - thanks to Putin!

        It will help as it helps! wink
        1. doktoraikasap
          -1
          6 February 2012 18: 00
          Quote: Doctor
          It will help as it helps!

          Where are the tanks ????

          The main battle tank T-84 "Hold"

          1. beard999
            -1
            6 February 2012 20: 46
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            T-84 “Oplot” tank

            And how many Ukraine has riveted Oplotov since 1999? Do not be shy to call a number?
            1. doktoraikasap
              -3
              6 February 2012 22: 10
              Quote: beard999
              And how many Ukraine has riveted Oplotov since 1999? Do not be shy to call a number?

              This year there will be statistics ... laughing
              1. beard999
                +2
                6 February 2012 23: 31
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                This year there will be statistics ..

                All? Essentially nothing more to say?
                1. doktoraikasap
                  -1
                  7 February 2012 01: 00
                  Quote: beard999
                  All? Essentially nothing more to say?

                  Yes, why and to whom? lol
            2. spirin199
              +1
              8 February 2012 09: 20
              the military received 8 pieces
          2. klop_mutant
            -2
            6 February 2012 21: 35
            Renamed St. Petersburg T-80 in Khokhlyat T-84. Cool.
            1. doktoraikasap
              -4
              6 February 2012 22: 12
              Quote: klop_mutant
              Renamed St. Petersburg T-80 in Khokhlyat T-84. Cool.

              Dybily from St. Petersburg - to degenerate the modern can not be 50 years old. O.478 cannot have a relationship with dybil spawn ... good
              1. klop_mutant
                0
                7 February 2012 22: 05
                Sure sure. From the non-cookery in T-84, only Khokhlyat pride and an opposing engine, which Ukrainians themselves had not mastered at one time and brought to mind half of the USSR.
              2. spirin199
                0
                8 February 2012 09: 23
                if stupid people from St. Petersburg, then hto homies
          3. ytqnhfk
            -1
            7 February 2012 00: 20
            Development 90 whether it is needed in this form, practically losing to everyone and all - NO NEEDED A NEW TANK WITH ANTICIPATED FORWARD !!
            1. doktoraikasap
              -2
              7 February 2012 00: 33
              Quote: ytqnhfk
              Development 90 whether it is needed in this form, practically losing to everyone and all - NO NEEDED A NEW TANK WITH ANTICIPATED FORWARD !!

              They say those who do not have it ... - GOP, TIUS, SUAT, SUIS, engine, gun, ballistic computer, stabilization systems, DZ, KAZ, etc. ..... laughing
          4. spirin199
            -1
            8 February 2012 09: 21
            to test in terrible
      2. Igor
        +1
        6 February 2012 17: 12
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        This has already been completed, and an injection will not help Russia - thanks to Putin!

        Doctor you are sick. Diagnosis.
        1. doktoraikasap
          0
          6 February 2012 18: 02
          Quote: Igorek
          Doctor you are sick. Diagnosis.

          Where is the GOZ, shipbuilding, aviation program a hundred a year by 2010 ????


          Engine TV3-117VMA-SBM-1V-03

          The goals of the TV3-117VMA-SBM-1V engine

          Improving the flight performance of helicopters in hot climates, high-altitude take-off areas and high flight altitudes.

          Creating a modification on the basis of the brought-in serial TV3-117VMA-SBM1 engine:
          high reliability and resource indicators
          technical risk reduction

          Further increase in reliability and durability:
          a resource before the first repair and overhaul - 3000 hours, 3000 cycles;
          Assigned resource - 9000 hours, 9000 cycles;

          Improving the safety of a single-engine flight:
          introduction of an emergency (2,5 min.) operating mode of the engine with a power of 2800 hp;
          the introduction of a 30-minute power mode, equal in power to the take-off mode;

          Improving economic performance:
          reduction in operating costs by increasing resources before the first overhaul and overhaul;
          restoration of airworthiness of engines under operating conditions by replacing the main components and modules;
          the introduction of measures aimed at improving the efficiency of the engine;
          increase in the range of permissible degradation of the gas temperature at the turbine inlet during the overhaul resource development

          Maintaining high flight performance of helicopters when installing dustproof and screen-exhaust devices on them.


          1. beard999
            +3
            6 February 2012 23: 30
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            Engine TV3-117VMA-SBM-1V-03

            Russian engine VK-2500. http://klimov.ru/production/helicopter/VK-2500.
            And a couple of news. Klimov plant, which is building a new production of helicopter engines in St. Petersburg. The volume of production of the new site after commissioning in 2013 will be 600 engines with an estimated cost of one engine, according to experts, at $ 1,2-1,4 million. Http://www.kommersant.ru/doc/1832751?isSearch=True
            In Ufa, the launch of a new project for the production of helicopter engines is planned. According to the Government of the Republic of Bashkortostan, the volume of state investment in new serial production until 2015 will be about 10 billion rubles. http://topwar.ru/9094-oboronpromom-nalazhivaetsya-seriynyy-vypusk-otechestvennyh
            -vertoletnyh-dvigateley-v-ufe.html
            1. doktoraikasap
              -4
              6 February 2012 23: 56
              Quote: beard999
              Russian engine VK-2500.

              From Ukrainian gasgen and hydraulic equipment.
              Quote: beard999
              And a couple of news. Klimov plant, which is building a new production of helicopter engines in St. Petersburg. The volume of production of the new site after commissioning in 2013 will be 600 engines with an estimated cost of one engine, according to experts, at $ 1,2-1,4 million.

              Yeah, they’ve been building it for 10 years. Klimov even now can do 800, only Motorsich - come on motors ... laughing
              Motor Sich is not only helicopter in classes from 450hp to 12000hp, it’s also airplane, such and such, different - even afterburners.
              And in Ukrin 3 gas turbine engine plants for everything that was invented in the world and everything at work. Ukraine can do all types of engines like the USA and Great Britain.
              1. beard999
                0
                7 February 2012 19: 48
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                Yeah, they’ve been building it for 10 years.

                10 years is only your imagination. But Oboronprom already guaranteed Klimov orders for 10 years in advance. But the main thing is that after the construction of two plants, the need for Motor Sich will disappear. We have already got rid of Ukrainian dependence on rocket engines http://www.vz.ru/news/2011/12/23/549294.print.html
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                Ukraine can do all types of engines

                And do not dream. Do you make fighter engines? For the bombers? Or maybe you have plans to create hypersonic engines? Or, for example, the engine for the new Russian CRBD X-101 / X-102 http://www.paralay.com/t60/R128-300.jpg, providing a range of 5000 km. Do you have one?
  5. VictoRUS123
    +3
    6 February 2012 09: 27
    The victims of the disaster on October 4, 2001 were 78 people: 51 Israeli citizens and 27 Russian citizens. According to the conclusions of the International Aviation Commission, the Tu-154, heading from Tel Aviv to Novosibirsk, was shot down by a rocket fired from a Crimean firing range, over which the Ukrainian military lost control during the exercises. If it really turns out that Ukraine is implementing its projects. airspace must be closed to all countries. And along the perimeter of the border to build a fence. Otherwise, after the first tests. we may not find border villages, and not count the population ...
    1. Bretwald
      -10
      6 February 2012 13: 07
      you know, dear, I agree with you in terms of strengthening the borders of Ukraine, Yushchenko’s loshka canceled visas for the entire foreign losh, for good you need to get a visa for 100 euros for everyone from amers to the wildest maskals, they’ll go around in Ukraine and normal people can always pay...
      1. Physician
        -6
        6 February 2012 16: 33
        Quote: bretwald
        you know dear, I agree with you in respect of

        and you also agree to hashish crack cyclodol and chlorpromazine laughing
        1. doktoraikasap
          +1
          6 February 2012 18: 04
          Quote: Doctor
          and you also agree to hashish crack cyclodol and chlorpromazine


          Where are the APCs ?????

          Armored personnel carrier BTR-4

          1. beard999
            0
            6 February 2012 23: 33
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            Where are the APCs ?????

            Boomerang is under development. While admire the "Typhoon" http://video.mail.ru/mail/yartsev2/_myvideo/11.html.
            1. doktoraikasap
              -1
              6 February 2012 23: 57
              Quote: beard999
              Boomerang is under development. While admire the "Typhoon"

              In the ass, and for 20 years we were fed BTR-90, and now they will feed us in development ... lol
              1. beard999
                -2
                7 February 2012 19: 52
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                BTR-20 fed us for 90 years, and now they will feed us in development

                Wait and see. However, the projects are funded by the RF Ministry of Defense. TTT agreed.
                By the way, the Ukrainian Armed Forces have bought a lot of BTR-4 for themselves?
          2. spirin199
            -1
            8 February 2012 09: 24
            also in the formidable and you bandera with him
      2. ytqnhfk
        -1
        7 February 2012 00: 24
        I AGREE WITH YOU BRETWALD AND YOUR TOURIST INDUSTRY WILL BE AFTER THE LAST DAYS! THINK THE LOWER PART OF YOUR BODY !!!!!!!!!!!!!! wink laughing
    2. doktoraikasap
      0
      6 February 2012 16: 33
      Not control, but not that.
      1. Physician
        -5
        6 February 2012 16: 40
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        Not control, but not that.

        Are you talking?
        1. doktoraikasap
          0
          6 February 2012 18: 06
          Physician,

          Where is the modernization of technology ?????



          1. beard999
            -1
            6 February 2012 23: 33
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            Where is the modernization of technology ?????

            Yes, here http://tank-t-90.ru/Mod/AM/mc1.jpg
            1. doktoraikasap
              -2
              7 February 2012 00: 03
              beard999,
              Raw Murzil, not yet needed and brought to anyone. With an old archaic chassis and MTO.
              1. beard999
                -2
                7 February 2012 19: 56
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                Raw Murzila, not yet needed or brought to anyone

                Listen less to the hot Andryusha Tarasenka. Russian Ministry of Defense liked http://army-news.ru/2012/01/gabtu-polozhitelno-ocenivaet-modernizirovannyj-tank-
                t-90 /
  6. Splin
    0
    6 February 2012 09: 37
    IFRC Sapsan
  7. beech
    +1
    6 February 2012 09: 57
    in words it’s all very much, they’ll do it from the beginning, then we’ll discuss
    1. doktoraikasap
      -2
      6 February 2012 16: 36
      Quote: beech
      in words it’s all very much, they’ll do it from the beginning, then we’ll discuss

      Yes, for example, an air defense missile system 25 missile already, on the approach of an air defense missile system missile to a beech at 50 km. And another 70 ....
      And here it is at 150km ...
      fellow
      1. Physician
        -4
        6 February 2012 16: 39
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        Yes, for example, an air defense missile system 25 missile already, on the approach of an air defense missile system missile to a beech at 50 km. And another 70 ....
        And here it is at 150km ...

        Schoolchildren draw such computer models wink
        1. doktoraikasap
          +4
          6 February 2012 18: 07
          Quote: Doctor
          Schoolchildren draw such computer models

          Where is KAZ Arena ?????


          The Zaslon active defense complex (KAZ), created by the MIKROTEK Base Center for Critical Technologies State Enterprise, is designed to protect individual mobile and stationary objects from all types of hand-held anti-tank grenade launchers, anti-tank guided and unguided rockets, artillery cumulative and armor-piercing shells with speeds approach to the target 70–1200 m / s. KAZ Zaslon has a detection system with the minimum required radius of action, is well-noise protected, barely noticeable and highly effective on the battlefield.

          KAZ Zaslon has an autonomous modular structure and can be installed on any tanks, light and heavy armored vehicles and stationary objects without significant changes in the design. The installation of KAZ "Barrier" on armored vehicles does not increase the dimensions of the carrier. The total weight of the system depends on the required level of protection, i.e. from the number of modules installed on the object (usually from 3 to 6) with the weight of one module from 50 to 130 kg. When installed on a tank, the Barrier active defense complex consists of a control panel in the turret, as well as protection modules, each of which contains two ammunition with striking elements. Several such modules are placed on the tank, while four of them are located on the tank’s caterpillar niches, which ensures the secrecy of such an installation. In the ammunition itself, in addition to the striking elements, there is also a target detection radar operating in the millimeter range. And in the armored module case itself, which protects the KAZ unit from small arms bullets and fragments, there is also a retractable device. Its electric motors push the ammunition from the marching to the combat position after the tank crew has brought the system into working mode. After the complex is turned on, the radar for detecting the target of each ammunition continuously emits a signal at a distance of approximately 2–2.5 m. The radar sensor offers coverage of 150–180 degrees in azimuth and from 6 to +20 degrees in height, and in case an attacking object appears in this area undermining the protective munition, which creates a circular damaging field of high-speed fragments. After undermining one of the ammunition, the second is advanced from the module to the combat position.

          KAZ “Barrier” modules have ammunition that does not require firing towards the target. This provides the Barrier with a gain in response time to the threat and the ability to intercept high-speed targets. So, the performance of the Barrier in comparison with the Arena is 0.001–0.005 versus 0.07 seconds. Under the influence of a blast wave and high-speed fragments, the Barrier’s ammunition detonates the enemy’s cumulative projectiles or detonates the trajectory. And attacking ammunition with a solid metal case in the fragmentation cloud of KAZ Zaslon change their trajectory and either go outside the area of ​​the protected object or meet with the main reservation at an angle that negates the ability of the striking element to harm the tank. KAZ Zaslon protects the object from anti-tank weapons of attack from above.

          An important feature of the Barrier protection is the possibility of combining it with dynamic protection. The Barrier system can also be used to protect light armored vehicles. Moreover, the effectiveness of their protection against simple armor-piercing and armor-piercing sub-caliber shells of small-caliber guns has already been tested. Lightweight active protection "Barrier-L" is a removable modules for single use. Two modules will be located on the upper frontal part of the BMP-3 and two - on the sides in the integrated version. The lightweight Barrier is effective against RPG-7 and RPG-9 grenades and anti-tank guided missiles (ATGMs).
          1. klop_mutant
            0
            6 February 2012 21: 36
            Speril at the Research Institute of Steel the idea of ​​30 years ago.
            1. doktoraikasap
              -2
              6 February 2012 22: 40
              Quote: klop_mutant
              Speril at the Research Institute of Steel the idea of ​​30 years ago.

              FAQ - at kago? This little thing is miserable - it doesn’t even touch ... lol
              1. klop_mutant
                0
                7 February 2012 22: 08
                The Barrier principle, like the Knife, was worked out at the Steel Research Institute a long time ago, even Tarasenko does not deny this.
          2. beard999
            0
            6 February 2012 23: 34
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            Where is KAZ Arena ?????

            In the same place as KAZ Barrier. How many armored vehicles have you sold with your screen? Again, the "statistics" will wait?
            1. doktoraikasap
              -2
              7 February 2012 00: 05
              beard999,
              They sold it. And my word, unlike yours, is enough.
              1. beard999
                0
                7 February 2012 19: 59
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                And my word, unlike yours, is enough.

                Your word is empty zilch. Unable to prove your fantasies, say so ...
      2. beard999
        +1
        6 February 2012 17: 52
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        on the approach of the air defense missile system missile to beech at 50km

        It's crazy what "achievements". On the export 9M317, a range of 45 km was achieved back in the 90s. http://www.niip.ru/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=17:-q-2q-9317&ca
        tid=9:2011-07-06-06-33-50&Itemid=9
        On the Buk-M3 air defense system, the maximum range of the SAM is already 70 km http://www.arms-expo.ru/055057052124057052049.html.
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        And here it is at 150km ...

        Is it like in Ukraine they want to add to the S-300? And 150 km you still have to confirm on the tests. But in general, the Russian export SAM 48N6E2 missile system S-300PMU-2 flew 200 km 20 years ago (since 1992), and missile 9M83M S-300VM system - the same 200 km since 1990. This is even Wikipedia writes http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A1-300.
        I don’t remember the Russian 48N6DM missiles with a range of 245 km and 40N6 with a range of 400 km.
        What are you actually trying to brag about?
        1. doktoraikasap
          0
          6 February 2012 18: 16
          There will be no Russian missile on the Ukrainian Buk, the Ukrainian will be 50 and 70.
  8. VictoRUS123
    +1
    6 February 2012 10: 21
    Quote: Igorek
    If Ukraine does not take urgent measures to inject the dough into its defense industry, then in 5-7 years this will not remain.

    Ukraine has no money. and nowhere to take, with the exception of investments. Ukraine does not want to consider Russia as such. waiting for the offer of Pindos. Pindos Ukraine does not need Ukraine as a strong economic republic, producing missile systems and a springboard for its purposes near Russia under its nose. But the goal is the same - to make the people of Russia happy ...
    1. Splin
      0
      6 February 2012 10: 33
      Ukraine does not want to consider Russia as such

      Russia wants to own a controlling stake in rights. The most famous example of the An-70. Intellectual property also costs money. And equality in this case is not provided for by the Russian government. Just the presence of petrodollars made the government hamovataya.
      1. Alexey Prikazchikov
        -3
        6 February 2012 10: 49
        The guy take off the pink glasses of the Russian Federation and Ukraine in different weight categories, all countries are divided into bandits and sixes, you don’t refer to bandits. Therefore, equal relations between us can never be in principle NEVER !!!
        1. Splin
          +5
          6 February 2012 10: 54
          And after these words, do you dream of merging? Please note! With such speeches, the time will come when you wake up alone. If such a time has not come. The state of Tuvalu does not count.
          1. Alexey Prikazchikov
            -6
            6 February 2012 10: 56
            Oh, she’ll cry for a moment, you weren’t and don’t be.
            1. Splin
              +6
              6 February 2012 11: 02
              Well then, do not "spit saliva" in the direction of neighbors noting their failures and achievements. On an individual subjective level, one can always be a pseudo-patriot, but on the scale of the country, this is not so. You shouldn't be like Onishchenko.
              1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                -2
                6 February 2012 11: 08
                Aya did not splatter, I'm just a realist and I advise you to be one too. Because mistakes need to be corrected, not whimpering to make excuses. And here is a piece of advice for the future, a people who seek greatness in the past, have no future. IMHO, Ukraine could be turned into a normal country, but it was necessary to do this, in the 90s when there was room for maneuver now it is not there, frankly I do not see it, and all these picking with the army are more like the convulsions of a dying man. And yes, I’m a patriot, but the Russian Federation, and not what kind of Ukraine is there
                just as you are a patriot of your state, so let us not return to this topic in the future.
                1. Splin
                  +6
                  6 February 2012 11: 21
                  The 90s are the same for both Russia and Ukraine. Where the citizens of Ukraine made a mistake, it was in 2004 that Yushch came to power.
                  1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                    -3
                    6 February 2012 11: 30
                    There is no blunder so these are your problems and no one else's, just set real tasks. We can afford to show off only because we have huge potential, but the most important thing is money, a lot of money for its realization. You also have high scientific potential, while high ... But there is no money. It would be better not invested in re-equipment but in R&D. Unfortunately, the existing army can no longer be saved, everything needs to be changed, just everything. And so you would have at least some groundwork for the future.
                    1. Splin
                      +3
                      6 February 2012 11: 39
                      I already wrote earlier about petrodollars. It’s great at a distance to write the degradation of our army without seeing it in vain. I can’t get everywhere with a certificate, not like a Russian. I don’t talk about the state of the Russian army based solely on the press, especially the local and not the world.
                      I'm not saying that everything is like cheese in butter, but there isn’t that absolute zero or point of no return
                    2. Tyumen
                      -1
                      6 February 2012 12: 40
                      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                      these are your problems and draws anymore

                      You are mistaken. Their problems, such as Yushchenko, are heard in Russia even more than at home.
                      1. doktoraikasap
                        -2
                        6 February 2012 16: 50
                        Quote: Tyumen 35
                        Their problems, such as Yushchenko, are heard in Russia even more than at home.

                        Russia bought as it buys under Yushchenko. The rest is.
                      2. Physician
                        -2
                        6 February 2012 16: 56
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        Russia bought as it buys under Yushchenko. .

                        This is because we have money patient! bully
                      3. doktoraikasap
                        0
                        6 February 2012 18: 10
                        Quote: Doctor
                        This is because we have money patient!


                        Where are the new developments for NATO ?????
                        Optical-electronic suppression station "Adros" KT-01AVE

                        Optos-electronic suppression station “Adros” KT-01AVE is designed to provide highly effective active protection of helicopters from guided missiles with infrared homing of various types.


                        The Adros station KT-01AVE is capable of equally and simultaneously counteracting infrared homing heads with amplitude-phase (AFM), frequency-phase (ChFM), time-pulse (VIM) modulation of the signal from the target and with increased noise immunity.

                        Adros station KT-01AVE disrupts target capture on the trajectory of missiles such as Stinger, Igla, Igla-1, R-60, R-60M, R-73, Sidewinder and others.

                        The station provides guided missiles from the flight path to the target, with subsequent disruption of tracking due to a gradually increasing guidance error in the missile control loop.

                        The station does not require information about the type and frequency of operation of the infrared missile homing head, as well as the presence of a missile launch detection system.

                        To achieve maximum helicopter protection efficiency, the Adros KT-01AVE station is used together with screen-exhaust devices that can significantly reduce the infrared visibility of the helicopter.

                        The station is designed for installation on helicopters Mi-24, Mi-8, Mi-17 of all modifications. Placing the Adros station KT-01AVE on other types of helicopters requires work on its adaptation.

                        Based on the principles underlying the operation of the Adros KT-01AVE station, it is possible to develop a highly efficient station according to the customer’s specifications for a specific class or type of aircraft.
                      4. beard999
                        0
                        6 February 2012 23: 36
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        Optical-electronic suppression station "Adros" KT-01AVE

                        Well, we will have better http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfxHWWqsRQI. In general, lamp ESRP is yesterday. It is necessary to do laser suppression systems http://77rus.smugmug.com/Military/MAKS-2011/i-bSzTxxh/0/O/Part839.jpg.
                    3. doktoraikasap
                      -4
                      6 February 2012 16: 49
                      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                      you just need to set real tasks.

                      The real task is for Sapsan to fly to Moscow.
                      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                      a lot of money for its implementation.

                      A lot of money-this is Russia, because they steal.
                      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                      and invested in research

                      Such clever words - can blow up the embryo of your brain, be careful - "reading a lot" ... lol
                      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                      And so you would have at least some groundwork for the future.

                      What is no groundwork in Ukraine, except for ship armaments?
                      1. Physician
                        -3
                        6 February 2012 16: 55
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        The real task is for Sapsan to fly to Moscow.

                        What are you talking about?
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        A lot of money-this is Russia, because they steal.

                        They steal everywhere and in Israel the president is generally a rapist am
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        Such clever words - can blow up the embryo of your brain, be careful - "reading a lot" ...

                        Be careful with the many-sided bots, who are you today, the great destroyer or billionaire remember our conversation?
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        What is no groundwork in Ukraine, except for ship armaments?

                        It is very stupidly said laughing
                      2. doktoraikasap
                        -1
                        6 February 2012 18: 12
                        Quote: Doctor
                        It is very stupidly said


                        Where is the production of the latest radars for STELS ?????



                      3. beard999
                        +1
                        6 February 2012 23: 37
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        Where is the production of the latest radars for STELS ?????

                        Here is http://www.nniirt.ru/catalog. And this will never happen in Ukraine in Ukraine http://www.ormira.ru/news/arms/711-radar-complex-sky-m-will-go-into-service-in-2
                        012.html.
                      4. doktoraikasap
                        -4
                        7 February 2012 00: 06
                        Quote: beard999
                        And this will never happen in Ukraine

                        Dumb Troll, we have the best schools and factories for radar and the best radar.
                      5. beard999
                        -1
                        7 February 2012 20: 06
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        Dumb Troll

                        Dumb Troll you with your cheap Murzilka. Wipe them.
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        we have the best schools and factories for radar and the best radar

                        Not tired of cormorants? To the Russian level of radar you like to Beijing cancer. We can objectively compare the nomenclature and characteristics of your and our radars. Believe me, you will be very sad ...
                      6. spirin199
                        -1
                        8 February 2012 09: 26
                        and who the student buys from you
                      7. Eugene
                        +2
                        6 February 2012 22: 34
                        The real task is for Sapsan to fly to Moscow.


                        Yeah, yeah, you first need to put into service (not giving a damn about the non-proliferation of nuclear weapons signed by Ukraine), then gash the fusion ammunition, if at that moment the democrats aren’t mining coal near Donetsk, then launching them, this handful of missiles will have to dodge volley s-400 and A-35/135. Oh yes, accept a gift into your territory because of the Urals with an aggregate mass of a couple of tens of megatons.

                        So do not write nonsense.
                  2. MURANO
                    +1
                    6 February 2012 11: 39
                    Quote: Splin
                    e citizens of Ukraine made a mistake; in 2004, they let Yushch take power.

                    10000000%.
                    1. doktoraikasap
                      0
                      6 February 2012 16: 51
                      Quote: MURANO
                      10000000%.

                      The main vector for everyone is European.
                      1. klop_mutant
                        +2
                        6 February 2012 21: 36
                        Bush Ass Licking - European Vector? Oh well.
                      2. spirin199
                        0
                        8 February 2012 09: 27
                        while you breathe near the back vector
                  3. PARROT
                    0
                    6 February 2012 12: 12
                    And then they made a mistake when they chose Yanukovych. And the fact that some money can be allocated there or not is not a reason to praise him until he has done nothing good, and his rating is falling for a reason, but what is falling there, he will soon have nothing left and there will be his mafia after half a year to change.
                    1. Splin
                      +2
                      6 February 2012 12: 31
                      This is a transition to the policy section. Everyone has their own opinion and it’s pointless to convince here. I suppose I think that the government passed the test of frost, when in the regions it was minus 30! Let’s say Tymoshenko would have justified herself like it was owl flu, but no one else went out into the second round.
                  4. doktoraikasap
                    -2
                    6 February 2012 16: 46
                    Quote: Splin
                    Where the citizens of Ukraine made a mistake, it was in 2004 that Yushch came to power.

                    And so far they have not lived before or after - how they lived then ... fellow
                2. MURANO
                  +3
                  6 February 2012 11: 38
                  Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                  And yes, I’m a patriot, but the Russian Federation,

                  This is good. But healthy patriotism is not directed against others.
                  Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                  and not some tog of Ukraine there

                  here after such words I begin to understand that some of my western fellow citizens are right about you. With this approach you will not have friends.
                  I served in the Federation Council. Now I am a citizen of Ukraine. This is my homeland. Like Russia. And for me these are two native countries. But COUNTRIES. Independent. And the more people like you look at the fraternal people from high, the more they will rub their hands our overseas "friends".
                  We must experience and rejoice at each other's successes and not gloat and maliciously. This is our Slavic power!
                  1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                    -8
                    6 February 2012 12: 06
                    We do not need friends and brothers, we need PARTNERS and that’s it. If you need adequate partners like Germany, I’ll repeat only business and nothing personal.
                    1. jamert
                      +3
                      6 February 2012 15: 19
                      We do not need friends and brothers, we need PARTNERS and that’s it. If you need adequate partners like Germany, I’ll repeat only business and nothing personal.


                      Super. That's just you and so sell your gas to us more expensive than Germany, and at the same time still stink the whole world.
                      1. doktoraikasap
                        -5
                        6 February 2012 16: 53
                        Quote: jamert
                        and still stink the whole world.

                        Which country - such a smell. lol
                      2. spirin199
                        -1
                        8 February 2012 09: 30
                        Bandera all the stink is always blissful prostitutes from you
                      3. beard999
                        +1
                        6 February 2012 17: 56
                        Quote: jamert
                        That's just you and so sell your gas to us more expensive than Germany

                        Give a link to confirm your words to any independent source, where is the gas price for Ukraine and Germany for the same period?
                      4. ytqnhfk
                        0
                        7 February 2012 00: 40
                        I WILL TELL ABOUT GAS ONCE AND FOREVER YOU HAVE ANYTHING! DO NOT LIKE DO NOT BUY! IN THE MARKET, HOW ASKED FOR THE PRICE, I WENT FASELY, I FOUND CHEAPER AND BOUGHT !!!! GETTED WITH GAS YOU DO NOT PURCHASE IT TO BUY IT UNDER A GUN!
                      5. doktoraikasap
                        -2
                        7 February 2012 00: 48
                        Quote: ytqnhfk
                        I will say PRO GAS ONCE AND FOREVER

                        Flooder is a Ukraine-NATO theme.
                      6. ytqnhfk
                        0
                        7 February 2012 01: 07
                        flood because you do not read the comments of others present!
                    2. doktoraikasap
                      -3
                      6 February 2012 16: 53
                      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                      We do not need friends and brothers, we need PARTNERS and that’s it.

                      Well, buy as you bought. And silently!
                      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                      I repeat only business and nothing personal.

                      You have no idea in this - an overdue. So do not make a very wise look. laughing
                      1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                        -4
                        6 February 2012 20: 17
                        First of all, I’m learning in a unary, secondly, it’s better to bleach, go to your hoslyatsk shed and fuck a fucking vyyanka, drink smelly like a macha gorilika, and go fuck your salazhori pigs.
                      2. maolex
                        0
                        12 February 2012 14: 43
                        for a university student, your spelling is lame, and there’s a mess with vocabulary; not clearly where administrators look am
                        terry nationalists - is the future of Russia? fucking patriot of you
                    3. vladimir89
                      0
                      14 February 2012 01: 47
                      These in search of partners served with Vlasov in the army, without friends and brothers.
                      Vali to the Pindos, their clerks are valued, and you’ll sell everyone there
                  2. ytqnhfk
                    0
                    7 February 2012 00: 37
                    SAY THIS FOR THE FIRST TIME TO THE DOCTOR AND EVERYTHING ELSE IN HIS FACE AND HE HE POOR HERE ALREADY HAS ALREADY CHANGED BUT NIKES BUT IT EVERYTHING EVERYTHING EVERYTHING WILL BE RECOGNIZED AT YOUR PARLIAMENTARY !!!!!!!!!!!!
                    1. doktoraikasap
                      0
                      7 February 2012 01: 02
                      ytqnhfk,
                      From capital letters - flooders do not get smarter.
                      1. ytqnhfk
                        -1
                        7 February 2012 01: 55
                        Mind for more is not enough? you would go to bed as a young man, and then tomorrow at the lessons again, oversleep everything !!!!!!!!!!!!! In your head, and there is nothing besides slogans !!! Yes, donkey stubbornness! about billions!
                3. doktoraikasap
                  -1
                  6 February 2012 16: 46
                  Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                  I'm just a realist and I advise you to be one too.

                  You are a drummer, and it has long been proven. lol
                  1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                    -2
                    6 February 2012 20: 18
                    Oh come on, how I regret that you tell me in person
            2. -3
              6 February 2012 11: 49
              I hope you expressed only your opinion ...
            3. doktoraikasap
              -4
              6 February 2012 16: 44
              Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
              Oh, she’ll cry for a moment, you weren’t and don’t be.

              So what rhena are you writing b-red here?
              1. Physician
                0
                6 February 2012 16: 47
                Quote: doktoraikasap
                So what rhena are you writing b-red here?

                So what rhena are you doktoraikasap here b-red write?
              2. Alexey Prikazchikov
                -2
                6 February 2012 20: 18
                This is the Russian forum Hohlostan!
          2. doktoraikasap
            -5
            6 February 2012 16: 43
            Quote: Splin
            And after these words, do you dream of merging?

            And this is not to be the whole point of the article - Ukraine forges swords against the last illusions of the Horde ... fellow
            Quote: Splin
            With such speeches, the time will come when you wake up alone.

            So it is already.
            1. Physician
              -1
              6 February 2012 16: 46
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              And this is not to be the whole point of the article - Ukraine forges swords against the last illusions of the Horde ...

              Against the US and NATO wink
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              So it is already.

              Ukraine is with Russia, but doktoraikasap wake up alone even without neighbors in the ward bully
            2. Alexey Prikazchikov
              -2
              6 February 2012 20: 19
              Ooh what ambitious pi we are ... di further time will tell who is hurt who.
            3. spirin199
              0
              8 February 2012 09: 31
              you are in the evenings his kuesh alone in a sartir of his hand
        2. Eugene
          +5
          6 February 2012 11: 41
          Alexey, you shouldn't be so. The Ukrainian people are fraternal to us, and Ukraine is a country, as they used to say before, "Russian World". Therefore, it is at least impolite to call 6-kami. Here's a look at the distribution of the language by regions of Ukraine:
          1. Alexey Prikazchikov
            -1
            6 February 2012 12: 09
            You were born under the union, I don’t; therefore, do not try to me to embrace it. And yes I will answer with the words of Dostoevsky - All these Slavic tribes will envy and not see us much more than our worst enemies.
            1. +3
              6 February 2012 12: 37
              Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
              You were born with the union, I'm not

              It's a pity. It only says that you have nothing to compare with.
              1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                -5
                6 February 2012 13: 11
                It is possible, but it’s not for you to change this for me, there is only the RF and its interests, the problem of others does not bother me the main thing so that everything is fine in the Russian Federation. The only thing I want is then, in old age, to look back and see what a great country we have built, but yes, I don’t care about Ukraine, like that.
                1. doktoraikasap
                  -6
                  6 February 2012 16: 57
                  Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                  It is possible, but not for you to change this; for me there is only the RF and its interests

                  So what are you doing on a branch buzet - if there is a conversation about the business of Ukraine and NATO?
                  Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                  The only thing I want is then to look back at old age and see what a great country we built

                  A country with akimi like you has a great future ... laughing
                  Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
                  but ukraine i don't care

                  Go away. Yes
                  1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                    -2
                    6 February 2012 20: 21
                    Ride to your hohlostan, it’s not for you to judge clearly, be patient for 10, 15 years, and then just look around if you live of course.
              2. ytqnhfk
                -1
                7 February 2012 00: 44
                Have you been in this country for a long time?
                1. -2
                  7 February 2012 15: 31
                  If the question is about the USSR, then I was born, raised, educated in this country and unmatched for better than what can be obtained in modern Russia. And for me, these reasons are enough to consider this country as their Homeland to this day. And the last time in this country was, like you, at her funeral. More questions?
            2. doktoraikasap
              -3
              6 February 2012 16: 55
              Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
              And yes I will answer with the words of Dostoevsky - All these Slavic tribes will envy and not see us much more than our worst enemies.

              Dostoevsky ugro-fin.
              1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                -2
                6 February 2012 20: 27
                Firstly, it has already been proved that the Khozkhs are not Slavs, read the topics or type Ukro-Türks in faces in the search engine. Turkic roots of Ukrainians. A lot of iterative with all evidence of disclosures. And we’ll be treated by Dostoevsky, so I’ll say it all the world knows and who’s a gentleman? Who needs you, you will die tomorrow, who will snuggle up to you on a magilla, huh? I answered myself these questions and now sit and do not blather.
              2. spirin199
                0
                8 February 2012 09: 33
                Yes, Poles you were tanned a lot by Romanians soon
          2. doktoraikasap
            -4
            6 February 2012 16: 54
            Eugene,
            map - murzilka.
        3. Bretwald
          0
          6 February 2012 13: 15
          handsome! the bandits of the six, fuck this tin, you really have some kind of Tagil hornet, this is also why masked baguettes will never be accepted into the closed clubs of the western elite no matter how much they throw their billions. we all have known this masculine subconscious for a long time; first you figure out where 150 thousand non-Vainakh populations of Chechnya went missing, 95% are maskals, and then even virtually try to put your chicken paws in inform. Ukrainian space.
        4. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 16: 42
          Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
          The guy take off the pink glasses of the Russian Federation and Ukraine in different weight categories

          Yeah, Ukraine is an industrial country, Russia is a raw materials appendage of the world.
          Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
          Therefore, equal relations between us can never be in principle NEVER !!!

          Yes, because my intellect is 2 times higher than yours ... fellow
          1. Alexey Prikazchikov
            0
            6 February 2012 20: 22
            How many mo1 184 balapo on the last test and you?
          2. spirin199
            0
            7 February 2012 14: 46
            hahol your desire may not have higher intellect
      2. doktoraikasap
        -4
        6 February 2012 16: 40
        Quote: Splin
        Russia wants to own a controlling stake in rights.

        And at the same time, he does not have the right to the right.
        Quote: Splin
        And equality in this case is not provided for by the Russian government.

        It is envisaged, but only the Ukrainian side can make changes, as well as production at the plant - only KB can set ...
        Quote: Splin
        Just the presence of petrodollars made the government hamovataya.

        Wild country.
    2. Eugene
      +2
      6 February 2012 10: 38
      Well, you’re in vain, Ukraine is now having a good start on Bulat and Oplot tanks. In the supply of armored personnel carriers abroad, they occupy second place in the world. They have an armored personnel carrier-2 and is being delivered to Iraq, and our topic of promising armored personnel carriers is still under development.
      1. Splin
        +4
        6 February 2012 10: 47
        BTR-3E go to Thailand. 420 BTR-4 go to Iraq. And BTR-7 in the UAE.
        1. doktoraikasap
          -3
          6 February 2012 16: 58
          Quote: Splin
          And BTR-7 in the UAE.

          They don’t go, but they go to the army.
          1. spirin199
            0
            8 February 2012 09: 33
            8 pieces all time
      2. rnb1983
        +8
        6 February 2012 11: 12
        Georgia was also well supplied .... feel
        1. Splin
          +2
          6 February 2012 11: 18
          Old seventies and BMP-1U with the Flurry module went to Georgia
          1. doktoraikasap
            -2
            6 February 2012 17: 00
            Quote: Splin
            Old seventies and BMP-1U with the Flurry module went to Georgia

            The old ones? These like:

            1. klop_mutant
              -1
              6 February 2012 21: 38
              Khokhlyat copy 2A42 on the Soviet BMP-2 corps. Cool.
              1. doktoraikasap
                -5
                6 February 2012 22: 17
                Hucklebacks themselves cannot create similarities from the price-quality category - over there, like the Russian General Staff and the Moscow Region, they settled like monkeys ... Not to mention the more advanced Ukrainian modules ... lol
                1. spirin199
                  -4
                  7 February 2012 14: 47
                  you still answer for Sevastopol
            2. beard999
              0
              6 February 2012 23: 37
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              Like these

              Yeah, I like it ... But the domestic Wolves, Typhoons, Boomerangs, Kurgan-25, and Almaty are going to buy. So you have to vparivat their crafts to anyone else.
              1. doktoraikasap
                -2
                7 February 2012 00: 07
                Quote: beard999
                Yeah, I like it ... But the domestic Wolves, Typhoons, Boomerangs, Kurgan-25, and Almaty are going to buy. So you have to vparivat their crafts to anyone else.

                Flooder is dumb.
                1. beard999
                  0
                  7 February 2012 20: 09
                  Quote: doktoraikasap
                  Flooder is dumb.

                  Already repeating. I’m looking completely blown away ... Quickly, your argument has slipped into banal rudeness.
        2. doktoraikasap
          -7
          6 February 2012 16: 59
          Quote: rnb1983
          Georgia was also well supplied ....

          Yes, and also to Armenia, Azerbaijan, Turkmenistan, Kazakhstan, Belarus ...
      3. doktoraikasap
        -4
        6 February 2012 16: 58
        Quote: Eugene
        In the supply of armored personnel carriers abroad, they occupy second place in the world.

        Yes, and the first in the CIS.
        Quote: Eugene
        They have an armored personnel carrier-3 and is delivered to Iraq

        BTR-3 is now in Thailand, in Iraq - BTR-4.
        Quote: Eugene
        and our topic of promising armored vehicles is still under development.

        Nowhere, the BTR-80 is purchased.
    3. sas
      sas
      0
      6 February 2012 11: 40
      Dough in Ukraine shaft. It is only necessary to use it.
      "The Pindos need Ukraine not as a strong economic republic producing missile systems, but as a springboard for their own purposes." Russia does not need it either.
      1. Eugene
        +1
        6 February 2012 12: 07
        As for the shaft, the logical question is where?
        Oil Dollars? Production?
        We look at the data of Russia's GDP in 2010: $ 2,230 trillion

        Ukraine: 2010 306,638 billion dollars

        Russia - I don’t argue with oil and gas dollars, now it’s not about that. In Russia the population is 3 times more, but for some reason the GDP is not 3 times different. That is, the per capita figure is miserable.

        Let's see other countries commensurate with Ukraine:

        Poland: $ 727,300 billion is also a former socialist country, the population is even smaller, but the GDP is larger.

        Italy - $ 1,771 trillion

        Austria - despite the fact that the population is 5 times lower and there are almost no resources - $ 330,496 billion
        1. sas
          sas
          0
          6 February 2012 19: 03
          It's not about GDP. There is so much gray cash that all of Poland have never dreamed of. Only everything goes to the left. In Ukraine, almost no large companies pay taxes. Everyone is muddied. They wash so much that, I repeat, Poland and others like them have never dreamed of.
      2. Alexey Prikazchikov
        -2
        6 February 2012 12: 10
        Well, if so fight for your country, and not whine. We almost won back our country, and we didn’t ask anyone for help or ache.
        1. jamert
          -10
          6 February 2012 15: 21
          And we will win back, if only the parachute "brothers" did not interfere.
          1. doktoraikasap
            -4
            6 February 2012 17: 03
            Quote: jamert
            And we will win back, if only the parachute "brothers" did not interfere.

            Hurrah! angry
          2. ytqnhfk
            -1
            7 February 2012 00: 50
            jamert you would not shout so much about your location so loud !!!!!!!!!!!
            1. doktoraikasap
              -1
              7 February 2012 01: 03
              Quote: ytqnhfk

              jamert you would not shout so much about your location so loud !!!!!!!!!!!

              PaRashny forgot to ask
              1. ytqnhfk
                -2
                7 February 2012 01: 18
                This is you to yourself! how self-critical a young man!
          3. spirin199
            0
            8 February 2012 09: 36
            warrior you are the island of snakes
        2. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 17: 03
          Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
          We almost won back our country, and we didn’t ask anyone for help or ache.

          What country did you conquer flooder?
      3. doktoraikasap
        -4
        6 February 2012 17: 02
        Quote: Sas
        It also does not need Russia.

        It is true that no one has ever come to do good for someone - everyone wants to do only good for themselves. And therefore - in Ukraine only Ukrainian interests.
        1. sas
          sas
          0
          6 February 2012 19: 06
          Right. "There is truth, strength, and will in your hut!"
    4. doktoraikasap
      -5
      6 February 2012 16: 38
      Quote: ViktoRUS123
      Ukraine has no money.

      But in Russia, as there is none, there is no Russian military-industrial complex except snot on the monitor ...
      Quote: ViktoRUS123
      Ukraine does not want to consider Russia as such.

      Oh, the main thing is to buy Ukrainian.
      Quote: ViktoRUS123
      But the goal is the same - to make the people of Russia happy ...

      Paranoia is vomiting ... belay
      1. beard999
        -1
        6 February 2012 18: 11
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        But in Russia, as it is not, this is not the Russian military-industrial complex

        Well, of course. What else can you think of? Only for export, $ 12 billion was delivered. http://www.armstrade.org/includes/periodics/news/2012/0125/115011296/detail.shtm
        l. The same Ukraine, among the world's arms suppliers, is not even in the top ten ...
      2. Alexey Prikazchikov
        -2
        6 February 2012 20: 29
        About how many sadlazhors the dog’s face came running !!!
        1. doktoraikasap
          -6
          6 February 2012 22: 19
          Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
          About how many sadlazhors the dog’s face came running !!!

          Piston - forget about it. The brain is like a shell, but it opens up. Yes
          1. Alexey Prikazchikov
            -2
            7 February 2012 00: 30
            The typical answer of the Khokhlostan Untermensch laughing
            1. doktoraikasap
              -3
              7 February 2012 00: 41
              Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
              The typical answer of the Khokhlostan Untermensch

              You have nothing to tell me because of organic inferiority
              1. Alexey Prikazchikov
                -2
                7 February 2012 04: 35
                Sorry, but I don’t speak with sabaks.
  9. gans
    -4
    6 February 2012 10: 29
    Ukrainian Wishlist, well, maybe someday they will concoct a thread like a flying Cossack
    1. +1
      6 February 2012 10: 42
      Already have and is being tested at the landfill.
      1. doktoraikasap
        -2
        6 February 2012 17: 06
        подводник,
        This is for BMP-3, with which the Russian Ministry of Defense could use BMP-3 ...

        But this goes to NATO:
        1. beard999
          0
          6 February 2012 23: 38
          Quote: doktoraikasap
          Here is a BMP-3

          Woke up? Yes, Russia has been using it for 20 years already http://pvo.guns.ru/images/expo/kbp80years/IMG_6092_DCE.JPG
          1. doktoraikasap
            -2
            7 February 2012 00: 11
            Quote: beard999
            Woke up? Yes, Russia has been using it for 20 years already http://pvo.guns.ru/images/expo/kbp80years/IMG_6092_DCE.JPG

            - Junk from Tula.
            Then the question is - for whom did Ukraine then make it ??? - Or so - for forums ???

            :))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) Ahhh, such a fucking ... And it’s not clear why it bodes here - that Ruska has no relation whatsoever to either Ukraine or NATO.
            1. beard999
              0
              7 February 2012 20: 19
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              Junk from Tula

              The rocket is not new. But Ukraine was able to reach its technical level only now! Can you compare the characteristics yourself or help?
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              Then the question is - for whom did Ukraine then make it

              Well, you ask your people. The Russian Federation sold about 1400 BMP-3 http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D0%9C%D0%9F-3. You don’t need your crafts for it.
              Quote: doktoraikasap
              :))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) Ahhh, such a fucking ...

              Hysteria has begun?
    2. doktoraikasap
      -3
      6 February 2012 17: 04
      Quote: gans
      they concoct something and a thread like a flying Cossack

      Is it about engines in helicopter-planes, or about the S-300 radar, or about the alimination from Zaporozhye? lol
  10. +2
    6 February 2012 10: 36
    Quote: beech
    Thus, according to Ukrainian experts, the new complex will be much cheaper than its closest competitor, the Russian Iskander, which costs about $ 1 billion.
    I read it alone? some kind of mathematical nonsense, from where "author -> author -> author" took such a figure. regarding cooperation between China and Ukraine, do the Ukrainians seriously believe that they will be able to suck this complex into China. seems doubtful to me. rather, the Chinese will steal ICBM developments. WE have already had such cooperation. it is gratifying that Kiev is stepping on the same rake. as they say: there is nothing so happy as the failure of a friend. when joining NATO, Kiev will be forced to abandon its military-industrial complex. HELLO BROTHERS, A FEW GENERATIONS MORE AND WE WILL BECOME NOT JUST ALIENS, AND ON THE GOING STILL ENEMIES.
    1. ZHORA
      -9
      6 February 2012 10: 52
      What kind of brother are you in FIG, through every word, bile ... and in your Russia there are such majority, the degrading country of Russia ...
      1. +3
        6 February 2012 11: 14
        I’m definitely not your brother, I’m not a finished Bandera. and about bile, where? that China has stolen all our achievements, it’s the irony about our military-industrial directors, and yours are no different from ours. Maybe the current on the mov is being spoiled, and so one to one.
        1. doktoraikasap
          -5
          6 February 2012 17: 11
          Quote: core
          that China stole from us all the best practices

          Russia itself has leaked to China ...
      2. +1
        6 February 2012 11: 19
        Zhora, do you talk about this !! in general I wonder how they themselves did not die from her
      3. doktoraikasap
        -4
        6 February 2012 17: 10
        Quote: JORA
        and in your Russia such majority, the degrading country of Russia ...

        As clerks - pronounced degradant.
      4. spirin199
        0
        8 February 2012 09: 39
        Zhora you shit more than Georgians
    2. jamert
      -8
      6 February 2012 15: 24
      rather, the Chinese will steal the achievements on ICBMs.


      And do not need to steal, we will give it back. As an aircraft carrier, T-10, etc. China is the only friend of our country.

      when joining NATO, Kiev will force one to abandon its military-industrial complex.


      For some reason, Poland and Romania were not forced.
    3. doktoraikasap
      -4
      6 February 2012 17: 09
      Yes, it will be cheaper - wait for competitors to enter your market with Iskander ...
      This has already happened to the Russian Cornets:



      There is no such thing in Russia:

      And of this and in sight:

      1. beard999
        0
        6 February 2012 23: 41
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        wait for competitors to enter your market with Iskander ...

        I remember I already heard this bike when your paper Sapsan called Borisfen. When you enter the market, everything will already be occupied by Iskander.
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        This has already happened to the Russian Cornets

        They are far from the Cornets. And the complex is half Belarusian (your only missile, and the Belarusian control system).
        And Tula does not stand still. There is such a http://www.kbptula.ru/rus/atgw/kornetem1.htm. There is such a http://www.kbptula.ru/rus/atgw/kornetem2.htm. And there is this http://www.kbptula.ru/rus/atgw/comsha.htm.
        Russia sold 35000 rockets of the Kornet complex for 2009. http://www.kbptula.ru/rus/kbp/news/newsr66.htm
        And how many Ukraine do their crafts?
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        And of this and in sight:

        This is for sure, this is only for Ukraine. We ourselves are doing better http://www.kbptula.ru/rus/multi/hermes.htm and http://www.kbptula.ru/rus/multi/hermesa.htm.
        1. doktoraikasap
          -3
          7 February 2012 00: 15
          Quote: beard999
          They are far from the Cornets.

          Are you sure? - Prove ...
          Quote: beard999
          And the complex is half Belarusian

          What exactly is a flooder? ...
          Quote: beard999
          And how many Ukraine do their crafts?

          Oooh, we just started a year ago and already a lot ...
          Quote: beard999
          This is for sure, this is only for Ukraine. We do better for ourselves

          No ... No it ...
          And we still have this:

          laughing
          1. beard999
            0
            7 February 2012 20: 44
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            Prove ...

            Easy. Here are the specifications from the official site http://luch.kiev.ua/russian/main.htm. The maximum range is 5000 m, with a Cornet rocket - 10000 m, armor penetration - at least 800 mm, with Cornet 1100 - 1300 mm, the mass of the complex with one rocket is 93 kg, and with Cornet - 67 kg.
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            What exactly is a flooder? ...

            Flooder you yourself. Throw yourself into the discussion, but you don’t know basic things. http://aljans.org/news/byelarusko-ukrainskiy-ptrk
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            we just started a year ago and already a lot ...

            Call the numbers? Or as always?
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            No ... No it ...

            Again behind the times. Aviation “Peck-A” is available at http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-49.html
            Quote: doktoraikasap
            And we still have it

            Murzilka. Would you like to compare the characteristics with the Hermes?
      2. ytqnhfk
        0
        7 February 2012 03: 04
        Complex Cornet-D / Cornet-EM
        DATA FOR 2011 (standard replenishment)
        Complex "Kornet-D" / "Kornet-EM"
        9M133FM-3 / 9M133FM / 9M133M-2 missiles

        Anti-tank missile system / multipurpose missile system. The Instrument Design Bureau (hereinafter - KBP, Tula) was developed, the chief designer of the direction is Lev Zakharov. The tests of the complex were carried out in 2011. On the official website of the KBP, the complex is called "Kornet-EM", in the media - "Kornet-D". According to unconfirmed official information, the name for the complex in the Russian Armed Forces is "Kornet-D", the export version is "Kornet-EM". By default, the data of the complex with the 9M133FM-3 missile are given. The Hermes / Hermes-A / Klevok-A / Hermes-K complex
        DATA FOR 2011 (standard replenishment)
        Complex "Hermes" / "Hermes-S"
        Hermes-A / Klevok-A complex
        Complex "Hermes-K"
        Promising Aircraft ATGM (as amended 1997)

        Multipurpose anti-tank missile system / multipurpose guided weapon system. Analysis of publications in the press as of 1996 made it possible to conclude that the development of a "promising aviation ATGM" in the Instrument Design Bureau (hereinafter referred to as KBP, Tula) under the leadership of A.G. Shipunov was already underway at that time. Tests of the aviation version of the Hermes-A ATGM as part of the Ka-52 helicopter were completed in the summer of 2003. The Hermes-A ATGM was prepared for serial production. On August 23, 2009, the head of the KBP delegation at the MAKS-2009 air show, Yuri Savenkov, said that in 2010 the helicopter version of the complex would undergo flight tests and be put into service. Serial production for the needs of the Russian Ministry of Defense for arming the Ka-52 and Mi-28N helicopters was planned to be launched in 2011-2012. It is also stated that in the future the missiles of the Hermes complexes can be used with the Pantsir C1 air defense system. Self-propelled ATGM "Hermes"
        Self-propelled anti-tank missile system "Hermes" is a chassis of the BMP-3 infantry fighting vehicle with a turret, on both sides of which are mounted six launchers of anti-tank missiles "Vikhr-S". The missiles can be equipped with various types of homing warheads. The Vikhr supersonic laser-guided missiles were originally developed as aviation weapons for the SU-25T attack aircraft and the Ka-50 combat helicopter. The standard Vikhr 9K121 rocket weighs 45 kg and flies 6000 m in 14 seconds. The maximum firing range of the "Whirlwind" in the daytime is 10000 m, at night - 5000 m. The missile is equipped with a cumulative warhead with contact and non-contact fuses.

        In front of the Hermes ATGM tower, an electron-optical system is mounted, which includes a combined sight with day and night channels and a laser rangefinder-target designator. At the top of the tower is a radar missile detection and guidance system.

        [Anti-tank missile system Hermes] Air-based variant Hermes-A (aviation)
        For the survival of helicopters - carriers of guided weapons and the fulfillment of combat missions by them in the conditions of enemy fire and information countermeasures, it is necessary for them to be able to carry out:
        • hidden exit to the attack area when flying at extremely low altitudes (20-50 m) using the shielding effect of the terrain and vegetation;
        • short-term “jump” to a given height in the attack zone for reconnaissance of targets and the use of guided weapons.

        At the same time, the height of a hovering or flying helicopter should be minimal (30-100 m), and the residence time (ideally, less than the reaction time of air defense systems) - up to 10-15 s or comparable with it.

        The air-based Hermes-A complex can hit targets at a range of 15-18 km, being itself inaccessible to the fire of the enemy's anti-aircraft weapons of the closest line. An inertial guidance system is used to launch the missile into the target area of ​​the homing head. In this case, the elements of the radio command system are excluded from the functional composition of the complex, the placement of which on board the aircraft carrier is problematic. All-day use is ensured by a day-night optical-electronic system with a two-channel laser designator and an automatic target tracking device with a range of optical channels (television, thermal imaging, laser designator-rangefinder) up to 15-25 km, which is not inferior to the capabilities of guided weapons. Tests of the aircraft version of the Hermes-A complex as part of the armament of the Ka-52 attack helicopter were completed in summer 2003. Complex "Hermes-A" is ready for serial production.


        [Anti-tank missile system Hermes] Sea-based variant "Hermes-K"
        The Hermes-K complex is designed to solve the urgent problem of equipping boats, corvettes, and landing ships with a small-sized high-precision missile system, the number of which in the Russian Navy is 4 times higher than that of ships in the far sea zone, and the vulnerability is lower due to their smaller size.

        When using the Hermes-K complex on small patrol boats to combat surface ships, it is advisable to have a firing range of 15-18 km. When it is deployed on landing ships and corvettes, which face more important tasks, in particular, the fight against large surface targets and the suppression of the enemy's coastal defense, it is at least 25-30 km. At the same time, the carrier of the complex is capable of performing a combat mission while remaining outside the effective range of enemy artillery fire.

        The sea-based Hermes-K complex, designed to equip low-tonnage boats, uses an inertial guidance system to launch the missile into the target area. For surface ships with a displacement of several hundred tons, the launch of the missile to the target area is provided by a radio command guidance system, which includes a radar station and a command transmitter on board the UR (similar to the ground-based option). Such a complex is capable of inflicting a level of irrecoverable losses to surface targets with a displacement of up to 100 tons with a single missile, and depriving larger ones of combat effectiveness when they hit vital nodes (wheelhouse, reconnaissance systems, ammunition storage).

        The Hermes-K multipurpose sea-based complex is also capable of hitting low-speed air targets (helicopters) without attracting additional anti-aircraft weapons.

        The performance characteristics of "Hermes":
        Firing Range, km 15-40-100
        Maximum flight speed, m / s 1300
        Average flight speed at a range of 40km, m / s 500
        Rocket launch weight, kg 90
        Rocket weight in TPK, kg 107
        Warhead weight, kg 28
        Weight BB, 18 kg
        Penetration behind dynamic protection, mm 1000
        The diameter of the rocket, mm 130
        The diameter of the starting accelerator, mm 170 (210 for the option with a range of 100 km)
        TPK Length, mm 3500
        Wingspan, mm 240
        1. doktoraikasap
          -2
          7 February 2012 11: 03
          ytqnhfk,
          There is no Hermes except pictures.
  11. GRU Special Forces
    0
    6 February 2012 10: 44
    Well, about the cooperation of Ukraine and NATO, the issue of contention is that we also need to develop technology in China, everything has been torn apart and is not shy, but what can we do? even the same engine on a ship can be propagated later)) and for Pindos, capital engines often came across without a doubt)
    1. ZHORA
      -5
      6 February 2012 10: 54
      in the field of armored vehicles, China is already ahead of you with the help of Ukraine, by the way ... in the field of aircraft industry, it’s catching up with or caught up with, their air defense systems are also good ...
      1. 0
        6 February 2012 11: 04
        Well, how about that !!
        Where to China without the help of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex!
        You also upgraded the tanks to rodents, so what? We have very well studied your modernization.
        1. ZHORA
          0
          6 February 2012 11: 11
          Air defense systems?
          1. Eugene
            +2
            6 February 2012 11: 34
            This is probably why the Chinese bought at the beginning of the 90s S-300, tried to copy, tried, tried to spit, and also bought a S-300.

            With the aircraft carrier, too, I think the Chinese are happy with the "present" in the form of a Varyag with his boiler and turbine installation, Kuzya did not get out of repairs because of her, but the truth should be sent for modernization, finally.

            And their aircraft, naturally better than our su-35s, are intended. And their strategic bombers (the heavily remade Tu-16s of the 60s) are very cool, where our White Swan and the Bear are before them. lol
            1. doktoraikasap
              -4
              6 February 2012 17: 16
              Quote: Eugene
              With an aircraft carrier too, I think the Chinese are happy with a "present" in the form of a Varyag with his boiler and turbine installation,

              The scattered documentation was leaked to the Chinese people in 97-98 for 830000 patriotic rubles. Oops ... fellow
              Quote: Eugene
              The White Swan and the Bear before them.

              The Chinese strategist will fly before PAK YES.
        2. Splin
          +2
          6 February 2012 11: 24
          Armored vehicles in the form of tanks were supplied to the Georgians by Czechs with modernization by Israel. By the way, at that time they excelled Russian. It’s just that more good singers come out from Georgians than soldiers.
          1. doktoraikasap
            -4
            6 February 2012 17: 17
            Quote: Splin
            Armored vehicles in the form of tanks were supplied to the Georgians by Czechs with modernization by Israel.

            Yeah, in the Lviv BTRZ.
            Quote: Splin
            It’s just that more good singers come out from Georgians than soldiers.

            Everything was planned there by the occupants - weekend and summer dismissal, the tanks were without crews.
        3. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 17: 13
          Quote: submariner
          Where to China without the help of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex!

          Yes - gas turbine engines, drives, Bison ...
          Quote: submariner
          You also upgraded the tanks to rodents, so what?

          And there is no Tu-22M3 ...
          Quote: submariner
          We have studied your upgrade very well.

          It won't help, you don't have the technological capabilities to do it. And even Belarusians buy "it" from us.
      2. +1
        6 February 2012 11: 20
        Yeah, catching up with the engine resource in 160 hours;))) laugh ??
        1. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 17: 18
          Quote: urzul
          Yeah, catching up with the engine resource in 160 hours;))) laugh ??

          Yeah, with 4 flying Tu-160s and without engine production for 17 years ... request
      3. gans
        0
        6 February 2012 13: 56
        Zhorik do not confuse soft with hard, with the help of Ukraine you can only become a pauper, and nobody needs your planes except Russia
        1. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 17: 20
          Quote: gans
          and nobody needs your planes except Russia

          And why is it such a territory as the Rassey Federation, suddenly decided to go down and buy in the pose of cancer - Ukrainian planes ??? fellow
          1. klop_mutant
            0
            6 February 2012 21: 21
            Cancer is a pose in which ukry stands behind the Racean denyushki. We will also be able to buy from NATO, and you, apart from us, will push your own trash to us.
      4. doktoraikasap
        -4
        6 February 2012 17: 12
        Quote: JORA
        in the field of armored vehicles, China is already ahead of you with the help of Ukraine, by the way ... in the field of aircraft industry is catching up

        Also with us.
  12. 0
    6 February 2012 11: 06
    its closest competitor is the Russian Iskander, which is worth about $ 1 billion.

    And where did this figure come from? maybe it's for the Iskander regiment after all?
    diesel generators will be acquired from the USA

    Fuel and lubricants for them, too, will be pulled from there?
    1. -1
      6 February 2012 11: 21
      And then they will spare parts in the amount of 1 billion dollars and ship;))
    2. Splin
      0
      6 February 2012 11: 26
      One watermelon is the development of the complex, and not its cost.
  13. -1
    6 February 2012 11: 17
    "NATO is not too enthusiastic about the military initiatives of Ukraine, which, before being accepted into the alliance of Hungary, Slovakia and Bulgaria, demanded the disbandment of missile units." When will it finally come that NATO does not need SUCH cooperation? As well as a strong, really independent Ukraine! We need a foothold for our own military formations and obedience, which will be ensured by the complete absence of our own weapons.
    1. sas
      sas
      0
      6 February 2012 11: 44
      After all, Russia also does not need a truly independent Ukraine.
      1. -1
        6 February 2012 12: 13
        Times change. Rulers come and go, but the people remain. I think, ideally: a single people - a single state. But at the moment it’s utopia.
        1. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 17: 23
          Quote: Ribwort
          I think, ideally: a single people - a single state.

          Yes, a single Ukrainian state of European mentality.
          1. spirin199
            0
            8 February 2012 09: 43
            Bandera what kind of mentality do you poouas tell the whole story on a freebie lived at the expense of Russian creatures
        2. maolex
          0
          12 February 2012 15: 24
          I agree completely about utopia for a given period of time, there was a moment when there was a choice between Yanukovych and Yushchenko - then everything could happen, but now there was a line of rejection between people, which was justified by nothing
      2. doktoraikasap
        -6
        6 February 2012 17: 22
        Quote: Sas
        After all, Russia also does not need a truly independent Ukraine.

        And why do you think this whole pig screech? The Ukrainian army in terms of combat readiness - better than the Russian one, increased the budget by a third, launched a number of army equipment programs, is actively upgrading equipment ...
        This squalor of some gnaws ... love
        1. klop_mutant
          0
          6 February 2012 21: 22
          Boo-ha-ha. This is not for you, ukrov, in case the military units for non-payment without electricity remained?
  14. +1
    6 February 2012 11: 33
    Ukrainian air defense
    1. doktoraikasap
      -5
      6 February 2012 17: 24
      подводник,
      fool
    2. sas
      sas
      -3
      6 February 2012 19: 18
      Russian air defense. So you have nothing to rejoice at.
      1. ytqnhfk
        0
        7 February 2012 01: 50
        In 90, in Latvia, in cartoons, pigs were tied to pigs before the border, they spent all their childhood and pork, and everything else is and will be with it, but it already is !!!!!!!!!!
  15. MURANO
    +1
    6 February 2012 11: 48
    Quote: submariner
    Ukrainian air defense

    Thank God that not all people in Russia think like you.
    Your actions fit well with the plan of overseas friends about the collapse of the Slavic world. Continue. They are glad.
    1. 0
      6 February 2012 11: 57
      MURANO
      Man, do not be offended!
      I really love you as brothers!
      I have a Ukrainian wife!
      But you have rotten sheep — don’t deny it, my comments are sent to them.
      When I was 10 years old, we went to western Ukraine to a Kalush emergency camp. We talked with the local population. And even then I was very surprised by the attitude of Westerners towards us-Russian children — we hated to put it mildly!

      I hope you are not one of them!
      1. Splin
        +2
        6 February 2012 12: 07
        There is a black sheep in any herd. It’s not worth generalizing all zapadentsev under a single banner. I served for some time in the West, I often come to visit. I do not see a bias for speaking Russian, even in Lviv. The main thing is not to rub yourself with your charter in a foreign monastery. This is how to prove to the American that the Soviet people endured the great burden of World War II. And the money doesn’t smell, they take Russian rubles.
      2. ab
        ab
        -3
        6 February 2012 12: 20
        Quote: submariner
        to put it mildly, they hated us

        and it was, to put it mildly, for what ....
        1. +3
          6 February 2012 12: 32
          And why can you hate children who came for a short time from the Subpolar North, who are 10 years old !?
          Did we offend someone?
          How can you hate children?

          Moreover, such an attitude was even from women!

          Well, as for the Israelis, you just like to kill and do not bear any responsibility for it! But soon the Lafa will probably end! We will help Iran in everything!
          The enemy of my enemy is my friend!
          1. lightforcer
            -5
            6 February 2012 13: 16
            Well, as for the Israelis, you just like to kill and do not bear any responsibility for it!

            God forgive this Thy servant, for he does not know what he writes and thinks about. It is the Arabs who kill Jewish children and talk about it smiling. If this is normal, then why are you whining that they don’t like Russians? They deserve it. It’s time for medical schools to adopt a law on criminal liability for the denial of the Holocaust, like all civilized countries.

            PS Why the hell did Iran become a friend of Russia? They vetoed, and enough of these monkeys. You patriots love to poke into history, and so Iran is a long-standing enemy of Russia.
            1. +1
              6 February 2012 13: 57
              1. Russia has only two friends: the Army and the Navy.
              The rest are just partners.
              2. We didn’t take a seat in the queue called "Love the Russians", and we absolutely do not give a shit about anyone's feelings about some kind of denial.
              3. Teach the right prayers.
              4. Well, if you are ashamed of your ancestors, why do you need to remember this?
              5. Poke women between the legs.
              1. lightforcer
                -4
                6 February 2012 14: 37
                absolutely do not care about someone else's feelings about some kind of denial.

                Why are there such tantrums about the participation of the war in the USSR, the Russian genocide, the Holodomor? You do not care. If you do not care at all, what in Syria and Iran have forgotten?
                Learn the right prayers

                I will not pray for the chosen Lord in two forms.
                1. -1
                  6 February 2012 15: 14
                  1. The Holodomor - what is it? (Is this what they came up with in Ukraine?) Not at all in the subject!
                  2. What tantrums about the participation of the war in the USSR? Well, it was, well, they won!
                  3. Russian genocide is about the Baltic? Well, yes there is genocide, but we’re not hysterical. On the contrary, the Baltic states are already scratching the door (by the way). The fact is that the EEC just doesn’t give money, it makes us work (not like the USSR built the plants ). They want to eat, they ask for loans, but we give them a message.
                  4. Iran and Syria are our sales market, and as capitalism teaches, they beat the muzzle and take out the brain. Moreover, our base in Syria.
                  5. I tell you about real church prayers, and you persecute some blizzard.
                  1. doktoraikasap
                    -2
                    6 February 2012 17: 32
                    Quote: submariner
                    Holodomor - what is it?

                    For such, you need to crush the caterpillar. am
                    1. -2
                      6 February 2012 17: 51
                      Why are you nervous, are you a victim of the famine?
                      At that time, hunger was not only in Ukraine .........
                      1. doktoraikasap
                        -3
                        6 February 2012 18: 17
                        Quote: Rebus
                        Why are you nervous, are you a victim of famine? At that time, hunger was not only in Ukraine .........

                        Bitch teeth knock out a little ... angry
                      2. -2
                        6 February 2012 18: 58
                        Quote: doktoraikasap
                        Bitch teeth knock out a little ...

                        You are the victim, open your mouth less ... am
                      3. sas
                        sas
                        +3
                        6 February 2012 19: 38
                        "During that period, famine was not only in Ukraine"
                        And the blockade of the whole republic by detachments too?
                    2. spirin199
                      0
                      11 February 2012 11: 44
                      the halodomor was not only on ukroin, but at the time your friend Georgians
                  2. ab
                    ab
                    -1
                    6 February 2012 19: 39
                    Quote: submariner
                    4. Iran and Syria are our sales market, and as capitalism teaches, they beat the muzzle and take out the brain. Moreover, our base in Syria.


                    there is no such crime for which capitalism is not ready to go for 300% profit. (Marx)
                    1. 0
                      7 February 2012 10: 49
                      And we can (or whatever you like, we can) - we are Russians!
                  3. lightforcer
                    -1
                    6 February 2012 19: 50
                    You see, already in confusion began to play. About Iran and Syria is true, in principle, this applies to the Serbs, and therefore abandoned them. I do not teach prayers, we are not Orthodox. We are multicultural and tolerant.
              2. doktoraikasap
                -4
                6 February 2012 17: 31
                Quote: submariner
                Russia has only two friends: the Army and the Navy.

                More fools and roads ... fool
                1. +2
                  7 February 2012 01: 50
                  Fools and roads are the trouble of Russia
                  1. doktoraikasap
                    -2
                    7 February 2012 11: 04
                    Quote: Heinrich Ruppert
                    Fools and roads are the trouble of Russia

                    Well, what am I talking about? A plus!
                2. 0
                  7 February 2012 10: 54
                  As for fools, so that you know, this is our favorite fairy-tale character (Ivan the Fool)! And what? And we are proud! He poured all the pills and took the princess as a wife! Ipen, so the queen! good

                  What fairy tales do you have?

                  Do you have them!
                  1. doktoraikasap
                    -1
                    7 February 2012 11: 37
                    Quote: submariner
                    As for fools, so that you know, this is our favorite fairy-tale character (Ivan the Fool)! And what?

                    In-in, and I'm talking about ... Tales is a projection of mentality. And also your national heroes - lodars lying on the stove, which we actually know and see - you cannot create and do anything.
                    Quote: submariner
                    And what? And we are proud!

                    It's good!
                    Quote: submariner
                    He poured all the pills and took the princess as a wife! Ipat-so the queen!

                    Not so fast the tale affects, not so fast the thing is done ... As dreamed by fools.
                    Quote: submariner
                    What fairy tales do you have?

                    Quote: submariner
                    Do you have them!

                    We have everything, not only the songs "we are walking across the field with a horse" and "oh frost-frost", but also "evening bells" ... lol
                    Quote: submariner
                    What fairy tales do you have?

                    Kotygoroshko is a hero, he saved and defeated everyone.
                    Pan-Kotsky - outwitted everyone.
                    Ivasyk-telesyk - outwitted and all is well.
                    Well, etc. ... Forming fairy tales - strength, cunning, judiciousness, resourcefulness and intelligence ... Not Ivan the fool - who has everything all of a sudden and Nashara without miracle ... lol
                    http://nashakazka.org.ua/
                    1. 0
                      7 February 2012 11: 50
                      Well, that's why we are rich, we have everything, because only we can have everything right away and on the ball!
                      Your tales will be revered, I will feel your projection of metallicity.
                      1. doktoraikasap
                        0
                        7 February 2012 12: 24
                        Quote: submariner
                        because only with us everything can be done right away and on the ball!

                        No, it is you who achieve the scoop - which you have been created. The mediocrities cannot even take what lies beneath their feet. This year begins a decline in oil production in Russia, which was drunk by the Ivan fools - Ukrainians. Even now, there is not enough gas for ourselves before the elections and for export.
                    2. spirin199
                      0
                      11 February 2012 11: 46
                      when a crest was born the Jews sobbed
            2. spirin199
              0
              11 February 2012 11: 42
              Russia even tries to conduct an independent policy, and you even have special services to the Americans, who are considered to be a warrior, Ukrointsy and Russians have died more than all Jews in history and for some reason, the zapod doesn’t really care how much they say about the Holocaust, but no
          2. doktoraikasap
            -3
            6 February 2012 17: 30
            подводник,
            that submarine vif love ...
            1. 0
              7 February 2012 10: 56
              Well, here's what I wrote, I did not understand! And what about the map?
              1. doktoraikasap
                0
                7 February 2012 11: 42
                Quote: submariner
                Well, here's what I wrote, I did not understand! And what about the map?

                That submarine vif lav - I give an old map of the best air defense in Europe. love
                1. 0
                  7 February 2012 11: 51
                  Thank you, but she is like a fifth leg to a dog.
          3. ab
            ab
            -3
            6 February 2012 19: 33
            Quote: submariner
            And why can you hate children who came for a short time from the Subpolar North, who are 10 years old !?
            Did we offend someone?
            How can you hate children?

            Well, I see, this is how you separate American or Georgian children from the policies of their governments. ? Ready to heal everyone. Be yourself people first, and then love your children
            1. 0
              7 February 2012 10: 59
              Well, here you are wrong!
          4. sas
            sas
            0
            6 February 2012 19: 35
            That's right, why did the NKVDshniki kill children in western Ukraine in the 39th and 44th? Give an answer, please.
            1. spirin199
              0
              11 February 2012 11: 48
              what kind of children are you carrying mine upa and beat them
        2. -2
          6 February 2012 14: 32
          Quote: ab
          and it was, to put it mildly, for what ....

          Why hate children?
          1. doktoraikasap
            -4
            6 February 2012 17: 34
            Quote: Rebus
            Why hate children?

            And how do you think that bird behaved there - since it behaves like that now? - Few "did not like" ...
            1. 0
              7 February 2012 11: 01
              Again, what did you write?
              Do you smoke anything?
        3. doktoraikasap
          -3
          6 February 2012 17: 29
          Quote: ab
          and it was, to put it mildly, for what ....

          Most importantly, the memory was fresh ... Yes
          1. 0
            7 February 2012 11: 02
            Well, there is a memory! laughing laughing
            1. doktoraikasap
              -3
              7 February 2012 11: 48
              Quote: submariner
              Well, there is a memory!

              Yes, there is - they don't like Russians anywhere. It is good that in the world Ukrainians and Russians are already divided, otherwise - "glory" was falling on the Ukrainians not on business.
              1. 0
                7 February 2012 11: 57
                And we didn’t get in line for this. They love, they do not like ........ We have loot.
                1. doktoraikasap
                  -2
                  7 February 2012 12: 21
                  Quote: submariner
                  We have loot.

                  For loot you can’t buy everything, even what’s for sale.
                  Quote: submariner
                  And we didn’t get in line for this. They love, dislike ...

                  You flock, snot about the imaginary "brotherhood" always smear on the monitor screen.
                  1. 0
                    7 February 2012 18: 36
                    They don’t block the gas for the brothers and don’t refuse cheese (hello to you from Onishchenko, are you still not up to date?)
              2. spirin199
                0
                11 February 2012 11: 49
                are you ukroinets you lyakh underelicts
      3. doktoraikasap
        -4
        6 February 2012 17: 26
        Quote: submariner
        I have a Ukrainian wife!

        Changed means, once this behavior.
        Quote: submariner
        And even then I was very surprised by the attitude of the zapadents to us-Russian children — they hated us, to put it mildly!

        Only inadequate.
        1. 0
          7 February 2012 11: 03
          Again! But what about his wife, did he want to say something?
      4. sas
        sas
        +2
        6 February 2012 19: 20
        And why do you hate you, didn’t bother to find out?
        1. 0
          7 February 2012 11: 04
          Yes, it was a long time ago!
    2. doktoraikasap
      -4
      6 February 2012 17: 28
      And who’s on the cheek?

      1. 755962
        0
        6 February 2012 21: 54
        It’s not enough for everyone to give away.
      2. beard999
        -1
        6 February 2012 23: 42
        Quote: doktoraikasap
        And who’s on the cheek?

        I see you have already taken your "cafe" by the cheek and drag yourself ...
        And again, we have this product in service http://www.kbptula.ru/rus/zencom/panzr.htm, and you are only in the picture. Poor things ...
        Try running through the Ukrainian murkers again, you’ll look at the pictures still wiped.
      3. 0
        7 February 2012 11: 08
        Well, we have such sweets! The current is thicker!
        laughing
        1. doktoraikasap
          -1
          7 February 2012 11: 49
          Quote: submariner
          Well, we have such sweets! The current is thicker!

          This is when the NATO fleet entered the Black Sea and the Russians had the hangman right there in the 2008th?
          1. spirin199
            0
            11 February 2012 11: 51
            what kind of things will you have when the Romanians incite you and it will be soon
  16. +1
    6 February 2012 12: 00
    A normal topic ------- money for the work of 160 enterprises of the military-industrial complex, KB Southern did not cope with such tasks.
    This is a hundred times better than purchasing imports, and we have nowhere to rush.
    The passage about obsolete Tornadoes and Grads especially liked the article - we have enough, and there are more than one echelon of shells for them.

    Recently, an article was about the fact that the Americans bought a couple of dozen Saiga carbines from Tula gunsmiths ---- so excuse me for the joy some had full pants.
    1. Eugene
      -2
      6 February 2012 12: 16
      I didn’t see the joy, but even if it was obvious, many people associate the shotgun with the American police and SWAT special forces, and they know a lot about this, but the fact that this special forces decided to buy Saigu caused respect, because For many years, the Americans developed their own weapons of this kind, destroyed a lot of money, and in the aggregate, Saiga turned out to be better.

      And tornadoes and Grads have significant drawbacks - range, accuracy, no guided ammunition (I’m not sure though), no modular loading - that is, you cannot immediately load a whole package into a launch stop, but you must insert each rocket separately.
    2. Splin
      +2
      6 February 2012 12: 23
      January 31 was Mo briefing on the defense industry. Peregrine Falcon became OTRK instead of multi-functional. A new missile with a range of = 300 km was developed for the S-150. In Ukraine, there are now complexes with a range of 75 km, so they refused the Sapsan anti-aircraft missile. They did not say anything about RCC for the complex. Apparently nothing to brag about. A new MLRS BM-21UM has long been adopted. Hurricanes and Tornadoes will be given new missiles and put on a unified chassis of a 4-axle KrAZ.
      1. Eugene
        0
        6 February 2012 13: 10
        And what's new in a rocket with a launch range of 150 km?

        For S-300PMU complexes, of which about 1500 in Russia:
        150 km (48N6 rocket)
        200 km (48N6E2 missile)
        40 km (9M96E1 rocket)
        120 km (9M96E2 rocket)

        For medium range, the Vityaz complex is being developed. For a large one there is the S-400 Triumph - the truth has not yet been fired at the maximum, but up to 500 km has been declared.
        Allegedly, the c500 is still being developed, but something I do not really believe.

        It is a pity there are no joint developments in this area and money would be saved and fraternal relations strengthened, so to speak.
        1. Splin
          +3
          6 February 2012 14: 22
          It’s not about the range and novelty of the rocket. Ukraine with its density of air defense and a territory of 150 km is enough for the eyes. Simply, with direct development, the state eliminates adjacent foreign enterprises. And this means all scheduled and technical work will be carried out at repair bases in the country. A container with missiles for Sapsan was planned as a replacement for the S-200 systems. But the military decided that it was not necessary to cross a crocodile with a hippopotamus and found a cheaper option. It’s not even a purchase of a license, but an independent development. Let's say drones and fighters Ukraine is not able to develop one, but here there is an opportunity to save.
          1. doktoraikasap
            -4
            6 February 2012 17: 41
            Quote: Splin
            Ukraine with its density of air defense and a territory of 150 km is enough for the eyes.


            Right.
            Quote: Splin
            Simply, with direct development, the state eliminates adjacent foreign enterprises.

            And there will be no Russians there anyway.
            Quote: Splin
            But the military decided that it was not necessary to cross a crocodile with a hippopotamus and found a cheaper option.

            No not like this.
            Quote: Splin
            It’s not even a purchase of a license, but an independent update

            Yeah.
            Quote: Splin
            Let's say drones and fighters Ukraine is not able to develop one

            UAV with Jews, fighters - we are modernizing ourselves.
            Quote: Splin
            and here is the opportunity to save.

            Nooo, rationally do and have your own. These are different things.
        2. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 17: 37
          Quote: Eugene
          For S-300PMU complexes, of which about 1500 in Russia:

          Lies...
          Quote: Eugene
          For the medium range, the Vityaz complex is being developed, for the large there is the S-400 Triumph - the truth has not yet been fired at the maximum, but up to 500 km has been claimed. Allegedly, the c500 is still being developed, but I do not really believe something.

          200 km and it does not always fly. We don’t need to lie and ride in the evening.
          1. klop_mutant
            -1
            6 February 2012 21: 25
            And proofs that do not always fly, do you pack? Ah, ukrotroll?
    3. gans
      -1
      6 February 2012 14: 01
      and why not rejoice, bought from us and not from you, especially Pindos spoiled with weapons
      1. +4
        6 February 2012 14: 44
        Well, so do not be discouraged when they buy something from us - or rather, rejoice. We are for you. You will be all the way for us.
        1. gans
          0
          6 February 2012 16: 03
          that's for sure, but armed with NATO-ek you waved. By the way, we still remember that you armed the Georgians, and for nothing
          1. +3
            6 February 2012 16: 18
            For nothing, not for nothing, I don’t know. But you also armed Georgia.
            And it’s necessary to arm someone --- you buy the Mistrals. We are exosets, maybe --- maybe we can get back and sell something of our own.
            Or do you think that NATO will not arm without us?
            1. Eugene
              -3
              6 February 2012 16: 38
              Give the facts of arming Georgia with Russia, after the arrival of Saakashvilli.

              Mistral / exoset should not be equated. KR could be purchased in Russia. But the Wunderwafle’s Mistral is tricky, there is a propeller from an electric motor and the best SENIT-9 system in NATO, and technology is transferred, not a piece of iron and an indication of which buttons to press.
              1. +2
                6 February 2012 17: 05
                And what about us Saakashvili? It doesn’t matter to us — Georgia is Georgia. Let’s say that they didn’t use co-pruned weapons from Principe. Yes, and if you look, I think there’s something in the initial period, although the initiative is NOT buy weapons from Russia came from saakashvili
                Quote: Eugene
                Mistral / exoset is not worth equal

                stands, stands --- against the background of the defense budgets of our countries, you have a big one - you bought a big ship, we have less we bought a rocket from the ship.
                Quote: Eugene
                moreover, technology was transferred, and not a piece of iron and an indication of which buttons to press

                and that our negotiations on these topics have gone so far? NAMERINIA still ---- and it was the best thing for us to do, and can and will do.
                Quote: Eugene
                KR could also be purchased in Russia

                Yes, we already have them, they remained from the USSR --- almost exactly the same as yours.
                And PRINCIPLE is ENOUGH for us ---- we don’t pretend to the Bosphorus, and we have something to protect the Danube from the Romanians with, if that.
                1. Eugene
                  -2
                  6 February 2012 22: 57
                  Distort.

                  1) There is no evidence of the sale of Georgia’s arms to Russia by Saakashvili, if suddenly there were then they were for a regime not so hostile to Russia as they are now. They didn’t have to take away from them?)) But Ukraine (the government) so wanted to equip Saakashvili, that even removed beeches from armament for this.

                  2) Still, it’s not worthwhile, if we consider the conversation in the plane of our relations (Russia-Ukraine) and we talked about it, then the Russian Federation could deliver missiles to Ukraine, and Ukraine couldn’t wash down the Mistral, there is the whole chip in this system management, without it he nafig is not needed. Plus an electric motor, which is neither in the Russian Federation nor in Ukraine.

                  3) Here I think our technology was jammed ... they do not want competition, and they were even afraid that Yanuk would sell it to the amers, like Oplot.

                  4) I'm talking about missiles for equipping ships for export.
                  1. 0
                    7 February 2012 13: 21
                    Quote: Eugene
                    There are no facts that Georgia sold arms to Russia before Saakashvili, if there were any, they were for a regime not so hostile towards Russia as now

                    Now you are distorting
                    Quote: Eugene
                    And Ukraine (the government) so wanted to arm Saakashvili,

                    Georgia was under the Embargo for the supply of weapons? But for Buki really insulting.
                    Quote: Eugene
                    Still, it’s not worth it if we consider the conversation in the plane of our relations (RF-Ukraine)

                    And why should we consider in the plane of our relations? Is this important?
                    Quote: Eugene
                    Russia could deliver missiles to Ukraine

                    And let’s say what Russia was able to deliver? What kind of RCC?
                    Quote: Eugene
                    what Yanuk will sell to amers, as a Bastion

                    did not know that Oplot was interested in amers
                    1. Eugene
                      -1
                      8 February 2012 00: 31
                      [quote] Georgia was under the Embargo on the supply of weapons? and for Buki really insulting. [/ quote]

                      It wasn’t, but to deliver to the opponent of the Russian Federation (albeit hypothetical) somehow not according to the CIS, slightly. Not to mention fraternally. And with beeches those who once served on it (former military personnel) were actually sent - mercenaries who later shot down our planes, which is all the more ugly. Do not agree?
                      [Quote]
                      why should we consider in the plane of our relations? Is it important? [/ quote]

                      We started a conversation with the idea that we could put each other and not look for markets on the side, and therefore suggested that we consider it.

                      [quote] Wait, you name what Russia could deliver? What kind of RCC? [/ quote]

                      Yahont. Vietnamese, Hindus like it. Well, Bramos, but I do not know at what stage everything is there.

                      [quote] [did not know that Oplot was interested in amers / quote]

                      Andrei Tarasenko wrote that either 3 or 4 strongholds had been sold, for study and shelling from promising BPSs.
                      1. -1
                        8 February 2012 14: 14
                        [quote = Eugene] Was not [/ quote]

                        This is enough [quote = Eugene] somehow not in the CIS, slightly. [/ Quote]
                        Who would say, especially after Tuzla [quote = Eugene] those who once served on it (former military personnel [/ quote]
                        there is no evidence, and to impute the actions of private individuals to the state is not at all that.
                        [quote = Eugene] Mistral / exoset should not be equal [/ quote
                        started with this yours should not be equal ---- continued with military budgets, and how you brought it under the plane of relations is known only to you.]
                        [quote = Eugene] that we could supply each other and not look for markets on the side [/ quote]
                        Strange to each other - you give us rockets, but we don’t give you anything, since you bought Mistral in France. [Quote = Eugene] Yakhont. Vietnamese, Hindus like it. [/ Quote]

                        And where will we put them? They are too heavy and overall for our frigates [quote = Eugene] Andrey Tarasenko wrote that either 3 or 4 strongholds were sold [/ quote]
                        There is a sign below --- T-80UD ----- and what's the difference if they wouldn’t buy from us then from Pakistan ---- Our tanks are not secret, they are goods on the arms market
              2. Splin
                +3
                6 February 2012 17: 23
                You can’t buy Russian anti-ship missiles, you didn’t sell it ... The Ukrainian corvette is a rival in the market to Russian models and quite serious, so when they turned to the Russians for help there they refused. Therefore, the plans are not yet 10 but only 4 troughs of the corvette class.
          2. doktoraikasap
            -5
            6 February 2012 17: 42
            Quote: gans
            that's for sure, but armed with NATO-ek you waved. By the way, we still remember that you armed the Georgians, and for nothing

            All of the above is excellent !!!
      2. doktoraikasap
        -4
        6 February 2012 17: 41
        Quote: gans
        bought something from us

        What did you buy?
    4. doktoraikasap
      -3
      6 February 2012 17: 36
      Quote: Kars
      The passage about obsolete Tornadoes and Grads especially liked the article - we have enough, and there are more than one echelon of shells for them.


      1. klop_mutant
        -1
        6 February 2012 21: 26
        Launchers from Soviet stocks.
        1. Splin
          0
          6 February 2012 21: 47
          In the photo there are new KrAZ trucks (cabs for sure). I don’t know the Soviet Grad on the basis of Kremenchuk cars, so it’s better to ask Odessa a question.
  17. MURANO
    +5
    6 February 2012 12: 06
    Quote: submariner
    we traveled to western Ukraine

    These are not Slavs. Everything is different with us. We would live separately, it would only be better.
    I understand you. good But we are a single country ... Therefore, it is necessary to be more correct.
    In Russia, there are also enough frostbitten.
    drinks This is how it should be.
    1. aironfirst
      +4
      6 February 2012 21: 55
      support drinks while we are fighting with each other with or without, our REAL ENEMY becomes stronger every day!
      For him, it would be beyond all dreams that Russia and Ukraine would cling to each other's throats, believe me!
      While we are tearing our throats, hammering claudia, insulting each other. spurred by all kinds of trolls, they stupidly laugh at us, like over rams, which they managed to push together with their foreheads.
  18. -4
    6 February 2012 12: 53
    Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
    There is a misfortune so these are your problems and draws anymore, you just need to set real tasks

    The election campaign in Ukraine was led by Medvedev, as a result: he failed miserably, and now this is not only a problem of Ukraine, but ours too !!
  19. 0
    6 February 2012 17: 12
    There is no need to argue who is cooler than the Russian Federation or Ukraine: there is only one example: Western weapons and other devices and mechanisms will be supplied to the projected frigato-corvette. And not because of the desire to "shit" the Russians. There is simply no production of all this in Ukraine. When there was the USSR, there was also cooperation. To the Nikolaev factories, where the ships were built, the "stuffing" came from all over the Union. Now this is not there. And the square in military shipbuilding stupidly falls into "zalizhnist" from the supply of weapons and equipment for ships either from Russia or from the West. That's all ... And who to depend on is a dumb choice of stupid Svidomo ...
    1. Splin
      +2
      6 February 2012 17: 47
      Equipment for the ship will be its own, domestic production. Weapon models can be developed, but is there any sense in this? The party is small, a decent amount to spend on development. Those. she will be paid for in the amount of the finished ship and not stand out much at the finish line with a competitor. Why such a waste. Russia is also able to develop its own UDC, but is buying it from the French. And does not feel the infringement of pride.
  20. VOEVODA
    -1
    6 February 2012 17: 27
    They do tank diesel engines well, but I doubt about the missile tactical complex.
    1. Splin
      +3
      6 February 2012 17: 56
      During the premiership, Yulka discussed Iskander's military purchases, but then they abandoned the idea. Probably not for nothing. Apparently the parameters of the Sapsan are better.
      1. +2
        6 February 2012 18: 04
        With Yulia, we already bought something from you - Dosipor does not disentangle.

        And is it just interesting that Ukraine needs such an expensive complex, albeit with excellent characteristics? And the price matters, and even the support of the domestic manufacturer ----- so everything is logical and appropriate.
        1. Splin
          +3
          6 February 2012 18: 14
          Ukraine needs such a complex. This is a cheap alternative to bomber aviation, which is not enough in Ukraine. If they bring to mind a container with RCC, coastal defense will grow significantly. Then, not only the Romanian, even the Turkish fleet, you can not be afraid.
          1. +1
            6 February 2012 18: 40
            Quote: Splin
            Ukraine needs such a complex

            they won’t hurt - but we still haven’t shot the Points, and in 2004 even the Scuds were in the warehouses --- my colleague guarded on an emergency.
            Quote: Splin
            This is a cheap alternative to bomber aircraft

            You are confusing something, the OTR is firstly not cheap, and secondly, it is not an alternative to bomber aviation.
            Quote: Splin
            If they bring to mind the container with RCC

            Several self-propelled batteries The shore is better, it would be possible to barter on the TKR Admiral Lobov.
            And the Romanian fleet is still optional.
            1. Splin
              +2
              6 February 2012 18: 59
              And what is this if not an alternative ?. Ever since the FAU-2, this is how it was. The aircraft is pressed daily and technical support, pilot training at least five years. And it’s not a fact that with an advanced air defense system the plane will still break through to the target. Old Skuda liquid rockets. Their preparation takes time. Point U is outdated, according to all the characteristics, although now it can enter right away.
              And the shore has an inappropriate range. He needs to turn around then aim, When land-based missile systems receive and enter target designations on the march and shoot from a short stop .. And the Romanians now have the third most powerful fleet and a very strong Danube flotilla.
              1. +1
                6 February 2012 19: 16
                Quote: Splin
                Ever since the FAU-2 it was

                It is strange then why the planes were preserved until now.
                Quote: Splin
                Daily and technical assistance, pilot training for at least five years

                And how many of these OTRs are in service? Iskander, for example, in Russia?
                Quote: Splin
                And it’s not a fact that with an advanced air defense system the plane will still break through to the target

                So OTR and designed to strike at the headquarters and positions of air defense so that the aircraft would break through.
                Quote: Splin
                When land based missile systems receive and enter target designations on the march and shoot from a short stop ..

                When it is still in large-scale execution, then there are obstacles, traps for missiles, they are fired by small-caliber artillery systems from ships --- again, there are few anti-ship missiles in any case, accounting for them is expensive, and exercises are even more expensive.
                Yes, the Romanian fleet - four frigates and Chetters of the corvette --- zero against coastal targets, the Danube flotilla --- several volleys of tornado
                we don’t have anything of them; they won’t arrange hunting in the neutral for merchant ships --- for this and you can get scouts in Bucharest
                1. Splin
                  +1
                  6 February 2012 19: 46
                  Think back to the history of rocketry. Until the early 0s, aircraft could not be replaced by missiles due to their low accuracy. Prada was such a bald "maize" Since the beginning of the 80s, all bomber aviation became multifunctional. Of course, it was cheaper to bomb the spirits in Afghanistan from above than to launch rockets, but in 91 Hussein could only respond with Scadam when the coalition was in the air. And he hit not at the headquarters, but at the accumulations of troops .. The headquarters and air defense systems are only part of the list of targets for the OTRK.

                  Now about Romania. An uncontrolled PC does not always get into a bridge, much less into a maneuvering gunboat. Yes, coastal artillery is needed and we have it, but it should complement the PRK complexes, and not be an alternative to it.
                  1. +1
                    6 February 2012 19: 59
                    Quote: Splin
                    but in the 91, Hussein could only answer with the Scuds, with the coalition fully in the air for a full year

                    let's not compare the USA with Romania or even Turkey
                    Quote: Splin
                    And he did not hit the headquarters, but on the concentration of troops

                    Actually, he hit the territory of Israel, not even talking about the fact that Scud is more tailored for special warheads
                    Quote: Splin
                    The air defense headquarters and facilities are only part of the list of targets for the OTRK.

                    And this is already how many missiles are there, you didn’t answer about the number of missiles in Russia, we have only a few hundred points.
                    Quote: Splin
                    Aircraft missiles until the 0's could not be replaced because of their low accuracy.

                    So they were replaced? And the accuracy of unguided weapons of aircraft is not much different even from the moon
                    Quote: Splin
                    You can’t always get into an uncontrolled RS in a bridge, much less in a maneuvering gunboat

                    Why would Tornado fall into the gunboat? It’s enough for her to get into combat fragmentation in order to lose her combat capability. And a tank on the shore for a gunboat is generally death.
                    1. Splin
                      +2
                      6 February 2012 20: 33
                      It’s hard for me to argue with you, because you reason not as a military or politically knowledgeable person, but as in a game on a computer. Which one has more and which performance characteristics are better.
                      1. +1
                        6 February 2012 21: 36
                        Quote: Splin
                        Which one has more and which performance characteristics are better

                        I’m just reasoning from the point of view of the military and economists. And you are reasoning obraztno. Rockets on trees do not grow, and if YOUR industry can launch 10 Operationally tactical missiles in a year, then you will not launch 10 more on the practice.

                        you can also bring lacunae in the logic of my statements - if you can of course.
                      2. Splin
                        +1
                        6 February 2012 22: 04
                        Above the Danube is Hungary Austria and several other countries. What MLRS. Forget it. densely populated Europe is not a territory where you can do without high-precision oryuzhiya. God forbid you to catch the civilian population. Western media will tear you up in an instant. What a rocket like the moon. Her main advantage was the delivery of nuclear charge. Romania is an EU member, so Brussels already has its own, even if it attacks first. Economically, you are right. would they make money. Missiles do not grow on trees, but Ukrainian industry is capable of making far more than 10 missiles per year.
                      3. +1
                        6 February 2012 23: 04
                        Quote: Splin
                        Above the Danube is Hungary Austria and several more countries

                        Are we already fighting a coalition? I thought we were considering a conflict with Romania
                        Quote: Splin
                        What MLRS

                        City, Hurricane, Tornado
                        Quote: Splin
                        Forget it. densely populated Europe is not a territory where you can do without precision precision

                        When is the territory of Romania narrowed to 70 km?
                        Quote: Splin
                        God forbid you to hook a civilian population

                        They, too, but if we apologize for anything --- the war is all the same. And I hope not we started it.
                        Quote: Splin
                        What a rocket like the moon. Her main advantage was the delivery of nuclear charge

                        Did I talk about any advantages? I compared the accuracy of free-falling bombs and unguided missiles --- they are in the same order
                        Quote: Splin
                        Economically, you are right. there would be money to make them

                        at least something pleases
                        Quote: Splin
                        You're right. would they make money. Missiles do not grow on trees, but Ukrainian industry is able to make much more 10 missiles per year

                        They said it before — there would be money, and for fun --- it’s possible to compare it with the United States --- on the first day of Yugoslavia they used over the 100 tamahawks alone ---- it’s not realistic for Ukraine to wage war DEAR OTR --- and vryatli our industry will be able to produce more 20-30 missiles, and I am still optimistic.
                        Quote: Splin
                        Romania is an EU member, so Brussels already has its own, even if it attacks first

                        Well, why do we need weapons at all, immediately give up the surrender.
                      4. Splin
                        -1
                        6 February 2012 23: 25
                        No, you are definitely not a military man. In any case, you do not have operational thinking. I really didn’t have time to enter the Academy either. Neighboring countries along the Danube are subject to environmental disaster. We are not NATO with impunity bridges as it was in Yugoslavia no one will attack. What area is covered by the Hurricane division, not to mention Smerch. The only case when Rumania was scared of us was in the mid-90s that they demanded that Snake Island be returned to them, and we sent a battalion of naval special forces there from Maysky Island. Now this part is not in Maisky (thanks to Yushchenko) and we don’t have a piece of the sea shelf.
                      5. -1
                        7 February 2012 13: 30
                        Quote: Splin
                        No, you definitely are not military
                        no, not military, but if it can be expressed then it’s more military than you.
                        Quote: Splin
                        Neighboring countries along the Danube are subject to environmental disaster

                        strange logic, don’t touch civilians, now an environment-friendly catastrophe (like the Hungarians lead plants explode and arsenic in the Danube flies so nothing, but we can’t drown a dozen canaries anyway - what’s going to change - the Danube is the most dirty .. river Europe and so) and this in light of
                        Quote: Splin
                        Above the Danube is Hungary Austria and several more countries

                        I focus on the word ABOVE
                        Quote: Splin
                        What area is covered by the Hurricane division, not to mention the Tornado.


                        Tornado 650 000 square meters
                        Quote: Splin
                        them the serpent island

                        the island remained, and it was necessary not to save on lawyers --- they could be worse than the special forces battalion
                      6. Splin
                        0
                        7 February 2012 20: 18
                        I have a cousin, a little over 20. The family gathered that year for her engagement. My dad, me, my brother are purely military. The uncle is also a military man, but he was not lucky. Three daughters and not a single boy. So they drank and started talking on a single topic. Uncle, he generally passed the Afghan cap. And they asked the groom such garbage, will you go to defend the countries ?. And he is a nerd, in his last year at university. There was so much browade. Well, plus ignorance and alcohol. After a couple of months, went fishing for the winter. Actually, there was no winter in December. They took him with them. It was the worst fishing in recent years. He whined like that these two days. Can’t do anything. Throw it in the field in the summer and it will die.
                        So now you remind me of it by talking.
                      7. -1
                        8 February 2012 00: 46
                        Quote: Splin
                        So now you remind him of me by talking

                        Simply put, you can not refute my considerations?
                        Quote: Splin
                        And he is a nerd, in his last year at university. There was so much browade

                        for a border conflict with romania do you intend to use students of the last courses of teacher training institutes?

                        And in general, why your retreat and excursion into your personal life ---- on the topic, you could not substantiate a single statement, brought a bunch of ridiculous arguments, are unfamiliar with the tasks of using aviation, artillery and tactical missiles, as well as their characteristics and economic factors ---- even with geography it is not very special over the course of the Danube. What command do you want to conclude?
                        Quote: Splin
                        Ukraine needs such a complex. This is a cheap alternative to bomber aircraft

                        And this pearl is just ready on the board of honor.
                        You didn’t even think of such a corn mailer, it was enough only to curtail work on the barrel artillery.
                      8. Splin
                        0
                        8 February 2012 09: 10
                        And I always rely on my personal experience on my life. Just before that, I lowered the ligaments. You still do not understand my monologue. You can be technically savvy, know all the subtleties in other aspects, but in real life you will face completely different sides of the problem. As the French say, "war is like war." It's like a young letekha comes to the troops and they say to him "Forget everything that you were taught in school." Just don't pull this phrase out of context again as with a student. There is a multifaceted concept in it. You do not need to stand up to prove only your innocence. For example, I admitted that the economic state of Ukraine does not allow it to massively rearm. A soldier or a young officer should not count how much his work costs. This is a warrantor in Soviet times, with every shot of a cannon, they could say, "Here's a pair of boots flew" Along the Danube, you again think like a physicist and mathematician. The coastal zone is polluted regardless of the current and above and below. Fauna ... Fish can swim up the river. Storks and ducks that nest at the mouth of the Danube fly over to Balaton. on the Rhine and other factors that you do not consider. Unknowingly, I don't know much either
                        Speaking of Khrushchev.
                        He not only curtailed programs for the barrel artillery. Under him, the entire assault aviation was cut, front-line bombers were breathing. And this is the range of R-17, Oka, Iskander and Sapsan (in terms of aging)
                      9. -1
                        8 February 2012 14: 33
                        Quote: Splin
                        And I always rely on my personal experience on my life

                        They fought, planned military actions, if not, then you contradict yourself by commenting on the military component.
                        Quote: Splin
                        It has a multifaceted concept

                        Quote: Splin
                        It has a multifaceted concept

                        What versatility in stdent batan --- project on the population of Ukraine is ridiculous.
                        Quote: Splin
                        I admit, I admitted that the economic condition of Ukraine does not allow it to massively rearm

                        What a sacrifice, to admit common truth, but to think otherwise it was, well, very very optimistic
                        Quote: Splin
                        A soldier or a young officer should not consider how much his work is worth.

                        Did I say somewhere that they should consider something? There is someone to consider for them.
                        Quote: Splin
                        The coastal zone is polluted regardless of the course and above and below

                        Honestly, but can it be more detailed than the pollution of the coastal territory upstream, preferably several hundred km --- we won’t arrange a battle on the border of Romania and the neighboring state --- from a volley of MLRS Smerch fragmentation ordnance for a group of gunboats. .Romania?
                        Quote: Splin
                        Fauna ... Fish can swim up the river. Storks and ducks that nest at the mouth of the Danube fly to Balaton. on the Rhine and other factors that you do not take into account

                        And with what joy should they be taken into account at all? Especially considering that thousands of tons of waste are poured into the Danube and without any war? Do you already climb into the jungle--
                        Quote: Splin
                        When he cut the entire attack aircraft, front-line bombers breathed
                        Well, not quite like that, but it’s just a stone in your garden ----------- Breathed in the wings, and once Su-25, SU-24 appeared, it turned out that they could not be replaced with missiles, self-propelled guns and new barrel artillery systems appeared - and the top-notch replacement of bomber aircraft, this can be met with a stretch of MLRS even at short distances.
                      10. Splin
                        0
                        8 February 2012 15: 06
                        I'm tired and I see no reason to fight with "windmills", If you want, let it be your truth. Who needs who knows the facts. Yes, I consider the Ukrainian people nerds, and even more cattle. Not in the word as it was born, but in their preparation. And not only citizens of Ukraine, but also of Russia and Belarus. In different proportions, but still. How a pastry bakes boots. Everyone should mind their own business. Theorists like you voted on December 1, 91 for Independence and in 2004 brought Yushch to power

                        Khrushchev was removed in the 64th. Only Il-28 (appeared under Stalin) and Su-7 were with him. Attack aircraft was not finally, as a kind of troops. After his departure, the Su-17, MiG-27, in the seventies Su-24 and at the end of their Su-25 appeared. This can be read from books, but the hypothetical fantasies of the first part of the conversation leave your own opinion. Life will show...
                      11. 0
                        8 February 2012 18: 05
                        Quote: Splin
                        You want, let your truth be. Who needs someone, knows the facts

                        Here you are right - my truth, you were not even able to bring facts that do not fit into my logic.
                        Quote: Splin
                        Yes, I consider the Ukrainian people to be nerds, and even more cattle

                        But I don’t count it that way, but I don’t forbid you to take it like that - you also relate to them - that means you consider yourself a nerd and cattle, about a batan, so you have confirmed this in a polemic.
                        Quote: Splin
                        Theorists like you voted 1 on December 91 for Independence
                        Russia also celebrates Independence Day, and it is the ruling elite that is to blame for the collapse of the USSR; people don’t have to blame people for it — local tsars in Belovezhka provided kingdoms for themselves.
                        Quote: Splin
                        He not only curtailed programs for the barrel artillery. When he cut the entire attack aircraft, front-line bombers breathed

                        Arrived and now have cut the trash? Well, you focused attention, then?
                        Quote: Splin
                        After his departure appeared Su-17, MiG-27, in the seventies Su-24 and at the end of their Su-25

                        it was written as if I wrote that SU-25 was received during Khrushchev’s
                        Quote: Splin
                        and hypothetical fantasies of the first part of the conversation leave yourself an opinion

                        Are you talking about OTR as a cheap aviation substitute? Is this your fantasy
                2. Eugene
                  -2
                  6 February 2012 23: 01
                  Scuds are not painfully accurate, and with a conventional warhead. Weak weapons against a NATO country with their defense of any NATO country under attack.
                  1. -1
                    7 February 2012 13: 31
                    But something boasted Petriot could not intercept them all, and those that could all did not destroy their warheads in the air.
                    1. Eugene
                      -1
                      8 February 2012 00: 45
                      A subtle point, the data on captured skads - 6% -30% depending on the source of the information and the question of what is considered an interception? Destruction of warheads? But in many cases the petriot didn’t knock down the warhead, but dismissed it from the target with its own explosion.
                      As a result of the shelling of approximately 90 rockets, 3 Israelis were killed, and 23 amer soldiers were killed with one rocket and more than 100 were injured. As you can see, the performance is not great, I am sure that the low accuracy of the scads, combined with the knockback, also had a hand in this.

                      And as I wrote above, Ukraine no longer has scads.
                      1. -1
                        8 February 2012 14: 43
                        [quote = Eugene] With 2011, Ukraine no longer has scads. [/ quote
                        Something I didn’t hear that the Scuds were cutting in 2011,
                        But they were removed from service even with the union.
                        Well, in principle, you can also add Zenith or Dnieper warheads, or Satan from a monument in front of Yuzhmash to bring to feelings (joke)]
                        [quote = Eugene] As you can see, the performance is not great, I'm sure that the low accuracy of the scads, combined with the knocking off the course, also had a hand in this [/ quote]
                        Well, let's say not Skudov, but El Huseynov --- and no one referred to the accuracy of the scads, and El Huseynov did not refer all the more --- especially since Saddam did not dare to use warheads filled with chemical weapons.
                3. Eugene
                  -1
                  8 February 2012 00: 35
                  for this and scouts in Bucharest can be obtained


                  Since 2011 Ukraine has no more scopes.
        2. doktoraikasap
          -4
          6 February 2012 18: 21
          Quote: Kars
          And is it just interesting that Ukraine needs such an expensive complex, albeit with excellent characteristics? And the price matters, and even the support of the domestic manufacturer ----- so everything is logical and appropriate.

          It will be a normal price, and in total - even with the development is cheaper than buying somewhere. And if you sell Iskander in competition - then the net benefit. fellow
      2. doktoraikasap
        -4
        6 February 2012 18: 20
        Quote: Splin
        During the premiership, Yulka discussed Iskander's military purchases, but then they abandoned the idea.

        There was no such thing, and Yulia wasn’t doing anything. About Iskander, several (two) piarasts shouted for us - one active, the other passive - also a tandem.
        1. Splin
          +2
          6 February 2012 18: 28
          I will not prove. What for?. This was not discussed at a meeting of the Cabinet of Ministers, but at the General Staff. Peregrine Falcon is better, but there was no money for its development. Replace the Point with something necessary. Therefore, they considered the export version of Iskander. Yanyk came, the money went and abandoned this idea.
    2. doktoraikasap
      -1
      6 February 2012 18: 18
      Quote: VOEVODA
      They do tank diesel engines well, but I doubt about the missile tactical complex.

      Well, the best "voivoda" did it themselves !!! .... laughing
      1. klop_mutant
        -1
        6 February 2012 21: 27
        Who! Ukry? Tada USSR was hundreds of specialized design bureaus. Now without any research institutes ukry even a tank engine for 1500ls cannot be made, they are torturing all the Soviet legacy.
  21. Sovok
    -2
    6 February 2012 18: 23
    bad news .... dera Russian military school merge NATO. it’s time for Putin to take the example of America ... and to finance a new revolution in Kiev. how they finance the orange and support Russian banderlogs. and in Ukraine there are enough willing. all Bandera and nobility are disgusting. I am a Kiev citizen. I fought in Bosnia and not as a Bandera which the Kiev authorities help in Georgia. If everything starts, I remember them and more like me. We will clear the baderlogs and add Canada-NEW WIDE UKRAINTS.
  22. Odesit
    -1
    6 February 2012 18: 47
    What kind of armaments of themselves and NATO can be discussed when I apologize ass - naked!
    The country is in real ruin, the army receives a cash allowance with a delay of a month! Police do not receive new vehicles.
    The senior officer buys a uniform for his own money, the rank and file "rivets shoulder straps" on leather jackets - because uniforms (especially winter quartermasters do not give out - they save)!
    It's time to understand, the Ukrainian project collapsed! The state as such does not exist.
    As one dear comrade General in the Glavka said (this is when I was on a business trip in Kiev), "I COULD BE MOVED TO RUSSIA, I WOULD RUN WITHOUT LOOKING EVEN ON THE COLONEL'S POSITION!"
    UKRAINE IS A SWAMP!
    WEAPONS, WEAPONS- ASS Naked AND THERE!
    Pensioners cannot pay for utilities, cops' benefits have been cut, soldiers - conscripts on the street "shoot" cigarettes! What is this state ?! The attitude towards the state flag is extremely negative!
    A SHAME!!!
    It's time to return to MATUS RUSSIA! UNTIL IT'S NOT TOO LATE!
    Ask the officers how they live here ?! And then talk!
    1. Sovok
      0
      6 February 2012 19: 01
      He’ll put the case on. Under a bike about armament of the army, technology is being sold for boxes of NATO matches. And the country is falling apart, bitterly on your soul. Plus you a friend. Although I’ll give moral support. God will be better. fellow
      1. +3
        6 February 2012 19: 22
        Firstly, NATO will fall apart faster than Ukraine will accept it. Yes, and we need NATO as a stop signal.

        Quote: Odess
        The country is in real ruin, the army receives a cash allowance with a delay of a month! Police do not receive new vehicles.

        I don’t know, probably Zaporozhye somehow differs from the rest of the country, my acquaintances from the air defense say nothing of the kind.

        We also treat the flag normally.
        So you write already scary becomes
        1. Odesit
          -1
          6 February 2012 19: 29
          Dear CARS!
          I write the truth as it really is!
          With respect!
          We have a "UAZ" not as they can not buy a new one. And the old one is already 24 years old. Is it normal?
          Sergeants complain they do not give out PR (baton). How to defend yourself, if that ?!
          We are driven into a dead end, from which it will be very difficult to get out!
          The country goes to the bottom!
          And you understand that perfectly!
          5 rounds of ammunition are issued for firing, and this is what you think is enough for an officer during training ?!
          Glory to GOD that everyone has their own "barrel" and their own cartridges!
          UKRAINE NEVER BEEN A STATE AND NEVER BECOMES THEM!
          THIS IS OUR RUSSIAN PROVINCE!
          1. +1
            6 February 2012 20: 07
            Quote: Odess
            UKRAINE NEVER BEEN A STATE AND NEVER BECOMES THEM!

            She has already become one. As the world community recognized him.

            On the ground floor there lives a policeman from the line department ------- he lives normally. PPSnikov are hanging around the district --- all with batons and fattened faces. About traffic cops --.... I don’t speak at all.
            And if we honestly have an army, this is a bunch of parasites, I, as an enthusiast of military equipment, deal with such (our office leases land from the HF through sublease --- there is also a penny) generally shocked --- and they still have an early retirement, with the union, okay - the war could start even tomorrow, but now.

            And don’t say that you think that as soon as we join Russia, it will become better for us to live? I don’t believe in this --- it’s worse, they’ll scream, and the younger brother will be the best expression.
            1. Odesit
              -5
              6 February 2012 20: 51
              Dear CARS!
              I am used to treating YOU with RESPECT, for one simple reason that you are a literate person!
              Sorry, please, but now YOU wrote "PURPLE"!
              You know the most important rule of communication in the "network" - ALWAYS BE ADEQUATEN!
              WITH RESPECT!
              And I respect the linear transporters too! Although I’m a wanted man of regional subordination ..
              1. 0
                6 February 2012 21: 40
                I wrote as I see my life and life around.
                I’m also ready to answer for my opinion. I do not pretend to be right in the last resort, but I think as I wrote.
                1. Odesit
                  0
                  6 February 2012 22: 07
                  KARSU
                  Ok, let's figure it out Dear!
                  You were also wrong in many ways! WE'LL KEEP THINKING!
                  WITH A THINKING PERSON ALWAYS YOU CAN FIND A GENERAL LANGUAGE.
                  THINKING TO FIND IT IS A GENERAL LANGUAGE WITH YOU!
              2. general
                -1
                9 February 2012 20: 01
                Dear Odessa - you seem like an ADEQUATE boob! laughing
        2. Sovok
          -1
          6 February 2012 19: 59
          kars, here’s your friend history, the flag of Ukraine, one of the Swedes Mazepa received for betrayal of his own .may be proud. a royal gift and a trident -will- on the old-fashioned gift from one of the nobility nobles. straight from Poland didn’t rot yosh. to the great prince VLADIMIR. Yes, they knew that the descendants would do KIY.SCHEK and sister LYBING sailed to the Turk and not Kiev and Great Russia could not have been. remember how the princes of KIEVSK RUSSIA collapsed and compare with the USSR. and then we repeat the same mistake, and the Mongol Americans were already close for the first time the Slavs barely survived 300 years here. and for wise men, NO MOSCOW RUSSIA BEGINNED NO KIEV FINISHED.
          1. +4
            6 February 2012 20: 35
            Quote: Sovok
            history flag of ukraine juwto-blakitnu od swedes Mazepa

            Yes, I somehow do not care what it used to be ----- why live in the past? It’s enough to know.
            We live in the new Ukraine and that’s it.
            I was more comfortable with the USSR (just look at the profile picture) --- but it is no longer there, and there will be no second.
            1. Odesit
              +2
              6 February 2012 22: 35
              KARSU
              WILL RUSSIAN EMPIRE !!!!!
              AND WE WILL PUSH THESE AMERO-JEWISH SUPPORTERS!
              1. doktoraikasap
                -5
                6 February 2012 22: 52
                Quote: Odess
                WILL RUSSIAN EMPIRE !!!!!

                What will happen? Is that a bunch of schizovrenics like you? It will not be - as it is not already. request
                Quote: Odess
                AND WE WILL PUSH THESE AMERO-JEWISH SUPPORTERS!

                If necessary, we will crush you with Kostuseva-Kivalov-Markov in one Warfalamean night. fellow
                1. Odesit
                  0
                  7 February 2012 01: 38
                  Markov will crush you himself, the poor Khokhlyatsky! PARTY MOTHERLAND IN ODESSA, THE STRONGEST OF ALL
                  WE HAVE POWER, MONEY AND OPPORTUNITIES!
                  AND YOU EXCEPT SLOGANS NOTHING!
                  I FINISHED THE ODESSA LEGAL ACADEMY, AND THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOUR KYIV JURFAK ,!
                  WE ARE THE TOWN OF THE CITY AND ALL MALOROSSII!
                  VALI HOME IN LEMBERG (HE SAME LIONS). UNTIL YOU HAVE GIVEN THE POLES ON YOUR NECK!
                  THIS IS MY LAND, AND YOU ARE A PAUL, HERE EXTRA!
                  WE ARE Odessky cops YOU ARE SUCCESSFUL TO DESTROY YOURSELF!
                  1. doktoraikasap
                    -3
                    7 February 2012 11: 14
                    Quote: Odess
                    PARTY MOTHERLAND IN ODESSA, THE STRONGEST OF ALL

                    Among mankurts.)))
                    Quote: Odess
                    WE HAVE POWER, MONEY AND OPPORTUNITIES!

                    Yeah, well, that Kostusev crap and sheer hatred in Odessa. It's good.
                    Quote: Odess
                    AND YOU EXCEPT SLOGANS NOTHING!

                    Send another consul pendelem to the rusk?
                    Quote: Odess
                    I FINISHED THE ODESSA LEGAL ACADEMY, AND THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOUR KYIV JURFAK ,!

                    When did this scammer begin to ride in not only the State, but also in Odessa? Kidalovka is a niche of zbrod, corruption and a "sewing college". lol
                    Quote: Odess
                    WE ARE THE TOWN OF THE CITY AND ALL MALOROSSII!

                    You are nobody, guests.
                    Quote: Odess
                    VALI HOME IN LEMBERG (HE SAME LIONS). UNTIL YOU HAVE GIVEN THE POLES ON YOUR NECK!

                    More accurate hysterical. And then you can run up to the Warfalamean night and reaction - as with the Romanian occupiers and partisans as it was in Odessa.
                    Quote: Odess
                    THIS IS MY LAND, AND YOU ARE A PAUL, HERE EXTRA!

                    No, this is our land, and you are a presumptuous ferret away. And judging by the hysteria, ferrets will realize their second-class niche.
                    Quote: Odess
                    WE ARE Odessky cops YOU ARE SUCCESSFUL TO DESTROY YOURSELF!

                    You are rubbish, and such rubbish easily turns into nobody.
              2. +1
                6 February 2012 23: 07
                I’m in principle ready to argue that there won’t be -----
                but let's just wait and see.
                1. doktoraikasap
                  -4
                  6 February 2012 23: 24
                  Quote: Kars
                  I’m in principle ready to argue that there won’t be -----
                  but let's just wait and see.

                  Of course "will be" - look out the window ... Can't you see her? - But how ... she galloped over there - over there almost 100 years ago ... laughing
          2. Odesit
            -1
            6 February 2012 20: 44
            Ay right UNCLE VICTOR! SO KEEP DEAR!
    2. 755962
      +2
      6 February 2012 22: 42
      Sasha, hello! I read comments on the forum and marvel! Swearing is continuous and accusations of each other's nationalism. Well, that someone would give an adequate answer ..... Boasting and posturing. I am personally glad that production in Ukraine is developing. PEOPLE work and have jobs, which means they will earn a piece of bread. The fact that cooperation is necessary and beneficial for both parties is a no brainer. Such cooperation is not beneficial only to Big Brother and NATO, they don’t even hide it. it’s not worth it, what they need and they will take it, and they won’t ask for permission. But the fact that clothes or money allowances bypass the money .... oh sad. It’s heart-reeling when such a bickering is.
    3. ZHORA
      -2
      7 February 2012 15: 40
      "I COULD BE MOVED TO RUSSIA, I WOULD ESCAPE WITHOUT A LOOK, EVEN TO THE COLONEL'S POSITION!"

      because garbage must be brought down first, rotten breed ...
  23. Odesit
    -1
    6 February 2012 19: 23
    Thank you Dear Victor, on a kind word!
    We hold on and will hold on.
    At least in Odessa - there was and will be order!
    YES GREAT GREAT MATUSHA RUSSIA YES HIS ENEMY IS ENERGY !!!!
    1. Splin
      +1
      6 February 2012 19: 52
      Odessa is written with two letters and pronounced softly as the name of a woman. Why is such pessemism forever. I don’t know how the cops are, none of mine have recently ran there, but the military receives regular salaries. Yes, I would like as a Russian military. But, mamo teso mamo.
      1. Odesit
        -1
        6 February 2012 19: 57
        Dear SPLIN.
        I’m tired of telling you that at US in the city they say ODESA or ADESA! Everything else for spelling!
        Read Zhvanetsky you will immediately understand everything! Each city has its own specifics, and "we don't need someone else's samovar."
        I don’t know about you. and we have difficulties to be!
        With respect.
        1. Splin
          +1
          6 February 2012 20: 05
          So we live in different Odessa (I'm definitely not in Texan). I remember when I visited my brother in 2000, they went to the KVN institute, where the people of Kiev said, well, here we are in Odesa, for which we heard hooting. And in the local news, Odessa is pronounced softly, if this news is not in Ukrainian. Regarding Bobikov, I rarely see, but Jaguar caught my eye several times.
          1. Sovok
            0
            6 February 2012 20: 32
            well, you for the little things. Odessa Davish. the man is telling the truth. and the cops are in vain. there are plenty of decent people and you’re all in one kosh.o they don’t remember on the TV and the news, they just spit like all thieves. and you will speak humane .Try it. You will not regret it. The authorities intentionally substitute Schaub Panam for Radi, he could freely steal with echelons and human blood.
            1. Splin
              +6
              6 February 2012 20: 53
              I never offended cops, even traffic cops. I have never come across filthy people, and maybe because I am still in the right form and with an order. I have many familiar cops (not close). And the presence of normal expensive cars in the department is just an indicator that the situation is being corrected. 94th year. Sinelnikovo. Police Constipation is on duty! And it was like that.
              1. Odesit
                +1
                6 February 2012 22: 27
                SPLEEN
                THANKS TO YOU IN GOOD WORDS!
          2. Odesit
            +2
            6 February 2012 20: 38

            SPLEEN.
            Well, I do not know where you DEAR saw the differences in our opinions, I do not quite understand you!
            Jaguar - this is in the Regional State Traffic Inspectorate - there is definitely - "confiscated" There is also. several "Merces", BMWs and "LANDKRUZERS".
            But this is at the "regional"!
            UAZ (24 years old) and five VAZ -04 are presented for the entire vehicle fleet. Apart from personal vehicles. Glory to GOD we have Zamozhnie guys! There is nothing cheaper than a BMW 318 - 2000 release! We hold on as we can!
            And with regards to Odessa, we’re probably just a friend — a friend didn’t understand something! Your thoughts really appeal to me!
            WITH RESPECT.
            1. doktoraikasap
              -2
              7 February 2012 11: 19
              Quote: Odess
              BMW

              I don’t know how it is now, but before there were a lot of BMWs in the Odessa police. And in private possession from the captain and above - many went to Prado with the numbers II-II, MI-Mi ... Now the shoblo again began to bury itself with corruption in Odessa, and this leads to what already happened in the 2004s. The people then see everything and know ... Yes
              Quote: Odess
              Glory to GOD we have Zamozhnie guys! There is nothing cheaper than a BMW 318 - 2000 release! We hold on as we can!

              Here is the confirmation of my words, it is necessary to do as in Romania - to beat out the bad ones, and to get the good ones. It will be so.
            2. ZHORA
              -4
              7 February 2012 15: 49
              Glory to GOD we have Zamozhnie guys! There is nothing cheaper than a BMW 318 - 2000 release!

              But you complained about the salary of the trash beggar? What garbage on the robbery of the population and on bribes from a criminal element have eaten up?
  24. URB
    URB
    +2
    6 February 2012 21: 09
    one name is already amusing =) I wonder how my country, with the paper army, will arm NATO? Is Ukraine advantageous in that it is an excellent springboard for attacking Russia if something happens ... and who needs it !?
  25. 0
    6 February 2012 21: 37
    Ukraine has potential in the construction of tanks, it must be used.
    1. Odesit
      -1
      6 February 2012 21: 48
      Why use it ?! To supply Sakashvili ?!
      Tanks are not needed for the so-called "Ukrainian army" - SHE WILL DISAPPEAR IN CASE OF CONFLICT!
      WE ARE MILITARY PERSONS IN THE COUNTRY MORE THAN THE WHOLE ARMENIAN COMPOSITION, WE ARE TRAINED, ARMED AND IF ORDERED, TAKE POWER IN OUR RUSSIAN HANDS!
      With all due respect to you Travis, you are wrong!
      With respect.
      1. doktoraikasap
        -1
        7 February 2012 11: 21
        Quote: Odess
        Tanks are not needed for the so-called "Ukrainian army" - SHE WILL DISAPPEAR IN CASE OF CONFLICT!

        As in the distant 2000s, as after Tuzla - 65% of the population was ready to fight ... Yes
        Quote: Odess
        WE ARE MILITARY PERSONS IN THE COUNTRY MORE THAN THE WHOLE ARMENIAN COMPOSITION, WE ARE TRAINED, ARMED AND IF ORDERED, TAKE POWER IN OUR RUSSIAN HANDS!

        This is a job for the SBU - print screen.
        1. spirin199
          0
          11 February 2012 11: 58
          and you were going to fight, and the remaining 35 percent
    2. doktoraikasap
      -6
      6 February 2012 22: 36
      Quote: Trevis
      Ukraine has potential in the construction of tanks, it must be used

      Not the potential, but the opportunity as the only country from the post-Soviet states - which has a cool design bureau, modern technology, and a full production cycle of modern tanks. And others do not, that’s what we threw you from the Kazakhstani market. You are salabons and you have nothing.
      Ta-dam !!! fellow
  26. +2
    6 February 2012 21: 56
    Ukraine needs to cooperate with Russia as closely as possible.
    1. lightforcer
      -5
      6 February 2012 22: 12
      Why not with NATO? Nobody has ever felt bad from entering there. Oh yes, it will fall apart soon as the USA and the EU ... Hello to Mikhail Leontyev wink
    2. Odesit
      0
      6 February 2012 22: 22
      THANKS DEAR TRAVIS!
      YOUR WORDS, GOD IN EARS!
      WITH RESPECT!
    3. doktoraikasap
      -4
      6 February 2012 22: 32
      Quote: Trevis
      Ukraine needs to cooperate with Russia as closely as possible.

      We are already working closely, much closer? lol
  27. aironfirst
    +3
    6 February 2012 21: 59
    I repeat:
    while we fight each other with and without, our REAL ENEMY becomes stronger every day!
    For him, it would be beyond all dreams that Russia and Ukraine would cling to each other's throats, believe me!
    While we are tearing our throats, hollowing the clave, insulting each other, spurred by all sorts of trolls, they stupidly laugh at us, like over the rams that we managed to push together with our foreheads.
    1. lightforcer
      -8
      6 February 2012 22: 10
      Let me guess this enemy is world Zionism?
      1. Odesit
        -3
        7 February 2012 01: 17
        ABOUT! Again, the light division of the American Armed Forces has appeared!
        AMERAM IS DEATH!
        NOW GAD I WILL FIND YOU!
        THIS IS OUR SITE, VALI, GO TO THE NIGERS, BUT MAJOR IS WATCHING YOU! And you will be ass fucked.
        JEANS, HERE ARE AMEROZHIDOVSKY!
        RUN HOME, AND THEN THE Muzzle will be beaten!
        Litter AMEROVSKAYA!
        1. lightforcer
          -3
          7 February 2012 11: 35
          The Zhidov-Ukrainian-Russian redneck woke up and felt a strong butt.
          1. Odesit
            +2
            7 February 2012 18: 07
            No, WAS THIS YOU!
            BROWN AMERICAN!
        2. ZHORA
          -3
          7 February 2012 15: 53
          See that you and Pushkinskaya 3 do not get your ass kicked ...
          1. Odesit
            0
            7 February 2012 18: 05
            Zhorik, let off the couples, sled! And then you’ll tear your back, compete with the Uncles!
    2. Odesit
      0
      6 February 2012 22: 24
      Right-IRON FIST! KEEP IT UP!
      WITH RESPECT!
      1. aironfirst
        +1
        6 February 2012 23: 12
        thanks, but I'm not an iron fist
        rather iron first smile
        1. Odesit
          -2
          7 February 2012 01: 09
          Alright brother, Be the General!
    3. +7
      6 February 2012 22: 48
      Something like this. I agree
    4. URB
      URB
      0
      7 February 2012 02: 42
      Well, it is!
  28. andrklimanov
    0
    6 February 2012 23: 15
    I also treat Ukrainians as brothers. BUT if so then I wouldn’t have any business with them. either unite or apart. Join and take gas like all Russians. And work wherever you want. atom how to bargain so west as gas to ask cheaper so with us. if everything is ok there in Ukraine. why bother working for us? someone wrote that we have something to hate, I would like to know why?
    1. doktoraikasap
      -4
      6 February 2012 23: 32
      Quote: andrklimanov
      either unite

      And did someone suggest such an option from independent Ukraine ???
  29. slan
    +1
    7 February 2012 00: 27
    Why do you trolley unfortunate ukrov? Life has offended them, and be more humane if you lived in such a backward country where GDP is determined
    Quote: Sas
    There is so much gray cash that all of Poland have never dreamed of.
    by prostitutes (which in Europe is one in four according to the most conservative estimates) and by a payment for the transit of gas, it would also be shit in people’s forums.
    In Ukraine, the minimum and average wages, pensions, benefits .. everything is 2-4 times lower than that of neighbors, cars per capita, square meters of housing, the same thing. And in Ukrainian schools and Ukrainian television they are taught that they are the highest Ukrainian and only Muscovites do not allow them to live better. How can one not get out of one's mind? Let the steppe villagers at least be glad that in the Russian cities in Ukraine there are still Russian engineers who were sent there under the Soviet authorities for distribution, who at least do something.
    1. Alexey Prikazchikov
      -2
      7 February 2012 01: 58
      So just neighing over the suckers I want.
      1. doktoraikasap
        -2
        7 February 2012 11: 23
        Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
        So just neighing over the suckers I want.

        So far, only you and the like are the "gold standard" sucker. Yes
    2. maolex
      0
      22 February 2012 19: 41
      I myself live in Russia in Russia, but I have never seen so many fascists obsessed with hatred of other nations, although I have traveled to many countries, and now think about it, guys - why don’t they like Russians, or did national pseudo-excellence take your mind away? duck, teach history and understand that the people of Ukraine will not let the Ukrainian state enter NATO, remembering ANTANT, and there is nothing to combine the desires of politicians with the desires of citizens am
  30. doktoraikasap
    -2
    7 February 2012 00: 52
    And pockets are for losers.





    1. -2
      7 February 2012 11: 18
      Good for you!
      And you are a savvy fighter!
      1. doktoraikasap
        -1
        7 February 2012 11: 52
        Quote: submariner
        Well done! And you are a savvy fighter!

        Very, you are right. Sometimes the truth is sometimes in floods at Pont require information which can not be given - I do not.
    2. 0
      7 February 2012 22: 50
      States bought of course for your reference. The rest was sold from old Soviet stocks. It is known that a huge number of tanks and other military equipment were taken from Western Europe to Ukraine.
    3. spirin199
      0
      11 February 2012 11: 59
      some armored personnel carriers and tanks
  31. kav8206
    0
    7 February 2012 11: 32
    From the article to the article about Ukraine I see one and the same picture, they resort to all sorts of banderlogs and start to bully the Russians, they start measuring with pipis, “but we have this, but we have this cooler.” What the fuck are small children? ! Sensible! Do not fall for the orange provocations! Let the svidomye mumble what they want! As they say, you mess with shit in shit and get dirty!
    1. doktoraikasap
      -2
      7 February 2012 12: 19
      Quote: kav8206
      From an article to an article about Ukraine I see one and the same picture, all sorts of banderlogs resort and begin to Russian

      Russians to this article which side at all?
      Quote: kav8206
      As they say with shit, you get in shit and get smeared!

      Well, what are the Russians doing here?
  32. klop_mutant
    +2
    8 February 2012 02: 07
    Gentlemen, set aside the panic. Hohlotroll turned out to be a Latvian from Jurmala, has nothing to do with Ukraine.
    http://doktoraikasap.livejournal.com/
  33. -1
    8 February 2012 04: 51
    Independence from Russia - with "Exosets"! Rzhunimagu :-)
  34. 0
    9 February 2012 11: 27
    Stop breeding srach!
    Ukraine is a friend! Since her defense industry is working and the west wants to buy, this is not a reason to envy, but a reason to learn!
    We must do it and not scratch our tongues!
    1. DEATH UWB
      0
      22 February 2012 16: 24
      hahaahahh that wants to buy the west, nothing. they have no one to vparit their
  35. 0
    11 January 2015 15: 04
    It's nice that the Ukrainian military-industrial complex is alive and efficient.