Military Review

C-300: a nightmare for NATO and anxiety for Russia

328
C-300: a nightmare for NATO and anxiety for Russia



The C-300 anti-aircraft missile system is vital weapons to increase the combat capability of Syria’s air defense, but Moscow fears that the supply of these complexes may create consequences for itself and throughout the Middle East, writes missilethreat.com on July 19.

The Israeli Air Force attacked targets in Syria with such regularity that Syrian airspace resembles Swiss cheese (probably referring to all covered with mold and holes - approx. “Military Parity”). Obsolete SAM systems in Syria’s air defense system are not able to reflect Israeli attacks aviation, therefore, Syria is desperately, but very late, waiting for the supply of S-300.

In several local conflicts, such SA-2 and SA-6 SA-systems (C-75 and “Cube” / export. “Square” variant - approx. “VP”, respectively) destroyed a large number of enemy aircraft. Modern C-300, C-400 complexes have been created in Russia and C-500 is being developed. These weapons can dramatically affect the course of wars and, in fact, are strategic weapons, which is unusual for non-nuclear missiles. This factor is the reason that Israel and the United States fear the supply of C-300 to Syria and Iran.

C-300: what he can and cannot

The C-300 has an impressive pedigree from SA-2, which in 1960 was "famously shot down" by the American U-2 reconnaissance aircraft over Russia, which caused "embarrassment" at the then administration of Dwight Eisenhower (Dwight David Eisenhower, US President at 1953) -61's - comment “VP”). Created to replace the first-generation air defense systems, the C-300 complex is an easy-to-maintain and use mobile system designed to repel massive enemy air raids. The complex is capable of hitting air targets at ranges from 5 to 150 km, simultaneously tracking 12 targets and firing six of them. The Russians claim that the target hit rate is 80-93%. No aircraft will be able to “run away” from a rocket that flies at a speed of 7200 km / h and has a maximum height of destruction 98 thousand feet (about 30 km - approx. “VP”). The latest versions of the C-300 are capable of hitting targets flying just 20 feet (6 m - approx. "VP") from the surface of the earth.

Unlike the US Patriot, which was advertised as the killer Scud (Western designation of the Soviet OTP series P-11 / P-17 - approx. "VP") and which, in fact, is a "loud jerk", the Russian ZRK works much more efficiently. According to Boris Bunkin, C-300 Chief Designer, during Operation Desert Storm, the American Patriots showed insufficient effectiveness in hitting ballistic missiles and destroying warheads in order to shift them from the flight path. Bunkin managed to solve this problem. His team conducted Scudam C-300 tests and demonstrated that the complex effectively destroyed the warheads at the interception point.

IHS Jane's Air-Launched Weapons editor Robert Hewson describes C-300 as a formidable and respected adversary: ​​"If you decide to enter Syrian airspace and start bombing, prepare for big problems." The missile is guided by a narrow beam of radar, which is not only difficult to detect, but also suppress by means of EW. But it should be noted that C-300 is not completely immune from the use of electronic interference, where Israel has superiority. In 1982, Israeli aircraft destroyed 19 Syrian anti-aircraft missile batteries after “blinding” with EW.

Contrary to media reports, C-300 alone cannot "change the rules of the game." It becomes deadly when it interacts with anti-aircraft artillery and interceptor fighters. The air defense system, which has a great height of defeat, forces enemy aircraft to fall and be fired by the FOR and fighter-interceptors.

Vietnam: dangerous at any altitude

Vietnam’s air defense system was probably the most organized and effective defense system in stories wars “It was a multi-level, dynamically integrated system that included radar stations, MiG fighter jets, anti-aircraft missile systems and anti-aircraft guns of various sizes, small arms,” wrote American Failure in its book (approx. "VP") Vietnamese General Van Tien (Van Tien).

As soon as American bombers and escort fighters entered the zone of operation of the Vietnamese air defense, radar guided MiG fighters on them. The information about the enemy was transmitted to the control centers of the air defense missile system. In order to counteract the air defense system, Americans used electronic interference from devices that were installed on the wing tips of their aircraft, which resulted in reduced maneuverability and made them more vulnerable to MiG attacks. “When the pilots tried to get out from under the zone of shelling by anti-aircraft missiles, they lowered the altitude and came under fire from the anti-aircraft artillery,” writes Robert Dorr in his book Air War Hanoi (“Air War over Hanoi” - comment “VP” ).

During the 1964-1973 period, Vietnamese anti-aircraft artillery shot down 740 fighters of the US Air Force, as well as hundreds of helicopters, several F-111 and 15 fighter-bombers of the B-52 strategic bombers. Bombers were lost despite the use of EW and escort fighters. Interestingly, after the Vietnam War, the US Air Force in local conflicts did not lose a single B-52.

SIRK over Sinai

If C-300 arrives in Syria, it will be a momentous moment. For the first time in the history of the Middle East, an Arab country will have the opportunity to shoot down Israeli aircraft over Israel. Missiles fired from the Damascus area would hit planes over Tel Aviv in about 107 seconds, leaving the Israelis with almost no time to react. This is unacceptable for Israel. Defense Minister Moshe Yaalon warned that "God forbid, as soon as they (C-300 - approx." VP ") appear in Syria, we know what to do." Deputy Foreign Minister of Russia Sergei Ryabkov, on the contrary, believes that the supply of C-300 will be a stabilizing factor that “will cool down the heat of some hot heads”.

The Syrian military is not as well prepared as "highly skilled, motivated and brilliant Vietnamese." Probably, Syria’s air defense is not capable of stopping Israeli air raids, and there is no guarantee that it will be able to effectively use C-300. This year, the Israelis have already struck four blows at Syrian military sites, and in each case they feared the supply of weapons for Hezbollah.

Thus, Russia has cause for concern. If the Israelis destroy C-300, it can drop the prestige of the system and allow other countries to "be less afraid of them." “Russia's delay in delivering C-300 comes from the understanding that the Israelis can respond in a way that will harm Moscow’s interests,” writes Strategy Page. There are two options. The first is that Russia is accelerating the preparation of Syrian calculations before sending the complexes, and the “uncut export version”, and the latest modifications. The second, C-300, is supplied on conditions that they will be served by Russian settlements, which are not only better prepared, but their very presence will deter Israeli raids. Israel’s reckless attack on the ZRK positions with Russian personnel will cause a “massive negative reaction” from Moscow, which will expand support for the Iran-Syria-Hezbollah alliance. The trickle of the Russian weapons he supplies will turn into a turbulent flow. And then you will hear the voice of the Syrian President Bashar Assad, addressed to the Israelis: "Go ahead, this is my day."
Originator:
http://missilethreat.com/s-300-natos-nightmare-and-perhaps-russias-too/
328 comments
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  1. domokl
    domokl 22 July 2013 06: 37 New
    20
    Prestige and so on, of course, is important. Is it just that it bothers us to work according to the same Vietnamese version? They are instructors, and not only for C-300, but also for other systems.
    1. Rus2012
      22 July 2013 06: 42 New
      16
      Quote: domokl
      Prestige and so on, of course, is important. Is it just that it bothers us to work according to the same Vietnamese version? They are instructors, and not only for C-300, but also for other systems.


      ... I think, dear colleague, the way it will be. Too much horse riding ...
      1. Sirocco
        Sirocco 22 July 2013 07: 27 New
        27
        Quote: Rus2012
        ... I think, dear colleague, the way it will be.

        I agree with you completely. And as to whether Syria now has S-300 or not, I will say the words of a movie hero, this is not known to science, but it would be better if there are 2, 3 divisions, and better if 5 laughing Now, at the expense of S-300 service specialists, I think Israel is screaming because it understands that it is our specialists who will work on planes, as in the case of Georgia, where Jews took an active part, as instructors.
        "God forbid, as soon as they (S-300 - approx." VP ") appear in Syria, we know what to do."
        The fact of the matter is that he does not know what they will do. He perfectly understands that the S-300, without a shutter, will not work. You would know, shut up, giggling in a rag. In this situation, Israel is like an anecdotal old toothless wolf who can only kiss Assad on the fifth point with his cold lips. All these raids on Syria, this is reconnaissance in battle, that where when, for the Jews, it’s completely incomprehensible what Syria possesses, let them start full-scale raids, and we'll see. The benefit of the experience of the war with the Jews is, and conclusions are drawn from past mistakes. So we wish the Israelites to try matzo with bacon.
        1. zvereok
          zvereok 22 July 2013 13: 43 New
          +3
          Yeah, I've kissed him four times since the beginning of the year, despite the presence of Buk and Carapace. I understand, the first time they were not ready for bombing, but 4 times, with 1 "conditionally wrecked" Israeli plane, that's too much.
          1. dustycat
            dustycat 22 July 2013 20: 43 New
            +5
            Quote: zvereok
            Yeah, I've kissed him four times since the beginning of the year, despite the presence of Buk and Carapace. I understand, the first time they were not ready for bombing, but 4 times, with 1 "conditionally wrecked" Israeli plane, that's too much.

            How the Beech block Israelis know.
            The weaknesses of the Shell also have already been studied.
            And how many planes ... planes will be needed to study the weaknesses and search for ways to extinguish the C300 - the population of Israel may not wait to receive sufficiently effective methods. And strongly want to ask Likud not to poke his nose into Syria.
        2. AVDOTYAKARLOVNA
          AVDOTYAKARLOVNA 22 July 2013 15: 09 New
          -25
          Israel both flew and will fly, and no horror stories about the S-300 will help.
          1. Simon
            Simon 22 July 2013 18: 42 New
            11
            Quote: AVDOTYAKARLOVNA
            Israel both flew and will fly, and no horror stories about the S-300 will help.

            Let Israeli planes fly, but they won’t return home. Their grave will be in Syria.
            1. sasha.28blaga
              sasha.28blaga 23 July 2013 05: 30 New
              +3
              As one veteran of the Great Patriotic War said, they came to seize our land, and they got two meters in depth.
          2. Blackgrifon
            Blackgrifon 22 July 2013 20: 40 New
            +4
            Quote: AVDOTYAKARLOVNA
            Israel both flew and will fly, and no horror stories about the S-300 will help.


            Well, dear, the Israeli military is far from fools - not one of their aircraft flew directly into Syrian airspace - and as a result, the Syrians did not have a reason to open fire on Israeli aircraft.
            And then, during the Doomsday War, the Israeli Air Force received well from Egypt's air defense, which was equipped with Soviet air defense systems.
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 21: 51 New
              +1
              Quote: Blackgrifon
              none of their aircraft flew directly into Syrian airspace

              Flew in. There were 4 attacks, judging by the data that appeared, in two cases the planes flew.
              1. tilovaykrisa
                tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 22: 02 New
                +1
                No, they attacked from the airspace of Jordan. It was not required just to fly in, in the missile strike zone, almost the entire territory of Syria.
                1. Pimply
                  Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 32 New
                  0
                  The videos were uploaded when they first bombed.
              2. Blackgrifon
                Blackgrifon 22 July 2013 22: 22 New
                0
                Quote: Pimply
                Flew in. There were 4 attacks, judging by the data that appeared, in two cases the planes flew.


                I have not heard, but I will not argue in view of the lack of information. But in defense of Syria we can say the following:
                - on the account of the Syrian air defense downed aircraft of the Turkish Air Force,
                - S-300, if they have already arrived in Syria and are even deployed, then the level of training of operators must be taken into account - it will not immediately be high.
                1. Pimply
                  Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 38 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Blackgrifon
                  - on the account of the Syrian air defense downed aircraft of the Turkish Air Force,


                  This is ultimately controversial information.

                  Quote: Blackgrifon
                  - S-300, if they have already arrived in Syria and are even deployed, then the level of training of operators must be taken into account - it will not immediately be high.

                  S-300 is not a panacea. In the article, by the way, everything is correctly laid out on the shelves.
                  1. Blackgrifon
                    Blackgrifon 24 July 2013 20: 08 New
                    0
                    Quote: Pimply
                    S-300 is not a panacea. In the article, by the way, everything is correctly laid out on the shelves.


                    I completely agree with this - problems must be comprehensively considered and resolved.
          3. sasha.28blaga
            sasha.28blaga 23 July 2013 05: 32 New
            0
            Like plywood over Paris.
        3. Simon
          Simon 22 July 2013 18: 37 New
          +1
          Of course, the Israelis know what to do. They have two options for deliveries, Syria S-300. The first is to hide deeper into the ground or, at best, sit quietly and quietly, and be silent in a rag.
          1. Aaron Zawi
            Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 19: 17 New
            -3
            Quote: Simon
            Of course, the Israelis know what to do. They have two options for deliveries, Syria S-300. The first is to hide deeper into the ground or, at best, sit quietly and quietly, and be silent in a rag.

            A curious thought. But for some reason, the Israeli Air Force in the 1982 year did not listen to its counterpart, although then the Syrians did not have the worst air defense, and the capabilities of the AOI Air Force are orders of magnitude less.
            1. tilovaykrisa
              tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 20: 22 New
              -1
              Accurately noticed that the most contrary is fair.
            2. dustycat
              dustycat 22 July 2013 20: 51 New
              +3
              Quote: Aaron Zawi

              A curious thought. But for some reason, the Israeli Air Force in the 1982 year did not listen to its counterpart, although then the Syrians did not have the worst air defense, and the capabilities of the AOI Air Force are orders of magnitude less.

              Well, in 1982, few people paid attention to UAVs and few knew how to neutralize mavericks.
              So where the Israeli Air Force did not have enough capabilities, I got a surprise from a bunch of UAVs + maverick.
              Now the Israeli Air Force is flying because too many air defense positions are crushed by Muslim brothers.
              But the situation is already improving - the Muslim brothers are calming down, the air defense positions are being restored.
              So soon the Israeli Air Force can expect a surprise.
              And who knows on whose street the music will play and whether it will be fun.
              1. Pimply
                Pimply 22 July 2013 21: 53 New
                +3
                For example, take the year 2006 (span on Assad’s palace) and the year 2008 (destruction of the reactor). Both this and that was with the anti-air defense not suppressed by the Islamists.
      2. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 22 July 2013 08: 30 New
        +4
        Quote: Rus2012

        ... I think, dear colleague, the way it will be

        ??? Until the Yaki 130 was sent, what is in the way? According to C 300 there is also a lot of noise, but there are complexes in Syria, what are we waiting for since many things are at stake?
        1. cosmos111
          cosmos111 22 July 2013 09: 07 New
          +6
          Quote: Alexander Romanov

          According to 300 there is also a lot of noise, but there are complexes in Syria, what are we waiting for since a lot is at stake?

          Perhaps we are waiting for permission, Moor Obamych am
          There are no other visible reasons. (There is no embargo on the supply of arms to Syria.) We do not forget the broken contract for the supply of C-300 to Iran, precisely because of US pressure.
          1. DEMENTIY
            DEMENTIY 22 July 2013 09: 49 New
            +4
            If the Israelis destroy C-300, this could drop the prestige of the system and allow other countries to "fear them less."


            I’m interested in this, but how can they be checked at all?
            Shoot the skeet? On computer games?
            Real prestige:
            During the 1964-1973 period, Vietnamese anti-aircraft artillery shot down 740 fighters of the US Air Force, as well as hundreds of helicopters, several F-111 and 15 fighter-bombers of the B-52 strategic bombers. Bombers were lost despite the use of EW and escort fighters. Interestingly, after the Vietnam War, the US Air Force in local conflicts did not lose a single B-52.
            1. DEfindER
              DEfindER 22 July 2013 11: 24 New
              +5
              Quote: DEMENTIY
              I’m interested in this, but how can they be checked at all?

              That's for sure, we can’t test them at all in the exercises. we don’t have NATO aircraft with their latest electronic warfare system, but don’t let it down and shooting plates on exercises is not an indicator, the enemy will use the whole complex of his forces and means, and this is not easy to simulate .. Before, the USSR without hesitation supplied friends with defensive weapons from here were his prestige, and if we don’t deliver them, they will stop respecting Russian weapons ..
              1. dustycat
                dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 03 New
                0
                Quote: DEfindER

                That's for sure, we can’t test them at all in the exercises. we don’t have NATO aircraft with their latest electronic warfare system,


                I remember one report from an exhibition in the Emirates. In it, one of our "developer representative" proudly told how he asked the French to turn off their demonstration jammers before the demonstration of our air defense complex. How he shamed them and shook his finger at them.
                And even they kind of obeyed him.
            2. olviko
              olviko 22 July 2013 13: 58 New
              +6
              Prestige, as an argument, in this case is insignificant, it is much more important, for our defense, to finally fire at the system in combat conditions, to identify the shortcomings of the S - 300, as well as the latest means of counteracting it. This is critically important, given that the S - 300, C - 400 form the basis of our air defense. At one time, the experience of using the S - 75 in Vietnam made it possible to modernize these systems and advance in creating new, more advanced ones.
            3. dustycat
              dustycat 22 July 2013 20: 59 New
              0
              Quote: DEMENTIY
              I’m interested in this, but how can they be checked at all?
              Shoot the skeet? On computer games?
              Real prestige:

              Well, certainly not a set of jamming domestic production.
              They are only capable of crushing voices and our company R-123.
              The Israeli maestro EW is just in topic.
          2. zvereok
            zvereok 22 July 2013 13: 45 New
            +8
            We still do not forget the broken contract for the supply of C-300 to Iran, precisely due to US pressure.
            This was not pressure, this odd Medvedev served, for the tablet. Even people have a short memory.
          3. APASUS
            APASUS 22 July 2013 13: 45 New
            +5
            Quote: cosmos111
            Perhaps we are waiting for permission, Moor Obamych

            Russia has no other choice, it will have to be put. Iran’s turn follows Syria, and there it will reach Russia itself. The conversation can only go on the degree of participation of Russia itself.
          4. dustycat
            dustycat 22 July 2013 20: 54 New
            0
            Quote: cosmos111
            Perhaps we are waiting for permission, Moor Obamych am
            There are no other visible reasons. (There is no embargo on the supply of arms to Syria.) We do not forget the broken contract for the supply of C-300 to Iran, precisely because of US pressure.

            How not ??
            We will wait another 200 days and the command "light up" will follow.
            Here, some hawks from the mattress remembered something about the boycott of Moscow80.
        2. AVV
          AVV 22 July 2013 13: 12 New
          +5
          First of all, it is necessary to ensure the protection of your base in Tartus with shells, and the 300 latest modifications! And also with the BUK-2M systems. Then Israel will stop scrolling !!! Plus put onyxes there! Then everything will work out logically.
          1. Simon
            Simon 22 July 2013 18: 55 New
            +1
            I add, and in the second case, help Syria with modern weapons.
            1. Blackgrifon
              Blackgrifon 22 July 2013 20: 47 New
              +1
              Quote: Simon
              I add, and in the second case, help Syria with modern weapons.


              Modern weapons require a higher technical culture - the training of both fighters and engineering and repair services. In addition, this is a completely different nomenclature of b / p and spare parts. The Syrians need to supply proven weapons - they do not need the ultramodern Ka-52 and Mi-28N, but the Mi-24P or Mi-35 - they know them and are perfectly able to handle them. Similarly with BBM. Another thing is the air defense and equipment of special forces - it will be the main emphasis in ensuring the defense of Syria both from the rebels and from the external aggressor.
      3. pavlo
        pavlo 22 July 2013 19: 34 New
        +1
        Probably more correctly at stake!
    2. ATATA
      ATATA 22 July 2013 08: 23 New
      12
      Quote: domokl
      They are instructors, and not only for the S-300, but for the rest of the systems.

      You did not carefully read the article.
      You need not only your personnel at the air defense system. Need a layered air defense system, along with modern fighters.
      1. Vladimirets
        Vladimirets 22 July 2013 08: 41 New
        11
        Quote: ATATA
        Need a layered air defense system, along with modern fighters.

        That's for sure. The S-300 complex itself is not a panacea, anti-aircraft gunners will have to fight with the internal enemy, sabotage, attacks on air defense systems, violations of control systems, etc. In addition, to create an effective air defense system quickly and in a snap does not work, it is a complex organism.
        1. aksakal
          aksakal 22 July 2013 09: 24 New
          +5
          Quote: Vladimirets
          In addition, to create an effective air defense system quickly and in a snap does not work, it is a complex organism.

          - one integration of various air defense systems (including air defense aviation) into a single information and MANAGEMENT system that can work in real time (and only such a regime is viable) belay Apart from Russia, no one has such an integral system and does not even have experience building such a system for foreign countries, taking into account the level of training of the local economy and the general scientific and technical level of the country, that is, adaptation must also be done! For Syria - ANRIAL, unfortunately.
          1. Constantine
            Constantine 22 July 2013 11: 03 New
            +8
            Quote: aksakal
            Apart from Russia, no one has such an integral system and does not even have experience building such a system for foreign countries, taking into account the level of training of the local economy and the general scientific and technical level of the country, that is, adaptation must also be done! For Syria - ANRIAL, unfortunately.


            History shows that at a critical moment we are quite capable of giving a non-standard solution to an unsolvable problem, which in turn throws the enemy into shock))
          2. S-200
            S-200 22 July 2013 19: 37 New
            +2
            Quote: aksakal
            Apart from Russia, no one has such an integral system, and does not even have experience building such a system

            This is not entirely true.... even - not at all consistent!
            In Europe - NATO’s Joint Air Defense,
            USA-Canada - United North American Air Defense System - NORAD
            so ... there is nothing to boast of, their technique is serious
            and working "in real time".
            there can be no other regime in any air defense!
          3. dustycat
            dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 15 New
            +1
            Quote: aksakal

            - one integration of various air defense systems (including air defense aviation) into a single information and MANAGEMENT system that can work in real time (and only such a regime is viable) belay Apart from Russia, no one has such an integral system

            Russia, alas, does not have it either. Redoubt on Chinese laptops with a transmission speed of 1200 baud is nothing at all.
            If only they would do at LTE, or at least at TsDMA-EVDO-450. Everything is faster and less intercepted.
            But some people have Aegis. True, so far on the ships, but what prevents her from placing in Bradley? And LTE is integrated into it or not is unknown.
            In Vietnam, it all worked in the Vietnamese language - the gap between the interference packets and from determining the spare frequency to its suppression was enough to transmit the necessary amount of information.
            In Syrian, this may not work, and the enemy is more skilled in electronic warfare than mattresses in the 1960s and 1970s.
        2. Constantine
          Constantine 22 July 2013 11: 01 New
          +5
          In addition, to create an effective air defense system quickly and in a snap does not work, it is a complex organism.


          But it is better to help them in this matter now than to receive "guests" on their territory later.

          And then, according to some reports, Syria has:
          20 complexes "Buk" + 8 "Buk-M2E" - medium range
          195 complexes "Cube" - short range
          30 "Strela-10" + 20 "Strela-1" + 14 "Osa-AK" - close combat
          This is not counting the numerous MANPADS. In battle, all means are good.

          In addition, the Syrian Air Force has, according to 2012, 11 MiG-25 and a certain number of capable MiG-29. Of course, not in the latest versions, but if you can build at least some effective system from what you have, then you can dramatically increase the risk of raids on the Israeli Air Force, and this, in turn, will make them think again before they fly. Theoretically, with the participation of our specialists, such a system can be assembled, in my opinion.
          1. dustycat
            dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 22 New
            +2
            Quote: Constantine

            But it is better to help them in this matter now than to receive "guests" on their territory later.

            What to do?
            Redoubt on P166 in MT-LB?
            The Ministry of Emergency Situations has a communication complex for fuels and lubricants many times better and more "rapid-fire".
            With it, even counter-strike can be played, unlike Redoubt.
        3. S-200
          S-200 22 July 2013 19: 26 New
          +1
          anti-aircraft gunners must fulfill their functions, and repelling attacks on positions and sabotage is the task of ground cover forces.
        4. Simon
          Simon 22 July 2013 19: 55 New
          +1
          Quote: Vladimirets
          Quote: ATATA
          Need a layered air defense system, along with modern fighters.

          That's for sure. The S-300 complex itself is not a panacea, anti-aircraft gunners will have to fight with the internal enemy, sabotage, attacks on air defense systems, violations of control systems, etc. In addition, to create an effective air defense system quickly and in a snap does not work, it is a complex organism.

          The Syrians need these systems like air, so let them guard the S-300 with their elite troops. They have a question of the life and death of the state, and the S-300 is a good chance for them.
      2. zvereok
        zvereok 22 July 2013 13: 51 New
        +2
        Quote: ATATA
        You did not carefully read the article.
        You need not only your personnel at the air defense system. Need a layered air defense system, along with modern fighters.


        Plus, Iskanders, for a retaliatory strike on the territory of Israel, otherwise fighter aircraft will be destroyed at airfields.
    3. Tatb
      Tatb 22 July 2013 10: 42 New
      +2
      If supplied, it is already better than the S-400! Because at stake is not only the face of the country, but sorry and the priest! And it is a fact! hi
      1. ATATA
        ATATA 22 July 2013 11: 37 New
        +1
        Quote: TATb
        If supplied, it is already better than the S-400! Because at stake is not only the face of the country, but sorry and the priest! And it is a fact!

        What would they destroy during deployment?
        And how many c400 are we on duty?
      2. zvereok
        zvereok 22 July 2013 13: 52 New
        +3
        The Syrian army will not withstand the full scale attack of Israel, are you suggesting that NATO transfer a couple of C-400 for study?
        1. Simon
          Simon 22 July 2013 20: 00 New
          +1
          And what can be sent, only on their own along the trajectory, to their airfields, let them catch airplanes. laughing
      3. dustycat
        dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 24 New
        0
        Quote: TATb
        If supplied, it is already better than the S-400! Because at stake is not only the face of the country, but sorry and the priest! And it is a fact! hi

        Put this untested walking excavator in a children's sandbox? laughing
    4. Reindeer herder
      Reindeer herder 22 July 2013 11: 02 New
      0
      The mentality is in the way. And not to us, but to the Syrians.
    5. Geisenberg
      Geisenberg 22 July 2013 14: 42 New
      +4
      Quote: domokl
      Prestige and so on, of course, is important. Is it just that it bothers us to work according to the same Vietnamese version? They are instructors, and not only for C-300, but also for other systems.


      Times are not the same. The information background has changed dramatically for the first time. Now it’s impossible to send a company of specialists to a quiet one - it’ll necessarily open. Secondly, in Syria there is a disgusting, terrorist war aimed at the destruction of the nation. Aggressors do not disdain means. Our military experts will simply become targets for the entire terrorist mess. They will open the hunt for the African five. Thirdly, the pro-American media support this war, which further complicates the information background. Therefore, any movement on our part will be an occasion for the next American zapadl and not the fact that the case will end with the next magnetic list.
      1. dustycat
        dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 31 New
        0
        Quote: Geisenberg

        Times are not the same. The information background has changed dramatically for the first time. Now it’s impossible to send a company of specialists to a quiet one - it’ll necessarily open.

        You might think in 1953 and in 1967 it was "a big secret for such a small company" for someone in the West and in the USSR ?!
        Send several regiments (1953) or 1000 specialists at once from several air defense schools (1967) and so that their relatives do not even understand where and for what they read reading reviews in Labor or Izvestia?
        This was the biggest open secret.
        Especially when the Russian service of Chinese folk radio was talking about it without any jamming.
    6. Blackgrifon
      Blackgrifon 22 July 2013 20: 37 New
      0
      Quote: domokl
      Prestige and so on, of course, is important. Is it just that it bothers us to work according to the same Vietnamese version? They are instructors, and not only for C-300, but also for other systems.


      I agree. But here’s the question, comrade, will our military advisers have enough time to prepare the military forces of the Syrian Armed Forces? And can the Syrian army provide security for S-300 bases? Remember how in Libya, the rebels, having destroyed air defense, opened the sky for the Allied air forces - as if this would not happen in Syria.
      1. Pimply
        Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 11 New
        +1
        Quote: Blackgrifon
        Remember how in Libya, the rebels, having destroyed air defense, opened the sky for the Allied air forces - as if this would not happen in Syria.

        In fact, Libyan air defense just brutally carried out by NATO forces
        1. Blackgrifon
          Blackgrifon 22 July 2013 22: 25 New
          0
          Quote: Pimply
          In fact, Libyan air defense just brutally carried out by NATO forces


          I ask you to clarify - what I read indicated that Libyan air defense was in a state of collapse precisely as a result of rebel attacks, and not air force attacks.
          1. Pimply
            Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 43 New
            +1
            The rebels at the time of the announcement of the no-fly zone were actively losing ground.

            Tomahawks, UAVs, helicopters and electronic warfare equipment.

            From the simplest, without reading several sources - take the same Wiki.

            http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%98%D0%BD%D1%82%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B2%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1
            %86%D0%B8%D1%8F_%D0%B2_%D0%9B%D0%B8%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B8
            1. poquello
              poquello 23 July 2013 01: 32 New
              +1
              Quote: Pimply

              Tomahawks, UAVs, helicopters and electronic warfare equipment.


              Oh how, but I thought the ceiling decided everything.
  2. FC SKIF
    FC SKIF 22 July 2013 06: 42 New
    +7
    S-Z00 IS A SELF-DEFENSE WEAPON. SOMETHING ON THAT SIDE of the Dutch heights are so excited. The Syrians will have no time for 50 years before the attacks on the Israelis, then they will need to rebuild the country again, and it is not known when.
    1. domokl
      domokl 22 July 2013 06: 46 New
      +3
      Quote: FC Skif
      S-Z00 IS A SELF-DEFENSE WEAPON. h

      lol Today I turned on the TV in the morning, watch the news. So they said that August is the sexiest month ... So it comes.
      We are used to thinking on a Russian scale, and in the East, distances are scanty ... So in defense you can strike at any country, especially with systems like 300's or some kind of Iskander ..
      1. FC SKIF
        FC SKIF 22 July 2013 06: 55 New
        +6
        I agree. There, the dwarf state of Israel has nightmares on its neighbors. Do they really think that they will never have something to answer? So I do not see in the long term the state of Israel in the Middle East.
        1. Sirocco
          Sirocco 22 July 2013 07: 37 New
          +6
          Quote: FC Skif
          I agree. There, the dwarf state of Israel has nightmares on its neighbors.

          I would like to see Israel without the support of the United States, I think he would have been blown away long ago. But in general, the United States did the right thing, stuck a splinter in the ass of the Arab world, and they hinder it from overseas. They themselves are far away, and they (the USA) do not give a damn about Israel patriots, who are pawns - cannon fodder in a foreign game. My opinion is that Israel is a chirium on a healthy body, which could not be treated medically, but it is not warmed, as a result it will be surgically removed. It's a question of time.
          1. Nayhas
            Nayhas 22 July 2013 08: 30 New
            0
            Quote: Sirocco
            I would like to see Israel without US support

            And what will happen to him?
            1. zvereok
              zvereok 22 July 2013 13: 59 New
              +4
              And what will happen to him?


              Well, at least the army itself will have to be maintained, which will ruin Israel, in years through 5-10 the question of economy or security will arise. In addition, the lack of powerful political and allied support will adversely affect violent heads.
              1. Pimply
                Pimply 22 July 2013 15: 28 New
                -1
                The United States transfers funds equivalent to those transferred to Egypt to Israel. It's just that in Egypt these funds are more biased into economic programs. US assistance to Israel - about 3 billion dollars from about 12-15 billion military budget. At the same time, the Americans receive in exchange various military technologies. This is so, for example.
                1. zvereok
                  zvereok 22 July 2013 16: 32 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Pimply
                  At the same time, the Americans receive in exchange various military technologies. This is so, for example.


                  Um ... Do they also sponsor the Israeli military-industrial complex?
                  1. Pimply
                    Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 16 New
                    0
                    More likely to limit. And they receive, for small investments, very interesting technologies. For example, the Arrow 3 rocket or the Iron Dome.
                    1. S-200
                      S-200 22 July 2013 19: 55 New
                      +1
                      Oh well....
                      "Based on the memorandum of understanding signed in 1988, the Arrow anti-missile system was created by joint efforts of specialists from the American corporation Lockheed Martin and the Israeli firm IAI."
                      US troops in December-January 2011 were to decide on the purchase of a new missile defense system to protect bases in Iraq and Afghanistan. It was expected that a choice could be made in favor of the Iron Dome missile defense system
                      and how many "domes" did you put in the USA ??
                2. S-200
                  S-200 22 July 2013 19: 51 New
                  +3
                  Quote: Pimply
                  At the same time, Americans receive in exchange various military technologies

                  I understand that without your (Israeli technology), the American military-industrial complex would be in the Stone Age? crying
                  1. Pimply
                    Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 13 New
                    +3
                    Quote: S-200
                    I understand that without your (Israeli technology), the American military-industrial complex would be in the Stone Age?

                    Have I written such nonsense somewhere? I wrote what I wrote - American subsidies are beneficial not only to Israel, but also to the USA. They are only partially beneficial to Israel — for the same amount, the United States supplies Egypt, for example, and sharply limits Israel’s capabilities in a number of ways. In addition, Israel gave for this money a fertile piece of land rich in oil and gas, twice its territory.
                3. Gecko
                  Gecko 23 July 2013 00: 19 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Pimply
                  The United States transfers funds equivalent to those transferred to Egypt to Israel.


                  Well, you compared Egypt with 80 million inhabitants and 8 million Israel.
                  1. Pimply
                    Pimply 23 July 2013 00: 50 New
                    0
                    Exactly. Egypt received back the Sinai, and receives money for various social programs and the army. Egypt, de facto, in terms of territory, resources, potential in a situation is much more advantageous than Israel.
                4. abdrah
                  abdrah 23 July 2013 02: 43 New
                  0
                  Well, this is about the United States if you look in the forehead at direct funding, but what about German help and reparations for the Holocaust? for example, how much jedi paid for the delivered submarines and their real value? Bitte link - http://topwar.ru/5713-na-dengi-germanii-izrail-stal-obladatelem-moschnogo-podvod
                  nogo-flota.html
                  and indeed in the Jewish economy and American aid there is not only financial aid, but also tax breaks and duty-free trade, industrial cooperation and much more. "The total amount of official American aid he receives alone corresponds to more than $ 1.000 per capita "
              2. dustycat
                dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 46 New
                +3
                Quote: zvereok

                Well, at least the army itself will have to be maintained, which will ruin Israel, in years through 5-10 the question of economy or security will arise. In addition, the lack of powerful political and allied support will adversely affect violent heads.

                Well, think instead of finishing free M16 mattresses, you will have to produce more of your Galilov and Tavor. They will simply hire more Arabs to sweep the chips from under the machines. At the same time, more well-fed Arabs will be less aggressive. Well, and even more shekels will be invested in their economy. Good gesheft.
          2. olviko
            olviko 22 July 2013 13: 39 New
            +1
            We say Israel - we mean the United States, we say the United States - we mean Israel, the God-chosen rule there and there. In former times, Israel was called the USA chain dog in the Middle East. While the United States is protecting Israel, the existence of the latter is ensured.
            1. zvereok
              zvereok 22 July 2013 14: 03 New
              +4
              Quote: olviko
              We say Israel - we mean the United States, we say the United States - we mean Israel, the God-chosen rule there and there. In former times, Israel was called the USA chain dog in the Middle East. While the United States is protecting Israel, the existence of the latter is ensured.


              In general, the dollar is the root of evil. While the United States can borrow from the whole world in its own currency, and print it in unlimited quantities, they will not live within their means.
            2. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 15: 28 New
              0
              Do you know that the United States began to show real interest in Israel only somewhere in 1969?
              1. dustycat
                dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 49 New
                0
                Quote: Pimply
                Do you know that the United States began to show real interest in Israel only somewhere in 1969?

                Well, modern history was taught very poorly in the USSR, and even worse in Russia.
                But the people did not read Soviet newspapers.
                Would read - would know.
                1. Pimply
                  Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 45 New
                  +1
                  Yes, with the history of most of those sitting here - full seams
          3. Pimply
            Pimply 22 July 2013 15: 15 New
            0
            Quote: Sirocco
            I would like to see Israel without US support

            Very simple and easy. Look at the history of Israel until 1969.
            1. shpuntik
              shpuntik 22 July 2013 17: 42 New
              0
              Pimpled (1) RU Today, 15:15 ↑
              Quote: Sirocco
              Look at the history of Israel until 1969.

              Absolutely right! We must not forget that the USSR advocated in the UN for the formation of the state of Israel.
              Interview on "Echo of Moscow":
              N. BOLTYANSKAYA: And where is Comrade Stalin, again?

              L. MLECHIN: Comrade Stalin did everything he could. At the UN, the Soviet delegation fought like a lion on the side of Israel. Just like a lion, defending and defending his rights. He supplied weapons. The first to be recognized de jure. The United States was the first to de facto. The first to de jure recognized the Soviet Union. "

              It turns out two ways: either the paradox with the "bad" Stalin or "everything is under control."
              I am inclined to believe that "everything is under control", but where will it lead? Considering the satanic government of the United States, these "hierophants" and all the rest of the five-pointed goat meat, and what they are doing, will it be good for the Jews themselves?
              Having destroyed (deposed and corrupted) Christianity in Europe, do they not chop the branch on which they sit? Won't they go on a wide front, through the streets of Jerusalem, those who were previously stoned. That is the question.
              1. Pimply
                Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 45 New
                0
                The issue is not the education of Israel. States are not formed by decision of the UN. The UN only declares the fact of recognition of the state by a number of other states.

                Quote: shpuntik
                It turns out two ways: either the paradox with the "bad" Stalin or "everything is under control."
                I am inclined to believe that "everything is under control", but where will it lead? Considering the satanic government of the United States, these "hierophants" and all the rest of the five-pointed goat meat, and what they are doing, will it be good for the Jews themselves?
                Having destroyed (deposed and corrupted) Christianity in Europe, do they not chop the branch on which they sit? Won't they go on a wide front, through the streets of Jerusalem, those who were previously stoned. That is the question.


                Listen, where did you go ??? What nonsense?
                1. shpuntik
                  shpuntik 22 July 2013 22: 37 New
                  0
                  Pimpled (1) RU Today, 17:45 ↑
                  Listen, where did you go ??? What nonsense?

                  Not entirely nonsense, just a brief summary of the root of the problem. There is only one problem, in plain sight, it is wars. The media portray them mainly as an element, "the anger of the people." This is not true. There are ideologues, organizers, sponsors.
                  About "hierophants" is a general phrase referring to US policy and bankers.

                2. Rakti-kali
                  Rakti-kali 23 July 2013 00: 28 New
                  0
                  Quote: Pimply
                  The issue is not the education of Israel. States are not formed by decision of the UN. The UN only declares the fact of recognition of the state by a number of other states.

                  So did the UN do it on November 29, 1947, adopting resolution 181? Is Israel already recognized? Of course, it would be completely strange, given the fact that the Jewish state was proclaimed on May 14, 1948 in the museum building on Rothschild Boulevard in Tel Aviv ...
                  1. Pimply
                    Pimply 23 July 2013 00: 54 New
                    0
                    Quote: Rakti-Kali
                    So did the UN do it on November 29, 1947, adopting resolution 181? Is Israel already recognized? Of course, it would be completely strange, given the fact that the Jewish state was proclaimed on May 14, 1948 in the museum building on Rothschild Boulevard in Tel Aviv ...


                    Man, don’t get killed like that - you won’t kill anyway. If you are not in the know, the UN General Assembly resolution is advisory in nature. No more.
                    Neither in science nor in international law there is no single and universally recognized definition of the concept of "state".

                    The largest international organization - the UN - does not have the appropriate authority to determine whether a particular entity is a state or not. “The recognition of a new state or government is an act that only states and governments can commit or refuse to commit. As a rule, it means a willingness to establish diplomatic relations. The United Nations is neither a state nor a government, and therefore it does not have any authority to recognize a particular state or government. ”
                    1. Rakti-kali
                      Rakti-kali 23 July 2013 16: 43 New
                      0
                      Quote: Pimply
                      Man, don’t get killed like that - you won’t kill anyway.

                      Talk to your mom like that.
                      Quote: Pimply
                      If you are not in the know, the UN General Assembly resolution is advisory in nature. No more.

                      "You". I did not allow you to switch to "you".
                      Of course a recommendation ...
                      "3. The independent Arab and Jewish states and the special international regime of the City of Jerusalem, as indicated in Part III of this plan, must be created in Palestine, two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the country of the mandate, but in no case later than October 1, 1948. The borders of the Arab State, the Jewish State and the City of Jerusalem are described below in parts II and III.
                      But why do you need this - the follower of the Irgun and Lehi ...
                      Quote: Pimply
                      “The recognition of a new state or government is an act that only states and governments can commit or refuse to commit.

                      It is not worth replacing warm green - "recognition", as if not quite the same thing as "creation / proclamation" ...
                      Or without distortions, substitution of concepts and other tricks of the demagogue, you are not able to conduct discussion?
          4. dustycat
            dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 37 New
            +2
            Quote: Sirocco
            But in general, the United States did the right thing, stuck a splinter in the ass of the Arab world, and they hinder it from overseas.

            And what have they?
            It is the British (not without kick from Uncle Joe) who have unsuccessfully figured out what to do with the remains of the Holocaust.
            And the mattress covers simply expose their relatives in black - nothing personal - just a gesheft.
        2. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 19: 24 New
          +2
          Quote: FC Skiff
          I agree. There, the dwarf state of Israel has nightmares on its neighbors. Do they really think that they will never have something to answer? So I do not see in the long term the state of Israel in the Middle East.

          Why so? I don’t know how in the long run, but for now, according to the forecasts of demographers in 2035, this is not so far, in Israel there will be more than 8mln Jews. At the time of Independence in 1948, there were less than 700tys of them. Israel's GDP for 2012 year amounted to 236 billion $ and 32tys per capita. Roads, interchanges, cities are being built. So everything is all right.
          1. dustycat
            dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 56 New
            0
            Quote: Aaron Zawi
            Israel's GDP for 2012 amounted to $ 236 billion and $ 32 thousand per capita. Roads, interchanges, cities are being built. So everything is all right.


            And do not give back for using 10 years any Kuril island for ten years to use your government?
            At the same time, they will clean our elite ... maybe .. winked
            And you look at your bloodlines in Russia more kindly start ..
            For the well-fed belly, most Russians do not care what Sidorov-Kassir is ..
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 47 New
              +2
              Will not help. Again it will go - Jews blood from Russia 8).
      2. dustycat
        dustycat 22 July 2013 21: 33 New
        0
        Quote: domokl

        lol Today I turned on the TV in the morning, watch the news. So they said that August is the sexiest month ... So it comes.
        We are used to thinking on a Russian scale, and in the East, distances are scanty ... So in defense you can strike at any country, especially with systems like 300's or some kind of Iskander ..

        Spookha .. Another 200 days before the command "light".
    2. zvereok
      zvereok 22 July 2013 13: 54 New
      +4
      Quote: FC Skif
      S-Z00 IS A SELF-DEFENSE WEAPON. SOMETHING ON THAT SIDE of the Dutch heights are so excited. The Syrians will have no time for 50 years before the attacks on the Israelis, then they will need to rebuild the country again, and it is not known when.


      Everything is logical, the Jews recall Egyptian slavery when they built the Pyramids, so they are afraid that they will be plowed, to restore Syria)))
  3. serge-68-68
    serge-68-68 22 July 2013 06: 42 New
    +4
    The fate of the Syrian S-300 has not been determined. Israel's readiness to destroy these complexes is clear before being placed on a database. Neither Israel's readiness to destroy the Russian specialists serving this complex, nor Russia's willingness to sacrifice its own people, is clear. It is obvious that for the "quiet" deployment and deployment of the S-300 on combat duty, cover by Russian army units is necessary. But neither Russia nor Syria (war) is ready for this.
    Destruction of C-300 during the deployment phase will not drop the prestige of the system. The main problem is not to destroy a certain critical number of Russian specialists (but what?).
    1. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 06: 51 New
      +1
      Quote: serge-68-68

      Destruction of C-300 during the deployment phase will not drop the prestige of the system. The main problem is not to destroy a certain critical number of Russian specialists (but what?).

      Yes, no number of Russians should die in our BV showdown. In the end, this is our headache with the Syrians and we have to solve it.
      1. domokl
        domokl 22 July 2013 06: 54 New
        +9
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        In the end, this is our headache with the Syrians and we have to solve it.

        I would like it to be that way. Only the realities are such that it doesn’t work that way. On the Syrian side, it’s probably more or less as you wrote, but on the opposite?
        BV disassembly, after all these events, now our problem is both Chinese and Turkish .. not to mention the American ..
      2. serge-68-68
        serge-68-68 22 July 2013 06: 55 New
        +6
        Aronu Zaavi: I would think so too, but the military (and special) history of Israel speaks in the name of state security (and in some cases out of state revenge), the Israeli commanders agree with the principle of "cutting wood - chips fly." Therefore, I affirm that for Israel (and for Russia) only the size of the "chips" is critical.
      3. Alexei
        Alexei 22 July 2013 07: 09 New
        11
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        In the end, this is our headache with the Syrians and we have to solve it.

        You have too many supporters who contribute to business, and in Syria - the cat has cried, don’t you?
      4. Sirocco
        Sirocco 22 July 2013 08: 05 New
        +6
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        in our BV showdowns

        I think you didn’t come into the world yesterday, It’s not your showdown, but ours, since Russia is the target in this mess. I want to emphasize that instability belt around the Russian Federation is created artificially, with the direct participation of Israel. Like the state of Israel placed artificially into the Arab world. (I emphasize that Israel was specially created and placed, for what?). Let's not hypocrite and cast a shadow on the fence. There is a redistribution of spheres of influence, and Israel is not in our camp, as a result of which there are possible problems from the Russian Federation in Israel. After all, there are many of our exes, but as we know, they are not former.
      5. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 22 July 2013 08: 32 New
        17
        Quote: Aron Zaavi
        x In the end, this is our headache with the Syrians and we have to solve it.

        You would not climb into Syria, then there would be no headache. You yourself created a pain in the neck.
        1. Rumata
          Rumata 22 July 2013 08: 54 New
          -5
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          You would not climb into Syria, then there would be no headache. You yourself created a pain in the neck.

          Therefore, this is our headache. Before the whole story of the S-300, most of those who express their opinions here, and they didn’t know what kind of relations between Israel and Syria were. Yes, and still do not know that for 40 years there has been a sluggish war, they make problems for us, we give them. It is precisely because many do not know this, or pretend that they do not know, there are so many angry comments about the violation of the airspace of a sovereign country that this is tantamount to a declaration of war. Although it didn’t end when, Assad even offered the Golan Heights at one time. It didn’t help; sponsoring Iran is more important ...
          1. Sirocco
            Sirocco 22 July 2013 09: 09 New
            +5
            Increasingly, I began to think about why they hate the Jews, do not tell me? I would like to hear an answer from a representative of the nation, Only if you are a real Jew, and not from our former ones, since this is no longer a Jew.
            1. Scoun
              Scoun 22 July 2013 12: 59 New
              +4
              Quote: Sirocco
              I began to think more and more often

              about a month ago, I watched a dispute between Evgeny (pimply) and a forum member (I don’t remember nickname), so there Evgeni managed to put himself up higher .. and he said the following.
              Scoun RU June 4, 2013 11:59 | Israel military women punished for naughty photos posted on Facebook
              Quote: Pimply
              A Jew, accordingly, is judged stricter in the next world

              as in a joke.

              Armenian and Georgians are trading at the market.
              Armenian says:
              - And the Armenians are better than the Georgians!
              The Georgian is silent. Armenian again:
              - And the Armenians are better than the Georgians!
              The Georgian is silent again.
              - And the Armenians are better than the Georgians!
              The furious Georgian could not stand it:
              - Well, what are they better than ?!
              - Than the Georgians!


              generally vicious circle))))
            2. 12345
              12345 22 July 2013 13: 17 New
              15
              "It doesn't matter who you are, what matters is WHAT you are!" (Soviet cartoon "Chunya Pig")

              Jews are not a nation, Jews are an ideology. The foundation of this ideology is based on the Old Testament, the Talmud (several versions, but according to the principle "horseradish - radish is not sweeter"), on additional "works", such as, for example, "Shulchan Aruch" (the most notoriously known) and others.

              Read it - and you will understand everything. In a few words: they were oppressed - they took revenge, they took revenge - they were oppressed. Ideology is tailored to a narrow circle of "friends" who, acting together, crush "aliens" one by one. Basically - financially, but after gaining their state - and physically. In this case, all the principles of morality (do not kill, do not steal, do not break perjury, etc.) are canceled in relation to "strangers". Moreover, the "strangers" themselves are equated with animals. As a result - harassment from the state of residence and further - along the above described circle. Throughout history, right up to the creation of their own state.

              After the creation of the state, the paradigm changed somewhat, but not much. Inside the state, "ours" and "strangers" were again found, and in the foreign policy arena Israel acts like a juvenile bully, with an elder brother behind him.
              Nevertheless, it should be noted that the living of Jews in their own state, in general, has a beneficial effect on their mentality at the everyday level. Dependence on ideology, the so-called. "Jewry" - decreases. This causes a certain irritation in religious circles, to the point that, they say, the Jews created a state against the will of the Almighty, who ordered them to live in the diaspora.
              A Jew deprived of his ideology ceases to be a Jew and becomes an ordinary, sometimes even a very good person. Like, for example, a German, a former fascist who sincerely denied Nazism. The Jews even have a special procedure for excommunication from Jewry, which was carried out by such a famous person as the never-defeated world chess champion Robert Fisher.

              This proves once again that Jewry is a pure ideology. For the genes that determine the nationality of a person, no rites and spells can not be changed.
              1. faraon
                faraon 22 July 2013 13: 47 New
                -14
                Remember Dear forum users!
                "The Jew is baptized, that the thief is forgiven." Over the centuries it was a persecuted and destroyed nation, but to everyone's surprise, it was constantly reborn from the ashes. from the time of Moses they have remained the same as they were thousands of years ago. This is all at the genetic level. They remained so die-hard, but did not change their attitude towards the creator.
                1. 12345
                  12345 22 July 2013 14: 22 New
                  +7
                  Yes, slander yourself!

                  It is, of course, I do not argue - it is pleasant to feel yourself head and shoulders above all for the mere fact of your birth, in the "chosen estate". Again - the guaranteed support of the "tribesmen". But this is all "in theory".
                  In practice, however, there are only continuous troubles and one prospect: to become a "bargaining chip" or even "cannon fodder" at all.
                  And, do you need it? Or really, can’t wait to lie on the sacrificial altar? Or comfort yourself with hope: someone, but not me, someone, but not me, will become a victim of tomorrow?

                  After all, without sacrifices, in such a case, it is impossible in any way, because without sacrifices your flock becomes poorly managed, or even completely flees.

                  IMHO, Jewishness is akin to schizophrenia. On the whole, he is a normal person, but as far as a certain topic is concerned, then - "complete cuckoo"!
                  "Religious extremism" is called.
                  1. Andrew-001
                    Andrew-001 23 July 2013 01: 59 New
                    -1
                    Quote: 12345
                    .For centuries, it was a persecuted and destroyed nation

                    I understand that I would like to become the author of the "new history of Israel" - but why so crudely fantasize ?! They tried to destroy the Jewish people only twice in 5000 years of Jewish history - in Persia during the time of Prime Minister Ahasuerus and in Germany during the time of Chancellor Schicklgruber. While other (non-Jewish peoples) disappeared for nothing.
                    Quote: 12345
                    They remained so stubborn ...

                    Do not confuse stubbornness with cunning.
                    Quote: 12345
                    ... but unchanged in their attitude towards the creator.

                    Then where did the currents of reformism, Hasidism, Orthodox modernism, religious Zionism come from in Judaism, as well as such movements of Judaism as: reconstructivist, renovationist, humanistic.
                    Comrade faraon, after all, I asked you - learn your own story!

                    12345 You are not entirely fair in your IMHO:
                    Quote: 12345
                    Jewishness is akin to schizophrenia. On the whole, he is a normal person, but as far as a certain topic is concerned, then - "complete cuckoo"! "Religious extremism" is called.

                    Try to talk "on certain topics" with Orthodox Christians or Muslims - there will also be a "full cuckoo"! especially if these people are newly converted Orthodox / Jews / Muslims / etc. The less a person knows about his religion, the easier his religious extremism manifests itself.
                    1. Andrew-001
                      Andrew-001 23 July 2013 03: 48 New
                      0
                      I apologize - I didn’t see something, but the first three citations in my previous answer are by the author of gr. faraon. And the last one belongs to 12345.
                      1. 12345
                        12345 23 July 2013 23: 21 New
                        -1
                        Quote: Andrew-001
                        I apologize - I didn’t see something wrong


                        Yes, fullness, apologize! The usual reflex worked. Apparently - hereditary.

                        The same "faraon", whose quotes you so awkwardly tried to hang on me here, here, on the page of this forum (see below), has sincerely confessed to everything.

                        The meaning of his confessions boils down to the fact that if the Jews did not use meanness and arrogance (and, I believe that this list is far from complete and "tovarisch" is clearly modest) in relation to non-Jews, then the Jews, for more than 2000 years and would not have survived at all.

                        And so - EVERYTHING is justified. And indeed - THEIR faith in such behavior only welcomes.

                        The main message is "to survive at any cost".
                        But, Mr. "faraon", as I have already noted, is a very modest person and shyly kept silent about the fact that the main goal is not just to survive, but also to cash in. Again, do not hesitate in the means. I mean, again - at ANY cost.

                        Information for consideration:

                        The US is ruled by the Jewish lobby. Israel is NOT a SECRET state at all - the Rabbinate rules there.
                        Once in the USA, a review of local (!) Historians came out that found out that the USA had not lived peacefully in their entire (!!) history for a single year: they were constantly at war with someone.
                        Well, there is nothing to say about Israel at all - it is still a "dove of peace".

                        Now it’s clear - WHY are they like that? I - about the state and about the Jews.
                        "Evolution" made them so, but they chose it for themselves.

                        And, according to this - "All - to the garden!" ©. In other words - to the "historical" homeland, fortunately, grandfather Stalin took care of its creation in time.
                        And we don't need to "sing" how talented you are super-duper, and how we will be terribly bad without you. We will survive.

                        Here, at one time, we did not have Jews (almost), but MV Lomonosov, oddly enough, was!

                        And, the presence of the Pale of Settlement in no way prevented the appearance of Mendeleev, Butlerov, Stoletov, and all of them - and you can't list them! And to shout that someone had "Jewish" blood can only the Jews themselves - such great fans constantly mix completely different concepts, such as, for example: "black" with "sour".
                        For example, Vaserman is "never" a Jew. Just like the aforementioned Robert Fisher. But, try, prove it to a Jew!

                        Summary:

                        If you want to stay in the country, change your ideology to any: from Islam and Buddhism to the multiplication table. If you do not want to - if you please "into the garden."
                        Testing an informal approach to changing ideology - on the "lie detector".


                        PS. Personally, I prefer to sincerely believe in the multiplication table. She has never deceived me.
                      2. Andrew-001
                        Andrew-001 24 July 2013 00: 19 New
                        -1
                        Quote: 12345
                        Yes, fullness, apologize! The usual reflex worked. Apparently - hereditary.

                        If an error occurred in something - a decent person apologizes, it seems unfamiliar to you.
                        And you again twisted the phrases and accused me (and my ancestors) - a Russian person, a Slav, an atheist - of vile behavior.
                        Quote: 12345
                        All the same "faraon", whose quotes you so awkwardly tried to hang on me here

                        As you can see, you have not mastered your studies at school. At least the written text is not perceived in your head - nothing, I repeat - I PUBLICALLY apologized for the error I had made during the insertion of the QUOTATION.

                        Quote: 12345
                        The US is ruled by the Jewish lobby. Israel is NOT a SECRET state at all - the Rabbinate rules there.

                        You apparently steer both here and there - unlike me, who has never been there either - because you are all well aware that your impression is that you speak in the first person.


                        Quote: 12345
                        And, according to this - "All - to the garden!" ©. In other words - to the "historical" homeland, fortunately, grandfather Stalin took care of its creation in time.

                        Russia is an imperial type of country (in a good way), multinational — if you do not understand this — your fate is to live within the state of the Moscow Ring Road. The Russian people are assimilating other peoples. Individuals who violate Russian law are isolated from society or offered to pick up other states.
                        Quote: 12345
                        And we don't need to "sing" what super-duper talented you are

                        For this phrase in which you declare that I am a Jew (European non-religious Jews are smart and talented people, but I am still Russian and would prefer them to stay) - you gave me a direct answer - one of your parents belongs to this people. You are unhappy with this and are trying to become "holier than the Pope" - talk to the Jews and they will tell you that the most terrible Anim Semites are "former Jews".
              2. Rebus
                Rebus 22 July 2013 15: 57 New
                +1
                Quote: faraon
                Great states with a rich cultural past went into oblivion, peoples oppressing Jews went into oblivion, religions changed, but Jews from the time of Moses remained the same as thousands of years ago. This is all at the genetic level. They remained so stubborn, but their attitude remained unchanged to the creator.

                And in this, I do not agree
                American geneticist Dr. Eran Elhaik from Johns Hopkins School of Medicine, on the pages of the January issue of the journal Genome Biology and Evolution, claims that an analysis of more than half a million single-nucleotide mutations identified in the genomes of 1237 people representing the Jewish population of these territories (in total the genomes of representatives of 8 Jewish communities, not consisting in a kinship), as well as Caucasian, Asia Minor and Middle Eastern ethnic groups were investigated ...
                The first analysis showed that European Jews descend from the Khazar ancestors who lived in the North Caucasus, on the territory of the Khazar Khaganate ...
                http://www.pravda.ru/science/mysterious/past/23-01-2013/1142514-hazarya-0/

                That is, even science proves that Jews are not a nation or a race, but an ideology ...
                What is described in the Bible and the Torah does not apply to modern Jews!
                1. Pimply
                  Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 23 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Rebus
                  What is described in the Bible and the Torah does not apply to modern Jews!

                  Refers to. Because Judaism is both nationality and faith, and initially included not one or two ethnic groups. In the course, for example, that the wife of Moses belonged to the Negroid race? And the Jewish presence on the land of Israel persisted even during the years of the expulsion of the main population.
                  1. Rebus
                    Rebus 22 July 2013 16: 39 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Pimply
                    . In the course, for example, that the wife of Moses belonged to the Negroid race?

                    In the course ... But this, only confirms my statement. (Although Jethro was from a Semitic tribe ...)
                    1. Pimply
                      Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 17 New
                      -2
                      Than? The fact that Judaism absorbed many ethnic groups?
                    2. Rebus
                      Rebus 22 July 2013 17: 34 New
                      +5
                      Quote: Pimply
                      Than? The fact that Judaism absorbed many ethnic groups?

                      Read carefully what I wrote above. For you, I repeat: "Jews are not a nation, not a race or a religion, but an ideology ...". No more and no less ...
                    3. Pimply
                      Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 37 New
                      0
                      This is a nation. United also by one ideology. You can find an approximate correspondence with the Druze, only with the Druze today it is impossible to become.
                    4. Rebus
                      Rebus 22 July 2013 18: 13 New
                      +5
                      I willingly believe ... hi
                      But the word nation (natio) means, from Latin, literally - a tribe, a clan (from the Latin verb nat-give birth), which implies, at a minimum, outward similarity and belonging to one race. For example, the Yakut, Kalmyk nationalities are Mongoloids, and Yoruba, Zulu will always be Negroids, like Poles, Germans and French - Caucasians. But Jews, as a rule, can be both Negroids and Caucasians (both northern and southern type), which means they are not united by single genetic ancestors (as shown in the photo above).
                    5. Andrew-001
                      Andrew-001 23 July 2013 02: 11 New
                      0
                      Quote: Rebus
                      But the word nation (natio) means, from Latin, literally - tribe, clan (from the Latin verb nat-give birth)

                      Comrade Rebus, with all due respect to you - and your wife is one clan with you (you have one family) - or is she a stranger to you (she was originally from another family) (do not take my words for insult) ?!
                      So with Judaism - you can be born a Jew, but not grow up a religious person. And you can initially be a stranger (Russian, Chinese, French, etc.), but spiritually be one with the teachings of Judaism - and become a Jew.
                  2. Arkan
                    Arkan 23 July 2013 03: 25 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Pimply
                    This is a nation. United also by one ideology. You can find an approximate correspondence with the Druze, only with the Druze today it is impossible to become.

                    An interesting sect - each generation of Jews invents its own "history" and terminology (or simply distorts the meaning of events at its discretion ...). Zhenya, a couple of years ago you and I discussed the works of the Jewish historian (Zionist) Joseph Kastein, Hasn't he been dubbed an anti-Semite in Israel yet? His conclusions are too different from what today's Jews are chatting ...
                2. Arkan
                  Arkan 22 July 2013 20: 42 New
                  +6
                  Quote: Rebus
                  Jews are not a nation, not a race or a religion, but an ideology ... ". No more and no less ...

                  I totally agree with you! An ordinary sect calling itself "the people".
                3. Aaron Zawi
                  Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 21: 28 New
                  -1
                  Quote: Arkan
                  Quote: Rebus
                  Jews are not a nation, not a race or a religion, but an ideology ... ". No more and no less ...

                  I totally agree with you! An ordinary sect calling itself "the people".

                  New stars of hebraistics. laughing
                4. Pimply
                  Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 15 New
                  0
                  Well, who would doubt that you would express yourself in a similar spirit
  4. zvereok
    zvereok 22 July 2013 14: 10 New
    0
    Quote: 12345
    Read it - and you will understand everything. In a few words: they were oppressed - they took revenge, they took revenge - they were oppressed. Ideology is tailored to a narrow circle of "friends" who, acting together, crush "aliens" one by one. Basically - financially, but after gaining their state - and physically. At the same time, all moral principles (do not kill, do not steal, do not break perjury, etc.) are canceled in relation to "strangers". Moreover, the "strangers" themselves are equated with animals. As a result - harassment from the state of residence and further - along the above described circle. Throughout history, right up to the creation of your state


    For the sake of justice: - What about the Muslims in relation to the "infidels"?
    1. 12345
      12345 22 July 2013 14: 40 New
      +5
      This is the whole "trick"!

      For what the Jews sincerely hate Christ and Mohammed, it is because the latter expanded the circle of "theirs" so much that it became impossible to extract material gesheft from the cohesive NARROW circle.
      It's like living in Israel today. EVERYTHING around is "ours". And who will you "hunt in a pack" for? Today, with the development of production, it has become possible not to live in poverty, remaining a loner. And even then, until you face the arbitrariness of the authorities. Well, then it turns out that the diaspora is power!

      And it all began with Christ, who began to accept in his sect all those who did not fall.
      All !!! Well, how can I forgive him after THIS?

      Remember what a difficult procedure is on the path of initiation "into the Jews." It's good if you prove that mom is Jewish, but what if not?
      Thought - did "giyur" - circumcision and already - a Jew? Yeah ... Right now, s-s-s! ..
      This is done by Muslims, circumcised - and it's done! And, the Jews - "sorry - move over"!

      So, for all claims to Christianity and Islam, a fairly comprehensive answer is given by one bearded anecdote:

      “And why do legs smell so bad?”
      - Ah, you remember about the place from which they grow ...
      1. Pimply
        Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 50 New
        0
        Quote: 12345
        And it all began with Christ, who began to accept in his sect all those who did not fall.

        Let's start with the fact that anyone can become a Jew. Simultaneously by nationality and by faith. Study and passing the exam - the so-called. passing the conversion. Conversion is a deliberate choice of faith and nationality with a specific code of conduct and understanding of procedures. There is no "chick" and that's it. The choice of faith is an important spiritual process and must be accompanied by a CONSCIOUS choice.

        Now about Christianity. You are illiterate and trying to reason in your ignorance about what you don’t know about. Do you know that initially, in order to become a Christian, you had to become a Jew. And only then, because of the apostle Paul, who said that he had a vision of Christ, was the procedure as simplified as possible?

        Do not shine with your ignorance - it blinds.
        1. 12345
          12345 22 July 2013 17: 36 New
          +5
          Quote: Pimply
          To begin with, anyone can become a Jew. At the same time, both by nationality and faith.


          This could be the end, as the totality of national characteristics is determined solely by the genotype - in other words, by a set of chromosomes, which even your usual hutspa will not help to change with the help of a razor.

          About "an important spiritual process, and which must be accompanied by a CONSCIOUS choice," it is kneshn - hefty enticing, if not for one real "trifle". Literally - "trifle".

          What kind of "CONSCIOUS choice" can there be for ... a baby? Nevertheless, if he was born to a Jewish mother, no one even stutters about it, right?

          "About Christianity" - and ... WHAT? If Christianity was originally a Jewish sect, then it is quite natural that its first adepts were baptized Jews.

          And, whether there was an obligation to become a Jew first and only then - a Christian, this is already a controversial issue. Given the indestructible craving of the Jews, everything is distorted.
          Show me the "Gospel of Mary Magdalene". With a smart look.

          At the stage of formation of any religion, there are their own apocrypha. I talked about already established traditions.

          Quote: Pimply
          Do not shine with your ignorance - it blinds.


          But I’m thinking everything - why did it bother you so much? Scientist with genetic surgery using a razor for circumcision.
          Your avatar with Freud settings - that ... Correlates!
          1. Pimply
            Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 42 New
            -7
            Quote: 12345


            This could be the end, as the totality of national characteristics is determined solely by the genotype - in other words, by a set of chromosomes, which even your usual hutspa will not help to change with the help of a razor.


            You are our radiant one, you can’t imagine what immense pleasure I am now delivering - not understanding about 90% of what you say, you are trying to put words like hutspa, talk about race, genotype, religion.

            There is such a thing - education. Take care of them. Adios.
          2. 12345
            12345 22 July 2013 18: 48 New
            +9
            Quote: Pimply
            There is such a thing - education. Take care of them. Adios.


            Oh no no no! And, how are you talking about "Astalavista baby!" - forgot? Disorder, especially for such a "tough pepper" as you think you are here.

            We used to call it in childhood: "Prokakal - and into the swamp!", Mr. Gumpy.

            You may even consider yourself an educated person, but, I dare say, between just Education and the so-called. "religious education", the same distance as between Chemistry and ... Alchemy.

            Genes are a kind of "building blocks" of heredity, do not obey the nasal lamentations of the rabbis, no matter how much the latter would like to, alas.

            And the "creation" of the World did not happen about 6 thousand years ago, but much earlier. A thousand, that is, six hundred times earlier, when it comes to the Solar System.

            However, no one is encroaching on your faith, continue to believe that the world rests on the Big Turtle, and the genes (probably from fear) obey the verbal instructions of the rabbis, at the mere sight of a sharpened razor ...
          3. Pimply
            Pimply 22 July 2013 18: 49 New
            -2
            Dear you are an ignoramus. But this is not the problem. The trouble is that you are an ignoramus - militant. Not ready to learn and boast of his ignorance. Peace to you. Shalom.
          4. The comment was deleted.
          5. Pimply
            Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 49 New
            0
            Ingenious. You did not become less ignorant of this speech.
          6. 12345
            12345 22 July 2013 23: 29 New
            +3
            "You can't embrace the immensity" (Kozma Prutkov)

            However, they themselves would have flashed, perhaps with a "scattering of knowledge", at least from some thread of the region. And then your monotonous "ignorant ignoramus" green reminds me of a character from a madhouse in the French film "Unlucky".
            This character, too, repeated only one thing to everyone: "P_durk! P_ridurok!"

            You, for an hour, have not been treated for mental illness? Jews suffer from this much more often than the rest of the world's population. The fruits of frequent marriages to cousins, in an attempt to preserve capital "in the family."
          7. Pimply
            Pimply 23 July 2013 00: 56 New
            0
            Everything is fine. You issued another speech. But where is the knowledge?
      2. Andrew-001
        Andrew-001 23 July 2013 02: 27 New
        0
        Quote: 12345
        A person painting himself avatars like yours is probably deeply unhappy in life.

        Let’s still talk about the meaning of the article. And then you already go to the individual without knowing what to answer.
        I also do not agree with much in your words - but I do not put forward thoughts why your login consists of the first five digits in order.
        Let me remind you that an article about S-300 complexes, Syria and Israel repeat
  5. Andrew-001
    Andrew-001 23 July 2013 02: 21 New
    0
    Quote: 12345
    About "an important spiritual process, and which must be accompanied by a CONSCIOUS choice", it is kneshna - hefty enticing, if not just one real "trifle". Literally - "little thing"
    What kind of "CONSCIOUS choice" can there be for ... a baby?

    My friend, you’re doing a brazen undermining under Christianity! Orthodoxy has a tradition of baptizing a baby for 40 days.
    Have you heard about the Federal Law of the Russian Federation of June 29, 2013 N 136-FZ, Moscow "On Amendments to Article 148 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation and Certain Legislative Acts of the Russian Federation in order to counteract insult to the religious beliefs and feelings of citizens?"
    And with one comment you insulted the religious feelings of two world religions.
  • shpuntik
    shpuntik 22 July 2013 18: 38 New
    +1
    Pimpled (1) RU Today, 16:50 ↑
    Do you know that initially, in order to become a Christian, you had to become a Jew. And only then, because of the apostle Paul, who said that he had a vision of Christ, was the procedure as simplified as possible?

    Eugene, "initially", apparently a short period of time, before the ascension (40 days). I am not a great specialist in history, but there is such a phrase in the Gospel:
    "Amen, I say to you, that you, who walked after Me, into life, when the Son of man sits on the throne of His glory, you will also sit on the throne of twelve, judging by the tenth tribe of Israel."

    Therefore, apparently, only the first twelve.
    Here is the interpretation:
    "But what do the words mean: Judge the tribe of Israel? That they will condemn them; the apostles will not sit as judges; but in what sense did the Lord say about the Queen of the South that she would condemn that race, and about the Ninevites that they would condemn them , in the same he speaks of the apostles.Therefore, he did not say: judging by the tongue and the universe, but: the tribe of Israel.The Jews were brought up in the same laws and according to the same customs, and led the same way of life as the apostles. Therefore, when they, in their defense, say that we could not believe in Chris because the law forbade us to accept His commandments, then the Lord, pointing out to them the apostles who had the same law with them and yet believed, will condemn them all as He said earlier: for this reason, you will be judged (Matt. XII, 27). "

    http://bible.optina.ru/new:mf:19:27#svt_ioann_zlatoust
    So that everything will be fine good
    1. Pimply
      Pimply 22 July 2013 18: 47 New
      0
      Quote: shpuntik
      Therefore, apparently, only the first twelve.

      Express yourself somehow more attentively
    2. shpuntik
      shpuntik 22 July 2013 22: 29 New
      0
      Pimpled (1) RU Today, 18:47 ↑
      Quote: shpuntik
      Therefore, apparently, only the first twelve.
      Express yourself somehow more attentively

      The "first twelve" are the apostles. What John the Baptist did is a little different.
    3. Pimply
      Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 50 New
      -2
      And what does John the Baptist have to do with the traditional rite of washing in the mikvah?
    4. shpuntik
      shpuntik 23 July 2013 02: 31 New
      +1
      Pimpled (1) RU Yesterday, 22:50 PM ↑
      And what does John the Baptist have to do with the traditional rite of washing in the mikvah?

      What kind of tradition is this for which they cut off their heads? request
      Stick-trees, now I’ll try to explain what I mean. You said that before the Apostle Paul, only Jews could be Christians. I gave an example to confirm your words: the fact that the 12 apostles were Jews (instead of Judas, the apostle Matthew was called, EMP). And Paul was among them, respectively, this happened in a short period of time: from the crucifixion of Christ to his ascension (40th day), and on the 50th day (Pentecost)
      there was the appearance of Christ to the apostles - they accepted the Holy Spirit, and after that they began to speak in different languages ​​and were able to preach as they should, went to different countries.

      "Vv. 22-23 Having said this, he breathed, and said to them: Receive the Holy Spirit. To whom you forgive sins, to him will be forgiven; on whom you leave, on whom they will remain."
      http://bible.optina.ru/new:in:20:22
      John the Baptist, in the Orthodox tradition, baptized with water and called for repentance:
      "7 And he preached, saying, The Strongest of me is coming after me, from whom I am not worthy, stooping down to untie the strap of His shoes; 8 I baptized you with water, but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit."
      9 And it was in those days that Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan.
      10And when he came out of the water, John immediately saw the heavens and the Spirit expanding, like a dove descending on Him.
      11A voice was from heaven: You are my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
      12 Immediately thereafter, the Spirit leads Him into the wilderness. "

      http://days.pravoslavie.ru/Bible/C18490.htm
  • fisherman
    fisherman 23 July 2013 01: 33 New
    +1
    Express yourself somehow more attentively



    Therefore, when in their defense they say that we could not believe in Chris because the law forbade us to receive His commandments, the Lord, pointing them to the apostles who had the same law with them and yet believed,
  • Andrew-001
    Andrew-001 23 July 2013 01: 37 New
    -2
    Quote: 12345
    Jews are not a nation; Jews are an ideology.

    3000, 2000, even 500 years ago, the concept of a nation did not exist yet. There were the concepts of "religion" and "citizenship". And religion is ideology.
    Quote: 12345
    Jews are an ideology. The foundation of this ideology is based on the Old Testament

    The ideology of Orthodoxy, Catholicism, Protestantism, etc. is also based on the Old Testament. - and what do you think - the patriarch of All Russia or the Pope are Jews ?!
    Quote: 12345
    Talmud (several versions, but according to the principle "horseradish - radish is not sweeter"), on additional "works", such as, for example, "Shulchan Aruch" (most notoriously known) and others. Read it - and you will understand everything.

    I got acquainted and understood everything - you are breaching on black. Talmud - a book of household purposes. Shulkhan Arukh is a book of explanations for Jewish religious traditions. If you thought that it says how to bake matzo on the blood of Christian babies, then you were very mistaken.
    Quote: 12345
    At the same time, all moral principles (do not kill, do not steal, do not break perjury, etc.) are canceled in relation to "strangers".

    You would rather not watch cartoons near-religious, but take and read the Old Testament (the original book in Hebrew is called the Torah).
    Quote: 12345
    in the foreign policy arena, Israel acts as a juvenile bully who has an older urka brother behind him.

    I agree with this - but keep in mind that small states can never be truly independent. In this case, little Izzy is politically dependent on the States.

    Quote: 12345
    Jews even have a special procedure for excommunication from Jewry

    The same procedure exists in Orthodoxy and in Catholicism (and possibly in Islam - who is familiar with Islam - specify this point for me). And according to your logic, a person excommunicated from the Orthodox Church automatically becomes a good person
    Quote: 12345
    such as
    Russian writer Leo Tolstoy ?!
    In my opinion, you have in your head a wild mishmash of domestic anti-Semitism with a dash. This happens wassat , do not be offended. But it is not necessary to mix "History of the Ancient World", "Foundations of Religious Culture" and "Modern Political Systems" into one heap.
  • Sirocco
    Sirocco 23 July 2013 02: 46 New
    0
    This is what bothers me in the Promised Land. Why in the Holy Land, so much blood is pouring. Maybe all the same, this promised Land is not there, for I doubt that such killings are pleasing to God. Maybe we are bred as suckers, another historical lie? Maybe someone was interested in this?
  • tilovaykrisa
    tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 13: 19 New
    +1
    just rootless cosmopolitans)))
  • Alexei
    Alexei 22 July 2013 11: 26 New
    +4
    Quote: Rumata
    Therefore, this is our headache.

    Something your headache has worsened at such a "suitable" moment for Syria. Not weird? Conveniently? The S-300 can be cured for this disease.
    1. Rumata
      Rumata 22 July 2013 11: 40 New
      -4
      Quote: Alexej
      Something your headache has worsened at such a "suitable" moment for Syria. Not weird? Conveniently? The S-300 can be cured for this disease.

      No, it’s just now that everything that’s happening here is on your hearing because of the history of S-300 shipments and the interest of the Russian media. Someone bombed factories in Sudan, a couple of days later they forgot if there were supplies of S-300 to Sudan they would talk about this plant for a month. Egypt is also a problem, Israel does not even comment on what is happening and certainly does not bomb anyone.
      If there had not been a civil war in Syria, and Israel would have bombed a convoy with weapons for Hazbullah, they would have talked about this and forgot about what happened with the reactor in 2007.

      Assad is now clamped. On the one hand, he needs the help of Hazbullah and Iran, everyone saw how effective they were in Al Quseir. And I think everyone knows exactly what Nasrallah wants from Assad for help. On the other hand, Assad does not want a confrontation with Israel, which will definitely interfere with attempts to arm Hezbollah ...
      1. Alexei
        Alexei 22 July 2013 11: 59 New
        +4
        Quote: Rumata
        No, it’s just now that everything that’s happening here is on your hearing because of the history of C-300 supplies and the interest of the Russian media.

        Still not convinced. Now is a convenient moment for you, I think you will not deny it. The interest of the Russian media is also due to the civil war (if you can call it that). S-300 is a defensive weapon, and Syria does not have nuclear missiles, unlike you, so someone, and you certainly should not let a tear go.
        1. Pimply
          Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 52 New
          -5
          S-300 conditionally defensive weapon. Which can, for example, bring down civilian liners. Or defend a convoy with Hezbollah missiles.
      2. zvereok
        zvereok 22 July 2013 14: 16 New
        +2
        Quote: Rumata
        everyone saw how effective they were in Al Quseir.


        Here mlyn, I read on the Israeli forum that they are extremely ineffective, and hundreds of them are buried. "Hezbalah can effectively use guerrilla tactics, set up ambushes, but when it met with the same tactics, it turned out to be extremely ineffective." And yet, at the same forum, Assad and his ineffective army have been buried for two years now, either monthly or quarterly, "firmly stating that Assad has a couple of months left."
  • Constantine
    Constantine 22 July 2013 11: 47 New
    +8
    2 Rumata,

    As far as I know, you are making problems for all your neighbors and you are using military force without any reason, hiding behind preemptive strikes. Just look at how you showed aggression against Palestine.

    Doesn’t it resemble a picture? That's right - the virus :)

    No offense, but you iterate realistically. Paradoxically, he saved Jews in the 40s, including and the Soviet Union, which was then destroyed by your comrades, and what was left of it, the Jews tried to destroy directly.
    1. Scoun
      Scoun 22 July 2013 13: 34 New
      +4
      Quote: Constantine
      Doesn’t it resemble a picture? That's right - the virus :)

      generally picture tin .... dissection absorption dissection absorption ...
      Reminds of how the Irish were genocidal by the British by "strangulation".
      1. Pimply
        Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 54 New
        -2
        The picture is tin because it is a lie.
    2. Pimply
      Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 54 New
      -2
      It’s certainly wonderful to post once a picture. Only there should be about three colors. Green until 1948 should be displayed at approximately the same points as white. There was no separate state under the control of the Arabs to put such a picture so boldly.
  • Scoun
    Scoun 22 July 2013 12: 42 New
    +2
    Quote: Rumata
    Assad even the Golan Heights, at one time, offered. It didn’t help; sponsoring Iran is more important ...

    and Turkey acted as a mediator who then famously wrapped up the peace talks and put up a fat cross. This is ONCE.
    Two.
    But now you can say that Israel even offered "heights" and the bad Assad refused.
    Three.
    To whose tune the "peace negotiator" is dancing Turkey is not exactly the kind of country that crawls out of its skin just to help the Syrians in plundering the country and other abominations
    And of course Israel "distances itself" from Turkey by ruling the Turks with its left hand from the United States.
  • Andrew-001
    Andrew-001 22 July 2013 18: 32 New
    +3
    Rumata, you still laugh at us.
    Quote: Rumata
    Assad even the Golan Heights, at one time, offered

    In fact, the Golan Heights and so belong to Syria. Your country simply occupied them - look at old maps printed OUTSIDE Israel and the USA. And you offered Syria its own land, and even set your conditions.
    1. Pimply
      Pimply 22 July 2013 18: 36 New
      -3
      Syria lost the Golan in the war. At present, the Golan belongs to Israel longer than Syria.
      1. Andrew-001
        Andrew-001 22 July 2013 18: 58 New
        +4
        Quote: Pimply
        Syria lost the Golan in the war. ...

        Officially, the war between you is not over yet, so the Golan is Syrian territory occupied by Israel.
        Quote: Pimply
        ... At the moment, the Golan belongs to Israel longer than Syria.

        Following your logic, if I throw you out of your apartment - and live in it at least 5 minutes longer than you - will this apartment be mine ?!
        1. Pimply
          Pimply 22 July 2013 19: 08 New
          0
          Quote: Andrew-001
          Following your logic, if I throw you out of your apartment - and live in it at least 5 minutes longer than you - will this apartment be mine ?!

          And here we come to the question of the existence of Israel, right? Jews (most) were kicked out of their apartment. They are back. Arab states have not come to terms with this situation. Syria, among others, acted as an aggressor. And she lost that piece of land that she considered her own. That's all.
          1. Andrew-001
            Andrew-001 22 July 2013 19: 34 New
            +4
            Bumpy, I will now start to kick both Zionists and anti-Semites, but I will still express my opinion: the so-called "Palestinian territories" are the territory of Israel. In 1967, the Arabs living there voluntarily left these lands at the request of the King of Jordan.

            But the Golan is Syria. And they can become the territory of Israel only if Syria cedes them at the official level - and this will happen only if the united Israel-USA-Al-Qaeda bloc wins in the current Syrian conflict.
            But fortunately, circumstances are not in favor of international terrorists.
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 19 New
              0
              Quote: Andrew-001
              But the Golan is Syria. And they can become the territory of Israel only if Syria cedes them at the official level - and this will happen only if the united Israel-USA-Al-Qaeda bloc wins in the current Syrian conflict.
              But fortunately, circumstances are not in favor of international terrorists.

              I will tell you so. Territorial integrity is generally a very controversial topic. The Spaniards still consider their Gibraaltar, for example, and the Argentines - the Falklands. Japan imagines that the Kuril Islands are its islands, and in China they lick their lips on a dozen neighboring countries.

              Different countries have different opinions. The fact is that Syria lost the Golan during the war, and could not recapture them. Israel annexed the territory. How legitimate it is is a question. If only because there are no established norms of international law in this matter. As, however, there is no international law as such.
  • dustycat
    dustycat 22 July 2013 22: 08 New
    +2
    Quote: Rumata
    Prior to the entire history of the S-300, most of those who express their opinions here did not know what kind of relations between Israel and Syria were.

    Well, this one is easier a ..
    Here, not all victims of the exam. Secondly.
    And you are not in the Anglo-Saxon-speaking forum! Firstly.
    This is Georgia somewhere in North America, and Syria is a street in Chicago or the Chinese district in LosAngelos.
    Here the majority is aware of which Mediterranean country has the Russian Navy. And there are many who know in which hemisphere it is to begin to search.
  • Pimply
    Pimply 22 July 2013 15: 39 New
    -5
    Sasha, Syria is a country bordering Israel, a country with which Israel has had a war started by Syria since 1948. What does it mean they themselves have created a smut, and "would not climb." Kindergarten of some kind. Are you asking Israel to clean the knife with which they will cut it?
    1. revnagan
      revnagan 22 July 2013 16: 54 New
      +1
      Quote: Pimply
      Sasha, Syria - a country bordering with Israel, a country with which Israel has had a war since 1948 launched by Syria.

      Yeah, the Israelis lived for centuries in their Israel, didn’t touch anyone, suddenly appeared out of nowhere ... Syria in the BV is next to Israel. And let’s attack him, unreasonably, poorly.
      1. Pimply
        Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 18 New
        -1
        Do you know when Syria appeared as a state? In the 1940th year.
        1. Rakti-kali
          Rakti-kali 23 July 2013 19: 04 New
          0
          Quote: Pimply
          Do you know when Syria appeared as a state? In the 1940th year.

          In 1920, the Syrian Arab Kingdom was founded with a center in Damascus. Faisal of the Hashemite dynasty, who later became king of Iraq, was declared king. But Syrian independence did not last long. Within a few months, the French army occupied Syria, defeating the Syrian forces in the battle at the Meisalun Pass on July 23.
  • DEfindER
    DEfindER 22 July 2013 11: 34 New
    +2
    Quote: Aron Zaavi
    Yes, no number of Russians should die in our BV showdown. In the end, this is our headache with the Syrians and we have to solve it.

    Actually, it’s not quite so, how many American specialists and especially American modern weapons are in Israel? Israel alone would not exist without such support. And Syria is now without support at all, because all the weapons are still from Soviet deliveries, there are no consultants, and modern ones aren’t even attacking even defensive systems .. not to mention the civil war. It is generally unacceptable to place an equal sign with Israel.
    1. Pimply
      Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 55 New
      -2
      Quote: DEfindER
      in israeli american specialists

      In fact, not so much. Israel initially had a powerful scientific and technological base
  • tilovaykrisa
    tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 13: 17 New
    -1
    Syria was able to independently, once and for all, solve its headache in the form of state education "Israel" because it sounds better, don't you think?
  • stroporez
    stroporez 22 July 2013 17: 19 New
    0
    for a long time ------ not your ............ I think, from the nuclear brass knuckles that Israel is so painstakingly hiding, the whole world will expect more blood ........
  • dustycat
    dustycat 22 July 2013 22: 02 New
    +1
    Quote: Aaron Zawi
    Yes, no number of Russians should die in our BV showdown. In the end, this is our headache with the Syrians and we have to solve it.

    Well, someone must separate you.
    Moreover, after each of your mouse fights in Russia, another sort of guest workers appears.
    We still need them?! So that you live like that!
  • Black Colonel
    Black Colonel 22 July 2013 11: 27 New
    11
    To begin with, the S-300 needs to be placed on the base in Tartus "to provide air cover for the support base of the Russian Navy." And after setting these complexes on the DB, already under their cover, put on the S-300 DB already in other regions of Syria, at the same time tying the rest of the existing air defense systems into the general air defense structure of the country.
    1. Hauptmann emil
      Hauptmann emil 22 July 2013 11: 34 New
      +5
      This would probably be the best option. First, "catch on", and then expand the area of ​​responsibility. In addition to guarding Tartus, a couple of battalions of marines should also send a "duty" missile boat.
      1. zvereok
        zvereok 22 July 2013 14: 21 New
        -2
        It seems that the last 2 employees were evacuated from Tartus a couple of months ago. If not disinformation, but no one began to refute.
        1. Hauptmann emil
          Hauptmann emil 22 July 2013 15: 38 New
          +3
          http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/20130627171607.shtml опровержение. Надеюсь это правда. И наши не собираются оставлять Тартус.
          1. zvereok
            zvereok 22 July 2013 16: 47 New
            +1
            Quote: Hauptmann Emil
            http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/20130627171607.shtml опровержение. Надеюсь это правда. И наши не собираются оставлять Тартус.

            So do I. Thanks for the link.
    2. Constantine
      Constantine 22 July 2013 12: 55 New
      -1
      Quote: Black Colonel
      To begin with, the S-300 needs to be placed on the base in Tartus "to provide air cover for the support base of the Russian Navy." And after setting these complexes on the DB, already under their cover, put on the S-300 DB already in other regions of Syria, at the same time tying the rest of the existing air defense systems into the general air defense structure of the country.


      Controversial point because It’s one thing if the Syrian Air Force knocked down the Israeli Air Force’s plane, and it’s quite another if ours knocked down in the absence of a direct threat to the base.
      1. olviko
        olviko 22 July 2013 14: 13 New
        +2
        Yes, normal moment, normal. The attack of Israeli aviation, as well as the attack by missiles from a submarine or a sabotage group of combat swimmers, etc., on our databases with S-300, is an attack on the territory of Russia with all that it implies. I think the fleet has a corresponding order.
        1. Constantine
          Constantine 23 July 2013 07: 41 New
          +1
          Quote: olviko
          Yes, normal moment, normal. The attack of Israeli aviation, as well as the attack by missiles from a submarine or a sabotage group of combat swimmers, etc., on our databases with S-300, is an attack on the territory of Russia with all that it implies. I think the fleet has a corresponding order.


          The commentary to which I replied says that the S-300 from our base needs to cover the sky of Syria before deploying its air defense system there. Read carefully and consistently. It was not about attacking our base there. hi

          Out of context, comments can take on a different meaning, which leads to misunderstandings :)
      2. DEfindER
        DEfindER 22 July 2013 15: 07 New
        +2
        Quote: Constantine
        Controversial point because It’s one thing if the Syrian Air Force knocked down the Israeli Air Force’s plane, and it’s quite another if ours knocked down in the absence of a direct threat to the base.

        Israel will proactively bomb even if the weapon has not yet reached its enemy .. And what can we not defend our base when it can face a direct threat from the air? First you give the Jews the first warning by radio, leave the airspace within a radius of 100 km around the base, the second warning will already be a landing.
        1. Pimply
          Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 57 New
          -1
          Do not be silly. Russia is more than interested in collaborating with high-tech Israel. And even in the days of the USSR, she did not go into a frank and direct conflict with Israel.
          1. S-200
            S-200 23 July 2013 00: 22 New
            +2
            Quote: Pimply
            And even in the days of the USSR, she did not go into a frank and direct conflict with Israel.

            .... but only assigned "Heroes" for the downed Israeli "Phantoms" to the commanders of the C-125 divisions deployed in Egypt! lol
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 23 July 2013 00: 57 New
              0
              Appropriated. But again, they didn’t go for a direct confrontation.
              1. poquello
                poquello 23 July 2013 02: 27 New
                +1
                Quote: Pimply
                Appropriated. But again, they didn’t go for a direct confrontation.


                I’m wondering the last time Syria went to a direct confrontation with Israel. I do not ask about hezbola.
        2. S-200
          S-200 23 July 2013 00: 28 New
          +1
          Everything that flies into Syrian airspace will be shot down, and no matter who! ours or the Syrians ...
          1. Constantine
            Constantine 23 July 2013 00: 38 New
            +1
            Quote: S-200
            Everything that flies into Syrian airspace will be shot down, and no matter who! ours or the Syrians ...


            It’s just the same, because if we beat, then us:

            A. Drawn into a war in which Russia, on a direct line, does not need to participate. Any war devastates, and in this case our guys will die, and part of the money for rearmament will be buried in the Syrian and adjacent lands. We need it, when can we do smarter?

            B. We will be accused of aggression against a weaker adversary, which will give rise to deploy leverage against us of a completely different rank. It’s too early for us to get involved in such fights.

            Of course, I understand that some readers have a desire to fight, but there are objective reasons and a cold calculation. Emotions, in this case, are not appropriate since can lead to disastrous consequences. Everything needs to be done thoughtfully and carefully.
          2. Pimply
            Pimply 23 July 2013 00: 57 New
            0
            You apparently did not read the article at all.
        3. Constantine
          Constantine 23 July 2013 07: 47 New
          0
          Quote: DEfindER
          Israel will proactively bomb even if the weapon has not yet reached its enemy .. And what can we not defend our base when it can face a direct threat from the air? First you give the Jews the first warning by radio, leave the airspace within a radius of 100 km around the base, the second warning will already be a landing.


          We are not Israel, and we have never done and will not do such things that they do. Russia is a peacemaking country and we operate within the framework of international standards, as well as moral standards. This is what makes us who we are and also allows us to fend off, at different levels, the attacks of Western politicians in our direction. Not everything is as simple as it might seem at first glance.

          Send to Syria the so-called Li-Xi-Qing we can, but openly get involved in a global war - no because any unreasoned action, for the sake of momentary benefits and advantages, can lead to a chain of consequences that will spill over into the third world war. I repeat again. We do not need it if we can achieve the same goals without loss, using patience and wisdom.
    3. S-200
      S-200 23 July 2013 00: 08 New
      0
      Tartus can also be covered by naval air defense systems based on our warships of the appropriate displacement ...
      So there should not be problems with unloading!
      The deployment of the S-300 mobile system is fast enough.
      From this, the Jews are nervous that they will not have time to plan a raid, as the airspace will be closed over a significant area of ​​the country (and not only Syria)))!
  • JIaIIoTb
    JIaIIoTb 22 July 2013 06: 52 New
    +4
    hear the voice of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad addressed to the Israelis: "Go ahead, this is my day."

    Israelis need to completely revise their foreign policy regarding Syria, otherwise the probability of hearing such words from Assad is great.
    1. serge-68-68
      serge-68-68 22 July 2013 06: 57 New
      +5
      Israel has no reason to reconsider its attitude towards Syria. Yes and Assad not. Even if everything goes well with him, in the next 30 years he will have something to do inside the country.
    2. Rumata
      Rumata 22 July 2013 07: 48 New
      -8
      Quote: JIaIIoTb
      Israelis need to completely revise their foreign policy regarding Syria, otherwise the probability of hearing such words from Assad is great.

      Israel and Syria are in a state of war that has never stopped. Syria gave weapons, knowing where it will go, and what will cause many deaths of Israelis. I DO NOT understand where such indignation over the relations between Syria and Israel, air raids, etc., is a war, and it is a war in Africa.
      1. domokl
        domokl 22 July 2013 08: 24 New
        10
        Quote: Rumata
        Israel and Syria are at war

        Baby talk. Syria, as a state, has not been at war with Israel for a long time. Only Israel allows itself, under the guise of combating Arab terrorism, to bombard foreign territory.
        I already wrote sometime, but I have to repeat it. For Israel, now, de facto, the terrorists were divided into friends and foes. Arab terrorists who oppose Assad are their own, Assad are enemies. How else can it be explained that Assad’s bombing is ONLY military? How can Israel be explained supports at the state level (friends of Syria) militants who do not even hide that their goal is the creation of an Arab state in the entire BV?
        If the state is consistent, then it should be consistent throughout. And not selectively, then when it is profitable.
        1. Rumata
          Rumata 22 July 2013 08: 47 New
          -3
          Quote: domokl
          Syria, as a state, has long fought against Israel.

          Silenok is not enough to start a big war, so they sponsor terrorists. If Israel were weaker, they would have attacked long ago. This is the difference between the two countries. Israel can overthrow Assad in 1 day, but is limited to Hazbollah’s precise weapons prevention operations. Syria, be it stronger than Israel. militarily, I would have attacked a long time ago. When she was a strong country, she attacked more than once.
          Quote: domokl
          I already wrote sometime, but I have to repeat it. . Otherwise, how can it be explained that bombing attacks are carried out ONLY by Assad’s military targets?

          I already wrote, will have to be repeated. Israel can help Assad’s opponents win in a couple of days. But he does not.
          Quote: domokl
          Israel supports at the state level

          You are probably talking about a super advanced "Sufa" with "super secret radio equipment" that has flashed more than once. Even the rusty car, which was forgotten in Lebanon, is called MILITARY AID from Israel, and figs who can be persuaded, "Lau" is there too.


          I repeat again. Israel and Syria are fighting, for this reason Israel bombed Syria before the civil war, and Syria fed Hezbollah. Therefore, one does not need to make surprised eyes and blame Israel for all troubles. Israel does not even think of violating the airspace of Egypt or Jordan, since there is no peace with them that they do not want to violate. Assad fought for it and ran into it, and I won’t be surprised that after Assad drank blood for so many years, Israel will take a more active part in its overthrow, for example, by supplying old ATGMs. I think this will be a mistake, but I will not be surprised at such a decision.
          1. Sirocco
            Sirocco 22 July 2013 09: 17 New
            +6
            Quote: Rumata
            Silenok is not enough to start a big war, so they sponsor terrorists.

            You know, I wrote the same above about Israel, if you remove the US aid, then what Israel will be like in 5 years. Israel in my opinion is a legalized terrorist organization. You will forgive the frankness, but everything is going this way, and not in your favor. I think so, if I was surrounded by "bad" neighbors who would have played dirty tricks on me, just like that, for nothing, I would have thought about the fact that something is wrong with ME. In your case, you are good, and there are only rascals around you. You alone are in step. Look at yourself in the mirror, you can see the beam in your own eye. hi There is a good saying. To live with wolves, howl like a wolf. You seem to me in the wrong pack many decades ago.
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 59 New
              -2
              I would recommend you see the history of Israel. That way until 1969. Many would have discovered for themselves.
          2. Zhenya-1
            Zhenya-1 22 July 2013 10: 35 New
            +3
            The myths about "arms shipments to Hezbollah" are ridiculous. How will illiterate peasants master the most complex equipment, if they have to prepare for work on it for at least a year (provided that they studied well in all ten grades at school)?
            1. Rumata
              Rumata 22 July 2013 10: 52 New
              -1
              Quote: Zhenya-1
              The myths about "arms shipments to Hezbollah" are ridiculous. How will illiterate peasants master the most complex equipment, if they have to prepare for work on it for at least a year (provided that they studied well in all ten grades at school)?

              I don’t understand whether the supply is generally a myth or the supply of BUKs and other myths? Regarding the former, Iran and Syria have supplied Hezbollah with thousands of ATGMs and missiles. Even before the Second Lebanese, these missiles regularly fell to the north of the country, and from pturov, on the border, they fired at patrols. Regarding more serious weapons, do not forget that Hazbullah is not Palestinian militants, it is a real army of thousands of fighters with very normal funding. Russia teaches the Syrians to use the Yakhonts, I see no problem transferring this knowledge to Hezbollah. My friend's father served on Onyx (it seems "Bastion") and according to him, you can teach more or less how to use them. Perhaps he is wrong, I will not argue anything, because I do not know about the requirements for operators of Yakhontov and S-300, maybe IQ 150+ is needed there, two higher and ten years of study.
            2. olviko
              olviko 22 July 2013 15: 04 New
              +1
              Let me disagree with Zhenya-1. Israel has every reason to fear the hit of modern Hezbollah weapons. So the operation against Hezbollah began in June 2006, when more than 400 IDF tanks invaded Lebanon with the task of destroying the armed detachments of the party of Allah, conducting shelling of Israeli territory. As a result, even judging by the statements of Israeli and Western media, the IDF, having absolute superiority in aviation, UAVs, artillery, tanks, RTR, electronic warfare, night vision devices, lost a large amount of armored vehicles.
              The ground forces of the Israeli army were not ready to fight the enemy, well trained and prepared for such a war. The main difficulty for the Israeli soldiers was related to the tactics of the Hezbollah’s fighters, which were based on sudden strikes by powerful weapons from maximum ranges, as well as fire ambush. A classic illustration of the described Hezbollah tactics was the battle of Wadi Saluki, which took place on the eve of the end of the Israeli-Lebanese war. In this battle, the IDF suffered the greatest losses during the offensive of the 401th Brigade, equipped with Merkava Mk4 tanks, through the Saluki River towards the village of Randuria. Of the 24 tanks participating in the offensive, 11 were hit by anti-tank missiles. Israeli media immediately began to claim that they were hit by the latest Russian ATGM “Cornet” and RPG-29 “Vampire”. During the second Lebanon war, the Israelis in separate Merkava tanks used the latest Trophy active defense system, consisting of a radar connected to four antennas located on the front and aft parts and sides of the platform, and providing protection in the 360-degree sector, and two destruction mechanisms flying weapons placed on each side of the platform.
              The Hezbollah specialists opposed no less original tactics to the possibilities of this miracle of design: the Trophy was put out of action with concentrated fire from ordinary small arms and good old rocket launchers, after which even the outdated Malyutki successfully drilled the newest IDF technology miracle.
              1. Pimply
                Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 10 New
                0
                Quote: olviko
                The Hezbollah specialists opposed no less original tactics to the possibilities of this miracle of design: the Trophy was put out of action with concentrated fire from ordinary small arms and good old rocket launchers, after which even the outdated Malyutki successfully drilled the newest IDF technology miracle.


                For starters, the tanks began to be equipped with Trophy only after the Second Lebanon. Prior to this, the system was not put on tanks, although it was developed. There is no evidence of Trophy. In 2009, Trophy proved its effectiveness in Gaza.

                Next - the total number of equipment irretrievably lost - 5 vehicles, 2 of them on high explosives. 16 cars required evacuation to the rear. The rest of the 49 affected tanks quickly returned to duty (within 48 hours). More than 500 ATGMs of various types have been produced. Conditionally - every 10th tank was affected, which is relatively small. As well as human losses - about one tanker for every penetration.
            3. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 03 New
              0
              It's funny Dozens of photos with specific items of supplies, recognition of Hezbollah representatives during visits. For example:

              The head of the Hezbollah’s Moscow-based delegation, Muhammad Raad, thanked Russia for the weapons with which Hezbollah, according to Raad, “crushed the Israeli occupiers.” A quote from a Lebanese thank-you speech is quoted by Islamnews:
              “If in the last century the“ Kalashnikov ”was a symbol of resistance and the struggle for freedom, then in our century the Russian rocket“ Cornet ”became such a symbol, with the help of which Hezbollah crushed the Israeli occupiers. In particular, thanks to the accuracy and power of the missiles, it was possible to destroy the myth of the Israeli Merkava tank, thus discovering its weaknesses and limited capabilities, ”said Raad.

              Raad told IslamNews that Hezbollah advocated strengthening Russia's "balancing role" in international decision-making, "just as it was during the Soviet Union."
              1. tilovaykrisa
                tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 17: 12 New
                +1
                Supply us with their silly speeches.
          3. Scoun
            Scoun 22 July 2013 13: 50 New
            +4
            Quote: Rumata
            I repeat again. Israel and Syria are fighting, for this reason Israel bombed Syria before the civil war, and Syria fed Hezbollah. Therefore, one does not need to make surprised eyes and blame Israel for all troubles.

            I will answer you with a quote from another comrade)))
            DezzeD IL July 12, 2013 09:55 ↑
            Unfortunately / Happiness to the "holy war" no one when not in a hurry.
            example: in 1967, Israel attacks Egypt. and what, Syria, is not easy Arab
            brother, but also an ally bound by a military treaty, will not enter the war within 3 days.

            during these 3 days, transmitting false data to Egypt about the alleged movement of the Syrian military deep into the Galilee
            (north of israel).
            and finally entering the war Syria does this not on its own initiative, but as a consequence of the Israeli strike through Lebanon and at the Golan Heights.

            So all the same, the Syrians, in spite of everything, did not enter the war and Israel itself drew him to her for "fish soup" ...
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 10 New
              -3
              Let's start by recalling the year 1948. What to begin with 1967.
          4. DEfindER
            DEfindER 22 July 2013 14: 54 New
            +4
            Quote: Rumata
            Syria, be it stronger than Israel. militarily, I would have attacked long ago. When she was a strong country, she attacked more than once.

            When was this?
            6 day war - Israeli aggression,
            Judgment Day - Syria and Egypt tried to return the territories occupied by Israel, Sinai and Golan.
          5. BIGLESHIY
            BIGLESHIY 22 July 2013 15: 05 New
            0
            And what do you think, supporting opponents of Assad, they will then be grateful to you? Yes, then they will attack you and with the support of Qatar and Saudi Arabia, you just warm the snake on your chest. But Assad’s support, you can very well change his attitude towards yourself.
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 12 New
              -2
              Tell me, where did you get that Israel supports the opponents of Assad. Israel is trying to neutralize its most serious threats by interfering at a minimum level. Enough to help there - Europe, States, Arabs. How do you imagine the help of Israel to the Islamists. The Islamists, with whom Israel has been fighting since the beginning of the formation of the state. And most importantly - why ???
        2. stroporez
          stroporez 22 July 2013 12: 58 New
          +3
          this is not a war. it looks more like a crowd of Caudla gopots "blizzard". And it’s not because of a bad life ----- but from that, sho nature demands its cannibalism. "State of Israel" - and habits are like tramp from delivery ............
          1. DEfindER
            DEfindER 22 July 2013 16: 46 New
            +2
            Quote: stroporez
            nature of cannibalism demands its own. "State of Israel" - and habits --- yak from tramps from the import ............

            I’m afraid that with a real threat to its security, Israel will not hesitate to use its nuclear weapons .. with its mentality, it will not rust after it.
            1. tilovaykrisa
              tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 16: 55 New
              0
              Can and Khimki Arabs throw some, and depending on how they are used, they themselves will start to glow, there are tiny distances there.
        3. Pimply
          Pimply 22 July 2013 16: 58 New
          -2
          Quote: domokl
          Baby talk. Syria, as a state, has long fought against Israel.


          What is the date of signing the peace treaty, or the date of termination of Syrian military cooperation with Hamas and Hezbollah.
          1. falcon
            falcon 22 July 2013 17: 55 New
            +3
            Quote: Pimply
            Quote: domokl
            Baby talk. Syria, as a state, has long fought against Israel.


            What is the date of signing the peace treaty,

            Russia and Japan also do not have a peace treaty (that is, we do not de jure
            are in a state of peace), but de facto since 1945 we’re not fighting, so
            Your argument is incorrect
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 18: 16 New
              0
              You are somewhat unaware of the situation. In Russia and Japan, the situation is fundamentally different. Between Russia and Japan, the state of the end of the war was recorded. Japan capitulated.

              The state of war was terminated and diplomatic and consular relations of the USSR with Japan were established; after signing the peace treaty, the USSR is ready to consider the possibility of transferring the islands of Shikotan and the Habomai archipelago to Japan. (Moscow conference of 1956).

              In accordance with the Declaration, the state of war that existed between the USSR and Japan on August 9, 1945, was terminated from the day the Declaration entered into force; peace and good neighborly relations were restored between the two states, the USSR and Japan agreed to restore diplomatic and consular relations, agreed to continue negotiations on concluding a peace treaty.
              The declaration provided that, in a short time, negotiations between the USSR and Japan would begin on the conclusion of treaties or agreements on trade and merchant shipping; simultaneously with the Declaration, the fisheries convention and the agreement on saving people in distress at sea, dated May 14, 1956, will enter into force.
              The countries also confirmed that in their relations they would be guided by the principles of the UN Charter, and they undertook not to interfere directly or indirectly in each other’s internal affairs. The USSR expressed its readiness to support Japan’s request for admission to the UN, agreed to release all Japanese citizens convicted in the USSR and repatriate them to Japan.
              The declaration fixed the refusal of the parties to mutual claims arising as a result of the war, as well as the refusal of the USSR from reparation claims to Japan.
              Simultaneously with the Declaration, a protocol was signed on the development of trade and the mutual provision of the most favored nation treatment.

              That is, a formal paper was not concluded that finally normalized relations.

              Nevertheless, the documents signed by Syria and Israel record that the state of war between them has not ceased. And everywhere it is noted especially.
              1. falcon
                falcon 22 July 2013 20: 42 New
                +1
                Thank you for clarification, but I am aware of the situation.
                I repeat:
                Quote: Pimply
                Quote: domokl
                Baby talk. Syria, as a state, has long fought against Israel.


                What is the date of signing the peace treaty,

                Do you think the thesis of DOMOKL is incorrect, in the absence of a peace treaty
                between Israel and Syria, and then you prove to me reasonably that the two countries
                can get along well without a peace treaty. Where is the logic and
                sequence? By the way, on the border between the USSR and Japan since September.
                1945 to 1956 also did not shoot
      2. Andrew-001
        Andrew-001 23 July 2013 01: 01 New
        0
        Quote: Rumata
        war she and Africa war

        When EVERYTHING (USA, Al-Qaeda, Israel, Turkey, the EU, Saudis, Qatar, Jordan, etc.) for ONE (Syria) - this is genocide, not war.
    3. Revolver
      Revolver 22 July 2013 08: 59 New
      -9
      Quote: JIaIIoTb
      hear the voice of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad addressed to the Israelis: "Go ahead, this is my day."

      1939 Heil Hitler!
      1945 Hitler kaput!
  • Alexei
    Alexei 22 July 2013 06: 58 New
    +6
    C-300 has an impressive pedigree, coming from SA-2, which in the 1960 year “famously shot down” the U-2 American reconnaissance aircraft over Russia

    Dad told me. He served in that part at that time. good

    Israel, to which Syria is inferior in armament, is a little fucking. They are worried about getting an enemy with the help of Russia who can fight back. I doubt that Assad will say "Let's move on", Syria, like Iran, has problems above the roof, after all kinds of sanctions that are regularly thrown by the West. They have no time for war. The contract was signed with Syria even before all this enticement, and it must be implemented, otherwise in dreams they will not want to be friends anymore.
  • valokordin
    valokordin 22 July 2013 07: 13 New
    0
    Quote: JIaIIoTb

    Israelis need to completely revise their foreign policy regarding Syria, otherwise the probability of hearing such words from Assad is great.

    And Russia does not need to be intimidated and intimidated, but immediately put complexes on Assad, otherwise everything looks like a teaser "Well, take it away, or stay there, come here." Not solid like that
  • Predator-74
    Predator-74 22 July 2013 07: 17 New
    +1
    It is urgent to move the S-300 to Syria and Iran, then, without the support of the Israeli Air Force and Western allies, it will immediately be seen "Who has wider breeches."
  • KazaK Bo
    KazaK Bo 22 July 2013 07: 41 New
    +7
    To repeat the "Vietnamese version" with v / advisers, when Vietnamese pilots by the name of LEE SI TSIN flew ... and our "guidance officers" and "shooting" were sitting in the cockpits of the air defense missile system, an appropriate agreement is needed ... FRIENDSHIP AND ALL-AROUND MUTUAL ASSISTANCE! We do not have such an agreement with SYRIA ... which means that we do not have the right, according to international laws, signed by Russia, to take part in hostilities. They can only do this with the status of "volunteers" not associated with our Armed Forces ... and then on a gratuitous basis, otherwise they fall under the status of "legionnaires". Different statuses lead to different attitudes ... either you are a prisoner of war or just a war criminal. In addition ... there is a certain international opinion ... But if we place a military base on the territory of Syria, and an adversary flies by and we open fire ... let's just say - to prevent the likelihood of an attack on us, then the custom anti-Russian media will make some noise and shut up. It is necessary to provide assistance ... but it is clever, so that once again not to substitute our specialists with the supplied military equipment.
    The size of the "chips", as one of the members of the forum quoted a good and interesting quote, will not stop ISRAEL. Behind them are fellow believers of the whole world and, first of all, the USA with their military might! In addition, they have already "bitten" the bit and will stop at nothing ... if Israel "gives up" and the Arabs win, then no matter how the whole world would have to remember the "sons of MOSES" then only in memorial prayers. The Arabs will not stop halfway. Both of the options are unacceptable ... that's why there is a containment of both the supply of weapons and the direction of our specialists.
    And the S-300 complex is really cool and he will still say his weighty word!
    1. Ustas
      Ustas 22 July 2013 09: 05 New
      +2
      Quote: KazaK Bo
      then we would repeat the "Vietnamese version" with v / advisers, when Vietnamese pilots by the name of LEE SI TSYN flew ... and our "guidance officers" and "shooting" were sitting in the air defense missile cockpits, an appropriate agreement is needed ... something like - Oh FRIENDSHIP AND ALL-ROUND MUTUAL ASSISTANCE! We do not have such an agreement with SYRIA ...

      Such an agreement exists. The Treaty of Friendship and Cooperation of the USSR and the ATS of October 8, 1980
      And article 6 of this treaty states:
      Article 6
      In the event of situations that threaten the peace or security of one of the Parties or pose a threat to peace or a violation of world peace and security, the High Contracting Parties will immediately come into contact with each other in order to coordinate their positions and cooperation to eliminate the threat and restore peace.
      1. KazaK Bo
        KazaK Bo 22 July 2013 17: 23 New
        0
        Quote: Ustas
        Such an agreement exists

        Thank you ... if I made a mistake ... but I watched the contract of RUSSIA ... And under the Treaty of 1980 with SYRIA I don’t remember the extension after the base period of validity .... although I could be wrong ...
  • buzuke
    buzuke 22 July 2013 07: 54 New
    0
    If the Israelis destroy the S-300, this could drop the prestige of the system and allow other countries to "fear them less"

    and if the c300 destroys someone else’s enemy aircraft, then the enemies will think hard - but is it necessary? they do not know how to fight without clear and overwhelming superiority, and even more so with losses
  • dojjdik
    dojjdik 22 July 2013 07: 55 New
    0
    and that out of the fact that Israel allegedly inflicted as many as 4 blows, this is no one needed bravado; and were there any "blows"; but even if there were, this "zilch" of the Syrian army did not bring any harm; Jews do not dare to make a massive raid even without the S-300, Syria has a good air defense; mobile BUKs and "shells" will also cause a lot of trouble for Israel
  • valokordin
    valokordin 22 July 2013 07: 57 New
    +2
    Quote: KazaK Bo
    To repeat the "Vietnamese version" with v / advisers when Vietnamese pilots by the name of LEE SI TSIN flew ..

    Soviet pilots in Vietnam did not participate in battles, they only taught how to fly, our officers were in anti-aircraft gunners.
    1. poquello
      poquello 23 July 2013 02: 55 New
      +1
      Quote: valokordin

      Soviet pilots in Vietnam didn’t take part in battles,


      I won’t tell you for fights, but they definitely flew.
  • makst83
    makst83 22 July 2013 08: 10 New
    +5
    C-300, the best vaccination from Democrats!
  • knn54
    knn54 22 July 2013 08: 20 New
    +9
    The Israeli Air Force is a great facility for testing the S-300 in combat conditions.
    But the author is right, Arabs are not Serbs or Vietnamese.
    Unlike Vietnam or Yugoslavia, there are rats in Assad’s army, and there are moles in Russia too.
    Just in this situation, the complex will not be allowed to deploy.
    Therefore, one of the options, as Boris said, is to create a COMPLETE military base in Syria.
    For impunity for crime breeds evil!
    PS We supply Syria with a SHIELD, and the West scumbags-SWORD ...
    1. Sirocco
      Sirocco 22 July 2013 08: 24 New
      0
      Quote: knn54
      Unlike Vietnam or Yugoslavia, there are rats in Assad’s army, and there are moles in Russia too.

      Are you sure that there are no such citizens in Israel? The United States also believed that they had all the type of top. For a long time now, who has come and in what position)))))
    2. Black Colonel
      Black Colonel 22 July 2013 11: 30 New
      0
      Regarding the deployment of the S-300, my version is above.
      1. cherkas.oe
        cherkas.oe 22 July 2013 17: 04 New
        +1
        A good option, from all sides, and probably if they will deploy 300 hundredths, then that's right. By the fact that in such a small territory like Syria it is not possible to covertly prepare camouflaged positions for five divisions.
  • sergey72
    sergey72 22 July 2013 08: 21 New
    +6
    It seems to me that all this dance with sabers around Syria in general and the S-300 in particular exactly until the end of the Sochi Olympics ... The interested parties understand this and everyone tries to the best of their ability ... Of course, you can make a mess of "borscht" with Olipiada ... BUT then Russia will have a free hand and the size of Moscow's "reaction" will take on a traditionally unpredictable character ...
  • Grenz
    Grenz 22 July 2013 08: 22 New
    +1
    The site already had reasoning about this.
    Iran asks for the S-300, but for some reason we are not giving it to him. Technology steals. Well so with them. All the same, the Chinese have long copied everything.
    It is necessary to stick to the entire Middle East of the S-300 and let everyone there practice their flying skills in combat conditions. It doesn't bother us. We do not carry "democracy" on our wings.
    By the way, the Iranians would be quicker than ours and prepared their own and Syrian calculations.
    Well then, you don’t have to worry about prestige. They would have covered their land with our missiles no worse than the Vietnamese.
  • lewerlin53rus
    lewerlin53rus 22 July 2013 08: 25 New
    +2
    Again, a fairy tale about a white bull: put, not set. All so far is only based on messages from the OBS information portal. We must wait for some official information. And at this stage, even rumors of a possible supply do not work badly.
    1. Black Colonel
      Black Colonel 22 July 2013 11: 33 New
      +1
      During the Caribbean crisis, the Soviet Union made no official declarations of nuclear weapons supplies to Cuba.
  • Nayhas
    Nayhas 22 July 2013 08: 38 New
    +1
    The apologists of the axiom gathered again that one S-300 will win all-all and all-all in the world are afraid of him. But the article was quite right to point out that "the S-300 by itself cannot" change the rules of the game. "It becomes deadly when it interacts with anti-aircraft artillery and fighter-interceptors." The S-300 is only a part of an air defense system, undoubtedly important, but only a part, in the absence of an air defense system, the S-300 is useless, these are future flaming wrecks ... Syria does not have an air defense system, so the S-300 is a waste of money.
    PS: The opinion that Israel is supposedly trembling with fear at the thought of the S-300 is especially amusing. Israel quite calmly stated that it would not allow the deployment of the complex and most likely would be so.
    1. Sirocco
      Sirocco 22 July 2013 09: 22 New
      +2
      Quote: Nayhas
      Again, the apologists for the axiom gathered that one S-300 will defeat all-all and all-all in the world are afraid of him.

      Pay attention to who shouts about it. Israel.
      Quote: Nayhas
      Israel quite calmly stated that it would not allow the deployment of the complex and most likely would be so.

      No tolerance did not grow. Here I will say in your words.
      Quote: Nayhas
      Again, the apologists for the axiom gathered that Israel alone will triumph over all and that everyone in the world is afraid of it.
      hi
      1. Revolver
        Revolver 22 July 2013 10: 04 New
        -3
        Quote: Sirocco
        No tolerance did not grow.

        And where did the "Yakhonts" go?
        1. Sirocco
          Sirocco 22 July 2013 10: 10 New
          +3
          Quote: Nagan
          And where did the "Yakhonts" go?

          Was there a boy? Can I ask you a question?)))) Why did the Israeli F-16s often fall into the water?
          1. zaazua
            zaazua 22 July 2013 22: 06 New
            0
            and often fall?
        2. cherkas.oe
          cherkas.oe 22 July 2013 17: 21 New
          +2
          Quote: Nagan
          And where did the "Yakhonts" go?

          And were there "yahonts" where you shot. But the number of your brother on the branch suggests that Israel, if not shivering, is banging for sure. wink
    2. sergey72
      sergey72 22 July 2013 09: 29 New
      +7
      Good day, dear fellow countryman! Excuse me, what do you mean by an air defense system? Maybe VKP or stationary KP? They are vulnerable in today's Syria. The beauty of the c-300 is that it is self-sufficient, it is enough to include a mobile module-cabin "Senezh" or "Baikal-1" in its composition. These modules are tied into a single network and "Armor", and "Buki", and older "Cuba" ... Israel is not worried about the s-300 itself, but the emergence of an integrated and, most importantly, stable system in Syria.
      1. Nayhas
        Nayhas 22 July 2013 10: 39 New
        0
        Quote: sergey72
        Excuse me, what do you mean by an air defense system?

        A single radar field, a complex of ground-based air defense systems + air defense fighters.
        1. sergey72
          sergey72 22 July 2013 11: 06 New
          +1
          Where is the management? You understand that all of the above you need to be linked into a single system, and s-300 only part of it. Not without reason with the delivery of s-300 there is no consensus that they supply, but with the package bundle everything is quite confusing. If everything was simple, Benya would not have rushed to meet with GDP in Sochi.
          1. Nayhas
            Nayhas 22 July 2013 16: 50 New
            0
            It's on your fingers. Roughly speaking, you need three "fingers", remove any of them and the whole system becomes unusable. A single radar field implies control, lighting of the air situation, guidance of aircraft and the issuance of target designation to ground air defense systems, if it is not there, then the aircraft will not be able to receive information about the approaching enemy forces in time. The lack of air cover allows the enemy to concentrate efforts on one sector, fearlessly identify the foci of defense, make a breach, after which the entire system will collapse. The lack of ground-based air defense opens the enemy freedom of action at low altitudes, thereby making defenseless command posts, radar stations, airfields. Now Syria does not have ANYTHING of the above, the appearance of one of the air defense elements does not solve the problem absolutely.
            1. tilovaykrisa
              tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 16: 59 New
              0
              Covering certain objects, there is tor1, there is a c200 system, there is anti-aircraft artillery, there are both stationary and mobile radars, there are a small number of twinks, this is quite enough to completely close Damascus with c300. or some other important object. And here, more likely, the conversation is not about bringing down Israeli forces, since they will be shooting from 100 territories of the airspace of neighboring states and the speech is about destroying missiles.
    3. Day 11
      Day 11 22 July 2013 11: 51 New
      +1
      I agree with you! Israel is not afraid of the S-300, but the consequences of the death of Russians in these complexes. They are afraid of the consequences for the Jews in Russia itself.
      1. poquello
        poquello 23 July 2013 03: 40 New
        +1
        How? You do not know the classics?

        "Aron Zaavi (3) IL June 29, 2013 14:54 ↑

        Are you not happy with Jews in Russia? So give them a pogrom. I personally don't give a damn about the Jews of Russia. I am an Israeli Jew. "

        I never thought that old humor is so real.

        "Two Jews are crawling to the top of the peak of Communism, whoever reaches it will become Russian. Abram is the first to crawl to the peak:
        - Well, it happened!
        Moysha, with all her strength, is asking for a hand.
        - Abram, help ...
        - Get out, you Jewish face. "
  • ed65b
    ed65b 22 July 2013 09: 21 New
    -1
    The Syrian military is not as well trained as "highly skilled, motivated and brilliant Vietnamese."

    It was they who became such after the amers were piled on. and before that, too, they were suckers who were powerless. As soon as the Syrians pile on the Jews, too, will become well done. Although what they do today confirms that they are well done now, well trained and have great combat experience brilliantly applied in practice. And the Jewish donut hole shines in the event of a new battle for the golan. I think that the Syrians will break Tskhal, perhaps even sure of it.
    1. Revolver
      Revolver 22 July 2013 09: 31 New
      +1
      Quote: ed65b
      As soon as the Syrians pile on the Jews, too, will become well done

      Since 1948 they have been trying to heap, and more and more they themselves are raking. Most likely they will still be shocked if they rock the boat. As one Jew with an obscene-sounding name in Russian (which is why he did not give it), former Israeli Foreign Minister, said, "Arabs never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity."
      1. Sirocco
        Sirocco 22 July 2013 10: 13 New
        0
        Quote: Nagan
        Since 1948 they have been trying to pile on, and more and more they are raking themselves.

        You just play ping pong, or giveaway, it makes you think about a lot. The powerful and invulnerable Goliath - Israel, cannot cope with the "gang" of Arabs in flip flops, why? or do you need it? then why do you need this?)))
    2. Rumata
      Rumata 22 July 2013 09: 41 New
      +2
      Quote: ed65b
      in case of a new fight for the golan. I think that the Syrians will break the IDF, perhaps even sure of it.

      Is this such a joke? I can’t believe that someone who is aware of the balance of power of the parties can believe it.
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 22 July 2013 12: 29 New
        +1
        Another soldier today in Syria is completely different. On this and kick your ass soldier. A soldier is better to go home, do not disgrace, women are fighting for men. Or is it an old Jewish tradition?
        1. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 21: 31 New
          0
          Yes Yes. Speak again.
  • freedmen
    freedmen 22 July 2013 09: 38 New
    +3
    Quote: Sirocco
    US competently acted, stuck a splinter in the ass Arab world

    Quote: Sirocco
    Just as the state of Israel was placed artificially in the Arab world. (I stress Israel was specially created and placed, for what?)

    Dear! I ask everyone who writes such a thing not to spoil the story.
    Israel, as a state, was created directly with the help of the USSR, namely with the filing of Stalin out of good intentions, namely to give land, statehood to outcasts (Jews). And relations were ruined between the USSR and Israel as a result of Brezhnev's support for the Arab world, namely Lebanon, Egypt, Libya, etc. And first of all, because of the misunderstanding and connivance of our "ana-geopoliticians" who made it possible to unleash a dispute over the Golan Heights.
    The Anglo-Saxons, took advantage of this geopolitical error of the USSR, and now we have what we have.
    And we will not solve the current problem until the Israelis and Arabs understand that their authorities are an instrument for controlling the cannon fodder, which their peoples are in the geopolitical games of the Anglo-Saxons.
    Brita, they've been nasty all their lives. Now the Turks were incited against Russia, then the Syrians, then the Afghans, etc. And so it will continue until the world community understands that we are in the "theater created by the Anglo-Saxons" (approx. Paraphrased from Shakespeare)
    1. Revolver
      Revolver 22 July 2013 09: 52 New
      +5
      Quote: freedmen
      And relations were spoiled between the USSR and Israel as a result of Brezhnev’s support for the Arab world, namely Lebanon, Egypt, Libya, etc.

      No, this is Khrushchev seduced by Nasser's statements that he is building socialism
      Quote: freedmen
      which allowed to unleash a dispute over the Golan Heights.
      If only the Golan, the Arabs have repeatedly stated their desire to "throw Israel into the sea."
      Quote: freedmen
      Britons, all their lives behaved foully.
      What yes then yes. Wherever they steer, everywhere after them a mess. Only the United States seems to have managed, and that’s only because they kicked out expelled by force early enough.
    2. Sirocco
      Sirocco 23 July 2013 02: 16 New
      0
      Quote: freedmen
      Dear! I ask everyone who writes such a thing not to spoil the story.
      I may not be as strong in history as you, But what I wrote, and you have quoted it, is history, and inappropriately once again twist it upside down.
      Quote: freedmen
      And relations were spoiled between the USSR and Israel as a result of Brezhnev’s support for the Arab world

      It is possible in more detail with this quote, Why Brezhnev ruined the relationship?
  • leon-iv
    leon-iv 22 July 2013 09: 47 New
    +2
    Article bullshit for the author did not even indicate what type of S-300, but they are very different from letters.
    Threat Tov from Israel, Syria is interesting to us, as the base of the fleet, as a business partner, and it’s just a pity for people when vile snatches like the Saudis and the dwarf Qatar want to decide the fate of the world.
    ZYY And in the place of the Russian Federation I would have razed Qatar to the ground (repeat the hippopotamus and 3-4 BB will fall into Qatar) and for business it’s good and for the world as a whole
  • tilovaykrisa
    tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 09: 58 New
    +1
    If the c300 systems are not covered by military air defense systems, and they are well guarded, they will become easy targets, look at them from the air defense base terrorists, airfields, divisional headquarters, it’s not necessary to destroy them from the air, they will attack from the ground and large-caliber rifles will damage the radar, and then stupidly call Uncle Bene from Odessa and say that you can bomb.
  • gregor6549
    gregor6549 22 July 2013 10: 12 New
    +2
    Israel is not so much worried about the threat of the C300 for its combat aircraft, especially since Israel can use other types of weapons against Syria against which the C300 will not be as effective as against aerodynamic and ballistic targets, but the possibility that these complexes can fall into the hands of thugs who they will want to try to shoot down passenger liners over Israeli territory or use the C300 missiles as medium-range missiles equipped with all sorts of muck like OBs against ground targets, i.e. against the civilian population. When using missiles in this quality, she will not need special guidance accuracy. Well, it must be borne in mind that like any other type of weaponry the C300 has its vulnerabilities and the United States and the Allies took care of finding such places at the beginning of the 90x, having spent on the purchase of 2x C300 PMU kits from Russia. Of course, some modernization of C300 has been carried out since then, but no particularly radical changes have been observed there, and those that are being observed are closely monitored by the United States and its friends.
    1. leon-iv
      leon-iv 22 July 2013 10: 33 New
      +1
      PMU-2 from PMU inside the shoppers are very different
      YES and from 300 to get to the SC it is necessary to have aerobatics.
      1. gregor6549
        gregor6549 22 July 2013 11: 00 New
        +1
        Do not believe the rumors. There are differences but not fundamental
        1. Scoun
          Scoun 22 July 2013 14: 10 New
          +2
          Quote: gregor6549
          Do not believe the rumors. There are differences but not fundamental

          Your message to which category is classified as fact or hearing?
          Change of algorithm to which category can be attributed?
          PS, on the road.
          1. gregor6549
            gregor6549 22 July 2013 15: 38 New
            +1
            SW Roman, I do not want to brag, but at one time I had a direct relationship with the development of the complex under discussion and I have some idea of ​​its technical and software tools, including algorithms for solving its combat missions.
            Of course, much depends on how the algorithm for solving this or that problem is written, and these algorithms are improved from time to time as experience is gained in operating the complex.
            On the other hand, by improving only the algorithms, no revolutionary breakthroughs in the effectiveness of the complex can be achieved, because they were initially optimized to the maximum.
            More serious is the modification of the SAM complex and the inclusion of radar systems in the air defense missile system, which at first were not part of it, For example, the Sky SV / SVU radar. But the trick is that these "new" radars are new only for the complex itself, and in fact they are well-known radars, against which a potential enemy has long developed methods and means of suppression, both jamming and fire.
            It cannot be otherwise, because against any "scrap" there is always a "trick" Dialectic p. This means that any advantage that can be achieved through new developments and technologies can only be temporary, and then if some development can be kept in complete secrecy from the enemy until the moment of its combat use.
            And with modern means and methods of intelligence, this is practically unattainable. And the corruption component of modern Russia must be taken into account. The one who guards the secrets is the first to sell them. This was especially evident in the mid-90s. And now there are enough precedents. Including at the famous association "Almaz Antey". The era of patriots of their country and experts in their field Bunkin Efremov ended with them, and "Almaz Antey" fell into the very skillful hands of traders like Ashurbeyli and Co. How much this figure managed to sell over the hill is known only to the Lord God and also to the curators of Ashurbeyli from Oboronservis, etc. of state offices. And it would not be so scary if Ashurbeyli was alone. And then, after all, people like him seized their hands and sold almost the entire defense industry, including Roskosmos. And this will be worse than the sale of the C300. And you tell me about algorithms ...
            1. Scoun
              Scoun 22 July 2013 17: 24 New
              +1
              + Thanks for the detailed answer.
              Yes, about the 90s we all remember, I’ll say a banal thing ... not to mention the leak of information over the hill and not only because of corrupt people but spyware too much has flowed ... but on the other hand ... if everything is so transparent and strangled EW .. why then such pressure against the sale of defensive weapons to Iran and Syria?
              Russia already decently suffered by signing a contract and then canceling it for Iran ... what pressure they exerted on DAM .. and if everyone knows everything about the S-300, they could put it to shame if everyone knows ... so this is an incident .. fear and resist.
              1. gregor6549
                gregor6549 22 July 2013 18: 30 New
                +1
                I don’t think that anyone is very afraid of the C300 and trembles with horror, just everyone who needs to understand that this system of a rather high level is quite capable of upsetting the existing balance of forces in the region under discussion and complicating the Israelis' task in disrupting the supply of arms to Hezbollah and Hamas. And in order to balance it, Israel will have to re-apply extra. efforts to risk the lives of their military personnel (not necessarily pilots), and given that Russian military and civilian specialists can be behind 300 jobs, these efforts can aggravate the already difficult relations between Israel and the USA with Russia, especially if they are efforts will lead to casualties among these specialists. There will most likely not be a big war because of this, but anything can happen, given the very possible intervention of Iran in these matters on the side of Syria and Hezbollah, as announced by the newly-elected president of this country. And there, Turkey will podsuetsya. She has long been overthrown to play the role of leader in that region. And Iran plus Turkey is a threat not only to Israel but also to Russia. East is a delicate matter.
    2. Zhenya-1
      Zhenya-1 22 July 2013 10: 42 New
      0
      The S-300 is not an assault rifle or "Needle", which does not require special skills to use. This is the most complex technique, which can only be used by a team of people who have undergone appropriate training.
    3. tilovaykrisa
      tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 10: 48 New
      0
      You can shoot down passenger liners in the sky of Israel with the help of MANPADS.
      1. gregor6549
        gregor6549 22 July 2013 10: 59 New
        +1
        Of course you can, but for this, the arrow from MANPADS needs to get to the Ben Gurion Airport at least a couple of kilometers away. And who will give him? You can’t just approach and crawl to this airport, even on a goat
    4. Corneli
      Corneli 22 July 2013 12: 30 New
      +1
      Quote: gregor6549
      Israel is not so much worried about the threat of the C300 for its combat aircraft, especially since Israel can use other types of weapons against Syria against which the C300 will not be as effective as against aerodynamic and ballistic targets, but rather the possibility that these complexes can fall into the hands of thugs who want to try to shoot down passenger liners over the territory of Israel

      In Syria, there was a long time ago the same S-200, with a firing range of at least S-300. But even no one knocks down request
      Quote: gregor6549
      or use C300 missiles as medium-range missiles equipped with all sorts of muck like OBs against ground targets, i.e. against the civilian population. When using missiles in this quality, she will not need special guidance accuracy.

      What prevents them from using for example SCADAS? Moreover, warheads are much cooler there and there is no need to remake rockets request
      In addition, in Syria there are enough other anti-aircraft systems and ground-to-ground missiles. Actually because the Israeli arguments about the S-300 and the use of these by the evil Syrians are some delusional childish excuses
  • Rumata
    Rumata 22 July 2013 10: 56 New
    0
    Quote: tilovaykrisa
    You can shoot down passenger liners in the sky of Israel with the help of MANPADS.

    For example, a needle with a range of 6 km?
    1. tilovaykrisa
      tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 13: 32 New
      +1
      Well, do you have vertical takeoffs and airbases? And you don’t need to come close to the airfield either, the main thing is to know the approach and take-off routes, and you can get it with a 6 km needle as soon as the Arabs get more MANPADS in their hands, they will start to be greedy and shoot regularly, then we’ll see 6km or enough, but there will be MANPADS, there are many of them after Gaddafi in Libya.
  • Remko
    Remko 22 July 2013 11: 09 New
    -5
    Greeks help Israel learn to suppress S-300 systems

    Israel and Greece have enjoyed a very cordial military relationship since 2008, including military drills ranging from Israel to the island of Crete. Drills include air-to-air long distance refueling, long-range flights, and most importantly aiding Israel in outmaneuvering the S-300 which Greece has.
    1. Hauptmann emil
      Hauptmann emil 22 July 2013 11: 23 New
      +1
      All this together should take and include the translator? Comrade You are on a Russian-language site.
      1. Remko
        Remko 22 July 2013 11: 44 New
        -6
        Comrade, you live in the 21st century, have you really not learned English yet?
        1. Hauptmann emil
          Hauptmann emil 22 July 2013 12: 26 New
          +4
          Quote: Remko
          Comrade, you live in the 21st century, have you really not learned English yet?

          Why am I obliged to learn English? My native language is Tatar and Russian. At school, at university, in graduate school, I studied German. What is one reason why I am obligated on a Russian-language website with a domain .RU read / write in english?
          1. Remko
            Remko 22 July 2013 13: 03 New
            -6
            I won’t forgive you here in English to write all the comments, but I just cited the confirmation from the English Wikipedia.
        2. tilovaykrisa
          tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 13: 33 New
          +2
          you need to know the enemy’s language, but how can you interrogate him?
        3. Revolver
          Revolver 22 July 2013 20: 58 New
          0
          Actually, I speak English fluently, after all, not the first year in America, but this is a Russian-language forum, so elementary politeness requires a translation. And it would be nice to give an address to the original source.
      2. Naval
        Naval 22 July 2013 12: 24 New
        0
        It is necessary to learn the language of a potential adversary hi
        1. Remko
          Remko 22 July 2013 13: 04 New
          0
          That's right!
          1. ed65b
            ed65b 22 July 2013 19: 59 New
            +1
            milk, oil, eggs laughing
            1. Revolver
              Revolver 22 July 2013 21: 11 New
              +2
              Quote: ed65b
              milk, oil, eggs laughing

              Belarus Fall. Grandma (b) selects the remaining potatoes from the sour field. GERMANS drive up on the truck (n).
              n: Hey grandma! Trigger eggs, milky!
              b: FAQ? Yes, in our village this has not been seen for a long time.
              n: Nein, grandma, das ist nicht richtig! We do not eat. We are vidavayt, and you are get gu-ma-ni-tar-ny help.

              ... it was autumn nineteen ninety-two ...
              1. Thunderbolt
                Thunderbolt 22 July 2013 21: 19 New
                0
                Quote: Nagan
                It was autumn nineteen ninety-two.
                ________________________________________
  • kapitan281271
    kapitan281271 22 July 2013 11: 30 New
    0
    The Lord of Israel is turning to you. You have become completely idiots from your satiety. Pray for Ased and ask all the gods to win. Ased will not come to you such guys that hezbala and Hamaz seem like a children's party. You understand that monarchies are already underpinned by amers and are making a difference for them, and you are simply already the antagonists of Amer’s interests. Look what happens with Senay. You left. BARDAK Obama has repeatedly recited that Israel must leave the sector. Why all of a sudden? Because the Arabs are beneath them and now you are only bothering them. As always, only Russia can save you, it has allies and the amers have only fuss. Jews save themselves before it’s too late.
    1. gregor6549
      gregor6549 22 July 2013 12: 04 New
      +3
      Uv. Constantine, I am not an Israeli or even a Jew, but I must admit that you are going too far. The Israelis clearly understand who Assad is and who opposes him and do not at all want to replace Assad with thugs. They are also aware of the sincerity of Obama's friendship for them in Barack, as well as the "friendship" of the leaders of many European states, which have already become hostages of their Muslim communities or Arab oil suppliers.
      On the other hand, Israel is a rather tiny state and understands that it will be difficult to stand against the Arab world alone. Therefore, Israel maneuvers, as far as possible, between all its friends and foes. On the other hand, Israel understands that without Assad, Hezbollah would not have lasted a month. The Lebanese themselves would have crushed her. Therefore, Israel is trying as much as possible to block the supply channels to Hezbollah and Hamaz of those types of weapons that it is more than difficult to combat after the start of their combat use. The same is true for Iran. Israel will never allow a country that is constantly threatening to destroy it to acquire weapons with which it could carry out these threats.
      Israel, by the way, was not at all opposed to all-round cooperation with the USSR and then with Russia, including in the military sphere. But both the USSR and Russia relied on their "Arab friends", who took weapons from the USSR and Russia with one hand, whenever possible free of charge (and immediately used these weapons against Israel), and the other deceived Russia with all sorts of nasty things, including sending those the same scumbags terrorists who do not care where and whom to kill, as long as they get paid. Therefore, Israel did not have and does not have much confidence in either the USSR or Russia, and it has nowhere to come from, therefore, even with a highly developed imagination, Israel will hardly be able to regard Russia as its savior. So Israel hopes mainly for itself, knowing full well that its allies, both real and imaginary, can throw Israel at any time, as they have been thrown more than once.
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 22 July 2013 20: 02 New
        0
        Yes, Israel is generally glad to cooperate with all that the Georgians are teaching us to fight, climbed into Azerbaijan. Yes, the Jews FSUs on you and on us, they are for themselves. And we must be for ourselves, and let the Jews go through the woods. not friends, they are not friends to us.
        1. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 20: 11 New
          +4
          Quote: ed65b
          Yes, Israel is generally glad to cooperate with all that the Georgians are teaching us to fight, climbed into Azerbaijan. Yes, the Jews FSUs on you and on us, they are for themselves. And we must be for ourselves, and let the Jews go through the woods. not friends, they are not friends to us.

          By the way, Israel, the only state that back in April 2008 completely curtailed military cooperation with Georgia, must pay tribute to the strong pressure of the Russian Foreign Ministry. But Ukraine and Serbia continued to sell weapons until mid-July. But this is off. But in general, you are right, each state proceeds from national interests.
          1. ed65b
            ed65b 22 July 2013 20: 18 New
            +1
            Yes, they are selling now. just do not need to compare you will still be more technologically advanced. and in Ukraine and Serbia junk. Of course, we can cope with your goodness, but it’s only a shame, the declarations are the same but in fact the seams. I wish that the words with the deed did not diverge, each means friend, the enemy is the enemy.
            1. Aaron Zawi
              Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 20: 25 New
              +3
              Quote: ed65b
              Yes, they are selling now. just do not need to compare you will still be more technologically advanced. and in Ukraine and Serbia junk. Of course, we can cope with your goodness, but it’s only a shame, the declarations are the same but in fact the seams. I wish that the words with the deed did not diverge, each means friend, the enemy is the enemy.

              It seems ridiculous to me to discuss the clash of the Republic of Armenia with any of the armies in the post-Soviet space. This is a comparison of a master of sports with a second-rate student.
              1. ed65b
                ed65b 22 July 2013 22: 27 New
                +1
                I’ll tell you more ridiculously to discuss a clash with any army in the world. Just ridiculous. The end is one and you know him. Only the capitals of countries where our names will be written on the ruins will change.
          2. tilovaykrisa
            tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 20: 26 New
            0
            The instigator of ethnic hatred, but that you are just unprincipled, worse than the British, they at least make appearances that they will support, a healthy censorship of relations.
        2. Pimply
          Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 24 New
          +1
          Georgia was armed with 23 countries. The main supplier was Ukraine. The main instructor is the NATO countries. Among others, fraternal Bulgaria armed itself, Serbs, etc. Israel was the only one at the request of Russia to cut off supplies. But for some reason, it was Israel that armed and trained Georgia. At the same time, Russia without any problems continued to supply weapons to countries in conflict with Israel, and received terrorists from Hamas and Hezbollah in the Kremlin. But the villains, definitely - this is Israel.
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 11: 51 New
    -2
    I read the article and the comments on it and was surprised. Dear forum users, sims and anti-sims, listen to the voice of your mind, understand that Russia should not get into a conflict in the Middle East. This is, first and foremost, a loss of the country's prestige. It will then be very difficult to restore. No St. 300, S-400, etc. etc. Syria will not help, understand me this is an internal conflict a civil war in which Assad must win or lose.
    You need to be an amateur in order not to understand this. To create a deeply layered, and therefore effective Syrian air defense, time is needed, a stable situation in the country is needed, which is not observed in Syria since active military operations are being carried out. Fundamentally new armed forces are needed, professionally trained, not guys from the plow. S-300 complexes it’s much more complicated than those that were shipped to Vietnam, and if they fall into the hands of untrained comrades they will even more seriously lose Russia's prestige since they still need to learn how to manage from an ordinary to a division commander, and so missiles will fly to no one knows where and to whom it follows that it will need Russian military specialists, or even completely Russian calculations, as was the case in Vietnam, Angola, Egypt and other hot spots where there was a military presence of the USSR. And the next, well, will not allow NATO to deploy this complex for one reason, it will threaten them with its presence, the deeply layered air defense system of Syria is unnecessary until it signs the corresponding peace treaties with border countries.
    Therefore, all this fuss is going on, and God forbid, it will fall into the hands of the Terrorists and bandit formations.
    And lastly, I think that the Russian president thinks soberly and adequately about these deliveries, since he perfectly understands what the delivery of these complexes, as well as calculations to them for Russia can turn out for Russia. This is drawing Russia into the Middle East conflict, and this is not the budget of Russia pull. Yes and there is nothing to her, and you dear forum users tighten their belts for the sake of fraternal peoples. The story says that ungrateful and troublesome thing.
    1. ed65b
      ed65b 22 July 2013 12: 21 New
      +4
      "Don't teach the scientist smoked citizen" - Zhiglov. Wherever we want to go there and climb behind us, look damn, the owners of the world were found.
    2. zvereok
      zvereok 22 July 2013 14: 48 New
      0
      Quote: faraon
      Civil War


      Here Pakistan, the Taliban, as true citizens of Syria threatened to send there.
    3. cherkas.oe
      cherkas.oe 22 July 2013 18: 03 New
      -1
      Quote: faraon
      this is an internal conflict civil war

      You are here, just called to the mind, and yourself ?. What kind of civil war? What is Moishe’s inner conflict? Open your eyes, or are you deliberately pretending to be fools or are you holding us all? I am surprised, however, by the appearance of such an educated kid, but say some kind of nonsense. request
      1. Pimply
        Pimply 22 July 2013 18: 31 New
        +3
        Quote: cherkas.oe
        What is Moishe’s inner conflict?

        Respected. You don’t seem to be rude, right? Vanka is not called Stepka or Proshka. Hold in your hands, show respect for the interlocutor.

        Secondly, civil war always includes the participation of not only internal but also external forces. I recommend recalling the civil war in Russia - how many different external forces took part there: for example, Chinese mercenaries actively fought on the Red side, and Entente units on the White side. At the same time, there were also the forces of anarchists, etc. etc.

        Syria, de facto, now has roughly the following picture:
        Assad, which is supported from within by the Alawites, Shiites, partly Christians.
        Assad is providing military and financial support to Russia and Iran.
        Iran also sends advisers, instructors and fighters.
        Hezbollah is supporting fighters.

        Neutral positions are occupied by Kurds and Druze.

        The opposition is divided into approximately two camps, and mainly consists of Sunnis.
        About half of the opposition is radical Sunni militants, with many volunteers from different countries. Actively sponsored by Qatar and Saudi Arabia.
        The second half is local Sunnis, more inclined towards secular ideology. Supported primarily by Europe, Qatar, Turkey and the United States.

        There is also Jordan, which receives the bulk of the refugees.

        At the same time, there is Israel nearby, which is ready to strike at either side, which violates the existing parity (for example, Syria, which is transferring more modern weapons to Hezbollah).
        1. ed65b
          ed65b 22 July 2013 20: 06 New
          0
          Quote: Pimply
          For example, on the side of the Reds, Chinese mercenaries actively fought,

          But from this place I ask in more detail. And do not forget about your own, how many Jews have taken part just to be terrible. Vissarionovich got tired then pick out. overlaid.
          1. Aaron Zawi
            Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 21: 43 New
            -1
            Quote: ed65b

            But from this place I ask in more detail. And do not forget about your own, how many Jews have taken part just to be terrible. Vissarionovich got tired then pick out. overlaid.

            Whom did he pick out? These are the Stalinist Commissars only during the war. And before Great cleansing in 1936, Stalin had 7 Jewish commissars. I don’t even speak about deputy / commissars.
            Colonel General Vannikov Boris Lvovich - People's Commissar of Armaments from 1939 to 1941, then Commissar of Ammunition in 1942-1946 After the war, Minister B.L. Vannikov led the work on the creation of the atomic bomb, being the chairman of the Government Committee No. 1.
            Ginzburg Semen Zakharovich - People's Commissar of the USSR in 1939-1946 During the war years, he directed the construction of defense and industrial facilities, the commissioning of evacuated enterprises, and the restoration of the national economy in the liberated areas.
            Kaganovich Lazar Moiseevich - member of the State. Defense Committee, chairman of the Transport Committee under the Council of People's Commissars of the USSR, People's Commissar of Railways in 1938-1942gg. and 1943-1944gg.
            Major General Zaltsman Isaac Moiseevich - People's Commissar of the Tank Industry of the USSR in 1941 - 1943. The creator and leader of Tankograd, created in Chelyabinsk on the basis of the Chelyabinsk Tractor Plant, the evacuated Kirov Machine-Building and Kharkov Tank Factories.
            1. ed65b
              ed65b 22 July 2013 22: 30 New
              +2
              I’m saying that they were, and then there were no more wives of their party members — I dispersed the Jews to the camps. So in vain you are helping a Teddy bear Georgians, he will not forgive you.
          2. Pimply
            Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 25 New
            0
            Quote: ed65b
            Vissarionovich got tired then pick out. overlaid.

            But this is contrary to the rules of the site.
            1. Totenkopff
              Totenkopff 22 July 2013 23: 19 New
              0
              And what contradicts? this is my friend the truth. Here Hitler spread rot Jews? Gnobil. what is the violation? Or an insult?
              1. Pimply
                Pimply 23 July 2013 00: 58 New
                0
                Do you have a tantrum? Drink some water.

                You, apparently, also did not read the site rules. There are rules about trolling and flood. You fall under them
  • kapitan281271
    kapitan281271 22 July 2013 12: 10 New
    +4
    You are disingenuous Izya there is no civil war there as well as it was not in Russia there is direct aggression and not covered how many Syrians are in the ranks of the bandits and? And how many trash there are from all over the world. You are right several S-300s will not stop you, but you are super warriors enough to put a dozen of your pilots and you will not put one more at the helm. It’s a pity, it’s a pity that with these S-300 everything will be in our own way, you’re right. There will be no unprepared specialists not cover complexes not "Pennant" covering the complexes, but would I like to look at your super elite fighters dreaming to meet with our guys remind? where all of Turkey’s spenaz has been swept away so unexpectedly and, most importantly, so quickly. And you are also cunning that it’s not Russia's business that a pipeline from the Gulf to Europe can only be laid through Syria, and as you understand, the guys from very democratic Saudi Arabia have been rubbing their hands for a long time. Yes, it’s terrible that the viability of today's Russia depends on oil supplies to Europe, and for the right to live we must fight by all available means.
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 12: 10 New
    0
    Quote: kapitan281271
    The Lord of Israel is turning to you. You have become completely idiots from your satiety. Pray for Ased and ask all the gods to win. Ased will not come to you such guys that hezbala and Hamaz seem like a children's party. You understand that monarchies are already underpinned by amers and are making a difference for them, and you are simply already the antagonists of Amer’s interests. Look what happens with Senay. You left. BARDAK Obama has repeatedly recited that Israel must leave the sector. Why all of a sudden? Because the Arabs are beneath them and now you are only bothering them. As always, only Russia can save you, it has allies and the amers have only fuss. Jews save themselves before it’s too late.

    Dear friend!
    We’ll not pray for Assad, It’s enough for a couple of days for Israel to have no Assad’s regime, but Israel doesn’t do this for the simple reason that this is Syria’s internal conflict. This is its civil war in which Assad must either win or lose. Israel only pursues its interests in the issue of security.
    As for Sinai, this was an agreement on peace and cooperation with Egypt, which was carried out (so often) by both parties. We left Gaza under the pressure of the international community to open our eyes to the whole world and to the world community what is radical Islamism.
    But this is not a problem for Israel, you can always turn back the clock.
    The question is different, we are in our own land, and we don’t have the Ural Mountains for which we can sit. We have no choice and no one will come to our aid. Whether we are them or they are not given us another.
    That's what we live with
    1. ed65b
      ed65b 22 July 2013 12: 24 New
      +3
      Quote: faraon
      The question is different, we are in our own land, and we don’t have the Ural Mountains for which we can sit. We have no choice and no one will come to our aid. Whether we are them or they are not given us another.
      That's what we live with

      And when did we sit behind the Ural mountains ???? Or did she go away ???? As for helping you, this is how the United States helps you and has helped and will help you, and you sit behind them and threaten the Arabs with your fist from behind the back of a terrible brother. And now are you trying to threaten us? We will decide whether to help Assad or not without Jewish friends.
    2. tilovaykrisa
      tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 13: 36 New
      0
      Tell me, dear, where will you run this time, to which country, when will the Arabs return Israel to where it came from?
      1. Aaron Zawi
        Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 20: 15 New
        +2
        Quote: tilovaykrisa
        Tell me, dear, where will you run this time, to which country, when will the Arabs return Israel to where it came from?

        Let them return first.
        1. tilovaykrisa
          tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 20: 29 New
          0
          Thanks to your actions and the stereotype that you have already established that the enemies around guano and Tsahal are invincible, be sure to return. Before Rome, you’ll be (I’m not going to voice it), and even his barbarians were stolen to the stones, and not just barbarians, but the children of those whom Rome did not consider to be people whom the Roman legions used to trample on as weaklings.
          1. Aaron Zawi
            Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 21: 46 New
            +1
            Nonsense. We got a gorgeous vaccine from 1973 year after conceit.
    3. cherkas.oe
      cherkas.oe 22 July 2013 18: 09 New
      +1
      Quote: faraon
      , and we have no Ural mountains beyond which you can sit.

      From you fraer, when did we sit behind the Ural Mountains? winked I don’t remember.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 12: 43 New
    -2
    Quote: kapitan281271
    You are disingenuous Izya there is no civil war there as well as it was not in Russia there is direct aggression and not covered how many Syrians are in the ranks of the bandits and? And how many trash there are from all over the world. You are right several S-300s will not stop you, but you are super warriors enough to put a dozen of your pilots and you will not put one more at the helm. It’s a pity, it’s a pity that with these S-300 everything will be in our own way, you’re right. There will be no unprepared specialists not cover complexes not "Pennant" covering the complexes, but would I like to look at your super elite fighters dreaming to meet with our guys remind? where all of Turkey’s spenaz has been swept away so unexpectedly and, most importantly, so quickly. And you are also cunning that it’s not Russia's business that a pipeline from the Gulf to Europe can only be laid through Syria, and as you understand, the guys from very democratic Saudi Arabia have been rubbing their hands for a long time. Yes, it’s terrible that the viability of today's Russia depends on oil supplies to Europe, and for the right to live we must fight by all available means.

    Earlier in my comments, I wrote that Syria is a meat grinder that grinds radical Islam. At the beginning of the Civil War, the majority of Syrians were on the side of the rebels, but as soon as this escalated into conflict, all the scum of the Muslim world began to get into it, no matter where to fight for money, the Koran, Islam, and other related attributes of cover. Be it the Caucasus, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, etc. So a respected opponent, the more their mincing machine grinds the better for Russia as well.
    You write for the pipeline from the gulf. Yes, this is a valid argument. So peaceful Syrians die for the pipe, which the United States and Russia cannot divide. I think this is the height of cenicism on your part. For this, there are many options for resolving peacefully.
    You dream about meeting with fighters of the elite units of the Russian army with the IDF, and I, in principle, do not mind, but in exercises and not in open combat. Tidy up your place in Russia, and then scatter with elite shots that take a lot of money and years of preparation. (almost all the fighters of the elite special forces are children and grandchildren of the Russian-speaking Israelis, only their motivation is much higher since they will go to die for their near and dear ones, and therefore for the people of Israel.
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 12: 58 New
    0
    Quote: ed65b
    "Don't teach the scientist smoked citizen" - Zhiglov. Wherever we want to go there and climb behind us, look damn, the owners of the world were found.

    Yes, actually no one claims to world domination. Yes, and it would be ridiculous. Moreover, to threaten Russia, the question is different (with regard to the Ural Mountains) Israel is not Russia and does not have those human, natural resources like Russia. If Russia can afford to get into any conflicts, then Israel does not have such an opportunity.
    Well, and as for the teachings, I think that Russia is a fairly educated country to understand so as not to step on the same rake that it attacked in the past (without sarcasm)
    1. ed65b
      ed65b 22 July 2013 13: 59 New
      -1
      We have a hobby such a rake walk laughing
  • Naval
    Naval 22 July 2013 13: 07 New
    0
    Quote: faraon
    This is her civil war in which Assad must either win or lose.

    No, this is not a civil war, this is the beginning of a big war, then there will be Iran, the former Soviet republics of Central Asia, the Caucasus, Russia. All this international terrorism is persistently pushing towards the borders of Russia. Therefore, we care ...
    He worked in the crew of one ship, many years ago, with the Syrians, though they were people from one clan, at first one, then a couple more arrived, and after 1,5 months there were already more than a dozen. All relatives, cousins, nephews, etc. I didn’t like them, they were sneaky, cunning, two-faced, don’t substitute their backs, double-check the work. For example, they overslept on a watch, they did not drain water from a consumable tank, and diesel engines died out. They punished, not with money, threatened with a finger, so they arranged arson in the pantry. The sprinkler system worked well, otherwise it would have been. After that, the Israelis began to understand, although I understand that it is impossible to judge people by one family.
    However, sympathy on the side, the fate of Russia is being decided in Syria.
  • dizelniy
    dizelniy 22 July 2013 13: 20 New
    0
    As the regional committee decides, so be it.
  • 12345
    12345 22 July 2013 13: 28 New
    0
    Promised missiles - definitely deliver!

    But, only by diluting them (every 100) with a large number of false containers. And pushshay Israel bombs them until they run into a "worthy meeting"!
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 13: 36 New
    0
    Quote: AVV
    First of all, it is necessary to ensure the protection of your base in Tartus with shells, and the 300 latest modifications! And also with the BUK-2M systems. Then Israel will stop scrolling !!! Plus put onyxes there! Then everything will work out logically.

    Question1, and who will allow this?
    Question2, and who will let them shoot?
    The base in Tartus is the base of the Russian Navy, with corresponding obligations regarding armaments. And is not the sovereign territory of Russia. If a shot is fired from the base, this is a direct involvement of Russia in the conflict, and the consequences of the war, which in my opinion are not profitable and harmful for Russia. There are no rear services, no security, hopes for supporting Syria are minimal.
    1. tilovaykrisa
      tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 13: 42 New
      0
      That's right, we need not to supply the c300 to Syria, but to Iran, and not only the C300, you just got a medium-range strategist and sent her to Russia, so we need updated Iskander, radars, to deliver to Iran, teach the Persians, and they will find options to help Syria, and while there is still time we need to prepare Iran to meet with the Israeli air force. You can transfer the documentation to the "pioneers" and help them in their creation. The PKR can be equipped with the latest, in general, the Persians need to help at this stage.
    2. 12345
      12345 22 July 2013 14: 54 New
      +2
      Quote: faraon
      Question1, and who will allow this?
      Question2, and who will let them shoot?


      Avon, how excited you are ...

      Shot, Shot, don’t worry! And you, then, try to prove: whether the launcher (quite legitimately sold to the Syrians) stood on the territory of the base, or next to it, but behind a fence. And who was there, in fact, was behind the control panels.

      Uncle Vova is a master at such jokes. And formally - everything will be absolutely within the framework of international law.

      So that: "Do not be dashing while it is quiet!" ©
      Sit on your priest evenly and do your favorite drip reclamation.
  • zvereok
    zvereok 22 July 2013 13: 39 New
    0
    The obsolete air defense systems in Syria’s air defense system are not able to reflect Israeli air raids,


    Beech and Armor, Not?
    1. tilovaykrisa
      tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 13: 44 New
      0
      no, to cover some kind of object yes, to repel a mass strike no.
      1. zvereok
        zvereok 22 July 2013 14: 58 New
        +1
        Quote: tilovaykrisa
        no, to cover some kind of object yes, to repel a mass strike no.


        So this, but that the presidential air defense palace was not covered? The explosions earlier this year were not far from Damascus. And like a massive air strike was not observed. Although the Americans talked about the massive movement of the Air Force in the airspace of a neighboring country, it is still not clear why the air defense did not work on missiles.
        1. tilovaykrisa
          tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 17: 21 New
          0
          and everything is simple, there is no single field of coverage, the Israelis struck from the adjacent state’s airspace in the least protected areas; most likely, the means of the reb were used. They can allow you to work from a distance of 200 km, and Syrian air defense cannot get them.
  • Volkhov
    Volkhov 22 July 2013 13: 50 New
    0
    The S-300 in Syria is a scam from a number of Iran / Syrian helicopters / Yak-130 / Syrian S-300 - they took the money, trained the calculations, but we cannot bring it, which is quite logical, since RF is fighting against Syria.
    Syria can get them in the same way as the M-46 - in the form of a trophy from the rebels in the new factory paint, by the way, and the calculations have already returned from training, so it will be mastered to someone, if that ...
    In reality, the S-300 is an old system of increased cumbersome technology of the 70s, for a real adversary there is little danger, hope can only be a coincidence, that is, if you are lucky, you can capture the wreckage of a separate device, but not gain air supremacy. The situation in the Navy is large defenseless targets, beautiful in peacetime.
    1. Raven1972
      Raven1972 22 July 2013 23: 37 New
      -1
      Quote: Volkhov
      bulky

      What is it like ? belay laughing
      I’m a rzhunimaga ... At least they knew what you were talking about so that people would not make people laugh
      laughing laughing laughing
      And yet, if she is so "low-risk" then there would not be so many screams about this hi
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 13: 50 New
    +2
    Quote: zvereok
    Yeah, I've kissed him four times since the beginning of the year, despite the presence of Buk and Carapace. I understand, the first time they were not ready for bombing, but 4 times, with 1 "conditionally wrecked" Israeli plane, that's too much.

    "When the pop fell from the bell tower for the first time, it was an accident, but when it fell four times, it was the system's fault."
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 14: 04 New
    0
    Quote: tilovaykrisa
    Tell me, dear, where will you run this time, to which country, when will the Arabs return Israel to where it came from?

    Nowhere. Israel never escaped from the battlefield, was taken prisoner and taken into slavery. But all the same, they returned individually, years later, to Israel, and there was always a Jewish presence in Yerusalim. There is historical evidence for this.
    1. tilovaykrisa
      tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 14: 12 New
      +2
      This time the US is brewing porridge in the Middle East, you cannot resist the role of a policeman, they are currently forming a new world enemy, new fascism only in the face of radical Islam, with a clear goal in principle, and again Israel is in the forefront , you will be turned into a victim again, just like the last time, then you left Europe and went to the United States, and Israel, and now it’s interesting to me where you’ll carry your feet.
    2. 12345
      12345 22 July 2013 15: 03 New
      +1
      Quote: faraon
      Israel never escaped from the battlefield, was taken prisoner and taken into slavery. But all the same, they returned individually after years ...


      Leavened Israeli "patriotism" - oil painting!

      Men, due to the characteristics of the national mentality, were rarely taken prisoner. This is not from a good life; Jewry began to be transmitted exclusively by mother. Simply, the fathers were regularly and totally exterminated.
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 14: 16 New
    -3
    Quote: ed65b
    We have a hobby such a rake walk laughing

    Well, what can I tell you about this, the flag is in your hands. Tighten your belts, spit on your old people with their beggarly retirement, on children with a meager allowance, on the development of education, healthcare, social infrastructure, But then the World Revolution, internationalism, fraternal friendship, how do you think Russia and its people are not tired of this, is it time to change the slogans and begin to build in the name of the people of Russia and not fraternal countries
    1. ed65b
      ed65b 22 July 2013 14: 57 New
      +1
      You leave the songs about the poor old people battling on the porch for consumption in Israel. Pensions were tightened and the elderly, by the way, also help their children. We will understand how to help children with infrastructure, Moscow was not built right away and our country has been robbed for 20 years with your help. world revolution for Marxists. By the way, Islam has already begun, you have not noticed? And we help Syria for our own sake - we won’t help them then we will catch these freaks in our country, but do we need it? so purely mercantile interests. same as yours. But why do you need jihadist Syria, I can’t understand BDSM?
    2. cherkas.oe
      cherkas.oe 22 July 2013 21: 24 New
      +2
      Quote: faraon
      But the World Revolution, internationalism, fraternal friendship,

      Current is not necessary from the Jewish head to Russian. These slogans listed by you were invented by your brother back in the days of the cromelle and later by the leaders of the French revolution (I won’t list the names you know) and then creatively developed again by Marx and his minion Engels, your field of fruit, and in Russia, Bronstein and others like him (the list is very long, all your poets). Well, in Syria, we will purely throat you for your vital and economic interests, if that. yes
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 14: 21 New
    -1
    Quote: zvereok
    Quote: 12345
    Read it - and you will understand everything. In a few words: they were oppressed - they took revenge, they took revenge - they were oppressed. Ideology is tailored to a narrow circle of "friends" who, acting together, crush "aliens" one by one. Basically - financially, but after gaining their state - and physically. At the same time, all moral principles (do not kill, do not steal, do not break perjury, etc.) are canceled in relation to "strangers". Moreover, the "strangers" themselves are equated with animals. As a result - harassment from the state of residence and further - along the above described circle. Throughout history, right up to the creation of your state


    For the sake of justice: - What about the Muslims in relation to the "infidels"?

    Still harder, they cut off the head like a ram to the infidels
  • kapitan281271
    kapitan281271 22 July 2013 14: 40 New
    +2
    Unlike many others, my friend always treated Israel with respect and in many ways you are right. Not a warm fact of Russian history, but the Syrian army and the Syrian people are indeed bleeding to defend Russia as well. And it’s more expensive to negotiate with Westerners to remind the Munich conspiracy to expand the NATO missile defense. And if you dig deeper it will be the same. I’m not talking about Bonoparte’s giving and direct financing by the Entente of the so-called Russian revolution. But now we are talking about something else. You wrote why Russia should climb mine. I answered. And all the same, I insist, close your eyes and imagine you got up in the morning and Assad won’t win a vacation, you’re at least razed everything there, you’ll get a terrible, terrible, and I’m not indifferent, I say this without pathos, the fate of many compatriots who now decided that they should live in Israel . This is politics, and your villains, in fact, as well as ours, do not care how many Jews the Syrians and Russians die. When your house will take off into the air and God forbid the mustard gas breaks they will tell you we were attacked by everyone and few will think about who brought these power to power
    1. zvereok
      zvereok 22 July 2013 15: 08 New
      0
      Quote: kapitan281271
      You got up in the morning and Aseda won’t defeat the cannibalism, but you’re even leveling the earth


      This is Israel’s dream when they are in tanks and planes, and around them all countries are armed with small arms. Any war will occur with the ratio of losses of 1 to 100, and civilians are high-profile terrorists, therefore they also need not be spared.
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 14: 49 New
    0
    Quote: 12345
    Yes, slander yourself!

    It is, of course, I do not argue - it is pleasant to feel yourself head and shoulders above all for the mere fact of your birth, in the "chosen estate". Again - the guaranteed support of the "tribesmen". But this is all "in theory".
    In practice, however, there are only continuous troubles and one prospect: to become a "bargaining chip" or even "cannon fodder" at all.
    And, do you need it? Or really, can’t wait to lie on the sacrificial altar? Or comfort yourself with hope: someone, but not me, someone, but not me, will become a victim of tomorrow?

    After all, without sacrifices, in such a case, it is impossible in any way, because without sacrifices your flock becomes poorly managed, or even completely flees.

    IMHO, Jewishness is akin to schizophrenia. On the whole, he is a normal person, but as far as a certain topic is concerned, then - "complete cuckoo"!
    "Religious extremism" is called.

    Let's see a little differently.
    You write God's chosen one, I’ll answer: except for the troubles, my God's chosen one brought me nothing.
    Support, yes, but all small nations have it (remember the army, the Georgians, the Armenians, the Chechens, etc.)
    Cannon meat: I will say in the words of my children who served in the elite parts of Tzahal, and go to military training every half a year. Nobody forces them to do this, but at the first request they return to their bases, and this is not subject to discussion.
    PS As my son said about this: "This country has given me and my family in moral and material terms much more than Russia in eighteen years of life, that I am ready to stand up for Israel at any time," this is not a slogan this is an answer to a cousin who came to visit from Russia.
    As for the victims: believe in the Second World War, not everyone fought for their homeland in Tashkent. There were many ordinary soldiers, officers, and generals who worthily fought and died for their homeland. (I think you will find examples to cite everything in the internet)
    Well, the last thing, with regard to faith, religion (call it what you like) Since the time of Moses, Jews have not imposed their faith (religion) on anyone, do not confuse it with Islam) In Judaism there is no call for war (kill the wrong one), there is no coercion to accept Judaism. (but if someone wants to join the people of Israel, he must undergo the appropriate rite of passage.) And this is not at all like admission to the pioneers
    1. 12345
      12345 22 July 2013 15: 48 New
      +2
      Quote: faraon
      ... apart from troubles, my God-chosenness brought me nothing ...


      What am I talking about?


      Quote: faraon
      Nobody forces them to this, but upon request, they return to their bases, and this is not subject to discussion.


      Yeah ... And, tell me, with a tear of tenderness, that in Israel there is no criminal prosecution for desertion.


      Quote: faraon
      As my son said about this: "This country has given me and my family in moral and material terms much more than Russia in eighteen years of life ...


      That is why they do not like Jews, because they even call their Israel "this country". Joke.

      Well, seriously - it is quite possible that "this country" has given a lot, but you can be sure that in return "this country" will demand even more.
      Taki - traditions ...

      As regards the Great Patriotic War, the Soviet people fought and won, I remember, the Soviet people. Soviet people fought with Jewish, Tatar, Kazakh and many other names of the most diverse nations and nationalities. But the main burden on himself was borne by the Russian (Belarusian, Ukrainian) people, for which Comrade separately thanked him. Stalin.

      It was only later that the Jews began to emphasize and defiantly single out "theirs" everywhere.

      Regarding the upcoming sacrifices. The Holocaust project was launched by the Jews of the United States to stimulate the departure of Jews from Europe to the "promised land".
      Indeed, well, what sane person would drag himself voluntarily from a settled cozy Europe into ... a lifeless desert? Yes, even to such neighbors? Only threatened with death! Which was organized.
      "When one person dies, it's a tragedy. When millions die, that's statistics." © Cynically, of course, but absolutely acceptable for the arbiters of your destinies.

      Quote: faraon
      Since the time of Moses, Jews have not imposed their faith (religion) on anyone, do not confuse with Islam) There is no call to war in Judaism (kill the unfaithful), there is no coercion to accept Judaism. (But if someone wants to join the people of Israel, he must pass the appropriate rite of passage.) And this is not at all like admission to the pioneers


      I already wrote about this. No mass character. The circle of "friends" should not be too wide, otherwise the whole tsimes will disappear.
      Calls for war? What are you speaking about? In the context of programmed NON-MASSITY teachings - this is tantamount to suicide.
      Simply - all "strangers" are declared as if not people. After all, even killing an animal (if it is not sacred) is not a sin. I'm not even talking about trivial deception, perjury and other "little things".

      The worst thing, IMHO, is when parents bury their children. And you are in a high-risk group. Heavily elevated.
      Bo, even the most perfect technique, in a big mess, from death - alas, does not guarantee.
  • Ruslan_F38
    Ruslan_F38 22 July 2013 14: 50 New
    0
    "The trickle of Russian weapons supplied by him will turn into a stormy stream. And then you will hear the voice of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, addressed to the Israelis:" Let's move on, this is my day. " - this is not an article, this is a song! Victory will be ours!
    1. Kyrgyz
      Kyrgyz 22 July 2013 15: 11 New
      0
      Quote: Ruslan_F38
      And then you will hear the voice of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, addressed to the Israelis: "Go ahead, this is my day."

      And then what is our benefit ?, the trouble of Syria is more from its fellow Arabs than from the "omnipresent" Jews
  • Khan
    Khan 22 July 2013 15: 03 New
    0
    As far as I know, the principle of operation of air defense is based on the fact that the Big Locator sees the object and informs the coordinators of the complex and then the complex guides the target and knocks it down. And what if there are a bunch of targets on the big locator that are all lit up, this is a result of interference with the enemy. How the complex will behave in such a situation if the main locator is blinded is always interesting to me.
  • kapitan281271
    kapitan281271 22 July 2013 15: 05 New
    0
    Let your son not mention the name of Russia in Sua. This is his mother we are distinguished for you all the time, someone must give something to release you from Auschwitz. You would explain to your son if Russia only took Jews from you then after May 9, 1945 another hundred thousand generations of Jews should have been given to Russia and you probably will not be able to return everything. But besides you, the Jewish people still consist of such as Rosenbaum Etush Vysotsky and many others who did not think how to take but thought how to give. YES EXTENDED RUSSIA YES OVERLINE OUR NAMES
    1. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 21: 52 New
      +1
      Only Russia? And to the other peoples of the USSR? But to partisans and underground workers in Europe? And what about the soldiers and officers of the Allies? And 1,5 million warriors of Jews who fought against Nazism? Is the Jewish people not obliged to all of them for their existence?
      1. tilovaykrisa
        tilovaykrisa 22 July 2013 22: 05 New
        +1
        1,5 Jews who fought against Nazism, do not exaggerate the numbers, you will soon pass the Holocaust for 20mln, but there were responsible Jews, but they fought, but where are the numbers about?
        1. Pimply
          Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 51 New
          0
          You, as I understand it, are not familiar with the site’s rules?
        2. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 22 July 2013 23: 24 New
          0
          Quote: tilovaykrisa
          1,5 Jews who fought against Nazism, do not exaggerate the numbers, you will soon pass the Holocaust for 20mln, but there were responsible Jews, but they fought, but where are the numbers about?

          Is that laziness of the mind? Or is Google closed to you? Yes, this is the most commonplace.
          http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Евреи_во_Второй_мировой_войне
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 15: 06 New
    -1
    Quote: 12345
    This is the whole "trick"!

    For what the Jews sincerely hate Christ and Mohammed, it is because the latter expanded the circle of "theirs" so much that it became impossible to extract material gesheft from the cohesive NARROW circle.
    It's like living in Israel today. EVERYTHING around is "ours". And who will you "hunt in a pack" for? Today, with the development of production, it has become possible not to live in poverty, remaining a loner. And even then, until you face the arbitrariness of the authorities. Well, then it turns out that the diaspora is power!

    And it all began with Christ, who began to accept in his sect all those who did not fall.
    All !!! Well, how can I forgive him after THIS?

    Remember what a difficult procedure is on the path of initiation "into the Jews." It's good if you prove that mom is Jewish, but what if not?
    Thought - did "giyur" - circumcision and already - a Jew? Yeah ... Right now, s-s-s! ..
    This is done by Muslims, circumcised - and it's done! And, the Jews - "sorry - move over"!

    So, for all claims to Christianity and Islam, a fairly comprehensive answer is given by one bearded anecdote:

    “And why do legs smell so bad?”
    - Ah, you remember about the place from which they grow ...

    Dear, do not ask questions for which there is an obvious answer.
    In Israel, there are different religious denominations. No one oppresses and humiliates them. So do not smack bullshit. As far as Christ is concerned, this is a separate issue. In brief I will tell you about it. God cannot have a son. He is GOD, why should he have a son? promote your ideas? politics? worldview? God is all powerful; he doesn’t need it, just click a finger and it will rain, once again it will snow, well, etc. etc.
    Mohamed is a separate case, ask where he received his revelation, and from whom? You’ll just be surprised at this, Islam is a religion taken from at least three sources - Jews, Christians, Druze.
    Initially, Islam was a peace-loving religion calling for a single god; later, under the influence of politics and at that time, it began to transform into radical Islam, which we now observe.
    And to love or not to love, this has nothing to do with it.
    1. 12345
      12345 22 July 2013 16: 17 New
      +3
      Quote: faraon
      God cannot have a son.


      Sorry, but whose son was, well, for example ... Hercules?

      Well, blaming God for impotence is simply blasphemy! The rabbis will certainly punish you!

      Quote: faraon
      He is GOD, why does he need a son?


      And, excuse me, what’s our business with you, why? Surely we, with our scanty little mind, are able to embrace the whole plan of the Creator?

      Well, suppose God the Father is a super entity. It is impossible for him to come to us, for we will have all the roofs removed from just his appearance. Not in vain, after all, God and Moses indirectly, "the burning bush" was.

      And, to reason with people is required. And not atomic bombing, like "Sodom and Gomorrah", but something more humane, or something.
      I needed an intermediary. With the authority of God. Which, in fact, was done.

      And after all it was: "An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth!", And it became: "Love your enemy!" As they say - feel the difference!

      In Russia - an abyss of nationalities and everyone, from time immemorial, lived together, apart from the hot guys from the Caucasus, who were regularly "set on fire" by Russia's enemies from behind a distant hill.

      In Israel, there are Jews and Arabs. Arabs and Jews. And for both: "An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth!"

      As a result, mutual hatred only multiplies. And, when the thread, it will definitely cover you. And no super-duper weapon will save you, alas. The ever-increasing degree of "radicalization of Islam" is on your conscience. Ah, the whole world pays for it later.
      1. Pimply
        Pimply 22 July 2013 17: 20 New
        0
        Quote: 12345
        Sorry, but whose son was, well, for example ... Hercules?

        And this is paganism, dear.

        For Christians, and other monotheists in Judaism, there is a separate, very respectful name - Bnei Noah (sons of Noah).
        1. 12345
          12345 22 July 2013 21: 11 New
          +1
          Quote: Pimply
          And this is paganism, dear.


          "Yes, okay ?! Ah, the guys don't know ..." ©

          And, from the position of the Ancient Greek and Roman? That, I remember, the Romans regularly admonished the Jews! Oh, and they did it well, just - "oil painting"!

          As for the respectful attitude of Jews towards "Christians and others ...", then, as they say in Odessa: "Don't tell my slippers!"

          The fact that you are so "white and fluffy" - you could have shown for a long time not in words, but by the example of building relationships with Arabs. Avon to you, stupid, Uncle Vova from Russia even showed a good example: HOW.
          Yes, on the example of a memorable and not by the evening mentioned Chechnya.
          What - the famous Jewish stinginess worked? Stupidly - "the toad crushed"? Better to buy a couple more bombers than build an extra mosque for people? That's it ... And, because the world is not a cheap thing. And the built mosque, on the scales of history, is guaranteed to outweigh the bombers.

          But - how so! Help the Gentiles! This is for you - faith does not allow! And therefore, bombers are a priority.

          And, according to this - you are not "white", and even more so - not "fluffy", but, exactly as you have on your avatar: "green and slimy".
          1. faraon
            faraon 22 July 2013 21: 25 New
            0
            Well, of course, poor Arabs can’t pray, you dear, don’t be ashamed, go to the Israeli Russian-language website and see photos if you don’t have the means to come and see for yourself how many mosques are in Israel and how and where the oppressed Palestinian people live and pray. Then talk about white and fluffy
            1. 12345
              12345 22 July 2013 22: 23 New
              +1
              Quote: faraon
              ... come and see for yourself how many mosques in Israel ...


              Well, HOW MANY of all this "evil Arabs" were built by "good Jews"? And, also, "in addition," go and, according to the widely known immense kindness of their souls, "white and fluffy" Jews built hospitals, schools and sports facilities for the Arabs? Maybe the residential areas were restored after the air raid? After all, a whole nation cannot be bad, by definition. So after the destruction of the terrorists, the destroyed houses need to be restored? After all, a civilized and democratic Israel is not a fascist, a thread, and does not fight with the civilian population? Or am I, somewhere, wrong?

              Come on, don't hesitate! Let the "evil anti-Semites" suddenly become painfully ashamed against the background of such an "attraction of unprecedented generosity" from truly "white and fluffy"!

              Huh? I do not see! That's it ...
          2. The comment was deleted.
            1. Pimply
              Pimply 22 July 2013 22: 53 New
              +1
              Bravo. The transition to the discussion of the avatar is the height of the genius of conducting the discussion. Bis?
              1. ed65b
                ed65b 22 July 2013 23: 33 New
                +2
                Patchy urgently change the avatar to pink and fluffy, people do not understand, draws different analogies, although about pink they are even more ragged. wink
                1. Pimply
                  Pimply 23 July 2013 01: 00 New
                  0
                  Trololo panting here is hard to call people.
                  1. Day 11
                    Day 11 23 July 2013 01: 07 New
                    0
                    Zhenya, can they admit me to the ritual of a giyur? There were no Jews in the family. Rebe said no ...
                  2. ed65b
                    ed65b 23 July 2013 08: 31 New
                    0
                    Quote: Pimply
                    Trololo panting here is hard to call people.

                    Well, why don’t you love us like that? We are with you wholeheartedly and you ..... wink
              2. 12345
                12345 22 July 2013 23: 51 New
                +1
                Avatars are on public display. It’s like in places of mass crowding of living people (square, park). And if some people offend public morality with their appearance, then why can't this be discussed?

                The mentally ill are a very cunning and resourceful people. ("People" - without a "back" thought.)

                For example, people with exhibitionism are eager to attract attention at any cost. And they achieve their goal by not always exposing themselves in a straightforward manner, but, for example, with the help of an avatar that attracts attention. Due to demonstrative ugliness and animation.

                You understand?
                1. Pimply
                  Pimply 23 July 2013 01: 01 New
                  0
                  Does it make you nervous? Drink some water.


                  Quote: 12345

                  You understand?

                  Everything is funnier. In "Monday Begins Saturday" there was a character - an ignoramus from an ignoramus. He loved to sprinkle his speech with bad French.
  • Kyrgyz
    Kyrgyz 22 July 2013 15: 09 New
    0
    Syria will not be able to ensure the operability of such a bulky system as the C300 nor its safety, the C300 is the final defense element, and as a separate part of it without the remaining elements it will not show proper efficiency, it is necessary to start soon with small and medium radius systems with modern countermeasure systems Electronic warfare and, of course, due to land protection, not forgetting about enemies from the sea
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 15: 14 New
    +1
    Quote: 12345
    Quote: faraon
    Question1, and who will allow this?
    Question2, and who will let them shoot?


    Avon, how excited you are ...

    Shot, Shot, don’t worry! And you, then, try to prove: whether the launcher (quite legitimately sold to the Syrians) stood on the territory of the base, or next to it, but behind a fence. And who was there, in fact, was behind the control panels.

    Uncle Vova is a master at such jokes. And formally - everything will be absolutely within the framework of international law.

    So that: "Do not be dashing while it is quiet!" ©
    Sit on your priest evenly and do your favorite drip reclamation.

    I think so "Uncle Vova understands everything perfectly and receives information not from our forum, and is also perfectly aware of the consequences of an ill-considered step.
    And as for the control panel of the complex, no one really knows who was sitting behind him. And who dunked him.
    Dear, take your comments seriously - do not underestimate your alleged opponent
    1. 12345
      12345 22 July 2013 16: 26 New
      +2
      Quote: faraon
      And who soaked him.


      As the Red Army soldier Sukhov said: "This is hardly!"

      And, in general, "respected" - you are catastrophically losing face. And - literacy. Avon, you are already starting to sink to the thieves' vocabulary. It's a shame and not comme il faut.
  • faraon
    faraon 22 July 2013 15: 26 New
    0
    Quote: ed65b
    You leave the songs about the poor old people battling on the porch for consumption in Israel. Pensions were tightened and the elderly, by the way, also help their children. We will understand how to help children with infrastructure, Moscow was not built right away and our country has been robbed for 20 years with your help. world revolution for Marxists. By the way, Islam has already begun, you have not noticed? And we help Syria for our own sake - we won’t help them then we will catch these freaks in our country, but do we need it? so purely mercantile interests. same as yours. But why do you need jihadist Syria, I can’t understand BDSM?

    We don’t need, We look at it as a meat grinder that grinds more and more supporters of radical Islam, it’s just at our fingertips, but it’s still a bit to you. And we catch these freaks every day.
    1. ed65b
      ed65b 22 July 2013 16: 17 New
      +1
      Quote: faraon
      It’s still a bit to you

      Yes, dear, it’s even closer to us than to you. When Syrians cut their heads, they don’t speak Hebrew in the video, but they regularly speak Russian.