Military Review

Kamran: time to scatter stones, time to collect them

128
As one character said the Soviet cartoon, the tree just will not begin to buzz. Especially in our time. And, if more and more active conversations began around the base in Cam Ranh, then apparently, something more is hidden behind this than it seems at first glance.




On May 17, Vietnamese Ambassador to Russia Nguyen Thanh Sean made a statement saying that Vietnam is not against Russia's return to the military base in Cam Ranh, but this cooperation should not be directed against third countries.

"Viet Nam’s policy is not to join military alliances or ally with one state against another. In this context, implement the ports of Cam Ranh for multilateral international cooperation in order to provide maritime transport services, repair ships and develop military equipment to ensure peace and stability in region is a suitable destination. "

It is worth figuring out what stands behind all this. Just because such statements are just not made by ambassadors.

So, the base Camran.

History It began back in 1979, when two months after the end of the Vietnam-China conflict, the USSR and Vietnam signed an agreement on the use of the port of Kamrani as a logistics point of the Soviet Naval fleet for a period of 25 years.

Subsequently, the largest Soviet military base abroad with a total area of ​​100 square meters was created here. km All infrastructure has been modernized. The 169th Guards Separate Mixed Station was constantly based at the airport aviation a regiment of three-squadron aviation personnel of the Pacific Fleet, including Tu-16K anti-ship missile carriers, Tu-95RTs naval reconnaissance and target-guards, Tu-142 anti-submarine aircraft, MiG-23ML fighter jets, and also a Mi-14 helicopter squad.

Under the contract, at the same time, 8 — 10 of Soviet surface ships, 4 — 8 submarines with a floating base, and up to six other ships could be at the same time. In addition, the simultaneous stay at the airfield 14 — 16 of rocket-carrying aircraft, 6 — 9 reconnaissance and 2 — 3 transport was permitted. By agreement between the USSR Ministry of Defense and the Ministry of National Defense of Vietnam, the number of ships and aircraft could increase.

A number of tasks were assigned to the E & P in Cam Ranh: provision of ships and vessels during the stay with electric power, water, fuel and lubricants, food; maintaining the established reserves of the MTS, their issuance and delivery to the ships and vessels of the Soviet Navy that were passing; the implementation of a transit link between ships and ships from the Pacific and Indian Ocean zones with command posts of the Pacific Fleet and Navy; the use of an airfield for the basing of anti-submarine and reconnaissance aircraft; development and maintenance of the Soviet-Vietnamese Commonwealth.

With the launch of the 17 th operational fleet squadron of the Pacific Fleet, Cam Ranh received the status of a naval base.

According to the Soviet-Vietnamese agreement, the rent of the base was free. Since 1991, the Vietnamese side has unofficially offered the USSR, and then Russia, to pay the rent.

In 2001, the Russian leadership decided not to renew the agreement with Vietnam and to evacuate the base ahead of schedule. Russian Foreign Minister Igor Ivanov noted in 2002 that "over the course of 10 years, our navy did not go into the Indian Ocean and did not use the services of a naval base." The base was closed after the closure of the military base in Lourdes (Cuba). The last Russian military left the Cam Ranh in May 2002.

Such is the background.

It should be noted that immediately after the hasty departure of their Camrani by our military, the gallant guys from the Pentagon came out to the representatives of Vietnam. And they offered to rent them to Cam Ranh.

Kamrani Port is considered one of the best deep-water ports in the world. Plus, the former American airfield, which the United States lost during the war in 1975, and ours were well modernized.

To the credit of the Vietnamese, I must say that everything is fine with their memory. And the Americans did not receive the port and the airfield. Kamran continued to exist as a port and an international airport, let's say, in a truncated manner.

10 years have passed. During this time, much has changed. Russia was changing little by little, the situation around us was changing too. Somehow imperceptibly Russian from the category of "poor and needy" moved into a different category. Suddenly, Kamran resurfaced as a submarine of a potential enemy floats in the middle of the order.

12 November 2013, literally six months after taking office, Vladimir Putin and Vietnamese President Truong Tan Shang sign an agreement to create a joint base for the maintenance and repair of submarines in Cam Ranh.

I note that the signing of this agreement did not attract much attention. But all the fun was ahead.

In February, 2014, Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu said that Russia would expand its military presence in the world: negotiations are underway to deploy military facilities with Vietnam and Cuba, and “active work is underway in the Seychelles, in Singapore, Algeria, Cyprus in Venezuela, Nicaragua and several other countries. "

Shoigu noted that at the equator and in other regions of the world it is necessary to provide refueling of the aircraft of the Russian Long-Range Aviation.

And since the spring of 2014, the Kamrani airfield was first used for servicing the Il-78 aircraft, which provide airborne strategic missile-carrying Tu-95MS.

This is not a saying, but also not a fairy tale. Although the tale of 2014, the year was already in full swing. And, watching this fairy tale, we simply missed the moments that began to develop on the other side of the globe. In Vietnam.

In November, 2014, during the visit to Russia of the Secretary General of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Vietnam Nguyen Phu Chong, an agreement was signed on a simplified procedure for calling Russian ships in the Vietnamese port of Cam Ranh. As explained in the Russian Ministry of Defense, Russian ships and ships after serving in the oceans need only notify the port authorities to make a call to Cam Ranh. This was an important event, if only because Vietnam became the second country (after Syria) with which Russia agreed on a “consensus” procedure for the entry of ships of the Navy.

This is more serious. The president is good, but those who lived in the USSR are well aware that in a country with a socialist structure and order, the secretary general of the ruling (and only in Vietnam) party is twice as weightier.

Even then, some military experts suggested that the signing of another agreement with Vietnam, which also operates with Syria, to create a logistics center for the Russian Navy (PMTC) in Cam Ranh, or rather, its return, is not far off the mark. Yes, few people heard them, because what kind of Kamran is here when such things happen. Crimea sailed!

But gradually everything calmed down (if I may say so), the Crimea remained in the new-old historic port of registry, NATO started the next movements at our borders, and Cam Ranh again emerges. Yes, and in the comments of the Ambassador of Vietnam in Russia.

It should say a few words about the base in Cam Ranh. This is not a Syrian Hmeimim, no. It is much more powerful. If Hamim is really a PMTO, a gas station with a minimarket, so to speak, then Cam Ranh is a full-fledged deep-water port with excellent infrastructure.

In Soviet times, the sign of the PMTO hid behind itself a full-fledged naval base of the 17 th operational squadron. There were simultaneously 8-10 surface ships and up to eight submarines. Plus court security. The presence of such a number of full-fledged warships allowed the Pacific Fleet to control the south-western part of the Pacific and the entire Indian Ocean.

Is this necessary today? Perhaps the most important question.

It makes sense to just look at the world map. Cam Ranh is a crossroads on the way from the Pacific to the Indian Ocean. Indeed, from there it is easy to control the many movements of the vessels of the probable "partner." Plus, very important, to the Persian Gulf - within reach. Our yardstick. And what is the Gulf for our "partners", do not say.

Kamran (unlike Hmeimim) is very difficult to "lock the lock." This is not the Mediterranean puddle, which can really be closed by the Bosphorus and Gibraltar.

In addition, there are at least two strategic allies in the region. This is Vietnam and India. Plus China, whose status is less defined. And from the ambitions of China, almost all the smutters in the region have come lately. But since the China-DPRK bundle is on the opposite side of the USA-Japan-South Korea bundle, we can say that we can be friends against our likely adversary.

And one more argument to the question of expediency. Since it turned out that the missile defense system seems to be working against Iran near our borders in Romania, Poland and other places, Tanks in the Baltic States and Poland, these are elements of the global struggle for world peace, then in this case, our presence in other regions, not even with tanks, but with something more efficient, is justified.

No one is talking about creating such a system of bases, which the United States has. We never catch up with them, and there is no point. But the need for reference points in different parts of the world, the same tracking systems - all this is really necessary and important.

There is no doubt that in the future we will observe the same picture: the deployment of various US military facilities (NATO is no more than a screen) near our borders. So the answer should be. Indeed, this is not just another crazy arms race, but the ability to give exactly the right answer.

Or, what I like much more - the ability to quickly and inevitably deliver a preemptive strike. Of such places that the Pentagon was the most difficult to block. Get closer, let's say.

By the way, the Cubans did not pass the base to Lourdes either, if that.

In past years, many stones were scattered. Even too much. It is not necessary to list, continuous afflictions, and only. But, as it was said in a smart book, if there was a time to scatter stones, then sooner or later it would be time to collect these stones.

Apparently, this time has come in the year 2014.

Yes, in that most intelligent book there was also a continuation of the phrase. It said that there is time to hug, and there is time to shy away from hugs.

To paraphrase, I will say this: we were already embraced. Kissed. All these guys and ladies from the countries of "enlightened democracy." But for some reason, all these kisses and hugs can be called Jewish. Especially in the light of recent events around our borders.

So the time to collect the scattered stones has come. And the time has come to shy away from the embrace of "partners." No good will lead to this.

Of course, there will be opponents of our presence in Cam Ranh and other places among our fellow citizens. Without this in any way. They will start squealing about bad roads and hungry retirees. But this song is old and useless. Heard.

But if we really want to be a force to be reckoned with, we will have to understand that the stones really need to be re-assembled.

At least in order to give this stone on the head the next climber to hug with a stone in his bosom. Well, I hope everyone understood who it was about me.
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  1. dmi.pris
    dmi.pris 20 May 2016 06: 36
    +43
    I have always considered the Vietnamese, unlike the Arabs, our real allies, so to speak .. They now need money for development, we need a base. So let's cooperate ..
    1. Uncle Murzik
      Uncle Murzik 20 May 2016 06: 48
      +22
      it's just that the Vietnamese have experienced all the delights of "American democracy" for themselves!
      1. 25ru
        25ru 20 May 2016 07: 07
        +16
        Quote: Uncle Murzik
        it's just that the Vietnamese have experienced all the delights of "American democracy" for themselves!

        And from this, trade with the United States breaks all records and branches of the same TNCs there at every step.
        1. asiat_61
          asiat_61 20 May 2016 07: 31
          -4
          Do you want AvtoVAZ to be there?
          1. 25ru
            25ru 20 May 2016 07: 59
            0
            Quote: asiat_61
            Do you want AvtoVAZ to be there?

            God forbid !!! And in a nightmare. There, Japanese and UK auto companies are all represented.
            1. Uncle Murzik
              Uncle Murzik 20 May 2016 12: 03
              +2
              Well, you have already decided everything for the Vietnamese! laughing
              1. Talgat
                Talgat 20 May 2016 19: 00
                +11
                Quote from the article: "... there will be opponents of our presence in Cam Ranh and other places, from among our fellow citizens. Without this, there is no way. They will start squealing about bad roads and hungry pensioners ..."

                The liberals helped to ruin our country - with false slogans such as why spend money on weapons and on allies - let's disarm and so what? there is no USSR - and all geopolitical positions are lost - and nifig people did not begin to live better from this. On the contrary - actually fell to the bottom

                now they continue these songs - why spend on the army! Why strengthen air defense! Why do we need Syria! Why bases in Kyrgyzstan and the CSTO! Russia has only 2 ally - the army and navy are also from this series.

                In fact, strengthening the geopolitical position - helps to defend the interests of the state. And allies are also needed. If you retreat constantly, you can lose not only Eurasia, but also get to the collapse of the Russian Federation.

                The paradox - but spending on the same base - you get a better perspective for the same pensioners, etc. This is already proven by history.
                1. Vasiliy16
                  Vasiliy16 21 May 2016 15: 05
                  0
                  Quote: Talgat
                  Liberasty helped ruin our country

                  Cuba and Camran were closed under Putin.
                  So he is a liberalist?
                  1. Vasiliy16
                    Vasiliy16 21 May 2016 15: 29
                    +3
                    Quote: Vasiliy16
                    Quote: Talgat
                    Liberasty helped ruin our country

                    Cuba and Camran were closed under Putin.
                    So he is a liberalist?

                    au minusers. Who really hurts my eyes? Or did I write a lie?
                    1. anykin
                      anykin 21 May 2016 20: 42
                      +1
                      Putin closed, Putin opened. Which truth do you like more?
          2. Warbird # 4
            Warbird # 4 21 May 2016 18: 27
            +1
            laughing with all desire, AvtoVAZ is not relevant there, as the Vietnamese ride mopeds hi ... Beautiful places. Was in Nha Trang a year ago. "Gorky Park" on the shore with a Ferris wheel ...
        2. Uncle Murzik
          Uncle Murzik 20 May 2016 07: 33
          +5
          trade by trade, and tobacco apart! the United States is not even one of the five main trading partners of Vietnam! belayif that despite the sanctions of the us, we have increased trade with them!
          1. gray smeet
            gray smeet 20 May 2016 09: 56
            +15
            Quote: Uncle Murzik
            trade by trade, and tobacco apart! the United States is not even one of the five main trading partners of Vietnam! belayif that despite the sanctions of the us, we have increased trade with them!


            What kind of tobacco are we talking about?
            Data for 2014:
            The main trading partners of Vietnam remain China - 58,5 billion US dollars (+ 17%),
            ASEAN countries - 42,1 billion US dollars (+ 5%),
            European Union - 36,8 billion US dollars (+ 9%),
            US - 34,9 billion US dollars (+ 20%),
            Republic of Korea - $ 28,9 billion (+ 6%),
            Japan - 27,6 billion US dollars (+9%).
            In Russia:
            Vietnam took only 37th place in Russia's foreign trade (2013 - 33rd). According to Vietnamese statistics, Russian deliveries in Vietnam's total commodity circulation are 0,97%.
            1. Uncle Murzik
              Uncle Murzik 20 May 2016 10: 27
              +16
              so, and what place does Russia occupy in Vietnam’s foreign trade? hithe question was not about that, but about strategic partnership! Vietnam rejected the US request for the closure of the Cam Ranh base for the Russian Air Force 15.03.2015/XNUMX/XNUMX Le The Tae Mau, a spokesman for the Vietnamese Ministry of Defense in an interview with national media reported that Vietnam did not approve the US request to prevent Russian planes from admitting the former US military base Cam Ranh. “Washington’s demand is nothing more than an interference in the internal affairs of Vietnam, a sovereign state that independently determines the policy of interaction with its friends and partners,” said Le The Mau, and added that Vietnam will remain a strategic partner of Russia. !
              1. gray smeet
                gray smeet 20 May 2016 11: 27
                +6
                Quote: Uncle Murzik
                so, and what place does Russia occupy in Vietnam’s foreign trade?


                I wrote above: in 2014. - Russia is on the 37th place in the trade turnover of Vietnam (2013 -33rd place). And pay attention to the trade balance (above the plate) - Vietnam delivers twice as much to Russia than we do to Vietnam! The balance is negative for us, in favor of Vietnam. The trade figures of Russia and Vietnam themselves are scanty compared to other participants in the Vietnam market.

                Quote: Uncle Murzik
                such a tobacco!
                1. Uncle Murzik
                  Uncle Murzik 20 May 2016 11: 52
                  0
                  I am writing again for those who are faint! Despite the sanctions imposed by the United States, we also increased our trade turnover, but they didn’t become strategic partners to us, just as we were enemies and we remained like enemies in Vietnam despite trading! trade turnover low consequences of the rule of our liberals in the nineties! The largest exporters to the Vietnamese market are:

                  • China (28%)

                  • Korea (16%)

                  • Japan (9%)

                  • Taiwan (7%)

                  • Thailand (5%)

                  • Singapore (4%) and where is the United States? Vietnam in 2015 became Russia's largest trading partner among countries belonging to the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN), said Maxim Golikov, Russia's trade representative in Vietnam. "The turnover of Russian-Vietnamese trade amounted to $ 3,9 billion, showing an increase of 4%," Golikov said in an interview with TASS. In 2015, Vietnam took 28th place in the general list of international trade partners of Russia, the trade representative emphasized.

                  Content source: http://www.eastrussia.ru/news/v-2015-godu-oborot-rossiysko-vetnamskoy-torgovli-s

                  ostavil-3-9-mlrd-dollarov /
                  eastrussia.ru
                  1. gray smeet
                    gray smeet 20 May 2016 14: 18
                    +6
                    Quote: Uncle Murzik
                    I write again for the faint!

                    Trade Representative of Russia in Vietnam Maxim Golikov. "Turnover Russian-Vietnamese trade amounted to $ 3,9 billion, showing growth of 4%", - said Golikov in an interview with TASS.



                    US-Vietnam trade - 34,9 billion US dollars (for 2014 + 20%)

                    compare - 3,9 billion (2015) and 34,9 billion (2014)

                    Vietnam supplies uses the US market. The share of exports to the United States from Vietnam's total trade is 18% !!! 18% Karl! Vietnam earns on the USA, selling 18% of its output selling there !!!
                    In general, trade between the two countries from 2006 to 2014 increased bmore than three times and amounted to almost 36 billion dollars. with significant surplus in Vietnam - What can this say if not about strategic partnership? Vietnam clearly wants to participate in the TPP and is waiting for the biggest economic dividends, incomparable, for example, with the benefits of creating a free trade zone between Vietnam and the Eurasian Economic Union. This is due to the prospect of greater openness for Vietnamese goods to the markets of the USA, Japan, Canada and other developed countries - its main economic partners in the world.

                    Thus, at the negotiations on TTP, the Vietnamese side sought recognition of Vietnam as a country with a market economy, the removal of dumping restrictions, a ban on discrimination against its state-owned corporations, liberalization of standards in the field of trade in services and other significant concessions. In turn, Washington is demanding that Hanoi implement structural reforms in the public sector, improve labor laws, and intellectual property rights. The most difficult point to agree on is the determination of the origin of goods, since the export of Vietnamese textiles, for example, is 90% provided by raw materials from China. Negotiations are delayed, and their fate remains unclear, including in view of the fact that Washington puts forward a number of political conditions that Hanoi cannot go to! And here Hanoi goes to Sochi and offers an offer ... There is an ordinary bargain, dear .... Politics, and again politics .. hi
            2. Uncle Murzik
              Uncle Murzik 20 May 2016 10: 50
              +3
              They were mistakenly attacked by a unit of American troops, commanded by Lieutenant William Kelly. Having lost in the course of the "operation" only one person who accidentally fell under the fire of their own comrades, the Americans conscientiously "combed" the village, throwing grenades at bamboo huts and shooting at everything suspicious, finishing off the wounded and small children crawling around the bodies of their killed mothers. The surviving about 300 people were herded into one place and there, without any interrogation or sorting, everyone - men, old people, women with children in their arms - were shot from machine guns. Lieutenant Kelly took part in the execution directly, on his account about 100 peasants killed by him personally.

              But, as already noted, it was impossible to conceal the fact of the destruction of family members not of some Viet Cong, but of servicemen of the "democratic forces" of South Vietnam, and for this crime, unlike thousands of others like them, the Americans had to answer. That's how Lieutenant Kelly ended up in the role of the scapegoat. The "poor man" was taken to the United States, tried in an open civil court and, after 3,5 years of trial, was found guilty, as already mentioned, and convicted.

              For some time, until the noise from his case subsides and America does not "forget" an unpleasant story for her, the lieutenant will sit under house arrest, quite comfortable, after which, as if nothing had happened, he will continue to serve, having retired under R. Reagan with full honor and respect as a hero and honored veteran who served his country with dignity. "Bloody boys in the eyes" of an elderly democrat do not appear and he does not need the services of psychoanalysts. Here is such a tobacco
              1. St_tov
                St_tov 20 May 2016 20: 29
                -1
                The Shtatovites documented 22 cases of F-1 fixation in 5-7 year old girls under a dress / panties, after which they joyfully ran to the US military and pulled the rope. Communism in Vietnam was a Maoist-Kampuchean edition, with the refusal to focus on China only after the well-known events of China's attempt to put in place the presumptuous little sister. By the way, barrel artillery (100mm, and 57mm), represented mainly by the Chinese air defense regiments, shot down 2/3 of American aircraft, and the number of Chinese personnel was hundreds of times higher than the Soviet. T.ch. takes place to be t.z. that the Americans held back the Maoists in Vietnam, making life easier for Soviet border guards. After a change of leadership in the Communist Party of Vietnam (they had their own analogue of the XX Congress), a decision was made to focus not on yesterday’s social-imperialists, but on the side that was the most consistent in fighting Maoism. Which is what we observe.
                1. Uncle Murzik
                  Uncle Murzik 22 May 2016 06: 42
                  0
                  So you came to the land of Vietnam, not the Vietnamese in the United States! belay
            3. yehat
              yehat 20 May 2016 13: 39
              +2
              our domestic turnover is 2 times underestimated in us dollars
              take into account financial manipulations with the ruble and recount the turnover of the Russian Federation
              get other numbers.
        3. Pitot
          Pitot 20 May 2016 12: 11
          0
          This does not mean anything. In general, we have white-collar workers in ministries and educational institutions.
        4. Vasek Trubachev
          Vasek Trubachev 21 May 2016 09: 50
          +4
          Vietnam became a member of the TTP, a trans-Pacific partnership with the United States, which is directed against China and is trying to secure against Russian aggression by the Russian base.
      2. Slavin
        Slavin 20 May 2016 08: 29
        +12
        We gave it to ourselves and still abandoned the tracking base in Cuba, but years passed, and Moscow’s erroneous decision on Kamrani became so obvious that they even began to reanimate this idea of ​​returning there. Although, very carefully and accurately, for an open admission of the fallacy of that decision would inevitably cast a shadow on Vladimir Putin himself. Our current position on Kamrani looks like a “cocktail” of masochism, short-sighted narrow-mindedness, and regular inconsistency.
        1. Schultz
          Schultz 20 May 2016 10: 22
          +6
          The rejection of Kamrani is essentially not an erroneous, but a criminal decision, and until the upper echelons recognize this fact, it is premature to talk about the restoration of Russia's ocean presence. A holistic program is needed to return the Russian Navy to the abandoned bases of Cuba, Angola, Mozambique, Yemen, etc., with the simultaneous adoption of the shipbuilding program of the large fleet, and for this it is necessary to revive the Ministry of the Shipbuilding Industry of the Russian Federation, with the assignment of the naval department federal status service.
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. gray smeet
            gray smeet 20 May 2016 15: 05
            +3
            Quote: Schultz
            A holistic program is needed to return the Russian Navy to the abandoned bases of Cuba, Angola, Mozambique, Yemen, etc., with the simultaneous adoption of the shipbuilding program of the large fleet, and for this it is necessary to revive the Ministry of the Shipbuilding Industry of the Russian Federation, with the assignment of the naval department federal status service.

            And then Ostap suffered:
      3. razmik72
        razmik72 20 May 2016 09: 03
        +1
        For Russia, renting Kamrani is a solid plus, but I don’t understand which Vietnam will get the gesheft.
        1. lelikas
          lelikas 20 May 2016 12: 29
          +5
          Quote: razmik72
          But what kind of gesheft Vietnam will get, I did not understand.

          Money for rent, money for servicing the base itself, a small trump card in the form of our group in territorial graters.
          1. razmik72
            razmik72 20 May 2016 17: 51
            +6
            Quote: lelikas
            Quote: razmik72
            But what kind of gesheft Vietnam will get, I did not understand.

            Money for rent, money for servicing the base itself, a small trump card in the form of our group in territorial graters.

            As far as I am informed, Vietnam has risen economically healthy lately and the money for renting a base is of last interest to it. The leadership of Vietnam, if it provides its bases for rent, will primarily seek military-political support from Russia not from the United States, but from the dragon. Whether Russia is ready to support Vietnam in their graters with China is another question.
          2. goblin xnumx
            goblin xnumx 21 May 2016 18: 55
            -1
            who is the trump card from? - dedicate us:) - but what does it mean = Russia - a small trump card0 and let me ask, what is the full value trump card?
        2. gray smeet
          gray smeet 20 May 2016 15: 07
          +1
          Quote: razmik72
          For Russia, renting Kamrani is a solid plus, but I don’t understand which Vietnam will get the gesheft.

          Bargaining for himself (Vietnam) preferences in the TTP in dialogue with the United States.
          1. razmik72
            razmik72 20 May 2016 17: 59
            +1
            Quote: gray smeet
            Quote: razmik72
            For Russia, renting Kamrani is a solid plus, but I don’t understand which Vietnam will get the gesheft.

            Bargaining for himself (Vietnam) preferences in the TTP in dialogue with the United States.

            What preferences can Vietnam give the naval base of Russia in their TTP with the United States?
        3. goose
          goose 20 May 2016 15: 58
          +9
          In Soviet times, only $ 3 million was spent on maintenance of the base by local organizations and the population - cleaning, washing, cooking, food, etc.
          A significant part of the region’s population was employed to maintain the base. Even without rent, operating Kamrani is a big plus for the Vientam economy, like a train for an entire province. At the same time, the Vietnamese and the USSR shared data on hydrology, the air situation, and provided medical services, which were very lame then in Vietnam.
          The Vietnamese sincerely hoped that the Soviet contingent would stop the expansion of China, which for more than 1000 years has been viewing Vietnam as a sweet bun, but cannot be captured.
          Regarding reliability, the Vietnamese are extremely reliable partners, although they are slightly harmful. The words of one of my acquaintance colonel who went through Vietnam, all the Middle East wars and Afghanistan say about their exceptional reliability - if I had been given 3 Vietnamese divisions in the Doomsday War, Israel would not have been on the world map. One Vietnamese three Arab division was worth it.
          1. Talgat
            Talgat 20 May 2016 19: 04
            +4
            Quote: goose
            if I had been given the Vietnamese division in the war of Judgment Day 3, there would no longer have been Israel on the world map


            Definitely - the Vietnamese proved themselves as battle-worthy allies - they smashed both the French and the USA and the Chinese - after all, Vietnam is the only country where the USA was defeated

            Israel is very lucky - that there are Arabs. No Amer’s help would save the Vietnamese.
            1. razmik72
              razmik72 20 May 2016 19: 32
              +2
              Quote: Talgat
              Quote: goose
              if I had been given the Vietnamese division in the war of Judgment Day 3, there would no longer have been Israel on the world map


              Definitely - the Vietnamese proved themselves as battle-worthy allies - they smashed both the French and the USA and the Chinese - after all, Vietnam is the only country where the USA was defeated

              Israel is very lucky - that there are Arabs. No Amer’s help would save the Vietnamese.

              The Jews are smart people, they did not create their own state alongside the Vietnamese smile I wouldn’t put the fighting qualities of the Arabs so low, they didn’t deserve it. There are periods of decline with any nation, and there are phenomena in history such as the Arab Caliphate, stretching from the shores of the Atlantic Ocean to the spurs of the Himalayas.
              1. andj61
                andj61 20 May 2016 19: 37
                +4
                Quote: razmik72
                I wouldn’t put the fighting qualities of Arabs so low, they didn’t deserve it. There are periods of decline with any nation, and there are phenomena in history such as the Arab Caliphate, which stretches from the shores of the Atlantic Ocean to the spurs of the Himalayas.

                Only it was more than a thousand years ago ...
                And my teacher at the institute at the military department was honored to fight in Cuba and Vietnam at the S-75 and S-125 air defense systems, and to be an adviser in Egypt and Syria. So he did not speak of Arabs as military experts except in obscene words. But the Vietnamese and Cubans praised ...
          2. St_tov
            St_tov 20 May 2016 21: 39
            +1
            In Vietnam, the average consumption of missiles of the seventy-fifth complex was about 5 per aircraft, among the Arabs about 25, incl. take more - one Vietnamese - 5 Arab. In general, fighting in the desert and in the jungle are two big differences. And, interestingly, what is the VUS of the said colonel? And further. The French, during the war in Indochina, had about 15 battalions of mercenaries (3 divisions from another source) formed by their former fascists. The phrase is attributed to R. Solan - if I had two more SS divisions, I would outweigh the entire united front of the peoples of Indochina, incl. nothing new. The Germans, by the way, almost all died.
            1. andj61
              andj61 20 May 2016 22: 30
              0
              Quote: St_tov.
              In Vietnam, the average consumption of missiles of the seventy-fifth complex was about 5 per aircraft, among the Arabs about 25, incl. take more - one Vietnamese - 5 Arab.

              Three for a fighter (with a probability of 0,97), five for a bomber, 7 for a strategist - if at all they gave him a shot. Moreover, bombers and strategists were shot from several divisions. After shooting back, they immediately turned and the Vietnamese actually carried air defense systems in their hands to another place directly through the jungle.
              Quote: St_tov.
              And, interestingly, what is the VUS of the said colonel?

              Yes, I already don’t remember my VUS by heart, and even more so, of the teacher, who was, in my opinion, an officer of the KBU in Cuba, and commander of the S-125 air defense system in Vietnam! We were trained as officers of the KBU and KVK S-200 air defense system.
              And as for the Arabs, he said that they had at least one shot down for one downed alien plane - for various reasons. They could not master the recognition system of their friend or foe, and the gouging is terrible. In the end, in some cases, advisers simply replaced Arab calculations.
              1. Lieutenant Izhe
                Lieutenant Izhe 21 May 2016 12: 38
                0
                And they could not master the recognition system of a friend or foe

                and they installed it (in the export version of the SAM)?
      4. My doctor
        My doctor 20 May 2016 14: 08
        +4
        Quote: Uncle Murzik
        it's just that the Vietnamese have experienced all the delights of "American democracy" for themselves!

        TOTALLY FOR. That is why, in contrast to the threat to territorial integrity from China, it cannot allow US troops to enter its territory. But Vietnam needs a guarantee of protection against Chinese expansion, especially as China begins to more actively make claims to the disputed islands, and moreover, China also has claims to the land part of the joint border. So I think if the government wants the diplomats will try and the base will go without rent.
        1. razmik72
          razmik72 20 May 2016 18: 03
          0
          Quote: MyVrach
          Quote: Uncle Murzik
          it's just that the Vietnamese have experienced all the delights of "American democracy" for themselves!

          TOTALLY FOR. That is why, in contrast to the threat to territorial integrity from China, it cannot allow US troops to enter its territory. But Vietnam needs a guarantee of protection against Chinese expansion, especially as China begins to more actively make claims to the disputed islands, and moreover, China also has claims to the land part of the joint border. So I think if the government wants the diplomats will try and the base will go without rent.

          What, in Russia, are ready in the event of a confrontation between Vietnam and China to take the side of the first? Will Russia take such a step?
    2. CONTROL
      CONTROL 20 May 2016 07: 01
      0
      Quote: dmi.pris
      I have always considered the Vietnamese, unlike the Arabs, our real allies, so to speak ..

      History shows that asians always were unreliable allies - dubious at least.
      It would seem ridiculous, but - in the rarest cases, the most reliable allies of Russia were ... Germans! If they betrayed, then with a pre-prepared warning of betrayal ...
      1. dmi.pris
        dmi.pris 20 May 2016 07: 15
        -2
        Let's remember the beginning of the twentieth century - Russia and Germany were allies. But the idea of ​​pan-Slavism violated this alliance. The Russian Empire began to support Serbia in its confrontation with the patchwork empire. Is it right or wrong, well, maybe it's right, support the little brothers ..NO.K what all this led to. The Second World War, disasters, the October coup .. The country is in ruins, Europe (and FIGs with it) is also in ruins .. Well, they say, they began to be friends with those .. Although at that time Emperor Nicholas could and it seemed right.
        Quote: CONTROL
        Quote: dmi.pris
        I have always considered the Vietnamese, unlike the Arabs, our real allies, so to speak ..

        History shows that asians always were unreliable allies - dubious at least.
        It would seem ridiculous, but - in the rarest cases, the most reliable allies of Russia were ... Germans! If they betrayed, then with a pre-prepared warning of betrayal ...
        1. sa-ag
          sa-ag 20 May 2016 07: 49
          +2
          Quote: dmi.pris
          Let's remember the beginning of the twentieth century - Russia and Germany were allies.

          When was Germany an ally? Is that the only time in the Battle of the Nations
        2. AID.S
          AID.S 20 May 2016 09: 54
          +5
          Quote: dmi.pris
          The Russian Empire began to support Serbia in its confrontation with the patchwork empire.

          Do you really think that the WWII began because of a shot by Gavrila?
          1. Talgat
            Talgat 20 May 2016 19: 09
            +2
            We all understand that geopolitically Europe (Germany) and the Eurasian empires are always doomed to confrontation. And Gavril’s shot is just a trigger. It began thousands of years before Russia - even under Attila - continued under the USSR - continues now - and tomorrow's Eurasian Union will be forced to seek an alliance with China and Iran in order to survive against another European drang nakh - and will continue for another thousand years

            Europe is a genetic aggressor and colonizer. And Eurasia is always an object of aggression for it. The truth is always her everything ends unsuccessfully - too freedom-loving and warlike peoples live with us.
      2. otter.1
        otter.1 20 May 2016 08: 58
        +7
        Well, of course, the difference is huge, what is the same Vietnamese deceived us? You were there at all (in Kamrani) talking with these people, or as always.
        And at the expense of the Allies, it is already tired of it, they do not happen by definition.
        This is the case with the Germans (though I don’t know, when did they ever warn us?), But the production itself ehh: “You see, the Germans are the most awesome allies when the Germans want to attack your country to destroy 27 (or more) million people, then they will warn you in advance "
        Well, no words !!!
        You most importantly do not spare the likes.
    3. sa-ag
      sa-ag 20 May 2016 07: 51
      +1
      Quote: dmi.pris
      They now need money for development, we need a base.

      Well, what kind of development will the base give, except for hiring local staff, service charges, for the country this is nothing, for the development of the country technologies are needed
    4. The comment was deleted.
    5. siberalt
      siberalt 20 May 2016 07: 55
      +7
      With the return of the base in Cam Ranh, Russia will hardly be called a "regional state". Here is a completely different status. But neither the United States nor China needs this. The question is difficult, however. And there is also Cuba on the way. Need money. Much money.
    6. Stirbjorn
      Stirbjorn 20 May 2016 08: 48
      +6
      Quote: dmi.pris
      They now need money for development, we need a base. So let's cooperate ..

      It seems that we also need money, otherwise the Ministry of Finance did not cheat with pensions the next year. The question is why the base was closed in 2002 if it was free, all the more so given Vietnam’s huge debt to Russia (the USSR) - they could have used it for another 100 years on account of debt. And since the place is worthy, this is not Syria, in which the civil war has been raging for 5 years. In Vietnam, everything is calm, and even under the protection of its allies and partners (our weapons are actively being purchased - Su-30, Varshavyanki, Cheetahs, Lightning bolts are being built under a license, etc.)
    7. The comment was deleted.
    8. ava09
      ava09 20 May 2016 09: 24
      +2
      Quote: dmi.pris
      I have always considered the Vietnamese, unlike the Arabs, our real allies, so to speak .. They now need money for development, we need a base. So let's cooperate ..

      Judging by the replenishment of the fleet, the Vietnamese have no worse economy, and considering, as the author of the article wrote, it is still not bad with memory and social structure, better with the economy. Or a respected dmi.pris - an oligarch who, together with his "comrades", decided to stop plundering the country's resources? A striking naivete and arrogance of a "strategist" living in an economic fairy tale ...) We need a base, and not for "friendship against someone", as the author of the article put it, but for defending YOUR strategic interests in that important region. Of the clever quotes in the article, the most appropriate: (c) But, as it was said in the clever book, if there was time to scatter stones, then sooner or later it will be time to collect these stones. (C) Although at the expense of the "smart book", the author again got excited, a lot of things are written in it and not everything is suitable for Russians ...
    9. wandlitz
      wandlitz 20 May 2016 10: 18
      +4
      I have always considered the Vietnamese, unlike the Arabs, our true allies, so to speak
      In Soviet times, I talked with both. Your opinion about the Vietnamese coincides with my observations.
    10. Pitot
      Pitot 20 May 2016 12: 11
      +1
      I completely agree. The Vietnamese are a worthy people.
    11. max73
      max73 21 May 2016 12: 57
      +2
      Last winter I visited Vietnam and will try to share some observations and conclusions from communication with the local population.
      1. Since the war, by historical standards, has ended recently, the memory of it is not just alive. In short, Americans are simply not liked there.
      2. Everything is spinning, everything is being built - Vietnam is sooooo actively developing and the Vietnamese, with all this, are somewhat similar to the Spaniards ... because the concept of "siesta" is about them))
      3. The officer of the army or navy - as I understand it, for ordinary Vietnamese, the most respected and paid profession
      4. There is no such pronounced social stratification as ours
      5. There is some kind of internal national pride or character or something ... I almost did not see the beggars, unlike other countries in Southeast Asia
      6. Russia for ordinary Vietnamese - really, a friend country
      7. here people talked about the auto industry ... I saw a decent number of UAZ cars, KAMAZ cars flickered, and so Japanese and Chinese vehicles prevail on the roads
      8. I haven’t been to Kamran, but I know that tourist charters from Russia now fly to the airfield of the former base ....
      9. The everyday uniform of border guards officers smiled - I immediately remembered the Soviet army, because it seems very ...))
  2. Ivan Slavyanin
    Ivan Slavyanin 20 May 2016 06: 43
    +3
    In the history of military affairs, fortresses, walls, etc., were first built. and then only life was arranged.
    In my recent dispute with a listener to "Echo of Moscow" and "Dozhd" I was asked the question: "What did the victory of Russia in Syria personally give you?"
    1. SSR
      SSR 20 May 2016 06: 58
      +4
      Quote: Ivan Slav
      In the history of military affairs, fortresses, walls, etc., were first built. and then only life was arranged.
      In my recent dispute with a listener to "Echo of Moscow" and "Dozhd" I was asked the question: "What did the victory of Russia in Syria personally give you?"

      And there are plenty of them, the main thing for them is to get something for free. An iPhone or other device is desirable. Imha had to say to these consumers that he received orders / orders at his factory and began to receive more money and in the winter for a month he went to Thailand with his whole family on vacation and now plan to Dominican Republic, so that they would go out to bile and farts burst.
    2. Stirbjorn
      Stirbjorn 20 May 2016 10: 12
      0
      Quote: Ivan Slavyanin
      "What did Russia's victory in Syria personally give you?"

      and whom did we defeat in Syria? What goals are set there specifically?
      1. Dart2027
        Dart2027 20 May 2016 21: 23
        -1
        Quote: Stirbjorn
        and whom did we defeat in Syria?

        Creature of the USA.
        Quote: Stirbjorn
        What goals are set there specifically?

        Destroy Daesh away from its borders.
        1. Stirbjorn
          Stirbjorn 20 May 2016 22: 58
          +1
          Quote: Dart2027
          US creature

          who are they? specifically
          Quote: Dart2027
          Destroy Daesh away from its borders.
          A caliphate cannot be destroyed without a ground operation. While they are livelier than all the living, they are sitting in Raqqah and Mosul, and they are raiding Palmyra and Deir ez-zor.

          Ivan, by the way, did not answer this question.
          1. Dart2027
            Dart2027 20 May 2016 23: 18
            0
            Quote: Stirbjorn
            who are they? specifically

            DAISH.
            Quote: Stirbjorn
            A caliphate cannot be destroyed without a ground operation.

            You do not know, but the ground operation is carried out by the armed forces of Syria and Iran.
            Quote: Stirbjorn
            While they are more alive than all living things,

            Keyword so far, not without reason in the United States so rush with a truce.
          2. Dali
            Dali 21 May 2016 23: 41
            -2
            Quote: Stirbjorn
            A caliphate cannot be destroyed without a ground operation.

            Are you a provocateur ... want a full-scale deployment of Russian troops? belay
            So then it turns out you are cheers ...

            Do you want Russia to be again blamed for all sins?
            You do not believe in the talent of our military, who can set up the Syrian army as it should, both technically and morally? belay
    3. Mikado
      Mikado 20 May 2016 17: 13
      +2
      Quote: Ivan Slav
      In my recent dispute with a listener to "Echo of Moscow" and "Dozhd" I was asked the question: "What did the victory of Russia in Syria personally give you?"

      It was not even necessary to start this dispute. Your opponent is from another planet, from a parallel reality. The iPad and Ford Focus on credit are more important to him.
  3. svp67
    svp67 20 May 2016 06: 44
    +4
    On May 17, Vietnamese Ambassador to Russia Nguyen Thanh Sean made a statement saying that Vietnam is not against Russia's return to the military base in Cam Ranh, but this cooperation should not be directed against third countries.
    I think that our Foreign Ministry is simply OBLIGED to urgently make such a statement. Cam Ranh is worth it ... It won't be superfluous for us now. But everything must be done according to the "Syrian standard", that is, at the highest level and even more.
  4. inkass_98
    inkass_98 20 May 2016 06: 51
    +8
    It's time to come back. The conditions, of course, will be somewhat different, but there are also many points of mutual contact regarding beneficial cooperation. Including more active assistance to Vietnam in offshore development - there is a chance to make Vietnam an active player in the local market. And having your base at the crossroads in SEA is never harmful. You need to show your flag.
    And talking about Cuba is generally strange: the best and only argument that the current leaders of the United States understand is a fist at the very nose, ready to strike. And better than Cuba, it is difficult to find an argument that the expansion and strengthening of NATO at our borders can lead to the emergence of no less threat directly off the coast of the United States. 90 miles - just a laugh for any rocket, but how intelligible!
    1. sa-ag
      sa-ag 20 May 2016 07: 47
      +1
      Quote: inkass_98
      And better than Cuba, it is difficult to find an argument that the expansion and strengthening of NATO at our borders can lead to the emergence of no less threat directly off the US coast. 90 miles is just a laugh for any rocket, but how intelligible!

      Well, there was this "laugh" in the early 60s, how did it end?
      1. SSR
        SSR 20 May 2016 07: 51
        +4
        Quote: sa-ag
        Quote: inkass_98
        And better than Cuba, it is difficult to find an argument that the expansion and strengthening of NATO at our borders can lead to the emergence of no less threat directly off the US coast. 90 miles is just a laugh for any rocket, but how intelligible!

        Well, there was this "laugh" in the early 60s, how did it end?

        Plusanul, but I would like to remind you that after the "Cuban missile crisis", the US did remove missiles from Europe and Turkey, and now they are again deploying missiles under the guise of missile defense.
        1. sa-ag
          sa-ag 20 May 2016 08: 07
          0
          Quote: SSR
          Plusanul, but I would like to remind you that after the "Cuban missile crisis", the US did remove missiles from Europe and Turkey, and now they are again deploying missiles under the guise of missile defense.

          Yeah, and then Pershing in Germany was, in one place it decreased, in another it increased
    2. St_tov
      St_tov 20 May 2016 22: 20
      0
      I visit Cuba almost every year, since 1975. Cuba returns to the fold of the "true" church. Fidels will leave, the next day after the mourning, there will be nowhere to push through from the staff. Las Vegas will wither in a block. In short, the Cubans will no longer go for any adventures, and all that the Russian Federation can offer them - the Americans will give five times. Remember the expectation of 1980 - i.e. communism? now about the same expectation in Cuba.
  5. surrozh
    surrozh 20 May 2016 06: 54
    +2
    I would like, of course, a squadron, but ... For starters, you can deploy tracking systems, missile defense, submarines. There is little sense from China, apparently, it's time to get back to square one. And there and "Cuba is far, Cuba is near" - there was such a song.
  6. Nicola Bari
    Nicola Bari 20 May 2016 06: 55
    +1
    Wow. It’s a pity that it’s too late, and the possible value of this acquisition is not clear right now, and not only in the long run - before the PRC was not so strong, incl. and at sea, the same applies to the rest of most countries, therefore it is doubtful that projecting force will be as effective as in Soviet times.
  7. CONTROL
    CONTROL 20 May 2016 06: 57
    0
    The direction of restoring Russia's defense capability - after its enchanting destruction and the liberal-state-democratic-... and te teh - attacks on the army began in the last year or two of the reign of the drunken liberal Yeltsin. I was forced to live as a hotz! ... in conditions of increasing pressure from the West "on all fronts"!
    ... Isn't this one of the main reasons - the real threat of the dismemberment and destruction of Russia - Yeltsin's "voluntary resignation" from his post and the transfer of powers to Putin?
    ... Kamran in the same row?
  8. Alexander 3
    Alexander 3 20 May 2016 07: 01
    +1
    Russia just needs to be proactive, because just recently we were called a regional power. They have not watched us so closely. Now, our eyes are wide.
  9. 25ru
    25ru 20 May 2016 07: 03
    +3
    The base, no words, is excellent. Itself was not, by service life, but still b / w photos from different family photo albums seen enough. Yes, deeply personal - my wife was born in Kamrani. Well, the next ship, going to Vladivostok, did not have time. So in the birth certificate and says: SRV, Kamran smile
    Let's go there again - only "FOR". Logistic "shoulder" to Vladivostok - 1-2 days on the large landing ship. Wouldn't miss the puncture of the previous agreement. In short: "free of charge" and "for the period of stay". Now the cunning (indeed so) Vietnamese can demand an annual rent, whatever they want. And what? Americans pay some humorous sum for Guantanamo.
  10. Kudrevkn
    Kudrevkn 20 May 2016 07: 21
    +5
    I have been twice - since, in 1988 along the course of the BS "there" and "back"! The sea is clean, nature is paradise! But what about the "excellent base" or the ideal base? Alas! The main pier was built by the Yankees for an aircraft carrier - high sides, so they stood on the inner roadstead, which means that all communication through the longboat and boats. the town itself is very well-groomed and even athletic, but wretchedly ascetic. In addition to sandy beaches and coconut trees, there is simply no other infrastructure! As our chansonnier sings: "What is this service if there are no women ?! a joke of course, but apart from half-naked Vietnamese and their dwarf pigs, there is nothing in this God-forsaken paradise! South Vietnam is not a developed North, the wilderness is terrible! But swim in the purest the sea, diving for corals and sunbathing on the gorgeous sand - this is YES! But I would like to remind you of the death of our pilots and the pleas and complaints of the PM-15 commander: “The sailors are degrading here after six months of stay (and they stood there for 14 months?), some go crazy, 3 gallows! So, brothers - "Vietnamese"?
    1. Dimon19661
      Dimon19661 20 May 2016 10: 19
      +1
      In 1985 he was there. Impressions of heat, poverty of the Vietnamese, and again the heat ....
    2. Avior
      Avior 12 February 2020 00: 12
      +1
      The situation has changed. now it is a tourism center
  11. Stinger
    Stinger 20 May 2016 07: 24
    +3
    Mr. Yeltsin and his ilk brought the country and the army to the handle, and therefore left Vietnam and Cuba. It's time to come back, gradually. And the exceptional ones are completely insolent. In Cuba, it would be good to place an early warning system for early warning, and then missile defense, similar to the American missile defense system in Europe. Naturally directed not against the United States. And just in case.
    1. sa-ag
      sa-ag 20 May 2016 07: 43
      +3
      Quote: Stinger
      In Cuba, it would be good to place an early warning system for early warning and then missile defense, similar to the American missile defense system in Europe.

      And then on the radio to announce and the desire to start negotiations on the relaxation of tension in the region, well, it was already, it was surprising to want to jump on an old rake
    2. ism_ek
      ism_ek 20 May 2016 09: 09
      -5
      Quote: Stinger
      Mr. Yeltsin and his ilk brought the country and the army to the handle, and therefore left Vietnam and Cuba.

      The country was driven to the point by the desire to deploy military bases around the world. What interests did the USSR have in the South China Sea? The money that the USSR spent on the 17th operational squadron could be built annually on a new AvtoVAZ
      1. Victor Demchenko
        Victor Demchenko 20 May 2016 14: 48
        +1
        it is possible, but whether it is necessary, it is not clear. so that your groans about "hungry pensioners" and other things that smell very strongly of guano!
      2. Dart2027
        Dart2027 20 May 2016 21: 25
        0
        Quote: ism_ek
        The country has been brought "to the handle" by desire

        some "comrades" to grab more for which they destroyed the USSR under hypocritical groans about the poor people.
    3. goose
      goose 20 May 2016 16: 09
      0
      Quote: Stinger
      Naturally directed not against the United States. And just in case.

      Right, against the Jamaican pirates.
  12. 25ru
    25ru 20 May 2016 07: 25
    +2
    I stuck you "+". The mother-in-law did not tell. I judge about the base from the point of view. infrastructure and geography.
    1. Kudrevkn
      Kudrevkn 20 May 2016 07: 44
      +1
      Alaverdy! I, too, expressed only my personal opinion, so to speak, "personal attitude"! I wish you success and good luck in your business!
  13. ism_ek
    ism_ek 20 May 2016 07: 29
    +5
    The 17th operational squadron of the USSR Navy in the South China Sea included more than 100 ships. Now we do not have so much throughout the Russian fleet. There are no Russian ships in this area. We have not built ocean surface ships since the time of Peter the Great. We do not need this base.
    1. 25ru
      25ru 20 May 2016 07: 43
      +2
      Quote: ism_ek
      The 17th operational squadron of the USSR Navy in the South China Sea included more than 100 ships.

      Smaller, but not the point.
      Quote: ism_ek
      There are no Russian ships in this area.

      But why. Go past all sorts of festive and significant events. For the resource of units with this Gulf of Aden and joint cheeks - killed for hell. I, here recently, watched the entry / exit of ships and boats based on Vladivostok - this is tough.
      Quote: ism_ek
      since the time of Peter the Great we have not built ocean water ships.

      Well, it’s you who got excited smile
      Quote: ism_ek
      We do not need this base.

      Remind me what the RIF ships were doing in the Pacific theater of operations since 1860? And what was the key word in their search? A link to the classic: "Around the world on the corvette" Korshun ".
  14. sa-ag
    sa-ag 20 May 2016 07: 41
    +1
    "... But since the China-DPRK link is on the opposite side of the US-Japan-South Korea link, we can say that we can be friends against our potential enemy."

    And China is also friends against Vietnam and the reason is still the same - the islands around which there are disputes, and Vietnam signed the Trans-Pacific Partnership, so "not everything is so simple" (C)
    1. Blondy
      Blondy 20 May 2016 08: 24
      +2
      Quote: sa-ag
      "... But since the China-DPRK link is on the opposite side of the US-Japan-South Korea link, we can say that we can be friends against our potential enemy."

      And China is also friends against Vietnam and the reason is still the same - the islands around which there are disputes, and Vietnam signed the Trans-Pacific Partnership, so "not everything is so simple" (

      Finally, sa-ag turned to history with geography. Indeed, the Chinese and the Vietnamese have a centuries-old "friendship", and of course the Paracel Islands. And the base in Kamran, in this context, is viewed by Vietnam as at least some kind of counterbalance to Chinese expansion in the region, which does not even contradict Russian interests in the APR, despite the fact that China, of course, will not like it very much.
      1. sa-ag
        sa-ag 20 May 2016 20: 52
        0
        Quote: Blondy
        . And the base in Kamran, in this context, is considered by Vietnam

        Here !!! Vietnam against China, in Syria also used for internal showdowns, where is the profit? It seems that the article was about oil and gas projects, isn’t it an interesting coincidence - oil and gas projects and the intention to revive Kamran ?:-)
  15. VasiliyKhilkov
    VasiliyKhilkov 20 May 2016 08: 10
    +1
    To be friends against our probable adversary is good. And to look after a Chinese friend is also not bad.
  16. Foresterer
    Foresterer 20 May 2016 08: 15
    0
    This time I agree with the author on everything. We need to have several strong points of law and order in different parts of the globe. Bullies will be more modest. They only understand the whistle and the baton.
  17. Zomanus
    Zomanus 20 May 2016 09: 01
    +1
    The base is good.
    But ... do we have anything to base there?
    As an option, I can assume electronic warfare, observation and target designation,
    airfield jump. And of course, commercial and industrial relations.
    1. 25ru
      25ru 20 May 2016 16: 36
      0
      Quote: Zomanus
      As an option, I can assume electronic warfare, observation and target designation,
      airfield jump.

      And so it was. Well, PMTO. Repair by "PM" forces. How well they patched up - it's not for me to judge, but in fact they reached Vladivostok and Peter-K.
  18. kos2910
    kos2910 20 May 2016 09: 58
    +1
    Well said - time to collect stones. Hope this is so ...
    1. sub307
      sub307 20 May 2016 10: 15
      +1
      And - to "collect" not in order to subsequently "scatter" again ...
    2. The comment was deleted.
  19. akudr48
    akudr48 20 May 2016 10: 14
    +4
    A muddy explanation of why Russia abandoned Camran and Lourdes and who made this decision. Not Ivanov. And not Petrov and Sidorov. After all, then at post No. 1 there was already one whose cunning plans are still in execution. Although, maybe he didn’t know, he was not up to date, this happens to the presidents, you know.

    Like, they flew off because the bases are not used. What, the Russian fleet is tired of going out to sea and using its key naval base somehow sounds dubious ...

    And why wasn’t Lourdes, the Russian intelligence center under the window of the main sworn partner, used to listen to the adversary tired or the prevailing opinion was that there were no more enemies, and it was not good to listen to friends, especially when they regularly shipped their hard-earned billion dollars?

    Or the partner said without hints that they would be cleaned and in 2001 we obediently tightened our tail and agreed with his opinion in the order of getting up from our knees. And it could be.

    It is possible that this aforementioned partner did not express any opinion at all, and the Russian leaders trained to anticipate his wishes, and did it, as it were, from "our table to their table," they made a favor, but what, you can't trample on friendship and threw stones, who did not collect ...

    But now it is quite clear that everything will be grown-up, our intelligence has increased significantly, we see the prospects clearly, and we will begin to "really reassemble the stones." So that later there was something to scatter.

    But again, that we are rushing here and there, because people in Hanoi and Havana are not without eyes, they notice what is happening. And draw conclusions. Unlike us.
    1. sub307
      sub307 20 May 2016 10: 21
      +2
      I agree ... - really "strange" somehow it all looks with active "scattering" and the subsequent desire to "collect" the scattered. Let's see what in the end all this will "pour out" ..., so in 2-3 years.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Cat man null
      Cat man null 20 May 2016 10: 31
      -1
      Quote: akudr48
      But now it is quite clear that everything will be grown-up, our intelligence has increased significantly, we see the prospects clearly, and we will begin to "really reassemble the stones." So that later there was something to scatter

      I carefully read the article, saw the following:

      - Vietnam said it "does not mind"
      - something has been signed that allows the ships of the Russian Federation to enter Cam Ranh "in a notification order"
      - Some experts suggested that the conclusion of something more serious is not far off (a la MTO clause)

      And all belay

      As far as I understand, the leadership of the Russian Federation has not yet made any decision on this matter (and if it did, it forgot to notify us).

      Question: what kind of "stones to scatter" did you just talk about? Nobody has collected them yet.
    4. Dart2027
      Dart2027 20 May 2016 21: 30
      +1
      Quote: akudr48
      A muddy explanation of why Russia abandoned Camran and Lourdes and who made this decision.

      Just at that moment the question was whether Russia itself would remain. I think just received an offer that could not be refused.
    5. Allax
      Allax 20 May 2016 23: 00
      -1
      Then the alignment was different. Our Putin then knew how to cooperate well with Amerov’s Bush. We had no day to find anti-American patriots with fire, and it seemed that there would never be a confrontation with the United States. Therefore, clear anti-American bases were removed as unnecessary.
  20. rus-b4
    rus-b4 20 May 2016 10: 22
    0
    The time has come not to respond to the situations that have arisen, but to create them ourselves so that the "partners" react to them, and preferably make more mistakes
  21. creak
    creak 20 May 2016 10: 25
    +2
    The author calls the airfield of the Russian air group in Syria Khmeimim - PMTO and compares it with Kamran.
    There is a certain mixture of concepts.
    The Russian 720 PMTO Navy in Syria has existed since the days of the USSR and is located in a completely different place, namely in the port of Tartus.
  22. sub307
    sub307 20 May 2016 10: 33
    +3
    In the meantime, something like this: "
    The opening ceremony of the port at the Vietnamese naval base of Camran in the South China Sea took place on March 8, 2016, reports NHK. The President of Vietnam, Cheong Tan Sang, emphasized that the port will play a very important role in ensuring the country's defense capabilities and ensuring peace and stability in the region.
    Details of the new facility are not disclosed. According to sources, the port has two berths, which can aircraft carriers and submarines.
    There is also information that in the future, warehouses and a repair base will be built in the port.
    Currently, Cam Ranh Bay is not the most important base of the Vietnamese Navy. But it is located close to the disputed islands in the South China Sea. "Http://palavan.ru/vietnam/politika/vetnam-otkryil-krupnyij-port-na-vo
    enno-morskoj-baze-kamran-v-yuzhno-kitajskom-more.html
  23. realist
    realist 20 May 2016 10: 39
    +1
    there is an opportunity to have a base - you need to use it! the place is good, it’s near to develop a resort area, and it’s going to be excellent, and sailors will be able to go out to their relatives and tourists near their own, under protection .... everything is certainly not easy, but you need to work in all possible directions
  24. Petrik66
    Petrik66 20 May 2016 10: 57
    +1
    if Vietnam lets us go, then how to balance our Chinese brothers. There is a Russian base there and it’s more difficult to show off to the Chinese.
  25. Tektor
    Tektor 20 May 2016 10: 58
    +1
    KMK, without a base on Kamran, sorry - PMTO, there is no need to talk about the tactical stability of the base in the Seychelles. And the base in the Seychelles is of great strategic importance, because allows you to control our important and wayward "partners". It turns out a strategic arc: Syria, Seychelles, Cam Ranh, which covers the entire heartland. ... Only Ceylon is missing, sorry.
    1. 25ru
      25ru 20 May 2016 12: 25
      +4
      Quote: Tektor
      KMK, without a base on Kamran, sorry - PMTO, there is no need to talk about the tactical stability of the base in the Seychelles. And the base in the Seychelles is of great strategic importance, because allows you to control our important and wayward "partners". It turns out a strategic arc: Syria, Seychelles, Cam Ranh, which covers the entire heartland. ... Only Ceylon is missing, sorry.

      Hmmm ... The heading "Russian combat fiction", of course, has the right to life.
  26. avg-mgn
    avg-mgn 20 May 2016 11: 29
    +1
    Quote: inkass_98
    better than Cuba, it is difficult to find an argument that the expansion and strengthening of NATO at our borders can lead to the emergence of no less threat directly off the coast of the USA. 90 miles - just a laugh for any rocket, but how intelligible!

    The states are more likely to drown Cuba (figuratively and literally) than let anyone enter there. Or do you think that the recent demarche with the lifting of sanctions from Cuba is from the kindness of Abama? They read your idea of ​​an unborn one and calculated this option.
    1. 25ru
      25ru 20 May 2016 12: 30
      +3
      Quote: avg-mgn
      States are more likely to drown Cuba (figuratively and literally)

      In direct, not really straining. It so happened - they need this entertaining brothelier ... and, farts, from the remnants of the formidable Russian Navy - it's ridiculous.
  27. v.yegorov
    v.yegorov 20 May 2016 11: 56
    +3
    They will start screaming about bad roads and hungry pensioners. But this song is old and worthless. Heard.

    Actually, to be a hungry pensioner is not good, since the pensioner himself.
    But if you choose between hungry and dead, I will choose the first, if only in favor
    it went, to the country, and not to the pocket of scummy little people.
  28. kav669
    kav669 20 May 2016 12: 34
    0
    I think that pensioners will not remain hungry (the pensioner himself). And we need a base in Vietnam. Balance the forces of China.
  29. lukke
    lukke 20 May 2016 13: 28
    +2
    Vietnam's policy is not to join military alliances or to ally with one state against another.
    phrase for diplomats, but taking into account the current moment and so it will come down)
    I would be more confident in the purity of relations if Vietnam didn’t take money from us to rent the base (if there is a base and without a lease, there will be many sources of income for the country). But we are brothers like a big schucher from the USA or with China, and as it’s all calm, it’s business and nothing personal.
  30. Chak
    Chak 20 May 2016 13: 35
    0
    "Or, what I like a lot more - the ability to quickly and inevitably deliver a preemptive strike. From places that the Pentagon would have as difficult as possible to block it. Closer, so to speak."
  31. 1536
    1536 20 May 2016 15: 32
    0
    Vietnam, as far as I know, entered the Pacific Trade Union that the Americans created. Everything that Americans do is directed against Russia and, in essence, is criminal in nature.
    Therefore, if the Vietnamese, still fearing the United States, but put in a hopeless situation, invites us again to Kamran, then this invitation must be answered for any money! So we can somehow restore our positions in Vietnam and control the Americans, and, possibly, prevent the execution of their criminal plans.
  32. Galleon
    Galleon 20 May 2016 15: 36
    +7
    There are too many questions for the author.
    I agree that Cam Ranh can control the Singapore Strait, but "a stone's throw to the Persian Gulf"? Nifiga yourself you have handles! We now control the Persian Gulf from the Caspian Sea.
    Infrastructure? Of the entire infrastructure, only a parade ground for combat training! Own water, own electricity.
    To lock the bay with mines, like any other bay - you can "just once" - in this the author's reasoning is just as wrong.
    The creation of a technical base for the submarine is connected with the decision of Vietnam to have its own submarine fleet, which did not exist before (9 submarines of the "Varshavyanka" type, if I am not mistaken). Naturally, this business requires maintenance and a search and rescue service.
    Under the USSR, there was rampant theft at the base in Cam Ranh! Theft and "kinam" is the Vietnamese word for a sale and purchase transaction. Kinamili everything and everything! My own steamer, for example, twice could not weaken anchor due to the theft of silver contacts in the starters of the anchor-chain bow spikes. There is nowhere else to go! This is the factor in my memories that causes fear and caution - not to repeat the situation.
    But if you ask me, then I - FOR! The sea is wonderful, in the summer only in the bay the water is too warm, you have to go to the sea. You can walk to the French battery for barbecue - an interesting local attraction. I used to think that only we write any crap on the walls or on fences. And there, walk through the casemates: John, Oklahoma - 1969, etc. - early 70s Vietnamese inscriptions, then ours .. - sorry, I didn’t think of taking pictures then. And when there are places where to go in and look at another life, it is more interesting to serve and memory remains.
    I am for our Kamran - to be!
    1. Vivan
      Vivan 20 May 2016 16: 14
      +2
      1) The Vietnamese Navy has not 9, but only 6 Varshavyanka submarines (and 28 Su-30MKV + 8 Su-27 + 50 Su-22 + 154 MiG-21s);
      2) “Kiniem” = “for memory”;
      3) If I were the Secretary General of the CPV, I would give the Kamran base to the Russian Federation with the only condition - to divert the force vector of the Navy of China from Vietnam (all the better, against the Americans)!
      1. 25ru
        25ru 20 May 2016 17: 06
        0
        Quote: Vivan
        The Vietnamese Navy has not 9, but only 6 Varshavyanka submarines (and 28 Su-30MKV + 8 Su-27 + 50 Su-22 + 154 MiG-21s);
        2) “Kiniem” = “for memory”;
        3) If I were the Secretary General of the CPV, I would give the Kamran base to the Russian Federation with the only condition - to divert the force vector of the Chinese Navy from Vietnam. So they gave it. In togument (anywhere, against the Americans - all the better!).

        Strategist, mana, in Asia Pacific, mana? Man, in a constantly changing balance of strategic forces in the region ....
    2. 25ru
      25ru 20 May 2016 16: 52
      0
      And I am in favor of "NO" until there is a variant that excludes double interpretation of the terms
  33. cap
    cap 20 May 2016 16: 55
    0
    At least in order to give this stone on the head the next climber to hug with a stone in his bosom. Well, I hope everyone understood who it was about me.
    Author Roman Skomorokhov.


    Understood not stupid.
  34. ioann1
    ioann1 20 May 2016 17: 27
    0


    Five friends of Putin will drive the United States to the grave
  35. 25ru
    25ru 20 May 2016 17: 27
    0
    Quote: cap
    At least in order to give this stone on the head the next climber to cuddle with a stone in his bosom. Well, I hope everyone understood who I mean.
    Author Roman Skomorokhov.


    Understood not stupid.

  36. V.ic
    V.ic 20 May 2016 17: 55
    +2
    Of course, there will be opponents of our presence in Kamrani and other places, from among ... Author Roman Skomorokhov

    Banshee, we don’t mind / as our citizens /, but where are you / more precisely, where will you find BILLION China, which has its own opinion about the presence of the pale shadow of the USSR in South Indochina?
    1. PENZA
      PENZA 21 May 2016 00: 59
      0
      yes how come dear
  37. Thomas 1989
    Thomas 1989 20 May 2016 18: 03
    +2
    in general, discussions about the Armed Forces are extremely limited, a separate hello to the mayor and the military prosecutor, but we will talk about the army of a non-existent state and the period of 20 years ago. A question for the admins - where do you get such "experts"? such excellent specialists in geography? I hope you didn't pay them much? ((Cam Ranh (unlike Khmeimim) is very difficult to "lock up." This is not a Mediterranean puddle that can really be closed by the Bosphorus and Gibraltar.)))) Hihaha !!!!!! I hope this was written not out of feeble mind, but from provocative considerations.? Refer to Google, find at least one strait with neutral waters through which you can get to the SKM. Found it? That's right, it's one-strait or Bashi's passage! Look down ... oh, the Philippines with an American military base, a little higher to the right is a base in Japan and Taiwan. If you only knew what a difficult task it is to overtake a plane to Cam Ranh, how people spent six months on vacation without being able to return to service. Regarding the attitude of the Vietnamese towards us, the last years before the closure of the base, it has radically changed, not only did they rob us as best they could, they also fired in our direction. In general, we do not need bases abroad, we have enough of our own, go to serve in the army , be fruitful and multiply, it will be a real thank you grandfather for the victory
    1. Dart2027
      Dart2027 20 May 2016 21: 35
      0
      Quote: Thomas 1989
      In general, we do not need bases abroad, we have enough of our own

      Favorite song of all kinds of "fighters for something there" when they were breaking up the USSR.
      1. Thomas 1989
        Thomas 1989 20 May 2016 21: 44
        0
        go serve then write
        1. Dart2027
          Dart2027 20 May 2016 23: 16
          +1
          Quote: Thomas 1989
          go serve then write

          2 years, back in the 90s. I understand that in essence there are no objections?
  38. Balagan
    Balagan 20 May 2016 18: 06
    +1
    When in 1984 a cousin demobilized and talked about Kamrani - for me, as a teenager, the stories sounded almost like fairy tales. Abroad in hot places.
    When he first flew to Nha Trang, there was a feeling of returning to familiar places.
  39. Volga Cossack
    Volga Cossack 20 May 2016 19: 11
    0
    time to come back ........ and come back!
  40. St_tov
    St_tov 20 May 2016 22: 01
    0
    The naive question - when would Russia feel more secure in the Far East theater of operations - now, even with Camrano or if Seoul had won, with all the consequences? That's it ...
  41. cdznjckfd
    cdznjckfd 21 May 2016 01: 48
    0
    Kamran should be considered primarily as a commercial project - a logistics center and a tourist complex, replacing Thailand, and then you can think about the military component, it will be easier to justify your presence, protect investments)))) nothing personal.
  42. user3970
    user3970 21 May 2016 08: 12
    +1
    I’ll bring in my five cents ... With regards to Cuba ... The only time the SSA wrote boiling water was when Khrushchev put rockets there. The liquidation of the darkest base there is the largest strategic military mistake. And while both Castro are alive, they must legally and forever gain a foothold in Cuba, like the Americans in Guantanamo. So that on the territory of the base nothing changes even with the change of regime. With regards to Vietnam and specifically Kamrani ... In connection with the loss of resorts in Turkey and Egypt, who and what prevents to do this in Kamrani? To think over transport logistics, to secure financial contents and logistics for Finnish friend of the darkest Timchenko with his personal capital, to pull Potanin there. We had the Chukchi governor Roma Abramovich. The edge only benefited. Well, but seriously? For a long time there has been one trade and production office in those places called SovVietPetro ... So, according to rumors, there was more turnover from it at other times than from Gazprom. So, God ordered us to develop an oil industry with deep processing of products there.
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 21 May 2016 08: 48
      -2
      Quote: user3970
      user3970

      According to your picture.
      Afghanistan is an eternal debt, they could give it only to heroin.
      Iraq, these could give over time.
      Mongolia is an eternal duty. You could take sheep’s wool, but why do we need so much wool?
      North Korea - no comment at all. This debt is more than eternity.
      Syria, everyone on the site screamed that Syria needed help, but Putin took and forgave Syrian debt tyrant.
      Vietnam has nothing to say. This is purely politics.
      Ethiopia is where in general?
      Libya, where is Libya now, and where is 4.5 billion?
      Algeria-USSR was generous, occupied hell knows who, hell knows why.
      Nicaragua-repost-USSR was generous, occupied hell knows who, hell knows why.
      Angola, hmm, it turns out there is such a country.
      Cuba-read North Korea-debt is longer than eternity. The second coming will be faster than Cuba will return at least a billion.
      1. Vasiliy16
        Vasiliy16 21 May 2016 17: 36
        +1
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        Cuba-read North Korea-debt is longer than eternity. The second coming will be faster than Cuba will return at least a billion

        so the base in Cuba was closed, citing that there was no way to pay 150 million dollars a year.
        A few years later, Putin forgave Cuba for a debt.
        Amount of debt - 20 years of rental.
        What is it - if not a betrayal.
  43. user3970
    user3970 21 May 2016 09: 51
    +2
    Alexander Romanov. Proverb: "Duty is not abuse, it does not hang on the gate" (correct, but leave the meaning.) More than once I was convinced that you do not really know the history of the country. So: the darkest year ago paid the French a debt on shares of the CER in 1914, somewhere around 800 million dollars. More than 100 years of debt, the CER does not exist as such! And what about the territories of the SGA, allegedly bought from the aborigines? And the dark story of the sale of Alaska and California? And the city of Jerusalem, allegedly sold by Khrushchev to Israel for a steamer of oranges? Debts, dear, start working when there are problems with the debtor.
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 21 May 2016 10: 06
      +1
      Quote: user3970
      . So: the darkest year ago paid the French debt on the shares of the CER in 1914 somewhere around 800 million dollars. More than 100 years of duty

      We were not forgiven, we paid.
      And who is this darkest one?
      Quote: user3970
      Debts, dear, begin to work when problems arise with the debtor.

      And they won’t send a fig, how did it get with Ukraine?
  44. user3970
    user3970 21 May 2016 10: 57
    0
    Well, Alexander, the example with Ukraine is a land. Back to our debts ... Afghanistan - rare earths and polymetals and it seems uranium, Angola - diamonds, Iraq - oil, the Anglo-Saxons are mining it now. Mongolia is a separate song! For your education, you are aware that the Soviet Army fought with the Germans in Mongolian sheepskin coats, and received no less meat from it than stews under Lend-Lease. And the meat, "thanks" to the GDP, is there now or are we eating g..vno? Mongolia alone can feed most of Russia with natural meat. And so for all debtor countries.
  45. irbis0373
    irbis0373 21 May 2016 11: 09
    0
    Good news. Such news is always a pleasure to read.
  46. aba
    aba 21 May 2016 12: 22
    0
    You read the article and you realize that first you had to destroy everything, so that later you could begin to restore it and present it as a great achievement. This is the result of the liberal 90s, with its slogan, "What we can't build, we'll buy."
  47. Lexa-149
    Lexa-149 21 May 2016 16: 06
    0
    We’ll return to Cuba a little bit! We’ll restore our radar there, put rockets there and tell our sworn star-striped friends that these are the most peaceful missiles that are aimed at the mythical aggressor!
    1. Vasiliy16
      Vasiliy16 21 May 2016 17: 38
      +1
      Quote: Lexa-149
      We’ll return to Cuba a little bit! We’ll restore our radar there, put rockets there and tell our sworn star-striped friends that these are the most peaceful missiles that are aimed at the mythical aggressor!

      So big, but believe in fairy tales! laughing
  48. certero
    certero 21 May 2016 22: 11
    +1
    Quote: Talgat
    and nifiga people didn’t live better from this. On the contrary - actually fell to the bottom

    Tryndet is not necessary. It was during this crisis that machines and televisions were bought up, not buckwheat and salt, as in 90.
    Of course, living standards have grown, the availability of food, communications, and the like has grown. Another thing is that this turned out to be weakly connected with the production of military equipment.
  49. Scharnhorst
    Scharnhorst 22 May 2016 22: 10
    +1
    We talk a lot about the newly formed multipolar world. The South China Sea and Vietnam are included in the zone of interests of Beijing. If we get into Cam Ranh with great-power ambitions, China will adequately and easily aggravate the situation in Central Asia. Russia must focus! Russia will not be able to handle an impressive contingent of forces on this base. And it's far from the nearest state with the capital in Honolulu. And to keep a couple of stationers there, like "Varyag" with "Korean", and a motley squadron is senseless and criminal. Do we have nowhere else to find a base from Vladivostok to Magadan? We'll find it! And on vacation, the military are happy to fly to Cam Ranh with their families on charters.
    Now Crimea with Russia, and first of all it is necessary in Sevastopol to bring the base to mind. And in politics one should not allow the tail (Vietnam) to wag the dog (Russia.
  50. solovald
    solovald 23 May 2016 05: 14
    0
    Cam Ranh is good, but where does "... about bad roads and hungry pensioners ... this is an old and useless song ..."? Old, because these issues should have been resolved long ago and radically, and not powdered with external advantages. Roads, by definition, should be normal, and pensioners should be well fed.
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