Hollande throws words to the wind

Hollande throws words to the wind



French President Francois Hollande for the first time during his leadership of the republic visited the city of shipbuilders Saint-Nazaire, located in the Loire-Atlantique department in the west of the country, at the confluence of the largest French Loire river into the Bay of Biscay. During the Second World War, concrete bunkers were built by the Germans in this city to keep German submarines hidden in them. These bunkers are preserved to this day and are of great interest to tourists.

But Hollande arrived in Saint-Nazaire not for tourist purposes. He was faced with a simple and at the same time difficult task - to relieve social tensions among local shipbuilders, which arose because the French president forbade the delivery of two ships-docks to Russia, built by her order at the local shipyards of DCNS / STX. or, as they are also called, Mistral class helicopter carriers called Vladivostok and Sevastopol. The ships, ready for 90%, only without weapons, which they had to mount on Kronstadt, stood aimlessly at the berths of the plant for several months, taking places that could be put on by other vessels under construction. And, besides, almost a thousand shipbuilders were left out of work; they brought the company monthly losses of 5 million euros due to the need to supply electricity, heat, high and low pressure air to the helicopter carriers, and to organize their protection.

And the French president had to delicately settle the conflict he created himself.

MYSTERAL SURPLYAS


We will tell you that few people know. The initiator and mediator in the conclusion of the Russian-French Mistral contract was today's runaway banker, whose issuance to domestic justice is required by the Investigative Committee of Russia, and in the tenths of this century, the senator from Tuva and the main owner of one of the largest domestic shipbuilding enterprises, Baltic Shipyard Sergey Pugachev. It was he who, as knowledgeable people say, suggested the presidents of France and Russia conclude an agreement on the purchase of two Mistral helicopter carrier dock ships, which in theory were supposed to significantly enhance the power of the Russian Navy fleet. This proposal was justified by the weighty fact that Nicolas Sarkozy was then preparing for the second presidential election and the support of the Dockers of Saint-Nazaire, where these ships were built and which did not have good orders, was extremely important to him. And having made such an order, not only could Russia unobtrusively support Sarkozy’s candidacy, but also note his significant contribution to the resolution of the Russian-Georgian conflict that arose on August 8, 2008 after the Georgian army attacked Russian peacekeepers deployed in South Ossetia.

In addition, it was believed that as a plus from this deal, Russian sailors would receive helicopter carriers, which the Russian Navy never had. They will be able to transport 450 manpower, 16 helicopters and 30 combat vehicles, or twice as many cars. Ships can be used both for amphibious operations and for controlling interspecific fleet groups, as well as, if necessary, as a floating hospital. And most importantly - Russia will receive the technology of building warships with a displacement of more than thousands of tons in 20, which are collected in just 36 months. And as a bonus, the command and control system adopted in NATO countries.

If we consider that in our shipyards such ships were built for five to six years, the argument, of course, was very weighty. And the "appendage" in the form of "NATO command and control systems" was generally perceived by some commanders as a cherry on a wedding cake. None of the serious people have even begun to doubt, the NATO members will share this system with their “probable opponents” or not. Those who timidly expressed such thoughts were quickly pushed aside: the times have changed, we are now partners with Brussels, in spite of everything. The system will be with us, not going anywhere. And when some admirals paid attention to the frank minuses of ship docks (weak weapons - two launchers of short-range anti-aircraft missiles, two 30-mm cannons and four 12,7-mm machine guns, which is obviously not enough for such a huge helicopter carrier, but also the inactivity of Mistral "For sailing in the northern areas compared to the Mediterranean, especially in winter, when the bay ice shackles), they were told: we will put our armament on it, we will strengthen the hull with additional protection, we will place our drums on the decks years ... And so on and so forth.

It was important that the Kremlin made a political decision to buy four ships from France. Not two, as usual in domestic media, but four. Two at once, and two more later, by option. The then Minister of Defense, Anatoly Serdyukov, who is often and erroneously called the initiator of a contract with Paris on the Mistrals, frowned with displeasure when journalists asked him about this deal. “There is money in the budget only for two ships,” he said, “we will order the other two or not, it will be visible after the trial operation of the first hulls”.

And Sergei Pugachev received an order for the Baltiysky Zavod for the construction of two Mistral fodder units and, according to "evil tongues", a French passport, which allows him to hide in France from being issued to Russian law enforcement agencies as a bonus for the signed contract. But we are not talking about that now.

Further история with the Mistrals, the surprise with them at the French shipyard is well known. The shipbuilders of Saint-Nazaire fulfilled their obligations. Both helicopter carriers, known as Sevastopol and Vladivostok, were, as expected, built during 36 contract months, and the flight hangars were rebuilt for the Russian Ka-52K attack helicopter, specially upgraded for these ships. On the dock deck, platforms for domestic anti-aircraft, anti-ship and anti-submarine weapons were equipped, which the French did not have either in the project or in reality, it was planned to install it in Kronstadt after the transfer of ships.

But the French election was not won by Sarkozy, but by Francois Hollande. He did not have any obligations to Russia, especially when the ships were almost ready, they began to put heavy pressure on him from Washington and the NATO headquarters in Brussels, demanded that Moscow not to give the helicopter carriers, since she could use them in “aggression against Ukraine” . Soft-tempered Hollande, either in Sarkozy's peak, or, indeed, under pressure from the Allies in the North Atlantic Alliance, refused to give the paid ships to their rightful owner. The Kremlin's gift to the Elysée Palace went sideways, and the Mistrals hung at the berths of St. Nazaire.

PROMISE - DOESN'T MEAN TO MARRY


But back to the stay of the President of France at the shipbuilding company DCNS / STX. Hollande boarded one of the Mistrals, praised the work done by his fellow citizens, and then spoke to the shipbuilders. “I want to report to you,” he addressed to them, “all the problems on Mistral were successfully resolved during the negotiations with Russia. And I think that in the future we will have a partnership with Russia on new ships. ”

“France wanted to sell the Mistral ships to a country that would use them in the best possible way. We did not want to sell them to a country that is at war. France wanted them to be owned by a country that intended only to ensure their own security. It is for this reason that the notorious decision on Mistral was made with respect to Russia. And the Russian side agreed with the need to terminate the contract. Everything went well with Russia, ”said Hollande, who was quoted by Tass. In addition, the French leader called the idea that Mistral ships, not delivered to Russia, "will be flooded in the open sea" ridiculous earlier by the Western media, ridiculous.

“These are high-tech ships, and such actions in relation to them would be unacceptable,” said the president. He expressed satisfaction that the helicopter carriers were sold to Egypt for the same price that was originally set for them. ” “STX shipyards will not lose a centime at this operation,” said Hollande. Then he, as they say, bent again.

The first time when he promised the shipsmen of Saint-Nazaire that Russia would order them new ships, which in the next 10 – 15 years, of course, will not happen under any weather conditions. This, by the way, was stated by one of the high-ranking Russian military leaders to the author of these lines. Having learned from the bitter experience of the “French non-commitment” and the inability of the leadership of the Fifth Republic to fulfill its contractual obligations, Moscow is unlikely to associate itself with commercial agreements in the field of military-technical cooperation with an unpredictable and un-independent Paris. This, in common terminology, is a medical fact and not to understand it, to deceive oneself and one’s fellow citizens is not the best feature that characterizes a policy of such a level as the President of France.

The second time he was very deceitful when he said that Saint-Nazaire shipyards did not lose on refusal to supply Russian helicopter carriers and resell them to Egypt or centime. A simple comparison of numbers convinces any unbiased observer that this, to put it mildly, is far from being so, if not to say tougher. We have already mentioned the downtime of these ships at the pier: “Vladivostok” supported the wall there for a whole year, “Sevastopol” - half a year. Multiply 5 million euros by 18 months and you will receive an expense in 90 million "EUREKA", which Paris did not compensate for STX. We now turn to the value of the contract.

COUNTING AND TRACKING



Ultimately, two landing craft, adapted to the harsh conditions of the north, will go to serve in Africa. Reuters Photos

The agreement to supply the Russian Navy with two Mistral-class docking ships cost 1,12 billion euros. Russia paid an advance for them in 875 million. Another 50 million euros spent on the construction of two feed compartments in its own shipyards in St. Petersburg, some amount for their transportation at the mouth of the Loire, to the STX plant. Built for these ships mooring wall in Vladivostok and Novorossiysk. Spent the necessary funds on a business trip to France to retrain 400 crew members for two helicopter carriers. In total, it cost the domestic treasury about 950 million euros, which France paid us in full.

Francois Hollande should be grateful to Russian President Vladimir Putin, who did not give a joke and did not recommend Rosoboronexport to sue the French partners to the International Court of Justice demanding to compensate not only for the financial costs of our country, which did not receive the ships promised to it, but also the penalty for delay in implementation, but then for breaking the contract. He would have exceeded twice the cost of the Mistral. But in the Kremlin, apparently, they decided not to waste time, not to waste time on legal proceedings, and to act according to the popular principle - “with a black sheep, even if it’s a shred of wool”. 950 million euros will not be superfluous for us. They can be spent on more important goals than the French helicopter carriers, which our Navy were, as we know, what is called, neither to the village nor to the city.

If we consider that in June 2011 of the year, when DCNS / STX and Rosoboronexport signed contracts for the supply of two ships-docks of Russia, the euro cost about 40 – 41 ruble, today its price fluctuations are somewhere around the 70 mark of rub. So consider who won and who lost because of the rupture of the Russian-French contract on the Mistrals.

Helicopter riders to fight Pirats


And now for the Egyptian purchase. French and Egyptian media recounted in detail that the signing ceremony took place in the presidential palace Al Ittihadia during the official visit to Cairo of French Prime Minister Manuel Wals. TASS sources said that the two ships would be transferred to Egypt in the winter after they dismantled Russian equipment. Control systems for ship power plants, communications, control weaponswhich is not on helicopter carriers (we'll talk about them a bit later), navigation complexes and much more, which meets Russian standards and is written with Cyrillic inscriptions.

It was reported that the Egyptian side at a meeting with the Waltz was attended by President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi, Prime Minister Sheriff Ismail, Foreign Minister Sameh Shukri and Defense Minister Sidqi Subhi. The deal was washed with champagne, and its value was, according to the French and Egyptian press, 950 million euros. Exactly as much as Paris paid Moscow for the failed contract.

Why the Egyptians "Mistral", where they are going to land the landing, we will not guess. In the end, the country has a president, defense minister, chief of the general staff, they will find out how and where to apply these ships. One should not forget that the state of Somalia is located to the south of the pyramid country, beyond the Suez Canal and the Red Sea, and some of its citizens who are engaged in robbery in the Horn of Africa and the Bab el Mandeb Strait are called Somali pirates. It is possible that the helicopter carriers will be useful to Cairo to fight them and to support their allies in Yemen. But these are only author guesses, which may not be in the national interests of Egypt.

But the fact that Cairo will definitely need to bring this arrangement of purchased French ships to the mind or, in other words, to high combat readiness. That is, to install on it the necessary weapons - anti-aircraft, anti-ship and anti-submarine. Moreover, the platforms for it on the decks of helicopter carriers have already been prepared. And most importantly, ships will need helicopters. It is possible that the ones under which the Mistral hangars were rebuilt. These are Russian attack helicopters Ka-52K, armed with unguided missiles, guided by supersonic anti-ship missiles, 30-mm cannons and other equipment.

Whether Cairo will buy all this from Moscow is a question. There is hope for this, at least in recent years, Egypt has concluded contracts with Russia in the sphere of military-technical cooperation on 5 – 7 billion dollars. It is possible that it will also need our ship-based helicopters. About this, by the way, says the general director of "Rostec", which includes Rosoboronexport, Sergey Chemezov. And he, it is necessary to understand, has information of state importance.

Russia earns on resale France "Mistral" to Egypt or not - a question that does not really bother us. There is a feeling that will work. But the fact that Moscow will never order more warships to Paris is a fact beyond doubt. Whatever and whoever promised Francois Hollande, no matter how thrown the words to the wind. Reputation is a serious thing. Once deceived no one will ever believe. And it's not just that. Our country will no longer depend on the whims and dishonesty of certain high-ranking politicians and statesmen. I think the Mistral lesson has not passed for us and will not be in vain.

Thanks to Hollande, now import substitution is not in words, but in fact is and will be our long-term and real state program.
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  1. Armored optimist 25 October 2015 07: 07 New
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    Henpecked!
    1. ZU-23 25 October 2015 08: 06 New
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      An unrealistically vile creature, you don’t even need to search for jambs on him, because he is the most huge jamb of France.
      1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 08: 55 New
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        Quote: ZU-23
        An unrealistically vile creature, you don’t even need to search for jambs on him, because he is the most huge jamb of France.


        So it’s like that, only with the help of such articles, it’s not Hollande who’s throwing mud in the mud, but trying to clean their feathers of dirt. for the stupid, bordering on betrayal and huge embezzlement of state. budget deal with Mistrals
        it’s not in vain to us unreasonable that the author chews in detail the prehistory of this “deal of the century”
        1. Penetrator 25 October 2015 09: 05 New
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          Quote: afdjhbn67
          trying to clean their feathers of dirt. for the stupid, bordering on betrayal and huge embezzlement of state. budget deal

          And what is wrong? That this transaction was our veiled gratitude to Sarkozy for his help in resolving the Russian-Georgian conflict? Or was the Mistral price overpriced? Or ships of this class are not needed by our Navy? ("Like" does not mean that they are completely similar) Or did the French not give us the latest technologies for building large-capacity vessels? What do you see as treason and embezzlement?
          1. Tatyana 25 October 2015 09: 26 New
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            About Hollande
            Memory 23 (1)
            An unrealistically vile creature ... he is France's largest jamb.
            Really! In vain on Hollande ABORTION was not! wassat
            1. Alexander Romanov 25 October 2015 09: 40 New
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              Quote: Tatiana
              In vain on Hollande ABORTION was not!

              You are mistaken Tanya, the abortion was just there, the brain was removed at the stage of formation.
              And judging by the fact that more than half of France voted for Hollande, brain removal is a mass phenomenon.
              1. kush62 25 October 2015 13: 31 New
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                Alexander Romanov (3) Today, 09: 40 ↑ New

                And judging by the fact that more than half of France voted for Hollande, brain removal is a mass phenomenon.

                Often they vote not for anyone, but against whom.
                In our time in Krasnoyarsk Lebed won because many were against the governor Zubov. In France, after the bombing of Libya, many opposed Sarkozy with posters of Sarkozy = fascism. So they chose this mumble.
                1. The comment was deleted.
                2. Tatyana 25 October 2015 15: 17 New
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                  Alexander Romanov (3)
                  Quote: Tatiana
                  In vain on Hollande ABORTION was not!

                  You are mistaken Tanya, the abortion was just there, the brain was removed at the stage of formation.

                  And you have to ?! What a bastard! fool wassat Still survived! crying
          2. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 09: 56 New
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            Quote: Penetrator
            Sarkozy for help in resolving the Russian-Georgian conflict

            What is his help ?? persuaded Tbilisi not to take? specify what he did for us ?? I remember that he flew out with bulging eyes .. to save Saakashvili from captivity .. As for the need for Mistral, opinions also diverge diametrically .. how much we got building technologies - check out.
            What to do with what was being prepared and built under the Mistral?
            1. Penetrator 25 October 2015 10: 13 New
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              Yes, he did nothing. Just would get sanctions back in 2008. About the technology and the need for "Mistral" - I will not explain, look for yourself, if interested. I can only say that the projects of such ships are now being intensively developed by our shipbuilders (about the UVDK project “Surf, have you heard?) And, even, they are planned to be laid next year. Probably, the Fleet is of great uselessness. smile Here, in this case, it’s useful "what was being prepared and built under the Mistral"
              1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 11: 01 New
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                Quote: Penetrator
                Just would get sanctions back in 2008.

                Do you have information or read it from Wang .. laughing
                I can only say that the projects of such ships are now being intensively developed by our shipbuilders (about the UVDK project “Surf, have you heard?) And, even, they are planned to be laid next year.

                You see, they themselves ... strange arguments you have the right word .. wassat
                Here, in this case, it’s useful "what was being prepared and built under the Mistral"

                Perhaps God forbid ..
                1. Penetrator 25 October 2015 11: 14 New
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                  Quote: afdjhbn67
                  You see, they themselves ... strange arguments you have the right word ..

                  I don’t understand, what’s strange here? This is a necessary measure due to the non-delivery of ordered ships. Therefore, they force the pace. I don’t know what will happen if the Ivan Gren BDK, which is three times smaller, was built for more than ten years. God forbid, to quickly, but, in any case, it will come out at least a year and a half (in such a time the French did to us).
                  Do you have information or read it from Wang ..

                  Yeah, Wang’s spirit whispered. Your right is to believe or not.
                  1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 12: 57 New
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                    Quote: Penetrator
                    Yeah, Wang’s spirit whispered. Your right is to believe or not.

                    So sanctions are kind of like an impetus to our development declare ... maybe in seven years we’d have more time?
                    God forbid, to quickly, but, in any case, it will come out at least a year and a half (in such a time the French did to us).

                    Have you already planned a war in this period? do not share with anyone? laughing
                    1. Penetrator 25 October 2015 13: 30 New
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                      Quote: afdjhbn67
                      Have you already planned a war in this period? do not share with anyone?

                      Count it, they plan everything for us. That's when the Americans of the European missile defense by the end of 2018 are fully deployed, then you laugh. Joker.
                      So sanctions are kind of like an impetus to our development declare ... maybe in seven years we’d have more time?

                      A “push” at your home - here’s him and rinse your brain. But I don’t see any improvements from the “import substitution” - only convulsive jerking, the second year already.
                      1. afdjhbn67 26 October 2015 02: 07 New
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                        Quote: Penetrator
                        A “push” at your home - here’s him and rinse your brain.

                        motherwort drink at night ..
              2. kepmor 25 October 2015 12: 00 New
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                Penetrator, you heard the ringing, but don’t know where it is! Our design bureaus began to develop the UVDK project in a hurry when they realized that we won’t see Mistral as our ears! Like, we can all go to figs ourselves! It was necessary to maintain the reputation of GDP at 86%. Again, dozens of lards will go nowhere — what will our fleet do with these air traffic controllers? What amphibious operations and which regions of the world of the Russian Federation with its purely defensive strategy was going to carry out? Marine amphibious operations - the purest water offensive view of the database!
                In our country, the Northern Fleet and Pacific Fleet remained virtually without ships of the near and far sea zones! How to ensure combat stability of the fleet’s strike forces (SSBN) during deployment? Do you offer "tankers"?
                instead of these “irons” it’s better to put into operation two frigates or 2-3 corvettes — there will be more benefits!
                1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 12: 59 New
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                  Quote: kepmor
                  Penetrator, you heard the ringing, but don’t know where it is!

                  He just honestly fulfills the number, do not bother him .. it is necessary for someone to have a positive field for ... to create and maintain.
                  1. Penetrator 25 October 2015 13: 21 New
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                    Quote: afdjhbn67
                    He just honestly fulfills the number do not bother him.

                    Am I a clown, do you work out the numbers? Or is an opinion different from yours already "custom"? Che Guevara room, damn it ..
                    1. afdjhbn67 26 October 2015 02: 03 New
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                      Quote: Penetrator
                      Che Guevara room, damn it ..


                      "Jupiter, angry - that means you're wrong" ..
                      I didn’t write in Latin, so that Google would not strain in vain wassat
                  2. kepmor 25 October 2015 13: 33 New
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                    I apologize! I somehow did not think about the "positive" ...
                2. Penetrator 25 October 2015 13: 00 New
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                  Quote: kepmor
                  Penetrator, you heard the ringing, but don’t know where it is! How to ensure combat stability of the fleet’s strike forces (SSBN) during deployment? Do you offer "tankers"?

                  And these are not questions to me, but to the Defense Ministry and General Staff of the Navy. They issue technical tasks and plan the application. Maybe they want to seize Hokkaido or Greenland, how do I know?
          3. Sea Wolf 25 October 2015 10: 52 New
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            What technologies are you talking about? Give an example. Our welded technologies for nuclear-powered hulls, ships, etc. are much higher. What we are talking about?
            1. Penetrator 25 October 2015 17: 32 New
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              Quote: Sea Wolf
              Our welded technologies for nuclear-powered hulls, ships, etc. are much higher.

              An order of magnitude ?! That is, 10 times? Are you sure? laughing
        2. Alekseev 25 October 2015 09: 06 New
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          Quote: afdjhbn67
          not Hollande wallow in the mud, but try to clean their feathers from the mud. for the stupid, bordering on betrayal and huge embezzlement of state. budget deal

          That's right!
          Although, such deals are always politicized.
          Take Norway’s purchase of an American F-35 for an astronomical amount.
          "There are persistent rumors" that Egypt is buying the "Misral" with the help of money from the Saudis.
          For his expensive, including in maintenance, ships, he would hardly have acquired.
          Even "for the fight against Somali pirates" laughing.
          And the Saudis on this matter have made everybody themselves know who.
          1. unsinkable 25 October 2015 13: 58 New
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            Quote: Alekseev
            Although, such deals are always politicized.

            It’s a very accurate conclusion, in my opinion. All questions immediately disappear. Without this, there’s no way in world politics. I ask your disagreeing colleagues to respect different opinions. Moreover, both opinions are quite logical.
          2. nikpwolf 27 October 2015 18: 49 New
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            Quote: Alekseev
            Quote: afdjhbn67
            not Hollande wallow in the mud, but try to clean their feathers from the mud. for the stupid, bordering on betrayal and huge embezzlement of state. budget deal

            That's right!
            Although, such deals are always politicized.
            Take Norway’s purchase of an American F-35 for an astronomical amount.
            "There are persistent rumors" that Egypt is buying the "Misral" with the help of money from the Saudis.
            For his expensive, including in maintenance, ships, he would hardly have acquired.
            Even "for the fight against Somali pirates" laughing.
            And the Saudis on this matter have made everybody themselves know who.

            No, well, here the economy also rules. We have it for sure. Personal interest. The deal is completely muddy. Like rollback. The key word is not some kind of defense or technology, but a rollback. Personal interests coincided with political ones and - you have steamboats on your country. Ceased to coincide - on ships a mighty Egypt. And the pharaohs will take part in this in Yemen. Although so what the hell is it? And about the "never let’s buy no more ..." you wait a moment. Kalash - junk, T-90 - sucks, IL and Tu - not aviation. Did not hear? You guys will easily surprise you. And not only in France. The main thing is to coincide. Not with defense and technology of course.
        3. The comment was deleted.
        4. Vladimir 1964 25 October 2015 10: 07 New
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          Quote: afdjhbn67
          So it’s like that, only with the help of such articles, it’s not Hollande who’s throwing mud in the mud, but trying to clean their feathers of dirt. for the stupid, bordering on betrayal and huge embezzlement of state. budget deal with Mistrals
          it’s not in vain to us unreasonable that the author chews in detail the prehistory of this “deal of the century”


          Nikolai, who was especially touched by what was written about Serdyukov, I almost did not let a tear in the morning, it turns out that it "fought for Russia's interests." yes
          Something like this, I agree with you, Dear colleague. hi
        5. kepmor 25 October 2015 11: 38 New
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          Absolutely right! Pugachev at one time was very friendly with the GDP, so his initiative on the “Mistrals” was “easy”. Our KING especially does not save "pennies of the sovereign", distributes them with lards to dubious projects, especially to his friends. Until now, anger is biting our teeth, what the hell did we need the Olympics, the Universiade and the mundale for, when the whole economy is in the anus? Is sport the top priority for the development of the country?
          1. kush62 25 October 2015 13: 38 New
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            kepmor (2) Today, 11:38 ↑ New

            Absolutely right! Pugachev at one time was very friendly with the GDP, so his initiative on the “Mistrals” was “easy”. Our KING especially does not save "pennies of the sovereign", distributes them with lards to dubious projects, especially to his friends. Until now, anger is biting our teeth, what the hell did we need the Olympics, the Universiade and the mundale for, when the whole economy is in the anus? Is sport the top priority for the development of the country?

            Sport is also a big policy. And it’s not strange, at any time people go in for sports. Olympics 80 also cost us a pretty penny (USSR).
            Sochi is now a huge number of people going and not only the Russians. This is the prestige of the country.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Bayonet 25 October 2015 16: 21 New
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        Quote: ZU-23
        Unreal vile creature

        Why are you doing this like that? The man helped to save and return the money spent by us on the purchase of ships, "which are not needed for hell" to our country! Where is the logic? smile
        Or maybe grenades of the wrong system? smile
  2. venaya 25 October 2015 07: 10 New
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    to act according to the popular principle - “with a black sheep, even a tuft of wool”. ...
    Thanks to Hollande, now import substitution is not in words, but in fact is and will be our long-term and real state program.

    Agree with them, as with a fake coin. No sense, only stink more than a mile away. They themselves are to blame to the fullest, and at the same time naturally out of habit, they will blame all the blame for their own sins on the injured party. Such a culture, there's nothing to be done.
    1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 08: 56 New
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      Quote: venaya
      They themselves are to blame to the fullest, and at the same time naturally out of habit, they will blame all the blame for their own sins on the injured party. Such a culture, there's nothing to be done.


      Are you talking about Kremlin celestials ?? laughing
      1. venaya 25 October 2015 09: 20 New
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        Quote: afdjhbn67
        Are you talking about Kremlin celestials ??

        In Russian culture there is an established concept: "The contract is more expensive than money".
        If the Kremlin does not use this basic position, then yes too. As for internal issues, you’re probably right somewhere, but when it comes to international obligations, I don’t remember deviating from this rule, more often the western side suffers from unprincipledness, it’s been noted.
  3. A1L9E4K9S 25 October 2015 07: 17 New
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    But the fact that Moscow will not order Paris any more warships is a fact

    And in my opinion, fools in Russia transferred to the time of the nineties, when all of Russia was kneeling before the West by the ruling elite, headed by the EBN, or not?
    1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 08: 20 New
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      Quote: A1L9E4K9S
      And in my opinion fools in Russia transferred to the time of the nineties

      I laugh from you wassat fools and roads this is our eternal everything ..
    2. veksha50 25 October 2015 10: 38 New
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      Quote: A1L9E4K9S
      А In my opinion, fools in Russia were transferred in the nineties, when all of Russia was kneeling before the West by the ruling elite, led by the EBN,or not?



      Let me ask, who do you mean ???

      If you mean duraks, actually pests - then they were at the top, there are, and, unfortunately, will be ... So no one is guaranteed from any idiotic moves in relations with France ...


      Look, now Merkel openly told Poroshenko that he should begin to build normal, friendly trade and economic relations with Russia ... Yes, and German business itself stands for normal relations with Russia ...

      So what ??? Due to political motives, we will again begin to "make friends" with Germany, as well as with France ... Well, again, until some first troubles with their African-American master ...
    3. unsinkable 25 October 2015 14: 06 New
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      Quote: A1L9E4K9S
      fools in Russia are extinct

      Fools in Russia will never be transferred. This is an axiom confirmed by the history of the Russian state, under whose control it was not. I agree with the rest. hi
  4. yuriy55 25 October 2015 07: 19 New
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    Oland - not a “handshake” president, is throwing not only words, but also money ... Maybe he is trying to look formidable and decisive, like Napoleon? lol
    1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 08: 57 New
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      Quote: yuriy55
      Öland - not a “handshake” president

      By whom ? You? wassat
  5. Vanya2013F 25 October 2015 07: 20 New
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    This Guardian holds us for suckers. He hopes we will order more. And HE CAN BE SMOKED!
    1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 08: 59 New
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      Quote: Vanya2013F
      HE CAN BE SMOKED!


      Judging by the comment, it’s more likely you .. Vanya
  6. Foresterer 25 October 2015 07: 25 New
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    One must be able to do this, for the entire term of the government nothing can be done. On retirement, the Mistals will definitely stick to his surname. Many politicians and retired are respected and in demand, but this certainly does not threaten this. When that word France aroused interest, respect, now it’s bewildering. Mistrals, Arabs, Charlie, frogs, Hollande - this is now France. Ugh!
    1. veksha50 25 October 2015 10: 40 New
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      Quote: Foresterer
      Mistrals, Arabs, Charlie, frogs, Hollande - this is now France. Ugh!



      Poor frogs in what were guilty that got to your list something ???

      The list of all rubbish made harmless and useful amphibian ... laughing
    2. nikpwolf 27 October 2015 18: 26 New
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      Quote: Foresterer
      Mistrals, Arabs, Charlie, frogs, Hollande - this is now France. Ugh!

      Ped ... pid ... Tolerasts and it1 & it2 forgot to put in the first place. Somehow it is so ...
  7. vobels 25 October 2015 07: 56 New
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    "..I think the Mistral lesson has not passed for us and will not be in vain ..." May God grant that once again I would teach and not be in vain. But this French chatterbox will answer to his people himself.
    1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 08: 30 New
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      Quote: vobels
      But this French chatterbox will answer to his people himself.


      And before us, who will answer?

      And Sergey Pugachev, as a bonus for the contract, received an order for Baltiysky Zavod for the construction of two feed units for Mistral

      Francois Hollande should be grateful to Russian President Vladimir Putin, who did not trifle and did not recommend Rosoboronexport to file with the International Court of Justice the French partners demanding to compensate not only the financial costs of our country, which did not receive the promised ships, but also a penalty for delayed execution, and then for breaking the contract. He would have exceeded the double cost of the Mistral.
      1. veksha50 25 October 2015 10: 51 New
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        Quote: afdjhbn67
        He would have exceeded the double cost of the Mistral.


        "...And before us, who will answer?"...

        And before us (the people), no one, in the entire history of the development of Russia-Russia-USSR-Russia, has ever answered ...

        A competent move would be even a protracted, but the trial and the knocking out of the "Eureka" from France to the maximum ... It would also be a kind of revenge personally to Hollande, with whom then no decent Frenchman would sit down on one hectare ...
        1. kush62 25 October 2015 13: 45 New
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          veksha50 (1) Today, 10: 51 ↑ New
          Quote: afdjhbn67
          He would have exceeded the double cost of the Mistral.

          "... And before us who will answer?" ...

          And before us (the people), no one, in the entire history of the development of Russia-Russia-USSR-Russia, has ever answered ...

          A competent move would be a protracted, but the trial and knocking out the "Eureka" from France to the maximum ... It would also be a kind of revenge personally to Hollande, with whom then no decent Frenchman would sit down on one hectare ..

          Why did you decide that this is a competent move? We need money now, and we would receive it (maybe a little more), but in a few years.
    2. Bayonet 25 October 2015 16: 47 New
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      Quote: vobels
      "..I think the Mistral lesson has not passed for us and will not be in vain ..."
  8. eugraphus 25 October 2015 08: 06 New
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    The Mistral situation was resolved positively for Russia as a whole. The option that they would not be given to us was obvious. The question was whether the money would be returned and how much. With a presentation on Yukos, they are also likely to be ruined. Still from Ukraine to repay debts? Make your bets, gentlemen!
    1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 08: 33 New
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      Quote: eugraphus
      Make your bets, gentlemen!

      And no matter how - an hour per teaspoon at best, so that we would not think badly ... but not about Ukraine, but about the Greatest ... then it will quietly dissolve in the billions already buried on an empty one ..
    2. CAMS 25 October 2015 09: 25 New
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      Russia began the deportation of Georgians in 2006, after the arrest of four Russian officers by Georgian law enforcement officers on charges of espionage. Georgia filed an interstate lawsuit with the ECHR on March 26, 2007. On July 3, 2014, the court ruled that Russia violated a number of articles of the European Convention against Georgian citizens, including Art. 3 - prohibition of torture, art. 5 - the right to liberty and security of person, art. 8 - the right to respect for private and family life, art. 13 - the right to an effective remedy, and Art. 14 - prohibition of discrimination.

      Accordingly, the ECHR in 2014 ordered the Russian Federation to pay material compensation to Georgia, however, the parties themselves should have agreed on the amount within 12 months through direct negotiations. A year later, on July 3, the Ministry of Justice of Georgia stated that since the Russian Ministry of Justice did not cooperate with the Georgian side on this issue, “based on the case-law of the Strasbourg court in similar cases,” Tbilisi determined the amount of compensation in the amount of 70 million euros and sent his proposal to the Strasbourg Court.

      Since the creation of the ECHR in 1959, a total of 16 interstate lawsuits have been submitted to the court. Until 2014, decisions were made in just three: Ireland v. Great Britain (in 1978), Denmark v. Turkey (in 2000) and Cyprus v. Turkey (in 2001).

      Tbilisi reaction

      Official Tbilisi believes that despite dissatisfaction, Russia will ultimately have to pay compensation to Georgia. As the Deputy Minister of Justice of Georgia Alexander Baramidze stated in his commentary to the media, Moscow should have submitted its thoughts to the ECHR on October 9 regarding the amount of compensation named by Tbilisi, and, in all likelihood, Baramidze believes that Moscow did not. In turn, the chairman of the parliamentary committee on human rights, Eka Beselia, told reporters that the decisions of the ECHR are “not subject to revision” and that, despite Russia's unwillingness, it will still have to comply with the order of the ECHR.
      1. CAMS 25 October 2015 12: 09 New
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        Official Tbilisi believes that despite dissatisfaction, Russia will ultimately have to pay compensation to Georgia. As the Deputy Minister of Justice of Georgia Alexander Baramidze stated in his commentary to the media, Moscow should have submitted its thoughts to the ECHR on October 9 regarding the amount of compensation named by Tbilisi, and, in all likelihood, Baramidze believes that Moscow did not. In turn, the chairman of the parliamentary committee on human rights, Eka Beselia, told reporters that the decisions of the ECHR are “not subject to revision” and that, despite Russia's unwillingness, it will still have to comply with the order of the ECHR.
        this is the voice of america. , you only happen to be talking about Russian sites. Look at the enemy in the face, laying down patriots
    3. veksha50 25 October 2015 10: 54 New
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      Quote: eugraphus
      Still from Ukraine to repay debts?


      Hmm ... why and with whom ???

      Industry is looted or sold out, partly the land is also ... We still don’t know about all kinds of covert games and frauds ...

      Ukraine is a black hole both for the USA and the EU, and for Russia ... True, for Russia it is also a powder keg ...
  9. taseka 25 October 2015 08: 16 New
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    “Francois Hollande should be grateful to Russian President Vladimir Putin, who did not trifle and did not recommend Rosoboronexport to file with the French partners to the International Court of Justice with a request to compensate not only the financial costs of our country, which did not receive the promised ships, but also a penalty for delayed execution, and then for breaking the contract. He would have exceeded the double cost of the Mistral. "- good uncle damn it! And if 950 orphanages and homes for veterans in Russia would receive 1 million Euros - it would probably have completely corrupted them !!!
    1. Penetrator 25 October 2015 08: 58 New
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      Quote: taseka
      good uncle damn it!

      They would be tortured to judge. And then the “Western partners” would also link the receipt of money with the Yukos affair, for example. So everything is correct: "give - take"
      1. veksha50 25 October 2015 10: 58 New
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        Quote: Penetrator
        And then the “Western partners” would also link the receipt of money with the Yukos affair,



        Here, in fact, there is only one good reason justifying Russia's unwillingness to sue on this issue ... I somehow did not think in my top comment ... But the truth, they could, in court, bind everything, and Russia as a result could get NOTHING ...
      2. taseka 28 October 2015 19: 49 New
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        For the first time, maybe they would be tortured! They would be tormented on the second, but on 3 they would be fucked to the fullest !!! Experience must be obtained because the price of the issue is not a ruble!
  10. BOB044 25 October 2015 08: 16 New
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    His face is written in capital letters pi ..... His people for the sake of another country. He drove into the ass. President of the country damn.
    1. afdjhbn67 25 October 2015 09: 01 New
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      Quote: BOB044
      His people for the sake of another country. In the ass drove. President of the country damn.

      Are you talking about what president you are writing now ??? am
  11. Million 25 October 2015 08: 43 New
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    Yes, you shouldn’t have any hopes for such presidents.
  12. Vega 25 October 2015 08: 57 New
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    And the guys from across the ocean won and not a lot of Russia, the yuss guys planted a pig from both Russia and France. And for one and the whole world he laughed at the French, but how pleased Frau Merkel and Poroshenko with K.
  13. grinyow.ivan 25 October 2015 09: 10 New
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    I don’t know how it would end if France didn’t refuse supplies, but the enemy’s anti-advertising is always beneficial
  14. bashmak 25 October 2015 09: 11 New
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    Thanks to the author, dedicated to the helicopter carriers. Excellent article.
  15. X Y Z 25 October 2015 09: 27 New
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    And I do not consider the current situation satisfactory for us. We have lost the most precious thing - time. We needed these ships yesterday and the discussion of their complete uselessness is just a good mine in a bad game. Yes, in such a configuration, maybe they didn’t completely satisfy us, but there is no doubt that we need them at all. And something like this we can now get no earlier than 2020, and even then in doubt. It's a shame.
  16. Frigate 25 October 2015 09: 27 New
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    Francois Hollande should be grateful to Russian President Vladimir Putin, who did not trifle and did not recommend Rosoboronexport to file a lawsuit against French partners with the International Court of Justice with a demand to compensate not only the financial costs of our country
    Why would Oland be grateful? The Jewish person will appreciate this as a weakness. If you concede yours, then you are a sucker and you can be fucked again by changing the scheme of divorce. We can say that the Jews once again divorced us.
  17. Rigla 25 October 2015 09: 47 New
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    But I do not agree that "with a black sheep at least a shred", it was NECESSARY to go to court with the French and to recover from them to the maximum. Let it be in a few years, but we would have gotten it, because in a year or two the country will need money, and not just now! Yes, and during the trial, forfeit, fines, fines would run up ... This is not a state approach, but weakness.
    1. Kuzyakin15 25 October 2015 17: 49 New
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      Quote: Rigla
      But I do not agree that "with a black sheep at least a shred", it was NECESSARY to go to court with the French and to recover from them to the maximum. Let it be in a few years, but we would have gotten it, because in a year or two the country will need money, and not just now! Yes, and during the trial, forfeit, fines, fines would run up ... This is not a state approach, but weakness.

      100% ++
      And as you know, you will show weakness in a couple of cases, any lousiest little dog will bark and lift his leg.
      What is observed
  18. Awaz 25 October 2015 10: 12 New
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    and right now, Mistral would be very useful in the Syrian Express ...
  19. AdekvatNICK 25 October 2015 10: 26 New
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    Oland won the election only due to the votes that gave him "same-sex" people whom he promised to legalize, which he did.
  20. veksha50 25 October 2015 10: 33 New
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    "Russia will earn at the resale of France "Mistral" Egypt or not - a question that does not concern us very much. There is a feeling that it will work.

    That’s the difference between modern media, because it’s completely bipolar, Brownian-like information ...

    At the same time, there is a conversation about the sale of Mistral to Egypt, about Egypt ordering our spacecraft and supposedly already about ordering the installation of the same equipment that is being dismantled by our ... Question: why is dismantling necessary then - for an extra waste of time and money ???

    At the same time, the author claims that Russia will never order warships in France again ... Everything is so changeable in this world ... Already one ordering of these Mistrals has become incident No. 1 ... Why not incident No. 2 with time ???

    And, in fact, this whole surreal story with the Mistrals is so tired ... I never thought that this topic would again appear on the pages of VO ...
  21. Lelek 25 October 2015 12: 53 New
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    (Reputation is a serious thing.)

    The reputation of any person is a serious thing, and the reputation of the state is many times over. The behavior of France in the person of its president causes disgust and baaaalshoe distrust in the future.

    In general, the behavior of the last two presidents of France (Sorcasi and Hollande) resembles a question-and-answer story:
    Why do men have horizontal wrinkles on their foreheads and vertical wrinkles on women?
    The husband comes from work "under-shafe" and the wife (hands on her sides and clenched brows - wrinkles are vertical) asks: "Well, where is the money?"
    The husband, staggering, rounding his eyes and raising his eyebrows to the ceiling (wrinkles are horizontal), responds with a gleaming voice: "what money?".
    To illustrate the picture with the above-mentioned Francois. bully
  22. Are
    Are 25 October 2015 13: 13 New
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    The response to the article is issued by the headline "Hollande throws words to the wind."
    The country's reputation is valued more than money. And France, if you please, is a competitor to Russia in the international arms markets. Make a conclusion yourself.
  23. traveler 25 October 2015 13: 33 New
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    Egypt can buy something only if the KSA throws money at it.
    and who pays, he orders the music.
    so for what purposes these French devices will be used in many respects will be solved by er-riad
  24. NDR-791 25 October 2015 14: 56 New
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    The initiator and mediator in the conclusion of the Russian-French Mistral contract was today's runaway banker, whose issuance to domestic justice is required by the Investigative Committee of Russia, and in the tenths of this century, the senator from Tuva and the main owner of one of the largest domestic shipbuilding enterprises, Baltic Shipyard Sergey Pugachev. It was he who, as knowledgeable people say, suggested the presidents of France and Russia conclude an agreement on the purchase of two Mistral helicopter carrier dock ships, which in theory were supposed to significantly enhance the power of the Russian Navy.
    Rave! Insanity grew stronger, etc. In theory? Whose idea is it? Each idea has an author, and if, according to the author, Pugachev replaces the general staff and personally easily pushes such a contract to the president, then hypothetically I would doubt the president’s mental abilities, BUT since I have no doubts about the full adequacy of our GDP, I have to doubt whether the author of the article. And what Hollande comes to his song, so we all understood when the problems went along the Mistrals.
  25. KG_patriot_last 25 October 2015 15: 33 New
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    A distinctive feature of the western democratic elections is the promise of a heap of everything with 60% rating, and then resignation from the post with 0% support.
  26. A1L9E4K9S 25 October 2015 16: 31 New
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    Quote: unsinkable
    Fools in Russia will never be transferred


    Well, you defeated me in all respects, and I was hoping there was nothing to be done, although hope was dying last.
  27. 3vs
    3vs 25 October 2015 17: 49 New
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    It responds to us for the non-delivery of C300 complexes to Iran!
    DAM himself launched this answer.
    The complexes were not under sanctions, but with overload, we have “overload”
    the button was so red.
    So overloaded ...
    A thing of the past, and even in a storm, I think, these pelvis will behave very badly ...
  28. pilot bin-bom 25 October 2015 22: 53 New
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    Egypt has no money! I know this question quite well - in early summer, requests came to the relevant ministries about credit deliveries of technology and equipment to Egypt, including dual purpose. They don’t have any money in the treasury - they stole it, sawed it, but they didn’t find any ends, only they fell on previous governments. By the way, they raised the visa fee from foreigners (tourists).
    Saudis will pay for Mistral. It will not be up to me to decide whether Mistrali’s over-selection will be a Russian weapon, there are more impressive heads, well, in the sense they spawn caviar and delicacies in them (in their heads).
    But if the Saudis pay for everything, then they are like pocket pugs of the USA, they will share with them everything that the states are interested in.
  29. Zomanus 26 October 2015 05: 24 New
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    Well, the Mistral example is valuable at least
    what he is. And in which case you can safely point to it,
    for example, when trying to buy some other weapons abroad.
    After all, we also iveco - we wanted to buy a lynx and wheeled tanks, if anyone forgot.
    And what about France, and indeed about all of Europe ...
    They just relaxed over the years of life without a Union.
    No need to strain and think over the policy “yours and ours”,
    no need to go on the counter for the sake of maintaining the image of the country and future alliances.
    Now the revision of politicians will begin precisely from these points of view.
    That all this could and could.