Military Review

The territory of the hunt for "Satan." Collapse of cooperation with Russia threatens Ukraine with leakage of rocket technologies

102
The territory of the hunt for "Satan." Collapse of cooperation with Russia threatens Ukraine with leakage of rocket technologies



After President Vladimir Putin’s call to US President Barack Obama, the head of the State Department, John Kerry, deployed the plane to meet with Sergey Lavrov at the Russian embassy in Paris. The conversation behind closed doors lasted four hours. What could have caused such a sharp reaction of the American side? It is unlikely that it was only about stabilizing the situation in Ukraine ... It is possible that the US president was informed about the imminent violation by Kiev of the non-proliferation regime of rocket technologies. And this is a direct threat to US security.

The Republic of Ukraine inherited from the Soviet Union a powerful defense-industrial complex, including the production of rocket and space technology. The State Enterprise "Design Bureau" Yuzhnoye "named after M.K. Yangel in Dnepropetrovsk - a major developer of intercontinental ballistic missiles.

The RS-36M UTTH rocket designed here, according to the NATO code, SS-18 Satan (“Satan”), is still in service with the Strategic Missile Forces of Russia. Ukrainian specialists carry out architectural supervision, extending the resource of "Satan" - the most powerful ballistic missile in the world.

Its production has long been discontinued, but the design documentation is still located in Yuzhnoye Design Bureau. Like the documentation for another intercontinental missile - SS-24 (Scalpel), we have known as the Molodets RT-23 UTTH. This is a rocket for combat railway missile system (BZHRK). Under the START-2 Treaty, the complexes themselves were decommissioned and destroyed.

The entire defense industry of Ukraine is tied to Russian orders. But 29 in March, the acting director general of the Ukroboronprom concern, Yuriy Tereshchenko, announced the termination of deliveries weapons and military equipment to Russia. Again the. Prime Minister of Ukraine Arseniy Yatsenyuk told one of the TV channels that it is planned to re-equip the defense industry through cooperation with the West. In the meantime, enterprises will be modernized, "will have to use other people's samples." Although after the procurement of the need for their own weapons is likely to disappear.

Without Russian orders, Ukraine’s defense industry is doomed to a speedy bankruptcy. And then there will be foreign buyers, if not already appeared. First of all, these are Israel and China, especially interested in rocket technologies.

Israel overlooked the anti-Semitism of the ultra-right members of the provisional Kiev government and the militants of the Right Sector. Reacting painfully to the manifestations of neo-Nazism in Europe, the Israeli leadership did not pay attention to the beating in Kiev of the head of the Jewish organization Rabbi Cohen and the famous musician Jan Tabachnik, the burning of synagogues and anti-Semitic inscriptions. But she took on the treatment of "Heroes of Maidan." Apparently, there is a very big interest in Ukraine. More precisely, all to one really existing resource - rocket technologies.

Not seeking to spoil relations with Kiev usurpers and Beijing. China declined to assess the reunification of the Crimea with Russia. He, too, needs to maintain good relations with Kiev, whoever is in power. And the whole world knows that the Chinese do not spare money for sensitive technologies.

What can the bankruptcy of Ukrainian defense industry enterprises lead to? First, to privatization. All or parts of them will begin to sell. You can buy a plant or KB with archives. Secondly, the documents can be sold by the employees themselves, first of all the managers. Thirdly, you can sign tempting contracts with leading designers, take them out of the country and restore key documentation. And finally, fourthly, the Kiev interim leadership for the sake of a large soft loan of the PRC itself can bring the technology on a silver platter.

In this perspective, Barack Obama is definitely not up to the Crimea. He no longer requires the return of the peninsula to Ukraine. Get, say, Beijing "Satan" and BZHRK, the US leadership in the world will be a big question.
Originator:
http://www.ng.ru/editorial/2014-04-02/2_red.html
102 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. Rupor
    Rupor April 4 2014 06: 42
    +26
    I suppose in the Yuzhnoye design bureau these documents are long gone, instead of them there is a "doll" with a Coca-Cola recipe :)
    1. Canep
      Canep April 4 2014 06: 56
      +31
      Quote: Rupor
      I suppose in the Yuzhnoye design bureau these documents are long gone, instead of them there is a "doll" with a Coca-Cola recipe :)
      Where would they go? It is highly probable that copies of these documents are also in Russia, but these archives are definitely preserved at YuMZ, they are under the stamp, and must be strictly accounted for.
      1. domokl
        domokl April 4 2014 07: 01
        +47
        Everything is in place ... There are simply a lot of specialists left. And in the USA, too, amateurs are not sitting ... They will think up the rest ... In short, the news is vile ...
        1. Mainbeam
          Mainbeam April 4 2014 07: 09
          +7
          So you can write about any industry in Ukraine.
          For example, about aviation or about tank building.

          http://censor.net.ua/f502478
          At the time of the collapse of the Soviet Union, the military-industrial complex (MIC) of the Ukrainian SSR totaled more than 3,5 thousand enterprises. There were about 700 plants with purely military production in Soviet Ukraine. Almost a half million people worked for them.

          So a leak from any enterprise is harmful to the Russian defense industry.

          Almost without exception, enterprises of the Ukrainian defense industry operate thanks to Russian contracts, and the Ukrainian defense industry produces half of its weapons for Russia. More than 70% of suppliers of systems and components for Ukrainian defense enterprises are located in Russia.
          1. domokl
            domokl April 4 2014 07: 11
            +11
            Quote: MainBeam
            So a leak from any enterprise is harmful to the Russian defense industry.

            Alas, you are right ... Too this integration is setting us up now ...
          2. avg
            avg April 4 2014 11: 03
            +5
            Quote: MainBeam
            So you can write about any industry in Ukraine, for example, about aviation or about tank building.

            That's how it is. Only sensitivity and consequences are different. In the field of rocket technology, Russia and the United States are decades ahead of the world, and capturing the secrets of KB Yuzhnoye is a chance to quickly bridge this gap.
        2. Sirocco
          Sirocco April 4 2014 08: 38
          +22
          Quote: domokl
          Everything is in place ... Just a lot of specialists left.

          You are right, everything is in place. And engineers of KB South last year spent more than one month in the United States, so to speak, on the site of a joint project. I think most of the information from the KB is already in the states. Ukraine goes in a circle, as in the early 90s. For 30 pieces of silver, they will sell what is left. (Documentation)
        3. Geisenberg
          Geisenberg April 4 2014 09: 27
          +6
          Quote: domokl
          Everything is in place ... There are simply a lot of specialists left. And in the USA, too, amateurs are not sitting ... They will think up the rest ... In short, the news is vile ...


          Even at the time of design, specialists were already not young people, now they are people over the age of 50 years. Even if they are all screwed in and taken out in bulk, with documentation, it will take 4-5 years to fully restore the technology. And if people just stubborn themselves? And if not everyone is screwed? etc ...

          The news is vile, but not fatal.
          1. andrewvlg
            andrewvlg April 4 2014 12: 32
            +2
            Quote: Geisenberg
            Even at the time of design, specialists were already not young people, now they are people over the age of 50 years.

            Well, this is you, frankly, too much. A talented engineer - even at 65 he is "like a cucumber". Moreover, it is required reestablish progress, not invent something fundamentally new.
            Moreover, they probably recruited young people, just young people. less. Are not the only "old men" engaged in the maintenance of the missiles in service?
            Otherwise, I completely agree with you - documentation and specialists - this is not production at all, especially serial production. And knowing the bureaucratic "traditions" of the Chinese military-industrial complex, it may not work.
            It's still sad. Engineers are remembered only when they are ready to be "bought" abroad. But Rogozin and others like him have a "personnel famine" in their reports. And our engineers are sitting without work. Both young and old. Now the chances of finding a job are for a small percentage of graduates who literate leaders lead in senior courses.
        4. Niki
          Niki April 4 2014 10: 45
          +5
          And what is new in this news?

          Several decades existing enterprise. Everyone has long known the nomenclature of his products. There probably have already been leaks of information, because the SBU (Ukraine), time after time, demonstrates its venality.

          The only trick is that you do not just need to sell the documentation - for example, the Americans have long had a license for rocket launcher engines, but they still fly on Russian assemblies. Here, most likely, they are more afraid of selling finished products.
        5. WKS
          WKS April 4 2014 11: 45
          +7
          To these papers, to create such a "little thing", the entire machine-building (or rather rocket-building) complex of the USSR is still required. YUZHMASH is only a small part of it. The main production facilities are located in Russia. The Chinese will deal with this product for more than a decade. And the states have their carriers, little inferior to Satan. For them, one conversion of the metric system to US standards will cost more than one billion. It should not be forgotten that to launch this carrier, a mine is needed, which is not just a pit, but a complex structure. The construction of which took 1,5-2 years in the USSR. With a full green street and Soviet prices for land, labor, etc. At this construction phase, all starting mine complexes were mapped, and by the time the product was loaded into the mine, the enemy's preemptive products were already aimed at it. This is yesterday. Modern nuclear deterrent devices are based on mobile launch complexes. Since 1991, YUZHMASH has not carried out any new developments, but was used mainly for the supply of secondary components. As for the leading specialists, they still left in the early 90s in all directions, to the states and China as well.
        6. Alekseev
          Alekseev April 4 2014 12: 04
          +3
          Quote: domokl
          It’s just that there are a lot of specialists left. And in the USA, too, amateurs are not sitting ... They will think up the rest ... In short, the news is vile ...

          And my opinion, taking into account the personalities who led independent Ukraine, that "everything was stolen before us", that is, what could have been sold long ago yes , the more technology is already old. Yes and not all technologies in rocket science are concentrated in Dnepropetrovsk.
          Nobody will copy "Satan". The West has its own for a long time, and the Makeev Design Bureau is creating a heavy liquid-propellant rocket based on new technologies in the Russian Federation.
          In the DPRK, etc., there is simply no money and production that is necessary to create a rocket of this class, or rather, a missile complex.
        7. afdjhbn67
          afdjhbn67 April 4 2014 14: 40
          0
          unfortunately this is not news a leak from the outskirts of the defense industry has been going on for a long time and systematically ... amerikosy have already downloaded a lot .. in the years of dem. of delight, they were able to dig around with us, and with that mess on the outskirts ... unless finished goods are exported
          1. Fornit
            Fornit April 4 2014 16: 20
            0
            I completely agree ... If a whole research institute for amers was calculating the characteristics of the defeat of the underground "non-rubber" (see Poltoranin) - what to argue about further?
        8. orek
          orek April 4 2014 17: 05
          +1
          Don't dramatize the situation. I hope you can imagine that for 23 years of "non-stagnation" these documents could not only be resubmitted, but copied manually. how many times. However, there is still NO equal weapon in the world (fortunately) !!!
          And yet in these archives there is not the most important thing - specialists able to put it all in a heap and most importantly make it all go up in the air. I hope the owners of the securities, they are also on the count.
      2. Tersky
        Tersky April 4 2014 07: 08
        +8
        Quote: Canep
        Where would they go? It is highly probable that copies of these documents are also in Russia, but these archives are definitely preserved at YuMZ, they are under the stamp, and must be strictly accounted for.

        No matter what they say, write, build dogmatics, my opinion is that the GDP is not so stupid as to miss this far from secondary fact when predicting the outcome of events in Ukraine. I think that before proceeding to the return of Crimea, all the consequences were taken into account, and appropriate measures were taken, including to exclude the likelihood of the "Satan" and "Molodets" documentation falling into the hands of NATO. And who will keep all the eggs in one basket ... Sergei, hi
        1. Ramadan
          Ramadan April 4 2014 08: 50
          +16
          Tersky, I’m sure that these technologies leaked back under Yushchenko in the very first year. Therefore, most likely, ours simply took this fact as a basis and based on this they make plans for the future. At least that would be more logical.
          And the return of the Crimea, in my opinion, can not be compared with any technology.
          1. CHILD
            CHILD April 4 2014 11: 09
            +2
            Kuchma, as a former director, probably would have sold ..... the very Israel in such cases would have delivered a pre-emptive bomb strike, and then a mosad all over the world would have chased information carriers .... although they have such a nice object there Weaving .... if you explode the whole city will not seem a little .....
        2. wax
          wax April 4 2014 11: 02
          +2
          The result of the change in the course of Ukraine did not depend on Crimea. Crimea simply transferred the process from the European (non-forced) option to the American (forced) one.
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. samoletil18
        samoletil18 April 4 2014 08: 19
        +4
        Quote: Canep
        but at UMZ
        And it was built, because the car factory! I managed to transfer the missile design bureau to this site, damn it!
        1. Bayonet
          Bayonet April 4 2014 08: 29
          +5
          Who thought the USSR would fall apart? So did Crimea - they transferred the rupe from one pocket to another, but they gave it to a stranger.
        2. CHILD
          CHILD April 4 2014 11: 12
          0
          so there they produced tractors .....
      5. Geisenberg
        Geisenberg April 4 2014 09: 24
        +9
        Quote: Canep
        Quote: Rupor
        I suppose in the Yuzhnoye design bureau these documents are long gone, instead of them there is a "doll" with a Coca-Cola recipe :)
        Where would they go? It is highly probable that copies of these documents are also in Russia, but these archives are definitely preserved at YuMZ, they are under the stamp, and must be strictly accounted for.


        Knowing the peculiarity of the brotherly people to total betrayal, I won’t be surprised if copies have already been made and negotiations are underway for sale.

        Purely my change urgently needs to be taken. Either destroy the archives under the fire, or take them out. A diplomatic solution will not work here - the partners are not reliable, guaranteed to be deceived.
        1. Aleksandr65
          Aleksandr65 April 4 2014 12: 53
          +4
          Something you underestimate this feature of the fraternal people-EVERYTHING has already been sold and betrayed even under Yushchenko — I have no doubt about this one iota!
        2. Cristall
          Cristall April 4 2014 23: 25
          -1
          I am against such a statement.
          Nowhere did the people totally betray ...
          I wonder how this statement relates to the statement that Russians and Ukrainians are one nation. It turns out that Russian can also be totally betrayed? smile
          Bullshit ... something I can’t remember in the history of the mass betrayal of all Ukraine ..
          Although what exactly do you consider a betrayal?
          Examples of Total Betrayal? It is desirable with the percentage of the number of Ukrainians!
      6. Anisim1977
        Anisim1977 April 4 2014 10: 17
        +10
        Given the mess in Ukraine over the past 23 years, all that could be compromised is already .... Therefore, do not spoil nerve cells in vain. hi
        1. operrus
          operrus April 4 2014 11: 07
          +3
          A good example of Thread, China made several visits before taking possession of the documentation on it, as a result, there is now an analog of Thread in China. I think on other issues everything is similar.
          1. aleks 62
            aleks 62 April 4 2014 11: 37
            +7
            .... The analogue is not the original ... The example of the c-300 can be seen ... Copied, but only no range ... So here. I do not think that the plant had a full cycle, that they received something through cooperation with Russia ... They will copy and ... get a range of 5-6 thousand km instead of 15-16 tons, for example, or something else ... It is foolish to think that for 23 years with all these "rulers" nothing has flowed HERE !!!! Not fatal ...
            1. svp67
              svp67 April 4 2014 12: 00
              +2
              That's right ... by and large, they assembled at UMZ, and they received components from all over the Union, engines, for example ... Now try to make a rocket without engines ...
            2. andrewvlg
              andrewvlg April 4 2014 12: 50
              0
              Quote: aleks 62
              Copy and ... get a range of 5-6 thousand km instead of 15-16

              Yes, you know, it's better to 15-16 ... maybe it will "slip through" somehow repeat
        2. The comment was deleted.
      7. Rus2012
        Rus2012 April 4 2014 13: 46
        0
        Quote: Canep
        YuMZ these archives are precisely preserved, they are also under the stamp, and are subject to strict accounting.

        ... periodically everything that is even under the stamp is subject to destruction. Including samples and accessories. Typically, when a topic closes ... These are the rules.

        It’s quite another matter, that in the brain is difficult to destroy, especially if the team is still working. Tech Docs is just the visible part of the iceberg called High and KnowHow Technologies.

        According to the available technical docs, even if there is everything 100%, it is impossible to create and produce even copies of weapons models if there is no team that can master all this. Especially if there is no industrial basis of the appropriate level.

        About -
        copies of these documents are in Russia

        Of course there is, but not all.
        There are probably no operational production cards or even full technological documentation. Because each production has its own documentation. All these are tons and tons of paper. And never in one place did they concentrate ...
    2. mrDimkaP
      mrDimkaP April 4 2014 07: 02
      +5
      For Americans, Coca-Cola leak is also a hit wassat
    3. yulka2980
      yulka2980 April 4 2014 07: 11
      +6
      I would like to believe, but in fact it may turn out that dill and these documents have already been sold to someone for an extra piece of fat!
      1. afire
        afire April 4 2014 07: 54
        +15
        You can think of all these 24 years no one has opened these archives ... yeah.
        1) Most likely, the technologies themselves are not there, a common assembly CD can only.
        2) It’s hard to imagine when a huge pile of billions lies nearby, not
        take advantage of this and do not merge, provided that the CD is complete.
        3) GDP, I am sure, previously worried about these archives and we have nothing to worry about.
        4) In connection with the complete fiasco of the Ukrainian defense industry, an important legacy was taken from them for
        inability to provide security.
        1. Starover_Z
          Starover_Z April 4 2014 09: 35
          +3
          Quote: afire
          an important legacy was taken from them for
          inability to provide security.

          It would be nice, but not sure. The FSB specialists will have to repeat the operation,
          colorfully painted in the series "Astrologer" Atnev, on the destruction of the archive.
          If the staff really didn’t retake him for 30 pieces of silver!
    4. potap48a
      potap48a April 4 2014 09: 18
      +1
      I support you completely. We are not fools and everyone knew about rockets. Because they are kings in Hohland for a long time, that’s all they needed to know long ago. So if we are not fussed. then everything has already sailed away for a long time. China and Eureka can smoke.
      1. Niki
        Niki April 4 2014 10: 53
        +1
        For some reason, I’m sure that China has long had any documentation they need for the development of rocket science and space. This is confirmed by their public space program.

        I repeat that the discussed problem is more likely to have the possibility of manufacturing finished products at Ukrainian plants and selling these products to anyone.
      2. pvn53
        pvn53 April 4 2014 11: 52
        0
        But the likelihood that everyone sold a long time ago is very high.
      3. pvn53
        pvn53 April 4 2014 11: 52
        +1
        But the likelihood that everyone sold a long time ago is very high.
    5. polite people
      polite people April 4 2014 14: 01
      0
      It would be nice if the USA and China banged their foreheads for these documents.
    6. theadenter
      theadenter April 4 2014 14: 14
      0
      Who needs these blueprints in the world if there are no engines, electronics, missile defense control and counteraction systems? And why will they be launched and controlled, interesting?
      There, the drawings are tied to certain turnkey system components.
  2. avant-garde
    avant-garde April 4 2014 06: 46
    +4
    A Th in the outskirts there is no article for the disclosure of state. secrets? Although probably what it is about, there’s no law there now sad.
    1. spech
      spech April 4 2014 06: 52
      +11
      What state secrets? There is no longer a state as such.
    2. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov April 4 2014 07: 33
      +4
      Quote: avant-garde
      A Th in the outskirts there is no article for the disclosure of state. secrets?

      Of course there is, it is only very selective and does not act in relation to the allied chiefs (USA).
    3. O_RUS
      O_RUS April 4 2014 07: 34
      +8
      Quote: avant-garde
      A Th in the outskirts there is no article for the disclosure of state. secrets?


      ... just the citizens of Okrain will be happy to spoil ... especially Russia.
      1. Cristall
        Cristall April 4 2014 23: 28
        0
        Quote: O_RUS
        just the Ukrainians will be happy to spoil ... especially Russia.

        Ukrainians in the first place.
        Only temporary workers and businessmen can crap ... and that's not all ...
        even intoxicated people, however, understand what's what.
        1. O_RUS
          O_RUS April 4 2014 23: 49
          0
          "Only temporary workers can shit ..."

          ... so yes. The outskirts turned out to be temporary workers ... they were part of the USSR, enriched, fled from the USSR, revived fascism, on May 9 they beat WWII veterans.

          Even in the tenths ... you revived fascism, Bandera and Sasha Bily have national heroes.
          Forgotten the past ... They became Euro-Ukrainians.
    4. andrewvlg
      andrewvlg April 4 2014 12: 56
      0
      Quote: avant-garde
      A Th in the outskirts there is no article for the disclosure of state. secrets?

      Of course have! AND warriors of Narnia with grinders your hands will be sawed off, the current in the archive what secret you shove.
  3. Mainbeam
    Mainbeam April 4 2014 06: 46
    +2
    All from a series of assumptions. So you can agree on anything.

    After a call from Russian President Vladimir Putin to US President Barack Obama, Head of State Department John Kerry deployed a plane to meet with Sergey Lavrov at the Russian Embassy in Paris

    Already not the first one to procrastinate this U-turn
  4. siberalt
    siberalt April 4 2014 06: 47
    +1
    This is already clarifying something in terms of Kerry's sudden air zigzag. Or maybe there was something more important and no less urgent. The big game is not over, but there are fewer grandmasters.
    1. BYV
      BYV April 4 2014 07: 00
      0
      As for the grandmasters - I would not say that there are fewer of them. Some leave, others come.
  5. ya.seliwerstov2013
    ya.seliwerstov2013 April 4 2014 06: 49
    +3
    With this perspective, Barack Obama is definitely not up to the Crimea. He no longer demands the return of the peninsula to Ukraine. Take on, say, Beijing “Satan” and the BZHRK, US leadership in the world will be in great doubt
    It’s not even a matter of US leadership, but the safety of the entire world community against terrorism using nuclear weapons. Not only will you deploy a plane.
    1. Starover_Z
      Starover_Z April 4 2014 12: 53
      +1
      The Chinese version of the BZHRK, "put" on a high-speed train - that will be a "headache" for everyone!
  6. Denis
    Denis April 4 2014 06: 53
    +5
    The RS-36M UTTH rocket designed here, according to the NATO code, SS-18 Satan (“Satan”), is still in service with the Strategic Missile Forces of Russia. Ukrainian specialists carry out architectural supervision, extending the resource of "Satan" - the most powerful ballistic missile in the world.

    Its production has long been discontinued, but the design documentation is still in the CB "South". As well as the documentation for another intercontinental missile, the SS-24 (Scalpel), which is known as the RT-23 UTTH Molodets. This is a missile for a military railway missile complex (BZHRK). Under the START-2 Treaty, the complexes themselves were withdrawn from service and destroyed

    Which is extremely sad
    But who was achieving this, whose black ears are now sticking out?
    re-equipment of the defense industry due to cooperation with the West is planned
    Of course, it was for this that they completely destroyed him
    Israel through the fingers looks at anti-Semitism of ultra-right members of the interim Kiev government and Right Sector militants
    Business, nothing personal
  7. Grenz
    Grenz April 4 2014 07: 05
    +5
    Quote: Denis
    Which is extremely sad
    But who was achieving this, whose black ears are now sticking out?

    You can call the name of a specific person - the head of the Russian Foreign Ministry Kozyrev. (He never hid that he was lobbying for US interests).
    After all, it came to a paradoxical point - the Ministry of Defense hid missiles from him so that he would not include them in the START treaty. One, not subject to inclusion - "Point", he included. It was later that the granddaughter "Iskanedr" was born.
    And rocket technology, according to the experience of Nazi Germany, the United States with the help of the SBU, apparently, has long been received and Kerry’s reversal is nothing more than a trick. But the glory is in Primakov.
    1. Denis
      Denis April 4 2014 07: 30
      +7
      http://s.bookmix.ru/books/3/6/6/Trotckij_Ubijstvo_bolshogo_zatejnika_7366.jpg
      Quote: grenz
      Russian Foreign Minister Kozyrev. (He never hid that he was lobbying for US interests)
      Another Judas on the list of members of the non-mountaineering club, ice axes mainly. A lot of them divorced, it's time to cut back
      Like this
  8. techmesh
    techmesh April 4 2014 07: 09
    +3
    There Americans with Jews ring around one stand around this design bureau, so that paper does not get into Iran and the DPRK.
  9. ken
    ken April 4 2014 07: 09
    +4
    Design documentation together with specialists in RUSSIA !!!
    1. inkass_98
      inkass_98 April 4 2014 08: 38
      +2
      Quote: ken
      Design documentation together with specialists in RUSSIA !!!

      But God forbid, if in such a condition as in the photo, and in a clean field so that later they will not be unloaded. And then there is experience, both during the Second World War and after the withdrawal of the ZGV troops in Russia.
      Everything should be done carefully and according to plan.
  10. ia-ai00
    ia-ai00 April 4 2014 07: 09
    +9
    Another proof that you need to "be friends" only with your FAITHFUL FRIENDS - the ARMY and the FLEET. As the song says: - "... and this is a serious matter, you CANNOT trust anyone." After the collapse of the USSR, Russia should have moved all strategic production to its territory. The only thing that those who developed the country had before the "Fene", the future of Russia.
  11. Andrey Yuryevich
    Andrey Yuryevich April 4 2014 07: 14
    +17
    There is a lot of fuss now going around the entire military-industrial complex of Ukraine, everyone wants to bite off a bigger piece, and the United States, as they presented the piece in the photo in A.N.A.L.E., they just ran around ... if China gets the documentation, the Xerox will give time is not only "SATAN". I would like to believe that the GRU is working on this.
    1. aleks 62
      aleks 62 April 4 2014 11: 41
      +1
      .... The main thing is different ... so that according to the drawings they collected ... We collected a rocket, but we got a steam locomotive ... (as in one famous joke). :))))))
  12. gland
    gland April 4 2014 07: 16
    +8
    this is actually very bad news, the United States is the first who wants this technology to get it to the fortuneteller not to go, and at least put the rest in the queue!
    1. aleks 62
      aleks 62 April 4 2014 11: 43
      +2
      Having the technology, the United States, for some reason, cannot repeat the Saturn engines, they buy RD-33 from us ...
  13. ArhipenkoAndrey
    ArhipenkoAndrey April 4 2014 07: 18
    +6
    And judging by the reaction, the moment China acquired the technologies of the Ukrainian defense industry is just around the corner and this will make everyone uncomfortable in the world, although it may be the other way around that the main world gendarmes (states and others like them will quieten down a bit), although it’s unlikely - in general, the Kiev gang has done a lot everything is just the beginning.
  14. mabuta
    mabuta April 4 2014 07: 19
    +4
    Now, in a period of instability and anarchy in Ukraine, everything is possible. Not only do many design bureaus eke out a miserable existence, many joint developments represent the availability of data. Remembering Russia during the time of troubles, many will sell everything and everything, spitting on honor and conscience. They say the revolution will write everything off. It only seems to me that our specialists will not allow this. And the bright heads of Ukraine are already in Russia.
    1. I read the news
      I read the news April 4 2014 09: 06
      +4
      Urgently take out bright heads! In Russia, not all.
      1. ArhipenkoAndrey
        ArhipenkoAndrey April 4 2014 10: 35
        +1
        Already most likely it’s not possible, the representatives of PMCs probably secretly but tightly secured the documentation and specialists, and they were most likely sent to the outskirts for these purposes, and there’s not much loss to protect these Kiev and Maydan bandits.
  15. Arkan
    Arkan April 4 2014 07: 28
    +2
    Here it is, the last division of the Soviet legacy. Political pygmies don't give a damn about anything that doesn't fit into their skullcap. Now let the American and European okhlos think, otherwise "Satan" will go for a walk around the world.
  16. gregor6549
    gregor6549 April 4 2014 07: 29
    0
    Leakage of information on "Satan" and other weapons produced in Ukraine threatens not only Ukraine itself but also Russia and all those republics of the former Soviet Union where these weapons are used. And you need to "make friends" not so much on an emotional basis as on a more solid foundation, for example, on the unity of political goals, agreements on cooperation in the economic and military spheres, agreements on mutual assistance in the event of external aggression, etc. And do not rush to hysteria if something went wrong. Firstly, the relevant services should not click and inform the management in a timely manner about dangerous trends from the ally, and if necessary, then take timely proactive plumbing actions. Well, remember that it's easy to ruin a relationship, but it's difficult to fix it. The same is with the war. Of course, Ukraine is much weaker than Russia, but this is not a reason to put pressure on it with military force. then Newton's law of action and reaction begins to operate, and the likelihood of getting NATO at the borders of Russia becomes much greater. than "before that" And there is already a transition from the Cold War to the hot one is not sunburned. Is it NATO for us? So much effort has been spent to reduce the likelihood of such a war and what, all over again? After all, if it, God forbid, starts, then there will be no one to argue on this and other topics. And now there are so many guns hanging on the wall of the theater of the absurd that one can shoot even against the wishes of the owner of the gun. And then go and figure out who first shot. And there will be no one to figure it out. Perhaps one should take an example from India, which is actively modernizing its Armed Forces, trying not to quarrel with any of its "sworn friends" and not to bring any quarrels to the point of absurdity. As long as India succeeds
  17. GRune
    GRune April 4 2014 07: 34
    0
    Very bad turn of events ...
  18. Sergey Vl.
    Sergey Vl. April 4 2014 07: 34
    +5
    When the USSR collapsed in 1991, I somehow did not think, living in Estonia, what would happen to my documents at the military commissariat. Later, after returning home to Russia and getting on military records, a month later I was holding my own business (and this was by no means 91 years old!). So there were people who were preoccupied with this. To the question of where, with whom, what lies ...
  19. stas11830
    stas11830 April 4 2014 07: 37
    +1
    Yes, there is already no full documentation there. For a long time already everything in Russia!
    1. Simon
      Simon April 4 2014 08: 32
      0
      So also, it would not be bad to pick up specialists from there!
    2. Flinky
      Flinky April 4 2014 08: 48
      +1
      Shhh. Kerry does not know about this, and let him not know further.
    3. samoletil18
      samoletil18 April 4 2014 08: 56
      +1
      Quote: stas11830
      Yes, there is already no full documentation there. For a long time already everything in Russia!

      And how can you confirm this?
    4. The comment was deleted.
  20. Ruswolf
    Ruswolf April 4 2014 08: 05
    +3
    If you try to put all the "puzzles" together, the US refusal of additional funding from the Pentagon for scientific research, the understatement of funding for space projects, the refusal to acquire missiles, etc. -technical developments of Russia, by establishing their control over the former Soviet republics that are part of the military-industrial complex of Russia.
    Resist this 50% 50, but this applies to the old (or relatively old).
    Now it is necessary to establish a production base in Russia, but at state institutions, and not on a commercial basis.
    And as they say
    "In the coffin of friends, in the coffin of friends - I am a great friend to myself!"
    Then the head will not hurt!
    1. Fornit
      Fornit April 4 2014 16: 34
      0
      Quote: Ruswolf
      Now it is necessary to establish a production base in Russia, but at state institutions, and not on a commercial basis.

      So far, they are setting up new ministries and, it seems, just on a commercial basis ...
      "The bureaucracy has a paradoxical property - it multiplies by division ..." (C)
  21. Stinger
    Stinger April 4 2014 08: 06
    +5
    In my opinion, what could have leaked has long been leaked. Kuchma alone has not leaked.
  22. ed65b
    ed65b April 4 2014 08: 25
    +6
    On the other hand, you might think that everything has long been sold and transferred over the hill. Is there such a possibility? Given the fact that dill has always been glad to make us muck from Chechnya to Georgia. And our all odes are sung by fraternal peoples, but what kind of music is my brother? Or Yarosh. Or Nalivaykin with the Pastor.
  23. Strashila
    Strashila April 4 2014 08: 28
    +1
    Now the fundamentals of the Americans' peppy statements about breaking off relations in the space sphere with Russia are clear, they are hoping for a Ukrainian backlog in this area ... what to buy for ... if you can steal it.
    1. inkass_98
      inkass_98 April 4 2014 08: 45
      0
      Quote: Strashila
      clear basics of cheerful statements by Americans about the severance of relations in space with Russia

      This is not entirely true. First, the State Department has already said that it did not call on NASA to break off relations with Roscosmos. Second, rockets of the "Satan" type can be (and are used) for low-orbit launches of SATELLITES of not the greatest weight, by no means for manned flights and launches of large spacecraft.
      Thirdly, Americans are interested in RD-180 engines, which are not produced in Ruin, these are the technologies in Russia.
      Although - quickly raised is not considered to be fallen, Americans will not be too lazy to squeeze something from their "friends", and even more so the Chinese.
  24. region46
    region46 April 4 2014 08: 34
    +2
    Quite possible. I can now expect everything from this "brotherly" people
  25. kodxnumx
    kodxnumx April 4 2014 08: 40
    +5
    It’s possible now that what I write will sound disgusting, but I don’t see another way, first of all those engineers and designers who refuse to move to RUSSIA need to be done so that they either become moron or they don’t become at all, life depends on it. our children and loved ones, if there is no way to take out the documentation, you need to destroy it, I don’t see any other way out, I’m afraid we missed so much time not China, not USA, not Israel, not at all who would refuse to get hold of drawings and specialists, any money will be spent and this everything will play against RUSSIA!
    1. papik09
      papik09 April 4 2014 09: 55
      0
      Unfortunately, but you are right ... hi
  26. Stiletto
    Stiletto April 4 2014 08: 53
    +5
    Possess, say, Beijing, Satan and the BZHRK, US leadership in the world will be in great doubt.

    I just killed the last phrase in the article. Why are we all nodding to Beijing? You yourself need to keep the bar, and the Western "partners" in good shape, so that their pants do not dry out!
  27. Klim2011
    Klim2011 April 4 2014 08: 54
    +4
    Anti Russian leadership in Ukraine has already been, and not a single year. Why does the author believe that under Yushchenko these technologies have not been sold to all interested parties?
  28. kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya April 4 2014 09: 02
    +1
    It seems to me that this is another "smoke curtain" especially for BZHRK. And yet, I don’t remember that Academician Utkin worked at YuMZ. And I would like to remind about Kolomna. And in general, why did you "cackle", in my opinion there is no reason for panic. And the fact that Kerry turned the plane around, so they apparently made such an offer that cannot be refused!
  29. Voenruk
    Voenruk April 4 2014 09: 02
    +2
    Yeah ... business affairs! Hope for a team of enterprises, I hope our people work there. In an extreme case, you have to send green men, take out documentation and blow up enterprises. In war as in war.
  30. kelevra
    kelevra April 4 2014 09: 03
    +2
    Ukraine signs another death sentence by refusing contracts with Russia!
  31. oxotnuk86
    oxotnuk86 April 4 2014 09: 12
    0
    The mattresses have all the documentation on Satan and Well done for a long time already. For 23 years they got it. They have no reason to copy rockets, but you must know everything about them. In Russia, all the documentation was still under development. But the production was not organized at home, apparently from the economy. Why duplicate after all, brothers make. I think the rustle went because of a possible leak of CD to China, Israel or Iran. Therefore, the mattress covers spun.
  32. samoletil18
    samoletil18 April 4 2014 09: 12
    +5
    Trouble! But look at how many workshops and even entire factories are empty in the country. Depressive territories? Relocation Program? But do you want to make your own production there for the military-industrial complex? Is it cheaper to buy in Ukraine? Nothing is impossible. The bureaucrats for eggs retractable and stolen should be taken. Money to the budget, and from there to production. The software must be created compatible with Intel (to sell cheaper instead of Windows and for distribution around the world), but hardware that is compatible only with its own. At first, everything will be awkward and bulky, then it will go, the main thing is to do it.
    1. Ruswolf
      Ruswolf April 4 2014 10: 17
      +2
      100% "+"
      Moreover, at all times, Russia did not suffer from the absence of smart and competent people, true patriots of their country.
      Unfortunately, many of these people are now forgotten and vegetate in obscurity.
      The result of the Western market + the desire of many officials - according to the principle why produce, it is better to buy!
      But we ourselves can and not just can, but so that the whole world will turn over and Russia has a crush!
    2. The comment was deleted.
  33. tolyasik0577
    tolyasik0577 April 4 2014 09: 22
    0
    Oh damn. the west did not take this into account. Damn, miss out lol
  34. Ruswolf
    Ruswolf April 4 2014 09: 49
    0
    On the other hand, what is Russia losing?
    It is not so easy for the United States to make or deploy new strategic weapons on its territory, there are a lot of obstacles - congresses, senates, and again, public opinion sometimes also plays a role, not showing stability of power and the like.
    Post in Europe? the same is in doubt, since they were the first to be hit by Russian missile defense.
    And Russia itself needs to do retaliatory actions, in the form of deployments, large-scale and joint exercises, to use the fleet's forces more, including military campaigns with a reinforced contingent of the Marine Corps. And leave requests without comment, even if itches at night.
  35. Sirop
    Sirop April 4 2014 09: 55
    0
    So it will soon be ..... (((!!!
  36. Pesnyadv
    Pesnyadv April 4 2014 10: 03
    +1
    Inhabitants of Ukraine during the period of the USSR probably read "12 chairs" and are familiar with the business of archivist Korobeynikov.

    It seems to me that back in 1991, the archives of the military-industrial complex (and other receipts "for furniture sets") began to be pulled apart.
    This fashion wave could not get around our specials. service. Not on the same day everything fell apart ...

    PS
    I remember in the 60s there was a scandal. Soviet intelligence TRUCKS exported drawings of French fighters.
    I think that there are no less drawings here. And maybe it was more! hi
    1. starley
      starley April 5 2014 02: 04
      0
      In 1941, the production of Nagans was restored according to the old Tula drawings, but they are not fired at the Ural plant.
      They found an old locksmith in Tula, brought him to the plant. He looked at the product: And he will not shoot - the drawing on the whisper was "fake", but we did the whisper differently.
  37. Dwarfik
    Dwarfik April 4 2014 10: 12
    -1
    Kind! There is a possibility of falling into the clutches of classified documentation, but I think it is minimal, since our specialists should not be underestimated. Something suggests that there has long been a dummy!
  38. Leha leha
    Leha leha April 4 2014 10: 51
    0
    I remember how they said that under Yeltsin all the developments in lasers were given, where we were ahead of the cowboys a lot, now they use our knowledge, and there is already an American laser shooting down missiles. Of course, this laser is not an impassable link, but still ...
    1. polite people
      polite people April 4 2014 14: 27
      0
      The new weapon maydanutyh.
  39. terrible
    terrible April 4 2014 10: 52
    +1
    ) in cowards) in dill everything has long been spasmed) it remains only to push the rolls) women in Russia sell their forefathers, men to the west backtracking cancer)
  40. Vitaly Anisimov
    Vitaly Anisimov April 4 2014 10: 56
    0
    I think you should not panic .. the KGB in the days of the USSR (and even now ..) was one of the best special services in the world (especially economic espionage), the USSR fell apart and the KGB only had a name changed so I think everything that needs to be cleared back in the early 90's. . At least I hope so .. bully
  41. tolancop
    tolancop April 4 2014 11: 15
    +1
    . I think that, as was rightly noted above, everything that could have been stolen has already been stolen a long time ago. The trick is that even having a complete set of design documentation, it is far from the fact that it will be possible to completely repeat the product. Complex machines are the result of the cooperation of thousands of enterprises. Even bicycles as a whole are not made at the same factory (tires, bearings, etc., purchased items), and a rocket car is several orders of magnitude more complicated. If you start repeating, you will surely stumble upon a block (knot), which is made in Russian Muhosk. Yes, yes, this block can be replaced by an analogue made at a factory in California or near Beijing. But an analogue still needs to be developed and how this analogue will work in conjunction with other blocks is another question. As long as you solve all the problems, it turns out that in terms of time and money it is easier to reconstruct the device taking into account the existing technological and production base.
    It is possible to peek at some ideas in the documentation, but nothing more.

    I am not an expert and not a big specialist. It's just that I DOUI.
  42. Giant thought
    Giant thought April 4 2014 11: 21
    +2
    For a long time they will reap the fruits of their ill-conceived actions. Well, rightly so. The Pandora's box is almost open, but, as a matter of fact, they are already living out the last days, very soon the United States, as a state, will cease to exist.
    1. starley
      starley April 5 2014 01: 58
      0
      Who gave guarantees for this outcome?
      The states should wish them good health - first of all, mental and spiritual - otherwise they can catch a cold at their funeral.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  43. Aaron Zawi
    Aaron Zawi April 4 2014 14: 03
    0
    In general, why China needs this is clear, but for Israel (IMHO) these are excessive expenses. For containment we have the Jericho missile launcher and the Popeye-Turbo missile launcher.
  44. polite people
    polite people April 4 2014 14: 03
    +1
    They will wait for a trial run.
  45. Nonik
    Nonik April 4 2014 16: 42
    0
    Quote: Thought Giant
    they are living out their last days, very soon the United States, as a state, will cease to exist.
    Before that, they will ruin half the world, one way or another. It has been said more than once that "World War III will write off all debts."
  46. gammipapa
    gammipapa April 4 2014 20: 27
    +1
    If Yanukovych took such unpopular steps as selling land for 99 years with his natives. I probably would not have missed such a freebie as selling documentation for rockets quietly. Most likely everyone has already sold before him a long time ago.
    News from the finger.
  47. Cristall
    Cristall April 4 2014 23: 46
    +1
    It is not clear ... that the screams - "let the mustache die there" were replaced by something else ..
    I read an offensive ... Mama Do not Cry.
    I repeat once again - that the KB Yuzhnoye and Yuzhmash generally survived - this is a feat! A poor country - thieves in power for 23 years .... and the design bureau did not die ... even got out - a set of specialists also carried out, there were small increases to sn (of course I don’t know what is there and how - I have to look)
    That is, the enterprise survived as best it could.
    And what is strange - despite the fact that you say that everything was stolen before us --- it is the Yuzhmash and Dnipropetrovsk residents who carry out the verification and renewal and conversion to Dnepr
    However .. however it does not matter. Together we stand for something .. individually, we are only twigs.
    1. Oleg Kharkov
      Oleg Kharkov April 5 2014 01: 09
      0
      Perhaps the Cyclone will still be launched.
      "Satan" is certainly a cool thing for its time. But she is already years and years old and all the time you will not live with the past, even such a wonderful one, with 10 separating combat units. In general, good luck to "Yuzhmash", despite the "well-wishers".
  48. mainu
    mainu April 5 2014 00: 41
    0
    It was because of Crimea that they were so excited. They needed Crimea. Why, we DO NOT know the whole truth. One can only speculate. And the military drawings are just ridiculous to think that after 20 years of independence, Ukrainians can be trusted with something more complicated than a coffee machine.
  49. starley
    starley April 5 2014 01: 55
    0
    What some people have come up with will come to others.
    The point here is not about the methods of beneficenting humanity, but only about the production of ammunition delivery vehicles.
    Ukrainians can do the maximum they can, sell specific equipment - and this will still have to be exported. This is where the old Peter's question comes to life - to stand firm by the sea at sea.