Military Review

Russian television 9 May 2013 of the year disgraced Russia

412



I am ashamed of those who lead Russia. I am ashamed of those who run Russian television. And it hurts me so much for the heroes who defeated fascism.

So, 9 May, during a minute of silence, a phrase about the victorious heroes was heard on all the main Russian TV channels:

YOU, WHO'S CLOSE AND FAMILY HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE STALIN CAMPS, YOU HAVE LIBERATED WITH OSVENTSIM, BUCHENVALD AND DAHAU ...

Probably, the authors of this text are very close relatives of the notorious de-Stalinizer Mikhail Fedotov, who for some reason misunderstanding, still holds the post of chairman of the Human Rights Council.

For even the underdeveloped idiot knows that now in Russia there are as many in prisons as they were under Stalin. And in the US even more.

But most importantly, because of this phrase, you can only draw three conclusions:

During the war, each soldier, officer and general someone sat. In total, about 37 million people passed through the Red Army. Therefore, sat the same. But this is a blatant lie.

Fascism was won not by free people and heroes, but by relatives of prisoners, for whom the fear of entering the camp was stronger than the fear of death. But this is a blatant lie.

Only those from whom someone was sitting fought well. But this is a blatant lie.

It turns out that there was no Victory ... But not heroes fought against fascism, but slaves, for whom the fear of entering the Stalinist camps was worse than the fear of death.

Disgusting. Disgusting. Disgusting.

I really want this article to be considered an official appeal to the UK and the Prosecutor General's Office.

And with great pleasure I will drink front 100 grams, when someone is removed from work and convicted of the betrayal of the heroes of his people.
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  1. xerus.sb
    xerus.sb 10 May 2013 07: 11 New
    99
    I do not think about chance! Vile! Dirty!
    1. Hleb
      Hleb 10 May 2013 08: 03 New
      -100
      But you need to think ..

      the author of this scribble would learn Russian language ...
      During the war, each soldier, officer and general someone sat. In total, about 37 million people passed through the Red Army. Therefore, sat the same. But this is a blatant lie.
      belay where does the text say what everyone has?
      if you follow his logic, then he could write that 37 million were burning near Prokhorovka, 37 million were fighting near Moscow and Stalingrad, etc. .... it’s silly to understand these words so finely and provocatively translate them into numbers.
      quote from the text:"You stood to death near Moscow and Stalingrad, drove bread to the besieged Leningrad, burned in a tank near Prokhorovka. By killing you saved millions of lives. You lost your relatives and friends in the Stalinist camps" why didn’t it generalize?
      1. YARY
        YARY 10 May 2013 15: 51 New
        135
        SW Gleb
        Broadcasting to the WORLD, it is necessary as if you are breathing on a candle.
        I was not born yesterday, and I know about penal battalions and arrests, but (!), Any phrases in this particular case that cast or can cast a shadow over the FACE and MEMORY do not have the right to be.
        To argue or study, take it on the sidelines and library circles.
        1. andrre122
          andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 05 New
          23
          Keep
          1. alex-defensor
            alex-defensor 10 May 2013 17: 07 New
            -85
            During the Stalinist regime, they planted without trial. There were a lot of innocents. I have a repressed family. A patriot is one who loves his homeland, what does Stalin have to do with it? Our leading designers, such as Korolev, also sat ... Say, they sat at work? Now they are also sitting in the USA, but CRIMINALS AND BY THE RESOLUTION OF THE COURT !!!
            1. zart_arn
              zart_arn 10 May 2013 17: 13 New
              -102
              That's right, Alexander, and I'm about the same. To love a country is spread out by hundreds of thousands of its people, it’s not in Russian somehow.
              1. nnz226
                nnz226 10 May 2013 19: 02 New
                61
                As one of the ancients said: "Tyranny is a great love for people, but insufficient faith in them!" And about: "they were sitting with a mustache!" do not need Solzhenitsyn to read at night. Even on this site there are a bunch of articles about who, when and how unwound the flywheel of repression, for what they planted, etc. etc. And those sitting didn’t swing their jokes much, even after the 20 Congress of the CPSU, and not out of fear, Rokosovsky was an example of this, or Meretskov, or Gorbatov. And a lot of these.
                Frinovsky or Yezhov, a victim of Stalin, I hope you will not dignify. A bunch of people sat at work, and despite all the liberal tricks and condemnations of "Stalinist terror" have not yet been rehabilitated. The most useful thing is to read the recollections of the prisoners, where half of them, describing life in the camps, write that they were firmly convinced of the erroneousness of their own sentence, but the validity of these sentences for their barracks neighbors.
                1. kontrol
                  kontrol 10 May 2013 22: 04 New
                  42
                  Solzhenitsyn is another provocateur
                  1. T-73
                    T-73 11 May 2013 12: 19 New
                    -11
                    justify please.
                    1. dddym
                      dddym 11 May 2013 13: 15 New
                      13
                      justify what? That all his numbers breathe poison and malice? What does he only write about the skin? What more than once did he shout on the air, "about send to the Russian Atoms"? What spits on holy dates? What dare to humiliate a soldier? What else do you need to substantiate?
                  2. mch1950
                    mch1950 11 May 2013 13: 10 New
                    -6
                    Can you confirm this?
                    1. dddym
                      dddym 11 May 2013 13: 19 New
                      +2
                      yes please http://www.dm-dobrov.ru/collections/solg.html
                      1. mch1950
                        mch1950 11 May 2013 14: 59 New
                        -3
                        Only archival documents can be convincing.
                      2. dddym
                        dddym 11 May 2013 19: 02 New
                        14
                        The young man works of Solzhenitsyn himself are the archive in this case. Read carefully and you will see that AI constantly calls on the United States to war with the USSR - that is, with your country including using atomic weapons. Only real traitors and provocateurs can deal with such abomination. http://www.dm-dobrov.ru/history/warning.html read carefully not the works of socialists like me, but specifically about whom you are so worried about. I didn’t come up with a line - only the AI ​​itself.
              2. alexandr00070
                alexandr00070 10 May 2013 23: 30 New
                +5
                Quote: nnz226
                Even on this site there are a bunch of articles about who, when and how unwound the flywheel of repression, for what they planted, etc. etc.

                On this occasion, there is an interesting documentary series "Stalin with us." It’s just popular, documented, shown and proved who is to blame for the repressions, how they happened, etc., etc. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOiARPs6Mnw - this is a link, and there are all the series nearby
                1. alex-defensor
                  alex-defensor 11 May 2013 13: 57 New
                  +1
                  Quote: alexandr00070
                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOiARPs6Mnw --это ссылка ,а там рядом все серии

                  I already watched part of the series. I agree with all of the above. But what does the personality of Stalin have to do with it when I write about the Stalin regime. Stalin is a man, and I am talking about the state regime, which is a set of norms, methods and ways of governing the state, through its many bodies and committees, etc. Stalin, this is one man, this is not a state. The Stalinist regime is the name of the state system of that period, of course it would be more correct to write the State regime of the period of Stalin's rule, but it is too long ...
                  I wrote here about the regime, and not about Stalin. The peculiarity of this regime was that the rule of law was not implemented in an exceptional form, as well as the principle that only a court can determine guilt. So, as it is now in any legal state, including Russia. And I’m sure that any of you would not want the three NKVD officers to determine his guilt with partiality ... each of you, if a criminal case is brought against him, will most likely count on an impartial, reasonable and lawful court decision, and not employees of the Ministry of Internal Affairs or the FSB. Do not fool yourself ... at least ...

                  God forbid, of course, if the criminal case is brought against any of you, do you resort to the help of a lawyer as nice ones, or are you ready for your investigator to decide your fate? Or maybe you are ready to "sit down" at the denunciation of your neighbor?

                  And let’s say this: Who is against Putin’s regime in Russia, huh? TO THE WALL !!! Do you agree? And only because someone considered your position regarding the state UNACCEPTABLE ...
                  1. alexandr00070
                    alexandr00070 11 May 2013 17: 02 New
                    0
                    Quote: alex-defensor
                    But what does the personality of Stalin have to do with it when I write about the Stalin regime.

                    Maybe the regime was communist, the leaders changed for 80 years, but the regime remained. At different times of the regime, there were shoals of all the rulers, if you read more materials about those times, you would know that Stalin, and any ruler, including Putin, do not have full power, and then and now there are people who they want to destroy the indigenous population of Russia more; the Khazars in Russia have not yet been transferred. And by the way, in the so-called Putin regime, there are quite a few Khazars and they are conducting their invisible battle, ruining the Russian economy, etc.
              3. alex-defensor
                alex-defensor 11 May 2013 13: 21 New
                -4
                Quote: nnz226
                mustache sat! "do not need Solzhenitsyn to read at night

                I didn’t read Solzhenitsin, and I don’t want to read ... he does not inspire confidence in me. However, there were repressions, this is a fact.

                Quote: nnz226
                A bunch of people sat at work

                And no one says that everyone was sitting for nothing. The problem is precisely that there were quite a few innocent people. People were imprisoned without ships. That is, there was no prosecutor, no lawyer, no judicial composition, there were no court hearings, there were no motions and appeals, there was not even such a principle necessary for any legal state legality, although, however, you hardly understand what it is.

                All those who advocate the restoration of the Stalinist regime in modern Russia are fools. And if their wishes, God forbid, come true, they themselves will either curry favor with this regime, like scoundrels, or they will howl from it ... so be careful with desires, they sometimes come true.
              4. psdf
                psdf 11 May 2013 13: 54 New
                +1
                Quote: nnz226
                e need Solzhenitsyn to read at night

                I hope that the study of all Solzhenitsyn and Shalamov from the secondary school program has already been removed.
            2. GreatRussia
              GreatRussia 10 May 2013 19: 42 New
              +6
              Jews from the TV.

              http://www.sem40.ru/famous2/e259.shtml





              It would seem that in common with these "artists" is the white-tape hit:
              The writer has published a list of those who will go for a walk with him: Dmitry Bykov, Sergey Gandlevsky, Dmitry Glukhovsky, Leonid Zorin, Alexei Kortnev, Julia Latynina, Andrey Makarevich, Sergey Parkhomenko, Lev Rubinstein, Lyudmila Ulitskaya, Irina Yasina.

              http://news.mail.ru/inregions/moscow/90/politics/8929631/?frommail=1

              1.
              http://www.ntv.ru/novosti/159869/
              (Yasina)

              2.
              http://zelikm.com/news/2010/03/05/%D0%BC%D0%B0%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%



              B8%D1%87-%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B4%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%B9-%D0%B2%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%B4%D0%B8%D0%


              BC%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87-%D1%80-1953-%D1%80%D0%BE%D1%81/
              (Makarevich)

              3.
              http://www.peoples.ru/art/literature/prose/roman/ulitskaya/interview3.html
              (Ulitskaya)

              4.
              http://www.jewish.ru/culture/events/2010/09/news994288796.php
              (Rubinstein)

              5.
              http://zelikm.com/news/2010/03/09/%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%85%D0%BE%D0%BC%D0%B5%D0%


              BD%D0%BA%D0%BE-%D1%81%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%B5%D0%B9-%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B8%D1%


              81%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87-%D1%80-1964-%D1%80%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%81%D0%B8/
              (Parkhomenko)


              6.
              Bykov (Zilbertrud)
              http://www.ejwiki.org/wiki/%D0%91%D1%8B%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B2,_%D0%94%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1

              %82%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%9B%D1%8C%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87

              7.
              (Zorin)
              http://www.sem40.ru/famous2/e696.shtml

              And this is only for those who have accurate data on the Internet.
              The rest, not listed by reference, are also under a big question (in particular, Glukhovsky and Gandlevsky). cool.gif
              1. alexandr00070
                alexandr00070 10 May 2013 23: 35 New
                +4
                Quote: GreatRussia
                Jews from TV


                Who would doubt that
                1. GreatRussia
                  GreatRussia 10 May 2013 23: 40 New
                  +2
                  Quote: alexandr00070
                  Who would doubt that

                  Heh, well, there were some, quietly minusanuv five times, afraid to openly object.
                  I did not like the truth.)))
                  1. alexandr00070
                    alexandr00070 10 May 2013 23: 53 New
                    +1
                    Quote: GreatRussia
                    Heh, well, there were some, quietly minusanuv five times, afraid to openly object.
                    I did not like the truth.)))

                    There are far from five of them, just the holidays have not all pulled themselves up. many hide their origin, but VIKI is not sleeping. I was shocked by this information (in the line of origin - grandparents on the father's side)
                    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C2%FB%F1%EE%F6%EA%E8%E9,_%C2%EB%E0%E4%E8%EC%E8%F0_
                    %D1%E5%EC%B8%ED%EE%E2%E8%F7#.D0.A1.D0.B5.D0.BC.D1.8C.D1.8F
                2. kosmos44
                  kosmos44 11 May 2013 05: 41 New
                  0
                  Quote: alexandr00070
                  Who would doubt that


                  And from the government?
                  1. alexandr00070
                    alexandr00070 11 May 2013 11: 14 New
                    +2
                    Quote: kosmos44
                    And from the government?

                    those from the government who control those from television
              2. kosmos44
                kosmos44 11 May 2013 05: 50 New
                +4
                Quote: GreatRussia
                (Makarevich)


                In our country, surnames pass from the husband (mainly), and among Jews, nationality passes from the mother. So what kind of Jew he is, the grandmother said in two. It’s not like the 90s already, that’s how to PR yourself! Like, I'm ready for anything, just to get the hell out of here. But young Makarevich, frankly, was more in my heart. In his years, in my opinion, the "roof" went.
                1. alexandr00070
                  alexandr00070 11 May 2013 11: 12 New
                  +5
                  Quote: kosmos44
                  In his years, in my opinion, the "roof" went.

                  the roof didn’t go, but the Khazar genes woke up and, well, let Russia fail like Kasparov, etc.
                2. mch1950
                  mch1950 11 May 2013 13: 14 New
                  0
                  For Jews, nationality is determined by the paternal side of the Coens and Levites, and the remaining tribes on the maternal side.
                  Learn materiel. Read the Old Testament.
            3. Atlon
              Atlon 10 May 2013 21: 22 New
              28
              Quote: zart_arn
              To love a country is spread out by hundreds of thousands of its people, it’s not in Russian somehow.

              Not in Russian, it’s to take for granted all that nonsense that we have been fed for the last 20 years! At least half of them repeat like parrots about the "Stalinist camps", about "without trial," and about "millions of repressed." Thank God only half! For, about 5-7 years ago, it was a good 90-95%! It means that something is changing in our brains, and this cannot but rejoice. I can’t admit, I myself so reasoned 10 years ago, embarrassed, and disoriented by the lies that rushed from the screens. But, he began to think, analyze, study and realized that we were just lying. What for? This is another question.
              As for the subject itself, I agree with the author, an abomination. The Soviet text of a moment of silence was not an example more correct.
            4. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 10 May 2013 23: 25 New
              24
              Quote: zart_arn
              To love a country is spread out by hundreds of thousands of its people, it’s not in Russian somehow

              Gnobya ??????????? Under Stalin, the population growth was colossal, people were not afraid to give birth, they were confident in the future, and this just tells Stalin the right behavior, and now, comrades, are we going the right way? ???????????????????????????
            5. Combitor
              Combitor 11 May 2013 02: 56 New
              +3
              zart_arn To love a country is spread out by hundreds of thousands of its people, it’s not in Russian somehow. - This must be addressed primarily to the leader of the current regime.
              Aren't you tired of digging in the bones? Do not touch the holy memory of fallen Warriors. A moment of silence is intended to honor the memory of the dead and dead by SILENCE, and not to carry nonsense approved and paid by the authorities.
              Shame and abomination!
            6. Van
              Van 11 May 2013 14: 18 New
              +3
              Well, if everyone why so believes in this, it means someone has done their vile deed, because even half of all the accusations against Stalin have not been proved by anyone, but only skillfully served to our average person in the form of noodles with skillful seasoning and sauce corroding a weak human brain, which apart from Western perception and urging, he is no longer capable of anything.

              Take at least one example, the debunking of the personality cult of I.V. Stalin by N.S. Khrushchev himself who fought for power by similar methods, and what we will see, he just started all that dirty search company
              compromising materials and dirt that touched on Stalin’s personality and affairs in the slightest degree. But the most interesting thing is that instead of taking and actually revealing the whole truth to people, it has been hidden in the archives and has been kept secret for the time being.
              Therefore, it is accurate to say that “FOR” and “AGAINST” by I.V. Stalin. At the moment, until all the secret archives are opened, I consider it simply an unreasonable chatter or someone’s personal hostility. hi
            7. sashka
              sashka 11 May 2013 16: 23 New
              -1
              Quote: zart_arn
              To love a country is spread out by hundreds of thousands of its people, it’s not in Russian somehow.

              8 seventy thousand. Maybe this is talking about something ... your words. I have nothing to do with it.
          2. YARY
            YARY 10 May 2013 17: 20 New
            71
            I'm deeply lilac about who and how much is in SyShyA, since this gang is not an indicator- (Guantanamo Bay, prisons in Iraq, East Geyropa, torture and bullying in them)
            But be that as it may, sweetheart, there are things which cannot be stolen.
            For twenty years, there has been a bacchanalia of smearing with slops the shrines around which the Russian people were rallied (and WILL BE). It's time to finish it. And saying "finish" I say, give out a ramzule to everyone who dares or dares to utter a peep against the wind.
            And you need to start with those who shit on the air.


            SUSHYA threw hundreds of thousands of its citizens into the camps simply because they were of Japanese descent. WITHOUT COURT.
            Something I did not hear repentant speeches from their politicians?
            1. alex-defensor
              alex-defensor 10 May 2013 17: 33 New
              -45
              Quote: Ardent
              I'm deeply lilac about who and how much is in SyShyA, since this gang is not an indicator


              Somehow it’s not right to relate to the common people of the United States. There are the same people, women, children, they also give birth, love. Yes, they hung noodles on their ears, but that does not make them villains. A gang is not a people, but a global transnational elite. It should be a shame to treat people like this. And at the expense of "plow" ..., the blind are blessedbut the facts, even though they cut eyes, are even a stubborn thing. REPRESSIONS WERE, and our people fought for their homeland, for women and children, for their home ... that's all!

              And then we have people especially didn’t spare, that’s why there were such victims and concentration camps ...
              1. YARY
                YARY 10 May 2013 17: 44 New
                22
                the blind are blessed, but the facts, even though they cut eyes, are stubborn

                alex-defensor
                If you don’t care where to catch lice and where to cook borsch, then learn from those who understand, but you don’t have to defend stupidity, you may not understand your stubbornness.
                On this day, there is no right to speak about such things as it was done! All point.
                1. alex-defensor
                  alex-defensor 10 May 2013 18: 37 New
                  -33
                  Quote: Ardent
                  If you don’t care where to catch lice and where to cook borsch

                  Somehow wrong, to object, starting with an insult ?!
                  Quote: Ardent
                  learn from understanding

                  Studied, believe me .. I studied a lot and not only studied, but also thought, analyzed! But what if those who consider themselves "understanding" are actually deeply mistaken in their "understanding"?
                  Quote: Ardent
                  You may not understand your stubbornness

                  Isn't it like that?
                  Quote: Ardent
                  On this day, there is no right to speak about such things as it was done! All point

                  I think it is right that on that day they also remembered the offended, humiliated, ruined by the regime, putting them on a par with all our heroic people. Some of them could and would become a hero of the war if he had not been killed in the 37th. Now more than ever, we need unity. We must remember all the fallen!

                  I am worried about the growing trend among our people aimed at rehabilitating the personality of Stalin and "whitening" the Stalinist regime. An example is the statement by Kurginyan, Starikov, other public figures ... what to do with this?
                  1. common man
                    common man 10 May 2013 19: 52 New
                    13
                    Quote: alex-defensor
                    I think it is right that on that day they also remembered the offended, humiliated, ruined by the regime, putting them on a par with all our heroic people. Some of them could and would become a hero of the war if he had not been killed in the 37th.

                    Let us at the same time recall the "innocently" killed Kolchak, Trotsky, Old Man Makhno. Someone from the same could become the hero of that war. Then we turn to the people of the Volunteers, the Decembrists. Their children could become heroes. And so on to the archers, hanged by Peter.
                    Why am I doing this? Everything has its time. There is no need to remind us of the Stalinist camps about and without. We remember about them. And then on the "Day of Remembrance of the Victims of Political Repressions," you will have to remember All the Great Patriotic War veterans. “You too could become victims of repressions, but you didn’t because you died for your homeland.” - some kind of idiocy.
                    1. alex-defensor
                      alex-defensor 10 May 2013 20: 05 New
                      -4
                      Quote: man in the street
                      Let us at the same time recall the "innocently" killed Kolchak, Trotsky, Old Man Makhno. Someone from the same could become the hero of that war. Then we turn to the people of the Volunteers, the Decembrists. Their children could become heroes. And so on to the archers, hanged by Peter.

                      1. No need to mock and all under one comb. You are not ashamed to put Kolchak Alexander Vasilievich, a Russian (white) officer, scientist, polar explorer on a par with Makhno and Trotsky on a par. That's where the hatred of everything Russian smelled! Decembrists are also rascals? For what? And what does the time of Peter have to do with it?
                      2. The whole situation with repressions was in many respects connected with a huge threat to the USSR from the side of Western countries and their sabotage activities, so repressed can also be considered fallen because of this confrontation between the Soviet Union and the Imperialists.
                    2. common man
                      common man 10 May 2013 20: 57 New
                      +8
                      Why didn’t Makhno please you? He fought for the peasants, beat the Germans, Petliurists. But Trotsky, too, was among other things a very educated man. And argued with Stalin, not afraid to defend his point of view. But Kolchak, I completely agree with you, only my great-grandfather, Kolchakites shot me in the 18th. Not fair by the way. He was for the people. Therefore, he is for me, (like Stalin for you), a negative hero.
                      But seriously, then All this is to let May 9th remember those who gave their lives and health for the Victory in that terrible war, and October 30th to recall innocently convicted, because unfortunately there weren’t any few.
                    3. alex-defensor
                      alex-defensor 11 May 2013 12: 55 New
                      0
                      Quote: man in the street
                      Why didn’t Makhno please you? He fought for the peasants, beat the Germans, Petliurists. But Trotsky, too, was among other things a very educated man. And he argued with Stalin, was not afraid to defend his point of view.

                      Yes, what are you? Leiba Davidovich Bronstein (Trotsky) simply hated the Russian people, which he didn’t even hide ... and do you compare this person with Kolchak? What was going on on the site? People, what are you?
                    4. common man
                      common man 11 May 2013 16: 35 New
                      +1
                      Quote: alex-defensor
                      and you compare this person with Kolchak?

                      Yes, I did not compare them, dear. Just listed. If in secret, he called the first names that came to mind that were not "friends" of Stalin.
                      Now to the point. Do you know Lev Davidovich so well? Maybe they did a revolution together? Or were in exile? Or, again, again from the books. So they were written under Stalin, but there it was impossible otherwise. According to Kolchak, by the way, the same thing. All from other people's words. Just don’t think that I praise Trotsky or denounce Kolchak. God forbid.
                      It was just that they were bright, extraordinary personalities who left their mark on the history of our country. Therefore, the first came to mind.
                    5. Aleksys2
                      Aleksys2 12 May 2013 02: 52 New
                      +2
                      Quote: alex-defensor
                      Leiba Davidovich Bronstein (Trotsky) simply hated the Russian people, which he didn’t even hide ... and do you compare this person with Kolchak?

                      What was Kolchak tried and shot for? Because he was royal admiral? Not. The Irkutsk Military Revolutionary Committee sentenced the admiral to be shot for organizing military operations against Soviet Russia and mass repressions against civilians and the Red Army.
                      In Yekaterinburg province, one of the 12 provinces controlled by Kolchak, at least 25 thousand people were executed under Kolchak, and about 10% of the two millionth population was outraged. Flogged both men and women and children.
                      The merciless attitude of Kolchak's punishers towards the workers and peasants provoked mass uprisings. As A. L. Litvin notes about Kolchak’s regime, “it’s difficult to talk about supporting his policy in Siberia and the Urals if out of about 400 thousand red partisans of that time, 150 thousand acted against him, and among them 4 — 5% were prosperous peasants, or, as they were then called, kulaks ”
                2. REZMovec
                  REZMovec 10 May 2013 22: 34 New
                  10
                  Alex! Take off the Soviet epaulette, remove the Soviet air defense system from the avatar, then your beloved Kolchak - who has arms on his shoulders in Russian blood - and shut off. A-I-I-th, in the film "Admiral" showed such a good character! But the people, sailor and soldier - bastards, killed admiral officers - not good !!! Read the memories of those who had to face the hordes of this "vaunted scientist-researcher" ... And whose instructions he followed, and with whose weapons he fought against his people ... And what about Peter? So he, like Stalin, in your opinion, ruined hundreds of thousands of Russian people ... And why? Russia had to be raised, Stalin - too, by the way. And do not politicize the situation on such a SACRED HOLIDAY - VICTORY Day. Remember repressions not today - today the ETERNAL MEMORY of the victims of fascism.
                3. Lopatov
                  Lopatov 10 May 2013 22: 39 New
                  +2
                  Quote: REZMovec
                  Alex! Remove the Soviet epaulette, remove the Soviet air defense system from the avatar,


                  wassat This is not a sight. And absolutely not Soviet. Someone indulged in capitalist Photoshop
                4. REZMovec
                  REZMovec 11 May 2013 03: 39 New
                  0
                  Perhaps I was mistaken - the profile picture is too small ...
                5. alex-defensor
                  alex-defensor 11 May 2013 13: 12 New
                  -6
                  Quote: Spade
                  And absolutely not Soviet. Someone indulged in capitalist Photoshop


                  OOOO !!! DAAAA !!! I feel I would have been shot, I would have been the 37th ... Thank God that Russia is not in the hands of such stranglers as all those who justify the Stalinist regime.
                6. mch1950
                  mch1950 11 May 2013 15: 12 New
                  0
                  They could have shot you too, but if your relatives or neighbors needed your room in the communal apartment and they wrote the corresponding denunciation to you without such a document, even then you would not even be interested in the OGPU-NKVD.
            2. alex-defensor
              alex-defensor 11 May 2013 13: 06 New
              -3
              Quote: REZMovec
              Alex! Remove the Soviet epaulette, remove the Soviet air defense system from the avatar

              I do not need to point out, no one gave you that right - this time.
              Not SAM, but self-propelled guns - these are two.

              Do you live in the USA?

              Quote: REZMovec
              your beloved Kolchak - whose hands are on the shoulders in Russian blood - and block it. A-I-I-th, in the film "Admiral" showed such a good character! But the people, sailor and soldier - bastards, killed admiral officers - not good !!!

              I didn’t watch the film, but thanks for the advice, I’ll definitely watch it. However, anti-Russian propaganda is deeply rooted in you ... or maybe it’s not about propaganda, maybe you are distorting Russian history quite consciously?

              Quote: REZMovec
              And what about Peter? So he, like Stalin, in your opinion, ruined hundreds of thousands of Russian people ... And why? Russia had to be raised, Stalin, too, by the way

              So I believe that it is legitimate for Peter the Great to commit these acts. However, you must understand that in those days it was everywhere. No need to compare with the XNUMXth century. You probably wouldn’t talk like that about the state need, if, for example, now, in the interests of building a canal, you would arrest your brother, whom you wouldn’t return alive. What can you say to this, Stalin’s singers? Are you ready to give your relatives to the decay in the name of the construction of the canal, eh?

              How easily we condemn others to death in the name of the "common good." However, usually, people who reason like this will fight even with a child for their life ... INCORRECTLY!
            3. REZMovec
              REZMovec 11 May 2013 14: 57 New
              0
              I do not need to point out, no one gave you that right - this time.
              Not SAM, but self-propelled guns - these are two.
              Do you live in the USA?

              And only the USA can indicate to you ???
              I don’t care, I am a SOVIET MAN! I have never been Russophobe, I am for the fraternal union of the Slavs ... I don’t twist history - I just study more widely than some. And the channel was dug by those who, by the decision of the COURT, went to jail. And there were ten times more criminals there than political ones. I also want to remind you - "he who is not with us is against us." And to paraphrase the dictum of one of your "democrats," Colonel Colt, - "a good enemy is a dead enemy." Do not think that I am bloodthirsty, no. I just don’t want to get a stab in the back - the “fifth column” is not asleep, unfortunately ...
        2. dddym
          dddym 12 May 2013 18: 22 New
          +1
          Attempts were made by legal means to justify the Supreme Ruler of Russia, but in January 1999 Mr. Military Court of the Trans-Baikal Military District declared him not subject to rehabilitationand then the Military Collegium of the Supreme Court of the Russian Federation also did not find grounds for this [8, p. 36].
          Why are you raising Kolchak? When will you calm down? Kolchak slandered so even your “democratic” court did not rehabilitate him.
      2. pavlec007
        pavlec007 10 May 2013 21: 28 New
        16
        Quote: man in the street
        Let us at the same time recall the "innocently" killed Kolchak, Trotsky, Old Man Makhno. Someone from the same could become the hero of that war.

        Well, let's just say that Trotsky was well removed, because when he was appointed chairman of the Military Revolutionary Council, he did not listen to knowledgeable people and did as he saw fit, did not spare people, changed managers to people who were true to himself, even if he was completely zero in military affairs. Well, it’s no secret that Lev Davydovich was against the revival of the economy and industry of Russia and shouted that they were GIVING A WORLD REVOLUTION. And all in order to turn Russia into someone else's raw materials appendage, preferably a Jewish one.
      3. RUS-36
        RUS-36 10 May 2013 23: 41 New
        +1
        100% agree with you.
    2. RUS-36
      RUS-36 10 May 2013 23: 39 New
      +4
      About Trotsky it’s not necessary, it’s that cattle .. Jew’s .. it’s inappropriate to put him in one place with Kolchak ..
  2. Atlon
    Atlon 10 May 2013 21: 42 New
    13
    Quote: alex-defensor
    I am worried about the growing trend among our people aimed at rehabilitating the personality of Stalin and "whitening" the Stalinist regime. An example is the statement by Kurginyan, Starikov, other public figures ... what to do with this?

    It bothers you ... It's good when a person is bothered by something, which means he at least thinks. Just tell me, HOW do you know about the "Stalinist atrocities"? That's real, where from? Have you read the archives? Have you been an eyewitness? Have you talked to eyewitnesses? (how many?). After all, all our “knowledge” about “repression” is gleaned from the cinematic crafts of the last two decades, several dubious television programs, and loud statements by “handshake” liberals. So why do you, as a thinking person, prefer to take a word from dubious sources, instead of trying to figure it out yourself if it "bothers" you?
    1. zart_arn
      zart_arn 10 May 2013 22: 03 New
      -7
      Dear Pavel! I didn’t believe anyone’s word and don’t believe it, about the millions killed during the years of repression too, but hundreds of thousands, alas, were. Near the city there is one beautiful place .. Beautiful, if not for hundreds of graves there, graves of 36 - 38 years of the 20th century. One of many similar on our long-suffering land. And it was discovered by chance, and after only relatives of those killed who put down modest columns as best they could. I looked at photographs of 17-19 year old "enemies of the people" and I was ashamed. For yourself, for your family, for your people. After all, it was by our silence or enthusiastic approval that we admitted or admit a similar attitude towards us. No great idea or great power is worth the lives of those guys (I do not like the word kid, it’s not Russian, abusive).
    2. Atlon
      Atlon 10 May 2013 22: 25 New
      +8
      Quote: zart_arn
      No great idea or great power is worth the lives of those guys

      Emotionally, but unproven. It turns out that you draw conclusions about Stalin’s “atrocities” based on physiognomy ?! belay Your will, sir, but at least it’s strange ...
      And you didn’t answer my questions. And they did not study the documents of those executed, which means that the conversation is useless ...
      Maybe someday, Putin will be blamed for “atrocities” in the fight against terrorists who innocently perished in the “fight for freedom” and were destroyed without trial or investigation ... Perhaps not the best example, I agree. They with arms in their hands oppose themselves to the state. But others are more dangerous ... Nemtsov, Navalny, Kasparov, Sobchak and others like them. This is who it is necessary to destroy, but not! Repression ... What about thieves, bribe takers, saboteurs? Everyone shouts: "Plant Serdyukov!" And this is not repression? And where did you get (from the photographs ?!) that the executed, the angels in the flesh?
    3. zart_arn
      zart_arn 10 May 2013 22: 37 New
      -3
      I personally know some of the repressed (or rather knew) and their relatives. Fortunately, my ancestors in a straight line it famously passed. Tell me, Pavel, have you ever been mistakenly taken by law enforcement agencies? They took me here, poked me in the back of the head with a gun, though they sorted it out and even apologized. And if, then, the trio would fall under trial? No, Pavel, we no longer need such an “order”, and the current younger generation will not allow it, it is much more dogmatic than us.
    4. Atlon
      Atlon 10 May 2013 22: 44 New
      11
      Quote: zart_arn
      and the current younger generation will not allow it, it is much more pragmatic than us.

      Oh, I doubt it ... They have nothing but “yaga” (alcoholic drink “Jaguar”) in their head, “Vkontakte” page, and a mishmash of false information provided by liberal media, nothing ... Neither principles nor aspirations (except as a "beautiful" life "), neither selflessness, nor love for the motherland ... Generation" nekst "is a torn piece. True, not all. But nevertheless ... These are ideal slaves, like in the USA. Eat, shit , and have fun. And no matter who touches. So in which case, the race will run to “knock” on each other, just to not get into circulation.
    5. zart_arn
      zart_arn 10 May 2013 23: 07 New
      -4
      The education and culture of today's young people, of course, let us down, but the ability to think soberly and analyze cannot be taken away from them. We were the zombie robots, not them. Not all and not all schools, but an increasing number of students are drawn to knowledge, as we used to call "planers." For example, I at one time only at the university became a “plane”. The current many began to understand the value of knowledge from childhood. The country that was under the Soviet system, unfortunately, will never be. I think that something will work out in today's youth. We will not interfere with them and drag them into the past, enough revolutions from us.
    6. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 10 May 2013 23: 44 New
      +4
      Quote: zart_arn
      The current many began to understand the value of knowledge from childhood. The country that was under the Soviet system, unfortunately, will never be. I think that something will work out in today's youth. We will not interfere with them and drag them into the past, enough revolutions from us.

      only you forgot that knowledge is now not the same, duped knowledge. Yes, and testing knowledge is not so hot, one exam which is worth
    7. antidote
      antidote 11 May 2013 13: 07 New
      +2
      My youngest son is 20 years old. Since childhood, I raised him as a patriot, but thinking. I never imposed my relationship to IW on Stalin. I myself just recently decided exactly. So he read a lot, comparing, thinking, firmly became the defender of Soviet history, led by Stalin and is actively fighting on the Internet in various forums. And I think, God forbid, the war will begin, he will be among the first to go to the front. And your children, if you have a line, it seems to me, will be hiding in the basement.
  3. Kaa
    Kaa 10 May 2013 23: 41 New
    +8
    Quote: Atlon
    No principles, no aspirations (except for a "beautiful" life "), no selflessness, no love for the Motherland ... Generation of" next "is a torn piece. True, not all
    In Zaporozhye on the 9th, I would not say that. Fashion (bad and alien) can and should be easily replaced by truth. The photo does not show the real scale, but I was there, these children spoke about the war in their own words, not in cliches, quite clearly and in tune with the statements of the majority on this site ... which, alas, cannot be said about the Center and the West ... "This morning in Zaporozhye, more than 35 thousand citizens took part in a parade of generations dedicated to the 68th anniversary of the Victory in order to commemorate the dead Soviet soldiers and pay tribute to the living heroes.
    Before the start of the solemn procession, the leaders of the city and Zaporizhzhya region laid flowers on the mass grave on the Walk of Fame.
    After that, the parade was launched from Shevchenko Boulevard to the port named after Lenin. The procession was led by a column of retro cars from the Great Patriotic War. As the head of the retro club Dmitry Poznyak told the “New Region”, this year the record number of cars is participating at the festival - about 30.
    Veterans, combatants rode on open platforms. During the movement, the Cossacks planted their children to them. And the kids presented spring flowers to former soldiers.
    Following the participants of the Second World War, representatives of the authorities marched. The archbishop of Melitopol and Zaporizhzhya Luka also took part in the parade.
    At the end of the column were the townspeople. They carried posters with the names of the districts of the city and various posters with slogans.
    Among the most popular slogans on this day was "No to neo-fascism."
    The threat of modern fascism was also announced by the head of the Zaporizhzhya region, Alexander Peklushenko.
    “Some politicians want to rename May 9 as a day of sorrow, a day of remembrance, not Victory. Because they did not want this Victory, - the governor noted. - Not to tell them how to name streets and what to do with monuments. Not a single street will be renamed in Zaporizhzhya region, not a single monument will be demolished. And no matter how these disguise themselves, not one of their boots will cross the borders of our region! We won the war, but we still need to achieve peace. "
    NR2.ru: http://www.nr2.ru/zaporozhia/437856.html
  4. Kaa
    Kaa 10 May 2013 23: 46 New
    +2
    Quote: Kaa
    More than 35 thousand citizens took part in the parade of generations dedicated to the 68th anniversary of the Victory
    Sorry, some kind of glitch, the photo does not cling ...
  5. Kaa
    Kaa 10 May 2013 23: 51 New
    +4
    Here is a video report
  6. CTEPX
    CTEPX 11 May 2013 11: 05 New
    +2
    Dear!
    If there are photos
    Quote: zart_arn
    and after only relatives of those killed who put down modest columns as best they could. Looked at photos of 17-19 year old "enemies of the people"
    on the “columns of 36-38 years” - this is a remake. Who has that kind of money when we live in poverty? That's right for you, hamsters. And they are allocated to pinch and humiliate us. Be proud that they are from Russian budget?
    So this is temporary)). And your time ends)).
  7. Egoza
    Egoza 10 May 2013 22: 13 New
    11
    Quote: Atlon
    After all, all our "knowledge" about "repression" is gleaned from the cinematic crafts of the last two decades, several dubious television programs, and loud statements by "handshake" liberalists.

    I support, Pavel! Moreover, I believe that such a text was approved at the very top, because otherwise, during the Parades and Celebrations of May 9, portraits of Comrade I.V. Stalin! And were they? From the official design of the square, streets, etc.? And so - since they said that there were "victims in the Stalinist camps", that's why there are no portraits. Cunning up there. Oh how cunning! Afraid of recognition and howling from Europe and the USA. When will they begin to tell the truth without looking at these liberals?
  8. Kaa
    Kaa 11 May 2013 00: 09 New
    +4
    Quote: Egoza
    it would be necessary to hang portraits of comrade I.V. Stalin!
    We had dozens of them in our hands ...
  • dddym
    dddym 11 May 2013 13: 29 New
    +1
    Talk about "unity" and the oil itself into the fire - here the majority of members of the forum. they honor their history and do not like de-Stalinizers, and you are talking about unity - you are the first and go to the left column.
  • andrre122
    andrre122 10 May 2013 17: 50 New
    11
    "For twenty years, there has been a bacchanalia of smearing with slops the shrines around which the Russian people have been (and can) rally. It’s time to end this"
    Another victim of desovetization.
    One has already agreed.
    The President called on UPA and Red Army veterans to reconcile.

    http://news2000.com.ua/news/sobytija/v-ukraine/229431

    People, people. You can’t alter the Anglo-Saxon nature. Explain to the Indians.
    1. alex-defensor
      alex-defensor 10 May 2013 18: 47 New
      +6
      Quote: andrre122
      The President called on UPA and Red Army veterans to reconcile.
      http://news2000.com.ua/news/sobytija/v-ukraine/229431


      I ask you, to be more precise, We are still in Russian language, we have the President - Putin, and you write about Yanukovych, so you had to clearly write.

      By the way, the question is, will you hate the grandson (or son) of a German soldier who fought against the USSR? ME NOT!
      1. Setrac
        Setrac 10 May 2013 22: 07 New
        +4
        Quote: alex-defensor
        By the way, the question is, will you hate the grandson (or son) of a German soldier who fought against the USSR? ME NOT!

        The time will come and this "grandson" of the fascist will come to Russia with weapons as his ancestor. so we will hate it.
        1. alexandr00070
          alexandr00070 10 May 2013 23: 56 New
          +2
          Quote: Setrac
          The time will come and this "grandson" of the fascist will come to Russia with weapons as his ancestor. so we will hate it.

          What was, as we remember from history, more than once
  • 4fedor1
    4fedor1 10 May 2013 18: 28 New
    +1
    and now we’re especially “sorry”!
  • nickname 1 and 2
    nickname 1 and 2 10 May 2013 18: 56 New
    -1
    Quote: alex-defensor
    . It should be a shame to treat people like this. And on the account of "plow" ... our blind people are blessed, but the facts, even though they cut our eyes, are a stubborn thing. REPRESSIONS WERE, and our people fought for our country


    Excuse me?
    I don’t remember that anyone perceived ...... as repression! The people did not understand or thought that there were apparently some reasons!

    And that's why:
    If you understand what you are doing - you will be careful and careful. So? And most fell for negligence in speech! For a joke, for a mistake, etc. When it's possible? When you feel like an "angel"!
    If this is at the front then: the "nerves" were to blame
    and the Germans! The Germans worked very hard on the nerves and mental state of our army.
    And the same special officers were under the same pressure but also plus their leadership i.e. double.

    Question to the manual i.e. to the CPSU and the Politburo!

    Someone should have realized that THIS BATTLE OF TANKS DO NOT STOP! besides knowing that these tanks are not penetrable. Thank God that the Molotov cocktail was not long in coming.

    The complete lack of information is one of the main reasons for the complexity of the defense and the very arrests and that Kolyma!


    DO NOT NEED TO TRY (APPLY) EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENED TO OUR UNIVERSITY!

    That's when the guys - Georgians drapanul at 08.08.
    then they experienced in microdose what was happening
    with our fighters but 100 times more.
    on the lock = these were not at all such advanced people. Another order of magnitude = they never thought of themselves in this state.

    And those who came to Kolyma did not know what horror could befall him!
    He treated his actions with a brow!
  • borisural
    borisural 10 May 2013 20: 01 New
    +4
    And you, that you are not aware of the fact that the USA has not existed and isn’t normal, or as you say “simple. People.” T.K. The state itself was created by thieves, bandits, etc. etc. Those who, having learned about new lands and wealth in their bowels, fled from justice from the Old World! They have genes to kill and steal, which they do all over the world and can be stopped only by RUSSIA as in 1945. fascists !!!
    1. bezumnyiPIT
      bezumnyiPIT 10 May 2013 20: 29 New
      -8
      The work of stereotypes is visible
  • Setrac
    Setrac 10 May 2013 21: 14 New
    +3
    Quote: alex-defensor
    Somehow it’s not right to relate to the common people of the United States. There are the same people, women, children, they also give birth, love.

    And these ordinary people, or their sons, husbands, fathers, killed, robbed, raped in captured Germany. They (Americans) blame us (Russians) for their crimes!
    And nobody in the USSR (in contrast to the West) was not imprisoned without trial!
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 10 May 2013 21: 41 New
    +2
    Quote: alex-defensor
    And we didn’t spare people at that time, that's why there were such victims and there were concentration camps ...

    What does it mean you didn’t spare because there were such victims?
    in numbers you can indicate who did not regret and what were the victims in connection with the lack of pity ?!
    As for the "concentration camps", I can say one thing: I have always been extremely negative about the article "on three ears of wheat", but exactly until I moved to the land to live
  • Georgs
    Georgs 13 May 2013 11: 50 New
    0
    Quote: alex-defensor
    Somehow it’s not right to relate to the common people of the United States. There are the same people, women, children, they also give birth, love. Yes, they hung noodles on their ears, but that does not make them villains. A gang is not a people, but a global transnational elite. It should be a shame to treat people like this.

    Oh, let’s run we will love the simple people of the United States, sharply and decisively declare them brothers forever, as they once enrolled in the Chinese brothers. We will convey to them through the Great Water the international proletarian solidarity and merge in some unified impulse.
    But now the question arises: who is serving in the American army? Transnational Elite? It’s personally she will hide to tear us to the British flag, what should happen? Or are they just plain American guys? By the way, these simple American guys cannot be propagandized by the ideas of world internationalism and brotherhood - they will not accept this. In them, the thought organ begins in the esophagus and ends in the rectum. Checked.
  • andrre122
    andrre122 10 May 2013 17: 33 New
    +4
    "For twenty years, there has been a bacchanalia of smearing with slops the shrines around which the Russian people have been (and can) rally. It’s time to end this"
    Correct words.
    1. antidote
      antidote 11 May 2013 13: 18 New
      +1
      By the way, not 20 years, but much more. In 1956, Khrushchev began to shed mud on Stalin’s IW and tried to put pressure on the military commanders with the aim of joining him.
  • rolik
    rolik 11 May 2013 02: 06 New
    +4
    Quote: Ardent
    Something I did not hear repentant speeches from their politicians?

    And no one will ever hear them. A nation, if we can call a nation a criminal rabble, which began its historical life with genocide, and which constantly develops within itself contempt and disdain for other nations, cannot itself realize its inferiority and the parasitic nature of its existence. Therefore, they will never repent, but will seek excuses for their actions: Hiroshima (it was necessary to stop the Japanese), Iraq (weapons of mass destruction), Grenada (they simply were bad guys) and so on and on.
  • S_mirnov
    S_mirnov 10 May 2013 17: 30 New
    24
    And under Stalin, criminals were sitting, and it was precisely by the decision of the COURT. Only the courts then were incorruptible. Only now, who of the parents will tell the grandson that he cut him up so that he was put in prison? Hence the heaps of "innocent." The percentage of erroneous and knowingly false sentences should also not be discounted, but he was less sure than now.
    And in some ways the author is wrong. Under Stalin, the people sat LESS than now and much smaller and the crime rate was much lower.
    1. alex-defensor
      alex-defensor 10 May 2013 19: 12 New
      -9
      Quote: S_mirnov
      And under Stalin, criminals were sitting and it was by the decision of the COURT. Only the courts then were incorruptible

      There were no ships, the NKVD officers decided, in triples. This is a historical fact.
      Quote: S_mirnov
      Only now, who of the parents will tell the grandson that he cut him up so that he was put in prison?

      So you can water everyone with slops, whitewashing the regime, but I rely on a specific example from my family, and I don’t judge you, indiscriminately and without knowing, walking like that, from the shoulder ... to take and insult a person. What do you know about my family, huh?

      Our judges divorced ... and who are the judges?
      1. vjatsergey
        vjatsergey 10 May 2013 21: 19 New
        +3
        we have divorced lawyers ... and who are the lawyers?
      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 10 May 2013 21: 44 New
        +2
        Quote: alex-defensor
        There were no ships, the NKVD officers decided, in triples. This is a historical fact.

        Well, in the first place this was not so long, and in the second you can describe the actions of triples?
      3. Atlon
        Atlon 10 May 2013 22: 02 New
        +2
        Quote: alex-defensor
        There were no ships, the NKVD officers decided, in triples. This is a historical fact.

        A loud statement ... Well, you would at least understand the materiel. THREE WERE INCLUDED:
        1. head of the regional (regional) department of the NKVD,
        2. Secretary of the regional party committee
        3. The prosecutor of the area.
        In addition, the "troika" operated in the USSR only ... from 1937 to 1938. This is a HISTORICAL FACT! So talking about lawless repression is at least not true.
      4. antidote
        antidote 11 May 2013 13: 21 New
        +1
        There were courts, and temporarily there were triples. You are like a true liberal, say one thing, forgetting to talk about another. Typical liberal chatter, saying, without proving anything.
  • aleshka
    aleshka 10 May 2013 17: 33 New
    16
    you would call now in any zone, and the convicts would tell you that they are all innocently convicted and they’re not at all for nothing !!! do not confuse one thing with a tram rail!
    1. alex-defensor
      alex-defensor 10 May 2013 20: 10 New
      -6
      Quote: Alesha
      you would call now in any zone, and the convicts would tell you that they are all innocently convicted and they’re not at all for nothing !!! do not confuse one thing with a tram rail!


      Do not confuse just the same for you. Already in this matter, I, as a practicing lawyer, know a lot. I will not ask the convict, I will study the materials of his case. My great-grandfather for a long time sought the rehabilitation of his executed brother, he did!
      1. antidote
        antidote 11 May 2013 13: 24 New
        +1
        By the way, noticed if a lawyer. it’s usually not a patriot, but rather a liberal. The most important lawyer Zhirinovsky is worth it. And all sorts of Padva, bulk and so forth
    2. vjatsergey
      vjatsergey 10 May 2013 21: 25 New
      13
      here I can authoritatively confirm (I served two terms myself, though a very long time ago) - for all the time I have not met a single person who would say that he is sitting behind a case.
  • valokordin
    valokordin 10 May 2013 18: 05 New
    29
    Quote: alex-defensor
    During the Stalinist regime, they planted without trial. There were a lot of innocents.

    They planted only in court, in the tribunal, in the court of triples and with the investigation. And your argument is sucked from an anti-Soviet and anti-Stalinist source. So now they are sitting at 140 million people more than under the USSR. repression affected both political opponents and ineffective managers. Chubais would not be given the opportunity to brazenly steal under the guise of project inefficiency. Serdyukov would not be allowed to ruin the army effectively, like Tukhachevsky’s company. Traitors Rezun, Kalugin, foreign agents under Stalin would pinched. So don’t cry for the repressed innocently, as they cried for Solzhenitsyn, who in his poem ruined the Soviet soldiers, calling them rapists, murderers and looters.
    1. DeerIvanovich
      DeerIvanovich 10 May 2013 20: 36 New
      +2
      maybe three zeros less? laughing
      1. Setrac
        Setrac 10 May 2013 22: 13 New
        +3
        Quote: DeerIvanovich
        maybe three zeros less?

        Yes, with a figure there is some kind of cold. Maybe valokordin means that we are all prisoners in Russia?
        1. DeerIvanovich
          DeerIvanovich 11 May 2013 11: 44 New
          +2
          no, he meant that the population of our country is 140 billion, and the Chinese and Indians with their 2 billion before us like before the moon laughing
  • antiaircrafter
    antiaircrafter 10 May 2013 18: 49 New
    +9
    Quote: alex-defensor
    I have a repressed family.

    And nobody was sitting with me.
    It was evident there was nothing.
    1. bezumnyiPIT
      bezumnyiPIT 10 May 2013 20: 31 New
      +1
      My great-grandfather was planted on the other hand, but he told on his collective farm that money can be earned at the railway station, and that they give out food there
    2. vjatsergey
      vjatsergey 10 May 2013 21: 31 New
      +7
      I didn’t have anyone sitting in the days of Stalin. I already wrote somewhere - all from our village at that time put two (for a fight and theft from a general store), and the village is large.
    3. antidote
      antidote 11 May 2013 13: 26 New
      +2
      Nobody was sitting at the same time with me. Not a grandfather during the war was captured and after his release he was not imprisoned
  • Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 10 May 2013 19: 13 New
    11
    Our leading designers, such as Korolev, also sat ... Say, they sat at work? Now they are also sitting in the USA, but CRIMINALS AND BY THE RESOLUTION OF THE COURT !!!

    Only criminals convicted by the people's courts sat in the USSR. When Korolev was sitting, he was not yet a leading designer, but if he was? Which of these?
    The law is one for all.
    And about the USA you are mistaken, there only 5% of cases are considered in jury trials, the rest are sentenced by triples (judge, lawyer, prosecutor) by agreement of the parties, no one is interested in the guilt and opinion of the defendant.
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 10 May 2013 19: 17 New
      -5
      Quote: Corsair5912
      Only criminals convicted by the people's courts sat in the USSR. When Korolev was sitting, he was not yet a leading designer, but if he was? Which of these?

      You are completely off topic. And therefore write full game.
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 10 May 2013 19: 27 New
        +8
        That you are not in the subject and are talking nonsense, the law is one for all.
        Or do you think that Korolev should not have been sitting for embezzlement of budget funds for other purposes?
        1. Lopatov
          Lopatov 10 May 2013 19: 37 New
          -6
          Whose law is it? The law of Kostikov, who denounced the post of head of the research institute and the title of Hero of Soc. Work? After all, Glushko and Korolev were still lucky, the others were shot.

          Is this a "law" for you?
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 10 May 2013 21: 47 New
            +9
            Quote: Spade
            After all, Glushko and Korolev were lucky, the others were shot

            Do you know what they were sitting for and what was the result of their landing?

            today that practice wouldn’t hurt, you look at Chubais’s nanotechnology and yielded results sochi would be 10 times cheaper, and even apples could be grown on Mars
            1. Lopatov
              Lopatov 10 May 2013 22: 15 New
              -9
              For what? Below is the indictment. Result? Yes, no. Wasted time.
              Today, this practice would lead to a collapse altogether — to plant those who really do something just so that a person who throws himself in a warm chair will get it — a lot of overkill.

              If you do not know, Korolev is the one who launched a person into space
            2. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 11 May 2013 00: 07 New
              +5
              Quote: Spade
              If you do not know, Korolev is the one who launched a person into space

              do not consider all idiots
            3. REZMovec
              REZMovec 11 May 2013 17: 46 New
              -1
              And it never occurred to anyone that specialists and designers were simply isolated from German intelligence agents ??? And so they were able to surprise the Fritz with new weapons?
        2. Aleksys2
          Aleksys2 11 May 2013 09: 22 New
          +1
          Quote: Spade
          The law of Kostikov, who denounced the post of head of the research institute and the title of Hero of Soc. Work?

          “In the 23 volume of the Great Soviet Encyclopedia (second edition), S. 126 contains an article about Andrei Grigoryevich Kostikov, who received high awards“ for great merit in creating a new type of weapon. ” Since we worked together for a number of years with A. G. Kostikov and we know for certain his role in creating a new type of weapon, we consider it our duty to report this.
          In the 1937-1938 years, when our Motherland was going through difficult days of mass repressions of Soviet personnel, Kostikov, who worked as an ordinary engineer at the institute, made great efforts to arrest and condemn the main leadership of this institute, including the main author of a new type, as enemies of the people. weapons, a talented scientist-designer, deputy director for science G.E. Langemak. Thus, Kostikov turned out to be the head of the institute and the “author” of this new type of weapon, for which he was immediately generously awarded at the beginning of the war ...
          Previously repressed employees of the institute are now rehabilitated, some of them, including G.E. Langemak, are posthumous.
          Please take into account the above when preparing the “Biographical Dictionary of the Figures of Natural Science and Technology” and the next edition of TSB.
          Corresponding Member of the USSR Academy of Sciences, Hero of Socialist Labor
          Korolev S.P.
          Corresponding Member of the USSR Academy of Sciences, Hero of Socialist Labor
          Glushko V.P. "

          Now a few dates:
          1. Repressions against the leading specialists of the RNII were an element of the avalanche-like process that hit the country. Shortly before this, the NKVD leadership changed (Yezhov replaced the executed Yagoda), which increased the atmosphere of fear and suspicion. And, as a result, the performers "competed in overfulfillment" of the planned figures.
          2. 27 September 1938 g. Held a hearing, at which C.P. The Queen was convicted at 10 years of camps with a loss of rights for 5 years. It should be noted that S.P. The queen was charged during the investigation under Article 58, paragraphs 7 and 11, and in the indictment, paragraphs 8 and 17 of the same article were unexpectedly added to him.
          3. 13 June 1939 g. Sentence in the case of S.P. The queen was canceled and the case was sent to the NKVD for further investigation. On 28 on May 1940, an additional investigation was completed.
          A special meeting under the NKVD, chaired by L.P. Beria 10 July 1940 g. Sentenced in absentia S.P. Queen to 8 years of forced labor camps. In September 1940 in relation to S.P. The queen was revised a preventive measure and determined serving a sentence in a special unit of the NKVD ("sharashka"), where he could work in his specialty.
        3. dddym
          dddym 11 May 2013 13: 45 New
          +1
          the law is clear to you - the privatization of all the wealth that the Russian people built and the law by which you do not have the right to dig a meter deep, but foreign firms not only dig the 1 meter, but simply dig it, almost everywhere they want and to arbitrarily large depths. And then you have to pay the costs. The law is when kindergartens are given to offices and queues in d / s by 30000 to a millionth city. Very legitimate Serdyukov bleeds the army, everything is so legal ....
      2. svp67
        svp67 10 May 2013 19: 37 New
        +4
        Quote: Corsair5912
        ... the law is one for all.
        Or do you think that Korolev should not have been sitting for embezzlement of budget funds for other purposes?


        CLOSING INDICTMENT
        on the trail, case No. 19908
        charged by the Queen
        Sergei Pavlovich 58-7; 58-11 of the Criminal Code of the RSFSR
        On June 28 of the 1938 of the NKVD of the USSR for belonging to the Trotskyist, wrecking organization operating in the research institute No. 3 (NKB of the USSR) 21 was arrested and prosecuted by a former engineer of the said institute Korolev Sergey Pavlovich.
        During the investigation, Korolev pleaded guilty to having been involved in the Trotskyite-wrecking organization in 1935 by the former technical director of the research institute No. 3 Langemak (convicted) of 22.
        In the course of the investigation in the Langemak case, he was not specifically questioned about the Queen and about the latter’s participation in the anti-Soviet organization showed that he knew about it from the words of Kleimenov, the former director of the Research Institute-3 (convicted) (ld.41).
        On the instructions of the anti-Soviet organization, Korolev carried out wrecking work to disrupt the development and commissioning of new types of weapons by the Red Army (ln 21-35, 53-55; 66-67, 238-239).
        By the decision of the Military College of the Supreme Court of the USSR of 27 on September 1938, Korolev was sentenced to 10 years of imprisonment.
        13 On June 1939, the Plenum of the Supreme Court of the USSR overturned the verdict of the Military College of the Supreme Court of the USSR, and the investigation case for Korolev was transferred to a new investigation (see separate folder of the trial) .283
      3. svp67
        svp67 10 May 2013 19: 38 New
        +4
        During the re-investigation, Korolev showed that the testimony given to them during the investigation in 1938 was untrue and false (ld 153-156).
        However, Korolev is exposed in the case materials of the investigation and documentary evidence that:
        In 1936, he led the development of a powder winged torpedo; knowing in advance that the main parts of this torpedo — devices with photocells — for controlling a torpedo and aiming it at a target cannot be manufactured by the central laboratory of the 23 wire communication, Korolev worked hard to develop the missile part of this torpedo in 2 versions in order to load the institute with unnecessary work .
        As a result of this test, the four torpedoes built by the Royal showed their complete unsuitability, which caused damage to the state in the amount of 120 000 rubles and delayed the development of other, more relevant topics (ld 250-251).
        In 1937, during the development of the side compartment of the torpedo (winged), he made a wrecking calculation, as a result of which the research work on the creation of the torpedo was disrupted (ld 23-24, 256).
        Artificially delayed the production and testing of defense facilities (object 212) (ld 21, 54, 255).
        On the basis of the above
        accused
        Korolev Sergey Pavlovich, 1906 year of birth, harvest. mountains Zhytomyr, Russian, city of the USSR, non-partisan, prior to arrest - engineer NII-3 NKB USSR,
        in that:
        from 1935 of the year he was a member of the Trotskyist wrecker organization, on the instructions of which he conducted criminal work at the NII-3 to disrupt the development and commissioning of new types of weapons, i.e. in crimes of Article.Article. 58-7, 58-11 of the Criminal Code of the RSFSR.
        He pleaded guilty, but subsequently refused his testimony.
        It is exposed by testimonies: Kleimenov, Langemak, Glushko; witness statements; Smirnov, Rokhmachev, Kosyatov, Shitov, Efremov, Bukin, Dushkin and acts of expert commissions.
        The case on charges of Korolyov should be forwarded to the Prosecutor's Office of the USSR for jurisdiction.
        The indictment was drawn up on 28 on May 1940 in Moscow.
        Investigator of the investigation department of the State Political Administration of the NKVD of the USSR ml. State Security Lieutenant Ryabov.
        Pom. beg. Sequentially, the State Institution of the NKVD of the USSR State Security Lieutenant Libenson.

        "I agree". The beginning afterwards, the State Security Service of the NKVD of the USSR Major of State Security Wlodzimirsky.
        "Approving." Deputy beg. Major Economic Security Nasedkin, Main Economic Directorate of the USSR.
        26 May 1940 g

        And you think that everything is fine here?
        1. Corsair5912
          Corsair5912 10 May 2013 21: 42 New
          +7
          And what is not normal here? Korolev was tried for misuse of budget funds, he pleaded guilty, in addition, there are testimonies from competent experts:
          In 1936, he led the development of a powder winged torpedo; knowing in advance that the main parts of this torpedo — devices with photocells — for controlling a torpedo and aiming it at a target cannot be manufactured by the central laboratory of the 23 wire communication, Korolev worked hard to develop the missile part of this torpedo in 2 versions in order to load the institute with unnecessary work .
          As a result of this test, four torpedoes built by the Royal showed their complete unsuitability, which caused damage to the state in the amount of 120 rubles and delayed the development of other, more relevant topics (ld 000-250)

          If at my work I start developing projects that have no prospects for implementation and spend the money, the smallest companies will immediately fire me, or they will even recover the wasted money through the court and can easily put me in prison.
          1. Lopatov
            Lopatov 10 May 2013 22: 25 New
            -4
            The Germans created an analogue of what Korolyov worked on in 1944. Thanks to the valiant authorities for not allowing cruise missiles to appear in the USSR before the war
          2. Corsair5912
            Corsair5912 11 May 2013 16: 51 New
            +2
            MLRS or Guards mortar "Katyusha" is also a powder rocket, they were successfully used by Soviet aircraft. The Germans did not have anything like this, and their cruise powder rockets were 100 times more expensive than Soviet wingless ones, had a very low percentage of hits, because of those same control devices with photocells and had no significant effect on the results of military operations.
          3. Lopatov
            Lopatov 11 May 2013 18: 20 New
            -1
            And the creator of these "powder rockets, which aviation has successfully used" since Khalkhin-Gol, Langemak-was shot after the investigation in this case. Do you know about this?

            Due to Korolev’s conviction, they stopped working on cruise missiles, which they could have completed in five years. They stopped work on a jet plane, which could have appeared earlier than the Germans; by the time of the arrest, they were completing the construction of a prototype.

            That's it.

            Quote: Corsair5912
            The Germans didn’t have anything like that,

            N-yes ... They would write better "I don’t know anything about the Germans." Would read something, learned a materiel ...
        2. 3 inches.
          3 inches. 13 May 2013 20: 10 New
          0
          nonsense. Someone forgets that the Germans were a colossal scientific and production abyss between us. German laboratories and institutes exceeded us completely. It was simply because they existed much longer than ours. At that time, the German research base was the best in the world. Ours KB and NII counted a maximum of 15-20 years of its existence. And then the KGB security officers ...
      4. svp67
        svp67 10 May 2013 22: 38 New
        -1
        Quote: Corsair5912
        If at my work I start developing projects that have no prospects for implementation


        On 217 missiles, stabilization and control in flight, as well as actuation of fuses, were to be carried out by telemechanical devices when flying missiles in a light beam from a searchlight illuminating the target. All rockets were launched without explosives. The highest lift height reached by the rocket was 1000 m at a range of 2500-3000 m. It should be noted that stable flight in the launch plane was achieved only in a few individual cases at a path length of no more than 1000 m and up to a height of 400-500 m. Further, with increasing flight speed and the angle of elevation, the autopilots did not hold the rocket, and it began to “loop”, make steep turns with a climb, and finally turned into a drop. Firing accuracy tests failed. The missile part at that time worked satisfactorily, the questions were mainly about the control system

        That is, Korolev brought the "missile" part of the Kyrgyz Republic. And he did this not as on OWN initiative. For me, all the “fault” is that Tukhachevsky was the customer and curator of these projects
  • Setrac
    Setrac 10 May 2013 22: 15 New
    +3
    Quote: Spade
    You are completely off topic. And therefore write full game.

    Those who planted were in the subject, so there was no need to justify the criminals.
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 10 May 2013 22: 32 New
      0
      But what about. A state security lieutenant with three classes of education was much more rocket-savvy than any Korolev there.
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 11 May 2013 16: 59 New
        -1
        State security officers had at least 7 classes and plus a special school for police and state security officers, which was at the level of higher education.
        To understand complex scientific problems, the Soviet special services and the police turned to highly qualified experts. The state security lieutenant did not need to know dozens of sciences and conduct expert examinations himself.
        1. Lopatov
          Lopatov 11 May 2013 18: 22 New
          -1
          The “highly qualified expert" guys with seven education classes chose the one who wrote the denunciation - Kostikov.
        2. Corsair5912
          Corsair5912 11 May 2013 18: 46 New
          -1
          Who cares who wrote the denunciation? This has absolutely no effect on sentencing. And the experts are appointed by the court.
          By the way, all the NKVD officers who were involved in this case were convicted, executed or received long sentences.
  • svp67
    svp67 10 May 2013 23: 19 New
    +1
    Quote: Setrac
    Those who planted were in the subject, so there was no need to justify the criminals.

    The fact of squandering money could be proved without the "removal" of the jaw of the Queen ...
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 11 May 2013 17: 02 New
      0
      And why did you decide that the NKVD officers removed the jaw to Korolev?
      He himself never said that.
  • antidote
    antidote 11 May 2013 13: 28 New
    -1
    But he was definitely not the lead designer
  • Zerstorer
    Zerstorer 10 May 2013 19: 57 New
    14
    And now many unjustly convicted people are sitting. The question is that the "bloody Stalinist regime" defended the independence of our country and built a great power. And with today's "rulers," we will soon not just get on our knees, but already get up with cancer with all the ensuing consequences.
  • fokino1980
    fokino1980 10 May 2013 20: 15 New
    -8
    Are you sure about this ??? wink
  • bezumnyiPIT
    bezumnyiPIT 10 May 2013 20: 24 New
    +3
    Your family was personally judged by Stalin, And the NKVDeshnik, who sent you to the camp in vain, Aga-aga
  • ramzes1776
    ramzes1776 10 May 2013 20: 30 New
    +9
    Quote: alex-defensor
    Now they are also sitting in the USA, but CRIMINALS AND BY THE RESOLUTION OF THE COURT !!!

    Amerovsky court is the fairest court in the world lol .Do not tell respected. Judging by the decisions made regarding the murderers of Russian adoptive children, these courts are so "fair." If these were American children, the sentences were much harsher. Double standards in AI rule in all instances negative
    1. antidote
      antidote 11 May 2013 13: 32 New
      +1
      The court is very righteous with them, but Bout’s landing says a lot
  • mbr0969
    mbr0969 10 May 2013 20: 59 New
    +3
    They didn’t lie in the USSR without trial or investigation; you mixed up with Guantanomo. And the special triples were so under Stolypin.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 10 May 2013 21: 37 New
    +3
    Quote: alex-defensor
    During the Stalinist regime, they planted without trial. There were a lot of innocents.

    where you read this nonsense?
    no matter what kind of investigation was conducted, and what about the completely innocent, unfortunately, we will never know when
  • Nick
    Nick 10 May 2013 23: 15 New
    +7
    Quote: alex-defensor
    During the Stalinist regime, they planted without trial. There were a lot of innocents. I have a repressed family. A patriot is one who loves his homeland, what does Stalin have to do with it?

    I will answer the question with a question, and where does Stalin? Mass repressions were organized by the regional elite in the field, in response to an attempt by I.V. Stalin's democratic reforms, which included the equalization of all classes of rights, alternative elections to Soviet authorities, etc. The so-called old guard, consisting mainly of not-too-educated participants in the civil war, trying to protect their privileges and rights to power structures, realizing that they would not go through alternative democratic elections, announced the intensification of the class struggle and began mass repressions .. .
    In the end, Stalin managed to remove the old Bolsheviks from power, and in 1939 the repression almost stopped.
    Do not repeat liberal cliches, archives are declassified, analyze the facts and draw conclusions.
    1. antidote
      antidote 11 May 2013 13: 42 New
      +3
      I give an example: the actions of Goloshchekin in Kazakhstan, which organized the genocide of the local population (and not only Kazakhs). Mr. Oz finished. Peredrast and a sadist. Personally shot the Tsar’s family.
      In 1939 he was shot. When Beria.
  • alexandr00070
    alexandr00070 10 May 2013 23: 20 New
    +5
    Quote: alex-defensor
    During the Stalinist regime, they planted without trial. There were a lot of innocents. I have a repressed family.

    You poorly know the essence of the matter, all the saddles are decided by a court, another question is how the decision was made and whether Stalin himself was to blame for the many landings. Stalin decided to plant your relatives, or there were some other people (neighbors) who were crouching in their apartment, the workplace of your relatives. Or for whom it was just a toad that worked. Or the whole thing is in the surname (if the surname is used in NIKE, then it was difficult to avoid repressions with the surname DEFENSE)
  • lyuboyan
    lyuboyan 11 May 2013 02: 03 New
    +2
    In your opinion, it turns out that now only criminals are sitting, and at that time they were sitting, exclusively, innocent. You either do not know anything, or you are lying. And the trial was .and the investigation was also. And there were killers, thieves, robbers, crooks, embezzlers, bribe takers, the whole spectrum of the criminal world existed. And how then does it turn out that then and now about the same number of people are sitting? AND? And my family is NOT repressed !!!! And all my family members are NOT repressed !! And the near and dear ones were not repressed either !!!!!! And to listen to you, the repressed ones are everywhere.
  • gusev_sa
    gusev_sa 11 May 2013 02: 25 New
    +2
    A repressed for what? For desertion, forgery of food cards, or for helping the Germans rob and kill Soviet people?
    Specify specifically. We will sympathize with you.
  • Storyteller
    Storyteller 11 May 2013 05: 54 New
    +4
    Long live the most humane court in the world, condemned Buta and Yaroshenko.
  • dmitrich
    dmitrich 11 May 2013 06: 06 New
    0
    But what did you plant them, you know? And if you did not plant do not talk about what you do not know.
  • kot11180
    kot11180 11 May 2013 07: 50 New
    +3
    Of course, criminals, for example, in Guantanamo, and no one mocks them, because America was a virtuous model
  • Lukich
    Lukich 11 May 2013 08: 53 New
    0
    ... in GUANTANAMO ...
  • mealnik2005
    mealnik2005 11 May 2013 11: 30 New
    0
    Guantanamo to help you.
  • mch1950
    mch1950 11 May 2013 13: 09 New
    +2
    You will understand the reasons for the repressions against your relatives, study the case (case) and find in this case a denunciation written by your own relatives or acquaintances of your relatives.
    And the main motivation of denunciations is envy.
    And no need to shake the air. This is not a party meeting.
  • Van
    Van 11 May 2013 13: 37 New
    +1
    Quote: alex-defensor
    Now they are also sitting in the USA, but CRIMINALS AND BY THE RESOLUTION OF THE COURT !!!

    belay laughing wassat
  • kostiknet
    kostiknet 13 May 2013 11: 56 New
    0
    Quote: alex-defensor
    Now they are also sitting in the USA, but CRIMINALS AND BY THE RESOLUTION OF THE COURT !!!

    In those years, the "criminals" were planted the same thing and the same "by the decision of the court", only the articles were "to match the era", and the courts ...
    I do not condone those judges and prosecutors, but you just shouldn’t make blah blah blah about the LAW (and even in the States) now and about the barbaric lawlessness in the Union then. Unfortunately everything was according to the law, only laws were cannibalistic (just like Now: whatever the law, then a mockery of the mind. Well, clean "notes from a crazy house")
  • Tatar
    Tatar 14 May 2013 13: 54 New
    0
    Now there are those who stole a kilo of potatoes to feed their sick son, and those who stole millions, quietly quietly drink Machito, surrounded by heifers and ride in limousines.
  • CTEPX
    CTEPX 10 May 2013 19: 26 New
    +7
    Quote: andrre122
    Keep

    In addition, I was skeptical that on commercials, veterans saluted the fallen American-style to an empty head.
  • Bashkaus
    Bashkaus 10 May 2013 19: 51 New
    18
    I support the author of the article. My great-grandfather was also repressed and shot at 37, my great-grandmother served 10 years in the camps as the wife of an enemy of the people.
    BUT TO THE LIGHT HOLIDAY OF THE VICTORY DAY THIS DOES NOT HAVE ANYTHING!
    And to all the nits who are once again trying by hook or by crook to denigrate a Russian soldier, I do not threaten, but I say BAD FINISH!
  • Geisenberg
    Geisenberg 11 May 2013 01: 35 New
    -4
    Quote: andrre122
    Keep


    What do you support?

    This is a libel; the author is ready for any villainy to blacken the day. They must be kept in the muzzle.
  • taseka
    taseka 12 May 2013 05: 27 New
    +1
    This television has dishonored Russia for a long time, showing on the central channels - "Dom-2" and "Comedy Club" - it went, vile and dirty !!!
  • mehan71
    mehan71 10 May 2013 17: 20 New
    10
    I completely agree, argue on the sidelines, but you need to give a picture without any shadows and shades.
  • Hleb
    Hleb 10 May 2013 18: 02 New
    -8
    Yes, I have nothing more to do, how to argue? every day similar topics will appear on the site and you will gnaw at each other. every day the same thing. these words have been said for many years, but you just woke up. And you never listened to the text, patriots. ..
    it’s not about my attitude to Stalin. I don’t know what you saw there, shadows or something else, but in fact you didn’t answer me. The author was driven away. There is no mention in the text that each soldier had a close illegally planted. If you don’t agree that there have been cases when people were sitting innocently, then prove it here.
  • pensioner
    pensioner 10 May 2013 18: 36 New
    +4
    Quote: Ardent
    Broadcasting to the WORLD, it is necessary as if you are breathing on a candle.

    This is 100% true!
  • mbr0969
    mbr0969 10 May 2013 20: 56 New
    +7
    If you were born and saw only the STRASBAT movie libel film about penal battalions, then I sympathize with you about penal battles (they were served only by demoted officers, and there were no recidivists or political officers in them, especially since there were no detachments of firing squads on advanced) you do not know - alas
  • Ivan Kalinovich
    Ivan Kalinovich 10 May 2013 21: 23 New
    +1
    support
  • 094711601
    094711601 10 May 2013 23: 19 New
    0
    AND SAY. BE GOOD. AT WHAT LEVEL IS THE TEXT FOR THE ANNOUNCER APPROVED? BY LOGIC. ELISING NOT GERMAN END OF LAGI. IF IT WERE NOT “STALINKI” VICTORY WASN’T IT BEEN? And who knows. Who commands the DH? CAN YOU FIND A CONCLUSION?
  • zart_arn
    zart_arn 10 May 2013 15: 57 New
    -19
    You stood to death near Moscow and Stalingrad, drove bread to the besieged Leningrad, burned in a tank near Prokhorovka. By dying, you saved millions of lives. You lost your relatives and friends in the Stalinist camps

    There is nothing offensive in these words, on the contrary, it only magnifies the feat of the Soviet people. Recall and commemorate the unjustly ruined in the camps before the war. Let us recall the survivors, but not embittered, of the same Rokossovsky, for example, whose contribution to the victory was at least no less than Zhukov. Hundreds of thousands of innocently ruined and posthumously rehabilitated - proven fact. Let’s not forget about those sacrifices so that another Asian would not once again put hundreds of thousands of Russians in the name of a great idea, because we are the main wealth, value and meaning of the existence of this country.
    1. Mikado
      Mikado 10 May 2013 16: 02 New
      41
      I completely agree with you, only in this case, so as not to forget ALL the victims and everything was fair, these words should be continued
      “You stood near Moscow and Stalingrad to death, brought bread to the besieged Leningrad, burned in a tank near Prokhorovka. By dying, you saved millions of lives. You lost your relatives and friends in the Stalinist camps. You, having survived to the times of Yeltsin and Putin, froze to death on the floor of your own at home, because the heating was turned off, I saw a gang of traitors and thieves settled in our ancient Kremlin ... "
      1. zart_arn
        zart_arn 10 May 2013 16: 07 New
        +1
        This is one of the troubles pursuing Russia - our power-hungry people of all time are beyond jurisdiction.
        1. SASCHAmIXEEW
          SASCHAmIXEEW 10 May 2013 16: 47 New
          33
          Khrushch stunned Stalin to whitewash himself, and there were only a few guilty at all !!! And about the millions who were shot, the absurdity! The archives must be picked up and studied !! But it’s not worthless ... Katyn was sewn to ours too, and this mendel still apologized ! But it turned out that "our" liberal perestroika
          you blinded a fake and issued for the truth, su ... and ....
          1. does it
            does it 10 May 2013 19: 42 New
            +6
            Quote: SASCHAmIXEEW
            Khrushch stunned Stalin to whitewash himself

            It's simple, this Khrushchev avenged Stalin for his son, begged on his knees! despite the fact that Stalin refused to change Field Marshal Pauls to his son, who was then in German captivity. “I’m not changing soldiers to generals,” he said (Stalin).
            1. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 11 May 2013 01: 48 New
              +1
              Quote: kvirit
              It's simple, this Khrushchev avenged Stalin for his son, begged on his knees! despite the fact that Stalin refused to change Field Marshal Pauls to his son, who was then in German captivity. “I’m not changing soldiers to generals,” he said (Stalin).

              It was he who did not exchange his son and the phrase to his son, and Khrushchev avenged his eldest son, the pilot, shot down by the Germans and agreed to work for them, so Stalin ordered, and the son of Khrushchev was captured from the Germans by partisans and executed
          2. bezumnyiPIT
            bezumnyiPIT 10 May 2013 20: 37 New
            +9
            That Khrushchev, when Nikita was the party’s first secretary of the party’s party, then zealously filed execution lists of unreliable sometimes up to 10 thousand people (former fists, bandits, officers, speculators, clergymen, etc., etc. who served their sentence or not) Stalin struck out to half .. on one of the documents wrote "calm down ,!" in my opinion Khrushchev was a bold, active, cunning but still limited man ... dumb.
        2. Boris55
          Boris55 10 May 2013 17: 22 New
          21
          Quote: zart_arn
          This is one of the troubles pursuing Russia - our power-hungry people of all time are beyond jurisdiction.

          You are mistaken!
          The first decree of Khrushchev, after coming to power, on the non-jurisdiction of senior officials.
          Under Stalin, everyone and everyone who deserved to be judged was sitting, regardless of nationality (Art. 282) and other merits.

          Regarding television, it has already been written more than once - it does not belong to the state, and the enemies as they can - and they will spare. (who do not know: http://klin.hutt.ru/viewtopic.php?id=113 )
          1. YuDDP
            YuDDP 10 May 2013 19: 25 New
            +2
            Quote: Boris55
            Regarding television, it has already been written more than once - it does not belong to the state, and the enemies as they can - and they will spare.

            Yes, they say (Forbes says) that Russian TV does not belong to the state, but belongs to Yuri Kovalchuk, Putin’s neighbor in Lake Dacha cooperative.
          2. the polar
            the polar 10 May 2013 20: 01 New
            +5
            Quote: Boris55

            The first decree of Khrushchev, after coming to power, on the non-jurisdiction of senior officials.
            Under Stalin, everyone and everyone who deserved to be judged was sitting, regardless of nationality (Art. 282) and other merits.

            And Putin’s first decree "on the jurisdiction of Yeltsin" and granting him with the whole numerous family of eternal wealth
            1. Boris55
              Boris55 10 May 2013 20: 47 New
              +3
              Quote: Polar
              And Putin’s first decree "on the jurisdiction of Yeltsin" and granting him with the whole numerous family of eternal wealth


              This was one of the conditions for a peaceful transfer of power.
              Or do you really believe that EBN abdicated?
        3. Corsair5912
          Corsair5912 11 May 2013 17: 25 New
          +2
          Not all times, but only from Khrushchev times, members of the Central Committee of the CPSU became inaccessible to the KGB and the prosecutor's office. Khrushchev forbade to conduct investigative actions in relation to them, bring charges, detain them for testimony, etc. Only then did they become a caste not obeying Soviet laws, and their relatives too. The son of the secretary of the regional committee could rape and kill the child, and they could not do anything for it.
      2. Merchant
        Merchant 10 May 2013 16: 17 New
        -10
        But what Mikado do you have for nothing that you and specifically RUSSIA, Vladimir Putin did a bad thing !!! Or are you like the 5th kalon no no yes and want to peck at the tune of Western intelligence services !!!
        1. Merchant
          Merchant 10 May 2013 16: 31 New
          -12
          THAT YOU ALL FIND OUT THE BAD EVEN ON SUCH GREAT HOLIDAYS !!!
          WHAT YOU DO NOT ALL LIKE !!!
          WHAT YOU ARE ALL DISSATISFIED !!!
          AND SO ALREADY TODAY THE PRESIDENT CAN HELP TO LIFT RUSSIA FROM KNEES !!!
          SO LET'S DO NOT INTERVENE IT, HELP !!!
          And THAT THE KNIFE FROM BACK OF EVERYONE CAN PLANT!
          HERE WITHDRAW GDP FROM YOURSELF AND 37 START YOU !!!
          1. Merchant
            Merchant 10 May 2013 16: 42 New
            -5
            WELL THAT THE FREAKERS OF THE WESTERNS AND THEIR AGENTS BEGIN TO MINUS!
            THERE IS NOTHING IN RUSSIA, Loyal citizens and their majority, RUSSIA IS UNBEATABLE !!!
            1. andrre122
              andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 53 New
              -28
              The great Pu. Hurray, comrades.
              1. Merchant
                Merchant 10 May 2013 16: 57 New
                0
                THIS IS ONLY WITHOUT SARCASM !!!
            2. AleksUkr
              AleksUkr 10 May 2013 17: 13 New
              20
              I do not want to dirty my hands, minus you. But answer - how do you specifically help your beloved Putin? From your statements you only put sticks in wheels. We like everything, and we are happy with everything. They are especially pleased with Putin’s attitude to Serdyukov, Chubais, Khristenko, Manturov, Golikova, Skrynnik and many other destroyers of Russia. But the attitude to the memory of the Heroes of the war is unambiguous, and it cannot be revised. Although there are still many renegades trying to do this.

              LET IT REMEMBER EVERYTHING SCAR: General photo of the Soviet delegation during the signing of the Act of unconditional surrender of all the armed forces of Germany. In the center is Marshal Zhukov. May 8, 1945
              1. alexandr00070
                alexandr00070 11 May 2013 01: 54 New
                +3
                Quote: AleksUkr
                From your statements you only put sticks in wheels. We like everything, and we are happy with everything. Particularly pleased with Putin’s attitude to Serdyukov, Chubais, Khristenko, Manturov, Golikova, Skrynnik and many other destroyers of Russia

                There is a logical chain of merchants - a Jewish merchant, and, accordingly, a "friend" to Serdyukov, Chubais, Khristenko, Manturov, Golikova, Skrynnik and many other destroyers of Russia
              2. CTEPX
                CTEPX 11 May 2013 19: 04 New
                +1
                Quote: Merchant
                WELL THAT THE FREAKERS OF THE WESTERNS AND THEIR AGENTS BEGIN TO MINUS!

                Quote: AleksUkr
                I do not want to dirty my hands, minus you.

                The merchant, as he is used to moonlighting as a troll on an e-mail, echo, rain, is trying here, being sent by the leadership)).
                The goal is to chat the resource, make it inoperative. For the last days of such - fifty appeared)).
            3. Gemar
              Gemar 10 May 2013 17: 51 New
              19
              Quote: Merchant
              WELL THAT THE FREAKERS OF THE WESTERNS AND THEIR AGENTS BEGIN TO MINUS!

              You are so smart. Cons he does not like. Deserved, then, if they put in such a quantity. People who disagree to praise the "great" president, immediately recorded in the "FAVORITES OF THE WESTERNS" and the liberals recorded ?! negative Well, judge for yourself, let’s not judge!
              Quote: Merchant
              IN RUSSIA, THERE ARE FAITHFUL CITIZENS IN RUSSIA

              Match the word "TRUE" with a noun. Who are the faithful to? The one who in every way rests against the demands of the people to put "Red" and "Tuburetkin"? The one who does not want to help the Russians return to their homeland, but brings hundreds of thousands of Central Asian citizens, giving them Russian citizenship?
              I am faithful to the Far East. And, despite the fact that people are fleeing from here en masse, to the delight of the Chinese, I am going to stay here. I have three children, I will give them a good education. I will teach them to hunt, love their homeland (and not the president), honor the memory of our soldiers, admire the achievements of our scientists. I will teach them not to be afraid of visitors, not to fly in front of foreigners ... and respond competently to such "patriots" like you.
              Quote: Merchant
              HERE WITHDRAW GDP FROM YOURSELF AND 37 START YOU !!!

              You, in turn, advice - disable Caps Lock. In capital letters, those who have a small organ are usually screaming ... the brain laughing
            4. bezumnyiPIT
              bezumnyiPIT 10 May 2013 20: 39 New
              +2
              I am faithful to my homeland-Russia, and I did not swear to Putin
              1. Setrac
                Setrac 10 May 2013 22: 22 New
                +4
                Quote: bezumnyiPIT
                I am faithful to my homeland-Russia, and I did not swear to Putin

                This is just a pun. If you are liable for military service, then Putin is your commander until the term of his presidency ends.
          2. Genady1976
            Genady1976 10 May 2013 16: 43 New
            10
            but I have nothing to fear let embezzlers fear 37g.
            1. Merchant
              Merchant 10 May 2013 16: 56 New
              11
              WE WILL GET ANYTHING AND TO THE OTHER TREASURES!
              TO ALL THOSE WHO HUMILIATES AND INSIGNES RUSSIA !!!
              A SIMPLE PERSON LOVING HOMELAND AND A BELIEVE IN GREATNESS OF RUSSIA IS NOTHING TO BE AFRAID !!!
              GLORY TO RUSSIA!!!
            2. ia-ai00
              ia-ai00 10 May 2013 21: 04 New
              +6
              So far, KAZNOKRAD are unlikely to be afraid. Putin said that now is not 37 years old. Yves 60s and 70s "for the theft of State property on an especially large scale - confiscation of property and execution."
              Well, even if it’s not 37, not the 60th, not the 70th, let it NOT SHOOT, but CONFISCATION of property and years, at least 10 prisons, at the logging! And with such "liberal" approaches to embezzlers, as now, there will be no order in the country, so the whole country will be allowed "around the world". Serdyukov was “misled”, chybasik - simply “inefficiently invested” more than 2,5 billion rubles. And I think it’s just that I “EFFECTIVELY” invested “for myself”. A thief is sitting on a thief and ...
          3. andrre122
            andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 51 New
            +9
            "LIFT RUSSIA FROM THE KNEES"
            By signing anti-people’s laws. Quietly, quietly, under the guise of a holiday. Despite protests and appeals.
            He doesn’t raise anything. He has a task to survive. Here he is spinning. He flirts with the people when the liberal liberal sidekick is pressed. Then he hugs them back when he lets him go. That's the whole strategy.
            1. Merchant
              Merchant 10 May 2013 17: 01 New
              -15
              I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THIS WHO SUCH A KNOWLEDGE SEEKED !!
              DO YOU KNOW THE PRESIDENT'S POLITICAL TECHNOLOGY AND STRATEGY!
              BETTER SILENCE M ...... C
              1. andrre122
                andrre122 10 May 2013 17: 24 New
                +6
                I don’t know. I say how I see the situation and judge by business.
                "BETTER SILENCE"
                Better not tell me.
          4. SASCHAmIXEEW
            SASCHAmIXEEW 10 May 2013 16: 51 New
            +9
            And at 37m Stalin removed the remnants of the railway Zionists from the cracks ...
            1. andrre122
              andrre122 10 May 2013 17: 07 New
              +7
              Not really. He tried to move the party nomenclature, and she responded with repression.
          5. TUMAN
            TUMAN 10 May 2013 17: 53 New
            14
            Quote: Merchant
            THAT YOU ALL FIND OUT THE BAD EVEN ON SUCH GREAT HOLIDAYS !!!

            Yes, no one is looking! It's just a shame for the Power! How much can our past be sent ?! It’s not possible in Ukraine to turn on the TV, it immediately makes you sick, they show the “white tiger”, then the prisoners who won the war, and in all these films the commanders are stupid, the soldiers are fools, the Chekists are bloodsuckers. Not a single movie was shown good, that's all!
          6. antidote
            antidote 11 May 2013 13: 49 New
            0
            The correct postulate, I fully support!
      3. Genady1976
        Genady1976 10 May 2013 16: 22 New
        +1
        For 20 years, they say this in a moment of silence
        1. andrre122
          andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 54 New
          +1
          Personally, I first heard this moment.
          1. Genady1976
            Genady1976 10 May 2013 17: 59 New
            0
            2009 is the same
            1. Genady1976
              Genady1976 10 May 2013 18: 17 New
              +1
              here 2001 04:45
            2. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 11 May 2013 01: 59 New
              +2
              Quote: Genady1976
              2009 is the same

              really 3,15 minutes the same phrase, go nuts
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. Hleb
            Hleb 10 May 2013 18: 08 New
            +3
            because you never listened
      4. mehan71
        mehan71 10 May 2013 17: 35 New
        +7
        Does anyone have statistics on the dead (deceased) veterans of the Great War in the damned 90 years? Share, then everything will be garlic. You are 10+.
      5. Mihae09
        Mihae09 10 May 2013 18: 42 New
        +5
        Dear Mikado, I completely agree with you and fully support !!! Especially about the Kremlin ...
      6. the polar
        the polar 10 May 2013 18: 55 New
        11
        "You, living to the times of Yeltsin and Putin, froze to death on the floor of your own house, because you turned off the heating, saw a gang of traitors and thieves settled in our ancient Kremlin ..."
        -------------------------------------------
        Good words Mikado!
        It is necessary to rewrite and hang on the forums so that the Kremlin collaborators who diligently pervert our Great History do not doubt what the people think of them
    2. andrre122
      andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 25 New
      35
      And why not the Khrushchevsky or Blackberry camps? The party nomenclature has blood-soaked hands and they were the initiators and active participants in the terror of 37-38 years.
      Because Stalin fought against this Trotskyite nits. But they have regretted so far up in Russia. The purpose of these creatures is to sacrifice Russia for world capital. And it is thanks to Stalin that we can celebrate May 9 and talk here.
      The meaning of this abomination is to oppose Stalin to the people. The people won the war in defiance of the commander in chief. For a normal person, this is nonsense.
      The task is to carry out de-Stalinization and desovetization. In the West they have already compiled a penitential list of what the Russians should repent of.
      The result will be the vocation of the USSR by the same aggressor as Germany. A review of the results of the Second World War. And there, Nuremberg 2 is just around the corner. Preparation for the hill is already underway.
      And do not stop there. The blackening of the entire history of Russia and de-Russification will follow. Our liberoid western servants are already slowly singing about it.
      And you continue to be held captive by liberoid delirium.
      1. jjj
        jjj 10 May 2013 18: 26 New
        13
        Yes, when at the beginning of the war, Comrade Stalin created the GKO - the body standing above the organs of Soviet power and the party, it became clear that it was precisely such a governance structure that allowed for large-scale reorganizations and really effective management of a huge state in wartime. The facsimile of the signature of Joseph Vissarionovich was among the GKO members. On his behalf, they made decisions in the subordinate sectors of the economy and defense.
        And that's what is remarkable. After the war, Comrade Stalin proposed reducing the role of the party in governing the country, and creating something GKO only for peacetime. But the party comrades did not even put forward this proposal of the "tyrant Stalin" for discussion. Instead, another "tightening of the nuts" began. By the way, Victory Day as a holiday was not celebrated then. And the awards of war veterans lay on tables, boxes, chests of drawers. Wearing them was considered not very decent. The society was dominated by front-line soldiers not the most rosy mood. The authorities did not stand on ceremony too. Perhaps only Simonov and Twardowski with their work worked for the prestige of the defenders. In the sixties, a turning point occurred - the massive emergence of "lieutenant prose." And ten years later they remembered about Stalin.
        I think that today's official attitude to the role of Comrade Stalin - ostentatious. For a number of reasons, the authorities have to adhere to liberal rhetoric. But in television programs, paper media, Stalin’s films are shown more or less adequately. Thus, the people retain their good name and set the stage for official recognition in the future. He will be our national hero.
        1. the polar
          the polar 10 May 2013 19: 04 New
          +4
          Quote: jjj
          He will be our national hero.

          Not “will”, but HE is and will remain so forever in the memory of the people.
    3. stranik72
      stranik72 10 May 2013 16: 46 New
      +9
      zart_arn
      "Let's not forget about the sacrifices so that another Asian will not once again put hundreds of thousands of Russians in the name of a great ideabecause we are the main wealth, value and meaning of the existence of this country. "
      I wonder who you think is the previous Asian. As far as I remember and know the story, Asians in Russia did not carry out great ideas. If you consider Stalin to be an Asian, then I am sad for my country in which the slumber does not hesitate to show his denseness.
      1. bezumnyiPIT
        bezumnyiPIT 10 May 2013 20: 42 New
        +1
        Asian can not be a Russian?
    4. S_mirnov
      S_mirnov 10 May 2013 17: 36 New
      +8
      "Hundreds of thousands of innocently ruined and posthumously rehabilitated - proven fact." - Who proved? Solzhenitsen and Novodvorskaya? Enough to carry chukhnu about the camps! For example, prisoners of war were passed through the camps, because Europe was all lousy and with trippers. While kept in quarantine, traitors were caught. It is only in the memoirs that all the prisoners were shell-shocked terminators, but in reality the fates were different and some were worthy of punishment.
    5. alex-defensor
      alex-defensor 10 May 2013 17: 41 New
      -2
      Quote: zart_arn
      You stood to death near Moscow and Stalingrad, drove bread to the besieged Leningrad, burned in a tank near Prokhorovka. By dying, you saved millions of lives. You lost your relatives and friends in the Stalinist camps


      That's how it coincided, as well. My great-great-grandfather (lieutenant general) was shot in the 37th, his wife, a housewife, was shot. When they were picked up, it was winter, a funnel arrived at night, they boarded up the windows and doors of their house, 4 children, in which they slept, were thrown out into the street, if they weren’t picked up by neighbors, they would freeze to death by morning. However, my great-grandfather (brother of the executed person) was just leading one of the caravans on the "road of life" along which they delivered provisions to besieged Leningrad. My grandmother’s brother, when he came from the front, was sent to a camp where he died of pneumonia. So here it is! There was a terrible time, there was a terrible regime, there were many scoundrels denounced by the authorities.
      1. alex-defensor
        alex-defensor 10 May 2013 18: 04 New
        -2
        Just now I specified with my mother, she knows better. They didn’t shoot his wife, but put him where she died.
      2. valokordin
        valokordin 10 May 2013 18: 51 New
        10
        Quote: alex-defensor
        there were many scoundrels exposed by authority.

        Quote: alex-defensor
        there were many scoundrels exposed by authority.

        There are a lot of them now, much more than there was, so they are trying to spoil honest people of that time.
      3. stranik72
        stranik72 10 May 2013 19: 50 New
        +4
        alex-defensor
        I do not believe about children, tell horror stories on another resource. There was a law on the children of those arrested, and even on the street at night, in winter, there were few suicides in the NKVD. So hang noodles. And about the lieutenant general, there are lists of rattle and convicts in such a level, and there is the whole story. Look, you might be surprised.
      4. Net
        Net 10 May 2013 20: 08 New
        +7
        Well, you think yourself logically, what was the point of Stalin personally to arrange such crimes? Well, what? If many then returned back! And what about Stalin? You better among the neighbors would look who denounced such scribbling at people.
    6. dizelniy
      dizelniy 10 May 2013 18: 41 New
      11
      Khrushchev rehabilitated him, who demanded that he increase his orders for repression, and the same lack of education as him, who were unable to organize and understand anything in politics and the national economy. They decided to blame Stalin for their desire to curry favor. It was they who ignored the backlogs and rates laid down under Stalin, 16-19% of GDP growth. Everyone nervously smokes on the sidelines.
    7. washi
      washi 10 May 2013 19: 26 New
      +2
      Rokkossovsky above Zhukov. But I recommend recalling the Lokot Republic. And then remember not legal repressions. Too many were legal and not repressed. Unfortunately. Otherwise, there would be less loss.
    8. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 10 May 2013 19: 31 New
      +5
      The Americans liberated Buchenwald and Dachau; it turns out that their relatives also sat in the "Stalinist camps." When did they get there?
    9. dmb
      dmb 10 May 2013 21: 09 New
      +6
      I think that the minuses to you and your like-minded have been instructed quite justifiably. The article does not talk about whether or not there were repressions. They can deny that they were, and that as a result of them, a considerable number of innocents suffered, and their harm to the country and the people, can only be finished ... However, the vileness that was said on TV after the "triumph of democracy" is not said to to give an objective assessment of the events of that time. It is said at the suggestion of the present leaders and their lackeys like Svanidze with the sole purpose of equalizing fascism and communism. Moreover, this is done not for us, but for our descendants. They need to be explained to them how badly we lived before the 1991 year and how happily they live now, under wise leadership ... etc. We who lived under socialism can evaluate its negative and positive sides, but to posterity they will only talk about the camps. To not have thoughts, live differently.
    10. antidote
      antidote 11 May 2013 13: 46 New
      +1
      Significant message: Liberals no longer speak of millions of innocently ruined, but only hundreds of thousands
  • Andrey Yuryevich
    Andrey Yuryevich 10 May 2013 18: 23 New
    +7
    victims of the exam wrote, not otherwise ... but what to expect, in principle, from the channels daily stuffing their (?) fellow citizens f. ??? because there’s not a single channel where they really say the TRUTH ... all the TV disgrace of the country ... such as the commissioners, a place in Butyrka ... !!!
  • bezumnyiPIT
    bezumnyiPIT 10 May 2013 20: 22 New
    0
    And what, in your opinion, did he have to go to the Vlasovites? It does not matter for whom, if only against Stalin?
  • mbr0969
    mbr0969 10 May 2013 20: 51 New
    +4
    And the authors of the text of a moment of silence would be happy to learn a story, for starters. Buchenwald concentration camps (uprising at the approach of the Americans) and Dachau war of the USSR Red Army did not release them
  • Masterzserg
    Masterzserg 11 May 2013 14: 21 New
    0
    Quote: Gleb
    de says in the text, what is each?
    if you follow his logic, then he could write that 37 million were burning near Prokhorovka, 37 million were fighting near Moscow and Stalingrad, etc. .... it’s silly to understand these words so finely and provocatively translate them into numbers.
    quote from the text: “You stood to death near Moscow and Stalingrad, brought bread to the besieged Leningrad, burned in a tank near Prokhorovka. When you killed, you saved millions of lives. You lost your relatives and friends in Stalin’s camps”, what didn’t generalize then?


    They don’t care, the main deer set the direction, the herd popped up. And it also seems to me that the scheme "fools in dumb dulls if they are 20 years old" works here, well, or less) The fanatic of Stalin from scratch began to bleat, well, as usual in the herd, he is echoed in unison.
    It is unfortunate that now the crowd can not be especially motivated, the main thing is to write emotional garbage, pull a convenient line out of context and develop hysteria and excitement from scratch - this is a sign of a strong debilitation of society. And you can come up with a slogan like crooks and thieves and everyone will repeat.
  • Cynic
    Cynic 11 May 2013 18: 35 New
    -1
    Quote: Gleb
    where does the text say what everyone has?

    Sorry, but you have embarked on a slippery slope protecting the compilers of this text.
    There are NO ERRORS in such texts!
    Honestly, these words were cut, the truth was just a bit inwardly _ And then this ... were noted!
    Already tired, if a political instructor, then a coward at best, and a hero, a former political prisoner, or just a prisoner!
    By the way, people got into the Gulag on the basis of court decisions, even triplets, but decisions! And the decision is made on the basis of documents! And an honest person can be condemned only on the basis of a denunciation!
    So, I do not recall a single case that a scammer would answer for a scam, and given the number of convicts, they, oh, are not few!
    1. Cynic
      Cynic 12 May 2013 16: 39 New
      0
      Quote: Cynic
      that the scammer would answer for the scam, and given the number of convicts, they, oh, are not few!

      While -1
      The heirs of nits are alive. Oh, how they don’t like it when they talk about them out loud.

      Udaltsovschina Tyutukivschina Nemtsovschina she crush in their heads in the bud
  • postman
    postman 13 May 2013 22: 15 New
    0
    Gleb is the reference.

    Quote: Gleb
    But you need to think ..

    Thought the author thought, don’t worry.
    He simply considers the rest as idiots.
  • varov14
    varov14 15 May 2013 15: 43 New
    0
    "You stood to death near Moscow and Stalingrad, drove bread to the besieged Leningrad, burned in a tank near Prokhorovka. By killing you saved millions of lives. You lost your relatives and friends in the Stalinist camps" why didn't you generalize that? --- According to the rules of the Russian language, it must be understood that you who lost loved ones in the Stalinist camps did the rest, what was the nit-picking of the author, onion grief?
  • Ducksar
    Ducksar 10 May 2013 17: 47 New
    14
    In my opinion, this is all a purposeful action to denigrate the feat of the Soviet people and the change of values ​​in today's heads. It’s easiest to start with leaders, and then go to the people themselves, they say they obeyed such a “fool”, so the “fools” themselves .. and therefore everything that they did was also not right, and indeed the USSR launched the 2nd World War and bombed Hiroshima and Nagosaki with nuclear bombs ... probably expect to approve this version of the story, say by 2030, or maybe earlier (Alan’s plan was given, went through all the stages). And this is everywhere, in all media, we’ll lie. culture ... all sorts of scum like Mikhalkov actively adhere to this .. making films like weary of the sun 2, here is a good (last episode of 4) review of this film

    media molestationPerhaps you can’t say better. Real cold war.
    1. alex-defensor
      alex-defensor 10 May 2013 18: 16 New
      -9
      Quote: DucksWar
      It’s easiest to start with leaders, and then go to the people themselves, they say they obeyed such a “fool”, so the “fools” themselves .. and therefore everything that they did was also not right, and indeed the USSR launched the 2nd World War and bombed Hiroshima and Nagosaki with nuclear bombs ...



      Nagasaki, if only checked before writing. Yes, it is NECESSARY to resist the distortion of history, however, we ourselves, the temptation to tint our history, the same can not be yielded. Our people fought heroically. The scheme you proposed is insolvent. The government was not stupid, it was cruel, however, to shift this definition to the whole people is pointless. Violent regimes were in many countries, for example, Chile during the time of Augustus Pinochet, but no one calls Chileans stupid, and what’s stupidity, the regime is always difficult to resist, because the organization (and the state is always an organization) is invariably stronger than the spontaneous manifestations of discontent among the population.

      Alan Dallas’s plan has nothing to do with it. I get the impression that you didn’t find the USSR specifically. And the USSR after Stalin was no longer the same. Stalin was a complex person, in a difficult country, at a difficult time, in a difficult situation. Judging is always easier, but it is not necessary to whitewash. I am against both those who smear everything with black paint, and against those who smear everything white ... let historians fight, we need to think about the threats of the present and future.

      PS Nikita Sergeyevich Mikhalkov is all right with patriotism. And those who whitewash the Stalinist regime, pass on insanity as patriotism!
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 10 May 2013 18: 25 New
        -5
        The correct position. The one who is really proud of his homeland, its history, does not need to hush up the real negative facts, which, like any country, it has.
        Well it was, and so what?

        PS Well, with Mikhalkov: he may have patriotism. But the mind and talent is a clear deficit.
        1. ramzes1776
          ramzes1776 10 May 2013 20: 42 New
          +1
          Quote: Spade
          Well it was, and so what?

          Many countries also had a lot of things, only no one puts it on display to the whole world except us and does not engage in “self-flagellation”.
          1. Lopatov
            Lopatov 10 May 2013 20: 47 New
            -7
            "Do not put on display" those who are ashamed of their story.
      2. zart_arn
        zart_arn 10 May 2013 18: 49 New
        -6
        That's right, dear Alexander. Unfortunately, there are many people on this site for whom their own opinions and reasonings have been deleted, and someone’s dogmas have been transplanted and it is impossible to convince them, but this does not mean that you and I should not express our thoughts and ideas. A lot of new participants appear on the site and you need to teach them to think independently, not to let their brains be riddled with different dogmas.
        1. stranik72
          stranik72 10 May 2013 19: 44 New
          +1
          zart_arn
          I agree with you, it’s only a strange thing that you yourself have independently learned to think, or while you are studying.
      3. stranik72
        stranik72 10 May 2013 19: 54 New
        +2
        alex-defensor
        PS And those who whitewash the Stalinist regime, pass on insanity as patriotism!
        Well, the one who talks about that time at the sewer level is just a favorite of men.
      4. Ducksar
        Ducksar 10 May 2013 20: 05 New
        +7
        And no one whitewashes his personality and his methods of governing the country, there were serious miscalculations. But it’s just now customary to notice only the dark sides and put them at the forefront, completely forgetting about the main thing.
        The government was not stupid, it was cruel, however, to shift this definition to the whole people is pointless.

        You understand this, I understand this by a few percent of people, well, let us explain this to the whole world that we are not “camels" ... or that not all Germans were fascists, they were simply deceived by Hitler and forced to commit atrocities, rape, kill. How to present and condemn! And that is important.

        You are right, I didn’t find a union (I belong to the generation of the 90s), but tell me why, well, why grandparents (mine included) only speak positively about that time, about the same Stalin and comparing it with subsequent rulers and with the current , only in his favor ??? Isn't this the main indicator? In any case, fewer are unhappy.

        Alan Dallas’s plan has nothing to do with it.

        и
        let historians fight, we need to think about the present and future threats.

        and what do you mean by current and future threats? those. the fact that the current generation (not all but enough to start worrying) considers everything Russian, excuse me, “shit”, and the Soviet is backward and erroneous, and indeed it’s necessary to bring down this “rashka”, the heir to the “scoop” - Do not you consider a threat ??? And it's not just trolls, it happens in life I know enough of these people ... and some are not at all stupid in terms of education.

        And now in the era of the Internet, it is easiest to control the consciousness of people, for example through films that are supposedly true about life !!! Oh well
        PS Nikita Sergeyevich Mikhalkov is all right with patriotism.

        those. show Soviet generals who fought and won battles that influenced millions of fates, a drunken drunk, dumb, somehow greasy and terrible. And the Russian soldier from Mikhalkov’s films is one who pisses right next to the woman who gave birth to a baby, all around are swearing, they are killing their own, they are constantly doggy and only dream of getting female tits and so on. Yes, this is just the limit of patriotism, in a normal person this can only cause a vile feeling, a nauseating reaction. Yes, he’s just a standard of patriot, let's equal (irony).

        and I'm only talking about movies, and the rest of life ?? this is not the moral decay of the population ?? not??

        and you about me
        Nagasaki
    2. kosmos84
      kosmos84 10 May 2013 18: 53 New
      0
      for a long time did not laugh
    3. MG42
      MG42 10 May 2013 18: 59 New
      +6
      I bought a DVD <Burnt by the Sun 2 Citadel>, regretted throwing money away, how interesting Mikhalkov burned money for a similar chukhnika, maybe budget ones?
      1. Ducksar
        Ducksar 10 May 2013 20: 17 New
        +4
        kinopoisk.ru states that Burnt by the Sun 2: Ahead was spent € 33, and fees of $ 000 (well, even let it be 000).
        and Burnt by the Sun 2: The Citadel spent $ 45 and raised $ 000. Comments are unnecessary. And yes, all this was filmed with state money
        1. MG42
          MG42 11 May 2013 00: 36 New
          +3
          Mikhalkov not only took off this bad taste <Burnt by the Sun 2 Citadel>, he seems closer another ideology >>> frame from the film <The Barber of Siberia>
    4. valokordin
      valokordin 10 May 2013 18: 59 New
      +4
      What a nasty face for Nikita, it’s scary to think that he is at the head of filmmakers, and here is another bald nasty face from the 9th company.
      1. MG42
        MG42 10 May 2013 19: 19 New
        +8
        Quote: valokordin
        What a nasty face for Nikita, it’s scary to think that he’s headed by filmmakers
      2. alexandr00070
        alexandr00070 11 May 2013 00: 56 New
        +2
        Quote: valokordin
        What a nasty face for Nikita,
  • Deniska999
    Deniska999 10 May 2013 17: 55 New
    +5
    And what about the war and the Stalinist camps? Do we now have these events equalized?
  • vladimirZ
    vladimirZ 10 May 2013 19: 01 New
    +9
    It seemed to me that I misheard that they were again pouring mud on the name of Stalin Joseph Vissarionovich on Victory Day. He even tried to find a repeat of the recording in order to listen again, but failed.
    Shame, shame on the Russian authorities, on the leaders of the state, Putin and Medvedev, on the mass media who committed insult to the Supreme Commander-in-Chief of the USSR Stalin I.V. on Victory Day, the person to whom we all owe for the Victory, for the great work of creating and defending a popular socialist state.
  • nickname 1 and 2
    nickname 1 and 2 10 May 2013 19: 11 New
    -3
    Actor needs to heal nerves! Hysterics!

    And such things must be treated calmly!
    You can’t put a scarf on someone else’s mouth!
    Freedom of speech!
    And the more we react to these breaks, the more often they will sound. And such hysterical articles will feed the aftors better.

    It is necessary to ignore all these yelling!

    No need to be provoked!
  • Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 10 May 2013 19: 19 New
    +7
    YOU, WHO'S CLOSE AND FAMILY HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE STALIN CAMPS, YOU HAVE LIBERATED WITH OSVENTSIM, BUCHENVALD AND DAHAU ...


    BUCHENWALD AND DHAHA RELEASED THE AMERICANS, WHAT HELLO AND THEIR KIND WEDDED IN THE "STALIN" CAMP?
    1. loisop
      loisop 12 May 2013 14: 49 New
      0
      Duc, eta .. "Espionage" (58.6), does not roll?
  • Kostya pedestrian
    Kostya pedestrian 10 May 2013 20: 18 New
    +2
    And yet, if you simply make up a word from 1 letters of the speaker’s statement, we get the RESIDENCE - add A or BUT - we get that some fascist clans decided to seriously break us and erase (rich bastards, super rich), if not ourselves the victorious nations of fascism, as the hitler wanted, then at least destroy the memory of their defeat, and take revenge on the grandchildren and great-grandchildren of the victors to our old people.

    So it turns out that the ZK liberated the ZK, and the Germans simply - exemplary police officers and warders. The very thing will be led by the UN troops forcing peace in the 3rd World War, and subordinate the resources of Russia, while we will exhaust each other with the United States.

    Australia has already been conquered with the help of fugitive Aporteans and Banderavets and former Deutsche and Syoiko settlers - we have Volkswagen, the brainchild of Hitler, Himler and Goebbils in the synagogue areas, a favorite means of transportation. And as soon as people containing the Holocaust Museum can come to work in this museum on Volkswagen? belay
  • Civil
    Civil 10 May 2013 20: 32 New
    -2
    I will say this, my great-grandfather is my grandmother’s father in 158 art. The Criminal Code for having married the ex-wife, the mullahs condemned 2 times for 10 years, left in 1953. Another great-grandfather died of hunger as a communist, and did not reach his 2 km. he carried seeds but didn’t touch a gram. Out of 16 brothers, my grandfather (he fought in World War II medals for courage, for military services, Order of the Red Banner, 2 Red Stars, World War 1-3 degrees), only one survived.
    May be enough?!
  • nycsson
    nycsson 10 May 2013 21: 23 New
    +5
    Quote: xerus.sb
    I do not think about chance! Vile! Dirty!

    Why be surprised? Where did you see Russian television in Russia ??? wassat
  • potap2872
    potap2872 10 May 2013 22: 45 New
    0
    just librarians ((((((((((((
  • rolik
    rolik 11 May 2013 01: 58 New
    +5
    Quote: xerus.sb
    I do not think about chance! Vile! Dirty!

    Unfortunately, our speaker institute has degenerated. Now on television you can, even without surprise and embarrassment, hear words that are more suitable for the lesson than educated people.
    The era of Soviet and Russian announcers ended with the departure of Igor Leonidovich Kirillov, Anna Nikolaevna Shatilova, N.M. Andreeva, V.P. Tkachenko and many others. It seems that, for the most part, on television now there are people who have fallen on the role of an announcer with the patronage of relatives. 90% of people cannot speak Russian correctly and make sentences correctly. The TV presenter should first show respect to the viewer and show him his attitude. This is especially necessary in our rather harsh time, when people lack attention, the warmth of some kind of human. Even if you just read the information, why don't you smile with a slight smile? Now, for the most part, it is: he came, he dangled on his salary and left. Or today’s shows: they’re sitting, joking with each other for an hour in the studio, muttering something under their breath, they joked themselves, laughed themselves. I do not care, the viewer understood me, did not understand. The main thing is that I have support: the crowd there is behind the scenes, the co-hosts are so funny. Why do we need such programs that they carry? Either they show themselves how beautiful and wonderful they are, or they work for each other, but not for the viewer. This, of course, does not mean that there are no good leaders now. Yes, but it is a huge rarity. Now there are no such announcers with a capital letter, on which they equated, on which they wanted to be like. Because the most important things that distinguish a real announcer have disappeared from television: goodwill towards the viewer, the culture of the word and the culture of communication.
    Yes, now television has become much livelier and more active, but the correctness of speech, however, should not be forgotten.
  • chpnik
    chpnik 11 May 2013 02: 28 New
    +3
    Hi guys. Specifically registered to chat here.
    I looked in the YouTube archive for minutes of silence from previous years. I must say that we have heard exactly such a text since 1995. And no one paid attention to it. The text was longer in these years, but the words in question were the same.
    Who wrote them, I have not figured out yet.

    http://youtu.be/lwMpqhfjZvY
    Victory Day 65: Minute of Silence May 9, 2010
    Here the text is prepared on the plot of a 10-minute minute of silence on central TV of the late nineties sample, 1995-1999

    http://youtu.be/zQKhJp5AEmk
    Minute of silence (TNT, May 9.05.2011, XNUMX)
    Read by Igor Kirillov

    http://youtu.be/ytVOBwozGLM
    A moment of silence - May 9, 2012

    http://youtu.be/XpqIHEDssxo
    A moment of silence (09.05.2013/XNUMX/XNUMX). The blessed memory of the fallen in the fight against fascism.


    http://youtu.be/dAp39Bd820w
    Victory Day (minute of silence)
    Posted on 02.05.2013/XNUMX/XNUMX
  • Mikhail m
    Mikhail m 10 May 2013 07: 19 New
    13
    To accept the Victory Parade, having lounged in an armchair, the Supreme is not ashamed.
    1. kris
      kris 10 May 2013 15: 53 New
      11
      Quote: Michael m
      To accept the Victory Parade, having lounged in an armchair, the Supreme is not ashamed.

      and read on a piece of paper?
    2. Armata
      Armata 10 May 2013 15: 55 New
      14
      Quote: Michael m
      To accept the Victory Parade, having lounged in an armchair, the Supreme is not ashamed.
      I am ashamed. But we should not be ashamed, but those who allegedly speak on behalf of the people of Russia (USSR). But they don’t know shame, it’s the bayan, who sharply fell into the hands of power.
      1. shpuntik
        shpuntik 10 May 2013 16: 08 New
        +9
        Mechanic Today, 15:55 ↑ New
        But they don’t know shame, it’s the bayan, who sharply fell into the hands of power.

        Yes, it can be seen from the faces: as if doing a favor. Money is not measured, but they are afraid of the officer corps. Time is being delayed ... Tomorrow, the day after tomorrow, soon. They pay pension, military salary was raised right before the election. Because, if they don’t do this, they won’t even sit in armchairs for a day. But there is no development of the country, and already twenty years have passed after- "Vote, or lose!"
      2. SASCHAmIXEEW
        SASCHAmIXEEW 10 May 2013 16: 53 New
        +6
        Which bayar? It’ll be more true from rags to riches, as many as one thousandths of the corruption crimes are at the mercy of the rest, they let go of the brakes ... And these are honest people, the "elite" ..
      3. S_mirnov
        S_mirnov 10 May 2013 17: 40 New
        10
        “It's a shame. But we should not be ashamed, but those who supposedly speak on behalf of the people of Russia” You and every Russian should be ashamed that they allowed the collapse of their homeland and tolerate traitors and traders at the head of the country. Otherwise, nothing will change, and we will wait when conscience wakes up in a crook!
        1. nycsson
          nycsson 10 May 2013 23: 18 New
          +3
          Quote: S_mirnov
          and we will wait when conscience wakes up in a crook!

          Totally agree with you! She will never wake up with them!
    3. Dilshat
      Dilshat 10 May 2013 16: 12 New
      +6
      In the last days of Victory, I saw in the photo how he and Medvedev were sitting at the table and veterans were standing nearby. This year they took this into account. Veterans are sitting next to them (in the parade). Maybe Putin has been replaced? There is a joke in every joke. But something is not funny .
      1. Armata
        Armata 10 May 2013 16: 30 New
        +9
        Quote: Dilshat
        In the last days of Victory, I saw in the photo how he and Medvedev were sitting at the table and veterans were standing nearby. This year they took this into account. Veterans are sitting next to them (in the parade). Maybe Putin has been replaced? There is a joke in every joke. But something is not funny .
        A veteran in 90 years may sit, it’s just hard for him, but if Putin is the president, and not a condom, he must respect. Moreover, he is the commander in chief. This is just rudeness. By the way, in 3 volts (2 finger batteries), did it slip past?
        1. S_mirnov
          S_mirnov 11 May 2013 00: 33 New
          +1
          In komenta I agree. And here I will explain:
          "By the way, at 3 volts (2 finger batteries) did he slip past?" - Most of the people who communicate here do not just get money, but earn money. So they don’t always sit on the site, I also don’t have time to answer all attacks in my direction, this is normal. No reason to blame.
  • vjatsergey
    vjatsergey 10 May 2013 07: 29 New
    21
    Brezhnev standing took the parade at 78 years old
    1. Normal
      Normal 10 May 2013 16: 29 New
      13
      Quote: vjatsergey
      Brezhnev standing took the parade at 78 years old

      Brezhnev still fought, and the current ....
  • Hleb
    Hleb 10 May 2013 07: 41 New
    +8
    Watch a video of the past, the year before last, etc .. years and hear the same words:YOU WHICH ARE CLOSE AND FAMILY PASSED THROUGH THE STALIN CAMP 10 years, they are exactly repeated
    1. Alexei
      Alexei 10 May 2013 15: 51 New
      +6
      Quote: Gleb
      the same words: YOU, WHOSE CLOSE AND KIND HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE STALIN CASES of 10 years, exactly repeat them

      Why are they repeated? Who invented this "fiery" speech? This “someone”, apparently, all sat in the camps under Stalin, but then they got out of people ... Outrageous.
      1. Alexei
        Alexei 10 May 2013 16: 31 New
        0
        What are these cons? Poke your nose where I'm wrong. Not, if you liked the speech, just say it and discuss it.
      2. andrre122
        andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 32 New
        +4
        These speeches were written by the Trotskyists who were not finished by Comrade Stalin. He prevented them from drinking Bavarian beer with this victory. They cannot forgive.
    2. sergo0000
      sergo0000 10 May 2013 16: 00 New
      +4
      Quote: Gleb
      10 years, they are exactly repeated
      For some reason they are repeated! winked Let's hope for the last time. wink
      1. Hleb
        Hleb 10 May 2013 18: 24 New
        +1
        Do you think that Putin will not be president in the year 14? or don’t know his opinion on this issue?
        1. sergo0000
          sergo0000 10 May 2013 19: 17 New
          +2
          Quote: Gleb
          Do you think that Putin will not be president in the year 14? or don’t know his opinion on this issue?

          We assume that not everyone has an unambiguous opinion on this issue in our society. This is firstly. Secondly, I hope in a year there will be more and more like-minded people in our country (based on the trend). Thirdly, Putin will speak and conduct politics based on the interests and aspirations of our society. And if the people are against the indiscriminate stomping of I.V. Stalin, then I think Putin will not object and go against the people's memory. wink Maybe I fantasized with a one-year period, but the fact that this crap with de-stylization ends is for sure!
          It is not in vain that they say that the people deserve the government they have.
          And the same with television. They will do what our society demands. They will not go anywhere! Remember how last year we together achieved that we rented “4 days in May.” This is a dirty and deceitful film about the war with the participation of Guskov. Now almost the whole country knows this corrupt actor! And I hope that in a decent society they don’t give him a hand! We’ll do this with all the people who vilify the history and memory of the people. We don’t have to think that we are powerless, wears away stone water!
          1. Hleb
            Hleb 10 May 2013 19: 38 New
            +2
            Putin will speak and conduct policies based on the interests and aspirations of our society.

            you want to say that he announced the opinion of society when he said that during the reign of Stalin there were reprisals, crimes against his own people and such a price is unacceptable?
            in a year, there will be more of us on this site and generally like-minded people in the country
            the opinion of like-minded people on this site was announced by the president; are we society?
            Opinion on this issue, let us not all have an unequivocal opinion in our society.
            but don’t you think that brazen liberal disinformation cannot so easily split society and so sharply debated? And the question still arises: are those who agree with Putin who are these? enemies ?? as such people are called here?
            1. sergo0000
              sergo0000 10 May 2013 19: 48 New
              +1
              During the reign
              You feel the difference! He did not directly blame Stalin. Or do you think the government apparatus at that time was different from ours!? Not sure. If half the government now consists of liberals, then the “Comintern” leaders who remained after the October Revolution were not as an example more! And they, I assure you, were much worse with their ideas about the world revolution!
              1. Hleb
                Hleb 10 May 2013 19: 55 New
                0
                He did not directly blame Stalin.

                really?smile
                but don’t know why many people on this site run into Putin about the fact that he’s sitting in a parade? Don't they understand that "the apparatus of governing the country at that time was no different from ours, and half of the government consists of liberals"
                1. sergo0000
                  sergo0000 10 May 2013 20: 25 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Gleb
                  but don’t know why many people on this site run into Putin about the fact that he is sitting in a parade?

                  Unfortunately, I didn’t have the pleasure of watching the parade yesterday. I was at work. I didn’t see if he was sitting or accepting the passage of columns. There was an incident in the past, I don’t deny it. But people are changing. The president is changing too. I hope that understanding will come about and should manage our a multinational and multiconfessional country! I in no way idealize Putin, but honestly I don’t see a replacement for him at this stage. Once again I repeat. The society deserves the ruler it deserves! It may happen that over time a person appears who will replace him, but not Today. Society is too mottled now to please one not to carry out repressions against others! And it is not known which in the country has recently become larger. My personal opinion does not matter. Look at the root.
  • Rrv
    Rrv 10 May 2013 15: 49 New
    12
    --------------------
    1. Rrv
      Rrv 10 May 2013 15: 50 New
      +5
      ----------------------
    2. djon3volta
      djon3volta 10 May 2013 16: 02 New
      -15
      Quote: RRV
      --------------------

      RRV I remember your pictures in the topic about the hamster march on May 6th.
      1. Armata
        Armata 10 May 2013 16: 34 New
        10
        Quote: djon3volta
        RV I remember your pictures in the topic about the hamster march 6 in May.
        What is yours about? Well, let them come for me. If tomorrow you are gone, the country will not lose much. Well, let them put me in prison, do you think after that you will add patriotic comments? You are not doing anything except screaming for the country. So you probably understand where yesterday’s sock should score? Vadim Smirnov, you can ban me after this koment, but there’s just no patience to watch this empty call on the site.
        1. djon3volta
          djon3volta 10 May 2013 16: 41 New
          -2
          Quote: Mechanic
          there’s simply no patience to observe this

          soon they will ban for Putin’s support, I won’t be surprised belay
          Glory to Putin !!! GLORY TO RUSSIA!!! HOORAY!!!

          1. andrre122
            andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 56 New
            +8
            And here he is the cult of personality.
          2. Armata
            Armata 10 May 2013 16: 59 New
            +6
            Quote: djon3volta
            soon they will ban for Putin’s support, I won’t be surprised
            Glory to Putin !!! GLORY TO RUSSIA!!! HOORAY!!!
            That’s all the good of you, but why didn’t you copy the dumbbell in the quote? the true patriot does not wear cowards in the color of the flag and does not yell glory to the government. You are not a patriot, you’re just a jerk.
          3. aviamed90
            aviamed90 10 May 2013 17: 08 New
            11
            djon3volta

            Why are you and your Putin scampering around like a written bag? What in Russia, besides him, are no worthy people? And mistakes must be answered. Especially for such.
            1. djon3volta
              djon3volta 10 May 2013 17: 11 New
              0
              Quote: aviamed90
              Why are you rushing around with Putin

              how is that what? did you watch this video?

              1. Armata
                Armata 10 May 2013 17: 22 New
                +4
                Quote: djon3volta
                how is that what? did you watch this video?
                Well, judging by the video, we finally can mega cool. Answer the simple question, what are you doing for the country except that you post dubious videos? Pustozolon it in Africa and a puffer, but well, an Internet fighter is also suitable for you. You do not climb weakly on wikis, and it’s not bad at Rutub.
                1. yur
                  yur 10 May 2013 19: 40 New
                  +3
                  Excuse me, what are you doing for the country? Or does your idle talk have any special value?
          4. Rrv
            Rrv 10 May 2013 17: 33 New
            +6
            Quote: djon3volta

            Glory to Putin !!! GLORY TO RUSSIA!!! HOORAY!!!
            1. sergo0000
              sergo0000 10 May 2013 19: 34 New
              -3
              Rrv
              Well, this is generally unscrupulous on your part! Who privatized !? Putin !?
              I really didn’t know! Apparently now we’re not embarrassed about absolutely anything and everything is allowed. So know that you poke buttons without fear of responsibility for libel, thanks also to Putin! Enrage Internet trolls!
              1. Rrv
                Rrv 10 May 2013 19: 49 New
                +6
                Sergey, please rage less emotionally and treat the memory:
                1. sergo0000
                  sergo0000 10 May 2013 19: 59 New
                  +2
                  Quote: RRV
                  Sergey, please rage less emotionally and treat the memory:

                  My memory doesn’t betray me yet. Only you turn on your conscience and your memory and remember what wave Yeltsin came to at that time! I don’t take responsibility from myself and don’t scream at the top of my mind that Yeltsin didn’t support then. But this Order Yeltsin Putin will be a shameful order both for me and a dirty stain in my past. I did the right thing, that I handed it to-weare now, the whole society from the pages of the Internet so that they would not forget and make mistakes again !!!
                  It is a pity that the Order of Judah would not be stronger!
                  1. Rrv
                    Rrv 10 May 2013 20: 38 New
                    +6
                    Your words are very solemn, but their meaning is zero.

                    Can't you see what is happening with science, education, living standards, with the country at last? Yes, you see all this! Only instead of just to compare the FACTS, you, like in the 90s, are led to quasi-patriotic rhetoric, and come up with delusional conspiracy theories about the Chekist-patriot in the camp of liberals.

                    What worries Putin? Almost every day I hear from him about the business climate and the need for foreign investment in the economy. The Chubais pimple - Zhenya Fedorov - also often talks about foreign investment, and also says that 95% of Russian enterprises are de facto owned by foreigners.

                    Do you understand what investment is? The main investment instruments are loans and the purchase of shares, and the purchase of shares is essentially the purchase of an enterprise - in part or in full (depending on the volume of shares purchased).

                    Thus, the words “we need foreign investment” mean that THE SPEAKER OF THESE WORDS OFFERS FOREIGN CAPITAL TO BUY THE REMAINING 5% OF RUSSIAN ENTERPRISES, OR FOR A GOOD END TO EXPLODE THEM IN A LONG PIT BY MEANS!

                    Do you understand WHO you support ?!
                    1. sergo0000
                      sergo0000 10 May 2013 21: 16 New
                      -2
                      Quote: RRV
                      Thus, the words “we need foreign investment” mean that THE SPEAKER OF THESE WORDS OFFERS FOREIGN CAPITAL TO BUY THE REMAINING 5% OF RUSSIAN ENTERPRISES, OR FOR A GOOD END TO EXPLODE THEM IN A LONG PIT BY MEANS!

                      Not necessarily and not a fact. With a competent and correct policy of the central bank, this can be avoided. Well, and if the state also helps especially large and strategically important enterprises from time to time, then not everything is as bad as you write.
                      1. Rrv
                        Rrv 10 May 2013 22: 12 New
                        +1
                        Under what policy? For 13 years, the Central Bank’s policy was very specific and no one even tried to change it!

                        Then - how do you not change this policy, and investments, one hell, will remain either buying up or loans.

                        Do you all fantasize that if yes, if only - have you ever seen real affairs?

                        Who needs to be that every 4 to 6 years they trust someone who has thrown you repeatedly? Maybe you regularly give money and loans to those who do not regularly return them?

                        Putin’s policy has not changed for 13 years. President Putin made EBN. Putin came to Moscow on the recommendation of Chubais, who then worked at Putin's campaign headquarters. Putin worked with Sobchak with Medvedev. Putin dragged Medvedev to Moscow; Putin also did President Medvedev. What we are talking about?!
                      2. sergo0000
                        sergo0000 10 May 2013 23: 46 New
                        0
                        Quote: RRV
                        Putin’s policy has not changed for 13 years

                        And Moscow did not immediately build. And what do you suggest!? What system, system? Transplant all the oligarchs, shoot all thief-officials and follow the path of North Korea? So you won’t go abroad to rest. You will forget about the Internet. will become kilometer-long. I have no doubt that the left forces will find and untwist the candidate for the role of “dictator. Only you personally want this !? When, on behalf of this dictator, the local authorities tighten the screws so that you get into a loop from hunger and hopelessness.
                        Look around. In what country of Europe or Asia is the people living better than in Russia!? Our people have stopped for the most part to leave for work over the hill, and Asians roam to us in droves. Is there a good life? Americans are preparing for a civil war, and Europeans will soon become involuntary Muslims. Otherwise, they will cut it out. Juvenile deprives children of their parents and gives their pidos for adoption ... am. Bank deposits are frozen and sheared without asking.
                        The whole world is looking at Russia with hope, which can make the Russians create a more or less fair society.
                        I personally don’t care how Putin came to power, it’s important what he started to do after the EBN! And if I served in the army in 93 under a contract and did not see a salary for months, now young people are not the last to go to serve in the army based on material considerations There are questions to the board, but only questions. And they are resolved and are being resolved. And it’s very easy to defame a person sitting at a computer without knowing the real situation and the situation as a whole, it’s more difficult to apologize. If you later apologize to anyone.
                      3. Rrv
                        Rrv 11 May 2013 01: 39 New
                        +2
                        What do I suggest? Oddly enough, democracy, to put it bluntly, is democracy, which is nothing but the process of fulfilling the order (will) of citizens of the state by citizens themselves and (or) their representatives, taking into account the possibilities of natural, economic and social resources within the borders of the state.

                        Nobody is going to plant oligarchs, as we see, rather the opposite happens: wek.com.ua/article/50504/

                        I would not want to go along the path of North Korea, but Vova & ko over the past 10 years with the final entry into the WTO have done everything to finish off industry and agriculture - for this reason, queues may arise.

                        At the moment, no more than 25% of the population can afford to go abroad; the number is the same for restaurants and cafes.

                        The Internet? And what prevents us from developing our technologies? And why do you think a dictator? Without leadership in any way? Or maybe now the nuts are not tightened in a certain way? Didn’t you try to uphold the truth in our courts?

                        In the noose of hunger and hopelessness? And find me the official statistics on the number of homeless people and street children. I just didn’t succeed - it turns out that the state is not dealing with this issue, but the bastards of NGOs voiced numbers from 5 to 9 million, of which up to 40% are children!

                        In which country do people live better? And you look at the ratings of the standard of living, or follow my comments - I laid out statistics on minimum wages as a percentage of GDP per capita.
                        Our people stopped leaving, because those who could have already left!
                        Do Asians come to us from Japan or South Korea?

                        The USA and Europe have their own problems and troubles - so what? What does the fact that from our point of view they have a worse situation on some issues? What do you prefer to be equal to - for the best, or for the worst?

                        Juvenile? And who is pushing her with us, is it not by chance that Putin & ko? And who originally concluded the contract for the supply of children in 3.14ndostan - not Putin? And the fact that we can instill a lot of money in show business, which is a big sport, and for disabled children who can be cured, volunteers have to collect money - is this normal ?!

                        What do you care about bank deposits? Thanks to the great Pu 2, the country's irrevocable annual budget is raising the US economy - haven't you thought about that? The world is not looking at Russia with hope, but licking its lips in anticipation of dinner!

                        What did Putin begin to do after coming to power? Yes, nothing special - he began to row everything for himself & ko, as before him and EBN did.

                        You did not see a salary then, but others do not see now - Remind Pikalevo? Maybe someone sat there, or paid a forfeit?
                        Youth goes to a contract from hopelessness, Kadyrov receives a hero, but they don’t even remember Efentiev! The minimum salary is BELOW! cost of living! The average salary in the country is at a level at which not only should, but MAY be minimal! Financing of the Caucasus is 10 times higher than the rest of the regions - and this is through money, not development of production.

                        These are not “questions” - this is a betrayal of the interests of the country.
                      4. sergo0000
                        sergo0000 11 May 2013 07: 06 New
                        0
                        I read your post and how "Echo of Moscow" listened. smile They are trying their best to operate with the same derivatives. They even agreed that Putin is a traitor to the Motherland! It’s not surprising that they have such a large audience. It seems that everything is correct, but here’s the thing, why both you and them have one to blame for everything GDP !? Your desires to remove him from power coincide in a surprising way! And the West does not wait until the rest of the society in Russia "sees" and becomes like you and you like democratic citizens. Enough to deceive us! Putin down from the Kremlin! ... Only now, who will replace him interestingly!? Can you tell me the candidacy!? And we will consider together!
                        Still, it’s strange to get it, like we want the same thing, but we don’t find a common language. People on Bolotnaya also wanted to solve everything radically and as quickly as possible, but this is revolution. And Russia cannot survive one more. Therefore, do not let the mental ones torment you torment for Pikalyovo and Serdyukov, those who are supposed to deal with them, but rather live today and enjoy life! I’m sure you personally get paid on time and if you use the Internet, there’s nothing wink And do not read anything liberal in the morning. Everything will be fine! hi
                      5. sergo0000
                        sergo0000 11 May 2013 09: 25 New
                        +1

                        German expert on Putin.
                      6. Rrv
                        Rrv 11 May 2013 12: 00 New
                        0
                        Quote: sergo0000
                        why do both you and them have one GDP to blame for everything !?


                        He is a personification of power - listing ALL surnames will take too much time.


                        Your desires to remove him from power coincide in a surprising way! And the West does not wait until the rest of the society in Russia "sees" and becomes like you and democratic citizens.


                        Yes, in words.


                        Only who is interested in replacing him!? Can you suggest a candidate!? And we will consider together!


                        During the imitation of the orange threat, 2nd in line was Zu.
                        As for me, I already called the names - Mukhin, Katasonov, etc.


                        And Russia cannot survive another one
                        .

                        Justification? Or did you believe the word Pu? )))
                        And where does the revolution come from? Change of Power is not a revolution yet.


                        Therefore, let you not be tormented by mental anguish for Pikalyovo and Serdyukov, those who are supposed to do it should deal with them, but rather live today

                        You blamed yourself so patriotically, laid out the Judah medal. And what about the problems of other people ...
                        This, Sergei, is called - cattle psychology. negative
                      7. sergo0000
                        sergo0000 11 May 2013 16: 26 New
                        0
                        Mukhin about ralliesI read at one time the enthusiasm of this engineer winked
                        I especially liked the Katyn revelations. I’m directly zombie with my investigations. I even went to his official website and got acquainted with the biography (also naturally official).
                        ... In 1995, the government of Kazakhstan transferred the Ermakovsky ferroalloy plant to foreigners. Mukhin is trying to save the enterprise from the invaders. He is fired, but the prosecutor cancels the dismissal. Mukhin is trying to raise the workers to fight for their rights and insists on the creation of a strike committee. However, the workers passively support the new owners, who still survive Mukhin from the factory.
                        And now as it is.
                        Information about the life path of Mukhin is available for free study in Pedivikia. In 1973 he graduated from the Dnepropetrovsk Metallurgical Institute. In 1973-1995 worked at the Ermakovsky ferroalloy plant in Kazakhstan, holding positions from engineer to deputy director.
                        With the onset of the nineties, Mukhin came to a harsh change. The plant in which he worked was bought by a Japanese corporation. Since the Mukhin skills of the shovel manager were not needed by the Japanese, they attempted to expel him from the factory. Mukhin tried to organize mass support for himself by the workers of the plant, but he flipped and epically leaked. The Japs, however, also decided to settle the conflict amicably. Mukhin was given 24 thousand dirty green papers, for which he bought an apartment in default city and organized his cozy newspaper “Duel”.
                        And what does he say about the great nuclear physicist Landau !! (easy to find on Wiki.)
                        And here is the opinion of his contemporaries: Chief editor of the journal “Taxes and Financial Law” A. V. Bryzgalin, candidate of legal sciences: “... I completely want to agree with the famous opposition writer and journalist Yu. I. Mukhin, who believes that the stratification of society it is necessary to carry out not by social classes and by belonging to the means of production (as communists), or by nationalities (as representatives of social-nationalism), but according to the principle of “creator” and “parasite.” ”[8]
                        Russian political scientist, Doctor of Political Sciences S. F. Chernyakhovsky: “Yuri Ignatievich is an extravagant man: for example, he has Hitler - the greatest commander of all time, more talented not only that of Zhukov, but also of Napoleon and Suvorov combined. Now, he has Nemtsov - well done! I think that the majority of Russian citizens do not share his opinion. ”[9]
                        Here is your ambiguous idol! smile For me personally, he is one of those patriots who would not have been better.
                      8. Rrv
                        Rrv 12 May 2013 09: 22 New
                        0
                        Quote: sergo0000
                        Mukhin about ralliesI read at one time the enthusiasm of this engineer


                        You yourself voice the problem, but for some reason you cannot understand it: it is not a matter of surnames and their carriers, it is a matter of the country's movement vector, and how much this vector corresponds to the ideas of the majority.
                        The president is not a sacred cow. The President is only the supreme coordinator and guarantor in matters of implementation of the Basic Law. He must not be a politician - he must be an ethic.

                        Reread again my definition of democracy - it is one hundred percent consistent even with the current Constitution, this is what it should be - citizens make an order, the Government, personified by the guarantor, executes it and is responsible for how it does it. All this is in the Basic Law!

                        But in fact, we see that the Basic Law is violated from and to that socio-economic policy runs counter to the demand of the majority, has a neoliberal orientation vector and defends the interests of minorities. All this, in conjunction with global trends, leads us to neo-feudalism.

                        I do not agree with this. You - decide for yourself.
  • ia-ai00
    ia-ai00 12 May 2013 12: 48 New
    +1
    So Putin is not trying to fix something in terms of "privatization" ...
  • Apollo
    Apollo 10 May 2013 17: 36 New
    +4
    Quote: djon3volta
    soon they will ban for Putin’s support, I won’t be surprised




    no one will ban anyone for their support here, but for the meaningless cheers and meaningless your comments you will personally get the minuses from me, Satisfies ?!
    PSdjon3volta VV Putin does not need your support, he is already elected and acting president of the Russian Federation.
    1. djon3volta
      djon3volta 10 May 2013 19: 03 New
      -4
      Quote: Apollon
      djon3volta V.V. Putin does not need your support

      Putin needs the support of each individual person. The more people support Putin, the more reliable his power, is it logical? Here I, as a resident of Russia, feel that Putin’s people in Russia REAL support, but on the Internet, of course, the advantage is not in his favor. But again I want recall that 64% of those who came to the polls voted for Putin, those who did not come are their problems, you had to go!
      you don’t think that there are so many of you on the Internet, I mean those who are against Putin, you (Anitputins) can’t even collect 200 thousand signatures for a visa regime with Asia on the Internet, and more than 60 million Russians visit Runet even at 4.5 millionth of Georgia collected more than 1 million signatures for the resignation of Sakashvili !!! and in 143 millionth Russia it’s too lazy to collect a million signatures ??? now think how many people on the Internet are interested in politics))) even this site has how many visitors a day, people 500-800 typed? Even if all 800 are against Putin, is that a lot? ))) you can even see the minuses, well, they put 10-30 minuses to the person, which means 10-30 people against Putin, but is this a lot? laughing
      1. Apollo
        Apollo 10 May 2013 19: 23 New
        +4
        Quote: djon3volta
        Putin needs the support of every single person


        Vladimir Putin will not need support. If there is a well-adjusted personnel policy:
        Questions to you
        1. Why did Surkov resign (or was dismissed) ?! Doesn’t you think that this is a yellow card in relation to D. Medvedev?! And that means to himself.
        2. In the hands of the RF IC, there are thousands of facts regarding Serdyukov and Vasilyeva. Why, one is still passing as a witness and the other has taken a preventive measure against house arrest. How to understand this.
        3. The Minister of Education, Livanov, another Minister Skrynnik there are a lot of questions in relation to them.
        4. Skolkovo, this is generally a separate issue, and extensive.
        5. On what basis did MP L. Ponomarev receive a fee of several hundred thousand dollars, and for what. Explain on whose side this fee was issued ?!
        6. What can you write about the activities of the former head of OJSC "Resorts of the Caucasus"
        7. What positive aspects do you personally see in the activities (with the exception of the ministries of the power block) of the government ?!
        8 And ​​finally, describe the large-scale, multi-billion dollar thefts committed in the country.

        Continue or enough ?!

        Yes, I almost forgot, I would like to receive your feedback about Chubais. laughing
        1. djon3volta
          djon3volta 10 May 2013 19: 38 New
          -5
          Quote: Apollon
          Questions to you

          Listen, Appalon, can I ask you one question? are you a citizen of which country? you do not live in Russia as I noticed. here tell me if you do not live in Russia that you care so much about our country in Russia? do you have little power here on the forum, you are a moderator on a Russian site, but you live not in Russia.
          I was removed from the group of Kurginyants on Facebook a year ago, and you know who the admins were there? one from Armenia another from Georgia. wink and these people are residents of other states, go into Russian affairs and decide to whom what can be written or not. They removed me because I raised the topic that the Kurghyans also rallied everything, then it’s against that if only to rally and protest, and I compared them with the Orangemen who also rally constantly.
          here I don’t go to Ukrainian, Georgian, Uzbek sites, and I don’t write DOLA YANUKOVICH or SLAVA YANUKOVICH there. I’m sitting on RuNet, on Russian sites, I don’t go into the politics of other states in their ukrnet or on the Internet.
          1. Apollo
            Apollo 10 May 2013 19: 53 New
            +4
            Quote: djon3volta
            Listen, Appalon, can I ask you one question? are you a citizen of which country? you do not live in Russia as I noticed. here tell me if you do not live in Russia that you care so much about our country in Russia? do you have little power here on the forum, you are a moderator on a Russian site, but you live not in Russia.
            I was removed from the group of Kurginyants on Facebook a year ago, and you know who the admins were there? one from Armenia another from Georgia. and these people are residents of other states, go into Russian affairs and decide to whom what can be written or not. They removed me because I raised the topic that the Kurghyans also rallied everything, then it’s against that if only to rally and protest, and I compared them with the Orangemen who also rally constantly.


            First, do not listen, but listen.
            Secondly, at least a lot of questions.
            Thirdly, with regard to my citizenship, although I do not live in Russia, many things connect me with this beautiful country. Follow my past comments. You will find answers there.
            Fourth, just a few minutes ago, one demotivator was deleted, one visitor, I won’t mention anyone (admins or other moderators can easily check this) for disrespectful attitude towards V.V. Putin.
            Fifth, I, unlike some Russian citizens, do not write shortened the name of the president, but write in full, guess what I'm hinting at.
            Sixth, we were in one state and was born during the time of this state, so the fate of Russia and its future are not indifferent to me.
            Seventh mess in my state is enough, you can believe me.
            The last one, but what about the questions I posed. Leaving aside my questions, I think that you have nothing to answer, which means without a meaningful discussion with you, entering does not make sense. laughing

            PS That's the trouble, you can’t even identify by the flag of which state I am a citizen, well, so click on the flag with your cursor. Everything is clear with you. laughing
            1. djon3volta
              djon3volta 10 May 2013 20: 15 New
              -7
              Quote: Apollon
              thus, I believe that you have nothing to answer, which means that without a meaningful discussion with you, entering does not make sense.

              why can’t I answer? I can - I’m not the defendant and you are not an investigator, I’m not worried about these guys that you listed at the time. If you want a specific answer - turn to Navalny, he’s our main online anti-corruption fighter, he will tell you everything, who, how much and from whom he stole, laughing he cares very much that he’s already climbing out of his skin, turning inside out, thinking about Russia, about Russian peasants laughing
              1. Apollo
                Apollo 10 May 2013 20: 24 New
                +2
                Quote: djon3volta
                why can't i answer? can


                empty rhetoric, see answer above.
    2. valokordin
      valokordin 10 May 2013 19: 06 New
      +2
      Quote: Apollon
      PSdjon3volta VV Putin does not need your support, he is already elected and acting president of the Russian Federation.

      Vladimir Vladimirovich does not need anyone's support, including yours.
  • Babon
    Babon 10 May 2013 17: 01 New
    +1
    A clear remark at the end)))
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Boris55
    Boris55 10 May 2013 17: 43 New
    +1
    Quote: RRV
    --------------------

    At that time (sitting in the parade in the picture), Medvedev was the boss, and Putin was a subordinate. Can you imagine what would happen if Putin stood up?
    At that level, such errors are not allowed. It is possible to substitute a neighbor at the household level - they don’t forgive it there and they don’t allow such mistakes.
    Medvedev and Putin are representatives of different clans and they have their own interests. Putin is a spokesman for security officials. Medvedev - Western liberals. Perhaps sometimes these interests coincide.
    The media (TV) constantly showing one after another in the news thereby, at a subconscious level, form an opinion of their unity, so that the people do not have a distinction between them, there is no doubt about their common "tricks", so that the sins of one are automatically attributed to the other ...

    Putin, as president, supreme commander in chief, hosted parades while standing that year and that.
    1. Rrv
      Rrv 10 May 2013 18: 19 New
      0
      Quote: Boris55
      Medvedev and Putin are representatives of different clans and they have their own interests. Putin is a spokesman for security officials. Medvedev - Western liberals.


      Can you give any FACTS to suggest that this is true?

      I, in turn, want to remind you that Medvedev and Putin have been members of the same clan since their joint work in the mayor’s office of St. Petersburg in the year 91, although it is likely that they met earlier - at LSU.
      1. Boris55
        Boris55 10 May 2013 20: 41 New
        -2
        Quote: RRV
        Can you give any FACTS to suggest that this is true?

        I can say that Putin has done useful for Russia.
        I can’t say that I did Medvedev useful for Russia.

        You need examples:
        President Medvedev - what happened to Libya
        President Putin - what about Syria.

        More: http://klin.hutt.ru/viewtopic.php?id=758#p1408
        If you do not see the difference, I feel sorry for you.
        1. Rrv
          Rrv 10 May 2013 21: 57 New
          0
          These are not facts, Boris, this is the implementation of agreements with Syria and propaganda.

          But these are the facts: the subsistence minimum for the able-bodied population in the 4th quarter of 2012 is 7 thousand 263 rubles.
          The minimum wage in 2012 is 4 thousand 611 rubles.

          The minimum wage as a percentage of GDP (PPP) per capita is 12% (17.5% of nominal GDP), minus 13 percent tax.
          Minimum wage as a percentage of GDP per capita:
          USA, Brazil - 33%, not taxed.
          Germany, France, Canada (commodity economy) - 38%, not taxed.
          Great Britain, Cyprus, China - 50%, tax is minimal.
          Australia (commodity economy) - 67%, minimum wage tax 17%.

          You do not spare me, Boris - you spare 75% of the population of Russia.
          1. Boris55
            Boris55 10 May 2013 23: 08 New
            -1
            And how do you like this video.



            I have some other data. According to the State Department and the CIA, Russia is at 5, 8 place in the world.
            http://klin.hutt.ru/viewtopic.php?id=761
            1. Rrv
              Rrv 11 May 2013 03: 34 New
              -1
              Quote: Boris55
              _

              Answered in PM.
  • Black
    Black 10 May 2013 15: 50 New
    +4
    For even underdeveloped idiot It is known that now in Russia he sits in prisons as much as he did under Stalin. And in the USA even more.

    Oh how !!!! where am I now first of all, after the holidays, to the hospital or again to school?

    But the broadcast program was really annoying.
    On one channel, lascivious girls drove 4 hours of vodka to the front, on another half-platoon of cheerful saboteurs, they gouged half of Germany, the sire women were friends with the teacher all day ....
    1. washi
      washi 10 May 2013 19: 50 New
      +4
      Please note. Not on one channel, because of the political correctness, they did not show how the Cossacks, Caucasians and Kalmyks fought on the side of the Germans. And the UPA and the “Russians” were shown.
    2. Andrey from Tver
      Andrey from Tver 10 May 2013 20: 16 New
      +3
      Yes, here’s a movie about delivering vodka to the front, which made me very angry. They mixed vodka with the film "And the Dawns Here Are Quiet", it turned out to be complete crap. And the film must have been made as part of a state order. Who claims such scenarios, aren't they ashamed?
      1. aviator65
        aviator65 14 May 2013 23: 10 New
        0
        Also, please note. In almost all the new movie masterpieces about the war, the main characters certainly either served time or were unjustly affected by the regime. Take the same "Fighters" or "convoy." And yet, surely all political workers are rascals. Just a sort of charge stamps. In general, for the umpteenth time I revised "Only the old people go into battle" and received real pleasure.
  • piotr534
    piotr534 10 May 2013 15: 50 New
    13
    YOU, WHO'S CLOSE AND FAMILY HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE STALIN CAMPS, YOU HAVE LIBERATED WITH OSVENTSIM, BUCHENVALD AND DAHAU ...
    Yes, combining the two parts of this phrase into one is not entirely beautiful, or rather, not at all beautiful. What is this, stupidity or malice? My grandfather is a front-line soldier, and his brother was shot in 37, after the war he was rehabilitated. But even in a nightmare I can’t imagine what he would say.
    1. andrre122
      andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 33 New
      +2
      There is no stupidity in such things.
  • Rrv
    Rrv 10 May 2013 15: 57 New
    +4
    ------------------------
    1. Rrv
      Rrv 10 May 2013 15: 58 New
      0
      =============================
      1. Vladimirets
        Vladimirets 10 May 2013 16: 06 New
        +3
        You at least decipher what you posted here and what you wanted to say.
    2. djon3volta
      djon3volta 10 May 2013 16: 04 New
      -3
      RRV, see here.
      1. Rrv
        Rrv 10 May 2013 16: 52 New
        +5
        Quote: Vladimirets
        You at least decipher what you posted here and what you wanted to say.


        What is there to decipher? Are hundreds of millions announced? No. That’s why the hell to all kinds of memorials about these hundreds of millions of 3.14 z dit.



        Quote: djon3volta
        RRV, see here.


        Should I be scared of an ice pick? belay

        laughing
        1. sergeschern
          sergeschern 10 May 2013 19: 48 New
          0
          My uncle was a teacher at the Tomsk Artillery School during the war. During the lecture, he “blurted out” that some German gun was “very good at battle” (he himself was a drill and got to school after being wounded), so the next day he was taken away and the three CCA gave him 20 years! One of the cadets "showed vigilance"! - WELCOME TO THE GULAG!
          1. Rrv
            Rrv 10 May 2013 20: 06 New
            +1
            Quote: sergeschern
            WELCOME TO THE GULAG!


            It may well be - a similar statement could be regarded as an undermining of morale. I don’t presume to argue now how stupid or not, but this sentence is absolutely legal.
            On the other hand, very good reasons are needed to send a professional officer to the camp.

            PS My neighbor’s father spent almost the entire war in captivity. Then he shook that they would come for him. So he died in the mid-80s without waiting.
          2. alexandr00070
            alexandr00070 11 May 2013 01: 16 New
            +1
            Quote: sergeschern
            One of the cadets "showed vigilance"! - WELCOME TO THE GULAG!

            You think there are few such vigilant cadets nearby
          3. ia-ai00
            ia-ai00 11 May 2013 07: 56 New
            +1
            So, such "vigilant cadets" are to blame mainly for those events.
            We have a relative of the neighbor who was treated to dinner, also said that he thinks that there is more freedom in the West. The neighbor "thanked" for dinner, and a relative was sentenced to 10 years. I have no doubt that these "cleaners" also embellished, which would certainly be ... But he never said that he was "put" by Stalin! He “remembered” with a “kind” word until the death of his neighbor, a bastard. So do not blame everything on Stalin, look around you, with WHOM would you "NOT GO ATTACK" ?!
  • andrre122
    andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 01 New
    15
    "YOU, WHOSE CLOSE AND FAMILY HAVE PASSED THROUGH THE STALIN CASES, YOU RELEASED Auschwitz, Buchenwald And Dahau ..."
    Specifically, they spat in the soul and spoiled the whole mood.
    Why all this pathos, then to spoil.
    That’s how they spoiled the whole day. On Russia 1 and Russia 24 they talked about the heroic Ingush people who fell victim to Stalin’s mistakes. About powerless collective farmers and post-war hunger. And as a result, Soviet agriculture did not come to their senses until the collapse of the Union.
    But undeniably a moment of silence was the final chord of the insanity of power.
    On the one hand cheers victory. You must remember and be proud. Flawless licking of veterans. On the other hand, inadequate performances.
    The patient is more dead than alive.
  • deman73
    deman73 10 May 2013 16: 08 New
    +9
    So traitors in power
  • arkgrz
    arkgrz 10 May 2013 16: 11 New
    -5
    the author has a Russian problem .. the image is sort of collective .. i.e. as it were, all are listed, then he participated in the war .. and no one wavered. and this bumblebee is looking for an excuse .. clings to the words .. well, it’s necessary to betray .. to drop it. to express a grain of doubt ..
    1. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 11 May 2013 01: 35 New
      +3
      Quote: arkgrz
      the author has a Russian problem .. the image is sort of collective .. i.e. as it were, all are listed, then he participated in the war .. and no one wavered. and this bumblebee is looking for an excuse .. clings to the words .. well, it’s necessary to betray .. to drop it. to express a grain of doubt ..

      in my opinion you have a problem not only with Russian, but also with an understanding of the problem itself, to read out the exploits of soldiers along with repressions (the main peak of which occurred in 37-39 years, then the repressions were not so big and mainly in the case, well, this if you also read relevant literature or a documentary filmets), and so the repression carried out during the war (no matter how cruel it looked - in many ways just brought Victory closer, there are saboteurs and traitors and cowards, and nations (small) waiting the arrival of the Germans, etc.) So the phrase can only be called a provocation, so what a spit, then spit ............ just the media got too big and lost in reality. By the way, I present the movie with 8.35 minutes interesting info on repressions, whitewashing Stalin
  • shpuntik
    shpuntik 10 May 2013 16: 15 New
    +5
    Anna Akhmatova, in turn, received Pasternak's poem "Scouts" and the verse "Downstream". Moreover, the “Scouts” went to her in a monstrous form - here the editor-home-made drastically pulled out. He so smartly jumped half of the verses, trying to shove the poem into one page, that the plot began to look like a monstrous mishmash, and the author a graphomaniac, unable to think coherently:
    piotr534 Today, 15:50 PM
    What is this, stupidity or malice?

    Rather, the second, not everyone left for the hill.
    Quote: “My humanitarian mother is a great poet and connoisseur of old Moscow architecture
    http://lleo.me/dnevnik/2013/05/04.html
  • KazaK Bo
    KazaK Bo 10 May 2013 16: 19 New
    19
    Not only on our 9th TV didn’t look at its best ... remember Cosmonautics Day ... except that there was nothing on the screens in the news releases ... The STAR TV channel (which their empty Majesty Mityai wants to close, they say no one is watching!) ... And the selection of films for these days of the Great Victory Day is set for viewing in the main film where the Russian people only suffer ... where they smash us to pieces ... And where is the positive? This is one side of the issue.
    Second - According to the Charter, if one soldier gives military honor to another, then the other (chief) must answer .... Soldiers passing in the front line give military honor to their higher commanders! Or am I mistaken after 27 years of service, having risen to several big stars, and 23 years of retirement coexistence? I don’t think so! Therefore, this should be called in our own words - ignorance and malicious not fulfilling our statutory duties on the part of our top military commanders, simply should not even be discussed. This is our shame and nonsense!
    1. bunta
      bunta 10 May 2013 17: 06 New
      +2
      Quote: KazaK Bo
      one soldier salutes another military honor

      In the Russian army, military honor is no longer given!

      CHARTER OF THE INTERNAL SERVICE:

      War greeting

      43. The military salutation is the embodiment of the friendly unity of the military, a testament of mutual respect and a manifestation of a common culture. When meeting (overtaking), all military personnel are obliged to greet each other, strictly observing the rules established by the Combat Charter of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation. Subordinates and juniors in military rank are the first to greet, and in an equal position the first is greeted by one who considers himself to be more polite and well-mannered.

      44. Military personnel are also required to welcome:
      - the tomb of the Unknown Soldier;
      ....
    2. ekama1
      ekama1 10 May 2013 18: 20 New
      +5
      And on STS cartoons with moronic animation the second day
      1. washi
        washi 10 May 2013 19: 58 New
        +3
        All is correct. No honor or conscience. Why change the charters for decades?
  • Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 10 May 2013 16: 26 New
    -14
    Before discussing this article, listen to the text again during a moment of silence. The author of this article is a provocateur. There are no such words there! Therefore, friends do not believe liars. Nobody can disgrace Russia! Moreover, an author with an Israeli surname ...
    1. andrre122
      andrre122 10 May 2013 16: 38 New
      +3
      Everything is there. You yourself are a provocateur. And not smart.
      1. Ivanovich47
        Ivanovich47 10 May 2013 16: 42 New
        -8
        You found such words in the text during a moment of silence, no! And then what are you talking about?
        1. Renat
          Renat 10 May 2013 18: 16 New
          +6
          There were these words. Personally, I heard it myself. That is exactly what happened.
        2. bubla5
          bubla5 10 May 2013 22: 47 New
          +1
          100% confirm
    2. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 11 May 2013 02: 08 New
      +1
      Quote: Ivanovich47
      Before discussing this article, listen to the text again during a moment of silence. The author of this article is a provocateur. There are no such words there! Therefore, friends do not believe liars. Nobody can disgrace Russia! Especially an author with an Israeli surname ..

      before writing yourself listen at 3,10 minutes, and in comments there is a video for 2009, this phrase is there too, so we have been hammered into it for a long time, and the corrupt media are shaming us
  • kmike
    kmike 10 May 2013 16: 33 New
    +6
    Those people who had to visit the Stalinist camps, and with the outbreak of the war were released were not embittered by the authorities and did not follow Vlasov, but went to fight for their homeland, they deserve even more respect. And Hitler had to remember that. the people in the Soviet Union tormented by these repressions will take a turn to serve him, but he was mistaken, the people stood in a different line.
  • The comment was deleted.
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    2. djon3volta
      djon3volta 10 May 2013 17: 24 New
      -8
      Quote: Ivanovich47
      Provocateur, threw the evil seed.

      I also wanted to write about this in detail and relishly that NO ONE noticed, and one he (the author) noticed something somewhere. introduce these negative stuffing about the country, the president, the government, the church, and so on. This is done on purpose, and most importantly, who supports provocateurs also understands why all this is being done.
      thank God that out of 143 million people, about 60 million visit the Internet, but all sorts of sites are read by thousands, and only hundreds of people visit individual sites. They can’t capture television (swamp, Trotskyites, liberoids), thank God for the millionth audience, unlike a couple of hundred hamsters that scurry around on a Runet 24 hours a day, with all sorts of corruption, explosions, beggars, and all kinds of negative nonsense. It’s worthlessly gone by May 6, they didn’t overthrow Putin)))
      1. sergeschern
        sergeschern 10 May 2013 19: 54 New
        0
        Himself not tired of ass licking power, posing as an idiot?
        1. djon3volta
          djon3volta 10 May 2013 20: 21 New
          -4
          Quote: sergeschern
          I’m not tired of myself

          Zdarova Leonid Ilyich hi
          well, whoever should confront you, opponents of the government. do you also do it the same way yourself. isn’t it? would put you all in a heap, in real life would look at us who you are and what you are, although I can roughly imagine how you look even, all those who are against.
          I remembered, one here somehow spread his photo, the topwar sits at the computer site, the physiognomy is frowning, some kind of evil))) I thought that some people looked like that)))
          1. sergeschern
            sergeschern 10 May 2013 22: 49 New
            +4
            Yes, here I am. I hope that even the granddaughter will see some changes in our homeland!
            1. Apollo
              Apollo 10 May 2013 22: 51 New
              +1
              Quote: sergeschern
              Yes, here I am. I hope that at least a granddaughter


              granddaughter plus and God grant her health good
  • Genady1976
    Genady1976 10 May 2013 16: 38 New
    +2
    This minute must be shown
  • Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 10 May 2013 16: 44 New
    +8
    Criminals convicted by the people's court for espionage, betrayal, theft, desertion, murders, etc., went through forced labor camps (which suddenly made them Stalinist), they had nothing to do with Victory, and only a dirty bastard could say that scoundrel.
  • slaventi
    slaventi 10 May 2013 16: 45 New
    +8
    "YOU, WHOSE CLOSE AND KIND WENT THROUGH THE STALIN CASES, YOU RELEASED Auschwitz, Buchenwald and Dahau, this phrase is, by and large, another ideological diversion. There is no coincidence, everything was done in a targeted manner, like Stalin like German fascism, etc. It’s necessary to understand that the so-called Russian television has not been such for a very long time. Almost absolutely all central media since the 90 years have been subordinate to the US Department of State. As well as NPOs, they receive billions of dollars and are leading odryvnuyu work against his naroda.Smi are now the main point of amerikantsev.Bez support their entire colony management system razrushitsya.Poetomu postvlena priority, on the conclusion of the media under external control.
    1. Ivanovich47
      Ivanovich47 10 May 2013 16: 48 New
      -6
      Stop grinding your tongue, find a better job
      1. Narkom
        Narkom 10 May 2013 17: 06 New
        +4
        ivanych47, We should have listened better. not fictions push now
    2. andrre122
      andrre122 10 May 2013 17: 01 New
      +5
      "One must understand that the so-called Russian television has not been such for a very long time. Almost absolutely all central mass media have been subordinate to the US Department of State since the 90s. As well as NPOs, they receive billions of dollars and carry out subversive work against their people."
      Right.
      1. Merchant
        Merchant 10 May 2013 17: 09 New
        -6
        DO YOU DO NOT OURSELVES FROM THESE NCOs?
        1. the polar
          the polar 10 May 2013 19: 43 New
          +2
          Quote: Merchant
          DO YOU DO NOT OURSELVES FROM THESE NCOs?

          And you?
    3. sergeschern
      sergeschern 10 May 2013 20: 04 New
      +3
      Just like small children: like this, does the State Department directly manage the media? Without intermediaries? With the connivance of the UK, the prosecutor's office, and the "guarantor" of the constitution? Much easier to explain it in one word - tied!
  • Goblin 28
    Goblin 28 10 May 2013 16: 46 New
    10
    Quote: RRV
    ----------------------

    I would also add to the wrecked Germans of the convicts and Cossacks of the Jews. In every film, there is always a heroic Jew and “evil” Russians mocking him with his family. By the way, many veterans now openly say that in today's films and the media there is an excessive heroization of the participation of the “children of Israel” in the Great Patriotic War. But if you read the book Shumilina A.I. "Vanka-company", and other front-line authors, everything looks completely different.
    And, as one of my Odessa comrades says - And what about the names of the scriptwriters, directors and the leadership of our television channels, did you expect something else?
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. Rrv
      Rrv 10 May 2013 17: 21 New
      +5
      Quote: Leshy 28
      I would also add to the wrecked Germans of the convicts and Cossacks of the Jews.


      There is such a thing.




      Quote: Leshy 28
      But if you read the book Shumilina A.I. "Vanka-company", and other front-line authors, everything looks completely different.


      To put it mildly ... laughing
  • erased
    erased 10 May 2013 16: 52 New
    11
    Yes, this moment has hooked strongly! No chance! The official line of power - it will soon apologize to the West for the very fact of the existence of Russians.
    The reaction is very interesting if power falls to it! ..
    1. andrre122
      andrre122 10 May 2013 17: 12 New
      +6
      "She will soon apologize to the West for the very fact of the existence of the Russians."
      Well said.
    2. Ivanovich47
      Ivanovich47 10 May 2013 17: 14 New
      -9
      You look like your helicopter
    3. lelikas
      lelikas 10 May 2013 20: 17 New
      0
      Quote: erased
      she will soon apologize to the West for the very fact of the existence of the Russians.

      In fact, we must apologize to everyone and all at once (let all the "victims" make a list), after which all claims and accusations against the USSR and Russia should be considered unfounded. Against those who disagree with this, impose sanctions.
  • Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 10 May 2013 17: 00 New
    +1
    You do not like the Western slurp that Russia is slowly rising from its knees. here and bark. spit saliva ..
  • aviamed90
    aviamed90 10 May 2013 17: 03 New
    +9
    "YOU, WHOSE CLOSE AND FAMILY WENT THROUGH THE STALIN CAMP" (if it really sounded on TV).

    I also think that this is not a topic. Does the speaker talk about the winners? So talk about them! Is there really nothing to say for 4 years of war? So remember all this ...

    If you want to talk about the victims of Stalinism, this is not appropriate here. Not at this event. This is a separate topic!
  • Alexssanderr
    Alexssanderr 10 May 2013 17: 04 New
    -9
    It seems that the author of the article is sick!
    1. Narkom
      Narkom 10 May 2013 17: 07 New
      11
      The one who wrote the text before the moment of silence is sick.
    2. Masterzserg
      Masterzserg 11 May 2013 20: 23 New
      +1
      Quote: Alexssanderr
      It seems that the author of the article is sick!
      - he’s a hysteric, and he even caught the bullshit how many fair men)))
      Well, now shout together: meeeeeeeeee)
  • Narkom
    Narkom 10 May 2013 17: 10 New
    +3
    Remember! Centuries later, in a year, remember!
    For those who will never come again, remember!
    Do not Cry! In the throat, keep moaning, bitter groans.
    In memory of the fallen, be worthy! Always worthy!
    Bread and song, a dream and poetry, a spacious life!
    Every second, every breath, be worthy!
    People! While hearts are beating, remember!
    At what price is happiness won - please remember!
    Sending your song in flight - remember!
    For those who will never sing, remember!
    Tell your children about them to remember!
    Tell the children of the children about them, so they will remember it too!
    At all times of the Immortal Earth - remember!
    Leading ships to the twinkling stars - remember the dead!
    Meet the tremulous spring, people of the Earth!
    Kill the war, curse the war, people of the earth!
    Carry your dream through the years and fill your life! ...
    But about those who will never come again - conjure - remember!
    Robert Christmas.
  • dizelniy
    dizelniy 10 May 2013 17: 19 New
    10
    Anyway, JV Stalin is the greatest statesman in the history of Russia - Russia. No attempt to discredit the Soviet past will lead to good. There is something to compare. A camp was created by Leib Bornstein, if anyone forgot.
  • Bezarius
    Bezarius 10 May 2013 17: 25 New
    +8
    I don’t understand at all with what Stalin the “bloody tyrant” was, when all such enlightened Europe killed hundreds of millions of people around the world. Or didn’t the type of those who died in European colonies around the world count people there?
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Igarr
    Igarr 10 May 2013 17: 29 New
    21
    Patients are all those who do not understand shame .. this insert ..
    "Relatives and friends who passed through the Stalinist concentration camps .." - and what is so pathetic?
    Well let's continue ... just hold on ...
    "Those who crap before sending to the front, those who crawl before the words - Halt, Tsuryuk .."
    "Those who jerked off the card ....
    "Those who shot in the forehead to their friend at the request of Bendera ...
    "All our women who lay under the Fritz, if only to save their children from starvation ..
    "All of our hundreds, dozens ... raped brutally - paratrooper girls ..
    "All that are not burned in Khatyn ... and ... other camps ...
    .
    What?
    The concept of LANGUAGE has disappeared completely?
    And here - concentration camps? And what about the camps?
    .
    Terrible is sabotage work. According to the language. By outlook.
    I’ll name who is to blame without thinking for a minute - Fursenko, Curriculum Preparation Committees. The current ... - Minister of Education.
    You look - through the word error. The construction of speech is generally nothing.
    Is this government policy?
    And, like a nail in the lid of the coffin - millions of forced slaves who brought freedom to the world.
    Explain - why - SO?
    I’ll explain ... I don’t have to think too much.
    In the Stalinist camps sat UZNIKI.
    From relatives - they brought freedom to Europe. Why?
    Wanting to quickly reunite with the light of democracy, pid ... oh, tolerance, freedom, etc. - by American troops. English knights.
    .
    These are the thoughts of those who oversaw the writing of the Appeal. This is their way of thinking.
    .
    What are we doing here?
    Only "clave" rumble?
    A disgrace.
    1. Amur
      Amur 11 May 2013 04: 01 New
      +3
      Igarr, you're 100% right - Wanting to quickly reunite with the light of democracy !!!

      "They" are still few, slandered those who gave the opportunity to live for all of us, robbed their grandchildren, and now make moral freaks of great-grandchildren ...
    2. Masterzserg
      Masterzserg 11 May 2013 20: 32 New
      -1
      Quote: Igarr
      Patients are all those who do not understand shame .. this insert ..
      - You are tormenting and slandering people, which despite it defended their homeland and jerking on a card comparing? Are you in opposition in general vegetables? Surely sick, by golly. As the author of the scammers made you (either stupid he, or a provocateur) feel the shame you are friendly and feel. Come on, go out to the swamp and do it all together, from the humiliation and insults that the "bloody regime" made you feel. laughing ))))))))))))))
  • vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 10 May 2013 17: 29 New
    15
    I agree that someone is trying to level off with just one phrase, the USSR and Nazi Germany, hinting that there were camps both there and there. Very smart and professional. And I’m absolutely sure not by chance. I fully support the author.
    1. svp67
      svp67 10 May 2013 17: 36 New
      +4
      Quote: vladsolo56
      announced someone is trying to level the USSR and Nazi Germany with just one phrase, hinting that there were camps there and there.
      Who is who? Who is our main liberal? The answer is Medvedev. Here it is worth looking ...
      1. Rrv
        Rrv 10 May 2013 18: 33 New
        +1
        Quote: svp67
        Who is our main liberal? The answer is Medvedev.


        You do not see the forest trees?
        1. svp67
          svp67 10 May 2013 18: 38 New
          0
          Quote: RRV
          Quote: svp67
          Who is our main liberal? The answer is Medvedev.


          You do not see the forest trees?
          So tell me, who do you think is that forest? I expressed my opinion ...
          1. Rrv
            Rrv 10 May 2013 19: 08 New
            +1
            Quote: svp67
            So tell me, who do you think is that forest?
            1. svp67
              svp67 10 May 2013 19: 28 New
              +3
              Well, everyone has their own opinion. For me, GDP is not interested in this, it’s trying to take as much as possible from the USSR ...
              1. Rrv
                Rrv 10 May 2013 19: 36 New
                0
                Quote: svp67
                on the contrary, he is trying to take as much as possible from the USSR ...


                If we were to speak specifically about the nomenclature of the late USSR, then I would unconditionally agree with you.
    2. Rrv
      Rrv 10 May 2013 17: 55 New
      15
      Stalin is the personification of equality, order, Victory and the communist idea of ​​JUSTICE.

      Therefore, they beat Stalin.
  • Yuri11076
    Yuri11076 10 May 2013 17: 36 New
    +6
    This is, to put it mildly, strange for a federal television channel, this is May 9th, the Great Victory Day, and not a discussion of how many people went through the camps ...
    1. aviator65
      aviator65 16 May 2013 20: 17 New
      0
      Nothing strange in my opinion. A certain attitude is systematically hammered into people: "VICTORY is the USSR, the USSR is Stalin, Stalin is the camp." About 15 years will pass, and a new generation of our citizens will be convinced that everyone in the Soviet Union sat in polls in Stalin’s camps, and on May 8 (eighth), along with all of democratic Europe, I will thank the United States for heroically saving us from the brown plague. To be honest, I would not want to live up to that ...
  • I think so
    I think so 10 May 2013 17: 38 New
    +6
    And after all, someone pointed out the minuses - that means the site is gaining popularity and the POWER OF THE PROPERTY (U. RODY) are forced to blow their chases here in order to create the impression that MUCH are against what was expressed in the article ... It is gratifying - well done site creators and its participants .. .
  • rexby63
    rexby63 10 May 2013 17: 42 New
    0
    Neue Zürcher Zeitung
    Year of Putin's presidency: spending alone is not reform
    10 May 2013 city
    The fact that Putin’s reformist rhetoric boils down to increased spending is a typical case. He does not want a painful economic recovery. But it is doubtful that active government intervention will lay the foundation for welfare.

    Les Echos
    Putin: one year in the Kremlin, the economy is stalled


    The newspaper
    The recession looms over King Putin
    10 May 2013 city
    Victory Day allowed Putin to take a little time with domestic problems. Government actions seem too slow and clumsy for the era of global economy. Surkov could be the first victim of a clash between Putin and the government.

    Paul Johnson | Forbes

    Vladimir Putin is the most unpleasant person in the world.

    Gentlemen, opponents of Putin! Do not you think that your tone and your statements are too similar to statements by no means friends of Russia? Whose water mill is it on?
    1. Rrv
      Rrv 10 May 2013 18: 41 New
      0
      Quote: rexby63
      Gentlemen, opponents of Putin! Do not you think that your tone and your statements are too similar to statements by no means friends of Russia?


      But doesn’t it seem to you that the “non-friends of Russia” are trying too hard to prove that they are not friends, and thereby push the people “into the arms” of Mr. Putin?

      Judging by cases is necessary, not by declarations.
      1. rexby63
        rexby63 10 May 2013 18: 47 New
        0
        It is for business. And my opinion is that Putin is now one of the few who really works. And with regard to "friends" - a certain Mrs. Alekseeva also does not like Putin, so I tell you so - EVERYONE who does not like this mossy bastard .. not, for me there will always be the best.
        1. Rrv
          Rrv 10 May 2013 19: 32 New
          +1
          Quote: rexby63
          It is for business.


          Commercialization and degradation of education and medicine
          One of the lowest in the world levels of minimum wages, which is also 2.5 thousand below the official subsistence level
          The world's lowest taxes on large business income and the highest on wage earners
          Management Responsibility on the Principle - The Higher the Less
          WTO accession, capable of killing production, including the defense industry
          Pushing the institute of juvenile justice destroying the institution of the family

          You want to say that all of the above cases suit you? If so, then you, consciously or not, are a loyal associate of Mrs. Alekseeva.
          1. djon3volta
            djon3volta 10 May 2013 20: 30 New
            -3
            Quote: RRV
            You want to say that all of the above cases suit you?

            say, you are not from the sect ESSENCE OF TIME Kurginyan? something like your pictures, komenty. Or are you from the Communist Party? Who do you support? Who is the best politician for you, tell me?
            1. Rrv
              Rrv 10 May 2013 21: 23 New
              0
              No, Johnny is not this or that. By the way, you are opposing these guys in vain - and Ku and Sue both work on Pu, but like Not with Na.

              In any case, the traitor Zyu is preferable to me than the traitor Pu.

              And I already mentioned surnames: Boldyrev, Mukhin, muddy comrade-Delyagin, Katasonov, Khazin, Glazyev, Kvachkov.

              Any surname will suit me if the Authority personified in it is forced to fulfill the order of the majority and be responsible for its actions. yes
              1. rexby63
                rexby63 11 May 2013 15: 15 New
                0
                Boldyrev, Mukhin, muddy tovarisch-Delyagin, Katasonov, Khazin, Glazyev, Kvachkov.


                And what do they have in common? No, you really, the second Alekseeva - even the hell, but not Putin
          2. rexby63
            rexby63 10 May 2013 21: 14 New
            0
            I’ll answer with the words of Alekseeva herself: “Our current president, having seen that the country is growing protest, that his rating is falling both in Russia and abroad, decided to overcome this by the only method he understands. He is a man brought up by the KGB who can act only from a position of strength, intimidating and deceiving. Now absolutely insane laws are being passed one after another, not just unconstitutional, but lying beyond the bounds of law. Tightening the nuts will not work, because the thread is worn. to the USSR will not be. "

            Do you really have a lot in common with her? So which of the two of us is her companion?
            1. Rrv
              Rrv 10 May 2013 22: 46 New
              -2
              Alexander, do not engage in verbiage: Putin is not trying to restore the USSR - nationalization (revising the results of privatization), which would simultaneously increase the budget by 2 times, will not happen - he said, not me. wink

              You better answer me in your own words and this is what:
              According to the Constitution, Russia is a social state. The President is the guarantor of the Constitution. At the same time, in the 4th quarter of 2012, the cost of living for the able-bodied population is 7263 rubles, and the minimum wage - 4611 rubles.

              How can this be and how does this situation compare with the Constitution?
              1. rexby63
                rexby63 11 May 2013 13: 53 New
                +1
                the minimum wage is 4611 rubles.


                If it's not a secret, who has such a salary? I stood at the labor exchange 2 years ago, they paid me 4900
                1. dddym
                  dddym 12 May 2013 14: 16 New
                  +1
                  I have already voiced these figures - I repeat: the cost of a dresser in the Krasnoyarsk Opera and Ballet Theater amounts to 7-8 thousand without prizes, with 2 thousand more prizes at full work schedule. Z \ n artist of the choir of the 10-th category 9800 with bonuses up to 14000. The minimum wage in the country is determined by the State Duma, the minimum wage in regions and territories is determined by the legislative assembly. For example, in the Krasnoyarsk Territory, it is slightly larger than the federal figure 5700 if I am not mistaken. You can live on this money only if you do not pay for a communal apartment. Which increase twice a year and s \ n does not grow.
              2. rexby63
                rexby63 11 May 2013 15: 33 New
                0
                Section 7. The Russian Federation is a social state whose policy is aimed at creating conditions ensuring a decent life and free human development.
                On the "creation", dear opponent X, and not on the maintenance. Or over the past 13 years, our fellow citizens began to live worse? Or in the 90s they didn’t shoot on the streets, and did the children overeat with sweets? Adults could choose work to taste, and young girls studied at prestigious universities and didn’t stand on the panel? Although you are right - we began to live worse, we forgot what "Bad" is. But again, I will allow myself to engage in "verbiage" and ask you: "Is Putin also to blame for the fact that we all became greasy, gobbled up shit? Are we still" white and fluffy "?
                1. Rrv
                  Rrv 12 May 2013 10: 58 New
                  0
                  Quote: rexby63
                  If it's not a secret, who has such a salary? I stood at the labor exchange 2 years ago, they paid me 4900


                  Apparently in Moscow? And were you interested in the minimal salary in the country?


                  Quote: rexby63
                  Article 7 ... On the "creation" and not on the maintenance ... etc.


                  You see, what are you talking about? You also tell us that you can create these conditions indefinitely (and that it will be completely legal), and also compare the number of mobile phones and Internet users in the 50s of the 20th century with the 2000s of the 21st .

                  Once again: 2012. The official minimum salary in the country is 4611 rubles. The official living wage for the able-bodied population in the country in the 1st quarter is 6827 rubles, in the 4th quarter - 7263 rubles.

                  Explain - in what way does this fact comply with the Constitution of the Russian Federation - do you risk it?
                  1. rexby63
                    rexby63 12 May 2013 13: 44 New
                    0
                    "Apparently" in Kostroma. And Kostroma is one of the poorest regions. He worked in Kirov, and in Komi, and in Karelia, and in Ivanovo on a business trip. Our Kostroma is still a hole with respect to salary.

                    Now about the violation of the Constitution of the Russian Federation - I thought for a long time what you mean, until in passing I looked at Wikipedia. B-o-o-o-t where the dog rummaged (purely idiomatically). If you increase your encyclopedic knowledge by reading this “glorious” resource, you can achieve a lot. Oh well, I wanted to focus your attention on this - this wikipedia relates to social countries: “Among modern examples of the ideal of a social state, countries of the Scandinavian peninsula usually cite ( that is, the “Swedish model”), Finland, the Netherlands, Canada, Switzerland, Germany, Belgium, and also sometimes the UK, France, Austria, New Zealand, Australia, the USA, Italy, Greece, Portugal, Japan, Poland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, the Gulf countries, Libya and other countries. " Wordless, is not it? And my opinion - a social state - is where every hour they try to improve the lives of their citizens. How it comes out, crookedly or bluntly, is another matter.
                    1. Rrv
                      Rrv 12 May 2013 14: 52 New
                      0
                      What side you remembered pedivicia is not clear to me.

                      "Without words, is it?" - It is also unclear: all kinds of inadequacies, progressing in the world since the 80s, are in no way connected with the social system.

                      "And my opinion - a social state - is where every hour they try to improve the lives of their citizens." - I completely agree, but it’s precisely by the way “it comes out” that one can judge how “they try”
                      I do not come up with numbers - these are legislatively fixed minimum wages and living wages in the country for the specified period.
                      The question arises - how much does a person really need, if at a minimum.
                      Since it is necessary to take into account the maximum population, as a guideline I take a 25-year-old working hypersthenic man with a daily intake of 4000 calories, not associated with excessive physical activity.
                      Minimum spending on COMPLETE nutrition at the current price level will average 12000 rubles.
                      Clothing, transport, recovery from work, rent (not buying an apartment), etc. also around 12000 minimum.
                      Thus we get a REAL cost of living for a working person.
                      But taking into account the demographic policy - at least 2 children in the family (and the child consumes half of adult consumption) - we add another 12000 to the cost of living and get the average-minimum wage for the country in the amount of 36000 rubles - this is what should be.

                      Is such a min s / n possible? The example of other countries shows that the possible minimum tax-free wage is 50% of GDP per capita (we have 12%). That is, in 2012, the proper level of the minimum wage for the SOCIAL state of the Russian Federation is about 18450 rubles.
                      If we eliminate the 50% increase in prices for tariffs, then the purchasing power of these 18 thousand will increase to at least 25-30 thousand.

                      You claim that the authorities are trying to do something like that?
                      1. rexby63
                        rexby63 12 May 2013 15: 00 New
                        0
                        I see. At our enterprise, salaries are no longer delayed. They have already got rid of the gray salary. And if we, the workers, are not silent, then they raise us. For example, compared with last year, they raised by 10%. Of course a little, but with a black sheep, as they say. There is one more question, here you are all about wages - and how can the state oblige an entrepreneur to raise his salary, legislatively? Well, you yourself understand that this is a double-edged sword.
                      2. Rrv
                        Rrv 12 May 2013 15: 33 New
                        0
                        Quote: rexby63
                        For example, compared with last year, they raised by 10%.


                        Consumer inflation, the cause of which is primarily the increase in tariffs, has averaged 25% compared to last year - and so over the past 10 years.


                        Of course a little, but with a black sheep, as they say


                        This is the psychology of a slave: activities in any field should take place in accordance with the law, and legislation should be drawn up in the interests of the majority, and not as it is now.


                        how will the state be able to oblige an entrepreneur to raise salaries - legislatively? Well, you yourself understand that this is a double-edged sword.


                        That is, state ownership Power to sell off, forcing 100 million to give up alcohol after 23 hours is also not a problem, but what about the compliance of entrepreneurial activity with the Basic Law, is it horror, horror, is that impossible? )))
                        Have you not noticed yet that the current Power is turning the country into a state-perverted perversity?
                      3. rexby63
                        rexby63 12 May 2013 17: 26 New
                        0
                        And you do not engage in demagogy, but try to predict what will happen if the state raises the minimum wage to 15000 rubles
                  2. Setrac
                    Setrac 12 May 2013 15: 59 New
                    +1
                    Quote: RRV
                    Minimum spending on COMPLETE nutrition at the current price level will average 12000 rubles.

                    You have overstated requirements. For 12000 rubles a month, a large family will eat hearty. Stop eating all kinds of rubbish (expensive delicacies), drink all kinds of garbage (alcohol, energy, etc.). Simple dishes of potatoes, Russian borsch or cabbage soup, cereals without frills, and you will see how much you have left from 12000 rubles.
                    Stop smoking, stop throwing from 3 to 5 thousand rubles a month to destroy your own body. And then, in retirement, you will demand money from the state for the treatment of the lungs and stomach. But the state is not to blame for the fact that you smoked and thumped, I would have left such people to die without medical help. (You are not personally you, but for example)
                  3. Rrv
                    Rrv 12 May 2013 16: 35 New
                    0
                    Quote: Setrac
                    You have overstated requirements.


                    I'm talking about good nutrition:
                    35% - meat, fish, poultry, eggs.
                    35% - vegetables (excluding potatoes) and fruits.
                    The rest is cereals, pasta, potatoes (not a very useful product), etc.
                    Relate the above to 4000 calories per day and modern prices and you will get a figure in the region of 12000.

                    But the state is not guilty that you smoked and thumped,


                    But this is how to say it: 15 years of aggressive advertising, loss of meanings, putting the majority of the population on the brink of survival, hopelessness from the realization that you work at least 3 rates, and you can’t take your family to the sea, the minimum salary that is lower than the official subsistence level minimum, etc.

                    Is all of the above not the affairs of the state, or Power 7
                  4. rexby63
                    rexby63 12 May 2013 17: 32 New
                    0
                    minimum wage, which is lower than the official cost of living, etc.


                    You didn’t answer the question of where you met an exotic salary of less than 4600 rubles, and already “brain” the next opponent
                  5. Rrv
                    Rrv 12 May 2013 18: 53 New
                    0
                    You are currently engaged in demagogy.

                    To raise the minimum wage, changes in taxation and price regulation systems are needed. Ideally, the nationalization of the Soviet heritage is needed - it will give a budget increase of 2 times.
                    Doing it - raising the minimum wage to 18 thousand is not a problem, moreover: the state was obliged to do this.


                    Read carefully, I repeat again: in 2012, the minimum wage in the Russian Federation amounted to 4611 rubles minus 13% of income tax.
                    At the same time, the established living wage for the working population: at the beginning of the year - 6827 rubles, at the end of the year - 7263 rubles.

                    That is, the established minimum wage at the end of the year is not less than 2650 rubles BELOW the established LIVING MINIMUM.

                    Now it is clear? Or do you tell me your address and demand to bring to you a person with a documented salary of 5 thousand?
                  6. rexby63
                    rexby63 12 May 2013 20: 08 New
                    0
                    To raise the minimum wage, changes in taxation and price regulation systems are needed. Ideally, the nationalization of the Soviet heritage is needed - it will give a budget increase of 2 times.


                    These are nothing more than general phrases suitable for a rally on Bolotnaya. Suppose I'm interested, put me on the shelves of the mechanism of nationalization in a country similar to Russia. It seems to me similar to the Great October Socialist Revolution, and you, respectively, with one notorious priest
                  7. Rrv
                    Rrv 12 May 2013 21: 07 New
                    0
                    Quote: rexby63
                    These are nothing more than common phrases.


                    Do you propose to lay out an economic program for 10 years in the format of a comment?

                    The issue of nationalization is resolved through the Accounts Chamber and the prosecutor's office - or do you doubt that the so-called privatization was de facto fraud and theft on an especially large scale? Venezuela is an example of nationalization; such issues are completely solvable (of course, if they want to solve them).


                    Quote: rexby63
                    It seems to me similar to the Great October Socialist Revolution, and you, respectively, with one notorious priest


                    You already decide what year you are comparing - with the 17th or 5th. What confuses you in the Revolution, and when did I call you to the rally?
                  8. rexby63
                    rexby63 12 May 2013 21: 30 New
                    0
                    or do you doubt that the so-called privatization was de facto fraud and theft on an especially large scale?


                    I have no doubt, but the laws of that time allowed fraud in such volumes. And comparing Russia with Venezuela is not quite, let's say, reasonable

                    You already decide what year you are comparing


                    Do you think that Mr. Gapon is alone in the “glorious” galaxy of provocateurs? And his undertakings stopped on March 28.03.1906, XNUMX?
                  9. Rrv
                    Rrv 12 May 2013 22: 32 New
                    0
                    The laws of the time provided an opportunity for fraud, but did not make fraud legal. Nationalization is possible - a referendum is enough for this.

                    Then - we are not talking now about the details of this action, we are talking about social guarantees, specifically - about the necessary level of the minimum wage and that the current minimum wage does not correspond not only to the Constitution, but also to common sense.

                    Is it possible to live (not survive) at the current 5205 minus 13%? No.
                    Can the minimum wage be below the subsistence level? No.
                    Perhaps an increase in the minimum wage? Yes, and 4.5 times.

                    The fact that the Authority has not done this over the past decade suggests that the Authority is criminal.

                    Here's another example: when a flat scale was introduced, this was explained by the fact that tax collection, that is, the budget, would increase in this way. Do you know what happened in practice? In fact, the percentage of the budget to GDP has not increased, but decreased. That is, in essence, a flat scale made it possible for big capital to do what he wanted - to pay less, and this was compensated by the additional burden on wage earners.
                  10. rexby63
                    rexby63 13 May 2013 05: 29 New
                    0
                    Nationalization is possible - a referendum is enough for this.


                    Well, they held a referendum, 90% voted in favor, the actions of the remaining 10?

                    Is it possible to live (not survive) at the current 5205 minus 13%?


                    Once again, in Russian - people of what professions, social groups, in which regions live on a salary of 5205 minus 13%? Do not answer - do not write anymore. The laurels of the revolutionary do not give rest - learn to separate economic slogans from political ones. To you, the opposition, smart people have figured everything out, put it on the shelves (V.I. Lenin PSS, cover to cover), and you just admire yourself like peacocks, and singing a note from you
                  11. Rrv
                    Rrv 13 May 2013 13: 47 New
                    0
                    actions of the remaining 10?



                    A lot of noise, someone is probably trying to sue, but they can’t do anything - any referendum decision is legal.
                    Remember Yukos, whose Rhodschild beneficiary? - If you want, you can do without a referendum.



                    Once again ... people of what professions, social groups ...


                    Ivan Petrovich Sidorov, Nizhny Novgorod Region, locksmith - should I bring it to your home and put the details on the table?

                    "A truck crane - OJSC Krasnogorsk MPMK - the main Krasnogorsk city settlement - from 5500 - 26.04.13/XNUMX/XNUMX - Department of public service for labor and employment of the Bryansk region." The proposed salary is below the subsistence level. www.rabota-bryanskobl.ru/home/seekrab/seekvac.aspx
                    Instead of denying the obvious, go to the website of the employment service of any region, take a walk through the pages.

                    Go to the website of the Federal State Statistics Service and see what percentage of the population, with the current unbelievably low subsistence level, continues to exist below the poverty line (from memory - 12.5%).

                    And stop lying to yourself.
                  12. rexby63
                    rexby63 13 May 2013 17: 54 New
                    0
                    And, you hit labor exchanges (employment centers). Apparently you only know the business on the Internet. I stood on the stock exchange for almost three months, I went on vacancies so much that it seemed to overtake the Earth at the equator. He also bought slogans, as long as they didn’t say in one place - man, are you looking for a job or a salary? You will work normally, there will be a salary, you will not, and you will receive a minimum wage only one month, and then they will try to get rid of you. It convinced me. As a result, for the first year of work at an official salary of 7000 rubles, I earned up to 25000. Now for health workers — why does one nurse whine about a small salary and still don’t know where to find a vein, and the other earns more than a chief accountant in a medium-sized enterprise per month? The answer, I think, is already clear.
                    And as a result. All that I have presented to you above and all that you have answered me over the past two days about wages is the economy and it is only necessary to fight with entrepreneurs. That's when the state will take their side, only then it is necessary to make claims to the state. And then you, the oppositionists, jumping up and down, pulling out all the loafers into the arena, passing them off as the working class, not realizing that the worker always has the very first enemy - his employer. The one who pays him a small salary. does not let go on vacation, does not read sick leave. And all these your slogans about the "party of crooks and thieves" are so abstract that sometimes you wonder. You have been treading with these appeals for the 3rd year, and the result? Zilch.
                  13. Rrv
                    Rrv 13 May 2013 18: 58 New
                    0
                    At the expense of “You are treading your head” - this is not for me - you have mixed me up with Bolotnaya Square.

                    How 7000 turned into 25000 and whether they were issued in accordance with the current legislation is also a question.

                    Do not forget about the salary-pension ratio.

                    About health workers: the basic rate (it is the minimum salary) of a doctor is 5–6 thousand, the rest is the cunningly built surcharges and combinations. In order to have 25-30 thousand per month, the doctor works for one and a half to two rates, that is, the load increases significantly. That at the same time the quality of diagnosis and treatment drops sharply - do you need to be reminded? And the fact that the norm is an eight-hour working day, that a person has to work in order to live, and not vice versa, what if on the contrary, then you can forget about demography and families, that a person wears out 2 times faster?

                    The state is already on the side of entrepreneurs: the minimum wage, which is below the subsistence level, is determined by the state.
                    The influx of Gaster, increasing the dumping of prices on the labor market and increasing unemployment - the state admits.
                    Gray salaries, reducing future pensions - the state admits with its inaction.
                    Enterprises that violate the Labor Code are given to the hands of entrepreneurs and continue to be given by the state.
                    Legislation according to which in case of violation of his rights to an employee is not sued is profitable - the state has created.
                    Changing the tax system in favor of entrepreneurs - made the state.

                    Alexander, at least stop lying to yourself.
                  14. rexby63
                    rexby63 14 May 2013 20: 52 New
                    0
                    Well, about Bolotnaya, I think I was not very mistaken. And yet, what do you yourself work in?
                  15. rexby63
                    rexby63 14 May 2013 22: 37 New
                    0
                    that a person must work in order to live


                    I do not quite understand (in my opinion it seems like conspiracy)

                    Gray salaries, reducing future pensions - the state admits with its inaction.


                    That you have already started talking. It is just more profitable for the state to collect more taxes. With a gray salary - can only be obtained from donkey ears.

                    The influx of Gaster, increasing the dumping of prices on the labor market and increasing unemployment - the state admits.

                    I agree, the state had a hand in this. However, you probably know why, only dissemble and limit yourself to general populist slogans.

                    Change in the tax system in favor of entrepreneurs


                    The opposite is heard from entrepreneurs.

                    You at least stop lying to yourself.


                    Is this your mantra?
                  16. Rrv
                    Rrv 15 May 2013 01: 24 New
                    0
                    Is that your style?


                    No. The fact is that I try to explain not with unsubstantiated statements, but with the help of verified numbers, and for this I have to spend a lot of time searching for information (now, for example, I try to find the budget size in the 90s by years, but there is no acceptable information). You, being unable to refute these figures, begin to replace concepts and reduce everything to the fact that doctors earn little because they work poorly (do not care that the rate is 5000 with a living wage of 7000), etc. This manner is understandable annoying.

                    I work in public catering, I have nothing to do with Marsh.

                    There is nothing wrong with consumerism in moderation - a person needs to have a tasty, sufficient and high-quality diet (scientifically substantiated), dress and use hygiene products in accordance with modern times (he will not get dirty in his bast shoes), have access to a high level of medical care, education and to recover properly after work (the 19th century, 75% of the population is illiterate, the average life expectancy of peasants is 31 years), to be able to raise, feed, raise children (living standards are scientifically based), etc. etc.
                    It is also worth noting that the growth of the economy of the loan interest, in which the country has been living since the 90s and the negative aspects of which I am trying to justify to you despite your resistance, is based precisely on consumerism.

                    To the state, if we understand it as a people, gray salaries are certainly unnecessary. If we understand the state as institutions of power and remember that the relatives of the vast majority of senior employees of these institutions are “unexpectedly” super-businessmen, then you come to the conclusion that gray salaries “at least” do not interfere.

                    For migrants: there is such a thing as equilibrium price - including in the labor market. It is also written in the Basic Law that the Russian Federation is a social state - that is, a real minimum must be guaranteed, and a person must work without harming himself, without exposing his body to excessive wear and tear with excessive volume and duration of work, and at the same time be able to fully live ( all of the above is justified scientifically).
                    Since the Planet Earth state does not yet exist, the labor market of the Russian Federation is closed, and as long as there are citizens whose qualifications allow them to perform certain work, foreign citizens in a social state should not apply for this work. In the event that citizens of the state do not replace vacancies, the employer attracts employees with an increase in salary (or in other ways) until all vacancies are filled (equilibrium labor price) - this is one of the laws of the modern liberal economy.
                    Instead of all of the above, the Authority opens the labor market for migrants, which leads to dumping of labor prices and an additional burden on the budget, since a large number of citizens have to pay benefits.
                    In addition, the situation is very alarming when the FMS speaks of from 3 to 5 million illegal immigrants, while Rosstat speaks of 4.4 million unemployed - almost identical figures.

                    The opposite is heard from small and medium-sized businesses, and big business is blissful, but crying. our tax scale is de facto regressive, much has been said about this.
                  17. Cynic
                    Cynic 15 May 2013 17: 01 New
                    0
                    Quote: RRV
                    The situation is alarming when the FMS speaks of 3 to 5 million illegal immigrants, while the Federal State Statistics Service speaks of 4.4 million unemployed - almost identical figures.

                    At one time there was a saying _ I know three pseudoscience: Astrology, Palmistry, Statistics.
                    Well, the first two with their own efforts left this status, but the third ...
                    Recently it was announced that a substantial number of the working-age population in Russia is not considered to be working.
                    Catch a nuance?
                  18. Rrv
                    Rrv 15 May 2013 18: 18 New
                    0
                    Be careful, Vladimir - not trusting even official statistics, you run the risk of thinking in the near future that all the great achievements of the current Government, including the growth of the gross product, are nothing more than nonsense, and then come to the conclusion that the elections were rigged. wink


                    Quote: Cynic
                    Recently it was announced that a substantial number of the working-age population in Russia is not considered to be working.


                    You ask a pointless question.
                    Where did you hear, when, what numbers were named and by whom? What is your attitude to the topic you are raising?
                  19. Cynic
                    Cynic 15 May 2013 19: 13 New
                    0
                    Quote: RRV
                    all the great achievements of the current Power,

                    For those living in Russia, the 90s and 10s are different, for foreigners not, but, excuse me, for metropolitan residents there is no identity either.
                    Quote: RRV
                    that the elections were rigged.

                    Yes, as it were, for me, to understand the truth of the elections, I did not need to look at the statistics, it was enough to go to my polling station.
                    By the way, I watched with pleasure there a poll of young LDPR activists who voted _ From the stream, people who voted for the LDPR were clearly selected! Not a single mistake in 15 minutes of observation! So Volfovich could reasonably file a complaint about falsification of the election results in this polling station based on this poll.
                    Quote: RRV
                    Where did you hear, when, what numbers were named and by whom?

                    Have you mixed anything up by chance? It seems you have not checked my homework!
                    They would honestly say that they are not familiar with this statement by a member of the government.
                    Summarizing _ Sorry Rrv but you soar in some spaces, real only for you.
                    How there is an eternally living classic wrote
                    “The circle of these revolutionaries is narrow. They are terribly far from the people ... ".
                    Used: ironically about the closed, far from the main population of the country community (the ruling class, officials, bohemians, etc.).
                    Underline whatever applicable .
                    bully
                  20. Rrv
                    Rrv 15 May 2013 20: 09 New
                    0
                    Yes, the 90s and 10s are certainly different - just like the 40s from the mid-50s.
                    Only there is a moment: the human losses of the 40s are comparable to the losses of the 90s, but the material losses of the 90s are many times less than the losses of the 40s. Moreover, the socio-economic growth of the 50s is several times higher than the growth of the zero, and the situation of the zero was much more favorable than the situation of the 50s. The goals of that period and the present also differ radically, and not in favor of the present.

                    Have you been to all polling stations in the country? Note - you create YOUR statistics, and on the basis of episodic observation, while not rejecting official statistics on the issue of elections. But you reject it in other matters - do not you think that this is a “somewhat” selective approach?

                    I accidentally mixed up nothing: maybe you again about the last century or another country - how do I know? laughing
                    In general, a person who does not speak specifically (who, where, when you still haven’t specified) either hides something, or lies, or instead of a healthy discussion, “moves out to the market”.

                    I emphasize: "... but their cause is not lost ...". And precisely because it has not disappeared, we have the opportunity to celebrate May 9th.
                  21. Cynic
                    Cynic 15 May 2013 21: 00 New
                    0
                    Quote: RRV
                    Have you been to all polling stations in the country?

                    This is neither a dream nor a spirit, but for some reason a strong association arose from this discussion with such a concept (for me) as scholasticism.
                    Quote: RRV
                    In general, a person who does not speak specifically

                    Lack of information, same information.
                    Is that familiar?
                    Your ignorance told me more about you than everything you said before.
                    In the circle of my personal communication, there are also people who completely ignore the official media, or rather, the official information in them.
                    It is interesting enough to listen to their interpretation of this information, refracted in their worldview.
                    Recently, I was puzzled by reliable information that Stalin simply simply bought himself the post of head of the USSR.
                    Did he rob banks? Robbed! I saved up some money and bought it.
                  22. Rrv
                    Rrv 15 May 2013 22: 13 New
                    0
                    Quote: Cynic

                    This is neither a dream nor a spirit, but for some reason a strong association arose from this discussion with such a concept (for me) as scholasticism.


                    I have a similar feeling - the conversation is pointless: you take one of my examples for clue, then take the topic aside, let the pseudo-philosophical fog with your quotes, do not even try to give any confirmation to your words and, most importantly, no specifics.
                    You are not a cynic, Vladimir, you are a balabol. )))


                    Your ignorance told me more about you than everything you said before.


                    I have already written about what your refusal to concretize told me about you.


                    Did he rob banks? Robbed! I saved up some money and bought it.


                    wassat

                    You should definitely choose your social circle more carefully. hi
                  23. Cynic
                    Cynic 16 May 2013 16: 57 New
                    0
                    Quote: RRV
                    no specifics.

                    Sorry, but
                    Only birds sing for free

                    Quote: RRV
                    You are not zinc

                    As they say not deja vu.
                    In general, rephrasing the classic
                    Premonitions did not deceive me.
                  24. Rrv
                    Rrv 16 May 2013 18: 29 New
                    0
                    And again, no specifics. laughing

                    PS hi
    2. rexby63
      rexby63 15 May 2013 17: 35 New
      0
      Reading your comments, I swim in jelly. I do not try to substantiate and prove anything - we and you have so different views on life that all our polemics resemble the theater of the absurd. You are talking about the desire to eat tasty food, to gently sleep, while you bring the minimum number of kilocalories, but I don’t need all this. I know that in the morning it’s enough for me to eat a plate of porridge and before lunch, for all my decent physical activity at work, it’s enough for me. Whether this porridge is tasty or not tasty, the question is so secondary that I pay attention to it only when my wife begins to wake up culinary "show-offs" and she aggressively seeks an answer regarding the digestibility of her dishes.
      For you, this question, as I see it, is much more significant if you push it so persistently in the comments, but even for this alone I conclude that our polemic is absolutely useless
    3. Rrv
      Rrv 15 May 2013 18: 36 New
      +2
      You are not trying to understand what exactly I'm talking about, initially seeing me as an implacable opponent, if not an enemy.

      I’m not talking about the desire to eat deliciously, but about the possibility of realizing this desire if it appears.
      What do you live for - what would work?
      What are you working for - to ensure the overconsumption of your employer, to satisfy his Wishlist?
      Why are you giving birth and raising children - so that they, like you, work for the interests of those who have papers in which it is written that everything that exists in the country belongs to them? In order for your children to turn into cannon fodder, when it is likely that an uncle from the outside can take the above-mentioned papers from their current owners?

      In my opinion, when the state and state institutions exist for their citizens, and citizens work for the state and defend it, this is the norm, a symbiosis.
      But in modern Russia there is no such symbiosis. Only a few of its elements are left, coming from the USSR, but every year these elements are becoming less and less.
      The country is following a neoliberal course through globalism towards a new feudal fascism on a global scale - is this convenient for you ?.
    4. rexby63
      rexby63 18 May 2013 17: 01 New
      +1
      What do you live for - what would work?


      Probably yes.

      Why give birth and raise children


      Probably in order to make himself better. Children are a kind of time machine. We try to prevent them from making those mistakes that we ourselves made and through them (children) achieve what we ourselves did not achieve.
      when the state and state institutions exist for their citizens, and citizens work for the state and defend it - this is the norm, symbiosis.


      Here I fully agree with you. But in the history of mankind - this rarely happened.
      Regarding fascism, we still have a few steps before it, while some are already on the latter and we need to react to this. And we are engaged in self-improvement. The thing is necessary, but we do it, as always, at the wrong time
    5. Rrv
      Rrv 18 May 2013 18: 20 New
      +1
      It has rarely happened, but it is necessary to strive, and the tendency towards fascism is already clear enough in my opinion.
      An alternative, as I think, could be an analogue of the USSR, but without the jambs of the latter.
      I don’t know about self-improvement, but something needs to be done, and yesterday. Otherwise, neither we nor our children will have a future.
    6. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 18 May 2013 21: 52 New
      0
      Quote: RRV
      and the tendency towards fascism is already clear enough in my opinion.

      Fascism, with the international idea and tolerance that the authorities do not succeed in moving us to, is manifested under the leadership of a nation or nationality (here, for example, the Chechnya of the 90s will do) and judging by how the Russian population is spread rot and ruin, fascism will obviously not Russian, but Russians will always wet it, as always
    7. Rrv
      Rrv 19 May 2013 00: 44 New
      0
      Quote: alexandr00070
      fascism with the international idea and tolerance towards which the authorities cannot move us, it manifests itself under the leadership of any nation or nationality

      Or class.


      Neo-liberalism (which is both a kind of fascism and an intermediate between liberalism and neo-feudalism) is different in that it puts the interests and rights of various minorities above the interests and rights of the majority - this is what we have the opportunity to observe in the West: what is served under a sauce of tolerance ( tolerance) de facto is a very strong excess towards abnormality.

      Or as in your example, when, despite the number of Russians at 78-80%, the bias goes towards the small ethnic groups of the North Caucasus (acting as a destabilizer of society - like pedas in the West), as well as holders of big capital and, so to speak, class officials (nomenclature-kleptocratic oligarchy).

      The last two categories are gradually joining the ranks of the supranational oligarchy, which in essence already now represents a kind of new feudal lord.
    8. Rrv
      Rrv 19 May 2013 01: 16 New
      0
      There is, by the way, one curious point: fascism comes from FASCIO - a sheaf, a bunch.
      The graphic symbol looks like this:
    9. Rrv
      Rrv 19 May 2013 01: 19 New
      0
      But it is curious that this crap, which is essentially fascist symbols, flaunts on the coat of arms of the Federal Penitentiary Service of the Russian Federation laughing
    10. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 19 May 2013 01: 22 New
      +1
      Quote: RRV
      But it is curious that this crap, which is essentially fascist symbols, flaunts on the coat of arms of the Federal Penitentiary Service of the Russian Federation

      Well, they then think that they joined Roman law and culture, and the coat of arms is the fruit of illiteracy
    11. Rrv
      Rrv 19 May 2013 02: 01 New
      +1
      The devil knows, maybe so - but annoying.
      Moreover, this is not an isolated case of such illiteracy: for example, the emblem of the Central Bank, it is also on the banknotes and coins, is the emblem of the Provisional Government, and its lower part (the tail of the eagle) is very similar to the lower part of the Rothschild family coat of arms (a bunch of arrows), which in turn, comparable to fashio. )))
    12. rexby63
      rexby63 19 May 2013 10: 30 New
      +1
      Yes, and about Rome - the lictors were kind of like guards, in the sense of bodyguards (FSO), well, sometimes couriers (courier), and very rarely executioners. So their attitude to law is very distant
  • Setrac
    Setrac 12 May 2013 20: 11 New
    0
    Quote: RRV
    35% - meat, fish, poultry, eggs.
    35% - vegetables (excluding potatoes) and fruits.
    The rest is cereals, pasta, potatoes (not a very useful product), etc.


    The numbers on which you rely are not true, everything is counted up to us, take for example the army ration. What you need to do is a modest amount, what you WISH - excuse me, what does the state have to do with it?
  • Rrv
    Rrv 12 May 2013 20: 54 New
    0
    And does our state ever happen to do this, or does it function independently of citizens? In your understanding, does the state exist for a person, or vice versa?

    The norms of the army ration, cited by you as an example, to which year belong? You didn’t think that the idea of ​​a healthy diet could have changed since then? That army canned minimalism is completely unsuitable for a citizen?
    Actually, the army diet has never had anything to do with healthy eating.

    This is not about any hoteliers, but about normal tasty healthy nutrition, which should be guaranteed to ANY working citizen - and the creators of the food basket should not forget about traditional holiday drinks.
  • Setrac
    Setrac 13 May 2013 04: 03 New
    0
    Quote: RRV
    It's not about any hoteliers, but about normal tasty healthy nutrition, which should be guaranteed to ANY working citizen - and the creators of the food basket should not forget about traditional holiday drinks

    Delicious food and healthy eating are not synonyms. The army diet is just a healthy diet, sufficient for vigorous activity, though the army diet is distinguished by freshness.
    Quote: RRV
    And does our state ever happen to do this, or does it function independently of citizens? In your understanding, does the state exist for a person, or vice versa?

    Undoubtedly, the state is more important than the individual, the state - many individuals, seven do not expect one, and seven million and even more so, somehow in their own words)))
  • Rrv
    Rrv 13 May 2013 13: 55 New
    0
    Tasty and healthy certainly are not synonyms, but healthy can not only be tasty - it should be like that.
    You obviously missed the army ration - can you give a link to an approximate ration?

    The state as a set of individuals forming a society is certainly more important, but I think that you understand what I meant and just play with words. )))
  • Cynic
    Cynic 13 May 2013 14: 07 New
    0
    Quote: RRV
    And our state someday happens,

    I enjoyed reading this discussion.
    Sorry dear, but the impression is clear _ Manilovism of pure water, oddly enough, on either side.
    Okay, these are emotions, the essence is as follows: A friend went to retire and was assigned a pension of 105 rubles, is it a lot or a little?
    bully
  • Rrv
    Rrv 13 May 2013 15: 07 New
    0
    Quote: Cynic
    is it a lot or a little?


    If this is not a mistake, then 105 - not rubles, but years of hard labor - for freaks creating such conditions in the country, it will be enough.

    What is the point of Manilovism? The fact that an ordinary citizen can reasonably live better than now, but he is not given?
  • Cynic
    Cynic 13 May 2013 15: 56 New
    0
    Quote: RRV
    If this is not a mistake

    Eh hehe.
    You can’t say about you
    Lack of experience offset knowledge

    Sorry, but the main thing is not how much a person gets, but how much he can buy with this money !!!
    By the way, recently all were millionaires! Do you want the return of those times?
  • Rrv
    Rrv 13 May 2013 16: 52 New
    0
    Quote: RRV
    Minimum expenses for FULL-FOOD nutrition at current price level will average 12000 rubles.

    So we get REAL living wage for a working person.

    That is in 2012 due level the minimum wage for the SOCIAL state of the Russian Federation is about 18450 rubles.
    If we eliminate the 50% overpricing of tariffs, then purchasing power of these 18 thousand will increase to at least 25 - 30 thousand.



    You kind of "got acquainted with the discussion"? Such phrases as - "the current price level", "real cost of living", "in 2012", "proper level", "purchasing power" - they don’t tell you anything? )))
    Or in your opinion, when speaking about the realities of 12-13 years, it is necessary for me to ask the interlocutor if he suddenly decided, for no reason, to talk about the mid-80s of the 20th century? Maybe it’s also worth clarifying which country we are talking about? wink
  • Rrv
    Rrv 13 May 2013 17: 06 New
    0
    Quote: RRV
    To raise the minimum wage changes in taxation and price regulation systems are needed.



    This is a word laughing
  • Apollo
    Apollo 10 May 2013 17: 49 New
    +2
    On this thread, for mating and insulting an opponent, I deleted several comments, including several warnings, please be restrained.
    1. kosmos84
      kosmos84 10 May 2013 18: 00 New
      +1
      I TNT (the channel insulted) and not an opener request
      1. Apollo
        Apollo 10 May 2013 18: 05 New
        +1
        Quote: kosmos84
        I TNT (the channel insulted) and not an opener


        mate and swearing curses, on the forum, in any form is prohibited, read the rules carefully. For the future, for any questions, please contact in a personal.
  • Lumene
    Lumene 10 May 2013 17: 49 New
    -2
    article BRILLING !!! complete.
  • darksoul
    darksoul 10 May 2013 17: 50 New
    +7
    Article +, unfortunately, it did not start yesterday .. well, they do not want to see the defender of the liberator in Russia ... the French who surrendered their country with offal in 2 weeks yes, the usa and england who started fighting in 1944 when they realized that it was time to collect cream yes, and then, with their shobla, e..b..loy signed on May 8 the act of surrender of Germany without the USSR, but not us .... on TV how many modern films where the meaning of films as political officers sniff out everything .... I wouldn’t see my eyes. It’s better to watch an old movie, from modern TV there is almost one negative
    1. Ivanovich47
      Ivanovich47 10 May 2013 22: 17 New
      -1
      Well done, he said everything correctly!
  • stvgol
    stvgol 10 May 2013 18: 08 New
    +4
    Buchenwald and Dachau freed the Americans.
    True, an uprising took place in Buchenwald before their arrival.
  • zennon
    zennon 10 May 2013 18: 13 New
    +5
    YOU RELEASED AUSCHWITZ, BUCHENWALD AND DACHAU ...
    I thought without thinking that Dachau was liberating parts of the third battalion of the 45th American division ... what
    1. stvgol
      stvgol 10 May 2013 18: 19 New
      +5
      And Buchenwald KA did not release. At first the uprising, and two days later the Americans entered there.
      1. pensioner
        pensioner 10 May 2013 19: 11 New
        +3
        Quote: stvgol
        And Buchenwald KA did not release. At first the uprising, and two days later the Americans entered there.

        It was in Buchenwald (if my memory serves me, of course) that the Americans kicked all kinds of burghers and their frau with a kick, so that they could see with their own eyes what their beloved Fuhrer had done. The newsreel on this subject is amazing. Romm seemed to have a movie.
        1. pensioner
          pensioner 10 May 2013 19: 30 New
          +1
          Well correct, if not right. I'm from memory. Also old, with sclerosis. But I definitely saw such a chronicle. It was the kicks that drove the Germans there. I'm right: pokazuha.ru - Buchenwald. [Pub N: 1127803]. Is there some more.
        2. zennon
          zennon 10 May 2013 21: 42 New
          +2
          [/ Quote]
          It was in Buchenwald (if my memory serves me, of course) that the Americans drove all kinds of burghers with a kick and their Frau Newsreel on this subject is amazing. Romm in the movie seemed to be. [/ Quote]
          Here's the price of this newsreel. In the city of Kassel, where every adult German was forced to watch a film about the “Buchenwald horrors,” a doctor from Göttingen saw himself on the screen, although he had never been to Buchenwald. It turned out that this was a film shot after the bombing of Dresden on February 13, 1945, where this doctor was then located. After the raid in which 130 thousand people died, most of them were women and children, refugees from the eastern regions.
          This is how this newsreel concocted.
          1. pensioner
            pensioner 10 May 2013 22: 44 New
            +1
            Quote: zennon
            This is how this newsreel concocted.

            Well, I knew Schaub ... So I fell a victim of falsification. It happens. Everything is not possible to check for accuracy. Otherwise, there will be no time to live. For help - thanks.
            1. zennon
              zennon 10 May 2013 22: 59 New
              +3
              Quote: retired
              Quote: zennon
              This is how this newsreel concocted.

              Well, I knew Schaub ... So I fell a victim of falsification. It happens. Everything is not possible to check for accuracy. Otherwise, there will be no time to live. For help - thanks.

              Look on-net Ernst Zundel’s book "Six million - lost and found," and take your time, calmly, including common sense and brains, read it. Your world will turn upside down, I assure you ...
              1. pensioner
                pensioner 10 May 2013 23: 08 New
                +1
                Quote: zennon
                including common sense and brains

                Thank! I always read with pleasure what was previously unfamiliar to me. I'll find it. I'll turn it on. By the way. Not difficult if, then lay out a working link. I’m still that user ... I call myself "a hopeless computer user" ...
                1. zennon
                  zennon 10 May 2013 23: 34 New
                  +2
                  Please:
                  http://www.hrono.ru/libris/lib_c/cundel.php
                  1. pensioner
                    pensioner 10 May 2013 23: 45 New
                    +2
                    So, let's start. Thank.
                    1. Igarr
                      Igarr 11 May 2013 18: 42 New
                      +1
                      Hello men ..
                      there is still such - Jürgen Graf, "The great lie of the twentieth century"
                      Link ... http://webreading.ru/prose_/prose_history/yurgen-graf-velikaya-logh-xx-veka.html
                      .
                      at least read, at least download ...

                      6 million ....
                      at a time when England refused ship with refugees ... Great sea power, damn it ..
                      1. pensioner
                        pensioner 11 May 2013 19: 46 New
                        +1
                        Thanks too!
  • MG42
    MG42 10 May 2013 18: 16 New
    18
    ... it turns out that a simple Russian soldier and the people brought the Victory to the Great Patriotic War, and the Supreme Commander-in-Chief I.V. Stalin stayed away, sounds a bit strange, if you continue the liberal logic, then the "Stalinist camps" and the NKVD were more afraid, and they went forward to fearlessly bring down fascists, >>> all because there are such TV series about the Second World War as <Brafrafat> ...
    1. MG42
      MG42 10 May 2013 18: 36 New
      17
      Photos of those times and before death, when everything was as in the spirit, did not write "For Stalin", right?
      1. ia-ai00
        ia-ai00 10 May 2013 19: 10 New
        13
        My father is also a front-line soldier, a participant in the defense of Moscow, unfortunately already gone to another world. When he spoke about the war, he said many times that they went on the attack with calls: - "For the Motherland, for Stalin!" Sorry, when a person goes on the attack and doesn’t know whether he will remain alive, you cannot “force” him to shout - “you can’t force him to” for Stalin, it came from the heart!
        1. Lopatov
          Lopatov 10 May 2013 19: 21 New
          -17
          You tell tales. Which, "for the homeland, for Stalin"? Pure agitprop
          1. ia-ai00
            ia-ai00 10 May 2013 19: 31 New
            +8
            I am talking about HIS FATHER! Speculate the words of the Father ... JUDGE YOURSELF? For you, it means nothing holy!
            1. Lopatov
              Lopatov 10 May 2013 20: 04 New