"All the criminal case of a" military coup "in Russia rests on the provocation of the FSB"
Son of Colonel Khabarov, suspected of preparing a rebellion, explains why his father is not guilty
In Yekaterinburg, a loud, important and rather strange case, known as the “case of Colonel Khabarov”, is approaching the final. For years, the legendary Colonel Leonid Khabarov, the hero of Afghanistan, whose authority among officers and commanders is very high, could be jailed. His age is approaching seventy, he is sick. The state considers him a dangerous rebel who was going to overthrow the constitutional order through sabotage and murder. Znak.com talked with Leonid Khabarov’s son Dmitry (also a military officer). He is sure that his father was a victim of a provocation developed by FSB officers.
Help Znak.com. The legendary paratrooper Leonid Khabarov, who in recent years led the military department of the USTU, was detained in July 2011. The investigation suspects him of preparing a large-scale insurgency, which aims to overthrow the constitutional system of the Russian Federation. The colonel is accused under the articles of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation 279 (“Armed insurrection”), 222 (“Illegal storage and acquisition weapons and ammunition "), 205-1 (" Assistance for terrorist activities "), 228 (" Illegal acquisition and storage of narcotic or psychotropic substances "). In addition to Khabarov, other members of the alleged terrorist cell were detained - Alexander Yermakov (recognized insane), Viktor Kralin, Alexander Ladeyshchikov, Sergey Katnikov. Part of the case is based on the testimony of two more members of the "underground" - Oleg Gorbachev and Ivan Botnari. According to the son of Leonid Khabarov, it was the latter that played the main role in the whole stories.
- The state prosecutor called the punishment he requires from the court for your father, Leonid Khabarov. 11 years. How unexpected was this for you?
- It was unexpected, like so much else in this trial. I was shocked by the lack of professionalism of the public prosecutor. Without a twinge of conscience, he did not take into account any circumstances of the trial, re-read the decision on charges in the final of the trial. Although already in court many of the testimony of witnesses differed from the information contained in this ruling. There are so many important details on which the charge rests. Like how, to whom and when the bag in which allegedly contained the weapon was transferred. This bag is one of the main evidence of the charges. And in court the witnesses did not show that Leonid Vasilyevich had any relation to this bag. He physically could not bear it, since she weighed more than a hundred kilograms. But in the indictment there is nothing of this. The prosecutor simply did not notice.
- It turns out that you entered the trial with one picture, the court witnesses gave some important testimony, but they did not take into account and the picture did not change?
- Yes. Lawlessness is complete. The prosecutor showed his incompetence, to say the least.
“I read that the phrase“ unspecified circumstances ”is found in the 128 indictment. Are any of these circumstances cleared up?
- Read the first paragraph of the ruling on charges. You will all see: "In an unspecified result of a place under unknown circumstances, in collusion with such and other unidentified persons ...". It turns out that the investigation did not really establish anything.
- What sentence do you expect?
- I expect an acquittal sentence, because there can be no other. But considering how the FSB falsifies all this, and the prosecutor’s office supports them, there is less hope. We have already seen the mood in the judicial process: the petitions of the defense are satisfied by five percent, and the petitions of the prosecution - by ninety-five percent.
- In recent days, several materials have appeared in newspapers, which are based on “drains” from the investigating authorities. It contains information about what kind of atrocities the group planned to include as your father. But there are two important points. Firstly, as a rule, if on the eve of the completion of the process, the investigation begins to merge something in the media, this means that they are not completely confident in their position. Secondly, there I caught such notes of sympathy for your father: they say that he happened to be in this company. Although earlier he was spoken of as the leader of this “rebel group”.
- I look at this disgrace no longer from the side, but directly participating in it. One gets the feeling that they do not really understand how to put all this in one picture. Why grabbed my father? What to do with it, they did not know. They began to persuade through relatives, as in the case of Kralin (another accused in the case - Znak.com): give testimony, let him begin to speak. I met with the investigator here at the FSB, and with the investigator in Moscow, who heads the investigative team for Kvachkov. They also asked my father to start talking. But what to talk about? They grabbed the man, but they don’t know what to do with him. There is no audio, no video recording, no hint that he wanted to do something. I was told not to doubt that they have evidence. Before the end of the investigation, I tried to figure out what other evidence was there. When the investigation ended, it turned out that they had nothing. Only that which was in the decision to prosecute as an accused, nothing else appeared.
- So what evidence was the result of the investigation?
- Not at all. There is no evidence that testifies that Leonid Vasilievich was involved in all this. He did not have any conversations, did not participate in the meetings of these “underground workers”. Yes, he held rallies in support of Colonel Kvachkov. No one denies that these were legitimate meetings, agreed with the administration of the city of Yekaterinburg. At meetings, people approached him. Someone shook hands, someone talked, someone gave a leaflet to read, someone offered financial assistance. There were many people there, many of whom my father did not know. FSB officers came in on tinted cars and took pictures of everything. So I greeted you by the hand, you handed me a piece of paper, tomorrow they will say that I participated in a state insurrection. Such evidence they have.
- Let's see. If your father has nothing to do with it, then where did all this come from - the “Breaking Dawn” plan, implying the undermining of power lines, “shooting lists”, etc.?
- For me now the picture is clear. This group of people was attended by two people, Oleg Gorbachev and Ivan Botnari, who were commonplace provocateurs of the FSB. The results of the operational-search activity and audio recordings were demonstrated in court. From these records it was clear that they were made by Gorbachev and Botnari, who apparently carried recording devices on themselves. Beforehand, Gorbachev kept audio and even video recording. Botnari also collected information. From all the conversations we hear that Gorbachev constantly provokes Yermakov. It turns out that they not only recorded the conversations, but also themselves provoked Yermakov (the alleged leader of the “cell”, declared insane - Znak.com). And this “Breaking Dawn” plan was written by Gorbachev’s hand. They were provocateurs of the FSB, one hundred percent.
- That is, Colonel Khabarov has nothing to do with this plan?
“This is a piece of paper, it says“ The Plan “Breaking Dawn” includes ... ”From a military point of view, this is utter nonsense, illiteracy. But Gorbachev, in principle, has never been literate.
“Why is the plan nonsense?”
- This experienced military will never make such a plan. It does not clearly indicate who, what and when to do. The seizure of an object is accompanied by certain actions that military personnel must work out. There should be groups of capture, fire cover, the tactic itself should be worked out. This is not three, not five people. And there is nonsense, like: "Blow up power lines." Blew up, and then what? People sit without light. Well, well, in our life they sit without light. So what? They will make this power line in a day, no one even remembers.
- In the case of these two, Gorbachev and Botnari, passed as witnesses?
- Yes, they were not accused.
- In the case of the accused are also Yermakov, Kralin, Ladeyshchikov, Katnikov. As far as they are related to your father, what kind of people are these?
- Let's take it in order. Ladeyschikov Jr. He met his father already in the SIZO. They were not familiar before the arrest. Senior Ladeyshchikov said that he and his father met at the rally. How did you meet? Came up, said hello, as I already told you. Kralin met Leonid Vasilyevich also already in the SIZO.
- They were in the same cell?
- Not. Kralina there was pressed in the chamber. There are specific names of FSB officers who did this. Witnesses clearly say that Lieutenant Colonel Sidorenko was doing this, sorry for the expression, garbage, as he put the repeat offenders to press him. Inmates confirmed. Petrushkin, who was already supposed to be transplanted, spoke at the trial. He personally inclined Kralin to sign the paper so that nothing would be. He signed, and Petrushkin personally took Sidorenko. And then he was removed from there (from the camera).
- And Katnikov who is?
- Katnikov Sergey Borisovich met with his father a couple of times. Once at his home. They met at a rally, Leonid asked to set up Skype at home on the computer. I do not know why it was him, so it happened, probably. We have not discussed this issue, I will not say anything. The second time, everything got hooked on the transfer of weapons, but Katnikov said in court that the father did not give him the weapon. In one resolution we are talking about one meeting, in the other - two meetings. At trial, the question is confused. Katnikov did not know what question to answer, confirmed both those testimony and this.
- Katnikov is already convicted in the case?
- Yes, his case was passed in a special order, he admitted his guilt. He received six years probation and some amount of fine.
- That is, he made a deal with the investigation?
- You can find online documents of Katnikov, in which he wrote that he is under pressure, on his family. He sent these applications on a huge list, in 12-15 organizations (regional prosecutor's office, general, military prosecutor's office, FSB). There was no answer. At the last moment, he apparently had already broken down and testified. And then in court he had already said something completely different. These readings do not correspond to what is written by the investigator. This is some kind of fantasy, fiction, this is what the investigator wants to see. Witnesses, both from the defense and the prosecution, whom the investigator called and took testimony, said at the trial that they did not agree with this.
- And this Alexander Yermakov, who was originally called the "cell leader", what kind of person?
- A regular guy. Gorbachev and Botnari found the fool and dissolved him under the guidance of the glorious organization of the FSB. Specifically developed all Alexander Sidorenko. He carried out operational support, collected reports, analyzed the situation. Botnari and Gorbachev - decoy with his submission. The investigator on the basis of their materials wrote that it is not clear who, it is not clear where, in what place. And when Yermakov was declared insane, Khabarov became the leader of this “underground”. They go to one hundred percent falsification of everything.
- An important logical moment. Initially it was implied that Yermakov would be the leader of the whole group, then he turned out to be insane, the leader of the group had to make your father. It turns out that the case was not originally directed against your father.
- I do not know. Investigators said that they no longer have options on how to make my father a leader. They have no evidence, and they argued the opposite. Good poker bluff. I do not believe them, because I understood more than the situation themselves. The role of each is set to 99%. These two friends did not appear by chance. The wiretaps are dated by the beginning of the year. Nobody talks about the insurgency on the records except for Gorbachev himself.
- Suppose, Gorbachev and Botnari infiltrated the group and were provocateurs. What did the band actually do?
- I do not know. Leonid Vasilievich had nothing to do with this group. He never appeared in an office on Posadskaya Street, where they were based, never met with Yermakov. Maybe at a rally somewhere flippers shook each other, that's all. There is no wiretapping. But Botnari says he made the conclusions that Khabarov is the eldest. I could not answer, on the basis of which he drew such conclusions. Just said unfoundedly. All other conclusions come from the words of Yermakov. Again, we see that Yermakov was hiding behind other people, not just Khabarov. He is a combat swimmer, a fur seal, and a Special Forces soldier - a many-sided Janus.
- Do you think he's really crazy?
- I saw him only in handcuffs, brought him up. But I would not say. Does not look like a fool, to be honest. He served in the army, tried to serve, at least. Then he deserted from there, he was caught, he went to jail. There he was already declared irresponsible, sluggish schizophrenia, healed, he lived normally, did not touch anyone. Maybe there are people who are prone to this. It’s like bringing a match to gasoline and it will explode. Such people in bulk. You can play on patriotic feelings, dilute, provoke.
- One of the proofs is an arsenal of weapons that were seized from your father.
- No, my father did not seize any arsenal. Withdrawn a collection of cartridges. These are different-sized cartridges older than you and me together. For example, a cartridge for underwater shooting, twenty centimeters such, with a needle. Or a cartridge with Arabic script, with a poisoned tip, 40-th year. All one by one. This collection can be seen in photographs or video footage at the military department of UPI, where his father worked. They stood directly in front of him on the table. She saw everyone who came to his office. Then seized small-caliber cartridges, 5,6 mm. They used to be sold in stores. There was no money in 90-s, and they bought them on the faculty with officers for a shooting gallery for their money. Another firing pen was seized - launching lighting flares for the New Year. Knives still gift. A part was taken, and a part was left - where to drag it? And the rest was seized from the Ladeyshchikovs in the house on Lezginskaya. This is the same muddy story with a bag, which is not very clear how it appeared. There was one TNT block inside, two gas revolvers. Another pistol, similar to the PM and one rusty PM with a silencer. Perhaps shooting, I do not know for sure. From the whole arsenal there are two shooting pistols, a TNT block, an electric detonator. Another grenade - they also raise doubts, because it is not clear if these are training grenades or combat ones.
- Does your father have to do with this bag?
“He didn't even touch her.”
- In “Komsomolskaya Pravda” they also published “shooting lists” and “manuals on conducting acts of sabotage”. Is that where it came from, whose hand is written?
- Either Gorbachev or Botnarem. Specifically, Gorbachev proposed to undermine the synagogue in Yekaterinburg, lay a charge there, he admitted in court. My father did not figure this out. The prosecution concluded that it was trying to overthrow the constitutional order. It is evident that the prosecutor does not bother to understand the situation, does not strain himself. So many witnesses showed the absurdity of this situation, the falsification of the investigator, the pressure from UFSB officers on relatives, etc. Of the people also beat testimony. The houses were handcuffed in front of small children, forced to talk to Khabarov. Very dirty, incompetently worked.
- In the federal media, the story is mentioned in the context of the situation with Kvachkov. Did your father have a relationship with him?
- Yes, they are familiar. Kvachkov came to speak to the officers of the faculty about two years ago. Also at the faculty and Swan spoke, and Chernetsky - any figure. Never Leonid Vasilyevich did not distinguish between a political and non-political activist, gave all the word: and the "United Russia", and not the "United Russia". Free speech. The officers could not attend these meetings, it was optional. Leonid Vassilievich did not agitate for anyone: they listened, but draw your own conclusions.
- How did he feel about Kvachkov’s political ideas?
- I did not discuss this topic. Speech and delivered Kvachkov.
- Could you call your father a nationalist?
- Of course not. He has friends and Jews, and Muslims, and Ukrainians, and Tatars. Very many people treat him well. A multinational company that has never shared. His friend and colleague, Gennady Kunyavsky, who is now in defense of my father, is an absolute Jew. So what? He never betrayed such things.
- What is the Minin and Pozharsky people's militia? What kind of organization? Was your father in it?
- I will not say for sure. I know that Leonid Vasilyevich tried to engage in political activities within the framework of the movement of veterans of Afghanistan. He was thinking about which political structure to rely on. Discussed and "NOMP". Only it was necessary to understand the structure of this organization, whether it has cells, a grid for certain regions. If it is well represented in the Ural Federal District, then it was possible to work, try to choose a deputy from the Union of Veterans of Afghanistan, so that good ideas could be implemented in our laws.
- A version is being put forward that the case against your father could have been initiated by the Ministry of Defense, because he often criticized the state of the Russian army. How realistic is this?
- If we assume that Serdyukov at that time was part of the Security Council of the Russian Federation, and there were other high-ranking officials, including the head of the FSB, the Interior Ministry ... The Russian government, to put it mildly, is corrupt, and they could easily agree there. I do not exclude such a possibility.
- How did your father treat Serdyukov?
- It is extremely negative. And spoke out about it in public. He said bluntly: Serdyukov, through the collapse of the army, did more than the CIA in all his years. Serdyukov must be condemned as a war criminal. He did not hide it, I do not hide it. This and many of my colleagues do not hide.
- Serdyukov in disgrace. Has something changed in this business after the resignation?
- Who said he is in disgrace? For some reason, he is not sitting in the SIZO. And others in his case are decided to release under house arrest, and according to Leonid Vasilyevich, the question is not solved at all. To bring the army to the boiling point, and then throw the bones, it will be distracted for a while - this is what the “Serdyukov case” is. I think the investigation will drag on for years, then it will be forgotten and no longer remembered. Nothing has changed since the resignation. You can see for yourself that in a debate of the parties, the prosecutor requested 11 years of strict regime.
- It was reported that the case was supervised by people from the FSB of the capital. Is this business still connected with the local FSB administration?
- An investigative-operational group was created, there were employees from various FSB organizations, including two Muscovites at the initial stage. Then they left. Then local people worked and they put a lot of pressure on witnesses. I can understand the people who testified against my father. If such pressure is applied to an officer of the FSB and his family, he will also sign anything. I picked up 37 materials for interest when the NKVD troika in five days sentenced a man to death. Is very similar. Then, by the way, two years later, one employee from this “troika” received the highest measure, another 60 GULAG years. Let the current investigators remember this.
- How is your father's health? I know that he had been ill with bronchitis and pneumonia several times in the SIZO.
- Heart ache. Five steps will pass - begins to choke. 66 years.
- You can tell this story, what it really was, in your opinion?
- It's simple. Found two fools, Gorbachev and Botnari. Found another Ermakova, which is unbalanced and easy to manage. Someone wanted new titles. The case of non-ordinary - the overthrow of the constitutional order. If everything went to "cheers", then Sidorenko would get a colonel, a general, probably a prize, etc. They fabricated the case, but could not finish it. Well, what a military coup? If this plan, which appears in the case, was even slightly related to reality, would the arrest of my father two weeks before the start of the implementation of the “plan” stop something? Where are these hundreds, thousands of secret underground workers who were supposed to support the uprising? Why aren't any of them caught? The whole thing - fiction and stupidity.
Comment by Anna Lastovetskaya, press secretary of the UFSB for the Sverdlovsk region: “Until the court’s verdict, we do not enter into discussions and do not respond to criticism addressed to us in order not to exert pressure on judicial bodies. I know that there is a lot of criticism about this case, but we are not responding to it yet, but just honestly doing our work. ”
In Yekaterinburg, a loud, important and rather strange case, known as the “case of Colonel Khabarov”, is approaching the final. For years, the legendary Colonel Leonid Khabarov, the hero of Afghanistan, whose authority among officers and commanders is very high, could be jailed. His age is approaching seventy, he is sick. The state considers him a dangerous rebel who was going to overthrow the constitutional order through sabotage and murder. Znak.com talked with Leonid Khabarov’s son Dmitry (also a military officer). He is sure that his father was a victim of a provocation developed by FSB officers.Help Znak.com. The legendary paratrooper Leonid Khabarov, who in recent years led the military department of the USTU, was detained in July 2011. The investigation suspects him of preparing a large-scale insurgency, which aims to overthrow the constitutional system of the Russian Federation. The colonel is accused under the articles of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation 279 (“Armed insurrection”), 222 (“Illegal storage and acquisition weapons and ammunition "), 205-1 (" Assistance for terrorist activities "), 228 (" Illegal acquisition and storage of narcotic or psychotropic substances "). In addition to Khabarov, other members of the alleged terrorist cell were detained - Alexander Yermakov (recognized insane), Viktor Kralin, Alexander Ladeyshchikov, Sergey Katnikov. Part of the case is based on the testimony of two more members of the "underground" - Oleg Gorbachev and Ivan Botnari. According to the son of Leonid Khabarov, it was the latter that played the main role in the whole stories.
- The state prosecutor called the punishment he requires from the court for your father, Leonid Khabarov. 11 years. How unexpected was this for you?
- It was unexpected, like so much else in this trial. I was shocked by the lack of professionalism of the public prosecutor. Without a twinge of conscience, he did not take into account any circumstances of the trial, re-read the decision on charges in the final of the trial. Although already in court many of the testimony of witnesses differed from the information contained in this ruling. There are so many important details on which the charge rests. Like how, to whom and when the bag in which allegedly contained the weapon was transferred. This bag is one of the main evidence of the charges. And in court the witnesses did not show that Leonid Vasilyevich had any relation to this bag. He physically could not bear it, since she weighed more than a hundred kilograms. But in the indictment there is nothing of this. The prosecutor simply did not notice.
- It turns out that you entered the trial with one picture, the court witnesses gave some important testimony, but they did not take into account and the picture did not change?
- Yes. Lawlessness is complete. The prosecutor showed his incompetence, to say the least.
“I read that the phrase“ unspecified circumstances ”is found in the 128 indictment. Are any of these circumstances cleared up?
- Read the first paragraph of the ruling on charges. You will all see: "In an unspecified result of a place under unknown circumstances, in collusion with such and other unidentified persons ...". It turns out that the investigation did not really establish anything.
- What sentence do you expect?
- I expect an acquittal sentence, because there can be no other. But considering how the FSB falsifies all this, and the prosecutor’s office supports them, there is less hope. We have already seen the mood in the judicial process: the petitions of the defense are satisfied by five percent, and the petitions of the prosecution - by ninety-five percent.
- In recent days, several materials have appeared in newspapers, which are based on “drains” from the investigating authorities. It contains information about what kind of atrocities the group planned to include as your father. But there are two important points. Firstly, as a rule, if on the eve of the completion of the process, the investigation begins to merge something in the media, this means that they are not completely confident in their position. Secondly, there I caught such notes of sympathy for your father: they say that he happened to be in this company. Although earlier he was spoken of as the leader of this “rebel group”.
- I look at this disgrace no longer from the side, but directly participating in it. One gets the feeling that they do not really understand how to put all this in one picture. Why grabbed my father? What to do with it, they did not know. They began to persuade through relatives, as in the case of Kralin (another accused in the case - Znak.com): give testimony, let him begin to speak. I met with the investigator here at the FSB, and with the investigator in Moscow, who heads the investigative team for Kvachkov. They also asked my father to start talking. But what to talk about? They grabbed the man, but they don’t know what to do with him. There is no audio, no video recording, no hint that he wanted to do something. I was told not to doubt that they have evidence. Before the end of the investigation, I tried to figure out what other evidence was there. When the investigation ended, it turned out that they had nothing. Only that which was in the decision to prosecute as an accused, nothing else appeared.
- So what evidence was the result of the investigation?
- Not at all. There is no evidence that testifies that Leonid Vasilievich was involved in all this. He did not have any conversations, did not participate in the meetings of these “underground workers”. Yes, he held rallies in support of Colonel Kvachkov. No one denies that these were legitimate meetings, agreed with the administration of the city of Yekaterinburg. At meetings, people approached him. Someone shook hands, someone talked, someone gave a leaflet to read, someone offered financial assistance. There were many people there, many of whom my father did not know. FSB officers came in on tinted cars and took pictures of everything. So I greeted you by the hand, you handed me a piece of paper, tomorrow they will say that I participated in a state insurrection. Such evidence they have.
- Let's see. If your father has nothing to do with it, then where did all this come from - the “Breaking Dawn” plan, implying the undermining of power lines, “shooting lists”, etc.?
- For me now the picture is clear. This group of people was attended by two people, Oleg Gorbachev and Ivan Botnari, who were commonplace provocateurs of the FSB. The results of the operational-search activity and audio recordings were demonstrated in court. From these records it was clear that they were made by Gorbachev and Botnari, who apparently carried recording devices on themselves. Beforehand, Gorbachev kept audio and even video recording. Botnari also collected information. From all the conversations we hear that Gorbachev constantly provokes Yermakov. It turns out that they not only recorded the conversations, but also themselves provoked Yermakov (the alleged leader of the “cell”, declared insane - Znak.com). And this “Breaking Dawn” plan was written by Gorbachev’s hand. They were provocateurs of the FSB, one hundred percent.
- That is, Colonel Khabarov has nothing to do with this plan?
“This is a piece of paper, it says“ The Plan “Breaking Dawn” includes ... ”From a military point of view, this is utter nonsense, illiteracy. But Gorbachev, in principle, has never been literate.
“Why is the plan nonsense?”
- This experienced military will never make such a plan. It does not clearly indicate who, what and when to do. The seizure of an object is accompanied by certain actions that military personnel must work out. There should be groups of capture, fire cover, the tactic itself should be worked out. This is not three, not five people. And there is nonsense, like: "Blow up power lines." Blew up, and then what? People sit without light. Well, well, in our life they sit without light. So what? They will make this power line in a day, no one even remembers.
- In the case of these two, Gorbachev and Botnari, passed as witnesses?
- Yes, they were not accused.
- In the case of the accused are also Yermakov, Kralin, Ladeyshchikov, Katnikov. As far as they are related to your father, what kind of people are these?
- Let's take it in order. Ladeyschikov Jr. He met his father already in the SIZO. They were not familiar before the arrest. Senior Ladeyshchikov said that he and his father met at the rally. How did you meet? Came up, said hello, as I already told you. Kralin met Leonid Vasilyevich also already in the SIZO.
- They were in the same cell?
- Not. Kralina there was pressed in the chamber. There are specific names of FSB officers who did this. Witnesses clearly say that Lieutenant Colonel Sidorenko was doing this, sorry for the expression, garbage, as he put the repeat offenders to press him. Inmates confirmed. Petrushkin, who was already supposed to be transplanted, spoke at the trial. He personally inclined Kralin to sign the paper so that nothing would be. He signed, and Petrushkin personally took Sidorenko. And then he was removed from there (from the camera).
- And Katnikov who is?
- Katnikov Sergey Borisovich met with his father a couple of times. Once at his home. They met at a rally, Leonid asked to set up Skype at home on the computer. I do not know why it was him, so it happened, probably. We have not discussed this issue, I will not say anything. The second time, everything got hooked on the transfer of weapons, but Katnikov said in court that the father did not give him the weapon. In one resolution we are talking about one meeting, in the other - two meetings. At trial, the question is confused. Katnikov did not know what question to answer, confirmed both those testimony and this.
- Katnikov is already convicted in the case?
- Yes, his case was passed in a special order, he admitted his guilt. He received six years probation and some amount of fine.
- That is, he made a deal with the investigation?
- You can find online documents of Katnikov, in which he wrote that he is under pressure, on his family. He sent these applications on a huge list, in 12-15 organizations (regional prosecutor's office, general, military prosecutor's office, FSB). There was no answer. At the last moment, he apparently had already broken down and testified. And then in court he had already said something completely different. These readings do not correspond to what is written by the investigator. This is some kind of fantasy, fiction, this is what the investigator wants to see. Witnesses, both from the defense and the prosecution, whom the investigator called and took testimony, said at the trial that they did not agree with this.
- And this Alexander Yermakov, who was originally called the "cell leader", what kind of person?
- A regular guy. Gorbachev and Botnari found the fool and dissolved him under the guidance of the glorious organization of the FSB. Specifically developed all Alexander Sidorenko. He carried out operational support, collected reports, analyzed the situation. Botnari and Gorbachev - decoy with his submission. The investigator on the basis of their materials wrote that it is not clear who, it is not clear where, in what place. And when Yermakov was declared insane, Khabarov became the leader of this “underground”. They go to one hundred percent falsification of everything.
- An important logical moment. Initially it was implied that Yermakov would be the leader of the whole group, then he turned out to be insane, the leader of the group had to make your father. It turns out that the case was not originally directed against your father.
- I do not know. Investigators said that they no longer have options on how to make my father a leader. They have no evidence, and they argued the opposite. Good poker bluff. I do not believe them, because I understood more than the situation themselves. The role of each is set to 99%. These two friends did not appear by chance. The wiretaps are dated by the beginning of the year. Nobody talks about the insurgency on the records except for Gorbachev himself.
- Suppose, Gorbachev and Botnari infiltrated the group and were provocateurs. What did the band actually do?
- I do not know. Leonid Vasilievich had nothing to do with this group. He never appeared in an office on Posadskaya Street, where they were based, never met with Yermakov. Maybe at a rally somewhere flippers shook each other, that's all. There is no wiretapping. But Botnari says he made the conclusions that Khabarov is the eldest. I could not answer, on the basis of which he drew such conclusions. Just said unfoundedly. All other conclusions come from the words of Yermakov. Again, we see that Yermakov was hiding behind other people, not just Khabarov. He is a combat swimmer, a fur seal, and a Special Forces soldier - a many-sided Janus.
- Do you think he's really crazy?
- I saw him only in handcuffs, brought him up. But I would not say. Does not look like a fool, to be honest. He served in the army, tried to serve, at least. Then he deserted from there, he was caught, he went to jail. There he was already declared irresponsible, sluggish schizophrenia, healed, he lived normally, did not touch anyone. Maybe there are people who are prone to this. It’s like bringing a match to gasoline and it will explode. Such people in bulk. You can play on patriotic feelings, dilute, provoke.
- One of the proofs is an arsenal of weapons that were seized from your father.
- No, my father did not seize any arsenal. Withdrawn a collection of cartridges. These are different-sized cartridges older than you and me together. For example, a cartridge for underwater shooting, twenty centimeters such, with a needle. Or a cartridge with Arabic script, with a poisoned tip, 40-th year. All one by one. This collection can be seen in photographs or video footage at the military department of UPI, where his father worked. They stood directly in front of him on the table. She saw everyone who came to his office. Then seized small-caliber cartridges, 5,6 mm. They used to be sold in stores. There was no money in 90-s, and they bought them on the faculty with officers for a shooting gallery for their money. Another firing pen was seized - launching lighting flares for the New Year. Knives still gift. A part was taken, and a part was left - where to drag it? And the rest was seized from the Ladeyshchikovs in the house on Lezginskaya. This is the same muddy story with a bag, which is not very clear how it appeared. There was one TNT block inside, two gas revolvers. Another pistol, similar to the PM and one rusty PM with a silencer. Perhaps shooting, I do not know for sure. From the whole arsenal there are two shooting pistols, a TNT block, an electric detonator. Another grenade - they also raise doubts, because it is not clear if these are training grenades or combat ones.
- Does your father have to do with this bag?
“He didn't even touch her.”
- In “Komsomolskaya Pravda” they also published “shooting lists” and “manuals on conducting acts of sabotage”. Is that where it came from, whose hand is written?
- Either Gorbachev or Botnarem. Specifically, Gorbachev proposed to undermine the synagogue in Yekaterinburg, lay a charge there, he admitted in court. My father did not figure this out. The prosecution concluded that it was trying to overthrow the constitutional order. It is evident that the prosecutor does not bother to understand the situation, does not strain himself. So many witnesses showed the absurdity of this situation, the falsification of the investigator, the pressure from UFSB officers on relatives, etc. Of the people also beat testimony. The houses were handcuffed in front of small children, forced to talk to Khabarov. Very dirty, incompetently worked.
- In the federal media, the story is mentioned in the context of the situation with Kvachkov. Did your father have a relationship with him?
- Yes, they are familiar. Kvachkov came to speak to the officers of the faculty about two years ago. Also at the faculty and Swan spoke, and Chernetsky - any figure. Never Leonid Vasilyevich did not distinguish between a political and non-political activist, gave all the word: and the "United Russia", and not the "United Russia". Free speech. The officers could not attend these meetings, it was optional. Leonid Vassilievich did not agitate for anyone: they listened, but draw your own conclusions.
- How did he feel about Kvachkov’s political ideas?
- I did not discuss this topic. Speech and delivered Kvachkov.
- Could you call your father a nationalist?
- Of course not. He has friends and Jews, and Muslims, and Ukrainians, and Tatars. Very many people treat him well. A multinational company that has never shared. His friend and colleague, Gennady Kunyavsky, who is now in defense of my father, is an absolute Jew. So what? He never betrayed such things.
- What is the Minin and Pozharsky people's militia? What kind of organization? Was your father in it?
- I will not say for sure. I know that Leonid Vasilyevich tried to engage in political activities within the framework of the movement of veterans of Afghanistan. He was thinking about which political structure to rely on. Discussed and "NOMP". Only it was necessary to understand the structure of this organization, whether it has cells, a grid for certain regions. If it is well represented in the Ural Federal District, then it was possible to work, try to choose a deputy from the Union of Veterans of Afghanistan, so that good ideas could be implemented in our laws.
- A version is being put forward that the case against your father could have been initiated by the Ministry of Defense, because he often criticized the state of the Russian army. How realistic is this?
- If we assume that Serdyukov at that time was part of the Security Council of the Russian Federation, and there were other high-ranking officials, including the head of the FSB, the Interior Ministry ... The Russian government, to put it mildly, is corrupt, and they could easily agree there. I do not exclude such a possibility.
- How did your father treat Serdyukov?
- It is extremely negative. And spoke out about it in public. He said bluntly: Serdyukov, through the collapse of the army, did more than the CIA in all his years. Serdyukov must be condemned as a war criminal. He did not hide it, I do not hide it. This and many of my colleagues do not hide.
- Serdyukov in disgrace. Has something changed in this business after the resignation?
- Who said he is in disgrace? For some reason, he is not sitting in the SIZO. And others in his case are decided to release under house arrest, and according to Leonid Vasilyevich, the question is not solved at all. To bring the army to the boiling point, and then throw the bones, it will be distracted for a while - this is what the “Serdyukov case” is. I think the investigation will drag on for years, then it will be forgotten and no longer remembered. Nothing has changed since the resignation. You can see for yourself that in a debate of the parties, the prosecutor requested 11 years of strict regime.
- It was reported that the case was supervised by people from the FSB of the capital. Is this business still connected with the local FSB administration?
- An investigative-operational group was created, there were employees from various FSB organizations, including two Muscovites at the initial stage. Then they left. Then local people worked and they put a lot of pressure on witnesses. I can understand the people who testified against my father. If such pressure is applied to an officer of the FSB and his family, he will also sign anything. I picked up 37 materials for interest when the NKVD troika in five days sentenced a man to death. Is very similar. Then, by the way, two years later, one employee from this “troika” received the highest measure, another 60 GULAG years. Let the current investigators remember this.
- How is your father's health? I know that he had been ill with bronchitis and pneumonia several times in the SIZO.
- Heart ache. Five steps will pass - begins to choke. 66 years.
- You can tell this story, what it really was, in your opinion?
- It's simple. Found two fools, Gorbachev and Botnari. Found another Ermakova, which is unbalanced and easy to manage. Someone wanted new titles. The case of non-ordinary - the overthrow of the constitutional order. If everything went to "cheers", then Sidorenko would get a colonel, a general, probably a prize, etc. They fabricated the case, but could not finish it. Well, what a military coup? If this plan, which appears in the case, was even slightly related to reality, would the arrest of my father two weeks before the start of the implementation of the “plan” stop something? Where are these hundreds, thousands of secret underground workers who were supposed to support the uprising? Why aren't any of them caught? The whole thing - fiction and stupidity.
Comment by Anna Lastovetskaya, press secretary of the UFSB for the Sverdlovsk region: “Until the court’s verdict, we do not enter into discussions and do not respond to criticism addressed to us in order not to exert pressure on judicial bodies. I know that there is a lot of criticism about this case, but we are not responding to it yet, but just honestly doing our work. ”
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