The White Bohemian rebellion and other hostilities in the spring-summer of 1918

72
The White Bohemian rebellion and other hostilities in the spring-summer of 1918
The first battery of the Czechoslovak corps named after Jan Zizka from Trocnov in the battles for Bezenchuk. June 1918


All that holds their thrones -
The work of the hand ...
We’ll fill the cartridges ourselves
Screw the bayonets to the guns.

“Bravely, comrades, keep pace,” words by Leonid Radin.
The lyrics of the song were printed in the legal edition
back in 1914 in the Bolshevik newspaper “The Path of Truth” (No. 75).

Unknown Wars. In the previous material about the White Bohemian uprising there were many pictures, or rather photographs. This material, as promised, will contain excerpts from the Izvestia newspaper. From them we will try to find out what information about current events Russian citizens received in 1918. But first we should give some information based on our current knowledge.




Here it is - the cover of the Izvestia newspaper binder from the funds of the Penza State Archive!

So, the Czechoslovak corps was formed on the territory of the Republic of Ingushetia from prisoners of war of the Austro-Hungarian army of the corresponding nationalities, armed with Russian weapons and was used on the Eastern Front of the First World War. The incentive was the promise after the victory to help create a Czechoslovak state independent from Austria and Hungary. The corps supported the October coup, which was enthusiastically written about by all Soviet newspapers and in particular Pravda.


And here is the appeal of the Soviet government on May 31. As you can see, the difficulties facing him and the country at that time were simply enormous!

But on March 3, 1918, an agreement was signed in Brest-Litovsk between Germany, Austria-Hungary and Turkey on the one hand and Soviet Russia on the other. Not everyone understood that this was a forced measure, but the terms of the agreement that gave peace to exhausted Russia were very difficult. Soviet Russia was losing control of Ukraine, Poland, Belarus, its Baltic provinces (now Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia) and its Caucasus provinces of Kars and Batum. These lands accounted for 34% of the population of the former empire, 54% of its industrial potential, 89% of coal deposits and 26% of railways.

The amount of reparations was set at 300 million rubles. The sale of 25% of the production of the Baku oil fields to Germany was also agreed upon. Three secret clauses of the treaty (this is despite the already declared rejection of secret diplomacy!) allowed Germany to act with armed force against the Entente forces on Russian territory, as well as British troops from Baku.


It is interesting that at that time it was necessary to disarm not only the Czechs, but also the Soviet regiments. The reason... non-payment of wages, and hence dissatisfaction with the authorities, which should not have been allowed

The agreement also provided for the exchange of prisoners of war, that is, the return to the active army of Germany and Austria-Hungary of a large number of soldiers of the Quadruple Alliance captured by Russia. It is clear that the Entente did not want all this. After all, no one could have foreseen the revolution in Germany at that time.


Information from Penza


Decree on conscription into the army

Meanwhile, from March 7 to March 14, in the Bakhmach region, the Czechoslovaks, together with the Soviet troops, fought against the Germans, ensuring the evacuation of Soviet institutions and refugees. At the same time, the leadership of the corps offered the Soviet government to allow him to travel to France through Vladivostok.


A note that the Soviet government does not harbor any dark intentions regarding the Czechoslovak corps...


Trotsky signed newspaper articles with one hand. Another... an order to disarm the corps and send Czechoslovaks to prisoner of war camps. Politics, however...

But then the Soviet government became aware of the secret negotiations of the allies regarding the Japanese landing in Siberia and the Far East. Therefore, on March 28, in order to prevent him, Leon Trotsky gave Lockhart consent to land an all-Union landing in Vladivostok. But on April 5, Japanese Admiral Kato landed a small detachment of marines in Vladivostok “to protect the lives and property of Japanese citizens” without notifying the allies.


"Japanese landing force." Then they wrote like this

The Soviet government, suspecting the Entente of a double game, demanded that negotiations immediately begin on the evacuation of the Czechoslovaks through Arkhangelsk and Murmansk instead of Vladivostok. Germany, of course, was also not happy about their imminent arrival on the Western Front. Therefore, the German Ambassador to Russia, Count Mirbach, sent a note to the Soviet government demanding that the corps be disarmed and, in fact, interned on Russian territory. This was the price for peace with the Germans.

And on April 21, People's Commissar for Foreign Affairs G.V. Chicherin sent a telegram to the Krasnoyarsk Soviet, ordering further movement of Czechoslovak trains to the east to be suspended:

Fearing a Japanese attack on Siberia, Germany resolutely demands that a rapid evacuation of German prisoners from Eastern Siberia to Western or European Russia begin. Please use all means. Czechoslovak troops should not move east.
Chicherin

The corps, however, continued to move in the direction of Vladivostok, therefore, on May 25, a telegram from Commissar Trotsky “to all Soviet deputies along the line from Penza to Omsk” followed, which left no doubt about the determination of the Soviet authorities to first disarm the Czechoslovaks, and then, to please the Germans, again turn them into prisoners of war.


The rebel legionnaires stayed in Penza for two days and moved on. Here is a message from Penza on June 2

The result was an uprising of the Czechoslovak corps from Penza to Vladivostok. The uprising of the corps allowed the forces of counter-revolution to unite. In particular, the government of Komuch (the Committee of Members of the Constituent Assembly) was created in Samara and, in fact, the first leadership of the White Guards in Russia opposed to the Bolsheviks. And this despite the fact that the People's Army of Komuch fought under the revolutionary Red Banner!


The first mention in Izvestia of the Civil War...

Already on July 10, its fighters under the command of Lieutenant Colonel Kappel re-took Syzran, and Chechek’s legionnaires captured Kuznetsk on July 15. On July 22, Kappel’s troops made their way through Bugulma to Simbirsk and then, together with the Czechoslovaks, went to Saratov and Kazan. On July 25, in the Urals, Colonel Voitsekhovsky occupied Yekaterinburg. In the east, General Gaida occupied Irkutsk on July 11, and later Chita.


The price for stopping the German offensive on Novorossiysk was the Black Sea Fleet...

But then the superior forces of the Red Army recaptured Kazan from the People’s Army on September 10, then Simbirsk on September 12. At the beginning of October, Syzran, Stavropol and Samara were taken. In the Czechoslovak legions themselves, uncertainty grew steadily that it was they who needed to fight in the Volga region and the Urals.


June 11 – “Fight against the Czechoslovaks”

It should be noted here that it was the Brest-Litovsk Peace Treaty, which became the prologue to the uprising of the Czechoslovak corps, that marked the advent of an era of open political pragmatism, that is, something that before that they at least somehow tried to veil. However, like any cynical and exclusively pragmatic “deed,” this agreement, by and large, did not bring much benefit to anyone. The losses of the Soviet side have already been mentioned here. But it didn’t bring much peace to it either: the White Bohemian rebellion began, White Guard gangs became more active, so the young republic still had to fight.


June 18 – “Towards the fight against the Czechoslovaks”

Accordingly, the Germans, having received a huge piece of the Russian Empire, were forced to keep numerous troops here, which ultimately never made it to the Western Front. The losses they suffered in battles on the territory of Ukraine were also significant. Many soldiers were promoted and became active participants in the November Revolution in Germany.


Burning of the commission. The realities of the Civil War...

In turn, the uprising of the corps blocked a huge number of German-Austrian prisoners of war in Siberian camps, who never appeared on the Western Front, which facilitated the victory of the Entente. Moreover, now the Soviet government had every reason to justify itself to the Germans for failure to comply with the clauses of the Brest-Litovsk Treaty regarding the release of prisoners of war. For they did not have the power to do this in territories controlled by the Czechoslovaks. True, we can say that it was the Czechs who raised the Omsk ruler Kolchak, but they also sold him to the Irkutsk Revolutionary Committee (and along with the gold reserves!), thus bargaining for themselves the right to leave Russia.


22nd of June. No sooner had the Czechs left Penza than a conspiracy immediately matured there!


Conspiracy in Penza. Continuation

Finally, what benefit did the Czechoslovak corps itself receive from the armed uprising on Russian territory?

Well, firstly, during their stay in Russia, the Czechs and Slovaks set up a lot of different enterprises. Beer and sausages were produced. But the main thing is that they loaded into their echelons everything that their hands could reach. Non-ferrous and ferrous metals (including door handles), rolled metal, hemp, leather, lard, flax, furs, gold - all this could be found in abundance on the trains heading east. The Legionary Bank was created. The corps participated in battles in such a way as to suffer minimal losses. Many legionnaires managed to acquire wives and children during their stay in Russia.


Fighting in the forests near Orsha...


Quite a modern announcement!


The rumors about the murder of the Romanovs are not true... But they were true... Then Izvestia will have to write about it! This is like the case of the Japanese plane in 1980, which went towards the sea. There is no way to immediately say: “The border is locked.” Briefly and clearly. And it exudes strength and confidence in its right. But no...

So, significantly more people left Russia on Czech trains than were in the corps at the start of the mutiny! And, perhaps, this rebellion can be considered one of the most profitable... economic enterprises of the early twentieth century. Namely, the legion, which returned to the created Czechoslovakia, brought such values ​​to it that it did not experience all the difficulties that the defeated Germany and Austria experienced, and quickly became one of the most developed states of post-war Europe!


There was a place in the newspaper in order to write about the project of the tunnel under the English Channel. And why not publish it if they wrote about it? It's interesting indeed. War is war, but the achievements of science and technology are... pleasing!

To be continued ...
72 comments
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  1. +6
    9 September 2023 04: 54
    If I am interested in any news in the Russian media, then I try to duplicate it and read it in the media not ours. This does not mean at all that I take everything at face value, however, by reading several different presentations of the material at once, you can get a more or less clear picture of what actually happened there...

    What am I for? And to the fact that News - just a mouthpiece of the Bolsheviks, expressing the views of the Bolshevik government sitting in Moscow. It would be interesting to read other newspapers, at least local ones from Penza. What did they write about this? Thank you...
    1. +8
      9 September 2023 05: 53
      And to the fact that Izvestia is just the mouthpiece of the Bolsheviks, expressing the view of the Bolshevik government sitting in Moscow.

      One of the classic examples of history is the coverage of the beginning of Napoleon's Hundred Days' War.
      "The Corsican monster has landed in the Bay of Juan."
      "The ogre goes to the Track."
      "The usurper entered Grenoble."
      "Bonaparte occupied Lyon."
      "Napoleon approaches Fontainebleau."
      "His Imperial Majesty enters Paris faithful to him."

      I think there is no point in looking for the bottom line in Vyacheslav’s works; he writes based on the source and does not hide it. Although it must be admitted that the article is a fairly balanced position.
      Definitely a plus for the work, thank you!
      1. +5
        9 September 2023 06: 20
        I perceive every page of what happened in every region as an addition to the title of the fairly well-known book “Russia, washed in blood.”
        1. +8
          9 September 2023 07: 14
          Quote from Korsar4
          I perceive every page of what happened in every region as an addition to the title of the fairly well-known book “Russia, washed in blood.”

          In the summer I went to the village of Kyn (on the western slope of the Ural Mountains in the Perm Territory). The local history museum caught some interesting information that the village changed hands 7 times during the Civil War. Moreover, on the one hand, the White Czechs fought, and on the other, the Red Hungarians.



          Some photos!
          1. +6
            9 September 2023 08: 02
            Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
            The White Czechs fought, and the Red Hungarians on the other.

            Oh, and they cut each other!
            1. +6
              9 September 2023 08: 28
              The national problems of the dual monarchy were transferred to Russian territory.
              1. +6
                9 September 2023 08: 34
                But here, the place is not so important.

                It's like a duel of irreconcilable football teams now. Only the price of the issue is slightly different.
                1. +5
                  9 September 2023 08: 48
                  Only the price of the issue is slightly different.
                  Exactly. "Grandfather, why do the Russians want to kill us?" You know who I'm talking about.
                  1. +5
                    9 September 2023 08: 49
                    Of course. I often remember this phrase. I just remember.
                    1. +6
                      9 September 2023 09: 00
                      You know, the problem is not in this question, asked a year and a half ago and which can be considered the result of state propaganda. The problem is that a generation is growing up whose “father the Russians killed” is reality, and not the result of agitprop.
                      1. +5
                        9 September 2023 09: 09
                        I don’t know what can pass through the spilled blood. Only time. And then two or three generations.

                        Or rather, even new shed blood interrupts the sharpness of perception.
              2. +3
                9 September 2023 08: 48
                Quote: 3x3zsave
                The national problems of the dual monarchy were transferred to Russian territory.

                How well you said!
          2. +5
            9 September 2023 08: 33
            Movement of people.

            Now I went to the train, and sang

            Foolish heart, don't beat
            Think fast in unison!
            There in France, near Reims,
            Hidden city of Mourmelon,
            Where for honor, not for a reward, -
            Slander, stay away forever -
            Russian brigades fought
            For the province of Champagne.
            1. Eug
              0
              10 September 2023 11: 08
              There is a song to the same tune with completely different words...
      2. +5
        9 September 2023 09: 06
        Definitely a plus for the work, thank you!

        Yes, this article is more interesting and informative than yesterday's. You can really feel the spirit of the era.
        1. +2
          9 September 2023 11: 51
          Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
          than yesterday

          Doesn't come every time...
    2. +3
      9 September 2023 07: 54
      Quote: Luminman
      It would be interesting to read other newspapers,

      And others were already closed at that time! There were no others! And about the rebellion in Penza, it is written in my 2016 article here on VO.
      1. +3
        9 September 2023 08: 27
        Quote: kalibr
        There were no others

        Well, how could it not be! What about foreign ones? Especially Czech and Slovak newspapers. You can immediately understand how the era lived ...

        Quote: kalibr
        There are articles on the web on Penza sites

        These are just squeezes from newspapers and the subjective opinion of the author ...
        1. +5
          9 September 2023 08: 47
          Quote: Luminman
          Especially Czech and Slovak newspapers.

          And how can I look there? Are you laughing?
          1. +3
            9 September 2023 09: 03
            Quote: kalibr
            And how can I look there?

            This applies to serious journalistic work - looking everywhere... wink
            1. +4
              9 September 2023 09: 06
              Quote: Luminman
              This applies to serious journalistic work.

              Pay for my trip to the Czech Republic and all expenses associated with processing various papers and... the train tomorrow! And since you yourself understand that this is impossible, then why write nonsense? Serious work must be seriously paid. At one time, I contacted the Czech magazine HPM and only thanks to this I received information about armored cars on the streets of Penza. But this was solely my initiative and my expenses for postage and all that. They paid for themselves through royalties. Now the costs of... “newspapers” cannot be repaid by any royalties!
              1. +3
                9 September 2023 11: 03
                Quote: kalibr
                Pay for my trip to the Czech Republic and all expenses

                Will it not be a shock to you that the World Wide Web has existed for a long time, where you can get to almost any information without leaving your home, including scans of any newspapers, including Czech ones?

                Quote: kalibr
                At one time I contacted the Czech magazine HPM...
                ...and received information about armored cars on the streets of Penza

                I always believed that information about armored cars on the streets of Penza can only be obtained in Penza... wink

                In a word:
                Quote: kalibr
                why write nonsense?
                1. Fat
                  +6
                  9 September 2023 11: 38
                  Quote: Luminman
                  It will not be a shock to you that the World Wide Web has existed for a long time, where you can get to almost any information without leaving your home, including scans of any newspapers

                  hi You have too many hopes for network resources, colleague. Obviously, what you find on the Internet is enough for you.
                  However, the expectation that you can find everything you need on the Internet is a fallacy. Typically, targeted searches on networks can be characterized by the words: “Abandon hope, all who enter here...” Even despite the fashionable “browser assistants.”
                  If previously search engines made it possible to filter the results obtained from the “ink cloud” according to designated criteria, now most often you have to do this practically “manually”.
                  The browser's search engine is now subordinated to the main function - to earn extra money by imposing another "cloud" of various
                  advertising "infojunction" request
                2. +3
                  9 September 2023 11: 54
                  Quote: Luminman
                  including scans of any newspapers, including Czech ones?

                  I know. But all my experience suggests that it is best to work with newspaper files yourself. No Internet can compare with this.
                  Quote: Luminman
                  I always believed that information about armored cars on the streets of Penza could only be obtained in Penza.

                  For some reason, such information was not available in Penza. It was only mentioned in passing, but what, which, where, was NEVER REPORTED. That's why I became interested.
              2. Fat
                +3
                9 September 2023 12: 02
                Quote: kalibr
                Pay for my trip to the Czech Republic and all expenses associated with processing various papers and... the train tomorrow!

                Vyacheslav Olegovich, why are you going to the Czech Republic to drink beer?
                You will make scans of Czechoslovak primary sources. Do you know Czech? This means you will need a translator, and the inconvenience associated with this will inevitably occur. You will not be able to use a scan of a newspaper without translation into Russian, which means the documentary value of the photocopy will sharply decrease.
                Of course, the visuals do not need translation, but confirmation of the authenticity of the photographic document is required. Here cooperation with NRM was justified. In these unfriendly circumstances, expect any kind of cooperation from the “Czechoslovaks”... - This is the apotheosis of optimism. smile
                1. +1
                  9 September 2023 15: 19
                  Quote: Thick
                  You will not be able to use a scan of a newspaper without translation into Russian.

                  Easily! All Slavic languages ​​have the same architecture and it is even easier to translate from them than from primitive English, only a dictionary should be at hand. About two years ago I translated for myself an interesting article from Bulgarian. The meaning was clear, and a dictionary was needed to clarify the details...
                  1. +3
                    9 September 2023 15: 51
                    Agree. Materials on the specialty in Bulgarian are quite easy and convenient to read.
                  2. Fat
                    +3
                    9 September 2023 16: 05
                    Quote: Luminman
                    All Slavic languages ​​have the same architecture and it is even easier to translate from them than from primitive English, you just have to have a dictionary at hand. About two years ago I translated for myself an interesting article from Bulgarian. The meaning was clear, and a dictionary was needed to clarify the details...

                    Will you translate for yourself, but for publication?
                    Dear reader, go ahead and translate it yourself?! Just bring a dictionary...
                    If it’s easier, dear reader, prepare an online OCR and the same translator and puff over a scan of the half-erased text, so that my author’s respectful attitude toward you is immediately clear... wink
                    No, offering a “piece of raw tenderloin” when the reader is waiting for a “steak” is a bad and thankless task negative
                    1. +1
                      9 September 2023 17: 51
                      Quote: Thick
                      Will you translate for yourself, but for publication?

                      What's the difference? A little literary processing - maybe for publication...
                    2. +3
                      9 September 2023 18: 12
                      If life forces me, I will translate it.

                      But I remember how I sat with an article on my specialty with unfamiliar German. There is no desire to repeat it again unless absolutely necessary.
                2. +3
                  9 September 2023 20: 03
                  Quote: Thick
                  why are you going to the Czech Republic?

                  This is for the “clocution”...
      2. 0
        10 September 2023 15: 16
        Quote: kalibr
        And about the rebellion in Penza, it is written in my 2016 article here on VO.

        "... The result was the uprising of the Czechoslovak corps from Penza to Vladivostok."
        Is it okay that Trotsky’s telegram was on the 25th, and the decision to revolt by the Czechoslovaks was made on the 20th?
        Is a half-truth a lie?
    3. +4
      9 September 2023 08: 03
      Quote: Luminman
      Penza.

      There are articles on the Web on Penza sites ... Look, do not take it for work.
  2. +4
    9 September 2023 06: 17
    Thank you, Vyacheslav Olegovich!

    Wherever the war does not reverberate.
    And I didn’t understand the scale of what the Czechs could take with them.
    1. +3
      9 September 2023 08: 01
      I had an article here about the Czech rebellion as a business. There are detailed descriptions of leather, hemp, cattle, rolled metal products, beer and sausages. If we put aside the military aspect, the rebellion was... one of the most effective business projects of that time! It’s just that all people are overshadowed by the war... war, war... And people played in an orchestra, had their own book publishing house (!), married Russians, had children... Despite the losses of the “Czechs”, many more people left Russia than were registered in the building at the beginning!
      1. 0
        8 January 2024 22: 57
        And how much they stole from us and killed our own. This was truly a wonderful business project. White officers and other figures of the white movement write interestingly about the Czechs in their memoirs. I haven't seen a single positive review. Epithets applied to them: traitors, robbers, and so on. They write that the population of Siberia hated them. It's not the Bolsheviks who write. To be fair, the Czechs are noted positively at the beginning of the uprising. And later they characterize them as the last monsters.) By the way...I don’t know about Czech book publishing. But the fact that they robbed the Perm University, stealing the entire library from there.... I came across such information. Why were they normal businessmen?)
  3. +5
    9 September 2023 08: 30
    But on March 3, 1918, an agreement was signed in Brest-Litovsk between Germany, Austria-Hungary and Turkey on the one hand and Soviet Russia on the other. Not everyone understood that this was a forced measure, but the terms of the agreement that gave peace to exhausted Russia were very difficult. Soviet Russia was losing control of Ukraine,
    The Germans signed an agreement with Ukraine on February 9; Moscow then, on March 3, no longer controlled the territory of Ukraine.
    1. +2
      9 September 2023 08: 45
      Treaty of Brest-Litovsk - Wikipedia
      ru.wikipedia.org›Brest Peace
      The Treaty of Brest-Litovsk is a separate peace treaty signed on March 3, 1918 in the city of Brest-Litovsk by representatives of Soviet Russia and the Central Powers
      1. +2
        9 September 2023 09: 32
        Vyacheslav, look https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D1%80%D0%B5%D1%81%D1%82%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0% B9_%D0%BC%D0%B8%D1%80_%D1%81_%D0%A3%D0%9D%D0%A0, this is about the agreement between the Germans and the UPR (Ukrainian People's Rada) on February 9, 1918. What happened earlier - February 9 or March 3?
        1. +2
          9 September 2023 11: 59
          Quote: Aviator_
          Vyacheslav, look

          I just didn't understand what you mean. Sorry. Then I realized. But I, in turn, will ask you to write to your counterpart Dima so that he no longer writes me comments with the expression “this is beyond the bounds,” okay? Double standards, you know...
          1. +2
            10 September 2023 05: 52
            Quote: kalibr
            ... Sorry. .... I, in turn, will ask you to write to your counterpart Dima so that he no longer writes me comments with the expression “this is beyond the bounds,” okay? ...

            hi sorry! Where is this written? Pls. Please clarify. In the last recent conversation, this was 100%% absent. And when we talked before ---- maybe a year or two ago.
            ...Double standards...
            1. -1
              10 September 2023 09: 51
              Reptiloid (Dmitry)
              4 September 2023 19: 30
              +2
              Danger of civil war. Echoes of bygone times
              Quote: kalibr
              ..... Education happens by itself. ...
              Yes! This is what happened to Sergei! But why are you poking Sergei? This is in general. The meaning is the same... And there is no need to spoil the beautiful Russian language with such words as “pardonte!” And without you there is someone... There are enough Russian-language synonyms.
              1. The comment was deleted.
            2. 0
              10 September 2023 09: 55
              Quote: Reptiloid
              ..Double standards...

              Is it inaccessible to your thinking?
              Quote: Aviator_
              Vyacheslav, look
  4. +10
    9 September 2023 08: 46
    That is why when they write about the Brest-Litovsk Peace Treaty, concluded between Soviet Russia, Germany and its allies, they never write about the Small Brest-Litovsk Peace Treaty concluded earlier, between the UPR and Germany? Why, when they write about lost territories, do they not mention that part of the European territories had already been lost , as a result of WWII, and partly as a result of the signing of the Small Brest-Litovsk Peace? Why, when they write about the amount of indemnity, do they never refer to the article of the Brest-Litovsk Treaty? Indicating the amount? But making reference to it? Meanwhile, Article IX of this treaty says the following:
    “The contracting parties mutually refuse compensation for their military expenses, i.e., government costs of waging war, as well as compensation for military losses, i.e., those losses that were caused to them and their citizens in the war zone by military measures, including all requisitions made in an enemy country" (c). Is the indemnity recorded in the secret protocol? Secret protocols to the studio! And by the way, secret protocols are an integral part of diplomacy. They have always been with everyone. If in other documents, documents also to the studio. Why, when they write that Komuch performed under the red flag, do they not mention who Komuch consisted of? And it consisted of Socialist Revolutionaries and Mensheviks. And the red color was the party color of the Socialist Revolutionaries. And the red flag appeared on their ballot papers and leaflets in the same Constituent Assembly. The Bolsheviks did not have a monopoly on red, a revolutionary color. And the fact that the Czechoslovak corps , at the time of the mutiny, was already a unit of the French army and was completely subordinate to its command; they generally prefer to remain silent about this.
    1. +4
      9 September 2023 09: 16
      Alexei! And how can I fit it all into one article? You understand what an unreadable vinaigrette it will be. And then... are there only half-educated people gathered here? Or people with the best education in the world? Everyone should know this, huh? What do you think? And about the Social Revolutionaries and so on. The material itself is written BASED ON ARTICLES IN THE NEWSPAPER. Its purpose is to show mainly WHAT CITIZENS OF RUSSIA COULD LEARN FROM IT THEN. So “they prefer to remain silent” does not apply here. Show me where in IZVESTIA it was written that the corps was a French unit, and I will immediately insert it into the next material!
      1. +5
        9 September 2023 09: 35
        Show me where it was written in IZVESTIA
        Vyacheslav, a newspaper is a newspaper, it solves immediate problems. Exaggerated - this is nothing more than a poster with appropriate calls. Drawing deep conclusions based on the contents of the posters is somehow unworthy of a historian.
        1. +5
          9 September 2023 12: 03
          Quote: Aviator_
          Drawing deep conclusions based on the contents of the posters is somehow unworthy of a historian.

          I don't. In the first material it was said that the purpose of the articles in this series was to show what Russian citizens of that time could learn from a newspaper such as Izvestia. Of course, some parallels at the level of today's knowledge are inevitable. But let everyone draw conclusions for themselves.
      2. +6
        9 September 2023 10: 16
        Vyacheslav Olegovich! No need for la la laughing It was enough for me, your article, where you posted a fake, namely, a paper where you were allegedly fined for believing and you wrote so convincingly that many believed it, commentators pointed this out, including me. Why make fakes here too.[b ]
        Show me where in IZVESTIYA it was written that the corps was a French unit, and I will immediately insert it into the next material![
        /b] Aha, ha. Kanesh, they didn’t write about this in the newspapers, not even in Izvestia laughing And then you point out the article in the Brest-Litovsk Treaty about indemnity.
        1. +1
          9 September 2023 12: 10
          Quote: parusnik
          Why make fakes here?

          Where are the fakes here? Here are photocopies of articles from the newspaper.
        2. +2
          9 September 2023 12: 15
          Quote: parusnik
          about indemnity.

          Russo-German Financial Agreement, serving as an addition to the Peace Treaty concluded between Russia, on the one hand, and Germany, Austria-Hungary, Bulgaria and Turkey, on the other. 1918
    2. +4
      9 September 2023 09: 28
      And the fact that the Czechoslovak corps, at the time of the mutiny, was already a unit of the French army and was completely subordinate to its command, they generally prefer to keep silent about this.

      The Czechoslovak Corps in Russia was never a unit of the French army and was never subordinate to its command.
      France had its own Czechoslovak Legion, which was formed in December 1917 from the remnants of the Nazdar company, which existed as part of the French Foreign Legion, volunteers and Czechoslovaks who arrived in France from Russia.
      Czechoslovak legions were also in Italy and Serbia.
      1. +7
        9 September 2023 10: 24
        Viktor Nikolaevich, I appreciate your authority, but formally the Czechoslovak corps was subordinate to the Czechoslovak National Council (CNS), but in practice the real power came from the French command. Since the CNS was created by the Anglo-French. Maybe I didn’t put it that way. For a person writes the Unknown War, but writes what was written in Soviet textbooks. So write about the unknown. And about the Brest-Litovsk Peace, it was not worth writing at all.
        1. +3
          9 September 2023 12: 04
          Quote: parusnik
          And the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk was not worth writing about at all.

          Why? If Izvestia wrote about him?
        2. +4
          9 September 2023 13: 33
          I appreciate your authority

          And yours, Alexey, similarly.
          the Czechoslovak corps was formally subordinate to the Czechoslovak National Council (CNS)

          The Czechoslovak National Council ceased to exist on November 14, 1918. The last train with Czechoslovaks went through Irkutsk to Vladivostok on March 1, 1920, the last ship with Czechoslovaks left Vladivostok on September 2, 1920.
          Therefore, its direct influence on events can be considered before the Penza Agreement on March 25, 1918 (which the author did not mention for some reason). Further, “the process became much more complicated.”
          CHNS was created by the Anglo-French

          The Czech Foreign Committee was created by the Czechs and Slovaks in 1915 on their initiative. In 1916 it was transformed into the National Council of the Czech and Slovak Lands, then into the Czechoslovak National Council. The main goal from the moment of formation is the dismemberment of Austria-Hungary and the creation of independent Czechoslovak and Yugoslav states and the assistance of the Entente states (France, Russia, the USA) in the formation of the Czechoslovak army.
          in practice, real power came from the French command

          In practice, the French command was for the speedy transfer of the Czechoslovaks to France. The proposal to use the Czechoslovaks on the side of the Whites came from Great Britain, which was accepted on April 14, 1918 at a meeting in the French embassy, ​​which was attended by representatives of France, Great Britain and the White movement.
      2. 0
        10 September 2023 14: 22
        Quote from Frettaskyrandi
        The Czechoslovak Corps in Russia was never a unit of the French army and was never subordinate to its command.

        Based on the decree of the French government on the organization of an autonomous Czechoslovak army in France The Czechoslovak Corps in Russia from January 15, 1918 was formally subordinate to the French command.
  5. +8
    9 September 2023 09: 16
    Namely, the legion, which returned to the created Czechoslovakia, brought such values ​​to it that it did not experience all the difficulties that the defeated Germany and Austria experienced, and quickly became one of the most developed states of post-war Europe!

    Here the author inserted another “urban legend” into the article. The legionnaires did not bring any “such valuables” with them. The fact that part of the gold reserves of the Russian Empire was stolen is also not confirmed. But even if we assume that the Czechoslovaks took away the estimated 36 to 63 million gold rubles, this money is negligible to boost the economy of the First Czechoslovak Republic.
    One of the most developed states of post-war Europe Czechoslovakia became due to the fact that it inherited 80% of the entire industry of the Austro-Hungarian Empire, including the porcelain, glass and sugar factories, more than 40% of all its distilleries and breweries, mechanical engineering and weapons production, and the chemical industry.
    1. +7
      9 September 2023 10: 32
      Here the author inserted another “urban legend” into the article.
      What a legend this is. laughing Izvestia wrote about this in 1918, the author read it, the author knows laughing
      1. +3
        9 September 2023 12: 06
        Quote: parusnik
        Izvestia wrote about this in 1918, the author read it, the author knows

        How about reading it yourself, Alexey? Do you know how interesting it is?
    2. +3
      9 September 2023 12: 07
      Quote from Frettaskyrandi
      The legionnaires did not bring any “such valuables” with them.

      There was an article about this in the magazine QUESTIONS OF HISTORY. I used her materials at one time. There were links to both archival documents and publications in the Czech Republic.
      1. +2
        9 September 2023 12: 37
        There was an article about this in the magazine QUESTIONS OF HISTORY.

        I would love to get to know her.
        But even without this article there is a lot of material about the economy of the First Republic. There was nothing that would distinguish it from the economy of other European countries, except for such a significant factor as the absence of external debt. The Great Depression affected Czechoslovakia no less than other countries. In terms of industrial production decline, Czechoslovakia was fifth in the world - 40,4%. The “leader” USA has 46,8%. France, Italy and Belgium have around 30%, Britain - 16%.
        1. +3
          9 September 2023 14: 02
          I would love to get to know her.
          It's probably her...
          L. G. Priceman "Czechoslovak Corps in 1918." Questions of history, number 5, 2012.
          1. +2
            9 September 2023 17: 30
            No, it's not her.
            I looked a little at Czech publications on the topic. So far, nothing has been found about “such values,” but almost every article describes the efforts of the First Republic to reintegrate legionnaires into civilian life and assistance programs. Appropriate administrative structures were even created to deal with this. This suggests that the majority of Czechoslovaks clearly did not return to the country with fortunes in their duffel bags.
            Of course, there were such unique people as the head of the financial department of the Czechoslovak troops in Russia, Frantisek Ship, who made a fortune through speculation with French and English bills, which allowed him to become the director of Legiobank after the war. But there were clearly few such legionnaires.
          2. +2
            10 September 2023 12: 52
            It would seem that one should no longer be surprised at the manifestation of deviant thinking in modern realities, but in the “History” section I just can’t get used to the presence of individuals at lower levels of development.
  6. +3
    9 September 2023 10: 40
    By the way, the legendary film "Chapaev" (1934) begins with an episode - the Czechs knock out the Chapaevites from the village and they run away, throwing their rifles into the river, at the same time drowning their machine gun. Then Vasily Ivanovich himself appears on the famous cart, with him the no less famous Petka scribbles at the Czechs from “Maxim” (a cult episode - the calling card of the entire film), the fleeing people are stopped and the Czechs have to run away. And in such a way that they will no longer appear on the screen for the entire film...

    The fuss between the Reds and the White Czechs was shown in more detail in the film “Vladivostok, 1918” (1982). The idea of ​​the film is that the White Czechs are generally good, they were simply fooled by their officers (totally counter) and the Entente...

  7. +5
    9 September 2023 12: 59
    Judging by this note, almost the entire corps was disarmed, with the exception of 3 rearguard regiments, one of which took Penza on May 29.

    The question arises: where did the Czechs again take the weapon that allowed them to nightmare the railway from Omsk to Vladivostok for 2 years?
    1. +4
      9 September 2023 13: 50
      Judging by this note, almost the entire corps was disarmed, with the exception of 3 rearguard regiments, one of which took Penza on May 29.

      Judging by this note, reality and its representation in the mass media went in different directions already in those turbulent times. In accordance with the Penza Agreement (March 26, 1918 in Penza, representatives of the Council of People's Commissars of the RSFSR (Stalin and others), the ChSNS in Russia and the Czechoslovak Corps signed an agreement) according to Czech sources, which in this case I trust much more, the Czechoslovaks transferred a total of 21 thousand rifles, 216 machine guns, 44 cannons, 4 aircraft, 11 cars and 3000 horses.
      As you can see, the numbers are significantly different.
      1. +3
        9 September 2023 14: 13
        One plane was clearly stolen for souvenirs...
      2. +4
        9 September 2023 20: 08
        Quote from Frettaskyrandi
        reality and its reflection in the media went in different directions already in those turbulent times.

        You are very right. This will be discussed in future materials.
  8. -1
    10 September 2023 10: 33
    Commission burning. Realities of the Civil War
    I advise the author to remember that a newspaper is first and foremost a means of propaganda, and secondly a means of entertainment.
    Therefore, it is naive to believe that what is written in newspapers is 100% historical truth.

    But overall the selection is interesting - it conveys the spirit of that hectic era
  9. +1
    11 September 2023 19: 58
    Well what can I say. They are traitors in Africa too, the Czechs betrayed everyone they could and even several times, in a word, scoundrels. The Poles were more honest in this regard; they didn’t interfere with us and hated us with all their hearts and immediately.
  10. -1
    18 September 2023 11: 50
    White Czechs...
    White Poles...
    White Finns...
    Didn’t forget anyone?
    White Chinese or White Japanese?
  11. 0
    23 September 2023 09: 39
    Talk about the consequences of the long-ago seizure of power in Russia by foreign armed gangs of rootless cosmopolitans, who were specially trained and armed by the USA and England. For 6 months, the militants were brought to St. Petersburg and placed on the outskirts, in empty barracks, by decision of the Provisional Government. Residents of St. Petersburg did not participate in the seizure, but simply observed the ongoing Locust invasion. The more important thing is that the Secret Always becomes Explicit. Look at today, after the second Locust Infestation in 100 years in the early 1990s. I recently read some interesting information. What's going on behind the scenes: https://dzen.ru/a/ZCx26jRcrB-Wjv0P?utm_referer=www.google.com What a trick! Read the article by the patriot-turncoat to the end. Shocking news from the leader of rootless cosmopolitans - he reveals “Achievements” at the Congress.