How do the 2nd Guards Army Corps of the RF Armed Forces treat the Wagner PMC

187
How do the 2nd Guards Army Corps of the RF Armed Forces treat the Wagner PMC

For a long time now, a heroic image of the Wagner PMC has been created in the Russian media field, whose fighters are fighting not only at the front, but also against pests in the rear, who supposedly interfere with the best assault infantry. After the completion of the assault on Bakhmut (Artemovsk), which lasted more than nine months, many say that the Wagner is the most successful paramilitary unit in Russia. In this connection, the layman, observing the course of the military operation in Ukraine from the side, has the feeling that only a private mercenary army is fighting well.

At the same time, everyone has already forgotten about the assaults on Mariupol, Rubizhne, Severodonetsk, which were by no means stormed by Wagner. About the fact that the RF Armed Forces, and in particular the 1st and 2nd Army Corps of the RF Armed Forces (People's Militia of the DPR and LPR), are now continuing tough assaults on fortified areas in Maryinka, near Avdiivka, assaults on the positions of Ukrainian troops (with minor advances) under Kupyansky. And all this in the absence of full-fledged fire support for artillery, due to daily ammunition limits. Moreover, these limits are much more stringent than those of the Wagner PMC, which often complained about the lack of ammunition, therefore, in Luhansk and Donetsk, they looked with some bewilderment at the Internet flash mob “give shells to Wagner”.



Not forgotten in the Donbass and some "dark pages" stories this PMC, which until 2022 had a completely different reputation here than now. Let's talk about how the Wagner is treated in the 2nd Guards Army Corps (People's Militia of the LPR), let's talk with a fighter of the 14th armored personnel carrier of the NM LPR "Ghost" Andrei Morozov ("Murz").

– Andrey, it is well known that many people in Lugansk, especially participants in the events of 2014, do not have a very good attitude towards PMC “Wagner” due to the fact that they were involved in the murder of some field commanders in the Luhansk region. Therefore, the question arises - how do PMCs "Wagner" relate to the NM of the LNR and why?

– On the one hand, no one lost his memory, and according to the experience of 2014–2015, everyone who saw that period remembers very well that a mercenary is a person who shoots whom they order for money. Today he is with you, tomorrow you are objectionable, and he is against you.

On the other hand, the really warring units of the army and the Wagner normally interact at the grassroots level - where the echoes of political games do not reach. At the same level, one can clearly see why some army units lose to Wagners. Excessive losses are unprofitable for a private contractor - it hits his pocket, so Wagners are equipped with good closed digital communications, modern aircraft-type UAVs, SIBZs (personal armor protection equipment - ed.) and so on. In the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, compensation for injuries and deaths of fighters is not deducted from the salaries of generals, so people can be sent into battle without communications, without UAVs and SIBZ, as it was at the beginning of the SVO.

That is, the real weaknesses of the army team and the army team themselves, and the Wagnerites understand well.

But then PR and political games begin. In which Prigozhin's PR people disperse either “Give shells to the Wagners”, or “Ah! The soldiers are on the run again." Both of these annoy people, because when people roughly know their average daily consumption of 152 and the average daily consumption for similar tasks for private traders, and then they hear that private traders need to be given even more shells, they have questions - why PMCs engaged in war, and the army in an endless bloody sacrifice of "meat assaults", the only possible rational goal of which is to prevent the enemy from pulling artillery and reserves against the Wagner.

A single run on an enemy defender after 4 (four) shells artillery preparation could change a lot in the views of the world among those who repost the popular slogan about shells. Simplifying, Prigozhin's PR adds enthusiastic admirers to the Wagners, but more and more angers people with an unenthusiastic way of thinking.

- PMC "Wagner" recruited quite a lot of people with a criminal record, criminals. Rumors circulated in Lugansk that they were engaged in robberies and “lawlessness” in the frontline zone. How true are these rumors?

- If we talk specifically about the divisions of PMC "Wagner", then it is the warring divisions of this PMC "to engage in robberies and" lawlessness ", as a rule, there is simply no time and nowhere. As well as an ordinary military man who actually conducts military operations. They are either directly on the front line, or in temporary deployment points near the front line, where there is nothing special to rob, and there are not so many civilians. This also applies to PMC units recruited from prisoners - their movements are even more limited.

But in addition to combat units, this PMC also has its own commandant service, numerically and organizationally approximately equivalent to a regiment. This "commandant's regiment" controls the rear of the PMC's area of ​​responsibility with checkpoints and patrols, in which commandant functions have been delegated to it. These people are constantly on the edge of civilization with all its temptations - just reach out if you have money. Well, the easiest way to get money before the completion of the contract is by abusing power and using the “company reputation” created by combat units. Here, for example, is a typical case - a mortal wound during an attempt to rob Captain Igor Mangushev from the 4th Motorized Rifle Brigade of the RF Armed Forces on the evening of February 3 this year.

- As far as I know, you have repeatedly raised the issue of the involvement of Wagner PMC in the murder of Igor Mangushev, but no official comments have been received from the investigation on the outcome. Tell us more about what happened.

- A failed attempt to "auto-set up" ended in a chase on the Stakhanov-Kirovsk road, Igor's car was caught up, cut off. And they tried to "smoke" him, locked in the car, by shelling the car from different sides. Then they realized that Igor did not have a pistol - he, as expected, left his standard machine gun in the PVD gun room, but they simply did not give him a pistol. They broke the driver's window, opened the car, under threat weapons forced to unlock the smartphone, as he did not have much cash with him.

Before the Stakhanov police arrived at the sound of these shots, it turned out that Igor was a man who had worked for Prigozhin in the past as a political strategist, a man who, obviously, would not keep silent about such an incident and who would have enough connections to secure a trial. It was then that the attackers lost their nerve - another shot sounded.

The investigation at the scene lasted until about 5 am, after which the attackers ... were released. And they didn’t open a criminal case for a long time, because how to write that, we found them over a man lying with a bullet in his head, talked - talked and ... let them go. It's embarrassing.

But the next day, on the Internet, friendly PMCs, media workers and military correspondents began to massively disperse the version that Igor allegedly tried to break through some checkpoint, and they shot after him. Of course, there was never any checkpoint in that place, and the story about “shooting after” does not explain the shooting of the car from all sides, including the bullet that entered the dashboard through the lower edge of the windshield.

There was no post. It’s just that the people who were part of the commandant’s office of the Wagner looked out for convenient victims in the evenings - then the salaries of the local military were still given out in cash.

Evgeny Prigozhin, having announced this situation and handing over the robbers to local law enforcement agencies, could have made this case a good example of cleansing his organization from rot, but he decided otherwise - through the hands of his media workers and military correspondents working on temniks, to present our comrade-in-arms as an alcoholic and brawler who died of his own nonsense. This is Prigogine's choice.
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  1. +10
    25 May 2023
    Let the 2nd Army Corps remember those mobilized from Samara whose command of the corps was placed in Makiivka, in a vocational school. Also, let Murz tell how they have been fighting since February 23, 2022 in Marinka and announce the losses of the NM DPR. Let him also tell how their 11th SME (Vostok) stormed two houses on the outskirts of Mariupol for three weeks, while the 150th division passed through the whole of Mariupol. And all sorts of push-ups of cars since 2014 can be remembered by them,
    1. +46
      25 May 2023
      Quote: Konnick
      Let the 2nd Army Corps remember those mobilized from Samara whose command of the corps was placed in Makiivka, in a vocational school. Also, let Murz tell how they have been fighting since February 23, 2022 in Marinka and announce the losses of the NM DPR. Let him also tell how their 11th SME (Vostok) stormed two houses on the outskirts of Mariupol for three weeks, while the 150th division passed through the whole of Mariupol.

      Mixed in a bunch of horses, people. You confuse the 2nd corps with the first, the DPR with the LPR, Marinka with the Seversky Donets, the 11th regiment with the 4th brigade. Not to mention the fact that in addition to the 150th division, Mariupol was taken by a bunch of units, both from the personnel of the RF Armed Forces (marines) and from the NM of the DPR.
      And it is not clear what the stupid opposition of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation and the NM (and now it is already a single entity) has to do with it when the topic of the article is Wagner and meat assaults in general.
      1. -8
        25 May 2023
        Mixed in a bunch of horses, people.

        Perhaps I mixed it up on emotions, but the NM of the LNR, promoted by Murz, has even less special merit. My friend fought in the 14th year near Luhansk, so I have heard a lot about their habits. Murz had previously breathed unevenly towards PMC Wagner. And it would be better not to remember the odious Mangushev, let him tell where the Padzherik came from his friend and where he was going. That's what I did not expect to see on VO is such an article.
        1. +45
          25 May 2023
          Quote: Konnick
          Perhaps I mixed up my emotions, but the NM of the LPR, promoted by Murz, has even less special merit

          In fact, his 4th brigade has been fighting since the beginning of the NMD without rotations and shifts and only goes forward, but of course it is far from such glorified formations as Kantemirovskaya, who fled twice with the abandonment of all equipment, or other similar "regroupers". But in general, the very opposition of some units of the RF Armed Forces to others is stupid and criminal. This is our army, our common misfortune and illness, the fighters of the same Kantemirovskaya are not to blame for such decisions of the authorities.
          Quote: Konnick
          And it would be better not to remember the odious Mangushev

          Well, of course, the acting captain of the Russian army was killed with a shot in the head, but we will not talk about this and we will declare him "odious". I understand that and the murdered Brain is "odious" for you?
          Of course, I wish you all the best, but do you have a desire to communicate with the Wagner commandant regiment yourself? Or take part in the meat assault on the "promoted" parts of the LPR, such as the March 2022 assault on Rubizhny, when the entire 7th brigade lay down there?
          The experience will be unforgettable...
          1. -16
            25 May 2023
            I understand that and the murdered Brain is "odious" for you?

            Well, of course, the current captain of the Russian army was shot dead

            There is no need to compare a bright person with a master of outrageousness.
            What other captain of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation owns a Pajero car or did this cause him to be stopped by a patrol at night.? In a war zone?

            like the March 2022 assault on Rubizhny, when did the entire 7th brigade lie down there?

            And this already speaks about the level of commanders of the NM LNR. Especially the Pasechnik.
            1. +7
              25 May 2023
              Quote: Konnick
              What other captain of the RF Armed Forces has a Pajero car

              And read Prilepin "Some will not go to hell." There, even his seventeen-year-old fighter had a network of car washes.
              https://knizhnik.org/zahar-prilepin/nekotorye-ne-popadut-v-ad/1
              1. +2
                25 May 2023
                It seems too early to share power, we still need to win. Previously, there were a lot of Khodakovsky in the VO, he boldly expressed his position on the NMD and suddenly he was gone from the VO. Oops!!!
                1. +1
                  27 May 2023
                  "Vostok" has been a brigade since 2015, its backbone initially consisted of fighters from the Donetsk "Alpha" and employees of the Ministry of Internal Affairs. So, by definition, the Russian Guard is closer to them. In Wagner itself, since ancient times, there have been many people from the DPR.
            2. +8
              25 May 2023
              Quote: Konnick
              What other captain of the RF Armed Forces owns a Pajero car

              I even know a military pensioner who has a Padzherik (bought used). But in your opinion it turns out - if you have a more or less cool car, then you are dog shit and you can be shot without suffering remorse.
              1. -6
                25 May 2023
                I even know a military pensioner who has a Padzherik (bought used). But in your opinion it turns out - if you have a more or less cool car, then you are dog shit and you can be shot without suffering remorse.

                Firstly, Mangushev was not a captain, but an ordinary aircraft, and secondly, riding at night after a restaurant in the NVO zone is a dubious occupation. And who shot him, the traffic police, the commandant's patrol or the Wagnerites is unknown. But Murz blames the Wagnerites. Turn your brains on. And ask how he acquired this "wheelbarrow".
            3. +2
              26 May 2023
              The public squabbling of supporters and opponents of Wagner and the NM of the LPR on a fairly well-known Russian website is something that should not be allowed during the information war at the height of the SVO, even if everything written here is an absolute, thrice-verified truth. And so - they made a gift to dill, and not for the first time already .. Like women, God forgive me.
            4. 0
              3 2023 June
              Quote: Konnick
              I understand that and the murdered Brain is "odious" for you?

              Well, of course, the current captain of the Russian army was shot dead

              There is no need to compare a bright person with a master of outrageousness.
              What other captain of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation owns a Pajero car or did this cause him to be stopped by a patrol at night.? In a war zone?

              like the March 2022 assault on Rubizhny, when did the entire 7th brigade lie down there?

              And this already speaks about the level of commanders of the NM LNR. Especially the Pasechnik.

              Our ensign had such a jeep.
          2. -13
            25 May 2023
            Well, of course, the current captain of the Russian army was shot in the head

            Sharp shot. Hitting a drunk driver in the head at night while trying to stop was publicized and turned into political violence by people like Murz. And Magnushev was a private, he used to be a captain of the NM of the LPR, and then from his words, when he was transferred to the RF Armed Forces, since Mangushev did not have an education, he was identified as a private. And this private cut through the war zone at night after the tavern in a Japanese jeep. You Belisarius go to church and light a candle and enough Luhansk freemen
            1. +5
              25 May 2023
              Quote: Konnick
              And this private cut through the war zone at night after the tavern in a Japanese jeep.

              For this, his Wagner was killed during a robbery. For example, from the story of December 26, 1980, drunken policemen at the Zhdanovskaya metro station (now Vykhino) illegally detained, severely beaten and robbed KGB Major Vyacheslav Afanasyev. Later, in order to cover their tracks, they killed the Chekist. It turned out that many Moscow police officers participated in robberies and robberies, massively concealed crimes. It all ended, in addition to the change of leadership and the total purge of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, first by the suicide of the wife of the removed head of the Ministry of Internal Affairs Shchelokov, and then by his own suicide. And then - the collapse of the USSR, in which not only in the police everything was so "good". And Prigozhin scammed his Wagners.
              1. -5
                25 May 2023
                Quote: ZhEK-Vodogrey
                For this, his Wagner was killed during a robbery .... And Prigogine smeared his Wagners.


                If there is evidence, then law enforcement agencies will listen to you carefully and punish the perpetrators, and if not, then this is a discrediting of volunteers, participants in the SVO, with all the ensuing consequences.
                1. +13
                  25 May 2023
                  Quote: Aleksandr21
                  this is a discrediting of volunteers, participants of the SVO, with all the ensuing consequences.

                  Repeatedly tried for murder and robbery, the urkagan goes to Wagner to speed up the term, it is not correct to equate him with volunteers. Or, for example, Demyan Kevorkyan, sentenced to 18 years for banditry, after the completion of the contract with the PMC, reorganized the gang. His accomplices Tatosyan killed the animator Tatyana Mostyko, and the owner of the agency, Kirill Chubko, was stabbed to death by Anatoly Dvoinikov. For what they did, they received 30 and 20 thousand rubles, Kevorkyan took 200 thousand. Or prominent personalities, leaders of organized criminal communities who died by Bakhmut. They were imprisoned under such grave articles and for such crimes, from which the inhabitants' hair can stand on end. How can you discredit the leader of the OPS Kusk or the organizer of the Kevorkyan gang, or the pedophile and former PMC fighter Sergei Sh. suspected of raping two girls aged 10 and 12?
                  1. -23
                    25 May 2023
                    Quote: ZhEK-Vodogrey
                    Repeatedly tried for murder and robbery, the urkagan goes to Wagner to speed up the term, it is not correct to equate him with volunteers.


                    The fighters of PMC Wagner, according to the law, fall under the definition of volunteers and are members of the SVO ... regardless of their activities up to this point. And Prigozhin (whom you mentioned in this context) is a Hero of Russia (there is a medal and a decree on the award). So I hope you will draw conclusions for yourself .... until your language has been brought (in this case, not to Kyiv), but to completely different places.
                    1. -18
                      25 May 2023
                      Quote: ZhEK-Vodogrey
                      Or, for example, Demyan Kevorkyan, sentenced to 18 years for banditry, after the completion of the contract with the PMC, reorganized the gang.


                      And what does this have to do with the situation? You write in plain text that the fighters of PMC Wagner committed a crime (without evidence) in the NVO zone, and the hero of Russia covered them .... according to the law, such messages can be regarded as relevant.

                      And in the case of a quote from the media, there is a completely different situation and context, this also needs to be understood. And if (let's say a prisoner - who received a pardon) after the SVO commits a crime, then this is also a different situation.
                    2. +16
                      25 May 2023
                      Quote: Aleksandr21
                      The fighters of PMC Wagner, according to the law, fall under the definition of volunteers and are members of the SVO ...

                      Prigozhin, in his speech, called his PMC "a paramilitary organized criminal group with tanks, planes and helicopters, which is outside the law, with its own code, which is" different from the laws of Russia. He also described the ideal candidate and said that PMCs needed "criminal talent". “The ideal candidate is Ilya Muromets from a strict regime, not for the first time convicted. This is 30-45 years old, strong, self-confident, hardy and, preferably, served a tag or more, preferably a tag or more in front. Preferably [those who have served time] more than once for murder, grievous bodily harm, robbery, robbery. "You can google it, there is a speech for 15 minutes.
                      1. -5
                        25 May 2023
                        Quote: ZhEK-Vodogrey
                        You can google it, it's 15 minutes long.


                        Prigogine has many speeches, and it is very bad that you choose only what is bad or convenient for your point of view.

                        Let me explain my attitude towards this and dot the "i" in this matter.

                        The fighters of PMC Wagner are currently volunteers, members of the SVO and assault squads (as the media call them, because our legislation is not perfect in this matter). And these guys have done a lot for our country and their homeland, among them a huge number of former military men and people with combat experience who have gone through everything possible, and since 2022 a small layer of former prisoners who have worked out their contract and survived in that hell, in which they were.

                        And for me, these people deserve respect. And the fact that you are focusing on murky stories, and unprovenly trying to denigrate the fighters as a whole, does not honor you. If the story of robbery / murder or any other offenses is real, then the relevant authorities should deal with it and give their assessment + punish the perpetrators, but in general you poured mud on the guys and think this is normal ... but there are not angels, there are no questions) but where is the proof of what you wrote? Maybe these people are not involved in this crime at all, and you are slandering them. (because in the LNR / DNR there was enough and enough without that showdowns and problems), but there is also the Armed Forces of Ukraine and other Natsiks.

                        By the way, how many commanders of the Russian Spring have died since 2014? And there are different opinions on this matter .... about the reasons for their death. Somewhere, the special services of Ukraine definitely worked, and somewhere there could be local showdowns.


                        And to believe what is written in the article is such a thing .... this is not the first time the author has written about Wagner PMCs, and in many articles they are shown from an unsightly side, although there is no reason for this. But there is a conflict between some groups in the LPR and PMC Wagner ... and through the prism of this, as I understand it, the author's point of view is presented.
                      2. +4
                        25 May 2023
                        Quote: Aleksandr21
                        By the way, how many commanders of the Russian Spring have died since 2014? And there are different opinions on this matter .... about the reasons for their death. Somewhere, the special services of Ukraine definitely worked, and somewhere there could be local showdowns.

                        “9 years ago, on May 23, 2015, Aleksey Borisovich Mozgovoy, the founder of Phantom, was killed from an ambush on the road near Alchevsk.
                        It is said that shortly after this, a division of a private military company, which in 2014-2015 was engaged in "purges of objectionable" among the rebels in the Donbass, arrived "to disarm the Phantom".
                        It ended with the fact that an officer of the "Ghost" approached the arrivals, showed where the two ZU-23-2s aimed at them were and asked if they had forgotten the road they had arrived on.
                        Units of a private military company packed up and left."
                        Quote: Aleksandr21
                        And for me, these people deserve respect. And the fact that you are focusing on murky stories, and unprovenly trying to denigrate the fighters as a whole, does not honor you.

                        Captain Bereg is on their conscience. Of course, the “Wagners” have normal people, who can argue. Does this require us to allow the abnormal to rob and kill our own while the normal ones are fighting?
                      3. -3
                        25 May 2023
                        Quote: ZhEK-Vodogrey
                        “9 years ago, on May 23, 2015, Aleksey Borisovich Mozgovoy, the founder of Phantom, was killed from an ambush on the road near Alchevsk.
                        They tell...


                        And why don’t you write that Murz writes, in fact, the one who gave the interview to the author. (At least this quote leads to him ... according to various sources).

                        Quote: ZhEK-Vodogrey
                        Captain Bereg is on their conscience.


                        Is there any evidence?

                        After all, I don’t deny such a possibility, it’s just that if there are perpetrators, then they should be punished, and there are many versions of Mangushev’s murder ... from the DRG of the Armed Forces of Ukraine (who dressed the militia commanders so well) to their own.

                        And all investigations / references to the involvement of PMC Wagner lead to Murz and his friends.
                      4. +2
                        25 May 2023
                        You are a specialist in Wagner. Let me ask you a few questions:
                        1. Tell me the number and date of the Law on PMCs. Without it, this is an organized crime group, in legal terms.
                        2. On what basis did the head of the organized criminal group recruit persons serving legal sentences from the institutions of the Federal Penitentiary Service, handed them military weapons, and granted amnesty to those who survived six months later? It seems that according to the Constitution, only one person in the country can amnesty, or already two?
                        3. According to published data, 50 ZK were recruited into the PMC. Do you know the staffing of MSD? This is a combined arms army in the state, even more. And where did they get the T-000, Su-90, Su-24, artillery, including MLRS? At a private structure?
                        I have more questions, but I'm sorry.
                      5. +1
                        25 May 2023
                        Quote: Kasatik
                        I'll ask you a few questions


                        These questions are not for me, because. it was not I who created and gave the task of PMC Wagner to participate in the SVO. Here are some questions I have...

                        1. Why do the National Guard, volunteer detachments, Cossacks, and PMCs (not only Wagner, but also other structures ... of the same Gazprom) participate in the NWO? And what does our legislation say about this?

                        2. Indeed, on what basis was there an amnesty for prisoners ... who in the country has such opportunities?

                        3. Where did Wagner get such weapons that you listed ....?

                        I can only give my understanding of this situation, whether it is correct or not, I do not know.

                        So, on February 24, 2022, the NWO announced by the President of the Russian Federation V.V. Putin, the RF Armed Forces were tasked with the demilitarization and denazification of Ukraine ... but something went wrong, the army did not cope with its task, Russia allowed Ukraine to mobilize the population and practically did not interfere with the supply of weapons from the West to Ukraine ... in the same time (we take the words of Prigozhin here) - PMC Wagner was asked to help the RF Armed Forces fulfill their task, and they were pulled out of Africa and other places to participate in the NWO ...

                        Who gave them the task? And who has such opportunities? This is either the president of Russia, or persons associated with the special services and who coordinate actions with the president. PMC Wagner is following the instructions of the supreme leadership of Russia, according to the NWO ....

                        And that is why they were supplied with everything necessary (aircraft, tanks, rocket launchers, etc.), they were given people and coordinated their work with the commander of the NWO (at that time Surovikin).

                        Are there any objections? Or do you have some other picture of the situation? Share, very interesting.
                      6. +2
                        25 May 2023
                        Amnestied by the State Duma. In this case, not an amnesty, but a pardon. The President has this right.
                      7. 0
                        26 May 2023
                        On what basis did the head of the organized criminal group recruit people serving legal sentences from the institutions of the Federal Penitentiary Service, handed them military weapons, and granted amnesty to those who survived six months later? It seems that according to the Constitution, only one person in the country can amnesty, or already two?


                        Hey, killer whale, do you, in general, own the question or so, did you decide to sketch purely swamp slogans here? Do you know exactly how the procedure went? If you don’t know, then just ask, and don’t pretend to be your mother’s truth-seeker here. Just like the FBK * ashnikov training manual - at first they themselves will say some unsupported crap and at the end of the sentence they refer to their own crap as a real fact. From what did you take your arguments about the fact that 2 people are amnestied? How did you rule out the option that amnestied 1 person, and exactly the one who has all the powers? Figured it out myself? Or is it more convenient for you to scoop up and throw on the "fan of anger"? laughing

                        And do you know, killer whale, that in the fall of 2022 the RF Ministry of Defense recruited "prisoners" from places of deprivation of liberty in exactly the same way? I personally sat with them in the trenches. Do you also call the RF Ministry of Defense an organized crime group?
                        Come on, grow up already, killer whale, unclench your angrily clenched fists and, if you don’t understand something, just ask those who are in the know. You will be explained. And only then, based on the information received, write your angry comments .. But then, at least, you will be supported by facts, and not by hysterical truth-seeking emotions, and you will not look somehow childishly ridiculous.
                      8. +2
                        27 May 2023
                        In a specific situation on your questions, the answer has one root. The appearance of PMCs at the first stage is justified by the decisions of the governments of the republics (depending on the area of ​​responsibility of the units). After becoming part of the Russian Federation, after a 6-month "adaptation" period, amendments were made to the law on defense (autumn 2022), allowing the administrations of the regions to form their own territorial defense units in an appropriate situation. The decisions of the governments of the republics were replaced by the legislative base of the Russian Federation. Naturally, the PMC does not act as a hired structure, but as a volunteer detachment (which acted in large numbers and still operate in the same legal paradigm on the same grounds). The prisoners in the "Wagner" did not fall under the amnesty, but under the pardon of the President on the basis of Article 89 of the Constitution of the Russian Federation. It is important! The basis for the pardon was recognized as a voluntary armed struggle as part of volunteer units for the sovereignty of the Russian Federation. The transfer of equipment and weapons was carried out on the same basis. At the beginning from the republican authorities (how it got to them is another question), then through the relevant institutions on a general basis under the law for defense. What is the status of "cunning" units such as aviation, artillery, tank? Yes, exactly the same volunteer. It is possible, in addition to simple acquisition of the necessary, that the legal status of saturation with heavy equipment (and possibly light weapons) has a platform similar to lend-lease (leasing to volunteer units for the duration of the SVO). Accordingly, we are not dealing with "armed tanks and aircraft of organized crime groups", but with volunteer units that are armed with rented equipment and safely dispose of it upon completion of "work" within the framework of the NWO.
                      9. 0
                        2 2023 June
                        Kasatik, Sergei. I will express my opinion, I will try to be brief. Someone is starting to pit the Moscow Region, Akhmat Kadyrov and Wagner. On your questions: if you disassemble them based on your logic, then the RF Ministry of Defense should be held accountable for supplying illegal military formations, providing weapons, ammunition, aviation, artillery, infrastructure in the form of airfields, fuel, etc., etc. The plan for delimiting the responsibility of units for certain sectors of the front bears the signature of an official of the Ministry of Defense. Everyone understands this very well.
                      10. +6
                        25 May 2023
                        Alexander wrote everything correctly. They mixed everything together. My brother died in PMC Wagner, two medals for "Courage". and don't make a fuss.
                    3. +4
                      26 May 2023
                      Neither the status of a volunteer nor the star of a hero makes a saint out of a person. Even in the Second World War, among the ZK, people with heavy general criminal articles were not taken into the army.
                    4. -1
                      27 May 2023
                      Putin, of course, can issue an amnesty, but even the Pope does not issue indulgences.
                  2. The comment was deleted.
              2. +8
                25 May 2023
                Quote: ZhEK-Vodogrey
                It all ended, in addition to a change in leadership and a total purge of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, first with the suicide of the wife of the removed head of the Ministry of Internal Affairs Shchelokov

                It was a struggle between Andropov and Shchelokov.
              3. -12
                25 May 2023
                For this, his Wagner was killed during a robbery.

                Not in the course of a robbery attack, but in the course of the performance of official duties.
                Again, where do you come from, it seems that you have never lived in the Russian Federation.
                What would happen to you if you were in Chechnya during the war at night trying to slip past the checkpoint with booze on Padzherik?
                1. +6
                  25 May 2023
                  Official duties there were carried out by the city militia. Do you have a heightened sense of justice or boyish truth? So this padzherik hooked you ... This is how the chaps, racket, lawlessness began ...
            2. +4
              25 May 2023
              And this private cut through the war zone at night after the tavern in a Japanese jeep.

              You obviously overdid it...
          3. +5
            25 May 2023
            In general, in a war, the last thing to divide into good and bad (this is the business of the relevant authorities). Remember old grievances, make setups .. Guys, you are doing a common thing
            1. +8
              25 May 2023
              Guys, you are doing the same thing.

              But this is a big question.
              I say 100 times. The majority in Russia refers to the NWO as a NWO and not a war.
              Therefore (I hope that only for this) everyone continues to do their job.
              Wrestlers fight in mode.
              The military in the General Staff make a career.
              Commerce to make money on defense orders.
              Diplomats are establishing ties with "partners".
              Etc
              And by the way, yes, GDP is guarding the galley so that they don’t swing.
              1. -1
                25 May 2023
                In my opinion, some people in the galley decided to dangle and fuck with fluff, but stumbled and shot a hole in the bottom of the galley.
        2. -10
          25 May 2023
          The author is working out the training manual, which is why she took it, the pointer came to wet the Wagners.
        3. +2
          26 May 2023
          That's what I did not expect to see on VO is such an article.

          I wonder why?
          After all, in fact, the article describes well-known events. The implementation of "difficult political decisions" imposed by shifting clowns from the sect of adherents of the Minsk agreements and a gangster attack on a serviceman of the RF Armed Forces. And the common thing here is the participation of PMCs and the fact that only the enemy benefited from this.
          And if in the first case the PMC fulfilled the contract / order received "from above", then in the second it is pure criminality carried out by specific persons, quite possibly not without agreements "with the other side", which aimed, among other things, to compromise the PMC. In the event of the notorious "friendly fire" they would have to obey his family, friends, colleagues - anything can happen in a war, and they would be understood. But they hid behind stupid replies and their superiors, which is called a very bad word ... A fly in the ointment spoils a barrel of honey. (C)
        4. 0
          26 May 2023
          The NM LPR, like the NM DPR, appeared in the fall of 2014, after the "north wind" and the main battles. If the machines were wrung out, then it was the militia, which was quite different. But for this they could have been imprisoned and there are people who then sat down and left only a year ago.
      2. +1
        25 May 2023
        There is nothing more to do now than to engage in disassembly - it is too far to "Berlin". The right experience needs to be disseminated, the sooner the better. Everything else later, especially in the pesse. This should be clear from above and below.
    2. +1
      25 May 2023
      "Bureaucrats do not allow the Russian people to win the battle"

      Prigozhin answered the media's question: "what would you advise TG channels and the media to do in order to have some influence on the solution of the main issue - to achieve much-needed changes in the RF Ministry of Defense and in general in the leadership of the NWO":

      “I fully agree with your interpretation. It is one thing to discredit the army, the government and some of the government officials, and another thing is to tell the truth and force them to change. Because if they do not change, then this war is doomed to defeat. And if they change, each little by little, then we will win this war, and great Russia and the great Russian people will remain great, and perhaps become even greater.

      When there was a Finnish war, everyone warned that the next one would be worse. Now we have, by comparison, the Finnish war, and we need to prepare for the next one. To do this, you need to clean out all the air bubbles that prevent us from living. As a matter of fact, what I said the day before yesterday in an interview: “I love Russia. I won't sell my country."

      As for the bureaucrats, we have to force them to change, because it is not written in the Constitution that they should do what they are doing now. Now they do not allow the Russian people to win the battle. Here is the answer".
    3. +1
      26 May 2023
      Exactly. Batman alone with his basement is worth something.
  2. -5
    25 May 2023
    custom-made shit floated on Wagner .... then girls raped by a former Wagnerite .... now offended Donetsk and Luhansk decided to question the old .... it’s clear where the smelly air blew in the Russian media.
    Donetsk and Luhansk need to remember that they themselves are not without sin. and the fact that Prigogine can use public areas to save the lives of his fighters, he is honored and praised for this. other commanders of the Russian army, including the former militia of Donetsk and Luhansk, have eaten their tongues out of rank.
    Prigozhin publicly voices real problems on LBS .... and there is no need to shut his mouth for any reason.
    1. +26
      25 May 2023
      Quote from moneron
      .now the offended Donetsk and Luhansk decided to question the old

      Killing the Shore is not old! Unless you're a mayfly butterfly, of course...
    2. +28
      25 May 2023
      For one case when a tragedy hit the press, there are dozens and hundreds of cases when no one knew about the tragedy. When the victim had no relatives, or the relatives did not have enough obstinacy, energy and free time to break through walls with their foreheads, there were no familiar journalists, and the case did not receive wide publicity.
      Think about it. About the underwater part of the iceberg, which is always much larger than the surface. I advise you to multiply all such information by a hundred, and do not reassure yourself that this is fiction, on the contrary, such things are usually greatly smoothed out and downplayed in the media.
    3. +7
      25 May 2023
      Quote from moneron
      custom-made shit floated on the Wagner .... then the girls raped by the former Wagnerian .... now the offended Donetsk and Luhansk decided to question the old ...

      Poetess Anna Dolgareva wrote poems https://vk.com/wall-208943372_8070

      "If you can, don't die,
      But if it was necessary, then for a just cause.
      Stormtroopers go to heaven
      Leaving the pierced body.

      "For those who died younger than me" -
      Writes twenty-year-old Sasha.
      They go to other lands
      Better than ours.

      Don't shut up about them, don't shut up
      This is not the time to quit and get out.
      All Wagners go to heaven
      But live better."

      All Wagners go to heaven, so there is no need to be offended by individual facts of child molestation, petty murders, as in the case of Captain Bereg. Some of the Wagners have been repeatedly convicted of murder, robbery and rape, they are used to living like this.

      "In Novosibirsk, 42-year-old Sergei Sh, who, according to preliminary data, served in the Wagner PMC, raped two schoolgirls from grades 4 and 5. Before that, the man threatened that he would blow up the girls with a grenade. The schoolgirls themselves reported that the rapist was wearing military uniform with a chevron on which a skull was depicted"
      "Other people's weaknesses must be respected, not condemned" (c).
      1. +5
        25 May 2023
        Quote: ZhEK-Vodogrey
        Poetess

        Smiled :-)
        1. +13
          25 May 2023
          Dolgareva is aware that Wagner was killed by Bereg, but nevertheless wrote poetry to them.
          “Do not touch artists, prostitutes and coachmen. They serve any authority." WITH.
      2. -15
        25 May 2023
        In Novosibirsk, 42-year-old Sergei Sh, who, according to preliminary data, served in the Wagner PMC, raped two schoolgirls from grades 4 and 5. Before that, the man threatened that he would blow up the girls with a grenade. The schoolgirls themselves reported that the rapist was wearing a military uniform with a chevron on which a skull was depicted.
        "Other people's weaknesses must be respected, not condemned" (c).

        It would be better if he raped you and blew you up.
        Some of the Wagners have been repeatedly convicted of murder, robbery and rape, they are used to living like this.

        So they don't have to live. And a simpotny and a sledgehammer should help them in this.
        Centerum censo washingtonium delendam esse
      3. The comment was deleted.
    4. +2
      25 May 2023
      Quote from moneron
      custom-made shit floated on Wagner ....


      When I started reading the article, I immediately looked at familiar sentences ... I think again Viktor Biryukov writes about Wagner, rewound to the end and really was not mistaken :), well, on the topic: the author of the article adheres to one point of view, namely the views of the LNR fighters on the Wagnerites , through the prism of their conflicts and showdowns .... so you should not expect objectivity here.

      For me personally, all the heroes are the fighters of the LPR who went to defend their homes, that the fighters of the PMC Wagner who shed their blood for their homeland. and the fact that they are paid for their work (servicemen are also paid by the way) does not change anything, and all this dirt, disassembly, resentment against each other ... this is not necessary.
  3. +6
    25 May 2023
    Everyone has enough there, but a cap for disassembly in the press must be given to everyone
    1. +24
      25 May 2023
      No, we just need to give everyone an equal opportunity to speak. An adversarial litigation with open debate of the parties was invented for a reason. This is a centuries-old method of establishing the truth.
      The bad thing is not that Prigozhin is yelling, but that he is yelling alone.
      1. -11
        25 May 2023
        Quote: Stinging_Nettle
        An adversarial litigation with open debate of the parties was invented for a reason.

        Why all these criminal procedural subtleties and red tape. You can just Wagnerian, with a sledgehammer on the head and the issue is closed.
        1. -6
          25 May 2023
          Why all these criminal procedural subtleties and red tape. You can just Wagnerian, with a sledgehammer on the head and the issue is closed.

          The sledgehammer doesn't care whose head it hits. Can embed and yours. Smart ass.
          Centerum censo washingtonium delendam esse
      2. -5
        25 May 2023
        we just need to give everyone an equal opportunity to speak

        And it will be like in the 17th year. Solid tryndez, but there is no one to fight.
        Centerum censo washingtonium delendam esse
  4. +37
    25 May 2023
    I wonder why the front-line commanders say that we have a limit of shells in all units? And the government media and generals are shouting that all the warehouses are filled up, the industry is working at full capacity, shells are supplied in any quantities. Some of them are lying. Either those who cannot fight on the front lines without these shells, or those who have long lost the habit of telling the truth to the people of Russia. And Prigozhin is right and does what he requires shells. If he had been actively supported by other front-line officers, unit commanders, then our officials would have moved much faster. Stalin and his people's commissars, by the summer of 1943, were already able to organize the evacuation of industry and overcome the shell hunger. And GDP with accomplices and in a year cannot organize anything by way. Only in Iran to build a railway, but to launch a nuclear power plant in Turkey. And now the Turks will not elect Erdogan, another president will come from them and that's it, again enthusiastic cries about our international victory.
    1. -16
      25 May 2023
      Quote: fiberboard
      Stalin and his people's commissars, by the summer of 1943, were already able to organize the evacuation of industry and overcome the shell hunger.

      And you read how. Recently, there was an article about this in VO, and so - they overcame the shell hunger not by releasing in the Urals, but by tightening consumption, exactly! And then before Moscow and at the beginning near Moscow, it was unjustifiably thrown shells anyhow where, at the first whistle, sorry, I don’t remember what the article was called, well, if you search, you will find
    2. Ray
      +30
      25 May 2023
      Agree. And Stalin, a year after the start of the war, had already changed the chief of the general staff for the third time, appointing the young and energetic Vasilevsky (48 years old). And Putin still has an unsinkable pensioner Gerasimov at the beginning of the General Staff.
      1. 0
        1 2023 June
        Quote from Ray
        Agree. And Stalin, a year after the start of the war, had already changed the chief of the general staff for the third time, placing the young and energetic Vasilevsky (48 years old)

        Yeah. And I suppose he shot and imprisoned everyone :))) Maybe first you should read about the General Staff of the USSR and the people who were led in the period from 22.06.1941/09.05.1945/XNUMX to XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX?
    3. +4
      25 May 2023
      And Prigozhin is right and does what he requires shells.

      And he clearly says that the fewer shells they give, the more dead soldiers. PMC Wagner has the right tactics to overcome the artillery defense, which was taught to the Armed Forces of Ukraine by NATO instructors.
      1. +5
        25 May 2023
        Quote: Konnick
        And Prigozhin is right and does what he requires shells.

        And he clearly says that the fewer shells they give, the more dead soldiers. PMC Wagner has the right tactics to overcome the artillery defense, which was taught to the Armed Forces of Ukraine by NATO instructors.

        I don’t know if it’s true or nonsense, but Prigozhin said that the loss of Wagner during the capture of Bakhmut / Artyomovskaya was 20 fighters. If for each town to lay down 000, then the male population of Russia will end somewhere near Lvov.
      2. -1
        1 2023 June
        Quote: Konnick
        PMC Wagner correct tactics for overcoming artillery defense

        By the army...
        1. -1
          2 2023 June
          due to the fact that the Ministry of Defense is lying about how well the industry is working now and the shells are heaped.
          1. 0
            3 2023 June
            Quote: TiRex
            due to the fact that the Ministry of Defense is lying about how well the industry is working now and the shells are heaped.

            Yes, yes :) Everyone lies to you :)))
    4. 0
      25 May 2023
      Quote: fiberboard
      Stalin and his people's commissars, by the summer of 1943, were already able to organize the evacuation of industry and overcome the shell hunger.

      Yes, it’s true, of course, only such a trifle was forgotten, like metals, machine tools, motors, gunpowder from the USA, otherwise there would be nothing to implement this, the Germans managed to cut off the USSR literally 100% from its military industry and supply chains of everything you need, one loss of Kharkov , Mariupol, etc. what they cost. Where can the Kremlin get those "Americans" now? The Chinese are not in a hurry.
      1. 0
        26 May 2023
        Compare how many tanks were built in the USA during all the years of WWII, and how many in the USSR during the years of WWII. You will be surprised, but in the USSR, cut off from everything and waging a terrible war, 25000 more tanks were built than in the USA, where they knew about the war only from newspapers. Kharkov and Mariupol in the Second World War were of the same importance as Bakhmut and s. Matveevka.
        1. -2
          26 May 2023
          Yes, it’s true, of course, only such a trifle was forgotten, like metals, machine tools, motors, gunpowder from the USA, otherwise there would be nothing to implement this,
        2. 0
          27 May 2023
          Quote: Kasatik
          Compare how many tanks were built in the USA during all the years of WWII, and how many in the USSR during the years of WWII. You will be surprised, but in the USSR, cut off from everything and waging a terrible war, 25000 more tanks were built than in the USA, where they knew about the war only from newspapers.

          What do you mean "cut off from everything"? And where did the lend-lease machines come from in the shops until the very restructuring? And from what source is the number 25000 difference? I came across a maximum of 17000, and in the TSB, in general, the Americans did 8000 more.

          However, I don’t understand at all why you gave the figures for the production of tanks. Your opponent's thesis was that Soviet tanks, no matter how many there were, would not have been produced in such numbers without American supplies of equipment and raw materials. What does this have to do with the comparison with the production of tanks in America itself? She already produced more than she herself needed - she supplied the British, the USSR, the French and everyone in a row up to the Brazilians with thousands, and some of the tanks never left the USA at all.

          Quote: Kasatik
          Kharkov and Mariupol in the Second World War were of the same importance as Bakhmut and s. Matveevka.


          The same?! The largest center of tank building in the world, where more tanks were made before the war than in France and Germany combined, was of the same importance as the regional center, which is valuable to both sides only for PR? Well, maybe...
      2. +1
        1 2023 June
        Quote: karabas-barabas
        Yes, it’s true, of course, only they forgot such a trifle as metals, machine tools, motors, gunpowder from the USA, otherwise there would be nothing to implement this, the Germans managed to cut off the USSR literally 100% from its military industry

        Nonsense ... And anti-scientific.
  5. -7
    25 May 2023
    In the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, compensation for injuries and deaths of fighters is not deducted from the salaries of generals, so you can send people into battle without communications, without UAVs and SIBZ

    That one sentence was enough. Everything else - fierce envy and petty insults. Not solid.
    1. +11
      25 May 2023
      Envy is a normal feeling. If someone is appointed as a favorite and is supplied better than others, this is disgusting. Or is injustice still to be rejoiced at?
    2. -15
      25 May 2023
      My friend, are you confused? Weapons PMC Wagner BUYS with his money earned in Africa and other restless places. BUY, CARL!!! And if you think that the shortage of shells (under the contract, Karl!) is the supply better than others, then one of the two of us does not understand something. And it's clearly not me.
      1. +20
        25 May 2023
        Weapons PMC Wagner BUYS with his money earned in Africa and other restless places. BUY, CARL!!!

        Where is the market where they sell offensive strike weapons? Checks in the studio. Until I see it with my own eyes, I won't believe it. For some reason, I can’t buy a machine gun, but Prigozhin can. At the same time, I am a law-abiding citizen, and Prigozhin is a former ZEK. And it's not just about shooting. Here is Erik Prince, for example, Apache cannot buy for his PMC Academy, but Wagner K-52 - please. Or still not bought, but rented? Then why bother? You can also provide military equipment for carports and birthdays.
        1. 0
          25 May 2023
          Here is Erik Prince, for example, Apache cannot buy for his PMC Academy, but Wagner K-52 - please.

          Shame on Eric...
      2. +8
        25 May 2023
        If you take the word of Prigozhin (an oligarch twice convicted of robbery) (and this is not self-respecting), then he has his own artillery and aviation, and satellites, in addition.
        Come on, come on, Leader, write to us, in some such market you can buy all this?
        Or was it all kindly provided by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, to which this urka is now opening his mouth? He bites the hand that feeds him, and without which he would be nothing.
      3. +1
        3 2023 June
        Quote: Leader_Barmaleev
        My friend, are you confused? Weapons PMC Wagner BUYS with his money earned in Africa and other restless places.

        Yep, buys. And where can you buy a T-90M tank, gun mounts, airfields? :)
  6. +11
    25 May 2023
    Respect to the author!

    Actually, these are the costs of any sledgehammer - the use of such methods quickly gets out of control.
    1. +12
      25 May 2023
      First, in the company, by and large, everything is under strict control, and the methodology works effectively. Secondly, a stupid person will always be found in any organization. Thirdly, focusing on the alleged criminals, it would be worthwhile to assume their probable fate.
      The article, hiding behind the general relationship between PMCs and AKs, focuses on the Bereg case, if you decide to take it out, and not find out directly where you need it, then state it directly.
      1. +2
        25 May 2023
        Quote: Victor Tsenin
        Secondly, a stupid person will always be found in any organization.

        But is it okay that the "office" itself is outlawed on the territory of the Russian Federation? And its employees should not receive a pardon, but 15 years in prison?
        1. The comment was deleted.
  7. +41
    25 May 2023
    Meat assaults are, of course, a disaster. At the same Murza, in this regard, one of the last posts with a video from such an "assault" is indicative, as a result of which about 20 of our fighters were captured. And what is characteristic - since last year, the lack of elementary correct actions to act on the enemy's flank and rear was explained by the lack of people in our country.
    But meanwhile, during the criminal and stupid frontal assaults, we put so many people that they would be enough to surround the entire group of dill in the Donbass.
    As for the Wagners, the "flourishing" of the Wagners is a consequence of the decline and severe crisis in our army. It is necessary to treat the army and the state, and then we will not need any Wagner.
    1. +4
      25 May 2023
      Unfortunately, it's too late to heal. It's gangrene. Only amputation and the sooner the better for the body as a whole.
      1. +8
        25 May 2023
        Please clarify what exactly needs to be amutated in the army and the state, for what purpose, and what favorable consequences will arise?
        1. +9
          25 May 2023
          In principle, it is necessary to amputate the head, because. everything rots away from her. But, Girkin and Co. furiously argues that the head cannot be cut off and only the neck should be cut out. The neck will somehow restore the functioning of the body itself, the old head will dry up (which prevented it from doing it before), and a new, smart and efficient one will grow out of the neck.
    2. -5
      25 May 2023
      But meanwhile, during the criminal and stupid frontal assaults, we put so many people that they would be enough to surround the entire group of dill in the Donbass.

      Naive opinion, do you think that all army ranks are dumber than you? Bypassing settlements on a bare field with mines, when nomadic artillery, located far beyond the villages and cities and which quickly redirects in any direction, is another action. Prigozhin combines the offensive with counter-battery combat, which is why he manages to advance, unlike others who hammer on mythical bunkers, spending a lot of shells on them, and not on suppressing enemy artillery. The main type of defense of the Armed Forces of Ukraine is artillery, like that of the Center group in the winter-spring of 44, when our generals laid down infantry in attacks, not even reaching the front line of the Germans and which, without firing a single shot, died under shells and mines.
  8. +11
    25 May 2023
    "Media" war, between divisions
  9. -5
    25 May 2023
    As I understand it, the command was given to fill Wagner with shit and mix it with it? Particular emphasis should be placed on the fact that almost all of them are total criminals, and this contingent can only wave knives in a drunken fight, and breed suckers for loot. Only now, citizen Biryukov, explain why "a criminal element; die en masse in battles with weapons in his hands? And it would not hurt to find out who Prigozhin recruited from among former and current prisoners. And the article you wrote smells bad, and clearly draws on the order. Admins, according to good so that there is no mass squabbling on the site now, please just delete this article!
    1. +17
      25 May 2023
      And what do you think Prigozhin does not interfere with the faeces of the MO ?! In his last interview, Yevgeny Viktorovich said a lot of things and that even almost the people's squads liberated the Crimea, and the Army and the Ministry of Defense stood in line like that. There is a usual squabble between the Kremlin towers over financial flows in the defense industry, which is why all this dirt is pouring, and the truth is somewhere in the middle.
    2. +20
      25 May 2023
      Your comment pulls to order. And who Prigozhin recruited - you need to ask Prigozhin. The organization in the legal sense is extremely incomprehensible, and who serves there, only Prigozhin knows. He suddenly remembered that even his son Peskov served (who throughout the country refused to go to the draft board because he was Mr. Peskov, and was publicly supported by his father). So how do you check who exactly is currently serving in Wagner?
    3. +3
      25 May 2023
      Quote: Thrifty
      As I understand it, the command was given to fill Wagner with shit and mix it with it?

      Why mix shit with shit? Moores simply wrote that Wagner is crap, you don’t need to mix him with anything, he is self-sufficient.
  10. VLR
    +21
    25 May 2023
    There were reports that the Wagner criminal, whose contract ended on May 19, had already managed to rape two girls in the Novosibirsk region - students of the 4th and 5th grade. I'm afraid this is just the beginning. The country will tremble when the "Wagner chicks" begin to en masse go into the "demobilization". And the question arises why honest mobilized people serve indefinitely without a clear prospect of returning home, and Prigozhin's criminals leave the line after 6 months?
    1. +14
      25 May 2023
      And the question arises why honest mobilized people serve indefinitely without a clear prospect of returning home, and Prigozhin's criminals leave the line after 6 months?
      So this is the whole joke. I plowed for six months and with a clear conscience .. And for long periods it’s not profitable, there would be no people who want it, the chances of surviving are decreasing and being free. ? And half a year is the most.
    2. +22
      25 May 2023
      Quote: VlR
      the question is why honest mobilized people serve indefinitely without a clear prospect of returning home, and Prigozhin's criminals leave the line after 6 months?

      Well, so the mobilized are suckers, and the inmates are the right guys.
      In the wild, well, life was not honey.
      Worked, dragged batteries,
      But the helmet was not found, for some reason the house was set on fire,
      At the dacha at the hucksters they calmed down.
      One Moscow Kent, nicknamed Associate Professor,
      Escaped from prison.
      On the ice at the hiding place, he met a double -
      Such is the irony of nature.
  11. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
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  12. +21
    25 May 2023
    Before our eyes, a monster has grown and gained unprecedented strength - PMC Wagner, whose owner, like his mercenaries, no laws are written. He wanted to leave his positions - and no one can order him to hold them - how is that? Personally, I get the impression that Prigogine can organize a coup d'état at any moment. And the Kremlin seems to be very afraid of this coup. PMC Wagner in its current form is a verdict for both Shoigu, who ruined the army from Serdyukov, and the current supreme commander, Putin. How incompetent do you have to be to put all your hopes on criminals who set conditions and negotiate with their feet on the table? And they slightly threaten to leave the front, bringing it down.
    1. +5
      25 May 2023
      Personally, I get the impression that Prigogine can organize a coup d'état at any moment.
      Nah ... the game is thinner here, he is being prepared as an alternative presidential candidate. And what? A servant to the tsar, a father to soldiers .. Socialist-Revolutionaries-For the truth! Who was proposed for president? Guess three times? Yes, yes .. Now acting. There is no alternative. And our elections are held only on an alternative basis.
    2. 0
      25 May 2023
      Quote: vet
      He wanted to leave his positions - and no one can order him to hold them - how is that?

      How is it "no one can"? Kadyrov turned to Prigozhin and said (ordered?, insisted?) not to leave the position until Akhmat or the RF Armed Forces were replaced. And then the shells seemed to be promised to be given.
      1. -1
        26 May 2023
        Quote: Hyperion
        Kadyrov turned to Prigozhin and said (ordered?, insisted?) not to leave the position until Akhmat

        And what? Kadyrov is actually a governor, or the president of Chechnya, maybe there is another governor, it is not in his competence to indicate Prigozhin. And I strongly doubt that the Kadyrovites are ready to advance at least to the second line of defense in Bakhmut. If anyone is fighting in the Akhmat regiment, these are all kinds of Russians, but not Chechens, especially Kadyrovites. In general, the Kadyrovites are not those ferocious militants of Gelaev, Basaev, or Yamadayev, they knew how to fight, but these are more likely the BB, or the National Guard today, but the regiments of Akhmat, etc. from Chechnya, these are mobilized, or contract soldiers who go through Akhmat, but command them kadyrovtsy.
        Prigozhin has been talking about weak flanks for weeks now, and his own ability to hold them is limited, and therefore, if during the offensive of the Armed Forces of Ukraine the RF Armed Forces are drawn to larger settlements, Bakhmut will become a trap for the Wagners, which Prigozhin for some reason does not want. The MO and Kadyrov can certainly order until they're blue in the face, but when the risks are so obvious to the Wagners, what other choice do they have? Many still don’t think about such a “little thing” that Wagner non combatante, the Armed Forces of Ukraine may not take them prisoner at all, but destroy them, even if they surrender and this will not be any violation of any conventions. Employees of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation are another matter, the Geneva Convention applies to them. Wagner, legally and according to all possible laws, including Russian, being somewhere with weapons, they are "unidentified militants", wild geese.
  13. +16
    25 May 2023
    throwing feces - Wagner structures at the structures of the Moscow Region, and the Moscow Region at Wagner, this will not lead to good, but it’s fun for the enemy and the search for weaknesses around the commander-in-chief of Russia. As for the current article, I don’t know the truth and the truth from the trenches of Donbass, I dare all the same notice that Prigogine stubbornly and methodically, but soon every day, they will begin to turn into Rasputin Nr2, only paramilitary!
    Well, if the supreme listens to Prigozhin and appoints Mezentsev and Surovikin to the place of Shoigu and Gerasimov, then the Court and around it will immediately scream that the modern supreme obeys the modern Rasputin. Those whose stripes are not stained with trench mud will stand behind their warm places with their chests, having previously ordered articles in the media in order to bring Prigozhin exactly under the "portrait" of Rasputinism.
    1. 0
      25 May 2023
      Quote: north 2
      Those whose stripes are not stained with trench mud will stand behind their warm places with their chests, having previously ordered articles in the media in order to bring Prigozhin exactly under the "portrait" of Rasputinism.


      100%, just yesterday I watched an interview between Prigozhin and Dolgov, and today everything turns out .... Konstantin Dolgov was fired from the Cart Online project, which is funded by the Internet Development Institute and supervised by the Presidential Administration.

      And how is Prigozhin's activity covered in pro-government telegram channels? Either complete silence (when there is criticism of the leadership of the Moscow Region and all sorts of sensitive questions .... nepotism, corruption, sycophancy, about "golden" children, etc.) or excerpts from quotes where he expresses gratitude to the president and where the successes of PMC Wagner were in Artemovsk.

      Actually, for those who know how to think with their own head, everything is obvious.
  14. VLR
    +15
    25 May 2023
    The most unpleasant thing is that Prigozhin is a very murky type with a suspicious past and a dangerous future for the country, who is clearly already considering the possibility of becoming a dictator in his mind, saying the right things about the current "elite" - about the incompetence of the army leadership, about the relatives of Shoigu and Lavrov and the ripening tension in society (in a recent interview) and so on. But he is clearly not a figure of state scale and level, and in the event of a seizure of power, he can finally destroy Russia.
    1. +24
      25 May 2023
      [B]
      he is clearly not a figure of state scale and level, and in the event of a seizure of power, he can finally destroy Russia.
      / B] laughing And Yeltsin, was a figure of state scale? And with his state mind, with one stroke of the pen, he ruined one power and almost ruined another: "Take sovereignty as much as you want!" "God bless America!" There was a big, statesman mind! laughing
      1. VLR
        +19
        25 May 2023
        And, characteristically, Putin has not said a single bad word about Yeltsin, who is the main culprit of the current situation.
        1. +6
          25 May 2023
          Quote: VlR
          And, characteristically, Putin has not said a single bad word about Yeltsin, who is the main culprit of the current situation.

          Putin had completely different conditions and a strategy of "stability", it ran out of steam like the stagnation of the USSR. As a result, the swamp has to be stirred up and we are in for even bloodier times than the 90s, although maybe not to the level of the 17th. But, here's how to count. If with the human losses of Putin's dictatorship in the NWO, then the base is already above the 90s.
      2. +5
        25 May 2023
        Quote: parusnik
        Big, state mind, was a man!

        Yeah. As on New Year's Eve he said that he was tired and was leaving, I almost choked on my stopar. YOKLMN, Boris Nikolaevich!
        1. -3
          25 May 2023
          Yeah. As on New Year's Eve he said that he was tired and was leaving, I almost choked on my stopar. YOKLMN, Boris Nikolaevich!


          Another fairy tale ... he did not say these words "tired and leaving." Here are his words

          "... Dear friends! My dears! Today is the last time I address you with a New Year's greeting. But that's not all. Today I address you for the last time as the President of Russia.
          I made a decision.
          I thought long and hard about it. Today, on the last day of the outgoing century, I I'm leaving resign.
          I never said this, today it is important for me to tell you this. The pain of each of you responded with pain in me, in my heart. Sleepless nights, painful experiences... What should be done to make people at least a little, at least a little bit easier and better? There was no more important task for me.
          Я I'm leaving. I did everything I could. And not for health, but for the totality of all problems. I am being replaced by a new generation, a generation of those who can do more and better..."
          -B.N. Yeltsin
          1. The meaning of this quote is conveyed by the short "I'm tired, I'm leaving"
    2. +15
      25 May 2023
      not a figure of state scale and level, and in the event of a seizure of power, it can finally destroy Russia.
      And how do you evaluate one statesman, a great mind, a person who has been in power for about two decades, one state, they won’t choose a stupid one, just the same? Who said that he was deceived by other statesmen from neighboring countries, near and far? And a little later, he called them idiots? And if so, where was his state mind?
      1. His mind is about the same as 500 million people who have taken preferential mortgages. Whether he has honor and conscience remains to be seen.
    3. +5
      25 May 2023
      Quote: VlR
      The most unpleasant thing is that Prigozhin is a very murky type with a suspicious past and a dangerous future for the country, who is clearly already in his mind considering the possibility of becoming a dictator

      He was unpleasantly struck by his words that Russia needs to become a kind of "DPRK" for several years and stop building roads and infrastructure. Despite the fact that he himself admits that the NWO began and continues hard and wrong. Quote: "What did we do? We walked boorishly across the entire territory with boots in search of the Nazis. While we were looking for the Nazis, we poked everyone we could."
      Although one cannot dismiss the option that he thus draws a "wonderful" prospect for Russia, under the current managers.
    4. -1
      2 2023 June
      And you, dill, what are you worried about Russia? Go away!
  15. +6
    25 May 2023
    Quote: VlR
    The most unpleasant thing is that Prigozhin is a very murky type with a suspicious past and a dangerous future for the country, who is clearly already considering the possibility of becoming a dictator in his mind, saying the right things about the current "elite" - about the incompetence of the army leadership, about the relatives of Shoigu and Lavrov and the ripening tension in society (in a recent interview) and so on. But he is clearly not a figure of state scale and level, and in the event of a seizure of power, he can finally destroy Russia.

    Do not forget that next year there will be presidential elections in Russia. It is very important, and also frightening and dangerous, who will take Prigozhin and his ideas, his "contingent" and his supporting electorate as "fellow travelers". It is very interesting if Zhirinovsky would have been alive, how he would have treated Prigozhin and his "army".
  16. -13
    25 May 2023
    an article one hundred percent custom-made on E. Prigozhin and his fighters "Wagner" .... it's just that mother really pricks someone's eyes, from what's going on in the Moscow Region and in general in Russia, someone is really fattening on the common people .... .
    1. +7
      25 May 2023
      Quote: Alex242
      it’s just that mother really pricks someone’s eyes, from what’s going on in the Moscow Region and in general in Russia

      And "Wagner" should / can somehow fix this?
    2. the article is one hundred percent customized for E. Prigozhin and his Wagner fighters.

      What do you think about Prigogine now?
  17. -16
    25 May 2023
    Quote: VlR
    The most unpleasant thing is that Prigozhin is a very murky type with a suspicious past and a dangerous future for the country, who is clearly already considering the possibility of becoming a dictator in his mind, saying the right things about the current "elite" - about the incompetence of the army leadership, about the relatives of Shoigu and Lavrov and the ripening tension in society (in a recent interview) and so on. But he is clearly not a figure of state scale and level, and in the event of a seizure of power, he can finally destroy Russia.

    you yourself are muddy with your couch thoughts .....
  18. VLR
    +16
    25 May 2023
    By the way, Wagner, as I understand it, was created by a completely different person. "Businessman" Prigogine simply "bought" this structure and began to earn money on it. And now - also to score "political points" And at the same time he clearly has a good "roof" - otherwise he would not have been forgiven for increasingly bold (and, unfortunately, justified) "raids" on high-ranking officials and generals.
    1. +2
      25 May 2023
      Quote: VlR
      And at the same time, he clearly has a good "roof" - otherwise he would not have been forgiven for ever more daring (and, unfortunately, justified) "assaults" on high-ranking officials and generals.

      He has a roof - no higher. what
      1. The comment was deleted.
  19. -9
    25 May 2023
    I appeal to the author of the article, Viktor Biryukov. Who do you work for? Why pit combat units, why pit people here in VO. Do you want the TRUTH? provocative and biased towards both PMCs and corps and everyone who fights. The question is why? And who are you to judge those with whom you did not even stand next to?
    1. +6
      25 May 2023
      Quote: Mikhail Maslov
      And who are you to judge those with whom you did not stand next to?

      According to your logic, all the judges stood (participated) next to the criminals?
      1. -6
        25 May 2023
        According to my logic, if there are facts that are not unfounded crimes, no matter who committed them, there should be punishment. And this is the business of the relevant structures. And there is nothing to sow discord and criticize. We are all in the same boat, although everyone thinks differently. Not all of Wagner "convicts and not everyone in the corps of the DPR and LPR are heroes, the war tests the strength of people and not all silicon.
        1. -2
          26 May 2023
          Quote: Mikhail Maslov
          We are all in the same boat

          Yes Yes...

          Quote: Mikhail Maslov
          war

          To clarify the war with us or the NWO is from the series "Whose Crimea?", Including I will not.
          1. -2
            26 May 2023
            And you don’t need to distort, for me it’s war, but for you, decide for yourself.
  20. +12
    25 May 2023
    All mistakes, regardless of who committed them, is our common misfortune, as our brothers, fathers and sons are dying. I'm not talking about material and moral losses. A lot of mistakes were made from the very beginning of the SVO GSh and MO, and the tactics of the first months were obviously a failure, if not criminal. Unfortunately, the situation with ammunition, communications and equipment in the army is still relevant, as well as numerous facts of corruption and theft on military contracts. There is no tough will of the Supreme, or it is no longer enough to restore order and punish the guilty.
    1. +11
      25 May 2023
      Quote from Dekimen
      A lot of mistakes were made from the very beginning of the SVO GSh and MO

      The main mistake was made long before the NWO and even before 2014 - this is a mistake of negotiating for the sake of the business of the oligarchs of its constituents, which is not controlled by anyone.
  21. +7
    25 May 2023
    The article looks very much like a custom one. Prigogine offended many. But after all, someone attracted him to fight with dill! Objectively, his PMC has already brought great benefits to the country. And this cannot be taken away. - neither MO, nor some hacks. And an ordinary person simply does not know the true state of affairs and someday something will become clear, or maybe not ... Because the supporters will voice their version, and the opponents will voice their own.
    1. +11
      25 May 2023
      Quote: Tikhonov_Alexander
      But after all, someone attracted him to fight with dill!

      With one attempt: And who was it?
      Quote: Tikhonov_Alexander
      Objectively, his PMC has already brought great benefits to the country.

      In terms of recycling part of the ZK at the front, or in terms of saturating the country with pardoned scumbags?
      Quote: Tikhonov_Alexander
      And the average person simply does not know the true state of affairs

      I wonder how much this mantra affects the Middle Attic layman that the guards use it so stubbornly on every occasion? What is there on 4 sides in Bryansk is not given to understand by an ordinary person? And what about highmarsirovki in Makiivka, is also not a question for the average mind?
    2. +5
      25 May 2023
      That's just such a "huge benefit" leads to the collapse of the state
  22. +17
    25 May 2023
    Personally, I don’t understand this glorification of mercenaries at all, the only plus from them is that they are fighting, and I’m sitting at home, I have no desire to participate in imperialist swarms, I don’t want to shed blood for bourgeois
    1. +4
      25 May 2023
      Quote: HaByxoDaBHocep
      Personally, I don’t understand this glorification of mercenaries at all

      The authorities are playing with fire, realizing that they themselves crap themselves, and MORP is not able to wipe up after them.
      Quote: HaByxoDaBHocep
      the only plus from them is that they are at war, and I'm sitting at home

      So yes, the only problem is that they are fighting on the territory of the Russian Federation.
  23. +10
    25 May 2023
    I will add. I'm still waiting for cardinal changes at the front after such a long exhaustion of dill in Artyomovsk. After all, this victory must be used to the fullest! So - the farther, the more doubts arise about the viability of our Defense Ministry and the guarantor ...
    1. +4
      25 May 2023
      Quote: Tikhonov_Alexander
      After all, this victory must be used to the fullest!

      How? To recycle manpower during the assault on Kramatorsk, so that after the combined forces of NATO, without resistance, marched in to denazify the demilitarized Russian Federation?
  24. -4
    25 May 2023
    Quote: Mikhail Maslov
    I appeal to the author of the article, Viktor Biryukov. Who do you work for? Why pit combat units, why pit people here in VO. Do you want the TRUTH? provocative and biased towards both PMCs and corps and everyone who fights. The question is why? And who are you to judge those with whom you did not even stand next to?

    in my opinion, this author, Biryukov, is not the first provocative, sowing enmity, article on VO. In my opinion, the editors of VO one morning posted his article, by lunchtime removed it from the site completely.
    1. -7
      25 May 2023
      in my opinion, this author, Biryukov, is not the first provocative, sowing enmity, article on VO. In my opinion, the editors of VO one morning posted his article, by lunchtime removed it from the site completely.

      He has relevant comments.

      He has been approaching the topic of PMCs for a long time, refer to point 1 in his commentary. Here they also want to make a hero of Murza's friend, who was allegedly killed by the Wagnerites for the purpose of robbery, and everything is far-fetched there. He even put forward a hypothesis that Prigozhin was forbidden to recruit in the zones because of robberies and murders in the NVO. And the fact that the Luhansk "militia" themselves were doing is silent. I would like to ask Murza where did this ordinary Mangushev get a Japanese jeep? Bought? Knowing the order in the LPR, it is unlikely that it’s good at least now they are putting things in order there.
  25. +7
    25 May 2023
    Have Wagner fighters committed and are committing crimes? They probably did and are doing it, especially considering the contingent. There will always be inadequate. The people's militia fighters of the DPR and LPR, especially from the age of 14, committed crimes in the same way, there were both racketeering and murders. Yes, and in the army of the Russian Federation, I think there are such cases. In the army, of course, much less, after all, in the army there is more control. It is always like this in war, the temptation to have weapons is great, and people are all different. The question here is how it has come to such a point that the state is forced to use private military companies in hostilities on its territories. As Prigozhin said, 20 PMC fighters died in Bakhmut and the state was not very worried, after all, these are not regular military men. Now PMCs are leaving for reorganization and the fighters of the Russian Army will die in such numbers, and this is a completely different alignment for the state, and for the country as a whole, and the border is like a sieve (there are both objective and subjective reasons for this). I think Wagner's "pouring mud" will begin now, they will remember everything that was and that was not.
  26. -14
    25 May 2023
    All power to the Soviets!

    "A pig will find dirt everywhere' is an army proverb.

    Another article to belittle our victory in Artyomovsk. Artyomovsk is ours and the musicians took it - that's a fact! Everything else is blah, blah, blah, the purpose of which is to belittle our victory.

    As a rule Winners are judged by envious people and losers.

    ps
    According to the article and its author as a whole.
    This is the subjective attitude of the individual, based on his prejudice towards the CBO that we are conducting. You expressed your attitude towards my country quite clearly - this is not your country.
  27. +4
    25 May 2023
    This is how Wagner is treated in the 2nd Guards Army Corps, but what do you think? What is your opinion of the author about all these skirmishes? And so the article reminds: "- So they called me yellow fish?
    - Yes! Yes! Fish! And another worm! Earthworm!
    “Did they call me a spotted frog?”
    - Yes! Yes! Frog! And also an earthworm!" (c)
  28. +1
    25 May 2023
    Oh, okay, that's all.

    No one says that the Wagner saints. However, they have results. And the AFRF, as rightly noted in the article, has been brutally storming Avdiivka for the second year with almost zero results.
  29. +2
    25 May 2023
    A single run on an enemy defender after 4 (four) shells artillery preparation could change a lot in the views of the world among those who repost the popular slogan about shells.

    Shifting responsibility for this to Wagner is the height of stupidity. Wagners can demand and demand, but others, for various reasons, are not given this. But Wagner is definitely not to blame for the lack of shells.
  30. -1
    25 May 2023
    Or maybe not to breed a bodyagu on the topic of who will remember what to whom and who relates to whom. Can all the same pull up the general army level to the level of "Wagner"? Although it is unlikely with our generals. recourse
  31. -1
    25 May 2023
    After the end of the assault on Artyomovsk, I subconsciously waited for the appearance of a media (so far) company against the musicians ...
  32. +6
    25 May 2023
    Sounds like the truth.
    Here and there, bad news breaks through from military correspondents and military experts with a conscience ....

    Although earlier they broke through about "cellars with abducted and prisoners" in the LDNR in the police units, they covered everything without trial. Like, there is a lot of limitlessness in the SBU, but everything is perfect with us
  33. -1
    25 May 2023
    Something similar to such articles was to be expected. The reputation of the "Wagners" is too high and that of the RF Armed Forces is too low. Not going to intermeddle and delve into all the squabbles, I will only say one thing: there is a concept that determines the efficiency or inefficiency of the system, this is the RESULT. Where the RF Ministry of Defense is, there is a retreat, flight, abandonment of equipment and other unseemly actions. Where Wagner is, there is success. Everything else is unnecessary poetry.
  34. The comment was deleted.
  35. -2
    25 May 2023
    Well, as soon as Prigozhin in his last interview went through the children of Shoigu, Lavrov and Peskov, the articles “not everything is so simple” immediately went
    1. -4
      25 May 2023
      Well, that's how Murz has been shaking this topic since February! By the way, in comparison with the attitude of this character to our Defense Ministry, Prigogine is generally a goldfinch ... So, here it is more likely that "taking the opportunity, they remembered ..." rather than "ordered compromising information ...".
  36. -3
    25 May 2023
    Murzik is the foster child of Kurchenko, who has been stealing federal money allocated from the federal budget for Donbass for eight years now. The prison cries for him.
    1. +1
      25 May 2023
      Yes, I, in fact, urinate from a high tower, and on Murzik, and on the characters of this opera. But in this particular case, it smells like feces not from him, and not from Kurchenko, but from those who broke the law, and even more seriously from those who excuse and whitewash them, including in the media space. It is impossible to pervert and cheat the law, and it doesn't matter who it stands to protect. Otherwise, how do we differ from khokhlostan, where, for the sake of political ambitions, the murderers of Oles Buzina are being smeared away? How? We speak the same language, everyone drowns for their own, we shoot at each other from the same weapon! Let's also liken the political and legal system to these miserable ones, and everything will become completely zashib!
  37. -5
    25 May 2023
    fighter Andrey Morozov is something very "in the know" on the situation with PMCs for "just a fighter" .... The very appearance of this article looks like a provocation. aimed at weakening our soldiers, our army, and not only the RF Armed Forces, which is at war with the enemy ... an order from that side is not ruled out .... well, on the topic - if someone thinks. that war is like a lyrical walk in nature with kind characters, then he is deeply mistaken ... war is dirt. inhuman blood and torment and people corresponding there and everything can be there .... and if a warrior fights for the Motherland on our side. this does not mean that he is white and fluffy in life and everyone there looks like the heroes of TV reports ... but this does not negate that. that our army is fighting for a just cause and all those who are there are heroic people and worthy of support and respect on our part .... and all these revelations of a "fighter" look like Solzhenitsyn-style chernukha ... now is not the time .. ..ugly... .
  38. 0
    25 May 2023
    The criminals fighting in the penal units (and PMC "Wagner" having recruited convicts became precisely the penal one) atone for their guilt with their blood. It is impossible to put them on the same level with the personnel troops of the Russian Federation and volunteers, otherwise we will return to the days of "Penal Battalions", "Bastards", "Citadels" and heroic raspberry jackets.
  39. 0
    25 May 2023
    So why didn't the Luhansk mobilized retreat from their land to the old growing regions in the Kharkov direction? And what about the marinka? Or Avdiivka. But Zakharchenko and Givi and Motorola, who also eliminated Wagner or their own? Thank God and good work, they have not yet eliminated a single person like that. And who's stopping you from going on the air to cram MO cubes and demand shells. If it’s scary to demand from your own, then you will die under the shells of strangers.
  40. +3
    25 May 2023
    Since different structures are at war, there will always be friction.
  41. +9
    25 May 2023
    Why be surprised? That hodgepodge that is now at war, the bizarre command structure, when it is often easier to negotiate, to establish interaction with neighbors directly than to rely on higher levels, indicates that there is pure Makhnovism, including regular units, albeit to a lesser extent. Well, where are the chieftains with their lads, everything gradually turns into a wild field, with requisitions, expropriations (read - robberies), extrajudicial executions and other delights of "free" life. And if someone thinks that after returning from the war, these "lads" will be reorganized into a peaceful life, then let them fantasize further. For the coming years, or rather - decades, we are provided with a wild field across the country.
  42. +7
    25 May 2023
    Knowledgeable people directly accuse Wagner of killing all field commanders in the LNR DNR, that on the orders of Plotnitsky and Surkov they acted in the Donbass, killing all those objectionable to the Kremlin who prevented the conclusion of Minsk agreements with the West, Mozgovoy bluntly stated that they were fighting here against the second Israel, after why he was killed on the way, and he was respected, unlike the eve..I, the carpenter's appointee of the Kremlin. With all the incompetence of the Defense Ministry and the generals, there is no need to make a hero out of Prigogine, he put 20 thousand fighters in the frontal assault on Bakhmut, only killed, they say even more. Prigozhin's business is war, no war, nobody needs PMCs. At the moment there is no one there except a simple soldier who is for Russia and the people, everyone has their own selfish interests. And all this will end for Russia with another tragedy.
  43. -7
    25 May 2023
    Vyser, paid for by people like general-deputat Sobolev. negative
    1. +5
      25 May 2023
      [quote = flSergius] Vyser, paid for by people like general-deputat Sobolev. [/quote]
      How old are you, dear, that you call names like in kindergarten (like "poop-poop")
      1. -5
        25 May 2023
        It is possible that twice as much as yours, by the way, this appeal is written with a capital. Consciously distorted his titles in order to show his attitude towards a social parasite, unworthy of them. What's wrong?
        1. +1
          26 May 2023
          Quote: flSergius
          What's wrong?

          Well, if you do not understand, then not so everything. By the way, I'm 76 years old.
  44. 0
    25 May 2023
    Quote: Konnick
    Yeah. As on New Year's Eve he said that he was tired and was leaving, I almost choked on my stopar. YOKLMN, Boris Nikolaevich!


    Another fairy tale ... he did not say these words "tired and leaving." Here are his words

    "... Dear friends! My dears! Today is the last time I address you with a New Year's greeting. But that's not all. Today I address you for the last time as the President of Russia.
    I made a decision.
    I thought long and hard about it. Today, on the last day of the outgoing century, I I'm leaving resign.
    I never said this, today it is important for me to tell you this. The pain of each of you responded with pain in me, in my heart. Sleepless nights, painful experiences... What should be done to make people at least a little, at least a little bit easier and better? There was no more important task for me.
    Я I'm leaving. I did everything I could. And not for health, but for the totality of all problems. I am being replaced by a new generation, a generation of those who can do more and better..."
    -B.N. Yeltsin
  45. -2
    25 May 2023
    Quote: Belisarius
    Or take part in the meat assault on the "promoted" parts of the LPR, such as the March 2022 assault on Rubizhny, when all 7

    Does it even have to do with it, is Wagner to blame for this too? Or the main shit to throw on the fan.
  46. +2
    25 May 2023
    Quote: Ohsetin
    So yes, the only problem is that they are fighting on the territory of the Russian Federation.


    ... which became such thanks to the CBO.
  47. +5
    25 May 2023
    Quote: VlR
    But he is clearly not a figure of state scale and level, and in the event of a seizure of power, he can finally destroy Russia.


    Rather, a toad will swallow the moon than Prigogine will seize power.
    Just a "zits-chairman", a hired manager and nothing more. It will be necessary - he will be pushed back once, he will not have time to utter a word.
    We had a gallant general, Lebed was his last name. It also seemed big. And now they rarely remember about him.
    "Wagner" is completely controlled by the Presidential Administration, which maintains it. Prigozhin, I suppose, is not a Rothschild to maintain such a structure on his own. And the Wagnerites obviously do not buy heavy weapons in the Voentorg.
  48. +3
    25 May 2023
    Quote: north 2
    Do not forget that next year there will be presidential elections in Russia.


    "With all the wealth of choice, there is no other alternative!".
    Either Putin again, or Medvedev. Others may not even bother. The extras will only get what they deserve.
  49. +6
    25 May 2023
    Quote: Leader_Barmaleev
    My friend, are you confused? Weapons PMC Wagner BUYS with his money earned in Africa and other restless places. BUY, CARL!!! And if you think that the shortage of shells (under the contract, Karl!) is the supply better than others, then one of the two of us does not understand something. And it's clearly not me.


    Unfortunately, it's just you.
    If Wagner is able to buy (where and from whom?) tanks, howitzers and attack helicopters, then what was the problem with buying shells for the same howitzers? Did the money run out? Why, supposedly a private PMC, demands shells from the Defense Ministry, and, it seems, for free? Does the Pentagon also allocate shells to the American "Academy" according to the order, or what?
    Prigozhin frankly fell asleep. He clearly showed with his requests to give shells (do not sell, Karl, just give!), That PMC Wagner is not a PMC at all! This is just a fig leaf for cover, it is not a private company, but a completely state-owned one, under the private label. No more private than the Foreign Legion of France. And it has such a status in order to circumvent some restrictions (primarily in the legislative sphere) that are imposed on state structures, that's all.

    "And remember: laws are not written for you. Act according to my instructions only!"
  50. +5
    25 May 2023
    Quote: VlR
    The most unpleasant thing is that Prigozhin is a very murky type with a suspicious past and a dangerous future for the country,


    On which there has long been both compromising evidence and other levers.

    "- See two criminal cases on the table? Your case is right!" laughing
  51. +5
    25 May 2023
    The question is not Prigogine, but the entire Russian Armed Forces, if there was someone to fight, PMCs would not be needed.
  52. +2
    25 May 2023
    The British, amers, chicks, as the TG channels Legitimny and Resident wrote, threw a lot of $$$ into discrediting the most successful PMC, it beats the Ukrainian too painfully and ruins plans for a counter-offensive, and then they turned Zaluzhny into a vegetable and how many other useful things they can do at front.. More and more such articles will be posted by paid scribblers, the oldest of professions. Prigozhin has many enemies, external and internal. Who else in our society can openly ask the Prosecutor General’s Office to check Beglov (the mayor of St. Petersburg) for the possible creation of an organized criminal community? And the fact that many parquet workers are prevented (prevented) from stealing and sawing up state property, trading in weapons taken out of storage, how does that even happen?
    p.s. You cannot win on the battlefield.. Everything is clear.
    p.p.s. As Vladlen would say: “The enemy will be defeated, victory will be ours, all the best to everyone!”
  53. +1
    25 May 2023
    In my not very outstanding opinion, the author raised this topic in vain. It is not appropriate, in a difficult time for the Motherland, to pit the defenders against each other. It is not nice to beg or exalt one or the other. We will figure out who is longer or thicker after the victory. It's a shame in front of all the military personnel.
  54. 0
    25 May 2023
    As they say, a drop of ointment spoils a barrel of honey. It would be wrong to blame all Musicians indiscriminately. And those who wanted to “cheat a sucker on a Padzherik”, in fact, people who committed several crimes (surely, there are many more sins behind them) and denigrated the Wagner PMC, need to be dealt with, even without loud statements to the press.
  55. +2
    25 May 2023
    How do the 2nd Guards Army Corps of the RF Armed Forces treat the Wagner PMC
    The author tells an inconvenient truth.
    And the “cooks” clearly perked up and became nervous (along with the “fans”)...
    1. -3
      26 May 2023
      The author tells an inconvenient truth.
      And the “cooks” clearly perked up and became nervous (along with the “fans”)...


      To know whether it was true or not, you had to be there somewhere, right? Well, tell me, where were you and in what role? What information do you personally have regarding the facts presented in the article? Or was the whole purpose of writing your comment in the word “cooks”, which you, in ecstasy at the opportunity, quickly threw on the keyboard? laughing
  56. The comment was deleted.
    1. -1
      26 May 2023
      Since censorship devoured the key phrase, I will repeat the paragraph with modification:

      “...And a little later, over the radio operator’s loud-speaking radio, I heard one of the commanders of the “liners” (that’s what we called the fighters of the NM LPR) say about this assault and these losses: “It’s okay. More DB-fishing (according to Lavrov) they will send"... So Konnick said correctly - this speaks about the level of some commanders of the LPR NM.
    2. +1
      26 May 2023
      This is another topic. Sharp, important. But different. In simple terms, this is called “translating the arrows.” The smart thing is to change the emphasis and change the topic of discussion.
    3. -1
      28 May 2023
      The LM of the LPR and DPR before the North Military District consisted at least of volunteers and had motivation. But with the beginning of the Northern Military District, mobilization was carried out in the republics, very tough. Everyone was rowed, but among the population of the republics there were not only many indifferent ordinary people who did not give in to “denazification and demilitarization,” but also many sympathizers of Ukraine (not everyone left for the West in 2104). They took people who, due to health reasons, would not have been taken even into the Volkssturm 1945. They were given poor weapons and ammunition (then Mosinki and SSh-68s began to appear en masse in the video), were given short formal training (and many had never served before and had only seen the army in movies) and were thrown into the front line. Well, what kind of morale and discipline could this army have? On the contrary, it is surprising that they fought at least somehow, and on our side.
  57. +4
    26 May 2023
    And yes, no matter how the armchair and rear “experts” growl, “Wagner” really fights hard. Whether you all like it or not, it's true. Crossed paths. I was in neighboring areas. Communicated. Saw.

    Who am I to say and write such things? Akhmat fighter. Volunteer. I stormed the outskirts of Soledar with friends, captured and held positions in the Yakovlevka area, and had to evacuate the 200s from the field at night, under the noses of the “Germans”. And the “Akhmatovites” were carried out, and the “Wagners”, and the “liners”. no one divided into “us” and “strangers”. everyone was ITS. And he took the wounded man out of the battlefield under targeted fire from the Rapier and the tank. This is not to brag. This is so that you know that “I am responsible for my market.”
    1. -1
      26 May 2023
      I will support you, I look at the comments and cons and I see this article came out for a reason. And the public has long been ready and reacts very unequivocally to this article. The meaning is one drain and far-reaching. For now we started with “Wagner” and there’s more to come. We’ll figure it out!
  58. +2
    26 May 2023
    They are doing absolutely the right thing. Advertising is the engine of progress. Wagner is a PMC, people voluntarily enter into a contract. PMC - shows results and can be found in difficult sectors of the front. PMC losses are often not taken into account in the losses of the Defense Ministry. The Defense Ministry can always freeze out from PMCs (outside the Russian Federation), as was the case in the SAR. Another thing is that you need to look at positive/negative experiences and translate them into MO.
  59. The comment was deleted.
  60. 0
    26 May 2023
    Quote from SergLv
    In my not very outstanding opinion, the author raised this topic in vain. No good.
    Whether it’s in vain or not, you need to ask the author where the mouse is, for example. About discrediting the army, etc.
  61. -3
    26 May 2023
    Quote from resident_again
    And yes, no matter how the armchair and rear “experts” growl, “Wagner” really fights hard. Whether you all like it or not, it's true. Crossed paths. I was in neighboring areas. Communicated. Saw.

    Who am I to say and write such things? Akhmat fighter. Volunteer. I was storming with friends... I answer the bazaar."

    Prigozhin has many enemies, external and internal. But here they just dug in on the sofas, but in the matskva they share apartments and positions.
  62. -6
    26 May 2023
    The entire article by this “author” is based on the testimony of a fighter. All the arguments are like “they could”, “they could have written”, “they had the opportunity”. Not a single concrete evidence or fact. Arranging races with the commandant's patrol is everyone's personal business, only the ending is always the same - detention or death when trying to "get away."
    Conclusion: the author is paid and subject to anathema, through a sledgehammer, as an enemy of the people and an instigator.
    Chicken Sot! Your exit!
    1. -1
      26 May 2023
      Absolutely right. After the Prigozhin-MO-Shoigu showdown, they moved to the “middle level”. The goal? I think this is a very disguised discredit.
  63. 0
    26 May 2023
    From everything written, I realized that everyone’s supply sucks :) . The rest is lyrics
  64. +2
    27 May 2023
    Finally, an article came out with a truthful assessment of Wagner’s activities. Otherwise, it really gave the impression that this PMC was just fighting and the rest of the 500-strong group was simply hindering them, the Ministry of Defense was generally pests and did not give them ammunition.
  65. The comment was deleted.
  66. 0
    28 May 2023
    The article smells like an order! Inciting discord between their brothers in arms.
  67. 0
    29 May 2023
    You don't need to read beyond the first paragraph. Hard assaults in the absence of proper art support.
  68. -1
    29 May 2023
    Quote: DMB_95
    The public squabbling of supporters and opponents of Wagner and the NM of the LPR on a fairly well-known Russian website is something that should not be allowed during the information war at the height of the SVO, even if everything written here is an absolute, thrice-verified truth. And so - they made a gift to dill, and not for the first time already .. Like women, God forgive me.

    Absolutely true.
    Why hang out this woman's underwear in public? Is it intentional to stir up discord? Or according to the principle of attendants from a bench at the entrance: “oh, what am I going to tell you right now, out of the corner of my eye I saw it through the keyhole, then listen”
  69. +1
    29 May 2023
    Quote: Igor1915
    The question is not Prigogine, but the entire Russian Armed Forces, if there was someone to fight, PMCs would not be needed.


    There is someone. But the use of PMCs (or what is passed off as PMCs) sometimes turns out to be more profitable and less tying hands with all sorts of legal subtleties.
    Or don’t you know that in Iraq and Afghanistan the Yankees also very willingly used their PMCs (the same “Academy”)? Probably not because they had no one to fight with.
    1. -1
      30 May 2023
      This is true, PMCs that are not legally associated with the government can fight in Africa in the interests of Russia.

      But when the Russian army is divided into PMCs and the Russian Armed Forces, only Prigozhin and his Patron need this. There is no need for anything to divide your ariyu into parts of Russia itself and within Russia.

      The problem is that there are so many mentally retarded people in Russia that the gopotas and street punks have become the main and dominant social stratum.

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