Russian attack helicopters Ka-52 received a high appraisal of the results of combat use in Ukraine

The Russian Armed Forces, with the support of the NM of the Republics of Donbass, continue to conduct a special military operation to demilitarize and denazify Ukraine. From the air, ground forces are covered by combat aviation, including attack helicopters Ka-52 and Mi-28NM.

The main part of attack helicopters in Ukraine is Ka-52, these helicopters are much more than the Mi-28NM Night Hunter. What this is connected with is not reported. The Ka-52 itself was highly praised based on the results of combat use during the special operation. As the commander of the crew of the Ka-52 helicopter explained, during training flights there were no such loads as in combat conditions.

(...) The helicopter is actually very maneuverable (...) Under these conditions, the helicopter shows itself from a very good side, very reliable equipment (...) allows you to emerge literally in front of the forest without letting the enemy identify itself

- the Ministry of Defense quotes the words of the crew commander.

The Ka-52 Alligator attack helicopter is a modernized version of the Ka-50 Black Shark. It has the best aerodynamic characteristics and is less noticeable for radars. Designed to destroy tanks, armored and unarmored military equipment, manpower and helicopters of the enemy, in all weather conditions and at any time. It can provide fire support for troops, patrol and escort military convoys.

Currently, Russia is testing a modernized version of the Ka-52M helicopter, which has received enhanced armor and a new airborne defense system. The armament of the helicopter was unified with another rotorcraft - Mi-28NM

Comments

[Saboteur_Navy]

This is the best helicopter, I saw a direct hit by a MANPADS like Stinger during a raid on Gostomel, and nothing itself sat down, the crew was evacuated.
Need more of these! I hope the military-industrial complex works in 3 shifts!
And we still need more SU-34 super plane!

[neworange88]

Good.

.Ka-52 can provide target reconnaissance, target distribution and hardware target designation. It is equipped with visibility reduction devices, an electronic protection system and active countermeasures.

The device develops a maximum speed of up to 300 km / h. The payload weight of the helicopter is 2,5 tons, the flight range is 460 km, the service ceiling is 5,5 thousand meters, and the cruising speed is up to 260 km/h. It also exists in a deck modification under the name Ka-52K "Katran".

The standard weapons of the helicopter are guided and unguided missiles, including Shturm-VU anti-tank systems equipped with laser-guided Ataka missiles, as well as Vikhr guided missiles. In addition, the helicopter carries aerial bombs and containers with cannon weapons.

At the Army-2021 forum, a contract was signed for the supply of 30 modernized Ka-52M helicopters to the Ministry of Defense until 2023. This version received a new radar system with an active phased array antenna and a guided missile with an increased range. The missile armament of the Ka-52M is unified with the armament of another newest attack helicopter, the Mi-28NM.

https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/14592839

The modified ATGM Whirlwind-1 was especially pleased. The Orion UAV can carry two such missiles.

.In May of this year, the Kalashnikov concern announced that in March, at one of the training grounds of the Ministry of Defense, a Ka-52 attack helicopter made test launches of “modified” Vikhr missiles. 22 missiles were fired, which unmistakably hit ground targets, including mobile ones.

. So, what is the advantage of "modified" missiles?

I must say that the Whirlwind-1 is a rather formidable weapon with strong characteristics. It is supersonic - the average speed reaches 600 m / s. Range - 10 km. The missile is used on Su-25 attack aircraft and Mi-28N Night Hunter and Ka-52 Alligator attack helicopters. Launch altitude - from 5 m to 4000 m. Two types of warhead - tandem cumulative and high-explosive fragmentation. Warhead weight - 12 kg. The mass of the rocket is 45 kg, in the transport and launch container - 105 kg. There are two types of fuse - contact and non-contact. The length of the rocket is 2,75 m, the largest diameter is 13 cm.

In the new missiles "Whirlwind" everything is the same. With the exception of the targeting system.

.In new missiles, targeting is carried out according to the “fire and forget” scenario. That is, they are equipped with homing heads (GOS).

Infrared seeker is installed on 9M227M1, 9M227F and 9M227O-2 missiles. The pilot of a helicopter or attack aircraft, having found a target for an attack, fires off such a missile and "forgets" about it. Then it works independently, without interference from the carrier, capturing a heat-emitting target with a homing head. That is, the three disadvantages of a laser-guided missile are removed. The pilot, having fired a rocket, can pilot a helicopter or an airplane in the manner necessary for him. The missile can hit tanks in the upper projection, where the thickness of the armor does not exceed 100 mm. You can also attack a target that is behind any natural or artificial obstacle. In this case, the rocket will find the target itself.

Another missile - 9M227M2 - is equipped with a passive radar seeker. That is, it is designed to destroy enemy radar stations operating as part of air defense and missile defense systems, as well as other enemy radio-emitting complexes.

https://vegchel.ru/index.php?newsid=47241

[Saboteur_Navy]

Would you like to try it during the storming of the city? I think it should work, it can turn around on the spot without entering the circle ...

[Konnick]

Would you like to try it during the storming of the city? I think it should work, it can turn around on the spot without entering the circle ...

It is dangerous to hang still. Can't be used in the city.

[Pereira]

Dangerously. There were bad precedents.

[vm68dm]

military commander Kots told how they knocked out turntables from anti-tank systems during hovering! (DRG)

[Dost]

Ukrainians themselves uploaded videos of how hovering Ka52s were shot down from the flanks from Stugna. I was still surprised how ours "hang" thoughtlessly.

[Pereira]

Were not afraid of attacks from the cemetery. By the way, then half of those were killed, and half were caught. The bearded one, who yelled the most, got caught.

[Dost]

This is different. The car and crew were lost. We haven’t thought about anti-tank systems yet, although our Cornets counted on it

[ramzay21]

The modified ATGM Whirlwind-1 was especially pleased. The Orion UAV can carry two such missiles.

These crafts with attaching ammunition from helicopters and planes from hopelessness and the lack of standard ammunition. For attack drones of this class, their own small-sized ammunition should be developed so that it can take not two missiles, but at least 6, but better than 10. Look at the same Bayraktar, it carries much more ammunition and it is much more effective than our strike UAVs.

In new missiles, targeting is carried out according to the “fire and forget” scenario.

But this is a real achievement. Our helicopter, magnificent in everything, lost to the American Apache precisely in this parameter. Now our helicopters will also be able to rise for a short time to attack the target and quickly leave without being detected, and not be at dangerous heights to aim missiles at the target. This will significantly reduce our losses and risks for the crews. It should have been implemented sooner.

[Volkof]

These crafts with attaching ammunition from helicopters and planes from hopelessness and lack of standard ammunition. For strike drones of this class, their own small-sized ammunition should be developed

There is the Krasnopol-M and Centimeter USS, which are ten times more effective than all the Whirlwinds and attack UAVs ... But no one knows how to use them with simple UAVs, and target designation and reconnaissance are at zero level in the best army .. In addition to missiles, there is nothing in the Russian Army (more precisely, except for missiles, it can’t use anything), it doesn’t know how to do anything and shoves people forward everywhere ... But they don’t win with missiles on the battlefield! I wonder how Gerasimov was going to and is going to fight? Like in WWII? Just like in Syria?

[ramzay21]

There are USS "Krasnopol-M" and "Sentimeter", which are ten times more effective than all "Whirlwinds" and attack UAVs ...

The use of US in combination with UAVs is effective, but this is already yesterday. It is only possible to use an AS within the range of an armed AS battery, but this way you greatly narrow your maneuver. A strike UAV is much more efficient, the operator does not need to think about the presence of batteries with US in the area, it is enough for him to detect the target and attack.
Otherwise, I agree with you.

[Romeo]

Effective weapon? Controversial moment. Low powered ammo. For me, two Whirlwinds are better. And "crafts" is also not true. This is called adaptation to another medium. This is a worldwide practice. A successful product is taken and adapted to a new carrier. Only the suspension is being redone there and this is done not on the knee, but in the conditions of a serious enterprise and undergoes multiple tests

[Volkof]

Likbez! How much does a helicopter cost and training for 2 pilots who are in the cockpit? They are in the enemy's kill zone and can be destroyed. The Vikhr missile has a laser guidance system and the target is illuminated from the helicopter until it hits, at which point the helicopter is vulnerable ...
The Krasnopol projectile has the same guidance system, but is fired from a gun or self-propelled gun, which is located several tens of kilometers away and is not vulnerable to the enemy. The UAV operator can be located next to the gun and highlight the target from the side of the light UAV, also without risking anything ... The cost of losing a light UAV is incomparable with the loss of a helicopter and crew ... In addition, the helicopter must receive preliminary target designation from fighters who may die , or from a UAV, which is also controlled by the same fighters ... In the second case, the UAV provides not only detection and guidance, but also controls its area of ​​​​responsibility in real time, and the operator sees this on a huge monitor in a safe place, or a group of operators from the calculation of self-propelled guns ... Is it clear to you now how the great Gerasimov has now, and how it should be? And this is one example of many. The General Staff of the Russian Armed Forces does not have the concept of modern combat!

[ramzay21]

Effective weapon? Controversial moment. Low power ammo.

For a strike UAV, which can carry tens or even hundreds of times less payload than a helicopter, to fit weapons from a helicopter capable of hitting targets tens of kilometers away is complete stupidity and sabotage. UAVs need low-yield ammunition, but in larger quantities. Low-yield ammunition easily destroys the same armored vehicles as the Whirlwind ATGM.

For me, two Whirlwinds are better.

In your opinion, it may be better, but world experience says something completely different. Attack UAVs should be in the air for hours and watch certain areas or targets and destroy the targets that appear, as many targets as possible and with the least visible weapons.

A successful product is taken and adapted to a new carrier.

So he can attach an excellent Kh-101 missile to a helicopter, perhaps he can carry one missile. Here is an UAV with ATGM Whirlwind as ridiculous as the Ka-52 with the Kh-101 missile.

[Volkof]

In your opinion, it may be better, but world experience says something completely different. Attack UAVs should hang in the air for hours and watch certain areas or targets and destroy the targets that appear, as many targets as possible and with the least visible weapons

.
There is no world experience ... A strike UAV takes off from an airfield, its control center with backup sources, as a rule, is located there. Such an UAV costs like the floor of a helicopter ... And most importantly, does it obey whom? Who and how will coordinate actions, because there are no such systems and organizational formations in the Russian Army ... What does he have to do with the BTG? Its range is about 150 km ... self-propelled guns and simple UAVs are directly subordinate to the BTG commander and act in his interests, in his area of ​​\uXNUMXb\uXNUMXbresponsibility, in his decision-making area ... Get off the couch and turn on your brains ... You understand the difference, and the possibility fast implementation...
The order for the supply of 30 Forpost-R sets was signed in 2020 at 10 sets per year...
And they will be reduced to UAV regiments with the subordination of the Aerospace Forces !!! And there are simply no other serial attack UAVs adopted for service, only experiments and fairy tales ... And where are these "Outposts-R"? New ammunition, new laser target designation station
in 2 options? Or also fairy tales?

http://weaponscollection.com/2022/01/15/na-vooruzhenii-razvedyvatelno-udarnyy-bpla-forpost-r.html

[ramzay21]

There is no world experience ... A strike UAV takes off from an airfield, its control center with backup sources, as a rule, is located there. Such an UAV costs like the floor of a helicopter

There is world experience, these are Karabakh, Libya, Syria and others, and this is only a Turkish UAV, information about much more modern American UAVs is closed.
The flight characteristics of Bayraktar UAVs allow you to take off from any paved road that is everywhere, which excludes being tied to large airfields.

Such an UAV costs like the floor of a helicopter ... And most importantly, does it obey whom? Who and how will coordinate actions, because there are no such systems and organizational formations in the Russian Army.

6 such UAVs with ammunition and two control stations cost like 3 helicopters without everything, but if the drone is lost, the stations remain, and if the helicopter is lost, the crew is also lost, and these are different things even in cost and not always replenished.
Therefore, it is criminal in modern wars to entrust expensive helicopters with tasks that drones are able to perform.
For example, escorting our convoys from the air would be much cheaper and more efficient with four strike UAVs similar to Bayraktar than with a pair of helicopters.

And most importantly, who does he obey? Who and how will coordinate actions, because there are no such systems and organizational formations in the Russian Army ... What does he have to do with the BTG? Its range is about 150 km.

The organizational issue is completely resolvable if those who are capable of it will think. As for the range, it is limited by the radio horizon, we all saw how during the war in Karabakh, the actions of UAVs were coordinated by AWACS aircraft and with the help of them and satellites, UAVs were controlled at completely different distances by operators from Turkey.

Self-propelled guns and simple UAVs are directly subordinate to the BTG commander and act in his interests, in his zone of responsibility, in his zone of decision-making.

This is the only modern scheme for the use of UAV-US, and quite effective. But unfortunately, it is far from being found in all of our BTGs.
But strike UAVs can and should be used much more widely, for example, in covering our military columns. A low-speed strike UAV with thermal imagers is much more efficient and more likely to detect an ambush and destroy it than a helicopter. The strike UAV itself can detect and attack enemy columns not covered by modern air defense on the march, can control certain areas in tactical depth, can pinpoint targets in residential areas without destroying residential buildings and killing civilians. If we add loitering ammunition to this, then the effectiveness of the troops will increase even more, and this can just be applied at the BTG level.

Get off the couch and turn on your brains ... You understand the difference, and the possibility of rapid implementation ....
The order for the supply of 30 Forpost-R sets was signed in 2020 at 10 sets per year...

Tears ... Turned on. But only nothing will change until those who must fulfill their direct official duties fly off their chairs, and here we need real investigative actions and executions of pests and saboteurs at the top without any snot.
Well, or tune in to the results to which we will come under the leadership of these traitors.

[Volkof]

At the Army-2021 forum, a contract was signed for the supply of 30 modernized Ka-52M helicopters to the Ministry of Defense until 2023.

The bulk of attack helicopters in Ukraine are Ka-52s, there are many more of these helicopters than the Mi-28NM Night Hunter.

What cynicism and impudent half-lies!!! One helicopter per month?
Amazing! A little more than 100 cars throughout the country ... it was ... How many years is this? One group of helicopters in the special operation zone and a lot of drooling with joy ... A country of unafraid idiot generals and other woodpeckers !!! How many years have they been told about the meager number of these machines ... But in Ukraine there are 4 positional areas, according to the most conservative estimates, and there is only one combat group of these helicopters ... There are few helicopters, no pilots ... Milevtsy and their lobby slowed down the release of Ka- 52 and everywhere they shove their raw creation of the Mi-28 ... And now there are much more of them in terms of production ... A lot of flaws, a crude gearbox, terrible weapons, etc. ... And they work, sculpt, drag ...

[Ilya_Nsk]

I hope that at least now all the saws will come out and caps will fly along with their heads ..

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Saboteur_Navy

This is the best helicopter

Nice car, the Nazis don't like it.

[Volkof]

There are many Nazis, there are almost no Ka-52 helicopters ... Most have not seen them and will never see them ....

[vvvjak]

As Fighterbomber wrote in the "cart": "Ka 52 is Su 34, only a helicopter."

[tTshka]

And he is also very handsome.

[bulvas]

Quote: tTshka

And he is also very handsome.

His wife says so about him - "terribly beautiful")

[sen]

The bulk of attack helicopters in Ukraine are Ka-52s, there are many more of these helicopters than the Mi-28NM Night Hunter.

Protection, maneuverability better. We decided to minimize losses.

[Pereira]

Once a night, let him work at night.

[New-pechkin]

Aashniks are generally handsome. Probably the most effective and belligerent part of the Aerospace Forces in this conflict. Good luck guys. KA-52, beautiful helicopter.

[Grits]

Quote from: New-pechkin

Good luck guys. KA-52, beautiful helicopter

My countrymen from the city of Arsenyev did a great job!
About 10 years ago I was lucky enough to go on an excursion in the workshops where those birds were built that are now beating ukroreykh

[mojohed2012]

In fact, active hostilities in modern conditions of full-fledged confrontation with comparable opponents in Ukraine, the Ka-52 and Mi-28 can be called the best in the world. The Mi-24 also, when properly used, has the potential for timely modernization and maintenance.
But the American Apache and the supercobra, the German Tiger, the Indian HAL, Denel in South Africa, the Chinese VZ10 and others have not been tested in battle. The US helicopter clashes in Iraq, Afghanistan and Somalia have no comparison with the current battles in Ukraine. So - they did not prove themselves in battle.

[Ilya_Nsk]

"Apache" has not been tested in combat? Seriously? Iraq, Lebanon, Afghanistan, Yugoslavia, Yemen and everywhere, with a high probability there were MANPADS ..

[musketon64]

Even if they were used wisely. Hiding behind the folds of the terrain, reach the line of attack without entering the MANPADS strike zone .. Get target designation and jump out of cover, like the devil out of a snuffbox, launch missiles and also leave or fly to another position for a new attack. And it does not rush over enemy positions, exposing itself to attacks from all sides.

[Grits]

Quote: musketone64

Hiding behind the folds of the terrain, reach the line of attack without entering the zone of destruction of MANPADS.

And where do the folds of the terrain come from in eastern Ukraine? So... uneven plains.

[musketon64]

Quote: Gritsa

And where do the folds of the terrain come from in eastern Ukraine? So... uneven plains.

If you look at the territory of eastern Ukraine from a satellite, you can see fairly large forests and forest belts, behind the tops of which you can approach the enemy. I myself once served under a contract in a helicopter unit at an airfield in a forested area and I remember moments when helicopters, when landing at an extremely low altitude, suddenly appeared due to the nearest forest. This is the main tactic of American helicopter pilots, who also have an over-hull radar (or optical stations) and ATGMs with fire-and-forget missiles. Ours, unfortunately, still have to hang for a few seconds, aiming missiles at the laser beam. But such a tactic is at least some chance not to be set up, especially with high-speed ATGMs with at least a range of 8 km. Entering the territory controlled by enemy short-range air defense is a game of "Russian roulette." The downed Ukrainian helicopters sent to evacuate the inmates from Azovstal are proof of this. Yes, and ours were beaten by the same hidden amount.

[iouris]

This is a general assessment.
"High rating" can be objective and subjective.
The overall assessment of combat effectiveness takes into account many particular criteria, on the basis of which a conclusion is made whether it meets the specified requirements or does not.
Particular performance criteria are as follows:
- damage caused to the enemy for the conditional number of sorties;
- the number of non-fulfillment of flight tasks due to aircraft failures,
- combat (and non-combat) losses per conditional number of sorties (for reasons);
- number of failures (by types) per conditional number of operating hours;
- average labor costs for types of training (by types) and maintenance work (by types),
- coefficient of serviceability during the operation,.
- average recovery time after combat damage.

[moscowp]

I agree, based on one interview with the pilot of the car, one cannot conclude that the car was highly appreciated, this is not a scientific approach, even if it de facto will be the best car in the world

[sasha_cho]

Helicopter ok. good, but damn it, explain why, when attacking with a rocket, the ice leads the rocket until it hits the target, and at the moment the helicopter weighs motionless.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: sasha_cho

Helicopter ok. good, but damn it, explain why, when attacking with a rocket, the ice leads the rocket until it hits the target, and at the moment the helicopter weighs motionless.

Because with the "fire-and-forget" ATGM, everything is bad with us. As a result, the helicopter must see the ATGM and the target with its on-board equipment until it hits.
And the MO killed the work on the "Russian Spike" AKA "Product 79" with their own hands. And if it were not for the "bloody gebnya", then we would not have received the OF version in the person of "Product 305".

"product 79" - the initial order of the RF Ministry of Defense
began to develop before the start of Russia's participation in the civil war in Syria.
Initially, the development of product 79 was initiated by the Ministry of Defense, but due to greed and stupidity, the work was actually "frozen" for several years.
A relatively small number of samples were ordered for testing, funding is typical for MO - a small advance, and payments at the end of the R&D stages.
In view of the failure to meet the deadlines (because of the MO, without details - this is such a failure, just an anecdote), the stages were not signed and paid for. The topic could really die out and close, and never reach the test.
Another customer "spied" this development, assessed the possibilities and ordered it for himself.
The original TK made additions (added a radio link - to control the target and the ability to "withdraw" at the last moment, if the intelligence was not correct).
The launch mode for an unobserved target was not considered due to the specifics of the "work" of the customer.
The item number has changed to "item 305".
Several times more products were ordered. The issue of financing was removed - 100% advance payment of all work (all stages) at once, at once.
In fact, the development and testing was paid for and accepted by another customer.
The Ministry of Defense then read off the test results of the "product 305". The Defense Ministry almost got a rocket for free, almost without risking anything (the investments were several times less), if the topic "did not go" (there were really a lot of difficulties and problems, they went straight along the edge).

[Comrade]

but the pilots, of course, hmm ... 2x hanging Ka-52s were folded from laser-guided ATGMs

[Mwg]

Recently I read somewhere that the KA-52 paired with the Mi-28NM is just the perfect combination of armament and equipment in the aggregate.

[Negruz]

Ka-52 paired with ka-52 is hardly worse ....

[APASUS]

What losses are interesting, this is the assessment of security, maneuverability, and so on.

[Roma 1977]

It will still not be an objective assessment. It is also necessary to take into account the saturation of the enemy’s defense with anti-aircraft weapons.

[APASUS]

Quote: Roma-1977

It will still not be an objective assessment. It is also necessary to take into account the saturation of the enemy’s defense with anti-aircraft weapons.

This is still a combat use. The saturation of the front line with air defense systems is not even. Yes, and the enemy, not barmaley in the desert

[Leshak]

Great helicopter! He would have had more, in the arsenal, "shot and forgot" missiles, and he would become indestructible!

[Force]

Mi-28NM takes part in the NWO? (maybe all the same Mi-28N )

[Murat]

Eh, I would still like to get things done with the overhead radar ...

[morozkm]

There was no doubt about the effectiveness and reliability of these helicopters even during testing, so the military-industrial complex of the Russian Federation and the Russian Aerospace Forces are a force

[Okakakiev]

It is necessary to quickly take into production bunk beds s8ofp. Has anyone heard they are already in production?
While they are shooting with traditional clods of which there are countless reserves.
A little more pity that the use of c8c with arrows is not visible.

[Carlos Hall]

Ka 52 gives excellent results.

[Chikua]

Eh, this bird would have an active protection complex ....

[iouris]

Did he get a high rating even without Vitebsk? A truly outstanding car (with a difficult fate).

[Valery R.]

Why do we not put machine guns on drones to fight enemy manpower. And you can also put long-range rifles. It's very cheap, one person gets several rounds.

[unhappy]

Make a mental effort - a computer toy and real life are different worlds. Maybe in a hundred years the intelligence of the machine and the executive systems will be enough for such a creation. Telemechanics will not help here, otherwise all armies would have had such a miracle in service for a long time.

[Alexey Koshkarov]

Interesting . And why is it so much better than the Mi 28. Or KA 52 is being promoted from the goal of selling to someone