Concern "Kalashnikov" develops new small arms based on the use of neural networks

_{The image is illustrative.}

Work is underway in the country to create new shooting complexes. We are talking about the rifle weapons, which will differ from the existing one in the ability to independently analyze and qualify targets, to carry out aimed shooting. In such a situation, the question always arises, does this weapon need an "operator" - a human?

It is noted that when using such a weapon, the fighter will have the main function - making a decision on the use.

On the development of "smart" small arms in an interview with the information service RIA News said the chief designer of the Kalashnikov concern Sergei Urzhumtsev. According to him, a number of elements of a promising system have already been created by now, and these elements in a closed display format were demonstrated to the head of the country's defense department. This show, according to Urzhumtsev, was held during the Army-2021 forum, which was recently held in the Moscow region.

According to the chief designer of the Kalashnikov concern, the promising weapon will eventually perform its functions based on the use of neural networks. It is neural networks that will make it possible to recognize and qualify the target. Artificial intelligence in this situation "will remain under human control." At the same time, the maximum automation of the use of small arms will be ensured.

Ultimately, after the completion of all the necessary research and design studies, it is planned to enter the serial production of such weapons.

The presence of an artificial intelligence system, as noted, will increase accuracy, provide automatic correction when firing. This will increase the effectiveness of the use of small arms in bad weather conditions, as well as in night conditions (poor visibility).

Separately, it is noted that they will use the so-called "trainable" neural networks capable of self-correction.

The final terms of development have not yet been reported.

Comments

[Vladimir_2U]

It is noted that when using such a weapon, the fighter will have the main function - making a decision on the use.

And also someone has to carry this beauty!
It would be better if a new cartridge was developed for the weapon of army self-defense, otherwise the excess 5,45 * 39 and indistinct 9 * 19 have already frayed many nerves here.

[Cananecat]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

And also someone has to carry this beauty!

And if you connect the sighting complex and the exoskeleton through the neuron, you can get a fantasy.

[alex neym_2]

Exoskeleton + heavy body armor + some of the additional attached weapons (grenade launcher, laser and other that fantasy will allow) - is this a walking warrior from the future? Perhaps there is some truth in this? Nothing is possible: the absurdity today is the reality tomorrow! (with humor).

[AUL]

Very informative article!
A new weapon has been invented. Powered by neural networks, green and one meter high. Turn it on - and everything is fucked up!

[Serg koma]

Quote from AUL

Turn it on - and everything is fucked up!

Neuro-controlled bullets all over the head They themselves find the target, regardless of what angle the enemy is, either during the day or at night - on the spot in an unprotected place.

[Shurik70]

Quote: aleks neym_2

An exoskeleton + a heavy body armor + some additional attachments (a grenade launcher, a laser, and so on that your imagination allows) - is this a walking warrior from the future?

And then this exoskeleton can be sent on a mission in an unmanned version.
And yes. This will. Inevitably.

[Flooding]

Quote: Serg Koma

Neuro-controlled bullets all over the head

the command "fu" or "no" is enough

[alystan]

They will develop some tiny chip with a powerful filling, "drive" it under the operator's skin and connect it to the neural network of his body - as a possible option :)

[Alexfly]

7,62x25 TOK already exists, can be modified ...

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: AlexFly

7,62x25 TOK already exists, can be modified ...

Very much to modify, to alter in fact. But the train of thought is correct.

[Alexfly]

I do not like it because when reloading, all the muzzles crumple from falling to the ground, thin-walled shells ... and a lot of fuss, but the cartridge is powerful ..
Luger practically does not suffer at the same time ...

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: AlexFly

I do not like it because when reloading, all the throats crumple from falling to the ground

A lot of practice? I envy. But practice is similar in a dash, because how about the ground, even trampled earth, can the edge of the sleeve from the TT bend (are we talking about the TT cartridge?)?

[Alexfly]

Quite simply, the sleeves are very thin-walled from TT .. A pebble, twigs, or even another sleeve is enough ... It is a pity that in our country they themselves do not try to develop their own developments, here I am talking about cartridges. The discussion is endless, in short ..

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: AlexFly

Quite simply, the sleeves are very thin-walled from TT.

Interestingly, I did not know for example. Only with submachine guns PM-ovsky yes 12 caliber dealt.

[Nexcom]

It would be better if a new cartridge was developed for the weapon of army self-defense, otherwise the excess 5,45 * 39 and indistinct 9 * 19 have already frayed many nerves here.

To date, there are 9H19 and 7H21 in the 7x31 form factor. More developments are underway. So it's not entirely clear why this form factor did not please in terms of nerve flutter.

as for 5.45x39, the range of ammunition there is still much more than wide.
see for example below.

https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/5,45_%C3%97_39_%D0%BC%D0%BC

The nomenclature is more than sufficient, especially considering the modernization of these ammunition.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Nexcom

To date, there are 9H19 and 7H21 in the 7x31 form factor. More developments are underway. So it's not entirely clear why this form factor did not please in terms of nerve flutter.
as for 5.54x39, the range of ammunition there is still much more than wide.
see for example below.

All this is not news, but for you the concept of PDW (Personal Self-Defense Weapon) looks like a novelty.

[Nexcom]

I am aware of PDW, as well as copies that break about this.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Nexcom

I am aware of PDW.

Then why are the passages about 9 * 19? It has nothing to do with PDW, with any bullet armor-piercing.

[Nexcom]

but I like this ammunition. at least that which is the only one with such widespread occurrence and such a history. yes, it is as ancient as dinosaur poop, but it is still used and continues to improve. If not our so much Westerners, then for sure it is still being processed and improved. Recently, there was an article on VO where it was written that the Americans again sawed down a new modification of this ammunition and by no means for civilian use. However, I will not argue.

Basically - the introduction of a new form factor of ammunition is VERY expensive and you know that. as well as what will entail the emergence of a new form factor in terms of shooting systems.
Specifically, what do you propose within the PDW concept?

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Nexcom

but I like this ammunition

For God's sake. Preferences are like that.

Quote: Nexcom

Basically - the introduction of a new form factor of ammunition is VERY expensive and you know that. as well as what will entail the emergence of a new form factor in terms of shooting systems.

However, in Russia, from 9 * 19, they did not really bother with it, and PDW was also designed to reduce the cost of arming the military of the second line.

[Nexcom]

and the PDW was designed to reduce the cost of arming the military of the second line.

Due to what, let me be curious?

ZY 9x19 began to be produced in the Russian Federation, including because there are a lot of shooting systems for it in the world (which are available in the Russian Federation and are used in the Russian Federation), IMHO.
And under the new form factor, such a shooting system will have to be created anew, it may not be possible to saw through something already existing. At least as far as I know, the normal sequence is to develop a rifle complex for the created ammunition and not vice versa.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Nexcom

Due to what, let me be curious?

Strange, you wrote that you are aware of the concept. The pistol cartridge did not give either armor-piercing or accuracy at 200 m, the submachine gun is expensive in itself and requires heavy and expensive weapons (relatively), the PDW cartridge is not more expensive than a pistol cartridge and is not picky about weapons.

Quote: Nexcom

And under the new form factor, such a shooting system will have to be created anew, it may not be possible to saw through something existing.

It is PDW that quietly admits the simplest automation scheme with a free shutter.

Quote: Nexcom

the normal sequence is to develop a rifle complex for the created ammunition and not vice versa.

And the ideal is to simultaneously create a cartridge-weapon complex.

[Nexcom]

The PDW cartridge is no more expensive than a pistol cartridge and is not picky about weapons.

That's what I asked about. about the rest, I know.

IMHO this is not easy to implement.
If it is brand new.
obviously not in a couple of years it will be possible to solve the problem.
at least cheap. mass production will require both the complex and the ammunition.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Nexcom

IMHO this is not easy to implement.
If it is brand new.

Well, I don't know what's new in the powder cartridge))). And the savings on weapons and ammunition for the second line are obvious. What is the current ratio of infantry to support forces?

[Nexcom]

Quote: Vladimir_2U

What is the current ratio of infantry to support forces?

I do not have such data. and if he did, he would not openly voice them.

[Nexcom]

Well, I don't know what's new in the powder cartridge)))

a new line will have to be created and launched if the form factor is new and different from what is already being produced. and this is money and time. you know that it is VERY expensive to equip the army with new ammunition. it would be so simple - business that would have been first armed long ago. For example, would have long ago abandoned the welted patron (the archaic is still the same). But they continue to stamp it. and why? because the shooting systems for it are produced immeasurably - what to do with them after the transition to a non-entrant? and the welded ammunition itself is also produced in great variety. IMHO.

Threat our country is perhaps the only one who still produces welted ammunition. I'm talking about 7.62x54 R ....
the Chinese do not count. although it seems that they even began to produce their own form factor.

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Nexcom

I do not have such data. and if he did, he would not openly voice them.

And I don’t know, but it’s possible to guess. By the way, I got a little excited about the second line, the tankers still have a first line, but they also need a powerful but compact barrel. And in the second line it is fashionable to boldly define drivers and other logistics, mechanics, staff, air defense, etc.

[Nexcom]

... and special communication.
again, separate signal battalions will also go here (if they still exist).

[Vladimir_2U]

Quote: Nexcom

and special communication.

Shame on me! Svyazyaz!

[Nexcom]

and without communications, nowhere.

By the way, it’s just PDW for communications workers.
I remember very well how the standard 74ka was constantly interfered with in KUNG when going to the landfill and so on. Nafik her. If only there would be a folding stock ...

Threat And I generally can not imagine how the signalmen during the Great Patriotic War with the three-line business did their communications. The three-line is still that "ski".

[Starover_Z]

We are talking about small arms, which will differ from the existing one in the ability to independently analyze and qualify targets, to carry out aimed shooting.

Of course I apologize, but after reading the title, I thought - did our Munchausen have been thrown or connected already to Kalashnikov?

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Starover_Z

Of course I apologize, but after reading the title, I thought - did our Munchausen have been thrown or connected already to Kalashnikov?

Here you are, well done! And then I really thought that I was the only one who remembered about the "smart" Munchausen rifle!

[Snail N9]

And what will it look like? Do you mean small arms with AI? An infantryman will have a submachine gun on his shoulder, like the Predator in the film of the same name with Schwartz? Nonsense. Most likely, this means a self-propelled, robotic shooting complex associated with the shooter, as with an operator. But this is not quite a "small arms", there is only a small arms destruction device, and everything else is a machine, a robot.

[Blackmokona]

Yes, the Americans have been selling smart sights to the civilian sector for a long time, which themselves calculate all the corrections and advances, and also make it possible to press the trigger only with precise aiming where the indicator points.
I think our analogue is being created.
Here is an example with an article
https://topwar.ru/172044-umnye-pricely-smash-2000-izrail.html
American variant
https://warspot.ru/4663-umnyy-pritsel-pomog-lyubitelyu-pobedit-snaypera-profi

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

Immediately imagined the situation, you aim the rifle at a remote target and the system does not give you the opportunity to pull the trigger ... And then another enemy infantryman appears slightly to the side and closer , you should shoot, but the trigger is not pressed until you point where it is programmed, artificial intelligence does not allow .

[Blackmokona]

The same as with the fuse itself, and must instantly click on the machine

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

This is if you have time ... Rather, it will turn out like in a movie, you pull the trigger, and he does , doesn’t listen until you figure it out ..

[Blackmokona]

Also with a fuse. But somehow they don't refuse him

[alystan]

It is noted that when using such a weapon, the fighter will have the main function - making a decision on the use.

The developers decided to immediately "sweep aside" this possibility, otherwise you can dream up to the point that the machines / AI will "get out" from the control of a person or, worse, subjugate him.

[Alexfly]

And for this emergency, you will have a PP-20 in your free hand.

[And Us Rat]

Quote: Snail N9

And what will it look like?

Just like the rest, just later.

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[Andrei Nikolaevich]

For me personally, the less electronics in combat, the better. Soon, a computer or a search engine will be screwed to the AK ..

[Murmur 55]

Terminator and the Rise of the Machines are getting closer ????

[riwas]

In such a situation, the question always arises, does this weapon need an "operator" - a human?

Like Minirex Lobaev.

Minirex is designed to operate in the very last, dangerous section of the advancement of units, to which it is transported in a regular backpack. Its task is to replace people at the most dangerous stages of the operation, associated with entering buildings, moving through the areas under fire, or being on duty in sniper ambushes. Thermal and optical sights allow you to quickly find targets, a ballistic computer - to prepare data for firing, and a shooting module - to hit targets from the first shot.

RS1A3 Minirex is already capable of recognizing faces at a distance of up to 400m, which is enough for urban combat conditions. The existing chassis allows you to overcome small blockages, climb steps and take advantageous positions for shooting.

https://www.popmech.ru/weapon/242222-rs1a3-minirex-takticheskiy-robot-dlya-gorodskogo-boya/

[Andrei Nikolaevich]

Not sure if this Rubric cube is capable of withstanding a sniper.

[Nafanya from the sofa]

Each fighter with an "intelligent machine" will be accompanied by:
1 robotic complex for transportation of a control computer with neural network interfaces and a satellite communication system;
1 robotic complex for transportation of batteries, which supplies power to the system from a computer with neural network interfaces and a satellite communication system;
1 robotic complex with a backup diesel generator to provide power to the system from the computer and .... in case of failure of the robotic complex for transporting batteries ...;
And finally, for every 10 fighters - a robotic complex for transporting spare parts to ensure the uninterrupted operation of a robotic complex with a computer, interfaces ... (it should already be clear even to the generals who finance the development of such crap)

[Eug]

As for me, we are not talking about the actual small arms, but about the orientation, recognition and control system, an electric trigger will be added to the actual small arms. All this is complicated, too many products and decision-making points will need to be connected by a single data network, which is likely subject to "hacking" (ie primitively powerful, albeit local) radio-electronic suppression. As for special operations - yes, for combined arms combat - oh, hardly.

[Serg koma]

Quote: Eug

orientation system, recognition and control

Yeah, real-time tele-picture to the commander

The principles of management are understood as the basic provisions that should be guided by the management bodies in the management of subordinate units and subdivisions.
The basic principles are: one-man management, centralization, scientific approach, foresight, firmness.
One-man management provides concentration of all the rights of leadership of subordinates in the hands of the commander (chief) and makes him responsible for the results and timing of tasks.
The centralization of management allows the senior chief to concentrate the main efforts of subordinates on the solution of the main task and to coordinate the actions of all forces and means.
The scientific nature of management presupposes that commanders (chiefs) take into account and use objective laws and patterns of armed struggle.

- and only when the complex (see fighter ) receives a command from the subunit commander (or AI), in cases where the commander sees an immediate threat to the complex, the weapons handed over to the complex are automatically removed from the fuse,.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

If we are talking about an optical-electronic module on military equipment, then it is also applicable for combined arms combat. For example, to recognize the silhouettes of grenade launchers, early detection of ambushes and proactive guidance of combat modules in the direction of priority targets.
But how this applies to small arms I have a bad idea. If this is just a clever sight, then it's understandable.

[Undecim]

Well, if Airbus, together with Dassault Aviation, based on neural networks, create an aviation combat system (Future Combat Air System, FCAS), which should include a manned sixth generation fighter and unmanned platforms that act as remote carriers and controlled by a human pilot sitting at the helm of such a fighter, why not try to create a shooting complex?

In such a situation, the question always arises, does this weapon need an "operator" - a human?

This is actually not a rhetorical question, which is why Airbus and the German Fraunhofer Institute for Communication, Information Processing and Ergonomics (FKIE) have set up a task force to define and propose ethical and international legal "iron restraints" for such projects.

[Jacket in stock]

Cybernetics...
Electronics....
The network is something distributed, which means there must be remote communication.
So it can be influenced.
Yes, there are ways to improve stability, noise immunity and all that. But still, the reliability is always less than 100%.
Plus, the system should have a means of obtaining information about the target, that is, sensors - optical, IR, radar, acoustic ...
So they can be influenced ...
Although, what am I, a living soldier can also be killed, stunned, injured, scared ... badly fed or prevented from sleeping ...
There is already a question of reproducing the resource, which is faster and cheaper - the women give birth to new soldiers or the factories of new robots will scold.
If, for example, the United States has its own "backyard" with an unlimited number of half-starved people who want to become a citizen and are ready to do a lot for this, do they really need these robots?

[Avior]

Not certainly in that way. A neural network is a control algorithm, not a distribution of elements in space.

[Andrei Nikolaevich]

The jacket is in stock, it is much easier to hire guest workers from the former USSR and only one employee of the migration service is "attached" to them. They are better than any electronics and any robots. Otherwise, there is nothing more reliable than AKM.

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich

gastrobeiter from the former USSR

Yes Yes.
Did you yourself communicate with this audience?
And here a young lady at the bazaar did not hesitate to tell me that Siberia is not a Russian land at all.
Even in Soviet times, not everyone was trusted with a machine gun, and now I would not do it at all.

[Andrei Nikolaevich]

You were unlucky. I had a taxi order. Taxi driver is a graduate of the Physics and Mathematics of Tashkent University. An intelligent, cultured person.

[Vladimir Vladimirovich Vorontsov]

***
- And here put a barrier or a sensible major ...
***

[Avior]

Purely theoretically, electronic elements can be introduced into handguns.
For example, face recognition, with an expanded spectrum, the camera is expanded into the infrared range - it makes it easier to shoot at a disguised enemy. You can also enter an automatic shot - switch the mode, the system calculates the moment of the shot based on weather conditions, barrel heating and other things - you aim, and the weapon makes corrections to the image on the sight screen and shoots at the moment of the most accurate aiming.
Theoretically, it may not be a very heavy device, all these functions are already in the smartphone, not only faces, but also smiles are recognized (it would be nice to determine the moment of the picture, while no one blinks or yawns in a collective photo :)))
But this is all just a theory, and the creation of such a practical device is still in the future.

[SVD68]

Quote: Avior

You can also enter an automatic shot - switch the mode, the system calculates the moment of the shot based on weather conditions, barrel heating and other things - you aim, and the weapon makes corrections to the image on the sight screen and shoots at the moment of the most accurate aiming.

Good idea, but! For an accurate shot, you need to fix the weapon on the target. Even the micro-movement of the shooter knocks down aiming. Those. for an automatic shot, a system is needed that is independent of the shooter's movements or stabilized.

[Avior]

It's hard to get it with manual control

[Sanichsan]

Quote: SVD68

Those. for an automatic shot, a system is needed that is independent of the shooter's movements or stabilized.

write nonsense. similar systems have been tested in the fleet for 100 years. do you know how firing from main battery guns on battleships is organized? Why stabilize the weapon when a shot can be fired if the targeting conditions calculated by the sight are met?

[rotmistr60]

And how much will one such machine cost?

The final terms of development have not yet been reported.

And this is just understandable. While the AI ​​is crammed into a weapon and probably a soldier's helmet, while they teach how to recognize targets, until ... a lot of time will pass. And it will also be necessary to teach the shooter to use this miracle weapon.

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: rotmistr60

And how much will one such machine cost?

How much will it turn out.
AKM is more expensive than "Mosinka", and SVD is more expensive than "Kalash".
The main thing is that the weapon would correspond to the tasks facing the fighter.
And by the way, if a fighter hits the target with the first shot, and does not fire bursts into the white light, you can probably save more on cartridges than a "smart" sight costs.
And if you remember that the killed enemy is not your killed soldier, then the score will turn out to be strongly in favor of a more expensive, seemingly, weapon.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

The technician should be able to recognize targets already now. If only because optoelectronic reconnaissance modules are already being installed on equipment. And the recognition program, in the form of an "engine", as they say among programmers, can be easily transferred to different platforms. Another thing is that it is not clear in what form they want to adapt this to small arms. How unclear these very abilities of recognition, before the flash of a shot, for example from a grenade launcher, or after.

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich

The technician should be able to recognize targets already now. If only because optoelectronic reconnaissance modules are already being installed on equipment. And the recognition program, in the form of an "engine", as they say among programmers, can be easily transferred to different platforms.

So the concern, apparently, began the development of such a platform that could be screwed to hand weapons, and not just carried on a truck.
I remember at school the first time I saw a night sight for a Kalash, I was a lot surprised by its size.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

This is where questions arise. If I already look through the scope, then I know the direction and I will be able to recognize the target on my own. Or will electronics have a wider field of view than the shooter's? There are not enough details yet.

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich

Details are not enough yet

Well, naturally.
Development has just begun.
And we will see what engineers will be able to cram in there in a few years.

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Snail N9

Most likely, this means a self-propelled, robotic shooting complex associated with the shooter, as with an operator. But this is not quite a "small arms", there is only a small arms destruction device, and everything else is a machine, a robot.

Quite a reasonable logical assumption! But I still think that a "smart" shooter is not only a "machine, a robot"; that is, a shooter on the platform ... For example, I recently read how the Israelis with the help of an "automated" machine gun destroyed a terrorist! And there are films with the "participation" of such machine guns ... There is a machine gun in the van alone (!) ... but the machine gunner could have been nearby! And if you imagine a large and important object where there is a guard-operator on duty ... And in the object's security system, "neural network" rifle machines are involved! Such an assault rifle detects, aims, reports ... The operator assesses the situation on the monitors, makes a decision and gives the appropriate command ... exoskeletons on rough terrain with "neural" stormgears, I still can not ... It does not work, sober!

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

I still can't imagine that a battalion of "infantrymen" runs in exoskeletons over rough terrain with "neural" stormgears

Why a battalion?
If each fighter kills the enemy faster than he sees him, then a dozen well-trained fighters armed with smart rifles will kill this battalion in a few minutes.
I had to read how the task of the battle was solved by only a couple of snipers, while the rest stupidly watered the area with bullets from their Kalash.

[Nikolaevich I]

Thank you for comfort! Means, "neural network" ghans for elite super special forces! And the "rank and file infantrymen" will continue to run with their old but dear and beloved Kalash! Something stable in our world!

[Jacket in stock]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

Means, "neural network" ghans for elite super special forces! And the "rank and file infantrymen" will continue to run with the old ones,

And what, somewhere and sometime happens differently?

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Jacket in stock

And what, somewhere and sometime happens differently?

Duc, I'm not indignant! I rejoice !

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

Technological progress in this direction is of course important, but for starters, one must at least make it a rule not to install machine-gun turrets on the roof of equipment without a backup electric drive on the hatches. They learned how to install electric power steering, windshield wipers and power windows on cars, which means that it should not be difficult to adapt a gear motor to the hatch of an armored car in modern conditions, as well as provide for a mount for a sight or a video camera in order to control shooting from the inside.

[Charik]

this is where everything goes