"Red line" for Washington: Ukraine is not accepted into NATO

105

Source: president.gov.ua

Zelensky offended


At the recently concluded NATO summit, a twofold situation developed. On the one hand, Washington and its allies are ready to accept Ukraine and Georgia into the Alliance. And they even officially stated on this matter:

"We reaffirm all parts of this decision (to join NATO), as well as subsequent decisions, including the fact that each partner will be judged on its own merits."

On the other hand, Ukraine was not even provided with an Action Plan for NATO membership. This year marks the 13th anniversary of Brussels' pledges to admit Ukraine and Georgia to a military alliance. Most experts claim that NATO will not shine for Kiev for the next twenty years.




Brussels and Washington are not ready to accept Ukraine into NATO. Source: NATO

Vladimir Zelensky, to put it mildly, is very discouraged by this turn of events. And it can be understood. The West has been persistently feeding Kiev in recent years with promises of military aid, NATO membership and cash subsidies. Now the Ukrainian leadership has actually been left to fend for itself. The incessant construction of Nord Stream 2 adds a special piquancy. Zelenskiy is permanently afraid of losing $ 3 billion annually from gas transit and the potential to be cut off from Russian hydrocarbon supplies. Moscow is closely following the rhetoric of the Ukrainian leader and assures that there are no plans to cut off gas supplies yet.

The ratings of Vladimir Zelensky on the world stage are gradually fading. The president was not invited to the NATO summit, although he clearly belongs to the "sympathizers". Some of his Facebook statements are worth:

“Ukraine is Europe. And we are Europeans. We are the center and heart of Europe. Geography, spirit, values ​​and aspirations. We proved it on the Maidan and we prove it every day, changing our state, building independence and our future, defending the eastern border of Europe. "

Nevertheless, even such sensual statements do not make their way through European leaders. The rhetoric remains the same - we do our best to support Kiev's aspirations to integrate into Europe and NATO, but ... this is where it all ends. No one is ready to take on any obligations - neither Washington, nor Brussels, nor Berlin.

With the Germans at Zelensky in general story sad happened. At the beginning of the summer, German Foreign Minister Heiko Maas openly stated that the Donbass problem cannot be solved by military means and the supply of weapons. The Germans have long become pacifists in this regard and are wary of supplying their own weapon to regions where there is a war. Nevertheless, Kiev complains about the lack of German attention to the problems "eastern ally"And asks for a weapon. At least "night vision devices, equipment for disposal of ammunition, assault rifles».

Having received nothing in the end, Vladimir Zelensky decided to act.

Militarism in Ukrainian


President Biden, whose election was so awaited in Kiev, spoke very characteristically about Ukraine's entry into NATO:

"They still have to solve the problem of corruption and also meet other criteria in order to get an action plan."

The "democratic" Maidan happened seven years ago, but the country has not been able to fight corruption. Although this was one of the slogans with which the Nazi thugs built barricades. Kiev's inability to resolve internal problems naturally repels external partners.

Zelenskiy and his team blame the Russian leadership for this. In particular, this is the opinion of the Minister of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine Dmytro Kuleba, which he expressed the other day on the air of the ICTV channel. A very paradoxical statement from a professional diplomat. Most of the educated public understands that any expansion of the NATO bloc, especially to the east, is perceived by Russia as a challenge. For the sake of ensuring its own security, Moscow must oppose by all means Ukraine's entry into the North Atlantic Alliance. Otherwise, it will untie the hands of hot heads in the Kiev government and potentially allow the deployment of strike systems directly on the border of Russia. In this regard, Vladimir Putin very clearly outlined the corresponding "red lines" to Brussels and Washington:

“Let's imagine that Ukraine becomes a NATO member. The flight time from Kharkov, say, or, I don't know, Dnepropetrovsk to the central part of Russia, to Moscow, will decrease to 7-10 minutes. "

That is, Ukraine's entry into NATO poses the most direct threat to the existence of the Russian Federation. It seems that the message of the Russian president was heard, and after the NATO summit Kiev was again left with only illusions.

"Red line" for Washington: Ukraine is not accepted into NATO
Source: NATO

In response, NATO allies heard only threats from Volodymyr Zelensky. In an interview with Agence France-Presse, Reuters and the Associated Press, the president promised to build the most efficient army in Europe in the near future. The Europeans do not want to arm the Armed Forces of Ukraine - we will do it ourselves and take back the Donbass by force. And there, if it works out, then we will return the Crimea. Zelensky's rhetoric is filled with blatant militarism:

“If Ukraine independently solves this global problem with Donbass, we will have no other way than to become a very strong, most powerful army in Europe in terms of equipment and troops. And for this we will simply spend everything that we have: a lot of human potential, a lot of talented people. Instead of becoming scientists, developing their country technologically, people will think about how to protect their families and homes. There is nothing good in war. "

For such words in a decent society, they are sent to an international tribunal. A typical crime against humanity is the extermination of civilians by the armed forces. And not by simple armed forces, but by the most powerful in Europe. Zelensky goes into hysterics, threatening not only Donbass, but also his own citizens. He promises to use the entire intellectual potential of the country for the needs of the military machine. Naturally, to the detriment of the traditional peace-loving values ​​of the Ukrainian nation. Another equivalent to the Ukrainian repetition of the history of the Third Reich? This is not the first time Zelenskiy has chosen to emulate Nazi politics. Let us recall at least the resonant bill "On the indigenous peoples of Ukraine", which actually appointed Russians as second-class citizens.

The Ukrainian army is the strongest


Leaving aside Zelenskiy's political husk, the question remains - does Ukraine have a "technical" opportunity to become a leading military power? Since independence, the country has seriously undermined its scientific and technological potential. The USSR left Kiev as a legacy of one of the most highly developed republics. For example, in 1990, up to 40% of the entire production potential of Ukraine was involved in mechanical engineering. In further history, the share of industry in the Ukrainian economy only declined. For example: in 2018, industrial production was only 82% of the 2013 level. Is Zelensky trying to raise the technical potential of the army at such a rate of industrial decline? Having chosen at one time the "European" path of development, the Kiev bosses reoriented the country to the service sector. As a result, Ukraine has no industrial reserve for the creation of a modern army. It got to the point that KrAZ, the only manufacturer of army vehicles, is forced to seek salvation in handouts from the United States. Recently it became known that the Americans have allocated about $ 50 million for the purchase of a batch of Kremenchuk trucks. And Kiev buys military equipment either in Belarus or in the Czech Republic. This is the basis for the growth and development of the potential of the Armed Forces.


The military-industrial complex of Ukraine, by definition, will not be able to technically provide the strongest army in Europe. And the purchase of weapons requires billions of dollars. Source: NATO

Zelensky, in a fever, did not take into account another fact. Russia will not detachmentally observe the growth of the military power of its western neighbor. Economically dependent on the transit of Russian gas, Ukraine may lose this stable source of income. Still, a lot of weapons can be purchased abroad for $ 3 billion. But even this will not provide Ukraine with the strongest army in Europe. There is not a single example in modern history when the army became outstanding with imported weapons. Azerbaijan has come close to this, but its power is palpable only against the background of an even weaker Armenia. To build strong armed forces, you need a powerful military-industrial complex, which is absent in Ukraine.

The Ukrainian army will certainly become the strongest in Europe, only this will not happen under Zelensky. With the proper level of diligence, the Armed Forces of Ukraine will achieve hegemony in a few decades. And this is provided that all the countries around will be simple observers and will not do anything.
105 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. -1
    20 June 2021 04: 06
    The red line for Kiev is Minsk-2, which Pleischner confirmed to Stirlitz in Geneva on June 16 ...

    And in general, how long is NATO left to live? "NATO's brain is dead" (c) E. Macron
    "We need a truly European army."
    Vladimir Putin supported the idea of ​​creating a European army, which aroused difficult feelings among European and even more so British and American colleagues.
    It is worth remembering that the recent proposal of French President Emmanuel Macron to create a common European army was based on the fact that the army is needed "to defend against China, Russia and even the United States."

    How long is the EU left? ADG raised the issue of Germany's withdrawal from the EU ...
    The topic has not been disclosed.
    ----
    The US White House temporarily froze the implementation of a plan to provide military assistance to Ukraine, Politico reports, citing four sources.
    The cost of the aid package, which includes the delivery of lethal weapons to Kiev, is $ 100 million. The plan was originally developed in response to "aggressive movements of Russian troops" along the border with Ukraine this spring.
    1. -6
      20 June 2021 06: 37
      Quote: Tank jacket
      The US White House temporarily froze the implementation of a plan to provide military assistance to Ukraine, Politico reports, citing four sources.

      Yes, they denied it long ago.
      Or do you only read news about what you would like?
      1. -4
        20 June 2021 09: 38
        Isn't it all the same to carry out Minsk-2 with or without weapons?
        How long will NATO last?
        How many years will the EU exist in its current form?
        The USA is withdrawing nuclear weapons, nuclear power plants are being closed in the EU, is it because the European Caliphate cannot be trusted with anything nuclear?
        1. -10
          20 June 2021 10: 05
          Quote: Tank jacket
          Isn't it all the same to carry out Minsk-2 with or without weapons?

          No, not all the same.
          If you do it, then you don't need a weapon, give up and that's it.

          How long will NATO last?
          How many years will the EU exist in its current form?
          No one knows,
          but everyone knows how many years Russia will exist in its present form.
          1. +7
            20 June 2021 10: 36
            Whose Crimea, may I ask?
            Russia is not just a country (Russian world) It is a civilization. Therefore, I agree with you, Russia will grow in both territories and peoples, therefore, in its current form, it will not last long. Russia will be much larger than it is now.
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. The comment was deleted.
              1. 0
                20 June 2021 12: 50
                Everything is very simple, otherwise these territories and peoples will fall under the influence of the Anglo-Saxons and they will be destroyed like Indians, or culturally re-educated through LGBT people, etc. In Russia, these peoples will retain their cultural identity.
                Hungary and Poland, for example, do not like LGBT people. Hungarians recently passed a law banning LGBT propaganda.
                1. +7
                  20 June 2021 17: 58
                  Quote: Tank jacket
                  Everything is very simple, otherwise these territories and peoples will fall under the influence of the Anglo-Saxons and they will be destroyed like Indians

                  Now it seems like not the time to destroy the Indians. They're blowing dust off the blacks. But in our country, the friendship of peoples flourishes. The other day in Karachay-Cherkessia they demanded to remove (and did take off) a poster with A.V. Suvorov. They say he oppressed them. This is such a cultural identity. At the cost of the Russians having to remove their greatest commanders from their posters.
                  1. +2
                    20 June 2021 21: 50
                    Quote: Hyperion
                    Quote: Tank jacket
                    Everything is very simple, otherwise these territories and peoples will fall under the influence of the Anglo-Saxons and they will be destroyed like Indians

                    Now it seems like not the time to destroy the Indians. They're blowing dust off the blacks. But in our country, the friendship of peoples flourishes. The other day in Karachay-Cherkessia they demanded to remove (and did take off) a poster with A.V. Suvorov. They say he oppressed them. This is such a cultural identity. At the cost of the Russians having to remove their greatest commanders from their posters.

                    Soon I will have to kneel before the Chechens. Bitter, but it will be so.
              2. +2
                20 June 2021 13: 29
                The life of a resident of modern Lithuania can be summed up in one paragraph: “I don’t want my sons to walk in dresses and kiss the feet of blacks or Arabs. We were all told in Europe life will be better. We have no money. EU laws are higher than ours. Previously, we were led by Moscow, now Brussels. There was a communist ideology, now it is pederastic. " This is how democracy she is in Lithuanian
            3. +1
              20 June 2021 12: 10
              NATO allies heard only threats from Volodymyr Zelensky. <,,,> Zelenskiy's rhetoric is filled with blatant militarism. <...> For such words in a decent society, they are sent to an international tribunal. A typical crime against humanity is the extermination of civilians by the armed forces.

              At the same time, all that Zelensky's party of power "Servant of the People" has succeeded in "intellectually" in Ukraine is to successfully play the piano with a penis and pretend to be transvestites.

              Even Gordon was forced to admit the complete lack of the necessary professionalism among the current cadre representatives in power in Ukraine:
              We (in Ukraine) are now in power just a lot of people! And don't just go comrade, but a lot of uneducated people! Those who do not understand what a state is! Those who have the first entry in the work book "minister" - but this cannot be! At the same time, people in the post of minister openly admit that they are "mentally retarded." Milovanov said that he was "d ...". Maybe he is not "d ..", maybe he is just joking, but the minister simply has no right to let go of such jokes! He is the minister of a European country, He must behave like a minister of a European state ....
              See the detailed video below from 2:19 min.

              Arestovich - KARAMELKA (Ukroklounada!) 27 nov. Feb 2020
              1. +2
                20 June 2021 13: 03
                There is already a public opinion about Zelensky that Zelensky is 1) a drug addict, 2) he cannot be a politician; 3) that Zelensky is a cowardly toy in the hands of inveterate "hawks" of the Bandera-Nazi persuasion - the heirs of WAR CRIMINALS, who even now have blood on their hands in Ukraine ... And therefore Zelensky is also a MILITARY CRIMINAL, for whom the Nuremberg court was longing.
                And that in general Zelensky is the case when it is not a person who paints a place, but a place that paints a person.

                People directly write:
                - Zelensky will not pull Hitler, but he can be Goebbels' secretary. Breshes a green tobacca so that Shirkhan would throw him a bone from his feast. "
                - "Zelensky and his clown criminal leadership are the direct enemies of the people of Ukraine - Russia. They must be zeroed out from our common thousand-year history."
                - "Zelensky is sick, on drugs. By this he contributes to the fall of Ukraine. He needs to be given a medal."
                - "Everything is explained very simply with Zelokh. He is a coward and a pathological one. And all his words and actions come only from this."

                See details - Discussion of Ukraine at the Geneva Summit. Evening with Vladimir Solovyov from 16.06.2021/1/XNUMX @ Russia XNUMX
                [media = https: //www.youtube.com/watch? v = huujvDHI-ko]
            4. -4
              20 June 2021 21: 28
              Quote: Tank jacket
              Whose Crimea, may I ask?
              Russia is not just a country (Russian world) It is a civilization. Therefore, I agree with you, Russia will grow in both territories and peoples, therefore, in its current form, it will not last long. Russia will be much larger than it is now.

              Hahahahahha. What are the prerequisites for the fact that Russia will grow in territories? And I am silent about civilization. The youth is completely Western, what values ​​have Russian culture retained?
          2. -3
            20 June 2021 13: 11
            To catch up, what do you see on this magazine cover?
            1. -4
              20 June 2021 21: 29
              Quote: Tank jacket
              To catch up, what do you see on this magazine cover?

              Now the magazine would judge the case, Germany will not leave the EU, as the EU = Germany. Germany conquered Europe with the help of the economy. And the priest of the defeat of the EU. Remind me how the currency after the dollar is spread in the world? And where is the Yuan in terms of financial turnover?
      2. -4
        20 June 2021 10: 23
        . Ukraine is not accepted into NATO

        Is there a merit of Russia in this?

        What does this mean for us? Can we somehow prevent this? Not? Will something change if Ukraine is admitted to NATO?

        In my opinion - nothing. There, the Americans and so feel at home! Most welcome guests.
        1. -1
          20 June 2021 10: 34
          The realities are such that the Americans were able to divide the once united people and made them hate each other. Putin was unable to prevent this or does not control geopolitical processes at all. Even in my nose.

          Nevertheless, this in no way prevented him from being reputed to be a strong politician, grandmaster, master of cunning plans, multi-moves ... and even now the winner of Biden!
          1. -4
            20 June 2021 12: 27
            Stas! Frankly speaking, as it is not bitter for me to agree with you, it was Putin who turned Ukraine into a state hostile to Russia. And it will be credited to him someday. Instead of wagging his tail to the west, he should have strictly instructed Yanukovych to disperse this hadabuda without hesitation in means when it was still possible. It was even possible to compensate the greedy and stupid neighbor for his personal losses due to the inevitable sanctions. Instead, it was not Ukraine that was raked to the full, but we. Class! He is left with pitiful babble about some "red" lines, if necessary, they will not listen to him, and he has no means to resist. He will not brandish a nuclear baton. I have an immodest desire to ask what color the line now runs along the border of NATO member Estonia, and the Leningrad region, 150 km, if anyone does not know. Or he doesn't give a damn about his native Leningrad
            1. -1
              20 June 2021 13: 59
              Quote: mikh-korsakov
              Instead of wagging his tail to the west, he should have strictly instructed Yanukovych to disperse this hadabuda without hesitation in funds

              Yanukovych, to disperse? You should blame everything on Putin. You need to start with Kravchuk ... or Khrushchev ... or better with Stalin, who pardoned the Banderlog.
              In fact, Yanukovych could not have done anything then ... to ban it, yes. To radically solve this problem, no.
              And yes ... why didn't you go to Ukraine earlier and organize an anti-fascist movement? Why should someone do it for you?
              1. +2
                20 June 2021 15: 07
                To disperse not Yanukovych, but under the banner of Yanukovych. Yanukovych Couldn't Do Anything? I could. Had a Berkut, ready for mockery of himself. break the Maidan, had the Russian population of Eastern Ukraine, which he did not have - it is intelligence and courage. He did not have a clearly expressed support for Russia. It was the Olympics on the one hand, and the risk in Ukraine on the other. And they chose the Olympics, for which they also won. Lukashenka did it, and Maduro did it. A radical solution to the problem? It was and was not needed, it was enough that millions of Ukrainians at that time were associated with Russia, there was no visa-free travel at that time. Even at the end, Yatsenyuk was ready to run away, remember this is his "Bullet in the forehead" It was the defeat of Russia from the Maidan that forced thousands of Russian volunteers to risk their lives, but in vain. We received mockery from Minsk, we received sanctions, and loans and weapons to Ukraine, and this will last for a long time. And NATO is already 150 km from St. Petersburg.
              2. +3
                20 June 2021 17: 50
                Bandera was amnestied by Khrushchev
            2. +2
              21 June 2021 09: 09
              Quote: mikh-korsakov
              It was Putin who turned Ukraine into a state hostile to Russia
              It was Putin who jumped on the Maidan and yelled "mockalyak at gilyak" and "mocked at knives"? Or was he pushing the jumpers to a coup d'etat in Ukraine with his cookies? In your putinophobia and distorting cause and effect, you lose the signs of sanity.
              1. 0
                21 June 2021 11: 58
                There is no Putinophobia! There is a statement of facts. And she is like that. During the turmoil in Ukraine, the Olympics were held in Sochi. There was a dilemma - to openly take the side of the greedy and stupid, but trainable Yanukovych, but not only him - to the side of the heroic golden eagle, to the side of the inhabitants of the southeast of Ukraine, connected with Russia by a common destiny, or to get off with vague statements of non-interference. There were unspoken levers to help Yanukovych - suffice it to recall the brilliantly carried out later operation in the Crimea. which, among other things, showed that then most of the Ukrainian Armed Forces and the Ukrainian Navy went over to the side of Russia. Lukashenka and Maduro are not God knows what geniuses of politics, but we can, when we want. But no - for the sake of the Olympic holiday, what happened was allowed to happen. After that, we received sanctions, the shame of the proceedings with WADA, and Ukraine received loans, military assistance and permission from the West to kill Russian supporters in Donbas with impunity. Where is the ability to foresee, the ability to sacrifice small in the name of the big?
          2. 0
            20 June 2021 14: 15
            Quote: Stas157
            The realities are such that the Americans were able to divide the once united people

            But who, the Americans, destroyed the Union in Belovezhskaya Pushcha?
        2. +7
          20 June 2021 11: 51
          Quote: Stas157
          Ukraine is not accepted into NATO

          Is there a merit of Russia in this? Can we somehow prevent this? Not?...

          You surprise again winked ... So it is only the merit of Russia!
          Question.
          Ukraine wants to join NATO because of Russia?
          Answer: Yes!
          Ukraine is not being accepted (even if for now) into NATO because of Russia?
          Answer: Yes!
          What else is needed? request

          Quote: Stas157
          There, the Americans and so feel at home! Most welcome guests.

          Guest is one thing, tenant is another wink
          1. -4
            20 June 2021 12: 44
            Quote: Terenin
            Ukraine is not accepted (albeit for now) into NATO because of Russia?
            Answer: Yes !

            I have heard this opinion. But only not from the Americans, but from the Russian political analysts, who pushed the crap about the fad in the charter (in a piece of paper, and we know how the West treats papers) of NATO. But here is what Russia itself can really answer (prevent) if Ukraine (Georgia) is admitted to NATO, I never heard that.

            You can also recall the history of the admission of the former Soviet Baltic republics to NATO. How did Russia respond? I can't remember! Will you help me?
            1. +3
              20 June 2021 14: 20
              Quote: Stas157
              You can also recall the history of the admission of the former Soviet Baltic republics to NATO. How did Russia respond? I can't remember! Will you help me?

              It was a failure of our foreign policy and diplomacy. We could not resist, we could not resist.

              Quote: Stas157
              I have heard this opinion. But only not from the Americans, but from the Russian political analysts, who pushed the crap about the fad in the charter (in a piece of paper, and we know how the West treats papers) of NATO.

              And here is a crap, a fad ... like in a kindergarten, by God ...
              If you think globally, then these situations with territorial disputes (Crimea, Abkhazia, South Ossetia) can be circumvented in several ways.
              For example, this clause can be removed from the NATO Charter or softened.
              They can generally close their eyes to this point.
              Or Ukraine and Georgia may recognize the absence of territorial claims and, after joining the Alliance, declare them again.



              Quote: Stas157
              You can also recall the history of the admission of the former Soviet Baltic republics to NATO. How did Russia respond? I can't remember! Will you help me?

              Are you ready to listen? In short, it may take several tens of pages.
              In short ...
              As for Ukraine. Its entry into NATO will mean the emergence of a huge land border between Russia and NATO.
              Let me remind you that today the Alliance borders with Russia in only two places. These are the Baltics and the east of Norway.
              The increase in the land border will lead to the disappearance of the buffer zone in Ukraine. This means that Russia will be forced to significantly increase its armed forces. And first of all, the ground forces. Today their number for the whole of Russia is only 400 thousand people. But the new border with a total length of 2250 km will require new security measures.
              Most importantly, NATO will be able to move its troops closer to Russia.
              This parameter is regulated by an agreement between Russia and NATO, according to which they undertake not to keep significant forces near each other's territories. But a country as large by European standards as Ukraine will allow, at least, to put at least a new NATO army corps in Lviv. And it will be possible to quickly transfer it to the borders of the Russian Federation by rail in the event of an aggravation of the situation.
              If Ukraine joins NATO, the needs of the Cold War era will begin to return. And then the military spending of Germany and other states will increase at least 2 times. And this is tens and hundreds of billions of euros annually.

              Georgia's entry into NATO will make it possible to place a naval base for the entire Alliance, as well as the air force of this bloc, on the eastern coast of the Black Sea. In addition, one should not forget about the land border with Russia and the fact that Armenia, in fact, will be cut off from Russia. It will be surrounded by Turkey, Georgia and Azerbaijan (a little - Iran). In addition, Georgia's membership in NATO will open the entrance to this organization for other countries. The same Azerbaijan, as well as Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan. And if this happens, then in Kazakhstan forces that will also want to join NATO will become more active. That will already be a direct threat not only to Russia, but also to China. Also, Iran may feel the threat from the North Caucasus and Central Asia. As a result, the Caspian Sea may also become an area of ​​increased risk for confrontation.

              In addition, if Ukraine and Georgia join NATO, there will be a risk of some countries leaving the CSTO, which will further hit the defense capability of Russia, and then Russia will have to invest even more funds in defense in the western direction and in the southern military district.
              The Russian army will be even larger. The West does not need this either.
              In addition, Georgia and Ukraine themselves should also understand that their desire to join NATO can make the territories of these countries vulnerable to Russian attacks in the event of a conflict.
      3. +4
        20 June 2021 11: 51
        Zelenskiy's rhetoric seems to have a double bottom.
        If all plans have collapsed, the power is weakening every day and support is melting, then ...

        Operation "Last Carnage" begins! It remains to spend EVERYTHING on the war, take everything away and write off ... And then RUN!

        And become an eternally aching minor clown-ruler in exile, because he will no longer be able to return to comedies. The viewer will openly hate him, and this is not to success ...
    2. +2
      20 June 2021 08: 28
      NATO cannot be underestimated. Sometimes we laugh at this "office". But at the same time everyone understands that there are no fools in NATO. But why does this bloc need Ukraine? To lose the statehood of Ukraine itself?
      1. -11
        20 June 2021 10: 59
        Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich
        To lose statehood Ukraine itself?

        Many people really liked Putin's expression about the loss of Ukraine's statehood. But did he personally do something for this? Can do? Maybe at least turn off the gas? Or take Donbass to your home harbor? Can't do anything.
        1. +8
          20 June 2021 11: 59
          Quote: Stas157
          Many people really liked Putin's expression about the loss of Ukraine's statehood.

          You're right. Many people liked it Yes

          Quote: Stas157
          But did he personally do something for this?
          How did whatbelay And who poisoned the Skripals, Boeing shot down, held elections in the United States, poured powder into the trousers of the codpiece Fuehrer, blew up warehouses in the Czech Republic, launched a cyber attack on the United States ... Now ice in the Arctic is melting ... bully

          Quote: Stas157
          Can do? Maybe at least turn off the gas? Or take Donbass to your home harbor? Can't do anything.
          Clarify, these are questions of joy fellow or regrets? crying
          1. -5
            20 June 2021 14: 28
            Quote: Terenin
            Specify these are questions of joy fellow or regrets?

            I don’t know for you. You, as a true putriot, are ready to rejoice at any crap coming from the king. Whether it's at least a retirement robbery! And from my side, these are not even questions. These are accusations.
            1. +2
              20 June 2021 14: 49
              Quote: Stas157
              I don’t know for you.

              And thank God.

              Quote: Stas157
              You, as a true putriot, are ready to rejoice at any crap coming from the king. Whether it's at least a retirement robbery! And from my side, these are not even questions. These are accusations.
              Well, it started ... winked In each topic again the same thing, "the tale of the white bull." crying Probably carry a photo of Putin in your breast pocket wink ... Nobody talks about him as much as you. No.
              We're talking about NATO three graters.
              1. -6
                21 June 2021 03: 37
                Quote: Terenin
                We're talking about NATO three graters.

                I'm talking about the politics of Russia. If you've read my comments!

                Do you think that the king has absolutely nothing to do with her? What is he doing then?
                1. +3
                  21 June 2021 16: 57
                  Quote: Stas157
                  Quote: Terenin
                  We're talking about NATO three graters.

                  I'm talking about the politics of Russia. If you've read my comments!

                  Do you think that the king has absolutely nothing to do with her? What is he doing then?

                  laughing Didn't I report to you?
                  Catches fish
    3. +6
      20 June 2021 10: 37
      Ukraine has turned into the same girl from the district who
      "and try and praise, but do not marry")
  2. +8
    20 June 2021 04: 33


    Salo dropped!
    1. +6
      20 June 2021 08: 30
      Have you seen the Kiev metro? I was there about five years ago. Complete horror! Dirt and devastation at the stations. The cars are dirty, old. Complete poverty and devastation! What is there to "hide" ?!
      1. +1
        20 June 2021 09: 34
        hi I have not been to Kiev, I was in Kharkov, Poltava and in the sanatorium "Novi Sanzhary" in 1987 with my mother and brother. Then I liked Kharkov. Then later he was in Odessa and Yalta for work points until 2014.
      2. +2
        20 June 2021 11: 03
        Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich
        Have you seen the Kiev metro? I was there about five years ago. Complete horror! Dirt and devastation at the stations. The cars are dirty, old. Complete poverty and devastation! What is there to "hide" ?!
        a sad picture, it turns out. But what is interesting? When they began to build the very first metro in the USSR, the Moscow metro, it was the engineers and workers invited from Ukraine who made a huge contribution to underground construction. After all, it was only there that there was a modern experience for those times. They searched and tried new solutions. The construction costs were huge, they did not want to rise in price by inviting foreigners.
        1. +6
          20 June 2021 11: 39
          from what kind of Ukraine were invited "workers and engineers" ???? The USSR was united and there is no need for your equivalents.
          It's like saying "a milkmaid from independent Tver goes to the independent Kaluga region to share her best practices."
          1. +6
            20 June 2021 12: 22
            Don't find fault with words! It would be easier if I wrote that from the Ukrainian SSR?
            I inform you that under the USSR I lived the first 6 years of my life. There, in the Far East, there were Leningraders, Muscovites, Khabarovsk residents ......., Ukrainians and residents of other republics (they spoke by names) and autonomies. Although the USSR was one. Understand?
            1. +5
              20 June 2021 13: 17
              You squabble and argue in vain. We were all born in a single country - the USSR. Speaking about the Kiev metro, I would like to say about the state of today's Ukraine. I'm not going to feel sorry for them or humiliate them. They (citizens of Ukraine) have chosen their own path. They themselves voted for their power. The result is visible. In other words, Ukraine is like a stupid youngster. She grabbed the guy with the money and left home. She was used and she is no longer needed. Who will use the next one is not clear. But for now, America. But why do we need this girl with a dirty reputation? ... I think we don't want to run to the KVD ..
              1. +6
                20 June 2021 13: 26
                a metro was built in Moscow, a huge city was expanding ..
                and who built it? who helped? the miner in the tunnel was hacked ...
                And I wanted to say that today's degradation of the Kiev metro is doubly insulting. This type of transport brought a lot of joy after the construction ...... Architecture, materials, art compositions. It was more than just transportation. This was the achievement of socialism. What.
                1. +2
                  20 June 2021 13: 28
                  I understand you. But socialism is no longer there. Some memories.
                  1. +3
                    20 June 2021 13: 36
                    These memories of socialism will still be in great demand. No doubt.
                    ... and having changed, we will again, again we will collect brothers ...
                    1. -1
                      20 June 2021 14: 43
                      There will be. Certainly. But what's the point in living with memories?
            2. +2
              20 June 2021 14: 24
              Quote: Reptiloid
              Don't find fault with words! It would be easier if I wrote that from the Ukrainian SSR?

              It was easier to write from Donbass, which had been transferred from the RSFSR 10 years before, so there could not be workers there from Ukraine ...
              1. 0
                20 June 2021 21: 32
                Quote: Lara Croft
                Quote: Reptiloid
                Don't find fault with words! It would be easier if I wrote that from the Ukrainian SSR?

                It was easier to write from Donbass, which had been transferred from the RSFSR 10 years before, so there could not be workers there from Ukraine ...
                and from Donbass, and from other construction sites, I even cited a quote from my poem ----
                .... a miner cut through the tunnel ...
        2. +1
          20 June 2021 14: 20
          Quote: Reptiloid
          When they began to build the very first metro in the USSR, the Moscow metro, it was the engineers and workers invited from Ukraine who made a huge contribution to underground construction.

          Who are the invitees?
          Where they built, there they stayed ... apparently from a good life in comparison with Ukraine.
          Kuzbass, Magnitka, BAM, Celina ... this is all the merit of Ukraine ... yeah.
          Ukraine fed the entire Union ... but why is it now feeding itself on IMF handouts?
          1. +1
            20 June 2021 21: 36
            Quote: Canecat
            Quote: Reptiloid
            When they began to build the very first metro in the USSR, the Moscow metro, it was the engineers and workers invited from Ukraine who made a huge contribution to underground construction.

            Who are the invitees?
            Where they built, there they stayed ... apparently from a good life in comparison with Ukraine.
            Kuzbass, Magnitka, BAM, Celina ... this is all the merit of Ukraine ... yeah.
            Ukraine fed the entire Union ... but why is it now feeding itself on IMF handouts?

            what fantasies about my words? This is your speculation. I'm not talking about the IMF or about food, don't you understand?
            When the first Moscow metro was being built, people were required for all the work. There were many from the villages. But these were unskilled workers.
        3. +2
          20 June 2021 15: 01
          engineers and workers invited from Ukraine

          Dmitry, for the construction of the Moscow metro, first of all, miners-sinkers were attracted, of whom there were a lot in the Donbass (not in Ukraine, no offense to real hard workers and engineers from Ukraine) and with tremendous experience. Yesterday I went to pick up work material from my old electronics engineer (92 years old in the spring, naturally, retired 12 years already), since his father was just building the Moscow metro. As he said, at home there was a whole collection of beautiful stones found during the sinking. It has not survived to date. The father of my employee was a native Muscovite.
          1. +1
            20 June 2021 21: 43
            hi yes, Sergey! You meet interesting people! And often. When I come home, I'll take a look and clarify where it comes from besides Donbass.
            1. +2
              20 June 2021 21: 52
              This Leonid Porfirievich, who is now 92 years old, contributed to my transfer to the optical department in the sector of registration of fast processes in 1995. This is a separate story.
              1. +1
                20 June 2021 22: 01
                You see, when you talk about your work and people, I think that everything good that was in the USSR can still return.
                But the other storyteller has all the dirt negative negative something turns out
                1. +1
                  20 June 2021 22: 22
                  Well, who cares about something, he talks about that. Send more memoirs?
                  1. 0
                    21 June 2021 08: 39
                    Quote: Aviator_
                    Well, who cares about something, he talks about that. Send more memoirs?
                    I've been looking forward to it! good Respect.
          2. +1
            21 June 2021 12: 13
            Greetings, Sergey! I read about the metro, including the Moscow one, books, the Internet, watched movies, stories, a lot of things, I can't find it right away. For example, there was such a wonderful architect Aleksey Nikolaevich DUSHKIN, was born on an estate near Kharkov, where his father worked, studied at various faculties of Kharkov institutes and graduated from the engineering faculty, although he received his diploma much later, already working, because of the Ukrainian language that was not passed! He built large objects, including Dneproges, in a team. He built social cities in Donbass, designed the Palace of Soviets, participating in this competition. He was summoned to Moscow, when in 1932 he was declared the winner of the competition together with co-author Y.N. Dodits (they were friends)
            1. +1
              21 June 2021 12: 22
              He co-built the metro stations --- Kropotkinskaya, Revolution Square, Mayakovskaya, Avtozavodskaya, Poveletskaya, Novoslobodskaya.
              Later he built railway stations in different cities, also Detsky Mir on Lubyanskaya Square, one of the "skyscrapers" and much more ...... Designed, supervised construction, completed. Stalin admired his work.
              One of my books was about workers from some Kharkov factories who came to Moscow to build the metro, but I haven't found it yet.
      3. +3
        20 June 2021 15: 06
        The cars are dirty, old

        Where will they get new ones? Unless someone from the overseas garbage dumps will deliver, after all, they have not established their production.
    2. +3
      20 June 2021 15: 18
      In 1964 I worked as a turner at a factory and sometimes I was put on a machine made in Germany. It had a sign with a Nazi eagle and a swastika on it, so what? These attributes did not interfere with work, the machine worked reliably and sharpened parts, there were also no idiots who would try to knock down this plate. Yes, and the machine was treated with care, like a war veteran. So many years have passed, but the memory of this machine has been preserved.
  3. +11
    20 June 2021 04: 47
    Ukraine is not accepted into NATO
    Well and good.
  4. +7
    20 June 2021 05: 40
    You can't be cute. The West is rich in promises, but practicality is paramount, it's time to understand this and not build castles in the air. In the 90s they also shouted: "the diaspora will help us"! It helped so much that the result is visible on the face ...
  5. +5
    20 June 2021 05: 54
    Well what can I say - well, not destiny, apparently to be a NATO member ... crying And the lord of the chief jester of the circus Ze does not need to make big eyes and indignation ... belay Not grown to the standard ... lol Standardize with Dzhorzhiks ... tongue But next year - (if you survive), I can certainly accept you as a member ... soldier Dreaming, wanting is not harmful, but dangerous to health. wassat
    1. +8
      20 June 2021 06: 53
      so honestly in NATO they said ...
      "each partner will be judged on their own merits."
      So they appreciated it and decided not to accept it. Well, promises can be thrown. And then they clung to corruption! But how can you deal with it if your pockets are not full.
      And Moscow's assurances about gas supplies! There is also the word "bye"! - There is something to lose sleep from Ze! )))
      1. +3
        20 June 2021 09: 26
        Quote: Egoza
        Well, promises can be thrown

        “Promise” does not mean “Marry”.lol
      2. +2
        20 June 2021 22: 07
        And there is a similar example --- Turkey has not been accepted into the EU for many years, but wassat lol promise. Since the last century.
  6. +7
    20 June 2021 06: 03
    When, instead of studying, I played in KVN.
    1. +8
      20 June 2021 08: 10
      Dad said to Zelebobik, learn to read and write will come in handy, and he sold the alphabet for 4 sold, contacted the robbers and decided that the doll could become the director of the puppet theater.
  7. +6
    20 June 2021 06: 31
    Some convulsions ... Total war? With Russia? Oh well...
  8. -8
    20 June 2021 06: 35
    Ospidya ....
    Well, nonsense here on VO began to publish. Every day, a home-grown "analeteg" from kindergarten ...
    I can agree with the author of this opus in one thing, Zelya is hysterical ...
    1. +7
      20 June 2021 06: 54
      Quote: Jacket in stock
      Well, nonsense here on VO began to publish. Every day, a home-grown "analeteg" from kindergarten ...

      Write better and send. Will publish you too
      1. 0
        20 June 2021 08: 50
        Not the fact that they will publish. I communicate with some of the authors. What I have, that they have some materials (especially those related to Ukraine) "wrapped" with innocent postscripts: "a lot of spelling errors" and DR. Although, others - neutral - easily missed.
        1. +2
          20 June 2021 12: 14
          Quote: Leader of the Redskins
          wrapped "with innocent postscripts:" many spelling errors "and DR

          I also covered military topics in the same way, and then a year later similar articles came out from other authors ...
          the point, apparently, is not in mistakes, but in the authors.
          1. +4
            20 June 2021 14: 18
            There is such an observation. I like war films. But one of the members of the editorial board took a liking to the same path.
            And so it turned out - I wrote an article about "cyborgs" and "Cherkassy". And they did not miss them. Although the latter is really devastating. I considered and still consider the film to be unsuccessful.
            But ... The information with the word "Ukraine" is not in the right key, apparently ...
    2. +5
      20 June 2021 12: 06
      Quote: Jacket in stock
      I can agree with the author of this opus in one thing, Zelya is hysterical ...

      The point is different, these Ukrainian authorities deprived of nature think that posting nonsense on Twitter and Facebook is politics. fellow
      Normal countries have ongoing operational activities - from diplomacy to trade - that are supported by information support. A, Zelensky and K think that information support is the activity of the state.
      These farm lads, accidentally getting into big politics, think that you can talk to serious people with slogans? fool
      And when another Kuleba broadcasts something about the "shield of Europe from Russian aggression" (and that therefore someone owes something to Ukraine, yeah), then they look at him as a moron (which he is, in fact) - because these are the Anglo-Saxons, their masters, invented this slogan to brainwash the natives, and it does not work for them No.
  9. +8
    20 June 2021 06: 43
    Zelensky needs a "road map" to NATO more for the rating. In fact, Ukraine has military-technical cooperation with the United States, Canada and especially Turkey. The offended "non-Europeans" found each other. In the end, it was clearly not the comedian's ancestors who wrote offensive letters to the Turkish sultan.

    [quoteZelensky in a fever did not take into account one more fact. Russia will not detachedly observe the growth of the military power of its western neighbor.] [/ Quote]

    The Russian Federation has been "watching from a distance" for almost 7 years.
    1. +5
      20 June 2021 12: 16
      Quote: samarin1969
      The Russian Federation has been "watching from a distance" for almost 7 years.

      That's right, in quotes Yes
      Everything that has been performed in Kiev for the last couple of weeks is pure hysteria, from despair and fear. And they have every reason for this.
      Navalny is sitting. Protasevich sings in falsetto. The Maidan opposition in Russia and Belarus has been defeated, and there are practically no hopes for a coup d'etat. The IMF does not give money. Nord Stream 2 is almost completed.

      As the predecessor of the current clowns, the head chieftain Petliura, said in the film "Shchors" am
      Where is the joy of victories?
      1. +8
        20 June 2021 12: 19
        Quote: Terenin
        As the predecessor of the current clowns, the head chieftain Petliura, said in the film "Shchors"
        Where is the joy of victories?

        hi
        There is a good continuation lol

        Simon Petlyura: Where is the joy? Where is the joy of victory ?! I'm asking you, me! Head ataman, me!
        Panove Directory, something must be done! Look around, the workers are looking like wolves, the Jews are hiding, the Bolsheviks are scurrying about in the barracks.
        Panove Directory, something needs to be done, concretely, concretely!
        Panas Andrievsky: I specifically propose to serve prayers in all Kiev churches!
  10. +7
    20 June 2021 07: 51
    some experts argue that NATO will not shine for Kiev for the next twenty years.
    Will Ukraine survive such a period? It is not clear what will become of her in 10 years, let alone 20.
    Ukraine is Europe. And we are Europeans. We are the center and heart of Europe
    Of course, he bent about the "heart", and thoroughly. If Ukraine is the heart, then what do Germany and France represent? Are they not appendages?
    turn into a very strong, most powerful army in Europe in terms of equipment and troops
    I will not say about the army, because in the case of aggressive actions, it may not come from the word at all. But today's Ukraine will lose its territories for sure. The same "democratic" Europe will gladly cut itself a piece. Poland with Hungary for sure.
    1. +2
      20 June 2021 08: 22
      Quote: rotmistr60
      Europe will gladly cut itself a piece. Poland with Hungary for sure.

      And the population of these "pieces" will not protest against this! on the contrary! with a joyful squeal will join the "European countries"
    2. +2
      20 June 2021 14: 49
      We are the center and heart of Europe

      Not a heart, that's for sure. If they will be taken to Europa, then as another part of the body. Everyone knows which one, it's obvious.
  11. +2
    20 June 2021 08: 08
    The Ukrainian army will definitely become the strongest in Europe [/ b], but this will not happen under Zelensky
    ????? write in riddles, the author. request And in comparison with whom, or rather with what tribe in Africa?
  12. +3
    20 June 2021 08: 41
    The court jester went into a rage, putting on the UPA suit and playing the role of the Gauleiter of Ukraine.
  13. -2
    20 June 2021 10: 34
    Volodymyr Aleksandrovich is going the right way ......... to suicide, your own and Ukraine.

    1. +1
      20 June 2021 11: 45
      Do not shame by comparing the name of one of the greatest politicians of the XNUMXth century and some third-rate clown.
      By the way, the Ukrainian army was already the strongest in Europe, except for the Russian Federation, after the collapse of the USSR.
  14. +1
    20 June 2021 11: 00
    Quote: prior
    Volodymyr Aleksandrovich is going the right way ......... to suicide, your own and Ukraine.


    Damn ... winked well, exactly Aldofovich ... belay So it will be, Ukraine will be in the bose of history, since Ze is tearing up his soft spot in the tseurop so much ... wassat
    1. +1
      20 June 2021 11: 35
      Do not stick this weirdo's father, he was correct in comparison with the son. Just write Vladimirko.
    2. +1
      20 June 2021 15: 12
      Not exactly. The Fuhrer had much less bloods from God's chosen people. Here - 100%.
  15. +3
    20 June 2021 11: 33
    NATU is afraid of embarrassment against Ukraine. After all, all NATA is against the most powerful army on the planet, Ukraine, like a fly against a sparrow.
  16. +4
    20 June 2021 12: 10
    Who needs traitors? I definitely don't. Maybe NATO? As we can see, no, because they will surrender NATO in the same way as the USSR and Russia. Betrayed once, betrayed twice.
  17. 0
    20 June 2021 12: 18
    One thing is clear that they do not take it YET.
    But they actively cooperate and promote.
    Moreover, the European NATO is no match for the United States. Which does much more militarily. And the EU economically.
    Wishlist does not always coincide with opportunities.
    However, for Ukraine it has long been clear that everything itself. As they fought, they are fighting themselves. No one will fight for them.
  18. +2
    20 June 2021 12: 31
    This is not comforting news for the Russian Federation. Ukraine is an encumbrance. NATO will not fight for Ukraine, but will use it in full. Ukraine is Anti-Russia on Russian territory.
  19. +4
    20 June 2021 12: 40
    There is not a single example in modern history when the army became outstanding with imported weapons. Well said!
  20. -1
    20 June 2021 13: 27
    Zelensky offended

    And what was he hoping that everyone would start kissing his gums with him ..?

    The drain went to the outskirts .. bully
  21. +1
    20 June 2021 14: 46
    The ratings of Vladimir Zelensky on the world stage are gradually fading.

    Have they ever been different from zero?
  22. +2
    20 June 2021 15: 09
    Honestly, it's a shame for the Little Russians when they are driven by KVN-shchik and Co.
  23. +4
    20 June 2021 16: 02
    We proved it on the Maidan and we prove it every day, changing our state, building independence and our future, defending the eastern border of Europe. "


    You have proved that you can only destroy, and building and creating is not yours ...
    1. +1
      20 June 2021 21: 54
      Quote: cniza
      ..... You have proved that you can only destroy, but building and creating is not yours ...
      hi good evening to you! To add to the above - to lie, to show off better every day
  24. -1
    20 June 2021 16: 56
    Zelensky is a puppet of benny kolomoisky.
    Given beni's toxicity, green has zero chances for NATO and the EU.
    But the general trend has not gone anywhere!
    Ukraine will join NATO not in 5 but in 10 years.
    This is the reality that you have to put up with.
    In fact, Crimea is too expensive in its strategic design.
    But this great geostrateg has gathered and raked his descendants.
    1. +2
      21 June 2021 08: 05
      Quote: dgonni
      Ukraine will join NATO not in 5 but in 10 years.

      Ukraine will not join NATO in 5 years or 10 years, because not a single NATO country wants to fight for Ukraine under the NATO Charter. But NATO will necessarily use the territory of Ukraine to the last Ukrainian in its colonial interests and at the same time without bearing any official responsibility for its people and its statehood.
      This is the fate of Ukraine.

      In addition, the plans of the US State Department regarding Ukraine were announced by H. Clinton when she was still head of the US State Department, during her presidential race in the United States, which she lost to Trump.

      According to the plans of the US State Department, the territory of Ukraine is needed by the United States to relocate part of the American population from the territory of the United States. Moreover, in American Ukraine, according to Washington, there should be no more than 20 million people. - together with American settlers.
      It is noteworthy that at the same time, the Ukrainian Zionist Igor Berkut, with his project to create a second Jewish state on the territory of Ukraine ("Israel-2") called "Heavenly Jerusalem" in this regard, on February 11,02, 2011, also determined that the "Ukrainians" in Ukraine, in general, no more than 5 million people are enough, and the "superfluous" others must be biologically "utilized".

      At the same time, Hillary Clinton let slip that those Ukrainians who do not self-destruct and do not die in the civil war, as well as who themselves do not emigrate from Ukraine, the US State Department plans to forcibly evict to the countries of North Africa and the BV.

      Ukraine will have enough 5 million inhabitants, the rest will be disposed of by Igor Berkut.
  25. 0
    20 June 2021 20: 14
    Well, let's start collecting "Nelokh" for the "best" army using SMS. wassat
  26. +1
    20 June 2021 22: 54
    And in my opinion, only Kiev still has no idea that Ukraine is not interested in any occupants and invaders. Currently, the saying is applicable to it: "We lived in poverty, and then we were robbed."
  27. +1
    21 June 2021 03: 05
    When the union collapsed, the Ukrainian army was practically the most powerful in Europe, although there is no point in writing about it
  28. +1
    21 June 2021 07: 29
    [quote = Canecat] [quote = mikh-korsakov] You should blame everything on Putin. We need to start with Kravchuk ... or Khrushchev ... or better with Stalin, who pardoned the Banderlog. [/ quote]
    Stalin gave amnesty to Bandera?
  29. 0
    21 June 2021 10: 21