Military Review

Why a system of permanent deficit developed in the USSR: on the causes of problems with the availability of goods

421

The proverb “If you stand in line well, you don't have to work” - this is precisely about him, about the deficit, which the opponents of the Soviet state included among the primary reasons for the need to change the existing economic system. Indeed, a number of goods in the USSR could be bought with great difficulty, small towns and countryside were supplied worst of all, best of all - Moscow, Leningrad, Sevastopol, as well as several capitals of the union republics, primarily the Baltic ones.


So why is there a system of total deficit in the Land of Soviets?

The main reasons for the deficit were the uneven distribution of goods, underproduction of a number of them, as well as the lack of competition. Illiterate planning led to the fact that from the side of the USSR it really looked like a very strange state in which spaceships are made, powerful weapon, but at the same time they cannot provide citizens with beautiful and affordable clothes, furniture, household appliances and even toilet paper.

What can I say, if food products by the end of the existence of the Soviet state could not be obtained all and not everywhere. So by the end of the 1980s, in many settlements of the USSR, there were interruptions in the supply of such goods as condensed milk, natural coffee, cocoa, boiled and smoked sausages, dishes, and children's toys.

The purchase of a TV set or, for example, a good carpet was previously a fairly large-scale project for the average Soviet person, and the point is not even the cost, but the availability of goods. Scarce goods were in high demand and immediately disappeared from sale after they appeared in stores. They were bought up, and not in all cases by especially lucky ordinary consumers, and often by speculators - with the aim of subsequent resale.

In addition, the deficit was actively supported by interested actors of all levels, including the managers of stores and warehouses, who were interested in keeping the counters empty - then the same product could be sold at higher prices from the “back door”.

Despite the fact that speculation was a criminal offense in the USSR, many people were engaged in it, who, by the nature of their occupation, had access to the distribution of goods. The scales were different, but directors of enterprises, storekeepers of warehouses or shop assistants could sell goods “to the left”. This is a human factor that also contributed to the growth of deficits in the existing socio-economic system.

At the same time, decades after the collapse of the Soviet system, one can come to the conclusion that the authorities of the late USSR were not interested in overcoming the deficit. For example, the theme of scarcity was played up in the works of many Soviet filmmakers and humorists, and thus prepared the ground for dissatisfaction with the existing system: the average man got used to the fact that scarcity is an integral attribute of the socialist economy, while receiving fragmentary information about “breaking counters” in the West.

By the end of the 1980s, a stable group of people had already formed in the Soviet elite who were preparing the destruction of the state and the socialist system, and with its submission, a policy of deliberate sabotage and disruption of supplies was carried out in order to create an artificial shortage even for those goods that were not previously in short supply.

The former head of the Soviet government, Nikolai Ivanovich Ryzhkov, wrote about this, in particular, in his book "The Main Witness". Interestingly, for more than five years Nikolai Ivanovich held the post of, as they would say now, prime minister, but he could not change the situation - it turns out that the backers of the artificial deficit were much more influential than even the head of the Soviet government.

Of course, the shortage of goods in itself could not cause the death of the Soviet country, but it was fully used - both in the socio-economic and ideological plans by those forces that were interested in the collapse of the socialist system. Even now, thirty years after the collapse of the USSR, the favorite argument of critics of the Soviet regime is the words about the notorious one sort of sausage in Soviet stores.

On the other hand, the state itself often did not allow itself to arrange general abundance, since the factor of the income of Soviet citizens played its role. For the overwhelming majority, the incomes were about the same, if we do not take into account the same speculators or representatives of the "elite". The elites could afford everything any day, and there was no point in increasing the production of goods for ordinary Soviet citizens, as the heads of industrial enterprises themselves admitted: demand did not lead to supply, since the state was still the financial regulator in the end. The prospects for the emergence of private property in the USSR were looked at, to put it mildly, with caution, perhaps, as a result, having missed an important stage of reform.

Now - another extreme: there are a lot of goods, but ... the same sausage, to put it mildly, is not always distinguished by the quality or at least the presence of meat. And by no means all Russian citizens today can afford to buy what is necessary for a full life.
Author:
Photos used:
https://nstarikov.ru
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  1. apro
    apro 13 December 2020 14: 54
    -30%
    Oh .... it’s a good topic to grieve how poorly they lived in the USSR. There were not enough sausages and jeans. It’s not enough to get diffsit ... and the communes kept trying to themselves.
    1. Chizhov Kirill
      Chizhov Kirill 13 December 2020 14: 59
      -31%
      and it was not so? Well, tell me how well they lived, sang songs, jumped over bonfires in a pioneer camp, etc.
      1. apro
        apro 13 December 2020 15: 01
        -26%
        Quote: Kirill Chizhov
        and it was not so? Well, tell me how well they lived, sang songs, jumped over bonfires in a pioneer camp, etc.

        This is communist propaganda ... the communists forced to live, the counselors jump over the fire, the teachers in the totalitarian school sing songs ...
        1. nnm
          nnm 13 December 2020 15: 08
          +18
          Yes, from communism, after Khrushchev, only one name remained ... And the more years passed, the more the essence changed with the obligatory external manifestations.
          1. Vladimir Mashkov
            Vladimir Mashkov 13 December 2020 17: 53
            +28
            EVERYTHING is much more complicatedthan Ilya stated. And these topics (yesterday and today) much more voluminous.

            The USSR has had many shortcomings lately. But the USSR did not need to be destroyed, but carefully restore and improve. Unfortunately, the power ended up with crafty traitors and greedy fools who, with the help of corrupt deceitful scribblers, turned the people around ...
            Likewise, now there are a large number of shortcomings, but there are also positive changes. But even now it is also necessary to act in a smart way: not to destroy, but to restore and improve, to develop Russia using all the good that was in its history.
            1. lucul
              lucul 13 December 2020 20: 43
              0
              The USSR has had many shortcomings lately. But the USSR did not have to be destroyed, but carefully restored and improved

              Everything was possible - but who would give us? Under our wealth, derivatives were issued thirty years ago (1991 minus 30 years))))
              I consider the shortage of food in the USSR to be art, just like the artificial shortage of food in tsarist Russia in 1917, as well as the creation of food chains in modern Russia that are not controlled by the state and unreasonably high prices. All these are links in one chain, and our government does not draw conclusions from this - we have not had food security for a long time.
              Putin only now realized this and began to fumble in this direction.
              1. Salty
                Salty 13 December 2020 20: 54
                -5
                Quote: lucul
                I think the food shortage in the USSR is art

                Ufff ... he wasn't "artificial". As for agriculture - labor productivity was ... none. And from what was collected - most of it safely rotted in vegetable depots. For example.

                I saw it myself, don't argue, it's not worth it.

                Quote: lucul
                we have not had food security for a long time. Putin only now realized this and began to swarm something in this direction

                Well, why so categorically? Do you remember "Bush's legs"? I remember them very well ... And now - here:


                This is also true, "purely for example" yes
                1. lucul
                  lucul 13 December 2020 21: 01
                  +4
                  Ufff ... he wasn't "artificial"

                  Yes ? And what happened to the products of meat processing plants and fish complexes, dairies and other food industry enterprises of the USSR?
                  The paradox - the enterprises are working at full capacity - and the shops, the shelves are empty, where does everything go?
                  Or would you deny that food businesses were running at full capacity?
                  1. Salty
                    Salty 13 December 2020 21: 06
                    -3
                    Quote: lucul
                    And where did the products of meat processing plants and fish complexes, dairies and other industrial enterprises go?

                    And how much was that product? Well, and a couple more questions arise ... okay, I won't talk about sad things.

                    Medical fact: Moscow, for example, in the 70s and beyond (did not find it before, excuse me) - lived normally, in the sense of eating. The nearest suburbs, at the same time - no longer, again - I saw myself (c).

                    Everything else, sorry, there is Dima-Gogia request
                    1. lucul
                      lucul 13 December 2020 21: 14
                      +4
                      And how much was that product? Well, and a couple more questions arise ... okay, I won't talk about sad things.

                      Quite on their toes - people who worked at meat processing plants and fish farms from 1960 to 1991 did not notice changes in the released shaft of products, that is, the enterprises both worked and work - you cannot deceive people. Where, which of the workers would say that the meat processing plant produced, for example, 5 tons of meat per month in 000, and in 1980 it began to produce only 1988 tons of meat per month? There are no such . People worked, and did not notice the changes, and the shops were empty.
                      1. Salty
                        Salty 13 December 2020 21: 18
                        +2
                        Quote: lucul
                        ... in the month 1980, and in 1988 ...

                        Ah ... so you mean preparing for a disaster? Toda yes, I agree.

                        The funny thing is that the deficit grub some food categories - it did not start in 88, but much before. What I said above, in fact,.
                      2. major147
                        major147 13 December 2020 22: 07
                        +8
                        Quote: lucul
                        who worked at meat processing plants

                        My father-in-law in the 80s worked as a forwarding agent at a sausage factory in Rostov n / a. Had a 3-room cooperative apartment - full "stuffing" and a new VAZ car. As he told me, you need to know to whom, what and when to take. This is the secret of success in the USSR.
                      3. sniperino
                        sniperino 14 December 2020 08: 02
                        +9
                        Quote: major147
                        know to whom, what and when to take. Here is the secret of success in the USSR
                        Not money-commodity-money ', but links-commodity-links'. The same money, in the presence and absence of "blat", had different purchasing power.
                    2. Cube123
                      Cube123 13 December 2020 22: 37
                      +5
                      Quote: lucul
                      Where, which of the workers would say that the meat processing plant produced, for example, 5 tons of meat per month in 000, and in 1980 it began to produce only 1988 tons of meat per month? There are no such . People worked, and did not notice the changes, and the shops were empty.

                      There is a simple answer to this question. In 1988 the Law on Cooperation was adopted. He opened the possibility for cooperatives to cash out non-cash government funds. Until that time, the USSR had a rigidly balanced amount of cash from the population and the mass of goods in stores. And since 1998, cooperatives have begun pumping the entire cashless turnover of state-owned enterprises into cash. State enterprises did not have such a right, but cooperatives - please. The volume of cash grew exponentially, but it was not backed by real goods. As a result, everything was swept off the shelves, including cooperatives for resale. Until this year, the population simply did not have the money to empty the counters.
                    3. Cube123
                      Cube123 13 December 2020 22: 56
                      +1
                      Sorry, wrote winked
                      The year is everywhere - 1988.
                    4. sniperino
                      sniperino 14 December 2020 08: 34
                      +3
                      Quote: Cube123
                      A year everywhere - 1988
                      Long before this law, we could see pictures like this

                    5. Cube123
                      Cube123 14 December 2020 13: 54
                      +2
                      Quote: sniperino
                      Long before this law, we could see pictures like this

                      Yes, there were queues even before 1988. But such totally empty counters, as in the photo of the author of the article, were not in the USSR until this year.
                      And in general, this does not mean that people were dying of hunger at that time. Emaciated dystrophics are not visible in these photos.
                    6. sniperino
                      sniperino 14 December 2020 17: 04
                      +2
                      Quote: Cube123
                      it does not say that people were dying of hunger at the time
                      Who says this? Did you hear a voice? Happened, maybe ...
                  2. iouris
                    iouris 16 December 2020 13: 19
                    0
                    This is the queue for tickets to Turkey.
          2. major147
            major147 13 December 2020 22: 02
            +1
            Quote: SaltY
            Medical fact:

            I have sons born in the mid 80s. So they had to go from Rostov n / D to Donetsk, Makeyevka and Lugansk to buy flannel diapers.
            1. Lycan
              Lycan 15 December 2020 14: 45
              +1
              This, perhaps, can be described as the failure of not the system, but of its underdeveloped consumer trends, recognized by "individuals" as irrelevant.
              Here is an interesting article about it:
              Why Khrushchev destroyed the Stalinist artels
              https://topwar.ru/169394-pochemu-hruschev-unichtozhil-stalinskie-arteli.html
            2. volodimer
              volodimer 15 December 2020 16: 00
              +1
              They could have driven the father-in-law ... especially since he was wearing something. He would probably have come to an agreement with the local forwarder ... You shouldn't have written about him ...
              That's because of those with a 3-room and a new VAZ, who knew "to whom, what and when to take" and to whom OBKhSS did not reach now and whine about the lost. I understand that he is not you, that many have done this, but this is not an excuse.
            3. major147
              major147 15 December 2020 17: 03
              -1
              Quote: volodimer
              They could have driven the father-in-law ... especially since he was wearing something.

              So I drove on his typewriter, then with his wife, then with his mother-in-law.
              Quote: volodimer
              now we whine about the lost.

              I have nothing to whine about, I have not lost anything. That's why I ended my service as a major because I was not a member of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union and the service went up only after the abolition of the "organizing and directing" ...
            4. volodimer
              volodimer 15 December 2020 18: 04
              +3
              Of course, that such a son-in-law of an opportunist could lose and himself, it seems, is the same opportunist. Oh, did the CPSU spoil your service on purpose? Or just there they immediately understood your essence. If not for the "organizing and guiding", then of course you would have a general's shoulder straps ... as now.
              Yes, I regret what I lost, probably because dad is not a forwarder of a sausage factory, and mom, working in the expert examination of the USSR Chamber of Commerce and Industry, did not allow store directors to steal, but helped the OBKhSS to plant people like your father-in-law. And to buy a toilet, they took the bus ...
              We are different, you can minus. Don't answer.
            5. major147
              major147 15 December 2020 22: 49
              +1
              Quote: volodimer
              Don't answer.

              And I will answer. Since you are addressing me personally, write "you" with a capital letter, otherwise it does not look pretty.
              You don't know anything about me, just like I about you, but unlike you, I don't publish my opinion about you here, although undoubtedly it (opinion) exists.
              I could give a bunch of information about the OBKHSS "struggle" with criminals, but I won't. It is possible that your parents were honest people and sincerely helped the "organs". And there was nothing to plant my father-in-law for, he did not steal anything. He helped people to get the deficit, which the communists strenuously created for the people, although they themselves did not need anything. After all, you must agree that if you are not an employee (regional committee, city committee, etc.) you will not see a deficit ...
              Quote: volodimer
              Oh, did the CPSU spoil your service on purpose?

              You apparently do not know that it is extremely problematic for a non-member of the CPSU to move "in the service", especially when you do not want to be in its ranks on principle. How I laughed when, before the 1991 putsch, all the party members had already been left to fend for themselves by the communists, and now on August 19! And the party organizer of the subdivision frantically collected party dues and rules the minutes of meetings, which had not been there for several months! But all to dust. All the hypocrisy of the communists at once (for the umpteenth time) got out.
              Quote: volodimer
              seems to be the same opportunist.

              This is yes! I famously "adapted" to the service. Budyonnovsk, both "Chechen" unit commanders. It's certainly not OBKHSS to help, but it's also worth something. Some sufferers of communist paradise may become jealous.
              At the end of the service, my colleagues who had previously gone into business, tk. I was not considered a "rubber-technical product"; I was offered the position of head of a department at a large enterprise. For six and a half years I was there "adjusting" 6 - 7 days a week, and by the hour so completely without a limit. Apparently "adapted", appointed a deputy. director, and then director. But the work schedule "did not suffer" from the promotion, and so he earned for the benefits for his family. But in the days of the USSR, who would have appointed me the director of an enterprise without "membership", no matter what my business qualities? Answer yourself to my question, I don't need it. Do not be ill.....
  • stalki
    stalki 15 December 2020 08: 21
    -1
    Ufff ... he wasn't "artificial". In agriculture - labor productivity was ... none
    Nonsense about performance. The root of all troubles in the Soviet Union is in a certain stratum of society. Correctly, the colleague mentioned above that after the crust, decay began. The internal concept of management was formed for an idealized society, it was this stratum that did not want to follow the ideals. She followed the animal wishlist. It's all about human vices. For example, everyone knows about religious precepts and ideals, but most of the planet is not even going to follow them. Well, after that you have to shout at all corners that religion is evil? The question is rhetorical. wink
  • EvilLion
    EvilLion 14 December 2020 10: 00
    -5
    And what is considered artificial? Is it artificial that the kulaks profited from high prices for bread and regularly staged famines until 1933, when their people and the Soviet government were finally slapped together?
    1. Kart
      Kart 14 December 2020 14: 47
      -1
      And after 1933, how was everyone slapped - there was abundance?
      1. EvilLion
        EvilLion 14 December 2020 15: 58
        0
        Abundance, not abundance, but there was no more famine in the USSR, except for the post-war 47th year. True, not because the kulaks were slapped, but because the collective farms and MTS with tractors came, but the kulaks were slapped because they resisted it.
        1. Kart
          Kart 15 December 2020 09: 40
          +2
          That is, it was not in the Soviet newspapers.
    2. Vadim237
      Vadim237 15 December 2020 22: 48
      +1
      For that, starting from the 41st, Hitler's troops slammed 90000 collective farms and 2800 state farms, tens of millions of head of cattle and more than 70000 villages and villages, as well as 28 million Soviet citizens - after such a blow, the Union of Artists of the USSR could not recover until 91.
  • Overlock
    Overlock 13 December 2020 15: 58
    +39
    Quote: apro
    The communists forced to live.

    you see, they were forced, a slave.
    1. Kart
      Kart 14 December 2020 14: 49
      +5
      No, he was the boss.
      I have such a friend, an elderly woman. Daughter of the 2nd secretary of the district committee.
      So she still has nothing to prove and explain. She is sure that everything was just fine, both with food and with goods. Tells how they lived together - they went to visit each other to dachas.
      We had a different USSR.
      Which is especially cynical against the backdrop of stories about social equality and so on.
      1. sniperino
        sniperino 14 December 2020 18: 02
        +3
        Quote: Carte
        Which is especially cynical against the backdrop of stories about social equality and so on.
        Against their background, the West looked more attractive, more honest. Although they did not hide the fact that they are predatory and self-interested, and these are the spitting image of "servants of the people" (look to the left).
        1. Kart
          Kart 15 December 2020 09: 48
          +2
          There was such a famous anecdote about Brezhnev, of course.
          To make it clear, a little explanation. Soviet vodka for the people was produced with such foil corks with such a special tongue - he pulled on it, and the cork fell off. And then suddenly some rationalizers decided to remove this tongue, and the citizens began to open this business with a knife or simply with their teeth. Elite sorts of vodka (or foreign production) were with screw caps.

          "It means that the workers are addressing a letter to Leonid Ilyich - Dear our general secretary, thank you, we live well, only now it has become very inconvenient to open vodka.
          It came to Brezhnev, he read, thought, went to the refrigerator, took out a bottle, unscrewed the cork ...
  • nnm
    nnm 13 December 2020 15: 01
    +18
    Well, why is this distortion? One of the reasons that in the 90s the people rushed to the west in search of 20 varieties of sausage and there were mistakes of both the State Planning Commission and the government in determining the priorities for the country's development. People want and deserve to live not only by rubbing the fifth point with the Pravda newspaper with the next speech of the Secretary General. The country should live for the people, not the people for the country. Or maybe the USSR could not notice this disproportion in production in time and change it? I could! But he did not want to, because the likes of Khrushchev began the Ryazan experiment, and so on. And they could have just stopped this problem at the very beginning, and then the fate of the union, perhaps, would have been different.
    Why, having a huge number of advantages in the form of medicine, education, social equality, did the country collapse so easily? Yes, because the internal traitors simply bought its population with trivial things - jeans, sausage, etc. But this could have been easily avoided. But who exactly brought the country to a deficit in everything and everyone ...
    1. apro
      apro 13 December 2020 15: 08
      +18
      Quote: nnm
      Well, why is this distortion?

      Yes, because now, without a smile at those problems of the past, you will not even look ... neither you credit, nor unemployment, not an eternal shortage of money, you are not waiting for any package from the state, from your fellow citizens.
      1. nnm
        nnm 13 December 2020 15: 12
        +8
        Is it true or what ?! The film "Afonya", remind you? Or plots from "The Wick"? Or about Shurik at a construction site? Or do you think that all these plots are sucked from the finger? And do not compare with the mess that is happening now. We are talking on a specific topic, in relation to a specific historical segment.
        1. apro
          apro 13 December 2020 15: 17
          +9
          Quote: nnm
          Is it true or what ?!

          Yes, it’s true. Then people were freer. And more protected. There were problems, but there were enough solutions. And there were prospects.
          1. nnm
            nnm 13 December 2020 15: 23
            +8
            Oh, not that word! I remember how, being on the council of a pioneer organization, at the city committee I asked a question about why schoolchildren were not paid money for picking potatoes on the collective farm. Oh, I felt freedom then to the fullest ...
            Yes, there were no prospects without changing the nursing home in power. The whole country since the days of Khrushchev simply plunged into a swamp.
            1. apro
              apro 13 December 2020 15: 28
              +17
              Quote: nnm
              I remember how, being on the board of a pioneer organization, at the city committee I asked a question about why schoolchildren are not paid money for picking potatoes on the collective farm

              We were paid 5 or 3 rubles for the labor camp. I won't say for sure. But we worked half a day, fed 4 or 5 times a day. In the evening, dances and amateur performances. And they showed a movie. Yes for sure. The limit is complete.
              1. nnm
                nnm 13 December 2020 15: 36
                0
                Yeah .... 2 months, 7 km from the road in any weather and back on foot, grade 5 ...
                1. apro
                  apro 13 December 2020 15: 40
                  +10
                  Quote: nnm
                  7 km from the road in any weather and back on foot, grade 5.

                  Do you happen to have a kind of aristocrats?
                  1. nnm
                    nnm 13 December 2020 15: 47
                    +17
                    And an aristocrat, is he who does not want to wipe his butt out with a burdock in the richest country in the world at the end of the 20th century, or who, after the toilet, washes his hands and believes that the people of the USSR deserve more than the toilets at the station? Or that girl who thinks that in the 20th century, during menstruation, to shove bundles of cotton wool in her underwear is too much? Who is an aristocrat for you? A 13 year old child with sinusitis and chronic runny nose for life, marching in the October rain to fight potatoes?
                  2. azkolt
                    azkolt 13 December 2020 16: 45
                    0
                    "Did you happen to have a kind of aristocrats?"
                    You are good at pretending to be an idiot! I will ask briefly, what kind of state is this if students, schoolchildren, workers had to go to a collective farm to harvest? And yet everything is in short supply! The article says that by the end of the 80s condensed milk disappeared, I probably grew up in the wrong parts, I did not see it in our stores in the 70s! And how long could it exist (the state) if everything is like this through the 5th point? I am now reading Leonid Borodin with his anti-communist Leningrad group, as there are graduate students already in the late 50s. in the early 60s, they predicted the collapse of the Union, because they understood these contradictions! But statesmen, institutions are different, they have not seen it point-blank, we will only catch up and overtake! And the group was created to rally and seize power from such people who (even then it was clear to them) would only seize it! Read Ogurtsov's group!
                    1. Svarog
                      Svarog 13 December 2020 16: 55
                      +12
                      Quote: azkolt
                      I will ask briefly, what kind of state is this if students, schoolchildren, workers had to go to a collective farm to harvest?

                      And I, too, will ask briefly .. And now with what fright, military service? Why don't they get paid? After all, we have capitalism and no one owes anything to the state .. especially since our state is a bunch of oligarchs ..
                      And now I will briefly answer .. about potatoes .. Everything was in common and to harvest the harvest together too ..
                    2. Harry.km
                      Harry.km 13 December 2020 17: 56
                      0
                      Quote: Svarog
                      And now I will briefly answer .. about potatoes .. Everything was in common and to harvest the harvest together too ..


                      Why, then, the collective farmers at AZLK in the third shift, in the fourth quarter, before NG were not taken to earn extra money for free? There, too, periodically blockages were according to plan.
                    3. Kostya Lavinyukov
                      Kostya Lavinyukov 13 December 2020 18: 51
                      0
                      So nobody removed this claim. Fixed-term service is an extremely unpopular archaism.
                    4. lucul
                      lucul 13 December 2020 20: 36
                      -2
                      All we had in common was to reap the harvest together too ..

                      Really ? Maybe wealth was also common?
                    5. savage1976
                      savage1976 15 December 2020 11: 23
                      0
                      I have not heard more stupidity. Since everything is in common, so why the fright in the store for the money? My wife and I have a common sofa, so who should pay whom for lying on it?
                    6. azkolt
                      azkolt 10 January 2021 17: 32
                      -1
                      As far as I understand, you include yourself know who?)))) Why should the workers break away from production, and the students from their studies? I had to pull one or the other. And the result is the unproductive work of non-specialists who come to collect potatoes and spend the fool's day!
                  3. apro
                    apro 13 December 2020 17: 44
                    -1
                    Quote: azkolt
                    You are good at pretending to be an idiot!

                    Don't flatter ....
                    Quote: azkolt
                    I will ask briefly what kind of state it is,

                    USSR. Yes that's how it was. Was it deliberately done? No. Simple decisions were made. Where not to think. How to solve the problem.
                    There are many smart ones. There are even more correct ones. And to do. To achieve. To risk a career. To a position, few people want. And it was.
                    The introduction of the concept of profit initially disorganized the Soviet economy, corrupted people, and killed ...
                    Capitalist recipes are not suitable for the Soviet economy ...
                  4. azkolt
                    azkolt 10 January 2021 17: 35
                    0
                    They are generally not suitable for any economy!
            2. Overlock
              Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 09
              +38
              Quote: nnm
              2 months, 7 km from the road in any weather and back on foot, grade 5 ...

              did everyone go or were you unlucky with the place of residence? As a child, I wore tarpaulin boots and nothing, I remember with love. Life is like this, somewhere it will be lost, somewhere it will arrive
              1. Kart
                Kart 14 December 2020 15: 03
                +2
                But now, how are the children still in tarpaulin boots?
                Well, what would then also be remembered with love.
            3. The popuas
              The popuas 13 December 2020 16: 21
              +9
              We were taken by buses and worked for two weeks in total, mostly we collected zucchini ... and paid money! And in the summer they worked as objectors or drove geese from cabbage fields as linemen! Who would grow up on horseback, cattle from wheat were frightened and the sides were opened in the hayloft!
              1. azkolt
                azkolt 13 December 2020 16: 51
                +8
                He grew up in the village, every summer he worked in the fields, mostly beets, never paid. Everything was considered a labor camp and like another work quarter. It all took two or three weeks, depending on the species, or potatoes, two weeks, or beets. maybe three. I don't remember the payment! I also had to help my mother with beets.
                1. The popuas
                  The popuas 13 December 2020 17: 14
                  +2
                  We were paid pennies but paid! And they worked during their studies for the first two weeks of September! And at the beginning of summer holidays, working off at the school site for two weeks, two hours a day! And even then they grew vegetables on it ... for themselves
                2. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 13 December 2020 20: 48
                  +1
                  Quote: Popuas
                  We were paid pennies but paid!

                  They paid. We got fifty dollars for planting apple trees.
        2. mmaxx
          mmaxx 13 December 2020 17: 12
          +6
          And sho so it was possible ??? I don't even remember any money from rumors.
        3. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 00: 17
          +1
          Quote: apro
          We were paid 5 or 3 rubles for the labor camp ... I won't say for sure, but we worked half a day

          In the second class we went to the factory, to disassemble the compressor. For a couple of hours a day. For four days they paid five rubles and a penny.
          1. Kart
            Kart 14 December 2020 15: 14
            +3
            We were paid once, for potatoes, in my grade at 7.
            As soon as they found out that they would pay, what did the Soviet children do, guess?
            The number of buckets was taken into account, the clerk stood out of his own, and noted in a notebook who collected and brought how much.
            Well, then on the classics ... of capitalism.
            The clerk's friends and he himself immediately became the leaders.
            Those who did not have such a friend tried with all their might to nay ... that is, to deceive - they carried these buckets in a circle, poured earth there and a layer of potatoes on top. etc.
            There was not a single hero who worked honestly - all the heroes were from the above categories.
            It was them who were later set up as an example to others at the rulers and meetings under the speeches about the young builders of the future.

            These are the 70s, the heyday of socialism. There was still no spirit about perestroika.
            We must pay tribute to the school administration - after such an experiment, they forbade paying at all.
            How did Soviet children react to this initiative - not to pay them for their work? Right. We tried to score on this potato as much as possible.
            Because all this cardboard tinsel in the form of letters and sonorous speeches was needed only by those who aspired to become a party leader, a real builder of socialism in a good suit, on the service Volga and special food rations.

            And these are children. With the best education in the world (as the current fake people claim). That is, not Khrushchev and Brezhnev.
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 15: 41
              +3
              Quote: Carte
              Not a single hero who worked honestly turned out

              Look at me. I worked honestly. And you can see what kind of team, and such customs.
              Quote: Carte
              We tried to score on this potato as much as possible.

              We had exactly the opposite. There were only a few who did not want to poke around in the "mud". We scored with pleasure to study. 80s.
              1. Kart
                Kart 14 December 2020 15: 52
                +2
                And we didn't forget to study.
                On the contrary.
                Everyone knew: if you study, you will become a boss, you will walk around in a white shirt and eat barbecue. No brains - you will load coal with a shovel.
              2. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 16: 02
                +4
                Quote: Carte
                Everyone knew: if you study, you will become a boss, you will walk around in a white shirt and eat barbecue. No brains - you will load coal with a shovel.

                I've been with a shovel since I was six. Grandfather and grandmother from collective farmers, taught to work honestly. Conscientiously. And the white shirt never attracted me. On the contrary, I like to tinker with iron. And the workers ate barbecue. For example, my father received about 300 rubles in the USSR. There was enough for a barbecue. And everyone needs brains.
              3. Kart
                Kart 15 December 2020 09: 52
                +1
                And my father received 120 rubles, and did not eat barbecue - there was no meat in stores, only on holidays. And we didn't have any friends among the director of the store, like 99% of the rest.
                And here I am with a shovel, and the whole family.
                Instead of being adequately paid for our work for the Soviet state, and then buying food for this, our whole family wrestled in the gardens by hand.
                Is it good? Instead of studying, pick potatoes? This is very bad.
              4. Elturisto
                Elturisto 15 December 2020 10: 42
                -1
                Tie up nonsense already.
              5. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 15 December 2020 18: 25
                +1
                Quote: Carte
                And my father received 120 rubles, and he did not eat barbecue - there was no meat in stores, only on holidays.

                But it was at the bazaar. My mother also received a hundred and twenty.
                Quote: Carte
                And we didn't have friends among the director of the store, like 99% of the rest

                Our family was also included in this percentage.
                Quote: Carte
                we with the whole family wrestled in the gardens by hand.

                And what, in your opinion, did I plow on a horse, or with a walk-behind tractor? The four of them harnessed themselves into the plow and pulled.
                Quote: Carte
                Is it good? Instead of studying, pick potatoes? This is very bad.

                It's not the same for everybody. Good for me. Do you know why? There were no unemployed in the USSR, and accordingly there were no seasonal workers. Although the enterprises cooperated with them. Ours, for example, every year several dozen men were sent there as machine operators, and they were paid more than at the plant of 300. APO Novomoskovskoye. I said everything, there is no more desire to argue on this thread.
            2. The comment was deleted.
          2. mmaxx
            mmaxx 14 December 2020 16: 13
            +1
            I will support. Nobody suffered from enthusiasm on collective farms. No one - neither teachers, nor teachers, nor parents, nor children, nor students understood why this was necessary. It’s just that the party needs it, and so on. Only teachers-teachers and such fools as me worked in good faith. And there were two of them per class-group. Late realizing that everyone else drives such fools, I personally scored on the public in such a way that you still can't force it. I do not go to any subbotniks and other actions. I think it's easier not to litter, etc. And you can't work for free. It always ends up as a feeding trough for the villains.
          3. sniperino
            sniperino 14 December 2020 18: 52
            +1
            Quote: Carte
            No brains - you will load coal with a shovel.
            Coal, that's putting it mildly.
  • Overlock
    Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 07
    +38
    Quote: nnm
    Yes, there were no prospects without changing the nursing home in power.

    today?
    Quote: nnm
    Since the days of Khrushchev, the whole country has simply plunged into a swamp.

    really into the swamp? Horror! The whole army today lives on the Soviet, and civilians too. Here they destroyed the Soviet legacy, albeit not ideal, but in return what? - Modernization and optimization?
    A bias towards the military-industrial complex (military spending in the 80s fluctuated around 12% of GDP) and an ineffective agro-industrial complex (producing approximately the same volume of products, agriculture had 4-5 times less productivity than in the United States and led to a shortage of agricultural products. the same situation was with light industry.
    The "Kremlin elders" did not want and could reform the economy; instead, the sale of hydrocarbons, easy money turned the heads of the authorities.
    Look at the "successes" of today's government: the fabulous prices for oil and gas - and the "economic miracle"! Prices have collapsed - that's all !. Have arrived.
    “There’s no money, but you’re holding on,” said one figure. So we move in a circle.
  • Mordvin 3
    Mordvin 3 13 December 2020 20: 46
    +1
    Quote: nnm
    why the money for collecting potatoes on the collective farm is not paid to schoolchildren.

    What are you driving that? Every day they carried a bucket home.
    1. Kart
      Kart 14 December 2020 15: 17
      -1
      That is, they stole?
      Well, adults too ... carried what they could.
      1. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 15: 34
        +2
        Quote: Carte
        That is, they stole?

        Courtesy of management. The chairman knew. Is this theft? Not sure. This practice was widespread in the USSR on collective farms. The workdays were called.
        1. Kart
          Kart 15 December 2020 09: 58
          +1
          Of course theft. Only under the leadership of the chairman.
          Ask the OBHS veterans.

          I am moved by stories about a friendly life, when "all the neighbors gathered and together, for example, built a playground." Then they drank naturally, but that's not the point.
          It suddenly turns out that boards, paint, nails, metal, even a tool - all this was brought by friendly citizens from their places of work.
          They were also proud, and the wives nagged their husbands - "look at Petrova's man, the man pulls everything into the house from the factory, and you just thump."
  • Starshina
    Starshina 16 December 2020 23: 41
    +2
    We in Moldova at school paid money for harvesting vegetables on the collective farm, and for schoolchildren they were not small !!! September and October we worked every day and in two months we received 80 - 100 rubles - not bad for a student for pocket money was enough for a year ...
  • avg
    avg 13 December 2020 16: 43
    +10
    Quote: apro
    .then a person was freer. and more secure. problems were but there were enough solutions. and there were prospects.

    After people got garden and summer cottages, they would have taken us all. If someone from the leadership addressed the people, the USSR would be alive.
  • major147
    major147 13 December 2020 22: 09
    0
    Quote: apro
    then man was freer

    Really made fun!
    1. Kart
      Kart 14 December 2020 15: 19
      +4
      You see, for some it really is.
      They had an excellent childhood, usually in a large city, mom and dad are a stratum of the intelligentsia, and even bosses.
      In that world, among equals - everything was beautiful. The truth is only for them.
      They sincerely don’t understand and don’t believe how it was possible to choke in line for sausage from scraps for some unknown reason.
      1. major147
        major147 14 December 2020 16: 04
        0
        Quote: Carte
        for some, this is indeed the case.

        Perhaps, if they lived in some kind of closed enclave. But it is impossible not to see what is happening around. When you think one thing, but you need to say what you should. When you “choose” from one candidate in an “election”. When the deputies of the USSR Armed Forces come to a session in Moscow to raise their hand on command when voting, etc. etc.
        1. Kart
          Kart 15 December 2020 10: 04
          +2
          They went to the "elections" for two reasons - it was the opportunity to buy scarce products (they were sold directly at the polling stations.) And fear of punishment - if they did not go to the elections, they could not only deprive them of bonuses, but also lower them in positions, simply transfer low-paying work, but it's just elementary to bother the brain with endless showdowns and washes at various meetings. People on this really lost health.
          Well, maybe even a feeling of celebration. Ordinary hard workers perceived this business in this way - today is a holiday, elections, we will boom like May 1.
          That's all.
          Except for the stubborn individual propagandists and political instructors on the salary, no one believed in this, and did not say a single kind word.
          This is the 70s.
          And then we are surprised - how is it, such a strong country, and suddenly! Well, exactly the enemies from another planet have turned on.
          1. major147
            major147 15 December 2020 11: 24
            -1
            Quote: Carte
            Kart (Stepan)
            Today, 10: 04

            I can not disagree with you.
          2. Essex62
            Essex62 15 December 2020 11: 42
            0
            Bullshit, I didn't give a damn about their attempts at fucking the brain. Sent, turned and left. The state guaranteed social benefits and more than one boss could not encroach on this. Such an attempt will end with a heart attack. Verified personally.
            There are always plenty of flaws in any organized cluster of sapiens. Inevitable distortions and shortcomings, lack of internal, conscious discipline, just mistakes in planning. The main thing is that SYSTEM was correct, humane, fair. Add consumer goods and sausage, by region, and in general, heaven on earth. What we have now is a jungle or a ring, a race for survival. Pkhni with your elbow in the gut of the one running alongside, step on your head and run further. Inhuman capitalism. Only margin, you can't see a person behind it.
  • Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 13 December 2020 18: 19
    +9
    Quote: nnm
    We are talking on a specific topic, in relation to a specific historical segment.

    Ah, let's talk:
    The former head of the Soviet government, Nikolai Ivanovich Ryzhkov, wrote about this, in particular, in his book "The Main Witness".

    For some reason, he went down in history as a “crying prime minister”, although outwardly it was impossible to convict him of dishonesty. A bright antipode of the same thieves Chernomyrdins, Kirienko and others ...
    By chance, the author himself answered the question:
    Why a system of permanent deficit developed in the USSR: on the causes of problems with the availability of goods

    Everything is simple:
    backers of artificial scarcity were much more influential

    For some reason, the total shortage of goods is attributed to the period of the HMS government. But, the late Arkady Isaakovich Raikin spoke about the deficit:

    If in his performance it was perceived as a joke, then in reality the matter was far from so simple. The main purpose of the deficit is revealed in the comedy "You - me, I - you". It was here that, in a humorous vein, director Alexander Sery and actor Leonid Kuravlyov showed that the main assessment of a person was derived from the indicator of his ability to provide services. It's just that in the society of developed socialism there was no place for private entrepreneurship (creation of goods and services with new added value). Although officials and employees of a "higher" rank used special shops, special polyclinics, and special sanatoriums. Ordinary citizens did not even have an idea about the set of goods and services that a certain group of people was allowed to do.
    In the days of the National Union of Artists and LIB it looked respectable. Everyone remembers these "necessary" people who could do everything: from buying instant coffee, Finnish cervelat and a "Rosenlev" ("ZIL") refrigerator to buying (again) a car (insert into the queue), getting an apartment, getting a trip to Western Europe , appointment to a position or place. This is how “speculation” was transformed. I will not explain what it is.
    And the lower link was engaged in local resale. They were detained (from time to time) or killed as they were used (as the director of the Eliseevsky store, Yuri Sokolov).
    Then everything happened very trivially: the “right people” realized that living constantly hiding from the KGB, OBKHSS, the Ministry of Internal Affairs was extremely inconvenient and legalized everything by canceling the persecution of speculators, embezzlers and various businessmen. Now everything is decided by the availability of money, which an ordinary citizen with such a legislative framework will never have in order to live in "conditions not burdened with loans." There are those who have money and who can spit on the laws, and there are those who will never have this money, who will always be content with pitiful handouts from the lord's table, while not having any rights to the same services prescribed by law. to the same rights and freedoms prescribed in the laws.
    Now answer, why is a shortage of goods worse (better) than a shortage of money? In common parlance, universal poverty. If speculation in the USSR (various methods of illegal enrichment) were prosecuted by law and forced the defendants to hide their true faces, then why are millions of Russian citizens completely legally (openly) at the lowest level of support and eking out their existence in despair?
    Why, having built a “deficit-free society”, where in a good sense there should be rich, middle class and people with low incomes, we found ourselves in a position where:
    We have: oligarchs, beggars, very poor, extremely poor, the most beggars, beggars nowhere further, absolutely beggars, beggars absolutely beggars, beggars, which do not exist.
    1. depressant
      depressant 13 December 2020 20: 08
      +7
      Colleague of ROSS 42, here you have shown the transformation of the USSR into modern Russia using the law of reverse mapping:

      a shortage of goods in the presence of money is transformed into a shortage of money in the presence of goods.

      How could this have happened? Goods - import. The population does not receive wages for their production, therefore, cannot buy goods.
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 14 December 2020 03: 23
        +3
        Quote: depressant
        How could this have happened? Goods - import. The population does not receive wages for their production, therefore, cannot buy goods.

        When I sent a message on TV, Putin spoke and there (from 9:00) strange questions were raised:
        [media = https: //www.youtube.com/watch? v = 3RxV7QZ9bt8]
        Where the main bewilderment was caused by domestic goods and the rise in prices for them in a pandemic.
    2. passerby
      passerby 14 December 2020 04: 07
      +2
      What you wrote is not the reason for the collapse of the USSR, but only one of the consequences of the inherent shortcomings of the Soviet economic system, when the industry did not produce what people needed and at the same time was the most "advanced" because it overfulfilled plans. What did this lead to? This led to the fact that the counters were filled with unnecessary products, and that which was not needed. Why did it happen? And everything turned out this way because the enterprises did not have sales problems, they produced products not in order to satisfy the needs of people, but to fulfill the plan, and so that they would not produce it from them, other state enterprises bought and sold it. This is not counting the fact that the plans were allegedly carried out in monetary terms. Khanin described how this happened. Prices for products were regulated by the state, but there was a loophole in this regulation associated with new products, when, for example, an extra fastening screw was added to the old product and the old product became "new" and the price for it increased by 10 times. Why was this done? This was done in order not to increase the physical volume of production to overfulfill the plan in monetary terms. Indeed, yesterday I produced 100 products worth 10 rubles, and today I produced 150 new products with an extra screw worth 50 rubles. As a result, I overfulfilled the plan by XNUMX% without spending practically any increased, having received buns in the form of bonuses and additional supplies to the plant of scarce consumer goods. Khanin wrote about this very well. What did this lead to? This led to the fact that the wage fund (WF) of Soviet enterprises grew by leaps and bounds, and the volume of commodity mass did not grow. What did this lead to? Correct to the shortage of consumer goods, which were simply not enough for the demand provided by the citizens. And this is just one example of the inflation of the payroll. In the USSR, salaries, in principle, were not set depending on the demand for what people produced, but were taken from the ceiling and conditioned by political ones. The growth in the mass of cash in the USSR, by the way, can be very well tracked in the statistics published by the Central Bank of the Russian Federation. Why did all this happen? Because there was no market in the USSR, so it was possible for decades to produce unnecessary trash and receive bonuses for such "production" for overfulfilling plans. And all these "Eliseevskikh directors" are already a consequence of the problem of the absence of the market and the excess of the money supply over the mass of goods.
      1. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 04: 30
        +2
        [quote = casual passer-by] but there was a loophole in this regulation associated with new products, when, for example, an extra fastening screw was added to the old product and the old product became "new" and the price for it increased by two and a half times. [/ quote]
        Sorry, but you are wrong. Every five years, the enterprise was supposed to renew its output and reduce prices. Therefore, it came to curiosities, when the previously released products turned out to be of better quality than those released after. Let me give you an example on pocket knives. One and the same model. In the first half of the 80s, there is a swivel, in the second - already stamped garbage with holes.
        [quote = random passerby]
        Everyone sees a deficit, but there were also deficit-free goods, which, by the way, enjoyed great popularity abroad. And these are not galoshes. Watch, for example.
        [quote = random passer-by] rubbish nobody needs [/ quote]
        What kind of rubbish?
        1. passerby
          passerby 14 December 2020 06: 34
          0
          Well, let's take the penultimate five-year plan, give examples or at least links to authoritative authors in which industries for which goods were prices for previously manufactured products reduced and how much were they reduced? Give examples of “deficit-free goods” that were in demand abroad, apart from watches. An example of useless rubbish is products instead of which citizens bought scarce imported counterparts - shoes, furniture, electronics, clothing. I can also name cars that were in constant demand, because foreign ones were simply not on sale.
          1. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 06: 49
            +3
            Quote: bystander
            Give examples of “deficit-free goods” that were in demand abroad, apart from watches.

            Pumps, for example. Those that we had 25 rubles cost, and over the hill they gave the vidac for them. And in general, a static reference book of export-import of the USSR to help. Auto Niva, for example, was delivered to more than a hundred countries of the world. By the way, it was on her that the price was lowered. From 11 thousand to 9. Televisions and refrigerators to Great Britain and France, bicycles to Finland, motorcycles ... Radios. Photo cameras. An aunt from Great Britain brought a receiver-designer to one friend. He began to disassemble the English letters, and there it says: "Made in Moscow".
            1. Salty
              Salty 14 December 2020 06: 57
              0
              Quote: Mordvin 3
              I began to disassemble the English letters, and there it says: "Made in Moscow"

              "Made in USSR", guess right? wink
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 07: 09
                +2
                Quote: SaltY
                "Made in USSR", guess right?

                No, it was the Moscow plant that produced them. I myself collected the same in childhood. Youth was kind of called.
              2. Salty
                Salty 14 December 2020 07: 14
                +1
                Quote: Mordvin 3
                Youth was kind of called


                Uh-huh. It was like that for me.

                Quote: Mordvin 3
                it was the Moscow plant that produced them

                And you said that too. Here are just "letters" "Made in Moscow" it says to be there ... but it simply could not, they did not write this in the Soviet Union. Well, maybe there is some thread on the box, deep in the corner.
              3. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 07: 25
                +1
                Quote: SaltY
                Well, maybe there is some thread on the box, deep in the corner.

                It was on the box that it was written. In the corner. Export option. The boy didn't upset his aunt. But we laughed for a long time. Was it worth it to go to England for him. They lay quietly in the store. Personally, I bought in the early 80s.
              4. Salty
                Salty 14 December 2020 07: 29
                +1
                Quote: Mordvin 3
                It was on the box that it was written. In the corner

                Well, that is, the horse-sensus has been achieved.

                And what bad person is grazing me, I wonder? On neutral comments - already on the minus. Volodya, is it not you, by chance? Come on, radish)))
              5. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 07: 32
                +1
                Quote: SaltY
                Volodya, is it not you, by chance? Come on, radish)))

                On the contrary, I correct the minuses for the pluses. drinks I'm not a radish.
        2. Profiler
          Profiler 14 December 2020 07: 36
          +2
          Quote: Mordvin 3
          Youth was kind of called.

          My first radio circuit, self-assembled and working, and it worked perfectly, covering the entire CB range.
          Before that, at a more tender age, there was an attempt to pile at least something from a similar set of the Malchish RC, also from the Moscow Chaika plant.

          But it was such ... a semi-finished product, with mounting on racks already sloppy, that RK "Yunost" with its printed wiring looked like the height of perfection!

        3. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 07: 40
          +1
          Quote: Profiler
          My first radio circuit, self-assembled and working.

          Likewise. Only with the antenna difficulties arose. I barely figured out how to reel.
        4. Profiler
          Profiler 14 December 2020 07: 48
          +1
          Quote: Mordvin 3
          Likewise. Only with the antenna difficulties arose. I barely figured out how to reel.

          My father wound me. He himself was afraid to break the litz wire, or to make "bugs" on it.
          Otherwise, everything itself, all components - transistors, diodes, resistors, capacitors, transformers (matching and output) ...
        5. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 07: 54
          +1
          Quote: Profiler
          My father wound me. He himself was afraid to break the litz wire, or to make "bugs" on it.

          And nobody taught me. Self-taught. I saved up money, went and bought it. It's the same with the camera. I saved up a year and a half. And the price is the same, and have not disappeared anywhere. Also me, deficit ...
  • Kart
    Kart 14 December 2020 15: 58
    +3
    Quote: Mordvin 3
    No, it was the Moscow plant that produced them. I myself collected the same in childhood. Youth was kind of called.

    Yes, I also collected one. Cost 12 rubles.
    And then, from a classmate, dad brought him a radio designer from behind a hillock, where each element was in the form of a separate module. It was possible to collect something about 50 schemes.
    After him, "Youth" was perceived as a greeting from the Stone Age.
    This is the question of the quality of goods that "were everywhere."
    Those that were more or less of quality were not found in the provinces during the day with fire. if only someone accidentally goes to Moscow and brings ...
  • Mordvin 3
    Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 16: 32
    0
    Quote: Carte
    Those that were more or less of quality were not found in the provinces during the day with fire. if only someone accidentally goes to Moscow and brings ...

    Well, our family is from the province. Two televisions Horizon, one Yunost, tape recorders Mayak, Electronics, Sirius (worked for thirty years without breakdowns). Receiver Ocean, Rigonda ... Computer Spectrum ... Refrigerators Saratov and Polyus. The furniture is all Soviet. All this was acquired before the collapse of the USSR, when the bata was given an apartment at the enterprise. It is in our city. I had to go to the store more often. What Russian is there now? Not a single name in Russian, great and mighty.
  • Kart
    Kart 15 December 2020 10: 25
    +2
    What province? For some, Yekaterinburg, for example, is a deep province.
    I come from the district center in the northwest.
    From the tape recorders in the store there was Orbit - no one bought it, it cost about 800 rubles.
    TV sets, if color - only by acquaintance and by appointment. And of course, not everyone could buy, the price is also about 700 rubles.
    Batteries - only if accidentally, and then not of the required types. Needed only from Leningrad or Moscow.
    Furniture, if good - just by acquaintance.
    After all, as you know, there were good goods, and better imported, and there were bad goods, including furniture, televisions, electronics, and so on.
    And all the electronics were just enchanting quality. You can't explain to a modern young man, he just won't believe when to choose a TV (if there was such an opportunity) he had to invite a special master, because half of them did not work right in the store.
    How can this be explained?
  • Essex62
    Essex62 15 December 2020 12: 01
    0
    So this, having pushed the grandfathers to rest, and had to do. And not to smash the country to pieces. Retrogrades only through the knee, they themselves will not move, and so hurt them. And now, nothing of their own, the Chinese are driving consumer goods, there is no money to buy it.
  • Profiler
    Profiler 14 December 2020 07: 28
    +2
    Quote: Mordvin 3
    Auto Niva, for example, was delivered to more than a hundred countries of the world.

    And AZLK, that is, "Moskvich"?









    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 07: 34
      +1
      Quote: Profiler
      And AZLK, that is, "Moskvich"?

      And even did right-hand drive.
  • passerby
    passerby 14 December 2020 09: 32
    0
    What kind of pumps, name the brand and model and see if they were on sale in the USSR. As for everything else, all the goods you listed were in short supply in the USSR. So tell me, what "deficit-free" Soviet goods were in demand abroad? Well, then let's talk about the export volumes of Soviet goods and the reasons for the demand for them, comparing the prices of Soviet goods and their Western counterparts. This is for completeness.
  • Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 14 December 2020 05: 00
    +2
    Quote: bystander
    What you wrote is not the reason for the collapse of the USSR, but only one of the consequences of the inherent shortcomings of the Soviet economic system

    You would have passed (by chance) along with Khanin, so that I would not spit on your idea of ​​the principles of socialism and the difference between these principles and the production of goods of groups "A" and "B". You and Khanin are apparently not aware that salaries in the USSR (in the bulk) were associated with the contribution of a citizen to the development of the country's economy. Not GDP, but economic potential. Did Khazin tell you that the capitalist world used the achievements of socialism in order not to collapse completely? And did you say anything about the insufficient technical equipment of production and the lack of technologies in the field of medicine and mechanical engineering? About who ruined Soviet electronics in charge? And about storing the grown crop in conditions when the average annual temperature is below 0 ° C, have you talked to him?
    So, if it were not for the National Union of Artists with its exposure of the "cult of personality", the world would have long been without speculative pseudo-market relations. Without pyramids and foolishness about inevitable inflation (because of what actually?). This should be so instilled in people that feeding the parasites is beneficial for society.
    Quote: bystander
    And all these "Eliseevsky directors" are already a consequence of the problem of the absence of the market and the excess of the money supply over the mass of goods.

    And store directors are a consequence of the built system of speculative relations, when the low state price of the goods allowed them to be manipulated for private selfish purposes. And the country was full of collective farm and cooperative markets. Only there it was necessary to grow (collect), and only then sell. It is much easier to receive goods intended for a wide mass of buyers from the warehouse at the state price, and at personal discretion distribute it depending on the needs and requests.
    1. passerby
      passerby 14 December 2020 06: 27
      +1
      I don’t argue with believers in principle, because they have no reasonable arguments and will not have them, they go out on emotions, so you can continue to believe in "the most advanced Soviet economic model", standing on its ruins.
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 14 December 2020 16: 28
        +1
        Quote: bystander
        I don’t argue with believers in principle

        See how we talked! But he didn’t keep his tail, but how did he go nuts ...
        And I don't believe in financial pyramids ... Or have you already painted a human face for capitalism?
        Quote: bystander
        to believe in "the most advanced Soviet economic model", standing on its ruins.

        Even standing on the ruins of an advanced economic model, which speculators and embezzlers have betrayed and trampled on while people pondered the "new thinking" and delved into the process of perestroika, I am proud that modern Russian industrial is STILL using Soviet developments.
        1. passerby
          passerby 15 December 2020 02: 51
          0
          Quote: ROSS 42
          I am proud that modern Russian industrial is STILL using Soviet developments.

          And the fact that the Soviet industry used the development of tsarist Russia are not proud?
    2. Profiler
      Profiler 14 December 2020 07: 54
      +4
      Quote: ROSS 42
      And store directors are a consequence of a built system of speculative relations, when the low state price of a product allowed them to be manipulated for private selfish purposes.

      There is an anecdote about Chapaev, which fully describes the processes taking place in the economy and trade of that period.

      - How did you manage to cope with the shortage of goods?
      - And we put two Maxims at the back entrance to each store ...
      - Why TWO belay ?

      - One was overheating repeat ...
    3. sniperino
      sniperino 14 December 2020 09: 22
      +2
      Quote: ROSS 42
      wages in the USSR (for the most part) were associated with the contribution of a citizen to the development of the country's economy.
      For example, 200 p. store manager + 100 p. cutter of meat is much more than 500 rubles. miner + 300 r. constructor. Where and what did the secretary of the district committee with the store manager and the cutter bring in what the miner and the scientist and the designer could not do for the economy? They carried out rather than brought in.
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 14 December 2020 16: 32
        +1
        Quote: sniperino
        They carried out rather than brought in.

        Why are you so gloating? It is written there:
        (in the bulk)

        And this means that people of productive labor earned enough money, not in the way they are now.
  • Shegor vechem
    Shegor vechem 15 December 2020 08: 47
    0
    Excellent opinion, I fully support ... !!!
  • Kart
    Kart 14 December 2020 15: 21
    +2
    Quote: ROSS 42
    The main purpose of the deficit is revealed in the comedy "You - me, I - you".

    It is also well revealed in the movie "Blonde around the corner".
    1. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 14 December 2020 16: 36
      +2
      Quote: Carte
      It is also well revealed in the movie "Blonde around the corner".

      Probably I misunderstood the meaning of this film, but I have already said that all this "speculative thieves" shobla simply burned with the desire to live openly, "humanly", not hiding his ability and ability to appropriate the fruits of someone else's labor incommensurate with his ability to create ... They achieved this only by means of cheating, ordinary defamation ...
      1. Kart
        Kart 15 December 2020 10: 33
        0
        The meaning is very simple - the authors oppose the "real Soviet man", the protagonist, scientist, complete "botanist", and his extremely meager unassuming life, but dedicated to serving Soviet science and the life of just people, not from science, and not quite Soviet, by the will of fate having access to the lower level feeder.
        They are trying to prove that scarce products, foreign cars, gold and other diamonds are spiritless, empty, and not for a real Soviet person.

        It was once shown on television in the USSR.
        Do you know what was the reaction of the spectators, ordinary Soviet hard workers? - Exactly. envy of those who are negative, but well-fed and successful. "I wish we were the same. They're furious with fat."
        1. Essex62
          Essex62 15 December 2020 12: 20
          0
          Not envy, but hatred. It is a huge regret that you cannot put yourself against the wall, for the edification of everyone like that. These are real enemies so, Comrade Stalin, they qualified. The power has rotted away, it has become bourgeois.
          It's just that the time when it was possible was turned into popular prints. The hegemon was pushed into the background by the hucksters. The fish always rots from the head. The upper ones allowed the creation of a similar system. Weakened by health, spirit and faith in the idea. And the parasites played on the basest feelings and today they play, they dissociate they are reduced to a selfish instinct.
  • Alexey Sommer
    Alexey Sommer 13 December 2020 15: 08
    -7
    Quote: nnm
    Yes, because internal traitors simply bought its population with banal things - jeans,

    Who is this?
    1. nnm
      nnm 13 December 2020 15: 13
      -3
      It's very simple - to promise (not to give, namely to promise) to people what they want. Nothing new was invented.
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 13 December 2020 15: 52
        +9
        Quote: nnm
        It's very simple - to promise (not to give, namely to promise) to people what they want. Nothing new was invented.

        In those days, just to the public promises they took seriously .. and in case of failure to fulfill their heads flew .. And now they lie in the eyes, they ask to treat insolently with understanding ..
        1. nnm
          nnm 13 December 2020 15: 55
          +7
          This is yes! They took the promises that the next generation of Soviet people would live under communism especially seriously !!! And so ... the best example is the anecdotes of those years. They show very well the attitude of the people to these promises.
          1. Svarog
            Svarog 13 December 2020 16: 09
            +3
            Quote: nnm
            They took the promises that the next generation of Soviet people would live under communism especially seriously

            Long-term goals were set. But this is more a vector than a promise .. And now there are no vectors and you can't hear from promises ..
            1. nnm
              nnm 13 December 2020 16: 10
              -1
              We will talk about now in the relevant topic. And the "next" generation is far from a long-term promise.
              1. Gardamir
                Gardamir 13 December 2020 18: 33
                +4
                We will talk about now in the relevant topic
                And what will be such a topic? I think people like you chubais, offended by the Soviet Union, will rise up like a mountain now.
              2. sniperino
                sniperino 14 December 2020 16: 41
                +2
                Quote: nnm
                The "next" generation is far from a long-term promise.
                On October 17, 1961, the XXII Congress of the CPSU opened
                The party solemnly proclaims: the current generation of Soviet people will live under communism
                Present, not next. I was specifically promised, even though I was small then. Thrown as a train station loxa.
            2. The popuas
              The popuas 13 December 2020 16: 26
              +8
              They ask to endure ... and do not rock the yacht wink
            3. Kart
              Kart 14 December 2020 15: 41
              +1
              Quote: Svarog
              Long-term goals were set. But this is more a vector than a promise .. And now there are no vectors and you can't hear from promises ..

              Why is there - nothing at all!
              How are we living?
          2. ANB
            ANB 13 December 2020 22: 03
            +1
            ... They took the promises that the next generation of Soviet people would live under communism especially seriously

            So this is what Khrushchev promised. And, of course, they did not remove their head. But then he flew from his post.
          3. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 04: 06
            +4
            Quote: nnm
            the best example is the jokes of those years. They show very well the attitude of the people to these promises.

            Why do you think they write less jokes now? Maybe it's no longer to laugh, but it's time to cry?
        2. Salty
          Salty 13 December 2020 16: 01
          -2
          Quote: Svarog
          In those days, public promises were taken seriously .. and in case of failure to fulfill the head they flew ..

          Examples in the studio ... promises and flying heads. Or blah blah blah again? wink
        3. azkolt
          azkolt 13 December 2020 16: 55
          +3
          Yeah, at
          Quote: Svarog
          Quote: nnm
          It's very simple - to promise (not to give, namely to promise) to people what they want. Nothing new was invented.

          In those days, just to the public promises they took seriously .. and in case of failure to fulfill their heads flew .. And now they lie in the eyes, they ask to treat insolently with understanding ..

          Yeah. accepted the Food Program, at least then someone believed that it would be fulfilled!))))) You may have confused it with another time, when heads and spikelets flew? And after all, what is remarkable, these spikelets were not stolen from a well-fed life from the fields, but rather they were collected after harvesting! That's how they collected, left, ripped off, time! As well as for a bundle of brushwood, but it was my mother who told me about the wartime, but still KVOROSTA !!!!!
      2. Overlock
        Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 11
        +35
        Quote: nnm
        It's very simple - to promise (not to give, namely to promise)

        well said! In terms of promises, we have three times Olympic champion. Soon he will promise again, the main thing is to believe him
        1. Kart
          Kart 14 December 2020 15: 39
          +2
          Why would I just believe?
          You can just go outside. And remember how it was 20 years ago.
    2. passerby
      passerby 14 December 2020 06: 36
      -1
      Why are you asking such inconvenient questions that believers have no answer to? This is not very politically correct.
    3. The comment was deleted.
  • The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 13 December 2020 15: 09
    +8
    Sorry, did you find the 80s?
    Personally, I remember very well the "sausage trips" when my grandfather went to Moscow and Aleksandrov for cheese, boiled sausage and butter. Well, not counting the little things.
    His grandmother gave him instructions:
    Take this there, and this in that store, if not, then look at that ...
    And I was sent to the station to meet him, because the bag is heavy, and he is a veteran after four wounds!
    And not in the 90s, but in 1986 - 1988 ...
    1. nnm
      nnm 13 December 2020 15: 18
      +2
      I even remember the anectot in the form of a question - "long, green and smells of sausage!"
      - train from Moscow. And now everyone is stubbornly trying not to take into account the mistakes of the past, and blindly shout that everything was just fine.
      1. Region-25.rus
        Region-25.rus 13 December 2020 15: 55
        +8
        The fact that "everything is crappy or everything is perfect" are shouting ... how to put it more culturally - limited people. Thinking in categories! There were shoals, there were shortcomings in the USSR. But there were also many advantages and benefits. BUT (!) Instead of actually fixing bugs (as it is now fashionable to say), while saving everything that was built, they stupidly lost it in the bud.
        And what remained (bought up for a penny in the course of privatization) is diligently used by a certain stratum of citizens, it is using the reserve of the "nasty scoop", without creating anything new. And most importantly, it is the USSR that blames everything. And, you still ask me - "what do you know about the USSR?" - Well, I still answer - I found it almost 19 years old. And I remember a lot of things, both good and not so much. And yes, especially towards the mid to late 80s. When there were both state farms and collective farms near my city! And the fruits were their own, vegetables, berries grew, the cows were milked! But the shops were full of rot! Why? Why did they grow a lot of things and ... where did it go? Themselves went to school to clean everyone! And in stores, if I saw it, it was pitiful crumbs! And in the mid-late 70s, early 80s, it was so easy to go to the same state farms, pick the fruits and berries themselves, and pay on the spot at almost the cost price! Ate fresh and rolled up for the winter! And it was a natural product and not what now - I bought plums, but they lie for 10 days and at least henna them! And even in my backwoods it was quite normal with food until the mid-late 80s (as I wrote above). And yes, they jumped over bonfires in pioneer camps, swam in the (Japanese) sea until they were stupid! Songs and speeches as propaganda - it is understood, and taught and sang but purely for fun! And they walked on the street all day until dark without fear, the doors were often forgotten to be locked at night. And every year we flew to our relatives in Altai and Northern Kazakhstan without much stress. And if such ... the yardstick of life is sausage then ... probably (probably) you are just jealous that someone managed to snatch a fat piece for themselves (and these someone are most likely just those who destroyed the country, speculated, fumbled , sold from under the counter). And you, from the division of the fat pie on the estate of the USSR, did not get anything.
        ps
        there were problems in the USSR! And there were many of them, but ..... read the first paragraph of my chaotic narration!
        1. nnm
          nnm 13 December 2020 15: 57
          +4
          Then, before responding - READ my original post. That's what I wrote about !!! I was able to fix everything, but they did not foresee, did not give a damn, overshot.
          1. Region-25.rus
            Region-25.rus 13 December 2020 15: 59
            +4
            carefully read ALL of your posts. And he answered so to speak according to the "hospital average"
            1. nnm
              nnm 13 December 2020 16: 02
              +1
              In this case, you are very much mistaken. And first of all, regarding my resentment of being realized. Everything is exactly the opposite. But for the State, I still feel offended.
              1. Region-25.rus
                Region-25.rus 13 December 2020 17: 07
                +1
                Maybe! " I'm not an angel!" (c) Ostap Bender.
        2. Dmitry V.
          Dmitry V. 15 December 2020 11: 44
          -1
          Quote: Region-25.rus
          But there were also many advantages and benefits.


          Father - a pilot, stood in line for an apartment in the squadron for several decades, the line was constantly moving, in the opposite direction, those who needed "urgently" were constantly added. Finally it came to him ... the turn was again given to another - the loader is a drunken truant, but he has one more child - it means "socially just" to give him housing first.
          Nothing that he thumps from 5 working days, one skips or gets drunk at work, and the other every day on flights to the north - a socially just state.
          I did not wait - someone always needed something more. And there the children grew up.
      2. Svarog
        Svarog 13 December 2020 15: 56
        +7
        Quote: nnm
        I even remember the anectot in the form of a question - "long, green and smells of sausage!"
        - train from Moscow. And now everyone is stubbornly trying not to take into account the mistakes of the past, and blindly shout that everything was just fine.

        If you take an objective approach, assessing the overall quality of life, then it was still better. But I also agree with you that there were enough problems that needed to be solved .. And one of the main problems is the turnover of leaders and the system of checks and balances .. after Stalin, it stopped working ..
        1. nnm
          nnm 13 December 2020 15: 59
          -1
          That's what I'm talking about. After him, the country simply plunged into a swamp. And every year it gets deeper and deeper.
          1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Paragraph Epitafievich Y.
          Paragraph Epitafievich Y. 13 December 2020 17: 00
          +2
          Quote: Svarog
          If you take an objective approach, assessing the overall quality of life, then it was still better.

          was not. She just was different - that's all. It is rather stupid to operate with the categories "better or worse", comparing the quality of life in the country with two TV programs, 45 private cars per 1000 citizens, queues and the Soviet phenomenon, when "buy" was replaced by the concept of "get", with modern realities. And what is the point in this at all? Nostalgic whining about "the trees were taller, and the kvass was more frothy"?
          1. Kart
            Kart 14 December 2020 16: 47
            +2
            Ooh, that makes a lot of sense!
            There are fewer and fewer real witnesses of the USSR, young people have grown up, but they do not go to the barricades.
            The liberal idea with lace panties and Europe didn't work for us.
            So what remains? That's right, to cultivate nostalgia for the wonderful life that "was in the USSR."
            They lie amicably, aggressively, professionally, and sometimes very convincingly.
            Of course, all this is done to capture the trough by the necessary people, pushing away unnecessary ones.
            Of course, there is no question of any social equality in the event of the victory of the "bright communist forces".
            This is exactly the same snag, with exactly the same purpose as the liberal one.
            But - much more cunning, which means more dangerous.
            1. passerby
              passerby 15 December 2020 03: 20
              +1
              A very interesting thought. In fact, it would be very interesting to look at the sources of funding for bloggers and information resources involved in the propaganda of communist ideas and the "bright" Soviet past.
              1. Kart
                Kart 15 December 2020 10: 50
                +1
                Yes, actually already.
                The sources are about the same. This allows us to speak about the use of the next version of the technology of destruction from the inside.
                Well, indirect signs already at the exit of the product are the same type of phrases and slogans, extreme aggressive intolerance even to the shadow of dissent, the creation of a negative information background about the country in any discussed topic, etc.
                The previous liberal project has not died either, the adherents, amazed to the whole brain, still lead their round dances around the "dying Russia", waving the dirty flag of liberalism and European civilization.
                But it became obvious to the curators of the project that this would not work anymore, there are too few of them.
                Now another wave is forming - this time with a red flag full of holes.
                And this is the second series.
                It is no longer enough to just shout about great socialism on the Internet. The second wave pushes out "serious experts" - verbose, scientifically and technically savvy, "personally living in the USSR" who impress the young more than simple shouts that can be easily verified.
                1. passerby
                  passerby 15 December 2020 17: 03
                  0
                  Quote: Carte
                  The second wave pushes out "serious experts" - verbose, scientifically and technically savvy, "who personally lived in the USSR"

                  So far, apart from balabols, who can offer nothing but slogans, I don't see anyone else, but your idea is extremely interesting.
      3. Overlock
        Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 13
        +36
        Quote: nnm
        And now everyone is stubbornly trying not to take into account the mistakes of the past, and blindly shouting that everything was just fine.

        there was everything. Earlier, for example, they ran to the policeman without fear, but now they go around the tenth road. But they will soon be allowed to shoot at their own discretion, and American life will begin. And you mean the sausage! There was confidence in the future, but now what confidence? - In whom? -Who should I believe?
        1. Gardamir
          Gardamir 13 December 2020 18: 38
          +6
          and now what confidence
          In the third wave of covid, and then the ninth wave.
        2. Kart
          Kart 14 December 2020 16: 51
          +2
          Quote: Overlock
          there was everything. Earlier, for example, they ran to the policeman without fear, but now they go around the tenth road. But they will soon be allowed to shoot at their own discretion, and American life will begin. And you mean the sausage! There was confidence in the future, but now what confidence? - In whom? -Who should I believe?

          So everything is now.
          Someone also has confidence in the future.
          And the confidence you are writing about is the confidence of the household in the stall. It's warm, they decide everything for you, they feed you.
          True, they feed so-so ... but you don't need to think about anything - do what they say.
          is it really not offensive - when everything. absolutely everything for you is decided by an unknown party uncle: where you go, what to say, what to wear, what to read and watch.
      4. sniperino
        sniperino 14 December 2020 10: 30
        +3
        Quote: nnm
        yelling blindly that everything was just fine.
        This op is used as arguments for the youth to the thesis of all-propolymers. The main thing is to assert how bad it is here and now, but how it really was there then is not important at all.
        1. Kart
          Kart 14 December 2020 16: 54
          +3
          Still worse.
          They invented an invented country, their own USSR, and relying on this they throw mud at their invented Russia, in order to destroy the real Russia.
          While this is the most devilish manifestation of destruction, technology of the XXI century.
          Where are the LGBT and liberals.
      5. sniperino
        sniperino 14 December 2020 16: 58
        +1
        Quote: nnm
        "long, green and smells of sausage!" - train from Moscow
        From the second half of the 70s, I heard an anecdote at school.
    2. The popuas
      The popuas 13 December 2020 16: 27
      0
      It all started at 85 ...
      1. sniperino
        sniperino 14 December 2020 10: 33
        +2
        Quote: Popuas
        It all started at 85
        Stop lying.
        1. Kart
          Kart 14 December 2020 16: 55
          +2
          See, they can really believe it.
          Indeed, in their fictional USSR, unlike the present, everything really began in 1985.
      2. Vadim237
        Vadim237 15 December 2020 22: 57
        0
        It all began in 1928, when the Bolsheviks of the NEP abruptly abolished and went to plunder the villages before they plundered everything into civilian life, and then they urgently needed money for industrialization, they pushed the damned Western bourgeoisie for everything they paid for in foreign currency to buy equipment from the West to hire Western ones specialist engineers, etc. It was all this that became the beginning of the end of the food security of the USSR - the planned five-year plans and the distribution system appeared.
    3. Freeman
      Freeman 13 December 2020 17: 17
      +5
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      Sorry, did you find the 80s?
      Personally, I remember very well the "sausage trip" when my grandfather went to Moscow and Aleksandrov for cheese, boiled sausage and butter. Well, not counting the little things.
      Grandmother gave him instructions:
      Take this there, and this in that store, if not, then look at that ...
      And I was sent to the station to meet him, because the bag is heavy, and he is a veteran after four wounds!
      And not in the 90s, but in 1986 - 1988 ...


      Dedicated to your heroic grandfather. hi

      Vladimir Vysotsky - A trip to the city (year of writing poetry 1969)
    4. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 13 December 2020 18: 41
      +4
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      Sorry, did you find the 80s?

      Sorry, did you find the end of the 50s - the beginning of the 60s? When was ordinary flour according to coupons, and products were sold by the piece to one person?
      Stop scaring us with horror stories about "sausage trains" ... There was a time when there were no normal hardware, paint, wallpaper in stores ... When a person with a "toilet paper garland" was perceived as a winner with a laurel wreath.
      1. Cottodraton
        Cottodraton 14 December 2020 04: 21
        0
        This was in the late 80s.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 04: 49
          +1
          Quote: Cottodraton
          This was in the late 80s.

          In the late 80s, my baht was given an apartment. We moved from a one-room Khrushchev to a quadruple of an improved type, over 80 square meters. As it was pasted over, and furnished.
          1. Kart
            Kart 14 December 2020 16: 57
            +3
            Well, that is, he lived all his life in a one-room apartment with his family?
            So there is also a total deficit.
            This is the concern of the party.
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 17: 15
              +1
              Quote: Carte
              Well, that is, he lived all his life in a one-room apartment with his family?

              No. From his home (my grandfather had five children) he moved to a barrack when he got married, then to a one-room apartment, then to four. Yes, and he messed up himself that he got it so late. He left for Magadan, he was removed from the queue. I would have received it much earlier, even when I went to kindergarten.
              Quote: Carte
              So there is also a total deficit.

              What did you fix, deficit, deficit ... There was, but not total. He did not interfere with my life. At the flea market, only imported cassettes were bought. Well you, in short. Tired of arguing.
              1. Kart
                Kart 15 December 2020 11: 34
                +2
                What am I doing ... really, what?
                Nonsense that this is one of the main consequences of the country's degradation and subsequent disintegration.
                You can endlessly argue for a long time "what prevented" and "but if only." the result at the output of the system is important. And he was like this.
                And it would be fine only the deficit. This could be explained if Soviet apple trees were really blooming on Mars.
                So it is not here either.
                Electronics - all with a lag of 10-20 years or worse. The most modern machines - either not at all, or imports, modern plastics, chemicals - again imports.
                T.N. applied science in failure - one pseudo-scientific mutter about "Soviet scientists managed to improve the chemical composition of some acid.
                Against the background of reports of breakthrough Western technologies (about which they wrote in Soviet magazines sometimes), it looked so-so.
                While the decaying capitalists were undergoing another change in their technical structure, we had a harvest battle.
                The battle is lost.
                Now no one is fighting for the harvest, but food is in bulk in stores.
                No congresses of rationalizers are held, new coefficients are not calculated, brigade contracts and rolling banners are not introduced - and factories are working and making world-class products, no worse than others.
  • WayKheThuo
    WayKheThuo 13 December 2020 15: 10
    +5
    Exactly. Back in the early 60s, they wrote about the emerging problems in explanatory notes to the Central Committee, both the State Planning Committee and the USSR Academy of Sciences.
    Everything was shelved, because the head-heads with corn in their heads can only yell at rallies, puff out their cheeks, or, bringing the situation to complete despair, demand heroic deeds from people.
    And these relics still live, fruitful by division - recently Radiant demanded from the government a plan to freeze prices - woke up, damn it! And then before this was not visible, since March, prices are already growing by leaps and bounds.
    Our people are Orthodox, highly spiritual, and therefore they will never miss the opportunity to profit from the misfortune of their neighbor. As, in general, any other nation on our ball.
    1. nnm
      nnm 13 December 2020 15: 20
      +6
      We touched on an excellent topic. It is also very interesting how he will limit prices under the capitalist system. And he doesn't want to look at the tariffs of the communal apartment from his friends? And for the purchase of Sberbank from themselves for billions, and for Chubais, and for the Rottenbergs, Sechin and so on .... there is nothing to limit? And then he begins to dump scraps from the master's table ...
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 13 December 2020 16: 03
        +4
        Quote: nnm
        We touched on an excellent topic. It is also very interesting how he will limit prices under the capitalist system. And he doesn't want to look at the tariffs of the communal apartment from his friends? And for the purchase of Sberbank from themselves for billions, and for Chubais, and for the Rottenbergs, Sechin and so on .... there is nothing to limit? And then he begins to dump scraps from the master's table ...

        He is a balabol .. and from him like a duck's water .. not to ask .. and he himself does not ask from his accomplices .. Why, he settled well .. spends money on himself, as the budget of a city of a millionaire .. could a belt together tighten with the people .. instead, constitutionally freed himself and his friends from all responsibility ..
        1. Salty
          Salty 13 December 2020 16: 13
          -8
          Quote: Svarog
          He's a balabol ..

          Whoa ... who's talking laughing
          1. sniperino
            sniperino 14 December 2020 10: 44
            +3
            Quote: SaltY
            Quote: Svarog
            He's a balabol ..
            Whoa ... who's talking laughing
            If you replace "spoke" with "balabolil", then any interrogative intonations disappear.
      2. Overlock
        Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 16
        +43
        Quote: nnm
        how he will limit prices under the capitalist system. Doesn't he want to look at the tariffs of the communal apartment from his friends? And for the purchase of Sberbank from themselves for billions, and for Chubais, and for the Rottenbergs, Sechin, etc. ... there is nothing to limit?

        he will not limit anything! He has been struggling with gasoline prices for 18 years and who won this "difficult unequal battle"? And so in everything. These are all words before December 17th. You have to say something, pound your fist and then - "come on, push them, pump money out of their pockets"
        1. nnm
          nnm 13 December 2020 16: 17
          +2
          So I am about the same ....
        2. Igoresha
          Igoresha 13 December 2020 19: 35
          -4
          Nitsche not a balobol, I found my 90-year-old grandmother and consoled me on the phone ..
      3. passerby
        passerby 14 December 2020 04: 15
        +1
        Very simple. Using market mechanisms such as increasing import duties on vegetable oil, sugar, grain, or even setting protective import duties. Plus the tools provided by the FAS. If you want to find signs of cartel collusion in our networks, you can very easily and if you have "your" courts, you can rip off the heads of all networkers using the FAS tools very quickly and efficiently.
    2. Svarog
      Svarog 13 December 2020 16: 00
      +2
      Quote: WayKhe Thuo
      Everything was shelved

      You are absolutely right .. it was then that there was an opportunity to turn the economy to face the consumer .. and a group of academics proposed such a plan, which substantiated the need for consumer goods and assortments on the shelves .. But the military lobby turned out to be stronger, as a result, the military industry was thrown up. ...
      1. Kart
        Kart 14 December 2020 16: 06
        +3
        Tell us - how did the war industry and the goods for the people manage to produce under damned capitalism? Also space and science. The best machines and equipment are from there.
        How so?
    3. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 13 December 2020 18: 43
      +3
      Quote: WayKhe Thuo
      Back in the early 60s, they wrote about the emerging problems in explanatory notes to the Central Committee, both the State Planning Committee and the USSR Academy of Sciences.

      The main problem was that even the available goods were distributed across the republics without taking into account climatic conditions, mentality and national characteristics.
      1. sniperino
        sniperino 14 December 2020 11: 32
        +1
        Quote: ROSS 42
        The main problem was that even the available goods were distributed across the republics without taking into account climatic conditions, mentality and national characteristics.
        Have you decided that the main one? What prevented you from adjusting the distribution, taking into account the above conditions and features? One so smart was not enough to give the order, perhaps the problem was not solved ... But then who determined the main problems? Perhaps some constitutionally stupid, oligophrenic, etc. Whoever has more, as they say, is also a pan ...
        1. Kart
          Kart 14 December 2020 16: 07
          +3
          The question is different.
          How did such people get upstairs? And in fact, everyone, without exception, turned out to be bad.
          What kind of system is it that pushes these very people up?
          1. sniperino
            sniperino 14 December 2020 16: 13
            +1
            Quote: Carte
            How did such people get upstairs? ... What kind of system is this ...
            Systems analysis will require criticism of the grounds, and they would have to get rid of a traitor with some accidental oversight.
            1. Kart
              Kart 14 December 2020 17: 00
              +3
              That's it!
              Critics of the grounds!
              As Zhvanetsky said - "can he fix something in the conservatory?"
              Maybe, in general, this whole idea of ​​Marxism is a chimera about a milk horse in a spherical vacuum?
              1. passerby
                passerby 15 December 2020 04: 25
                +3
                Quote: Carte
                Maybe, in general, this whole idea of ​​Marxism is a chimera about a milk horse in a spherical vacuum?

                Is it possible to say such things in front of believers? You will be held accountable for insulting the feelings of believers. Repent!
              2. sniperino
                sniperino 17 December 2020 12: 22
                0
                Quote: Carte
                Maybe, in general, this whole idea of ​​Marxism is a chimera about a milk horse in a spherical vacuum?
                Where is the idea of ​​Marxism seen? The idea of ​​putting social justice over economic freedom remains. The analysis of capitalism as an unjust social order needs to be supplemented with new realities, but the conclusion about the need to transform society, in my opinion, will not go anywhere. The transformation method is a subject of discussion.
  • paul3390
    paul3390 13 December 2020 15: 18
    +10
    There is a huge layer of documents and memoirs, allowing to assert that the deficit in the late USSR was created artificially and very purposefully. Especially food. For the top leaders were already actively preparing for the sale of the country and the betrayal of the people ..

    Those who were in the early 90s, say, in Poland, remember how it turned into a giant flea market of Soviet goods .. They dragged everything through the cordon, from household appliances to pots. And all this poured across the border in colossal quantities. This is to the question that the Union, like nothing but galoshes, did not produce, and even those shitty ones .. Only outright liars and scum can assert that.
    1. Antonio_Mariarti
      Antonio_Mariarti 13 December 2020 15: 53
      -3
      Quote: paul3390
      There is a huge layer of documents and memoirs, allowing to assert that the deficit in the late USSR was created artificially and very purposefully. Especially food. For the top leaders were already actively preparing for the sale of the country and the betrayal of the people ..

      Those who were in the early 90s, say, in Poland, remember how it turned into a giant flea market of Soviet goods .. They dragged everything through the cordon, from household appliances to pots. And all this poured across the border in colossal quantities. This is to the question that the Union, like nothing but galoshes, did not produce, and even those shitty ones .. Only outright liars and scum can assert that.
      Aha, tell me more technology lagged behind the West in technologically 10-20 years, also the work of traitors in alsti, ilzh!
      1. paul3390
        paul3390 13 December 2020 16: 07
        +12
        Yeah - that's what Soviet goods all and swept abroad like a broom, as soon as the border was opened .. Apparently - because they lagged behind .. Alas, the liberal myth does not want to understand that in the USSR, in principle, premium goods were not produced. In the absence of a proper number of wealthy consumers. All products were quite average, designed for everyone. Do you want to say that the USSR produced things of a worse quality than, say, Chinese junk? I do not believe!! For to this day we use something. But China has filled up the entire planet with its products, and nothing, they take it with pleasure. For the main thing is the price-quality ratio. And here the USSR was quite at the level. Of course - if you compare the Zhiguli with the Rolls-Royce, the Zhiguli is shit. However - almost half of the planet went to them with great pleasure, and in some countries to this day. Since it's cheap and cheerful. And so - it was in everything ..

        You cannot compare the realities of the Soviet Union exclusively with the wealthy classes of the West. For those - feed at the expense of the rest of the planet. And you compare, say, with today's Bangladesh - and you will understand that in the Union we lived like in paradise .. But what is there - compare with how the workers lived in England at that time - I would not say that our hard worker lived significantly worse .. Rather - in many respects it is still much better. But in comparison with the English lord - of course a beggar. But after all, there are not very many lords to put it mildly .. So - the whole question is in the system of comparisons .. What with what ..
        1. Arpad
          Arpad 13 December 2020 19: 02
          -2
          Quote: paul3390
          And you compare, say, with today's Bangladesh - and you will understand that in the Union we lived like in paradise ..

          but what about Bangladesh?
          let's go straight from Zimbabwe or Haiti.
          And you will understand. that you still live in full chocolate.
        2. Kart
          Kart 15 December 2020 11: 22
          0
          Quote: paul3390
          Do you want to say that the USSR produced things of a worse quality than, say, Chinese junk? I do not believe!!

          Chinese TV works without problems for 4 years.
          The Russian-made iron also works for about 3 years, also without problems, a modern product.
          A similar television miracle of the Soviet industry at one time did not work for a month.
          He himself repaired it at one time for himself and for others, I know what I mean.
      2. Kart
        Kart 14 December 2020 16: 09
        +3
        Nikita, look at the pros and cons.
        A group of sectarians gathered here. To prove something to them is like arguing with a TV set.
    2. Overlock
      Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 18
      +35
      Quote: paul3390
      in Poland - he remembers how it turned into a giant flea market of Soviet goods .. They dragged everything through the cordon, from household appliances to pots.

      it was the same in Romania and Turkey. The Turks, after the collapse of the Union, rose to their feet.
      1. apro
        apro 13 December 2020 16: 25
        -3
        Quote: Overlock
        Quote: paul3390
        in Poland - he remembers how it turned into a giant flea market of Soviet goods .. They dragged everything through the cordon, from household appliances to pots.

        it was the same in Romania and Turkey. The Turks, after the collapse of the Union, rose to their feet.

        In our region. They say that the PRC got up at our expense .... but in fact the Russians dropped themselves.
        1. Overlock
          Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 34
          +32
          Quote: apro
          .a in fact the Russians have omitted themselves.

          the law of life: if somewhere has departed, then somewhere has arrived
          1. apro
            apro 13 December 2020 16: 36
            -3
            Quote: Overlock
            law of life:

            This is not the correct goal setting.
            1. Overlock
              Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 39
              +32
              Quote: apro
              This is not the correct goal setting.

              but vital, and in life justice and correctness are not frequent guests
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 15 December 2020 23: 08
          0
          The PRC rose on Western infusions of money and technology since the 70s, thanks to this, unlike us, they smoothly transitioned from a planned economy to a market economy and market business planning, and unlike us, they did not supply 120 rogue countries at their own expense and did not participate in the arms race.
    3. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 13 December 2020 18: 46
      +5
      Quote: paul3390
      the deficit in the late USSR was created artificially and very purposefully.

      good

      There is a lot of official confirmation of this, reports from the scene of events and hidden data on the "deep drilling" department ...
    4. sniperino
      sniperino 14 December 2020 11: 50
      +1
      Quote: paul3390
      deficit in the late USSR - created artificially and very purposefully
      And in the "average USSR" - naturally and spontaneously?
      1. Kart
        Kart 14 December 2020 16: 12
        +2
        So in the early USSR, too, everything was not easy to put it mildly.
        But the adherents firmly believe that these are all external enemies - interventionists, counter-revolution, war, imperialists.
  • paul3390
    paul3390 13 December 2020 15: 22
    +14
    Why, having a huge number of advantages in the form of medicine, education, social equality, did the country collapse so easily?

    Because no one told us that the country and socialism were going to destroy .. If you remember - they rubbed us that everything that happens is just modernization and improvement. Well, it will be like, instead of the USSR, the stupid CIS - but they say it is practically the same, only better and freer .. And there will be socialism with all its conquests - just a slightly different type .. With elements of a free market, ..

    We were stupidly taken to lie .. And we, like fuckers, believed in all this .. For which now we are raking in full ..
    1. Arpad
      Arpad 13 December 2020 19: 03
      0
      Quote: paul3390
      We were stupidly taken to lie ..

      but in the USSR they did not lie, from the word in general. laughing
  • for
    for 13 December 2020 17: 40
    +3
    Quote: nnm
    that in the 90s people rushed to the west in search of

    If you consider power as a people, then yes, people. The people lived and live what then, what now their life with care of "daily bread"... I have not seen anything in my city (Kuibyshev which is on the Volga) rallies, etc. But they bought not jeans and sausage, but empty counters, and then gave in return (USSR) a pacifier in the form of Western values.
  • Cottodraton
    Cottodraton 14 December 2020 04: 13
    +1
    Here balance is needed. And the people for the country and the country for the people. Otherwise nothing good
  • Crowe
    Crowe 13 December 2020 15: 02
    +25
    Quote: apro
    Oh .... good topic


    And what did the USSR fail to do with free education, medicine, confidence in the future?
    1. WayKheThuo
      WayKheThuo 13 December 2020 15: 13
      +8
      The picture is awful.
      Smiled.
      For her - a plus
    2. WayKheThuo
      WayKheThuo 13 December 2020 15: 14
      +7
      And what did the USSR fail to do with free education, medicine, confidence in the future?

      The fact that he broke up and badly, badly spoiled people, ordinary people who put their lives and hopes for the future into it.

      And the picture is a complete flight.
      For her - a plus.
    3. apro
      apro 13 December 2020 15: 31
      +8
      Quote: Crowe
      Quote: apro
      Oh .... good topic


      And what did the USSR fail to do with free education, medicine, confidence in the future?

      Yes sarcasm does not reach ...
    4. Overlock
      Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 20
      +34
      Quote: Crowe
      Free education, medicine, confidence in the future?

      they are masochists! After all, free is a gift, but now for money, if any. Through hardship to the stars!
      1. Freeman
        Freeman 13 December 2020 18: 23
        +7
        Overlock (Sergey) Today, 16:20
        Through hardship to the stars!

        Which in Latin sounds like - Per aspera ad astra.
        But for some reason, we did it - Per aspera ad anus. wassat
    5. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 13 December 2020 18: 54
      +7
      Quote: Crowe
      And what did the USSR do not please? Free education,medicine, confidence in the future?

      The USSR did not please those people who, having access to everything, were forced to hide from journalists, the press, television, people's control, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the KGB, the OBKHSS, party and departmental control. At a time when ordinary citizens drilled their teeth without anesthesia and placed cement fillings, there were other methods of treatment. I tell you this as a witness. Now you can build a palace for 1 billion rubles and live happily ever after. And in the USSR, one could get 15 years of work in uranium mines for such a palace or get a bullet.
      That is why all embezzlers, bribe-takers and other scoundrels were immediately reassured by the abolition of the death penalty.
      1. Igoresha
        Igoresha 13 December 2020 19: 42
        0
        drilled teeth without anesthesia
        as a frequent dentist in my wonderful school years, I remember this horror. Not so long ago I asked a friend of a pensioner who worked in a regional center as a nurse at a dental office about an anesthetic, says that in the USSR it was weak and not far away. But the head of this clinic lived well - a two-story house. a car, and a dozen fur coats from his wife, in the omda it smelled of mothballs))
        1. Kart
          Kart 14 December 2020 16: 16
          +2
          Are you kidding!
          After all, there was the best medicine in the world!
      2. Kart
        Kart 14 December 2020 16: 16
        +1
        Quote: ROSS 42
        And in the USSR, one could get 15 years of work in uranium mines for such a palace or get a bullet.

        Now you can get a bullet for that too.
        And the top party leaders lived in such palaces - and nothing, did not buzz.
  • Civil
    Civil 13 December 2020 15: 43
    +9
    1. All this was artificially done by trade enterprises, a flaw in the OBKHSS, but it was also impossible to accept into the party all those who were involved in the distribution of consumer goods.
    2. It was impossible to impose a ban on the development of the KGB of party leaders.
    3. It was impossible to waste the achievements of the Revolution in terms of the replacement of leaders.
    1. Overlock
      Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 21
      +34
      Quote: Civil
      2. It was impossible to impose a ban on the development of the KGB of party leaders.
      3. It was impossible to waste the achievements of the Revolution in terms of the replacement of leaders.

      the old communists from the organs did not work on the mistakes of their predecessors. Again the rake comes
    2. Kart
      Kart 14 December 2020 16: 19
      +3
      Quote: Civil
      ... It was impossible to impose a ban on the development of the KGB party leaders.

      Then the KGB figures would gradually turn into the very figures they developed. Unpunished and omnipotent.
      Wealth would simply pass from one hand to another.
      Of course, everything is accompanied by choral singing about building socialism.
      1. passerby
        passerby 15 December 2020 04: 33
        +1
        Quote: Carte
        Then the KGB figures would gradually turn into the very figures they developed. Unpunished and omnipotent.

        In all fairness, it should be noted that this is what we are now observing in modern Russia.
        1. Kart
          Kart 15 December 2020 11: 10
          +1
          To be fair, we now have capitalism, which, as you know, does not at all declare social equality.
          Unlike socialism, which just announced it as the basis of society, but in practice did not even come close to implementing it.
          1. passerby
            passerby 15 December 2020 17: 00
            0
            Quote: Carte
            To be fair, we now have capitalism, which, as you know, does not at all declare social equality.

            I'm not talking about that a bit, I'm talking about what the state security officials have become
    3. passerby
      passerby 15 December 2020 04: 32
      +1
      Quote: Civil
      3. It was impossible to waste the achievements of the Revolution in terms of the replacement of leaders.

      I remember especially well the achievements in the form of the replacements of Comrade Stalin, Comrade Brezhnev, Andropov, Chernenko, and Comrade Khrushchev was generally replaced beautifully, using the best practices of the banana republics, so to speak.
  • The comment was deleted.
    1. apro
      apro 13 December 2020 16: 13
      +4
      Quote: Svarog
      Today would be these problems.

      Svarog. Today, for some reason, everyone suddenly remembered the USSR. What advantages they had. They remember the prices. But many do not understand how all this was achieved. And they don’t want to study. Everything is measured by capitalistically. Market standards. And the USSR was not a market country. She worked and created not for the sake of profit for her pocket, but for her citizens to satisfy their healthy needs.
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 13 December 2020 16: 35
        +11
        Quote: apro
        and the USSR was not a market country. The country worked and created not for the sake of profit for the pocket, but for its citizens to satisfy their healthy needs.

        Yes .. just .. now even the idea itself is erased .. how so not for the sake of profit .. and that was the essence of the USSR - not for the sake of profit, but for the sake of citizens .. and how funny it looks like chewing gum, sausage and jeans today. . when on the other side of the scale the welfare state, which did everything for the benefit of its citizens.
        1. apro
          apro 13 December 2020 16: 43
          +4
          How unwell you feel today when they laughed at LIBrezhnev's diction, to his words ALL IN THE NAME OF A MAN. ALL FOR THE GOOD OF HUMAN.
          1. Kart
            Kart 14 December 2020 16: 20
            +4
            They didn’t laugh at his words.
            They laughed at the inconsistency of these words with real life.
            1. apro
              apro 14 December 2020 16: 21
              -3
              Quote: Carte
              They didn’t laugh at his words.
              They laughed at the inconsistency of these words with real life.

              Yes ... but today you understand what corresponded ...
              1. Kart
                Kart 15 December 2020 11: 11
                +1
                In the USSR invented by the propagandists, yes, they did.
                In the real country of the USSR, no, they did not correspond.
                1. apro
                  apro 15 December 2020 11: 16
                  -1
                  Quote: Carte
                  In the USSR invented by the propagandists, yes, they did.
                  In the real country of the USSR, no, they did not correspond.

                  You and I have different realities and different goal-setting.
                  1. Kart
                    Kart 15 December 2020 11: 18
                    +2
                    There is only one reality. She is outside the window - on the streets, in factories (of which 2020 were launched in 150), in stores, finally.
                    The second - a fictional one - is in the minds of propagandists.
                    1. apro
                      apro 15 December 2020 11: 23
                      -2
                      Russian. Can you tell me what Russian you are wearing now? What Russian device do you write comments from? What Russian car do you take to work? What Russian plane do you take on vacation? And why are there really fewer Russians in Russia than in the RSFSR?
                    2. Kart
                      Kart 15 December 2020 11: 40
                      +2
                      Dressed in all ours, except for shoes. and even then, you could buy domestic, maybe better than theirs. Lada Vesta Cross car, green metallic, very beautiful. Made in Russia.
                      I don't fly on vacation, I go to my relatives.
                      More questions?
                      A counter question - where did you get so many "Russians" from?
                    3. apro
                      apro 15 December 2020 11: 56
                      0
                      Quote: Carte
                      Dressed in all ours

                      ???? what is it?
                      Quote: Carte
                      ... Lada Vesta Cross car

                      Renault ...
                      Quote: Carte
                      A counter question - where did you get so many "Russians" from?

                      I am not Russian. I am Soviet. We are few.
  • d4rkmesa
    d4rkmesa 13 December 2020 16: 52
    +1
    "About normal free medicine" - oh, I remember about this medicine. Yes, there are many doctors, but for some reason the same queues are everywhere in offices, to pediatricians, etc. When you come to an appointment, they will appoint a bunch of useless injections in the ass. There were almost no modern antibiotics in the form of suspensions and tablets, occasionally only "Made in India" came across. But the famous amoxiclav at the end of the 80s was made in friendly Yugoslavia. And so, only hardcore - well-known ampoules of penicillin (which was already ineffective at that time) and injections, a reusable syringe, no autoclaves in the doctors' office - only "from a saucepan" where they were boiled. And no probiotics! Yes, you can easily be sent to the hospital for "treatment" - for the most part, it is pointless to spend time in the company of poor fellows. There they will give you glucose with a dropper, give you the same injections, make mustard plasters and, perhaps, undergo a course of physiotherapy. No complicated therapeutic protocols. However, in some cases, even such treatment was beneficial, but this is the level of the 60s!
    1. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx 13 December 2020 19: 04
      +5
      Quote: d4rkmesa
      oh, I remember about this medicine.

      and I remember that medicine and today. There were few medicines, they cost a penny. And the complex operations for which we collect money "sms-kami" were carried out free of charge. Probably you have come across Svyatoslav Fedorov's eye microsurgery clinic. Such centers should have been around the country. Where Fedorov and clinics are there ...
      The shortage of instruments, drugs and everything else related to medicine arose only because the country's party leadership preferred to send billions to vaccinate the peoples of Africa. And the surgical practice in the clinics of the world was ... in the wild fantasies of Soviet doctors. We were the ones who built a nuclear power plant for bananas, and we had to pay hard currency for training doctors.
      1. passerby
        passerby 14 December 2020 04: 28
        +3
        I found Soviet oncology, when the only treatment was to cut something off, no chemotherapy, no radiation therapy, cut something off, waited a little - survived well, metastases started, well, go home and die there.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 04: 39
          +2
          Quote: bystander
          I found Soviet oncology, when the only treatment was to cut something off, no chemotherapy, no radiation therapy, cut something off, waited a little - survived well, metastases started, well, go home and die there.

          My grandmother's cousin was also sent five years ago, and my friend's was my stepfather. Another friend's father died in the hospital corridor, although there were vacant wards. But paid. And you are going to sell me about Soviet medicine? They didn’t want to have an operation for my father this year, my sister went to negotiate with the head physician, since she is also a physician. One hell, died. They also sent home.
          1. passerby
            passerby 14 December 2020 04: 59
            +4
            Of course I will. After all, I myself have come across Soviet oncology and current oncology, which is certainly not equal to Western ones, but much better than what was in the USSR, now at least chemotherapy and radiation therapy are being done, and in 1987 in the USSR they did not even talk about this, although all over the world such methods of treatment were actively practiced. And I am also closely familiar with dental treatment in the USSR, when without anesthesia they drilled and pulled out teeth and sculpted cement fillings. I remember well.
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 05: 10
              +2
              Quote: bystander
              and in 1987, the USSR did not even talk about it,

              Since 87, 33 years have passed. Incidentally, I was in 89 with bronchitis. In a double room. Two weeks until complete recovery.
              Quote: bystander
              And I am also closely familiar with dental treatment in the USSR, when without anesthesia they drilled and pulled out teeth and sculpted cement fillings. I remember well.

              Do you have any money? Now you have to pay for everything. And dentists came to our school every year. And he treated his mother's teeth at the enterprise. Is free. Oh, you want it like in the USA, I guess? So there they will tear off the last pants for the treatment of the tooth. And you still have to stay.
              1. passerby
                passerby 14 December 2020 06: 46
                +5
                If anything, chemotherapy appeared in the West in the 40s of the last century, read about methotrexate, for example, but in the USSR, even in 1987, they could only cut and that's it. And now I will somehow find money for dental treatment, but in the USSR there were simply no options for me, even with money, even without it. This is not to mention the fact that now, according to compulsory medical insurance policies, they are treated with anesthesia.
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 06: 57
                  +2
                  Quote: bystander
                  And now I will somehow find money for dental treatment

                  You'll find? And, say, a pensioner will find it? A kindergarten teacher? The average rassian with a salary of 17 thousand?
                  1. passerby
                    passerby 14 December 2020 09: 26
                    +1
                    Have you read about the compulsory medical insurance, or considered it unnecessary?
                2. d4rkmesa
                  d4rkmesa 15 December 2020 20: 54
                  0
                  Methotrexate is a thing, sorry, now there are problems with it.
              2. d4rkmesa
                d4rkmesa 15 December 2020 20: 54
                +1
                "And dentists came to our school every year." - it would be better not to come. Children sometimes graduated from school without 2-3 teeth.
    2. Svarog
      Svarog 13 December 2020 19: 34
      +3
      Yes, you can easily be sent to the hospital for "treatment" - for the most part, it is pointless to spend time in the company of poor fellows.

      Did you ever live in the USSR ..? I was diagnosed with pneumonia for 5 years, they cured .. but gave complications to the muscle of the myocardium, they cured .. my grandfather had three heart attacks and he lived in the village .. died of cancer in the 90s ..
      And if it were as you say ... everyone would die .. Right now, we have a problem with demography and in this trouble, we have a significant share of medicine ..
      1. d4rkmesa
        d4rkmesa 15 December 2020 21: 08
        +1
        "then everyone would have died ..." - well, why generalize like that, the human body is still a life-loving thing, often people with any kind of treatment (as luck would have it, in the provinces it is worse, somewhere in departmental hospitals - better), but under supervision still coped with sores. As for childhood pneumonia, pah-pah with this as a parent did not come across, but in general, usually a bottle with an antibiotic in the form of a suspension does not leave a chance for pneumococcus to do things. Here you probably need to clarify: Soviet medicine was massive - and this is one of its few advantages, but relied on undeveloped pharmaceuticals, backward industry, practically no biotechnology (Yugoslavia, Hungary and some other countries of Eastern Europe were head and shoulders above the USSR in this). Complex operations were sporadic. Even Fedorov's operations became massive only in the early 90s. The real state of affairs became clear under Gorbachev, when it was no longer possible to hide the massive HIV infection through reusable syringes.
  • Sahalinets
    Sahalinets 13 December 2020 15: 49
    +8
    Moscow, Peter lived well. I'm talking about cities where I lived a little. Maybe somewhere else it was good. But the main part of the country ate poorly and dreamed of sausage. Not only about her, of course, but it was a kind of symbol. Around Moscow there is a hunger belt, people on Saturday went by train to the capital to buy basic products such as vegetable oil or sausages. Ural - a hunger zone back in the 70s, they sat on coupons. Buying a pound of boiled sausage after standing in line for two hours is happiness! And more in one hand did not give.
    And there are a lot of such examples. Soviet people in the provinces never saw many products at all.
    1. Blacksmith 55
      Blacksmith 55 13 December 2020 16: 31
      +7
      I would like to add.
      The supply of Moscow and some union republics compared to the RSFSR is like day and night.
      Yes, all the republics were supplied better than Russia itself.
      It is impossible to understand this.
    2. Svarog
      Svarog 13 December 2020 16: 40
      +9
      Quote: Sahalinets
      Moscow, Peter lived well. I'm talking about cities where I lived a little. Maybe somewhere else it was good. But the main part of the country ate poorly and dreamed of sausage.

      In general, I spent my childhood in the Ulyanovsk region .. and did not notice the shortage of sausage .. and we had homemade sausage .. there were unprecedented bananas .. this delicacy was brought from Moscow, it was green, not ripe .. I waited two days .. then I ate it. . and to this day I have no attraction to them ..
      My own milk, eggs, meat .. I was still a child in the 80s, but I don't remember any "bad eating" at all .. sweets every grandmother suvala ..
    3. Sergej1972
      Sergej1972 14 December 2020 10: 14
      0
      Since the 70s, my parents and other rural relatives have never had a shortage of meat. In the earlier period it was, of course, worse and poorer. Chicken, turkey, duck, goose, rabbit, pork. Only beef was rare. But they still bought, and sometimes "got" the sausage. Quite often, and in considerable quantities. For meat is meat, and sausage is sausage, this is different.) Having their own cattle, relatives were indignant at the shortage of sausage. The only thing is that, unlike the townspeople, they understood that good ham or smoked sausage cannot be cheap.
    4. Kart
      Kart 14 December 2020 16: 26
      +4
      Around Moscow there is a hunger belt, people on Saturday went by train to the capital to buy elementary products such as vegetable oil or sausages. Ural - a hunger zone back in the 70s, they sat on coupons.

      Yes, it is useless.
      They have at least a stake on their heads.
      They will hammer their own - in the USSR everything was better than now.
      What for? But this is an interesting question.
  • EvilLion
    EvilLion 14 December 2020 09: 52
    +2
    At that time, even diapers were not available. And a lot of other things that did not require megatechnologies.
  • nnz226
    nnz226 18 December 2020 22: 05
    0
    Personal example: I spent my childhood in Rybinsk (this is where NPO Saturn is) I go to grade 1 (1964) - my parents send me to the store. There: 4 varieties of butter, including the real "Vologda", 3-4 varieties of cheese, a couple of different varieties of sausage, but only boiled. I graduate from school in 1974: in the same store from the above there is NOTHING !!! I entered the Leningrad University, and, going on vacation to my parents, I was carrying a whole travel bag of food! So .... Then the term (ironic) arose - "the starving Volga region" (not the 20s under Lenin, but the 70s under Brezhnev) And the "sausage trains" are also an "invention" of the Soviet system ...
  • Uncle lee
    Uncle lee 13 December 2020 14: 57
    +14
    And there are sausages, and the yards are full of cars, but life is somehow bleak ...
    1. apro
      apro 13 December 2020 14: 58
      0
      Quote: Uncle Lee
      , but life is somehow bleak ...

      You don't know how to use it.
      1. Bumblebee_3
        Bumblebee_3 13 December 2020 15: 05
        +11
        apro (Frolov Oleg
        Quote: apro
        You don't know how to use it.

        Can you teach me how to use the "joyless life"? I am one of those who "did not fit into the market economy"
        1. apro
          apro 13 December 2020 15: 12
          +1
          Quote: Bumblebee_3
          apro (Frolov Oleg
          Quote: apro
          You don't know how to use it.

          Can you teach me how to use the "joyless life"? I am one of those who "did not fit into the market economy"

          Likewise chief ... try not to strain.
          1. Bumblebee_3
            Bumblebee_3 13 December 2020 15: 51
            +5
            apro (Oleg Frolov)
            I don’t know how you manage to live without straining, I cannot do anything without straining. This is the current situation.
            1. apro
              apro 13 December 2020 15: 55
              +4
              Quote: Bumblebee_3
              Don't know how you do it

              There is work. Work no. So no. Tired of this race beyond the elusive horizon.
              1. Imobile
                Imobile 13 December 2020 18: 04
                -2
                My mother lived under Stalin, went through the war, there was hunger every day, and not just a slight feeling of hunger, but all the grain was raked out until 56 years old. We ground birch branches and ate. When there was absolutely nothing, and even light and sewn with a torch from pieces of cloth something similar to clothing. And she says that then happy people walked around, joking jokes, no matter how hard it was and they did not know whether they would last another week or not. About today's life, she says that they did not even dream then that it would be so good. In her presence, I do not even stutter that Putin and his friends are stealing, but I listen to her every story about the war and hunger, I will tell people.
                1. Uncle lee
                  Uncle lee 14 December 2020 05: 01
                  0
                  Quote: Imobile
                  until 56 year.

                  I went to school in 57 ... And I don't remember something about birch branches ... There were no pickles, but they didn't starve either.
                  1. Imobile
                    Imobile 14 December 2020 09: 22
                    -3
                    Where are you from? In Georgia, even 43 people ate kebabs. In 56 cities there was no longer hunger. Speech about Tverskaya, Pskov, Smolenskaya
                    1. Uncle lee
                      Uncle lee 14 December 2020 10: 27
                      +1
                      Primorye and Khabarovsk Territory.
        2. Freeman
          Freeman 13 December 2020 18: 50
          +1
          Quote: Bumblebee_3
          apro (Frolov Oleg
          Quote: apro
          You don't know how to use it.

          Can you teach me how to use the "joyless life"? I am one of those who "did not fit into the market economy"

          As an option. wink
          A Russian person is not the one who has nothing, but the one who has
          nothing - and to hell with it
          .
    2. Deck
      Deck 13 December 2020 15: 01
      +14
      but life is somehow bleak ...


      And what girls were before!
      1. apro
        apro 13 December 2020 15: 03
        +16
        Quote: Deck
        but life is somehow bleak ...


        And what girls were before!

        And how it stood ...
      2. Crowe
        Crowe 13 December 2020 15: 04
        +17
        No silicone, botex and hair extensions. The girls were just super !!! Real !!!
        1. Deck
          Deck 13 December 2020 15: 06
          0
          Painted with hydrogen peroxide, with hairpieces, in bike pants and a Komsomol badge !!!
          1. Van 16
            Van 16 13 December 2020 15: 24
            +11
            Come on .. Peroxide and badges were, but about hairpieces and pantaloons you don't even go there, it's for the older generation. At least our girls didn't wear such a thing))
          2. for
            for 13 December 2020 18: 07
            +4
            Quote: Deck
            in bike pantaloons

            Better in thongs without children.
      3. Uncle lee
        Uncle lee 13 December 2020 15: 04
        +7
        Quote: Deck
        And what girls

        I agree ! Each age has its own charms, and in youth, also strangers ... repeat
      4. The leader of the Redskins
        The leader of the Redskins 13 December 2020 15: 12
        +3
        Yes ... In the late 80s, early nineties, it was like blowing up roofs!
        I remember very well how I went to see my uncle in Novograd Volynsky. And many of the GSVG moved there. And how the company of virgins went to the city park, and on one mini skirt made of leather, so that the panties are visible and the tights in a large net! Well, straight "Intergirl"! My sister lifted my jaw and wiped my drool!))) laughing
    3. Alexey Sommer
      Alexey Sommer 13 December 2020 15: 09
      -24%
      Quote: Uncle Lee
      And there are sausages, and the yards are full of cars, but life is somehow bleak ...

      and she's always bleak for losers like you. hi
      1. Uncle lee
        Uncle lee 13 December 2020 15: 23
        +12
        Apparently you have an oil well, which is why you are so lucky! And I’m all with my own hands and my head ...
        And I advise you to read "Hot Stone" by A. Gaidar, maybe you will understand something ... Although I doubt it, you are our lucky one!
        1. Alexey Sommer
          Alexey Sommer 13 December 2020 15: 38
          -21%
          Quote: Uncle Lee
          And I’m all with my own hands and my head ...

          Apparently, you don't need your hands, not your head)))
          And where is the oil?
          ps Although you need hands to solder the cons. ) laughing
          You are funny)
          1. Uncle lee
            Uncle lee 13 December 2020 15: 41
            +7
            And where is the loser? You watch the expressions, lucky with a head and hands! hi
            1. Alexey Sommer
              Alexey Sommer 13 December 2020 15: 42
              -17%
              Quote: Uncle Lee
              And where is the loser? You watch the expressions, lucky with a head and hands! hi

              Because your life is bleak.
              And what to watch then?
              What's wrong?
              ps you yourself would follow. And there would be no need to ask questions.
              1. Uncle lee
                Uncle lee 13 December 2020 15: 45
                +4
                We speak different languages ​​! Goodbye!
  • ul_vitalii
    ul_vitalii 13 December 2020 14: 59
    +2
    Now someone's blood will be shed, again the torpedo was launched. smile
    1. apro
      apro 13 December 2020 15: 04
      -4
      Quote: ul_vitalii
      Now someone's blood will be shed, again the torpedo was launched. smile

      Somewhere Jews rub their hands ...
      1. ul_vitalii
        ul_vitalii 13 December 2020 15: 11
        +2
        And not Jews either. yes
      2. The leader of the Redskins
        The leader of the Redskins 13 December 2020 15: 27
        -4
        And cyclists.
  • WayKheThuo
    WayKheThuo 13 December 2020 15: 01
    +12
    I read the title and waited for a more or less in-depth study and disclosure of the topic, but I received a weak, meaningless unsubscribe article.
    Unfortunately, I can't get a plus.
    Well, no matter how.
    1. Sergey Valov
      Sergey Valov 13 December 2020 15: 32
      +6
      More or less disclosure of the topic will draw on a monograph of pages of 500 - 600. Although in principle everything is more or less simple, we were taught this in the early 80s in advanced training courses. The Soviet economy and planning, as an integral part of it, were not initially set for progress, hence the intermediate results, and, accordingly, the final. And the movement forward was carried out exclusively by volitional methods, and not by self-regulation of the system.
      1. Kart
        Kart 14 December 2020 16: 31
        +3
        Quote: Sergey Valov
        Soviet economy and planning as an integral part of it were not initially set for progress

        In the quote box!
        This is a solid five.
        This is the whole essence of the Soviet economy and planning - a dead ideologized cadaver that has nothing to do with real people made of bones and flesh.
    2. depressant
      depressant 13 December 2020 15: 40
      +15
      Everyone is tired, colleague WayKhe Thuo)))
      Here I look out the window, and there is winter. In the western room through the window I see a heavy snowfall, and through the window in the east - settled snow, no snowfall. How can this be? Maybe ...))
      As for the deficit - it is always the work of human hands and someone's purposeful will. The residents of Stavropol have sold food products abroad (milk, butter, sour cream, cottage cheese, return, all sorts of vegetables, grain) worth more than 650 million dollars, they are happy, and the unsold leftovers - to us in Central Russia - go up the price! And I am more than sure that the butter they sold abroad does not contain palm oil. As well as sour cream and cottage cheese.
      In fact, the topic of the article is good, but winter powerlessness, tiredness from everything. Well, maybe tomorrow, diluting the boredom of work, people will tense up)))
      1. Was mammoth
        Was mammoth 13 December 2020 20: 58
        +4
        Quote: depressant
        Here I look out the window, and there is winter. In the western room through the window I see a heavy snowfall, and through the window in the east - settled snow, no snowfall. How can this be? Maybe ...))

        And, at this time in Ryazan .... Minus 12 and not a single snowflake. winkBut, snow is promised next week. Children went ice skating to a forest lake. The ice is clean, like on an indoor ice rink. ... Winter! belay
        I read the article and the comments and it seems that the deficit is in itself, and the country is itself. But, after all, two world wars, three revolutions, a Civil War swept across the country in the twentieth century ... The country was restored more than once. This was laid down in all five-year plans. Group "A" and group "B". Who will remember what these groups were when planning? wink However, every year people lived better and better. According to the possibilities of the country. Until the bad memory of Gorbachev. The times of Brezhnev can be considered the "golden" time of socialism.
        Quote: paul3390
        Because no one told us that the country and socialism were going to destroy .. If you remember - they rubbed us that everything that happens is just modernization and improvement.

        Quote: paul3390
        We were stupidly taken to lie.

        "Gold words!
        1. Kart
          Kart 14 December 2020 16: 34
          +2
          Do you know why it happened?
          Because those who "stupidly deceived you" turned out to be smarter, stronger and more adventurous than you.
          It was an epic failure of all the ideological propaganda of the USSR, including the best education in the world.
          1. Was mammoth
            Was mammoth 14 December 2020 21: 12
            0
            Quote: Carte
            Do you know why it happened?

            It is only in fairy tales that good always triumphs over evil. In life, lies are stronger. But, "how much rope does not twist ...".
            For nothing, perhaps even a certain Soloviev from TV began to call himself a Soviet person. wink
            1. Kart
              Kart 15 December 2020 11: 16
              0
              Well, if this someone, by definition of your "liars of what the world has never seen," so - has he changed now? Turned into an honest man? And just because he called himself your supporter?
              That's your whole definition of truth - "who is not with us, he is against us." Well, what about you - so immediately an excellent, right person.
              Obviously, this very situation automatically takes your entire ideology out of the realm of honest and truthful. and therefore the assertion that you are "for the people" is also subject to strong doubts.
              1. Was mammoth
                Was mammoth 15 December 2020 22: 35
                0
                Quote: Carte
                Obviously

                Obviously, you have a problem with the logic. wink
    3. Overlock
      Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 29
      +39
      Quote: WayKhe Thuo
      I was waiting for a more or less in-depth study and disclosure of the topic

      those who lived in those days do not need treatises. Everything was simple: the elders in the Kremlin did nothing and all the time thought about the war, how to answer the foe. For the sake of this, civilian production was abandoned - televisions, refrigerators, textiles, footwear, agriculture. And most importantly, they didn’t want to vacate their chairs. Their shift came, as talentless as they are. This is not surprising - like is drawn to like. Then the “Komsomol members” and the fighters of the invisible front stood at the helm. But in the economy, nothing has changed - as they drove oil and gas, and drove. And times have changed, but they are still reluctant to vacate their chairs. So we are waiting for "Swan Lake"
      1. WayKheThuo
        WayKheThuo 13 December 2020 20: 37
        +3
        More or less disclosure of the topic will pull on a monograph of pages of 500 - 600.

        Yes it is. The topic is extremely difficult and multifaceted, but the title of the article reassured me, I thought that really there was material more interesting on VO than in TyTruba, but no - but those oud. As for the monograph, any sensible scientific work can, with the proper skill, be expressed in several sentences, and even on an A4 sheet of paper, this is generally the case - it is very easy to convey the essence. This, of course, if the work is efficient and useful, if over 9000 "hairy" formulas have been written and the author himself does not know what for, then there is no way to do without "how easy it is to see and not difficult to prove".

        Everyone is tired, colleague WayKhe Thuo)))

        Yes, yes. You have a change of weather from window to window, and I have a continuous series of business trips like a ferris wheel. But nothing - NG will come, he will put things in order. Hold on, just a couple of weeks left.

        But in the economy, nothing has changed - as they drove oil and gas, and drove.

        So, nothing has changed since tsarist times. Previously, they drove hemp and forest, furs and gold, and now all of the above, plus oil, gas and talented specialists. Evolving, you understand.
        For it was said by Stolypin (?): "In Russia, everything changes in 10 years, nothing in 200 years."
        Aptly, caustically, insulting, but true.
        1. depressant
          depressant 13 December 2020 22: 26
          +4
          Colleague, you made me wake up: "How? Is it really only two weeks before the New Year?!?" I was horrified by the accelerated flow of time, which passes by the perception so that you do not notice - but excuse me, this is my life! )))
          As for the article, in the comments above, a colleague of ROSS 42, reasoning at length on the topic set by her, forced me from his reasoning to deduce the law of the transformation of the USSR into today's Russia. The meaning of the law is reduced to mirroring. Indeed, in the mirror, what is right looks left and vice versa. So again:

          USSR - there is money, no goods. Russia - no money, there are goods. And the same, that before, that now, the inability to buy.

          In the USSR, there was money because there was industry - both category A (heavy industry) and category B (light and food). That is, there were jobs for everyone and everyone, such that they could satisfy the material needs of everyone to a sufficient extent. And the shortage of goods subsequently developed due to Khrushchev's breakdown of the flexible system of Stalin's cooperatives, responsive to any, most capricious requirements of the consumer market. It was a local industry! With the minimum deduction of taxes to the state treasury and with the maximum - to the local one. The administrations of not only the Union republics - of any of the smallest settlements were extremely interested in its existence and development.
          If Khrushchev did not break this system, now we would have a Chinese version of the Union, that is, we would be inundated with consumer goods of our own production and of the highest quality ...
          Gorbachev tried to return the cooperatives, but it was too late - the goal was already to destroy the Union, and the Gorbachev cooperatives went under the knife. The reasons for the creation and death of perestroika cooperatives were previously discussed at VO many times.

          There is no money in Russia because well-paid jobs, unlike the Union, are in huge deficit. Unemployment. Life on handouts, on retirement, on credit. Why is that? Why is there no money, but there are goods, and they are not in short supply?
          And because there is no money, because the jobs that produce these goods are in China, Turkey, etc. But not in Russia. And salaries for the production of these goods are received not by the Russians, but by the Chinese, Turks, etc. They produce, they receive wages, they can buy what they produce, and someone brings the surplus of those goods to Russia. And so Russians walk past the windows and do not buy anything - there is no money, they have not earned! Because there are no jobs in Russia where those goods are produced. So there are no salaries.

          I just want to exclaim: "President Putin! .. Where are the promised 25 million high-paying jobs?!?"
          But I am silent. And then the colleagues on the forum will beat him for the demand, as for the told anecdote with a gray beard.
          1. WayKheThuo
            WayKheThuo 13 December 2020 23: 43
            +2
            There is no money in Russia because well-paid jobs, unlike the Union, are in huge deficit.

            There is money in Russia. A lot of money - just look at the capital outflow and our mega-projects.
            Another thing is that this money is spent with the efficiency of Papen's steam engine.
            Many people say, usually through the lips, that if you have a raw materials economy - it's bad. I do not think so. You can have excellent technologies, but if you do not have coal, oil, gas, ores and other elements that make up basis technological chains - you are helpless.
            Raw materials are the backbone. Without it, nowhere: neither there nor here.
            Moreover, raw materials are the most important element, because no mind games can replace it. We still don’t understand this, but the West and Asia understood it a long time ago, because they have been sitting without raw materials for almost the last 200 years.
            It is of paramount importance for us to understand that raw materials are our flesh and blood, and giving them "over the hill" in exchange for colored candy wrappers is the height of stupidity. We need to process the raw materials ourselves and produce the finished product. "No" to the global market, for this is a deception working for the benefit of a handful of rich people, "Yes" to the full cycle of processing and production of goods and services for the benefit of exclusively and only citizens of the Russian Federation. Then jobs will appear. Probably. But it is not exactly.
            I think so.
  • Egoza
    Egoza 13 December 2020 15: 03
    +16
    Unpleasant topic. I remember how at the Glushkov Institute a computer program was developed for the distribution of finances in the economy. BUT hacked at the root. How! They swung at the power of the party apparatus and the theft of officials. That is why the deficit "suddenly arose" like winter, which always "comes unexpectedly"
    1. Gato
      Gato 13 December 2020 15: 36
      +8
      Unpleasant topic

      Not that word. In the USSR, there were also much more ambitious projects - for example, something like the "Soviet Internet", not for social networks and porn, but solely to optimize planning and distribution. Was hacked to death for the reason you specified.
      In general, there are no simple answers to the topic of the article. It seems to me that the matter is in the finiteness of resources: the state provided free housing, education, medicine and guaranteed employment, plus a completely inadequate bias towards the military-industrial complex - and any consumer goods received leftovers and was generally secondary.
      1. Dart2027
        Dart2027 13 December 2020 15: 56
        +6
        Quote: Gato
        It seems to me that the matter is in the finiteness of resources: the state provided free housing, education, medicine and guaranteed employment, plus a completely inadequate bias towards the military-industrial complex - and any consumer goods received leftovers and was generally secondary.

        One of the main reasons. That is, it is very easy to believe in the deliberate creation of a deficit, but the USSR initially focused on this, as Stalin said:
        So, we had comrades who were frightened by the difficulties and began to call the party to retreat. They said: "What do we need your industrialization and collectivization, machines, ferrous metallurgy, tractors, combines, automobiles? We would rather give more manufactory, buy more raw materials for the production of consumer goods and give the population more of all those little things than people's life is beautiful." The creation of an industry with our backwardness, and even a first-class industry, is a dangerous dream. "
        Of course, we could have 3 billion rubles in foreign currency, obtained through the most severe economy and spent on the creation of our industry - we could turn them on the import of raw materials and the intensification of the production of consumer goods. This is also a kind of "plan". But with such a "plan" we would have neither metallurgy, nor machine building, nor tractors and cars, nor aviation and tanks. We would find ourselves unarmed in the face of external enemies. We would undermine the foundations of socialism in our country. We would be held captive by the internal and external bourgeoisie.

        That is, the initial installation was in a certain direction (reasonable, you can’t say anything), and then they simply went by inertia, although the urgent need for this had already disappeared.
        1. Gato
          Gato 13 December 2020 16: 11
          +8
          That is, the initial installation went in a certain direction (reasonable, you can’t say anything), and then they just went by inertia

          Exactly. I will say more, the excessive military power may have been the result of the psychological distortion of the then leadership, which survived the war. Nobody wanted a repetition of 1941, and there was no guarantee that the cold war would not develop into a hot one. And nobody wanted to meet her in jeans and with a hundred varieties of sausages at the ready instead of tanks and missiles.
          1. Egoza
            Egoza 13 December 2020 17: 18
            +3
            Quote: Gato
            the excessive military power may have been the result of a psychological distortion of the then leadership, which survived the war. Nobody wanted a repetition of 1941, and there was no guarantee that the cold war would not develop into a hot one.

            However, at the time of Comrade. I.V. Stalin's artels worked very well. And the quality of the goods was at a very high level.
            1. Sergej1972
              Sergej1972 14 December 2020 10: 30
              +1
              Only even in the sphere of light industry, state-owned enterprises produced many times more products compared to industrial cartels, which were analogues of collective farms in the sphere of industry. By the way, we forget that there were also other type of artels that sold exclusively their own labor and did not have their own means of production. They existed in Stalin's time, right up to the beginning of the 50s. This is when high-altitude installers and representatives of other professions united in artels and performed work at state enterprises and construction sites under a contract.
  • Old jew
    Old jew 13 December 2020 15: 07
    +13
    Back in the 60s, Academician Glushko proposed creating an information network for transmitting data from enterprises to the State Planning Committee. This purely technical measure cut off the party organs from economic information and made it impossible to influence decision-making. The academician's proposal was rejected. The creation of such a network greatly helped in solving many problems in the economy of the USSR and would have been the impetus for the creation of a Soviet analogue of the Internet back in the 60s. Not to mention the progress in creating the element base for computers.
    1. Gato
      Gato 13 December 2020 16: 14
      +3
      Back in the 60s, Academician Glushko proposed to create an information network to transfer data from enterprises to the State Planning Committee

      By the way, there was another dark story. At one time, there were stories that the impetus for the creation in the states of ARPANET was the Soviet developments of the late 50s, especially in the part of the 1822 protocol.
  • svp67
    svp67 13 December 2020 15: 08
    +7
    the backers of the artificial deficit were far more influential than even the head of the Soviet government.
    And so it is, okay there is sausage and jeans, but to provoke a shortage of railway or air tickets, given that the same trains were empty on the route, this is the highest class from these "patrons"
    1. The leader of the Redskins
      The leader of the Redskins 13 December 2020 15: 30
      -1
      Well I do not know! I saw empty trains in 1986 in Ukraine, when Chernobyl went bang. Then the attitude was such that there would be no panic and the people would not leave. And so ... That at sea, that from the Ukrainian SSR to Moscow - there are always tickets by pull, and there are a lot of people in the carriages!
  • Roman1970_1
    Roman1970_1 13 December 2020 15: 13
    +3
    So by the end of the 1980s, in many settlements of the USSR, there were interruptions in the supply of such goods as condensed milk, natural coffee, cocoa, boiled and smoked sausage,


    What interruptions were observed?
    These goods were not on sale without interruption.
    There was consistency in their absence
  • Bashkirkhan
    Bashkirkhan 13 December 2020 15: 13
    -1
    The Khrushchev-Brezhnev era is the time of the reign of political officials (political workers, members of military councils, nomenklatura political workers), who, due to their wretched way of thinking, a complete lack of healthy pragmatism and laziness, could not provide the country with stupid food and the most necessary consumer goods, otherwise what was poor and of low quality, they could not get out of the dead ideological templates, they reacted absolutely ineffectively to external and internal challenges, but they even helped a lot to the detriment of the Soviet people, all sorts of socialism-oriented regimes, whose leaders recently climbed off a palm tree and broke their tail ...
    Red-footed political workers, this is me about the Khrushchev-Brezhnev communists, only those fanatically engaged in making mistakes in relation to the Russian people - they fed and nurtured all kinds of Georgian-Armenian and Lithuanian-Latvian-Estonian outskirts, raised and poured unthinkable funds into Soviet Ukraine, and the hardworking and talented Russian people spread rot, and also lied and hypocritically ... In central Russia, villages without gas and often without normal hospitals, because during the Soviet era, gas was supplied and new hospitals were built for ragul and Baltic tigers, which all these ungrateful creatures forgot ... But now there will be no more such errors, I hope.
    1. Sergej1972
      Sergej1972 14 December 2020 10: 35
      +1
      And to be honest, most of these political workers rose sharply up the career ladder from 1937-1938. If there were no massive repressions, most of them would have remained the second, eternal deputies, workers of the district-city level. It was during Stalin's time that they began to make a career.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • parusnik
    parusnik 13 December 2020 15: 19
    +14
    With another rise in prices for goods, services, an increase in the dollar exchange rate, articles on how bad things were in the USSR, VO appeared on various sites, and it turned out to be no exception. smile Moreover, this is already a tradition. smile
    1. Overlock
      Overlock 13 December 2020 16: 31
      +37
      Quote: parusnik
      Moreover, this is already a tradition.

      and before each performance of the leader
      1. Svarog
        Svarog 13 December 2020 16: 58
        +7
        Quote: Overlock
        Quote: parusnik
        Moreover, this is already a tradition.

        and before each performance of the leader

        It's hard to call him a leader ..
      2. paul3390
        paul3390 13 December 2020 19: 09
        +5
        and before each performance of the leader

        To be honest, he looks more like a shaman-spellcaster with horns and a tambourine than a leader in a war gear with feathers and a spear ..
    2. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 14 December 2020 01: 03
      0
      This is yes. In some places I read this from the patented cheers of propagandists that make my eyes go over my head. There are such miracles of demagoguery and verbal balancing act that the legendary State Department is crying with envy.
  • General failure
    General failure 13 December 2020 15: 27
    +5
    In fact, not all goods were in short supply, but the "newest", "fashionable" or superior quality.

    It's like Wait, all of a sudden, Porsches / Lamborghinis / Gelendas or the latest versions of flagship phones or the same "Louboutins" that are "ah" became available to everyone.
    Of course, there would not be enough of them for all.

    Wait, these goods are cut off from the mass buyer at an arbitrarily high price.

    Under the USSR, due to ideology, it was impossible to set the price arbitrarily, everyone has more or less the same money, so the distribution was based on the principle "who got up first, that and the sneakers" and "by acquaintance".

    And the moral is simple. If we had already undertaken to build a "new society", then it was necessary to build a new moneyless distribution system. That's just to come up with such a system so that it is fair in it there were no "bugs" with a swoop will not work.
    And the monetary system (with its bugs) has been developing for more than one thousand years.
  • U-58
    U-58 13 December 2020 15: 28
    +2
    The description seems to be correct, but somehow superficial.
    There was simply not enough food. Including for million-plus cities in the Urals and Siberia.
    That is, the cities for these decades forged the BASIC defense products (the most), but the state could not feed the workers.
    But Minsk, Vilnius and even Druskininkai with a population of 30 lived nothing to themselves.
    In 1985, the same Druskininkai even tucked Moscow into the belt. I was stunned by the shops there ...
    And how can such an imbalance be explained?
    Yes, the money was not spent on that.
    Yes, Moscow then was already sharing from the country and living its own life for itself.
    A set for the holiday in Sverdlovsk - 1 kg of doctor's sausage, 2 kg of half-rotten apples and a load of 1 kg of sugar.
    A set for a holiday for an installer from Mosproekt - 1 stick of Finnish salami (from Finland!), A glass jar of BLACK caviar, canned food: tongue in jelly, a jar of cod liver and "on load" - processed cheese "Viola" from Finland again.
  • fomin
    fomin 13 December 2020 15: 28
    +15
    About
    Quote: apro
    and the communes kept pestering themselves

    In my homeland, the district secretary built a house for himself in the city, for nowadays, a shed, so this house was taken away from him and the garden was given, as now the democrats steal such theft "commies" and have not seen in a dream, but not a single dog barked at On this occasion, they swept the whole country in front of our eyes, but they were silent about this, but how did the commies steal, mocked the people with free resort vouchers to the Crimea, tortured people? Tormented! And free education terrorized the Moscow underground democrats and terrorized the whole country, and crushed everyone with free medicine, and they absolutely scoffed the scoops by giving out free apartments, how can a fierce democrat not spit in them for all their meanness. As it is good now, there is no work. There is no salary, and if you have a job, then they pay Putin's minimum wage 12130 with something, you have to pay for everything for studies, rent, treatment for vouchers, and so on. and so on, this is a democratic life, this is not a scoop for you, they steal everything and do not imprison anyone for this, half of the country works in Moscow does not pay taxes, but they drive by cars, it's cool, in the places all industry is in ruins, but he saves China and will dress and shoe and feed with plastic rice, otherwise there was not enough sausage in the scoop? And you ask the Balts how things were with the sausage? 5-6 varieties of one smoked, smoked chickens about them and in Moscow not everyone heard about them, they fed their freaks like for slaughter, and you say there was not enough sausage, it was just not going there, then now heaps, pork skin sausage, chicken skins, soybeans, starch, sweeteners, thickeners, preservatives chew - I don't want to, here's a visual agitation of the victory of democracy over the scoop. Live rejoice, you are tired of the commies, so enjoy the surrogate sausage, rake up the minimum wage, and for gas, oil and other natural resources, they will receive other money for you, well, why do you need them in a free democratic country!
    1. depressant
      depressant 14 December 2020 00: 11
      +1
      I can not resist:
      Bravo, colleague of fomin! love good hi )))
  • Igoresha
    Igoresha 13 December 2020 15: 29
    +2
    I read and read but did not see the disclosure of the title topic. It seems to me that they did not produce much. The army, kindergarten schools, hospitals, etc. were fed tasty and nourishing food, but they did not get into the retail network except for the privileged cities.
    Uncle served in Transbaikalia, 70s, the regiment commander drank in the dining room - in shops, rolling. At the same time, the miners in Lugansk Donetsk were supplied better than Kharkov, where the entire Belgorod region went for food and partially the miners' Rostov, which was stocked with sausage in Lugansk. And all sorts of the Baltic states and Georgia, according to rumors, ate even better
    1. General failure
      General failure 13 December 2020 16: 27
      +3
      I was a student at 86-90 in Minsk, lived in a hostel.
      Live on 50 rubles. the scholarships were still difficult, but real. We had delicacies very rarely, but we didn’t get hungry from the word “absolutely”. Meat, milk, fish were on the table every day.
      I just had to organize a little and learn how to cook.
      1. Igoresha
        Igoresha 13 December 2020 16: 31
        0
        grandfathers remember about the Belarusian SSR with warmth and love - "there was a spoon in sour cream (s)"))
        1. General failure
          General failure 13 December 2020 16: 32
          +4
          Well yes. Without half a glass of sour cream, lunch at the student table was not lunch.
  • A_Lex
    A_Lex 13 December 2020 15: 31
    +11
    1. Really empty shelves in the country have been since 1989, when the country was deliberately prepared for collapse by the supreme party power together with the KGB. And the entire deficit of that period was the result of 3 processes:
    1.1: the beginning of the collapse of trusts, which came as a result of the "parade of sovereignties"
    1.2: the opening of borders, as a result of which the newly-minted businessmen, who at that time were called "cooperators", drove Soviet products abroad as part of the process of "accumulation of initial capital", which, thanks to the reforms of Perestroika, was already carried out on a legal basis, in contrast to the period of the shop workers who secretly appropriated the results of labor of the social means of production.
    1.3: in some cases there was direct sabotage, sanctioned from above, with the aim of causing discontent among the population, which was directly projected onto the Soviet regime, against the background of which the same Yeltsin was then perceived almost as a national hero.

    2. There was no shortage of food in the USSR restored after the war after the abolition of the cards, and could not exist in principle. Store shelves in this case are not an indicator, since in the USSR there was an extensive network of departmental canteens, public catering and centralized enterprises for the production of semi-finished products. The food was high quality on the one hand and cheap on the other. And they worked then, unlike now everything.

    3. If in the USSR there was a real shortage of food throughout its entire length, this would inevitably find its reflection in medical statistics - people would be sick en masse. However, we know that the people of that period were generally quite healthy precisely because of high-quality nutrition, the popularization of sports, preventive medicine, which was an integral part of the system of actually military medicine created under the leadership of Semashko, real labor protection in production. The situation is completely incomparable with today, when in the Russian Federation, as in the United States, there is an epidemic of obesity, which is directly a consequence of the consumption of finished products with a high content of trans fats in the form of the same palm oil.

    4. In the USSR, the main thing was achieved - the system solved the critical problems of life support for EVERYONE. Food, clothing, housing with infrastructure, transport, education, medicine, sports, culture - all this was provided not for the elite, but for everyone. Of course, it is provided within the framework of certain norms, because if someone wants to live in a castle and have a private plane, this can only be done if someone else lives on the street in a box from a copier. It doesn't happen otherwise.

    5. It should be understood that the USSR is now viewed through the eyes of the current consumer society, the main value of which is shopaholism. The whole life of a person in a consumer society revolves around receiving pleasure, the scale of which is not limited by anything, and the whole question is how much you personally can grab in order to live as beautifully as possible. This is how the West lives and it broadcasts this ideology to the whole world. The USSR was originally created as a state of mentally sane people who understand that pleasure is not the goal of life. And that is typical for most of its history in the USSR, for EVERYONE there was a real opportunity for self-realization, which, of course, does not imply a race of status consumption, when "since a neighbor bought a Zhiguli, then I also have to live no worse than others." The problem is that under the left deviationist Khrushchev, the construction of socialism was stopped, and under the right deviator Brezhnev, the tacit restoration of the bourgeois system with all the attributes relying on it in the form of status consumption and a life for pleasure as an end in itself took place. As a result, the bourgeoisie, which had been actively developing since the mid-60s, in full force declared itself by the mid-80s and naturally finished off the country, whose ideology at that time was completely incompatible with the bourgeois worldview.
    1. TOR2
      TOR2 13 December 2020 16: 17
      -5
      Quote: A_Lex
      And that is typical for most of its history in the USSR, for EVERYONE there was a real opportunity for self-realization, which, of course, does not imply a race of status consumption, when "since a neighbor bought a Zhiguli, then I also have to live no worse than others."

      Guess what? What is a luxury car? Why, then, such a society could not create an AC locomotive by itself. And the washing machine did not work either. Even the technology purchased from the Italians could not be started normally. An ordinary electric heating pad was copied. So where is this self-realization?
      1. A_Lex
        A_Lex 13 December 2020 16: 35
        +5
        It involved solving critical problems for everyone, which was valuable, because everyone knew that, unlike Western countries, he would not be left without food, housing and other services necessary for a normal human life. And for these services, which were typical and natural for every Soviet person, he would not have to work three jobs, undermining his health and actually depriving himself of full value, i.e. a varied life, and you don't have to take out a loan, driving yourself into long-term bondage, moreover, such when the bank knows exactly what you owe it, but you yourself don't know whether you will have a job in the future and whether you can pay off the bank or not ...

        In conditions of open confrontation with the capitalist system, which included the Western colonies in Africa, Latin America and Asia, regularly supplying them with cheap resources and at the same time serving as sales markets, the problem with the highest priority was security.

        And this problem was successfully solved, although the USSR was inferior to the West in terms of resources and personnel and after WWII was constantly under technological sanctions within the framework of the "Coordinating Committee for Multilateral Export Controls - CoCom", which the West introduced immediately after the Iron Curtain was lowered after the Fulton Churchill's speech.

        Against this background, a car in personal ownership was, of course, far from the first necessity and only a person with a bourgeois / bourgeois / bourgeois limited worldview for whom the main thing is to satisfy his personal desires could not understand this, and everything else does not interest him at all.
        1. TOR2
          TOR2 13 December 2020 23: 46
          -1
          Quote: A_Lex
          Against this background, a car in personal ownership was, of course, far from the first necessity and only a person with a bourgeois / bourgeois / burgher

          You tell this to those who live in remote areas and where the bus went once a day. I think you will be awarded with not such epithets there.
          1. A_Lex
            A_Lex 14 December 2020 13: 43
            +1
            I am not discussing the modern situation, when, to please the oligarchs, the infrastructure that worked for the benefit of everyone was destroyed. Under the USSR, planes flew to villages and there were hospitals with schools.
            1. TOR2
              TOR2 14 December 2020 21: 13
              0
              We flew, and what was the coverage. How to get to the district center which was 190 km away. from the regional I know not by hearsay. And how to sit in a queue with a temperature for 6 hours, besides, in a building that was built before the revolution. And at the expense of the oligarchs, you probably know their biography as well as I do and where they came from.
    2. paul3390
      paul3390 13 December 2020 18: 10
      +6
      The USSR was originally created as a state of mentally sane people who understand that pleasure is not the goal of life.

      I would say a little differently. People who understand that pleasure can be obtained not only by devouring, having sex and trying on cool clothes. And for example, from a well-done business, a complex problem solved, gaining new knowledge, and so on .. All that makes a person - a Human, and not just one of the varieties of primates ...
      1. A_Lex
        A_Lex 13 December 2020 18: 16
        +2
        If you look from this point of view, then something like this:

        I am at the very top and I am aware of it. It seems to everyone around that I am killing myself with work, but they do not understand that now I live at the very peak of clarity and beauty, the existence of which I did not even suspect. All my components are set to work. During the day I absorb, and in the evenings - in the moments before falling asleep - ideas explode in my head like fireworks. There is no greater pleasure in the world.
        It is impossible to believe that something will happen that will drain this seething energy, zeal that fills all my affairs. It is as if all the knowledge I have acquired in recent months has united and lifted me to the top of light and understanding. It is truth, love and beauty, fused together. This is a delight. How can I give up all this? Life and work - better than this a person cannot have anything. The answers are already inside me, and soon, very soon they will burst into my brain. If only I could solve one tiny problem! I pray that her solution turns out to be exactly what I am missing. But whatever it turns out to be, I'll try to be grateful for it.

        Keyes D. Flowers for Algernon
  • Doccor18
    Doccor18 13 December 2020 15: 46
    +1
    Quote: apro
    Quote: nnm
    Well, why is this distortion?

    Yes, because now, without a smile at those problems of the past, you will not even look ... neither you credit, nor unemployment, not an eternal shortage of money, you are not waiting for any package from the state, from your fellow citizens.

    I partially agree. But there were always enough problems, at all times. I respect the people who created the USSR, but in the later stages, the partocrats perverted and plowed everything. The film "From the Life of Fyodor Kuzkin" very peculiarly shows the life of a Soviet collective farmer. The old people said that much of this film was so in reality ...
    Any business, even the most necessary and important for everyone, can be destroyed ...
    1. nnm
      nnm 13 December 2020 16: 15
      0
      ... ... There was no shortage of food in the USSR restored after the war after the abolition of the cards, and there could not have been in principle

      As far as I understand, you haven't even heard of the Ryazan experiment? As well as its consequences ..
      As, however, and the rest of the theses - just a set of words that have little to do with real history.
      1. A_Lex
        A_Lex 13 December 2020 16: 57
        +3
        There is no point in commenting on hints and sophistry, since there is no factual material in hints and sophistry. There are real facts of constant, i.e. long-term deficit - state. And, of course, not in the typical format of bourgeois slanderous propaganda "I myself lived there, there was no meat or fish, I tell the truth, that's how everyone lived", since such personal revelations are unverifiable, which means they are unprovable.
  • A_Lex
    A_Lex 13 December 2020 15: 53
    +12
    6. As for communism and the notorious slogan "from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", which within the framework of the consumer society is interpreted approximately as follows - "I will go, work for an hour, and then go buy a Bentley and go on vacation to Hawaii for six months" ...
    So, it was initially assumed that communism would be professed by mentally sane people, each of whom would gain access to a product or service not in order to "wipe his neighbor's nose and live no worse than people", but because he has a REAL need, which he realizes, and does not act on consumer instincts, sweeping off the shelves the product that LIKES, and not CONSCIOUSLY NEEDED.

    Whereas the status show and consumption of the beautiful just because it is beautiful is precisely the direct consequence of real or brainwashing problems with the head, when a person actually consumes not so much to satisfy his real needs, but to demonstrate to others how well he lives and fully enjoys life. And within the framework of the race for a beautiful life, when the more beautiful, the more expensive the prices, and the salaries are set the way the owner of the company wants, there is not enough for everyone by definition. As a result, a situation inevitably arises where 1% owns 99%, and the rest eat palm oil cheese and feed wheat bread. And this is the best case. This system, which artificially implants jungle-type relationships in society, cannot work otherwise.
  • Overlock
    Overlock 13 December 2020 15: 56
    +35
    In the Soviet Union there was money, but there was a commodity - but not for everyone. Today - there is a product, but no money - again, not all.
    For example, the Central Bank said that the level of indebtedness of the population of the Russian Federation increased in 2020: in total, more than 72% of the country's households have debts to banks or other financial organizations, citizens of the Russian Federation must give banks more than 20 trillion rubles.
    It 12,7% morethan in 2019.
  • Senior seaman
    Senior seaman 13 December 2020 15: 59
    +5
    Everyone has their own experience. For example, in Kolyma, the supply was very good and there was not a shortage at all, but in principle, goods often appeared on the shelves that other regions could only dream of. Another such moment, people from us earned well and took .... a lot. A steamer came to Magadan with some fruit. Tangerines, bananas, it doesn't matter. Within a couple of days, they are already in all shops in workers' settlements along the highway. A couple more days and it was all over, because no one took the small package. Brought in boxes means a box. In baskets means basket. Also with sausage. - How old are you, a stick? - No, why so much, half a stick is enough ... Damn, this is more than a kilogram!
    But we come to the south ... Again, there is a lot of money, but everything was in the markets. Both meat and fruits. But these are more childhood memories.
    But at the end of the USSR, the deficit was also artificially organized. I'm talking about the famous "tobacco riots". Under centralized management, stop at the same time most of the tobacco factories for repairs, how's that?
  • Alexey Koshkarov
    Alexey Koshkarov 13 December 2020 16: 02
    +2
    As I remember now. As children, you can buy dried or smoked tulka for 8 kopecks and carry and eat this bag of fish all day. Very tasty and healthy
  • tatra
    tatra 13 December 2020 16: 03
    +4
    The Soviet communists tried to do what no other country was able to do under capitalism vaunted by the enemies of the communists - to provide all the people with cheap domestic products and cheap and natural products. But their external and internal enemies did not give them a single quiet year - they untied the destructive, murderous, predatory Civil War and the attack on the USSR in 1941, and then immediately imposed economic sanctions. In the USSR, imports accounted for a third of budget revenues, and in capital countries, in particular, in the United States, imports make up about 70-80% of budget revenues. And if now all imports are removed from the communists vaunted by the Russian enemies of the Communists "but now everything is there," and only products made according to Soviet GOSTs are left, then there will be even more golyak than during the food and commodity sabotage during Perestroika. And the supporters and opponents of the USSR will never come to an agreement, because the supporters are proud of what they have done useful for their country and people, and the opponents of the USSR are that they GOT at the expense of other people's labor, besides this they have a maniacal passion for criticism and cowardice, fear of the slightest hint of responsibility for what they did.
    1. andreykolesov123
      andreykolesov123 13 December 2020 16: 33
      -3
      Quote: tatra
      Soviet communists tried to do what no other country was able to do under capitalism vaunted by the enemies of communists

      Why did the Soviet communists need a distribution system?
      1. tatra
        tatra 13 December 2020 16: 57
        0
        This is the essence of the enemies of the communists - the presentation of the highest demands to the communists and their supporters. It is normal for you to have the richest and most secured power at the expense of the people in the Russian Empire, and in your States on the territory of the USSR you captured, but your Soviet communists had to be poor and consume only what the people did.
        1. andreykolesov123
          andreykolesov123 13 December 2020 17: 03
          -4
          Quote: tatra
          were to be poor and consume only what the people.

          And why should communists eat with a big spoon, when all the people eat with a small one?
          1. tatra
            tatra 13 December 2020 17: 07
            +2
            And why is it normal for you, enemies of the communists, that Nicholas II, praised by you, his family, his officials, ate with full spoons, like your Yeltsin-Putin power imposed by you on Russia and the Russian people, under which you crucify for 30 years before the supporters of the communists, how do you like her "and now it is better than in the USSR under the communists"? And why is your intellect and mentality enough only for AGAINST and criticism? Why do you have nothing and no one FOR?
            1. andreykolesov123
              andreykolesov123 13 December 2020 17: 29
              -3
              Quote: tatra
              And why is it normal for you, enemies of the communists, that Nicholas II, praised by you, his family, his officials, ate with full spoons

              So why are communists better than nobles? It turns out that in the 17th year they changed the awl for soap. After all, the communists came to power under the slogan of equality, but it turns out they deceived the people.
      2. paul3390
        paul3390 13 December 2020 18: 05
        +4
        Because this is another lie of the liberals. Yes - there were special distributors, but by no means only for party bosses. For example - factory. And many more. The reason for their appearance is simple - an attempt to fight the trade mafia by delivering goods directly to people.

        And if you are so butted with privileges - look at the prices in the new Kremlin and Duma canteens .. And be horrified. And this is with their crazy salaries !! In general - in our realities, the type of servants of the people who were finally snickering - it is simply immoral and shameless to talk about some kind of privileges then .. Compared with the new ones, the officials of that time are simply holy ascetics - ascetics ..
        1. Arpad
          Arpad 13 December 2020 18: 12
          -1
          Quote: paul3390
          Yes - there were special distributors, but by no means only for party bosses. For example - factory. And many more

          strangely, the very concept of a special distributor means - for the elite, not for everyone.
          That somehow does not fit with the fundamental sign of socialism - equality.
          Quote: paul3390
          The reason for their appearance is simple - an attempt to fight the trade mafia

          well. Yes, you really do not put it on your feet. type special distributors were not related to trade.
          Quote: paul3390
          delivering goods directly to people.

          alshi - express laughing
          do not drive bullshit. I've been in these special distributors and specials. hospitals and special. sanatoriums - there was no smell of ordinary people.
          I can imagine a special distributor on the collective farm of Uryupinsk.
          Or there are owls. citizens did not live?
          Quote: paul3390
          look at the prices in the new Kremlin and Duma canteens .. And be horrified. And this is with their crazy salaries !!

          Well, tell me more. that the Soviet nomenclature lived on the salary?
          so now capitalism. and then the type of equality was.
          Quote: paul3390
          In general - in our realities, the type of servants of the people who are finally choked up - to talk about some kind of privileges then is simply immoral

          Why? Because then there was socialism? and all were wounded, except for those that were smoother.
          Only today's servants of the people, you yourself choose.
          1. paul3390
            paul3390 13 December 2020 18: 14
            +4
            Only today's servants of the people, you yourself choose.


            I'm sobbing ... laughing laughing laughing

            The rest is even lazy to comment .. So crazy .. fool
  • From Tomsk
    From Tomsk 13 December 2020 16: 08
    0
    Who cares why now.
  • zenion
    zenion 13 December 2020 16: 08
    +3
    In general, the deficit began when Soviet trade realized that it would get nothing for it. And it began at the end of Brezhnev's reign, and blossomed during the reign of Tagged. At the end of Brezhnev's reign, what could not be driven out for normal money was simply written off, or burned. In the days of Bullseye, this did not reach stores at all. From the warehouses, it immediately went to the market for sale by its own people. Things that could not be sold openly and could cause a revolution, like sausage, butter and canned food, were burned in ravines or fed to pigs. In the same place where there was a sensible first secretary of the regional committee and district committee, and the OBKHSS worked in the stores, there was everything, the main thing is that the train would reach. Almost towards the end of Brezhnev's reign. The head of the sausage section at the bakery reported in the district committee report that 800 kg of various types of sausages had been produced in a month and saved 40 kg. high quality meat. A work colleague said that the first secretary of the district committee was filled with the color of beets. What, what did he ask? The chief repeated. For a minute he said the first one left and after five minutes he returned. Five minutes later, the district committee was already the head of the OBKHSS, the prosecutor, the head of the police and the head of the investigation department of the police. The sausage shop was closed and an inspection began. Six months after the trial, they soldered him seven years old, confiscated a two-story house, and everything in the house, except for the things of his wife and daughters. They were given a two-room apartment in a high-rise building, and the house was put up for sale. Until the very ascent to the helm of the galley, the Marked were quiet and everything. This is in the Chernivtsi region.
    1. Avior
      Avior 13 December 2020 16: 24
      +3
      ... The head of the sausage section at the bakery reported in the district committee's report that 800 kg of various types of sausages had been produced in a month and saved 40 kg. high quality meat.

      And why was that? What Meat didn't steal? Was it necessary to steal and not show any savings?
      Then they did it.
      They came up with a rational cut, where there is less waste, and the resulting excess leather is left unaccounted for.
      But for the fact that they planted saving, it is not clear ...
      1. ANB
        ANB 13 December 2020 22: 53
        +1
        ... They came up with a rational cut, where there is less waste, and the resulting excess leather is left unaccounted for.
        But for the fact that they planted saving, it is not clear ...

        I wonder how to cut the meat rationally so that you get the same amount of cutlets and less meat?
        1. Avior
          Avior 13 December 2020 23: 02
          +1
          I do not know. Less goes to waste, less remains on the bones, for example.
          Or less marriage.
          It's about sausage.
          As you can imagine, we cannot check the numbers.
          In any case, he did not steal the meat, but showed it as an economy, judging by the text.
          Why such a harsh reaction is unclear.
    2. Arpad
      Arpad 13 December 2020 18: 21
      -6
      Quote: zenion
      In general, the deficit began when Soviet trade realized that it would get nothing for it.

      in general, a deficit occurs when something is missing.
      and the USSR lacked almost everything.
      Quote: zenion
      And it began at the end of Brezhnev's reign, and blossomed during the reign of Tagged.

      Yes . okay . do not drive bullshit.
      Socialism and scarcity are twins. It happened in all social countries and continues to happen in their remains
      Quote: zenion
      From the warehouses, it immediately went to the market for sale by its own people.

      strange. it seems as if before all this was enough. then why sell to your people? They, a priori, had to have all this (well, like everyone else) to a deficit wink
      Quote: zenion
      That which could not be sold openly and could cause a revolution, like sausage, butter and canned food, was burned in ravines or fed to pigs.

      I wonder how many thousand tons had to be burned and the most interesting thing. Did the pigs come for rations themselves, or did the pigs have to feed them with cervelat? And someone had to carry it to them. like this . products. echelons. pigs - and no one knew about it.
      We did not have farms far away, some of our pigs were not correct - this abundance did not reach them. ... Apparently the correct ones had their own special distributor - with sausage and pineapples.

      Quote: zenion
      In the same place where the sensible first secretary of the regional committee and district committee was, and the OBKHSS worked in the stores, there was everything, the main thing is that the train would reach

      Name is sister. name. Where everything was. name pliz.
      Where did these trains go?
      Quote: zenion
      The head of the sausage section at the bakery reported on the district committee report that 800 kg of various types of sausages had been produced in a month and saved 40 kg

      800 kg per month is cool for the shop. as much as 40 kg per day.
      Yes, I don't want to read further, about this nonsense.
      1. zenion
        zenion 16 December 2020 18: 18
        0
        There was such a thing. A hundred eggs were brought to the store selling gold and rare goods. There they were, they took eggs and medicinal herbs, and instead they sold gold products, or electronics. In general, by the end of the day, Sonya handed over two hundred eggs to the warehouse. And others also wanted to buy, then they took eggs from this warehouse and took them to the store, but Sonya did not care and she sold, and had additional money from buyers. Then they decided to put on eggs, in general, mark them and sell them through the grocery store. We bought our eggs in bulk. The marks were washed off and eggs were borne again to Sonya. Sonya handed them over. The report was major. A refrigerator car was driven to the station, for eggs. What a surprise it was that there were only three hundred eggs and half of them already stank. And with regard to the head of the sausage shop. There shouldn't have been anything left. All the meat had to go to the sausage. The workshop was small and they made 800 kg in a month, it was the plan and they exceeded it a little, or so, besides this, the boss loved to drink and boasted that they could make savings. The economy must be economical. When the editor of the newspaper wrote the editorial, he said that the boss did something that the other would not do it. He wrote that he handed in so many of the released products, but it turned out that they took much less from him. He was engaged in postscripting and selling meat, at weddings and where else they are silent about it. It was exactly the same with the eggs, the unfortunate three hundred eggs were spinning in place, but they were constantly recorded at the inter-district base with a plus and no one looked what was really there, because they walked in a circle. Maybe you still write the name of the sausage maker, but I will not have fun with the fact that he was a Jew.
  • andreykolesov123
    andreykolesov123 13 December 2020 16: 25
    -3
    The Zionists got into the leadership of the CPSU and distributed all the goods through the synagogues among their own. Thus, the indigenous population was left without the provision of essential goods.
  • Knell wardenheart
    Knell wardenheart 13 December 2020 16: 35
    +3
    Over the years, there was less and less real strong analytical work in GOSPLAN, and more and more political and defense considerations that hung over the entire structure like a snow cap.
    Plus, cunning guys from the Union republics and tsekhoviks joined in all this, as well as the "functionaries" who covered them, who were already far from Marxism-Leninism, but red as a tomato on the outside.
    In the USSR, they went too far with politics and abstractions - this always affects the normal economy.
    1. paul3390
      paul3390 13 December 2020 19: 17
      +2
      Confucius, answering the question about what is important for the state, said that three things are needed: the sufficiency of weapons, the sufficiency of food and the people's confidence. And when he was asked to drop two points, leaving the most important thing, that without which it is impossible in any way, he answered: the trust of the people.
  • rocket757
    rocket757 13 December 2020 16: 49
    +1
    Weird topic !!! Not because we do not know something, but because we, as always, will not agree on anything! There will be more opinions than participants in the dispute.
    1. tatra
      tatra 13 December 2020 17: 02
      0
      Yes, because none of the enemies of the USSR is capable of honestly, objectively, adequately, like people with the intellect and self-consciousness of citizens of their country, who want well for their country and people, are not able to discuss the history of their country in the pre-revolutionary, Soviet, post-Soviet periods, WHAT and WHO is better for their country and people.
  • Old26
    Old26 13 December 2020 17: 02
    +5
    Quote: apro
    Quote: nnm
    Well, why is this distortion?

    Yes, because now, without a smile at those problems of the past, you will not even look ... neither you credit, nor unemployment, not an eternal shortage of money, you are not waiting for any package from the state, from your fellow citizens.

    There were also loans. Only this installment purchase was called. The accounting department immediately deducted a certain amount of money from your salary. Depending on the purchase price, the time for which the installment plan was drawn up and your salary, a certain amount was calculated.

    There was no unemployment. There were those who did not want to work. They were called parasites then.

    There was also an eternal lack of money. Women (wives) should have erected monuments because they distributed the household budget in such a way that there would be enough for everything. If you had your own apartment or lived in a hostel, that was a plus. It was very costly to live in an apartment. For example, for the first few years of my life "outside the hearth" I paid 20 rubles for the EMNIP apartment. With an initial salary of 115 rubles. The sixth part - it was still sensitive. Then there was the problem of scarcity (and you don't have to nod at sausage and jeans all the time). It was a great success to buy normal shoes. Or you had to pay "from above". A good suit (from a good factory) was inexpensive, I don't remember exactly, but under 40 rubles, if sclerosis does not change me. But a good suit still had to be found (color, quality of materials, cut, price). In the mid-late 70s, in the same Novocherkassk, the food situation became much worse than in the early 70s. And this means that it was necessary, if there was a need for a quality product, to buy it in a co-shop (the price is 2-3 times higher). The furniture is the same.

    That's the only thing that was not, I agree with you here - dirty tricks from the state. There was some kind of stability

    Quote: Leader of the Redskins
    Sorry, did you find the 80s?
    Personally, I remember very well the "sausage trips" when my grandfather went to Moscow and Aleksandrov for cheese, boiled sausage and butter. Well, not counting the little things.
    His grandmother gave him instructions:
    Take this there, and this in that store, if not, then look at that ...
    And I was sent to the station to meet him, because the bag is heavy, and he is a veteran after four wounds!
    And not in the 90s, but in 1986 - 1988 ...

    In Novocherkassk, such a mystery was heard. What it is? - "With a red stripe, it smells delicious sausage." The answer is the "Quiet Don" train going from Moscow. We, who from the KB often went on business trips to Moscow and the Moscow region, women in the department gave thick notebooks, reminiscent of today's organizers. And apart from the alphabetical part, everything else was filled with orders that were given to you when you went on a business trip. If closer to the holidays - then sometimes they ordered food, outside the holidays - cosmetics, perfume (male and female) and all sorts of things (up to "diplomats")
    Each had a diagram indicating where and what brand stores there are in Moscow (especially Polish, Czech, Bulgarian, German, etc.). And upon arrival they met. Depending on the orders - sometimes several people

    Quote: depressant
    Everyone is tired, colleague WayKhe Thuo)))
    Here I look out the window, and there is winter. In the western room through the window I see a heavy snowfall, and through the window in the east - settled snow, no snowfall. How can this be? Maybe ...))
    As for the deficit - it is always the work of human hands and someone's purposeful will. The residents of Stavropol have sold food products abroad (milk, butter, sour cream, cottage cheese, return, all sorts of vegetables, grain) worth more than 650 million dollars, they are happy, and the unsold leftovers - to us in Central Russia - go up the price! And I am more than sure that the butter they sold abroad does not contain palm oil. As well as sour cream and cottage cheese.
    In fact, the topic of the article is good, but winter powerlessness, tiredness from everything. Well, maybe tomorrow, diluting the boredom of work, people will tense up)))

    You know, Lyudmila, that list of sales abroad from the Stavropol Territory, frankly speaking, amused me. I have been living here for almost 35 years and for the first time I see that we sell butter, sour cream, cottage cheese, vegetables abroad. Here is the grain - I agree, but the rest - I wonder where ?? If in the republics of the former USSR, then it turns out like barter. They also "sell" something to us. If there are other countries abroad for you, then hardly anyone in the same Turkey needs our tomatoes and vegetables (as well as in Bulgaria, Hungary), thank God that we got rid of Turkish winter tomatoes with a taste of cardboard. Who should we supply?
    And we, as in principle, probably in other cities have branded stores of the same Belarus. Which also supplies us with some products.
    And the deficit, yes, I agree, has always been the work of someone's hands. For example, having lived almost 15 years in Novocherkassk, I have NEVER seen the same smoked sausage "Novochekasskaya" in the city, which either went to special distributors or was sent to Moscow by refrigerators. I brought them from Moscow. A paradox, but alas, quite real in the USSR.
    And the prices, dear Lyudmila, have grown in the Stavropol Territory over the past year. Despite the fact that much is not imported, its
    1. rocket757
      rocket757 13 December 2020 17: 29
      0
      Quote: Old26
      A paradox, but alas, quite real in the USSR.

      As beautifully expressed, through the mouth of N. Mordyukova, the house manager from the movie "The Diamond Arm" - Istanbul, a city of contrasts !!!
      We've had a whole country of contrasts ... I had the pleasure to make sure that for a dozen years I had to go from one country to another, through capitals and villages, closed or just distant cities. Many times, year after year ...
      We can say before our eyes there were events, changes, collapse, catastrophe.
      If asked if I would like to come back at that time, I will answer YES!
      If they ask if I want EVERYTHING to be like it was then, I will answer NO!
      It may be a paradox, but just like that.
    2. depressant
      depressant 14 December 2020 00: 56
      +1
      Dear colleague Old 26, welcome! hi
      I live in a village near Moscow, information about the Stavropol Territory, which surprised me greatly, took it from the news and immediately began to think: how many palm trees in unsold abroad will Stavropol residents add to the remains of butter, and even raise the price, and then send here, to us))
      And this means of propaganda is presented as a victory. I would like to think that the millions of dollars earned will go for the good of your region, only for some reason doubts plague.
  • Iskazi
    Iskazi 13 December 2020 17: 06
    0
    Another shaking of the air ...., nostalgia, but unfortunately the question of the USSR is still important .. What went wrong? The USSR at the end of the 80s, was fundamentally different, the USSR-20s, 30s, 50s ...., Under the "tyrant" of Stalin, there was officially -Non-State Sector of the Economy, about 15% ..., nationalized by Khrushchev and co The deficit is just one of the forms of a dead end into which the CPSU drove the country, and it's not even about Marxism as such - Ricardo and Smith are the basis of Marxism ..., but Murphy's laws have also been fulfilled ... about the total incompetence of the pyramid of power ..., the fish of the USSR rotted from the head, or rather, its head rotted ...
  • evgen1221
    evgen1221 13 December 2020 17: 13
    0
    In (deficit), we do not forget to be honest for ourselves, to remember that sooooo much we tore off ourselves (the union) by supporting and sending echelons of various equipment and so on for wars once (for slaughter in fact), to help Europe (restoration of socialist countries), Asia Africa. One Vietnamese swept out of the union a lot of everything we needed. I am silent about the deficit before the collapse because it is artificial and caused by the struggle of clans for power.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Bobrick
    Bobrick 13 December 2020 18: 40
    +2
    and lack of competition

    And with such reasons "this" should be considered an article?

    You would at least read an economics textbook and understand that there is no deficit in the market system, not because everything is enough for everyone, but because those who cannot buy goods at the offered price are cut off, of course "fair, ensuring the good of the whole society" (What are you - a businessman is the most decent person in society, that thinks only about the public good, as M. Friedman said and performed by the "Chicago boys", and not this all the Marxist "about profit and people - goods").

    Therefore, the conclusions were "stupid", and the way to solve the deficit was the simplest - to raise prices to the ceiling and the deficit will disappear as if by magic, and then you will scratch your head like a government and wonder: Why did the people buy sugar, flour and sunflower oil much less?
  • Radikal
    Radikal 13 December 2020 19: 55
    +3
    Quote: paul3390
    There is a huge layer of documents and memoirs, allowing to assert that the deficit in the late USSR was created artificially and very purposefully. Especially food. For the top leaders were already actively preparing for the sale of the country and the betrayal of the people ..

    Those who were in the early 90s, say, in Poland, remember how it turned into a giant flea market of Soviet goods .. They dragged everything through the cordon, from household appliances to pots. And all this poured across the border in colossal quantities. This is to the question that the Union, like nothing but galoshes, did not produce, and even those shitty ones .. Only outright liars and scum can assert that.

    yes good Respect drinks hi
  • pyagomail.ru
    pyagomail.ru 13 December 2020 20: 21
    0
    Respected commentators were divided into two groups: some write that it was good in the USSR, but there were some shortcomings, the second write that there was something good in the USSR, but there were many shortcomings. The perennial controversy about "The glass is half empty or half full." Let's take it for granted: the USSR collapsed while all the former republics, except for Belarus and Turkmenistan, became capitalist to one degree or another. However, you will not be able to name a single capitalist state that collapsed or became socialist in peacetime. Apparently, the capstroy itself is more stable and better adapts to the requirements of the time.
  • Radikal
    Radikal 13 December 2020 20: 52
    +1
    Quote: Gato
    Back in the 60s, Academician Glushko proposed to create an information network to transfer data from enterprises to the State Planning Committee

    By the way, there was another dark story. At one time, there were stories that the impetus for the creation in the states of ARPANET was the Soviet developments of the late 50s, especially in the part of the 1822 protocol.

    What do you mean - this is probably a protocol for the production of ... galoshes! lol hi
  • Selevc
    Selevc 13 December 2020 22: 00
    -1
    In Russia (both under the USSR and now) they have always eaten and eaten like nowhere else in the world !!! Our usual solid table lunch (according to Soviet GOSTs) is called a feast everywhere in the world !!! Americans and Europeans call such dishes as cheesecakes and pancakes a delicacy !!! And festive feasts are generally often called a complete overeating (as a complete opposite to their tartlets and sandwiches). Foreigners apparently do not understand the difference between food and snacks ...))
    Therefore, of course, there was a deficit - but compared to the daily menu of a Soviet person in Asian and African countries, for example, we can say that they are constantly starving !!!

    And by the way, there is a lot of evidence from people who worked in warehouses in the late 80s that Soviet warehouses at that time were literally bursting with everything from a needle to an airplane or a car !!! In the early 90s, all this goodness poured into spontaneous markets and what was not there !!!
    Therefore, Gorbachev's deficit was done on purpose, artificially and was part of the general line of the werewolf and his entourage to dismantle the state !!!
  • faterdom
    faterdom 13 December 2020 22: 18
    +2
    It was about the personalities.
    Put the same Gorbachev as president of the United States for 4 years - he will do more harm than Dubya, Obama and Trump combined. Moreover, exclusively from good intentions, not from evil.
    All hope for Bidon - someone has to surpass, even the movie was "Dumb and dumber".
    Managers, so to speak ...
    Now I watched the film about Prince Yaroslav, so he reigned 13 in the 1st millennium, and 54 in the second. He was the prince of Rostov, Novgorod, Great Kiev (for which some ranked him among the Ukrainians - a word he hardly heard as a designation of nationality).
    And somehow successfully everywhere.
    And here ... then Khrushchev, then Gorbachev - bad luck for the full program.
    1. Selevc
      Selevc 13 December 2020 23: 10
      0
      The article is stupid and the topic of scarcity (especially in the case of food) is generally the stupidest one. Since the days of the USSR, we have always been presented with the topic of scarcity one-sidedly - they portrayed the abundance of the West by showing huge supermarket showcases and as the opposite of the queue in Soviet stores. But for some reason they almost never said what quality this food is ??? And between the USSR, the strictest GOST-ovsky quality system in food and food preparation was in force !!! And in the West, on the contrary, food is full of chemistry !!! Their food is full of preservatives, stabilizers, flavor enhancers and other chemicals that are often considered conditionally safe !!! That is, no one has yet tested the long-term effect of this chemistry on generations of people.

      Every third American is obese - because they eat food that disrupts the body's metabolism !!! But they have food for the crowd - for the poor !!! And for the rich, there are specialty stores that say 100% organic. And believe me the prices there are orders of magnitude more expensive !!!
      In the USSR, one of the reasons for the shortage of food is that natural food quickly deteriorates !!! And after the collapse of the union, we also had milk and sour cream that are stored for months and beer stored for six months !!! That is, our newly minted capitalists simply spill chemistry from there to here - but thank God, the scale is not there yet !!!
      1. Avior
        Avior 14 December 2020 00: 33
        +1
        But for some reason they almost never said what quality this food is ???

        Have you been to Italy? Holland?
        The quality of the products is very high.
    2. Kushka
      Kushka 13 December 2020 23: 41
      +1
      And here you go! And there will be a plus! Whoever they put there-
      Reagan is plus, Obama is plus, Trump is plus (see record
      growth of the DD index, record growth of household assets
      119 trillion dol! The system is like that - even if Trump is
      the whole head, even if the ass instead of the head - forward
      please, all the cards are in your hands! Back not a step!
      The system THERE does not work back - THE PRESIDENT CANNOT
      DOING HARM TO THE USA - IT CANNOT IN PRINCIPLE! Even
      if he hangs himself!
      And you are bad luck! Fegas system - one fella gave -
      and 250 million people. for pea bread in the queue for 1/6 of the planet
      (I was 12 in 1964, I remember everything).
      EBN went through, but he did not dry out - the whole country on
      Is grazing a LADDER too? Maybe
      the system is wrong?
  • certero
    certero 14 December 2020 00: 00
    +1
    Quote: lucul
    I think the food shortage in the USSR is art,

    Or you can consider anything but the shortage of food in the Soviet Union is a material phenomenon. independent of your wishes.
    And the reasons for it are absolutely clear.
    Lack of production and lack of distribution system.
    Look around how many shops are in the square next to the house now? There are 10 times more of them than there were during the Soviet Union.
    And of course, agriculture has progressed very much since then in terms of productivity.
    The Soviet Union demanded reforms, not to be torn apart here 100% agree
  • faterdom
    faterdom 14 December 2020 00: 12
    +1
    Quote: Kushka
    record
    growth of the DD index, record growth of household assets

    Well, well, on TV in our country and in the USSR everything was unanimously good, all around the increase in milk yields, perestroika and glasnost again ... But then it got even worse .... worse.
    Those tens of millions of beggars are already a little bit out of the Dye-Jones index. And the future is hardly bright.
  • Old26
    Old26 14 December 2020 00: 35
    +2
    Quote: lucul
    Yes ? And what happened to the products of meat processing plants and fish complexes, dairies and other food industry enterprises of the USSR?
    The paradox - the enterprises are working at full capacity - and the shops, the shelves are empty, where does everything go?
    Or would you deny that food businesses were running at full capacity?

    They worked at full capacity, no one denies, but the first people of cities, regions, territories (secretaries of city committees, regional committees, regional committees) considered it their duty (or maybe not a duty, but there was an order) to send food in trains to Moscow, Leningrad ... as a result, this very shortage arose on the ground. At the same time, the residents of the capital sometimes did not even think that they were bringing food from all over the country.
    I once told a story about butter. In the year 79-80 in Moscow there were some problems with this product. Issued at work. When I came to celebrate a business trip, the girls from the office, seeing the Rostov region on the travel certificate, said "this is where our butter goes", And on the packs lying on their table it was read - Novocherkassk dairy plant. I had to "poke" them. Were extremely surprised

    Quote: ROSS 42
    Sorry, did you find the end of the 50s - the beginning of the 60s? When was ordinary flour according to coupons, and products were sold by the piece to one person?
    Stop scaring us with horror stories about "sausage trains" ... There was a time when there were no normal hardware, paint, wallpaper in stores ... When a person with a "toilet paper garland" was perceived as a winner with a laurel wreath.

    The end of the 50s was found, but at a rather young age. about flour on coupons - I don't remember, I will not lie, but I went to buy bread with my grandmother or grandfather, because they gave 1 loaf each. After Khrushchev was removed, as if by magic, bread ceased to be in short supply. Most often they fed from the market. Until the mid-50s, according to grandmother and grandfather, even in the city (our then had a population of about 140-150 thousand, some kept pigs and poultry in yards (sheds). The arrival of the National Union of Artists and its "privatization" of all this led to that they began to cut down the gardens, so as not to pay the state taxes from the trees, removed the animals from the cities. To say that the shelves in the stores were empty is to lie. From childhood memories I remember how in the fish section of the deli in the background there was a pyramid of blue, one-kilogram metal cans with black caviar. Meat was. True, from childhood memories I remember that it was "lumpy" meat that was consumed extremely rarely. Most often, minced meat, from which my grandmother cooked cutlets, stuffed bell peppers, made naval pasta, cabbage rolls, dolma. consumed fish, followed by poultry.

    Quote: andreykolesov123
    Quote: tatra
    were to be poor and consume only what the people.

    And why should communists eat with a big spoon, when all the people eat with a small one?

    It is not necessary to write down all the communists as consumers of the people's goods. At the beginning of the 60s, there were about 9 million people in the CPSU. And only an extremely insignificant stratum (party bosses of all levels) lived in the "communism" regime. The rest, if as "small" as the rest of the people

    Quote: paul3390
    Because this is another lie of the liberals. Yes - there were special distributors, but by no means only for party bosses. For example - factory. And many more. The reason for their appearance is simple - an attempt to fight the trade mafia by delivering goods directly to people.

    There were no factory special distributors. It happened that before the holidays, the workers of the plant received food rations, but most often there was no shortage there, as in rations from a special distributor.

    Quote: Arpad
    in general, a deficit occurs when something is missing.
    and the USSR lacked almost everything.

    So to speak. There was a deficit in the USSR QUALITY PRODUCTS... Unfortunately, even the same socialist competition was turned so that the winner was the one who gave more products, albeit of poor quality, and often also marriage.
    They did not swell with hunger, in particular, but it was very easy to get high-quality products in a regular store. If we return again to the same sausage that sore on edge, then in the early 70s (about 1973) in the same Novocherkassk it was possible to buy 6-7 varieties of boiled sausages, several varieties of semi-smoked and smoked sausages, several varieties of cheese and cream oils. Nobody paid any attention to such sausages as "Estonian" with almost solid fat, offal or liver sausage.
    But by the end of the 70s, all this abundance had already disappeared. Mainly the same Estonian, offal, liverwort remained in the store. Rarely and in small quantities, they "threw away" semi-smoked ones. For the same table (for the holidays) it was necessary to take it from a co-shop at a price several times higher.
    And so with almost everything. vegetables at the end of the 70s more often rotted in vegetable warehouses than were high-quality to the table.
    It's the same with clothes and shoes. To say that nothing happened is impossible. true quality (cut, color, material) was alas ...

    Quote: Selevc
    In Russia (both under the USSR and now) they have always eaten and eaten like nowhere else in the world !!! Our usual solid table lunch (according to Soviet GOSTs) is called a feast everywhere in the world !!! Americans and Europeans call such dishes as cheesecakes and pancakes a delicacy !!! And festive feasts are generally often called a complete overeating (as a complete opposite to their tartlets and sandwiches). Foreigners apparently do not understand the difference between food and snacks ...))

    It is not necessary to equate the presence of the product with the GOST according to which it was manufactured. So what if the same sausage like "Moscow" or "Servilat" (not to mention "salami") was made according to GOST. The question arose, where to get it ...
    Each country has its own food. Your historical preferences. Although, of course, we ate more than the same Westerners. As for a good-quality canteen lunch - such a dinner was perhaps in the closed canteens of the design bureaus and factories, and perhaps even in the military canteen. In all the rest - when you are given such a people as "fried" (in other metas they called goulash) and instead of 5-6 pieces of meat you are given the same amount of lard - you cannot call such a meal "Good". The same is the first course. Therefore, they tried to take either a side dish, or cheesecakes or cottage cheese for the second. Although, of course, in different cities it was different. In some cities, even before the beginning of the 90s, there were "cookery" stores where you could take quite high-quality semi-finished products ...

    Quote: Selevc
    The article is stupid and the topic of scarcity (especially in the case of food) is generally the stupidest one. Since the days of the USSR, we have always been presented with the topic of scarcity one-sidedly - they portrayed the abundance of the West by showing huge supermarket showcases and as the opposite of the queue in Soviet stores. But for some reason they almost never said what quality this food is ??? And between the USSR, the strictest GOST-ovsky quality system in food and food preparation was in force !!! And in the West, on the contrary, food is full of chemistry !!! Their food is full of preservatives

    You again equate GOST, according to which most of the products were produced, which became a deficit and lack of such products
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 00: 42
      +2
      About milk. I did not find this time, but the grandfathers said that they brought them to the brigade in boxes, take as much as you want.
      1. Avior
        Avior 14 December 2020 01: 43
        +2
        what kind of brigade?
        in some industries he was given coupons for the harmful conditions.
        1. Mordvin 3
          Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 01: 48
          +2
          Quote: Avior
          what kind of brigade?

          Auto locksmiths. Overhaul ZiLov. I worked since the mid-90s, and then every day they gave out half a liter of milk. They also gave sour cream. And for plumbers - juice. Orange, tomato ... I envied them.
          1. Avior
            Avior 14 December 2020 01: 54
            +2
            We were given coupons, back in Soviet times. but they could simply pay for lunch in the factory canteen. they were usually given in ribbons, for a week or two.
            1. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 02: 00
              +2
              Quote: Avior
              We were given coupons, back in Soviet times. but they could simply pay for lunch in the factory canteen. they were usually given in ribbons, for a week or two.

              In Soviet times, my mother worked as a cashier at an enterprise. I hesitated to help her, to put stamps on coupons. There were thousands of them. And also. He studied in a techie, you could exchange coupons for food. By the way, we always had sausage in the buffet. This is in the late 80s, when everyone is talking about the deficit.
              1. Avior
                Avior 14 December 2020 02: 11
                +3
                Estonian was usually in the store, with fat. somewhere in the mid-80s.
                And the dairy or the doctor's had to be found.
                At first, we slightly fried the Estonian one with rings, and picked out the fat, then we fried sausage on it, in it another can of Krasnodar sauce - there was a student dinner for everyone. Smoked was expensive, almost never taken.
                In general, the assortment was not very good, but there was usually some kind of boiled water.
                There was a huge shortage of sausages. We went to eat specially in a sausage shop, on the other side of the city.
                1. Mordvin 3
                  Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 02: 15
                  +2
                  Quote: Avior
                  And the dairy or the doctor's had to be found.

                  That was exactly what it was. Three rubles with something. And coupons for 50 kopecks. They were giving out 15 rubles. I constantly carried the sausage home.
                  1. Avior
                    Avior 14 December 2020 02: 31
                    +3
                    At the factory, the assortment in the store was more or less a choice, but in ordinary city stores it is very scarce. Of course, you cannot die of hunger. But the cake for March 8 had to be taken with a fight :)
                    In the buffet, this is with a surcharge, as I understand it, Varenka cost up to three rubles, from 2.10 to 3.00, if the memory does not fail.
                    The shelves in the store often looked like this - the main part of the shelves is alternating 3 liter cans of tomato juice and birch juice - at least that's what it was called. And only a small honor - with other products. Cereals in bags, canned fish, it could be chocolate - it was expensive, they didn't take much, sweet bars are cheaper, some kind of herring, milk, usually in the morning, usually in bottles with a tin lid, but it could also be a tetrapak corner, and it could be the other way around - sour cream for pouring from a milk can with a mug on a long handle, some kind of citro, bread and even little things. Of course, you won't die of hunger, but with fat, too :)))
                    But there were individual stores in which the assortment was noticeably different.
                    For example, in a city in a neighboring region there was a store selling curd cakes in chocolate glaze, 15 kopecks a piece, in one hand they gave no more than 3 rubles, when they got it, I always went to it. The rest is a very ordinary store.
                    1. Mordvin 3
                      Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 02: 39
                      +1
                      Quote: Avior
                      But the cake for March 8 had to be taken with a fight :)

                      Whoa! And we had no problems with the cakes. I even bought it for my mom on weekdays.
                      Quote: Avior
                      In the buffet, this is with an extra charge, as I understand it

                      Yes, three fifteen in my opinion.
                      Quote: Avior
                      some citro

                      We went to the bakery as boys, they poured us there for free. Kvass, Tarhun ... And they gave away the defective bread.
                      1. Avior
                        Avior 14 December 2020 03: 05
                        +3
                        Kvass was in barrels on wheels.
                        In the store one could very rarely find "Moskovsky" with an unusual taste in a bottle. Citro, lemonade - it happened, but the taste and quality were very different - they bought what was at the moment. There was also beer in bottles, with no choice, of course. Zhigulevskoe. Rare Wheat.
                      2. Mordvin 3
                        Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 03: 24
                        +1
                        Quote: Avior
                        There was also beer in bottles, with no choice, of course. Zhigulevskoe. Rare Wheat.

                        This is where you lived then? When Gorby introduced prohibition, in 86 I was admitted to the Tula hospital. I got cold. So that's it. Mom and Dad were carrying parcels to me, and they dragged me a drink called "Spikelet". Thought it was lemonade. They opened it, and there was beer. There was also Velvet, Barley, and some other, I don't really remember. And there was a pub near the house, so we ran every Saturday with cans and bags. And in general, in the area of ​​15 minutes walk there were 5 pubs and two pubs.
              2. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 02: 18
                +1
                Quote: Avior
                There was a huge shortage of sausages.

                Uh-huh. The co-operators bought everything. They went to Moscow, were indignant: "What, should I pay these hucksters exorbitantly?"
                1. Avior
                  Avior 14 December 2020 02: 39
                  +3
                  was not in co-trade or in other trade.
                  Stable food - only in the pork.
                  Different cities were supplied in different ways, were better, and were worse. I remember that a guy from Kuibyshev, or something, we had, said that they have much worse and even the usual boiled water is a problem.
                  In Moscow, of course, there was no comparison in the assortment.
                  But in general, I do not have the most rosy memories, maybe because I saw how it could be.
                  1. Mordvin 3
                    Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 02: 48
                    +2
                    Quote: Avior
                    was not in co-trade or in other trade.

                    There were, were, when the cooperative cafes went. I remember exactly. Since the late 80s. Excessively the prices were fighting.
                    Quote: Avior
                    Stable food - only in the pork.

                    Our tech canteen was located next to the city department. They were always deliciously fed. yes
                    Quote: Avior
                    But in general, I do not have the most rosy memories, maybe because I saw how it could be.

                    And mine is normal. I remember that I was so bitten by 95 kopecks that I barely crawled out of the table.
                    1. Avior
                      Avior 14 December 2020 03: 01
                      +2
                      I meant to eat sausages.
                      Work canteens were generally not bad and not very expensive, but student canteens and city canteens were not so-so. City-again, different.
                      No, about the fact that he was hungry, there was no question. But the dining room is still not homemade. There were cafes with better quality, but they were also more expensive.
                      But I will not say that there was a stable variety in stores either. Sometimes I accidentally found something special, as they said then, "thrown away." I could have come in - there is ice cream. And tomorrow in the same store, no.
                      Yes, and my requests then were so-so, I did not know anything else. In Moscow, of course, I saw a variety, but somehow I did not correlate it with other cities. Moscow is Moscow.
                    2. Mordvin 3
                      Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 03: 11
                      +3
                      Quote: Avior
                      City-again, different.

                      I agree with this. There were a couple of city canteens, I hated going there. The nausea is real. But our factory was one hundred percent. They were fed for slaughter. And on state farms too.
                      Quote: Avior
                      Moscow is Moscow.

                      I'm not a Muscovite even once. Tula region.
                    3. Avior
                      Avior 14 December 2020 03: 40
                      +2
                      In those days, closer, in the early 80s, I was just brought to the Tula region. In Aleksin there is a famous pine forest, as I understand it, they lived there.
                      But since we went to Moscow from there, the impressions of the Moscow stores remained. From Tula, only gingerbread :)))
                    4. Mordvin 3
                      Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 03: 46
                      +1
                      Quote: Avior
                      In Aleksin there is a famous pine forest, as I understand it, they lived there.

                      No, Novomoskovsk. Aleksin is so-so. Unless the polygon underneath is nothing.
                      Quote: Avior
                      But since we went to Moscow from there,

                      We went, no doubt about it. Why not go if a train ticket cost four rubles and a penny? I usually went to VDNKh for a walk, and at the same time I was stocked there. I am sending gingerbread to my brother to the Urals now. Fly away.
            2. Mordvin 3
              Mordvin 3 14 December 2020 03: 31
              +1
              Quote: Avior
              I remember that a guy from Kuibyshev, or something, we had, said that they have much worse and even the usual boiled water is a problem.

              In 79th we were in Kuibyshev, visiting grandma's sister. So my grandmother treated me to such a sausage that I later called it Kuibyshev. Ham.
  • Old26
    Old26 14 December 2020 01: 04
    +2
    Quote: depressant
    And this means of propaganda is presented as a victory. I would like to think that the millions of dollars earned will go to the good of your region, only for some reason doubts plague

    To be honest, I didn't track the final result for the year, but I'm afraid that the figure named was taken from nowhere. Our region is mainly agricultural, although there are, of course, industrial enterprises. But to be honest, I hear for the first time that the products you have named go "abroad". As I already wrote, the question arises - where, abroad?
  • oracul
    oracul 14 December 2020 08: 08
    +1
    The deficit was growing due to the fact that they were carried away by increasing production, but this did not take into account that people are different, tastes are different. Economists proceeded from consumption norms and drove fish, for example, to the Caucasus, where they preferred meat. The main thing was that the price did not work and everyone could claim everything.
  • fif21
    fif21 14 December 2020 08: 41
    +1
    The deficit was created artificially, since the traders realized that they could make good money on it, and at the same time remain unpunished, because people also worked in the city committees of the CPSU, executive committees, and law enforcement agencies. Whoever remembers the word "blat" will understand what it is about. The richest and most needed person in the city is the trading director! The stores could have empty shelves, but I did not see people looking for food (as it is now) in the garbage dumps. hi
    1. Salty
      Salty 14 December 2020 08: 50
      +1
      Quote: fif21
      people looking for food (as now) in the garbage dumps, I have not seen

      Yes, there was nothing to look for, obviously. I remember food waste (well, like peelings from potatoes, etc.) - and they were thrown away separately from other things, sort of like feeding cattle. Selective garbage collection, oga. Moscow region, 70s.

      Now the garbage cans are much richer. And, as a rule, they are not looking for food there, but luminous cans for change.
  • EvilLion
    EvilLion 14 December 2020 09: 58
    +1
    Speculation is not a cause of scarcity, it is a consequence of it.

    The reason for the deficit is the cancellation of all forms of entrepreneurship by Nikita Khrushchem, the sponsoring of various monkeys in Africa and the republics in which the habit of constantly asking for Moscow has developed. If at the same time the Baltics produced at least something and even a lot of things, then what products came from some Georgia, or Central Asia, you still need to look. Well, the transformation of enterprises from organizations for the production of goods for the people into organizations for the improvement of their own workers. And also the banal lack of control and the inevitable plundering of any "planned unprofitable enterprises". Well, simply because if the task of generating profit is not there, then no one will reduce costs.
  • Maks1995
    Maks1995 14 December 2020 10: 00
    +2
    but, general words + a nod to a group of people with whom the "head of the Soviet government" could not do anything ... Untitled, of course.
  • Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 14 December 2020 10: 52
    +2
    A lot of states had and still have much bigger problems of a socio-economic plan in comparison with the late USSR. However, only the USSR, the SFRY and Czechoslovakia collapsed. Probably, it is necessary to share the collapse of the Soviet socio-political and economic system, as well as the socio-economic systems of Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia, and the collapse of these three federal multinational states. It is clear that one cannot be completely separated from the other. But it's still not quite the same thing. Croatian or Lithuanian separatists, probably, even in the absence of serious economic problems, would still strive to secede from Yugoslavia and the USSR, respectively.
  • Kart
    Kart 14 December 2020 14: 42
    +1
    So by the end of the 1980s, in many settlements of the USSR, there were interruptions in the supply of such goods as condensed milk, natural coffee, cocoa, boiled and smoked sausages, dishes, and children's toys.

    Interruptions? Gracefully.
    Yes, in many of us. points in the province of all this never happened. There is always a hard shortage, and only on May 9 or November 7 could you buy, if you were lucky.
  • Tektor
    Tektor 14 December 2020 17: 09
    -1
    They started a difficult topic, but did not reveal it. The deficit extended to quality goods and products. Lack of good products was associated with the unprofitability of their production: standardswhich forced the village workers to produce food at a loss during the entire post-war period. For example, the payment for electricity was based on the power connected to the farm, and not on the consumed one. And even if you did not produce anything on this farm, but you had to pay.
    С industrial goods There was also an ambush: the profit rate was approved at a few percent, and in order for the enterprise to break even, it had to sell a specific and sufficiently large number of goods, for example, dresses, on the consumer market, but the fashion changed every year, and it became problematic to sell old products. As a result, enterprises were forced to produce a lot of products (in order to break even according to the plan), but they could not realize all this, and were left with losses, i.e. asked for subsidies. New and high-quality goods sold out very quickly, and it could only be produced according to the approved plan. So a deficit appeared - a property of the planned economy. As a result, resources were recycled into garbage, and quality goods were in short supply. Everything went according to plan.
    1. Elturisto
      Elturisto 14 December 2020 21: 13
      0
      You also need to be able to talk nonsense. Where are the logs about the low profitability of the production of industrial goods in the USSR. The profitability was tens and sometimes hundreds of percent. Due to this, the enterprises maintained social and cultural life, sports, sanatoriums, canteens and subsidiary farms, and some of them built housing. Now they are good food is in short supply, for example good dairy products cannot be bought in supermarkets for any money, there are no cows.
  • Elturisto
    Elturisto 14 December 2020 21: 07
    +1
    Another worthless empty person. Total deficit, yeah everyone in the USSR went naked and hungry.
  • Arnaut
    Arnaut 14 December 2020 21: 12
    0
    "So by the end of the 1980s, in many settlements of the USSR, there were interruptions in the supply of such goods as condensed milk, natural coffee, cocoa, boiled and smoked sausages, dishes, and children's toys."
    The author and I lived in different USSR.
    In my USSR, all this was no longer in the regional center at the end of the seventies (I did not find it before). And a very clear understanding that there are two kinds of Soviet people: Muscovites + Leningraders and everyone else.