Military Review

Narva disaster of the Russian army

87
Narva disaster of the Russian army
Painting A. E. Kotzebue "Battle of Narva".


320 years ago, the Swedish army under the command of King Charles XII defeated the Russian army near Narva. The Swedish king received the glory of an invincible commander. Russian troops to Poltava ceased to be perceived as a serious force.

The outbreak of war


In 1700, the Northern Union - Rzeczpospolita, Saxony, Denmark and Russia, opposed Sweden. The allies sought to undermine Sweden's dominant position in the Baltic region. The moment for the outbreak of war seemed auspicious. The great powers of Europe (England, Holland, France and Austria), as well as possible allies of Sweden, were preparing for the War of the Spanish Succession. Sweden was left alone. The situation in Sweden itself was unstable. The treasury is empty, society is dissatisfied. The young King Charles XII by his behavior gave his contemporaries reason to consider him a very frivolous person. It was hoped that the Swedish monarch, keen on hunting and other amusements, would not soon mobilize the forces of Sweden to repulse the enemies. In the meantime, the allies will be able to solve the main problems, and then begin negotiations from favorable starting conditions.

The Russian high command planned to launch the campaign by attacking the Swedish fortresses of Narva and Noteburg. These were two ancient Russian fortresses - Rugodiv and Oreshek, captured by the Swedes. They occupied strategic positions on the Narva and Neva rivers, blocking the Russian kingdom from entering the Gulf of Finland (Baltic Sea). Before the outbreak of hostilities, the Russian Tsar Pyotr Alekseevich organized the collection of information about the system of fortifications, the number of garrisons, etc. At the same time, Russia carried out a concentration of troops in areas close to Sweden. The governors in Novgorod and Pskov received instructions to prepare for war.

The allies were unable to perform simultaneously and powerfully. The Saxon Elector was supposed to start the war as early as November 1699, but did not act until February 1700. Moscow was supposed to start in the spring of 1700, but opened hostilities only in August. August II was unable to organize a surprise attack on Riga. The Riga garrison, amid the indecisive actions of the enemy, managed to prepare for the defense. The Saxon and Polish ruler himself was more entertained than engaged in military affairs. He was more interested in hunting and theater than war. The army did not have the means and forces to storm Riga, the king did not have money to pay the soldiers. The troops, demoralized by inaction and lack of victory, grumbled. Everyone believed that the Russian army should come to their aid. On September 15, the Saxons lifted the siege of Riga.

Meanwhile, the Russian government was awaiting news from Constantinople. Moscow needed peace with Turkey to start a war with Sweden. The Peace of Constantinople was concluded in July 1700 (Peace of Constantinople). While the Saxon prince was ineptly killing time, and the Russian tsar was waiting for peace with the Turks, the Swedes managed to withdraw Denmark from the war. In the spring of 1700, the Danish army invaded the Duchy of Holstein, at the junction of the Jutland Peninsula and mainland Europe. Both Denmark and Sweden claimed the duchy. Charles XII, unexpectedly for the allies, received help from Holland and England. Swedish fleet, covered by the Anglo-Dutch fleet, in July he landed troops near the Danish capital. The Swedes laid siege to Copenhagen while the Danish army was tied up in the south. Under the threat of destruction of the capital, the Danish government capitulated. The Peace of Travenda was signed in August. Denmark refused to participate in the Northern Alliance, from the rights to Holstein and paid an indemnity. With one blow, Charles XII brought Denmark out of the war and deprived the allies of the Danish fleet.


Panorama of Narva in the middle of the XNUMXth century.

Northern hike


Having received news of peace with the Ottoman Empire, Peter ordered the Novgorod governor to start hostilities, enter enemy territory and take convenient places. Other troops were instructed to start moving. On August 19 (30), 1700, Peter declared war on Sweden. On August 22, the sovereign left Moscow, followed by the main forces of the army. The main goal of the campaign was Narva - the ancient Russian fortress of Rugodiv.

The troops were divided into three "generals" (divisions) under the command of Avtonov Golovin (10 infantry and 1 dragoon regiments - over 14 thousand people), Adam Veide (9 infantry and 1 dragoon regiments - over 11 thousand people), Nikita Repin ( 9 infantry regiments - more than 10 thousand people). The general command was carried out by Fyodor Golovin, who had been promoted to field marshal the day before. He was an excellent diplomat and business executive, but did not possess the talents of a commander. That is, Golovin was the same nominal Field Marshal as an admiral. At the disposal of the field marshal was the noble militia - more than 11 thousand people. In Novgorod, 2 soldiers and 5 rifle regiments (4700 people) were to join the army. The arrival from Ukraine of 10 thousand Cossacks of Hetman Obidovsky was also expected. As a result, the army was supposed to number more than 60 thousand people. But neither Repnin's division nor the Ukrainian Cossacks were in time, so the army numbered no more than 40 thousand people. In fact, there were about 30 thousand people near Narva, not counting the cavalry. A detachment (artillery), replenished in Novgorod and Pskov, set out from Moscow. The artillery consisted of 180-190 howitzers, mortars and cannons. The convoy moved with the army - at least 10 thousand carts.

Strategically, the campaign to Narva was clearly late. Denmark surrendered. The Saxon army will soon retreat from Riga. That is, the Swedes were able to concentrate their efforts on Russia. It was logical to go over to a strategic defense, prepare the border fortresses for a siege in order to bleed the enemy, and then launch a counteroffensive. The campaign began at an unfortunate time for hostilities (they were waiting for news of peace with the Turks). Autumn thaw slowed down the movement of the regiments, winter was approaching. Usually at that time the troops were sitting out in "winter quarters". There was not enough supply, which slowed down the concentration and movement of the regiments. The supply was poorly organized, there was not enough provisions and fodder. The uniforms quickly fell into disrepair. The army itself was in a transitional state: old traditions were crumbling, new ones were not yet established. Peter was building an army of the Western model, but there were only two new regiments (Semyonovsky and Preobrazhensky), two more were partially organized according to the Western model (Lefortovsky and Butyrsky). Peter and his entourage made the wrong bet on everything western (although the Russians beat the enemy for centuries, both in the west and in the southeast). The training of troops was carried out by foreign officers, according to the Military Regulations, created on the model of the Swedish and Austrian. The command was dominated by foreigners. That is, the army has lost its national spirit. This had a dramatic negative effect on her combat effectiveness.

The Russian Tsar himself was captivated by optimistic hopes. According to his contemporaries, Pyotr Alekseevich was eager to start a war and defeat the Swedes. It is obvious that the king was convinced of the fighting efficiency of the army. Otherwise, he would not have led the regiments towards disaster. At the same time, the combat effectiveness of the Russian army and military reform was highly appreciated not only by the tsar, but also by foreign observers. In particular, Saxon General Lang and Ambassador Gaines. They did not hide their impressions of Peter. After the surrender of Denmark, as Moscow knew, Peter had reason to suspend the campaign to Ingermanland. To organize the defense, complete the military reform, improve the supply and operation of the military industry. Peter, however, did not. Obviously, he overestimated his strength and underestimated the enemy's army. On the other hand, then Peter bowed to the "enlightened" Europe (later, after a series of serious mistakes, he would change a lot in his European policy), he wanted to look like a man who did not violate his obligations before the European courts.

Siege of Narva


Peter moved in his usual manner: often around the clock, making only stops to change horses, sometimes at night. Therefore, he was ahead of the troops. 2 guards and 4 soldier regiments departed from Tver at the same time. The sovereign arrived in Novgorod on August 30, and the regiments - six days later. After a three-day rest, the regiments moved to Narva. The Weide, Golovin and Repnin divisions were delayed due to a lack of transport (carts). Golovin arrived in Novgorod only on September 16, while Repnin was still in Moscow.

Therefore, the concentration of the forces of the Russian army near Narva took a very long time (for wartime). The advanced forces from Novgorod, led by Prince Trubetskoy, were at Narva on September 9 (20), 1700. The fortress was strong and there was a garrison headed by General Horn (1900 men). On September 22-23 (October 3-4), Peter arrived with guards regiments. On October 1 (12), Weide's "generals" approached, on October 15 (25), part of Golovin's troops. As a result, the Russian army did not have time to muster all the forces for the arrival of the Swedish troops. Engineering preparation of the area began, installation of batteries and trenching. On October 20 (31), a regular shelling of the fortress started. It lasted two weeks, but did not give much effect. It turned out that there was not enough ammunition (they simply ran out in two weeks of firing), there were not enough heavy weapons that could destroy the walls of Narva. In addition, it turned out that the gunpowder is of poor quality and does not provide the nuclei with sufficient impact force.

Meanwhile, the Swedish king, wasting no time, put his troops on ships, crossed the Baltic and on October 5 (16) landed in Revel and Pernau (about 10 thousand soldiers). The Swedes were going to go to the aid of Narva. Karl did not rush and gave the army a long rest. Peter sent Sheremetev's horse detachment (5 thousand people) for reconnaissance. The Russian cavalry moved for three days and covered 120 versts. On the way, she defeated two small advanced "parties" (subunit, detachment) of the enemy. The prisoners told about the offensive of 30-50 thousand Swedish army. Sheremetev retreated and on November 3 informed the tsar about it. He made excuses for winter conditions and a large number of patients. This angered Peter, he in harsh terms ordered the voivode to continue the reconnaissance raid. Sheremetev followed the order. But he reported on difficult conditions: villages, all burned, no firewood, water is "immensely thin" and people are sick, there is no forage.

On November 4 (15), the Swedes moved east from Reval. The king moved lightly, without strong artillery (37 cannons) and a convoy, the soldiers carried with them small supplies of provisions. Sheremetev had the ability to stop the enemy's movement. However, he made a number of mistakes. His cavalry had the ability to track the movement of the enemy and find out the true strength of the enemy army. But this was not done, moreover, they misled the main command (the number of the enemy was greatly exaggerated). The cavalry was divided into small detachments, and sent around the neighborhood to collect provisions and fodder. Lose the opportunity to threaten the enemy from the flanks and rear. The Swedes conducted reconnaissance and achieved surprise. The Russian cavalry detachments retreated and could not provide a worthy resistance to the enemy. Sheremetev took his army to Narva. He arrived there on November 18 (29) and said that the Swedish army was on his heels.


Battle


Peter himself with field marshal Golovin and favorite Menshikov left the army a few hours before Sheremetev's arrival. He handed over the main command to the Saxon Field Marshal Karl Eugene de Croix (originally from the Netherlands). The Saxon commander arrived with a group of generals to Peter with a message from Augustus (he asked the Russian troops for help). The Duke de Croix, not knowing the situation, not trusting the Russian army, resisted, but Peter insisted on his own. After the victory, the Swedes announced that the Russian tsar chickened out and fled from the battlefield. This is obviously a lie. Previous events (the Azov campaigns) and future battles showed that Pyotr Alekseevich was not a cowardly person. On the contrary, more than once he showed personal courage and courage. Apparently, he believed that there was still time before the decisive battle, he underestimated the enemy. You can pull up the lagging regiments, agree with the Saxon monarch about joint actions. He also trusted foreign generals too much. He believed that the enemy would be stopped without him. Neither the tsar nor his generals have yet encountered Charles XII, his manner of fighting. They could not imagine that he would rush into the attack on the move, without reconnaissance, without resting the tired soldiers. It was assumed that the Swedish command would first conduct a reconnaissance of the area, set up a strong camp and then try to help the Narva garrison.

Russian troops were stationed in a previously prepared position: a ditch and two lines of ramparts on the western bank of the Narva. Weide and Sheremetev stood on the left flank, Trubetskoy in the center, and Golovin on the right flank. All troops were in one line, without reserves. The battle line was about 7 miles, which allowed the enemy regiments assembled into a strike fist to make a breakthrough. At the council of war, Sheremetev proposed to put up a barrier against the fortress and withdraw troops into the field, to give the enemy a battle. With a numerical advantage, the presence of numerous cavalry that would bypass the enemy (Charles himself feared this), and good organization, the plan had a chance of success. De Croix, not believing in the troops, refused to confront the Swedes in the field. On the whole, his plan had a chance of success. The Russians have always fought well in strong positions. That is, if the army had a high fighting spirit, order and respected commanders, it would have thrown the enemy back. But this time it was different.

The Swedish army reached the Russian positions on the morning of November 19 (30), 1700. Unlike the enemy, Karl was well aware of the number and location of the Russians. Knowing that the Russians have the strongest positions in the center, the king decided to concentrate his efforts on the flanks, break through the defenses, push the enemy to the fortress and throw them into the river. There were significantly fewer Swedes, but they were better organized and built in two lines with a reserve. On the left flank in the 1st line were the Renschild and Horn regiments, in the second - the Ribbing reserve; in the center of the troops of Posse and Maydel, in front of the artillery of Schöblad; on the right flank is General Welling, followed by the Vachtmeister's cavalry. The battle began at 11 am with an artillery firefight, which lasted until 2 pm. The Swedes wanted to lure the Russians out of the fortifications, but without success. The Swedish king was also lucky with the weather. Heavy snow poured down. Visibility dropped to 20 steps. This allowed the Swedes to imperceptibly approach the Russian fortifications and fill the ditch with fascines (bundles of brushwood). They suddenly attacked and captured positions with cannons.

Panic began in the Russian regiments. Many felt that they had been betrayed by foreign officers. The soldiers began to beat the officers. The crowds of soldiers fled. Sheremetev's cavalry rushed to swim across the river. Sheremetev himself escaped, but hundreds of soldiers drowned. The infantry rushed to the only pontoon bridge off Kampergolm Island. He could not stand a large crowd of people and exploded. The river has received many new victims of the panic. And the "Germans" really changed. Commander de Croix was the first to go to the Swedes and lay down weapon... Other foreigners followed.

As the battle showed, even after the line was broken, not all was lost. The Russians retained their numerical advantage and could turn the tide of the battle and drive the enemy back. The cavalry could play a large role, go to the rear of the Swedes (if it had not fled). On the right flank, the Semyonovsky, Preobrazhensky, Lefortovsky regiments and the soldiers from Golovin's division who joined them created a fortification of carts and slingshots, fiercely repulsed all enemy attacks. Renschild's column was scattered by the fire of the Russian guards. On the left flank, the enemy's onslaught was repelled by Weide's division. Karl himself arrived on the battlefield to support the soldiers, but the Russians stood by. General Ribbing was killed, Renschild and Maydel were wounded. A horse was killed near Karl. At night, riots broke out in the Swedish army. Part of the infantry got to the carts, staged a pogrom and got drunk. In the darkness, the Swedes mistook each other for Russians and began skirmishes. Karl planned to resume the fight the next day.

Thus, with experienced commanders, the Russians could still finish the battle with dignity. But they were not there, as well as communications between the standing flanks of the Russian army. In the morning of the next day, Prince Yakov Dolgorukov, Imeretian Tsarevich Alexander Archilovich, Avtomon Golovin, Ivan Buturlin and Adam Veide began negotiations with the enemy. The Swedes swore an oath that the Russians would be freely allowed to the other side of the Narva with banners and weapons, but without artillery. At night, Russian and Swedish sappers prepared the crossings. Golovin's division and the guards left with weapons and banners. Weide's division capitulated only on December 2, on a repeated order from Dolgorukov. The troops received free passage, but now without weapons and banners. The losses of the Russian army amounted to about 6-8 thousand people killed, drowned, frozen, wounded and fled. All the artillery, the wagon train with the treasury, over 200 banners and standards were lost. Swedish losses - about 2 thousand people.

The Narva catastrophe was a heavy blow to the Russian army and state. Its reasons are military and political miscalculations and errors of the command. The allies were overestimated, like their own forces, the enemy, on the contrary, was underestimated. The war began at the wrong time. They were drawn into a poorly organized siege of Narva, the initiative was given to the enemy. Poorly prepared. The reconnaissance failed. The army was entrusted to foreign commanders and officers, undermining the confidence of the soldiers in the command. Narva was an excellent lesson for Peter and his entourage. Mobilized the king, country and people. The Swedish High Command, on the other hand, overestimated the Narva Victoria. The Russians in one battle, where several factors unfavorable for our army came together, were considered a weak enemy. Karl did not develop success, and when the Swedes attacked, Peter could ask for peace. He and his generals decided to beat and plunder the Rzeczpospolita. The personal factor also played a role. Charles XII underestimated the Russian tsar, considered him a coward who abandoned the army. And he despised the Saxon prince, hated him as the person who, in his opinion, formed the Northern Union. I wanted to punish Augustus, to deprive him of the Polish crown. Therefore, Karl turned his troops westward. He decided that it was impossible to go to Moscow while the Saxon troops were in the rear. Also, the Rzeczpospolita, which so far refrained from this, could oppose Sweden at any time.


Swedish victory in the Battle of Narva. Swedish artist Gustav Söderström.
Author:
Photos used:
https://ru.wikipedia.org/, http://bse.sci-lib.com/
87 comments
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  1. kalibr
    kalibr 21 November 2020 06: 00
    11
    The uniform quickly fell into disrepair state... The army itself was in transition Condition: STYLE! For such students grades are reduced ... Two identical words in consecutive sentences.
    1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
      Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 08: 03
      +5
      Vyacheslav Olegovich, bravo!
      Let's go to the guillotine! laughing
      Being a Cat, I got 6 bans for 4 comments !!! After that, I go around the Author's articles.
      I'll add it myself. Alas, the topic has not been disclosed. For a Russian person, the Narva tragedy is more than just a battle - it is a drama about which a series of articles must be written and that will not be enough !!!
      Regards, Vlad!
      1. kalibr
        kalibr 21 November 2020 08: 07
        +1
        Dear Vladislav! I think the remark about style will go without consequences. Although "there are no two identical words on the page" is the rule, or rather the ideal that any journalist should strive for. And then there is the "Fog-index" ... but this is really aerobatics and it's even somehow ... ashamed to write about it. You draw, they say ...
        1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
          Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 09: 51
          +4
          God forbid! I would like to read more about Narva, but I'm so afraid to even turn around, catch a ban and go out.
          Regards, Vlad!
          1. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 21 November 2020 16: 11
            +3
            Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
            God forbid! I would like to read more about Narva, but I'm so afraid to even turn around, catch a ban and go out.

            On December 21, 1919, there was a very long article on this site, with many illustrations, "A Cruel Lesson". And your comment on the article would be the first, where you commented very competently on the battle of Narva, as well as on NIK "Pan Kohanku".
            You yourself could fill in the missing space on the site. Try it, you will be good at it. Sincerely, Vladimir.
            1. Niel-le-Calais
              Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 14: 29
              0
              Quote: tihonmarine
              21 December 1919 years there was a very large article on this site, with many illustrations, "Cruel lesson".

              A century was recently on our favorite portal. laughing
              The article "Cruel lesson" from Ryzhov is indeed more detailed in the description.
              Here the author highlighted the battle itself (although Ryzhov described it in even more detail)
              And the numbers are different. And conclusions.
              For example, the army near Narva is considered weaker than Golitsyn in the Krym. (In terms of the number of regiments in the Western style)
      2. Revolver
        Revolver 21 November 2020 12: 29
        +2
        Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
        For a Russian person, the Narva tragedy is more than just a battle - it is a drama


        Quote: Friedrich Nietzsche
        What doesn't kill us makes us stronger.
        or, in common parlance, we, ahem, have, and we grow stronger. Poltava followed Narva.
        1. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 21 November 2020 16: 15
          +2
          Quote: Nagan
          or, in common parlance, we, ahem, have, and we grow stronger. Poltava followed Narva.

          More precisely, let's say "Learning from our mistakes." Although no one learns from strangers, they only say that they are learning.
          1. Revolver
            Revolver 21 November 2020 23: 37
            0
            Quote: tihonmarine
            More precisely, let's say "Learning from our mistakes." Although no one learns from strangers, they only say that they are learning.

            Smart people learn from the mistakes of others. Normal on their own. Fools don't learn. lol
        2. Niel-le-Calais
          Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 14: 34
          +1
          Quote: Nagan
          Poltava followed Narva.

          At first, Narva was followed by panic, and then another mobilization of resources from a poor country.
          And there were new battles. Fortress assaults in the Baltics. Construction, work, spending, deprivation and other delights ..
          Poltava as the final of the campaign, but not the company.
          It is a mistake to think that Poltava is the end of the Northern War. She is one of the battles. Let it be the end of Karl's campaign. There will still be naval battles, land battles ... and the Peace will be concluded by the sister, not Karl.
          This war will cost several decades (by the way, an invasive one, because the allies attacked Sweden, and Peter will conclude an eternal peace with the Swedes and immediately attack them in the Baltic States)
    2. Proxima
      Proxima 21 November 2020 13: 15
      +8
      Quote: kalibr
      The uniform quickly fell into disrepair state... The army itself was in transition Condition: STYLE! For such students grades are reduced ... Two identical words in consecutive sentences.

      But you are merciful however! What other students? In the Soviet school, grades 5-7, if you remember, two marks were given for an essay, one for grammar, the second for literary presentation. So, for two such bloopers, the second mark was reduced by one point! negative Well, as they say, what is not allowed for a Soviet child is allowed for the venerable author of a well-known site ...
    3. bandabas
      bandabas 21 November 2020 15: 39
      -3
      It happens. Nothing wrong. Try to write a long article yourself without "typos".
      1. Proxima
        Proxima 21 November 2020 18: 29
        +6
        Quote: bandabas
        It happens. Nothing wrong. Try to write a long article yourself without "typos".
        I have not tried it, I have written and published on VO, including more than once (though under a different nickname, it was never restored to me for unknown reasons). Understand, this is not about typos, but about not a literary presentation of the text in terms of stylistics, which did not fit into the 5th grade level of the Soviet secondary school. This is what I told Mr. Shpakovsky, who wrote about the level of the institute. As for the Honorable Mr. Samsonov, I don't care what style he writes in. If only the meaning of what was said was clear. hi
        1. bandabas
          bandabas 21 November 2020 22: 59
          +1
          It happens. Nothing personal. Good luck in the future.
    4. Looking for
      Looking for 21 November 2020 17: 09
      0
      yes you are also elementary illiterate !!!!
  2. Cartalon
    Cartalon 21 November 2020 07: 27
    +6
    Even if Rugodiv is called a Russian fortress 20 times, the fact that the fortress was Danish cannot be canceled.
    1. Niel-le-Calais
      Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 14: 39
      -2
      Quote: Cartalon
      Even if Rugodiv is called a Russian fortress 20 times, the fact that the fortress was Danish cannot be canceled.

      when the territory passes from hand to hand, then everyone considers it "their original"
      The Danish Land Register of 1241 mentions the village of Narvia on the site of part of the territory of the modern city. In ancient Russian sources, the fortified settlement was first mentioned by the Novgorod I Chronicle under 1256

      "In summer 6764. Came Holy and Yem and Sum and Didman with their volost and a multitude of rats and began to repair the city on Narov"
      Moreover, first the name Narva is documented, and then
      Under 1344, 1420, 1444 in the same Novgorod first chronicle, as well as in the "dangerous letter" of the Novgorod governors to the Hanseatic ambassadors in Dorpat in 1417, this settlement is called Rugodiv.
      But we forgive the author of superussov..and other features.
      Well, he confused Denmark. Or maybe DaniRusskoy also considers her, from the word tribute. laughing
  3. parusnik
    parusnik 21 November 2020 07: 31
    +7
    ..Yes ... it's hard for Kresnovsky to edit smile
  4. The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 21 November 2020 07: 40
    +3
    And I first read about the defeat at Narva in "Peter 1", Leo Tolstoy.
    At school, they did not go through this, but more and more they extolled Poltava. There, they say, is the heroism of the Russian soldier, and the genius of Peter.
    1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
      Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 08: 14
      10
      HOW Leader, Poltava is not possible without Narva!
      I can only sympathize with the unlucky you at school with a history teacher.
      In grade 4 we drew diagrams and prepared reports on all battles from the Battle of Kulikovo to the Kursk Bulge. Despite the fact that the teacher was a pensioner, she was a real scoop, but she was able to instill a love for history in boys and girls. For girls, the emphasis was placed on the rulers of women, Princess Olga, Catherine, Anna Ioannovna, the den of the Decembrists and tsars.
      We were split about guns, ships, generals. We wake up the last with her. Then she finally retired. But I am still grateful to Galina Ivanovna.
      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 21 November 2020 16: 35
        +2
        Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
        In grade 4 we drew diagrams and prepared reports on all the battles from the Battle of Kulikovo to the Kursk Bulge.

        And the lesson began with a short questionnaire - place, date, sides of the battle, commanders. Answered "5" did not answer "2". It's the same throughout history. But our story began only at the age of seven from the fifth grade. Until now, history and mathematics with chemistry are my favorite subjects.
      2. Niel-le-Calais
        Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 14: 41
        -2
        Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
        HOW Leader, Poltava is not possible without Narva

        I do not know about many. But Narva, as a battle and the first siege, always comes at the beginning of the chapter of the Northern War.
        Even with me.
        Although I am sure that without the second siege and the capture of Azov, even the first Narva is impossible.
    2. Undecim
      Undecim 21 November 2020 10: 56
      12
      And I first read about the defeat at Narva in "Peter 1", Leo Tolstoy.
      Alexei Tolstoy.
    3. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 21 November 2020 16: 29
      +2
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      There, they say, is the heroism of the Russian soldier, and the genius of Peter.

      Well, that's what the novel is, to describe not what happened, but what the writer came up with, although the historical facts remain unchanged, and they fit into a dozen lines.
      And Tolstoy's novel begins precisely not with a historical description, but with invented characters. Novel. Book one. Chapter one. 1. Sanka jumped off the stove, banged her backside on the swollen door. Yashka, Gavrilka and Artamoshka quickly got down after Sanka: suddenly everyone wanted to drink, We must all know, remember and write about the heroism of the Russian soldier. But we write about the genius of the generals not by their genius, but by the size of their position.
    4. Unknown
      Unknown 21 November 2020 21: 42
      +7
      Alexei Nikolaevich Tolstoy wrote to Peter. I was born in Narva, I know those places firsthand.
      Here is a monument erected by the Semenovtsy and the Preobrazhentsi is called the Heroes of the Ancestors. There is also a monument on the bastion to the perished Russian wars, but already in 1704 during the capture of Narva
      1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Kote Pan Kokhanka 22 November 2020 16: 48
        0
        Valuable addition Victor Nikolaevich, THANKS!
  5. ee2100
    ee2100 21 November 2020 07: 49
    +8
    These were two ancient Russian fortresses - Rugodiv and Oreshek, captured by the Swedes. (C) Rugodiev is the Russian name for the city (settlement, fortress) of Narva. Only in 1558, during the Livonian War, it was captured and became Russian for some time, and before that it was Danish and Livonian.
    1. Bar1
      Bar1 21 November 2020 09: 42
      -7
      Quote: ee2100
      These were two ancient Russian fortresses - Rugodiv and Oreshek

      Do you know that this fortress-Oreshek is depicted by the OI in the wrong place? Previously, this fortress or the city of Oreshek was on the site of Petersburg: at the exit from the Neva. So the question arises: did the cursed Peter build the city on this place?
      Here is a 15 map by Paolo Farlani from 1568.

      1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 09: 55
        +9
        Timur, don't you take into account that Farlani, drawing his map from the words of merchants, could have made a mistake?
        1. Bar1
          Bar1 21 November 2020 10: 55
          -3
          I am of the opinion that there was already a city on the site of Petersburg before Peter, because there are old engravings on which the city had already heavily deconstructed quarters by the year 15 - this is in the first place.
          Secondly, not only Farlani's maps show that there was already a city in this place, here in 1566 Giacomo Gastaldo, we see Nut and the badge is shifted closer to the sea than to the lake.

      2. Cartalon
        Cartalon 21 November 2020 09: 57
        +7
        Yes - yes, they took it apart, stone by stone, and carried it to Walnut Island in my arms, I saw it myself.
      3. ee2100
        ee2100 21 November 2020 11: 02
        +3
        That St. Petersburg and the Oreshek fortress have a very advantageous geographical position. We all know the story of Nut. The fortress was built to keep the Swedes out of Lake Ladoga, which the Novgorodians considered theirs. It was possible to build a fortress at the mouth of the Neva, but in those days it was difficult. There is evidence that there were already Swedish settlements there.
        Most likely the cartographer was really wrong.
        1. Bar1
          Bar1 21 November 2020 11: 36
          -6
          Quote: ee2100
          Most likely the cartographer was really wrong.

          and here is the third card, Antonio Vid: was he also wrong? It can be seen that some city was at the mouth of the Neva.

          1. ee2100
            ee2100 21 November 2020 11: 43
            +4
            The city is not a city, but the settlement was quite large. Last year, archaeological excavations were carried out on Sredneokhtinsky Prospect, which was not discovered there. They write that medieval buildings laughing
        2. Niel-le-Calais
          Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 14: 48
          -1
          Quote: ee2100
          It was possible to build a fortress at the mouth of the Neva, but in those days it was difficult to do. There is evidence that there were already Swedish settlements

          do not forget that in addition to the favorable geographical position, the terrain and climate change quite often (flood, swamps, sea)
          therefore, the settlements often change their position. Well, fortified settlements even more so.
          It is difficult to build a large fortress on inconvenient terrain ... but fellow Romans long ago showed that they do not care where to build, if you know how to build.
  6. Kote Pan Kokhanka
    Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 08: 16
    +3
    August II was unable to organize a surprise attack on Riga. The Riga garrison, against the background of indecisive actions of the enemy, managed to prepare for the defense. The Saxon and Polish ruler himself was more entertained than engaged in military affairs. He was more interested in hunting and theater than war.

    Yes, women were interested in this royal person, a little carried away by August the second of this name, nicknamed strong! laughing
    1. parusnik
      parusnik 21 November 2020 12: 21
      +5
      "Evil" tongues claim that he had about 250 illegitimate children, perhaps I am mistaken. But he really had strength, unbend horseshoes, could stop three horses on the move ... There was a jock ... During his reign, Saxony acquired china on an industrial scale, the same languages ​​claim that he wanted to produce coffins from porcelain, but limited himself to sets, which sufficiently replenished the treasury ..
    2. Niel-le-Calais
      Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 14: 58
      -1
      Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
      Yes, women were interested in this royal person, a little carried away by August the second of this name, nicknamed strong!

      well August had a bunch of mistresses and favorites. Well imitated Louis 14 (and who did not imitate? All of Europe imitated)
      well, he spent on women. He spent a lot on all sorts of Aurora ... Plus another war ..
      But for the sake of interest, Augustus first began hostilities even before the start of the war. Seeking to suddenly capture Riga. But the Swedes had E. Dahlberg, the Saxons lost their hero. And the besieging pace.
      Plus epidemic from siege, conditions, logistics ..
      E. Dahlberg was so cool for the Saxons that he kept the city after breaking through the walls.
      So I would not blame Augustus - he was not directly responsible for the siege of Riga. He was supposed to be all the time either in Warsaw or not far .. It's Poland! There you could drive away from the capital and mustache ..
  7. infantryman2020
    infantryman2020 21 November 2020 08: 25
    +1
    Excellent educational program. Better only visualization.
    1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
      Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 10: 04
      +6
      Quote: infantryman2020
      Excellent educational program. Better only visualization.

      Well, let's essentially, in the history textbook, the defeat at Narva during the Northern War is given much wider and more complete.
      The inhabitants of the site's history branch are far from neophytes and do not need an educational program.
      So, naturally, I would like to receive a detailed series of articles on this tragic event for my Fatherland, and not a retelling of generally known information.
      My personal opinion is the defeat of the Russian army at the walls of Narva - this is the event in the description of which size matters!
      1. Motorist
        Motorist 22 November 2020 19: 17
        +1
        Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
        The inhabitants of the site's history branch are far from neophytes and do not need an educational program.

        What do you say for everyone - we are also here with Infantryman. Invisible ... smile
        1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
          Kote Pan Kokhanka 22 November 2020 20: 08
          +1
          Then the question is, what have you learned new for yourself from the article?
          I personally do not consider an infantryman a neophyte from history.
          Regards, Vlad!
          1. Motorist
            Motorist 23 November 2020 00: 00
            +1
            Then I apologize to the Infantryman! I learned exactly new things - about going out without banners and weapons, and a lot of well-forgotten old ones (that's why I read the article). You know, I recently even searched the Internet for what is the difference between butane and isobutane, although, it seems, I should remember the elementary ...
            Yours! hi
            1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
              Kote Pan Kokhanka 23 November 2020 04: 36
              +1
              If you write about Narva, you need a series of articles. This is the nodal point of our history.
              So information for reflection at your leisure.
              Almost all of the field artillery and firearms of the Fuselers of Peter's army were of Swedish origin.
              Regards, Vlad!
  8. Olgovich
    Olgovich 21 November 2020 10: 20
    +3
    He decided that it was impossible to go to Moscow while the Saxon troops were in the rear. Also, the Rzeczpospolita, which so far refrained from this, could oppose Sweden at any time.

    I thought correctly.
    1. Nazar
      Nazar 21 November 2020 11: 56
      +5
      Olgovich - Field Marshal Montgomery: "The first rule in the book of war - never march on Moscow" - before this statement at that moment there were still 250 years, but Karl's "chuyka" worked right wink
      But seriously - in densely populated Poland and Saxony there was something to plunder, and in Russia, in its northwestern part, there are rare and by that time pretty impoverished cities that did not promise any prey. It is no coincidence that Karl's second visit to Russia was made from the south-west, from Little Russia.
      1. ee2100
        ee2100 21 November 2020 12: 19
        +5
        This is not a "chuyka", but a real assessment of the situation. The fact that he was lucky near Narva does not mean that he would have taken Pskov, Novgorod so easily and naturally with a small contingent, and there is nothing to talk about Moscow.
        Do you want to pass off Samsonov's fabrications as the thoughts of Karl XII?
        1. Undecim
          Undecim 21 November 2020 12: 56
          +5
          This is not a "chuyka", but a real assessment of the situation
          This was a mistake and an incorrect assessment of the situation. Strategy is clearly not Charles XII's forte.
          1. ee2100
            ee2100 21 November 2020 13: 34
            +1
            What is Karl's mistake? What has not developed its success?
            1. Undecim
              Undecim 21 November 2020 13: 50
              +7
              The fact that the war with Russia had to be brought to its logical end. The logical end of the war at that time was the conclusion of peace on appropriate terms.
              And Charles XII took up nonsense, chasing the womanizer Augustus the Strong through Europe and caught himself already in 1707, but it was too late. And even at this time, he had every chance not to bring the matter to Poltava, but to take a strategic pause, making peace with Peter on acceptable terms. But for this one had to be a strategist and think on the appropriate scale.
              1. ee2100
                ee2100 21 November 2020 13: 58
                +3
                As history has shown, Sweden's resources are not unlimited. I think Karl was sober in his assessment of the situation. And with 10 thousand troops, where would he go? Karl's goal is to unblock Narva and he achieved it. The resources were intended only for this operation and that's it.
                1. Undecim
                  Undecim 21 November 2020 14: 26
                  +7
                  Why would he go somewhere with 10 troops? After the Narva confusion, Peter I made multiple attempts to conclude peace with Sweden through Austrian and French mediators. August II made similar attempts during the winter of 000/1700.
                  With strategic thinking and diplomatic ability, Charles XII had the widest room for maneuver.
                  Instead, he received the Birzhai agreement. That is, to swing the sword beautifully is good for a combatant. And kings should also think with their heads.
                  1. ee2100
                    ee2100 21 November 2020 14: 30
                    0
                    It is easy from the XXI century to comment on the events of four hundred years ago. What is done is done, otherwise they will soon write it down to the alternatives.
                    1. Undecim
                      Undecim 21 November 2020 14: 34
                      +5
                      It is easy from the XXI century to comment on the events of four hundred years ago
                      I would not say. In order for the comments to be more or less substantiated, it is necessary to make certain efforts in the form of mastering and analyzing information starting from Voltaire.
                      1. ee2100
                        ee2100 21 November 2020 14: 36
                        0
                        I think we have a pointless conversation. Good luck!
                      2. Undecim
                        Undecim 21 November 2020 14: 38
                        +8
                        All the best. Judging by the minuses that have appeared, you have like-minded people. The truth is not able to clearly state their objections.
                      3. ee2100
                        ee2100 21 November 2020 14: 42
                        0
                        Why like-minded people? Maybe just your enemies.
    2. Olgovich
      Olgovich 21 November 2020 14: 59
      0
      Quote: ee2100
      with a small contingent, he would take Pskov, Novgorod, but there is nothing to talk about Moscow


      To go to the Russian expanses and distances, along its north, to the Russian WINTER is what resources and desperate courage to have had?

      Karl did not have the necessary resources.

      And while leaving the army of the Saxons in the rear, and the Poles, is generally the height of stupidity.
      1. ee2100
        ee2100 21 November 2020 15: 29
        0
        And I mean the same, but the 11th thinks differently
        1. Undecim
          Undecim 21 November 2020 23: 42
          +2
          but the 11th thinks differently
          In my opinion, you never read my comment, although it seems written in Russian.
    3. Nazar
      Nazar 22 November 2020 03: 31
      0
      ee2100 - Dear Alexander, I don't care about Samsonov and his "creativity" at all, I was just joking wink
      And so - everything happened then as it happened and what would not be written here now, nothing will change from this. we can only discuss - would a grandmother become a grandfather if she had certain gender characteristics? fellow
  9. Niel-le-Calais
    Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 15: 01
    -2
    Quote: Nazar
    It is no coincidence that Karl's second visit to Russia was made from the southwest, from Little Russia.

    Grodno, Minsk, Mogilev, Smolensk ... it doesn't look like Ukraine.
    And about the turn to Europe, of course, the glory and the money were there, but the trip to Novgorod and Pskov is long, dreary, expensive, and there is no glory.
    Karl made the right choice.
    Usually the eastern company for the Swedes was the capture of fortresses, the destruction of the army, peace on the terms of the winner. Go to Moscow? Yes ... Karl was dissuaded from this. Too risky. And there were no resources for such logistics.
    Karl was generally easy to dissuade by the fact that it did not have fame and battles.
    As for the conclusion of peace, for Karl there was no peace at all. Only war and surrender.
  • Undecim
    Undecim 21 November 2020 11: 05
    12
    While reading this hack, I remembered Ilf and Petrov:
    The red-haired man was quite accustomed to the situation and quite sensibly, albeit monotonously, told the content of the mass brochure "Mutiny at Ochakovo"
    1. ee2100
      ee2100 21 November 2020 11: 31
      +7
      What makes Balaganov related to Samsonov is money!
  • ee2100
    ee2100 21 November 2020 11: 29
    +7
    It makes no sense to parse the article. The author's conclusions are very confused. On behalf of the advantage in almost everything, the Russian army suffered a humiliating defeat. And the reason, in my opinion, is the lack of a general strategy and planning of the company. There were no experienced military commanders, and it was still difficult for a Russian soldier to fight with experienced Caroliners at that time.
    There is only one road from Tallinn to Narva and it could have been blocked in different places, but this was not done.
    This is a lesson and a very expensive and hurtful lesson.
    1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
      Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 12: 00
      +4
      Here I will fully support you.
      For example, the Russian siege artillery shot the cannonballs in three days. The rest of the available ones did not fit any weapon.
      Moreover, the menagerie of cannons, mortars and squeaks near Narva was noble, over 100 barrels.
      1. ee2100
        ee2100 21 November 2020 12: 11
        +4
        God! What unanimity am Joke.
        1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
          Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 13: 11
          +3
          How can I have a bad attitude towards the person who awarded me the Order of the Shpakovsky name, three oily! wink
          Also a joke!
          1. ee2100
            ee2100 21 November 2020 13: 32
            +3
            I did not award an order. laughing .but I do not like the eulogies for the run-of-the-mill article, albeit a respected author here. I believe that comments are appropriate here, and not praise
            1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
              Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 16: 00
              +4
              I consider a kind word to a stray dog ​​to be pleased.
              1. Catfish
                Catfish 21 November 2020 18: 54
                +3
                The cat too. smile
              2. Korsar4
                Korsar4 22 November 2020 08: 57
                +1
                It is strange that this is forgotten.
                Although, when stroking against the grain, it is remembered better. Remarque pointed to this.
    2. Catfish
      Catfish 21 November 2020 18: 57
      +7
      Hello Alexander hi ... Vic Nick is right - not the author to break spears. drinks
      1. ee2100
        ee2100 21 November 2020 20: 57
        +2
        He changed the saying "a kind word and a dog ..... nice" in reality and a cat, and you will agree these are different creatures! In the thought of God.
        1. Catfish
          Catfish 21 November 2020 20: 58
          +2
          Of course they are different, just like people. smile
          1. ee2100
            ee2100 21 November 2020 21: 05
            -1
            The word "cat" in your nickname says a lot. I will not be like "racists" by species, but I am a dog lover. And I perceive the distortion in the statement as "how to lick something that has not yet been licked." Litter for my truth
            1. Catfish
              Catfish 21 November 2020 21: 09
              +3
              Obviously, you are somewhere in the wrong place. Your business, but the desire to communicate with you has disappeared. All the best to you with "your truth", only one you understand.
              1. ee2100
                ee2100 22 November 2020 10: 36
                +1
                Good morning. Maybe he didn't put it exactly. Sori.
            2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
              Kote Pan Kokhanka 21 November 2020 22: 23
              +3
              Divide cats and dogs by race! But!!!
              1. Korsar4
                Korsar4 22 November 2020 08: 59
                +3
                It is not a race: it is a species.
                I am damaging, although I am quite critical of systematics.
                1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
                  Kote Pan Kokhanka 22 November 2020 12: 04
                  +2
                  I know Sergey that's why I'm laughing!
              2. Catfish
                Catfish 22 November 2020 13: 54
                0
                Yeah ... I wonder how much and what was drunk before that? laughing
  • Narak-zempo
    Narak-zempo 21 November 2020 15: 11
    -1
    As always, the Russians were set up by the allies.
    The Poles made all this mess, snatched it from Riga and merged ...
    1. Niel-le-Calais
      Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 18: 29
      -2
      Quote: Narak-zempo
      The Poles made all this mess, snatched it from Riga and merged ...

      the main ideologist of the Northern War is not at all Poles.
  • itis
    itis 21 November 2020 19: 28
    -1
    Charles XII is the last monarch of Europe who died in battle.
    Peter I also risked a lot (without irony), died from complications of gonorrhea.
  • Moskovit
    Moskovit 22 November 2020 17: 36
    0
    Sweden is a funny country. Charles's lessons did not go to the future kings. They repeatedly declared wars to Russia and lost. Until the new king Bernadotte appeared, who broke this paradigm, otherwise half of Sweden could have been taken))
    1. Niel-le-Calais
      Niel-le-Calais 22 November 2020 18: 45
      -2
      Quote: Moskovit
      Over and over again they declared war on Russia and lost

      If we take the wars between Sweden and Russia (and not Novgorod, for Russia is the heir to the Moscow principality and itself captured Novgorod), then the Swedes won at least two times (especially in the Livonian War)
      Mostly draws in games.
      The Great Northern War is the largest war on the list. And the last winning company in 1808-1809, when Russia again attacked Sweden without declaring war during the Anglo-Russian war as a result of an agreement with Napoleon, ended with the registration of territorial concessions and the adoption of a continental blockade of England.
      Stockholm, although it was nearby, but the problems with logistics are the trouble of all armies. Yes, and the capture would still not give anything. The conditions of Napoleon and Alexander were accepted. Was it for nothing that Napoleon won in the battle of Friedland ... according to Tilsit RI was obliged to influence northern countries with the aim of blockading England.