Military Review

“Petliura is an idealist without any scope”

131
In May, 2012 was 133, the year since the birth of Simon Petlyura. Hardly in stories Ukraine, there is a more controversial personality. Who was he? Who is he - a paid agent of the Western powers or a fiery patriot, a talented politician, or an ordinary gangster. Some historians describe him as an incorrigible adventurer and careerist, others as a traitor to national interests, and still others as the unofficial head of the criminal circles of Ukraine. Hardly ever we will find out all the answers. History carefully keeps its secrets. However, let us today at least open the veil.

“Petliura is an idealist without any scope”


Simon Petliura had strong leadership qualities and an extraordinary mind, he was always interested in art, liked to speak on the topics of literature and drama in Ukraine, played the violin well. Following the advice of his parents, he entered the Poltava Theological Seminary and studied there until the 1901 year. It was not possible to finish it, since he was expelled for poor academic performance and participation in the meetings of the Revolutionary Ukrainian Party. Young Petliura in search of work in the 1902 year comes to the Kuban. His dream was to become a teacher, but his reputation as a revolutionary and troublemaker closes all doors before him. He makes a living by printing in local newspapers and collections. His study of Kuban, published in the Literary and Scientific Gazette, is known. Hiding from the authorities, in 1902, Simon moved to Yekaterinodar, where he was arrested in December 1903. After being released in March 1904, he entered the university in Lviv. He returned to Russia in the 1905 year after the amnesty. Before 1907, the expedition explores the steppe regions of the Kuban, works as a teacher, accountant, and editor of the Slovo newspaper. Due to the threat of another arrest, Petlyura leaves for Moscow. In the period from 1907 to 1912, he edits the magazine Ukrainian Life, marries, and his daughter Lesya is born.

With the onset of World War I, Petlura’s life changed dramatically. First, he is arranged in a charity organization that deals with consumer services of the royal army. At the end of May 1917, the Central Rada of Ukraine held elections for the first military congress of Ukrainians. Military uniforms and education give Petlura the advantages, and he gets into the composition of the delegates. Later, with the reputation of a Social Democrat, he joined the presidium. After the formation of the Central Rada government, Simon is appointed Minister of Military Affairs. The reasons for such a rapid career take-off are explained by the fact that Ukraine lacked literally adults. In addition, Petliura was delegated from the front. His personal qualities, ability to negotiate and experience in military affairs then did not matter.



In the early days, Petliura decided to defend an alliance with Russia. At the same time, he advocates a war with Germany and Austria. The provisional government in Russia is completely satisfied with this state of affairs. They began to create "Ukrainianized" military units. Petlura spent most of his time in a train car traveling through the western regions of Ukraine. A colleague wrote about him:

“Petlyura is an idealist without any scope. But what I liked was a certain feeling of love for everything Ukrainian. This feeling was genuine and without any personal utilitarian goals. It was evident that people do not work from under the lash, but with passion. ”


However, after the October Socialist Revolution, the new Soviet government signed the Peace Ordinance with Germany. The eastern front disintegrated, which worried the Entente countries. Their only hope remained the Central Council. Simon Petliura accurately caught the wind of change and, as Minister of Military Affairs, began negotiations with Western diplomats in Kiev. But I was glad to consider it more promising to unite with Germany, rather than relying on the promises of the Entente countries and the USA. After that, Petliura only had to resign.

Power changes people. Petliura felt her taste and did not want to part with it. Therefore, he goes directly to Poltava region, with the support of the friendly local ataman Volokh, to organize his own Haidamak military detachment. It was based on the Cossacks and foremen from the Kiev military schools. In the winter of 1918, Petlyura comes to Kiev to the aid of the Central Rada, which, under the pressure of the advancing Red Army, is rapidly losing supporters. Petliurists brutally suppress the uprisings of workers in the city. In those days, they killed about 1500 people. Two days later, the Central Rada fled the city. Petliurovsky detachment covered her retreat to Zhytomyr. Here 27 January 1918, they joined with the German-Austro-Hungarian troops, launching an attack on Kiev. Thus, by coincidence, Petliura was associated with the seizure of Ukraine by German-Austrian troops. He wrote in 1925:

“It is necessary to remember only one thing: if the Central Council did not call the Germans, they themselves would come to us. They knew well that the front was no longer there, and in Ukraine there was neither a large, disciplined army, nor firm power, then the road to us would be free: no one would stop. ”


The occupiers created the Ukrainian state under the leadership of Hetman Skoropadsky. Petliura gained the post of chairman of the All-Ukrainian Union of Zemstvos, but was hostile to the new regime. In August, 1918, Petliura was arrested. After his release, he was able to get to a nearby squad of Sich Riflemen. That same night, he wrote on his own behalf an appeal to all the people of Ukraine with a call to start an uprising. Having spread throughout the country, the liberation movement instantly ceased to be controlled, resulting in the self-actions of individual gangster atamans. Pogroms and destruction took place throughout Ukraine. Some gangs fixed up special atrocities by shooting their victims without trial. The real extermination of the Jewish population began. A huge number of people killed, hundreds of cities and villages burned to the ground. Lawlessness in Trostinets and the Uman massacre, atrocities in the town of Slovechno and the Novomirgorod massacre, pogroms in Smela, Radomysl, Elisavetgrad will remain forever in history. According to eyewitnesses, Petlyura did not approve of anti-Semitism, but was not going to stop him. Atamans, squad commanders, acted at their discretion throughout Ukraine. Petliura gave them complete freedom of action and diligently did not notice the crimes they committed.

In the winter of 1918, the German occupation ended. Petliura single-handedly led the troops of the Ukrainian Directory. In January, 1919, in order to increase its authority in the eyes of the Entente countries, the Directory officially declared war on Russia. Allied forces landed in Odessa, but did not rush to the provision of military assistance to Ukraine. And the war flared up more and more. In February 1919, the Directory left Kiev. In response to a desperate request for support, the head of the allied forces, Colonel A. Freudenberg, asked to remove a number of people from the leadership. Petlyura with the short phrase “for banditry” got into this list. The management of the Directory only partially fulfilled their request, limiting its authority. At a meeting in Proskurov 14 in March 1919, Petlura stubbornly defended the decision to continue negotiations with the Entente. He also managed to prevent a long-overdue peace treaty with Russia. For military assistance Entente appointed a huge price. In three months, the directory was to form an army with a number of thousands of people in 300 and put it under French command. Also under the control of the French passed all the finances of Ukraine. These plans were not destined to come true. Without waiting for confirmation of the peace pact, the Red Army again launched an offensive and ousted the Ukrainian army to Poland.

After the negotiations with the Entente were stumped, and their troops were driven out by the Red Army, Petlyura went to negotiations with the Poles. Now his obsession was to liberate Ukraine from Soviet troops with the support of Poland. 21 April 1919 Petlura signed the Warsaw Agreement, under which Western Volyn and Eastern Galicia passed to Poland. After this, the liberation army marched. At the same time, Petlyura is attempting to come to an agreement with Denikin, who also moved towards Kiev at the head of the Volunteer Army. By coincidence, 31 August between Denikinians and Petliurists an armed clash occurred because of insulting the Denikin banner, which put an end to the relationship that had begun. Petliura betrayed his headquarters, after which he had to flee to Warsaw. And 12 June 1920, Kiev was again occupied by the Red Army

In 1920, Russia forced Poland to sign the Riga Peace Treaty, and Petlura leaned toward Baron Wrangel. But the joint November offensive of the White Guard units and the Petliura troops did not lead to success. When Wrangel's troops were defeated in the Crimea, the Petliurists laid down weapon. In 1923, the Soviets demanded that Warsaw be given Petlura, so he and like-minded people fled to Hungary, then to Vienna and Geneva. Finally, in October 1924, he settled in Paris, where 25 May 1926, was killed by a pistol shot by some Samuel Schwarzbard. According to one version, the killer was an anarchist, a friend of Nestor Makhno. According to another version, Schwartzbard avenged the relatives killed in Ukraine. He was later acquitted.

There is no unequivocal assessment of the actions of the disgraced ataman. In Dnepropetrovsk, there is a plaque installed in memory of the victims of Simon Petliura and his soldiers. And on May 16 on Ukraine's 2005, the president signs a decree to perpetuate the memory of the ataman and erect monuments to him. But today it is known that he still has no monuments.

Sources:
http://www.vitrenko.org/news.php?lang=1&part_id=25&subpart_id=111&article_id=1213&year_id=2007&month_id=05
http://voenhronika.ru/publ/grazhdanskaja_vojna_v_rossii/pjat_smertej_simona_petljury_rossija_2008_god/7-1-0-1336
http://hrono.ru/biograf/bio_p/petljura_s.php
http://myblogjoker777.blogspot.com/2011/05/25-25.html
http://www.people.su/131424
http://www.e-reading.org.ua/chapter.php/1004551/34/Sever_Aleksandr_-_Russko-ukrainskie_voyny.html
Five deaths of Simon Petliura

25 May 1926 in Paris, the former chief ataman of the army of the Ukrainian People’s Republic, the former head of the Directorate of the UPR, Simon Petlyura, was shot with five shots at close range. The killer was detained by the police at the scene of the crime. He said that he killed a man of revenge - for the Jewish pogroms during the Civil War in Ukraine.
However, there were other versions of the murder. In the emigrant environment, for example, they were convinced that this was the work of the NKVD.
The film, exploring all the options, tells история the elevations and deaths of Petliura, who in his homeland are considered by some to be a national hero and others to be a traitor.

Simon Vasilyevich Petlyura - Ukrainian political and military leader, head of the Directory of the UNR (Ukrainian People's Republic) from 1919 to 1920, Chief Ataman of the Army and Fleet.

Very controversial and ambiguous personality.

Author:
131 comment
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  1. Shohmansur
    Shohmansur 7 July 2012 09: 33
    +8
    Oh, how Mikhail Afanasevich Bulgakov hated him.
    1. Green 413-1685
      Green 413-1685 7 July 2012 10: 24
      +11
      And there was a reason. Just in the hands of such clever fools of idealists rushing from side to side there is always a lot of blood. And in a situation of civil war, when all the foundations and traditions are crumbling, when there is no law, and the price of life is less than a piece of bread, such figures with burning eyes are especially dangerous.
      1. Норд
        Норд 7 July 2012 13: 55
        +4
        Fools are not smart by definition. And this individual is just a rare bastard without convictions and conscience, no matter what slogans he uses. In general, politics is a dirty business, but Petlyura’s execution is also wildly bloody and mean.
        1. Green 413-1685
          Green 413-1685 7 July 2012 15: 36
          +1
          There are also how. Talking about his moral qualities I really see no reason. However, there are few righteous in the civil war. And there is blood on the whites, but the red ones are generally on the very eyebrows. Well, at the expense of Petlyura, we can say that if the same Makhno was a hysterical psychopath, then Petlyura is precisely a frostbitten idealist, ready for the sake of his bullshit to drown Little Russia in blood.
          1. Lech e-mine
            Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 40
            0
            fighters PETLURA did their ideas so
      2. Lech e-mine
        Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 39
        0
        after the raid of Petliurists
  2. raptorr
    raptorr 7 July 2012 10: 21
    -25
    Patriot. Everlasting memory
    1. smile
      smile 7 July 2012 13: 37
      +7
      raptorr
      Burn him in hell for great achievements in the field of the destruction of his own people. This hero was ready to put Ukraine even under the Poles, with their slogan - Polsk from the Mog to the Mogul pursuing a fierce policy of polonization and oppression on all the same Ukrainian and Belarusian (essentially Russian) lands! ..dog-dog death!
      1. raptorr
        raptorr 7 July 2012 14: 53
        -13
        And what do you know about him. What topwar wrote
        1. Alexander Petrovich
          Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 14: 56
          +6
          And you, as I understand it, were personally acquainted with him.
        2. smile
          smile 7 July 2012 15: 55
          +1
          raptorr
          Okst, unfortunate. Here particles are written about him - the format does not allow it. If they had written about him in detail here - you would have come out with bile ... sapsem. If I scooped all the information only from here and would not read anything all my life, I would not write a single comment.
        3. chistii20
          chistii20 7 July 2012 20: 04
          +2
          Quote: raptorr

          And what do you know about him. What topwar wrote

          Even more than you think. In my opinion you are Bendera
          1. ZuluS
            ZuluS 8 July 2012 22: 39
            -2
            Well, in Bendera, you are special, probably? Dear Russians, all these Bendera, Petliura and even Zaporozhye Cossacks fought, often successfully, for independence from Russia, in particular. Therefore, at the time of the scoop, they were doused with mud and anathematized at the "imperial" level. The reasons, I hope, do not need to be explained? In Ukraine, they are respected and revered as heroes, not all, of course, but not only in Lviv, as they like to poison you on a zombie box. Even in Donbass and Crimea there are Ukrainian nationalists. And the stronger the government will carry out senseless russification in Ukraine, the more nationalists will appear! Features of the mentality acquired through history! Bendera and Shukhevych are heroes of Ukraine, OFFICIALLY !!! Nobody canceled this law! (In Russia there is Minin and Pozharsky, who are hated in Poland, for example. And you hate them, by the way, not only them, but Russia is a big country, with great ambitions and a centuries-old history full of wars, therefore you have produced many enemies! ) So already on a subconscious level you hate those who fought for freedom in the lands of modern Ukraine and not only! It's time to stop poking your finger and trying to offend with hackneyed labels hung by a now defunct country! Moreover, this is no longer an insult. Tolerance and respect are, first of all, an indicator of good breeding and intelligence!
      2. gor
        gor 7 July 2012 16: 38
        -7
        like Lenin and Stalin for the great achievements in the destruction of the peoples of their country. Since I saw many people who are tightly reaching here, I explain. There is no reason to respect Petur, and the person correctly spoke out that Bulgakov hated him, would not hate, but despised. .and this is described in the novel The White Guard
        1. Alexander Petrovich
          Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 16: 53
          +4
          Lenin and Stalin, revived the liberating country in 20 years (!!!), at the cost of many lives, but what did your Petlyura do, destroyed the country at the cost of many lives, do you feel the difference?
          1. ZuluS
            ZuluS 8 July 2012 23: 15
            -2
            You can’t destroy what was destroyed before you !!!! CAPRI EAT LAPTI NUI - having bought a DAC ... !!! Do you feel the riznitsyu ???
            1. Alexander Petrovich
              Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 00: 34
              0
              And in Russian?
              1. ZuluS
                ZuluS 9 July 2012 02: 49
                -2
                Why don’t you understand?
                1. Alexander Petrovich
                  Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 19: 47
                  0
                  Well, what's in the middle, it’s written in capital letters.
                  1. ZuluS
                    ZuluS 9 July 2012 20: 18
                    -1
                    What are you pretending to be? You perfectly understood everything !!! Or do you want to banish for yours?
                    1. Alexander Petrovich
                      Alexander Petrovich 10 July 2012 23: 02
                      0
                      Hmm, my? No, I’m not a banderlog, but seriously speaking, from all that you wrote. I understood only a few words. Here then, I would advise you to write more competently.
                      1. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 10 July 2012 23: 21
                        0
                        I wrote everything correctly, forget it in the search engine and look! If there is an error, indicate where!
                      2. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 11 July 2012 23: 52
                        0
                        Well, honestly, I just realized a few words, in Russian how?
                      3. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 12 July 2012 06: 24
                        0
                        As our Moldovans translated to me: there is a goat, no milk (literally)! And the witches came up with a rhyme: having bought a suck goat ... oh (bought a suck goat ...)! Something like the Russian expression "use is like milk from a goat!" It turned out to be a kind of pun with a Moldovan-Ukrainian flavor, appeared long ago, even during the union!
                      4. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 13 July 2012 00: 57
                        0
                        capre, capra is a goat, a goat is a dac, well, if you correct your spikes, it is spelled correctly - capre naturally lapte nui - capra este lapte nui.
          2. gor
            gor 9 July 2012 12: 59
            0
            Lenin, your beloved, whom you bow to, revolutionized German money with the goal of pulling Russia out of the First World War. Thus, Russia betrayed its allies. And if you take it logically, he’s just a spy of the German special services. That’s a traitor. By the way, many historians claim that he there was also non-traditional sex orientation. I found his love correspondence with comrade Zinoviev. Here and draw your own conclusions as a follower of who you are and who I can call you. By the way, do not believe historians read the female name NINEL on the contrary. Just do not try to read the soft sign, it is not readable)) )))))))))))))))
      3. Lech e-mine
        Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 53
        0
        Petliura is just one of many executioners who exterminated their own people.

        COURT IN FRANCE OVER HUMAN KILLED PETLURO
    2. Alexander Petrovich
      Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 14: 29
      +3
      "Patriot", an eternally boiling cauldron for him, and devils about 30.
    3. dark_65
      dark_65 7 July 2012 18: 19
      +2
      Of course .. you have the right to an opinion, but it is erroneous ....
    4. chistii20
      chistii20 7 July 2012 20: 02
      0
      Quote: raptorr

      Patriot. Everlasting memory

      Are you fucked like a moron he killed so many people
      1. Lech e-mine
        Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 42
        0
        here people bury those whom the Petliurists killed
      2. ZuluS
        ZuluS 8 July 2012 23: 29
        -2
        And who at that time, when in power, had their hands not in blood? Can you name? And the way I look, you’re a waving tongue. It's just that you have different countries, respectively, and patriots too !!! And no need to swear, it's not beautiful ...
    5. Insurgent
      Insurgent 7 July 2012 22: 21
      0
      pidriot you wanted to say
    6. Alex63
      Alex63 8 July 2012 03: 08
      +2
      raptorr,
      The Poles slaughtered you in whole villages, the Turks wanted to enslave you. Forgot HISTORY? Where did Russia start from? We are of the same blood - Slavic! Why are you such Russian-haters? My heart bleeds when I learn that Russians are vilified in Ukraine, the graves of Russian people are desecrated, the Russian language is banned, and various non-people like Bandera and Petliura are elevated to the rank of saints. You dance "hopaka" and "polka" in front of the west. How much is that good? Come back to us. It's easier together.
      1. Lech e-mine
        Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 29
        +1
        Petliura Poland. "I was so tormented with this Galicia ... Take it for nothing!"
      2. ZuluS
        ZuluS 8 July 2012 23: 51
        -1
        So you’ll either starve to death, or send to Siberia, or force international debt to be paid somewhere in the Caucasus or Central Asia. At the same time, you will teach to hate everyone around you, and you will love and thank you for everything in the world. But God forbid, you will have a power change, so we will choke with blood. It’s dangerous to be very close to you! Thank you, of course, but for starters, let's each in his own house put things in order. We won’t transfer the country to another place and no one bothers us on friendly terms, except for our ambitions, I don’t see any obstacles !!!
        You can safely spit in a lying face to someone who tells you that in Ukraine the Russian language is banned! It's time to start worrying so that Ukrainian does not disappear! And it's not a joke!
        And finally, this phrase: "Come back to us", what does it mean? How to understand it? I just want to ask: "What? Is it so hard without us?"
    7. Lech e-mine
      Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 24
      +1
      According to the sister of mercy, Maria Nesterovich, after the capture of Kiev by the Petliurites:

      A lot of officers who were cured in hospitals were killed, landfill sites were literally crammed with officer corpses .... On the second day after the Petlyura invasion, I was informed that the anatomical theater on Fundukleevskaya Street was littered with corpses, that 163 officers had been brought there at night. Lord what I saw! On tables in five halls, corpses were brutally, brutally, villainously, savagely tortured! Not a single shot or simply killed, all with traces of monstrous torture. There were puddles of blood on the floor, it was impossible to pass, and almost all the heads were chopped off, for many there was only a neck with a part of the chin, and some had stomach tears. These corpses were carried all night. I did not see such horror even among the Bolsheviks. I saw more, many more corpses, but there weren’t such trained ones! ... Some were still alive, the watchman reported, still wriggled here .... Our windows went outside. I constantly saw the arrested officers being led ...

      - Pleshko N. From the past provincial intellectual // Archive of the Russian Revolution, 1X, p. 218.
      1. ZuluS
        ZuluS 8 July 2012 22: 48
        -4
        163 corpses? Well, nothing, the Bolsheviks drove Petlyura, and so they showed how and how much it was necessary to kill, starve and torture! Petlyura is a harmless child in comparison with the Bolsheviks !!!! Lamb!
        1. Alexander Petrovich
          Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 00: 50
          0
          Well, here he was fucked up. as a child, so he fled to Poland.
    8. erkenegon
      erkenegon 9 July 2012 17: 23
      0
      I agree with you
  3. raptorr
    raptorr 7 July 2012 10: 44
    -22
    I read a lot about him (Normal-not soviet literature). Great person.
    1. smile
      smile 7 July 2012 13: 39
      +4
      raptorr
      It's like in a joke about Vovochka - Yesterday I read my dad's pager ... I thought a lot ..... Well, you unfortunate, are you having such heroes - prostitutes? Read better Chicken Ryaba!
      1. raptorr
        raptorr 7 July 2012 14: 59
        -12
        "Happy", Simon Petliura defended the people and land of Ukraine from the "northern" brothers. I hope I would have defended it from other "relatives" too.
        1. Alexander Petrovich
          Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 15: 18
          +4
          So defended that already in Poland meaning. A true hero will protect his land at the cost of his life, and as for Petlyura, he correctly said that he was a real monkey, and you, his followers, banderlogs, are now scampering with him.
          1. chistii20
            chistii20 7 July 2012 20: 12
            +3
            Quote: Alexander Petrovich

            So defended that already in Poland meaning. A true hero will protect his land at the cost of his life, and as for Petlyura, he correctly said that he was a real monkey, and you, his followers, banderlogs, are now scampering with him.

            Well done Alexander, the answer to this bran
          2. Lech e-mine
            Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 43
            +1
            another massacre organized by Petliurists
          3. ZuluS
            ZuluS 9 July 2012 00: 36
            -3
            But how do you, Romanians, know about heroes? You are already tired with insults! Nothing but negativity, your comments do not cause!
            1. Alexander Petrovich
              Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 00: 48
              0
              Well, you are banderlogs, negative in life, it’s for you, to flee to another country is heroic, and if you are tired, then, n .... blow your monkey back to the forum.
              1. ZuluS
                ZuluS 9 July 2012 03: 29
                -4
                What kind of passion do you have for monkeys, huh? Some kind of mania! Maybe you're a monkey? Romanian monkey! And what a piquant! I understand, therefore, the Roman brothers do not like you. All Romanians are like Romanian goat-security, and you are a monkey, you for that, well, I don’t know how you, Romanians, take it, in a word, they offend, and here you are watering everyone with mud to assert themselves! Well, guessed?
                1. Alexander Petrovich
                  Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 19: 45
                  -1
                  Yes, as for Romanians, I absolutely agree with you, they are like you at the plate, and they have the same ideas as you. Well, I guessed about it, almost, I dream of shooting at you, honestly, probably that is what attracts me)) As for self-affirmation - no, I just like you. cattle. omit, as you deserve it.
                  1. ZuluS
                    ZuluS 9 July 2012 20: 30
                    -2
                    How quickly did you disown the Romanian brothers !!! Well done, you will not die of hunger !!! You see how the truth told you so you immediately went to you !!! I know how it is with you Romanians. You, bl..dyam, you can’t give a descent !!!
                    "As for self-affirmation - no, I just like you. Cattle. To lower" - Come on, fill in here ... Whom you can omit, monkey goat herder laughing , with your Romanian mindset? Only yourself, what you regularly do in each of your comments !!!!
                    1. Alexander Petrovich
                      Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 20: 42
                      -1
                      I say monkey. He didn’t say anything good, on the contrary, he showed himself even dumber.
                      1. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 9 July 2012 22: 55
                        -2
                        Auuuuuuuuu !!! Romanians, where are you ????? Come out, I’m kicking you, you are illiterate hamlo !!!!
                      2. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 23: 25
                        0
                        Oh, but it seemed to me the opposite, well, I'm here. By the way, about illiteracy, why did you get the idea that I am illiterate, because an illiterate person cannot write.
                      3. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 10 July 2012 05: 57
                        -2
                        It only seemed to you! lol The fact that you are trying to put unfamiliar letters in the correct order does not mean that you know how to write! I pointed out to you some of your many spelling mistakes (you can’t explain it with a typo, you have too many of them), and you continued to repeat them, which indicates your poor reading and reading skills! And how can a person who writes and reads with difficulty (which is not surprising, the Romanian education has never been distinguished by high indices in education) judge the history and historical figures that he (you) learned about from a third-rate article with very controversial content? And when people who studied well at school, unlike you, having an idea of ​​what they are talking about, argue, you should listen carefully (in this case, read) and study, not be rude! One hundred percent with a dictionary of Russian-Romanian sitting near a computer? laughing
                      4. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 10 July 2012 19: 42
                        0
                        Well, as you see, writing is not bad at me. and by the way, I learned from you that knowledge of the difference between the three languages ​​is a sign of illiteracy, well, you have such concepts in monkeys, I will not argue. I look, you are trying, something like that to reason logically, it's a pity to disappoint you, but you are mistaken. However, I’ll still please you, monkeying is good at you, I’m even a little fun))
                      5. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 10 July 2012 22: 00
                        0
                        Yes, from me, here, you have learned more than in your whole life! The fact that you know three languages, and even in contrast, laughing I will never believe !!! Just look at your previous comments and everything will become clear, and about languages ​​and about difference! laughing It became cleaner to write, I noticed, but there are still mistakes !!! And I think, where did my Romanian go? And you, poor fellow, sat and tried to write without errors? So much want to impress me? Your desire to become better is commendable !!!! Well then, come on! Maybe you will become the first Romanian in history to become a cultured person !!!
                      6. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 10 July 2012 22: 59
                        0
                        Alas, I won't, since I'm not Romanian. I didn't try to make any impression on you, but I realized that monkeying like you was not worth it, and decided to talk differently. That is, to show who is who, if you try, "poke" my forehead. in my mistakes, then you sir, you are doing this in vain, I made them quite by accident, because of my inattention. By the way, you are trying to make me Romanian, but you should know that you consider me Romanian as well as I do you as a monkey, in fact, there is no difference, so I gave you the arguments that Moldovans are not Romanians, and that they are an older people. Based on your words, I realized that somewhere you read something about the fact that Moldovans are Romanians and did not even ask about their difference. And this, by the way, is very bad, I do not like Romanians as well as you, and this is the only thing we have in common with you at the moment, and you and us, they create a territorial threat.
                      7. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 10 July 2012 23: 10
                        0
                        I live in Bessarabia! Do you need to explain anything else about my knowledge of Romanians and Moldavians? Have you seen a lot in our region Bendera? Surely been in our area, I must know! I have a lot of Moldovan comrades and one friend! I became rude to you deliberately, on purpose! And notice what worked, now we are communicating culturally with you! Only three days have passed, but I don’t recognize you!
                      8. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 11 July 2012 00: 19
                        +1
                        And I'm in Chisinau, of course. sorry for my rude remarks. at that time. I didn’t speak seriously, in general, I just don’t like Russophobes, I got it here in Chisinau, but I myself take part in this policy. Wait. in general, Bessarabia is the name of the current Moldova, the Romanians call it that, well, many Ukrainians, maybe Bessarabia?
                      9. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 11 July 2012 05: 58
                        +1
                        I admit, I counted on the fact that this will end !!! I am glad that you were not mistaken in you, that you are not Romanian (take it as a joke, for the last time!) And you excuse me if you were too rude to you, you see, everything is in favor, we will be stronger friends !!!! I myself do not like people who judge by individual persons about the whole nation and hang some labels, because I am convinced that there are no bad nations, there are rude people who dishonor it with their behavior! In my comments I do not condemn the Russians, but the Bolsheviks and those who destroyed millions of innocent people, as well as the Nazis and their minions! I love Ukraine and consider myself a patriot, but under no circumstances can I justify cruelty towards civilians !!! I try to be unbiased in my opinions on this matter and rely solely on facts! The theme of the Second World War and the struggle for the independence of the republics is very slippery, saturated with blood and crimes on each side !!! Therefore, we must try to hide emotions, and give preference to facts, well, I have already begun to repeat myself!
                        Regarding Bessarabia, this is the name of the territory between the Dniester, on the one hand, and the Prut, and the Danube, on the other! Even under the Tsar there was the Bessarabian province. Now in the territory of Bessarabia is located Moldova and the southern part of Odessa region, where I was born and live !!! I am familiar with Moldavians from birth, as with all nations living with us, I always characterize you as true friends, honest and kind people, hospitable hosts and hardworking workers! I speak as it is !!! I wish you success in your studies !!! I will be glad to talk with you again on the expanses of this site. Good luck
        2. smile
          smile 7 July 2012 15: 47
          +2
          raptorr
          Yeah, and he defended his people exclusively by destroying them, and trying to put them under any conqueror, if only to bargain for a warm place under his ass! Once again I want to remind you that the Poles worked with you on those lands. that they were able to chop off at 20m from Russia. Like? Well, put a yoke on your neck, flog your back periodically, forbid speaking Ukrainian, stop attending the Orthodox church, don’t attend and don’t attend children’s national school and universities ... yeah, still burn a couple of your relatives in the barn - and then you will receive what Petliura wanted to receive for your people, calling on the Poles to your land! Yes?
          1. ZuluS
            ZuluS 9 July 2012 00: 41
            -4
            And what do you know about the Poles? Apparently no! The same as with the komunyaks, until the 60s the Soviet army could not do anything! You’re carrying some kind of foolhardy!
        3. chistii20
          chistii20 7 July 2012 20: 10
          +4
          Quote: raptorr

          "Happy", Simon Petliura defended the people and land of Ukraine from the "northern" brothers. I hope I would have defended it from other "relatives" too.

          I can’t understand one thing. Are you a normal person?
    2. Alexander Petrovich
      Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 14: 31
      +4
      You know, in general, a banderlog is not a man, but a primate. So Petliura is truly a great primate.
      1. raptorr
        raptorr 7 July 2012 15: 03
        -11
        He’s a scoop. He’s a scoop. Especially if he is fertilized by the imperial megalomania and the spirit of revenge for the collapse of the scoop.
        1. Alexander Petrovich
          Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 15: 15
          +2
          Well, you are monkeys, and you will jump over the trees and yell about your heroes, until someone shoots you from our thread.
          1. smile
            smile 7 July 2012 15: 50
            0
            Alexander Petrovich (1)
            For every bandarlog, Kaa will come sooner or later! Where is it seen that the monkeys in the jungle die with their death? :))))) This tailed, who has reproached himself as a hooter, senses it with his ass - that’s why he freaks out!
            1. Alexander Petrovich
              Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 16: 20
              +2
              He wonders if his contract was not included, so he ran to the owners for moral damage to ask for money.
              1. chistii20
                chistii20 7 July 2012 20: 16
                +1
                Quote: Alexander Petrovich

                He wonders if his contract was not included, so he ran to the owners for moral damage to ask for money.

                Guys, I understood everything. This is a raptorr provocateur (
                1. Alexander Petrovich
                  Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 20: 25
                  0
                  Well, what did you think? People like him here have not been taken seriously for a long time.
            2. Kaa
              Kaa 7 July 2012 21: 48
              +2
              smile
              Already come, but .... we do not eat carrion
          2. ZuluS
            ZuluS 9 July 2012 00: 32
            -4
            Do you want to talk about primates? Civilized resident of Moldova! Or Romania? Who are you now? Proud Romanian? Judging by your comments, you yourself rarely go down from trees! Moldavian bull!
            1. Alexander Petrovich
              Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 00: 36
              0
              Are emotions boiling, monkey? Did you find any other arguments? Or cling to nationality, like the last h-mo, is that all you can?
              1. ZuluS
                ZuluS 9 July 2012 02: 56
                -3
                "Well, you are monkeys, and you will jump up and down the trees and yell about your heroes until one of ours will shoot you." Didn't you write that? I am Ukrainian! And for me this is an insult !!! And as for the nationality, for such devils as you, this is not the main thing, the truth is, damn Romanians, this is a diagnosis !!!
                1. Alexander Petrovich
                  Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 19: 41
                  -1
                  Hah, Romanian? No wonder I called you a monkey. since you do not distinguish Romanian from Moldavian, and by the way, I am half Russian, mixed with Ukrainian and Cossack blood, and you, not Ukrainian, are banderlog, because Ukrainians are different, they distinguish killers from liberators. And I ask, before you diagnose me, first go to a psychiatrist yourself, otherwise many of you here simply do not understand
                  1. ZuluS
                    ZuluS 9 July 2012 21: 25
                    -1
                    You do not understand me, because you did not study well at school! And the changes are really on the face !!! On "YOU" began to address! Can I teach you to respect others? And then they tried to water each other in Romania and to poke each other in the city ... And I don't need your pedigree, my dog ​​is richer! One hell, you are all Romanians - pi .. duny !!! And here you explain to me how a Moldovan (correctly - a Moldavian, for the future) is half Russian with "ADMINISTRATION" (I say, Romanian wassat ) Ukrainian and "Cossack blood" (he invented it himself?) Could it be such a boor? Maybe you haven't noticed, but here people, even of opposite views, are trying (ATTENTION !!! key word) to CULTURALLY express their opinion and argue! Learn to respect the opinions of other people, young man (I'm sure of that), it will come in handy in life.
                    1. Alexander Petrovich
                      Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 21: 45
                      -1
                      I went to you in order to show which of us is cultural and civilized. The result is obvious)) Your opinion, not only that it is impossible to respect, but to listen to it, and what kind of people you are talking about. when you, I will not tire of repeating this - a real monkey, and this is a fact, and almost everyone. here, it will confirm. As for himself, he came up with - in fact, no, you come up with stories about Petlyura, but I say what I really have. And I ask. dare not talk about culture. since, you are not an example of culture, rather the opposite. No offense, I said everything as it is. And about nationality. I’ll explain to you a fool - my dad is Moldovan, half Ukrainian, and my mother half Russian Cossack, and now, look at your dog. with his rich pedigree, and look in the mirror, and you will understand that between you, the only difference is that you are a monkey. and he / she is a dog, and so, both are animals.
                      1. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 9 July 2012 22: 12
                        -1
                        laughing Well, that you are Romanian, I have no doubt, now you have confirmed that you were poorly taught in the Romanian school!
                        And as for nationality, I’ll explain to you now, fool. Your dad is not Moldovan, but Moldovan, if you were Moldovan, and not Romanian, you would know that !!! And such a nationality as a Cossack does not exist at all !!!! Because your mother is Russian and that's it !!! And I have no offense at you and cannot be !!! Because even Romanians are not offended by doctors! That is how this saying originally sounded !!! laughing
                        At least now, after our communication, you won’t be rude to people like that, I’m sure, because your weak and poor Romanian education doesn’t allow you to have a full-fledged dialogue without disgracing yourself! You also learned a little about nationalities, including yours! And the spelling rules! See how much good! good
                      2. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 23: 02
                        0
                        Hmm, even you monkeys are all sure when you say something, but you don’t realize that, in fact, you are talking nonsense. As for the nationalities - you are an idiot sir, because the Moldavian nation arose earlier than the Romanian as well as the language, I understand that you are trying to get me crazy, however, it will work out for you, the Romanian nation, and the country, officially arose, in the middle of the 19th century, while Moldova itself has existed since the 14th century. and the Moldavian language, first mentioned in the 17th century, I say, you are a monkey, and do not argue with me. And about being rude, but I was not rude, I said what you deserve. As for the Cossack nationality, you tell the Cossacks that they don’t have it, they’ll rather beat you for it))
                      3. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 10 July 2012 07: 05
                        -2
                        It's time to hit you, for how you write !!! I’m not interested in your weak knowledge in the history of Moldova (if it weren’t for our argument, you wouldn’t have known this, I had to read it, probably?) laughing , where are you (Romanian) and Moldova? I don’t see anything in common! And I do not advise you to conduct any parallels! You Romanians, a dead end branch of human development, goat security !!! Only under this and sharpened !!! And forever smeared with Moldova and mow under Moldovan !!!
                        "you are trying to piss me off, however, you can hardly do it ..." laughing No, you guessed wrong! I conduct this dialogue with you, only because it amuses me. Each of your comments is a couple of minutes of laughter from me and those who read you here! You give out pearls here, the other will try, it will not work !!! And laughter, as you know, (although how do you, Romanian, know this) prolongs life! And I, in turn, involuntarily teach you to read, write and learn new things correctly! You see, one positive !!! good
                        Now about the "Cossack nationality"! There is nothing to discuss here, but still ...! It is not surprising that you, Romanians, consider the Cossacks a nationality !!! Your grayness and wretchedness, Romanian, has long been known to everyone !!! Here you will have to read a little again! What is there to do? No other way!!! request
                        Waiting for your further pearls !!! wink
                      4. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 10 July 2012 19: 53
                        +1
                        Well, everyone deserves one whip for their actions, but you deserve two, the first for your actions, the second for your views.
                        ! I’m not interested in your weak knowledge in the history of Moldova (if it weren’t for our argument, you wouldn’t have known this, I had to read it, probably?) - No, he taught at school. About Moldova, I know enough, though. it’s impossible to know everything, but nevertheless, sometimes you have to look on the Internet to clarify some things, but believe me. just not in your case.
                        No, you guessed wrong! I conduct this dialogue with you, only because it amuses me. Each of your comments is a couple of minutes of laughter from me and those who read you here! You give out pearls here, the other will try, it won’t work out !! - Well look. so that your laugh does not turn into hysterical, by the way, about pearls, I look, you try and you can do it.)
                        Your grayness and wretchedness - and you look, you look much like Romanians, the same one))
                      5. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 10 July 2012 22: 20
                        0
                        You tell me everything about my actions and views, what exactly do you mean? Now let's move smoothly, from spelling, to the correct presentation of your thoughts! That is, now you do not just write all the words that you know, but try to choose them in meaning, so that they have a semantic load! If you succeed! But I get the impression that another person is talking to me now, I don’t recognize the Romanian who was rude to everyone here ... request
                      6. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 10 July 2012 22: 50
                        +1
                        I mean, your views on history, especially regarding the personality of Petliura. You build him up as a hero, but you try to keep silent about his crimes against the Ukrainian people. arguing that it is that supposedly. everyone then had blood on their elbows. sorry. you hate the Bolsheviks. but then forgive me if the Bolsheviks are so bad, why is your Petliura better? The fact that he was Ukrainian. and fought, ostensibly for the "freedom" of Ukraine? You have the right impression. however, communicates with you. still the same narrow-minded person as you thought. I'm not a fool and I understand everything perfectly, however, Bandera and all sorts of Russophobes, I am ready to curse up to the seventh generation.
                      7. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 10 July 2012 23: 00
                        0
                        Show me where I wrote that I consider Petlyura a hero?
                      8. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 11 July 2012 00: 20
                        +1
                        I sincerely apologize for all my words, I take them back since they are mine.
        2. chistii20
          chistii20 7 July 2012 20: 14
          0
          Quote: raptorr

          He’s a scoop. He’s a scoop. Especially if he is fertilized by the imperial megalomania and the spirit of revenge for the collapse of the scoop.

          I can’t understand one myself
      2. Lech e-mine
        Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 45
        +1
        the great Fuhrer PETLUR.
    3. chistii20
      chistii20 7 July 2012 20: 08
      0
      Quote: raptorr

      I read a lot about him (Normal-not soviet literature). Great person.

      I listened to you In Ukraine, all the heroes And blaiter pyatyura I apologize for the distorted words, but these people are not worthy that their names would be written even with a capital letter
    4. Akuzenka
      Akuzenka 8 July 2012 16: 24
      0
      With such an outlook, study the history of Hollywood, and so according to Hollywood (films shot in Soviet times), in Ukraine there are killers, rapists, Jewish commissars (neither Jews) and other trash. So there is nothing surprising in praising murderers, rapists and fascists in your comments - no.
  4. itr
    itr 7 July 2012 11: 02
    +3
    For YOU, yes, for Russians, no! laughing
  5. Brother Sarych
    Brother Sarych 7 July 2012 11: 36
    +3
    An article about something! In my opinion (more precisely from memory), everything was somehow not quite right, if not to say that it was not at all - the author either misses or even ignores some moments of history ...
    For me, the character is purely negative, an adventurer thrown out by the course of history onto the crest of a not-so-fragrant wave ...
    But in general, you can have such a point of view ...
    1. George IV
      George IV 7 July 2012 12: 29
      -6
      Nichrome your memory !!!
      How old are you, grandfather?
      1. itr
        itr 7 July 2012 12: 56
        +7
        Don’t rush about George, your memory is much less than in 20 years, everyone completely forgot and invented all kinds of horseradish
        1. George IV
          George IV 8 July 2012 00: 27
          0
          You apparently mistook me for someone else, comrade.
          But I forgive you.
      2. Brother Sarych
        Brother Sarych 7 July 2012 13: 03
        +2
        I wrote that I was an eyewitness? I just read a lot about it and quite a while ago ...
        1. George IV
          George IV 8 July 2012 00: 26
          +2
          Well, everyone read :)
          I remember, at the institute in my first year, it was the year 2000, I did an essay on history on the subject of Petlyura.

          Then he quarreled with the teacher for a long time, because he was such an ardent nationalist (back in 2004 he then called for Yushchenko to vote), and I made conclusions about Petlyura’s person not very comforting.
          Thank God, then another story began to lead in our country, otherwise I feel that I didn’t get a credit. As we grappled with him for half a couple when he began to push about how bad it was that Russia had returned the old anthem.
  6. sichevik
    sichevik 7 July 2012 13: 16
    +5
    He is neither a patriot nor a great man. Adventurer and opportunist. Having no real power, he wanted to rule Ukraine. Hence all the throwing in search of a strong patron (master). If only on whose bayonets, but to enter Kiev the winner. In short - both ours, and yours, and any dance to the tune.
    And the Entente, and Germany, and Poland, and Denikin, and Wrangel. Even to Nestor Ivanovich Makhno sent messengers ... In a word - a prostitute.
    Makhno was always on his own. I did not seek an alliance with anyone and did not seek anyone for my strong patrons and owners. He was betrayed, but he did not betray anyone.
    1. itr
      itr 7 July 2012 13: 31
      -2
      Mr. Makhno behaved as usual. Hahol that's all laughing
      1. sichevik
        sichevik 7 July 2012 13: 59
        +6
        ITRU You, dear, if you do not know, then it’s better not to write. Spoil the opinion of yourself.
        Firstly, not a hahol, but a crest. All the Cossacks shaved their heads, leaving only a long forelock (in Ukrainian - oseladets, in Russian - crest). Prince Svyatoslav Khorobry also wore such a forelock. That's because of this the name went - crest. I am also a crest and proud of it. Just by the will of fate I ended up in Russia and live in it. And I consider both Ukraine and Russia as my Homeland. For I was born and raised in the USSR. And my homeland is the USSR.
        Nestor Ivanovich Makhno spent all of his "universities" in the Butyrka prison under the leadership of the famous anarchist (former Bolshevik P. Arshinov). According to the recollections of eyewitnesses, Makhno spoke Russian.
        I would like to know in more detail from you, but how do you think the usual huhls and Nestor Makhno, including?
        By the way, in the internet there is a lot of information about Nestor Ivanovich Makhno and it differs significantly from that which official communist propaganda presented to us about him. Google if you wish. You will learn a lot of interesting things about N.I. Makhno. And, take my word for it, your opinion about this person will change for the better.
        1. Shohmansur
          Shohmansur 7 July 2012 14: 18
          -2
          Everyone is trying to shut up, but on the bayonets of the army of Makhno the Communists entered the Crimea, was awarded Makhno and the Order of the Young Republic. Noble was a man.
          1. sichevik
            sichevik 7 July 2012 14: 43
            0
            The Communists awarded Makhno an order and immediately deprived him of this order. And then on Sivash treacherously and mowed down the Makhnovsky cavalry. So that Makhno did not betray anyone.
        2. itr
          itr 7 July 2012 14: 59
          -1
          1. crest I write through because this word on the site is considered filthy and forbidden. Probably because we have a tolerant society on the site
          2. And why the hell should I respect the person who ruined the Russian state * I am a citizen of Russia and heroes trident for me traitors
          3. And the fact that this Mr. Urka does not mean his decency. In difficult periods of life, only tough and oppressive leaders rule the crowd. So your swallow millet killer, thief, I guess you now understand my sincere hostility to this hero. With judging by the flag you should share my opinion
          1. sichevik
            sichevik 7 July 2012 15: 48
            +2
            And how do you feel about Stalin? After all, he also began his revolutionary activities with the robbery of postal stagecoaches on the Georgian military road. And he ruled the country or the crowd, as you put it in difficult times too. And Peter the Great. It is no secret to anyone that one of the most beautiful cities in the world, St. Petersburg, stands on the bones of hundreds of thousands of unknown ordinary Russian men.
            And the Russian state did not ruin Makhno in his Gulyai-Pole. Which, by the way, never had a trident. Again, if you do not know, it is better not to write. And the Russian Empire was destroyed by its own homegrown liberals-integppigents who wanted freedom and democracy. And Tsar Nicholas turned out to be a wimp and a h-sh-ohshnik. And not Makhno, but Kerensky headed the interim government. And not Makhno, but Ulyanov organized the October coup with German money. And not Makhno, but Ulyanov and Bronstein allowed separation from Russia of Poland and Finland. But Makhno simply wanted to distribute the land to the peasants so that they lived on it and cultivated it and could feed their families.
            And the last thing about the lessons. But in today's Russia, and in Ukraine, too, the oligarchic clans that rule, have they earned their multi-billion dollar fortunes honestly?
          2. ZuluS
            ZuluS 8 July 2012 23: 09
            0
            The trident is a small coat of arms of Ukraine and the fact that you are a citizen of Russia does not give you the right to speak in such a tone. And about the collapse of Russia, so Makhno and Petliura is a consequence, the cause should be sought in Russia itself. And the process of collapse, suspended by the Union, continues to this day. And in this case you have no one to blame, except for yourself! The devastation begins in the minds, as Professor Preobrazhensky used to say! And he was right!
    2. raptorr
      raptorr 7 July 2012 15: 07
      -5
      He fought with the main enemy of Ukraine at that time - with Bolshevik Russia. Like a politician hiccuping alliances, so do all politicians. And Makhno was an anarchist, and that’s it.
      1. biglow
        biglow 7 July 2012 19: 24
        +5
        raptorr there is such a profession to see their homeland. That's all the seropagonists are doing it, the question is why. Why and why to sit on the Russian patriotic site and write all sorts of nasty things. The point of view of opponents cannot be changed like that, or you are all fed up with negative emotions and with all their strength you are trying to squeeze out of people.
        1. Akuzenka
          Akuzenka 8 July 2012 16: 29
          0
          Most likely they pay him for it. A sane person, having studied the available materials, has his own point of view, most often it coincides with the opinion of thinking people. And here are just propaganda cliches.
      2. chistii20
        chistii20 7 July 2012 20: 18
        0
        raptorr,
        No, you're really a sick person
    3. CARBON
      CARBON 7 July 2012 22: 16
      +3
      sichevikAdventurer and opportunist. Having no real power, he wanted to rule Ukraine. Hence all the throwing in search of a strong patron (master). If only on whose bayonets, but to enter Kiev the winner. In short - both ours, and yours, and any dance to the tune.
      Therefore, our ghoul, in 2005, and wanted to perpetuate it - a kindred spirit!
  7. shurikchaevnik
    shurikchaevnik 7 July 2012 16: 43
    +2
    raptorr - well, you and a stupid person feel sorry for you ... Tell me a pimp, and Hitler is a very good politician to you too? In general, take a history book and read the gas, maybe you’re smarter ... I hope to follow my advice - good luck malacholny.
  8. Alx1miK
    Alx1miK 7 July 2012 16: 58
    +1
    Quote: shurikchaevnik
    and Hitler is you a great politician too?


    Hitler was essentially a strong politician, and very much so. Until September 39, he turned on a member of the Western Powers. So the comparison is unsuccessful.
  9. shurikchaevnik
    shurikchaevnik 7 July 2012 17: 27
    +1
    Alx1miK, you didn’t quite understand exactly - I didn’t mean his quality as a politician, but I meant his plans for the Slavic population - extermination.
  10. suharev-52
    suharev-52 7 July 2012 18: 22
    +2
    Instead of analyzing the article, they again lit up on the forum ..... I would like to remind everyone that the whole story from the beginning of the 20th century was rewritten by the winners, i.e. Jewish Bolsheviks. So, I advise you not to completely trust everything written. And the fact that Petlyura was killed in revenge clearly says the name of the killer. And the hero himself, of course, is a contradictory figure. But there was such a time, and everyone tried to uphold what he believed in. Sincerely.
    1. sichevik
      sichevik 7 July 2012 18: 41
      -2
      Sukharev-52. Totally agree with you. Especially about srach on the forum. Honestly, Svidomo self-styled already got, and some of our compatriots-great-power Sordimord. For them, they can fight on the forum, insult the opponent, and throw mud on the brotherly people like a drug. They cannot live without it. I hate all shareware and kvass patriots. And from those and from others, only one harm.
      1. ZuluS
        ZuluS 8 July 2012 22: 56
        -2
        Nice to meet adequate people here! My hello to you !!!! drinks
        1. Alexander Petrovich
          Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 00: 54
          0
          Well, about your adequacy. To be honest, you can argue.
          1. ZuluS
            ZuluS 9 July 2012 03: 10
            0
            Yes, goat goats or cook mamalygu! Do you know how to argue? Read your comments with some baseless insults. If people make any arguments, then you either blaspheme all the shit or sing along .. you don’t have any reasoned information. Some slop!
            1. Alexander Petrovich
              Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 19: 33
              -1
              Something on your part. I have not seen any arguments. And about Homna, but you do not deserve another.
              1. ZuluS
                ZuluS 9 July 2012 21: 40
                -1
                You can't even write the word "shit" correctly, although you yourself are!
                1. Alexander Petrovich
                  Alexander Petrovich 10 July 2012 20: 00
                  0
                  Alas, in these words, I do not have such high knowledge as yours, here I am "illiterate" as you said. Your education is higher than ours, you probably memorized them, you see you now use them every day, monkeys in one word, culture is alien to you. You just have to jump and shout about the monkey Petliura and about all sorts of Banderlog, who are already burning with a blue flame in hell.
                  1. ZuluS
                    ZuluS 10 July 2012 22: 29
                    0
                    A person's education is, first of all, evidenced by his ability to express his thoughts correctly and beautifully, which so far you have not succeeded !!! Apart from "such" words, you have distorted others so much that you are simply kabzdets! And you remember, for some reason, that is! laughing
                    1. Alexander Petrovich
                      Alexander Petrovich 10 July 2012 22: 42
                      +1
                      So learn to state it, otherwise nobody understands you, therefore your profile is blurred.
                      1. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 10 July 2012 22: 56
                        +1
                        What is "her"? laughing Are you doing this on purpose? laughing
                        Oh, a minute of laughter, you're the best !!! The profile is minus because I don’t say what others want to hear from me, if I don’t think so !!! I advise you to learn to do as well! In life, this causes more problems than benefits, but tempers character! And everyone understands me perfectly! Most are just a word away! wink
                      2. Alexander Petrovich
                        Alexander Petrovich 11 July 2012 00: 29
                        +1
                        Well, in fact, although I am Moldovan (in), I’m Russian at heart, at least I see patriotic people here. in our time. their minority, unfortunately. I’m a young guy, by the way I’m 21 years old, and looking at people who do not care about their own country, it somehow pains and pity this land. Yes, and parents are very sorry. Again, sorry for my bad manners, just me before. at least I tried to have an honest dialogue, without insults, but unfortunately I heard a lot of mats in response
                      3. ZuluS
                        ZuluS 11 July 2012 06: 15
                        0
                        And you in response, next time, write to me lately! Accurate facts, correctly presented arguments and the most important calm and emphasized respect are the key to success in any dispute! And if you want to cool the boor, then do it restrained and witty !!! bully
    2. Lech e-mine
      Lech e-mine 8 July 2012 19: 49
      0
      And here is the killer PETLURA.
  11. loc.bejenari
    loc.bejenari 7 July 2012 18: 42
    -1
    and by the way, besides the fact that Bandera is also a Petliurist wink
    but seriously, my grandfather at 19 mobilized in Fastov in the Petlyura army
    I still have a photograph - where he is in a military overcoat - by the way, the usual RIA army without insignia
    HAVE BEEN DISCUSSED THERE 2 MONTHS AND WITHOUT TAKING PART IN ANY ONE BATTLE GRANDFALLY SINKED OUT HOME
    On this all his heroic Petliura activity ended wink
    it’s true that in the 30s he was reminded of this (what was his fault if he was forcibly mobilized at the age of 18) -fired from work (he was a train driver) and he could not get anywhere
    1. Alexander Petrovich
      Alexander Petrovich 7 July 2012 18: 54
      0
      Well, it’s clear that all went to grandfather. In words, it’s straight Petliur’s, but in fact, again - monkeys.
      1. ZuluS
        ZuluS 8 July 2012 22: 52
        -3
        Listen, Petrovich, you choose expressions!
        1. Alexander Petrovich
          Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 00: 38
          0
          But the fact that? Fart again?
          1. ZuluS
            ZuluS 9 July 2012 03: 15
            -1
            Does that turn you on? Well this is not for me! I know that the Romanian goats, a peculiar sense of humor, do not disgrace! Nobody here will understand your jokes!
            1. Alexander Petrovich
              Alexander Petrovich 9 July 2012 19: 36
              0
              Jokes? I’m not joking about shame at all, only you are embarrassed when running with portraits and stories about your monkeys.
              1. ZuluS
                ZuluS 9 July 2012 21: 36
                0
                Are you kidding You don’t know how! What do you know about shame? It is shameful to be born Moldovan, and to be Romanian in essence, this is a shame! And as for the monkeys, if you happen to get to the zoo, well, everything in life happens, well, all of a sudden ... be sure to go to the aviary with monkeys, it’s useful to the Romanians, you will learn a lot, climb up the evolutionary ladder, so to speak, if at all you understand what I'm telling you !!!
                1. Alexander Petrovich
                  Alexander Petrovich 10 July 2012 20: 02
                  +1
                  It’s better to be a Moldavian than a dumb monkey like you))) Why in the aviary? Visit you or what? Sorry, you didn’t deserve a banana))
                  1. ZuluS
                    ZuluS 10 July 2012 22: 40
                    +1
                    Yes! I already wrote to you, not Moldavians, but Moldovans! And will you tell me that you know languages, unlike ??? laughing Three times, even reading by syllables, it was possible to read correctly !!! Being Moldovan is better than a Romanian, I told you about this from the very beginning, but you are Romanian so far! What can you do here? request Honestly, what class are you in?
                    1. Alexander Petrovich
                      Alexander Petrovich 11 July 2012 00: 30
                      +1
                      I don’t know here, they say so, and indeed. I thought it could be this way and that)) I'm the third year at university.
    2. laurbalaur
      laurbalaur 8 July 2012 11: 14
      +1
      I settled on the grandmother and got a folder!
  12. Aeneas
    Aeneas 8 July 2012 11: 46
    0
    Petlyura succeeded in something, and much more. It is possible to evaluate the scale of the Ukrainian movement (Central Rada, Getmanat, Deriktoria) for a long time, and argue as well. But, in my opinion, the evidence of an eyewitness to the events, a great writer, and at the same time to a certain degree Ukrainophobe (enemy or misunderstanding of the Ukrainian movement) Mikhail Afanasevich Bulgakov is really very valuable. It shows the mass character, almost the element of the Ukrainian movement, and the personality of Petlyura, as with who this movement is associated with: “... And in these same towns, there are public teachers, paramedics, odnodvortsi, Ukrainian seminarians who, by the will of fate, became ensigns, hefty sons of beekeepers, headquarters captains with Ukrainian surnames ... everyone speaks the Ukrainian language, everyone loves Ukraine magical, imaginary, without lords, without officers — and thousands of former Ukrainian prisoners who returned from Galicia.
    This is in the appendage to tens of thousands of peasants? .. Oh-hoo! (...) Turk, Zemgusar, Simon. (Bulgakov about Petlyura) Yes, he was not. Did not have. So, nonsense, legend, a mirage. It’s just a word in which unquenchable fury and thirst for peasant revenge and the aspirations of those faithful sons of their sunflower, hot Ukraine ... who hate Moscow, whether it be Bolshevik, tsarist or whatever, merged. ” This is the gang of kazaly ... Here you have the gang. Hooray!

    - Glory! Glory to Petlyuri! Glory to our father!

    - Hurray! ..

    Other:

    - Eh ... eh ... there you are fifteen thousand ... What a lie to us. Fifteen ... thug ... corruption ... Lord, you will not consider! Another battery ... more, more ...
    1. The cat
      The cat 8 July 2012 11: 53
      +3
      It is better to read about the Ukrainian movement for independence at the beginning of the XNUMXth century not by Bulgakov, but by Gorlis-Gorsky "Kholodny Yar".
      1. Aeneas
        Aeneas 8 July 2012 17: 24
        -1
        And I'm interested in the point of view of the opponent of Ukraine. Even if the Ukrainian skeptic Bulgakov gives such estimates, then this movement was not an operetta, but a reality.
  13. Vrainbow
    Vrainbow 27 July 2012 16: 06
    0
    read the article, then the statement by ZuluS.
    It became a shame. Anyone who allows himself to kill civilians in order to liberate the country does not cause positive emotions and ratings.
    And we don’t need to tell us that we are hiding behind a country that has long existed! This is our story! And I love Ukraine!