The Ugly Duckling Il-Xnumxv

100
Since the first test flight of the IL-112, a certain amount of time has passed, which allowed both to look at what others are saying and talk to those who are directly related to flight. That is, with VASO employees.

But, first, I would like to ask an obvious such question to everyone who rushed to criticize the plane. And, actually, what did you expect?



The Ugly Duckling Il-Xnumxv


Let's go in order. So, we are leaving on a certain time machine on 20 years ago, at the very beginning of the two thousandth, when the first work on the aircraft on paper began.

The path itself IL-112V was very difficult, however, something like that, out of the ordinary, in this storiesPerhaps, there was no, except for the intermediate final.

So, let's go.

2001 year. Beginning of R & D on the project IL-112В.

2004 year. The IL-112V aircraft project won the tender for the development of a light military transport aircraft conducted by the Russian Ministry of Defense.

2005 year. The media get the numbers from the Air Force, who say that the first IL-112 will rise into the air already in 2006, the installation batch will be released in 2007, and then, according to the LG, the Air Force will receive 2015 airplanes per year . As usual, hooray and all that.

2006 year. Funding is declining, the timing of R & D is constantly being transferred.

2009 year. VASO reports that in the year 2010 the first flight copy of the IL-112B will be ready.

2010 year. The Defense Ministry completely stops financing and offers the Ilyushin Design Bureau to independently raise money (almost a billion rubles) for the final assembly of prototypes.

2011 year. The Ministry of Defense officially refuses IL-112В in favor of An-140.

2013 year. At the end of December, the Main Committee of the Russian Air Force presented to the Minister of Defense S. Shoigu a justification for the resumption of the IL-112В project. Works have been resumed.

year 2014. OJSC "Aviation complex to them. S. V. Ilyushin "reports about the conclusion of a contract with the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation for the development of the military transport aircraft Il-112V.

2016 year. Aviastar-SP JSC proceeds with the preparation of the production and manufacture of the first parts for the prototype.

2017 year. At VASO began assembling the first instance of the aircraft.

2018 year. November 27 The 2018 of the year at VASO underwent the procedure of transmitting the first IL-112В flight model to the flight test station.

2019 year. 30 March 2019, the first flight of the IL-112V.

What can I say? In fact, 15 years spent on the construction and the first flight of the flight sample. Well, to be honest, we knew more long-term projects. But what happened next?



And then a wave of criticism began. And often not something that was unreasonable, but simply some cries of people who didn’t fit the VASO gun and didn’t even know how this plane was born. What throes of creativity.

And really, you can't call it otherwise. Today the concept of a labor feat somehow does not exist, I agree. However, the fact that in Voronezh there were people whose hands the plane was assembled and flew, is a feat by now. If only because for ten years, VASO was simply kicked from department to department, the salary of those who remained in the field was at the level of a cleaner in a minimarket, and there were no prospects at all.

Meanwhile, the Ministry of Defense aircraft fleet slowly and steadily became disheartened. Moreover, since 2015, everything has gone by leaps and bounds. Yes, exactly when they quarreled with Ukraine and to serve all these ancient An-24, An-26, which were already dilapidated, there was no one and nothing. The production base of spare parts was closed for us.

The situation was completely unpleasant, the situation had to be changed.

Then the leaders of the Ministry of Defense did a stupid thing. When it came right up to the president, he was happily reported that it was okay, everything was under control. The OKB (now Aviation Complex) named after S. V. Ilyushin is working on a domestic aircraft on 100%. And this plane will fly into the sky in the summer of 2017.

Alas, it quickly became clear that rainbow reports are one thing, but the reality is often completely different. For throughout the entire 2017 of the year IL-112B, if it was something of itself, then it’s rather a set for construction, and a fairly incomplete one.

Plus, as the assembly began to turn out unpleasant things. For example, the initial overload of the aircraft is almost three tons. This, by the way, became known in the same 2017.

In parallel, problems with alignment were revealed. Moreover, both problems existed initially, that is, they were the fruits of design flaws. Nikolai Talikov, chief designer of the AK named after Ilyushin, explained such an unpleasant result by the fact that the new generation of designers turned out to be “weak”.

Is amazing? Not. Naturally. In terms of the training of designers, it’s more than sad in the country; it’s not a secret to anyone. Why potential aircraft designers don’t want to beg, I don’t know, but they don’t. And they go anywhere, but not to the design departments of aircraft companies, alas.

Did Alexey Rogozin, Director General of the AK Ilyushin AK know about this? They say that he knew. It was from 2017 that he knew, but he continued to make confident and encouraging reports. By myself. For which he was punished by the deprivation of all posts and posts. Right? Full

A rare case in the country, usually our officials can easily shoot down an airplane or drown a ship. But then the opposite happened; IL-112B shot down Rogozin. Completely Well, and God bless him, the main thing is that a knowledgeable and understanding specialist, and not an “effective” manager, will come to the place of the AK named after S. Ilyushin.

In general, aviation specialists, to whom it was possible to reach out, unanimously say one thing: IL-112В was originally a “crooked” project, which should not have taken off at all.

But when it began to smell real plantings and expulsions, the management of AK Ilyushin went on principle, formed a new team under the leadership of Bykov (God bless them of health and success in the future) and started to eliminate the flaws of the previous team of designers at a shock pace.



And what happened in March 2019, I repeat, by and large, this can be called a feat. Absolutely a failed project, which could become one of the symbols of the cut of the country and the same disappointment, suddenly took off.

Of course, not suddenly. Of course, the hellish efforts of the whole AK of Il'yushin, VASO as a whole and the Hero of Russia test-pilot Nikolai Kuimov in particular.

Well, a certain answer to all those who squealed and were unhappy that the plane would have to be “corrected” within a year. While there will be tests, corrections and corrections will be made. Already at the time of the first flight, it was possible to “remove” one ton of overload from three and work with reloading the tail section.

In total, it is planned to make about a hundred changes to the design.

Yes, yesterday (in March) IL-112В demonstrated that our design school has weakened. Very weak, very strong. But, fortunately, not critical. Otherwise, the plane would have remained on the ground, what a magician or soar at the helm.

And yes, this is the first military transport aircraft actually created in our country. Sorry, but there is a difference between building such a machine, really on 100% from domestic components, and assembling an imported designer of the “Superjet” type.

15 years - is it a lot or a little?

And it all depends on the result. It is clear that now the AK named after Ilyushin are waiting for dismissal and upheaval, but I hope that they will cope. And in a year our army will have a new transport plane.



The year is not so much. There is something to wait for.
100 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. +15
    April 9 2019 15: 12
    This plane is needed, even if it’s morally obsolete, it’s necessary to change the fleet, and the rest is all lyrics
    1. -15
      April 9 2019 15: 29
      It was necessary to do the IL-114 first (it can only be redesigned wings from above). And from it a cargo version without a ramp. Why does the army need a small plane and that it can certainly carry armored cars? Then it would be cheap and cheerful. And the flight characteristics would be higher, and carrying capacity. What has been done, of course, is a compromise, but let it be so than nothing.
      1. +17
        April 9 2019 16: 28
        These are two fundamentally different aircraft.

        IL-112 - in the category of Spartan. That is, a large volume of the cargo compartment into which an army machine (Tiger / Iveco / Oshkosh) or even a light helicopter (well, this is a Western bauble, then Ka-226 is more voluminous).

        IL-114 - only in the category C-295 and the ramp is simply required. However, the passenger body - allows you to really significantly increase the flight characteristics of the aircraft, its performance and economy. However, do not shove the car or helicopter.

        Here - graphically, there are Ana by the way.


        Here is the work of Watermelon (C-295)


        1. -3
          April 10 2019 06: 28
          Quote: donavi49
          These are two fundamentally different aircraft

          I understand it. Therefore, he wrote that it was necessary first to IL-114, and on its basis the IL-112. Without increasing the cross section of the hull, like the An-24 and An-26.
      2. +9
        April 9 2019 16: 34
        Quote: Stas157
        even if it’s morally obsolete

        What does it mean your "morally obsolete"?
        There is a huge need for this car.
        What or whose morality has suffered here?
        1. +3
          April 10 2019 06: 33
          Quote: For example
          Quote: Stas157
          even if it’s morally obsolete

          What does it mean your "morally obsolete"?
          There is a huge need for this car.
          What or whose morality has suffered here?

          Where am I writing this ?? Why do you attribute other people's extracts to me? Do you know what they stand for?
      3. 0
        19 June 2019 09: 43
        It's so simple: cut a hole for the ramp, reinforced the floor and ceiling, rearranged the wings from the bottom up - oops! ready: "Then it would be cheap and cheerful" ...
        Indeed, then ...
        Then this plane would carry itself without loading on the runway. To and fro, to and fro ...
      4. 0
        22 July 2019 14: 38
        You do not understand anything in the BTA. Here for what purpose do you need a transport without a ramp? What to carry on it? In addition to the armored car, he must transport aircraft engines, gearboxes, and other spare parts. How to shove it all through the door?
    2. +6
      April 10 2019 10: 49
      This plane is needed


      Hmm ... There is one story in Soviet aviation. Eve of the Great Patriotic War. The fighter is badly needed. And the great 23-year-old "genius" Silvansky Alexander Vasilyevich (son-in-law of the People's Commissar of the Aviation Industry Kaganovich) receives a design bureau, a task, money and designs an I-220. "Fucking shit" - testimonials of testers (including Grinchik). There are so many design mistakes that it is time to become a model, just like it is impossible to design airplanes. The reason is that the main (albeit an MAI graduate) "confuses ailerons with spars", but confidently commands. Old people scatter from the design bureau in all directions. Result - Shakhurin kicks out the designer with a bang. Time is such that it would seem - a prison or a watchtower. But no, he is happily going through the war and Stalin. Hangs around Korolev for some time with "projects". And he lives to an honorable old age.
      And the only plane "flew". Somehow ... several times ...
      1. +1
        April 14 2019 07: 15
        Sorry, I could not resist and copied a piece of the article:
        The work dragged on. The deadlines for all stages of the development of the program were disrupted. Only in August 1939 the I-220 was built. Test pilot I.S. Baranov made six taxiings and three runs on the strip from September 24 to October 6, 1939. On September 25, the aircraft made its first run, which was interrupted due to shock vibrations of the propeller group when the machine was aligned in a flight line. After stopping and inspecting the screw, tattered injuries of the ends of the blades were found, which, when the chassis depreciation was completely reduced, a number of soil sections were plowed very thoroughly. There was a joker who advised to dig a ditch for the propeller along the runway ... Universal laughter had a killer effect on the main one. There was no other screw, and Sylvansky, annoyed, did not find anything better than cutting 100 mm from the ends of the blades. "Circumcision" engaged in the assembly shop. The plane was lifted onto the tragus and, substituting an elementary emphasis, they began to turn the screw with each blade to the peasant with a hacksaw in his hand ... laughing
        If this is interesting (and this is a very interesting, solid article), then it is here:
        http://авиару.рф/aviamuseum/aviatsiya/sssr/istrebiteli-2/1940-e-1950-e-gody/istrebiteli-drugih-konstruktorov/istrebitel-i-220-is/
        Thank you for mentioning this page of the domestic aircraft industry. hi Apparently, we have never had a shortage of adventurers ("effective").
  2. +18
    April 9 2019 15: 15
    Clear skies, full tanks and soft landings!
  3. -10
    April 9 2019 15: 16
    And in a year our army will have a new transport aircraft.

    "The young man's hopes are nourished" ... In a year there will be a prototype (God forbid), and the plane, if there will be, then just another 15 years.
    1. AUL
      +10
      April 9 2019 20: 05
      But then the opposite happened, IL-112V shot down Rogozin. Totally. Well, God bless him, the main thing is that a knowledgeable and understanding specialist, and not an “effective” manager, will come to replace the AK Ilyushin AK.
      God grant. But there is no certainty about this - many more sons and nephews are waiting for a warm place!
  4. +5
    April 9 2019 15: 22
    And what, on Ilyushin, a million design engineers? Is there really no way to raise their salary? And yes, for a fee, more experienced engineers should train salabons during off-hours, rather than wait until they grow up.
    1. +17
      April 9 2019 15: 29
      There, piece specialists, who have been grown for years, and now the recruits went to war. You can’t change your head from double salary. For their new experience, you will have to pay not so much with money as with time.
      1. +7
        April 9 2019 15: 50
        This is true, but for a penny wage, how long will the young and promising last? Will not five (!) Ilyushin departments run to Irkut?
    2. +5
      April 9 2019 17: 29
      A. Fedorov. Mr. is not in the subject, to prepare a qualified designer (1 category) you need 7-10 years, continuous design work, maintenance work during construction and a decent salary.
    3. +1
      April 9 2019 21: 58
      average salary of design engineers in Russia is 70 thousand. rubles per month, in the USA 42 thousand dollars a month, that’s the answer to your question.
      1. +7
        April 10 2019 05: 14
        In Soviet times, too, compared. And, too, the alignment was not in our direction. However, the planes were.
        1. +3
          April 10 2019 20: 15
          Then it was impossible to leave! Now please!
      2. +2
        April 10 2019 08: 14
        Where is such a crazy figure from? Where are the designers who pull it up? Where do they work?
      3. +7
        April 10 2019 10: 25
        average salary of design engineers in Russia is 70 thousand. rubles per month

        In our defense industry with an average engineer engineer, you obviously got excited
        1. 0
          April 10 2019 20: 17
          Do not confuse the engineer and the design engineer!
          1. +1
            April 11 2019 09: 26
            I don’t confuse it at all, and your correction does not affect the essence, because I am familiar with the situation from the inside.
      4. 0
        April 11 2019 14: 47
        I, as a former design engineer, from 1992, after moving from Tashkent to 2015, carefully monitored the salaries of design engineers in Russia and their requirements. You are deeply mistaken. However, in Soviet times, production wages were 1.5 times higher than in KB.
      5. +1
        22 July 2019 14: 51
        42 thousand dollars in the United States can receive only an extremely cool designer, and not a graduate of the university. Do not carry nonsense. And consider what personal income tax in the United States, it does not less than 45% of these 42 thousand.
    4. 0
      22 July 2019 14: 45
      If the person holding the position of designer is not able to create, then you put him at least a million rubles a salary, he still will not do anything.
      There are many engineers, but the designers, as a rule, noticed here, this is a piece of goods.
  5. +7
    April 9 2019 15: 25
    The plane flew! Contrary to "effective managers", thieving bureaucrats and other liberal shit - he flew!
    1. +3
      April 9 2019 16: 40
      Quote: mik193
      The plane flew! Contrary to "effective managers", thieving bureaucrats and other liberal shit

      Since when did burglar officials and effective spending cutters become liberals?
      1. +2
        April 9 2019 20: 02
        And this is the liberal approach. Fans of the "invisible hand of the market" like to forget that in a typical market, "invisible hands" usually do not regulate, but rummage through other people's pockets.
        1. +2
          April 9 2019 23: 27
          The "invisible hand" of the market was so fumbling in its pockets that it searched for aircraft carriers, for the largest fleet of ships and aircraft, as well as for the design of modern launch vehicles and satellites, and much more. I think that the problem is not in the "invisible hand", but in quite visible hands, for example, in videos and photographs from meetings in the State Duma and ministries
    2. +5
      April 9 2019 20: 35
      An airplane is not something that flies (it is possible to make a gate from a fence fly), but that it is mass-produced and performs its functions. From a prototype to a production aircraft, years of intense engineering work lie.
  6. +10
    April 9 2019 15: 35
    It may be morally obsolete in terms of filling, but a good glider in conjunction with the engines is timeless! Good luck! Peanut)))
  7. +7
    April 9 2019 15: 36
    The plane is in demand. Good luck in testing and operation. In the heyday of design ideas, in the last device of our homeland, not all aircraft stood in defense of the Fatherland. Many, including promising developments, were closed in offices. I hope the crisis will be overcome.
  8. +2
    April 9 2019 15: 37
    Yes, yes, again # prosralipolymers ..
    Article plus, all in the case. From myself, I can add to all-propagators that in the world (in Russia it is simply much larger and brighter) there is a crisis with design engineers. From personal experience working with German and American designers on much simpler products, I can say that the degradation from the level of the last century is complete. All talented went into private business, the popularity of the profession fell, in general, a lot more. In my city, firms are very well paid to designers and lured by others, and still not enough.
  9. +2
    April 9 2019 15: 46
    IL-112V shot down Rogozin.
    Is he the only one? A failure in the release of IL-76md-90?
    And no matter what anyone says, but I really hope that in a year and a half, the second copy of the Il-112 will be released on the runway with already corrected "errors"
  10. +10
    April 9 2019 15: 49
    why go far? but not far, or rather, right behind the VASO fence, the Aviation Technical College is located. You can go in and chat with teachers about the level of training of their wards. They themselves frankly say that specialists are graduated almost at the level below the plinth. They just had at least some kind of peel, no matter the air college or soap technical college. Units fall into the plant, the rest dissolve in the sunset. And how to produce modern competitive equipment? with whom? Whoever stayed there at VASO and assembled this plane should be put on buses and taken to the Kremlin for gold stars by everyone. It is a fact.....
    1. 0
      April 10 2019 13: 46
      I correctly understood that teachers themselves speak of their incompetence? And that they have prepared the ignoramus? Class ...
      1. +2
        April 11 2019 14: 47
        You can’t teach. You can only learn. The average young man does not want to learn a profession. No one has the right to force him and cannot. That is why degradation is observed. And this is ubiquitous in all educational institutions in all specialties. There are few self-motivated guys.
    2. 0
      22 July 2019 15: 01
      The Aviation College NEVER supplied designers to the Voronezh Aircraft Plant. In the best case, even the very best ones went to this position to work as production masters, and not in the main workshops, but in auxiliary ones. I have not seen a single master in workshop No. 7 (whoever is in the subject knows what kind of workshop this is) a graduate of a technical school.
      The real specialists and designers were supplied by the Voronezh Polytechnic Institute, there was a faculty of "aircraft construction".
  11. +5
    April 9 2019 15: 51
    Of course it will be brought to mind and will be collected, but again, in miserable parties, like AN-148, not worthy of the factory producing Tu-144, IL-86 and IL-96.
    1. 0
      22 July 2019 15: 04
      In fairness, the Tu-144 was also produced in a small batch. One plane in 1,5 years. He personally assembled a fueling and balancing system there.
  12. The comment was deleted.
  13. BAI
    +11
    April 9 2019 15: 53
    2011 year. The Ministry of Defense officially refuses IL-112В in favor of An-140.

    Everything is as always - to the detriment of oneself, for the sake of the "brothers", who fouled us. And time and money have been spent on the An-140 (and An-70). As I remember now, what kind of dogs were not let down on the Air Force general (right up to his dismissal, but I forgot his last name), who defended the priorities of the domestic industry and opposed cooperation with Antonov. Who turned out to be right in the end, and who remembers this?
    1. +2
      April 9 2019 16: 44
      Quote: BAI
      And time and money were spent on the An-140 (and An-70).

      AN-70 2/3 belongs to the Russian Federation, it is another matter that joint projects had to be called into question after the actual liquidation of Antonov Design Bureau. There has long been only an office for servicing junk and transportations on the An-124, and not a design bureau. All engineers have been dispersed for a long time. And the Ministry of Defense could not know this.
      1. -1
        April 11 2019 21: 48
        Quote: goose
        that joint projects needed to be called into question after the actual liquidation of Antonov Design Bureau. There has long been only an office for servicing junk and transportations on the An-124, and not a design bureau. All engineers have been dispersed for a long time. And the Ministry of Defense could not know this.

        Antonov has resumed technical assessment of Volga-Dnepr aircraft from November 2017
        no Ukrainian sanctions imposed on VD
      2. 0
        22 July 2019 15: 06
        An-70 exists in a single copy and it certainly does not belong to Russia.
  14. +4
    April 9 2019 15: 56
    It was from 2017 that he knew, but continued to make confident and encouraging reports. Himself. For which he was punished by the deprivation of all posts and posts. Right? Quite.

    Is it really for this? The media vying with each other say that they removed Rogozin as a result of optimization of the number of management. This means that no one more intelligent will come to his place, because the place is reduced. Another spitefulness, like they removed Rogozin's son from work for an incorrect report. Although, for the sake of objectivity, the plane was prepared for take-off during Rogozin's work. In principle, the Rogozins, as they say, don't care for me. Another annoying. Instead of the essence of the problem, we are thrown some fakes about the "checkers", born without leaving the office. Apparently this is considered a worthy topic for the next "gum". Would be engaged in real business ..... And the IL-112 will fly, not in a year, then in two. There is no other way. Maybe we will hear something positive about the 214th. The sad thing is that not from this resource. Here, positive news, not blown away by third-party media, is not held in high esteem.
    1. -1
      April 9 2019 20: 07
      IL-214th was renamed IL-276. I think everything will be fine with him.
      1. 0
        April 9 2019 20: 34
        Quote: Gregory_78
        I think everything will be fine with him.

        I think so too. All question in terms.
    2. 0
      April 10 2019 10: 31
      aircraft prepared for take-off during the work of Rogozin

      here it is more appropriate to say: contrary to the work of ml. Rogozin
      1. +1
        April 10 2019 14: 44
        Quote: Povelitel_buri
        here it is more appropriate to say: contrary to the work of ml. Rogozin

        Do you work there and can reliably confirm his negative participation in the project? Our teacher is engaged in oil, and is quite successful. What is wrong with Rogozin? Or are you for the choir ....?
        1. 0
          April 11 2019 09: 30
          I can give one example: During the period of Rogozin Jr.’s leadership, at least one leading design engineer managed to leave the frame just the same - to put it mildly, they did not agree on the characters.
          1. 0
            April 11 2019 12: 28
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            During the leadership of Rogozin Jr., at least one leading design engineer managed to leave from there

            Firstly, the lead engineer is not the only unit, and secondly, is this the engineer who, as a result of his work, does not meet the proposed requirements? Thirdly, one resigned employee for 2 years is not an indicator of the quality of relations in a team at all. Another thing is clear, you have nothing concrete against Rogozin the Younger. Simply, you are for the company ...... This is not beautiful, and not productive. Although this is with us at every turn .... just to blurt out something ....
  15. +5
    April 9 2019 15: 58
    Rogozin ml. and aviation, some kind of guard and a complete failure.
    Rogozin senior cosmos, guard and failures .... the conclusion in my opinion suggests itself
  16. +1
    April 9 2019 16: 33
    As for criticism of the aircraft at VO, if I met comments on the case, I won’t say anything about other resources. The bottom line is that the aircraft is morally obsolete, R&D work began in 2001, as the author writes, whether the alteration of the project was done after winning the competition in 2004 is doubtful, i.e. in subsequent years until 2019. Fair criticism? I think so ... do we need such a plane? definitely, the army has long been waiting for him, especially if there is obsolescence of equipment, then this is not critical for a transport aircraft. Another question is how much the plant will be able to produce such aircraft per year? The first flight of the prototype is of course great, and the fact that it consists of Russian components is also an achievement .... but now the question arises of the serial production of this aircraft, will the statements of the plant management differ from the real picture? Over these 15 years, there have been many expectations and statements that are about now .... but only in 2019 it finally happened. Let's see how the fate of the aircraft will turn out, here we can only wish good luck to designers, workers in general to all those involved in this development.
    1. +1
      April 10 2019 10: 32
      Can you justify how it is morally obsolete?
  17. +5
    April 9 2019 17: 53
    I’m interested in something else: unlike the An24 / 26/140 ... new aircraft are initially made in digital form and part of the strength and aerodynamic and centering issues is solved by computer mathematics .... how did they make so many gaps?
    1. 0
      April 10 2019 08: 36
      Quote: Zaurbek
      new planes initially do in digital

      Well do not tell. If there are still old and experienced war designer, then it is already many years old and it’s very difficult to transfer and teach them to a computer, but everything is old-fashioned. Young people and they don’t even know what a culman is and whatman and when they come to the workplace they think that by clicking the comp button and the program they will draw everything themselves, although many processes are already automated, but they won’t do much weather except performance and time . But the ability to think and invent is not the ability to draw.
      In addition, if one of the veterans switched to a computer such as Compass 3D, Solid, Pro Engineer, Akad, some still draw in 2D, and 3D is already difficult for them.
      Regarding centering or the center of mass, it’s if the full 3D is up to a millimeter and comp calculates, but otherwise only theoretically with the head. Now, estimate in 2001 when it all started, who in digital terms did all this there? Yes, surely no one and everything through the kulman and whatman at that time, and computers and 3D programs, did not glow very well in the workplace.
  18. 0
    April 9 2019 18: 49
    Of course, a VERY NECESSARY plane! And thank God that he took off and flew ... It is clear that not without flaws ... but they are leveled over time. Considering our country and our so-called airfields, it is more needed than the Il-114. IL-114 is just a passenger plane, moreover, with a low-winged plane, accordingly, you need a high reinforced landing gear ... And our copy of the Italian Spartan (by the way, it lifted 9 tons) is more needed even for passenger traffic. Let the passenger version lose in comfort, but on D-day there are armchairs in the warehouse, and the wheeled load will be inside ... Now we should not fool our heads, abandon the construction of the Il-114 and throw all the forces into the construction of the Il-112 ! Because 112 is more versatile, and it can do what 114 cannot!
    1. 0
      April 9 2019 20: 17
      Here it is not necessary ... Both planes are necessary. Passenger doesn’t need such a volume of the fuselage - does it make sense to carry air? By the way, on the basis of IL-114 there will certainly be military aircraft such as anti-submarine, reconnaissance, etc. Both are needed, with no options.
      1. -1
        April 9 2019 21: 20
        But I'm afraid you are mistaken. If 114 would be in such demand as 112, then why do we have it? At least a hundred? Why don't they let him out? And those who used to buy it, how were they sent to the sludge as a passenger? It is clear that we do not know much, but it looks like it is not ice at all! I am convinced that as soon as 112 goes in marketable quantities, 114 will be safely forgotten. Why produce two planes on the same engines, and, accordingly, two sets of spare parts, etc. we get two fleets of identical aircraft. If 112 does not suit it as a purely passenger one, it can also be a cargo-passenger one. Or develop a new fuselage for a purely passenger one ... I hope they will not do this. Somewhere in the internet there were schemes for him to pass. variant, it seems for 44 people? Well, An-24 48 people. took. Although I like 114, But "at least Plato is dear to me ....".
  19. +2
    April 9 2019 21: 07
    Respect for designers, engineers and ordinary employees of enterprises who were able to eliminate the shortcomings in such a short time. It would be nice to distribute their names among those studying for this or a similar profession, so that it would be to whom one of his contemporaries be equal to.
    And the plane, made on 100% of domestic components, is definitely needed. The aviation industry needs orders for its development.
  20. +1
    April 9 2019 21: 36
    It's easier, of course, to stand on the sidelines and broadcast "everything is gone." But since Gorbachev is still alive, and especially ebn + "Chubais-Gaidars" bombed the backbone of aviation designers, someone and when it is necessary even not "0" but with "-100" smile
    And teams of aircraft designers to create and build "correct" airplanes !!!
  21. +1
    April 9 2019 21: 38
    The article is good but there is not enough at least a little comparison with what the adversaries have
  22. 0
    April 9 2019 22: 21
    But, firstly, I would like to ask an obvious such question to everyone who rushed to criticize the plane. And, in fact, what did you expect? Is the plane criticized?
  23. 0
    April 9 2019 22: 22
    To summarize ..
    ***** In general, the aviation specialists who managed to reach out unanimously say one thing: the Il-112V was originally a “crooked” project that should not have taken off at all ****
    It took off all the same .. But the curvature has not disappeared and in this form no one needs it ..
    Why then rejoice?
    1. +5
      April 10 2019 00: 29
      The AN-148 also flew after the revision; they will bring it to VASO and IL-112 with a "file". Now, on other issues, in 2004, in fact, the conversation was about the modification of the IL-114, the IL-112 is a fundamentally different aircraft, there can be no talk of any moral obsolescence, except that the "experts" determining the fundamental novelty of the smartphone, because of the pair extra inches of the screen, something will seem.
      About the ubiquitous figure that people can design, everything else is an implementation tool, by the way I remember hearing about the digitization of drawings, it means that part of the project was not born in numbers. quite a lot of components comes from subcontractors and here their problems.
      As for funny salaries, unfortunately it’s not a joke, although they say in special workshops they are not bad, and several years ago, I explained to one graduate why I had to agree to work at VASO, and after a year I got experience and filling out the paragraph in the CV summary about it, look work with a decent salary.
  24. +1
    April 9 2019 22: 48
    ".... Plus, as the assembly progressed, unpleasant things began to emerge. For example, the initial overload of the aircraft was almost three tons. By the way, it became known in the same 2017.
    At the same time, problems with alignment were revealed .... "

    "Overload", a colleague "only" 600 kg, which, however, is also a lot .... and the problem with alignment is the same as "overload", only a side view ...
  25. -1
    April 9 2019 22: 53
    It’s good that he finally appeared, but he needs a larger transport plane
    1. 0
      22 July 2019 15: 14
      There is a larger one for a long time, it is IL-76.
  26. -1
    April 9 2019 23: 31
    The main thing is the result! Everything else is snot ....
  27. 0
    April 9 2019 23: 41
    And what is the truth they say that: "Rogozin is capable of not bringing any task to mind .."?
    Why do they put them in charge if they don’t know the road !!!
    I hope Putin does not know this, but what am I supposed to think about him then ?!
  28. 0
    April 10 2019 01: 08
    If you look at this aircraft in profile from above (third photo), you get the impression that narrow wings from the AN-76 were attached to the thick fuselage carcass (as it is, a reduced version of the IL-26) - where does the lift for this takeoff and flight come from? duckling "? winked
    1. +4
      April 10 2019 15: 59
      The lifting force of a wing of an airplane equipped with propeller engines depends very much on the area blown by the jet from the propellers. Since the speed of air flow behind the screws is higher than the flight speed of the aircraft itself. For An-12/24/26/32 aircraft, the wing area blown by screws reached 80 percent of the total area, I think the values ​​here are approximately the same. The relatively small wing area contributes to its lower resistance in flight, which positively affects the characteristics of cruising flight. The disadvantages of the same wing on takeoff and landing (insufficient lift) are compensated by the so-called. mechanization of the wing (flaps, slats of the slats), which contribute to an increase in the lifting force of the wing, by increasing its area and curvature of the profile.
    2. -1
      April 11 2019 21: 55
      Quote: Radikal
      If you look at this aircraft in profile from the top (third shot), you get the impression that narrow wings from the AN-76 added a thick fuselage carcass (as-is-a reduced version of the IL-26)

      They say that it is. They took a whole piece of the fuselage of the IL-76. Hence the problems with an advantage.
  29. 0
    April 10 2019 02: 03
    the author is trying to sweeten shit with candy and pass off an epic failure for a feat ... no need to reassure anyone and refer to difficult conditions .. any problem and failure, as in the case of this aircraft, has names and surnames .. starting from dumb-headed designers and ending with people who led all the processes and made decisions .. where are these surnames? .. the country should know the names of these villains .. although the name of one bastard who plunged the country into the cause of corruption and theft is well known to everyone - this is Putin .. it is this person who bears all responsibility for all the mess going on ..
    1. +1
      April 10 2019 13: 08
      Not true. Surnames, of course, are. And "dumb-headed designers", as you say, also need to be taught, time is needed, technologies that do not stand still (knowledge is needed, yes), and the school actually sagged and strongly, but it was not under Putin that it sagged, mind you ... And the people of today in the industries have not yet done everything from their own, but are accustomed to buying someone else's over the hill. At one time, as we know, our big country was piled on its side in full strength: together with the leadership, ministries, departments, ... commanders, designers, ... drivers, cooks, nannies ... Remember when, with what efforts, and with the help of whom and what, they began to pull the state out of the swamp ... All connections and chains were restored. And responsibility - yes, always at the head ... Go yourself for everything and do it, huh? You will not do one alone? Much needs to be organized, provided, taught. It takes time. Otherwise, it is not correct to say, this is a super simplified approach to circumstances. No offense).
      1. 0
        April 10 2019 13: 11
        I fully support.
  30. +2
    April 10 2019 07: 30
    An article as a tale of a fortune-teller gypsy "... What happened, what will happen .." Only the main thing is how the heart will calm down. And, in general, there is nothing to calm down. The formula "there is no money, but you hold on here" has not yet been canceled. Consequently, in the near future, videoconferencing will have to choose a hundred to spend the allocated money? A new military aircraft or an ugly duckling? What do you think they will spend on?
  31. +1
    April 10 2019 12: 43
    Do you need to change the ancient An-24 and An-26? Yes need. Do they replace them? Yes, they do. Does it work? It turns out, albeit with attempts, problems, underfunding and nerves, and even during the period of all kinds of restrictions (sanctions), but only from its own. Here's a new board! And the good fellows, although the "new" shoots of designers are weak - nothing, they will learn quickly, if you don't let them mess around. All will be! I would like it faster, but it will definitely come with experience. The main thing is not to stand still!
  32. +3
    April 10 2019 15: 09
    So, let's go.
    2001 year. Beginning of R & D on the project IL-112В.

    I was still a student and helped a draftsman in KB Tupolev (do not be surprised, then only heads remained in Ilyushin) much earlier than this date. Then they covered everything, then again they took it out of the archive, then again into the archive, and this is the third attempt to launch it.
    2011 year. The Ministry of Defense officially refuses IL-112В in favor of An-140.

    Complete nonsense.
    the leadership formed a new team under the leadership of Bykov (give them the god of health and success in the future) and began at an accelerated pace to eliminate the shortcomings of the previous design team.

    Which team? Teams of Soviet engineers? Teams of girls who "digitized" Soviet drawings in AutoCAD, while painting their nails and communicating on a smartphone?
    I remember we were sent on a business trip to Ylyushin in Moscow, so only on the second day they allocated one computer for everyone. From him they warmed themselves indoors in the winter. So this plane was born. And you are about God.
  33. 0
    April 10 2019 16: 10
    Quote: ASASHOKA
    Do you need to change the ancient An-24 and An-26? Yes need. Do they replace them? Yes, they do. Does it work? It turns out, albeit with attempts, problems, underfunding and nerves, and even during the period of all kinds of restrictions (sanctions), but only from its own. Here's a new board! And the good fellows, although the "new" shoots of designers are weak - nothing, they will learn quickly, if you don't let them mess around. All will be! I would like it faster, but it will definitely come with experience. The main thing is not to stand still!

    Flew, only now sat on one engine .... sad
  34. 0
    April 10 2019 17: 11
    As you wish, but I like this airplane. And there are flaws in every new project. Gradually bring to mind, eliminate the shortcomings and he will fly for the good of Russia.
  35. +3
    April 10 2019 18: 32
    In mining, which is closer to me, there are also difficulties with the generational change and computers. In the older generation, a three-dimensional model is easily formed in the head when reading flat drawings and they categorically do not want or cannot be retrained. I myself came across this problem and stepped back, not wanting to break the usual course of things. Much is also tied to TB-safety equipment. At the same time, young people are happy to learn Compass and other surrogates, and real ARPA or GGIS of foreign companies cost a lot of money and any manager who comes to a senior position in order to improve his financial situation with a creak allocates money for programs, i.e. good programs unknown or not available .. You have to trap, look for outdated pirated copies, and as soon as you figured out the pirate, your superiors suddenly allocates a couple of millions for a familiarization program with a key for a month. For a month, you have less or less learned how to find the right buttons and ask to buy a permanent key, but the issue with financing hangs because the chair is already a new young manager and has been going on for decades, and you say the figure smile
  36. +2
    April 10 2019 20: 02
    I read the comments and the hair moves. It is still worth first of all understanding the subject of the article and only then writing something. The article itself is also weak - it was worth rummaging through history.
    The Il-112 and Il-114 projects appeared in the 80s, but only the Il-114, which flew in 1990, has advanced to the release of a prototype. Then there was a period of devastation, the Il-114 was put into production in Tashkent, but there was no demand and the plane died together with the plant. The Il-112 continued to be designed in the initial stages as the funds were available for it and the requirements for it from the Ministry of Defense changed. In the mid-140s, they returned to it, there was some kind of funding, but that project was "paper" and was abandoned after the Ministry of Defense decided to buy the An-2014. After the events of 112, it was necessary to return to domestic developments and the Il-476V project was resumed, only it was already a new project, which was entirely done in digital form. This is not a digitization of an old project (as was the case with the Il-476), but a new development using common solutions from old designs. That is why errors got in (unlike the Il-114). They also began to restore the Il-112, but this is precisely the digitization and modernization of a quite successful aircraft. Il-114 and Il-XNUMX will be largely unified in a number of systems and PKI. Both aircraft will be modern, and people who are far from aviation or interested persons speak about their moral obsolescence.
  37. +1
    April 10 2019 20: 07
    Tired of the sofa experts screaming: - "Oh, how bad we are, but in the states ...". And in the states it is often even worse. Of those who scream the most, he hardly knows how to use a wrench or what a wrench is. I am sure that the plane will be finished and it will serve for a long time. No need to find fault with what you have no idea about.
  38. +1
    April 10 2019 21: 59
    clear skies to the new plane, thanks to the creators!
  39. +1
    April 11 2019 05: 27
    The Ugly Duckling Il-Xnumxv


    at the moment it is the only Russian aircraft developed from scratch and assembled entirely from domestic components. The rest is either modernization of the Soviet heritage or crafts in which a good half of foreign parts, analogues of which we still do not produce.
    We have a lot of deficiencies such as Superjets, the MC21 for which there are still no Russian engines or wings (composite wing). For transport and passenger aircraft, we still do not have a second-stage engine for the SU-57.
    But they all fell off the chain attacking something that was flying, and it was assembled completely from domestic parts. Apparently IL-112 is already very much hindering someone both in Russia and over the hill.
  40. +1
    April 11 2019 06: 35
    We simply express our anxiety and our feelings about the plane, which is urgently needed for people in the outback. In general, I owe my life to such an aircraft. When I was pulled out of the mountains in a helicopter in a grave condition, then I went to the hospital in the regional center at An-26. With these airplanes, the gold miners carried the watch and cargo, i.e. not only the military is interested in a light transport, but also industry.
  41. 0
    April 11 2019 20: 39
    In the late 90s, all the documentation for the Tu-330 aircraft was ready - a transport variant based on the used Tu-204 with PS-90A or excellent NK-93. Carrying capacity up to 35 tons range - 4500 km. They wanted to do at KAPO Gorbunov. in 2000m they were ready to begin construction, but everyone was poker. It turns out that the aircraft was completely localized, and then Antonov was unfastened on the An-70, on the IL-214, on the IL-112, on the 150. Spent no R&D dough so much that 330 pieces of TU-200 could be built. Some kind of nonsense ... I want to cry from resentment. Already in the early 76s, it became clear that Ilyushin Design Bureau lost all its competencies - they could only offer modernization IL-XNUMX. This was written then. At the same time, Tupolev had a quite young team, capable of pulling out a project.
    By the way, NK-93 was also forgotten or betrayed (like traitors)
  42. Quote: dauria
    Silvansky Alexander Vasilievich

    ***
    Great quoting, but check something out ....
    L.M. Kaganovich had two children:
    1. Daughter, Maya Lazarevna Kaganovich (1923-2001), architect.
    She was married to Georgy Minervin before the 1971 divorce.
    2. In addition, Lazar Moiseevich Kaganovich raised his adopted son Yuri (1931-1976).
    Questions:
    1. Was George Minervin Sylvan Alexander part-time?
    2. Did Maya Lazarevna marry Silvansky after her divorce from Minervin in 1971?
    3. The indicated events (with the purpose and design of the I-220 aircraft) didn’t happen after 1971, when L. M. Kaganovich was deeply retired, and the urgency of constructing the I-220 still existed?
    And if the answers are negative to 1., 2., 3., then
    4. Was the specified son-in-law of Kaganovich-Silvansky Alexander Vasilievich married to the young son of Kaganovich YURII (born in 1931) in the period 1932-1940?
    1. 0
      April 13 2019 04: 51
      "The future ally of Stalin was born on November 10 (22), 1893 into a Jewish family living in the village of Kabany in the Radomysl district of the Kiev province. The family had many children - 13 children, of whom six survived to adulthood."
      “Little is known about Silvansky himself, like he was involved in the project of a 'space plane', worked for Korolev. As for his appointment to such a high and responsible post, despite the complete lack of abilities and elementary knowledge, everything is explained simply. was "only" the son-in-law of the first people's commissar of the aviation industry, and later the people's commissar of the defense industry (NKOP) of the USSR, Michael Moishevich Kaganovich. " ©
    2. 0
      April 14 2019 10: 28
      Mikhail Moiseevich Kaganovich (October 16, 1888 - July 1, 1941) - Soviet statesman and party leader, older brother of Julius Kaganovich and Lazar Kaganovich. 11.1.1939/XNUMX/XNUMX People's Commissariat of Aviation Industry of the USSR was allocated from NKOP, at the head of which was put Mikhail Moiseevich Kaganovich. You just rushed to the conclusions and told us about one of his younger brothers. lol
  43. [quote = asher] I, as a former design engineer from 1992, after moving from Tashkent to 2015, carefully monitored the salaries of design engineers in Russia and their requirements. You are deeply mistaken. However, in Soviet times, production wages were 1.5 times higher than in KB. [/ Quote
    ***
    Hello fellow countryman! Chilanzar, quarter 10.
    6th Guards Military Transport Aviation Zaporizhzhya Red Banner Orders of the Suvorov and Bogdan Khmelnitsky Division (6th Guards Military Commissariat) from 1977 to 1989, ZKP VTA and VDV from 1989 to 1994. IL-76 - great aircraft.
  44. 0
    April 12 2019 02: 07
    Roman Skomorokhov, you write about the history of the aircraft, or the history of one of its modifications.
    For comparison, here is how his story is presented on the TASS website https://tass.ru/info/6277181
    Design history
    The design of the IL-112 began in the first half of the 1990's in the passenger version. Serial production was supposed to begin in 1994 at the Kumertau Aviation Production Enterprise (Kumertau, Bashkiria), but due to lack of funding the plan was not implemented.
    In 2000, the design of the IL-112 in the military version of the IL-112ВТ was resumed.

    This is a very recent publication from 30 March.
    Here we can mention one regulation:
    COUNCIL OF MINISTERS - GOVERNMENT
    RUSSIAN FEDERATION

    P O S T A N O V L E N I E

    4 dated November 1993 N N 1119
    Moscow

    About the creation of a multi-purpose passenger aircraft Il-112
    for local airlines

    This means that work on it began exactly no later than 1993 of the year. Why are you cutting off this piece of history? Yes, this reference to the passenger version of the IL-112 reveals a scam in a different light with the allocation at the end of the 2016 of the year 50 of billions of rubles for the mass production of the IL-114. And in the 1993 year, as today, it was obvious that neither in Russia nor abroad (for various reasons) low-level turboprops of similar capacity are suitable for regional passenger traffic. IL-112 and IL-114 aircraft of almost the same class (as AN-26 and AN-24).
    And if you recall the history of IL-114:
    The Il-114 aircraft was intended to replace, also on a number of local lines, the Yak-40 and Tu-134 turbojet aircraft. The OKB initiative was supported, and in 1986 the USSR Council of Ministers issued a decree on the development of the aircraft.
    And add to this what has been done
    Even a layman should have a question: Is that two fat
    So the question arises: are you mistakenly setting out the story so badly, or intentionally?
    1. 0
      April 12 2019 12: 17
      The site began to fail yesterday, so such a mismatch at the end. I wanted to mention there that instead of the TU-134 and YAK-40, a Superjet was created. Yes, IL-114 will compete more with the Superjet than the AN-24 and foreigners existing today. And because D. Rogozin was not interested in the plane, but in the deal on which he hoped to make money. The essence of the transaction is to buy at a bargain price the production reserve and some production facilities in Uzbekistan, where they decided to stop the production of aircraft. It was an ill-conceived deal in which D. Rogozin’s consultant was either old shots from the past (even if they were well-deserved) or new shots from the present. The trouble is that the country was broken down in the 1991 year, as a result of which a generation gap was formed, one of which knew and could, but in the old system, and the other knows and can in the new, but does not know how.
  45. 0
    April 12 2019 02: 07
    This extremely attractive and demanded niche of the world and domestic aviation market had all the chances 15-18 years ago to be occupied by the Russian-Ukrainian, Iranian-Ukrainian An-140, which began to be serially built in Kharkov, at the Kharkiv State Aviation Enterprise, in Samara at the Aviakor, in Iran at the HESA plant in Shahinshahr

    Alas, the aircraft was unhappy, and the leadership of the Ukrainian aviation industry and the Ministry of Industrial Policy was engaged more in squabbles, intrigues, stuffing their own pockets, than in the aircraft industry and promoting the global aviation market. So they killed both the An-140 and the aviation industry of Ukraine.

    A holy place is never empty. So Ilyushin’s plane will take him. Despite all his problems ..
    We wish them success, especially since the new head of Ilyushin is Yuri Grudinin, who began his career in the aviation industry in Kharkov, at KSAMC.
    1. 0
      April 12 2019 09: 53
      I believe that not weak salaries of engineers put the aviation industry in the wedge, but clans of effective managers
  46. [quote = lelik613] Michael Moishevich Kaganovich [/ quote
    ****
    Kaganovich, Mikhail Moiseevich
    He had one daughter, Julia (1919-1961), was married to the violinist Mikhail Izrailevich Fichtengolts (1920-1985).
  47. 0
    19 June 2019 10: 09
    In principle, it is no better and no worse than the An-26 (well, the price is five times more), the avionics are prettier, the reliability is worse, but it is fashionable and new.
    And what about Ukraine with the An-132?
    Okay, we have modernized the An-32. Overloaded (as the chassis was counted), hung American engines instead of Ukrainian AI-20 ..., foreign propellers, APU - foreign instead of Tg-16 or RU-19A-300 (by the way, Antonov KB testers, who worked with us on 2 "sawmills" - An-22 showed the LeBourget badge - An-24 with a Ru-19 (they completed one lap with the AI-24 engine off, the second one - with two off and landing approach to RU-1 (Tyumen Motor Plant).
    Further, Avionics is foreign.
    Of all - the sky-high price, features and service are unrealistic.
    So Already better is the weak IL-112 than some An-132.
  48. The comment was deleted.