Devotional Division. The tragic fate of Russian soldiers in France

In 1915, World War I was in full swing. By this time, it became clear that the Russian imperial army did not have enough ammunition and weapons. The military industry of the Russian Empire could not quickly move to such a work capacity that would satisfy the needs of the fighting army in armaments and ammunition. And here, as it seemed at first glance, the main then ally of the Russian Empire in the Entente - France - came to the rescue.

The representative of the French Senate Military Commission Gaston Dumerg put forward a very interesting proposal to the authorities of the Russian Empire - France provides Russia with the necessary amount of ammunition and weapons, and in return, the Russian Imperial Army sends thousands of servicemen — officers, non-commissioned officers and privates — to the Western Front of the 400. After all, there was no shortage of weapons in France, but combat-ready and brave soldiers were required, and the quality of Russian soldiers was always known in Europe.

The tsarist government, for which the common people had always been a consumable, immediately agreed with Doumergue’s proposal. As early as January 1916, the 1-I Special Infantry Brigade was formed. It consisted of the 2 infantry regiment, and the commander of the brigade was appointed Major General Nikolai Aleksandrovich Lokhvitsky (pictured), who commanded the brigade as part of the 24 Infantry Division. At that time he was 48 years old, and he received a general's rank a year earlier - in February 1915 of the year.

A graduate of the 2 th Konstantinovsky Military School, Nikolai Lokhvitsky was a career officer who graduated from the Nikolaev Military Academy in 1900, and in the 1906 year already received the rank of colonel. During the First World War, Lokhvitsky established himself as a capable and courageous commander, which served, apparently, as a pretext for choosing his brigade commander, who was sent to the Western Front.

Since it was not possible to transfer the brigade to the Western Front through Eastern Europe, where battles with the Germans and Austro-Hungarians took place, infantry regiments of the brigade were transported by rail from Moscow via Samara, Ufa, Krasnoyarsk, Irkutsk and Harbin to Dalian port, and then French ships through Saigon, Colombo, Aden and the Suez Canal in Marseille. Russian soldiers arrived at the port of Marseille on 20 on April 1916. From Marseille, they were transferred to the Western Front.

In July, the 1916 was sent to the Thessaloniki front, where the troops of the Western allies fought, was sent to the 2-I special infantry brigade of the Russian army as part of the 3-th and 4-th special infantry regiments and the Marching battalion. The commander of the brigade was appointed Major-General Mikhail K. Diterikhs. A graduate of the Page Corps, the Nikolaev Academy of the General Staff, Diterikhs was a member of the Russian-Japanese War, and during the First World War he was the Chief of Staff of the 3 Army. The brigade under the command of Diterikhs was aimed at helping the Serbian army and inflicted severe defeats on the Bulgarians who fought in the Balkans against the Serbs.

In August, the 1916-I Special Infantry Brigade of the Russian Army, commanded by Major General Vladimir Vladimirovich Marushevsky, also an experienced officer, a member of the Russo-Japanese War, was sent to France through the port of Arkhangelsk to France in August. Before his appointment to the brigade, Marushevsky commanded the 3 th Finnish Infantry Regiment.

Finally, in the middle of October 1916, the 4-I Special Infantry Brigade, commanded by Major General Mikhail Nikolayevich Leontyev, arrived in Thessaloniki from Arkhangelsk. Prior to his appointment as commander of the brigade, he served as quartermaster-general of the general staff.

Thus, 4 infantry brigades were transferred to Europe from Russia. Naturally, about any 400 thousands of people we were not talking. Despite the impressive mobilization resources of the Russian Empire, the Russian authorities could not transfer so many soldiers to help the French with all their desire. Therefore, a total of 45 of thousands of soldiers and non-commissioned officers and 750 officers of the Russian army were transferred to Europe. Of these, 20 thousands of people fought in France, and the rest in the Balkans.

The arrival of Russian troops in France caused a great stir. The French already then did not differ high fighting qualities and were terribly afraid of defeat from the Germans, because in their memory there was already a defeat in the war with Prussia. In the Russian soldiers, the French man in the street saw a much more reliable defender than in the French army itself. But the attitude of the French authorities towards the Russian troops was rather like the gratuitous "cannon fodder". And although at first Paris successfully concealed this attitude, in the end it manifested itself. But more about that later.

Russian soldiers fought heroically for Champagne-Ardennes, defended Pompel Fort, fought near Verdun. The contribution of the two infantry brigades of the Russian army to the prevention of the German offensive is invaluable. At the same time, Russian brigades suffered heavy losses. Our soldiers died in exile, defending France.

In the spring of 1917, the French army launched a large-scale offensive against the German positions. In this offensive, named for the commander of the French army, General Robert Nivelle, “the offensive of Nivelle”, French troops suffered huge losses - the French army lost more than 180 thousand people. Naturally, the “Nivelles massacre” was very much battered by the Russian brigades. Approximately 4500 people lost 1-I and 3-I special infantry brigades of the Russian army during the "Nivelles offensive". As a result, the Russian brigades were taken to rest and re-form into the La Curtin military camp in the region of Limoges. There, in La Curtina, two brigades were merged into a special infantry division of the 1. The division commander was appointed Major-General Nikolai Lokhvitsky.

While our soldiers were in the camp at La Curtin, fermentation increased among them. At home, the February revolution had already taken place, the three-hundred-year-old monarchy of the Romanovs ceased to exist, and Russian soldiers, and officers too, increasingly wondered what they were fighting for in France. As a result, in order to prevent the demoralization of units and divisions of a special division, it was decided to leave the unreliable units in the camp of La Curtin, and trustworthy, ready to fight for France, transferred to the Cournot camp.

In the meantime, the attitude towards the Russian soldiers from the French command has seriously changed. After the February Revolution, the Entente countries suspected Russia of wanting to make a separate peace with the Germans. The French command was frightened by the revolutionary events in Russia and no longer trusted the Russian units, considering them to be struck by revolutionary and anti-militarist ideas. Therefore, despite the requests of General Lokhvitsky to send his subordinates to the front, the French command preferred to “marinate” Russian soldiers in the Cournot and La Curtin camps. The deterioration of the attitude towards the Russian soldiers also affected the quality of their supplies - the nutrition has changed significantly for the worse. As a result, in September 1917, the soldiers of the units deployed in the La Curtin camp demanded that they be sent home immediately to Russia. They refused to obey not only French but also Russian officers.

Major General Mikhail Zankevich Ipolitovich (pictured) - former quartermaster general of the general staff of the Russian army was sent from the Provisional Government to France as a representative of the Supreme Commander General Headquarters. However, the insurgent Russian soldiers were not going to listen to either Zankiewicz or the division commander Lokhvitsky.

As a result, the Russian generals called for help from the French gendarmerie and the Russian artillery from the Cournot camp. Fighting in La Curtina went on for three days. During the fighting killed and injured before 600 people. The uprising of the Russian division was literally sunk in blood. Although the French authorities reported on the 9 killed, in fact there were many more. Generals Lokhvitsky and Zankevich are considered the heroes of the First World War, the true patriots of Russia, but prefer not to recall such an episode in their biography as the shooting of their own soldiers in the La Curtin camp.

After crushing the uprising in La Curtin, many of its members who survived were thrown into French prisons. Since the October Revolution had just taken place in Russia at that time, the French command had made an unequivocal decision to disband a special infantry division. Russian soldiers and officers were asked to either continue to fight as part of French units and divisions, or work in French enterprises, or go to hard labor in French colonies in North Africa.

But of the entire division, only one battalion of about 300 men expressed a desire to go to the front and fight for France. Another 5000 man decided to demobilize and work in French enterprises, and 1500 military personnel were sent to penal servitude in North Africa, mainly in Algeria.

Of course, those soldiers and non-commissioned officers who participated in the uprising in the La Curtin camp were among the "convicts". But among them there were simply activists of soldiers' committees, and too “arrogant”, according to the French command, soldiers. In Algeria, Russian soldiers and officers were in very difficult conditions. They were placed in remote and sparsely populated areas, at a great distance from each other. The French authorities were afraid of the new uprising of Russian soldiers, so they tried to keep the "convicts" in Algeria in scattered groups.

Soon the number of convicts increased - a significant part of those Russian soldiers and junior officers who expressed a desire to work in civilian enterprises were sent to Algeria. The French authorities feared that Russian workers from among the former military could have a corrupting effect on the French workers and therefore preferred to send them to the North African colonies. It is still unknown how many Russian soldiers were killed in Algerian penal servitude.

It was only in the spring of 1919 that the first trains with Russian soldiers were sent to Russia from France. First, people with disabilities who were injured in the war and who no longer interested the French authorities as labor were sent to Russia. By the spring of 1920, up to half of the Russian soldiers stationed in Algeria were also sent to Russia. Finally, in April 1920, the governments of France and Soviet Russia signed an agreement on the exchange of citizens, after which it was decided to ship the rest of the soldiers and officers who were in Algeria to the RSFSR. Only by the end of 1920, was the repatriation of the surviving Russian warriors completed.

Of those 266 soldiers and officers who decided to fight for France, the Legion of Honor was formed, which continued to fight on the Western Front, and then, after the beginning of the Civil War in Russia, transferred to the Armed Forces of Southern Russia. However, here more than half of the soldiers and officers of the legion revolted and went over to the side of the Workers 'and Peasants' Red Army.

Perhaps the most famous Russian soldier who fought on the expedition corps in France was Rodion Malinovsky, the future Marshal of the Soviet Union, the Minister of Defense of the USSR. First served in the 256 Machine Gun Team of the Elisavetgrad Infantry Regiment of the 64 Infantry Division, Rodion Malinovsky was sent to France as part of the 1 Special Infantry Brigade, participated in many battles, was wounded, and after treatment he enrolled in the Foreign Legion, as well as a young brigade. in the Russian Legion of Honor, but then with a group of colleagues was able to get into Russia, where he joined the Red Army.

History The Russian expeditionary corps in France is a big tragedy of Russian soldiers and officers and their families and a great shame for the tsarist and Provisional governments who left the Russian people in a foreign land to their fate. By the way, both the generals who commanded the execution of Russian soldiers in the La Curtin camp — and Zankevich and Lokhvitsky — after the Civil War lived in France and died in old age, unlike thousands of our soldiers who died during the battles for France or disappeared without a trace in penal servitude in the deserts of Algeria.

Comments

[Reptiloid]

I learned new things for myself. Thank you for the article.
In my opinion, this is the development of a new storyline in your work.
I really like the fact that you, dear Ilya, develop topics in several articles over the course of a long time.
After reading all your articles, their topics, you can see and understand the picture of the World differently than before. How did this happen to me!

[Basil50]

Oh how.
The French, however, like other Caucasians, only consider themselves * the navel of the universe *. The atrocities in the French colonies were no less than in the Belgian-German-English- and others. What am I talking about, THE RUSSIAN EMPIRE was considered by the Caucasians as a colony, like India, where their maharajas and other brahmanas helped the colonialists.
RUSSIAN troops in France passed through the department of the colonial troops, and the attitude was appropriate. Moreover, there was a frank purchase of soldiers and officers. The fact that the generals and other purchased officers remained in France is from contempt for them even from the former and other figures of the * white movement *.

[Normal ok]

Quote: Reptiloid

I learned new things for myself.

In the late 80s, I read a fiction book about the Russian Expeditionary Force in France. Of course, it was written from the standpoint of "world revolution))" But it was written well. Incl. on the suppression of the uprising of the corps. Unfortunately, I don't remember the name.

[Reptiloid]

Quote: Normal ok

Quote: Reptiloid

I learned new things for myself.

In the late 80s, I read a fiction book about the Russian Expeditionary Force in France. Of course, it was written from the standpoint of "world revolution))" But it was written well. Incl. on the suppression of the uprising of the corps. Unfortunately, I don't remember the name.

Thank. Such gaps in the history of our country. Trying to at least minimally overcome. True, most of your interest is the destruction of the USSR and the Second World War.

[210ox]

The author, you have a wonderful article. I want to remind you that Malinovsky went to the war not only as a volunteer, but in fact illegally. He did not seem to fit in his age. I advise you to watch the film "First World War."

[bistrov.]

There is an interesting book "On the Eastern Front of Change" by Nikolai Brykin. It very interestingly describes the preparation of soldiers of the tsarist army to be sent to France in the camps near Tula. The relationship between ordinary soldiers, officers and non-commissioned officers was revealed. From the content you conclude that all the non-commissioned officers of the tsarist army were very highly qualified specialists.
The soldiers to be sent abroad were selected according to special criteria. Standards were established not only for height and physique, but also for the color of eyes and hair. Everyone had to be literate.
They were also dressed very well, in woolen uniforms and high-quality cloth overcoats. The color of shoulder straps and edging was crimson

[XII legion]

Some things are difficult to even comment ...

The tsarist government, for which the common people have always been consumables

Where was the big consumable for the later government for that matter?
What does armament and ammunition have to do with it) In 1916, there was order (and maybe with the exception of heavy artillery) in Russia, and what is the point of transferring troops somewhere for this? And what are 4 brigades? A drop in the sea...
It was about the military contingents of the allies on the fronts of other allies - about the all-Union fronts, the strengthening of the fronts and the military community. About to show the face of the country. That is why the contingent for the Special Brigades was so carefully selected.
The troops of some allies fought on the fronts of others, and there was nothing surprising in this, because the war is coalition. The English and French divisions found themselves on the Italian front, the Russians on the Romanian, the American on the French. And no one says that someone was paying for something. Just needed recharge. The same French who suffered near Verdun or Italians after Caporetto.
By the way, regarding the Americans. In order to somehow saturate the front during the Great German offensive, and speed up the transfer, it was decided to transfer only American infantry - without artillery and rear structures. Is that the creditor of Europe, too, was cannon fodder ?? )))
In general, this is an outdated stamped point of view, especially since there is a lot of literature about the Russian Special Brigades (divisions), and many new documents have been introduced into the scientific circulation.
By the way, the Russian brigades obeyed the allied command only in operational terms, had their own organizational structure and command structure, obeyed the Russian charters, and the Russian representative in the Allied Council in France enjoyed the disciplinary rights of the front commander in relation to the Russian brigades in France.
And our brigades fought better than the French troops (Nivelles Slaughterhouse), were awarded collective military awards and mentioned in the orders of the French command. You need to be proud of it.
Subsequently, in the post-revolutionary period, the actions of agitators, newspapers, etc. really led to a drop in discipline and degradation of brigades. The result was an open disobedience of some troops (well, what to do with the rebels ??) and the division of the Russian contingent (after the October events of 1917) into three categories.
One of them remained combat - the Russian Legion of Honor (formed in accordance with a decree of April 11, 1918 from 252 volunteers), which participated in the war to the bitter end, representing the Russian army in the ranks of the Allies and carrying the Russian flag under the Arc de Triomphe in Paris during the victory parade. Moreover, he then served as the occupying forces, which made the Germans shocked.
During the Civil War - the traditional demarcation.

[Trapperxnumx]

XII legion, thanks for the balanced and reasoned answer to that nonsense that is written in the article.

[XII legion]

Thank you for your rating!
By the way, Dmitry, it would be worthwhile to figure out who and whom in general betrayed here. In particular, who allegedly betrayed these 2 brigades (later a division) in France.
Imperial government? Not at all. It formed them, transferred them, supplied them, etc. Naturally, while maintaining the old system, there was no question of any abandonment.
Interim government? Also no. By the way, the replenishment and the material part continued tossing throughout 1917.
French people? Yes, they reacted harshly to the rebellion. But will anyone really endure such things during the war? It’s clearly not the French - crushing their own red banner units in their army during the unrest in the spring of 1917.
So maybe it turns out that the one who betrayed this division who did not need the whole old Russian army — that is, the maximalist government that came to power in October 1917? And, as usual, keep the thief loudest than the thief himself screams?

[tatra]

Well done, he clearly rattled off the "policy of the party and government" of the anti-Soviet clique. , for the sake of profit justifying everything that Nicholas II and the bourgeois shared, and raging against everything that the Bolshevik-Communists and their supporters did.
I don’t give a damn to all the enemies of the Communists about those that in that unnecessary Russia and the Russian people of the First World War, and so 3 million Russian citizens died in 3 years, you need for your hatred of the Bolsheviks to die even more.

[Trapperxnumx]

Quote: tatra

, you need for your hatred of the Bolsheviks to die even more.

Do we need? Forgive me, the controversy about the death toll during the Civil, caused by two revolutions and the overthrow of the Tsar, still does not subside, and ranges from "a lot" to "unbearable many" If it weren't for Civil, the losses, although they were very great, would have at least some justifiable purpose and meaning - a victory! And so they just turned out to be useless and forgotten.

[tatra]

Exactly, what do you care about, "sucking to the bones" the loss of the Soviet people in the Great Patriotic War, the loss of the Russian people in the First World War. There is NO benefit to portray "philanthropy", which all enemies of the communists are involved exclusively in propaganda against the communists to justify your capture of the USSR. And in the same way you all proved that you do not care about all those who starved and died of hunger, repressed and executed for political reasons, hundreds of thousands of deported people of "unreliable" nationalities, killed at meetings of the people under Nicholas II.

[Trapperxnumx]

And you do not rank me among all Latynins. In my comments, I gave a clear idea of ​​why this article and a similar approach are unacceptable to me. I’ll repeat it again especially for you, because the Bolshevik government that came to power in 1918 reduced to zero all the sacrifices and sufferings of the Russian people during the First World War, and because instead of the peace and tranquility that all countries enjoyed starting from the 1918 year, we have been killing each other for the long 4 years. Can you tell me whose it was the slogan of turning into a civil war?
So it turns out like in that joke, and they gave the money and ate a bag of salt. Only here we are talking about the lives of people, and this is worse.

[tatra]

Well, yes, everything is strictly according to the "program" I wrote about. Nicholas II, who dragged Russia and the Russian people into the First World War for the sake of helping France and Serbia, and which caused great material and human damage to Russia. "It's not to blame for anything," like you, enemies of the Communists, with your relatives, a priori never for whatever you are not to blame, you always have only the accusations of others, and the Bolsheviks are to blame, who led Russia and the Russian people out of this war. Remind what the Bolsheviks promised the people? "PEACE to the peoples".

[Trapperxnumx]

Nicholas II, who dragged Russia and the Russian people into the First World War

If my memory serves me, the war was declared to us, by the note of the German government.
If you follow your logic, then Stalin pulled the USSR into World War II ...

Quote: tatra

Remind what the Bolsheviks promised the people? "PEACE to the peoples".

I remind you specifically for you

"The transformation of modern imperialist war into a civil war is the only correct proletarian slogan." IN AND. Lenin

Peace to the nations, speak? Which one? They turned the world into a civil war, and this is a real historical fact, no matter what you say. The rest of your boorish statements I will not even comment on because I do not want to stoop to your level.

[XII legion]

Thanks to Tatra for calling me well done
Only even less than the First World War (where not 3 million died, but from 775 thousand to 2,3 million Russians) - did the Russian people need the Civil War, in which more than 10 million Russians died - and certainly not at all for a snuff of tobacco.
If the WWII, into which Russia (as well as a number of other countries) was pulled in - could bring at least some geostrategic results, then the Civil War, which the Bolsheviks unleashed to destroy all opposition forces, led only to the death of a significant part of the Russian gene pool.

[tatra]

According to the book "RUSSIA AND THE USSR IN WARS OF THE XX CENTURY" published under the editorship of G.F. Krivosheev, the irrecoverable losses of Russia - 2254,4 thousand people, sanitary losses - 3749,0 thousand people. and the loss of prisoners - 3343,9 thousand people.
Civilians of the Russian Empire perished from military operations 340, hunger and disease 000.
And the enemies of the Communists are all according to Freud. If you are meanly and cowardly trying to blame others for what you yourself have done, then admit it as your crimes. If you blamed the Bolsheviks for the fact that after the October Revolution you created your armed armies to overthrow the power of the Bolsheviks, seized the territory of Soviet Russia / the RSFSR, overthrew Soviet power on them, killed the Bolsheviks and their supporters, threw them into concentration camps, then you YOU acknowledge all this as your crimes.

[XII legion]

The numbers are like that.
Killed - from 775 тыс. (data of the Bet as of September 1, 1917) until 2,3 million (incl. not returned prisoners - World War in numbers. 1934.). Interim figures are NN Golovin (1 million 300 thousand killed) and B. Ts. Urlanis (1 million 800 thousand killed).
Prisoners - 2 million 400 thousand (Golovin and Soviet materials).
Why shamefully keep silent about the losses in the Civil? They are not comparable from any point of view.
And they themselves unleashed a massacre - having dispersed the Constituent Assembly and the assembly and attacking the Czechoslovak Corps, which is being transferred to the French Front. And off it went. Moreover, combustible material has accumulated.

[tatra]

MY numbers are from the trustworthy commission of Krivosheev, whose figures on the number of Soviet citizens who died in the Great Patriotic War were recognized even by your anti-Soviet authorities. AND ENOUGH to lie and talk nonsense. How can the Dissolution of the Constituent Assembly be the cause of the Civil War? And what is nonsense about "attacking the Czechoslovak corps"? Enemies of the communists are constantly talking about such nonsense, as if they spend their whole life without regaining consciousness. Correctly, the communists did not give you freedom of speech, you YOURSELF proved that you are not worthy of it, as well as freedom of action, from which it was under the USSR, that after you captured the USSR there was only evil, harm, losses to the country and the people, and huge sacrifices of the people, and your eternal cowardly slogan "we have nothing to do with it, it's all the communists are to blame."

[XII legion]

I will not say anything about Krivosheev. Out of politeness.
But he is far from ideal. And, in turn, he brought you several credible sources at once. One Urlanis is worth it. Classic. Soviet way.
about this

ENOUGH to lie and talk nonsense. How can the Dissolution of the Constituent Assembly be the cause of the Civil War? And what is nonsense about "attacking the Czechoslovak corps"? Enemies of the communists are constantly talking about such nonsense, as if they spend their whole life without regaining consciousness. Correctly, the communists did not give you freedom of speech, you YOURSELF proved that you are not worthy of it, as well as freedom of action, from which it was under the USSR, that after you captured the USSR there was only evil, harm, losses to the country and the people, and huge sacrifices of the people, and your eternal cowardly slogan "we have nothing to do with it, it's all the communists are to blame."

I don’t even answer. this is beyond reality of a sober person.

[Moore]

Quote: XII Legion

The civil war that the Bolsheviks unleashed to destroy all opposition forces

Excuse me, who started the Civil War?

[XII legion]

In my opinion, I wrote everything clearly above

[Moore]

What you wrote, I see. Just amused your peremptory phrase.

[XII legion]

and how the categorical phrases of local "experts" amuse me.
not for long and learn)

[lwxx]

What does the armament and ammunition have to do with it) In 1916, in Russia there was order (well, maybe with the exception of heavy artillery) in Russia

https://topwar.ru/25350-patronnyy-golod-pervoy-mirovoy-oslabit-deficit-boepripasov-dlya-vintovok-udalos-lish-nakanune-revolyuciy.html С начала войны до 1 января 1917 года Российская армия получила 2 850 000 000 патронов от отечественных заводов и 1 078 000 000 – от зарубежных. Если заметно ослабить «винтовочный голод» удалось в начале 1916 года, то в целом снять вопрос о недостатке винтовок и патронов – только к 1917-му. Но для «военных успехов» было уже поздно, а вот для революции в самый раз.

[Trapperxnumx]

During Lend-Lease deliveries during the Second World War, up to 85% of all explosives and gunpowder was delivered to the USSR. But for some reason no one talks about this. The USSR, transferring the entire economy to a war footing, could not cope with the needs of the front.

[tatra]

Well, how much the enemies of the Communists in the USSR with their manic fix idea are eager to take the well-deserved Victory from their country and their people in order to give the victory to their beloved Americans.

[Alf]

Quote: Trapper7

During Lend-Lease deliveries during the Second World War, up to 85% of all explosives and gunpowder was delivered to the USSR.

Everything is exactly the opposite.

[Trapperxnumx]

Quote: Alf

Everything is exactly the opposite.

I apologize. Double-checked. Indeed, general data indicate 53% of supplies from production in the USSR. But still a lot.
(Maybe 85% reached in a certain year of the war, but now it's too lazy to search and double-check, sorry).

[Alf]

Quote: Trapper7

I apologize.

Everything is fine. +.

[naidas]

According to Lend-Lease deliveries, during the years of the Second World War, 257 buttons were delivered to the USSR, but for some reason no one talks about this. The USSR, transferring the entire economy to a war footing, could not cope with the needs of the front.

[Alber]

Quote: naidas

According to Lend-Lease deliveries, during the years of the Second World War, 257 buttons were delivered to the USSR, but for some reason no one talks about this. The USSR, transferring the entire economy to a war footing, could not cope with the needs of the front.

During the years of Gorbachev's "catastrophe", Yeltsinism and the subsequent reign, the country's industry was destroyed and destroyed.
I dare to suggest that in the case of "God forbid" we have not only buttons and laces, panties, spoons, not to mention ammunition. I am afraid that even simple matches will have nothing to produce - everything has been stolen. And no one is responsible for anything. Nichubais, nor ragozin.
"There will be no revision of the privatization results ..." thieves sleep peacefully
Srebrennikov was released, as were the other accomplices of the Itins, Apfelbaum and other similar

[Reptiloid]

Quote: XII legion

...... By the way, Dmitry, it would be worth sorting out -?

Whether I am this Dmitry or not, I could be mistaken ........
As I wrote earlier, in my opinion, we must wait for the development of the entire storyline. The picture of the world may be completely different.
For example, for several years, the author wrote and published articles about Geril. If you put them together, add some more, it turns out that there was an opportunity to expand the world socialist bloc in the 60s. For some reason, the Soviet Union did not take advantage of the situation then ... ???????? ... The author provided interesting material. It’s necessary to take a closer look at other storylines. (.. unfortunately I didn’t manage to read all of the author’s articles ...) Maybe we are talking about destructive changes in the leadership of the CPSU after Khrushchev?
And, perhaps, we will get the opportunity to find out who actually led when Brezhnev became ill, and how it was.

[XII legion]

Whether I am this Dmitry or not, I could be mistaken.

I wrote to Dmitry Trapper7, with all due respect

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

It would be worthwhile to figure out - who and whom in general betrayed here

propose that these Russian divisions betray Russia?

[XII legion]

No, the thought was like that. If you can read Russian.
these divisions, as well as the entire Russian army, were ultimately betrayed by the post-October government, which finally developed and disbanded the old army. It turned out to her, this power, not needed there and any divisions abroad

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

Interim government? Also no.

"The vehicles at our disposal would allow the 1st brigade to be put [on ships] starting from the first days of August. The departure of the 2nd brigade could be envisaged at the beginning of October" "(Georges Noulens," Memories of my mission in Russia ", 1917-1919", Paris, 1933). After the official request for the repatriation of the no longer needed by France and obviously drooping of the spirit of the Russian troops, the Provisional Government spent another three months pulling rubber. It was only on November 5 that it gave Paris the right to dispose of the servicemen of the Special Brigades at its own discretion, and then the order of the Minister of War Georges Clemenceau appeared, giving the Russian stateless persons the right to re-and now really voluntarily choose their fate. The choice was as follows: The first option - the Foreign Legion: again under bullets, the second: working companies in the rear of the army, if these two options are rejected, then the third is not discussed: to North Africa, to hard labor!

[XII legion]

The departure of the 2nd brigade could would be foreseen at the beginning of October"

later they were already needed by no one - the new government, for well-known reasons

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

later they were already needed by no one - the new government, for well-known reasons

a lie, because the interim government granted Paris the right, at its discretion, to dispose of Russian troops.
The Bolsheviks in 1920 pulled out of hard labor

[XII legion]

the interim government granted Paris the right, at its discretion, to dispose of Russian troops.

very interesting
Is it possible to find out the name of the document with the paragraph and article?

[naidas]

And in a weak look at the GA of the Russian Federation, or do everything small for you, your knowledge is already amazing, I hope to master it?

[XII legion]

my question is:

very interesting
Is it possible to find out the name of the document with the paragraph and become

answer naidas (naidas)

And in a weak look at the GA of the Russian Federation, or do everything small for you, your knowledge is already amazing, I hope to master it?

Conclusion: it means weak and your reasoning naidas (naidas) - TUFTA.

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

Conclusion: it means weak and your reasoning XII legion (Caesar) - TUFTA.

Quote: XII legion

Uh-huh.
Every family has its black sheep. You will find 2-3 people everywhere.
Battering ... It was an illegal affair. And for a long time. And eradicated by and large. Both documents and memories speak of this.

Well, where are the documents?

Quote: XII Legion

And they are not, these examples

But in response there are riots, shots in the back of officers, desertion.

[XII legion]

Yes, where are the documents confirming your fabrication? Not fantasy in books, but documents?

[naidas]

on the body to the memoirs of the participant Lisovenko Dmitry Ulyanovich
They wanted to deprive them of their homeland, there at the end of the link to the military archive
according to deserters — those whom you sent to pass the USE — there is a historian, general, minister of the Provisional Government.
according to the soldiers' letters -GA of the Russian Federation
according to how the Provisional Government abandoned the corps - Mr. Noulensa "Memories of my mission in Russia" in the Military History Journal 2001. №4.
General Yuri Danilov has little relation between officers and soldiers, and although he is on the other side, he calls your legal relationship unfair persecution or an accident (episode with Krause).
What about you?

[XII legion]

I've told -

Not fantasy in books, but documents?

I thought that you would send to what is on the Internet.
Lisovenko ... He meant it. What's the deserters archive there?))
Okay, everything is clear with you. The topic is exhausted.
From sound literature
Read the Russian troops on the French and Macedonian fronts of Danilov.
As well as the monograph of Doctor of Historical Sciences Pavlova.
Yes, there are documents - but not in books)) And don't talk about criminal liability "for letters", "thoughts" - it's high time to stop believing in fairy tales

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

I said - Not fantasies in books, but documents?

Well, where are the documents? Chatterbox! Danilov writes practically about the course of hostilities, however, if Lisovenko has links to the military archive, then Danilov hasn't found any links to military orders or documents in the newspaper’s text. .Nonetheless:
-Only the extreme financial and material dependence of Russia on France, as well as the sincere desire to provide the latter with all possible assistance and maintain good relations, made General Alekseev recognize the possibility of making the experience of forming and sending to the French front.
-Approximately it was planned, therefore, to send in 1916 up to 1500 officers and up to 80 thousand soldiers.
-About the letters you lied on Danilov:
Of course, along with such correspondence, probably, another series of correspondents was carried out and the propaganda of our military contingents was taking advantage of their unbalanced state of mind.
-My opinion is that the author exaggerated the influence of the Bolsheviks before the revolution: -very similar to your nonsense:
-Page 91 — the Bolsheviks’ agitation in the spring of 1917, and even before the description of the February Revolution on page 97
-127str-we were led to the slaughter- the opinion of soldiers in hospitals
-129str the answer that revolution soldier influenced the mood (and Danilov spat on your opinion with agitators and newspapers). (At the end of the book Danilov writes, they started to divide the land without them).
-135str demands of the Kurtinsky camp in Russia and to fight on the Russian fronts — and for this they were announced by the rebels? After the suppression, the command itself took the position of withdrawing to Russia.
-136str-Tereshchenko about the death penalty for rebels to General Zankevich-as a fee for the desire to return to Russia. (Again Danilov spit on you with care from the Provisional Government)
- 140 pages events about the rebels in the archives of France are not found, like almost everything about the attitude of soldiers and officers.
213str 3272 a man of 4 thousand (rebels) volunteered for Africa (Danilov again spat on you, showing the attitude of the soldiers towards the officers, preferring Algeria to serving officers).
-214 pp. distribution table - fought at the front at 6.01 1918 -252 people from 19 thousand.
-216-217str Balkans –– fight 556, 12,5 thousand to Africa, out of 13,5 thousand –– Danilov spat on you with your statutory relations.
-225 pp. — Complaints about the failure to receive letters for several months — delivery in August 1918 (they had eaten before this letter from relatives with a description of the events — again you are in a puddle with your newspapers)
-237str-letter from the officer June 1917 -With regard to the mood of officers and soldiers, we consider ourselves sentenced, without any hope of returning back to Russia whole.
In short, the talker, I practically agree with Danilov (except for p. 91), mostly repeating Lisovenko without details.

[XII legion]

But who of us is a talker ??
Well, I just wrote - that the documents are not in books.
and you all chat and post books ...
I did not see a single discovery in your post - well-known facts.
But don't tell anyone about criminal punishments naidas (naidas) for "letters, thoughts", this is a kindergarten and old soviet propaganda.
Brigades fought well? Yes sir. After the rebellion, the contingent is divided into 3 parts. Of course. And to each - his own. No need to rebel during the war. But the reason is not thoughts, spanking or spitting, but a rebellion. The French in this sense defended their rear, and even in difficult times.
Both I and Danilov do not care - what does the illiterate talker naidas (naidas) agree with

[naidas]

Unlike the talker, who

Quote: XII Legion

Read the Russian troops on the French and Macedonian fronts of Danilov. As well as the monograph of Doctor of Historical Sciences Pavlova.

I agree in almost everything with these authors, they seem to be with my sources. And Danilov repeats, like others, that he raves and did not master both them and the article.
Yes, if there are documents, why bite your tongue, show if you are not chatting simply.

[XII legion]

I'm glad you agree. but we were talking about something else, do not distort.
And my advice: don't talk about what you don't understand. When you were making noises about rebel sufferers who were prosecuted for "feelings and thoughts", I asked you to analyze the difference between administrative, criminal, and disciplinary liability. You ignored my request. For at once all the nonsense of propaganda will come to light in the books of the Lissovenko style (in terms of the related politics).
Why should you do yours? Sob further on excitedly about those held criminally responsible for feelings and thoughts, and leave me alone

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

but we previously talked about something else, do not distort. And my advice: do not talk about what you do not understand

I’ll remind you of the relations between officers and soldiers, my source tells in detail on examples, yours notes how sad it is. For your feelings, you washed your thoughts.

Quote: XII Legion

I asked you to analyze the difference between administrative, criminal and disciplinary liability.

This is when, remind your post? The conversation was that the rebellion, strikes, desertions and shooting at officers didn’t arise from scratch (as you said there was no assault), throw off your couch delirium on agitators, as eyewitnesses confirm in their memoirs .That the problem was noted and those whom you sent to pass the exam. Documents to give you poorly, one chatter, as I understand, apart from the chatter that was not confirmed by documents, by any recollections of eyewitnesses, or by knowledge of history, you can stop the discussion, squeeze at least some then historical facts, it doesn’t work out of you.

[XII legion]

No, you previously wrote that people were brought to criminal responsibility "for feelings, thoughts." And I have asked you many times to distinguish between types of responsibility - see above.
Do not get out.
Better to school - take the exam in law. But I do not need to squeeze anything out of me, and so I spend a lot of time on you. And who would blame me for the lack of knowledge. You are a fan of attributing your own vices to others, which is already there)

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

Monograph by Doctor of History Pavlova.

may candidate of historical sciences Pavlov A.Yu. The Russian expeditionary force in Thessaloniki, even until 1917 there was no mention of the Bolsheviks’ agitation, the historian did.
But the lieutenant colonel Krause, suspected of treason, was killed. (Third version, an accident at Danilov, Makarov). After the investigation, 26 soldiers and non-commissioned officers were put on trial, 8 of them were shot.

[XII legion]

and then there you hang noodles about Lisoveko’s archive ...

the lieutenant colonel Krause, suspected of treason, was killed. (third version, an accident at Danilov, Makarov). After the investigation, 26 soldiers and non-commissioned officers were put on trial, 8 of them were shot.

Well, what's the discovery? such facts are complete in all armies. but there is no that fantastic massacre, inflated later, and thousands of those executed "for feelings, thoughts"

[Trapperxnumx]

Quote: XII Legion

By the way, Dmitry, it would be worthwhile to figure out who and whom in general betrayed here.

I agree with your assessment and your findings. Thank.

[ecolog]

And how did agitators and even more newspapers leak into France?

[XII legion]

Firstly, with replenishment arriving from Russia;
Secondly, in France there are a lot of branches of different parties, and ours too. Paradise for agitators)

[ecolog]

Firstly, where did the royal SMERSH look then? Did not see who they are sending? Or maybe there were no others.?
Secondly, in your opinion, were the soldiers of Ingushetia in France something like tourists? I went on leave to Paris, dropped in to see the local communists. I spoke to them in Voltaire's language, read L'Humanité. (illiterate peasant for a second)
As for me - everything is much simpler. They threw off the tsar (liberals, bourgeoisie, generals, czar’s relatives - not Bolsheviks or even social democrats). The ruling circles perceived February in their own way, and the workers and peasants in their own way, and wanted different things. Newcomers broadcast news from their homeland. Peasants, and so do not really understand what they are fighting for (hello to the work with the staff that the government has loved) wanted only one thing - to go home and share the land.
It’s stupid to blame everything on mythical agitators. I do not understand this power of the Bolshevik agitators. There were 20 batch of active bayonets there. Leadership is all on the run-emigrations. How could they take and decompose a multimillion army like this? Again, there are Duma parties, they have legal media. Well, so agitate the soldiers, explain to them why you think they are fighting, conduct events, educational work. Why were the Bolsheviks in the Second World War able to convey to the population the need to stand to death, but their nobleness?

[XII legion]

Are you fooling your head with your sofa fabrications ???
I tell you how it was, as noted in sources and literature:
a) arriving from Russia (and it was 17 years old) brought newspapers and moods with them. They knew how to read soldiers, who would not later insinuate.
b) soldiers were treated by agitators who swarmed at the locations of the Special Brigades (immediately after the withdrawal after the advance of Nivelles). Agitators of all parties (both the Socialist Revolutionaries, the Mensheviks, and the Bolsheviks) worked together for a common result - the collapse of the army.
Chatter that let mushrooms grow in your mouth - keep it to yourself. This is not interesting to me.

[XII legion]

off-topic, but just explain to you ecolog (Oleg), if you yourself do not know
from your statements

Firstly, where did the royal SMERSH look then

Yes, there was no SMERSHA, that is the point. There was no capable ideological and repressive apparatus.
And ... Do you know what we are talking about the 17th year? What else is royal?

It’s stupid to blame everything on mythical agitators. I do not understand this power of the Bolshevik agitators. There were 20 batch of active bayonets there. Leadership is all on the run-emigrations. How could they take and decompose a multimillion army like this?

You forget the 3 most important circumstances:
1) The Provisional Government itself corrupted the army — purposefully and systematically;
2) ALL parties acted in this direction, and not only the Bolsheviks, who were then insignificant, this is true;
3) after the introduction of committees and elective principles in the army, it is less and less like an army.

Again, there are Duma parties, they have legal media. Well, so agitate the soldiers, explain to them why you think they are fighting, conduct events, educational work.

here they were doing it - for a united and capable army (remember 1905) was dangerous for them.

Why did the Bolsheviks in the Second World War were able to convey to the population the need to stand to death

because a totalitarian state with a powerful propaganda apparatus was created

are they noble?

firstly, their nobility was brought up so that the officer is out of politics
and secondly, in 17 year there were no nobility - neither legally (the title was changed to "lord" with an indication of the rank) or in fact (the overwhelming majority of officers are former warrant officers, not much different from soldiers).

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

1) The Provisional Government itself corrupted the army — purposefully and systematically; 2) ALL parties acted in this direction, and not only the Bolsheviks, who were then insignificant, this is true; 3) after the introduction of committees and elective principles in the army, it is less and less like an army.

Do you blame the Provisional Government for anti-state activities?

[XII legion]

you accuse the Provisional Government of anti-state activities

is not it so? In fact?

[naidas]

Then you are a Bolshevik, and as a Bolshevik, you must welcome the BOP and restore order in the country after the Civil.

[XII legion]

And what, dislike for the Provisional Government means belonging to the Bolsheviks?
Deep conclusion))

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

And what, dislike for the Provisional Government means belonging to the Bolsheviks?

Actually, something about the love of the Bolsheviks is your speculation. I wonder where the XII legion raves, and where not?

Quote: XII Legion

By the way, Dmitry, it would be worthwhile to figure out who and whom in general betrayed here. In particular, who allegedly betrayed these 2 brigades (later a division) in France. An interim government? Also no. By the way, the replenishment and the material part continued tossing throughout 1917.

Quote: XII Legion

1) The Provisional Government itself corrupted the army — purposefully and systematically;

[XII legion]

Well, you constantly rave))
There are no questions)))

[ecolog]

it is precisely that there was nothing really competent. No propaganda, no police, no understanding of what is happening.
King 1st quarter of the 17th still type of rule
Why temporarily decompose the army, if they are for the war to a victorious end?
Cadets, Octobrists, monarchists also decomposed?
committees - yes, not about the army.
Well, the army is outside politics, what did it interfere with the Duma parties? Moreover, the people with a serious schucher crush except the army, in fact, was no one.
And RI was which state, not totalitarian? It’s a paradox, but for the Constitution and the Duma, we must thank those who stood on the barricades in 1905.
The officer in 1917 was certainly not the same (like the soldier), but still, for the most part, he was not a peasant from the backwoods and was more educated.
Officers before the war were out of politics. In 1917, they nevertheless engaged in it, taking an active part in the abdication of the king. But the politicians from them were actually none, so they lost the GV.

[Alex t]

"... the soldiers knew how to read, whoever insinuates what later" -
These are your bold conjectures. Literacy in Central Asia is not a secret. Probably only the Turks were worse.

"... Agitators of all parties (both Socialist-Revolutionaries, and Mensheviks, and Bolsheviks) worked together for a common result - the collapse of the army" -
Nobody did more for the collapse of the army than General Alekseev, General Alekseev, and Nikolai 2 himself ("... surrendered as a squadron ...")
No need to blame from a sore head for a healthy one. The Bolsheviks pulled the people out of nobody unnecessary war. The main losses in the civil war were not from hostilities, but from illness and hunger.
You have provided interesting material, but your speculation is forced to minus.

[XII legion]

they knew how to read soldiers, whoever insinuates what later "-
These are your bold conjectures. Literacy in Central Asia is not a secret. Probably only the Turks were worse.

"... Agitators of all parties (both Socialist-Revolutionaries, and Mensheviks, and Bolsheviks) worked together for a common result - the collapse of the army" -
Nobody did more for the collapse of the army than General Alekseev, General Alekseev, and Nikolai 2 himself ("... surrendered as a squadron ...")
No need to blame from a sore head for a healthy one. The Bolsheviks pulled the people out of nobody unnecessary war. The main losses in the civil war were not from hostilities, but from illness and hunger.
You have provided interesting material, but your speculation is forced to minus

Speculation? On the contrary - I see a flurry of empty irresponsible talkers. Look who's Talking...
Here you are, for example.
First question. Do you own a topic at all? You know that in the regiments there were training teams in which soldiers were taught literacy, literature, and so on.
Photos do not want to see those years - where Russian WWII soldiers read newspapers and write letters?
Second question. What material did I provide you ??)

[XII legion]

therefore minus you Alex T (Alex)

[Alex t]

Oops ... Sorry. The material is to the author of the article.
Well, all you have to do is to refute the Wikipedia data (link to the VIZH) that after mass conscription into the army during the PMA, more than 60% of Russian soldiers were illiterate or semi-literate. That is, the newspaper could be read in syllables for only a few days at best.
Your arguments with photos are of course very strong. When you rule Vika, be sure to refer to them.

[XII legion]

after a mass draft in the army

firstly, after the draft, and secondly, regimental training teams, naturally, during the war could not function as in peacetime. But the fact was the place to be. In peacetime, soldiers returned from the army literate, they knew how to read and write.
And about the numbers in the VIZH and Wiki - you do not worry))

Your arguments with photos are of course very strong

Nonetheless. Plus memoirs plus documents with references to soldiers reading leaflets and newspapers
Well, as part of the argument that I hear here - this is a normal argument, with photos)

[XII legion]

wiki I don't rule, I have nothing more to do

[Alex t]

Yes, in peacetime, much has been done to improve literacy in Central Asia. And the same dynamics of literacy growth in Central Asia looks very good, if it corresponds to reality, of course. But at the start of WWI it was necessary "yesterday". The army is what it really is, only after mobilization. Until now, this is a half-hearted mechanism, and it is very bold and in fact incorrect to judge the real level of literacy by it.
I, too, can find a bunch of photos of the Red Army or even the SA, where an officer reads newspapers to fighters sitting in a heap. But if, against the background of these photos, I conclude that the army is completely illiterate, then this will be fundamentally wrong.

[naidas]

Quote: ecolog

And how did agitators leak into France

Newspapers are unlikely, rather letters. And about the agitators it’s clear that the soldiers were beaten, fired upon, and then simply not fed.

[XII legion]

Newspapers are unlikely, rather letters.

how do you know, served in special brigades?)))
No, it is newspapers. Which local agitators handed out to the soldiers and brought with them new arrivals.

soldiers were beaten, fired, and then they simply did not feed.

Raikin is resting))) anyway that blurt out. Already in this as you say - pretension

[naidas]

Fully sharing the views of the chief of the brigade, General Lokhvitsky on the essence of military discipline, most of the officers of the brigade continued to engage in assault here in France. The brigade officers could stop on the street of the French town a Russian soldier who was fired on vacation, and, finding any defect in his uniform or a slight lapse in behavior, he would deal with him in the most inappropriate manner. Often these wild scenes provoked open indignation of French citizens, and they resolutely spoke out in defense of the Russian soldier, indicating to the officer the unworthiness of his act. But this did not always act soberingly upon the officer who had entered the rage. There were even cases when a Russian officer attacked a Frenchman who tried to defend a Russian soldier with a hail of abuse and threats, completely forgetting that he was in a foreign country, and not in the royal barracks.
Such scenes greatly embittered the brigade soldiers. Here in France, where they, as their officers told them about, represented a great power - Russia and its army - the lawlessness of a soldier and the cruelty of an officer were felt with special force.
And here are a couple of examples:
1. In the camp near Marseilles, Lieutenant Colonel Mauritius Krause was killed.
The soldiers had been boiling for a long time: this officer stood out on the part of the assault, but when he started to hit the face directly on the parade ground with a bamboo whip, they could not stand it. 26 soldiers and non-commissioned officers appeared before a military court, 8 were shot the next day.
2. The company commander, Captain Schmidt, who was distinguished by particular cruelty, during the day bypassing the trenches, perpetrated reprisals against the soldiers ... The noise attracted the attention of the Germans. They opened indiscriminate rifle fire. The same unorganized return fire followed from the Russian trenches. In the ensuing firefight, Schmidt was seriously wounded by a stray bullet. From which side this bullet came, it remains unknown "

[XII legion]

Uh-huh.
Every family has its black sheep. You will find 2-3 people everywhere. And what document are you referring to? Bamboo whip, it’s necessary to come up with this.
Battering ... It was an illegal affair. And for a long time. And eradicated by and large. Both documents and memories speak of this.
By the way.
And I have a letter where the Red Army writes in 1921 - mother, what a terrible assault. That's what was not in the old army and what you have to endure now)
It happens that is already here)

[XII legion]

I don’t know who these brigades are devoted to. Well, what slanders are a hundred pounds

[naidas]

But, alas, the lower ranks did not know how to evaluate these efforts. It just seemed to them that they went to hell. The enforcement, which, in principle, was based on sound legal considerations, in the form in which it reached the soldiers, in their eyes was just a sadistic mockery. Criminal punishments for the simple manifestation of emotions, for expressing neutral opinions before the boss, for trying to hide behind when you are being beaten (illegally beaten!) Were all at odds with the common man's idea of ​​the rational structure of the community of people and basic justice.
Simple questions from the boss - like "did you like cabbage soup?" - caused horror in the soldier; he suspected (not without reason) that for an answer like "cabbage soup is too salty" he might end up in jail. Soldiers who did not adapt well to army life often panicked so much that they simply did not answer any questions from senior officers (by the way, they could end up in solitary confinement for this too) or uselessly babbled "I'm glad to try, Your Honor."

[XII legion]

You post it here
Do you even know what CRIMINAL punishments are?
And how do they differ from DISCIPLINARY and ADMINISTRATIVE ??

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

You post it here

And let's give 2-3 examples, otherwise I will give you examples, and you will chatter in response.

[XII legion]

I have not seen a single example
on the contrary - one chatter. You see that you are grinding? Criminal punishments ...
Once again I ask - do you know what it is? Who is appointed, what is the severity, huh?

[naidas]

Examples from my side: Krause, Company Commander Captain Schmidt, Lieutenant Colonel Gotua, who was reputed to be the "first fighter" of the division.

Quote: XII Legion

I have not seen a single example on the contrary - just a chatter. You see that you are grinding? Criminal punishments.

Where are the examples of criminal punishment of officers for assault?

[XII legion]

And they are not, these examples
Because the CRIMINAL punishment is not appointed for mythical assault and all the more not for conversations, as you deigned to note, but FOR CRIMES - that is, for especially grave and criminally punishable acts and only by the court.
You didn’t even understand what I asked, what’s on the forehead and what's on the forehead.
I meant that this is yours

criminal penalties for the simple manifestation of emotions, for expressing neutral opinions in front of the boss, for trying to hide behind

called noodles for inexperienced people

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

Because the CRIMINAL punishment is not appointed for mythical assault and all the more not for talking, as you deigned to note, but FOR CRIMES - that is, for especially grave and criminally punishable acts and only by the court

Well then, it’s understandable for you to beat with bamboo whip in your face, just beat you (like a soldier), do not feed you (like a soldier) according to the law!
from soldiers letters. - We stand in the trenches. Cold, dirt, parasites bite, eat once a day at 10 pm, and then the lentils are black that the pig will not eat. You can die of hunger just like that ... "
“The soldier’s face seems to be a tambourine: the louder the beat, the merrier the heart”, soldiers said with wicked irony about the fighting in the army.
“The farther one lives, the worse. Our superiors are strangling us, squeezing the last blood, which is very little left. You will not wait for this time, when all this comes to an end ... "
“Dear mother, it would be better if you had not given birth to me, it would have been better if you drowned me in water, so I’m suffering now”
L. Voitolovsky, who observed the life of the army, recorded a soldier’s song: “Oh, will I go, orphan, With grief in the dark forest. I’ll go into the dark forest with a rifle. I’ll go hunting myself, I’ll do three troubles: Already as the first trouble - I will lead the Commander. And the second trouble - I'll bring a rifle. I’m the third trouble - I’ll get right into my heart. You, rassukin son, boss, Damn you!
They preferred a half-starved life of a deserter at the front, for whom the field gendarmes hunted as if they were for the STAR rem. In 1916, the Russian army numbered more than one and a half million deserters.

[XII legion]

naidas (naidas) You first decide on the concepts.
What is
CRIMINAL
ADMINISTRATIVE
DISCIPLINARY
offenses.
No one CRIMINAL punishment for thoughts or spanking does not appoint, you are our diplomas.
And then we continue. Because with people who do not understand the essence of the issue, what can I talk about.
And continue your tearful posts further - mourning the mythically devoted divisions. If they were betrayed by anyone, it was the Soviet government, which abandoned the entire old army and its inheritance. Under the old regime, these brigades fought well and were supplied.
The temporary workers and their successors turned the combat units into an armed crowd of rebels, and then composed a beautiful fairy tale - about unfortunate sufferers abandoned by someone. And they threw them themselves.
Good luck in the further cry of Yaroslavna naidas (naidas)

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

And continue your tearful posts further - mourning the mythically devoted divisions.

Yes, of course, the rebellion described in the article according to your myth, as well as the description of eyewitnesses, it is time for you to submit a Nobel Prize for history.

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

Because CRIMINAL punishment is not imposed for mythical assault, much less for talk,

Well, that's why they shot at the officers, went on strike, and then supported not your speculation and parallel history, but the Bolsheviks and the result, such as you got in full and were thrown out of Russia.
And with the stories you have a problem, you do not care about the notes of eyewitnesses, the riots, the million-strong army of deserters fleeing your legitimacy.
And there is nothing to translate the arrows, it’s weak for you to cite even one case of officers ’responsibility for stealing, when around there are protesting examples of soldiers against officers. Consider some already spat on the Russian people and drowned, it will also be with people like you.

[XII legion]

This is not my parallel story.
You’re an ignoramus, I’m sorry. Where only a million deserters counted.
Go take your exam and do not drown yourself))

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

You’re an ignoramus, I’m sorry. Where only a million deserters were counted. Go take your exam and do not drown yourself))

This is for you to Golovin N.N., Sukhanov N.N., Guchkov A.I., Rodzianko M.V. etc.
the truth is you are lucky that these eyewitnesses died, leaving behind letters and memoirs.
Yeah, with the stories you have not really.

[XII legion]

One unsubstantiated chatter from you. Surnames somewhere heard and clever.
But still it’s not a ride.
I will give you, in response to your lie about a million deserters (as, in principle, criminal penalties for spitting and the rest of the noodles), the data from the master of Soviet military-historical science Kavtoradze. He writes that from the beginning of the war until the February Revolution, the total number of deserters was 195 thousand people.
But in the post-revolutionary period - from March to August 1917, the number of deserters increased five times, and in the period from June 15 - July 1 - six times.
so go nibble on the granite of science and don't spit on the Russian imperial army

[naidas]

Quote: XII Legion

One unsubstantiated chatter from you. Surnames somewhere heard and clever. But after all, it still doesn’t.

Quote: XII Legion

But in the post-revolutionary period - from March to August 1917, the number of deserters increased five times, and in the period from June 15 - July 1 - six times.

But you did not master the article, there from 1914 until 1917.

[XII legion]

I mastered everything. and books and articles
And I point you to your untruth - and a lie with numbers

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: naidas

they simply did not answer any questions from the senior officers (by the way, one could end up in solitary confinement for that too), or uselessly babbled "glad to try, Your Honor."

Pikul wrote something similar:

I first caught a glimpse of Samsonov when he became acquainted with the replenishment of new recruits who had just arrived in his army, still bewildered by the non-commissioned officers, fooled naked. Impressively rising above the young, Samson Samsonych decided to conduct a survey of complaints and complaints:

“Do junior officers offend you?”

“No way ... glad to try.”

“Did you get your three pounds of bread a day?”

“Received, Your Excellency.”

- Did you get footcloths with sugar?

- Received ...

And no matter what Samsonov asked them, the answer followed everything: they received. Finally, the general suspected the evil:

- Maybe pineapples also gave you?

“They did,” recruits said joyfully.

“And eel with crouton moelle sauce?”

- Received ...

- You are all fools, your mother is like that! - Samsonov said clearly and, stumbling, went to his car ...

[naidas]

Well, the rebellion on Potemkin also began -beat while they could.

[Mordvin 3]

From there. I like "I have the honor" all the same.

We left the table and, fastening our arms, went to Neidenburg Square ... Before us were rolling ambulances, soldiers without caps, others stomped barefoot, throwing boots over his shoulder, a rare soldier dragged a rifle on him. The sight of the people was almost terrible; covered with scabs of dust and dirt, in bloody scabs, exhausted ...

Samsonov imperiously called one of them:

“Hey ... tramp!” Why are you here?

- And where are we supposed to be? - the soldier answered him. - Five Danes are not grubs, and - held on ... But with what? How to fight? - "Tramp" furiously pulled the rifle shutter, but not a single sleeve popped out of an empty clip. “That's how they fought ... until the last bullet,” the soldier said with deep anguish. - Now everything is over ... amba to everyone! Because I'm here, not there ...

Samsonov did not crack the soldier in the ear. Samsonov did not cover him with obscenities. Samsonov did not order the soldier to go back:

“Go, brother, where are your legs dragging ... God be with you!”

[XII legion]

This is how the warrant officers of yesterday behave in 1917 ?? Wow)))
And they are even called their nobility, despite the fact that the title is canceled? Wow)))
Well, they found the source - Pikul ...
Samsonov mentioned in the post - is this the author from Military Review?)

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: XII Legion

Samsonov mentioned in the post - is this the author from Military Review?)

Well, if you have not heard about General Samsonov, then there’s nothing to talk about.

[XII legion]

And what does it have to do with the events of the article - 1917 in France?))
Has he been dead for 3 years already?)))
Circus, and only

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: XII Legion

And what does it have to do with the events of the article - 1917 in France?))

Yes, such that this is all - the First World War. At Pikul and about our case is described.

Soon, the Special Russian Infantry Brigade arrived at the front, already fired upon in the battles for France, where it glorified itself as reckless courage and bloody riots.

- And who is against us? - they asked. - Nemaki al austrians?

“The Bulgarian army,” I answered with shame.

Having learned about this, our people did not think for a long time: they hung a towel on the bayonet and waved it over the trench, shouting towards the enemy:

- Hey, bros are damned! Why the hell did you sell to nemaks, like all of you? Ali, didn’t we shed blood for you in buckets? My grandfather is still creeping on pieces of wood, but for you, you bastards, getting freedom from a Turk ...

On the part of the "bros" was heard - the answer:

- Stop barking! Are we going to fight against you? Yes, they sent us like cattle for pasture ... and here is rotting here ...

The French and the British tried to sit out in the rear, did not forget to shave in the city's hairdressers in the morning, in the evenings all the cafes and restaurants were occupied by them, and the front was kept by the same unfortunate Serbs and Russians and, in addition to them, still black as boots, Senegalese and troops from Morocco

[XII legion]

He probably was there, Pikul, even if I heard private conversations))

[fuxila]

Communists constantly write about the problem of assault in the tsarist army. The phenomenon is certainly shameful, but we must not forget that the society itself at that time was completely different, firstly, it was a class, and secondly, then the peasants did not disdain to converge village to village and stuff each other in the face, I know this from my grandfather, who still remembered the Civil ... You'd better explain why the soldiers were beaten by Soviet officers, I myself once came to the unit to my older brother, when he served his first year, so when I told him and his colleagues that I wanted to enter a military school, the words flew swearing, they did not call the officers anything but jackals, which shocked me, because I had an idea about the army only on the programs "I Serve the Soviet Union."

[Trapperxnumx]

The article is a complete lie from Soviet propaganda, I simply have no other words.
1. The French in WWI did not differ in high morale? hahaha, just in WWI, the French showed themselves perfectly!
2. Traded the lives of soldiers for loans? And so instead of 400 thousand sent to France ... 20 thousand!
3. The rebellion of our soldiers in France is connected not with the French command, but with the February revolution in Russia, and it is to them, our liberals, and thanks for the collapse of the army and the lost war. And by the way, the rebellion was suppressed by our own units, which preserved the conscience and the concept of honor and military duty, among which, by the way, was Malinovsky, for some reason the author does not write about him in a derogatory tone.
In general, as always, the next set of stamps and dirt on the history of their own country. Abomination.

[Major48]

I agree, this is another set of cliches and factual errors, because even in a superficial sketch one should know the facts that have long been known and published by more competent authors. So, R. Malinovsky did not enroll in the French Foreign Legion. He served in the Russian Legion of Honor, included by the command in the Moroccan division of the Foreign Legion.

[naidas]

1. The spirit was, the weapons were lagging. Article on VO January 30, 2016
2. Until the middle of October 1916 they sent, if the king lasted longer, there would have been more.
3. The article says it was suppressed by our artillery.

[Aviator_]

It is worth adding that not only Russian troops fought on the Western Front, but also troops from Senegal (at that time - the French colony). So the gentlemen from Paris put Russia on a par with their colony.

[Major48]

Colleague, soldiers from all French colonies fought in the French army, even Vietnamese. Read, the Vietnamese even participated in the intervention in Siberia. And the Vietnamese sailors in 1919 rebelled in Sevastopol.

[XII legion]

I add that the Moroccan division, which included the Legion of Honor, was an elite front-line formation of the PMV. This is the shock division, almost the best at that time in the French army. Akin to the British corps of the British.
And the inclusion of the Legion of Honor in it is, in general, the recognition of the fighting qualities of the Russian contingent. Excellent shock formation, albeit small in number.

[naidas]

Quote: Major48

And the Vietnamese sailors in 1919 rebelled in Sevastopol.

Andre Marty, Sh. Tiyon, L.F. Badin-participants in the riot, with the Vietnamese is somehow controversial.
Modern scholars question the story of Ton Duc Thang's participation in the Black Sea rebellion, but they note the significant role of this legend in Vietnamese historiography and propaganda.

[Trapperxnumx]

Quote: Aviator_

It is worth adding that not only Russian troops fought on the Western Front, but also troops from Senegal (at that time - the French colony). So the gentlemen from Paris put Russia on a par with their colony.

And the French themselves, the British and the Americans themselves fought on the Western Front, so it’s entirely colonial troops, I agree.

[Normal ok]

Quote: Aviator_

It is worth adding that not only Russian troops fought on the Western Front, but also troops from Senegal (at that time - the French colony). So the gentlemen from Paris put Russia on a par with their colony.

In other words, for you the Senegalese are second-rate people compared to Russians ?!
PySy. The French honored those who fought honestly, and not on a national basis.

[Aviator_]

Well, yes, I honestly fought for the French loans that RI grabbed before the WWII.

[fuxila]

Yes, and also the British, Belgians and Americans, whom the gentlemen from Paris also apparently considered their colonies.

[BAI]

The tsarist government, for which the common people have always been consumables,

Well, this statement is quite controversial. The Duma was going to create a special commission to investigate the causes of the high losses of the Russian army in WWI. That is why the General Staff understated irretrievable losses, increasing the number of missing persons. But the Duma did not have time - a revolution.

[tatra]

And the enemies of the communists who seized the USSR are all the same. For the sake of PROFIT - to justify their crimes and their capture of the USSR, they are trying more - more, to throw the dead Soviet people into the Great Patriotic War, in order to dump all of them into "victims of Stalin", expose Hitler and the Nazis, like themselves "in nothing not guilty ", and if we are talking about Nicholas II, praised by them for the sake of creating an anti-Soviet myth," as before the communists everything was wonderful ", then they are trying in every possible way to underestimate the number of Russian citizens who died in the First World War.

[Fevralsk. Morev]

Great article. The author is a plus. I read the book "Fifty Years in the Ranks" by the Soviet Count Ignatiev. During WWI, he was a military attache in Paris and met special brigades. It was especially memorable that for the Russian brigades the French translated and published the combat manuals in Russian, which were changed taking into account the combat experience. What was not in Russia. Surprisingly, the article does not contain a single tear for the "innocently murdered" Nikolai 2 others, who crunched a French bun on a delightful evening in Russia. The author is great.

[Trapperxnumx]

The author wrote a lie almost from the first to the last word, if you like to read such articles - your will. But for me it is so necessary to know how it was, and not how you want.

[Ryazan87]

kt were changed taking into account the experience of fighting. What was not in Russia.

Corrected on 01.08.1914/XNUMX/XNUMX

Corrected on 01.11.1914/XNUMX/XNUMX

Corrected on 01.08.1915/XNUMX/XNUMX
There was much more that was interesting (for machine gun teams, for the use of chemical shells, etc.)
Here specifically for privates:

R.S. try reading something other than Ignatieff.

[Trapperxnumx]

What most revolts me in such materials is that they are written mainly on Soviet patterns. Moreover, without denying the great achievements of the USSR, I still want to recall that
1. The war was fought by Russia against the aggressor country
2. Almost the whole country took part in this war, millions of people went through the active army, colossal sacrifices were made - for the sake of victory! And all this was not just flushed down the toilet by those people who shouted "let's turn the imperialist into a civilian one", but they also tried to erase the very memory of ordinary soldiers so much that for us it is still the most unknown war, although only 100 years. Yes, we know more about the Russian-Japanese than about the PMA. And after that there are articles of this kind that continue to write all sorts of nonsense and shed tears about "abandoned to the mercy of fate." Abandoned by whom, I hesitate to ask? Is it not the Bolshevik government that came to power?

[Lucky_bard]

No need to argue with the Soviet - a deliberate lie should not be put on a par with the truth.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Trapper7

And all this was not just flushed down the toilet by those people who shouted "let's turn the imperialist into a civil one"

No. The war was flushed into the toilet by noble gentlemen in expensive jackets and award-winning uniforms. Moreover, one of the most active supporters of the collapse of the army even managed to become prime minister renewed Russia.

[Trapperxnumx]

These people did everything for Russia to lose the war. I agree completely. But unfortunately, and it is to my great regret, the subsequently coming Bolshevik government put an end to that war.
Although I understand the mood of ordinary soldiers at that time. Fatigue and hopelessness were such that we cannot even remotely imagine this. But still bitter. After all, so many millions lost their lives and health for the sake of victory, and here it is, the victory is in the hands. There was no need to even advance. Just sit in the trenches, wait. But but but...

[naidas]

1. In February 1914, the Russian Council of Ministers held a meeting to discuss the prospects for the conquest of Constantinople and the Straits, and came to the conclusion that the most favorable opportunity would arise in the context of the pan-European war. In April 1914, Nicholas II approved the recommendations of his cabinet and instructed the government to take all necessary measures to capture Constantinople and the Straits as soon as possible.
2. XII legion (Caesar) Today, 20: 13-answered the Provisional Government decomposed the army, the Bolsheviks could not because of their small numbers.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Trapper7

1. The war was fought by Russia against the aggressor country

Yeah, you still say that nemchura first border crossed.

Quote: Trapper7

for us it is now the most unknown war, although only 100 years have passed.

Lies. Who is interested, he knows.

Quote: Trapper7

Yes, we know more about Russian-Japanese than about WWI.

No need to speak for everyone. Ask the youth, you will be surprised at the result. It would not have turned out that Zhukov and Nevsky fought against the Khan Mamaia, and Suvorov beat the Swedes near Poltava.

[Trapperxnumx]

Yeah, you still say that nemchura first border crossed.

I will probably surprise you, but YES! On 2 on August, German troops occupied the city of Kalisz, which belonged to the Russian Empire. 3 August Germans occupied Czestochowa. Let me remind you that the East Prussian operation began on August 4. So they declared war and it was the German army that crossed the border first.
By the way, you can read about Kalish, you will learn a lot for yourself. Especially about the pogroms of civilians - a great rehearsal of the Great Patriotic War, in terms of hatred of the Slavs. Well, this is the topic that the Germans and I were friends and all that ...

Lies. Who is interested, he knows.

Judging by the previous paragraph, for some reason many are still convinced that it was RIA that crossed the border first.

[Sergey Oreshin]

Quote: 210ox

The author, you have a wonderful article. I want to remind you that Malinovsky went to the war not only as a volunteer, but in fact illegally. He did not seem to fit in his age. I advise you to watch the film "First World War."

Yes, he was younger than draft age, so he hid his real age and joined the mobilized soldiers. In fact, the "son of the regiment". The soldiers and commanders liked the smart guy, they decided not to expel him from the unit. Malinovsky received the military specialty of a machine gunner and fought very successfully. And then he ended up in France, where he also showed himself as a valiant and skillful warrior

[Ryazan87]

Poor and unfair article full of biased ratings:

"The tsarist government, for which the common people have always been a consumable, immediately agreed with Doumergue's proposal."

- a direct lie. The number of Russian troops and their organizational form radically differed from the proposal of Dumerg, about which the author himself writes below. By the way, for example, a detachment of Belgian armored vehicles fought on the Eastern Front, and a group of British submarines worked in the Baltic.

"Even then, the French were not distinguished by their high fighting qualities ..."

This is simply disrespect. Before the defenders of Verdun would be ashamed.

"... the Russian authorities could not have sent so many soldiers to help the French with all their desire."

- there was never a desire for this. It is enough to get acquainted with the opinion of General Alekseev in this regard.

"Our soldiers died in a foreign land defending France."

The soldiers died, fighting against a common enemy and performing an allied duty.

"After the February Revolution, the Entente countries suspected Russia of wanting to conclude a separate peace with the Germans."

Why's that? In the period from February to October 1917, only the Bolsheviks held the position of "defeatists" (starting in 1914).

"They refused to obey not only French, but also Russian officers."

And this is called rebellion. With clear consequences. By the way, the French in the summer of 1917 crushed the mass soldier riots in their own army no less harshly.

"The uprising of the Russian division was literally drowned in blood. Although the French authorities reported 9 killed, in fact there were many more."

but the author did not bother to cite any serious data, of course (there is a spread from 9 to 1500). Actually, the Russian artillery units themselves suppressed the uprising.

the shooting of their own soldiers in the camp of La Curtin

how else would you suppress a military insurrection? For a long time they still offered to agree peacefully.

great shame for the tsarist and Provisional governments, who left Russian people in a foreign land to their fate

whom could the tsarist government abandon after February 1917 is a big question.

Article minus.

[naidas]

Quote: Ryazanets87

this desire has never happened. It is enough to get acquainted with the opinion of General Alekseev in this regard.

French bankers were creditors of tsarist Russia, and General Alekseev was forced to not only listen to the impudent demands of Senator Doumer, but also to find opportunities to fulfill this requirement. And these opportunities have been found.

Quote: Ryazanets87

The soldiers died, fighting against a common enemy and performing an allied duty.

In October 1916. the brigade went on the offensive, without preparation, reconnaissance, artillery preparation, etc., stumbled upon barbed wire and machine-gun fire. During October, this episode was repeated several more times. "Despite 2 attempts (October 6 and 14) of the assault, both, despite the powerful artillery barrage, ended in nothing: reaching the barbed wire, Russian soldiers did not find passages in it and were forced to return to their positions, having lost in the first case 8 officers and 450 soldiers, in the second - 367 soldiers. “Artillery preparation and support, of course, were done by the allies - the brigade did not have its own means for this. Thus, the brigade lost hundreds of fighters each time. This is how the soldiers died, fighting against a common enemy and fulfilling their duty of alliance. There is no need for agitators.

Quote: Ryazanets87

And this is called rebellion. With clear consequences.

The arrived representative of the Provisional Government blessed the suppression of the uprising by force, in which the French gendarmes, supported by artillery, and some of the Russians, including the officer-guarantor with the same representative, Ensign N. Gumilyov (author of an ultimatum to the rebels).

Quote: Ryazanets87

Why's that? In the period from February to October 1917, only the Bolsheviks held the position of "defeatists" (starting in 1914).

Not only, already in 1914, fraternisations of units of the belligerent armies were going on on the Western Front, soldiers wrote in letters home that they were ready to surrender, just not to continue this massacre. It is also possible about the defeatists: Easter battle 1917: The brigades have already occupied three lines of enemy trenches. But when the Germans responded with a powerful counterattack, which they managed to repel with difficulty, the French artillery suddenly unleashed volleys not on the retreating enemy, but on Russian soldiers. On signal flares - "hit your own!" - there was no reaction. Then it turned out that the fire was corrected by the commander of the 2nd regiment, Colonel Ivanov, and the commander of the 2nd battalion, Lieutenant Colonel Gotua, who was reputed to be the "first fighter" of the division. "Error"? Their commanders knew perfectly well that the enemy's trenches had been captured the day before, but the sight was fixed only after 20 minutes of shelling. How many lives were taken away by these shots is not calculated.

[Ryazan87]

impudent demands of Senator Doumer, but also to seek opportunities to fulfill this requirement

1. First, Gaston Dumerg.
2. Secondly, the proposal of Dumerg included the sending to the Western Front of 400 thousand Russian soldiers without officers and an organizational staff (they wanted to be included in the French regiments). In reality, 20 were sent to the West under the command of Russian officers as part of separately formed units of the Russian army. Don't you feel the difference?

In October 1916 the brigade went on the offensive, bwithout training, reconnaissance, artillery training[/ b] etc., came across barbed wire and machine gun fire. During October this episode was repeated several more times. "Despite 2 attempts (October 6 and 14) to assault, both, [b] despite the powerful artillery preparationended with nothing: ...

Are you sure you read what you write?
"The arriving representative of the Provisional Government blessed the suppression of the uprising by force, in which the French gendarmes, reinforced by artillery, and some of the Russians participated."
the French stood there in the second line.
"... at the beginning of August the 2nd special artillery brigade arrived in France. From the port of Brest it was to be transferred to the Thessaloniki front, as it was structurally part of the 2nd Special Division, which fought in Macedonia. But the artillerymen loyal to the Provisional Government agreed take part in suppressing the uprising in La Courtin ... On September 11, the camp was blocked. French infantry and artillerymen were stationed behind the Russian ring. "

Not only, already in 1914, fraternities of units of the warring armies were marching on the Western Front, soldiers wrote in letters home that they were ready to give up, just to not continue this massacre. Possible about the defeatists: Easter battle 1917:

And here it is? It was about a political position and readiness for a separate peace. The Bolsheviks, as a political force, took an initially defeatist position and never hid it. The interim government never officially announced the possibility of a separate peace.
Read the original comment.

[naidas]

1. Joseph Atanaz Paul Doumer was in Russia in 1915.
Gaston Dumerg was in Russia 1917 at the Petrograd Conference.
2. Sent 45 thousand (the Balkans and France), the tsar held out longer was longer. At the same time, some of those destined to be sent to France were thrown to Mitau.
3. 3 episodes are described, the details are omitted, highlighting the main thing as the Russians were under machine-gun fire in front of pristine wire fences.

Quote: Ryazanets87

And here it is? It was about a political position and readiness for a separate peace. The Bolsheviks, as a political force, took an initially defeatist position and never hid it.

What kind of Bolsheviks were in the Russian corps in June 1917? In Russia in June they laughed at the Bolsheviks.
Do you think the Bolsheviks staged a rebellion?

[Ryazan87]

1. Yes, that's right, I made a mistake.
2. I spoke about the Western Front. As for the Balkans, what’s the problem, I don’t understand. Those. is it normal to fight with Germans or Bulgarians in Romania, but is it somehow wrong in Macedonia? Joint actions of allies against a common enemy.
3. So what? Are you outraged by the ineffective artillery barrage? Or a case of "friendly fire"? in war, it happens quite often (despite all the development of means of communication and now too). Do you think this was not the case on the Eastern Front?
4. So. I wrote about this part of the article:
"... After the February Revolution, the Entente countries suspected Russia of wanting to conclude a separate peace with the Germans."
5.

In Russia, in June they laughed at the Bolsheviks.

- And on July 3-5 they stopped.

[naidas]

Quote: Ryazanets87

Those. is it normal to fight with Germans or Bulgarians in Romania, but is it somehow wrong in Macedonia?

2. It is not right both here and there: it came to some in 1915, to many in 1916, and in large numbers in 1917: the soldiers preferred the deserter's half-starved life at the front, for which the field gendarmes hunted like a beast. In 1916, the Russian army numbered more than one and a half million deserters.
3. I repeat the third time I was surprised by the attack on the pitchfork for the third time in a month, to reach the wire under fire and to return.

Quote: Ryazanets87

After the February Revolution, the Entente countries suspected Russia of wanting to conclude a separate peace with the Germans. "

4. Aha with the slogans of the interim government to victory?
5. You didn’t answer where you saw the Bolsheviks in the corps in France, they laughed at them in Russia in June 1917, and you didn’t know about them in France.

[Ryazan87]

the soldiers preferred the deserter's half-starved life at the front, for which the field gendarmes hunted like a beast. In 1916, the Russian army numbered more than one and a half million deserters.

And what, deserting scum had to give coupons for enhanced nutrition?
However, 1.5 million by 1916 is still nothing:
"... only for the period from June 22 to the end of 1941, the organs of the NKVD of the USSR detained over 710 thousand deserters, more than 71 thousand evaders from mobilization "
https://cyberleninka.ru/article/v/dezertirstvo-iz-krasnoy-armii-kak-sotsialnaya-osnova-prestupnosti-v-period-velikoy-otechestvennoy-voyny-1941-1945-gg
This, we will note, for the first six months and only for those detained. It turns out that the Soviets got it "faster". Do you have the same sympathy for deserters from the Red Army?

surprised attack on the pitchfork for the third time in a month

on Gallipoli or the Somme there were precedents much worse. The problem of overcoming prepared defense is, as it were, key to the Great War.

Yeah, with the slogans of the interim government to victory?

Again. After some suspicions of the Entente countries after February, the author of the article wrote, not me. To me, on the contrary, this thesis seems false.

You did not answer where you saw the Bolsheviks in the corps in France, they laughed at them in Russia in June 1917

(patiently) I never attributed the organization of the rebellion in La Curtin to the Bolsheviks. I wrote only that the Bolsheviks as a political force took a defeatist position.
As for June, no one in Russia laughed at them. In June, the Bolsheviks - already 240 thousand people. And on July 3-5, sheer trifle is an armed rebellion in the capital. Tear yourself up with laughter.

[naidas]

Quote: Ryazanets87

detained over 710 thousand military deserters,

One of my grandfathers was a deserter, a military man, he came out of the encirclement with a couple of dozens of the same skeletons, like him, far behind the front line, they deserted from a hospital bed from a month to a month and a half and buried, could not go out. There are graves, and where who is already incomprehensible.

Quote: Ryazanets87

I wrote only that the Bolsheviks as a political force took a defeatist position.

Is it about France or not?

Quote: Ryazanets87

And on July 3-5 a sheer trifle - an armed rebellion in the capital

For these events, the Bolsheviks are also not very, so after they were appointed responsible for them, they began to grow rapidly.

[Torins]

The tsarist government, for which the common people have always been consumables

As if under the Soviet regime or under the current, it became different.

[Torins]

Quote: Ryazanets87

Article minus.

I fully support!
P.S. I wonder what forum rule I violated when they deleted my previous post?

[naidas]

About convicts: 8 thousand participants in the Kurta rebellion - in court. In November 17th, volunteers will join them en masse - first 5 thousand former soldiers of the 1st brigade of the Russian corps, then another 12 thousand from the disbanded Russian units on the Balkan front. The French were amazed: Russian soldiers chose hard labor instead of workers' companies, and the Foreign Legion. It was unthinkable to escape from the African penal servitude, but in a mysterious way the colony melted away: a year for several thousand souls. They did not speak about where the personnel had flowed, but in the end General Denikin made the "leak": his words, addressed to the French Foreign Minister Pichon, became known. The general said that he would no longer accept repatriates from Africa, since they would still run away to the Reds.
The end in the history of the Russian corps was only set in the spring of 1920, when the outcome of the Civil War in the former empire was a foregone conclusion. Since many French citizens were stuck in Russia, Paris offered to start negotiations on the exchange of people left without a homeland. The agreement with Moscow entered into force (there were no diplomatic relations yet) when 3733 Russians remained in hard labor in Algeria. Among them, a survey was conducted: it turned out that 96 percent want to return to Soviet Russia. On the day of boarding the steamer of the first batch of repatriates, already former Russian soldiers came to the Algerian harbor with red flags and the very "Marseillaise" that enthusiastic France greeted them with in April 1916 ...

[Salen Kotch]

The former Quartermaster General, General of Infantry of the Russian Empire, the closest associate of Grand Duke Nikolai Nikolaevich the Younger, Yu. N. Danilov, wrote a whole book on this topic, in great detail, down to the smallest detail. Subsequently, when Danilov became the commander of the 20th corps, he personally was engaged in the selection of soldiers for this expeditionary corps. The book is called "Russian detachments on the French and Macedonian fronts. 1916-1918", I recommend everyone to read, remember the military glory of our great power. Whoever wants this book, leave it, if you please, and I will send you by mail.