On the combat use of the Su-57 in Syria: F-35 is no longer stealth ...

The newest Russian Su-57 fighters have gained combat experience in Syria, where an anti-terrorist operation is being conducted, reports RIA News message by a member of the State Duma expert council on aviation industry of Vladimir Gutenev.

The four Russian Su-57 aircraft in Syria allowed, among other things, to obtain additional data on the ability of the machine to detect (using on-board equipment) American F-22 and F-35, which are involved in the same theater of operations, Gutenev said.

Earlier, in February, the Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation, Sergei Shoigu, said that Su-57 had been carrying out a testing program in the SAR for two days. True, then reported only about two cars.

Meanwhile newspaper News spoke about the final tests of the new P-37M super-long-range air-to-air missile (development of the previous-generation P-37 rocket).

The development of P-37M designers began at the end of 2000-s. It was planned that the rocket will go into service with the MiG-31 interceptor. However, it was later decided to modify the ammunition and equip them with the Su-30 and Su-35 fighters. For this, the starting mass and the length of the product have been reduced.

TTX missiles are not disclosed. It is only known that its range is more than 300 km, weight is more than 500 kg. It is made according to the normal aerodynamic scheme with a wing of small elongation, equipped with non-contact active radar and duplicate contact fuses. On the final leg of the flight, the ammunition accelerates to Mach 6 speed.

According to military experts, the new missile will significantly increase the capabilities of the Russian fighter aircraft.

Comments

[Grandfather]

The four Russian Su-57 aircraft in Syria allowed, among other things, to obtain additional data on the ability of the machine to detect (using on-board equipment) American F-22 and F-35, which are involved in the same theater of operations, Gutenev said.

in fact, this was to be verified.

[Aaron Zawi]

Quote: Dead Day

in fact, this was to be verified.

I was interested in other accents in his speech.

Moscow. 4 July. INTERFAX-AVN “The promising Su-57 fighter should be regarded as a wonderful aircraft with export potential, but the main efforts should be concentrated on the creation of a transition aircraft,” said Interfax-AVN on Wednesday the head of the State Duma commission on legal support for the development of defense industry organizations, the first vice-president of the Engineering Union RF Vladimir Gutenev.
“I believe that the sixth generation fighter will be a transition vehicle between aircraft still manned and unmanned intelligent strike systems (BIUK) - in this case we are talking about air BIUKs that, thanks to their intelligence, can perform assigned tasks, including quite massive ones groups, "he said, commenting on a statement by Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov that there will be no mass deliveries of fifth-generation Su-57 fighter jets to the Russian Air Force in the coming years.
 "I largely agree with the words of Yuri Ivanovich (Borisov) that massive purchases of the Su-57 can hardly be expected", - noted V. Gutenev." With the undoubted advantages of this machine, we, of course, understand that the start of the program was given back in 2001, and the implementation of the program for a number of objective reasons was delayed (it was originally planned in 2006-2007 to conduct flight tests, and since 2014 have already been supplied to the troops), due to the very dynamic development of technologies - this also applies to electronic warfare systems, and new composite materials, and new opportunities that additive technologies provide in terms of constructive reduction in the cost of machines, "stated he.
“Well, and of course, this is due to the fact that we have very advanced machines - these are the Su-34 and Su-35, which have shown themselves well,” said V. Gutenev. "Until the 2023-2024 year, the Su-57 does not intend to install a second-stage engine, the tests of which have just begun, this is "Product 30", and despite the fact that our car is much cheaper (according to my estimates, 2,5 times than foreign counterparts of the 5th generation), it is still much more expensive and requires thinner services in comparison with the Su-34 and Su-35 ", - added V. Gutenev.

[Andrey Yuryevich]

Quote: Aron Zaavi

other accents interested me in his speech

old information. already ordered SU-57 for the army, with engines of the "2nd stage".

[Don]

There was information that the first order involves the supply to the troops for trial operation of the 12 Su-57 with engines of the first stage.

[NKT]

There was information on 10 cars with a first stage engine and 2 cars with a second stage engine.

[edge]

Quote: Donskoy

the first order involves the delivery of 12 Su-57s with engines of the first stage to the troops for trial operation.

it’s not in Chinese; -the Jewish Sabra were thrust into it by engines from the su-35 and screaming that after the Americans they managed to overtake RUSSIA in the fifth generation ...... Here the work is being done with feeling, with sense, with testing and consolidation

[dik-nsk]

this is the same performance on July 4 (yesterday !!), as in the article it turns out to change the shoes .. although I do not exclude that you know more than the vice-premier He reports

he said, commenting on the statement of Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov that there will be no mass deliveries of fifth-generation Su-57 fighters to the Russian air forces in the coming years

they know how to have cancer behind a stone, camouflaging the lack of necessary resources

I believe that the sixth generation fighter will be a transition vehicle between airplanes still manned and unmanned intelligent strike systems (BIUK)

well this is the true reason

but still it is much more expensive and requires more subtle services compared to the Su-34 and Su-35

[edge]

Quote: dik-nsk

know how to have cancer over stone

any development is justified if it goes into a sufficiently large series, otherwise money is wasted (I think regiments 5 will be acquired as a reserve of the supreme)

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Andrey Yurievich

old information. already ordered SU-57 for the army, with engines of the "2nd stage"

Invalid information. Do not run ahead of the engine. The engine of the "second stage" has not yet been tested, and only 12 cars with AL-41F1 engines were ordered by the current GPV. And yes, Borisov’s statement is very interesting. It would be better if he kept his mouth shut, and it turns out that the Su-57, as it were, are not needed by the airborne forces at all, because there are such wonderful planes (this is not sarcasm), like the Su-35. Well, for the future - do not give a damn, maybe he will not sit in an armchair anymore, but will grow dill on an honorary pension

[VO3A]

What is the conversation about? You are thrown dice in the form of engines and almost 6th generation aircraft, and you are led to it! All this is a false attempt by high-ranking officials to get away from the main problem ....
Why do we need a 5th generation airplane in the army in general? He must, first of all, perform the functions of an invisible reconnaissance (without turning on the radar) to work in information systems to receive and transmit information about the enemy in the air, on land and at sea .... If in the air it is possible to communicate with air defense systems and other aircraft It’s not necessary to talk about the ground component and real-time target designation for artillery and missile systems ... We do not have modern combat information systems for receiving. real-time transmission, information processing and response ... It is for such systems, along with UAVs operating in them, and not separately, that a 5th generation aircraft is needed ... These systems include all types of destruction systems, starting from "Coalitions", MLRS and ending with helicopters and attack aircraft, which use information for target designation and destruction of the enemy in real time .... We have no such systems, except for air defense .... We use fire spotters for targeting and targeting on the ground in real time for aviation and artillery - Syria experiencerather her A SHAME...
We don’t need a 5th generation airplane yet, or rather, we just don’t have it, it’s too early ... Before it appears, you need to create Combat Information Systems that replace intelligence with advanced ones and work in real time ... In real time, for Dummies, this is when you do not see the picture on the screen of the UAV control operator and even transmitted to the headquarters, and when the coordinates of the target immediately go to the fire control system of the weapon ... This weapon shoots and we immediately see the result, it is better in the form of the destruction of the enemy .. This is not a fairy tale, it is a requirement and the essence of modern military operations ... They just can’t understand this, or they don’t want in our General Staff (Brilliant Headquarters) ....

[PROXOR]

Andrei.

How will you adjust the fire of the same artillery and aviation with the help of UAVs in the depths of enemy defense with the active use of air defense and electronic warfare. In Syria, UAVs and video from the heights of our aviation were also used, made from drones. But not a single drone can replace the trained eye of a reconnaissance - corrector. And if you need to work 100 meters from your advanced positions and attack aircraft cannot be involved, the same problem is active air defense.

[VO3A]

And who will lie in the coffin? I have a UAV, and you trained eye spotter ? Your examples are illogical and stupid, like questions ...

[PROXOR]

One coffin? Or Thousands of Broken Divisions?

[faradien]

UAVs, so far in any case, will not be able to completely replace ground reconnaissance. This has already been said in relation to the Syrian operation. But for excavators, tractors and transformer booths, and even for wedding trains, like mattresses - this is easy with insufficient intelligence

[VO3A]

Add our UAVs cannot replace ground reconnaissance ... In Syria, our UAVs cannot give out the coordinates of the target, and there is nobody to take them ... They fly there without exchanging information in real time on a remote route and write information to a memory card that is decrypted after landing ... The miserable TU-214 R also works in the same way .... The operation in Syria showed the complete inability of our army to wage a modern war using information technology .....

[faradien]

Well, you have to complain right to the Pentagon, everything is gone!

[kit88]

Colleague. You mean the absence of Combat Information Systems, ring the bells constantly. But you can’t get hung up on that. Stating until they are gone, 5th generation aircraft are not needed. Surely the development is coming. And soon the entire theater of operations will be covered by all-seeing drones and satellites, recording the appearance of each enemy’s trunk from each trench, from each aperture of the destroyed building, with the subsequent transfer of coordinates to the Calculator in the Control Center. Which, in turn, will distribute targets between the infantry’s individual computers at the forefront, with digital computers of the VKS Defeat Aviation Complexes, will transmit data to the appropriate Navy center, and will provide target coordinates for the Strategic Missile Forces.
And a blow will be struck. Barmaley will be destroyed. Completely.

[VO3A]

I would like to believe ... Although your views, despite the general correct tendency, are very primitive and raw and repeat many existing prejudices ....
But in Syria, where there is no opposition whatsoever, there is nothing and the territory is miserable - 3-4 positional areas in total and nothing ... Full zero ... But they found achievements, and they are introducing experience ... An experience of stupidity and inability?

[kit88]

Quote: VO3A

your views, despite the general correct trend, are very primitive

Where are we to the syry.
Tolley business you:

We don't need a 5th generation airplane

Where the staff of the General Staff are looking. Such a STRATEG is not employed by vocation!

[VO3A]

Precisely, tell me, I will help ... No need to be offended, you are not a girl .. In essence, your views are correct, inaccurate in details ... But these details lead to a dead end ... as with the Acacia-M ASUV in the article nearby....

[kit88]

I do not intend to be upset at your words. But in fact, you repeat the same thing from the commentary to the comment with the tenacity of the machine.
If you are so competent in this matter, then for what reason your knowledge is not in demand in the Moscow Region? And ask me to put in a word for you? Maybe there are people who understand this issue better than you? And they do not sit during working hours on the VO website and do not scribble endless comments with tips to the Chief of Staff and moralizing to other users. And in closed research institutes they are working on this issue as well.
You already decide - either you are special, or you are a balabol. Moreover, the latter, in my opinion, is more consistent with the truth, since all your thoughts about the organization of LSIs are just a declaration of intent without any specifics, and are no better than my statement on the general principles for the use of these LSIs in the future.

[VO3A]

Good wish, but apart from reality in our country with decision-making, there are age factors and other reasons. You can talk with an elderly person (grandfather), or maybe with a student ... So do not rush to personal assessments and tips. This is a forum and we exchange opinions to a certain level ...

[Photon]

Don’t suffer like that. Type in the search engine "combat information management systems"

[Pathos]

Situation: Two bodies fly at each other from around the corner of the house with machine guns and stare at each other. Your actions?
Py. Sy. Maybe we will call aliens for help

[Random]

Quote: Andrey Yurievich

old information. already ordered SU-57 for the army, with engines of the "2nd stage".

You have old information ..... yes, 12 pieces have been ordered ... but with the engines of the "1st stage" ... here they will "come out" 10..11 and 12.th and that's all .... here is your party

[Alexei]

Quote: Aron Zaavi

other accents interested me in his speech

I agree, unpromising accents. If the USSR were today, then these new aircraft would have been modified and delivered to the armed forces long ago. But for this to happen, we need a planned economy.

[Hole puncher]

Quote: Alexej

If the USSR were today, then these new aircraft would have been modified and delivered to the armed forces long ago.

There would be the same mess. Read the history of the creation of Su27, Sukhoi Design Bureau has a long tradition of letting folk remedies downwind.

[Alexei]

Quote: Puncher

Read the history of the creation of Su27, Sukhoi Design Bureau has a long tradition of letting folk remedies downwind.

Yes, it’s better to let people’s money go in the attempt to strengthen the country's defense than on yachts, villas and on western accounts through offshore.

[Govorun]

And remember how not a few very interesting and promising developments were ruined in our USSR so that it is not necessary to say that under the USSR everything would have been finalized and put into the armed forces, do not live by the illusions of a beautiful past and a gloomy present, because, because then that now there are a lot of nuances (I do not take into account the human factor of politicians) that influenced and influence the creation of this technique.

[Alexei]

Quote: Govorun

And remember how quite a lot of very interesting and promising developments were ruined in our USSR

I know. After the 61 year, the 22 Congress of the CPSU, the planned transition began back to capitalism, which ended with the counter-revolution of the 1991 year. And military developments were ruined, very interesting and promising. But today things are much worse, with both staff and production capabilities.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Govorun

it’s not necessary to say that under the USSR everything would have been finalized and delivered to the Armed Forces

and yet the chances would be higher. In the USSR, somehow the Su-27 (besides paired with the MiG-29) was rattled and adopted - and at that time the machines were at the same level as the current Su-57. And they would also say - see, we have a MiG-23! And strategic missile carriers were built, and not piece by piece for 10 years, etc. I’m silent about the fleet. Not everything, of course, was wonderful "in the kingdom", but it cannot be compared with present times

[Govorun]

Well, why are you all comparing a cow with a bull, where the bull is the same cow only with Ya.YTs..I .... there was one country, but just look at the USSR and present Russia’s economy, what could be allowed in the USSR and take into account many factors, maybe the RF Ministry of Defense and was glad to put all this in the army, but it is impossible to grab everything at once, so you have to look for a balance between opportunity and desire ...

[Angina]

You should write fiction. I worked in a military research institute during the late USSR. The same mess and mess. And money flew into the breakthrough pipe: everything around is collective farm, everything around me. Sometimes you wonder how nobody defeated us then. A planned economy is not a panacea either: there will be money or components, but ... at the end of the five-year period. Question from the questions - which is worse?

[Govorun]

The key word of the LATE USSR, I dare to assume before sunset, but there’s nothing at all surprising, the restructuring of the mess and confusion of what happened, and I don’t argue at all, and on the contrary even pointed out that there were, are and will be problems ... that with the economy, that without an economy .... and it’s so stupid to even argue that the Soviet economy was worse than the current one, and politically the situation was more stable, which also affects the economy. And what I write I will allow myself to decide for myself.

[milling machine]

[/ quote] in fact, this was what we needed to check. [/ quote]
First: the Americans could have done the same.
Secondly: Americans could fly with Lunberg lenses.
Nevertheless, it seems to me that this flight was more for public relations and domestic consumption.

[SETTGF]

milling cutter! When it seems - it’s necessary to shave!

[Don]

Why for this drive the Su-57 to Syria? In my opinion, reconnaissance aircraft of the Tu-204P type are most preferable for this. And the aircraft undergoing testing were sent only for the sake of advertising and claiming that the aircraft was tested in combat conditions. What could they have experienced for incomplete 2 days, taking into account pre-flight preparations and after-flight service? Or ours do not agree something

[mishaia_23]

In fact, it was necessary to check
It’s like Yugoslavia with f-117 stealth shot down, sorry, we just didn’t know that they were invisible ...
And now we know for sure that Russian on-board equipment sees pseudo stealth f-35 and f-22 aircraft

[Grigory_45]

Quote: mishaia_23

In fact, it was necessary to check

check what? EPR Luneberg lenses? So how, feel better? How does it compare with the real EPR of an airplane?

[Tektor]

There is unverified data from an unofficial source that:

Several contacts of the Su-57 and F35 already existed. The night detection of ours and 35 with the frontal was the same - 60-70 km. With our lateral we see from 105, and 35 already from 190 km. The probability of passive escape from the rocket from the rear hemisphere is 50% in our company (ESR increases to 0,5), in 35 it is about 8%. We did not meet in the daytime, but because of the optics for 35 everything will be even worse.
By 22, there is almost no data yet ...

Therefore, everything will be decided by the reaction and speed of decision-making, and the new weapons, the R-37M, will give an undeniable head start to our Su-57.
On the other hand, it is possible that a small number of Su-57s has been revised taking into account the progress in creating the newest, inconspicuous UAV “Okhotnik-B”, which can be a “coordinator, navigator, target indicator and ally” for the Su-57, i.e. Hunter-B can do everything that the Su-57 can. One Su-57 and a pack of Okhotnikov-B is a combat wing for solving the tasks of the full range of military operations in the near future.

[milling machine]

Quote: Tektor

There is unverified data from an unofficial source that:

Several contacts of the Su-57 and F35 already existed. The night detection of ours and 35 with the frontal was the same - 60-70 km. With our lateral we see from 105, and 35 already from 190 km. The probability of passive escape from the rocket from the rear hemisphere is 50% in our company (ESR increases to 0,5), in 35 it is about 8%. We did not meet in the daytime, but because of the optics for 35 everything will be even worse.
By 22, there is almost no data yet ...

Therefore, everything will be decided by the reaction and speed of decision-making, and the new weapons, the R-37M, will give an undeniable head start to our Su-57.

And if we assume that f35 flew with lenses that increase epr by orders of magnitude, then the picture is not so rosy.
And yet, f 35 also has an OLS which, according to the developers, detects the BR torch at a distance of 1200 km.

[Muvka]

Quote: frezer

Quote: Tektor

There is unverified data from an unofficial source that:

Several contacts of the Su-57 and F35 already existed. The night detection of ours and 35 with the frontal was the same - 60-70 km. With our lateral we see from 105, and 35 already from 190 km. The probability of passive escape from the rocket from the rear hemisphere is 50% in our company (ESR increases to 0,5), in 35 it is about 8%. We did not meet in the daytime, but because of the optics for 35 everything will be even worse.
By 22, there is almost no data yet ...

Therefore, everything will be decided by the reaction and speed of decision-making, and the new weapons, the R-37M, will give an undeniable head start to our Su-57.

And if we assume that f35 flew with lenses that increase epr by orders of magnitude, then the picture is not so rosy.
And yet, f 35 also has an OLS which, according to the developers, detects the BR torch at a distance of 1200 km.

If the F-35 flew with lenses, then they should have been visible from 200 km, or even more. But not from 60-70. Or do you think that the Su-57 radar sees 100-150 km?

[voyaka uh]

"Or do you think that the Su-57 radar sees 100 - 150 km?" ////

Like that. At least distinguishes the type of aircraft that is in front of it, at about such distances.

[voyaka uh]

I will clarify the type of aircraft with an EPR of 1-3 m2
He will distinguish B-52 from 400 km

[SETTGF]

Grigory_45! Do not write nonsense about Luneberg lenses!

[Random]

Quote: Dead Day

in fact, this was to be verified.

Essentially .... this is the usual "noodle" for people
And the realities are more than .. pragmatic: ".... The Su-57 promising fighter should be regarded as an excellent aircraft with export potential, but the main efforts should be concentrated on creating a transition aircraft, Interfax-AVN told First Vice President on Wednesday Union of Mechanical Engineers of the Russian Federation Vladimir Gutenev.
“I believe that the sixth generation fighter will be a transition vehicle between aircraft still manned and unmanned intelligent strike systems (BIUK) - in this case we are talking about air BIUKs that, thanks to their intelligence, can perform assigned tasks, including quite massive ones groups, "he said, commenting on a statement by Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov that there will be no mass deliveries of fifth-generation Su-57 fighter jets to the Russian Air Force in the coming years.
“I largely agree with the words of Yuri Ivanovich (Borisov) that it is unlikely that massive purchases of Su-57 are to be expected,” V. Gutenev said.

A curtain.....

[little country]

Quote: Random

.... The promising Su-57 fighter should be regarded as a wonderful aircraft with export potential, but the main efforts should be concentrated on creating a transition aircraft, Vladimir Gutenev, the first vice-president of the Russian Engineering Union, told Interfax-AVN on Wednesday.

“Speaking at a gala rally dedicated to the transfer of 10 combat vehicles of the Pantsir-C1 air defense missile system to parade crews of the Russian Air Force, the research director of KBP KBP Shipunov noted that the release of new complexes is a whole event both for the industry and for the country."

Development, implementation and testing should be done in a calm working environment, without super advertising and cap-making.
Yes, the verification of everything new must be carried out in conditions close to the combat or in combat conditions. Everything that has been tested in Syria, tested in conditions close to combat.
All air raids did not receive an adequate response since Assad’s opposition does not have real anti-aircraft defense, and even so, the losses of the air forces were big.
I don’t understand the mockery and laughter in the direction of Israeli developments, although most of you are well aware that ISRAEL IS STANDING ON THE FIRST PLACE TO DEVELOP AND IMPLEMENT THE MOST NEW AND MODERN MILITARY SUPPORT IN THE WORLD

[SETTGF]

little country! No need to write absurdities about Israeli developments in the field of air defense and missile defense ...

[faradien]

And what, there is no thought that in Syria they simply worked out a blow to the ground as at a training ground? We checked on-board systems, weapons, pilot training. In normal situations, you still need to cut to the landfill, throw the blanks ... well, or not quite blanks. And here in a combat situation "pleasant" with useful combined. And you immediately see the "show"

[Vladimir 5]

What the deputy of the State Duma Gutenev says loudly what needs to be discussed behind closed doors. According to this, the personality is clearly ambiguous ... The Turks got a pair of F-35s, and that's to cooperate, because all the airfields in Turkey can be controlled ... The secrets of the F-22 and especially the F-35, as an expert in many countries, should be revealed and quickly searched for " antidotes "...

[newcomer]

yeah, this deputy issued an opus from a series of incoherent letters on the theme of need Su57. I recommend the MIC. name

[dog breeder]

yeah, my deputy issued an opus from a series of incoherent letters on the theme of need Su57. I recommend the MIC. name

Is there more specific and reliable data on the presence of the SU-57 in the warhead? Share it!

[cniza]

Nobody will tell us anything, there is an information war, from this angle everything must be perceived.

[bouncyhunter]

Victor, good day!

Quote: cniza

there is an information war

And in war, all means are good, including "disinformation."

[cniza]

Greetings Pasha! and the higher the herald, the more interesting it becomes ...

[bouncyhunter]

In-in, therefore, do not rush to conclusions, but observe from an ambush.

[cniza]

Now in general, to draw conclusions on the basis of various articles does not make sense, and even the speech of "specialists" is ...

[asv363]

Pavel, do not flatter yourself about the perception of the high level of this deputy!

[bouncyhunter]

I don’t flatter myself: "talking head."

[newcomer]

colleague, well, you’d even come in and read in the journal the reasoning for this “pillar” of the aircraft industry, where does the operation on the military aircraft take place? this figure (since you are too lazy to read his statements), said the following, that we generally do not need the 57th, to export it and, concentrate our forces on the 6th generation car. “Maintenance of the Su57 requires finer tuning of the service.”
By the way, there Aron Zaavi already laid out.

[Vadim851]

Here is the R-37M and is suitable for placement in the internal compartment of the Su-57 rather than the giant KS-172.

[Runoway]

About the detection of "cheers-patriotic" nonsense, we ran in and revealed all the enemy’s cards in one two-day walk (prototypes), well, just a superweapon . And the Americans about the arrival of the 57th at once all the equipment into the sky to measure their pussy, directly unspoken Syrian Aviadarts passed

[Fungus]

You know better than a sofa expert than pilots who fly 57 in Syria.

[rotmistr60]

Runoway
"cheers-patriotic" nonsense

I have long drawn attention to the fact that this year the posts of “handshakes with bright faces and high intelligence” began to be very popular. Flock to the site in packs.

[faiver]

la la poplar - empty words ....

[Cossack 471]

Well, where is that. that the F-35 is no longer invisible? Tired of information chatter ....

[spirit]

F35 is no longer stealth; Su 57 is not yet stealth

[Piramidon]

Quote: spirit

F35 is no longer stealth; Su 57 is not yet stealth

Conclusion - "stealth" does not exist. One chatter and PR.

[LMN]

Quote: spirit

F35 is no longer stealth; Su 57 is not yet stealth

Not stealth yet?
Was there such a task? Wanted reduced visibility, lowered

[Anatoly Chikunov]

This is all good for local wars.

[Vard]

Stealth ... Not stealth ... That's what I don’t understand ... behind any plane there is no stealth at all ... engine nozzles and how it is ... exhaust ... And it’s better to launch rockets ... and then the garden to fence ... of course, if you need money, then it’s clear ... and so in my opinion it's all nonsense ...

[Altona]

Quote: Donskoy

Why for this drive the Su-57 to Syria?

--------------------
Check the on-board equipment complexes and how he sees the signatures of the F-35 and F-22. One thing is virtual in absentia, another thing to check in.

[Altona]

Quote: Vard

Stealth ... Not stealth ... That's what I don’t understand ... behind, any plane is not stealth at all ... engine nozzles and how it ... exhaust ...

------------------------------
These are ground penetration air defense breakthrough planes, at least they thought so.

[PROXOR]

All the same, it is more correct to call this plane - the plane of gaining dominance in the sky. Earlier detection of the enemy, even in passive mode. Longer-range Air-to-Air missiles. Transmission of information on air and ground transmission to the command center A-50, A-100 and ground.

[Yrec]

I strongly doubt that the SU-57 turned on its radar and shone them in the direction of the "partner" aircraft. This, in general, would be tantamount to a missile attack, and I would immediately disclose the characteristics of the radar. The main source of radar information are AWACS and radar missile defense / air defense systems. The Su-57 was simply used at the “warring” airdrome to see how it is in maintenance and daily operation.

[Vita vko]

Quote: Yrec

SU-57 turned on its radar and shone them in the direction of "partner" aircraft. This, in general, would be tantamount to a missile attack, and I would immediately disclose the characteristics of the radar.

It has several radars, including the L-band, but passive detection systems for radio and optoelectronic intelligence are considered the main ones.

[Yrec]

The radar, which is turned on, in order to see at a great distance the enemy and shoot at him, he has one. The rest, the side / rear view of the OE reconnaissance, etc., have, rather, a defensive function and work within the limits of optical visibility, maybe a little more. If it’s about garlic, then the main radar should not turn on, guidance should be from other carriers of the radar signal. Otherwise, the notorious "stealth" is complete bullshit. Turning on the main radar is more an exception than a rule (for a fighter-interceptor).

[Vita vko]

Quote: Yrec

Turning on the main radar is an exception rather than a rule (for an interceptor fighter)

For long distances, there are modes such as LPI mode ("low signal capture capabilities"). The potential interception range of such an ultra-wideband signal with noise-like modulation is much lower than the missile launch range.

[Yrec]

That is why external target designation and guidance are used. For example, using the MIG-31 or A-50.

[voyaka uh]

Moreover, any takeoff and landing at Khmeinim (and any other air base in Syria) is instantly tracked in Israel. And if Su-57, which are naturally curious for Israel, rose from there, then approaching the F-35 (if it was, which I doubt very much) would be a decoy to scout them. And of course, the F-35 EPR would be the way we want the intelligence to be interesting.

[asv363]

Hardly tearing up an emery cloth, probably?

[3vs]

And where are the details that "F-35 is no longer stealth ..." ?!

[Grigory_45]

Quote: 3vs

And where are the details that "F-35 is no longer stealth ..." ?!

gentlemen decided to take the word))

[EvilLion]

What nonsense is this? Who did they find there? F-22, which still need to be met and on which the EPR is artificially inflated stupidly for the convenience of their own dispatchers?

[Hole puncher]

Quote: 3vs

And where are the details that "F-35 is no longer stealth ..." ?!

Well, I dare to assume:
Su-57 took to the air, turned on the radar and saw the pilot, that there was darkness around the Raptors, and Lightning aliens, and he shouted “get out of the dusk!” The enemy flyers were frightened then, the Orthodox waves electromagnetic to them burned the stealth hide and flew home crying to the chief bourgeois Lokhidov to complain, saying that your multibillion-dollar cover does not save from the sight of a Russian, we will no longer fly in the Syrian sky to protect bearded non-Christians ... And they wrote the entire application for care for treatment in a boarding house the anti-khibiny tears wiping away ...

[3vs]

It's five!!!

[Old26]

Quote: Altona

Quote: Donskoy

Why for this drive the Su-57 to Syria?

--------------------
Check the on-board equipment complexes and how he sees the signatures of the F-35 and F-22. One thing is virtual in absentia, another thing to check in.

The question is whether the American F-22s and F-35s were at that time in the range of his radar. The second question is whether they really flew with lenses or not. The only known thing about the SU-35 radar is that it sees a target with an EPR of 1 square meter at a distance of 400 km. And with the EPR of these American planes ?, In short, the note is about nothing, but the headline is biting ...

[outsider]

Quote: mishaia_23

In fact, it was necessary to check
It’s like Yugoslavia with f-117 stealth shot down, sorry, we just didn’t know that they were invisible ...
And now we know for sure that Russian on-board equipment sees pseudo stealth f-35 and f-22 aircraft

- There is only one single true and unique pseudo stealth, which has no analogues in the world, is the Su-57.

[PROXOR]

BUGAGA. The question is not in the stealth coating of SU57, but in the fact that the steamed Vu35 and Fu22 turned out to be quite a tooth for our locators. And do not tell me fables about the fact that Fu22 also works in passive mode. He is also blind without Avax. But the passive antenna of the Su57 is much more powerful than the Fu22.

[Grigory_45]

The stay in Syria of four Russian Su-57 aircraft made it possible, inter alia, to obtain additional data on the machine's ability to detect (using on-board equipment) the American F-22 and F-35

and this statement that is not specifically speaking allows us to draw a very far-reaching conclusion

F-35 is no longer stealth

? However...

[outsider]

Quote: Vadim851

Here is the R-37M and is suitable for placement in the internal compartment of the Su-57 rather than the giant KS-172.

- And what's the point of holding a huge rocket with a range of 300 km, if you can see the enemy’s aircraft only at a distance of 30 km ??

And the enemy, having missiles with a range of "only" 180 km, can see you for 300 km ?!
(Here the detection range of the F-22 and F-35 radar systems of the Su-35C is significantly overestimated.)

[SETTGF]

Outsider! Your chart is incorrect! Count yourself and you will be very amazed! This is just a PR not for specialists!

[ioan-e]

Quote: SETTGF

Outsider! Your chart is incorrect! Count yourself and you will be very amazed! This is just a PR not for specialists!

It can not be wrong, this is an advertising booklet FU-35!

[PROXOR]

This is in the passive mode of operation of the systems Fu35 and Fu22. But as soon as they start pointing to the Su35 they will immediately find themselves. Guidance without a locator is not possible. Fu can only do this with Avax, and so will our A-50s. And they will paint this Fu at a distance approximately where the typhoon is drawn.

[scientist]

Quote: Outsider

Here, the detection range of the F-22 and F-35 radar systems of the Su-35S is significantly overestimated

Do you know such a thing as a radar portrait of a target?

It is only in one plane and in one frequency range.
In addition to Irbis, the Su-35 has an optical-location station (there is neither F-35, 22) and the OEIS
In addition, the Su-35 is not intended for covert penetration into someone else's territory, therefore, unlike your F-35, it will receive information from ground stations, most of which operate in the meter and decimeter ranges and Stealth planes see even better than usual.

[Daniel]

Who told you this 30 km, you have the data of the Su-57 radar, but it's just ridiculous. Only the developers know the characteristics of the radar, all this is secret, and what they write in the media on the wiki is amateur

[Yarhann]

nice people are long-range missiles for aircraft that can be seen from afar, that is, AWACS aircraft. It is a combination of a DRLO + MFI airplane in stealth mode (all emitting reconnaissance means are turned off) and is applicable both for air combat and for ground operations. If f 35 or f 22 or some other hawk flies with the included radar - then it is no longer stealth. And without the radar turned on, you can’t find targets other than the near zone by thermal radiation (which is less than 50 km) and here both f 35 and su 35 see each other about the same shitty - naturally, when approaching, the thermal track becomes sharper and you can turn on the radar and to attack . But within the meaning of this application, the AWACS aircraft gives out target designations and MFIs only launch missiles or throw bombs - all weapons must be with ANN + GOS - that is, high-precision so as not to exit stealth mode. That is why it is first and foremost necessary to destroy AWACS aircraft. There is simply no other application for airplanes using stealth technologies - this is the only way. Naturally, the search and target designation can be done even by long-range ground-based radars, ships, etc. — in short, all means of radio-technical and radar reconnaissance of large power and range.

[outsider]

Quote: Fungus

You know better than a sofa expert than pilots who fly 57 in Syria.

- And where is the interview with the Su-57 pilots flying in Syria ??! There is only a rehash of Rabinovich’s arias performed by Caruso ... In a note, an unimaginable nonsense!
For your information: F-22 for all military events in Syria fly WITHOUT BLOCKS LENS LUNEBERG!

[outsider]

Quote: Old26

The only known thing about the SU-35 radar is that it sees a target with an EPR of 1 square meter at a distance of 400 km. And with the EPR of these American aircraft?

- No, sir, dear, Su-35S sees the target with EPR = 3 m² at a distance of 350 km, but under the conditions:
1. You can see the sector 10x10 = 100 square degrees.
2. The signal accumulation time in this solid angle is ~ 10 seconds.
3. The probability of target detection is 0.5.
And if you fumble with a beam all over the sky, trying to see: is there any stealth cursed ?! Since the radar pattern here needs to be rotated much faster, the sky is huge, the detection range for a standard (American standard) target of 1 m² Irbis radar, being “reduced to a common denominator”, for example, with F-35 radar APG-81, will not be 350 km, but only ~ 85 km.
I understand that it is very difficult for you to believe in it, it is almost impossible, but this is a medical fact ...

[bk316]

Michael You know NOTHING about the capabilities of the SU-57 radar. And most likely nothing about real ERP and F-35 and F-22 signatures. And judging by your comments, there is very little about radar.
So do not disgrace.

[xtur]

> 2. The signal accumulation time in this solid angle is ~ 10 seconds.

There is hardly a person here who does not understand what you are talking about secret characteristics whose carriers do not disclose such information.
The old one (26) once said about the reception that you are supposed to use - the accumulation time will change in your messages or in other messages, tracking the activity of special services to find out the true accumulation time.

This reception of special services 100 years in the afternoon. So all your activity is the best evidence that you do not know anything about the Su-57 radar.

And yes - the optical station sees the F-22 and F-35 at about a range 10 times greater than what you voiced. That's the price of your claims. And since there is no reliable information in your statements, then the reason for your activity is the search for important information - simply, you are a spy at work

This conclusion is even more reliable than all your reasoning.

[PROXOR]

And he will fly not including the radar ?! And how will he be cursed induced?

[SETTGF]

Outsider! And then you turned everything over to your advantage for complacency!

[outsider]

Quote: 3vs

And where are the details that "F-35 is no longer stealth ..." ?!

“These are not the details.” This is "bullshit on a moonlit night."

[outsider]

Quote: Altona

Quote: Donskoy

Why for this drive the Su-57 to Syria?

--------------------
Check the on-board equipment complexes and how he sees the signatures of the F-35 and F-22. One thing is virtual in absentia, another thing to check in.

1. F-35 is not there at all (except in Israel).
2. Well, let him let them examine their signatures ?? Who will be substituted?
3. And to hell, in order to remove the stealth signatures, you need to send the Su-57 there ?? Any powerful radar is suitable for this.
4. Radar Su-57 N-036 "Squirrel" according to all data has not yet been launched into series, not brought to mind. And how long will the Su-57 be produced with the engines of the first stage - it is not clear with what while they will be launched?

[rotmistr60]

Outsider, I hope that after the sixth comment you have reassured the rushing soul of the representative of Israel overflowing with information? The main thing is that you don’t bother much; for the time being, you are not threatened with war.

[PROXOR]

Kaspers are always ready to fight. The belly button will ever come loose.

[SETTGF]

Outsider! Young sofa strategist! To begin with, learn the basics of radar in order to have at least an idea of ​​how the target detection range is calculated and what it depends on! Judging by your statements, you do not know this, with your knowledge of the student! No need to write a lie and wishful thinking! Radar 036 "Squirrel" is in service with the Russian Aerospace Forces and the first batch of Su-57 aircraft is under construction. And try to calculate at what distance your F-35s will be detected, but for this you need to know the radar parameters that are secret and the image intensifier tubes (EPR) of the F-35s that are also secret! And the rest - "grandmother said" and no more ...

[SETTGF]

Outsider! Weak to count?

[PROXOR]

Of course weak. If he writes nonsense. It makes sense to detect Fu35 in general if it rushing in passive mode. He is blind as a kitten. It has an alarm that it is illuminated by a radar. But induced by this signal, he will not be able to. Although I may already don’t know what. Is there air-to-air airborne while the active guidance head emits radar radiation?

[voyaka uh]

"Fu35 if he rushing in the passive mode. He is blind as a kitten" ////

This is not true. In passive mode, he can even conduct reconnaissance.

[Yarhann]

at what distance, but a connoisseur))) do not make laugh - it is with the help of an optoelectronic system that will only see that it is heat-contrast, that is, even flying over a disguised tank or military air defense like Arrow, it will not notice it while Arrow will notice this plane invisibly in the same thermal spectrum it will launch a couple of missiles - an attack with which the stealth will also not be warned.
What are you going to find there in the thermal spectrum? Here's a stinger in the ass or the Igloo get it all the same yes it is possible but no more. That nobody canceled radio intelligence - but there is already a second task - selection of targets what it is and whether it is worth it.
The passive mode is cool but from the ground a hot plane against a cold sky is always better visible than something cold on the ground - that is, with such a search, the probability that the plane will be detected on the ground is greater than the fact that the plane will detect anything.

[SETTGF]

Outsider! To your lie, the first batch of Su-1 aircraft was manufactured with 57-stage engines, 2 aircraft ordered by the Russian Ministry of Defense ... Delivery will be in 12! Rejoice!

[igorbrsv]

Quote: Govorun

And remember how not a few very interesting and promising developments were ruined in our USSR so that it is not necessary to say that under the USSR everything would have been finalized and put into the armed forces, do not live by the illusions of a beautiful past and a gloomy present, because, because then that now there are a lot of nuances (I do not take into account the human factor of politicians) that influenced and influence the creation of this technique.

But there were much more achievements in the USSR. And now it’s naturally difficult to lift the military-industrial complex to its feet

[outsider]

Quote: Gregory_45

Quote: Govorun

it’s not necessary to say that under the USSR everything would have been finalized and delivered to the Armed Forces

and yet the chances would be higher. In the USSR, somehow the Su-27 (besides paired with the MiG-29) was rattled and adopted - and at that time the machines were at the same level as the current Su-57.

- No need to tell ridiculous fables about the “level” of the MiG-29 - their 15 F-1991C was driven by “pissing rags” in Iraq until on the 4th day of “Desert Storm” Saddam ordered them to be driven to Iran (where the Iranians they were then confiscated in the manner of indemnities for the war of 1980-88).
No fables about the "level", the level in relation to the enemy is checked only in real fights with this enemy. Unless, of course, you have airplanes that allow you to qualitatively simulate the enemy during exercises. But "hde to take them" ?!

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Outsider! Your chart is incorrect! Count yourself and you will be very amazed! This is just a PR not for specialists!

- I was right there and said that she was wrong. In fact, during normal scanning of the space, the Su-35C will see the F-22 / F-35 at a distance of approximately 8-9 kilometers. That is: it will see first visually, through the flashlight, and only then through the radar.
But in real combat conditions, this means that the Su-35S will be shot down 20 times already.

[SETTGF]

Outsider! Again a lie from you! You are not an expert! Su-35 much earlier than you wrote, will see the Israeli F-35 and bring it down! And do not wishful thinking! Weak to count?

[Yarhann]

Yes, that's just in the same optical range, he will notice it much earlier))) well, and in close air combat, there’s a little chance that f22 and especially f 35

[outsider]

Quote: rotmistr60

Outsider, I hope that after the sixth comment you have reassured the rushing soul of the representative of Israel overflowing with information? The main thing is that you don’t bother much; for the time being, you are not threatened with war.

- Well, if you give guarantees - then everything is in order!
And the soul is not tossing and shifting, but these are two different things. One must study the native language, not Hebrew, tea ...
http://otvet.expert/kak-proverit-slovo-myatushiys
ya-1430471

[rotmistr60]

And the soul is not rushing, but restless

I advise you to recall your native language at your leisure. There is such a definition as a rushing soul (from the word rushing).

[Zaurbek]

I think that the industry is not yet ready for Su57 (mass production is a separate song), nor operation ... And the Russian Air Force is not even full of 4+ generation aircraft ... This is besides the unavailability of Su57 itself ... a bird in his hand ...

[Vadim237]

Su 57 is looking forward to a good export future, but its time has already passed, an aircraft that has become obsolete has been working on it for 18 years, now the sixth generation is being actively developed, both in the USA and in Russia.

[SETTGF]

Vadim237! And what is it that is morally obsolete?

[Zaurbek]

For example:
1.44 was also designed as a 5th generation aircraft (in accordance with the requirements of the Air Force of that time). Actually, it turned out to be a larger Rafal. (Rafal was too late). During the design of the T-50, new composites may have appeared in the Russian Federation, the proportion of which could be increased in the airframe (but for this it needs to be fully designed).

We can only speculate.

[Vadim237]

On the way, new materials engines and avionics.

[Zaurbek]

Engines, yes .... and% of new composites can be dramatically increased in the design without remaking the glider? The T-50 in this is inferior, for example, to Rafal.

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Vadim237! And what is it that is morally obsolete?

- He is obsolete, not having time to be born, for an elementary reason: because by the most important criterion, the ratio efficiency / cost, it is very significantly inferior to the Su-35S.

[SETTGF]

Outsider! You are deeply mistaken! First, look at the meaning of the expression
"morally obsolete"! And the Su-57 surpasses the Su-35 and is still inferior to the criterion in terms of cost, but when it goes into large batches in a series, it will begin to approach the Su-35 by the cost criterion ... so for all new aircraft and other equipment. State defense sometimes cost criterion is higher Compare F-15 and F-35 - it will be the same at the initial stage ...

[outsider]

Quote: bk316

Michael You know NOTHING about the capabilities of the SU-57 radar. And most likely nothing about real ERP and F-35 and F-22 signatures. And judging by your comments, there is very little about radar.
So do not disgrace.

- Don’t tell my slippers, "Colonel General" ...

[SETTGF]

Outsider! What is the image intensifier of the F22 and the F-35? What is the range of radar 036 "Squirrel"? You yourself could not calculate the distance at which the Su-57 detects the F-35 ... and at what F-35 it detects the Su-57! Weak?

[Zaurbek]

Su-35S still fly and fly ... I wonder if the Product30 engines will eventually be installed on the Su-35S?

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Outsider! What is the image intensifier of the F22 and the F-35?

- I’ll say - you still won’t believe it!

What is the range of radar 036 "Squirrel"?

- Until now, nobody has absolutely told me anywhere that it is stable, confidently functioning. I’m dancing from Irbis so far, at least there is data about that.

You yourself could not calculate the distance at which the Su-57 will detect the F-35 ...

- As soon as at least some scanty information about the “Squirrel” appears, only then will it be possible to think something on this topic. But for now, with her as with the engine of the second stage - what can we talk about at all ??

... and on which F-35 will find the Su-57!

- But this is just easier than easy: D obn. targets with EPR = 1 m² radar APG-81 - 160 km. EPR Su-57 - 0.5 m², respectively, it will be detected at D = 160 / √√ (1: 0.5) = 160 / 1.1892 = 134.5 km.

[SETTGF]

Outsider! You write a lie again! Already completed manufacturing order
12 Su-57 aircraft for the Russian Aerospace Forces with a 2nd stage engine! Finally, the aircraft will be delivered to the troops in 2019 ... with the Squirrel radar 036, which operates "without problems" ... the Su-57 EOP (EPR) is not 0,5 square meters! - accordingly, all your calculations are incorrect !!!

[outsider]

Quote: Zaurbek

Su-35S still fly and fly ... I wonder if the Product30 engines will eventually be installed on the Su-35S?

- If provided for by compartment dimensions and attachment points ...

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Outsider! You are deeply mistaken!

- If it seems so to you, it means that you misunderstood something in this place ...

For starters, look at the meaning of the phrase "morally obsolete"!

- And then I do not know the meaning of this expression ?!

And the Su-57 surpasses the Su-35 and is inferior to the criterion in cost so far, but when it goes in large batches in a series, it will begin to approach the Su-35 in terms of cost ... so for all new aircraft and other equipment.

“No, sir, however.” Until now, elderly aunts have glued the composite sheathing of the Su-57 with strained hands in rubber gloves. In the USA, this is done by conveyor robots. Cost and pace are simply incomparable ...

The defense capability of the state is sometimes above the cost criterion.

- Absolutely right! Therefore, when it turned out that as a result of extremely low visibility (EPR ~ 0.0001-0.0002 m²), the F-22 knocks down F-15, -16, -18 “packs-cars”, at a ratio of 144: 0, the US Department of Defense is ecstatic I did not regret that I had to pay $ 386 million per unit (counting from R&D). But when it turned out that the EPR of the Su-57 was only 0.5 m², that is, comparable to the EPR of Rafal and Eurofighter, the Russian Defense Ministry and the Air Force command said: and on a fig we need such a ?? What the hell is the use of it over the modern battlefield, if it is almost the same as the Su-35S ?! And purely symbolic. so as not to lose face, not to lose prestige, reputation for good, they ordered 12 units until hell knows which year (2027 ??).

Compare F-15 and F-35 - it will be the same at the initial stage ...

- ?? F-35 in a duel situation in aerial combat (which always starts with DVB and nothing else!) F-15 fells 10 times out of 10, 20 times out of 20, 50 times out of 50 ... you still do not know ?!
Despite the fact that in general the F-35 is mainly a drummer and its main purpose is to work on ground targets ...

[SETTGF]

Outsider! Your data from the Internet is completely incorrect! The desire of the United States is to wishful thinking and no more ... If you were an expert in the field of Radar, you wouldn’t write such nonsense with respect to the F-35 EOR (ESR), and even more so with regard to the Su-35! And also the image intensifier tubes in different directions and at different wavelengths are different and moreover the F-35 image intensifier can not be commensurate with an image intensifier such as a sparrow! According to your statements, you don’t know the Su-57 radar emitter (ESR) and especially the Belka radar 036’s parameters, while you’re trying to spit on the Su-57 radar, it’s supposedly unstable, it’s an outright lie on your part and no more .. But I compared the F-35 aircraft with the F-15 in terms of the cost-effectiveness of manufacturing new equipment with the "old" * modernized one, and you are trying to answer this with a "stupid" not even technical comparison ... carefully read the dialogue and do not engage in forgery!
Regarding the calculations, you calculated the detection range of the Su-57 radar
The APG-81 didn’t have accurate data, and then presented inaccurate data on the F-22 - it’s also a forgery ... You did your calculations in half a day, but I can count it in 10 minutes and in most cases I’m thinking! Therefore, even here you are trying to assume here and no more, which is also false, Israeli ...

[SETTGF]

Outsider! And more precisely, even no more than 5 minutes in the mind takes such a calculation and no more!

[SETTGF]

Outsider! According to your children's sayings about detection in solid angle while decreasing the number of pulses in a packet, you forgot about increasing sensitivity in the denominator of the equation due to ... for Russian radars! Scratch your chest with a heel - which is so far away, a school strategist and no more!

[sentaniel]

Quote: Outsider

- Absolutely right! Therefore, when it turned out that as a result of extremely low visibility (EPR ~ 0.0001-0.0002 m²), the F-22 knocks down F-15, -16, -18 “packs-cars” in the ratio 144: 0

Look for the EA18G pilot’s blog, which in a scientific battle in 2009 defeated the F22 as easily as a blind kitten. No stealth will help when the radar is “blinded”)) And how will F22 destroy from above the SU-35, when it will have hundreds of marks of this SU-35 on the radar?

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Outsider! Again, a lie from you! You are not an expert!

- Of course, I'm an expert.

Su-35 much earlier than you wrote, will see the Israeli F-35 and bring it down!

- And why did you get this ?? SUBSTANTIATE ??

And do not wishful thinking! Weak to count?

- I counted everything a long time ago and counted it five times ... And here you are - no, sir. You don’t even know how to do it! ..

[SETTGF]

Outsider! Your data from the Internet is completely incorrect! The desire of the United States is to wishful thinking and no more ... If you were an expert in the field of Radar, you wouldn’t write such nonsense with respect to the F-35 EOR (ESR), and even more so with regard to the Su-35! And also the image intensifier tubes in different directions and at different wavelengths are different and moreover the F-35 image intensifier can not be commensurate with an image intensifier such as a sparrow! According to your statements, you don’t know the Su-57 radar emitter (ESR) and especially the Belka radar 036’s parameters, while you’re trying to spit on the Su-57 radar, it’s supposedly unstable, it’s an outright lie on your part and no more .. But I compared the F-35 aircraft with the F-15 in terms of the cost-effectiveness of manufacturing new equipment with the "old" * modernized one, and you are trying to answer this with a "stupid" not even technical comparison ... carefully read the dialogue and do not engage in forgery!
Regarding the calculations, you calculated the detection range of the Su-57 radar
The APG-81 didn’t have accurate data, and then presented inaccurate data on the F-22 - it’s also a forgery ... You did your calculations in half a day, but I can count it in 10 minutes and in most cases I’m thinking! Therefore, even here you are trying to assume here and no more, which is also false, Israeli ...

[SETTGF]

Outsider! And more precisely, even no more than 5 minutes in the mind takes such a calculation and no more!

[SETTGF]

Outsider! According to your children's sayings about detection in solid angle while decreasing the number of pulses in a packet, you forgot about increasing sensitivity in the denominator of the equation due to ... for Russian radars! Scratch your chest with a heel - which is so far away, a school strategist and no more!

[outsider]

Quote: scientist

Quote: Outsider

Here, the detection range of the F-22 and F-35 radar systems of the Su-35S is significantly overestimated

Do you know such a thing as a radar portrait of a target?

- Well then!

It is only in one plane and in one frequency range.

- Who would have thought?!

In addition to Irbis, the Su-35 has an optical-location station (there is no F-35, 22)

- Yes, you, respectable, do not know the materiel at all, it turns out!
https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/products/f-3
5-lightning-ii-eots.html

and OEIS

- You absolutely do not know the materiel:
https://www.google.co.il/search?biw=1024&bih=
635 & tbm = vid & ei = OVU-W93oHIu3kwW6tomIDA &
;q=F-22+AN%2FAAR-56&oq=F-22+AN%2FAAR-56&g
s_l = psy-ab.3 ... 24075.25724.0.27787.5.5.0.0.0.0.14
4.556.1j4.5.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..0.0.0....0.W
jt1v3TmJs4

In addition, the Su-35 is not intended for covert penetration into foreign territory

- What absurdity: a military aircraft "is not intended to penetrate into someone else's territory" ?? Only Voronezh will bomb, or what ?!

therefore, unlike your F-35, it will receive information from ground stations, most of which operate in the meter and decimeter ranges and Stealth aircraft see even better than usual.

- And where did they tell you this fable ?!

[Mentat]

Quote: bk316

Michael You know NOTHING about the capabilities of the SU-57 radar. And most likely nothing about real ERP and F-35 and F-22 signatures. And judging by your comments, there is very little about radar.
So do not disgrace.

He sits here promoting the ultra-expensive F-35 junk, which was sculpted by the entire NATO world from what it was, as a result they blinded the crazy under-something that is behind the TTX from the Russian aircraft, plus it lags behind technologically. I already wrote here that they not only do not install ISS stations on their aircraft (analogues of the Atoll), they are unable to do, because they are technologically behind in this area.
How to explain this to your allies? No way. Nothing to explain, impossible. So they are sitting here, puffing, puffing, some “ridiculous” absurdly composing about the “superiority” of their Pepelats sucked out of a finger with worthless flight characteristics. And the tales of how the stealth cannot see the mubut from the jungle in their radar, assembled from the microwave in a local forge, which at the same time horseshoes the oxen, are already fed up with everyone.

[Vkd dvk]

The development of P-37M designers began at the end of 2000-s. It was planned that the rocket will go into service with the MiG-31 interceptor. However, it was later decided to modify the ammunition and equip them with the Su-30 and Su-35 fighters. For this, the starting mass and the length of the product have been reduced.


You need to be careful when writing (describing events). Until the end of 2000 you still have to live.

[Victoria-V]

Former Commander-in-Chief of the Aerospace Forces of the Russian Federation Viktor Bondarev emphasized that it would take time for large-scale production of the Su-57 in Russia. “In the first year, the Aerospace Forces will not receive 20 or 15 aircraft, only two or three, and so on,” the chairman of the Council said. The lack of engines of the second stage, weak EPR, it is possible to list the disadvantages of the Su-57 ad infinitum. And by the way, the Indians, the only potential customers of the Su-57, who are already rejecting this project and are looking towards F-35, know about all these shortcomings. So now think why these imperfections were sent to Syria. The F-35 fighter is in service with the US Air Force in the amount of 175 units, and has also been adopted by Australia, Britain, Israel, Italy, the Netherlands, Norway and Japan. And this does not take into account future deliveries under contracts with Denmark, Turkey, etc.

[SETTGF]

Dear Ukrainian student Victoria-V! Carefully read the news and do not write nonsense ... 12 copies of the Su-57 with engines of the 2nd stage have already been made ... this batch will be delivered to the troops in 2019!

[SETTGF]

Victoria-V! Before you write a lie about the Su-57 EOP (EPR), you need to know ...

[Victoria-V]

I am in the subject. Let's link to the engines.

[SETTGF]

Victoria!
Link: https: //www.google.com/url? Sa = t & source = w
eb & rct = j & url = https: //inosmi.ru/amp/politi
c / 20180702 / 242650787.html & ved = 2ahUKEwjwwZ_Sg4
vcAhVK2ywKHT_sABYQFjAAegQIARAB & usg = AOvVaw23yP
lp5tNv5AQe1Mx6cCkf&ampcf=1

[SETTGF]

Victoria! Signed-up link!

[mc1aren]

chatterbox - a find for the spy ...;)

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Victoria-V! Before you write a lie about the Su-57 EOP (EPR), you need to know ...

- You tell the Indians, otherwise they do not know ...

[SETTGF]

Outsider! Better to such illiterate Israeli students like you!

[Victoria-V]

Hindus in the know. What do you not know? They threw us to the fullest ...

[Victoria-V]

And about the Russian fleet, because a similar situation. Just two weeks ago, in the article “Marine superpower again postponed“ for later ”my super-destroyer“ Leader ”wrote that the laying of the newest Russian destroyer of project 23560“ Leader ”, the design of which was carried out since 2009, was postponed indefinitely - after 2020 of the year. This fact confirmed my version that Russian shipyards are not able today to cope with the construction of a surface combat ship with a displacement of more than 10 thousand tons, reports news.enovosty.com. And now, less than six months have passed, and another hint appears that the poor fellow “Leader” may not see the horizon at all. So, according to the draft “Strategy for the development of the shipbuilding industry for the period until 2035”, which was prepared by the Ministry of Industry and Trade of the Russian Federation, such objects of imaginary pride of Russians as the aircraft carrier of project 23000E “Storm” and the destroyer of project 23560 “Leader” mentioned above, in the event of a drop in oil prices to $ 60 per barrel and below, may not see the light right up to 2035. And who needs them in 2035, outdated and “dull” - the question is already another.

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Outsider! Better to such illiterate Israeli students like you!

- My dear, when I graduated from school, you are still not something in the world - you were not in the project yet! ..

[SETTGF]

Outsider! Little girl is you and not only! Before you write nonsense, you need to know! The radar showed - you have little knowledge according to age, which means that you are a child, and you are not a specialist in the field of radar, learn to measure who is conducting a dialogue with you ... and this speaks of your childhood! A person becomes wiser towards old age, but you won’t say that!

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Outsider! Little girl is you and not only! Before you write nonsense, you need to know! The radar showed - you have little knowledge according to age, which means that you are a child, and you are not a specialist in the field of radar, learn to measure who is conducting a dialogue with you ... and this speaks of your childhood! A person becomes wiser towards old age, but you won’t say that!

- Will you ever begin to back up your ridiculous “theses” with at least some serious arguments?

[SETTGF]

Outsider! If my arguments are funny to you, then you are still young, then there’s nothing to talk about ...

[1970mk]

What a nonsense! What is a combat use? They don’t have engines — what will make them competitive — engines — are still being tested .... Dviglo is on an old glider .... The armament is also being developed .... They found something from the Dryers of the Su-27 family everybody? Great, but nonsense ...

[outsider]

Quote: SETTGF

Outsider! If my arguments are funny to you, then you are still young, then there’s nothing to talk about ...

- You do not give arguments, however ... "Muddle instead of music" ...