Do we need a powerful AK-15?

So, the Russian army has adopted a new machine. Yes, not one, but four at once. These are AK-12, AK-15, AEK-971 and AEK-973. The first two will go to the regular troops, the rest - to the special forces.

Of particular interest is the new Kalashnikov assault rifles, the development of which was launched just 6 years ago, while the AEK assault rifles exist from the 90's.

Control mechanisms for 5,45-mm AK-12 and 7,62-mm AK-15 significantly reworked. weapons. Machines have become more ergonomic. Significantly reduced recoil when fired. The target range has grown to 1000 meters.

Picatinny rail is integrated into the rifles, which makes it easy to install additional sighting equipment, rifle grenade launchers, tactical lights, etc.

On the basis of new machines it is planned to create 20 of various civil and military modifications.

Comments

[Lexus]

In principle, nothing tricky. One is the main sample (AK-12) and several specialized ones.

[Falcond]

Are you raising a panic ?? Any question needs economic feasibility

[Wreaper]

In general, in the weapons and firearms community of developers, it is already considered as 30 that the peak has been passed. The point is that radically weapons from the beginning of the twentieth century have not changed and will not change in the near future if the notorious "new principles" are not found. The intermediate cartridge has been over 100 years old, the rest is trifles, super-precision manufacturing, replacing materials with new, lighter ones, balancing weapons - these are trifles in comparison with the advent of automatic weapons, as such a unitary cartridge, cutting barrels ... and all these discoveries already well over 100 years old. A shotgun is at an impasse ... It doesn’t make sense to create a supermachine gun even on altered calibers, there are laws of physics for which a particular caliber works, the relationship of diameter * mass * length * length of trunks and weight, but for everything there are limitations, you won’t shoot from an ultralight machine gun or from a 4m rifle, as you won’t take it with you ... And the main thing for the army is the production cost per million pieces + stock per gram. the population and ease of management, what would you use as a club ... It would be nice to just throw a few cartridges into the chamber / holder and it would be an ideal weapon ... Kalash therefore lives so long, he does not need to change, he incorporated a lot of all the most practical solutions and here is the result ...

[Bobrovsky]

That's right. Here you can add this. There are interesting memoirs on the Internet of the infantry officer "Vanka-company." He writes that in battle sights are not needed at all. People are stressed and just shoot towards the enemy. The war showed that snipers effectively shoot up to 800 meters, excellent shooters up to 600, and ordinary shooters up to 400. Even the Mosin rifle, with its powerful cartridge, gives a spread of one square meter at a kilometer distance. Attempts to make a sniper rifle under an intermediate cartridge turned out to be futile, after three hundred meters the bullet is already beginning to be worn in different directions. Therefore, on the machine you can do the cutting of the sight as much as one and a half kilometers, but there is no sense in it. We need to teach shooters to fully use their weapons. The new machine will not give anything so superhigh. But it will be economically expensive.

[NG inform]

New principles - is to increase the intelligence of weapons and its integration into a common information network on the battlefield.
Those. a modern automatic rifle is obliged to provide the ability to shoot a shooter while behind cover, is obliged to show objects that are not visible from the shooter's point of view, but are detected by other observers. Shoot shells, not bullets.
Soon it will be completely normal situation, for example, when a shooter conducts aimed fire at visually invisible opponents hiding in the forest. Russia is not at all ready for this, but it is already coming.

[Nahum]

I can assume that in the near future firearms will become irrelevant. It will be replaced by a beam weapon, for example a laser one. In general, a person will leave the battlefield - in shelters with remote control. "Fight" will be robots. And mainly - in the information space. Enemies will strive to win without killing and destroying, but subjugating the enemy, reformatting their consciousness. It will be terrible wars ...

[sub307]

What kind of panic? Just the facts .... I, personally, would also add to the "list" of VNEU for non-nuclear PLPL, the promised "God knows" when. Is this lag also for reasons of "economic expediency"? Loss of primacy in manned space probably also. But this very “expediency” looks like “economic impotence”. Well, what else? When at first they “shake the atmosphere” with all kinds of declarations like: yes, in the Mistral, we’ll build our own, even aircraft carriers .... and then -ops .... no money, “shift to the right” habitually ... in an uncertain future .

[Ezekiel 25-17]

Son, to me on an urgent, in 1978, at night it was possible to get into a light bulb on a growth at 200m. Hands must be sung and brains in the head.

[gromoboj]

Alas, this is so. You ask a person to say the same thing, but in Russian, he cannot pick up a word.

[Falcond]

It seems that two machines are needed to stupidly keep the production of the Kovrov plant ... It would be ridiculous to assume that AK would be abandoned in favor of AEK ...

[Victor_B]

Quote: FalconD

It seems that two machines are needed to stupidly keep the production of the Kovrov plant ...

But do not tell me what's wrong with that?
And how many in percentages will AEK / AK be issued?
Maybe not scary?

[Falcond]

I didn’t say that it’s bad ... the same thing happened in the 90s with the companies Sukhoi and MiG ... MiG barely saved then ...
Most recently, during the tests, they wrote that AEK is superior to AK in a number of parameters .. therefore they decided for a long time who to be and who not ... But there was a solution!)

Can you imagine the news: "The Russian army abandoned the Kalashnikov assault rifle" ????)

[Dmitry Tantsyura]

I hope in the Kalimator simple AA or AAA battery?

[Falcond]

Why do you need such a hope?

[Thompson]

And in what military are they installed ???

[Victor_B]

The question is simply whether the army needs an automatic machine chambered for 7,62x39?
If necessary, then it should be identical to the 5,45 caliber assault rifle.
And this is regardless of brand and manufacturer.
As for the AEK-971 and AEK-973, they will not be issued in millions of copies, therefore they will not overload the budget, but it seems they have serious advantages over AK. The Kalashnikov Concern simply sold / lobbied for its AKs, but they had a serious trump card - the price!
And this is not so much the price of the product itself, but also the cost of deploying a new production.
For the total cost of changing the main machine is the cost of building an aircraft carrier along with the air group modestly smokes in the corner!

[Falcond]

And the military would not have refused to reject Kalashnikov ... AEK is more difficult, this is useless for a soldier ...

About the caliber, the question is urgent .. it has long been said that an intermediate 6,5 is needed ... therefore they cannot refuse 7,62

[Victor_B]

And the military would not have refused to reject Kalashnikov ... AEK is more difficult, this is useless for a soldier ...

Yes crazy with this complexity gone!
The other day, for the first time in a video about the AN-94, I looked in detail at disassembly / assembly - so what's so complicated?
Nothing! Everything is thought out and simple!
Harder than AK? Yes! But not a problem!
I think that AEK is definitely no more complicated than AN.

[Alexander Bagaev]

Technically 6.5 is more interesting. Flatness, wind drift. But! The economic part of the rearmament is fantastic.

[Falcond]

So it all rests on

[Alexander Bagaev]

Under 5.45 there is no subsonic cartridge. Under 7.62 - is.

[Northern warrior]

There is also a subsonic 5.45 mm. The mass of his bullet is increased to 5.15 grams, and the speed is reduced to 300 m / s.

[MRomanovich]

How to understand this video? Are the authors of this video full of zeros in weapons or is it intentional? What the hell are Definitive Arms, Krebs Custom and their AK15, which has nothing to do with our AK15.

[shootnik113]

Totally agree

[dDYHA]

The comrades who say laugh- We have all the warehouses littered with modifications of the Kalashnikov assault rifle. Like why release? I think Berdan's single-shot rifles were also full in warehouses. But all the same, they re-equipped with a three-ruler. Progress is not worth it. It is possible to take something better.

[rasteer]

And there’s nothing funny in such logic. There is no special difference between AK-74 and AK-12, it’s not a berdan and a mosquito for you. But the quantity in the warehouses is such that it will be enough for several tens of years of operation in the troops. But the situation with AEK is different, it’s just a really evolutionary step against the background of Kalash, and not only the special forces need it. But lobbyism, as you know, is an evil thing.

[Valery Saitov]

Do we need a powerful AK-15?)))
Even as needed. Especially during operations in the mountains.

[Alexander Pugachev]

Yes, what’s there - there should always be a choice of weapons, even if you choose a shovel on your own ... Well, and about the complexity - so collecting for one Rubik’s cube is not a question, but for another 2 * 2 problem

[Abel]

And nefig all give AEK. This is a machine for the pros, special forces.

[Xscorpion]

Quote: Alexander Bagaev

Under 5.45 there is no subsonic cartridge. Under 7.62 - is.

There is a 7U1 5,45mm caliber, but the last time I saw these cartridges was in the beginning of the 2000s. It seems like they were withdrawn from service at the present time. But I think it will not be difficult to restore their production if necessary. Caliber 7,62 is needed, still in reconnaissance units do not refuse AKMs of the 60s, although their technical condition has long left much to be desired. If AK-15s have at least partially eliminated AKM's shortcomings, in particular, a stronger return compared to 5,45 caliber, then he already has the right to life. And, apparently, they worked on this.

[shootnik113]

Brother, the impact on the AKM is not a problem, the problem is a dangling butt ... but the quality of the barrel and assembly outweigh all the shortcomings ... sorry if I offended ..

[cultural post]

They did everything right. The ability to produce both types of automatic rifles in series is definitely a plus
In addition, the military-industrial complex of peacetime (that is, not a total war) is, above all, not only economy but also the economy.
Kalashnikov Concern has developed a serious scientific base and not only in the military industry and modern production, therefore it is very expedient to finance it indirectly. As far as I understand, the Degtyarev Plant can also produce AK-12, along with AEK, since it is currently mass-producing the Kalashntkovs and will not be left out

[Thompson]

For pessimists and gorlopans, the question is: How many years has the arsenal been armed with the states, with the Germans about etc, etc. ???
Since when did they become excellence in the midst of weapons? Leave your collective and small-town reasoning for your fellow villagers. Upstairs, too, are not all fools, and you cannot push shit with lobbyism alone.

[Navigator Basov]

It is AR-15 (self-loading) that the United States has not been in service with for any number of years (0 years), but is sold only on the civilian market (sports, hunting, self-defense).

[Savignon]

Well that's it, now no enemy is afraid of us.
Tired of watching, the meaning in the video itself is repeated several times.

[Catfish]

Quote: Valery Saitov

Do we need a powerful AK-15?)))
Even as needed. Especially during operations in the mountains.

Yes, and in the woods does not hurt, I do not remember that from the trunks ricocheted. And in urban areas and even more so. No, there would be a choice, then of course AK15. And about the accuracy ... Correctly said Comrade. Ezekiel: you need to be able to shoot.

[shootnik113]

Just compare the energy of 5,45 and 7,62, and you will understand that it is not necessary to pierce a bulletproof vest ...

[shootnik113]

Dear, I have been using AK products for more than a dozen years, and so ...
The quality of AK has recently been lower than the plinth, (over the past 5 years it has changed 3 machines) with active use even in a peaceful environment, when it is possible to immediately clean, chrome plating from the gas piston flies already in 2 weeks ... Sights are installed ... probably the blind ... Burnishing ... this is not bluing, but some kind of paint ... In good times, it was called sabotage and for this the military acceptance and directorate were shot ...
As for the new models, I don’t agree at all with the enthusiastic howls of the correspondent ... The mine reception window for shops is “like on the M-16,” a step back that will lead to delays in the combat situation, the ability to shoot from the open shutter thanks to the new fuse, such so rubbish! Have you tried to disassemble the new AK12? Another pleasure for lovers of alternative sex ... At an exhibition in Alabino, I tried to connect the store from one sample to another, guess what happened? And the old 5.45 and 7.62 do not fit ... Sabotage and exhaustion of money from the budget of clean water, And it started from the moment when pure athletes came to the Concern’s management, but the sport is different ...

[shootnik113]

Sorry, I wrote chaotically, but really STILL! The machine should be simple and reliable. It should be possible to disassemble it, sorry, in a trench in a footcloth, without additional keys and fixtures, details from one should be suitable for anyone. For specialists, a modernization kit can go, and as for accuracy, I agree ... if your hands grow out of hands, then a sniper rifle will not help .. Learn to shoot. AK has excellent accuracy. allowing to carry out a combat mission up to 400, and with a certain training up to 600 meters

[Abel]

Nevertheless, 5,45 is rather weak. Bronik will not break. 7,62 heavier, but if ..... then it will not seem enough. AEKs are good for special services. Interestingly, old stores 7,62 fit?

[shootnik113]

Abel, are you talking about the needle bed, have you heard anything?
Breaks through ...

[shootnik113]

Dear, I have been an AK user with experience, and so, what can I tell you ... The quality of the AK in the last 15 years has collapsed below the baseboard, over the past 5 years I have changed 3 automatic machines (AK-103), chrome stupidly crumbles on the gas piston and the barrel after 2-3 weeks of dense fire training, and sights are probably installed ... blind. In the best of times, this was called sabotage, and for this the directorate of the plant and military representative was sent to Kolyma at best, and ideally they were taken out into the open field, placed facing the wall and shot into the forehead.
Did you hold new AKs in your hands? Have you tried to make out without hammering a hammer and a screwdriver? And on your knees in the trench? And now the most interesting thing, have you tried to take a store from a friend and attach it to your machine? I didn’t succeed at my exhibition in Alabino ... And the old shops do not suit them ... TAMPERING and exhausting the dough from the budget!
I will not join the enthusiastic howls of the correspondent! The mine (like the M-16) shop window is a step backward, in a combat situation this will lead to a delay, like firing from an open shutter, while you move around so you make a mess of the chamber that you have to disassemble and clean, but it wasn’t .. All this nonsense in the concern began after the athletes, having seen the video with Costa and Juarez, came to the leadership, only they forgot that they are making the machine for the war, and not for the shooting gallery! In general, not an automaton, but one continuous misunderstanding. Sorry, I wrote chaotically, but really STILL! The machine should be simple and reliable. It should be possible to disassemble it, sorry, in a trench in a footcloth, without additional keys and fixtures, details from one should be suitable for anyone. For specialists, a modernization kit can go, and as for accuracy, I agree ... if your hands grow out of hands, then a sniper rifle will not help .. Learn to shoot. AK has excellent accuracy. allowing to carry out a combat mission up to 400, and with a certain training up to 600 meters

[Navy7981]

Join. "" The machine should be simple and reliable. It should be possible to disassemble it, excuse me, in a trench in a footcloth, without additional keys and fixtures, details from one must fit any ""
Used AKM and 74 gray years of release. There were no claims to weapons. Unfortunately, I didn’t use modern ones, I can’t compare, but there were no complaints about those that were.

[Xscorpion]

Quote: shootnik113

Brother, the impact on the AKM is not a problem, the problem is a dangling butt ... but the quality of the barrel and assembly outweigh all the shortcomings ... sorry if I offended ..

It’s just that recoil is not a big problem when the trunk is new, and when the trunk is decades old, the accuracy is poor. It hasn’t been produced for the army. I personally am glad that the caliber of 7,62 is back, I would be happy even with a simple new AKM. But in the army those that are over 50 years old, the wear of the trunks is specific. And here is a new machine, with the possibility of fastening all sorts of sweets, without talking a plus. Now in the army, many guys at their own expense upgrade their trunk-lids of the receiver with picatinny rails, forend with handles and LCC, collimators, ergonomic pistol grip pads all buy. And then it's all for free. The question is when it really gets to the army.

[shootnik113]

And here is the question for RAVist, he is either an idler or an enemy ...

[Mr Catofei]

And what, have you completely forgotten how to speak Russian? If for the foreign market all these names may be good, marketing is all the same, then why should we?

[Jamuqa]

This is a review from an airsoft player, not a specialist. This companion urgently needs to go through, and then do reviews on combat vehicles.

[Navigator Basov]

Krebs-custom in the army machine? Seriously? Syracote? Flat Dark Rings and Great Black? And why not extreme deluxe? Is this designed for counter-strike players? And why not just adopt the flamethrower Ilona Mask? To arming against zombies, of course, in accordance with its declared mission.

[Max bad]

"Sighting range increased to 1000 meters." (c) what nerd wrote?

[Max bad]

the article is absurd in fact, the author is not familiar at all with the subject, which is discussed in the article

[Vakus-100]

I read the comments and did not understand what is better than AK or AEK .... I shot current with AK and RPK

[shootnik113]

Continue to shoot from them, disappointment will come along with new machine guns, but not immediately ...

[Dr. AKM]

At the expense of the “gland”, life will show .. but at the expense of the caliber, I will say no to sports, each has its own purpose and characteristic ... in addition to the lethal force, there is also the concept of stopping ability of a cartridge, the larger the caliber the more it is .. both calibers have rights to life ... they correctly noted that scouts (and attack aircraft) give preference to a large caliber (Vintarez in general 9mm), because the chances of getting a bullet from a wounded enemy are less ... and in positional or defensive battles it is better to 5,45, because from 1 a wounded fighter still 4-5 out of the battle to evacuate ... a small caliber for this and invented!

[air wolf]

And I would recommend producing all these new submachine guns under a deeply modernized cartridge 7,62x39mm, and the economic effect and power (new gunpowder, bullet ballistics) is comparable to 7,62x51 mm, that would be a shock for pin-up-owls

[Thompson]

Quote: Bass Navigator

It is AR-15 (self-loading) that the United States has not been in service with for any number of years (0 years), but is sold only on the civilian market (sports, hunting, self-defense).

Ie renaming it to M16, then bringing it to version A2, shortening it to M4, it became different ???
The same rake!

[AKS-U]

The Kalash has a powerful lobby. And the Kovrovites are under pressure, they do not fit into the market. And this has been the case since 1982.